# Why does modern society seem to encourage extroversion?



## Theophania (Sep 7, 2014)

It seems to me that today's society strongly encourages extroversion, especially in schools. I can't speak for everyone, but from my experience as a strong introvert, it seems to me that everyone is always trying to force me out of my introvert ways, or my 'shell' as they tend to call it. In school, many of my assignments involved large group discussions, presentations and so on that were graded solely on how much you spoke or contributed to discussion. On more than one occasion, my grade has truly suffered as a result on my poor performance on these tasks.

In many of my classes, I'm constantly forced to work in groups or pairs, which I loathe. It's fine once in awhile, and I understand it's value, but I don't think it's necessary to be in groups every single day. Yet one of my teaches even had the nerve to tell me I am "bound to fail in school and in life" unless I become more sociable and able to constantly function in groups. 

Currently in college, I am enrolled in a class that gives points for how often you make comments or questions during class. This is not my strong suit. As a result, I LOSE points because I am not 'actively engaging.' The way I see it, I bet I am more engaged than half the class members that freely make stupid comments, but they get better grades than me simply because they speak out a lot. I absorb and process the information real well, turn in excellent assignments, and I don't think it's fair to me to suffer simply because I'm an introvert. I feel like it's an attack on my inborn ways. My teachers keep trying to force me out of it and cram me into an extrovert mold, and I don't think it's right. We should value BOTH traits and accept that some people are extroverts while others are introverts. Both contribute valuable things to the world, and I think it's wrong to force on type to become another.

When I try to explain this to people, they just tell me to 'talk more, it's not that hard!" But it's not that easy either. Not if your a strong introvert like me. I'm not quiet because I'm shy. I'm just more reserved. I prefer to keep most my thoughts to myself, unless I feel particularly passionate about something. That's just how I am, and I wish other people would stop trying to create a different person out of me.

As an introvert, do you ever feel like you're being forced to behave like an extrovert (or vice versa)? Do you think the society tends to value extroversion more than introversion?


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## The_Wanderer (Jun 13, 2013)

No; the nail that sticks out gets hammered down, after all.


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## Quernus (Dec 8, 2011)

Yes, I relate to this. Whenever I have a class that grades on participation and group work, I will very quickly stop showing up, save for exam days. In these cases... I tend to get A-'s, instead of A's, for example... since I lose out on the participation points. 

But oh well. I hate it. Not only am I an introvert, but I also have really bad social anxiety and general anxiety. And even when I'm doped up on my ativan, I still don't *care* to speak out in front of a bunch of people, or even in smaller groups of people I don't know. I don't *care* to interact without a meaningful purpose. I don't *learn *that way. I don't *care *what my classmates say, nor should they care what I have to say. When people speak for the sake of speaking, whether because they're forced to (for a grade or whatever), or because they like hearing themselves talk, it's just jibberish a lot of the time...

...I may sound bitter, but I'm not saying extroverts don't say things of value! There's plenty to be gained from hearing other perspectives, and interacting with people, when everyone WANTS TO BE ENGAGING. Haha. But it's not fair when such different personalities are held to the standards that clearly favor one type over another, in my opinion. I'm paying just as much money as everyone else to learn the material and get a fucking grade.... let me just do that.

Once I am out of school, it may be different. I face this kind of thing in my current work setting too. But, I think there are plenty of fields where introversion is accepted or even encouraged... I just haven't been lucky enough to get involved with them yet.


Alternative perspectives to this are welcome. Perhaps it will help me cope.


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## Adena (May 14, 2014)

Hmm, I think it's because we say "connections" is a very important thing to make, and extroverts excel in that. Maybe it's because it makes the other person feel more welcomed when someone wants to start a conversation with them, and people just like to feel good. But I don't know haha.


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## Deejaz (Feb 19, 2014)

They tend to deliver more. They say everything~ what they think and feel.

Introverts deliver less on the spot, even though introvert's are said to deliver the most originality and new ideas because of solitude and less attachment to the world.


lol I don't know.


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## JoyDreamer (Sep 1, 2014)

I had a college class (Intercultural Communication) where the teacher was a big tough motorcycle dude who loved class discussion. I would read all the material before attending class, but when he would ask questions he would expect immediate answers. I need time to digest questions and come up with thoughtful answers (or really any answers) and he would get frustrated with me and the rest of the class when we would fail to speak up right away. I also think everyone was a little intimidated by him and weary to speak up because he would take any answers and tear them apart to make us think about it (this was in Minnesota and we're all a little more reserved and socially conscious here). 

But as for the rest of my schooling, I never really felt forced to become extroverted. There were group projects, but not too often and I didn't mind them unless I ended up carrying the group. I think it really depends on where you live. Some places are definitely extrovert dominant; others, not so much. To me, Minnesota (or at least the area I live in) feels like an introverted state with a strong auxiliary Fe, as most people are highly conscious of social norms.


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## Thorweeps (May 17, 2014)

Theophania said:


> As an introvert, do you ever feel like you're being forced to behave like an extrovert (or vice versa)? Do you think the society tends to value extroversion more than introversion?


Yes. I wonder if it because society is generally invented and run by extroverts. Not to be disrespectful, but sometimes I wonder if the Es in general don't understand that there are some of us that simply want to do what we do, contribute what we do and help society along in our quiet way without fuss or much conversation, sometimes without even recognition. Perhaps this lack of understanding on Es part is why there are 'syndromes' like social anxiety disorder. _Socially anxious? Have a hard time being the life of the party? Introverted? *TAKE THIS PILL WE INVENTED TO HELP YOU BE MORE LIKE US!!!*_

It's gotten really bad when society at large thinks we are diseased and need a pill.


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## PaladinX (Feb 20, 2013)

Thorweeps said:


> Yes. I wonder if it because society is generally invented and run by extroverts. Not to be disrespectful, but sometimes I wonder if the Es in general don't understand that there are some of us that simply want to do what we do, contribute what we do and help society along in our quiet way without fuss or much conversation, sometimes without even recognition. Perhaps this lack of understanding on Es part is why there are 'syndromes' like social anxiety disorder. _Socially anxious? Have a hard time being the life of the party? Introverted? *TAKE THIS PILL WE INVENTED TO HELP YOU BE MORE LIKE US!!!*_
> 
> It's gotten really bad when society at large thinks we are diseased and need a pill.


That's why we made E.


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## Thorweeps (May 17, 2014)

PaladinX said:


> That's why we made E.


Perhaps it's the S in me, but I'm not following you.


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## PaladinX (Feb 20, 2013)

Thorweeps said:


> Perhaps it's the S in me, but I'm not following you.


E = Extraversion and E = Ecstasy. It was a play off of the idea of needing a pill for extraversion.


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## O_o (Oct 22, 2011)

You would think it would be something along the lines of "value over surplus". And it's almost odd because of how often it goes against the other social rule of "think before you speak". 

I understand the benefits of being able to present in public and participate in group work. It's important to know how to present your thoughts so others can understand and etc. To which there is no point if whatever is on your mind isn't useful or insightful. So in a situation where X is graded higher while expressing a huge amount and only one thing useful, and Y is graded lower for only expressing two things (thought both useful)... why should someone get graded higher for that. And I've had classes where that was one of the skills most heavily used for judging effort and grades I mean, of course it's subjective whether something is useful, etc. But it's probably one of the dumbest things to assume someone isn't participating or engaged just because they're not constantly churning out comments or questions. 

This isn't the case in all countries though. America, in specific, generally likes to zoom in on this. There's a common assumption (not just in America, of course) that if you are alone and not participating that you 1) secretly want to but are too shy 2) upset or uncomfortable for some reason 3) not a kind person and therefore cant find anyone to talk to. 

"Bound to fail in school and in life" is an extremely close minded and judgmental thing to say to someone you hardly know.


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## Thorweeps (May 17, 2014)

PaladinX said:


> E = Extraversion and E = Ecstasy. It was a play off of the idea of needing a pill for extraversion.


Love it.
Never had it. Thanks for the help. Literal mind, here.


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

@_Theophania_

I think this is actually an incorrect assumption that has grown out of control, due to several factors, including the negative connotation around introversion, and the idea that it's the "underdog" who "bucks the odds" that we Westerners tend to value. Keep in mind, in Far Eastern cultures, it's not the extrovert whose valued, it's the conformist introverts. 

The truth be told, is that Extroverts and Introverts are both equally undesirable 'extremist' states. Being too reserved is no better, or worse, than being too exuberant. What is really being reinforced more and more is _Ambiversion_. This is the ability to adjust to the environment, be flexible, be able to work independently, as well as within a team. It is far more productive than the "either/or" of Introversion and Extroversion. Here's some links for you to consider: 

Why extroverts fail, introverts flounder and you probably succeed - The Washington Post

Quiet: The Power of Introverts - By Susan Cain

Introversion Doesn't Kill Confidence, Society Does

Ambiversion: The Lost Personality Type ⋆ LonerWolf

Ambiversion: The Not Too Quiet Counter-Balance to the "Dark Side" Effect of Extraversion In [Legal Persuasion] Selling - Psycholawlogy


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## PallasAthena (Aug 3, 2013)

I think when teachers in middle school and high school gave group assignments they were thinking, "Here are valuable life skills that you will use for the rest of your life! How exciting!" And they don't realize that to you, it's more like, "Here's a project that one person will have to take over if you want an A. The others can write the bibliography and find pictures for the slideshow!" 
So stupid. I don't believe for a second that I wouldn't know how to work with people if we didn't do group projects in high school.

As for college: Yeah, it sucks. Sometimes you just want to go to class, do the assignments, take the test, and get your A. Not every class can be your most important class ever.
Anyway, here's something that helped me out. Most professors don't have the time to keep track of every comment people make to give an accurate participation grade at the end of the semester. You really don't have to say a ton to get a decent grade. As long as you occasionally ask a question, give an answer, or share your opinion, your teacher will remember your name and your face enough to give you credit. When they're at their grade book, they're thinking, "John...John Smith...Who is that? Oh, that's the kid in the back who doesn't say anything." They're first trying to remember who you are because they have lots of students, so at the very least, be remembered.
Also, I've found it's hard to fix your participation later in the semester when you see it needs improvement, because it's really weird to speak up later in the semester in a class you've never spoken in before. You know everyone's thinking, "Wait, who is that?" So I got in the habit of making sure to say something within the first week, so I wouldn't feel weird speaking up the next week or the next.

I don't like speaking up in class and I do have mild social anxiety, but practicing does make it way easier. And in the long run, it's worth a bit of discomfort to increase your social skills.


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## cautiouskitty (Sep 4, 2014)

I speculate that the reason so much of first world society tends toward extraversion is simply because introverts move inward, while they move outward, and because of that outward movement, they generally are seen more and can therefore impress upon others their need to be more like extraverts.

It's like, as an introvert, you know when someone asks you how you're doing today, and you actually stop to think about it...then they take that silent pause for two and a half seconds as permission to just start talking all over you and at you? And after a short while, you realize that they weren't interested in you at all, but they just wanted someone to talk at? I think it's a lot like that. Because they're out there, it's what everyone sees and what everyone thinks must be normal.

And when you're not that? Well, clearly you must be abnormal.

For me personally, I'm happy to let the extraverts do their thing. They can be happy talking at each other all day long. I'll say "I see, sorry/happy to hear that. Listen, I've gotta run, but good luck with X event!" and disengage from the alleged "conversation" as quickly as possible...so that I can go do what introverts like, prefer, and do best. Think. 

I'm not saying, of course, that extraversion is a necessarily bad thing. But I've been steamrolled by them far too many times to not be at least a tiny bit jaded! lol


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## Max (Aug 14, 2014)

I'm pretty extroverted more times than I am others. I enjoyed contributing to group work and speaking a lot during classes (more some than others though), and I understand some people don't. I, personally think that it's stupid to mark down those students who communication isn't a strong point for. I would have thought that schools would value well thought out questions and sensible contributions over smartass answers. Obviously not. The school system lacks basic judgement. And logic.


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## ai.tran.75 (Feb 26, 2014)

I think it depends on the culture - for example America prefer extroversion - but Asian culture values Introversion- in fact there are many Chinese and Vietnamese proverb that criticizes extroverts- growing up my mom (who's extremely extroverted) is often criticized by the family and people of her own race not so much with other races and people she works with ( she's a preschool teacher ) or friends of different race . Most of my Asian friends are introverts and even those who are extroverted refuses to believe that they're extrovert(bc deep down everyone have something private about them). As for most of my Caucasian and Hispanic friends quite enjoy the fact that they're extroverted - however I've never met an introvert who wishes that they were extroverted - not yet - just from personal pov.


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## Angebear (Jan 17, 2014)

Theophania said:


> Currently in college, I am enrolled in a class that gives points for how often you make comments or questions during class. This is not my strong suit. As a result, I LOSE points because I am not 'actively engaging.' The way I see it, I bet I am more engaged than half the class members that freely make stupid comments, but they get better grades than me simply because they speak out a lot. I absorb and process the information real well, turn in excellent assignments, and I don't think it's fair to me to suffer simply because I'm an introvert. I feel like it's an attack on my inborn ways. My teachers keep trying to force me out of it and cram me into an extrovert mold, and I don't think it's right. We should value BOTH traits and accept that some people are extroverts while others are introverts. Both contribute valuable things to the world, and I think it's wrong to force on type to become another.


UGH! I FEEL YOUR FEELS!!! This is precisely the reason why I left college because it became utter BS and waste of time for me to fail classes because I only talked when I had something to say. While all these other fools were talking just to talk, same reason I hate small talk. 

I had this extremely extroverted professor who just didn't understand this. He would actually force students to speak, whch doesn't make any sense to me because if you have nothing intelligent to say then......how does that work. He blamed it on students being too scared to speak up. Meanwhile I'm not scared to speak up at all, but I am a horrible verbal communicator. All my writing assignments were A+ but when I need to speak something off the top of my head, nope. I'm extremely visual. 



******
Higher education needs to stop shaming students for having different learning and communication needs. Some students just don't learn and communicate extroverted-ly. 

I REEAALLYY believe that this is all to mold students into the business world. Sitting at a desk, analyzing data, making meaningless small talk, being able to advertise and sell and make money. It's quite heartless. I hated it. I left.


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## Angebear (Jan 17, 2014)

on the other hand I also had this awesome grad student professor who was really just perfect. I wrote in a free write once that I consider myself a writer by default because I'm definitely not a speaker. It's not that I don't have anything to say or that I'm too shy (even though that is atleast part of it) (I am also daydreaming through pretty much all of every class ever roud but I really need time to think and reflect and write and draw diagrams and doodles to understand things. And basically awesome professor dude wrote on my paper something like, "Awesome! I do the same exact thing, I totally understand--I won't force you to speak when you don't want to " I was just like........*sigh* be still my heart <3


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## Theophania (Sep 7, 2014)

@Asuzanne515 I'm exactly the same way - I'm a good writer but not so good at verbal communication, especially if I don't have time to prepare what I'm going to say. Schools need to understand that not everyone learns the same, and not everyone has the same goals in mind. Not everyone wants to be part of the extroverted business world. The second professor you mentioned sounds awesome! We need more professors like him!


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## Morn (Apr 13, 2010)

Theophania said:


> It seems to me that today's society strongly encourages extroversion, especially in schools. I can't speak for everyone, but from my experience as a strong introvert, it seems to me that everyone is always trying to force me out of my introvert ways, or my 'shell' as they tend to call it. In school, many of my assignments involved large group discussions, presentations and so on that were graded solely on how much you spoke or contributed to discussion. On more than one occasion, my grade has truly suffered as a result on my poor performance on these tasks.
> 
> In many of my classes, I'm constantly forced to work in groups or pairs, which I loathe. It's fine once in awhile, and I understand it's value, but I don't think it's necessary to be in groups every single day. Yet one of my teaches even had the nerve to tell me I am "bound to fail in school and in life" unless I become more sociable and able to constantly function in groups.


There is truth to that. There's very little in the way of careers in which solitude is acceptable. It is valuable for an introvert to learn how to handle and influence people. It's a sound strategy to attempt to be more extroverted.





> As an introvert, do you ever feel like you're being forced to behave like an extrovert (or vice versa)? Do you think the society tends to value extroversion more than introversion?


I don't really care what foolish people are trying to force me to do or what society gives greater value to. But I do care about furthering my goals, which requires relationships with other people.


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## Tetsuo Shima (Nov 24, 2014)

Does it? Does it, though? I don't know about you, but my professors hate it when I talk out of turn.


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## Morn (Apr 13, 2010)

Don't stop. You're getting noticed, making a name for yourself. And if you're able to deliver insightful commentary and worth while content it will enable more people to see your value.


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## lunai (Feb 22, 2014)

There are many societies with different norms. Some of them encourage introversion and others encourage extroversion.


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## Cohle (Feb 21, 2014)

Society is the product of sexual reproduction, and conversely, the end goal of society and social mobility is further sexual reproduction. Since extroversion is a sexually desirable trait because it communicates strength, power and social adeptness, society values extroversion.

If everyone was an introvert, there would be fewer people having sex and making babies, which defeats the whole purpose of society.

That's my take.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## orihara (Nov 23, 2014)

they teach you how to work with people in a superficial way, maybe it's an attempt so we don't get too separated if we want to advance as society but you know. most people (including myself) are individualists and we want to succeed. getting along with others may give you a better chance for the true goal which is improving your own status


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## ShadowsRunner (Apr 24, 2013)

It doesn't help when it's not natural to you either. 

Even if I wanted to, I don't think I could do very well in large groups. The thing I hate the most is the screaming over top of people just to be heard, and how most of what is being said doesn't even have any substance to it. It's just inane stupid babble, usually petty gossip or dumb trends.

It's okay once in a while, but when it's 24/7 it makes me want to vomit.

Somebody please, PLEEAASE take me off this merry-go-round of obnoxious happy go lucky magical carbon-monoxide-hysterical-laughing gas induced wonderful fantabulous sunshine happy world. I don't think real life works that way. It's so gross. It's like vomit colored walls. Waking up to vomit colored walls. Everyday. I'd rather just get drunk and play in incoming traffic.

Maybe if most people weren't assholes, I'd be more willing to pretend to be their best friends.


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## Cohle (Feb 21, 2014)

CloudySkies said:


> It doesn't help when it's not natural to you either.
> 
> Even if I wanted to, I don't think I could do very well in large groups. The thing I hate the most is the screaming over top of people just to be heard, and how most of what is being said doesn't even have any substance to it. It's just inane stupid babble, usually petty gossip or dumb trends.
> 
> ...


Well said. I think that the real world is a far more grotesque, twisted, and dark place than anyone cares to admit.


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## ShadowsRunner (Apr 24, 2013)

Cohle said:


> Well said. I think that the real world is a far more grotesque, twisted, and dark place than anyone cares to admit.


THANKS, it's always made me think of this song lyric quote from John Lennon:

"There's room at the top they are telling you still
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
If you want to be like the folks on the hill"​


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