# Shaking



## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

tine said:


> citalopram for anxiety and I seemed to adjust to both so they stopped having any effect (I seem to get used to medication very fast). I'm not on any at the moment (I stopped about two months ago).


To be honest I haven't noticed any effect whatsoever from taking citalopram. I may as well be taking sugar pills for all the good it does me.


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

tine said:


> Thanks, I just seem to have issues working out what actually bothers me. I get stressed for no reason sometimes or have no symptoms of stress when I should be.


This is a sign that your stress has become chronic and un-managable. I had the same issue with my panic attacks they only ever happened when I was calm and relaxed which made no sense and was also a major reason why I was unable to accept it as an anxiety symptom for a long period of time. I'm just fine in a real crisis though, it's the downtime when I get hit.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

@tine perhaps a massage would help then. It would physically reduce stress and put you in a relaxed state similar to meditation. Yoga is another way to do that. 

I used to have a hard time crying but that was due to my repression. Crying makes you feel ill on purpose, it's supposed to be a storm but after the storm is calm. It's like exercising in the same way, where working out makes you sore or weak but after a few days you'll feel stronger.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

InSolitude said:


> To be honest I haven't noticed any effect whatsoever from taking citalopram. I may as well be taking sugar pills for all the good it does me.


Same here to be honest, it didn't help me very much at all and I came off it after a few months!



InSolitude said:


> This is a sign that your stress has become chronic and un-managable. I had the same issue with my panic attacks they only ever happened when I was calm and relaxed which made no sense and was also a major reason why I was unable to accept it as an anxiety symptom for a long period of time. I'm just fine in a real crisis though, it's the downtime when I get hit.


Hmm, why does it mean it's chronic? Because of not being able to identify triggers of stress/anxiety? Panic attacks are so horrible, I still get them on and off or get close to them.



Stelliferous said:


> @_tine_ perhaps a massage would help then. It would physically reduce stress and put you in a relaxed state similar to meditation. Yoga is another way to do that.
> 
> I used to have a hard time crying but that was due to my repression. Crying makes you feel ill on purpose, it's supposed to be a storm but after the storm is calm. It's like exercising in the same way, where working out makes you sore or weak but after a few days you'll feel stronger.


I tried out yoga/stretching, but was told not to do it much because of having hypermobility (Id just pop my joints out haha - apparently it's common in females in the UK). 
Ahh okay, I was worried about the sick feeling because people always said how crying makes you feel better and for me I feel sick and tired afterwards, need at least a day to recover from it and then don't seem less tense... The massage idea sounds good, my friend gave me one because I hurt my back and I did feel a lot better after (now to catch a masseuse...)


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

tine said:


> Same here to be honest, it didn't help me very much at all and I came off it after a few months!
> 
> 
> Hmm, why does it mean it's chronic? Because of not being able to identify triggers of stress/anxiety? Panic attacks are so horrible, I still get them on and off or get close to them.
> ...


Ah I have the reverse condition of hypermobility.  the worst that happens to me is cramps but I just take a break when that happens. Interesting to know that fact about UK women.. I don't think I know anyone personally with hypermobility. 

Also if you don't feel relieved from crying it's probably because it wasn't enough crying. It took me a couple years of crying weekly at one point to get rid of certain repressed stresses involving my father who left when I was 12. I just treated myself like it was no big deal and that was a mistake. Not having a father there is a big deal so it took a few years of depression to overcome all because of my repression.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

Stelliferous said:


> Ah I have the reverse condition of hypermobility.  the worst that happens to me is cramps but I just take a break when that happens. Interesting to know that fact about UK women.. I don't think I know anyone personally with hypermobility.
> 
> Also if you don't feel relieved from crying it's probably because it wasn't enough crying. It took me a couple years of crying weekly at one point to get rid of certain repressed stresses involving my father who left when I was 12. I just treated myself like it was no big deal and that was a mistake. Not having a father there is a big deal so it took a few years of depression to overcome all because of my repression.


I havent heard of that condition, but sounds very annoying!

Sorry about your dad, I had depression hit very hard after mine died when I was 18 - Im glad you managed to work your way out of it and feel better now! I kind of pretended nothing had changed for a while and only cried a bit, so I guess my repression kept going? I usually dont cry at all, but if I do its for a few seconds (once or twice a year I'll cry for a few minutes and feel terrible after though).


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

tine said:


> I havent heard of that condition, but sounds very annoying!
> 
> 
> Sorry about your dad, I had depression hit very hard after mine died when I was 18 - Im glad you managed to work your way out of it and feel better now! I kind of pretended nothing had changed for a while and only cried a bit, so I guess my repression kept going? I usually dont cry at all, but if I do its for a few seconds (once or twice a year I'll cry for a few minutes and feel terrible after though).


My "condition" is unstretched noob. Lol. 


I used to cry like twice a year too! Recently though I've been in contact with people who have great dads or rather just great dads. It really shined a light on everything I missed out on. It all awakened those deeper feelings.

Im sorry about your dad too.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

Stelliferous said:


> My "condition" is unstretched noob. Lol.
> 
> 
> I used to cry like twice a year too! Recently though I've been in contact with people who have great dads or rather just great dads. It really shined a light on everything I missed out on. It all awakened those deeper feelings.
> ...


Ohhh! I tend to go between being really stretchy and really inflexible, but my joints get hurt if I do too much stretching (I can touch the floor without my knees bent though).
I guess it's good that it made you realise it did affect you? It's hard to accept things bother you, Ive found anyway - I hate admitting there's a problem (I had anorexia for several years and only admitted there was a problem after seeing a show on TV about the illness that said about a girl dying in her sleep from organ failure and it freaked me out a lot).
Aw thanks, it's been a little while since then, but I still miss him - I guess thats the norm though?


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## VinnieBob (Mar 24, 2014)

i did in my early 40's
stopped several years ago
docs never did diagnose it


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

tine said:


> Hmm, why does it mean it's chronic? Because of not being able to identify triggers of stress/anxiety? Panic attacks are so horrible, I still get them on and off or get close to them.


It goes chronic when you become normalised to the feelings of stress so that you no longer notice them. After this last month when I thought back and examined my life and all the little bits of information my body was giving me and I was thinking that was normal, it all made sense. I've been living with very high stress levels for about 3yrs now. Of course consciously I knew I felt stressed but I was really only thinking I was stressed periodically when the reality was I was stressed to a high degree every single day but unless major alarm bells were ringing (like breaking down in tears) I told myself I wasn't stressed at all. Yet my habitual thought patterns, my actions (certain OCD behaviours, disaster thinking, pacing in order to wind down at the end of a day, chronic fatigue levels that meant I was operating on 4hrs sleep per day on average) all pointed to being stressed out day in and day out. 

The panic attacks are just my body going......Screw this! You're not reading the signs here. We're going to make you stop, right now! Here pay attention to this.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

InSolitude said:


> It goes chronic when you become normalised to the feelings of stress so that you no longer notice them. After this last month when I thought back and examined my life and all the little bits of information my body was giving me and I was thinking that was normal, it all made sense. I've been living with very high stress levels for about 3yrs now. Of course consciously I knew I felt stressed but I was really only thinking I was stressed periodically when the reality was I was stressed to a high degree every single day but unless major alarm bells were ringing (like breaking down in tears) I told myself I wasn't stressed at all. Yet my habitual thought patterns, my actions (certain OCD behaviours, disaster thinking, pacing in order to wind down at the end of a day, chronic fatigue levels that meant I was operating on 4hrs sleep per day on average) all pointed to being stressed out day in and day out.
> 
> The panic attacks are just my body going......Screw this! You're not reading the signs here. We're going to make you stop, right now! Here pay attention to this.


That makes sense. I do have OCD tendencies and wont stand still if I'm waiting for people (I tend to walk round the block so I'm not waiting in one place, unless I have music playing or a book with me so I can kind of escape from the situation). 
With disaster thinking, is that thinking about how everything could go wrong if you did something or said something and so never actually acting?
With sleep, I either sleep very little (3-6 hours) or way too much (10-12 hours) and cant seem to get a nice 7-8hour pattern going...


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

Yeah that's disaster thinking the constant worst case scenario in your head that you're convinced is going to play out. Can sometimes border on paranoia. I don't have a problem acting but I would often then catastrophise whatever action I had taken. Very regularly to stupid levels where it lost all connection to reality. 

I have trouble with the sleeping as well. But at this stage I'm not entirely convinced it isn't lifestyle factors (inadequate exercise, dietary etc) enough to attribute it either to anxiety or just not having a big need for sleep. But yeah I was engaged in full time avoidance and denial of my feelings and didn't even know it. Luckily my therapy for the anxiety is now teaching me to recognise when I become avoidant and to learn to stop and face it instead so it gets resolved instead of building.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

InSolitude said:


> Yeah that's disaster thinking the constant worst case scenario in your head that you're convinced is going to play out. Can sometimes border on paranoia. I don't have a problem acting but I would often then catastrophise whatever action I had taken. Very regularly to stupid levels where it lost all connection to reality.
> 
> I have trouble with the sleeping as well. But at this stage I'm not entirely convinced it isn't lifestyle factors (inadequate exercise, dietary etc) enough to attribute it either to anxiety or just not having a big need for sleep. But yeah I was engaged in full time avoidance and denial of my feelings and didn't even know it. Luckily my therapy for the anxiety is now teaching me to recognise when I become avoidant and to learn to stop and face it instead so it gets resolved instead of building.


I used to have bad paranoia, but luckily that's gone now! I do tend to overthink everything though - It's to the point it stops me acting because I wont take the risks.
How have you managed to identify that due to therapy?


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

tine said:


> I used to have bad paranoia, but luckily that's gone now! I do tend to overthink everything though - It's to the point it stops me acting because I wont take the risks.
> How have you managed to identify that due to therapy?


Because my current symptoms are manifesting as phobia, I have to specifically put myself in uncomfortable situations and just experience it until the discomfort leaves. It was hard at first because I kept trying to zone out, distract and not experience the discomfort. It was only then that I realised how much of an unconscious habit that was.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

InSolitude said:


> Because my current symptoms are manifesting as phobia, I have to specifically put myself in uncomfortable situations and just experience it until the discomfort leaves. It was hard at first because I kept trying to zone out, distract and not experience the discomfort. It was only then that I realised how much of an unconscious habit that was.


Oh kind of exposure therapy?
I'm very bad at that sort of stuff, because I just cant make my mind stay in the moment - it just escapes and wanders away...


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

tine said:


> Oh kind of exposure therapy?
> I'm very bad at that sort of stuff, because I just cant make my mind stay in the moment - it just escapes and wanders away...


You might want to pick up The Happiness Trap, it explains very clearly why habitual avoidance and zoning out is likely to result in psychological pressures and unpleasant outcomes. Distraction can be a useful tool used in the right moment, but when it becomes a way of life things get difficult.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

InSolitude said:


> You might want to pick up The Happiness Trap, it explains very clearly why habitual avoidance and zoning out is likely to result in psychological pressures and unpleasant outcomes. Distraction can be a useful tool used in the right moment, but when it becomes a way of life things get difficult.


I should have a look for it! I find that it's something that happens most with human stressors, whereas life stressors cause me to dwell on them...


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

tine said:


> I should have a look for it! I find that it's something that happens most with human stressors, whereas life stressors cause me to dwell on them...


There's techniques for dealing with both types of stressors. To be honest I've left this book on the shelf about 50 times without ever opening it or buying it. It seemed like some kind of new age, motivational crap of the variety that has not helped me in the past. But actually it's a psychology workbook with specific exercises that seem more realistic than the usual _think positive! _mantra.I've experienced severe cognitive dissonance with a lot of self-help stuff in the past because it failed the utility test and did not help me move forward. I was quite surprised by this title because it does address a lot of the issues I had with the self-help movement in a very practical way. 

But I warn you, it's not a sit back and easy read kind of book. You have to work through it step by step and the exercises while not hard, do require commitment to get through and a lot of personal honesty. A hell of a lot cheaper than therapy and just as valuable.


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## Tad Cooper (Apr 10, 2010)

InSolitude said:


> There's techniques for dealing with both types of stressors. To be honest I've left this book on the shelf about 50 times without ever opening it or buying it. It seemed like some kind of new age, motivational crap of the variety that has not helped me in the past. But actually it's a psychology workbook with specific exercises that seem more realistic than the usual _think positive! _mantra.I've experienced severe cognitive dissonance with a lot of self-help stuff in the past because it failed the utility test and did not help me move forward. I was quite surprised by this title because it does address a lot of the issues I had with the self-help movement in a very practical way.
> 
> But I warn you, it's not a sit back and easy read kind of book. You have to work through it step by step and the exercises while not hard, do require commitment to get through and a lot of personal honesty. A hell of a lot cheaper than therapy and just as valuable.


That's good, it's nice when a book is actually useful like that!
I find being honest with myself hard because I was very lost from myself for years (PTSD etc) so cant identify myself from who I project myself as...


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

tine said:


> That's good, it's nice when a book is actually useful like that!
> I find being honest with myself hard because I was very lost from myself for years (PTSD etc) so cant identify myself from who I project myself as...


I find myself just wanting to hug you.


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