# Intj>p : Entj>j



## Ozymandias (May 6, 2011)

Considering how the INTJ CF's are ordered Ni>Te>Fi>Se verses ENTJ's Te>Ni>Se>Fi
Is it correct to assume that ENTJ's put more emphasis on structure and less on vision than their NTJ counterpart?

These two Jungian personality types can be see as such:

INTJ- Visionary>Director

ENTJ- System building>Visionary

Further more, because ENTJ's make use of a primary judging function can they be seen as "more" of a judging type than INTJ's?


----------



## MegaTuxRacer (Sep 7, 2011)

I wouldn't say "more". I think ENTJs come to their judgments quicker than INTJs.


----------



## L'Empereur (Jun 7, 2010)

Well, Ni is a perceiving function and Te is a judging function. . . .so yeah.


----------



## Ozymandias (May 6, 2011)

mkeath said:


> I wouldn't say "more". I think ENTJs come to their judgments quicker than INTJs.


That make sense they do come to their judgments quicker but that does imply that they are "more" judging. Where INTJ's would keep their options open for longer and consider alternate possibilities.

If I could get an INTJ perspective on how you guys come to make decisions that would be great.


----------



## sanari (Aug 23, 2011)

I make my decisions quickly. I input the data of a situation, and my Ni computer spits out a decision that floats around until I speak it.

I'm still working on learning the terms that are common around here.

By the way, I cannot find the quiz or quizzes that show your cognitive function order. Can someone show me? I've been to that particular subforum but I looked at the stickies and did not look at the rest... No go.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer (Sep 7, 2011)

@sanari Yeah I think that is a good explanation. We aren't any less judging. I personally will mull things over for a bit and cone to a conclusion even if that isn't necessarily the best conclusion. If it's not then I will come back to it later when I have more evidence and/or more time to think it through. For example, if I see that my house is dirty, the immediate judgment is that it needs to be cleaned. If I come across an interesting social situation that I have never experienced before, I will explore a few ideas really quickly and make a judgment call. Later, I will revisit the situation in my head and analyze what happened. I think the key difference here is that INTJs will revisit and refine the decisions we make whereas ENTJs don't necessarily do that as much. Okay that didn't come out the way I wanted, but I haven't had my coffee this morning.


----------



## Ozymandias (May 6, 2011)

> I think the key difference here is that INTJs will revisit and refine the decisions we make whereas ENTJs don't necessarily do that as much.


As a strong user of ENTJ cognitive functions I can say that what you described is exactly how an ENTJ operates. They act upon their decisions (Te) and refine over time (Ni). I don't understand how you could say that INTJ's do this better than ENTJ's. On the contratry INTJ's should Plan intuitively first then act.


----------



## Spades (Aug 31, 2011)

I tend to agree with your statement, but my only data is myself. I'm relatively slow in making decisions but pretty firm once I've made them. I prefer to theorize things extensively first, then put them into action.


----------



## cantstopthinking (Aug 13, 2011)

Ozymandias said:


> That make sense they do come to their judgments quicker but that does imply that they are "more" judging. Where *INTJ's would keep their options open for longer and consider alternate possibilities*.
> 
> If I could get an INTJ perspective on how you guys come to make decisions that would be great.


I wont make concrete decisions until I'm 95% sure i'm right, based on hunch(intuition) & evidence(judgements). All moral & value judgements will come naturally, as if its already absorbed based on Evidence alone... 

Yes, we might be contingency planners, which explains the speed of decision making... but usually when decision is made, it doesn't require much fixing =)

If there's a problem or situation, all loose ends are tied up, action plan is made, then execution.


----------



## Ozymandias (May 6, 2011)

cantstopthinking said:


> I wont make concrete decisions until I'm 95% sure i'm right, based on hunch(intuition) & evidence(judgements). All moral & value judgements will come naturally, as if its already absorbed based on Evidence alone...
> 
> Yes, we might be contingency planners, which explains the speed of decision making... but usually when decision is made, it doesn't require much fixing =)
> 
> If there's a problem or situation, all loose ends are tied up, action plan is made, then execution.



Excellent yes this is the kind of perspective I was looking for! And it agrees with MBTI theory in that INTJ's use Ni>Te in that order.

ENTJ's on the other hand who put greater emphasis on judgement will initiate plans almost immediately. Objectives are defined, goals are set and then efforts are made to drive towards them. Intuition plays it's role just before making a decision, it is a fast process. A bit more time is spent on tweaking the master plan because it is executed on the fly.

The way I see it If there is a problem situation, Execution of a rudimentary plan is made. Perhaps it begins to make more sense as it progresses.

ENTJ: [Problem] > Te solution (logic) > Ni insight + Te tweak > Resolution

Time------------------------------------------------------------------->

INTJ: [Problem] > Ni insight > Te solution (comprehensive) > Resolution


INTJ strengths in this case are: complete contingency plan, minimal error but longer to implement.

ENTJ strengths in this case are: Immediate results in the first draft of the plan, error is reduced over time with Ni insight and efficiency is implemented in all processes.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer (Sep 7, 2011)

Ozymandias said:


> As a strong user of ENTJ cognitive functions I can say that what you described is exactly how an ENTJ operates. They act upon their decisions (Te) and refine over time (Ni). I don't understand how you could say that INTJ's do this better than ENTJ's. On the contratry INTJ's should Plan intuitively first then act.


The difference is that ENTJs naturally thrive doin this whereas INTJs prefer to think things through. However, given a situation where we have to make a snap decision, we can do so adeptly. I still wouldn't say ENTJs make more judgments though. Most of my judgments happen very fast.


----------



## Ozymandias (May 6, 2011)

mkeath said:


> The difference is that ENTJs naturally thrive doin this whereas INTJs prefer to think things through. However, given a situation where we have to make a snap decision, we can do so adeptly. I still wouldn't say ENTJs make more judgments though. Most of my judgments happen very fast.


Maybe you're an ENTJ. Have you ever considered it?


----------



## MegaTuxRacer (Sep 7, 2011)

Yes I have. I am not. I am merely saying that, when forced, INTJs are more than capable of making a good decision based on the situation very quickly. Just because it is not the way that I am more comfortable with doesn't mean I am bad at doing it. I am just better at having the time to think things through. ENTJs and INTJs just draw conclusions differently. Also, everyone is different. I happen to be an INTJ that can make good snap judgments. Are all INTJs like that? No. Do I believe we all possess the ability? Yes. Is it more developed in some than others? Absolutely. It's not that ENTJs make more judgments. It's that ENTJs tend to make more quality judgments quicker. 

I know what you are talking about though. I have an entj grandfather. I had an INTJ grandfather. My dad is an INTJ. Every test I have taken has typed me INTJ. I identify as INTJ. I am an INTJ.


----------

