# Do you belive in mind upload technology?



## Wtpmjgda (Dec 15, 2014)

I found this from future predictions done by scientists. By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence. So we can upload our mind (consiousness) in to machines and achive immortality. But i dont belive in this.


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## yet another intj (Feb 10, 2013)

Brain in a vat - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Kavik (Apr 3, 2014)

The 2030s or 2040s sounds too soon so I don't think it can be possible by those dates. We're still going through the process of learning how to control computers with our minds. 
Controlling Computers with Your Mind - NIH Research Matters - National Institutes of Health (NIH)
Vegetative patient talks using brain waves | Reuters
They're far cries from uploading but could be steps toward it if such a thing is possible.


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## DeathByFishHeads (Mar 29, 2014)

Whomp! - Pork Futures


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## Wtpmjgda (Dec 15, 2014)

Kavik said:


> The 2030s or 2040s sounds too soon so I don't think it can be possible by those dates.


A human can perform aprox. 20 quadrillions calculation per sec. Todays supercomputer can perform trillions of calculation per sec. Which means we are near to that. It still needs a 10+ years to reach human level. This predictions done according to moore's law of semiconductors. Here the probelm is, how can we upload our mind into computers? Or how this thing work?


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## KingAndrew (May 8, 2015)

I suppose, in the future, an advanced computer could be programmed to scan the brain and be able to emulate the behavior of the scanned individual. But it still wouldn't be you. But there could be so many sweet ideas you could do with this. I can see me uploading my image/likeness into an entire army of robots which I will use to take over the world.


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## Max (Aug 14, 2014)

Wtpmjgda said:


> I found this from future predictions done by scientists. By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence. So we can upload our mind (consiousness) in to machines and achive immortality. But i dont belive in this.


I have had thoughts about humans uploading their minds onto password protected, individual hard-drives if they were ever to develop amenesia or another neurological disorder, but they thought of uploading our own minds onto machines to create an artificial version of themselves. 



> *By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence.*




Have you ever heard of the 2045 iniative? Thry are basically planning to make this a reality by 2045. Here's a quote from their Ideaology section of their website:



> " The main science mega-project of the 2045 Initiative aims to create technologies enabling the transfer of a individual’s personality to a more advanced non-biological carrier, and extending life, including to the point of immortality. We devote particular attention to enabling the fullest possible dialogue between the world’s major spiritual traditions, science and society.
> 
> A large-scale transformation of humanity, comparable to some of the major spiritual and sci-tech revolutions in history, will require a new strategy. We believe this to be necessary to overcome existing crises, which threaten our planetary habitat and the continued existence of humanity as a species. With the 2045 Initiative, we hope to realize a new strategy for humanity's development, and in so doing, create a more productive, fulfilling, and satisfying future.
> The "2045" team is working towards creating an international research center where leading scientists will be engaged in research and development in the fields of anthropomorphic robotics, living systems modeling and brain and consciousness modeling with the goal of transferring one’s individual consciousness to an artificial carrier."


People have been talking about this for years. If things get as advanced as this, the world will go to pot. It'll be destroyed by these Terminator-type machines. I guess that is what they want in a sense. 

As for achieving immortality in humam form, I don't think this is possible. Humans are mortal. They always were and always will be. Yes, our spirits are immortal, but our bodies and minds are just cells to keep our Spirit grounded inside, until we die. Once we go, our bodies and minds go with us. We become a clean slate. We remember nothing after we die.


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## g_w (Apr 16, 2013)

Wtpmjgda said:


> I found this from future predictions done by scientists. By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence. So we can upload our mind (consiousness) in to machines and achive immortality. But i dont belive in this.


Not yet: the sheer number of neurons is one thing; the physical architecture of their connections is not yet known in detail, and we are still discovering things about what you might call secondary and tertiary features of neuroanatomy; let alone the exact flow of neurotransmitters and re-uptake enzymes, and how all of these things synchronize at a cellular level (let alone molecular!), which will be necessary to assure that we can re-create the mind.
(Let alone the bandwidth necessary to transfer the information, and error-checking: and the physics of *RESTORING* the information which had been collected electronically, back into organic form...)


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## Doran Seth (Apr 4, 2015)

I think uploading human consciousness to a machine would not actually be a transfer of consciousness to the machine, just the creation of a model of that human's mind. This would result in AI that mimics a person's behavior but would not actually replicate human life. I believe a true upload of the mind is impossible because our brains are not computers, their functions are not programs, and thoughts are not data. Essentially, mental content is irreducible to the symbols on which computing is based so it cannot be transferred like files from one medium to another.


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## Laiskiainen (May 27, 2015)

There are many things I consider advanced technology useful for - some things I prefer just natural and my mind is on that list. If people can hack into almost any service or device nowadays, imagine how long it would take to hack into this system and use the information for something it's not there for. 

Although then I also could hack into the system and take over the world - others would be my borg drones or at my mercy about their precious mind backups! ;P 

...I wonder however if this technology mentioned would eventually be able to handle the creative parts of our minds, or restore it?


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## Rachel Wood (Mar 25, 2015)

Wtpmjgda said:


> I found this from future predictions done by scientists. By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence. So we can upload our mind (consiousness) in to machines and achive immortality. But i dont belive in this.


Seems plausible, but not a certain thing by any means. Why do you believe this is impossible, would be my question?


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## Amine (Feb 23, 2014)

Our minds are already uploaded as I see it. In an organic substrate, sure.

Will we be able to transfer them to a different substrate? I have my doubts about this happening as easily as people think. I think a vital part of the question is that of _binding_. Computers are almost as fast as brains as we speak - and are, I think, as fast as some of the simpler brains on this planet, yet they do not seem conscious. So it isn't just a question of computing power or operations per second, clearly. It may not even be a question of software. There may be something more fundamental about matter and consciousness that would not allow silicon chips to be conscious no matter how much computing power and algorithmic complexity they have. They will still fail at the integral process which defines mind-making, binding. Does that rule out other paradigms, like quantum computing? No. Ultimately we are machines and I would be surprised if there were only one way, the biological one, to skin this cat.

Quantum computing, which may be required for conscious mind, is still in its infancy, but once it takes off, it will _really take off_, I think. A Moore's Law of quantum computing would be staggering in its implications. 

One thing I have become less skeptical about, however, is identity transfer. This article compares 3 methods of mind uploading and ultimately equates them in terms of identity preservation: gradual replacement of neurons, fast or instantaneous replacement, and destructive scan-and-copy, whereby one would have one's brain preserved, scanned, and uploaded into another substrate without, ideally, being killed in the process and having a mere identical imposter born in one's place. Mind-bending stuff. 

I'm more, at this point, an advocate of rejuvenation technologies like biotech and nanotech. But my mind is open.


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## Alles_Paletti (May 15, 2013)

Perhaps. Technology develops so rapidly that predicting the future is little more than guessing. 

I wonder if such a thing as individuality will still exist if we manage to digitize someone's brain. 

One thing that makes us individuals is our physical separation. 

What if you can literally link brains, like an internet for brains? You'd be able to access other people's "data" to certain extent, perhaps literally see what they see, or feel what they feel. 

In the end, our brains are different but the way our bodies work is largely the same. So perhaps it would even be possible to control a body with a digital brain; you can see already how brain signals can be used to operate artificial limbs, so why not real ones. 

Could you put a brain in a perpetual state of bliss? Will people succumb to that temptation, if we know what signal in the brain does that? Is it the next hard drug, the joy without the physical risk?

If a brain is digital, is there anyway to separate false information from real information (as far as we believe data from our senses is real)? 

In general, if it happens, what happens to society, individuality, morality?


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## Stelmaria (Sep 30, 2011)

I'll only believe it when I see it.


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## Amine (Feb 23, 2014)

Alles_Paletti said:


> Could you put a brain in a perpetual state of bliss? Will people succumb to that temptation, if we know what signal in the brain does that? Is it the next hard drug, the joy without the physical risk?
> 
> If a brain is digital, is there anyway to separate false information from real information (as far as we believe data from our senses is real)?
> 
> In general, if it happens, what happens to society, individuality, morality?


We'd probably be able to choose our moods very easily, and bliss wouldn't be the only option. Motivation itself would be quite readily enhanced, such that we would look like lazy, malaise-ridden fools in our current state. 

The truth of the matter is that a full immersion VR world of mind uploading would be paradise in every possible way. Anything you think is good would be the case, anything you think is bad wouldn't. The only thing you wouldn't have full control over is other people, but you could probably at least be assured there would be very strict laws ensuring they don't cause harm to others. The potential for suffering in VR is equal and opposite as the potential for bliss. VR hell would create a staggering new level of torture. It can't be allowed, period. Not even the possibility.

Without suffering, though, empathy would concern itself with sharing other people's joy. Life would be about creativity, play, love, and exploration, and there would be _a lot_ to explore. I doubt it would ever be fully explored. 

People would still concern themselves with the real world too though. Space exploration, expansion, perhaps even finding other life and assisting it.


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## Alles_Paletti (May 15, 2013)

Amine said:


> We'd probably be able to choose our moods very easily, and bliss wouldn't be the only option. Motivation itself would be quite readily enhanced, such that we would look like lazy, malaise-ridden fools in our current state.
> 
> The truth of the matter is that a full immersion VR world of mind uploading would be paradise in every possible way. Anything you think is good would be the case, anything you think is bad wouldn't. The only thing you wouldn't have full control over is other people, but you could probably at least be assured there would be very strict laws ensuring they don't cause harm to others. The potential for suffering in VR is equal and opposite as the potential for bliss. VR hell would create a staggering new level of torture. It can't be allowed, period. Not even the possibility.
> 
> ...


What I'm saying is, that without the restriction of the body and brain we've been born in, but our consciousness and individuality being able to be independent from it, I wonder what individuality will still mean and if it will still exist.

We are physically separated but if that physical barrier is gone, will we still be truly individual? 

And if brain data can be digitized, can we create "new personalities" from scratch? Could we copy+paste this data? Could this "new personality" data be uploaded in a brain (so is it only read, or read+write)?


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## Death Persuades (Feb 17, 2012)

Wtpmjgda said:


> I found this from future predictions done by scientists. By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence. So we can upload our mind (consiousness) in to machines and achive immortality. But i dont belive in this.


And? Whether you believe it or not will not affect the truth. If it's possible, it will eventually happen. if not, then it will never happen. Regardless of what people might believe today.

Just remember that a long time ago scientists laughed at the idea of black holes. Now we can create them in the LHC.


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

Hopefully the upload tech takes into account the human perception of time going faster as the person gets older.
It is EXTREMELY hard to not do that.


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## Mac The Knife (Nov 5, 2014)

Wtpmjgda said:


> I found this from future predictions done by scientists. By 2030s or 40s artifical intelligence surpass human inteligence. So we can upload our mind (consiousness) in to machines and achive immortality. But i dont belive in this.


Believe in this? Do you mean, you don't think it would be "ethical" to do such a thing? Or is it that you just don't think it's possible to do? If you think it's an ethically questionable, then I would suggest you probably won't HAVE to do it, others may want to though. But if that's not what you meant than I'm sorry, I couldn't quite tell for sure which you meant.

I wouldn't presume personally, to think that would be impossible in the future. Provided that we don't kill ourselves off. It's not really all that 'crazy' of a thought to surmise though. ESPECIALLY in comparison to what people do actually "believe-in" today without a shred of any good observational evidence or historical. So due to the fact that we actually have witnessed the incredible acceleration of our technology and science in just the past 20-40 years, it's not illogical to make some assumptions like this one. 

(_I would say being specific as that prediction is, I'm only skeptical that the great advance will deal completely in that exact area of technology, for that exact purpose._) 

But given the rate we are making these vast improvements and witnessing them literally right in front of us, I can certainly say it would seem very naive to think that something like uploading our consciousness (or any other radical idea pertaining to technology and science) isn't going to happen in the future. 

Whether it happens 2030 or 2120 is debatable and completely different argument though. So if we survive, I can almost *guarantee* you that due to the rate of our improvements, some very radical things that seem just as far fetched as the possibility of uploading consciousness or something else is going to happen and probably within our lifetimes.


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## Mac The Knife (Nov 5, 2014)

aef8234 said:


> Hopefully the upload tech takes into account the human perception of time going faster as the person gets older.
> It is EXTREMELY hard to not do that.


 Always an interesting thing to think about. It seems like it would basically have something to do mainly with a 'settling-in/getting-use-to' concept, to how the experience of time as we experience it increases gradually."Much like how we can slowly get use to the temperature of hot bath water, and it eventually not feeling quite as hot as it did at first, when it's still realistically the same temperature it always was. Provided it was at least somewhat temperature controlled." 

But, I haven't really looked at any detailed info on that specific subject, so I'm just speculating. On what I could see being a main reason we experience that increase in 'speed' of time and our perception, is due to how long we've been experiencing it and our ability to adapt.


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