# Figure Me Out Mk.II: The refiguring



## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

alright, I'm going to make this as comprehensive, and hopefully as brief as possible.

my results to date have been varied, and all around confusing.



First off, my results from the last two mbti function tests I took

the PerC test

*Your Cognitive Functions:
Introverted Intuition (Ni) |||||||||||||||||||||||| 11.255
Introverted Thinking (Ti) |||||||||||||||||||||||| 11.15
Extroverted Intuition (Ne) |||||||||||||||||||||||| 11.11
Extroverted Thinking (Te) ||||||||||||||||| 7.93
Introverted Feeling (Fi) ||||||| 2.71
Extroverted Sensation (Se) ||||| 1.57
Extroverted Feeling (Fe) ||| 0.98
Introverted Sensation (Si) || -1.46
*
Based on your cognitive functions, your type is most likely:
Most Likely: INTJ
or Second Possibility: INTP
or Third Possibility: ENTP




Your cognitive functions are, in order of development:
Ni - Ti - Ne - Te - Fi - Se - Fe - Si


and the KEYS II

extraverted Sensing (Se) ************************** (26)
average use
introverted Sensing (Si) *************** (15.5)
unused
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************************ (36.1)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ****************************** (30.7)
good use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ****************************** (30.6)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ************************************* (37.1)
excellent use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ************************** (26.6)
average use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************************* (37)
excellent use





Trying a different questionnaire this time

*0. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.*

I'm a 22 year old male, current state of mind? erm... lightly caffeinated... pretty neutral at the moment

*1. Click on this link: Flickr: Explore! Look at the random photo for about 30 seconds. Copy and paste it here, and write about your impression of it.
*









Autumn, everything is ever so slightly out of focus, or it's a filter, I can't tell, like it's a daydream or a good memory almost, lacking in detail but pleasant nevertheless, but I find the lack of clarity almost annoying, I'm curious as to where the road leads, I'm reminded of the smell of rotting leaves

*2. You are with a group of people in a car, heading to a different town to see your favourite band/artist/musician. Suddenly, the car breaks down for an unknown reason in the middle of nowhere. What are your initial thoughts? What are your outward reactions?*

am I driving in this scenario?, who am I kidding?, I'm always driving.

initial thought: fuck.

I don't want to be blamed for people missing this show

initial outward reaction: fuck.

check the car, see if I can figure it out
check for cell service if it's not fixable
if there is no service, hitch hike?
*
3. You somehow make it to the concert. The driver wants to go to the afterparty that was announced (and assure you they won't drink so they can drive back later). How do you feel about this party? What do you do?*

I probably want to be going home then, or maybe a quiet drink, but I doubt if after 2 hours of being jammed up against people in a noisy environment I'm going to be keen on putting myself back in that same situation.

I will likely sip a highball in the corner and fiddle with my phone unless someone talks to me

*4. On the drive back, your friends are talking. A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward reaction? What do you outwardly say?*

inward reaction: moron

outward reaction: I'd likely ask why they think what they do, after their explanation I'd likely just play with their answer in my head to try and understand it. If they insist on debating things I will be merciless, if they make good points I'll likely stew on them for some time, try and understand it from a few perspective. 

*5. What would you do if you actually saw/experienced something that clashes with your previous beliefs, experiences, and habits?
*
like, going to a young earth creationist museum?

a mixture of anger for blatantly misrepresenting science, and laughing my ass off. I'd likely try to go to every exhibit and pinpoint all of the ways it is patently wrong. And get a picture with plastic Jesus of course.

*6. What are some of your most important values? How did you come about determining them? How can they change?*

Empiricism is the thing I value more than all others.

as a kid, I'd just absorb information like a sponge. As time went on, I learned the value of being able to assess the worth or validity of information, because of a lot of science advocates on PBS. 

I would need to hear a very solidly reasonable argument against empiricism for me to reject it

of course, by virtue of doing so I would be acting in an empirical manner. lol


I generally don't have a lot of very strongly held beliefs, I'm receptive to change if a good enough argument can be made

*7. a) What about your personality most distinguishes you from everyone else? b) If you could change one thing about you personality, what would it be? Why?*

a) I don't think I'm special, as much as I'd like to be, I don't really know what does distinguish me

b) More assertive and driven, because while I have aspirations I'm not very disciplined at trying to attain them

*8. How do you treat hunches or gut feelings? In what situations are they most often triggered?*

I trust them most of the time, because generally when I second guess myself it means taking a right answer and making it a wrong one. Tests.

I also notice it while playing music, I don't have a comprehensive understanding of theory but I can still somehow manage to zero in on things correctly. I can figure out songs very quickly, an intuitive understanding of how music works I suppose.

*9. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?*

a) getting really caught up in a brainstorming session or joking with one or two really smart people. Playing guitars or listening to music, starting something. I enjoy the concept of "possibility"

b) Large scale social interaction/public speaking/trying to make small talk, I find it very, very difficult

*10. What do you repress about your outward behavior or internal thought process when around others? Why?*

I tend to mostly keep opinions on the inside, I try to dial down my desire to make ridiculously bad jokes about everything.










right, I'm giving this one last go, if it goes poorly, I'm sticking with "unknown personality" and washing my hands of the JCF



EDIT

I'll add my enneagram: 5w6, 1w2, 4w5


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Those 2 don't actually really do JCF, but rather just MBTI cognitive functions.

You're name says NTP and your reaction to question 5 supports you being an NP type, lol.
You also seem more INTP :tongue:


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

Acerbusvenator said:


> Those 2 don't actually really do JCF, but rather just MBTI cognitive functions.
> 
> You're name says NTP and your reaction to question 5 supports you being an NP type, lol.
> You also seem more INTP :tongue:


>_>

edited.

aaaand noted.


thanks.



I'd like to get as many different opinions as I can on this one.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

DarwinsBastard said:


> I'd like to get as many different opinions as I can on this one.


Yep, I know what you mean. :happy:
That actually has to do with Ne :crazy:


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

Acerbusvenator said:


> Yep, I know what you mean. :happy:
> That actually has to do with Ne :crazy:


all falls down if I don't get them though, haha


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## Ember (Feb 11, 2012)

I see more Ni than Ne and more Se than Si.

What do _you _like more? INTJ or INTP? What's more appealing and why?


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

Immerse said:


> I see more Ni than Ne and more Se than Si.
> 
> What do _you _like more? INTJ or INTP? What's more appealing and why?


mm, I don't really fit a lot of the INTJ attributes, I'm not organized, I'm not driven, and I only like leading people when I feel there is nobody more competent around for the job. Then again, if I'm any type I'm not going to fit the description perfectly as I've had a lot of issue thus far.

I can definitely relate to the idea of INTPs liking to learn for its own sake, as opposed to having practical applications, but this is a trait common to all of the XNXP types.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

I see the distinct possibility of Ti dominance, and I would consider you an INTP based on that (Ti with intuition).

Kind of noting this here for real analysis later.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

Okay, I'm adding some more to this, I'll try the questionnaire by @_LeaT_ 


*1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.*


okay, as above, 22 male, today is a conflicted day, dealing with relationship stuff.


*2. Study these two images here and here. Which one do you prefer and why? How would you describe it?*

The picture of the borealis, I like it because it makes me feel small, in a good way, puts things in a greater perspective.

plus I try to stay away from pastries at all costs XD


*3. Please describe yourself as a person if you were to introduce yourself to someone else like in a cover letter. What kind of person are you and why?*

I think if I had a better answer to this I wouldn't need a personality typing, lol, but I'll give it a shot. This isn't so much a cover letter, as I'll talk good and bad here.

Generally speaking, if I'm in a group of people I'm either the quietest person or the loudest. When I'm around strangers I do not like speaking, when in more familiar settings I'm very confident and outspoken, this has to do with both developing trust with someone, and unresolved anxiety problems. I'm generally if nothing else a hard worker in employment settings, I don't think I'm particularly good at hiding my disdain for some coworkers though. I don't really like small talk, I can handle it for about 30 seconds but then my store of common banalities is gone. I've never been late to a class or a job in my life, though I can be quite forgetful and do have a tendency to zone out. I think while not particularly warm or outgoing, I get along with most people providing they respect my need to have quiet. I can be very pragmatic when necessary. I'm very curious, and I learn as a hobby, so anything I do with my life will need to involve constant learning if I'm to be happy. I am a perfectionist, I do not settle for average.


I hope that works, it's not really a cover letter, but I always lie in cover letters so they wouldn't do any good here.


*4. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?*

I'd like to be assertive, and driven, and not a procrastinator, why? because I want to be better at setting goals and achieving them. I don't want to be the kind of person that works a labour job for the rest of my life, why? because I want to in some small way contribute to the sum of human knowledge with my life. I would also not want to be the kind of person who lets emotion and slavish attention to traditions get in the way of progress and greater understanding.

*5. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two that are you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?*

Some people see me as a snob, because I'm quiet and generally don't take part in stupid jokes. Some people see me as being nicer than I actually am on the inside, I think I'm good at throwing up the veneer of affable guy when I have to, if for no other reason than avoiding an ultimately pointless discussion that I want no part of.

My friends see me as being smart, lazy, witty, musical, and quite often, grumpy and not fun 

I think they give me far too much credit in the intelligence department, I wish I was smarter. 

*6. What in life do you find to be of importance? Why? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.*


*1. Intelligence*(9 votes)*2. Curiosity*(9 votes)*3. Love*(7 votes)*4. Logic*(7 votes)*5. Intuition*(6 votes)*6. Learning*(6 votes)*7. Knowledge*(4 votes)*8. Wittiness*(4 votes)*9. Contentment*(2 votes) 

*10. Sensuality*(1 votes)

*7. How do you react to new situations in your life? Can you describe an event in your life where you were in an unknown situation? How did you deal with it?*

Living in a dorm for the first time, I read, listened to music, went for solitary walks, to escape having to deal with people I didn't know nor care to know


*8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.*

I tend to procrastinate, or dissociate or generally attempt to avoid dealing with them

*9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

*when I'm enjoying myself I think I can be quite easy going and funny, whenever I'm at a small party with people I know well I'm like this. I also get a thrill when I know I am doing really well on a test, it sounds lame, but knowing I'm crushing the test gives me a rush.

*10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?*

my relationship generally isn't a good one. Group interaction would depend on the group, in familiar settings I'm fine most of the time, foreign groups bring out a desire to escape -_-' One on one interactions are only good if I like who I'm talking to, if people are interesting and witty and smart, I love talking about things with them, if I dislike the person and feel they have little to offer nothing is worse than being forced to make small talk


*11. Describe your relationship to society. What are the elements of it you hold important or unimportant (e.g. social norms, values, customs, traditions)? How do you see people as a whole?

*I don't care much for tradition, and I think in general people pay way too much attention to social customs. You could say I don't care much for people as a whole, I don't think I believe in the basic good of humanity, and most people in the world do not see the world I do, for the most part, I couldn't care less for society.

*12. Describe your relationship to authority. How do you perceive authority? What does it mean to you, and how do you deal with it?

*It really depends on whether I feel their "authority" is reasonable or not. Generally if I feel a person is well suited and competent in a position of authority I'm fairly at ease. When I think someone is ill suited to it I can very from quietly dismissive to outright rude and vocally dismissive.

*13. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?* 

I think I live on the precipice of both. I live in what is perceived as chaos, but I know where things are most of the time. I'm as ordered as I need to be to get by, but I enjoy the openness and freedom of chaos.

*14. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest to you both in how you think and how you act?
*
Failure, I'm not sure why, I have high expectations of myself, generally this will manifest itself as playing it safe, avoiding risks.

*15. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?
*
Knowledge. Understanding. I don't know why, I've just always been driven to know things.

*16. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?*



answered above in other questionnaire

*17. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know your enneagram, please post this here. If you have done any online function tests such as the 
Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here as well.
*
I want to know my type in the hope that knowing how I work will give me better insight to improve my shortcomings. 

posted keysII and enneagram above

*18. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of relevance when helping to type you?*

I doubt the MBTI's validity in general, and yet I am trying to use it to improve myself. Strange no?


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

I shoot since you mentioned me. 


DarwinsBastard said:


> alright, I'm going to make this as comprehensive, and hopefully as brief as possible.
> 
> my results to date have been varied, and all around confusing.
> 
> ...


Hokai. What I get from these two is either INTP or ENTP. ENTP according to K2C and the PersC test. Why? Si is so clearly inferior and average use of Fe implies tertiary position.


> Trying a different questionnaire this time
> 
> *0. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.*
> 
> ...


You go full force Ti but then move on with Si.


> *2. You are with a group of people in a car, heading to a different town to see your favourite band/artist/musician. Suddenly, the car breaks down for an unknown reason in the middle of nowhere. What are your initial thoughts? What are your outward reactions?*
> 
> am I driving in this scenario?, who am I kidding?, I'm always driving.
> 
> ...


I get more tertiary Fe here than inferior. Also, you actually check the car. Seems to imply Ne dom.


> *
> 
> 3. You somehow make it to the concert. The driver wants to go to the afterparty that was announced (and assure you they won't drink so they can drive back later). How do you feel about this party? What do you do?*
> 
> ...


Hard say anything here. Sounds more intro but I don't think you actually are one.


> *4. On the drive back, your friends are talking. A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward reaction? What do you outwardly say?*
> 
> inward reaction: moron
> 
> outward reaction: I'd likely ask why they think what they do, after their explanation I'd likely just play with their answer in my head to try and understand it. If they insist on debating things I will be merciless, if they make good points I'll likely stew on them for some time, try and understand it from a few perspective.


LOL. You're so NTP. I get more of an Ne dom feel here than Ti. You want to generate ideas, not analyze something into bits and pieces.


> *5. What would you do if you actually saw/experienced something that clashes with your previous beliefs, experiences, and habits?
> *
> like, going to a young earth creationist museum?
> 
> a mixture of anger for blatantly misrepresenting science, and laughing my ass off. I'd likely try to go to every exhibit and pinpoint all of the ways it is patently wrong. And get a picture with plastic Jesus of course.


LOL. You sure are so Ne dom.


> *6. What are some of your most important values? How did you come about determining them? How can they change?*
> 
> Empiricism is the thing I value more than all others.
> 
> ...


Still get Ne dom feeling here. Focus on ideas, not so much analysis.


> *7. a) What about your personality most distinguishes you from everyone else? b) If you could change one thing about you personality, what would it be? Why?*
> 
> a) I don't think I'm special, as much as I'd like to be, I don't really know what does distinguish me
> 
> b) More assertive and driven, because while I have aspirations I'm not very disciplined at trying to attain them


In a tertiary or inferior position in answer a), and we get perceiver from b).


> *8. How do you treat hunches or gut feelings? In what situations are they most often triggered?*
> 
> I trust them most of the time, because generally when I second guess myself it means taking a right answer and making it a wrong one. Tests.
> 
> I also notice it while playing music, I don't have a comprehensive understanding of theory but I can still somehow manage to zero in on things correctly. I can figure out songs very quickly, an intuitive understanding of how music works I suppose.


More focus on ideas.


> *9. a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain you most? Why?*
> 
> a) getting really caught up in a brainstorming session or joking with one or two really smart people. Playing guitars or listening to music, starting something. I enjoy the concept of "possibility"
> 
> b) Large scale social interaction/public speaking/trying to make small talk, I find it very, very difficult


Yeah, Ne dom.


> *10. What do you repress about your outward behavior or internal thought process when around others? Why?*
> 
> I tend to mostly keep opinions on the inside, I try to dial down my desire to make ridiculously bad jokes about everything.


LOL. Ne dom.


> right, I'm giving this one last go, if it goes poorly, I'm sticking with "unknown personality" and washing my hands of the JCF
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why are you even wondering that you're not an ENTP? <.< You're just very intro ENTP because of your enneagram, that's all. But Ne dom regardles. Ne is flowing out from your ears.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Because more is better, right? 


DarwinsBastard said:


> Okay, I'm adding some more to this, I'll try the questionnaire by @_LeaT_
> 
> 
> *1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.*
> ...


Blech.


> *2. Study these two images here and here. Which one do you prefer and why? How would you describe it?*
> 
> The picture of the borealis, I like it because it makes me feel small, in a good way, puts things in a greater perspective.
> 
> plus I try to stay away from pastries at all costs XD


LOL. Ok, I see a little Ni in the first, but then you move over to Ne. Pastries yeah. I fail to see the connection. Se is not your thing, isn't it? Neither is Si apparently. You're not very keen on describing anything.


> *3. Please describe yourself as a person if you were to introduce yourself to someone else like in a cover letter. What kind of person are you and why?*
> 
> I think if I had a better answer to this I wouldn't need a personality typing, lol, but I'll give it a shot. This isn't so much a cover letter, as I'll talk good and bad here.
> 
> ...


So much enneagram 5 with integration towards 8 here.


> *4. What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of person would you NOT want to be? Why?*
> 
> I'd like to be assertive, and driven, and not a procrastinator, why? because I want to be better at setting goals and achieving them. I don't want to be the kind of person that works a labour job for the rest of my life, why? because I want to in some small way contribute to the sum of human knowledge with my life. I would also not want to be the kind of person who lets emotion and slavish attention to traditions get in the way of progress and greater understanding.


So much NeFe my god, I die from Ne overload. Ti can't manage this much.


> *5. Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourself and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two that are you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?*
> 
> Some people see me as a snob, because I'm quiet and generally don't take part in stupid jokes. Some people see me as being nicer than I actually am on the inside, I think I'm good at throwing up the veneer of affable guy when I have to, if for no other reason than avoiding an ultimately pointless discussion that I want no part of.
> 
> ...


Fe is far down there. I still think tertiary over inferior. You admit that you can be warm. Witty is a keyword here also. Hahahaha, NTP intelligence complex exacerbated by e5.


> *6. What in life do you find to be of importance? Why? If you are unsure you can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do note that it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values as suggested at stage 2.*
> 
> 
> *1. Intelligence*(9 votes)*2. Curiosity*(9 votes)*3. Love*(7 votes)*4. Logic*(7 votes)*5. Intuition*(6 votes)*6. Learning*(6 votes)*7. Knowledge*(4 votes)*8. Wittiness*(4 votes)*9. Contentment*(2 votes) 
> ...


Yeah, curiosity as number 2 and wittiness. You got many N related values here with the T ones. I suppose love would be your Fe?


> *7. How do you react to new situations in your life? Can you describe an event in your life where you were in an unknown situation? How did you deal with it?*
> 
> Living in a dorm for the first time, I read, listened to music, went for solitary walks, to escape having to deal with people I didn't know nor care to know


Speaks for intro but you're Ne dom, definitely.


> *8. Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.*
> 
> I tend to procrastinate, or dissociate or generally attempt to avoid dealing with them


Wow, you really hate Si, do you?


> *9. Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.
> 
> *when I'm enjoying myself I think I can be quite easy going and funny, whenever I'm at a small party with people I know well I'm like this. I also get a thrill when I know I am doing really well on a test, it sounds lame, but knowing I'm crushing the test gives me a rush.


Ne power rush! Seriously. No contest. INTPs don't describe themselves like that. 



> *10. Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceive one-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?*
> 
> my relationship generally isn't a good one. Group interaction would depend on the group, in familiar settings I'm fine most of the time, foreign groups bring out a desire to escape -_-' One on one interactions are only good if I like who I'm talking to, if people are interesting and witty and smart, I love talking about things with them, if I dislike the person and feel they have little to offer nothing is worse than being forced to make small talk


lol makes it sound like you don't like people at all. So much NeTi in this response.


> *11. Describe your relationship to society. What are the elements of it you hold important or unimportant (e.g. social norms, values, customs, traditions)? How do you see people as a whole?
> 
> *I don't care much for tradition, and I think in general people pay way too much attention to social customs. You could say I don't care much for people as a whole, I don't think I believe in the basic good of humanity, and most people in the world do not see the world I do, for the most part, I couldn't care less for society.


Hahahahahaha. So much Ti and anti-Si and Fe


> in here.
> 
> *12. Describe your relationship to authority. How do you perceive authority? What does it mean to you, and how do you deal with it?
> 
> *It really depends on whether I feel their "authority" is reasonable or not. Generally if I feel a person is well suited and competent in a position of authority I'm fairly at ease. When I think someone is ill suited to it I can very from quietly dismissive to outright rude and vocally dismissive.


Yeah, e5 focus on competence.


> *13. Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?*
> 
> I think I live on the precipice of both. I live in what is perceived as chaos, but I know where things are most of the time. I'm as ordered as I need to be to get by, but I enjoy the openness and freedom of chaos.


Ne dom response. Precipice of both eh? You don't want to fit into anything. You're just pure chaos as it can get.


> *14. What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest to you both in how you think and how you act?
> *
> Failure, I'm not sure why, I have high expectations of myself, generally this will manifest itself as playing it safe, avoiding risks.


Enneagram 5.


> *15. What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?
> *
> Knowledge. Understanding. I don't know why, I've just always been driven to know things.


Enneagram 5 again.


> *17. Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know your enneagram, please post this here. If you have done any online function tests such as the
> Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post these results here as well.
> *
> I want to know my type in the hope that knowing how I work will give me better insight to improve my shortcomings.
> ...


5w4.


> *18. Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance you want to add about yourself you think might be of relevance when helping to type you?*
> 
> I doubt the MBTI's validity in general, and yet I am trying to use it to improve myself. Strange no?


5w4 can be an irrational enneagram.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

@LeaT

You are so awesome for taking the time to do all that <3


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## petitpèlerin (Apr 23, 2012)

I agree with ENTP. You ooze Ne and you have that special Ne-dom obnoxiousness.  And your thinking is clearly high above your feeling. Your feeling is lower and it seems to be Fe rather than Fi: sounds like you don't have an Fi bone in your body. I don't really see any other options: ENTP.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

ltldslwmn said:


> I agree with ENTP. You ooze Ne and you have that *special Ne-dom obnoxiousness.*  And your thinking is clearly high above your feeling. Your feeling is lower and it seems to be Fe rather than Fi: sounds like you don't have an Fi bone in your body. I don't really see any other options: ENTP.


I choose to take this as a compliment. haha


Thanks for your input.


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## petitpèlerin (Apr 23, 2012)

DarwinsBastard said:


> I choose to take this as a compliment. haha


Good.  The awesomest friend I have is an ENFP. I tell him on a daily basis how obnoxious he is. If I don't he feels unappreciated.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

LeaT said:


> Why are you even wondering that you're not an ENTP? <.< You're just very intro ENTP because of your enneagram, that's all. But Ne dom regardles. Ne is flowing out from your ears.


I get the shit end of both sticks. 

Not analytical like a Ti dom, but still shy.

oh the humanity.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

DarwinsBastard said:


> I get the shit end of both sticks.
> 
> Not analytical like a Ti dom, but still shy.
> 
> oh the humanity.


Shyness has nothing to do with introversion or extraversion.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

LeaT said:


> Shyness has nothing to do with introversion or extraversion.


yes I'm aware of that.

what I mean is, whereas an introvert, even a shy introvert, will at the very least be at home in the realm of introspection and thought, a shy extrovert is confined to introversion even though it is not best how they relate to the world, a shy extrovert lacks the ability to be introverted for long periods of time, and also the ability to think and interact in the way they are best suited to, it seems a very bad place to be.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

DarwinsBastard said:


> yes I'm aware of that.
> 
> what I mean is, whereas an introvert, even a shy introvert, will at the very least be at home in the realm of introspection and thought, a shy extrovert is confined to introversion even though it is not best how they relate to the world, a shy extrovert lacks the ability to be introverted for long periods of time, and also the ability to think and interact in the way they are best suited to, it seems a very bad place to be.


You're right about that. You're extro for sure and it's probably frustrating for you being shy as it's harder for you to engage with your dominant function in a way that feels satisfying. For me the problem is to explain to people why I don't feel like seeing them right now lol!


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

LeaT said:


> You're right about that. You're extro for sure and it's probably frustrating for you being shy as it's harder for you to engage with your dominant function in a way that feels satisfying. For me the problem is to explain to people why I don't feel like seeing them right now lol!


I have to ask what makes you think I'm a shy extrovert though, I'm curious. This is a possibility I've been playing with in my head for weeks, but I can't seem to justify that conclusion, I also have a piss poor memory and have trouble recalling events in my past that might just help, an example I can remember would be like, my roommate comes home from work and bursts into my room to make small talk, and I can feel myself on the brink of snapping or panicking or telling him to get the hell out, it's downright painful. 

I need a space of my own to be solitary... granted, much of that time is spent interacting with people in a different medium (ie. here) but it doesn't speak to my extroversion. 

I say this not to be a pain btw, I just need to be sure I've asked all the questions I have while this thread is going, because there were too many left last time.


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## MegaTuxRacer (Sep 7, 2011)

DarwinsBastard said:


> Well that is helpful to know.
> 
> perfectionism aside,
> 
> when it comes to the matter of introversion or extroversion, I can't really find a compelling reason to believe I'm an extrovert, that really doesn't make sense to me. I have been a very quiet, solitary person for my entire life, I find it bizarre that anyone would consider me an extrovert.


It is your attitude towards the world rather than the minutiae of how you interact with it. I honestly think that you are just an ENTP that needs to figure out who he is as a person and feel empowered as himself rather than his perception of who he should be. I am speaking from experience.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

***


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

well, I guess I'll stay put for now.

thanks all.



LeaT said:


> The good old cognitive extraversion is not the same as social extraversion comes to mind. Functions are about how you think.


This was all sort of brought on for two reasons, the similarities between an ISTJ friend and myself, and my understanding of the dominant and inferior functions. 

The descriptions of inferior Ne tend to make a point to single out words like "catastrophizing" or "anticipating a number of bad outcomes" etc... and I understand that you can see how a dom function can also be used in this way, but I also understand that dom functions largely take the form of the positive (beebe calls it the hero function correct? a reliable and well exercised trait that we can depend upon) and the inferior the aspirational, largely unconscious, and frequently used in exaggerated and generally clumsy ways. 

I've been attempting quite frequently to observe myself as I engage with the world... metacognition I suppose, the observing self, or whatever you want to call it. Trying to classify my thoughts, how they might be interpreted in a functional sense, and I really just was at a loss. I don't really have a well formed "self" as it were, there is no one "me" I can identify.

cue the craziness. *sigh*

anyway, thanks for taking the time.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

DarwinsBastard said:


> well, I guess I'll stay put for now.
> 
> thanks all.
> 
> ...


I would suggest talking to Rim and how he came to realize he's a cognitive extravert over an introvert even though he thought he was a cognitive introvert for the longest of time for exactly the same reasons you bring up here - he was socially introverted so how could he be cognitively extraverted?

I was also thinking that your neuroticism could rather point towards 6w5 as your core type rather than 5w6. That, or you're an unhealthy 9 core that's currently disintegrated to 6. 9s are also introverted, are often mistyped as 5s (specifically 5w6, 5w4 kind of goes against what 9 stands for due to how 4 works) when they are more intellectual and rarely have any actual sense of self.


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## DarwinsBastard (Apr 27, 2012)

LeaT said:


> I would suggest talking to Rim and how he came to realize he's a cognitive extravert over an introvert even though he thought he was a cognitive introvert for the longest of time for exactly the same reasons you bring up here - he was socially introverted so how could he be cognitively extraverted?
> 
> I was also thinking that your neuroticism could rather point towards 6w5 as your core type rather than 5w6. That, or you're an unhealthy 9 core that's currently disintegrated to 6. 9s are also introverted, are often mistyped as 5s (specifically 5w6, 5w4 kind of goes against what 9 stands for due to how 4 works) when they are more intellectual and rarely have any actual sense of self.


well, I had a look at this,


> _A detailed comparison and contrast between Fives and Nines is warranted because so many Nines mistakenly think that they are Fives; typically, the misidentification almost never happens the other way around. Particularly if they are well educated and intelligent, average male Nines tend to think that they are Fives. (As noted in the discussion of Twos, average female Nines tend to think that they are Twos.) _
> 
> _Of all the personality types, Nines have the most difficulty identifying which type they are because their sense of self is undefined. Average Nines have little sense of who they are apart from those they have identified with; hence, they are usually at a loss to know where to begin to find their type. (As we have seen, either they think they are Fives or Twos or they see a little of themselves in all the types and make no further effort at identifying themselves. If they have no guidance, Nines in this predicament usually shrug their shoulders and give up on the Enneagram and more important, on acquiring self-knowledge.) _
> 
> ...


I can definitely see the similarities between a 5 and a 9, on the surface at least, but I see a lot of red flags in the mistyping descriptions. 9's are portrayed as idealists at the core, afraid of conflict, and made anxious by intense introspection, whereas I am, for the most part, pragmatic and realistic, aggressive but only if pushed, and comfortable introspecting... when I say I have difficulty making observations of the self, it is not the introspection that causes problems, rather, my understanding of human nature and how it changes under scrutiny, especially within the realm of the self, despite any and all efforts and the best of intentions to behave "naturally"

I'm just aware of the limitation of one's own ability to do that, we can observe internally, but by the nature of things we can't do it objectively (not even the Ti-est of the Ti), therein lies the constant doubt of my type.





> Type Six-Type Five
> 
> Fives and Sixes are both Thinking types and, when educated, can both be quite intellectual. It is far more common for Sixes to mistype as Fives, but for some easily understood reasons. Of the two types, Sixes tend to be more linear and analytical in their thinking because they are interested in troubleshooting, in prediction, and in establishing methods that can be repeated. Thus, contrary to popular belief, the world of academia and higher education is more the realm of Sixes than of Fives. Academia teaches students to work with advisers and mentors, to cite sources and back up arguments with quotes from authorities, to follow proper procedures in papers and theses, and so forth–all type Six values.
> Fives are much more non-linear in their thinking. They are interested in finding out where established theories break down and in developing iconoclastic ideas that shake up structures and established methods. Fives are, generally speaking, bolder than Sixes in their positions and creativity, but also far less practical. Fives feel that they can only trust their own minds to come to conclusions–they believe that everyone else is likely to be less well-informed. Sixes get frantic trying to find something to trust precisely because they do not trust their own minds to come to meaningful conclusions. The difference between them can be seen in the difference between Umberto Eco ( a Five) and Tom Clancy (a Six), or Peter Gabriel (a Five) and Bruce Springsteen (a Six).



This I can see a definite case for,

I'm going to keep reading on some differences between fives and sixes, but I think 6w5 is a good fit at first glance anyway.

I think I just need to get a better understanding of how the wing influences the core before I give any solid opinions, one way or the other.






EDIT- 

Okay, so there are a few things I'm getting wary of as I read the 6 vs 5 descriptions.

First of all, the root of my neuroticism is fear of failure, that needs to be established. Right out of the gate, as I read the 5 description "*Basic Fear: Being useless, helpless, or incapable" *vs the 6 "*Basic Fear: Of being without support and guidance"
*
The 5 still seems more appropriate to me than anything, I am not a GAD-type person, anxious about the world in general, I have a specific set of triggers that centre around a failure of competence above all other things.

I also found this handy little head to head list, so I went through and tried to pick which of the two descriptors fit me
*
6 and 5*

Mistyping frequency: sometimes (6w5 and sp 5s tend to resemble each other)
*Six* *Five* 
Relate to tradition--------Eccentric y
Consider rules y--------------Ignore rules
Linear thinking--------------Non-linear thinking y
Establish methods-------------Contest methods ​y
Practical ---T--- Impractical I think I'm practical, in theory...
Doubt their minds y------------Trust their minds
Reactive--------------------------Aloof y
Affiliative-----------------------Independent y
Seek security-------------------Seek knowledge y
Paranoid-------------------------Schizoid y
Engaged-------------------------Detached y
Group-oriented-----------------Individualist y


EDIT-2

and upon further study, I'm finding more that squares with my perception in the 5 




> Their problem with anxiety, one of the issues common to the personality types of the Thinking Center, is related to their difficulty with perceiving reality objectively. *They are afraid of allowing anyone or anything to influence them or their thoughts. Because they doubt their own ability to do, they fear that others’ agendas will overwhelm them.* They fear that others are more powerful than they are and will control or possess them. Ironically, however, even average Fives are not unwilling to be possessed by an idea, as long as the idea has originated with them.* Nothing must be allowed to influence their thinking lest their developing sense of confidence be diminished,* although by relying solely on their own ideas and perceptions, and without testing them in the real world, Fives can become profoundly out of touch with reality.


 

particularly in bold, these are problem areas of mine.




> One of the results of the way Fives think is that even healthy Fives are not very deeply rooted in visceral experience. They are the type of people who get a great deal of intellectual mileage out of very little experience because they always find something of significance where others see little or nothing. This may lead to great discoveries. However, *when they stop observing the world and focus their attention on their interpretations of it, Fives begin to lose touch with reality. Instead of keeping an open mind while they observe the world, they become too involved with their own thoughts and dreams. This leads them further away from the world of constructive action—the very arena in which their self-confidence needs to develop. They may spend a great deal of time playing around with ideas or visions of reality which have almost no practical impact on their lives, leaving them more fearful about themselves and feeling more vulnerable to the predations of the world*.




this as well.


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## fihe (Aug 30, 2012)

I feel so stupid for asking this, but where'd you find that test with the cognitive functions? I took one at similarminds.com and here's what I got. although I'm not sure if I fully agree with the Ni because I thought I was more individualistic than that. oh well, lately I've seem to have lost some of my creativity because I'm too busy working and hating life:

*Ti (Introverted Thinking)* (75%) 
your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational

*Te (Extroverted Thinking)* (60%) 
your valuation of / adherence to logic of external systems / hierarchies / methods

*Si (Introverted Sensing)* (60%) 
your valuation of / focus on internal sensations and reliving past moments

*Ne (Extroverted Intuition)* (60%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli

*Ni (Introverted Intuition)* (50%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity

*Fe (Extroverted Feeling)* (45%) 
your valuation of / adherence to external morals, ethics, traditions, customs, groups

*Se (Extroverted Sensing)* (30%) 
your valuation of / tendency to fully experience the world unfiltered, in the moment

*Fi (Introverted Feeling)* (15%) 
your valuation of / adherence to the sanctity of your own feelings / ideals / sentiment


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

fihe said:


> I feel so stupid for asking this, but where'd you find that test with the cognitive functions? I took one at similarminds.com and here's what I got. although I'm not sure if I fully agree with the Ni because I thought I was more individualistic than that. oh well, lately I've seem to have lost some of my creativity because I'm too busy working and hating life:
> 
> *Ti (Introverted Thinking)* (75%)
> your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational
> ...


Ni has nothing to do with being individualistic or not. I'm quite sure that @FacelessBeauty who's an Ni dominant can explain it better than I can. If you want others to type you need to submit a questionnaire and make your own thread.


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