# Dating a girl that loves to be topless?



## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

ENFPathetic said:


> No. That's obviously a cheap woman. You'd have to be emotionally compromised to give such a woman your time, company and protection.


Or she is a liberated women, who feels free to express her self, and the guy who dates her is proud of his woman, with such a high level of self esteem and beauty.


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## ENFPathetic (Apr 3, 2018)

Electra said:


> Or she is a liberated women, who feels free to express her self, and the guy who dates her is proud of his woman, with such a high level of self esteem and beauty.


In other words a cheap woman, and an emotionally compromised man. How else would one come to the conclusion that getting naked = high self esteem and beauty. Do you think people wear clothes because they're ugly?


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

ENFPathetic said:


> In other words a cheap woman, and an emotionally compromised man. How else would one come to the conclusion that getting naked = high self esteem and beauty. Do you think people wear clothes because they're ugly?


No. I don't quite understand the way you think. Also its a bit challanging because I'm not the type to do such things, but there are many females who do, and I know thats how the boyfriend feels. They don't look at them as honorless sluts but as extremely pretty and valuable. They don't feel compromised, rather it gives them pride that they have such a wonderfull women.


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## ENFPathetic (Apr 3, 2018)

Electra said:


> No. I don't quite understand the way you think. Also its a bit challanging because I'm not the type to do such things, but there are many females who do, and I know thats how the boyfriend feels. They don't look at them as honorless sluts but as extremely pretty and valuable. They don't feel compromised, rather it gives them pride that they have such a wonderfull women.


I get it. You want to defend the honour of cheap women, but find it challenging because you yourself are not a cheap woman. You know a number of cheap women who have emotionally compromised boyfriends who are happy to have an attractive girlfriend, even if she's on display for every man to see. In fact, there are men who are so emotionally compromised, they pressure they're women to put themselves on display for the world so they can show them off as trophies. None of that contradicts what I'm saying.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

ENFPathetic said:


> I get it. You want to defend the honour of cheap women, but find it challenging because you yourself are not a cheap woman. You know a number of cheap women who have emotionally compromised boyfriends who are happy to have an attractive girlfriend, even if she's on display for every man to see. In fact, there are men who are so emotionally compromised, they pressure they're women to put themselves on display for the world so they can show them off as trophies. None of that contradicts what I'm saying.


No, it isn't exactly like that.
I dont look at people as cheap or slutty.
All humans without exception has value to me.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

ENFPathetic said:


> In other words a cheap woman, and an emotionally compromised man. How else would one come to the conclusion that getting naked = high self esteem and beauty. Do you think people wear clothes because they're ugly?


Some people don't consider women commodities that should be defined as "cheap," or whatever--but as human beings with their own minds, thoughts, emotions, and motivations. 

And some men are thoughtful, intelligent, and empathetic--so I can see how perhaps that would be considered "emotionally compromised" because they do relate to women on an emotional level, rather than just treating them like objects to be defined by terms like "cheap."


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

Yes it sounds like speaking about a lamp or a table. Not like a human.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

That being said I can understand how people get _jealous_, on the other hand.


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## ENFPathetic (Apr 3, 2018)

Electra said:


> No, it isn't exactly like that.
> I dont look at people as cheap or slutty.
> All humans without exception has value to me.


I agree that all humans have value. But some have lower value than others. An exhibitionist has more value than a slut.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

ENFPathetic said:


> I agree that all humans have value. But some have lower value than others. An exhibitionist has more value than a slut.


Totally disagree.


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## ENFPathetic (Apr 3, 2018)

Electra said:


> Totally disagree.


To each their own.


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## Squirt (Jun 2, 2017)

Electra said:


> Yes it sounds like speaking about a lamp or a table. Not like a human.


Hey, what’s wrong with a lamp or a table?


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

ENFPathetic said:


> In other words a cheap woman, and an emotionally compromised man. How else would one come to the conclusion that getting naked = high self esteem and beauty. Do you think people wear clothes because they're ugly?


Yes ofc, when Adam & Eve (ok this was A CHOICE since they are the prime example of a cheap woman and emotionally compromised man) ate from that tree they looked at their nakedness and were humiliated by it so they had to grab the nearest leaf to cover themselves.
Idk generally speaking I wear clothes to keep warm, the fact that I won't be putting men into sinful temptation is just a plus because Jesus said it is their business to tear out their eyes not mine. The only exception is how I started wearing a bikini top out of shame at a time when I didn't even have breasts yet, so that is the weird part for me.


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## ENFPathetic (Apr 3, 2018)

DOGSOUP said:


> Yes ofc, when Adam & Eve (ok this was A CHOICE since they are the prime example of a cheap woman and emotionally compromised man) ate from that tree they looked at their nakedness and were humiliated by it so they had to grab the nearest leaf to cover themselves.
> Idk generally speaking I wear clothes to keep warm, the fact that I won't be putting men into sinful temptation is just a plus because Jesus said it is their business to tear out their eyes not mine. The only exception is how I started wearing a bikini top out of shame at a time when I didn't even have breasts yet, so that is the weird part for me.


I can't tell if you're just stupid or that insincere. Before you call Eve a cheap woman and Adam an emotionally compromised man, answer this question. What man other than her husband was Eve on display for?

I understand that you've been sexualised since before you knew right from wrong, and that you're so used to it being the publicised norm, you feel tempted to shed layers just to fit in. It doesn't change the fact that it devalues you.


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## Scoobyscoob (Sep 4, 2016)

FreeKekistan said:


> A true american.
> 
> I wouldn't. Seeing her naked, even partially should be something exclusively reserved for me, not for everybody. Relationships are about exclusivity.


Hm, I had to think about your response for a bit but yeah, I agree with you but for different reasons. I don't ever want any other guy(s) gawking at my SO's body or our kids either, when they're older of course. My wife and I have all girls so far so I have to be the "strict one" due to that. Normally, I wouldn't care if a woman chose to be topless at say the beach. My wife however is the kind of person to be wearing a t-shirt and shorts at the beach so I know she wouldn't and I'd make sure the kids know that they can't do that until they're old enough to decide if they want to. As that would attract a lot more attention than staying covered.


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

ENFPathetic said:


> I can't tell if you're just stupid or that insincere. Before you call Eve a cheap woman and Adam an emotionally compromised man, answer this question. What man other than her husband was Eve on display for?


Oh I was referring to how Eve sold paradise for the high price of an apple, not their original state of nakedness.
Idk when all the other people appeared. But that was not the point of the story. It was how the fruit changed their understanding of themselves, not if there were other men around.


> I understand that you've been sexualised since before you knew right from wrong, and that you're so used to it being the publicised norm, you feel tempted to shed layers just to fit in. It doesn't change the fact that it devalues you.


Oh no no, I said I added layers, because someone thinks 8 year olds (lacking) breasts are sexual objects.
The fact that I have seen female breasts, just casually, has helped remove the idea there is something shameful about them.


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## Mark R (Dec 23, 2015)

It depends on context. It is her body. In some social settings exposing breasts is acceptable. She might do it for feminist reasons. Some cultures don't sexualize breasts. Some reasons for her exposing her breasts might or might not be meant in any disrespect to your relationship. It all depends on her intent.


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## ESFJMouse (Oct 13, 2020)

Well, just a thought but maybe you want something to be more private between the two of you?
Did she just get implants? I ask because many women I know with a naturally larger chest usually go through great lengths to keep it hidden in public. Some women (just some) with a larger chest will often wear tops that go to their collar bone.


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## Eu_citzen (Jan 18, 2018)

tanstaafl28 said:


> Did you all know this is a thing?
> 
> [POTENTIALLY OFFENSIVE MATERIAL]
> 
> ...


I knew as well. "Free the nipple" was also hyped a lot a while back.


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## ENFPathetic (Apr 3, 2018)

DOGSOUP said:


> Oh I was referring to how Eve sold paradise for the high price of an apple, not their original state of nakedness.
> Idk when all the other people appeared. But that was not the point of the story. It was how the fruit changed their understanding of themselves, not if there were other men around.
> 
> Oh no no, I said I added layers, because someone thinks 8 year olds (lacking) breasts are sexual objects.
> The fact that I have seen female breasts, just casually, has helped remove the idea there is something shameful about them.


Insincere it is. She didn't trade paradise for an apple, she succumbed to temptation.

It's not limited to someone. It's society at large. From the sick industry that advertises that fashion to the parents who dress their little girls like prostitutes. Women have been so brainwashed into being sex objects that every other woman will endure the discomfort of wearing high heels just to grab coffee with a friend.

There is nothing shameful about breasts. The shame is in exposing them in public.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

daleks_exterminate said:


> That makes me think of this:
> 
> 
> __
> ...


this paragraph hit home to me, because I read this and I've experienced various emergencies in my life where I had to act, and also...with the girl on the train...it's the same thing. Sometimes there are just SECONDS between your safety and your not-safety, and girls are so often socialized to be polite...to give the benefit of the doubt, to be kind, to be gentle etc.

It really needs to be disregarded if a woman or girl feels something is wrong or off. 



> Now, this is about a 3 second interaction at this point. For some reason, I thought of Ted Bundy and how he'd pretend to be crippled to target his victims. I thought of my mom telling me to not be nice to strangers-don't be afraid to be a bitch. My thinking wasn't as "calculated" as all that, but it was more the nano-processing of how to deal with the situation.


Like the girl on the train...odds would have shifted DRAMATICALLY if she'd taken an extra few seconds to figure out what was going on, and the train had left. 

But for other situations it can be a couple seconds before the person is in pepper-spray distance to physical contact, because men do tend to be physically stronger than most women. You want to stop the attack (or defend) before they get to your physical space.

So I feel like it's worth it to "don't be afraid to be a bitch" if you feel an "uh oh" feeling. Do not override your gut feeling.

As far as "being angry" though-- many people also experience "freeze" as one of their fight/flight responses. That's another reason why it's scary, because if she froze she might not have had the same result, but freezing is not uncommon. 

But I totally agree--being aggressive or "being a bitch," rather than being nice, can save your life in some circumstances. And women should not worry about being polite in a situation they feel unsafe.


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## Ace Of Forests (Aug 22, 2021)

WickerDeer said:


> this paragraph hit home to me, because I read this and I've experienced various emergencies in my life where I had to act, and also...with the girl on the train...it's the same thing. Sometimes there are just SECONDS between your safety and your not-safety, and girls are so often socialized to be polite...to give the benefit of the doubt, to be kind, to be gentle etc.
> 
> It really needs to be disregarded if a woman or girl feels something is wrong or off.
> 
> ...



Man, it's almost like the traditional message of being passive, polite, and not opening your mouth wasn't because of anything wrong with you, but so men could count on your vulnerability when it suits them.

It's just nature though guys. Women are supposed to be killed by serial killers, after all.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

The sad thing is that sometimes pure assertiveness in our culture is sometimes considered being a bitch, while in reality we just say what we think or put up healthy boundaries. How bitchy, huh?


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## Squirt (Jun 2, 2017)

Apparently, this mythical topless gal is perfect for projecting all our worst fears about women onto - whether she’s a cheap, gold-digging succubus or vulnerable maiden asserting her human rights in a dangerous world.

Maybe we should make a “topless gal” plushie.


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## Queen of Cups (Feb 26, 2010)

Squirt said:


> Apparently, this mythical topless gal is perfect for projecting all our worst fears about women onto - whether she’s a cheap, gold-digging succubus or vulnerable maiden asserting her human rights in a dangerous world.
> 
> Maybe we should make a “topless gal” plushie.


She’s probably also a redhead 👩🏻‍🦰 😅


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## Dalien (Jul 21, 2010)

WickerDeer said:


> this paragraph hit home to me, because I read this and I've experienced various emergencies in my life where I had to act, and also...with the girl on the train...it's the same thing. Sometimes there are just SECONDS between your safety and your not-safety, and girls are so often socialized to be polite...to give the benefit of the doubt, to be kind, to be gentle etc.
> 
> It really needs to be disregarded if a woman or girl feels something is wrong or off.
> 
> ...


I hope like hell that if I ever were to be put in that situation that I wouldn’t freeze.
I tend to put my foot down in situations that aren’t anything like that. So…


I did have an experience where a male was breaking into my house through the front door.
I woke up and immediately ducked behind my bed waiting.
I was home alone.
My house layout (closed in front porch across living room and bedroom right next to each other) allowed me to run out the front door just after he went through the living room.
The police had already been called by my neighbor and caught the guy.

I think having the mindset of quick thinking and utilizing the fear for survival compliments aggressive behavior to do what is necessary. One might think running is not aggressive in its true sense, but in a sense it actually is—did not give them the satisfaction of whatever they were up to. 
Bitch if you will, but the term bitch is a little more complex than standing up and fighting back at the male world. It’s standing up no matter what and to who.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

AceOfForests said:


> Man, it's almost like the traditional message of being passive, polite, and not opening your mouth wasn't because of anything wrong with you, but so men could count on your vulnerability when it suits them.
> 
> It's just nature though guys. Women are supposed to be killed by serial killers, after all.


lol edit: I removed a joke idk I shouldn't go there right now. 

But yeah--it does seem like that sometimes.


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## Ace Of Forests (Aug 22, 2021)

WickerDeer said:


> lol edit: I removed a joke idk I shouldn't go there right now.
> 
> But yeah--it does seem like that sometimes.


(It's okay, I saw it)


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## Queen of Cups (Feb 26, 2010)

This reminded me to charge my taser….


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## Squirt (Jun 2, 2017)

AceOfForests said:


> (It's okay, I saw it)


I missed it! 😩


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## Queen of Cups (Feb 26, 2010)

Thinking back to all my negative interactions with the opposite sex, and what I was wearing was rarely a factor. (Except that one time at the gym, when dude saw my “I’m with the drummer” shirt and said “I’m a drummer, can I bang you all night long?”).

And, not every dude is attracted to tits. Legs, feet, butts, thighs, hell one dude told me he thinks my hair is a turn on. My best friend thinks sweats are hot.
Attraction is weird y’all.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

Squirt said:


> I missed it! 😩


It was just the same sort of thing. A comparison between the dangers of being nice with the example of the girl in the subway vs. being nice and not getting sex (nice guy complaints).

edit


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

Squirt said:


> I missed it! 😩


Me too 😳🥺


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