# Are all men intimidated by women who are more succesful careerwise than themselves?



## FXGZ (May 19, 2011)

Izismile.com - The Main Difference between Men and Women [VIDEO]

This video shows everything


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## Mr.Xl Vii (Jan 19, 2011)

Only if she were a better artist than me. Otherwise, I dont really give a shit. I would love to marry a successful doctor, lawyer, or business woman. That would be pretty sexy actually, but if we were both in the same field and she was just consistently better than I was then that might put a strain on things.

I'm not really someone who gives much of a shit about money. As long as I can pay my bills and eat well I dont care really.


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## Aqualung (Nov 21, 2009)

I'm not intimidated by women who are more successful than me but I also know I'm off their radar so I don't give it much thought. There was one exception though, years ago. Had a fling with rich girl with a higher degree from a big university but I was just a rebound guy after her divorce. It could have been any guy. Anyway, she constantly reminded me that her mom was worth a few million, her ex was a lawyer & she had a great salary, nice house, etc. I didn't care. Meant nothing to me. It got old & I told her she needed to find a stiff in a suit with a briefcase & a silver BMW, & I left. Months later she called me & said "Cosmo magazine says what you drive determines how your sex life is. And what are you driving?" "Uh...a used Ford Festiva." "Ha! There you go!" I said "I get 40 mpg, it's paid for & my girlfriend's happy. Bye." : ) Anyway, I know all women are not like her, thank goodness.


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## FXGZ (May 19, 2011)

Here is a great insight for you guys: sometimes a very strong and successful woman is actually very vulnerable. She is acting strong because she is scared. She is actually a very nice and considerate woman, she is being successful because she doesn't want to be a burden for her SO. This is when you guys need to be ashamed, when your woman had to be more successful because you cannot satisfy her needs so she has to do it herself!


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## Rogue Eagle (Oct 14, 2009)

my girlfriends more qualified and in a higher paying job than I.

Though I still feel like her equal. If a persons qualifications made up a persons whole personality I'd be screwed, thankfully I have lots of other things to offer.


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## sparkles (Mar 2, 2011)

abster said:


> To women, have you been in a similar situation? How did you handle it?
> 
> If your in a same sex relationship, do you encounter issues like this where one has to be the breadwinner, or the other one feels intimidated by the other person's success?


*waves to the future social worker*

I have been more advanced in education or career but I haven't gotten too far into a relationship where this was a problem for the guy. At one time I was working on a Master's and teaching college and my boyfriend worked in fast food and then on a cleaning crew. I didn't care. He didn't seem to care either. I wasn't with him for what he did for income, and he didn't hang his sense of manhood on it either. He was plenty manly, heh. 

So... I haven't run into this being a problem even though I've been in the situation. But then I tend to color outside the lines as far as the choices I make and whether I allow for external influences to chart my path. (As in it is about do we like each other not are people going to judge.) I can see how this could be more of a potential snag in couples that want to stick to tradition more or feel drawn to act on that cultural conditioning. Not that there's anything wrong with it, and technically I do have areas where I'm like that myself. I just wonder if that might be one factor in how we could both have similar situations but different emotional flavors to them. 

I *have* noticed some men get intimidated by my education and intelligence, which I don't get. They have areas of expertise that balance things out. I wish it didn't become an issue, but I'm glad it really doesn't in more substantial situations.


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## sofort99 (Mar 27, 2010)

Why do the men have to be "intimidated"? Maybe these men are just more realistic.

Do a quick search on it, and you can find tons of sites where women complain about having no respect for their out of work husbands. And considering two thirds of all divorces are initiated by women, and the most common reason given by women for it is they were "bored with being married", why would a man put any effort into a relationship that has the odds against from the beginning?

Men, by and large, need to feel respected, and women want to feel cherished and provided for. 

I understand this may not be how it is in the imaginary world in their heads a lot of people live in, but it works pretty much like this in the real one. Even the women that are responsible for modern feminism wound up married to richer, more powerful men.


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## Konan (Apr 20, 2011)

No; just the traditional sexist ones but I think some men find independent women pretty attractive as well. I would say 50/50 but not most.


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## skycloud86 (Jul 15, 2009)

I couldn't care less. I love her, why wouldn't I want her to be successful?

The only way that you can "be a man in a relationship" is to be biologically male and/or have a male gender identity. At least, as long as you recognise that societal expectations and gender roles are social constructs that only have very a small connection to reality.


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

I'm going to have to say no. I don't like the idea of a "couple," so if I'm seeing someone who's doing better than I am, then my level of jealousy would be on par with that of a friend being more successful. A level which is more or less nonexistent. Worst case scenario, it might make me want to try to achieve a bit more, but its not something that I would find intimidating.


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## Snakecharmer (Oct 26, 2010)

FXGZ said:


> Here is a great insight for you guys: sometimes a very strong and successful woman is actually very vulnerable. She is acting strong because she is scared. She is actually a very nice and considerate woman, she is being successful because she doesn't want to be a burden for her SO. This is when you guys need to be ashamed, when your woman had to be more successful because you cannot satisfy her needs so she has to do it herself!


I hope this is a joke, especially the last sentence. :sad:

I'm a successful woman, but not because I don't have a man to take care of me and support me...I'm successful because it makes ME feel good and I don't WANT to be dependent upon anyone else. :happy: I'm also building a strong foundation for my children, and I'm a positive role model for them.


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## etherealuntouaswithin (Dec 7, 2010)

Were we in the same field of work,i'd get competitive and dickish.Outside of that,it isn't a problem.I actually find it attractive.


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

FXGZ said:


> Here is a great insight for you guys: sometimes a very strong and successful woman is actually very vulnerable. She is acting strong because she is scared. She is actually a very nice and considerate woman, she is being successful because she doesn't want to be a burden for her SO. This is when you guys need to be ashamed, when your woman had to be more successful because you cannot satisfy her needs so she has to do it herself!


Wow, so a guys position in a relationship is to always be the driving force between the two? I do not have the constitution to be someone's father or coach. This type of thinks breeds codependency and few things could be more harmful than that in a relationship. 

Wouldn't things work out better for both parties if each person were individuals? No competition or need for a metaphorical parent in your sex lives?


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## sparkles (Mar 2, 2011)

sofort99 said:


> Why do the men have to be "intimidated"? Maybe these men are just more realistic.
> 
> Do a quick search on it, and you can find tons of sites where women complain about having no respect for their out of work husbands. And considering two thirds of all divorces are initiated by women, and the most common reason given by women for it is they were "bored with being married", why would a man put any effort into a relationship that has the odds against from the beginning?
> 
> ...


 There is a huge jump between "out of work" and "rich and powerful." 

Where do you hear women say they were bored with being married? No one I've met who's gotten divorced has mentioned that as the reason.


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## Monkey King (Nov 16, 2010)

I will not agree that men are intimidated by successful women. I will however say that men uncertain of themselves will fall victim of intimidation by successful women.


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## sparkles (Mar 2, 2011)

FXGZ said:


> Here is a great insight for you guys: sometimes a very strong and successful woman is actually very vulnerable. She is acting strong because she is scared. She is actually a very nice and considerate woman, she is being successful because she doesn't want to be a burden for her SO. This is when you guys need to be ashamed, when your woman had to be more successful because you cannot satisfy her needs so she has to do it herself!


 Wow that's wrong for so many reasons.

My ability to support myself financially has nothing whatsoever to do with a man's ability to provide for me. I wouldn't quit working if I met a rich guy who fit all my preferences for a partner. How boring would that be. 

I don't think shaming people is ever called for. If you felt insecure about something would you hope someone would walk up and shame you for it?


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## thor odinson (May 21, 2011)

Suppose it depends on the guy really

It makes me uneasy and it would force me to strive to better my self but then I've got some friends who just couldn't care less "Good, she can take care of me and I won't have to do shit" they say lol seems they want a mother figure, scuse the freudian underpinning I know it's an outdated theory


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## dalsgaard (Aug 14, 2010)

No, it doesn't irritate me. I WANT a woman that is more career-oriented than me, someone who can challenge me and is independent. I don't like the idea of having a partner that isn't at least as ambitious as I am.


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## skycloud86 (Jul 15, 2009)

FXGZ said:


> Here is a great insight for you guys: sometimes a very strong and successful woman is actually very vulnerable. She is acting strong because she is scared. She is actually a very nice and considerate woman, she is being successful because she doesn't want to be a burden for her SO.


I can't understand what you are trying to say here. Are you suggesting that successful people can't be vulnerable, that they can't be scared? Are you suggesting that all successful women are vulnerable and scared? 

You're also assuming that the only reason a woman might be successful is because she doesn't want to be a burden on her partner. That might be true for some successful women, but most of them are successful because they want to be successful, because they want to accomplish things in their life regardless of what biological sex they are and regardless of the gender roles and societal expectations that are pushed onto both sexes, with women facing a much harder time from society than men.



> This is when you guys need to be ashamed, when your woman had to be more successful because you cannot satisfy her needs so she has to do it herself!


Oh no, did the poor wittle fwower have to go and be successful all by herself? She could have been in the kitchen all day, barefoot and pwegnant! She might even have been able to have thoughts about fwowers and kittens as well!

Modern day women are being successful on their own, because they have the ability to do so. You are the kind of person who would have kept Marie Curie out of the laboratory, who would have kept Amelia Earhart out of her plane, who would have kept Jane Austen away from her writing desk, who would have kept Mary Seacole away from the hospital, who would have kept Rosalind Franklin away from the laboratory and who would kept Harriet Tubman away from her activism. They, along with countless other great women throughout history, didn't have the modern world to help them, and even today women still have the extra hurdles and glass ceilings that men don't.


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## skycloud86 (Jul 15, 2009)

sofort99 said:


> Why do the men have to be "intimidated"? Maybe these men are just more realistic.


No, I would call them intimidated. These men are generally insecure in their masculinity. It's rather pathetic, but these men have few other ways to prove their masculinity other than being successful in their career.



> Do a quick search on it, and you can find tons of sites where women complain about having no respect for their out of work husbands.


Those women are generally more conservative, more traditional women who may see their partner as the main breadwinner of the relationship. They may also be successful themselves, and want their husbands and boyfriends to be successful as well.



> And considering two thirds of all divorces are initiated by women, and the most common reason given by women for it is they were "bored with being married", why would a man put any effort into a relationship that has the odds against from the beginning?


Do you have any sources for this alleged most common reason?

Also, that's a rather fatalistic approach to marriage, isn't it? You could turn it around and say, why would a woman put any effort into a relationship if her husband bores her?



> Men, by and large, need to feel respected, and women want to feel cherished and provided for.


You're stereotyping. Women in general want to feel respected just as much as men, and not all women need to feel provided for.



> I understand this may not be how it is in the imaginary world in their heads a lot of people live in, but it works pretty much like this in the real one.


Pot and kettle spring to mind here, seeing as you sound like one of those MRA people.



> Even the women that are responsible for modern feminism wound up married to richer, more powerful men.


So? Does that mean that they weren't or couldn't be successful on their own? Is there a law that states that successful women can't get married to more successful men?


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## heartturnedtoporcelain (Apr 9, 2010)

Honestly, they can go fuck themselves if they think that way. They've internalized old fashioned gender roles (and the sexism implied in those roles) and I have no use for that whatsoever.


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## skycloud86 (Jul 15, 2009)

louea380 said:


> Haha, so i'm a misogynist because i'm aware of what the majority of men in the world require from a relationship.


How can you be aware of that? Have you asked every man alive on the planet?

If you believe that, how did it come to be that the majority of men require such things from a relationship? What are the causes and why?



> I think you need to open your eyes and accept reality


Baseless arrogance - first you ask me to "open my eyes" and then you assume that your view is reality.



> rather than picking my argument to pieces and asking for evidence.


Why would you have have an argument if you didn't have evidence to support that argument?



> Sometimes generalizing and using a healthy dose of wisdom is all you need.


Those are two very different things, and if you think you are wise, you aren't - having wisdom is something far more complex than just saying that you have wisdom.



> 1) Yes, it was a generalization. It would be silly of you to deny the validity of that generalization. Your correct in saying many women also feel this need but it has no bearing on my argument.


I agree that the generalisation is valid, but it is a generalisation in the grounds of "Most people like to be happy". Of course most men need to feel needed in a relationship.



> 2) I don't have a source. However, i would bet my car that i'm correct and you wouldn't bet yours that i'm incorrect. Again, generalizations make life easier. I said most men would feel LESS attraction, not loose attraction all together.


Firstly, making up for not having a source by making some useless bet is of no use to anyone. Secondly, why would they feel less attraction if their partner was more successful than them? There are more ways to be needed in a relationship than just bringing in an income.



> 3) A woman tends to loose respect for a man when he is insecure in himself= him behaving in a more feminine manner eg indecisive, sensitivity, not standing up for himself


Firstly, this generalisation is invalid as you are assuming all straight women are attracted to the same type of man. Secondly, you're stereotyping by assuming that men who are indecisive, sensitive and/or not able to stand up for themselves are somehow more feminine than other men. There is nothing wrong with being sensitive, and as for indecisiveness and not being able to stand up for themselves - those are personality traits that are not usually applied to the gender roles and societal expectations of a certain sex.



> and her behaving in a more masculine manner as she becomes frustrated without the security he provides eg. Taking more control, getting angry, being stubborn (generalizations make life easier)


You're making invalid generalisations - taking control depends on a person's personality and whilst society sees it as masculine, many women are able to take control in many situations and women have often been expected to take control in various ways (bringing up and looking after children, for example). Anger is an emotion, that society tends to find more acceptable in men than women, but again you are stereotyping as anger can be used by both men and women. Stubbornness is a personality trait that I wouldn't associate with either masculinity or femininity.



> 4) What's misogynistic about wanting to feel like a man in a relationship? It sounds as though your implying all men are misogynists and quite frankly your comment is insulting!


Nothing, and it would be ridiculous to imply that all men were misogynists. I was stating that it is more likely for insecure men to need reminders of their sex in a relationship, and so insecure men tend to be more traditional and prefer more traditional relationships.



> 5) I never mentioned anything about being a control freak. I said give away SOME control and i'll think your'll find this is good advice to the majority of women who feel that their SO isn't fulfilling her expectations.


If that works for a couple, then it works, but I would look into other reasons why he isn't fulfilling her expectations.



> 6) Could be anything really but i was more referring to more personal problems.


Fair enough.



> 7) Point taken, but it would help a person feel needed which is part of giving them their purpose in a relationship.


OK, fair enough.



> 8) I really don't no why you think i'm misogynist? What man doesn't like his SO to sort him out with a beer?


One who can get off his fat, lazy arse and get it himself? I cannot understand why some men need to act like they are in some unfunny sitcom, where he's just sat there and the woman has to do practically everything for him. I would see treating my partner like a servant as highly disrespectful.



> Women are more nurturing than men that's why their prone to behave in a more nurturing way.


Whilst women in general are more nurturing than men, there are many women who are not nurturing - unless of course you think Myra Hindley, Aileen Wuornos, Beverley Allitt or Irma Grese are more nurturing than the average man simply because they were/are women.

Also, getting her partner a beer isn't being nurturing, unless you're a sexist who uses the women are more nurturing generalisation to justify treating your female partner like a servant. When women are described as being nurturing, they are usually referring to bringing up and looking after children.



> 9) Again, the more its done the better.


I agree that communication is vital to a relationship.



> 10) Come on, take a joke.


I'm aware that it was a joke, but there are some men who seriously like to be told that.



> 11) No, but unfortunately we live in reality and most do feel the need to live up to the stereotype.


Just because societal expectations and gender roles have been around for a long time and are mostly obeyed by most people does not mean that we have to accept them. Society can change, and I can see that we are at the beginning of a period of time in which the effects of societal expectations, societal conditioning and gender roles is weakening, and people are more able to be themselves, rather than worrying whether their actions are correct for their biological sex.



> 12) Hmmmm. So your assumptions about me were wrong. Remember you really need to be careful around highly insecure men like myself, especially the woman haters haha. Your assumptions are just as "bad" as my generalizations.


Just because my assumptions were partly disproven by your answers does not make the rest of my argument invalid.



> I don't see why you need to dissect peoples arguments like this.


It is so that I can answer different points separately and so that I can understand more about what you are trying to say in your post.



> Not everybody can give you citations of where they get their evidence.


Fair enough, that is a good point.



> I'm just an insecure man with no brains


I didn't say that you had no brains, or are you just saying this because you don't believe yourself to be intelligent?



> and i'm really not here to debate the ins and outs of my argument.


That's fair enough.



> I use generalizations because i see them as useful, if you have a problem with that then challenge the generalization as a valid statement, don't discount it on the basis of being a generalization.


That is a valid point.



> I'm not saying that the generalizations i make above are definitely correct (although they probably are), but any intelligent person would realise that arguing using generalizations is the only efficient way to argue.


I sometimes use generalisations myself, but people have to be careful not to misuse or overuse generalisations, at least in my opinion.


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## MiriMiriAru (May 1, 2011)

I earn quite a bit less than my wife, probably just over two thirds of what she does. I have no problem with this whatsoever. I feel no insecurity or anxiety over this at all. She just happened to find a better paying job. It's not something I ever think about. I don't see it as being "looked after", any more than I would consider I "look after" her if the situation were reversed, as we both have to work to contribute to expenses. What I find however, is that she has a very large problem with this, and, probably at least once a day, explicitly or implicitly, informs me of how much of a loser I am, for the reason that the man is "supposed" to earn more, because "that's just the way it is".


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## Super Awesome (Jul 11, 2011)

I make more money than my boyfriend. A _lot_ more money. He's man enough to handle that, and I love him all the more for it. 

Some guys have egos thinner than tissue paper, though.


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## Istbkleta (Apr 30, 2011)

Lexie said:


> Some guys have egos thinner than tissue paper, though.


Yes. 

*Also*

I am convinced women in general can't love a man they don't respect and a lot of women respect men who make a lot of money.

For myself: it depends entirely on the women if I'll feel comfortable with her making more. I see a lot of women every day who have nothing but contempt for the men they are with. Most often because of money.

I might say I am open and stuff, but I'd never be with somebody who despises me for who I am.

Thus some women are simply doomed to never find a way out of this and the reason is entirely within them.




Zombie Jesus said:


> What I find however, is that she has a very large problem with this, and, probably at least once a day, explicitly or implicitly, informs me of how much of a loser I am, for the reason that the man is "supposed" to earn more, because "that's just the way it is".


Based on my RL observations not all, but a lot of women do that. I wish ppl could just be honest and say it: I want a man with money. Period. 

And earning potential is a social, easy to measure sign of the quality of a person. As stated above - most women need to respect a man to love him. I dunno. This is all terribly complicated and I feel completely unprepared to marry 
Watching other ppl I can see them making so many mistakes and paying for them. It's scary.


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## DustyDrill (May 20, 2011)

To be a man in a relationship he must have 2 things.

1. A drive to be a contributing member of the team.
2. A penis.

Anything more is just your pride and outdated social stigmas fucking with you. If a woman holds the fact that she makes more money over you, hit her with a brick and go find a real person to spend your time with.


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## MiriMiriAru (May 1, 2011)

DustyDrill said:


> To be a man in a relationship he must have 2 things.
> 
> 1. A relationship.
> 2. A penis.


Fixed. 

You didn't specify that it had to be a good relationship.


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## WamphyriThrall (Apr 11, 2011)

*Hides in a closet*

The bidnezz wimminz are coming.


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## Erbse (Oct 15, 2010)

If both make enough to support themselves individually everything beyond becomes a moot point.


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## freeagen (Apr 29, 2011)

Intimidated? 
It's more like wariness.
Power struggles between the sexes is far from over.
Trust is more important than anything else in a relationship.


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## Codger (Aug 7, 2010)

I couldn't care less myself, as long as I've got the cash to do what I want, then the rest is irrelevant. Bit selfish? Possibly.


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## MiriMiriAru (May 1, 2011)

freeagen said:


> Intimidated?
> It's more like wariness.
> Power struggles between the sexes is far from over.
> Trust is more important than anything else in a relationship.


The question is still begged, why are they wary? Certainly there are power struggles between the sexes in the overall society, but how does this translate into men being wary of women who earn more money? What would they have to be wary of?


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## freeagen (Apr 29, 2011)

Personally I'm wary of growing female chauvinism.
Of the reversal of the status quo ante instead of equality.
It's really interesting isn't it?

Besides I don't consider the amount of dollars someone earns as a unit of measurement concerning success.


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## Super Awesome (Jul 11, 2011)

freeagen said:


> Personally I'm wary of growing female chauvinism.
> Of the reversal of the status quo ante instead of equality.
> It's really interesting isn't it?


Yes, it really is interesting. There seems to be a shift, where some want to be more equal than equal. 

Meanwhile, I embrace the idea that the sexes are equal but different. We each have our own strengths and weaknesses. I might make more money, but my guy brings other things to the relationship that are invaluable to me. 

Being complementary is important (to me, at least).


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## mrscientist (Jul 4, 2010)

You make more money then me? You buy me dinner then! Problem solved.


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## louea380 (Dec 5, 2010)

skycloud86 said:


> I sometimes use generalisations myself, but people have to be careful not to misuse or overuse generalisations, at least in my opinion.


Yes, but challenging a generalisation does not have to involve nit picking. Asking questions like, "Have you asked every man alive on the planet?". No, i haven't asked every man on the planet. 

how did it come to be that the majority of men require such things from a relationship? I don't know

Making such challenges as, "Just because societal expectations and gender roles have been around for a long time and are mostly obeyed by most people does not mean that we have to accept them" - If you have a point to make about whether we accept gender roles or not then take it to another thread. I'm just stating the way it is NOW.

"you're stereotyping by assuming that men who are indecisive, sensitive and/or not able to stand up for themselves are somehow more feminine than other men"- ...the assumption is valid

Your style of debate would be much clearer/ less annoying if you stopped resisting generalisations and said what you meant.

Eg. Rather than saying "you're stereotyping by assuming that men who are indecisive, sensitive and/or not able to stand up for themselves are somehow more feminine than other men" you could say... 
"I see that the majority of women exhibit those traits but that doesn't make those men any more feminine". The second version is clearer because I can see then that your issue is with me thinking that those men are more feminine, and not that the initial statement was a stereotype. Arguing on the grounds that a statement is a stereotype will only annoy your opponent and is not a valid point.

Anyway, the way i look at it is in terms of the archetype. Consider masculine and feminine as two separate energies. It just so happens that a woman usually demonstrates more feminine energy than masculine energy which means that most women will be more feminine than masculine. This is also why most woman are attracted to manly men and most men are attracted to feminine women. Having a high flying career is not demonstrative of feminine energy so most men would be less attracted (physically) to this type of woman.


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## Runvardh (May 17, 2011)

I'm not sure what to say about intimidated, but I know I won't pursue a girl I like if she's going better. Something about not wanting to be perceived as being a gold digger. That said, if I get the signs she likes and wants me, then we're good to go. It's kind of a practical move with all the social flux going on these days.


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## Sputnik (Jul 17, 2011)

I've been in a relationship where my mate made considerably more money than I did, and I was proud of her for her accomplishments (she is an excellent mother too). It is not the money, but the person who makes me feel inadequate. There are some women who have travelled the world and who have sophisticated tastes that make me feel totally inadequate as a human being and even if they showed an interest in me I would feel so worthless I would slink away.


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## femalegamer (Nov 2, 2010)

I'd like to thank people for responding to this thread in ways that have made me less worried. I'm a software engineer with 12 years under my belt, and thus make much more money than my current guy. 

It was mainly a concern because I think that resentment of relative financial situation may have been part of what broke my marriage. Of course, that's a slightly different setup. He was also a programmer, and was laid off in 2003, decided he didn't want to do that anymore, got an MBA so he could go into management more easily, and then decided to start a small business. (Owning your own business is the second most overrated thing in the world, after natural childbirth.) And then decided he didn't want to do that, sold it and went to law school.

And then resented me for not being willing to move someplace else back when he got laid off, so that he could find a job. While at the same time admitting that he isn't good at looking for work.

So, reassurances that there are plenty of men who don't care if I make more money are very, very helpful to me.


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## Philosophaser Song Boy (Jan 16, 2011)

I wouldnt have a problem being a stay at home dad, so no.


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