# Bad Girl or Good Girl



## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

perennialurker said:


> I've always been most attracted to the really really good girls. By that I mean something along the lines of "the preacher's daughter good girl". This is all the more complicated and makes me seem all the more creepy given the fact that I am not Christian. Still "good girls" in the most traditional sense of the idea are the ones that I fall for. "Bad girls" really have no appeal to me.


You obviously did not go to catholic school or to church. Church girls are rarely "good" by any stretch of the imagination.


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## perennialurker (Oct 1, 2009)

android654 said:


> You obviously did not go to catholic school or to church. Church girls are rarely "good" by any stretch of the imagination.


As I stated, I am interested in the idealized version and not what church girls are literally like. 

Whether they are actually priests' daughters or someone else, I don't care, I am interested in the girls whose behavior and beliefs line up with this ideal. While I acknowledge they are extremely rare these days, they do exist.


But you're right, I didn't go to Catholic school or church.:wink:


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

perennialurker said:


> As I stated, I am interested in the idealized version and not what church girls are literally like.
> 
> Whether they are actually priests' daughters or someone else, I don't care, I am interested in the girls whose behavior and beliefs line up with this ideal. While I acknowledge they are extremely rare these days, they do exist.
> 
> ...


Too bad, because they can be filthy. But then they still proclaim their faith... I never understood that.


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## undead (Nov 28, 2010)

android654 said:


> You obviously did not go to catholic school or to church. Church girls are rarely "good" by any stretch of the imagination.


Why Church girls are not "good" ?
I don't really understand.


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

undead said:


> Why Church girls are not "good" ?
> I don't really understand.


Religion is stifling whether you believe in it or not. Combine that with blossoming sexuality, an overbearing father figure and several "authority figures" presented as youth ministers and you have a lot of things going on in a church that wouldn't expect. Now if you're the pastor's daughter multiply that by a thousand and have it follow you home. I was raised evangelist and went to catholic school since pre-k. Trust me, they're more perverted than you expect.


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## curious0610 (Jun 27, 2010)

android654 said:


> Religion is stifling whether you believe in it or not. Combine that with blossoming sexuality, an overbearing father figure and several "authority figures" presented as youth ministers and you have a lot of things going on in a church that wouldn't expect. Now if you're the pastor's daughter multiply that by a thousand and have it follow you home. I was raised evangelist and went to catholic school since pre-k. Trust me, they're more perverted than you expect.


I didn't go to Catholic school, but I can verify what you write about on how religion can be stifling. 

In children raised in strict Christian households, I've seen two common outcomes: the first is close to what you mention- generally acting out or in some way rejecting values they were raised in (e.g., in this context - engaging in promiscuous behavior despite being forced by parents to attend retreats/conferences on the sin of pre-marital activities) ; the second is when I've experienced that children try to "grow into" the mold their parents' values have for them (e.g.- engaging in the belief that virginity is a gift you give your husband and refraining from pre-marital activities). The problem with the latter is that it becomes difficult for that person to later determine whether these values are their own beliefs in the first place. 

Both are bad.


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## undead (Nov 28, 2010)

android654 said:


> Religion is stifling whether you believe in it or not. Combine that with blossoming sexuality, an overbearing father figure and several "authority figures" presented as youth ministers and you have a lot of things going on in a church that wouldn't expect. Now if you're the pastor's daughter multiply that by a thousand and have it follow you home. I was raised evangelist and went to catholic school since pre-k. Trust me, they're more perverted than you expect.


Look, I grew up in a Catholic school and in a conservative country and culture. 

I know religion is twisted in some ways. But, I don't understand why you consider the girls are not "good".

The ones I know (including my relatives) are really really good. They always try to behave properly, timid, never questioned authority. Although very very few tries to make up their own mind, but these kind of people are very rare (or they don't show themselves).

I'm not interested with church girls due to myself rejecting Christianity (I have to be consistent), except if they experienced the similar transition as I did.

But, in terms of "good", I don't understand why they are not.


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## girlsgonewilde (May 16, 2011)

I'd like a girl I can tie up. ^_~


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## OrangeAppled (Jun 26, 2009)

I'm lazy and haven't read the whole thread, so excuse me if this has been mentioned...but in the Black Swan, Portman's character was both good & bad, struggling with both parts of herself (Kunis' character was used to identify with her own "bad" side).

Most women don't fit neatly into either category, but I think the virgin-whore complex does exist in some minds.


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

undead said:


> Look, I grew up in a Catholic school and in a conservative country and culture.
> 
> I know religion is twisted in some ways. But, I don't understand why you consider the girls are not "good".
> 
> The ones I know (including my relatives) are really really good. They always try to behave properly, timid, never questioned authority. Although very very few tries to make up their own mind, but these kind of people are very rare (or they don't show themselves).


That's more like castrated rather than good in my opinion.



undead said:


> I'm not interested with church girls due to myself rejecting Christianity (I have to be consistent), except if they experienced the similar transition as I did.
> 
> But, in terms of "good", I don't understand why they are not.


Perhaps its a cultural difference, but like I mentioned before, your idea of the "good girl" is rare in catholic schools and churches in the US.


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

a nice girl- i always go for the ones who everyone's like "oh HER! oh yeah, she's really nice.."- the girl next door. i guess those type of girls make me want to be a better person which is really attractive.


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## Shemp (Mar 29, 2011)

They both suck. Now give me the girl who goes both ways.


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## undead (Nov 28, 2010)

android654 said:


> That's more like castrated rather than good in my opinion.
> 
> Perhaps its a cultural difference, but like I mentioned before, your idea of the "good girl" is rare in catholic schools and churches in the US.


Yes, castrated or whatever is the right term to describe it.

I still don't understand why do you think they are "not" good.

Update: 
I think I do, and as usual people are sooo inconsistent (especially in religion). They don't fit my logical framework.


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## undead (Nov 28, 2010)

OrangeAppled said:


> I'm lazy and haven't read the whole thread, so excuse me if this has been mentioned...but in the Black Swan, Portman's character was both good & bad, struggling with both parts of herself (Kunis' character was used to identify with her own "bad" side).
> 
> Most women don't fit neatly into either category, but I think the virgin-whore complex does exist in some minds.


I guess so. 

I was referring to the side of Portman when she's conscious of what she's doing.


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

undead said:


> Yes, castrated or whatever is the right term to describe it.
> 
> I still don't understand why do you think they are "not" good.
> 
> ...


It's simple, the way you described "good girls" behaving isn't the way most church girls I knew behaved. They weren't the archetype of "good" girls they were more confused and with youth comes devilry. In a church setting, especially one as fanatical as catholic schools and evangelist churches it really stands out.


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## UserFriendly (Apr 10, 2011)

Good girl would be better in the long run, but bad girl for short term.


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## Runvardh (May 17, 2011)

Why can't I have the one who's an angel in public and a devil under the sheets? It's not like I want to or enjoy publicizing my private life. That said, I'm a monogamist and can't do one night stands; not for any religious reason, it's just the way that I am based on how I react in certain situations. I can't really choose with out the grey area.


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## strawberryLola (Sep 19, 2010)

Yeah. That is why I tend NOT to be attracted to conventional types of mentalities. Brings back A LOT of negative memories of growing up with a very judgmental uncle who was very domineering and preachy like a mofo.

So what if a female (woman, girl, human being) has thoughts of her own?

She is automatically a bad girl? 

"Should" a girl have to wear an apron and cater to her man like a little prancing kitten everywhere he goes? 

No wonder I have such a vehement dislike for guys who think like that (yes- I am heterosexual, and no I REFUSE to put up with that crap). I get goosebumps just thinking about it.

Thanks for a great definition of good verses bad. Some females ourtright do not feel attracted to a guy for whatever reason; that does not make her bad. It just tells the other person it's not a match.


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## killerB (Jan 14, 2010)

skycloud86 said:


> I don't understand this. You first say can't all of you be good women, but then you say some have to be bad. That doesn't make any sense.


 

This was a tongue in cheek statement, meant to be witty, such as in "If you can't say anything nice, come here and sit by me."(Mae West). 

As for being a so called 'good girl', I find that status overrated, from what I have learned and observed. What society dictates a good girl must be to attain the label, is confining, and sexist. Once a woman states her wants and needs, and refuses to follow societies dictates, she is labled as a 'bad girl'. She may be honest, faithful and kind, but if she does not do what others think she should, it's all over.


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## undead (Nov 28, 2010)

strawberryLola said:


> Yeah. That is why I tend NOT to be attracted to conventional types of mentalities. Brings back A LOT of negative memories of growing up with a very judgmental uncle who was very domineering and preachy like a mofo.
> 
> So what if a female (woman, girl, human being) has thoughts of her own?
> 
> ...


There's nothing in the OP that says whether being "bad" is worse/better than being "good". It's circumstantial, and it's just a label to describe the common perception of society. If I want to be diligent, I have to use various terms like independent, fun, cheerful, timid, rebellious, smart, intelligent, loving, etc. But, I was lazy, so that's what I was starting with. 

Actually, the "value" of "good" and "bad" was determined after the OP by the responses I see in this thread, not when I wrote the post. Look back, there's no value determination at all. It's all about preferences from an individual.

I also dislike the kind of girls who think that a good guy is determined by his religion or by his submission to an authority. Also *nobody* says that disliking certain characters of a guy makes that girl "not" heterosexual. 

That kind of label also brings back a lot of negative memories of my father who kept on trying to brainwash me with Christianity or how to be obedient to a culture that's not 100% correct or better than what I have in mind. I don't believe that "marriage" is an absolute way to determine whether a couple have a good relationship (people will consider me as bad for thinking like this).

Then, there's no relation between being bad and not attracted to a guy. Being bad tend to be perceived as less "loyal" or less "committed" to a partner. Ever hear of "bad boys" perception? 

In the OP, I did correlate this bad or good with the dualism in the movie, and which characters are preferable. But, as I predict there will be some misunderstandings and the kind of emotional response like this. 

The question is "Which one do you prefer of these characteristics?" 
Not about whether they are separate entities in one female to another female.


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