# Se vs Fe Expressiveness and Thinking Back



## Malandro (Jul 17, 2014)

Okay, so the functions are confusing me again. I know that Se is renowned for its expressiveness... But so is Fe.

I'm thinking this because I've read comparisons of ESFPs and ESFJs (because I swear, we're supposed to be hella different but I couldn't believe it) and ESFJs are supposed to be more expressive than ESFPs because Fi makes us keep our feelings silent... Huh? I thought Fe meant adjusting your morals and feelings to that of the people around you? Okay, I'm confused.

Se is supposed to be blunt, honest and straightforward whether we know it or not. Fe is supposed to be more open compared to Fi because Fi is an introverted function. How this makes sense, I don't know. I know we're all extroverts at the end of the day 

So is Fe more expressive in terms of... I dunno feelings? And Se more in terms of the truth?

I'm still trying to understand functions more.

There's also how Se looks at the past compared to Si. I know Si is supposed to make comparisons to past experiences, but how does a Se user look back? I have nostalgia. It's more in terms of "Oh my gosh, when I was a kid, I used to love that!" or "Oh my gosh! I _have_ to listen to that song again!" But apparently, nostalgia is a Si thing. My whole love for Digimon is very nostalgia driven. It's present tense too, but remembering what happened from childhood is cool. I mean, I never watched it in Japanese before a couple years back and some I never watched at all. Would that be a Se way of doing things?


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## uncertain (May 26, 2012)

Se and Fe are expressive in different ways and have different focus.

You can express yourself in different ways, in words, pictures, music, action, etc. SPs are more expressive in a non-verbal way, like fashion and music, while Fe types do so through words and connecting with people. ESFPs are more spontaneous while ESFJs are more deliberate, I guess.

As an ESFP, your primary function is Se, not Fi. You might be expressing yourself without knowing it, or maybe you are not expressive, which is not unusual, I think. Not every ESFPs are expressive.

People use their extroverted function to express themselves. For example, ISFPs are said to be artists who express their feeling through art and other non-verbal way, which is Se. They also connect to the world through their Se, going out, doing things. Then a lot of INFPs/INFJs show their feelings and thoughts through writing. So yeah, even an introvert can be expressive.


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## Malandro (Jul 17, 2014)

No, I _am_ expressive. Very much so. I'm just saying I don't get the descriptions and I know Se is my main function, it just seems almost contradictory.

I've read other types are more expressive and that we're more 'private' and then the next minute read that ES*Ps with their leading Se are the most outspoken and brutal XD


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## uncertain (May 26, 2012)

I got you. I have read contradictory description, too. It's so confusing. But those descriptions are written by different people, and it would not be unusual to read very different opinions, so maybe we can just conclude that ESFPs are as expressive as ESFJs.



> I've read other types are more expressive and that we're more 'private' and then the next minute read that ES*Ps with their leading Se are the most outspoken and brutal XD


Yeah I guess the "private" part is about Fi. Then Feelers are said to be more expressive than thinkers, so ESTPs, who have tertiary Fe, may have about the same level of expressiveness as ESFPs.

Fi is private. For ISFPs, their primary mode is Fi, with supportive Se, so their main theme would be feeling. It's not a natural thing for them to go around to tell everyone how depressed they are. They might show their feelings in non-verbal ways, or talk about it to just a few. You can also tell how they feel by observing their behaviors. A depressed ISFP might become even more private, close his door, look tired, procrastinate everything, etc. ISFPs are energized by their Se, like seeking new experience. 

For ESFPs, their primary mode is Se, with supportive Fi, so their main them would be seeking new experience and satisfaction for their five senses. Fi is how you make judgment on the way, so you use it when situation calls for it. But Fi doesn't equal to feeling and emotion, it's just that you tend to make a judgment in a more subjective and personal way, which often causes emotion within oneself, especially for ISFPs. Fi doesn't have a need to be known... so many ISFPs just don't feel like talking about it but simply live with it. But since you are extroverts, you might just like to _talk, _including feeling.

My aunt is an ESFP and she's often being blunt and honest. She also just make fun of you in front of everyone and think it's just harmless joke, or it's your problem if you feel offended. She is definitely loud about her Fi, like she would talk about her day at work and make fun of how stupid some customers are or how she would just do this and that because she feels like it.


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## Acadia (Mar 20, 2014)

@sharlzkidarlz 

don't worry, nostalgia is not solely an Si thing. Si is more likely to use past recollections in order to navigate the present world. best example I've got is the difference between myself and my dad; my dad will go through a parking lot he doesn't like in a plaza and say 'I can never find any spots here' whereas, I don't care if I've found parking spots there before or not. I'm scanning and searching my environment for what's there; and lo and behold, I find parking spots much more quickly than he does.

Fi is very private. I'm very uncomfortable sharing my feelings. I have to ruminate on things. But I'm also a much more outgoing introvert. I overuse my Se. It is very expressive. I'm happy doing things with people I'm comfortable with to make them feel comfortable in the immediate moment. I've sang to Lady Gaga with my boss, and I've run through a parking lot in winter in shorts after fencing practice with my unhealthy ISFJ friend, encouraging her to run with me by singing. 

But I'm still dominated by Fi. It still makes me feel uncomfortable to try and put my emotions into words. I take all of the issues I see on the outside, and internalize them. Se makes me feel better. And, it does make me painfully blunt. So many people are willing to overanalyze and think, and I will tell them, upfront, "Stop thinking and start _doing_ something with your life." 

Se will count on visual cues to understand what's going on with other people; it can make an Fi-user very adept at it; but an Fe-user will be much more capable of understanding much more quickly, and almost more intuitively. 

They are quite different functions. In a way, a person could call me more expressive than that same ISFJ friend; but she will open up and talk about everything that's wrong in the hopes of getting people to understand her. I don't need people to understand me. I just want to be with people that want to try new things and have new experiences without infringing on the way I choose to live my life, in accordance with my internal value systems.


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## ferroequinologist (Jul 27, 2012)

sharlzkidarlz said:


> No, I _am_ expressive. Very much so. I'm just saying I don't get the descriptions and I know Se is my main function, it just seems almost contradictory.
> 
> I've read other types are more expressive and that we're more 'private' and then the next minute read that ES*Ps with their leading Se are the most outspoken and brutal XD


Fe types express with the desire to mold their environment emotionally or volitionally. ESFPs express their own feelings, not to shape or mold those around them, but almost in ignorance of the feelings of those around them. In other words, Fe types know the effect their words are having on others, while Se-Fi types will more likely be oblivious to the effect their words are having on others. Both may be brutal, but Fe will have a reason for it, while Se will just be saying what Fi is thinking, or maybe to accomplish an Se objective ("get out of my way") At least, that's how I've observed things.


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## Malandro (Jul 17, 2014)

ferroequinologist said:


> Fe types express with the desire to mold their environment emotionally or volitionally. ESFPs express their own feelings, not to shape or mold those around them, but almost in ignorance of the feelings of those around them. In other words, Fe types know the effect their words are having on others, while Se-Fi types will more likely be oblivious to the effect their words are having on others. Both may be brutal, but Fe will have a reason for it, while Se will just be saying what Fi is thinking, or maybe to accomplish an Se objective ("get out of my way") At least, that's how I've observed things.


Gawd, we sound haaarrrrsh XD I'm always aware of what I do and how it affects other people. I guess that's more from observations than anything. 

So would a Fe user stop in their tracks if they know what they're doing will affect someone? Would they be hesitant or have few complaints?


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## ferroequinologist (Jul 27, 2012)

sharlzkidarlz said:


> Gawd, we sound haaarrrrsh XD I'm always aware of what I do and how it affects other people. I guess that's more from observations than anything.
> 
> So would a Fe user stop in their tracks if they know what they're doing will affect someone? Would they be hesitant or have few complaints?


If they are harsh, they know they are being harsh, and will do it anyway. "Cruel to be kind" is probably their motto. ;-) Of course, if someone is an "outsider" being cruel will not be considered bad in any case, as I've seen it. 

In other words, there is not "if they know what they are doing will affect someone." They always know it. So if they are being harsh, they have a reason for it, or are unhinged and don't care what the result will be. I, on the other hand, can become unhinged, and 1. not be aware I'm unhinged, and 2. have no idea that I'm impacting others in a negative way. It's sad, but usually the first sign I've done something wrong is the look in my family's eyes. And then I collapse like a burbling baby at how cruel I've been... I hate those moments, because it is never _them_ who I'm unhinged over, but myself or somebody not even around... :-(


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## Malandro (Jul 17, 2014)

ferroequinologist said:


> If they are harsh, they know they are being harsh, and will do it anyway. "Cruel to be kind" is probably their motto. ;-) Of course, if someone is an "outsider" being cruel will not be considered bad in any case, as I've seen it.
> 
> In other words, there is not "if they know what they are doing will affect someone." They always know it. So if they are being harsh, they have a reason for it, or are unhinged and don't care what the result will be. I, on the other hand, can become unhinged, and 1. not be aware I'm unhinged, and 2. have no idea that I'm impacting others in a negative way. It's sad, but usually the first sign I've done something wrong is the look in my family's eyes. And then I collapse like a burbling baby at how cruel I've been... I hate those moments, because it is never _them_ who I'm unhinged over, but myself or somebody not even around... :-(


Aaaaah. Okay, that's more like me XD I can be the worst person if I feel like it. I don't care only if.... I dunno. I guess I stopped caring if people don't want me to achieve me goals, I just do them. I'm a tough love sort of person I guess. I hate it because people then think I'm there to be their mother. That's when I leg it 

Family disappointment. It's the worst  I'm aware of my feelings a lot more than I used to be, so I can relate to the part where you don't know if you're unhinged. 

This all makes a lot more sense now


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