# Promiscuity and the way the sexes are viewed



## Cheveyo (Nov 19, 2010)

amanda32 said:


> If a woman is promiscuous, she should be discreet about it because it's rare to find a man whose ego can take it.


Why? Who gives a shit if the man can't take it?

Is it your belief that a man who finds promiscuity unattractive, only finds it thus because their "fragile" ego can't take it not being the first, last, and only?
Is there some shame the woman should feel?

Maybe, instead of chasing after men who find it unattractive, you should find one that doesn't care. Or keep lying. Lies are the foundation of a good relationship after all.





That last line was sarcasm.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Cheveyo said:


> Why? Who gives a shit if the man can't take it?
> 
> Is it your belief that a man who finds promiscuity unattractive, only finds it thus because their "fragile" ego can't take it not being the first, last, and only?
> Is there some shame the woman should feel?
> ...


I wasn't saying to lie, I said be "discreet". Don't advertise. After all what business is it of his?
And believe me -- men care, they care a LOT. Even the "evolved" ones.


----------



## Cheveyo (Nov 19, 2010)

amanda32 said:


> I wasn't saying to lie, I said be "discreet". Don't advertise. After all what business is it of his?


"Don't lie, just don't tell the truth."

It is my belief, that you should be upfront with people. Let them know what they're getting into so there aren't any unpleasant surprises later on.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Cheveyo said:


> "Don't lie, just don't tell the truth."
> 
> It is my belief, that you should be upfront with people. Let them know what they're getting into so there aren't any unpleasant surprises later on.


more like, just don't answer that question. Like I said, it's none of his business.

And what do you mean by, "Unpleasant surprises?" Like you find out later on she was promiscuous? lol. Why would that matter? Or did you mean something else?

By the way, in theory I agree with you, it shouldn't matter but in practice from all the things I've seen -- it's just not the way it is in reality. I wish it were.


----------



## Cheveyo (Nov 19, 2010)

amanda32 said:


> more like, just don't answer that question. Like I said, it's none of his business.
> 
> And what do you mean by, "Unpleasant surprises?" Like you find out later on she was promiscuous? lol. Why would that matter? Or did you mean something else?
> 
> By the way, in theory I agree with you, it shouldn't matter but in practice from all the things I've seen -- it's just not the way it is in reality. I wish it were.


If some guy comes up to you and asks "How many dicks have you sucked?", then yeah, he can go mind his own business.
But if it's a guy you are actually interested in as more than just a screw, then you should be upfront, imo.

The fact that someone wouldn't be upfront, would indicate shame on their part. Or regret.
I'm not saying you should walk around with a T-shirt advertising the number of men you've slept with. I'm saying you should not feel the need to hide it.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Cheveyo said:


> If some guy comes up to you and asks "How many dicks have you sucked?", then yeah, he can go mind his own business.
> But if it's a guy you are actually interested in as more than just a screw, *then you should be upfront*, imo.
> 
> The fact that someone wouldn't be upfront, would indicate shame on their part. Or regret.
> I'm not saying you should walk around with a T-shirt advertising the number of men you've slept with. I'm saying you should not feel the need to hide it.


Why? What business is it of his? It happened before him, it doesn't matter.
But men, they always ask this question don't they. Do you know what they're really asking? Are you a slut? And they're setting you up for judgement.

Again: it's none of anyone's business who a woman slept with -- she shouldn't have to or be exptected to divulge that information at all. Yet men seem to think it's their right to know.

I don't agree. And the reason I don't, is because they do judge women for it and there is a good chance they'll use it against you later.

"A gentleman never asks and a lady never tells" -- that's the philosophy I live by.


----------



## Sali (Feb 9, 2011)

amanda32 said:


> more like, just don't answer that question. Like I said, it's none of his business.
> 
> And what do you mean by, "Unpleasant surprises?" Like you find out later on she was promiscuous? lol. Why would that matter? Or did you mean something else?
> 
> By the way, in theory I agree with you, it shouldn't matter but in practice from all the things I've seen -- it's just not the way it is in reality. I wish it were.


I would be far more upset with a woman I was with whom I believed had mutual respect for one another hiding something like that from me than I would be about any thing she could possibly have done.


----------



## Cheveyo (Nov 19, 2010)

amanda32 said:


> Why? What business is it of his? It happened before him, it doesn't matter.
> But men, they always ask this question don't they. Do you know what they're really asking? Are you a slut? And they're setting you up for judgement.
> 
> Again: it's none of anyone's business who a woman slept with -- she shouldn't have to or be exptected to divulge that information at all. Yet men seem to think it's their right to know.
> ...



So, in other words, you feel your actions would have a negative effect on the way people would look at you. You are afraid of feeling ashamed of yourself because of this.
You put far too much stock in what other people think of you.

If you can't trust your partner, what hope is there for the relationship?


----------



## Arbite (Dec 26, 2010)

MuChApArAdOx said:


> Yeah, the man automatically becomes a _hero_
> Women becomes a _slut._
> Go figure.


You wouldn't want a lock that opened for every key. But a key that oppened every lock however...


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Sali said:


> I would be far more upset with a woman I was with whom I believed had mutual respect for one another hiding something like that from me than I would be about any thing she could possibly have done.


The more interesting question is: "why do men want/_feel a right _to know?"
Why do you guys ask?
You want to know if she's a good girl. If she's trust worthy. And you base that, in part, on her answer.
As I said: "you are setting her up to judge her." It's not about "hiding" it's about not putting yourself in a position to be judged by someone who hasn't lived your life.

If the answer matters so much to a man, that tells me I shouldn't answer -- unless I'm the virgin Mary.



Cheveyo said:


> So, in other words, you feel your actions would have a negative effect on the way people would look at you. You are afraid of feeling ashamed of yourself because of this.
> You put far too much stock in what other people think of you.
> 
> If you can't trust your partner, what hope is there for the relationship?


No, I'm not afraid of feeling ashamed. I'd feel anger if he judged me, perhaps but not shame.

Like it or not, there is a double standard and men are jealous creatures.

Somethings are better left unasked and unsaid.


----------



## Cheveyo (Nov 19, 2010)

amanda32 said:


> No, I'm not afraid of feeling ashamed. I'd feel anger if he judged me, perhaps but not shame.
> 
> Like it or not, there is a double standard and men are jealous creatures.
> 
> Somethings are better left unasked and unsaid.


My ex was upfront with me about it when I asked. The fact that she both trusted and respected me enough to open herself up in that way, meant a lot to me.
I never felt like less of a man. Nor did I suddenly start thinking of her as a slut or think any less of her, as she had never cheated on any of her partners.
Yes, before you ask. I would think less of a person for cheating.

You experience the double standard because of the men you've been with, not because it's universal.
PEOPLE are jealous creatures. Not just men.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Cheveyo said:


> My ex was upfront with me about it when I asked. The fact that she both trusted and respected me enough to open herself up in that way, meant a lot to me.
> I never felt like less of a man. Nor did I suddenly start thinking of her as a slut or think any less of her, as she had never cheated on any of her partners.
> Yes, before you ask. I would think less of a person for cheating.


Perhaps her number was acceptable to you. What if it hadn't been?

The irony is your asking a question (and feeling 'honored' that she told it to you) to a question you claim the answer doen't make a difference to you.

Just look at how bent out of shape you are getting about not knowing how many men you're girlfriend has been with. You guys almost find it offensive not to be told.

YOu really have to get it out of your head that it's your right to know. And women have to learn that it's none of anyone's business.





Cheveyo said:


> You experience the double standard because of the men you've been with, not because it's universal.
> PEOPLE are jealous creatures. Not just men.


I wasn't talking about my relationships.


----------



## Sali (Feb 9, 2011)

amanda32 said:


> The more interesting question is: "why do men want/_feel a right _to know?"
> Why do you guys ask?
> You want to know if she's a good girl. If she's trust worthy. And you base that, in part, on her answer.
> As I said: "you are setting her up to judge her." It's not about "hiding" it's about not putting yourself in a position to be judged by someone who hasn't lived your life.
> ...


I wouldn't want it hidden for the same reason I wouldn't want someone I'm with to hide what elementary school they went to. It's a matter of trust and sharing with the person you supposedly love.

Personally I don't really care how many guys a girl has been with it makes absolutely no difference to me whatsoever but hiding it is dishonest (I don't actually ask this question unless it comes up, which it usually does because when you first get involved with someone their sexual experience tends to come up for whatever reason, I find this to be the case even with friends.) Your ideas about how it is judged are your own ideas that quite frankly I don't like being projected onto me.

Define "Good girl" to me by the way, my last girlfriend took her clothes off for money as her profession. Lots of people would classify her as a "bad girl" or a "slut" etc. terms which I abhor, and never once saw her as such or any woman for that matter.

It is the deceit which bothers me in your tactics not any kind of judgment.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Sali said:


> I wouldn't want it hidden for the same reason I wouldn't want someone I'm with to hide what elementary school they went to. It's a matter of trust and sharing with the person you supposedly love.
> 
> Personally I don't really care how many guys a girl has been with it makes absolutely no difference to me whatsoever but hiding it is dishonest (I don't actually ask this question unless it comes up, which it usually does because when you first get involved with someone their sexual experience tends to come up for whatever reason, I find this to be the case even with friends.) Your ideas about how it is judged are your own ideas that quite frankly I don't like being projected onto me.
> 
> ...


Then you are far, far more open minded than 99% of the men I've met in all my years and all my travels.

edit: What deceit? refusing to answer an extremely personal question is _[/I]deceit now? Hm...interesting you view it that way...and it is not a "tactic" -- it's NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS. *how many more times do I have to say it*?_


----------



## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

I think a persons sexual past is to an extent my business. I want to know because I happen to enjoy being std free. So if someone asked me, I'd understand why.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

Eerie said:


> I think a persons sexual past is to an extent my business. I want to know because I happen to enjoy being std free. So if someone asked me, I'd understand why.


I think it stands to reason if you have an STD you tell someone. lol.

A childhood friend of mine has only been with 3 men (one of which she was married to) and she got an STD -- so that's not why they're asking 

If that's their concern, agree to get tested and show them the results. No need to divulge anything more.


----------



## greenlow (Dec 12, 2009)

amanda32 said:


> Why? What business is it of his? * It happened before him, it doesn't matter.*
> But men, they always ask this question don't they. Do you know what they're really asking? Are you a slut? And they're setting you up for judgement.
> 
> Again: it's none of anyone's business who a woman slept with -- she shouldn't have to or be exptected to divulge that information at all. Yet men seem to think it's their right to know.
> ...


I agree. As long as you are sexually healthy, what matters is that you are with -them- now. 

I dislike that i've had many male friends of mine inquiring about my sexual history; my male relationships and who i'm seeing etc. I flat out refuse to answer questions of this caliber.

Who I sleep with is my business. I am happy to talk about my experiences with a partner and to share what i've learned about myself with them, but who i've been with and "how many" is not a question I feel I have to answer to anyone.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

greenlow said:


> I agree. As long as you are sexually healthy, what matters is that you are with -them- now.
> 
> I dislike that i've had many male friends of mine inquiring about my sexual history; my male relationships and who i'm seeing etc. I flat out refuse to answer questions of this caliber.
> 
> Who I sleep with is my business. I am happy to talk about my experiences with a partner and to share what i've learned about myself with them, but who i've been with and "how many" is not a question I feel I have to answer to anyone.


Good for you!
In my younger, more naive years I used to answer this question. Then later I saw how some close friends used that information against their wives even! It was horrible. And I began to pay more attention to the things my male friends would say when I was invited along with them on a "boys night". Very revealing. 
Never again.


----------



## MuChApArAdOx (Jan 24, 2011)

amanda32 said:


> Why? What business is it of his? It happened before him, it doesn't matter.
> But men, they always ask this question don't they. Do you know what they're really asking? Are you a slut? And they're setting you up for judgement.
> 
> Again: it's none of anyone's business who a woman slept with -- she shouldn't have to or be exptected to divulge that information at all. Yet men seem to think it's their right to know.
> ...


It was quite the opposite in my relationship. I asked my husband all the tough questions, he never asked me any. To this day he has never asked me about previous sexual partners, not that there were many, regardless, he just didn't ask. Unless it is somehow related, or relevant to our marriage, why? I did because well, i'm nosy, although i would have respected his wishes if he had said no.

Talking about past sexual behavior doesn't change anything about the current relationship. I don't think men or women should be pressured into talking about things that are irrelevant to who they are as a couple. And if they want to hear those details, don't even think about trying to use it against you in the future.

And i totally disagree with the poster who says if you don't spill your guts, you must have something to hide, or feel ashamed. That is such a stupid narrow minded way of thinking. Its men like him that would use information against a women, irrelevant information i must add, data that plays no part in the current relationship. I would never share details with any man who was in love with control ;-)


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

MuChApArAdOx said:


> It was quite the opposite in my relationship. I asked my husband all the tough questions, he never asked me any. To this day he has never asked me about previous sexual partners, not that there were many, regardless, he just didn't ask. Unless it is somehow related, or relevant to our marriage, why? I did because well, i'm nosy, although i would have respected his wishes if he had said no.
> 
> Talking about past sexual behavior doesn't change anything about the current relationship. I don't think men or women should be pressured into talking about things that are irrelevant to who they are as a couple. And if they want to hear those details, don't even think about trying to use it against you in the future.
> 
> And i totally disagree with the poster who says if you don't spill your guts, you must have something to hide, or feel ashamed. That is such a stupid narrow minded way of thinking. Its men like him that would use information against a women, irrelevant information i must add, data that plays no part in the current relationship. I would never share details with any man who was in love with control ;-)


You husband sounds like a gentleman. 
Also, I'm sure he doesn't want to even think about you with another man doing...stuff. He probably can't stand the thought of another man having been with you.
Smart man not to ask for details that would haunt him.


----------



## Shield of Light (Aug 28, 2010)

Sali said:


> It seems to me that in this thread all the women are trying to paint men with the same brush and all the men are trying to paint women with the same brush. It's extremely near sighted in my opinion to look at people as sexes rather than as individuals.


I was going to post this, but then I saw you already posted it for me.

Thanks. :tongue:


----------



## Promethea (Aug 24, 2009)

It seems you are mentioning two types of what I think of as paths of growth, in sexuality, the one of the individual, and the one of the culture.

Theres a really great kabbalah book which explains the path of growth in sexuality (and its also pretty in-line with the other philosophies of growth in kabblah) -- I mention it as a ref and not to promote or hide behind those philosophies. I just happen to think it nails what I think but in a more concise and eloquent way, as I often have trouble with expressing exactly what I mean in words. The kabbalah book of sex explains that sometimes an individual will go through a phase of sex as meaningless activity, but basically become burned out on it because of the nature of the sex, they need something more kinky, risky, more.. something, each time until there are no more taboos to appeal to the growing appetite. At this point, they are more likely to try more meaningful sex, abandoning the old way. The ultimate way for meaningful connection in sex is with your partner who you love, and because of your love, you want to give them as much pleasure as you possibly can. In a purer connection, this leaves no room for spilling these desires into other vessels, but to focus on the pleasure of the partner.. thing is.. they also do this for you. So what you have is two pure and loving energies giving focused on the pleasure of one another. Instead of more kind, more bodies, its more pleasure put into the one you love. 

I have seen these phases in sex a lot, but many find no way out of it.. they just end up with extremely weird kinks or having unfulfillable and jaded sex.. thinking maybe the next random lay or conquest will be better.. but I believe they get bored. I did as well. I found that meaningful sex pleases me much more. And the withholding from other vessels makes the energy shared with the -one- i love so powerful. I also don't think about other men when I masturbate.

Sexual liberation.. thats a tricky thing. Are men who have promiscuous attitudes about sex liberated, and what from? It is repression to have an attitude that sex should be withheld until theres more meaning. I think that sure, we live in a very immature culture. We are a very new immature species.

In cultures where promiscuity is a taboo, you have some who easily fall into those ways, not desiring to go against it, some who can't handle it, and leave (and here I am thinking of some research I have done into amish culture lately) -- then others who quietly resent it, and fantasize about ways out.

Maybe its the types of personality we are born with. In some of these really seemingly repressed cultures, it seems the socialization is the same for most of these children, yet you have personalities that are sometimes way too different from the rest, who seek to just get out and be rebellious. 

I often think when someone mentions human nature, they are missing something.. that there is more than one human nature. And in saying that others will evolve into a particular type (for example pacifistic ways) perhaps that truly is contrary to the nature of some human beings. It seems humanity could become very stagnant if not for all types, filling certain roles.

So, to those who have this desire to become more sexually liberated, in a way of embracing promiscuity, I would say that sure, they absolutely need to experience it for themselves and see if later, it is something they wish to grow away from. 

This culture seems to be allowing more of that for women, in my observations. I think that a lot of this is allowed now because of their economic independence, and lack of need for a male for physical protection/survival. People now have money taking the place of a need for a mate who can physically protect them, and they have careers, so they don't need to rely on a man's money. So you do see more free attitudes about sex, in women.

Does culture wholly accept this yet.. not completely, not yet, but the masses who adopt a more free lifestyle seem to be getting on board slowly with the idea simply because its a fact that its happening around them. It can continue to offend the sensibilities of the individuals who do not believe in promiscuity, but for the culture of sex that I see for the most part, they all seem entitled to screw about like monkeys.

So far as continuing to call women sluts, whores, etc. .. people are going to use derogatory language when they want to offend a person, no matter if the label fits. Traditionally it has been seen as an unflattering thing, being a female with many partners, so I think the awful insulting terms will stick. Some people I knew from phllly who were really racist, still used extremely old outdated terms to insult people of other ancestry.. limey for example.. just because a guy has a brit last name and is suspected of being a protestant. 

I don't think that promiscuous women are shunned in this culture though. Its just some residual idea from the past, giving people ammo who don't like her.. to call her a whore.


----------



## greenlow (Dec 12, 2009)

amanda32 said:


> I disagree. It is personal information that is offered if a person feels like sharing it, but all too often men feel like you do -- entitled to know and made a character judgement off of that information). If the man doesn't like that I won't tell him, he can walk.
> 
> Why is it so important to him? "Oh, you've only slept with that many?" Okay, I can take you home to Mom.
> or, "You've slept with that many!" *Makes a _negative _ judgement about your moral character.* Then later in the relationship (if he decides to stick around), "well how do I know I can trust you? You did such and such with such and such."
> ...


Completely agree.

I really don't think anyone is entitled to know everything about another person. Trust and honesty are things that you offer in good faith and don't offer or expect with strings attached "I wont trust you until you tell me everything!". That just sounds distrustful and possessive. Especially if the knowledge they are inquiring about is in someones past. Feeling pressured to tell someone everything because they feel entitled to know sounds plain unhealthy to me. 

Perhaps two people who 'want to know everything and expect complete disclosure' would be better matched. I personally couldn't be in a relationship with someone who felt entitled to know about my past except if it truly concerned them.And I am an adult, I can decide for myself what is relevant to the current context. Entitlement is an attitude in people i'd rather avoid. Honesty and trust to me, don't involve full disclosure. Or entitlement.


----------



## WamphyriThrall (Apr 11, 2011)

@Stephen Their place is not following the example of men who can get away with sleeping around, or wanting to be in such a position in the first place. My opinion? Unless it's an open relationship, it's not exactly something I'd say is a positive trait in someone, and it usually leads to hurting the person in the long run, anyway. So, what's the point of feeling entitled to something like that at all? Male, female, whatever, I don't support such behavior in anyone.


----------



## Stephen (Jan 17, 2011)

WamphyriThrall said:


> @Stephen Their place is not following the example of men who can get away with sleeping around, or wanting to be in such a position in the first place. My opinion? Unless it's an open relationship, it's not exactly something I'd say is a positive trait in someone, and it usually leads to hurting the person in the long run, anyway. So, what's the point of feeling entitled to something like that at all? Male, female, whatever, I don't support such behavior in anyone.


I see a distinction between promiscuity and cheating.


----------



## WamphyriThrall (Apr 11, 2011)

Stephen said:


> I see a distinction between promiscuity and cheating.


There is, but I personally, would probably have some concerns of sleeping with someone who had been with half the campus. Health, reputation, drama, and paranoia of them not being able to leave old habits, for beginners. Again, I can't see why someone would want to aspire to such a position in the first place.


----------



## foobar (Sep 22, 2011)

Female promiscuity is a little more outwardly accepted these days, but theres still that undercurrent of hostility towards it. Whenever people talk about how its "gross" or "dirty" I drill them in a really annoying manner "What do you mean, its gross? How so?" "Well, you know, its just... well, disrespectful." "How is it disrespectful?" "Um... I just don't agree with it." "Why?" They're always left flustered with absolutely nothing worthwhile to say. Because theres no logic in it.

I think its really repugnant to judge a person based on their sexual habits. If you don't want to sleep around, that's fine. Don't do it. I don't want to ride roller coasters, in fact I hate them. But I'm not gonna say mean things about you cuz you ride them all the time. It doesn't make sense to shun a person and make judgments about their self-worth just because they want to be ploughed by the whole football team. Unfortunately its a very deeply rooted biological thing, like someone else mentioned, for it to be "better" for women to not sleep around. Its a psychological remnant of our ancestry, which is why few people can explain why they detest female promiscuity... they just have this vague feeling that its "not right." Truth be told, a promiscuous woman several thousand years ago was more irresponsible than a promiscuous man, because shes risking much more. Biologically speaking. She can only reproduce so many times and needs a good mate to help her raise her offspring, meanwhile a man can father thousands of children and pass on way more genes by being a slut. Evolution rewarded chaste women and slutty men. But those ancient ideals don't match our modern society.

Meh. Oh well. I sleep with whoever I want and whoever gets mad about it can go fuck themselves. Viva la revolution of sluttiness.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

WamphyriThrall said:


> There is, but I personally, would probably have some concerns of sleeping with someone who had been with half the campus. Health, reputation, drama, and paranoia of them not being able to leave old habits, for beginners. Again, I can't see why someone would want to aspire to such a position in the first place.


If she's slept with half the campus you won't have to ask her how many men she's slept with -- everyone else will tell you.

@greenlow 

Yes! I agree! 
_"Trust and honesty are things that you offer in good faith and don't offer or expect with strings attached "I wont trust you until you tell me everything!". That just sounds distrustful and possessive."_


----------



## La Li Lu Le Lo (Aug 15, 2011)

Wouldn't sleeping around with a bunch of people tell you something about what the person values in life? It's a valid thing to judge someone on IMO. I'm not saying people can't change, though. But you should make sure they have already before things get serious.


----------



## Thomas D M Thompson (Sep 14, 2011)

Eerie said:


> I think a persons sexual past is to an extent my business. I want to know because I happen to enjoy being std free. So if someone asked me, I'd understand why.


ultimately, what does it accomplish to know such information? It's better just to ask them to get an std test and to see the results. Then the following example won't happen:




amanda32 said:


> I disagree. It is personal information that is offered if a person feels like sharing it, but all too often men feel like you do -- entitled to know and made a character judgement off of that information). If the man doesn't like that I won't tell him, he can walk.
> 
> Why is it so important to him? "Oh, you've only slept with that many?" Okay, I can take you home to Mom.
> or, "You've slept with that many!" *Makes a _negative _ judgement about your moral character.* Then later in the relationship (if he decides to stick around), "well how do I know I can trust you? You did such and such with such and such."
> ...


----------



## Thomas D M Thompson (Sep 14, 2011)

LaLiLuLeLo said:


> Wouldn't sleeping around with a bunch of people tell you something about what the person values in life? It's a valid thing to judge someone on IMO. I'm not saying people can't change, though. But you should make sure they have already before things get serious.


Nice thought, but impossible to really prove and provide consistently for life. People treat change in values like an iron clad contract that exists upon which circumstances are perfect, that it will stay the same and this isn't reality. Real life will always overrule that which we feel control over.


----------



## Thomas D M Thompson (Sep 14, 2011)

LaLiLuLeLo said:


> I like gender equality in that I believe people should have sex with as few people as possible regardless of their gender. I'm a virgin, and it is important for me that my future girlfriend also be one. It's not going to be the determining factor in the relationship of course, but I want her to be as committed as I am so that we're the only people we have sex with from that point on. Perfection is only having one partner to last you your entire life.


Bettin' man I see, like going to the casino and playing one hand with similar odds? but that jackpot awaits on it right my boy?


----------



## n2freedom (Jun 2, 2011)

The myths, generalities, and the distortions. Be still my spinning head. There is a guy who has a video online and he said if you are single (not married) and having sex then you fuck at your own risk. It takes only ONE (count it up)....ONE sexual encounter to contract a sexual disease. So, if you have had sex with three people and you are in a so called monogamous relationship if your partner creeps out and contracts an STD....then do the math when he comes back to have sex with you, then you are at risk.

So, bottom line if you are having sex....you are at risk. Trust is something we extend to anyone, yes that includes your spouse, and does not translate into a guarantee that you will not contract a STD. Hell, I know more married people who have contracted a STD from their spouse while having unprotected sex than a sexually liberated single person who NEVER lets a man ride bare back or a man who NEVER chooses to ride bare back.

It's a higher gamble and risk anytime you have unprotected sex with someone (including SOs)...it's still a gamble and risk anytime you have protected sex with someone because yes as someone has already mentioned you can get STDs like herpes with a condom. It's a crap shoot anyway you look at it so to each his own how he/she decides if their bet is a sure one. Unless you follow your SO around 24-7 the fact of the matter is you do NOT know....you only choose to believe.

Number of sexual partners in my opinion is a personal matter and really has nothing to do with me. However, red flags that I look for are...how much self-control do you demonstrate...what you do with me, you'll do to me. In other words, if you are eager to have unprotected sex with me then you are probably equally as eager to have unprotected sex with someone else. So, I use various ways to ease this into the screening process. How often do you go to get tested...directly impacts me. Do you get tested between sexual partners...directly impacts me.

But, let's be honest how many of you asked your boyfriend and/or girlfriend these types of questions before engaging in sex with them? (not looking for an answer) I would venture to say highly unlikely. I would also venture to say that more than likely the partners just dived into having sex without any discussion about sexual habits. 

And, the "used" versus the "slightly used" versus "unused" vagina? Speechless...just shaking my head. Chooses to sleep with have the campus? SMH Being compared to chips and dips? SMDH Give me a break....I wonder what is underneath all of this....I mean what is really underneath it? Other than *personal* morals and dogmas. Again, I say to each his own. 

Judge you and you alone by your own yardstick (rulers for some because they live in a 3x3 box). If you are really concern about STDs....good luck with that one ... I really hope your trust pays off because abstinence is the *ONLY* 100% STD free solution. Make sure you ask your potential sexual partner about their sexual habits regardless of if you have strict or liberal ideas concerning number of sexual partners. And, by all means if you are not married....then you had better not go out into the rain without your rain jacket.

And, get a complete STD screening annually regardless of if you are sexually liberated, in a committed relationship, or married.


----------



## foobar (Sep 22, 2011)

LaLiLuLeLo said:


> Wouldn't sleeping around with a bunch of people tell you something about what the person values in life? It's a valid thing to judge someone on IMO. I'm not saying people can't change, though. But you should make sure they have already before things get serious.


No. All it'd tell you is that they like to have sex (who doesn't?), and don't see anything particularly wrong with enjoying it casually.


----------



## La Li Lu Le Lo (Aug 15, 2011)

foobar said:


> No. All it'd tell you is that they like to have sex (who doesn't?), and don't see anything particularly wrong with enjoying it casually.


Well that wouldn't be something I find particularly attractive >_>


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

LaLiLuLeLo said:


> Wouldn't sleeping around with a bunch of people tell you something about what the person values in life? It's a valid thing to judge someone on IMO. I'm not saying people can't change, though. But you should make sure they have already before things get serious.


See how they link promiscuity to trust and faithfulness? 
That's what I'm talking about ladies.

If she's had X amount of lovers she's not trustworthy.
If she's performed this "activity" she's ____.
If she's done it that many times she's ____.

You're asking to judge her on something you exhonerate yourself from.

It goes like this:

"I've had 50 women, a couple of threesomes." [describes the threesome to his male friend and us with pride and a smile and says, "yeah, I was just really lucky". *Laughs and high fives (literally)*

A couple of weeks earlier he'd said:
"I'd never marry a woman who had a threesone".

-- Real life, recent conversation with an educated, polite, gentleman guy I work with who considers himself very open minded and easy going. 

Men do not judge themselves by the same stardards they judge women by.


----------



## La Li Lu Le Lo (Aug 15, 2011)

amanda32 said:


> Men do not judge themselves by the same stardards they judge women by.


Except that I did in the first post I made in this thread.


----------



## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

LaLiLuLeLo said:


> I like gender equality in that I believe people should have sex with as few people as possible regardless of their gender. I'm a virgin, and it is important for me that my future girlfriend also be one. It's not going to be the determining factor in the relationship of course, but I want her to be as committed as I am so that we're the only people we have sex with from that point on. Perfection is only having one partner to last you your entire life.


You are consistent, but you know very well that is not the norm.


----------



## funcoolname (Sep 17, 2011)

People like sex, people have sex, I don't judge them on the # because it does not tell me much about any other part of their value system other than their value system regarding sex - which personally I don't think is the most important. A person who has only had sex 3 times, two of those times being a time they cheated on a partner, says a great deal more negative things about their character/values than someone who has had sex 8 times and never cheated. The ONLY way you can tell what kind of person a person is, is by getting to know them!



amanda32 said:


> Men do not judge themselves by the same stardards they judge women by.


Immature men do not judge themselves by the same standards they judge women by


----------



## foobar (Sep 22, 2011)

LaLiLuLeLo said:


> Well that wouldn't be something I find particularly attractive >_>


Why not???


----------



## BlackMamba (Aug 5, 2011)

Guys are "The man" 
Girls are "A Whore"
Its the biggest double standard ever.


----------



## Sali (Feb 9, 2011)

BlackMamba said:


> Guys are "The man"
> Girls are "A Whore"
> Its the biggest double standard ever.


It is indeed, and one that in my experience I've seen reinforced far more by other women than by men generally speaking.


----------



## BlackMamba (Aug 5, 2011)

Sali said:


> It is indeed, and one that in my experience I've seen reinforced far more by other women than by men generally speaking.


Good point...


----------



## dalsgaard (Aug 14, 2010)

amanda32 said:


> Yeah...it's not the same.
> 
> Was a man's virginity ever an issue in the olden days? It was always women getting examinations to see if they were virgins, the blood on the sheets on the wedding night, the exam to see if she's pure.
> 
> Men's virginity was not an issue. Things have changed, but not _that_ much.


But for all the finger-pointing at men; when it comes to judgmental attitudes, it certainly is true, as @Ormazd pointed out, that women seem to be using the word 'slut' a lot more than men do. "She dresses like a slut!" is not something you'd hear a lot of men say, their comments tend to be a lot more along the lines of appreciative.


----------



## dalsgaard (Aug 14, 2010)

Duck_of_Death said:


> In my experience, there is not. And any man of maturity is wise to stay away from women like this.
> 
> I've known a lot of promiscuous women in my life. A LOT.
> And every single one has cheated on their husbands and/or boyfriends, or is a constant drama queen starved for male attention. Or feels she is entitled to some "Prince Charming" that doesn't exist and goes from guy to guy like a pack of Tic-Tacs because the current flavor-of-the-month isn't good enough for the Princess.
> ...


Well, I've certainly met a lot of women who are both promiscuous and successful. But you're right in that this is the way people stereotypically think about a 'slut'. Or perhaps the co-worker who is accused of fucking her way up the corporate ladder.

It's just that there are a lot of women out there who have had a lot of sexual partners, who just has a healthy passion about sex. Most women who had a lot of sex partners, I find, don't have psychological issues - they are just independent strong women who know what they want.


----------



## funcoolname (Sep 17, 2011)

One thing I don't understand... Why do guys do everything in the books (buying girls drinks, getting girls drunk, telling them they're beautiful etc.) to get girls to sleep with them, and then if the girl obliges, she's suddenly a slut/easy/untrustworthy? But if she doesn't she's an ice queen/playing hard to get/a prude/a bitch, etc.? I don't think men will ever understand women with that kind of attitude..


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

funcoolname said:


> One thing I don't understand... Why do guys do everything in the books (buying girls drinks, getting girls drunk, telling them they're beautiful etc.) to get girls to sleep with them, and then if the girl obliges, she's suddenly a slut/easy/untrustworthy?


Because she was stupid enough to fall for it.
Oh, and before you accuse me of doing such a thing: I never have.
I'm very upfront about what I want. If she doesn't bite, I walk away.



> But if she doesn't she's an ice queen/playing hard to get/a prude/a bitch, etc.? I don't think men will ever understand women with that kind of attitude..


What's there to understand?
Those assclowns couldn't get their entitled dicks sloppy and have to insult her to save face.

Isn't that obvious?


----------



## funcoolname (Sep 17, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> Because she was stupid enough to fall for it.
> Oh, and before you accuse me of doing such a thing: I never have.
> I'm very upfront about what I want. If she doesn't bite, I walk away.
> 
> ...



You sound angry and defensive.... I never said you did anything like that, I was just speaking in generalities and as someone who is young and sees this all the time. I just think it's a disrespect to both genders and sad and wanted to know why it's done only to be condemned later.


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

Of course I'm angry. I hate answering silly questions.

(By the way, I will admit I've engaged in the latter before)


----------



## foobar (Sep 22, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> In my experience, there is not. And any man of maturity is wise to stay away from women like this.
> 
> I've known a lot of promiscuous women in my life. A LOT.
> And every single one has cheated on their husbands and/or boyfriends, or is a constant drama queen starved for male attention. Or feels she is entitled to some "Prince Charming" that doesn't exist and goes from guy to guy like a pack of Tic-Tacs because the current flavor-of-the-month isn't good enough for the Princess.
> ...


Wow. How extremely ignorant and judgmental. Sure, there are probably plenty of promiscuous girls who just want self-validation and attention, but that's not the only (or simplest) motivation for having casual sex. Has it ever crossed your mind that some women just really like to have sex and don't want to wait around for a serious relationship in order to enjoy it?


----------



## funcoolname (Sep 17, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> Of course I'm angry. I hate answering silly questions.
> 
> (By the way, I will admit I've engaged in the latter before)


It wasn't so much a literal "why do you do it?" as in what are your motivations, but "why is there this hypocrisy?" There is really no need to be abrasive.


----------



## Stephen (Jan 17, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> And any man of maturity is wise to stay away from women like this.


*shrugs* I make my own choices. I believe everyone deserves a chance. People do different things, and become different people, over the course of their lives. I don't think a history of promiscuity automatically represents a future of cheating, any more than a history of cheating represents a future of cheating.



> I've known a lot of promiscuous women in my life. A LOT.
> And every single one has cheated on their husbands and/or boyfriends, or is a constant drama queen starved for male attention. Or feels she is entitled to some "Prince Charming" that doesn't exist and goes from guy to guy like a pack of Tic-Tacs because the current flavor-of-the-month isn't good enough for the Princess.


Your experiences sound unpleasant, but no matter how many promiscuous women you think you've known, you've likely known many more who exercised some level of discretion about their sexual history. Just like the women who haven't been promiscuous, some of those cheat, and some do not.



> And I laugh as these women whine, rationalize, argue and shame men from maintaining this attitude, but it's not going anywhere. Men want what they want and, well.


Nice work on the empathy there. :laughing: What you're implying is selling our segment of the species short.


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

foobar said:


> Wow. How extremely ignorant and judgmental. Sure, there are probably plenty of promiscuous girls who just want self-validation and attention,


More than I'd care to acknowledge.



> ...but that's not the only (or simplest) motivation for having casual sex. Has it ever crossed your mind that some women just really like to have sex and don't want to wait around for a serious relationship in order to enjoy it?


I didn't know that! Women want to get their rocks off just like men?
Stop the press!

I was talking about a subset of women who bitch and whine that they can't keep a guy beyond the 3 month mark because their heads are so far up their asses that it ain't even funny.

And luckily, I get to listen to them rant and rave about it like it's 9/11 all over again. 
I don't wanna hear about it. I don't care. 

Most men generally have no problem with women who have the occasional one night stand in between relationships.
The women I mentioned?
Those they have a problem with.

The problem isn't with the "slutiness", that's a red herring.
Nobody wants to put up with such women for long--

And for good reason.


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

funcoolname said:


> It wasn't so much a literal "why do you do it?" as in what are your motivations, but "why is there this hypocrisy?" There is really no need to be abrasive.


Hypocrisy, my ass. Women do the same thing and they generally make a bigger fiasco of rejection than men. I've turned women down before--ranging from desired relationships to casual sex and this sent a few of them into a psychotic frenzy.

You don't hear me bitching how I was called nasty names, do ya?
I don't care. I was glad to be rid of them.



Stephen said:


> *Nice work on the empathy there. :laughing: What you're implying is selling our segment of the species short.


I am no one's wet nurse.


----------



## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

> Women do the same thing and they generally make a bigger fiasco of rejection than men.


I've turned down men and put up with them going into some sort of psychotic frenzy.... and then dealt with them stalking me... and then dealt with them attempting to spread rumors about me. So yeah that comment is _far_ from the truth.


----------



## funcoolname (Sep 17, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> Hypocrisy, my ass. Women do the same thing and they generally make a bigger fiasco of rejection than men. I've turned women down before--ranging from desired relationships to casual sex and this sent a few of them into a psychotic frenzy.
> 
> You don't hear me bitching how I was called nasty names, do ya?
> I don't care. I was glad to be rid of them.
> ...


Personally, I've never seen women behave that way, although I'm sure they exist, but I see it much, much more often from guys. But just because a subset of two groups of people do the same hypocritical thing to one another does not makes it right or acceptable or less hypocritical. And empathy is not about being or not being someone's wet nurse, it's just the capability to see a situation from another person's point of view and it sometimes leads to understanding and sometimes then to less defensiveness and even to kindness, which is not something to be sneered at all the time. I'm going to stop here because I just don't think we're going to ever see eye to eye.


----------



## foobar (Sep 22, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> More than I'd care to acknowledge.


Well, maybe you need to go to places where you can meet more respectable women?



> I was talking about a subset of women who bitch and whine that they can't keep a guy beyond the 3 month mark because their heads are so far up their asses that it ain't even funny.


A subset of women? Sounds to me like you were generalizing "most" promiscuous women to be that way:



> Take your pick. *Most of them* are all of the above.


Maybe you know so many of these women because they're the only ones desperate enough to tolerate your obnoxious, judgmental attitude?


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

Eerie said:


> I've turned down men and put up with them going into some sort of psychotic frenzy.... and then dealt with them stalking me... and then dealt with them attempting to spread rumors about me. So yeah that comment is _far_ from the truth.


I've dealt with female stalkers myself. Why? 
Because I rejected them.

And I've known a lot of women that went crazy and go to ridiculous lengths to exact revenge on the guy doing the rejecting. How about the "all men are scum!!!" sessions that women regularly have? What the hell do you think that's all about?

Women are equally as guilty of all of the things men are held responsible for. Predatory and sexist behavior is NOT exclusive to one gender. Men don't talk about it that much, because women expect us to "take it like a man!" This in turn, leads to repressive tendencies and misogynistic views towards women and their "nature".

And that's the damn truth.



funcoolname said:


> Personally, I've never seen women behave that way, although I'm sure they exist, but I see it much, much more often from guys.


But women still do it. And when they do, it is _always_ a bigger ordeal--it becomes a colossal clusterfuck of infantile histrionics that nobody really wants to get wrapped up in.



> But just because a subset of two groups of people do the same hypocritical thing to one another does not makes it right or acceptable or less hypocritical. And empathy is not about being or not being someone's wet nurse, it's just the capability to see a situation from another person's point of view and it sometimes leads to understanding and sometimes then to less defensiveness and even to kindness, which is not something to be sneered at all the time. I'm going to stop here because I just don't think we're going to ever see eye to eye.


Of course this behavior is unethical. I don't encourage it. I never said that I did.
What's more unethical, however, is that you insist that "it's no big deal" when it happens to men. 

And you accuse me of lacking empathy?
Try again.


----------



## funcoolname (Sep 17, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> I've dealt with female stalkers myself. Why?
> Because I rejected them.
> 
> And I've known a lot of women that went crazy and go to ridiculous lengths to exact revenge on the guy doing the rejecting. How about the "all men are scum!!!" sessions that women regularly have? What the hell do you think that's all about?
> ...


Dude, I never, ever said it wasn't a big deal when it happens to men. It's not pleasant for anyone. I just said I have seen it *happen more* with men getting angry at women - as in just that that has been my experience and not belittling others' experiences. I already said that yes, women probably do it, too. By saying it wasn't an ethical thing to do I was just responding to your "Hypocrisy, my ass" comment, wherein you made it sound like you didn't believe that type of behavior was hypocritical because women do it too. My point was that it's hypocritical in anyone, so saying "Hypocrisy, my ass" doesn't really apply. It's not even not seeing eye to eye anymore, you take things that I say and go in directions I never intended, so I can't tell if you're trolling or not. If you want to go around believing that all women have "men are scum!!" sessions, and don't want men to share their feelings, and don't want them to ditch the need to "take it like a man" those will be the kind of women you attract so I will leave you to it.


----------



## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> And I've known a lot of women that went crazy and go to ridiculous lengths to exact revenge on the guy doing the rejecting. How *about the "all men are scum!!!" sessions that women regularly have?* What the hell do you think that's all about?


I don't know any women like that, honestly.


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

foobar said:


> Well, maybe you need to go to places where you can meet more respectable women?


I don't actively seek these women out.
I'm an ISTP--we're hard to get.
These types like the whole mystery "aura" bullshit we have going on.
_*jerk-off motion*_



> A subset of women? Sounds to me like you were generalizing "most" promiscuous women to be that way:


Probably. I know "promiscuous" women often have high testosterone levels and this creates severe mood swings and otherwise erratic behavior as a result. 

Either way, I am indifferent. People can do what they want.
Doesn't mean I have to cheer it on or agree with it wholesale.
I only ask that you get it out of my face, thanks.



> Maybe you know so many of these women because they're the only ones desperate enough to tolerate your obnoxious, judgmental attitude?


Truth is hardly obnoxious, young one.
I know them because they are EVERYWHERE. From work, acquaintances, people I meet while I'm out and about. I don't get close to these women; I keep it casual.

_"'Sup? How's Donny? Have you eaten at the new Chipotle in town? Nice purse--is it Prada?"_

Shit like that.



Eerie said:


> I don't know any women like that, honestly.


They exist. And there are also monstrous women who terrorize men because they're bitter and disgruntled themselves and many of them are hard to figure out until it's too late. 

Welcome to the male perspective, sweetheart. It ain't as pretty as you're led to believe.


----------



## MXZCCT (May 29, 2011)

Jesus Duck, making waves I see.

Your fellow ISTP agrees with what you have said. Rock On.


----------



## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> They exist. And there are also monstrous women who terrorize men because they're bitter and disgruntled themselves and many of them are hard to figure out until it's too late.
> 
> Welcome to the male perspective, sweetheart. It ain't as pretty as you're led to believe.


Firstly, I don't have people that _immature_ in my life whether male or female, second _*don't call me sweetheart*_.


----------



## KINGoftheAMAZONS (Jun 21, 2011)

When a woman has sex specifically with a man, society comes to view her as 'used goods'. She's been tainted and defiled. Men however, because they are supposed to be the active partners, are not seen by society as being defiled or tainted when they have sex with other people (as long as they're topping their partner). That is why so many people have negative reactions only to promiscuous women, because such a woman has 'exchanged her natural use for that which is against nature'. And her natural use is to open her legs only for her *husband* (whenever *he* wants it) and provide and give birth to *his* children.

So it's not just promiscuous women who are seen in a negative light, but also any woman who doesn't have sex within the confines of marriage with only her husband (though younger American generations are starting to ignore this belief). Also, a woman's personal control over her own sex life, takes away the power that men have given themselves over a woman's vagina for thousands of years. And that just makes some people uncomfortable roud:.


----------



## KINGoftheAMAZONS (Jun 21, 2011)

Duck_of_Death said:


> Women are equally as guilty of all of the things men are held responsible for. Predatory and sexist behavior is NOT exclusive to one gender. Men don't talk about it that much, because women expect us to "take it like a man!" This in turn, leads to repressive tendencies and misogynistic views towards women and their "nature".


You've got this twisted. It was not women who invented the fallacy of 'taking it like a man', and it is not only, or even mostly women who propagate such a myth. It was men who created this (as it is a central philosophy created by a patriarchal society), and a lot of women jumped on the bandwagon. But there's no such thing as taking it like a man. Secondly, misandry does exist, and I hate it. But it is not, nor has it ever been as prevalent as misogyny. Thirdly, Misogyny does not exist because of misandry. Misogyny exists because historically men (not all of course) have always used their physical, financial, and social strength to bully and oppress women. 

P.S, not all women have the same 'nature'. We're all different, just like how all men are not the same either.


----------



## Duck_of_Death (Jan 21, 2011)

I agree with many of your points. In fact, I'll come right out and say you're pretty much dead on with all of them. I did feel that it was vital, however, to introduce several points that are often deemed "politically incorrect" and fly under-the-radar, yet undeniably are an important piece of the puzzle.


----------



## Jamie.Ether (Jul 1, 2011)

I don't agree with promiscuity in either sex. I've called guys "sluts", same standard for girls. 
I don't see how gender should make this any different.

In the way society sees it, there's a paradox.
Guys are encouraged to have sex with many girls.
Girls are encouraged to have sex with few guys.
If guys are having lots of sex... so are girls. Because the guy is having sex with girls. It takes 2 to tango.
If you expect either gender to have little or much sex, the activity of the opposite gender will mirror their amount of activity.


----------



## shadowofambivalence (May 11, 2011)

Women don't always have the final say, becasue men are usually physically stronger than women and could easily take advantage of them that way if the woman wont have sex with him and they sometimes get their freinds with them to gang up on a woman and do it that way and the woman will have no say and the men would turn around and call the woman a whore anyway. Most people dont really care weather or not a woman gets raped and just sees it as an every day thing. The next time you call a woman a whore think of it this way; that woman ends up doing it with every guy she comes across becasue she is afraid of them and and confused on what to do, so she does it out of the despair she feels becasue its the only thing she can do or at least she thinks so and she ends up avoiding men becasue those men wont give a damn about how she feels. 

This is one of the more depressing points of veiws i have on the promiscutity between the sexes and it may be a little outdated but it still happens.


----------

