# What goes on in an SJ's mind?



## steerthestars

On behalf of all intuitive types-- oh, the lowly 21.5% of people who lose their car keys in the midst of extreme theorization and mental story-telling-- what on earth do sensors, particularly SJs, think about?

When you're zoned out in class or a boring lecture, or when you're doing rote, easy work (like dishwashing, potato peeling, filing, etc.) what do you think about? How do you not dream? How do you pay attention?


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## Dr. Metallic

The SJ mind must be a terrible place. I think it's really neurotic.
Sometimes I seriously can't pay attention in a (very) boring lecture. I think about all kinds of things (particularly the book series I'm writing--It just sort of creeps in there).


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## moon

Plans to take over the world.


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## Perseus

*Crazies*



Hooded Knight said:


> The SJ mind must be a terrible place. I think it's really neurotic.
> Sometimes I seriously can't pay attention in a (very) boring lecture. I think about all kinds of things (particularly the book series I'm writing--It just sort of creeps in there).


You would not believe the mind of a SF Irrational.


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## Linesky

Why do you all seem to view yourselves as better? It's just a difference, not a gradation. 

Oh, and I also wonder what goes on in there, they seem to be good at sticking to chores and preserving things (like cultures or something? or keeping in touch? etc), which I actually admire, well, especially "my P" does, "a little J" wouldn't hurt I assume,..at least in certain areas.. [yo, MBTI slang]


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## TreeBob

wow so when did it become a what is going on in an N mind? Hooded you are acting like and ass by the way. 

I don't know what everyone else in the SP/SJ world is thinking, but I think about chicks mainly. Basically, whatever is in my head at the time. I don't think about complex equations or theories of how the universe was created, flowers, moonlight or any other NT/NF stuff.

Sometimes that stuff interests me, but we are talking 5 minutes. I am an EST so I am on the go, thinking about the next time I can interact with a living human being. That is about it. I am sure some of you think that means I am stupid, ignorant, shallow or whatever. In fact I am none of those things.


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## T-Guy

Similar to Treebob. I think about what I have to do next when I'm not concentrating on something that I'm doing.


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## Perseus

*Member of Parliament*



TreeBob said:


> wow so when did it become a what is going on in an N mind? Hooded you are acting like and ass by the way.
> 
> I don't know what everyone else in the SP/SJ world is thinking, but I think about chicks mainly. Basically, whatever is in my head at the time. I don't think about complex equations or theories of how the universe was created, flowers, moonlight or any other NT/NF stuff.
> 
> Sometimes that stuff interests me, but we are talking 5 minutes. I am an EST so I am on the go, thinking about the next time I can interact with a living human being. That is about it. I am sure some of you think that means I am stupid, ignorant, shallow or whatever. In fact I am none of those things.


Just like a Member of Parliament (UK) filling in the Expenses form without thinking of the consequences. And these people could be in charge of the War Machine!


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## thewindlistens

T-Guy said:


> I think about what I have to do next when I'm not concentrating on something that I'm doing.


That sounds awfully... empty, for the lack of a better word. I can't imagine a life like that. I think that would be quite exactly the opposite of me.




TreeBob said:


> I am sure some of you think that means I am stupid, ignorant, shallow or whatever. In fact I am none of those things.


I don't, that would be childish, and let's face it, stupid and ignorant, as you put it. 

One of the traits of an N is to be (more) comfortable in looking at things from different perspectives. As an INTP, I always take the role of devil's advocate, especially when, for instance, people are gossiping. I find it instinctively easy to put myself in the shoes of the attacked person and defend them from 'their' point of view. My friends always go "why are you defending that asshole", but to me it's obvious.

The only thing you can be sure of when people look down on you for being simply what you are is that they're immature.


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## Psilo

I have to admit that I'm interested in this question as well. I'm curious as to what goes on in an S type's mine, particularly an extrovert. It just seems to be different than my day to day life. My surroundings are alive will hidden information, hidden connections, and possibilities waiting to be discovered and explored. I can't ever think about what to do next because I'm probably not thinking about what I'm doing right then. 

I also must agree it does sound like it is shallow, but I don't believe that to be true. You guys are just not as enthused about sharing the way you think it's become this interesting mystery. I'm speaking mainly from my experience with people. What kind of depth is it? I imagine it radiates outward rather than inward, but I'm curious as to what that is like.

If I may use the forest and trees analogy, I imagine you have a more firmer grasp on the true beauty of the trees while I stand in awe at the forest. Similar depth for completely different reasons.

Sorry, ESxx's are fascinating to me. It's so different than anything I've experienced.


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## TreeBob

Psilo said:


> I have to admit that I'm interested in this question as well. I'm curious as to what goes on in an S type's mine, particularly an extrovert. It just seems to be different than my day to day life. My surroundings are alive will hidden information, hidden connections, and possibilities waiting to be discovered and explored. I can't ever think about what to do next because I'm probably not thinking about what I'm doing right then.


I dated and INFP and we clicked rather well, and very quick. It was one of the best 4 month periods in my life. Unlike other N types they didn't say a lot of confusing words and I understood them rather easily. i could sense when she was having a problem and I enjoyed getting her to talk about this. I realize that was very hard for her being the type she is. 



Psilo said:


> I also must agree it does sound like it is shallow, but I don't believe that to be true. You guys are just not as enthused about sharing the way you think it's become this interesting mystery. I'm speaking mainly from my experience with people. What kind of depth is it? I imagine it radiates outward rather than inward, but I'm curious as to what that is like.


Sensors tend not to speak in metaphor or hyperbole. We can be enthused about an issue but when we speak it won't be wordy like you. We say what we think and typically come to the point rather quickly. I don't understand your depth question sorry. Radiating out??


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## de l'eau salée

TreeBob said:


> Sensors tend not to speak in metaphor or hyperbole. We can be enthused about an issue but when we speak it won't be wordy like you. We say what we think and typically come to the point rather quickly. I don't understand your depth question sorry. Radiating out??


While I do really enjoy metaphors, I don't really like it when they're used in conversation where I'm trying to understand something, especially when it's somewhat hard to grasp. Some metaphors, similes, analogies, or whatever non-literal figurative language it may be can be hazy and unclear. The fact that I'm trying to understand something and then I'm told it a non-literal can be very frustrating because there's always the, "Wait, did I interpret that wrong?" thought in my head. I appreciate literalness because it's much harder to mistranslate, and if I mistranslate it, that can affect the conversation or the opinions in it a lot. I think metaphors and stuff are more for fun rather than seriousness to me.
Does that make me an S? I dunno, possibly roud:.


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## TreeBob

Silhouetree said:


> While I do really enjoy metaphors, I don't really like it when they're used in conversation where I'm trying to understand something, especially when it's somewhat hard to grasp. Some metaphors, similes, analogies, or whatever non-literal figurative language it may be can be hazy and unclear. The fact that I'm trying to understand something and then I'm told it a non-literal can be very frustrating because there's always the, "Wait, did I interpret that wrong?" thought in my head. I appreciate literalness because it's much harder to mistranslate, and if I mistranslate it, that can affect the conversation or the opinions in it a lot. I think metaphors and stuff are more for fun rather than seriousness to me.
> Does that make me an S? I dunno, possibly roud:.


thinking or saying metaphor makes you a N, but the fact that you mainly think it, I think confirms your IN:mellow:


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## Darthmat

I daydream a lot about music. A lot. I almost always have some song running through my head. It's usually accompied by a visual. Usually a concert, but it can be the band jamming in a garage or something. When I'm really bored, I picture them parading through the halls of my school like they did in the music video I Wanna Rock by Twisted Sister. Otherwise, I'll usually be thinking ahead if I don't really need to think about the present. During the last period of the day, I often think of what things I need to pack so I am prepared by the time I get to my locker. On the bus ride home I'll think about how much time I need to dedicate to work and how much time I can play video games and browse the web. But if I am really interested in something, I will become totally absorbed in it and try my best to drown everything else out, and it often works.


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## Andrew Scott

Hooded Knight said:


> The SJ mind must be a terrible place. I think it's really neurotic.
> Sometimes I seriously can't pay attention in a (very) boring lecture. I think about all kinds of things (particularly the book series I'm writing--It just sort of creeps in there).


In Hooded Knight's defense I don't think the word neurotic should automatically be taken with a negative connotation. I mean I don't even think the word is used anymore in the majority of the psychiatric world. I would describe some of my thoughts as being neurotic. Look up the definition if you must, by most definitions I have read being under the influence of caffeine can be considered a neurotic state. 

Anyways, about the SJ mind, I don't think anyone besides SJs quite know. But I can guarantee that they think they are more rational than intuitive types. I wont explain my reasoning here, maybe another time.


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## TreeBob

Andrew Scott said:


> In Hooded Knight's defense I don't think the word neurotic should automatically be taken with a negative connotation. I mean I don't even think the word is used anymore in the majority of the psychiatric world. I would describe some of my thoughts as being neurotic. Look up the definition if you must, by most definitions I have read being under the influence of caffeine can be considered a neurotic state.
> 
> Anyways, about the SJ mind, I don't think anyone besides SJs quite know. But I can guarantee that they think they are more rational than intuitive types. I wont explain my reasoning here, maybe another time.


That is cause they are more rationale:laughing:


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## Perseus

Trouble with Sensors is they think that Ns think like them. And when they don't they get hurt/confused/angry/manipulative/vindictive/contrite etc. 

SFs are the worst. They are Irrational. *Beware!*


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## Psilo

> Sensors tend not to speak in metaphor or hyperbole. We can be enthused about an issue but when we speak it won't be wordy like you. We say what we think and typically come to the point rather quickly. I don't understand your depth question sorry. Radiating out??


I was saying S types generally aren't enthused about talking about HOW they think, not what they think. I'm interested in the differences between N and S types as far as how they see the world. In my experience, it's the most jarring differences between types as opposed to E/I or T/F. At least, personally, I can relate less to S types than any other difference in traits.

Ignore the depth question. That was a ramble and I can't clear it up.


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## TreeBob

Psilo said:


> I was saying S types generally aren't enthused about talking about HOW they think, not what they think. I'm interested in the differences between N and S types as far as how they see the world. In my experience, it's the most jarring differences between types as opposed to E/I or T/F. At least, personally, I can relate less to S types than any other difference in traits.
> 
> Ignore the depth question. That was a ramble and I can't clear it up.


Well shit that is an easy one. We see the world as it is. The sky is blue, unless there is smog. The grass is green unless it is unwatered. We see things simply as they are, with not too many frills. Now this is typical. Sometimes I find myself admiring some piece of nature that just pops out at me. Since I am an extroverted sensor I might even be more detail oriented but maybe you'd have to ask an introverted sensor what they see.


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## NewSoul

I don't really know what type I am, but here's my answer to the OP: I think about people a lot. I don't have many friends irl, so I like to wonder about them. I wonder why some are so snobby, some are so oblivious, and why some are so irrational, etc. My thoughts really aren't that complex, though. If I'm going on a long car ride, I'll just daydream or look at the sights out the window. I think about everyday life, mostly, and not too much more.


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## thewindlistens

TreeBob said:


> Well shit that is an easy one. We see the world as it is. The sky is blue, unless there is smog. The grass is green unless it is unwatered. We see things simply as they are, with not too many frills. Now this is typical. Sometimes I find myself admiring some piece of nature that just pops out at me. Since I am an extroverted sensor I might even be more detail oriented but maybe you'd have to ask an introverted sensor what they see.


So we Ns see the world as it isn't? How would you describe your thoughts on intuitive perception?


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## TreeBob

thewindlistens said:


> So we Ns see the world as it isn't? How would you describe your thoughts on intuitive perception?


I won't go in your head, the question was about sensors. You describe anyway you like using as many words as you like. I am not into theory or maybe you missed that about people like me.


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## Sidewinder

Psilo said:


> I was saying S types generally aren't enthused about talking about HOW they think, not what they think. I'm interested in the differences between N and S types as far as how they see the world. In my experience, it's the most jarring differences between types as opposed to E/I or T/F. At least, personally, I can relate less to S types than any other difference in traits.


Well, I'm an SP rather than SJ, but here goes ...

We mainly look and listen at what's around us, and are rooted in what's going on at present (although we do reflect on the very recent past and try to predict the immediate future, as that can tell us what to do next). The distant past and what might happen in the far future are less important. We see the world in terms of what we can do in and with it. We are motivated by action, and are comfortable doing favorite activities over and over again. We see how we can move forward or improve things by building or refining on what we already know. This tends to make us realistic and/or tactical. We almost never make huge imaginative leaps.

Sensors can imagine things too, but we tend to imagine concrete events, like how a dinner out is going to go, how a meal we are getting ready to prepare will turn out, what an upcoming concert might be like, how a particular chord progression might work with a song we are writing, how we can use Photoshop to present a picture we've just taken when we get home, etc. I personally never try to imagine how I can turn my stapler into a ray gun. :laughing: Of course, there are 8 types of sensors, and they all have their differences. Those details are very important!

This might be surprising, but I find that J vs P is the biggest difference! I think I get along with and understand INFPs better than ISFJs, for example. But I don't think there should be Sensor vs. Intuitive conflict. I like N-types and find them very interesting! :happy:


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## Psilo

That's understandable as both ISFP and INFP have dominant Fi unlike the auxilliary Fe of an ISFJ. There is the Si/Se difference as well. My best friend is ISFP and we are very similar people, for very different reasons. 

Also, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to pin one against the other. Just looking for insight. Thanks.


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## ArchonAlarion

This whole thread gets a F for fatiguingly pretentious and condescending

uhg MBTI is whack.

I would say that Si and Se are just as capable as any other type in theoretical matters, but here its like basically in the definition that they aren't lol.


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## Andrew Scott

It is very hard to find common ground in this discussion. I have read many books, about philosophy and psychology, and I have to say that the one thing that most pre and post-Jungian psychologists, as well as philosophers, agree upon is that the biggest difference in human personality is that of intuition and sensing(although not always in the same words). Although some would argue that the biggest difference in human personality would be Man and Woman, I don't agree. I have met women who think almost exactly the same as me. (They might have different sexual fantasies)


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## TreeBob

Andrew Scott said:


> It is very hard to find common ground in this discussion. I have read many books, about philosophy and psychology, and I have to say that the one thing that most pre and post-Jungian psychologists, as well as philosophers, agree upon is that the biggest difference in human personality is that of intuition and sensing(although not always in the same words). Although some would argue that the biggest difference in human personality would be Man and Woman, I don't agree. I have met women who think almost exactly the same as me. (They might have different sexual fantasies)


Archon is right. 

This thread started as a what is going on in an SJ mind. Due to a lack of SJ it became a general S mind. For some reason all the non-S people have decided they either don't like what is going on in our minds or you think you know better. If you don't like how "empty" our minds are keep it to yourself. WE happen to like how WE think.


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## NephilimAzrael

ArchonAlarion said:


> This whole thread gets a F for fatiguingly pretentious and condescending
> 
> uhg MBTI is whack.
> 
> I would say that Si and Se are just as capable as any other type in theoretical matters, but here its like basically in the definition that they aren't lol.


YouTube - Trollulz


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## ArchonAlarion

LOLLLL

Yep, slightly :blushed::laughing:

But its really sad to see how S's are rolled over like N's are little demigods.


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## TreeBob

ArchonAlarion said:


> LOLLLL
> 
> But its really sad to see how S's are rolled over like N's are little demigods.


As if some of them even stop at demi


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## Crystalview

Based on my experience with an SJ (my Mom) I've noticed two things about the Sensors that is different, First they are always the ones to stop and literally smell the roses as opposed to us N types who could pass by a whole field of roses without noticing it. Second, and I think this is a an SJ not an SP thing, they seem to have a higher awareness of time and money and are constantly asking questions about "when" and "how much" as opposed to the questions N types typically ask such as "why" and "how".


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## Perseus

Portait of an SJ Extreme, he was surprised to discover that he was human.

Extreme sensors would be like animals, reacting to events in the here and now. One thousandth post: about time I stopped for awhile. 

I have met one of these. He was a gardener by trade.


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## NephilimAzrael

Perseus said:


> Portait of an SJ Extreme, he was surprised to discover that he was human.


That lad is in my top ten fictional characters in the Discworld universe..


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## philtoxphobia

I once heard the comparison of N and S minds being different types of cameras. Sensing minds will focus in on the person, or detail, of what they see. Intuitives will see the background scenery behind the obvious. What drives me crazy is how sensing types never seem to pick up on certain meanings that are SO obvious to me. Even the most respectable, far more intelligent than myself, are often completely oblivious to so many things. It's like they are blind. They are so concentrated on what they are doing, doing it better, and thinking how they should in a predictable straight line. I know that they have their advantages, but I'm frustrated because I know I'm not seeing them clearly. I would have the question rephrased from "What goes on in an S mind" to How can the S type concentrate singly on what's at hand, instead of a million unrelated things like I do?


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## Sidewinder

Psilo said:


> Also, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to pin one against the other. Just looking for insight. Thanks.


No worries! I felt you meant well and were just looking for info. Glad to help. I always enjoy talking to INFP types. :happy:



TreeBob said:


> Archon is right.
> 
> This thread started as a what is going on in an SJ mind. Due to a lack of SJ it became a general S mind.


Good point. I believe we only had a couple of SJ types answer. Now that I read it over, I feel my own answer was more about how SP types approach sensing.



ArchonAlarion said:


> LOLLLL
> 
> But its really sad to see how S's are rolled over like N's are little demigods.


Most of the N's here have been nice and welcoming to me. There are a few who I see giving us a hard time. It's easy to ignore, and I don't worry about it too much. I think that most SPs are hella tough about stuff like that. Many of us have had to deal with real troubles in our lives. Some hard words on an Internet forum are nothing by comparison. :happy: I just try to present myself as I am and be a good role model, and hope that convinces people more than by arguing back. Everyone's got their different approach.


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## decided

philtoxphobia said:


> I once heard the comparison of N and S minds being different types of cameras. Sensing minds will focus in on the person, or detail, of what they see. Intuitives will see the background scenery behind the obvious. What drives me crazy is how sensing types never seem to pick up on certain meanings that are SO obvious to me. ...


I love this description Philtoxphobia, and definitely know what you mean!


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## Perseus

*Obvious*



philtoxphobia said:


> I once heard the comparison of N and S minds being different types of cameras. Sensing minds will focus in on the person, or detail, of what they see. Intuitives will see the background scenery behind the obvious. What drives me crazy is how sensing types never seem to pick up on certain meanings that are SO obvious to me. Even the most respectable, far more intelligent than myself, are often completely oblivious to so many things. It's like they are blind. They are so concentrated on what they are doing, doing it better, and thinking how they should in a predictable straight line. I know that they have their advantages, but I'm frustrated because I know I'm not seeing them clearly. I would have the question rephrased from "What goes on in an S mind" to How can the S type concentrate singly on what's at hand, instead of a million unrelated things like I do?


Nothing is ever obvious, even that is not obvious to a Sensor!

You Know .....


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## Ungweliante

I want to say that the Sensor mind is a mystery to me. At least one of my exs was a probable ESTJ and I could never understand him. What I can't understand attracts me - I feel utterly baffled that I often can't follow their thought processes at all. I want to understand.

One of my best friends is a probable ESFJ and I can't understand her either. We almost always get into friendly arguments about people's behaviour. We do complement each other, though - often she makes points and provides insight into other Sensors that I could never come up with myself. I've told her many times about how I see the world in a sort of layers, where many realities weave an intricate web of meaning upon the reality that is readily there. When I look at a tree, I don't just see a tree - I see a living organism with aesthetic value, whose history stretches out to the past as well as the possibilities to the future. She mostly just thinks that I'm psychotic :happy:


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## Andrew Scott

Ungweliante said:


> I want to say that the Sensor mind is a mystery to me. At least one of my exs was a probable ESTJ and I could never understand him. What I can't understand attracts me - I feel utterly baffled that I often can't follow their thought processes at all. I want to understand.
> 
> One of my best friends is a probable ESFJ and I can't understand her either. We almost always get into friendly arguments about people's behaviour. We do complement each other, though - often she makes points and provides insight into other Sensors that I could never come up with myself. I've told her many times about how I see the world in a sort of layers, where many realities weave an intricate web of meaning upon the reality that is readily there. When I look at a tree, I don't just see a tree - I see a living organism with aesthetic value, whose history stretches out to the past as well as the possibilities to the future. She mostly just thinks that I'm psychotic :happy:



Yeah, I understand. When I watch Planet Earth or something I just try to relate to all the living things in as many ways as possible, and that inevitably leads to kind of a 3 dimensional web of inter connectivity in my mind.


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## Kokos

To take the example of my ISTJ dad, one thing is sure anytime, he is way better at surviving to life than i am.

He likes money a lot, he likes making things or take them somewhere for the sake of selling them, he loves negotiating deals with people and to wander in the nature with his dog where he observes and see anything he could take. 

He is a work/pleasure oriented person, he likes working and get a reward for it, and enjoy simple stuff. There's nothing complicated to understand really. He just lives his life for himself like somekind of _Mad Max_ and will break the nose of anyone who will be on his path, haha


When i was young he was my best enemy and represented everything i shouldn't be, and now that i've grown up i admire him for just what he is, i see his qualities and bad sides. I guess it's part of being an adult .


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## Misspicy

Wow. Where to begin?

On a bad day, I try to keep my mind off of what is bothering me by keeping myself busy(small chores, drawing, taking a walk) but this is just when I can't do anything about bad events. It really depends. Other times I just want to be left alone so I can think about how to deal with myself (meditation), but on the other hand I also want my partner to give me just a little more affection than most days if he's around. This really helps especially if he encourages me to meditate if I still seem too negative.

Most days I just try to be productive, but since I have an over imaginative brain sometimes, I never seem to feel bored because I amuse myself with such silly ideas. (e.g.) Once I was just sitting down with my boyfriend and we were just talking but when it got silent for a while I just started laughing at this crazy thought. He kept asking what was so funny and I knew he was going to think I was weird or something but I just randomly pictured a large school bus flying through our living room window and crashing through the other... It was like my mind just wanted to break the silence so it came up with something (from my subconscious??)

This is just me though. These days I just enjoy the fact that I'm ALIVE and WELL. I also have a boyfriend so I do think of him often too, and what I'd like to be doing with him later on. Not in a sexual way, but maybe wondering what should I make for dinner for him that'll maybe be a surprise or clean up the room a bit so he can work in a better space. I just enjoy doing small things for him. That doesn't mean I don't give time to myself... I don't need a lot to be happy.

As for social things, I don't go too out of my way to hang out with friends. But I do find myself willing to drive for over an hour for someone thats really close to me even if it isn't necessary at all. I definitely give more than I need to to those I love the most. 

My mind is usually on priorities, and while I'm doing them, my mind is just a curious place to be. I don't mind people asking me about whats on my mind or how I'm feeling, in fact I wish people would ask more often. This is how I connect better with people...


but ask me at the right time, and occasionally a school bus will crash through the window:wink:


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## dasch

a lot of what goes in my mind is, what should I be doing and what should be done? in my mind there's like this list that I check off and when it's done, I can finally do whatever I want! :tongue:

get homework out of the way and it's all good. College has been a pain lately, a lot of homework!

and go to sleep in the end of the day with everything finished while the next day have a load for me.


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## BehindSmile

_My list seems never ending, and since I feel the need to accomplish everything...that could attribute to why I'm a stress-case :crazy:._


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## Irulan

pedrodavid said:


> I'm always thinking about my stuff, my people, and myself, and how to improve them... I like to read men's health, for example, because it has data that is usefull and practical. I think, for example: "I need to go to the gym today, don't be lazy", "I need to eat better", "that girl is hot!", "remember to change the tires", "my gf is mad at me", "my lap needs more RAM"... my mind is always full of random thoughts about how can I improve everything. My head is 100% of the time busy. Think, for example, Wall Street.
> 
> When I'm driving, I think about how to improve music (burn new cd's, getting a aux cable), I need to fix the sratch in the bumper, etc.
> 
> When I'm eating, I'm thinking if I like it or not, if I can improve it's flavor, if I can improve my efficency at eating to do more important stuff...
> 
> While having sex I think if she's enyoing it, or, "if I do this, does she like it?"... "I don't like this or that about her"... Sometimes I enjoy more doing things "perfect" than the acutal feel of them (I hate that, I would love to just feel and don't care about anything sometimes) I'm super critical about everything, to myself and to others.
> 
> Maybe this sounds empty, but it isn't... I always think about how to be happier, better, to make me and others around me happier and more comfortable (maybe they would be happier if I just relax, but I can't)...
> 
> I also sometimes think about the world. When I'm in traffic or in a crowd, sometimes I think about the big picture, how small we are in the universe, how funny is that we have cars, houses, phones (we are animals after all... monkeys not so long ago). I make a scheme in my head, I imagine how everything connects: people, animals, enviroment, our planet, the sun, plants... I imagine how this place looked like 1,000 years ago. I imagine what would a person in 200 years from now will think about my life, etc.
> 
> I believe 60% or 70% of the time I think "S" stuff, the rest is "N"... When I finish thise, leave the office and go back in my car, I'll think about my post, what others will say about it, what could be improved, etc
> 
> P.S. I've read what I wrote 1,000 times, fixing it, changing it, improving it... My mother language is spanish, if this was in spanish, It would have zero grammatical and puntuation errors. I'm fucking nuts.


I came here to look for a post that would allow me to see into my husband's mind. I think in general, you have accomplished that best. Thanks.

And thanks to all the other SJs who responded. After the first few pages I thought it would only be intuitives. haha



Perseus said:


> ESFJ tend to think the rest of the world thinks like they do and INTPs do not, cannot even think like them at all, unless by dint of doing the reverse of what I woud normally do.


Sorry, but I feel as if I have to respond to this one. I see where Perseus is coming from here, although he needs to remember it is certainly not true in every case. I have met quite a few ESFJs who are _not _like this _at all._ But at the same time, the people who I have met who have had this issue the most _are _ESFJ. Take for instance my roommate in college. Generally, we got along quite well. The only issues we had were similar to this: mid-winter and the heat is up like crazy. She is terribly hot so she throws open the windows. After a few minutes she snuggles under her down comforter. I do not have a down comforter. I am freezing. I let it go the first few times, but it gets to the point that I am very uncomfortable. I say something about how cold I am. Now, she honestly and truly thinks that I am just trying to be a pain in the butt and annoy her because she cannot possibly imagine how anyone could be so cold when she is so hot. She couldn't see how I could be different from her. This caused many similar problems while we were roommates, and they were the only problems we had as roommates.
So I see where Perseus is coming just because she and a few other ESFJs I have met have had this issue to the extreme and more so than other types I have met. I do not, however, believe that _every_ ESFJ has this issue, just that some have more of an inclination to it for whatever reason. Every type has it's inclination to act in a way that is selfish or lacks awareness. My roommate in college is one of my closest friends despite this, and she has grown out of it quite a bit anyhow.


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## saslou

Irulan said:


> Sorry, but I feel as if I have to respond to this one. I see where Perseus is coming from here, although he needs to remember it is certainly not true in every case. I have met quite a few ESFJs who are _not _like this _at all._ But at the same time, the people who I have met who have had this issue the most _are _ESFJ. Take for instance my roommate in college. Generally, we got along quite well. The only issues we had were similar to this: mid-winter and the heat is up like crazy. She is terribly hot so she throws open the windows. After a few minutes she snuggles under her down comforter. I do not have a down comforter. I am freezing. I let it go the first few times, but it gets to the point that I am very uncomfortable. I say something about how cold I am. Now, she honestly and truly thinks that I am just trying to be a pain in the butt and annoy her because she cannot possibly imagine how anyone could be so cold when she is so hot. She couldn't see how I could be different from her. This caused many similar problems while we were roommates, and they were the only problems we had as roommates.
> So I see where Perseus is coming just because she and a few other ESFJs I have met have had this issue to the extreme and more so than other types I have met. I do not, however, believe that _every_ ESFJ has this issue, just that some have more of an inclination to it for whatever reason. Every type has it's inclination to act in a way that is selfish or lacks awareness. My roommate in college is one of my closest friends despite this, and she has grown out of it quite a bit anyhow.


I like that you are keeping an open mind even if you have had one or two experiences that may say otherwise. 

You'll find the good, the bad and the darn right angelic in any type. Lol


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## gonecrazytoo

saslou said:


> I like that you are keeping an open mind even if you have had one or two experiences that may say otherwise.
> 
> You'll find the good, the bad and the darn right angelic in any type. Lol


Absolutely!

One of my best friends is an INTP, whether we think alike or not is irrelevant. We are very capable of understanding one another. Part of our friendship that we enjoy so much is the very fact that we are so different, with different perspectives. We like to find out what the other thinks about certain things, it can be quite helpful. Don't make excuses of why you can not get along with someone, or why you think you don't like them, or that you don't like their style. Learn and grow yourself, maybe the other person will take your example.

Trust me, I am no angel....
but I am certainly not evil.


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## Tucken

I'd like to point out the following, since there seem to be alot of misconceptions/bias.
I spend most time *daydreaming*, thinking deep about my *interests/troubles* or* enjoying the moment*- the sensation of warmth against your skin or the breeze in your hair.

When I'm "at my game" I strategically plan my actions and make sure I dont forget anything. 
I will make sure, in advance, that I get everything with me at once. To the laundry room, as an example. At the same time, I could have food in the microwave and something downloading on the computer, and when I'm back, everything will have played out perfectly. 
When I'm like that, what actually occupies my thoughts are my next moves and to fit them into routes(to do things in the right order, with the shortest distance possible) and time-frames. I'm driven by needs to be efficient and perfect. Because in this mode, that's what matters, thats to be good. 
In this mode, I feel content. I'm in control and, dare I say, _may feel better than others_..atleast at what I do. 

It is to occupy your mind with what is useful to complete a task as good and fast as possible, to check things off along the way. It's to anticipate the tools and items needed for some task before it's at hand. Preferably, you would like to gather these tools as you do something else. 

So you are taking your car somewhere? It could go like this: 
You start in the kitchen and put on some coffee.
>hallway (grab keys and a backpack) 
>bathroom (leverage+accessories) 
>closet/drawer (clothes+ gloves,hat,boots) 
>kitchen (grab a snack for the trip and leave your spouse a message while you drink your coffee and ponder if you didn't forget something) 
>hall (you didnt forget anything, thus you can be very proud of yourself ^^
>Drive off and be 10mins early at destination-woho!

Under less healthy circumstances I'm not able to keep this up. I get absent-minded and ain't able to organize things the way I want to.


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## gonecrazytoo

Tucken said:


> I'd like to point out the following, since there seem to be alot of misconceptions/bias.
> I spend most time *daydreaming*, thinking deep about my *interests/troubles* or* enjoying the moment*- the sensation of warmth against your skin or the breeze in your hair.
> 
> When I'm "at my game" I strategically plan my actions and make sure I dont forget anything.
> I will make sure, in advance, that I get everything with me at once. To the laundry room, as an example. At the same time, I could have food in the microwave and something downloading on the computer, and when I'm back, everything will have played out perfectly.
> When I'm like that, what actually occupies my thoughts are my next moves and to fit them into routes(to do things in the right order, with the shortest distance possible) and time-frames. I'm driven by needs to be efficient and perfect. Because in this mode, that's what matters, thats to be good.
> In this mode, I feel content. I'm in control and, dare I say, _may feel better than others_..atleast at what I do.
> 
> It is to occupy your mind with what is useful to complete a task as good and fast as possible, to check things off along the way. It's to anticipate the tools and items needed for some task before it's at hand. Preferably, you would like to gather these tools as you do something else.
> 
> So you are taking your car somewhere? It could go like this:
> You start in the kitchen and put on some coffee.
> >hallway (grab keys and a backpack)
> >bathroom (leverage+accessories)
> >closet/drawer (clothes+ gloves,hat,boots)
> >kitchen (grab a snack for the trip and leave your spouse a message while you drink your coffee and ponder if you didn't forget something)
> >hall (you didnt forget anything, thus you can be very proud of yourself ^^
> >Drive off and be 10mins early at destination-woho!
> 
> Under less healthy circumstances I'm not able to keep this up. I get absent-minded and ain't able to organize things the way I want to.



Thank you, I am very much like this. I guess it is something I do not always consciously think about myself, but I do plan, fix my strategy, find the most efficient means to the end. I get frustrated when my daughters are unable to do the same. I call it 'thinking ahead', knowing what my next move is. I am NEVER late. I am methodical at routine things because it gets them done faster! I hate wasting time on basic routines like say, washing dishes. Wash them, be done! It might take me a half hour to clean the kitchen, but it will take my 18 yr. old daughter 3 hours. I can cook a meal, everything will all come to the done stage at the same time so that the entire meal is still HOT... when my daughter cooks, half is cold from sitting and waiting for something else to finish. 

Thank you for pointing that out. I do not consciously think about what I am doing, and yet, that is exactly what I do. Think ahead, plan ahead, be prepared. 

This is not to say that I don't spend an hour in my car daydreaming. I love to see the mountains and the snow, or when the leaves are turning green. Sunsets and sunrises happen a lot on my commute and they are stunning. I think a lot about my loved ones. I daydream about the future. I put myself in his arms and it my minds eye can see his face.


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## Sunrain

One of my brothers is an INTP, the other is an ESFP.. and I love the conversations: it's "Why do we eat?" versus "Where shall we go for lunch?" 

My sister is also an S and she's probably the person I know best in the world, and she certainly doesn't shun conversations about abstract topics, but she just views them in a different way.. she relates them to things that are related to her senses instead of sailing into the clouds with them. She's actually really imaginative, she's just imaginative in a different way. She'll create an amazing artistic design or make an elaborate cake, or write complicated elaborate poems, but they'll be about the beauty of our world as it is, about emotions are they are in a deep and pure sense. She takes the abstract and brings it back down to earth to remind it of the world's beauty as it is, whereas I take the concrete up into the clouds to fantasize about the world as it could be. I said to her: "I love how I can see so much beauty in the snow, it's like there could be wood nymphs in the trees... ", and she said "Imagining wood nymphs into the trees surely takes away from the pure beauty of what is already: my imagination can't even begin to compare to this real beauty that touches my senses like this..the world would be hollow without my senses" And my response was "What I can see is just the beginning of the endless beauty that I can feel and imagine, the world would be hollow without my imagination." We decided we both appreciate things with equal depth, in a different way.


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## gonecrazytoo

Sunrain, thank you.
I feel just that way about my INTP friend, and the man I am engaged to as well. We love the part of the other that we ourselves do not possess. It's wonderful. It gives a whole other dimension that each of us might have missed without the other!


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## maneater

thewindlistens said:


> I've said it before... But still, damn do you guys live empty lives if that's really all that goes on in your head. :shocked:


A couple weeks ago my ISTJ boyfriend asked me to write everything I thought in a day down in a notebook. By the end of the day I had three pages, it was a few human/animal nature theories, thoughts of my own behavior, questions, opinions on the news and politics. After he read it he asked if I usually thought that much and he was surprised when I said it was a slow day. Then he said that he didn't think that much. I love his mind he's smarter than me in the here and now and makes me feel stupid sometimes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## gonecrazytoo

> Originally Posted by thewindlistens
> I've said it before... But still, damn do you guys live empty lives if that's really all that goes on in your head.


No, this is not all that goes on in our heads,this is only what goes on in some of our spare time. At work, my mind is fully engaged. 

Be damned if I am gonna share some of my more private thoughts with strangers. 
And being an introvert, they are ALL private thoughts.

It saddens me that the only thing you had to say was something mean and uncalled for. I thought this was moderated.


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## LongStory

lol @ gonecrazytoo. don't be too offended. :crazy:
thewindlistens, sensors are more involved in the external world. Physically, they probably are doing more activities, going to more parties, and noticing more details. Their external world is your internal. Intuitives can be deeply involved in the outside world too but we still will take "huge clumps" out of our day to anaylze and try to find a "meaning" behind activites.


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## gonecrazytoo

LongStory said:


> lol @ gonecrazytoo. don't be too offended. :crazy:
> thewindlistens, sensors are more involved in the external world. Physically, they probably are doing more activities and going to more parties. Their external world is your internal. Intuitives can be deeply involved in the outside world too but we still will take "huge clumps" out of our day to anaylze and try to find a "meaning" behind activites.


As an introvert, why would I be interested in going to more parties, I never go to ANY parties. Not my thing at all. I think there are a lot of misguided ideas here. The extroverted part of me is F not S. Just like an INFJ.


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## Tucken

gonecrazytoo said:


> As an introvert, why would I be interested in going to more parties, I never go to ANY parties. Not my thing at all. I think there are a lot of misguided ideas here. The extroverted part of me is F not S. Just like an INFJ.


Yeah people seem to have the wrong idea:sad: 
To put it more simply, a sensor sees the world through his senses. A good example is what you notice on a photograph. 
Sensors will say they see streets, people, stands, flowers, colours etc. 
With intuition you see a marketplace, a gathering, a thursday morning etc. 

There may be a correlation between sensors and "activities" and there may not. But its definitely more of an I/E, outgoing/withdrawn kind of thing.


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## Narrator

Ayeayeayeaye.

I don't know flagrant user of stereotypes. I think about people, places, events, theories, stories. I guess I'll take a foundation and build from it, or question it - how it got there, how it works. It can be what I'm having for dinner, or an author's use of pathetic fallacy, or the way a person brushed past me, or the importance of conformitism in an overly individualistic culture. Introspection is also a big factor.

Perhaps there are some sensors, or SJs who think in the 'You think this much?' way. However not all of them do, I'm one of the ones they question about thinking so much...and I'm an SJ...:frustrating:
It's true that there are likely differences as Tucken described, however being described as comparable to an animal, and living empty lives is rather insulting, and a mistaken assumption.




LongStory said:


> lol @ gonecrazytoo. don't be too offended. :crazy:
> thewindlistens, sensors are more involved in the external world. Physically, they probably are doing more activities, going to more parties, and noticing more details. Their external world is your internal. Intuitives can be deeply involved in the outside world too but we still will take "huge clumps" out of our day to anaylze and try to find a "meaning" behind activites.


*facepalm*


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## gonecrazytoo

Just because I don't let many people into my 'personal space'....
Just because I 'appear' to be anti-social or isolated....
Just because you read something, somewhere, that an extrovert wrote....
Just because you 'assume' there is something wrong with me and that I am somehow not well adjusted....
Just because I am quiet, reserved and self reflective....
Just because I didn't ask for your opinion and I didn't offer mine....
Just because I save my laughter and my tears for the people in my life who matter most....
Just because you LOOK at me and can't see what my brain is thinking....

Doesn't mean that I don't have wonderful friends,
Doesn't mean that I fit anyone else's ideas or stereotypes,
Doesn't mean that I am not happy, and completely content with my life,
Doesn't mean that I am not friendly and easy to get along with,
Doesn't mean that I don't have an opinion or thoughts on many subjects, I would simply rather learn what others think,
Doesn't mean that I am cold and unemotional and unable to express deep and abiding emotions with my loved ones,
Doesn't mean that I am not capable of having an intelligent and deep conversation on subjects that are dear to me.

I will never want to go to parties, but I will always go the extra mile to make sure my co-workers are treated kindly and with respect. They see me as being quite friendly. At the end of the day, I go home exhausted. Sometimes I stay close to my own work area where I don't have to spend a lot of energy on the people around me. But when the need to interact with others arises, I do so.

My brain never really shuts down on it's own. Many times I have a very hard time going to sleep at night, and I will wake up at some ungodly hour and not be able to go back to sleep because my brain is so damn busy. My INFJ says he has the same problem. What does anyone think about? This and that and everything under the sun. Problems, family, future, finances, children, grandchildren, trips to see my daughters Air Force BMT graduation, I dream about going to Cancun, Australia, Spain, Ireland and the moon! I think about the book I am reading, I think about the song I am listening to, I think about what's for dinner! The list goes on and on to infinity! Bills that I wonder how I will pay! Whatever! Should I buy the ingredients for homemade margaritas or would I rather spend my money on chinese food on my way home from work! HA!

And isn't it just too funny that my INFJ tells me that I get too emotional? He is the only one that see's that part of me, but it's ironic he tells me that, when he is every bit as emotional as I am! Funny.

I think some FJ hold onto the emotion and let it guide all that they do, they hold onto it forever. (hence things like grudges) and I think some of us let the emotion wash over us in the moment and when it begins to subside, we think about WHY we had such a strong reaction.

Now there's something to consider.


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## HandiAce

Stuff that goes on in my mind:


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## Perseus

................

SJs can be awful with bad-mouthing and Dogs ISTJs are often to blame, accusing Pandas INFP of being whores and Mice ISFP of ..... etc. They have other nasty habits as well. By this poisonous behaviour they can cause a lot of trouble.


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## Narrator

Can you expand on how bitching relates to what goes on in the mind of an SJ Perseus?

The SJs I know, most of them...are some of the last people I would expect to bad mouth others, particularly the ISTJs...maybe it's just a limited experience...but...

Maybe enneagram factors in.


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## RafaelEnvoy

thewindlistens said:


> I've said it before... But still, damn do you guys live empty lives if that's really all that goes on in your head. :shocked:


Though I don't think you meant what you've said, claiming that someone''s life is empty is quite simply a judgement you can't make (at least not solely based on your premise). I bet there are people who would say that if you can't get anything done your life is empty.



Perseus said:


> SJs can be awful with bad-mouthing and Dogs ISTJs are often to blame, accusing Pandas INFP of being whores and Mice ISFP of ..... etc. They have other nasty habits as well. By this poisonous behaviour they can cause a lot of trouble.


Let me guess, INTPs are the Sloths, aren't they?



Liminality said:


> The SJs I know, most of them...are some of the last people I would expect to bad mouth others, particularly the ISTJs...maybe it's just a limited experience...but...


Don't think SJ's would either. Most SJ's I know will either tell you what they don't like or keep quiet. Though you can't really pin that on personality types. Still, I know some ISFPs...


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## Korvyna

Wow, an easier question would have been what doesn't go on in my mind! I've constantly got thoughts running through my head....it's part of why I have such a hard time sleeping at night. 

My current thoughts revolve around a private matter in my life that I won't share on a forum... But I can say that my thoughts are currently on developing potential plans to handle a potential issue that may arise in the future. I've developed plans for the worst case scenario all the way back to the best case scenario. I'm also thinking a lot about what needs to be done in the house once we finally get to closing and gain access to it. I've been budgeting in my head about how much I'll have to put towards a refrigerator and washer/dryer. And also what place offers the best deals on appliances. That's like a fraction of what I have going on in my head... A lot of it I can't share because it's way too personal for a forum. 

Someone also said something about playing devil's advocate... I do that all the time too... And usually end up pissing people off by doing so. Sheesh, try and help people see the other side of things and they get all hateful.


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## Narrator

Ditto on not being able to get to/having trouble getting to sleep at night, it was a real problem as a kid and during the most part of my teens, I think it's related much more to being a 6w7 than SJ though.


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## gonecrazytoo

Disagree on the not being able to sleep being the enneagram. I think it's the FJ part. Haven't met one yet that has an easy time with shutting down their mind so they can sleep at night.
ISFJ INFJ ESFJ ENFJ Doesn't matter, sleep seems to be an issue with the brain on overdrive.


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## Narrator

Ahh, I should have been clearer, there are two factors for me, nervous tension (6w7) and my brain being on (FJ?) - I've been shutting it off alot recently. Nervous tension is the thing that always runs underneath and won't stop even when my mind pretty much has.


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## Perseus

*Witches*



Liminality said:


> Can you expand on how bitching relates to what goes on in the mind of an SJ Perseus?
> 
> The SJs I know, most of them...are some of the last people I would expect to bad mouth others, particularly the ISTJs...maybe it's just a limited experience...but...
> 
> Maybe enneagram factors in.



Not a SJ trait unless they are following the lead of another. This is Artisan SP, mostly ISFP. INFPs moan and complain, but this is not bitching.


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## Mina

Perseus said:


> Not a SJ trait unless they are following the lead of another. This is Artisan SP, mostly ISFP. INFPs moan and complain, but this is not bitching.


You sure like to generalize people


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## Korvyna

I'm glad I'm not alone. I know my boyfriend isn't an FJ if that's the case... He can lay down and be out in five minutes flat... It's at least an hour long process for me... :dry:


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## RafaelEnvoy

gonecrazytoo said:


> Disagree on the not being able to sleep being the enneagram. I think it's the FJ part. Haven't met one yet that has an easy time with shutting down their mind so they can sleep at night.
> ISFJ INFJ ESFJ ENFJ Doesn't matter, sleep seems to be an issue with the brain on overdrive.


Interesting. Might this be the curse of inferior (as in 4th function) Ti? I know I have a terrible time sleeping.


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## gonecrazytoo

RafaelEnvoy said:


> Interesting. Might this be the curse of inferior (as in 4th function) Ti? I know I have a terrible time sleeping.


Sorry, I can't answer that one as I am also a 5 and have been told I may as well be an IST* except it's more complicated than that....
*shrug*
humans are complicated, no way around it.


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## Pyroscope

I think it's always assumed that Ns have tons going on in their heads constantly and Ss don't unless it's 'necessary'. Personally I don't buy this. Ns can go off on crazy tangents but I've had one N tell me that her mind's fairly blank until something stimulates her. That's kind of the way I feel a lot of the time.

I think a lot of the tangents go on underneath my thought processes to be honest. When I start thinking about something it can either go nowhere for a while or keep developing in a conscious fashion. When it's not going anywhere I think I'm either distracted or I'm waiting for one of the subconscious processes to come out. To be honest though, I don't get nearly enough sleep pretty much all the time so I think this is why more of it is subconscious.

I have to say that I almost never think about anything regarding duty, but I don't have any bills to pay. Sometimes I will think 'I need to do these things' but it's fleeting and I don't think in any depth about it.

No I'm not an SJ, so in that perspective maybe I shouldn't be posting how I think, but I believe that the S/N stereotypes aren't helpful so I thought this might be a new perspective? I believe that both S and N thinking need to be stimulated though. Maybe though if you're more extreme in what you are then you need more or less stimulation though? Maybe Ns tangenting easily is a result of extreme N and Ss planning loads and thinking about nothing else is just really extreme S. But this is all just theory, I'm open to and interested in the SJ perspective firsthand :happy:

I agree with you that comments like 'that's empty' sound cruel. Most Ns don't like the idea of thinking that way. Hey, guess why that is? Because we're Ns!! We like thinking in the N way, but Ss usually like the way they think and why shouldn't they be allowed to? Why is it okay for Ns to be proud of the way they think and not okay for Ss? Yes I probably get on with and communicate better with Ns, but that ain't the Ss fault. We're just different. As it's been said, we CAN communicate, but it takes work on both our sides. So no need for S-hate, it's up to both sides to talk to each other.

...Damn... This post is LONG... :mellow:


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## gonecrazytoo

I don't have that much trouble communicating with the Ns in my life.
Two of my three daughters are N. My fiance is N. 
Honestly, the Ns in my life spend more time being scatter brained with their heads in the clouds.... simply daydreaming into no mans land A LOT! 

I think we spend far too much time pointing out what we perceives as 'faults' in others.... rather than working to improve our own individual selves. 

Just because I don't share my thoughts with you, doesn't mean that I don't have very deep and profound thoughts, it simply means that I prefer to keep them to myself.

I am profoundly I
borderline N/S
borderline F/T
and completely even on the J/P.

We all have certain ways our minds tick. Some are more easily understood than others. Many of us think ahead as well as look back and learn from the past. 

LEARN ABOUT YOURSELF so that YOU can learn better how to interact with others. If you want to understand someone, it may not be helpful to insult them!

Also, it is my understanding that 'emotional' intelligence is highly regarded among scholars.


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## Perseus

RafaelEnvoy said:


> Though I don't think you meant what you've said, claiming that someone''s life is empty is quite simply a judgement you can't make (at least not solely based on your premise). I bet there are people who would say that if you can't get anything done your life is empty.
> 
> 
> 
> Let me guess, INTPs are the Sloths, aren't they?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't think SJ's would either. Most SJ's I know will either tell you what they don't like or keep quiet. Though you can't really pin that on personality types. Still, I know some ISFPs...



Sloths would be a ESTP term or INTPs.

In the world of E, I come as a Turtle. I have to stick by neck to progress (a famous quote). I can handle a few hostile criticisms of the Dogs ISTJ and tramplings by Bulls ESTJ, but not a hole pack or herd of them, nor a Rhinoceros ESFJ variant. 

If Dogs ISTJ are in a different tribe or gang, they can be rather nasty. SJs seem want you to be just like them, whereas, I want to be accepted for what I am, not be just like them. I would not know how.


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## Perseus

Perseus said:


> ................
> 
> SJs can be awful with bad-mouthing and Dogs ISTJs are often to blame, accusing Pandas INFP of being whores and Mice ISFP of ..... etc. They have other nasty habits as well. By this poisonous behaviour they can cause a lot of trouble.


If this OTT this is what really happened. Accept it was much worse than this from these people. The other stuff is the hands of the Police.


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## gonecrazytoo

How did 'What SJ's Think' turn into an INTP forum? Curiouser and curiouser


----------



## Perseus

*Ceremonies of the Fire Horsemen*



Irulan said:


> I came here to look for a post that would allow me to see into my husband's mind. I think in general, you have accomplished that best. Thanks.
> 
> And thanks to all the other SJs who responded. After the first few pages I thought it would only be intuitives. haha
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry, but I feel as if I have to respond to this one. I see where Perseus is coming from here, although he needs to remember it is certainly not true in every case. I have met quite a few ESFJs who are _not _like this _at all._ But at the same time, the people who I have met who have had this issue the most _are _ESFJ. Take for instance my roommate in college. Generally, we got along quite well. The only issues we had were similar to this: mid-winter and the heat is up like crazy. She is terribly hot so she throws open the windows. After a few minutes she snuggles under her down comforter. I do not have a down comforter. I am freezing. I let it go the first few times, but it gets to the point that I am very uncomfortable. I say something about how cold I am. Now, she honestly and truly thinks that I am just trying to be a pain in the butt and annoy her because she cannot possibly imagine how anyone could be so cold when she is so hot. She couldn't see how I could be different from her. This caused many similar problems while we were roommates, and they were the only problems we had as roommates.
> So I see where Perseus is coming just because she and a few other ESFJs I have met have had this issue to the extreme and more so than other types I have met. I do not, however, believe that _every_ ESFJ has this issue, just that some have more of an inclination to it for whatever reason. Every type has it's inclination to act in a way that is selfish or lacks awareness. My roommate in college is one of my closest friends despite this, and she has grown out of it quite a bit anyhow.


The trouble is when ESFJs get hot. In Sore Dragon terminology (Advanced Perseus Planetary System) it is called "Orbiting too close to the Sun". I think Caesar said they (Atrebates) followed the God Mercury. Educated ESFJs (Not the Crazy Gang) can cool off. I think it is better if they do not drink alcohol at all. For the well being of society they (males) should smoke heroin.


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## Ahoy

Perseus said:


> The trouble is when ESFJs get hot. In Sore Dragon terminology (Advanced Perseus Planetary System) it is called "Orbiting too close to the Sun". I think Caesar said they (Atrebates) followed the God Mercury. Educated ESFJs (Not the Crazy Gang) can cool off. I think it is better if they do not drink alcohol at all. For the well being of society they (males) should smoke heroin.


You are absolutely bananas my good man!


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## RafaelEnvoy

gonecrazytoo said:


> How did 'What SJ's Think' turn into an INTP forum? Curiouser and curiouser


The real question is how didn't it happen sooner.


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## Perseus

*Thin Men Everywhere*



Ahoy said:


> You are absolutely bananas my good man!


A typical SJ derogatory comment for things they don't understand. Do you Mister Jones?


You have many contacts among the lumberjacks
to get you facts when someone attacks your imagination
but nobody has any respect, anyway they already expect
you to all give a check to tax-deductible charity organizations
Ah you've been with the professors and they've all liked your looks
With great lawyers you have discussed lepers and crooks
You've been through all of F. Scott Fitzgerald's books
You're very well read, it's well known
But something is happening here and you don't know what it is
do you, Mr. Jones?

Lyrics: Bob Dylan - Ballad of a Thin Man


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## gonecrazytoo

A typical INTP sticking his nose into something he should walk away from. Please, go elsewhere to cause trouble. It's not needed here. I walk away from this forum time and again because of this exact kind of crap!


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## Narrator

Perseus said:


> A typical SJ derogatory comment for things they don't understand. Do you Mister Jones?
> 
> 
> You have many contacts among the lumberjacks
> to get you facts when someone attacks your imagination
> but nobody has any respect, anyway they already expect
> you to all give a check to tax-deductible charity organizations
> Ah you've been with the professors and they've all liked your looks
> With great lawyers you have discussed lepers and crooks
> You've been through all of F. Scott Fitzgerald's books
> You're very well read, it's well known
> But something is happening here and you don't know what it is
> do you, Mr. Jones?
> 
> Lyrics: Bob Dylan - Ballad of a Thin Man



Being so allusive in an SJ topic is probably gonna land you with your sanity being questioned. You _do_ sound like you're muttering to yourself a tad. You remind me of Kreacher, or an out of touch poet. You can't be surprised at the reaction, your response makes that clear. If you want to be understood, communicate in a way you know people will understand (depending on the context) - maybe it's not so easy to change your style, I don't know. I'm guessing not for one or both, so...I shall diminish.


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## RafaelEnvoy

Liminality said:


> If you want to be understood, communicate in a way you know people will understand [...]


If no one understands what you're saying, it becomes orders of magnitude easier to pose as an intellectual. "Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex and more violent. It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction." - Albert Einstein

Yeah, I'm bored, bear with me.


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## Tucken

gonecrazytoo said:


> A typical INTP sticking his nose into something he should walk away from. Please, go elsewhere to cause trouble. It's not needed here. I walk away from this forum time and again because of this exact kind of crap!


He's not trying to offend anyone, I think. Instead, he's showing us his great sense of humour! I like it.


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## Narrator

I'm not sure whether to take it as humour or seriously...


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## Perseus

*Something really Nasty happened to Felix*



Felix (ISFP) came to the wrong door

I'll be Doggone! she said

ISTJ Personal Growth

This thread is not about understanding the INTP but the SJ. I don't think Overseer* is the correct terminology, Line Manager, Landlord or Guardian fits them better. 

Quiz question: How do you tell a Racehorse from a Donkey? (Both are ESFJ)




*seer | s, in sense 2 also si | n.1 ME. [f. SEE v. + -ER1.] 1 A person of supposed supernatural insight, esp. into the future; a person able to see visions, a prophet; transf. a predictor of events, trends, etc. ME. 2 gen. A person who sees. (Foll. by of the thing seen.) Cf. SEE-ER. LME. 3 An overseer, an inspector. L15-E17.seeress n. a female seer M19. seerlike a. resembling (that of) a seer M19. seership n. the office or function of a seer 

---------------------------------------------------------
Excerpted from The Oxford Interactive Encyclopedia
Developed by The Learning Company, Inc. Copyright (c) 1997 TLC Properties Inc.


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## niss

I would suggest changing the name of this thread to something more representative of the nonsense posted in it. Perhaps something along the lines of NTs venting about SJs. Or maybe: Ask an NT what an SJ thinks. This might prevent quite so much time being wasted digging through the dumpster looking for that one good item...:crazy:

_*walks away shaking his head*_


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## Narrator

Perseus said:


> This thread is not about understanding the INTP but the SJ. I don't think Overseer* is the correct terminology, Line Manager, Landlord or Guardian fits them better.


It's fun to ponder though - and I suppose you could say INTPs - but point taken.

Actually, out of curiosity, is there a particular type, or type of person other SJs would say they spend the most time trying to get their heads round? Particular behaviours or functions which befuddle? What kind of person goes on in your mind?


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## Ahoy

Perseus said:


> A typical SJ derogatory comment for things they don't understand. Do you Mister Jones?


Man, are you *trying* to antagonize me?


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## Lady K

I wanted to add in that I often will have trouble falling asleep at night too. There are actually several reasons for this, but one of them does tend to be that I can't shut my mind down when I want to lie down to sleep. I'll just be in bed, and I won't be able to stop thinking about random things that I need to get finished, or about people I've talked to that day... I've been doing much better recently, but I think it might be because of the drastic change in my schedule. I'm getting barely enough sleep to make it through my days now, as opposed to way too much sleep.


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## Perseus

Ahoy said:


> Man, are you *trying* to antagonize me?


I am just responding likewise to your antagonisation. An INTP may very well respond to personal attacks. It might not happen straightaway though. It could happen at any time. Difference of opinion will not antagonise an INTP. Personal attacks will.


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## Ahoy

I think about people mostly, or stuff that I'm going to do, or that I've done. Its like constantly doing this big social/intellectual puzzle.



Perseus said:


> I am just responding likewise to your antagonisation. An INTP may very well respond to personal attacks. It might not happen straightaway though. It could happen at any time. Difference of opinion will not antagonise an INTP. Personal attacks will.


All right, all right, don't get your panties in a bunch, mate. I hereby retract my dubbing of you "bananas" because it's clear to me now that your the Batman of the internet. And we all know what happens when you make Batman mad. I don't know if I can live with the thought that around every dark corner Perseus could be waiting... ready to personally attack me!

Ad absurdum I tell you.


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## Perseus

Ahoy said:


> I think about people mostly, or stuff that I'm going to do, or that I've done. Its like constantly doing this big social/intellectual puzzle.
> 
> 
> 
> All right, all right, don't get your panties in a bunch, mate. I hereby retract my dubbing of you "bananas" because it's clear to me now that your the Batman of the internet. And we all know what happens when you make Batman mad. I don't know if I can live with the thought that around every dark corner Perseus could be waiting... ready to personally attack me!
> 
> Ad absurdum I tell you.


Is it really a tell and it it is not meant to be absurd.

Perseus (INTP talk) says Batman is a regressed INTJ after chasing a ESFP and the pearls.


Perseus may call Batman a low down ********* (I've forgotten the term: not freak)


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## Perseus

*Batman is a Crackpot*

*Batman is a Crackpot*

Links to Types (Derogatory Terms)
PersonalityCafe

I suspect some ISTJs have Hawk-like INTJ characteristics. INTJs have been called Deputy Dawg by mistake.


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## vel

TreeBob said:


> Sometimes that stuff interests me, but we are talking 5 minutes. I am an EST so I am on the go, thinking about the next time I can interact with a living human being. That is about it. I am sure some of you think that means I am stupid, ignorant, shallow or whatever. In fact I am none of those things.


zomg! they are thinking about reality!!! omgomgomg ... omg :crazy:


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## JTG1984

Tucken said:


> He's not trying to offend anyone, I think. Instead, he's showing us his great sense of humour! I like it.


He's trolling the shit out of you guys.


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## Ahoy

JTG1984 said:


> He's trolling the shit out of you guys.


I like it like that though.

Ohhh baby... ohhhh yeaahhh.... troll me baby... oooh! oohh! ohhhh!


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## JTG1984

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZXcRqFmFa8


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## JTG1984

Ahoy said:


> I like it like that though.
> 
> Ohhh baby... ohhhh yeaahhh.... troll me baby... oooh! oohh! ohhhh!


You're sick, this isn't the SJ and homosexuality thread.


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## Frannyy

when I am in a boring lecture I usually think about the cute boy sitting two rows in front of me and what I would like to do to him....


if there's no cute guy I will either look around and try to type people by their mannerisms, think about what I need to get done for the day, think about anything stressful on my mind.... nothing too unusual


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## Ahoy

JTG1984 said:


> You're sick, this isn't the SJ and homosexuality thread.


:blushed: Oh JTG, would you like to go there with me?


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## fishier3000

The great majority of my thoughts tend to be more of like what would happen if I say this or if I posted a certain comment. How would it come across to other people? Would they see it as humorous, boring, offensive, or interesting?

Sometimes my mind can get a little carried away and thinks about what might happen when I go to college and future relationships and future possible hobbies.

I used to be more imaginative a few years ago (still in high school). I thought about a new imaginary continent filled with humongous catfishes that fill niche as filter feeders in an inland sea, flying purple gobies that live in isolated pockets of humid rainforests, and large bony fishlike crustaceans that scour temporary lakes for food and then when the lake dries, they burrow in the lake bottom and hibernate.

Sometimes I imagine what would happen if I happen to become a president of a developing nation. Would I be able to help the country into an economic power? Or would they overthrow me? Or would I be addicted to power? (And then my mind cuts this thought process off)

But nowadays, music is going through my head repeating.


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## Llanis

*my thoughts*

My thoughts during a boring lecture/meeting will depend on other aspects of my life, and whats going on. If I'm attracted to someone in the room, and I can see them I will probably daydream about them, or mentally review my interactions with them, deciding if they could be attracted to me. If work is pressing in and deadlines are approaching I will think about what needs to be done. Assuming I've done enough of this, I might find humor in the way others are acting because they are board, this can be real funny people watching btw. (People dozing, getting frustrated, drawing, or looking at people they like, lol). If the presenter, has some comical feature, or mannerism I might enjoy imagining them in different situations.

Now this will only speak to a few of you out their who have relevant experience with a phone conference, this is where you set in a room and listen/watch some person give a speech remotely, and they typically can't hear you. Some great enjoyment in other peoples suffering can be had here.


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## ENTrePenuer

steerthestars said:


> On behalf of all intuitive types-- oh, the lowly 21.5% of people who lose their car keys in the midst of extreme theorization and mental story-telling-- what on earth do sensors, particularly SJs, think about?
> 
> When you're zoned out in class or a boring lecture, or when you're doing rote, easy work (like dishwashing, potato peeling, filing, etc.) what do you think about? How do you not dream? How do you pay attention?


I know this is crazy but, they think about what they're doing, and they don't zone out.


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## gonecrazytoo

ENTrePenuer said:


> I know this is crazy but, they think about what they're doing, and they don't zone out.


Of course we zone out, get real! There are times when I can't remember the hour drive home on the freeway!! I know I was there, I know my mind was engaged in the drive and getting me here safely, but for the life of me.... I won't remember most of it. Because I am zoned out. That hour of ALONE time, after a long days work and being with other people and my mind just goes off to it's own planet. I notice I spend a lot of time thinking about my love because he is so far away right now! Thinking about a movie I watched last night. Thinking about the possibilities when he gets home... stuff.... no rhyme or reason, whatever pops in there and gives me an out.

My teachers used to call my Mom and get me in trouble when I was a child because they told her I was daydreaming in class. I was a straight A student, but they still complained because they thought it was disrespectful and it ticked them off. 

I think these temperaments get mistaken for the WHOLE person. They are only ONE facet of who we are.


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## fievre

In the boring lecture setting, I'm probably doing something else, usually either drawing or writing. If there is a person or situaiton in my life particularly preoccupying, I'll be going over that. Thinking about what's been done/said, what needs to be done, what the effects would be, etc. 

Other times, for instance when I'm sitting silently with my INTJ and he asks me what I'm thinking, sometimes I'm not really thinking at all. It's difficult to describe but sometimes instead of thinking about anything in particular, it's more like I'm just observing-- but then not actively observing. Sure there are vague thoughts in the background, but nothing that has my focus. The only comparison I can think of is like a computer that is awake, but has no open windows, sure there are background processes, but the processor's not doing much. At that point I'm just experiencing things.


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## Expat in Japan

gonecrazytoo said:


> Of course we zone out, get real! There are times when I can't remember the hour drive home on the freeway!! I know I was there, I know my mind was engaged in the drive and getting me here safely, but for the life of me.... I won't remember most of it. Because I am zoned out. That hour of ALONE time, after a long days work and being with other people and my mind just goes off to it's own planet. I notice I spend a lot of time thinking about my love because he is so far away right now! Thinking about a movie I watched last night. Thinking about the possibilities when he gets home... stuff.... no rhyme or reason, whatever pops in there and gives me an out....


In the INTJ portion of this site there is a current thread on "thought comas"...a term seemingly proposed by a fellow INTJ. 

From what I gather from your post and other SJ posts is that while zoned out, you seem to think about reality-based things while an INTJ, for example, is thinking over ideas/concepts/imagery. 

Neither is better. Your post along with others has helped me (at least) to understand a facet of the whole. :happy:

Thank you.


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## tallenglishgirl

As an ISTJ female, when I get the opportunity to let my mind wander, I tend to focus on reviewing what has happened recently, occassionally in the distant past and wondering what could have happened, what might have happened and occassionaly I'll imagine a completely new scenario with the most desireable outcome. It depends. If I've seen someone I like the look of then it's off into fantasy land... Sometimes, I think about my family, friends, work colleagues, things I've seen heard or read that need more consideration and reflection. Really, it's just letting the tape run in my head. No direction.


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## KrystRay

Ungweliante said:


> I want to say that the Sensor mind is a mystery to me. At least one of my exs was a probable ESTJ and I could never understand him. What I can't understand attracts me - I feel utterly baffled that I often can't follow their thought processes at all. I want to understand.
> 
> One of my best friends is a probable ESFJ and I can't understand her either. We almost always get into friendly arguments about people's behaviour. We do complement each other, though - often she makes points and provides insight into other Sensors that I could never come up with myself. I've told her many times about how I see the world in a sort of layers, where many realities weave an intricate web of meaning upon the reality that is readily there. When I look at a tree, I don't just see a tree - I see a living organism with aesthetic value, whose history stretches out to the past as well as the possibilities to the future. She mostly just thinks that I'm psychotic :happy:


 
My attention span was completely lost towards the middle of the second paragraph. What the hell does "seeing the world in layers" mean? An intricate web of meaning??? SJ's don't do metaphors like that. That didn't even register as a proper sentence to me. It's not a cake or a spiderweb! 

I'm a biology major and I still don't stop to think about a tree's actual existance unless I'm teaching someone something for a specific purpose. Everything that we do, every relationship that we have MUST have a specific purpose, otherwise it is meaningless to us. I would find you psychotic too. lol.


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## KrystRay

Charlie said:


> *looks confused*.
> 
> soooooo, you guys think about... just the current events intermixed with the occasional future plans. Are you guys just feeling the present-- I feel hungry, tired, feeling the sun? Am I getting this right?



There are ENTIRELY more important things to think about! Responsibilities, deadlines, making sure everyone else is fed, has enough sleep, and "feeling the sun." If it weren't for people like us, the world would fall apart! No longer would your electricity be working because the idiot in charge was daydreaming about whatever it was and just forgot. It is a rare occasion that I forget anything because I'm constantly going over lists in my mind, making sure everything is done, no one is leaving anything behind, each item is accounted for... Very observant about physical things. Planning for the future is HUGE as we will work hard now to ensure a secure future.


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## SPtheGhost

KrystRay said:


> There are ENTIRELY more important things to think about! Responsibilities, deadlines, making sure everyone else is fed, has enough sleep, and "feeling the sun." If it weren't for people like us, the world would fall apart! No longer would your electricity be working because the idiot in charge was daydreaming about whatever it was and just forgot. It is a rare occasion that I forget anything because I'm constantly going over lists in my mind, making sure everything is done, no one is leaving anything behind, each item is accounted for... Very observant about physical things. Planning for the future is HUGE as we will work hard now to ensure a secure future.


please ...
PLEASE lets not get into a "if it werent for people like us" kinda discussion 

its a road paved with hubris leading only to oblivion


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## KrystRay

Welcome to "What goes on in an SJ's mind." If you don't like it, feel free to post in the NJ's forum.


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## SPtheGhost

KrystRay said:


> Welcome to "What goes on in an SJ's mind." If you don't like it, *feel free to post in the NJ's forum*.


:laughing:


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## Rowan

Perseus said:


> Trouble with Sensors is they think that Ns think like them. And when they don't they get hurt/confused/angry/manipulative/vindictive/contrite etc.
> 
> SFs are the worst. They are Irrational. *Beware!*


Unfortunately I agree with this. I am an ISFJ, and I try to avoid myself........sigh.


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## SuperKillNinjaAssassin69

Most INTPs on here are posers who get off on emotional masturbation. They think that because they got INTP on an test (usually unadministered) they're an absentminded genius like Einstein; they seem to just assume that any non INTP is retarded due to the way they process information and what the focus on. It's just an unearned sense of superiority I'd say.


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## Mendi the ISFJ

steerthestars said:


> On behalf of all intuitive types-- oh, the lowly 21.5% of people who lose their car keys in the midst of extreme theorization and mental story-telling-- what on earth do sensors, particularly SJs, think about?
> 
> When you're zoned out in class or a boring lecture, or when you're doing rote, easy work (like dishwashing, potato peeling, filing, etc.) what do you think about? How do you not dream? How do you pay attention?


i think its a drive to make sure that im doing the job correctly. I also tend to count things or double check things. When i do zone off its usually emotionally related to whats going on in my life.


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## gonecrazytoo

steerthestars said:


> On behalf of all intuitive types-- oh, the lowly 21.5% of people who lose their car keys in the midst of extreme theorization and mental story-telling-- what on earth do sensors, particularly SJs, think about?
> 
> When you're zoned out in class or a boring lecture, or when you're doing rote, easy work (like dishwashing, potato peeling, filing, etc.) what do you think about? How do you not dream? How do you pay attention?


Just because we are sensors does not mean that we don't zone out and day dream. Okay, yeah, maybe what we day dream about is different... but I'm not buying this whole package, lock, stock and barrel. When I was a kid, the teachers used to send notes home to my parents, said I spent a lot of the day staring out the windows, in another world.... It's not like my grades were suffering, I was an honor student! I think about the past, I dream about the future, I plan for what comes next, tomorrow... what shit do I got to get done to get to the next activity..... 

..... and sometimes I think about what might have been.
What might happen tomorrow.
Wonder where my girls lives will take them.

I don't really think that we are all so much different from each other. Not really. I think we differ more in HOW WE UNDERSTAND OTHERS, than in the actual differences.

One of my very closest friends is an INTP. He has no idea that he is one. He is steady, stable, and feels compelled to do those things that NEED to be done. He would rather dink around and build another computer, but he's always early for work. He takes an hour to run get a gallon of milk, but he won't leave you standing on the curb at the airport!

These personality temperaments, they are to learn about YOURSELF. To help us all learn how to relate to each other better, despite our own personalities similarities and differences. We are so busy pointing our fingers at somebody else, when in reality, nobody is better than anybody else. There is good and bad in all people, no matter their temperament.


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## Narrator

steerthestars said:


> On behalf of all intuitive types-- oh, the lowly 21.5% of people who lose their car keys in the midst of extreme theorization and mental story-telling-- what on earth do sensors, particularly SJs, think about?
> 
> When you're zoned out in class or a boring lecture, or when you're doing rote, easy work (like dishwashing, potato peeling, filing, etc.) what do you think about? How do you not dream? How do you pay attention?


Where the hell are my car keys? I lost them again?

I zone out about an idea in the lecture which engaged me onto another thought track.

I am always present somewhere. I am one track minded, and therefore can be absentminded, if my track drops something immediate and practical. I can think about multiple things at once, but the track of my thoughts will always be contained in a tunnel.

I think about other people, how they percieve me, fictional story verses in which I might be their long lost sister, or go through a portal into another world with them or whatever, review situations with them, when I'm around people. I find it hard to revise with people around as there is lots of strong non idea based input going on. 

I can get lost to the world such that I outright zone out more othen than not, through ideas, as they are in ways not of this world.

When I'm doing boring work...review situations, think of negative times/situations (I inherited my dad's catastrophising), think about possibilities, think about things which are going to happen in the nearish future, fantasise about being famous and advising people, think about the strangers around me, think of positive times.
I find it hard to become unstuck when there's a real sense of being bored - it will be too solid a feeling to drift off.
If I'm doing the washing up I might well just be reacting to the sensory information - enjoying warm water, being disturbed by food/grime (I'm sorta wimpy about it) and thinking of other enjoyable/disturbing sensory situations. Or I could get lost more easily about ideas and fantasies and such like as warm water is relaxing, and it's an activity which doesn't take much thought/interpersonal interaction.

I find it much easier to zone out when I am happy and relaxed/balanced.

If you presume we're incapable of dreaming, then I must presume you're incapable of interfacing with reality, however you want to describe it. If this is the case, does a robot power you instead of your brain when you talk with people while you occupy dreamland? (You cannot leave, 'you' are actually a robot to us, your true self is wholly disconnected to your body, if we took the robot away you'd be in a catatonic state)
Obviously not, obviously you are there, talking, interfacing with reality, not wholly dreaming. In the same way, we are quite capable of dreaming - though there are those who are more just having current preoccupations in mind, and not much else, I always found comfort in a world of ideas and imagination as a child, so if they didn't find it to be so when they were, I can pretty easily understand why it might not be a part of their mental places canon.

I do generally feel connected to the present though - or whatever sensory detail/impressions is/are singificant to me. I find it hard to ignore people when they're talking to me, if someone's lecturing me about doing something wrong, I can't just fly away, I'm there, and they're the strongest thing I'm sensing at that time. Like I said, I have a one track mind - I'm focused on what's grabbing my attention at the time, if an idea pulls I'll follow, more often than not I will still feel connected to the real world and current preoccupations however, as that's the strongest pull.


How do I pay attention? Boring articles/instructive passages I can struggle with ALOT, I feel like the visual description of ADHD generally - the text is very hard to focus on, and I'll keep getting distracted. I forget details and can find it hard to concentrate on them in higher stress social situations, but generally there won't be too much input from other places/sources of stress, and I'll want to focus - when sources of stress appear/I don't feel so much like focusing I'll find it harder.
*- I am still being focused, but not on what I should be focused.* I am focusing hard on the stress/difficulty rather than the important information I'm supposed to be focusing on.


After spending pretty much a solid day and night in my room - leaving only to get breakfast/snacks in the morning stocked up for the rest of the day - and having watched lots of youtube videos on a particular youtuber, and having thought about them alot the last few days before (He had already entered my consciousness, and was something abstracted from the immediate reality around me/my mind was sort've being prepared...if that makes sense. Like how in lectures I'll zone out about ideas, because that is where the train of focus and thought is. Reminds me of Derren Brown hpnotising a man to be an assasin and then forget all about it - certain criteria/stages must be met in the guys mind to create something different/unusual), and having been sort've reclusy for the last week or two, when it came to an extened period in my room, I was able to merge with the online world, and got weirded out by seeing a door out my room when I got up after several hours to brush my teeth - the door became discarded as no longer useful/relevant information. The idea of a world outside the one I'd begun inhabiting felt a sort've foreign and distant; somewhat dreamlike. The world outside was no longer impacting on my reality for a short period of time, so I embraced a new present and always.
When I get used to one frame of mind it becomes my reality, and I am very connected to it. The real world and sensory input are too frequent in my world, however, for me to be able to abandon the common reality easily.


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## Dashing

Everyone calm the fuck down. I can relate to a lot of the things posted ITT. Often daydream about music, girls, food (progresses into any kind of subject given enough time/inspiration). I don't really see the difference. Maybe I just like to be deep in thought figuring stuff out for myself, others like doing that in the real world, encountering people and dealing with them. I do not. Both are valuable ways to gain knowledge and understanding, I'd even say SJ's do it more efficiently.


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## Perseus

Dashing said:


> Everyone calm the fuck down. I can relate to a lot of the things posted ITT. Often daydream about music, girls, food (progresses into any kind of subject given enough time/inspiration). I don't really see the difference. Maybe I just like to be deep in thought figuring stuff out for myself, others like doing that in the real world, encountering people and dealing with them. I do not. Both are valuable ways to gain knowledge and understanding, I'd even say SJ's do it more efficiently.


The SJ way is chaotic. But they can follow a prescribed text. But often they stick on the same railway line. But who designed the track? SFJ is chaotic and irrational and often illogical to boot. STJ is logical from a premise deduced by sensory observation. They may or may not be better on a sinking ship?


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