# Explain Si and Te to a ENTP (Ne>Ti>Fe)



## renordw (Mar 19, 2014)

I've consistently scored 0 on my Extroverted Thinking ability, whereas nearly 100 on Extroverted Intuition and Introverted Thinking, clearly ENTP means (Ne>Ti).

Every time I read about Te, it just makes no sense. It's usually something about projecting your thoughts onto the outside world, trying to make sure it conforms to your logic. It's so foreign and bizarre to me, do people really have a first sense that involves "scheduling and contingency planning"? It sounds like a recipe for neurosis.

Similarly, I usually score 0 - 25 on Si, and that's even one supposedly part of my top four. But for the life of me, I can't see how I really do anything other than Ne, Ti, Fe.

Si sounds like you want to make everything in your life the way it was. Things like "I want to live a life like I'm familiar with" is what I usually read about this sense. I cannot possibly understand this, in fact, I do things and go places just for the sole sake of them being different, I will buy a different color, size, style for the hell of it, just for the novelty. Sometimes I let my beard grow out because I'm bored just being one single person, and wish I could be/have alternative players (the way you have alts in World of Warcraft).


Anyhow, if someone could try to subjectivize these senses to an ENTP (Ne>Ti>Fe) like me, I'd be really appreciative of the attempts.

Thanks all.


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## ENTPreneur (Dec 13, 2009)

Te= Pragmatic- it works IRL or crap it. (Ti theorizes/invents/reads Systems/casuality that may or may not work/be totally true : equally interesting. The obsession/need of having it work in IRL is Te)

Si= Accumulated references/experience that ground Ne to "plausible" scenarios instead of equalling unrealistic vs realistic.


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## renordw (Mar 19, 2014)

ENTPreneur said:


> Si= Accumulated references/experience that ground Ne to "plausible" scenarios instead of equalling unrealistic vs realistic.


Can you explain to me then why this is in our top 4 and we just seek out new experiences, and try new things constantly? That's what's seeming to confuse me. 

For me it's like I have no "sense" of what's plausible, I only think through possibilities and just use that. If something is proven plausible, it's almost like there's no purpose to do it. 

So a good example is how I cook. I just throw whatever feels right into the skillet, adding horseradish to dishes just because it feels right, and sometimes people love it. But even then, I'll rarely ever make the same exact thing twice. Are you saying there are people whose first sense is to just do what is "plausible" or "proven" and have no impulse to try or do new things?


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

renordw said:


> Can you explain to me then why this is in our top 4 and we just seek out new experiences, and try new things constantly? That's what's seeming to confuse me.
> 
> For me it's like I have no "sense" of what's plausible, I only think through possibilities and just use that. If something is proven plausible, it's almost like there's no purpose to do it.
> 
> So a good example is how I cook. I just throw whatever feels right into the skillet, adding horseradish to dishes just because it feels right, and sometimes people love it. But even then, I'll rarely ever make the same exact thing twice. Are you saying there are people whose first sense is to just do what is "plausible" or "proven" and have no impulse to try or do new things?


Because you are probably not an ENTP, but instead an ESTP... caught in the classic trap of seeing that Ne is about 'ideas' and seeing that as applying to yourself... but an ESTP is ALL ABOUT IDEAS.

Literally yesterday, my ESTP father in law comes up to me and wants to discuss making a small device (or even a paint!) with a radioactive isotope (or something) that an app could use to track any object (so you could find it if lost).

Such a hair-brained idea from the biggest Trump-eat-your-heart-out ESTP of all time.

Anyway, you are basically telling us you are an Se and not an Si. Big red flag. Your example with cooking is a great example of Se. Dynamics in all things. 

The biggest ENTP I ever met ate out every day, and always got the same thing every time. Why mess with what works? Also, why bother doing anything more? Inferior Si. Sensory things heavily deprioritized and subjectivized. Food is a bother, new food is a risk.


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## pretense (Jan 2, 2013)

arkigos said:


> Such a hair-brained idea from the biggest Trump-eat-your-heart-out ESTP of all time.


That's unfortunate.


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

consciousness said:


> That's unfortunate.


?


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## pretense (Jan 2, 2013)

arkigos said:


> ?


idk, personally, I don't like Donald Trump or anyone like him.


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## Lurianar (Apr 17, 2013)

arkigos said:


> Because you are probably not an ENTP, but instead an ESTP... caught in the classic trap of seeing that Ne is about 'ideas' and seeing that as applying to yourself... but an ESTP is ALL ABOUT IDEAS.
> 
> Literally yesterday, my ESTP father in law comes up to me and wants to discuss making a small device (or even a paint!) with a radioactive isotope (or something) that an app could use to track any object (so you could find it if lost).
> 
> ...


Not sure about this... I mean I usually cook like this, when I feel like trying something new (which happen every once in a while). Then of course I do what you say as most of the time I cook the same thing over and over because its brainless and I don't always feel like putting efforts into something I'll be the only one to enjoy. 

I do agree however that it could be interpreted as Se. But from what I can see from OP, this'd be closer to Ne. In any case... on the matter at hand:

Te is a judging function oriented toward the external world. A judging function is something that doesn't get information. Instead, it "filter" things to be the way they should be and check if that new information fit the general spectrum of the individual. 

For instance, an INTP (Ti dom) would listen to what you have to say but if he didn't agree with, he'd try to correct you and argue with you, trying to understand and debate the point at hand. For him, the truth and the process of the information is more important than the outcome. An ESTJ wouldn't bother arguing with you - instead, he'd probably say "because that's how it should be and if you don't have the right to do it any other way as it is not meant to be this way". As you can see, Te would be more interested in the outcome and the utility of the information. If it's not useful or if it change what is already in place (and has been proved successful), chances are that Te will throw it in the bin. Both are right and wrong, depending on the situation. (Long life to stereotyping!)


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## Pinion (Jul 31, 2013)

renordw said:


> Can you explain to me then why this is in our top 4 and we just seek out new experiences, and try new things constantly? That's what's seeming to confuse me.
> 
> For me it's like I have no "sense" of what's plausible, I only think through possibilities and just use that. If something is proven plausible, it's almost like there's no purpose to do it.
> 
> So a good example is how I cook. I just throw whatever feels right into the skillet, adding horseradish to dishes just because it feels right, and sometimes people love it. But even then, I'll rarely ever make the same exact thing twice. Are you saying there are people whose first sense is to just do what is "plausible" or "proven" and have no impulse to try or do new things?


New things are measured against the expected or typical process and evaluated on how they've played out in the past, how they might play out based on what's immediately observable, according to known information and logic, etc.

I'm lazy. I'll do things the way I've always done them, which is least-effort and most-predictable, unless a new way is shown to be better or I have a need for something not currently covered. 

Your Ne-Ti sounds neurotic. Pop a chill pill, popper.


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

consciousness said:


> idk, personally, I don't like Donald Trump or anyone like him.


I don't think anyone does, to be honest... I just used the reference to over-emphasize the fact that the person I am talking about is not only an ESTP, but one who fits every negative stereotype. Not a clever, intelligent, witty ESTP ... but the opposite of that... and yet STILL is interrupting his Civ 5 game to brainstorm how to utilize isotopes in creative ways. The devil in such a case is very much in the details. 



Lurianar said:


> Not sure about this... I mean I usually cook like this, when I feel like trying something new (which happen every once in a while). Then of course I do what you say as most of the time I cook the same thing over and over because its brainless and I don't always feel like putting efforts into something I'll be the only one to enjoy.
> 
> I do agree however that it could be interpreted as Se. But from what I can see from OP, this'd be closer to Ne. In any case... on the matter at hand:
> 
> ...


Why Ne in this case? I don't think there is a fine line between Ne and Se that requires careful interpretation not to slip across. Se is the dynamics and potential of the physical aspect of all things.... and Ne is the dynamics and potential of the conceptual aspect of all things.

So, something like "I think the way he prepares food is somewhat more Ne than Se" is an absurdity. First, I think all types might get a little creative or whimsical with their food. It seems to succeed more with Se types, but I just assume that is due to their orientation to the sensory. 

I mean, look at the difference just in your post. You jumped right into the conceptual, the meaning, the underlying, etc ENTPs are MORE high-concept than you would be, as a rule. ENTP posts should be, like, "MBTI is crap because it violates Sonso Economics" which is a ramble about some bizarro non-sequitur set of theories about society as an abstract.

I mean, we are talking intuitive DOMINANT when we are talking ENTP. They should and will be constantly and consistently showing that their interaction with the sensory is INFERIOR and and a specific and intense preference for the conceptual aspect of .... anything.


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## Valtire (Jan 1, 2014)

Lurianar said:


> For instance, an INTP (Ti dom) would listen to what you have to say but if he didn't agree with, he'd try to correct you and argue with you, trying to understand and debate the point at hand.


All NTs do this. An NTJ will do it to try and change your mind, but will change their own if your argument is superior. You're right that a Te user won't debate without a useful outcome, but that outcome could be purely for learning purposes or correction.


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## renordw (Mar 19, 2014)

That's so interesting that you'd say that it sounds neurotic. Si sounds neurotic to me in general.


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## Pinion (Jul 31, 2013)

renordw said:


> That's so interesting that you'd say that it sounds neurotic. Si sounds neurotic to me in general.


 I was just poking back and hoping for a fun response. I don't get Ne and am not trying until people stop using words that even they admit don't actually describe it, like "random".


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## renordw (Mar 19, 2014)

@arkigos I think it's really interesting what you've said about ESTP.

I don't think I'm an ESTP in fact, but in my world view I feel ESTPs are the only personality type that are in fact more alpha than we ENTPs are, and it's something I've thought about a lot. And it bugs me. 

If anything you're probably picking up on my tendency to emulate the ESTP type, because of their brazenness and confidence. I'm definitely an ENTP who uses an ESTP mask for dominance and social interactions.

My father is an ENTP, when we talk about anything theoretical, we get visceral verging on anger but not quite. 

Even something as trivial as what sample numbers are useful for statistical significance, it's just in both of our personalities to never let it go. It's just our type to fixate on the differences and just tear the other person apart for them, no matter how tiny they are. 

Other family members will think we hate each other, and sometimes leave the room because of our interaction style and how uncomfortable it makes them. We'll argue for hours and hours, and then realize we'd missed some appointment altogether, so we're always late.


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

renordw said:


> @_arkigos_ I think it's really interesting what you've said about ESTP.
> 
> I don't think I'm an ESTP in fact, but in my world view I feel ESTPs are the only personality type that are in fact more alpha than we ENTPs are, and it's something I've thought about a lot. And it bugs me.
> 
> ...


You sound very very much like an xSTP and your interaction with your father sounds very much like an STP/STP interaction. There is no better word for Se than 'visceral'. The theoretical stuff you are talking about and the adamance of it is in fact Ti. Probably Ti/Ni. 

I know, I have conversations with ESTPs about theoretical things all the time. They do indeed tend get very visceral, and passionate... as do I in my way... due to, I assume inferior Fe. However, that visceral, buckle-down and fight attitude is much much much much more oriented Se/Ni. I promise you this. 

You've said nothing in your posts that would make me even vaguely type you as an ENTP. I get the feeling I'll not convince you of that, however, so I'll say that I've said my peace and leave it at that.


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## renordw (Mar 19, 2014)

Interesting. I appreciate the feedback, it's just not something I'd ever considered before. 


Enviado do meu iPhone usando o Tapatalk


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## Aha (Mar 6, 2014)

From a questionnaire about Te:



> Extraverted Thinking (or Te):
> 
> 1.) I objectively define the scope of problems
> 2.) I set or identify measurable goals for my efforts and the efforts of other people
> ...


I can say that I can be anything of this if there is a responsibility - for example, if I were put in charge of the project; or being in command of people. And you know what - though I feel a bit of anxiety, it is really an energizing process - like going into the unknown. Gets me every time. So, I score high *Te* on those tests. 

But just outside of work - I fly into my unpragmatic Ne-Ti-Ne-Ti-Ne-Ti-Ne Imaginationland

But most noticeable for ENTP must be the Ni-shadow. At least, it is for me - it can pop up on its own just when I am in the Imaginationland

As for Si (I already asked this you guys, thanx), I finally understood the Ne-Si connection. It works as a reference to what was so I can build an instant connection to generate a new idea and/or funny joke. Though, it can cause a bit of paranoia and deja-vu from time to time (under stress).


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## Valtire (Jan 1, 2014)

renordw said:


> Interesting. I appreciate the feedback, it's just not something I'd ever considered before.


I would like to see this queried. I do not like loose ends, nor anything to be accepted without being proven.

renordw would you mind completing a questionnaire from one of the sticky threads here: What's my personality type?


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## Aha (Mar 6, 2014)

Differences Between Ni/Se & Ne/Si | Cognitive Types some interesting info on Ne/Si and Ni/Se connections


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## renordw (Mar 19, 2014)

Aha said:


> As for Si (I already asked this you guys, thanx), I finally understood the Ne-Si connection. It works as a reference to what was so I can build an instant connection to generate a new idea and/or funny joke. Though, it can cause a bit of paranoia and deja-vu from time to time (under stress).


Are you saying then that ENTP is more apt to feel Si as deja vu? Or do all types who experience Si feel deja vu? 

For me, I experience deja vu really frequently, and paranoia as well, especially under stress.

My abilities to put things together and predict the outcome can go haywire when I'm freaking out, and it can seem how you described above.


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