# The Evil Side of the ENFJ/ INFJ



## Raichan

NateK314 said:


> I'm sorry I didn't mean to misrepresent you! My INFJ best friend and I were just noticing how INFJ's can be suspecting (for good reasons, she always notices things that I don't notice yet)
> 
> I think INFJ's are super awesome, and of all the personalities I definitely relate to them the most  (other than my own)
> 
> Also I think the bit about being careful with what you share or labeling people before you know them is really true. But I think that's more ST's business, because they tend to put stereotypes without really developing all possible sides. Of course which the INFJ and INTJ have the best ability to see all possible sides for which I highly respect *head nod*


Haha, I was simply clarifying, not looking for praise about my type. All types have their strengths and weaknesses but I doubt an INFJ who wants to use a strong moral code (not saying it's applicable for all INFJs, every type has unhealthy/bad people) would be suspicious or label others just for being 'reserved' alone -__-..I don't push people if it's none of my business or if they've shown they do not want my opinion. 

A small example (just an example) of when I can get excessively suspicious --> Individual tries to convince me of something in his/her character,''I'm a closed off person, I like to help others and give them charity etc etc'' but then shows too many subtle and obvious signs of being arrogant, talking down to others while maintaining a ''friendly'' ''pleasant'' face, in spite of use of 'formal' language - manipulated oh so cleverly to make others feel bad.


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## Sai

Raichan said:


> Nah, an INFJ typically has reasons that are deep-rooted for their paranoia and suspicions based on heavy experience because maybe their Ni+Fe has made them exposed to some of the darker sides of psychological human psyche,though a healthy INFJ has developed Fe as well as Ti/ Se/ whathaveyou to keep them from pushing those suspicions on others in an unfair, cruel manner.
> 
> The REAL dark side of an INFJ -- comes at some point when *after* many times being treated rudely even though they have tried their best to be in all manner tactful and civil, after being shown inconsistency in communications a lot of times even after showing signs of wanting a more open fair discussion, being shown injustice for no reason except to serve the other person's ego.. fucking hell, all hell can break loose and it'd be best to just stay away.


Thats Me 

Ive been loosing empathy and growing more selfish gradually, ive just stop caring about others as i used to. Also lost faith in people and abandoned many "dreams". im really realistic and ive learned that doing the "right thing" and being nice doesnt really work xD


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## fatum210

Sai said:


> Ive been loosing empathy and growing more selfish gradually, ive just stop caring about others as i used to. Also lost faith in people and abandoned many "dreams". im really realistic and ive learned that doing the "right thing" and being nice doesnt really work xD


You sound tired and disgusted of the world. I feel obliged to tell you that doing the right thing and being nice works, but it doesn't work if you try that method on the wrong people. Some people are just too self-centered and ignorant to even value your efforts to make the world a better place. That doesn't mean there is no one out there who deserves your high standards and your dreams.

"If you can change your mind, you can change the world" -Joey Reiman-


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## Dyidia

I think the evil side of xNFJs comes from understanding how to manipulate people _and occasionally doing it to further their own ends_.

Seems like the ones proposed here aren't really that dark or evil, just minor character flaws and questionable decisions in judgment (thinking one can manipulate someone "for their own good" or "for the greater good").

I can relate to the OP somewhat, but I don't have an incessant need for everything to be on the surface. I tend to be confident that if someone is hiding something that will likely harm me, their motives will become apparent long before it's a problem. If someone is so secretive as to arouse suspicion, don't let them get close until they open up. Simple.


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## Faux

I stand by my original post that cold indifference is the superior tactic, but I should also note that I've had to make an exception recently. Considering that he's the kind of disgusting hypocrite who preaches loyalty to your face while selling out his friends and strung along multiple women while milking them for pity, I don't really care. Any stain on my character is worth getting rid of him.

That's all I want. I don't want to toy with or change him so much as I want to drive him away from my social circle using what I know and can glean myself. It's honestly kind of placating to watch him squirm in the spotlight like a rat caught in a trap after all the trouble he's put me and other people through, but I mostly just want this whole chapter closed. There's no place for him here, and every other word out of his mouth is a lie or a pathetic, transparent attempt to cover his ass now that everything's crumbling and nobody wants to stand by him after I brought to light what was going on behind the scenes.

Haven't even had to do much, though. Despite bragging about his INTP intellect or whatever, he made the pretty laughable mistake of revealing his genuine weaknesses and insecurities in his desperation to make the "kicked puppy" act pass inspection with me and get me to rub his ego just right. Not that it's made him think twice about looking down on the intelligence of others or anything.


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## Laeona

Quac said:


> Sarcasm or not, you're frighteningly close to the truth! (How do I know? I'm married to an ENFJ.)


lol You've just hit on one of the INFJ's and ENFJ's awesome abilities. They can blurt out the truth and make you laugh about it.  Love you guys.

@_NateK314_ Knew you were joking! Was laughing the whooooole ride

I will say this though, my most explosive showdowns have been with INFJ's and ENFJ's. Hey, it happens. Tornado meets a volcano. But you're still my favorites!


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## Phal

Sai said:


> Thats Me
> 
> Ive been loosing empathy and growing more selfish gradually, ive just stop caring about others as i used to. Also lost faith in people and abandoned many "dreams". im really realistic and ive learned that doing the "right thing" and being nice doesnt really work xD


I must admit I'm experiencing this more and more. So I get more closed off, but I don't like it. I don't feel like myself, but it isn't bad to be a little bit more selfish either. 



fatum210 said:


> You sound tired and disgusted of the world. I feel obliged to tell you that doing the right thing and being nice works, but it doesn't work if you try that method on the wrong people. Some people are just too self-centered and ignorant to even value your efforts to make the world a better place. That doesn't mean there is no one out there who deserves your high standards and your dreams.
> 
> "If you can change your mind, you can change the world" -Joey Reiman-


Thank you  Although I still believe that with me for instance, I was so naive and trusting, it was necessary to get hurt really badly, to learn to defend myself and become stronger. The same with my INFJ best friend.


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## wisdomdreams

Berns321 said:


> I often feel that my ENFJ thinks that he gets me completely...which really annoys me, but I'll never say it. I know this won't change his mind =/


I strongly agree with this. It really bugs me when someone thinks they have me pegged and completely understood. And I really dislike reading personality descriptions that describe one type or another as being able to know others better than they know themselves. That really bugs me and I find it so arrogant.


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## NateK314

Laeona said:


> lol You've just hit on one of the INFJ's and ENFJ's awesome abilities. They can blurt out the truth and make you laugh about it.  Love you guys.
> 
> @_NateK314_ Knew you were joking! Was laughing the whooooole ride
> 
> I will say this though, my most explosive showdowns have been with INFJ's and ENFJ's. Hey, it happens. Tornado meets a volcano. But you're still my favorites!


Oh my gosh finally someone who understands XD Although ironically my showdowns of late have been with my two friends who are siblings and both ENFJ's right now. You're my mama's personality type of whom I call "Mahallamarama" XD She definitely understands me because though I'm judging I'm judging in all the ways she wants to be sometimes. Out of her ESTJ, ISFJ, and ENFJ (Me) kids (don't know how a poor INFP ended up with three judging kids and a husband who's also juding) I'm her favorite though, Ok maybe I'm just saying that XD


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## NateK314

wisdomdreams said:


> I strongly agree with this. It really bugs me when someone thinks they have me pegged and completely understood. And I really dislike reading personality descriptions that describe one type or another as being able to know others better than they know themselves. That really bugs me and I find it so arrogant.


Ok not to do the "I totally understand that" but I totally understand that. I HATE when personalities think they totally get me. Especially non NF's it's like NF's actually usually at least understand me but it's ok to not completely get me you don't have to always understand, just go with it.


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## roxasquall

Well, I'm an ENFJ who has turned evil to certain people. Yes we are quick to judge people's body language and are quick to know people as if we knew them forever. I'm not going to lie, anything you do, we just pick up instantly, and we just remember them, what you hate, what you like, what oddities you have, and yes, we are loving, until you piss us off, and then we're going to use everything that you love against you. 

Example, one of my peers is very exclusive and I wanted to befriend him, and I tried, but in the end, he never cared or tried (until now). Since his group is exclusive, I'm trying to make everyone else exclude him and trying to make him feel like his small little group is not enough compared to the group of friends I've made in class and other classes. I know his weaknesses and I know what would make him tick and would make this worse, but I choose not to do it, and am waiting for him to confront me about it. I think that's one thing I differ from typical ENFJs, if I find something wrong or something that I can tell someone is mad at me about, I confront people about it because I'm not the type that likes lingering or running away from problems. People's body language screams out at me if I do see that there's something wrong, and I cannot stay silent about it. 

I hate broken promises. I hate when people are flakes and when I feel like they are using me (btw, this is the problem, and I have told him about how I felt what was going on, and I have told him the solution, but I guess he refuses to listen, and he's now in this bind until he learns to man up and confront me about the problem and stop putting a front in front of other people). So it's not that I am being passive aggressive, I have told him the problem before. I make it obvious that there's something wrong, especially in front of other people, and you know with the ENFJs charm, everyone loves you (which I'm still not believing that we have that charm, but my peers have told me that a lot of people love you and look up to you as a leader). But anyway, not trying to backdoor brag or anything, these are more of what I see and observe what people told me. I think other ENFJs can attest to that statement. 

Moral of the story: if an ENFJ has confronted you about a problem, DO WHAT THEY SAY, IT'LL SAVE YOU FROM A LOT OF PAIN. Like many forums have said, it's one of the worst things you can do since it's true that we know your strengths and weaknesses and know how to work the social system. And if you did get an ENFJ pissed off, CONFRONT THEM UNTIL THEY SPEAK ABOUT IT!!! GET THE PROBLEM OFF YOUR BACK!!!

My best friends have been on my bad side before, and they know it's not fun. The good thing is that they know to confront me when I'm mad at them. :happy: I sort of copied and pasted some stuff from this forum and other forums, and they laughed because they know it's all true. 

So yes, we have the power to do good, at least majority of us. When there's two ENFJs in the same table for dinner, it's a night of love and fighting to pay the bill since you know both ENFJs would be too giving and wanting to do so. A person who I look up to is an ENFJ, and he and his family have been amazing. 

Again, most ENFJs are good, just don't piss us off. :happy:


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## NateK314

Haha yep pretty much! But actually ENFJs can be very confrontational. We only sweep small problems under the rug, but thats what really separates me from my best friends whos and INFJ. Shed rather ignore all the issues and Id rather work it out. Then theres some ppl like my ISTJ father or ISFJ sister that no matter what I say they dont seem to be able to see from my angle and relate. I blame their first mode Si. Anyway thanks for your post and Im the same way, very confrontational. And I think the most evil thing we'll do is if you dont let us at least talk to you, we will try to work the social system until it excludes you which actually is kind of cruel when you think about it. But yeah Ive some that before. My other ENFJ friend started to ignore me so I started becoming friends with all his friends until he was like "since when are you friends with all of these ppl" and Im like "idk".


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## roxasquall

HAHA....I am the same way...if they try to ignore me or if they don't want me to talk to them, I try to work around the social system as well, and I think I've done a good job showing everyone else how exclusive he is and how he does things for himself, and showing hints to people of how much of an arse he is. So @NateK314, I resonate your ways of doing things. I don't know if you have dealt with ESFPs, but yeah it's my fault I raised him in popularity with my colleagues, so my job now is to bring him down. I think I'm doing a good job since I've been showing people that everything he does is only for his resume. I also helped him get his name out there, which I shouldn't have, so I brought someone up for no reason. Essentially from my point of view, he used me. He never made any effort with me, so I'm trying to destroy him. I know all his weaknesses and I hope to succeed in overthrowing/taking him down.


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## AirDarkling

Personally don't feel as if I, as an INFJ, am all that alike to ENFJs. In fact, I tend to find them very annoying, demanding, and incapable of a heartfelt or even intelligent conversation. The E tends to piss me off in general after awhile.. But you'll never know. INFJs are actually pretty secretive about their feelings and wouldn't just openly tell you, unless they've worked pretty hard at not being walked all over..


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## NateK314

AirDarkling said:


> Personally don't feel as if I, as an INFJ, am all that alike to ENFJs. In fact, I tend to find them very annoying, demanding, and incapable of a heartfelt or even intelligent conversation. The E tends to piss me off in general after awhile.. But you'll never know. INFJs are actually pretty secretive about their feelings and wouldn't just openly tell you, unless they've worked pretty hard at not being walked all over..


Ouch! Are you sure you're an INFJ? Because I have 6 INFJ friends and none of them would ever say anything that rude to someone they don't even know let alone just met. All I know is every INFJ I know thinks we're alike and my INFJ best friend (DEFINITELY an introvert) tells me everything. 

Com'on man, have a little manners this thread was partly a fun joke. Something you'd understand if you were actually an INFJ. Frankly I think you've mistyped yourself, cause you're definitely not a feeler and no NF or decent human being I know would be so rude to say that ENFJ's can't have an intelligent conversation.


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## AirDarkling

Nat4 said:


> Ouch! Are you sure you're an INFJ? Because I have 6 INFJ friends and none of them would ever say anything that rude to someone they don't even know let alone just met. All I know is every INFJ I know thinks we're alike and my INFJ best friend (DEFINITELY an introvert) tells me everything.
> 
> Com'on man, have a little manners this thread was partly a fun joke. Something you'd understand if you were actually an INFJ. Frankly I think you've mistyped yourself, cause you're definitely not a feeler and no NF or decent human being I know would be so rude to say that ENFJ's can't have an intelligent conversation.


1. I get sick of being nice all the time, so I can slip into bouts of insensitivity.
2. Lots of stress
3. Bad experiences with lots of extroverts.
4. I know I'm an INFJ. Have constantly typed myself for the past two years. I just have strengthened my lower functions and go into a bit of a dark mode.

The ENFJs that I've met are more manipulating than I could ever be.. And once I've been hurt, I don't forgive.

Sorry to come off a little cold..


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## AirDarkling

Nat4 said:


> Ouch! Are you sure you're an INFJ? Because I have 6 INFJ friends and none of them would ever say anything that rude to someone they don't even know let alone just met. All I know is every INFJ I know thinks we're alike and my INFJ best friend (DEFINITELY an introvert) tells me everything.
> 
> Com'on man, have a little manners this thread was partly a fun joke. Something you'd understand if you were actually an INFJ. Frankly I think you've mistyped yourself, cause you're definitely not a feeler and no NF or decent human being I know would be so rude to say that ENFJ's can't have an intelligent conversation.


1. I get sick of being nice all the time, so I can slip into bouts of insensitivity.
2. Lots of stress
3. Bad experiences with lots of extroverts.
4. I know I'm an INFJ. Have constantly typed myself for the past two years. I just have strengthened my lower functions and go into a bit of a dark mode.

The ENFJs that I've met are more manipulating than I could ever be.. And once I've been hurt, I don't forgive.

Sorry to come off a little cold..


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## Aquarian

NateK314 said:


> Ouch! Are you sure you're an INFJ? Because I have 6 INFJ friends and none of them would ever say anything that rude to someone they don't even know let alone just met. All I know is every INFJ I know thinks we're alike and my INFJ best friend (DEFINITELY an introvert) tells me everything.
> 
> Com'on man, have a little manners this thread was partly a fun joke. Something you'd understand if you were actually an INFJ. Frankly I think you've mistyped yourself, cause you're definitely not a feeler and no NF or decent human being I know would be so rude to say that ENFJ's can't have an intelligent conversation.


I find this response really quite nasty. For a lot of reasons, including the logic chain here that yields some pretty ugly typism:

"Frankly I think you've mistyped yourself, cause you're definitely not a feeler and no NF *or decent human being* I know would be so rude to say that ENFJ's can't have an intelligent conversation."

Feelers/NFs are NOT synonymous with "decent human being." For shame. And as you're addressing the question of intelligent conversation, perhaps you might try actually _having_ one here.


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## Shapaha

Aquarian said:


> I find this response really quite nasty. For a lot of reasons, including the logic chain here that yields some pretty ugly typism:
> 
> "Frankly I think you've mistyped yourself, cause you're definitely not a feeler and no NF *or decent human being* I know would be so rude to say that ENFJ's can't have an intelligent conversation."
> 
> Feelers/NFs are NOT synonymous with "decent human being." For shame. And as you're addressing the question of intelligent conversation, perhaps you might try actually _having_ one here.


You're right, just because Hitler was an INFJ doesn't mean all INFJ's are like Hitler.
Typism is not a good thing.


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## AirDarkling

My intention was not to hurt any feelings, but more to let my introvert side down and actually share my thoughts, somewhere that you ENFJs have more of an advantage. INFJs just can not do that with anyone, it's against our nature. I said the part about intelligent conversation, because all extroverts but some ENFPs I've met talk about is how much they hate certain people for no reason at all, feel the need to make fun of random people, or are just all around inappropriate..


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## Amacey

Ectoplasm said:


> I tend to find the "dark side" of the NFJ to be the disposition towards unfounded paranoia which parades itself through farcical and hilarious displays. I've seen some INFJs claim not to trust my type (INFP) because they suspect us to have an ulterior motive due to the reservation of expressing internal feelings or values. Even if we did have an ulterior motive why would it be the annihilation or detriment of the NFJ? Do they think they are the eye of storm/center of events or something? I found myself mocking the stupidity of it all.
> 
> As well as seeming to be up their own asses, there is a seeming black-and-white victim mentality (with the NFJ being the "good guy" who is always being unfairly treated by the "bad people" coupled with an "I'm right and I know I'm right" attitude. All of which are also facepalm inducing moments.
> 
> The Fe usage can also become very saccharin and sickly which grates me to no end.
> 
> I suppose you're not all like that but I have no means to say either way.


That's complete bullshit I love INFPs even one of my best friends is one , personally I think INFPs choose to keep their feelings to themselves because they just like it that way or feel more comfortable or they are just private about it , it could be anything so I'm not gonna bother about it .:frustrating:


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## Highway Nights

Ectoplasm said:


> I tend to find the "dark side" of the NFJ to be the disposition towards unfounded paranoia which parades itself through farcical and hilarious displays. I've seen some INFJs claim not to trust my type (INFP) because they suspect us to have an ulterior motive due to the reservation of expressing internal feelings or values. Even if we did have an ulterior motive why would it be the annihilation or detriment of the NFJ? Do they think they are the eye of storm/center of events or something? I found myself mocking the stupidity of it all.
> 
> As well as seeming to be up their own asses, there is a seeming black-and-white victim mentality (with the NFJ being the "good guy" who is always being unfairly treated by the "bad people" coupled with an "I'm right and I know I'm right" attitude. All of which are also facepalm inducing moments.
> 
> The Fe usage can also become very saccharin and sickly which grates me to no end.
> 
> I suppose you're not all like that but I have no means to say either way.


This rings very true, and I've been on the receiving end of this. One time they said, and I quote "The world doesn't deserve me".

A while back, I was curious as to what types tend to buy into nutty conspiracy theories the most, so I looked through several typing related threads on those sort of sites. It was page after page after page of xxNJs, especially INFJs and INTJS. I wouldn't be surprised if this sort of thinking could also creep into social situations in unhealthy cases.


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## visionaryspirit

Ectoplasm said:


> As well as seeming to be up their own asses, there is a seeming black-and-white victim mentality (with the NFJ being the "good guy" who is always being unfairly treated by the "bad people" coupled with an "I'm right and I know I'm right" attitude. All of which are also facepalm inducing moments.


I agree we can take ourselves too seriously at times. Most INFJs have been unfairly treated, judged, and misunderstood soo many times in our lives that I can understand why some continue to have the good guy/bad guy mentality. As for the "I'm right and I know I'm right" attitude, it's a result of consistently doubting our intuition and following what someones else says or does, only to realize in the end that our intuition was right all along.

Those facepalm inducing moments you speak of. There's been times where I'd be telling friends something, and because they aren't able to process or understand what I'm saying in that moment, I'll get face palmed or not taken seriously. You know what ends up happening a few weeks, months, or a year later? They suddenly begin to realize "Oh, he was actually right."


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## RoadRunnerz

Ni can be pure evil when overloaded....they go after pockets of negativity in their environment...


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## TONY T

O wouldn 't waste my time tryning to toy with people who had pissed me off; Thye simply cease to exist, become invisible. That is alwasy my (INFJ) solution to anyone becoming unbearable, so I am inclined to think the OP may apply more to ENFJs?


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## Moogles

Well...evil is putting it a bit strongly or maybe mildly...guess it depends on the point of view.

I have hurt so many people intentionally and unintentionally, both deserving and innocent.

When I was younger, that was never the case. I was described as innocent, lovable, introverted, extremely quiet, friendly, blah blah blah. Okay...there was one incident I can remember from grade 3...i think that girl(woman by now if she's alive) still hates me. Now that I really start to think about it...quite a few..oops...hahaha. Now the few friends I keep will describe me as 'evil', yes I said it, or even dangerously malicious to others when crossed. Don't know exactly when and where the transformation happened, but life is not your friend, neither are the people in it. I always feel so surprised to see their reactions when they talk about my 'wrath' or getting on my wrong side....say what??? I have enough love, patience and forgiveness to share with the whole world and to spare!

But that is just a side of many I have. Think I have a pain meter and when the limit is reached, which is miraculous in itself, people get hurt by me, badly. I use all their insecurities and shortcomings against them in the most hurtful manner I can get at that emotional time. 

Not something I am proud of at all. I have mended a few executions, but I can see and feel their pain often and it will haunt me always.

That won't stop me from any future executions I'll be delivering, but at least I have learned to be more aware of my actions and when not to whip out the mentally destructive scythe. That was the person before I took my personality type more seriously.

That being said...I have learned and tested execution by my hand without me being directly involved and yet being the source of the hammer falling. I'm proud of my development and also ashamed.


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## Puntje

I actually... never really.. get that mad. 

And I'm starting to feel a bit like a weirdo after reading all this. XD


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## Moogles

Puntje said:


> I actually... never really.. get that mad.
> 
> And I'm starting to feel a bit like a weirdo after reading all this. XD


I think it all depends on our own personal life experiences. I can't close the veil anymore..or don't want to, to be honest. luckily I only 'snap' when i can't take the pain anymore, and I have a pretty good grip on it.


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## Adonnus

I can certainly relate a lot of what's been said here to my own experiences, specifically with a particularly mental INFJ. And especially the paranoia, the suspicion, the coldness, the venom, the narcissism...basically a whole load of tiring horseshit I don't have to deal with in anyone else.

Any advice on how to tell this person that everything that they've said is completely and utterly wrong and to actually make them understand that fact, apologise and come around? To be clear I don't dislike the person themselves. But their words I find pretty despicable.


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## Soft_Sound

@NateK314

Yeah, I suspect my mom might be an ENFJ. "I'm right and I know it", so I had to mess with her, "give me a quarter every time you are wrong". She finally realized she is _not_ always right. Though, granted she is right pretty often...

I can easily ruffle her feathers, but I hold back because I know she isn't against a kick in the face.

When she loses her temper she _demands_ I tell her this or express some emotion to that and I'm always still trying to figure out my own emotions. It becomes very hard to figure out my emotions when someone else is upset because I have too much going through my head and find it hard to talk which _really_ frustrates her and she starts to suspect all this stuff (I'm not willing to help or whatever, the world is going to end because the food is ready yet or we are lost, and I have the map, should I turn here or not?) and here I am trying to figure out a way to calm her down and augh... I've gotten better, I figured out, I need to take away the decision for her, or tell it it's okay because of.... Doesn't always work but it certainly helps. She will later apologize for cursing me out but also said I should have helped her before then, she gave me plenty of warning....

I feel like she can't really manipulate me per say so I question if she really is an ENFJ, honestly she seems pretty bad at social events and misses all these unspoken things going on, but she thinks she _really _gets people. *Sigh... She at least can understand sometimes something happened that she missed, I tend to fill her in...She also struggles with symbols and doublespeak, so meh...

Granted it's good that she will drag me to stuff and tries very hard to build me up. But gah, that temper.

Ya know, I never thought of her as honest, but I can't imagine her telling a lie unless it was related to some sort of card game where you need to tell lies. She can get pretty competitive. She is pretty honest and is happy to criticize/give you some input, no matter if you want it or not.

I think people are mixed on how nice she is though so I'm still not sure about the ENFJ thing either. She is still popular though and known to get work done, but she also a little too happy to voice her opinion. But she will always go out of her way for you.


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## Kyusaku

TONY T said:


> O wouldn 't waste my time tryning to toy with people who had pissed me off; Thye simply cease to exist, become invisible. That is alwasy my (INFJ) solution to anyone becoming unbearable, so I am inclined to think the OP may apply more to ENFJs?


Everyone can be a pain in the ass, and 90% of the time you aren't even aware of it. What people fail to recognize is that this is the way of life, you constantly interact and push others around, it's not evil but simply impossible to avoid.


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## Wishful

I am incredibly forgiving of others. I am not, however, concerned with the "political correctness" of putting up with others bullshit. If you offend me once, I'll probably let it you know and let it go. Maybe that "first offense" can extend to several offenses. It takes repeated offenses towards me, my values, and those around me to really cross that line I have.

But once you cross, you can never go back. 

There are things I know that even I didn't know about you, secrets, insecurities... and if you cross my line I will use ALL of those to make my point clear. You are in the wrong. And you will suffer for making others suffer. My sense of justice is suddenly more important than mercy. Every word you say I will tear apart. I don't care if you say you didn't mean it. That it wasn't personal. Because it just got personal, and you shouldn't mess with fire simply because it hasn't burned you before.

Just because you've never seen me angry doesn't mean I can't be. Just because I've always been forgiving or understand in the past doesn't mean I will continue to be. When I warn you to back down, you had better back down.

Only two people have crossed that line of mine to date. They both regret it. They both avoid me. They both know better than to even approach me. I don't remember the things I said (heat of the moment) but they both cried. A girl and a guy. DO NOT think you can get away with constantly berating me, those I care about, and infringing on the values of others because your bull**** opinion is godly and worth more than someone else's feelings on multiple occasions. That is unforgiveable.

It's not pretty, but on most occasions I am a very pleasant person. So do not judge the NFJs by the rare occasions that lines are crossed. But also, don't go crossing those lines.


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## ann4

If you hurt me, you cease to exist. 
That I have A LOT of patience doesn't mean I don't have a limit and if you cross it, you burn.
I can be incredibly cold sometimes and can turn my Fe to Fi just to avoid being hurt by and hurt others.
If I let you in and you break stuff, I won't be the only broken thing.
Summarizing: I'm very temperamental and forceful, but very patient, so don't mess with me only because I'm very empathic and patient, 'cause I have a limit too.


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## TheDarknessInTheSnow

I'm an ISFJ and I'm just as honest as you are. I have Fe so I obviously work with your feelings, but I don't sugarcoat, and I also know exactly what to say to get under your skin. 

Having said that, I think ENFJs are a diverse group. There's the ones with really obviously fake Fe yet their intentions are good, the more honest and raw ones, and finally the ones who misuse Fe to get what they want and are superficial, selfish and mean (God forbid they use Fe positively on people other than their cherished loved ones).


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## Vahyavishdapaya

Why do people always pick on Hitler like a bad INFJ, have you ever seen his speeches? He was a master at oration. Your average INFJ is not going to have anywhere near that level of skill, he was not an ordinary average type of person and I think it's totally fallacious to use people like that to make assumptions about types. If INFJs can be like Hitler they can be genius polymaths like Plato, or heroes like Trotsky; too. How unrealistic is that! These sorts of people are once in a lifetime, you can't use them as a yardstick to measure or comment on the average.


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## Silastar

> I find ENFJ's and INFJ's to be extremely honest and blunt. My INFJ friend and I are incredibly similar we're almost perfectly similar except I'm a little more outgoing hense the 'E'.


I never noticed this in any xNFJ. Ever. Usually Fi are more blunt and honest than FJs, who at best mitigate what they want to say. At worst, they often cover what they think and attempt to manipulate other people!

While I appreciate and admire blunt speeches, they are not my stuff unless I already know I can speak my mind with a very special individual. Blunt speeches are more Fi land (TJ or FP) than Fe.
I have an ENFJ friend that is highly manipulative towards an ISTJ I know. Personally, this is a trait I detest in immature NFJs. I truly hope I never come out as that ignoble. But I didn't call her out on that, why? Because by doing so I would only increase a tension which would not solve anything (they are too close to each other) and potentially severe a connection I have with them. So I wait a while, analyze the situation, think of the best way to approach the issue and after a day or two I speak to her alone, telling her that she shouldn't behave like that. Before speaking, I have considered why she would behave like that (Ni) and the results of my interference in her behavior (Fe).

Nevertheless... While I am not a manipulative individual, I more often than not refrain from speaking my mind if I might hurt someone's feeling in an uncalled way. If I am speaking my mind, I either believe she/he is a special individual mature enough to understand my line of thought or someone that needs honesty and truth. But these people are rare, hence my need for significative relationships. 

Most of the time I give a more generic message without adressing myself directly. I can be blunt only when my values are called on the board; when I find something which goes against the very nature of what I value. Otherwise I mitigate what I have to say. INFPs and ENFPs often support me a lot in this. But yes, I always try to be direct even if I conceal the main issue. I realize this may come across as a paradox. But I believe the capacity to mantain balanced relationships and at the same time remaining true to oneself (integrity) is important. For example, if I dislike a conversation others are enjoying I wont say it aloud but might enter in an other conversation with an individual which is not as entertained. If everyone else is entertained... I get bored but let them finish, unfortunately. But I'll go places to defend my indipendence if it is called into question. Or if I feel drained - as in, tired - I will say it aloud and ask them for some personal space. Unfortunately... this is something many people misinterpret.


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## Solar Wizard

Taj Badalandabad said:


> I think it's totally fallacious to use people like that to make assumptions about types.


Well said. I think it's generally uncool to make any assumptions about any types as people of the same type have their own flexible personality and differences. Just because two people are INFJ it doesn't mean they have similar values and world views.

Even the way they react to annoying people is different as I've heard some roast the person if they are annoyed whereas more forgiving ones would keep up with it to an extent eventually ignoring the said person, rendering him/her invisible.


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## Rozy96

I think it depends on how u use your intuition. If youre healthy or not. My coworker was a very manipulative enfj but im an infj and saw through it. I could be manipulative too if i want to. I could be harsh and direct. I notice things i could be mean about and twist things my way but i dont do that i dont believe in ever doing that. I usemy intuition differently and would rather understand others and accept them than use what i know to mislead them. But i think were guilty of manipulating people in a good way and i aint gonna get into that but i think other infjs might get me


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## Felix5

So you want to manipulate, but you don't want to be manipulated. I find this to be the greatest paradox of the ENFJ. You want to be liked, (and you exude that) but in doing so, you make it very difficult for someone to say..."hey I don't like what you did right there." 

You're forgiving, but you shut people out. You love people, but they become unlovable to you. Isn't the point of unconditional love, to love a person no matter how irritating or grating they are at a particular moment? ENFJs can be wonderful people and they can be horrible people.

ENFJs can be extremely unforgiving of other people even when they make the same mistakes. A part of me fears you because I know that you have the infinite capacity to destroy my shell and my sensitive INTJ inner emotional self. Yet a part of me desires nothing but the warmth you exuded. 

As an INTJ, I definitely see through you, see your dark side and feel even more drawn to you.


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## principesa

Felix5 said:


> So you want to manipulate, but you don't want to be manipulated. I find this to be the greatest paradox of the ENFJ. You want to be liked, (and you exude that) but in doing so, you make it very difficult for someone to say..."hey I don't like what you did right there."
> 
> You're forgiving, but you shut people out. You love people, but they become unlovable to you. Isn't the point of unconditional love, to love a person no matter how irritating or grating they are at a particular moment? ENFJs can be wonderful people and they can be horrible people.
> 
> ENFJs can be extremely unforgiving of other people even when they make the same mistakes. A part of me fears you because I know that you have the infinite capacity to destroy my shell and my sensitive INTJ inner emotional self. Yet a part of me desires nothing but the warmth you exuded.
> 
> As an INTJ, I definitely see through you, see your dark side and feel even more drawn to you.


This is spot on! Words of wisdom. Please continue


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