# Fe-Users, Explain Fe to an ISTJ



## atamagasuita (May 15, 2016)

@Ms ISTJ
It feels good to be a feeler. To love without expecting anything in return. 😁


So, Fe-users, what is going on inside your head when you use Fe? 
- Love 

What does it feel like? 
- Awesome like an awesome possum

How would you describe it? 
- Nirvana? It's like overrated sex as an idea 💡 

Is there anything that you'd compare it to? (I often like to compare my dom-Si to a database.) 
- Well it's like, you have emotions. That's it. You allow yourself to have the emotions


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## Shiver (Nov 10, 2016)

Don't defile the grand name of possums with Fe.


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## umop 3pisdn (Apr 4, 2014)

Shiver said:


> The idea of picking up cultural "values" in that way does not sit right with me at all, but I suppose if the other snowmen's values start imposing, you can always melt them.
> 
> Really though, to me a "value" is only such if it's internal to me. Anything else seems less than genuine and I don't have need of it...


I feel the same way about Te and using systematic philosophy to think through problems and stuff. That is, if you're not doing it from an internal and individualist position, my impulse is to feel that you're 'doing it wrong'.

Fe users, paradoxically, tend to care enough about social values to try to rehabilitate them. You might say that that's less true of Fi users, since they don't really have the necessary interest in social values.

But for me, it really doesn't make any sense that value would be solely an internal property  I mean I think subjectivity is an important part of e_valu_ating, but I haven't built a set home for value to roost in.


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## Cobble (Dec 6, 2016)

Since we're speaking about social values.
(Again, my Fe is my last function.)

When using my Fe :
- I'll adapt with the current social values in order to blend in. But I don't like "social values" and don't try to "rehabilitate them". I'll more go for social *harmony*.

- In a given situation, I'm more likely to adapt to the other people's values instead of mine. (But I won't adopt it) For example.
>> I value freedom and authenticity.
>> But my friend value loyalty very much. Loyalty is so much more important than freedom. (As for me, I don't care that much about "someone not being loyal enough" because my definition is different.)
>> I want to ditch my friend in order to be free.
>> But I don't want to hurt him so I'll follow his "loyalty rule" (if it's not too long)
>> I'm more likely to give a "Not being loyal isn't cool" speech (if my Ti is in mute mode) in order to appease my friend even if I don't really believe it.


(By the way, I see "valuing social values/norms" more like an Si trait.)


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## Shiver (Nov 10, 2016)

umop 3pisdn said:


> I feel the same way about Te and using systematic philosophy to think through problems and stuff. That is, if you're not doing it from an internal and individualist position, my impulse is to feel that you're 'doing it wrong'.


What about in situations where the most efficient solution is expected?


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## umop 3pisdn (Apr 4, 2014)

Shiver said:


> What about in situations where the most efficient solution is expected?


Ad hoc solutions seem like hack jobs, which to me actually seems like a kind of _in_efficiency.

Idk, people just have different sensibilities. Obviously facilitating social harmony has a kind of efficiency too, but Fi types tend to see us as more invasive. My point is just that it cuts both ways. People using introverted functions tend to see the extroverted equivalent as too-simple and steamroll-y, and people using extroverted functions tend to see the introverted equivalent as hyper-reflective and boring.



Lynway said:


> Since we're speaking about social values.
> (Again, my Fe is my last function.)
> 
> When using my Fe :
> ...


Social norms can just mean a common basis for understanding or interpreting a social environment. Like it's 'socially inefficient' if everyone has a completely different understanding of what some social gesture means. It's like the same reason it's helpful if everyone speaks the same language, it creates a channel of communication, creates a basis for rapport, etc. That's the kind of 'social values/norms' that Fe tends to deal in. It's more a kind of convention/formalism, than it is tradition, if that distinction is at all meaningful. Basically Fe tends to promote a form or style of social interaction that has mutual intelligibility. It's at least social-value adjacent.


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## umop 3pisdn (Apr 4, 2014)

double post, sorry.


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## Cobble (Dec 6, 2016)

@umop 3pisdn : With everything you said, I think even more that it's an Si trait and not an Fe trait. 
It fits 99% my ISTJ Si-Te-Fi-(low Ne) boyfriend... and it just doesn't "speak" to me even though I understand what you mean. (I get scolded by Si-dom a LOT about these kind of stuffs)

Also, I think S/N functions are more related with "vision/interpretation of the world" while F/T functions are about "prioritizing decisions". But I'm going kind off topic there, there are plenty of threads about that and I don't want to open a debate here.

Going back to Fe.
I have inferior Fe so maybe I don't use it the same way as mainly-Fe-users do. 
So I may not understand well what you're speaking me about. I can only speak about my case.
Every information is good to give, so thank you for your precision.


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## mp2 (Dec 18, 2016)

Lynway said:


> Since we're speaking about social values.
> (Again, my Fe is my last function.)
> 
> When using my Fe :
> ...


I think this might be a good example of how Fe works based on its position. I also do the same thing with adapting to others the same way you explained with your example, but I do sometimes go on to _adopt_ them. 

If I'm around someone for too long with different values, unless it's far too against a value I have, I will adapt and see it from their point of view so much that I can sort of trick myself into thinking I agree with them. It's only when the situation is over that I realize "Wait a minute, I don't think that or agree with them at all!" I don't know if this is based on aux Fe Vs inferior Fe or not or if many heavy Fe users also do this.

Also, I think both Fe and Si can be concerned with social values/norms. I don't know all that much about Si, but I think both Fe and Si can appear to value social values/norms equally, but the difference may be in why they value these and how they interpret them on a personal level.


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## Cobble (Dec 6, 2016)

Well, speaking about *my* experience. (Meaning : what I'm saying doesn't contradict what you're saying.)

- When I adopt a value (instead of adapt), I don't feel it Fe-related at all. I adopt people values because : by talking/living with them, we share our experiences, and their experiences/values will speak (deeply) to me. As an INTP it'll usually be my Ti saying : "It makes sense", or my Si saying : "These experiences are important to me. So I'll stick to it to honor it."

- When I'm in these situations where I realize "Wait a minute, I don't think that / I don't agree with them at all", it's when I just went in the flow and totally lost my anchor. (introverted functions not working at all / sensing without thinking. ) That's one of the reason all my introverted functions are scared of the external world and that I was so focused in thinking when I was younger. I was afraid to loose my "self".

In a way I relate it to Fe and the fact it's an extroverted function. When I'm using Ne, it blurts out a load of craps I didn't "sort out yet". 

- As for "being concerned with social values", I think everyone is concerned by it. (Even if we like it or not) But once again, *everything that was said about social values didn't fit my Fe at all, and that's all I wanted to say.* (Instead, it reminded of what my Si-friends usually say.)


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## Cobble (Dec 6, 2016)

[ sorry double post]


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## mp2 (Dec 18, 2016)

(Sorry if I'm getting too off topic or irrelevant here)



Lynway said:


> When I adopt a value (instead of adapt), I don't feel it Fe-related at all. I adopt people values because : by talking/living with them, we share our experiences, and their experiences/values will speak (deeply) to me. As an INTP it'll usually be my Ti saying : "It makes sense", or my Si saying : "These experiences are important to me. So I'll stick to it to honor it."


Ah, I just wasn't sure if adopting values was related to Fe's position in a person's stack or exactly how Fe operates in different positions but the Ti and Si examples make a lot more sense than what I was thinking.


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