# INTJ or INTP?



## Idalia (May 21, 2013)

Excuse the lengthy and back-and-forth nature of the post. I'm deeply sorry. Well, not deeply, but still. 

I've been reading about MBTI for a good two years now, and began learning about the cognitive functions a little under a year or so ago. MBTI is a large portion of my life; I spend hours every day reading up on it. For the longest time, I've identified as an INTJ, though there's always been a small voice at the back of my head telling me that I possibly could be an INTP. Honestly, I don't think I've ever truly understood Ni, but I've simply brushed it off due to the abstract nature of the function and have made a vow to myself to get a better understanding of it sooner or later. This has never happened, though. 

I know that INTPs and INTJs often come to similar world views due to their introspective and critical nature, but that they're in reality quite different from one another. Anyway, I have, admittedly, been almost married to the idea of being an INTJ, which I think might have led to this whole ordeal in the first place. However, after a strange incident (which I will soon elaborate on), I further began considering that I could be an INTP, and that was when I found this quote. I can't remember where I found it, nor do I remember the exact words. It went a little like this: 

"INTJs wish to change the world, and through changing the world, they will learn to understand themselves and the world around them. INTPs wish to understand themselves and the world, and through doing this, they have the potential to change the world."

It felt a little like a revelation. I've never indentified as someone who feels the need to change the world. In fact, I don't much believe in change - but that's an entirely different and unrelated topic. My number one goal in life is to understand myself and the world, and if changing it follows with that, that's simply a perk. 

Now, to the strange incident. Earlier that day, I'd been in a short but heated debate with someone I'm fairly certain is a lead Se, which generally comes off as rather animalistic and intimidating to me. The person I was debating with is also a fair bit older than me (I'm sixteen; they're almost ten years my senior), and I could almost feel the person looking down on me and simplifying my ideas, as well as me as a person, which is something I cannot stand. Their blatant ignorance on the subject and lack of wish to listen and hear me out, made me feel frustrated. I felt intimidated, upset. I felt out of control. Then the crying started. Tears practically flew from my eyes, and I couldn't control my breathing. It was simply awful. I regard myself as aloof and cold, a person who observes people with a sense of detachment. Needless to say, I keep my emotions to myself, and any sort of public display of emotion makes me feel ridiculously uncomfortable. I was mortified. This is something I simply cannot imagine an INTJ doing, but an INTP, with their weak Fe, will at times feel as though they have little control of their emotions, which might cause emotional outbursts. 
*

Other reasons for why I relate to INTPs:*



INTJs seem to not care about smoothing out social situations. In other words, they don't give a shit (or won't even notice) if a situation is awkward. I don't relate to this. Although I freaking suck at small talk (and see little point of it), I will, at least to a certain extent, attempt to smooth out a situation if it feels awkward to me. I usually fail, but still.
I don't tend to care if knowledge can be applied in the future. If I'm interested in a topic, it's usually because I wish to gain an understanding of it. That's that.
From a visual standpoint, I relate more to the INTPs - especially in regard to facial expressions. While stoic, if INTPs are interested in a topic, they will become rather animated (though not as much as, let's say, an INFJ).
Truth in the form of evidence is all that matters to me. I have little to no regard for religion and spiritualism. Maybe I'm wrong, but INTJs (due to their lead Ni and tertiary Fi) seem more religiously inclined than INTPs.
I'm the least practical person I know. I do enjoy drawing, though.

*Why I still think I might be an INTJ:*



Arrogance. Judging from past experiences, INTJs tend to be a lot more arrogant and narcissistic than INTPs, which is something I relate to. In a way, I'm almost proud of it. But, as of late, I've started to think that perhaps it's simply a defense mechanism which is rooted in feeling inadequate in social situations, which has then led to me building up my intellect to the point of arrogance.
Deadlines. Although I do procrastinate, it makes me feel uncomfortable. While INTPs seem to thrive off of thinking about a project for a couple of weeks, before spending two days actually _doing_ it, INTJs seem to take the opposite approach. I need to actually _do _something to properly process it - at least if it's on a subject I care little for. This seems very Te; not Ti.
INTPs seem to be a little too nihilistic. They're often described as the personality type that "gives the least amount of shits", which is an attribute I certainly don't relate to. Although I rarely follow through with my goals, I love setting goals; I love imagining the future and am deathly afraid of achieving "nothing".
I'm not sentimental or nostalgic. Nolstalgia usually makes me feel sick. I can't stand it. INTPs have tertiary Si, which is focused on the past - hence the nostalgia.
I take myself rather seriously. I've often heard INTPs described as "children who come off as children", but I'd probably describe myself as "an adult who comes off as an adult". I do take myself very seriously, and am quite aware of how I appear to other people.

Anyway, that's all I have to say for now. I tried to keep this short, but failed miserably - INTJ trait? Honestly, I've got to the point where I almost feel like giving up on the system; it all just seems to blend together; nothing is crisp and clear anymore. I think I've shattered the concept to smithereens - INTP trait? :bored:

Not sure if this will in any way help, but here's a photo of me:






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(And NO, I'm not an INFJ. I know this with an utmost certainty.)

Help is much appreciated. Thanks.


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## Ellis Bell (Mar 16, 2012)

So my first (well, only, for right now) question is, why the intense, obsessive interest in MBTI? I mean, we all are to a certain point, but what fascination does it have for you?

Also, would you be willing to fill out one of the questionnaires stickied at the top of the forum? It's easier to try to help people if they fill out one of those, rather than try to do it based on a list of stereotypes the typee thinks they relate to.

ETA: By the way, what sources have you been reading?

ETA, again: if you're an inferior Fe type, you seem actually to have a great deal of ease describing your emotions, especially with the situation you described. As an inferior Fe type myself, I have a hard time recognizing the way I feel, even in a stress situation, and even with a great deal of thought on the subject afterward (so that expression of those emotions kind of works on a time delay. What I'm saying, in a roundabout way for an ISTP, is that you sound, from your reaction to the conflict, like an IFP type).


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## ttanzkel (Nov 26, 2012)

You don't look like sixteen in your picture. I would say you're really pretty, though. Meh, I apologize for the random comment. xD


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## EasterInTheBatcave (Aug 18, 2012)

You're kinda hot. Anyway, yeah, fill out a questionnaire, and we can more easily help type you.


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## Idalia (May 21, 2013)

Hi! Thanks for the reply!

Well, there are many reasons, I suppose, for my obsession with MBTI. The main reason is to understand myself and the world around me, I think. IFP? I very much doubt this. I've considered INFP in the past, but don't seem to relate to the describtions or the people who identify as INFP. Also, my mother's an ISFP, and we're so different from one another, it's rididuclous. Although I do have a fairly good grip on my internal emotions, I think this is mostly related to my extremely introspective nature; I overanalyse everything, and usually, it's not of emotional content. I've been reading a bit about the TiSi INTP loop, and find that this is something I highly relate to. Also, it's very, very hard for me to express my own emotions. I don't think I could ever say what I wrote on here to a person in "real life". I'm extremely analyctical when it comes to pretty much everything. 

What sources I've been reading? Pretty much everything. Which might be why I'm extremely confused as of now, and am considering giving up on MBTI. But, I've reading with a critical eye. The thing is, it seems that no matter what source, it's always, to some agree, from the writer's perspective.

Haha, I'm even more confused now! No, I'm joking. Sort of. Anyway, thanks again! 

(I'll fill out a questionnaire later!)


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## ttanzkel (Nov 26, 2012)

EasterInTheBatcave said:


> You're kinda hot.


Believe him. That's Se speaking.


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## Tru7h (Oct 16, 2012)

So far by what you have described and by your picture, I can indicate that you have both the Ti and Fe cognitive functions.

However, to help confirm your type, please fill out a questionnaire. Thanks.


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## Snow (Oct 19, 2010)

I suggest this web site to better narrow your search.


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## Juan Carlos (May 16, 2013)

This is getting really interesting. I kind of went through the same analyses you've performed on yourself, and I'm also on the dilemma whether I'm an INTJ or an INTP. I can't wait to see how this ends!


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## Recon777 (May 24, 2013)

One thing to consider is that if you're 16, your second, third and fourth functions are not going to be very well developed yet. If you are an INTP, your life will blast Ti. If you are INTJ, it will be all about Ni. So one of these two will dominate your personality in your younger years. If its Ni, then to be honest you could very well be INTJ or INFJ.

As an INTJ, I can say that for me, logical reasoning is paramount. My best friend is INTP and I can see very well how we both think so differently. He loves collecting random unrelated details and storing them in his mind, and then instantaneously being able to fit them together as a whole, AFTER collecting them. That drives me crazy. I can't do it. My style is to take a single concept and follow it in threads, to all the subconcepts and related pathways to the very last minute detail. He hates that style, and has no patience for it. Also, I am very focused, where he is very open minded. I hate acting before knowing all the facts. He just acts. I really need to understand a system fully before being comfortable with it. He just dives in. See the pattern? I also have a hard time multitasking, and like to finish one thing before starting the next. Flipping back and forth rapidly drives me crazy. He has no problem with this and multitasks like a pro. I also over-analyze everything and try to form judgments or conclusions about a person or concept as fast as possible. An INTP will not do this. I love building systems and making things as efficient as possible. He doesn't really care for that and thinks its tedious. He admires my endurance for minute detail work when designing something. Oh, and we're both computer programmers, so again, there are many things the two types both enjoy and both do well. But the way of thinking is entirely opposite.

Ni vs Ne. I'm all about the big picture and seeing the end from the beginning. I also can get obsessive about thoroughly understanding a concept. He is more scattered in thoughts. Likes to jump from idea to idea.

Te vs Ti. I'm much more driven to find pragmatic solutions. I also am more vocal in correcting others when they are wrong about something. He is more introspective and likes personal soaking up of information and theories and concepts, even if they have no practical use in reality. I generally stop studying once I have what I need to accomplish my goal.

Fi vs Fe. I'm more personally moved by emotional expressions of beauty and personal appreciation of things, where he is more sensitive to the feelings of others and I really don't have that gift much at all unless its for one or two people. I simply cannot be bothered to tend to the feelings of multiple people.

Se vs Si. I'm more interested in showing off a skill or sensate enjoyment of something. I also view most rules as merely guidelines and rely on my intuition and axiomatic principles to understand if something is acceptable or not. He is more apt to do something properly or by the book, and is more likely to give credence to things like tradition than I am.

So yes, INTJs and INTPs are VASTLY different. There are many things they both enjoy in life and they are going generally the same direction, but the way they process thoughts is like night and day.


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## spiderman616 (May 22, 2013)

whats your gut reaction? do you judge? like u dont want to but you cant help making an initial judgement? or do you develop judgement over time?

I believe our base traits are our gut reactions.


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