# Avoid Shadow Functions?



## RoSoDude (Apr 3, 2012)

Okay... what's all this crazyness with having all eight functions and using them to their fullest potential? What kind of misguided information are we throwing around? To do that would make you quite a lot more capable mentally than the ordinary human being, if you buy any of Jung's theory. If what we're doing is coming up with some wild offshoot of it that uses all of the same names for everything but disregards any of the limitations, then fine, by all means go ahead and do that, but that's not what I believe a great deal of us are here to do.

One of the first things to do is to get rid of the idea that each cognitive function is some magical force that you can tap into at any time to produce results. It's the idea that Ti and Te are completely different and that for certain tasks, you have to employ one or the other. The same goes for the other functions. No matter what spin you have on it, _thinking is thinking_. Whether it's approached from an objective or subjective standpoint, it's still going through ideas and all of that. And, according to Jungian theory, we each possess a type of thinking that is directed either internally or externally, and is on a certain level of our consciousness. The same is true of the other three types of functions. If you're looking to follow the theory that has been laid out (which is rather internally consistent and often jives well with actual personalities), then you must accept that you have a certain ordering of functions that balances subjective and objective attitudes as well as perceiving and judging traits. That's the makeup of your personality. These functions are not tools that you can grab at and use at your disposal because you're just that amazing (if you intend to follow the theory, again). So, if you're an INTJ, you use your subjectively oriented intuition to process information and your perception of reality, and filter into thought and action with your objectively oriented thinking. You don't use Ti as an automatic process (or if you try, you really really suck at it). You may, however, think in subjective terms, because _thinking is thinking_. It's not some amazing brand new thing, it's just a way to approach judgments. It's amazing that we can do it, but it's not special when compared to Te.

As for the shadow function thing in general, I completely agree with DaveSuperPowers, even in a sense beyond just MBTI. Nobody can be everything. Focus on your strengths, the things you are really good at and are interested in, and you'll offer a lot more to the world than you would were you to be mediocre at the many many things you attempt to be. I'd think you'd make your life more fulfilling and interesting that way, too.


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## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

@RoSoDude
I agree!
Thanks for bothering to make the point so clear!


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## FlaviaGemina (May 3, 2012)

hornet said:


> Yeah precisely, you can emulate the effects of the function and if you do mbti may believe that you just did
> an opposite function. But pretending to be focused on unity is precisely that PRETENDING!
> You didn't process the information in the way that you should to have that function.
> 
> ...


LOL, I meant that you argue tenaciously. I don't know any ISFPs in real life, but the F and P somehow made me imagine them to be cuddly and fluffy


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## FlaviaGemina (May 3, 2012)

RoSoDude said:


> Okay... what's all this crazyness with having all eight functions and using them to their fullest potential? What kind of misguided information are we throwing around? To do that would make you quite a lot more capable mentally than the ordinary human being, if you buy any of Jung's theory. If what we're doing is coming up with some wild offshoot of it that uses all of the same names for everything but disregards any of the limitations, then fine, by all means go ahead and do that, but that's not what I believe a great deal of us are here to do.


I think this idea might stem from shamanism and transpersonal psychology, but it got misrelated to the shadow functions somehow. In transpersonal psychology, some practinioners try to 'bring out the shadow', which means they try to access the subconscious and 'integrate' it. In practice all it means is this: you may get annoyed by other peeople's behaviour because it's not what you would do. But you can observe yourself and see that you actually sometimes do the same things and then you can aknowledge that this is the case and forgive yourself. Rather than striving to be 'perfect' (as opposed to other people who are then 'not perfect'), you accept that everyone does these things and then you're supposed to see how all of creationg works together despite the differences.
That's all I know about it. I'm not sure whether shamanism or transpersonal psychology requires anyone to develop all their functions. I've seen some self-proclaimed shamans on the internet* say that they have developed all their functions... But the ones I know IRL are still clearly one particular MBTI type, they're just a bit more easy going than the average person.




*note that all shamans are self-proclaimed


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## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, I meant that you argue tenaciously. I don't know any ISFPs in real life, but the F and P somehow made me imagine them to be cuddly and fluffy


Heh don't let the stereotypes get to you!
Just because we live most of our life haunted by the other three judging functions, 
it don't mean that we have to be sweet little pussycats. 
I'm using Te when I'm arguing so I can't keep it up forever and I might seem a bit more rigid than a dom/aux Te user.

Only reason we have the reputation of pussys is that mentally everyone is out to get us on almost every level.
Fe/Ti and Si/Ne plus Te constantly push us around from an early age.
All we want is to use Fi and Se and be on our own, and it's constantly denied.
Then Ni makes it's entry and we abandon this place.
MBTI helped me back to the real world and activated my Te *and now it's payback time!!! }:-D*

Honesty, what a concept! =D


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## RoSoDude (Apr 3, 2012)

FlaviaGemina said:


> I think this idea might stem from shamanism and transpersonal psychology, but it got misrelated to the shadow functions somehow. In transpersonal psychology, some practinioners try to 'bring out the shadow', which means they try to access the subconscious and 'integrate' it. In practice all it means is this: you may get annoyed by other peeople's behaviour because it's not what you would do. But you can observe yourself and see that you actually sometimes do the same things and then you can aknowledge that this is the case and forgive yourself. Rather than striving to be 'perfect' (as opposed to other people who are then 'not perfect'), you accept that everyone does these things and then you're supposed to see how all of creationg works together despite the differences.


Well sure, I think that acknowledging the differences between people and the positive aspects/strengths of each individual personality is great. It can be hard at certain times, but in general I don't think one personality is better than another (even if some may aggravate me from time to time, as with anyone). However, I'd doubt that such a thing requires surfacing of one's shadow. To be honest, I doubt its existence in one's personality, given how the rest of Jung's theory works. Jung actually called the tertiary and inferior functions the unconscious/subconscious functions. We can't access them directly or easily like we do with our dominant and auxiliary functions (as they're significantly weaker in our cognitive processes).



> That's all I know about it. I'm not sure whether shamanism or transpersonal psychology requires anyone to develop all their functions. I've seen some self-proclaimed shamans on the internet* say that they have developed all their functions... But the ones I know IRL are still clearly one particular MBTI type, they're just a bit more easy going than the average person.
> 
> *note that all shamans are self-proclaimed


I think it's good to be open-minded about other personalities, I just strongly doubt that _anyone_ can develop all eight functions to their fullest potential. To be honest, developing four seems quite enough  One kind of feeling, one kind of feeling, one kind of sensory perception, and one kind of intuitive perception all seem to give us all we need, and developing what you have seems to be a lot more effective and worthwhile than developing what you don't.


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## FlaviaGemina (May 3, 2012)

RoSoDude said:


> *I think it's good to be open-minded about other personalities, I just strongly doubt that anyone can develop all eight functions to their fullest potential*. To be honest, developing four seems quite enough  One kind of feeling, one kind of feeling, one kind of sensory perception, and one kind of intuitive perception all seem to give us all we need, and developing what you have seems to be a lot more effective and worthwhile than developing what you don't.


So do I. Apart from the fact that it isn't possible it is also unnecessary to devlop all your functions in order to understand others. You just need to read their user manual (MBTI) and accept that they are the way they are. One can accept differences on an intellectual level even if one isn't capable of having exactly the same thought process. You don't need to _be_ another person in order to accept them. E.g. I can use Ni to follow Ti with a bit of processing time. If I pause to follow what an INTP says, I can see where they are coming from. If I react spontaneously, misunderstandings ensue because of Te.


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## FlaviaGemina (May 3, 2012)

@hornet, @gingertonic

Could it be possible for an INTJ to use Ni+Te to fake a rudimentary Ne (with processing) delay? Could an ENTP use Ne+Ti to fake Ni?
Can an ENTP use Ti and Fe to fake Fi? I don't know why I'm asking this 
But then, there's still this theory that the tertiary can easily swing from extraverted to introverted, so maybe ENTPs and INTJs aren't the best example when talking about Fi vs. Fe. 
Or do our examples contradict this theory and the tertiary 'swinging' is actually the aux+tert faking a different orientation of the tert?


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## Ed S (Jul 27, 2012)

I agree with Dave. I'm INTJ so I try to find people and jobs that fit my type so I can accentuate the positive aspects of myself. I try to work on certain things I lack in relationships but in general I try mainly to find others with similar was of understanding ideas. Sometimes you just have to admit your strengths and weaknesses. Like in a work setting I wouldn't want to be in a big group I prefer to work primarily solo. The group takes away from my performance, but when left alone I can make huge strides much faster. On that note really good bosses understand how to motivate different types in different ways. That boss understands the different advantages of certain types over others and he puts the best people for each scenario according to their abilities. You can't fit square pegs through round holes.


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## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

FlaviaGemina said:


> @_hornet_, @_gingertonic_
> 
> Could it be possible for an INTJ to use Ni+Te to fake a rudimentary Ne (with processing) delay? Could an ENTP use Ne+Ti to fake Ni?
> Can an ENTP use Ti and Fe to fake Fi? I don't know why I'm asking this
> ...


I dunno anymore, let me spend a month reading trough psychological types and I'll get back to you. XD


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