# Supervisor/Pedagogue



## livanay (Nov 17, 2008)

Hey all, I'm hoping to gain a broader understanding about the "supervisor" relationship between types. 

I kinda know about pedagogues, for instance INTJ-ENFP, however, I've noticed in a couple of websites that INTJ and ESTP are supervisors? What's the difference? Also, I've noticed that 'supervisors' get along quite ok...what's the deal with it? Why does it work?

I'll have parting questions based on this as we progress.

Thank ye!
Liv


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## Perseus (Mar 7, 2009)

*Petit Gods (Pedagogues)*



livanay said:


> Hey all, I'm hoping to gain a broader understanding about the "supervisor" relationship between types.
> 
> I kinda know about pedagogues, for instance INTJ-ENFP, however, I've noticed in a couple of websites that INTJ and ESTP are supervisors? What's the difference? Also, I've noticed that 'supervisors' get along quite ok...what's the deal with it? Why does it work?
> 
> ...




It is all very confusing the terms used by different systems. Therefore, I use animal terms which I do not even understand properly. 

Type Relationships:
*Pedagogue*
each is both the other's mentor and student: has a "parent to child" feel

The Sore Dragon: Type Relationships

Hawk (INTJ) and Ferret (ENFP) relationship. This would be a very strange one. The trouble is the INTJ always thinks (s)he is right!

Eagle (INTP) and Wolf (ENTJ) is similarly strange. But the Wolf will never have time to listen. 

"I have not got time to listen to your excuses," said the Wolf. "If you do not do as you told I am going to swallow you up!"


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## livanay (Nov 17, 2008)

Haha, that's pretty neat.

I notice the INTJ-ENFP mentor-student thing though they seem to get stuck at a certain point...I mean, very stuck... They can hardly reconcile sooner than later without me or my friend intervening between the two to settle the heat.

I guess they'd have to learn on themselves pretty soon.

As for ENTJ-INTP, I can see it, however, I'm leaning more toward, say, ENTJ-ISTP - how would that work? Do supervisors make more effective 'mentors' to one another than pedagogues? Other examples are ESTJ-INTP, ENFJ-ISFP, etc.

If so, then what is the _actual_ role of a pedagogue? Anyone experienced it?


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## Perseus (Mar 7, 2009)

ENTJ - ISFP Wolf and Cat is very common. In ine instance I thought it was ENTJ - ISTP Wolf and Dog at first.

The thing is the Wolf is attracted to the ISFP so badly that it is joke if it did not have serious ramifications for everybody else who suffers.


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## decided (May 17, 2009)

So I looked up 'INFJ pedagogue' and found TypeLogic: ((INFJ Profile)), that says that ENTP is the pedagogue to INFJ. They described pedagogue as: each is both the other's mentor and student: has a "parent to child" feel.

One of my best friends is an ENTP. I suppose you could say we have a 'parent to child' feel sometimes. He can be a bit flippant and assholey, and I can be a bit fussy and wimpy, so we sometimes call each other on shit. So maybe the role of the pedagogue is to bring some balance to the other personality...?

It didn't mention 'supervisors' though. But this site is pretty cool, I'll have a longer look at these relationship pairs.


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## livanay (Nov 17, 2008)

Striking a balance might just be the case. Generally, other variables can determine a sense of balance between people, however and perhaps 'pedagogues' do this the most blatant and more workable fashion.

I had a thought about the supervisor Vs pedagogue thing, though.

Since I have an ESTP father, an INTJ brother, and a couple of ENFP friends, I will use 'em as examples.

I notice my dad and bro at least know 'what to do' in a situation _with_ a great deal of confidence. My dad is very fast-paced and straight down to the point (according to how he discerns it of course)... whereas bro takes a few steps back to speculate on different angles to the situation before knowing at least what can be done - and knows it can be done. Whenever they work together, my bro sees that my dad isn't foreseeing what can happen next, rather dad just wants to 'see' what will happen. This is where dad doesn't wanna be told what to do and bro will not agree with him straight out. However, when it's executed, and should there be any problems, my bro has a way of 'mentoring' dad and so does dad have a way of 'mentoring' him. They have a very practical relationship. It seems they don't share the same passions but will be found in similar opportunities.

Now onto the ENFPs that I know, that interact with INTJs, they tend to show how they want more or less the same things and are able to emphasize their passion for such things with each other. However, it comes with different 'methods' of executing their goals, dreams and what not - and sometimes they run into each other _really_ badly. Perhaps it's a life-long learning type of relationship - the fact that something positive can be built or produced since a passion is shared. It almost looks like an interaction whereby one's supervising the 'supervision'.

I dunno, that's just my take! Any more perspectives are much appreciated.


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## 480 (Jan 22, 2009)

I have experienced ENTJ to ISTP over a long haul... it was a one way relationship, but I didn't mind... he was a puppy.

ENTJ to ISFP.... yes... I'll take the whole litter.

ENTJ to INTP really depends on the INTP. It's a question of self-awareness. The problem sorts itself out though because the retarded INTPs just avoid me to begin with. Those I connect with have very enjoyable conversations, and works out just fine.

As for ENTJs... I've seen some that give the type a bad name. I tend not to wear the label because knowing I'm ENTJ wont tell you much about me. Retarded ENTJs rank right up there with retarded ESTJs in terms of annoyance factor... but the ENTJ is going to be better at it.


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## Dr. Metallic (Nov 15, 2008)

You might find this thread I started interesing, Livanay.

Pedagogue Relationships


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## livanay (Nov 17, 2008)

Grim- quite right, there are several variables beyond 'type' that determines an individual's position. For instance, it would depend on what stage in life an entj reached, or even an intp, and what are their differing needs and wants -- but these won't necessarily be the kind of needs and wants they'd want forever -- it's with realization as per experience that any person learns to appreciate what's in front of them because they understand _why_. There are labels of 'entjs' as being controlling, however it depends on the receiving end too as people interpret words and behaviour slightly or to a degree larger, in different ways. There's no right or wrong, but there's an understanding that I've noticed whenever I see for instance an entj and intp interacting - that when a certain set of people thought of the entj as being controlling, the intp being logical and objective 'caught onto' the points the entj was making simply because it sounds 'right': should this intp follow through the execution of an idea or plan made by the entj would only mean the intp discerned them to make logical sense and would otherwise say 'no' if you weren't right. I think if an intp would have to 'walk out' simply because an entj went ahead to do what he/she had to do even if he/she were wrong creates a hole wherepon pedagogues are usually good at filling. So you're good at something at the inadequacy of the other - both being just as important to progression or personal growth. But it matters as to what's important and valued for any given type and the responsibility taken upon this decision. I dunno why relationships end because something as such is 'missing' - there will always be something valuable that's missing in most if not all relationships.

Metallic - thanks for the link, it was very insightful... it's interesting to note from that thread that pedagogues is a friendship that wasn't meant to happen...so, the desire to want a relationship with a pedagogue type would mean one would have certainly experienced such an interaction before and is more or less sure this is what they're looking for.

Anyhu I'm calling it a day, night night folks!


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## asbreathingflows (Jul 19, 2009)

In all honesty I think categorizing type relationships is stretching MBTI too far - we can have good and bad relationships with any type. For example - take two ENTJs I know, one of them I consider to be amongst my closest friends, the other I consider an opinionated asshole. I have yet to see the relevance of socionics to _real_ life - there is much that MBTI cannot explain, but at least it doesn't go ridiculously overboard in attempting to do so.


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## livanay (Nov 17, 2008)

Yeah, well that in essence would be my point when I state 'there will always be something(s) missing in any relationship' - hence, one have to truly know what's good for them. And truth said, not everyone in this world are compatible for one another - some can be fit for you more than others - and by using the MBTI tool helps to see instances as such, that's all.


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## Perseus (Mar 7, 2009)

*Poor Judge of Character*



Grim said:


> I have experienced ENTJ to ISTP over a long haul... it was a one way relationship, but I didn't mind... he was a puppy.
> 
> ENTJ to ISFP.... yes... I'll take the whole litter.
> 
> ...




Retard just means slow. The greater Perception of the INTPs over the ENTJ takes longer to process. ENTJs can regress to ESTJ and bully people by calling them names like Retard.


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## 480 (Jan 22, 2009)

Perseus said:


> Retard just means slow. The greater Perception of the INTPs over the ENTJ takes longer to process. ENTJs can regress to ESTJ and bully people by calling them names like Retard.


No retard does not just mean slow, it also means held back. My point was not an insult, it was that INTPs retarded (held back) by lack of the aforementioned self-awareness tend to be the ones who avoid me.

Don't sweat it though Perseus... I'll wait for you to catch up. I'm sure you're just a bit held back by all that extra processing you're doing.


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