# Fe - Se Loop, a crave for attention?



## Rydori (Aug 7, 2017)

How would an Fe - Se loop (or vice versa) operate?

Is Fe - Se loops suppose to crave for attention from others and be over dramatic when not given the love?


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

We get plenty of attention as is so why would we have a special craving for it in a "loop"?


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## Rydori (Aug 7, 2017)

DOGSOUP said:


> We get plenty of attention as is so why would we have a special craving for it in a "loop"?


An unhealthy variant of feeling to want more attention despite getting a lot? I mean loops can be quite unhealthy. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Eset (Jun 7, 2016)

From MBTI-Notes it is defined as:



> *Tertiary Se (ENxJ):* As these two types overindulge Ni, they become increasingly inflexible, extreme, and out of touch with reality. Therefore, the tertiary Se function should be used to bring them back to what really matters in life. When a person listens to the need for tertiary Se development, they will suddenly start to value being more: amenable, adaptable, grounded, present, adventurous, fun (in enjoying simple pleasures), honest and accepting (about human weaknesses and limitations), attuned to beauty. If one resists Se development, overindulgence of Ni is likely to lead to increasingly negative consequences, perhaps repeatedly shooting oneself in the foot by indulging unreasonable ideals/demands that create the perfect conditions for eventual defeat/disappointment. However, if Ni has remained chronically underdeveloped for whatever reason, a person is likely to develop serious Se looping tendencies in adulthood as a lame attempt to cope with development failure. With Se looping, they can continually excuse the lack of Ni development and justify never slowing down to properly introspect. Unfortunately, over time, this produces a creeping sense of losing control that can lead to inferior Ti/Fi grip.
> 
> *Defensive loop tendencies:* selectively gathers superficial details as evidence to justify problematic beliefs or hasty action; believes oneself “deep” or “special” but actually cannot see past appearances; impulsive and error-prone because of overlooking/ignoring important facts and details; rationalizes taking the path of least resistance instead of the morally correct path as long as desirable result is obtained (end justifies the means); does whatever feels good in the moment when feeling aimless; indulges in sensory pleasures to escape from (self-imposed) stress or negative emotions; emotionally volatile, highly reactive to setbacks, problems, challenges, negative feedback; covers up flaws or mistakes instead of addressing them transparently, unable to admit to wrongdoing, unable to apologize for mistakes; prone to being over-competitive, incorrectly uses social comparison to define personal success/worth, tends to be jealous/envious of material gains or possessions that signal high/respected social standing; prone to adopting extreme and superficial societal standards to define “intelligence” or “achievement”; externalizes personal issues/insecurities by controlling the environment; compartmentalizes private life from public persona, able to rationalize doing bad/questionable things as long as public appearances/reputation remain intact; stubborn or combative mindset, defends beliefs and values with the unconscious intent to repress feelings of uncertainty or ambiguity.
> 
> *Fe-Se loop dynamics:* selectively seeks out evidence in support of one’s judgments (about people/relationships) or to justify one’s ideas and methods as being (morally) superior -> but cannot understand the deeper meaning and implications of one’s actions, resulting in (recurring) life/relationship problems that stoke underlying inferior Ti anxieties about being intellectually unworthy or socially inferior ->


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## Crowbo (Jul 9, 2017)

It's a good possibility

Attention is part of the reason I made the mention anyone thread and it's pulled people in like a magnet.
@Snowdori see you there, or in another dimension!


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## Rydori (Aug 7, 2017)

Crowbo said:


> It's a good possibility
> 
> Attention is part of the reason I made the mention anyone thread and it's pulled people in like a magnet.
> @Snowdori see you there, or in another dimension!


 @Crowbo yes I shall be there through a different dimension
@narcissistic makes sense I guess with the defensive, an Fe-Se loops involves in extreme impulsive behaviour in where a ENFJ (and ESTP) are unable to make proper decisions or thought themselves and depend too much on outer stimuli.


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## Turi (May 9, 2017)

Is this really a thing, though?

To buy into loop theory, you have to buy into the tertiary function being in the same direction as the dominant which isn't the stance the official MBTI folks take.

What is the difference, between this "loop" and an ExFJ type who has not properly developed their S/N?

What would mean the above person, shifts from Ni to Se?
Why would it be Se, anyway? 
As in what specifically is the difference between Fe-Se and Fe-(undeveloped)Ni.

Doesn't shifting from Fe-Ni to Fe-Si make more sense when you apply yourself to times you've been in a rut?

Just some thoughts I had.


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## Rydori (Aug 7, 2017)

Turi said:


> Is this really a thing, though?
> 
> To buy into loop theory, you have to buy into the tertiary function being in the same direction as the dominant which isn't the stance the official MBTI folks take.
> 
> ...


I'm not too sure about the difference, but undeveloped Ni seems more rather of a long term rather than a loop which rather last quite quick (if theory says it) I mean isn't a loop essentially someone repressing their aux function? In this case underdeveloped Ni would be the same kind of repressed Ni rather. I HIGHLY doubt though an ENFJ would switch to Fe-Si rather than looping Fe-Se.


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## Angelica Emerson (Jan 8, 2018)

Rydori
online
BAKA
Dec 29, 2017 · #1
Fe - Se Loop, a crave for attention?
How would an Fe - Se loop (or vice versa) operate?

Is Fe - Se loops suppose to crave for attention from others and be over dramatic when not given the love?

DOGSOUP
Dec 29, 2017 · #2
We get plenty of attention as is so why would we have a special craving for it in a "loop"?
Rydori
online
BAKA
Dec 29, 2017 · #3
DOGSOUP said:
Original Post
We get plenty of attention as is so why would we have a special craving for it in a "loop"?


An unhealthy variant of feeling to want more attention despite getting a lot? I mean loops can be quite unhealthy. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
narcissistic
Dec 29, 2017 · #4
From MBTI-Notes it is defined as:

Quote:
Tertiary Se (ENxJ): As these two types overindulge Ni, they become increasingly inflexible, extreme, and out of touch with reality. Therefore, the tertiary Se function should be used to bring them back to what really matters in life. When a person listens to the need for tertiary Se development, they will suddenly start to value being more: amenable, adaptable, grounded, present, adventurous, fun (in enjoying simple pleasures), honest and accepting (about human weaknesses and limitations), attuned to beauty. If one resists Se development, overindulgence of Ni is likely to lead to increasingly negative consequences, perhaps repeatedly shooting oneself in the foot by indulging unreasonable ideals/demands that create the perfect conditions for eventual defeat/disappointment. However, if Ni has remained chronically underdeveloped for whatever reason, a person is likely to develop serious Se looping tendencies in adulthood as a lame attempt to cope with development failure. With Se looping, they can continually excuse the lack of Ni development and justify never slowing down to properly introspect. Unfortunately, over time, this produces a creeping sense of losing control that can lead to inferior Ti/Fi grip.

Defensive loop tendencies: selectively gathers superficial details as evidence to justify problematic beliefs or hasty action; believes oneself “deep” or “special” but actually cannot see past appearances; impulsive and error-prone because of overlooking/ignoring important facts and details; rationalizes taking the path of least resistance instead of the morally correct path as long as desirable result is obtained (end justifies the means); does whatever feels good in the moment when feeling aimless; indulges in sensory pleasures to escape from (self-imposed) stress or negative emotions; emotionally volatile, highly reactive to setbacks, problems, challenges, negative feedback; covers up flaws or mistakes instead of addressing them transparently, unable to admit to wrongdoing, unable to apologize for mistakes; prone to being over-competitive, incorrectly uses social comparison to define personal success/worth, tends to be jealous/envious of material gains or possessions that signal high/respected social standing; prone to adopting extreme and superficial societal standards to define “intelligence” or “achievement”; externalizes personal issues/insecurities by controlling the environment; compartmentalizes private life from public persona, able to rationalize doing bad/questionable things as long as public appearances/reputation remain intact; stubborn or combative mindset, defends beliefs and values with the unconscious intent to repress feelings of uncertainty or ambiguity.

Fe-Se loop dynamics: selectively seeks out evidence in support of one’s judgments (about people/relationships) or to justify one’s ideas and methods as being (morally) superior -> but cannot understand the deeper meaning and implications of one’s actions, resulting in (recurring) life/relationship problems that stoke underlying inferior Ti anxieties about being intellectually unworthy or socially inferior ->

This is very interesting, sounds like something that could easily happen to an INFJ.


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