# Model D (2020)



## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

This is my current view on Model D.


ILI

Si+ (Se-) // Fe+ (Fi-) ... strong (ego)

Se- (Si+) // Fi- (Fe+) ... weak ............................ extroverted (?)
_________________

Fi+ (Fe-) // Se+ (Si-) ... strong (super-ego) ......... extroverted (?)

Fe- (Fi+) // Si- (Se+) ... weak


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Fe includes Si and Fi includes Se.

ILI's Fe+, Fi-, Se+ and Si- correspond to the vital functions.

"The second peculiarity: the contents of vital track functions is the result of individual period of psyche development, the period when we are individuals, when we are the hub of the universe, when everything rotates around us, around our interests, when we are still children and we are not interested in the society with all its demands. Socionists say: the vital track is the superblock of individual life activity. This means that vital track functions work for our individual needs and in the way that is customary and comfortable for us."

"Some socionists suppose that the functioning of the superblock of personal life is unconscious. It is incorrect. Founders of psychoanalysis differently considered the concept of the 'unconscious'. The term 'preconscious' is appropriate to the content of processes, which take place in the superblock of personal life. In normal conditions, the preconscious processes function out of consciousness, automatically. But these processes can become conscious, if there is a need. In turn, functioning of the superblock of social life is obviously conscious."

https://www.facebook.com/groups/255791568132476/

https://www.the16types.info/vbulletin/showthread.php/51596-Model-D


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

What are your definitions for Fe-, Fe+, Fi-, and Fi+?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> What are your definitions for Fe-, Fe+, Fi-, and Fi+?


Si and Se are based on the ventral and dorsal streams. 

Fe and Fi are mirror neuron systems, which are dependent on Si and Se.

'+' with Intuition/imagination (i.e. PFC, working memory)

'-' without Intuition/imagination

Logical reasoning (PFC) does not change the quality of information, so it is excluded from the model.


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

This is very cool. A lot to think about. I'm not one to speak for accuracy or validity, but this model makes a lot of sense to me. Thumbs up.



Tellus said:


> Si and Se are based on the ventral and dorsal streams.
> 
> Fe and Fi are mirror neuron systems, which are dependent on Si and Se.
> 
> ...


So basically Fi+ and Fi- are the same, but one has imagination mixed in?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> So basically Fi+ and Fi- are the same, but one has imagination mixed in?


'+' functions are detailed, specific

'-' functions are broad, general


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> '+' functions are detailed, specific
> 
> '-' functions are broad, general


Assignment of +/- on the same function depending on whether PFC and memory are used?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> Assignment of +/- on the same function depending on whether PFC and memory are used?


'+' functions are always detailed and specific, and '-' functions are always broad and general.

ILI uses Si- as well, but it is a vital function.


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> '+' functions are always detailed and specific, and '-' functions are always broad and general.
> 
> ILI uses Si- as well, but it is a vital function.


I get that. I'm just asking if functions regardless of +/- are referring to the same part of the brain or not e.g. do you mean that both Si+ and Si- is referring to the ventral stream, but '+' means working with PFC and the '-' without PFC?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> I get that. I'm just asking if functions regardless of +/- are referring to the same part of the brain or not e.g. do you mean that both Si+ and Si- is referring to the ventral stream,


yes



> but '+' means working with PFC and the '-' without PFC?


'+' means working with PFC _and_ working without PFC

'-' means working without PFC


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

What do you mean by 'strong', adept or high energy, or both? or are they the same thing in this case?
or does it mean focused?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> What do you mean by 'strong', adept or high energy, or both? or are they the same thing in this case?
> or does it mean focused?


My current view is that the functions _seem_ strong or weak.

"In addition, users of type often forget that inferior or unconscious functions are inferior to consciousness not inferior in strength in the psyche (Jung, 1971 p.450)."

The strong functions seem sophisticated (or adept) and they have high energy.


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

There could be a difference in strength when it comes to working memory, though.


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

You said that '-' functions are broad and general, how does that apply to Fi- which you previously stated is high in trust and disgust? Wouldn't that require more specificity? In an example, how does the specificity of Fi- compare with the specificity of Fi+?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> You said that '-' functions are broad and general, how does that apply to Fi- which you previously stated is high in trust and disgust? Wouldn't that require more specificity? In an example, how does the specificity of Fi- compare with the specificity of Fi+?


Fi- itself is not high in acceptance (or trust) and disgust, but it is directly related to those basic emotions.

Fi- and Fi+ are two different strategies for survival. Fi- maximizes acceptance (a positive emotion) and Fi+ minimizes disgust (a negative emotion). Fi+ sees all the details and has a better understanding of a situation. For example, if you know everything about a criminal's past, then it is hard to feel disgusted.


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## mrei (Nov 10, 2019)

Tellus said:


> Fi- itself is not high in acceptance (or trust) and disgust, but it is directly related to those basic emotions.
> 
> Fi- and Fi+ are two different strategies for survival. Fi- maximizes acceptance (a positive emotion) and Fi+ minimizes disgust (a negative emotion). Fi+ sees all the details and has a better understanding of a situation. For example, if you know everything about a criminal's past, then it is hard to feel disgusted.


So basically, Fi- is more conclusive and snappy whereas Fi+ is considerate and takes more time?
Is this a principle for -/+ on all functions?


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## Tellus (Dec 30, 2012)

mrei said:


> So basically, Fi- is more conclusive and snappy whereas Fi+ is considerate and takes more time?


Yes, Fi- deals with an immediate situation.



> Is this a principle for -/+ on all functions?


Yes


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