# INFJ vs. ISFJ



## Prada (Sep 10, 2015)

*Si-Fe vs. Ni-Fe*

There have been several threads about the difference between Si-dom and Ni-dom but I'm more curious about these functions when connected to Fe. How would you describe the difference?


----------



## giorgaros2 (Sep 2, 2014)

A secret : ISFJs are the epitome of normalcy and maturity and INFJs are crazy lunatics who hide it very well.


----------



## charlie.elliot (Jan 22, 2014)

ISFJs dont have a problem acting totally "normal" in accordance with their Fe.... while INFJs feel conflicted about how to use Fe because they're divided inside between wanting to be normal and wanting to be individual and authentic. So ISFJs are pretty predictable and easy to understand and guileless, whereas INFJs can be easy to understand but they can also be two-faced and grouchy for seemingly no reason. 
Both seem extremely self-conscious to me; though INFJs seem possibly more likely to manifest the "anti-self-consciousness" stance, i.e. repressing feelings of self-consciousness by being cocky and self-assured. Probably because they obsess over the concept of Self, while ISFJs accept that they are shy and self-conscious and don't worry about it as much (I think?)

INFJs also have the "competency" issue that they share with INTJs. They have to feel capable and they have a lot of pride... and being shy and self-conscious makes that difficult. This also complicates the issue of how to use Fe.
ISFJs, rather than having pride and needing to be competent, are more self-deprecating, seemingly relatively okay with being "meek" "shy" etc.


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 3, 2011)

charlie.elliot said:


> I
> INFJs also have the "competency" issue that they share with INTJs. They have to feel capable and they have a lot of pride... and being shy and self-conscious makes that difficult. This also complicates the issue of how to use Fe.
> ISFJs, rather than having pride and needing to be competent, are more self-deprecating, seemingly relatively okay with being "meek" "shy" etc.


I disagree.

ISFJ's want to LOOK competent. they want the people around them to see their little family unit as peaceful and happy and perfect and blah blah blah. All about how it LOOKS.

INFJ doesn't really care how it LOOKS. They want people BE happy, and get along, and have happy relationships with each other. They actually do want to help other people BE happy inside. 

Source: married 15 years to an isfj, dated a bunch of INFJ's.


----------



## charlie.elliot (Jan 22, 2014)

drmiller100 said:


> I disagree.
> 
> ISFJ's want to LOOK competent. they want the people around them to see their little family unit as peaceful and happy and perfect and blah blah blah. All about how it LOOKS.
> 
> ...


I dont really think you were addressing my point that you quoted... BUT I also think that INFJs can be quite image-focused as well. Don't give them so much credit for being "deep", at least if that means they aren't _also_ very shallow at times. They can be quite vain and self-absorbed and can treat people badly as a result. (And to be honest I've never experience an ISFJ doing that!) 

INFJs have this hang-up about their own personal ~*~*~IDENTITY~*~*~ that ISFJs don't have. That can have a variety of effects- I think sometimes it makes INFJs seem more shallow and image-focused, and sometimes makes them seem "deeper."


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 3, 2011)

charlie.elliot said:


> I dont really think you were addressing my point that you quoted... BUT I also think that INFJs can be quite image-focused as well. Don't give them so much credit for being "deep", at least if that means they aren't _also_ very shallow at times. They can be quite vain and self-absorbed and can treat people badly as a result. (And to be honest I've never experience an ISFJ doing that!)
> 
> INFJs have this hang-up about their own personal ~*~*~IDENTITY~*~*~ that ISFJs don't have. That can have a variety of effects- I think sometimes it makes INFJs seem more shallow and image-focused, and sometimes makes them seem "deeper."



I think you are conflating enneagram and MBTI. the identity thing is more enneagram. 

When done, S is sensing, and N is intuitive. Visual appearances are more important, in general, to an ISFJ than an INFJ. 

Yes, some INFJ's can be very shallow, and some ISFJ's very deep.


----------



## Gossip Goat (Nov 19, 2013)

And here is where the great "Intuituves are deep and Sensors are not" debacle starts :-/ these two functions are how you gather/process information (which in the case for Ni and Si dom's its an introverted process meaning its harder to even link to behavior) and could go either way in terms how ones motivations, philosophies, personal depth go...

Introverted/Extraverted in Jungian terms does not mean what we normally associate it with (colloquially). (shocking right?)
And the same goes with Intuitive and Sensing. 

#stop the misinformation

As far as how they interact with Fe, I don't know. I hoped this thread would have some answers in regards to that but sadly not.


----------



## Prada (Sep 10, 2015)

Gossip Goat said:


> And here is where the great "Intuituves are deep and Sensors are not" debacle starts :-/ these two functions are how you gather/process information (which in the case for Ni and Si dom's its an introverted process meaning its harder to even link to behavior) and could go either way in terms how ones motivations, philosophies, personal depth go...


Ironically enough, the most deep person I know is an ESFJ. Because her Ti is very well developed for an inferior.



Gossip Goat said:


> As far as how they interact with Fe, I don't know. I hoped this thread would have some answers in regards to that but sadly not.


Not that the information that's here wasn't useful but I'm waiting for that too. There were only textbook descriptions and stereotypes for both types but No Si-Fe vs. Ni-Fe comparison. I take part the blame because I incorrectly named the thread, I admit.


----------



## charlie.elliot (Jan 22, 2014)

drmiller100 said:


> I think you are conflating enneagram and MBTI. the identity thing is more enneagram.


No, if you read up about the NF types you'll find it has a lot to do with identity and the search for self. its really one of the crucial aspects of the whole personality type.


----------



## Pinina (Jan 6, 2015)

One of the greatest, or at least most visible differences IMO is between the inferior functions. With ISFJs often being unaware of the possibilities around them and what courses of action that are open to them, whith INFJs rather being unaware of their actual surroundings and how to use that to the greatest extent.


----------



## Valtire (Jan 1, 2014)

charlie.elliot said:


> No, if you read up about the NF types you'll find it has a lot to do with identity and the search for self. its really one of the crucial aspects of the whole personality type.


It's enneagram type 4, and I've come across a hell of a lot of Fe-Si's who are like that.

Despite that, I've yet to come across a Si-dom who was gender fluid or a Ni-doms that isn't.


----------



## charlie.elliot (Jan 22, 2014)

Fried Eggz said:


> It's enneagram type 4, and I've come across a hell of a lot of Fe-Si's who are like that.
> 
> Despite that, I've yet to come across a Si-dom who was gender fluid or a Ni-doms that isn't.


Yes it is enneagram type 4 but _also_ heavily NF.


----------



## Zosio (Mar 17, 2015)

*Si/Fe* = "You need some ibuprofen? It's in the bathroom. Cabinet above the sink, left-hand side, second shelf, next to the nail clippers." 

*Ni/Fe *= "Where's my car?"


----------



## JTHearts (Aug 6, 2013)

zosio913 said:


> *Si/Fe* = "You need some ibuprofen? It's in the bathroom. Cabinet above the sink, left-hand side, second shelf, next to the nail clippers."
> 
> *Ni/Fe *= "Where's my car?"


That's a bunch of lies


----------



## Zosio (Mar 17, 2015)

JTHearts said:


> That's a bunch of lies



It's called "a joke", but I appreciate the random condemnation. roud:


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 3, 2011)

zosio913 said:


> It's called "a joke", but I appreciate the random condemnation. roud:


there is a LOT of truth to your joke. INFJ's are famous for getting lost and not being able to use maps.

I think the second part might be another joke? Or sarcasm? or SNARK!!!!!!!!!!!

INFJ's are FAMOUS for snark.


----------



## Zosio (Mar 17, 2015)

drmiller100 said:


> INFJ's are FAMOUS for snark.


It's the INFJ weapon of choice. :wink:


----------



## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

ISFJ: Lets get together for my little teaparty.
INFJ: Lets get together for creating this movement that will save the world.

Of course that is quite a simplification.
Yet it points towards the domain that Fe is activated in.
INFJs have this need for a greater cause.
ISFJs have this need for creating a good time in cozy/classy/whatever surroundings.

It doesn't mean that neither of them can't enjoy being part of the reverse.
Fe is Fe and will be well recieved either way.
Just as an ISTJ and INTJ will agree on facts being applied to getting tangible measurable results.
Yet they come from two very different domains.
It is all about having a grand overarching vision behind the object in focus 
or being content with it connecting to the close everyday things.

An INTJ for example would become mad if all he did was getting out the same result over and over and over.
Yet an ISTJ would be comforted by this stability.
The INTJ wants things to progress into a grand vision, a vision that demands progress outside the familiar.
AGAIN
This doesn't mean that the ISTJ can't enjoy such progress, but it will be with mixed feelings over the uncertainty involved.

Back to the ISFJ, being part of a revolutionary movement driven by Fe, they will tend to keep an eye on the small things.
They will let all the INFJs do all the envisioning and be glad to hang around for the ride, doing their little rituals,
whatever they may be.
The INFJs will partake in the rituals and find them to be nice artefacts to lure in more people to the cause.
Everything is about that grand glorious vision.

In real life however INFJs are usually miserable due to them not being able to find their cause.
ISFJs are usually fine, they are able to establish their little ritualistic lifestyle in most cases.

*Keep in mind that this is a crude generalization that in no way shape of form approaches the reality of the situation


----------



## drmiller100 (Dec 3, 2011)

hornet said:


> I
> In real life however INFJs are usually miserable due to them not being able to find their cause.
> ISFJs are usually fine, they are able to establish their little ritualistic lifestyle in most cases.


With maturity most INFJ's seem to find a cause worth dedicating themselves to.

Some ISFJ's are miserable because they KNOW everyone can SEE how their lives really aren't as perfect as they could be.


----------



## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

drmiller100 said:


> With maturity most INFJ's seem to find a cause worth dedicating themselves to.
> Some ISFJ's are miserable because they KNOW everyone can SEE how their lives really aren't as perfect as they could be.


Yes a good way to describe the issue.


----------



## teddy564339 (Jun 23, 2010)

peyandkeele said:


> personally from what ive seen, fe cares about people, ni or si just provide the focus so to speak. si fe is focused on you the person, ni fe is focused on all people everywhere. this is why alot of social workers and what not can often be isfj's because there focusing on helping an actual person in a practical way. Infj's are more likely to be in peace movements and what not because there standing for a cause that affects people as whole, not just one or 2 people. often times (to me at least, as a person using te in the place of there fe) it seems as tho infj's care more about the idea of people and less about actual physical people themselves. Not to say they dont care about people, im just speaking in general terms here.



This is the way I've thought about this before too. I usually don't want to say or presume it because it seems like INFJs take it as them not caring about the people around them. 


But actually, a little while ago an NT member posted in the ISFJ forum about how the ISFJs they know will care deeply for those they're in relationships with or who are family, but will treat others badly. This definitely isn't true for all ISFJs, but I do think that ISFJs tend to focus on a lot on those in front of them. The stronger the bond, the more they'll feel attached. Of course, this is true for everyone regardless of type, but I think ISFJs are more likely to help people directly in front of them, because that's so much more real to their sensing. Like you said, I think INFJs tend to think more big picture.


I'll be honest that sad things don't affect me much if I feel like they're far away or not a part of my life. I think NFs are more bothered by this sort of thing than I am.


----------



## peyandkeele (Jul 28, 2015)

teddy564339 said:


> This is the way I've thought about this before too. I usually don't want to say or presume it because it seems like INFJs take it as them not caring about the people around them.
> 
> 
> But actually, a little while ago an NT member posted in the ISFJ forum about how the ISFJs they know will care deeply for those they're in relationships with or who are family, but will treat others badly. This definitely isn't true for all ISFJs, but I do think that ISFJs tend to focus on a lot on those in front of them. The stronger the bond, the more they'll feel attached. Of course, this is true for everyone regardless of type, but I think ISFJs are more likely to help people directly in front of them, because that's so much more real to their sensing. Like you said, I think INFJs tend to think more big picture.
> ...


I agree with the last part, i know nf's wholl go on and on about issues like the bombings in france, or whatever else. But wont talk to much about the people in their personal lives that they care for. Not to say they dont care about friends or family, but intiution by nature is focused on the general idea of things (like a country of people, or all the people on planet earth), instead of individual objects (like your best friend, or some needy homeless person).


----------

