# Sps, are you at war with your sx? Sxs, are you at war with your sp?



## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

I generally like to be by myself and not to have anyone bother me. I really enjoy my own company; so I rarely get lonely in the conventional sense.

This all unfortunately goes to hell when it comes to romantic relationships. Either the other person ( more often than not) is moving too fast for me and I need to cling to my boundaries and flee from them (sp), or they are moving too slow and I don't feel my intensity for them reciprocated and I experience great internal frustration at this (sx).

The irony is that part of me, is _acutely_ aware that it ironically might _not_ necessarily be a bad thing because my greatest fear is losing completely control of myself which can happen in an unhealthy romantic obsession.

If I had my way, I would completely skip over infatuation altogether and just head straight to the LTR part of things. That's why I value friendships much more highly than romantic relationships: no messy emotions.

*So, I would like to know, are others in as great conflict over their first two instinctual variants as I am?*


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## Devrim (Jan 26, 2013)

Sex/So seems to work for me


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## meridannight (Nov 23, 2012)

nope. they're at a paradox with each other. where they go into conflict i want both (sometimes/often(?) contradicting) resolutions at the same time. 

it's fine. i'm used to it. i'm used to living in paradox.


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## perennialurker (Oct 1, 2009)

No. Maybe I used to feel that way, but now in a strange way, I feel that my dominant Sx instinct and secondary Sp instinct support one another. 

The Sp works as a defense to keep myself safe and well taken care of. The Sx is not always present and usually tolerates my solitary attitude until something (or someone) throws on the Sx switch and it takes over. 

Nonetheless both work together as screening agents, ensuring that I invest minimal energy into nonessential areas of my life and overwhelming energy toward things that excite my passion.


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## braided pain (Jul 6, 2012)

Yes. My sp is almost as strong as my sx (so is barely existent). There is a constant push between the two that can make me run hot and cold with someone until I know exactly where he's coming from and where he thinks the relationship is going. That's when sp settles down.


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## Vaka (Feb 26, 2010)

sp/sx and no, not at all. I think I might be an sp/sx with heavy sx. Sx and sp just go hand in hand for me. Sx brings in deep, intense indulgence in myself(sp), my worlds I've created(sp again), and in my passions. It gives me a desire for rawness I embrace


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## MissyMaroon (Feb 24, 2010)

I am an Sp/Sx and I don't really feel much inner conflict there. I imagine an Sx dom in general would have more issues with it because of the hot-cold energy of the instinct. Having self preservation first stabilizes me that much more. I have my passions, I have my interests. I'm crazy about them actually. I just feel like a generally stable (albeit kind of weird and creatively crazed) person who reserves lots of energy and passion for things and people that I love. Outside of that, I tend to be fairly low-key. Or, hyper, mreh. XD

I guess what I'm trying to say is I feel perfectly natural being the way I am.


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## wk05 (Aug 26, 2012)

I can relate to this. 

I yearn for intense relationships, but I rarely put myself in a position to attain them. 

It is a constant source of frustration.

A sense of feeling "trapped" within my sp tendencies when all I really want to do is satiate my sx thirst.


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

wk05 said:


> I can relate to this.
> 
> I yearn for intense relationships, but I rarely put myself in a position to attain them.
> 
> ...


Actually, I for the most part really don't think too much about them . . . that is until I happen to somehow fall into one. First, my sp is extremely careful and guarded, then in the next stage: infatuation; my sx goes off the wall batshit certifiable until I am able once again to reflect and get back to my safer and much more comfortable sp.

Interestingly enough, my sx, rarely causes me too much problems in platonic friendship; which is probably why I value friendships so much. In it, I feel that my sp and sx can co-exist the happiest. In friendships, I can both experience intense closeness with someone but also maintain my separate space, the easiest.

It really isn't the sexual aspects of romantic relationships that are the problem for me; I feel very comfortable with that; its the _emotional_ aspect, that I have so much trouble with. I guess it may have something to do with the fact that I am very uncomfortable with my sx, and am terrified when it either takes over or when I give it free rein. When it isn't kept in check by my sp; it feels very ungrounded to me.


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## wk05 (Aug 26, 2012)

TreasureTower said:


> *Actually, I for the most part really don't think too much about them . . . that is until I happen to somehow fall into one. First, my sp is extremely careful and guarded, then in the next stage: infatuation; my sx goes off the wall batshit certifiable until I am able once again to reflect and get back to my safer and much more comfortable sp.*
> 
> Interestingly enough, my sx, rarely causes me too much problems in platonic friendship; which is probably why I value friendships so much. In it, I feel that my sp and sx can co-exist the happiest. In friendships, I can both experience intense closeness with someone but also maintain my separate space, the easiest.
> 
> It really isn't the sexual aspects of romantic relationships that are the problem for me; I feel very comfortable with that; its the _emotional_ aspect, that I have so much trouble with. I guess it may have something to do with the fact that I am very uncomfortable with my sx, and am terrified when it either takes over or when I give it free rein. When it isn't kept in check by my sp; it feels very ungrounded to me.


I agree with more or less everything you have said here. Especially the bold. 
I don't have much else to add because you have pretty much already summed it up, haha. 



Re: the bold text. 

It is seemingly inevitable that I go through (endure) this process. For some reason it exists even in the instance of a budding platonic friendship. I don't open up to the person for like 6-9 months and then when I realise that we have a connection (platonic or romantic) then I go all out INFATUATED and almost obsessive. It's super destabilising. Luckily now I can acknowledge that I'm just going to have to wait it out, before, I used to do everything in my brain power to fight against it. 

It invariably calms down, though sometimes it takes longer than others. I can almost _feel _my sp acting against it, trying to rationalise it, persuade me to devote more time to my solitary pursuits, but my sx pretty much takes over for 1-4 months or so.


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

wk05 said:


> I agree with more or less everything you have said here. Especially the bold.
> I don't have much else to add because you have pretty much already summed it up, haha.
> 
> 
> ...


Well, it's really good to know that I'm not the only who goes through this. I see myself in general as rational and balanced person; so, it is hard on my self-esteem to _suddenly_ albeit _temporarily_, become obsessed like that. It's weird 'though because honestly, I really have no desire whatsoever to actually _be_ in a romantic relationship at all. That said, should I come in contact with someone who I feel an intense romantic connection with; suddenly, I almost feel that my life _depends_ on this relationship. I don't really understand how to even logically explain it, because if I am perfectly fine being without one; than how can I suddenly make something so important to me; that never even mattered beforehand. It's almost as if, I have two distinct and completely separate personalities.

:crazy:


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## wk05 (Aug 26, 2012)

TreasureTower said:


> Well, it's really good to know that I'm not the only who goes through this. I see myself in general as rational and balanced person; so, it is hard on my self-esteem to _suddenly_ albeit _temporarily_, become obsessed like that. It's weird 'though because honestly, I really have no desire whatsoever to actually _be_ in a romantic relationship at all. That said, should I come in contact with someone who I feel an intense romantic connection with; suddenly, I almost feel that my life _depends_ on this relationship. I don't really understand how to even logically explain it, because if I am perfectly fine being without one; than how can I suddenly make something so important to me; that never even mattered beforehand. It's almost as if, I have two distinct and completely separate personalities.
> 
> :crazy:


Yep yep yep, can totally relate. 
The only logic I have for it (because no-one else around me seems to get so obsessive like I do, though, if they did they obviously wouldn't tell me, but just a hunch)...is that because it is so f****ng *rare* that I find someone who I connect with, like, _really _connect with, someome who is seemingly from the same grain as me and sees the world in the same way I do, that when I do finally happen to find someone like that, I go nuts. Because prior to finding them, I was totally absolutely completely deprived of that strong connection. It's like my body is telling me how much it has been neglected (socially) and now that I find potential in another, it fights as hard as it can to propel me towards that person. That's my current theory anyway.

Are you familiar with the concept 'Limerence'? 
David Sack, M.D.: Limerence and the Biochemical Roots of Love Addiction
Limerence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

That is exactly what I experience. Except it generally only lasts about 3-6 months or so.... depending on the person.
Though, to be honest I could probably apply all of that to someone I have known for over 2 yrs now (a friend, platonic, who I can't seem to work up the courage to pursue, probably due to my damn SP) - actually this friend is platonic at the moment, more of an acquaintance really, and I cannot for the life of me decide whether my attraction is platonic or romantic. Ugh, the confusion. 


Let me know if you can relate to the point on Limerence, it would be a great consolation to me if you did :blushed:


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## wk05 (Aug 26, 2012)

It's kind of ridiculous to be honest. I don't have a 'moderate' switch. 
I'm either detached and pretty unconcerned with people I know, or I am obsessed as fuck. 
Same goes for learning and intellectual/musical pursuits. 
There's no grey area (seemingly). Which, again, is why it's such a surprise to be catapulted into this limerent/infatuated phase so suddenly. 

I think being a core 5 exacerbates this, because 5 is fundamentally SP already. Add another layer of SP on to that and then a fiery SX fighting against _all _of that....


It is very destabilising.

Also: http://personalitycafe.com/enneagram-personality-theory-forum/98872-sx-sp-sp-sx.html


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

wk05 said:


> Yep yep yep, can totally relate.
> The only logic I have for it (because no-one else around me seems to get so obsessive like I do, though, if they did they obviously wouldn't tell me, but just a hunch)...is that because it is so f****ng *rare* that I find someone who I connect with, like, _really _connect with, someome who is seemingly from the same grain as me and sees the world in the same way I do, that when I do finally happen to find someone like that, I go nuts. Because prior to finding them, I was totally absolutely completely deprived of that strong connection. It's like my body is telling me how much it has been neglected (socially) and now that I find potential in another, it fights as hard as it can to propel me towards that person. That's my current theory anyway.
> 
> Are you familiar with the concept 'Limerence'?
> ...


Well, today is your lucky day, I guess; I am just fucked up about relationships as you are. 

:tongue:

No seriously, that is the main reason why I avoid romantic relationships altogether. I just can't stand it, when I lose control of myself like that.

:crazy:


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## wk05 (Aug 26, 2012)

TreasureTower said:


> Well, today is your lucky day, I guess; I am just fucked up about relationships as you are.
> 
> :tongue:
> 
> ...


It's only unbearable if it's unreciprocated. (which is all the time, lol). Ugh.


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)

wk05 said:


> It's only unbearable if it's unreciprocated. (which is all the time, lol). Ugh.


According to that link you gave me; lack of reciprocity is a major factor in limerence.

What's hardest for me; is if someone really likes me initially, then cools off. That is the worst.


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## wk05 (Aug 26, 2012)

TreasureTower said:


> What's hardest for me; is if someone really likes me initially, then cools off. That is the worst.


Yeah, haha. I think what happens (for me anyway) is that I get super intense in the initial stages of conversing with this potential friend/love and then I kind of disappear and withdraw and they get bored during my absence.

I can't put all the blame on them, my sporadic communication style isn't exactly conducive to forming friendships.


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## braided pain (Jul 6, 2012)

wk05 said:


> Are you familiar with the concept 'Limerence'?



I... Oh. Damn.

I've always avoided drugs and gone easy on the alcohol due to all the addictions in my family.

Apparently I didn't avoid it after all.


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## Proteus (Mar 5, 2010)

I wouldn't say my dominant Sp variant is constantly struggling to keep the Sx at bay or anything, but every now and then it does complicate matters. At times when I get the need to indulge in something wholeheartedly to the point of it shutting out my surroundings I'm often able to do that with things I enjoy and inside my own head. I don't necessarily need others in order to have an outlet for my passions. 

However I do go through periods of loneliness or have the desire to forge actual connections with other people (not necessarily in a romantic or sexual sense, just a bond beyond accquaintanceship) and find myself at a loss. It's just difficult for me to cultivate such relationships or maintain them as it's not what I'm used to doing. This doesn't come around that often but when it does it's often difficult to navigate. These urges are typically a strong undercurrent that I try to manage however I can but sometimes it's frustrating, wanting to be close to others but not being sure how or not having anyone to do so with.


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

lycanized said:


> sp/sx and no, not at all. I think I might be an sp/sx with heavy sx. Sx and sp just go hand in hand for me. Sx brings in deep, intense indulgence in myself(sp), my worlds I've created(sp again), and in my passions. It gives me a desire for rawness I embrace


makes sense.
Sp/Sx is typically less internally conflicted than Sx/Sp (Sp/Sx with heavy Sx is my favorite subtype. they seem to strike just the right balance)


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## Jaune (Jul 11, 2013)

I think I'm sx blind, and it doesn't seem to get in the way of my high sp. Most of my sx pertains to activities rather than people, and whenever I do become highly interested in a person, I keep my distance and don't mind things that way. It's more my so that gets in the way, to be honest.


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## amongfirstslugs (Jun 23, 2012)

Hah, I feel the same about skipping to a LTR. I am sx/sp and historically if someone seems too intimate too fast, I have been fine to go along with it because it satisfies sx...and then afterwards I will think of sp-things like is this sustainable, will our future children eat, etc. 

It seems sp is all the instinct I have left for dating these days, which means I just don't date, because @#$! everyone. 

Generally they do conflict in ways, like sometimes I really need to pee but I'm having an enthralling conversation and I'm like oOOooOoh-Decisions.


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## Krayfish (Nov 3, 2015)

Chesire Tower said:


> *So, I would like to know, are others in as great conflict over their first two instinctual variants as I am?*


From what I've read, this seems to be a pretty common scenario for contraflow people. Personally I feel as though all my instincts are sort of at odds with one another to a degree


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## Hellfire (Nov 30, 2015)

Not really no. A partner becomes an indispensable part of my nest, so to speak. I start automatically looking out for them too.

Edit: I should add. Intimacy, intensity and vulnerability are only ever bad things if I'm with the wrong person (that is someone who disrupts my nesting instinct or sense of survival in an emotional or material sense.). If it's the right person I rarely feel threatened, defensive or the need to take control. I saw sexual eights described by Helen Palmer as Possessive/Surrendering, and SP as Satisfactory survival. If its the right person, and they are _trustworthy, loving, competent and open_ there is no reason to feel endangered. Why would I? They're a part of me now. 
I am SP first though and if a person isn't right, or trustworthy I do protect myself first then.


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## pwowq (Aug 7, 2016)

Wouldn't say I'm at war with my blind-spot. It does get cringy childish SX or very immature SX if I don't keep it away. A cognitive dissonance happens when I try show uniqueness intentionally while inherently thinking and most often acting comfortably around the sentiment "I'm not unique.".


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## Saira (Feb 2, 2012)

sx/sp here!

Yes, to the point of sometimes not being sure which instinct is more dominant in me. I think it's sx, blocked by sp, or maybe blocked by some other problems, like depression/anxiety, it's hard to tell. I am definitely more sx on the inside than I let myself behave. It's like insatiable hunger for something I can only call _more_, unknown, undefined thing(s) that I constantly feel that I lack in life. I need to have intensity in my life, I thrive when something new, interesting and even risky is going on. Without it, when my life seems bland and boring, I get depressed, and I act out destructively - like I need to create that intensity myself no matter what it costs.

However, from some reason, I don't feel full of energy at all, on the contrary. I am very protective towards it, I constantly choose to act less, or not to act at all. I am lazy. I hate that, and feel it's not natural for me, but it's like being sick - you hate being confined to bed, but you simply don't feel well enough to get up and _do _things. Again, I'm not sure how much it's sp, and how much some issue which causes my lack of energy. 

I'm not very "neurotic" about some main sp issues (activelly working on my survival is not that high on my list of priorities; I'm very lazy here and keep forgeting to think about things like food until it's too late - then it suddenly becomes the most important thought in my head!), but there are certain things I feel very nervous without - physical comfort and beautiful, comfortable athmosphere! Hygiene, ambient etc. are extremely important to me. My love of food and comfort made me certain for a while I was sp-first. 

In other words, I rarely think about sp-issues in advance, but it can really ruin my mood when I realize I'm not physically comfortable (hunger, lack of hygiene in some place).
Sx intensity is always somewhere in the background of my mind. Lost, but not forgotten lol.


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## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

Sx/Sp
No there is no conflict of interest.

The whole point of the system is that you pay attention to two and have blindspot on one.
Sx/So are the only type that would feel that Sp conflicts with Sx,
just as So/Sx will feel Sp conflicting with So.
As the dom instinct is the one that harbour the most insecurity.
Any attempt of the blindspot to take away energy is seen as a direct assault on ones insecurity.
The security of the second instinct is realistic and balanced.
It doesn't tie itself in a knot unless there is a real problem like being in the desert without water,
and even then one will be levelheaded and try to fix it to the end.
As opposed to dom Sp who go into conservation mode at the slightest hint of a possible shortage.


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## Dare (Nov 8, 2016)

My sx/sp was more divided when I was a child -- when I wasn't inhaling books, I'd 'connect' with nature or do dangerous stunts. The stuff the other little girls got up to at playtime really didn't cut it. I'm surprised I didn't break my neck. My Mom had to go out of her way to get me to eat, wear warm clothing, come inside when it rains etc and was dismayed that my version of a scrape was the skin missing up one side on my leg (my bicycle was a motorbike in my mind, I had to go low on the tight fast turns...) It was a time of 'what sp?' basically. Naturally I assumed I'd grow up to be a spy (lol -- this is how I justified 'practice' jumping off the roof etc).

Heading into my early teenage years, it was life that took a sharp turn and I had to learn to take care of myself. At first I was just frightened so it was all about sp but after a while my pent up sx side needed to come out. I ended up having this hugely stressful double life for a couple of years; a hyper-responsible (sp) side with a wild (sx) counterbalance. Things got better after I shifted to doing work that contains intensity and I decided on a career path that will combine both sx & sp. I resigned my questionable sx side to reading about (optimal) relationships & watching action movies (until I could meet Mr Right and take it out on him 

At this point I see my sx/sp as far more integrated. Putting sx into my sp things makes them better for me (intensify the mundane), as is true in reverse (don't get too crazy). There is still a major focus on sx mentally, but my behavior doesn't (usually) reflect that. I've worked out that sp things taken care of forms the base for a good life for me. I enjoy sx better as the layer on top of that foundation. I'm a lot more calculating at this age and less, well, Dare -- although that still happens occasionally, when things aren't moving at the right speed/depth/intensity. 

In a way, for me anyway, I see sx as sp-ish, just on the pair-bonded couple level -- we care for, watch out for one another and tend to each other's needs (where possible/appropriate). We're a team that crush achieve goals together. It's just a bigger 'one' to 'preserve' than a single person. I expect I'll spend a great deal of time in the future thinking about the 'fitness' of my marriage and each of us in it. Just not when he's chasing me around the backyard. In little clothing. In the rain. Perhaps I've changed less than I think...


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