# Model D (mk5)



## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Tellus said:


> I don't think an introvert uses his/her strong functions solely in the inner world. It could be 70% in the inner world and 30% in the outer world.


It is probably more like 50-50 for extroverts.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Si interprets the meaning of visual stimuli and establishes object recognition (the temporal lobe). This is not the same thing as seeing an object (the occipital lobe).


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

I: "Si recognizes facial expressions, body language and tone of voice. Fe evaluates the emotional state of people, and deals with social behavior and manipulation."

This is probably incorrect. I now think Fe recognizes facial expressions, body language and tone of voice. So Fe and Fi are actually sensory processes! The difference is that Fe and Fi deal with sensory information which refers to an emotional state.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

"Mirror neurons have been interpreted as the mechanism by which we simulate others in order to better understand them..." (Fi)

"Mirror neurons are proposed to be a basis for understanding the actions of others by internally imitating the actions using one's own motor control circuits."

"The mirror neuron system (MNS), comprising premotor cortex, inferior parietal lobe, and motor and somatosensory cortex, is engaged when one performs a motor action or views another person perform the same action, thus providing a potential neural mechanism by which we understand other's action goals."

Se is directly related to the premotor cortex and the parietal lobe.

Se and Fi are blocked together because they are essentially doing the same thing.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> This is probably incorrect. I now think Fe recognizes facial expressions, body language and tone of voice. So Fe and Fi are actually sensory processes! The difference is that Fe and Fi deal with sensory information which refers to an emotional state.


Brocca’s Area is what a person uses to create facial expressions, body language, and speech. Wernicke’s area is what is used by the individual to process other’s doing those things.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> Brocca’s Area is what a person uses to create facial expressions, body language, and speech. Wernicke’s area is what is used by the individual to process other’s doing those things.


Those areas deal with speech. Fe and Fi are about something else. 

Fe is related to the cingulate cortex and Fi is related to the orbitofrontal cortex.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

I think Si includes Wernicke's area, though.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> Those areas deal with speech. Fe and Fi are about something else.
> 
> Fe is related to the cingulate cortex and Fi is related to the orbitofrontal cortex.


Read more. They deal with the other things you wrote as well. They are the language centers, not just the speech centers. Facial expressions, body language, etc are there.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> Read more. They deal with the other things you wrote as well. They are the language centers, not just the speech centers. Facial expressions, body language, etc are there.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broca's_area

_"It has been speculated that because speech-associated gestures could possibly reduce lexical or sentential ambiguity, comprehension should improve in the presence of speech-associated gestures. As a result of improved comprehension, the involvement of Broca's area should be reduced."
_
They are language centers but they do not read/express emotional states, so they are not related to Fe and Fi.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broca's_area
> 
> _"It has been speculated that because speech-associated gestures could possibly reduce lexical or sentential ambiguity, comprehension should improve in the presence of speech-associated gestures. As a result of improved comprehension, the involvement of Broca's area should be reduced."
> _
> They are language centers but they do not read/express emotional states, so they are not related to Fe and Fi.


Like I said, read more.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Fi also includes ventromedial prefrontal cortex.

"involved in the cognitive evaluation of morality"


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbitofrontal_cortex

"encoding value, encoding inferred value" (Fi)


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus, do you know what, exactly, you are attempting to solve?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> Tellus, do you know what, exactly, you are attempting to solve?


I am trying to define the functions and build a model.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Si and Fe are ultimately about pattern recognition. Both functions form new memories and recall memories. Fe focuses on facial expressions, body language and tone of voice.

Se and Fi perceive/simulate an interaction between a person (i.e. a subject) and objects/subjects. Both functions cause (and are caused by) emotions, but only Fi reflects upon emotional responses.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

It is very likely that facial expressions etc cause emotions, so I think Fe also reflects upon emotional responses.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> I am trying to define the functions and build a model.


You are trying to find best fit matches for the semantics of typology and the semantics of neuroscience.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> You are trying to find best fit matches for the semantics of typology and the semantics of neuroscience.


 It depends on what you mean by "semantics of typology". For example, I don't use Thinking and Intuition since they are too vague.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> It depends on what you mean by "semantics of typology". For example, I don't use Thinking and Intuition since they are too vague.


You can coalesce descriptions. It’s effectively reductionism of semantics into singular, distinct concepts, then matching such to existent singular concepts of neuroscience, expanding the neuroscience concepts back out, and then comparison and contrast of those existent neuroscience descriptions to the descriptions of typology, checking the accuracy and precision, then repeating the processes by altering the manner of reductionism, and repeating this whole process while utilizing heuristics on the reductionism. Eventually, at some point, you will be higher than 50% accuracy and precision, then 75%, then 90%, etc. until you pass the reasonable efficiency curve.


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## Lord Fenix Wulfheart (Aug 18, 2015)

Isn't there some risk of losing or missing components of the ideas in the process? It seems a good way to capture where the ideas and the realities are coinciding, but one wonders whether it would not be better to begin with a full inventory of concepts in the manner of the Big 5 and reduce down through synergy rather than through discarding. That is, you begin with all the concepts you can find both in typology and in neuroscience and reduce down only after the initial expansion of the list into its largest form, and perform any comparison and contrasting before reducing at all. It'd be more work, but I suspect the odds of missing something would be less.

EDIT: Also, refreshing to see that you two are still arguing. How long has it been now? XD


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Lord Fenix Wulfheart said:


> Isn't there some risk of losing or missing components of the ideas in the process? It seems a good way to capture where the ideas and the realities are coinciding, but one wonders whether it would not be better to begin with a full inventory of concepts in the manner of the Big 5 and reduce down through synergy rather than through discarding. That is, you begin with all the concepts you can find both in typology and in neuroscience and reduce down only after the initial expansion of the list into its largest form, and perform any comparison and contrasting before reducing at all. It'd be more work, but I suspect the odds of missing something would be less.
> 
> EDIT: Also, refreshing to see that you two are still arguing. How long has it been now? XD


You would have to lose parts. The components are conflated.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Si interprets the meaning of visual stimuli and establishes object/pattern recognition. It forms new memories and recall memories.

Se perceives/simulates an interaction between a person and objects/people.

Both functions cause emotions and are caused by emotions. Fe and Fi reflect upon those emotional responses. They combine perception (=sensation+cognition) and emotion.

Fe focuses on facial expressions, body language and tone of voice.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

There is an alternative way of defining Se, Si, Fe and Fi.

Se/Si: a subject observes objects

Fe/Fi: a subject observes a subject who observes objects

"V.S. Ramachandran has speculated that mirror neurons may provide the neurological basis of human self-awareness."


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

There could be a connection between the functions and the basic emotions.



Se- maximize anger, minimize fear

Se+ minimize not anger, maximize not fear



Si+ maximize anticipation, minimize surprise

Si- minimize not anticipation, maximize not surprise (tradition, custom...)



Fi- maximize trust, minimize disgust

Fi+ minimize not trust (i.e. distrust), maximize not disgust



Fe+ maximize joy, minimize sadness

Fe- minimize not joy, maximize not sadness




IF this is accurate then I must change the model:


ILI

Introvert

*Si+* Fe- // *Se+* Fi-

*Fi+* Se- // *Fe+* Si-


... which is similar to Model D mk4.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

So what’s your dichotomous correlation for action vs speech.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> So what’s your dichotomous correlation for action vs speech.


Se is about an interaction between a subject (i.e. a person) and objects/subjects. Si is about object/pattern recognition, which includes speech.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> Se is about an interaction between a subject (i.e. a person) and objects/subjects. Si is about object/pattern recognition, which includes speech.


Wouldn’t that make anyone with 4D Se or 4D Si be better at both actions and speech than the average individual, due to the other element then being 3D?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> Wouldn’t that make anyone with 4D Se or 4D Si be better at both actions and speech than the average individual, due to the other element then being 3D?


I think LSE and SLI (Si-) _are_ better at speech than the average individual, and SLE and LSI (Se-) _are _better at interaction with objects. But there are many aspects of speech... EIEs are usually good at the emotional aspects of speech.


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> I think LSE and SLI (Si-) _are_ better at speech than the average individual, and SLE and LSI (Se-) _are _better at interaction with objects. But there are many aspects of speech... EIEs are usually good at the emotional aspects of speech.


Really? LSE and SLI are two of the most physical action oriented types by descriptions, the other two being SLE and LSI. By what you stated, though, all four would be better at both physical actions and speech than most people, which is basically everything people actually _do_.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

DavidGH said:


> Really? LSE and SLI are two of the most physical action oriented types by descriptions, the other two being SLE and LSI. By what you stated, though, all four would be better at both physical actions and speech than most people, which is basically everything people actually _do_.


No, because it is not just about an innate ability (i.e. type)... it is also about practise and experience. And consciousness is another factor (besides strength of the functions).


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Tellus said:


> There could be a connection between the functions and the basic emotions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


"Anger, when viewed as a protective response or instinct to a perceived threat, is considered as positive. The negative expression of this state is known as aggression. Acting on this misplaced state is rage due to possible potential errors in perception and judgment."

Anger is always caused by an obstacle (including a threat).

Fear is always caused by an "inverse obstacle" ... i.e. he/she (or it) wants to remove _you_.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Intelligence is directly related to logical reasoning, but it is only somewhat related to creativity/imagination (or Intuition). So '+' = abductive/inductive reasoning could be inaccurate.


I will temporarily use these descriptions instead:


'+' = "abstract, imaginative, absentminded, impractical, absorbed in ideas" ... "open to change, experimental, liberal, analytical, critical, freethinking, flexibility"


'-' = "grounded, practical, prosaic, solution oriented, steady, conventional" ... "traditional, attached to familiar, conservative, respecting traditional ideas"


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

'+' = many connections between the frontal lobe and the other lobes (?)

logical reasoning (including working memory) = similarities/differences between objects ... the prefrontal cortex (?)


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> No, because it is not just about an innate ability (i.e. type)... it is also about practise and experience. And consciousness is another factor (besides strength of the functions).


Yes, and in the Socionics-sense, they would be better.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

This is also possible:

ILI

Introvert

*Si+* Se- *Fi+* Fe- // *Se+* Si- *Fe+* Fi-



1. ILI's Si+ and Se+ are strong functions, and Fe- and Fi- are weak functions.

This is based on MBTI, Socionics (duality etc.), observations (physics, mathematics, chess etc.) and symmetry.

2. Imagination/Intuition (or '+') is always dependent on Se, Si, Fe and Fi. So if '+' is strong, then all '+' functions are strong.

ILI prefers Si with Intuition, i.e. Si+ is a strong function. Si without Intuition (Si-) must be a weak function.

3. ILI _is _sensitive to criticism from ESE and SEI, so Fe- should be a Mental function.

4. LII's Fe+ is clearly a Mental function (watch superseniorsydney on Youtube).

5. ILI's Se+ is a Vital function.

*Si+* Fe- *Se+* Fi- // ... This is not possible. If both Fe- and Fi- are Mental functions, then we cannot explain duality. Also, Si+ and Se+ don't complement each other.

6. Si+ and Se- are more conscious than Fi+ and Fe-.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

*Si+* Se- *Fi+* Fe-
*Fe+* Fi- *Se+* Si-

Si+ _is _assisted by Fe+ (like mk5). Why? Because Fe needs input from Si, but Si+ and Fe- do not process the same kind of information.

An ILI usually focuses on objects (in his/her work), but there is always some awareness of himself/herself as a subject or other people who might be affected by his/her work. That awareness is Fe+ (and Fi-). This probably means that there are two rings or tracks: Si+, Se-, Fe+, Fi- and Fi+, Fe-, Se+, Si-.

I think Fe+ is more important in ILI than LII, but as a Vital function it is mostly an individual/private process. Therefore it is much more obvious in LII.

If there are two tracks, then it is easy to understand why ILI and SEE are duals. Fe+/Fi- is the audience, so to speak.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Si interprets the meaning of visual stimuli and establishes object/pattern recognition. It forms new memories and recall memories.

Se perceives/simulates an interaction between a person and objects/people.

Fe = awareness that one specific pattern causes one specific emotional state (?)

Fi = awareness that one specific interaction causes one specific emotional state (?)


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

"The super-ego can be thought of as a type of conscience that punishes misbehavior with feelings of guilt. For example, for having extra-marital affairs. Taken in this sense, the super-ego is the precedent for the conceptualization of the inner critic..."

*Fi+* Fe-
*Se+ *Si-

Is this ILI's super-ego?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

"In psychoanalysis, preconscious is the loci preceding consciousness. Thoughts are preconscious when they are unconscious at a particular moment, but are not repressed. Therefore, preconscious thoughts are available for recall and easily 'capable of becoming conscious'—a phrase attributed by Sigmund Freud to Joseph Breuer."

Yermak:

"Some socionists suppose that the functioning of the superblock of personal life is unconscious. It is incorrect. Founders of psychoanalysis differently considered the concept of the "unconscious". The term "preconscious" is appropriate to the content of processes, which take place in the superblock of personal life. In normal conditions, the preconscious processes function out of consciousness, automatically. But these processes can become conscious, if there is a need. In turn, functioning of the superblock of social life is obviously conscious."

Another way of looking at it is that one function is active (i.e. temporarily conscious) and all other functions are inactive (i.e. temporarily unconscious). So there are no Vital functions and information is never processed automatically.

But then why do ILI and IEI look so different? Because the functions are still blocked: Si+ (Fe+) vs. Fe+ (Si+). Fe+ is an auxiliary function which motivates the ILI to work. IEI, on the other hand, focuses on the motivation itself, so his/her auxiliary function provides the facts.

The question is whether ILI can process Fe+ (Si+) or not.

------

ILI's Fe+ (Si+) is either rare or non-existent, otherwise we would not be able to differentiate between ILI and IEI.

*Fi+* Fe-
*Se+* Si-

... or: *Fi+ (Se+)* Fe- (Si-)

This is what we see when ILI focuses on people/motivation. He cannot (?) process Fe+ (Si+) and Fi- (Se-), so he must process Fe- (Si-) and Fi+ (Se+).


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## DavidGH (Aug 10, 2019)

What Yermak is referencing is that consciously utilizing a function necessarily automatically disables the function’s opposite.

Utilizing Ni+ for ILI causes the autonomous non-utilization of Ne+, which is why the 7th function is Ne-. Should the ILI consciously utilize Ne-, then Ni+ would autonomously be utilized. Should the ILI consciously utilize Ne+, then the ILI would autonomously utilize Ni-. Etc. It’s simply bit switches.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5382157/

The medial temporal lobe (MTL) includes the hippocampus, amygdala and parahippocampal regions, and is crucial for episodic and spatial memory. MTL memory function consists of distinct processes such as encoding, consolidation and retrieval. Encoding is the process by which perceived information is transformed into a memory trace. After encoding, memory traces are stabilized by consolidation. Memory retrieval (recall) refers to the process by which memory traces are reactivated to access information previously encoded and stored in the brain. Although underlying neural mechanisms supporting these distinct functional stages remain largely unknown, recent studies have indicated that distinct oscillatory dynamics, specific neuron types, synaptic plasticity and neuromodulation, play a central role. The theta rhythm is believed to be crucial in the encoding and retrieval of memories. Experimental and computational studies indicate that precise timing of principal cell firing in the hippocampus, relative to the theta rhythm, underlies encoding and retrieval processes. On the other hand, sharp-wave ripples have been implicated in the consolidation through the “replay” of memories in compressed time scales.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occipital_lobe

The first functional area is the primary visual cortex. It contains a low-level description of the local orientation, spatial-frequency and color properties within small receptive fields. Primary visual cortex projects to the occipital areas of the ventral stream (visual area V2 and visual area V4), and the occipital areas of the dorsal stream—visual area V3, visual area MT (V5), and the dorsomedial area (DM).

The ventral stream is known for the processing the "what" in vision, while the dorsal stream handles the "where/how." This is because the ventral stream provides important information for the identification of stimuli that are stored in memory. With this information in memory, the dorsal stream is able to focus on motor actions in response to the outside stimuli.



https://www.jneurosci.org/content/32/24/8107

The idea of a division between a dorsal and a ventral visual stream is one of the most basic principles of visual processing in the brain (Milner and Goodale, 1995). The ventral stream originates in primary visual cortex and extends along the ventral surface into the temporal cortex; the dorsal stream also arises in primary visual cortex, but continues along the dorsal surface into parietal cortex. The ventral stream (or “vision-for-perception” pathway) is believed to mainly subserve recognition and discrimination of visual shapes and objects, whereas the dorsal stream (or “vision-for-action” pathway) has been primarily associated with visually guided reaching and grasping based on the moment-to-moment analysis of the spatial location, shape, and orientation of objects. It has been proposed, however, that the dorsal stream also processes tools as a category, so that manipulable objects would be processed by those brain regions that are important for the execution of actions. However, because dorsal and ventral visual regions are heavily interconnected, it is difficult to tell in healthy subjects whether information is processed along the dorsal stream only, or whether it is fed to parietal cortex via ventral visual regions.








Spontaneous (real-time) brain activity using tNLM filtering of fMRI data


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Why are there mental and vital functions? Because two functions must process information simultaneously. You cannot observe structural differences (Se: longer, higher, fewer...) without being somewhat aware of the object (Si).


ILI

Si+ (Fe+) // Se+ (Fi+) ... strong (ego)

Se- (Fi-) // Si- (Fe-) ... weak
________________

Fi+ (Se+) // Fe+ (Si+) ... strong (super-ego)

Fe- (Si-) // Fi- (Se-) ... weak


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Here's a visualization of the functions.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

"Why are there mental and vital functions? Because two functions must process information simultaneously."

Is this correct? hmm...



ILI

Si+ (Fe+) // Se+ (Fi+) ... strong (ego)

Se- (Fi-) // Si- (Fe-) ... weak
________________

Fi+ (Se+) // Fe+ (Si+) ... strong (super-ego)

Fe- (Si-) // Fi- (Se-) ... weak


OR


ILI

Si+ (Se-) // Fe+ (Fi-) ... strong (ego)

Se- (Si+) // Fi- (Fe+) ... weak
_________________

Fi+ (Fe-) // Se+ (Si-) ... strong (super-ego)

Fe- (Fi+) // Si- (Se+) ... weak


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Tellus said:


> There could be a connection between the functions and the basic emotions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Here's an example:

Se+ ... math --> engineering --> a bridge --> no need to climb --> he or she avoids dangerous situations

I think robots are the ultimate expression of Se+.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

_Si interprets the meaning of visual stimuli and establishes object/pattern recognition. It forms new memories and recall memories._

_Se perceives/simulates an interaction between a person and objects/people._

_Fe = awareness that one specific pattern causes one specific emotional state (?)_

_Fi = awareness that one specific interaction causes one specific emotional state (?)


------


_I think Se and Si are accurately defined, but Fe and Fi have to be modified.

We interact with objects and we identify objects (Se and Si), and we interact with subjects and we identify subjects (Fi and Fe). But what does the latter mean? We can move an object but we (usually) cannot move another person. Instead, Fi and Fe deal with social relationships and _cooperation_. We need other people to hunt, to farm, for protection etc. That is why Fi is directly related to mirror neurons. Fi imitates another person, which is essential for cooperation, and builds a (new) relationship. Fe identifies a relationship via facial expressions, tone of voice and body language.


"The original role of emotions was to motivate adaptive behaviors that in the past would have contributed to the passing on of genes through survival, reproduction, and kin selection."

Joy informs a person that he/she is on the right track: _Keep identifying a useful relationship._


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anterior_cingulate_cortex

"The ACC area in the brain is associated with many functions that are correlated with conscious experience. Greater ACC activation levels were present in more emotionally aware female participants when shown short 'emotional' video clips. Better emotional awareness is associated with improved recognition of emotional cues or targets, which is reflected by ACC activation."

Fe is definitely related to the cingulate cortex.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_neuron

"Stephanie Preston and Frans de Waal, Jean Decety, and Vittorio Gallese and Christian Keysers have independently argued that the mirror neuron system is involved in empathy." (mainly Fi+)

"David Freedberg and Vittorio Gallese have also put forward the idea that this function of the mirror neuron system is crucial for aesthetic experiences." (mainly Fi- ... ESI: art, fashion etc)


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Here's a clarification on Te and Ti. Te is about a) logical reasoning and b) facts, technology, effectiveness etc. Ti is about a) logical reasoning and b) size, direction, angle, quantity etc.

b) in Te is included in Si and b) in Ti is included in Se.

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However, FPN includes the frontal lobe and the parietal lobe. So when Se is activated, logical reasoning is activated as well. (IQ measures how efficiently a person uses logical reasoning).

Hence, logical reasoning (i.e. comparing objects/patterns and extracting information) is also included in Se and Si.

It is a process: sensation --> perception --> cognition ... OR ... sensation --> cognition --> perception

-----

Intelligence/IQ is a part of our personality but it is not a part of our personality type.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-cognition-and-perception

"Perception is a process: first comes sensation, then comes cognition; perception is sensing influenced by cognition. For example, if someone calls you a name:

1. you hear it, then

2. you think about it (whether quickly or not), then

3. what you were thinking affects how you perceive what was said."

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This means that Thinking and Sensing cannot be two separate functions.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

It is possible that the functions correspond to (large-scale) brain networks.

The motivation network, Fe/Fi (?):


View attachment 840787



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Si + F = Fe (?)

Se + F = Fi (?)

Nardi's brain maps do not support this, though. They look more like Se -- Si -- Fe -- Fi, so Se types show the least empathy (Fi).


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

_I think the right PFC (i.e. "Intuition") is essentially logic with real objects/patterns. (This is incorrect)_

The left hemisphere deals with symbolic representations of objects. They are simplified and definite objects (words and other symbols) and are used in communication between people.

A = B, B = C, therefore A = C. This is processed by the left PFC ... A = B is compared to B = C

Is a dolphin a fish or a mammal? (_"Ne" This is incorrect ... _categorization/classification is correct). This is processed by the right PFC ... a visual image of a dolphin is compared to a visual image of a fish and a mammal

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Ne: "With someone else, talk about everything you could do with the object that you have not done before."

The right PFC ("Ne") does not associate one object with another object. Instead, it changes the shape of an object, which is then recognized by the temporal lobe and/or the parietal lobe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_memory#Neural_mechanisms_of_maintaining_information

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The right PFC/Se can mentally rotate a bowl (on a table) 180 degrees and transform it into a completely different object (a simple drum) or a new object.

The right PFC/Si ("Ni"), on the other hand, only deals with patterns (not structures/spatial relations) so a bowl can be mentally moved to the floor, but it is still a bowl and an interaction between a person and the bowl is the same. However, if the bowl is mentally moved from the table to the floor, then the interaction is changed. But then it is processed by the right PFC/Se instead.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Another way of looking at it is that there are two kinds of logic and two kinds of Intuition/imagination (left and right hemispheres)._ So the right PFC deals with categorization/classification. ...This is incorrect._ (Logic is a comparison: it sees similarities and differences, and extracts information/draws conclusions).

Both logic and Intuition use PFC/working memory.

America <---> track ..... 'America' is mentally moved to 'track'... and there is a similarity: an 'a' is used in both words ... This is logic/categorization (left PFC).

Amtrak ..... 'Am' (in 'America') is mentally moved to 'track' ... This is Intuition/imagination (left PFC).





















These four processes are fed by either Se or Si, so there are eight processes in total.

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Is categorization always processed in the right hemisphere? No, the right PFC/Se is just the most obvious one. I actually think there are four kinds of categorization and four kinds of "formal logic" (2 Se and 2 Si). In the former case, the similarity is not obvious but the conclusion is (often) obvious. In the latter case, the similarity is (often) obvious but the conclusion is not obvious.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Si and Fe are definitely related to DMN.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Default_mode_network

Remembering the past and thinking about the future

Remembering the past: Recalling events that happened in the past
Imagining the future: Envisioning events that might happen in the future
Episodic memory: Detailed memory related to specific events in time
Story comprehension: Understanding and remembering a narrative


Thinking about others

Theory of mind: Thinking about the thoughts of others and what they might or might not know
Emotions of other: Understanding the emotions of other people and empathizing with their feelings
Moral reasoning: Determining just and unjust result of an action
Social evaluations: Good-bad attitude judgments about social concepts
Social categories: Reflecting on important social characteristics and status of a group


"Though the DMN was originally noticed to be deactivated in certain goal-oriented tasks and is sometimes referred to as the task-negative network, it can be active in other goal-oriented tasks such as social working memory or autobiographical tasks."


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://positivepsychology.com/negative-emotions/

Cambria, Livingstone, and Hussain (2011) took Plutchik’s wheel to another level and developed ‘The Hourglass of Emotions’. In their book, they built on Plutchik’s eight basic emotions and broke them down into four dimensions: sensitivity, attention, pleasantness, and aptitude. *They also made distinctions between which of the emotions were positive (joy, trust, anger, and anticipation) or negative (disgust, sadness, fear, and surprise).*



Se- anger ********************, fear *******************


Se+ anger ***, fear ***




Si+ anticipation ********************, surprise *******************


Si- anticipation ***, surprise ***




Fi- trust ********************, disgust ********************


Fi+ trust ***, disgust ***




Fe+ joy ********************, sadness ********************


Fe- joy ***, sadness ***


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Si+ and Si- are two different strategies for survival.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

It is possible that Fe uses mirror neurons as well. So Fe recognizes patterns from another person's point of view, and recognizes himself/herself from outside.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_neuron#Theory_of_mind

In Philosophy of mind, mirror neurons have become the primary rallying call of simulation theorists concerning our "theory of mind." "Theory of mind" refers to our ability to infer another person's mental state (i.e., beliefs and desires) from experiences or their behaviour.

There are several competing models which attempt to account for our theory of mind; the most notable in relation to mirror neurons is simulation theory. According to simulation theory, theory of mind is available because we subconsciously empathize with the person we're observing and, accounting for relevant differences, imagine what we would desire and believe in that scenario. Mirror neurons have been interpreted as the mechanism by which we simulate others in order to better understand them, and therefore their discovery has been taken by some as a validation of simulation theory (which appeared a decade before the discovery of mirror neurons). More recently, Theory of Mind and Simulation have been seen as complementary systems, with different developmental time courses.

At the neuronal-level, in a 2015 study by Keren Haroush and Ziv Williams using jointly interacting primates performing an iterated prisoner's dilemma game, the authors identified neurons in the anterior cingulate cortex that selectively predicted an opponent's yet unknown decisions or covert state of mind. These "other-predictive neurons" differentiated between self and other decisions and were uniquely sensitive to social context, but they did not encode the opponent's observed actions or receipt of reward. These cingulate cells may therefore importantly complement the function of mirror neurons by providing additional information about other social agents that is not immediately observable or known.

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I think Fe and Fi have to include "cooperation with oneself" and "negative cooperation" (Machiavellian thinking etc).

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Si interprets the meaning of visual stimuli and establishes object/pattern recognition. It forms new memories and recall memories.

Si recognizes a new car (or a friend). Fe processes a relation between a person (including himself/herself) and a new car.

Joy motivates a person to gain resources (i.e. useful objects and subjects, including knowledge) and form positive memories.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Se perceives/simulates an interaction between a person (i.e. himself/herself) and objects. It is directly related to the premotor cortex and the parietal lobe.


Fi uses mirror neurons so that a person can experience another person's interaction with objects. This is why SEEs are excellent imitators and IEEs see potential in others.


Fi also reflects upon one's own interactions.











Trust motivates him/her to continue using safe objects/products and making friends.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

If he (or she) is on the right track, then anticipation (or interest) motivates him to continue using the same method.

If he is right, then a lack of anticipation (or interest) stops him from using this method.

If he is on the wrong track, then surprise (or distraction) motivates him to start using a different method.

If he is wrong, then a lack of surprise (or distraction) stops him from using any method.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://introvertdear.com/news/intr...ns-really-are-different-according-to-science/

Another difference between introverts and extroverts has to do with our nervous systems. Everyone’s nervous system has two “sides” — the sympathetic side, which triggers the “fight, fright, or flight” response, and the parasympathetic side, which is responsible for “rest and digest” mode.

In other words, the sympathetic side is like hitting the gas pedal, while the parasympathetic side is like slamming on the brakes.

When your sympathetic system is activated, your body gears up for action. Adrenaline is released, glucose energizes muscles, and oxygen increases. Areas of your brain that control careful, measured thinking are turned off, although dopamine increases alertness in the back of your brain.

On the other hand, when you engage the parasympathetic side, your muscles relax, energy is stored like a squirrel preparing for winter, and food is metabolized. Acetylcholine increases alertness and blood flow to the front of your brain.

To be clear, extroverts and introverts use both sides of their nervous systems at different times. But which side do we introverts generally prefer? You’ve probably already guessed: According to Dr. Laney, we prefer the parasympathetic side, which slows and calms us.

Ever wonder why, as an introvert, you are prone to overthinking? It may have to do with how we process stimuli differently than extroverts.

When information from the outside world — like someone’s voice or images on a computer screen — enters an extrovert’s brain, it travels a shorter pathway, Laney theorizes. It passes through “quick response” areas of the brain where taste, touch, sight, and sound are processed.

[...]

If Laney’s theory is correct, this means introverts process information more thoroughly than extroverts do. No wonder it can take us longer to put our thoughts into words, react, or make decisions!

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This is a definition of extraversion/introversion.

Extroverts make fast decisions but they can be imprecise. Introverts make slow decisions but they are usually precise.

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This also explains why there are no ambiverts, since we are either in the extroverted mode or in the introverted mode.

I also think everybody has a preferred side.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

Both Fe and Fi see a person from "outside": person --> person (including himself/herself) --> objects. So these functions are about joy/sadness and trust/disgust. Si identifies a pattern/situation (e.g. someone's economic situation), and Fe relates it to a person.

Why is Se only about anger and fear? Because Se interacts directly with objects (person --> objects), so it cannot be about joy/sadness and trust/disgust. For example, a person cannot think solely about a new car and feel joy. And Se does not know what a specific object/pattern/situation _is _(i.e. the meaning of a situation), so it is pointless to anticipate a situation. Se: an apple and an orange are (almost) identical objects.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

_Si+ anticipation ********************, surprise *******************_

_Si- anticipation ***, surprise ***_


_Si+ tries to predict an outcome._

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​1) the more certain a person is about a prediction, the more surprised he (or she) will be when it fails

2) the more new situations, the more unexpected situations


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://www.researchgate.net/public..._for_emotions_and_monoamine_neurotransmitters

https://en.wikiversity.org/wiki/Motivation_and_emotion/Book/2015/Lövheim_cube_of_emotion

"The only emotion in the model that is not shown to have an influence by these neurotransmitters is shame/humiliation. According to Lövheim (2012), this emotion is where the individual feels defeated and unworthy and that this makes it clear, when remembering what each axis represents, that this is where this emotion belongs."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acceptance

"Acceptance in human psychology is a person's assent to the reality of a situation, recognizing a process or condition (often a negative or uncomfortable situation) without attempting to change it or protest it."

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It is possible that acceptance (or trust) fits even better than shame/humiliation.

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"Recent evidence in support of the idea of basic emotions has also been gathered from brain imaging studies and investigations of autonomic responses, demonstrating unique patterns of activation associated with certain emotions."


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

https://imgur.com/NCXJqvC

https://i.imgur.com/NCXJqvC.gif


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