# Ne>Ni>Ti>Fi Does This Make Any Sense?



## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

For years I identified as an INFP. Recently I decided that ENFP fits me better, as I am very open about my thoughts, feelings, and life experiences...very hyperactive and usually scattered in my energies. Well, cognitive functions tests seem to indicate otherwise:

extraverted Sensing (Se) ********************* (21.6)
limited use
introverted Sensing (Si) ******* (7.8)
unused
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************************************ (48.8)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) *********************************************** (47.7)
excellent use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ******************** (20)
limited use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ***************************************** (41.8)
excellent use
extraverted Feeling (Fe) *********************** (23.5)
limited use
introverted Feeling (Fi) **************************** (28.6)
average use

-------------------------------

The other cognitive functions test I took showed me as a Ni Dom with Ti Aux. This one shows me as Ne-Ni-Ti. Does this mean I am likely an ENTP rather than an ENFP? But my Fe is weak...my Fi is significantly higher. I received similar results on both tests. And this actually confirms my suspicions that I have strong Ti...something ENFPs are supposed to lack completely. 

I've wondered for some time if the MBTI cognitive function orders for the different types just don't represent the majority of the population. I believe I do have strong Ne, Ni and Ti. But what type would that make me? An INFJ in a Ni-Ti loop? An ENTP with poorly developed Fe? Thoughts?


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## zenity (Nov 6, 2011)

This posts looks very typical of Ne, and ENFP in particular. However, your past history makes you look very much like an INFP.

You have to take the cognitive function tests with a very large grain of salt. From what I've seen here, it's very common for people to score strongly in the same function with both intraverted and extraverted perspectives, like you do with Ne and Ni; that usually implies a strong focus on a particular function without reference to how its energy is directed, and can often throw off test results. In this case, it seems that you have a strong focus on Ne and Fi. Ignore the larger assessment of the test for a moment.

For a very long time, you thought of yourself as having strong Fi, even if you were not putting it in those terms. So what has changed recently for you?


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## LiquidLight (Oct 14, 2011)

Yea you probably don't have both strong Ne and Ni, that's probably an error of the test like has been pointed out. Ni is basically the polar opposite way of intuitive perception from Ne so it would take tremendous amounts of cognitive energy to jump back and forth between the two. I also don't think those test do a great job of differentiating introverted functions anyway. From that test you are probably an ENTP (maybe INTP), but you should further research the functions and see what applies to you. If you are a Ti-type then you must also be a Fe-type.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

Thanks for the response. OK, I am going to try to do this without rambling too much. 

As a kid I considered myself extremely logical. I excelled in elementary school and was in gifted programs. I was actually tested as having the highest IQ in my entire county amongst preschool students when I was four years old. I always deeply analyzed anything that interested me, though I had a tendency to have more breadth than depth to my general knowledge base. However, when I am intrigued by something, I become so completely absorbed by it that I fixate and even obsess. I am well known by friends and family as being somehow both scattered and obsessive. When it comes to logic versus emotion, I feel I have hefty doses of both. I realize that feeling does not equal emotion in MBTI, and thinking does not equal lack of emotion. Generally, I go by what seems logically most sound when I am forming an opinion. The only reason I was not sent to the magnet gifted school where some of my closest friends went is because of my disorganization. My reading comprehension and writing abilities were always scored in the 98-99th percentiles. My math was only "above average" as a young child...was "average" in middle school, and was below average in high school. I absolutely struggle with math. I do like biology, but not physical science. My interest in history varies depending on the time period and events at hand.

I spend much of my time alone thinking and feeling on things that matter to me. I do however love deep one-on-one relationships. As a kid and to this day, I tend to make one or two best friends with whom I spend all my social time. With these friends I discuss in depth our experiences of life and our thoughts and feelings about the world around us. Often I am drained by social interaction, and sometimes I am charged by it. In general, I don't like large groups of people. I much prefer to spend time with one to a few people I trust and relate to, rather than to surround myself with lots of shallow relationships. I am infuriated by stupidity but try to be compassionate when possible. When someone has no ability for logical thought I have no desire to interact with them. 

I am insanely romantic and right now I am deeply, hopelessly in love with an INTP who may or may not ever become my life-partner. I've written him poems, cooked him romantic dinners, and when he and I are together I am constantly caressing him in between our deep conversations. I am extremely physically affectionate. I feel more secure sleeping with my lover in bed with me. However, I do not flit from one relationship to the next. It's extremely rare that someone really fascinates me. I am most attracted to INTPs, followed by ENTPs and INTJs. To be frank, SPs are absolutely unattractive to me romantically, as are SJs. I am only romantically attracted to intuitives, and have a strong preference for NTs. Someone who can discuss philosophy and literature is much sexier to me than someone who is business oriented or very physical. I realize those things aren't mutually exclusive, but I tend to long for the absent-minded-nerd-professor type. My love for this INTP is so strong that I have spent many days and nights sobbing uncontrollably because of my fear we will never truly be together.

My interests scholastically are English and the human sciences. I am attending community college for Psychology and Social Work right now. I would major in English but I don't think I want to be a teacher. I am leaning towards counseling people who have experienced grave trauma, or being a patient liaison in a hospital or nursing home. Ages 17-19 I worked in a nursing home and the residents became extremely close with me. I was a surrogate grandchild to many of them, and held people's hands as they passed away. I would say I felt a combination of detachment and compassion for these people. I was just detached enough that I could endure it, and yet attached enough that I genuinely wanted to ease their pain and bring them joy. 

I love good poetry and good writing in general. I have written a few excellent poems and a lot of mediocre ones. I sometimes have a hard time focusing on anything in order to hone my skills. Other times I am so obsessed by a topic that I can't get it out of my head and I study and analyze it incessantly. 

I have only one social issue that deeply, utterly affects me. For that subject I would be willing to nearly die to enact significant change. Even though I have significant logical data to back up my position on this topic, during a debate I become dizzy with feelings and have a hard time maintaining my cool. I can stay stubbornly detached about all sorts of other issues, but on this one, I am completely involved. 

I am often depressed and feel misunderstood. I am very passionate and am accustomed to people laughing at me for it. I tend not to take other's advice and have to learn everything "the hard way". The INTP relationship is one example - most everyone recommends I walk away, but I feel he is my soul mate. I would be willing to give him a kidney even if he never does partner up with me. In general, though, I am reserved in how much I give of myself. Romance is my Achilles' Heel.

I seem to have an intense sort of magnetism about me. Many men become rapidly enamored of me. I realize that I am above-average in the looks department, but there is certainly more to it than that. At any given time, I literally have a handful of suitors who would be willing to do nearly anything for me to choose them as my partner. This is despite the fact that I have addiction issues, Borderline Personality issues, and lack a solid career. I've been told I could "charm the birds out of the trees." I sometimes do this intentionally, but usually not. I am very sexual and sensual, but above all, romantic. I am very picky and am only attracted to the smartest people.

OK -- I have said quite a lot here already. I will post this and ask that anyone please chime in with thoughts. If anyone has any specific questions to help me ascertain my type, I am more than willing to answer them.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

I just saw the last post on this thread. I know that if I am an ENTP I must be a Fe type, according to the theory. I am not sure about that one. I do, certainly, desire a powerful melding of the souls with another individual. This is what I feel for my INTP beau. But that can be Fi as much as Fe? I don't feel a strong connection with most people. I am aware of what people are feeling and what to do to make them feel better, most of the time. I do like to make people happy but that is only a priority for me in regards to the people I am closest to.

It seems obvious to me that I utilize Ne. I also believe I use Ni, though, because I am very focused on an internal image of what I want to become. My biggest confusion is Ti versus Fi. From what I've read, I use Fi more than Fe. But, how do we know that this system is absolutely perfect? I COULD be a Ne-Ti-Fi - it's possible if one doesn't take the system as absolutely accurate, don't you guys think?

INFJ seems possible for me, and so does ENFP and ENTP. I used to think I might be INTP, but ultimately I am far too open and passionate to fit that description. I look at my INTP beau, who fits the INTP mold almost too perfectly for his own good, and we are very different people. However, we both feel that we are soulmates. We have felt a deep, heart-wrenching connection from the first moment we started speaking. The main reason I am mentioning him is because I wonder if me being so enamored of a quintessential INTP might give a clue as to my own type.

The main thing that has changed recently for me is truly being in love. If anything I fit the INFP/ENFP model in this regard. I fantasize about us being together for the rest of our lives, in love. But my INTP fantasizes about those things too. I think I WANT to be an NT, but that I am probably an NF. But sometimes I am confused, as I am more attracted to logic than sentimentality...even though I enjoy both.


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## LiquidLight (Oct 14, 2011)

You are probably an INFJ. 

You definitely have that Ni self-assuredness (and the Ni-Ti laboring over an issue from however many angles you can think of). I'd be curious to know what your issue is that gets you so passionate (maybe in private if its too sensitive to post). INFJs tend to have specific things that get on their nerves (like SPs).

There will be a lot of people who come on and say stuff like 'there's nothing that says you can't use both Fe and Fi' but technically even if you could use both with similar functionality it would make you a strange personality. The function attitudes are opposites, so Fi and Fe is like trying to go north and south at the same time. You pretty much are going to favor one over the other (and its really unlikely you would commonly vacillate between your dominant function and its attitudinal opposite, that's damn near schizophrenia).


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

You sound like an INFP to me who probably wants to be T-like. Perhaps an INFJ. I suggest you look into that one also. And to truly understand the system, you CANNOT use 2 judging functions or 2 perceiving functions one-after-the-other - otherwise this renders the original system useless and you'd have to start from scratch to create a new one (of course, I don't think the brilliant Carl Jung spent so much of his time and effort pushing the limits of his psychological fortitude to come to the conclusions that he did just to be completely wrong...why would so many people agree with him on this forum to begin with who have studied the theory in depth?). According to my analysis, using, say, Fi after Ti like in the example you provided would technically make you incapable of thinking at all, since they are polar opposites, whether you like it or not. 

As for your conclusion about using Ni a lot since you have an internal image of who you want to become, well, as dominant Ni user, all I can say is there is no particular quality in what you mentioned that sounds anything like Ni to me - this is very likely Fi, since it is so personal and idealistic - all INFPs strive towards an ideal image of themselves by default as far as I've seen from forum discussions and the type descriptions. This is actually the dead last focus of an INTP, since this is their last function - it's basically irrelevant to them, and my experiences with an INTP identical twin sister definitely proves this (we have twin ESP in great degrees as identical twins anyhow, which is downright fascinating and eerily accurate when it comes to understanding her in terms of Jung relative to me! ^^). Frankly, I see no evidence of Ti in your writing, which also holds true to Jung's theories, since this should be your last function - of course, anyone can use any one of their functions, but the last function is the least relevant to one's thought-processes. I've noticed that a lot of INFPs tend to mistake their inferior Te for Ti, which I mainly blame on the lame and biased Te descriptions online, which can't shut up with the words "pragmatic," "rigid," - basically anything that makes it sound super boring, anal, critical, robotic - you name it. Sure, it can be those things, but obviously, there's much more to it than that on the positive end that is highly neglected by internet descriptions, which often have a heavy bias in favor of Fs, just to warn you. This can sound a bit conspiratorial, but I suspect that since Isabel Myers was an INFP, a lot of her depictions Te are projections of her negative experiences with it, but don't take my word for it. ;P As an INTJ who embraces Te as it really is, all I can say is the best you can do to explore your T side more is ask self-aware forum members for insight on it and compare their insights to the descriptions to gain a clearer sense of what it is.


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## LiquidLight (Oct 14, 2011)

JungyesMBTIno said:


> You sound like an INFP to me who probably wants to be T-like. I think you've already figured this out for yourself, so congrats on that! And to truly understand the system, you CANNOT use 2 judging functions or 2 perceiving functions one-after-the-other - otherwise this renders the original system useless and you'd have to start from scratch to create a new one (of course, I don't think the brilliant Carl Jung spent so much of his time and effort pushing the limits of his psychological fortitude to come to the conclusions that he did just to be completely wrong...why would so many people agree with him on this forum to begin with who have studied the theory in depth?). According to my analysis, using, say, Fi after Ti like in the example you provided would technically make you incapable of thinking at all, since they are polar opposites, whether you like it or not.
> 
> As for your conclusion about using Ni a lot since you have an internal image of who you want to become, well, as dominant Ni user, all I can say is there is no particular quality in what you mentioned that sounds anything like Ni to me - this is very likely Fi, since it is so personal and idealistic - all INFPs strive towards an ideal image of themselves by default as far as I've seen from forum discussions and the type descriptions. This is actually the dead last focus of an INTP, since this is their last function - it's basically irrelevant to them, and my experiences with an INTP identical twin sister definitely proves this (we have twin ESP in great degrees as identical twins anyhow, which is downright fascinating and eerily accurate when it comes to understanding her in terms of Jung relative to me! ^^). Frankly, I see no evidence of Ti in your writing, which also holds true to Jung's theories, since this should be your last function - of course, anyone can use any one of their functions, but the last function is the least relevant to one's thought-processes. I've noticed that a lot of INFPs tend to mistake their inferior Te for Ti, which I mainly blame on the lame and biased Te descriptions online, which can't shut up with the words "pragmatic," "rigid," - basically anything that makes it sound super boring, anal, critical, robotic - you name it. Sure, it can be those things, but obviously, there's much more to it than that on the positive end that is highly neglected by internet descriptions, which often have a heavy bias in favor of Fs, just to warn you. This can sound a bit conspiratorial, but I suspect that since Isabel Myers was an INFP, a lot of her depictions Te are projections of her negative experiences with it, but don't take my word for it. ;P As an INTJ who embraces Te as it really is, all I can say is the best you can do to explore your T side more is ask self-aware forum members for insight on it and compare their insights to the descriptions to gain a clearer sense of what it is.


I could buy this for sure. I just figured since she identified so much with her thinking I figured it wasn't in the inferior but I definitely think you're onto something. It crossed my mind that her obsession with the INTP was probably an animus projection based on inferior-Ti or Te. Either way I don't think she's an NT.


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

@LiquidLight

Great point about schizophrenia at the end of your post. I never looked at it that way before.


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

@LiquidLight

Ah, I can see where you're coming from with the animus projection. I suspected that at first too, but as an Fi user, I couldn't help but notice that she pretty much involuntarily described Fi in her previous post, which according to Vicky Jo's website, is often mistaken for Ni by non-Ni users.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

I'm a homosexual male, by the way. 

I understand why it would make little sense for me to use Ti and Fi regularly. "Whether I like it or not" - It just seemed from my cognitive functions testing that I didn't fit a classic MBTI mold. I don't have a desire to transcend the system or prove it incorrect. 

I'm not offended by not being perceived as an NT. I do gravitate toward them, but they gravitate toward me too...so obviously we both have something the other wants. I am fixated on this INTP in my life, and it's sometimes unhealthy. He is quite fixated on me, also, though. He refers to me as hi soulmate. 

I do have a fixation on my INTP due to an attraction to the cold Ti logic he uses so effortlessly. There's also something about the warmth that exudes from him when he embraces me and tells me he loves me...a rawness to his Fe that is so sweet and beautiful to me...an innocence in love that F types don't possess in the same regard. Our intellectual connection is also uncanny. It may very well be a meeting of Ne. 

I suspected I am probably NF. I just like thoroughly exploring the possibilities. I would say I'm narrowed down to ENFP, INFP, or INFJ. What makes you guys think INFP over ENFP? I am much more open, talkative, and scattered than most INFPs I've met.

I feel instinctively that I am probably either INFP or ENFP. I hardly use Si at all, and perhaps what comes up as Ti in the cognitive functions test is a combination of Fi and Te? This would lead me to think I'm more likely an ENFP? I'll keep INFJ open as a possibility while I do more research. But I think I use Fi rather than Fe. I'd like to talk with some INFJs more to get a feel for them. I've known INFPs in my private life, but not any identified INFJs.

I do rely heavily on logical/factual data when supporting my arguments, and this is probably indicative of me being an ENFP using my tertiary Te.

In regards to my passionate, personal issue...I am willing to share in private but think it would derail the thread if I mentioned it here. It tends to polarize people and cause a lot of emotional reactions.


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

Ah, sorry about the gender mistake. Seems that we were both caught in an inferior Se moment there, lol (at least I know that I was too lazy to look, even though the thought occurred to me)! Honestly, I can't really deduce anything more from this post about the possibility of you being an ENFP until you provide more evidence supporting this, since I've seen INFPs like you also. Factual data is often associated with Si, which you claim to "heavily" rely on when supporting your arguments.


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## jessmk7 (Oct 12, 2010)

I've gotten those results as well. Ne-Ni-Te-Ti, or diff variations, normally Ne-Ni and some sort of T or both with Fi before or after one- I'm pretty sure I'm enfp- the results change with my mood, or general life placement at the time. If you are an NF with these results, I wonder, are you stressed or bitter towards anything?


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

What kind of evidence would you like me to provide? As far as me relying on factual data to support my arguments - I do. So far we haven't had a debate here, so I haven't needed to tap into that side of myself in this thread. I don't expect people to believe my position on a matter simply because I say it is so. I don't know if I use Si or Te more often and or thoroughly. I like to use studies, factual evidence, when arguing a matter of scientific import...whether it be neurochemistry, psychology, or anything else. 

I'm not offended by your gender mistake. I was just clarifying. An inferior Se moment? lol Because you made an assumption based on limited data? Or is it something else that makes you say that? I am curious.

The main reason I suspect I am ENFP over INFP is that I am extremely open about myself. It's true that I don't share everything with everyone I meet, but I am rapidly willing to share personal information with a person if they seem receptive and interested. At the same time, I am much less social than many ENFPs I've seen on message boards claim to be. I spend most of my time alone or with a close friend. And I am as insanely romantic as INFPs seem to be described. 

If anyone has any specific questions for which I can supply more concrete evidence regarding what type I might be, please ask.

And yes, I am bitter about something right now. The INTP who I feel is my best friend and soulmate may or may not ever be in my life the way I desire. It breaks my heart. I see couples together and I feel bitter. I see a romantic scene in a movie, or hear a song, and I feel sad. I want to be with him, and I have no control over it. I've never been in a situation where I had a love interest who denied me. So far I haven't been outright denied, but rather kept in limbo. I'ts extremely painful and I am tortured by it every day of my life.

As I said previously, I have not ruled out INFJ as my type. I am one of these three: INFJ, ENFP or INFP. I am leaning towards NFP, but still unsure. I am not organized at all, and have a difficult time following my goals through to completion. I often require motivation from those closest to me to accomplish my goals. When I am passionate about something, nothing can shake my conviction. The love I have for my INTP is one solid example--no matter how much people try to dissuade me from continuing to converse and dream with him, I continue to do so. I love him deeply and I want to be with him and I want him to be happy...and so I hold on. My activism issue is also a good example of this, no matter how much some may disagree with me, I know what is right and I will continue to fight for it. I use both logical analysis and emotional conviction to drive me in this endeavor. My feelings are substantiated by facts. In the case of my beloved, the fact that we so deeply relate intellectually gives weight to my romantic feelings for him. I use both feeling and thinking to come to my conclusions. But do I use Ni and Ti or Ne and Te?


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## jessmk7 (Oct 12, 2010)

I'm sorry to hear your pain  not sure I have any insight as to how to lessen it, I think it helps to go through all depths of feeling, good or bad. But I still dislike even saying that bc it does hurt. When I get bitter or stressed about people an relationships, I turn into a non feeler, I get cold and very logical. Feelings of any sort don't make any sense and irritate me bc I shut them off completely. 

As far as the message boards go- enfp's are NOT as social as they write us to be. We are also know as the most introverted extrovert, or even most extroverted introvert. It seems pretty common for us to be so unsure of our types. 

We're not all bubbly and lovey like I read- Ill admit, I was until a few years ago when I went through hurt and pain and growing up- the real world isn't as nice as sheltered high school life. 

It might take a while to fully figure it out and be happy with what you conclude.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

Thanks for the response. I have also read that ENFPs are the most introverted extroverts. I think I probably am ENFP. The inarticulate nature of many ENFPs I see online is one of the things that made me question that typing. I know I am more emotional in my expression than an NT, but I am more articulate in language than most NFs - excepting INFJs - that I see on message boards. Of course, being articulate is important to me, and therefore it may be a Fi issue...since I find it important I put a lot of effort into it. 

Thank you for your compassion. It does hurt excruciatingly to be in love with someone I may never get to be with. I would give anything to be able to be with my INTP. He literally refers to me as "his". *Sigh* But he is not mine, not now anyway. 

As far as being bubbly and lovey, I have mixed experience with that. I was a very sweet, loving child...but also very intellectual. I suppose I did trust most people when I was younger, and I still do tend to give people the benefit of the doubt. But I have also been bitter and cynical since I entered adolescence. I experienced my first major depression when I was a child, and I've felt that periodically ever since. That is one of the ways my INTP and I relate so deeply.

The fact that I retreat internally to analyze my feelings and my position in life, and that all of it often seems poetic and mystical, seems to indicate either Fi or Ni from what I've read...most likely Fi.


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## jessmk7 (Oct 12, 2010)

Ha you sound a lot like me, in experience, anyway. I was also very intellectual as a child. My elementary school teachers would have me sit in the back of the class doing next year or two years ahead hmwk bc I'd be done and bored too quick. 

I have also wondered at time about infj, but one of my best friends is infj and we've compared notes- our Ne and Ni comes from such different angles and she says im definitely Fi not Fe, so I've accepted enfp. 

My guy is istp, and you bring a sad but maybe valid view on relating. I too have struggled with depression on and off since middle/high school, but not too much right now. Actually, even of I was, I deny it anyway and usually it can fade into the background so much it can be almost forgotten. 

My ISTP is depressed, but also, when I first started dating him, I asked his friend if he was depressed and my ISTP got defensive for him and was like don't ask him questions like that- it'll make him depressed if he wasn't already, so I get too afraid to delve into that topic. 

Do you think its healthy when you guys do get into that part of depth? And have you looked into Fe vs Fi and Ne vs Ni, maybe talk about it with someone you trust or is closer to you- it might help you to pinpoint it better than internalizing it, especially if you are enfp  or any E.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

I also was given schoolwork beyond my grade-level as a child. I did 1st grade work while in preschool. They considered skipping me ahead a grade or even two, but my mom refused. Later on they discovered that my organization was not up to par with my perception and analytical abilities. 



> Do you think its healthy when you guys do get into that part of depth?


What are you asking here? Can you please word that differently? Are you referring to the level of depth I have in my relationship with my INTP?

My INTP doesn't mind discussing his depression. I think ISTPs and INTPs are VERY different though...just as ESFPs are very different from ENFPs. I am not attracted to Se...I am totally into Intuitives. My INTP likes discussing everything in depth, and doesn't shy away from any topic.

I am more uncertain of whether I am Ne or Ni than whether I Fe or Fi. I realize that they are related, as if I am Ne Fi I am ENFP and if I am Ni Fe I am INFJ. I am pretty sure I am an ENFP with well developed Te, but I am still exploring. I of course could also still be INFP. Arg.


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## jessmk7 (Oct 12, 2010)

Lol sorry, I meant it like how you assumed I did. I agree istps are very different than intps though. Good point. 

My question was spoken before thought about really. All my sp friends I've talked about that stuff with, it's left me with a sour taste in my mouth wishing is have kept shut, as well as eventually with my NF friends, I haven't experienced that with my nt friends, although I really only know ntj's- ntps idk as much so that was a blind question. 

My bad.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

You're fine, I was just pointing out that I think ISTP and INTP are extremely different types.

You could use to meet some NTPs if you don't have any in your life. For me, they are the most wonderful people to converse with. Most are extremely intelligent and yet very open to new ideas/data. And when they do show their warm sides, they are extremely sweet and cuddly.

NTJs are interesting folks too, but I don't seem as drawn to them. I think it's because I'm attracted to the "bohemian" nerd types rather than the business-like rationals.


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

@Wounded Bird

I had an inferior Se moment when I called you a female instead of a male, due to being too lazy to look at your gender listed under your username, even though the thought occurred to me to do so before addressing your gender.

The fact that you spend most of your time alone or with a close friend screams introvert to me. Being open around others has nothing to do with how extroverted or introverted you are - there are probably deeper psychological motivations behind this that relate to your upbringing, etc. I've heard often that introverts have tendencies to be more open with people on a personal level than extroverts, since introverts invest less of themselves in maintaining a particular social image. Also, all three of the types you mention tend to have communication difficulties, being very right-brained and not Ts, so this doesn't narrow anything down.

I think a very interesting and helpful way you can employ to narrow your options down between ENFP or INFP, which I suspect most at this point, would be to do the following: Decide which function you would be able to live without more easily, even though this is usually very difficult to decide between between the dom & aux. This can help you figure out which one is more ego-syntonic, and thus, your dominant function. This is not my original idea, btw, but a very insightful one.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

Thank you for your input, Jungyes. The more I reflect on it, the more I think I am an INFP after all. By the way, I don't feel I have "communication difficulties" - I am really quite adept at articulating my thoughts and feelings. That's one reason I wondered if I could possibly be an INFP, as they seem to report difficulty in communicating their feelings. I am good with both vocal and written communication, though I admit I am more articulate when writing/typing.

I have no idea how to discern whether I would more easily survive without Fi or Ne. I am leaning toward thinking that Ne is more important, as it is the actual information gathering function. I just don't know. I agree that I am likely either ENFP or INFP. I think I am an obvious Ne user. 

One of the reasons I wondered whether I could be ENTP or INFJ is that the ENFPs and INFPs I see on the message boards tend to be inarticulate. While I don't claim to be the epitome of eloquence, I think I am above average in my communication skills. But, I have seen examples of both types who are as or more articulate than I am, so that was probably not the most sound criteria to use for judgement.

Right now I am sitting alone in my room and it's Thanksgiving. My INTP is off with his own life, far away from me. When I feel sad I don't want anyone near me, generally. Sometimes when I've frightened myself because I am suicidally depressed, I have spent time around someone I care for, but generally I want to be alone. Right now I want my INTP with me, and it breaks my heart to be so far from him. I meet so few people I relate deeply to. *Sigh*


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

Well, you need both functions to gather info and decide, so both would be equally important, practically speaking, but I think your reply to this just confirmed to me that your Ne is your aux function, since many people have an easier time recognizing their aux function over their dominant function and might consider it more important than the dominant, since the dominant is usually taken for granted and most profoundly impacted by the secondary function. Do you find yourself often "parenting" others with your Fi or your Ne more? If you choose Ne, then you're an INFP (e.g. (aux Ne) emphasizing the importance of keeping an open mind to alternatives and currently unrealistic possibilities, advising others when helping them, etc.). Aux (parent) Fi would be more about correcting the immoral behavior of others or spreading emotional awareness, lecturing others on right/wrong somewhat, emphasizing the importance following your passions, etc. 

Glad to see you've settled on a type though.


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## electricky (Feb 18, 2011)

JungyesMBTIno said:


> Well, you need both functions to gather info and decide, so both would be equally important, practically speaking, but I think your reply to this just confirmed to me that your Ne is your aux function, since many people have an easier time recognizing their aux function over their dominant function and might consider it more important than the dominant, since the dominant is usually taken for granted and most profoundly impacted by the secondary function.


It's an interesting sort of contradiction though, isn't it? Because it would seem that the function you feel you couldn't live without would be the ego-syntonic (dominant) one, and not the one you take for granted. I see the "taking for granted" part happening a lot more with the functions outside the dom/aux, since they are less favored and seen in a more simplistic fashion. 

I can see where this is coming from but in some cases it really just blurs the line more between a strong favoring of the aux. and favoring due to it being the dominant. 

Seeing which one parents others is a little more clear, I think. (That part might explain why even though I'm dominant perceiving, how strangely I end up being the one trying to get other people to focus on solving the essentials of the problem... but then again often I'll externally facepalm too if someone says something could've only happened one way but often I'll just shake my head on the inside and not even begin to bother  )


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

Hmm...Yes, you're right about the dominant function, although I'm not sure if you're implying that the aux function would be the one you would take for granted relative to the dominant function. That's definitely possible though. As for the lower functions, can you provide any examples? I'm just curious, since I'm exploring whether or not the fact that lower functions are less favored would result in "taking them for granted" or result in them taking the upper two functions for granted as ways to deal with the lower ones. Perhaps this varies more between introverts and extroverts?

In your last example, I approach short-sighted situations similarly, but am often a bit more ambitious about correcting them -well, if I'm in a classroom setting anyhow and points are involved. ;P


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## electricky (Feb 18, 2011)

JungyesMBTIno said:


> Hmm...Yes, you're right about the dominant function, although I'm not sure if you're implying that the aux function would be the one you would take for granted relative to the dominant function. That's definitely possible though.


I think the situation is kind of blurry with the aux. function. I suppose by extention it would be seen as a little less essential than the dominant, but this could also depend on how well you know type theory, and also what stage of development you are in. Like, it might make more sense to have a really strong attachment to your aux. function if you are in your later teenage years. 



> As for the lower functions, can you provide any examples? I'm just curious, since I'm exploring whether or not the fact that lower functions are less favored would result in "taking them for granted" or result in them taking the upper two functions for granted as ways to deal with the lower ones. Perhaps this varies more between introverts and extroverts?


Well, in the lower functions, I often recognize doing a lot of the things that happen to be associated with them, but there is a superficialness to it and a lack of real identification. Like with Si, it seems to be associated overall with recognizing the familiar from what is sensed and relying upon past information, and I think of course I do those sorts of things, but it's just something that I do and not prefer to do. There's obviously a lot of the essence of it that I'm missing here, so it just seems boring to me. What is interesting though is that I have noted the same thing in reverse in an ISTJ, who has remarked that Ne is just something he gets into sometimes but he finds the whole thing boring. Yes, he actually said that Ne is boring xD

This is also part of the reason that even though it has often been suspected that I am xNFP that I do not actually have Fi as a preferred function. When I see it described it just seems like liking and not liking stuff and having morals and I know it is something more than that because I recognize that I obviously have tastes and morals but it seems like most everyone has those and that what I see from xxFPs is a character very different than simply feeling bad when you see someone hurt or choosing blue over orange. And it's not that I haven't read up on the functions enough, but I think that because the lower ones are less familiar that is hard for them to not get oversimplified in my head..


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

I actually don't care much for morals. I do care about ethics. Ultimately I think logic is ethical. I don't lecture people when they are in need...I try to help them explore the possibilities and realize that they can be happy again. I do this even when I am feeling hideously depressed. Honestly, right now, I am feeling very sad. I didn't get to be with my INTP for Thanksgiving and I miss him. The biggest downfall of being romantic is having one's heart broken. I would do anything for him, even if he never is with me. I would give him a kidney. He is so uncertain, he doesn't know what he wants. He is both intrigued and frightened by the intensity of the intimacy between us. I am just so sad right now. *Sigh*

I don't know how to ascertain my Dom/Aux functions, still. If anything it seems to me like I am a Ne Dom. However, as I've said, I spend most of my time alone or with a close friend. I am a bleeding heart, which I don't even like...my feelings overwhelm me often. I do value logic but I am more likely to make a decision based on what I feel. I am either an asocial ENFP or a very talkative and open INFP. From everything I've gathered on this thread, it seems I am probably an INFP, which is how I've tested since I was 17.


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## JungyesMBTIno (Jul 22, 2011)

@ElectricSparkle

Right on with the Fi complaints! Even as an INTJ with tert. Fi, I am very uncomfortable with most of the online descriptions of it and trust none 90%+, particularly the descriptions that state or imply that it concerns itself with personal values, the "liking and not liking stuff" that you mentioned, which is waaaaaay too universal and can be more prominently observed in Fe users in my experience, who are usually (and naturally) more vocal about their feelings/opinions. The way I classify Fi in dom/aux users is as a function that forms personal attachments to morals and values (these attachments cannot be easily overthrown by their own logic) , but unlike Fe users, don't view them as an extension of themselves employed only when helping others or to understand their place in the world - rather, Fi doms/auxes, in a way, _are_ the values/morals they embody, I guess??? At least I've heard that Fi users tend to form attachments and are far more often fanatics than Fe users, which as an Fi user, I've pretty much been a fanatic several times about personal interests, LOL. It's helpful to use Te vs. Ti as a reference point when understanding what differentiates the F functions, especially since Ti, like Fi, tends to become fixated on specific interests far more or ways of thinking, while Te is more general and used as an extension of the person when approaching the misunderstandings of others - both Te and Fe are often viewed like tools, in a way, to help themselves and others, but don't have a huge influence on the way a person thinks, other than being used as a reference point to guide thinking (logic or a people-oriented subjective form of reasoning)? Frankly, I have no idea how helpful I've been, since Fi is so difficult to describe specifically-enough, but overall, I guess an easy way to differentiate between Fe and Fi would be that Fe is more flexible in terms of values/morals and can experiment with different ones to help determine one's identity, whereas Fi is rigid, and experimentation with values/morals, etc. can be much more harmful to their personal identity, since they pretty much constitute major aspects of their personal identity - thus they usually have more complex ways of approaching issues of personal encroachment and can be more sensitive in this department than Fe users, who are usually more sensitive to *more direct* personal attacks (e.g. I hate you! You're annoying and stupid!, anything addressed specifically at them), since their values are more an extension of themselves (they are less attached). Fi users tend to get offended more by anything that encroaches on a value they hold dear and can be a bit irritatingly unpredictable in this regard (why people often feel like they're walking on eggshells around them, while as long as you maintain proper protocol with the Fe user (moreso behavior), then this is less of an issue. Argh! I still couldn't describe Fi without using the word "values" though.

As for the lower functions, very interesting. I get what you mean about the inferior function, which I probably oversimplify when observing Se doms due to projection of my inferior Se. Lol about the ISTJ! XD My ISTJ dad is very similar in this regard, actually, though he doesn't know anything about the MBTI. I could tell he found dominant Ne that pervaded the honors student speech of the ENTP in my 2011 high school senior class this year pretty uninteresting and a waste of speech - he didn't find it anywhere near as entertaining as most found it. He seems to think that Ne doms are often sorely lacking in common sense (well, that'd actually be his anyway) and "too eccentric". My ISFJ mom seems to have more tolerance for them, which makes sense since she shares all of the functions of an ENTP.


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## Wounded Bird (Aug 28, 2010)

I received more information today by reading about Dom-Tert loops on another thread dedicated to the topic. I am not a healthy person emotionally right now. I actually haven't been emotionally healthy since sometime in childhood. Analyzing the rut I am, I think that I am caught in a Fi-Si loop. I spend most of my time alone or talking to one friend or relative...usually online or the phone. I rarely use Te, but I think I often use Si when I am feeling stressed. When I think about how to fix things I realize I need to organize all my stuff and make a detailed, step-by-step, logical plan to get my life together (Te). But instead, I obsess about mistakes I've made and the way I desperately want things to be, the way I feel things should be. I tear myself apart thinking of everything I've done wrong. I close off access to new information (Ne) because I am so disturbed by the things it makes me feel (Fi) and regret (Si, though I realize Si doesn't rule over regret, in this instance I think it has something to do with it). If something makes me feel bad I avoid it, even if I know I need to do it. Seeing other people living happy, full lives makes me envious as so I avoid as much as possible having to see those things right now. 

I am trying to figure out how all of this might help me overcome my issues. I had a major "AHA!" moment when I figured out this Dom-Tert loop phenomena. For one thing, I think it helps solidify that I am a definite INFP. For another it gives me some insight into my emotional illness. I feel a bit overexposed having shared some of this but it's the internet and I realize I have nothing to fear. Is there a way to embrace my Ne in a healthy way, consciously? I am thinking what I need is to go out into the world more and allow my Ne to be exposed to lots of new, positive data and experiences.

Oh, and another interesting facet of all of this is that the INTP I am desperately in love with is clearly in a Ti-Si loop at times. He does take in lots of new information, I don't think he's as disturbed as I am, but like me he isolates himself too much and sits in a pool of self-loathing and regret. He's also terrified of changing his life, as he does have a secure material nest built around him. If he wants to be with me, he will have to take risks, and he isn't sure if he can do that. Could that not be an example of Si? And couldn't, taken to an extreme, someone in a Ti-Si loop become rooted down in an unfulfilling but secure situation, from which they can simply isolate and analyze concepts that have nothing to do with changing their situation?

Isn't often living in the past, in memories, a potential product of Si...especially Si gone awry?


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## austin_music (May 8, 2013)

I am an ENFP and has Ne - Fi - Ni - Ti - Si - Se - Fe - Te. Most likely you're also ENFP, i guess?


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## dzeniba (May 9, 2011)

I have similar situation where I've misstype INFJ. But now I know for sure I'm an ENFP. But my functions leiout is Ne(95%); Ni(80%); Fi(80%); Ti(75%) and rest is below 45%. There is one thing people don't think about much, that introverted and extroverted functions are more likely to be present and understood by one individual then the opposite ones.


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