# What function?



## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Feel free to ask if something about me seems unclear. :tongue:
> I've always related to 8w7 quite well and I agree I might be type 7. What about instinctual stacking?


I will probably ask you a lot in the future, haha!!  Thanks.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> I will probably ask you a lot in the future, haha!!  Thanks.


Sure, ask away. I'm ready.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Sure, ask away. I'm ready.


Thanks. I am tired now XD


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Sure, ask away. I'm ready.


Do you ever feel that your type has changed through the years, and can you see any social reasons (non mbti) for why it could?


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> Do you ever feel that your type has changed through the years, and can you see any social reasons (non mbti) for why it could?


No, I don’t. I evolved through the years, I got a lot of experience, sure, but, at the very core, I’ve always stayed the same - ambitious, motivated, high-principled, honest, spontaneous and good-hearted.


I’ve been at war with myself for quite too many times in the past, but I am starting to become comfortable with my own self, with my “all or nothing thinking” and seeing things as absolutes - my feelings aren’t reality.


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## spaceynyc (Feb 18, 2017)

sounds like an Fi soup with some Ni seasoning


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> No, I don’t. I evolved through the years, I got a lot of experience, sure, but, at the very core, I’ve always stayed the same - ambitious, motivated, high-principled, honest, spontaneous and good-hearted.
> 
> 
> I’ve been at war with myself for quite too many times in the past, but I am starting to become comfortable with my own self, with my “all or nothing thinking” and seeing things as absolutes - my feelings aren’t reality.


I got a XXTJ feeling from this  Would you say you are introverted or extraverted, and do you focus more on things, people, ideas? Do you get energy from communicating with others and or by being alone? If you are an introvert you can still feel lonely, it's often communication in it self that can be draining. So an introvert often want company around...as long as it's not too intense communication/attention vice. Extraverts often need more action or stimulation and can get bored more easily. An EXFX focus on people while an EXTX focus on the outer world of things. An IXTX focus on the inner world of theories while an IXFX focus on the inner world of theory people vice, generally speaking.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

@*Electra* @*Turi*

I'll try to keep it straight and informative at the moment, need to spit it out. 

I remember being the healthiest and mostly in peace with myself at the age of 20. I find no use in thinking about the past, but things were quite different back then, if you think about it. I was a lot simpler than now. 
Back then, I’ve lost a person I deeply cared about and was inspired by - my grandmother. The day I got to know, she was in hospital, unconscious, I told myself “It’s awful and devastating, but there is nothing I'd be able to do to change the fact. There is no actual use in being sad or displaying feelings of loss and resentment, as it has no real use - it simply _will not change anything_.” 
Waking up earlier the next day, starting to do usual things I do - plan, take action, succeed. 
I came to the hospital the day I was told she was still unconscious and at a very bad condition, I knew she was dying and there was _nothing_ I could do about it. When she did, I was overwhelmed by the pain and emptiness on the inside, but I shoved it down, never showing anybody I suffer. To be honest, I didn't care that people around me were waiting for an emotional response, _I didn't think it mattered_. I kept it rational keeping myself busy with goals and activities. Slightly remember thinking to myself back then “_Emotions have no use. _I feel what I feel and I am perfectly aware of own emotional state on the inside, but the state I'm in doesn’t have to do _anything_ with the flow of life and the outer world. _I’ve got to keep things going_, life goes on, time flies. Feelings have no weight on the _real_, actual world, they only matter to me, therefore have no use. Strategy, planning and, most importantly, action is what truly, essentially matters.” 

Now, pretty much, I am able to say that I have quite _too many_ feelings and emotions on the inside that have been put aside _for years_, too many to ignore, as if they are screaming from the very bottom begging me to be dealt with. 

A lot of influences started to come in as I got older and, just like everyone else, I wanted to fill myself with the sense of belonging, but I’ve dashingly realized that sense of belonging comes from being the purest and truest self and, because I couldn’t be entirely comfortable with myself around other people to the point of not being able to interact and present myself the right, proper way, I’ve pushed away too many. The main focus has always been on _action_ - I’ve always believed that people have to perceive me by _what I do at my very best intentions_, not what I say and who I seem to come off as on the surface, but I kept falling into the same trap. 

Always thought that communication and good relationship is a part of getting things done for myself more efficiently, always loved the idea of “collecting” people in a useful manner. Had very few people to _actually _make me feel something and, everytime I did, it came in overwhelming, intense waves - addictable, yet resentful. 

I do think that there is always a part of ourselves we suppress. Part we are too afraid or too stubborn to admit about ourselves. Part of a personality we hide deep inside, keep thinking we are better off without, and is actually something we do not choose, but rather something that has always naturally been there. I’ve had a wall up for much of my life - people could see me, but they were never getting all of me, I was running in a constant cycle of distraction and suppression. 

Somehow, nowadays, I do feel that it is coming out and there’s nothing I can or intentionally want to do to stop it. I have to _get out_, I have to explore myself, I have to fulfill what I’ve kept inside, spend time with myself and give myself a chance to live life unapologetically.

Can’t say I focus on things, people, neither ideas entirely. I focus on goals and whatever needs to be in priority to reach it. I focus on values. Without goals and ambition, I become lost, numb and paralyzed.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

@*Electra* @*Turi*

I was in a relationship I perfectly understood that he uses and mistreats me, logically, intuitively. I knew he would lie every now and then, but kept playing silly, because I loved the feelings it gave me - the thrill, intensity, utter control.

Not going to lie, a small part of me wanted to know what it would be like to take endless care of a person and be taken care of, and to experiment with values and behavioral patterns of my own. I’ve come too far, because I was addicted to the feeling of novelty of that, even though I knew I’m not the type of person to give everything away for a conventional relationship and love in a sentimental, stereotypical manner. 

I’d lie and fake reactions to see what he would do next, I’d take him back after endless lies to see what he will come up with, what twisted and unexpected schemes would he play to get me back and what potential he might suggest. Trigger myself to feel alive, experience for the sake of it. I loved building a map of his behavior - predictable, structured, a train going from A to B, so on. Loved observing how every action brought a prospect, predictable reaction - like a chess game. I love anything fascinating, until it becomes trivial and shallow. I drop a person with no potential. Is that bad though? Each person lives to act, experience, feel intense and rush into action, at some point of life. To be passionate about something. To be passionate about everything. 

I do play with people sometimes. Not because I am mainly interested in people themselves, but to test my own capabilities, to learn, to gain power.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Do you have some thoughts @Electra @*Turi* ?


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> Extraverts often need more action or stimulation and can get bored more easily.


Plus, yes, I do need constant action and stimulation, but it does not always come in the form of communication.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> I got a XXTJ feeling from this  Would you say you are introverted or extraverted, and do you focus more on things, people, ideas? Do you get energy from communicating with others and or by being alone? If you are an introvert you can still feel lonely, it's often communication in it self that can be draining. So an introvert often want company around...as long as it's not too intense communication/attention vice. Extraverts often need more action or stimulation and can get bored more easily. An EXFX focus on people while an EXTX focus on the outer world of things. An IXTX focus on the inner world of theories while an IXFX focus on the inner world of theory people vice, generally speaking.


Did you read a bunch of previous posts though? :laughing: :tongue:


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## Lady of Clockwork (Dec 14, 2017)

I don't believe any of this is much to do with the functions.

What you seem to be going through is a crossroad, as we all of us go through in our 20s. You're maturing, you want your independence, you've realised you've been living to fulfil others' expectation and came to realise none of that is what you wanted. Within a small, concentrated period of time, much happened to you in one go which left a greater impact, and now you're trying to conciliate that.

You could very well be an ENFJ who put too much focus on everything outside of yourself, on the object, or whatever you want to call it, and lost touch of your own self, which you're presently facing the consequences for. You've fallen into an overindulgence of Se to compensate that, which is what tends to happen with the lesser developed functions. You'll get on your feet again: if you are ENFJ, just refocus that Ni so your Fe doesn't lose itself again.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

@Electra 
@Turi

Are you ignoring me?


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> @*Electra*
> @*Turi*
> 
> Are you ignoring me?


No, I just have homework to do first.


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## SirCanSir (Mar 21, 2018)

Well, its not as if anyone could type you accurately based on just what you said here without knowing you. The first thing i thought reading your post was (same as me) and as you can see im an ENTP. I ve also been mistyped as J, but im closer to the ENTP (enthusiastic type 7w8) metnality. I used to believe types are absolute, but i see many differences between people of the same type and also many who get traits from more than one of them. Fi might not even be a concious function for me but i feel like im using it almost as much as fe. Isnt functions typing a little bit limiting? I mean one's personality is made by the life experiences he got which are unique. Its not like all ENTPs are going to use their functions the same way by the same amount.
So thats why i feel its really hard to type someone by just reading 10 lines of text (someone is going to say thats the P part of me).


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> No, I just have homework to do first.


Thanks God, I thought you forgot about me :tongue:


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Thanks God, I thought you forgot about me :tongue:


No, I just want to do it properly if I am gonna do it. I procastinate a lot but I should be doing my homework..*.right now!! *_Electraaaa_...*points pinger towards self*:angry:


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

SirCanSir said:


> Well, its not as if anyone could type you accurately based on just what you said here without knowing you. The first thing i thought reading your post was (same as me) and as you can see im an ENTP. I ve also been mistyped as J, but im closer to the ENTP (enthusiastic type 7w8) metnality. I used to believe types are absolute, but i see many differences between people of the same type and also many who get traits from more than one of them. Fi might not even be a concious function for me but i feel like im using it almost as much as fe. Isnt functions typing a little bit limiting? I mean one's personality is made by the life experiences he got which are unique. Its not like all ENTPs are going to use their functions the same way by the same amount.
> So thats why i feel its really hard to type someone by just reading 10 lines of text (someone is going to say thats the P part of me).


I am willing to write hundreds and thousands of lines if it needs to be done :tongue:


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## SirCanSir (Mar 21, 2018)

heavydirtysoul said:


> I am willing to write hundreds and thousands of lines if it needs to be done :tongue:


Haha so you ve got this much of energy to keep the thread alive huh?
Do what you will, im just going to be nearby... in the next tag watching peaky blinders and waiting for action.


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## SilentScream (Mar 31, 2011)

heavydirtysoul said:


> I didn't know about it :tongue:


I know. People talk about the Enneagram without talking about its origins. Shady origins = Invalid theory.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Soul Kitchen said:


> @*heavydirtysoul* I've read through your questionnaire, as well as posts 1, 6, 28, 29, and 42 from your functions thread. It's safe to say you're a Limbic INFP. I can elaborate on my reasons for typing you as such if you want, although it would take quite a bit of time to do so, hence why I would prefer to take such discussion to your questionnaire thread.


Sure, elabarote when you'll be able to. Could you also explain what does exactly "Limbic INFP" mean?


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

@Turi do you still think I am a thinking type? Could you give me some additional thoughts based on latest posts?


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

Turi said:


> This is a literal _avoidance _
> 
> with your _need/want to escape from them _.


It could also be related to enneagram type 7 which is often related to Ne...


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> @*Turi* do you still think I am a thinking type? Could you give me some additional thoughts based on latest posts?


I believe you are. I'll gt back to why


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> I believe you are. I'll gt back to why


Yay! Here you are, thank you. :heart:


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> It could also be related to enneagram type 7 which is often related to Ne...


Well, but you don't have to be Ne to be type 7?  From what I've read about perceiving functions, I relate to Se frankly the most. Not saying I've settled though.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Well, but you don't have to be Ne to be type 7?  From what I've read about perceiving functions, I relate to Se frankly the most. Not saying I've settled though.


Type 7 is very much Percieving yeah... I would be like:
Introverted iNtuitive 2/4/9 (feeler), 7 (persieving).
Here is where MBTI differ from Keirsey if we compare it to the Eneagram and don't use the functions, just the letters, if I get it right.

Avoidant personality disorder is assosiated with INFP but to avoid getting down is not assosiated with Fi. Fi is emidiate emotions and "is this right of me/others to do? Am I a bad person if this or that? etc". To avoid sad feelings or mindstates is a lot more assosiatd with some other personality style (not disorders). INFP is also usually submissive as opposed to leading. You like to be in control and lead rather then focus very much on the negative emotions so I would go with ExTJ, 8w7. That being said you could be introverted since your focus is self directed towards your inner world of things but INTJ's are usually type 5 and you have that directive 8 energy, and we could theorize that you were ISTJ but thy are more assosiated with type 1. Types with Fi up in their stack know emidietly how they feel about things and normally ar very aware how other feels too (unless suffereing from emidiate PTSD and simmilar conditions where emotions are supressed as functional protection from trauma) and people with Fe are said according to theory to be super aware how others feel but maybe not always so aware how they feel _them selves_. People with Fe high in their stack are said to observe peoples reactions and adjust automaticly. Peoples reactions are a high priority, and they often "delete" them self or put thm self aside to make room for others. Feeler types often analyze eyecontact, body language, tone of voice, energy level, use of words etc. very carefully to read what others feel. They are often very scared to say or do inappropriate things that annoys or bother others. They often take a subjective personal side in a conflict as oppose to thinkers who tend to be more objective. You supress your feelings for the logical thing to do, so: thinker. I don't know if you are iNtuitive or sensor yet, I have to read the posts you wrote me earlier properly first, but you spend a lot of time communicating with others in here, so I assume you are EXTJ, possibly ENTJ since you care about this theory , hehe. You might also be ENTP btw... but more 8 w7 points to ENTJ.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> Type 7 is very much Percieving yeah... I would be like:
> Introverted iNtuitive 2/4/9 (feeler), 7 (persieving).
> Here is where MBTI differ from Keisey if we compare it to the Eneagram and don't use the functions, just the letters, if I get it right.


Ooookay


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

@Electra I know you're busy, but I'll be waiting for more of your thoughts on my type when you will read my previous posts  Thank you so much.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Well, but you don't have to be Ne to be type 7?  From what I've read about perceiving functions, I relate to Se frankly the most. Not saying I've settled though.


Some types that are typically assosiated with type 8 are: ENTJ, ESTP, ESTJ


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> @*Electra* I know you're busy, but I'll be waiting for more of your thoughts on my type when you will read my previous posts  Thank you so much.


Your welcome, hun :heart:


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## Soul Kitchen (May 15, 2016)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Sure, elabarote when you'll be able to. Could you also explain what does exactly "Limbic INFP" mean?


To reiterate, I have no interest in discussing functions. I had intended to take our discussion to your questionnaire thread.

But in the meantime, I'll answer your question. The four dichotomies overlap with the Five Factor Model in a number of ways. E/I overlaps with Social/Reserved (Extraversion, obviously), N/S with Inquisitive/Non-Curious (Openness to Experience), F/T with Accommodating/Egocentric (Agreeableness), and J/P with Organised/Unstructured (Conscientiousness). There is one factor which doesn't overlap cleanly with any MBTI dichotomy, and that factor is called Neurotism, which is also known as Limbic/Calm.



Wikipedia said:


> Neuroticism identifies certain people who are more prone to psychological stress. The tendency to experience unpleasant emotions easily, such as anger, anxiety, depression, and vulnerability. Neuroticism also refers to the degree of emotional stability and impulse control and is sometimes referred to by its low pole, "emotional stability".


Your posts have given me the impression both that you're a person of turbulent feelings, and also the impression that deciphering those feelings is of paramount importance to you.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

Reap said:


> I know. People talk about the Enneagram without talking about its origins. Shady origins = Invalid theory.


I must admit I agree because; unrelated to the history, it is , (as is the stable character definicions of the zodiak signs) often somewhat related to the obvious traits of the types -or how they see them selves. But like you pointed out, age and environment matters. Also influences an culture.


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## Turi (May 9, 2017)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Because, hopefully, it will help me to understand myself and my deepest motivations a little bit more. It will help me to get a better judgement of my weak spots and, through that, I will be able to evolve and become even better.


ie help you get in touch with your introverted Feeling and/or Thinking side.
Which then, is likely not a default preference.



Electra said:


> It could also be related to enneagram type 7 which is often related to Ne...


I'm not hip to Enneagram type 7, the relationship to 'Ne' only rings true due to extroverted perceiving being the opposite of introverted judging, so yes, perhaps ExxP but not necessarily N.



heavydirtysoul said:


> Thank you. Although, I've never truly been living to fulfil others' expectations and, especially, needs - I've always been too preoccupied with expectations of my own striving to be twice as good as other people, often in a very harsh, scheming manner.
> 
> I find it nonsensical to preoccupy mind with memory, expectation and hope. There is no other experience than the present experience - concerning yourself with such things as others’ opinion is pretty much equal to being out of touch with reality. To be frankly honest, expectation, from both, external and internal sources, is no other than the root of constant chaos and endless misery - it makes simple things complicated, irrational and delusive. I always choose control over fallacy.


Okay so although you haven't been 'living to fulfill' the expectations of others - you're still very much people-focused in a competitive, "I have to be twice as good as you" kind of way, so you're clearly oriented towards the judging functions, imo, it's still extroverted judging here as you're wanting to discover your introverted side, you're not posting about wanting to get out and be helpful, do some hardwork, be more assertive etc (at least, as far as I've seen).

Re: 'no other experience than the present experience' ironically, the 'present experience' is an abstract concept that is constantly changing.

You note here, expectations from external and internal sources and a constant source of misery etc - what kind of misery, and what kind of control do you attempt to exert over it?



heavydirtysoul said:


> @*Electra* @*Turi*
> 
> I'll try to keep it straight and informative at the moment, need to spit it out.
> 
> ...


Probably Thinking - repress Feeling, keep it inside - focus on control as well, same with above - curious as to how this plays out in your life - it's like once you realize you can't control a situation or affect change, you basically just give up and resign yourself to the happenings of the external world - this (iirc) is related to extroversion of Sensation.



> Waking up earlier the next day, starting to do usual things I do - plan, take action, succeed.
> I came to the hospital the day I was told she was still unconscious and at a very bad condition, I knew she was dying and there was _nothing_ I could do about it. When she did, I was overwhelmed by the pain and emptiness on the inside, but I shoved it down, never showing anybody I suffer. To be honest, I didn't care that people around me were waiting for an emotional response, _I didn't think it mattered_. I kept it rational keeping myself busy with goals and activities. Slightly remember thinking to myself back then “_Emotions have no use. _I feel what I feel and I am perfectly aware of own emotional state on the inside, but the state I'm in doesn’t have to do _anything_ with the flow of life and the outer world. _I’ve got to keep things going_, life goes on, time flies. Feelings have no weight on the _real_, actual world, they only matter to me, therefore have no use. Strategy, planning and, most importantly, action is what truly, essentially matters.”


Pretty clear introversion of Feeling, who knows where abouts - but this, imo, rules _out _ExFJs - I do note that you mention keeping yourself busy with goals and activities - this to me, rules _out _introverted Feeling - it's more avoidance of it.
You do literally anything to escape it. Possibly, then, Feeling is your inferior function - you basically make out as if what goes on inside of your head etc, doesn't mean anything.
Ergo, _not _introverted judging whereby the Feeling and Thinking in introverted types is very real, and is basically means everything. You appear to dismiss this idea.




> Now, pretty much, I am able to say that I have quite _too many_ feelings and emotions on the inside that have been put aside _for years_, too many to ignore, as if they are screaming from the very bottom begging me to be dealt with.


Indeed they probably are, feelings and emotions shouldn't be seen directly as the Feeling function, but what you're saying here does indeed match up with what I've read of the inferior Feeling in an extroverted Thinking type, from Jung and von Franz.



> A lot of influences started to come in as I got older and, just like everyone else, I wanted to fill myself with the sense of belonging, but I’ve dashingly realized that sense of belonging comes from being the purest and truest self and, because I couldn’t be entirely comfortable with myself around other people to the point of not being able to interact and present myself the right, proper way, I’ve pushed away too many. The main focus has always been on _action_ - I’ve always believed that people have to perceive me by _what I do at my very best intentions_, not what I say and who I seem to come off as on the surface, but I kept falling into the same trap.


This really does sound like an Extraverted type meeting their inferior introverted Thinking or Feeling.
The whole sudden realization of "sense of belonging comes from being the purest and truest self" ie a magical and sudden deep understanding of Gavin DeGraws "_I Don't Wanna Be_" is an indication of it not being a default, preferred mode of being - it's a flash of inspiration that's arisen from the unconscious - it's an inferior function that's "giving" you this, imo.



> Always thought that communication and good relationship is a part of getting things done for myself more efficiently, always loved the idea of “collecting” people in a useful manner. Had very few people to _actually _make me feel something and, everytime I did, it came in overwhelming, intense waves - addictable, yet resentful.


Well this throws a little spanner into the works, as it does sound like an introverted perspective - though, we all have introversion and extroversion.
One thing that leads me to believe this is might not an introverted perspective, at least insofar as Feeling is concerned, is actually forming good relationships and developing good (I assume?) communication skills in the first place - doesn't particularly resonate with my understanding of introversion - not that introverted types can't, or don't do this - it's just not ordinarily their primary focus (which is of course, themselves).




> I do think that there is always a part of ourselves we suppress. Part we are too afraid or too stubborn to admit about ourselves. Part of a personality we hide deep inside, keep thinking we are better off without, and is actually something we do not choose, but rather something that has always naturally been there. I’ve had a wall up for much of my life - people could see me, but they were never getting all of me, I was running in a constant cycle of distraction and suppression.
> 
> Somehow, nowadays, I do feel that it is coming out and there’s nothing I can or intentionally want to do to stop it. I have to _get out_, I have to explore myself, I have to fulfill what I’ve kept inside, spend time with myself and give myself a chance to live life unapologetically.


What do you suppress?

This thread could probably be merged with your type-me thread in the "What's My Type?" forum at this point, imo, lol.
I'm still thinking ExTJ is a best-fit, though I am leaning a little more towards you being more Te and Se - so, ESTJ, but a normal, Jungian one, not an MBTI one - I think Te-Se is a best-fit, where Te takes the lead due to what appears to be inferior Fi falling into the right place.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

@*Turi* I understand what you mean, and also a good point, but [email protected]:00






I mostly lean towards ENTJ also consider ESTP, ENFP, ESFP and ESTJ so fare.
@*heavydirtysoul* Please look at this picture and point out which type is more like you. 










*also one could consider enneagram type 3.

Enneagram and personality disorders
Published 4 September 2014 | By Frédéric Schmitt
Heidi Briebe
Enneagram & MBTI: 
Type 1 ISTJ, ESTJ, INTJ 
Type 2 ENFJ, ESFJ 
Type 3 ENTJ 
Type 4 INFJ, INFP 
Type 5 ISTP, INTP, INTJ 
Type 6 ISFJ 
Type 7 ENFP, ESFP, ENTP 
Type 8 ENTJ, ESTP, ESTJ 
Type 9 ISFP 
*


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

heavydirtysoul said:


> Thank you. Although, I've never truly been living to fulfil others' expectations


 Supressed feelings


heavydirtysoul said:


> and, especially, needs - I've always been too preoccupied with expectations of my own* striving to be twice as good as other people,*


stereotypic type 3


heavydirtysoul said:


> often in a very harsh, scheming manner.


 Supressed Feelings


heavydirtysoul said:


> I find it nonsensical to preoccupy mind with memory, expectation and hope. There is no other experience than the* present experiences *


 Sensing 


heavydirtysoul said:


> - concerning yourself with such things as others’ opinion is pretty much equal to being out of touch with reality. To be frankly honest, expectation, from both, external and internal sources, is no other than the root of constant chaos and endless misery - it makes simple things complicated, irrational and delusive. I always choose control over fallacy.


 SJ (practical, grounded realistic, supresses dreams and thinking of the future possibilities) or extraverted sensing, (Here and now thinking) could also be Thinking (Logical, realistic) :idunno:


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

@*Electra* @*Turi* sorry it takes too long to answer, today is a busy, productive day. 



Turi said:


> Okay so although you haven't been 'living to fulfill' the expectations of others - you're still very much people-focused in a competitive, "I have to be twice as good as you" kind of way, so you're clearly oriented towards the judging functions, imo, it's still extroverted judging here as you're wanting to discover your introverted side, you're not posting about wanting to get out and be helpful, do some hardwork, be more assertive etc (at least, as far as I've seen).



To be precise, I turn every real life communication experience into competition, striving to be fluent, dominant, inventive, proficient and quick-witted. 




Turi said:


> You note here, expectations from external and internal sources and a constant source of misery etc - what kind of misery, and what kind of control do you attempt to exert over it?



*Misery* = uncertainty, disorder, second-guessing, vagueness, blurriness, stagnation, self-mistrust, inhibition.
*Control *= power, influence, directness, supremacy, freedom, focus, constant action towards the outcome, determination, adaptability, awareness, efficiency. 




Turi said:


> Probably Thinking - repress Feeling, keep it inside - focus on control as well, same with above - curious as to how this plays out in your life - it's like once you realize you can't control a situation or affect change, you basically just give up and resign yourself to the happenings of the external world - this (iirc) is related to extroversion of Sensation.



Exactly. Once I realize I can't control a situation, I either overplay it with unexpected spontaneous move, either drop it outright. 




Turi said:


> You do literally anything to escape it. Possibly, then, Feeling is your inferior function - *you basically make out as if what goes on inside of your head etc, doesn't mean anything*. Ergo, not introverted judging whereby the Feeling and Thinking in introverted types is very real, and is basically means everything. You appear to dismiss this idea.



Yes, I certainly relate to that. 




Turi said:


> What do you suppress?



Anything I consider negative, distracting or unworthy of time and energy - doubt, fear, unnecessary processing, immoderate impulse action (unless it profits the current goal). 



Turi said:


> I'm still thinking ExTJ is a best-fit, though I am leaning a little more towards you being more Te and Se - so, ESTJ, but a normal, Jungian one, not an MBTI one - I think Te-Se is a best-fit, where Te takes the lead due to what appears to be inferior Fi falling into the right place.


How does Jungian ESTJ use Te-Se? Could you explain it for a bit?


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

Hiii @heavydirtysoul  A friend is soon coming over.


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## heavydirtysoul (Jan 13, 2012)

Electra said:


> I mostly lean towards ENTJ also consider ESTP, ENFP, ESFP and ESTJ so fare.
> @*heavydirtysoul* Please look at this picture and point out which type is more like you.


Tough call. Mostly, it would be *Choleric *(95/100), except for being *inflexible* - I am quite good at adaptation. The second one would be *Melancholic* (75/100) - [I relate to being] *cautious*, *independent*, *an excessive planner*, *good at preventing problems* and some of the weaknesses, expect the "tunnel vision", deeply affected by tragedy, procrastination and being prone to play the martyr. Not creative in poetry and art either though. 
How does being Choleric-Melancholic define the MBTI type?


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

Turi said:


> @heavydirtysoul - without getting too much into it, consider an _inferior _Fi.
> Sounds like you may be falsifying your type and more specifically, introversion.
> 
> 
> ...


Don't mean to keep quoting you Turi, just that you happen to be every thread I post in and here it seems like a lot of people agreed with this. 

If you were experiencing negative feelings, wouldn't you want to avoid it too? 




Turi said:


> > Keep questioning. Who am I becoming? Who do I have to become? What is it I have to change on the inside to survive?
> 
> 
> This is _introverted _judging - combine these introverted thoughts, with your _need/want to escape from them _by way of distraction, and it appears to me we're likely looking at a true Extroverted Feeling or Thinking type, from a Jungian perspective - an ExxJ.


No, this is just someone who is thinking about how to make life easier. This is isn't introverted judging, and it's not Fi-Ni. Introverted feeling isn't literally about your own feelings. 
@heavydirtysoul Honestly from reading the OP it is clear this isn't function related. It sounds like you have too much time to mull over your thoughts and feelings because you're isolating yourself or trying to deal with it on your own. It's the situation you are in, none of this really indicates functions. I hope this doesn't sound rude, I'm just being honest. 

Looks like some of it could be relevant to enneagram, but I'm not very familiar with the theory.


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## Turi (May 9, 2017)

Wisteria said:


> Don't mean to keep quoting you Turi, just that you happen to be every thread I post in and here it seems like a lot of people agreed with this.
> 
> If you were experiencing negative feelings, wouldn't you want to avoid it too?
> 
> No, this is just someone who is thinking about how to make life easier. This is isn't introverted judging, and it's not Fi-Ni. Introverted feeling isn't literally about your own feelings.


Can you _please _do some research before responding to me?
At the very least, read Marie-Louise von Franz' lecture on the Inferior Function.

Yes, what we avoid and fear, these hidden complexes, absolutely 'indicate functions' in fact they're like half of the theory, probably more.


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

Turi said:


> Can you _please _do some research before responding to me?
> At the very least, read Marie-Louise von Franz' lecture on the Inferior Function.
> 
> Yes, what we avoid and fear, these hidden complexes, absolutely 'indicate functions' in fact they're like half of the theory, probably more.


Research on what exactly? maybe you should reference this in your post or briefly explain it. otherwise there is no way I can do research assuming I have the time.

I know types are supposed to have weak or inferior function but that doesn't mean I agree with this definition of inferior Fi, that it's avoidance of your own feelings etc. 

It is common to be like this at a young age, this isn't just about functions (or at all in my opinion). Also functions aren't really about our behaviours.


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

turi said:


> can you _please _do some research before responding to me?
> At the very least, read marie-louise von franz' lecture on the inferior function.
> 
> Yes, what we avoid and fear, these hidden complexes, absolutely 'indicate functions' in fact they're like half of the theory, probably more.


inxp


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## Electra (Oct 24, 2014)

Wisteria said:


> Research on what exactly? maybe you should reference this in your post or briefly explain it. otherwise there is no way I can do research assuming I have the time.
> 
> I know types are supposed to have weak or inferior function but that doesn't mean I agree with this definition of inferior Fi, that it's avoidance of your own feelings etc.
> 
> It is common to be like this at a young age, this isn't just about functions (or at all in my opinion). Also functions aren't really about our behaviours.


My Ti is better then my Te according to tests lol


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

Electra said:


> My Ti is better then my Te according to tests lol


haha that's not unusual. An INFPs Ti is probably better than inferior Te


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## SilentScream (Mar 31, 2011)

Wisteria said:


> Research on what exactly? maybe you should reference this in your post or briefly explain it. otherwise there is no way I can do research assuming I have the time.


But he did though. He specifically suggested reading Marie-Louise von Franz's lectures in the very post you quoted. 

That led me to this thread (since I don't like to buy books and see if there's excerpts that I can pick up for free wherever I can): 

http://personalitycafe.com/cognitiv...ise-von-franz-soreness-inferior-function.html

Apparently, this is a goldmine of great information.


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

Reap said:


> But he did though. He specifically suggested reading Marie-Louise von Franz's lectures in the very post you quoted.
> 
> That led me to this thread (since I don't like to buy books and see if there's excerpts that I can pick up for free wherever I can):
> 
> ...


I meant his first post, the one he said to do research before quoting. 

I did look up the author, found an excerpt of the book, showing the first few pages up until describing each inferior function. Found it from a quick google search:
https://www.jungiananalysts.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/von-Franz-M-L-1971-Characterisation-of-the-Inferior-Function.pdf


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## Lakigigar (Jan 4, 2016)

when i discover something or find something out, i actually have a desire to share that.

examples: i read a news article (can be politics, sports or science), i share that on Facebook often, and summarize it for my Facebook Friends (if it is difficult), sometimes hoping to get them on my side (in politics) or entertaining them with the news article, provoking a fun reaction (esp. in real-life).

I also like to see other people playing games.


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## Lakigigar (Jan 4, 2016)

imposing your personal beliefs and values on others

OH OOPS, this thread is absolutely not what i thought it was.


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