# Just try it



## PyrLove (Jun 6, 2010)

INTJ

I didn't see anything in our discussion that spoke strongly of sensing. Your reaction to the photos was more about a personal, non sensual, reaction. You didn't discuss composition, example.

You extrovert your rational function which is thinking. You seem to feel a need to share the products of your mind, i.e. teaching, which on this form comes in the form of discussion about MBTI.

An intuitive with Te means you are either INTJ or ENTJ based on the MBTI dichotomy. You seem to have a stronger Fi than Se so that means INTJ.

Please pick apart my analysis. I'm curious how you see yourself because that's really the only analysis that matters.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

arkigos said:


> INFP! No question whatsoever.
> 
> Whoa.....
> 
> ...


You always say INFP! XD




Redthir Jerdisheim said:


> Your username alone convinced me of inferior Se. Upon a deep examination, I have quickly been brought to the conclusion that your decision to blend 3 non-associated words was an attempt at boldly standing out and stealing a crowd, rather like the archetypal, impulsive Se-dom. Only your desperated attempt is a poor use of the function, and shows someone who uses it based on subjective perception. You probably spend all day dreaming up hypothetical party situations, in which you're at the centre.
> 
> I will also jump to the conclusion that you use Fe. This thread was created for the purpose of bringing everyone together, and co-operating to help those around you. It is rather akin to xNFJs lighting torches in the wilderness, beckoning people over to join them and create a new cult of sorts, where each member lives in harmony.
> 
> I hereby have your type. You are an INFJ.


How does my username convince toy of inferior Se?
If anything, it's my 4 in my enneagram that makes me want to have something that is unique to myself, I just have such bad imagination that I couldn't figure out anything better. XD
The 3 words were more like challenging people than standing out and stealing a crowd.
How does Se actually relate to use of words? It is a perceptive function.
But no, I seldom think about parties, I don't like them and I absolutely don't like to be in the center of attention.

This thread was made because I was bored, not to bring people together or to make them cooperate or anything such as that. Tho it would make it more interesting.



Stelliferous said:


> With further information I change my assessment. INFJ.


I did say "make it convincing". So far you have failed that.


ValliLoves said:


> A very gifted INFJ at the core. Your life experiences and traumas caused you to oscillate between each type depending on many factors when you were younger. Now, you are a well-rounded chameleon.


As much as I enjoy being called gifted; MBTI is not a dynamic system (there's a difference between a dynamic system and a system that is open to dynamics).
I was pretty much always an introvert even tho I'd argue that I haven't heard any convincing arguments for why I would be a certain type so far.
Just haven't heard an argument that flawlessly can defend why one person would have a tendency to deal with logic for example subjectively whereas another does it objectively. Especially since logic is subjective. Just look at science.



ChanceyRose said:


> INTJ
> 
> I didn't see anything in our discussion that spoke strongly of sensing. Your reaction to the photos was more about a personal, non sensual, reaction. You didn't discuss composition, example.
> 
> ...


So, what function do you believe is responsible for a "personal, non sensual, reaction"? You didn't answer that.

I am sure that Te does not = wanting to teach.
In that case there would be no Ti teachers or such. Which means that @arkigos for example is an exception. Or the self-typed ENTP psychology teacher I had. Or all the self-typed Ti users who were professors etc. that I've met.
Well, basically that doesn't make sense.

Even tho the JCFs are also dichotomous, then you need to be more specific if you wish to use MBTI or JCFs.

Now I've picked it apart. But now I need to do some stuff because we got a guest incoming.


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## ValliLoves (Jan 10, 2014)

Are you a Gemini?


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

ValliLoves said:


> Are you a Gemini?


No? How is that relevant?


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## ValliLoves (Jan 10, 2014)

I'm not really sure what your first question means.

To your second question, I'm not sure how to answer that either since I sense a condescending undertone.


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## PyrLove (Jun 6, 2010)

Thank you for the analysis but you didn't give me an analysis of yourself in exchange.



Acerbusvenator said:


> So, what function do you believe is responsible for a "personal, non sensual, reaction"? You didn't answer that.


What perceiving function isn't sensual? I didn't have enough information to determine if the function was introverted or extroverted.



> I am sure that Te does not = wanting to teach.
> In that case there would be no Ti teachers or such. Which means that @arkigos for example is an exception. Or the self-typed ENTP psychology teacher I had. Or all the self-typed Ti users who were professors etc. that I've met.
> Well, basically that doesn't make sense.
> 
> ...


I did not state all teachers use Te, only that a passion to teach is indicative, in my opinion, of Te in you. The key phrase in that section was your desire to share the product of your mind with the world. Not all teachers wish to share their own mental creations. I've know quite a few who would rather regurgitate the book than actually think for themselves or encourage students to think. You claimed to be passionate about teaching. Not all teachers by profession are passionate about teaching. Not all people who are passionate about teaching are teachers by profession.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

ChanceyRose said:


> Thank you for the analysis but you didn't give me an analysis of yourself in exchange.


Because that would be cheating? 



> What perceiving function isn't sensual? I didn't have enough information to determine if the function was introverted or extroverted.


Intuition?
So ask more questions. 



> I did not state all teachers use Te, only that a passion to teach is indicative, in my opinion, of Te in you. The key phrase in that section was your desire to share the product of your mind with the world. Not all teachers wish to share their own mental creations. I've know quite a few who would rather regurgitate the book than actually think for themselves or encourage students to think. You claimed to be passionate about teaching. Not all teachers by profession are passionate about teaching. Not all people who are passionate about teaching are teachers by profession.


I still don't see how this is relevant to Ti vs Te.
It seems more like profession due to necessity vs profession due to desire.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

It's not failure if I didn't try. I did say I didn't want to defend my answer on my first post. I'm wondering, do you know your type, mostly or fully, or did you make this thread to help determine your type?


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## RandomUsar (Jan 10, 2014)

ENTP. Your choice of a profile picture is typical of the legendary ENTP humor. :kitteh:


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Stelliferous said:


> It's not failure if I didn't try. I did say I didn't want to defend my answer on my first post. I'm wondering, do you know your type, mostly or fully, or did you make this thread to help determine your type?


I know what I and many others have typed me as earlier, tho I decided to abandon the idea of types.
In a way, I used this to check the arguments of the MBTI community from an objective standpoint to see if there's any basis behind what they say or if I should stay on my current course away from it.


ch3rryb0mb said:


> ENTP. Your choice of a profile picture is typical of the legendary ENTP humor. :kitteh:


I just like things that make people feel awkward so I tend to switch between what I find beautiful, amusing and what others just find awkward to look at.


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## krikits_roar (Jan 10, 2014)

INTP. I pegged you as an NT because 1. You seem to thrive on intelligent conversation. 2. You have the same argument style as my brother (who's an INTP) where you both want solid information strictly pertaining to the conversation at hand. 3. You're obviously introspective and have given this experiment serious thought. 4. Every person has the capacity to care for others or simply want a better world. Therefore I think the notion you are a feeler is wrong. 5. You seem more open to possibilities (even tho I think you have major doubts about anyone coming up with something that'll sway your position) than a regular j type. 

Feel free to pick this apart. I'm very curious to see what you think and what I might have gotten right. Even tho is is highly probable I got it all wrong. 

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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

krikits_roar said:


> INTP. I pegged you as an NT because 1. You seem to thrive on intelligent conversation. 2. You have the same argument style as my brother (who's an INTP) where you both want solid information strictly pertaining to the conversation at hand. 3. You're obviously introspective and have given this experiment serious thought. 4. Every person has the capacity to care for others or simply want a better world. Therefore I think the notion you are a feeler is wrong. 5. You seem more open to possibilities (even tho I think you have major doubts about anyone coming up with something that'll sway your position) than a regular j type.
> 
> Feel free to pick this apart. I'm very curious to see what you think and what I might have gotten right. Even tho is is highly probable I got it all wrong.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


I enjoy that you're not confident in a way.
Enjoying intelligent conversations is not related to being a T tho and even less related to being an NT.
Problem with the MBTI dichotomies is that they are not capable of explaining a person. For example, 95% would be typed as a P in their teenage years and as a J when they become parents. It's one of the things I bring up in the "article" I wrote.


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## krikits_roar (Jan 10, 2014)

While that is certainly true that enjoying intelligent conversation is not usually related to being a T (matter o fact I'm not one and I definitely enjoy it) but in my humble opinion I would think being a T, one would enjoy it more than the average person. And NTs I know very much enjoy debate, and to talk of things such as probability and the universe and all that jazz. I guess you and I are looking at this differently and I apologize because I know you want more numbers and research but the way I see it is the MBTI is there to tells us basically that we act in a certain way (our instincts, certain dispositions, and why we act the way we do at times) my instincts (being a N myself) are simply screaming you are an NT and by process of emlimantion you would either be (in my mind) a INTJ or an INTP. Although there is (as always) room for error in my thoughts as to what you are because even NF's can be cold, calculating, stubborn people. I think it is of course possible for a P to later test out as a J as one grows old. But wouldn't you agree that life and circumstance change all of us from when we are young? We learn to get harder and more J-ish as time goes on. You are still young so there is still hope you'd be a P type. 
P.s. what "article" are you referring too? And sorry there was so much to read in all of this must have skipped it. 

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## ValliLoves (Jan 10, 2014)

My Dad took the MBTI test today. He said after some research, he found that the tests are not accurate because it requires a trained professional to interpret the results. Is this true?


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

krikits_roar said:


> While that is certainly true that enjoying intelligent conversation is not usually related to being a T (matter o fact I'm not one and I definitely enjoy it) but in my humble opinion I would think being a T, one would enjoy it more than the average person. And NTs I know very much enjoy debate, and to talk of things such as probability and the universe and all that jazz. I guess you and I are looking at this differently and I apologize because I know you want more numbers and research but the way I see it is the MBTI is there to tells us basically that we act in a certain way (our instincts, certain dispositions, and why we act the way we do at times) my instincts (being a N myself) are simply screaming you are an NT and by process of emlimantion you would either be (in my mind) a INTJ or an INTP. Although there is (as always) room for error in my thoughts as to what you are because even NF's can be cold, calculating, stubborn people. I think it is of course possible for a P to later test out as a J as one grows old. But wouldn't you agree that life and circumstance change all of us from when we are young? We learn to get harder and more J-ish as time goes on. You are still young so there is still hope you'd be a P type.
> P.s. what "article" are you referring too? And sorry there was so much to read in all of this must have skipped it.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


You know, according to the official MBTI agencies then most people are Ts, so they are the average.
Now, I don't really like debates and stuff, I am more for discussions and reaching an agreement.
The article I referred to is in my signature. The text is clickable and takes you to it.


ValliLoves said:


> My Dad took the MBTI test today. He said after some research, he found that the tests are not accurate because it requires a trained professional to interpret the results. Is this true?


Tests are not accurate, not even the official one.
A professional won't really help either.
What you need is to educate yourself.


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## krikits_roar (Jan 10, 2014)

I'll have to check it out when I have a chance than. Sorry didn't mean to debate. You're cool. Thanks for the convo.  

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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Acerbusvenator said:


> I know what I and many others have typed me as earlier, tho I decided to abandon the idea of types.
> In a way, I used this to check the arguments of the MBTI community from an objective standpoint to see if there's any basis behind what they say or if I should stay on my current course away from it.
> 
> I just like things that make people feel awkward so I tend to switch between what I find beautiful, amusing and what others just find awkward to look at.


You do realize the type is what you are COMFORTABLE with, what comes NATURALLY. INFP is my comfortable state but from the outside I would be seen as a T because I think a lot with logic and maybe an S too. I can BE any way I WANT to be but what is natural, easy, and comfortable for me is the INFP state. If your goal is to be on both sides of a spectrum that could be for many reasons determined by the enneagram type. 5s would want to have both sides for intelligence reasons. 9s would want both sides for.. balance. 3s would want both sides because they feel more successful that way. Being a certain type is like picking which hand is your dominant one. Some people train their non-dominant hand to be equally as capable as their dominant hand. Why do I not defend my answer? Because I don't know what your'e comfortable with. I can see multiple sides that you show but only you know which side is dominant and which one is worked upon.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Stelliferous said:


> You do realize the type is what you are COMFORTABLE with, what comes NATURALLY. INFP is my comfortable state but from the outside I would be seen as a T because I think a lot with logic and maybe an S too. I can BE any way I WANT to be but what is natural, easy, and comfortable for me is the INFP state. If your goal is to be on both sides of a spectrum that could be for many reasons determined by the enneagram type. 5s would want to have both sides for intelligence reasons. 9s would want both sides for.. balance. 3s would want both sides because they feel more successful that way. Being a certain type is like picking which hand is your dominant one. Some people train their non-dominant hand to be equally as capable as their dominant hand. Why do I not defend my answer? Because I don't know what your'e comfortable with. I can see multiple sides that you show but only you know which side is dominant and which one is worked upon.


I am well aware of the meanings within this typology.
However, it is about preference.
Now, that word is often misused, but think about things like sexual preference.
You may be able to have sexual intercourse with the gender you don't have a sexual preference for, you may do it if you have no other alternative, but you won't like it and if given a choice you'll give in to your preference. You don't want to deviate from your preference.
A preference is not a fluid thing.

In the enneagram I am btw an enneagram 8(54)


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## Dalton (Jun 10, 2013)

What's your stance on abortion and marijuana use?


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

dalton.thompson said:


> What's your stance on abortion and marijuana use?


I haven't really formed a stance on either. It's usually like that for me. Constantly staying open.
I do however think that people should decide over their own life (even if some things like drinking alcohol and such annoys me) and I don't consider something living before it has actually been born.


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## Dalton (Jun 10, 2013)

Acerbusvenator said:


> I haven't really formed a stance on either. It's usually like that for me. Constantly staying open.
> I do however think that people should decide over their own life (even if some things like drinking alcohol and such annoys me) and I don't consider something living before it has actually been born.


ENTP. If not that, INTP.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

dalton.thompson said:


> ENTP. If not that, INTP.


Spell out your reasoning to me like as if I was stupid. :happy:


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## Dalton (Jun 10, 2013)

Acerbusvenator said:


> Spell out your reasoning to me like as if I was stupid. :happy:


Star Trek & Sci-fi: Indicates intuitive preference.
Nick Cage. I (being an ENTJ) don't really understand why some people find putting his face on everything so damn funny. I believe that Ne results in a weird sense of humor than Ni.
You're more of a thinker than a feeler.
More evidence for Ne than Ti.
This is all I really need to determine ENTP.
Edit: Or ENxP. You might be a feeler. roud:


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

So far we've really just talked about my ability to reason which is only a part of me and why people like me, even if it is the predominant thing you see on the Internet.
What really defines me tho in real life is to a large portion my heart which I am also less comfortable speaking about.

When my mother would yell at my sister when I was young, they needed to put me in my room so I couldn't hear them because otherwise they would find me curled up, crying.

What defines me is my will to help and that beacons strongly through me, teaching is merely an extension of this. I don't teach to prove how knowledgable I am, I teach because I both want and need to help others.

I may be good at reasoning and write articles like the one in my signature that I keeps getting compliments about, I may get compliments of my skill in English and seeing things that others don't etc. but I am also good at speaking from my heart.

Once I do start writing or talking from my heart I can get really passionate, not in a condescending way against others, but merely questioning and honest. From asking why organizations harass the families of criminals when the only crime of the family is love, to holding a speech for a girl with a developing eating disorder that the guy who told her that she was fat had no right to do so to criticizing an organization for seeing some refugees as broken when they are just normal teenagers with abnormal experiences.
This is why I have gained a lot of respect from the people around me who I call friends. Because they know I care and they know I am loyal to them. This is also why I decided not to become a social worker. Because I put all my energy into every person I try to help that it simply gets too much. I can't handle the strain.
This sincerity in how I care also allows me to make people happy even when they are not or at least I make them feel like someone cares. I mean, I made a guy with a cancer in his throat that was so bad he could barely eat smile for a while.
But what especially brings me friends is the combination of my head and heart. My close friends come to me for guidance if it so is knowledge based or emotional. I can usually help them in some way.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

Acerbusvenator said:


> That's a secret.


No, but let's move on.


> City Hall Moon/Blue Hour (Explored!) | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
> I like this photo, I like how high-tech some of the stuff looks and I've always been drawn to high-tech stuff.
> It kinda reminds me of Shanghai. Tho apparently it is in London, so I don't like it. I currently dislike England in general.


I'm somewhat confused at the quick reversal. Your mind jumps in associative ways that are somewhat strange. When you like something, you don't like it for itself, but rather for what you associate with it?



> Had an English friend, but she decided to terminate our friendship in an attempt to become more "modest". Also part of what lead to what you see in my signature, she was typed as an INFP for quite some time so I kinda blame the system in a way.


What about you was making her feel exposed?



> Inside The Treasury | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
> This is probably the reddest picture I have seen this year, with the red sand(?) rocks being lit up by the lights that are shining red it really really looks... red. Then you have the dark sky in contrast (sigh, my mother is yelling so loud while she tries to sing that I need to put on music). I don't really know what else to say, it's red and black, 2 colors I like. What really caught my eyes was the lights in what looked like a small pool of water.


I think inferior Sensing may have been the right call for you, but I don't necessarily think it's Se. More on that later.



> As with my mother earlier who made me turn on the music. I don't enjoy by any definition to have people interrupt my train of thought. Usually because once it is rolling, it rolls really good, but it is easy to derail and then it takes me a long time to get back my flow.


That can happen with any type for different reasons.



> I am a lot more friendly tho to my friends than my mother as I don't like my mother. I'd likely give some snarky comment that would be a bit bellow the belt, but not too offensive to get their attention and then tell them I need to focus.


Are you habitually aware of the emotional effects of what you say and do on people?



> But if they didn't leave anyways I would get meaner, like when my father kept arguing with me and not understand what we were actually talking about and instead argued with me about his own topic in which I called him unintelligent and incapable of understanding as no matter how many times I tried to explain he'd keep arguing about the same thing that was just semi-related to what we were talking about. Then ofc. it ended with me disproving what he said anyways so yea.


This bit of text is just confusing. What was the origin of the chat in question? 

I'm seeing in you a lack of restraint in your expressions toward others, and an underdevelopment, though, that reminds me of the tertiary Fe I've encountered in others. It's somewhat immature and this is why ExTPs can get thought of as narcissistic, because Fe expresses stuff that's supposed to be taken for granted as correct in a common context but in the ExTP it's not so well developed and the judgement can be really off.



> Obtaining knowledge, teaching, defending those close to you, staying loyal.


Why do you value these things? What does knowledge do for you, why do you teach, what do you think is important about defending those close to you or staying loyal?



> No, they wouldn't change because I've always been passionate about all of these.


When did you develop these values?



> I would sit and plan how to respond in a smart way and then when I have, the conversation will have moved on so I just stay silent. :/


Sounds kinda like Ti to me off the bat, but what constitutes a 'smart' way?



> Learning and teaching. Discussing abstract topic is also interesting.


What satisfaction do you get from these?



> Anything that involves people really.
> Also doing repetitive things.


How are you interested in teaching if you don't like things that involve people?

The disdain for repetition seems to back up the idea that your preference is for extraverted perceiving over introverted perceiving, or even just extraversion over introversion. Repetition mollifies/dulls the outer awareness so you can reflect internally, which leads to me doing things like playing a song or an album without lyrics on repeat while I study for hours on end or talk to a person, or doing chores while I think about a problem.



> Well, introverted is rather obvious. My mother has constantly whined about me not being "out there" enough, which is really because I get drained and I also see it as shallow and fake to do things you don't want to just because you should be "out there".


It sounds like your mother has some way she wants you to go in life and you have other ideas in mind. This kind of contention is typical between parents and children. What are you like when you aren't being driven by your mother? What is _your_ preference in life, not the definition against hers? What is it you _do_ want to do?



> Not to forget that my internship as a social worker sent me into depression due to constant lack of energy.


What about it was draining, exactly?



> One of my greatest strengths and weaknesses is my ability to connect things.
> When it is accurate it is really good, but when it is wrong it can be the end of a friendship. I tend to be very paranoid (at least I used to be. These days I don't know).


Out of the intuitive types, connecting things is most reasonably the domain of Ne. Ni serves as an inference-reader for bland Se perceptions, while Ne shoots out into different connections from a unique Si sense of reality.



> My greatest strength tho is my ability to understand myself. I didn't really think about it until I told someone that MBTI was useless since it said things about me I already knew after which it was replied that so is not the case for everyone, most completely unaware of these things of themselves it was said.


This does not inherently mean you understand yourself, it can mean you know how you see yourself. If that is the case, and that is the bulk of what equates to understanding yourself, then you are more likely looking at yourself predominantly from the surface, which is cognitive extraversion.



> I suppose that what made it easier for me to break out from MBTI even after having spent so many hours on it. It never really did anything for me so there was nothing that would be thrown back into confusion for me.


I suspect what I'm reading in here is Ne over Si in practice: Ne read the possibility of gathering something from MBTI but your experience through Si bore out nothing from it, so you ditched it as meaningless to you.



> My greatest weakness is also that I am aware of my strengths. It makes me seem arrogant when I am merely reflective. It always seems to find a way to stab me in the back.


So your weakness is what causes others to respond to you in a certain way? Fe reads reactions like that as indicators of relation, and the tertiary tends to develop into an area of conscious weakness. 



> My mind tells me to go in all directions at the same time. I think my ADHD makes the stress worse or the other way around so suddenly instead of doing one thing at a time I suddenly feel a need to do a hundred things at the exact same time. Usually leads to me giving up or collecting myself.


If it's your ADHD, I don't think it's related to type.



> I hate being accused of things. It really bugs me when people make assumptions about me based on their subjective perception because I know they are wrong.


A subtle hint again that your inferior is introverted. Subjective perception is the domain of the cognitive introvert.



> I mean, when I know something inside out and someone claims I don't know shit I get really upset because they don't even want to face me in argument or anything, they just withdraw with an insult. If you wish to withdraw from a discussion, just say so. No need to go all butthurt. I seldom argue against people, but against ideas.


When you know something inside out, what shape does your knowledge take? What about it is it that you know?



> Currently around stuff like the construction of games, taking over the world and stuff. The usual.
> I tend to construct a lot of things in my head, from the essay about MBTI to an entire world in my mind. It's all ways to keep my mind busy.


This is where I'd suggest to you that you might look into enneagram 7, pending your motive for keeping your mind busy. Also the idea of 'constructing things in your head' sounds rather Ti-oriented to me, though it's not conclusive.



> I love feedback, tho sometimes I will be like "I don't think you're smart enough to contribute" or "you haven't earned enough respect from me to make your input interesting", but I don't say those, it's more of a thought. Not really arrogant, just filtering out people that don't know what they are talking about.


Why does your respect for a person matter in finding their input interesting? What criteria do you use to determine if a person is smart enough to contribute?

So far I think ENTP is the type, if not that then INTP. I don't see a lot of maturity in Feeling, but then I really don't see Sensing at any real developed level, and what's there that seems to pertain properly to type looks more Ne-Si and Ti-Fe shaped than the other way around.

I tried it.


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## ValliLoves (Jan 10, 2014)

Preferences actually can be fluid.

A number of lesbian women, and some heterosexual women as well, perceive choice as an important element in their sexual orientations.


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## krikits_roar (Jan 10, 2014)

Ok now I'm just confused. (I still need to read your article so bare with me) so you are very smart, (my thoughts ofc) you reason things out, you have a heart of gold, and you want to be recognized for both. So for that (I'm gonna sound crazy cause I'm 99 percent sure I am) I'm gonna say either enfj (yes I know I said you couldn't be a feeler but you never know as I also said earlier) or INTP. 

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## krikits_roar (Jan 10, 2014)

How many times have you you been tested and were your results consistent? 

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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Flatlander said:


> No, but let's move on.


But I am such a secretive person! D:



> I'm somewhat confused at the quick reversal. Your mind jumps in associative ways that are somewhat strange. When you like something, you don't like it for itself, but rather for what you associate with it?


Yea, that's pretty much it. Tho some things are beautiful on their own.



> What about you was making her feel exposed?


Apparently she removed a lot of people from her friends list.
My crime was compliments. Did a little flirting tho as well and she removed friends who gave her compliments and who flirted with her so double out.



> Are you habitually aware of the emotional effects of what you say and do on people?


Nope. What I think the effect is and what the effect is can be very distant things.



> This bit of text is just confusing. What was the origin of the chat in question?


We were discussing maps and I showed a map that is proportionately correct and then suddenly my dad brought in a miniature version of the earth for no reason and got really mad and said that the globe is proportionately correct, even tho we were discussing normal maps.



> I'm seeing in you a lack of restraint in your expressions toward others, and an underdevelopment, though, that reminds me of the tertiary Fe I've encountered in others. It's somewhat immature and this is why ExTPs can get thought of as narcissistic, because Fe expresses stuff that's supposed to be taken for granted as correct in a common context but in the ExTP it's not so well developed and the judgement can be really off.


I had more restraint when I was younger.



> Why do you value these things? What does knowledge do for you, why do you teach, what do you think is important about defending those close to you or staying loyal?


The knowledge things is answered in the post above yours.
When it comes to loyalty and defending those close to you then it is a matter of being consistent so people know they can trust you.



> When did you develop these values?


Has always been something I've had.



> Sounds kinda like Ti to me off the bat, but what constitutes a 'smart' way?


Can be a good answer with facts or some snarky comment.



> What satisfaction do you get from these?


I get energy and that is always in low supply for me. I also get a sense of accomplishment.



> How are you interested in teaching if you don't like things that involve people?


It's not that I don't like people, it's that it drains me.
I was drained even when my closest friend was at my place



> The disdain for repetition seems to back up the idea that your preference is for extraverted perceiving over introverted perceiving, or even just extraversion over introversion. Repetition mollifies/dulls the outer awareness so you can reflect internally, which leads to me doing things like playing a song or an album without lyrics on repeat while I study for hours on end or talk to a person, or doing chores while I think about a problem.


I don't know many people who like repetitive things and I don't see how that connects to MBTI exactly. Seems more like personal preference. Like how I could eat the same food my entire life, but some can't even eat the same food twice in a month.



> It sounds like your mother has some way she wants you to go in life and you have other ideas in mind. This kind of contention is typical between parents and children. What are you like when you aren't being driven by your mother? What is _your_ preference in life, not the definition against hers? What is it you _do_ want to do?


When I lived alone I barely went outside unless I needed to go somewhere. I limited myself to conversations over the Internet and such.
Personally I just want to learn stuff.



> What about it was draining, exactly?


Answered in the earlier post.



> Out of the intuitive types, connecting things is most reasonably the domain of Ne. Ni serves as an inference-reader for bland Se perceptions, while Ne shoots out into different connections from a unique Si sense of reality.


Ni and Ne supposedly originate from the same function, just divided into 2 dichotomous attitudes.



> This does not inherently mean you understand yourself, it can mean you know how you see yourself. If that is the case, and that is the bulk of what equates to understanding yourself, then you are more likely looking at yourself predominantly from the surface, which is cognitive extraversion.


No, but it was just a simplistic example.



> I suspect what I'm reading in here is Ne over Si in practice: Ne read the possibility of gathering something from MBTI but your experience through Si bore out nothing from it, so you ditched it as meaningless to you.


Irrelevant and flawed understanding of the functions is what I see from this. Like someone trying to predict your life by looking at your hand.
You just lost grasp of what a perception is.



> So your weakness is what causes others to respond to you in a certain way? Fe reads reactions like that as indicators of relation, and the tertiary tends to develop into an area of conscious weakness.


Uh?



> A subtle hint again that your inferior is introverted. Subjective perception is the domain of the cognitive introvert.


Uhu... So you have no issue with people saying slander about you or such and you believe it is connected to MBTI?



> When you know something inside out, what shape does your knowledge take? What about it is it that you know?


Uh, everything more or less?
Another expression is "I know it like the back of my hand".



> This is where I'd suggest to you that you might look into enneagram 7, pending your motive for keeping your mind busy. Also the idea of 'constructing things in your head' sounds rather Ti-oriented to me, though it's not conclusive.


That actually sounds more like enneagram 5.



> Why does your respect for a person matter in finding their input interesting? What criteria do you use to determine if a person is smart enough to contribute?


Because I respect smart people with arguments that are logical that don't go against my values.



ValliLoves said:


> Preferences actually can be fluid.
> 
> A number of lesbian women, and some heterosexual women as well, perceive choice as an important element in their sexual orientations.


When you have sexual preference for neither gender you are either bisexual or asexual.
I am supplying the definition of the word and some small group of people talking about the importance of choice is then irrelevant.



krikits_roar said:


> Ok now I'm just confused. (I still need to read your article so bare with me) so you are very smart, (my thoughts ofc) you reason things out, you have a heart of gold, and you want to be recognized for both. So for that (I'm gonna sound crazy cause I'm 99 percent sure I am) I'm gonna say either enfj (yes I know I said you couldn't be a feeler but you never know as I also said earlier) or INTP.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Except that ENFJs have inferior Ti and are extroverts.


krikits_roar said:


> How many times have you you been tested and were your results consistent?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Many many times and not consistent. Completely dependent on my mood.


----------



## ValliLoves (Jan 10, 2014)

No. Actually you weren't supplying the definition of the word "preference". You specifically said that a preference is not fluid. 

That is not accurate or logical.


----------



## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

ValliLoves said:


> No. Actually you weren't supplying the definition of the word "preference". You specifically said that a preference is not fluid.
> 
> That is not accurate or logical.


Preference: something preferred; choice; selection: Her preference is vanilla.


What preference means is that if you are doing A and you can use B or C, you will always choose the one that you prefer.
preference - a strong liking; "my own preference is for good literature"; "the Irish have a penchant for blarney"preference - a predisposition in favor of something; "a predilection for expensive cars"; "his sexual preferences"; "showed a Marxist orientation"
preference - the right or chance to choose; "given my druthers, I'd eat cake"
preference - grant of favor or advantage to one over another (especially to a country or countries in matters of international trade, such as levying duties)
Preference: 
a greater liking for one alternative over another or others:
her preference for white wine
he chose a clock in preference to a watch
a thing preferred:
nearly 40 per cent named acid house as their musical preference


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

I don't actually remember what we were talking about @ValliLoves (I'm a bit slow today).

I assume it is about this:


Acerbusvenator said:


> However, it is about preference.
> Now, that word is often misused, but think about things like sexual preference.
> You may be able to have sexual intercourse with the gender you don't have a sexual preference for, you may do it if you have no other alternative, but you won't like it and if given a choice you'll give in to your preference. You don't want to deviate from your preference.
> A preference is not a fluid thing.


And no, preference is not a fluid thing and that is one of the reasons I criticize the use of it in MBTI.
For example, if you were an INTP you'd always prefer to do it in the Ti Ne Si Fe order, but people are not that solid, we are dynamic.
This is the origin of one of my examples:


> For example, you are at the hospital with your terminally ill child. The hospital is too crowded for everyone to be taken care of. You have the choice to A. kill your child so that someone who may be able to live can have a chance or B. let your child remain regardless of the circumstance.
> 
> 
> Now, this may seem extreme, but a preference is a preference and if you prefer to do what is logical, you will kill your child. If you prefer to do what is ethical, you will not.


Just like "I prefer to do it the good old way" means that you do it the good old way as long as you can.


----------



## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

Acerbusvenator said:


> But I am such a secretive person! D:
> 
> 
> Yea, that's pretty much it. Tho some things are beautiful on their own.
> ...


Why did you change?




> The knowledge things is answered in the post above yours.
> When it comes to loyalty and defending those close to you then it is a matter of being consistent so people know they can trust you.


Why do you need people to trust you?




> Has always been something I've had.


Very good explanation. If you were aware of your 'inner world' (as it were) from an early age, perhaps you would be able to tell how you derived these, where they came from.




> Can be a good answer with facts or some snarky comment.
> 
> 
> I get energy and that is always in low supply for me. I also get a sense of accomplishment.


Why is energy in such low supply for you? And what makes you feel accomplished about this stuff?



> It's not that I don't like people, it's that it drains me.
> I was drained even when my closest friend was at my place


Can you describe what being 'drained' is like for you, or means to you? It's common parliance in MBTI, but it also isn't very specific.



> I don't know many people who like repetitive things and I don't see how that connects to MBTI exactly. Seems more like personal preference. Like how I could eat the same food my entire life, but some can't even eat the same food twice in a month.


I already described it to you, but I guess I will explain. It'll link back down to something I have to say to you later.

A cognitive extraverted perspective has to do with prioritizing the surface aspect of the world. It looks for things that _everyone_ should supposedly have access to, be they the precise appearance of things via Se, the possibilities that arise for a thing's transformation via Ne, the overtly defined logical structure of the world via Te, or emotive cues or cultural/common evaluations via Fe. 

When you have extraverted perceiving as a preference, it pairs with an introverted perceiving inferior. Introversion has to do with subjective emphasis on a perspective, be it what sensed data is important or what impression is gathered via Si, what possibility is deemed most probable or personally accepted via Ni, the refining of a personal view on systematic structure via Ti, or the personal evaluation and relation via Fi.

I see this especially in people I consider extraverted perceiving dominant: a variety of things to take in via the world tends to suit them more than a repeated stimulus. Repeated stimulus _drowns out_ the extraverted awareness, bores the fuck out of Se or Ne, and that wouldn't be too pleasant most of the time to someone who prefers these styles of awareness. Given that people are abstracting creatures, it doesn't necessarily have to be a constant sensory stimulus, it can extend to things like reading different books or websites to gather new information, talking to different people online, creating new mental landscapes, or just engaging in action. By contrast, for someone preferring Si or Ni, a repeated stimulus can be used to mollify the inferior Se or Ne so the person can sit to ponder or formulate without interruption from the world, and hence a preference might grow up around doing this.



> When I lived alone I barely went outside unless I needed to go somewhere. I limited myself to conversations over the Internet and such.
> Personally I just want to learn stuff.


Toward what purpose do you want to learn stuff?




> Answered in the earlier post.
> 
> 
> Ni and Ne supposedly originate from the same function, just divided into 2 dichotomous attitudes.


Yes, but if you are downplaying the importance of attitudes then you're downplaying half the point of each perspective. The personal priority element of introversion creates a tendency to stick to the prioritized inference and refine it, where Ne basically views potentials or connections equally, so the emphasis could end up on the fact of seeing connections itself.



> No, but it was just a simplistic example.


So go deeper.



> Irrelevant and flawed understanding of the functions is what I see from this. Like someone trying to predict your life by looking at your hand.
> You just lost grasp of what a perception is.


No, I did not. You apparently did not grasp what I had to say. I will quote and explicate.



Me said:


> I suspect what I'm reading in here is Ne over Si in practice: Ne read the possibility of gathering something from MBTI but your experience through Si bore out nothing from it, so you ditched it as meaningless to you.


 If we go back to the simple, Intuition is the perception of what surrounds a thing, while Sensing is the perception of a thing itself. The world is filled with things, so Intuition fills in what comes from a single thing or between different things to complete the picture.

Ne, therefore, can give you the general idea that something holds possibility without telling you specifically what it is, because there could be any number of possible pictures that Ne could use to fill in the holes of reality. Si is Ne's anchor if Ne is in the dominant, pinning it down to the reality that you have experienced. If Ne gets interested in something and continues to read it, then eventually the data filters down into the Si-shaped unconscious and the person's perception of it changes. Since Si is giving you a personal perspective on what exists, it suggests different and more defined potential from what was once an open book, and the person ends up with a better basis to judge whether they are interested in something or not. 

It may seem elementary, but not every mind works this way. 

If my idea of what is going on in your mind is not accurate for you, you have every right to dismiss it as an incorrect inference about yourself, but to call me wrong about Ne/Si on the basis of an opinion that is well-formed about Ne/Si is bullshit.



> Uh?
> 
> 
> Uhu... So you have no issue with people saying slander about you or such and you believe it is connected to MBTI?


I know slander when I see it and I don't generalize it to subjective opinion.



> Uh, everything more or less?
> Another expression is "I know it like the back of my hand".


That's incredibly definitive. Few people genuinely know everything about a topic, and real experts tend to think there is always more to know so they don't consider themselves so knowledgeable - for reference, wiki the Dunning-Kruger effect.

'Everything' is a massive generalization. It could mean you know every fact, every analytical detail, every possible point of view, every possible projection from a thing, etc. If you could give an example of the kind of knowledge you have and, say, define what you think MBTI Feeling is, perhaps it would help give an idea of the format of your knowledge. 



> That actually sounds more like enneagram 5.


No.

Enneagram 5 is not about keeping your mind busy. It is about existential separation from the world, which mentally means holding in what is yours and keeping out foreign influence. Type 5, from a psychological point of view, is defined by the mental content itself, not the action of keeping your mind busy which reads more like avoidance of facing deeper issues or fears, which, in the mind triad, is the purview of type 7.



> Because I respect smart people with arguments that are logical that don't go against my values.


What about smart people with arguments that suborn what you value yet make perfect logical sense?


----------



## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Flatlander said:


> Why did you change?


I decided not to get pushed around.



> Why do you need people to trust you?


I don't "need" it, I desire it. I see myself as loyal and it makes me happy when they think so as well.
Trust also means you can be honest and I am very sensitive to barriers, especially as I can be suspicious myself.



> Very good explanation. If you were aware of your 'inner world' (as it were) from an early age, perhaps you would be able to tell how you derived these, where they came from.


Look, I've had these values from before I have memories. That's what I mean.
I remember being 6 years old and passionately trying to help people.



> Why is energy in such low supply for you? And what makes you feel accomplished about this stuff?


Because I am a very tired person. I am energized by intellectual and deeper discussions and they are relatively hard to come by.



> Can you describe what being 'drained' is like for you, or means to you? It's common parliance in MBTI, but it also isn't very specific.


It means I get really tired, like I've been awake for days. I get snappy.
Each day after my internship I went to bed and slept for an hour before dinner.



> Toward what purpose do you want to learn stuff?


For no other reason than because it is interesting and energizes me. Also allows me to teach others.



> Ne, therefore, can give you the general idea that something holds possibility without telling you specifically what it is, because there could be any number of possible pictures that Ne could use to fill in the holes of reality. Si is Ne's anchor if Ne is in the dominant, pinning it down to the reality that you have experienced. If Ne gets interested in something and continues to read it, then eventually the data filters down into the Si-shaped unconscious and the person's perception of it changes. Since Si is giving you a personal perspective on what exists, it suggests different and more defined potential from what was once an open book, and the person ends up with a better basis to judge whether they are interested in something or not.


Basically seems like a description I could give to anyone and they may accept it as describing themselves.
Reminds me of the forer effect that is.



> That's incredibly definitive. Few people genuinely know everything about a topic, and real experts tend to think there is always more to know so they don't consider themselves so knowledgeable - for reference, wiki the Dunning-Kruger effect.
> 
> 'Everything' is a massive generalization. It could mean you know every fact, every analytical detail, every possible point of view, every possible projection from a thing, etc. If you could give an example of the kind of knowledge you have and, say, define what you think MBTI Feeling is, perhaps it would help give an idea of the format of your knowledge.


Thus "more or less" as I don't know what I don't know. But I know that I am proficient at using the system.

The MBTI feeling function is a value oriented function. It is about what you find good or bad/agreeable or disagreeable etc.
The values of an Fi user are subjective and independent of external stimuli with no wish to be affected by it.
The values of an Fe users are objective and dependent on the external environment, Fe users tend to take the values of those who are close to them and seek to create a consensus of values.



> No.
> 
> Enneagram 5 is not about keeping your mind busy. It is about existential separation from the world, which mentally means holding in what is yours and keeping out foreign influence. Type 5, from a psychological point of view, is defined by the mental content itself, not the action of keeping your mind busy which reads more like avoidance of facing deeper issues or fears, which, in the mind triad, is the purview of type 7.





> Currently around stuff like the construction of games, taking over the world and stuff. The usual.
> I tend to construct a lot of things in my head, from the essay about MBTI to an entire world in my mind. It's all ways to keep my mind busy.


I don't actually see the avoidance that I supposedly described.
When I say that I like to keep my mind busy it is usually connected to the energy question. If I spend time trying to build complex things in my head I am "preserving energy" in a way and also trying to increase the power of my brain.



> What about smart people with arguments that suborn what you value yet make perfect logical sense?


Depends on my mood, I may consider it or tell them that I don't give a shit if it makes sense or not. 
The former is a part of my "old" self, the latter is more of my "new" self. I used to have greater issues disagreeing with people than I have now. Tho I still tend to over-agree with people even if I may add in my perspective as an alternative view.


----------



## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

Acerbusvenator said:


> I decided not to get pushed around.
> 
> 
> I don't "need" it, I desire it. I see myself as loyal and it makes me happy when they think so as well.


So basically they are backing up your self-image.



> Trust also means you can be honest and I am very sensitive to barriers, especially as I can be suspicious myself.
> 
> 
> Look, I've had these values from before I have memories. That's what I mean.
> I remember being 6 years old and passionately trying to help people.


Nothing ever happened to alter what you value, or caused your values to grow in weight to you or make you think about them or anything?



> Because I am a very tired person. I am energized by intellectual and deeper discussions and they are relatively hard to come by.


How do you know an intellectual or deeper discussion when you find one? What kind of things do you find deep and intellectual?



> It means I get really tired, like I've been awake for days. I get snappy.
> Each day after my internship I went to bed and slept for an hour before dinner.


K.



> For no other reason than because it is interesting and energizes me. Also allows me to teach others.


There is _no_ depth of meaning I can see in this. There is a breadth, it allows you to act in the world and creates or maintains a mental state that is pleasant to you. Not everyone thinks to do that.



> Basically seems like a description I could give to anyone and they may accept it as describing themselves.
> Reminds me of the forer effect that is.


Perhaps this is because _you_ fit it. I could pose this description to someone who doesn't match it and get a different response.



> Thus "more or less" as I don't know what I don't know. But I know that I am proficient at using the system.


You are proficient at using what you see of the system, or understand as being the system. 



> The MBTI feeling function is a value oriented function. It is about what you find good or bad/agreeable or disagreeable etc.
> The values of an Fi user are subjective and independent of external stimuli with no wish to be affected by it.
> The values of an Fe users are objective and dependent on the external environment, Fe users tend to take the values of those who are close to them and seek to create a consensus of values.


This explanation still supports the idea that you have extraverted cognition, on the whole. It is very much things 'as they are', being that it looks like it came from an MBTI textbook and includes the manifestations of the functions that place them at extremes possible to no organic thinking. Who really has the total capacity to not be affected by external stimuli in evaluative deliberation or only evaluate dependent on the things others say?

Granted that I did ask you to 'define', even if I left room for subjectivity in my request, so whatever. I meant 'explain', but I wasn't perfect.



> *I don't actually see the avoidance that I supposedly described.*
> When I say that I like to keep my mind busy it is usually connected to the energy question. If I spend time trying to build complex things in my head I am "preserving energy" in a way and also trying to increase the power of my brain.


That's precisely it. You *don't* see it.

You "preserve energy" because you are indulging yourself in something you like to do, something that is positive to you and appears to help rather than hurt you. One of the facets of E7 is that it prefers to do this in order not to have to face the negative states that the mind itself implies, whatever those might be. It is in the 'idealist' triad, meaning this tendency to suppress the negative parts of mind is a key component in how they achieve control over themselves and their lives.

I could see how this would be construed as gaining power, but it stands in a bit of contrast to the E5 agenda of viewing the whole of your mind clearly and living as your mental concepts as a way to achieve a feeling of separation from the world. What you presented appears to have more to do with the nature of the mental action itself, and the implied result is different.



> Depends on my mood, I may consider it or tell them that I don't give a shit if it makes sense or not.
> The former is a part of my "old" self, the latter is more of my "new" self. I used to have greater issues disagreeing with people than I have now. Tho I still tend to over-agree with people even if I may add in my perspective as an alternative view.


Why did you have issues disagreeing with people, and how did you change so easily? A lot of people seem to struggle with that.


----------



## krikits_roar (Jan 10, 2014)

Sorry enfj was me jumping to a conclusion to quickly (thats a nasty habit of mine) but I was talking to my brother (i wanted a second opinion) and he said if your results were consistent you'd be a NT. But if it changes according to your mood that implies something else. I had the same problem for the first few yrs when I started taking the test. You're smart, you're kind, you're both. So scratch the E in enfj and replace that with an I. Infj have inferior Ti but as a shadow function they have Te you could have very well built it up enough to be perfectly usable. I know two infj's one guy (who is or was a nurse) and the other a girl (who works at a day-care) They are both smart caring people and that's why I love them both. My bro thinks you are a P type which if you are not a intp that would make you a Infp like me. You don't want to debate, but want to be reasoned into a agreement. You like harmony, and peace, and you hate to see people mistreated. Infj's are notorious for taking on people's problems as their own and getting to attached. Which leaves them overly drained and tired. The infj guy I know also thrives of intelligent conversation (yes, yes its not simply a T thing. I should have realized what that said about you sooner) and of course some of the other things about you can be affected by your enneagram type (but I don't know enough about those things to break that down yet) the infj I know also likes to play devils advocate ( he really likes to play the what if game) which (no offense) seems kind like what you're doing. Stirring that pot so to speak. Infp is possible because you don't seem to speak in absolutes like a lot of J types do. I don't know 100 percent what you are but its driving me crazy trying to figure it out. Lol. Either way what do you think/feel on the matter? Oh and sorry if I got anything technically wrong in said analysis. 

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Acerbusvenator said:


> I don't actually remember what we were talking about @_ValliLoves_ (I'm a bit slow today).
> 
> I assume it is about this:
> 
> ...


You're right. Generally people resist change. People make a lot of money writing books and such to get people to change. However there are plenty of people out there unafraid of exploring their other cognitive functions because they are not afraid to change. When you become a person ready to adapt to a new environment you will no longer prefer your old ways because the motivation to change is too great. Your mind is a muscle and all you have to do to change is exercise. Very fluid.


----------



## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Flatlander said:


> So basically they are backing up your self-image.


To a degree, yes.



> Nothing ever happened to alter what you value, or caused your values to grow in weight to you or make you think about them or anything?


Not really, but being betrayed by some people made me more keen on not being like them.



> How do you know an intellectual or deeper discussion when you find one? What kind of things do you find deep and intellectual?


That's why I made it as a broad statement.
I like conversation that discuss ideas openly, I like people talking about themselves and what they find important etc.



> Perhaps this is because _you_ fit it. I could pose this description to someone who doesn't match it and get a different response.


Perhaps not.



> You are proficient at using what you see of the system, or understand as being the system.


Indeed.



> This explanation still supports the idea that you have extraverted cognition, on the whole. It is very much things 'as they are', being that it looks like it came from an MBTI textbook and includes the manifestations of the functions that place them at extremes possible to no organic thinking. Who really has the total capacity to not be affected by external stimuli in evaluative deliberation or only evaluate dependent on the things others say?
> 
> Granted that I did ask you to 'define', even if I left room for subjectivity in my request, so whatever. I meant 'explain', but I wasn't perfect.


However, people are not objective, people are subjective. This is one of the delusions of typology. Sensory experiences are for example always subjective.
We may do bungee-jumping together, but our experiences of it will be vastly different. Who's to say what is objective in a subjective world? I am objective to myself, just like you are objective to yourself, but to someone else we are equally subjective.



> That's precisely it. You *don't* see it.
> 
> You "preserve energy" because you are indulging yourself in something you like to do, something that is positive to you and appears to help rather than hurt you. One of the facets of E7 is that it prefers to do this in order not to have to face the negative states that the mind itself implies, whatever those might be. It is in the 'idealist' triad, meaning this tendency to suppress the negative parts of mind is a key component in how they achieve control over themselves and their lives.
> 
> I could see how this would be construed as gaining power, but it stands in a bit of contrast to the E5 agenda of viewing the whole of your mind clearly and living as your mental concepts as a way to achieve a feeling of separation from the world. What you presented appears to have more to do with the nature of the mental action itself, and the implied result is different.


I disagree a bit with your comparison to E7 and me, but let's just agree to disagree.



> Why did you have issues disagreeing with people, and how did you change so easily? A lot of people seem to struggle with that.


I prefer to stay open to other views, even tho I am influenced by the moods of other people.
If I talk to someone who's really aggressive about their values I'd for example likely shut up. If I talk to someone who's a bit uncertain about what they say I'd likely "teach" them my perspective. If someone says something I disagree with I may not say anything, but if there's someone else expressing disagreement I will gang up with that person.



krikits_roar said:


> Sorry enfj was me jumping to a conclusion to quickly (thats a nasty habit of mine) but I was talking to my brother (i wanted a second opinion) and he said if your results were consistent you'd be a NT. But if it changes according to your mood that implies something else. I had the same problem for the first few yrs when I started taking the test. You're smart, you're kind, you're both. So scratch the E in enfj and replace that with an I. Infj have inferior Ti but as a shadow function they have Te you could have very well built it up enough to be perfectly usable. I know two infj's one guy (who is or was a nurse) and the other a girl (who works at a day-care) They are both smart caring people and that's why I love them both. My bro thinks you are a P type which if you are not a intp that would make you a Infp like me. You don't want to debate, but want to be reasoned into a agreement. You like harmony, and peace, and you hate to see people mistreated. Infj's are notorious for taking on people's problems as their own and getting to attached. Which leaves them overly drained and tired. The infj guy I know also thrives of intelligent conversation (yes, yes its not simply a T thing. I should have realized what that said about you sooner) and of course some of the other things about you can be affected by your enneagram type (but I don't know enough about those things to break that down yet) the infj I know also likes to play devils advocate ( he really likes to play the what if game) which (no offense) seems kind like what you're doing. Stirring that pot so to speak. Infp is possible because you don't seem to speak in absolutes like a lot of J types do. I don't know 100 percent what you are but its driving me crazy trying to figure it out. Lol. Either way what do you think/feel on the matter? Oh and sorry if I got anything technically wrong in said analysis.


Try to use paragraphs, lol. It's hard to read otherwise. @arkigos would at least find INFP a bit ironic.



Stelliferous said:


> You're right. Generally people resist change. People make a lot of money writing books and such to get people to change. However there are plenty of people out there unafraid of exploring their other cognitive functions because they are not afraid to change. When you become a person ready to adapt to a new environment you will no longer prefer your old ways because the motivation to change is too great. Your mind is a muscle and all you have to do to change is exercise. Very fluid.


Which would disprove the premises of MBTI as MBTI claims your type (function preference) never changes.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

@*Acerbusvenator
I do disagree with that aspect of what MBTI suggests. Type isn't permanent, it's just hard to change and all hard things require tremendous motivation. I use my sensory functions a lot more than I used to, probably more often than my intuitive functions in my attempt to rid my mind of depression and be happy. It took a lot to want to change but overall I'm happy with the change. Since now I prefer S functions you could say I'm an ISFP. Unless you just say I'm an "untypable" person based on mental disabilities. And if a system to type people doesn't work on specific people then clearly it's just the person's fault right and not the rules governing the system. In my personal experience, cognitive functions have been fluid and nothing stays permanent. I went from INTP to INFP to ISFP, for different reasons. It's all about the WANT.*


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## ValliLoves (Jan 10, 2014)

Acerbusvenator said:


> I am well aware of the meanings within this typology.
> However, it is about preference.
> Now, that word is often misused, but think about things like sexual preference.
> You may be able to have sexual intercourse with the gender you don't have a sexual preference for, you may do it if you have no other alternative, but you won't like it and if given a choice you'll give in to your preference. You don't want to deviate from your preference.
> A preference is not a fluid thing.


I was referring to this. You are correct.

Also this just now, right here: 



Acerbusvenator said:


> And no, preference is not a fluid thing and that is one of the reasons I criticize the use of it in MBTI.
> For example, if you were an INTP you'd always prefer to do it in the Ti Ne Si Fe order, but people are not that solid, we are dynamic.


You contradict yourself here. In one statement, you say that preferences are not fluid. 

In another statement, you state, "For example, if you were an INTP you'd always prefer to do it in the Ti Ne Si Fe order, but people are not that solid, we are dynamic."

That last statement contradicts your first and would suggest that your statement, "preference is not a fluid thing" is not true, therefore, not logical.


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