# Politeness - common trait among XNTJ?



## Scoobyscoob (Sep 4, 2016)

DOGSOUP said:


> Hell yea I love drama
> 
> BTW I think this is a genuine type difference because for me nothing is as energizing as confrontation
> 
> ...


ENTJ who tries to be more ESFJ. 😛


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## Scoobyscoob (Sep 4, 2016)

Darlene_ said:


> Literally never met NFJs who create drama (on accident or by purpose). Studying MBTI and different personal metrics over 15+ years and knowing several NFJs, I know they are not drama seekers by nature. I wouldn't even put that characteristic to any specific type preference. Drama seeking and creating properties in a personality aligns with some other personality factors, which are not covered by MBTI.


Oh really? So Charles de Gaulle and Adolf Hitler were just outliers and not the rule?

Drama in War: 




War is simpliest the deadliest drama.


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## cynfalyn (Jan 24, 2021)

impulsenine said:


> It is also about gestures and words used.
> 
> I have not heard any "thank you", "that was my pleasure" or "please" that sounds more authentic and sincere from someone other than xNTJ.
> 
> ...


Nothing wrong with being an ENTJ. Of course, not all ENTJs are that bent.


Scoobyscoob said:


> Shows how much you know then. War is basically serious drama that NFJs create.


My daughter is an INFJ, and war would be the last thing she would start. She doesn't want to get that close to people, ha! She really doesn't enjoy a big to do, but, that being said, she would bitch slap the hell out of someone if it came to it. So, maybe a mini-war. I am being light-hearted!


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Scoobyscoob said:


> ENTJ who tries to be more ESFJ. 😛


which one of us? 😆


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## Scoobyscoob (Sep 4, 2016)

DOGSOUP said:


> which one of us? 😆


I was referring to you. Are there more?


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Scoobyscoob said:


> I was referring to you. Are there more?


Considering I have typed as both, you win this round


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## ImpossibleHunt (May 30, 2020)

I don't know, but trying to avoid confrontation might be a thing that's more applicable to the Enneagram.
An INTJ 5w6 will be a lot different compared to an INTJ 8w7. Being the former, I try to avoid confrontation when it is unnecessary. I think there is a correlation with most INTJs being E5s.
On the other hand, Enneagram 8s tend to feel a lot more comfortable with confrontation and aggression. I think ENTJs and ESTPs are the most common E8s.
As such, I think an INTJ is going to be more likely to avoid conflict, over an ENTJ.

For example, I was at a _Tim Hortons_ today, and some lady in front of me was giving the cashier a hard time.
The lady asked the cashier to just put her spare change into the donation box, but the cashier couldn't reach around the till.
So he opted to give her back the change, and asked her to deposit it herself since the box was on her side. Seemed pretty simple to me. But the lady just kept on being condescending and insulting.
After a minute or so, I got annoyed. I ended up telling the lady to "_take her change, to grow up, and to deal with it_".
But that was after a few seconds of back and forth, outweighing the positives and negatives of the situation.
After that, I figured I got my point across, and didn't say much else. The lady was a different story (she went on insulting me while I ignored her), but that's besides the point.

On the other hand, My father is an ESTP 8w7, and he doesn't think much before jumping into action, or giving someone a hard time if he feels like they deserve it.
One time I was at a restaurant eating with my father. There was this drunk guy being racist towards the cashier.
To put the difference into perspective. I am a 5w6, and I was extremely bothered by the man, and I was seriously deliberating getting involved.
By the point I committed myself into getting involved and got out of my seat, my E8 father was already across the room threatening to throw the man out with his bare hands.


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## AngelaKirijoo (Jan 6, 2021)

impulsenine said:


> I agree with that. xNTP wants to introduce drama in order to have fun with that.
> 
> And the rest ... each with his own interests.


Is that so? I don't find dramas to be fun at all. And usually I am formal and dry.


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## Rift (Mar 12, 2012)

as far as patterns go, I would say more xntj develop finesse in navigating social parameters but they also risk crashing down hard when they fail. . . vs Ps which tend to wear their neuroses on their sleeves and the expectations for them tend to be lower. of course, it depends on their motivations.. and ability to do so.


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## Scoobyscoob (Sep 4, 2016)

cynfalyn said:


> Nothing wrong with being an ENTJ. Of course, not all ENTJs are that bent.
> 
> My daughter is an INFJ, and war would be the last thing she would start. She doesn't want to get that close to people, ha! She really doesn't enjoy a big to do, but, that being said, she would bitch slap the hell out of someone if it came to it. So, maybe a mini-war. I am being light-hearted!


It's usually the extroverts that start stuff. Hence why I said NFJs. 🙂


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## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

DOGSOUP said:


> I don't think that's politeness tho. I get what you are getting at, @Catwalk has been nothing but sweet to me in the past but if she ever went after my posts I would have started crying.


Aww. Crying is the only thing that breaks my NTJ heart and make me pause in shame.


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## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

impulsenine said:


> Or am I biased?
> 
> The most polite people I have met in my life have been ENTJs and INTJs.
> 
> ...


Unless I am in a professional environment or something, I would not say I am that polite. I literally just run right over people in conversation rather rudely and say some shit accidentally I probably shouldn't have or should've worded differently, because I don't actively register how anyone else would take it. I've always learned over the year(s) to watch my tone, because I can come off harsh, condescending or accidentally "bossy" sometimes. I swear, none of it is purposeful. Introvert(s) have this problem less, I'm sure. That reminds of the time @WickerDeer described my social situations as violence LOL. 

But professionally, of course I am polite. I am following social conventions - but it's not because I care about the people, lol, I wouldn't do it like a (Fe) user kissing ass, I really couldn't care less about the people/think of the children aspect of it, so long as I'm getting the best out of the situation. It is just the best root to getting what you want. I will kiss ass if they are important, but it's selfishly done, and I rather do that than just go around terrorizing people for what because it's just not productive. Manners seems like a cultural, upbringing/parenting thing, more than some MBTI thing. So you've ran into some M'ladies, & that's what I get out of it. 

I've had many people stop me mid conversation & go "you can't just say things like that! Think of who might me listening or "who might get hurt,". Stuff like that. I have literally hurt people with my mouth, and I'm not even saying mean things. Lmao. Many NFs get on me about this tone watching and tact thing, but that is probably because I just like hearing myself speak so I'm not picking up details of how I'm actively coming off. I thought I was being polite, but apparently not.


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## HAL (May 10, 2014)

My dad is ENTJ. Rather than being polite, I think he prefers to not say anything at all unless it's worth saying. This has a level of moral tact to it too, i.e. he won't deliberately do something wrong or hurtful. 

An INTJ guy I worked with was the least polite person I've ever met. He clearly approached life from a highly analytical viewpoint, and I could tell he always made great efforts to think of others, but it was very forced and out of character. Most often he would get it wrong, and usually came across as blunt, selfish or thoughtless. He was waaaaay into the bad end of whatever the bad end of the INTJ spectrum is. We got on very well as friends but I quit that job because of him. He was impossible to work with.

Generally I don't think NTJs care that much for social niceties. They care for getting shit done. ENTJs are probably better at dancing the social minefield than INTJs.


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## Pretender (Apr 27, 2016)

If we go by the personalities baseline traits, INTJs and ENTJs are one of the least polite types. 

INTJs tend to be ignorant of social norms and only pay attention to them if they have a specific reason. INTJs also prize efficiency, and combining that with Ni's _I already know the answer_ thought pattern leads them to be completely dismissive of the people that they see no direct value in interacting with, so they don't even pretend to small talk out of politeness because it's a waste of time. They also often state their thoughts and opinions without considering the impact on other people's feelings, because INTJs barely pay attention to their own feelings. All of that can come off impolite as fuck.

ENTJs, with their HGH-enhanced Te are basically human bulldozers and how does that tie into politeness?


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## Ewok City (Sep 21, 2020)

ENTJ female might be polite to someone that they don't know too well. Once you get to know them better, they will start to lower it down. 

But generally, xNTJs that I have met are not as polite as the xSTJs that I have met.


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## HAL (May 10, 2014)

The least polite person I have ever known is an INTJ. He does sort of make an effort, but it's a very robotic effort and he accidentally offends people all the time. I genuinely think he might be on the autism spectrum though.

My dad, an ENTJ, is perfectly polite when needed. But then, most people I know are polite. I think there will also be cultural factors at play here.


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## Allostasis (Feb 2, 2021)

I am neither polite nor rude, I think.
Just assertive and robotic, too focused with the point of conversation rather than the experience of it.

I am not on the spectrum though. Although I do think that I am much more numb emotionally than most with whom I converse.


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## Eu_citzen (Jan 18, 2018)

I like WickerDeer's post. It's how I see it, too, for the most part

As for bulldozing. 
This is usually done by me when the recipient of my message doesn't seem to register it any other way.
i.e. having to slap some sense into them so they get what I'm saying.

Someone mentioned ENTJs "loosing" their politeness as you become closer to them.
This is typically true, IME, I specifically choose friends on the premise that I shouldn't have to filter myself too much.
And the closer you get, the less filters there'll be.


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## Glittris (May 15, 2020)

It might show up as politeness, but for me, it is more from my "I do not care about you"-attitude. I do not start drama and never reinforce drama either, especially if it is about petty details. Makes other people think that I am polite and just hold my thoughts, instead of acting on it.

I might think you are a jerk for jumping the queue, but I am more busy with my own thoughts and my own life to make a fuss about it, especially if it is only a few people in line. Yes, it looks I am polite.



Pretender said:


> INTJs tend to be ignorant of social norms and only pay attention to them if they have a specific reason. INTJs also prize efficiency, and combining that with Ni's _I already know the answer_ thought pattern leads them to be completely dismissive of the people that they see no direct value in interacting with, so they don't even pretend to small talk out of politeness because it's a waste of time. They also often state their thoughts and opinions without considering the impact on other people's feelings, because INTJs barely pay attention to their own feelings. All of that can come off impolite as fuck.


True and indeed true... What is the idea of following a rule when it is illogical? Those rules just wish to be broken and replaced by more efficient rules.

For myself though, being Fi-heavy, I do not state my opinions unless taking other people's whereabouts into consideration. I simply can't see myself as a "bulldozer" in any discussion, i am too much of a rational diplomat for that. ^^


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## Allostasis (Feb 2, 2021)

off-topic: 



Glittris said:


> For myself though, being Fi-heavy


I am not sure how legal this statement is, to be honest.
In Jung's typology, you can't be "introverted intuitive" with thinking as an auxiliary function AND be Fi heavy, as it has to be unconscious.
So, either you don't have it, or you are not INTJ, in my understanding. (or you don't use this typology).


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