# Offer you can't refuse: help me type myself!



## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Hello everyone!

I've been into MBTI for a while now, but still have no definite answer to what my type might be, just few vague ideas... so I thought it'd be helpful to bring this matter into your consideration. Ignore all typos, if you possibly can. I ended up rambling at some points, please bear with me! 


*1) What aspect of your personality made you unsure of your type?*

Most of the internet tests seem to be clueless, and everyone I've asked have their own explanations for the functions... I'd like to hear as many unbiased opinions as possible before typing myself for good.
The idea that we all have just one type fascinates me, and that it is possible to figure it out no matter how complex it seems... it's interesting, to say the least.


*
2) What do you yearn for in life? Why?*

Breaking free from the barriers and limitations of my own thinking, understanding the larger scale of events... in a scale so big it changes the way I perceive the world, preferably. Experiencing - what's the word I'm looking for, numen? - sort of otherness, the type of wonder when facing divinity, I guess, and as often as possible.

Of couse I'd also like to travel around the Earth, since were stuck on this one planet, see places, study history and politics, and somehow contribute to the well-being of humankind... figuring out solutions to our problems.

*
3) Think about a time where you felt like you were at your finest. Tell us what made you feel that way.*

Figuring out I have written over 100 pages of my space opera while I thought I was simply procrastinating, spending the last day of school with a friend with whom I spend the first day, understanding a difficult math formula and finally figuring out a way to combine my diverse interests in a meaningful way... all these in the course of one day made me really happy.


*4) What makes you feel inferior?*

Being disliked or criticized by people whose opinions I respect, especially if I think they are incorrect or mistaken. Overall, being insecure and overanalyzing conversations to figure out what people might have meant when they said something, or not being able to "reach" people (mostly intellectually like when others refuse to share their thoughts, ideas etc. but sometimes emotionally as well). 

I might for example freak out and go all "I cannot believe you don't find this fascinating! How come you have nothing to say about this? Do you even have thoughts!!!" as if not being as talkative or enthusiastic as I am would be a crime or something. I think it's got something to do with impatience, and might connect to my enneagram more.

*
5) What tends to weigh on your decisions? (Do you think about people, pro-cons, how you feel about it, etc.)*

I usually do whatever seems to make most sense to me, but I do try to think how my decision will affect other people. Sometimes I become overwhelmed and spend a lot of time considering what people will think or say if I do A as opposed to B, but I'm unsure whether it has ever lead into a good outcome.

Well, let's see, I chose what I wanted to study because it made perfect sense: I'm interested in the subject and find it suitably challenging. It's also a sort of a collective field combining science with humanities, and studying it rather opens doors than narrows anything down.


*
6) When working on a project what is normally your emphasis? Do you like to have control of the outcome?*

I often derail things... Finishing a project is never that important to me personally, it's more about understanding something on a deeper level. When doing a group work, I understand finishing it is a must, and automatically give space to people: if someone wants to lead, so be it, if no one does, I'll take charge, however a bit reluclantly.

I don't think I even could control the outcome... it's such an intuitive process into which I completely sink in, and eventually things will fall to their right places and I just know when it's finished and there is nothing more to add or delete.

If I'm ever a control freak over anything, it's the details. I might obsess over them needlesly, when they hold no real value; or ignore them just when they mattered the most.


*
7) Describe us a time where you had a lot of fun. How is your memory of it? *

I kept telling my new friends these weird anecdotes about my childhood, largely exaggerating some bits for comical effect... then crossing into some dreams I had and finally ended up to summarize our human nature based on all this absurd evidence. All this with an unusually grim face. Every time they laughed, I levelled up, it was awesome. Most of the things I said, I do not remember... just the feeling of being entertaining for once. The best thing was that I gained their acceptance.


*8) When you want to learn something new, what feels more natural for you? (Are you more prone to be hands on, to theorize, to memorize, etc)*

When I want to learn it? I have basically already learned it... as soon as I see or hear something interesting, I want to know everything about it. I'll give it some though, try to understand how it connects to things I already know about... then I just adopt the consept and frequently revisit it - probably falls into the theorizing/memorizing cathegory.


*
9) How organized do you to think of yourself as?*

For some reason I think being organized is a requirement for being a civilized human: organizing books into alphabetical order, keeping stuff at their right place, carrying daily planners and timetables everywhere, being methodical, setting goals and deciding how to best pursue them, splitting hair and having tranquil fengshui order everywhere in the apartment.

I tried to do this. It felt exotic for a while. Then it felt abnormal.

I have a system. It looks messy but it works up until a point where someone moves a lamp or a vase a bit and then I have means to navigate through my daily life, especially during mornings, especially without caffeine boost.
I don't "get" organizing. Things end up in a mess anyway, so why bother? Chaos increases. I think it has something to do with entropy, but I'll have to google that up.


*
10) How do you judge new ideas? You try to understand the principles behind it to see if they make sense or do you look for information that supports it?*

This is actually interesting! Let's take an example, because I'm not sure what to make of this. That movie "The good dinosaur", which I haven't seen... but just the idea: what if the meteorite had missed, and dinosaurs and humans would coexist?

It bothers me immensely. Why? Without the group extinction, there is a big chance mammals hadn't evolved to a point where they did. They changed the history of evolution radically - and supposedly nothing else changed alongside with it? Nothing else. No other species. Nothing. Just dinosaurs and humans living happily ever after...

(I know it's for kids, but it would have bothered me as a kid too.) 

Is it because the internal logic of the story is flawed (though I love space opera and can take pretty much) or because it doesn't match the external information I have on the subject? I'd say both.


(The idea of dinosaurs and humans coexisting is lovely though: but I daresay Chrichton's Jurassic Park made it in a lot more clever way, more believable, more problematic.)


*
11) You find harmony by making sure everyone is doing fine and belonging to a given group or by making sure that you follow what you believe and being yourself?*

I become restless and less self-assured when I notice someone isn't allright, and try to ask them if somethings wrong (I tend to try to fix people's problems way too much when they just need to open up). 

I almost like losing self when I'm with people. Not having a fixed personality of listed adjectives (if anyone is like this), but instead reacting to people, assuming different roles with different people. And I'd like to follow what we believe in.


*
12) Are you the kind that thinks before speaking or do you speak before thinking? Do you prefer one-on-one communication or group discussions?*

I speak before thinking, a lot. Oh, how I wish I was that strong, silent type.

I get more out of group dynamics. I find one-on-one a bit awkward at times; groups are more easygoing in general, the discussion has a more free form. The most important thing is that there's talk, the amount of talkers doesn't matter so much, as long as everyone participates conversation.


*13) Do you jump into action right away or do you like to know where are you jumping before leaping? Does action speaks more than words?*

I'm somewhat conscious of external world and notice opportunities or when something needs to be done, but I'm bad and awkward at jumping to action myself.

Words can be just words and actions might reveal them to be just words.. so I guess actions speak more louder than words. Not sure if that's still correct. I always pay more attention to what people say and the way they say it as opposed to observing their actions and deducing something from it.


*14) It's Saturday. You're at home, and your favorite show is about to start. Your friends call you for a night out. What will you do?*

I'm not strongwilled enough to stay home! So I'll go out with my friends and watch the show later, gritting my teeth... and then notice I actually prefer company to solitary.

Or, if I'm definately in the mood for the show, I'll invite them in so we can watch it together! Is this the solution you wanted to hear?


*
15) How do you act when you're stressed out?*

I snap at people for petty reasons and find it hard to stay indoors because the walls feel to threatening and I'm positively freaking out.

I might also become very reclusive, apathetic, just lie in my room petrified, full of anxiety and worry about anything.


*
16) What makes you dislike the personalities of some people?*

More often than not I have issues with people who have similar negative personality attributes than I have: loud and gregarious in company, nitpicky, defensive martyrs when questioned. But usually these people have so many redeeming qualities that I end up loving them. 

Bigoted, insincere and pretentious people are harder for me to deal with, because our ways of thinking are so fundamentally different. They clash so violently with my idea of a caring, loving, wise human being. 


*
17) Is there anything you really like talking about with other people?*

Pretty much anything, as long as they are willing to talk, instead of doing it just for social niceties. Even mundane 
subjects can be intersting, if they open up new perspectives. 
Most of all I'd like to talk about possible case scenarios for humanity, philosophy, politics, economy, religion, history and entertainment of course. 


*
18) What kind of things do pay the least attention to in your life*

I don't know? The little meaningful things? Thanks to which I repeatedly lose my keys... 


*
19) How do your friends perceive you? What is wrong about their perception? ? What would your friends never say about your personality ?*

Frankly, I have no idea, and questions like these should be banned, thank you very much.
Seriously, I think they see a more outgoing, warmer me with a flare for drama. I'm not really as sharp or humorous as I pretend to be, nor so cynical. Secretly I am an idealist, I'm a child at heart, but please don't tell anyone.


*
20) You got a whole day to do whatever you like. What kind of activities do you feel like doing?*

I'll watch a bunch of crime series, drink gallons of good coffee and probably read some comics and books while listening to the radio. Nothing special. Was I supposed to go bungee jumping, all the while I can read Hyperion and travel through vast distances in space?

Thanks for your time and patience!


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## Maker of helmets (Sep 8, 2014)

this seems like some kind of enxp to me


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## Yu Narukami (Jan 14, 2016)

The entire post strikes me as being quite ENFP-esque. There were certain parts where it hinted at ENTP, but those parts could as easily be a learned reaction as opposed to a natural state. For example, when you talked about judging new ideas, it came across as a very linear, coherent Ti with the additional Ne slapped onto it. But what really stood out to me was this:



DOGSOUP said:


> Bigoted, insincere and pretentious people are harder for me to deal with, because our ways of thinking are so fundamentally different. They clash so violently with my idea of a caring, loving, wise human being.


That particular part screamed Fi to me, about insincerity and pretentiousness. In my experience, Fe is definitely not bothered by pretense as much as Fi is.

So my guess is ENFP


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

I would guess either ENFP or ENTP.

How would you write a novel?

Te: Write an outline with an estimated word count and charted plot points / progression for each subsequent chapter.

Ti: Invent a logically consistent world that makes sense from a narrative point of view, and perhaps go some way in inventing languages along the way.

Fe: Decide what emotional impact you want your novel to have, and find an appropriate way to express difficult themes without alienating the reader.

Fi: Find a theme that resonates with a deep personal belief or experience, and write it mostly for yourself.

Ne: Start writing. After a few chapters you wind up with 45 main characters and subsequent plot lines all running simultaneously. 

Ni: Spend months and even years visualizing every element of your highly conceptual story, then sit down and write it without much revision. 

Se: Emphasis is on impacting sentences and intense experiences for the reader. Sensory details are devoid of emotional sentiment.

Si: Focuses on those archetypes and themes that are significant to you, often supplemented by a vast library of reading experience. Natural sense of plot structure.

Combine these and you can see how writers tap into different functions. Something I have noticed is that N writers often incorporate description to try and ground their story or make it seem more real, whereas sensor writers usually tap into their intuitive functions to branch out into unexplored territories. Feelers might dip into thinking to structure their worlds with logic and/or explore different principles, just as thinkers might explore emotions through their writing. 

Often our lower functions are how we “play” so we access them during writing.


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Thanks for your input!  Interesting to hear what you have to say.

I guess it's time to throw some of my own thoughts here... I've discussed the matter with someone who guessed INTx, though back then I might have been uncharacteristically focused on my internal world, more in a shadow of myself than the real me. After this has passed, my friend and I came to the conclusion I have Ne preference over Si, but T and F relatively harder to determine... excactly due to learned reaction.

@Yu Narukami, do you think my judging of new ideas could be influenced by the fact I have been discussing and dissecting things with a lot Ti-users lately? I suspect both of the fellas in our debate club have a heavy lean on Ti... growing a very specific logical structure to prove their point, whereas I usually go for the most obvious solution, no matter how unrealistic or unachievable eventually is.

@Kitty23, Ne snaps on pretty automatically, I have tried to keep the plot simple with only small but it feels restricting and sucks all joy out of writing. I do see a lot Si, too, since I love archetypes, but also creating new, modern, occasionally shocking versions of them, and everything I've ever read somehow reflects into my own writing through some sort of mythos. In a way my Si could be much more fantastical than my Ne.

I'd like to think the worlds I create are realistic, by this I mean, they do not defy gravity or anything... so far. For instance, because the idea of our galaxy being full of aliens with whom humans could get along with perfectly well and converse and trade and everything seems tad bit unrealistic to me, I decided not to do it. It's only reasonable assume that aliens would be so different from us that there is no hope in finding any common ground what so ever. I see this more as a Te thing, though.

Aside from that, I also outlined some plot points in advance, though they ended up being a bit scatterminded and unhelpful... I've also sketched some mind maps to help me keep on track of the structure. Weak Te-Si over here?

Last but not least, Fe vs. Fi. Based on these two examples, it's Fi, but with a doubt. I try to leave as much responsibility to the reader as possible, so I serve them something on a platter and it is up to them to decide what to think or what to feel. I write essentially for myself what I want to write and what seems correct to me, if someone find that problematic I am sorry, but doing otherwise would feel... wrong. The story winds up as it should, and I guess it stems from my own experiences more or less, or rather, it is a study of my own possible experiences.


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## Maker of helmets (Sep 8, 2014)

your style of introspection strikes me as introverted Thinking


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## Kiriae (Oct 2, 2015)

I see strong Fe, that's for sure. But you seem to be using Ti too. You are an Extrovert so your Fe must be either 1st or 3rd. You could be either Fe-x-x-Ti or x-Ti-Fe-x. Your Ti doesn't seem to be stronger than Fe though. Therefore Fe-x-x-Ti. You actually mentioned Ti when speaking about your inferior (thinking others are mistaken, overanalyzing, having trouble relating to people intellectually) so it fits.
About other functions - I see a bit of Ne in you and I don't see Se and there were quite a few things you mentioned suggesting quite strong Si - the way you mention your childhood anecdotes, being obsessive with details, interest in history. 

Therefore Fe-Si-Ne-Ti, ESFJ. 

How does it sound?


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

In my opinion I would say you definitely prefer Ne over Ni. 

Who are you at a theme park? 

Extroverted Sensing (Se) is busy noticing all the details of the park and the people in it. Sights. Sounds. Colors. Oh, cool. That ride flips upside down! I’m going to try that. Do you smell those hotdogs? Aren’t they great? I think we ought to go bungee jumping… it’s only $50 for a group of $12! Which way is the Tower of Terror? I’m going to ride down it and watch all you sissies wet your pants when it drops 50 feet in 12 seconds!

Extroverted Intuition (Ne) sees the possibilities of the park. Look at those two people. You can tell they’re not “together” anymore, but just hanging out for the kid’s sake. See their body language? How many rides are in this park? Do you think anyone ever died here? I think they should put a new ride in this space. Call it the Haunted House of Horrors, and have Dead Presidents in it. You know, they could put up an entire haunted SECTION of the park. That would be awesome. Who do I call to pitch that idea? Stay away from the guy in the red hat. He gives me vibes. Ooh, you know, I could write a story about a murder in a theme park! He could die because the Tilt a Whirl malfunctioned. No, no, because the Tower of Terror ride didn’t stop, it crashed the elevator to the bottom floor! His sister did it. No, his uncle! No, the theme park guy, because he’s freakin’ insane.

Extroverted Thinking (Te) is busy organizing others and coming up with “battle plans.” Which direction do we go first? Give me the park map. Okay, where do we want to be by noon? When and where do we meet for lunch? Who is in charge of watching the kid? Which rides do what? When is the bus leaving? What do we have time for? How long are the lines? Okay, everyone who wants to go on these twelve rides, line up to the left! Everyone else to the right! We meet back here at 7pm! No stragglers! Does everyone have their phone on? Good!

Extroverted Feeling (Fe) makes sure everyone feels involved and has their needs met. Does everyone have a buddy? Nobody should be alone! Let’s go to the bathroom first, okay? How do we feel about hamburgers for lunch? Is that okay? Let’s meet over there, shall we? Does everyone know the plan, so no one is left behind? Let’s take a vote on which direction to go first! Fe will go on a ride it doesn’t like so a friend doesn’t have to do it alone.

Introverted Sensing (Si) relates everything around them to past experience. Last time I was here, I threw up on that ride; I’m not going on it again. Oh, hey, that’s the bench I sat on when so-and-so kissed me! Oh, good, the line is shorter this year. Why does this slushie taste different? I think they put less cherry cola in it than before! I feel ripped off. OR… I’ve never been to a theme park before, but that Ferris wheel reminds me of that scene in The Notebook, when Noah won’t take no for an answer, until Allie agrees to go on a date with him…

Introverted Intuition (Ni) knows what will happen before it happens. I’m going to take a step back, because that kid is going to spill his slushie all over – yup, there it goes. I know which ride I want to go on. I’ve thought about it all week. I’m going to have an awesome time on that ride. I’m going there first. Wait, there are other rides? I didn’t even notice! I was busy fixating on getting to the head of the line! Ha, Marsha better not go on that thing, she’ll hurl—yep, there she goes.

Introverted Thinking (Ti) is busy analyzing how the rides work and what makes the most sense. If I go this way, the path winds around past what I want to see, and by the time we’re to meet up, I’ll have been all the way around the park. I won’t have to walk back, or rush from one side of the park to the other. Wait, why are they all walking in the opposite direction? Don’t they know this is the logical way to do it? If you go that way, you’ll engage in needless walking and won’t be able to get through the line in front of the House of Mirrors.

Introverted Feeling (Fi) decides which direction to go based on what is important to them. I’m going on this ride. No, it’s okay, I can go by myself. I don’t need you to come along unless you want to. I’m serious. I’m not afraid to do it alone. I’m not feeling the burgers, either. You all go ahead. I’m going to dash over to that taco stand. Nope, not going on that ride. You can beg all you want, I won’t do it. I’m scared of heights. Not a chance, bud. Drop it.


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Thanks again, people! Much appreciated!

@Maker of helmets, combined with your first comment... if it boils down to ENTP/ESFJ, which one would you bet on? I sort of agree with the introspection, but what do you think of my tendency to almost tenaciously head for the obvious solution and shrugging off the creative, abstracted thinking? Is this not Te?

@Kiriae, hm, that was my initial thought, too! Fe all the way, though I'm pretty sure my use of it is somewhat unhealthy, well, at least not very mature. Doesn't mean it couldn't be dominant, though. Do you think Fe-doms are often conserned and insecure about their abilities to deal with people? I'd like to argue the functions I feel are underdeveloped are Fe paired up with Si, at least they cause a great deal of havoc and insecurity in my life... however, I'd be pretty pleased to find out if I were actually an ESFJ. Not closing it out at this point. 

Se is nonexistant, I think we can all agree on that one 

@Kitty23, lol, battle plans seem like fun, but I don't think I'd be able to pull that out for very long. Maybe my approach would be more Fe-like, making sure no one is left behind which in all likelyhood causes problems with my more independent buddies. I often notice I'm the one rejecting other people's reasoning, because there are faster ways to do things; shortcuts, tricks. 

Ne definately, feeding up from exciting new things in more of an idea-sense rather than, well, need for speed. This particular example of Ne seems a bit neurotic, though. Not the quantity of ideas, but mechanic way they emerge, as if Ne would be some type of idea-machine... shouldn't it be more of a mindset? Being able to change heads mid-sentence, if necessary. If Si is a lence, then Ne is one too, though a very different kind. Am I making any sense here? Probably not, but I'll try and clarify it later. 

I don't think it's necessarily seeing "the possibilities", but it's more looking into some alternative reality, maybe. What could be, all excting thigns behind the obvious. Not just seeing a House of Horrors, but all it's history, it's story. The house is an archetype of specific houses, in this case horror houses. I suppose this might be Si talking, but what do you think? 

So in order... Fe with Ti working nicely together, loads of Ne especially if other people feed my imagination, Si appears maybe...? I'm not so sure about that one. I don't relate to it, at least on a conscious level.


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## Kiriae (Oct 2, 2015)

DOGSOUP said:


> @Kiriae, hm, that was my initial thought, too! Fe all the way, though I'm pretty sure my use of it is somewhat unhealthy, well, at least not very mature. Doesn't mean it couldn't be dominant, though. Do you think Fe-doms are often conserned and insecure about their abilities to deal with people? I'd like to argue the functions I feel are underdeveloped are Fe paired up with Si, at least they cause a great deal of havoc and insecurity in my life... however, I'd be pretty pleased to find out if I were actually an ESFJ. Not closing it out at this point.


It is possible for a Fe dom to be concerned about their abilities to deal with people in situations involving less developed functions (teaching someone how to do math). It wouldn't be a constant state though and there would be way more situations where they feel confident, especially when the situation is purely emotional(comforting someone who is crying).

However since you feel that your underdeveloped functions are Fe and Si then you might be ENTP after all. It isn't that uncommon for tertiary to mimic dominant when someone speaks about self. I am such case myself. I was typed as ISTJ and ISFJ at first because my Si(tertiary) function is the function I focused on developing past a few years(I'm 27 year old). Now I find it easy to see how Si helps me in life (good memory, storage of sensations I can freely play with, strong senses) but I also see how much of a weakness it is (sensory processing disorder, anxiety related to sensations). And when I describe myself I tend to focus on those function related abilities and problems instead of my actual strengths. 
However I would say my attempts to use of Si function are 60% successful and 40% damaging to my life while my use of Ti is almost always successful (unless Si or Fe gets in the way) and using it is so natural that I don't pay conscious attention when and how I actually use it - because I do it pretty much all the time, even right now.

Given how you described your functions "Fe with Ti working nicely together" I think you are the case. You are currently focusing on developing your tertiary Fe and pay too much attention to it. I also described my functions as "Ne and Si working nicely together" recently so it sounds awfully familiar.

However your description of the Haunted house idea seems kinda like Si and Ne working together.
It's also not impossible for someone not to see own auxiliary. It took me a while to realize how much Ne I actually use, and I wasn't even in a dom-ter loop, I simply didn't understood Ne descriptions. You might be the same with your Si. Most Si descriptions describe dom Si working with aux Te, it looks totally differently when it's just an auxiliary paired with dom Fe.


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## Kiriae (Oct 2, 2015)

Deciding what is your auxiliary and inferior should settle it.

Ti:
How good are you in figuring out such stuffs and whatever or not you would be willing to deal with them in your free time without any outside motivation(such as being helpful to someone else):

Math, computers(repair, install, configure), Lego bricks, Ikea furniture, strategic games, Sudoku...


If you consider them entertaining and you are good at them you probably have Ti aux.
If you struggle with them or can do them but won't deal with them without additional motivation you have Ti inf.


Si:
How aware are you of such things and how much time you tend to spend thinking of:

Hunger, temperature, physical comfort, placement of things, memory, sentimentalism...



If you are always aware when your body is getting distressed and know how to deal with it and if you can make good use of past memories and spend quite a lot of time recalling them for entertainment you are probably Si aux. 
If you tend to not pay attention to your physical state and then suddenly realize you are extremely distressed and have no idea how to deal with it and if you keep forgetting where you put your stuff and don't realize when things got misplaced you are Si inf.

Oh. BTW. 
I see another reason how a Fe dom could be insecure about his abilities of dealing with people. Being Fe dom doesn't make one immune from having social anxiety and having anxiety might make one not recognize own strengths. 
Because Fe doms don't have strong rational function and they give a lot of attention to other people feelings they might be prone to social anxiety due to "rationally" over-analyzing social cues instead of trusting their well developed social instincts.


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## imaginaryrobot (Jun 11, 2013)

I'm thinking ENTP. I saw Ti and Ne right away. I had thought INTP until I got to some of the later questions where you described yourself as more extroverted.

These are your statements that gave the biggest indicators of each function, from my perspective.
There were bits of* Ne* everywhere, but this one showed it the most for me:I might for example freak out and go all "I cannot believe you don't find this fascinating! How come you have nothing to say about this? Do you even have thoughts!!!"

The idea that we all have just one type fascinates me, and that it is possible to figure it out no matter how complex it seems... it's interesting, to say the least. *(Ti - like I said, I noticed Ti right at the beginning with this)*

I become restless and less self-assured when I notice someone isn't allright, and try to ask them if somethings wrong (I tend to try to fix people's problems way too much when they just need to open up). 
I almost like losing self when I'm with people. Not having a fixed personality of listed adjectives (if anyone is like this), but instead reacting to people, assuming different roles with different people. And I'd like to follow what we believe in. *(Basically all of this is Fe)

*I have a system. It looks messy but it works up until a point where someone moves a lamp or a vase a bit and then I have means to navigate through my daily life, especially during mornings, especially without caffeine boost.
I don't "get" organizing. Things end up in a mess anyway, so why bother? Chaos increases. I think it has something to do with entropy, but I'll have to google that up. *(Inferior Si)**

...And this perfectly shows a great combination of Ne, Ti, and Si:
*When I want to learn it? I have basically already learned it... as soon as I see or hear something interesting, I want to know everything about it. I'll give it some though, try to understand how it connects to things I already know about... then I just adopt the consept and frequently revisit it - probably falls into the theorizing/memorizing cathegory.


I hope some of this helped!


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

> lol, battle plans seem like fun, but I don't think I'd be able to pull that out for very long. Maybe my approach would be more Fe-like, making sure no one is left behind which in all likelyhood causes problems with my more independent buddies. I often notice I'm the one rejecting other people's reasoning, because there are faster ways to do things; shortcuts, tricks.
> 
> Ne definately, feeding up from exciting new things in more of an idea-sense rather than, well, need for speed. This particular example of Ne seems a bit neurotic, though. Not the quantity of ideas, but mechanic way they emerge, as if Ne would be some type of idea-machine... shouldn't it be more of a mindset? Being able to change heads mid-sentence, if necessary. If Si is a lence, then Ne is one too, though a very different kind. Am I making any sense here? Probably not, but I'll try and clarify it later.
> 
> ...


Ne is an idea machine. It looks at something in the external world and generates several possibilities at once. Ne says "what if's, what could be?" No it's not a mindset, it's cognitive functions. Yes, strong Ne users sound random to weak/non- Ne users. But inside the Ne users head everything connects, nothing they say is random. It seems so far you prefer Ne over Ni, Fe over Fi, Ti over Te, and probably Si over Se. 

That leaves:
ENTP= Ne, Ti, Fe, Si
INTP= Ti, Ne, Si, Fe
ESFJ= Fe, Si, Ne, Ti
ISFJ= Si, Fe, Ti, Ne

How do you act when stressed?

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the ENTP's shadow may appear - a negative form of ISFJ. Example characteristics are being pedantic about unimportant details, doing things to excess - e.g.: eating, drinking or exercising - expressing emotions in an intensive and uncontrolled way, being very sensitive to criticism. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An ENTP may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the INTP's shadow may appear - a negative form of ESFJ. Example characteristics are expressing intense negative emotions towards others, being very sensitive to criticism, and becoming preoccupied with details. You may make decisions without any logical basis, interpreting facts or events in a uncharacteristically subjective way. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An INTP may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the ESFJ's shadow may appear - a negative form of INTP. Example characteristics are being very critical and finding fault with almost everything, ignoring others' feelings, having a pessimistic view of the future, and suggesting ideas that are quite impractical. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An ESFJ may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.

Under extreme stress, fatigue or illness, the ISFJ's shadow may appear - a negative form of ENTP. Example characteristics include making irrational changes to the way things are done, being very intolerant of others who do not act competently, and suggesting impractical ideas. You may also be critical of others, finding fault with almost everything, having a gloomy view of the future, and being uncharacteristically argumentative. The shadow is part of the unconscious that is often visible to others, onto whom the shadow is projected. An ISFJ may therefore readily see these faults in others without recognising it in him/her self.


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## Maker of helmets (Sep 8, 2014)

I think I would probably say entp- cos extroverted intuition I find is or at the very least seems to be inherently optimising, looking for the best possible solution, but in the meantime introverted Thinking has the kind of "cynicism" which tends to anchor those considered possibilities in real-world results


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

@Kiriae



Kiriae said:


> It is possible for a Fe dom to be concerned about their abilities to deal with people in situations involving less developed functions (teaching someone how to do math). It wouldn't be a constant state though and there would be way more situations where they feel confident, especially when the situation is purely emotional(comforting someone who is crying).


Hm... I guess I have it the other way. I like being helpful by explaining problems and introducing people to new information, for example, whereas emotional situations are not easy for me to deal with; it's something I wish I were better at, actually, being more adept in comforting people, offering good advice. I'm just... awkward-ish. _Pat pat. You feel better already?_ Not "Sheldon's here", but pretty close. But hey, I could be overthinking this?

It seems like our functions fool us a lot. The closer the functions are in the stack, the better they seem to play together, and the harder separating them gets. I thought the Haunted house might be either Si or Ne, or even both together... aren't both supposed to be somewhat idealistic in comparison to Se and Ni?

Back to Ti/Si. I've always been good at math and assembling furniture for instance (I'm not efficient though, and like to take my time with it to thoroughly understand what I'm doing, it's very relaxing in a way) and I do like chess for example... but my style is somewhat.. um, impulsive. I'd like to play more strategic games actually... but not so many people are interested.

Well, there are times I overly consern about physical comfort and where things are and can spend ages organizing something, but usually this is more or less a symptom of something not being allright in my life, it only manifests in these quirks. Uh, another thing: is inferior Si prone to being neurotic at times of stress? Like, making sure the coffee machine is off at least ten times, or checking things over and over again to point of being ridicilous (something my friends scorn at, but they don't get it). And like said, I have my own system based on which I know where's where, but it's kind of feeble and vulnerable to other people's attacks.



Kiriae said:


> I see another reason how a Fe dom could be insecure about his abilities of dealing with people. Being Fe dom doesn't make one immune from having social anxiety and having anxiety might make one not recognize own strengths.
> Because Fe doms don't have strong rational function and they give a lot of attention to other people feelings they might be prone to social anxiety due to "rationally" over-analyzing social cues instead of trusting their well developed social instincts.


Ha! If this is the case... This is exactly how it feels! I wonder... This requires some thought, but it's definately worth a while to think about it. This really resonates with me, especially the last sentence.


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

My posts seem to gain immeasurable lengths... Sorry not sorry.

@imaginaryrobot, thanks a lot! Your message really clears my head, helps me understand how my functions manifest and in which order people perceive them. Besides I am glad everyone seems to agree which functions I use, confusion would only make this quest for truth harder.

@Kitty23, well, under a lot of pressure I become increasingly more emotional, and these outburts are just childish when measured objectively. Usually I am very good at dealing with criticism, it only annoys me if I think it's incorrect, but I don't take it personally. When I'm tired I do, and then I sulk and descend into martyrdom. I don't know if this counts, but I do overindulge in coffee under stress, which usually just makes everything a lot worse (imagine me, becoming a laboratory experiment of a nervous coffee mouse... I shake like a mouse).

The shadow xSFJ not so much. That's not stress me, that's just how I was when I was younger and more immature, perhaps. Especially at teens (lol, show me a teen who isn't argumentative, gloomy and critical... but you get the picture). I am still sceptical and somewhat annoyed with imcompetence, but I'm trying to find more mature ways to express myself; one part is due to my environment reacting badly to my insensitivity, and one part because I noticed this flaw in my and wanted to treat my fellow humans better. It still keeps me on my toes with people.

@Maker of helmets, okay, that's reasonable, something I might have said. Especially I liked the word "optimizing". Not seeing possibilites, because we all can see them to a degree, but optimizing them while staying somewhat critical to solutions that alreadye exist. Definately.


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## Kiriae (Oct 2, 2015)

DOGSOUP said:


> @Kiriae
> Hm... I guess I have it the other way. I like being helpful by explaining problems and introducing people to new information, for example, whereas emotional situations are not easy for me to deal with; it's something I wish I were better at, actually, being more adept in comforting people, offering good advice. I'm just... awkward-ish. _Pat pat. You feel better already?_ Not "Sheldon's here", but pretty close. But hey, I could be overthinking this?
> 
> It seems like our functions fool us a lot. The closer the functions are in the stack, the better they seem to play together, and the harder separating them gets. I thought the Haunted house might be either Si or Ne, or even both together... aren't both supposed to be somewhat idealistic in comparison to Se and Ni?
> ...


I think you are ENTP, focusing on development of Fe after all.

Inferior is a function that shows negatively at times of stress. 
Si in ENTPs is often related to hypochondria but neurotism also makes sense. 
Do you perhaps also tend to thoroughly clean the house till it shines and everything gets in order when stress hits you really hard despite usually not paying much attention to such stuff? Its apparently also sign of "Si grip".
http://personalitycafe.com/enfp-articles/76803-recognizing-inferior-function-enfps.html
http://mbti-notes.tumblr.com/post/119442161307/accurate-typing-the-inferior-function

BTW. It makes me think my father is an ENTP too after all(I suppose he is one but for me he is too emotional: he is very sensitive to rejection and gets angry easily). 
He certainly does the obsessive house cleaning when he gets really pissed and he takes pills like candies whenever he thinks "something is taking him down". He can also take them "just in case".


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

> well, under a lot of pressure I become increasingly more emotional, and these outburts are just childish when measured objectively. Usually I am very good at dealing with criticism, it only annoys me if I think it's incorrect, but I don't take it personally. When I'm tired I do, and then I sulk and descend into martyrdom. I don't know if this counts, but I do overindulge in coffee under stress, which usually just makes everything a lot worse (imagine me, becoming a laboratory experiment of a nervous coffee mouse... I shake like a mouse).
> 
> The shadow xSFJ not so much. That's not stress me, that's just how I was when I was younger and more immature, perhaps. Especially at teens (lol, show me a teen who isn't argumentative, gloomy and critical... but you get the picture). I am still sceptical and somewhat annoyed with imcompetence, but I'm trying to find more mature ways to express myself; one part is due to my environment reacting badly to my insensitivity, and one part because I noticed this flaw in my and wanted to treat my fellow humans better. It still keeps me on my toes with people.


I would guess ENTP=Ne, Ti, Fe, Si or INTP= Ti, Ne, Si, Fe. Or maybe ESTP=Se, Ti, Fe, Ni or ISTP=Ti, Se, Ni, Fe before? Ne and Se can look alike. Ne wants to go on adventures with it's ideas. Se wants to go on actual physical adventures.


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Kiriae said:


> Do you perhaps also tend to thoroughly clean the house till it shines and everything gets in order when stress hits you really hard despite usually not paying much attention to such stuff?


Well, my usual custom is to spray cleanser to give the illusion of a clean house... Folks can always tell when I'm mad or having exam week when I have taken out the vacuum and duster. It's an unconscious way to 'clean' one's life, I suppose (oh, very believable kitchen psychology, at least I tried).

Oh, but another problem: I did some reading about "Ti grip", and there were some elements of familiarity there. At least in confirms that my focus turns inward during grip (but does my Ti fix Si, or Si fix Ti I cannot yet say: especially during lengthy episodes it can be harder to define which function caused the issue to begin with). I guess I'll have to read the "Return of Equilibrium" in both cases more carefully and continue introspection, so I can see which introverted function is the troublemaker and which one is left to deal with it. Thanks for linking the article (albeit it led me into a rabbit hole )



Kiriae said:


> BTW. It makes me think my father is an ENTP too after all(I suppose he is one but for me he is too emotional: he is very sensitive to rejection and gets angry easily).
> He certainly does the obsessive house cleaning when he gets really pissed and he takes pills like candies whenever he thinks "something is taking him down". He can also take them "just in case".


Well, I do those things and understand his struggle... I guess it's not unheard of for a tertiary Fe to be sensitive sometimes... I could be, for sure (I think past experiences could play a big role in this). And I happen to know an ISTP who is very irritable, shows his Fe but isn't very comfortable that way. Anyway, the obsessive cleaning to channel uncomfortable emotions. Check. Resorting to pills as a last resort when connecting to Si has backfired. Check. 

@Kitty23, let me see... I'm not much of a doer, I prefer theory, big time, and always have. To me an idea of something has proven to be way better than the "real deal", in most cases anyway. This is why I doubt the xSTP is possible typing. The combination of Se-Ni seems unlikely in comparison to Ne and Si mingling together which seems to be going on. So I still think it boils down to confusion between ESFJ and ENTP... largely thanks to our internet description of the two types. 

--
Big thanks to you! I have a feeling that my type is about to clarify, and without your help it wouldn't have been possible! Just need to do some extensive reading on the subject...

Oh! And if anyone feels like they could contribute to this, there is still time!


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## Kitty23 (Dec 27, 2015)

> let me see... I'm not much of a doer, I prefer theory, big time, and always have. To me an idea of something has proven to be way better than the "real deal", in most cases anyway. This is why I doubt the xSTP is possible typing. The combination of Se-Ni seems unlikely in comparison to Ne and Si mingling together which seems to be going on. So I still think it boils down to confusion between ESFJ and ENTP... largely thanks to our internet description of the two types.
> 
> --
> Big thanks to you! I have a feeling that my type is about to clarify, and without your help it wouldn't have been possible! Just need to do some extensive reading on the subject...


ESFJ= Fe, Si, Ne, Ti
ENTP= Ne, Ti, Fe, Si 

How easy is it for you to absorb others emotions?
Do you come off as bubbly to others? 
How easy is it for you to brainstorm ideas?
How random and scattered do you sound to others?


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