# INTP and INTJ females unite!



## INTJellectual

My slumnote:

*age*: 28
*location*: Philippines
*job*: did quit my job
*relationship status*: married
*meandering career*: degree in Computer Science
*hobbies: *Internet surfing, forum posting, reading, watching t.v., eating
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: Web development
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *painting, writing (stories, novels, blogs)
*current obsessive interest*: MBTI, Personality typing, Psychology, Architecture, Interior design, Houses, Feng Shui
*former domain of geek-dom*: History, Encyclopedia, Biology, Astronomy, Geography
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Discovery Channel, History, National Geographics, Documentaries
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: fb (yoville) games, video games that are not rpg
*clothes*: blouse/shirt, jeans, flats. dress and heels (churchwear)
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *kissing cats and kittens, watching movies, dating, eating out, shopping, wandering, music-listening, porn-watching


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## Perhaps

Zippy BawBaw said:


> An INTJ with copious amounts of estrogen in their body?
> 
> Oh god


You're overcome with lust, I know.


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## Jennywocky

*age*: 43
*location*: Balt/Wash DC metro area, USA
*job*: Systems Analyst for the federal gov
*relationship status*: Separated (4+ years), soon to be divorced
*meandering career*: English degree, math minor; editor -> managing editor -> tech writer -> developer -> analyst
*hobbies: *hiking, biking, exploring, foruming, computer gaming, RPGs, writing, reading, learning (anything of interest), horror, watching movies (ALL sorts) and other media, psychology and personality
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: shooting guns, fencing, long-distance running, home remodeling, jewelry making, cleaning, cloth-making, glass-blowing, beer-making. I'd also like to know more science in the areas of evolution, astronomy, and genetics.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *cartooning, photoshop, web page programming, tennis, composing music, playing piano
*current obsessive interest*: psychology (still), gender & transgender studies, music (I'm branching out into various genres), serial killers and crime psychology, 
*former domain of geek-dom*: Religion/Christianity, comic books, archaeology, foreign ancient cultures and mythology
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Star Trek (TOS, TNG), Heroes, Simpsons, Mythbusters, 1000 Ways to Die, Forensic Files... and a friend just gave me a boxed DVD set of all the Thundarr the Barbarian episodes -- wow!
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: l33t sp34k
*clothes*: usually jeans/cutoffs and a t-shirt, barefoot/sandals; but I also like halter tops, short skirts (I have good legs), casual skirts, pretty dresses, nice topcs, rings, earrings, bracelets, and jewelry -- organic artsy stuff. It all depends on how I'm feeling that day and what the occasion is. note: I'm often wearing my ankh necklace, I rarely take it off. 
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *smile benevolently at little children, hang out with girlfriends and/or bring food for a get-together, drink socially, talk to people I don't know, make my bed, call friends on the phone
　
*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
Yes, it's a bit lower (alto area), and I have to consciously think about adding inflection; I like how it sounds when I do, and can make my voice sound more interesting when I work at it, but my typical mode is fairly flat. I've had people tell me I have an endearing and/or soothing voice, but I'm not sure what that means.
　
*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all? *
Yes. I don't have a loud voice either, I can't raise the volume that well, and it doesn't tend to cut through things. I can't really yell. I like quieter settings where I feel I'm better heard.
*
Favorite Pickup Lines from list
*


> *ISTJ:* Stand still so I can pick you up.
> *ISFJ:* If I had a rose for every time I thought of you, I'd be walking through my garden forever.
> *ESTJ:* Is it hot in here, or is it just me?*
> ESFJ*: (hold out hand) Would you hold this for me while I go for a walk?
> *ISTP:* Hello. Are you taking any applications for a boy/girlfriend?
> *ISFP:* Hello. Cupid called. He says to tell you that he needs my heart back.
> *ESTP:* Can you pull this heart-shaped arrow out of my ass? A damn little kid with wings shot me.
> *ESFP*: If I followed you home, would you keep me?
> *INTJ*: Giant polar bear. ("What?") It broke the ice.
> *INTP:* You know, we have actually met before. Remember the dream you had of the perfect guy/girl? I was the guy/girl standing to his/her right.
> *ENTJ:* I'm sorry, were you talking to me? (“No.”) Well then, please start.
> *ENTP:* If you were a laser, you'd be set on "stunning".
> *INFJ:* See this pin? I want to prick you with it to see if you truly do bleed sunshine.
> *INFP:* Can I borrow a quarter? I want to call my Mum and tell her I just met the person I'm going to marry.
> *ENFJ:* Wouldn't we look cute on a wedding cake together?
> *ENFP:* Well, here I am. What were your other two wishes?


...actually, I'd probably just be pleased to be hit on and wouldn't know what to say in response -- terror, arggg!


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## Jennywocky

FlaviaGemina said:


> I think one of the reasons I get along with my ESFJ best friend is that she is also shy. And she's really interested in different kinds of people and doesn't try to change them. Her friends are all so different that she mainly hangs out with them on a 1:1 basis because they'd all murder each other if they had to meet up as a group. I don't think I'd last long in a _group_ of extraverted girls.


The friend I'm currently staying with is VERY extroverted (I don't think she actually thinks inside of her head at all, it all comes straight out her mouth); and while at first I confused her, I think it actually has made it possible for us to get along, as soon as she accepted me being introverted.

Basically, she can say whatever she wants, and I'll actually listen to her; meanwhile, she draws me out of myself some, which I appreciate. If she was with other extroverts, they'd probably all end up fighting / talking over each other; and when I've been with other introverts, if they are really introverted, I get frustrated at not having anything to respond to as they wouldn't talk at all.


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## Rachel Something

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
I don't know if it's _deeper_ than most females, but I have been told that I sound bored.

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
At times I do... especially when I'm conversing with really extraverted people, for some reason. One of my extraverted friends has a habit of talking over me while I'm talking to another friend, and diverting attention away from what I'm saying... It's incredibly frustrating, and it makes me feel like I shouldn't bother trying to converse with anyone. I'm not an attention junkie, but it hurts to feel like I'm being ignored and dismissed.


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## Rachel Something

*age:* 23
*location:* Trinidad
*job:* currently searching for one... -_-
*relationship status:* in a relationship
*meandering career:* degree in Psychology, don't know what the fuck to do with my life now...
*hobbies:* internet surfing, forum lurking and posting, movies and tv shows (mostly horror/supernatural, fantasy, drama, historical and period pieces), listening to music, games, getting high, behavioural sciences.
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* mathematics, physics, programming, musical instruments (piano, violin, guitar), weapons and how to use them, martial arts, digital painting, traditional painting.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* visual art (drawing and photo manipulation), languages, literature, writing (fiction.)
*current obsessive interest:* MBTI, psychology, gender relations...
*former domain of geek-dom:* Monty Python, Anne Rice's Vampire Chronicles, Harry Potter, history, mythology, literature and creative writing.
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* Anime (Monster, Hellsing, Claymore, etc.), Myth Busters, The X Files, Game of Thrones, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Avatar: The Last Airbender... not sure if these things qualify me at all, but oh well.
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* Uh... can't think of anything right now...
*clothes:* My style is mostly casual... but I don't mind dressing up for the occasion. I like pretty dresses and shoes but I'm not obsessed with them. At home, I just throw on whatever's comfortable.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* Lose my mind over cute animals, smile at cute babies/children, go out with friends (dinners, bars, clubs, parties), keep up with my current favourite TV shows, snark on celebrities.


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## FlaviaGemina

Jennywocky said:


> The friend I'm currently staying with is VERY extroverted (I don't think she actually thinks inside of her head at all, it all comes straight out her mouth); and while at first I confused her, I think it actually has made it possible for us to get along, as soon as she accepted me being introverted.
> 
> Basically, she can say whatever she wants, and I'll actually listen to her; meanwhile, she draws me out of myself some, which I appreciate. If she was with other extroverts, they'd probably all end up fighting / talking over each other; *and when I've been with other introverts, if they are really introverted, I get frustrated at not having anything to respond to as they wouldn't talk at all*.


LOL, yep, sometimes when I'm with other introverts, I don't want to bother them and they probably don't want to bother me because we both no what it's like to be bothered and then nobody has anything to say. With extrovertes, at least you know they'll survive if you say something to them.


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## V3X

*Age: *18
*Location: *Norway
*Job: *Student (a full time job in my eyes)
*Relationship status: *Single
*Meandering career: *None
*Hobbies: *Gaming, jogging, longboarding, photography, politics, reading, rock climbing + anything that gives me an adrenalin kick!
*Interests, as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: *Drawing, advanced computer stuff.
*Interests, as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Math (or anything else theoretical), remembering random facts, languages. 
*Current obsessive interest: *Aliens, birds, plants, psychology, math, literature, computers, jailbroken iPhones, comics, drugs and their effects on the human body, religion. Pretty much everything that catches my fancy at that moment of time.
*Former domain of geek-dom: *Have not left anyone jet (I think), it goes in cycles so I always end up back in them.
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Dr.Who, Blood Ties, Merlin, Legend of the Seeker, Game of Thrones, Warehouse 13, random documentaries ( I watch everything no matter the subject), Fringe, and many more (just don't remember their names right now).
*Clothes: *Generally dark, my style is pretty punk-rock.
*Some of the "human" things I like to do occasionally: *Partying, hang out with friends and getting to know new people.

*The Questions!
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
*It definitely sounds much more bored. People usually think that my monotone voice is because I dislike them when the fact is that I just can't help it. If the voice is deeper than that of most females I have no idea.

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?
*It happens, but not as frequently as before. I used to be really shy and talk very quietly but I have pretty much stopped now, but it still happens but usually when we are a group of people trying to talk to each other simultaneously.


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## FlaviaGemina

*Hey, ladies, here's another question.
How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?

*I've known my type for about a year or two.
When I was younger I just used to get bothered and hyper if I was stuck with a big group of people for too long (e.g. study trips etc). I'd get really cranky and kick off on them after a while. Now I'm better at just walking off and minding my own business. Also, MBTI makes it easier to understand that there is no point in getting to know some people better, because in fact, they've already told me everything they have to say. LOL, on a more positive note, it makes it easier to talk to people of other types and understand what they are trying to say.


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## Snakecharmer

*age: * 42
*location: *  VA, US
*job: * Manager of a weight control clinic
*meandering career:* Same as my current job - I enjoy what I do (finally)
*hobbies: * reading, this forum, gym, activities with my kids (ages 12 and 19)
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: * I'd like to be better @ math 
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: * I'm finally using my interests for a purpose (my obsession is nutrition and I'm finally working in the field)
*current obsessive interest:* MBTI, the obesity epidemic in the US and how to fix it, improving my endurance, health issues, neuroscience, human behavior
*former domain of geek-dom:* computer science, finance
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: * any type of forensics or medical show (NOT fiction - I mean shows like Dr G, Medical Examiner)
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* I can't think of anything...probably because I'm well aware of my weaknesses and don't attempt things I know are beyond my area of expertise without researching first
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* go to the gym (frequently), go out to dinner with a couple of close friends


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## Snakecharmer

FlaviaGemina said:


> *
> How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?*


When I was a kid, my mother constantly forced me to interact with other kids. I was completely content in my own little world...reading, writing, listening to music, etc...but she forced me to go outside, join clubs, etc. I used to bring my books and writing supplies outside when she made me leave the house. I did enjoy exploring the woods and creek behind our house, though. 
I always chose activities and sports that were less team-based, like swimming and horseback riding. 

I never thought about my personality having a "type" or why I preferred doing things alone. I read about MBTI several years ago, but it wasn't until I took the test in an Organizational Behavior class two years ago that I developed an interest in the subject. When I took the test in class my result was INTJ, but the more I learned, the more I knew that wasn't right. Reading about the cognitive functions helped me determine my type (and hey, I still could be wrong, but I doubt it...I know for sure that I'm not an E, F, or S. J traits, definitely...but P is more dominant than J for me).

I forgot to answer the voice questions before. I have a deep voice, and I don't have trouble getting people to listen to me.


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## Raymond DiLuzio

FlaviaGemina said:


> But this is not the thread where you guys go looking for INTx girls to chat up or show off about how you are the greatest antisocial jerk in the world or something.


But I am the greatest antisocial jerk in the world! Every day I tell myself to stop being so god dame polite!


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## quadrivium

FlaviaGemina said:


> *Hey, ladies, here's another question.
> How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?
> *


Since I was about 14 ish. I had only began to be okay with it. 
The jury is still for me as for as mistyping myself goes. I've tested INFJ and INTJ in Myers Briggs but I test NT in Keirsey. JCF renders me Ni dom so I've been comfortable with that. 
Learning all of this has opened myself up to more efficient communication methods, which is something I struggle with. It confirmed and reinforced much of my personal identity that I had already built and I was relieved to know I wasn't completely insane.


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## Helios

FlaviaGemina said:


> *How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you? *


I've known this since I was very young. I get really uncomfortable around large groups of people and I don't like forced interaction at all. 
I just recently learned that I was an INTJ after thinking that I was INFJ for so long. This has helped me understand how I interact with other people a little better and I've learned more about myself by becoming more self-aware I guess.


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## DeductiveReasoner

Even though I wasn't invited to this party, I figured I'd crash it anyways. :crazy: You knew an ENTP would do this eventually
*age*: 18
*location*: U.S.
*job*: Student
r*elationship status*: Fuck Buddy/ In a love triangle :frustrating:, but I'm a bit irritated with that, so mostly a single lady
*meandering career*: perpetual student/ traveller/ bum
*hobbies*: dancing, writing, gaming, running, travelling, picking up random hobbies
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: I'm trying to teach myself piano, but it's not going well 
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* writing, philosophizing, 
*current obsessive interest*: MBTI, various TV shows, Ayn Rand books
*former domain of geek-dom*: History, Encyclopedia, Biology, Astronomy, Geography, Doctor Who, Astrophysics
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Discovery Channel, Science Channel, Documentaries, Doctor Who, Torchwood, various animes, batman
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* Watch Batman, right now. Mostly because netflix doesn't have it, and the only channels it comes on I don't get. Disappointing.
*clothes*:jeans, shorts, mostly, shirts that unintentionally reveal too much cleavage, sneakers. Black heels if I feel like being badass
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* Walk my dog. Drink. Text. Sleep. Eat. I shower every once in a while.


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## FlaviaGemina

Snakecharmer said:


> When I was a kid, my mother constantly forced me to interact with other kids. I was completely content in my own little world...reading, writing, listening to music, etc...but she forced me to go outside, join clubs, etc. I used to bring my books and writing supplies outside when she made me leave the house. I did enjoy exploring the woods and creek behind our house, though.


That sounds cruel. I was kind of lucky in that both my parents are probably introverts and encouraged me to read etc. They only started getting weird after I had moved out to study at uni. I was living on my own and was very content, because I could just do my homework, lie in my bed and read etc, but they started pestering me to move to a student hall or a shared house. (It never happened). Lol, that was when I was over twenty. ???


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## FlaviaGemina

DeductiveReasoner said:


> Even though I wasn't invited to this party, I figured I'd crash it anyways. :crazy: You knew an ENTP would do this eventually.


LOL, don't worry. In fact, YOU'RE LATE!


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## FlaviaGemina

FacelessBeauty said:


> I've known this since I was very young. I get really uncomfortable around large groups of people and I don't like forced interaction at all.
> I just recently learned that I was an INTJ after thinking that I was INFJ for so long. This has helped me understand how I interact with other people a little better and I've learned more about myself by becoming more self-aware I guess.


I didn't use to be that uncomfortable around large groups of people.... Well, I used to sit in my own corner and wonder what was the point of it all. But it didn't make me feel uncomfortable as such.... or maybe that was just me being emotionally retarded. But nowadays, large groups creep me out immediately. I guess it's because I work full-time and am more stressed in general, so I've got less energy left for group situations. Dunno....


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## RedX

Fascinating idea!



FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. No. I have the stereotypically girlish, high-pitched voice associated with women of my ethnic background. It becomes even more high-pitched when I speak Mandarin-Chinese.

2. Not at all. Introverted implies that you draw your energy from being alone or in small groups of people, not that you're shy and quiet, though those two lend well to each other. It also implies that you highly value aspects that come within, such as independent thinking and inner "feelings". All are quite normal to think about.

*age*: 21, but I turn 22 soon.
*location*: Boston, MA USA
*job*: Electrical Engineering Student, Physics Research Assistant, Tutor in School's Learning Center, TA in mathematics courses
*relationship status*: Single. Not looking. Pursuing a High School History teacher.
*meandering career*: Uh, still in school. End goal: Physics Research professor. I love teaching, but I am a perpetual student to the universe. I study cosmology constantly.
*hobbies*: Learning, Reading, Studying people, Tennis, Chess, Outdoors activities (kayaking, extreme sports, skydiving, camping), star-gazing, music, break dancing, fashion coordinating, teaching, playing matchmaker/pickup artist for my male friends.
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: *Fine Arts*, History.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment*: Cooking, Linguistics/Language.
*current obsessive interest*: Cosmology - Specifically Quantum Gravity and Conformal gravity, Differential Geometry, Multilinear Algebra, an ENTP male (yes, singular), exercise. 
I'm a proponent of alternate theories to General relativity, since we all know Einstein wasn't foolproof (it's rubbish that we work in only second order problems/geometries even though it's proven that we live in a 4-dimensional spacial plane)
*former domain of geek-dom*: Linguistics? English Literature? I'm not sure what this is asking.
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: I don't watch TV. Sherlock, I suppose. I love a witty man, with sarcastic, dry wit.
*clothes*: Comfortable, cute, beautiful, sexy. Comfortable is a must though. It's my goal to be a beautiful, intelligent, and _dangerous_ woman. Though I've been told being beautiful and intelligent as a woman often implies dangerous [to all men around her].
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally*: Everything. We're still biologically functioning, are we not? Breathing. Living.

To OP, @_FlaviaGemina_ , if you'd like to talk about Math and Physics, I would be delighted to teach you all that I know, and anything new that I learn. It's quite fascinating to discuss.
@Jaryuu, OOOH, another physics enthusiast. Tell me, have you read Flatland? I hated it before when I studied art and design, but I'm really loving it now.


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## FlaviaGemina

RedX said:


> To OP, @_FlaviaGemina_ , if you'd like to talk about Math and Physics, I would be delighted to teach you all that I know, and anything new that I learn. It's quite fascinating to discuss.


Thanks for the offer. I might ask for help sometime... I work with a boy with special educational needs who's taking A-levels in maths and physics (A-Levels are exams that kids in England have to take at the end of highschool to get into uni.) So I go to his lessons with him and I do their homework so I can help him with it... LOL, A-levels are enough to make my tiny brain burst, but if I've got a specific question, I'll let you know, OK?

Edit: @RedX, actually I do have a question: My boy was off today and they are starting a coursework, where they have to use autograph to make graphs with 3 x-intercepts. But the teacher didn't tell them how to find those graphs, they've just got to experiment and he didn't tell them any method. I came up with a few equations this way:
I chose 3 points on the x-axis first, e.g. 0, 3, -3 and then started to patch together a cubic equation like this y = x^3 +/- _____x. Then I equalled y=0 and filled in the missing number for ___x. I found some nice curves that way, but basically they are all variations of the same kind of shape. 
This one 'weird' boy came up with all kinds of strange equations with n^x and y^5= y^3+...... But he can't explain how he did it.....
Also, the teacher said he doesn't want nice numbers like 1, 2, 3, 4 for the x-intercepts and he doesn't want (0,0) as one of them. So I tried to find an equation and shift it sideways, but I forgot how to do that.  He doesn't want whole numbers ..... 
So........... is there some method?


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## Perhaps

FlaviaGemina said:


> Hey, ladies, here's a question for debate:
> 
> Do you think if women ruled the world, it would be a better place?


Yes. If only because if the balance of power were to somehow instantaneously shift tomorrow, we would have thousands upon thousands of years' worth of examples of what, precisely, _not_ to do.



MegaTuxRacer said:


> Have all of your periods synced up yet?


Why do you want to know? Are you looking to earn your red wings?

@_RedX_, I'd respond in detail, but my brain is choking on the contradictory nature of your posts. You say you believe women aren't inferior, but the rest of the content of your post suggests the opposite. You also say you believe people are inherently logical, but then you say that they're irrational. I'm not sure what your stance actually is on any of that.


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## quadrivium

FlaviaGemina said:


> Hey, ladies, here's a question for debate:
> 
> Do you think if women ruled the world, it would be a better place?



Let's take it a step further:

What would be the pros and cons of an NT woman in power?


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## RedX

@_Action Potential_: I think men and women both have serious faults, but I usually highlight problematic points in either long before I address any of the good. The original question only asked for an opinion on women in power, so I addressed it as such. I could think of just as many issues with men being in power, because I don't think either is any better. 

I think there's a possibility for more good in women simply because we're more empathetic in nature, but because we're social creatures we're often influenced by the opinions of others. Which is why I feel like there'd be no change. Peer pressure, cognitive dissonance, things like that often affect decision making. 

People are inherently logical because logic only requires a premise to be true, then points to support it. Rationality on the other hand requires examining the system and people subjectively first and understanding the idea of, "Is this right?". You often end up taking other people into account too, rather than just yourself. A sociopath can be and usually is perfectly logical, but are not necessarily rational people.

That red wings comment was completely unnecessary and rude, even if his comment was equally so. You could've just ignored it.

Anyways, my stance is that it doesn't matter which gender is in power, it's more important to have *good* people in power. There's no point to having a woman president/prime minister/[Insert whatever your nation has] if she's just as corrupt as her predecessors. Gender, race, sexual identity? It all doesn't matter. Let's put someone who cares for their nation in office.


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## Jaryuu

I think if solely women were in power we'd have a whole set of other problems than the ones created by men. Firstly, I don't think we'd run on capitalism or at least the market wouldn't be as competitive or have as many extremes such as extreme growth or extreme depressions. I say this because women aren't as aggressive nor do we take as many risks in the market as men do. We tend to think more on it and go for the safe route, there is nothing bad about it but we would probably run on a different market system than we do today. Also I think our politics would actually be more corrupt, or at least there would be a lot more back stabbing and drama etc. As much as we are reluctant to admit it, we all have our bitchy sides, and through the extensive observation of the girls at my school, and media portrayal (I'm in no way saying that this is an accurate portrayal of females) but we all gossip and back stab, have our little alliances etc etc etc, we'd have a much more complicated political system. Sure we could have what we have on the outside but in the inside there would be a lot of foul play and manipulation. Maybe some of the problems we have today are gone, but new problems would arise.


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## Perhaps

@_RedX_, thank you for clarifying. That makes much more sense. I would rather have someone competent and slightly less self-serving than average (I'm not really on-board the notion of "good" people and "bad" people, but that's another subject) in power. What I don't like is the notion that somehow women would do worse due to being "more emotional" or some other arbitrary descriptor which really has nothing to do with our ability to lead. In other words, things like this:



> Also I think our politics would actually be more corrupt, or at least there would be a lot more back stabbing and drama etc. As much as we are reluctant to admit it, we all have our bitchy sides, and through the extensive observation of the girls at my school, and media portrayal (I'm in no way saying that this is an accurate portrayal of females) but we all gossip and back stab, have our little alliances etc etc etc, we'd have a much more complicated political system.




Because, quite frankly, it sounds exactly like what we have now, and men are running the show. Like I said, if nothing else, we can learn by example of what _not_ to do.

As for that other comment, I didn't particularly feel like ignoring it, so I didn't. It was actually fairly offensive and I don't believe in meeting that kind of behavior passively.


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## Isis

corgiflatmate said:


> Let's take it a step further:
> 
> What would be the pros and cons of an NT woman in power?


What would be the pros and cons of an NT man in power?


----------



## Dashboard Hula Dancer

*Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? *No, very quiet. Not sure about pitch though. I sort of sound like Helen Hunt and Demi Moore's love child.*

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?* Indeed
*age*: 46 (ancient)
*location*: Iowa (but I'm an California girl)
*job*: Insurance agent
*relationship status*: married
*hobbies: *genealogy, volkswagens, collecting antique gold mining equipment
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: math, statistics, 
*current obsessive interest*: MBTI, introversion and extroversion,
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Who do you think you are? I thought I'd died and gone to heaven. A research show. 
*clothes*: casual as I can be but not to the point of scruffy


----------



## quadrivium

Isis said:


> What would be the pros and cons of an NT man in power?


Are we saying the gap of differences between NT men and NT women are slighter?


----------



## Entropic

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. No. I'm of Asian descent so my voice is very light to my great dismayal. I've always imagined myself as having this deep but utterly sexy female voice but alas. Apparently people that hear me don't think I'm all that bad though and my stepmother has told me that I got a good telephone voice. Well, we're in clear disagreement.

2. I have a tendency to be very soft-spoken and timid if I don't talk about a subject that really interests me and that may result with people not even noticing that I'm there at all. I think the voice that makes people listen to me the most is when I speak with obvious confidence.

*age*: 24
*location*: Schweden
*job*: Unemployed T_T
*relationship status*: Single
*hobbies: *Hobbies? I change them as often as I change clothes... My only real recurrent hobby is my interest in the Bleach manga and perhaps that I do have an interest in debate but not sure if it qualifies as a hobby since people tend to flee in terror when I'm in debate mode IRL :headscratch
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: Neurobiology, physics, especially particle physics and Japanese is on my "to do" list *sigh*
*former domain of geek-dom:* I hang out a lot at the www.bleachasylum.com forums roud: Nah, I'm mostly into the humanities and social sciences and I you find a lot of geeks in the humanities. It's like hipster-heaven but without the hipster-aspect. Especially if you do history, linguistics and philosophy.
*current obsessive interest*: PersC
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Quite a few on my list I think, but Buffy the Vampire Slayer, The X-Files. I think Dexter is too mainstream...
*clothes*: Metalhead/rockish casual when I bother to dress properly

*Hey, ladies, here's another question.
How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?
*Since I was a kid and then we speak like 3+ years old. I score very high on the introverted scale so yeah, it was probably very obvious from the start. I always loved when I was fishing with dad or playing video games (with him) roud: Dad's also an introvert by the way.

*Do you think if women ruled the world, it would be a better place?*
And yes it would. It's actually proven that women in general are more interested in focusing on the well-being of all rather than competition, so women would actually in theory be much better world leaders because they would not sit and squabble about "but you've exceeded the maximum greenhouse gas emissions you were allowed to emit this year, now pay or else...!" our world politicans often do today. There would be much more focus on cooperation. We would also probably see less warfare as women would focus on finding interpersonal solutions to conflict resolution rather than applying military intervention.


----------



## koakuma

*Age:* 23
*Location:* Sweden
*Job:* Receptionist
*Relationship status:* Yes
*Meandering career:* Art/economics/interior design/strategy 
*Hobbies:* Art, design, CAD, interior and exterior design, anything visual, economics, patterns, strategy, watching dramas, walking, gaming, being outside reading in the sun or playing on my old gameboy, driving, motorsports.
*Interests, as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* Rubbish? I'm not rubbish at anything.
*Interests, as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* Languages...
*Current obsessive interest:* MBTI, the cognitive functions, puzzles
*Former domain of geek-dom:* Oooh, aint going there today. 
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* There neither.
*Clothes:* A mix of stylish and Rambo. Rough office.
*Some of the "human" things I like to do occasionally:* Go out.

Gosh, I'm sorry for a boring list. I'm just so freaking tired. 60+ hours of work in one week. -_-



FlaviaGemina said:


> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. I think my voice is pretty average. Just maybe a little deeper than average.

2. "Hey! Listen!" works. If they don't listen, I demand that they listen (if it's not just random whatever. I let words slip to if they are unnessecary. Prioritizing).

*



How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?

Click to expand...

*I did the test first time almost 10 years ago, which confirmed what I had already figured = that I loved to be in my head and that most people around me liked to be outside their heads, and that I had figured the difference since long and that this information was new to the outside-the-head people. At the test (among 30 other students), I was the only INTJ. The rest were mostly ESF or ENF.

It mattered to learn that I was introverted since I got it confirmed. I noticed very early (in kindergarden) that I was different from the other kids. The other kids were loud and playing, and I wanted to test things, play with pearls, draw, etc. I was amazed by how easy it was for the other kids to just be loud and tag along. 

Learning about the cognitive functions have helped me understand myself. I've learned where my brain works the best and what I should boost in. I've also learned how to handle the extroverted people, how to make them understand me. Plus, I've learned that I have no idea how my brain works as well, lol.


----------



## koakuma

*Do you think if women ruled the world, it would be a better place?
*Nah, let's go for 50/50, k? Both are needed. _"It takes two to tango"_. It wouldn't be a _he_, if there would be no _she _(and the other way round). And so on...


----------



## Entropic

koakuma said:


> *Age:* 23
> *Location:* Sweden
> *Job:* Receptionist
> *Relationship status:* Yes
> *Meandering career:* Art/economics/interior design/strategy
> *Hobbies:* Art, design, CAD, interior and exterior design, anything visual, economics, patterns, strategy, watching dramas, walking, gaming, being outside reading in the sun or playing on my old gameboy, driving, motorsports.
> *Interests, as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* Rubbish? I'm not rubbish at anything.
> *Interests, as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* Languages...
> *Current obsessive interest:* MBTI, the cognitive functions, puzzles
> *Former domain of geek-dom:* Oooh, aint going there today.
> *TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* There neither.
> *Clothes:* A mix of stylish and Rambo. Rough office.
> *Some of the "human" things I like to do occasionally:* Go out.
> 
> Gosh, I'm sorry for a boring list. I'm just so freaking tired. 60+ hours of work in one week. -_-
> 
> 
> 1. I think my voice is pretty average. Just maybe a little deeper than average.
> 
> 2. "Hey! Listen!" works. If they don't listen, I demand that they listen (if it's not just random whatever. I let words slip to if they are unnessecary. Prioritizing).
> 
> 
> 
> I did the test first time almost 10 years ago, which confirmed what I had already figured = that I loved to be in my head and that most people around me liked to be outside their heads, and that I had figured the difference since long and that this information was new to the outside-the-head people. At the test (among 30 other students), I was the only INTJ. The rest were mostly ESF or ENF.
> 
> It mattered to learn that I was introverted since I got it confirmed. I noticed very early (in kindergarden) that I was different from the other kids. The other kids were loud and playing, and I wanted to test things, play with pearls, draw, etc. I was amazed by how easy it was for the other kids to just be loud and tag along.
> 
> Learning about the cognitive functions have helped me understand myself. I've learned where my brain works the best and what I should boost in. I've also learned how to handle the extroverted people, how to make them understand me. Plus, I've learned that I have no idea how my brain works as well, lol.


Sweden. WHERE?!


----------



## Isis

corgiflatmate said:


> Are we saying the gap of differences between NT men and NT women are slighter?


Good one. I was actually trying to hint that it was NT rather than gender that could be the key element...but yours is better


----------



## Graficcha

*leaves this here*

Allow me to grind my teeth for three hours and headdesk for twice as long.


----------



## Graficcha

A titch about me, btw

*age*: 21
*location*: Belgium (huzzah huzzah)
*job*: student: Master of Biology + higher secondary education teaching qualification
*relationship status*: 't is complicated, long-distance
*meandering career*: studystudystudy meep meep
*hobbies: *anything virtual from games to roleplay with friends, making up stories and doodling character designs, having long loaded discussions, and unsolicited life-coaching
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: chemistry, perhaps music
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *armchair knowledge in various fields
*current obsessive interest*: anything mind and personality related, figuring out the most effective and proactive ways of coping with people with difficult situations
*former domain of geek-dom*: freakin' Japan and anime, reading tonnes of fiction until I somehow felt I'd 'seen it all before', ran out of good material to keep the flow going
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: House MD, Berserk, Sunday evenings lounging with National Geographic
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: pretend I like puzzle games
*clothes*: jeans and t-shirt, sweater optional, at home the jeans get chucked in a corner
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *want to get married happily ever after, go see a movie with the buds/friends I don't actually know very well



My voice?
I have no idea. I think I sound deeper, and my vocal range is laughably narrow. 

Would I be heard?
In normal conversations, just fine, but when the ambient volume goes up, so does mine.


----------



## voronoi goggles

*age: 18
location: USA- Florida
job: student, unemployed, searching
relationship status: in a relationship
meandering career: Forensic science-- Crime scene analyst
hobbies: surfing the internet, exercising, having conversations, playing with my cats, reading, writing, chess.
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Doing any sort of art, Math.
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: CSS, creating weapons.
current obsessive interest: social psychology, forensic science, getting healthy, my future.
former domain of geek-dom: Skyrim forever
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: How it's made, TED, Natgeo, The universe.
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: i don't know.
clothes: jeans, a blouse, moccasins or any subtle flat.
some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: Pay attention to my appearance.


Voice: Assertive, medium tone, feminine.
- People hear me when i want them to listen.*


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Graficcha said:


> *leaves this here*
> 
> Allow me to grind my teeth for three hours and headdesk for twice as long.



What a weird video. OMG, is this really by the EU? I thought it was a commercial for make-up or something.


----------



## Graficcha

FlaviaGemina said:


> What a weird video. OMG, is this really by the EU? I thought it was a commercial for make-up or something.


That's a commercial commissioned by the EU to promote recruitment of females into science, more specifically engineering and technology areas.

I'm sure you can see why they took it down and everyone's dissing it.


----------



## Entropic

FlaviaGemina said:


> What a weird video. OMG, is this really by the EU? I thought it was a commercial for make-up or something.


lmao I thought the same thing. I am still not sure if I should like it or hate it. It's exactly like the BBT.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

LeaT said:


> lmao I thought the same thing. I am still not sure if I should like it or hate it. It's exactly like the BBT.


What's BBT?


----------



## Entropic

FlaviaGemina said:


> What's BBT?


Big Bang Theory.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

LeaT said:


> Big Bang Theory.


Ah. LOL. Thanks, I'm totally oblivious of what's going on in the world. It was my ESFJ friend who introduced me to BBT.


----------



## Entropic

FlaviaGemina said:


> Ah. LOL. Thanks, I'm totally oblivious of what's going on in the world. It was my ESFJ friend who introduced me to BBT.


I only know it's abbreviated like that because someone else typed it in a thread further down in this subforum :crazy:


----------



## FlaviaGemina

LeaT said:


> I only know it's abbreviated like that because someone else typed it in a thread further down in this subforum :crazy:




Oh my ... I hardly watch any TV at all. I guess I'll wait for 50 years until some of today's popular programmes are classics.


----------



## juansmustache

*Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?


*1.Yeah just a bit though, that's my own body.
2. Not many people ignore me, but when I'm talking about something interesting I keep a tone of excitement in my voice. That reels them in  (hahaha)


----------



## Persephone

After interacting with male and female INTPs (and male fellow INTJs) I'm more convinced that there are gender differences. For one, I connect better with female INTPs than male INTJs. Even though I think like other INTJs, being female, I deal with the world differently, and I definitely _feel_ a more immediate affinity to female INTPs. I often tell friends that my INTP female friend is my "soul mate", and that I have never felt so completely understood me than this girl. We think and feel alike, and even though we have our differences, we can talk about them in such a way that we empathize with each other's quirks, and it never feels like we have to agree to disagree about them because even though we don't act the same way, we understand why the other might.

What can I say. INTP females are just more... female. I used to think I didn't like female company, but still I discovered that connecting with a like-minded female can be magical.

*Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?

*1. No. I either sound deadpan (my voice never drawls or drags) and give very short answers: "No." "Yes." "Do me a favor." Or it's very expressive (but not in an Fe way. Frequently, in an "excited and passionate" way)

2. Yeah. I talk quietly.


----------



## Entropic

For those curious about how I sound, I made this recording for another site which had a game that was about telling people 5 interesting things you about you didn't think others would know. (Damn evil person had to tag me!)


----------



## Helios

LeaT said:


> For those curious about how I sound, I made this recording for another site which had a game that was about telling people 5 interesting things you about you didn't think others would know. (Damn evil person had to tag me!)


Awwww you sound really cute.


----------



## Entropic

FacelessBeauty said:


> Awwww you sound really cute.


:dry:

But I don't want to be cute...


----------



## Helios

@LeaT Just because your voice is cute doesn't mean I'm not going to take you seriously. :wink:


----------



## Entropic

FacelessBeauty said:


> @_LeaT_ Just because your voice is cute doesn't mean I'm not going to take you seriously. :wink:


Why don't I feel assurred?


----------



## Helios

@LeaT I don't know. You've shown me in your posts that you deserve to be taken seriously so you've really got nothing to worry about. :O


----------



## Entropic

FacelessBeauty said:


> @_LeaT_ I don't know. You've shown me in your posts that you deserve to be taken seriously so you've really got nothing to worry about. :O


Oh, I think Ne sarcasm completely flew by... :frustrating:

That's the only problem being Ne. I should socialize more with non-NPs since it's apparent that I've forgotten that I can't take for granted that everyone gets NP humor :frustrating:


----------



## The Wanderer

age: 22
location: USA
job: Unemployed student
relationship status: Single
meandering career: I'm working on a BA on English Lit and Psychology
hobbies: Reading, browsing the interweb, thinking, writing
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Calculus, Writing Poetry, Photography
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: Literary theory and analysis
current obsessive interest: PerC, astrophysics, science fiction, physics in general, neuroscience
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Star Trek TNG, Dead Like Me
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: Figuring out why time slows for the person accelerating at the speed of light while time for others not moving at the speed of light experience time at a normal pace. So far I'm failing at this on an enormous scale.
clothes: very laid back. When I'm at home I wear plaid pajamas and my scary shirt. This particular shirt scares people. I like it. I think that it's morbidly and sarcastically hilarious.

some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: Watching Glee, singing along to showtunes, squealing like a little girl when watching videos of maine ***** on youtube, listening to music, etc.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

The Wanderer said:


> Star Trek TNG


Do you have a favourite character? also @hela @Jennywocky @corgiflatmate @Jaryuu (hope I didn't forget anyone).

Mine is Picard. LOL, I was instantly fascinated with Picard when I first stumbled upon TNG at the tender age of 13 and it turns out he's supposed to be an INTJ. LOL. I'd like to blame some of his embarrassing girl friends on his secret INTP-ness, though 


By the way, what do you ladies think of TOS? Does the sexism and machoism put you off? As for me, I don't take this aspect too seriously. In fact, I find it quite hilarious and can accept it with a sort of detached attitude.


----------



## Jennywocky

FlaviaGemina said:


> Do you have a favourite character? ).
> 
> Mine is Picard. LOL, I was instantly fascinated with Picard when I first stumbled upon TNG at the tender age of 13 and it turns out he's supposed to be an INTJ. LOL. I'd like to blame some of his embarrassing girl friends on his secret INTP-ness, though


I think on ST:TNG I had found Data and Worf the most intriguing -- Data, because I could understand him and he was exploring humanity, in order to learn; and Worf, because I understood his brand of loyalty and honor but he expressed passions in a way I could not and didn't flex or turn from his course regardless of cost, and I admired that.

I did find them all most interesting in their own way, most of the characters were pretty distinct. I think Deanna got the worst lines and just wanted her to shut up much of the time. I also wanted to see Wesley beamed through the shields, he became tiresome.



> By the way, what do you ladies think of TOS? Does the sexism and machoism put you off? As for me, I don't take this aspect too seriously. In fact, I find it quite hilarious and can accept it with a sort of detached attitude.


It doesn't bother me, because I detach from it and can look at it from a third-party POV. Kirk makes me laugh, his intensity makes me laugh. In some ways, they're all a bit of a caricature. Campy fun.

I very much enjoyed Abrams Star Trek reboot recently, and it was kind of eerie how the leads channeled the original performances of the characters.


----------



## hela

FlaviaGemina said:


> Do you have a favourite character? also @_hela_ @_Jennywocky_ @_corgiflatmate_ @_Jaryuu_ (hope I didn't forget anyone).
> 
> Mine is Picard. LOL, I was instantly fascinated with Picard when I first stumbled upon TNG at the tender age of 13 and it turns out he's supposed to be an INTJ. LOL. I'd like to blame some of his embarrassing girl friends on his secret INTP-ness, though
> 
> 
> By the way, what do you ladies think of TOS? Does the sexism and machoism put you off? As for me, I don't take this aspect too seriously. In fact, I find it quite hilarious and can accept it with a sort of detached attitude.


I grew up with TOS, and adore Spock, so. No, not at all.  

Q was my favorite in TNG, although I was also fond of Worf.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Jennywocky said:


> I did find them all most interesting in their own way, most of the characters were pretty distinct. I think Deanna got the worst lines and just wanted her to shut up much of the time.


LOL. "I feel pain!"
I find the whole Riker-Troi business pointless, it's like a soap opera. Whenever one of them has made up their mind, the other says "I CAN'T" *melodramatic voice* for no reason at all. But then I guess Picard and Crusher are even worse 




Jennywocky said:


> I very much enjoyed Abrams Star Trek reboot recently, and it was kind of eerie how the leads channeled the original performances of the characters.


I haven't watched it out of an irrational fear of prequels.... hum, might watch it one day.. or maybe not... I know this sounds silly, but I don't like it that the technology and special effects etc. are better than they were in TOS, when the film is supposed to be set before TOS. That kind of put me off watching ENT after the first season, because it just confuses me. The cool thing about TOS is that the sets and props are all really trashy but I don't even notice it when the story and characters are good.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

hela said:


> I grew up with TOS, and adore Spock, so. No, not at all.


Yep, you've got to love Spock. It's hilarious when Kirk tries to troll him at the end of an episode and he just stands there and raises his eyebrow.


----------



## quadrivium

FlaviaGemina said:


> Do you have a favourite character?


Yeah Picard has been one of my favourite TV characters throughout the span of my life. I always enjoyed Q episodes. He was such a trolly asshole.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

@corgiflatmate, thanks for that clip, I had to laugh out loud  I'll go and pester the husband to watch some TNG with me now.


----------



## quadrivium

Jennywocky said:


> I very much enjoyed Abrams Star Trek reboot recently, and it was kind of eerie how the leads channeled the original performances of the characters.


Agreed. The man who played Spock nailed it.


----------



## The Wanderer

FlaviaGemina said:


> Do you have a favourite character? also @_hela_ @_Jennywocky_ @_corgiflatmate_ @_Jaryuu_ (hope I didn't forget anyone).
> 
> Mine is Picard. LOL, I was instantly fascinated with Picard when I first stumbled upon TNG at the tender age of 13 and it turns out he's supposed to be an INTJ. LOL. I'd like to blame some of his embarrassing girl friends on his secret INTP-ness, though
> 
> 
> By the way, what do you ladies think of TOS? Does the sexism and machoism put you off? As for me, I don't take this aspect too seriously. In fact, I find it quite hilarious and can accept it with a sort of detached attitude.


All of the characters, except Wesley, were interesting in their own way. But my favorite character on TNG was Data; I found his exploration of humanity quite intriguing. I enjoyed his character arc. Data was ironically one of the most human characters on the show.

The sexism and machoism in TOS did not bother me. I just watch it from a detached point of view. I acknowledge that TOS was made in a context in which sexism and machoism was more acceptable, so some of those societal biases will naturally present itself in TOS.

Plus, Spock's character really compensates for the sexism and the machoism in the show. He's just awesome.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

*Picard = INTJ*

^^^ Yep, I can see how Data must appeal to INTPs 
@_corgiflatmate_, your video inspired me to improve my geekdom. So I tried to watch Deja Q yesterday, but my husband doesn't have season 1-3 (crap, I married him just so I can watch his Star Trek DVDs j/k), so I ordered them off amazon.

Anyway, I ended up watching the episode "First Contact" (not the film!), where Riker is reconnoitering on some planet to see whether they could join the Federation. This is the first time I watched TNG after learning about Myers-Briggs. So I watched Picard from a whole new angle, seeing as he's supposed to be an INTJ ............. OMG, I've never had to laugh so hard in my life . 
First I read an epsiode guide where it said "Picard must make his presence known ahead of schedule". ROFL, that's two things in one sentence that an INTJ doesn't like: _making their presence known_ AND doing so _ahead of schedule as well_. I thought: I MUST see this.
So.... Picard beams down to the planet into a scientists office, introduces himself (and Deanny Troi, "my _associate_", whatever that means.. friend? colleague? minion? shrink?) as an _alien on a mission_. OMG, _I _got the shock of my life and I'm supposed to a) like Picard and b) be like him myself ...brrrrr Come on... even I know that this is where you say "Hello, me chicken, luvely day, in'it?"*** Then, throughout the whole episode when he talks to the aliens he drones one mercilessly about the Federation's peaceful mission, learning from each other, humanity, history, this that and the other. Whenever the alien leader makes any objections he just carries on regardless, taking it for granted that they _will_ join. And the alien says "You speak the language of diplomacy well." WTF? Even when the alien leader decides not to join at this point Picard is like "OK, see you soon.". Isn't this were you back off and let them rot on their own?
Summary: 
- OMG, that boy worries me sometimes!
- 100% pure INTJ pester power, now I know why the Borg wanted him as their speaker
- INTJ pester power = the language of diplomacy ?! 
- My husband says I'm not like Picard, but when I think of what I'm like at work .... OMG.... I must devise a plot to trick my boss into telling me whether I have Picard's powers of intimidation.




* Liverpudlian greeting and conversation starter about the weather


*







*


*By the way:
Greetings, INTP girls. I am an INTJ. I am on a friendly mission to explore the culture of your species so that we can learn from each other! (Feeling creeped out yet?) Read the above if this seems out of context. 


*


----------



## Entropic

FlaviaGemina said:


> ^^^ Yep, I can see how Data must appeal to INTPs
> @_corgiflatmate_, your video inspired me to improve my geekdom. So I tried to watch Deja Q yesterday, but my husband doesn't have season 1-3 (crap, I married him just so I can watch his Star Trek DVDs j/k), so I ordered them off amazon.
> 
> Anyway, I ended up watching the episode "First Contact" (not the film!), where Riker is reconnoitering on some planet to see whether they could join the Federation. This is the first time I watched TNG after learning about Myers-Briggs. So I watched Picard from a whole new angle, seeing as he's supposed to be an INTJ ............. OMG, I've never had to laugh so hard in my life .
> First I read an epsiode guide where it said "Picard must make his presence known ahead of schedule". ROFL, that's two things in one sentence that an INTJ doesn't like: _making their presence known_ AND doing so _ahead of schedule as well_. I thought: I MUST see this.
> So.... Picard beams down to the planet into a scientists office, introduces himself (and Deanny Troi, "my _associate_", whatever that means.. friend? colleague? minion? shrink?) as an _alien on a mission_. OMG, _I _got the shock of my life and I'm supposed to a) like Picard and b) be like him myself ...brrrrr Come on... even I know that this is where you say "Hello, me chicken, luvely day, in'it?"*** Then, throughout the whole episode when he talks to the aliens he drones one mercilessly about the Federation's peaceful mission, learning from each other, humanity, history, this that and the other. Whenever the alien leader makes any objections he just carries on regardless, taking it for granted that they _will_ join. And the alien says "You speak the language of diplomacy well." WTF? Even when the alien leader decides not to join at this point Picard is like "OK, see you soon.". Isn't this were you back off and let them rot on their own?
> Summary:
> - OMG, that boy worries me sometimes!
> - 100% pure INTJ pester power, now I know why the Borg wanted him as their speaker
> - INTJ pester power = the language of diplomacy ?!
> - My husband says I'm not like Picard, but when I think of what I'm like at work .... OMG.... I must device a plot to trick my boss into telling me whether I have Picard's powers of intimidation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> * Liverpudlian greeting and conversation starter about the weather
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *
> 
> 
> *By the way:
> Greetings, INTP girls. I am an INTJ. I am on a friendly mission to explore the culture of your species so that we can learn from each other! (Feeling creeped out yet?) Read the above if this seems out of context.
> 
> 
> *


Hi...?


----------



## FlaviaGemina

LeaT said:


> Hi...?


LOL, you are brave


----------



## FlaviaGemina

OK, here's another question for debate: Are all women "sisters"?


----------



## Graficcha

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, here's another question for debate: Are all women "sisters"?



No.


----------



## Entropic

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, here's another question for debate: Are all women "sisters"?


No, I don't like the idea. It makes me sound as if I'm a part of a collective I did not choose. It sounds more like something an Fe dom or aux would say I think.


----------



## Helios

Like I always say, human being first, everything else second. On top of that, I'd much prefer autonomy.


----------



## Library_Cat

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. Yes, my voice is a bit deeper than those of most of the girls I know, but it's not like I sound like a guy. 
2. I do often find myself making an effort to sound more animated/involved in a statement than I really feel, and I have had the problem of not being listened to (especially frustrating when I'm making perfect sense logically, so they should be able to follow me with no problem). This might have something to do with the fact that I'm a bit soft-spoken, though.


----------



## quadrivium

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, here's another question for debate: Are all women "sisters"?


Considering the psychological warfare women put each other through, I'd say we have a ways to go before making that claim.


----------



## Library_Cat

corgiflatmate said:


> Considering the psychological warfare women put each other through, I'd say we have a ways to go before making that claim.


Very true... Haha. But I'd like to think that on some level, we do want to treat each other as sisters when we have the chance (like when we're not in direct competition for something). But it doesn't always start out that way, and when you start off badly with a woman, it's rough from then on...


----------



## The Wanderer

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, here's another question for debate: Are all women "sisters"?


IMO, Not really. Being " sisters" implies that all women share a commonality so significant that they have to form a collective. Women as a whole has not found that general commonality that's beyond biology. Women finding this significant commonality is improbable because women are so different from one another. These differences are aggravated due to social and cultural influences.


----------



## Library_Cat

The Wanderer said:


> IMO, Not really. Being " sisters" implies that all women share a commonality so significant that they have to form a collective. Women as a whole has not found that general commonality that's beyond biology. Women finding this significant commonality is improbable because women are so different from one another. These differences are aggravated due to social and cultural influences.


True, we are all very different. And that can be frustrating, sometimes even unbearable. 
I was thinking of the term "sisters" a little bit differently than you, perhaps. I was thinking, it's not so important that we are all the same (in fact, I prefer that we are different from each other, because this variety offers more opportunities for learning and growth for all of us), but that as family members of a kind, we watch out for each other. This doesn't necessarily happen all the time, but it can happen, similarly to how biological sisters often behave towards each other despite major differences in personality and perspective.


----------



## Graficcha

Library_Cat said:


> True, we are all very different. And that can be frustrating, sometimes even unbearable.
> I was thinking of the term "sisters" a little bit differently than you, perhaps. I was thinking, it's not so important that we are all the same (in fact, I prefer that we are different from each other, because this variety offers more opportunities for learning and growth for all of us), but that as family members of a kind, we watch out for each other. This doesn't necessarily happen all the time, but it can happen, similarly to how biological sisters often behave towards each other despite major differences in personality and perspective.


At least you said 'often' and not 'always'.
My younger sister firmly believes I was trying to kill her and mom when I made a mistake driving when I was highly stressed and just in training, and mom'd been nagging me uselessly for minutes.

She talks to me like I'm the household's pet retard.


----------



## Library_Cat

Graficcha said:


> At least you said 'often' and not 'always'.
> My younger sister firmly believes I was trying to kill her and mom when I made a mistake driving when I was highly stressed and just in training, and mom'd been nagging me uselessly for minutes.
> 
> She talks to me like I'm the household's pet retard.


I'm sorry. I know how stressful it is to be nagged at for a long time, while just learning to drive. (Recent experience for me.) I'm an only child, so at least I didn't have that particular stress. I hope your sister matures a bit soon and stops speaking that way to you.

I don't think one can ever make a generalization that truly represents the entire human population, even when it is only limited to women or sisters. :laughing: But we are all human, and we're all fumbling in the same dark. I'd just like to think that it's not so far out of human nature to extend a helping hand to the people around us when it's possible.


----------



## The Wanderer

Library_Cat said:


> True, we are all very different. And that can be frustrating, sometimes even unbearable.
> I was thinking of the term "sisters" a little bit differently than you, perhaps. I was thinking, it's not so important that we are all the same (in fact, I prefer that we are different from each other, because this variety offers more opportunities for learning and growth for all of us), but that as family members of a kind, we watch out for each other. This doesn't necessarily happen all the time, but it can happen, similarly to how biological sisters often behave towards each other despite major differences in personality and perspective.


Yeah, each of us was thinking of it in a different way. I was thinking of "sisters" from a political standpoint. But I do agree with your point that we should seek to watch out for each other, despite of our differences.


----------



## Kiwizoom

I only have two friends that are girls and they are both INTJ.
We have some cross-cultural exchange problems sometimes.

I am often the one trying to make the weirdest, wittiest comments which may go unnoticed and can frustrate me, while they can squee over simple things like cute animals and babies. And they have trouble noticing things, where my hiccup of wishing they were mind readers comes in.
But I love them, we all have this low energy attitude. A lot of our conversations go like this:

"What do you want to do?"
"I don't know, what do you want to do?"
"I don't know, what do you want to do..?"
''
''
''
"How about let's do this."
"ok"

And the computer/game fest thing continues unimpeded for hours

I am thankful that they are not like my old friends, who were pretty cruel and unforgiving about things. I feel like with them I could have a friendship that wasn't rocky, because none of us are conflict seeking or try incite competitive emotions like pride or jealousy


----------



## See Above

Dashboard Hula Dancer said:


> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? *No, very quiet. Not sure about pitch though. I sort of sound like Helen Hunt and Demi Moore's love child.*
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?* Indeed
> *age*: 46 (ancient)
> *location*: Iowa (but I'm an California girl)
> *job*: Insurance agent
> *relationship status*: married
> *hobbies: *genealogy, volkswagens, collecting antique gold mining equipment
> *interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: math, statistics,
> *current obsessive interest*: MBTI, introversion and extroversion,
> *TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Who do you think you are? I thought I'd died and gone to heaven. A research show.
> *clothes*: casual as I can be but not to the point of scruffy


*age:* over 50 (HollaHh to Hula! Another mature specimen!)
*location:* NE quarter of U.S.
*job:* higher education
*relationship status:* currently hermit
*hobbies:* working full-time and being a single home-owner leaves little time for "hobbies". I have creative fits around holidays sometimes.
*interests resulting in rubbish:* math, cooking
*current obsessive interest (COI):* people, getting healthy
*TV program qualifying me for super-geekdom:* I'm old. I've watched'em all, I still do. PBS shows, too.
*clothes:* more or less professional attire during the work week. I tend to absolutely destroy my casual clothes (with gusto), so dark colors, cozy, cheap and comfortable on the week-ends.

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
Yes. Deeper, not bored.
*
2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
Not if they can see my eyes.

I've had one very good INTJ friend and my current boss is INTJ, - both female. INTJs, female or otherwise, have much to offer the world.

Here is a questions for INTJ/INTP women. Is there such a thing as a "mothering" instinct and, if so, how does it/did it manifest for you personally?


----------



## Persephone

*age*: 19
*location*: Midwest
*job*: Rising college sophomore
*relationship status*: going steady
*meandering career*: If I had a clue all my problems would be solved
*hobbies*: Reading, surfing the web, listening to music
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: Physics
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment*: Latin
*current obsessive interest*: Latin, real analysis
*former domain of geek-dom*: history
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: The Blue Planet (BBC)
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: Draw, haha. I don't take art classes but I can't help but want to sketch shit sometimes. My most recent attempt at a self portrait:








*clothes*: T-shirt + shorts in the summer. Hoodie + cloaks and down jackets, if necessary + jeans in the winter.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally*: Um. I do lots of human things.


----------



## beth x

Sapphyreopal5 said:


> Very well thought out view. I never thought about this in this way. Thanks for the new perspective (that is logical he he)! I do agree that people believe they are meant to be parents (especially women) when they get all excited and feel all "bonded" with the newborn child once it's born. I don't always think that parents know what is best for their child. In a lot of cases they do but not all the time. I read an article once in a Psychology Today magazine that talked about how parents in America tend to see a child's failures as their own fault, and that problems with a child are entirely their own (thus American parents tend to be more miserable in this way). That's just generally speaking but perhaps that trend has to do with what you said.
> 
> At the end of the day, it really is a crap-shoot how a person turns out in the end. Sure with the right environment a person typically thrives well and the wrong a person doesn't do so well, but sometimes the best parents create monstrous children (think of psychopaths), and the worst parents can create perfectly sane, healthy children. Some people are meant to be parents and others are not meant to be (and no, this isn't determined by someone's fertility, or how well they initially bond with the child when they're first born, or the strength of someone's desire for kids).


Thanks. I guess a fair amount of support in growth is dependent on adapting to a child's needs in personality. I hardly know anyone who can be objective about their own children, they see themselves a fair amount of the time or they are trying to impose some type of hope for them. They don't always have the knowledge or the wherewithal (with constant other concerns such as finance/work) to reflect, adapt and modify to benefit those types of concerns.

I heard recently (a news report) that success/health/well being is highly dependent on levels of literacy. Of course this backs up the idea that instinct isn't all that it's cracked up to be too.


----------



## Library_Cat

bethdeth said:


> I heard recently (a news report) that success/health/well being is highly dependent on levels of literacy. Of course this backs up the idea that instinct isn't all that it's cracked up to be too.


Hmm, that's interesting. There is definitely a correlation, I'm sure. But I wonder if "success" is dependent on (caused by) literacy, or if it might be the other way around? I know it happens both ways, but I would think that you would have to be relatively privileged in the first place to have the time to read. It's easy to forget, isn't it? XD I find myself worrying about "first world problems" more than is probably healthy for me.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Persephone said:


> The Blue Planet (BBC)


I watched an episode of that with one of my pupils today and really enjoyed it. The quality of the pictures is amazing. Will try to find some more on iplayer now.


----------



## beth x

Library_Cat said:


> Hmm, that's interesting. There is definitely a correlation, I'm sure. But I wonder if "success" is dependent on (caused by) literacy, or if it might be the other way around? I know it happens both ways, but I would think that you would have to be relatively privileged in the first place to have the time to read. It's easy to forget, isn't it? XD I find myself worrying about "first world problems" more than is probably healthy for me.


It was general happiness they were talking about. Health, happiness, success. I might have a look around to see what the damn study is and what it's about. 

Yes it is a privilege to be able to take time out from general food gathering, keeping out of the elements (how much time? Not much here at all) to sit around on the netz and read stuff. I try not to take for granted now how very lucky I am to live in Aus. So many boat people die just to come here. I think we are even luckier than the States in a lot of ways. These thoughts help me to refrain from whining so much about getting the wrong colour hair dye, heh.


----------



## muddy120

lol NTs rock


----------



## See Above

bethdeth said:


> I think it's a confusion between bonding with the child and knowing what to do for a child. The concept of maternal instinct implies that mothers always know best for their babies because they love them the best, know them the best. Whilst it may be true to some extent there has to be knowledge on what to do. How do they get the knowledge? It can't all be instinctual, they learn by talking to "expert" others (mothers who have children already), they read books on what to expect, they have regular checkups. Bonding by the gush of oxytocin when the baby is born isn't an instinct, it's a biological event. It doesn't always occur either (post natal depression, not bonding with child).


I understand your point, still, after I posed the questions it occurred to me that both men and women respond to a child in distress and, there are occasional instances of inter-species "mothering." While acknowledging that there is no guarantee that any individual will be at all good at it, there does seem to be some evidence for an impulse toward nurturing/protecting younglings. Perhaps the term mothering, or maternal, instinct is too restricting?


----------



## Graficcha

See Above said:


> I understand your point, still, after I posed the questions it occurred to me that both men and women respond to a child in distress and, there are occasional instances of inter-species "mothering." While acknowledging that there is no guarantee that any individual will be at all good at it, there does seem to be some evidence for an impulse toward nurturing/protecting younglings. Perhaps the term mothering, or maternal, instinct is too restricting?


I'd rather say maternal instict refers to the urge to at least TRY to look after a baby and raise a child well, also applicable to cutesy animals and confused or injured or cutesy adults.

No guarantees it'll actually WORK included in the definition. After all, a hare has an instict to run away from danger, instinct doesn't mean it'll not suck at getting away alive. It may entail some unconscious notions of 'how to' but I don't think FAPs as complicated as feeding a baby with a spoon and changing diapers really exist in the human species, let alone homework aid and teaching morale and attitudes.


----------



## JackInTheBox

Prof. Song said:


> I'm actually pretty high.


Heh. You know I had to do it.


----------



## Navi

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. Deeper? Not at all. In fact, countless times I have been told I sound like Fluttershy from My Little Pony:tongue:. More bored? Oh definitely. I'm always speaking in monotone and am told that I can make good jokes, I just suck at delivery. 

2. This...oh yes. Story of my life. :frustrating:


----------



## FlaviaGemina

*Hey girls, I need your advice about "socialising" with colleagues.

*I work as a teaching assistnat at a school and there are about 30 people on our 'team'. The thing is we're not really a team, as in 'a group of people working together on the same project'. Some of us have their 'own' individual kids who they work with and some work with a whole class. Others work with this same class, too, but in different lessons (at different times, so they don't work together as such).
At lunch, lots of people sit in the staff room in their little groups and have conversations (mainly about personal small talky matters such as what they bought and what they are going to buy next, their weekend, their kids/nans/mums etc.)
This being England, most people have no problem whatsoever talking about their private life in front of everyone, but you're not really allowed to talk about anything more abstract like politics, what's going on in the world etc, because these matters are considered private and personal (confused!!!). Sometimes the two resident ISFJ ladies sit in their quiet corner and complain about how it is too noisy. Nowadays one of them goes to our office and then tells whoever is there (me or one of our bosses) everything about her children. Alos, most of these people claim to be "friends" with the people in their group, but they aren't friends outside school. I suppose they just mean "colleagues who get along well". 
Now, if I were back in Germany, there'd probably be a cafe next to the school and I'd just ask the two ladies "Hey, do you girls wanna go for a coffee?" and then we'd talk about some topic that seems relevant at the time. It's just something that colleagues can do in Germany without any expectations of life-long friendship etc.
I have conversations with everyone individually at one point or another and get along well enough with most people, but I don't really join any groups because there are too many dynamics going on within the groups and I don't care to be involved in them.

Now, about twice a year there is some socialising event for the whole school organized by some teacher or admin person.
This is what happened at Christmas:
An admin decided we must all go to a fancy hotel for a 3 course meal, which costs £70 (a huge amount of money in the middle of an economic crisis for people with families). You had to sign up for it in advance in JUNE, I kid you not. Lots of people refused to sign up for it because a) they don't have the money b) they had no say in choosing the location c) they'd have to travel there and be stranded in the middle of the night.
So one of my bosses (ENFJ?) decided we should do our own thing and enlisted a colleague (ISTJ?) to organise it. I don't know why the ENFJ didn't organise it hersefl, seeing as it was her idea. So the ISTJ decided that we'd go to a pub on the last Friday of term. First everybody said what a great idea it was because we all love each other and should really socialize together. Then people started shouting that they can't possible go out on the last day of term because they want to go home to their families. Then they all asked each other "Are you going? Who's going? I don't know whether I'm going." They all shouted at the ISTJ, so he changed it to Thursday. Then the same people who had complained about the Friday, among them the ISTJ's "friend", started shouting at him in front of everyone that they can't possibly go on the Thursday. They can't get drunk on the Thursday because they'll have to work on the Friday!" Nobody said they have to get drunk but never mind. Then it all fell apart and my INTP lady boss said that she and some other people are going to the pub on the first Tuesday of the holidays and whoever wants to join them is welcome. (I would have liked to go, but I was in Germany at that time).
Now, the same thing happened again for this year's end-of-term do: A teacher booked a pub with a DJ for the whole school and she had to pay the DJ in advance. Everyone had to pay her £3 (a trifling amount of money) two weeks in advance. You had to buy your own food and drinks at the pub. Lots of people signed up for it, but didn't pay. ENFJ says how nice it will be to socialise with everyone including the teachers. I decided straight away not to go, because I know I can't handle that kind of event on the last day of term when I'm shattered from a long year at work. My INTP boss got people from our team to write their name up on the board in our office and collected the money to pass it on to the teacher. She doesn't bother me about these events because she knows what I'm like. This one day, I was sitting and dozing in the office after work because I was exhausted. It was obvious that I was sleeping. Also, I hadn't written my name on the board and it was obvious that I didn't intend to, because the deadline had passed. Pushy ISFJ lady: "FlaviaGemina, are you going? We won't bite!" Me: "No." Considerate ISFJ lady: "You SHOULD go!" Me: *ignore*. INTP boss lady: *ignore*. 
So far so good, ...everyone was going except me and the INTPs little sister. Everyone got to bother me and I survived and got over it.
The following day ENFJ boss asks me weather I'm going and I say "No, not my kind of thing." She looks a bit shocked but got over it.
On the day of the event half the people who said they were going changed their mind. A colleague (a man who's always flirting with everyone, talking about carrots, trying to be friends with everyone but who gets aggressive and even kicks another colleague) arrived in the office and told the ENFJ boss "People are voting with their feet now!". ENFJ decides we should do our own thing, because she doesn't really want to go out with the teachers, it should just be our team. Says we should all go to the NEAREST pub straight after school, so everyone can go. I tell ENJF boss that I'd like to go. She enlists male colleague to organise it. I was willing to go to the pub straight after school, because I'd still be awake enough and it's easy to travel there. Male colleague decides that he wants to go to a different pub further away in the evening, just before the main event, and makes an announcement about it in a meeting. 
So I decided to go home and stay there because I can't travel to that other pub. 
Considerate ISFJ lady got confused because "nobody" was going to the main event any more. But there was a girl who was leaving to do teacher training. So ISFJ girl says to her "Oh, it's your leaving do. I'm going for you then!"
ENTP boss (boss of the whole team) usually disappears without a comment.

Anyway, most people do a lot of "self disclosure" at work and it's very unlikely that they'd get to know each other any better at a socialising event. If they are socially competent, they make polite conversation. This is bearable, but seems odd because it's like talking to strangers and actually people know each other better than that. If they are scallies, they get drunk and make nasty comments about each other.

Last year, an INxJ boy went to the main event and afterwards went on a pub crawl with some of the males. 6 weeks later someone asked him what it was like and he said it was good but there were "only" 4 people. 

Although people hang around in their little groups at lunch, they are incapable of just going out in their little group, because everybody needs to be involved and it would also be too direct to invite anyone personally. People might think they are friends or something and that would be strange.

I usually take a lot of flak for the whole situation, because I'm one of the few people who make up their own mind, but I'm not a boss, so I'm an easy target.

So, ISTJ husband and me have analysed the situation and we think the problem is that there is no activity to do, apart from getting drunk. Nor is it possible to have a conversation because the group is too big and the DJ makes too much noise.
So I'm now thinking of organising a German Games Night, which is where people play harmless family-friendly board or card games and there is no need for ill-fated conversations. I'd like to make a poster about it that explains what it is and says "If it sounds interesting to you just show up on the day. If it sounds boring, don't". I'll do it at the pub next to school right after school on a Friday. And I'll say that German rules for buying drinks apply. I.e. everyone has to buy their own drink and food and they aren't excpected to buy rounds for everyone. --> No one can complain that it's too expensive. 
They don't need to sign up for it, so that should reduce the bickering and agonizing. Also, if nobody shows up, I'll just go home and sleep. In fact, I don't care how many people show up, as long as it's enough people to play a game. The less the merrier.
Seeing as I'm the 'host' they can't bother me to go, because I'll already be there, lurking for them to appear. Also, if people insist on getting to know my 'human' side, playing games IS my human side. Getting drunk isn't. If they don't like it, I can't help them. 
I know a handful of people who would probably be interested, but I don't know whether they'll have the courage to show up in a small group or whether they'll drop like flies when they find out that "nobody" (i.e. less than 30 people) is going. 
Hum... it sounds like a good plan to me, but I'm still not 100% sure whether it's worth the effort. Personally, I could live without it and right now my only motivation is to get people off my back. I.e. if they don't want to spend their free time at my "event", why should I even worry about spending my free time at theirs? If nobody indicates an interest in it, I'd then have the right to just shrug them off without a second thought when they bother me about their events. On the other hand, if a few people do show up, we could have a nice time. On the downside: others would get jealous and comment on how geeky or exclusive we are.

So what do you think? Would you do it? What's the socialising situation at your work place like? Do you ever socialise with huge groups of colleagues? Are you friends with some colleagues outside work?
Thanks for your help


----------



## A Little Bit of Cheeze

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. Pretty much, I guess I sound a bit mature for my age... and I always sounds bored/uninterested :mellow:

2. Depends on who I'm talking to and what I'm talking about. If somebody's purposely making conversation with me, I'll make sure to speak up but when it's a group conversation... I tend to have to repeat myself a lot because apparently I'm "too quite" and "mumble" a lot.  But I beg to differ... it's not my fault everybody else is too loud :laughing:

I'm just going to be stalking this thread and see what happens here... I like stories... 

Oh and for that socializing thing.... I never even bother... but then again I don't know anybody to socialize with in the first place.

EDIT:
heh... I forgot to add this... 

*age*: not important right now
*location*: US of A 
*job*: nope
*relationship status*: .... no. 
*meandering career*: ......
*hobbies: *photography, psychology, writing, hiking, people watching... rping, art in general
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: messing around with gimp/photoshop
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *...speaking in a very pretentious manner? ... writing.
*current obsessive interest*: ...I had a slight obsession with a certain anime, a band, and a movie... but it's all faded again and I'm bored. 
*former domain of geek-dom*: LOtR, psychology 
*TV program that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: ...... I usually only watch crime shows... the news? Oh, I was watching Dragon Ball Z with my brother til 2AM last night (or this morning?) 
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: My brother tried to get me to play video games with him... I was alright-ish... 
*clothes*: shirt, pants... the basics. Sometimes a hat. 
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally:* I like watching tv, surfing the web... taking walks in the woods... baking... typing out dots .... 

That's it.


----------



## illegal

1. Yes, my voice is deeper than other girls. 

2. No, I naturally project. People say I'm too loud. I tell them to shove it.

I'm 23
I live in Tennessee
I work at a Ford Dealership as the Internet Director and Head of Social Media Marketing (no, I don't make alot of money - at all)
My style varies. Nice, dressy for work. Jeans and a hoodie everywhere I can get away with it. I'm also a big fan of lazing nude.
Hobbies include reading, writing, and that's it. really.
what I wish I was good at but am totally rubbish -- linguistics
I forgot the rest. 

:kitteh:


----------



## Sapphyreopal5

FlaviaGemina said:


> *Hey girls, I need your advice about "socialising" with colleagues.
> 
> *I work as a teaching assistnat at a school and there are about 30 people on our 'team'. The thing is we're not really a team, as in 'a group of people working together on the same project'. Some of us have their 'own' individual kids who they work with and some work with a whole class. Others work with this same class, too, but in different lessons (at different times, so they don't work together as such).
> At lunch, lots of people sit in the staff room in their little groups and have conversations (mainly about personal small talky matters such as what they bought and what they are going to buy next, their weekend, their kids/nans/mums etc.)
> This being England, most people have no problem whatsoever talking about their private life in front of everyone, but you're not really allowed to talk about anything more abstract like politics, what's going on in the world etc, because these matters are considered private and personal (confused!!!). Sometimes the two resident ISFJ ladies sit in their quiet corner and complain about how it is too noisy. Nowadays one of them goes to our office and then tells whoever is there (me or one of our bosses) everything about her children. Alos, most of these people claim to be "friends" with the people in their group, but they aren't friends outside school. I suppose they just mean "colleagues who get along well".
> Now, if I were back in Germany, there'd probably be a cafe next to the school and I'd just ask the two ladies "Hey, do you girls wanna go for a coffee?" and then we'd talk about some topic that seems relevant at the time. It's just something that colleagues can do in Germany without any expectations of life-long friendship etc.
> I have conversations with everyone individually at one point or another and get along well enough with most people, but I don't really join any groups because there are too many dynamics going on within the groups and I don't care to be involved in them.
> 
> Now, about twice a year there is some socialising event for the whole school organized by some teacher or admin person.
> This is what happened at Christmas:
> An admin decided we must all go to a fancy hotel for a 3 course meal, which costs £70 (a huge amount of money in the middle of an economic crisis for people with families). You had to sign up for it in advance in JUNE, I kid you not. Lots of people refused to sign up for it because a) they don't have the money b) they had no say in choosing the location c) they'd have to travel there and be stranded in the middle of the night.
> So one of my bosses (ENFJ?) decided we should do our own thing and enlisted a colleague (ISTJ?) to organise it. I don't know why the ENFJ didn't organise it hersefl, seeing as it was her idea. So the ISTJ decided that we'd go to a pub on the last Friday of term. First everybody said what a great idea it was because we all love each other and should really socialize together. Then people started shouting that they can't possible go out on the last day of term because they want to go home to their families. Then they all asked each other "Are you going? Who's going? I don't know whether I'm going." They all shouted at the ISTJ, so he changed it to Thursday. Then the same people who had complained about the Friday, among them the ISTJ's "friend", started shouting at him in front of everyone that they can't possibly go on the Thursday. They can't get drunk on the Thursday because they'll have to work on the Friday!" Nobody said they have to get drunk but never mind. Then it all fell apart and my INTP lady boss said that she and some other people are going to the pub on the first Tuesday of the holidays and whoever wants to join them is welcome. (I would have liked to go, but I was in Germany at that time).
> Now, the same thing happened again for this year's end-of-term do: A teacher booked a pub with a DJ for the whole school and she had to pay the DJ in advance. Everyone had to pay her £3 (a trifling amount of money) two weeks in advance. You had to buy your own food and drinks at the pub. Lots of people signed up for it, but didn't pay. ENFJ says how nice it will be to socialise with everyone including the teachers. I decided straight away not to go, because I know I can't handle that kind of event on the last day of term when I'm shattered from a long year at work. My INTP boss got people from our team to write their name up on the board in our office and collected the money to pass it on to the teacher. She doesn't bother me about these events because she knows what I'm like. This one day, I was sitting and dozing in the office after work because I was exhausted. It was obvious that I was sleeping. Also, I hadn't written my name on the board and it was obvious that I didn't intend to, because the deadline had passed. Pushy ISFJ lady: "FlaviaGemina, are you going? We won't bite!" Me: "No." Considerate ISFJ lady: "You SHOULD go!" Me: *ignore*. INTP boss lady: *ignore*.
> So far so good, ...everyone was going except me and the INTPs little sister. Everyone got to bother me and I survived and got over it.
> The following day ENFJ boss asks me weather I'm going and I say "No, not my kind of thing." She looks a bit shocked but got over it.
> On the day of the event half the people who said they were going changed their mind. A colleague (a man who's always flirting with everyone, talking about carrots, trying to be friends with everyone but who gets aggressive and even kicks another colleague) arrived in the office and told the ENFJ boss "People are voting with their feet now!". ENFJ decides we should do our own thing, because she doesn't really want to go out with the teachers, it should just be our team. Says we should all go to the NEAREST pub straight after school, so everyone can go. I tell ENJF boss that I'd like to go. She enlists male colleague to organise it. I was willing to go to the pub straight after school, because I'd still be awake enough and it's easy to travel there. Male colleague decides that he wants to go to a different pub further away in the evening, just before the main event, and makes an announcement about it in a meeting.
> So I decided to go home and stay there because I can't travel to that other pub.
> Considerate ISFJ lady got confused because "nobody" was going to the main event any more. But there was a girl who was leaving to do teacher training. So ISFJ girl says to her "Oh, it's your leaving do. I'm going for you then!"
> ENTP boss (boss of the whole team) usually disappears without a comment.
> 
> Anyway, most people do a lot of "self disclosure" at work and it's very unlikely that they'd get to know each other any better at a socialising event. If they are socially competent, they make polite conversation. This is bearable, but seems odd because it's like talking to strangers and actually people know each other better than that. If they are scallies, they get drunk and make nasty comments about each other.
> 
> Last year, an INxJ boy went to the main event and afterwards went on a pub crawl with some of the males. 6 weeks later someone asked him what it was like and he said it was good but there were "only" 4 people.
> 
> Although people hang around in their little groups at lunch, they are incapable of just going out in their little group, because everybody needs to be involved and it would also be too direct to invite anyone personally. People might think they are friends or something and that would be strange.
> 
> I usually take a lot of flak for the whole situation, because I'm one of the few people who make up their own mind, but I'm not a boss, so I'm an easy target.
> 
> So, ISTJ husband and me have analysed the situation and we think the problem is that there is no activity to do, apart from getting drunk. Nor is it possible to have a conversation because the group is too big and the DJ makes too much noise.
> So I'm now thinking of organising a German Games Night, which is where people play harmless family-friendly board or card games and there is no need for ill-fated conversations. I'd like to make a poster about it that explains what it is and says "If it sounds interesting to you just show up on the day. If it sounds boring, don't". I'll do it at the pub next to school right after school on a Friday. And I'll say that German rules for buying drinks apply. I.e. everyone has to buy their own drink and food and they aren't excpected to buy rounds for everyone. --> No one can complain that it's too expensive.
> They don't need to sign up for it, so that should reduce the bickering and agonizing. Also, if nobody shows up, I'll just go home and sleep. In fact, I don't care how many people show up, as long as it's enough people to play a game. The less the merrier.
> Seeing as I'm the 'host' they can't bother me to go, because I'll already be there, lurking for them to appear. Also, if people insist on getting to know my 'human' side, playing games IS my human side. Getting drunk isn't. If they don't like it, I can't help them.
> I know a handful of people who would probably be interested, but I don't know whether they'll have the courage to show up in a small group or whether they'll drop like flies when they find out that "nobody" (i.e. less than 30 people) is going.
> Hum... it sounds like a good plan to me, but I'm still not 100% sure whether it's worth the effort. Personally, I could live without it and right now my only motivation is to get people off my back. I.e. if they don't want to spend their free time at my "event", why should I even worry about spending my free time at theirs? If nobody indicates an interest in it, I'd then have the right to just shrug them off without a second thought when they bother me about their events. On the other hand, if a few people do show up, we could have a nice time. On the downside: others would get jealous and comment on how geeky or exclusive we are.
> 
> So what do you think? Would you do it? What's the socialising situation at your work place like? Do you ever socialise with huge groups of colleagues? Are you friends with some colleagues outside work?
> Thanks for your help


Wow that was a lot to read (have been meaning to get back to you sooner but hey later better than never, right?)! Well I would say that sounds like a lot of effort to get people off your back, although I do suppose that organizing an event one time rather than going to a bunch of events would help out in the long run ha ha. Some of your colleagues sound very... oh boy, they sound like they're pieces of work ha ha. And really, do get-togethers really have to be a lot of money for some of these people? Idk why people don't realize they can have fun without spending money. 

I do like your idea however. Something funny I've noticed is that at get togethers with large groups of people, people will insist "everyone" shows up, yet everyone is stuck in their own little "cliques" and don't socialize with anyone outside those cliques. Idk if that is the case with your "team" or not but it sounds like it could be, since you stated only a "handful" of people most likely would be interested unless everyone is going.

I have to say, I'd be pretty frustrated in your spot too. Those are nice problems to have I must admit but still (well compared to more serious problems). I would probably do the event thing and if no one shows or only a few, then they have no valid point in complaining if you don't show up to future events. Furthermore, it should show them you are at least somewhat willing to join in on group activities if you are willing to put together something.

Hope this helps a bit :happy:


----------



## Wasp

FlaviaGemina said:


> *Hey girls, I need your advice about "socialising" with colleagues.*
> ..................................................
> ..................................................
> So what do you think? Would you do it? What's the socialising situation at your work place like? Do you ever socialise with huge groups of colleagues? Are you friends with some colleagues outside work?
> Thanks for your help


*My initial thoughts:* It doesn't sound like anyone at your workplace is worth your time. 
If i were you? Were you to give them any time, perhaps show up for an hour (tops) to someone's hyped-up pub outing. It proves to be a dud & you leave, or you caught the new intern cozy with the guy in accounting, and that's just funny.

I'd spare yourself the headache of dealing with everyone's idiosyncrasies in order to unite outside work for whatever year-end or xmas reason ppl have. It's _work. _
And, if you honestly don't care to be around those coworkers any longer than your work schedule lasts in any other situation, then what difference does it make? Now you get to suffer in their presence after everyone has enhanced their insufferable traits with alcohol. Yay! 

*My secondary thoughts:* On the other hand, if there are some of whom you don't mind too much, and would enjoy their company. Then, this is what i would do. I'd go along to whatever event is being attended by the people you 'like' (AKA - you wouldn't immediately punch them in the throat if it were suggested by anyone aloud). See how things go (since i don't recall seeing you relay anything about ever attending any of the "events"), and store the information for yourself in case you get a silly idea next year. 

Perhaps next year you'll laugh at the thought of burdening yourself with it. OR, perhaps you'll know just what to do to bring them all together.

I tend to find that there are admirable people with the skills to handle event planning and the shit that goes with it, and i'm not one of them.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Sapphyreopal5 said:


> I have to say, I'd be pretty frustrated in your spot too. *Those are nice problems to have I must admit* but still (well compared to more serious problems). I would probably do the event thing and if no one shows or only a few, then they have no valid point in complaining if you don't show up to future events. Furthermore, it should show them you are at least somewhat willing to join in on group activities if you are willing to put together something.
> 
> Hope this helps a bit :happy:


I know! Sometimes I think "Here we are arguing about socialising while the Chinese are trying to take over the world. I hope they'll do it soon because at least they are quiet!"
Thanks for your advice!


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Wasp said:


> *My initial thoughts:* It doesn't sound like anyone at your workplace is worth your time.
> If i were you? Were you to give them any time, perhaps show up for an hour (tops) to someone's hyped-up pub outing. It proves to be a dud & you leave, or you caught the new intern cozy with the guy in accounting, and that's just funny.
> 
> I'd spare yourself the headache of dealing with everyone's idiosyncrasies in order to unite outside work for whatever year-end or xmas reason ppl have. It's _work. _
> And, if you honestly don't care to be around those coworkers any longer than your work schedule lasts in any other situation, then what difference does it make? Now you get to suffer in their presence after everyone has enhanced their insufferable traits with alcohol. Yay!
> 
> *My secondary thoughts:* On the other hand, if there are some of whom you don't mind too much, and would enjoy their company. Then, this is what i would do. I'd go along to whatever event is being attended by the people you 'like' (AKA - you wouldn't immediately punch them in the throat if it were suggested by anyone aloud). See how things go (since i don't recall seeing you relay anything about ever attending any of the "events"), and store the information for yourself in case you get a silly idea next year.
> 
> Perhaps next year you'll laugh at the thought of burdening yourself with it. OR, perhaps you'll know just what to do to bring them all together.
> 
> I tend to find that there are admirable people with the skills to handle event planning and the shit that goes with it, and i'm not one of them.


Thank you Wasp. There are a few people who I like, but they don't really need this kind of event either and we can get on fine at work without getting drunk together. I'll think about it some more. A lot of it has to do with Enlish social awkwardness and you can't really blame them. 
I can have half-way decent conversations with most of them 1:1, it's only in group situations that they go ga-ga.


----------



## Library_Cat

Have any of you had experience with random roommates before? I'm hoping to keep peace with my new roommate.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Library_Cat said:


> Have any of you had experience with random roommates before? I'm hoping to keep peace with my new roommate.


I lived with random roommates for a year once. Was quite nice back then, but couldn't do it now.
What's going on with your new roommmate?


----------



## Library_Cat

FlaviaGemina said:


> I lived with random roommates for a year once. Was quite nice back then, but couldn't do it now.
> What's going on with your new roommmate?


Nothing major is going on at this point, and I'm hoping to keep it that way. My school just released our room assignments today, and we spoke to each other online. She seems friendly, but we have different ways of looking at the world. From what I could tell about her on her facebook page (I know, not the best way to get to know someone), we have opposing political views, and not much in common. I've had some good friends over the years who have political views in opposition to mine, but I've never lived with them before. I'm hoping that my initial assessment is not correct, and that I have nothing to worry about, but I have heard horror stories about roommates who don't get along.

Basically, I'm just wondering what some of you have discovered about keeping peace with a roommate you might not have much in common with.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

@Library_Cat: well in that case:
Rule #1: Don't mention politics.
Rule #2: If she brings it up say something vague like "Oh yes, that's an interesting development/question/etc."

Wait and see whether you've got enough in common to get along apart from politics.

- make a duty rota for the houswork and pin it up where everyone can see it
- I'd be more worried about whether she wants to party in your shared house/room or take drugs there etc.  So try to find out 
indirectly, maybe :"So what do you like to do for fun?" etc.
- tell her you'd like to agree on some rules and ask her what rules she would like to have FIRST! (this way you don't come across 
as selfish and anal)


----------



## Konigsberg

Age: 18
Location: Mexico
Job: None, I'm a student waiting to get into college to study psychology.
Relationship status: Taken
Meandering career: Psychology?
Hobbies: Reading, learning, discussing, over-analyzing, music.
Interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Chemistry, playing an instrument. I'm going to be better in maths and physics soon.
Interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: languages, drawing.
Current obsessive interest: Slash ships, tumblr, MBTI, international colleges, tv series.
Former domain of geek-dom: Astronomy, astrophysics. I still get on it a lil bit.
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Supernatural
Random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: videogames. I'm just plain bad, but I like them. 
Clothes: Comfortable. Shoes: converse, vans or sandals. I never use skirts, and shorts only under extreme high-temperature. Regular t-shirts, v-necks and hoodies. 
Some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: I'm human therefore everything I do is. Either way, I guess... I like puppies. I am also quite romantic.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Konigsberg said:


> I never use skirts, and shorts only under extreme high-temperature. Regular t-shirts, v-necks and hoodies.


LOL, I'm the same. I'm slighty paranoid of 'public nudity', which to me includes wearing shorts or skirts. I don't mind other people wearing them, but I couldn't wear them them myself (or at least not at work). At work, I've always got my suit (incl. blazer) and a scarf on. I wear the scarf out of habit not because I'm cold and just forget to take it off even in summer. So my colleagues always shout at me to take the blazer and scarf off  When everybody else is walking around in a short dress and sandals, I finally take the blazer off and roll me shirt sleaves up. 
LOL.


----------



## Library_Cat

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, I'm the same. I'm slighty paranoid of 'public nudity', which to me includes wearing shorts or skirts. I don't mind other people wearing them, but I couldn't wear them them myself (or at least not at work). At work, I've always got my suit (incl. blazer) and a scarf on. I wear the scarf out of habit not because I'm cold and just forget to take it off even in summer. So my colleagues always shout at me to take the blazer and scarf off  When everybody else is walking around in a short dress and sandals, I finally take the blazer off and roll me shirt sleaves up.
> LOL.


Haha, me too. It was funny, the one time I did wear shorts this summer (to an outdoor concert; it was in the 100 degree range here for a while), my friends joked that for all they had known, I had tentacles instead of legs! :laughing:


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Library_Cat said:


> Haha, me too. It was funny, the one time I did wear shorts this summer (to an outdoor concert; it was in the 100 degree range here for a while), my friends joked that for all they had known, I had tentacles instead of legs! :laughing:


LOL. These days I never wear shorts at work (I work at a school), because it would just invite naughty little boys to stare or make comments. Makes my life easier because that's one silly behaviour less to manage.
But when I was studying at uni I'd occassionally wear shorts or a skirt and people would give me really surprised looks, as if they didn't know I've got legs at all. 
LOL, this one girly girl was always bothering me to wear girly clothes. She said she doesn't understand why I don't wear tight trousers or a skirt because I've got the right figure for it. I just thought "I know. I don't actually need to convince anyone of it as long as I'm sure of it myself and if people are really that interested in my figure they can use their imagination.".


----------



## FlaviaGemina

OK, girls, here's another random question.

Out of the following, who do you get along best with/ who makes most sense to you/is most interesting to you:

a) INTP girls
b) INTP boys
c) INTJ girls
d) INTJ boys

Please go by your experience (either real life or internet), not by theory.


----------



## Konigsberg

INTP girls, INTJ boys.

Although I'm not sure I know an INTP boy... would be nice.


----------



## Sapphyreopal5

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, girls, here's another random question.
> 
> Out of the following, who do you get along best with/ who makes most sense to you/is most interesting to you:
> 
> a) INTP girls
> b) INTP boys
> c) INTJ girls
> d) INTJ boys
> 
> Please go by your experience (either real life or internet), not by theory.


Geez I wish I could really say this with more experience and such. I haven't (at least to my knowledge) met many INTXs irl (and am just starting to meet some on here); however, my dad, who is INTJ, and I get along pretty well for the most part, although he can be too rigid for my liking at times (but not unreasonable). I find myself able to agree with (or civilly disagree ha ha) with some INTX females online. I get along pretty well with my sister who is also INTP (we're twins ^_^ ), even if I find her to be way too indecisive for my liking (although if she were actually INFP I wouldn't be terribly surprised really, as she is pretty complacent with others' wishes, even if they go against her grain). I have to admit that my J is more developed than hers is, so that may be part of my slight impatience with her inability to make decisions (or to lead herself).
From my rather limited experience based on a little bit of interaction with people online and the couple INTX people I know irl, I'd say INTJ males and INTP females. However, that could very well change as I haven't had too much experience. I hope this is a good enough answer XD


----------



## Melody Choate

Jaryuu said:


> Need some advice from fellow INTP/INTJ females.
> I just want to be free from her, but I'm not sure if that's a good idea because there could be a small chance of her being depressed for real and I don't want her to actually kill herself. What do you think I should do?


It sounds like this relationship is a real drain on you, without much benefit in return. I would direct her toward professional help, if possible, and then sever all ties out of self-preservation. As someone else has already said, her behavior and her choices are on her, not you. You need to take care of yourself. It's sometimes a hard thing for NF's (especially female NF's) to do, but it is so necessary.


----------



## See Above

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, girls, here's another random question.
> 
> Out of the following, who do you get along best with/ who makes most sense to you/is most interesting to you:
> 
> a) INTP girls
> b) INTP boys
> c) INTJ girls
> d) INTJ boys
> 
> Please go by your experience (either real life or internet), not by theory.


Sorry, insufficient data. (I don't know for sure if I have ever met: INTP female, INTP male, INTJ male.)


----------



## PyrLove

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, girls, here's another random question.
> 
> Out of the following, who do you get along best with/ who makes most sense to you/is most interesting to you:
> 
> a) INTP girls
> b) INTP boys
> c) INTJ girls
> d) INTJ boys
> 
> Please go by your experience (either real life or internet), not by theory.


I suck at typing people IRL. I think my best friend is INTP female. We've been friends for over 25 years. Some of her personality traits are annoying (way too much detail!) but the in-depth discussions we have had are absorbing and beautifully random. My daughter is an INTJ and I adore her. There's an instinctive, sublingual understanding between us that goes beyond the parent-child connection -- so much deeper than what I have with my parents. Another close friend is INTJ female and the connection is the same as with my daughter, although not as strong. I had a brief fling with an INTJ male and, again, felt that connection. He commented that he'd never experienced the ease of conversation that we had. He said it as if he had never expected a woman to keep up with intellectually. I don't think I've met an INTP male IRL.

Online, I've enjoyed conversations with all four types. The only times I've felt dissonance are with individuals who are trying to fit into a stereotype that is clearly not close enough to their natural personalities to be comfortable. I'd say that's the case regardless of type.


----------



## quadrivium

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, girls, here's another random question.
> 
> Out of the following, who do you get along best with/ who makes most sense to you/is most interesting to you:
> 
> a) INTP girls
> b) INTP boys
> c) INTJ girls
> d) INTJ boys
> 
> Please go by your experience (either real life or internet), not by theory.


I unfortunately do not know any INTJ women in real life. I know one INTP girl who is really more of a friend of a friend. I prefer INTJ males over INTP males. I've had plenty of ENTP male friends and they are a handful.


----------



## bored

I'm pretty terrible at typing people. I suspect one of my male friends is an INTJ and we get along well but I don't know if I know any of the other INTP/J types so can't say how I'd get along with the others.


----------



## Christina123

FlaviaGemina said:


> OK, girls, here's another random question.
> 
> Out of the following, who do you get along best with/ who makes most sense to you/is most interesting to you:
> 
> a) INTP girls
> b) INTP boys
> c) INTJ girls
> d) INTJ boys
> 
> Please go by your experience (either real life or internet), not by theory.


I have gotten along better with INTP boys and girls but not other INTJ's. I'm not sure if it was because of the actual person they were. It's not like they were a mirror to me but I've just found INTP's hunger for theories and occasional spontaneity both fascinating and invigorating. I'm sure some INTJ's are or could be the same as well but not the ones I have met. Both have a tendency towards thinking that they are right and you are wrong or they are right and you are lesser unless you come up with an idea that is ingenious within 30 seconds. I'm trying to do that less...I think I'm getting better at it but I think it'll always be a problem with me...so I need to keep it in check ). Listening to the entire sentence before jumping to a conclusion helps. It helps us learn more and shut off less I think.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

*Maths help?*

@_RedX_, or anyone who's good at maths. 
I need help. I'm pre-learning some maths for next school year to help my pupil.

Today I did about proofs.
Here's one of the questions and my answer. Can you tell me whether I did it right? The book doesn't give the answers for this chapter.


"Prove by direct argument that the sum of the squares of any 5 consecutive integers is divisible by 5". 

my answer:

m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2[/SUP] = x
m[SUP]2[/SUP] + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+2m + 1) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+4m + 4) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+6m + 9) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+8m + 16) = x
5m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 20m + 30 = x 
m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 4m + 6 = x/5

Then I put some random numbers for m to test it
e.g. m = 2

5*2[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ 20*2 +30 = 20 + 40 + 30 = 90
2[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ 4*2 + 6 = 4 + 8 + 6 = 18

90/5 = 18


Is this right? The book didn't really explain what "by direct argument" means. Some of the examples of it look more like "by exhaustion".

THANKS


----------



## Mr. Meepers

FlaviaGemina said:


> @_RedX_, or anyone who's good at maths.
> I need help. I'm pre-learning some maths for next school year to help my pupil.
> 
> Today I did about proofs.
> Here's one of the questions and my answer. Can you tell me whether I did it right? The book doesn't give the answers for this chapter.
> 
> 
> "Prove by direct argument that the sum of the squares of any 5 consecutive integers is divisible by 5".
> 
> my answer:
> 
> m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2[/SUP] = x
> m[SUP]2[/SUP] + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+2m + 1) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+4m + 4) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+6m + 9) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+8m + 16) = x
> 5m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 20m + 30 = x
> m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 4m + 6 = x/5
> 
> Then I put some random numbers for m to test it
> e.g. m = 2
> 
> 5*2[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ 20*2 +30 = 20 + 40 + 30 = 90
> 2[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ 4*2 + 6 = 4 + 8 + 6 = 18
> 
> 90/5 = 18
> 
> 
> Is this right? The book didn't really explain what "by direct argument" means. Some of the examples of it look more like "by exhaustion".
> 
> THANKS


Someone sent me here to look at this post ... but I am gender neutral, so I hope it is okay
(... I'm also an NF :shocked: ... I iz in your bases, NTs (Please don't hurt me))
It looks like you did it right, but I'm going to redo it just to check the arithmetic

m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2[/SUP] = q5 + r .... = r (mod 5) ... note: by the division algorithm q and r are unique (0<=r<5)


m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2 [/SUP]= m[SUP]2[/SUP] + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+2m + 1) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+4m + 4) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+6m + 9) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+8m + 16) 
= 5m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 20m + 30 = (m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 4m + 6)5 = q*5 + r
r=0, q=m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 4m + 6 ... since m is an integer, q is an integer

i.e. There exists an integer q such that m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2 [/SUP] = q*5 

Yup ... you did it correctly ... directly just means that you start with the premise (The addition on 5 consecutive numbers is equal to an integer, c) and work your way to the conclusion (c is divisible by 5)

Another common proof technique is a subset of indirect proofs:
Assume c is not divisible by 5 ... now prove that assumption leads to a contradiction


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Mr. Meepers said:


> Someone sent me here to look at this post ... but I am gender neutral, so I hope it is okay
> (... I'm also an NF :shocked: ... I iz in your bases, NTs (Please don't hurt me))
> It looks like you did it right, but I'm going to redo it just to check the arithmetic
> 
> m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2[/SUP] = q5 + r .... = r (mod 5) ... note: by the division algorithm q and r are unique (0<=r<5)
> 
> 
> m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2 [/SUP]= m[SUP]2[/SUP] + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+2m + 1) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+4m + 4) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+6m + 9) + ( m[SUP]2[/SUP]+8m + 16)
> = 5m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 20m + 30 = (m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 4m + 6)5 = q*5 + r
> r=0, q=m[SUP]2[/SUP] + 4m + 6 ... since m is an integer, q is an integer
> 
> i.e. There exists an integer q such that m[SUP]2 [/SUP]+ (m+1)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+2)[SUP]2[/SUP] + (m+3)[SUP]2[/SUP] +(m+4)[SUP]2 [/SUP]= q*5
> 
> Yup ... you did it correctly ... directly just means that you start with the premise (The addition on 5 consecutive numbers is equal to an integer, c) and work your way to the conclusion (c is divisible by 5)
> 
> Another common proof technique is a subset of indirect proofs:
> Assume c is not divisible by 5 ... now prove that assumption leads to a contradiction


Thanks  LOL, I hav no idea what your additions mean, but as long as I've done it right, I'm happy 
Feel free to drop by in here, even if your NF and gender neutral LOL, I'd say INTJ and INTP 'females' are gender neutral anyway compared to many SF females.


----------



## Mr. Meepers

FlaviaGemina said:


> Thanks  LOL, I hav no idea what your additions mean, but as long as I've done it right, I'm happy
> Feel free to drop by in here, even if your NF and gender neutral LOL, I'd say INTJ and INTP 'females' are gender neutral anyway compared to many SF females.


Thank you ^__^ *hug*

By additions did you mean the division algorithm and/or modulo a number (mod 5)? 

They are just other ways to look at whether or not a divides b

Divisor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Division Algorithm (link from wikipedia that can be used for two negative numbers too)
Euclidean division - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Modulo:
Modular arithmetic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


You don't need to write it down, but some people might be able to picture it easier by looking at the problem through the lens of these mathematical ideas ^__^


----------



## FlaviaGemina

@Mr. Meepers , thanks. I don't think my kid will have to answer these questions to such a high level. (Or at least I hope he won't, because if I have to help him with it, that will create more work for me  ) It's 'only' A-level (Year 13 at high school).


----------



## FlaviaGemina

@Mr. Meepers, sorry to bother you again. Got another maths question.

I got the answers right, but it's a weird question.

"Alexander lives 800 metres from school. One morning he sets out at 8.00 am an _t_ minutes later the distance _s_ m which he has walked is given by
s= 800(1-e[SUP]-0.1t[/SUP])

i) sketch the graph of s against t. ---> I got that
ii) How far has Alexander walked by 8.15 am? ---> I got that righ
iii) What time is it when Alexander is hafway to school? ---> I got that right.

iv)When does Alexander get to school?

800 = 800(1-e[SUP]-0.1t[/SUP])
800/800 = 1-e[SUP]-0.1t[/SUP]
1 = 1-e[SUP]-0.1t
[/SUP]e[SUP]-0.1t[/SUP] = 1-1 = 0, --> it doesn't work because you'd have to ln both sides and you can't ln 0, because the calculator says 'maths error'...
The answer in the book is: Never

OK, it seems I've done it right. But what is this question supposed to tell us about the real world?
Does he get murdered on the way to school? Is the formula wrong? Or is it a philosophical question, e.g. "He approaches the school infinitesimally, but can never really reach it?" :crying:


----------



## Mr. Meepers

Well, since I'm here and this thread is for Female INTXs ... maybe I'll add something.

I don't want to attribute too much to our MBTI as it is just a theory on how we think and not who we are (although I believe how we think can play a big role in shaping who we are ... and I also believe that we view the world through the ideas that we see)

Anyway ... I'm a male (by sex ... my gender identity is neutral) and I tend to be nurturing and sensitive ... I'm sure "stay true" to a lot of the gender rules (without even realizing it at times), but I also break some gender rules/expectations too (If we think of femininity and masculinity as sets of character attributed that we expect men and women to have, respectively ... I'm probably more feminine).

Anyway, I have not looked at the whole thread, but the issue of gender roles/expectations might be a good topic for a thread like this as being "logical" is a cultural expectation that seems to be usually placed on men ... and being more "Feely" is a cultural expectation placed on women

I don't know if you guys already talked about it and I missed it ... but I was wondering what your views on and/or your experiences with social norms were ...

... also some interesting links about the possible lack of innate differences between the cognition of males and females

Stanford neuroscientist tackles myths about the brain
The Gender Trap, Part 1 | Ideas with Paul Kennedy | CBC Radio
The Gender Trap, Part 2 | Ideas with Paul Kennedy | CBC Radio


----------



## laylay918

HI... oh wait. intp/intj. nevermind


----------



## FlaviaGemina

laylay918 said:


> HI... oh wait. intp/intj. nevermind


Basically any type is welcome  
ENTPs are among my favourite species  (Yes, I know I'm so typist and there are probably lot of jerks who just happen to be ENTPs)


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Mr. Meepers said:


> Anyway, I have not looked at the whole thread, but the issue of gender roles/expectations might be a good topic for a thread like this as being "logical" is a cultural expectation that seems to be usually placed on men ... and being more "Feely" is a cultural expectation placed on women
> 
> I don't know if you guys already talked about it and I missed it ... but I was wondering what your views on and/or your experiences with social norms were ...
> 
> ... also some interesting links about the possible lack of innate differences between the cognition of males and females
> 
> Stanford neuroscientist tackles myths about the brain
> The Gender Trap, Part 1 | Ideas with Paul Kennedy | CBC Radio
> The Gender Trap, Part 2 | Ideas with Paul Kennedy | CBC Radio


Thanks for the links, will watch them later 

Hum ... no-one has ever directly complained that I'm not "feely" enough, but then I grew up in Germany and people generally don't talk about feelings there, regardless of type.
LOL, I do frighten some women though. This one time, my ENFJ boss (a really nice and easy going lady who I can learn a lot from) said people should show their feelings because that's the way she was brought up. Yet, whenever I express my feelings of murderous rage for some incompetent person she gets frightened. 
Out of all the types, I have most problems with ISFJs because I don't understand where there friendly feelings come from at all and feel completely creeped out. Strangely, I haven't got this kind of problem ENFJs, ESFJs or INFJs. 

What I've got most problems with is being happy on command. It's always been like this. E.g. when we were ordered to sing a happy song in kindergarten, I got majorly confused. It's not that I was feeling unhappy at the time. I was just feeling "normal" and I have no idea to sing an insanely happy song for no reason. I'm still like that today at the ripe old age of 31. 
Anyway, I'm rambling .... sorry I have only got silly anecdotes.


----------



## Mr. Meepers

FlaviaGemina said:


> Thanks for the links, will watch them later
> 
> Hum ... no-one has ever directly complained that I'm not "feely" enough, but then I grew up in Germany and people generally don't talk about feelings there, regardless of type.
> LOL, I do frighten some women though. This one time, my ENFJ boss (a really nice and easy going lady who I can learn a lot from) said people should show their feelings because that's the way she was brought up. Yet, whenever I express my feelings of murderous rage for some incompetent person she gets frightened.
> Out of all the types, I have most problems with ISFJs because I don't understand where there friendly feelings come from at all and feel completely creeped out. Strangely, I haven't got this kind of problem ENFJs, ESFJs or INFJs.
> 
> What I've got most problems with is being happy on command. It's always been like this. E.g. when we were ordered to sing a happy song in kindergarten, I got majorly confused. It's not that I was feeling unhappy at the time. I was just feeling "normal" and I have no idea to sing an insanely happy song for no reason. I'm still like that today at the ripe old age of 31.
> Anyway, I'm rambling .... sorry I have only got silly anecdotes.


Awe *hugs* .... Yeah, I can see why people might feel uncomfortable around rage ... especially murderous rage :tongue:

*random friendly feelings* *hugs* :tongue: ... Maybe you are just a likable person? ... Or maybe those ISFJs just like people ^__^ ... And you can always threaten to dissect them to find out where their friendly feelings come from :tongue: , well, maybe just scanning their brains would be better

I know I won't always want to listen to happy songs when I am not happy, but at least with listening (I don't know about singing), I just try to focus on the mood of the song (I think about and/or feel the song) and just not think about my other feelings (If that makes any sense) ... Also, I have heard that smiling 15 minutes a day (even if you are not happy) can make you happier ... I don't know if it is true though (At the very least, you might look funny doing that :tongue ... And I don't think you need to start out happy to sing a happy song (or you can make fun of the song for being too happy as you sing it ), although I could understand why you would not feel like you were in the mood for it *hugs* and I could certainly see it being harder for some people (since we all have different abilities)


----------



## See Above

FlaviaGemina said:


> Thanks for the links, will watch them later
> 
> Hum ... no-one has ever directly complained that I'm not "feely" enough, but then I grew up in Germany and people generally don't talk about feelings there, regardless of type.
> LOL, I do frighten some women though. This one time, my ENFJ boss (a really nice and easy going lady who I can learn a lot from) said people should show their feelings because that's the way she was brought up. Yet, whenever I express my feelings of murderous rage for some incompetent person she gets frightened.
> Out of all the types, I have most problems with ISFJs because I don't understand where there friendly feelings come from at all and feel completely creeped out. Strangely, I haven't got this kind of problem ENFJs, ESFJs or INFJs.
> 
> What I've got most problems with is being happy on command. It's always been like this. E.g. when we were ordered to sing a happy song in kindergarten, I got majorly confused. It's not that I was feeling unhappy at the time. I was just feeling "normal" and I have no idea to sing an insanely happy song for no reason. I'm still like that today at the ripe old age of 31.
> Anyway, I'm rambling .... sorry I have only got silly anecdotes.


I've been to Germany a few times. Remind me to tell you someday (over a couple of pints, preferably,) about the time that I was in Germany and I came across a neatly- and conservatively-dressed elderly woman who had fallen on a city sidewalk and was bleeding from a split that went from her forehead to the tip of her nose. The reactions and interactions of people that became involved were very interesting and educational for me to observe.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

See Above said:


> I've been to Germany a few times. Remind me to tell you someday (over a couple of pints, preferably,) about the time that I was in Germany and I came across a neatly- and conservatively-dressed elderly woman who had fallen on a city sidewalk and was bleeding from a split that went from her forehead to the tip of her nose.  The reactions and interactions of people that became involved were very interesting and educational for me to observe.


Oooooo, I wanna know. Can't you tell me know? Did they tell her off for being stupid enough to slip? Wouldn't put that past them.


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## MegaTuxRacer

NT girl-talk is more girly than I thought it would be. This has actually been an interesting thread.


----------



## PyrLove

MegaTuxRacer said:


> NT girl-talk is more girly than I thought it would be. This has actually been an interesting thread.


http://personalitycafe.com/intj-forum-scientists/23212-female-intjs-let-s-girly.html#post467759


----------



## See Above

FlaviaGemina said:


> Oooooo, I wanna know. Can't you tell me know? Did they tell her off for being stupid enough to slip? Wouldn't put that past them.


Maybe I'll have a quiet moment tomorrow. Too late right now. I can start though. 

Once upon a time there was a young woman out seeing the world. She had few belongings with her in the strange land she traversed and even less money, but it was all a terrific adventure, so, what the heck. She was walking down a city street in Germany when, in the distance, she spied what looked to be a woman on her knees across the street and halfway down another block. "That seems unusual to me," she though, "I mean, I know I am in a foreign country and things are bound to be different, but, a woman on her knees? In a stylish felt hat with a feather on it? It is cold and windy today. I can't _imagine_ that this could be cultural......."

Stay tuned!


----------



## Sapphyreopal5

Sapphyreopal5 said:


> *Age*: 21
> *Location*: Earth
> *Job*: Student (am looking otherwise) (going to school to become a cardiovascular technician [basically x-rays and stuff], putting psychology on the back burner via getting a 2 year degree [odd, right?])
> *Relationship Status*: Single, although wish to be with my ex (of 2.5 years) still :/ (I moved about 650 miles away from where I used to live about 4 months ago)
> *Hobbies*: Oh geez, I could list a lot of them. My interests change a lot, as I'm open to liking new things and trying new things (as long as I'm in a good mood ha ha).
> - I wish I could be better at math. It's not that I'm bad at it because it's hard but because I want to know the _why _of math and feel it is taught in a way to memorize formulas and such, rather than understanding the big picture concepts. I also really wish I was good at cooking but it stresses me out and end up not doing it quite right XD
> *TV*: I don't watch too much TV, so I hope I can be excluded from the TV program question ha ha
> *Geeky things I fail at*: being awesome at math
> *Wardrobe*: whatever is most comfortable (nude if possible lol). Looking as nice for work (when I am employed) as I need to be with minimal effort.
> *Normal stuff I like to do sometimes*: listening to tunes, going out to eat, etc., paint, create graphic art, cleaning (only sometimes and when there is no one else home he he), play with dog
> *Current obsessive interests*: metabolites (and in this, looking how to improve health and prevent diseases via what is consumed, rather than relying on drugs), psychology (especially personality), PerC forums :wink:
> *Former domain of geek-dom*: video games he he
> *My voice*: some have said it sounds like I'm from Brooklyn, New York (I was born in the Niagara Falls area of New York but moved to the Detroit area with my family when I was 4). In other words, my voice sounds like it belongs to a woman but is deeper and is naturally louder. Ironic that I am an introvert yet my voice is naturally louder, huh? I'm told to talk quieter when I do talk a lot, making me annoyed as hell because I don't mean to and stuff. Perhaps subconsciously I feel like I do have to talk louder to people so I'm "heard" by others.
> *Pet Peeves*: short-sightedness (probably my worst one), incompetence, lack of intelligence, people interrupting others when they're talking, being ignored (or other people being ignored) by rude extroverted people, closed-mindedness, people being unable to think rationally. Gah, thinking about the stupid women I see in movies who panic and/or get emotional over stupid things makes me frustrated as hell!


I'd like my sister @ejkamens to introduce herself here (she's an INTP) :happy:


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## ejkamens

big sister rellie @_Sapphyreopal5_ is an INTP in my opinion! hmph... I bolded some things she forgot to put in her intro

Age: 21
Location: Outer Space
Job: Waitressing part time whilst going to school
Relationship status: In a relationship happily
Hobbies: 
+ *League of legends!! and the Sims 2* atm (used to be Diablo III, they didn't do Diablo Franchise justice  ), basically fun video games
+ Random Photoshopping (pictures, making my own abstract art... whatever i feel like doing)
+ I'm quite random myself; i have bursts of reading, drawing, arguing intellectually... I
+ really want an alaskan malamute companion  I love doggies! I also think the Alaskan Malamute's personality would fit right along with me as well... we'd be perfect for each other :3
*+ Making fun of and picking on Jelly Belly... she does the same but reversed)*

TV: I love watching 
+ subbed anime (japanese acting, english subtitles)
+ Breaking Bad (yes, I love the drama AND the Chemistry a lot)*
+ Prison Break (was so awesome  Ellie loved this show...)*
*+ Desperate Housewives (RELLIE loved this show; she watches more TV than she thinks)*
+ I'm just not particularly picky with what I watch; it is entertainment after all

Geeky things I fail at: I'm quite amateurish at Chess (dunno, just don't play much)
Wardrobe: comfy clothes; sweatshirts, jeans, t-shirts... casual stuff.
Normal Stuff I like to do sometimes: Listening to some video game soundtracks /soundtracks of shows (BLEACH!!! :O), go outside, gossip (tehe it can be silly), make slideshows about random things for my bf (educational, funny... entertainment; he loves them!)

My voice: People say I sound exactly like my twin sister sapphyreopal5 ^^

Pet Peeves:
+ Shortsightedness
+ Narrow mindedness
+ Blindly drawing conclusions, and talking over opposition (REALLY? Let me have a word or two -.-)
+ Sheer stupidity

hehe... rellie likes the lady on the bus from Speed "What about the rest of us?!!"
And, Ellie could be good at math if she took the right classes and stuff.. She's just too impatient sometimes


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## FlaviaGemina

@ejkamens, I love Desperate Housewives, too, but I only saw a few seasons of it. One day when I'm rich, I'll buy all of them.


----------



## animalcule

My boyfriend got upset with me (mostly because we hadn't seen each other for far too long) and told me that my idea of intimate connection was like a man's - as though it were an insult!

I was like.. 'Haven't I told you this many times, starting in the very beginning?' He's an NT too, I feel like he should understand. :/ He's fascinated by my personality, but somehow still startled and even upset sometimes when I prove to him that I am very different from other women he has dated. This only my second serious relationship, but this was a problem with my ex as well. I am very open with who I am, all the difficult parts as well as the good points - why would someone who really wants an F woman be with me?

Sigh. Just because I look and sound like a cute girl, doesn't mean I'm an E or an F. No matter how many times I try to explain it logically, no one seems to absorb it.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

animalcule said:


> ' He's an NT too, I feel like he should understand. :/ He's fascinated by my personality, but somehow still startled and even upset sometimes when I prove to him that I am very different from other women he has dated. This only my second serious relationship, but this was a problem with my ex as well. I am very open with who I am, all the difficult parts as well as the good points - why would someone who really wants an F woman be with me?


What kind of NT? Just out of curiosity?


----------



## ejkamens

hehe @FlaviaGemina you can watch the series online for free if you want to... and THEN buy the series when you're rich


----------



## animalcule

FlaviaGemina said:


> What kind of NT? Just out of curiosity?


xNTP - he's always tested as an INTP, but I think he's ENTP for sure - quite developed Fe, and much more flamboyant and social than I've ever heard of an INTP being. My ex was a heavy Fe user as well. I think this might be a problem.

Give me adviceeee


----------



## See Above

FlaviaGemina said:


> Oooooo, I wanna know. Can't you tell me know? Did they tell her off for being stupid enough to slip? Wouldn't put that past them.



It is just tooooo busy to tell the story details, let's just say that a lot of people walked/drove in the vicinity (not, however, to be fair, right by her) and didn't notice her. When I did, and with my child-level German tried to comfort her and get the assistance of other people, the others that gathered dithered and squawked like chickens. We ended up with a taxi and an ambulance come to get her and when the other folks convinced her to let the first-responders load her into the ambulance, and then amazingly disappeared from the scene in a swirl of dust, the taxi driver got all upset and started yelling angrily at me to pay him for his trip.

Ah, I believe the most commonly used phrase in this sort of instance is, "No good deed goes unpunished." :tongue:


----------



## FlaviaGemina

animalcule said:


> xNTP - he's always tested as an INTP, but I think he's ENTP for sure - quite developed Fe, and much more flamboyant and social than I've ever heard of an INTP being. My ex was a heavy Fe user as well. I think this might be a problem.
> 
> Give me adviceeee


LOL, I knew you'd say XNTP. Yep, I think Fe and Fi don't translate easily. I'm tired now. Will think about it at the weekend and write more.


----------



## Sapphyreopal5

FlaviaGemina said:


> @_ejkamens_, I love Desperate Housewives, too, but I only saw a few seasons of it. One day when I'm rich, I'll buy all of them.


Speaking of that show.... I have all of the seasons except the last one ^_^


----------



## Wasp

Sapphyreopal5 said:


> It's really interesting how if you don't show up to their events, it's the end of the world... YET if they don't show up to your event, it's perfectly okay. Interesting how that works.


I KNOOOW!!! (That's the most i've reacted all week, hah.) No but this is something that irritates me. Mostly the part about them being pissy when I don't attend. I don't really host things.... ever... at all. 
But in the past, it was no big deal to me. _So-and-so_ didn't come, oh well. However! i get an ear full from someone venting about how offended they are that Nancy didn't make it. _Who cares?_ _Honestly!_ And it tends to be a great big indicator of how sore they are when I decide not to go, since i get a cold shoulder when i see them next. 
It's a real irritation for me.. in the back of my mind... where i keep those thoughts.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Wasp said:


> I KNOOOW!!! (That's the most i've reacted all week, hah.) No but this is something that irritates me. Mostly the part about them being pissy when I don't attend. I don't really host things.... ever... at all.
> But in the past, it was no big deal to me. _So-and-so_ didn't come, oh well. However! i get an ear full from someone venting about how offended they are that Nancy didn't make it. _Who cares?_ _Honestly!_ And it tends to be a great big indicator of how sore they are when I decide not to go, since i get a cold shoulder when i see them next.
> It's a real irritation for me.. in the back of my mind... where i keep those thoughts.


LOL, one of the ISFJs is a bit cranky towards me nowadays. She still asks me all kinds of considerate questions, but it sounds more forced than it used to. It's probably just because she's generally stressed and has nothing to do with me. Ironically, I like her better when she is like this than when she is all fluffy and cozy. Wouldn't it be fun if she hated me now and I could cope a lot better with her when she hates me than when she 'loves' me?


----------



## Sapphyreopal5

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, one of the ISFJs is a bit cranky towards me nowadays. She still asks me all kinds of considerate questions, but it sounds more forced than it used to. It's probably just because she's generally stressed and has nothing to do with me. Ironically, I like her better when she is like this than when she is all fluffy and cozy. Wouldn't it be fun if she hated me now and I could cope a lot better with her when she hates me than when she 'loves' me?


Very interesting approach there. Oddly enough, I have felt the same way with some people, especially those "fluffy and cozy" people as you put it ha ha. That way, they aren't so smothering and can actually leave me at peace ha ha. Those kind of people get on my nerves so much! Plus, it seems more real when someone is cranky towards others rather than in a mania-like state all the damn time.


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## Sapphyreopal5

Okay you guys, I'm in a bit of a frustrating situation. In my chemistry lab group, I have a really bossy lady who's older (99.999% sure she's an ESTJ). We were doing an experiment this morning. She insisted on following the procedure and weighing every item (a, b, c, d, e, f, etc). I said why don't we just do a-b to get c and d-e to get f? She said I don't know, I'm just doing it by what this procedure says. I tried saying that if we do it that way, the numbers won't be consistent (those damn scales are so sensitive making the numbers constantly change for god's sake!). But to make her shut up basically, I decided to do it her way. Internally, I knew the chem lab teacher was going to say something about the numbers being off and such (wanted that lady to see how her way was wrong).

So we proceed with the experiment and do the calculations, the whole 9 yards afterwards. The chemistry teacher looked at our numbers and what do you know? She said the numbers were off and said we should've just subtracted. Suddenly it's my fault because I did things the way bossy ESTJ lady insisted and recorded those numbers, even though I knew she was wrong the whole time. Her and the guy that's also in my group decided to give me a hard time about it in a "playful" manner and then said "oh you know we're just messing with you". I told them I was insisting on just subtracting the numbers instead of weighing everything piece by piece but nope, they didn't listen when I tried explaining myself either. 

Before we did the 2nd part of the experiment, we were doing one of the calculations involving energy being released (formula being E= mass x specific heat x temperature change [indicated by delta C]). I wanted to confirm a number and asked "what is the specific heat of water"? She insisted it was the temperature change. I said no, temperature change is another thing and is indicated by delta C on the board in the formula. She kept insisting she was correct and said oh why don't you go ask the teacher? I'll bet you specific heat is temperature change. I ended up looking for the specific heat of water up myself in the lab manual. For shits and giggles (pardon my French), I decided to overhear her conversation with the teacher asking her what specific heat is. She even asked "isn't specific heat the temperature change?" and midway though the teacher's answer, I smiled to myself after she said that is actually delta C. So the lady comes back and says "I'm sorry, I was mistaken and you were right".

She also ended up getting her sh*t mixed up on *yet* another calculation and also insisted she was looking at the right formula when she was clearly looking at the wrong formula. "Oh I'm so lost" is what she kept saying every time me and the guy in our group were trying to explain why we're using formula A (the formula him and I were using and the CORRECT formula) instead of formula B (the one she was insisting is the correct one). Sure enough, when the chemistry teacher was looking over our data, she said the formula him and I were using was, you said it, correct! 

I hope this post makes sense. Does anyone else have experience these frustrations? What would you guys deal with this frustration? I'm sure you can imagine my absolute frustration with this lady. UGH!


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## ejkamens

Sapphyreopal5 said:


> Okay you guys, I'm in a bit of a frustrating situation. In my chemistry lab group, I have a really bossy lady who's older (99.999% sure she's an ESTJ). We were doing an experiment this morning. She insisted on following the procedure and weighing every item (a, b, c, d, e, f, etc). I said why don't we just do a-b to get c and d-e to get f? She said I don't know, I'm just doing it by what this procedure says. I tried saying that if we do it that way, the numbers won't be consistent (those damn scales are so sensitive making the numbers constantly change for god's sake!). But to make her shut up basically, I decided to do it her way. Internally, I knew the chem lab teacher was going to say something about the numbers being off and such (wanted that lady to see how her way was wrong).
> 
> So we proceed with the experiment and do the calculations, the whole 9 yards afterwards. The chemistry teacher looked at our numbers and what do you know? She said the numbers were off and said we should've just subtracted. Suddenly it's my fault because I did things the way bossy ESTJ lady insisted and recorded those numbers, even though I knew she was wrong the whole time. Her and the guy that's also in my group decided to give me a hard time about it in a "playful" manner and then said "oh you know we're just messing with you". I told them I was insisting on just subtracting the numbers instead of weighing everything piece by piece but nope, they didn't listen when I tried explaining myself either.
> 
> Before we did the 2nd part of the experiment, we were doing one of the calculations involving energy being released (formula being E= mass x specific heat x temperature change [indicated by delta C]). I wanted to confirm a number and asked "what is the specific heat of water"? She insisted it was the temperature change. I said no, temperature change is another thing and is indicated by delta C on the board in the formula. She kept insisting she was correct and said oh why don't you go ask the teacher? I'll bet you specific heat is temperature change. I ended up looking for the specific heat of water up myself in the lab manual. For shits and giggles (pardon my French), I decided to overhear her conversation with the teacher asking her what specific heat is. She even asked "isn't specific heat the temperature change?" and midway though the teacher's answer, I smiled to myself after she said that is actually delta C. So the lady comes back and says "I'm sorry, I was mistaken and you were right".
> 
> She also ended up getting her sh*t mixed up on *yet* another calculation and also insisted she was looking at the right formula when she was clearly looking at the wrong formula. "Oh I'm so lost" is what she kept saying every time me and the guy in our group were trying to explain why we're using formula A (the formula him and I were using and the CORRECT formula) instead of formula B (the one she was insisting is the correct one). Sure enough, when the chemistry teacher was looking over our data, she said the formula him and I were using was, you said it, correct!
> 
> I hope this post makes sense. Does anyone else have experience these frustrations? What would you guys deal with this frustration? I'm sure you can imagine my absolute frustration with this lady. UGH!


Oh POOR BIG SISTER @Sapphyreopal5 

Do you have to do everything with the group? Can you do your own work and hand it in to the professor? Because honestly, I just DON'T deal with stuff like that.... why put down inaccurate data just because someone says so? I know my big sister rellie wouldn't want to do that. If it were me, I would tell her this: 
"go ahead and put down whatever you want to put (if you hand it in individually), while I will do it the correct way, and get an A. I don't care about your say-so's because I want an A."

If you don't hand it in individually, just assume control of the group. INTPs don't usually like to lead people, but if current leadership is failing, I find myself assuming such a position. "I do things according to what makes sense and IS CORRECT. Does anybody here want to follow a leader who will lead you to failure?" 

What if that fails? Ask the professor if you can do your own work, because _you cannot work with this person_. It sounds like a group project, not a dictatorship; everyone has their individual thoughts and opinions, and if this person is suppressing their opposition (ESTJs don't like being defied), then why deal with it?


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## Sapphyreopal5

ejkamens said:


> Oh POOR BIG SISTER @_Sapphyreopal5_
> 
> Do you have to do everything with the group? Can you do your own work and hand it in to the professor? Because honestly, I just DON'T deal with stuff like that.... why put down inaccurate data just because someone says so? I know my big sister rellie wouldn't want to do that. If it were me, I would tell her this:
> "go ahead and put down whatever you want to put (if you hand it in individually), while I will do it the correct way, and get an A. I don't care about your say-so's because I want an A."
> 
> If you don't hand it in individually, just assume control of the group. INTPs don't usually like to lead people, but if current leadership is failing, I find myself assuming such a position. "I do things according to what makes sense and IS CORRECT. Does anybody here want to follow a leader who will lead you to failure?"
> 
> What if that fails? Ask the professor if you can do your own work, because _you cannot work with this person_. It sounds like a group project, not a dictatorship; everyone has their individual thoughts and opinions, and if this person is suppressing their opposition (ESTJs don't like being defied), then why deal with it?


That would work..... if we turned things in _individually_. I was hoping she would realize how much of an idiot she is and that she would learn her lesson for not listening. NOPE that didn't work, she just displaced her idiotness onto me and made me look like the fool. Tbh the guy is an idiot too but not as much of an idiot as she is. Get this: the lady claims she _used_ to work in a gov't chemistry lab. With the way she doesn't wrap her head around simple formulas, I am starting to doubt that. She once admitted she was the one who "got stuck doing the housework [cleaning]" (hmm I wonder why that is...). The other girl who is in our lab group was missing today (the only other smart person in the group).

Really what the chem teacher does is look over our data sheets and such. I'm not really sure if she actually grades the data sheets themselves but will discuss them with the class group by group. We use the data sheets, pre-lab and post-lab assignments for the tests however. My evil plan to make that lady look dumb didn't quite work, although I think that guy saw she's clearly not that smart after she was not understanding why she was using the wrong formula (formula B instead of formula A) after several explanations, all put in the simplest of terms. 

From now on, I will be putting down the data I know to be correct. It's silly because based on how she reacted to our specific heat definition argument and how she treats me generally speaking, it seems like she is trying to assume dominance (that specific heat definition argument was clearly her doing a dominance ploy against me which *miserably* failed). It's absurd because it seems as though there's been some assumed competition for dominance between her and I (she created this not me) from day one. 

She is more often willing to accept help from the guy because he is like her minion (complies with her no problem), yet if I do I'm trying to assume the dominant position it seems and therefore dismisses my help (even if he's in the wrong....  ). The reality is that I am clearly the most competent person in the group ha ha. Isn't that how it usually is if there's only one xNTx in the group (especially INTx types)? :laughing: such a humble thing to say, isn't it?

I have thought about switching groups although I don't think that's an option seeing as how the other groups are full....

Jean-Baptiste Emanuel Zorg said it best:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=lbDoZTs3NoY#t=68s


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## FlaviaGemina

Sapphyreopal5 said:


> Before we did the 2nd part of the experiment, we were doing one of the calculations involving energy being released (formula being E= mass x specific heat x temperature change [indicated by delta C]). I wanted to confirm a number and asked "what is the specific heat of water"? She insisted it was the temperature change. I said no, temperature change is another thing and is indicated by delta C on the board in the formula. She kept insisting she was correct and said oh why don't you go ask the teacher?


She's dumb. I don't know anything about chemistry, but generally if there are two different words in science, they mean two different things. Why would specific heat be called temperature change? Even if you don't know anything about it, you can tell from the meaning of the words that they are two different things.

I wouldn't try to switch groups and the worst thing you can do is tell the professor that you can't work with a particular person. This might not be officially part of your assessment, but inofficially group work means that you are supposed to learn how to work with different people. I think you should try to take control of the group. E.g. if she says something dumb, ask her what makes her think that. Say something like, "You know, I'm confused about this too, can you explain your thought process." Because there still is the off chance that she _is_ right after all. So you are doing your duty by considering all possibilities, but if her explanation is dumb as well, hopefullly the other group members will notice.
Maybe plan ahead for the next experiment and be the first to speak. Tell the others what steps are involved and how you thought you should carry it out. Then invite their opinions. Debate about it _before_ you get started so it can't all go pear-shaped in the middle of the experiment. If you haven't got time to prepare, just say something like "Let's think about how we are going to do this first."
Even if you fail, the professor will notice that you tried and will get a favourable impression of you.


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## FlaviaGemina

animalcule said:


> *My boyfriend got upset with me (mostly because we hadn't seen each other for far too long) and told me that my idea of intimate connection was like a man's - as though it were an insult!
> *
> I was like.. 'Haven't I told you this many times, starting in the very beginning?' He's an NT too, I feel like he should understand. :/ He's fascinated by my personality, but somehow still startled and even upset sometimes when I prove to him that I am very different from other women he has dated. This only my second serious relationship, but this was a problem with my ex as well. I am very open with who I am, all the difficult parts as well as the good points - why would someone who really wants an F woman be with me?
> 
> Sigh. Just because I look and sound like a cute girl, doesn't mean I'm an E or an F. No matter how many times I try to explain it logically, no one seems to absorb it.


If he is an ENTP that might just be because extraverts generally prefer more frequent (but short) interaction, whereas introverts prefer less frequent but more 'meaningful' interaction. 
I forgot what I was going to say about about Fi-Fe clashes. LOL, can you tell us some more examples of what he gets upset about?

Here are some examples of Fi-Fe clash from my experience:

- I was meeting up with my INTP guy friend. He says we could sit outside in the sun. I say "I don't care where we sit, as long as I can SIT." That was OK with him, but later I thought about it and it dawned on me that the silly thing had actually thought about our meet-up _in advance_ (OMG, I have a continued existence for him outside our meet-ups!) and was being considerate in thinking about what I might like. To me it seems like I'm totally uncomplicated and easy-going because I don't care where we sit, but that also means that I totally ignored his effort.
- When I mail him about meeting up, he just writes back "Tuesday or Wednesday would be possible.". That makes me feel rejected immediately because I think "How do I know when he's got time? That's what I'm asking him. If he _wanted_ to meet up he'd also know _when_ he wants to meet up. Aloof, vague and non-commital INTP creature why do I even put up with him!" But when I think about it, it's probably just Fe, because he wants to do what I want.


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## FlaviaGemina

Girls, here's a new question: Share your amusing anecdotes about females of the other 'species'.

*Me and INTP girl back in Germany:*
INTP - girl: I dated a married man for one and a half years once. I didn't notice he was married. *puzzled*
Me: How could you not notice? They usually have a ring on their finger and if they only want to meet up an hour a week and have sex, that usually gives them away.
INTP - girl: ?

A few weeks later:
INTP girl: I got to know an English man.
Me: Is he old?
INTP girl: No, he's only 40.
Me: Is he married?!?!
INTP girl: No. He's separated. He's still friends with his wife, but they are getting divorced. 
Me: I got to know an English bloke in England once. THIS WAS BEFORE I HAD A BOYFRIEND! I WAS ALLOWED! He seemed WILLING, but he said weird things to me like: 'Maybe you will come to my house some day.' or 'Then I won't see you again, which will be a shame.' I wasn't sure whether that's some polite English expression or a pick-up line. What an idiot, I'd have loved to 'come to his house'.

a few days later:
INTP girl: He told me he texted his friend: 'I got to know a weird girl."

A few weeks later:
INTP girl: I'm going out with a YOUNG man tonight.

*******************************************
I got stalked by an unhealthy ISFJ girl who had lots of issues:
INTP girl: She's crazy. Has she ever thought about whether she is 100% heterosexual? I have _thought_ about it and the answer is yes, I am.
Me thinks: _You can think about whether you are gay? Could someone have told me this before I asked my best girl friend to marry me? _[Good think she didn't want to marry me, because as it turns out I'm not gay. Next time I want to marry a woman, I'll THINK first]

*******************************************
INTP girl about my INTP guyfriend: INTP GUY was sitting in the office! So I sneaked off. Like I wanna sit there with HIM!!!!! *brrrrrrrrrrrr*
Me thinks: _Er? You're exactly like him? Why can't you sit together? 
**************************************************

_Introduction to INTP logic 101:
INTP girl likes crazy ENTJ/INTJ/ENTP guy with narcissist personality disorder (I'm not exaggerating), although she is very aware of his craziness and criticizes him all the time.

INTP guy likes (in a friend way) the same crazy ENTJ/INTJ/ENTP guy with narcissist personality disorder , although he is very aware of his craziness and criticizes him all the time.

INTP guy is on his best behaviour towards INTP girl, i.e. he says "Hello, INTP girl." when he sees her, rather than just ignoring her like he ignores most people.

INTP girl doesn't like INTP guy. Adduces logical reasons why she likes him (he's hardworking etc.), but actually is totally creeped out by him.

*More to come.*


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## Cetanu

Random male INTJ post.

*waves a fist of spite at the thread title*


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## FlaviaGemina

Cetanu said:


> Random male INTJ post.
> 
> *waves a fist of spite at the thread title*


Males are welcome if they've got something relevant to say. Got anything to share about INTX women?


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## Cetanu

FlaviaGemina said:


> Males are welcome if they've got something relevant to say. Got anything to share about INTX women?


Sure.

I like them and wish I knew of some or even one. I would befriend them or seek to develop a relationship with one.

It's a bit hard to do all of this from my bedroom. Therein lies the problem...


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## Sapphyreopal5

FlaviaGemina said:


> She's dumb. I don't know anything about chemistry, but generally if there are two different words in science, they mean two different things. Why would specific heat be called temperature change? Even if you don't know anything about it, you can tell from the meaning of the words that they are two different things.
> 
> I wouldn't try to switch groups and the worst thing you can do is tell the professor that you can't work with a particular person. This might not be officially part of your assessment, but inofficially group work means that you are supposed to learn how to work with different people. I think you should try to take control of the group. E.g. if she says something dumb, ask her what makes her think that. Say something like, "You know, I'm confused about this too, can you explain your thought process." Because there still is the off chance that she _is_ right after all. So you are doing your duty by considering all possibilities, but if her explanation is dumb as well, hopefullly the other group members will notice.
> Maybe plan ahead for the next experiment and be the first to speak. Tell the others what steps are involved and how you thought you should carry it out. Then invite their opinions. Debate about it _before_ you get started so it can't all go pear-shaped in the middle of the experiment. If you haven't got time to prepare, just say something like "Let's think about how we are going to do this first."
> Even if you fail, the professor will notice that you tried and will get a favourable impression of you.


Thank you for your response! Great advice I must say. I do agree that switching groups is not a good idea at this point, as it’s been almost 2 months since class started (why switch now?). I also think you make a good point that it would look bad trying to switch out now by telling the professor “I can’t work with her because we don’t get along”. Lol you’re right that even dumb people like her can be right sometimes (even if the chance is small lol).

Typically I do try to ask “now why do you think it’s this?” or something along those lines if there is some kind of disagreement or if I am curious about why someone thinks the way they do. In this case, I suppose that I have been perhaps a little hostile about the situation based on how she treats me (and even sometimes the other members of the group), and how it seems she turned this into a competition for the “top dog” position when it’s supposed to be team work.

I have been gradually trying to take away the reins from her tbh although I do agree I should try to do it moreso because she is not as capable of doing such as she believes. She is way too by the book for my liking. The funny thing is that it seems like every experiment we’ve done so far, there have been a lot of changes the professor has made to the procedure just before we conduct the actual experiment. Don’t we just love it when extroverted morons like her try being in charge?

Yay! Even you know that specific heat isn’t about temperature change just by the _wording_ of it and you’re not a chemistry student. Brownie points for you! Ha ha. The sad part is that this lady has stated again and again she has the “experience” and worked in a government lab before (is now unemployed) as I said in a previous post, yet is absolutely clueless what half the formulas and terms mean. I am starting to think she was an actual employee at the government lab but was a janitor or something…. Furthermore, it is rather curious that someone with her so called “credentials” is taking a beginner’s chemistry class (I would think she would’ve talked her way to a more advanced class due to her “experience”). Hmmm…

Next time we’re in class, I’ll think about what you and @_ejkamens_ have said to me in regards to this quandary of mine ha ha. Again, thank you for your post!


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## ejkamens

I still think there is a difference between working with people and working FOR people. This woman has made it so that she wants people working FOR her in a sense, hence she must "qualify" herself. Yes, it can be hard to work with people, but it can _*make a hostile work environment*_ if someone is trying to shut you down every step of the way. 

But perhaps there is salvation; she did ADMIT to being wrong and making a mistake. Working in a lab does not qualify you for the education required to UNDERSTAND the work in a lab. As I have worked in many chemistry labs in school, it's really important that not one person makes all the decisions, and do real group work.
My Organic Chemistry teacher told me that I am one of few students who works better in lecture than in the lab (crazy; lol I know I am going for Chemical Engineering, but I don't like the blandness of writing lab reports her way... I performed worse in the lab because I preferred to _*take my time, and be sure I did things correctly! hmph*_). Anyway, moral of the story: just because you worked in a lab, it doesn't mean you know what you're talking about. 

Remember this next class @Sapphyreopal5; either way, I like how @FlaviaGemina approached this in an objective manner. I agree; you SHOULD try to make it happen. Although, if you aren't confused about something, don't say so  if she says something off, just say, "what is it that makes you think that? explain your thought process" like flaviagemina said. Then say, "well I interpretted it this way; why would they provide us with this data labeled as specific heat if it was meaningless and was actually change in temperature? Maybe we should rethink this data, or ask the professor for assistance (even if _*you*_ don't need it lol)." Stuff in science ALWAYS MEANS SOMETHING! 

Sometimes though, it just doesn't... happen oO lol. I had this happen to me in my lab last semester SORT OF, and she just shut down my input, which is very frustrating. But she went out of her way to make sure I felt stupid (I acted goofy, trying to make people laugh and stuff). That just made me mad, because a fellow classmate even went out of his way and said that I was the smartest person in the class, and to not work with her. I stopped studying and working with her all together, and I did much better without her. Sometimes, it's just better to not work with someone if you feel you are _being suppressed or degraded in any way_. All I would be concerned about is her shutting down your grades because she is overqualifying herself  which is very bad oO either way, do NOT let someone who is not qualified in understanding the concepts to run the show.

I guess that's just me; if my grade depends on having a properly functioning group, then I'll do whatever it takes. If it's not working for me, I'll say whatever to make it work for myself... Get off of a sinking ship before you go under so to speak. Sometimes a slap on the wrist lets people know they are getting out of hand.


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## ejkamens

@Sapphyreopal5, on another note (SO INTP to get technical), why call change in temperature ΔC? lol it should be like ΔT (Δ is the Delta symbol for those who don't know, which means change in... ΔT would indicate change in temperature, but ΔC = change in... change or celsius? lol I'm not sure -.-) I've always had it labelled as ΔT D:


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## Sapphyreopal5

ejkamens said:


> @_Sapphyreopal5_, on another note (SO INTP to get technical), why call change in temperature ΔC? lol it should be like ΔT (Δ is the Delta symbol for those who don't know, which means change in... ΔT would indicate change in temperature, but ΔC = change in... change or celsius? lol I'm not sure -.-) I've always had it labelled as ΔT D:


The reason why it was indicated as ΔC on the board in that case is because it was meant to be read as "change in celsius" as we were working with temperature changes in degrees celsius. The teacher changes that around sometimes on us but I still know what she means by it :happy:


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## Sapphyreopal5

ejkamens said:


> I still think there is a difference between working with people and working FOR people. This woman has made it so that she wants people working FOR her in a sense, hence she must "qualify" herself. Yes, it can be hard to work with people, but it can *make a hostile work environment* if someone is trying to shut you down every step of the way.
> 
> But perhaps there is salvation; she did ADMIT to being wrong and making a mistake. Working in a lab does not qualify you for the education required to UNDERSTAND the work in a lab. As I have worked in many chemistry labs in school, it's really important that not one person makes all the decisions, and do real group work.
> My Organic Chemistry teacher told me that I am one of few students who works better in lecture than in the lab (crazy; lol I know I am going for Chemical Engineering, but I don't like the blandness of writing lab reports her way... I performed worse in the lab because I preferred to *take my time, and be sure I did things correctly! hmph*). Anyway, moral of the story: just because you worked in a lab, it doesn't mean you know what you're talking about.
> 
> Remember this next class @_Sapphyreopal5_; either way, I like how @_FlaviaGemina_ approached this in an objective manner. I agree; you SHOULD try to make it happen. Although, if you aren't confused about something, don't say so  if she says something off, just say, "what is it that makes you think that? explain your thought process" like flaviagemina said. Then say, "well I interpretted it this way; why would they provide us with this data labeled as specific heat if it was meaningless and was actually change in temperature? Maybe we should rethink this data, or ask the professor for assistance (even if *you* don't need it lol)." Stuff in science ALWAYS MEANS SOMETHING!
> 
> Sometimes though, it just doesn't... happen oO lol. I had this happen to me in my lab last semester SORT OF, and she just shut down my input, which is very frustrating. But she went out of her way to make sure I felt stupid (I acted goofy, trying to make people laugh and stuff). That just made me mad, because a fellow classmate even went out of his way and said that I was the smartest person in the class, and to not work with her. I stopped studying and working with her all together, and I did much better without her. Sometimes, it's just better to not work with someone if you feel you are _being suppressed or degraded in any way_. All I would be concerned about is her shutting down your grades because she is overqualifying herself  which is very bad oO either way, do NOT let someone who is not qualified in understanding the concepts to run the show.
> 
> I guess that's just me; if my grade depends on having a properly functioning group, then I'll do whatever it takes. If it's not working for me, I'll say whatever to make it work for myself... Get off of a sinking ship before you go under so to speak. Sometimes a slap on the wrist lets people know they are getting out of hand.


More than anything, I find her behavior somewhat entertaining. Her obnoxious, trying to put me down bs just annoys me because it is her covering her ass essentially. It is her trying to hide the fact she clearly doesn’t know what she’s doing and that she’s full of it. The funny thing is that she keeps apologizing to the guy in the group and says “I’m sorry if I’m being pushy. If you think I’m being pushy, you can let me know” and then he says “oh no you’re fine”. She “apologized” multiple times when she was in the wrong but it hasn’t stopped her from trying to act like she knows it all (it’s *VERY* clear she knows squat about chemistry). 

This lady tries to shut down my input as well, although it’s starting to become clear even to that guy that she is a moron. When her ignorance shines or is otherwise noted, she becomes apologetic all of the sudden (ha ha as if!). The other girl in our group has also known from day one the lady was going to be a problem as well and knows I am far more competent. I certainly agree that work experience in the lab doesn’t equate to understanding of a laboratory. What I was suggesting rather is that I would think that she would’ve used her so called credentials to get herself out of classes. Furthermore, it would make me think that she’d be more familiar with things besides how to “tare” a scale ha ha. 

I certainly will be asking her about her perceptions of her thoughts and opinions more often, as I want to understand the thought process behind her actions and such. I can understand the whole leadership thing but at the end of the day, it _is_ group work and is not meant to be a dictatorship of some sort. Tbh I believe the class is more about actually participating (and some tests of course) more than anything. Participating as in partaking in the experiments and showing up to class. It’s about 2 months into the class, so really the best thing to do is to try making it work (can’t really get out of the group now)… and asking her for her views and perceptions on why she thinks the way she does (and also having the stronger say within the group).


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## FlaviaGemina

*What? No anecdotes yet?* :cryingsee page 25)


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## GweNdZ

been lurking this thread for a while *

age:* 20 (going on 21,in one month from today)
*location:* South Africa
*job:* sales person/cashier at a local music store
*relationship status: *non-existent
*meandering career: *currently studying a BA in Visual Communication Design, AKA graphic design
*hobbies:* drawing, painting, internet surfing, writing, running, thinking intentively about things.
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* maths, astronomy, science
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* foreign languages, painting, anything craft related really, I'm also musical but I stopped playing an instrument when I was 13.
*current obsessive interest:* MBTI, french music scene, Disney, and Fowler's stages of faith.
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: *when I'm at work I sometimes get a little nervous under pressure when I'm behind the till and that's when I seem like someone who doesn't really know much about working on computers. Also the fact that the internet at work only decides to crash the computer when I'm working on it. :[ I wanted to avoid looking like a total noob, because I'm exactly the opposite of one when it comes to computers Y___Y. Especially since most of my colleagues are guys who know their shit like I do when it comes to computers. But I shouldn't be giving a shit what they think anyway. :[
*clothes:* jeans and a T, sometimes a skirt. I like contrasting colours.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* Fangirl about silly boys in shows or movies I love. Listen to music. visit the city and explore pretty little shops...


*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? *

I don't know. I guess it's not high nor low. Medium pitched 


*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*

I just give up, I don't see the point in wasting my energy like that, especially when they take "shouting" as me having an attitude or being mad or something.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Welcome @GweNdZ


----------



## wumbeast

*age:* 13 
*location:* Canada
*job:* Student, I guess.
*relationship status:* Single.
*meandering career:* N/A
*hobbies:* Yoga (sounds kind of NF, I know), walking, filming, research
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* I wish I was better at typing people.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* Knowledge of things that I don't get to use in school or at a job (since I'm too young to get a job)... Psychology/MBTI stuff.
*current obsessive interest:* MBTI, cognitive functions, mental disorders
*former domain of geek-dom:* Mental disorders (Still interested in that, but it's no longer my #1 obsession). I also used to be really into history.
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* Not a TV show, but Star Wars.
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* World of Warcraft
*clothes:* Jeans and hoodies
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* Squeal at cute animals, haha


----------



## FlaviaGemina

welcome @wumbeast



*Girls, I don't remember if I have asked this before*:

1. Do you know other females of your own type in real life?

2. I'm having a socionics-based discussion with two guys about whether INTPs and INTJs are predetermined to "antagonize" each other.


My answers:
1. I don't currently know another female INTJ. The wife of a friend of mine is probably one, but I'm not really in touch with that friend anymore. 

2. I think that's mainly a guy thing.


----------



## Tapir

Hello!

*age: Mid-twenties
location: London
job: Journalist. Specialising in technology and business, perhaps unsurprisingly.
relationship status: single
meandering career: awful all-girls' school, degree in English, MA in journalism, actual journalism, all interspersed with regular life crises
hobbies: music, writing and swimming in cold water. 
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: medicine
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: piano, french and german
current obsessive interest: Boardwalk Empire. I've actually just finished it.
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Firefly. 
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: console games, RPG games (though not for a while, because apparently this is not attractive)
clothes: smart casual, almost permanently. and slightly untidy. how do some women look tidy all the time?
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: Dancing in clubs! With other humans!
*


----------



## lboogy85

Well for me INTPs can be fun to talk to but in the forums and on the facebook group they annoy me. They are so petty about things. Their first instinct is to tear ideas apart without trying to understand the idea. INTJs on the other hand seem to go into their minds and form connections as to why the idea is important. Instead of destruct they construct.


----------



## lboogy85

FlaviaGemina said:


> Girls, here's a new question: Share your amusing anecdotes about females of the other 'species'.
> 
> *Me and INTP girl back in Germany:*
> INTP - girl: I dated a married man for one and a half years once. I didn't notice he was married. *puzzled*
> Me: How could you not notice? They usually have a ring on their finger and if they only want to meet up an hour a week and have sex, that usually gives them away.
> INTP - girl: ?
> 
> A few weeks later:
> INTP girl: I got to know an English man.
> Me: Is he old?
> INTP girl: No, he's only 40.
> Me: Is he married?!?!
> INTP girl: No. He's separated. He's still friends with his wife, but they are getting divorced.
> Me: I got to know an English bloke in England once. THIS WAS BEFORE I HAD A BOYFRIEND! I WAS ALLOWED! He seemed WILLING, but he said weird things to me like: 'Maybe you will come to my house some day.' or 'Then I won't see you again, which will be a shame.' I wasn't sure whether that's some polite English expression or a pick-up line. What an idiot, I'd have loved to 'come to his house'.
> 
> a few days later:
> INTP girl: He told me he texted his friend: 'I got to know a weird girl."
> 
> A few weeks later:
> INTP girl: I'm going out with a YOUNG man tonight.
> 
> *******************************************
> I got stalked by an unhealthy ISFJ girl who had lots of issues:
> INTP girl: She's crazy. Has she ever thought about whether she is 100% heterosexual? I have _thought_ about it and the answer is yes, I am.
> Me thinks: _You can think about whether you are gay? Could someone have told me this before I asked my best girl friend to marry me? _[Good think she didn't want to marry me, because as it turns out I'm not gay. Next time I want to marry a woman, I'll THINK first]
> 
> *******************************************
> INTP girl about my INTP guyfriend: INTP GUY was sitting in the office! So I sneaked off. Like I wanna sit there with HIM!!!!! *brrrrrrrrrrrr*
> Me thinks: _Er? You're exactly like him? Why can't you sit together?
> **************************************************
> 
> _Introduction to INTP logic 101:
> INTP girl likes crazy ENTJ/INTJ/ENTP guy with narcissist personality disorder (I'm not exaggerating), although she is very aware of his craziness and criticizes him all the time.
> 
> INTP guy likes (in a friend way) the same crazy ENTJ/INTJ/ENTP guy with narcissist personality disorder , although he is very aware of his craziness and criticizes him all the time.
> 
> INTP guy is on his best behaviour towards INTP girl, i.e. he says "Hello, INTP girl." when he sees her, rather than just ignoring her like he ignores most people.
> 
> INTP girl doesn't like INTP guy. Adduces logical reasons why she likes him (he's hardworking etc.), but actually is totally creeped out by him.
> 
> *More to come.*


I was having trouble deciding between INTP and INTJ and after this I'm going to go ahead and say INTJ.


----------



## Sharkee

*age*: 20
*location*: U.S.
*job*: none as of now :/
*relationship status*: single
*meandering career*: ?
*hobbies: *drawing, reading, puzzles, games...
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: Math, a whole lot of IT stuff
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Art
*current obsessive interest*: mbti, gaining more obsessive interests 
*former domain of geek-dom*: Anime
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: the biggest loser(?)
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: solving random math problems, fixing computers/video game consoles
*clothes*: jeans, t-shirt or sweater, hoodie/jacket, tennis shoes/boots
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *Certain sports, playing/listening to music, watch romantic comedies


----------



## TriggerHappy923

Hm, I don't see why I'm bothering at 2am, but... mmmmmmmm yeah ok.
*age:* 21*
location: *Western North America*
job: *Eh, odd jobs, right now I'm unemployed going to college on my life saving with no clue what to do or with no idea if I'll ever get hired after I graduate... woopty doo.*
relationship status:* Single*
meandering career: *Was looking at becoming a lawyer... but I don't know... do I want to stay in the US? Psychology real-estate, forensics... now I'm thinking X-ray tech; but I don't know, undecided I guess.*
hobbies: *Minecraft, research, hanging out with friends, being a lazy ass.*
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* Learning a couple of languages like German, Latin, Spanish and Italian. HA! I can barely learn a few basics in Spanish. Let's see, I want to learn everything. I love knowledge... but I'm "rubbish" at everything.*
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* Math and picking people's brains*
current obsessive interest: *MBTI, anything having to do with the human brain, sleep, smoothies, green tea, psychology and human behavior, philosophy, economics (I love) and government... etc.*
former domain of geek-dom:* Halo (the game) my N-64 games (Pokemon, golden eye, super mario... etc. sssshhh I still play. ;-o)*
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* Star Trek, Red vs. Blue, South Park , Pokemon(former), the original Dr. Who!!!
*random geeky things I sometimes do but apically fail at:* When I try to talk about football but I don't know anything but getting my failure of a team(raiders) to run the ball towards the endzone. That's all I need to know. Don't criticize me, sports are not practical. what's the point of rooting for a team that's in your districts because of arbitrary boarders... See I fail at understanding but I do enjoy watching.*
clothes: *Jeans, flip-fops, and v-neck top.*
some of the 'human' things I like to do *occasionally: *Eat crap, sleep, drink, listen to music that fits my mood... blink... breath... I enjoy all those things. I enjoy doing human things so much I'm going to pass out on my bed and pretend to sleep for 8 hours, that's how committed I am. For the cause.

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? 
*I have more of a high pitched voice. In the mornings it's low... I guess... lol I hate my voice... with a passion.*
2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?
*I believe I have to talk a bit louder to get my words to be heard. I usually don't bother in the first place. I'm tired of hearing "Huh?" or "Uh?".


----------



## FlaviaGemina

lboogy85 said:


> Well for me INTPs can be fun to talk to but in the forums and on the facebook group they annoy me. They are so petty about things. Their first instinct is to tear ideas apart without trying to understand the idea. INTJs on the other hand seem to go into their minds and form connections as to why the idea is important. Instead of destruct they construct.


LOL, I'm sure INTPs would say the same about INTJs.


----------



## goodgracesbadinfluence

FlaviaGemina said:


> 1. Do you know other females of your own type in real life?
> 
> 2. I'm having a socionics-based discussion with two guys about whether INTPs and INTJs are predetermined to "antagonize" each other.


1. I know one. 

2. Not on purpose.


----------



## The Question

I'm an INTP with one of my two close friends typed as an INTJ. We get along rather well as we instantly clicked, which is probably helped by the fact we are both in the same university course. I think the clash that some people get between female INTP and INTJs is if the two are_ really _their type (if that makes sense). Based on functions I type as ENTP generally, but the paid MBTI I did gave INTP as my type, whether that plays any role in getting along with INTJs, I don't know. Also, I think the two definitely know how to push each others buttons, but I find that rather fun.


----------



## GweNdZ

1. Do you know other females of your own type in real life?

I don't Y__Y or at least I don't think so...

2. I'm having a socionics-based discussion with two guys about whether INTPs and INTJs are predetermined to "antagonize" each other.

I know an INTJ, my best friend's boyfriend, and if I wasn't the one trying to not speak to him we'd be constantly arguing. My friend told me that she doesn't mind us arguing because she said that he enjoys it. But I hate it, because he argues like a narrow-minded-personal-opinion-pusher, and it annoys me to hell and back. SO I just keep to myself whenever I'm around him.


----------



## VamPie

*Hi, I'm an INTP

relationship status: single
hobbies: literature (mainly SF and fantasy), wasting time on Internet, foreign languages
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: abstract hard science and maintaining hardware
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: linguistics, foreign languages, beauty tips
current obsessive interest: color analysis
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: I don't watch TV at all, how snobbish is it?
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: action games, any computer game which requires **dexterity
clothes: I stick to my own style which is well-fitted and somewhat dressy, but always comfortable.
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: talking with others, acting like I'm an extrovert *




*1. Do you know other females of your own type in real life?*

I think so, but we're not close with each other, in fact I don't think I was ever very close with another INTP, but we're usually like each other without getting close.

*2. I'm having a socionics-based discussion with two guys about whether INTPs and INTJs are predetermined to "antagonize" each other.*

I'm not sure, I think I can recognise my own MBTI type, but not others.


----------



## SmilesforMiles

I do have a deeper voice than most other women, but I've been told frequently it's rather sexy. People do ignore me and I have to shout at them. Huh, that's funny lol


----------



## datMBTIguy

Im not INTJ, INTP, or female, but I just came here to be all starry eyed at the hoard of super-fascinating-girls-I-would-probably-get-along-poorly-with in this thread. I find XNTP people in particular to be most fascinating. I dated an INTP girl once, it was a bumpy ride  But she was just so sharp and stubborn and intuitive and mysterious, I just couldn't resist it!


----------



## A Clockwork Alice

*age*: 17
*location*: Eastern-Europe, precisely - Latvia
*job*: none
*relationship status*: single
*meandering career*: none
*hobbies: *reading, drawing, writing, playing guitar, mostly art or science stuff.
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: PHYSICS, it's hard but I love it because it challenges me.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Drawing, playing guitar.
*current obsessive interest*: MBTI, science-fiction.
*former domain of geek-dom*: Organic chemistry, neurology, psychology
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Star Trek, also a crazy fan of Doctor Who
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: html stuff, math
*clothes*: jeans, t-shirts, skirts, usually bohemian style clothing.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *going on fun adventures, riding bike, having wine/poetry sessions with close friends.*

1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
*No, it sounds feminine.*
2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?
*I have a quiet voice, so unknown people don't hear me at start, but if I get to know them, my voice starts to sounds louder (maybe it's confidence, idk).


----------



## lboogy85

*age: **27**
location: USA USA
job: Promotional model, photographer
relationship status: single and ready to mingle
meandering career: we'll see
hobbies: modeling, learning, photography, editing
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: people
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: fashion design
current obsessive interest: MBTI, learning self acceptance, narrowing down career options
former domain of geek-dom: MBTI, psychology, goofy shows like Parks and Recs
TV program that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Parks and Recs, Arrested Development, almost anything on Adult Swim, documentaries on religion, politics, aliens
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: I fail at nothing. *:ninja:*
clothes: retro or boho chic. I love dresses.
some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: talking to people, laughing, crying
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
Yes, it's deep and slow and most people don't listen to me, don't respond or ask me to repeat myself.
2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all? Yes*


----------



## See Above

Here is a random question for you bunch. 

I was standing in a friend's office, after picking something up from him, and chatting with him and his co-worker. It is an active office with a lot of other co-workers and peripheral external support workers dropping in and out. A man I've never met stopped in. He kidded around with my friend about the busy time coming up and people getting demanding. He looked at me, frowned comically and said, "Like you....are you giving him a hard time?" I just smiled and said, "Heck, no! I've been hired as the bouncer around here. I rough up and toss out the bad ones!" The man looked back at my friend, glanced again at me, and said, "Well, I guess you're all set then. A beautiful bouncer, all your work and supplies lined up, --ready to go!" He made a just few more meaningless comments and left.

I react so badly to that sort of comment. My smile turns to glass and my eyes lose focus as my brain goes, "Whaa?" How can people say things like that so casually to complete strangers? I'm old (50-ish) and I _know_ that I'm _not_ beautiful and I'll probably never cross paths with that guy again, so, I am completely confused. What was the point to that? How would you react? Is there an appropriate way to react to that? It felt somehow patronizing, but, I don't think there was evil intent at the root of it. Still, I was embarrassed my friend and his co-worker heard it. So odd! I don't like the way that made me feel.


----------



## GweNdZ

See Above said:


> Here is a random question for you bunch.
> 
> I was standing in a friend's office, after picking something up from him, and chatting with him and his co-worker. It is an active office with a lot of other co-workers and peripheral external support workers dropping in and out. A man I've never met stopped in. He kidded around with my friend about the busy time coming up and people getting demanding. He looked at me, frowned comically and said, "Like you....are you giving him a hard time?" I just smiled and said, "Heck, no! I've been hired as the bouncer around here. I rough up and toss out the bad ones!" The man looked back at my friend, glanced again at me, and said, "Well, I guess you're all set then. A beautiful bouncer, all your work and supplies lined up, --ready to go!" He made a just few more meaningless comments and left.
> 
> I react so badly to that sort of comment. My smile turns to glass and my eyes lose focus as my brain goes, "Whaa?" How can people say things like that so casually to complete strangers? I'm old (50-ish) and I _know_ that I'm _not_ beautiful and I'll probably never cross paths with that guy again, so, I am completely confused. What was the point to that? How would you react? Is there an appropriate way to react to that? It felt somehow patronizing, but, I don't think there was evil intent at the root of it. Still, I was embarrassed my friend and his co-worker heard it. So odd! I don't like the way that made me feel.


I can totally relate. I don't like it in general when a guy notices me, like compliments me or some shiz like that. I feel focused on or something. When a guy does this I automatically become cold and distant towards them, but not because I don't appreciate the kind gesture, I just don't like the way it makes me feel. And I'm also scared they actually mean it.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

See Above said:


> Here is a random question for you bunch.
> 
> I was standing in a friend's office, after picking something up from him, and chatting with him and his co-worker. It is an active office with a lot of other co-workers and peripheral external support workers dropping in and out. A man I've never met stopped in. He kidded around with my friend about the busy time coming up and people getting demanding. He looked at me, frowned comically and said, "Like you....are you giving him a hard time?" I just smiled and said, "Heck, no! I've been hired as the bouncer around here. I rough up and toss out the bad ones!" The man looked back at my friend, glanced again at me, and said, "Well, I guess you're all set then. A beautiful bouncer, all your work and supplies lined up, --ready to go!" He made a just few more meaningless comments and left.
> 
> I react so badly to that sort of comment. My smile turns to glass and my eyes lose focus as my brain goes, "Whaa?" How can people say things like that so casually to complete strangers? I'm old (50-ish) and I _know_ that I'm _not_ beautiful and I'll probably never cross paths with that guy again, so, I am completely confused. What was the point to that? How would you react? Is there an appropriate way to react to that? It felt somehow patronizing, but, I don't think there was evil intent at the root of it. Still, I was embarrassed my friend and his co-worker heard it. So odd! I don't like the way that made me feel.


I wouldn't worry about it. Some people make all kinds of comments and they don't even care how you react. As you said, you'll never meet that guy again and he probably won't remember you, because he makes these kinds of comments 100 times a day. So it doesn't really matter how you react. I agree that what he said sounds patronizing, but he probably didn't mean to patronize _you _personally, so it's a waste of effort to think about him.


----------



## Tophthetomboy

*age: 15
location: USA
job: None, but sometimes I make money off drawings/paintings.
relationship status: Not interested in a relationship at the moment.
hobbies: Reading (Sci-Fi, comics, informational), learning (Science, History), digital art, graphic design, traveling, surfing the net
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Math, physics, engineering
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: Learning the German language
current obsessive interest: Astronomy and Cosmology (origins of the universe), MBTI
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Transformers I guess lol
clothes: Mostly graphical t-shirts and jeans

*


----------



## ana julia

See Above said:


> Here is a random question for you bunch.
> 
> I was standing in a friend's office, after picking something up from him, and chatting with him and his co-worker. It is an active office with a lot of other co-workers and peripheral external support workers dropping in and out. A man I've never met stopped in. He kidded around with my friend about the busy time coming up and people getting demanding. He looked at me, frowned comically and said, "Like you....are you giving him a hard time?" I just smiled and said, "Heck, no! I've been hired as the bouncer around here. I rough up and toss out the bad ones!" The man looked back at my friend, glanced again at me, and said, "Well, I guess you're all set then. A beautiful bouncer, all your work and supplies lined up, --ready to go!" He made a just few more meaningless comments and left.
> 
> I react so badly to that sort of comment. My smile turns to glass and my eyes lose focus as my brain goes, "Whaa?" How can people say things like that so casually to complete strangers? I'm old (50-ish) and I _know_ that I'm _not_ beautiful and I'll probably never cross paths with that guy again, so, I am completely confused. What was the point to that? How would you react? Is there an appropriate way to react to that? It felt somehow patronizing, but, I don't think there was evil intent at the root of it. Still, I was embarrassed my friend and his co-worker heard it. So odd! I don't like the way that made me feel.



Ok. First of all, how can you KNOW you're not beautiful according to every possible taste in the world? People are allowed to find you pretty - what if there was some specific trait he liked, or you reminded him of someone he liked?
Besides. This guy probably just realized that treating people well at first glance leads to them treating you well back, so, if you ever need anything, it would be more likely that people would help you with it. Since you never know when someone's sympathy will come handy - or whose -, it's smart to make it a habit to be outwardly nice to everyone. Sociopaths know it.


And hi.  I'm an INTJ girl. I've been lurking for a while here in PerC... Actually, I've been lurking for a much longer while than it seems, cause I had so much earlier than when I created this account - and when I did, I didn't really post anything. So, that's me and my self introduction. But I'm working on it.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

I am me said:


> the first time i took the test i got intj and then intp, so i researched the types and they were really cool. However, they didn't pinpoint me, so i took another test and got infp, which had all the jobs i ever wanted, and explained me exactly. but i think the intp and intj personalities are most similar to infp, and I enjoy the humor that can only come from you guys. So i ended up here.
> *btw what do you mean by an infusion of Fi?*


Are you familiar with cognitive functions? Just checking before I launch into an impromptu lecture.


----------



## I am me

FlaviaGemina said:


> Are you familiar with cognitive functions? Just checking before I launch into an impromptu lecture.


ya. I just don't understand how you want to get some of our Fi, if it basically means we don't share our feelings. It sounds like you want to get what we don't give. I don't get what you meant by that. Feel free to explain


----------



## FlaviaGemina

I am me said:


> ya. I just don't understand how you want to get some of our Fi, if it basically means we don't share our feelings. It sounds like you want to get what we don't give. I don't get what you meant by that. Feel free to explain


Huh? No, I meant that being in the company of Fi-doms kind of "activates" my Fi. E.g. when I'm in Ni-Te mode, I see things from different perspectives and think about whether they work or whether they are "real", but I don't think about my_ personal _opinion and values. When I see Fi users talk about their values, I start to think "hey, I (dis)agree with this person".


----------



## I am me

FlaviaGemina said:


> Huh? No, I meant that being in the company of Fi-doms kind of "activates" my Fi. E.g. when I'm in Ni-Te mode, I see things from different perspectives and think about whether they work or whether they are "real", but I don't think about my_ personal _opinion and values. When I see Fi users talk about their values, I start to think "hey, I (dis)agree with this person".


oh. Well then i guess you guys have the opposite effect on me. When i'm around intps and intjs i begin thinking logically. I think that's why i love math and engineering, because i get to exercise that part of me.


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## thekatspajamas

Hello, my name is Kat. I'm 23 years old and I don't think that I know any other INTP folks in my life, let alone female ones. My husband is an ISFJ and we have a 17 month old daughter. I have my degree in astronomy, but I have chosen to be a stay-at-home mother instead of pursuing a career in my field. I love to read, research, hike, watch movies, cook, work out, debate, and learn. I LOVE science and I'm always reading random academic articles and studies to keep growing my knowledge base. I'm a bit of an odd bird and I've always been told by folks that I am intimidating. Which seems silly to me, but I guess that my directness and my inability to mince words can come on a little strong at times. We're a Christian family who love God and try to serve Him with our lives. Oh and I LOVE the outdoors-- we're big hikers, campers, climbers, etc. We're both from Colorado, so we have a passion for nature. Should be interesting to meet y'all


----------



## Watercolourful

Hi there. I'm JAP- fifteen years old. I like Death Note and Sherlock. I enjoy learning about MBTI- it's my obsession at the moment, actually. I want to be a be a neuroscientist and professor of neuroscience at a university in the future. I live in Canada. My father is an ENTJ and my most-admired person in the world. My mother is an INFP and one of my best friends. I skipped over the majority of this thread after reading the first page, so I'm sorry if I ought to have read it. I'm often accused of being heartless and wanting to kill all my friends when actually, I just don't like talking unless I have something to say. Apparently I speak in monotone and people can't tell when I'm being sarcastic. I can't think of anything else to add.


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## anonimouze123

Hey, INTJ female here. Where do you think I can find other INTJs? I have never met another one...


----------



## A Skylark

anonimouze123 said:


> Hey, INTJ female here. Where do you think I can find other INTJs? I have never met another one...


Outside of the internet? Good luck, but... you don't exist. INTJ's (and INTP's) are few and far between, and when we are there, it's not easy to see. I would love more INT friends too, but- they're nigh on impossible to find.


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## FlaviaGemina

anonimouze123 said:


> Hey, INTJ female here. Where do you think I can find other INTJs? I have never met another one...


Not all INTJs are as interesting as you might think. I've got a colleague who's an INTJ and he's dead boring. He never says anything except "Huhnnnn." and when he does say something his opinions are very narrow minded and conventional (yes, I know that sounds strange, but I'm pretty sure he is an INTJ anyway). He's got one or two special topics, but he doesn't even talk about them all that much.
I know another male INTJ who is a senior citizen and he's dead cool and very wise.
I think it depends on the individual rather than type.
I'd concentrate on getting to know different people and see how you get along with them. 

Strangely enough, I've never met another female INTJ either. I had a female ENTJ friend in school and I know a few female INTPs and a female ENTP, but zero female INTJs. (Well.. One of my pupils might be one, but she's too young to tell).


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## Persephone

FlaviaGemina said:


> Strangely enough, I've never met another female INTJ either. I had a female ENTJ friend in school and I know a few female INTPs and a female ENTP, but zero female INTJs. (Well.. One of my pupils might be one, but she's too young to tell).


I've met another female INTJ... She thinks she's better than me. :dry:


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## nezumify

Hello! I just found this thread...and I was too lazy to write so I borrowed your form instead. roud:*

age:* 23*
location: *East side of USA*
job: *Student-ish*
relationship status: *Dating a male INTJ*
meandering career: *Still deciding, try again later*
hobbies: *Umm, learning, reading, playing with my pittbull, watching House and MASH with my SO, dancing, and simulation games*
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: *Math, programming, pixel art, Aquaponics, genetics*
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Martial Arts, mmorpgs, ornithology, sims 1/2/3, basic zoology*
current obsessive interest: *MBTI, Aquaponics, programming
*former domain of geek-dom*: The Sims*
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Babylon 5*
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: *Trying make an INTJ laugh, playing RTSs, go/chess*
clothes: *Home: comfy pants, stolen SOs shirt and fluffy robe. Work: See home*
some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally:* Spend time with friends/roommates, go to raves and dance, experiment with um.....things XD, clean things, hike, watch southpark
*


*


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## FlaviaGemina

Welcome @nezumify. What is Aquaponics?


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## nezumify

FlaviaGemina said:


> Welcome @_nezumify_. What is Aquaponics?


It's a way to grow plants. Kinda like Hydroponics, but instead of buying and adding nutrients to the water a live running fishtank is used instead.
They share the water though a pump system. The plants eat the fish waste and clean water and then it's sent back. It costs less, organic and uses less water. Plus I get to have cute fishies!


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## Watercolourful

FlaviaGemina said:


> Not all INTJs are as interesting as you might think.
> 
> Strangely enough, I've never met another female INTJ either. I had a female ENTJ friend in school and I know a few female INTPs and a female ENTP, but zero female INTJs. (Well.. One of my pupils might be one, but she's too young to tell).


Really? I know two other female INTJs. I agree that we aren't necessarily as interesting as one would expect, though. While one of them is very fun to talk to, the other has almost nothing in common and most of the time I find her rather dull.


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## TriggerHappy923

Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
My intj friend, she has a deeper voice than me. she's pretty mano tone. I have a higher pitched, but not squeaky... People just tell me it's unique. I don't care for it, but whatever...
2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?
People ignore both us usually, we both can put our foots down and get our voice heard though. We aren't scared of doing that. But yes, sometimes our normal voices aren't enough.


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## nezumify

TriggerHappy923 said:


> Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> My intj friend, she has a deeper voice than me. she's pretty mano tone. I have a higher pitched, but not squeaky... People just tell me it's unique. I don't care for it, but whatever...
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?
> People ignore both us usually, we both can put our foots down and get our voice heard though. We aren't scared of doing that. But yes, sometimes our normal voices aren't enough.



I would say my voice is of normal tone. I can be very expressive and loud if I want. But in a natural content state, most people think I'm mad at them. Apparently my normal/content voice comes off as dry/angry/upset/not-ok


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## 539885

Do you think us female INT-types are all the harder to find since we need to be chameleons somewhat for the society we're in? Like adapting to a different culture, we've learned enough of the language of those we're outnumbered by to get by, but maybe that also makes us look outwardly like another personality type.

@nezumify, I have to add I love the colors you got going in your ID pic!

Anyway, now for the boring stuff...*

age: *30*
location: *USA*
job: *Writer*
relationship status: *Happily taken by a male INTJ I stumbled into on NaNoWriMo forums*
meandering career: *Entrepreneur, writer, artist, why, why, WHY did I go into retail/sales?*
hobbies: *Video games, anime, writing, drawing, reading, music, movies, psychology, MBTI, managing people (not really a hobby, but something I end up doing way too often)*
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: *Dancing, singing, how to play various musical instruments, modding (as in making modifications to video games)*
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Website design, graphic arts, video editing, some music production, MMORPGs*
current obsessive interest: *MBTI*
former domain of geek-dom: *World of Warcrack*
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Stargate/Atlantis, Serenity (only partway through Firefly), growing up with Star Trek NG, most of the anime I've seen, some obscure shows like Dead Like Me*
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: *Trying to act my age*
clothes: *Baggy, unless the function is important, then I actually try*
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *Hug, squee at cute things or cute behaviors, go out with friends, display emotion

My voice has been described as "mellow," and I've been complimented that I could be a good DJ or even a public speaker. While it's not terribly deep, I was confused as a 15-year-old boy once on Ventrilo. I thought it was hilarious. This is probably due to how I talk as well, since I'm not very girly as a speaker.

My voice also carries, so I've actually been told to keep it down. I only have a problem being heard when people don't want to listen, but the rare few times I've been required to shout I can really get people's attention.


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## erialClaire

Deathmint said:


> Do you think us female INT-types are all the harder to find since we need to be chameleons somewhat for the society we're in? Like adapting to a different culture, we've learned enough of the language of those we're outnumbered by to get by, but maybe that also makes us look outwardly like another personality type.


I was about to pose a similar question when I read yours. I think it is highly plausible. At my workplace (in the education sector for little kidlets) and when interacting with strangers/acquaintances/children, I tend to slip on an ESFJ mask. In lecture halls (as a student), I tend to come across as an ENTJ. 
_
How does one identify an INTx female in the wild? _I'd really like to know. 



FlaviaGemina said:


> job: teaching assistant (i.e. working with kids with special needs)





> *1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*


Glad to meet a fellow INTJ teacher. I've been contemplating on creating a thread for INTJs working in the education sector, but am unsure if there are enough/many of us around. 

In answer to question #1: Yes, deeper and more calm (I wouldn't call it bored). I have noticed that if I raise the pitch higher, along with slightly raising my brows and smiling, I tend to elicit much more positive responses from others. (I've since been using this to my advantage.) Also, my voice/speech (and demeanour) tends to remain calm across all situations, where others had been frantic, ecstatic, infuriated, etc.


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## Aenye

FlaviaGemina said:


> I'd like to see whether INTP and INTJ females can get along and share experiences without the usual INTP vs INTJ debates (e.g. "Who's more intelligent?" or "Who's more arrogant?" etc.)


You nailed it: who's more intelligent is usually a debate for arrogant people, whatever their mbti type may be.


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## onthefence

I love INTJs! Several of my closest friends (male and female) are INTJ.


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## evilarchitect

Age: 33
Location: USA
Job: graphic designer / photographer
Relationship status: in a relationship with an INFJ
Meandering career: …?
Hobbies: playing piano, electronic music, walking around cities in my headphones, wine and cheese, perfume, museums, modern art
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: math, chemistry, objective c programming
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: web development
Current obsessive interest: perfume / scent / olfaction
Former domain of geek-dom: web development
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: black adder
Random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: web development
Clothes: modernist, casual, monochrome
Some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: riding my bike, taking bubble baths, picnics

1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?

by default, yes. at work i have to actively work against that.

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?

only when surrounded by extroverts, which happens more than i’d like to admit.


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## Light_92

_I'm here! I just noticed this topic from FlaviaGemina's signature.
I'll try to write a short introduction of myself by taking her first post here as an example.

_*age: **21**
location: Italy
job: Student (I have a Biology degree)
relationship status: Single
meandering career: Hmmm, I would love to be a college professor, or a professional photographer.
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: I'm so horrible at Philosophy ... but my best friend, an INTP student of Philosophy is helping me to get better.
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: Biology, they say I'm a brilliant student.
current obsessive interest: Lucid dreams
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Pokèmon, playing with Nintendo 3DS, loving The Lord of the Rings
Clothes: Shirts and jeans. I used to like very masculine clothes, like vests or ties! I like grey, light blue or brown ones.
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: Eating nice food. Cuddling my cats. Acting like a guide to my friends and loving when they trust me.*

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? Sometimes, it depends on the tone*.

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all? Yes. It's just a way to get others' attention.*


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## FlaviaGemina

Welcome @Light_92. I hope everything is going according to plan?



Brrrrrrr, I've been neglecting this thread.

Here's a moderately interesting philosophical question raised by my female INTP boss:
"If you didn't need the money, would you still work?" (We work at a school, it's stressful, emotionally draining, the pay is shit, but at least it's useful.)

Her answer was no. She'd stay at home and do lots of hobbies.
My answer was yes, I'd still work because I get bored when I have too much unstructured free time and just end up posting tables on the internet.


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## Light_92

_Hello, thank you for welcoming me! I got there by following your signature as I said!  
INTJ girls are 0,5% of population ...how could I simply resist to a place where the the frequency of INTJ (and INTP) girls is so high? 

My answer would be: No. 
Unless the job is really motivating and I love it a lot ... there is no reason of keep doing something frustrating and stressing. I can deal with boredom quite well ...  
I agree with your boss._


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## A Skylark

FlaviaGemina said:


> "If you didn't need the money, would you still work?"


While this question is not applicable to me, as I neither work nor need to work, I've been reading lately about various forms of basic income, and I find it fascinating. My dad and I, in fact, were just debating over it. He seems to think that most people would get lazy and not work. I disagreed, and went to the internet to help me prove my point. Apparently, in an experiment in Manitoba, when a basic income guarantee was implemented, there was a surprisingly low drop (5%) in the hours and amount of people who worked.

Personally, imagining for a moment that I am an adult, through with many years of school and living on my own, I would continue to work. If I had a really distasteful job, I'd probably consider it, but when you invest time, money, and passion into your career, you just don't leave. And in general, people get bored, depressed, restive- we are usually better for working.


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## FlaviaGemina

@A Skylark, that's very interesting.
I think it depends on the cultural background of the country. It might well be that people in Canada are more positive about life in general and work in particular than here in the UK.
In the UK, most people have a negative attitude towards their job. They basically only work because they have to, not because they think they can achieve something. I think this is mainly because of the British top-down hiearchy and class system.
There was a survey in which Europeans were asked whether they'd keep working if they won the lottery. 32% of people from other Western European coutries said they would. Only 13% of Brits said they would.


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## VamPie

FlaviaGemina said:


> @_A Skylark_, that's very interesting.
> I think it depends on the cultural background of the country. It might well be that people in Canada are more positive about life in general and work in particular than here in the UK.
> In the UK, most people have a negative attitude towards their job. They basically only work because they have to, not because they think they can achieve something. I think this is mainly because of the British top-down hiearchy and class system.
> There was a survey in which Europeans were asked whether they'd keep working if they won the lottery. 32% of people from other Western European coutries said they would. Only 13% of Brits said they would.


Or maybe because they have some ideas how to spend their time if they had much more money. In some countries people may think it would isolate them from their environments, I guess.

Hm, have you got a link to to that survey?



A Skylark said:


> While this question is not applicable to me, as I neither work nor need to work, I've been reading lately about various forms of basic income, and I find it fascinating. My dad and I, in fact, were just debating over it. He seems to think that most people would get lazy and not work. I disagreed, and went to the internet to help me prove my point. Apparently, in an experiment in Manitoba, when a basic income guarantee was implemented, there was a surprisingly low drop (5%) in the hours and amount of people who worked.
> 
> Personally, imagining for a moment that I am an adult, through with many years of school and living on my own, I would continue to work. If I had a really distasteful job, I'd probably consider it, but when you invest time, money, and passion into your career, you just don't leave. And in general, people get bored, depressed, restive- we are usually better for working.


I think it's more about sense of safety. That's why I believe in social state - when people feel safe ans supported they are more eager to put their effort into various enterprises, like working, creating businesses, starting families etc. When it becomes too risky people are scared and try to minimise the risk by doing less.


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## FlaviaGemina

VamPie said:


> Or maybe because they have some ideas how to spend their time if they had much more money. In some countries people may think it would isolate them from their environments, I guess.
> 
> Hm, have you got a link to to that survey?


I'm afraid not. I remember it was in some newspaper. I'm pretty sure I remember the figures accurately, but don't remember how exactly they conducted that survey.


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## Swede

What a cool thread! :happy:*

Age:* 40
*Location:* USA, 1st gen immigrant from Sweden
*Job:* R&D Engineer
*Relationship status:* Married to another INTJ
*Meandering career:* Craft store owner, shoe designer, glass blower, needlework designer
*Hobbies: *Reading, PerC, exercise, nature & walks, coffee breaks with friends, craft
*Interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* Making people laugh - stand-up comedian. Problem is, most people don't get my humor..., geography (sigh)
*Interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *The Swedish language/culture, down-hill skiing (slalom & Telemark), swimming, writing, sailing
*Current obsessive interest: *My twin daughters (8 months old)
*Former domain of geek-dom: *Embroidery & my embroidery blog (used to be addicted, now I don't have the time...)
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* Property Brothers, Flight of the Concords, Keeping up Appearances - shows that make me happy
*Random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* Programming classes in college - that would have been really cool to know how to do. Feign an interest in my husbands video game adventures... blah!
*Clothes:* Feminine! High heels, accessories - the works! Not skirts and dresses so much anymore - I hate my legs!
*Some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally:* Socialize with friends

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
I think it does sound deeper compared to US women - not so much compared to Swedish women. I don't sound bored as much as snobby, even though I absolutely don't intend for it to come across as such!

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
Some of my female friends have bad habits of interrupting, but I'm all right with that. At work - never - I tend to make people who don't seem to respect me pretty uncomfortable by just looking at them a special way. lol

*3. If you didn't need the money, would you still work?*
A few years back, my answer would have been a definite yes. It still is, but not so definite anymore. Kids and age change things. If I didn't have a job, I would probably not get out and interact with people a whole lot, which I do actually enjoy.


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## FlaviaGemina

Welcome to the thread @Swede. I think you take the prize for the INTX with the most 'feminine' hobbies.
Do you ever go back to Sweden at all? It's a lovely country!


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## Swede

Thanks @FlaviaGemina, yep, I am a pretty 'girly' INTX, I guess... I have to balance out all the men I deal with at work on a daily basis. lol I only eat lunch with female colleagues at work too, since US is relatively gender divided. 

I used to go home about once every other year, but since I had the twins I doubt I'll be traveling for a while. (And my pass-port expired, but don't tell anyone... shhh.)
My mom, dad, and youngest sister were just here last week for a visit though. It was nice - I got to sleep some! :laughing:


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## Dragheart Luard

Derp, I didn't see this before, so I will leave that basic info thing:

*age:* 23
*location:* Chile
*job:* chemistry student
*relationship status:* forever alone during my whole life
*meandering career:* maybe uni teacher and researcher
*hobbies:* reading, listening to rock and metal music, RPing (I kill my free time at tumblr xD), drawing
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* playing instruments like electric guitar, I tried to do that and failed epically.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* writing random stuff, playing videogames
*current obsessive interest:* RPing, playing Samurai Warriors on the 3DS
*former domain of geek-dom:* this is a bit difficult to define, but I think that Final Fantasy can be one, as I played the games but right now I'm not too interested in them.
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Anime
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* playing fighting games, I fail at them, specially the combos are painful.
*clothes:* comfy clothing, blue jeans, nothing too special but I don't like girly clothing like dresses and skirts.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *talking with my friends, who also like geeky themes and science in general


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## FlaviaGemina

Hi and welcome @Mugino Shizuri.
Wow, someone from Chile! I did Chile for my Spanish A-Level. I'd really love to visit your country one day! Los Prisioneros are one of my favourite bands. Don't know whether you know them because you might be too young


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## birdsintrees

ooh look.. questionnaire.

*age*: 30
*location*: Tropical Australia, imported
*job*: Quality Assurance
*relationship status*: Long term relationship with an ISFJ
*meandering career*: Degrees in Law that are sitting on the shelf collecting dust.
*hobbies: *PerC, Commenting on tv shows while watching them, cooking, the gym
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: Physics. I have zero patience.
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Law, languages
*current obsessive interest*: relocation.... Where Will We Move To Next
*former domain of geek-dom*: online gaming
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom*: Yep. Star Trek. All of ‘em.
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at*: Start reading a book on maths or a physics related topic and then actively watch the attention span fizz out around the 30 page mark.
*clothes*: Work: smart casual. Non-work: shorts, tank top. I try to wear a dress at least once a year or so.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: *FLUFFY ANIMALS. I want them all.


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## Dragheart Luard

FlaviaGemina said:


> Hi and welcome @_Mugino Shizuri_.
> Wow, someone from Chile! I did Chile for my Spanish A-Level. I'd really love to visit your country one day! Los Prisioneros are one of my favourite bands. Don't know whether you know them because you might be too young


Nice xD the people from here is rather friendly (well, maybe less than in other South American countries), and about Los Prisioneros, I know them because my mom heard their songs, and they also went to the Festival of Viña on the year 2003, so I saw them trolling the people from the TV channel that transmitted that festival. After all they were one of the most relevant chilean bands during the 80s.


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## Meliora

*age:* yes
*location:* USA
*job:* keeping the lights on
*relationship status:* single
*meandering career: *studied first for something in the hard sciences, then something in the fuzzy humanities, but ended up doing neither really
*hobbies:* reading, writing, sewing, baking/cooking, decorating, traveling, shopping, dressing nicely (dresses/heels/makeup - well, my friends always ask why I'm dressed so nicely but they're my regular "non-work" clothes that I enjoy wearing so...^^, playing with my pets, archery, driving, researching, watching foreign entertainment, concert-going
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* quantum physics (though I haven't really delved into this subject)
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* sports
*current obsessive interest:* Sherlock (BBC series)
*former domain of geek-dom:* anime
*TV programmes that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* Small Wonder, MacGyver, Star Trek (TOS, TNG, DS-9, Voyager), Doctor Who, Battlestar Galactica, Sailor Moon, Rurouni Kenshin 
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* tabletop gaming
*clothes:* on my personal time anything that catches my eye - dresses, skirts, fitted tops, jeans, heels, boots, cute hats, accessories. I enjoy fashion a lot. Textures of fabrics, colors, etc. all make me happy.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally:* go to the museum, people watch at a cafe, surprise close friends with gifts (baked items, funny things, etc), participate in a sing-a-long, enjoy tea time, go to the masseuse/spa, get a mani/pedicure

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
My voice is not deep at all and is feminine in tone. Depending upon the person I'm speaking with, that is, if I find them annoying or otherwise displeasing, it can sound very bored or monotone. Usually, if I'm talking about something that interests me, it can be quite lively sounding.

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
No as I am quite forthright and make my opinion known. Friends, coworkers, family - I don't hesitate to speak but in a way that adds to the conversation.

*3. If you didn't need the money, would you still work?*
No. I have many diverse interests, causes and hobbies outside of work that I would pursue instead that I don't have the time to do so now.


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## BlackMoonlight

age: 20 
location: U.S.A.
job: College student planning on studying geosciences and anthropology. 
relationship status: Single
hobbies: studying, finding random online information about astronomy and other sciences, scrabble, writing, and reading.
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Math 
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: Photography
current obsessive interest: The X Files
former domain of geek-dom: I guess star trek
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: maybe star trek even though I don't watch the show that much anymore.
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: I'm not sure about that. I guess it depends on what people consider geeky. 
clothes: T shirts, leggings, sweatpants, tank tops, sneakers; I'm very casual.
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: sleep


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## 539885

BlackMoonlight said:


> some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: sleep


Thanks, that made me LOL. xD I really wish I didn't have to sleep.


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## Meliora

Deathmint said:


> Thanks, that made me LOL. xD I really wish I didn't have to sleep.


And here I am wishing I were snoozing away in lala land. :laughing: I love to sleep. Some of the dreams I have are better than watching movies.


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## zerogravity

Greetings, fellow Introverted NT girls!

*age:* 18
*location:* Indonesia (South East Asia)
*job:* Interior Design student
*relationship status:* single since birth (lol forever alone)
*hobbies:* drawing, listening music, watching anime/movies/reality shows, reading manga, photography
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* marine biology, typography
*current obsessive interest:* MBTI, mameshiba
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* animes
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* I suck at games, sadly
*clothes:* black and white stuff, jeans, graphic tees, plaids, mostly stuff on the boyish side, I also love bags that stands out
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* I love animals and cute plushies characters

Questions:
1. My voice is somewhat deep... but it can go ultra high-pitched too at times haha!
2. Ah I do get ignored a lot, and usually I'll just... act like nothing happened :|

I don't really know my friends' types, but my bestfriend in high school is an ENFP, and my older friend (which I was pretty close with) is an INFP. And these people are the ones who could /kinda/ gets me out from my shell...


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## FlaviaGemina

@zerogravity, what is mameshiba?


----------



## Grain of Sugar

Also my question (;


----------



## Dragheart Luard

If you are into reading, do you ever talk about books with other bookworms?

Yeah, I talk about books with my best friend, and with other people that like to read a lot, in fact I've lent some of my sci-fi books to my friend (I don't know her type, but she seems to be a Ne-dom or aux), apart of some dystopic titles like 1984. She also recommended to me some fantasy books that I will check when I have more free time.


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## SHERlockedEnigmaPage394

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. Deeper? Interestingly enough, yes. More bored than most females? Sometimes. It really depends on what I'm talking about though. If I'm talking about something I'm interested in I get quite worked up and a little squeaky in tone.

2. Yes!!!! Nobody seems to hear me when I talk!!!!! I went on for a half hour once talking to my ESFJ friend (subject I loved I didn't even notice her unresponsiveness) and it was in a normal volume. She just didn't hear!!! Didn't even notice I was talking!!!! That seems weird to me. It's actually quiet offensive and annoying. It happens with basically everyone. Aside from my INTP friend, oddly enough...


----------



## INTJellectual

*age: **late 20's**
location: Philippines
relationship status: married
hobbies: reading, going for walks, eating, internet, chatting, watching t.v.
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: computer programming
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: writing
current obsessive interest: MBTI, Enneagram, Psychology
former domain of geek-dom: History, Science, Literature, Language
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: National Geographic, Educational shows
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: having trouble with trouble-shooting
clothes: shirt, blouse, jeans, capri pants, skirt sometimes, flats
some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: reading and watching romance and erotic stories
everybody else: watching tv, listening to music, going to the cinema,restaurant etc 

*


----------



## zerogravity

FlaviaGemina said:


> @<span class="highlight"><i><a href="http://personalitycafe.com/member.php?u=12520" target="_blank">zerogravity</a></i></span>, what is mameshiba?


It's this cute yet weird Japanese short anime, which is also famous as plushies characters!




lol!


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Thanks @zerogravity, I'll try to watch it tomorrow.


----------



## Madders

Age:17 
Occupation: restaurant hostess / busser
Relationship: single
Hobbies: reading, studying/learning, drawing, thinking, sleeping, walking around, listening to music, eating...a lot
Interests that I'd like to know/do but would be rubbish at: Computers, technology, mechanical stuff. I can't even comprehend programming, but I'd like to ;_;
Interests that I'm good at that are irrelevant: drawing, laying around
Current obsessive interest: psychoanalyzing people, psychology, neuroscience, biology
TV programmes that qualify me for super geekdom: Classic Who, documentaries, Black Books, Supernatural, Marble Hornets
Random geeky things I like to do but usually epicly fail at: short stories, games, cryptology
Clothes: jeans, shirt, hoody, shoes. usually neutral colors, but sometimes I like to jazz it up with vivid colors
"Human" activities/things I enjoy: animals, food, movies, nature. anything cute. trying to find someone to fall in love with ;_;

Answers:
1. I have a deeper voice usually, unless I'm talking to a superior or trying to get heard.
2. Yes. Apparently, if I don't raise my voice a few octaves, talk slower, and louder, no one has any idea that I'm saying anything. I have to wonder if people have been conditioned by society to not hear something unless it's extremely loud, because i'm definitely producing sounds and syllabless when I speak.


----------



## ChaosEqualsFun

I support this group wholeheartedly considering I am close friends with mostly girls/ was on the female team in every "battle of the sexes" game in high school...however, since there has been both an extroverted nt and a male nt....I want to answer this questionnaire. 

Age: 20
Occupations: Intelligence Analyst (CSIS)/Convenience store worker/ game theory research (assistant professor)....I know it is confusing.
Relationship: Single, looking for love.
Hobbies: Game theory, statistics, Martial arts(kung fu), political science, pyschology, swing music, video games, board games, card games, gambling, drinking coffee, drinking tea, drinking wine, reading, positioning myself in places where I might find interesting people/events occuring, sleeping, visiting used bookstores.
Interests that I'd like to know/do but would be rubbish at: Biology, Physics, any sort of spatial intelligence related hobby.Linear algebra...
Interests that I'm good at that are irrelevant: speed reading, mythology, history, I am pretty good at learning languages.
Current obsessive interest: Social networking, making friends, explaining my true self to close friends.
TV programmes that qualify me for super geekdom: Anything agatha christie/sherlock holmes related, all of doctor who (old and new), firefly/anything whedon, anything Tim Burton, starwars, startrek, stargate, anime, supernatural, x-files, scifi movies...the list just goes on and on.
Clothes: I tend to wear button-up shirts/ jeans or dressed up to the nines in a suit...
Human Activies: Hanging out with close friends, looking for love, empathy, existing.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Madders said:


> 2. Yes. Apparently, if I don't raise my voice a few octaves, talk slower, and louder, no one has any idea that I'm saying anything. I have to wonder if people have been conditioned by society to not hear something unless it's extremely loud, because i'm definitely producing sounds and syllabless when I speak.


It might also be evolutionary. High-pitched female screaming attracts males to help them, but I forgot the scientific reason for why it has to be high-pitched.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Hi @ChaosEqualsFun
How come you've got so many jobs at your tender age?


----------



## ChaosEqualsFun

Mostly to occupy time. As well, the analyst job happens during summer and after I graduate. The assistant professor job happened because one of my profs noticed that I never showed up to class yet had a perfect mark in her introduction to game theory course. This led to some wonderful conversations on the subject and she had me hired. The convenience store job was because my friend's family needed some help and I needed the money.


----------



## anon1234

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? 
**
Yes, except when I'm speaking to my dog or young children.**

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?

Yes and when I tell people that I already told them the things I yelled to them they outright deny it. It drives me crazy. Worse than being ignored is when someone says the same exact thing after I do and because they are more credible (older) it magically makes the same logic/ argument more valid. *


----------



## Grain of Sugar

I didn't answer whether my voice is bored. (; yes, it is. In school, for example, when I answer a question, everyone could think I've no interest for the issue even when I have.


----------



## Raha

*Greetings everyone! 
age: 16
location: Tehran,Iran(Middle East) 
job: teaching English to my grandmother 
relationship status: single
hobbies: reading and writing, gaming, drawing, thinking and practicing my deduction skills 
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Dramatic arts, Psychology 
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: game designing, computer programming, dead languages, Anthropology
current obsessive interest: complex systems, game theory, philosophy of science, Biotechnology, evolutionary biology and literature.
former domain of geek-dom: political and social studies. 
TV program that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Sherlock, Hezar dastan(an old Iranian TV program) 
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: studying plant biology 
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: **ehmm..archery. 
**
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
well, i have a very girly voice but it could be bored and emotionless. 

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?
No, not really. sometimes they can't hear me because i speak in a low voice, except that i have no problem. 

about the books. i can say that my entp and estp friends and i are always talking about the books we read. the day we don't talk about our favorite books won't be a normal day. although my entp friend is more interested in fantasy and sci-fi and my estp friend likes classic and modern Farsi poetry and i am into books with philosophical and social theme, we can always find something to discuss. For example we talk about characters and we try to analysis them. or we change characters and we re-write the story. our favorite fields of discussion are Tolkien's works, Rumi and Shamlou's poetry, and novels of George Orwell, Mikhail Bulgakov and Simin Daneshvar. *


----------



## HighSteaks

FlaviaGemina said:


> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. My voice is softer and girly, but I can be a bit monotone at times if I'm not thinking about my inflection. I also have to think about showing facial reactions and emotions because I tend to not physically react to things unless I make a point to. This is one of the reasons I like acting, because I already have to think about what type inflection should be used when and what body language is appropriate for which situation.

2. Because my voice is soft and quiet, I do have to try hard to get people's attention often. Mostly I try to get people's attention when I am having trouble by doing physical motions rather than shouting.

*
location: *The Midwest*
relationship status: *single*
hobbies: *reading and writing, gaming, drawing, thinking, acting, dreaming, running, making music*
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: *Coding, Sociology, Psychology*
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *Dramatic arts, Percussion, Theorizing*
current obsessive interest: *MBTI, Sociology, Psychology, Red vs Blue: Bloodgulch Chronicles, various video games (Zelda, Pokemon, minecraft, Halo, etc.)*
former domain of geek-dom: *Doctor who, Generational Studies*
TV program that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Sherlock, Doctor who, various anime, Red vs Blue (not really on TV but it is a series), Things that I can't remember at the moment but know exist.*
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: *Coding, Tetris*,
some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally:* play the marimba with four mallets, sing when no one's around.


----------



## Bahburah

The Nth Doctor said:


> It's horrible when it's been recorded for some reason..


Thats the sound of your normal voice, our voice reverbs in our head a bit so it sounds softer to us than it actually is.


----------



## Grain of Sugar

I somehow don't want this thread to die. I fell in love. ♥ 

I'm not even sure if I know INTJs in real life. I have the strong feeling I know too few people. 
How many people who are INTx females do you know?


----------



## FlaviaGemina

BlueberryCupcake said:


> I somehow don't want this thread to die. I fell in love. ♥
> 
> I'm not even sure if I know INTJs in real life. I have the strong feeling I know too few people.
> How many people who are INTx females do you know?


I've known 3 or 4 INTP females over the years. 
One was a classmate at uni, one is a friend of mine, another is a colleague and the other one is her litte sister. I'm not sure the little sister is an INTP, because she talks too little for me to type her, but there isn't anything else she could be, really.
I'm aware of the existence of another INTJ female at my workplace, but I don't know her personally.


----------



## Grain of Sugar

So many  

If there isn't any other possibility she has to be ^^ Or why not an idealist?


----------



## FlaviaGemina

BlueberryCupcake said:


> So many
> 
> If there isn't any other possibility she has to be ^^ Or why not an idealist?


The little INTP sister? LOL, well, when she does talk, she hisses  But honestly, she's so quiet it's hard to say. She might be an INFP who's under the influence of her bigger sister, but she doesn't seem opinionated enough to be an INFP. No idea.


----------



## worldsconverged

*1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
Yes. Out of all of my friends, I have the deepest voice.

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
Yeah, most of the time for me to get my point across requires me to talk loudly, sometimes yell. It makes me so unbelievably angry T_T


----------



## Hypathia

Reportin'.


----------



## Cherie

Such a diverse demographic yet so similar  

age: 19
location: California
job: Office Assistant / Psychobiology sudent
relationship status: Single
[aspiring] career: Physicians Assistant specializing in Psychiatry
hobbies: Painting, reading, finding new music, playing piano, exploring new places and food
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Theoretical math, time management, astronomy, art therapy, color psychology, world politics
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: Painting
current obsessive interest: INFPs / INFJs :kitteh:. I've been obsessed with psychology and art for as long as I can remember. Other than that, my interests are wavering and I drop/pick up new things on the daily. 
former domain of geek-dom: Literature
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Not super geeky but Sherlock, GOT. 
clothes: jeans, boots, and dressy coat/shirt if it's winter
some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: Go shopping, party, watch movies, melt at the sight of cute animals

ISTJ: Stand still so I can pick you up.
ISFJ: If I had a rose for every time I thought of you, I'd be walking through my garden forever.
ESTJ: Is it hot in here, or is it just me?
ESFJ: (hold out hand) Would you hold this for me while I go for a walk?
ISTP: Hello. Are you taking any applications for a boy/girlfriend?
ISFP: Hello. Cupid called. He says to tell you that he needs my heart back.
ESTP: Can you pull this heart-shaped arrow out of my ass? A damn little kid with wings shot me.
*ESFP: If I followed you home, would you keep me?*
INTJ: Giant polar bear. ("What?") It broke the ice.
INTP: You know, we have actually met before. Remember the dream you had of the perfect guy/girl? I was the guy/girl standing to his/her right.
*ENTJ: I'm sorry, were you talking to me? (“No.”) Well then, please start.*
ENTP: If you were a laser, you'd be set on "stunning".
INFJ: See this pin? I want to prick you with it to see if you truly do bleed sunshine.
INFP: Can I borrow a quarter? I want to call my Mum and tell her I just met the person I'm going to marry.
ENFJ: Wouldn't we look cute on a wedding cake together?
ENFP: Well, here I am. What were your other two wishes?


----------



## Mcblahflooper94

Why I'm in this thread


----------



## tech_hunter

This looks like a good place to do a first post!

age: *39*
location:* United States*
job: *IT recruiter (wishing I was one of the developers I talk to every day!)*
relationship status: *married*
meandering career: *started out in dental assisting, homeschooled my kids through 8th grade, went into admin and home health care, then trained to recruit in IT, now taking online programming classes. This is real meandering because in the 80s, there was nothing I liked more than sitting at my TI 99/4A for hours, typing out basic programs, only to see a little 8 bit guy dancing on the screen for a few minutes. There was no save, so when I turned it off, I knew that it would all have to be typed over again, and I still did it....because I enjoyed it.*
hobbies: *reading, playing WoW, horseback riding, raising animals for our freezer.*
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: *would LOVE to understand chemistry, but I really sucked at it in high school, now don't really want to bother to see if I would be good at it, but I wish I understood it!*
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: *alternative money, bartering, alternative internet systems in case the SHTF*
current obsessive interest: *MBTI, INTP/ESFJ relationship (my SO is ESFJ and drives me up the wall, been married almost 20 years and would like to not separate), ENTP/ISf(t)J/INFJ (my kids tested out, I think I get along with my ENTP daughter the most, my INFJ son and I talk computers a lot, so that's good, but I don't always click with my ISf(t)J daughter*
former domain of geek-dom: *BASIC programming*
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Sherlock, Doctor Who*
random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: *random math stuff deeper than basic knowledge, anything mechanical (WHY!?!)*
clothes: *Robe and PJs, (I work at home), jeans and tshirt or nice shirt (out about town)*
some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: *Oh, I like to occasionally have coffee with people. I don't like to do it, but when one of my kids cries, I have a pretty immediate tear-up reaction. Very irritating.*

1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? * Deeper, yes, and I often sang in the tenor section in choir when they didn't have enough guys.
*
2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all? *Actually, I have found that people interrupt me halfway through a sentence. I usually just brush it off, but occasionally it infuriates me.*

How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you? *Since I was about 18 and took the MBTI test. I tested INFP then, but I think it must have been part extreme hormones/stress, and a bit of lying (don't want to come off as cold hearted to a test, now do I? Now that I know I am INTP, I have started to accept that it is not bad to do more thinking then feeling. I have been told that I am bad, that I am cold and unfeeling, that I am arrogant, stuck up, an "Ice Queen". I finally found that this was all told to me by the feelers in my life. I am not bad, I just process differently.*


----------



## paige1136

*Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
More bored, yes. I don't have a lot of fluctuation in my tone. So I won't be one of those girls who shows a ton of emotion in her voice (which is societally expected). 

With that said, my voice is soft. I always *think* it sounds deeper, but a lot of people have told me it doesn't. I think I just don't like the sound of my voice :/

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
This happened more as a kid. Now this isn't the case, unless it's a group of 4+. Usually in these settings I take the role of a listener and can usually speak up if needed, but sometimes I have to pretty much yell/act annoyed to get people's attention (this is quite rare though).


----------



## Mair

age: 18
location: Greece
job: I'm working part-time as a teacher for elementary school students that have trouble studying on their own
relationship status: Single
hobbies: reading, watching movies, listening to music
interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Astronomy, physics, maths
interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: foreign languages
current obsessive interest: Philosophy
clothes: anything casual

1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females? 

Deeper yes, but not bored

2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" .voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all? 

No

How long have you known you're an introvert? And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?

I was always an introvert but I didn't know details about extraversion and introversion until very recently


----------



## passmethecookies

Hello, I just found this thread. I will read it in its entirety later -really, P notwithstanding-


*age:* old enough to know that I know nothing
*location:* Spain
*job:* Let's say I work in the more technical side of medicine
*relationship status:* single.
meandering career: 
*hobbies:* reading, drawing, writing, watching movies and TV shows, trekking
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at*: physics
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment*: learning a foreign language and improving my English
*current obsessive interest:* psychology, psychiatry and neuroscience in general. 
*former domain of geek-dom:* : LOTR (although I wouldn't call it 'former'. I still consider myself a LOTR and LOTR related themes geek.
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: * Idk....Lost maybe? But I read comic books. Now I'm into Doctor Strange.
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* web design
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:* laughing, cooking
*
Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
No. It's not especially high pitched but I've been told that it's "sweet" (*vomits*). I only sound bored when I want to sound that way

*Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" .voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*
No. People tend to pay attention to me when I talk. Maybe because it doesn't happen too often. 
*How long have you known you're an introvert? *
Since I was born (well, sort of. Let's say since I had some sort of self awareness, probably 3 or 4 years old)
*when did you learn about introversion/extroversion? * I didn't have the theorical knowledge but always knew I felt better alone, on my own, with my thoughts.
*How long have you known you're an INTx.* 19 years. 
* And (how) has all of this helped you?* It helped to understand many of the conflicts I've had with other people and also to analyze my own behavior..

ETA:
-I'm a 'rational' but that doesn't mean I don't like more 'girly' things like fashion, make up and related stuff. In fact, I love it. -I like cars and football and more stereotypically male subjects too. On the other hand I also love cats and animals in general and get all mushy around them. I love my cats, they're my babies.
-Speaking of babies: I'm not interested in human babies. Give me a puppy or a kitten and I turn into a chocolate flan. 
-Many people I've later become good friends with have told me that their first impression (and probably second and third) about me was 'so serious' and 'intimidating', other have plainly said I was 'an arrogant bitch'. 
-I never liked dolls. I actually loathed them. Only had one Barbie and to make clothes for it, never really 'played'.

ETA again (after reading a few posts back)
-I don't think I've met any other INTP woman. I've probably come across one INTJ, but still not sure. The only other confirmed INTP I know is a male and he's one of my best friends.


----------



## Hypathia

We should have our own subforum gals. We really should.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Crap, I haven't been able to think of any questions in ages.
Here's one:
Has an INTX ever expressed that they like you platonically?

Here's how my female INTP boss went about it (quoted from "Excerpts from Everyday Conversations"). So cute  



> INTP lady boss isn't my boss anymore because they've shuffled the line management groups. I'm now in an ISTJ's group.
> INTP in a shy but soothing voice that heralds matters of great import: FlaviaGemina, has ISTJ spoken to you?
> Me: ??? Oh, that I'm in her group. Yeah, she said she was going to put something about a meeting in my tray. *ignores emotional dimension*
> INTP in soothing but logical voice: It's not because I don't like you.
> Me thinks: _Why is she trying to calm me down when I haven't even complained? Has she rehearsed this? Also, I bet she'd say this to anyone.. but you gotta get it where you can, so never mind. We are alone and she looks like this is "the right moment" to say this. I bet she has rehearsed it. I know I have. It is time to recite my premeditated joke now:
> _Me: It's because you HATE ME!!! BOHOOOOOO! MY HEART IS BROKEN! *clutches chest*
> INTP, dryly: Oh, I'm very sorry. :|
> Me: I bet you are!
> Both:
> INTP, seriously: I just thought I'd tell you so you don't get any of that [heartbreak].


----------



## Hypathia

My last best friend of a long time was INTP, our relationship was platonic. Male and female spooning while they sleep but without sexual tension? No one ever understood how we'd do it. But it did, and it was magic. People underestimate platonic relationships so much.


----------



## passmethecookies

I don't underestimate platonic but it's something I'm unable to do. I can't do a relationship like that without the physical. In fact, the physical part of it is what makes me have a relationship in the first place (the rest comes later). So platonic for me is a no-no. I have the need to concretize, sooner than later. That's why the closest I get to platonic is unrequited, really.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

passmethecookies said:


> I don't underestimate platonic but it's something I'm unable to do. I can't do a relationship like that without the physical. In fact, the physical part of it is what makes me have a relationship in the first place (the rest comes later). So platonic for me is a no-no. I have the need to concretize, sooner than later. That's why the closest I get to platonic is unrequited, really.


I was just referring to friendships, really. Has an INTX ever expressed their friendly affection to you?


----------



## passmethecookies

FlaviaGemina said:


> I was just referring to friendships, really. Has an INTX ever expressed their friendly affection to you?


Ah ok, I tend to link 'platonic' with unexpressed romantic interest without the physical/sexual part.
I have one INTP friend but he has never expressed affection in words or hugs or similar (I, predictably, haven't either) but he's always been there for me. As an INTP I understand that's his way to show affection and the way I value the most.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

passmethecookies said:


> -Many people I've later become good friends with have told me that their first impression (and probably second and third) about me was 'so serious' and 'intimidating', other have plainly said I was 'an arrogant bitch'.


How do you get people to tell you what their first impression of you was? Did you ask them about it or did they just tell you?


----------



## Fish Launcher

FlaviaGemina said:


> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. I sound like a computer, which is unfortunate. It's slightly nasal and monotonous, unless I ate too many Skittles. Then it's all shrieky and high-pitched.

2. When I was younger, my voice was barely audible. But now people can hear what I'm saying, but I have slight dyslexia, so they can barely tell if I talk spontaneously, and it's creepy if I give them a blank stare while I process my sentence, so that's unfortunate.


----------



## passmethecookies

FlaviaGemina said:


> How do you get people to tell you what their first impression of you was? Did you ask them about it or did they just tell you?


They told me. Typical situation is: I switch to hyper mode for whatever reason and become some sort of clown. People who witness this are baffled/surprised at the unexpected display from the INTP, laugh their asses off, and then tell me about the 'first impression thing' I already know it's coming.


----------



## Rumex

Hello there, am I too late to join this discussion?
*age:* Old enough to join PersonalityCafe
*job:*Bored Student
*location:* East Coast
*relationship status:* single
*hobbies*: reading, writing, the viola, painting, and eating.
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* German
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* Theorizing, asking random detailed questions, and picking up new obsessions.
*current obsessive interest:* Interactive fiction text-based games, and physics & astronomy.
*former domain of geek-dom:* Anime & manga, the stock market, and coding.
*TV program that qualifies me for super-geekdom:* I usually don't watch TV.  but Big Bang Theory?
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* Coding from scratch.
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally:* Waste my time on tumblr and (try to) cook.

*Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*
Yes. I have the second deepest female voice in my grade. I get confused as a guy all the time over voice chats, and my voice is pretty monotonous as well.

*2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all? *

No, they just look creeped out.

*How long have you known you're an introvert?* A year.
* And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion?* A year as well.
* How long have you known you're an INTx. And (how) has all of this helped you?*
I've known that I was an INTJ for a couple of months. Knowing that I was INTJ helped solve many questions I've had in my life. I've been called/described as "anti-social" and "cold", unlike my fellow extroverted and hyper classmates. I suppose it also helped me to understand myself better.


----------



## Chinatsu

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah  Just stand in a corner and lurk for while  I'm used to it
> 
> 
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


For question 1 I'd definitely have to say yes unless I'm feeling really enthusiastic about explaining the theory of what I'm talking about. As for question 2 I consider myself able to communicate effectively without shouting because of my seriousness and tone.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

toastandtea said:


> And for that matter, when did you learn about introversion/extroversion?
> During a citizenship class a year ago. After doing it at school, I decided to do a little more research and found out about MBTI.


I'd like to know more about that. What was the context of this lesson? Was it a whole lesson about introversion/ extroversion or was it more like in PSHE when they mention it in passing as a synonym for other words?


----------



## polyangel

Hello 



FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL, yeah
> *Edit: Here are my first question for INTP and INTJ girls:
> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


1. My voice sounds definitely more bored and monotone than most girls I know. I wouldn't call it deep, though. 

2. I am not one for "shouting", and anyways I find most people who already know me listen to me when I speak (since is not very often if I'm honest). If not, I don't repeat unless the information is critical to the other person.

And since I'm already here (and new) I might as well do this
_age:_ teens
_location:_ let's not
_job:_ student
_relationship status: _single (for life)
_hobbies:_ reading, studying, violin, the internet, fitness (a bit of a strech), chess
_interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:_ i'm rubbish at the plastic arts but is not one of my interests... i am doing latin right now and although i'm not "rubbish" i can tell i'm not a natural at ancient languages; acting, calligraphy
_interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:_ arguing for fun, political theory, math, organizing stuff, strong focus, "testing" people
_current obsessive interest:_ metas, planning for my future, science, history, paradoxes, game theory
_(former) domain of geek-dom:_ anime, science fiction, fantasy, all very current as well
_TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom:_ Star Trek, Cosmos, anime
_random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:_ explaining how brilliant are all things above
_clothes:_ smart outside, comfy when hiden.
_some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally:_ watching the Academy Awards last night 

Apart from that, I'd like to know the opinion of you ladies on typical "girly" affairs: beauty, fashion, the like. 
(I haven't seen all 43 pages but I don't know if you've already stated your take on this)


----------



## toastandtea

FlaviaGemina said:


> I'd like to know more about that. What was the context of this lesson? Was it a whole lesson about introversion/ extroversion or was it more like in PSHE when they mention it in passing as a synonym for other words?


It was spoken about by the teacher for about five minutes, not exactly in passing, but not an entire lesson devoted to the subject. The lesson itself was more to do with emotion and how/why people react to things in certain ways and why everyone's emotions are different and that we shouldn't be ashamed of them.etc, that sort of thing. During the lesson it was presented as a proper aspect of someone's personality, not just the 'extroverts are all loud, introverts are all quiet' myth. But it was a while back, I'm not too sure of all the details.


----------



## marybluesky

FlaviaGemina said:


> *1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?*


Yes. I have a deep, monotonous voice. I cared it could be much better if not that monotonous. I speak loudly by nature, but when I control it my voice is somewhat bored too.



FlaviaGemina said:


> *2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?*


 Sometimes it happens, though I guess not because of my voice but because I don`t try to make my stories more interesting by lots of emotion, details (I`m minimalist), exaggeration, etc.


----------



## ChristynJ

See Above said:


> I react so badly to that sort of comment. My smile turns to glass and my eyes lose focus as my brain goes, "Whaa?" How can people say things like that so casually to complete strangers? I'm old (50-ish) and I _know_ that I'm _not_ beautiful and I'll probably never cross paths with that guy again, so, I am completely confused. What was the point to that? How would you react? Is there an appropriate way to react to that? It felt somehow patronizing, but, I don't think there was evil intent at the root of it. Still, I was embarrassed my friend and his co-worker heard it. So odd! I don't like the way that made me feel.


Me too! Some random guy stopped me on the street and told me I was beautiful. I thanked him and almost ran away. That bothered me for days. Why would he say that? Weird! Make it go away!


----------



## comanche

ChristynJ said:


> Me too! Some random guy stopped me on the street and told me I was beautiful. I thanked him and almost ran away. That bothered me for days. Why would he say that? Weird! Make it go away!


lol. I have been stopped several times by a man from my street and complimented. He looks like a hobo-drunkard but he is kind and always says respectful things. I live in the type of neighborhood full of gangs of all ethnicities and I usually avoid the packs of bad boys that seem to be around every corner of the street. They sometimes make dirty remarks to every woman that they pass. I used to think of it as unbearable, and it is for some people. When this hobo complimented me and always wished me good luck on my way home I realized that the gangs of bad boys surrounding him were dropping their jaw in amazement. They could not believe their eyes when I answered in the same polite manner. Soon, they started hello-ing me respectfully whenever they pass me by.


----------



## ChristynJ

comanche said:


> lol. I have been stopped several times by a man from my street and complimented. He looks like a hobo-drunkard but he is kind and always says respectful things. I live in the type of neighborhood full of gangs of all ethnicities and I usually avoid the packs of bad boys that seem to be around every corner of the street. They sometimes make dirty remarks to every woman that they pass. I used to think of it as unbearable, and it is for some people. When this hobo complimented me and always wished me good luck on my way home I realized that the gangs of bad boys surrounding him were dropping their jaw in amazement. They could not believe their eyes when I answered in the same polite manner. Soon, they started hello-ing me respectfully whenever they pass me by.


Wow, that's interesting. I wonder who that guy was? It sounds like the boys respect him.


----------



## comanche

ChristynJ said:


> Wow, that's interesting. I wonder who that guy was? It sounds like the boys respect him.


he's the drunkard of the neighborhood. his wife kicks him out of the house every morning. apparently, he makes a better husband when piss drunk.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

comanche said:


> he's the drunkard of the neighborhood. his wife kicks him out of the house every morning. apparently, he makes a better husband when piss drunk.


There's a book in this.


----------



## Knight of Ender

My voice... I normally speak low, but I feel like I can be shrill sometimes. Also, whenever I start talking, my brain shuts off. I either give instinctively good speeches that both feelers and thinkers can relate to (I'm fairly balanced) or stutter aimlessly and no one can understand what I mean. I sometimes talk too quietly and have to repeat myself.

Another thing I noticed is that most of the people I actually talk to are INTJ. Maybe we have similar interests, or maybe we are all ok with ignoring each other for a day. And I noticed that I'm a better planner than one of them, the poor guy.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Knight of Ender said:


> My voice... I normally speak low, but I feel like I can be shrill sometimes. Also, whenever I start talking, my brain shuts off. I either give instinctively good speeches that both feelers and thinkers can relate to (I'm fairly balanced) or stutter aimlessly and no one can understand what I mean. I sometimes talk too quietly and have to repeat myself.
> 
> Another thing I noticed is that most of the people I actually talk to are INTJ. Maybe we have similar interests, or maybe we are all ok with ignoring each other for a day. *And I noticed that I'm a better planner than one of them, the poor guy*.


My INTP boss is better organized than me. She's always writes lists and writes things down in her planner and knows what's going on in the school. She sorts herself out for the next day in the afternoon. I come in in the morning, look at my timetable and find out what I've got. I do prepare my lessons way in advance, though. Then I forgot that I've already prepared them and panic


----------



## comanche

FlaviaGemina said:


> There's a book in this.


what do you mean? you find it inspiring? life's not that rosy.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

comanche said:


> what do you mean? you find it inspiring? life's not that rosy.


No, I don't find it inspiring as in uplifting. But it sounds like little anecdotes from your neighbourhood could be interesting to read for people from a more sheltered background.


----------



## Knight of Ender

It's like I know that I am severely disabled in remembering things, so I make a little check list. Stars for things due tomorrow, circled stars for really important things, and 2s for long term projects. It works surprisingly well, unless I just ignore all work for a day.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

Knight of Ender said:


> *It's like I know that I am severely disabled in remembering things*, so I make a little check list. Stars for things due tomorrow, circled stars for really important things, and 2s for long term projects. It works surprisingly well, unless I just ignore all work for a day.


I got the impression that my INTP-boss is like that. It's like her drive to be competent is so strong that she has invented so many anti-P measures that you hardly notice her P at all. She's always bothering both my ENTP boss and me to tidy up, but she is less bossy about it than ISTJs or Te-doms would be  I have the honour of being nearly as messy as the ENTP boss, but I tidy up when the INTP tells me to. The ENTP argues or runs away.


----------



## suzypike

Hi- I'm new. I actually speak at a lower volume than most people I know. Most of the time if someone doesn't want to hear what I have to say, I don't care. If it's really important, I'll write it down/email it to them. 

I find as a female that I don't fit in, and I naturally gravitate toward males as friends. I got a job transfer this year to a different school. Of a staff of say 25 only 5 are male. 3 of those 5 are the ones I've developed a friendship with- meaning we seek out one another's company to talk about stuff other than work. Do any of you find it hard to relate to most other females?


----------



## suzypike

I am reading through the pages of this thread (which I find awesome) and saw this-
It's pretty typical of me to forget to introduce myself. My apologies. :happy:
*age:* 49
*location:* Alabama, USA
*job:* Instructional Coach - I work for the public school system, like a teacher, but I write school improvement plans, student, teacher or class strategy plans, trouble shoot, develop programs. I LOVE my job!!
*relationship status:* Single and prefer it that way
*meandering career:* Dog trainer- minus the owner!
*hobbies:* hiking, backpacking, rock climbing, camping 
*interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at:* I wish I could decorate- or at least care. My house is just sad. 
*interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment:* I used to love to plan my kids elaborate, themed birthday parties- I even buried a real chest once for a treasure hunt. I have boys so they were a blast! The party itself was h*ll but they were fantastic parties and my (now grown) sons still talk about them. 
*current obsessive interest:* The most effective efficient way to lift weights to build muscle at the gym. I am obsessed!
*former domain of geek-dom:* I'm a big Elder Scrolls player and love to mod my games!
*TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: *Big Bang Theory totally rocks!
*random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at:* Playing on gaming systems instead of my computer. And Microsoft Excel is my nemesis right now!
*clothes:* Work- I dress up. I like dresses too because they are easy. Home- jeans or camo pants and T- shirts
*some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: * I love to go to the movies. Also, riding 4-wheelers, off-road especially if it's muddy. 

I am really excited about reading everyone else's intro post. I now have something to do for the rest of the night!


----------



## suzypike

Meliora said:


> Yay! Dreamers unite. What has been your favorite dream so far? :kitteh:
> 
> _(Though I could have really done without the dream where my cousin and I had to jump out of a window to flee the devil. :crying_


Great topic! I love to dream and my dreams are usually exciting. If I could take a pill to make me dream more I would. 
My favorite dream ever was over 10 years ago but I'll never forget it. I dreamed I was a spy--real James Bond guns, gadgets and action. In my dream someone was chasing me (Not the devil! Haha!) and I ran off a cliff. Before I hit bottom and died, I said to myself (in the dream) "This is a dream. I don't have to die." And I landed with an action roll kind of thing. 
This was before The Matrix movies, but it was very Matrix-like. I've always hoped I'd dream it again but I never have. 

The rafting dream (another post) sounded fun!


----------



## suzypike

I am me said:


> the first time i took the test i got intj and then intp, so i researched the types and they were really cool. However, they didn't pinpoint me, so i took another test and got infp, which had all the jobs i ever wanted, and explained me exactly. but i think the intp and intj personalities are most similar to infp, and I enjoy the humor that can only come from you guys. So i ended up here.
> btw what do you mean by an infusion of Fi?


I'm new here and still learning all the lingo (Fi?) too. 

The same thing happened to me. I tested and got INTJ, then took a different test and got INTP. That was not okay- so I found another and another... Got INTJ twice, INTP twice and ISTP once. Based on a questionnaire here another member agreed with ISTP, but when I look at the components independently I'm right back at INTP. On my numbers, the Judging/Perceiving are almost 50/50. 

I was glad to find another person with the same problem. And really really glad to find an NT group. After reading, I'm sure this is where I fit- Now I just need the letter at the end of my INT. :blushed:

I wonder if it has something to do with being females or do guys have the same problem?


----------



## suzypike

FlaviaGemina said:


> As in?
> a) You doubt that they exist.
> b) You didn't know they exist but are pleasantly surprised
> c) You'd like to find one so you can do personality incest with her?


:laughing:


----------



## FlaviaGemina

suzypike said:


> But my answers are almost entirely INTJ - the highest percentage I've ever gotten.
> Why am I still an x?


Sorry, I've lost the plot. Your answers on what test?
Your signature says INTX, so I thought you weren't sure.


----------



## ScientiaOmnisEst

> OK, imagine this scenario: You are living in a place where there aren't any shops around and you don't know anyone and can't get to know anyone either. You can move to a new place that's got more shops and more diversity.
> Would you call the old place:
> *a) emotionally isolated and lonely* (I actually live in this kind of situation, and this is really what I think of it, more or less.)
> b) too far away from civilization
> INTP answer
> 
> 
> 
> Also: do you obsess
> a) more about mental health, but get bouts of hypochondria about physical illnesses
> *b) more about physical health, but find yourself sitting in a corner thinking "What's this all about [e.g eating, talking etc.]? Help, what is happening to me, am I going schizophrenic?" *(I don't think I really obsess about either, but as much as I fear for my sanity at times, I am more aware of when my body doesn't feel right.)
> INTP answer
> 
> 
> Do you
> *a) hold on to objects too tightly (e.g. when you hand an item to a person, do you hold on to it while they try to pull it away), hug people too hard; when something is stuck, do you think a bit and say "Right" (or words to that effect), get up and try to fix it *(The first part is "meh, sometimes" for me (but the b option has happened maybe twice in my life), but the second part is completely true.)
> 
> b) let go of objects too easily, drop things if you don't make a conscious effort to hold on to them; when something is stuck, do you poke at it gently first, try to use your telekinetic witch powers to unstick it, whimper and wait for ISXJ or ESFJ to help you, toss it away and rant, before you try to do it yourself
> INTP answer
> 
> 
> Are you a
> *a) dictionary but you'd like to be a grammar book *(Not a lot to say here, except I actually read a dictionary once. It's not enormously relevant, but I just remembered that and I felt like sharing.)
> b) a grammar book but you'd like to be a dictionary
> INTP answer
> 
> 
> 
> An (unhealthy) ESFP or ISFJ is talking about totally obvious, normal stuff and making it sound as if they are the only person who's ever experienced this. Your reaction:
> *a) Grrrrrrrrrrrrr, why is he/she telling me this? What planet do they live on? Shut up, bitch!* ("And please, for the love of God, leave me alone - can't you see I'm thinking?!")
> b) Ts ts ts, he/she likes to share his/her little observations.
> INTJ answer
> 
> 
> When you beat yourself up, you think:
> *a) I should be nicer to people and warmer* (When I beat myself up I think "I should be smarter", but of these two options, this one is more likely. I have thought it on occasion)
> b) I should do more for people
> INTP answer
> 
> 
> 
> Words
> a) have a meaning in context, even if you waffle, people will understand you somehow, it doesn't really matter whether you are exaggerating
> *b) words have a meaning in themselves, one has to chose the correct words and build a sentence from them* (Settled on this one after much back-and-forth. It's the first part of the first option that got me: words absolutely have contextual meaning to be inferred - but if it can't be inferred, then yeah, no one's going to get it. If you're "waffling" between definitions/usages, say so, and yes, it does matter if you are exaggerating, in my opinion.)
> INTP answer
> 
> 
> 
> Scales, continua and gradients
> a) are amusing, e.g. *MBTI isn't a set of types, it's a scale, ambiverts exists; situations can go either way: positive or negative*
> b) *scales are probably more realistic than black and white boxes*, but they are a nuisance, they must be tidied up; situations can go either way: negative: 'end of the world' or positive: 'at least we're not dead'
> (I have no answer for this one, so I just bolded the stuff I agree with.)
> ???? answer


Well, that was fun. 1 INTJ answer, 5 INTP answers, and 1 undecided.


----------



## suzypike

suzypike said:


> OK, imagine this scenario: You are living in a place where there aren't any shops around and you don't know anyone and can't get to know anyone either. You can move to a new place that's got more shops and more diversity.
> Would you call the old place:
> 
> b) too far away from civilization
> b) INTJ
> 
> 
> Also: do you obsess
> b) more about physical health, but find yourself sitting in a corner thinking "What's this all about [e.g eating, talking etc.]? Help, what is happening to me, am I going schizophrenic?"
> b) INTP
> 
> Do you
> a) hold on to objects too tightly (e.g. when you hand an item to a person, do you hold on to it while they try to pull it away), hug people too hard; when something is stuck, do you think a bit and say "Right" (or words to that effect), get up and try to fix it
> 
> b) let go of objects too easily, drop things if you don't make a conscious effort to hold on to them; when something is stuck, do you poke at it gently first, try to use your telekinetic witch powers to unstick it, whimper and wait for ISXJ or ESFJ to help you, toss it away and rant, before you try to do it yourself
> 
> ???? I have no idea. I drop stuff a lot. I never ask for help unless I've tried pretty hard and can't succeed --at anything.
> 
> Are you :
> b) a grammar book but you'd like to be a dictionary
> b) INTJ -definitely
> 
> An (unhealthy) ESFP or ISFJ is talking about totally obvious, normal stuff and making it sound as if they are the only person who's ever experienced this. Your reaction:
> a) Grrrrrrrrrrrrr, why is he/she telling me this? What planet do they live on?
> a) INTJ
> 
> When you beat yourself up, you think:
> b) I should do more for people
> b) INTJ- definitely
> 
> Words
> a) have a meaning in context, even if you waffle, people will understand you somehow, it doesn't really matter whether you are exaggerating
> b) words have a meaning in themselves, one has to chose the correct words and build a sentence from them
> 
> ???
> 
> Scales, continua and gradients
> b) scales are probably more realistic than black and white boxes, but they are a nuisance, they must be tidied up; situations can go either way: negative: 'end of the world' or positive: 'at least we're not dead'
> b) INTJ. They are necessary and helpful and pinpoint accuracy but I don't like them.
> 
> Also, my appearance is that of a normal(?) woman. I fix my hair, wear makeup, my clothes match, I work out, I'm even a little vain I guess-- but, my personality is more like a male and I fit in with most males in a social group.


 @FlaviaGemina
This one.


----------



## FlaviaGemina

suzypike said:


> @_FlaviaGemina_
> This one.


Oh, sorry, I didn't see your answers. 
LOL, so according to "FlaviaGemina's INTP vs INTJ female differential scale" you are an INTJ .
Hehe, I based these questions on differences I have observed between me and my female INTPs. So it's not really a valid test, because it's only based on a few people. However, they are concrete examples not only of Ti-Ne, Ni-Te but also of the quirks caused by their tertiary and inferior functions.


----------



## suzypike

FlaviaGemina said:


> Oh, sorry, I didn't see your answers.
> LOL, so according to "FlaviaGemina's INTP vs INTJ female differential scale" you are an INTJ .
> Hehe, I based these questions on differences I have observed between me and my female INTPs. So it's not really a valid test, because it's only based on a few people. However, they are concrete examples not only of Ti-Ne, Ni-Te but also of the quirks caused by their tertiary and inferior functions.


Thank you! If I am indeed an NT, I'm INTJ. However, now I'm doubting my entire NT-ness. 
I honestly feel like there are two me 's! I don't know who is going to win. :/


----------



## VIIZZY

@suzypike 

Have you taken any functions tests? Like similarminds? It might help clear things up or it might make things all the more confusing.


----------



## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> @suzypike
> 
> Have you taken any functions tests? Like similarminds? It might help clear things up or it might makes things all the more confusing.


Yes- I've taken all if them with varied results, the most common ending up typing me as INTJ, INTP, ISTP. 
I'm beginning to think I'm ISFP tho- :/


----------



## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> Yes- I've taken all if them with varied results, the most common ending up typing me as INTJ, INTP, ISTP.
> I'm beginning to think I'm ISFP tho- :/


Don't suppose you still have the results on hand? When I took the 60 question one it basically categorized me as 'unclear' type because my Ti and Ni were equal. Have you taken the ennmeagram tests? The socionics test? They tend to pair up with mbti types but even then it's not always a perfect fit, there's also the sloan test which I thought was impressive.


----------



## FePa

VIIZZY said:


> Don't suppose you still have the results on hand? When I took the 60 question one it basically categorized me as 'unclear' type because my Ti and Ni were equal. Have you taken the ennmeagram tests? The socionics test? They tend to pair up with mbti types but even then it's not always a perfect fit, there's also the sloan test which I thought was impressive.


:crazy: I stayed for several minutes looking at your signature . gif just following the lines...


----------



## suzypike

Yes! I do. 
High: Ne and Ni (yes, both and nearly equal), Fi
Low: Fe and Te
My enneagram is in my signature line. I think it is correct. I took my Socionics off, but now I wish I hadn't. 

Thanks so much! One note, when I read the INFP and ISFP descriptions, they don't sound much like me. I am not low energy, nor am I a "people person". I'm a high-energy, outdoorsy, happy loner!


----------



## spookyfornever

I'm still trying to picture a female me. And the images that action conjures are truly disturbing.


----------



## suzypike

spookyfornever said:


> i'm still trying to picture a female me. And the images that action conjures are truly disturbing.


lol!


----------



## spookyfornever

I see. and are you as evil?


----------



## FlaviaGemina

suzypike said:


> Yes- I've taken all if them with varied results, the most common ending up typing me as INTJ, INTP, ISTP.
> I'm beginning to think I'm ISFP tho- :/


LOL. My ISFP colleague claims that we are the same. When we are together, we do sort of morph and adapt to each other. But the difference is that she actually does make all the foot-in-mouth Te comments that I have learned to suppress.

In my case, I'm very INTJ at work. When I feel harassed because there are too many people around I get more and more introverted and cranky.
At home, I can be an ISFP-like or even ENFJ-like. That's only my behaviours though. My cognitive functions stay the same. 

I'm not very attached to my INTJ status. I will argue that I test as an INTJ and that the results are correct, but I _am_ just me and nobody knows what they are anyway.
E.g. I understand INFJ-ness to some extend and I don't think I'd die if I woke up as an INFJ tomorrow morning, but I wouldn't choose to be one.


----------



## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> Yes! I do.
> High: Ne and Ni (yes, both and nearly equal), Fi
> Low: Fe and Te
> My enneagram is in my signature line. I think it is correct. I took my Socionics off, but now I wish I hadn't.
> 
> Thanks so much! One note, when I read the INFP and ISFP descriptions, they don't sound much like me. I am not low energy, nor am I a "people person". I'm a high-energy, outdoorsy, happy loner!


You don't mention Ti which is weird, which intuition was higher? Anyway, if intuition was highest for you (primary) you'd be closer to an intj though their extroverted thinking is high. You can go with whatever description you think matches you best in the end if you'd like. I hear the sensor descriptions aren't that great so that's something to keep in mind...

Your enneagram is indeed in your signature oops! 5 correlates with intp.

I find socionics a bit confusing 'cause there's supposed to be some switch thing for introverts, currently trying to figure why that is. 

You should try the sloan test, it's at similar minds as well.


----------



## suzypike

spookyfornever said:


> I see. and are you as evil?


Yes! I am. ;]


----------



## spookyfornever

suzypike said:


> Yes! I am. ;]


I see. 
*Digs around in room for a ring, comes back 3 years later looking like a mountain man with a magnet*
Will you enter into a mutually beneficial relationship that is acknowledged by the current governmental authorities?


----------



## suzypike

FlaviaGemina said:


> LOL. My ISFP colleague claims that we are the same. When we are together, we do sort of morph and adapt to each other. But the difference is that she actually does make all the foot-in-mouth Te comments that I have learned to suppress.
> 
> In my case, I'm very INTJ at work. When I feel harassed because there are too many people around I get more and more introverted and cranky.
> At home, I can be an ISFP-like or even ENFJ-like. That's only my behaviour's though. My cognitive functions stay the same.
> 
> I'm not very attached to my INTJ status. I will argue that I test as an INTJ and that the results are correct, but I _am_ just me and nobody knows what they are anyway.
> E.g. I understand INFJ-ness to some extend and I don't think I'd die if I woke up as an INFJ tomorrow morning, but I wouldn't choose to be one.


I totally relate to this! I am INTJ at work and IFSP otherwise maybe- although my energy level is pretty high always and I'm usually in a good mood, be it for good or evil. ;]


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## suzypike

spookyfornever said:


> I see.
> *Digs around in room for a ring, comes back 3 years later looking like a mountain man with a magnet*
> Will you enter into a mutually beneficial relationship that is acknowledged by the current governmental authorities?


LOL! My (dark) prince has arrived. XD


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## spookyfornever

Except i'm not a prince anymore. The peasants didn't take to kindly to my rule. they made the Reign of Terror look like an orderly congressional impeachment


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## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> You don't mention Ti which is weird, which intuition was higher? Anyway, if intuition was highest for you (primary) you'd be closer to an intj though their extroverted thinking is high. You can go with whatever description you think matches you best in the end if you'd like. I hear the sensor descriptions aren't that great so that's something to keep in mind...
> 
> Your enneagram is indeed in your signature oops! 5 correlates with intp.
> 
> I find socionics a bit confusing 'cause there's supposed to be some switch thing for introverts, currently trying to figure why that is.
> 
> You should try the sloan test, it's at similar minds as well.


If I take Sloan will someone interpret it for me? I'll try to do it during lunch. 
Okay- I have to work! Haha! I'm supposed to be researching Text Based Questioning and creating a presentation on it.


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## FlaviaGemina

VIIZZY said:


> I find socionics a bit confusing 'cause there's supposed to be some switch thing for introverts, currently trying to figure why that is.


In MBTI, INTJs are called Judgers because their judging function (Te) is extraverted. INTPs are called Perceivers because their perceiving function (Ne) is extraverted. 
Socionics goes by dominant functions, not extraversion vs. introversion. Thus, extraverts have the same name: ENTPs are ENTp because their dominant function is Ne. An ENFj is an ENFj because their dominant function is Fe.
An INTJ is an INTp because their dominant function is Ni, which is a perceiving function.
An INTP is an INTj because their dominant function is Ti, which is a judging function.

All the extraverts have the same label, but for the introverts p and j are switched.

MBTI chose to link judging and perceiving to extraverted functions because that's what the world can see. They can see an INTJ's Te, but not their Ni. The world can see an INTP's Ne, but not their Ti. 
Socionics bases their labels on the dominant function because this is the one that is most important to the introverted person themself.

According to MBTI, an INTJ is just a quiet ENTJ. An INTP is a quiet ENTJ.
In socionics (or at least my interpretation of it), an INTJ is a quiet ENTP. An INTP is a quiet ENTJ.


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## VIIZZY

FlaviaGemina said:


> In MBTI, INTJs are called Judgers because their judging function (Te) is extraverted. INTPs are called Perceivers because their perceiving function (Ne) is extraverted.
> Socionics goes by dominant functions, not extraversion vs. introversion. Thus, extraverts have the same name: ENTPs are ENTp because their dominant function is Ne. An ENFj is an ENFj because their dominant function is Fe.
> An INTJ is an INTp because their dominant function is Ni, which is a perceiving function.
> An INTP is an INTj because their dominant function is Ti, which is a judging function.
> 
> All the extraverts have the same label, but for the introverts p and j are switched.
> 
> MBTI chose to link judging and perceiving to extraverted functions because that's what the world can see. They can see an INTJ's Te, but not their Ni. The world can see an INTP's Ne, but not their Ti.
> Socionics bases their labels on the dominant function because this is the one that is most important to the introverted person themself.
> 
> According to MBTI, an INTJ is just a quiet ENTJ. An INTP is a quiet ENTJ.
> In socionics (or at least my interpretation of it), an INTJ is a quiet ENTP. An INTP is a quiet ENTJ.


I understand what you describe but from what I'm reading it's a bit more complicated than that; I'll have to study it a bit more than I can currently but thank you for replying.


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## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> If I take Sloan will someone interpret it for me? I'll try to do it during lunch.
> Okay- I have to work! Haha! I'm supposed to be researching Text Based Questioning and creating a presentation on it.


There's already a correlation chart I have on hand for the sloan test if that's what you mean.


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## suzypike

I would love the chart and where is a Socionics test?

Yep, I'm still here. I am obsessed now!


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## FlaviaGemina

VIIZZY said:


> I understand what you describe but from what I'm reading it's a bit more complicated than that; I'll have to study it a bit more than I can currently but thank you for replying.


Nah, not really. It's just that some people on the internet make it more complicated because they claim that they read somewhere that the function definitions of socionics are totally different than those in MBTI. From what I can tell, the socionics functions definitios are more detail and offer additional dimensions to MBTI but they are not mutually exclusive at all.
Anyway, I'll let you figure it out for yourself. Maybe I'm just too dumb and vague to see how they are different.


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## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> I would love the chart and where is a Socionics test?
> 
> Yep, I'm still here. I am obsessed now!


Socionics

SLOAN

Chart from NephilimAzrael in his sloan thread, page two. 



NephilimAzrael said:


> As I had said in the OP, the types do not always align to MBTI.. But here is a list of the one's that do.
> 
> INFP: RCUAI, RLUAI
> INTP: RCUEI, RLUEI
> INFJ: RCOAI, RLOAI
> INTJ: RCOEI, RLOEI
> ISTJ: RCOEN, RLOEN
> ISFJ: RCOAN, RLOAN
> ISTP: RCUEN, RLUEN
> ISFP: RCUAN, RLUAN
> ENFP: SCUAI, SLUAI
> ENTP: SCUEI, SLUEI
> ENFJ: SCOAI, SLOAI
> ENTJ: SCOEI, SLOEI
> ESTJ: SCOEN, SLOEN
> ESFJ: SCOAN, SLOAN
> ESTP: SCUEN, SLUEN
> ESFP: SCUAN, SLUAN


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## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> Socionics
> 
> SLOAN
> 
> Chart from NephilimAzrael in his sloan thread, page two.


Got RCOEI. Took different test on same site- got RCUEI. 
Both say I have low energy level, turn work in late...? and basically don't care about much- not true. 
I have high energy and I've probably never missed a work deadline in my life.
It says my primary is Calm. Which I am. I'm calmly hiking, calmly running, calmly working....


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## suzypike

Okay- I tried to be brutally honest-----

INTJ - "Mastermind". Introverted intellectual with a preference for finding certainty. A builder of systems and the applier of theoretical models. 2.1% of total population


Introverted (I) 67.65% Extroverted (E) 32.35%
Intuitive (N) 54.29% Sensing (S) 45.71%
Thinking (T) 67.74% Feeling (F) 32.26%
Judging (J) 51.43% Perceiving (P) 48.57%

Type 1 Perfectionism	||||||||||||||	56%
Type 2	Helpfulness	||||||||||	36%
Type 3	Image Awareness	||||||||||	33%
Type 4	Individuality	||||||||||||||||	70%
Type 5	Rationality	||||||||||||	46%
Type 6	Cautiousness	||||	13%
Type 7	Adventurousness	||||||||||||||||	70%
Type 8	Aggressiveness	||||||||||||||	60%
Type 9	Calmness	||||||||||||||	56%

My Enneagram was the ONLY thing I was sure of... I already knew the 4, but it had always been paired with 5 and 9 before. 

Opinions? Then I'm ready to talk about one of YOU!!! ;]


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## VIIZZY

At least it helps to lower it down. 

You simply don't fit all the stereotypes that go with the two types which is fine, very few people will. I don't miss deadlines and am more fond of schedules than an intp should be but I still think intp fits me best and that behavior is somewhat linked with avoiding consequences. 

Do you work ahead on projects to avoid rushing at deadlines or do you procrastinate quite a bit and use the approaching deadline to energize you and keep you on task?


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## spookyfornever

you can't spell procrastinate without INTP 
well....you could, but it wouldn't be spelled correctly


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## FlaviaGemina

@suzypike even if you turn out to be an ISFP, please stay on this thread.


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## suzypike

FlaviaGemina said:


> @suzypike even if you turn out to be an ISFP, please stay on this thread.


Yay! I don't want to leave and whatever I am I have a lot in common with you all. I'll figure it out. Or not.


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## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> At least it helps to lower it down.
> 
> You simply don't fit all the stereotypes that go with the two types which is fine, very few people will. I don't miss deadlines and am more fond of schedules than an intp should be but I still think intp fits me best and that behavior is somewhat linked with avoiding consequences.
> 
> Do you work ahead on projects to avoid rushing at deadlines or do you procrastinate quite a bit and use the approaching deadline to energize you and keep you on task?


If I LIKE the project I always work ahead. The Instructional Specialists in my school system are spread out and meet once a month. If I really like a project, I'm usually one of the first if not the first person done out of approx 10 Specialists. If I don't like a project, I will procrastinate until the bitter end- have stayed up all night before to finish. :blushed:


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## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> If I LIKE the project I always work ahead. The Instructional Specialists in my school system are spread out and meet once a month. If I really like a project, I'm usually one of the first if not the first person done out of approx 10 Specialists. If I don't like a project, I will procrastinate until the bitter end- have stayed up all night before to finish. :blushed:


That sounds like a P thing to me; xxxp types are known to procrastinate on projects/assignments/work unless they're passionate about it. 

Judgers typically get things done as soon as possible to avoid rushing at the deadlines, they're very goal oriented and tend to have a 'work before play' approach to their lives. If you look at the 'You know you're a judger when...' thread you'll see a lot of them talk about needing to have completed certain tasks that they've schedule before going to sleep. 

You can always lurk on the forums of the types you think you're most like and see which one you think is more honest with yourself.


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## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> That sounds like a P thing to me; xxxp types are known to procrastinate on projects/assignments/work unless they're passionate about it.
> 
> Judgers typically get things done as soon as possible to avoid rushing at the deadlines, they're very goal oriented and tend to have a 'work before play' approach to their lives. If you look at the 'You know you're a judger when...' thread you'll see a lot of them talk about needing to have completed certain tasks that they've schedule before going to sleep.
> 
> You can always lurk on the forums of the types you think you're most like and see which one you think is more honest with yourself.


I think that's what I'm going to do. I may end up sticking with INTX. ;]
I fit in with INTP group with the exception of my energy level and general cheerfulness. I have a very dark sense of humor, but I'm usually an upbeat kind of person- I always have been.


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## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> I think that's what I'm going to do. I may end up sticking with INTX. ;]
> I fit in with INTP group with the exception of my energy level and general cheerfulness. I have a very dark sense of humor, but I'm usually an upbeat kind of person- I always have been.


Sounds like a plan, have fun, and I sincerely hope to see you around.


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## suzypike

One last thing, can anyone interpret my Enneagram? I think it might be right even though it's different than what I had and thought was right. It is very hard to merge my work self and my not-at-work self. 

And what are you all doing this weekend? XD


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## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> That sounds like a P thing to me; xxxp types are known to procrastinate on projects/assignments/work unless they're passionate about it.
> 
> Judgers typically get things done as soon as possible to avoid rushing at the deadlines, they're very goal oriented and tend to have a 'work before play' approach to their lives. If you look at the 'You know you're a judger when...' thread you'll see a lot of them talk about needing to have completed certain tasks that they've schedule before going to sleep.
> 
> You can always lurk on the forums of the types you think you're most like and see which one you think is more honest with yourself.


After about a million quizzes and 4 questionnaires this did it. The questionaires helped narrow it down- thank God I didn't have to lurk on 16 forums. But I'm pretty sure I'm ISFP except for at work- I'm still INTX there. Haha!

Thank you all!

I want to hear about you-you know ALL about me. 

What are your hobbies? Your passions?


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## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> After about a million quizzes and 4 questionnaires this did it. The questionaires helped narrow it down- thank God I didn't have to lurk on 16 forums. But I'm pretty sure I'm ISFP except for at work- I'm still INTX there. Haha!
> 
> Thank you all!
> 
> I want to hear about you-you know ALL about me.
> 
> What are your hobbies? Your passions?


Glad you found your type vuv. 

Hobbies involve writing and languages mostly. I'm currently an English major. 

My passions come and go, they're sporadic.


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## suzypike

VIIZZY said:


> Glad you found your type vuv.
> 
> Hobbies involve writing and languages mostly. I'm currently an English major.
> 
> My passions come and go, they're sporadic.


What kind of writing?


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## VIIZZY

suzypike said:


> What kind of writing?


Various writings...I can thank my literature courses for that. I write for myself and like to play around with symbolism, word structures, and various elements. Lately I've been enjoying stream consciousness writing.


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## KittyKnits

I can be a bit monotonous and low toned when I speak, but then when I'm talking to myself or quite excited about something, I go really high pitched, or sing to myself. I guess I'm just never excited when I'm talking to other people...


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## VIIZZY

KittyKnits said:


> I can be a bit monotonous and low toned when I speak, but then when I'm talking to myself or quite excited about something, I go really high pitched, or sing to myself. I guess I'm just never excited when I'm talking to other people...


Same with the monotone, I try to not be so monotonous with others though.


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## KittyKnits

I don't speak for ages, because I'm on my own, then I say 'good morning' at work and it comes out like a toad croaking


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## shameless

FlaviaGemina said:


> 1. Does your voice sound deeper or more bored than that of most females?
> 
> 2. Do you find that people ignore you when you talk in a "normal" voice and that you have to "shout" at them repeatedly to get them to listen to you at all?[/B]


1.Yes I have a melancholy voice kinda. Not like the clear eyes guy, but its dry and lower, female but lower.

2.Um I don't talk in my normal voice when needing to be heard. I talk with more animation. (Not shouting). 


age: 30
location: Midwest US
Job: I am coordinator/staff/resident supervisor of a wing in a facility for dementia, elderly care, disability
Relationship Status: Divorced
Meandering Career: I studied in mass communication (but never finished) minored in generalized electives of social science & marketing type stuff. I never went far enough for specialized classes was all intro.
I started a seasonal photography business in 2008 when I was STAHM, I was very successful in terms of local recognition just not enough to make a living. I still do it seasonal and only weddings now. I honestly hate the photographing people part, its the creating and editing I enjoy more. 
Interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: Everything I would love to learn more of. I am a jack of many trades master of none I would love to be an expert at something.
Interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: I am good at many artistic type of things that I really don't do much with as it serves no purpose right now.
TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: I like PBS sometimes, I like "old people" shows like murder she wrote, matlock, downtown abbey, love period type of stuff that would put most people to sleep. I love old 50s/60s movies
Some of the 'human' things I like to do occasionally: I love the beach, I like hammocks, I love to dance, I like movies & music, I love embracing my kids and residents with affection.

Anyways I got along well with INTJ's in high school even with them being studious and my being a delinquent. I always respected them & I believe they respected me too in an odd way.

Hi nice to meet you


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## BlackDog

*Okay! I'll give it a go, fellow INTX females.**

age: 23

location: Canada

job: Until recently, a corporate legal assistant. Now an office manager and student.

relationship status: Common Law

meandering career: No freaking idea. I wish. Currently in a bachelors degree program majoring in molecular biology, but I'm really liking some palaeontology classes I've been taking... so who knows. The plan was always law school, so maybe that. 

hobbies: reading, writing, learning (like, watching lectures, having debates), running (when I can, hurts my hips too much), painting

interests as in things that I'd like to know but am rubbish at: foreign languages - not necessarily rubbish at them but I have never had time to put enough effort in to master one (I'm so-so at Spanish and French)

interests as in things that I'm good at but that don't seem relevant at the moment: remembering entire pages of texts word for word, writing, math, interpreting literature (will literally never use that... heh, get it?)

current obsessive interest: palaeontology

former domain of geek-dom: quantum mechanics

TV programme that qualifies me for super-geekdom: Firefly or Frasier, probably. Oh! Or Doctor Who. 

random geeky things I sometimes do but epically fail at: computer programming

clothes: Old man - tweed, blazers, blouses, leather, suede (wish I had a pocket watch...) but at home comfortable with a slight gothic, punky flavour. Very slight, I've outgrown most of it, but I love black and do throw in the occasional skull earrings or band t-shirt under a blazer.

some of the 'human' things I like to do occassionally: I love animals. They make so much more sense than people. I like to train my dog, and I used to help train horses. I'm a sucker for a puppy. Like, that weird girl who gets right on the ground with it and doesn't care at all if it licks her face or pees on her. 

As for my voice:

1) My voice is deeper than most females, yes. It used to be kind of deep, quiet, and monotonous but lots of public speaking has given me a more commanding voice. I have trained myself to emphasize certain words, end certain sentences with an upward inflection, etc. 

2) **I used to not be heard, but now I make myself heard. I despise being talked over and will generally not allow it. I find it very rude! That being said, I would never talk over someone else either. *


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## Prismira Vex

I would talk over you


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## FlaviaGemina

@Prismira Vex

I've thought about gender and this is weird: In real life, I'm pretty gender neutral but somehow I can't bring myself to change my gender to "neutral" in my profile on this forum. 


Also, I'm curious about your signature (the purple bit). Is this something you believe in and if so, how do you define strength and victory? Do you mean improving yourself or do you mean victory over others? I'm just asking this because if it's victory over others, that wouldn't be freedom because you'd still be defining yourself through others. But if it is purely improving yourself according to some criteria that you have set for yourself, how could you be sure that your criteria are not subject to outside influences?
Sod my Te(+Se) and Fi, I've always got too much of either when it is the other that I need.


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## suzypike

Ladies,
This is a very interesting thread- it explains a lot- about me anyway. 
http://personalitycafe.com/isfp-forum-artists/179358-isfp-do-you-have-inner-intj.html

Do any of you INTJs experience the same- in reverse maybe? 
Many times I am living "in the grip" of my INTJ-ness.


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## Belladonne

*lurks on thread so as to bask in awesome*


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## suzypike

Belladonne said:


> *lurks on thread so as to bask in awesome*


Haha! Yep- this is where it's at. :kitteh:


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## Belladonne

suzypike said:


> Haha! Yep- this is where it's at. :kitteh:


I shall be behind the curtain :kitteh:


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## Prismira Vex

> Also, I'm curious about your signature (the purple bit). Is this something you believe in and if so, how do you define strength and victory? Do you mean improving yourself or do you mean victory over others? I'm just asking this because if it's victory over others, that wouldn't be freedom because you'd still be defining yourself through others. But if it is purely improving yourself according to some criteria that you have set for yourself, how could you be sure that your criteria are not subject to outside influences?
> Sod my Te(+Se) and Fi, I've always got too much of either when it is the other that I need.


It is something I believe in very, very sincerely. I define them as abstract principles; Usually victory over nature (What I happened to be born with) by my free will (what I want to be) but also victory over others. With strength, I mean psychological strength (always persevering, making hard/harsh decisions in my self-interest, having both courage and being able to shut down my empathy to do whatever necesarry to get what I want.)

I call it freedom, because I do what I want; I'm an extravert, remember? I don't mind having others be a part of my life/identity; As long as I decide in what way, and they work for me. Free will is everything here. So, it's both. Power, strength, victory.. These are my core values. In every sense. (Well, I'm not physically strong, like, muscles, but... Every other sense.)


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