# Typing Questionnaire: 5w4 INFJ?



## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hello there, just a type questionnaire, thank you if you do take the time.


*1.) Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.*

Not really, I have some knowledge on mbti and the functions and I think that may influence my answers, although I imagine the idiosyncrasies will show themselves whether I want them to or not. Decent state of mind atm, a bit nostalgic, depressed and anxious.

*2.) What kind of person are you and why?*

I’d say I am a person who wants to be logical and relatable at the same time. I desperately want connection with others and most of my life I thought that there was a step by step way to make that happen, but I soon realised that it’s more fluid than that. I can’t just be prepared for everything on the horizon, I need to accept that I may fail and proceed anyway. Easier said than done though.

I truthfully don’t know why I am this way, it could be genetics or good/bad experience. Probably both.

*3.) What about your personality most distinguishes you from everyone else?*

From my point of view, it’s that I fit in well, but I still don’t have things other people seem to get so easily or at least that they have the skills to get those things so easily. For me, it’s taken so much effort to develop social skills, and it feels like it’s not paid off, but I know I’ve improved and I try to be proud of myself but it is hard when I compare myself to people who are amazing at being social and having strong relationships.

*4.) Do you think there are any differences between how you described yourself and how people actually perceive you? How do you think others would describe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two that you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?’*

I do believe people view me far more favourably than I view myself. I’ve been invited to some parties by people who I like and have gone to most of them. But even still, if someone says they like me and I do believe that they’re being genuine, there’s still a part of me that doubts that. Like how could you like me, I’m so boring and weird?

*5.) How do you react to new situations in your life? Can you describe an event in your life where you were in an unknown situation? How did you deal with it?*

I react usually with a mixture of fear and anticipation. I guess my first date is a good example. I was actually surprising calm and I am generally head strong or I go with the flow when I’m nervous. I think I massively detached or became macho man because I was so nervous.😂

*6.) Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order and chaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?*

I strive for order but my brain is quite chaotic sometimes. Order is something like a serene lake where peace can be found and chaos is a state of panic that I need to leave, but simultaneously desire because it has more character. Well, my room is quite chaotic but I know where everything is and I am too lazy to change it because it doesn’t ‘need’ to be changed.

*7.) You are given a reasonable budget and must buy and prepare a Holiday (Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc.) dinner. What are you thinking? What do you buy? What do you do?*

If I can’t defer it to someone else and I have to do it, I’d do a Halloween Ramadan. A month long feast or just theme where everyone can enjoy whatever they want. I don’t care for themed cupcakes or stuff like that, but I’d just want it to be Halloween for a month and the rest be normal. I feel like holidays are anti-climactic, especially Christmas and Halloween, if they lasted for a month each they’d be great, but they don’t sadly.

*8.) Do you see ideas as revolving around core concepts or as gateways to new ideas?*

I’ll give my example of mbti and enneagram. I first learnt mbti and that became the foundation, but as it lacked answers I moved to enneagram and narrowed it down, I keep trying to narrow it down until I find the perfect system or combination of systems to give the exact answer.

*9.) Do you find yourself to be obsessive about topics? Do you continually divine value from something you already understand or do you move on once you feel you have a fair enough understanding?*

I do obsess about topics, but once I feel like all the usefulness has been gotten I usually discard it, or at least keep it until I can fit it into another puzzle -> Mbti within the enneagram. I always keep a note in my brain about the topic though, like meditation. It may not give results right now, but it has shown to give results later down the line (the potential of the puzzle piece itself). My problem is I want the results now; I always have to have the last piece of cake because someone else might take it if I don’t eat it right now.

*10.) What do you like about travelling and what would you do if you could travel anywhere?*

My lord, I love travelling. As long as I can get someone to do all the booking and all that stuff. I just want to be there and have the thrill, an exciting trip to Rome to see the Vatican or the colosseum, all that history I could be a part of; standing in Pompeii. I’d travel anywhere really, as long as all the menial stuff was done by someone else.

*11.) What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve? Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or are inspired by?*

I desire a life like anyone else’s. I want a wife and kids, I want to go places and enjoy myself. I want to achieve enough so that I can die a happy man. I do this all because I want to have kids and see them grow up, I want to experience the hardships and feel connected to all the people in the past that have gone through the same. I want to be worthy so desperately. If I did these things I could finally prove to myself that I did it, I have conquered my doubt, I’m equal to the people I admired. I want nothing more.

*12.) What type do you think you are? Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to your self-perception, that you would like to be? Why?*

I’m definitely an uncertain and doubtful person I think (;D this sentence cracks me up just reading it.)

Because I feel like I have such a high standard for myself that making a bad mistake will be the end and I won’t recover. I think the person who can bounce back from failure and brush it off and even incorporate that failure and wear it as a badge of honour, I truly admire. I think that’s why I like enfp’s so much. My perception of them is that of a confident, social person who can charm others and can get up after failure and become a better person.


Thank you so much for reading. 🙏


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## Grehoy (May 30, 2014)

You sound like an untidy extravert. You say you want to enjoy yourself and travel and experience the world/life but would prefer others to do the organizing and boring stuff (ST stuff?). 

You say you want to feel as worthy as the people you admire. That might be Fi. You find yourself weird, which might point to intuition.

So I would say ENFP.

Can you paste a couple of anime/tv/movie/game characters that you identify with? Note: not characters you aspire/admire.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Grehoy said:


> You sound like an untidy extravert. You say you want to enjoy yourself and travel and experience the world/life but would prefer others to do the organizing and boring stuff (ST stuff?).
> 
> You say you want to feel as worthy as the people you admire. That might be Fi. You find yourself weird, which might point to intuition.
> 
> ...


I don't know how to post photos but ill write names:

Hikigaya hachiman
Obito Uchiha
Shikamaru
Kabuto
Po from kung fu panda.

I'll think of some more if you need me to.


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## Grehoy (May 30, 2014)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> I don't know how to post photos but ill write names:
> 
> Hikigaya hachiman - ISxP
> Obito Uchiha - ISTP
> ...


So you are ISxP. Your feelings of worthlessness suggests you might be an ISFP.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Grehoy said:


> So you are ISxP. Your feelings of worthlessness suggests you might be an ISFP.


I don't think I agree with all your assessments of their types. Po for example is very extroverted. Kabuto is a schemer and very long term, he seems very INTP or INFJ to me.

Thank you for the posts though.


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

You sound INFJ 459 tritype to me (4 first or 5 first for you, I didn’t catch it.). 

@ai.tran.75 (my best friend). Wrote some “Hoe do you think?” Threads that we’ve been learning from ever since and a few things that we learned have given a few interesting ways to type people that we have never seen before.

1. Would you say the narration in your mind is (A). like a symbolic or pre-language? Almost compressed thoughts? Are there moments of silence? Never silence? (B) Or language, yes, and a single narrator OR if you try to make that narrator silent you realize there is an open tab or an extra (or maybe several extra) other trains of thought running that riseup so that there is never silence? Is there background music going on at all times, like a radio playing?

If there are mixes of this, try to describe it as best you can.

2. If you had to make a choice between (A). You can keep all of your memories and skills but all improvement and new memories stops from now on OR (B) you lose all memories and skills but can make new ones... what would you choose? It’s okay if this takes time to decide and please explain why you decide it.

I think @Ai,tran.75 and I can tell a lot from these two questions.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Llyralen said:


> You sound INFJ 459 tritype to me (4 first or 5 first for you, I didn’t catch it.).
> 
> @ai.tran.75 (my best friend). Wrote some “Hoe do you think?” Threads that we’ve been learning from ever since and a few things that we learned have given a few interesting ways to type people that we have never seen before.
> 
> ...


I'd say for me it's a mixture of both, When I concentrate when I'm interacting with people or solving a difficult question the voice comes forth. however every other moment of my life there is a constant filler, it is almost like primeval soup gushing around in the back of my brain, at around 50% power. I'm a restless person and I think an insomniac because of it, although coffee.

I know that life is a constant replay of itself, but I think even still I cherish my memories too much. picking A is essentially condemning myself to a vegetated state and B to a newborn state. I think I have to go with A, I'm okay with what I've learned so far and although I'll be upset if I can't learn anything new, at least I'll be able to hold on to what I cherish most, however superficial it all is in the grand universe in which we live. I know I haven't talked about the familial ramifications of my choice but I really don't know which one they'd find more shocking.

Thank you for typing me. 🙏


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> I'd say for me it's a mixture of both, When I concentrate when I'm interacting with people or solving a difficult question the voice comes forth. however every other moment of my life there is a constant filler, it is almost like primeval soup gushing around in the back of my brain, at around 50% power. I'm a restless person and I think an insomniac because of it, although coffee.
> 
> I know that life is a constant replay of itself, but I think even still I cherish my memories too much. picking A is essentially condemning myself to a vegetated state and B to a newborn state. I think I have to go with A, I'm okay with what I've learned so far and although I'll be upset if I can't learn anything new, at least I'll be able to hold on to what I cherish most, however superficial it all is in the grand universe in which we live. I know I haven't talked about the familial ramifications of my choice but I really don't know which one they'd find more shocking.
> 
> Thank you for typing me. 🙏


I don’t think we are done typing you at this point. Actually what you just said might throw some doubt on it.

Can you describe the primeval ooze of your brain a bit more? Is there language? Or compressed symbolic stuff? Is there background talk or music?

You answered question 2 very decidedly. It’s very interesting!


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Llyralen said:


> I don’t think we are done typing you at this point. Actually what you just said might throw some doubt on it.
> 
> Can you describe the primeval ooze of your brain a bit more? Is there language? Or compressed symbolic stuff? Is there background talk or music?
> 
> You answered question 2 very decidedly. It’s very interesting!


It's like a baseline for any thought that may appear, I guess that's what consciousness is? There is usually language or concepts, I don't imagine pictures or scenes very often. I called it primeval because it's similar to stem cells just the thought version I guess. I don't really know how else to explain it, but when I actually start to want to concentrate, it's like an instinctual knowledge of the topic i'm thinking of, less of a direct solving of it, if that's even possible. And that ultimately is my goal, even with mbti. I want to get to a point where I feel it's the right answer and it is. my brain just knows it's the right answer, or right word with my writing.


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> It's like a baseline for any thought that may appear, I guess that's what consciousness is? There is usually language or concepts, I don't imagine pictures or scenes very often. I called it primeval because it's similar to stem cells just the thought version I guess. I don't really know how else to explain it, but when I actually start to want to concentrate, it's like an instinctual knowledge of the topic i'm thinking of, less of a direct solving of it, if that's even possible. And that ultimately is my goal, even with mbti. I want to get to a point where I feel it's the right answer and it is. my brain just knows it's the right answer, or right word with my writing.


That sounds like a very very good description of the experience of Ni... one of the best, actually.
But no INFJs or ENFJs have chosen A with the second question before. So you really have learned to derive value from the past more than most NFJs. That’s interesting and might mean that there is more to figure out on you. What types are most of your family members?


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Llyralen said:


> That sounds like a very very good description of the experience of Ni... one of the best, actually.
> But no INFJs or ENFJs have chosen A with the second question before. So you really have learned to derive value from the past more than most NFJs. That’s interesting and might mean that there is more to figure out on you. What types are most of your family members?


Wow, thank you. 

That's really interesting, what are their reasons for not choosing it if I may ask?

my mum and dad are ESFJ and ISTJ respectively. I think mum's a 1w9 and dad's a 6w5. my sister's are esfp and isfp, my brother is definetely an N type, I don't know it exactly though, maybe a shy entj.


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> Wow, thank you.
> 
> That's really interesting, what are their reasons for not choosing it if I may ask?
> 
> my mum and dad are ESFJ and ISTJ respectively. I think mum's a 1w9 and dad's a 6w5. my sister's are esfp and isfp, my brother is definetely an N type, I don't know it exactly though, maybe a shy entj.


Because most NFJs don’t have as much value for the past and value the future much more. NFJs sometimes have to be shown the relevance of the concepts that can be learned from the past, otherwise the past doesn’t seem too relevant for the Ni-Se axis. 

For ENFPs we can review and learn from our own past with Fi and Si fairly frequently, not as frequently as INFPs. And NFPs and NTPs usually like viewing the big picture of history, seeing the relevance of the past in what we are doing now. Fi on its own seems to have a special kind of memory for the things it loves, even with SFPs. 

I’m about to write a thread about Si that you might find interesting.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Llyralen said:


> Because most NFJs don’t have as much value for the past and value the future much more. NFJs sometimes have to be shown the relevance of the concepts that can be learned from the past, otherwise the past doesn’t seem too relevant for the Ni-Se axis.
> 
> For ENFPs we can review and learn from our own past with Fi and Si fairly frequently, not as frequently as INFPs. And NFPs and NTPs usually like viewing the big picture of history, seeing the relevance of the past in what we are doing now. Fi on its own seems to have a special kind of memory for the things it loves, even with SFPs.
> 
> I’m about to write a thread about Si that you might find interesting.


I'd love to read it!

So do you still believe I'm an INFJ? 😂


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> I'd love to read it!
> 
> So do you still believe I'm an INFJ? 😂


No, I’m not sure. You’ll want to do more digging.


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Your answers are quite eerie to read through, you're writing a bunch of things close enough to what I would've said. But I'd say you're more eloquent even.
You're maybe a little more outgoing perhaps with the love of traveling, but even I dream to travel to every country one day. As I get older I feel like I'm missing out and I want to experience the world more and enjoy myself, but it's hard.

For what it's worth, I really have no arguments against INFJ 5w4 for you, even though I thought I might.
I see Ni-Se and Fe-Ti. But of course, you should continue learning and refining your understanding so you can be more sure. It takes a long time to know your type, I still learn new things about it and I've been interested in typology for years.
I actually haven't met many INFJ 5w4s if you are one... Often the ones on here later change their typing to something like INTP or INTJ. (Do you feel these types are relatable too btw?)
Maybe I can ask some further questions though, I'm curious.... You don't have to answer them though if you don't want to.

1. Do you like to solve puzzles? Do you find fascination in what's mysterious? (Do you take interest in the esoteric , paranormal or occult things more specifically?)
2. What is your relationship to anger? How do you deal with it?
3. How do you view traditions?
4. How do you handle romantic relationships? Do you ever feel a need to maintain a certain distance from people, even if you love them? Do you go into fluctuating periods of hot and coldness in relationships?
5. When you're analyzing something, do you often like to mix it in with your creativity?
6. Are you a futurist?
7. How would you define your sense of humor?
8. Do you like making your own symbols or taking existing symbols and giving them a new meaning?
9. How do you view the macabre or dark side of life?
10. What are your favorite types of stories? Any particular genre or elements you enjoy frequently?




Llyralen said:


> That sounds like a very very good description of the experience of Ni... one of the best, actually.
> But no INFJs or ENFJs have chosen A with the second question before. So you really have learned to derive value from the past more than most NFJs. That’s interesting and might mean that there is more to figure out on you. What types are most of your family members?


To be fair, that second question you put forward is rather hard to answer, I wouldn't want to make such a choice really because the past does have importance to Ni (It recognizes past events, themes and cycles to help it understand how this can lead to future events). It's the present that Ni has struggle with.
But I would lean towards B because lost skills can always be regained, and having a fresh slate essentially means a new life. I love the idea of reincarnation and I would never want to be unable to learn anything new. That would be stagnation and I can see that resulting in feeling left behind in society and unable to function normally because I simply couldn't adapt to the future world's skillsets. You'd become like one of those grumpy old people who are out of touch with the time period they're in.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hexigoon said:


> Your answers are quite eerie to read through, you're writing a bunch of things close enough to what I would've said. But I'd say you're more eloquent even.
> You're maybe a little more outgoing perhaps with the love of traveling, but even I dream to travel to every country one day. As I get older I feel like I'm missing out and I want to experience the world more and enjoy myself, but it's hard.
> 
> For what it's worth, I really have no arguments against INFJ 5w4 for you, even though I thought I might.
> ...


I thought I was intp for the longest time but it just didn't really fit with who I am, I don't go out of my way to correct someone for example, even when I know they're wrong.

1. I do like solving puzzles and doing online tests, they're great fun. I guess so, to be honest i think I would if I didn't stigmatise it as being an 'i am very unique' kinda thing. although I am an avid fan of cryptid theories, they're always fun.

2. I have a lot of anger, and I am very critical of other's sometimes, but they don't hear it because I know how they'll view me if i did. I usually express it physically by grinding my teeth or punching things, not people though, never.

3. I don't really care for them, but I can get defensive of traditions I may not hold or completely disagree with if i feel someone is unjustly attacking them. maybe an underdog kinda situation?

4. I could definitely handle them better. I do feel the need to escape because I feel like I may get hurt a lot if I don't protect myself, but I've never left a relationship that way. definitely hot and cold, although I try my hardest to be luke-warm but people always ask me if something's wrong anyway.

5. i draw a lot, and I think I do, I sort of don't think and feel my way through the drawing. I don't know what i'm gonna do until my hand makes it, then I go from there. Although I do have an idea of what I want to draw.

6. I am, but i'm also a very doubtful person. If you mean futurist in the sense of future focused, then yes. I am quite anxious about the future though. although I can get quite nostalgic about the past, even today I was watching a video called, "wake up bro! it's 2007". And i'll say I enjoyed it thoroughly, but also hated it for the sadness it brought me.

7. I'd say sarcastic. But i'm not trying to get the person to laugh, i want to laugh when I see their reaction to my sarcasm. Other than that I find my sense of humour to be quite exclusionary, i'll find trends or memes everyone will find funny really unappealing. I think they're played out and there's nothing funny to it.

8. I don't think i've ever really done this tbh.

9. mainly with dread, I hate feeling depressed and sad. I want to be brain off all the time. It would be so much simpler if I could just turn my brain off and be like all the other people living their simple lives. but I can't.

10. I love horror or thrillers. I love a movie called the witch, it's great. I also love who done it movies, where there's an investigative aspect where you have to find the killer, i love it. Anything with a strong story and great characters with dark aspects, but I hate gore for the sake of gore, it's distasteful to me.


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

Hexigoon said:


> To be fair, that second question you put forward is rather hard to answer, I wouldn't want to make such a choice really because the past does have importance to Ni (It recognizes past events, themes and cycles to help it understand how this can lead to future events). It's the present that Ni has struggle with.
> But I would lean towards B because lost skills can always be regained, and having a fresh slate essentially means a new life. I love the idea of reincarnation and I would never want to be unable to learn anything new. That would be stagnation and I can see that resulting in feeling left behind in society and unable to be function normally because I simply couldn't adapt to the future world's skillsets. You'd become like one of those grumpy old people who are out of touch with the time period they're in.


No, it isn’t an easy question. It took me a week to answer although most NFJs have come up with their answer very quickly— like you did. 

The Ni value of the past is kind of interesting, sometimes you guys have a hard time picking out meanings and patterns from it that seem relevant to a current situation, I guess that’s subjective. But I’ve heard a few INFJs and INTJs say the past is not really a thing until someone shows them or they see a pattern.

Someone will be telling a story and usually the Nis will want to know why I’m asking how old the person was when it happened, but that kind of info to someone on the Si-Ne axis can mean a lot for relevancy...it means a lot about the impact of their story.

The main difference in this question actually is the value for the past but also attachment and there is even more to find out. Your particular answer @Hexigoon, doesn’t include the people who you love. INFP and ENFP have universally (so far) after being given lots of time choose A because we don’t want to lose the relationships we already value— which is a surprise, I’d say, given the nature of Ne. I know all the scenarios I put my mind through to come up with my answer. I haven’t yet asked enough Te folks or Si folks to have a pattern established so I can’t speak to that. I also haven’t asked ENTPs. My ESFJ son’s answer was fascinating— he said it would be too difficult to sever the past from someone, might as well just start completely fresh (which makes no logical sense from the individual’s standpoint, but he was thinking of those who would be trying to do the severing, obviously). For Ti doms they will ask “How old am I in this scenario? If I’m younger than 40 then future, if older than 40 then past.” Basically they take all of the value out of it and make it logical, of course. One INTJ (?) said this same thing, but I think some ENTJs would just say “Nobody can do that, so it doesn’t matter.” Also thinking about the people trying to do it, I bet ESTJs would say the same thinking: how would you do it? Impossible. But NFJs have had the most consistent and swift response including ENFJs.


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> I thought I was intp for the longest time but it just didn't really fit with who I am, I don't go out of my way to correct someone for example, even when I know they're wrong.
> 
> 1. I do like solving puzzles and doing online tests, they're great fun. I guess so, to be honest i think I would if I didn't stigmatise it as being an 'i am very unique' kinda thing. although I am an avid fan of cryptid theories, they're always fun.
> 
> ...


Interesting. Well nothing here really goes against INFJ. I think you probably have strong 9 in you at least...
I think there may be some 6 in there too. But take that with a grain of salt because I really don't have much understanding of 6 because it's probably my weakest enneagram number.

For the sake of comparison:

1. Yeah I get that, I suppose for me I don't think so much about it making me seem special or odd. If something feels like it goes beyond the curtain of reality or has a "hidden knowledge" feel to it then I'll take great interest. (I was really into conspiracy theories when I was younger too, I don't know if you have been?), and there's a certain artistic quality to a bunch of it that I like too like with tarot and sacred geometry, though it's more a means of entertaining concepts than holding any spiritual beliefs.

2. Ah I see, that goes into why I'm seeing Fe and 9 in you. Kinda the same really, I fear and hate losing my temper with people too. I don't want to be anyone's enemy. Yet, unlike you, I'm afraid I can't say I've never done it to people. I have and it takes people by shock. I always feel deep regret for it even if I think I was right and I couldn't stand what the person was doing at the time.
It's rare but in the moment when it happens it feels freeing to just be able to express my own feelings for once without always feeling like I have to keep myself imprisoned. But it's a very short lived feeling and then it's like:









3. Interesting, I don't care much for traditions either beyond those that have good reasoning and keep society together.
I don't think I've ever thought about it in that "underdog" way though that you describe. That is interesting.

4. Lol Same here!

5. True with how I draw too. What sort of stuff do you like to draw the most? (I draw symbols, eyes and faces a lot).
Do you do much journaling at all? When I make notes I draw pictures and symbols to help me visualize information, so that's kinda what I mean with merging analysis with creativity. ^-^

6) Well, when I say futurist, I guess I mean more specifically people who like to try and predict the future of global society based on technological and social trends and the potential of where things are headed. People like Elon Musk or Ray Kurzweil for instance. They seem to have a clear vision of how they see the future, not just in the personal sense but a global one. Musk is more pessimistic sounding though when I hear him talk about AI, Kurzweil is a lot more optimistic about it.
I surprisingly keep quite an optimistic view about the future myself but I can get very anxious too; The past is.... yeah, kinda how you describe it. Makes me upset.

7) Mhm, I think that's more or less the same with me too. I like getting reactions. Meme humor is hit or miss like anything really. I don't dislike memes but when people repeat the same jokes that can get annoying.

8) Oh, I just ask because I make and utilize symbology very often.

9) I see, I wonder if that's a 6 thing. I ask because 5s are commonly into macabre / dark subject matter.

10) Aye, I see, so you do like dark mysteries.
I don't like "torture porn" gorefest films much myself (although I did love Braindead strangely enough and that has the most gore I've ever seen in a movie - but that movie was ridiculously comedic). It'd take a lot for me to prepare and sit down to watch something I know has torture or rape in it though. Though if I can dull my feelings down a bit then I can maybe get through it and try to see what the movie is trying to get at.
For horror it's the jumpscares I hate. A director has to be pretty smart about them otherwise it feels cheap. I love the more slow, lingering, atmospheric horrors like The Shining or Ringu. .





Llyralen said:


> No, it isn’t an easy question. It took me a week to answer although most NFJs have come up with their answer very quickly— like you did.
> 
> The Ni value of the past is kind of interesting, sometimes you guys have a hard time picking out meanings and patterns from it that seem relevant to a current situation, I guess that’s subjective. But I’ve heard a few INFJs and INTJs say the past is not really a thing until someone shows them or they see a pattern.
> 
> ...


You're right, I didn't really think about the people I have some degree of closeness to. That feels a little coldhearted of me actually, but I suppose I imagine it wouldn't affect them much at all if I lost my memories... I could reconnect with them again as long as we're both alive and live close by.
Perhaps it's sad to say but even though I do feel what I consider as "love" for people like my family, I rarely feel what you'd call intimate closeness to anyone. There's a certain barrier between us. I find life is mostly a long path of loneliness because ultimately I don't think the vast majority of people ever really know me to any depth at all, and they'd probably hate me if they did so I don't let them in. They can only see some mask, and they may very well be doing the same thing too. We just know each other by our masks. So if the mask breaks a replacement can be made.

I see! This is interesting, I probably would ask why you'd want to know the specific age too. For me, I think of age mostly in the way of "arcs"/ "eras" rather than specific years.
I can't really remember much of what happened year from year, not good with dates, but I do remember when stuff happened within a story arc like the "childhood" arc, my "highschool" arc, my "college" arc, etc. Again, it's kinda like understanding the past through cycles.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hexigoon said:


> Interesting. Well nothing here really goes against INFJ. I think you probably have strong 9 in you at least...
> I think there may be some 6 in there too. But take that with a grain of salt because I really don't have much understanding of 6 because it's probably my weakest enneagram number.
> 
> For the sake of comparison:
> ...


well, I'm really enjoying this i'm not going to lie. You are the first person who I've met who is EXACTLY like me. Bruh.

when I've taken enneagram tests, like katherine fauvre, I got 974. But I knew while taking the test the cards that had 'you are very logical' on them, i shied away from. I don't want to appear arrogant, even to myself when I'm alone. I could have a 6 in me, but I feel that my fears definitely fall closer to failing or being incompetent, especially in the social and romantic realm. 

1) I do like having knowledge or understanding of something before everyone else, I remember telling my mum that there was a virus that escaped in china, this was jan 2020. I was the first of my friends to know about it too. I do like conspiracy theories a lot, I enjoy channels like bedtime stories and bob gymlan. the latter is bigfoot guy and the former is everything else, really. although I do take both with a huge grain of salt. Very interesting, do you hold any spiritual beliefs? 

2) ahh interesting. Don't get me wrong, I've done the same, I just meant I've never assaulted anyone. 😂 I remember yelling at my boss, after he was being a dick to me. He got all snarky about my work and I said, then how about you do it then?! He was shocked, he treated me like shit after that, so I do feel deep regret because I know how petty some people are. I feel you hagrid.

3) I'll give another example. My brother hates Christians, and I think they're just like everyone else. So when he attacks Christians, I try to tell him that I think that there are better ways to convince people of your point of view. but I used to be the same as him. 

4) We can do it, it'll get better. lol jinx.

5) I like drawing faces, with a huge emphasis on the eyes, they make the character. I also like drawing landscapes, especially ones that reflect my mood (I drew a moon lit swamp last with a witch's hut in the middle of the frame). I want to draw a city with vines all through it, like the last of us. I love, temperate climates and ferns, so the last of us 2 art is pretty much dead on with what I want to draw next. I did draw a surrealism picture once, but that was my first drawing.

6) I think we're in the western roman empire around 350 ad atm. that's my view on our civilisation. i sort of hope for a reason to break the standard ways of life and we have to go to a free-er lifestyle. But without a health care system of modern day, i'd imagine i'd drop dead from an infection at 35. but there would be less of a bureaucratic strangle of every moment of our lives.

7) I agree with your explanation more than mine.

8) Interesting, I was looking at your profile and a weird word came up, starting with a C. it was about creating language deliberately. That does sound really interesting.

9) interesting, well I guess I enjoy sad and nostalgic music, even though I know it will get me sad. I wish I could enjoy them just as much without it affecting my mood so much.

10) indeed. Yes when gore is done in a funny way, it's less overwhelming for me. But the saw movies are a hard pass, even the thought of something like that happening to someone freaks me out. it's a similar feeling to your parents yelling at each other and you cover your ears. Yeah I understand, I just think it's unnecessary at that point, but I know reality can be as bad as those movies. I hate jump scares too, they're cheap. at least try to get me to feel scared in an interesting way. the witch movie I talked about is exactly like that. a slow build and your constantly tense, I love it.


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> well, I'm really enjoying this i'm not going to lie. You are the first person who I've met who is EXACTLY like me. Bruh.
> 
> when I've taken enneagram tests, like katherine fauvre, I got 974. But I knew while taking the test the cards that had 'you are very logical' on them, i shied away from. I don't want to appear arrogant, even to myself when I'm alone. I could have a 6 in me, but I feel that my fears definitely fall closer to failing or being incompetent, especially in the social and romantic realm.
> 
> ...


 Haha well hopefully we're not too similar otherwise I'd feel unfortunate for you. Lol jk I'm actually quite wow'd to find someone like me. I get INFJ males are pretty uncommon, even more so if you add in certain enneagram variables like 5w4. But hey it's nice to meet you.

Same here, I begin to doubt my own intelligence if I'm asked how logical I am vs emotional in tests.
Hey maybe 5w6 is possible, but again I'm not all that sure about 6.

1. That sounds cool, you're a perceptive one! I forget when I was made aware of the virus... BTW How has lock-down been for you? It actually never bothered me.
I'll have to check those youtube vids out too, it sounds like something I'd enjoy. Mm, well spirituality is... I don't know really... I guess I'm always curious about such things like astral projection, tantric meditation and lucid dreaming - weird stuff the mind can potentially do, oh and I like ghosts and stuff of that nature. That stuff I find endlessly fascinating but I don't know if I believe in anything religious like that. Fortunately I don't let my skepticism get in the way of fun, I'll still play around with spiritual concepts at least. Do you?

2. Oh that's good then! Now I understand, yeah I can't remember physically assaulting anyone out of anger either. I smashed a small mirror once though. 😔 Yeah it sucks how that happens, I don't want to feel regret over every display of anger, some people I feel deserved it and they themselves never really show remorse if they throw anger at you.

3. Ahh, I get that now. Yeah I would agree that is usually counter-productive to changing anyone's mind if that's the desired result.

4. xD Haha well, It's a bit of a pain to go through but experience does help at least. Have you gone on many dates in the past?

5. I like to try to add expressiveness to the faces.too. I like landscapes too, although I'd paint them instead (more so digitally). You should draw that then for sure and show it off! lol I bet you're good. I wish I had got to play the first game of LoU, I heard such good things, but wasn't that a Playstation exclusive?

6. That's pretty grim. Haha! Well I do at least agree there are problems with the government and bureaucracy (my big issue is usually big corporate money in politics), I think there are methods of cutting back on that without needing to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

8): Oh conlanging? Yeah, it's ah, an interesting hobby to get into if that intrigues you. I don't know why other than I'm crazy but I have this strange desire to have my own secret language only certain few know how to decipher and I'd use it throughout my fiction and videos primarily, in part to tease and sneak things by the audience. lol

9. I understand the feeling, you have to be in the right frame of mind for certain pieces of art. ^^ If one is in a happy / norrmal mood then you don't really want to go bringing yourself down like that. I'd like to treasure the moments of happiness I get to have, life or the internet finds a way to kill them.

10. Yeah, that and Hostel. I think I'm gonna have to watch the first Saw movie though at least because it's in my "501 Must-See Movies" book.
Yeah! I was trying to remember if there ever was a jumpscare I thought improved the experience. Mm but I got nothing.
Really? I'm gonna have to watch the Witch then.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hexigoon said:


> Haha well hopefully we're not too similar otherwise I'd feel unfortunate for you. Lol jk I'm actually quite wow'd to find someone like me. I get INFJ males are pretty uncommon, even more so if you add in certain enneagram variables like 5w4. But hey it's nice to meet you.
> 
> Same here, I begin to doubt my own intelligence if I'm asked how logical I am vs emotional in tests.
> Hey maybe 5w6 is possible, but again I'm not all that sure about 6.
> ...


don't worry man, I know exactly what you mean. Yeah, I always doubted i'd be an INFJ, there was no way in hell, I thought. likewise 

1) ohh please don't flatter me, i'm already arrogant enough. 😊 Yeah it's been pretty quiet where I'm at, I have had to get the rona test twice now, but both came back negative so that's something. absolutely, but there's no obligation bro, don't watch em if you don't feel like it, no pressure. I'm pretty similar, I love the thought of there being ghosts and all that, all my friends have had paranormal experiences and i'm here waiting for mine. yeah I've never been religious but I do act as if karma is real, just in case.

2) Yeah if i'm justified with my anger I don't feel any guilt. But I think I have pretty good control over my anger thankfully.

3) Ye, I didn't mean to be preachy if it came off like that, I just honestly believe that the moment you attack someone's belief's is when reason leaves.

4) absolutely! 3 so far. I want to date more but I feel like half the time they just pity me, so I don't bother them. 

5) cool! do you use ms paint or do you have an app or something? I wouldn't mind trying it out. I want to send you a picture if that's okay. I drew it once I finished the last of us actually. It's not fantastic, and now I can see issues with shading and much more. But i'm proud of it anyway. it is an amazing experience and if you do play it i recommend going in blind, it'll hit so much harder. yeah unfortunately, actually I bought my ps 4 just for the last of us.

6) Yeah I agree completely. I know humans are greedy by nature, but we should at least try to make it so people don't do things for money. but I feel like I'll have as much impact on that as a wet fart.

8) lol, that does sound pretty fun actually. I think shakespeare did that as well. I'll look it up some more.

9) But i also think that everytime I experience sadness or happiness I become a better person, or develop in some way. I still hate being sad though.

10) all I can say is good luck with saw lol. I'm probably just a wuss though I think you'll be fine. I cant either. Tis a great movie.

Thank you for helping me btw. Very helpful to have someone to bounce off. 🙏


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Ellie from the last of us.


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## Llyralen (Sep 4, 2017)

[QUOTE="Hexigoon, post: 44168795, member: ] 
You're right, I didn't really think about the people I have some degree of closeness to. That feels a little coldhearted of me actually, but I suppose I imagine it wouldn't affect them much at all if I lost my memories... I could reconnect with them again as long as we're both alive and live close by.
Perhaps it's sad to say but even though I do feel what I consider as "love" for people like my family, I rarely feel what you'd call intimate closeness to anyone. There's a certain barrier between us. I find life is mostly a long path of loneliness because ultimately I don't think the vast majority of people ever really know me to any depth at all, and they'd probably hate me if they did so I don't let them in. They can only see some mask, and they may very well be doing the same thing too. We just know each other by our masks. So if the mask breaks a replacement can be made.

I see! This is interesting, I probably would ask why you'd want to know the specific age too. For me, I think of age mostly in the way of "arcs"/ "eras" rather than specific years.
I can't really remember much of what happened year from year, not good with dates, but I do remember when stuff happened within a story arc like the "childhood" arc, my "highschool" arc, my "college" arc, etc. Again, it's kinda like understanding the past through cycles.
[/QUOTE]

@Hexigoon you answered like 99.9% of NFJs. Normal thought processes for you guys and how your brains work as far as I’ve seen so far.

@Angry-Spaghetti ‘a answer was different than most and in my opinion needs exploring to figure out the things that angry-spaghetti has either learned form others who he cares about (sometimes Ni (probably other functions too?) can put on a certain “channel” of people who they are close to. Or a value for the past is something learned from a part of their own wisdom at this time. But needs exploring anyway for me as kind of a casual researcher.


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## Fru2 (Aug 21, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> I think we're in the western roman empire around 350 ad atm. that's my view on our civilisation. i sort of hope for a reason to break the standard ways of life and we have to go to a free-er lifestyle. But without a health care system of modern day, i'd imagine i'd drop dead from an infection at 35. but there would be less of a bureaucratic strangle of every moment of our lives.


You're a gamma most probably.


> I have a lot of anger, and I am very critical of other's sometimes, but they don't hear it because I know how they'll view me if i did. I usually express it physically by grinding my teeth or punching things, not people though, never.


My first hunch is ISFP. INFJs can lash out at people in certain moments even to the point of physical violence, it takes a bit of consciousness in the Se department to keep oneself under control.


> I don't really care for them, but I can get defensive of traditions I may not hold or completely disagree with if i feel someone is unjustly attacking them. maybe an underdog kinda situation?


Fi


> i draw a lot, and I think I do, I sort of don't think and feel my way through the drawing. I don't know what i'm gonna do until my hand makes it, then I go from there. Although I do have an idea of what I want to draw.


I like drawing as well, I sometimes do the same as you, just go with the flow of it and see what comes up, but I noticed that a painting means much more to me when I base it off of a vision I've had and I get the urge to paint it. The INXJs in my life are a lot different from that, they'll have to know exactly what they're going to make before they make it, and some of them will get attached to the image in their mind so much that they wouldn't want to ruin it by painting it in a less than ideal way, so you see how they can be insecure about their Se. I don't see that coming from you, you seem pretty secure in your ability to Se. I would say ISXP because you show both Se and Ni traits, but I'd go with higher Se.


> I am, but i'm also a very doubtful person. If you mean futurist in the sense of future focused, then yes. I am quite anxious about the future though. although I can get quite nostalgic about the past, even today I was watching a video called, "wake up bro! it's 2007". And i'll say I enjoyed it thoroughly, but also hated it for the sadness it brought me.


Fi, Se, Ni, Te


> mainly with dread, I hate feeling depressed and sad. I want to be brain off all the time. It would be so much simpler if I could just turn my brain off and be like all the other people living their simple lives. but I can't.


Fi dom


> Yeah if i'm justified with my anger I don't feel any guilt. But I think I have pretty good control over my anger thankfully.


Good control over your anger crosses out INFJ for you imo. 


> I just honestly believe that the moment you attack someone's belief's is when reason leaves.





> absolutely! 3 so far. I want to date more but I feel like half the time they just pity me, so I don't bother them.





> I know humans are greedy by nature, but we should at least try to make it so people don't do things for money.





> But i also think that everytime I experience sadness or happiness I become a better person, or develop in some way. I still hate being sad though.


You're so ISFP it's not even funny. I fully get you on the third one btw it's a big goal of mine. Very Gamma(SFP, NTJ), not at all Beta(Maybe some ESTPs could relate a bit, but they mostly stay stuck in the time axis changing and reorganizing things for the sake of not leaving any kind of opening for guilt to manifest while Gammas are more space axis oriented looking at what they could do and create that will be of worth).

I know you're thinking to yourself "hold on a minute, where did this guy come from so suddenly" Yeah I'm kinda crashing the party here but that's what I do 🤷‍♂️


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Fru2 said:


> You're a gamma most probably.
> 
> My first hunch is ISFP. INFJs can lash out at people in certain moments even to the point of physical violence, it takes a bit of consciousness in the Se department to keep oneself under control.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this. I actually think I agree with you. I don't know what I feel a lot of the time. I thought I was infp, then I jumped to infj. But this does seem to fit a bit better. I feel like I'm less patient than infj's. I want to jump to a conclusion, even if it's not well thought out. Where as infj's seem to be very flexible and understanding.

With this understanding of mbti, what do you think my enneagram is? I'm really curious and I have a feeling it's probably 49X or 4X9


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> don't worry man, I know exactly what you mean. Yeah, I always doubted i'd be an INFJ, there was no way in hell, I thought. likewise
> 
> 1) ohh please don't flatter me, i'm already arrogant enough. 😊 Yeah it's been pretty quiet where I'm at, I have had to get the rona test twice now, but both came back negative so that's something. absolutely, but there's no obligation bro, don't watch em if you don't feel like it, no pressure. I'm pretty similar, I love the thought of there being ghosts and all that, all my friends have had paranormal experiences and i'm here waiting for mine. yeah I've never been religious but I do act as if karma is real, just in case.
> 
> ...


No problem. Keep searching and finding out more. You'll find the answers eventually.

1. Lol I don't mean to, but that's good, I took the rona test at least once (negative too). Have you been offered vaccination yet? I haven't. Yeah, karma conceptually sounds appealing, but in practice I can imagine it might make everyone very anxious and too afraid to act. lol

2. I see then! I'd like to think I have good control of my anger too, the few people who have been on the bad end of me might say bullshit to that, but I repress a lot of it.

3. No no, you didn't come off like that to me, that can be true if things are said purely out of spite rather than good reasoning.

4. Really? Why do you think they pity you?

5. Oh no, I use Clip Studio Paint usually. It's a really good program for digtal art (although you have to buy it). That is a good start with your drawing, you should finish it with the hair. Keep at it! ^^ Aah, well I'll try to play it one day, I don't know much about it beyond it being a horror game, maybe they'll bring out a PC port (I usually play PC with video games).

6. People can be greedy for sure, but then they do live within a world of scarcity. One day I think money will be obsolete though, there won't be much of any point to the stuff.

8. He did? Wow, I didn't know that. I kinda took inspiration from other writers, notably Tolkien. But also from the idea of secret societies and alchemists writing their stuff in coded language. lol

9. It can make you a better person to be in touch with your own emotions for sure. I don't know if I dislike being sad. I mean, I understand the value of sadness intellectually-speaking (without sadness, could there be happiness?). But I really don't know if what I experience sometimes is truly sadness or just numbness, apathy or something else entirely. Maybe longing.

10. Well I'm not in any rush to watch it because I have a giant list of other movies to watch first. Haha Saw is kinda spoiled on me anyway since I actually know what the twist at the end is.


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## Fru2 (Aug 21, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> Thank you for this. I actually think I agree with you. I don't know what I feel a lot of the time. I thought I was infp, then I jumped to infj. But this does seem to fit a bit better. I feel like I'm less patient than infj's. I want to jump to a conclusion, even if it's not well thought out. Where as infj's seem to be very flexible and understanding.
> 
> With this understanding of mbti, what do you think my enneagram is? I'm really curious and I have a feeling it's probably 49X or 4X9


No problem, tbh I find it easier to type through MBTI than Enneagram, it feels more intuitive to me since I can get easily in others headspace but I find that understanding peoples personal inner drive is much more of a Fi/Fe gift. I've reread your opening post as a refresher and decided it might be a good idea to pick one of the answers and analyze it, potentially discovering your Enneagram in the process:


> I’d say I am a person who wants to be logical and relatable at the same time. I desperately want connection with others and most of my life I thought that there was a step by step way to make that happen, but I soon realised that it’s more fluid than that. I can’t just be prepared for everything on the horizon, I need to accept that I may fail and proceed anyway. Easier said than done though.


What I see in this answer is an individual whose main focus is from a rational standpoint, all of the sentences showcase a movement from what is naturally you towards what your main focus of growth is. The level of self knowledge is pretty darn good, shows a great use of Fi, and your aspirations and growth seems to be in the direction of Se.
I really like this site since it indicates the points on which each type should work on in order to have a happier and more fulfilling life:


https://www.personalitypage.com/html/ISFP_per.html



As for Enneagram, I thought I might have some clue but I'm left only with questions, so I think the best way to go is to present you with the subtype descriptions of 4s and 9s:
_- Self-Preservation Fours_ are stoic, strong, and long-suffering—emotionally sensitive on the inside, they often don’t communicate their darker feelings to others. While they feel things deeply, and may feel sad inside, they often have a sunny, upbeat exterior, as they often received the message early on that their caretakers couldn’t handle their pain or darker emotions. They may feel anxious inside, but they tough things out and have a high tolerance for frustration.
_- Social Fours_ suffer. They focus on their own emotions and the underlying emotional tone of whatever situation they are in. They compare themselves to others and tend to see themselves as less worthy or lacking in some way. They are more emotionally sensitive than most other types, they wear their feelings on their sleeve, and connect to themselves through the authenticity of their emotional truth.
_- One-to-One Fours_ are more assertive and competitive. These Fours are not afraid to ask for what they need or complain when they don’t get it. They can appear aggressive to others, and they strive to be the best.
_- Self-Preservation Nines_ focus on finding comfort in familiar routines and the satisfaction of their physical needs. Whether through eating, sleeping, reading, or doing crossword puzzles, SP Nines tend to lose themselves in whatever activities help them feel grounded and comfortable.
_- Social Nines_ focus on working hard to support the groups they are a part of as a way of seeking a sense of comfort in belonging. Congenial people who like to feel a part of things, Social Nines tend to be light-hearted and fun, and expend a lot of effort in doing what it takes to be admitted to and supportive of the group or community.
_- One-to-One Nines_ tend to merge with the agenda and attitudes of important others in their lives. Sweet, gentle, and less assertive than other types, this relationship-oriented Nine may take on the feelings and opinions of the people they are close to without realizing it.

Sounds to me like 9 So or 4 So might fit you based on your description of yourself, though you will surely know better. Here's the rest:








Instinctual Subtype Dimensions of the Enneagram — Beatrice Chestnut







www.beatricechestnut.com


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Fru2 said:


> No problem, tbh I find it easier to type through MBTI than Enneagram, it feels more intuitive to me since I can get easily in others headspace but I find that understanding peoples personal inner drive is much more of a Fi/Fe gift. I've reread your opening post as a refresher and decided it might be a good idea to pick one of the answers and analyze it, potentially discovering your Enneagram in the process:
> 
> What I see in this answer is an individual whose main focus is from a rational standpoint, all of the sentences showcase a movement from what is naturally you towards what your main focus of growth is. The level of self knowledge is pretty darn good, shows a great use of Fi, and your aspirations and growth seems to be in the direction of Se.
> I really like this site since it indicates the points on which each type should work on in order to have a happier and more fulfilling life:
> ...


Thank you! This is exceptionally helpful. I would say so 4. Reading it was a bit too close to home. Other than that I'd say sx 9, but that doesn't fit as well.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hexigoon said:


> No problem. Keep searching and finding out more. You'll find the answers eventually.
> 
> 1. Lol I don't mean to, but that's good, I took the rona test at least once (negative too). Have you been offered vaccination yet? I haven't. Yeah, karma conceptually sounds appealing, but in practice I can imagine it might make everyone very anxious and too afraid to act. lol
> 
> ...


1. I think I can get it near me, but I haven't had the time. I never thought of karma that way, I guess I have a relaxed version I follow; just treat everyone kindly.

2. Interesting 

3. Thank you, I'll have to remember that for the future. 😊

4. Well I think they do because I'm just a sad case that they want to take care of. But I want to be treated like everyone else. But I can't blame them, i get what I give. 

5. I've tabbed clip studio art, thanks for the recommendation. I'm not really confident enough to finish it, I will draw her again one day when I get the passion. There might be a pc port now, but sony is pretty uptight about those things.

6. God I hope so, that sounds like the perfect world. I just hope humans will be empathetic enough to get there. 

8. Yes, he'd make fun of the upper classes in lower class speech. You must like full metal alchemist. 😄

9. I guess I hate being sad because I feel I can't really express it. I cry a lot when I'm alone, and I feel a lot of shame if I were to go to someone for help. I feel that if I can't help myself, then I don't deserve to be healed. I also don't want to bother others with my problems. I feel all those emotions, I hope you learn to decipher your emotions in the future.

10. I think I'll have to write one of those up, I just don't think I have the attention span. 

Thank you so much for the help. 🙏


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> 1. I think I can get it near me, but I haven't had the time. I never thought of karma that way, I guess I have a relaxed version I follow; just treat everyone kindly.
> 
> 2. Interesting
> 
> ...


Haha well that is a preferable way of looking at karma at least. ^^ No problem of course.

I see, getting the pity treatment sucks. It must make dating feel less fun if you feel that's how your dates view you. Maybe it's just a matter of confidence? I don't think I've experienced that feeling that they pity me. (although I'm not exactly confident either). But I can't imagine people dating me even out of pity. If they do, they must be a little weird. lol 😅

No problem btw, it's my favorite art program for sure and I've used stuff like Photoshop and what not. You should save that picture at least and when you get better --- which I'm sure you will if you keep at it --- you should try to redraw it and you'll see how far you've come.  Oh yeah I bet they are.... Them and EA's business practices are... grrrr.

I hope for that world too myself, but I'm guessing money will still be around for some time to come. Earth ain't quite at Star Trek's level yet. So atleast for the mean time I want money to go towards things of actual benefit to society's people.

Ah! Hey good intuition! You're right, I do like FMA! You've watched it? Brotherhood is my favorite anime, next to Hunter x Hunter (speaking of which, that actually has its own conlang).

I can understand that, it can really suck when you feel you can't talk to anyone about what troubles you. Thank you though! I mean, I cry sometimes too, although when I do it's usually because of taking in other people's emotions or out of sheer exhaustion of trying to hold myself together for ages.

Oh, you have trouble with patience? If so you could just start small, make a little word document and add a few titles to the list every day or so and then that way it won't cut into your attention span too much, you'd have a good selection by the end of a month.

No worries though! I hope talking with me helped somewhat at least. You feel ISFP 4w5 speaks stronger to you?


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## Fru2 (Aug 21, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> Thank you! This is exceptionally helpful. I would say so 4. Reading it was a bit too close to home. Other than that I'd say sx 9, but that doesn't fit as well.


You're welcome! I'll leave a small quote from Jung here about the introverted judger, he's truly the best source if you want to understand the functions:


> Almost more even than the extraverted is the introverted type subject to misunderstanding: not so much because the extravert is a more merciless or critical adversary, than he himself can easily be, but because the style of the epoch in which he himself participates is against him. Not in relation to the extraverted type, but as against our general accidental world-philosophy, he finds himself in the minority, not of course numerically, but from the evidence of his own feeling. In so far as he is a convinced participator in the general style, he undermines his own foundations, since the present style, with its almost exclusive acknowledgment of the visible and the tangible, is opposed to his principle. Because of its invisibility, he is obliged to depreciate the subjective factor, and to force himself to join in the extraverted overvaluation of the object. He himself sets the subjective factor at too low a value, and his feelings of inferiority are his chastisement for this sin. Little wonder, therefore, that it is precisely our epoch, and particularly those movements which are somewhat ahead of the time, that reveal the subjective factor in every kind of exaggerated, crude and grotesque form of expression. I refer to the art of the present day.
> 
> The undervaluation of his own principle makes the introvert egotistical, and forces upon him the psychology of the oppressed. The more egotistical he becomes, the stronger his impression grows that these others, who are apparently able, without qualms, to conform with the present style, are the oppressors against whom he must guard and [p. 498] protect himself. He does not usually perceive that he commits his capital mistake in not depending upon the subjective factor with that same loyalty and devotion with which the extravert follows the object By the undervaluation of his own principle, his penchant towards egoism becomes unavoidable, which, of course, richly deserves the prejudice of the extravert. Were he only to remain true to his own principle, the judment of 'egoist' would be radically false; for the justification of his attitude would be established by its general efficacy, and all misunderstandings dissipated.





Classics in the History of Psychology -- Jung (1921/1923) Chapter 10


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hexigoon said:


> Haha well that is a preferable way of looking at karma at least. ^^ No problem of course.
> 
> I see, getting the pity treatment sucks. It must make dating feel less fun if you feel that's how your dates view you. Maybe it's just a matter of confidence? I don't think I've experienced that feeling that they pity me. (although I'm not exactly confident either). But I can't imagine people dating me even out of pity. If they do, they must be a little weird. lol 😅
> 
> ...


Hey.

Unfortunately I could never get into fma, but i love HxH. I think my favourite character has to be Hisoka. He's a perfect villain.

ISFP 4w5 does I think. I was still a bit doubtful of INFJ because it seemed too rare for me. Reading up on ISFP's I relate alot. I chose 4w5 because it fits better, I may still have a 5, but I think I'm either 4w5 or 9w1. If I am 9w1 then I think i'd be sx. If you had to guess what would you say my enneagram is? It's always good to have a new perspective, I did consider ISFP at one point but I must've convinced myself otherwise.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Fru2 said:


> You're welcome! I'll leave a small quote from Jung here about the introverted judger, he's truly the best source if you want to understand the functions:
> 
> 
> 
> Classics in the History of Psychology -- Jung (1921/1923) Chapter 10


That's amazing. I feel like I went to the past. A book that's almost a century old, dissected my personality completely. The amount of insight Carl Jung had is astonishing, a 150 year old man who has never met me, knows more about my personality than the mind living in this skin suit.

thank you, I didn't realise how egotistical I was, that was very refreshing. Sometimes it's nice to have someone who can just tell you the answers.


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## Fru2 (Aug 21, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> That's amazing. I feel like I went to the past. A book that's almost a century old, dissected my personality completely. The amount of insight Carl Jung had is astonishing, a 150 year old man who has never met me, knows more about my personality than the mind living in this skin suit.
> 
> thank you, I didn't realise how egotistical I was, that was very refreshing. Sometimes it's nice to have someone who can just tell you the answers.


I really appreciate your impression of it, it's something I thought myself too but just couldn't ever put in such accurate wording. Carl Jung is overly underestimated, and you can see how most of the MBTI community just downplays him just because of their failure to recognize the essence of his words.
It's a pleasure, keep being you!


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> Hey.
> 
> Unfortunately I could never get into fma, but i love HxH. I think my favourite character has to be Hisoka. He's a perfect villain.
> 
> ISFP 4w5 does I think. I was still a bit doubtful of INFJ because it seemed too rare for me. Reading up on ISFP's I relate alot. I chose 4w5 because it fits better, I may still have a 5, but I think I'm either 4w5 or 9w1. If I am 9w1 then I think i'd be sx. If you had to guess what would you say my enneagram is? It's always good to have a new perspective, I did consider ISFP at one point but I must've convinced myself otherwise.


Aw that's a shame, but I understand there's nothing that's for everyone. I think FMA appeals a lot to xNFJ functions (especially Brotherhood).
Hunter x Hunter was written by a pretty clear INTP 5w4 so you see strong appeals to the Ti-Ne in it, but also Se a lot as you'd expect from a shounen action series.
Well that's a good choice! Hisoka is a great and fun character! 🤡 I suppose my favorite villain in HxH would be Chrollo. He reminds me of myself quite a bit. My favorite of the main "good" guys is Kurapika though. Yours?

Oh, I wouldn't pay too much mind to the whole "rarity" thing honestly. I think that gets overstated and quite lacking in statistical evidence.
Mm, well if I had to guess, I'd say your dislike of being sad make me think 9. It does go into what I said earlier about seeing strong 9 in you. I think 9s generally dislike connecting to their anger or any other negative emotion that drains them, it goes against their inner peace. From what I can tell, 4s are usually prone to melancholy. 4 gets correlated a lot with Fi by people (though MBTI and Enneagram are different systems judging different things) so if you're an ISFP you may be extra inclined to relate to 4's commonly defined traits by virtue of being an Fi-dominant. But I don't think there's anything wrong with you choosing 4w5 as the core if you relate to both strongly enough. Depends on what you fear more. Loss and conflict or lacking personal significance.


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Fru2 said:


> I really appreciate your impression of it, it's something I thought myself too but just couldn't ever put in such accurate wording. Carl Jung is overly underestimated, and you can see how most of the MBTI community just downplays him just because of their failure to recognize the essence of his words.
> It's a pleasure, keep being you!


Thank you. 😊


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## Angry-Spaghetti (Feb 25, 2021)

Hexigoon said:


> Aw that's a shame, but I understand there's nothing that's for everyone. I think FMA appeals a lot to xNFJ functions (especially Brotherhood).
> Hunter x Hunter was written by a pretty clear INTP 5w4 so you see strong appeals to the Ti-Ne in it, but also Se a lot as you'd expect from a shounen action series.
> Well that's a good choice! Hisoka is a great and fun character! 🤡 I suppose my favorite villain in HxH would be Chrollo. He reminds me of myself quite a bit. My favorite of the main "good" guys is Kurapika though. Yours?
> 
> ...


I'd say Leorio is my favourite.

Yeah, I just remember seeing stats that infj's are very rare, so that through in some doubt. I think I agree with you, 9 fits better. I don't think i have the usual 4 traits either, at least one's that aren't on the surface. I don't desperately want to be different, I want to be like people who I admire or at least as skilled as them. I know 9's have a very hard time typing themselves because they can 'imitate' every other type. so if the Fi from isfp accounts for the 4 ish feeling, do i even have a 4 in my tritype, or is the tritype an outlet for my Fi. so essentially, is my Fi and 4 connected and influence eachother or are they different things entirely?


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## Hexigoon (Mar 12, 2018)

Angry-Spaghetti said:


> I'd say Leorio is my favourite.
> 
> Yeah, I just remember seeing stats that infj's are very rare, so that through in some doubt. I think I agree with you, 9 fits better. I don't think i have the usual 4 traits either, at least one's that aren't on the surface. I don't desperately want to be different, I want to be like people who I admire or at least as skilled as them. I know 9's have a very hard time typing themselves because they can 'imitate' every other type. so if the Fi from isfp accounts for the 4 ish feeling, do i even have a 4 in my tritype, or is the tritype an outlet for my Fi. so essentially, is my Fi and 4 connected and influence eachother or are they different things entirely?


Hehe good ol' Leorio, that goofball.

Sure, you might still have 4 in your tritype, or it might be acting as a wing. I had a gut feeling but it wasn't strong enough for me to really say it, but maybe you have 3 in your tritype. Honestly I relate a lot to your desire. That's kinda the big driving force of my life. I want to be successful and as masterful in something meaningful as the people I admire.
Enneagram is about fear and motivation so it's not the same thing as cognitive functions, which is about how you process information. So to know if you have 4, you have to do a bit of digging into what drives you, what do you fear most. You have to be able to be honest about this. It might take some time but it sounds like you have some idea.
I'd say enneagram does have influence on how you process information though, yes. For example, my Ti gets quite a lot of room to develop itself when I have major 5 concerns, it often makes me feel like an INTx sometimes because I sorta downplay my Fe and try to keep it more controlled than say an INFJ 2 might.


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