# Where are all the NT ladies at??



## wind_up_bird (Mar 16, 2015)

Seriously. This is a clarion call for all the NT women.

We need to form a coalition. I am an ENTP and I thought _for years_ that I was a feeling type. After all, isn't it so acceptable and encouraged to be emotional and nurturing? Now I'm not saying we aren't, because we are just as capable of being as emotional as everyone else. But if you're anything like me, you've never felt like the conventional female. You might have lived on the fringes as a kid, and you couldn't relate to the girls in your high school because you weren't willing to get mixed up in their bullshit. Maybe your peers thought you were bitchy or too outspoken or bossy. Maybe you weren't as nurturing or motherly as you were taught to be. Maybe you are emotional but you are stuck rationalizing how you feel and you can't just feel like other people can. Maybe you feel like nobody listens to you even when you've rationally solved the problem. Or maybe (even hopefully) none of this happened to you. But you all are rad and strong and brave. Don't feel like you're dysfunctional in any way because you aren't interested in what your other peers are interested in. You do you. 

Sincerely,

A fellow NT female

P.S- I'm feeling rather punchy today. Can you tell?


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## dracula (Apr 5, 2015)

It's very true NT women can have a difficult time due to not being "stereotypical" females. I have a wide social circle and know a lot of people in general and besides myself I have only met ONE other NT female (ENTJ) who is a good friend of mine. From my current school I've always had friends but even two years ago people used to think I was sort of cold, bitchy, mean and shallow due to still being somewhat reserved back then and generally choosing to not speak if I wasn't interested in the topic (I always hated talking about celebrities or other matters like that). Although still not seen as a warm person, nowadays I guess people view me as an outgoing, friendly and somewhat eccentric person with a good sense of humor but also as someone who has a lot of potential and an interesting way of thinking but who does very little to achieve her goals. 

Two years ago excluding my friends I had difficulties dealing with both female and male population as I simply didn't fit in their standards of behavior. I've always liked analyzing people so I felt like even if I could not relate to them, I still understood them but others never really understood me. Currently it seems like many other girls think they actually understand how I think and and act while continuing to suggest reasons why. I'm still of the opinion that they kind of still don't (seems like there are people in the ENTJ, ESTP, ENFJ and INFP categories who have some sort of a clue). When it comes to males, I've always had difficulties forming friendships or relationships with them even though I've been described as a pretty girl, probably simply because I don't adhere to their norms of what a female is supposed to be like. I look very feminine but don't really act that way. 

At one point I attempted to just start behaving like everyone else by suppressing my inner ENTP and I just ended up miserable. Even if most people are not capable of understanding me, I still have many friends and as I'm quite open, I am always ready to explain the reasons for my behavior. It would be interesting to know whether other NT women have had the same problems as I don't really have many people to compare myself to


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## Royolis (Feb 22, 2015)

I'm too prideful of my self being or apathetic to social conformity to hide my xNTP-ness. Which makes me extremely lonely when it comes to sitting in a room with multiple friends who are talking about their current/ex- boyfriends. The times that I have felt a strong connection to a guy, he doesn't seem to feel the same about me or I fail at dropping hints. It's aggravating when you can give advice on a subject you have no experience in yourself. 

Also, it seems I'm often talked over when talking to friends. Normally, I wait until there's a break and I input my two cents, but in conversation, I find I can never get a word in until it's too late. Then they say I'm going off topic when I'm commenting about the previous topic, or when I finally bite the bullet and speak, they say I'm interrupting or talk too much. I hate it. I like to talk, debate, discuss, theorize, joke around, etc with people, but they don't seem to let me say anything. 

I have one NT friend (INTJ), she's one of my best friends and one who sometimes looks/talks to me like I have no idea what I'm doing (true 40% of the time, but whatever). We often feel trapped by society's customs in education and rage at society's overall dislike towards our kind.


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## dracula (Apr 5, 2015)

Royolis said:


> We often feel trapped by society's customs in education and rage at society's overall dislike towards our kind.


This is exactly what me and my ENTJ friend tend to do from time to time. It is difficult to be an NT female who wants to educate herself in the society as I feel like we often don't have the possibilities to function according to our full potential in the highly structured environment.


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## adultchildofalieninvaders (Aug 29, 2014)

I don't know, plenty of people I talk with mention that sense of alienation and feeling like they don't fit in when growing up. It's particularly hard for sensitive men and logical women (gender normative stereotypes and the teenaged pressure of fitting in) but I think most of us experience some form of that. One thing I notice that pertains to NT women in particular is that many of us peak later, in our twenties or thirties, so our teenage years can seem pretty rough. But I don't think the goal should be assimilation, just finding our own places in the world and being able to relate to others on our own terms (and theirs) instead of trying to live our lives by some imaginary standard of appropriateness few people really manage to reach. Everybody's weird and different in some way.

I also think that teenagers on the whole are highly self absorbed and shit at relating to other people. I've met a few exceptions, but most of us are so busy struggling with our own shit we pay surprisingly little amount to other people. And we can only compare our behind the scenes to anyone else's outward appearance, which might be miles away from how they really feel or think.

All that said, I was a pretty butch teenager in appearance and mannerisms (NT lack of interest in appearances + going through a particularly rough patch that left me even less interested in people + typical teenage rebellion against "how women should look and behave") and had some empathy/social awkwardness problems. I really didn't fit in. Nowadays I'm much more conventional in appearance (took out a number of piercings, traded my shaved head for a pink undercut, which I grew out into a brown bob recently, and bought some dresses instead of walking around in dude uniform and army boots) but I still surprise people when I open my mouth. That's fine though, I like subverting societal mores in a less in-your-face way nowadays instead of going for the full assault.

My best female friends when growing up, btw, were an ISFP that I kept getting into trouble but sort of responsibly because I knew she was a nice family girl ("I love the way you think, it's so different"), an INTJ ("people are shit, let's discuss how we could assassinate the headmaster") and an ISTP ("people are shit, let's get naked and drunk and high, put on some body paint and climb the fire escape to the roof") ... great people. I didn't feel like I stood out as much as I could have because two thirds of my friends were at least as strange as I was.


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## olonny (Jun 9, 2014)

I don't understand emotions. There's this ENFJ friend of mine who calls me an 'emotional illiterate'. I know I have feelings but a lot of time passes until I understand them. (though recently I've come to understand myself a little bit more when it comes to feelings... but just a little). 
I've always felt "different", not for how I feel, though, but for what I wanted. I was the weird one who was interested in different things from far away lands and who always wanted to go and live abroad and who longed for change more than anything


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## DeductiveReasoner (Feb 25, 2011)

I'm right here.


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## Sophia1 (Oct 7, 2014)

Never hid, was ashamed of, or denied my NTness. 
Its always been there, will always be there. Take it or leave it.


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## wind_up_bird (Mar 16, 2015)

adultchildofalieninvaders said:


> One thing I notice that pertains to NT women in particular is that many of us peak later, in our twenties or thirties, so our teenage years can seem pretty rough.


I am in my 20's and boy is this true.


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## BezoargDownTheirThroats (Jan 6, 2015)

Well I'm 16 and thankfully I think our society has evolutioned enough to at least stop pushing the nurturing bullshit into us, yeah nowadays we are seen as the rad mfs we are and so many people actually look up so much to female NTs (probably because we're really rare or like you said some NTs have lost it or just don't embrace it). Alhtough we are still being currently undermined at times, like I just hate when people call me a "tomboy" I can be brave, smart and be able to kill a damn insect with anything I have close and still be quite VERY feminine (I consider myself "girly"), because seriously when did feminine became weak and stupid? Also boys always say how serious I am and how threatening and angry I look and how I'm more "macho" than them... if they're expecting me to apologize for not being a bimbo then fuck them. Yeah, it's not a mystery that guys don't like me and yes you guessed it: idgf.


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## Cesspool (Aug 8, 2014)

@wind_up_bird Who's the woman in your avatar?


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## wind_up_bird (Mar 16, 2015)

@Cesspool her name is Julie Delpy. She's an actress/ director that I admire. I've also been told I look like her.


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## Cesspool (Aug 8, 2014)

wind_up_bird said:


> @Cesspool her name is Julie Delpy. She's an actress/ director that I admire. I've also been told I look like her.


Then you must be pretty.


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## kimpossible119 (May 15, 2014)

I try to be friendly towards people, but I'm always treated differently because of my NT-ness. Maybe it's intimidation or something, but the NT females I know, even the extroverted ones, are ostracized by the general public more than any other type of female. 

The only friend I've managed to find that I even remotely relate to is an ENTP female. Though she can be over-dramatic sometimes, we are on the same wavelength. Both of us were complete loners before we met in high school and then we just clicked.


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## Fascist (Dec 22, 2014)

how you doin'


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## Vanitas (Dec 13, 2009)

I don't think I can act/convince anyone I'm a F for any prolonged time. At most I'd look ENTP. I'm 'feminine' looking, though.


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## cotti (Aug 24, 2014)

I don't know where they are but i'd really like to meet them :wink:


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## Vanitas (Dec 13, 2009)

My INFJ close friend said (if onlookers see me/ they don't know me), I seem ENxP by looks/way of dressing alone.


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## MidnightThunder (Aug 20, 2011)

Here. I tend to hang around guys more. Haven't found another NT girl yet that I know of.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

I've never met an NT girl... What does it look like?


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## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Dabbling said:


> I'm an INTJ.
> 
> Why would NT women *want* to get together?


Same reason NT guys typically do, unless that was a reference to the culturally-endorsed truism of females inherently being competitive/disloyal with one another. (I wasn't sure if you were referring to this or not.)


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## ShadowsRunner (Apr 24, 2013)

Ultr4 said:


> It's a pink and purple wolf shouting at the moon with this gaz escaping for his breath, something like a sool..
> It's fucking pink and purple!!!!
> 
> I don't like overly-emotional people (unless I'm in love) because their comportment can sometime follow no rule, and they often try to address my 'feeling side', and I clearly don't like that. It's a kind of rape.
> ...


“You will never be able to escape from your heart. So it's better to listen to what it has to say. That way, you'll never have to fear an unanticipated blow.”

so you're saying it's only okay for women to be 'emotive'
SEXIST!!


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## ShadowsRunner (Apr 24, 2013)

Metasentient said:


> I liked it x3
> 
> I just prefer monochrome avatars for myself. (My previous was a white wolf, which another INTP recently took on anyway).


That jerk!!!!

different sides of the same coin?

I like muted colors, too(oh no, my canadianism is showing)
sometimes I wish I could have both, but it doesn't work that way, does it?


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## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

CloudySkies said:


> That jerk!!!!
> 
> different sides of the same coin?
> 
> ...


Haha, I'm sorry, I just meant that person took on the white wolf _theme_ (their picture is different), and they were new, so it wasn't really related to me... we just happened to both like them, I guess.

Yep, interesting to shake things up every once in a while.

Sure, you could do that... you'd just look for multicolored pictures with a low saturation, or a picture with only a few colors. I wouldn't change it though!


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## Belrose (Dec 23, 2011)

The only other NT I know of in person besides myself is my Mother and she is an ENTJ. She never hid herself and is quite a bold, proud lady. 

As for me, I did get shit for it but it wasn't all the time. One example is that I eventually grow distant from my friends ( with the exception of my best friend who I speak with every day, who is an INFJ ) and because of that I've been told I was insensitive. It's not intentional, I just am _really_ terrible with keeping track of people. My best friend remains close because no one ever completed me like she has. In the ten years we've known each other, we never had a fight. *That* is something amazing.

The biggest problem I've had though are from relationships. I'm considered to be low-maintenance I guess. I don't require a lot of attention, never had issues with feeling jealousy and I prefer buying things for myself instead of them being handed to me ( otherwise I feel bad when given something because I have to reciprocate back ). The downside though is that I am not very affectionate and that's what most men look for. I've only been with Feeler types that really required it. I recall being told that I am "a frigid, cold bitch", "boring" in past relationships because I just... can't be that girl who jumps into someone's arms then act schmoozy and cutesy on a whim.

Not that I _don't_ display affection or want to. It's just that it's _hard_ for me to feel it and it hurts that it seems so difficult for folks to understand that people like this exist.


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## zanah0dia (Apr 8, 2015)

I have arrived.
*swishes cape*


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## dwelfusius (Feb 16, 2015)

BezoargDownTheirThroats said:


> Well I'm 16 and thankfully I think our society has evolutioned enough to at least stop pushing the nurturing bullshit into us, yeah nowadays we are seen as the rad mfs we are and so many people actually look up so much to female NTs (probably because we're really rare or like you said some NTs have lost it or just don't embrace it). Alhtough we are still being currently undermined at times, like I just hate when people call me a "tomboy" I can be brave, smart and be able to kill a damn insect with anything I have close and still be quite VERY feminine (I consider myself "girly"), because seriously when did feminine became weak and stupid? Also boys always say how serious I am and how threatening and angry I look and how I'm more "macho" than them... if they're expecting me to apologize for not being a bimbo then fuck them. Yeah, it's not a mystery that guys don't like me and yes you guessed it: idgf.


I think you sound pretty fucking awesome  and a lot like me at your age.Sometimes I would "doll up" (not overboard, just, paying a bit of attention and letting looks come before comfort a bit more) and other kinds of people would engage in conversation, and then I opened up my mouth and every one of them was, wait, what just happened?


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## dwelfusius (Feb 16, 2015)

mashedpotato said:


> I am not a lady...
> 
> I am a potato.
> 
> View attachment 319922


I'm sorry to be the one telling you this..but I think I ate your uncle yesterday.
Scuzi


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## dwelfusius (Feb 16, 2015)

double post


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## dwelfusius (Feb 16, 2015)

Allright, now serious ^^

As if. XNTP here, still deciding (aargh my desire for new information to continuously change and revise my thoughts sometimes).

I concur with the F being sort of kind of turbo developed (for an NT) in females due to environmental and societal expectations.
I mean, even if you were a "tomboy" or whatever, or just plainly didn't care adhering to any of the stereotypical image of how THE female should be (not that I believe that, but there are unfortunately still a lot of people that have this idea), the expectations from your environment or yourself maybe to "fit in to feel less alone/awkward but at the same time not wanting to deal with all these illogical people that do not care for solutions to problems but just need people to say, there there and "what a bitch/*hole/... (big generalization I know, just trying to make a point  no sf or st discrimination here) still probably caused a speedier growth in those function than had those stimuli not been there.


Pff, I really should start using footnotes instead of brackets.

On another note, any NTP women here that have vids online? I am looking because I am trying to see if that can help me type myself but as I already noticed, there isn't really an abundance of female npt vids (intp a bit,entp almost none) out there and I do believe that's a hole in my typing information database I'm using.

Stuff from me here, if someone else should care (warning, I don't edit since too lazy/no software)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLEcXC8HfNna5_4X10suQtXSe7KcN6d7Kq


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## Shampoocat (Aug 11, 2011)

I would love to meet some NT females. Any cool ones around Munich, Germany?


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## cannamella (Mar 25, 2014)

I have noticed several NT ladies although not many (what do you expect). Three ENTJs. Two INTJs. Two NTPs. A couple more are my lecturers (who don't count lol). It is not often to notice NT ladies, I admit (not that I'm seeking them but I can tell based on vibes). I'm not even 20 and I still can count how many they are with my fingers. In fact, I'm only close to two or three out of those I have mentioned.

One thing for sure, yes, I can tell that they are _struggling_. Some are not afraid of speaking up their 'intellectualism' in public, some suffer from depression and go to a psychiatrist, some are even ready to accept if they can't find the right 'man', some are strictly private, etc.

Sure, I'm still learning and will always be, but I think a little dose of feelings from time to time won't hurt. And no, I'm not talking about changing everything to be sweet and all. That's too extreme. Accepting that feelings exist can be helpful sometimes and that's what I have learned so far.


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## mashedpotato (Apr 12, 2015)

dwelfusius said:


> I'm sorry to be the one telling you this..but I think I ate your uncle yesterday.
> Scuzi


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## Lumika (May 10, 2015)

Whenever I show MBTI test to my acquaintances, I want them to guess my personality type out of pure curiousity. I'm quiet and reserved most of the time. I analyze carefully what I want to say and, well, real-time conversations definitely are not in my favor  Not to mention I don't want to interrupt others while people don't seem to mind interrupting me. Then I'm like "oh, whatever" and I don't pick up what I planned to say until someone asks me to end. My emotions can burst out, although they last just for an instant - sometimes it is a one word, sometimes it is a one sentence. It's never longer than a few seconds anyway. So why I'm always labeled by them as Fi? Seriously, it doesn't matter how tactically I think when we play MOBA together. All my analyses on varios topics are irrelevant. Nobody cares how much time we spent discussing some problems in the past. Moreover, I acknowledge subjective aspects but I never take them as a priority. And yet, I'm not considered as Ti. It definitely doesn't make me happy as I'm very proud to be INTP ^^ Honestly, I can't find more reasons to label me as Fi than gender stereotypes.


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## dwelfusius (Feb 16, 2015)

Yeah,got some friends to take a test today, enfp.both. Okay just a test but confirmed my suspicion, and another good friend is also enfp and I see the resemblances very strongly. Apparently I blend well with them


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## BezoargDownTheirThroats (Jan 6, 2015)

Depends, SF is probably not good at all, NFs are pretty cool though, overly-emotional guys bother me just as much as overly-emotional girls or overly-emotional potatoes for that matter but as long as you can be perfectly rational when you have to I think it's fine. By the way, would you classify yourself as overly-emotional? Are you poetic and kinda blue all the time? (I know this characteristics may be kind of cliche but I'm just curious, I rarely see many INFP boys and I find INFPs intriguing in some way)


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## a_dude (Oct 12, 2014)

amen. I can see what that would be a rather difficult way to be living, as an NT female, with all of the conditioned gender roles, etc. frankly, im looking for an NT female, so I encourage the self expression of all individuals as well


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## Lady D (Mar 17, 2013)

wind_up_bird said:


> I am in my 20's and boy is this true.


I'm 29 and men come from doors and windows to talk to me. I was an ugly and lonely teenager. I peaked late like couple other NT girls I know...if I am an NT myself anyway. I've tested ENTP when happy and INTP in depression. There's too much Se and Fe involved to have a clue.


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## Delicious Speculation (May 17, 2015)

I peaked late, too. I'm 30 and I'm far more outwardly confident and attractive than I was as a teenager or even in my 20s. Being a nerd is cool once you're an adult. I transformed from someone who came off as painfully shy and quiet to someone who is still quiet, but confident and not afraid of anyone. 

It's much easier to find other intuitive thinkers online than it is in real life. Two close friends are another INTJ and an xNTP, though, so I know we're out there somewhere.


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## vesper007 (Aug 11, 2015)

adultchildofalieninvaders said:


> One thing I notice that pertains to NT women in particular is that many of us peak later, in our twenties or thirties, so our teenage years can seem pretty rough.


I find this incredibly true. ENTP female here. For years, I found it very hard to fit in. I had friends and was never a loner (well, in high school I was a loner), but I always had this sense of "am I doing the right thing" or "am I fitting in", and I didn't want to be "found out". 

I felt like the perpetual outsider in a strange world that I craved acceptance into, like Dan Humphrey in Gossip Girl. People liked me because I was a conventionally pretty, preppyish girl on the outside, but people didn't "get" my personality and I was often called things like 'weird' (or worse) behind my back. 

College sucked because I became the target of gossip (Greek system stuff). I could never understand why this whole mess of girls were calling me a "sl*t" when (1) I had hooked up with the same amount of dudes they did and (2) I was still a virgin at the time! Very hurtful to say the least. 

And don't get me started on relationships. I always tried to mimic an ISFJ, just because I figured that's what all best guys wanted. 

I've spent nearly 3 and a half decades on this earth and I'm just recently getting comfortable in my own skin. I have a fantastic group of friends - men and women of varying MTBI types (I assume - never tested them) who enjoy what I bring to the table and also share a lot of things with. But I let the "NT" come out gradually. 

Cognitive functions be damned, I still feel most comfortable with other NTs in terms of dating, although the lack of emotionality throws me for an occasional loop. I've fallen hard for guys who say the right romantic things, but no one *gets* me like another NT, and finding that mutual "you're like me!" understanding is huge.


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## the.soph.ia (Jul 21, 2015)

wind_up_bird said:


> adultchildofalieninvaders said:
> 
> 
> > One thing I notice that pertains to NT women in particular is that many of us peak later, in our twenties or thirties, so our teenage years can seem pretty rough.
> ...


Started speaking up in my late teens (15/16+) gradually till now (at 21) i'm an unapologetic ENTP.


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## LadyKitty (Jun 3, 2014)

I agree with the "late bloomer" consensus. High school was certainly not my glory days. College/grad school was better- I had far better luck with friends when I actually chose them based on shared interest not solely geographical convenience. (I went to a very small local high school with a few hundred students, and then a large state university with tens of thousands.) I feel like I have really "bloomed" though as an adult professional woman- who would have thought?? While many of my friends at this point (late twenties) are angsting over getting old/leaving their college days behind, I feel like I am finally reaching my best years so far. Making money is awesome, esp after so many years of broke student-hood. I've become far more confident and less worried about what others think of me.


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## Doktorin Zylinder (May 10, 2015)

You rang?

I haven't peaked, yet. I'm just getting started.


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## Jagbas (Jul 8, 2015)

ENTP here! My favourite years were in elementary school where there were no prejudices and teachers fed my curiosity. I struggled through high school and college (I'm not very familiar with your educational system so let's say in my teen years) because I desperately tried to fit in and only had one real friend. When I started university I began knowing and appreciating myself more. Now I'm proud of who I am, I feed my own curiosity and I am happy with my few but true friends.


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## RecklessInspirer (Oct 11, 2010)

Here I am. What's good


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## DAHN (May 13, 2011)

Wazz good yall.


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## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

*Advancing scouting pieces*


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## Exquisitor (Sep 15, 2015)

I dealt pretty badly with my teenage years. I was homeschooled and didn't have access to very large social groups, so I didn't get to meet other people who were, I guess, NT. I felt like a weird overly introspective outsider.

The first time I made a friend who seemed to have a similar mentality to me, I was 14. We became penpals through a magazine. I'd tentatively type her as INTP. We exchanged long letters and emails of our ideas, debated things, and she felt I was the only person she knew her age who also showed any interest in thinking so deeply and analytically.

When I started getting on forums around age 15-16, I made an idiot of myself because I thought I could reinvent myself online. I poured into it all my frustrations about my inability to relate to the people around me by trying to act like my shadow type, spontaneous, gregarious, and playful to the extreme. I probably missed several chances to engage with people who I could have really related to. It all ended badly.

I think it was only in recovering from abuse PTSD and six weeks of psychosis that I really learned to be comfortable with myself, and patient, and present myself as who I am, in all my oddness, instead of trying to be someone else. Call it a forced reality check over a period of three years.


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## Tsubaki (Apr 14, 2015)

Hm... I think that one of my oldest friends is an INxJ, probably INTJ. I'm not sue though, since she changed a lot over the years and she doesn't fit the characteristics as well anymore... Then, there's an ESTP and an ISTJ girl, but ST doesn't count... The only other female NT that comes to my mind is my aunt, who is probably also an ENTP ^^

I really had the problem of "not feeling like a female", because I was usually hanging out with guys and didn't pay much attention to the drama that was going on. At some point, I really thought that everyone just sees me as a guy and that I would never ever be seen as a girl. (which wasn't the case) Still, I think it's more of an advantage to be an NT female ^^ I mean, I was always pretty inventive and managed to come up with new things. It wasn't like I was really handicapped by my lack of sympathy for other people. I simply never cared XD Also, I usually went my own way and even not-so-nice-people never really bothered me, since I either saw them as an irritation or a joke.


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## Monty (Jul 12, 2011)

behind you


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