# Issues typing my boyfriend lol questionnaire included



## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

1. Is there anything that may affect the way you answer the questions? For example, a stressful time, mental illness, medications, special life circumstances? Other useful information includes sex, age, and current state of mind.

No

2. What type(s) do you usually score as on tests?

INTJ

3. Click on this link: Flickr: Explore! Choose 2 photos and look at each for as long as you feel that you need. Copy and paste the photos here (or write the link like example: www[dot]flickr[dot]com/photos/jacoboson/8697480741/in/explore-2013-05-01), and write your impression of each of them.

Morning has broken... | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

it's a relaxing landscape making me feel home, it gives me the idea of isolation.

INSIDE THE SHADOWS II ~ EXPLORE | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

it's a place where I would like to live, a view I'd like to have nextdoor.


4. You are on the clock to fix something, a friend of yours sits beside you and gives a lot of interesting ideas, none of them actually help or are related to your situation, but they are still something you find interesting. What is your reaction? What do you say? What do you do? What's your train of thought?

I'd think “who the hell makes me do what I'm doing?” I would want to go with my friend, but I would finish what I have to do as quickly as possible or try to organize my time differently to be able to do both, trying to explain my friend that I unluckily have no choice.

5a. What are some of your most important values? 

Welfare, independence, live and let live.

5b. Can they change? What would be the reason if they changed?

They could change because I could stumble into somthing through life.

6. You are in a car with some other people, the people in the car are talking. Someone makes a claim that you see as immoral/rude/cruel. What is your inward reaction? What do you think? What do you say?

I could be that person, anyway if it was someone else I'd shut up and I wait for the person to change the subject of conversation.

7. a) What activities energizes you the most? Why?

Video games, football and poker. Football and poker because they are fun activities and at which I'm good and with an ability slightly above average I have fun doing. Video Games because they are fun and take me in better worlds and tell me beautiful stories I live.



7. b) What activities drains you the most? Why?

Working, because there's no end and it's always on the run and always on a razor's edge. 

8. Do you believe you are introverted or extraverted? Why do you believe that? (Please be as detailed as possible)

Extraverted, because I don't have difficulties socializing and I have tons of friends, I don't find difficulties with the outside world.

9. Please describe yourself, what do you see as your greatest strengths and what do you see as your greatest weaknesses?

My greatest strength is my way of thinking, having some neurons above average, I'm also a reliable person.

My greatest weakness is finding the right words, it often happens that I think of the right way to say something only after a while when it's already too late. I'm also too altruistic.

10. Please describe yourself when you are feeling stressed. How do you act and why? Real life experiences are welcome.

I disconnect my brain and I go for some hobby, because it helps me to take away my attention from reality

11. What is your "soft spot" (the area that makes you upset if people mess with)?

When someone intervenes on my habits, wanting to have a say in what I do or in what I decide to do, or when despite I know the person doesn't necessarily mean it that way they seem to question my abilities. Or being pulled into conversations I don't want to go through

12. What are most of the ideas/thoughts you get generally centered around (try to expand your answers as much as possible)?

Foundamentally my past successes, I think and I view myself in future successes or future surreal situations like a zombie invasion or a nuclear war or an alien invasion or if I did tons of money, stuff like this. 

13. What's your opinion of getting frequent feedback on what you do? (Someone pointing out what is good, what is bad, what and how to improve) Is there a limit to how often you want feedback? If so, what is the limit?

I don't like it in general.

14. Anything beyond what has been discussed that you would like to add?

I don't like talking about my feelings and about my thoughts and my problems. I'm never satisfied about anything, I always aim for something better although better can't be reached since then there will be something even better.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

Note: HE answered the questions not me. And if a further debate is needed I can turn him the questions and provide his answer.


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

3a: Si/Ne
3b: Si
4: Te? Probably strong. Not 100% sure.
5a: Welfare? Huh?
5b: Hrm... Pe.... possibly tertiary??? No idea.
6: Te... not seeing Ni here.
7a: That first part sounds like Si to me... and the second could be Ne. Not saying it can't be Ni, but I think the first is more likely.
7b: Yeah, I wonder how much of this you pile on yourself, though. Te-doms complain about the madness, but they put themselves there in the first place. Complain about the whack-a-mole but you keep puttin' the quarters in!
8: Yeah, you are a Je dom Pe tertiary I think. ESTJ is my current guess.
9a: Te/Si
9b: Yeah, you wanna get it just right. I bet your altruism is very laborious - I personally think that ESTJs are perhaps the most ACTUALLY altruistic type - inverted INFPs they are. Some tYPes may philosophize, but if you are in trouble, it's the ESTJ that shows up first and prepared.
10: Yeah, usually quirky rote stuff like model airplanes or collecting things. Lots of soothing logistics and putting stuff together.
11: Te/Si - Decisive, no-nonsense, comfort in habits and procedure.
12: Te/Si ... then a little Ne fun there, too. Good stuff. If you are an Ne rather than an Ni, that future stuff is probably a bit more in good fun than actual tinfoil wearing. The doomsday prepping ESTJs are usually really more focused on the hobbiest aspect of it, not trying to look into a crystal ball.. though the ISTJ might be more grim in a pragmatic way.
13: It's Ti/Fe-Fe/Ti that is more pro-feedback. Fi/Te-Te/Fi not so much.
14: Perfectionist not strongly in touch with emotions.




E S T J


One of the more misunderstood types.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Not enough sample size.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

I was about to start with my regular "but he says" but no, really it would only lead us out of track. 
@Acerbusvenator is right, @arkigos, that is the main issue I've had, he sais I ask the wrong questions (of this I'm sure), meaning I ask questions the wrong way, we have some major communication issues when it comes to MBTI. Last night for example I asked his mom what he was like as a child since she had told me he was very calm until 3 and she didn't need to pay particular attention to him aside from him needing tons of affection. She said after 3 he was extremely active, always looking for his friends to get out, but he hadn't much of a chance to since he lived on a ill. I was after I/E here, potentially a wrong question but I was looking for the usual outwards oriented attitude. 

Lets' see what he sais when he wakes up though ^^


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## Velasquez (Jul 3, 2012)

ISTP. Doesn't matter that he thinks he's an extravert. Clear thinking dom, but the difference between Ti dom and Te dom is that generally Ti doms are proud of how well they think, whereas Te doms are proud of how well they get stuff done. Your BF seems like the former rather than the latter.

I'll explain the 'welfare'/'too altruistic' thing too...because you sometimes find this in thinking dominants. What's happened is that they've identified themselves as having a weakness in feeling, but at the same time, they _can't accept that they could possibly even have a weakness _(OP's BF is obviously perfectionistic, as evidenced by their answer to the last question...again, points to Ti over Te - ISTPs are perfectionistic, ESTJs don't dick about like that - they just get the job done - their strength is precisely that they don't waste time mulling over what the perfect way to do things is). So what happens is...the narrative they come up for themselves to explain away their imperfections will end up being something like..."the reason that I lack empathy must be that deep down, I am actually _really empathetic._ In fact, I am _so empathetic _that it is overwhelming and I have to shut it down. So _as it turns out_, not only am I the best at logic and stuff, but I'm also the best at feelings." And that's why you sometimes have strong thinkers identifying themselves as being really caring and stuff, when all of the people around them can see that they are quite clearly not.

Arkigos has like an 'equal opportunities program' kinda thing going on where he has to type so many people as ESFP, so many people as ESTJ etc., so that he's got a launch pad from which to talk about how _misunderstood _that type is. The reason he does this is because he feels self-conscious about his own elitism and deeply held contempt for S types in general. Do I actually think this though? Am I completely 100% serious about this, or am I just being lighthearted and whimsical? _You decide!

--

_Edit: That god damn 'look at this picture and describe it' question is the number one reason for mistyping on this forum. I really wish that wasn't part of these questionnaires.

Edit 2: ESTJs are rarely about 'independence' and 'live and let live'. They're more like 'everybody should have a sense of duty' and stuff. On the other hand, independence and live and let live are distinct STP traits.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

Hi Velasquez, 

Honestly... I've pondered each and every of the 16 types for him  all suit him none suits him, one day he says A the day after he refuses A and he has never said it, I take it it's me misunderstanding his words, but as far as I am seeing and knowing about my conversation with Acerbusvenator last night, I'd say it's not just me lol

ADDED LATER: if you saw his pictures you would never say I in any possible case. I've been living with him for 1 year now, trust me, I is not an option :wink: . I have pondered them also, but honestly, he's all about the external world, insight to him is a waste of time... but I will have him tell you his version in short


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Velasquez said:


> Arkigos has like an 'equal opportunities program' kinda thing going on where he has to type so many people as ESFP, so many people as ESTJ etc., so that he's got a launch pad from which to talk about how misunderstood that type is. The reason he does this is because he feels self-conscious about his own elitism and deeply held contempt for S types in general. Do I actually think this though? Am I completely 100% serious about this, or am I just being lighthearted and whimsical? You decide!



You clearly don't know @arkigos very well if you think he's an elitist or that he holds contempt against anyone.
Actually, you seem to be clueless about him and honestly, he's a friend of mine and the OP so you can go away now.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

yeah :kitteh: me luvs @arkigos :kitteh: he's patient and calm, stumbled into him once and liked him a lot for that :kitteh:

But I like @Velasquez also, I hope it won't end up in a major fight, cause I know the material I'm providing is highly challenging and I provided it exactly for that reason :kitteh:


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

Velasquez said:


> ISTP. Doesn't matter that he thinks he's an extravert. Clear thinking dom, but the difference between Ti dom and Te dom is that generally Ti doms are proud of how well they think, whereas Te doms are proud of how well they get stuff done. Your BF seems like the former rather than the latter.


ENTJ wouldn't take pride in how they think? This seems too narrow... or is this contextualized in the ISTP/ESTJ dichotomy? Still, while I see what you are getting at, I don't think it works. I don't know. It may end up being true, but it feels too narrow.



Velasquez said:


> I'll explain the 'welfare'/'too altruistic' thing too...because you sometimes find this in thinking dominants. What's happened is that they've identified themselves as having a weakness in feeling, but at the same time, they _can't accept that they could possibly even have a weakness _(OP's BF is obviously perfectionistic, as evidenced by their answer to the last question...again, points to Ti over Te - ISTPs are perfectionistic, ESTJs don't dick about like that - they just get the job done - their strength is precisely that they don't waste time mulling over what the perfect way to do things is).


I think that all introverted functions are perfectionistic in their arena. To say one type is or is not perfectionistic might need to be narrowed down to such a context. An ESTJ would be perfectionistic in the realm of Si... 

For example, an ISTP would very naturally assume responsibility for infallible logic, a trait they may not recognize because it is so core to them, and invariably one that they are very adept at. They will, in fact, be quite logical and it will feel pretty abstract, as if it is something you can get closer to by closing your eyes or staring off - not something that is obvious, but rather nuanced. In this they might be said to be perfectionistic... but I don't know if that is the word I would use. Exacting about internal logic?

Next, they will be exacting on their conceptual view of things... they are quite inclined to have subjective theories that they hold strongly to.. usually quite imaginative ones. Conspiracy theories are the most common, but all sorts of things apply - just any subjective theory that you might call imaginative or very subjective. Perhaps in the context of religion this might lead to perfectionism.. ? I've noticed a bit of an ascetic spirit from them, kinda like a purifying. Yeah, purifying... the soul or the body. It's that internal INFJ at work or something. Very Burning Man sorta feel to it... becoming one with something... be it 'the road' or God or whatever. I am tangenting, feel free to disregard.



Velasquez said:


> So what happens is...the narrative they come up for themselves to explain away their imperfections will end up being something like..."the reason that I lack empathy must be that deep down, I am actually _really empathetic._ In fact, I am _so empathetic _that it is overwhelming and I have to shut it down. So _as it turns out_, not only am I the best at logic and stuff, but I'm also the best at feelings." And that's why you sometimes have strong thinkers identifying themselves as being really caring and stuff, when all of the people around them can see that they are quite clearly not.


ISTPs? I have never even kind of seen this. Making a logical assertion like that would be an extraverted thing - especially if they were trying to sell it to others. Having ego tied up in a function is a sign of introversion. So, wouldn't that be Te/Fi? Actually, it doesn't matter... this feels too specific as well. There is no way this is a universal thing... certainly not ubiquitous to be useful in typing. Maybe if you could back this up with something?



Velasquez said:


> Arkigos has like an 'equal opportunities program' kinda thing going on where he has to type so many people as ESFP, so many people as ESTJ etc., so that he's got a launch pad from which to talk about how _misunderstood _that type is. The reason he does this is because he feels self-conscious about his own elitism and deeply held contempt for S types in general.


But, they ARE misunderstood. Your assertion isn't logical - I have had my life deeply affected by many S types and have observed through long and deep relationships that the blanket stereotypes about them are not factual... and I feel compelled to correct it, or be corrected in it.

...so, how in the world could that turn to contempt? That I am unimpressed with low-Ni conspiratorial ramblings? That's certainly true, but that is because they are crazy! If someone told me I was being ridiculous with my low order Si/Fe social anxiety/neurosis stuff, I'd wholeheartedly agree. I don't have contempt for S types at all... quite the contrary, but I am still going to call bizarre thoughts bizarre. I rather think that is a sign of respect and I have noted that it is universally taken as such.

@_Kore_ - So, you stated off this thread that he isn't much of a planner. What are his favorite sorts of things to talk about? Does he talk a lot? What sort of hobbies does he have and how does he approach them? How consistently and thoroughly?


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

@arkigos: some explanations of his views directly from him, please note to him ESTJ and INFP may well be two cupcakes XD:

4) I'm giving priority to the important things and putting on a second level what I enjoy, but I try to do both. The reason why the job is more important is that it's money at play, whereas stuff I can enjoy there's a life time to do. 

5) the things I could stumble into could be a world tragedy or a change in my financial situation.

6) I wouldn't intervene because I don't see any reason to start an argument, it would be a waste of words. 

7) about what you said here I do agree to an extent, in that at least subconsciously I have a tendency to put myself in the kind of situation generating the complaint. 

9) I don't view myself much like that, I the way view myself as altruistic, I'm not exactly the kind of person who helps someone else unless explicitly asked to, I rather view myself as altruistic in that if I see someone in truble I feel simpathy for the person and I'm sad for them. 

10) when I say hobby I mean playing videogames. I'm not the kind of person who collects stuff. 

11/12) totally agreed

14) it's possible, I don't know, it's something I would never be able to tell on my own. 

______________________________________________________________

@Velasquez, like i said to arkigos, the following answers are directly from him, please note that one type or the other to him makes no difference, he doesn't know the types, his answers are merely pointing to clarification, here it goes :kitteh: :

I agree that the way of thinking is more important then the final result, but it's also true that without the final result the thinking per say would be aimless, I tend to see the two things as intertwined, although I slightly tend towards the thinking more, in that even a not so satisfactory result can be acceptable if the tactic I applied was well reasoned. 
About the empathy part, I disagree, it is something that I don't see as having anything to do with me. I don't worry too much about feeling what others feel, I see they feel bad or I see they feel good and that's it. Like I told arkigos above, it goes like I fell the other is sad and I'm sad for him, it depends how involved I am in the situation or in the relationship if I take action or not and what kind of action I take. I don't view myself as a saviour of any sort, I'm not really empathic, I'd rather say I can feel simpathy, but it stays at that. 
_____________________________________________________________________________________

That's all for now folks :kitteh: do not waste time persuading about which theory is right please, I'd suggest following the flow of answers and questions to come to a conclusion. I won't grow tired of repeating that I've been going through this typing path of my boyfriend for a few months already and I have come to no conclusion yet...


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

> So, you stated off this thread that he isn't much of a planner. What are his favorite sorts of things to talk about? Does he talk a lot? What sort of hobbies does he have and how does he approach them? How consistently and thoroughly?


AHAH! This is a fun question LOL! Thank you!!!!! :kitteh:

Talking is well... sometimes I wonder if he has a voice XD lol... no really take it from an ENFP, which means stopping the flow of words would be a miracle, well, he's kinda my opposite in that, he's more the action oriented type, while I'm blabbering my vocal cords to exhaustion he will have done about 4 or 5 different things. lol He grows extremely tired with introspection and I could bet he has been looking for the "off" button when I start talking lol... with his friends though he does talk a bit more, about football mostly, sometimes also politics but not that much. He also has tons of fun remembering old situations in which he did stupid stuff while drunk. lol

The part about hobbies he answered himself I think, let me know if you need a view from the outside and further infos ^_^


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

Kore said:


> 10) when I say hobby I mean playing videogames. I'm not the kind of person who collects stuff.


What sorts of videogames and why? Give me an example of one you play and how you play it, if you wouldn't mind. 

Would anyone consider you to be gregarious? Generous? Does taking risks energize you or not do much? Are big risks necessary? Why?


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## Boop (Oct 4, 2012)

Kore said:


> AHAH! This is a fun question LOL! Thank you!!!!! :kitteh:
> 
> ^_^


Opposite?

How that?


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

Thanks for the questions, arky :kitteh: ! here are his answers after each quote:



arkigos said:


> What sorts of videogames and why? Give me an example of one you play and how you play it, if you wouldn't mind.


I like Assassin's Creed mostly because of the plot and setting and because of the freedom in the game and that all these factors are brought together. 

I like online games like Guild Wars 2 because of the growth and development of the character, the risk game of finding better equipment. 

I like Duel of Champions because of the chance to find new cards, which is a sort of gamble thing and the same risk when you play with your deck and it's a matter of chance if the right cards are picked and anyway I have to play at my best with what I pick from the bunch.

How do I play games? Take Assassin's Creed I will go first for the secondary missions and then follow up with the main mission, balancing the two things to come to the end having done both, sometimes I will push myself also to do stuff a little too advanced to see if I can do it despite the lack of equipment. 



arkigos said:


> Would anyone consider you to be gregarious? Generous? Does taking risks energize you or not do much? Are big risks necessary? Why?


Yes, people usually consider me both gregarious and generous. My friends anyway do, I'm very outgoing, I enjoy joking and throwing in bullshit. Often I catch myself looking at other's interest before my own. 

As to risk, well... I play poker, it's something energizing and inspiring, but it always depends on the risk taken, until it is something like poker it's okay, but in other areas it's more difficult (romantic risks I am more careful about, and also working risks I try to avoid or at least I go through careful evaluation) 

Yes, they are because no pain no gain.


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## Boop (Oct 4, 2012)

Kore said:


> Thanks for the questions, arky :kitteh: ! here are his answers after each quote:


But why?? You know your type already?

We should concentrate on Acerbusvenator's type!...


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

@Boop: how about reading the title? :tongue:


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## Boop (Oct 4, 2012)

Kore said:


> @_Boop_: how about reading the title? :tongue:


The thread makes the title! Don't forget that!


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## Velasquez (Jul 3, 2012)

I've got three unread notifications right now so if anybody's replied to me as I was typing this up, I'll get round to it eventually. 

*Kore -*

1. What do you mean by 'his pictures'? Post 7. Can you elaborate?

2. I'm glad you like me, and nobody is going to get into a major fight with arkigos. You can prod and poke at him all you like, and he always remains calm. Also I like you too <3

3. If your BF is definitely not an introvert, then I have no good answer for you. Which is why I think he is an introvert. Maybe ESTP, but then where is his Fe? (*Edit: *if you like, you can throw the same question back at me. If he's ISTP, where is his Ni? I don't have a good answer to that one either)

4. Thank your Bf for the clarification on his empathy thing. I think it is clear that he is thinking dominant, so we're left between ESTJ and ISTP. All signs point away from ESTJ for me.

*Edit 2:* 5. The fact that you say your bf says one thing one day and another thing the next day points to Se/Ni rather than Si/Ne for me. Si types are more consistent.

Arkigos - 

1. Yeah, ENTJs probably do take pride in how they think, but at the same time they think that thinking well is irrelevant unless you do something with it. 'Knowledge is useless if you don't apply it' etc. I use the word 'generally' because sometimes there are exceptions maybe, although on this specific point I can't think of any. But yeah, the difference is maybe clearer in the ISTP/ESTJ split than it is in the ENTJ/INTP split (although in fairness, if you consider ENTJs on their own then my argument breaks down a little bit, but if you take ENTJs and compare them to their INTP counterparts, the difference just becomes obvious)

2. I'd say that both INTPs and ISTPs strive for competence. INTPs want to be the most competent at ideas, and ISTPs want to be the most competent at actual things. Snoop Dogg or Snoop Lion or whatever it is says something about 'whatever you're doing, be the best you possibly can at it. Even if you're just flipping burgers at McDonald's - be the best damn burger flipper you can'. I think that is basically the ISTP attitude. So Te types set goals according to objective data in the outside world ('I want to make X amount of money' / 'I want to get this thing done by 5 o'clock') or whatever, and then they might end up compromising on the actual specifics of whatever it is in order to achieve that goal. Because Ti doesn't do 'outside goals' like that and is just concerned with whether things are good on their own terms or not, I think perfectionism lends itself to Ti far better than it does to Te although obviously some Te types are going to be perfectionistic too and some Ti types are not going to be perfectionistic. With regards to Si - Si perfectionism is to do with everything being in the right place, everything being orderly etc (generalisation/oversimplification), whereas Ti perfectionism is to do with competence. ESTJs can easily be perfectionistic too but it's a slightly different kind of perfectionism, if that makes sense. Our OP's BF seems to be more about competence.

3. With my point about thinking dominants identifying themselves as emotional or whatever it was I was saying…I'm not sure how you can accuse me of being too specific when I said '_sometimes_ you find this in _thinking dominants_'. It seemed to me that everything in the OP was consistent with Ti _except _the stuff about altruism and stuff, so I just attempted to explain how it is/could be possible that somebody with inferior Fe could identify them as 'too altruistic' or whatever it was OP's BF said. Annoyingly, all of the times I've come across this have been irl, so I can't back myself up here whatsoever and you can feel free to discard that whole point altogether, but I maintain that the theory is plausible on its own.

4. I agree that all of the types are misunderstood and that the S types are more interesting than people on here portray them as. However I do get the impression that you let that cloud your judgment when it comes to actually typing people…like I said, maybe some part of you _wants_ these people to be S types so that you have like…actual examples from which you can say 'look guys, S types are interesting too'. Like, everyone online overtypes everybody as N types, and you end up overtyping people as S types to compensate. I think it is good, and I don't doubt your sincerity one bit, but maybe you are biased in ways that you are not aware of? Or maybe you are not and are 100% correct about everything. And maybe I am biased too. In fact in all likelihood I probably am too. I dunno. Anyway, the point is that that is what I think and you can either take it or leave it, I suppose.

5. I'm going to look at Russell Brand again at some point. The more I think about him, the more I think that you are correct that he is ESFP, but I haven't done any research so I don't know.

*General - *

1. Both ISTPs and ESTJs can be workaholics.


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## Velasquez (Jul 3, 2012)

If we take a Keirseyan approach to this (which I am not normally inclined to do, but why not?), the obvious question to ask is...is this person an artisan/experiencer, or are they a guardian? Obviously the label of 'guardian' for SJs is problematic and clumsy, but for the purposes of this conversation it'll do.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

@Velasquez, I think it's best if I answer here, you can find confirmation above though :kitteh:



> 1. What do you mean by 'his pictures'? Post 7. Can you elaborate?


Sure :kitteh: His pictures on facebook and any picture display an attention whore performing some attention whoring attitude lol... carnival costumes, some weird dress pulling attention per say, singing to entertain his friends. Yup...lol... that's pretty much what is in there, an attention whoring attention whore XD ahahahahah 



> 2. I'm glad you like me, and nobody is going to get into a major fight with arkigos. You can prod and poke at him all you like, and he always remains calm. Also I like you too <3


purrr :kitteh: me likes appreciation exchanges :kitteh: 



> 3. If your BF is definitely not an introvert, then I have no good answer for you. Which is why I think he is an introvert. Maybe ESTP, but then where is his Fe?


Bingo! My same issue! could you define what you would expect from an Fe tertiary, please? Maybe with that he would be able to tell us if he's there or not :kitteh:



> 4. Thank your Bf for the clarification on his empathy thing. I think it is clear that he is thinking dominant, so we're left between ESTJ and ISTP. All signs point away from ESTJ for me.


I'm really sorry to do this, but... Te dom is quite unlikely to me, I already told @arkigos... I would expect a Te dom to organize a week end out like 

at 9.00 am wake-up and breakfast
at 10.00 am we leave for xyz
at 11.15 am we arrive at xyz and to y

etcetera... but when we left for the week end out my bf's idea of organization was: we're going, find a bed! 
I asked him what we were going to do, he said he wanted to see Lucca Comics and Pisa, how and when was usless information... 

as to ISTPs my dad is ISTP and my bf and him are so different... dad is all about fixing stuff and being the smart guy, my bf doesn't give a puck (lol, me luvs pucks XD ....ahem sorry) about those things, he's more about action, doing, going, performing, getting, achieving... so... pfft... no clue really... I'm curious about the quest for ESTP


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## Velasquez (Jul 3, 2012)

Kore said:


> purrr :kitteh: me likes appreciation exchanges :kitteh:


Haha, don't encourage me, I could do that all day.

Generally people's tertiary function has a certain kind of childishness to it. Fe tertiaries sometimes get mistaken for Fe dominants because their Fe can sometimes be so cartoonish that it's the most immediate thing about them. (Taylor Swift is the example here, although again, not many people agree with me that she is ESTP) Other times, with Fe tertiaries...they have like, a distinct awareness of what's _appropriate_, but being appropriate themselves isn't really a major goal with them, so they can use that knowledge to kind of get what they want out of other people and life in general. Sometimes ESTPs can be manipulative (think of that monorail guy from The Simpsons...he's obviously in tune with what the people around him want, and is really slick and smooth and personable and seeks to align himself with the people around him, but that alignment with people around him isn't his main goal like it might be in an Fe dom). Other times they can be incredibly lovely. Sometimes they appear to not have any Fe at all.

So I suppose the main theme is that ESTPs have this kind of...social fluidity about them. While they don't necessarily seek to _get along_ with people on their own terms, they're still very good at navigating social situations. They are well liked by everyone, but what they are doing is _technique_ rather than _empathy_ or whatever. And I should stress that there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.*

Edit:

*


Kore said:


> as to ISTPs my dad is ISTP and my bf and him are so different... dad is all about fixing stuff and being the smart guy, my bf doesn't give a puck (lol, me luvs pucks XD ....ahem sorry) about those things, he's more about action, doing, going, performing, getting, achieving... so... pfft... no clue really... I'm curious about the quest for ESTP


This is good stuff. With this in mind, I think ESTP is probably actually more plausible than ISTP.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

let's see what @_arkigos_ and @_Acerbusvenator_ think :kitteh:


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

On a side note, I just read him the following post by monemi and he agreed totally. 
(I guess in a few days he will inform me that I took him wrong or that I translated it wrong but ATM that's how things are)



monemi said:


> We're pretty versatile. 'Don't' seems like an exaggeration but I'll give it a try. I expect other ESTP's will correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> We're observant. When I meet people, I'm trying to figure out if they're trustworthy. If I can't figure them out easily, I'll start pressing buttons and play it up to get a reaction out of them. I want to know what I'm dealing with as soon as possible and I'll be an annoying bitch if I have to be to figure them out. Don't let me catch you lying when I meet you. I won't call you out on it, but I'll lose respect for you from the outset and it's unlikely you'll ever have my respect in the future.
> 
> ...


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## Ludovico.Rex (Nov 24, 2013)

Kore said:


> On a side note, I just read him the following post by monemi and he agreed totally.
> (I guess in a few days he will inform me that I took him wrong or that I translated it wrong but ATM that's how things are)


This thread is getting confusing...

May we have a re-cap? The key points? The juice?

Then more people could get into it.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

Ludovico.Rex said:


> This thread is getting confusing...
> 
> May we have a re-cap? The key points? The juice?
> 
> Then more people could get into it.


I don't understand, it's just 3 pages, it's not that long to read...


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## Ludovico.Rex (Nov 24, 2013)

Kore said:


> I don't understand, it's just 3 pages, it's not that long to read...


A re-cap might even help you as well, you know  Try it.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

Ludovico.Rex said:


> A re-cap might even help you as well, you know  Try it.


All right, I hope I won't regret it, but you seem like having good intentions, so... 

Se: wasn't much taken into account, actually, we named Se doms but no one made a point about Se in my bf's questionnaire
Si: arkigos seems to see tons of Si in there, but I'm not entirely sure about it because the types having Si do not have much in common with my bf

Ne: arkigos seems to see a lot of Ne in my bf's questionnaire, but again, I'm not persuaded because he's a huge Ne killer in RL, but not the way Ne inferiors do it, rather the way no Ne types do it. 
Ni: it was just thrown in superficially here and there, mostly claiming it's not there

Te: thinking was the main focus up to now. but Te doms and Te tertiary have a greater need for scheduling which my bf doesn't have at all. Scheduling to him is a waste of time, he wants to go, do, achieve, perform etc...
Ti: we didn't go much in depth with it, we agreed though that being Te excluded it has to be Ti

Fe: I was asking for examples of Fe tertiary at play because we haven't yet come to splitting Fe/Fi
Fi: never mentioned. 


ESTJ: excluded for lack of Te
ISTP: excluded for lack of typical traits
ESTP: suggested but not confirmed


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## Ludovico.Rex (Nov 24, 2013)

Kore said:


> All right, I hope I won't regret it, but you seem like having good intentions, so...
> 
> Se: wasn't much taken into account, actually, we named Se doms but no one made a point about Se in my bf's questionnaire
> Si: arkigos seems to see tons of Si in there, but I'm not entirely sure about it because the types having Si do not have much in common with my bf
> ...



ES *x* P?...What do you think?


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

Ludovico.Rex said:


> ES *x* P?...What do you think?


Not really, even in dichotomies theory that T would be the only certain thing... we're still at ESTX in dichotomies theory, but given the excluded J I'd say dichotomies point clearly to ESTP. 

Personally I don't trust dichotomies, I'm all for cognitive functions theory, so, my post with monemi's quote was an affirmation of Fe. 

So now, I'm standing with Ti-Fe, what I need to find out still is if he is Ne dom or Se dom, the inferior will come automatically. I can see the point of Se dom, a little less the point of Ne dom, but honestly speaking I don't know much about ENTPs so, I still leave options open


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## Ludovico.Rex (Nov 24, 2013)

Kore said:


> Not really, even in dichotomies theory that T would be the only certain thing... we're still at ESTX in dichotomies theory, but given the excluded J I'd say dichotomies point clearly to ESTP.
> 
> Personally I don't trust dichotomies, I'm all for cognitive functions theory, so, my post with monemi's quote was an affirmation of Fe.
> 
> So now, I'm standing with Ti-Fe, what I need to find out still is if he is Ne dom or Se dom, the inferior will come automatically. I can see the point of Se dom, a little less the point of Ne dom, but honestly speaking I don't know much about ENTPs so, I still leave options open



I think we should try to simplify this -- if we want a four-letter code.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

well... given that @arkigos knows a thing or two I think I'm going to pick ENTP for now... he saw Ne at play and tons of Si, which points to Ne dom... so... ENTP makes sense.


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

@Kore - I can almost guarantee he isn't an Ne dom. There has been no sign of that at all. 

ESTP is kinda the only choice at this point, given the criteria:

1) Must be an extravert
2) Isn't a 'J'
3) Must be a 'T'
4) I don't think anyone will agree with an Ne-dom typing

That only leaves ESTP... the only other option would be ENTJ and bank on tertiary Se to explain the lack of planning - focus on achievement. However, I don't think there is a good foundation for that at all. ESTP, then. His answers did not strike me that way - but I've been wrong before.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

@arkigos, the guess I made was for ESTP as well (haven't posted it here earlier on purpose to not taint any analysis you may make).


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## Velasquez (Jul 3, 2012)

Yeah, I think that now that we've got a little bit more information, this one is actually pretty much cut and dried. ESTP


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## Psychopomp (Oct 3, 2012)

Kore said:


> Thanks for the questions, arky :kitteh: ! here are his answers after each quote:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh, almost missed this. Yes, this is all congruent with an ESTP typing... I personally would keep ESTJ in the back of my head if I were you, but ESTP seems to be the best idea at this point for sure.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

How do we deal with the part: no interest for sensory input? *grin*


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

@arkigos: didn't you agree that tons of Si points to Ne dom? And didn't you say at the beginning of the whole thing you saw Si everywhere?


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Kore said:


> How do we deal with the part: no interest for sensory input? *grin*


It's not about interest and also, he's a gamer, gaming gives you a lot of sensory input. Just seeing is sensory input and so is hearing etc. Rather flawed belief.


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## BurningIce (Oct 19, 2013)

So, ESTP doesn't make sense but it has to be because you can't see the drive for action of Ne doms? LOL!


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