# Romantic vs Pathetic



## missushoney (May 16, 2011)

kaleidoscope said:


> I agree completely with this. I was with an INFJ 9w1. He slowly gave up his needs, his entire sense of self for me. When I met him, he was this funny, sweet and quirky guy. When we broke up, I couldn't recognize him anymore because of how much he lost his identity. He too, was _*overly *_romantic. He wanted to talk all the time, thought about me the entire day, did absolutely nothing else and talked to no one.
> 
> It was too much for me. He got too clingy, too needy and I felt suffocated. It wasn't fulfilling to me at all :\ I want a man who has a life, interests, connections outside of me. I am much, much more comfortable being with a more reserved man, one who just enjoys spending time with me without all the embellishments and the fluff, that pressure to be "romantic". I want a man I can have intelligent discussions with, not exchange mushy talk with 24/7. Some girls might be extremely fulfilled being with someone like my ex, but I certainly wasn't.


That's too bad. I think you could also call that one "being inexperienced" as well. He probably hadn't had a lot of experience in relationships and gotten his heart broken enough to learn how to take care of himself first. I was that way when I was younger (I'm INFJ too), but as time went on I got tired of worrying about people and trying to call them and put myself out there. I think one of the best things you can do for yourself is learn to like/love someone without sacrificing who you are. It's tough for us so that's why we usually seek out people who like that we are easily influenced by them rather than scared off. It's why I end up going for someone who takes time to warm up to me because I know that once he likes me, that's it. I don't have to try to change or be anything special or constantly keep him entertained.


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## Library_Cat (Apr 5, 2012)

Shinji Mimura said:


> This is how I've learned when I just got used for a one-night stand.
> 
> Girl: "So, what would you say tonight means to you?" (in reference to the sex we had)
> Me: "Well...I mean, clearly it was fun for us. But, I mean, I suppose it's always possible that maybe from this we could talk more, hang out again, just kinda see where things go. If they don't go anywhere, that's totally cool. But I figure that since this was nice, it'd be nice if we did it again sometime."
> ...


This really sounds like the rant I've been doing in my head for the past few days... I had been hoping for a relationship with a friend of mine, but it would seem that all he was interested in was a momentary distraction from some things that were going on in his life. I wondered for a while if expressing my wish for a possible "starting point" was somehow "clingy" or "possessive," but I really don't think it is. Just a misunderstanding about a difference in expectations. Now that I think about it, maybe that's all anyone really means when they call somebody creepy, anyway.


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## Shinji Mimura (Aug 1, 2012)

Library_Cat said:


> This really sounds like the rant I've been doing in my head for the past few days... I had been hoping for a relationship with a friend of mine, but it would seem that all he was interested in was a momentary distraction from some things that were going on in his life. I wondered for a while if expressing my wish for a possible "starting point" was somehow "clingy" or "possessive," but I really don't think it is. Just a misunderstanding about a difference in expectations. Now that I think about it, maybe that's all anyone really means when they call somebody creepy, anyway.


As a writer, I try my hardest to stay away from commonly-misused words because I wouldn't want to be pigeonholed in the same group as the people who misuse them.

Among this list of commonly-misused words is "creepy."

It's really clear to me that people feel that anything that violates any sort of norm, or any thought in their very head, can be described as creepy. I remember I once asked my sociology class, "Why is it so wrong that some guy just goes up to some person and starts a conversation? Isn't that how friendships begin? Taking a chance with a stranger?" One of the responses, "Because that's creepy." Another "Because he probably just wants sex."

To me, this really shows that people not only don't socialize properly, but they glorify and hold onto the idea that people aren't worth talking to. They then demonize it, and now socialization begins to die in the eyes of many.

Creepy goes hand in hand with clingy and possessive. While many of us go to the more logical definition of clingy, such as "not respecting already-established privacy, dependency that goes well beyond the level that is ordinary between the two people, etc", some people have called me clingy because my ex and I texted each other every day when we were together.

To me, that isn't clingy at all. It's not like we MADE each other do it. We did it because we loved each other and liked talking and didn't live together.

So, what I've come to learn of this is, really, people are some selfish, loveless douchebags, and their friends only help promote their shitty behavior to them.

I've also learned that, really, no amount of talking prior to sex will matter. If you haven't taken the time to establish a SEXLESS relationship with somebody beforehand, there's absolutely no telling what'll happen after sex. If you're lucky, they will understand and have, if anything, a FWB relationship with you and things will go smoothly.

However, that's a gamble I'm honestly not really willing to take anymore. I'm totally down for quick sex...if you're forthright and say, "Hey, this is just a once-only thing." But, yeah, I'm not really prepared to meet a girl, find things in common, etc, make it clear that we could either be A. good friends or B. fuckbuddies, and then wind up getting the result of C. a one-night stand cloaked in a friendship's disguise.


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## ElectricHead (Jun 3, 2011)

Shinji Mimura said:


> So, yeah, I suppose some girls might argue that went "into the pathetic/creepy zone", but, too me, if all you wanted was my dick for a quick fix...fuckin say that. I'm not going to think badly of you.* If anything, I might fuck you better knowing this is my 1 chance I get.* And why would you even ask? If I had said "it was just a one night stand" would you have fucked me again?


:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Laguna (Mar 21, 2012)

I had a couple of stalkers years ago who entered the creep zone big time. Like the hair on your arm stands on end creep zone.
Still get the creeps when I think about it to this day. But overall I'm a romantic at heart. And if he can't hold my hand, steal a kiss here and there and surprise me occasionally with a romantic gesture- then just forget it. He can go and be with someone else.


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## ElectricHead (Jun 3, 2011)

Buying a girl flowers. Romantic
Buying her a flower for every special hour she's brought sunshine into your life. Creepy.

Sending a private facebook message pretending to be jealous - kind of cute from what I've heard. 
Sending a public facebook message asking why that one guy commented on your photo - creepy.

Bringing you a surprise lunch - Romantic
Telling her that you know what she likes because you watch her eat - kind of creepy.

Leaving a note before leaving work saying "I will miss you". Romantic
Leaving her 11 voice mails asking if taking it slow is overrated. Creepy.

A bottle of wine on a table with a candlelit dinner. - romantic
A tub of Vaseline sitting next to a candlelit shrine of her on your dresser - romantic also.

Eye contact and smiling. Romantic
Eye contact and smiling like Captain Scary Eyes- way creepy.






(someone keep it going?)


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

Romance is subjective. For some people romance is a more sexualized or sensual thing involving physicality and gifts and spontaneous outings or something (I would find this romantic) but for others it's more romantic to read poetry to one another, or sing to someone over the phone or something more ...hmm...I don't know, but I don't dig that kind of thing. I met this guy like in May who I thought was an ENFJ, maybe. I thought he was really cool the first day I met him. But then he ruined it by being what I perceived as ridiculous: he wanted to spend my birthday with me if I had no other plans, and I had met him only one time; he said things like "I think we owe it to one another to get know each other better" and sang some French song to me on the phone as soon as I answered because I had mentioned I minored in French in college. WAY OVERKILL. I later found out (after he disappeared for like a month) that his father had died recently and he said he was going through a bad time; he really overexplained too. But I realized A) he was acting pathetically needy because he was suffering from grief but B) I didn't want to be around someone who acted that desperate after ONE INTERACTION WITH ME.

I find that kind of "romance" contrived and pathetic, because it seems false or pretentious to me, and too fanciful. Channeling Petrarch much?

Yeah I felt sorry for him, but I refused to get involved with him or even see him again. I wished him well, but wanted nothing to do with it.

I think the line where anything tends to become pathetic is when the other person is your entire world; like you'd die without them. That's a sign something is missing in YOU and you expect to be completed by a human being. Two whole people make a romantic relationship; two half people trying to make a whole often make a pathetic or dysfunctional relationship.

I don't deny that I've been pathetic at some points in the past myself, though.


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

Shinji Mimura said:


> This is how I've learned when I just got used for a one-night stand.
> 
> Girl: "So, what would you say tonight means to you?" (in reference to the sex we had)
> Me: "Well...I mean, clearly it was fun for us. But, I mean, I suppose it's always possible that maybe from this we could talk more, hang out again, just kinda see where things go. If they don't go anywhere, that's totally cool. But I figure that since this was nice, it'd be nice if we did it again sometime."
> ...


It may be the opposite of what you think. It might not have seemed clingy or needy, but actually too cold. Maybe you never saw or heard from her again because she thought you just wanted a fuck buddy. Did you ever call her, just out of curiosity? Or did you put all of the responsibility on her to contact you? 




> So, yeah, I suppose some girls might argue that went "into the pathetic/creepy zone", but, too me, if all you wanted was my dick for a quick fix...fuckin say that. I'm not going to think badly of you. If anything, I might fuck you better knowing this is my 1 chance I get. And why would you even ask? If I had said "it was just a one night stand" would you have fucked me again?
> 
> Oh well, this is one reason I'm really passed fucking girls too soon. It can work out, but most of the time I was just being used and I didn't realize it til the next morn.
> 
> ...


Oh dear. 



> Haha, funny rape jokes aside, I'd heard a girl took up his offer but then rejected it. Taking his to defense, I messaged her on Facebook and tried to stand up for him. Her response:
> 
> "Well, he's a nice guy and maybe we would've tried a date, but every time I talk to him he keeps wanting me to have sex with him."
> 
> ...


Not romantic. Not even pathetic. Just ...gross. 



> YOU NEVER TELL THE GIRL "OMG YES I WANT TO BONE YOU!" BE SMOOTH! BE DON JUAN DE LA NOOCH!
> 
> I'm so glad I'm not a girl; I don't have to put up with men and that bullshit, "Because I am male, suuuuurely I'm special enough that you just instinctively want to fuck me, amirite?"
> 
> Instead, I get the better counterpart: "Because I'm a girl and don't want to come off as a penis-starved whore, I'm just going to use this poor guy for a pity fuck and then never talk to him again LOLTWEETIT!"


Hmmm. This happens to you often? Are you sure?


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## Solrac026 (Mar 6, 2012)

Yardiff Bey said:


> I'm beginning to think that romance is a crock of shit. One designed for the woman's convenience, not the man's. /brood


One woman's romance is another woman's creepy [noun]. Can't fill in the blank, but I think I make my point.


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## Solrac026 (Mar 6, 2012)

Shinji Mimura said:


> As a writer, I try my hardest to stay away from commonly-misused words because I wouldn't want to be pigeonholed in the same group as the people who misuse them.
> 
> Among this list of commonly-misused words is "creepy."
> 
> ...


It's amazing how women always talk about honesty, but are hardly ever in the mood to be honest themselves.


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## Icebreaker (Aug 20, 2012)

Well depends on the person . 'You are beautyful'. The same line would strike as a compliment to a creative person and as shallow to a porn star or celeberity its a matter of thinking and circumstances .


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## Shinji Mimura (Aug 1, 2012)

fourtines said:


> It may be the opposite of what you think. It might not have seemed clingy or needy, but actually too cold. Maybe you never saw or heard from her again because she thought you just wanted a fuck buddy. Did you ever call her, just out of curiosity? Or did you put all of the responsibility on her to contact you?
> 
> Hmmm. This happens to you often? Are you sure?


1. Of course. If you and I had a good time, sexually or otherwise, I'd surely call you sooner or later to indulge in more fun times. I could be wrong, but I believe that's referred to as "friendship." Even if we aren't on that level, we are, at the very least, acquaintances that have a good time together. But, yes, all the girls that I later learned used me had been contacted (not repeatedly or in a clingy way, mind you).

2. It's not that it HAPPENS often, it's that it has happened enough times for me to file a complaint and to do-away with meaningless sex, unless I'm aware of her thoughts on it and so on and so forth.


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

Shinji Mimura said:


> 1. Of course. If you and I had a good time, sexually or otherwise, I'd surely call you sooner or later to indulge in more fun times. I could be wrong, but I believe that's referred to as "friendship." Even if we aren't on that level, we are, at the very least, acquaintances that have a good time together. But, yes, all the girls that I later learned used me had been contacted (not repeatedly or in a clingy way, mind you).
> 
> 2. It's not that it HAPPENS often, it's that it has happened enough times for me to file a complaint and to do-away with meaningless sex, unless I'm aware of her thoughts on it and so on and so forth.


So you do follow up with these girls? You call them? Or email them? And they still fall off of the face of the earth?

Are you selfish in bed?


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## Shinji Mimura (Aug 1, 2012)

fourtines said:


> So you do follow up with these girls? You call them? Or email them? And they still fall off of the face of the earth?
> 
> Are you selfish in bed?


I usually text first. If nothing, I might be compelled to either call or send them a message on Facebook, it depends. Some of them were straight up in their disappearance, others just played the ninja smoke grenade game.

Nope, not selfish at all. I'm more about what she wants, so selfless is more like it.


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

Shinji Mimura said:


> I usually text first. If nothing, I might be compelled to either call or send them a message on Facebook, it depends. Some of them were straight up in their disappearance, others just played the ninja smoke grenade game.
> 
> Nope, not selfish at all. I'm more about what she wants, so selfless is more like it.


Oh I don't know. Usually if a person keeps attracting the same type of person, it is something they are doing. Like maybe you weren't as open as you thought, or waited for them to contact you, or were selfish toward them, but if it's none of that...maybe you're attracted to women who treat you badly?

Because I can promise you all women aren't like this, if this has happened to you repeatedly, I don't think that's the norm. Unless you brought them all home from bars.


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## Shinji Mimura (Aug 1, 2012)

fourtines said:


> Because I can promise you all women aren't like this


I never said they were, nor am I so unintelligent that I'd make a blanket statement like "all women _____________."

No, there is no pattern here, just a series of bad luck in my youth. But I curbed said bad luck by raising my standards, as well as by just not jumping into sexual activities so soon.

Also, I'm in no way attracted to women who treat me badly. I abhor such people that are into that sort of thing. Like I said, no use trying to make any sort of connection. I've learned from my mistakes many moons ago. I am merely writing of them here.


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

Shinji Mimura said:


> I never said they were, nor am I so unintelligent that I'd make a blanket statement like "all women _____________."
> 
> No, there is no pattern here, just a series of bad luck in my youth. But I curbed said bad luck by raising my standards, as well as by just not jumping into sexual activities so soon.
> 
> Also, I'm in no way attracted to women who treat me badly. I abhor such people that are into that sort of thing. Like I said, no use trying to make any sort of connection. I've learned from my mistakes many moons ago. I am merely writing of them here.


Okey dokey. Just trying to help. Didn't mean it as an insult, I just thought it was odd that you said you had kept meeting women who would use you for sex and disappear. I know it happens, but it's not the female standard, generally speaking.


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

Solrac026 said:


> It's amazing how women always talk about honesty, but are hardly ever in the mood to be honest themselves.


I think this is bullshit. I was very honest with someone tonight, pathetic even. I always am with people I love and respect, I'm quite honest.

I also have an ESFJ friend who is about 15-20 years older than me who is quite...forthright. It's interesting to me that she and I are both like this, but with her it's a matter of constantly talking and extending personal info to create a bond, even with new acquaintances (Fe) and I'm more reticent but once you get to know me I'm quite blunt. But the end result is that we're both pretty forthright people who are honest and cut-the-crap about relationships, even if we take different paths to get there. 

So I don't even think it's type related. I know that there are "fake" ESFJs and ISFPs who don't speak up out of fear of confrontation, just as there are big-on-Fe-sharing-type ESFJs and more Fi "authenticity is everything" ISFPs like myself. 

Somehow the poster in question (and apparently you) have a knack for attracting sneaky women. But I'm really puzzled as to who these sneaky over-sexed whores are. I know these women are out there, but attracting them habitually would take great skill or a penchant for a particular type of woman who is bad for you (just like when women are sometimes attracted habitually to "playa" types).


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## Shinji Mimura (Aug 1, 2012)

fourtines said:


> Okey dokey. Just trying to help. Didn't mean it as an insult, I just thought it was odd that you said you had kept meeting women who would use you for sex and disappear. I know it happens, but it's not the female standard, generally speaking.


Mm, I didn't take it as an insult.

I'm aware. It doesn't help that I was young and so were the females; around the 18-20 bracket, we were collectively.

But, yeah, all the more reason to raise standards and increases your chances for a better quality of living and better quality of people in your life.


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## Paradox1987 (Oct 9, 2010)

Depends by what you mean by romance. I mean I won't lie I'm a sucker for romance, and I am relatively "romantic". But it's my idea of romance. E.g. I've had a woman say "I'd do anything for you" to me in a relationship, which is a nice sentiment, but it's not romantic, it's platitudinous. That's the problem with romance. Go straight in to the deep end and declare your undying love quickly and you look (for sound reasons) a bit unhinged. If you are romantic for the sake of being romantic then you end up just spouting platitudes.

To be honest, the best way to wield romance IMO is in the form of the metaphor/similie, but be imaginative, don't just quote Shakespeare or Austen (even if you can get away with it), and be able to back it up or expound on it. Of course, that's all me. Other people may find other things romantic.


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## Alysaria (Jul 7, 2009)

Romantic is unselfish affection.
Pathetic is selfish affection. 

Romantic is assertive
Pathetic is possessive

Romantic is rooted in independence and mutual happiness. 
Pathetic is rooted in insecurity and desperation to have the other person or the relationship itself.


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## Christina Breann (May 8, 2011)

missushoney said:


> Exactly. It's sad because he still tries to contact me. He thinks that we're going to be together in the future but that's not going to happen. The relationship was mostly just him feeling great for having someone like me and me feeling upset for not having someone I really wanted. I had to be the stable one taking care of him basically and that wasn't what I'd signed up for.


That is Exactly what I had with my ISFJ ex. He hated himself so much that having a long-term girlfriend was, in his eyes, his only source of affirmation. I felt like I was in an emotional prison. If I told him I was uncomfortable with something between us, he would be hurt-beyond-repair and passive aggressively scold me for being "mean" to him. He wanted a pet he could cuddle with and call his own, not a relationship where there was open communication where either of us could safely air our ideas/feelings. He even AGREED WITH ME when I snapped and told him he only "loved" me when I was sick (back when I was in and out of hospitals). He said "you were sweeter then..and didn't have so many opinions." 

And almost a year after the break-up, he tells me, very hurt, "I sound like an axxhole in your eyes."

I told him he wasn't. I excused his behavior for overall immaturity---that his actions were all Unintentional manipulation. 

Now I'm not so sure.


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## missushoney (May 16, 2011)

Christina Breann said:


> That is Exactly what I had with my ISFJ ex. He hated himself so much that having a long-term girlfriend was, in his eyes, his only source of affirmation. I felt like I was in an emotional prison. If I told him I was uncomfortable with something between us, he would be hurt-beyond-repair and passive aggressively scold me for being "mean" to him. He wanted a pet he could cuddle with and call his own, not a relationship where there was open communication where either of us could safely air our ideas/feelings. He even AGREED WITH ME when I snapped and told him he only "loved" me when I was sick (back when I was in and out of hospitals). He said "you were sweeter then..and didn't have so many opinions."
> 
> And almost a year after the break-up, he tells me, very hurt, "I sound like an axxhole in your eyes."
> 
> ...



Yeah, he sounds kind of selfish; only wanting you when you do the things he likes. My ex wasn't mean or manipulative like that. He just wasn't the right person for me. For your case though I like to use "Bride Wars" as an example because I think the relationship between Anne Hathaway and the guy she plans to marry is realistic and that kind of story is not told usually. I don't know if you've seen it but basically Anne has been with this guy for a while and they are going to get married but then her best friend likes to compete with her about everything so she wants to get married too before Anne. So the two end up going at each other and trying to sabotage each others' weddings. When you first look at the relationships you think that the friend is too crazy and headstrong, but you see that no matter what she's like, her man loves her to death and supports her and pretty much thinks she's great. Anne on the other hand seems to have a good relationship with her man but you start to notice that it's because she agrees with everything he says and doesn't quite get to have her own personality. But when she starts letting herself compete and be crazy like her friend, her guy doesn't like who she has become and doesn't support her and wants her to just be agreeable like before. 

I think that this kind of lesson is the best to learn when it comes to relationships because I think people can save time and energy and heartache when they show their true selves and allow themselves to be loved for who they are. Your ex is not emotionally healthy. There's no questioning that. And I'm glad you realized it before it became too hard to get out of it. You deserve better. And I hope you're doing better now. T_T I don't like people to be sick.


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## Christina Breann (May 8, 2011)

missushoney said:


> Yeah, he sounds kind of selfish; only wanting you when you do the things he likes. My ex wasn't mean or manipulative like that. He just wasn't the right person for me. For your case though I like to use "Bride Wars" as an example because I think the relationship between Anne Hathaway and the guy she plans to marry is realistic and that kind of story is not told usually. I don't know if you've seen it but basically Anne has been with this guy for a while and they are going to get married but then her best friend likes to compete with her about everything so she wants to get married too before Anne. So the two end up going at each other and trying to sabotage each others' weddings. When you first look at the relationships you think that the friend is too crazy and headstrong, but you see that no matter what she's like, her man loves her to death and supports her and pretty much thinks she's great. Anne on the other hand seems to have a good relationship with her man but you start to notice that it's because she agrees with everything he says and doesn't quite get to have her own personality. But when she starts letting herself compete and be crazy like her friend, her guy doesn't like who she has become and doesn't support her and wants her to just be agreeable like before.
> 
> I think that this kind of lesson is the best to learn when it comes to relationships because I think people can save time and energy and heartache when they show their true selves and allow themselves to be loved for who they are. Your ex is not emotionally healthy. There's no questioning that. And I'm glad you realized it before it became too hard to get out of it. You deserve better. And I hope you're doing better now. T_T I don't like people to be sick.


Within the context of the movie, I remember thinking both Anne and Kate were way too immature and insane..and sided with Anne's fiance xD I had never considered that their relationship was based on something uneven like that--it honestly hadn't crossed my mind! But I guess you're right haha. Still, I do believe Anne was still in the wrong and that whole mess was just...a mess..lol

And yes! -^ ^- I'm actually engaged to an INTJ <3 <3 <3 He's very supportive and always asking for my opinions and never ever raises his voice or throws passive aggressive tantrums when things don't go his way <3 <3 <3


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## missushoney (May 16, 2011)

Christina Breann said:


> Within the context of the movie, I remember thinking both Anne and Kate were way too immature and insane..and sided with Anne's fiance xD I had never considered that their relationship was based on something uneven like that--it honestly hadn't crossed my mind! But I guess you're right haha. Still, I do believe Anne was still in the wrong and that whole mess was just...a mess..lol
> 
> And yes! -^ ^- I'm actually engaged to an INTJ <3 <3 <3 He's very supportive and always asking for my opinions and never ever raises his voice or throws passive aggressive tantrums when things don't go his way <3 <3 <3


haha. Yeah, I actually thought she was silly too in the beginning. My mom was the one who showed me that bit of wisdom. And not to mention, when Anne was being herself, the hot brother liked her. If only that would happen in real life. -_-

Yay! That's great that you're engaged. I like INTJ's too. My best friend is one and we call each other twins because we click so well. But I wish the best for you. ^_^


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## Joseph (Jun 20, 2012)

Romantic = Attractive and sweet
Pathetic = Unattractive and possessive


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## Nowhere Man (Apr 22, 2012)

Attractive person shows affection = romantic
Unattractive person shows affection = pathetic


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## thegreatandthesmall (Aug 22, 2012)

There was a period of time in my life where I thought I was totally cold and efficient in the love and romance game. I liked being aloof and not committed to anyone. I realize now that if I had let myself be myself, I could have found happiness in at least one of those relationships. As I reflect upon this, none of them were creepy or too clingy I just didn't want to let anyone in close enough to see a flaw or fear of getting hurt. In the moment I guess I found some of these guys very needy and pathetic, really they only loved me and thought I loved them but I couldn't be bothered to give anything of myself back. BOO HOOO! Looking back I was a real bitch.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Alysaria said:


> Romantic is unselfish affection.
> Pathetic is selfish affection.
> 
> Romantic is assertive
> ...


I could not have said it better myself. Kudos and Thank You for posting! )


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## searcheagle (Sep 4, 2011)

Joseph said:


> Romantic = Attractive and sweet
> Pathetic = Unattractive and possessive


Romantic=The girl likes you
Pathetic=The girl doesn't like you


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## searcheagle (Sep 4, 2011)

thegreatandthesmall said:


> There was a period of time in my life where I thought I was totally cold and efficient in the love and romance game. I liked being aloof and not committed to anyone. I realize now that if I had let myself be myself, I could have found happiness in at least one of those relationships. As I reflect upon this, none of them were creepy or too clingy I just didn't want to let anyone in close enough to see a flaw or fear of getting hurt. In the moment I guess I found some of these guys very needy and pathetic, really they only loved me and thought I loved them but I couldn't be bothered to give anything of myself back. BOO HOOO! Looking back I was a real bitch.


I think there is a real point in this. Allow yourself to be happy. I've talked with several people recently who (whether they admit it or not) will not allow their hearts to be open due to past pains, and therefore shut themselves off to new happiness.


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## nordlund63 (Jul 24, 2012)

yello said:


> If you are ridiculously good looking you can.
> 
> View attachment 46049


I saw that while it was happening. To be fair, he sent on at least dozens, more likely hundreds, and only got a few back.


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## refugee (Mar 26, 2010)

RabbitHeart said:


> Where is that fine line between romance and being completely codependent, creepy and pathetic?
> 
> Has anyone ever said or done something to you that ended up being much creepier and more pathetic than they probably intended?
> 
> or have you personally ever gone too far, or gotten too caught up with someone too quickly?


God I hate that word: codependence.

I have a mortal fear of becoming codependent or being in a relationship with a person who is.


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## AphroditeGoneAwry (Jan 10, 2012)

I think codependence is something you WANT to have/see in an intimate relationship. 

I really can't imagine having a relationship any other way. To me, it doesn't sound close enough.


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## Master Mind (Aug 15, 2011)

searcheagle said:


> I think there is a real point in this. Allow yourself to be happy. I've talked with several people recently who (whether they admit it or not) will not allow their hearts to be open due to past pains, and therefore shut themselves off to new happiness.


I've had a friend of mine tell me this.


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## refugee (Mar 26, 2010)

searcheagle said:


> Romantic=The girl likes you
> Pathetic=The girl doesn't like you


ahahahaha

Romantic=no hairy armpits
Pathetic=hairy armpits






justkidding


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## android654 (Jan 19, 2010)

AphroditeGoneAwry said:


> I think codependence is something you WANT to have/see in an intimate relationship.
> 
> I really can't imagine having a relationship any other way. To me, it doesn't sound close enough.


There is such a thing as too close.


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## AphroditeGoneAwry (Jan 10, 2012)

lol. I know that conceptually. 

I guess I sorta have known aspects of that in my personal life before.

But I don't have too much experience with it.


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## Christina Breann (May 8, 2011)

AphroditeGoneAwry said:


> I think codependence is something you WANT to have/see in an intimate relationship.
> 
> I really can't imagine having a relationship any other way. To me, it doesn't sound close enough.



Here's a nifty article about that..
Codependence

I think what you mean to say is "every relationship needs teamwork." You want to be Able to rely on your partner and vice versa, but you do not want to be their "god" and vice versa. Codependency KILLS individuality and emotional stability/strength. My ex had this crap Bad-----and it was Not pretty. 

Every "sweet" little gesture was inherently selfish because he was doing stereotypical things He Wanted to do to "please me" but not because he wanted to genuinely make me happy, but feel like he was a good boyfriend (and that I was selfish for not liking anything and everything he offered). He wanted me to be weaker so he could Feel stronger without ever actually having to carry any of the burden. 

Codependency is definitely the wrong word. Codependency is like a freaking mental disease. 

There's a difference between being intimate with someone enough to connect on multiple levels--and share your life and your troubles and your hopes and future--and being Trapped with someone who only wants the Illusion of these things, without exercising any sort of emotional maturity or sense of responsibility. 

Someone else mentioned earlier (I think it was in this thread) about how her boyfriend wouldn't help her carry in the groceries, but he wanted all of her physical attention while she was carrying all of the bags in. THAT is a prime example of what we're talking about here. He wants the illusion of intimacy without actually going out of his way to meet his partner's needs in a realistic manner. It's purely selfish and self-gratifying. THAT is codependency. Someone who NEEDS and never Truly Gives.


And that's how ALL abusive relationships last so long. Either the abused or the abuser (or both) are codependent of the other, regardless of whether or not the abuse itself outweighs whatever affirmation or "security" that codependent relationship has to offer.

__________________________________________________________________________________





refugee said:


> ahahahaha
> 
> Romantic=no hairy armpits
> Pathetic=hairy armpits
> ...



Just saw your profile. You have a thing for armpits, eh?


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## Persephone (Nov 14, 2009)

Yardiff Bey said:


> I'm beginning to think that romance is a crock of shit. One designed for the woman's convenience, not the man's. /brood


Ha. Nearly every man I've been with is more (outwardly) romantic than I am.


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