# XNTJ's



## L (Aug 12, 2011)

How does your Te manifest itself in most situations?

Do you think yours is normal?

What about your Ni?


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## Chipps (Jun 1, 2011)

Hm. Tricky, I guess I don't spent a lot time actually thinking about it. No pun intended.

Te usually causes me to literally only be logical most of the time. I find it hard to process things that aren't defined on logic. I always need a reason or a better reason for things or processing the information takes longer.

For example: In situations involving feelings. If a girl is dating a guy and he treats her like crap the entire time then he dumps her, I cannot understand why should would still be in love with him and would jump at the chance to get back with him. Apparently this concept is simple for most people but its difficult for me. I always think:

So he treats you like shit, puts you down, and you still love him?
He broke up with you for another girl, and now you want to get back with him? Because you love him?

To me, that is not a good enough reason. Its irrational and ridiculous.

Also, when people go through the motions "just because".

Example: College graduation. Its the same as every other graduation we've ever had in our lives so I decided Im not going. My bf doent want to go but his parents would be pissed if he didnt. If I point out that its the same event that has happened 3 other times in most people lives and has no real meaning people look like deers in headlights. Its they don't know the specific reason for doing shit, just that everyone else is doing it.When I point it out, and the think about it they tend to get angry and tell me to "just do it".

With Ni I literally cannot assign things concrete meanings. Like if you asked me if I was a democrat or conservative. Id say neither. I literally cannot get into political parties because the terms for each is too rigid for me. I want to take a piece from here, a piece from there and create an idea that is probably only specific to me as a person.

This is also why I don't have a favorite color, movie, celebrity, hobby etc. If you make me choose my brain cant do it. I will say well I like morgan freeman in shawshank, but oh that new movie with leonardo was really good it made me feel X way and i saw this independent film that was really thought provoking etc. I end up on some abstract rambling never being able to choose. I can tell you what I don't like very easily though.

I also have a hard time with blindly stereotyping things. My brain naturally looks for what is not the same and how that person is unique and different. You could tell me that most women are emotionally driven and or neurotic or jealous etc. Even though I know that I wont assign this idea to a female when first meeting her. I can't. I also can't accept someone elses opinion of another person. 3 people can tell me that "amanda" is a psycho bitch, I wont think that when first meeting her. I tend to want to see shit from my own personal perspective.

I think of it like an organism that doesn't have one from. Its constantly in motions and changing shape and is never concrete. Like how water takes the mold of anything while ice has one form.

I think i just rambled. Sorry. I wish I could give better examples.


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

Chipps said:


> For example: In situations involving feelings. If a girl is dating a guy and he treats her like crap the entire time then he dumps her, I cannot understand why should would still be in love with him and would jump at the chance to get back with him. Apparently this concept is simple for most people but its difficult for me. I always think:
> 
> So he treats you like shit, puts you down, and you still love him?
> He broke up with you for another girl, and now you want to get back with him? Because you love him?
> ...


Bold please.



> Also, when people go through the motions "just because".
> 
> Example: College graduation. Its the same as every other graduation we've ever had in our lives so I decided Im not going. My bf doent want to go but his parents would be pissed if he didnt. If I point out that its the same event that has happened 3 other times in most people lives and has no real meaning people look like deers in headlights. Its they don't know the specific reason for doing shit, just that everyone else is doing it.When I point it out, and the think about it they tend to get angry and tell me to "just do it".


I wanted to skip my high school graduation but my family wouldn't let me. Little do they know though that I will be skipping my college graduation on "accident" lmao. I have to take summer class's and I'm going to forget to apply for spring graduation in time. It's only my 2 year degree so I really, REALLY don't see the point in it. Might forget to apply for my 4 year graduation too. When I eventually get my doctorate (I hope) I will _might_ go to that one.... if they even have those haha.

Seriously though, the college I'm in is supposed to be a small school and I was told that there would be like 300 people graduating this spring, I practically fell into a coma right there. That would take FORFUCKINGEVER. My stupid ass high school took like 2 hours to graduate 20 people. Pfffffft... 300? No fucking thank you.


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

Also I'm mainly interested in Te as I might have a good way of describing Ni in a way. That thread will be coming out tomorrow as a prelude to four others I have been working on, just need to see how this one goes first. But I thought that perhaps I could get some last minute information about Ni that I might not have :happy:

Thanks in advance by the way, and also thanks for the previous post.


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## knittigan (Sep 2, 2011)

I can relate to what was said about finding feelings, etc. irrational. When people don't "make sense," they piss me off and I get very frustrated. I get easily irritated with people who have wishy-washy "subjective" logic. Ni can be a good substitute sometimes because I can force myself to "see" where they're coming from, even if I think they're full of shit.

My Te mostly expresses itself through my organisation. I have a colour-coded daily agenda that I would be lost without. My school notes are immaculate -- when I start putting together things to study with, they're typed and bulleted and bolded and italicised and underlined in all of the appropriate places. My computer files anal-retentively labelled and tagged, my book and disc collections are organised by genre and then alphabetised.

As for Ni, it mostly manifests itself as uncharacteristic indecision. I'll answer almost every question with "well, it depends..." Obliviousness: my head is always up in the clouds and concrete things can be very difficult for me to understand. I can write an entire thesis on the phenomenological construction of male bodies in the literature on sexual assault but basic car maintenance is exhausting. I know that I know things but I don't know how I know them and I'm routinely surprised that people are "impressed" with the things that I know because I often feel like I'm rambling and not really making a point. I'll add more as I think of it, by I hope that helps.


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## Donovan (Nov 3, 2009)

i'm not an XNTJ and therefore don't have Te, but from the Ni-dom perspective:

when a new lesson or information is being presented i just know when it's incomplete, or that something's missing--like if "A's" here and then we have "D"... something has to go here--"we're missing something"--and then from there my Ni allows me to just know where and how to search, or how to look at the information, and even after that point it allows me to organize and "streamline" the thinking or the concept in order to solidify it within my head, so, say in when i'm taking a test i'll go, "ok so here we have [this], and all of these separate parts really just mean [this], so the problem is basically asking me, or trying to become [this]", and then i have a "thought-grid" of sorts in which to follow through on.

i don't know if this is Ni or what, but i used to be able to picture things very vividly within my head to the point that i could recall the image and then draw it, well that talent became almost non-existent by the time i turned 10ish, but now it's almost like my mind traded that talent for understanding something my inferior Se would naturally comprehend. i can't just look at at a map, or physical puzzle and understand it without pouring over it for a while unless i break it down into words and thoughts, then i can literally follow an image or semblance of a road (odd side note: the roads or bars or lanes are usually green) within my head and completely understand the directions... not sure if that's Ni or not, but maybe it'll help you with your future post.


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## n2freedom (Jun 2, 2011)

I color code my agenda too. Basically, I will color code just about anything I can. My Te comes out in a need for things to be organized. I like to keep my task and their associated notes in folders. When things are too complex and don't make sense to me I will chart and or flowchart the information to identify how to streamline the information and/or regroup it for it to make sense to me.

It manifests in conversations as cutting through shit when people are trying to lie or bullshit me as I can uncannily pick up on what is not being said or to identify the gaps in the information being provided. It comes out in a need to have my surroundings organized to make the best use of my time. Te helps me to look at my to-do list and organize what needs to be done to get the most bang for my buck. For instance, I habitually cook all my meals for the week on Sunday and divvy my meals up in containers for ease of packing my lunch and preparing meals in the evening.

Te helps me manage my money, time, energy, and resources. As it helps me to see long range consequences of my actions today. It helps me to keep my eyes on the prize when it comes to my goals and mapping out how to get from point A to point B in the most effective way possible.

Ni is a little harder to explain. Best I can tell is it gives me hunches about what is going to happen next. When presented with information Ni gives me flashes of solutions that I have no idea of how I came up with them and if it is a debate or something I usually won't say anything until I look up information to find out my inclinations were correct. Either Te or Ni or both helps me to find the optimum solutions for problems and the insight to ask questions that others may not have considered.

Also, not sure if this is Ni or Te or both, but it also helps me to connect seemingly unrelated information to identify problems and situations. It helps me to see the unfamiliar in the familiar and basically see beneath the surface.

I believe Te/Ni drives me to yearn for a deeper understanding of things.....an insatiable need for knowing the "why". Ni has a spooky feel to me and I am learning to trust my instincts more. I guess my Te and Ni battle it out because Te says where are the facts and Ni says just trust me on this one....I got this. *shrugs shoulder* I don't know. I am still learning about cognitive functions.

They have been playing like an orchestra for me all these years and trying to separate them out is like trying to figure out the notes being played by the orchestra without the sheet music. I hope this helps.


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## Donovan (Nov 3, 2009)

> I believe Te/Ni drives me to yearn for a deeper understanding of things.....an insatiable need for knowing the "why".


(above) This, minus the Te part... kind of like, why not understand it from left to right, bottom to top so that it's inside and around your mind?


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## TheBoss (Oct 27, 2011)

L_Lawliet said:


> How does your Te manifest itself in most situations?
> 
> Do you think yours is normal?
> 
> What about your Ni?


My Ni says my Te is normal.
My Te provides the investigation to maintain that view.
What really strikes me is they work so close together, I can not imagine one without the other.

My Te manifests a lot/all the time. It likes organizing my files a lot, I put my stuff in specific places for efficiency. I do not want to waste brain matter OR time to find them. 
Te manifested like mad at school. "This is WRONG, this proof is irrational" was my customary line - much to the dismay of my teachers & professors. "This doesn't make rational sense" <- Te
It also likes to gather data. I observe people and events in the same detached way and gather data by the procedures, results, actions & reactions, all the time.
One INTx noticed it once, he asked "why you ask?" one day I had made a personal question to him. I said "just for my "general data mental file". He said "I thought so" and went on to answer my question.
Te has provided the action to re-write every single mathematical and physical theory I was ever taught in trees and step by step procedures, lists. Looking for effective (time wise too) "idiot proof" ways to learn/teach those subjects in the fastest way. (<- you can also see how my Ni plays a part in this and you can imagine Ti giving me a hard time in the whole process.)

The strongest manifestation, I would say comes when analyzing feelings and actions made by them.
There is nothing 'stupid' nor anything random. Te wouldn't accept that, it needs to find the REASONS and it believes there always are reasons. Logical ones. Rational causes to every feeling. So it dissects with Logic and reaches rational conclusion on everything, even feelings. Especially feelings - is like the ultimate goal perhaps, if one can be rational about them, is the absolute Te victory.

My Ni demonstrated itself equally early. Making science theories, life theories, creating completely new or combining older ones in a fascinating light-bulb way. It gets the *idea* where everything snaps in place and then his buddy Te comes to realize it, to add the practical aspect.
Best examples: realizing matter IS energy (way before I even heard of relativity), solving whether light is particles or waves (on my own), and my personal cumulative Universal Physics theory.


> Ni synthesizes seeming paradoxes to create the previously unimagined.


There is both occult and hard science that comprise my Physics theory. That's Ni :wink:

Without my Ni, life would be uninspired. Without Te, I'd be unable to analyze and apply - I'd be 'practically stupid'. Gullible if you prefer.


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

Interesting.... I see a lot of Ne inside of your posts about Ni. But I can see such a huge different between the precision of Ni whereas Ne is more playful and not really concerned with much.

So if I have this right then Ne basically creates a web of information whereas Ni finds a previous made web and cuts out what isn't needed. Thanks everybody:happy: and merry christmas.

Look for my thread later in the day (possibly at night) in the general psychology forum:wink: I'll provide a link from here to it. It will be about the Sensing and iNuition functions.


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## TheBoss (Oct 27, 2011)

L_Lawliet said:


> Interesting.... I see a lot of Ne inside of your posts about Ni.


And quite some Si


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

TheBoss said:


> And quite some Si


Precisely!


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## boblikesoup (Nov 26, 2011)

It's hard for me to differentiate my Te and Ni functions so I'll just write about how my thought processing works and let you make your analysis.

-I have spent hours on CIA World Fact Book looking at random points of data (populations, GDP's per capita, etc...), then getting hunches and theories, then scrambling to other fields of research to confirm them. 
-I visualize strange graphs in my head for very abstract concepts.
-I easily express arguments and am a very convincing person in general. I understand others' apprehensions and know exactly what to say to ease them.
-Somebody will start to say something or express an idea and I can often quickly and easily deduce what they are going to say, then cut them off and finish their idea (to show I am on the same page).
-In groups, I ask tactful questions/make statements that result in revelations and learning based on peoples' observations and experiences, even though deriving such understandings was not the purpose behind the information being shared
-When a group is deciding what to do and in what order to do it, I have a ready willingness to put forth ideas and a tendency to have them acted upon.


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## TheBoss (Oct 27, 2011)

boblikesoup said:


> -Somebody will start to say something or express an idea and I can often quickly and easily deduce what they are going to say, then cut them off and finish their idea (*to show I am on the same page*).


I do all mentioned too (xcept sometimes I am not much on the tactful side).

I quote this to point two things. The 1st is the bolded part; is the reason I do that too, "see I am truly paying attention to what you say" and "am on same page".
The 2nd thing is, it doesn't work with assholes. They take personal offence being interrupted, mainly because they do not give a DAMN whether you are on the same page. They just like the sound of their voice lecturing - uninterrupted.
Exercise with caution...


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

TheBoss said:


> I do all mentioned too (xcept sometimes I am not much on the tactful side).
> 
> I quote this to point two things. The 1st is the bolded part; is the reason I do that too, "see I am truly paying attention to what you say" and "am on same page".
> The 2nd thing is, it doesn't work with assholes. They take personal offence being interrupted, mainly because they do not give a DAMN whether you are on the same page. They just like the sound of their voice lecturing - uninterrupted.
> Exercise with caution...


Actually in my case it's not that I love the sound of my own voice or anything I just fucking hate being interrupted. Happens all of the time with my so called family, it's like they don't respect me at all.

If you were adding something to something I was saying, that may be different. But being an INTP with lots of information on things that nobody cares about... well that has yet to happen.


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## TheBoss (Oct 27, 2011)

L_Lawliet said:


> it's like they don't respect me at all.


So, you don't give a damn if the other person in a conversation is on the same page with you? <- you don't discuss; you lecture
So, you don't give a damn if the other person in a conversation comprehends? <- you don't care for them to comprehend, just to say your thing => hear own voice

And you (all you's are generic) can't GET that something you say may spark a thought they need to express to actually prove your point (which means they TRULY gave a damn about what you were saying).


Every time i see people getting offended by being interrupted, I stomp them. Like the egotistic roaches they are. They dislike my reaching out => they reject (or fail to grasp the gesture) my good nature => they care just for themselves, their own opinions *+* they can't process multiple thoughts simultaneously => I dislike their bad nature => I dislike their lack of mental flexibility => they see my bad nature.
Egalitarian to the core. ^^

If they act offended, it means 2 things:
- they are in fact idiots that lose their own train of thought and that frustrates them
- they have this insanely blown up ego that makes them believe that whenever they do the honours to utter an opinion, world should stand still and listen.

Oh man, I can't stomp them enough...

Wouldn't be disrespectful if they utterly ignored you making NO effort to work mentally what you say. You prefer to talk to walls or to intelligent humans?
Then again, walls won't challenge our theories and are very patient listeners. Basically, because they do not care - at all...

----

What I HOPE you are saying, is you talking about a subject and people interrupting only to change the subject, completely ignoring what you wanted to communicate. Like your voice never came out.
That, I sympathize and understand.


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

TheBoss said:


> So, you don't give a damn if the other person in a conversation is on the same page with you? <- you don't discuss; you lecture
> So, you don't give a damn if the other person in a conversation comprehends? <- you don't care for them to comprehend, just to say your thing => hear own voice
> 
> And you (all you's are generic) can't GET that something you say may spark a thought they need to express to actually prove your point (which means they TRULY gave a damn about what you were saying).
> ...


The second one lol. My second paragraph should have conveyed that, if not then my mistake.


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## TheBoss (Oct 27, 2011)

Sorry I ranted ^^


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

TheBoss said:


> Sorry I ranted ^^


*looks at signature*
Wouldn't want to upset you :wink:


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## L (Aug 12, 2011)

Here it is!

The reason for this thread, and the link I promised :happy: 

Enjoy, and let me know what you think.


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