# Frustrations and Problems, Annoyances and Complaints.



## Scruffy (Aug 17, 2009)

This forum moves in a constant circle, a long standing complaint of mine is that knowledge does not continue after a certain point, nor does self discovery. I'm going to call out many trends and what I consider to be thought-traps in this thread, as an effort to clean up some of the bullshit I see around here.

*MBTI is not a cure-all, or an explain-all.*
So, you newly discover the MBTI. Thrust into a world of understanding and self-discovery, you cannot get enough of analyzing everything and everyone through this grand unifier. My issue here is when you suddenly see all of your behaviors (and others) explained through this theory. What you're doing is limiting the depth that you have as a human being, and locking the world into a box. "_____ does this because they're an XXXX", ignoring psychology to shove MBTI up their ass, whisking them away into a world a simplicity.

*Stop correlating everything.
*Fucking seriously, just stop. From physical features, how one wipes their ass, in which manner one uses a drinking straw, handwriting, taste in music, taste in cats, favorite flavors of ice cream, and repeat to fuckin' everything. *Type is not based on behaviors nor skills/interests. Type is a window of perception; the way you process the world.* So stop correlating everything.
*
Hivemind/N/NT Superiority
*XNXX and especially the XNTX's have this thing about them where they assume they are God's gift to the universe and that everyone should be like them. Take a gander at the NT sub forums and you'll find that people typecast themselves based on what they feel their type should be talking about. There is so little variety in those forums they have become dull. It's not about circle-jerking your type, those forums are for you to converse about *everything* with people similar to yourself. I find that people are afraid of even changing subjects or talk about anything else but approved topics, due to fear of being witch-hunted. Show compassion, empathy, happiness, or acceptance and you're labeled as a feeler.

Nothing about your type makes you better at anything than anyone else. You are not more intelligent, you are not more logical, and you are not special because you are an N/NT. The world does not give a damn about your perceived individuality/uniqueness/psuedo-intellectual bullshit. Sensors have brains, Feelers have brains, and they can do complex logical and abstract things regardless of your labeling them as handicapped. You are a person, they are people, shut the fuck up and deal with humanity as a whole. Stop locking yourself away in a tower of hubris.

*"Being an overly rational douchebag without emotions is super cool"
*Being an asshat is not cool, it is juvenile to assert such things. Similar to how children think it's cool to be "evil", you simply are not cool by being a pretend emotionless-cockball. Instead of pretending you're without emotions or compassion, or that you don't understand the feels, just be a goddamn human and get over it.

*Tests on the MBTI are absolute bullshit.*
I'm so tired of seeing people hungup on bullshit test results "Test A says I'm this, but Test B says I'm this!" Jesus Christ guys, stop letting a a javascript/html code tell you who you are. *​You are more complicated then multiple choice STOP giving tests the power to determine your identity. *Basically, grow a fucking pair and introspect about yourself, stop asking life to give you the answer.
*
If you think E/I is based on how social you are, shut the fuck up and read some of the theory. If you think Extroverts are smalltalk machines, refer to shutting the fuck up. *Introversion and Extroversion deals with one's orientation to the world, Extroverts are reactionary to their environment, and Introverts push from their inner world into reality (allowing the environment to react to them). Extroverts exist in a world of things and people, an Introverts world is applied to things and people.
*
Sensors and Intuitives can communicate and understand each other, stop trying to draw a line, or build a wall.
*
Ever been to a bar, or to a party? People are so determined to make themselves relevant, that they become a caricature of themselves. You are forming yourself to fit into your idealized self-image, or even worse, the idealized image of what you feel others want you to be. (Acting more and more type XXXX to gain acceptance)



I'll add more later, I've lost interest for this period.


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## Jewl (Feb 28, 2012)

If I could thank this 10,000 times, I would.  Thanks for taking the time to write this, @Scruffy.


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## Jennywocky (Aug 7, 2009)

*"I know what type <some really popular celebrity> is, just from watching them on TV once!"*

Besides the reality that some stranger's type doesn't even matter in the long run, there's so much variance in human behavior from a multitude of factors, and so much overlap ("All human beings think. All human beings have values. All human beings have senses. All human beings have dreams and make connections. etc") that just because you happen to be XYZX type and see a celebrity do something that resonates with you _doesn't mean they are your MBTI type. 

_Nor does it make them any better or worse or helpful or important if they match your type or not.

It ain't a "Pokemon -- gotta collect 'em all <for my type>" easter egg search with the fullest basket getting bonus prizes.


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## Scruffy (Aug 17, 2009)

Indeed, making a special club for people "like" you. Cliques, everywhere. MBTI talks about accepting diversity and difference, over here we tend to circle-jerk. ONE OF US ONE OF US


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## Surreal Snake (Nov 17, 2009)

Finally some sanity welcome back Scruff


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## Van Meter (Sep 28, 2012)

Agreed, but I think I'd rather do the perverse opposite of what you just proposed. The status quo is a sacred thing that cannot be amended except by a special council in a tall building on an unknown planet. I like the familiar and that includes drinking long island ice tea with a disproportionate amount of tequila, putting forth my impeccable opinion, reading no one else's opinions or responses, and promptly logging off.


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## Halcyon (Jun 21, 2013)

Sticky. NOW.


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## C3bBb (Oct 22, 2013)

This is PerC gold. Can we force every new user to read this before they post?


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

Scruffy said:


> Indeed, making a special club for people "like" you. Cliques, everywhere. MBTI talks about accepting diversity and difference, over here we tend to circle-jerk. ONE OF US ONE OF US


It's similar in the Enneagram forum. The whole reason to even both studying it is to understand our blind spots and overcome ego fixations but in the forum; people are way more concerned - just like MBTI - with being a certain type then getting free of the limits of their respective type.

TYPOLOGY ISN'T SUPPOSED TO BE LIKE FREAKING ASTROLOGY, PEOPLE!!!


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## Promethea (Aug 24, 2009)

Halcyon said:


> Sticky. NOW.


Agreed, and stuck.


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## pretense (Jan 2, 2013)

Gospel.


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## mushr00m (May 23, 2011)

Well at least it is stickied, the amount of times people have been called out on their type superiority crap only to have reiterate the same thing over and over, a bit like banging your head against a brick wall. I mean it's still a trap people fall into but if they were that concerned about taking function talk away from the kiddies playground, they would know a lot more! You mentioned that anyway Scruff and am glad you did! Playground games simply dumbs people down. It no pretty. I just hope that attitudes will reform and it's possible but can't seem to get round the idea that they are a vulnerability, that trap people fall into over and over again, known as giving into the worst of their ego, when you lower yourself so much you dehumanize others(detach yourself) by your illusionary props to elevate yourself over others whilst dismissing and using poor logic(NT's too!) to justify this.*

Hivemind/N/NT Superiority
XNXX and especially the XNTX's have this thing about them where they assume they are God's gift to the universe and that everyone should be like them. Take a gander at the NT sub forums and you'll find that people typecast themselves based on what they feel their type should be talking about. There is so little variety in those forums they have become dull. It's not about circle-jerking your type, those forums are for you to converse about everything with people similar to yourself. I find that people are afraid of even changing subjects or talk about anything else but approved topics, due to fear of being witch-hunted. Show compassion, empathy, happiness, or acceptance and you're labeled as a feeler.

Oh yes, spot on! However, last time I challenged a recent stint with something like this, it turned into some interrogation, that was fun, not! *


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

Senshu_Ben_Gone said:


> This is PerC gold. Can we force every new user to read this before they post?


I would make it like driving tests for seniors: make them read the OP on a periodic basis; the problem is rarely with the newbies; it lies with the holier-than-thou "experienced" users, who falsely accuse you of being over-sensitive if you dare to disagree with their God give expertise.

:dry:


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## pretense (Jan 2, 2013)

I have to disagree with what Scruffy said about MBTI tests. Not that they aren't bullshit, but that is just how most people get into this stuff. Take the test, read your type description, that was fun, I want more. So then they end up on PerC and within five minutes someone castrates them for giving value to the online tests. Most realize the error of their ways and move on, it is only the very select few that continue to take them seriously. Not as big a problem as he has made it out to be. From what I've seen at least.

I've noticed quite a few people that seem to pop up in every type me thread in which someone claims that they're N and doesn't fit perfectly into the N stereotype. Then they take it upon themselves to defend the sanctity of intuition and smack down any notion of the OP being intuitive. They're fucking bullies, and it is infuriating. It's school yard bull shit. You know who you are, stop it.

Another thing that people tend to do, and I am more guilty of this than anyone, is give way way way too much weight to the PerC braintrust's opinion of your type. If you're really fucking sure you're a certain type and you have a solid grasp of the functions, you probably aren't wrong. Type me threads are so shallow and untelling. The questionairres touch only the surface, which as Scruffy has said, is not definitive of type.

...you know what, fuck it. I've been typed as xSTP by so many people and they're all wrong. I'm confident that I am an xSFP, if you think otherwise, blow me. (not really though thanks for trying to help me)


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## C3bBb (Oct 22, 2013)

TreasureTower said:


> I would make it like driving tests for seniors: make them read the OP on a periodic basis; the problem is rarely with the newbies; it lies with the holier-than-thou "experienced" users, who falsely accuse you of being over-sensitive if you dare to disagree with their God give expertise.
> 
> :dry:


Very true, I think the problem is persistent mainly in people who have insecure identity or neurotic loneliness issues and feel the need to be validated by strangers on internet communities so they become vulnerable to forum-specific groupthink.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Vesters (Mar 9, 2014)

Scruffy are you an SF type? :b


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## Janovich (Apr 9, 2014)

@Scruffy,

"MBTI is not a cure-all, or an explain-all."

I don't see why you act so mad at the way people use the theory. People like having handles when it comes to grasping things, and MBTI is a great handle for trying to get a better understanding of human nature. I takes away part of the abstract-ism about people's behaviour and personalities, which is a good thing because it lowers the threshold to understand individuals better.
There is only a certain amount of depth you can contemplate when it comes to knowing someone (although you'll most likely spend more time with your partners and family thus getting to know them better than most people you know) and I think understanding someone through MBTI types is already a big step. I know it won't reveal the utter most depth of people, but on many occasions that isn't even necessary or relevant.


"Stop correlating everything."

I wouldn't say I utterly disagree with you on this, and you'r right that type is not based on skills/interests. But there is a reason certain things are linked to specific personality types. You should not deny the existence of stereotypical behaviour.


"Hivemind/N/NT Superiority"

You're completely contradicting yours previous statements with this. First you tell people to look beyond MBTI types and then you basically claim that N/NT are all the same. I'm not denying your statements that such circle-jerk behaviour on N/NT subforums actually exists, but it makes me feel like you're just ranting around being overly biased yourself.


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## Scruffy (Aug 17, 2009)

I'm ok with it.


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## Pelopra (May 21, 2013)

yeah, the ENTP forums are going through a phase where they are easily the least interesting part of this site, in part thanks to a small group of members devoted to the idea of ENTP = Egomaniac Narcissistic Troll Psychopath ...
"you're getting upset that we're being idiots! upset is a feeling! you're a feeler!" 

---


I will admit to having once fallen prey to this one, but I think I'm better now: "You don't identify with my description of a type /function, you must not be/have that type/function"


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## dulcinea (Aug 22, 2011)

I just get frustrated with threads that are like "I'm an XXXX in love with a YYYY type, it's hopeless, isn't it?" when type has very little to do with the success/failure of a relationship...psychololgy studies have only linked the success of a relationship with 3 Big Five personality traits: agreeableness, conscientiousness, and I don't remember the third, haha, but it's out there, and, one day I'll get around to googling it, but similarity/differences in other personality traits, don't really matter that much. It's all based on what you're willing to put up with on a daily basis, tbh.

The other thing is "I'm such and such a type, and I want X job... It's hopeless isn't it?!" when, again, it's just a case of what you're willing to deal with on a daily basis, if anything.... Like, an accountant would be considered a "stereotypical" "STJ job" I know and ENFJ accountant, who is excellent at it. He had the motivation to pursue it, so he excelled in that field. I think it just boils to down to what motivates you. 

The last thing that irritates me is when someone is like "I don't care for such and such a type" when they may have met, like only one or two of a type that may contain hundreds of millions of people, and somehow they can come to the conclusion that they all suck, based on, like, one example. Right. But, I think that's under the category of typism, which is a form of discrimination. No two of any type is alike, and how do you know that you've been getting along with someone in your like that's a particular type that you swore that you weren't fond of because you had them mistyped all along?


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## AndyBeanz (Feb 15, 2016)

I agree lol


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