# ILE problems with EII?



## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

Hey ILEs!  
I think Im an EII recently married to ILE. Socionics says thats really bad because we "supervise" you guys with Fi. I dont see any problems in our marriage and my husband says hes really happy. But does anyone know real examples of how this relation feels for an ILE? 
Thank yous...
PS- feel free to use brutal honesty, thats what Im asking for..


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

curiositykillsme said:


> Hey ILEs!
> I think Im an EII recently married to ILE. Socionics says thats really bad because we "supervise" you guys with Fi. I dont see any problems in our marriage and my husband says hes really happy. But does anyone know real examples of how this relation feels for an ILE?
> Thank yous...
> PS- feel free to use brutal honesty, thats what Im asking for..


I think the best way to describe a relation of supervision is you have three choices:

(1)You can gently guide your supervisee when it comes to their sore spot.
(2)Use their weakness ruthlessly against your supervisee but just know you then open yourself up to massive retaliation from your supervisor.
(3)Just avoid your supervisee if you think you being around them is harming them.

Choose Your Own Adventure: Which choice will you make?


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## d e c a d e n t (Apr 21, 2013)

Hmm, I tried asking @_Word Dispenser_ how she experienced Fi-PoLR earlier. Might as well copy it here since it's in public anyway:



> Fi-PoLR is.. Intensely uncomfortable sore spot kinda deal. Ultimate insecurity. It's not just when other people are 'projecting' Fi (for lack of a better term), in which case the Fi-PoLR in question will go, 'UUGGHHH' internally, but also when _the subject is forced to consider it, cognitively speaking. Fi-PoLR is terrible with psychological distancing, with having consistent values and understanding other people's... 'Bubbles'. Does that make sense?_


I'm guessing, though, that if you've been bothering your husband's PoLR, you'd have an idea of already. So maybe it's really fine.


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

thanks guys but oh my goodness -_- I still dont understand exactly what Fi polr would be.. like some ppl have tried to explain but I still dont get it..
-_-


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

curiositykillsme said:


> thanks guys but oh my goodness -_- I still dont understand exactly what Fi polr would be.. like some ppl have tried to explain but I still dont get it..
> -_-


Introverted Ethics isn't my polr but I'll give it a shot:

The fourth position or vulnerable position is a conscious element and to one who is cognescent of it knows that it is their vulnerable point because it is always unshielded and attacks on the fourth element is consciously painful and subconsciously anger inducing.

How that manifests for Introverted Ethics in the fourth and vulnerable position is an inability to gauge distances accurately and may constantly miss the mark when judging psychological distances must be done correctly. Because of this, they are not well suited to positions based on trust.


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## Schweeeeks (Feb 12, 2013)

Supervisor/Supervisee isn't as bad as people say it is. As long as you don't start viewing yourself in a level above him or start "pushing him to do what you know is best for him", it will be fine. I think the latter is usually what results in retaliation.

I can maybe imagine an Fi base pushing an Fi PoLR to express their feelings in an honest, real way. Share their deepest fears. Or reveal your own in a deep and serious way, looking for a response. The best way to "connect" to someone's PoLR is through their HA. If things can be discussed in a way that is more carefree and not binding (Fe anything goes atmosphere), he might be able to air out his real concerns without feeling insecure.

Also "reconciling" after a fight can be nerve-wracking for Fi PoLR. It might be difficult, awkwardly worded, whatever. Just not easy to be sentimental about it. 

The Fi PoLRs (and other devaluers I know) will panic after a major fight. They won't reach out to you, they'll sit there kind of nervously. I usually am the one to go back to them and be like "I'm not mad anymore. Wanna go out/watch a movie/etc:?" 
Then after awhile, when they realize nothing has changed, they might say "Sorry about that...that was screwed up" and be more likely to open up from there



> "No more chick flick moments, mk? It's a not big deal." - LSI (although they don't value Fi either)


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

Okay the only things I can think of:

*Before we were married he went driving after having 5 beers and said hes done it with more and he feels its okay cuz he feels okay. I was so furious and gave him the ultimatum to wait one to two hours after every beer he drinks. Since then hes agreed and its been fine.

*He one time was "joking" with a female coworker who Im sure had a crush on him. I never could tell exactly if he was attracted to her but I saw is joking/playing as flirting. Like they would play thumb wars all the time and something else with a heart and note but its a long story. Anyways I broke up with him over the latter thing but later got back with him and forgave him.

*He would spend his free time hanging out alone mostly with this other girl when he couldnt be with me. He more referred to her as a sister but the first time I saw her picture he joked that she was his wife. I asked him to only mostly hang out with her if they are with the rest of his friends.

*I try to go to church every week. He doesnt see it as important but if hes not working he goes with me without me asking him to. I dont expect him to or ever judge him for it but he seems to do it for me. (If Im sick he says he doesnt want to go without me)?

Are these examples? Cuz I really cant think of anything else. Unless I truly am blind to it, but he really says hes the happiest man in the world in our marriage.... ?

Also when we were first together his friends were telling me he has a heart of gold but has always been a major alcoholic. They told me that I seriously saved his life because after we were together he just stopped getting drunk.

Does all this sound like a Fi Supervision relation?
The only reason Im so obsessed with recognizing it is because Im so afraid of hurting him. Socionics says these relations can be extremely damaging for the supervisee.. But other than these very past things I see our marriage as healthy and wonderful.


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

MNiS said:


> Introverted Ethics isn't my polr but I'll give it a shot:
> 
> The fourth position or vulnerable position is a conscious element and to one who is cognescent of it knows that it is their vulnerable point because it is always unshielded and attacks on the fourth element is consciously painful and subconsciously anger inducing.
> 
> How that manifests for Introverted Ethics in the fourth and vulnerable position is an inability to gauge distances accurately and may constantly miss the mark when judging psychological distances must be done correctly. Because of this, they are not well suited to positions based on trust.


Yea but I dont see that in him. I mean the things I mentioned from years ago made me not trust him. But now I trust him more than anyone. I see him as extremely loyal and with better intentions than I have most of the time. Maybe the Supervision relation happened only in the early part of our relationship?


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

curiositykillsme said:


> Does all this sound like a Fi Supervision relation?
> The only reason Im so obsessed with recognizing it is because Im so afraid of hurting him. Socionics says these relations can be extremely damaging for the supervisee.. But other than these very past things I see our marriage as healthy and wonderful.


Only these two sound supervisor-like but ultimately beneficial to him if the both of you believe Marriage is an institution.



> *Before we were married he went driving after having 5 beers and said hes done it with more and he feels its okay cuz he feels okay. I was so furious and gave him the ultimatum to wait one to two hours after every beer he drinks. Since then hes agreed and its been fine.
> 
> *He one time was "joking" with a female coworker who Im sure had a crush on him. I never could tell exactly if he was attracted to her but I saw is joking/playing as flirting. Like they would play thumb wars all the time and something else with a heart and note but its a long story. Anyways I broke up with him over the latter thing but later got back with him and forgave him.


Otherwise, the rest is just couples stuff. Nix the major alcoholic part though. >_> If you knew how dumb life can be then you'll know it's a lifeline for a lot of otherwise smart and intelligent people.


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

...... ? -_-


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

curiositykillsme said:


> Yea but I dont see that in him. I mean the things I mentioned from years ago made me not trust him. But now I trust him more than anyone. I see him as extremely loyal and with better intentions than I have most of the time. Maybe the Supervision relation happened only in the early part of our relationship?


You shouldn't even worry about your Supervisory status then. If he says he's the happiest guy in the world with you, then he really means it. You'll likely have to guide him yet not be so restrictive so as to suffocate him though.



curiositykillsme said:


> ...... ? -_-


I meant his friends are wrong about him. >____>


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

okay...


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## Schweeeeks (Feb 12, 2013)

Forgot to mention.
Supervisor and Supervisee both fulfill each other's DS with a little compromise.
He puts more focus (at least outward focus to you) into this Demonstrative, you do the same with your HA.

EDIT: You both have ONE FUNCTION you can always unite over. His Base, your Creative. At the very least, exploring new ideas and attempting to see everyday things in as many different angles will be a strong common factor between you both. He makes a career of it, you love playing with it and consider the IM to be fairly important. --------> Stop worrying! 


When people get into a relationship, they fall into complementary roles over time anyway. He seems to love you a lot. I really don't believe that a problem will happen due to Fi PoLR when things have been going great so long.
Socionics isn't everything...it can only account for several factors and assumes "all else is the same" like every other model in the world. I was with my Supervisee for over 5 years. I wouldn't have related to MOST of the Socionics descriptions. It was far more subtle and could have been worked through.

It's even possible your husband is Base subtype + with another more Fi-friendly subtype that lessens the weight of PoLR on him by a lot (compared to other ILEs).

I'm curious, why bring this up if there isn't a problem? Do you feel you might be doing something lately that could be hurting him? Not trying to offend. I read the examples, but I just don't understand the significance of connecting it to Socionics...Let sleeping dogs lie (unless they are undead zombies, then _*HEADSHOT*_)
Anyway you two seem happy together


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

Thanks, this helps me feel better  And what you were saying about DS sounds really interesting but something I dont understand.. but good.  Everything seems so wonderful.. and I guess Im just really afraid of the part in the supervision relation description where it says that the supervisee can hurt so much it even causes mental illness.. So Im afraid that he could keep telling me how happy he is when he is really hurting a lot in something Im blind to. Like I cant imagine a relationship with my Supervisor ESFp. Like I would probably go crazy. But yes I do think Im taking Socionics too seriously.. its more like an obsession.. maybe I need therapy -_-


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

curiositykillsme said:


> Thanks, this helps me feel better  And what you were saying about DS sounds really interesting but something I dont understand.. but good.  Everything seems so wonderful.. and I guess Im just really afraid of the part in the supervision relation description where it says that the supervisee can hurt so much it even causes mental illness.. So Im afraid that he could keep telling me how happy he is when he is really hurting a lot in something Im blind to. Like I cant imagine a relationship with my Supervisor ESFp. Like I would probably go crazy. But yes I do think Im taking Socionics too seriously.. its more like an obsession.. maybe I need therapy -_-


Ugh, you'd be so unhappy with an ESFp unless the ESFp were an extremely refined individual and not brutish. Otherwise why would you want to ruin your marriage? )


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

haha nooooooooo... I was saying like If I was the supervisee in a relationship with Esfp I would be miserable. Im trying to empathize what it would feel like for him as the supervisee. I really hope its not that feeling for him. Haha no I dont know any male Esfp.. and Id certainly never want to be with anyone besides my husband!


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## cyamitide (Jul 8, 2010)

curiositykillsme said:


> But does anyone know real examples of how this relation feels for an ILE?
> Thank yous...


It shows up as the EII wanting to correct the ILE in any situations when ILE's opinion deviates from that of the EII, and wanting to point out and bring to attention instances when the ILE was being rude. A real life example of the first: Do you Believe in Global Warming? - Page 2


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## curiositykillsme (Jun 18, 2014)

cyamitide said:


> It shows up as the EII wanting to correct the ILE in any situations when ILE's opinion deviates from that of the EII, and wanting to point out and bring to attention instances when the ILE was being rude. A real life example of the first: Do you Believe in Global Warming? - Page 2


Thanks and thank you for the video earlier. But yea I still dont really see too much of that in our relationship.. 
Argh.. maybe the most recent one would be :
My husband was saying how him and some of his male cowerkers were "teasing" a female coworker about still being single for a long time. They were laughing and kept telling her how she probably wants to kill herself. He said she got mad but it was really funny.. I got really mad at him and told him he should never joke like that... 
Thats all I can think of besides my earlier examples .. but still dont really see how I supervise him with Fi....
?


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

@curiositykillsme

 are you doubting the relationship based on some test results or the test results based on the relationship? You know you guys could be:

a) mistyping
b) relationships depend also on other variables that have nothing to do with cognitive makeup, they found conflictor relationships that were working just fine 

EDIT: Plus EII is MBTI INFP you know, meaning Fi-Ne not Ni-Fe.

*Tell me about your Fi.*

*This is Fe:* Perceives information about processes taking place in objects — first of all, emotional processes that are taking place in people, their excitation or subduedness, and their moods. This perceptual element implies the ability to know what excites people, and what suppresses them. It defines a person's ability or inability to control his emotional state, and also the emotional states of other people. 

When this element is in the leading position, the individual has the innate ability to induce or convey his moods to others and energize people with his emotions. He is able to activate the psychological/spiritual lives of other people and their emotional readiness for action. You might say that such a person has the ability to infect others with his moods and tends to impose on others the emotional states that he considers beneficial for their life activities. 

*This is Fi:* This is the subjective relationship between two carriers of potential or kinetic energy that shows the level of attraction (or repulsion) between one object or subject and another object or subject. Thanks to this IM element a person feels which objects attract him and which repel him. You might say that this perceptual element conveys information about objects' need or lack of need of each other and about the presence or absence of mutual or one-way needs.

Such an individual perceives information about this facet of objective reality the individual perceives as a need for certain objects that satisfy physical wishes/desires, psychological or spiritual desires, and a need for other people — in other words, a person's wishes/desires and interests that are directed toward animate and inanimate objects. This includes feelings of like and dislike, love and hatred, the desire to obtain some thing/object, etc., and greed or the absense of greed. The higher feelings of this kind can be called ethical, because relationships between people's needs are mainly regulated by ethical normals. 

*TLTR:* Fe is concerned with other people's feelings and influencing these, with expressing one's own feelings, while Fi functions as a value meter, where the relationship between the self and anything external is established and regulated.

*Fi is relational ethics and Fe is ethics of emotion.* (probably why Fi users tend to be less emotive, sort of like thinkers on the outside).

*I'll give myself as a Fi aux as example:* I am very aware of how and what people feel, but I do not tend to express my feelings openly unless I can't hold it in anymore and when it happens its not with the intention of causing change, its more of release, nor do I comfort people or try to change their emotional state by influencing them through expressing myself emotionally. For me solving their problem in a practical manner is more important, because their negative feelings bother me. I'd rather avoid negative emotions then change them. I am also basically aware and guide myself according to what my relationship with everyone and everything is aka how I feel about everything personally regardless of what others think, so i have a very strong personal sense of ethics, that may or may not coincide with that of my environment. I usually am more concerned with how I feel then with how others or the group feels.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Why did you make another thread? You are so clearly Fe.


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