# Do I have to approach a younger man (barista)?



## ThisNameWorks (Mar 11, 2017)

@Ariel88 
I honestly think you just have the hots for this guy. Not sure if you’re that type, but maybe its worth a one nighter?

If you’re both shy, and he’s under 25, you’re probably just going to run into some problems in the long run. I don’t think its worth the risk of getting your feelings involved.


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

YearseRayneDon said:


> @Ariel88
> I honestly think you just have the hots for this guy. Not sure if you’re that type, but maybe its worth a one nighter?
> 
> If you’re both shy, and he’s under 25, you’re probably just going to run into some problems in the long run. I don’t think its worth the risk of getting your feelings involved.


What does it mean - having hots? I'm not native speaker, but I guess it's something like crush based on sexual attraction?
Unfortunately I can't imagine one night stand with anyone, and not with him at all. So this is not a way for me. 
Why do you think I'm going to run into some problems?


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## ThisNameWorks (Mar 11, 2017)

Ariel88 said:


> What does it mean - having hots? I'm not native speaker, but I guess it's something like crush based on sexual attraction?


Yes.




Ariel88 said:


> Unfortunately I can't imagine one night stand with anyone, and not with him at all. So this is not a way for me.
> Why do you think I'm going to run into some problems?


Can you at least name 10 things you like about this guy that have nothing to do with the way he looks?


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

YearseRayneDon said:


> Yes.
> 
> Can you at least name 10 things you like about this guy that have nothing to do with the way he looks?


I saw him only few times, and I don't know him enough to name 10 things, but there are few things I like about him
1) he is kind and attentive to customers,
2) he looks like a hard-worker (he is young, but tries to make money by teaching and working in a cafe)
3) I like his voice A LOT (it's not his look 
4) he lived in a foreign country for 2 years, which means that he has some experiences and probably is self-reliant and his English must be pretty good (so he is also educated)
5) he is smart
6) he is a good person (somehow I can know this about people, you can see in in the eyes)

I have to know him better for more, otherwise the rest would be just bare guessing 

OH, yes, I know the 7th thing! - he prepared me one of the best macchiato I ever had, honestly. I guess he is a good cook, hehe.


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## Schizoid (Jan 31, 2015)

Ariel88 said:


> I saw him only few times, and I don't know him enough to name 10 things, but there are few things I like about him
> 1) he is kind and attentive to customers,
> 2) he looks like a hard-worker (he is young, but tries to make money by teaching and working in a cafe)
> 3) I like his voice A LOT (it's not his look
> ...


You seemed to like him a lot. Tell me more about your feelings for him!  Do you daydream about him a lot? If yes, what do you usually daydream about?
Do you find yourself fantasizing about spending lots of time with him and becoming really emotionally close with him?
Or do you find yourself fantasizing about kissing him and cuddling together with him?

Just asking these questions as I've been in a somewhat similar situation as you before, but I needed more information before I'm able to share my insights.


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

Schizoid said:


> You seemed to like him a lot. Tell me more about your feelings for him!  Do you daydream about him a lot? If yes, what do you usually daydream about?
> Do you find yourself fantasizing about spending lots of time with him and becoming really emotionally close with him?
> Or do you find yourself fantasizing about kissing him and cuddling together with him?
> 
> Just asking these questions as I've been in a somewhat similar situation as you before, but I needed more information before I'm able to share my insights.


I honestly don't daydream a lot about him, because I have a lot of stuff to do (work, hobbies), but yes, I think about him few times a day. I mostly remember the way he looked at me and smiled. But I don't like daydreaming because it's just give you false hopes.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

Edit: nevermind--just saw the response and haven't read through it yet.

I think you said you are older than you look--and you look like 25 or 26--so I'd guess maybe you are in your thirties?

I dated a 36 year old when I was only 22. Sure--I was "mature" (I mean, not really--but for the sake of the argument) when I was 22, but I was going to mature more because I wasn't yet a fully mature person.

Whereas he was already there. 

I just think age is kind of a big deal in this sort of situation, because if you're not just looking for casual sex then you need to think about the different places you are in your lives at those respective ages.

He's still deciding what he's going to do. And even if he does end up deciding to have a family--he might not want to do that till he's like 30 himself, which would possibly make you 40? 45? I don't know how much older you are than him. 

Or maybe he'll decide in four or five years that he really doesn't want the type of life he thought he'd want at 21.

I just think this is more of an issue with that young of an age. I can get that there are young men who are attractive and have good personalities, but I would feel pretty apprehensive about trying to be in a relationship with someone younger than 25 because even if they are "mature" they are going to be that much more mature in a few years, and they might have a different perspective on what they want in their lives then. That's just how I feel, having been the younger person in a relationship with an older person before.

But as for giving him your phone number--I don't think it's too forward. But I don't know what's considered socially acceptable where you live. And you should consider that he may not see a future with you--especially depending on how old you are and if he wants to have children in the future, though he may be interested in you as a sexual partner. I suspect sometimes younger guys think older women are more sexually experienced and that's the appeal, but idk.

Of course, age could mean nothing and you could work well regardless, in which case you should just give him your phone number and try to be friends with him while you see what he's really like and also what his life goals are and if he's interested. At worst, maybe you'd just make a new friend, or maybe he'd get a confidence boost knowing he's made a good impression on you. Even if you are not compatible, there's nothing wrong with being honest when you find someone attractive. 

It might make them feel good, especially if they are not the type of person to consider it a sexual "invitation" (not an idiot etc.) So long as that isn't a worry, I think it's harmless to be honest and let someone know they've made a good impression on you or improved your day, and you find them interesting. And I don't know how you'll get to know him better if you don't talk to him, which is why I suggested giving him your number. But yeah, you could just write it on a post it note and say--here's my phone number.


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## letsrunlikecrazy (Sep 21, 2015)

I think passing him a note or your phone number will work better than talking to him directly. If other baristas overhear your conversation it might be embarrassing for him, and he might get distracted by another person approaching and possibly not hear you properly. If the cafe is busy it might be too noisy to talk anyway.

I don't have anything to say about the age difference. I wouldn't think it's ideal but maybe it'd be worth having a chat with him just to know what he's like, or perhaps to make a friend.


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## Schizoid (Jan 31, 2015)

Ariel88 said:


> I honestly don't daydream a lot about him, because I have a lot of stuff to do (work, hobbies), but yes, I think about him few times a day. I mostly remember the way he looked at me and smiled. But I don't like daydreaming because it's just give you false hopes.


Hmm I wonder if your feelings toward him might be more of a platonic crush rather than a romantic crush..?

I used to have a few of those platonic crushes in the past, but I mistook those feelings as romantic crushes, given that platonic crush can be as passionate as a romantic crush. When I have a romantic crush on someone, I'll daydream about the more romantic stuffs with them, rather than just admiring them for their good qualities and how they smiled at me etc.








Platonic Crush: What This Means and How to Proceed Platonically


When it comes to liking someone, we’ve all had a platonic crush before. If you’re not sure just what that is, we have all the details for you.




www.lovepanky.com





The website above describes very well how a "platonic crush" looks like... Just like how romantic crush can make one feel happy and giddy and nervous, platonic crush often have those same feelings too, and the only difference between platonic and romantic crush is the romantic/sexual aspect.
You mentioned earlier that you didn't have any sexual feelings toward him, and you also don't have much romantic fantasies about him such as wanting to cuddle together with him, so could your feelings toward him be actually a platonic crush rather than a romantic crush? If you were to become best friends with him, would those feelings ended up disappearing?

And I have the same mbti type as you, I'm an INFJ too, and I'm also an sx/so, so you can imagine how deeply i bond with people, and my friendships tend to be as intense as romantic relationships. Whenever I meet someone I clicked with, I'll crave a deep emotional connection with them, to the extent that I'll sometimes mistake those platonic attraction as romantic attraction. So I wonder if you might be going through the same situation as me? And if you're curious about your enneagram instincts, you seemed like an sx-dominance btw.


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

Schizoid said:


> Hmm I wonder if your feelings toward him might be more of a platonic crush rather than a romantic crush..?
> 
> I used to have a few of those platonic crushes in the past, but I mistook those feelings as romantic crushes, given that platonic crush can be as passionate as a romantic crush. When I have a romantic crush on someone, I'll daydream about the more romantic stuffs with them, rather than just admiring them for their good qualities and how they smiled at me etc.
> 
> ...


Where did I wrote that I don't have sexual feelings towards him?  I actually have them and...ehm...pretty strong. I just try to avoid day dreaming, because I don't know him well yet, so I don't want to create false hopes in my mind.
Btw, thank you for the article, it helped me to realized that I had big platonic crush few years ago with one man - the description fits perfectly. But not to the "barista" guy. 
I have never heard about sx-dominance. I have to find more about it


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## Schizoid (Jan 31, 2015)

Ariel88 said:


> Where did I wrote that I don't have sexual feelings towards him?  I actually have them and...ehm...pretty strong. I just try to avoid day dreaming, because I don't know him well yet, so I don't want to create false hopes in my mind.
> Btw, thank you for the article, it helped me to realized that I had big platonic crush few years ago with one man - the description fits perfectly. But not to the "barista" guy.
> I have never heard about sx-dominance. I have to find more about it


Oopsie, I guess I've misinterpreted what you wrote then, I was actually referring to your post #22. 

But if you have sexual feelings toward him, then it's a romantic crush yes. 

Anyway, wish you all the best about the "barista" guy! That article I linked in my previous post had given a bunch of tips on how to approach a platonic crush, but I think those tips could work well for romantic crushes too.  

This website here has a bunch of information about enneagram instincts, so you can read up about your sx-dominance in here: The 3 Instincts From the Enneagram
To summarise what that article wrote, Sx-dominance is about one-to-one connection and deep soulmate-like bond with people, So-dominance is about friendships and social popularity, while Sp-dominance is about preserving one's physical/mental/financial resources.
Based on the way you approached romance, I'm pretty sure you're an Sx-dominance, although I'm not quite sure if sx/so or sx/sp fits you better. I tend to have a harder time identifying the secondary instincts in people, as compared to their dominant instincts.


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

WickerDeer said:


> Edit: nevermind--just saw the response and haven't read through it yet.
> 
> I think you said you are older than you look--and you look like 25 or 26--so I'd guess maybe you are in your thirties?
> 
> ...


I was thinking about your post quite a lot.
Yes, I'm 31.
Now I don't think the age difference is very big problem, what could be a problem (as you wrote) is totally different life situation we are both in. While I have a stable job and I'm at the beginning of promising career and in 5 years I would like to have a child, he is in his first year at the university at best (I don't know this for sure). 
Maybe we have the same values and perspectives, but I know very well that in his age (he is under 25) I wasn't mature enough to know what's really important and what is not. Maybe he is much more mature than I was in his age, who knows...But still there is a big probability he doesn't want a child in the next 5 years. 

Anyway, it still doesn't change the fact that I would like to know him better. I don't know why, but he impressed me for some reason. 

About giving him my phone number - well, he may think that I flirt with him. And in the country where I live there isn't a consensus about woman giving her phone number to the man. Some people say it's too much and women should be passive in this, some people say why not, we live in the 21st century. 
Sometimes I'm almost depressed for the "dating" situation in this century. First I want to know the person without some expectation, even as a friend, no matter if there is a sexual attraction or not. But there is still a lot of prejudices about how woman and man should meet, who should approach etc. 

Thank you for the last paragraph you wrote. It reminds me words of my psychologist


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

Schizoid said:


> Oopsie, I guess I've misinterpreted what you wrote then, I was actually referring to your post #22.
> 
> But if you have sexual feelings toward him, then it's a romantic crush yes.
> 
> ...


Thank you 
And thanks for the website, it's interesting and yes, according to the description I'm Sx-dominance. Sx/So, for sure  
And you?


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## Schizoid (Jan 31, 2015)

Ariel88 said:


> Thank you
> And thanks for the website, it's interesting and yes, according to the description I'm Sx-dominance. Sx/So, for sure
> And you?


You're welcome. And I'm an Sx/So too. Glad to know that you have found your type, and us having the same enneagram instincts explains why I find myself able to relate to your threads...


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

Well, dear people, today I was in the cafe and now I'm pretty confused and for some reason I feel like a teenage girl, no clue what to do and IF to do something.

The guy - barista was preparing drinks and coffees today, so he didn't see me until I came for a drink. The moment he saw that it's me who is coming, his face literally lit up. He smiled at me with raised eyebrows, I was surprised, I thanked him and smiled shyly at him (for some reason I still feel shy around him). 

After a while, he took his civil clothes and he prepared himself some sandwich and went to eat it in a cafe. There were many tables free but he sat down at the table which was the nearest to me and we could see each other. I was thinking what is he doing, why he has to sit exactly here? Once I glanced at him, he also glanced at me and we both quickly looked away. I didn't look at him again, discouraged by the fact he looked away. 
Then it happened few more times - glancing at each other and both looking away. He had pretty serious face, by the way. 
But when I was leaving the cafe, I took my cup to hand it to the baristas. The moment he saw me getting up from the table he stopped doing what he was doing and he watched me until I came to the bar and handed the cup, he hurried up to the bar and said: Thank you, good bye, and smiled at me a bit while looking into my eyes. Every time he looks me in the eyes I feel like he wants to say something with those eyes. But maybe I'm wrong. 

Well, I described it in such detail because I'm confused by his behavior. One time he is apparently happy to see me, the other time he looks away.I was observing the way he behave to other customers and he is not so friendly and happy with them.
I don't want to be fool and just rely on his smiles and deep looks during interaction, when he had a chance to approach and he didn't.

Do you all have some ideas?  Maybe he would look at me like at fool, when I'll approach him...


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## secondpassing (Jan 13, 2018)

All of our ideas will really come from you, as you are the reporter of the said event.

My prediction is that he was indeed happy to see you, really wanted to say something but either couldn't come up with something good enough to say, stalled and stressed over his inability to say anything, realized his time was up when you got up, and decided to play it "cool" with a flat face.

I highly doubt he was trying to discourage you. He's probably trying to just hide his embarrassment. Well, you'll never know unless you talk to him.


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## Ariel88 (Oct 7, 2019)

secondpassing said:


> All of our ideas will really come from you, as you are the reporter of the said event.
> 
> My prediction is that he was indeed happy to see you, really wanted to say something but either couldn't come up with something good enough to say, stalled and stressed over his inability to say anything, realized his time was up when you got up, and decided to play it "cool" with a flat face.
> 
> I highly doubt he was trying to discourage you. He's probably trying to just hide his embarrassment. Well, you'll never know unless you talk to him.


Yeah, you are right. I hope next time he will be at the cash desk for orders, so I can talk to him somehow...


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## dulcinea (Aug 22, 2011)

I was getting excited, at first, thinking you might have been Cappucino one sugar in this video, but realized that's not a UK flag haha:





But, seriously, I think it's a tricky situation. I guess it would be good to put feelers out. If you have him as a friend on social media, maybe look for an excuse to talk to him that would appear innocuous enough that he doesn't think you're aggressively. I don't see a problem with going to the coffee shop at different times of the day. I find it's a behavior people behave in that isn't necessarily because they want to see a specific person. I suppose it's difficult for it to appear casual, and it's hard to say exactly what to do in this situation. I suppose it takes a good deal of balance. I hope it works out.


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## marybluesky (Apr 23, 2012)

I had been interested in a guy 8/5 years younger than me for 3/5 years. I considered him the great love of my life, but never confessed my feelings until a night in a group journey where he asked if I liked him. He had a girlfriend at the time and we didn't go further...

I know it is so stressful to approach a guy you find attractive, but after doing it for the first time it gets normal.
How did your story go on? 


secondpassing said:


> For reference, I'm 25, and every 30+ woman intimidates me a bit.


You remind me of my younger years when every guy +3 years older scared me, while it's considered normal for girls to date older guys, even some prefer the man to be +5 years their senior, specially in more traditional societies where he is expected to be the breadwinner.
The thing is, the imbalance in power scared me- and I'd say rightly. Of course not every relationship with an age gap is unhealthy and we talk about -10 years of gap. Sometimes people click very well. However I understand the fear.


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## Senah (Oct 17, 2017)

God, I don't know how all you other personalities endure this. Seriously - this is the most (no offense) drawn out thing I have ever heard. Just slip the guy your number, or ask him out, and you have your answer in less than 12 hours. It is almost like someone enjoying the chase but not the meal. 

Lordy - I guess I am just an ENTP through and through. I actually am feeling empathy after reading this thread or something.


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