# INTx... am I a P or a J?



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

Amenamy said:


> You're focusing too much on stereotypes and descriptions. _Why _do you relate to INTJs? What particularly makes you say, "this is me"?
> 
> I have serious doubts about you being an INTJ, although it's possible since you're 14 and most likely not very cognitively developed yet.



First off, I can relate to 'the INTJs know what they know, but also what they don't know'. They are perfectionists, which I am incredibly. To INTJs, people that are 'slacking' lose an INTJ's respect, which is how I see the world. 'INTJs do not grasp social rituals' This girl feels the same way! I'm the complete opposite of a normal teenager. 'INTJs tend to want people to make sense'= exactly me. Basically, if you were to read this : INTJ Profile it's kinda my autobiography. You know that sense of 'elation' you feel when you finally understand something? Well, after taking the MBTI test for the first time, and getting INTJ and reading that profile thing, that's what I felt. I finally understood why people didn't get me; because I wasn't the norm.

Oh, and here's a conversation I had on an INTJ group on Facebook (the attachment)


----------



## Ellis Bell (Mar 16, 2012)

Amenamy said:


> You're focusing too much on stereotypes and descriptions. _Why _do you relate to INTJs? What particularly makes you say, "this is me"?
> 
> I have serious doubts about you being an INTJ, although it's possible since you're 14 and most likely not very cognitively developed yet.


I'm going to second/reinforce this. It may be that you're trying to jump into this too fast, too soon.


----------



## Teybo (Sep 25, 2012)

At 14, it's much less important to "know" your "type" than it is to just understand that there is something called Thinking, something called Feeling, something called Intuition, and something called Sensing. Actually, I would argue that at any age, understanding that there are these different viewpoints on life will get you further than pinning down a particular 4-letter code for yourself. It's great that your interested in finding out your type, but take it from an older person who has been there, done that: both your personal benefit and your quest to find the answer will be better served by understanding that other people might have perfectly valid points of view that have nothing in common with your own. If you can really truly, with all your heart and soul, (and brain and mind and whatever for you Thinkers:wink understand that, then you are on your way to making happy connections with people, doing what truly pleases you, and living a fulfilling life. And like a plant in the sun, your own understanding of your personal psychological preferences is going to shift a little, turn a little, grow a little, and become more distinct and mature with time.

Don't rush it. Especially not with so many people on the internet full of bad ideas. Just know that there are different ways of viewing life, and try to be open to the idea that the way you see things might not make sense to other people, and that's not any one's fault. And sometimes, things will click, and it might be magic, but it might just be that you are speaking the same "language".


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

Teybo said:


> Don't rush it. Especially not with so many people on the internet full of bad ideas. Just know that there are different ways of viewing life, and try to be open to the idea that the way you see things might not make sense to other people, and that's not any one's fault. And sometimes, things will click, and it might be magic, but it might just be that you are speaking the same "language".


That's what happened to me on an INTJ group on Facebook; I found my place. I love the group, since I can be myself, and everyone is themselves, and we're all happy INTJs because we can finally be ourselves. Everything they do, I do, and vice versa. We're so much alike. We speak the same ''language''. I have finally found my place!

(Although, I can see that I have some INTPness in me as some of you pointed out, but I think I can judge myself better and I know, in my heart, that I'm an INTJ.


----------



## irregularQuestioner (Oct 25, 2012)

I'm sorry, but if you are so sure, why did you start the thread in the first place? It is as if you had started the thread to affirm that are an INTJ without even considering what the people you asked said. Sincerely, I never payed much attention to the Types "profiles" because they are full of stereotypes and just confuse you. The same thing with the 4 letters system, one letter difference can change ALL your cognitive functions, like in the case in question, INTP and INTJ. When I was sure that I was an INTP, I decided to start reading descriptions, and I have a lot in common with both, and malice is something both have, once I came home "smiling"(even though my smiles are in 99% of the time smirks) and my mother asked me who had been the victim. I have a preference to hang out with INTJ's and ISTP's, because they make me actually do stuff that I don't want, and my INTJ friend didn't lose the respect she had to me because I slacked, we actually talked about non school related topic's, like the Chernobyl Disaster or Higgs Boson. Being an INTJ is way more then being a complete idiot with God Complex, at least not all the time.


----------



## NighTi (Jan 1, 2013)

@ccath17c, you viewed some very sound advice from @Amenamy, @Teybo, @irregularQuestioner and @Ellis Bell. With respect, did you read them with an open mind?


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

@NighTi Absolutely, but if you've every talked or met with any INTJs, we're very... to say the least... stubborn? Anyways, I realized I posted this thread because a part of me, first, didn't want to be an INTP because some people don't like us INTJs on here, and also because INTPs have the highest IQ average. As someone pointed out on the Facebook INTJ group, many of us aren't a SET type. We all have a little E, a little S, a little F and a little P in us... 

I've always tested as an INTJ on tests (the first time I took it, I tested as INTJ), for example, one of my friends, when she first did the test, got ENTP. Afterwards, since she wanted to be an INTJ, she redid the test and arranged for her answers to give her INTJ. But, she isn't an INTJ AT ALL. She's got a lot of P, and a lot of E in her (she's honestly one of the most Extroverted person I've ever met...), and she's a borderline F-T. 

All I'm saying is that I'd love to be an INTP, and I'm an INTJ... but that doesn't mean I don't have a little INTP in me. I know myself better than other people, and I know I'm almost 100% INTJ (maybe like 90%)


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

irregularQuestioner said:


> I'm sorry, but if you are so sure, why did you start the thread in the first place? It is as if you had started the thread to affirm that are an INTJ without even considering what the people you asked said. Sincerely, I never payed much attention to the Types "profiles" because they are full of stereotypes and just confuse you. The same thing with the 4 letters system, one letter difference can change ALL your cognitive functions, like in the case in question, INTP and INTJ. When I was sure that I was an INTP, I decided to start reading descriptions, and I have a lot in common with both, and malice is something both have, once I came home "smiling"(even though my smiles are in 99% of the time smirks) and my mother asked me who had been the victim. I have a preference to hang out with INTJ's and ISTP's, because they make me actually do stuff that I don't want, and my INTJ friend didn't lose the respect she had to me because I slacked, we actually talked about non school related topic's, like the Chernobyl Disaster or Higgs Boson. Being an INTJ is way more then being a complete idiot with God Complex, at least not all the time.


Because, as I stated in my last comment, a part of me wanted to be an INTP, not an INTJ. And also because I had a little doubt in the back of my head.


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

Also, when I tried going to the INTP place on PerC, I couldn't relate to almost everything! I'd say 5% of what people said about INTP applied to me, whilst for INTJs, and I'd say 90% (or more) applies to me.


----------



## NighTi (Jan 1, 2013)

@ccath17c , you provide ample evidence to support your claim of stubbornness. You convinced me, but being stubborn proves you're an INTJ no more than having a tounge proves you're an aardvark.

You're clearly not going to listen today, but I hope you remember when you are a little older. You have yet to scratch the surface of the MBTI. Your posts so far show only a superficial understanding. You may very well be an INTJ. I don't know but am pretty sure that you don't either. Maybe that will bother you enough to ask more questions. Maybe you'll spend the next 20 years wearing a label that you don't understand. Either way, I wish you peace.


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

After talking to INTPs, I've concluded that I'm an INTP with a strong Te... although I'm not entirely sure....


----------



## soppixo (Jun 29, 2011)

ccath17c said:


> After talking to INTPs, I've concluded that I'm an INTP with a strong Te... although I'm not entirely sure....


As everyone has been telling you, learn the functions before typing yourself.

An INTP would find Te similar enough to Ti to be understood but too alien to truly like/develop properly. You could have misidentified Ti manifesting through Ne/Fe as "Te" or you may have been led astray by your cordial interactions with other INTJs and begun taking on / mimicking their characteristics unconsciously. 

...Plus I'm pretty sure you're still 14, so please do some growing up before fixating on a type. Rather than caring so much about MBTI, learn more about the Jungian Functions instead, because the MBTI has a lot of problems in itself that easily lends to mistyping and misunderstandings especially when you lack the crucial understanding of the Jungian Functions it was built on.

Please learn what being a Ti-dom means, and please also learn what being a Ni-dom means. Please do some serious self-reflection and recognize whether Fe or Se is your achilles heel. Please stop buying into stereotypes and relying on others to do the hard work for you- by judging yourself based on surface mannerisms rather than an in-depth reflection of your strengths and weaknesses, and by pushing away advice / reasonings without doing the work to verify the actual relevance and usefulness of the information beyond your own subjective assumptions.


----------



## Watch Key Phone (Mar 29, 2013)

ccath17c said:


> First off, I can relate to 'the INTJs know what they know, but also what they don't know'. They are perfectionists, which I am incredibly. To INTJs, people that are 'slacking' lose an INTJ's respect, which is how I see the world. 'INTJs do not grasp social rituals' This girl feels the same way! I'm the complete opposite of a normal teenager. 'INTJs tend to want people to make sense'= exactly me. Basically, if you were to read this : INTJ Profile it's kinda my autobiography. You know that sense of 'elation' you feel when you finally understand something? Well, after taking the MBTI test for the first time, and getting INTJ and reading that profile thing, that's what I felt. I finally understood why people didn't get me; because I wasn't the norm.
> 
> Oh, and here's a conversation I had on an INTJ group on Facebook (the attachment)
> View attachment 68970


All of those stereotypes are pretty much associated with NTs in general, not INTJs specifically. Being stubborn, enjoying debate, the desire to repress emotions. All of those are simply characteristics of people with top-two thinking functions and poorly-developed feeling functions. Some of them would even apply to INTPs more than INTJs. For example, the thing about social rituals. INTPs have inferior Fe - that means it's their absolute weak spot and something they are likely to struggle with for most of their life.

It's also worth noting that the letter dichotomies are really not an accurate way to determine your functions. An IxxP will have an introverted *judging *function as their primary. That means they're likely to come across a lot more like a 'judger' than an ExxP. I thought I was INTJ for a long time, because I knew I was INTx, and I fitted the description of 'judger' much better than 'perceiver' - organised, plans ahead, decisive, that kind of thing. But when I learnt about the functions I realised those were all just manifestations of Ti being projected outwardly through Ne (and Fe to a lesser extent).

In general, I'd say the best way to determine your type is to consider your primary function first and foremost. Especially at your age when your other functions probably aren't very developed - it should be easy to tell between your primary function and your others. So, find some descriptions of Ti and Ni. Find some people talking about how they manifest and also how they contrast with the inferior function (Fe or Se respectively). Try to be as open-minded as you can. There really is no superior type. I wanted to be INTJ for a while because I'd heard a lot of stereotypes about them being geniuses, antisocial loners who didn't need approval from others. But that's not really true. Everyone has emotions and attachments, different types simply demonstrate them differently. Try not to let your assumptions cloud your judgement about your true type. In the end, you'll feel much better if you're comfortable identifying as your accurate type, than if you keep trying to fit yourself into something which isn't right, but which you believe to be superior.


----------



## NighTi (Jan 1, 2013)

@ccath17c, you're trying to ride your bicycle to the moon. Pedaling harder won't get you there. I'm afraid you won't realize this until you collapse with exhaustion.

You don't need to push harder. You need a different vehicle.


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

NighTi said:


> @_ccath17c_, you're trying to ride your bicycle to the moon. Pedaling harder won't get you there. I'm afraid you won't realize this until you collapse with exhaustion.
> 
> You don't need to push harder. You need a different vehicle.


What are you trying to say by that? Confused...


Also, I'm not trying to box myself to a type, I'm just curious about it, and I like to talk to people that are similar to me. Because I'm seen as weird by most of my peers.


----------



## NighTi (Jan 1, 2013)

ccath17c said:


> What are you trying to say by that? Confused...


I'm pleasantly surprised to see you write that. Maybe we can make some progress after all.

Since I caught your attention, I might as well save time by being blunt. The model can give you access to a whole lot of power, but you're trapped in a way of thinking which prevents you from reaching it. @_Watch Key Phone_, @_soppixo_, @_Teybo_, @_Amenamy_, @_irregularQuestioner_, @_Ellis Bell_, and I have all been trying to say the same thing, but it hasn't gotten through until now. 

If you want to escape from the trap, forget everything that you think you know about the MBTI. Better yet, assume that everything you think you know is wrong. That's not far from the truth anyway. Then re-read the other posts in this thread. Others have already pointed you in the right direction, but you heard only gibberish because you were stuck in the trap.

Please feel free to ask more questions, but you have to clear your mind of the gunk that is holding you back.

I truly hope this helps. I would be thrilled to see you unleash the power.


----------



## soppixo (Jun 29, 2011)

ccath17c said:


> What are you trying to say by that? Confused...
> 
> 
> Also, I'm not trying to box myself to a type, I'm just curious about it, and I like to talk to people that are similar to me. Because I'm seen as weird by most of my peers.


He is saying that whatever method you're using to determine your type isn't working. And that you should probably try another option.

The fact that you want so badly to find a niche group to fit into, speaks to me of a desire to properly define yourself and your identity in this world. In other words, you want to know what you are so you can find your natural habitat and live in happiness etc. Perhaps you should concentrate more on your reasons and motivations for wanting to find this feeling of belonging- do you do it because you want to understand others more? Or do you do it so you won't feel so alone in the world?

Asking critical questions of yourself is the first step to understanding who and what exactly you are. More so than finding "comrades" or some convenient label to explain away your disconnect from social reality. It is only you who can answer whatever question it is that you're asking. All we can do is to interpret and advice you on your course.


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

NighTi said:


> I'm pleasantly surprised to see you write that. Maybe we can make some progress after all.
> 
> Since I caught your attention, I might as well save time by being blunt. The model can give you access to a whole lot of power, but you're trapped in a way of thinking which prevents you from reaching it. @_Watch Key Phone_, @_soppixo_, @_Teybo_, @_Amenamy_, @_irregularQuestioner_, @_Ellis Bell_, and I have all been trying to say the same thing, but it hasn't gotten through until now.
> 
> ...


I'm now seeing the types as they cognitive functions, and not their letters, which is the best way to see it, from what I've learnt. I'm leaning towards INTP, because of my cognitive functions.


----------



## ccath17c (Apr 21, 2013)

soppixo said:


> He is saying that whatever method you're using to determine your type isn't working. And that you should probably try another option.
> 
> The fact that you want so badly to find a niche group to fit into, speaks to me of a desire to properly define yourself and your identity in this world. In other words, you want to know what you are so you can find your natural habitat and live in happiness etc. Perhaps you should concentrate more on your reasons and motivations for wanting to find this feeling of belonging- do you do it because you want to understand others more? Or do you do it so you won't feel so alone in the world?
> 
> Asking critical questions of yourself is the first step to understanding who and what exactly you are. More so than finding "comrades" or some convenient label to explain away your disconnect from social reality. It is only you who can answer whatever question it is that you're asking. All we can do is to interpret and advice you on your course.


I do it so I don't feel as alone as I do, and also to understand what makes me so weird compared to my peers.


----------



## NighTi (Jan 1, 2013)

ccath17c said:


> I'm now seeing the types as they cognitive functions, and not their letters, which is the best way to see it, from what I've learnt. I'm leaning towards INTP, because of my cognitive functions.


Now you're talking. Since you have done some reading, you probably know that INTP looks like this:

Dominant: introverted thinking (Ti)
Auxiliary: extraverted intuition (Ne)
Inferior: extraverted feeling (Fe)

What led you to the conclusion that this describes your cognitive wiring? For example, how do you experience a preference for Ti over Te? How do you know that Ti is dominant and Ne auxiliary rather than the other way around? How do you experience inferior Fe?


----------

