# What's next?



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

@Red Panda I Want to thank you for suggesting the auto immune gastritis for me. Now I can get on the right track to actually feeling better, happier and healthier but...what's next? I can't afford b12 shots. Would a good diet full of b12 work? (I am vegan, though so this will be super difficult)


----------



## Stelmaria (Sep 30, 2011)

I'm not quite sure what you are asking as I have not seen the rest of the discussion.

But you are talking about b12, are you taking any sort of methyl or hydroxyl cobalamin (not cyanocobalamin which is the cheap stuff)? You can get them in tablets and sublingual varieties (sublingual is supposed to provide better absorption) and has proven effective (given suitable dosage) compared to b12 shots.


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Snow Leopard said:


> I'm not quite sure what you are asking as I have not seen the rest of the discussion.
> 
> But you are talking about b12, are you taking any sort of methyl or hydroxyl cobalamin (not cyanocobalamin which is the cheap stuff)? You can get them in tablets and sublingual varieties (sublingual is supposed to provide better absorption) and has proven effective (given suitable dosage) compared to b12 shots.


Well, every b12 pill I take causes me to have bad anxiety. I have anemia, the b12 deficiency type.


----------



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

chip said:


> @Red Panda I Want to thank you for suggesting the auto immune gastritis for me. Now I can get on the right track to actually feeling better, happier and healthier but...what's next? I can't afford b12 shots. Would a good diet full of b12 work? (I am vegan, though so this will be super difficult)


You are welcome.You will have to see a gastroenterologist to tell you what to do exactly. If your stomach has lost the ability to produce enough protein that assists in B12 absorption then shots is probably the only way. I assume the doctor will measure how big the damage is, if you have auto immune gastritis in the first place.


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Red Panda said:


> You are welcome.You will have to see a gastroenterologist to tell you what to do exactly. If your stomach has lost the ability to produce enough protein that assists in B12 absorption then shots is probably the only way. I assume the doctor will measure how big the damage is, if you have auto immune gastritis in the first place.


How many types of gastritis exist anyhow? I have read that most doctors tests are inaccurate for b12, but that b12 deficiency is very common.

Why is B12 deficiency so under-diagnosed?B12 deficiency is often missed for two reasons. First, it’s not routinely tested by most physicians. Second, the low end of the laboratory reference range is too low. This is why most studies underestimate true levels of deficiency. Many B12 deficient people have so-called “normal” levels of B12.


----------



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

chip said:


> How many types of gastritis exist anyhow? I have read that most doctors tests are inaccurate for b12, but that b12 deficiency is very common.
> 
> Why is B12 deficiency so under-diagnosed?B12 deficiency is often missed for two reasons. First, it’s not routinely tested by most physicians. Second, the low end of the laboratory reference range is too low. This is why most studies underestimate true levels of deficiency. Many B12 deficient people have so-called “normal” levels of B12.


I'll tell you what I know:
Gastritis is either chronic or acute. In chronic (or non-erosive) there's chronic inflammatory damage to the stomach mucosa which eventually leads to atrophy and epithelial metaplasia (replacement of stomach cells with other kinds like intestinal). It can either happen because of H.Pylori infection (90% of cases) or auto-immune in the rest 10% which causes b12 deficiency anemia among other things. 
Acute gastritis is of transient nature and usually due to heavy use of various drugs like NSAIDs, or other health issues like infections and traumas. But, if caused by NSAIDs (aspirins, paracetamol etc) it's erosive and may even cause peptic ulcers. 

I was just discussing B12 laboratory levels with my therapist, because I have in-limits but close to low and it contributes to my bad PMS. When I supplement a multi-vitamin with B1+B6+B12 I feel almost as good as I did on antidepressants. She says that laboratory levels are criminally low and they should be at least 300-400 instead of 200. B12 is quite expensive examination here, compared to other regular exams. But it doesn't matter, you can supplement without testing because there are no upper limits that may cause toxicity, the only bad that happens is that after a certain amount it's useless to add more because your body just can't absorb it. Of course, if you have autoimmune gastritis your absorption may be impaired anyway.


----------



## Bago (Aug 30, 2011)

Do you mind also sharing what is your diet like ? 

I also had gastritis too at one point but then when I removed myself from that job viola! My stress level was so tense it was quite surreal too. I also cut back on coffees, and any kind of strong acidities, and did eat well for a long while etc. I also avoided heavy amount of meat, but I did not remove it altogether. Plus I also do not eat late any more. If you want further advice on this, then I can try and help you too on the diet side of things. 

My family members all or more or less do have the H.Pylori infection too. This is kind of due to late night eating, and causes burning on the gastric area too.


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

@Bago I eat vegetables a lot but I have been eating too many refined carbs like chips and also potatoes which every time I eat has made me feel sick (but this only happens when I take b12 supps) I have atrophic gastritis. I have not been tested for it specifically but I had a light down my throat (the endoscopy) and the doctor said he found no traces of h.pylori so with my own conclusion using google, I found that there are two types of gastritis, there is A. And B. 

Exert from wikipedia:

Type A gastritis primarily affects the body/fundus of the stomach, and is more common with pernicious anemia.
Type B gastritis (most common overall) primarily affects the antrum, and is more common with _H. pylori_ infection.


I have type A and your family members may have type B
@Red Panda

I just found out some great news. B12 is 6 dollars a vial here in canada and lasts for 4 months or so and no need for prescription!  So happy!


----------



## Spades (Aug 31, 2011)

I second the sublingual supplements, but I don't know much about B12 shots or gastritis (even though I had it for a little bit).


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Spades said:


> I second the sublingual supplements, but I don't know much about B12 shots or gastritis (even though I had it for a little bit).



I was taking them but since I have anemia, they are not enough and they have been proven most of them anyway, to be ineffective.


----------



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

chip said:


> Exert from wikipedia:
> 
> Type A gastritis primarily affects the body/fundus of the stomach, and is more common with pernicious anemia.
> Type B gastritis (most common overall) primarily affects the antrum, and is more common with _H. pylori_ infection.
> ...



The doctor has to diagnose you, as it could be something else... don't make self-diagnoses and definitely not self-treating please. You will need medication anyway.


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Red Panda said:


> The doctor has to diagnose you, as it could be something else... don't make self-diagnoses and definitely not self-treating please. You will need medication anyway.



He did...I mentioned that already. I had an endoscopy.


----------



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

chip said:


> He did...I mentioned that already. I had an endoscopy.


you said "*I have atrophic gastritis.I have not been tested for it specifically* but I had a light down my throat (the endoscopy) and the doctor said he found no traces of _h.pylori_ so *with my own conclusion using google*, I found that there are two types of gastritis, there is A. And B. "

Did the doctor say that you have atrophic gastritis?


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Red Panda said:


> you said "*I have atrophic gastritis.I have not been tested for it specifically* but I had a light down my throat (the endoscopy) and the doctor said he found no traces of _h.pylori_ so *with my own conclusion using google*, I found that there are two types of gastritis, there is A. And B. "
> 
> Did the doctor say that you have atrophic gastritis?


He didn't say anything because he told me to take antacids. He is like most other traditional doctors and he had NO idea why I had gastritis if it wasn't related to h.pylori. He said "Get on ssris or ativan for stress" The stress did not cause my gastritis because I had it since I was 23, and I wasn't exactly stressed at all. I remember being happier back then. It's diet related. Over consumption of caffeine and eating once a day because I was anorexic caused my gastritis which in turn caused the anemia. I have an enlarged heart, which is a symptom of PA. Sorry but I'd rather be my own doctor here and b12 injections are safe if you know how much to take, which I do.


----------



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Well go to another doctor then. If it's autoimmune it will never go away (and it didn't happen because of caffeine), you'll have it for the rest of your life, so you have to find good doctor and registered dietitian to help you manage it. Otherwise, it will only get worse. If you are serious about taking care of your health, you will do the things necessary to achieve that, not self-diagnoses or self-treatment.
As for B12, you'll have to do blood tests and the doctor will decide how you'll treat it.


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Red Panda said:


> Well go to another doctor then. If it's autoimmune it will never go away (and it didn't happen because of caffeine), you'll have it for the rest of your life, so you have to find good doctor and registered dietitian to help you manage it. Otherwise, it will only get worse. If you are serious about taking care of your health, you will do the things necessary to achieve that, not self-diagnoses or self-treatment.
> As for B12, you'll have to do blood tests and the doctor will decide how you'll treat it.


Caffeine is part of why gastritis occurs because diet can cause it. Autoimmune problems exist mostly because of horrible diets. When I say caffeine I mean I was drinking 5 energy drinks per day, coffee, and pepsi and eating gluten and candy. I never ate vegetables or anything nutrient dense so my body got fed up and pissed off at me and showed me how angry it was so now I have gastritis. Oh yeah, a lot of sodas contain carcinogens found in the caramel coloring. With all of the horrible foods I was consuming, it's a given something bad would happen. 

So what if I self diagnose? You think I want to go to a doctor who tells me to get on pills, who doesn't tell me what else is going on with me because they are lazy about testing? They want to put me on pills that make me worse. No thank you, I am my own doctor and I listen to my body and I research and research until my fingers hurt. People tell me I'm also stupid for being vegan but they have no idea what meat consumption is doing to their body. I'm not a dumb ass. I'm not responding to your replies any more. I'm a big girl, not a retard.


----------



## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Autoimmune problems may be inherited. A lot of people have terrible diets but they still don't develop autoimmunes, but that's not the point. 
Point is, you can't self-diagnose just from checking symptoms, you have to do blood tests for antibodies, for anemia etc. Find another doctor who's more capable. If you have searched so much about it you can tell him that you want to be tested. 
I will not contribute further to this.


----------



## Bago (Aug 30, 2011)

chip said:


> He didn't say anything because he told me to take antacids. He is like most other traditional doctors and he had NO idea why I had gastritis if it wasn't related to h.pylori. He said "Get on ssris or ativan for stress" The stress did not cause my gastritis because I had it since I was 23, and I wasn't exactly stressed at all. I remember being happier back then. It's diet related. Over consumption of caffeine and eating once a day because I was anorexic caused my gastritis which in turn caused the anemia. I have an enlarged heart, which is a symptom of PA. Sorry but I'd rather be my own doctor here and b12 injections are safe if you know how much to take, which I do.


I will try and address your other diet issue on your other thread ? 

Maybe he did not specifically say you "had" gastritist, than he "thinks" you have gastritist. The thing with doctors is that, they try to troubleshoot and find the root cause of the symptoms based on you telling them what symptoms you have. The thing which I got clever with also, is that I try to tell them the history too. I used to get so irate with going to the doctors with my granma to try and get the doctors on board on a proper good old diagnosis asap. I do not know whether it is the fact that I work in IT, but I try and find the absolute "truth" on what is the root cause. I normally try and build the flow chart so I know which ones they have eliminated already etc, so I am on the same page as they are. So it seems to me that your doctor has done that typical test for the h.pylori, so basically you do not have the gastritist which is normally caused by h.pylori.. Ok.... but you still have the symptoms which is similar to gastritist. So at least he eliminated a possibility. 

Then yes, I agree that you need to then tackle your diet side of things. Before you lump all of this together, and think that this is stress of ssris, just go for the basic of simple eating for a while and cruise the situation til your body and lifestyle steadied on something, rather than to grab any pills, diets, anything. Cos you are not likely to root out the problem any way. I know and knew I never did when I was just grab eating, and not being mindful of every single thing which I ate and touched and remind myself of things that is going on etc. I have been okay for a little while. 

So, you have had the throat scan. Ok.... and is now on B12 injections. When will you finish these ? Do you need to continually take them or are they just a simple treatment for a short specific time ? 

You know when you mentioned the different types of gastritist, it isn't as types as such, but as it is the way it is categorised. 

I found some information, which probably is similar to what you were saying before. I will annotate and write down which ones I had and which one my granma had etc as examples if you like. Bear with me on that for a bit.


----------



## chip (Oct 12, 2011)

Bago said:


> I will try and address your other diet issue on your other thread ?
> 
> Maybe he did not specifically say you "had" gastritist, than he "thinks" you have gastritist. The thing with doctors is that, they try to troubleshoot and find the root cause of the symptoms based on you telling them what symptoms you have. The thing which I got clever with also, is that I try to tell them the history too. I used to get so irate with going to the doctors with my granma to try and get the doctors on board on a proper good old diagnosis asap. I do not know whether it is the fact that I work in IT, but I try and find the absolute "truth" on what is the root cause. I normally try and build the flow chart so I know which ones they have eliminated already etc, so I am on the same page as they are. So it seems to me that your doctor has done that typical test for the h.pylori, so basically you do not have the gastritist which is normally caused by h.pylori.. Ok.... but you still have the symptoms which is similar to gastritist. So at least he eliminated a possibility.
> 
> ...



He gave me an endoscopy. It showed that I have gastritis. He took blood from me, which also confirmed that I do not have h pylori associated with gastritis. . He did not test anemia because my stomach was not bleeding. Usually the doctors I have seen do not do extra testing if they do not see anything too severe. Which is kind of silly. The actual test for b12 should be for the cells but they use blood tests which is even sillier since like I said, b12 is found in our cells. 


I took a b12 shot today in the thigh and I have energy to the roof, I feel no depression, I feel absolutely fantastic. I even ate food and I don't feel drained like I normally do. I feel like myself again and no one can take that away from me. 

Gastritis is categorized like that and I have the one that does not involved the disease, I have the one that causes anemia and even the one with h pylori causes it as well ,which is why when I took my shot for the first time today, I felt fantastic and still do!



Gastritis - National Digestive Diseases Information Clearinghouse


----------

