# Ti, Te and cake.



## Ksara (Feb 13, 2014)

Here is a little analogy of mine between Ti and Te. What do you think?
I was aiming to highlight the differences.


Both Te and Ti are given a recipie to make a cake.
So Te starts by making a plan (what in ingredients are needed, where to get them from, what tools will be needed, etc.)
Then will get straight on to prep work, making it, bake it, then let it cool down. Fine tuning the process to get the cake completed in the least amount of time.

In the mean time Ti looked at the recipie and asked why? Why these ingredients? Why in this order? Why these ratios. And then Ti begins the long process of experimenting with different ratios, cooking times, even ingredients. Eventually (with a few disasters along the way, like cooking the cake until it's a pile of hot ash haha) Ti finds the exact formula to make the _best_ cake, with parameters that can be adjusted depending on the conditions the cake is to be made.

At this point Te looks at Ti and says "big woop, it's only cake" and is happily sitting down eating it's 20th cake compared to the one Ti has come up with in the same amount if time.
Ti looked at it's cake and thinks...
_this is *the one *cake...*the one cake to rule them all !!! * *insert evil laugh here*_


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## The Hungry One (Jan 26, 2011)

I like it! Bonus points for devastating punniness!


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## nichya (Jul 12, 2014)

Correction: we are eating our 20th cake only because we imagined 20 different types of possible recipes :kitteh:



Ksara said:


> Here is a little analogy of mine between Ti and Te. What do you think?
> I was aiming to highlight the differences.
> 
> 
> ...


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## Mimic octopus (May 3, 2014)

If this is the case I might be a Ti user. Any other indicators of thinking preference?


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## Ksara (Feb 13, 2014)

nichya said:


> Correction: we are eating our 20th cake only because we imagined 20 different types of possible recipes :kitteh:


Haha funny XD


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Ksara said:


> Here is a little analogy of mine between Ti and Te. What do you think?
> I was aiming to highlight the differences.
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah this really highlights both Te and Ti strengths without creating any like.. preference for one over the other. Sometimes you need lots of cakes and sometimes you just need a nice cake. For instance, a general would want Te to make hasty decisions. The importance is the haste, not the action because if you take too long to act because you want to make the perfect action then you're an open target. Ti would be better at like.. spec ops.


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## Ksara (Feb 13, 2014)

Patrick_1 said:


> If this is the case I might be a Ti user. Any other indicators of thinking preference?


I'm not too sure.
I just know there are two types of thinkers, the one's who use Te and the others who use Ti.

Te is often associated with efficiency, using facts to achieve something, ordering the world in a logical way, learning something with an intent to use this knowledge in some way. But Te also works with Fi. Fi is like the internal ethical rules of the individual, Fi wants to ensure the user is authentic, is good, does the right thing.
(I'd say if you prefer to get the job done, even if that clashes a little with inner values that would be Te over Fi)


Ti seeks to understand everyhing, break everything down into it's small parts and examines these building blocks. The understanding is more important than what it could be used for. But Ti works with Fe. Fe is concerned with adhering to others values, social rules, social niceties.
(I'd say if you tend to want to understand things, but may come across as rude or even don't care about social ettiquette because it doesn't make logical sense, then may be Ti over Fe)


Keep in mind what I've written is very brief and may have missed information.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Patrick_1 said:


> If this is the case I might be a Ti user. Any other indicators of thinking preference?


Yeah Te kind of just takes what is useful and Ti just takes everything in. It's weird because it's an opposite of Ne and Ni: Ne takes everything in and Ni only takes in important things. I guess that's the difference between extraverted judging (quick) and extraverted sensing/intuiting (massive). Both have their flaws, either missing information or looking at information that is not needed to look at. They can help each other stay on track though. That's a good thing about having friends, or social influence.


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## uncertain (May 26, 2012)

I love this! 

If this is true then I will be using Te. I sometimes follow recipe accurately to the fault.
I feel like the Ti cake will just be the exact same one as the Te cake. Haha.

You make and eat the same cake for 20 times? Wut?? I would make 10 different things instead.
(For some reason I think you are doing that every day and eating an eight-inch cake by yourself. You get insane! I live alone I guess thats why.)


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## Octavian (Nov 24, 2013)

I should add that a Te-user may question "why" regarding the cake, its ingredients, and etc. but if they do, it will be through the perceiving function.

In the case of Si, it may trash certain recipes, or switch out ingredients relative to what they've known to have worked for them in the past, or what they've know to have to tasted good or not.

In the case of Ni, it may decide to trash or switch out certain things as well, but based on how they'd imagine certain combinations to turn out. For example I'm well aware of the effects of using certain spices, oils, and ingredients relative to the actual thing that is being cooked (Te.) Hence I may decide to bring out olive oil or something where it typically would not be used because I've an inclination or sureness of what the result will be (Ni.) Most often it turns out really good. 

Although there have been times that my Te has refused the Ni suggestion lol.

Any time I deviate away from a standard, set of guidelines, or etc. it is Ni driven. And seeing as my Te emphasizes efficiency and effectiveness, I end up deviating very frequently, although still methodical and scientific the entire way through.


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## Chesire Tower (Jan 19, 2013)




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## Dyslexicon (Mar 9, 2013)

With my Ne in the driver seat, before Ti, this certainly explains why I suck at cooking. :tongue:


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## Wartime Consigliere (Feb 8, 2011)

Good analogy, but it feels like Te was a bit simplified. Efficiency isn't the only value when it comes to applying logic. I don't see why they would be focused any less on the quality of the cake. If anything, it seems like they'd be anal over trying to ensure that the cake comes out perfect. Aren't TJs more stereotyped toward being perfectionists in comparison to TPs?

Overall though, I like it. In regard to the process of making the cake, the considerations and the approaches taken I thought it was a very good illustration of how the two functions might appear _in action_.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Optimist Mind said:


> Good analogy, but it feels like Te was a bit simplified. Efficiency isn't the only value when it comes to applying logic. I don't see why they would be focused any less on the quality of the cake. If anything, it seems like they'd be anal over trying to ensure that the cake comes out perfect. Aren't TJs more stereotyped toward being perfectionists in comparison to TPs?
> 
> Overall though, I like it. In regard to the process of making the cake, the considerations and the approaches taken I thought it was a very good illustration of how the two functions might appear _in action_.


Yeah that's why the Te chose the 5-star rated recipe off the internet.


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## Satan Claus (Aug 6, 2013)

True in some parts but Ti and Te act different depending on where it is in the function stack. I know Fi users who will experiment with other ingredients. I'm an INFJ and will follow the recipe by the book but at the same time, change it up to my own taste or others depending on who I'm cooking for.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

I'm definitely more of a Te user.

Example: Many years ago I prepared to cook pasta for dinner. I read the directions on the box of pasta, selected the correct pan & began to measure out the cups of water to boil.
The woman that I was dating had difficulty not bursting out with laughter & kidded me that it's only pasta rather than a science experiment.
I likely felt stupid but I'm still not comfortable "half-assing" stuff that I'm unfamiliar with.


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## Ksara (Feb 13, 2014)

@Optimist Mind

I'd say both of them have been simplified.

I've seen in both profiles that both want to be perfectionist, I guess it depends on what area of perfection.
Would Te be more concerned with making accurate measurements to ensure they reach the perfect cake, where as Ti would be more concerned with finding the perfect algorithm for the perfect cake?


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## Ksara (Feb 13, 2014)

@Satan Claus

I would say also the other functions as well would experiment or not experiment.
Ne or Se would be happy to throw something new into the mix just to see what happens for example.
I'm sure you Fe be the influence for the concerned for who you're cooking for


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## nichya (Jul 12, 2014)

I love how INFJs get everything literal, it is cute. Actually I thought we were making a metaphor here?! Is it really about the cake? The cake is a lie  And yes stop underestimating Te, Te does not just follow rules on a box, well not when coupled with intuition for sure. And yes efficiency matters, so you should take all the time Ti spent on the cake and consider everything we did meanwhile in that box too because we are so past that cake  I would say for the cake, both would be mostly following the recipe and adding, skipping stuff then get some alright cake - in literal sense. But like I said as a metaphor, Te would come up with tens of possible cake recipes, or maybe the person who found the cupcake was a Te, she was all like, hey wouldn't it be cool if we had cake for one person? not a slice but a cake on its own? ) Te coupled with Ne at least will come up with a lot of scenarios and ideas with the puzzle pieces they have, Te will rather make it -public- as in you have a ton of ideas and you want to share it with people, or you want to find more puzzle pieces from other people so you ask them questions and explore new possibilities and the moment you do, you get that puzzle piece and in a flash, all the possibilities change like the stairs in harry potter, but faster. Ti is a noble, elderly wedding cake baker known for his perfect, classic cakes. Not very experimental but he follows his family recipe and will get frustrated if something goes not according to plan and will bake from scratch improvising is not a good idea. The couple does not get to choose how the cake will look, they get what the baker thinks it is the best but that is his signature. While Te would come up with a great decoration that will wow people or add something personal for the couple as a surprise.

Anyways, if you want to compare Te and Ti, Te is like growing branches to a little plant while Ti is cutting off branches of a plant.
Ti wants precision, and they minimize risk and effort. They try to see all aspects to an -idea- or -event- but they don't consider every environmental effect like we do. While Te takes every piece and grows possible many and many scenarios and ideas that puts puzzle pieces in missing joints. It is a very dynamic system that could adapt or be rebuilt in a flash with new pieces.



Satan Claus said:


> True in some parts but Ti and Te act different depending on where it is in the function stack. I know Fi users who will experiment with other ingredients. I'm an INFJ and will follow the recipe by the book but at the same time, change it up to my own taste or others depending on who I'm cooking for.


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## pernoctator (May 1, 2012)

This is an inefficient arrangement. Ti should be writing the recipes while Te makes the cakes.


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## Bricolage (Jul 29, 2012)

Ksara said:


> Here is a little analogy of mine between Ti and Te. What do you think?
> I was aiming to highlight the differences.
> 
> 
> ...


That illustrates the differences, although Ti normally focuses on larger matters than cake…An INTP making a cake would probably be using Ne and combining ingredients in an off-label way…Or daydreaming with Ti and thinking about a chorus for a new song and burning the cake to ashes.


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## uncertain (May 26, 2012)

Bricolage said:


> That illustrates the differences, although Ti normally focuses on larger matters than cake…An INTP making a cake would probably be using Ne and combining ingredients in an off-label way…Or daydreaming with Ti and thinking about a chorus for a new song and burning the cake to ashes.


All I see is an INTP can't handle these things. Oh well, you don't have to make a cake though. You can just buy one.


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## OberonHuxley (Jun 2, 2013)

I've read extensively on this subject.

TE and TI seem very much a like in many ways because the users of these functions intersect in their approach to determining a logical principle.

Let me give you an example...

TE will look at the evidence, external empirical evidence, and look for a pattern. Then they will assess this pattern and see if it holds up.

TI on the other hand will come up with a principle, then look at empirical evidence, then reformulate the principle.

Both are using deduction and induction but the TE uses Induction more and the TI uses deduction more.

The TE is good with figuring out how to test what the TI discovers.

TE is often synonymous with cold efficiency because the most objective measurements are distance and time and inevitably all issues of time and distance are problems and issues of maximization.

The TI is often synonymous with systems analysis because understanding and comparing systems does not require much experimentation except at certain critical leverage points where determining a fact or confirmation seems to confirm the entire system.

Of the two I wish I was TI but I am more TE....


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## Satan Claus (Aug 6, 2013)

nichya said:


> Ti is a noble, elderly wedding cake baker known for his perfect, classic cakes. Not very experimental but he follows his family recipe and will get frustrated if something goes not according to plan and will bake from scratch improvising is not a good idea.


I guess you've never met an ENTP? They experiment a lot! I also think you're getting Ti confused with Si. Si would follow the family recipe, Ti would go "Now _why_ do we need this much butter?" then if they think they don't need that much, they won't do it. Ti follows it's own personal logic. Te takes the recipe apart and keeps whats efficient. This is why INTJ's and other Te valuing people are so critical. The recipe thing is obviously metaphorical, yes. I've noticed lol. xD Look at my user name and picture, do you really think I took that literally? lol


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## nichya (Jul 12, 2014)

Satan Claus said:


> I guess you've never met an ENTP? They experiment a lot! I also think you're getting Ti confused with Si. Si would follow the family recipe, Ti would go "Now _why_ do we need this much butter?" then if they think they don't need that much, they won't do it. Ti follows it's own personal logic. Te takes the recipe apart and keeps whats efficient. This is why INTJ's and other Te valuing people are so critical. The recipe thing is obviously metaphorical, yes. I've noticed lol. xD Look at my user name and picture, do you really think I took that literally? lol


But the experimental part comes from their dominant Ne ! Now you got me wondering with all the possibilities they come up with, do they use their Ti to root out those ideas to find the perfect one? ENTPs are seriously perfectly balanced smart people, love them and their snarkiness  Well I have noticed that the cake analogy is making this more difficult haha. 

Indeed Te look for puzzle pieces, not taking apart and keeping what is efficient though, it does not end there. There are endless explanations and overlaps and cause-effect scenarios but maybe I tend to think it coupled with intuition. But yes I think Ti follows its own logic and coupled with Ni, it may be a gift or a curse because the thing you hold on to is very personal. 

I want to say it has something to do with expressing as well, see INTJs have Ni and Te, they usually consider an aspect carefully but they usually don't talk about it, I mean not about the idea leading to conclusion itself but they talk to get more information from people or find clues. While INTP with Ti dominance, thinks a lot and comes up with a an idea, evaluates it makes sure it makes sense to his own logic then with the Ne, goes to others to share the idea and also to get it validated. Nikola Tesla versus Albert Einstein. 

So that is why I go with my own analogy "Anyways, if you want to compare Te and Ti, Te is like growing branches to a little plant while Ti is cutting off branches of a plant.
Ti wants precision, and they minimize risk and effort. They try to see all aspects to an -idea- or -event- but they don't consider every environmental effect like we do. While Te takes every piece and grows possible many and many scenarios and ideas that puts puzzle pieces in missing joints. It is a very dynamic system that could adapt or be rebuilt in a flash with new pieces."

BUT I am in love with @OberonHuxley 's explanation, very well put.


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## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

I'd be wondering about why cake changes color when heated up. Then I'd stick it in the oven. It would likely turn out bad. I think my oatmeal method is better. The first time I used those mircowavable ones, I would measure out the exact amount of liquid. Then I learned that I didn't like it that way so I started using milk, then I added a lot of milk. Then I liked it. Then I used apple juice but the apple juice must have mostly evaporated in the microwave but the result of was literally candy flavored. The oatmeal tasted like a lollipop.


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## pretense (Jan 2, 2013)

OberonHuxley said:


> I've read extensively on this subject.
> 
> TE and TI seem very much a like in many ways because the users of these functions intersect in their approach to determining a logical principle.


This makes me wonder, how often do Te users look to determine a logical principle? I don't think very often, and so I don't think this is at all the reason Te and Ti seem very much alike... well, nor do I really think they seem very much alike. Maybe some people do, but I suspect that they seem alike to those people more due to a bad understanding of the functions than the functions actually being alike. 



> TE is often synonymous with cold efficiency because the most objective measurements are distance and time and inevitably all issues of time and distance are problems and issues of maximization.


I don't have anything to say directly related to this, just some thoughts about Ti and efficiency that I think are kind of funny. I am a Ti dom and my brain crumbles when I attempt to determine efficiency. When it happens it makes me feel inadequate and frustrated but looking back on it, it is pretty fucking funny. Like taking a world champion figure skater, putting her in a mud pit, and then watching her fall in the mud. I hate Te doms too and I know the best way to fuck with them at work (when I am forced to be around them) is to suggest a method more efficient than the method they have suggested. So of course I'm falling in the mud pit fairly often.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

OberonHuxley said:


> I've read extensively on this subject.
> 
> TE and TI seem very much a like in many ways because the users of these functions intersect in their approach to determining a logical principle.
> 
> ...


You've always come across as more Ti to me.


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## proto (Oct 2, 2014)

Ti: the iPhone
Te: the zune


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## Ksara (Feb 13, 2014)

Satan Claus said:


> I guess you've never met an ENTP? They experiment a lot! I also think you're getting Ti confused with Si. Si would follow the family recipe, Ti would go "Now _why_ do we need this much butter?" then if they think they don't need that much, they won't do it. Ti follows it's own personal logic. Te takes the recipe apart and keeps whats efficient. This is why INTJ's and other Te valuing people are so critical. The recipe thing is obviously metaphorical, yes. I've noticed lol. xD Look at my user name and picture, do you really think I took that literally? lol


I look at your username and picture and think, that would be a really cool name for a cat... haha


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## ninjahitsawall (Feb 1, 2013)

Bricolage said:


> That illustrates the differences, although Ti normally focuses on larger matters than cake…An INTP making a cake would probably be using Ne and combining ingredients in an off-label way…Or daydreaming with Ti and thinking about a chorus for a new song and burning the cake to ashes.


I also kind of feel like making cake is a waste of time unless it's for a special occasion. In which case I would go all out and attempt something as fancy as possible without going beyond my means. Especially if multiple cakes are required. Then it's a test of wits.


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