# The REAL definition of introversion and extroversion.



## Andrea (Apr 20, 2009)

despite numerous threads on various forums, i am still having trouble with the difference between introversion and extroversion.

common definitions, and why i have found them inadequate:


based on social habits. generally understood as inaccurate.
based on your dominant function. can be difficult to determine because dominant and secondary work in tandem, and because cognitive functions can be tricky to abstract from their real life manifestations.
"are you energized or drained" by whatever. what does this even mean? everything is draining.
the layman's definition. in MBTI context it would correspond to N and S, not I and E.
some other things. covered here: http://forums.intpcentral.com/showpost.php?p=1202199&postcount=1
 
from what i've gathered and digested, here is my definition:
introverts think in terms of what the world "should" be. they have a subjective concept of the world, and if external events are inconsistent with their internal system, it's "wrong" / incorrect.
extroverts think in terms of what the world _is_. they're objective. if an external event is inconsistent with what they like, it isn't wrong, it's just something that has to be dealt with.

however, this might be true for perceivers only, and isn't yet cogent enough for me.

feel free to add and justify your own definitions.
how did you decide whether you were E/I?


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## Vaka (Feb 26, 2010)

I do agree that these accepted definitions are false...to say the very least!! lol

I'm not sure that those definitions are really any better, though. I just can't really relate those to myself.


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## Andrea (Apr 20, 2009)

hm... how does your extroversion present itself?


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## Drea (Apr 13, 2010)

I agree, this is why I have a hard time typing people.

I consider my self introverted because I am very shy, and socially awkward.


Unless people are shy or outgoing-which most people are in the middle- it's really hard to tell whether they are I or E.


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## firedell (Aug 5, 2009)

It's where I get more energy from.


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## Vaka (Feb 26, 2010)

Andrea said:


> hm... how does your extroversion present itself?


I'm actually very confused with this. The only reason I'm calling myself an ENFP rather than an INFP is that i can relate more to the profile...I'm not sure if I'm actually an extrovert, and introvert, or an ambivert. So I am interested in what other people say here.


I'm not sure if there things would make me extroverted, or what...I just thought this might help a bit:

I can tell you that I love people and I have a strong interest in listening to peoples' perspectives and views and thoughts. I like to feel free and like I can be open with people and they can be open with me. I'm not an overly private person. Or...I keep a lot of myself buried, but a lot of things most people would be uncomfortable saying, I don't feel uncomfortable with. I love to explore and try new things. I very much like variety.



I get my energy from people, but I can do with being by myself for hours. So even that definition kinda--...I dunno...
Introverted doe snot equal shy or awkward though...not necessarily...


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## Psilo (Apr 29, 2009)

Game-Board Exegesis

Forward-Direction Exegesis


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## Andrea (Apr 20, 2009)

i'm the same way 

i typed myself based on my habits as a baby, and because if i was INTP, i'd be a behavioral anomaly.


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## lovnlife (May 31, 2010)

*What's my personality type*

If you don't understand what it is to be "energized" by people, you probably aren't one who is energized by people. You can be an extrovert and still need your hours of alone time, it just depends on what percent of your personality falls in that category. I think true introverts get worn out by just the idea of being around people for too long. Just my thoughts...


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## Vaka (Feb 26, 2010)

Psilo said:


> Game-Board Exegesis
> 
> Forward-Direction Exegesis


Those are the best descriptions of extroversion and introversion I've ever read...by far!
I think that would out the idea of ambiversion since that relies solely on the energy description.
And I also love the descriptions of the primary, secondary, tertiary, and inferior functions.




lovnlife said:


> If you don't understand what it is to be "energized" by people, you probably aren't one who is energized by people. You can be an extrovert and still need your hours of alone time, it just depends on what percent of your personality falls in that category. I think true introverts get worn out by just the idea of being around people for too long. Just my thoughts...


I don't feel like either takes precedence though xD


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## Andrea (Apr 20, 2009)

an extrovert would be compelled to build his model while an introvert would be satisfied with the plan alone.
an extrovert's interest is piqued when knowledge has the potential to be applied. an introvert's interest is piqued based on the artistic or conceptual beauty of the information.

though these aren't real definitions, they are indicative of an underlying principle.


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## U-80 (Mar 12, 2010)

Andrea said:


> introverts think in terms of what the world "should" be. they have a subjective concept of the world, and if external events are inconsistent with their internal system, it's "wrong" / incorrect.
> extroverts think in terms of what the world _is_. they're objective. if an external event is inconsistent with what they like, it isn't wrong, it's just something that has to be dealt with.


I think objectivity and subjectivity have a lot more to do with Thinking vs Feeling. 

I agree with you though, that the standard definitions of E/I leave a lot to be desired. I think that's because E and I are a bit different for each of their respective types.



Andrea said:


> an extrovert would be compelled to build his model while an introvert would be satisfied with the plan alone.
> an extrovert's interest is piqued when knowledge has the potential to be applied. an introvert's interest is piqued based on the artistic or conceptual beauty of the information.


No, that's not it. You're mixing up the principles now. 

I'd like to help you come up with a foolproof definition, but it's tricky. I don't really have one of my own. I have ideas about it, but I haven't found a simple way to articulate them yet.


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## Theaetetus (Apr 24, 2010)

Andrea said:


> "are you energized or drained" by whatever. what does this even mean? everything is draining


I'm going to tell you what introversion is to me through an experience that happened last weekend, and then you'll answer a few questions, confirming or disproving the theory. Ready?

On Saturday, I spent 8 hours with 5 other people performing a job. Though I enjoyed it, and had fun, I felt like absolute crap when I got home. Utter exhaustion.

On Sunday, I performed the same job for the same amount of time, but by myself. I felt alright when I got home, though a little tired. This was an extremely sharp contrast.

Now, answer me this:

Was there a time in your life when you had to work in a group for several hours, and then returned home to solitude? How did you feel afterwards, when you were home? An intovert will feel relieved, an extrovert will feel stressed (though extroverts can decompress the same as us, and it's less measured from their side of the spectrum.)



ADDENDUM



Andrea said:


> based on your dominant function. can be difficult to determine because dominant and secondary work in tandem, and because cognitive functions can be tricky to abstract from their real life manifestations.
> from what i've gathered and digested, here is my definition:
> introverts think in terms of what the world "should" be. they have a subjective concept of the world, and if external events are inconsistent with their internal system, it's "wrong" / incorrect.


Study cognitive functions!

Here's a quick rundown:
Ni (I have this dominant): My subconscious suggests possibilities. ("Is this cookie poisoned?" or "I should probably bring my knife, I might need it.")
Ne (You have this dominant): You see possibilities in the world around you. ( "What if that tree branch over there fell?" and "Whoa, the walls are melting. Hah.")
Fi (I have this): Whenever I feel something, it's not because something happened in the outside world or someone else feels something, but because I'm thinking of negative or positive possibilities in my head.
Fe (You have this): Feeling because someone else appears to feel it or something happened in the outside world.
Ti (You have this): Constructing an internal model (sort of a flowchart - this means that), and picking at it inside your head.
Te (I have this): Thinking 'on the paper.' I observe and manipulate problems right in front of me, or with a mental visual model that represents them in-person.
Si (Neither of us have this dominant): "I'm hungry." "I remember something that happened some time." "I'm feeling this inside, so that."
Se (We both have this dominant): "Hey, it looks like that over there is this." "Wait, that condition is wrong."

Here's a breakdown of your dominant cognitive functions, too:
_Ne > Ti > Fe > Se 
_
Here's mine:
_Ni > Te > Fi > Se_

SERIOUSLY: check this thread to see how these functions work for ENTPs and INTJs, and others!
http://personalitycafe.com/articles...gnitive-functions-communicate-each-other.html


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## Andrea (Apr 20, 2009)

*Theaetetus*: in response to your question: when i'm doing an activity i'll keep going indefinitely. if i've worked for hours with others, i'd be the last person who wants to go home, and when i am home, i'll stay buzzed for an hour then crash.

as i said, my definition may be true only for perceivers. then again, i keep thinking I's are the type to gripe about why the world is flawed while E's would either fix it, deal with it, or move on.

edit: my understanding of cognitive functions is solid, but thanks for the run-through, it's good to have it at hand. my inferior is Si.

*rousse:* hm... my quoted examples seem pretty well agreed upon when the intent is to type a person. what do you find wrong with them?


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## U-80 (Mar 12, 2010)

Theaetetus said:


> Was there a time in your life when you had to work in a group for several hours, and then returned home to solitude? How did you feel afterwards, when you were home? An introvert will feel relieved, an extrovert will feel stressed (though extroverts can decompress the same as us, and it's less measured from their side of the spectrum.)


I agree with this as a rule of thumb. But it's not an entirely reliable test for E/I. I've always had, as Andrea does, a hunch that there's more to it. No doubt much has been written on the subject, and many definitions proposed. I'm not sure if any of the E/I definitions are completely true for all the different types. There's quite a lot of variation, it seems.


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## U-80 (Mar 12, 2010)

Andrea said:


> i keep thinking I's are the type to gripe about why the world is flawed while E's would either fix it, deal with it, or move on.


I dunno... a lot of introverts never even think about the world. They live in their own world. Extraverts are far more likely to be influenced by the "world out there." They need to be part of something bigger than themselves, some sort of community, in order to do the things that are most normal/natural/preferable to them. Introverts require much less external influence, or contact with the world, in order to do whatever it is that they're "wired" to do. 

But then again, I'm not happy with that definition either. It doesn't account for everything.


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## Theaetetus (Apr 24, 2010)

Andrea said:


> as i said, my definition may be true only for perceivers. then again, i keep thinking I's are the type to gripe about why the world is flawed while E's would either fix it, deal with it, or move on.



This is only a rough correlation! A stereotype! Us Introverts tend to be more detached. Before I developed decent social skills, I wouldn't even bother talking to someone else to fix it. An extrovert is more able to go to someone right-off and do something.


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## Andrea (Apr 20, 2009)

rough, yes, but a correlation nonetheless. what is the underlying concept here?

to synthesize your latest posts, *rousse* and *Theaetetus*:
an Introvert interprets, and therefore forms his own concept of how the world works. he has his "own world". so to speak, his own reality, which to him is correct and perfect. when the real world functions differently from the way he thinks it should, it's "incorrect".
for an Extrovert, the real world IS his reality, and if he doesn't like world events, he _has_ to deal with it. an Extrovert moves within the world, and is an actor in it. 

so: an Introvert conceptualizes the world. an Extrovert sees the world.
in other terms,
an Extrovert acts, thinks, then acts again. an Introvert thinks, acts, then thinks again.
an Extrovert lives to act. an Introvert lives to think.
an Extroverts gives to the world, an Introvert takes from the world.

these definitions are widely available, but considering they haven't been established as canon, i'm looking for alternatives or improvements.


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## thewindlistens (Mar 12, 2009)

I don't know. I still like the "recharge" definitions best. A lot of the new proposed definitions here have more to do with P and J or S and N than I and E.



Andrea said:


> an extrovert's interest is piqued when knowledge has the potential to be applied. an introvert's interest is piqued based on the artistic or conceptual beauty of the information.


Especially this. This is the very essence of judging and percieving as I understand it, the proper definition of P and J in contrast to the flawed definitions that talk about neatness and such. You're saying E is J and I is P here.

It is, as well, the most striking difference between me, an INTP, and an INTJ friend of mine. We are both unambiguously introverted.


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## FearsomeCritter (Jan 14, 2010)

The definition is really simple.

It's where you get your energy from. If you get energetic from being around people, then you're an extrovert. If you get it from being alone where you can comfortably recharge, you're an extrovert.

You can't define it off of personality traits and general behavior... Those things can be learned. There's a large number of introverts that come off as extroverts, and a large number of extroverts that are shy and come off as introverts.

I am VERY quickly drained from being around people for too long... even though i'm ussaly the person sitting in the dark corner of the room next to the speakers quietly enjoying my mug of coffee. I crash hard after anything social, and the whole time i'm ussualy just waiting till my obligations are done and i can go. THAT is draining. I'm more stessed at parties keeping vigilant than i am having fun and talking with folks.

Would an extrovery like to describe what it's like for them to spend long periods of time alone so that we can have a contrast?


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