# Types of vegetarians/vegans on PerC



## He's a Superhero!

I wonder what this would look like if all of PerC voted here...I would hope that there would still be a large percentage of vegetarians and vegans here.


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## ShadowsRunner

I suppose I am ovo-vegetarian.

I will eat some diary, but not milk itself as I believe there is often too much hormones in it, and the concept of eating another animals milk is kind of sick (unless it's natural) but still...(plus I think, some allergies maybe?)

But I think it is difficult to eat a full diet, and as a male, I do not feel adequately nourished or fulfilled if I do not eat a full diet, and thus I am not a strict vegetarian or vegan. But I plan to cut it back once I am more established and a bit older.


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## sereneone

Red Panda said:


> There isn't any evidence that gluten free is healthier, unless you suffer from celiac disease, or some other diagnosed form of sensitivity that are controversial.


That's not really true. Some people have reactions to mycotoxins in grains, and I have seen studies in the last five years that suggest the peptides in wheat can trigger autoimmune conditions.

In general I am not crazy about starches. Too much concentrated glucose, and that is not the diet we evolved to eat.


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## sereneone

I am a little radical on diet, but generally I avoid grains and starches, eat lots of meat and eggs, some fish.

I have all processed foods out of the diet and I focus on whole foods.

I eat about 100-to-150 grams of carbs, mostly from fruits that have glucose and fructose and low amounts of sucrose.

I avoid all grains, including wheat, and I'm actually a step beyond that and I do the simple carbohydrate diet (SCD) that avoids all starches (no wheat, no corn, no rice, no beans, no potato).

I get a lot of saturated fat, mainly coconut milk, coconut oil, and indian ghee (I make my own).

I probably get 20% of calories from carbs, 20% from protein, maybe 55% from fats, and maybe 5% from non-starchy vegetables (so just a different type of carb).


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## Simpson17866

I learned the term "Lacto-Ovo" when I was about 8, and I'm just seeing "Ovo-lacto" for the first time in my life.

"Lacto-Ovo" sounds a lot better to me :wink:


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## Notus Asphodelus

I've been semi-vegetarian since I was born.


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## He's a Superhero!

Simpson17866 said:


> I learned the term "Lacto-Ovo" when I was about 8, and I'm just seeing "Ovo-lacto" for the first time in my life.
> 
> "Lacto-Ovo" sounds a lot better to me :wink:


I don't think it matters - oddly enough, Ovo-lacto sounds more natural to my ears.


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## Red Panda

sereneone said:


> That's not really true. Some people have reactions to mycotoxins in grains, and I have seen studies in the last five years that suggest the peptides in wheat can trigger autoimmune conditions.
> 
> In general I am not crazy about starches. Too much concentrated glucose, and that is not the diet we evolved to eat.


Autoimmune condition = celiac disease
mycotoxins in grains are probably an issue of wrong handling and safety because they come from fungi, not the grain itself. Concentrated glucose is not that much of an issue from starches, especially if you eat whole grains because they are slowly digested and don't spike insulin as much. And people have been eating grains and starchy veggies for many thousands of years even before agriculture was developed and most modern nations that had starch based diets are much healthier than the rest. See for example the Mediterranean Diet that is heavy on whole grains, healthy fats and lean proteins is one of the best for managing diabetic patients.


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## DiorLips

I eat meat but have recently been feeling conflicted about it for ethical, environmental and health reasons. I already don't consume dairy or gluten, so what's one more thing to cut out?  Fortunately, I know myself well enough to understand that a strict vegan/vegetarian diet would be too much pressure so my goal is to only eat meat on rare occasions, such as at a BBQ where there are no meatless options, but to each their own.


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## sereneone

Red Panda said:


> Autoimmune condition = celiac disease


Celiac is just a very specific - and statistically very rare - disorder in which specific wheat peptides result in destruction of the intestinal lining. That is NOT what I am referring to. In the last five years they are finding that foods can trigger systemic autoimmune diseases in many parts of the body. 

I don't think wheat is a natural food for humans at all. We evolved over millions of years to eat a specific kind of plant and meat based diet. Grain is simply easy sugar in a concentrated form and it only became widely available 10,000 years ago, which is not enough time in an evolutionary framework for every possible human genetic expression to adapt to it. It won't kill most people, but I do not think it is an optimal nutritional food for humans.



> mycotoxins in grains are probably an issue of wrong handling and safety because they come from fungi, not the grain itself.


That is exactly correct, but no one is checking for them. One batch of grain can have a ton of them, and another can have very little. 25% of the population has a genetic defect where they do not develop antibodies to mycotoxins, and as one of those people I stay away from possible exposures.

In my own case, I get very weird reactions to wheat. Sometimes it digests fine, but other times I wake up the next day feeling like someone fed me rat poison, and I am literally derailed for days. I am not celiac, so it is some other reaction to either a wheat peptide or something else that hangs onto the wheat like a mycotoxin. I just know for me - after a lot of very methodical experimentation - that wheat is not a good food.



> Concentrated glucose is not that much of an issue from starches, especially if you eat whole grains because they are slowly digested and don't spike insulin as much.


Again, possibly it is just me, but I have tested extensively my own blood sugar response with a glucometer and starches like wheat spike my blood sugar and keep it high for three or more hours. To contrast, if I just use fruits like blueberries with glucose and fructose - and very little sucrose - then I get a spike after 45 minutes and that is gone by 90 minutes and my blood sugar totally normalizes for the rest of the day.

I think honestly most people have no idea what their glycemic responses to foods are, because no one is willing to invest time in buying a meter and doing careful experiments. And very few people appreciate how keeping blood sugars low dramatically lowers disease of many types.

80 million Americans are now prediabetic. That isn't a natural condition for humans to have 25% of the population suffering from high blood sugar. That happened because of a very sick American diet that loads people up with table sugar, high fructose corn syrup, and then adds to that tons more sugar from foods in wheat, corn, rice, and potato. People get dysregulated blood sugar and insulin from massive overdoses of sugar.



> And people have been eating grains and starchy veggies for many thousands of years even before agriculture was developed and most modern nations that had starch based diets are much healthier than the rest. See for example the Mediterranean Diet that is heavy on whole grains, healthy fats and lean proteins is one of the best for managing diabetic patients.


Remember the human condition before the agricultural revolution was starvation. The body was built to scavenge every bit of energy from the occasional starch because the next day it would be starving again.

The agricultural revolution was 10K years ago, and evolution of apes is millions of years. So the period in which we have been overeating starches is a blip of time in evolutionary terms.

Mediterranean diet is certainly much better than the average American diet. But that diet is much higher in fat, so it may be about lowering sugar calories and raising fat calories.

I am not talking about crazy diets like ketogenic diets. I get sugar from fruit. But for me, I do way better on a diet that is high in high-quality fats and low on sugar/carbs. I eat a ton of nonstarchy vegetables for nutrition.


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## Red Panda

sereneone said:


> Celiac is just a very specific - and statistically very rare - disorder in which specific wheat peptides result in destruction of the intestinal lining. That is NOT what I am referring to. In the last five years they are finding that foods can trigger systemic autoimmune diseases in many parts of the body.
> 
> I don't think wheat is a natural food for humans at all. We evolved over millions of years to eat a specific kind of plant and meat based diet. Grain is simply easy sugar in a concentrated form and it only became widely available 10,000 years ago, which is not enough time in an evolutionary framework for every possible human genetic expression to adapt to it. It won't kill most people, but I do not think it is an optimal nutritional food for humans.


Celiac is the only autoimmune disease we know that is directly related to gluten, all others may have some connection but it's likely due to the already malfunctioning immune system that creates gluten sensitivity rather than the other way around. If you do a google search, all the sites that talk about this issue are "alternative" medicine stuff or at least not from reputable institutions or official health organization sites. That's because the evidence for these links are scarce and it's not safe to draw such conclusions yet. I've looked into these sites and some even link studies from PubMed and even then they misrepresent the conclusions of the study because they are personally biased.
Yes, that's the argument of Paleo supporters but it's not really based on evidence, our genes change from one generation to the other and even our own as we live our lives, 10k years are probably more than enough to adapt to eating grains regularly. There videos on YouTube from anthropologists who show examples of how incorrect this arguments are.
It's much more possible that diseases are caused by highly processed ingredients and hormone/chemical pumped meat rather than gluten from whole grains.




> That is exactly correct, but no one is checking for them. One batch of grain can have a ton of them, and another can have very little. 25% of the population has a genetic defect where they do not develop antibodies to mycotoxins, and as one of those people I stay away from possible exposures.
> 
> In my own case, I get very weird reactions to wheat. Sometimes it digests fine, but other times I wake up the next day feeling like someone fed me rat poison, and I am literally derailed for days. I am not celiac, so it is some other reaction to either a wheat peptide or something else that hangs onto the wheat like a mycotoxin. I just know for me - after a lot of very methodical experimentation - that wheat is not a good food.


I think it's much more possible that you have irritable bowel syndrome than being poisoned by mycotoxins, or it could be something else that bothers you when you eat them. As for whether they check them, I guess it depends on where you live.



> Again, possibly it is just me, but I have tested extensively my own blood sugar response with a glucometer and starches like wheat spike my blood sugar and keep it high for three or more hours. To contrast, if I just use fruits like blueberries with glucose and fructose - and very little sucrose - then I get a spike after 45 minutes and that is gone by 90 minutes and my blood sugar totally normalizes for the rest of the day.
> 
> I think honestly most people have no idea what their glycemic responses to foods are, because no one is willing to invest time in buying a meter and doing careful experiments. And very few people appreciate how keeping blood sugars low dramatically lowers disease of many types.
> 
> 80 million Americans are now prediabetic. That isn't a natural condition for humans to have 25% of the population suffering from high blood sugar. That happened because of a very sick American diet that loads people up with table sugar, high fructose corn syrup, and then adds to that tons more sugar from foods in wheat, corn, rice, and potato. People get dysregulated blood sugar and insulin from massive overdoses of sugar.


Did you try it on processed white wheat or whole? What else did you eat alongside? Fruit will generally spike your glucose less simply because you eat less of it.
The problem of Americans who are prediabetic is not that they eat starchy whole grains (as they should), but because they are 1) overweight 2) very inactive and 3) eat highly processed junk food diets. HFCS is horrible and of course eating tons of processed grains and trans fat is not ideal either. But 1+2 are hugely important when we talk about risk for diabetes and arguing against whole grains using diabetes as an argument when we are talking about a population that is in such a state, carrying excessive amounts of fat and being inactive, is intellectually dishonest.



> Remember the human condition before the agricultural revolution was starvation. The body was built to scavenge every bit of energy from the occasional starch because the next day it would be starving again.
> 
> The agricultural revolution was 10K years ago, and evolution of apes is millions of years. So the period in which we have been overeating starches is a blip of time in evolutionary terms.
> 
> Mediterranean diet is certainly much better than the average American diet. But that diet is much higher in fat, so it may be about lowering sugar calories and raising fat calories.
> 
> I am not talking about crazy diets like ketogenic diets. I get sugar from fruit. But for me, I do way better on a diet that is high in high-quality fats and low on sugar/carbs. I eat a ton of nonstarchy vegetables for nutrition.


A typical Med Diet ranges from 40-60% carbohydrates, 30-40% fats and the rest is lean proteins from legumes & beans, fish, poultry and very little red meat. It was a superior diet even 50-60 years ago that the American diet wasn't as bad as today, and was even better than many European high meat diets that continue today. 
I'd suggest to Paleo supporters to firstly try such a diet that is tested against time from multiple studies rather than spend their time and money on a couple of people who popularized the cave man diets and make fortunes out of it without any real evidence to back them up.


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## MonieJ

omnivore but I try to not eat pork, sometimes a rib calls my name and I gotta answer


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## He's a Superhero!

MonieJ said:


> omnivore but I try to not eat pork, sometimes a rib calls my name and I gotta answer


I understand.


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## He's a Superhero!

I'm now trying to stick by a Pescetarian diet already, so by the time 2017 arrives I'll be used to it and know that I can do it. Also, been trying milk alternatives - mostly because I'm slightly lactose intolerant. I actually really like the taste of soy milk (oddly enough, most people I know hate the taste?), and one almond milk I tried was really nice, but another tasted bitter. I like soy yogurt, and olive spread rather than normal butter is nice too.


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## Eram Sum Ero

I'm ovo-lacto but would like to switch to a raw vegan diet, it just seems too hard, as I'm also a "olympic" weightlifter. I know that's not a real excuse, but it's what I have, and I also have more important stuff to worry about imo, trying to be politically active and stuff.


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## Cesspool

Ovo-lacto vegetarian.


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## isamanthax

:O Where's paleo!
But I desperately want to switch my lifestyle to vegan. Preferably raw-vegan.


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## He's a Superhero!

isamanthax said:


> :O Where's paleo!
> But I desperately want to switch my lifestyle to vegan. Preferably raw-vegan.


The focus is on vegetarians and vegans - Paleo doesn't have dairy tho, so perhaps I should've added it afterall.


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## CoffeeCat

I'm pescetarian for 6 months now 
I stopped eating meat because I didn't like the taste anymore. My family consumes a lot of meat, so I reduced it before, but just stopped one day without even thinking too much about it. At that time, I only wanted to stop for a month or so, but I found out that I didn't miss meat. I'm not the biggest animal activist. I didn't see a documentation about how the animals we eat are treated. But I don't want to consume an animal that had to die for that purpose when I don't even enjoy the taste of it.
I continued to eat fish because I LOVE fish, I always did. I know about the problems with overfishing and everything but as I said, I had other reasons for stop eating meat, so I don't think about that too much. I can't save the whole world and for me it's healthier not to try to do so. I'm still of the opinion that eating meat is okay, I just personally don't want to do so anymore.


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## He's a Superhero!

Thought I'd share this vid...


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## He's a Superhero!

Tropes said:


> I feel like I need a foodie level bellow omnivorous.
> I've had whale, I'll probably have dolphin and ape when I get the chance, I am very curious about elephant meat and human placenta, I consider squids both brilliantly sentient and delicious, I'd be among the first to try cloned human meat, and one day I hope to be eaten by loved ones.


Are you being serious with this post?


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## Tropes

He's a Superhero! said:


> Are you being serious with this post?


Yes, you've seemed to have zoomed in on the vegan-sphere close enough to see the diversity of ranges within it but omitted the rest to omnivore, which is a bit like an American asking where you are from, listing all states, and then adding an option for "The rest of the world". Now, there's nothing wrong with a geography lesson about the US, if it didn't include the omnivore option I would just assume that this is a thread strictly for vegans, as I initially thought from the title.
If you want to include the range of omnivores, there is a very large diversity. There are people who abide by western food taboos, and there are people who'd happily enjoy a dish of sannakji hoe with wiggling tentacles. Many others will avoid Entomophagy altogether, or have a special aversion to specific animals like dogs cats or horses, or highly respected animals like dolphins, whales or elephants. You've included some room for "religious vegan", which do exist, but that is very far from covering people who will only eat meat made by kosher butchering practices. Then you have those people who won't eat anything that doesn't come on a McDonald's menu unless it's mac and cheese. And then at the complete opposite extreme there are foodies, which also come in different degrees and different attitudes. Some will travel great distances and play it out like it's extreme sports. Personally I enjoy a more stoic approach, people rarely believe it's my first time trying something out, and if the menu has anything I haven't tried, it usually is.


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## B3LIAL

Prada said:


> If you think eating animal products is unhealthy, maybe you should get more information on that. Also, yes, it is necessary for me. I have only few windows in my schedule for meal with difference of 6-7 hours and I would be all day hungry if my only income of food was vegetable. Maybe you should check your assumptions on how other people should eat.


And... there we go. Get defensive straight away. I stated you could eat any diet you want, I wasn't going to lecture you, but i'm not just going to sit by when people are just blind consumers and think they need to eat meat to get their protein or whatever else.

1. Name me something that you think you need to get from a "healthy" animal product, and I'll show you a healthier, and probably cheaper, plant based source.

2. "I would be all day hungry if my only income of food was vegetable".... And you're telling me to check my assumptions? You seriously think you have the right to tell others to check their info and assumptions when you have just said that? 

- Who said you could only eat Vegetables?

- Fruits and Vegetables, as well as plant products in general, will likely keep you fuller for longer because of the fact that they are more nutrient dense and also packed with fibre.


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## He's a Superhero!

Tropes said:


> Yes, you've seemed to have zoomed in on the vegan-sphere close enough to see the diversity of ranges within it but omitted the rest to omnivore, which is a bit like an American asking where you are from, listing all states, and then adding an option for "The rest of the world". Now, there's nothing wrong with a geography lesson about the US, if it didn't include the omnivore option I would just assume that this is a thread strictly for vegans, as I initially thought from the title.
> If you want to include the range of omnivores, there is a very large diversity. There are people who abide by western food taboos, and there are people who'd happily enjoy a dish of sannakji hoe with wiggling tentacles. Many others will avoid Entomophagy altogether, or have a special aversion to specific animals like dogs cats or horses, or highly respected animals like dolphins, whales or elephants. You've included some room for "religious vegan", which do exist, but that is very far from covering people who will only eat meat made by kosher butchering practices. Then you have those people who won't eat anything that doesn't come on a McDonald's menu unless it's mac and cheese. And then at the complete opposite extreme there are foodies, which also come in different degrees and different attitudes. Some will travel great distances and play it out like it's extreme sports. Personally I enjoy a more stoic approach, people rarely believe it's my first time trying something out, and if the menu has anything I haven't tried, it usually is.


This poll is focused on types of vegetarians and vegans. By all means feel free to create a poll that is focused on types of omnivorous diets.
Actually there are so many kinds of diets out there, it would be quite the poll that could fit them all in as separate options.


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## Tropes

He's a Superhero! said:


> This poll is focused on types of vegetarians and vegans.


So I didn't misinterpreted the title. Why then include "Standard omnivorous diet"?


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## He's a Superhero!

Tropes said:


> So I didn't misinterpreted the title. Why then include "Standard omnivorous diet"?


Of course, not everyone on PerC is vegetarian or vegan, so the last two options allow for others to vote as well instead of feeling left out, making it easier for everyone to see the poll results. People who are not vegan or vegetarian could still find the poll results of interest.


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## Prada

He's a Superhero! said:


> People do vary in circumstances and needs, but I think he was just pointing out that many humans can have healthy diets that suit the needs of their bodies without meat consumption.


First of all, I never said that was impossible. But just because he thinks it's better to do something it doesn't mean everyone has to agree or everyone has to do it. I don't go preaching my vegan or vegetarian friends about how they should eat meat, yet majority of vegans and vegetarians have to go out of their way to call me disgusting or a monster for eating meat/animal produce. All I'm saying is if my body was made to eat animal produce and it's better for me in multiple ways so why shouldn't I? 



B3LIAL said:


> And... there we go. Get defensive straight away. I stated you could eat any diet you want, I wasn't going to lecture you, but i'm not just going to sit by when people are just blind consumers and think they need to eat meat to get their protein or whatever else.


You're the one who got on offense with "you shouldn't assume that because we're omnivores that eating animal products is necessary or healthy". I can eat whatever I want and I don't want to be judged for it. Is that really that much to ask?



B3LIAL said:


> 1. Name me something that you think you need to get from a "healthy" animal product, and I'll show you a healthier, and probably cheaper, plant based source.


In smaller quantities and I can assure definitely not cheaper around here. Animal products are better for convenience because it's easier to keep a balanced diet with it. Besides, I dislike the taste of plenty of these replacements vegetables. So, why should I eat something I dislike and makes my life more complicated instead of what I like and is more convenient? My family has our own animals so plenty of the produce is free for me compared to me running all across the town finding rare and expensive vegetable/fruit to cover for meat.



B3LIAL said:


> 2. "I would be all day hungry if my only income of food was vegetable".... And you're telling me to check my assumptions? You seriously think you have the right to tell others to check their info and assumptions when you have just said that?
> 
> - Who said you could only eat Vegetables?
> 
> - Fruits and Vegetables, as well as plant products in general, will likely keep you fuller for longer because of the fact that they are more nutrient dense and also packed with fibre.


You are the one who calls animal produce unhealthy. What gives you the right to tell others to check their assumptions? 

Also, been there done that. And I was hungry all the time. That's why I said it in the first place. You really need to stop taking this topic so personally and stop forcing your diet on others. Animal produce is not unhealthy and vegan diet is not good for everyone. Just as not everyone wants to eat meat or animal produce. Why is it so hard to understand? Everyone should be free to eat whatever they want/need without someone preaching to them about how they're doing it wrong.


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## _XXX_

Ovo-lacto.

10 years+ and counting. 

I'm not a stickler about it like some others... I couldn't care any less what anyone else wants to eat.


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## He's a Superhero!

Prada said:


> First of all, I never said that was impossible. But just because he thinks it's better to do something it doesn't mean everyone has to agree or everyone has to do it. I don't go preaching my vegan or vegetarian friends about how they should eat meat, *yet majority of vegans and vegetarians have to go out of their way to call me disgusting or a monster for eating meat/animal produce.*


Have vegans and vegetarians been verbally abusive to you about your dietary choices? I'm sorry that that has happened to you. I'd like to reassure you that I don't judge you for what you eat. I like to encourage more people to choose to eat less meat, but only out of their own free will, and people should respect the freedom of others.


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## Aridela

B3LIAL said:


> You are of course free to eat whatever diet you wish, but you shouldn't assume that because we're omnivores that eating animal products is necessary or healthy.
> 
> Not trying to nit pick but people need to check their assumptions on diet and lifestyle.


Not necessary but some of that soy meat/cheese replacements are really unhealthy. 

Also, just because you chose to go vegan/veggie you're not necessarily going to lose weight/be healthier either. And you have a need for added B complex vitamins (esp B12), iron and zinc.


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## Aridela

I'm an omnivore. 

However, I was raised in an Eastern Orthodox family and we've observed Lent and ate specific foods on specific days as tradition dictated. That basically meant I was pretty much observing a vegan diet for two thirds of the year. I like veggie foods, and I actively eat veggie most of the time. I do suffer from iron efficiency and I have difficulty absorbing iron even from meat (yes, I do take Vit C to aid absorption). 

I have absolutely zero issues with Vegans and Vegetarians, but I do get a hollier than thou feel from them a lot of the time. Please do not assume people who chose not to follow a meat/animal product free diet are ignorant, that's just condescending. I have no need to be educated on nutrition and I follow the diet that best suits my needs.


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## coconut sharks

I would love to at least try being vegetarian for a year and see how it's like but I'm allergic to almost all fruit and peanuts. I don't think I could survive eating vegetables... unless there's more food out there for vegetarians that I just don't know about.


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## Ardielley

Lutece said:


> I would love to at least try being vegetarian for a year and see how it's like but I'm allergic to almost all fruit and peanuts. I don't think I could survive eating vegetables... unless there's more food out there for vegetarians that I just don't know about.


Almost all? What specifically are you allergic to?


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## Prada

He's a Superhero! said:


> Have vegans and vegetarians been verbally abusive to you about your dietary choices? I'm sorry that that has happened to you. I'd like to reassure you that I don't judge you for what you eat. I like to encourage more people to choose to eat less meat, but only out of their own free will, and people should respect the freedom of others.


Thank you, I appreciate it. I know some vegetarians who can humour a good discussion on the diet topic and are perfectly fine with ending it on agree to disagree. One even thanked me for discussing it with her as it gave her more insight on possible pros for other people to eating meat. The funny thing is that I don't even eat so much meat, red meat maybe once a month and white meat (not counting fish) about once every two weeks at most. The only meat I eat regularly is fish. I prefer vegetables myself, I just can't bear it when someone tries to force their way of life on other people.

My low income of meat is also why tried to void animal produce for a while but I just ended up hungry and thinking about food and not being able to focus. Probably the second biggest issue is my love for cooking. Neglecting a huge class of food greatly limits what I can work with. When I have people I can cook for, not eating animal produce (except for sea food) is much easier, ironically. Not to mention sea food is my favourite group of food and I would never be willing to give that up even if I developed an allergy to it or something. XD


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## coconut sharks

Ardielley said:


> Almost all? What specifically are you allergic to?


Apples, peaches, plums, pears, apricots, cherries, raspberries, nectarines.. I'm probably forgetting something. Sometimes I can eat them cooked (or just not raw) but it depends. I know I can eat bananas and most citruses. It seems like I'm developing new allergies with time. For nuts I can't eat hazelnuts, walnuts, peanuts (I'm unsure about other types). 
There's probably a way around it but I'd have to develop a specific diet and it would be hard to do at the moment. I'd like to try when I'm older and more independent.


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## B3LIAL

Prada said:


> First of all, I never said that was impossible. But just because he thinks it's better to do something it doesn't mean everyone has to agree or everyone has to do it. I don't go preaching my vegan or vegetarian friends about how they should eat meat, yet majority of vegans and vegetarians have to go out of their way to call me disgusting or a monster for eating meat/animal produce. All I'm saying is if my body was made to eat animal produce and it's better for me in multiple ways so why shouldn't I?
> 
> 
> You're the one who got on offense with "you shouldn't assume that because we're omnivores that eating animal products is necessary or healthy". I can eat whatever I want and I don't want to be judged for it. Is that really that much to ask?
> 
> 
> In smaller quantities and I can assure definitely not cheaper around here. Animal products are better for convenience because it's easier to keep a balanced diet with it. Besides, I dislike the taste of plenty of these replacements vegetables. So, why should I eat something I dislike and makes my life more complicated instead of what I like and is more convenient? My family has our own animals so plenty of the produce is free for me compared to me running all across the town finding rare and expensive vegetable/fruit to cover for meat.
> 
> 
> You are the one who calls animal produce unhealthy. What gives you the right to tell others to check their assumptions?
> 
> Also, been there done that. And I was hungry all the time. That's why I said it in the first place. You really need to stop taking this topic so personally and stop forcing your diet on others. Animal produce is not unhealthy and vegan diet is not good for everyone. Just as not everyone wants to eat meat or animal produce. Why is it so hard to understand? Everyone should be free to eat whatever they want/need without someone preaching to them about how they're doing it wrong.


You can keep trying to deflect this back at me all you want by telling me I'm taking this personally, but my opening remarks where respectful, and stated you could eat whatever you want. 

You were the one telling me to check myself and my supposed assumptions first, not the other way around. I simply pointed out something wrong in your comment, and instead of respectfully disagreeing, you got defensive.

You are simply making assumptions because you've _supposedly_ tried and failed, and like many others who fail on a lifestyle you blame the lifestyle rather than your own decisions.

LOL you keep on telling me - 'what right do I have to tell people to check their assumptions' when you told me to do that first.

- Veganism is not a diet. It is a lifestyle, and there are many variations and diets you can adopt while under it.

- The reason I label animal products unhealthy is because the vast majority, if not all, are not health foods. 

They are a convenient source of protein and fat, but they are low in fibre, complex carbs, and are usually no where near as nutrient dense as plant products.

With every pro there's a con with an animal product, and like I said before, if you believe a vegetarian/vegan diet is so inconvenient, tell me what you believe you cannot get on a vege/vegan diet and I will find you numerous sources.

I am offering help which you are rejecting because you are so adamant that you cannot do it. If you live on the outskirts of society or are an eskimo, then I apologise, I didn't know, but I'm going to assume you're not one of the few people in such a position, and that you have simply given up before you've even really tried or put an effort into researching into the issue.


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## soop

semi-veg with and emphasis on macrobiotics (sp?)


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## busybee

I have been veggie on and off since I was 10 (38 now) but I've decided to not label myself anymore ! I don't eat red meat and try and eat as veggie as I can but I am allergic to dairy. I find a vegan diet is very restrictive especially if you go out for food. 
So I try to avoid animals as much as I can but sometimes I can't and I'm ok with that  
A new vegan restaurant has opened near me though and I can't wait to try it!!! 


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## periwinklepromise

I've been flexi for most of my life, only I grew up in a ... "religious" household that thought it was an actual _insult to God _to not eat meat, so I was forced into eating animal products pretty regularly. I tried going vegan once, but I didn't do it right. And my doctor currently says it's not safe for me to restrict food groups from my diet, considering I don't get enough calories as it is (not an eating disorder, let's be clear). 

I voted pollo-pesc, and I was very excited to see it included in the poll! No one I've ever spoken to has heard of it, which is very sad for me. I eat chicken (but no other poultry) and saltwater fish (but no shellfish or freshwater fish). I eat dairy products (despite being lactose-intolerant) but I don't eat eggs. I do hope to one day get to vegan, but that's far off.


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## He's a Superhero!

periwinklepromise said:


> I've been flexi for most of my life, only I grew up in a ... "religious" household that thought it was an actual _insult to God _to not eat meat, so I was forced into eating animal products pretty regularly. I tried going vegan once, but I didn't do it right. And my doctor currently says it's not safe for me to restrict food groups from my diet, considering I don't get enough calories as it is (not an eating disorder, let's be clear).
> 
> I voted pollo-pesc, and I was very excited to see it included in the poll! No one I've ever spoken to has heard of it, which is very sad for me. I eat chicken (but no other poultry) and saltwater fish (but no shellfish or freshwater fish). I eat dairy products (despite being lactose-intolerant) but I don't eat eggs. I do hope to one day get to vegan, but that's far off.


Wow...I've never heard of that one before where the religion required eating meat.


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