# I don't know if I'm gay, bi, trans or depressed, and I need help in deciding.



## 45130 (Aug 26, 2012)

wxns said:


> I thought I was gay since a few years from when I started watching porn. I started watching porn from around 7 or 8 out of curiosity even though I knew I shouldn't do it (thanks to this porn ad that popped up randomly while I was on YouTube (YES, I was using IE, because that was pretty much the only browser that anyone had back in those days, really); since then, I've been caught once or twice watching porn). After watching lesbian porn for three years, I started to get bored of it until I came across trans porn, and masturbated to it (the first time I came, and I didn't know how to prior to that even though I got erections from around 8 years old). After briefly watching trans porn, I just somehow got a little more and more into gay porn (partly, I think, because I was making myself get into it just to check if I was into gay porn or I felt I was a creep to girls), because normal straight porn and even lesbian porn became boring and predictable.



Read this through, it might help you decide... or confuse you even more. Are Sexual Tastes Immutable? | Your Brain On Porn


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## Shroud Shifter (Sep 9, 2015)

Lucifel said:


> If you have trouble and think you're trans why not contact a doctor about it?


I would imagine real transsexuals are not on the fence with it. From what I've read, they've known it from early childhood in some level. So I would throw that question out of the window if it needs to be asked at all.


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## Aya the Abysswalker (Mar 23, 2012)

Shroud Shifter said:


> I would imagine real transsexuals are not on the fence with it. From what I've read, they've known it from early childhood in some level. So I would throw that question out of the window if it needs to be asked at all.


If he wants to transition he still needs to see a doctor. I think it would worth specially if he is really depressed or has gender dysphoria.
It is true they know it from early childhood in some cases, but I am dating a transperson and a doctor was still necessary for him to start to process.
Besides his depression might be connect to his gender dysphoria and pin pointing ot rather than letting wander around is much better.


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## Strayfire (Jun 26, 2010)

Shroud Shifter said:


> I would imagine real transsexuals are not on the fence with it. From what I've read, they've known it from early childhood in some level. So I would throw that question out of the window if it needs to be asked at all.


Real life is usually a bit more messy than the clinical diagnosis in the DSM. 

While it's true that the classical narrative of a transsexual is someone who knows adamantly that they are trans, there is probably a wide gradation of "seriousness" or "severity" of trans. 

Firstly uncertainty is a very natural thing to feel. I get uncertainty when I walk into a shop to buy a new phone - it's a commitment to use that phone for at least 2 years, hoping that everything in the phone - the camera, the battery the OS and apps are all good enough for you. Some people instinctively already know "Hmm ok, I know I NEED the iPhone 6S... or a Lumia 640... or a Galaxy S6..." that's not me. For those in the gradation of trans, deciding feels a million times worse than finding the right phone and a professional help can be a huge help. 

Secondly exposure to new ideas might trigger the desire to transition and that's not entirely a negative thing. Prior to my second year of university I had no idea that transitioning was even possible. Just sitting there in the lecture theatre hearing this completely blew my mind and opened me up to thinking about transition because I didn't even think it was possible! Bridging this to the phone analogy - in 2007 the first iPhone totally blew everyone's mind because it redefined how people used phones. 

Thirdly uncertainty doesn't mean that transition won't be beneficial to some people. Way back I remember how people with their Blackberries would go on about how the iPhone (and smartphones) were just a fad and how they'd never buy one themselves. Eventually most did, as the capabilities of smartphones grew and they learnt more about the functions. Conversely transition for the sake of transition is rarely beneficial. I told my friend about how much I loved my Windows Phone. He bought one. Threw it away almost instantly. Just be careful.

Ultimately you need to be careful about what decision you make. Choosing to transition is a much bigger commitment. It doesn't have to be today, tomorrow or next year that you make up your mind.

I'd advise professional help to assist (but not dictate) your choice. You need to have as much information as you can reasonably obtain to make the decision. This includes "trying it out" in the same way you'd try out a phone in the store. Try dressing up like a girl first, see how that makes you feel. If that's all you want (like me) then there's no point in transitioning. If you feel like you need to take further steps, you might need Gender Reassignment Surgery. 

Think about it like this: Some people just need a mobile phone... like a classic Nokia. Some people want a smartphone. Both are valid options. 



Lucifel said:


> If he wants to transition he still needs to see a doctor. I think it would worth specially if he is really depressed or has gender dysphoria.
> It is true they know it from early childhood in some cases, but I am dating a transperson and a doctor was still necessary for him to start to process.
> Besides his depression might be connect to his gender dysphoria and pin pointing ot rather than letting wander around is much better.


Agreed. We can't rule out transition for him though, if he feels the need to.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

StrayRoomba said:


> Secondly exposure to new ideas might trigger the desire to transition and that's not entirely a negative thing. Prior to my second year of university I had no idea that transitioning was even possible. Just sitting there in the lecture theatre hearing this completely blew my mind and opened me up to thinking about transition because I didn't even think it was possible! Bridging this to the phone analogy - in 2007 the first iPhone totally blew everyone's mind because it redefined how people used phones.


Yeah, I think I just learned about androgyny and being trans on the web. Before that, I was somewhat ashamed to have been caught crossdressing by my parents, although I was made to wear a dress for a photo my aunt and grandmother took (for giggles, but embarrassing for me and my brother). I did say at one point on how I wanted to be a girl in my childhood, and I wanted to get to talk to some girls also. I was curious as to how it felt to wear a skirt and not have a penis and testicles (I was given a pair of dungarees once and it chafed down there). never knew that people could change their genders at all.



StrayRoomba said:


> I'd advise professional help to assist (but not dictate) your choice. You need to have as much information as you can reasonably obtain to make the decision. This includes "trying it out" in the same way you'd try out a phone in the store. Try dressing up like a girl first, see how that makes you feel. If that's all you want (like me) then there's no point in transitioning. If you feel like you need to take further steps, you might need Gender Reassignment Surgery.
> 
> Think about it like this: Some people just need a mobile phone... like a classic Nokia. Some people want a smartphone. Both are valid options.


By that logic in the last paragraph, I'd just need a better self-esteem, but I don't really like the traditional expressions of being a guy. It's like me wanting a motorbike that has the practicality of a car without fitting a sidecar or other accessories, wanting to develop a high quality game entirely in Python, or wanting a new Nokia feature phone that can run Java apps and games. No thanks to society and 2010s trends, I can't seem to escape that without being deemed "trans" and hence I'd be seen to need surgery.

I don't know, but I probably just hate myself because I'm a little overweight. I used to be anorexic until I gave in to my parents saying I needed to eat more; I felt like my thighs, calves and belly were too big during that stage (and still do) despite two guys (who were straight) complimenting my body. At the same time, however, I can't seem to stand the hairstyles, voices and the accents of some of the guys I come across where I live, and it makes me think having a deep voice is intimidating. 

I was raised with some kind uncles, although I wasn't really intrigued by their slightly fat hairy bodies (sometimes they'd be shirtless because we lived in a hot country), although, in hindsight, it'd be a bit weird at the same time if they shaved that all off or something.

On to the point with how the guys around me sound, I don't like British accents that much, at least the sort Ed Sheeran speaks, because I had bad experiences with people who spoke in this way. I managed to get rid most of the accent after watching one or two films and I aspired to sound like Amanda Bynes, because I thought she was badass.

I've been thinking of getting a psychological referral or something but only as long as I have better autonomy than what I have right now i.e. being able to go out when I want because I'd have my own source of income and would be at uni when I can spend most of the time independently studying or doing what I want or need to.

To be fair, I might hate being a guy because I felt like I didn't experience boyhood well enough, as my parents wanted me to try and study in my spare time (even though the Web in those days wouldn't have a lot of stuff for kids to browse that could be educational and easy for them to understand) and I started puberty WAY TOO EARLY. I got erections, facial hair (which people kept pointing out), mood swings, a deeper voice and smelly armpits between the ages of 8 and 10. My growth spurt stopped at 13 (or I just stopped sleeping at appropriate times) so I stopped being the tallest boy in the class around Year 7 or 8. I could have been pushed into responsibility too early, and I feel like being a girl might excuse me of some of this.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> You're making things more complicated than it really is.
> 
> Trans people don't realise they're trans because they're envious of what the opposite gender wears


Incorrect. A lot of trans people do realize they are trans because they experience envy or long to express their identity by utilizing objects associated with the sex they identify with. It can be clothes, toys, friends etc., because it seems to make more sense or "click" better, mentally speaking, to be that way.



Shroud Shifter said:


> I would imagine real transsexuals are not on the fence with it. From what I've read, they've known it from early childhood in some level. So I would throw that question out of the window if it needs to be asked at all.


There is no such thing as a "real" transsexual. This narrative is complete bunk. There are transsexuals who realize from a young age, and there are those who realize in their adolescence, and there are those who realize it as adults.


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## Purple Skies (Aug 31, 2015)

Entropic said:


> Incorrect. A lot of trans people do realize they are trans because they experience envy or long to express their identity by utilizing objects associated with the sex they identify with. It can be clothes, toys, friends etc., because it seems to make more sense or "click" better, mentally speaking, to be that way.


They don't realise they're a transsexual solely based on envying clothes was my point. They must have some desire to actually *be* that gender, not just -'Oh, I wish I could wear a dress and not be judged for it, I wish I could wear make up etc''. That's probably leaning more towards a cross dresser.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> They don't realise they're a transsexual solely based on envying clothes was my point. They must have some desire to actually *be* that gender, not just -'Oh, I wish I could wear a dress and not be judged for it, I wish I could wear make up etc''. That's probably leaning more towards a cross dresser.


Ok, no offense, but are you transgender or otherwise an active spokesperson for the trans experience? Also, crossdressers are a part of the trans movement too. To be a crossdresser is also a form of a transgender experience though they are not transsexuals and do not necessarily perform a medical transition.


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## yet another intj (Feb 10, 2013)




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## Purple Skies (Aug 31, 2015)

Entropic said:


> Ok, no offense, but are you transgender or otherwise an active spokesperson for the trans experience? Also, crossdressers are a part of the trans movement too. To be a crossdresser is also a form of a transgender experience though they are not transsexuals and do not necessarily perform a medical transition.


I don't need to be a spokesperson to have common sense. To be a transsexual is to feel like the opposite sex, correct? From what I've read, the OP didn't state he wanted to be a girl, or felt like one, just that he envied the type of clothing that women can wear without being judged for it. I even remember reading another thread of his where he said he doesn't like the fashion for men now (baggy clothing), he wished they were as stylish as women's fashion. So why on earth would I jump to conclusion and think he wants to be a girl when all he has talked about is clothes? I'm a girl who likes men clothing, I usually flick through men magazine and like to browse the men's section in a clothing store, so am I a transgender? No I'm not. And I don't need a ''spokesperson'' to tell me otherwise. Now I can go ahead and wear boyish clothes as a lot of girls do, the same isn't true for men (who want to wear more feminine clothing) which is why I'm assuming he is frustrated, there's a certain level of double standards. 

You said it yourself, a cross dresser isn't a transsexual. They don't _want_ to be women. Whether they are part of the movement is irrelevant. So my point still stands valid that he could be a cross dresser. (Unless of course he comes forth and provides more information in terms of feeling like the opposite sex).


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> I don't need to be a spokesperson to have common sense. To be a transsexual is to feel like the opposite sex, correct? From what I've read, the OP didn't state he wanted to be a girl, or felt like one, just that he envied the type of clothing that women can wear without being judged for it. I even remember reading another thread of his where he said he doesn't like the fashion for men now (baggy clothing), he wished they were as stylish as women's fashion. So why on earth would I jump to conclusion and think he wants to be a girl when all he has talked about is clothes? I'm a girl who likes men clothing, I usually flick through men magazine and like to browse the men's section in a clothing store, so am I a transgender? No I'm not. And I don't need a ''spokesperson'' to tell me otherwise. Now I can go ahead and where boyish clothes as a lot of girls do, the same isn't true for men which is why I'm assuming he is frustrated, there's a certain level of double standards.
> 
> You said it yourself, a cross dresser isn't a transsexual. They don't _want_ to be women. Whether they are part of the movement is irrelevant. So my point still stands valid that he could be a cross dresser. (Unless of course he comes forth and provides more information in terms of feeling like the opposite sex).


So if I get you right, you think you are entitled to speak for the trans experience just because "it's common sense", without you yourself being a trans person and therefore have no access to what it is like to be a trans person? You are applying _your_ experiences on the OP's but not just that; you make a generalized statement and assume your experiences are true for a group of people whose experiences you do not share. It is extremely arrogant, to say the least. 

For one thing, if you actually bothered to speak to many people who are diagnosed as TS (this isn't a very distinct definition btw, as anyone who seeks medical transition will ultimately receive the diagnosis, including non-binaries and genderqueer), you will see that many did report an envy towards being able to have access to or express their gender identity in ways that they felt was off limits to them e.g. wear dresses if they later came out as MTxs. Part of how they figured out that they were trans is precisely because of that felt sense of envy, because they repressed their other feelings. 

And no, a crossdresser isn't a transsexual but they _are_ transgender. You changed your vocabulary to equalize transgender with transsexual; they are not equivalent. This is what you wrote, initially:



> Trans people don't realise they're trans because they're envious of what the opposite gender wears


By definition, this includes crossdressers.


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## Strayfire (Jun 26, 2010)

Luna Medlock said:


> I don't need to be a spokesperson to have common sense. To be a transsexual is to feel like the opposite sex, correct? From what I've read, the OP didn't state he wanted to be a girl, or felt like one, just that he envied the type of clothing that women can wear without being judged for it. I even remember reading another thread of his where he said he doesn't like the fashion for men now (baggy clothing), he wished they were as stylish as women's fashion. So why on earth would I jump to conclusion and think he wants to be a girl when all he has talked about is clothes? I'm a girl who likes men clothing, I usually flick through men magazine and like to browse the men's section in a clothing store, so am I a transgender? No I'm not. And I don't need a ''spokesperson'' to tell me otherwise. Now I can go ahead and wear boyish clothes as a lot of girls do, the same isn't true for men (who want to wear more feminine clothing) which is why I'm assuming he is frustrated, there's a certain level of double standards.


It's about examining the motivations behind the thinking. 

A desire to wear girl's clothes might be motivated by a genuine interest in the aesthetic quality of girl's clothes.

But there's also a possibility that they want to wear these clothes in order to feel female. Perhaps both.

Sometimes people won't be honest and frank with you - there's a certain shame to admitting these things...



Luna Medlock said:


> You said it yourself, a cross dresser isn't a transsexual. They don't _want_ to be women. Whether they are part of the movement is irrelevant. So my point still stands valid that he could be a cross dresser. (Unless of course he comes forth and provides more information in terms of feeling like the opposite sex).


Depends on the cross-dresser. 

Some cross-dress to temporarily be female.

There's a high social and medical cost to transitioning and not everyone is willing to have surgery or afford it.


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## Purple Skies (Aug 31, 2015)

Entropic said:


> So if I get you right, you think you are entitled to speak for the trans experience just because "it's common sense", without you yourself being a trans person and therefore have no access to what it is like to be a trans person? You are applying _your_ experiences on the OP's but not just that; you make a generalized statement and assume your experiences are true for a group of people whose experiences you do not share. It is extremely arrogant, to say the least.


I'm not speaking for them, I go by what was written by the OP. 

''I feel like I'm unappreciated as a guy. I also have a feeling guys can't be feminine unless they're gay, bi or closet transwomen even to this day when we're more accepting of these sort of people than before; I have a feeling it's because of these stupid quiffs that guys have to look like men again, when I reckon guys in the 2000s and probably as far back as the 1980s could have gotten away with looking almost like a girl because long hair was in back then. Again, from Tumblr, I found out that many of the guys with long hair there were usually gay or bi.''

I'm not one to assume, maybe you are. From this I gathered that he likes feminine clothes and wishes he could wear it without people thinking he's gay, bi or trans. Could he be a transsexual? Yes, that's a possibility and it's not as though I ruled that out for him. But that's not what he wrote so there's an equal chance he is or he's not, who knows, no one but him. I'm not applying my experience to his, the reason I brought up my experience is because you're suggesting that someone can be a transsexual just from envying the opposite genders clothing and I used myself as an example to say that people can like opposite gender clothing without being trans therefore he could be like me (or not). 



Entropic said:


> For one thing, if you actually bothered to speak to many people who are diagnosed as TS (this isn't a very distinct definition btw, as anyone who seeks medical transition will ultimately receive the diagnosis, including non-binaries and genderqueer), you will see that many did report an envy towards being able to have access to or express their gender identity in ways that they felt was off limits to them e.g. wear dresses if they later came out as MTxs. Part of how they figured out that they were trans is precisely because of that felt sense of envy, because they repressed their other feelings.


That's valid, but again I'm going by what the OP said. The repressed feelings may be true to some, but why apply it to someone you don't know on a forum. If he is a trans, only he really knows it. I myself find the idea of supposedly being born as something, only to magically realise it later on in life preposterous. And you can say, well you're not a trans etc etc, So what? So now I have to be a trans to give my opinion? Should it be exclusively trans people who reply to the OP and anyone else who chips in is not worthy to talk on the issue? OK then. 





Entropic said:


> And no, a crossdresser isn't a transsexual but they _are_ transgender. You changed your vocabulary to equalize transgender with transsexual; they are not equivalent. This is what you wrote, initially:
> 
> 
> 
> By definition, this includes crossdressers.


Fair enough, I made a mistake on that one.


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## Playful Proxy (Feb 6, 2012)

Oh god, don't ever let _COGIATI _determine anything for you. That thing is the spawn of evil and inaccurate in sooooo many ways. Sexuality is something you figure out, gender is something that just kinda smacks you across the face one day and never leaves you alone. If you're trans, there'll come a day when you'll just know. Fwiw: people don't choose to be trans, they choose to transition (even though the only other options are suicide or having a pysch med you to hell on antidepressants and antianxiety meds until you're little more than the walking dead).


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> I'm not speaking for them, I go by what was written by the OP.
> 
> ''I feel like I'm unappreciated as a guy. I also have a feeling guys can't be feminine unless they're gay, bi or closet transwomen even to this day when we're more accepting of these sort of people than before; I have a feeling it's because of these stupid quiffs that guys have to look like men again, when I reckon guys in the 2000s and probably as far back as the 1980s could have gotten away with looking almost like a girl because long hair was in back then. Again, from Tumblr, I found out that many of the guys with long hair there were usually gay or bi.''
> 
> I'm not one to assume, maybe you are. From this I gathered that he likes feminine clothes and wishes he could wear it without people thinking he's gay, bi or trans. Could he be a transsexual? Yes, that's a possibility and it's not as though I ruled that out for him. But that's not what he wrote so there's an equal chance he is or he's not, who knows, no one but him. I'm not applying my experience to his, the reason I brought up my experience is because you're suggesting that someone can be a transsexual just from envying the opposite genders clothing and I used myself as an example to say that people can like opposite gender clothing without being trans therefore he could be like me (or not).


Even I suggested the OP seems more likely to be a crossdresser if they are trans; however, I wasn't so interested in understanding the OP in my original post to you. It was a correction of a statement you made where you drew inaccurate assumptions about the transsexual experience.



> That's valid, but again I'm going by what the OP said. The repressed feelings may be true to some, but why apply it to someone you don't know on a forum. If he is a trans, only he really knows it. I myself find the idea of supposedly being born as something, only to magically realise it later on in life preposterous. And you can say, well you're not a trans etc etc, So what? So now I have to be a trans to give my opinion? Should it be exclusively trans people who reply to the OP and anyone else who chips in is not worthy to talk on the issue? OK then.


Sure, but why does it give you the right to assume this experience is not a part of how transsexuals may experience their identity? That _is _the problem. My beef with you has nothing to do with the OP, my beef is how you label the experiences of a group of people whose experiences you are not privy to, and then assume this is how they experience things.


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## Purple Skies (Aug 31, 2015)

Entropic said:


> Even I suggested the OP seems more likely to be a crossdresser if they are trans; however, I wasn't so interested in understanding the OP in my original post to you. It was a correction of a statement you made where you drew inaccurate assumptions about the transsexual experience.
> 
> Sure, but why does it give you the right to assume this experience is not a part of how transsexuals may experience their identity? That _is _the problem. My beef with you has nothing to do with the OP, my beef is how you label the experiences of a group of people whose experiences you are not privy to, and then assume this is how they experience things.


I didn't assume, that's why I'm confused as to why we're having this convo. 

I really don't know why we're going back and forth. You seem to agree with me but at the same time want to call me out for whatever reason. Perhaps I didn't explain properly, when I said you can't be a transsexual solely on the fact you envy opposite gender clothing, I meant *solely*. Even if a person represses their feelings and doesn't realise as you said, that they're a transsexual -they don't fit my definition. Because there's something within them that possesses the desire to *be* and *live* as the opposite sex. It's much more than wanting to wear the opposite genders clothes. And only they can recognise this for themselves, not us. 

My conclusion is that the OP could and could not be a transsexual. He asked us for our opinion, I say he might be a cross dress from what I've read. But if he is keeping something to himself out of shame, then my answer is probably false. I can't be accounted for that though.


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## Playful Proxy (Feb 6, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> I myself find the idea of supposedly being born as something, only to magically realise it later on in life preposterous. And you can say, well you're not a trans etc etc, So what? So now I have to be a trans to give my opinion? Should it be exclusively trans people who reply to the OP and anyone else who chips in is not worthy to talk on the issue? OK then.


I'd just like to correct this. For what it's worth, when you're trans, it's not this loud echoing explosion of, "YOU'RE ACTUALLY A GIRL" in your head. It's a huge series of lots of different feelings and when you're little you don't understand why certain things upset you, you don't know why you hate looking at certain parts of your body or why you avoided making friends with boys or why you couldn't comprehend the idea of a male role model when teachers asked you about one. Being trans can be really difficult to come to terms with. When you're small, all you know is that everyone says you're a boy, you just assume you are because hey, adults haven't been wrong before (or so you thought), and that for some odd reason, you hated having the parts down there but may everyone else did too? For some odd reason, everything about puberty felt fundamentally wrong but once again, everyone from day 1 has said you were a boy and everyone hates puberty because it has loads of suck so maybe it's normal? It's small things like that which you keep telling yourself over and over again that even though a part of you 'wanted' to be something, you keep telling yourself you just arn't and will never be and there's no real choice (until it boils over years later and your hand gets forced).


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> I didn't assume, that's why I'm confused as to why we're having this convo.
> 
> I really don't know why we're going back and forth. You seem to agree with me but at the same time want to call me out for whatever reason. Perhaps I didn't explain properly, when I said you can't be a transsexual solely on the fact you envy opposite gender clothing, I meant *solely*. Even if a person represses their feelings and doesn't realise as you said, that they're a transsexual -they don't fit my definition. Because there's something within them that possesses the desire to *be* and *live* as the opposite sex. It's much more than wanting to wear the opposite genders clothes. And only they can recognise this for themselves, not us.
> 
> My conclusion is that the OP could and could not be a transsexual. He asked us for our opinion, I say he might be a cross dress from what I've read. But if he is keeping something to himself out of shame, then my answer is probably false. I can't be accounted for that though.


But why do you think you have the right to categorize someone else's experiences and thus also, what identity they perceive themselves to have on that, though? I'm not disagreeing with your analysis of the OP, but your presentation of the inner experiences of a transsexual. Yes, TS is more than seeking to crossdress, but a TS can also be a crossdresser too, simultaneously. The identities aren't even opposed. I mean, the tl;dr is that it's not that simple.


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## Purple Skies (Aug 31, 2015)

Entropic said:


> But why do you think you have the right to categorize someone else's experiences and thus also, what identity they perceive themselves to have on that, though? I'm not disagreeing with your analysis of the OP, but your presentation of the inner experiences of a transsexual. Yes, TS is more than seeking to crossdress, but a TS can also be a crossdresser too, simultaneously. The identities aren't even opposed. I mean, the tl;dr is that it's not that simple.


I'm frankly bored of your ramblings. You just want an argument just for the sake of having one since I'm not a ''spokesperson'' and you know all about trans people and their experiences. 

I said multiple times that only the person themselves truly knows what they are, so I'm not trying to school anyone about their identity, it's you who wants to school me on how to give my opinion cause you don't like the way I worded it. 

I stand by my statement that you can't be a transsexual solely based on the fact you like boy/girl clothing. Because if I was wrong, that would mean I'm a transsexual too. The thing that separates me from a trans is that they have a desire to be the opposite sex even if they don't realise it whereas I'm happy and content with being a girl and have always been.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Luna Medlock said:


> I'm frankly bored of your ramblings. You just want an argument just for the sake of having one since I'm not a ''spokesperson'' and you know all about trans people and their experiences.
> 
> I said multiple times that only the person themselves truly knows what they are, so I'm not trying to school anyone about their identity, it's you who wants to school me on how to give my opinion cause you don't like the way I worded it.
> 
> I stand by my statement that you can't be a transsexual solely based on the fact you like boy/girl clothing. Because if I was wrong, that would mean I'm a transsexual too. The thing that separates me from a trans is that they have a desire to be the opposite sex even if they don't realise it whereas I'm happy and content with being a girl and have always been.


Then please go back to what I wrote; it's not that simple. @Playful Proxy summarized it well, imo. It's not about seeking to have an argument for the sake of it; it ultimately boils down to that you invalidated my personal experiences of myself by what you wrote and I also know by experience not just mine, but also that of others', such as in this case Playful Proxy's. Yes, I'll school someone else on their opinions if those opinions are a) invalidating mine or that of others' experiences or b) are just plainly incorrect or biased.

Realizing you are transgender is a complicated experience. Yes, that is up for the OP to figure out, but it doesn't mean that the one thing you point out here that makes the OP _not_ TS doesn't mean the OP cannot be. It is not exclusive. I realized I was TS via a very similar thinking pattern the OP has expressed here, though for me it came a lot later and was the culmination of a wide variety of experinces that added up over time. That's the entire problem. But yes, this is indeed going nowhere because you don't even understand how you were invalidating though I think I've been pretty clear on trying to express exactly how you are.


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## Purple Skies (Aug 31, 2015)

Entropic said:


> Then please go back to what I wrote; it's not that simple. @Playful Proxy summarized it well, imo. It's not about seeking to have an argument for the sake of it; it ultimately boils down to that you invalidated my personal experiences of myself by what you wrote and I also know by experience not just mine, but also that of others', such as in this case Playful Proxy's. Yes, I'll school someone else on their opinions if those opinions are a) invalidating mine or that of others' experiences or b) are just plainly incorrect or biased.
> 
> Realizing you are transgender is a complicated experience. Yes, that is up for the OP to figure out, but it doesn't mean that the one thing you point out here that makes the OP _not_ TS doesn't mean the OP cannot be. It is not exclusive. I realized I was TS via a very similar thinking pattern the OP has expressed here, though for me it came a lot later and was the culmination of a wide variety of experinces that added up over time. That's the entire problem. But yes, this is indeed going nowhere because you don't even understand how you were invalidating though I think I've been pretty clear on trying to express exactly how you are.


K.


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## Kyusaku (Mar 18, 2014)

All those things aren't mutually exclusive. Being depressed in the face of those kinds of existential questionings is perfectly understandable and normal. The only instance when someone can think about being gay/bi/trans without feeling depressed is in the case of an acceptive and positive environment, I don't think there's any society where this requirement can be entirely met, there will always be some degree of rejection. Before you are able to understand your identity you first have to find a semblance of peace. You clearly don't have the strength yet to accept whoever you are so take it easy until you feel more confident about your own judgment. There's no rush, ultimately your identity is there that you might be conscious of it or not, that you accept it or not.

Also don't take people too seriously, as everyone is biased in some way.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

Playful Proxy said:


> I'd just like to correct this. For what it's worth, when you're trans, it's not this loud echoing explosion of, "YOU'RE ACTUALLY A GIRL" in your head. It's a huge series of lots of different feelings and when you're little you don't understand why certain things upset you, you don't know why you hate looking at certain parts of your body or why you avoided making friends with boys or why you couldn't comprehend the idea of a male role model when teachers asked you about one. Being trans can be really difficult to come to terms with. When you're small, all you know is that everyone says you're a boy, you just assume you are because hey, adults haven't been wrong before (or so you thought), and that for some odd reason, you hated having the parts down there but may everyone else did too? For some odd reason, everything about puberty felt fundamentally wrong but once again, everyone from day 1 has said you were a boy and everyone hates puberty because it has loads of suck so maybe it's normal? It's small things like that which you keep telling yourself over and over again that even though a part of you 'wanted' to be something, you keep telling yourself you just arn't and will never be and there's no real choice (until it boils over years later and your hand gets forced).


Thank you for this, because I think you're on point with this post. However, I might have to go through this with a professional or something in case I regret having a transition or something.

As far as my memory serves me, I've probably been interested in female characters when the majority of the leading cast is male when I was watching cartoons (e.g. Daphne from What's New, Scooby-Doo?), although I'm not sure if it's any further than just sexual attraction and if it's in terms of being able to relate to them or anything, and I think there may be a few exceptions (Ben and Gwen from Ben 10; Mahad from Skyland (although I've seen barely enough episodes to understand the entire plot of the series) and Ross from Friends, in whom I relate quite easily to in a few ways). I'm also not too keen with having facial and body hair, although I often say it's because I feel too young for it, or that I want to look feminine. After browsing Tumblr, I'm envious of guys who have the emo hairstyle because they can look androgynous, and it doesn't really matter if they look somewhat bulked up or skinny.

It's difficult to say if I'm trans or not, though, nevertheless, because of blurring gender roles.


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## Playful Proxy (Feb 6, 2012)

wixness said:


> Thank you for this, because I think you're on point with this post. However, I might have to go through this with a professional or something in case I regret having a transition or something.
> 
> As far as my memory serves me, I've probably been interested in female characters when the majority of the leading cast is male when I was watching cartoons (e.g. Daphne from What's New, Scooby-Doo?), although I'm not sure if it's any further than just sexual attraction and if it's in terms of being able to relate to them or anything, and I think there may be a few exceptions (Ben and Gwen from Ben 10; Mahad from Skyland (although I've seen barely enough episodes to understand the entire plot of the series) and Ross from Friends, in whom I relate quite easily to in a few ways). I'm also not too keen with having facial and body hair, although I often say it's because I feel too young for it, or that I want to look feminine. After browsing Tumblr, I'm envious of guys who have the emo hairstyle because they can look androgynous, and it doesn't really matter if they look somewhat bulked up or skinny.
> 
> It's difficult to say if I'm trans or not, though, nevertheless, because of blurring gender roles.


When in doubt when it comes to being trans, if you're really seriously uncertain, I always suggest a psychologist with experience in these things to help you sort things out. Maybe you just have feminine hobbies/tendencies/dress style you'd like to explore and you feel you can't because male gender roles are bullshit. Not everyone who is AMAB (assigned male at birth) and has feminine interests has to go through a transition. That being said, a third party professional who is familiar with both DSMv5 and WPATH would be very beneficial towards helping you decide what if anything you need to do. Good luck roud:

It only took my first psychologist 2 months before he was ready to write me a letter of recommendation to start hormone therapy. My parents weren't happy about that and pulled the _"Ok, but we want a second opinion. WE get to pick the next psychologist this time"_ (I started hormones anyway under guidance of an endocrinologist in the meantime). Another 2 months (and 3 hours of MMPI testing everyone knows is bullshit but is okay for an 'average idea') went by with the new psychologist, _"Yeah, you're fine. You're very intelligent, have an almost diagnosable amount of social anxiety, but aside from that, there's nothing that'd inaccurately make you think you're trans when you're not. You're trans and thinking clearly through this."_ My parents kinda bit the bullet and have been slowly getting more accepting as time has progressed after that.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

wixness said:


> Thank you for this, because I think you're on point with this post. However, I might have to go through this with a professional or something in case I regret having a transition or something.
> 
> As far as my memory serves me, I've probably been interested in female characters when the majority of the leading cast is male when I was watching cartoons (e.g. Daphne from What's New, Scooby-Doo?), although I'm not sure if it's any further than just sexual attraction and if it's in terms of being able to relate to them or anything, and I think there may be a few exceptions (Ben and Gwen from Ben 10; Mahad from Skyland (although I've seen barely enough episodes to understand the entire plot of the series) and Ross from Friends, in whom I relate quite easily to in a few ways). I'm also not too keen with having facial and body hair, although I often say it's because I feel too young for it, or that I want to look feminine. After browsing Tumblr, I'm envious of guys who have the emo hairstyle because they can look androgynous, and it doesn't really matter if they look somewhat bulked up or skinny.
> 
> It's difficult to say if I'm trans or not, though, nevertheless, because of blurring gender roles.





Playful Proxy said:


> When in doubt when it comes to being trans, if you're really seriously uncertain, I always suggest a psychologist with experience in these things to help you sort things out. Maybe you just have feminine hobbies/tendencies/dress style you'd like to explore and you feel you can't because male gender roles are bullshit. Not everyone who is AMAB (assigned male at birth) and has feminine interests has to go through a transition. That being said, a third party professional who is familiar with both DSMv5 and WPATH would be very beneficial towards helping you decide what if anything you need to do. Good luck roud:


Another thing which works is to simply begin to experiment yourself and see what you are comfortable with. That's what I did when I was unsure. I for example began with buying male products and kept expanding from there. If you need someone to talk to if you feel confused, you can message me. Figuring out your gender identity can be messy as hell.


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## ForestPaix (Aug 30, 2014)

Porn is made to make people horny pretty much. I think you don't need to worry too much about your sexuality. Just go with the flow and find out what happens


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