# SSRI for depression?



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

wanderingskitzo said:


> What happened when you were born? Were you incubated or did your mum hold you? Did she take you home straight away or did you stay in the hospital for a while. Were you born naturally or by C section?


I was born naturally, she held me, took me home, breastfed. All was good.


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## wanderingskitzo (Mar 31, 2013)

Red Panda said:


> I was born naturally, she held me, took me home, breastfed. All was good.


Apart from your Dad dying (which is horrible so I'm really sorry to hear that), have you lost any other people that are close to you?


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## chimeric (Oct 15, 2011)

wanderingskitzo said:


> I'm glad to hear that you had a positive experience with the drugs, however to me the idea of 'learning to push something away' is not healthy. If you are having to learn a defense mechanism in order to survive and it's a long term thing rather than a short term response then that is a hindrance Would it not be better to look into the reasons WHY you have such overwhelming fears, address these and overcome them? Drugs can't do that for you.


There isn't always a logical reason why. Sure, anyone can find problems in their life and pin things on them if they want, but...

I'm on an SSRI right now. It's seriously saved me. I was barely able to leave the house before. Panic attacks, crying all the time, dark obsessive thoughts, etc. My life circumstances were pretty OK. Sure, there were things I was miserable about, but even in the thick of my depression, I knew I shouldn't have been _that_ miserable, and that I had many reasons to feel grateful. But I couldn't feel grateful, and that just made me feel worse. Depression doesn't always have a reason.

(I do hope you realize that. If you're a therapist and you don't, that's concerning.)


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## wanderingskitzo (Mar 31, 2013)

chimeric said:


> There isn't always a logical reason why. Sure, anyone can find problems in their life and pin things on them if they want, but...
> 
> I'm on an SSRI right now. It's seriously saved me. I was barely able to leave the house before. Panic attacks, crying all the time, dark obsessive thoughts, etc. My life circumstances were pretty OK. Sure, there were things I was miserable about, but even in the thick of my depression, I knew I shouldn't have been _that_ miserable, and that I had many reasons to feel grateful. But I couldn't feel grateful, and that just made me feel worse. Depression doesn't always have a reason.
> 
> (I do hope you realize that. If you're a therapist and you don't, that's concerning.)


Yes I know - it depends on the type of depression that you have. There are 7 different types of depression currently categorized. In MOST cases there IS a root cause stemming more often than not from childhood experiences; these kinds of memories are also usually suppressed or it takes a long time to unearth them. Situations cause short term depression and when the neurons in the brain begin to break down, that is when long term depression arises. There have been a number of patients all over the world where significant changes have been oted simply by using methods of exercise therapy for example, in preference to drugs, which created the same chemicals in the brain with no side effects. It is becoming more accepted among the clinical profession these days to look at alternative methods first in preference to medicating.


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## chimeric (Oct 15, 2011)

wanderingskitzo said:


> Yes I know - it depends on the type of depression that you have. There are 7 different types of depression currently categorized. In MOST cases there IS a root cause stemming more often than not from childhood experiences; these kinds of memories are also usually suppressed or it takes a long time to unearth them. Situations cause short term depression and when the neurons in the brain begin to break down, that is when long term depression arises. There have been a number of patients all over the world where significant changes have been oted simply by using methods of exercise therapy for example, in preference to drugs, which created the same chemicals in the brain with no side effects. It is becoming more accepted among the clinical profession these days to look at alternative methods first in preference to medicating.


Understood, and I definitely agree that medication shouldn't be the first go-to. But many people have B&W views where these matters are concerned, and that's unrealistic. Drugs aren't the answer to everything or for everyone, but they also aren't useless or evil. Exercise is hugely important, but it wasn't enough on its own, and there were days I seriously couldn't make myself exercise. I've always maintained a fairly healthy diet, so nutrition wasn't the issue. Tried supplements and didn't notice any difference. The SSRI, though? Night and day. It's enabling me to make lifestyle changes that make me happier still.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

wanderingskitzo said:


> Apart from your Dad dying (which is horrible so I'm really sorry to hear that), have you lost any other people that are close to you?


Well, my grandma died too, 3 months ago almost. She suffered from dementia for the last 7 years or so and my mum and aunt took care of her day and night. I considered her lost a long time before she died to be honest. Can't say I'm not traumatized by her health situation but it's different than my Dad's.


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## wanderingskitzo (Mar 31, 2013)

Red Panda said:


> Well, my grandma died too, 3 months ago almost. She suffered from dementia for the last 7 years or so and my mum and aunt took care of her day and night. I considered her lost a long time before she died to be honest. Can't say I'm not traumatized by her health situation but it's different than my Dad's.


How about when you were young?


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

wanderingskitzo said:


> How about when you were young?


nope, none


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## Haydn (Sep 20, 2012)

Red Panda said:


> That's not what I meant exactly. My point is that without the drugs I couldn't feel and see what other ways of thinking I could follow to combat my anxiety and depressing thoughts. For example, because my depression was mostly existential, I couldn't stop thinking about my beloved ones dying. The thoughts came at night and I couldn't push them away unless I cried to sleep.


I think depression can cause one to enter into a kind of mentally destructive loop that is hard to break out of and sometimes not even therapy can work at that point because the mental state/cognition needed to benefit from therapy is just not present and if SSRIs can help at that point I can understand why you would want to take them.

I wonder though, what is it about your loved ones dying that caused you to be so depressed?

Do you think for instance, that you could manage to cope well if all your loved ones died?


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## DiamondDays (Sep 4, 2012)

Haydn said:


> I think depression can cause one to enter into a kind of mentally destructive loop that is hard to break out of and sometimes not even therapy can work at that point because the mental state/cognition needed to benefit from therapy is just not present and if SSRIs can help at that point I can understand why you would want to take them.


That loop is actually brain damage... SSRIs helps set things right.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Haydn said:


> I think depression can cause one to enter into a kind of mentally destructive loop that is hard to break out of and sometimes not even therapy can work at that point because the mental state/cognition needed to benefit from therapy is just not present and if SSRIs can help at that point I can understand why you would want to take them.
> 
> I wonder though, what is it about your loved ones dying that caused you to be so depressed?
> 
> Do you think for instance, that you could manage to cope well if all your loved ones died?



Maybe because I don't know if they exist anymore, if I'll ever see them again, and because I can't do things with them anymore. For example now that my dad has died he can't teach me how to drive his car better, which is something that hurts me because I like driving and always wanted to learn, and things like that. And then there is the pain or suffering when dying, like my dad who had pulmonary edema and couldn't take a breath before he died, and what went on in his head, what did he think about etc. It's all of these.


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## Haydn (Sep 20, 2012)

Red Panda said:


> Maybe because I don't know if they exist anymore, if I'll ever see them again, and because I can't do things with them anymore. For example now that my dad has died he can't teach me how to drive his car better, which is something that hurts me because I like driving and always wanted to learn, and things like that. And then there is the pain or suffering when dying, like my dad who had pulmonary edema and couldn't take a breath before he died, and what went on in his head, what did he think about etc. It's all of these.


I think I understand. You think of all the things you will no longer be able to do with them and it seems that you love them and do not them to suffer before death and you fear being permanently separated from them after death.


I wonder, do you think though that if they all died you would be able to make new connections, build a fulfilling life, learn all the skills you want in alternative ways, make new memories and have new great experiences whilst accepting the nature of life, death and the unknown and the uncontrollable and just exist with some sadness & loss without becoming depressed? 

In other words, do you think you could survive and thrive well?

Do you feel generally competent, strong and capable as a person?


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Haydn said:


> I think I understand. You think of all the things you will no longer be able to do with them and it seems that you love them and do not them to suffer before death and you fear being permanently separated from them after death.
> 
> 
> I wonder, do you think though that if they all died you would be able to make new connections, build a fulfilling life, learn all the skills you want in alternative ways, make new memories and have new great experiences whilst accepting the nature of life, death and the unknown and the uncontrollable and just exist with some sadness & loss without becoming depressed?
> ...


Yes I think I can survive and be well, and I am doing better now, a year from my dad's death, but it certainly feels that something is missing, or at least it makes me sad that I have to experience life without him now. It's also that he died young, at 64 and I'm 22. It'd certainly be different if he lived for another ~20 years or so. Like with my grandma, who died at 92 I don't feel sad that she died, but I do feel sad for what she went through 7 years with dementia (and what we went through too). If my mum lives to be 93 and her mind is healthy, I certainly will feel better when she dies than if she goes young.


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## Haydn (Sep 20, 2012)

Red Panda said:


> Yes I think I can survive and be well, and I am doing better now, a year from my dad's death, but it certainly feels that something is missing, or at least it makes me sad that I have to experience life without him now. It's also that he died young, at 64 and I'm 22. It'd certainly be different if he lived for another ~20 years or so. Like with my grandma, who died at 92 I don't feel sad that she died, but I do feel sad for what she went through 7 years with dementia (and what we went through too). If my mum lives to be 93 and her mind is healthy, I certainly will feel better when she dies than if she goes young.


It can be hard to deal with death but when someone dies younger and you have not spend as much time with them as you would like, I think the loss is way keener. I think death, unfortunately is inevitable for us all but there is so much that we can all learn, be, contribute etc in the meantime. Your father may be dead but I think that for as long as you live, the love you have for him will never die. I hope you not only feel the longing and sadness of his loss but also the happiness and appreciation for the time you had together and that you move forward in strength despite sadness and fear.


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## conscius (Apr 20, 2010)

uncertain said:


> How is the medicine supposed to help your depression if what makes you depressed in real life is unresolved?
> Maybe it is about how anti-depressant work in general?


I look at it this way: There is a chain and there are different points where you can intervene. Meds are supposed to work on the biological level. And they're far from perfect. That's why each medication comes with a long list of side-effects. Those are actually not the side effect but the actual effects. What I mean is that medications influence many different part of the body. In the next few decades, I anticipate more customaizable meds, like based on people's genetics and so forth. But for the time being, this is what you got.

But there are other ways of helping someone with depression. For instance exercise, talk therapy, social support, vitamins and better nutrition, meaningful activity, spiritual/religious practices, etc. Why one person chooses on method and ignores others, or why a person receives recommendations for one particular approach, is a whole other story, and sometimes reasonable enough (i.e. the symptoms are severe enough and lack of access to other resources) and other times not (Big Pharma pushing docs to prescribe). But it does help to know that there are various alternatives out there. It also does help to know that meds are not supposed to "cure" you of depression or make real life issues go away. 

What meds do is influence the neurotransmitter systems inside your brain. Serotonin which is the one mainly affected by SSRIs, is one that influences our moods (though others, like dopamine, also do). I don't want to get into the biology of it, but meds just try to increase the neurotransmitter in the synapses between the neurons inside your brain, and that's supposed to help with your mood. 

p.s. I have a degree in psychology.


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## uncertain (May 26, 2012)

conscius said:


> I look at it this way: There is a chain and there are different points where you can intervene. Meds are supposed to work on the biological level. And they're far from perfect. That's why each medication comes with a long list of side-effects. Those are actually not the side effect but the actual effects. What I mean is that medications influence many different part of the body. In the next few decades, I anticipate more customaizable meds, like based on people's genetics and so forth. But for the time being, this is what you got.
> 
> But there are other ways of helping someone with depression. For instance exercise, talk therapy, social support, vitamins and better nutrition, meaningful activity, spiritual/religious practices, etc. Why one person chooses on method and ignores others, or why a person receives recommendations for one particular approach, is a whole other story, and sometimes reasonable enough (i.e. the symptoms are severe enough and lack of access to other resources) and other times not (Big Pharma pushing docs to prescribe). But it does help to know that there are various alternatives out there. It also does help to know that meds are not supposed to "cure" you of depression or make real life issues go away.
> 
> ...


I think there is something that differentiates depression from just being sad. It's like you just can't... I don't know how to put it but I can somehow feel that f***ing thing in my mind. It's disturbing, distracting, and de-motivating me from doing various thing or just getting up from my bed or my chair. My sadness mainly comes from a relationship problem but I don't know what the sadness exactly *is*. People don't know how to help me either because I don't have that very answer, and they give advices that are not very helpful. I try to figure that sadness out but whenever I do so I get mentally and then physically tired. It's unthinkable and I hate myself for that.


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## mooray (Nov 22, 2011)




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## conscius (Apr 20, 2010)

uncertain said:


> I think there is something that differentiates depression from just being sad. It's like you just can't... I don't know how to put it but I can somehow feel that f***ing thing in my mind. It's disturbing, distracting, and de-motivating me from doing various thing or just getting up from my bed or my chair. My sadness mainly comes from a relationship problem but I don't know what the sadness exactly *is*. People don't know how to help me either because I don't have that very answer, and they give advices that are not very helpful. I try to figure that sadness out but whenever I do so I get mentally and then physically tired. It's unthinkable and I hate myself for that.


Uncertain , I'm sorry that this is causing you this much suffering, both the sadness but also its elusiveness.

I agree that sadness is not the same as depression. The way docs define clinical depression is just really some agreed upon criteria, and they're descriptive and do not focus on causes. For instance, it's the feeling depressed or loss of pleasure/interest in things, for most of a two week period, and additional factors like loss of energy, insomnia, weight change, etc. Regardless of what causes it.

But that's just for diagnostic purposes. I think sadness can be bothersome regardless. Especially when it feels alien, in the sense that you can't quite figure out what it is or where it comes from. Sadness that comes along after death of someone close, or even during/after watching a sad movie, is unpleasant also but not mysterious because the cause seems fairly clear. 

Sometimes I feel sad and it passes. I may not know why I feel sad. It does not always have a clear conscious reason. We don't have access to all parts of our mind and sometimes a small thing might trigger us and depending on the trigger and our reaction, we might have a short or long emotional reaction to it. 

For instance, I have had a difficult relationship with my mom, a relationship that has been mix of love, hate, care, rage, manipulation, a mess of things that overwhelmed my psyche and that taken me years to come to analyze and to terms with. So if I go out and see a mother being genuinely and unconditionally loving towards the child, it might make me sad and I may not realize the source till later when I can review what was happening before I got sad. However, I could also get sad because of something much less important, like maybe a color or smell or arrangement of furniture, triggers something, some old memory, fear, whatever. 

So therapists usually do realize their limitations and instead of trying to get to the bottom of all sadness, try to address a persistent mood that lasts a long time because it's more likely to find reasons for that, or at least ways of improving that. Moments of sadness may just need to be accepted as part of life. And some people even reference this beautiful poem by mystic Rumi, called Guest House,regarding accepting emotions:

The Guest House - Poem by Jelalludin Rumi, translated by Coleman Barks

But as for more persistent sadness (that is not quite clinical depression) that eludes your attempts at explanation, you may just need to be patient. Maybe it will reveal itself soon. Maybe it will come up in the relationship or other ones, or maybe even when talking to a therapist. Maybe a movie will do it. Or reading someone else's post.


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## RaidenPrime (Aug 4, 2012)

Honestly, the medication is there as a crutch, to help with anxiety and depression symptoms you get during rough times. The rest is up to you -- learning to cope with what is going on and getting the emotional support you need. Eventually you may not need the medication anymore unless you have a chemical imbalance and chronic depression problem, which requires medications of some sort, or at least a strong will power and lots of positive hobbies that keep your mind from wandering to nasty places.


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## Shabby (Feb 14, 2013)

I took anti-depressants for a couple of years. The first year was difficult since I kept having very bad reactions (became even more depressed and developed suicidal thoughts, etc..) to the medications they were prescribing. However, eventually I started taking Prozac, which worked with my body a lot better than the pervious meds. Soon after, I decided to stop taking them and until I did, I never truly worked on my depression - just popped the meds hoping for an easy fix. 

Once I stopped taking the meds, I dipped for a while but I managed to force myself to go to therapy at least once a week. Slowly, I started leaving the house more often (part of my depressive tendency is when I start staying at home for weeks and weeks on end - I live in a country where ANYTHING can be delivered to your home so that doesn't help.) I think it is always important to try to stand back and look at your life, issues, and how to solve the things that are bothering you the most (take the medication if you feel it may help but also be patient and understanding with yourself). Maybe a change of atmosphere is needed, perhaps you need to let go of any resentment towards yourself, etc... Whatever it is, getting to the root of the issue and understanding it is just as important as popping pills to fix any sort of chemical imbalance you may have. 

A great comic read on depression, how one reacts/feels towards it, and why it's a tricky state to be in: Hyperbole and a Half: Depression Part Two


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Haydn said:


> It can be hard to deal with death but when someone dies younger and you have not spend as much time with them as you would like, I think the loss is way keener. I think death, unfortunately is inevitable for us all but there is so much that we can all learn, be, contribute etc in the meantime. Your father may be dead but I think that for as long as you live, the love you have for him will never die. I hope you not only feel the longing and sadness of his loss but also the happiness and appreciation for the time you had together and that you move forward in strength despite sadness and fear.


thank you for your encouragement
I think all of us who lose a loved one should try to continue on our lives because we're going to die too so there is no point in dwelling, but only in remembering. Each person has a different period of time they need to move on of course, but eventually we all do because we have to.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

uncertain said:


> I think there is something that differentiates depression from just being sad. It's like you just can't... I don't know how to put it but I can somehow feel that f***ing thing in my mind. It's disturbing, distracting, and de-motivating me from doing various thing or just getting up from my bed or my chair. My sadness mainly comes from a relationship problem but I don't know what the sadness exactly *is*. People don't know how to help me either because I don't have that very answer, and they give advices that are not very helpful. I try to figure that sadness out but whenever I do so I get mentally and then physically tired. It's unthinkable and I hate myself for that.


I think you should try going to just therapy first since therapists can help you find why you are feeling sad, with the right questions and guidance and if that doesn't work you'll plan differently. I think the therapist will be adequate if the problem is a relationship, s/he will help you analyse exactly what that relationship is for you so you will eventually reach the problem, if it lies there. Yea you should definitely talk to a professional.


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