# Isfj?



## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

@angelcat @robert666


Thank you guys so so so much, I dont haave time to answer now but will soon!! promise!!


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

angelcat said:


> First up: I'm not saying this to try and convince you that you ARE an SFJ. I'm merely pointing out that the stereotypes really don't fit ALL ISFJs.
> 
> I know one ISFJ on this website who can compete, logic-wise, with the INTJs and INTPs in debate. Her Ti is FIERCE. (Mine is not too shabby, either.)


I have understood that the stereotypes often are misleading. But it's just that I don't recognize myself at all in the overall descriptions of ISFJ's. I _could_ see myself in it function-wise but I don't feel like it's enough. But who knows, maybe it is. 



> Here's another thing to remember -- Enneagram makes all the difference. A lot of the stereotypical online ISFJ profiles are written with ISFJ Enneagram 2's in mind. 2's love to serve, they want to be loved, they're sensitive and kind. But I'm a counterphobic Enneagram 6w7. Contrary, ultra-logical, combative, not all that polite or sensitive, and a giant troll who likes to mess with people. IE, my Enneagram 2 ISFJ best friend fits all the online profiles. I fit none of them. But I still process new information through SiFeTi, so I'm an ISFJ. Like it or not. Care to admit to or not.


Yes, I know this but I also knew since earlier that they were also 6's. And I would absolutely say I'm a 9. That fits me _so_ well. The first Enneagram-test I did I felt that when I answered the questions it felt right because it was a lot about how you behaved when you were a child, which is less debatable than how I behave now. That time I got 9 and a close second was both 5 and 4. And that feels like a "me"-result. Totally forgot to mention Enneagram in my posts but there you have it.


I'm not thinking about anything in particular now or "trying" anything but how certain are you that you are an ISFJ? I don't really get that vibe. I absolutely might be wrong but still... 



> In fact, since you're comparing yourself to other people and using stereotypes to do it ... Si is likely. It's what Si does.


Why is this? 



> Nor I. That's an INXJ thing.


I also got to that conclusion after posting this... But, I mean, they are the ultimate planners but I feel like Si are planners too? 



> Si-dom approaches new situations by keeping related information in mind, so it knows what to expect. The more exposure Si has to different situations, the more comfortable it is with all of them. Si is impressionistic. It's a little hesitant to try things it has never done before, because it needs time to learn them and likes to have an idea of what it is in for. That's why Si looks up a lot of information before trying something new, so it knows what to expect, what the outcome ought to be like, etc.
> 
> Do you do that? Does the idea of doing something you've never done before excite you, or make you a little anxious or nervous?


Most of all it excites me. I don't think anyone can do everything that's new and never feel a bit anxious or nervous. But whether I feel excited or anxious depends on what kind of thing it is. If it involves other people seeing me do it/some kind of performance I freak out. I wasn't too nervous about this before (except performing) but lately I've developed a very anxious me when people are involved. 

When I'm alone, however, or don't mind the people I'm with (they might not be looking/minding me/something) I'm not anxious at all. Really.



> > I would say Fe tires me more and is definitely something I'm less confident in using, compared to Ti. I also would say I care too little about other people? And, I am so not sensitive. If someone says something bad about me I'm just like: "ok, cool. Thanks for telling me" or "Thank you! I suspected it but didn't know I was bad at it but now it's confirmed" and genuinely mean it. Sure, I can get sad but I generally don't really put focus on being sad about it. I also think it's annoying/tiring when I need to think about that someone in the room might get hurt if I say the truth about something. I barely know anything about my values but there is one thing and that is honesty.
> 
> 
> THIS sounds more like either Te (ISTJ) or inferior Fe (IXTP).


When thinking about it, it depends on what they are saying. I have learned to not react like I'm sad. If they are pointing out something that doesn't bother me too much (doesn't matter how "big" it is or how much others care about it) I totally have the reaction I wrote about but if it's something that hits me in my heart (I think my parents are the only ones capable of doing this. I'm not saying they are heartless and that my friends are all saints, it's just that the things they point out are the ones I'm sore about. Also a bit of how they do it, I guess, maybe) I kind of shut down, get quiet, look at the ground: ""Okay". Then I think about it for quite sometime, generally thinking I'm awful and stuff. I never lash out, though. 



> ... what? Do you think INTPs like live in caves or something?


Hahaha, no. I guess I'm just thinking about how much I socialize and just write my thoughts here but not telling you about how much I socialize. I just think I might be putting too much weight on socializing, compared to my view of INTP's, stereotypically, of course.


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## 68097 (Nov 20, 2013)

snakespeare said:


> I have understood that the stereotypes often are misleading. But it's just that I don't recognize myself at all in the overall descriptions of ISFJ's. I _could_ see myself in it function-wise but I don't feel like it's enough. But who knows, maybe it is.


I couldn't either (and still can't, on the overall descriptions) until I finally, fundamentally, understood what Si actually IS -- beyond the stereotypical descriptions, to its inner essence and mythology, and then I looked back on my childhood and recognized it, woven throughout my behaviors, my beliefs, my approaches, and my thought process. 

Once you can fully comprehend Si, you'll know if you have it or not. It's beyond "likes things the same, hates change, enjoys routine, has a good memory, blah, blah, blah," and more -- forms an internal way of perceiving reality that is deviated from it, based on what is eternal and proven, and inclined to reject that which does not fit its inner framework. In that way, it does not differ from Ni much, because both are delusional up to a point -- that is, deviating from reality to a private inner life, but Si focuses on the present and on what it expects from reality, whereas Ni focuses on shaping reality for long-term future ideas.



> how certain are you that you are an ISFJ? I don't really get that vibe. I absolutely might be wrong but still...


99.9% sure, although my inferior Ne still raises doubts from time to time. I'm like none of the other ISFJs I know, but I also process information through Si/Ti, and my Ne is not higher than my Si, so that leaves ISFJ. 

What kind of a vibe do you expect from an ISFJ? And in what way do I differ?



> Why is this?


Si is a comparative process. Blue should be THIS COLOR, because this is the color blue is, and this is not blue, so it is not blue. IE, this stereotype / archetype of this particular personality type is in my mind, and you/me do not fit it exactly, so you/me is not it, because we are different from what I expect from THIS ARCHETYPE. Si is archetype central. It looks for sameness and if the thing deviates, then it must not be the thing that it is, because it's not fitting what Si expects to see.



> I feel like Si are planners too?


Some of them. I'd say the less active your lower Ne is, the more you plan. My Ne is hyperactive in that sense, so I always figure you can't plan, because anything can happen and it's stupid to close off your options before you get there.



> Most of all it excites me. I don't think anyone can do everything that's new and never feel a bit anxious or nervous.


I suspect Se-dom/auxes are more fine with it, because new experiences are just... THRILLING.



> But whether I feel excited or anxious depends on what kind of thing it is. If it involves other people seeing me do it/some kind of performance I freak out. I wasn't too nervous about this before (except performing) but lately I've developed a very anxious me when people are involved. When I'm alone, however, or don't mind the people I'm with (they might not be looking/minding me/something) I'm not anxious at all. Really.


Fe-ish?

Interesting. Might not be higher Si, then. But there again, I'm going off of Si-stereotypes, of what SJs are SUPPOSED to act like. Anyone I encounter that breaks the mold breaks my brain.



> Hahaha, no. I guess I'm just thinking about how much I socialize and just write my thoughts here but not telling you about how much I socialize. I just think I might be putting too much weight on socializing, compared to my view of INTP's, stereotypically, of course.


If you want to know if you're an INTP, go to @akrigos and stalk his posts for awhile. THERE is a class-act INTP. Look at how he communicates -- high abstractions. I get the gist of his meaning but usually not all of it.


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

robert666 said:


> @snakespeare here's my assessment of your type. Some of the quotes are from your other typing thread.


Okay, I'm not going to comment on your choice of my functions because I clearly don't know enough about them :laughing: _But_, do you have any idea of how FREAKING good your conclusion was?! It really hit me! 

ENFP is quite different from what the others have told me, though. Interesting. I went to this page: http://personalitycafe.com/socionics-forum/12781-socionics-description-best-enfp-guide-ever-written.html and when I read it then I was like, wow. But now, of course, I'm second-guessing everything so I don't know. 


Okay, now I'm continuing to write this post (I started writing what's above this sentence before what I'm writing now). Been a few days but the wifi was lacking but it was more because this was too much for my head and I needed to lay off of MBTI-stuff for a while. When I get too into it I kind of can't calm down. 

But, I have "looked at my life" once again and know I'm not an ENFP. I understand the ENFP-type now and that's not it. I haven't looked up the funtions any more than looking at a page about Fi and seeing it was _all_ about ethics, morals, right and wrong. Kind of like you're thinking with feelings instead of thinking with logic (Ti). And then Fe would be acting on feelings and Te would be acting on logic. That's my own conclusion of that article and I don't think that's right, really. If anything it could be a _very_ simplified version of "the truth". Another page, though, said something about Fi feeling for self and Fe feeling for others, which I don't think could be true, although people told that person that they were very much right. I mean, we are selfish beings. Everyone are. I could explain this further but basically, hmm, no. I don't think the difference between Fi and Fe is that.
@angelcat Could you link some page(s) or anything else about Si that made you understand it? I kind of have half of the Si-puzzle in my head but it's not too clear. 

My mom is always kind of baffled by my memory, though. I also am very good with maps and finding my way around, I read somewhere that's something Si-users are good at. 


Also, when "looking at my life" I think I have reached the conclusion, again, that I'm an ISFJ. Shocker. If anything I might be an ISTJ but I don't know. ISFJ is much more likely. I guess I just have to understand the type a bit better. And also distinguish between Ne and Ti a bit more (lol, I know they are very different but I really have mixed them up a bit).

One more thing, I have read about dom-tert loops and when I read about the Si-Ti/Ti-Si one, at first, I was like: "Hmm. Kinda fits" The wording in it was too off. I really wouldn't think in those "words" or, ugh, can't explain. But, I had a revelation (hahahaha) yesterday. So, during a long time (years) I have had this really weird mindset. It wasn't until recently I thought of it as weird, though. I, like said before, want to get to the bottom of things so I guess I at some point thought about socializing or some other thing. Could have been something little that just planted a seed in my mind and kept getting bigger by the time passing. Yeah, probably that. 

So, when going out shopping (example) when I was smaller, I "instantly" (lack of a better word) called friends to see if someone wanted to come with me. If no one could, I just wouldn't go out shopping. I didn't question anything about it (this was like in fifth grade). But I guess I started thinking something like "What's the point of going out shopping? To buy stuff, get stuff you need. Okay. But the friend-thing? Hmmm. I really don't know why I need to bring a friend? But I would look lonely if I go alone, wouldn't I? Well, maybe, but the shopping is much more effective if you do it alone, then you actually end up getting the stuff you want, in a shorter time. Yeah!" Idk, something like that. And that has built up to me really questioning why we hang out with people. It really doesn't "do" anything else than just having a bit of a better time. In my head it sounds a bit differently.

Okay, so, Why I had a revelation about this yesterday was because I thought about the loop, making sense of it. So, it's basically that you start questioning the meaning of relationships (Ti) and Si coming in to say "how did that end up the last time you did that? Yeah, not good" so you don't do that thing. I wouldn't say I can relate to the Si-part that much but the first one *really* hit me yesterday. I have lately sometimes, to like two or three people, discussed this "view" of mine, tried to word it but kind of failing and no one has shared it. They are like: "What? I don't get that" or something. It has been more like monologue-ing with someone there, though, because they haven't had much input since they don't agree. So basically, I happened to think of that in that moment and it hit me, that is exactly what the loop describes. I just thought of it a bit differently but it is the exact same. Still, the Si-part is off but the Ti-part, holy crap. I'm like screaming inside. I thought it was just a normal, "innocent" thought but I have realized how "my life" has totally started acting on this thinking. I guess I don't see the point (and I'm really one of those who don't do stuff because they have no reason to do them, okay, not 100% of the time but it really is that way) and then I just don't socialize until I need to do it for something. This is just insane how much that has shaped me, just thinking about how small that thought is and what impact it has made. Sure, my life wouldn't be completely different if I didn't act on my thinking about it but the realization of that just totally whoa-ed me. Again, the loop might not be what I'm in (I'm always wrong about this stuff) but at least it made me realize that. 

Still not going to set it in stone what type I am or anything but at least I'm learning stuff. The thing I'm most sure about being, though, is an Enneagram 9. Haven't read about all of the types but that one really fits, if that makes any difference. I'm going to read about the rest of them and maybe learn about this tri-type thing I know nothing about and see if I can make any further conclusions. Enneagram is so clear and fantastic, though? Why isn't it getting more attention? MBTI is all fishy but not Enneagram? Hahaha, bye.


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

Adding a little to the relationship-theory of mine; it also includes just doing things, with or without friends. I guess I think a bit like, I can do a lot at home that fits my needs, so why do I have to go out and do other stuff? I don't need big things to happen. And I'll always find things to do at home. That's a specialty of mine. Yeah, the thinking I talked about in the latest post of mine includes a lot of this. I guess it's all about that I'm content with what I can do by myself , so I don't reach out, because I don't need it or "crave" it enough. Again, both relationships and activities. 

I guess it's a little bit about that during times when there were no computers and such, people had to go out to do anything. That I understand. But it's like I have gotten into this narrow minded-thinking that when we have _so_ many things to do at home, why bother going out? Why? Where is the need? Hmm.. Yeah. That kind of thinking. It's a bit deeper than that, though, but that's basically the idea.


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

@angelcat



> until I finally, fundamentally, understood what Si actually IS -- beyond the stereotypical descriptions, to its inner essence and mythology, and then I looked back on my childhood and recognized it, woven throughout my behaviors, my beliefs, my approaches, and my thought process.


Like I said in my earlier post, any recommendations about how to do this? Or do I just have to wait and have it all click one day?



> > how certain are you that you are an ISFJ? I don't really get that vibe. I absolutely might be wrong but still...
> 
> 
> 99.9% sure, although my inferior Ne still raises doubts from time to time. I'm like none of the other ISFJs I know, but I also process information through Si/Ti, and my Ne is not higher than my Si, so that leaves ISFJ.
> ...


First off, thank you for not reacting negatively :hugs: I don't _really_ know but I think I have this "overly nice and sweet" picture of people with dominant or auxiliary Fe. Perhaps even more when it's auxiliary. No, I really don't have a big explanation of this. 



> Si is a comparative process. Blue should be THIS COLOR, because this is the color blue is, and this is not blue, so it is not blue. IE, this stereotype / archetype of this particular personality type is in my mind, and you/me do not fit it exactly, so you/me is not it, because we are different from what I expect from THIS ARCHETYPE. Si is archetype central. It looks for sameness and if the thing deviates, then it must not be the thing that it is, because it's not fitting what Si expects to see.


Hmm. This makes me think about that I've read that Ne is a connecting process. But I feel like that's what Si does? (Like you kind of explained here). But I think I fit in what you wrote there, yes. 



> Some of them. I'd say the less active your lower Ne is, the more you plan. My Ne is hyperactive in that sense, so I always figure you can't plan, because anything can happen and it's stupid to close off your options before you get there.


Okay, this makes sense. But some say that using your inferior function too much is not good for you (makes you worry/tired/whatever) so, it would be healthy for us non-planning ISFJ's (if I am one) to plan a bit more? That kind of terrifies me a little.



> > Most of all it excites me. I don't think anyone can do everything that's new and never feel a bit anxious or nervous.
> 
> 
> I suspect Se-dom/auxes are more fine with it, because new experiences are just... THRILLING.


Hahaha, if I read that in the right tone, it was hilarious :laughin: lol



> > But whether I feel excited or anxious depends on what kind of thing it is. If it involves other people seeing me do it/some kind of performance I freak out. I wasn't too nervous about this before (except performing) but lately I've developed a very anxious me when people are involved. When I'm alone, however, or don't mind the people I'm with (they might not be looking/minding me/something) I'm not anxious at all. Really.
> 
> 
> Fe-ish?
> ...


Explain this, pleeaase :snowman: Why not Si? 



> > Hahaha, no. I guess I'm just thinking about how much I socialize and just write my thoughts here but not telling you about how much I socialize. I just think I might be putting too much weight on socializing, compared to my view of INTP's, stereotypically, of course.
> 
> 
> If you want to know if you're an INTP, go to @akrigos and stalk his posts for awhile. THERE is a class-act INTP. Look at how he communicates -- high abstractions. I get the gist of his meaning but usually not all of it.


I don't think I'm an INTP, though. I wouldn't say I'm _that_ smart. Sure, people tell me I'm smart but I'm no genius. Also, I would say I care too much about what people think of me. Always have.


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## 68097 (Nov 20, 2013)

snakespeare said:


> another page, though, said something about Fi feeling for self and Fe feeling for others, which I don't think could be true, although people told that person that they were very much right. I mean, we are selfish beings. Everyone are. I could explain this further but basically, hmm, no. I don't think the difference between Fi and Fe is that.


Fe is ethical objectivity. Fi is subjective and abstract.

In other words, someone sits down at the table and tells you that so and so left his wife for another younger woman. All the Fe's at the table agree that person is an a-hole. The Fi's don't comment, probably, because ... _the heart wants what it wants and who are you to judge what another person wants? He had his reasons, I'm sure_. 



> @angelcat Could you link some page(s) or anything else about Si that made you understand it? I kind of have half of the Si-puzzle in my head but it's not too clear.


No, because I'm a moron and never bookmark anything.

Here's what I just wrote to someone else, regarding Si/Ne:



> I’ll say how my ISFJ friend uses it.
> 
> She has a STRONGLY NEGATIVE and resistant reaction to information that contradicts what she is familiar with – so, let’s say we’re discussing the Bible, and I propose the idea that Job might be an allegory and not literal. She doesn’t like the sound of that, because she grew up being taught that Job is a literal story, so for her, considering it might not be, throws her into imbalance. If Job isn’t literal, what ELSE isn’t literal? That one domino might cause a catastrophic fall-out effect in her thinking, and force her to re-evaluate everything (Si-Ti), which is Big and Scary and Hard Work, because it requires a complete reprogramming of her former thinking. That’s Ne in bondage to Si-dominance.
> 
> ...


Si over Ne says, "This person is wonderful and beautiful," when they aren't, because Si has chosen to see them not as they are, but in a more idealized (Ne) form, self influenced through subjective (Si) perception. 

Si-dom is what causes Christine Daee to think the Phantom of the Opera is the "Angel of Music." She grew up on the idea that her father would send her the angel of music, and she can't rationalize away Erik's sudden magical appearance in her life, so he must be that angel Papa told me about! She isn't living in reality. She's putting her mythology ON TOP OF IT. That's Si. 

More Si-examples... the television show "A.D." I wasn't sure about Claudia Procula's type (Pilate's wife) until I realized she wasn't seeing reality for what it was, because it was all colored through her Si-dom perceptions. In her mind, so long as the Jews and the Romans are at peace, it's all normal and... fine. Except it's not fine. Roman dominance in Judea SUCKS, and she can't see it, because she chooses to see Rome as something it is not, as a force of good, because she can't deal with the truth of how awful it is. 

Basically, coming to acknowledge oneself as a Si-dom is a humbling experience, because it is forced admittance that your perception of reality is not reality. It's a subjective, impressionistic view of reality, heavily shaped through whatever you prioritize most -- your faith, your agnosticism, your interests, your past, etc. 



snakespeare said:


> First off, thank you for not reacting negatively :hugs: I don't _really_ know but I think I have this "overly nice and sweet" picture of people with dominant or auxiliary Fe. Perhaps even more when it's auxiliary. No, I really don't have a big explanation of this.


So... I'm not sensitive and sweet enough to be an ISFJ?

OH MY GAWD, I'M SO INSULTED BY THAT.

Kidding.  



> Hmm. This makes me think about that I've read that Ne is a connecting process. But I feel like that's what Si does? (Like you kind of explained here). But I think I fit in what you wrote there, yes.


They work in tandem, for the most part... subconsciously.



> Okay, this makes sense. But some say that using your inferior function too much is not good for you (makes you worry/tired/whatever) so, it would be healthy for us non-planning ISFJ's (if I am one) to plan a bit more? That kind of terrifies me a little.


Inferior Ne is not a planning function. To exercise lower Ne, you need to practice developing multiple explanations and possibilities that are NOT NEGATIVE based on situations in your life. (Inferior Ne has a nasty habit of becoming negative and pessimistic. Boo.)



> Explain this, pleeaase :snowman: Why not Si?


Si is very interested in knowing what to expect, and what to do, before trying something new -- so not being nervous about doing something you've never done before doesn't seem very Si-dom-ish.


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

First off, thank you for still posting on my thread, haha! You are being _extremely_ helpful. 



angelcat said:


> Fe is ethical objectivity. Fi is subjective and abstract.
> 
> In other words, someone sits down at the table and tells you that so and so left his wife for another younger woman. All the Fe's at the table agree that person is an a-hole. The Fi's don't comment, probably, because ... _the heart wants what it wants and who are you to judge what another person wants? He had his reasons, I'm sure_.


Okay, so if that's a part of what it's about, I'm the Fi-version of that. As I've said before, I'm very pro-honesty. Also, I'm the typical person who would say that! Maybe I wouldn't always voice them (depending on my level of confidence with the company) but I still think exactly like that. If I don't feel enough confident with the person/group I will either go into Fe-mode or, more likely, don't comment, only if they ask me to. Then I will say the Fi-thing.



> She has a STRONGLY NEGATIVE and resistant reaction to information that contradicts what she is familiar with – so, let’s say we’re discussing the Bible, and I propose the idea that Job might be an allegory and not literal. She doesn’t like the sound of that, because she grew up being taught that Job is a literal story, so for her, considering it might not be, throws her into imbalance. If Job isn’t literal, what ELSE isn’t literal? That one domino might cause a catastrophic fall-out effect in her thinking, and force her to re-evaluate everything (Si-Ti), which is Big and Scary and Hard Work, because it requires a complete reprogramming of her former thinking. That’s Ne in bondage to Si-dominance.


Hmm. Doesn't sound like me. I like it when those kinds of things are scrambled. When I have believed in something, haven't really questioned it and someone comes with another perspective, that's hella fun. Of course, I don't always think it's the best thing ever when something I have believed turns out to be a lie (if it's something that affects me badly, I guess) but I don't worry about it too much.



> For me, Si is subconscious comparison… effortless comparison. I really figured out my own Si when I realized that Si is symbolic and mythological; we form a personal mythology that we can then lay on top of reality, changing reality to reflect our innermost desires – which is why I can impose my religious beliefs and awareness of symbolism onto just about anything; my Si-mythology is coloring my worldview. Whatever you Si-mythology is, whatever you value most, is going to color yours – and change your view of reality.


Didn't understand this, really. I'm not at all religious (I understand that's not what you're talking about) and symbolism, mythology and that kind of stuff never was something I got into... I guess I don't know enough about what it is (not religion).



> SiNe and futuristic predictions subconsciously gathers data for comparison to knowledge banks – ie, Jenny just divorced her husband to marry this other guy, who divorced his wife to be with her. Since we now know that both of them are unfaithful to their spouses, it’s only a matter of time before one or both cheats on the other, and he/she leaves her/him for another person. And then it happens, just as predicted, because the variables were all there. Slim margin of chance it WON’T happen, but they’ve already established a pattern that says it will.


I guess I'm capable of doing this but I wouldn't say I ever do this, really. I think I see things as more: "What could happen? What's possible?". I would never say "This is going to happen", really. Because I don't _know_, so I wouldn't say it.



> Si over Ne says, "This person is wonderful and beautiful," when they aren't, because Si has chosen to see them not as they are, but in a more idealized (Ne) form, self influenced through subjective (Si) perception.


Are you saying this uses more Si or Ne? "Si over Ne says" but then "but in a more idealized (Ne) form". 



> Si-dom is what causes Christine Daee to think the Phantom of the Opera is the "Angel of Music." She grew up on the idea that her father would send her the angel of music, and she can't rationalize away Erik's sudden magical appearance in her life, so he must be that angel Papa told me about! She isn't living in reality. She's putting her mythology ON TOP OF IT. That's Si.
> 
> More Si-examples... the television show "A.D." I wasn't sure about Claudia Procula's type (Pilate's wife) until I realized she wasn't seeing reality for what it was, because it was all colored through her Si-dom perceptions. In her mind, so long as the Jews and the Romans are at peace, it's all normal and... fine. Except it's not fine. Roman dominance in Judea SUCKS, and she can't see it, because she chooses to see Rome as something it is not, as a force of good, because she can't deal with the truth of how awful it is.


Heh, I'm not the kind of person who gets these things, because I never know anything about "cultural stuff" and I am the typpical person that hasn't seen these "must see"-movies... References never really work either. If I do watch any of this stuff, though, I never remember these details or focus on them while watching. 

Another thing about Si that I read somewhere is about their memory. People say they can remember exact conversations they had with someone, even years ago! That's kind of insane to me. Sure, I remember things I have done but it never is more than the big picture. I could never remember what someone says to me (other than, again, the big picture, the content of the conversation) more than, like, maybe a couple hours? I could only do that if I focused on doing that. I'm overall very, very bad at remembering exact things, but I remember "bigger things" really well, just not detailed. I relate to that feeling when people say it's almost as if you're reliving a memory when thinking about it. Okay, not reliving, but the feelings from memories are pretty vivid. 

If I want to remember something, though, I can put effort into it and remember, like numbers. It requires repetition, though. But yes, remembering the idea of things is pretty easy for me. Although I'm really picky about what to remember, subconsciously. My Si-dom friend has almost photographic memory (compared to mine, at least). We met on a summer camp last summer (this is also the friend I've mentioned here before) and whoa, she remembers friggin everything from it. I only remember faint things but the feeling I had while being there feels very real/vivid when I think back on it. But I have a couple snippets (kind of pictures? Really vague) but the feelings from it remains, I guess. Ugh, can't explain it any better.



> Basically, coming to acknowledge oneself as a Si-dom is a humbling experience, because it is forced admittance that your perception of reality is not reality. It's a subjective, impressionistic view of reality, heavily shaped through whatever you prioritize most -- your faith, your agnosticism, your interests, your past, etc.


I can relate to this.



> Inferior Ne is not a planning function. To exercise lower Ne, you need to practice developing multiple explanations and possibilities that are NOT NEGATIVE based on situations in your life. (Inferior Ne has a nasty habit of becoming negative and pessimistic. Boo.)


Yes, I know Ne isn't planning, but I meant that but planning a bit more, ISFJ's would (and supposedly should?) use less of Ne t be healthier. 



> Si is very interested in knowing what to expect, and what to do, before trying something new -- so not being nervous about doing something you've never done before doesn't seem very Si-dom-ish.


Okay, so I do want to know about some things, but I hate people spoiling about things. HATE it. Whether it's a story (Book/TV-show/movie), something about some trip I'm about to make (talking about traveling here), just anything! I really don't want to know, because then I start making things up about it and being all judgemental or expecting (yes, expectations suck. They ruin things!!) and that sucks!! The more I know, the less I want to do it. If it's a big life choice, then I want to know stuff about it, yes, but other things, NO. I like the adventure part and hate it when people influence my judgement. HATE IT. Okay, no more caps. 


What do you get from this post?


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## 68097 (Nov 20, 2013)

snakespeare said:


> Okay, so if that's a part of what it's about, I'm the Fi-version of that. As I've said before, I'm very pro-honesty. Also, I'm the typical person who would say that! Maybe I wouldn't always voice them (depending on my level of confidence with the company) but I still think exactly like that. If I don't feel enough confident with the person/group I will either go into Fe-mode or, more likely, don't comment, only if they ask me to. Then I will say the Fi-thing.


What makes you think you're Fe? What is Fe to you? 



> Hmm. Doesn't sound like me. I like it when those kinds of things are scrambled. When I have believed in something, haven't really questioned it and someone comes with another perspective, that's hella fun. Of course, I don't always think it's the best thing ever when something I have believed turns out to be a lie (if it's something that affects me badly, I guess) but I don't worry about it too much.


Sounds more NeSi.



> Didn't understand this, really. I'm not at all religious (I understand that's not what you're talking about) and symbolism, mythology and that kind of stuff never was something I got into... I guess I don't know enough about what it is (not religion).


You don't understand what I'm saying. You're linking the word "mythology" with Greek mythology, and I'm saying that Si creates its own mythology/symbolism based on past impressions / interests / beliefs / archetypical thinking. 



> "What could happen? What's possible?". I would never say "This is going to happen", really. Because I don't _know_, so I wouldn't say it.


Unwillingness to commit to a single conclusion. Ne/Si.



> Are you saying this uses more Si or Ne? "Si over Ne says" but then "but in a more idealized (Ne) form".


I'm saying they work in tandem, together, to gather information from the external world. Si rejects reality based on personal preference and uses Ne to see the person as a more idealized form of themselves. Ne essentially is about not seeing what exists, but what something COULD BE.



> Heh, I'm not the kind of person who gets these things, because I never know anything about "cultural stuff" and I am the typpical person that hasn't seen these "must see"-movies... References never really work either. If I do watch any of this stuff, though, I never remember these details or focus on them while watching.


Again, you're focusing literally on what I'm saying and not seeing the impression I am giving you -- you don't have to see the shows I'm referencing to understand how Si works, because I just TOLD YOU how it works -- what it is DOING in the person who is using it. Which, by the way, reveals my own Si, because I'm translating impressionistic ideas and concepts into _examples of behavior _in order to get my message across. 



> Another thing about Si that I read somewhere is about their memory. People say they can remember exact conversations they had with someone, even years ago! That's kind of insane to me. Sure, I remember things I have done but it never is more than the big picture. I could never remember what someone says to me (other than, again, the big picture, the content of the conversation) more than, like, maybe a couple hours? I could only do that if I focused on doing that. I'm overall very, very bad at remembering exact things, but I remember "bigger things" really well, just not detailed. I relate to that feeling when people say it's almost as if you're reliving a memory when thinking about it. Okay, not reliving, but the feelings from memories are pretty vivid.


Memories aren't really Si. Some Si's are good at memorizing and remember things exactly, others aren't. I have a crap memory. I can't remember something five minutes after I've read it. 



> My Si-dom friend has almost photographic memory (compared to mine, at least). We met on a summer camp last summer (this is also the friend I've mentioned here before) and whoa, she remembers friggin everything from it. I only remember faint things but the feeling I had while being there feels very real/vivid when I think back on it. But I have a couple snippets (kind of pictures? Really vague) but the feelings from it remains, I guess. Ugh, can't explain it any better.


I remember almost nothing -- vague impressions of people, places, things, events. The longer it's been, the less I remember it and the more my mind logically fills in the blanks. 



> Yes, I know Ne isn't planning, but I meant that but planning a bit more, ISFJ's would (and supposedly should?) use less of Ne t be healthier.


No, ISFJs should use MORE Ne to be healthier -- because the more you exercise your lower functions, the more your higher ones have less of a strong hold on you, and the more balanced an individual you become. 



> The more I know, the less I want to do it. If it's a big life choice, then I want to know stuff about it, yes, but other things, NO. I like the adventure part and hate it when people influence my judgement. HATE IT. Okay, no more caps.


Ne/Si. 

The more Si knows, the more comfortable they feel in doing something, because now they know what to expect.



> What do you get from this post?


XNFP.


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

angelcat said:


> What makes you think you're Fe? What is Fe to you?


I think very much about how other people perceive me, what they think. Also because I relate to Ti, although this is questionable since it's pretty complicated and I have mixed it up with Ne a bit, even, so, maybe not? I don't relate to the whole "moral system" that Fi's have going on. Strong ethics, right and wrong. Not really.



> You don't understand what I'm saying. You're linking the word "mythology" with Greek mythology, and I'm saying that Si creates its own mythology/symbolism based on past impressions / interests / beliefs / archetypical thinking.


Haha, no, you're right. I don't :rolling: I definitely thought of the Greek mythology, yes. Still don't really understand what you're saying..



> Unwillingness to commit to a single conclusion. Ne/Si.


You might have noticed this pattern throughout my thread :laughin: 



> Again, you're focusing literally on what I'm saying and not seeing the impression I am giving you -- you don't have to see the shows I'm referencing to understand how Si works, because I just TOLD YOU how it works -- what it is DOING in the person who is using it. Which, by the way, reveals my own Si, because I'm translating impressionistic ideas and concepts into examples of behavior in order to get my message across.


Yeah, I got that but I think I didn't get the picture well enough, maybe. I don't know who Eric is in Phantom. 



> Basically, coming to acknowledge oneself as a Si-dom is a humbling experience, because it is forced admittance that your perception of reality is not reality. It's a subjective, impressionistic view of reality, heavily shaped through whatever you prioritize most -- your faith, your agnosticism, your interests, your past, etc.


I relate to this. I know I'm not that objective, even though I often try to be.



> Memories aren't really Si. Some Si's are good at memorizing and remember things exactly, others aren't. I have a crap memory. I can't remember something five minutes after I've read it.


Hmm okay.



> No, ISFJs should use MORE Ne to be healthier -- because the more you exercise your lower functions, the more your higher ones have less of a strong hold on you, and the more balanced an individual you become.


Haha, yes, I knew you would say this. But from an anxiety/similar perspective?



> The more Si knows, the more comfortable they feel in doing something, because now they know what to expect.


Okay. Sure, I sometimes want to be "in on the subject" but if people tell me a lot about the thing I might get anxious. Yes, I get anxious when thinking about how things might work out (if it's something that's unsettling to me from the beginning) but if I stop caring and just go there it's fine. Over thinking things I'm about to do just makes me not do them. I feel like everyone are doing this in a way, though?



> XNFP.


That's actually something I've thought about too. Not ENFP, though. Wouldn't say I'm that restless, really. But, if I'm an INFP, how does the sensitivity add up? Am I just neglecting my feelings or what? Not putting too much importance on them?


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## 68097 (Nov 20, 2013)

snakespeare said:


> I think very much about how other people perceive me, what they think. Also because I relate to Ti, although this is questionable since it's pretty complicated and I have mixed it up with Ne a bit, even, so, maybe not? I don't relate to the whole "moral system" that Fi's have going on. Strong ethics, right and wrong. Not really.


Okay, sure. Fi-doms tend not to care all that much. They just do what they do.



> Haha, no, you're right. I don't :rolling: I definitely thought of the Greek mythology, yes. Still don't really understand what you're saying..


... which could mean you're a sensor after all, because grasping abstract broad concepts is not something Si-dom does very well. It took me ... 5 years to get the hang of it?  I'm sorry, I don't know any other way to explain it. Um... read Jung's Si descriptions? Though they're so Ni and Ti heavy, it's HIGH LEVEL abstraction, so it'll bend your mind a bit. Gives me a headache. 



> Yeah, I got that but I think I didn't get the picture well enough, maybe. I don't know who Eric is in Phantom.


Sorry. I forgot they never mention his name in the musical -- Erik IS the Phantom. 



> Haha, yes, I knew you would say this. But from an anxiety/similar perspective?


I'm not sure what you... want me to say here?



> Okay. Sure, I sometimes want to be "in on the subject" but if people tell me a lot about the thing I might get anxious. *Yes, I get anxious when thinking about how things might work out (if it's something that's unsettling to me from the beginning) *


This could be inferior Ne.



> I feel like everyone are doing this in a way, though?


... no. With 16 distinct cognitive personality types, not everyone thinks the way you do. 



> That's actually something I've thought about too. Not ENFP, though. Wouldn't say I'm that restless, really. But, if I'm an INFP, how does the sensitivity add up? Am I just neglecting my feelings or what? Not putting too much importance on them?


*Here is a thing on Ne-dom/aux*. Do you relate?

If not, you're probably just an ISFJ with a strong Ne. There's quite a few running around on the forum.


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## Snakespeare (Jun 6, 2015)

angelcat said:


> Okay, sure. Fi-doms tend not to care all that much. They just do what they do.


That's what I thought, as well. Although, I think many IFP's are insecure (correct me if I'm wrong) but do these still don't care about the looks from others, etc?



> ... which could mean you're a sensor after all, because grasping abstract broad concepts is not something Si-dom does very well.


Hahaha, yes. I need things explained to me really well before I get it. When I have the basic information about something, though, I usually work my way up from there by myself. But yeah, I need a perfectly clear picture of what something is. 



> Um... read Jung's Si descriptions? Though they're so Ni and Ti heavy, it's HIGH LEVEL abstraction, so it'll bend your mind a bit. Gives me a headache.


...which makes this extremely tiring. Ti is about accuracy, though? But yes, N-descriptions of things make me mad.



> Sorry. I forgot they never mention his name in the musical -- Erik IS the Phantom.


The more you know! Now I'm a bit more cultural.



> I'm not sure what you... want me to say here?


Lol, talked about that Si-doms can get anxious when using their Ne much, thinking about possible outcomes (stressing them) and trouble-shooting maybe? I don't know much about this.



> ... no. With 16 distinct cognitive personality types, not everyone thinks the way you do.


I know, but we are all human beings and some things are fundamental that everyone just do/think from time to time. 



> Here is a thing on Ne-dom/aux. Do you relate?


Nahh..



> If not, you're probably just an ISFJ with a strong Ne. There's quite a few running around on the forum.


Probs. Could the stronger Ne maybe be the reason why I would respond in an Fi-way about the marriage-thingy? Or, Ti? I'm mixing Ti with Ne all the time, ugh. Not the other way around, though. I know Ne quite well. 

About Ti, though; I know I'm confusing it with stuff but the parts I don't mix up, I relate to them _so_ well. I always use logic. Aaaalways and love it. Also, when people have complimented me throughout the years I've heard pretty much that I'm smart/logical etc and not really _that_ nice/kind. Of course, I put more value on being smart so it can be that way that I haven't cared that much for the nice-comments and therefore forgotten them. I do think I put out a more Ti-picture of myself, though, but yes, that could be my Fe wanting to look that way, haha. Lately I've gotten more comments about being nice more than being smart, though. I guess I'm trying a bit more now :rolling::laughin:

Like I've said before, anyways, I do relate to the Si-Ti-loop. But I'm also really anxious when in public, so maybe not.

I also read this, ugh, didn't bookmark it... Basically it was a description about Si involving making a sandwich (it was from PerC) and it was sooo good! I have tried explaining this to people (think I might have done it in this thread?) without success but that one nailed it. 

If you haven't seen it, it basically said: "If an Si-dom (or aux, I guess) with bad memory (this proves the variations of remembrance) gets instructions on how to make a certain sandwich, without having any experience in sandwich making it goes like this; so, the sandwich consists of a top and bottom bun/bread (don't know what you guys call it), slice of tomato, onion, lettuce and mayo. The recipe says in which exact order these should be, so the person follows that. When the Si makes the next sandwich, they don't get to have the recipe. So the person totally forgot how to make it, but starts out trying something that might work. If they get that "right feeling", they probably chose the right one to put on first. This goes on until the person finally gets it right, based on a gut feeling (which is supposed to be N? But the gut can totally be Si as well).

Well, if you find it anywhere it's really good and fits me well. 

Oh, I also made a short thread in the Enneagram forum where I say some stuff (it's not as much text as here, haha!) and I have to say, I just love the Enneagram!? It's so much clearer than MBTI, jfc. There are always multiple sides to everything in MBTI but not really in Enneagram (guess this makes me more of an S). I'm pretty damn sure I'm a 9 and then either 4 or 6 (have read almost nothing about tritypes so yeah......) 


This definitely wasn't my longest post but I always smile when hitting the "Post Quick Reply"-button. Irony warms my heart.


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