# Help! Fe or Fi user?



## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

These two functions have been confusing me so much for a while now. I read about both functions a lot and I have decent knowledge and understanding about them, I just can't decide which one do I use the most because I can relate to both functions, so please help me out by clearing my confusion :frustrating:

I'm a person who doesn't like to express their feelings too much, especially negative feelings. I never express them even to the closest people to me. Which is an Fi user trait right? I also find it hard to explain my feelings to others even though I'm clearly aware of how I'm feeling, I just can't put them into words. 

But at the same time I really care about others feelings and can easily read how they're feeling, and I can quickly get effected by it. If someone is upset I can tell easily and become upset as well the whole day till they feel better again then I can feel relieved. I also try to make everyone feel involved so no one feels left out when something is happening, it's like I'm always on the look out for others feelings. Now these are Fe traits right?

Ah help me! I'm really confused


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## Xenograft (Jul 1, 2013)

Often it's tough to search for evidence of function in certain social behaviour, since MBTI is simply a theory of internal cognition. I would say that the internalisation of one's emotional experience is *not* a trait of Fi, and is more about you and how you feel about vulnerability.

From the information you've included in your post, I gather that you are a human who is undergoing human pain and confusion under the weight of having to be a human in this world. I can also gather that you are attentive to how you feel and how other people feel and how all those feels get felt by other people, which sounds like an awareness of emotions and their importance. 

Neither of these things are Fe or Fi, they are human. 

If you would like to look for evidence of Fi and Fe, look for it in how you manage a room, or how you process/present a concept. Heavy Fi users tend to refer back to themselves constantly, literally and figuratively. They will use a heavy amount of "I" statements, and will use themselves as examples, generally being as personal as possible with their construction of the concept. Heavy Fe users will tend to try to establish harmony, as in similarity, as in sharedness, they will try to meet people where the people are. Heavy Fe tends to reach, heavy Fi tends to watch.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

@Xenograft

Okay honestly everything you said is really really helpful, and you honestly gave me a better idea of what the functions are. But seriously your analysis from what I wrote is so accurate that I felt like you know me in person haha

And from your description of Fe and Fi I feel like I lean towards Fi more, especially with the mentioning and referring to myself a lot. I really don't mean it in a selfish way at all  but it's the best way I can relate and explain things to others. Especially when comferting someone else, a way of showing them they aren't alone. And I do tend to watch more than interact.

Thank you a lot for your effort, and reading and commenting. I really appreciate your help roud:


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

QueenBella said:


> These two functions have been confusing me so much for a while now. I read about both functions a lot and I have decent knowledge and understanding about them, I just can't decide which one do I use the most because I can relate to both functions, so please help me out by clearing my confusion :frustrating:
> 
> I'm a person who doesn't like to express their feelings too much, especially negative feelings. I never express them even to the closest people to me. Which is an Fi user trait right? I also find it hard to explain my feelings to others even though I'm clearly aware of how I'm feeling, I just can't put them into words.
> 
> ...




For the most part I think the descriptions in this thread are pretty accurate:

http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/844977-fi-vs-fe.html




I think a good way to look at it is...do you value group harmony more, or authenticity more? Fe values group harmony more, Fi values authenticity more.


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## Ardielley (Aug 4, 2013)

teddy564339 said:


> For the most part I think the descriptions in this thread are pretty accurate:
> 
> http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/844977-fi-vs-fe.html
> 
> ...


This is probably one of the biggest distinctions between these two functions, and it's an important one to remember, but there are definitely other ones, too, @QueenBella.

I'd say that in general, Fe makes broader connections, while Fi makes deeper ones. Fe spreads itself thin and therefore doesn't go as deep into people or causes. It sees someone hurting, it wants to help - because if someone's hurt, s/he needs help. It sees the pain before it sees the person and therefore doesn't connect as deeply_ to _said person (although it will naturally connect to _more _people). For Fi, it's the opposite. It may make fewer connections, but the connections will be deeper. It'll go beyond the hurt and see the individual behind it. This is a _person_ who needs my help. It's more getting to the source of the pain than the pain itself.

I'd also say that Fi tends to be more self-assured. If you're the type of person who is constantly on a mission of self-discovery, it's not likely you're an Fi user. At their core, Fi users have a strong sense of who they are and what they stand for. It's more fluid and relative for Fe, which is why you'll often see Fe users shaping and refining their identities. Fi users do this less frequently, but when they do it, it's to better match their actions with their values. This process isn't as introspective for Fe users and can often be brought about by external influences such as family, friends, or culture.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

@teddy564339

After reading that thread I see myself relating the most to Fi, especially with wanting to be accepted for who I really am. And honestly I value authenticity A LOT. Genuineness and authenticity are really important to me. 

Ah now I really have a much better understanding of the functions so thank you for your efforts, I appreciate the help roud:


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

@Ardielley

I seriously never thought that Fi was that deep or that it was meant to mean something like that. 

Learning about the functions was really hard for me and I had a lot of misunderstandings apparently, at first I thought Fi just meant that the person's awareness of their feelings is stronger than of other people's feelings. But now I can see the actual meaning and understanding of it. 

No wonder why I always get too deep with my relationships and thoughts.. 

Thank you for helping me get a better understanding of the functions, I really appreciate your help and answer. Now I'm certain that I'm an Fi user.:happy:


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

Ardielley said:


> I'd say that in general, Fe makes broader connections, while Fi makes deeper ones. Fe spreads itself thin and therefore doesn't go as deep into people or causes. It sees someone hurting, it wants to help - because if someone's hurt, s/he needs help. It sees the pain before it sees the person and therefore doesn't connect as deeply_ to _said person (although it will naturally connect to _more _people). For Fi, it's the opposite. It may make fewer connections, but the connections will be deeper. It'll go beyond the hurt and see the individual behind it. This is a _person_ who needs my help. It's more getting to the source of the pain than the pain itself.


Overall I agree with this. A while ago I also came to the conclusion that Fe is broad and Fi is deep (I actually think this is true for all of the functions).

I mentioned this idea in this thread:

http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/839458-helping-people-always-act-fe.html


However, not everyone agreed with it. I think the reason why is that there are a lot of variations among people.

The way I described it in that thread is that every individual has a certain amount of "energy" that they would use to help people. This amount of energy varies from person to person.

The difference between Fe and Fi is how someone exerts or applies their energy. If we assume that an Fi user and an Fe user each had the same amount of energy, I agree with you...the Fe user would help more people but not as deeply, and the Fi user would help fewer people in more detail.


However, the key thing to keep in mind is that not everyone has the same amount of this energy. So, if you had an Fe user who had a lot more energy, they wouldn't just help more people...they would also help some people more deeply. It's not like an Fe user can't help people deeply...it's just that it takes more energy, and generally, they are going to disperse their energy.

Same thing if an Fi user had more energy. They could help more people....it's not just that they would help the same number of people more deeply.


That's why it gets confusing. You could have an Fe user who actually helped more people just as deeply as an Fi user does...or you could have an Fi user who actually helped more people than an Fe user does and helped htem deeper. It all depends on the aspects of the individual.



An INTJ member noticed a similar thing in this thread:

http://personalitycafe.com/isfj-forum-nurturers/832570-isfj-nice-but-not-kind.html

He claimed the ISFJs he knew helped people close to them (family, friends) very deeply, but didn't help anyone else. He viewed it as them being "kind" to those they knew, but showing a fake, meaningless politeness (being "nice") to everyone else.

So in his mind, the Fe way of helping was shallow and pointless, only used to save face for the ISFJ. But he did admit that the ISFJs were capable of helping those that they cared about more deeply.


Even though I don't agree with his view of Fe, I did agree with the point that as an ISFJ, it's not like I don't care for anyone deeply. I can care for some people more than others, and those I do help deeply.


So even though I agree with your general description, I don't think it's that Fe users always help "the pain" and never "the person". There are definitely plenty of times I care about helping the person.

However, there are other times where I will just help "the pain". And I'm willing to bet an Fi user wouldn't be as likely to do that. But on the flip side, there are some people that I would never go deeper with, and the Fi user would.


So I guess what I'm saying is...for both Fi and Fe users, for those close to them, they will help them deeply, and in neither case it will be very many people.

But when things extend beyond that close circle, then your description fits...an Fe user will help more people by focusing on the pain, and the Fi user will help fewer people focusing on the person. 


And it's still not universal, but as a general idea, I think it's true.


I think it helps to explain why Fi users sometimes find Fe help to be unhelpful...they can view it as shallow or like it's not real help. Likewise, Fe users might find Fi help to be unhelpful because it doesn't bother with people that it won't go all in for. 




Ardielly said:


> I'd also say that Fi tends to be more self-assured. If you're the type of person who is constantly on a mission of self-discovery, it's not likely you're an Fi user. At their core, Fi users have a strong sense of who they are and what they stand for. It's more fluid and relative for Fe, which is why you'll often see Fe users shaping and refining their identities. Fi users do this less frequently, but when they do it, it's to better match their actions with their values. This process isn't as introspective for Fe users and can often be brought about by external influences such as family, friends, or culture.


In relative terms I think this is probably true. I do think Fe users tend to flow more.


However, part of it is that Fe users have a bunch of things that are all true for them at once...but none of those things is quite as deep as the things for Fi users. It goes back to our broad vs. deep conversation.


For me, I don't think I have any principles that I feel are extremely deep and unmoving. I feel like I have a bunch of them that are all kind of true at the same time. And when I'm around certain people, I'll emphasize certain ones and de-emphasize others.

So to Fi users, it may appear that I'm wishy-washy or don't have any principles, because they're not deep and un-moving. 


I think this is related to Ti as well. For me, my Ti is always looking for new information. That makes me feel like I can't stick really strongly to any one principle...because I could always hear a new bit of information that could change my mind. My current state still believes in that principle, but it's always in the back of my mind that it could change if I hear a compelling logical argument.


I think for Fi/Te users, the logic is more objective and locked into place, which makes their Fi principles very deep and resolved.

So that's why Fe users might find Fi users to be stubborn (since they won't sacrifice any of their principles for the sake of finding common ground, or finding harmony/getting along), and Fi users might find Fe users to be fake because their principles can be adapted based on the situation.


I think the problem comes when either type doesn't view the whole thing as relative to themselves. When you compare yourself to the opposite feeling function, it's always going to feel like an extreme to you...because neither of you are in the middle. When we understand that both of us are at the extremes, it helps us to realize that the gap feels bigger than it is from the center...because none of us are at the center. 


But when you're aware of where you are too, it makes you realize that neither of you are further from center than the other...you're just in opposite directions. So it's not like the other person is being any more extreme than you are.



I don't know if that made sense, but hopefully you get what I'm generally saying.


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

QueenBella said:


> @_teddy564339_
> 
> After reading that thread I see myself relating the most to Fi, especially with wanting to be accepted for who I really am. And honestly I value authenticity A LOT. Genuineness and authenticity are really important to me.
> 
> Ah now I really have a much better understanding of the functions so thank you for your efforts, I appreciate the help roud:




I think what makes it tricky is that all of this is relative. Fi users can want people to feel included just like Fe users will. Fe users want others to accept them for who they are and they value honesty and genuineness too.


But where it comes to light is when there's a conflict of these interests. Let's say that you have to make a choice...you can either make others feel comfortable, or you can hold firmly onto your principles/authenticity. Let's say you can't do both. By making others happy and making them feel comfortable, you're going to have to sacrifice some of your principles. 

What you choose is more likely to tell whether you're an Fe or Fi user.


But again, it's all relative....it doesn't have to deal with extremes. It may be that you only have to sacrifice a little of your principles to make someone happy. 


So it's all generally speaking, which is what can make it confusing.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

teddy564339 said:


> I think what makes it tricky is that all of this is relative. Fi users can want people to feel included just like Fe users will. Fe users want others to accept them for who they are and they value honesty and genuineness too.
> 
> 
> But where it comes to light is when there's a conflict of these interests. Let's say that you have to make a choice...you can either make others feel comfortable, or you can hold firmly onto your principles/authenticity. Let's say you can't do both. By making others happy and making them feel comfortable, you're going to have to sacrifice some of your principles.
> ...


I see what you mean, that's why I was really confused at first but now I understand the actual difference. And like you said, honestly my older brother (An INFJ) is one of the most genuinely caring people I know in my life, so I know that even Fe useres are absolutely genuine in certain aspects.

But what I was referring to and understood from the thread is that Fi users tend to need to be accepted for who they really are, and can find it hard to change beliefs or values they strongly believe in, even if for someone else. Meanwhile an Fe user wouldn't mind as you described it, sacrifice some of that for others. So by genuine and authentic I meant when it comes to our identity and strong beliefs. 

Now that I think about it more, that's actually really touching how someone can be so caring of others.. :happy:

I really hope my understanding so far is right, please be patient with me if it wasn't :frustrating:


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## IDontThinkSo (Aug 24, 2011)

Well I don't know, but I'm here to see @tr0u8l3m4k3r doing something crazy right now.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

IDontThinkSo said:


> Well I don't know, but I'm here to see @tr0u8l3m4k3r doing something crazy right now.


A wild ENTP appears! :laughing: -Even though you didn't exactly answer my question- it's still a pleasure to have you come by this thread roud: 

And I'm still new to this site and everyone so I absolutely have no clue who you just mentioned. Now I'm just curious :happy:


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## IDontThinkSo (Aug 24, 2011)

@QueenBella Well, nice to meet you ; you'll understand better by reading 

this

and then.. 

this
this
this
this


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## IDontThinkSo (Aug 24, 2011)

Now to answer your question, FE and FI are no functions. F is a function, so the difference is the attitude.. If you're on the adaptive, intropunitive side, you're INFP. If you're on the defensive, extrapunitive side, you're ENFJ. However if your preference for F is very strong, it'll dominate your attitude and you'll be borderline INFP/ENFJ.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

IDontThinkSo said:


> @QueenBella Well, nice to meet you ; you'll understand better by reading
> 
> this
> 
> ...


Nice meeting you too roud: And okay I understand now... xD

But yeah I wasn't really serious no worries, I'm starting to have a better understanding now and so far I'm finding myself leaning more towards Fi. And from your description too I relate to Fi more.


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## Bunny (Jul 11, 2015)

We all use Fi & Fe, it just depends on if they are in your main 4 fuctions or in your shadow functions but any way...

As an Fe user, I am genuine to myself and I do not conform to anyone's beliefs or values just to create harmony.
Ti is also an internal judging function and it can (and will) interact with Fe.

If an entire group of people wants to go one way, I am never going to go that way if I think differently.
There are always exceptions, if and when someone changes my mind on a personal level.
However, for the most part. I stick to my guns and I do not waiver.

I do not like it when people say Fe always wants "harmony", it's wrong, they don't.

If it is something I personally believe in, I'm not just going to go along with what the group wants (which would be the opposite of what I want) just for the sake of others. Nope, won't do it.


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## Ardielley (Aug 4, 2013)

Wytch said:


> We all use Fi & Fe, it just depends on if they are in your main 4 fuctions or in your shadow functions but any way...
> 
> As an Fe user, I am genuine to myself and I do not conform to anyone's beliefs or values just to create harmony.
> Ti is also an internal judging function and it can (and will) interact with Fe.
> ...


I think what we all need to remember is that different functions manifest differently depending on the position they're in. For you, your Ti takes precedence over your Fe, so it makes sense that you'd be more independent-minded. If anything, I'd say this is more of a judging vs. perceiving difference - judgers on the whole appreciate hierarchy and collaboration in this way much more than perceivers.

But back to what I was saying, the OP is/was debating whether she has auxiliary Fe, in which case Ti _wouldn't_ take precedence over it, resulting in a less independent mindset than yours, most likely.


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## Bunny (Jul 11, 2015)

Ardielley said:


> I think what we all need to remember is that different functions manifest differently depending on the position they're in. For you, your Ti takes precedence over your Fe, so it makes sense that you'd be more independent-minded. If anything, I'd say this is more of a judging vs. perceiving difference - judgers on the whole appreciate hierarchy and collaboration in this way much more than perceivers.
> 
> But back to what I was saying, the OP is/was debating whether she has auxiliary Fe, in which case Ti _wouldn't_ take precedence over it, resulting in a less independent mindset than yours, most likely.


I'll agree with you on how the function placings will give someone a different view (& J vs P).
I have often thought this myself.
It is probably one of the reasons that xSTPs can be seen as rebellious.

Ah, okay.
Well, I did not read that part of her dilemma but I was posting about Fe in general.
Given some of the posts here about Fe.

IxFJ would be less prone to independence because of the J too, as you know.


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## Ardielley (Aug 4, 2013)

Wytch said:


> I'll agree with you on how the function placings will give someone a different view (& J vs P).
> I have often thought this myself.
> It is probably one of the reasons that xSTPs can be seen as rebellious.
> 
> ...


Ah, wait... I just noticed you're right. xD

I was reading another thread about INFJs vs INFPs recently and must've gotten the two threads mixed up.


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## Bunny (Jul 11, 2015)

Ardielley said:


> Ah, wait... I just noticed you're right. xD
> 
> I was reading another thread about INFJs vs INFPs recently and must've gotten the two threads mixed up.


Haha :tongue: no worries roud:.
I just thought I skimmed over that part in due to my laziness.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

@teddy564339

Negative response is definitely something I fear about expressing my feelings, but at the same time I feel like my feelings are a very important part of me that if I show it, it's as if I'm exposing a part of me? And I can't trust everyone to treat it right, because if I got hurt it's probably going to hit hard. 

As for in conflict, even though I don't have that many things that I value so strongly, I probably will not back down if it's something I truly disagree with. I will still be very respectful and understanding when hearing the other persons opinion. But like I said I don't have that many things I strongly value that I would get too worked up over.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

Sorry for the absolutely late response but I've been extremely busy in my personal life.

But I basically did what almost everyone has been telling me and decided to read more on how functions work together. Since I'm confused if I'm an INFJ (Fe) or INFP (Fi) I read these two types' function stacks, and ended up settling on and relating more to INFP. 

I still stand for what I said about relating to Fe on some traits, but maybe I'm just confusing normal emotional behavior with what the function itself is supposed to mean.

Nevertheless thank you to anyone who helped me out and gave me advice or explained to me. I really appreciate your time and effort.


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

QueenBella said:


> @*teddy564339*
> 
> Negative response is definitely something I fear about expressing my feelings, but at the same time I feel like my feelings are a very important part of me that if I show it, it's as if I'm exposing a part of me? And I can't trust everyone to treat it right, because if I got hurt it's probably going to hit hard.
> 
> As for in conflict, even though I don't have that many things that I value so strongly, I probably will not back down if it's something I truly disagree with. I will still be very respectful and understanding when hearing the other persons opinion. But like I said I don't have that many things I strongly value that I would get too worked up over.




Yeah, I have to say, your situation is a tough one to figure out. You're not striking me as super far in the direction of Fi or Fe.


For me, it was never hard to figure out my type because my judging side was so strong. I figured out my type without even looking at the CFs. This is partly because I have dominant Si, which makes me very structured...I've never once the considered the idea that I could be a perceiving type. So I never had to figure out if I used Fe or Fi...it just came naturally. And then when I read about Fe, I ended up relating to it anyway.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

teddy564339 said:


> Yeah, I have to say, your situation is a tough one to figure out. You're not striking me as super far in the direction of Fi or Fe.
> 
> 
> For me, it was never hard to figure out my type because my judging side was so strong. I figured out my type without even looking at the CFs. This is partly because I have dominant Si, which makes me very structured...I've never once the considered the idea that I could be a perceiving type. So I never had to figure out if I used Fe or Fi...it just came naturally. And then when I read about Fe, I ended up relating to it anyway.


Haha do you see why I had to start this thread now? roud:

But I ended up deciding on Fi, my understanding of Fe and Fi is still not the best, but after reading how all the functions of INFP work together it seemed easier to understand it's role and how it works, and I related to it more. I guess this is why everyone's been telling me to focus on learning that instead of only just Fe and Fi itself.


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## Agniete (Jun 8, 2015)

teddy564339 said:


> Yeah, I have to say, your situation is a tough one to figure out. You're not striking me as super far in the direction of Fi or Fe.
> 
> 
> For me, it was never hard to figure out my type because my judging side was so strong. I figured out my type without even looking at the CFs. This is partly because I have dominant Si, which makes me very structured...I've never once the considered the idea that I could be a perceiving type. So I never had to figure out if I used Fe or Fi...it just came naturally. And then when I read about Fe, I ended up relating to it anyway.


I've been eyeing this thread for some time and have to apologie to the OP, but I have a question especially for this post. Have you ever met other SFJs? You mention Si makes you very structured, so as a Si dominant, do you never felt as if you very a chaotic person and it is just the way of living? I've been thinking that maybe Si grounds this, but you still could feel as if you were a cloud shape in the wind. Have you ever felt this way? I am really interested in this.


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

Agniete said:


> I've been eyeing this thread for some time and have to apologie to the OP, but I have a question especially for this post. Have you ever met other SFJs? You mention Si makes you very structured, so as a Si dominant, do you never felt as if you very a chaotic person and it is just the way of living? I've been thinking that maybe Si grounds this, but you still could feel as if you were a cloud shape in the wind. Have you ever felt this way? I am really interested in this.



I'm not 100% sure what you're asking but I'll try to answer it the best that I can.


I don't think I've ever felt like I'm a chaotic person. The idea of chaos actually scares me a lot. I have found many other people to be chaotic people, though.


Sometimes that's a good thing. Sometimes I feel like perceiving types, especially SPs, are very entertaining. Taken in the right amounts and right context, they can be super fun, and they can help me loosen up and relax. It's very important to me that I feel comfortable around them, though, and feel like I can be myself without being judged. If that's the case, I can have a very good time with them.


But if I'm in a situation where I feel uncomfortable because I"m being judged, then I'll feel very intimidated and I'll hate the chaos. 


I think I originally chalked all of this up to introversion vs. extroversion. EP types particularly wear me out with all of their constant energy. But with EJ types, I think there's a little more balance and it makes it easier for me.



I don't know any surefire SFJs in my life. The ones I do know tend to be adults and female, so I don't really relate to them. I think I tend to be more easy-going than they are. I have a lot of internal structure, but generally I don't push it on others, and I get along with just about everyone because I'm pretty quiet and kind of go with the flow. I tend to kind of bounce my reactions off of others. 



So I don't feel very chaotic myself, but sometimes I can get overwhelmed by other people. I think part of this is because my Fe is trying to adapt to too many things at once.


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## Agniete (Jun 8, 2015)

@teddy564339 Will it be too personal, too much if I would ask you to define what you being structured means? Like, for example, you go on a trip and make a list of crucial things you will need? You have a routine? You do not like things being open ended, with too many possible outcomes, possibilities, meanings? You love your life being structured? 

At this point what I mean by saying chaotic is more related to cognitive functions. For example, I understand your thoughts, but I can't really say if I relate to you, to it or not. One day you can relate to descriptions, PC user posts, another day you can find yourself being wrong. You are in a constant state where everything can be yes and no, where everything that you thought about yourself the other day, every truth can be denied. So you are always searching for some truth, a pattern that will always work, that will always be true no matter the situation. I could be exaggerating, and maybe tomorrow I will look at this and see that it is not true, but now it is. I hope this helps to make sense.


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

Agniete said:


> @*teddy564339* Will it be too personal, too much if I would ask you to define what you being structured means? Like, for example, you go on a trip and make a list of crucial things you will need? You have a routine? You do not like things being open ended, with too many possible outcomes, possibilities, meanings? You love your life being structured?


So I actually think the two parts of your post seem to fit with my top two functions.

This top part fits with my Si. In terms of time and physical things, yes, I want structure. I like to be able to plan for things, I like to know what's coming, I don't like being surprised. I like consistency. I do like new things, but I also enjoy repetition. I also like to take new things slowly, gradually and one step at a time. I don't like there being a lot of open possibilities all at once...that's very stressful for me. I really like to have things planned out. 




Agniete said:


> At this point what I mean by saying chaotic is more related to cognitive functions. For example, I understand your thoughts, but I can't really say if I relate to you, to it or not. One day you can relate to descriptions, PC user posts, another day you can find yourself being wrong. You are in a constant state where everything can be yes and no, where everything that you thought about yourself the other day, every truth can be denied. So you are always searching for some truth, a pattern that will always work, that will always be true no matter the situation. I could be exaggerating, and maybe tomorrow I will look at this and see that it is not true, but now it is. I hope this helps to make sense.



I think this has to deal with my Fe (and to a degree Ti). For me, I guess you could argue because the main parts of who I am as a person can kind of shift based on who I'm with, you could argue that this is "chaotic". I don't know if I feel it quite to the extent that you're describing here, but I do think that this occurs.


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## seashell (Sep 15, 2013)

Since Fe and Fi have been described by other posters in different contexts, hope you don't mind if I reference music videos as possible examples. Both singers are upset over a relationship with someone they care about. In my opinion, each of their experiences and lyrics have a different focus. 


*Fi *











*Fe *


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

seashell said:


> Since Fe and Fi have been described by other posters in different contexts, hope you don't mind if I reference music videos as possible examples. Both singers are upset over a relationship with someone they care about. In my opinion, each of their experiences and lyrics have a different focus.
> 
> 
> *Fi *
> ...


Now that's a really interesting way of putting it! roud: and no not at all, I actually find it easier to understand things using methods like that. And I do find 'Stay with me' more relatable. But I understood what you meant clearly by listening to the lyrics to both songs.

I want to hear an Fe user's opinion on this though if they also relate to the other song.


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## ferroequinologist (Jul 27, 2012)

QueenBella said:


> I do tend to always notice others feelings first, and if making sure everyone is on the same page and toning it down when sensing conflict is group harmony then probably yes.
> 
> I really get confused when it comes to the types, even though I took the test more than once I got different results between INFP and INFJ. But I used to type myself as an INFJ till I got confused again and settled on INFP. Even my siblings say they see me as an INFP -but they haven't really read the functions and typed me based on reading the type's description-
> 
> This is why I'm starting to learn more about the functions instead, I'm still not sure about Ne and Ni, Fe and Fi are the first ones I started exploring so far because it confuses me the most. If you can give me an article like that one about Ne and Ni that would be really helpful <3


IMO, the most important thing said in this article is this:

"Fi users can easily identify their own feelings and emotions in a very accurate way; this is in contrast to Fe users, who easily can identify other people’s emotions, but are very confused about their own."

And to go together with that, Fe types are more prone to seek to modulate the feeling tone of the environment, both by trying to modulate it in others, as well as in themselves. Fi types, on the other hand, consider feelings to be the responsibility of the individuals, and do not do so, and thus, while maybe being quite aware of the feeling tone of the environment, not be willing or able to modulate it, and will instead, look after their own feelings. This does not mean that Fi doesn't have an impact, but that it will be unintentional and a side effect, not the primary goal. 

IMO, these differences are the main, visible difference between the two, and generally, once one becomes aware of them, are observable across the spectrum of FJ and TP types (Fe) and FP and TJ types (Fi).


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## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

ferroequinologist said:


> IMO, the most important thing said in this article is this:
> 
> "Fi users can easily identify their own feelings and emotions in a very accurate way; this is in contrast to Fe users, who easily can identify other people’s emotions, but are very confused about their own."
> 
> ...




I think that's overall right. I think that Fe types tend to want everyone to be on the same page. To me, that's what's meant by harmony. 


I think the reason why the Fe/Fi clash happens is that Fe gets stressed when people aren't on the same page, and Fi is fine with people being separate. So the problem is that either the Fe user is going to have to change, the Fi user is going to have to change, or they'll both have to change.

And this is where things get so frustrating between the two types. If the Fe user is the one changing, the Fi user finds it fake...they feel like the Fe user is only changing to "make people happy", and they find it disingenuous. If the Fe user tries to get the Fi user to change, then the Fi user feels like they're being controlled and being forced to be inauthentic. 


So that's where the clash becomes so hard, and it's why types using the other function can have so much trouble getting along. 


And I still don't know what the solution is. It works out well if the two people are already on the same page...then neither has to change anything and harmony is still present. It also works well if they have the option of staying away from each other. But if they're forced to co-exist and aren't on the same page, I don't know what the solution is.


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## AlphaLeonis (Jun 13, 2014)

QueenBella said:


> These two functions have been confusing me so much for a while now. I read about both functions a lot and I have decent knowledge and understanding about them, I just can't decide which one do I use the most because I can relate to both functions, so please help me out by clearing my confusion :frustrating:
> 
> I'm a person who doesn't like to express their feelings too much, especially negative feelings. I never express them even to the closest people to me. Which is an Fi user trait right? I also find it hard to explain my feelings to others even though I'm clearly aware of how I'm feeling, I just can't put them into words.
> 
> ...


*MBTI theory, as you've probably learned, is not really about traits*. They're about your *cognition*, and cognitive needs (what you seek to do). Cognition goes extremely fast. *You need to develop awareness of your decision making-process* to establish which combination of the judging function you're using, and what you're doing with them. 

That's what it's about, ultimately : decision-making. All.The.Time.
From trivial to life-time decisions, we're always making choices. Life is a succession of choices, every instant. One leading to the other. Like a domino thingy, if you will. 

Caring for people can happen for anyone. Let go of the stereotype according to which some types care more than others. We all care. We're all human. MBTI is just about ... how you see the world, and you're navigating it.

We both have the *Thinking* and the *Feeling* judging functions. We all make rational and irrational decisions, in a way.

Feeling judges things whether they're *good* or *bad*. Itis a really simple go-to definition, but it involves so much more ; what's good and bad, and how do you define good and bad ? Do you think "this is good because this is how the world considers this thing/person" (Fe ; Ti compensates by saying yes, okay, good and bad, but be critical about this, duh, look at it from a detached, objective way.) Do you think "this is good because I just know it is, deep down, that's what I believe" (and you may be aware of what other people think of it, but you trust yourself more. Your trust your opinion about whether a thing is good, or bad ; or ... rather, not just good or bad, but, like... how it is. (Scrmbl Fi is somehow strange to me, although I grasp the concept I have a hard time decribing it clearly).

Fi goes to personal feelings about a situation. (Do I like this ? Yes ? Then it's good.)
Fe goes outside : is this good, is this bad ? Not good, and bad as absolute truth (Ti hopefully backs up your judgement with objectivity in that case), but ... look at a person in the street. If you're judgemental, you're Fe. Fe (to me) is so judgemental if not well balanced with Ti. Fe just knows how a person will appear in a society, what that's person status, in relationship to others, how she might be perceived ; Fe is aware of those interactions.

Notions of Good and Bad are just the root of the judging factor. A person may wear eccentric clothing : what do you think of that person, and where does your judgement 'appreciation) comes from ? A consensus (formed by a given community) about wearing such and such clothing, or ... you... disliking it because you just don't like it, for yourself, but it's okay if that person likes it, you know, you respect that.

See the difference in the process here ?


Keep in mind that we all have preferences. Whether you use Fe or Fi tells you what you put first : your opinion about something, or the opinion of others (Fe cares about what other people think. It's not a very popular trait to have, and if you're trying to avoid admitting you're using Fe, then it's mostly because Fe have a bad social rep in the MBTI community.) Fi doesn't care that much about other people think. It likes what it likes, and it encourages you to like what you like. It doesn't really care if you become upset because they have an opinion ; however, I'm not saying Fi is super harsh, but let's not forget it's rooted in Te. Fi-Te dynamics are about *actualizing yourself and your values*. 

Thinking judges things whether they're correct or incorrect. (True/False).
Te looks for simple, straitforward, efficient answers.
This is a little more complex, but I've written about Ti already tonight, so I'm worn out 8). 
Your question was about Fi - Fe anyways 

Don't forget that if you use Fe, you also will use Ti. 
Try to figure out what you'll eat tonight. Try to figure out what you'll do this week. 
What do you do first ?

(! Info that may bias your judgement to come !)
My ISFP girlfriend (Fi-dom) prioritizes things and chooses what she will do according to what she wants to do. Simple and clear. When this judging function doesn't allow her to clarify and make the decision, she turns outwards, for strong logic (Te). I can tell she sees Te as too impartial and impersonal, but she sometimes needs it when he Fi isn't helping her figuring things out. (She turns to me, but well. I've got Ti, so my answers aren't really as clear-cut as she'd want to.)

So, what are you doing right now, to figure out your type ? If you're conflicted, it means your judging functions are fighting to have their own, and that your internal stored data isn't helping you seeing things clearly.
If you're Fi-Te, you're going to be conflicted about being authentic, but you want to be efficient. 
If you're Fe-Ti, you might be overly concerned by other's opinions of what personality is more likeable, what traits are more likeable.


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## QueenBella (Aug 27, 2015)

AlphaLeonis said:


> *MBTI theory, as you've probably learned, is not really about traits*. They're about your *cognition*, and cognitive needs (what you seek to do). Cognition goes extremely fast. *You need to develop awareness of your decision making-process* to establish which combination of the judging function you're using, and what you're doing with them.
> 
> That's what it's about, ultimately : decision-making. All.The.Time.
> From trivial to life-time decisions, we're always making choices. Life is a succession of choices, every instant. One leading to the other. Like a domino thingy, if you will.
> ...


I really don't know what to say but thank you very very much!! This was honestly SO helpful! ;-;


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