# Istj or Intj



## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

> can't recall anyone from elementary names or faces unless I have been in constant contact. Middle school and the distant past is really blurry. That's some amazing memory.


haha yes, I suppose my memory is good. There's the stereotype that Si users have the best memories. Perhaps it is true. 



> How did you know? Yes, it' s a bad habit. Lol it's not only movies and books , there's also dramas and anime. In one case, I was watching a Korean drama and with in the first 20 minutes I predicted what was going to happen and who was going to end up with who. I even said lines that just seemed predictable. Only for everyone else to get annoyed. oops.


Because Ni is about looking for those subconscious clues to "predict the future" that's why it's got the mystical stereotype. 



> Lol cx It can be a whole month or even years.... sometimes a week or more. It depends. Right now I have an interest in Personality Types. There's so much going on it's going to take a while to master this. This began last year early fall maybe. Astrology is an on and off again thing. Maybe a whole month. A person could also be an interest... I think an obsession with someone that leads the one obsessing to think they are in love... 4 years It was a bad case of limerence. The problem is that while I may have other thoughts or concerns I end up engaged in anything to do with that particular interest to the point that I may neglect more present matters. It also seems to be the only thing I can talk about. *sigh* Anime and dramas are around a week. Books a day to a week. I tend to need to finish what I start and then forget about it. It's always the names. xD


Hmm, I'm starting to see evidence of possible Ni over Si. 

This site describes who you are at your worst:

Accurate Typing: The Inferior Function - MBTI Notes

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the INTJ's shadow may appear - a negative form of ESFP. Example characteristics are doing things to excess - e.g.: eating, drinking or exercising - acting very impulsively, and perhaps starting off more projects than the INTJ could hope to accomplish. You may express emotions in an intensive and uncontrolled way, be very sensitive to criticism, and ask for lots of information that is irrelevant. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An INTJ may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the ENTJ's shadow may appear - a negative form of ISFP. Example characteristics are withdrawing and wanting to be alone, having intense emotions, that may or may not be expressed, being very sensitive to criticism, acting very impulsively, and doing things to excess. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An ENTJ may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the ISTJ's shadow may appear - a negative form of ENFP. Example characteristics are having a gloomy view of a future, suggesting impractical ideas, acting impulsively, and changing things without any thought. You might also have intense negative feelings towards others, though you might not necessarily express them. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An ISTJ may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising them in him/her self.

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the ESTJ's shadow may appear - a negative form of INFP. Example characteristics are withdrawing and wanting to be alone, having intense emotions (that may or may not be expressed) being very sensitive to criticism, and attributing unrealistic negative meaning to others actions or statements. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An ESTJ may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.

Inferior Ne:

The Plight of Inferior Ne - Funky MBTI in Fiction

Inferior Se:

Inferior Se in an INFJ - Funky MBTI in Fiction

Inferior Se: the monk's inner libertine - Funky MBTI in Fiction

Inferior Fi:

Inferior Fi - Funky MBTI in Fiction


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## Monyxg (Dec 29, 2015)

Great Links!a
In the first Website,


> Do you feel mentally shut down, like you are tired of thinking? Do you often feel an underlying anger, or ready to rant/rage at the slightest provocation, or want to systematically tear someone down?.... Do you compulsively check on certain things or fuss about aesthetic details in your environment, even your/others’ physical appearance?


 This resonates strongly with me. Especially the anger and getting easily upset which is not in my character. Not too long ago, it was the dreaded finals week and I was worrying about my grades. I was extremely stressed and ended up lashing out at my brother and getting over emotional about the lighting in that particular environment. I was convinced that the smallest detail could affect how I studied which usually is not the case. I guess I can get impulsive... hmmm... 

Although those do match at my worst, I don't do anything excessively. The eating, drinking, or exercising.... perhaps exercising even then... In the long run it causes serious damage to my overall health. I have a health condition that demands of me to follow strict guidelines that I get tired of. I really dislike routines

Another case of stress, although I may procrastinate it's rarely to the point where I barely have enough time to complete the assignment. I had a physics project along with a written lab report due and I had left it to the last days. Again, if anyone bothered me ...including my mom I would be incredibly upset and just ignore everyone. I send a "don't even look at me vibe". 



> Do you become more clumsy and lose some control over your body?


 I have always been clumsy in the first place xD


Second website, I don't relate to it all. The idea of change has never really bothered or scared me to the point where I avoid it



> spend too much money on something that I don’t really need. I also sometimes miss opportunities when they come to me sometimes.


 Hmmm... 

In the last Inferior Se: I found that I didn't relate to any of that. I don't become extreme with actual out there activities. 

Inferior Fi:


> It’s not even that I’ve disappointed others, the key here is I’ve disappointed myself.
> 
> Even though I’m crying, this does not mean “approach me and we’ll have a deep conversation about your feelings and insecurities" because that is what does not happen. I don’t know what I’m feeling. You don’t know what I’m feeling. Stop asking. I’m crying and the vague reason is that I’ve disappointed myself in some way and you aren’t helping right now. Go do something productive, away from me.


 Yes. I relate to this but not over grades but similar. That feeling of being disappointed in yourself can be at times too self critical. I don't think I have actually thought this during what I may consider stressful situations, rather it' s in the sort of scenarios where feelings such as guilt/remorse are expected. 

I read more on the mbti-notes tumblr. Apparently a well developed, or balanced personality type is able to use all functions appropriately meanwhile not changing the order of the functions. If I understand this correctly, correct me if I'm not. The Se is responsible for taking in the present moment as it is and it's details. The Ni function subconsciously makes connections and predictions using what the Se collected. So all the functions work together se collects, ni makes deep connections to one point, te makes plans that have results, fi establishes personal values and morals, and J basically means structure and focus on one subject.
Ni<Se ... Ni is focused and se is broad. yes? ti is internal thinking? trying to understand something first.

So then Ne>Si Ne is broad all of the possible connections and Si is more focused on details- internal past collections 
If this works then it all depends on the order of the functions. This determines how you perceive your surroundings aka as Personality Types and make decisions. 

Alrighty then. :tongue:


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

Well, according to theory people can't change the order of their functions. 

Yes, but Se is not nostalgic or sentimental like Si is. Fi is just personal values, has a narrow focus, and is subjective. Whereas, Fe is more about morals, has a broad focus, and is objective. Don't think about the letters, such as J vs P when typing yourself or anyone else, just the functions. 

For example, how each dominant function writes a novel:

"Te: Write an outline with an estimated word count and charted plot points / progression for each subsequent chapter.

Ti: Invent a logically consistent world that makes sense from a narrative point of view, and perhaps go some way in inventing languages along the way.

Fe: Decide what emotional impact you want your novel to have, and find an appropriate way to express difficult themes without alienating the reader.

Fi: Find a theme that resonates with a deep personal belief or experience, and write it mostly for yourself.

Ne: Start writing. After a few chapters you wind up with 45 main characters and subsequent plot lines all running simultaneously. 

Ni: Spend months and even years visualizing every element of your highly conceptual story, then sit down and write it without much revision (may also write about conceptual archetypes). 

Se: Emphasis is on impacting sentences and intense experiences for the reader. Sensory details are devoid of emotional sentiment.

Si: Focuses on those physical archetypes and themes that are significant to you, often supplemented by a vast library of reading experience. Natural sense of plot structure.

Combine these and you can see how writers tap into different functions. Something I have noticed is that N writers often incorporate description to try and ground their story or make it seem more real, whereas sensor writers usually tap into their intuitive functions to branch out into unexplored territories. Feelers might dip into thinking to structure their worlds with logic and/or explore different principles, just as thinkers might explore emotions through their writing. 

Often our lower functions are how we “play” so we access them during writing. "


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## Monyxg (Dec 29, 2015)

When the Si looks back and recalls a past experience does he not only remember how he felt, but also manifest those feelings in the present? Or is it just remembering how he felt and learning from those experiences in order to avoid or pursue a decision. 

When I look back to the past. I remember the moment and put a name to the emotion I may have felt. But that's as far as it goes. 




> Often our lower functions are how we “play” so we access them during writing.


That does makes sense. In this manner, you can identify and type writers of novels.

What about reading material? As in what they read could that also help in typing. I've noticed that compared to certain people... I enjoy different reading material. I have a friend that when we go to the reading section at a store always picks the celebrity magazines while I pick the national geographic or a psychology magazine...novels with meaning.... My mom is always at the top of current international politic/business news... Grandma is gossip and news...Dad is movies and films... hmmm 

I was thinking about the functions and trying my newly acquired knowledge to type. I have found that once I have a general picture of someones type it helps me understand their personality better. It gives me a better insight to their thoughts and actions and in this way enables me to communicate better and be more tolerant. I have no patience at times. 

My first thought: my mom is most likely ExTJ. Her first function is definitely Te... Her profession is that of accounting manager and she has to work with people, move people, and figure out how to organize job by what is required. She enjoys this job. Her first concern is actual evidence of work. Now, it's either ni or si... So I tried to think of how she reacts when she's stressed. Her emotions are all out of the place and when we're talking about a topic such as gun control... She gets extremely subjective, emotional, and angry. She also comes up with really unlikely scenarios.. I just can't with her at those times... I was asking about the Si and how it is manifested at the present. She'll remember something that made her really upset and feel like that and behave in such a way. She tends to get stuck in the past. It's the same with my grandma. They'll get angry or begin crying. so ESTJ 

My grandma Is definitely ESFJ. Her primary function is Fe. No question about it. She is constantly worrying and getting anxiety about the well-being of other people. She also says that if she doesn't talk with other people she gets depressed and lonely. Another thing is, she absolutely despises arguments or fights. Her Si comes out when talking about traditions and her love for routine. She does the same thing everyday without a thought about it. Fe comes before Si since even as a child she was voted for most liked or something.. an award as such. 

I don't know about my dad. He has changed philosophically speaking. He doesn't appear to use Si at all. When stressed he points out the errors in others... gets really hypocritical and also subjective... Definitely extrovert.. claims to be a player in the 'old days' LOL xD ... Maybe ESFP... not much of a planner... bad grades.. His job is head cook. He's great with tastes and makes exquisite food. 

If the provided guesses are accurate then I'm not Si dominant. 

Would those be good predictions oh wise one? It's not sarcasm btw C:


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

> When the Si looks back and recalls a past experience does he not only remember how he felt, but also manifest those feelings in the present? Or is it just remembering how he felt and learning from those experiences in order to avoid or pursue a decision.
> 
> When I look back to the past. I remember the moment and put a name to the emotion I may have felt. But that's as far as it goes.


Si is sort of both. 



> What about reading material? As in what they read could that also help in typing. I've noticed that compared to certain people... I enjoy different reading material. I have a friend that when we go to the reading section at a store always picks the celebrity magazines while I pick the national geographic or a psychology magazine...novels with meaning.... My mom is always at the top of current international politic/business news... Grandma is gossip and news...Dad is movies and films... hmmm


I generally go for the same types of genres over and over again. I think visual people tend to like movies over books, but more so the extraverted visual types. 

Your guesses sound accurate but I don't know them personally, so I can't say your guesses are 100% accurate. 

The first video is pretty accurate except he says INTJ's think about "what could be"...which is actually Ne. But other than that it's accurate in my opinion. 






Michael Pierce is legit.


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## Monyxg (Dec 29, 2015)

I think that the most difficult part of typing myself had to do with my age. I am an adolescent and still developing anatomically and mentally. Younger than 20... still leaves room for evolving. My personality will develop even further as time goes by and I am looking forward to the changes. As the first video mentioned, both personalities are similar in that they are recluse and it is even more difficult when raised in a different environments. In my case, with extroverts and sensors. 

In the videos I related to the surreal interests and challenging beliefs. I think its interesting and complex how environment has a major role on personality development. I am surrounded by tradition and importance in what is and was along with strict norms. This has manifested in religion. However, when it comes to tradition or simple what it may look like but what it really is I do challenge everything. I enjoy acting as the devil's advocate and discussing people's perceptions and opinions. 

I found more information but rather than on the typical intj profile of an adult I searched for the young or adolescent. I questioned people known to me what my attitude was like a child and got the responses of silently defiant, creative and artistic, and mature. I want to say the circumstances have made me what I am. The best way to express my feelings, emotions, and thoughts has always been through writing in the form of poems and actions. I found narrative stories I wrote as a middle school student and found them loaded with sensory details. lol Even though I am an introvert, I enjoy dancing, singing, and drawing...origami aye!... making my own tunes The moment I entered High School I actually became more extrovert still quiet but more social with joining marching band. However, I felt that I was completely isolate during football games or competitions. Just there, but not belonging there even when surrounded by all sorts of people. I actually enjoy socializing but get tired real fast. 

Alright I have come to the conclusion that I am in fact an Intj.
The question was Si vs Ni
And from these videos It's a strong ni. The abstract and attraction to the surreal. Arts, concepts, novels and anything theoretical or creative. Fiction... I appreciate all forms of artwork and expressions even if I can't handle emotions of others... cringe... but I'm working on desensitizing myself... or would it be conditioning hmmmm. I understand why routine and traditions are fundamental but when it comes down to it ... it's not really my thing. The whole looking forward and striving into the future. Having a general notion of the future outcome and embracing it rather than fearing it. Change has never made me uncomfortable and I prefer constant innovation. There is always room for improvement. Oh and the random I know what's going to happen or why it happens moments.

When it comes down to it, each individual is exactly that... unique... and The only person who knows if Intj is my personality is myself and if I think it fits me best. So yeah  


I mean to originally write less and end up with paragraphs... sigh... if only it were the case for erwc 


Again I am most thankful. I have gained a lot of knowledge from this entire thread. 


"Knowledge is Power" - Francis Bacon
or even better
"Knowledge is Power is Time is Money" - _Storm and Silence_


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

> Again I am most thankful. I have gained a lot of knowledge from this entire thread.
> 
> 
> "Knowledge is Power" - Francis Bacon
> ...


You're welcome  That is my main motto "Knowledge is power." I wish you the best of luck on your journey of self-discovery.


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