# NF are probably the worst... Here's why:



## Cxunsxlxr (Apr 15, 2021)

Allow you to introduce me yourselves. I came here after I seen penguinz0's video (an originally 2007 YouTuber/Twitch streamer, for those who live above a rock) about personality types, aka cr1tikal's/Charlie White. His content is based on many things including personal opinions, food, games and most importantly podcasts (he interviewed many "famous" people, i.e. Felix Kjellberg). I thought it'd be cool to take that test, at start I took that 16 pers. Myers Briggs colourful test + another one on truity that shown 3 results, found myself that I'm mainly an INFJ, but truity shown that ENFJ is my possibly my secondary personality, however, few days after, I discussed personality types with other people and they had interest, retook the test again just incase, found myself ENFJ, did another time later on on a third website, found myself INFJ... *I'll explain to you why I written that title, but keep reading or you won't understand.*

Back in 2011, my mom used to tell me about astrology and I found it unique, although after a decade, it seems to be farfetched regarding much stuff and I found it basically bs, however some, maybe a very little are true, but it's all theoretical, personality types are technically also theoretical, but they rely on rationality and reasoning, which seem to me much more appealing & fruitful.

I found this site few days ago by googling "personalities", found this website Very Well Mind (there's also verywellhealth.com) and read about few personalities, also found PrC, wish if I could've found it earlier but it's better than ever not! Read about cognitive functions a bit, but when I came here I found people with stuff like: 7w8, 2s4, 9d5. So can someone explain to me what the hell are these stuff?

I'd also like knowing about more ways to get to know myself because I really find myself interesting based on my methodology & the way I view things. I'm into everything new, psychology, life related topics, controversial topics, weird thoughts including conspiracy theories and discussing others' life issues, while discerning, maintaining rationality & intuition.

I need a few more dozens of tests to fully understand myself, and would like to look in every perspective because it's really interesting, also we can discuss topics like, parenting, society downfall, industries or anything you find interesting, people here are pretty much cultivated and it's not something I often see nowadays.

Do not dare hesitate to reply or ignore after reading, it'd be such a waste of time which is pretty shameful since you already clicked! _"Never judge a book based on it's cover"_, I know few of you might be still be pissed because of the title, but hey no hard feelings, this is the first impression and I had to be creative. The title was just a clickbait to spice things up! Admit that this was decently good


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## aerstyu (Mar 3, 2021)

I'm guessing you're new to MBTI because 16 Personalities and Truity are inaccurate. Those type by letter, which more closely resonates with SLOAN (Big 5). Your 4-letter code is based off of Jung's theory of cognitive functions. Most of the people I know who claim to be INFJ after taking the 16 Personalities test are actually mistyped ISFJ's or INFP's.

There are 8 cognitive functions: 4 judging types (Fe, Fi, Te, Ti) and 4 perceiving types (Se, Si, Ne, Ni). T/F stands for thinking/feeling, S/N stands for sensing/intuition, and e/i stands for extroverted/introverted (this does not mean how socially extroverted/introverted you are, but rather whether your focus is external or internal). So take Se for example, that means extroverted sensing. Each of the 16 MBTI types has a set of 4 cognitive functions in different stacking orders.

Here's a very, very vague description of each function from what I've learned (see spoiler):

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Fe - likes making decisions based on group values and what they think would accommodate the most people, strives for group harmony
Fi - likes making decisions based on their own internally based moral/ethical values
Te - likes making decisions based on outcome-based benefits, good at being objective and putting aside feelings when making decisions, systematic
Ti - likes making decisions based on what makes the most logical sense to what they know, strives for inner logical consistency, typically needs to see the process of how something works before fully being able to understand or accept it

Se - takes things in as they are, sees the world in its rawest form, lives in the moment, present-oriented
Si - takes things in based on their relation to past experiences, pays attention to details, likes routines
Ne - looks for possibilities - not just what things are but what they _could_ be, finds meaning behind things, good at branching out from one idea to form multiple
Ni - takes things in and unconsciously processes them to jump to conclusions, may have trouble explaining their perceptions of things (this one is probably the hardest to explain and understand)




Each type has 2 judging and 2 perceiving functions in its stack. One thinking and one feeling (one is introverted and one is extroverted), and one sensing and one perceiving (again, one is introverted and one is extroverted). Here's the stacking order for each type (see spoiler):

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ESFJ: Fe, Si, Ne, Ti
ISFJ: Si, Fe, Ti, Ne
ESTJ: Te, Si, Ne, Fi
ISTJ: Si, Te, Fi, Ne
ESFP: Se, Fi, Te, Ni
ISFP: Fi, Se, Ni, Te
ESTP: Se, Ti, Fe, Ni
ISTP: Ti, Se, Ni, Fe
ENFJ: Fe, Ni, Se, Ti
INFJ: Ni, Fe, Ti, Se
ENTJ: Te, Ni, Se, Fi
INTJ: Ni, Te, Fi, Se
ENFP: Ne, Fi, Te, Si
INFP: Fi, Ne, Si, Te
ENTP: Ne, Ti, Fe, Si
INTP: Ti, Ne, Si, Fe




XXXJ's have an extroverted judging function as their dom/aux and XXXP's have an extroverted perceiving function as their dom/aux. Just because you are a XXXJ doesn't mean you are an organized person who likes to plan things ahead of time, and being an XXXP doesn't necessarily mean you're disorganized, which is what 16 Personalities makes them to be.

Your first (dominant) function is the strongest, and the other functions (auxiliary, tertiary, and inferior) work together to serve it. Your inferior function is the one you're weakest in. Note that your personality may not fit _perfectly_ with the functions though, everyone is going to use a little bit of each function even if it's not in their type's stack.

7w8 is an example of an enneagram type. The first number is your core type that describes you the best, and the second number (your wing, hence the w) is a number adjacent to your core type (so a type 7 can have a 6 or 8 wing) and depends on which one you relate to closer out of the two.
Here is some info on the nine enneagram types: Type Descriptions — The Enneagram Institute

I'm not sure where you saw the stuff like 2s4 and 9d6, but those aren't a thing.


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## Cxunsxlxr (Apr 15, 2021)

aerstyu said:


> I'm guessing you're new to MBTI because 16 Personalities and Truity are inaccurate.


Yeah, I am. Are there any recommendations for other alternatives or like I have to find my cognitive functions myself?



aerstyu said:


> There are 8 cognitive functions: 4 judging types (Fe, Fi, Te, Ti) and 4 perceiving types (Se, Si, Ne, Ni). T/F stands for thinking/feeling, S/N stands for sensing/intuition, and e/i stands for extroverted/introverted *(this does not mean how socially extroverted/introverted you are, but rather whether your focus is external or internal).* So take Se for example, that means extroverted sensing. Each of the 16 MBTI types has a set of 4 cognitive functions in different stacking orders.


Say for example, ENFJ has Ti, does that mean my thinking is introverted? Can you define that more? Do you mean by _"but rather your focus is external or internal"_, that it's more of a selfish/selfless function? So like thinking introverted means I think about myself more or I keep my thoughts to myself? Or both? :b Sorry, this part was a bit unclear and confusing, since I always question things in every possible way.



aerstyu said:


> Here's a very, very vague description of each function from what I've learned (see spoiler):
> 
> * *
> 
> ...


I suppose that these are personal analysis based on researching/experience, pretty thankful for your efforts, will note them down, appreciated, I'd love seeing any further information regarding these if you've any sources, interested much.
You can also tell me about your experiences if you've any, like, how did you come to such conclusions and for how long you been doing this? 



aerstyu said:


> Each type has 2 judging and 2 perceiving functions in its stack. One thinking and one feeling (one is introverted and one is extroverted), and one sensing and one perceiving (again, one is introverted and one is extroverted). Here's the stacking order for each type (see spoiler):
> 
> * *
> 
> ...



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I'd say I'm (self diagnosing, DO NOT TRY AT HOME): 99% Ti (didn't see God but believes in him based on researching and finding proofs acknowledging the fact I was an atheist for a bit, not a Christian nor a pagan but a Muslim), 95% Fi, I also think Fe is important but my thoughts are much better than others - huge claim but facts, but would definitely compensate based on the first two. Te is also related to being unbiased which kind of contradicts Fi, balancing rationality on a 60% vs 40% intuition. Look, in a nutshell I care about humanity and also value rationality but I think my ethic/moral values are the most righteous (regarding mental and physical wellbeing) if applied not just on me but also everyone else, too much confidence in my opinions but I almost made them turn into facts to me, which is good because I find people with the same thinking, not much but a few which is okay because unique thinking isn't supposed to be that common. I'd say I'm 99% Ne & Si, numbers may seem too high but I believe in a good amount of conspiracy theories while being skeptic, they don't seem illogical to me since I believe there's good and evil, which wants opposing the other, also I do like talking with people about mostly their and my experiences, viewing different problems while trying to provide the most accurate solution, not one but many if there are, based on my analysis and rationality. Where the goal is to satisfy others having actual help and someone listening to them, getting "the best" advices possible & gaining their years of experiences in a matter of minutes if not hours or days, not few but much people, all online anyway, since I have had my most conversations online, has it's own pros and cons sides anyway, you may be surprised if I said more pros. Ti, Fi/Fe, Ne, Si I'd say, but Idrk the order. Just looked at ENFJ and I'm not even Ni/Se at all. Ti% > Te%, however Fi for sure.. I based my personality on your very, very vague description :b , I guess I should make myself a new personality since I don't find myself belonging to any of those... Although looking "ENFJ" on verywellmind shown me my pros and cons semi accurately... Idk if you know that site but now you know. I'm also into idealism that I have borderline OCD if that adds up anything as well as deep/long &/ critical thinking encouraged civilized discussions. Edit: ESFJ seems to be the perfect match but unsure about the order, since I like counselling people, learning from experiences & getting satisfied off their satisfaction, looks for possibilities and questions everything seeking the best of the best, very rational.






aerstyu said:


> XXXJ's have an extroverted judging function as their dom/aux and XXXP's have an extroverted perceiving function as their dom/aux. Just because you are a XXXJ doesn't mean you are an organized person who likes to plan things ahead of time, and being an XXXP doesn't necessarily mean you're disorganized, which is what 16 Personalities makes them to be.
> 
> Your first (dominant) function is the strongest, and the other functions (auxiliary, tertiary, and inferior) work together to serve it. Your inferior function is the one you're weakest in. Note that your personality may not fit _perfectly_ with the functions though, everyone is going to use a little bit of each function even if it's not in their type's stack.


I myself isn't currently an organized person, but I'd love being so only if I can stay consistent but there's some lack of motivation proportionally with procrastination. Idk if that's J or P but I'll know one day anyway.. I'd like knowing how can I have functions sorted based on a test or something trustable, so I assume it takes the most 2 judging + 2 perceiving types, so it's basically like, XX < XX < XX < XX.



aerstyu said:


> 7w8 is an example of an enneagram type. The first number is your core type that describes you the best, and the second number (your wing, hence the w) is a number adjacent to your core type (so a type 7 can have a 6 or 8 wing) and depends on which one you relate to closer out of the two.
> Here is some info on the nine enneagram types: Type Descriptions — The Enneagram Institute
> I'm not sure where you saw the stuff like 2s4 and 9d6, but those aren't a thing.


Are there any sort of tests for that or I have to figure them out myself? And about the 2s4 & 9d6, I just really dropped random stuff because I didn't care much about previously meaningless characters for me haha.

That was REALLY long, but it was worth it, I really appreciate your efforts, since you taught me a lot about it so I'd like to thank you ؛)

Also I noticed your:
*sp/sx • 584 • SLI • FLEV • RCUEN *+ [ Se > Ti > Ne > Fi > Te = Ni > Fe = Si ], can you teach me these if possible? ^^
Maybe after providing me more answers so I have more knowledge though.


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## aerstyu (Mar 3, 2021)

Cxunsxlxr said:


> Yeah, I am. Are there any recommendations for other alternatives or like I have to find my cognitive functions myself?


Usually a search of cognitive functions tests would be more accurate than tests like those, here's 3 I found to be pretty popular. Although they're a good start to finding your type, no online test is 100% accurate, and self-introspection/asking others to help type you could probably give you a more personalized and accurate approach.
typologycentral
keys2cognition
sakinorva

You can also go to this forum and fill out one of the pinned questionnaires to post and have others have a shot at typing you:



> Say for example, ENFJ has Ti, does that mean my thinking is introverted? Can you define that more? Do you mean by _"but rather your focus is external or internal"_, that it's more of a selfish/selfless function? So like thinking introverted means I think about myself more or I keep my thoughts to myself? Or both? :b Sorry, this part was a bit unclear and confusing, since I always question things in every possible way.


If you are an ENFJ then you likely have low Ti, so you may struggle a bit more with the things people with strong Ti are good at. As a strong Ti user, I would describe Ti as a puzzle - you have a puzzle of pieces of information pieced together, and when you come across a new puzzle piece of new info, you'll see if it fits into the puzzle. If it doesn't, you'll struggle with processing it.

Internal focus would best be explained when comparing it to external. Ti means you want _inner_ logical consistency, and you find it important that things line up with your own logic. "Does this process fit in with logically with what's stored in my mind?" Te on the other hand wants something that ends in the outcome of something. "Is this end result the most beneficial to my goals?"

So Ti doesn't necessarily mean you keep your thoughts to yourself, it just means you focus more on how things fit into your inner understanding of how things already work. I can't say anything about the selfless/selfish thing, since anyone can be selfish no matter what their type is (though strong Fe users do generally have a good reputation for coming off as selfless).

Everyone uses every function, regardless of whether it's one of the 4 functions in their type's stack. So if you're an ENFJ, your Te could actually possibly be stronger than your Ti, even though it's not in your stack. It's just left out since their Fe is so strong, and that's already an extroverted judging function. For example, I'm an ISTP, which has Fe and not Fi in its stack, but my Fi is stronger (granted Fe is ISTP's inf function so I'm naturally weaker at it anyway).



> I suppose that these are personal analysis based on researching/experience, pretty thankful for your efforts, will note them down, appreciated, I'd love seeing any further information regarding these if you've any sources, interested much.
> You can also tell me about your experiences if you've any, like, how did you come to such conclusions and for how long you been doing this?


Some resources that I've found:
cognitiveprocesses
psychologyjunkie

This PerC forum has some info on cognitive functions as well.

I've been looking deeply into this for about a month or two, since this is something I'm very interested as well and I've been jumping at every opportunity to learn more. I came to these conclusions based on my research rather than experiences, and then I took what I researched and used it to analyze others.



> * *
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You definitely give me the impression of a strong Ne user based on your interest in abstract and controversial topics, and that means Si would be in your stack too. Not sure about the judging axis though.



> I myself isn't currently an organized person, but I'd love being so only if I can stay consistent but there's some lack of motivation proportionally with procrastination. Idk if that's J or P but I'll know one day anyway.. I'd like knowing how can I have functions sorted based on a test or something trustable, so I assume it takes the most 2 judging + 2 perceiving types, so it's basically like, XX < XX < XX < XX.


It would depend on whether your top judging or perceiving function is extroverted - like my top 2 functions are Ti + Se, and my extroverted function is Se, which is a perceiving function, and therefore I'm an XXXP.



> Are there any sort of tests for that or I have to figure them out myself? And about the 2s4 & 9d6, I just really dropped random stuff because I didn't care much about previously meaningless characters for me haha.


Oh gotcha lol, I've looked less into enneagram than I have into cognitive functions so I'm not sure which tests are the most accurate, and again no online test is perfectly accurate. Here are some I took though:
eclecticenergies
yourenneagramcoach
Truity has one too, and I'm guessing it's going to be more accurate than their MBTI one because MBTI is so often misunderstood.



> That was REALLY long, but it was worth it, I really appreciate your efforts, since you taught me a lot about it so I'd like to thank you ؛)


No problem  I like explaining stuff I'm interested in and helping people where I think I'd be able so I enjoyed writing this out.



> Also I noticed your:
> *sp/sx • 584 • SLI • FLEV • RCUEN *+ [ Se > Ti > Ne > Fi > Te = Ni > Fe = Si ], can you teach me these if possible? ^^
> Maybe after providing me more answers so I have more knowledge though.


The sp/sx is my instinctual variant and the 584 is my tritype, which are both related to enneagram.

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There are three types of instinctual variants: sp (self-preserving), sx (sexual), and so (social). I think the below article explains it better than I would. Note that these variants can vary a bit by type so it would be a good idea to find your enneagram type first and then read on the variants based on your enneagram type.

Here's how I explained tritypes in a previous post in someone else's discussion:


> * *
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This post goes into more depth about instinctual variants and tritype.




SLI is my socionics type.

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I honestly haven't looked to much into this and just did a really quick self-diagnosis after reading through them, so I can't explain much. This forum may help you out though.

Also here is an online test I found but the design of the website gives it an informal, inaccurate vibe. I did get SLI from it though so maybe it's helpful to an extent.




FLEV is my attitudinal psyche, it's one of the newer methods of personality typing.

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There are 4 letters with descriptions from the attitudinal psyche site:
V (volition) - "The attitude towards decision, activation energy, willpower, planning, personal direction, goals, responsibilities, control, authority, obligations and esteem."
L (logic) - "The attitude towards all truth, details, facts, comparisons, calculations, assessments, computations, categorizations, systems, analyses, and proofs."
F (physics) - "The attitude towards matter, materials, location, practicality, sensations, appearances, nutrition, hygiene, possessions, comfort, and worth."
E (emotion) - "The attitude towards reactions, moods, affect, tone, expressions, imagination, associations, bonds, relationships, morals, and passion."

The position of your letter shows your attitude towards it.
The 1st one is your most "confident" one, 2nd is "flexible," 3rd is "insecure," and 4th is "unconcerned."
This part of the attitudinal psyche website explains those 4 positions.

attitudinal psyche test (painfully long)




RCUEN is my SLOAN/Big 5 type (I am a borderline RCUEI though). This is basically how 16 Personalities and other inaccurate MBTI tests type you.

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Basing these descriptions off of similarminds.com

1st letter is S or R (in inaccurate MBTI tests this correlates with E/I)
S - social - "Social types feel at ease interacting with to others"
R - reserved - "Reserved types are uncomfortable and/or disinterested with social interaction"

2nd letter is L or C (in 16P this correlates with -T/-A)
L - limbic - "Limbic types are prone to moodiness"
C - calm - "Calm types maintain level emotions"

3rd letter is O or U (in inaccurate MBTI tests this correlates with J/P)
O- organized - "Organized types are focused"
U - unstructured - "Unstructured types are scattered"

4th letter is A or E (in inaccurate MBTI tests this correlates with F/T)
A - accommodating - "Accommodating types live for others"
E - egocentric - "Egocentric types live for themselves"

5th letter is N or I (in inaccurate MBTI tests this correlates with S/N)
N - non-curious - "Non-curious types are less intellectually driven"
I - inquisitive - "Inquisitive types are insatiable in their quest to know more"

SLOAN/Big 5 test




The Se > Ti > Ne > Fi > Te = Ni > Fe = Si is just my results from the first cognitive functions test I linked. It basically lists the order of how well I use each function.


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## TheUnnecessaryEvil (Mar 28, 2021)

As with every discussion like this, do you mean NFJs or NFPs? They're completely different.


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## Meliodas (Nov 16, 2016)

TheUnnecessaryEvil said:


> As with every discussion like this, do you mean NFJs or NFPs? They're completely different.


Agreed. NFJs are fascists and NFPs are hippies.


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## FrostMoon (Mar 31, 2021)

I fell for the clickbait 😂


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## LeafStew (Oct 17, 2009)

ENFJ and INFJ use the same cognitives functions (Ni Se Ti Fe), same as ISTP and ESTP, just in a different order or preference.

I find it's a bit easier to understand cognitive functions than to type yourself with enneagram. I know pretty much which functions I use most of the time in a situation but I can't tell if I'm using head, heart or gut in a situation. :\


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## Fru2 (Aug 21, 2018)

@Cxunsxlxr You're likely ENTP, you sneaky.
Best sites for this: https://personalitypage.com/html/portraits.html


Classics in the History of Psychology -- Jung (1921/1923) Chapter 10


Welcome!


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## Deuce (Feb 16, 2021)

FrostMoon said:


> I fell for the clickbait 😂


Same, lol. I wanted to get roasted


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## FrostMoon (Mar 31, 2021)

Deuce said:


> Same, lol. I wanted to get roasted


🤣


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## Eren Jaegerbomb (Nov 13, 2015)

Meliodas said:


> Agreed. NFJs are fascists and NFPs are hippies.


Fascist INFJs.
Too many of them.


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## WraithOfNightmare (Jun 20, 2019)

In a weird way it gives me a sense of intrigue, maybe even a twisted sense of pride that I belong to a group of types that produced some really evil people (NFs). It’s because even though they’re vile as one could possibly me, it certainly doesn’t make us run of the mill at least lol. Hitler’s backstory is sort of interesting. And for those like Bin Laden, I mean being so driven by a single set of ideas, morals (or lack of, in their case), and vision that comes not from rational thought but from the depths of the heart is fascinating to me and something I can relate to although of course I am not an evil, genocide invoking dictator or terrorist leader (though sometimes I do have a vague feeling that I could be driven to similar actions if the right mix of pain, insanity and idealism hit me).

I haven’t watched the movie yet but it’s like Batman vs Joker, to me Joker represents the manifestation and attempts to redress / fight back at a broken system while Batman represents the system’s desperate attempts to maintain and justify the utterly unfair and unsustainable status quo. Therefore in the general sense I identity more with Joker than Bruce Wayne.


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## NIHM (Mar 24, 2014)

TheUnnecessaryEvil said:


> As with every discussion like this, do you mean NFJs or NFPs? They're completely different.


How did you get that far? I'm still stuck on what's the purpose of the question let alone the nouns they're meaning to include for the personalization at the end. Like the worst at what? It's so vague. It can't be everything. You can't be that ambiguous with Ne, I'll overthink that for an hour.

I mean I'm pretty darn sure I'm the worst at some subjects but I would be hard-pressed to ever admit being the worst at all of the skills, even in a moment of brief depression and self-doubt. Like hell, I'm in my phase that I'm awesome where my Te is thinking "I'm the ish," crap I'm more like "I need to dust my shoulders off cuz I'm so fly. You best believe I'm the best flavor of cake." But someone is going to pop my bubble and say no one says that any more X gen. Still doesn't shake my delusional set of mind and having me go...










at "NF's are probably the worst..." like it even has probably.... like is that a question within a question? That's just unfair towards a Ne forward person. The chain reaction it would cause. Plus it was clickbait, the subject had nothing to do with the title. 










Too bad, I'll forget it and reset with a new project in five minutes. Ohh, look penguin camping in Antarctica.


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