# 4w5- how to not hate body types (8,9,1)?



## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

I'm a 4w5 , Sx/So.

It troubles me greatly that whenever I see my cousin,who I grew up with, and his girlfriend, I get really intimidated and angry.

They are both definitely body types- 
Cousin I think is a 9w1 and girlfriend 8w7 (also a sexual 8, I feel).

They're very confident and in their body, 
and I feel that they look at my emotional complexity as pathetic. I just feel very uneasy and irritated around them, because to get on with them I can't really talk in deep terms the way I do normally. They don't live at that level, and would just give me a blank stare.


Being a sexual 4 , I feel intense jealousy and hatred, as I think they're looking down on me. I don't want to feel like this, as it's my cousin. I will be seen them at a family dinner next week.

To people in the head/heart category, how do you deal with those bodily types? Should I just accept I'll never really yet along with them, and largely ignore them?


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

Added to that they are 6'3 and 5'10 respectively, and I'm 5'8. That feeling of inadequacy I've had as a 4w5 has generally been related to my height and scrawnyness


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## JennyJukes (Jun 29, 2012)

you could start by not blaming others for your own insecurities.


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

My cousin did used to pick on me and be condescending to me in childhood though. Called me fat etc. Girlfriend 6 years ago slapped me condescendingly. I never brought it up with her.


Hmm, I wonder if it was a woman posting what I did, about another woman. Don't know if you'd give that response. So much for equality.


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## Starflakes (Sep 13, 2009)

Edit: Nevermind. I may respond later though.


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## JennyJukes (Jun 29, 2012)

i actually assumed you were a woman so don't pull the sexism/victim card. i've no sympathy for someone who basically says:

"my cousin and his girlfriend are very confident in their body and i _feel/think _like they look down at my emotional complexity. they don't live at my level. should i accept i'll never get along with them". at that point, you had never indicated that they did anything wrong to you, except be _confident, _which apparently isn't fair because y_ou're _not​.


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

@starflakes, it's a shame you deleted your post, I liked it, I was going to respond


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

@jennyjukes

Okay well they have. They've displayed condescending behaviour for a number of years. My cousin has taken the hint that I don't put up with that (unlike when growing up, where I couldn't stand up for myself), and in the last year he's changed accordingly.

The girlfriend though is a very combatative personality.

Being an 8w7, she's very protective of her relationship. My cousin is 6'3, ripped, extremely good looking and making $300k+ a year working in finance. He's 29 years old.

As such, she knows she's doing very well for herself. A few years ago when I was very promiscuous, she would almost try and block my cousin from seeing me, because she thought I'd influence him.

Bottom line is I love my cousin and I get on with him ok when his gf isn't there. But when she is I feel tension, that she partly initiates.

Oh, and I started this thread precisely so I could work through these issues, and not end up starting an argument next week because of "my insecurities".


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## Starflakes (Sep 13, 2009)

rohan89 said:


> @starflakes, it's a shame you deleted your post, I liked it, I was going to respond


First of all, don't feel the need to respond to anyone who tries to correct you harshly. There's a lot of verbal violence in the enneagram community, unfortunately. 

I guess I'll try to sum up what I said earlier....

Your emotional depth and complexity is _not_ pathetic. It's strength. Not weakness. Depth...vulnerability....that stuff's not for sissies. A _lack_ of depth and complexity could be seen as weakness. I'm not saying it is, I'm just saying strength is in the eye of the beholder. 

I think once you feel comfortable in your own skin, in your own quiet emotional strength, you won't care so much if others think you're pathetic. However, if your cousin's girlfriend slapped you then that's abuse and to be honest I'm not quite sure what to tell you about that but I think maybe some boundaries need to be asserted and I think you'd be justified in keeping your distance and/or keeping conversation polite but to a minimum.

That's all I got :/ Hopefully others can help more.

Edit: If you want to spend more time with your cousin you could always have a heart to heart and express that to him. 
Also, question: Were you simply promiscuous or did you cheat on girlfriends also? I'm not necessarily saying that what went down between you and your cousin/his gf was all okay, I don't feel qualified to make that assertion, however, I will say that cheating has broad social ramifications that go beyond just hurting the one you cheated on and making amends may actually involve apologizing to more people than just the one you cheated on.


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## Starflakes (Sep 13, 2009)

ALSO! I forgot to add....you should know....your wording....it's a little inflammatory....the body types might feel like you are prejudiced against them. Others probably won't take kindly to this thread. If there's any way to delete it and do a re-do with different wording, I think that would be best to help you get to most helpful replies....because I think many people won't be able to get past the inflammatory wording.


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

@starflakes 

Thanks for re replying!
Yeh, I think that initial reply from Jenna was unhelpful- I don't know why someone would do that.

I agree that emotional depth is a strength- I'm an aspiring novelist and I'm starting to focus that depth towards the right direction.

To be honest this enneagram stuff is mixed with a lot of run of the mill family issues- ie most of the family are academics so I feel out of place anyway as an artist. Therefore uncomfortable at family events. Maybe I'm projecting that on them as well.

Look the gf isn't a bad person, again she slapped me in a kind of motherly-joking way but it still humiliated me. Being a bodily type though she didn't understand maybe. I really should just let it go as it was 5 years ago.

It's hard for me and my cousin having a heart to heart as we've both had abusive fathers and we both took the brunt of the abuse. So both of us have issues connecting- no doubt still slightly stunted from our upbringings.

And regarding the promiscuity- no I didn't cheat, I just tried to get with pretty much every woman in site, lol.

Thanks for replying though, I think I just needed to talk about these issues out loud. In the context of life it's not a big deal. They both live in another city so I only see them a few times a year. 

I have a lot of emotional maturing to do myself, so I'm not perfect.


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

BTW I would change the title if I could, but my smartphone doesn't allow it on this site


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## charlie.elliot (Jan 22, 2014)

Oh the generalizations in this thread lol

Keep working on yourself, it's all you can do. Some people are hard to get along with but on the inside everyone's a person.


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

charlie.elliot said:


> Oh the generalizations in this thread lol
> 
> Keep working on yourself, it's all you can do. Some people are hard to get along with but on the inside everyone's a person.



You're right lol. Thanks for the advice. I'm aware I sound like a real asshole to the body triad types. Yes I do have lots of insecurities that I need to work on.


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## Dangerose (Sep 30, 2014)

rohan89 said:


> I'm a 4w5 , Sx/So.
> 
> It troubles me greatly that whenever I see my cousin,who I grew up with, and his girlfriend, I get really intimidated and angry.
> 
> ...


My guess is that what you meant is: "I don't know how to connect with these people" or "They do not seem interested in playing on my field" but what this sounds like is: "I feel intimidated by these people and they are not as deep as me so I dislike them", I think this is what people took issue with in your post.


> Being a sexual 4 , I feel intense jealousy and hatred, as I think they're looking down on me. I don't want to feel like this, as it's my cousin. I will be seen them at a family dinner next week.
> 
> To people in the head/heart category, how do you deal with those bodily types? Should I just accept I'll never really yet along with them, and largely ignore them?


Sounds like you've already decided to?

What it sounds to me that you are saying is:

-you are insecure about some things
-your cousins represent the things you are insecure about
-you imagine or rightfully believe that your cousins look down on you
-as a result you feel jealous and angry towards your cousins

So what you need to know is:

-What do you really value? Is physical presence/strength really so important to you? If so, why? What does that really mean for you? What is more important for you?
-How can you embody the things you value? Put yourself in charge of being the person you wish you were. Even just being on the path towards being a better person, a person you will be happy being, will make you less resentful of the people that you perceive as being already there.
-Whose opinion do you really value? At the end of the day, is your cousin's opinion what you're going to stake your self-image on? 

You're in charge of how you feel. As long as you perceive yourself to be a victim, you will perceive an oppressor. Be the protagonist in your own life. If you're so dissatisfied, it means that something is wrong. Start making changes. Fiddle with the dials until something in your life clicks. You sound like you're waiting for the radio to come to you. 

(sorry, couldn't fit any more cliches in there...seriously, don't have a better way to phrase my advice lol)


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## brightflashes (Oct 27, 2015)

It seems to me that your situation is more about your insecurities and what you are assuming people are judging you about and less about actual enneagram types. 

For example, I didn't finish college when I first went. As a 5, this was really hard on me and, because I judged myself for some sort of inadequacy, I assumed others did, too (just because it was such a big deal to me). Sometime in between then and the time I went back to school and got my degree, I realized that other people really aren't judging me that much. After all, I certainly don't think that people who don't go to college are intellectually lesser than others; I know that some people can't afford it, some people follow whatever path their parents did, or whatever other possibilities. Once I stopped judging myself, I no longer thought other people judged me.

As far as body types, it's easy for me not to hate them because they always seem so badass to me. : D


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

@TheNightsQueen

Great reply. 
Yeh, I mean as a sexual 4, I have an envious/competitive energy. I'm very aware if a man has qualities that are very attractive to women , that I don't . In this case, it's height and physical genetics (my cousins are built like warriors, I'm built like a scientist) .

Having said that, I admit I'm speaking as a 4 who is not taking complete action in his life always- ie not integrating towards 1. For example, I have only exercised once in the last two weeks- probably why I feel so weak in my body.

I need to have some principles/non negotiables (like a 1 does)- exercising a certain amount a week should be one. Adequate social activity should be another.


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## brightflashes (Oct 27, 2015)

rohan89 said:


> In this case, it's height and physical genetics (my cousins are built like warriors, I'm built like a scientist).


I meant to comment on this in my first post, but I forgot. I'm a chick who is 5'3" and my favorite height for men is 5'8" or 5'9". I've never been into tall guys and I've never really understood the appeal. As for body type, I'm a bit more interested in the individual.


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## Dangerose (Sep 30, 2014)

brightflashes said:


> I meant to comment on this in my first post, but I forgot. I'm a chick who is 5'3" and my favorite height for men is 5'8" or 5'9". I've never been into tall guys and I've never really understood the appeal. As for body type, I'm a bit more interested in the individual.


agree, I don't need to be constantly craning my head upwards to talk to someone 
(obviously everything mostly depends on personality but as an isolated quality 'tall' is not much of a selling point.


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## rohan89 (Oct 15, 2016)

brightflashes said:


> It seems to me that your situation is more about your insecurities and what you are assuming people are judging you about and less about actual enneagram types.
> 
> For example, I didn't finish college when I first went. As a 5, this was really hard on me and, because I judged myself for some sort of inadequacy, I assumed others did, too (just because it was such a big deal to me). Sometime in between then and the time I went back to school and got my degree, I realized that other people really aren't judging me that much. After all, I certainly don't think that people who don't go to college are intellectually lesser than others; I know that some people can't afford it, some people follow whatever path their parents did, or whatever other possibilities. Once I stopped judging myself, I no longer thought other people judged me.



That's really interesting regarding being a 5 and being insecure about not finishing college the first time.

As a 4w5 who dropped out of law school after a couple of years, I felt the same for a while- although I think my four side eventually won out, with me realizing deep down it's not creative enough for me and my passion.

Yes you are all right that much of this is projection. When I'm not feeling whole, I tend to think it's something inherent about me that's bad ie height.

It's interesting that a healthy 4 integrates to 1- a body triad type. 
The 1 is someone very principled and, I think disciplined with how they live their life.
That's also something my cousins have always naturally had. I think that's what I need to incorporate.


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