# Introverted triple assertive? (378)



## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

Hey everybody, I've just joined this forum, although I've read more than a few threads on here. So I've got a question that I just can't find the answer to anywhere. I know for sure that I am an introvert (ISTP), albeit an rather outgoing one. I also know that my enneagram tritype is 3-7w8-8w7 (Haven't discovered wing for 3 yet). Yet every single description I've ever found on the 378 is that they're the epitome of extroversion, which I am not. So I guess what I'm asking is what what an introverted triple assertive look like? How would they differ from an extroverted one? Thank you so much for any help!


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## Gilly (Apr 22, 2012)

Any possibility your wings are off a bit? Like 7w8-8w9? Id say throwing in 6/9 adds a bit more distance to a very outgoing personality. 
Can you describe your level of extroversion? I don't think you should be looking for what anyone type is. But look at yourself. Everyone is different. Trying to fit in a box is silly and the boxes are ever changing because we're ever changing. 

To to some extent anyways


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## sucrilhos (Apr 18, 2015)

Have you ever watched Mad Men?

Don Draper seems like a good example of an introverted triple assertive (although I'm not really sure about his MBTI)


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Strong Bulk Brah said:


> Hey everybody, I've just joined this forum, although I've read more than a few threads on here. So I've got a question that I just can't find the answer to anywhere. I know for sure that I am an introvert (ISTP), albeit an rather outgoing one. I also know that my enneagram tritype is 3-7w8-8w7 (Haven't discovered wing for 3 yet). Yet every single description I've ever found on the 378 is that they're the epitome of extroversion, which I am not. So I guess what I'm asking is what what an introverted triple assertive look like? How would they differ from an extroverted one? Thank you so much for any help!


I understand where you are coming from, but when enneagram literature speaks of the 378 being the extroverted or id types, they mean it more in terms of where the focal point of these types lie and how they orient themselves in the world. In a sense, all three of these types are kind of go-getters, and they like to interact with the environment in a way the other types do not. All of them overly focus on what resides outside of themselves as opposed to being introspective or focusing on their inner reality. Calling them extroverts in this regard is a bit of a misnomer, imo, since it's not applicable in a colloquial sense. This especially applies to type 2 which also shares this quality along with possibly type 9, and one could argue perhaps 2 should honestly replace 3 in this regard except that it would break the symmetry of the system.

Anyway, as for how this kind of type would look like, I wouldn't focus so much on social introversion/extroversion, as much as I would focus on how important it is to control your environment. 3s seek recognition, achievement and a sense of accomplishment from those around them and in their environment, so they will set out goals to achieve this. Similarly, 7s tend to occupy themselves with distractions so they won't think about or linger too much on what they find to be unpleasant. 8s are also action-oriented in how they seek stimulation, though theirs is more a focus on doing by taking action. A 7 can for example be quite content in seeking escape in their own minds. 

Hope that helps.


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

Gilly said:


> Any possibility your wings are off a bit? Like 7w8-8w9? Id say throwing in 6/9 adds a bit more distance to a very outgoing personality.
> Can you describe your level of extroversion? I don't think you should be looking for what anyone type is. But look at yourself. Everyone is different. Trying to fit in a box is silly and the boxes are ever changing because we're ever changing.
> 
> To to some extent anyways


7w8 for sure, know wayyy that wing is a 7w6 lol. Havent looked too much into 8w9 doe. I would say that I definitely don't fit any description of an introvert I've ever read. Prefer to be around people, enjoy parties, enjoy doing things rather than thinking about them, etc.. But I can just as easily spend weeks in solitude getting stuff done, researching for whatever project im working on, goal I'm working towards. I think I said about three sentences total up until I turned 16, then everything turned around.


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

I haven't yet sucrilhos, although now I probably will.


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

Entropic said:


> I understand where you are coming from, but when enneagram literature speaks of the 378 being the extroverted or id types, they mean it more in terms of where the focal point of these types lie and how they orient themselves in the world. In a sense, all three of these types are kind of go-getters, and they like to interact with the environment in a way the other types do not. All of them overly focus on what resides outside of themselves as opposed to being introspective or focusing on their inner reality. Calling them extroverts in this regard is a bit of a misnomer, imo, since it's not applicable in a colloquial sense. This especially applies to type 2 which also shares this quality along with possibly type 9, and one could argue perhaps 2 should honestly replace 3 in this regard except that it would break the symmetry of the system.
> 
> Anyway, as for how this kind of type would look like, I wouldn't focus so much on social introversion/extroversion, as much as I would focus on how important it is to control your environment. 3s seek recognition, achievement and a sense of accomplishment from those around them and in their environment, so they will set out goals to achieve this. Similarly, 7s tend to occupy themselves with distractions so they won't think about or linger too much on what they find to be unpleasant. 8s are also action-oriented in how they seek stimulation, though theirs is more a focus on doing by taking action. A 7 can for example be quite content in seeking escape in their own minds.
> 
> Hope that helps.


Definitely helps, although if you could humor me, what would be the difference between this type in regards to social introversion/extroversion? If that makes sense lol


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## Gilly (Apr 22, 2012)

What you describe sounds like it works perfectly well with your type to me. An extrovert with goals. The only extrovert that I can really think of as, perhaps flighty, would be a extremely strong 7. I know a lot of people with strong 7. I love 7s. They know how to have fun and fun is what I need to keep out of my own head. 

Just because someone is extroverted doesn't mean they cant be quiet. They may not feel like something is worth saying. Or it might ruin the fun. 

Also an 8 and a 3 both like to get things done.


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

Gilly said:


> What you describe sounds like it works perfectly well with your type to me. An extrovert with goals. The only extrovert that I can really think of as, perhaps flighty, would be a extremely strong 7. I know a lot of people with strong 7. I love 7s. They know how to have fun and fun is what I need to keep out of my own head.
> 
> Just because someone is extroverted doesn't mean they cant be quiet. They may not feel like something is worth saying. Or it might ruin the fun.
> 
> Also an 8 and a 3 both like to get things done.


I worded my response to you rather poorly. What I meant when I said that I dont fit the description of an introvert, is that I'm very outgoing... But still an introvert. I do end up needing to retreat back into my head at SOME point, no matter how much I try to resist it lol.

Edit: Ive always related to 3 so/sx more than 7. Core fear is still being worthless, but can still end up "falling off my path" with fun.


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## JusticeBreaker (Apr 29, 2015)

As long as I know, any MBTI can be any Enneatype (Including Tritype). I'm a 7w8-8w7-3w2 sx/so and INTJ, and like you i'm outgoing but still need to retreat at some point. And i'm pretty sure there's more of us introverted 378 in PeRC.

As for the extraversion part, I'm pretty sure it doesn't refer to talking 24/7 (tho you, as well as me, probably do) but rather in the focus and/or activities you do, and how you interact with problems and such. When the situation is getting hard, things are getting fun, won't you agree?


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## tanstaafl28 (Sep 10, 2012)

No more unusual than an extroverted 584.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Strong Bulk Brah said:


> Definitely helps, although if you could humor me, what would be the difference between this type in regards to social introversion/extroversion? If that makes sense lol


No real bearing or impact, since I don't think the enneagram relates to social introversion/extroversion as a whole. You could argue there is a loose correlation where withdrawn types are more likely to be introverted than not, but then again, that's not a hard rule. It's better to see the systems as separate ideas.


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## angelfish (Feb 17, 2011)

3w4 is typically going to be significantly more introverted than 3w2. More time in anaylsis, reflection, self-contemplation. 3w2 is more of a "doer". ISTP is introverted but usually very active and independent; 378 is not at all incomprehensible. But I would guess 3w4 much more likely than 3w2.


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

JusticeBreaker said:


> As long as I know, any MBTI can be any Enneatype (Including Tritype). I'm a 7w8-8w7-3w2 sx/so and INTJ, and like you i'm outgoing but still need to retreat at some point. And i'm pretty sure there's more of us introverted 378 in PeRC.
> 
> As for the extraversion part, I'm pretty sure it doesn't refer to talking 24/7 (tho you, as well as me, probably do) but rather in the focus and/or activities you do, and how you interact with problems and such. When the situation is getting hard, things are getting fun, won't you agree?


I have to imagine you are the only 7w8 INTJ on the planet. And yeah, I would say I'm usually working towars SOMETHING. It might be a different thing every three weeks, but something nonetheless lol. God knows I can talk a hole through a wall


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

angelfish said:


> 3w4 is typically going to be significantly more introverted than 3w2. More time in anaylsis, reflection, self-contemplation. 3w2 is more of a "doer". ISTP is introverted but usually very active and independent; 378 is not at all incomprehensible. But I would guess 3w4 much more likely than 3w2.


Yeah, I remember reading somewhere that Fe types are usually 3w2. But the only intorverted 3 examples I've been able to find are Tom Cruise (ISTP 3w4) and Arnold Schwarzenegger (INTJ 3w2)... So that hasn't helped me narrow it down at all. lol


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## periwinklepromise (Jan 26, 2015)

Strong Bulk Brah said:


> I have to imagine you are the only 7w8 INTJ on the planet.


This typing is actually not at all uncommon on PerC


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## Whitewolf (Sep 21, 2015)

Enneagram is not tied to personality...or, better: it's tied to the source of our conflicts and our principal fears.
Let's take me: I'm a 215. Therefore, my three fears are: to be unliked, to be unmoral and to not understand.
Now, if you see, the second two are tied to my internal life. That's a little logical: the more someone is concentrated on external life, the more he will be afraid about meditation and so on.
Now, let's take Ariel, my daemon (ISFP). He has got 962: he wants peace, safeness and love. This time there are all three (two and half) tied to external.

If you are introverted and have a triple external "fear", that's nothing so odd: simply means your fears come from external reality, while you try to win it using your internal resources.
On the other hand, I've mostly "introverted fears". So, I try to win my phantoms with external activities. 
Therefore (it's a pure supposition) you may be likeable to face a very strong imposition of sedentary work, into analysing it and working out the way to go away as quickly as you can XP, while I'll face an ununderstandable and wrong hostility into acting toward the other and change his mind.
Let's switch the tritypes, shall we? I get ENFJ 378, and you get ISTP 215. Therefore, I express with the "right" words my disagreement, while you try to analize the situation.

that's how it change: MBTI=strategy, enneagram=motivation/energy.


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## angelfish (Feb 17, 2011)

Strong Bulk Brah said:


> Yeah, I remember reading somewhere that Fe types are usually 3w2. But the only intorverted 3 examples I've been able to find are Tom Cruise (ISTP 3w4) and Arnold Schwarzenegger (INTJ 3w2)... So that hasn't helped me narrow it down at all. lol


So do you identify as 3w2? I don't remember you having that in your profile when I commented; my apologies if you did. 

I think dominant and auxiliary Fe types are more likely to be 3w2, but I have an ENFJ friend who is easily a clear 3w4. In fact, I think I know two ENFJ 3w4s. I would say it is fairly unusual for Ti dom/aux to identify as being 2s or having 2 wings, though I certainly don't discount the possibility. I think the issue that typically arises is Ti dom/aux's Judgment is very internal-logic-based, which seems to often run contrary to Enneagram 2's tendency to take on others' burdens as one's own. 

Regarding 3 in ISTPs, I don't know if @Fanille is still around, but they identified as ISTP 3w4. 

I do know both my INTP dad and ISTP little brother, though neither are 3s, both bear traits of 3 - I am pretty certain my dad's tritype would be 5w6-3w4-9w1, while my brother is a 9w8, and I imagine his tritype to be 9w8-5w4-3w? - I'm not sure where his 3 wing would fall. He may well be 3w2. My dad has always been an overachiever. He was the eldest, won numerous academic prizes as a kid, went to an Ivy for med school, and is very skilled at his hobbies. But there's also a lot of personal-emotional pushback in him. He's tense with his parents, who he feels tried to push him to be something he wasn't (his parents used to make the kids perform in "friendly" competitions, which he hated). I know he also feels self-frustration and contempt for not being more skilled at times. He's hard on himself. In my brother, 3 shows up more in the way he presents - he always wants to look nice, dress well - plus his haircut, watch, and so on. He's an overachiever in his own right, though it's less pronounced than with Dad. He garners awards, too, but it's more as a matter of course than a longterm goal, and he's less set on a clear path in comparison to Dad at his age. Of course there are plenty of other differences that may impact them, including N-S, instinct variant, and 5w4 vs 5w6, but hopefully it's useful for you to see the elements of 3 in them along with being IxTPs. 

I think what ends up happening is removing the "overlays" - consider that for 3 E will give a more "social" and "gregarious" overlay; F will yield a more "warm" and "charming" overlay; J will yield a more "planning" and "decisive" overlay. Once you remove those elements from 3 descriptions, you are left with more of a backbone of what an IxTP 3 will look like: an ambitious, success-oriented, competency-focused, socially smooth, action-oriented, task-focused person. 

So then in terms of w2 vs w4 - 

With 3w2, the type traits are more "supportive" of one another; they run together more. Both numbers pull outwards. 3's desire for success and achievement tends to bring them into the social world, where their 2 wing is likely to be satisfied and to shine. 3's inherent competitiveness is tempered by the 2ish desire to genuinely serve others, while 2's tendency to subvert ego is tempered by 3's drive to stand out. At the same time, 3 and 2 together can be doubly repressive of a person's internal emotional life, so 3w2 is more likely to have repressed their own deeply personal traits and desires in favor of winning merit with others. 

In 3w4, the numbers have some resistance. 3 pulls outward, while 4 draws inward. 3w4s tend to have a "unique" streak, because they don't fully repress the less popularly-appealing side of themselves. 3 still leads, so they tend to draw that uniqueness into their creation of a self-image. They therefore tend to have a more intentional self-presentation than 3w2, who can sort of "surf" their own charm. 3w4 can certainly play the social game, too, but it's more aware, more of a gap between when they're in "on" mode with the crowd and retreating into reflection and aesthetics. 

So one way that can help you identify is to consider how fluid you feel in moving between your self and others. For 3w4s it's a more more self-conscious, self-aware transition; for 3w2s it's more fluid. 3w4 spends more time intentionally thinking about their personality, their traits, how they present themselves. 3w2 spends more time thinking about others and how they can cooperate with others in a way that makes the 3w2 stand out. Both are goal-oriented but 3w4 is more likely to have very personal, streamlined goals. 3w2 is more likely to have more fluid goals because their external arena will tend to have a greater influence on what they are aiming for. One final distinction is the nature of your frustration. 3w4s are going to spend more time in self-contempt, while 3w2s aren't really drawn there. 

So, this should all apply regardless of your MBTI type. It can definitely be challenging to separate the two. I know that a lot of my less INFP-like traits are accounted for by 6w7, but it took me a long time to figure out my type because the average 6 is not an INFP - probably an ISTJ or ISFJ. Likewise, your average 3 is probably an ENTP or ENFJ, so as an ISTP you're going to have to consider how you might "look" different than the average 3, even though your motivations will remain the same.


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

angelfish said:


> So do you identify as 3w2? I don't remember you having that in your profile when I commented; my apologies if you did.
> 
> I think dominant and auxiliary Fe types are more likely to be 3w2, but I have an ENFJ friend who is easily a clear 3w4. In fact, I think I know two ENFJ 3w4s. I would say it is fairly unusual for Ti dom/aux to identify as being 2s or having 2 wings, though I certainly don't discount the possibility. I think the issue that typically arises is Ti dom/aux's Judgment is very internal-logic-based, which seems to often run contrary to Enneagram 2's tendency to take on others' burdens as one's own.
> 
> ...


Everytime I think I've got a good grasp on what my wing is, someone comes along and messes it up. lol and as far as the 3w2 in my profile, I think I've changed the wing 3 or 4 times since joining a few days ago. I'm not sure I'm nearly introspective enough to pick specific traits of mine (that are actually real) to pick a wing. So instead I'll provide a story. As I've said several times on here, up until age 16 or 17 I was rather socially awkward. I've always been more of a groups person rather than a one on one, alot more energy to give and take from in groups. But I remember in middle school, thinking that if I can't rely on my own charm to get where I want to be socially, then I'll just use someone elses. Ended up befriending one of the most popular kids in the school (dem 7th grade machiavellian tactics) and basically riding on his fame. Did the same thing in the freshman year of highschool. Found the most influential people in the activities I was involved in and attached my self to them. Now, eventually I got alot better with social situations (I presume from aux Se coming up?) and can hold my own in one on one, although I still am much better in groups. So I guess my point is wouldn't that be more reflective of a w2? And on that same note, what would a 3w4 so/sx look like as compared to a 3w2 so/sx?


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## Strong Bulk Brah (Oct 23, 2015)

periwinklepromise said:


> This typing is actually not at all uncommon on PerC


Color me surprised.


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