# my take on LeaT's questionnaire :D



## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

_1.Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions?For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, speciallife circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, andcurrent state of mind._
Nothing unusual I can think of. I'd rather you focus on my questionnaire 


_2.Study these two images here and here. Which one do you prefer andwhy? How would you describe it?_
The first one.


Northern lights! I've always wanted to see northern lights, I've dreamed ofthem so many times... I just can't explain it. If I had a week of life left, I'd just go far north and wait for northern lights.


There'sa sense of vastness, depth, black alien space, things larger and infinitely more scary than humanity. Lovecraftian, if I may say so. It makes me feel so tiny and insignificant, and yet, at the same time, infinite. I merge with the northern lights, they draw me in so much than I feel hypnotized.


_3.Please describe yourself as a person if you were to introduceyourself to someone else like in a cover letter. What kind of personare you and why?_
Ah,not cover letters  Can I just describe my personality?
If I had to choose just one trait, it would be „passionate”. Doing things and people I love is the essence of my life.
I feel there are two people trapped inside my body. The first is compassionate, artistic, gentle and sensitive, an idealistic dreamer who wants nothing but to be surrounded by love, beauty and inspiration. The second one is tough, violent, arrogant and cold, able to overcome every obstacle and leave every enemy defeated. I alternate between the two, but they're not opposites. Both are, as I wrote above, passionate, unrestrained, reaching for things larger than life. Nevertheless, the tension inside me is draining. I don't know which aspect I prefer, sometimes it's the former, sometimes the latter.


_4.What kind of person would you LIKE to be? Why? What kind of personwould you NOT want to be? Why?_
I just want to be at peace with who I am. I want to be tolerant, passionate, knowledgeable, wise, powerful, accepting, imaginative, independent, strong. I don't want to be dull, aggressive, intolerant, boring, obsessive, unhappy, ill-wishing, irrational, impatient and to forget my dreams. They keep me going. I want to be happy, to love and be loved, to experience new, wonderful things every single day.


_5.Do you think there are any differences to how you described yourselfand how people actually perceive you? How do you think others woulddescribe you? If there are any discrepancies between these two thatare you are aware of; do you know why exactly that is?_
Some people tend to describe me as charming, sensitive, caring and socially smooth, which is different from how I view myself. Also, I think others overestimate my confidence and inner strength.


_6.What in life do you find to be of importance? Why? If you are unsureyou can always take the Value Test and post the results here. Do notethat it helps if you narrow it down to 20 or ideally 10 values assuggested at stage 2._
Independence, honesty, passion, inspiration, imagination, sincerity, intimacy,ingenuity, intelligence... there's more, so much more, always more 


_7.How do you react to new situations in your life? Can you describe anevent in your life where you were in an unknown situation? How didyou deal with it?_
Well, pretty chill I guess. For example (it's a silly thing really) I was going home at 4 a.m. with my sister and we missed the last night bus, we'd have to wait an hour for the first tram in the morning. It was January I think, a clear night cold as frozen hell. Well, I didn't panic; I just thought the best option would be to walk home. We talked to each other, laughed at the situation a bit and started to come up with crazy ideas. It could have been worse after all.


_8.Please describe yourself when you are in a stressful situation. Howdo you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome._
I become moody, irritable, hostile and violent. I snap at people and sometimes I even resort to physical violence. I feel a need to vent somehow. I try to refrain from breaking things or hitting people, so I just run, listen to music, have sex, play video games, sleep... something to distract myself, to avoid thinking. I hate myself for that, too. Sometimes I hurt people I loved, and it makes me feel so mad at myself.
I don't want to write about RL experiences here, I hope you understand.


_9.Please describe yourself when you are in an enjoyable situation. Howdo you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome._
Oooh, I stare at the world with my eyes wide open and my imagination runs wild. I may talk like crazy, spewing a nonsense stream of consciousness, or just stay silent. It's orgasmic, actually (even if no sex is involved ). Nothing else matters. I feel a sort of serene bliss, a release of anger like it wasn't there in the first place. It's like weed without actually smoking weed I think.


_10.Describe your relationship to socialization. How do you perceiveone-on-one interaction? How do you perceive group interaction?_
I'm not a big fan of socialization. Large groups of people drain me very much, but I can't say I'm socially awkward; on the other hand, I think I'm pretty polite and cultured (although that might be a case of nurture over nature). One-on-one conversations are different – it depends on a person. I like people in general, I'm interested in them, but a conversation with a person I don't feel a deep connection with is draining. In an opposite situation, when I connect to someone I care about, I feel like talking for eternity 


_11.Describe your relationship to society. What are the elements of ityou hold important or unimportant (e.g. social norms, values,customs, traditions)? How do you see people as a whole?_
As I said, I like people. I'm fascinated by cultures different from my own, their customs, social hierarchy etc. Of course, people are mixed; capable of both greatness and pettiness, of unmeasurable compassion and cold cruelty, even in the same person.
When I was a teenager, I was rebellious, but I wasn't really anti-social... more like disappointed, frustrated that the world is not how I want it to be. Social norms bother me sometimes, but I believe that they came to exist naturally, as a result of innate hierarchy (which is dynamic, not static – power struggle, if you wish). Maybe I'm just becoming a boring adult 


_12.Describe your relationship to authority. How do you perceiveauthority? What does it mean to you, and how do you deal with it?_
I don't have much trouble with authority. I'd rather be a leader than afollower, but I don't seek to overthrow authority if what they do doesn't concern me (or people close to me). It's not a main concern of mine.


_13.Describe your relationship to order and chaos. What do order andchaos mean to you? How do they manifest in your daily life?_
An interesting question. Well, I think I'm more orderly outwardly; for example, at work I'm one of the least chaotic people, a perfectionist of sorts. On my own, though, I feel chaotic; my inner world is a hugemess, vague images battling with unspoken needs. I want it to be logical and composed, but more often than not I feel it isn't.


_14.What is it that you fear in life? Why? How does this fear manifest toyou both in how you think and how you act?_
I fear being trapped, abandoned, weak, suffering, not in control of my life. It manifests in two ways I think: first, I tend to depend on myself and take what I want, although I want to consider others as well. Second... eh, I don't like to talk about it, but I can become restless, controlling, even violent. I hate that part of myself tbh.


_15.What is it that you desire in life? What do you strive to achieve?Why? Where do you think these drives and desires stem from or areinspired by?_
I want to be able to do what I love. Just that. I have a artistic skills, sensitivity and enough determination to develop it, patience to sit and draw 12 hours a row, so why not use them? I want happiness, I want to discover what the world has to offer, I want beauty, fulfillment and I want to leave a mark on this world. I want my art to move people, to inspire them, to make their lives better.


_16.a) What activities energize you most? b) What activities drain youmost? Why?_
a) Art! I love drawing, painting, just seeing beautiful things. Most ofthe time I feel trapped inside my body, imperfect and lost; when I create art, I gain an ability to speak an universal language, to communicate with people on a deeper, non-verbal level. I love to immerse myself in my imagination, intangible quasi-reality where anything is possible, where no material laws restrain my dreams.
For similar reasons, I love music, books, films, video games etc. I like travelling too, sex, being with those few people I really care about.
b) Shopping, cleaning, any kind of physical work, especially involving tedious details. Prolonged arguments. Having to take care of things like taxes, reports etc. Being in a large group of people I don't like (especially if they talk about boring things such as money,food, work etc.). Having to be aware of what happens around me all the time.


_17.Why do you want to know your type? What type do you think you are?Why this/these type(s)? Is there a type that appeals to you, to yourself-perception, that you would like to be? Why? If you know yourenneagram, please post this here. If you have done any onlinefunction tests such as the Keys2Cognition, it helps if you post theseresults here as well._
Well, I don't want my personal biases to influence your responses, I ask you not to take what I previously typed as into account. I've done the K2C test, but I feel I'm too subjective, so I won't post the result there 


I'm7w8-4w3-8w7 sx/so, also Socionics IEI-Fe.


_18.Finally, is there something else you find to be of importance youwant to add about yourself you think might be of relevance whenhelping to type you?_
Please, don't confuse Enneagram/instinct-related traits with cognitive processes. Thank you


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## Vermillion (Jan 22, 2012)

First observation I shall make: I don't see the Te. Or the Si-Ne, actually.


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## DomNapoleon (Jan 21, 2012)

@aconite 

I really don't think you are an INTP... I just don't see Ti at all in your answers. This Ti description came to my head: 



> *Dispassion*: Ti types are usually level-headed, objective, impersonal, yet intensely involved in problem solving. They are rigorous with their thoughts and analysis, choosing the exact words that convey precisely what is meant. Ti types maintain the utmost objectivity. They approach people and events as dispassionate observers, with the goal of arriving at the most comprehensive truth possible. Ti types typically do not take constructive criticism and disagreement personally. They often welcome tough, unrelenting critique as an aid to achieving the highest levels of accuracy and objectivity.


Unlike Ti-users, you seem to be so much passionate about many different things (as you even say, art, the cultures that are different from your own, beauty,...). I think you are an INFP :crazy:. I see a lot of Fi in your answers, and you also give the vibe of day-dreamer idealist. 

*Functions that I see in your answers: *
2. Se, Ni
3. Fi(your '_sensitive, gentle, idealistic dreamer_' side)-Te(your '_arrogant, able to overcome obstacles_'); Definitely not Ti here
4. Definitely not Si-user
7. Se? Ne? 
8. Fi, Fi, *FI* ('_moody, irritable, hostile and violent_')
9. Ne ('_imagination run wild_') 
11. Fe, Ni and some Fi?
13. Some Ti
16. a) Fi (The way you use art and so as an '_Universal language_' )

So, yeah I think you are an INFP. However, I don't see some INFP traits on you, like for example: 
*1. *INFP-s usually have strong moral codes, and they tend to judge people (even if they keep their opinions to themselves) when they see something wrong. 
*2.* INFP-s tend to be very sensible toward criticism - to the point of over-react in irrational ways. 

Can you relate? 

If you really are an INFP, then I think you have your inferior function -Te- activated and somewhat developed. For more informations, check this: http://personalitycafe.com/infp-articles/76770-recognizing-inferior-function-ifps.html


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## thunder (Jun 15, 2011)

First thought -- xNFx
Then I thought xNFP
and then, INFP


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Unlike Ti-users, you seem to be so much passionate about many different things (as you even say, art, the cultures that are different from your own, beauty,...).


Why can't Ti users be passionate about things? Keep in mind that I'm Sx/So 



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 3. Fi(your '_sensitive, gentle, idealistic dreamer_' side)-Te(your '_arrogant, able to overcome obstacles_'); Definitely not Ti here


I'm actually inclined to think that it's a side-effect of having both 4 and 8 fixes, but thank you for your opinion, I'll consider it 



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 4. Definitely not Si-user


Why?



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 8. Fi, Fi, *FI* ('_moody, irritable, hostile and violent_')



Could you elaborate please? 




Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 13. Some Ti



You said you couldn't see Ti at all in my answers, so?




Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 16. a) Fi (The way you use art and so as an '_Universal language_' )



Why do you think it's Fi?




Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> However, I don't see some INFP traits on you, like for example:
> *1. *INFP-s usually have strong moral codes, and they tend to judge people (even if they keep their opinions to themselves) when they see something wrong.
> *2.* INFP-s tend to be very sensible toward criticism - to the point of over-react in irrational ways.



Nope. I don't relate to 1 at all, I don't have a definite moral code so to speak. Of course, there are things I perceive as unjust, cruel, unconsiderate etc. but I think it all depends on a situation. Same about 2 - I think I'm pretty thick-skinned 




Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> If you really are an INFP, then I think you have your inferior function -Te- activated and somewhat developed. For more informations, check this: http://personalitycafe.com/infp-articles/76770-recognizing-inferior-function-ifps.html


Hmm, I don't think I use Te. Thanks for the link, but I can't relate at all.


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## bearotter (Aug 10, 2012)

Phoenix Rebirth said:


> Unlike Ti-users, you seem to be so much passionate about many different things (as you even say, art, the cultures that are different from your own, beauty,...).


 I can't relate to most Ti users, yet I scream Ti-dominance even to those who couldn't see it as clearly till they got to know me. I am ragingly passionate about many matters of aesthetic taste. 

SX-dom is one thing.



This whole business is complicated, because it's about best-fit. 



> Hmm, I don't think I use Te.


By some interpretations, @_aconite_, you probably _have_ to use Te, to some extent, even if it's a slave to Ti. That said, you're very likely right about the gut instinct that you're not on the Fi-Te side of things quite as much. 


There are some strange cases where both Ji's show up. Not all INTPs reject Fi equally. 


From our discussions, first things first, we have to decide on what are acceptable compromises to you in adopting a given label -- "best" fit is ultimately about what the user wants out of discovering the type, because "best" is subjective, even if the functions are not necessarily so. 
For instance, as someone who may be an NTFS type, one could adopt ENTP or INTJ, but be a Ti-INTJ -- the realization of Ni visions may utilize some Te, yet be subordinate to Ti in some cases. Much as my Ne supports my Ti, yet my Ni is strongly dominating much of my analytical thinking.

Right now, we could focus on figuring out which perceiving combinations dominate your processes. Your top J function is, according to you, clearly Ji. We can keep that in mind.

I think all matters of "best fit" where there isn't a cookie-cutter fit amount to some subjective choice on the user's part, beyond determination of the dominant function (or in perhaps rare cases a dual-dominant), what enlargements of the standard interpretations of the aux-tert-inferior / shadow business they adopt.


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

bearotter said:


> By some interpretations, @_aconite_, you probably _have_ to use Te, to some extent, even if it's a slave to Ti. That said, you're very likely right about the gut instinct that you're not on the Fi-Te side of things quite as much.


Yes, I know. However, I believe my default mode of judging is Ti-Fe.



bearotter said:


> From our discussions, first things first, we have to decide on what are acceptable compromises to you in adopting a given label -- "best" fit is ultimately about what the user wants out of discovering the type, because "best" is subjective, even if the functions are not necessarily so.
> For instance, as someone who may be an NTFS type, one could adopt ENTP or INTJ, but be a Ti-INTJ -- the realization of Ni visions may utilize some Te, yet be subordinate to Ti in some cases. Much as my Ne supports my Ti, yet my Ni is strongly dominating much of my analytical thinking.


Well, I think the label should reflect my cognitive functions more than preferences for Thinking over Feeling or Intuition over Sensing, for example. If my function stack is, let's say, Ni>Ti>Fe>Se, I'd be more comfortable wearing the INFJ t-shirt than the INTJ one. As I said yesterday, though, the only letter I'm really attached to is I.



bearotter said:


> Right now, we should focus on figuring out which perceiving combinations dominate your processes. Your top J function is, according to you, clearly Ji. We can keep that in mind.


Maybe not "clearly Ji"... I think I prefer using Fe to Fi  Nevertheless, I agree with the premise.


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## Vermillion (Jan 22, 2012)

So my proposition is INFJ, but you already know that. What do you think?


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

Amaterasu said:


> So my proposition is INFJ, but you already know that. What do you think?


Well, it's definitely a good idea I think. Actually makes a lot of sense. The only issue I have with that (aside from immature bursts like "OMG I'M NOT A FEELER" XD) is that I'm not sure if my most used perceiving function is Ni or Ne. However, I'm reasonably sure of N preference.

edit:


PlainJane said:


> Well I am an 7W8 INFJ... And while this possibility is rare, it isn't impossible. I believe the reason why I was so confused and lost in my growing up years, was partially because it felt like I had 2 very contrasting personalities within myself. Both, very complex. It was as if I was a daredevil and saint combined... I have evolved by leaps and bounds since then, and understood myself better. Learnt to control and rationalize both sides of myself...


the part about 2 contrasting personalities is... uncannily similar to my OP, no?

edit 2:


PursuitofVikings said:


> Actually, you just described me. I am an INFJ 7w8. Essentially, my greatest battle in life is conquering my emotions. I have to control myself so that I do not act foolishly or in rage. Normally I am the strong an silent type, but once in a great while I become blinded by rage and have to control my aggression. This is rare. Normally I am impulsive and happy to try new things. But I force myself to stick to a hard routine that keeps me focused on what's important. Without a to do list, I am lost in whatever distraction pops into my head next.
> 
> I have done so many different activities that it has hurt my ability to focus on what is important sometimes. I have to meditate on what I need to do, but when I get focused I am unstoppable.


uhhh, okay... these are the only 7w8 INFJs I could find on PerC, but both actually speak of experiences very similar to mine.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Well, here's a great guide if considering INFJ - http://personalitycafe.com/infj-articles/126361-conundrum-infj-vs-infp.html


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## DomNapoleon (Jan 21, 2012)

aconite said:


> Why can't Ti users be passionate about things? Keep in mind that I'm Sx/So


Well, Ti users are incredibly objective, somewhat cold, and detached - they would rather watch something from a no-emotional perspective (that happens because Ti-users search for inconsistent information: they judge 'what's true vs what's not'). When you express you opinion towards art, and all the things you are passionate about, you are using a subjective point of view - your own perspective about something and it seems, in my opinion, something that you have a very emotional connected to and so it doesn't look Ti (cause as I said this function detach from it's own feelings to see things consistently). 




> I'm actually inclined to think that it's a side-effect of having both 4 and 8 fixes, but thank you for your opinion, I'll consider it


Thank you :happy: 




> Why?


I can't find much thing in this answer, but you say this: '_to experience *new,* wonderful things every single day.' _Si users enjoy stability and this function has some difficulties in getting 'outside the box': Si is the function that you use when you compare the present activities to the past, when you use your memory and when you prefer kinda more routine actives and to don't get away from your past experiences. You are saying the opposite :laughing:





> Could you elaborate please?


Yes, sure. In this answer you are expressing your emotional reactions (moody, temperamental, ...) without any project it to onto others. In other words, you are describing you inner emotional state and you don't care if it goes or not against the harmony on the outside (you even say that you have to control in order to don't get physical lol) - This goes against the Fe nature that wants to promote to the harmony; also, Fe is known by appropriateness and alignment connection with people (a typical Fe answer in my opinion: 'When others started to feel stressed, I got stressed too, and then I reacted'). Take a look at this: 




> Jung continues to discuss the introverted feeling type (IF) by stating that this type is often silent, inaccessible, hard to understand, hides behind a childish or banal mask, and is inclined to melancholy. In fact, as many as 65-85% of people diagnosed with major depressive episode are introverted feelers. Introverted Feelers value peace and harmony above almost anything else; strong emotions are struck down “with murderous coldness” or nearly paralyze the IF. In women, especially, introverted feeling tends to come off as cold because the strong feeling component is introjected rather than sent outward by projection onto others. In pathological introverted feelers, there is a tendency to overpower or coerce others to get one’s way, “in the form of a domineering influence often difficult to define”




In contrast to this: 




> The extraverted feeler is just as full of feeling and emotion as the introvert, but often only knows *what she feels once it is projected onto an object–or another person*. The unconscious (or simply immature) EF only finds something “beautiful” or “good” because others say it is so, which reminds me of the wickedly funny movie _Untitled,_ in which trash and neurotic behavior become art simply because artists and gallery owners agree that it is, in fact, art.




Besides, sterotypically Fi-users are very moody, temperamental, self-absorbed and highly self-aware. 




> You said you couldn't see Ti at all in my answers, so?


Strangely in this answer you seem an INFJ (Ti is tertiary)  When I started reading your answers I though 'Oh well, another INFJ mistyped' but then you started to sound so much in tune with your own feelings, with art, beauty and using too much Fi. Still I could see some Fe and Ni. 





> Why do you think it's Fi?


 The desire to get to 'universal x' is associated with Fi, Ti and Ni. Fi reminds me a lot enneagram type 4 and 1 (lol). Fi search for universal morals (while Ti search for universal facts) . Fi is also worried with authenticity and they spend a lot of time finding 'what am I feeling?' (Fe don't, 'cause they find what they are feeling by projecting onto others - that's why, I would, say many E6 are Fe users). In this case, I found more Fi because you are talking of art - something where you express your own emotions. I could be wrong too. 





> Nope. I don't relate to 1 at all, I don't have a definite moral code so to speak. Of course, there are things I perceive as unjust, cruel, unconsiderate etc. but I think it all depends on a situation. Same about 2 - I think I'm pretty thick-skinned


Right. 
Perhaps you may be an INFJ? I would advice you to watch this video about Fi vs Fe, and then tell me which one do you relate more: 






I have some questions to you too :crazy::
1. What do you search for when you are creating art? And what makes you to do so?
2. What would you feel if someone doesn't like your art? 
3. Imagine a stranger insult you - what do you do? 
4. Imagine someone has a different opinion of yours: how do you react? And what if that opinion really crashes with your core beliefs?
5. Tell me your experiences with using Se - where do you think you use it? How does it manifest? Do you have an example?


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Take a look at this:
> 
> 
> > Jung continues to discuss the introverted feeling type (IF) by stating that this type is often silent, inaccessible, hard to understand, hides behind a childish or banal mask, and is inclined to melancholy. In fact, as many as 65-85% of people diagnosed with major depressive episode are introverted feelers. Introverted Feelers value peace and harmony above almost anything else; strong emotions are struck down “with murderous coldness” or nearly paralyze the IF. In women, especially, introverted feeling tends to come off as cold because the strong feeling component is introjected rather than sent outward by projection onto others. In pathological introverted feelers, there is a tendency to overpower or coerce others to get one’s way, “in the form of a domineering influence often difficult to define”


I can't relate. I sure as hell don't value peace and harmony above anything else, quite the contrary; I feel comfortable with my strong emotions and want them to be mirrored by others. Also, I doubt anyone who knows me well would say I'm cold 



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> The extraverted feeler is just as full of feeling and emotion as the introvert, but often only knows what she feels once it is projected onto an object–or another person. The unconscious (or simply immature) EF only finds something “beautiful” or “good” because others say it is so, which reminds me of the wickedly funny movie Untitled, in which trash and neurotic behavior become art simply because artists and gallery owners agree that it is, in fact, art.


Can YOU relate to the above, dear Fe user? How much?



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> The desire to get to 'universal x' is associated with Fi, Ti and Ni. Fi reminds me a lot enneagram type 4 and 1 (lol). Fi search for universal morals (while Ti search for universal facts) . Fi is also worried with authenticity and they spend a lot of time finding 'what am I feeling?' (Fe don't, 'cause they find what they are feeling by projecting onto others - that's why, I would, say many E6 are Fe users). In this case, I found more Fi because you are talking of art - something where you express your own emotions. I could be wrong too.



I do have a 4 fix, but 1 is one of the types I can relate to the least. I don't care for universal morals... well, when I hear the word "morals", I cringe.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Perhaps you may be an INFJ? I would advice you to watch this video about Fi vs Fe, and then tell me which one do you relate more.



I have some problems with my sound, I can't watch it right now.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 1. What do you search for when you are creating art? And what makes you to do so?


What makes me create art? You can as well ask me what makes me eat, drink or breathe. It's a deeply ingrained need, a desire I must act on. I want my art to influence people, to make them feel what I feel, to express my imagination



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 2. What would you feel if someone doesn't like your art?


Depends why. If they see technical flaws, I just try to work more on my foundations. If they just don't like my message/style, well, it happens. I'd feel hurt a bit, but art is highly subjective, I can't expect (and I don't) everyone to like what I create.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 3. Imagine a stranger insult you - what do you do?


Shrug. It's only a stranger.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 4. Imagine someone has a different opinion of yours: how do you react? And what if that opinion really crashes with your core beliefs?


I ask them why. I might think they're an idiot, but I won't say that aloud, most probably. If their explanation is sound, I might consider it if I didn't have a strong opinion on that. If it's something that crashes with my core beliefs, I'd just stand my ground. If the other person is polite, I'd probably just tell them we wouldn't reach a compromise anyway; if rude, I'd just ignore them.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> 5. Tell me your experiences with using Se - where do you think you use it? How does it manifest? Do you have an example?


Drawing from life, maybe? I don't really know. Even when I try to focus on the external surroundings, I just drift back to my head. Well, I like swordfighting, is it a good example?  It's a good way to relax I think. I sometimes turn more physical when I feel stressed, it helps me calm down a bit.


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## voicetrocity (Mar 31, 2012)

Well..... 

This isn't going to be entirely helpful, but just by going on posts I've seen from you; I definitely don't see enough evidence to believe you use Fe over Fi.


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## bearotter (Aug 10, 2012)

@Phoenix_Rebirth



> Ti users are incredibly objective, somewhat cold, and detached - they would rather watch something from a no-emotional perspective


The part about objective isn't what Ti is, since it likes to form theories which are individually conceived. However, it can be rather detached and unemotional. My flavor tends to be that way, possibly because my head type is strongly 5w6. 

What Ti-users such as myself believe about objectivity is that to achieve a good description of objective reality, one formulates theories, and these theories are founded upon what "principles" we believe fundamentally hold. So sometimes one can actually put a lot of ethos into this process. And sometimes, Fi-Ti can synergize surprisingly. 

But in a lot of cases yes, as you say, Ti is utilized in a detached sense.
@_aconite_: OK sure, good to know; in that case, it's about your dominant function at this point. I mean, it's a matter of taste: Ni-Ti-Fe-Se would be an IN as opposed to be an EN type, and it could either be called INTJ or INFJ in some sense. Probably the use of Fe makes it closer to INFJ, much as the use of Ti-Ni-Se-Fe might still be labeled ISTP; effectively, FJ means Fe I guess.

I mean, if you really look at it, if you consider yourself a thinker type, and that's the aspect of your personality you wish to emphasize, you can call Ni-Ti-Fe-Se an INTJ. It's not really the standard INTJ, but it is at least in ordering the correct one (NTFS). If you wish to emphasize which functions extrovert, then INFJ makes sense in that scenario.


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## bearotter (Aug 10, 2012)

> Maybe not "clearly Ji"... I think I prefer using Fe to Fi


Yeah, though it seems you like to Ti more than Te, Fe, Fi


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## DomNapoleon (Jan 21, 2012)

aconite said:


> Can YOU relate to the above, dear Fe user? How much?


I can relate to that, particularly when I was child. :crying: I project myself onto people in order to understand how people express themselves and to connect (or disconnect) with (or from) them.



> I have some problems with my sound, I can't watch it right now.


Ok, no problem. 



> *Depends why. If they see technical flaws, I just try to work more on my foundations. *I*f they just don't like my message/style, well, it happens. (Ti?)* I'd feel hurt a bit, but art is highly subjective, I can't expect (and I don't) everyone to like what I create.
> 
> I ask them why. I might think they're an idiot, but I won't say that aloud, most probably. If their explanation is sound, I might consider it if I didn't have a strong opinion on that. *If it's something that crashes with my core beliefs, I'd just stand my ground (Ti)* *If the other person is polite, I'd probably just tell them we wouldn't reach a compromise anyway; if rude, I'd just ignore them (Fe).*


Do you agree? 



> Drawing from life, maybe? I don't really know. Even when I try to focus on the external surroundings, I just drift back to my head. Well, I like swordfighting, is it a good example?  It's a good way to relax I think. I sometimes turn more physical when I feel stressed, it helps me calm down a bit.


This doesn't tell too much, sorry. INFJ-s last function is Se. There are some triggers of this function in this type, like for example completely new situations, ... and when this function is triggered, INFJ-s may find themselves lost in all kind of sensual pleasures, hedonistic behavior, FUN FUN FUN and so on (which goes against the Ni nature of withdrawing and observe). 

Just to finish, I know a 7w8(>4w5>8w9) INFJ Sx/Sp. The things I have noticed with this combination are the following: 
-Very driven to knowledge (to the point of appear 5-ish), He searched on the same topic for years, but he would search for variety inside of that same topic; 
-Extremely emotional on the inside (even if, on the outside they appear hard, unemotional, somewhat arrogant or untamed);
-Prone to some sudden Fe explosions (where he would all of the sudden reveal the warm of his heart); 
-Even being assertive, there was a tendency to fall into abusive relationships: INFJ-s, and this is from my own experience too, may struggle with this dilemma: Ni (truth telling, following your insights, be rigid about your ideas) vs Fe ([dis]connect with others, promote the harmony, be attuned with them).


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

bearotter said:


> @aconite: OK sure, good to know; in that case, it's about your dominant function at this point. I mean, it's a matter of taste: Ni-Ti-Fe-Se would be an IN as opposed to be an EN type, and it could either be called INTJ or INFJ in some sense. Probably the use of Fe makes it closer to INFJ, much as the use of Ti-Ni-Se-Fe might still be labeled ISTP; effectively, FJ means Fe I guess.
> 
> 
> I mean, if you really look at it, if you consider yourself a thinker type, and that's the aspect of your personality you wish to emphasize, you can call Ni-Ti-Fe-Se an INTJ. It's not really the standard INTJ, but it is at least in ordering the correct one (NTFS). If you wish to emphasize which functions extrovert, then INFJ makes sense in that scenario.


Mhm yeah, as I wrote on skype, even if I'm Ni-Ti-Fe-Se, I'd prefer INFJ over INTJ. I'd just feel more comfortable with that label I guess. And I found the NTFS order quite funny. NT File System, huh. Human computer ^^ I'm attached to the "I" letter, as I wrote before, to "T" not that much. BTW, I take it you see Ti-Fe in me over Fi-Te, yes?



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> I can relate to that, particularly when I was child. :crying: I project myself onto people in order to understand how people express themselves and to connect (or disconnect) with (or from) them.


I actually think this is related to your enneagram type, which is different from mine.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Do you agree?


Probably. Your interpretation makes sense to me.



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> This doesn't tell too much, sorry. INFJ-s last function is Se. There are some triggers of this function in this type, like for example completely new situations, ... and when this function is triggered, INFJ-s may find themselves lost in all kind of sensual pleasures, hedonistic behavior, FUN FUN FUN and so on (which goes against the Ni nature of withdrawing and observe).


Well, I am a Seven. I'm not lost in new situation and I can drown in hedonism too easily. Read #18 of the OP pretty please? <3



Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Just to finish, I know a 7w8(>4w5>8w9) INFJ Sx/Sp. The things I have noticed with this combination are the following:
> -Very driven to knowledge (to the point of appear 5-ish), He searched on the same topic for years, but he would search for variety inside of that same topic;
> -Extremely emotional on the inside (even if, on the outside they appear hard, unemotional, somewhat arrogant or untamed);
> -Prone to some sudden Fe explosions (where he would all of the sudden reveal the warm of his heart);
> -Even being assertive, there was a tendency to fall into abusive relationships: INFJ-s, and this is from my own experience too, may struggle with this dilemma: Ni (truth telling, following your insights, be rigid about your ideas) vs Fe ([dis]connect with others, promote the harmony, be attuned with them).


How sure are you of that guy's type? He sounds a bit like a sx 6 tbh. I'm Sx/So, so I'm naturally less restrained than Sx/Sp folks. Well, I think I'm very driven to knowledge (and I regularly score as 5 on tests); I'm very emotional, even if sometimes I come across as distant, I'm just a private person and I share only as much as I want on the forum; I'm very warm, sincere, compassionate and loving when I'm with people I care about, but I don't fall into abusive relationship. As for the dilemma between following our own truth and attuning to others, doesn't everyone experience that on some level?


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## DomNapoleon (Jan 21, 2012)

aconite said:


> I actually think this is related to your enneagram type, which is different from mine.


Not sure ... But I guess this why the combination INFJ and 6w7 is quite common (my 4 fix is offended :c) 




> Well, I am a Seven. I'm not lost in new situation and I can drown in hedonism too easily. Read #18 of the OP pretty please? <3


I know, right? Well, of curse many of what I said sounds like E7 :laughing: What differs that from mbti is that mbti is about how you solve the problem (which where is used the functions) while enneagram is about core fears and motivations and why you have /dial with the problems, as you know. The difference is that 7s are hedonistic cause they fear to be trapped down in emotional pain and they want to escape from their fears; while in the INFJ-s case, the hedonism tendency is triggered under some new situations. 



> How sure are you of that guy's type? He sounds a bit like a sx 6 tbh. I'm Sx/So, so I'm naturally less restrained than Sx/Sp folks. Well, I think I'm very driven to knowledge (and I regularly score as 5 on tests); I'm very emotional, even if sometimes I come across as distant, I'm just a private person and I share only as much as I want on the forum; I'm very warm, sincere, compassionate and loving when I'm with people I care about, but I don't fall into abusive relationship.* As for the dilemma between following our own truth and attuning to others, doesn't everyone experience that on some level?*


Nah I don't think he is a 6, he isn't clearly a reactive type or super-ego  too bloody ID. 

I am going to post something about that: 



> *Self (Ni) vs Others (Fe); Truth (Ni) vs Harmony (Fe)*
> 
> Even if not to the same extent as EFJs, INFJs can be warm, welcoming, and endearing. They genuinely want to please and help others, working to ensure that people are getting along and are well cared for. They tend to be loyal, giving, and self-sacrificing. At the same time, however, INFJs are forward-thinking, goal-oriented, and independent-minded. As Introverts, they need time to themselves to recharge their proverbial batteries. This creates an ongoing, even lifelong, struggle for INFJs. Namely, trying to balance their own needs, values, and desires against those of others.
> 
> ...


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## bearotter (Aug 10, 2012)

aconite said:


> BTW, I take it you see Ti-Fe in me over Fi-Te, yes?




It does seem likely yeah. 

What you've written suggests to me though that your temperament being less hyper-detached as compared to mine results in using more Fi than I do. Both Ti and Fi ultimately form judgments based on subjective tenets, but the Fi reasoning process more directly self-references. It needn't be gushy, in fact it can be quite _cold_ in a way, with a vibe of "This is precisely what rings true with my inner X or Y, and thus this is how it must be." I think you'd be more comfortable doing that than I would. For instance, your response to the "conflict with beliefs" question. Me? I'd try to make everyone agree and reconcile the viewpoints no matter what. I'd remain convinced my analysis is correct. sure, but the level to which I'd Fi is probably about as miniscule as Fi gets. 

Your relationship to Te remains an interesting subject to be broached a bit perhaps. As was stated earlier, I am unable to as yet see clearly where your Te stands. 

Where I use Te is very much in support to my Ti. If I am reasoning to make conclusions about something that objectively exists, I will typically form a personal system to analyze it, but will reference bits of reasoning that rest on the purely objective. My observation is that that quite often, the P and J functions work synergistically with their extro/intro counterparts. 

Consider, for instance, how I take in a slice of pizza. There is part of me that must take in the sensory experience as is -- as an existing thing, outside me, for what it is worth, yet as I process the pleasure of consuming it, there's so much Si that goes into play. Even if the pizza slice is consumed at a location distinct from where I typically consume, there is a ton of back-reference to the subjective remembrance of what concrete qualities make up a pizza. And this is what I enjoy typically most about the experience -- the marked contrast/compare between what my subjective view of pizza is and what is in front of me.

The Si-notion is more comparison oriented. It provides hunches as a result. But the weakness of using Si too much over Se is evident in me too -- I have a hard time absorbing completely new information without excessive reference to past sensory experience. This is where my Ni tends to come in. I may not be able to process it directly as is, but I may be able to relate it more abstractly to my individual experiences. But this process is honestly "slow" and thus makes me unfit to succeed in many settings that require more direct sensory engagement, including several intellectual endeavors.

To take in something _utterly and totally new _is very difficult for me. I'll try very hard to use Pi functions.



Just a few thoughts as you ponder Se-Ni. It's in one way about whether you experience sensory data in the moment or whether your tendency is to process it with excessive self-reference.

The whole thing behind Se-Ni is that to a heavy Ni-user, due to heavy subjective function use, it's unnatural to just let in Pe information without assimilating it in some way into a personalized picture. This is less true of ISTP, yet they still can Ni a lot -- they're just likely comfortable with Se. 
So you may use Se over Si even if you heavily subjectively reference. The question is how much you reference _concrete experience _with a subjective bent. 

Se is more "detached" from its sensory experience, but Ni is very attached to to connections it forms, because they inherently link back to the user's understanding/storehouse of experiences/etc.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

@_Phoenix_Rebirth_, using that logic I'm an INFP in the MBTI system and I'm very sure I'm not. Not MBTI INFP. I can't even relate to the INFP 5s out there more than perhaps mildly so. But xNTPs of my tritype? Yes. @_Jawz_, where are you when you need you? Also, I watched that video you linked and I am not sure if Garfield is an INFP necessarily, but INxP makes sense I suppose. I related a lot to him by the way. In his scenario I would probably have removed the shoes though, because I think you at least take off your shoes before you sit down in the sofa, but I wouldn't really give much of a fuck whether someone else thought my way of sitting would be offensive or not.

Bla bla. And I related a lot to his rant about how artistic endeavors are downplyaed in school sigh. Or any other endeavor that is not valued in society for the matter.


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