# Females who say they get along with males moreso than females (in a non sexual manner



## StableSun35 (Oct 14, 2013)

Choice said:


> ^ why, in what ways, and how did that come to happen?


i could be wrong but guessing it stems from a dislike of being female in herself, and heterosexual, getting to know boys is fun when you're hetero. Disempowered females can be an ugly sight to behold. Humans like to categorize, so after 10 mean females, they are all mean, to some.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> Because women are divided by feminists and antifeminists. They need to reconcile themselves with their fellow comrades and fight their unifying problem, corporate America.


Give it a rest.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

flummoxed said:


> I'm sure there are plenty who just get along better with guys than girls, but for the most part I seem to hear it a lot from girls who are totally oblivious to the fact that all their male, "friends" want to fuck them. Of course they treat you better, they're trying to get into your pants! But that's their own stupidity too because treating a girl nicely is never going to get you laid.


Is that true for most male friends a woman has?


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Metasentient said:


> Give it a rest.


That really hurts my feelings.
No we don't want to have sex with all of our female friends because most of them are train wrecks and don't deserve what we have. I'm afraid your assumptions were incorrect.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> That really hurts my feelings.
> No we don't want to have sex with all of our female friends because most of them are train wrecks and don't deserve what we have. I'm afraid your assumptions were incorrect.


 I could say something so smoldering to this but my empathy is kicking in at an inappropriate time.

hehe

inappropriate


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

flummoxed said:


> I'm sure there are plenty who just get along better with guys than girls, but for the most part I seem to hear it a lot from girls who are totally oblivious to the fact that all their male, "friends" want to fuck them. Of course they treat you better, they're trying to get into your pants! But that's their own stupidity too because treating a girl nicely is never going to get you laid.


Exactly it's statistically shown that males and females who do get in each other's pants are more likely to be violent with one another than nice.


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Metasentient said:


> I could say something so smoldering to this but my empathy is kicking in at an inappropriate time.
> 
> hehe
> 
> inappropriate


If you did you'd be getting onto my sexual preferences which is an example of violence


----------



## Ace Face (Nov 13, 2011)

@Grandmaster Yoda

Y U so troll?! But seriously, the comedy is appreciated.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> If you did you'd be getting onto my sexual preferences which is an example of violence


Hate it to break it to you, but my friends have standards.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> Exactly it's statistically shown that males and females who do get in each other's pants are more likely to be violent with one another than nice.


Yes,women become 99.9% more likely to rape their significant other with a strap-on.


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Metasentient said:


> Hate it to break it to you, but my friends have standards.


I'm still waiting for the perfect person to rape me and correct me for my injustices. I also want to live in poverty for the same purpose. I wish to underachieve.


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Metasentient said:


> Yes,women become 99.9% more likely to rape their significant other with a strap-on.


Nah nah nah. Are you not an avid reader? It's a fact that relationally involved humans are more likely to be suspected of murder of their relational partner.


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Ace Face said:


> @Grandmaster Yoda
> 
> Y U so troll?! But seriously, the comedy is appreciated.


Why do you have to underappreciate my words and call me a joker?


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> Why do you have to underappreciate my words and call me a joker?


They misunderestimated me.


----------



## peter pettishrooms (Apr 20, 2015)

I've always found other girls to be intimidating. I didn't have a problem with other girls and never really had any catty altercations, but I was never the prettiest girl growing up. Surrounding myself with (nerdy) guys made me less insecure about myself because I didn't have to worry about competing with other girls. And most girls at my school were better-looking than I was, so I felt inferior to them.


----------



## ai.tran.75 (Feb 26, 2014)

*Females who say they get along with males moreso than females (in a non sexua...*

I get along with both equally but I have twice as many guy friends as I do girls. It's easier for me to talk to men than women ( don't get me wrong women are nice to me ) . But my approach towards male and females are quite different(base on first impression) - I'm much more care free - playful- tomboyish and talkative around men ...as to I'm more tranquil and serious around women . If I'm around both gender then I'm quite outgoing but with girls alone I naturally bc more quiet- I enjoy listening to what they have to share ( bc that's how I am around my close gf and family members except for my entp bff) and I suppose I have a really crude sense of humor- I don't get offended if pick on- I laugh a lot - I like sports - cars -video games and sci fi - and I have good insight on what's going on inside a females mind and a lot of cute girl friends so I'm guessing that's why i attract more male friends than female .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## BlackLikeMySoul (Sep 7, 2015)

Because men are dirty and messy and vulgar and chill, and they don't bitch around, and their choice of topic isn't what girl is currently being a hoe, but all hoes in general, and how to fuck them real good (and they actually use words like "fuck" and "dick" and "cock" and "cunt" without cringing), and they drink out of the bottle and they can look like complete shit while hanging out, and they don't have to always do something, and they don't judge if you eat a shitload of anything, because they do too, and they like movies with real *action*, and they don't always have to talk about their feelings, and if they do they can use the word "fine" without getting interrogated after, and _*life must be really freaking good being a man*_. 

Wow. May I just add that my best friend is a woman (however we act like men when we're together, so..)


----------



## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

pyrrhic victory said:


> Ugh seriously. And then when you call them out on their shit they're usually in denial or say that you're being ~sensitive~ *and they don't realize that they're basically exhibiting the traits that they claim to hate.*



Exactly!


----------



## Dania (Oct 31, 2009)

Most women I don't see as my equal... Not challenging, profoundly annoying, lacking depth, superficial. I disregard them until they prove substantial. 

A great example is during university, of about 10 to 15 male lecturers I disliked 1.. and of 30+ female lecturers I liked only 5.

Women try to compete with other women, I just don't see them as competition. I'm more likely to compete with a male.

That being said, I appreciate powerful women, like my mom n bff.

Men can be stupid jerks too, a lot are, but its probably easier to find males that I can get along with fine.


----------



## untested methods (May 8, 2015)

I've had mixed experiences with this.

Growing up I knew a lot of women into horror movies and video games. Approaching something like video games solo as an adult, it's often disproportionately men. Example, the first small guild I joined only had two other women... who were married and only socialized with their husbands or each other as couples outside of big group content.

Offline, I'm also in places that are imbalanced. I think there are communities specifically to introduce women to each other (in the case of STEM, etc), but I don't seek them out. Feels inorganic unless I can approach it from a professional angle, which I may try to in the future. 

A lot of new potential friendships don't quite make it to friendship. I try not to give preferential treatment to women I don't quite get along with just to have some around.


----------



## d e c a d e n t (Apr 21, 2013)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> I'm still waiting for the perfect person to rape me and correct me for my injustices. I also want to live in poverty for the same purpose. I wish to underachieve.


So that's what you're into?



acidicwithpanic said:


> I've always found other girls to be intimidating. I didn't have a problem with other girls and never really had any catty altercations, but I was never the prettiest girl growing up. Surrounding myself with (nerdy) guys made me less insecure about myself because I didn't have to worry about competing with other girls. And most girls at my school were better-looking than I was, so I felt inferior to them.


Lol, I actually tend find guys to be more intimidating. Now I still do have some male friends, so like I said, I don't see gender as the most important factor, but I admit there's a part of me that find guys more "scary" on average (though it might have gotten better). Part of it might be the "girls have cooties"-attitude that boys often have at a younger age, though even as I got older I still sort of felt they might just see me as a "stupid annoying girl." In a way I think guys can be more intimidating (to me) because I'm more sensitive to possible rejection from them, either in the sense of not finding me attractive enough, or having less respect for me as a person. It's partly subconscious, though (or instinctual). Not like I go around always thinking "gee, I hope every guy I talk to finds me attractive enough," especially since I'm not THAT interested in the majority of the guys I see. (Though I mean, if they're interesting enough that I actively want a friendship with them or whatever...)

Whoops, rambling. =P


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Distortions said:


> So that's what you're into?
> 
> 
> Lol, I actually tend find guys to be more intimidating. Now I still do have some male friends, so like I said, I don't see gender as the most important factor, but I admit there's a part of me that find guys more "scary" on average (though it might have gotten better). Part of it might be the "girls have cooties"-attitude that boys often have at a younger age, though even as I got older I still sort of felt they might just see me as a "stupid annoying girl." In a way I think guys can be more intimidating (to me) because I'm more sensitive to possible rejection from them, either in the sense of not finding me attractive enough, or having less respect for me as a person. It's partly subconscious, though (or instinctual). Not like I go around always thinking "gee, I hope every guy I talk to finds me attractive enough," especially since I'm not THAT interested in the majority of the guys I see. (Though I mean, if they're interesting enough that I actively want a friendship with them or whatever...)
> ...


It's not so much a preference as a moral obligation that someone must attend to immediately


----------



## SiFan (Mar 10, 2015)

Choice said:


> ^ why, in what ways, and how did that come to happen?


After several good explanations, it's fairly clear how some women (maybe most) may get along better with males than females ("in a non sexual manner"). Fine; still, while it may be non sexual in the sense of either side looking to have sex, I believe it is, even so, sexual. 

Plain fact is that females and males are inherently attracted to the other sex pretty much no matter what. There is a deep instinctual friendliness and openess and williness to trust between the sexes that simply does not exist within the same sex. (Gay persons may be an exception.) Same situation seems to hold in nature.

Meanwhile, society has always aimed to promote all kinds of within-sex camaraderie & bonding opportunities, such as Boy Scouts/Girl Scouts, Fraternities/Sororities, rites of passage for boys/rites of passage for girls, ... . Rationale has been that boys could learn male stuff and girls could learn female stuff. 

Makes sense. However, we may at least suspect that, going back to caveman days, another rational for within-sex bonding was to avoid wholesale within-sex slaughter when young people reached their teenage years.

Anyway, something that has puzzled me for years is resolved. It makes perfect sense that my playmate and 'pal' for that summer at age 7 was someone of the opposite sex. We were 'naturals'.


----------



## ForestPaix (Aug 30, 2014)

As a female, I find it much easier to get on with guys. I like to be dorky, and weird and talk about all sorts of random stuff, and I feel like females perceive me as weird if I was talk to them like that, due to being called weird back when I was 15 by a bunch of girls who looked down on me, so I'm more reserved and polite to females. Guys are just very chill, and I can be myself around them, and while I do get on with some girls, it's mainly guys, which bothers my boyfriend sometimes. Nothing's sexual, except for today, one of my friends was joking about my boobs and motioned to his dick kinda jokingly.....it was uncomfortable....he's the only friend who's ever been like that. Me and my other guy friend were just kinda like .......haha? I just felt uncomfortable about it.


----------



## Wellsy (Oct 24, 2011)

The myth that women secretly hate other women has a long history

Looks like a somewhat short and interesting read that seems like it may be relevant.


----------



## Enfpleasantly (Mar 5, 2012)

I trust men over women. I don't trust any woman completely on this Earth, but I have the capability to trust a man entirely. All of the times in my life that I've ever been betrayed, it's been the doing of a woman in some way. Betrayal by men has been very rare in my life.


----------



## Toru Okada (May 10, 2011)

Wellsy said:


> The myth that women secretly hate other women has a long history
> 
> Looks like a somewhat short and interesting read that seems like it may be relevant.


I'm not sure that it's a total 'myth'. Hate is just being used as a buzzword here. Glib would be a more accurate word to use. There's a certain amount of glib in most initial social interactions, but I'd say men are liable to get past the glib phase faster, probably because they are less concerned with tact and tone, and usually connect through some sort of common objective. Why this sort of approach to friendship would lead to less misunderstanding or potential animosity I don't know. I get the impression sometimes that women can't cut loose with other women as fully as men can with other men. If they do, they can be ostracized by other women for not conforming to standard. That's why women find friendships with men refreshing, I think. But then there's the *they also want to fuck you* part.


----------



## Wellsy (Oct 24, 2011)

Gore Motel said:


> I'm not sure that it's a total 'myth'. Hate is just being used as a buzzword here. Glib would be a more accurate word to use. There's a certain amount of glib in most initial social interactions, but I'd say men are liable to get past the glib phase faster, probably because they are less concerned with tact and tone, and usually connect through some sort of common objective. Why this sort of approach to friendship would lead to less misunderstanding or potential animosity I don't know. I get the impression sometimes that women can't cut loose with other women as fully as men can with other men. If they do, they can be ostracized by other women for not conforming to standard. That's why women find friendships with men refreshing, I think. But then there's the *they also want to fuck you* part.


I think their focus isn't so much a point about the relationship that exists between sexes in all their variations and degrees but more the characterization that this is the state of women has a historical precedent. That hate between women is considered the norm to the neglect of the relationships that are successful between women and thus conflict between women is thought of in specifically gendered terms as being catty, indirect and so forth. To which on another topic, I'm not sure how well some beliefs stack up when it comes to how women's expression of aggression.
It'd be silly to deny that there's animosity within sexes but whether this is of the sort of significance it's given culturally is suspect.

Makes me curious as to what design a study would take to evaluate hypothesis on friendships between sexes and within sexes and what factors determine the individuals belief for one, the other or both.
Because we have this thread, but we've also got threads asking can men and women _really _be friends and here we have people state how they don't jive with their own sex so much they prefer friendships with the opposite sex.

Seems like cross-sex bonds is an area that has some research behind it for a while now.

* *




https://etd.lib.metu.edu.tr/upload/4/12604934/index.pdf


> This study compares same-sex friendships, cross-sex friendships and romantic relationships in young adulthood in terms of the negative effects of various conflict issues, the different conflict management strategies and relationship maintenance strategies employed in these relationships, as well as the perceived rewards and costs, the integration of the networks, and perceived overall quality. The main purpose is to investigate cross-sex friendships and discern its similarities to and differences from romantic relationships and same-sex friendships, as well as the gender differences that emerge. Data is collected by means of questionnaires, from a sample of 298 Middle East Technical University Students. Cross-sex friendships were rated as the poorest relationship in terms of quality, rewards/costs, or the frequency of maintenance behaviors and conflict occurred at very low levels in these friendships. Women employed more relationship maintenance strategies in their same- and cross-sex friendships compared to men. In addition, men preferred the dominating and women the accommodating strategies of conflict management in their same-sex friendships. It was concluded that same-sex friendships remain to be the accepted and approved form of friendship among this sample of Turkish young adults and cross-sex friendships were distant and inferior to the other two relationships. Finally, there were some differences across these relationships as to what predicted relational quality, yet in general the rewards and maintenance strategies predicted quality better than costs and conflict behaviors.


http://bleske-rechek.com/April Website Files/Bleske-Rechek et al. 2012 Benefit or Burden.pdf
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.489.7712&rep=rep1&type=pdf
https://www.psychologytoday.com/sites/default/files/attachments/85933/sexrolesarticle.pdf
http://etd.fcla.edu/CF/CFE0002070/Emmett_Melissa_C_200805_MA.pdf


----------



## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

Try hards. Usually those are the types that require male approval. They want to be seen as "one of the guys" and part of an in crowd.


----------



## jamaix (Sep 20, 2013)

Wellsy said:


> That hate between women is considered the norm to the neglect of the relationships that are successful between women and thus conflict between women is thought of in specifically gendered terms as being catty, indirect and so forth.


First I'll admit I only briefly glanced at the thread and didn't read the links, but for me it has absolutely nothing to do with hating other women. It has to do with not feeling like I fit in with most. I usually don't like the same things, and often feel like an outsider. I've tried to fit in, I just don't. There is a thread that was in the ISTJ forum some time ago and many of the ISTJ women who commented, said similar things. It seems to come down to many of us not having what is considered stereotypical emotions, preferences, hobbies, etc.

I don't hate other women, I just have difficulty figuring out how to communicate and interact with a lot of them. I have troubles understanding many women. Sorry if I am totally missing the point. That happens sometimes when you sneak a peak at at thread when you only have a couple of minutes available.


----------



## ENIGMA2019 (Jun 1, 2015)

Men are less emotional or sensitive. I do not have to wonder most of the time things like....Is this going to hurt their feelings? Are they going to be crying every time I see/talk to them? I do not have to filter what I say around most males.
Also, most females are Catty bitches....I do not want to invest my time around people that tear others down in order to feel better about their self or are jealous of me because of some stupid reason or another.


----------



## la_revolucion (May 16, 2013)

I honestly hate hearing women say that they don't like being friends with other women or even like other women much. All my closest friends have been females. I love women. 

My personal theory on this has been that *some *(NOT ALL) women love being with men for the attention. Men are laid back and fun due to low key flirting and sexual tension. Women aren't going to put up with another woman's shit because the potential payback of a subconsciously flirtatious moment means nothing. A guy will put up with a chick's shit due to this low key attraction. And by low key I literally mean that. There may be no feelings or romance AT ALL but the chemistry of opposite genders coming together is there. 

Women I have known that are constantly saying how women don't get along with them because all women are "catty bitches" and they feel better being "one of the guys" usually are some of the cattiest bitches I have ever met. For example, it's laughable to hear grown women talk down classically feminine traits as undesirable so they can pump up how "unique" they are. "OH! I am a guy's girl! I'm not like other women!" Lolz. You ain't fooling anyone.


----------



## WamphyriThrall (Apr 11, 2011)

stiletto said:


> Try hards. Usually those are the types that require male approval. They want to be seen as "one of the guys" and part of an in crowd.


That was me, before realizing I had little in common with those douche bags, and got along just as well with members of both sexes.


----------



## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

WamphyriThrall said:


> That was me, before realizing I had little in common with those douche bags, and got along just as well with members of both sexes.


Takes one to know one. I was also "one of those" when I was a teen. :happy:


----------



## Enfpleasantly (Mar 5, 2012)

I just flat out don't trust women. What does that say about me? Women have betrayed me, but not men. I love my female friends and enjoy their company very much. I just don't let my guard completely down with them. It's all in different aspects, though. With them, it's hard to trust them fully with my heart. 

As for women in general, I swear to you, my husband just MENTIONS being married around young, single women, and it's like a spark lights in their eyes and they immediately try with him. Examples include, a girl asking several times for him to pull her hair, another girl telling him she did something naughty with the banana on his desk, another girl grabbing him by the tie and asking him how he wants it. Over and over and over, not when they think he's single, but when he says "I'm married". 

You know what? Scratch that. It's not even just young single women. Married women at his work are the same way. The nice thing is, he tells me about it and while I think they're a bunch of slimy bitches, it makes my ego so big the harder they try. I actually find it hot. And the sneakier she is about it, the more satisfaction I get from it. 

You know the girl...the one who smiles and kisses your ass while around you because she knows when you're not around, she tries so hard for your guy. Yep.

But to be clear, I actually trust my girlfriends in this regard.


----------



## gardengnome (Dec 12, 2014)

This whole thread = yikes


----------



## BlackDog (Jan 6, 2012)

I have nothing against women, and one of my best friends is a woman. But as a general rule I find women harder to identify with, and I tend to have less in common with them. So most of my friends are male.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

I love this attitude they have sometimes, "I'm a "masculine" woman and I'm assertive and I don't let my emotions get the best of me, so I'm mostly friends with guys "


----------



## BlackDog (Jan 6, 2012)

Metasentient said:


> I love this attitude they have sometimes, "I'm a "masculine" woman and I'm assertive and I don't let my emotions get the best of me, so I'm mostly friends with guys "


I actually was surprised by this. Because in my experience, males are far more sensitive and emotional than females.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

BlackDog said:


> I actually was surprised by this. Because in my experience, males are far more sensitive and emotional than females.


I would seriously be very interested in meeting the kinds of men you have, then, just to really see it for myself. Sure, I've known emotional guys, but very broadly and generally speaking, there are very few men who have cared about me beyond some mundane level. The emotions are focused on the self. The deepest and most affectionate relationships have been with women. But I end up talking to more guys anyway because more of our interests coincide.


----------



## MaggieMay (Dec 27, 2014)

I was rather shy growing up and didn't have *any* friends until I was around 12. I started to notice a lot of girls did not like me and I could not tell if it was because guys were always around me and my other four sisters so they assumed we were flirts or if I did not like them because most of the girls I knew were superficial and insecure. 
I plagued myself with the question up until nearly the end of high school when I resolved to stop caring and bring meaning into the friendships I did have, which happened to be male. They understood my sense of humor, for the most part I liked to keep things light-hearted, and they always came to me for girl advice. It was nice. Of course, it wasn't always non-feelings as many of our friendships ultimately ended because their eventual feelings were not returned. 
Also, I was surrounded by girls every day. I had 4 sisters already on top of my cousins coming to stay with us (I think of them more like siblings) which added another girl and a boy into the mix. We also babysat two middle school girls who were at our house every day after school. 

So in case you lost track that's EIGHT girls and ONE boy in one household.
Yes, it was crazy.

Any girl friendships I had seemed to end fairly shortly and eventually it was really hard for me to find girls I got along with enough to talk to. 
I enjoyed talking about things that mattered, I wasn't concerned with who was dating who and the latest trends and fancy private schools. 
I was a shy girl who enjoyed art and writing and music and family. It was difficult for me to "click" with other females when I didn't have enough time to figure them out before they stopped wanting to hang out. It was just how it was. As a result, many girls hated us for having real friendships with boys our ages. Maybe it was gossip, who knows. All I do know is that our male friendships were a big highlight for us in high school. We all got together every friday and would terrorize the neighborhood with our craziness and walk the train tracks back home. After my sister started dating my best friend and broke up with him, the entire group fell apart (probably for the best, unfortunately) and it is still very hard for us to let go of those friendships because they did mean so much. 

I am now married and without friends. 
However, my husband is in an all-male band and we hang out with them a lot so I am once again immersed in a man's world. 
They also quickly accepted me as part of the group and ask my ideas, opinions, and advice often. It's nice to sort of have that back. 

I guess some women just appreciate men because they can be direct and actually appreciate our minds instead of female friendships that simply would rather talk about their ex and what shoes they got on sale. I think it has a lot to do with personality too.

I have one female friendship that has stuck and I love her even though I only see her every couple months. Women still need someone who understands her and can do girly things but for the most part I am content with my own company and the few male friends that I do have. 

Hope that helped and wasn't hard to understand.


----------



## Monty (Jul 12, 2011)

Well, in my case I was raised in an all-woman family. Males have always been intriguing to me, more so than women. For me, it's not really about other women being less interesting or "worse" than men, but more about my profound interest in the subtle/not so subtle differences between the two. It makes for interesting conversations.


----------



## OrangeAppled (Jun 26, 2009)

It is sad to see some seriously trite views of women in here. It reads like a caricature of an ESFJ or ISFJ profile. Who is that one-dimensional?

I have had many of these issues...with men! They have been catty, two-faced, quick to take offense, incapable of stimulating converstion, possessing mainly shallow interets (TV, video games, sports - YAWN), etc. The typical man is no deep thinker and may carry a serious chip on his shoulder. I find most men extremely sensitive, but in a worse way where they are unaware of it and act passive-aggressivley because of it. At least women OWN it. 

For me, this is just PEOPLE. It is rare for me to find a person of any gender that I clique with and who likes ME. I am willing to accommodate others far more than they do me....I regularly put off women AND men. However, it is better when I give the benefit of the doubt and try and see what is enjoyable about others. Sometimes people really surprise me. They have more depth or much broader interests than you might ever imagine.


----------



## sogood (Aug 24, 2014)

This is such internalized misogyny. I agree with the above poster that men display the same traits but they may come out slightly differently due to social expectations for expression or be interpreted differently. Female aggression or ego is displayed as catty, male's often as being a winner or not even recognized. Both can be manipulative; and in my personal experience, many men are more entitled and manipulative. Women pick up on this attitude towards women and learn to distance themselves as being percieved as society sees women, so they take a "i'm not like other girls" attitude to be seen the way they want, because who would want to be seen negatively?


----------



## ENIGMA2019 (Jun 1, 2015)

la_revolucion said:


> I honestly hate hearing women say that they don't like being friends with other women or even like other women much. All my closest friends have been females. I love women.
> 
> My personal theory on this has been that *some *(NOT ALL) women love being with men for the attention. Men are laid back and fun due to low key flirting and sexual tension. Women aren't going to put up with another woman's shit because the potential payback of a subconsciously flirtatious moment means nothing. A guy will put up with a chick's shit due to this low key attraction. And by low key I literally mean that. There may be no feelings or romance AT ALL but the chemistry of opposite genders coming together is there.
> 
> Women I have known that are constantly saying how women don't get along with them because all women are "catty bitches" and they feel better being "one of the guys" usually are some of the cattiest bitches I have ever met. For example, it's laughable to hear grown women talk down classically feminine traits as undesirable so they can pump up how "unique" they are. "OH! I am a guy's girl! I'm not like other women!" Lolz. You ain't fooling anyone.


--Prime example of Catty : )

I have at least 6 female best friends-That by the way, I have been friends with over 15 years. Can you say that? Even about 5 years? 

Also, I am NOT one of the boys. I am VERY feminine. I was just explaining why I prefer interacting with males over females-Outside of my FEMALE circle.


----------



## ebae (Sep 21, 2015)

ENIGMA15 said:


> --Prime example of Catty : )
> 
> I have at least 6 female best friends-That by the way, I have been friends with over 15 years. Can you say that? Even about 5 years?
> 
> Also, I am NOT one of the boys. I am VERY feminine. I was just explaining why I prefer interacting with males over females-Outside of my FEMALE circle.


What do you mean by being "very feminine"?


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Thank you for thanking these Wamphy 
Glad to see you're not taking it personally


----------



## la_revolucion (May 16, 2013)

ENIGMA15 said:


> --Prime example of Catty : )
> 
> I have at least 6 female best friends-That by the way, I have been friends with over 15 years. Can you say that? Even about 5 years?
> 
> Also, I am NOT one of the boys. I am VERY feminine. I was just explaining why I prefer interacting with males over females-Outside of my FEMALE circle.


I wasn't targeting you at all so don't think that. I did not have you in mind when I wrote my response to this thread. If I did I would have post quoted you. I did just notice that you used the exact phrase of "catty bitch" above me but that is honestly the same phrase I use when describing this situation. We just use similar language so if anything we are similar in our vocabulary. :happy:

Also, yes, I do have several female friends that I have been friends with since I was 10. I am 25 now. Was just the maid of honor in one their weddings. 

So let's take a truce my fellow lady!


----------



## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

I can never really be objective about this topic - having had a terrible relationship with my mother, ever since I can remember and having a practically idyllic one with my dad.

To this day, if a man hurts me, *one* man hurt me but if a women does the exact same thing; I take it completely personally and am devastated. I struggle with the ability to act like the bigger person and maintain objectivity like I can with a man. The irony of course is that I have been hurt/lied to/abused/betrayed by many more women than men but the very few men who have hurt me, have actually caused the most damage. I seem to possess a much greater resiliency when dealing with being possibly hurt by a man but seem to possess less than zero, when it comes to women. I am trying very hard to overcome my past conditioning but it's not easy when every women who sticks a metaphorical knife in me, reminds me of my late mother. 

For the record, I have spoken to numerous men, who tell me the exact same thing in reverse: how much more comfortable they feel around women, how they only want to confide in them and don't trust men, because competition and rigid gender roles, etc., that all almost all their friends are women, that men don't want to discuss anything other than sports and other superficial stuff; In fact, so many men have told me this and comparable things to it; that I've lost count.

So, rather than positing that this is possibly somehow a female phenomena; I would suggest that the more accurate conclusion to be drawn: is that both genders get along better with the opposite gender - in general - than their own.


----------



## FlaviaGemina (May 3, 2012)

Children Of The Bad Revolution said:


> I side eye women who say this. You're not a ~Cool Girl~. Why be against other women.


Because some people have a more differentiated and less categorical understanding of what makes a person who they are. 




----------------------------------------------------------------------
As for the OP, I wouldn't say that I get along with males 100% better than females. My small circle of best friends is made up of 50/50 men and women. As far as my friends are concerned, they are just normal people and (with the exception of this one feminist) gender doesn't seem to play a major role in how they go about their everyday life.
On average, I do find men more easy-going, funny, emotionally honest and direct, though. Also, being an INTJ, I'm more likely to have interests in common with men than with women.

Let me compare the kinds of men I like with the kinds of women I don't like. By no means would I argue that all men and all women are like that. However, in the worst case scenario (i.e. when I'm surrounded by the kind of women I don't like), those are the reasons that would make me prefer some types of men over women.

*The kind of men I like*: 
- Have a "masculine" Enneagram and/or MBTI, like E5, E1, E8, INTP, ENTP, ISTJ, INTJ, (some ESTJs if they have the same values as me), (some ISTPs but only for debating, not for friendship), + the occassional ISFP or INFP sweetie like @_hornet_ or @_Wellsy_. 
- At the same time, they don't make loud noises about their precious masculinity and don't follow traditional gender roles.
- Are able to have a 1:1 conversation
- Can speak about a variety of topics, e.g. their work, politics, linguistics, philosophy, psychology, religion, their opinions etc. (I should include ESFPs as well)
- Can also speak about their private life, but it's not the first thing they confront you with
- Are independent and don't bother me every day
- Can disagree about some things and still be friends
- Don't require presents and other conventional/ materialistic forms of showing affection

*The kind of women I don't like:*
- Have nothing to say about themselves, all they can speak about are men (boyfriends, husbands, sons)
- Are conformist and expect everyone to be the same
- Only speak about private matters, like family
- Force-feed others because they wouldn't know what to do with themselves if they didn't have anyone to "mother"
- Always have to be in a group
- Need constant attention and smother you with "liking" the minute they meet you
(No, this is not anti SF bias, I've seen many an NF, ST and NT woman do the same and I get on so well with some ESFJ women that those who try to fit some stereotype want to retype me as INTP BECAUSE SOCIONICS SAYS SO )


----------



## FlaviaGemina (May 3, 2012)

flummoxed said:


> I'm sure there are plenty who just get along better with guys than girls, but for the most part I seem to hear it a lot from girls who are totally oblivious to the fact that all their male, "friends" want to fuck them. Of course they treat you better, they're trying to get into your pants! But that's their own stupidity too because treating a girl nicely is never going to get you laid.


Hahaha, if that's the case, then one of my best guy friends has been waiting to fuck me for 10+ years. I guess he deserves bonus points for being patient, maybe if he waits another 80 years, it will finally happen.

What makes you think that girls' guy friends are "nice" to them? My guy friends aren't particularly nice to me. When I get to know them, they don't treat me any different than they treat a guy or any random person. When I know them better, they can even be incredibly harsh when it comes to giving me advice and none of them ever go out of their way to do me favours, make me compliments etc.


----------



## Toru Okada (May 10, 2011)

Enfpleasantly said:


> I swear to you, my husband just MENTIONS being married around young, single women, and it's like a spark lights in their eyes and they immediately try with him. Examples include, a girl asking several times for him to pull her hair, another girl telling him she did something naughty with the banana on his desk, another girl grabbing him by the tie and asking him how he wants it. Over and over and over, not when they think he's single, but when he says "I'm married".


Off to buy myself a wedding ring. Thanks for the pick up tip.



BlackDog said:


> I actually was surprised by this. Because in my experience, males are far more sensitive and emotional than females.


That's true. But mainly when it comes to "love". The basis of which is different for both sexes.


----------



## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

I don't know why, but there's this girl I know who's this. She's really pretty though (and it makes me feel beneath her and irrelevant, especially considering I'm a guy as well, and most of us are lazy and score only around 2/10 in looks), and I can't tell if she has a boyfriend or is looking for one, or if basically all her relationships with guys are platonic.


----------



## Intricate Mystic (Apr 3, 2010)

In the past I tended to prefer friendships with men because I have difficulty trusting women and preferred mens' seemingly less emotional and objective approach to life. However, I realized in more recent years that men can betray you just as easily as women. I guess it comes down to the individual character of the person rather than gender. 

I've had to deal with a lot of women in grad school since my program has mostly women students. It has been interesting. Two of them are narcissistic and immature. Being around them completely drains me of not only energy but self-confidence. I tried to be friends with them but finally decided it's best to avoid them because they both have major psychological issues. Another woman in my program has become a great friend. We have a lot in common and have really helped each other deal with the challenges of living in a foreign country on top of the demands of grad school. In addition to being forced to be around a lot of women in my program, including a program director who has not a maternal, kind bone in her body, I recently met my cousin and five of her women friends for dinner as they were visiting my city in Italy for a vacation. My cousin was warm and effusive while one of her friends who sat across the table from me (who I was friendly and nice to) got in a few digs at me (I realized later) because she was apparently jealous that I live in Italy and have a chef boyfriend who likes to do the cooking. Really, why couldn't she just suck up her jealous feelings and be nice? That's the sort of competitive crap some women spout that makes me not want to associate with women at all. I could care less about competing with other women on a social level. We should just all be nice, kind, and supportive to each other, especially later in life when everyone should have achieved some degree of maturity.


----------



## SalvinaZerelda (Aug 26, 2010)

> why, in what ways, and how did that come to happen?


I might be a female but I guess I was more of a tomboy.. I was naturally more drawn to the stuff that the guys liked..
I had a couple of female friends that were neighbors or friends of the family, but girls at school my own age never wanted to talk to me.. when they did, they were weird about it..
Like I remember one girl offered to be my friend, and then got mad at me because she assumed I was judging her because of her height, but.. I would have been very happy to be her friend.. why would her height have been a problem? Made me very sad and hurt.
She couldn't be reasoned with, though.
There was a girl that shared the same interests with me about veterinarianness, but she didn't talk to me very much..

I had a female friend in first grade for a very short time, until she moved away..
One of my first "best friends" had pretty much nothing in common with me and.. when I went to her birthday party I discovered how different we were, and felt so out of place there. 

My other female friends have been very close to me, though.. I tend to only have like one female friend at a time..
and I don't "get" women.. If people were to ask me what girls are thinking, I could only tell you of what I'm thinking.. and I just so happen to be female..
I will agree that all women are crazy in a heartbeat..
but our craziness isn't necessarily a bad thing, and.. well.. can be expressed in different ways..

My grandmother sort of pushed girly-girlness on me.. I started dressing like a girl, allbeit a kind of "tough/scary girl" kind of girl.. 
She paid for me to go to massage therapy school, which I loved, but couldn't finish.. I realized that that was something I could talk to girls about.. kind of funny.. 
She got me to do cooking, and flower arrangement, and I learned some hygienish things on my own..

I guess that's the most I know about being a girl, lol. What my ESFJ granny sort of pressured me into.
I still don't understand the nuances of speaking to women.. ALl I know is that there are way too many. >.<
I tend to include girls when I say "hey guys" and I notice girls seem kind of tiffed off about that.. but.. even though I am not a guy, and I'm very obviously a feeler, I've always felt more like one of the guys than one of the girls.

Sometimes I think way too many girls limit themselves and are cowardly, though.. I don't have many strong female role-models that aren't tomboyish.

but.. women have a pecking order that is outrageous to me.. I just can't handle what they bicker about on a regular basis.. I know guys have a similar thing, sort of, but.. it's much more tolerable.


----------



## AriesLilith (Jan 6, 2013)

In my case I used to be a tomboy so even thought I used to hang out with girls I just didn't have that natural ability to totally blend in and get along with female friends. Actually even with classmates in general (I was also not a kid to easily get along with I guess). Later I grew up and somehow got along with a male friend who became my best friend rather than other girl classmates. I still had girl friends but they were also interested in stuffs like video games, anime and manga.

Now I guess that I'd get along with both male and female friends, thought it'd depend on the interests.

I don't really perceive females or males as more or less complicated, they can both be complicated, envious or mean depending on their personality.


----------



## LittleOrange (Feb 11, 2012)

I prefer to hang out with guys. Guys are usually more relaxed and more fun than girls in my opinion. Maybe evan smarter. Also, most girls see other girls as competition....that´s why I think it´s really difficult to have true friendship with a girl. It does happen though. It is difficult to have true friendship with a guy too (cause they usually see you in a sexual/romantic way). But, it can happen. Ehh....there should be balance though. I guess I feel better around guys, because they don´t see me as a competition.


----------



## Persephone (Nov 14, 2009)

*Disclaimer*: I do have female friends. Many times they are like me in the important ways.

I suspect it's a combination of several factors.

*1. Guys approach me.

*For whatever reason. You can extrapolate based on this all you like, about how guys and girls can't be friends et cetera. But it's a fact. Girls approach me for friendship less often. It just happens.

*2. I have a stereotypically masculine personality and stereotypically masculine interests.*

Video games, philosophy, math, physics, etc. I'm also blunt and direct. It offends a lot of women; fewer men. I don't think I've ever offended a guy, though I've offended many, many girls with my personality, many times I would only be aware of it after they blow up at me MONTHS after the fact; it was crazy that they held a grudge against me for months for something that just slipped out of my mouth like it was the most natural thing to say in the world.

*3. I'm in a male dominated field**.*

I math. According to my professors, in this country there are about, for every 10 male mathematicians, there are only two females. Simple statistics favor men here as my natural friend group, even assuming men and women show platonic interest in me at the same rate, which they don't; see point 1.

*4. Female competition*

So shoot me for saying this. It exists. And I'm not nearly socially sophisticated enough to fight these battles so I prefer to avoid them. Many girls I've known get territorial about the men. Especially men officially dating them. I've been in some instances where previously unknown girlfriends of new guy friends of mine would suddenly become overly friendly and familiar, sometimes to the extent of being more friendly towards me than their boyfriends. In this creepy, territorial, guilt-tripping way, because if I have a relationship with them, I would first of all _know_ their boyfriends are taken and hopefully know my place, and secondly I would probably feel more guilty about trying to attract a friend's guy. My roommate and I were discussing her long distance boyfriend. She asked if I thought he was attractive. I thought for a while and answered: "No, not really. I tried to imagine myself with him and I just can't." To me it was just an honest to god attempt to evaluate his attractiveness to me. But she immediately got nervous even though I will probably never meet this guy in my life (and will never try). She said: "yeah. Erm. Don't imagine yourself with him."

And personally, since I have so much male exposure and they have less, I don't mind the lack of competition from other women. And I have to say, mathematicians, physicists, computer scientists and engineers (who are part of my social circle) are some of the most magnificent segment of the male species to me. I don't try to push other females out of my circle, but I don't mind at all that few females are coming in. My 70% male social circle is a status quo I did little to create, but I also have zero incentive to change it.


----------



## Persephone (Nov 14, 2009)

Rune said:


> I know guys have a similar thing, sort of, but.. it's much more tolerable.


It's more tolerable... And as a female I'm usually not a part of it. That's the most important thing, I think.



flummoxed said:


> I'm sure there are plenty who just get along better with guys than girls, but for the most part I seem to hear it a lot from girls who are totally oblivious to the fact that all their male, "friends" want to fuck them. Of course they treat you better, they're trying to get into your pants! But that's their own stupidity too because treating a girl nicely is never going to get you laid.


I know that. It doesn't bother me. It's biology for most straight men and women. Fortunately they see something in me other than a vagina they have to be very nice to. I'm sure at least one of them appreciates who I am as a person. I had a very honest friendship with a man who was very open about his attraction, but also very open about the fact that he values my friendship so highly he'd never let it get in the way.



Metasentient said:


> I would seriously be very interested in meeting the kinds of men you have, then, just to really see it for myself. Sure, I've known emotional guys, but very broadly and generally speaking, there are very few men who have cared about me beyond some mundane level. The emotions are focused on the self. The deepest and most affectionate relationships have been with women. But I end up talking to more guys anyway because more of our interests coincide.


Being self focused doesn't mean they're not sensitive and emotional. That's different from expressing it, or caring about you as an emotional being. I told my date on Friday that only one person has really broken my heart. It was a platonic female friend of mine. I thought she was my soulmate and she just crushed me. In contrast, I'm usually cool as a cucumber during romantic break ups. Women worm their way into your hearts. If she has your best interests in mind, she's the best thing ever. If she doesn't, she'll destroy you. My friendships with male friends are as a rule a little shallower (not true for the man I mentioned above though) but I'm okay with it.


----------



## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Persephone said:


> It's more tolerable... And as a female I'm usually not a part of it. That's the most important thing, I think.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The first sentence is that's what I'm referring to. Everyone can be emotional, but if the sensitivity is exclusive to what affects them personally and not extended to treatment of others, that's just selfishness.


----------



## Persephone (Nov 14, 2009)

sereneone said:


> I think there is a pretty simple dynamic at work here. Men befriend a large number of women because they either want to evaluate them for dating or sex, or because they want to leverage a relationship with a woman into a dating or sexual relationship with friends of that woman. This makes it *easy* for women to be friends with men. Because the men will show interest independent of true personality dynamics, based on pure physical or sexual attraction.


That would imply most of these women who get along with males better either 1. are inordinately attractive compared to women who don't have a lot of guy friends (which is suspect to say the least. I know a lot of gorgeous women who pretty much only hang around females 2. Have a lot of attractive female friends (which is mostly untrue, if you look at this thread)

Now, I'm not saying my intersex friendships couldn't have had these elements INVOLVED, but I've also see plenty of men drop women platonically once they realize there's nothing else on the table and they don't REALLY have anything in common. So far, no one has dropped me yet (at least those who has gotten to know me)


----------



## sereneone (Aug 1, 2013)

Persephone said:


> That would imply most of these women who get along with males better either 1. are inordinately attractive compared to women who don't have a lot of guy friends (which is suspect to say the least. I know a lot of gorgeous women who pretty much only hang around females 2. Have a lot of attractive female friends (which is mostly untrue, if you look at this thread)
> 
> Now, I'm not saying my intersex friendships couldn't have had these elements INVOLVED, but I've also see plenty of men drop women platonically once they realize there's nothing else on the table and they don't REALLY have anything in common. So far, no one has dropped me yet (at least those who has gotten to know me)


Your assumption is that men make dating or sexual decisions on appearance alone, which is false. Men can be sexually attracted to the personality. Men can want the challenge to test their sexual power even when they have no sexual attraction at all.


----------



## Persephone (Nov 14, 2009)

sereneone said:


> Your assumption is that men make dating or sexual decisions on appearance alone, which is false. Men can be sexually attracted to the personality. Men can want the challenge to test their sexual power even when they have no sexual attraction at all.


It would still imply that women with lots of male friends are somehow more attractive in some way, or in some way stands out from other women. See, that's what I can't agree with. I've acknowledged in my first post in this thread that men probably approach me for friendship because they're attracted to me in some way. But what makes them stay, I believe, goes deeper than attraction and more into general compatibility and plus, I'm pretty easy to talk to. At some point they actually just want to be my friend, regardless of whether I was introducing them to my female friends (which I wasn't; I have one or two female friends in any given location), or whether I had shown any romantic/sexual interest in them. And no, I don't think extroverted men are tools, having befriended and dated them. My ex ENFJ is interested in a lot of girls sexually, but he is selective in whom he befriends.


----------



## sereneone (Aug 1, 2013)

Persephone said:


> It would still imply that women with lots of male friends are somehow more attractive in some way, or in some way stands out from other women. See, that's what I can't agree with. I've acknowledged in my first post in this thread that men probably approach me for friendship because they're attracted to me in some way. But what makes them stay, I believe, goes deeper than attraction and more into general compatibility and plus, I'm pretty easy to talk to. At some point they actually just want to be my friend, regardless of whether I was introducing them to my female friends (which I wasn't; I have one or two female friends in any given location), or whether I had shown any romantic/sexual interest in them. And no, I don't think extroverted men are tools, having befriended and dated them. My ex ENFJ is interested in a lot of girls sexually, but he is selective in whom he befriends.


That's a great point that the men might stay for real friendship, even if their initial motives were suspect. But the initial motives and behavior are what make that possible.


----------



## Lunacik (Apr 19, 2014)

*In short:*
Typical females are overly-emotional and batshit crazy. Too many drama llamas.

*In-Depth:*
Most females who do get along with a lot of other females, are more emotional types that can _emotionally_ bond as the primary staple in the relationship...that, or they have a common enemy and bond over that.
*A lot of those girls try to bond over things like:*
*• Talking about feelings.*
*• Cute Animals, etc. *while I'm just sitting there staring at it like, "uhhhmmm it's a monkey..." _not emotionally moved by stuff like that_ but they interpret it as me being a bitch if I am not moved by things the way they are.
*• Cute Boys* (Me: Ok? So they have a nice body...so what's your point? Is that supposed to be impressive?)
*• Relationship Issues *(Me: shouldn't I be talking to the person I have an issue with instead, so that we can resolve things and move on?)
*• Dirty Secrets *(It will make them feel close when things are good, like they're "special" and "trusted," but they will later use against you if they get upset, even if they don't have a right to be upset over something because they caused it, then later they'll regret it even though damage is done, and because they're so emotionally out of control they cannot _actually_ be trusted.)


*In stark contrast, here are my typical interactions with other women:*

• Just because I tend to have a lot of submissive males following me around, they automatically assume I'm competition. In reality I'm screaming inside my head, "Please get these fucking lost pups a girlfriend..." because I love alpha males who can challenge me, not baby males who need someone to coddle them. That's the type you attract though, when you're a female who's somewhere on the Gamma / Alpha spectrum by nature.

• They seduce my male friends _not_ because they actually want them, but just to try to "take" them from me, all because they're entirely void of any sense of self worth and it makes them feel a little better about themselves if they _could_ get the guy. Meanwhile, my guy friends are stupid enough to get their hopes up and be led on, not even seeing any of the subtleties at all, and *that entire classic situation just really pisses me off; the girls because they're malicious, my guy friends because they're morons, but if I try to warn them I'm just a "jealous asshole."*
*It's sort of difficult to want to be friends with people who are like that from the moment they meet you.*

• The friendship can't just be genuine and relaxed because it's all a bunch of mind games, there's always an air of deceit and manipulation following these girls, adhering to them like it's their shadow...*(plus, as an ENTJ / INTJ, I don't pick up on subtle emotions enough to play their mind games back and forth even if I did have the patience for it. I pick up on the most subtle of cognitive dynamics with accuracy, but not the emotional ones.)*

• They turn a normal setting into subtle bashing just because I'm comfortable in my own skin and not wearing fake-up or showing off my tits. They think that if I don't look like a "girly" girl that day, somehow I'm some sort of peasant and they're the queen.

• When there's a problem, they gossip or run their mouths to everyone BUT me, which only makes matters worse, all the while_ I have no clue they even have a problem with me to begin with but they expect me to hunt them down and make amends...*they think you're supposed to read their minds.*_

• They are _hypersensitive_...if you don't agree with them every step of the way, or if you tell them they're wrong and "this is why," they blow up like it's a personal attack.

• _Even in their jokes_ they're after a power struggle and you can't just simply have fun without some sort of underlying mind game.

• Expect you to get on your hands and knees and be their servant practically if you admit to a mistake.

• Guilt trips. Manipulation. Vindictiveness. Deceit. Insincerity, ulterior motives.* Insecurity.*

*Most men don't even notice how many mind games women are actually playing in the shadows. That's why they get along with them better. They're entirely oblivious and don't understand women. That's what makes them compatible.*
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7d/88/98/7d8898d6d7294cc0767b3c2c254e6822.jpg

http://in1.ccio.co/S6/OE/k4/2b9073d26017fa78f7880b8343f2ff0f.jpg?iw=300


*Don't get me wrong, I do befriend the minority who isn't like this. Those women are incredibly rare, but when I do find them, we actually end up getting along better than we do with guys and being best friends for many years. Guys come and go more...usually once they realize they actually are friend-zoned like I was saying all along and they interpret it as rejection.*


----------



## Elaihr (Jun 24, 2015)

First off, I'm an INFJ, if that matters at all... Then, I think the reason why I've been getting along with males better might be because I've always preferred sincere people, and when I've been around guys there haven't been any "games" going on... They've been more straight forward and honest, which I actually appreciate. 

Also as a kid I was extremely un-concerned with things like boys, or clothes, or make up, or parties, and liked books, computer games, animals and the outdoors better... And most girls my age didn't like those things. They liked to talk about clothes, or parties, or who was together with whom. The boys seemed more willing to be outdoors with me, they didn't think it was as nerdy to play computer games as they did so themselves, and so on. I know this sounds very stereotypical, but that's actually how it was. Come to think of it, I have no female friends who are like that, the only ones I have are a bit androgynous, even a bit "butch"... Hm. Weird.

Anyway, I also feel like with guys, I've been able to connect more easily on a spiritual level as there hasn't been any competition between us in the same way. With other girls there's always been talk about looks and boys, and uugh, it gets in the way! The guys I've been friends with haven't been competing with me in these areas, so we could simply enjoy each others' company without having to think about such things, and instead focused on what we really wanted to talk about, or what we really wanted to do. It's felt more genuine, I suppose  

Also as an introvert I require a certain amount of alone-time, which guys have seemed to be more accepting of. They've been more like "ah you wanna be alone, cool, seeya tomorrow instead", while my female friends have been more intrusive, like "but honey, how are you, are you sure you're alright? Want me to come over and you can tell me everything?". The latter has been really horrible, and I hate to say it, but those friendships never lasted for long... Not because I've been rude or anything, but they just wouldn't get "no honestly, I just need some alone-time, I'm perfectly fine, just playing with my parrots/watching some films ". I suppose they've felt like I didn't let them in enough, or like I wouldn't let them help me, or like they didn't mean anything to me, or something...


----------



## Elaihr (Jun 24, 2015)

Corah said:


> *Don't get me wrong, I do befriend the minority who isn't shallow, snobby to compensate for low self-esteem, feeding on attention, etc. Those women are rare, but when I do find them, we actually end up getting along better than we do with guys and being best friends for many years. Guys come and go more...usually once they realize I was serious all along, and they actually are friend-zoned like I was saying all along.*


That's exactly the case with me and my best friend, who is a female ESTJ. She's the oldest friend I have, and the best. I seem to like T-girls


----------



## Lunacik (Apr 19, 2014)

Elaihr said:


> First off, I'm an INFJ, if that matters at all... Then, I think the reason why I've been getting along with males better might be because I've always preferred sincere people, and when I've been around guys there haven't been any "games" going on... They've been more straight forward and honest, which I actually appreciate.
> 
> Also as a kid I was extremely un-concerned with things like boys, or clothes, or make up, or parties, and liked books, computer games, animals and the outdoors better... And most girls my age didn't like those things. They liked to talk about clothes, or parties, or who was together with whom. The boys seemed more willing to be outdoors with me, they didn't think it was as nerdy to play computer games as they did so themselves, and so on. I know this sounds very stereotypical, but that's actually how it was. Come to think of it, I have no female friends who are like that, the only ones I have are a bit androgynous, even a bit "butch"... Hm. Weird.
> 
> ...



It does sound stereotypical, but the only reason it has a bad name is from the girls who pretend to be that way when they're not, just because guys tend to be more attracted to girls who genuinely are like that for the long-term, and the others they're more attracted to for the "short term" if you get what I mean.



> Also as an introvert I require a certain amount of alone-time, which guys have seemed to be more accepting of. They've been more like "ah you wanna be alone, cool, seeya tomorrow instead", while my female friends have been more intrusive, like "but honey, how are you, are you sure you're alright? Want me to come over and you can tell me everything?".


And yeah honestly though most females sort of _want_ you to do this with them. Want you to chase 'em down and pry their feelings out of 'em. So when you do it...people probably assume you're wanting that.
Fuck all that. Say what you mean, mean what you say, and don't be mean saying it. ;P


----------



## sereneone (Aug 1, 2013)

Corah said:


> *Most men don't even notice how many mind games women are actually playing in the shadows. That's why they get along with them better. They're entirely oblivious and don't understand women. That's what makes them compatible.*
> https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7d/88/98/7d8898d6d7294cc0767b3c2c254e6822.jpg
> 
> http://in1.ccio.co/S6/OE/k4/2b9073d26017fa78f7880b8343f2ff0f.jpg?iw=300
> ...


I thought my response was cynical, but - wow - you are twice as cynical. I think I like you. lol

I don't think our replies are necessarily in conflict either. I think men are largely motivated by dating or sex ritual, and they may in fact be oblivious to the layered and nuanced communications that women give them back. The fact is men make themselves available and maintain a positive interaction in spite of these things, which tends to self-perpetuate their interactions with women. And - as you say - if a woman makes a man realize he is friend-zoned, the interaction tends to end. That agrees with my point that the male motivation for the interaction is usually around dating/sex ritual, habit, or validation of power.


----------



## Elaihr (Jun 24, 2015)

@Corah

You are most likely right. It's really annoying though that people expect you to be in a certain way so much, that they won't even hear you when you basically shout "I'M NOT LIKE THAT WOULD YOU FRIGGIN LISTEN!". Luckily those who know me understand this, so when I say I'm fine, I really am fine, and if I wanna be alone, I just want to be alone. And that's it.

I really liked your last sentence. _"Say what you mean, mean what you say, and don't be mean saying it"_. I've never heard it before so I have no idea if you came up with it or got it from somewhere else, but either way, thanks for sharing  It was a comprehensive way of putting it!


----------



## Persephone (Nov 14, 2009)

sereneone said:


> I thought my response was cynical, but - wow - you are twice as cynical. I think I like you. lol
> 
> I don't think our replies are necessarily in conflict either. I think men are largely motivated by dating or sex ritual, and they may in fact be oblivious to the layered and nuanced communications that women give them back. The fact is men make themselves available and maintain a positive interaction in spite of these things, which tends to self-perpetuate their interactions with women. And - as you say - if a woman makes a man realize he is friend-zoned, the interaction tends to end. That agrees with my point that the male motivation for the interaction is usually around dating/sex ritual, habit, or validation of power.


If any of you are interested in an academic exploration of the dynamics and competition between women, the book "In the Company of Women" does a great job. For a take on the more negative aspects, "Woman's Inhumanity to Woman" is also a good exploration. I picked up these books because, well, for the obvious reasons.


----------



## gmaslin (Feb 28, 2015)

@Elaihr


> "Say what you mean, mean what you say, and don't be mean saying it".


My mother would always say this to me and I said it directly to Kim Garst when I met her at Boom! with my friend Gary. She has been popularizing it ever since. It's funny how quotes get accredited.

+1 on the books recommended above.


----------



## Lunacik (Apr 19, 2014)

sereneone said:


> I thought my response was cynical, but - wow - you are twice as cynical. I think I like you. lol
> 
> I don't think our replies are necessarily in conflict either. I think men are largely motivated by dating or sex ritual, and they may in fact be oblivious to the layered and nuanced communications that women give them back. The fact is men make themselves available and maintain a positive interaction in spite of these things, which tends to self-perpetuate their interactions with women. And - as you say - if a woman makes a man realize he is friend-zoned, the interaction tends to end. That agrees with my point that the male motivation for the interaction is usually around dating/sex ritual, habit, or validation of power.


Yep. They assume you're playing hard to get or something. Ties into what @Elaihr and I were talking about, how they sort of keep being insistent when really, no actually means no from a girl for once. It's kind of bullshit though because it just goes to show they only wanted you for shallow reasons, not because they really love who you are and want to hang out with you even without being together with you. That, and...Idk how many times a guy has blown up on me over feeling rejected once it sinks in. Egos, man...egos...they can't take it.

The men who hang out with women wanting more, reassure the woman by giving her attention...so where felame-felame interaction would revolve around insecurity and competition, male-felame would be more of a give and take in that dept...whiiiiich sort of turns out to be a situation where the guy is plagued by the woman's insecurities if it goes on long-term.


----------



## Lunacik (Apr 19, 2014)

gmaslin said:


> @Elaihr
> My mother would always say this to me and I said it directly to Kim Garst when I met her at Boom! with my friend Gary. She has been popularizing it ever since. It's funny how quotes get accredited.
> 
> +1 on the books recommended above.


I've heard people say, "say what you mean, mean what you say" my whole life. My dad tacked on that last bit though, but I'm sure he's not the only one who ever has said it.


----------



## gmaslin (Feb 28, 2015)

@sereneone
I think you got the male _friendship_ dynamic pretty accurately but after reading all the other posts here I suspect we aren't being honest about the female motivation for friendship. Sexuality is closely tied to intimacy for us where it is less so for males so when we choose our female friends there is a strong sexual component by default. This probably explains why bisexuality is less traumatic for us. The different types of friends we make corroborates well with the gamut of our sexual desires. As for the men=tools comment, don't we need tools to get some things done?



I cant play the piano said:


> but jokes on you guys because i'm bi so the only reason i talk to any of you is because i want to get in your pants.


 LOL



Corah said:


> Ties into what @Elaihr and I were talking about, how they sort of keep being insistent when really, no actually means no from a girl for once.


I'm hoping this next comment doesn't flame up the really good conversation in this thread. I'm not speaking for anyone else here but I've been persuaded from a "no" to a "yes" by a persistent erection against my body. I mean, I'm only human.


----------



## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

I don't say I get a long with males *better* than females; but rather, I was always on the Tomboyish side until I reached 19 or so and started becoming more in touch with a more feminine side; it's not that I got along _better_ with males, it is just that, all the things I took an interest in, were nothing but male dominated. (e.g technology, video games, bugs, fighting, wrestling, etc). o__O I wasn't _avoiding_ my female counterparts per se, they were just never around. I mean,_ come on_, violent video games (GTA) are *fun* . 

I also _preferred_ being around adults more than I did my own age - it was just one of those things, of course my friends never understood why I rather sit and listen to adults mingle than be upstairs sitting around while we all teased and slapped each other and other immature *nonsense*. 

Regardless, its not gender specific - I don't have many female friends nor male ones for that matter. I am not ''against'' non-males and females or have some kind of hidden female hating plot going on or any such assumptions sounds rather silly and energy consuming, IMO. I *enjoy* the company of females.

On further speculation - I was an early bloomer in terms of sexuality and sex, around 6 years old or so - my interest in boys was very strong. I've always a fascination in boys. Perhaps, I was just sexually attracted and couldn't stay away, this may have all been subconscious. I do like a nice paynus.


----------



## dulcinea (Aug 22, 2011)

Children Of The Bad Revolution said:


> I side eye women who say this. You're not a ~Cool Girl~. Why be against other women.



As someone who gets along with guys more often, it's not that I'm against other women. I just get sick of being badmouthed everytime I do something unconventional in a social setting, because I wasn't aware of some unspoken social rule. Probably why I get along with more tomboyish women. Can't speak for everyone though. I don't think being someone who likes to gossip makes you a "cool girl" which tends to be true of 99% of the female population here, at least.


----------



## Saturnian Devil (Jan 29, 2013)

I think it depends. For some girls, I think it's got a lot to do with how a lot of girls and young women tend to be into that competitive crap. It's exhausting and, frankly, that kind of behavior is petty to me. But I don't hate women or anything, nor do I see the point in going around making misogynistic comments toward other women. I also don't consider all females to be drama queens. 

However, I've noticed that, a lot of the time, girls/women who go around bragging about how they only get along with guys are just doing it for male attention. It's obvious in the way they go about it. Watch carefully and you'll notice they become just as catty as the girls they claim to hate. They also never shut up about how other women annoy them and what have you. Now, the ones who genuinely happen to have more male friends due to having traditionally masculine interests (like gaming, science, sports, etc.) are the ones I'll never hear making those "Ugh, girls are so annoying. This is why I have male friends more" type statements. They just do their thing and mind their business. 

Anyway, that's my personal take on the subject. As far as my friends, the ratio of male to female friends I've got is rather even. My two best friends are female and we get along very well. If you're a woman or girl who happens to be chill, interesting, and we have something in common, I'll be cool with you regardless of whether or not you're traditionally feminine.


----------



## Enxu (Dec 14, 2012)

It could be personality or mindset. Some girls are more masculine. Others see fellow women as competition/enemy.


----------



## Aya the Abysswalker (Mar 23, 2012)

It felt natural. I always liked boy things, so it felt natural to get along with them.


----------

