# American teenagers suck.(and are generally pretty useless)



## Rihanna (Nov 30, 2020)

Obviously the statement above is a generalization not a universal.

I was thinking about this, this morning when I thought about how some parents in the US will need to coax their children into doing chores by paying them something like an hourly wage to make them do it.

The explanation being to teach them the value of a dollar and the underlying assumption that one should not do anything except for the underlying incentive of money. God forbid you do it to help your mother or father or contribute to a household you live in, freely - of your own volition.

And when I was a young child inculcated solely onto the American culture still, - that didn't seem to me like a crazy thing. (Even if my own family didn't happen to do it that way.)

Now, as an adult, and importantly as someone who has a general sense for how people are raised outside the US in many areas of the world I find that fact somewhat absurd.

I spent significant amount of time in a society of strong gender segregation and pretty solid gender roles. So having to spend a lot of time with the women, I did what a lot of they did. I cooked. I cleaned. I did the laundry. I counted and managed the money. And so on and so forth...

And I remember this hitting me over the course of growing up a few different ways.

1- I grew up in an immaculately clean home. (Whether in the US or abroad.) And although some would think it.
Poverty stricken countries do not = unclean living situation. In fact the most impoverished still have a culture of cleanliness and a sense of dignity as well as pride about that and the look of their home, (sidenote but also the way they dress)...many Americans don't. I wasn't allowed much visiting of friends when I was young. But when I went off to college in the US and visited other students I realized very quickly the mismatch. Many didn't seem to mind if clothes were strewn across the rooms. Their bedrooms smelled like BO and they had no idea. Sheets were clearly not changed for months. Bathrooms were disgusting, I tried very hard not to exhibit that on my face. (I remember one time almost passing out when someone tried to get me to do pushups in their bedroom w/ terrible BO of exponential caliber and making the excuse I was hot to open the window. And doing pushups in the hall as I didn't have the heart to tell that person how bad it was, especially since she had the car. ) The living rooms may have smelled like weed or animal poop. Dishes piled up, each roommate too lazy to do anything about it and avoiding it as not to be expected to do it each time. Without it being said the kitchen stinked of the rotting food particles. etc. Etc.

2- I lived in the dorms and there was a stove on the ground floor by the laundry room. I was never taught to eat out and college food seemed absurdly expensive and of bad quality. So I would go downstairs to cook and other students would pass by and look at me like I was crazy. An alien almost - for cooking.
I don't think anyone else in the building ever used that stove. - Don't get me started on how several didn't know how to add detergent to their wash.

3- This also reminded me of when I was in a biology class in highschool in the US and we all had to slice a piece of a potato to look under a microscope I think? And watching everyone struggle to use a knife was an eye opener. I even felt so awkward I pretended to be as lacking in manual skills as all of them so that I wouldn't stand out. But I could have sliced that potato 10 different ways with no board and in less than half a minute. They were all holding the knife with the tip of their fingers as if they'd never held one before and ....now so realize - they probably haven't.

I can also count large amounts of cash quickly for example. Someone saw it and thought I was a drug dealer. And cashier's/tellers here are so slow. They have to separate bills onto the table to or in each hand pull each bill from the other hand to count and count coins one my one. As children we'd go do the shopping on our own, get fresh bread, milk, and snacks, build relationships with vendors (baker, milk man, falafel shop etc. we called "uncle" & "auntie." Here a child left alone for two seconds is called child neglect while I used to take public transport alone in middle school and walk over a mile by foot to/from school every day. There's more....


Again, this ain't everyone, but it's a surprising lot of people - who are full supposedly totally grown adults that don't know how to do something as simple as washing dishes, make themselves food, (actual food not a sandwich), fold their own laundry, change their sheets etc.

It's disappointing.

Hell - some don't even know how to make a phone-call to a plumber/electrician say, let alone fix any plumbing by themselves. Many have no real thinking effort invested in political discussions.

And it's not like they are particularly great at anything as a group which would accommodate for the imbalance. Like it's not like they are just so great at school they neglect themselves physically.

I often hear for example the justification of the decline in cooking in America in specific being caused by women entering the war effort/workforce, and then the spread of "easy meal" products.

This I don't believe, as plenty of people work and cook. Certainly most immigrant families. To the point I literally can count the number of times I've had fast food in my life on one hand, and it's been when I had been on road trips with really no other choice. It's not just my mother. In these other countries I've lived I've seen many men and women with full time jobs who still cook regularly as they breathe.

So yeah...idk

Maybe just a general lack of discipline and structure as a value in the US and more of an emphasis on excess and leisure and a grind just to gain kind of mentality. As opposed to responsibility being the higher culturally ensconced virtue. (Although you'd think independence as a value generally includes being able to depend on yourself.) But maybe it's a lack of social inter-dependence that's somehow the issue, now that I think about it.

_Shrug_


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## Flabarac Brupip (May 9, 2020)

I'm not a teen, but I just hire a maid service to keep my apartment clean. Otherwise I literally can't keep a clean apartment. Believe me, I've really wanted to before I had the maid service, but just couldn't.


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

I could do all that stuff before I left home too. I sometimes used the stove in the dorm to cook, but often I went to the dining hall, On the weekends, most of my "nutrition" was liquid based (but I usually stopped at the Subway on the way home from the bar). I learned to scramble my own eggs at the age of 4. I had to wash my own bedding every week by the time I was 10. I helped my parents chop vegetables as a kid, and I was tasked with washing any dishes that didn't fit in the dishwasher easily (my sister had to dry). I left home at 17 and joined the Navy. I never went back to living with my parents after that. 

Now, I could probably dust, vacuum, and declutter my apartment a bit more than I do, but I live alone. I keep up with my dishes, I clean my counters and stove, I cook my meals in bulk and freeze them for easy reheating later, my laundry gets done every other week, my trash goes out when it is full, and there's no physical obstructions caused by clutter anywhere in my apartment. I have lived alone for 6 years now. I do miss just how spoiled I was when I had a wife and MIL doing a lot of the chores for almost 16 years before that, but that's an entirely different story. 

It took me a few years to get back on my feet financially after the divorce, but I now have enough cash on hand to survive a week or two, if I had to. The rest is earning interest in the bank. I have a 401K, a 403B, and a Roth IRA . All of them are growing quite nicely. 

The younger generations will learn how to do these things the hard way, when nobody else is there to do it for them.


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## ESFJMouse (Oct 13, 2020)

They are involved in important causes, and bringing awareness to various issues using social media, and they are quite adept at this. They have their gifts, and the ones I know are quite noble and principled. They will find a way to navigate the world.

Definitely though, I was doing chores like laundry at age 8, I wasn't given at allowance for it. But by my very early twenties I was prepared to buy a small home and easily care for it because I was comfortable with household tasks.


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## Ms. Aligned (Aug 26, 2021)

Rihanna said:


> Obviously the statement above is a generalization not a universal.
> 
> I was thinking about this, this morning when I thought about how some parents in the US will need to coax their children into doing chores by paying them something like an hourly wage to make them do it.
> 
> ...


I can explain this, I think. there are a lot more grandmas and grandpas being front and center when raising kids. A lot of them are old, and don't have the....gusto...of making meals every day. Not only that but hours upon hours of food network have seriously made them creative!

Since the pandemic, I love cooking now! I feel like I've settled on some forms or flavors that could be my signature dishes, and they're absolute not based on the best ingredients. In some ways, I feel like pulling the flavors together into something everyone understands, recognizes, and shares together is better than if I have the best tasting dish. That could be my goal...but it isn't. I want harmony and western ways of peace. So I don't have to fight anyone this christmas.


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## islandlight (Aug 13, 2013)

I don't think it's just nationality. I'm Canadian. When my daughter was 4 or 5, I started putting food lower down so she could prepare her own snacks or get something to drink.

Then I married a Mexican. He was horrified that she got her own food. I guess in his world, you were supposed to sit there and wait for the servant to bring you something.

My husband and his son would leave their dirty cups and glasses in the living room when they were finished. Any Canadian of my acquaintance (of any age) would take their cup to the sink when finished.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

Seems like it's been going on since Socrates time. These youth...universally the worst, deplorable, lazy people on earth according to various grumpy adults with bugs up their butts in every generation.

edit: It seems this quote is actually from a Cambridge dissertation, that is a summary/paraphrasing of complaints against children from ancient times. It isn't a quote of Socrates! Fortunately Rihanna noticed this. 





Misbehaving Children in Ancient Times – Quote Investigator







quoteinvestigator.com






* *





*“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”

--Socrates








*


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## Rihanna (Nov 30, 2020)

.


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## Rihanna (Nov 30, 2020)

WickerDeer said:


> Seems like it's been going on since Socrates time. These youth...universally the worst, deplorable, lazy people on earth according to various grumpy adults with bugs up their butts in every generation.
> 
> *“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”
> 
> ...



Funny that you misquote Socrates, a man put to death on charges of impiety and corrupting the youth. Not to mention one of the greatest philosophers of all time and a bedrock of western civilization and thought as we know it. Actual origin, if you're curious.

Additionally, it's not "the youth." It's some youth I've happened to encounter. Excess, bad manners, contempt only hurts themselves. Gluttony, bad manners, and contemptuous outlooks are unattractive features in individuals. I never mentioned disrespect to elders although I would say American society has much more disrespect for elders than most other societies which have a tendency to revere elders. I worked for a law-firm taking on nursing home abuse cases, let me tell you, one of the most depressing jobs of my life.

Fun fact: In many present day cultures children still stand up for their elders, teachers, etc. Russia for just for one.

Children should not be servants to the household. I am a firm believer that adults owe their children not vice versa. They didn't ask to be here, but they shouldn't be lazy. That makes their own life hard. Once they get out in the real world they'll need to know basic self care skills or they'll sink into a whirlpool of depression, lack of structure, and bad habits that create an over all bad life.

But anyway, there's a reason all teenagers do become adults eventually.


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## Rihanna (Nov 30, 2020)

Ms. Aligned said:


> I can explain this, I think. there are a lot more grandmas and grandpas being front and center when raising kids. A lot of them are old, and don't have the....gusto...of making meals every day. Not only that but hours upon hours of food network have seriously made them creative!
> 
> Since the pandemic, I love cooking now! I feel like I've settled on some forms or flavors that could be my signature dishes, and they're absolute not based on the best ingredients. In some ways, I feel like pulling the flavors together into something everyone understands, recognizes, and shares together is better than if I have the best tasting dish. That could be my goal...but it isn't. I want harmony and western ways of peace. So I don't have to fight anyone this christmas.


which dishes? I'm looking for new things to try.

As to your comment. I mean grandparents in my experience love cooking for their grandchildren and stuffing them with food, spoiling them rotten. I don't think anything ever gave mine so much joy. It gives them purpose too. If anything food brings people together and creates that harmony but to each their own. Cultures do differ.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

Rihanna said:


> Funny that you misquote Socrates, a man put to death on charges of impiety and corrupting the youth. Not to mention one of the greatest philosophers of all time and a bedrock of western civilization and thought as we know it. Actual origin, if you're curious.
> 
> Additionally, it's not "the youth." It's some youth I've happened to encounter. Excess, bad manners, contempt only hurts themselves. Gluttony, bad manners, and contemptuous outlooks are unattractive features in individuals. I never mentioned disrespect to elders although I would say American society has much more disrespect for elders than most other societies which have a tendency to revere elders. I worked for a law-firm taking on nursing home abuse cases, let me tell you, one of the most depressing jobs of my life.
> 
> ...


Ah yeah, good to know that the quote is actually a summary and paraphrasing of ancient complaints against children. 






Misbehaving Children in Ancient Times – Quote Investigator







quoteinvestigator.com





But you are welcome for misquoting Socrates--yet another thing to be offended by and complain about, I suppose, which seems to be quite an exciting and fulfilling activity, judging by your recent threads. I'll just step out. I find figuring out the complexities of problems in an objective way, and then coming up with solutions more stimulating than complaining about various groups of people, though of course it's totally normal--people do it all the time. It's just not my cup of tea so I will show myself out of the thread.


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## Cederbusch (Sep 1, 2017)

Rihanna said:


> God forbid you do it to help your mother or father or contribute to a household you live in


To me, this is error #1. 

I never ask my kids "to help me" with stuff. I just make them know that we live in our household together, and therefore are responsible together for all the things that need doing. In asking them to help me, I imply that it is in fact only my job, and they do me a favor. I´d rather that they see it as shared responsibility. If they won´t do it, neither will I. 

I´ve let things pile up, just to make my point. But the again, I´m INTP. Maybe not like most.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

I assure ya as someone who grew up with a maniac making us clean around crevices with toothbrushes, some US kids who end up slob adults were taught and made to clean. I just refuse to waste that much of my life, obsessive about tedious tasks that just always repeat. The shit will get done. Obsessive cleaning is not my thing. 

I didn’t pay my kids in cash for chores. That was called a phone was their payment for doing chores. I guess still payment. Whether they are slobs or not in their own homes is not my business or care. I just care if they do chores if they live at my home.

From what I’ve seen so far of my eldest daughter on her own, she takes pride in keeping her home clean. Good for her. Wouldn’t really matter to me though if she were a slob though either in her own home. That is her business.


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## Somewherenothere (3 mo ago)

We should work together to destroy western society


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