# enneagram and goths



## SuperDevastation (Jun 7, 2010)

I'm curious about which enneagram(s) is most likely to be a goth. I consider myself gothic btw, I didn't used to but when I read a description it fit me very well.


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## The Nth Doctor (May 18, 2012)

Just from a superficial guess I would say 4.


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## Dolorous Haze (Jun 2, 2012)

I suppose any type could be 'goth'. Personally, I detest the label. It's just another form of conformation and attempting to pigeon-hole people. If I feel like wearing black or listening to dark music I will, but if you call me goth I'll be highly offended. :tongue: You should dress how you like, listen to what you want and read what you're interested in...don't worry too much about what subculture you belong to.


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## SuperDevastation (Jun 7, 2010)

I've thought about it and it seems 5s are likely to be rivetheads (my main type), and 7s are likely to be cyber goths.

I've thought about it more and it seems like 5s with an 8 fix and vice-versa are likely to be rivetheads with some military style.


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

Whoa. I never cared for labels, but many people called me goth in high school. I like the music, clothes, the overall culture. I'm more a fan of the oldschool fishnet kind of goth, or Victorian lace'n'absinthe, than more modern incarnations, though.

Sorry if I'm blabbering. Lack of caffeine.


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## RepairmanMan Man (Jan 21, 2012)

I've been thought of as a goth as well--has something to do with my black and white hair and my propensity to wear Arabian eye makeup and a lot of black, I think.

I'm a 6, and I'm not really part of any subculture. Including goths.

It looks like it's not a particularly type-dependent phenomenon. Could appeal to any type for reasons that have little-to-nothing to do with the enneagram. I know it _seems_ 4-ish, though.


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## Choice (May 19, 2012)

4s...

Perky Goth - Television Tropes & Idioms

6s, 7s 

... and 2s?








(disclaimer: random guess based on hearsay, haven't actually read much of series)


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## SuperDevastation (Jun 7, 2010)

I wonder what is Ruby Glooms enneagram?


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## chimeric (Oct 15, 2011)

4s are too special-snowflake to readily associate themselves with a category like that, I'd think.

Stereotypically, at least, I'd sooner guess that most goths are 6es. (Note: Does not mean that most 6es are goths...)


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## Inguz (Mar 10, 2012)

What is "Goth" in this context? Specifically people listening to Goth? So say metal etc isn't included in the definition?


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## AngelOnHerFlight (Feb 26, 2012)

Type Four-Robert Smith, Peter Murphy
Type Five-Ian Curtis
Type Six-Amy Lee
Type Seven-Jhonen Vasquez

Many of these people aren't really goth, but I just made this list because I felt like replying to this post. But yeah, not much correlation between Enneagram and subcultures.


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## Dolorous Haze (Jun 2, 2012)

AngelOnHerFlight said:


> Type Four-*Robert Smith*, Peter Murphy
> Type Five-Ian Curtis
> Type Six-Amy Lee
> Type Seven-Jhonen Vasquez
> ...


""It's so pitiful when 'goth' is still tagged onto the name The Cure"

"It's only people that aren't goths that think the Cure are a goth band"

"“It’s (goth) such a lazy stereotype,” Smith sighs when I mention the G-word to him"

"When I was with the Banshees I made the point of wearing pyjamas––I wore a blue stripey pyjama top. I wanted to make a point I was not part of this (goth) world."


“I’m tired to be known as a doomy goth casualty.” 

All of the above quotes are from Robert Smith. I'd be wary of calling Mr. Smith a goth....he might sneak into your room in the middle of the night....and leave a strongly worded letter about how silly the subculture is. :tongue:


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## SuperDevastation (Jun 7, 2010)

Inguz said:


> What is "Goth" in this context? Specifically people listening to Goth? So say metal etc isn't included in the definition?


Just goths, the clothing, the music, and the fascination with darkness and death.


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## AngelOnHerFlight (Feb 26, 2012)

Niamh_Chinn_Oir said:


> ""It's so pitiful when 'goth' is still tagged onto the name The Cure"
> 
> "It's only people that aren't goths that think the Cure are a goth band"
> 
> ...


Yes, Jhonen Vasquez also made fun of being called "goth." Subcultures are silly altogether.

I just assumed that this thread was about people who dress gothic and nothing more substantial than that.


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## SalvinaZerelda (Aug 26, 2010)

I could have sworn Jhonen Vasquez was a type 5.

When I'm in 9w1 mode, I am more ethereal goth like.
9w8 is when I am excitable and want to party and do important things for the world.
When I'm in 4w5 mode I am more romantigoth like.
In 4w3 mode I might be perky goth/artsy goth.

My preferred style is definitely ethereal goth.

I am not embracing the label publicly, but I fit the description. =(


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## SuperDevastation (Jun 7, 2010)

AngelOnHerFlight said:


> Yes, Jhonen Vasquez also made fun of being called "goth." Subcultures are silly altogether.
> 
> I just assumed that this thread was about people who dress gothic and nothing more substantial than that.


Actually it was about people who are goths in every or almost every sense of the word.


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## DomNapoleon (Jan 21, 2012)

Many 4w5 choose black clothing


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## SuperDevastation (Jun 7, 2010)

Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Many 4w5 choose black clothing


I'm wearing black clothing right now.


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## marckos (May 6, 2011)

Im going for 4w5s, 5w4s and 8w7s sx


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## soya (Jun 29, 2010)

Rune said:


> When I'm in 9w1 mode, I am more ethereal goth like.


I'm not someone who considers myself a goth or any other label, but I enjoy that type of music as well as shoegaze, dreampop, anything with that vibe.

I also like instrumental metal/post-metal and some industrial/EBM.

I like The Cure, Joy Division, Bauhaus, etc., but I don't really consider any of those bands "goth".

Not sure how heavily type matters here, but I figured it might be helpful to add a 9's perspective (I think I'm the first type 9 to comment here). I think a lot of people assume all 9s are sunshiney people.


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## SalvinaZerelda (Aug 26, 2010)

soya said:


> I'm not someone who considers myself a goth or any other label, but I enjoy that type of music as well as shoegaze, dreampop, anything with that vibe.
> 
> I also like instrumental metal/post-metal and some industrial/EBM.
> 
> ...


Yeah.. I like ethereal, ambient, synthpop, futurepop, darkwave, industrial.
Have never heard of dreampop, but sounds interesting..

I feel most "myself" when I listen to these types of music.

They aren't Goth Rock? I completely forgot about that genre.. xD


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## soya (Jun 29, 2010)

Rune said:


> Yeah.. I like ethereal, ambient, synthpop, futurepop, darkwave, industrial.
> Have never heard of dreampop, but sounds interesting..
> 
> I feel most "myself" when I listen to these types of music.
> ...


Me too. I feel connected to that music in a very organic way.

I don't know, I consider the Cure pop, and Joy Division and Bauhaus post-punk. But I think everyone has their own labeling systems, and of course most bands may fall into various categories.


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## m_dogg (Feb 22, 2012)

Dolorous Haze said:


> ""It's so pitiful when 'goth' is still tagged onto the name The Cure"
> 
> "It's only people that aren't goths that think the Cure are a goth band"
> 
> ...



if he had the balls... 

:wink:


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Never considered myself a goth even though I'm kind of drawn to the more classic types of goth as @aconite pointed out. I like the Victorian dramo-rama goth much more than the new modern forms of goth that I don't understand despite loving industrial metal fusion bands such as The Kovenant that I think is likely to be strongly associated with the cybergoth scene?

Honestly, I don't understand all this "conform to a subculture" kind of thing. While I do consider myself a metalhead, to go out of my way and dress to conform to a subculture or dress in a way that's clearly linked to a subculture even if it was done out of free choice is not my thing. 

I am going to go my way out and say that for example social 3 types are more likely to do this than a 4, unless so 4w3 who happens to identify with that culture. I also think 6s could be likely to do this to be honest, if again, identification with that subculture provides with a sense of security. With that said, I don't think there's any necessary correlation in the end.


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## The Scorched Earth (May 17, 2010)

I would CP 6s. 4s don't like being identified by any common label.

I can't imagine a goth being a 1 or 2.


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## Dolorous Haze (Jun 2, 2012)

m_dogg said:


> if he had the balls...
> 
> :wink:


Just because you sneak into people's rooms to....ahem...."melt" them. :tongue:


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## Dolorous Haze (Jun 2, 2012)

soya said:


> Me too. I feel connected to that music in a very organic way.
> 
> I don't know, I consider the Cure pop, and Joy Division and Bauhaus post-punk. But I think everyone has their own labeling systems, and of course most bands may fall into various categories.


The Cure do have a few poppy albums but Pornography, 17 Seconds, Bloodflowers and Disintegration are tremendously dark and their first album has a post-punk feel to it. I'd call them Alternative Rock or New Wave. As you said, most bands don't stick to one genre. I don't listen to Bauhaus that much, so I can't comment...but I do think post-punk fits Joy Division pretty well.


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## Vanishing Point (Oct 2, 2012)

Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Many 4w5 choose black clothing


Actual picture of my walk in closet:







contents of the laundry basket:







Me celebrating Christmas:


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## DomNapoleon (Jan 21, 2012)

Vanishing Point said:


> Actual picture of my walk in closet:
> View attachment 55038
> 
> contents of the laundry basket:
> ...


Hmmm... Looks fascionable


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## Vanishing Point (Oct 2, 2012)

Phoenix_Rebirth said:


> Hmmm... Looks fascionable


Thanks!


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## Promethea (Aug 24, 2009)

examples i can think of..
goth spotting: 4s, 6s, 5s, 7s, and i can think of at least one example of someone who i would have typed as an 8w7.


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## Dolorous Haze (Jun 2, 2012)

Vanishing Point said:


> Actual picture of my walk in closet:
> View attachment 55038
> 
> contents of the laundry basket:
> ...



A _red_ santa hat? For starters, it *should* be black and secondly, as a 4, you are most certainly not permitted to enjoy Christmas! BLASPHEMER. If you enjoy such a soulless, celebration of consumerism, you're _obviously_ a 6.


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## Vanishing Point (Oct 2, 2012)

Dolorous Haze said:


> A _red_ santa hat? For starters, it *should* be black and secondly, as a 4, you are most certainly not permitted to enjoy Christmas! BLASPHEMER. If you enjoy such a soulless, celebration of consumerism, you're _obviously_ a 6.


Firstly... Red is an approved color, especially with black. ...though admittedly not usually in the form of a santa hat. That said I'm a subculture iconoclast and wearing a Santa hat and indulging in wholehearted yule time joy is the best act of rebellion against po-facery and subculture posery. ..Also as an added bonus my local Yule time comes with straw goats and other suspicious pagan influences. If liking huge straw goats makes you a non four then I will be a big straw goat loving non four.







Furthermore... Christmas is not the same if I do not celebrate it. By bestowing people the opportunity of giving gifts to me is mighty generous from my part as it presents the poor lowly creatures with a chance of engaging in genuine of Goddess worship. :wink:


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## Mizmar (Aug 12, 2009)

I actually find Christmas to be a pretty sad (at times depressing) time of year. Part of that might be caused by hearing so much beautiful, sad music being played everywhere I go. Music like this: 


* *


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## Tater Tot (May 28, 2012)

The stereotype is 4, obviously. :laughing: The goth thing is going out of style though because it was for people who were different, and now everyone is doing it, so its not a "different" thing anymore.


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## voicetrocity (Mar 31, 2012)

The only thing that keeps me from being recognized as a goth is my fashion sense. 

A lot of people seemed shocked by my interests because, well, I guess it doesn't "ooze" out of me. I do wear a lot of black clothing and makeup; I also own a small amount of "accessories", but that's about as far as it goes. I really don't have the interest or patience to really keep up with any "image"; so I guess I'm not officially "goth" in that sense; but I've never refrained from appreciating the culture and the people I've met in it.


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## bombsaway (Nov 29, 2011)

I'm a 9 and was a goth as a teenager.

Well, I'm still have black hair and black eye makeup and am currently wearing a black blazer, a cream + black blouse, black jeans and black Doc Martens. I like to think of my style as more Grown-Up Goth than goth these days but my love for black clothing and my morbid sense of humour has never left me.


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## Mizmar (Aug 12, 2009)

I wonder what enneagram type the steampunk sub-culture would stereotypically be associated with. I find it an adorable style.


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## aconite (Mar 26, 2012)

Mizmar said:


> I wonder what enneagram type the steampunk sub-culture would stereotypically be associated with. I find it an adorable style.


I like steampunk ^^ I guess a stereotype would be some kind of 5 because of the associations with science.


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## cudibloop (Oct 11, 2012)

Out of the four of them, the curly haired one and the one with the red streak are legit 4s; 4w3 and 4w5 respectively. The girl is cp-6w7 or 8w7 Sx-Dom. The smallest one is phobic 6w7.


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