# Who would win in a fight to the death?



## tooboku (Jun 9, 2010)

All else being equal; same class starship, same crew complement, same resources.

Who would win a battle to the death? The Star Trek TOS crew or the TNG crew? Kirck vs Picard, Spock vs Riker, Uhura vs Troi, Chekov vs Data, Sulu vs Worf, Scotty vs La Forge, McCoy vs Crusher...

If you want to throw in some DS9 and VOY, go for it.


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## skycloud86 (Jul 15, 2009)

Probably TNG, as it occurs a century later and due to technological advances, they probably have much better weaponry and defences.


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## Emerson (Mar 13, 2011)

Picard and Spok would team up and destroy them all.


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## absentminded (Dec 3, 2010)

tooboku said:


> All else being equal; same class starship, same crew complement, *same resources*.





skycloud86 said:


> Probably TNG, as it occurs a century later and due to technological advances, they probably have much better weaponry and defences.


Picard always struck me as a more intelligent/tactically-inclined commander than Kirk. I'd go with TNG, because they'd outmaneuver TOS.

Spock would definitely own Riker, though. :mellow:


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## tooboku (Jun 9, 2010)

Poor Riker. He has to be the weakest link on that crew 

I've heard people pointing to Scotty as the weakest link on the TOS crew but he'll pwn Jordie any day and really the weakest is probably Chekov... who is pitted against the strongest link on the TNG roster, Data.

Hmmm... I will say though that the TOS crew is overall a lot more rugged. The only captain that I've seen with half the testicles Kirk had was Janeway. That would be an interesting battle too.


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## PyrLove (Jun 6, 2010)

tooboku said:


> The only captain that I've seen with half the testicles Kirk had was Janeway. That would be an interesting battle too.


Bwahahahahahahaha *gasp* hahahahahahahaha

Janeway was the only thing that made VOY worthwhile.

I was thinking in terms of one-on-one hand combat.
Picard over Kirk because Kirk would lose his temper and make a stupid mistake.
Spock over Riker because Spock is just awesome that way.
Uhura over Troi because Troi is just prissy and wouldn't want to mess up her hair.
Data over Chekov. Duh.
Worf over Sulu because Worf was born to kick ass.
Scotty over LaForge Scotty's a scrapper and LaForge seems lost without something to analyze.
Crusher over McCoy because she'd smile at him and he'd surrender.
Of course, Guinan could take them all.


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## Transcendence (Apr 25, 2011)

Oh God 

Nerd overdose... can't compute... Argh 
*Dies*


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## yaintj (Dec 17, 2010)

No matter who will win, finally Clowns will come with their Volkswagen bubble fleet and crush them.


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## The Proof (Aug 5, 2009)

tooboku said:


> All else being equal; same class starship, same crew complement, same resources.


nobody, it wouldn't be a fight to the death, though it would be a fight of nerdy memes


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## Coburn (Sep 3, 2010)

tooboku said:


> All else being equal; same class starship, same crew complement, same resources.
> 
> Who would win a battle to the death? The Star Trek TOS crew or the TNG crew? Kirck vs Picard, Spock vs Riker, Uhura vs Troi, Chekov vs Data, Sulu vs Worf, Scotty vs La Forge, McCoy vs Crusher...
> 
> If you want to throw in some DS9 and VOY, go for it.


Showdown winners:

Kirk: I think Picard has a really good mind for strategy, but he'd be hard pressed to hold out for a long time against the crazy Captain Kirk. It's like pitting a quarterback against a line defender. The quarterback may be fast, but he's not gonna last long, especially when he gets tired of running...

Spock: I love Riker, but I think Spock would crush in a one on one. Riker just seems a little too overeager to cover all his weaknesses. I think in the moment of truth, he would sacrifice security for opportunity-- which Spock would deduce and use against him.

Uhura: She seems like she'd go Sigourney Weaver on her enemies if given the right opportunity.

Data: Although mind you, this would probably be the least interesting of the fights. Chekov would sneak around, get caught, and then be forced to listen to Data lecture on and on and on about how he broke down Chekov's defenses [or lack thereof]. Point being, this would not be a match to the death.

Worf: Unless Sulu can make the bridge explode sparks from the consoles [that always seemed to knock Worf back about ten feet and disable him as a fighter for a good couple minutes].

Scotty: This would be one hell of a nerd battle. Probably the only pairing here with the most equal footing.

McCoy: Crusher would die.


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## DeductiveReasoner (Feb 25, 2011)

The Doctor.
...Or maybe Indiana Jones.


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## TPlume (Aug 27, 2011)

I always thought data was replacement for spock... ya know 'cold logic'


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## Jennywocky (Aug 7, 2009)

TPlume said:


> I always thought data was replacement for spock... ya know 'cold logic'


Data's positronic brain never had to deal with Pon Farr....


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## Abraxas (May 28, 2011)

USS Defiant shows up and whoops them all.

It's a tough little ship.


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## Popinjay (Sep 19, 2011)

tooboku said:


> All else being equal; same class starship, same crew complement, same resources.
> 
> Who would win a battle to the death? The Star Trek TOS crew or the TNG crew? Kirck vs Picard, Spock vs Riker, Uhura vs Troi, Chekov vs Data, Sulu vs Worf, Scotty vs La Forge, McCoy vs Crusher...
> 
> If you want to throw in some DS9 and VOY, go for it.


I have mad love for TNG but Kirk, no question. Kirk's an ENTJ...he's a shoot-first-ask-questions-once-the-bad-guys-are-at-your-mercy kind of guy. Picard oscillates between ISTJ and INTJ, with SJ crap like "Keep the shields down, Mr. Worf, as a sign of good faith" bull-shit...while the ship gets shot to pieces by cunning Te Romulans who know he's a trusting dipshit.

That, and the Enterprise-D gets beaten by an inferior vessel EVERY FREAKING film (except Nemesis), where Kirk beats the crap out of superior vessels in the original series and beats the crap out of similar-class vessels with an advantage (cloaking device, etc.) in the films.

That, and the Enterprise-D's idea of "return fire" is one shot from the phasers (never a photon torpedo), after getting pounded on for several minutes by an inferior vessel. 

The Enterprise-D is a ship of exploration...of peace...of diplomacy...of stupidity.

The Constellation-class (god, I'm exposing my rampant nerdiness) Enterprise is a traditional warship...exploring but also protecting the vulnerable Federation from bad guys.

Kirk just keeps shooting until the job's done.

Kirk, all the way. ENTJ beats ISTJ...bammo.

Janeway's about as naive and trusting as Picard, but Sisko's much closer to Kirk, IMMHO. I like DS9 because people die...ships get blown up...photon torpedos get shot in huge volleys.

It's not like I have a strong opinion on any of this, though.


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## tooboku (Jun 9, 2010)

Picard has way too much regard for the rules to be anything other than Si. I have no clue why he gets typed as INTJ as often as he does. ISTJs can have gut feelings too just like INTJs can recall from memory. When you look at the more typical examples of INTJs in Star Trek you have Ro Laren, 7 of 9, and Scotty; none of which even remotely resemble Picard. They tend to rely on their own personal logic to determine their ethical decisions - often utilitarian to a fault. Picard is basically every CEO's role model. He plays by the books and almost never makes mistakes. He takes risks but never any "dumb" risks like Kirk, Janeway, Archer, or Sisko ever did. I don't think he can be typed as anything but ISTJ.


... and Kirk is Fe all the way dude. He has way too much sex and although red shirts always die, he has way too much attachment to his crew as a whole. He's probably ENFJ. Chris Pine's Kirk might be ENTJ though.


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## Coburn (Sep 3, 2010)

Popinjay said:


> I have mad love for TNG but Kirk, no question. Kirk's an ENTJ...he's a shoot-first-ask-questions-once-the-bad-guys-are-at-your-mercy kind of guy. Picard oscillates between ISTJ and INTJ, with SJ crap like "Keep the shields down, Mr. Worf, as a sign of good faith" bull-shit...while the ship gets shot to pieces by cunning Te Romulans who know he's a trusting dipshit.
> 
> That, and the Enterprise-D gets beaten by an inferior vessel EVERY FREAKING film (except Nemesis), where Kirk beats the crap out of superior vessels in the original series and beats the crap out of similar-class vessels with an advantage (cloaking device, etc.) in the films.
> 
> ...










[


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## Popinjay (Sep 19, 2011)

tooboku said:


> When you look at the more typical examples of INTJs in Star Trek you have Ro Laren, 7 of 9, and Scotty; none of which even remotely resemble Picard.


Such a good call. I forgot about Archer/Enterprise...he's certainly less of a weeny than Picard although he still seems somewhat naive relative to Kirk or Sisko.



tooboku said:


> ... and Kirk is Fe all the way dude. He has way too much sex and although red shirts always die, he has way too much attachment to his crew as a whole. He's probably ENFJ. Chris Pine's Kirk might be ENTJ though.


You think so? I just watched the episode A Taste of Armageddon last night and he was totally clashing with the air-headed Fe diplomat. But I could see what you're saying, as far as being attached to the crew and so forth. It seems a little muddled. Pine's Kirk seems very ENTJ.


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## tooboku (Jun 9, 2010)

Just because you're using the same functions, doesn't mean you're going to agree all the time. Look at us.

More to the point, I happen to have the full TOS on my computer and am skimming through that episode now. I remember it now. They were having virtual bombs drop and people would report to disintegration chambers so they don't destroy the buildings.

Kirks response was very emotionally extroverted. There was a lot of logic behind it but a well formed argument will always have logical, ethical, and emotional elements in it.

"Death; destruction; disease; horror; that’s what war is all about, Hanan. That's what makes it a thing to be avoided. You've made it neat and painless, so neat and painless you've had no reason to stop it - and you've had it for 500 years. Since it's the only way to say it my crew, my ship; I'm going to end it for you, one way or another."

(Pardon the semi-colons. Kirk has bad grammar and it was hard to make neatly structured sentences. He speaks in a poetic style.)

He's also always clashing with Spock and advocating that it's emotion that makes us human.


On a side note, Scotty kicked butt in that episode.




Popinjay said:


> Pine's Kirk seems very ENTJ.


Yeah, Te was definitely Alternate Kirk's dominant function.


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## Popinjay (Sep 19, 2011)

tooboku said:


> Just because you're using the same functions, doesn't mean you're going to agree all the time. Look at us.


Very true.



tooboku said:


> More to the point, I happen to have the full TOS on my computer and am skimming through that episode now. I remember it now. They were having virtual bombs drop and people would report to disintegration chambers so they don't destroy the buildings.
> 
> Kirks response was very emotionally extroverted. There was a lot of logic behind it but a well formed argument will always have logical, ethical, and emotional elements in it.
> 
> ...


Yeah, you make very good points here.



tooboku said:


> He's also always clashing with Spock and advocating that it's emotion that makes us human.


Yes, although is it Fi or Fe emotion? Fe would have left Spock on Genesis because it was what was best for the collective. Fi valued Spock personally/internally, so he broke every rule in the book to get him back...even putting the rest of his crew in danger (both physically and politically).

Although Spock's a stereotypical INTP, his character supposedly doesn't have (much...he is half human) emotion, so an ENTJ's emotion would be substantially more than a Vulcan.

Also, Kirk does things that involve Te strategy: pretty much everything he does fighting Khan in the Reliant in TWOK. Signaling the Klingons in TSFS pretending to be Lloyd's character. Telling Spock to shoot Sybok in TFF. Figuring out that the hot chick changeling in TUC is plotting against them, "Ask her what she's getting in return. And don't tell me that flare is standard prison issue...it's to let them know where we are."



tooboku said:


> On a side note, Scotty kicked butt in that episode.


"We're big enough to take a few insults." I love how he beats up the Klingon only after the Enterprise is insulted...how INTJ of him.


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