# Why can't I ever be sure of my type?



## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

I hate making these sort of threads all the time but I like being completely sure of things. I decided on ENTJ a while ago but then I realized that I might not be a thinker. I'm very focused on mine and other people's feelings. Also many people online think I'm a feeler of some sort. Many descriptions are biased towards feelers so I'm making this post. 

My development's probably really weird. My parents beat me from the time I was 4 up to the age of 8 and I was depressed up until the age of 14. I remember that my parents thought I was high half the time (I was so oblivious to my environment) and a bossy know-it-all. I honestly don't know how. How did they expect me to function in a household without structure and rules?

I have a lot of strong values and morals. I would probably die for them actually. I abide by my moral code no matter what. I actually have moral rules. When I was younger, I never had morals and I was somewhat wild. I made racist/sexist jokes and I was an aggressive bully who really just wanted a friend. I really got off on confrontation and conflicts. I created problems in a lot of my friendships just for the fun of it. Oddly enough, when it comes to things I'm emotionally invested in such as my values, I can end up crying and feeling hopeless thinking about the state of the world.

I really love helping others but I don't really do it because I care. Being as helpful as I possibly can is one of my values. I believe in loyalty but, and while this might seem selfish, if I had to choose between my friends or being true to myself and my morals, I would choose myself any day. I don't really like loyalty very much because I feel like people should do things because they think it's the right thing to do rather than because they care.

I love schedules and plans. I absolutely cannot adapt. I always need a plan and around 3 back-up plans. I need to be able to put things in perspective. Is what I'm doing going to matter in 40 years? I believe in productive fun and I absolutely hate things that have no purpose. I want to be as efficient as I possibly can. 

I remember being very escapist when I was young and I still am to a certain extent. Reality is so disappointing and living in my head is much more satisfying. But then I feel pathetic and end up planning out my vision of how reality should be like. I love to research in the library regarding this. I am not a knowledge for knowledge's sake person, applied knowledge is definitely my thing. 

I hate talking about abstract things because what's the point? What am I gaining from talking about it? I love having fun and grabbing opportunities to experience the moment as much as I can. If I don't have anything to do, at least. I like to keep things light-hearted and I hate anything gloomy when I'm in this sort of mood. I do things for impact, for a reaction. Whoever gets the most laughs and gasps, wins. I'm getting better at putting on a show and entertaining people. But I usually never live in the moment and I'm quite the obsessive planner. 

What do you think?? I'm very sure I'm an extravert and probably an Ni-Se user.


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## HighClassSavage (Nov 29, 2012)

I vote ENTJ.


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## surgery (Apr 16, 2010)

Sounds like ENTJ and maybe even 8w7


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

One of my moral rules is to never invalidate someone's feelings because I remember a traumatizing event that occurred to me revolving around that so whenever I'm about to do the same with others, I always remember how I felt at that time. Would a thinker have a moral rule like that?


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

surgery said:


> Sounds like ENTJ and maybe even 8w7


Interesting, could you explain the 7 wing? I think I'm very 8-ish, I agree.


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## HighClassSavage (Nov 29, 2012)

NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> One of my moral rules is to never invalidate someone's feelings because I remember a traumatizing event that occurred to me revolving around that so whenever I'm about to do the same with others, I always remember how I felt at that time. Would a thinker have a moral rule like that?


Having the moral rule that you have described doesn't really differentiate yourself from being a Thinker or a Feeler. Besides, it only makes sense to me that you would probably avoid invalidating someone else's feelings due to having a traumatizing event. A traumatizing event could probably do that to anyone, of any type.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> One of my moral rules is to never invalidate someone's feelings because I remember a traumatizing event that occurred to me revolving around that so whenever I'm about to do the same with others, I always remember how I felt at that time. Would a thinker have a moral rule like that?


Why not? ENTJs got Fi after all.


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## surgery (Apr 16, 2010)

NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> Interesting, could you explain the 7 wing? I think I'm very 8-ish, I agree.





NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> I remember being very escapist when I was young and I still am to a certain extent. Reality is so disappointing and living in my head is much more satisfying. But then I feel pathetic and end up planning out my vision of how reality should be like.
> 
> I hate talking about abstract things because what's the point? What am I gaining from talking about it? I love having fun and grabbing opportunities to experience the moment as much as I can. If I don't have anything to do, at least. I like to keep things light-hearted and I hate anything gloomy when I'm in this sort of mood. I do things for impact, for a reaction. Whoever gets the most laughs and gasps, wins. I'm getting better at putting on a show and entertaining people. But I usually never live in the moment and I'm quite the obsessive planner.


Basically, everything you said here sounded very type Seven to me.


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Having the moral rule that you have described doesn't really differentiate yourself from being a Thinker or a Feeler. Besides, it only makes sense to me that you would probably avoid invalidating someone else's feelings due to having a traumatizing event. A traumatizing event could probably do that to anyone, of any type.


Hmm yeah, I guess that would make sense. Thanks!


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

surgery said:


> Basically, everything you said here sounded very type Seven to me.


Didn't see this until now! Hmm wouldn't that Pe? Maybe both a 7 wing and Pe?


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

Because you don't trust yourself. You know yourself better than anyone else can, you've lived with yourself all your life. 

(I should trademark this statement, I pull it out and use it all the time).


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

tanstaafl28 said:


> Because you don't trust yourself. You know yourself better than anyone else can, you've lived with yourself all your life.
> 
> (I should trademark this statement, I pull it out and use it all the time).


But what if I'm trying to convince myself that I'm this type? xNTJs are glorified on the Internet after all. Yeah, the ones who've typed me don't know me too well. I don't really share anything important about me with people. 

You should, maybe you'll make a fortune.


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> But what if I'm trying to convince myself that I'm this type? xNTJs are glorified on the Internet after all. Yeah, the ones who've typed me don't know me too well. I don't really share anything important about me with people.
> 
> You should, maybe you'll make a fortune.


You know you well, what do you think/feel? 

I keep finding my eyes drawn to your Avatar...I LOVE chocolate chip cookies!


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## Rafiki (Mar 11, 2012)

ESTJ is possible. I think ESTJs have a conflict with being the "most common male" type whose being socially focused conflicts with a desire to be valued and independent. I have some friends who don't like the sound of SJ because of the dogmatism seen at the worst/lower ends of the spectrum.

NTs have a use for the abstract. I suppose being Te doms, the preference is for the efficient and useful but something about that Ni penchant for expansion or absorption, inclusion, learning etc. (as a body has to gravitationally pull in enough sediment to form itself)

Do you find the abstract useful in long-range plans?


Truth is I think reducing it to
Je
Pi
Pe 
Ji 
helps get rid of the S/N, and T/F problems. Perspectives seem to lean Te, maybe some confusion or trouble in Fi, can't live in the moment sounds like "Ni/Se" struggle but i don't like labeling individual behaviors a lot. I wish I were more knowledgeable. 


Tell us more! Tell us more!


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## Rafiki (Mar 11, 2012)

In the end, I'm more asking for more N/S distinction material.
I'm not calling you either type ah sorry if that's there.


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

tanstaafl28 said:


> You know you well, what do you think/feel?
> 
> I keep finding my eyes drawn to your Avatar...I LOVE chocolate chip cookies!


I think I'm an ENxJ for sure but I could be a super unhealthy ISFP or whatever. I'm honestly not sure. 

My soul loves chocolate chip cookies!


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> I think I'm an ENxJ for sure but I could be a super unhealthy ISFP or whatever. I'm honestly not sure.
> 
> My soul loves chocolate chip cookies!



I would suggest you study more. Consider Isabel Briggs-Myer's own book "Gifts Differing." It is well-written and clear

(Free pdf of the book is available by clicking on the above link).


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

arsenal92 said:


> ESTJ is possible. I think ESTJs have a conflict with being the "most common male" type whose being socially focused conflicts with a desire to be valued and independent. I have some friends who don't like the sound of SJ because of the dogmatism seen at the worst/lower ends of the spectrum.
> 
> NTs have a use for the abstract. I suppose being Te doms, the preference is for the efficient and useful but something about that Ni penchant for expansion or absorption, inclusion, learning etc. (as a body has to gravitationally pull in enough sediment to form itself)
> 
> ...


Ah okay, yeah, a lot of people think SJ=boring and traditional. It's kind of sad.

Hmm I see. What is your definition of abstract? 

Yeah, that makes it so much so easier to find your type, I agree. I think a lot of individual behaviors are usually just that, individual behaviors. Oh no, it's not a problem.

Well, my whole life really revolves around my plans and goals. I've always wanted to become my ideal of perfection and I have to create an impact on the world that will last around 1 or 2 centuries. I care a lot about being authentic to my myself and my morals. I don't believe in excuses ever when it comes to doing the right thing. I believe in emotional control at all times in order to do what I deem as the right thing to do. I'm very into aesthetics and shock affect. Many times, I say something ridiculous or blunt just to impact others. I've very focused on making on making an impact, doesn't matter if it's negative or positive, the more, the better. I really hate conflict sometimes but the other times, I find it fun and refreshing. I used to have a problem in which I created conflicts in my relationships just because I was bored and wanted to spice things up.


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

tanstaafl28 said:


> I would suggest you study more. Consider Isabel Briggs-Myer's own book "Gifts Differing." It is well-written and clear
> 
> (Free pdf of the book is available by clicking on the above link).


Thanks for the link! Yeah, I've read it before but I think I'll read it again.


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

arsenal92 said:


> In the end, I'm more asking for more N/S distinction material.
> I'm not calling you either type ah sorry if that's there.


Ah okay

I just noticed your sig, I love Kurt Cobain!


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## Rafiki (Mar 11, 2012)

NerdyCool5EVAH said:


> Your description of Si/Ne. I think I understand it.


realyl shows itself differently

lots say the THIRD function is a recreational function, you often see IxTJs doing little self-fulfilling pursuits like giving money to a poor guy (as this would be what a good, moral person does) for Fi

like that
INPs i know often listen to music for Si, or pull into a world of their own where things are nearly routinized 

I often start projects in recreation if not that ^ 
i like sarting books or songs ima make (usually don get finished) but that's my recreation time

ENxJs I know definitely go on streaks of use/abuse and can totally go out rampage one night only to be found in their exact position of control the next day.. one of my friends goes to a buffet and PIGGGGS out... smokes tons of cigarettes on his down time, 

these obviously seem universally applicable 
but it is a noteworthy trend


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

arsenal92 said:


> realyl shows itself differently
> 
> lots say the THIRD function is a recreational function, you often see IxTJs doing little self-fulfilling pursuits like giving money to a poor guy (as this would be what a good, moral person does) for Fi
> 
> ...


I've heard that before! I do things that apply to both tertiary Te and Se. I love starting projects for fun but I also adore parties and just letting go and having fun.


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## Recede (Nov 23, 2011)

arsenal92 said:


> realyl shows itself differently
> 
> lots say the THIRD function is a recreational function, you often see IxTJs doing little self-fulfilling pursuits like giving money to a poor guy (as this would be what a good, moral person does) for Fi
> 
> ...


I'm skeptical about this. If I were to list all activities I enjoy, it would probably include all 8 functions. This is probably true for everyone. Anyone can think of a way their tertiary function is used for recreation, but the thing is, we could think of ways we use _any_ function for recreation. This seems like something that could more likely lead to confirmation bias than actual insight into one's type.


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## Rafiki (Mar 11, 2012)

Silveresque said:


> I'm skeptical about this. If I were to list all activities I enjoy, it would probably include all 8 functions. This is probably true for everyone. Anyone can think of a way their tertiary function is used for recreation, but the thing is, we could think of ways we use _any_ function for recreation. This seems like something that could more likely lead to confirmation bias than actual insight into one's type.



Basically the caution i was taking. I do think it's a _recreational_ function for a lot of people, just in considering it's not actively used most of the time.

Preferential 
Alternative/ Advisory
Recreational
Spasmodic

might be a nice way to look at 'em


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

arsenal92 said:


> Basically the caution i was taking. I do think it's a _recreational_ function for a lot of people, just in considering it's not actively used most of the time.
> 
> Preferential
> Alternative/ Advisory
> ...


Spasmodic?


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## Rafiki (Mar 11, 2012)

It seems to come out in occasional outbursts.
With spasmodic I meant to stress low frequency and high energy


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## QueenOfCats (Jan 28, 2011)

arsenal92 said:


> It seems to come out in occasional outbursts.
> With spasmodic I meant to stress low frequency and high energy


Just saw this post, and I could see that.


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