# Assuming only one possibility: Do you want to be happy or change the world?



## Longdove (Jan 4, 2011)

Change the world, I never had any problem being unhappy, and in any case I already am (happy) so that's why the other option is more viable.


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## Leeoflittlefaith (Dec 8, 2010)

I'll change the world. Then I'll live a downward-spiralling life of hedonism. How romantic. Hopefully people will write a few plays about me.


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## Spades (Aug 31, 2011)

Happiness is a mindset. All it takes is the ability to change your perspective.

Since the poll explicitly states "*Assuming only one possibility*", I would rather be happy and not change the world than unhappy and change the world.
(Though I don't believe you don't change the world. You do so by being here, period).


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## AussieChick (Dec 27, 2010)

Where's The SJ option?????. I couldn't vote because this wasn't avilable as a choice.I want to be truly happy because you can't change the world if the people in it are opposed to change.


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## Dylio (Jul 4, 2011)

ST's must be content with how the world is. Why fix something that isn't broken? Happiness is a more rewarding effort in my mind.


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## Mulberries (Feb 17, 2011)

The two can't be separated for me. Given that much of my unhappiness stems from the way the world currently is (and will be in the future), I would probably be a lot happier if I could change it to something that fits in better with my vision. 

Living is blissful ignorance is not my idea of true happiness.


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## MilkyWay132 (Jul 15, 2010)

I'd prefer to change the world. Simply being happy wouldn't be enough for me, and besides making a positive impact on the world would make me happy anyway. And besides..even if the world didn't completely change in a positive way, wouldn't things get boring if they just stayed the same? Change is inevitable, just like death. We can't prevent it.


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## Questor (Mar 9, 2012)

Whether we are happy or not, each of us in some way WILL change the world, as someone else just mentioned. The byproduct of being happy would be having a positive effect on the world instead of a negative one. 

It is hard to make someone else happy and not lift your own spirits at the same time, so a byproduct of making the world a better place is happiness.

Its Win-Win. Isn't that great!!!


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

"married to the money fuck the world that's adultery" Words of Wisdom from Lil Wayne


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

Spades said:


> Happiness is a mindset. All it takes is the ability to change your perspective.
> 
> Since the poll explicitly states "*Assuming only one possibility*", I would rather be happy and not change the world than unhappy and change the world.
> (Though I don't believe you don't change the world. You do so by being here, period).


I don't agree with this, there are different kinds of happiness and only some can be experienced by simply changing your internal state. some different types (some of which I personally don't care about and others I lust after) including
- accomplishing a goal
- making progress toward a goal
- exciting intellectual stimulation
- sensual connection
- feeling like you belong
- the satisfaction that comes from being internally consistent with your values
- appreciating what you have
- attaining something you want
- hedonistic pleasure
- competitive excitement 

only about half of these can be attained from just changing your perspective. you can't appreciate having a comfortable house, fine wine and an sexual intimacy if you don't have a comfortable house, fine wine and a sexually stimulating partner.


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## Spades (Aug 31, 2011)

@Swordsman of Mana

Good points, I hadn't considered different kinds of happiness. I was thinking of the sense of contentment that comes from within, an overall appreciation and enjoyment of life. Of course, even though I consider myself happy, I *still* seek the things you mention, because they make life *even* better. And it's a lot easier to be happy when you have freedom and good friends, than when you're being tortured or abused, for sure.


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

Spades said:


> @Swordsman of Mana
> 
> Good points, I hadn't considered different kinds of happiness. I was thinking of the sense of contentment that comes from within, an overall appreciation and enjoyment of life. Of course, even though I consider myself happy, I *still* seek the things you mention, because they make life *even* better. And it's a lot easier to be happy when you have freedom and good friends, than when you're being tortured or abused, for sure.


I think a balance of intrinsic and extrinsic motivation is the key to a balanced, fulfilled and happy life


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## Traum (Jan 3, 2012)

Odd how Fs so far want to be happy and Ts want to change the world. I would figure it'd be the opposite, as feelers tend to be more compassionate... but then again, maybe a feeler has had an emotionally hard life and just want to be happy, whereas a thinker may logically see that the world needs changed. :happy:


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

Happiness to me is extremely visceral - it is or it isn't, basically. Otherwise, it just becomes an abstract mess of discussion that could be better spent on other topics, imo. Ego satisfaction and happiness go hand in hand - happiness comes from the ego syntonic, basically. Changing the world is one of my ideas of happiness - they go hand-in-hand.


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## Bazinga187 (Aug 7, 2011)

I don't think that changing the world is a realistic aspiration and I've never desired the power that comes with it. It's one thing to want to help people, but change the world? No. Being happy is a more attainable goal and I prefer the outcome of choosing that pathway.


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## liza_200 (Nov 13, 2010)

Change the world, and make it a better place.


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## Sequestrum (Sep 11, 2011)

Neurasthenia said:


> Assuming these options are mutually exclusive, that would imply that the person would have to be truly selfless in changing the world (assuming the option is to change the world _for the benefit of humanity_).


Why does this imply that someone has to be selfless? Gaining a few moments of happiness does not mean that one lead a happy life, or that one is happy with their life. These are temporary emotions that fade.



> I am by no stretch of the imagination selfless, and thus could never selflessly give. Giving and doing "good" for others provides me some satisfaction, which means that in giving I am happy, which means that I could not apply myself to the second option.


Again, why does gaining a temporary emotion of satisfaction mean that the act was not selfless? Selfless does not mean that you didn't gain anything, it means that your motivations were centered more around the concern of others rather than centered around concern for yourself.



> I, an INTP, would choose to be happy (assuming I could not relinquish my current human "selfishness").
> 
> If you're trying to tease out "statistics" on selfishness/generosity by temperament, you might need to work on the phrasing of the question/options a bit. I don't care what type one is, everybody here has almost definitely not achieved true selflessness; we all gain some satisfaction (happiness) from giving. Some might feel negatively about giving, but I doubt that anyone here can give without gaining something themselves (though I am open to hearing any disputes).


The question doesn't imply you must never experience happiness in your pursuit of your goal. That is something that you derived all on your own, which is fine, part of the fun of questions like these is to see how variously it is interpreted. However, gaining satisfaction and purpose from causing change in the world may or may not fill all the criteria required of a person's subjective ideal of happiness. For example, if they wanted a loving partner and family, but never achieved this due to their concern with their goals, they may very well have achieved their goals, but may not have achieved their subjective ideal of happiness. Conversely, if a person's subjective ideal of happiness is to change the world, then they might have achieved both selfishly.

I don't think this is meant to determine who is selfish and who is not. I think it is more to determine who is willing to sacrifice. Additionally, sacrificing your happiness may very well mean that you are sacrificing the happiness of someone else as well, so one cannot say that a person who sacrifices happiness is any more or less selfish than someone who does not. Something like that would have to be determined based on many other factors that simply were not included in the question.


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## intrasearching (Jul 15, 2011)

Sequestrum said:


> Why does this imply that someone has to be selfless? Gaining a few moments of happiness does not mean that one lead a happy life, or that one is happy with their life. These are temporary emotions that fade.
> 
> 
> Again, why does gaining a temporary emotion of satisfaction mean that the act was not selfless? Selfless does not mean that you didn't gain anything, it means that your motivations were centered more around the concern of others rather than centered around concern for yourself.
> ...


These are all fair points and considering them I may have to amend my response to the question.


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## alionsroar (Jun 5, 2010)

ISTP. I'd choose to be happy. I don't see the point in changing the world if I'm still going to be unhappy.
But if I answered the OP's friend's question, I would say I would want to change the world before I die. Because I think that would bring happiness.


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## xKZx (Feb 17, 2012)

We need more SFs in this site. Otherwise no statistic can be made sufficient. I wanted them to make a huge "Be Happy" bar, but that impotent thing just doesn't get higher. Darn!


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## spiderfrommars (Feb 22, 2012)

Happy. I want to figure out who I am/what I'm "meant for", and to fulfill my potential. I have never really longed to change the world.


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## Zyforb (Jan 22, 2012)

I'd rather change the world. A purely hedonistic life is a wasted one, in my INTP-flavored eyes. Though I'd rather be left to my own, knowledge-gathering devices.


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## Astralis (Oct 23, 2011)

I think it's possible to change world by being happy. If you could spread happiness and joy around, wouldn't that be good?


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## electricky (Feb 18, 2011)

JungyesMBTIno said:


> Happiness to me is extremely visceral - it is or it isn't, basically. Otherwise, it just becomes an abstract mess of discussion that could be better spent on other topics, imo. Ego satisfaction and happiness go hand in hand - happiness comes from the ego syntonic, basically. Changing the world is one of my ideas of happiness - they go hand-in-hand.


Exactly. This hypothetical creates two conditions that do not occur in reality: that one's happiness cannot change the world, and that changing the world cannot create happiness. The first one denies the universal principle of causation, and the second denies the nature of many, many people. So yeah, of course this is a hypothetical and doesn't really happen. But then for this hypothetical to happen, and for change in the world to not make me happy, would essentially make me another person, so how can I answer this even hypothetically from the person that I am now?

(watches as the hypothetical explodes)

(Runs off happily to change the world)


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## Sequestrum (Sep 11, 2011)

ElectricSparkle said:


> Exactly. This hypothetical creates two conditions that do not occur in reality: that one's happiness cannot change the world, and that changing the world cannot create happiness. The first one denies the universal principle of causation, and the second denies the nature of many, many people. So yeah, of course this is a hypothetical and doesn't really happen. But then for this hypothetical to happen, and for change in the world to not make me happy, would essentially make me another person, so how can I answer this even hypothetically from the person that I am now?
> 
> (watches as the hypothetical explodes)
> 
> (Runs off happily to change the world)


A way to apply this hypothetical situation to your particular situation:
1.) Imagine that changing the world as you see it leads to consequences that you did not intend that you cannot be happy about.
2.) Alternatively, imagine that your happiness has no affect on an apathetic society, and does nothing to change the world.

This is a hypothetical situation, use your imagination. You don't have to believe that the two situations could never occur, that is not being asked of you. Just imagine that no matter what you do (change the world or be happy), fate will throw a curve ball at you just for kicks so that the second option does not occur.


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## electricky (Feb 18, 2011)

Sequestrum said:


> A way to apply this hypothetical situation to your particular situation:
> 1.) Imagine that changing the world as you see it leads to consequences that you did not intend that you cannot be happy about.
> 2.) Alternatively, imagine that your happiness has no affect on an apathetic society, and does nothing to change the world.
> 
> This is a hypothetical situation, use your imagination. You don't have to believe that the two situations could never occur, that is not being asked of you. Just imagine that no matter what you do (change the world or be happy), fate will throw a curve ball at you just for kicks so that the second option does not occur.


Yeah, what I am saying is that of course we treat the situation as non-reality because it's hypothetical..... in response to a lot of the responses that are treating this as something that actually happens.

To (1), that would involve the action of changing the world killing me before I realized that I changed it. So yes, I suppose I would rather live.

To (2), if all of society is _that_ apathetic, the world is pretty much destroyed already. (Plus, that isn't the world, it's people.) Option 1 is more appealing now, but then I kind of want to live still...

_I've imagined this..... it's pretty much a trap whichever way you hang it_ :laughing:


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## xKZx (Feb 17, 2012)

ElectricSparkle said:


> Yeah, what I am saying is that of course we treat the situation as non-reality because it's hypothetical..... in response to a lot of the responses that are treating this as something that actually happens.
> 
> To (1), that would involve the action of changing the world killing me before I realized that I changed it. So yes, I suppose I would rather live.
> 
> ...


I think you are using the N bit too much. The question in my first post was : What to you want to do in your life before you die? to which people replied these things. Obviously no matter what I do, I will be happy in my life and I will change something in the world definitely. Just by existing that will happen. 

If you ask this question to yourself. What is your answer? Is it a family , round the world travel maybe [be happy]. Or is it making my country patriotic, feeding the poor or maybe giving people education etc. [change the world]. It is not that complicated.


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## Deathbagel (Feb 18, 2012)

Well... I guess it depends on how you look at this really. I voted change the world, but not because I'm selfless and want everyone else to be happy, the truth is I want to be remembered, and I want to be remembered well. Happiness is great and all, and of course I strive for it too (and have already experienced it as we all have, if not in its purest form). However, the memory of myself as a great man throughout centuries of posterity while my own 80 or so years on the planet were miserable is a more tantalizing option to me than dying in blissful unimportance.


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## Master Mind (Aug 15, 2011)

Change the world. I haven't really been "happy" the majority of my life anyway to this point, so it doesn't really matter now. However, I have much personal experience on how much the world sucks, and there are definitely things that need changing. My own personal happiness is really irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. After I die, what will it matter? However, to change the world for the better is something that will benefit others after I am gone. I wish for things to be better for future generations than they were for me.


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## KittyKraz13 (Jan 3, 2012)

Astralis said:


> I think it's possible to change world by being happy. If you could spread happiness and joy around, wouldn't that be good?


The way the original question was phrased means that if you are happy, you can't change the world. It's a polarized _hypothetical _question, saying you must have one or the other without having both.

I'd rather change the world than be happy.


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## Dark Romantic (Dec 27, 2011)

Hm... I've changed my mind. I would much, much rather change the world than engage in meaningless happiness. Changing the world would bring purpose, and _real_ happiness, rather than nihilistic complacency.


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## skycloud86 (Jul 15, 2009)

I want to change the world for the better, and it'll make me happy by doing so.


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## CrabbyPaws (Mar 5, 2012)

I'd rather be happy in a shitty world than be unhappy in a perfect world.


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

Dark Romantic said:


> Hm... I've changed my mind. I would much, much rather change the world than engage in meaningless happiness. Changing the world would bring purpose, and _real_ happiness, rather than nihilistic complacency.


clearly you're more integrated than me lol

that said, you wouldn't be able to enjoy the happiness of changing the world if you only were given one option (let's say they kill all the serotonin cells in your brain)
PS: my opinion hasn't changed from the Lil Wayne quote in my avatar


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## Zero11 (Feb 7, 2010)

If I were happy I wouldn´t want to change the world. :dry:
Dissatisfaction leads to the desire for a better situation and so to a change.


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## Zero11 (Feb 7, 2010)

CrabbyPaws said:


> I'd rather be happy in a shitty world than be unhappy in a perfect world.


Feelers and logic especially INFPs :dry: unhappy in a perfect world :laughing:

You can´t be unhappy in a perfect world if you were unhappy it wouldn´t be a perfect world.


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## Dark Romantic (Dec 27, 2011)

Swordsman of Mana said:


> clearly you're more integrated than me lol
> 
> that said, you wouldn't be able to enjoy the happiness of changing the world if you only were given one option (let's say they kill all the serotonin cells in your brain)
> PS: my opinion hasn't changed from the Lil Wayne quote in my avatar


It has less to do with the future of the world, and more to do with the desire for self-actualization. If I were self-actualized, I would be unable to exist in simplicity; I would need to put all my talents to work in a way that brought me satisfaction, and this would necessarily lead to _real_ happiness, rather than complacency. Because I do, in fact, have considerable potential, this would be likely to have the effect of changing the world.

However, given the scenario you've put forward, it would carry little meaning for me to change the world if I got nothing out of it. Therefore, I would choose happiness in actualization over meaningless reform.


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## U-80 (Mar 12, 2010)

It's totally obvious to me what people need to do to make the world a better place. It's also obvious to me that they will never do it. So I don't see any point in going down that road. 

I look at the world for what it is: a shitty place that I'm stuck in for a while. I try to make the most of it in whatever way I can. That's plenty enough challenge as it is.


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## CrabbyPaws (Mar 5, 2012)

Zero11 said:


> Feelers and logic especially INFPs :dry: unhappy in a perfect world :laughing:
> 
> You can´t be unhappy in a perfect world if you were unhappy it wouldn´t be a perfect world.


Hahahaha yeah I guess, but I guess I was thinking about perfect as in externally, and I don't think just because it might be nice externally (everyone is rich, peace, no famine/war etc) doesn't necessarily mean you will be perfectly happy internally(rich but lonely, alone etc)? I dunno :tongue:


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## DreamStepper (Feb 27, 2012)

I would change the world.


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## Chell (Dec 25, 2009)

Um, it's funny that.. I'm (probably) NF and answered 'be happy' quickly, almost automatically, because I tend to think that changing the world to however I want it to be would be such a big stretch and wouldn't do much good anyway, I mean, the end would be to make myself happy. Only then it ocurred to me that being happy all the time isn't an option either, and if we're to be this idealistic I guess changing the world is better because nobody is ever satisfied so let's make a world where everybody, including myself, is satisfied and happy always.  ..so yeah it feels like a trick question, like, in a 'which came first, the chicken or the egg?' way. um.
what am I saying


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## hailfire (Dec 16, 2012)

ST, and be happy. Why? simple: it's one of the very few things in my life that I'm relatively close to being guaranteed to. Changing the world isn't.


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## VioletTru (Jun 24, 2012)

Since I'm both depressed and have selfish desires/needs, I'd rather choose happiness. Being happy can also make me more altruistic.


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## Dark Romantic (Dec 27, 2011)

I reject the notion that happiness means not changing the world.


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## Iustinus (Jun 13, 2012)

I'd change the world. My happiness is, in the background of seven billion people, irrelevant.


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## Mmmm (Jul 6, 2012)

It's impossible to change the world. I would love it if I could be happy. I don't think I have ever been _really _happy. It comes in spurts like when I'm on vacation or when starting to crush on someone. All very fleeting & temporary but nothing lasting for me. I wonder what's the longest period of time someone has felt 'HAPPY'?


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## HippoHunter94 (Jan 19, 2012)

Changing the world would make me happy. :3


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## TheProcrastinatingMaster (Jun 4, 2012)

Changing the world for the better would make me happy, or at least satisfied.


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## Cassieopeia (Jan 9, 2012)

I just knew, before I voted, that the xNTx's would be the ones to want to change the world over being happy.


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