# What happens when 8w7 disintegrate?



## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

I think I am 8w7, and I noticed something that counters my current assumptions about disintegration.
How can an 8w7 disintegrate since 8s go to 5 and 5 is the growth direction of 7s?


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

WikiRevolution said:


> I think I am 8w7, and I noticed something that counters my current assumptions about disintegration.
> How can an 8w7 disintegrate since 8s go to 5 and 5 is the growth direction of 7s?


well, traditionally, 8s grow to _2_ rather than 7, but in certain schools of the Enneagram, the connection points from the lines are both present at all levels of health. an unhealthy 8 will have traits of unhealthy 5 and unhealthy 2, a healthy 8 will have traits of healthy 5 and healthy 2. personally, I subscribe more to this school of thought (because I've a number of 7s with high level 1 characteristics, 8s with high level 5 characteristics among other types), but it's a little controversial. 

as for the disintegration process, it's going to vary largely depending on the subtype.
http://personalitycafe.com/type-8-f...exual-eights-according-beatrice-chestnut.html
http://personalitycafe.com/type-8-f...ocial-eights-according-beatrice-chestnut.html
http://personalitycafe.com/type-8-f...servation-8s-according-beatrice-chestnut.html

in general:
*Self Preservation 8:* withdrawn, internally dead, retreat to their "lair" (often to draw up battle plans), often Macchiavellian, most sinister of all Enneagram types and the most similar to a predator (ex: Hannibal Lecter, The Sith, Richard "The Iceman" Kuklinksi, The Hound from Game of Thrones)
*Social 8:* self forgetting (not in a self-sacrificial way, more in the manner of forgetting their own needs and pushing themselves too hard), manipulative, narcissistic, pseudo 2-ish (ex: Bill Cosby, The Governor from The Walking Dead)
*Sexual 8:* impulsive, grandiose, often sadistic, likely to become leaders of cults or gangs (ex: Charles Manson, King Henry VII, Ursula from The Little Mermaid)


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## cir (Oct 4, 2013)

WikiRevolution said:


> I think I am 8w7, and I noticed something that counters my current assumptions about disintegration.
> How can an 8w7 disintegrate since 8s go to 5 and 5 is the growth direction of 7s?


 I'm going to cut through some complications, specifically that people integrate/disintegrate in both directions. I do actually subscribe to this, but right now, I don't think that's important. People in disintegration mode tend to be predictable and not that complicated.

Are you disintegration mode? 
If yes: 8->5 AND 7->1. Alternatively, you draw on the shitty traits of 8, 5, 7, 1, 2.

Are you disintegrating really badly?
If yes: 8->5->7 AND 7->1->4. You are probably suicidal.

Are you integrating?
If yes: 8->2 AND 7->5.

Are you integrating really well?
If yes: then you should be developing all of the other types and display their capacities.


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## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

@Swordsman of Mana I like Mrs Chestnut's description and I think I am Social instinct dominant. I also like the school of enneagram you subscribe to. Even though it might be controversial, it makes more sense to me like that. I am curious where did you get that fine knowledge about enneagram if you don't mind sharing.
@cir I am curious where did you find that interesting statement, that very well integrated ppl would display every type's best qualities.

Thanks both of you, I was really about to throw the baby with the bath water.

For more context, I disintegrated very much last year, now it s getting better though.


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## cir (Oct 4, 2013)

WikiRevolution said:


> @_cir_ I am curious where did you find that interesting statement, that very well integrated ppl would display every type's best qualities.


 This is usually in the "the purpose of the enneagram" section at the beginning of most enneagram books. Here's one:


Riso/Hudson said:


> No matter what type you are, *you have all nine types in you, to some degree*. To explore them all and see them all operating in you is to see the full spectrum of human nature. This awareness will give you far more understanding of and compassion for others, because you will recognize many aspects of their particular habits and reactions in your-self. It is much more difficult to condemn the aggressiveness of Eights or the disguised neediness of Twos, for instance, if we are aware of aggressiveness and neediness in ourselves. If you investigate all nine types in yourself, you will see how interdependent they are - just as the Enneagram symbol represents them.





> Thanks both of you, I was really about to throw the baby with the bath water.
> 
> For more context, I disintegrated very much last year, now it s getting better though.


 That's good


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

@WikiRevolution
another thing to keep in mind is that a lot of 8s see more generic descriptions of 2 and think "lmao! I don't have a drop of that in me :laughing: ", however, in both the healthy and unhealthy range, there are a number of 2-ish characteristics present in 8.

unhealthy range:
- narcissistic (Sexual 8 in particular is very prone to the outbursts of fiery narcissism common in unhealthy 2s of all subtypes)
- pride/grandiosity. unhealthy 8s have gigantic egos (most kept in check in Sp 8s and least, again, in Sx 8s) which prompt them to jump in over their head and stubbornly ignore the signs that they are, in fact, running themselves into the grave. Khal Drogo from Game of Thrones, who little _walks into a sword blade because he doesn't realize it can actually hurt him_ comes to mind as an exaggerated example
- impulsiveness. similar to above
- seductiveness

healthy range:
- protective
- charismatic
- loyal


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## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

Yes but shhh, I don't want to be discovered!
Actually it is very subtle I think the ones under my protection don't even notice it, only external ppl.


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## Despotic Nepotist (Mar 1, 2014)

Here's a question. What is making you believe that you are an 8w7?


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## drmiller100 (Dec 3, 2011)

8/7 says you are MOSTLY 8. 8 disintegrates to 5. 

You become a superficial shitty 5. Or rather I become a shitty 5.

I pulled into my hole, visited few people. researched trivia, built a bunch of weird stuff (my entp coming out), and tried to reconcile unable to FIX things in my life. 

Suicidal? Sure. Productive? not really.

Coming out, in retrospect my 7 showed. Maybe I disentegrated straight to 5. But coming back, I used a bunch of 7 traits to get back to being able to put my will upon parts of the world.


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## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

Dark and Derisive said:


> Here's a question. What is making you believe that you are an 8w7?


Tests results and my behavior. Also, the fact that I didn't want to respond to this first, because your question is just about the premises of mine. Irl, I would've done a much sharper comment on that, but luckily I m just writing and have plenty of time to moderate my answer


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## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

drmiller100 said:


> 8/7 says you are MOSTLY 8. 8 disintegrates to 5.
> 
> You become a superficial shitty 5. Or rather I become a shitty 5.
> 
> ...


Yes, all of that happened to me. I d also add I become really nihilistic and antisocial...

The problem I tried to point out is that how can my core enneatype disintegrate where my dominant wing integrates?


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## drmiller100 (Dec 3, 2011)

WikiRevolution said:


> Yes, all of that happened to me. I d also add I become really nihilistic and antisocial...
> 
> The problem I tried to point out is that how can my core enneatype disintegrate where my dominant wing integrates?


because the CORE is the CORE. Besides, when you disintegrate you are not getting the awesome health attributes of the type you devolve to.


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## TimeWillTell (Jan 14, 2015)

drmiller100 said:


> because the CORE is the CORE. Besides, when you disintegrate you are not getting the awesome health attributes of the type you devolve to.


Alright, confusion cleared!
Thanks everybody!


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