# Would you rather have a serious mental illness + high iQ or be average intelligence



## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

Couldn't say it all concisely in the topic title.

Would you rather have a high intelligence along with a serious mental illness. Or would you rather have average intelligence and no serious mental illness?


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## Quernus (Dec 8, 2011)

Well. Depends on what we mean by severe mental ilness. I've seen and worked with many people who have even more severe mental illness than I have. That's changed my perspective a bit.

It's a tough call. In the past I would have always chosen smart while ill. I believe most of my good qualities are related to my types of intelligence, as well as most of the good things I do get out of life (ability to perceive things a certain way, ability to learn a certain way, ability to experience a certain type of depth). Not to say that a certain intelligence is required to have these things, but it's relevant to my own personal development and aptitudes. 

At this point I think I might opt for "average intelligence" without mental illness. It's difficult to think about being "average" but it's not like I'm intelligent in every single way, as there are some ways in which I'm rather incompetent. Maybe if my brain chemistry and mind structure changed then I'd learn to derive meaning differently, especially I could go through life with less inhibition and misery related to mental illness. It's getting to the point I'd might as well opt to give up IQ points along with mental illness, in a life or death kind of way.

Also, this is based on my belief that I will never be mentally well. It's something I've recently had to acknowledge. There may be worse times and better times, and I can aim to make things "manageable" as opposed to "good", but it's tough to swallow that. If I felt I could actually recover... I don't know. 

One way to look at it --- Under no circumstance would I opt to increase my IQ, if it meant increasing my mental illnesses.


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## Ausserirdische (May 2, 2015)

Well, I barely care about this Q.I. thing anyway, so I don't see any point in having something like schizophrenia or so just to be smart. If it was a moderate mental disorder though, then it would be a different story.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

I'm already the first. Except not really for the _serious_ part.


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## Cthulhu And Coffee (Mar 8, 2012)

Not that I know all that much about this but I said average intelligence/no serious mental illness. This is because I'm lazy and I feel like I'd have to do more day-to-day if I had a serious mental illness in terms of routine. Plus, I'm pretty happy with the IQ I've got. Maybe I'm just used to it.


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## He's a Superhero! (May 1, 2013)

I'm betting anyone who has a serious mental illness will be choosing average intelligence over the alternative.


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

Nobody wants to have a _serious_ any type of illness.

That's like asking if you'd rather cut off one of your legs and gain a sports car or have both your legs intact but have no car.


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## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

Miharu said:


> That's like asking if you'd rather cut off one of your legs and gain a sports car or have both your legs intact but have no car.


Nope. That's merely your interpretation of the question and the effects of having a serious mental illness. Having a serious mental illness does not mean your high IQ is useless. Many people who have had high IQ and serious mental illnesses have contributed to society. Having high IQ is correlated with a higher chance of having a serious mental illness. That's why this question is relevant, because many people wish to have a higher IQ but don't want the possible side effects of it. It's more like asking would you rather have a high paying job that requires a tremendous amount of hours worked (lets saying >60/week), or an average paying job that requires an average amount of hours worked (40/week).


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

bluefox91 said:


> Nope. That's merely your interpretation of the question and the effects of having a serious mental illness. Having a serious mental illness does not mean your high IQ is useless. Many people who have had high IQ and serious mental illnesses have contributed to society. Having high IQ is correlated with a higher chance of having a serious mental illness. That's why this question is relevant, because many people wish to have a higher IQ but don't want the possible side effects of it. It's more like asking would you rather have a high paying job that requires a tremendous amount of hours worked (lets saying >60/week), or an average paying job that requires an average amount of hours worked (40/week).


Yes, that is me interpreting it my own way. Losing one leg doesn't mean you're not going places, you have your sports car for that. People with both legs but have no car can always take the train. Many people wish to have a sports car, but don't want to lose a leg. 

So I say, I'd rather have both my legs because a sports car is not the only way for me to go where I want to go.


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## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

Miharu said:


> Yes, that is me interpreting it my own way. Losing one leg doesn't mean you're not going places, you have your sports car for that. People with both legs but have no car can always take the train. Many people wish to have a sports car, but don't want to lose a leg.
> 
> So I say, I'd rather have both my legs because a sports car is not the only way for me to go where I want to go.


Oh right - you're talking about a sports car that is automatic and not manual, my apologies.


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

bluefox91 said:


> Oh right - you're talking about a sports car that is automatic and not manual, my apologies.


A sports car that doesn't only travel one route.


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## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

Miharu said:


> A sports car that doesn't only travel one route.


I mean that my immediate impression was that you were saying that you wouldn't be able to travel with the sports car due to it being manual (needing the clutch) - essentially making it useless. But I misinterpreted.

But yes your analogy is good, people without sports cars can take trains or other forms of travel to get where they want.


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## fuliajulia (Jun 29, 2013)

Ah yes, this is already me. I mean, my brain can get to be a pretty dismal place, but if I were to substantially change it I would stop being me, the weirdo I am. Maybe I'm just being one of those people with mental illness who are afraid of getting better, but I feel like I would be choosing blindness and not caring over appreciating the world in the intense way I experience it...


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## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

therandomsciencegirl said:


> Ah yes, this is already me. I mean, my brain can get to be a pretty dismal place, but if I were to substantially change it I would stop being me, the weirdo I am. Maybe I'm just being one of those people with mental illness who are afraid of getting better, but I feel like I would be choosing blindness and not caring over appreciating the world in the intense way I experience it...


You put up a good point that wasn't really present before you posted that. Many people actually wish to have SOME of the symptoms of serious mental illness, they just don't know that what they want is a symptom. For example, hypomania can exhibit itself as a favorable trait. People may react saying "wow I wish I could think on my feet as fast as that", or "I wish I could be as charming"... etc. I'm also aware of people who do wish to have mild forms of serious mental illness because it would make them 'special', or see the world in a different way. I also believe on the other hand there's plenty of people with mental illness who wish to not have the mental illness, but would rather not see the world like an average person.

The point being - be careful what you wish for, and everything has trade-offs. Although, I'm a bit surprised how low the amount of people are that are wishing for the high IQ + mental illness. For example, in Argentina psychiatry is a bragging right. People brag about going to their shrink, because to that culture it's a sign of being special or enigmatic - a good thing to them. I get a similar cultural vibe in a place like this...which is why the poll results are a bit puzzling.


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

bluefox91 said:


> I mean that my immediate impression was that you were saying that you wouldn't be able to travel with the sports car due to it being manual (needing the clutch) - essentially making it useless. But I misinterpreted.
> 
> But yes your analogy is good, people without sports cars can take trains or other forms of travel to get where they want.


And here I was wondering what was unclear. Not being able to travel with the sports car due to it being manual did not cross my mind at all. I thought you were jabbing at the fact that females are thought to just be able to drive an automatic car.

Hm. Interesting. We both misinterpreted in different ways. 

And I'm glad you understood the analogy. In simpler terms, I don't think I'd want that High IQ if I'd have a serious mental illness in exchange. I'm perfectly capable of making my own ways and going places without that. What even is IQ? I don't believe in that crap. Inaccurate. I personally don't think it reflects true intelligence.

Well, that's it.


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## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

Miharu said:


> And here I was wondering what was unclear. Not being able to travel with the sports car due to it being manual did not cross my mind at all. I thought you were jabbing at the fact that females are thought to just be able to drive an automatic car.
> 
> Hm. Interesting. We both misinterpreted in different ways.
> 
> ...


Hehe good points. Also your view is one I can't disagree with. I won't say what my view is because I'm the poll creator . But yea about the misunderstanding - I just woke up so sometimes I make leaps and bounds without checking everything along the way.


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

bluefox91 said:


> Hehe good points. Also your view is one I can't disagree with. I won't say what my view is because I'm the poll creator . But yea about the misunderstanding - I just woke up so sometimes I make leaps and bounds without checking everything along the way.


You put up a pretty decent ...how should we call it? Anyway, what I'm trying to get at is - shame, I was interested in what you'd pick.


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## bluefox91 (Oct 8, 2015)

Miharu said:


> You put up a pretty decent ...how should we call it? Anyway, what I'm trying to get at is - shame, I was interested in what you'd pick.


Okay I'll say only because. This question is hard - of course I'd ask such a difficult question to myself. I mean there's 4 possibilities right. The first two are you have average intelligence. You have a good life or a bad life. The good life I imagine would involve being average and living a average life which is pretty much what most people do. Having happiness based on achieving your personal values and the values of your society. I don't want to say ignorance is bliss, but most average people with a family and job and things are probably pretty happy. The other notable possibility is that you are an average person but you're unhappy. Maybe you have a bad job and a family in a bad neighborhood without much hope. So those are the two generic good and bad. On to the other two options. Having high IQ + mental illness. The generic good would be that you're functional. Even this has many options, but for the sake of argument I'll say you go down the good path - in which you become educated and have a high paying job. Well the good is that you probably see the world in a effective way. You have a good paying job, and you may have a decent amount of influence over your environment. The bad option is that you go from mental hospital to mental hospital, and may even become homeless.

These are merely my guesses about what the most common routes for each type would be. And there's many other possible ones. I'd have to go with being average intelligence. I'd prefer the functional high IQ + mental illness person, but the chances of being that are less likely than going down the bad route. So I'll take my chances with the possibility of living in a bad neighborhood with my children possibly turning into gangsters and having to deal with all the other problems that effect a large amount of average people in America (note many of the people here probably don't deal with that - because many of the people on Perc, let alone the internet, come from upper-middle class families - where the IQ is above average - on average).


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## Flaming Bassoon (Feb 15, 2013)

I have a moderate mental disorder (anxiety/depression) and moderately high intelligence (115 maybe?), so I'm cool with that.


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

Flaming Bassoon said:


> I have a moderate mental disorder (anxiety/depression) and moderately high intelligence (115 maybe?), so I'm cool with that.


115 maybe?


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## Flaming Bassoon (Feb 15, 2013)

Miharu said:


> 115 maybe?


I've never taken a legitimate IQ test, so that's my estimation.


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## AdroElectro (Oct 28, 2014)

I would say I already have a moderately high IQ with moderate mental illness. I would choose the higher IQ with serious mental illness, and here's why -

I don't believe humans can ever achieve complete contentment. Even your most average and mundane John Doe will have SOMETHING to complain about, something he "struggles" with. However if you have a serious mental illness then your personal struggle is already established and clearly defined. In my opinion a high IQ has enough potential to change the world, potential which balances out or even outweighs that of the serious mental illness.


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## Danse Macabre (Oct 30, 2009)

AdroElectro said:


> In my opinion a high IQ has enough potential to change the world, potential which balances out or even outweighs that of the serious mental illness.


I don't think so. I have a pretty high IQ and I had a serious mental illness for years and I was paralysed by it. Nothing outweighs serious mental illness. I've spent 18 months in psych wards and seen it for myself, it doesn't matter how rich, attractive, intelligent, kind, popular you are.... if you have a serious mental illness, you're totally screwed.


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## Exquisitor (Sep 15, 2015)

If we're talking _statistically_ average intelligence, I'll take the serious mental illness. Having experienced a debilitating psychotic episode in the past, I think I could handle having to go through more (assuming I couldn't completely manage it through medication etc.) as long as I could arrange my life and resources accordingly.


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## Miharu (Apr 1, 2015)

Flaming Bassoon said:


> I've never taken a legitimate IQ test, so that's my estimation.


Sounds legit.


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## NewYorkEagle (Apr 12, 2015)

I would rather have average intelligence than having a serious mental illness, like schizophrenia or something like that. Who seriously wants to have a mental illness where you freak out of nowhere and people think that you're crazy? Especially when they lock up a lot of mentally ill people during the 20th century. It's not really good. As an autistic, at least my disability doesn't make me insane compared to the other mental illnesses that people mention a lot.


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## AdroElectro (Oct 28, 2014)

Danse Macabre said:


> I don't think so. I have a pretty high IQ and I had a serious mental illness for years and I was paralysed by it. Nothing outweighs serious mental illness. I've spent 18 months in psych wards and seen it for myself, it doesn't matter how rich, attractive, intelligent, kind, popular you are.... if you have a serious mental illness, you're totally screwed.


You phrased all of that in past tense. Let's say you live to the age of 80, you've now got the next 57 years of life sane with a high IQ. Sounds like a fair tradeoff.


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## charlie.elliot (Jan 22, 2014)

This would be a much harder question to answer if it was _low_ intelligence vs. high intelligence/ serious mental illness. If you're talking about average intelligence vs serious mental illness, there's no question. Serious mental illness is absolutely hell. But low intelligence seems like its own kind of hell (at least if its low but high enough to understand things).


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## Act of Sensation (Apr 19, 2010)

.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

I'd go with average intelligence. The knowledge would still be at your disposable. I don't think you need to have an exceptionally high IQ to be an intellectual, have well formed opinions on different topics, and be successful in your career/schoolwork. Its all about how and where you apply yourself. I don't think a high IQ is worth the struggles that a serious mental illness would make you go through.


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## dragthewaters (Feb 9, 2013)

I HAVE a serious mental illness and high intelligence. 0/10 would not recommend.


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## Hei (Jul 8, 2014)

I have experienced recurrent depression, it is rather horrible to live with. And for me I think that would be the most "liveable" on a list of severe mental illnesses. I think I would rather be "average," whatever that is.


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## RottenAppleCore (Nov 12, 2015)

So, either a car with a great engine and bad wheels or a car with an average engine and wheels. Well, even if you're just an average car, you can still make insights and have well-developed opinions backed by robust reasoning on a variety of topics and enter the race, even if you don't finish first. If you're a car with a fantastic engine but bad wheels, you may come up with revolutionary visions and insights, but having rusty wheels will hold you back from these ever actually entering the competition that would win the race. So, I would choose the average, at least I can enter the competition, even if I'm not the alpha dog in the end.


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## Mr. Demiurge (Jun 18, 2014)

Depends a lot on the mental illness. If it's so serious that I can't even function in society, then I'm not sure how much consolation the high IQ would be.


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## Act of Sensation (Apr 19, 2010)

.


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## Danse Macabre (Oct 30, 2009)

AdroElectro said:


> You phrased all of that in past tense. Let's say you live to the age of 80, you've now got the next 57 years of life sane with a high IQ. Sounds like a fair tradeoff.


That's a great point and I would say you've changed my mind if I hadn't hurt so many people by being so sick. I'm not sure what I'd choose now.


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## AdroElectro (Oct 28, 2014)

Danse Macabre said:


> That's a great point and I would say you've changed my mind if I hadn't hurt so many people by being so sick. I'm not sure what I'd choose now.


Choose to help a greater number of people than you have hurt. It is true though that option 1, a sane person with an average IQ would also be able to help people, and they would not be starting off with a deficit of hurt people that you are currently starting off with. So option 2 is only worth it if you are able to use the high IQ to exceed the helping capabilities of option 1 while ALSO overcoming the initial hurt deficit.

For some reason this whole question brings to mind Van Gogh. A great man, but a tortured soul. To me it is totally worth it, but I'll admit that is my type 4 talking. I find the idea of average to be... disagreeable.


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