# Does this happen to you ENTP/INTPs?



## AvocatInTraining (Nov 18, 2012)

When someone comes up to you (mother or friend) and accuses you of doing something. Do you argue for your innocence and get so caught in defending yourself, you do not realise the fact that they were right and you really did the thing they are accusing you of, You temporarily forget your actions and are so focused in your lie you feel no guilt and actually feel offended that they're accusing you. Then you actually start believing in that lie you've fabricated and end up clearing your name and after you've gone out of your 'argue' mode you realise that you were lying. 
Has this happened to you guys? :laughing::frustrating:


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## DeductiveReasoner (Feb 25, 2011)

Yeah.

Isn't that the first step of being an effective liar?

Not that it's something i'm particularly proud of...


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

I don't really do this. I typically will defend whatever I do, rather than my innocence.


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## EllieBear (Nov 8, 2012)

To be honest I lie so often and so quickly that I have no idea what is the truth any more.


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## DiamondDays (Sep 4, 2012)

AvocatInTraining said:


> When someone comes up to you (mother or friend) and accuses you of doing something. Do you argue for your innocence and get so caught in defending yourself, you do not realise the fact that they were right and you really did the thing they are accusing you of, You temporarily forget your actions and are so focused in your lie you feel no guilt and actually feel offended that they're accusing you. Then you actually start believing in that lie you've fabricated and end up clearing your name and after you've gone out of your 'argue' mode you realise that you were lying.
> Has this happened to you guys? :laughing::frustrating:


I do this instinctively. I'm getting smarter about it though. It's a quite annoying trait. I try not to lie about emotional or important stuff. I don't want to hurt people, but sometimes the truth is better even though it puts you in a bad light or hurts somebody.


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm more like @devoid, I don't do anything that really warrants lying so I defend what I am doing rather than my supposed innocence or not.


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## TWN (Feb 16, 2012)

I did this when I was a kid.

As an adult I just rationalize my actions to prove that I am right.


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## TheProcrastinatingMaster (Jun 4, 2012)

Not really, I can't really remember a time where I've pursued a lie so vigorously. Must have been years ago if it was such a vigorous defense it would usually be because it's true, that said I can't even remember the last time I had to do that either...


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

AvocatInTraining said:


> When someone comes up to you (mother or friend) and accuses you of doing something. Do you argue for your innocence and get so caught in defending yourself, you do not realise the fact that they were right and you really did the thing they are accusing you of, You temporarily forget your actions and are so focused in your lie you feel no guilt and actually feel offended that they're accusing you. Then you actually start believing in that lie you've fabricated and end up clearing your name and after you've gone out of your 'argue' mode you realise that you were lying.
> Has this happened to you guys? :laughing::frustrating:


"I-didn't-do-it-nobody-saw-me-you-can't-prove-anything." -Bart Simpson

Pretty much, I was up to some form of mischief or another, so accusing me was usually a safe bet. Of course, denial was always a safe bet for me. :tongue:


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## Murnando (Dec 10, 2011)

I don;t think this is NT exclusive. When we're being accused of something, we tend to shell into a hyper defensive state of mind. In the heat of that moment, the rational side telling you truth matters more than self preservation gets drowned out by this impulse. A defense mechanism, more than anything else.


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## ninacheburashka (Oct 30, 2012)

That to me sounds like compulsive lying. :tongue:


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

Well, wasn't that a verbal delight?


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## MegaTuxRacer (Sep 7, 2011)

No.


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

You missed the obvious sarcasm?


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## AvocatInTraining (Nov 18, 2012)

tanstaafl28 said:


> You missed the obvious sarcasm?


I liked it *because *it was sarcasm >


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

AvocatInTraining said:


> I liked it *because *it was sarcasm >


I have this tee-shirt: 

"Sarcasm: One of my many talents."


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## AvocatInTraining (Nov 18, 2012)

tanstaafl28 said:


> I have this tee-shirt:
> 
> "Sarcasm: One of my many talents."


Sarcasm can be scary, especially when it becomes habitual.


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

AvocatInTraining said:


> Sarcasm can be scary, especially when it becomes habitual.


Like any effective tool, it needs to be used sparingly.


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## AvocatInTraining (Nov 18, 2012)

tanstaafl28 said:


> Like any effective tool, it needs to be used sparingly.


If not, it becomes....predictable :O. Oh the horror!!!! :shocked:


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

AvocatInTraining said:


> If not, it becomes....predictable :O. Oh the horror!!!! :shocked:


Well, what else horrifies an ENTP more than predictability? :wink:


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## Calvin (Jun 21, 2012)

Never. I feel guilty whether I did it or not, and other people always have to defend me. When someone walks up with a scowl on their face and starts accusing me of something, I just freeze up and get butterflies.


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## AvocatInTraining (Nov 18, 2012)

tanstaafl28 said:


> Well, what else horrifies an ENTP more than predictability? :wink:


SF's  well maybe just as much.


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## Pete The Lich (May 16, 2011)

Whatever it was
I didn't do it
it was the _dog _I swear


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## TBK (Feb 6, 2013)

tanstaafl28 said:


> Well, what else horrifies an ENTP more than predictability? :wink:


If there _is _a Hell, they're going to make ENTPs repeatedly fold the same pair of socks for the rest of eternity in a small, dark room with only one light.

They'll probably surround us with...


AvocatInTraining said:


> SF's.


EDIT: I have to say that I don't find SFs that bad, at all. I have to take each person individually and decide if they put a bad taste in my mouth. The only time I capable of being aggressively against one type of people is if I'm very, very mad, and it only lasts for five minutes, before somebody proves me wrong and I'm back to loving everybody and thinking everybody is a genius.

Then, again, I think I spend about fifty percent of my time SFing.


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## madferit (May 7, 2011)

AvocatInTraining said:


> When someone comes up to you (mother or friend) and accuses you of doing something. Do you argue for your innocence and get so caught in defending yourself, you do not realise the fact that they were right and you really did the thing they are accusing you of, *You temporarily forget your actions and are so focused in your lie you feel no guilt and actually feel offended that they're accusing you.* Then you actually start believing in that lie you've fabricated and end up clearing your name and after you've gone out of your 'argue' mode you realise that you were lying.
> Has this happened to you guys? :laughing::frustrating:


I would typically feel offended by my incompetence because my rationalization and lying was not good enough to make them believe me.


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## The Plot (Jan 31, 2012)

TBK said:


> If there _is _a Hell, they're going to make ENTPs repeatedly fold the same pair of socks for the rest of eternity in a small, dark room with only one light.


INTP hell is roughly the same I think, but one sock is slightly longer than the other and there's a ******* that only talks about local politics.

In response to the original post: I did that often when I was a kid but these days I settle for admitting that a justifiable mistake has been made.


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## bellisaurius (Jan 18, 2012)

I used to get lost in defending myself. Now I've learned the importance of taking credit for the small bad stuff. It gives you crazy credibility in denying the big stuff.


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## Devin87 (May 15, 2011)

I used to do that all the time until one day last summer one of my bosses called me out on it. I was mortified that this guy was pointing out such a blaring personality flaw I never even realized I had (and I knew he was right). It wasn't usually blatant lying-- it was just denying responsibility, shifting the blame, and making excuses... After he said that I felt like a complete failure because people who do stuff like that are weak and don't deserve much respect. And that was me.

I've been working on it since then. It feels much better to just accept responsibility, although it takes a lot of courage sometimes when the big boss is glaring down at you with that fire in his eyes and you have to look up into them and tell him "yes, I did do that thing that's pissing you off so much". But I've found blatant honesty disarms him much faster than making excuses. It almost seems to throw him off a little. Not too many people admit their mistakes that blatantly and readily. I've actually made him stumble over his words once or twice because he just seemed so surprised.

It goes against my nature to admit I'm not perfect, but I sure as hell don't want people thinking of me as some weakling who throws others under the bus and can't own up.


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## TBK (Feb 6, 2013)

A Mole of Photons said:


> INTP hell is roughly the same I think, but one sock is slightly longer than the other and there's a ******* that only talks about local politics.


 My eyes are stinging from internal laughter. That's how I know this is hilarious. I think the ******* talking about local politics is an SJ. And he isn't just talking. He's talking very, very slow, and scratching himself, a lot, too. I can see how one sock being slightly longer than the other would get irritating. I get mad when I try to match socks, and it's usually because the socks are supposed to be the same color, but they aren't. I think I get irritated by the socks' details, because I'm already irritated, anyway, so I just start aggressively picking the socks apart. 'How dare you be a slightly different color and texture than the sock that's supposed to go with you?! Why are you such an asshole, sock?!' I probably don't need to mention that my socks never match, anyway, so getting upset about them not matching's really just... ignorant and hypocritical.



bellisaurius said:


> I used to get lost in defending myself. Now I've learned the importance of taking credit for the small bad stuff. It gives you crazy credibility in denying the big stuff.


I do this, too, but it's the, 'I'm a bad liar,' thing. I know it's manipulative, and wrong, but I pretend I don't know how to lie, so when I do lie, people believe it.


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## AnCapKevin (Jun 7, 2012)

AvocatInTraining said:


> When someone comes up to you (mother or friend) and accuses you of doing something. Do you argue for your innocence and get so caught in defending yourself, you do not realise the fact that they were right and you really did the thing they are accusing you of, You temporarily forget your actions and are so focused in your lie you feel no guilt and actually feel offended that they're accusing you. Then you actually start believing in that lie you've fabricated and end up clearing your name and after you've gone out of your 'argue' mode you realise that you were lying.
> Has this happened to you guys? :laughing::frustrating:


Yeah. I did this all the time when I was a drug addict.

For better or worse, I'm an extremely good liar now. I had time to hone my skills. Regardless, I'm honest almost all of the time. Not having to spin such an elaborate web of lies and keep up with it consistently so you aren't exposed is tiring. Being honest makes life a lot easier...usually.


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