# Does your culture have an effect on your MBTI type?



## Straystuff (May 23, 2014)

I'm Finnish ENFJ and I think my country of origin has a strong impact on how I come across as an individual of my type.

The First thing is that showing emotions is concidered a bit rude in my country. I'm a strong Fe user so I'm very aware of this and I try to town down my feelings exept when I'm with my closest friends. I think I might seem like a Fi user at times 'cause of this. All in all I'm pretty sure many strong Fe -types have hard time living in countries like mine 'cause we can't really show all the passion we have inside of us without being rude.

The Second point is the "ENFJ:s are always positive" -stereotype. Not in my country. We take pride on being pessimistic. Really, it's a thing. I am, however, a positive person in our standards which means my thought process is less "we're going to die" and more "we're going to die but lol whatever, we've got nothing to lose anyway". In the gif below an American person is interviewing a Finnish singer. I added it 'cause that awkward situation happens to us quite often when we travel abroad.










Finally there's the way we show extraversion. I thought for the longest time that I was an introvert 'cause compared to the stereotypes I can be very quiet, shy and reserved at times. Then again I think it might be 'cause of my culture. This video of Jimmy Kimmel talking with random Finns tells you pretty much everything you need to know about our mad communication skills (that quy with the glasses would be an example of an exrovert here).






So yeah. Does anyone else see their culture effect on their type?


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## Tao Te Ching (May 3, 2013)

I've wondered this myself but know nothing about it. I would imagine it would but have no evidence.

WOW, that video was excellent, thank you for sharing.


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## Bugs (May 13, 2014)

Yes - I think so. At least superficially. I come from a family of culture and tradition. Many of my family and friends growing up were really tradition based and had a strong reverence for it. I think it showed a lot of Si. My best friend growing up is probably ESTJ because of that.


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## jinhong91 (Apr 29, 2014)

Tell me about it. My culture has a lot to do with do stuff, don't question so much.
Being a Ti dom, it really suppresses it. Good thing that I have the fortune to meet people who aren't so keen on following that.

But then again it can go both ways since I do enjoy getting around stupid BS. Learn the rules and sort of abuse the loopholes kind of thing.


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## Straystuff (May 23, 2014)

If it isn't too uncomfortable for you it would be really cool to know where you guys are from! I could learn about the types in a certain culture


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## GoosePeelings (Nov 10, 2013)

Straystuff said:


> I'm Finnish ENFJ and I think my country of origin has a strong impact on how I come across as an individual of my type.
> 
> The First thing is that showing emotions is concidered a bit rude in my country. I'm a strong Fe user so I'm very aware of this and I try to town down my feelings exept when I'm with my closest friends. I think I might seem like a Fi user at times 'cause of this. All in all I'm pretty sure many strong Fe -types have hard time living in countries like mine 'cause we can't really show all the passion we have inside of us without being rude.
> 
> ...


A fellow Finn, huh.
Judging by MBTI, I'm almost the exact opposite of yours. But that doesn't mean that this culture doesn't affect me. I'm extremely introverted, at times to the point of not getting a single word out. And I'm too disorganized to achieve anything. I once read that the most common type for a Finn is ISTJ which seems to be true. I'm surrounded by Judgers.


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## FePa (Feb 13, 2014)

It seems so, I'm from Brasil
So... happy shine people dancing


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## Draki (Apr 4, 2014)

Yes! I'm German and INTP. I always test as INTJ because I'm always punctual. And do plans and schedules and so on.
And I learned to get stuff done efficiently and on time. And I take work very seriously.

However I don't have the functions of INTJs and after work I'm always late xD and "unserious".
I do plans but I never work them through at home...


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## Straystuff (May 23, 2014)

GoosePeelings said:


> A fellow Finn, huh.
> Judging by MBTI, I'm almost the exact opposite of yours. But that doesn't mean that this culture doesn't affect me. I'm extremely introverted, at times to the point of not getting a single word out. And I'm too disorganized to achieve anything. I once read that the most common type for a Finn is ISTJ which seems to be true. I'm surrounded by Judgers.


Kappas en ookkaan ainoa aktiivinen meikäläinen tällä sivustolla! 

Most Finns are ISTJ:s? Hah, now that I think about it it sounds painfully accurate. And I believe you about the judging too. I've been studying abroad for a while now and more than one foreigner (as in, not a Finn) has said that the only nationality that is more organized and "rigid" than Finns are the Germans 

Ps. I bet you are a lot better than you think. If something it's the contrast to the majority that makes you feel inadequate in some situations. It doesn't mean it's the truth about you or your abilities. (dominant Fe explosion, sorry)


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## PaladinX (Feb 20, 2013)

@Straystuff

I think you raise a good point about culture. When I was doing the MBTI certification training they brought up the idea that culture can impact finding one's best-fit type. For example, when we think of Italy, we might think of a lot of extraverted and expressive behaviours, but that doesn't mean that they are all extraverts. It creates a new baseline and should be taken into account when someone is trying to identify their type.


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## Straystuff (May 23, 2014)

PaladinX said:


> For example, when we think of Italy, we might think of a lot of extraverted and expressive behaviours, but that doesn't mean that they are all extraverts. It creates a new baseline and should be taken into account when someone is trying to identify their type.


Oh I completely agree with this! I have been studying abroad and one of my friends was a French introvert and I tell you he was a lot louder than me  

I think especially the stereotypes about introversion and extraversion confuse people. MBTI is originated in America which has a very expressive culture when compared to many other countries. I think a lot of e.g. north European and Asian people accidentally type themselves as introverts when doing tests online 'cause they are being compared to the norm in USA. Same thing goes backwards in more expressive cultures (e.g. Italy you mentioned).


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## shakti (Oct 10, 2012)

PaladinX said:


> @_Straystuff_
> 
> I think you raise a good point about culture. When I was doing the MBTI certification training they brought up the idea that culture can impact finding one's best-fit type. For example, when we think of Italy, we might think of a lot of extraverted and expressive behaviours, but that doesn't mean that they are all extraverts. It creates a new baseline and should be taken into account when someone is trying to identify their type.


My close friend's boyfriend is Italian and lives in Italy...before meeting him I knew he tested as ISFP, so I was quite surprised when he turned out to be very expressive, flamboyant and funny in person! 

But then she explained how he is used to putting on a very extroverted facade when he's in his hometown to fit in better, which made perfect sense


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## shakti (Oct 10, 2012)

I grew up in New Zealand, a very ISTP country, so maybe this helped me develop my Se - Ti more than the average ENFJ 

Now I live in Croatia which is as Si - Fe as hell, so the Si overload grates on me from time to time :-D


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## chanteuse (May 30, 2014)

Chinese culture tends to ask for comformity and obedience, not individuality. I wouldn't say it affects my personality. It just adds pressure. However, for the (INFJ) life of me, I can't obey nor conform to be what's expected of me from the society (get a degree, find a stable job, marry, have children, take care of husband's whole family, etc.). I've always wanted to buck the tradition, to do the unexpected, even at my own expense. Sure, when I was younger I felt torn because all my peers were on the road well traveled. However, I am at an age that I feel at peace with the road I chose.

Fortunately my own parents hardly pressured me to be like other Chinese women. They knew better because I never did what they told me to do. ;-)


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## jcal (Oct 31, 2013)

GoosePeelings said:


> I once read that the most common type for a Finn is ISTJ which seems to be true.


I can say with near certainty that if it was me (an American ISTJ) being interviewed by Jimmy Kimmel, the results would have been quite similar to what's in the video.


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## derlierina (Aug 5, 2014)

I think in my country (Slovakia), the most favored type is INTJ and typical Slovak humor is also full of irony, so I think my jokes are a little bit too insensitive for the average INFP. :tongue:


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## Zee Bee (Aug 19, 2014)

Germany: SJ, meticulously producing. Also NJ, to develop new things to produce.
Even the most anarchistic German skinhead will SJ be on time, for everything


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## crumbs (Dec 17, 2013)

@chanteuse whoo, another Asian!  Apparently we're rare here on PerC. 

To OP's question, yeah, I think it does. I'm from Ontario, Canada and we have that typical East Coast "smile and wave politely and try not to over step your boundaries unless it involves the government" thing down to a science. Politeness is like the code of living here. Loudness is frowned upon (public disturbance), talking to strangers in the street is frowned upon (invading their personal space), even batting an eye or looking rudely at someone who's going crazy is looked down on because you don't want to acknowledge that there's something wrong with the person since it would be rude to get involved and possibly cause an even bigger public disturbance, and if they need help, they've probably been taken care of already by our amazing healthcare system. It makes for a very passive culture. In the long run, the ENFPs I know (including myself) are probably a lot more apologetic about their personalities than others since we have to dial down ourselves a lot to be taken seriously. We communicate through subtleties and nuances instead of grand ENFP-ish gestures, our humor is a bit drier, and we expect the worst before we expect the best. This is also very different from the typically in-your-face Filipino culture my parents brought over, which I can "switch on" when I'm around other Filipinos, but even then the Filipinos who've been here for a while have largely assimilated to Canadian sarcasm and politeness.

Anywho, I really like this thread. It's interesting seeing how different cultures shape different MBTI types. I want to see a Finnish ENFP now.


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## Straystuff (May 23, 2014)

crumbs said:


> [MENTION=111497]
> Loudness is frowned upon (public disturbance), talking to strangers in the street is frowned upon (invading their personal space), even batting an eye or looking rudely at someone who's going crazy is looked down on because you don't want to acknowledge that there's something wrong with the person since it would be rude to get involved and possibly cause an even bigger public disturbance, and if they need help, they've probably been taken care of already by our amazing healthcare system. It makes for a very passive culture. In the long run, the ENFPs I know (including myself) are probably a lot more apologetic about their personalities than others since we have to dial down ourselves a lot to be taken seriously. We communicate through subtleties and nuances instead of grand ENFP-ish gestures, our humor is a bit drier, and we expect the worst before we expect the best.
> 
> Anywho, I really like this thread. It's interesting seeing how different cultures shape different MBTI types. I want to see a Finnish ENFP now.


You know they say here that if we Finns decide to move abroad Canada is a great choise and I just realized why. The culture seems pretty similar in some aspects. We are maybe not as polite as you guys (you've made that into an art ) but the whole "don't interact with people, it might disturb them", "if somebody does something unordinary act like they don't exist 'cause staring etc is rude" -thing sound very familiar :'D 

I think Finnish ENFP:s often dress extravagantly and especially in their teens they might be part of some kind of subculture (you know, hippies, punks etc). Other than that I think they might be experiensing pretty similar things as what you described. 
E.g. this girl here might be a Finnish ENFP


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## DarkSideOfLight (Feb 15, 2011)

Draki said:


> Yes! I'm German and INTP. I always test as INTJ because I'm always punctual. And do plans and schedules and so on.
> And I learned to get stuff done efficiently and on time. And I take work very seriously.
> 
> However I don't have the functions of INTJs and after work I'm always late xD and "unserious".
> I do plans but I never work them through at home...


What's with this German thing. Hitler didn't get his job done + hi was late with attacking Russians like a year. Whole bloody year! Ohh BUT hi was Austrian?? How the hell the whole nation missed that detail? Ohh I get it everyone was always on time so the guy would be like 3 hours late and mindfuck all of them. God what can be perceived as a strength can really go deep inside your ass and cause lot of pain. 

Free yourself. It's ok to be late and cut corners  All the time!


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## DarkSideOfLight (Feb 15, 2011)

chanteuse said:


> Chinese culture tends to ask for comformity and obedience, not individuality. I wouldn't say it affects my personality. It just adds pressure. However, for the (INFJ) life of me, I can't obey nor conform to be what's expected of me from the society (get a degree, find a stable job, marry, have children, take care of husband's whole family, etc.). I've always wanted to buck the tradition, to do the unexpected, even at my own expense. Sure, when I was younger I felt torn because all my peers were on the road well traveled. However, I am at an age that I feel at peace with the road I chose.
> 
> Fortunately my own parents hardly pressured me to be like other Chinese women. They knew better because I never did what they told me to do. ;-)


You sound like an ENTP


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## chanteuse (May 30, 2014)

DarkSideOfLight said:


> You sound like an ENTP


INFJs are pretty stubborn, not some shrinking violets.


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## mikan (May 25, 2014)

My culture has a very strong Fe and Ne. That's why sometimes, I can't take it I'm completely the opposite, so I have to make myself look like a Fe user a lot.


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## Promethea (Aug 24, 2009)

Different cultures seem to value certain functions more than others.. like western culture is very Te and Se valuing. People are encouraged to be more industrious, or more spontaneous and exciting. Both really. I suppose the "ideal" american male for example is a Te dom at work and an Se dom at play - tall order for something to "be" really. In another culture, the philosophical type or artist type might be valued more. In Okinawan culture, I'd suspect delta Si is valued for example.

Do those expectations influence type? Hm, dunno, but they could certainly influence how types who aren't those feel about themselves. Maybe this is where all the bullcrap "alpha vs beta" male stuff comes from, other types recognize that this culture is conducive to happiness mostly in certain types. A certain personality can more easily succeed in a culture that embraces its way above others. 

I don't know that people can really change their type through any amount of focus or self-loathing though, and it seems like type is a blend of inborn trait and early childhood development. For example, I had a Te dom friend who decided that she was going to force her son to become like her, but that usually doesn't work out as planned, the kid just grows up thinking its defective and hates itself if its too far from what shes expecting.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

Promethea said:


> Different cultures seem to value certain functions more than others.. like western culture is very Te and Se valuing. People are encouraged to be more industrious, or more spontaneous and exciting. Both really. I suppose the "ideal" american male for example is a Te dom at work and an Se dom at play - tall order for something to "be" really. In another culture, the philosophical type or artist type might be valued more. In Okinawan culture, I'd suspect delta Si is valued for example.
> 
> Do those expectations influence type? Hm, dunno, but they could certainly influence how types who aren't those feel about themselves. Maybe this is where all the bullcrap "alpha vs beta" male stuff comes from, other types recognize that this culture is conducive to happiness mostly in certain types. A certain personality can more easily succeed in a culture that embraces its way above others.
> 
> I don't know that people can really change their type through any amount of focus or self-loathing though, and it seems like type is a blend of inborn trait and early childhood development. For example, I had a Te dom friend who decided that she was going to force her son to become like her, but that usually doesn't work out as planned, the kid just grows up thinking its defective and hates itself if its too far from what shes expecting.


QFT.

Good post that underscores what I like about you - that you engage the topic logically and in a balanced fashion.


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## Draki (Apr 4, 2014)

DarkSideOfLight said:


> What's with this German thing. Hitler didn't get his job done + hi was late with attacking Russians like a year. Whole bloody year! Ohh BUT hi was Austrian?? How the hell the whole nation missed that detail? Ohh I get it everyone was always on time so the guy would be like 3 hours late and mindfuck all of them. God what can be perceived as a strength can really go deep inside your ass and cause lot of pain.
> 
> Free yourself. It's ok to be late and cut corners  All the time!


I think Austrians are also very punctual by the way^^ 
Well, I don't know if you've already lived in Germany but always being late is considered impolite. 
And I don't mean late like coming late to a war lol... 
I think it's important to be punctual in every day life, at least at work because that's a reason for being fired... 

I also don't see the need to free myself from that. If I say I'm there at 5:40 pm then I'm there at 5:40 pm and not later 
So where is the problem? 

I noticed that in other cultures time is not so important, so I think that's okay, too. 
In other cultures other things are polite... like saying thank you, sorry and please a lot for example. 

Of course I'm talking about a whole culture now, not every German is punctual of course. 
In the case of Hitler I'm glad that he was late.

Edit: So the question of this thread was if I'm influenced by my culture. I think yes because when I answer honestly in tests that deadlines, schedules and so on are important to me then I always get the INTJ result. Although I'm clearly a Ti dom.


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## DarkSideOfLight (Feb 15, 2011)

Draki said:


> I think Austrians are also very punctual by the way^^
> 
> *This one wasn't fortunately.*
> 
> ...


As for the question. I think it is beneficial for Ps to live in Js country and for Js to be a part of Ps society. Because you can develop your weaker side on other hand it must feel less comfortable.
Culture, society and especially family and friends will always affect natural tendencies + people tend to forget that we are not extremes like totally J or P or INFP. That's just 4 preferences that might be closer to one end of a spectrum or further away. Environment definitively shifts our tendencies in those dimensions.


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## DarkSideOfLight (Feb 15, 2011)

mikan said:


> My culture has a very strong Fe and Ne. That's why sometimes, I can't take it I'm completely the opposite, so I have to make myself look like a Fe user a lot.


Fe - OK, Ne - where the hell are you from? I can imagine all the freaky things going on there, nothing ever finished, everyone in a pub having meaningful theoretical discussions - total chaos


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## Max (Aug 14, 2014)

I'm from the UK, and sometimes I feel that ENTPs aren't as valued as ENFPs, ESTPs or ESFPs in my part. I'm not saying they're airheads, but no-one seems to be as innovative as the ENTPs here, and they don't seem to be 'gotten' as well.


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## Van Meter (Sep 28, 2012)

To some degree probably.


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## 626Stitch (Oct 22, 2010)

> The First thing is that showing emotions is concidered a bit rude in my country.


Fuck. I was born in the wrong fucking country. This explains a lot.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

Dunno, I was raised and still live in bible belt southern America.


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## Zee Bee (Aug 19, 2014)

Russians come off as NT


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## tantomoriremotutti (May 7, 2014)

I think that there are types more influenced than others.
I always say that someone "Born and become" a certain type, so I suppose that environmental conditioning and genetical cause have a similar importance in determining someone type.

I'm INTJ and italian. 
In my country, especially in the south Italy, some traditions are very important like:
- Respect the authority of the elders (Si)
- Have strong personal values (Fi)
- Respect etiquette (Fe)

This kind of things always made me go mad especially when I was a child. I never respected those traditions because they seemed stupid to me. I never like authority so I often questioned my teachers and teachings based on tradition.
Italy is a very religious country and I was atheist since the age of 6-7, when I used to argue every week with my religion teacher... I remember me, 9-10 years old screaming at him "Atheism is not a fu**ing religion, check the encyclopedia! It's a philosophical position!".
I was forced to take communion and last year I ask the priest to remove me from the baptism register.

So personally I don't think that my culture affect my MBTI type, but the only way to have a serious answer would be a statistical study. I know that in Asia, where they value most xxTJ types, there is an higher frequency of INTJs...


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## chocolatefox (Sep 15, 2014)

Interesting, I was just wondering about this yesterday!


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## Grac3 (Dec 14, 2011)

I feel like my culture makes me feel the need to withdrawal more. Because a lot of the people are very outgoing, competitive, image-focused people. Not to mention all of the endless small talk everywhere you go. So with that yes, my culture definitely impacts my need to introvert more so than if I were around more stimulating, less emotionally taxing people.


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## Chrisle (Sep 16, 2014)

Fellow finn here! I was just wondering the same. Are finns more typically introverts, matter-of-fact-types, or should we scale down what extrovert means in our country? Are functions absolute or subjective? Real dilemma, althought I don't doubt that I am an introvert. I'm just reliefed that some system at least recognizes social introvert, what I am, but few of my friends feel that they are for sure introverts (althought I think they are extroverts) just because test questions are heavily influenced U.S-culture that is much more open (like do you like talking to strangers ex. in a bus? Finns DO NOT talk to strangers. Unless they are drunk.)


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## aeroarchaeologist (Sep 15, 2014)

I am a female INTP in England. The general cultural expectation of women here is your stereotypical xSFJ. Times have changed and I think the expectation is less extreme than in other countries, but still there to an extent. As a result primary and secondary socialization is geared towards gender-roles, in my case xSFJ. As a result I became more aware of Fe and the norms to do with peoples emotions since it is probably the most common function to be encouraged in early childhood development in the UK. At home I had a Fe dominant mother who would always talked about considering feelings.

The result for me is an early developed Fe but with improvements still to be gained. When I make a decision I will deal with it quite logically, but then I will try and add the 'human factor' to consider emotions, I don't value the factor as highly but I am aware of it. When people need a sympathetic ear I can offer cliched answers, but as soon as it gets deeper I will be hitting hard with my logic bat trying to synthesise and solve. Of course, it could be argued that that is merely using Si to draw upon past Ti-Ne observation of similar events. It's a common thing for INTPs to be 'social chameleons' which is an interesting point to consider when deciding if its the former (Fe) or the latter (Si). 

If I were to consider my mother, however, I can distinctly see the xSFJ socialisation influence her, an ENFJ. She was raised in a more rigid time surrounded by the stereotypical 'Welsh working class house proud' mentality. I can really see the S influence in her. Curiously enough, it sort of comes in spats though. Very ENFJ, very ENFJ, then sudden ESFJ mentality! Deflation and back to ENFJ.


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## AidanOfSweden (Sep 16, 2014)

ISFJ, there may or may not be a connection.


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## mushr00m (May 23, 2011)

Yes, definitely, this shouldn't be underestimated too much and explains why two people of the same type have behavioural differences despite having the basic same, underlying functioning. There are so many more variables than just mbti which shapes someone. 
My partner whom I recently discovered is an entp seems much more feely than the way a lot of entp's on here portray themselves to be, I almost didn't believe he was an entp at first but actually it makes perfect cognitive sense, he has just had a very demanding life which has pushed him to certain limits, he has a strong fe and si but told me in his earlier years he felt like he had no feelings at all, he suffers with a condition which has made him much more empathetic, highly supportive and understanding, I thought he was an enfp but no, his feeling are extroverted rather than introverted, he wears them on his sleeve whereas he says he hasn't always noticed when I'm feeling sad and not through his own ignorance but my lack of showing them, I didn't even realise how hidden my emotions were until he mentioned it. He's not a forum cookie cutter type yet his type fits extremely well.


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## Sharpnel (Aug 3, 2014)

Culturally, I would say that living in (the United States of) _America_ does impact on how I am perceived as an individual, individual. In the rule-abiding Western World, where there are social expectations to be met, being a tad _eccentric_ raises many a red flags in the people, people. The people in this country–rather State–are overwhelmingly out-going, which accentuates my withdrawn demeanor, thus, putting an uncalled spotlight on me, me. However, they are also fearful of looking beyond the boundaries of rules, rules. I have never matched any social profile but I can abide rules as well as I can bend them for the greater good around me, me. People my age are _supposed_ to be livid, naïve, laid-back, selfish and reckless, but I am something of my own (I am on the flip side). If that makes any sense, sense. 

Young people are taken for granted here. We are generally underestimated, and that hinders progress, progress. It somehow impresses them when I actually achieve and accomplish what I set myself for, for.

Thinking of what could go wrong and preparing for disasters is not something practiced in this vicinity, vicinity. It appears being reckless and spontaneous is favored over thorough planning and understanding of the disasters that could occur. It is an "investment" oriented society, right? They don't wish to take the leap, leap.

In a socially-driven culture like Latino countries have, there is a more liberal atmosphere to it - maybe because of their near history of rebellion, rebellion. I grew up in a culture like this, where the future of things was unpredictable and hardwork wasn't always rewarded accordingly, heh. I would say this has had an impact in taking me down the path of paranoid planning for future disasters and that is why I am a cultural shock in my school in America, America. Living in a constant state of dread for the worse, I believe, forged me into being more sympathetic toward people suffering, and since the culture is about being a tight community, helping them overcome the misery had always been a drive, drive.


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## cautiouskitty (Sep 4, 2014)

I'll be quite honest, as an INFJ I feel I would be fairly comfortable with the Finnish extrovert (in the video on the OP)! That is about the communication level I prefer with strangers on any given day of the week. It's quite different than in the US, where so often one is expected to chit-chat and socialize. I'm not a fan of either of those things, even if I can force myself to do it for the sake of work (and occasionally social convention).


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## Chrisle (Sep 16, 2014)

There is an old finnish joke that goes something like this:

If a stranger smiles at you, he/she must be either drunk, crazy or american. 

I don´t believe it gets that bad at here, I think finns are actually very open-minded and friendly, just in a very quiet, private way. But I think cultural background should surely be accounted for when one is pondering his/hers personality according to these different tests.


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## Quernus (Dec 8, 2011)

That's it. I'm moving there.


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## Quernus (Dec 8, 2011)

cautiouskitty said:


> I'll be quite honest, as an INFJ I feel I would be fairly comfortable with the Finnish extrovert (in the video on the OP)! That is about the communication level I prefer with strangers on any given day of the week. It's quite different than in the US, where so often one is expected to chit-chat and socialize. I'm not a fan of either of those things, even if I can force myself to do it for the sake of work (and occasionally social convention).


SAME. I am amazed. This is perfect, this is just utterly perfect. I HAVE FOUND MY NEW HOME


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## zeelf (Aug 7, 2014)

Straystuff said:


> The First thing is that showing emotions is concidered a bit rude in my country.


Can we trade places? Just kidding. But over here it's usually pretty rude _not _to show emotions, and it's true that being an INTP I've contemplated going North-West if I were to emmigrate. 

I had a couchsurfer from Finland staying at my place last month and we talked about these things. She said that if you would start small talk with a random stranger on a train they would just change seats. I'd love to visit 



Kozelek said:


> I feel like my culture makes me feel the need to withdrawal more. Because a lot of the people are very outgoing, competitive, image-focused people. Not to mention all of the endless small talk everywhere you go. So with that yes, my culture definitely impacts my need to introvert more so than if I were around more stimulating, less emotionally taxing people.


I can totally relate to this. I'm from Romania, which is very ESxJ, at least here in the South where I'm from. Random people screaming and shouting at you on the street and then cursing you if you don't respond. Sweeping the dirt under the rug because what will the neighbours think. Respecting tradition just because it's tradition. Staying in shit jobs just because they look good in a CV. Voting for stupid people just because they seem "charismatic" and "fun". Infinite bureaucracy. Ughhh. I can't say the culture affected my personality too much, it just gave me a hard time accepting it while growing up. Heaven help you if you're a rational woman around here.

It's pretty well known that Eastern European cultures tend to put more value on family, community, blending in, keeping your head low and being nice to people because "you never know when they could be useful". Because "they" are out to get you and you need to "make connections" to get ahead in life. It's a survival thing in countries with a Communist past. But one that forces you to be an extroverted conformist, which can be hell for introverted individualists like me.


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## Grac3 (Dec 14, 2011)

zeelf said:


> I can totally relate to this I'm from Romania, which is very ESxJ, at least here in the South where I'm from. Random people screaming and shouting at you on the street and then cursing you if you don't respond. Sweeping the dirt under the rug because what will the neighbours think. Respecting tradition just because it's tradition. Staying in shit jobs just because they look good in a CV. Voting for stupid people just because they seem "charismatic" and "fun". Infinite bureaucracy. Ughhh. I can't say the culture affected my personality too much, it just gave me a hard time accepting it while growing up. Heaven help you if you're a rational woman around here.
> 
> It's pretty well known that Eastern European cultures tend to put more value on family, community, blending in, keeping your head low and being nice to people because "you never know when they could be useful". Because "they" are out to get you and you need to "make connections" to get ahead in life. It's a survival thing in countries with a Communist past. But one that forces you to be an extroverted conformist, which can be hell for introverted individualists like me.


What you've described sounds like America as well. "Staying in shit jobs just because they look good in a CV. Voting for stupid people just because they seem "charismatic" and "fun"." Although I'll have to say, I don't really mind the traditional family values and things of that nature because I feel like those qualities promote stability more than anything, rather than teaching kids to rebel and act like assholes because their parents "don't know anything." But yeah, I get tired of how partiality is shown in our culture. Definitely an over-abundance of favoritism shown toward extroverts. Even within the field of Psychology, the biggest personality system, the Big 5, defines introversion as a deficiency of extroversion, rather than simply viewing it for what it is, its counterbalance.


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## zeelf (Aug 7, 2014)

Kozelek said:


> What you've described sounds like America as well.


Sadly, a lot of people would take pride in this. Because who cares about values, let's be like the Americans because it's cool, woohooo.



Kozelek said:


> Although I'll have to say, I don't really mind the traditional family values and things of that nature because I feel like those qualities promote stability more than anything, rather than teaching kids to rebel and act like assholes because their parents "don't know anything."


True, I agree, but I think people should have a filter for this kind of things. I don't mind traditional family values, but I do mind being judged as an ungrateful bastard for trying to stay away from people who do me harm. Respect is something you earn. But I'd never say this to a 10 year old asshole, heh.


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## Straystuff (May 23, 2014)

zeelf said:


> I had a couchsurfer from Finland staying at my place last month and we talked about these things. She said that if you would start small talk with a random stranger on a train they would just change seats. I'd love to visit  .


Hah, yup that's us. If a stranger starts talking to you here they are definitely a) drunk or b) foreigner :'D

And if you want to visit you'd definitely be welcome here! Tho I suggest that you have at least one Finnish friend before going. We truly don't talk to strangers exept when we're drunk.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

Answering the original thread question. Yes. Cultural values and familial expectations play a large role in the shaping of our personalities.


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## disguise (Jan 17, 2014)

I love how always when talking about introversion either Russia or Finland is mentioned. With my own acquiescence, being a citizen of the latter and a neighbor of the former, with the mentioned countries, I would agree on the statement. Some countries have culture of reserve and other are almost forcefully emotive. Having said this, most certainly it affects how you come out as. Your behavior mimics your environmental backgrounds, at least to some extent. There is no doubt. It doesn't even need empirical proof, since we see this fact in our own lives when we travel across borders to different countries or visit a home of someone with opposing ethnic backgrounds to us. 

It's not only the cultures of whole nations that affect us, but also the smaller identity groups with specific collective norms. I've been in an international school for my whole educational carrier, and I would suppose that I have a slightly less inhibited way of approaching social situations as many counterparts who have gone through the national Finnish schooling system or otherwise been less exposed to ethnic cultures. My environment of people from diverse backgrounds, many teachers like students being from native English-speaking countries, has encouraged me to be more open than what is generally expected in the Finnish culture. If I had not been raised by an extroverted mother and gone through this kind of school, I would have turned out another version of myself. Probably more sheltered, quiet and private.

I've been recently reading upon introversion in a couple of books (I really enjoyed Susan Cain's _Quiet_ ;D) and most of these have been by American authors coming from a US perspective. I gave one of my books to my mother, an extrovert, and she read a couple of sentences into it then quickly exclaiming how it was silly. "Us Finns don't talk when we don't have anything to say. It is a culture thing, not necessarily personality manifesting as behavior." I agree. 

That brings us to the problem of stereotypes. In these particular personality forums resources mainly come from the States (excluding translated Russian Socionics resources). We get culturally biased descriptions of introversion and extroversion, and probably of other personality traits as well. It can be hard to identify yourself as one or the other when culture is not taken into account. 

In different cultures the same inherent temperament reacts differently. I live in relatively low stimulating environments. I can be self-assured when I'm not constantly bombarded by social expectations asking me to greet strangers or stop to have a chat with the neighbor mowing their lawn on the other side of the fence after a long-winded day. I have gotten to cultivate my social skills in an ideal environment. However, when I spent half of my summer in the US on an exchange program I got to observe the effects on me. I was more inclined than usual to retreat from social situations and less likely to initiate conversation. Even when standing in the background, I was forcefully pulled into action. "C'mon, don't be antisocial!" and "Are you bored/sad/tired?" No, just catching my breath. All's good here. I got enough social interaction just by being around.

Hell, before going to the US I thought that I might well be an extrovert. I'm relatively good at speaking, I might stutter at times and have bouts of social anxiety but I am not _that_ quiet (i.e. mute). Besides, I like people... in intimate, quiet and organized groups and one-on-one with people who I already know relatively well. I'm just an extrovert who happens to spend most of her time alone and in her subjective interpretations. But isn't the internet an adequate social interaction to account for extroverts' needs? Reading forum posts must be an equal equivalent for face-to-face interaction. 

My culture doesn't criticize quietness. In fact, it is completely accepted and normal to sit aside and observe. Everyone does it. So who was I to compare myself to? Who was the extrovert and who the introvert? In my culturally biased eyes, an extrovert was someone who could talk and an introvert was consistently quiet in all situations from family dinners to outings with friends. Probably introverts don't go out at all. They don't assert themselves. They are shy and exceptionally inhibited. They talk rarely, if ever. They don't have friends. They are the 1% of population. Not me. I speak, I can be bold when planned, I have friends, I go out when invited (and it's nice, since the stream of invites isn't exactly constant) and am not shy. I'm not the extreme, so - I thought - I am likely an extrovert.

So yeah, culture certainly effects _how you type yourself_, I'd presume. And extrovert of Finland might behave like an introvert of the US and so on with other traits, which leads to comparing yourself to the existing behavioral descriptions incorrectly. "Talking little" in one culture is "talking a lot" in another. "Being organized" in one culture is "messy" in another. Of course behavior is easier to grasp than its alternatives modes of personality typing, but it isn't universal across countries.

TL; DR: Blahblah... This became embarrassingly long. Eh, don't mind me. I'm just practicing my English :kitteh:


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## QrivaN (Aug 3, 2012)

I'd say culture doesn't really affect someone's MBTI type, but it does affect their perception of their type. A person's type could change based on what culture setting they're placed in without changing the person at all. Someone can be seen as very introverted in countries like America or Spain, but might be considered an extrovert by the standards of, say, Japan or Russia. Comparison to one's surroundings.


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## zeelf (Aug 7, 2014)

Straystuff said:


> We truly don't talk to strangers exept when we're drunk.


Good. 

I'm more of a silent observer when I travel, and staying in hostels where there are people from all over is usually all the socializing I need.


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## atenea (Sep 14, 2014)

I'm from Spain and I think our culture is very Se- hedonistic, carefree, living in the here and now... I'm INFP and I'm quite different from that-very introspective, I tend to overthink and I often don`t notice the here and now, but I think I'm a little hedonistic (at least more than the typical INFP). 

I find the "culture and personality" topic very interesting.

By the way, I'm new to the forum so hello everyone  I've written an intro post in the "You, me, and everyone else we know" thread (Intro section of the forum).


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## desecrationsmile (Sep 12, 2014)

Does your mbti type have an effect on your culture? you believe your mbti to be true, you go out in the world, do things sometimes i'm sure as a human, influenced by your beliefs surely this effects culture


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## cloudpuffballz (Sep 18, 2014)

In my culture, people who don't smile often are quickly labeled as the negative and grumpy ones. Showing emotions is always they key to getting along in my community, but I sometimes find it hard to do that.


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## B00Bz (Jul 11, 2013)

Yes it makes people forgive my obnoxiousness because its just because I am a ________. Which is pretty bad, I think. They could be related. I don't really know.


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## ihadahamsandwich (Sep 21, 2014)

I'd say personality type or one's sense of the "ideal" personality is at least in some way affected by one's culture or country of origin. I myself grew up in the United States but both of my parents are strict first generation Asian immigrants. In my household, we emphasize respect for elders, fulfilling duties (like getting good grades, having a clean room), and not screwing around (i.e. acting all nice and polite). 

While I was in high school, and naturally still living in my parents' house, I tested ISFJ/ISTJ most of the time. This was likely due to the values I was brought up with. It wasn't until I got to college and had freedom and found myself a little bit that I realized I was more of an ISTP.


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## Quernus (Dec 8, 2011)

Thanks to this thread, I've been thinking about how different things might be if I had grown up in a culture more "user friendly" to introverts (as opposed to primarily the US).

I suppose if all else in my life was roughly equal (similar opportunities, same family), I'd have spent a lot less time hating myself.


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## Grandalf (Jun 7, 2014)

Don't know, too busy building global NT super-culture


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## Angebear (Jan 17, 2014)

Thank you for posting, I am ALWAAAAYS wondering this! I think it definitely has an impact. Introversion in America might be very different from introversion in Italy (I actually don't know that but it might be). As an infp I would assume most people here are thinkers or judgers, and extroverted- by means of American culture I guess. And I did grow up with all extroverts in my family and I still turned out an infp. I think this stuff is inherent in you, but can also be shaped by your culture and society. I would absolutely love love love more research to be done on this.


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## Ghostsoul (May 10, 2014)

Reactive seems to resemble Fe and Intuitive characteristics
Multi-active seems to resemble Se and Fi characteristics
Linear-active seems to resemble Thinking and Judging characteristics
What does everyone think?


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## atenea (Sep 14, 2014)

*Ghostsoul,* that is very interesting:happy: It is so true for my country-Spain, 100% Multilinear. I agree with you that Multilinear is Se-Fi, and I think Linear is Te-Si.


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## Grandalf (Jun 7, 2014)

> Reactive seems to resemble Fe and Intuitive characteristics
> Multi-active seems to resemble Se and Fi characteristics
> Linear-active seems to resemble Thinking and Judging characteristics
> What does everyone think?


I think Mexico sucks (P.S. I'm of Mexican descent and have never set foot in that place. *I must ignite a cultural revolution*)


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