# Type me.



## owlet (May 7, 2010)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I do mostly get ENTJ as a result on most tests (or INTP/INTJ) but it's hard to know for sure since my functions are quite oddly developed.
> 
> Ok, so , some examples of Se and Si.
> 
> ...


Si isn't about memory and Se isn't about thrill-seeking. They're modes of collecting/processing data. I recommend finding a variety of sources and reading up on them to get a good understanding yourself, then come back to trying to find your type.

However, based off your responses so far, I'd say xSTP. I'm not really sure between Se dominant and Ti dominant, but I'd lean towards ISTP due to brevity (Se) and how you appear to have already come to a conclusion (indicates judging dominant).


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

laurie17 said:


> Si isn't about memory and Se isn't about thrill-seeking. They're modes of collecting/processing data. I recommend finding a variety of sources and reading up on them to get a good understanding yourself, then come back to trying to find your type.
> 
> However, based off your responses so far, I'd say xSTP. I'm not really sure between Se dominant and Ti dominant, but I'd lean towards ISTP due to brevity (Se) and how you appear to have already come to a conclusion (indicates judging dominant).


If I would research the cognitive functions what would the point of asking for help be?

But I did research them ... "modes of collecting data" - yes, and people with developed Se tend to like thrilling experiences, most ISTPs and ESTPs enjoy doing stuff that excite their senses. If you find xSTPs that are just not "doers" and "in the moment" than you've got misstyped xNTPs.

And Si about empiricism, therefore - memory. It makes you aware of your physical body as opposed to Se - making you feel aware of your surroundings.


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## owlet (May 7, 2010)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> If I would research the cognitive functions what would the point of asking for help be?
> 
> But I did research them ... "modes of collecting data" - yes, and people with developed Se tend to like thrilling experiences, most ISTPs and ESTPs enjoy doing stuff that excite their senses. If you find xSTPs that are just not "doers" and "in the moment" than you've got misstyped xNTPs.
> 
> And Si about empiricism, therefore - memory. It makes you aware of your physical body as opposed to Se - making you feel aware of your surroundings.


The point would be to learn and develop your understanding so you can make sense of the system with little external input. Asking for help is fine - that's how people learn - but it's useful to do some reading around. It's like a student going to lectures and only using what the lecturer gives them rather than reading books on the subject: you don't get as good an understanding as you could.

I'd argue the definition of 'thrilling experiences' (and that the preference for such activities are purely indicative of Se dom/aux types). If we're saying Se is about the external environment, then wouldn't a thrilling experience be going to a completely new country and exploring? There would be plenty of new sensory data there. My ESFP friend hates roller coasters whereas I love them, as does my INTP sister.

Si can make you aware of your body, yes, but everyone has varying levels of good and bad memory abilities. I have a very good memory, as do several of my friends, some of whom use Si, but not all. A lot of the descriptions based around behaviours are based on correlations and can be misleading.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

laurie17 said:


> The point would be to learn and develop your understanding so you can make sense of the system with little external input. Asking for help is fine - that's how people learn - but it's useful to do some reading around. It's like a student going to lectures and only using what the lecturer gives them rather than reading books on the subject: you don't get as good an understanding as you could.
> 
> I'd argue the definition of 'thrilling experiences' (and that the preference for such activities are purely indicative of Se dom/aux types). If we're saying Se is about the external environment, then wouldn't a thrilling experience be going to a completely new country and exploring? There would be plenty of new sensory data there. My ESFP friend hates roller coasters whereas I love them, as does my INTP sister.
> 
> Si can make you aware of your body, yes, but everyone has varying levels of good and bad memory abilities. I have a very good memory, as do several of my friends, some of whom use Si, but not all. A lot of the descriptions based around behaviours are based on correlations and can be misleading.


Can you please give me a link to a good Se/Si description? I did read on the subject but you seem to have a different view and I'd like to see what exactly is Se/Si in your opinion. 

The main reason why I think I don't use them much is because I'm always in my head, unaware of what happens near me. I'm the type of person that would only realize the house is on fire after getting third degree burns. Of course, when I work it's important to be focused and in the moment so I focus. But in any other situation I'm oblivious of what happens around me. It's a miracle I haven't been walked over by a car.


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## something987 (Jul 20, 2014)

Alright, I'll try again. I'm not crossing my fingers.



L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I would like to be:
> 
> 1.successful
> 2.knowledgeble
> ...


These are generally Te dom/aux goals. External expression of intelligence/power.



> I wouldn't like to be:
> 
> 1.mediocre
> 2.ignorant
> ...


More evidence for Te - pretty much the opposite of what you said above, which makes sense, obviously



> Of course there are. People see what they want and are prepared to see. I get everything from "the sweetest, warmest person ever" to "cold hearted" and "very inadequate".


Judging function, likely Te or Ti again since I see no evidence of internal/external expression of feeling other than that coming from the other person. Objective assessment of others' words.



> 1.Imagination
> 2.Logic
> 3.Making a differance
> 4.Freedom
> ...


Again lots of Thinking-related goals here. Knowledge, self sufficiency, power, all require intelligence.



> I welcome new situations and enjoy the process of figuring out what the unknown situation is going to be like.


Te. Not sure what it's combined with - could be Si, even though you say you don't have it, trying to figure out the situation based on past external data; could be Ni, even though you say you don't use it, though I see no evidence of it. Inconclusive.



> Definitely an extrovert.


Alrighty then.



> I don't mind social norms unless they contradict with my own norms.


Seems like inferior Fi.



> I believe authority is a necessary evil but I tend to defy it. Anyway, the power it has over the masses is preposterous. Have you heard about the Milgram experiment?


Then this might be the Ni showing up. Te is the clear dominant function, but I don't see Si doing this without good reason. Seems like a subconscious act, so I'm going with Ni.



> Doing something both interesting to me and challanging recharges my bateries the most. Things that are boring to me drain me the most.


Likely just more evidence for Te dominance. Second part could be arguably either Se or Ne.



> That's a very broad question. To answer it I'll give an example. There is this 100 years old man on his death bed. He asks everyone not to grieve for he has lived a wonderful life - he has witnessed the growth of human kind through so many events and inventions. This is my worst case scenario - live as much as I can in order to look into the future as much as I can. In the best case scenario I would have been the inventor.


Some evidence for Ni-Se rather than Si-Ne. Wanting to experience as much of life, but only secondary to being innovative, which would more likely be Te+Ni. Si doesn't seem to be as future oriented as Se.



> I'm not very enthusiastic by nature and I can't recall a time when I felt particularly fine but I feel best when I think about stuff I'm interested in. I feel particularly good when I'm right about something or when I'm in control or when I'm with friends.


That last part would be Te speaking.



> Most of my decisions don't involve others so I just think about it in terms of what would make more sense and would provide the best outcome through its efficiency.


Going to go with Ni here since it's hard to tell either way. Ni (and Se) again being more future oriented and theoretical (particularly Ni), rather than recalling what worked in the past and improvising from there (Si + Ne).



> I have a lot of fun inside my head. Compared to that, everything that I can experience in reality just loses its color.


Well that right there sounds like a Ni trait if I ever heard one. It's certainly not Si that makes up imaginary internal worlds.

It's pretty clear Te is your dominant function, I didn't include every Te answer because it would've just been redundant. Based on this questionnaire I'd say ENTJ sounds about right.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Ksilva said:


> Alright, I'll try again. I'm not crossing my fingers.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for your input. Quite nicely explained. I will fill up some other questionnaires that maybe will be even more accurate/conclusive.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Flash news: not that anyone cares ( obviously ) but my Ni seems to be working awfully fine lately. Right to the point where I have premonitions.


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> Flash news: not that anyone cares ( obviously ) but my Ni seems to be working awfully fine lately. Right to the point where I have premonitions.


That's pretty cool!  I was looking back at my childhood, teen years, young adult years, and trying to see if i could pinpoint a time frame where certain cognitive functions seemed to strengthen in me. I'm INFP Dom Fi, Aux Ne, Tert Si, Inf Te. I definitely can see Fi strong in me as far back as i can remember to 3 years old or so. Te definitely is not a strong function in me but i do use it. I do like to organize externally, whether in recordkeeping or objects. Recordkeeping is boring to me though i can do it well, but it's very unsastisfying and boring if i have to do too much of it. Explaining complex logical things to people is painful for me, my Te is very weak that way. But i am more short winded and bullet pointed and want closure on theory quickly like Te does. So my Te definitly is my main Thinking function but it's kind of erratic in me. Sometimes i use it well in certain things, other times i don't use it well. It's an unstable function in me, so i guess maybe we could look at the inferior function as being an unstable function. As for my Tert Si, i had pretty good memory until i hit perimenopausal hormonal imbalances in mid life and now my memory kinda sucks. But up until around 45 or so my memory was still quite sharp but not as wide a data base as i think a dom or aux Si would be? I used to have a good memory though, but not as much in people's faces. I only remember a few faces and names, and it's usually people i interract with more than a few times for it to stick in my memory unless it was a real deep profound meaningful interraction. Other than that people can say don't you remember me? and i say either no or i remember your face but not your name. I live in a small town, so that happens alot. I'm very selective in my memory (unconsciously automatically - not deliberately) with faces/names of people i remember, most of them i don't remember. So my Si was orite, nowhere as strong as my Fi for sure though. Fi was always the leader of my pack! I had a strong sense of moral, ethics and right from wrong from i was a little girl. Now to aux Ne. I was really trying to pick my brain to look back and see where i first notice aux Ne in me? And i can't figure it out in me as a child? I wonder if our aux develops later in life and not as a child? I know i used it somewhat in my teens, then more from my 20's onward. 

maybe that's something to explore is when does aux kick in? not sure?



EDIT - ADD MORE:

omg!!! i just found an article that says in it the aux kicks in at around 21!! makes sense to me, cause that is about when i can start to see much useage of it in me. And in my 30's more so, and tremendously so in my 40's. like it keeps getting stronger! maybe that's how nature made us, cause if the aux gets us out of stress and depression, the older we get is the more stress and depression we would have passed through in life as it adds up along the way, so it makes sense our aux keeps developing more as we age imo! to help us not be so weighed down in so much stress/depression that has happened along life's way, so that we can survive rather than die from such depression. Maybe people who commit suicide just weren't able to activate enough useage of their aux? Maybe it pertains to people committing crimes too, because they are in unhealthy state of mind when they commit crimes. And also people who live chronically depressed and it just keeps sinking them deeper into more medical distress.

here's the article:

http://www.careerplanner.com/8cognitivefunctions/cognitive-functions-simply-explained.cfm


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> That's pretty cool!  I was looking back at my childhood, teen years, young adult years, and trying to see if i could pinpoint a time frame where certain cognitive functions seemed to strengthen in me. I'm INFP Dom Fi, Aux Ne, Tert Si, Inf Te. I definitely can see Fi strong in me as far back as i can remember to 3 years old or so. Te definitely is not a strong function in me but i do use it. I do like to organize externally, whether in recordkeeping or objects. Recordkeeping is boring to me though i can do it well, but it's very unsastisfying and boring if i have to do too much of it. Explaining complex logical things to people is painful for me, my Te is very weak that way. But i am more short winded and bullet pointed and want closure on theory quickly like Te does. So my Te definitly is my main Thinking function but it's kind of erratic in me. Sometimes i use it well in certain things, other times i don't use it well. It's an unstable function in me, so i guess maybe we could look at the inferior function as being an unstable function. As for my Tert Si, i had pretty good memory until i hit perimenopausal hormonal imbalances in mid life and now my memory kinda sucks. But up until around 45 or so my memory was still quite sharp but not as wide a data base as i think a dom or aux Si would be? I used to have a good memory though, but not as much in people's faces. I only remember a few faces and names, and it's usually people i interract with more than a few times for it to stick in my memory unless it was a real deep profound meaningful interraction. Other than that people can say don't you remember me? and i say either no or i remember your face but not your name. I live in a small town, so that happens alot. I'm very selective in my memory (unconsciously automatically - not deliberately) with faces/names of people i remember, most of them i don't remember. So my Si was orite, nowhere as strong as my Fi for sure though. Fi was always the leader of my pack! I had a strong sense of moral, ethics and right from wrong from i was a little girl. Now to aux Ne. I was really trying to pick my brain to look back and see where i first notice aux Ne in me? And i can't figure it out in me as a child? I wonder if our aux develops later in life and not as a child? I know i used it somewhat in my teens, then more from my 20's onward.
> 
> maybe that's something to explore is when does aux kick in? not sure?
> 
> ...


From a psychological point of view maybe depression has something to do with aux functions, from a medical point of view however it's a very weak theory. Again, if we're talking jungian psychology you might be right. I am depressed and it seems weird to be depressed at 20 when you basically have your whole life ahead of you. If I really am Te dom then my Ni is quite highly repressed, but I don't really see the connection between my Ni and the reasons why I'm depressed.

My Fi is quite well developed and when I were a child my Fe was higher too I believe. Now my Fe is pretty much nonexistent I suppose since everybody tells me that I have no regard for other people's feelings. Although I'm quite an altruistic person.

I think my Ne is alright.


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## Neo1 (Aug 18, 2014)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> Nope. Not an F type. Not a Ni dominant but who knows. Mostly I'm stuck between ENTJ/INTJ/INTP.


I'm thinking you seem like ENTJ. Based on your responses to the questionnaire, you seem to think in a rational way, so that suggests NT. If you usually like being around people and being fast paced, then you are more likely E than I. Also if you had some INFJ-like qualities then you probably use Ni, which is also used by INTJ/ENTJ. So I'd say ENTJ with quite developed F.


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## owlet (May 7, 2010)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> Can you please give me a link to a good Se/Si description? I did read on the subject but you seem to have a different view and I'd like to see what exactly is Se/Si in your opinion.


Ne-Si vs. Ni-Se: Myers-Briggs Function Pairs

That's a good starting point, but try to just do a google search, then look for good books (online articles/journals too, maybe). My differing opinion might just be a different interpretation of the same thing.




L'Enfant Terrible said:


> Flash news: not that anyone cares ( obviously ) but my Ni seems to be working awfully fine lately. Right to the point where I have premonitions.


Ni doesn't really provide premonitions. My Ne-Si-using sister has had dreams of 'the future' (my opinion on most is that you dream it so you work towards that point). Ni is more about linking seemingly unrelated data together in a particular way - viewing everything as inter-connected, like a large jigsaw puzzle, but very easily changed. So with the future, it can notice trends. It takes a variety of data and filters it together into a new conclusion (not saying it's original because not much is these days). Ni also looks for meaning sort of 'between the lines'. I tend to think of it as the Literature function - analysing things which appear to have no meaning but, based on the context, can be significant (it's also good at making weak links between things seem stronger my altering the view/perception of them).


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> From a psychological point of view maybe depression has something to do with aux functions, from a medical point of view however it's a very weak theory. Again, if we're talking jungian psychology you might be right. I am depressed and it seems weird to be depressed at 20 when you basically have your whole life ahead of you. If I really am Te dom then my Ni is quite highly repressed, but I don't really see the connection between my Ni and the reasons why I'm depressed.
> 
> My Fi is quite well developed and when I were a child my Fe was higher too I believe. Now my Fe is pretty much nonexistent I suppose since everybody tells me that I have no regard for other people's feelings. Although I'm quite an altruistic person.
> 
> I think my Ne is alright.


engaging the aux in activities that stimilate the aux helps us to relieve depression/stress. 

Ne is endless possibilities something could become. Ni is focused on making sure all the dots connect properly and a plan or theory can be perfect and sound without any flaw. Ne just rolls along and makes it up along the way rather than pre-planning. Ne is not as worried of preplanning to avoid errors, it is actively rolling along and making decisions along the way as to what the next best step is. Ni likes to follow an exact plan that is well thought out. But of course functions work together with other functions otherwise none of us could have any balance in our life. So with Ne there is other functions working to make decisions with Ne, not Ne alone. Like Ni also, other functions are working to make decisions with Ni, not Ni alone.

If you are an ENTJ, your Te and Ni make decisions together if a plan isn't working the way planned. So you have the ability to act spontaneously to quickly look for an alternate solution because your Te is working with your Ni.

I've heard Ni users complain that strong Ne in others tires them out, like it can be exhausting to them.

When a person has Fi or Fe in dom or aux, they are termed as a Feeler. xxFx. I know for sure you are not an xxFx. You are definitely a more practical logical thinker as it shows in all you communicate so far. So when you say that your Fi is quite well developed, can you give some examples of what you mean by this?


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> engaging the aux in activities that stimilate the aux helps us to relieve depression/stress.
> 
> Ne is endless possibilities something could become. Ni is focused on making sure all the dots connect properly and a plan or theory can be perfect and sound without any flaw. Ne just rolls along and makes it up along the way rather than pre-planning. Ne is not as worried of preplanning to avoid errors, it is actively rolling along and making decisions along the way as to what the next best step is. Ni likes to follow an exact plan that is well thought out. But of course functions work together with other functions otherwise none of us could have any balance in our life. So with Ne there is other functions working to make decisions with Ne, not Ne alone. Like Ni also, other functions are working to make decisions with Ni, not Ni alone.
> 
> ...


I can act selfishly and throw a tantrum sometimes if I get really angry. It's also quite easy to offend me. When my depression relapses feelings get quite messed up and it's very uncomfortable.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

laurie17 said:


> Ne-Si vs. Ni-Se: Myers-Briggs Function Pairs
> 
> That's a good starting point, but try to just do a google search, then look for good books (online articles/journals too, maybe). My differing opinion might just be a different interpretation of the same thing.
> 
> ...


Premonitions or "dreams of the future" are just that - linking seemingly unrelated data together in a particular way. There is no mystical or spiritual thing to them. 

Can you give me some real life examples of how Ni works for you?

Thank you.


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

Still seems like ESTP.

Maybe @Entropic has had more sleep. :kitteh:


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> Still seems like ESTP.
> 
> Maybe @Entropic has had more sleep. :kitteh:


Your opinion is welcome and all but can you give some explanation on that?

How is Se my dom function or Ti my aux?


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> Your opinion is welcome and all but can you give some explanation on that?
> 
> How is Se my dom function or Ti my aux?


Well, a lot of people are saying that you're a Te dominant, but Se+Ti is easily confused as Te. 

What I've seen from your posts is a _lot _of Se-force behind your words, and a certain 'dominance', for lack of a better word, in the way you execute your prose, initiate conversation, as well as a bit of conflict.

You don't appear to be utilizing an external logical system, ie: Te, but you are definitely primarily logical in the ego. It's just that it's a very personal, reserved logical system-- Ti. :kitteh:

You definitely appear extroverted, at the very least-- And if anyone would know that you're stronger in Se, it'd be Entropic, because he's Se Dual-seeking, which further confirms that particular assessment.

Now, it's _possible _that, as an ENTJ, your Se can appear much stronger, being a sneaky tertiary function, but the Te-Ni being in the ego together just _doesn't _add up according to the cognition behind the text, or at least what _I've _read of it.

But, your being drawn to strong Ni, and having it around you, _does _make sense, because as an ESTP, you'd be Ni dual-seeking.

And I can probably bet that you hate/dislike/cringe at Fi being utilized by other people (Fi PoLR in ESTP) If that's the case, then Fi dual-seeking's probably impossible for you. Which means ENTJ is out anyway. And ExTP is in. But, I don't see any Ne. I'm seeing Se-Ti-Fe. So, ESTP seems logical to me.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> Well, a lot of people are saying that you're a Te dominant, but Se+Ti is easily confused as Te.
> 
> What I've seen from your posts is a _lot _of Se-force behind your words, and a certain 'dominance', for lack of a better word, in the way you execute your prose, initiate conversation, as well as a bit of conflict.
> 
> ...


I can't see myself in any Se descriptions. I'm not that much of a daredevil. I like driving but I don't usually drive because I am mostly in my head and afraid not to crash the car because of that. I am definitely not a "physical" person. I have always disliked sports and was always very bad at them too. In my head I might be a physically fit FBI agent but in reality I don't do any physical work unless I really have to. I am not clueless my dear, I know enough about functions to realize that I'm NT.

And while I use both Te and Ti and they're both easy to use for me, I prefer Te. An argument is not valid to me unless it can be backed up by external data.


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I can't see myself in any Se descriptions. I'm not that much of a daredevil. I like driving but I don't usually drive because I am mostly in my head and afraid not to crash the car because of that. I am definitely not a "physical" person. I have always disliked sports and was always very bad at them too. In my head I might be a physically fit FBI agent but in reality I don't do any physical work unless I really have to. I am not clueless my dear, I know enough about functions to realize that I'm NT.
> 
> And while I use both Te and Ti and they're both easy to use for me, I prefer Te. An argument is not valid to me unless it can be backed up by external data.


Se isn't about being a daredevil at all. It's not about being good at sports. And it's not necessarily 'physical'. It's about how you see things.

ESTPs can be in their head a lot too, definitely. Anyone can.

Nothing you're describing is changing my mind-- But, this _is _your cognition we're talking about, so you know what's in your head.

I'm just not sure that you've necessarily got the understanding of what the cognitive functions mean in full. But, you will, eventually, if you haven't yet. And you'll either confirm or disprove ENTJ for yourself.


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## something987 (Jul 20, 2014)

Word Dispenser, can you please explain exactly what Se-Ti looks like compared to Te? From my experience, both have a very dominant appearance.

Here is a video I found, made by an ESTP vlogger, describing the difference between ESTP and ENTJ. According to this video, ENTJ seems to be the answer.


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

Ksilva said:


> Word Dispenser, can you please explain exactly what Se-Ti looks like compared to Te? From my experience, both have a very dominant appearance.
> 
> Here is a video I found, made by an ESTP vlogger, describing the difference between ESTP and ENTJ. According to this video, ENTJ seems to be the answer.


Well, apparently, I've heard it claimed this guy's actually an ENFJ, and _not _an ESTP. I'm not sure about that, myself, as I haven't watched his videos enough to know. 

But, he _appears_ to utilize quite a bit of Fe, and quite frankly, I don't think he's necessarily got a hold on all the functions either. He often speaks of behaviour, but misses the mark on the introspective nature of cognition due to being an extrovert, possibly.

I'll go more into detail on Se+Ti vs. Te in a bit. :kitteh:


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## Dragheart Luard (May 13, 2013)

I just did a quick read of this thread as I have to go to class soon, but at least I got a ESTP vibe from the whole thing. I didn't notice anything that would seem like TeNi, nor has the dry tone that I've noticed that's common with ENTJs. Heck, somehow how you deal with extra questions reminded me of an ESTP that I know, incluiding the abrasive and willful attitude.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> Well, apparently, I've heard it claimed this guy's actually an ENFJ, and _not _an ESTP. I'm not sure about that, myself, as I haven't watched his videos enough to know.
> 
> But, he _appears_ to utilize quite a bit of Fe, and quite frankly, I don't think he's necessarily got a hold on all the functions either. He often speaks of behaviour, but misses the mark on the introspective nature of cognition due to being an extrovert, possibly.
> 
> I'll go more into detail on Se+Ti vs. Te in a bit. :kitteh:


You're deluded. This guy is not Fe at all.

Anyway, can you please just not help me anymore? Just move over to some other thread. There are a lot of people that , unlike me , would greatly appreciate your help.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Blue Flare said:


> I just did a quick read of this thread as I have to go to class soon, but at least I got a ESTP vibe from the whole thing. I didn't notice anything that would seem like TeNi, nor has the dry tone that I've noticed that's common with ENTJs. Heck, somehow how you deal with extra questions reminded me of an ESTP that I know, incluiding the abrasive and willful attitude.


Can you do a more in-depth read and come back when you're actually ready and have time to explain your choice more thoroughly?


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## something987 (Jul 20, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> Well, apparently, I've heard it claimed this guy's actually an ENFJ, and _not _an ESTP. I'm not sure about that, myself, as I haven't watched his videos enough to know.
> 
> But, he _appears_ to utilize quite a bit of Fe, and quite frankly, I don't think he's necessarily got a hold on all the functions either. *He often speaks of behaviour, but misses the mark on the introspective nature of cognition* due to being an extrovert, possibly.
> 
> I'll go more into detail on Se+Ti vs. Te in a bit. :kitteh:


Wouldn't this probably be evidence for dominant Se then? I don't see him being ENFJ at all, I'd like to have a word with whoever claimed that... I've seen quite a few of his videos. To be honest I don't see him using a lot of Fe here, maybe more than his other videos but still not a lot. And he has the domineering way of speaking that you mentioned.


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> You're deluded. This guy is not Fe at all.
> 
> Anyway, can you please just not help me anymore? Just move over to some other thread. There are a lot of people that , unlike me , would greatly aprreaciate your help.


As said, I'm not entirely sure of that typing for him, myself, but he _does _utilize Fe. Which, uhm, he does. Even if he _is_ an ESTP, that's what he'll be doing. And a tertiary function's usually pretty solid, especially in dominant subtypes.

And... I dunno. I kinda like helping you. :kitteh: 

I think I'll stick around. I might grow on you. Or, you know. Maybe you'll actually consider different points of view instead of exuding confirmation bias.

Who knows.


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

Ksilva said:


> Wouldn't this probably be evidence for dominant Se then? I don't see him being ENFJ at all, I'd like to have a word with whoever claimed that... I've seen quite a few of his videos. To be honest I don't see him using a lot of Fe here, maybe more than his other videos but still not a lot. And he has the domineering way of speaking that you mentioned.


No, it isn't evidence of dominant Se. It's evidence of extroversion-- Focusing on the object instead of the subject.

Fe is a different kind of dominance from Te, they're markedly similar, but with different focuses. One being ethical, the other being logical, both being rational.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> As said, I'm not entirely sure of that typing for him, myself, *but he does utilize Fe*. Which, uhm, he does. Even if he _is_ an ESTP, that's what he'll be doing. And a tertiary function's usually pretty solid, especially in dominant subtypes.
> 
> And... I dunno. I kinda like helping you. :kitteh:
> 
> ...


We all *do* utilize Fe to some extent , unless we are psychopaths.

I wouldn't say that having Fe as a tertiary function that's all he'll be doing. On the contrary, if anything, tertiary and aspirational functions are not only in the background but also working in a subconscious manner. 

I'm not looking for "confirmation bias", I'm ready to consider pretty much every type if presented with good enough arguments. 

But what you are doing is presenting a theory without any reasonable explanations and expecting me to believe in it. 

If you believe you're right and want to stick around you might as consider two,three types for me as well and work from there instead of bluntly telling me I'm ESTP ( without any logical arguments) and feel annoyed because I don't believe you.

Present some proof.


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## something987 (Jul 20, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> No, it isn't evidence of dominant Se. It's evidence of extroversion-- Focusing on the object instead of the subject.
> 
> Fe is a different kind of dominance from Te, they're markedly similar, but with different focuses. One being ethical, the other being logical, both being rational.


Trust me this guy is not big on ethical. He is Se dom. And his descriptions, as you say, are not rational, he's focusing on their actions and appearances (behavior). That's perception, is it not? Where are you seeing this Fe?

I have been scavenging the web in the meantime for a single person who claimed he was an ENFJ and found nothing...


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> No, it isn't evidence of dominant Se. It's evidence of extroversion-- Focusing on the object instead of the subject.
> 
> Fe is a different kind of dominance from Te, they're markedly similar, but with different focuses. One being ethical, the other being logical, both being rational.


Fe is not a rational function, it's a judging function. Fe/Fi/Te/Ti are all judging functions but only Te and Ti are rational. They are means to an end. Someone with dom Fe can make the same decision as someone with dom Te but they will make this decision based on very different reasons and following a very different path of reason. They are in no way similar. 

"He often speaks of behaviour, but misses the mark on the introspective nature of cognition" = "It's evidence of extroversion" - this doesn't make any sense whatsoever.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Ksilva said:


> Trust me this guy is not big on ethical.


Which one can clearly see unless one is completely clueless.


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> We all *do* utilize Fe to some extent , unless we are psychopaths.
> 
> I wouldn't say that having Fe as a tertiary function that's all he'll be doing. On the contrary, if anything, tertiary and aspirational functions are not only in the background but also working in a subconscious manner.
> 
> ...


Who's annoyed? I'm not annoyed. 

As for us all using Fe-- That's true. More for some than others, though. A moot point, really, and a point which speaks from Ti, in my opinion.

And for those who have Fe as PoLR, it's something they almost never use, certainly.

I have no qualms with your not believing me-- It's the cognition I've seen in your posts thus far. That's all. That's really all the evidence anyone needs. 

Just 'cause I see Se-Ti, doesn't mean that's what it is. It's just my opinion that your behaviour/actions/words are grounded in those motivations. I'm not trying to convince anyone. It's your task to take that information as you see fit, or ignore it.

Also, to quote Typelogic: "Of the four functions, two (Feeling and Thinking) are the _rational_, or deciding, functions. The other two (Sensing and iNtuition) are the _irrational_ (non-conclusive/perceiving) functions. If an individual has a dominant rational function, one of the irrational functions is always auxiliary."

So, that's what I meant by rational. And, maybe you don't think what I'm saying makes any sense, but that doesn't mean it doesn't to others. roud:

Perhaps you think I'm clueless. That'd be your loss, not mine. I've been here awhile. I've done this dance before. I don't mind. I know the steps. :wink:

.
@Ksilva: Meh-- I never said he wasn't ESTP. Even if he is-- His opinions don't strike me as particularly reliable in terms of typology. I would take everything he says with a grain of salt, but he _is _a source, and I'm not discrediting him outright. Just.. Grain of salt. Or, possibly, take a net and carefully withdraw salt from the bottom of a small sea. Just in case. roud:


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I can't see myself in any Se descriptions. I'm not that much of a daredevil. I like driving but I don't usually drive because I am mostly in my head and afraid not to crash the car because of that. I am definitely not a "physical" person. I have always disliked sports and was always very bad at them too. In my head I might be a physically fit FBI agent but in reality I don't do any physical work unless I really have to. I am not clueless my dear, I know enough about functions to realize that I'm NT.
> 
> And while I use both Te and Ti and they're both easy to use for me, I prefer Te. An argument is not valid to me unless it can be backed up by external data.


the being in your head while driving and afraid not to crash the car, things like that would show you're an INTJ rather than ENTJ imo. I'm really baffled that you're like that if you are ENTJ? ENTJ's are pretty sharp drivers as far as i know. This definitely needs to be researched more, the "clumsiness" so to speak of being in your head so much when driving being afriad to crash. And the not being a physical person, to me might indicate INTJ rather than ENTJ also. And to mention being a "physically fit FBI agent in your head but not in reality", could indicate the mind of INTJ also. Maybe you are INTJ after all? Or maybe you sit close on the fence of being INTJ/ENTJ, but maybe INTJ is the slight more dominant type?

But you did say you relate the most to the ENTJ descriptions, rather than the INTJ descriptions, right? So maybe you are ENTJ sitting close on the fence to INTJ, but ENTJ is the slight more dominant type in you? 

Maybe that's it, you are an ENTJ but almost equally INTJ with just slight higher ENTJ in you?

The Fi inferior of the ENTJ would be slight different than the Se inferior of the INTJ.

Look a bit more closely at how those inferior functions work under stress.

Which one seems a bit closer to home in you?


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> the being in your head while driving and afraid not to crash the car, things like that would show you're an INTJ rather than ENTJ imo. I'm really baffled that you're like that if you are ENTJ? ENTJ's are pretty sharp drivers as far as i know. This definitely needs to be researched more, the "clumsiness" so to speak of being in your head so much when driving being afriad to crash. And the not being a physical person, to me might indicate INTJ rather than ENTJ also. And to mention being a "physically fit FBI agent in your head but not in reality", could indicate the mind of INTJ also. Maybe you are INTJ after all? Or maybe you sit close on the fence of being INTJ/ENTJ, but maybe INTJ is the slight more dominant type?
> 
> But you did say you relate the most to the ENTJ descriptions, rather than the INTJ descriptions, right? So maybe you are ENTJ sitting close on the fence to INTJ, but ENTJ is the slight more dominant type in you?
> 
> ...


I'm like both when under stress. 

This is spot on: 

The ENTJ's need for external stimulation, thrill and danger is what makes this type probably one of the most stress-resistant personality types, but like every other human being they are not immune to it.

When under stress ENTJs may exhibit these behaviors:

- Jumping to conclusions
- Losing patience
- Ignoring their emotional needs and feelings of others
- Finding it hard to listen to others because they’re always in a rush
- Avoiding small talk because they find it frivolous and nonproductive
- When they’re losing control they feel the need for closure and completion
- They may resort to completing simple, meaningless, repetitive tasks (i.e. cleaning, counting, inspecting) to relieve stress
- May begin to strongly doubt themselves
- Avoid their ability ever being tested out of fear of failure
- Become critical of opinions and attitudes which don't match their own
- If under extreme stress they may explode with terrible tempers
- May withdraw, feel hurt, trapped and become overly emotional

But, at the same time when I'm stressful and depressed I indulge a lot. I want to party the most when I'm depressed.

INTJ under stress:

May experience mental fatigue and an inability to think clearly.
Tries to control everything in the immediate environment, becoming intense and driven.
Grows restless, frustrated and self-critical.
Desires to be left alone, becoming intolerant of other’s intrusions.
Finds it difficult to communicate with people, having little energy to do so.
Turns worried and alarmed about the present.
Constantly expects obstacles and problems to plague them.
Overindulges in sensual pleasures, often overeating, exercising or sleeping, binge shopping, and marathon sessions with the TV or pulp fiction.


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I'm like both when under stress.
> 
> This is spot on:
> 
> ...





> *Overindulges in sensual pleasures, often overeating, exercising or sleeping, binge shopping, and marathon sessions with the TV or pulp fiction.*


do you overindulge with these mentioned above activities as well? or just partying as you mentioned?


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> do you overindulge with these mentioned above activities as well? or just partying as you mentioned?


When stressed/depressed/unwell I tend to binge eat or drink, to watch tv shows days in a row or just sleep all day. All these things in return make me even more miserable so it's a vicious chain which I manage to stop on time.

However, when I'm in such state my Fi is going crazy, I get basically everything on that stressed ENTJ list. I become an emotional wreck - I self doubt everything that I am, I lose all my confidence, I get easily hurt and the worst part is I can't really explain in normal terms or manage those feelings, I just want them gone.

When I'm alright I'm a very confident, energetic, thick skinned person.


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> When stressed/depressed/unwell I tend to binge eat or drink, to watch tv shows days in a row or just sleep all day. All these things in return make me even more miserable so it's a vicious chain which I manage to stop on time.
> 
> However, when I'm in such state my Fi is going crazy, I get basically everything on that stressed ENTJ list. I become an emotional wreck - I self doubt everything that I am, I lose all my confidence, I get easily hurt and the worst part is I can't really explain in normal terms or manage those feelings, I just want them gone.
> 
> When I'm alright I'm a very confident, energetic, thick skinned person.


You show ways of both INTJ and ENTJ. 

What things make you feel alright?
What things make you feel stressed?

Also what do you think of this video? 




Looking back from now til childhood, do you see more Te or more Ni in you?


Also this video, what do you think of it?


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> You show ways of both INTJ and ENTJ.
> 
> What things make you feel alright?
> What things make you feel stressed?
> ...


I think that she's a slob and rambles a lot due to not planning the video ahead of time. That was the most "primitive" initial impression. But I can find some similarities. I come across as harsh or feisty or "looking for trouble" which is shocking to me. Honestly I'll have to watch it again some day, I find the way she talks to be not to the point enough and I get impatient. 

I like the way EJArende usually talks though. I like ESTPs probably too much for my own good.

I can charge people up if I want to. Although I'm not much of an empath people have told me for as long as I know that I have this way about me I can make everybody else feel what I'm feeling, so if I'm happy and enthusiastic you just can't resist but be the same, same goes with me feeling sad/angry. People tell me I'm energetic and lively even when I feel like I'm at my worst.

I'm not that much in touch with myself I suppose. I can't give 10 page long answers to random abstract questions about myself, which seems really easy and enjoyable to introverts.

He's right, when I'm in a social situation I can very much resemble an ESTP since my Te and Se are working together.

I really don't like people asking me if I like them or what I think about them or how I feel about them. I have no problem with showing love but I can't talk about my feelings freely, it's just uncomfortable and makes me feel "naked" somehow.

I am very unbiased. It's hard for me to be biased. I have only been biased once as far as I can remember and it was to protect somebody I really care about and that didn't came naturally.

Lol the all or nothing thing is so much like me. I will either look like I'm going to attend the Grammies or just wash my face and be done with it, there's no in between.

As a child though, I think I was very Ni and Fe, very INFJ like.

What things make me feel alright ... Being the center of attention, being admired or even just talked about makes me feel good, I don't even care if people talk badly about me as long as they do talk about me, I like being right and knowing stuff, I enjoy being different, being accepted within a group also makes me feel good because I like to talk just for talking's sake, seeing real goodness in this world makes me feel good, succeeding at something makes me feel alright etc

Things that make me stressed... Knowing that I can be great but I'm standing here doing nothing, for others this is always a reason to laugh but I feel really really depressed when I think about how other people my age are doing incredible things and I don't have enough money/ideas to change stuff, being almost 21 makes me feel bad, people telling me I'm harsh and heartless and stuff like that when I've been ( in my opinion) good to them makes me feel bad, not knowing stuff/being ignorant are probably the worst, being mediocre and living a mediocre life makes me wanna blow my brains out


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I think that she's a slob and rambles a lot due to not planning the video ahead of time. That was the most "primitive" initial impression. But I can find some similarities. I come across as harsh or feisty or "looking for trouble" which is shocking to me. Honestly I'll have to watch it again some day, I find the way she talks to be not to the point enough and I get impatient.
> 
> I like the way EJArende usually talks though. I like ESTPs probably too much for my own good.
> 
> ...





> *and I don't have enough money/ideas to change stuff*


what kinds of stuff would you like to change?



> *As a child though, I think I was very Ni and Fe, very INFJ like.*


Tell me examples of why you think you were Fe like an INFJ as a child?

try another video, don't worry looking back at that one, move on to another one, see how you relate?


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> what kinds of stuff would you like to change?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't really see the point of this video though. Ok, I get mad too when people can't use "there" "their" and "they're" right but other than that it was a lot of laughing and fooling around.

What stuff I'd like to change. Let's see. My life for example. 

Why I think I was a lot like an INFJ as a child. I was very Ni/Fe. I was the stereotypical INFJ child - that mature kid, mystical and pensive, thinking about stuff beyond his years, wishing that there would be no suffering people, seeing how evil is so unnecessary, how foolish are grown up people to not understand that our time here as a race is so limited that there's no point in giving ourselves to envy,greed and sloth. I was the most sensible and creative child between my peers. As a child I was very much in my own head, I used to make up stories from a very early age. I could turn everything into a story and create a whole new dimension. I also had very strong gut feelings ( intuitive guesses ) about stuff which always turned out to be right. Ok, I wasn't entirely like an INFJ but Ni/Fe were definitely strong.


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## Dreamer777 (Jan 15, 2011)

L'Enfant Terrible said:


> I don't really see the point of this video though. Ok, I get mad too when people can't use "there" "their" and "they're" right but other than that it was a lot of laughing and fooling around.
> 
> What stuff I'd like to change. Let's see. My life for example.
> 
> Why I think I was a lot like an INFJ as a child. I was very Ni/Fe. I was the stereotypical INFJ child - that mature kid, mystical and pensive, thinking about stuff beyond his years, wishing that there would be no suffering people, seeing how evil is so unnecessary, how foolish are grown up people to not understand that our time here as a race is so limited that there's no point in giving ourselves to envy,greed and sloth. I was the most sensible and creative child between my peers. As a child I was very much in my own head, I used to make up stories from a very early age. I could turn everything into a story and create a whole new dimension. I also had very strong gut feelings ( intuitive guesses ) about stuff which always turned out to be right. Ok, I wasn't entirely like an INFJ but Ni/Fe were definitely strong.


INJ kids have alot of similarities. Te and Fe are the aux and wouldn't show much til late teen to early 20's to develop.

You don't show the attributes of a Te dom child, but rather a Ni dom child. This would put you back to INTJ. So maybe it is that you are INTJ close to ENTJ. And your indulgences when stressed is really more so INTJ than ENTJ.

I think then you are INTJ but real close to ENTJ. 

gosh, you seem to swing from one side of the pendulum to the other between INTJ and ENTJ.

so what's your thoughts on that, think you could be an INTJ then? the fear of having accidents while driving because of being in your head alot would be inferior Se dom Ni as well. INFJ's have the same ways of being in their heads so much and walking and bumping into things. They don't like to go to new places that they are not used to the drive, they prefer to go on the same routes. are you like that too with not liking new routes? 

seems INTJ more than ENTJ in the long run?


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## Word Dispenser (May 18, 2012)

@Ksilva: A good example of an ESTP is Jenna Marbles (in my opinion). I think if you contrast her _cognition_ against that dude, you'll see an interesting contrast. However, key word here is 'cognition', and not necessarily the words being used, behaviour, or interests.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Dreamer777 said:


> INJ kids have alot of similarities. Te and Fe are the aux and wouldn't show much til late teen to early 20's to develop.
> 
> You don't show the attributes of a Te dom child, but rather a Ni dom child. This would put you back to INTJ. So maybe it is that you are INTJ close to ENTJ. And your indulgences when stressed is really more so INTJ than ENTJ.
> 
> ...


when I am stressed I'm more like an entj but indulge like an intj. 

as a child I showed many characteristics of entjs, I talked about this previously. I wasn't an extroverted child, but this was due to specific things that happened during my childhood. I was more INFJ than anything else because of that childhood experience.

before everything happened, when I was a toddler I was very ENTJ. I used to manipulate the other kids into giving me their toys, manipulated grown up people into buying me what I wanted, was very determined and independant etc

"the fear of having accidents while driving because of being in your head alot would be inferior Se dom Ni as well" - I'm an excellent driver. however, I'm sure that in the long run I might get into trouble because of being in my head ( for example, I might not notice red changing to green because I would be thinking about an upcoming exam) I don't think this is very uncommon though. Unless you are Se dom you are bound to at least once be inside your head while driving.

"are you like that too with not liking new routes?" - if the route I'm currently taking is the most time efficient then taking another route would be plain stupid. if the other route has some added benefits than why not. I like new.

I've never really considered INTJ as my type. Never got INTJ on any test. I guess I should research the differences between INTJ/ENTJ and ESTP a bit more.


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## L'Enfant Terrible (Jun 8, 2014)

Word Dispenser said:


> @Ksilva: A good example of an ESTP is Jenna Marbles (in my opinion). I think if you contrast her _cognition_ against that dude, you'll see an interesting contrast. However, key word here is 'cognition', and not necessarily the words being used, behaviour, or interests.


I do see some similarities between her and EJ.


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