# Successful relationships that came from "not playing hard to get."



## daleks_exterminate (Jul 22, 2013)

Call me a terrible human being but I like mind games. 

However, the best relationship of my life: aka my current one didn't have any mind games 
@CaptSwan and I were friends on skype because of a mutual friend introduced us.
uh by the way thanks @LeoCat I owe you, big time.

we joked, laughed, lightly flirted but there wasn't anything more than friendship happening or so I thought. I started to fall for him, was honest about that & he told me he had liked me for a while. We just try to have open, honest communication. Long distance can be challenging, but I love him & am committed to making it work.


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## CaptSwan (Mar 31, 2013)

Daleks_exterminate said:


> Call me a terrible human being but I like mind games.
> 
> However, the best relationship of my life: aka my current one didn't have any mind games
> @_CaptSwan_ and I were friends on skype because of a mutual friend introduced us.
> ...


Awww!!! You're making salty fluid come out of my eyes! :happy:

Truth is, mind games can be very arousing; but, it can't be "all" mind games, there has to be a balance between the mind games and bonding, sharing and forging intimacy. Otherwise, it's an eternal chase; like Fenrir seeking to devour the moon.


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## Primeval (Dec 4, 2011)

CherishYourHeart said:


> What did you find hilarious about it? Please tell.


For reference: [Seduction] Ellen Fein - The Rules.pdf

If I was to critique the entire book it would be double its length. Bearing that in mind, I will focus solely on page six, as it is representative of the rest. Again, I speak from my perspective alone. And I didn't mean hilarious in a humorous context.

The stated purpose of the book, with up-spin removed, is the make the woman an object. If an exorbitant amount of effort is made necessary to acquire the object, this artificially inflates its value due to investment of resources. No mention is made of the actual _quality_ of the object. It doesn't matter if it functions as intended or is beautiful or interesting. Because so much was "spent" to get it, a great amount of resources are "wasted" if it is lost. 

A quote: "If you follow The Rules, you can rest assured that your husband will treat you like a queen - even when he's angry with you. Why? Because he spent so much time trying to get you."

This indirectly implies that his behavior is a direct result of the threat of you leaving him, therefore nullifying his previous investment. 

The two sentences that follow: "You have become so precious to him that he doesn't take you for granted. On the contrary, he thinks of you constantly." 

This same behavior pattern is exhibited in those who collect cars or expensive baseball cars. It's called obsession. 

The entire texts stated objective is to entice a man into owning you. The literal implication of ownership, not the legalistic.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

Daleks_exterminate said:


> Call me a terrible human being but I like mind games.
> 
> However, the best relationship of my life: aka my current one didn't have any mind games
> @CaptSwan and I were friends on skype because of a mutual friend introduced us.
> ...




With an LDR, I can definitely see that putting your cards on the table is worth it. Otherwise, you are waiting forever!


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

Primeval said:


> For reference: [Seduction] Ellen Fein - The Rules.pdf
> 
> If I was to critique the entire book it would be double its length. Bearing that in mind, I will focus solely on page six, as it is representative of the rest. Again, I speak from my perspective alone. And I didn't mean hilarious in a humorous context.
> 
> ...




While all of the long-term relationships that I've been involved a man pursuing me and courting (and a floozy that involved me pursuing a guy), I will say that a man can still get angry at you or treat you poorly once the courtship phase is over. I'm not dismissing courtship. Courtship can tell who is trying to impress you and who isn't, but it's no guarantee of a relationship not turning abusive or broken.


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## Aya the Abysswalker (Mar 23, 2012)

CherishYourHeart said:


> If you're a woman, you know you've been told to play hard to get to get the guy.


I never been told that. I'm rather oblivious about whatever guys want me or not, actually... I don't play hard to get, I'm just me. People might think I'm easy actually because I'm kind.



> My question is: how many of you guys fell madly in love with a woman that did NOT play hard to get?


I don't know... My best friend has a huge crush on me. And of course, my fiancée.



> If she doesn't play hard to get, she risks getting dumped or cheated on (according to these dating gurus).


I've never had that happen. People dumped me a lot because they saw me a little sister, an equal sometimes.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

Well we are not together now so its not 'successful'. But I did marry my ex spouse without having ever played hard to get. 

Actually every serious relationship I had I did not play hard to get.

A few evolved from friendships tho I should say, was not necessarily that we pounced each other immediate.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

Cinnamon83 said:


> Well we are not together now so its not 'successful'. But I did marry my ex spouse without having ever played hard to get.
> 
> Actually every serious relationship I had I did not play hard to get.
> 
> A few evolved from friendships tho I should say, was not necessarily that we pounced each other immediate.


I guess the question is he really liked you or went ga ga over you, even though you didn't play hard to get?

I think that if you don't play hard to get, you're not necessarily "easy."


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## snail (Oct 13, 2008)

I didn't play hard to get. I've never been into that. There have been times in my past when I was too shy to immediately let guys know I was interested, but that isn't the same thing. I pretty much always eventually told them. If any of them had shown an interest, I would have eagerly accepted their advances without pretending anything or being inauthentic about my feelings.

I married someone really wonderful a couple of years ago. We met online. I noticed that he had briefly checked out my dating profile but hadn't left a message. I looked at his answers to the matching questions and found that we were a perfect match on every issue I considered important. We were listed as a 99% match and had answered over 500 questions identically. He was far too special to let get away so easily. The moment I realized that he was just right for me, I messaged him. There was no playing around with his feelings or seeming less interested than I really was. I didn't hold anything back. We started chatting. I painted him pictures about how much I wanted to be with him. Then, when he seemed receptive to the art, I told him directly that I was interested (which he already knew by that point because I had been making it pretty obvious) and he came to visit me in person, where we were both upfront about our feelings. Emotional openness still forms the foundation of our relationship even now that we have been happily married for a while, because it is one of our shared values.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

Snail-I value emotional openness, but I will admit that I've fallen prey to the "Men don't like emotional women that talk about their feelings" propaganda. 

Your story was inspiring to the point where I may seductively let a particular person know how I feel. If I don't, him and I may just be playing it cool for A LONG time. It's not like this is some sort of cold situation. He has already expressed interest, I've reciprocated, and we've went on a few dates.


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## Dashing (Sep 19, 2011)

I fucking hate mind games. You don't have to fuck me right off the bat ya know, just be honest about your intentions. 

Luckily I'm done wading through shitty people because I'm living with the woman I love. (And it's not my mother! Yay me!)


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## AriesLilith (Jan 6, 2013)

In my case, things with my husband happened pretty fast when we met.  We belonged to a group of friends and met when we were playing the same online game, then one day we started to talk on the messenger and somehow he invited me to hang out and I accepted. Then we went out a few times and talked constantly, and after around 3 weeks we started the relationship.

I used to want to take things longer before starting a relationship (I didn't have any before ours), but with him he just showed me that he is trustworthy and will value our relationship, so when we started liking each other things went fast lol.

From what I've learned, people either are compatible and have feelings for each other in the long run (not just passion but affection), or they don't, no matter how easy or play hard to get we do. It clicks or doesn't click. If it doesn't click, even after you play hard and is finally being together after a series of trials or events, you might find each other incompatible or have no real affection towards each other. You either bond in deeper levels or don't bond.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

Mind if I ask how do you know when you're in a relationship with each other?


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

I don't play hard to get. I am hard to get.


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## AriesLilith (Jan 6, 2013)

CherishYourHeart said:


> Mind if I ask how do you know when you're in a relationship with each other?


Here in our culture usually one asks the other if they want to be his/her gf/bf.  Not sure if this still remains true with the younger people, thought I guess that when two people start to know each other and know their expectations about long term relationships, it's kind of implicit if they tell each other that they start to have some feelings for each other and things develops.


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## lightwing (Feb 17, 2013)

Personally, I have low tolerance for games. I'd just as soon be on my own than with a woman who wants to play hard to get (or any other reindeer games for that matter). If I wasn't already taken, I'd be looking for someone who's honest and real.


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## EccentricSiren (Sep 3, 2013)

I think one very annoying side effect of the whole playing hard to get idea is that when a person genuinely is not interested, the pursuer takes it as playing hard to get and then tries even harder. I've had this happen to me before with people I had zero chance of becoming interested in, and now someone is acting the same way towards my younger sister.


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## Golden Rose (Jun 5, 2014)

There were no mind games between us, just a longass time before we both realized the fire burning inside of us and that it was time to go for it and stop trying to look elsewhere or suppress something so powerful. Once we were together, everything was on the table, sure he's reserved as hell and I have that kind of brain-mushing communication style but no matter how fast or slow everything comes out, we've both been extremely honest and straightforward about our own feelings and needs, with some playful bluntness. Occasionally I played hard to get, but in all truth I was harder to "get" before we smashed through each other's inner walls.


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## yentipeee (Jun 19, 2013)

You'll find a guy even if you play hard-to-get, it will just be a different type of guy.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

AriesLilith said:


> Here in our culture usually one asks the other if they want to be his/her gf/bf.  Not sure if this still remains true with the younger people, thought I guess that when two people start to know each other and know their expectations about long term relationships, it's kind of implicit if they tell each other that they start to have some feelings for each other and things develops.



Yes, that's my style and how I was raised. The man will ask you to be his girlfriend or to be exclusive. Even if he doesn't ask straight up, there are signs that he is developing feelings for you.


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

OrangeAppled said:


> This is what the dating gurus are talking about, although most advise waiting on sex as many women do not genuinely only want sex, and they may find themselves hurt if they play the game that way.
> 
> The idea here is to not scare men away by displaying desire for a committed relationship early on, but generally, showing physical attraction is fine (but not necessarily acting on it unless emotionally able to handle the consequences). You're supposed to appear to not care to rope him into any commitment, which is supposed to make you seem desirable as you're not "needy".
> 
> ...


Mm, I don't think I've ever gotten into a relationship out of "curiosity." I've had a lot of men try to get with me, and I only pick the ones that I'm uniquely attracted to. Perhaps you're not being picky enough. If you have a lot of people to choose from, you should really be more selective imo. I always pick men I feel something mutual with, not just the ones who are pursuing me strongly, and my experience has been that they become totally infatuated even once I do reciprocate. Sounds to me like you may have unintentionally let yourself get caught by pickup artists.


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## OrangeAppled (Jun 26, 2009)

devoid said:


> Mm, I don't think I've ever gotten into a relationship out of "curiosity." I've had a lot of men try to get with me, and I only pick the ones that I'm uniquely attracted to. Perhaps you're not being picky enough. If you have a lot of people to choose from, you should really be more selective imo. I always pick men I feel something mutual with, not just the ones who are pursuing me strongly, and my experience has been that they become totally infatuated even once I do reciprocate. Sounds to me like you may have unintentionally let yourself get caught by pickup artists.



Oh no, I have not gotten "picked up". I don't do casual sex, so those types would drop out fast, but they don't even bother with me. 

I am picky, which is why I go years without dating much at all, except here & there out of boredom and to fend off criticism that I don't give people a chance. 

The few times I have "picked" someone, the minute I show interest in dating and not just flirting, the person cools off quickly. That's the issue the dating gurus are advising on, and why they say stuff like "he's just not that into you". But when someone is THAT into me, then I often am not THAT into him (oh the contrariness!). Once in a great while, I have reciprocated over time with someone who pursued me, and it seems that as my attachment grows, then theirs wanes.


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

OrangeAppled said:


> Oh no, I have not gotten "picked up". I don't do casual sex, so those types would drop out fast, but they don't even bother with me.
> 
> I am picky, which is why I go years without dating much at all, except here & there out of boredom and to fend off criticism that I don't give people a chance.
> 
> The few times I have "picked" someone, the minute I show interest in dating and not just flirting, the person cools off quickly. That's the issue the dating gurus are advising on, and why they say stuff like "he's just not that into you". But when someone is THAT into me, then I often am not THAT into him (oh the contrariness!). Once in a great while, I have reciprocated over time with someone who pursued me, and it seems that as my attachment grows, then theirs wanes.


Oh, pick up artists aren't all out for casual sex. I know a guy who's a pickup artist who hates sex. He finds young, attractive women in bars, woos them for the thrill, goes on a few dates for a while and then tosses them aside when he gets bored or when they get too attached. Sometimes he never even has sex with them. This is pretty common. Men who chase women for sport and for an ego boost.

That's the problem with the "game." People who play it the best are sociopaths. Either that, or they're so used to playing they don't know what actual intimacy is.

What I'm hearing is that you avoid dating in general, and every so often you go out with one guy for an extended period of time until one of you gets bored with the other. The problem with this is that if you spend that much time with someone you don't feel a spark for, you're never going to meet the ones you do feel something with. I don't know about you, but personally I always know if I'm compatible with a guy on a first date. If I don't feel something within the first couple hours of meeting a guy, that chemistry just doesn't exist. And yeah, sure, if you date someone for long enough you may start to develop feelings as we all do. But it will never be as intense as it is with the people you just click with immediately. Don't waste your time with anyone who's less than exhilarating up front.


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## OrangeAppled (Jun 26, 2009)

devoid said:


> Oh, pick up artists aren't all out for casual sex. I know a guy who's a pickup artist who hates sex. He finds young, attractive women in bars, woos them for the thrill, goes on a few dates for a while and then tosses them aside when he gets bored or when they get too attached. Sometimes he never even has sex with them. This is pretty common. Men who chase women for sport and for an ego boost.
> 
> That's the problem with the "game." People who play it the best are sociopaths. Either that, or they're so used to playing they don't know what actual intimacy is.
> 
> What I'm hearing is that you avoid dating in general, and every so often you go out with one guy for an extended period of time until one of you gets bored with the other. The problem with this is that if you spend that much time with someone you don't feel a spark for, you're never going to meet the ones you do feel something with. I don't know about you, but personally I always know if I'm compatible with a guy on a first date. If I don't feel something within the first couple hours of meeting a guy, that chemistry just doesn't exist. And yeah, sure, if you date someone for long enough you may start to develop feelings as we all do. But it will never be as intense as it is with the people you just click with immediately. Don't waste your time with anyone who's less than exhilarating up front.


I don't meet men in bars or typical singles' scenes....usually through mutual acquaintances, and in the past, online.

It's more like the guy calls/texts me a lot, and I finally agree to go out with him a few times. I might start warming to the idea of dating, and then he'll lose interest. But I'm not hurt by it because, no, I didn't care much to begin with. I suppose "attachment" was too strong of a word, as perhaps that's only happened once and it was a longer relationship, with initial, mutual chemistry, but I was not as strongly interested as he was.

I don't know if I'm wasting time or if it's a problem to do so if it's because I am bored and want "filler". 

Mutual chemistry where we both want to actually date & it actually happens is extremely rare for me. It's maybe happened a handful of times in life...at the most.


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

OrangeAppled said:


> I don't meet men in bars or typical singles' scenes....usually through mutual acquaintances, and in the past, online.
> 
> It's more like the guy calls/texts me a lot, and I finally agree to go out with him a few times. I might start warming to the idea of dating, and then he'll lose interest. But I'm not hurt by it because, no, I didn't care much to begin with. I suppose "attachment" was too strong of a word, as perhaps that's only happened once and it was a longer relationship, with initial, mutual chemistry, but I was not as strongly interested as he was.
> 
> ...


Yeah, definitely a problem with method. Mutual friends and online... doesn't really help with chemistry. A huge amount of romantic attraction is just about physical chemistry, something you can't know until you're in person together. It's almost impossible to find people with that kind of chemistry online, and through friends is a kind of small pool to draw from. It's easier to meet someone at a bar, or at a conference, some sort of meeting, party, etc. Somewhere with a lot of different people. If you're picking from people your friends introduce you, you'll probably meet less people than you would going to a coffee shop for ten minutes.

I think you would benefit from becoming the instigator in relationships. If it's so rare for you to feel chemistry, you need to be the one to pick a man out of a crowd and say, "I want that one." There's no better way to get what you want than to go out and take it.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

OrangeAppled said:


> This is what the dating gurus are talking about, although most advise waiting on sex as many women do not genuinely only want sex, and they may find themselves hurt if they play the game that way.
> 
> The idea here is to not scare men away by displaying desire for a committed relationship early on, but generally, showing physical attraction is fine (but not necessarily acting on it unless emotionally able to handle the consequences). You're supposed to appear to not care to rope him into any commitment, which is supposed to make you seem desirable as you're not "needy". However, you're also supposed to boost his ego by showing you find him attractive. That's why they often suggest "mixed signals" - attraction without need.
> 
> ...


 I find that mentioning commitment and that you want a serious relationship right away can either scare people or invite people that lie. I'm not being cynical, but I've seen some people lie and pretend to be serious, just to give a woman what she wants to hear. Nobody is dumb enough to say, "I'm just going to date you and pretend to be serious, so I can have sex with you." 

I HATE it when women pressure me into negotiating the "talk" with a man that I just met. My male friends don't care. I feel like my male friends are more understanding of the "getting to know you" phase, instead of assuming that someone is automatically your boyfriend/husband when you just went on one date.

I'm not demeaning men and saying that they don't want relationships. They do. But, you may find yourself running into those that don't want it along the way.

I think a lot of women can easily get hit on, but today's hook-up culture makes it challenging to find out who genuinely wants a relationship with you.


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## yentipeee (Jun 19, 2013)

CherishYourHeart said:


> I find that mentioning commitment and that you want a serious relationship right away can either scare people or invite people that lie.* I'm not being cynical, but I've seen some people lie and pretend to be serious, just to give a woman what she wants to hear. Nobody is dumb enough to say, "I'm just going to date you and pretend to be serious, so I can have sex with you."*
> 
> I HATE it when women pressure me into negotiating the "talk" with a man that I just met. My male friends don't care. I feel like my male friends are more understanding of the "getting to know you" phase, instead of assuming that someone is automatically your boyfriend/husband when you just went on one date.
> 
> ...



Girls do that too, they just don't talk about it. They're waiting for "the one" but meanwhile they have needs, so they have temporary flings. I seem to be a fling magnet because I'm easy-going and non-judgmental. Sometimes they play both games simultaneously, they'll play hard-to-get with some nice guy, while they show up at my place with lubes & toys on the first date.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

Sometimes a woman will pursue me when she thinks I'm playing hard to get. No. I'm trying to be a dick cuz it wouldn't be a good idea. Usually has opposite effect.

I think I will start being extra nice and buying flowers for girls that come at me.


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## OrangeAppled (Jun 26, 2009)

CherishYourHeart said:


> I find that mentioning commitment and that you want a serious relationship right away can either scare people or invite people that lie. I'm not being cynical, but I've seen some people lie and pretend to be serious, just to give a woman what she wants to hear. Nobody is dumb enough to say, "I'm just going to date you and pretend to be serious, so I can have sex with you."
> 
> I HATE it when women pressure me into negotiating the "talk" with a man that I just met. My male friends don't care. I feel like my male friends are more understanding of the "getting to know you" phase, instead of assuming that someone is automatically your boyfriend/husband when you just went on one date.
> 
> ...


Oh I don't do "negotiating talks". I never bring it up directly, and I'm not someone who feels the need to define everything at every step. It's just a change in my behavior and attitude. Suddenly, _I_ will initiate a call or text instead of blowing off half of their calls/texts, or _I_ will express interest in seeing them again after I've finally agreed to go out with them. I'm just not as cold & dismissive anymore.


I'm pretty sure these guys are just looking for the ego boost of reciprocated interest, to confirm they could get me if they wanted me. Maybe they're just bored too.




devoid said:


> Yeah, definitely a problem with method. Mutual friends and online... doesn't really help with chemistry. A huge amount of romantic attraction is just about physical chemistry, something you can't know until you're in person together. It's almost impossible to find people with that kind of chemistry online, and through friends is a kind of small pool to draw from. It's easier to meet someone at a bar, or at a conference, some sort of meeting, party, etc. Somewhere with a lot of different people. If you're picking from people your friends introduce you, you'll probably meet less people than you would going to a coffee shop for ten minutes.
> 
> I think you would benefit from becoming the instigator in relationships. If it's so rare for you to feel chemistry, you need to be the one to pick a man out of a crowd and say, "I want that one." There's no better way to get what you want than to go out and take it.


I agree I need to broaden my pool. I actually hang out at coffee shops a lot... People honestly don't catch my eye, and I'm very shy. 
I know that being more aware of my surroundings would be good. It's hard for me to want someone by just seeing them briefly. It's probably some ego-driven thing, but I tend to need to be "wooed" a bit. 

When I had more money, then I used to go to concerts a lot, and I'd often meet someone chatting in line, but again, there was almost never attraction. When I do meet someone I find attractive, then I tend to go mute. I have confidence issues, which I am working on as well.

I also have somewhat unusual goals, values, spiritual beliefs, etc, which is why I've mostly used filters like friends, church/volunteering, or online dating to look for people more likely to be compatible. I can meet men in person who are attractive, but they are often not suited to me beyond the physical & other shallow stuff. 

Yes, I know I'm difficult


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

CherishYourHeart said:


> *I find that mentioning commitment and that you want a serious relationship right away can either scare people or invite people that lie. * I'm not being cynical, but I've seen some people lie and pretend to be serious, just to give a woman what she wants to hear. Nobody is dumb enough to say, "I'm just going to date you and pretend to be serious, so I can have sex with you."
> 
> I HATE it when women pressure me into negotiating the "talk" with a man that I just met. My male friends don't care. I feel like my male friends are more understanding of the "getting to know you" phase, instead of assuming that someone is automatically your boyfriend/husband when you just went on one date.
> 
> ...


You are wise.

Hook up culture. Hmmm. Men have evolved and studied the minds of women. Realized that acting aloof and kind of a dick and generally ignoring them is what they wanted all along.

"women can fake an orgasm, but men, they can fake an entire relationship."

Study this animal.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

johnnyyukon said:


> CherishYourHeart said:
> 
> 
> > *I find that mentioning commitment and that you want a serious relationship right away can either scare people or invite people that lie. * I'm not being cynical, but I've seen some people lie and pretend to be serious, just to give a woman what she wants to hear. Nobody is dumb enough to say, "I'm just going to date you and pretend to be serious, so I can have sex with you."
> ...


I'm sorry, but I'm confused if you're sarcastic or being serious (I'm very literal). Maybe im misunderstanding. im not trying to imply all men want sex, or that all women want relationships. Yentipee is correct that some women will also string men along, or pretend to be serious when they're not. I'm using specific examples based on some things I've seen. With my little rant about women's relationship advice of putting your cards on the table, Im also just venting on personal experience and don't mean to generalize.


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## Blessed Frozen Cells (Apr 3, 2013)

That's why I only date friends and always have friendship as base. I don't get that whole implied dating rules. I know people put such a stigma on being friendzoned but I love being friendzoned. At least I can be open and honest about my feelings when I want to without getting judged as clingy or whatever because my partner is my close friend.


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## Mr. Meepers (May 31, 2012)

sleepingnereid said:


> okay, MANY men are liars
> 
> okay well i don't have any experience with men who watch the kids, cook or give a backrub. so i guess i can't say much about it, except that i doubt men do this irl. I only had one long relationship so maybe i am wrong. I know i don't want a relationship like my marriage again.
> 
> ...


I don't think the distinction of "many" is much better. Some men, absolutely, but I think most people (men, women, or otherwise) are mostly honest, imo. And "many" probably still starts off with the assumption that if someone ois hitting on you, then assume they are a liar and treat them with mistrust.

I think it is true that the norm is that women are the main care takers, but I think that slowly more and more dads are becoming the main care giver. That being said, I was saying "ideally". Although I did say a standard that I certainly hope most Dads meet, which is being heavily involved in their children's lives and being a loving parent (So you should expect him to take on some of the burdens of parenthood imo)

You can like whatever you like. For instance, what I like means I have to choose someone I really trust lol. But everyone has a different line and many people may find such behavior on the guys part as disrespectful since he is assuming that his desires are more important and I think yoy may need to be careful with guys like that, otherwise you may find a lot of guys who will try to walk all over you, I would think. Which is why I think communication is important. So you don't lose those guys who wish to respect what you want (otherwise hoew would anyone know that you want them to keep trying if you don't give any signals. If ypou seem to be enjoying it, that might be different) ... Plus, I was just saying how those two scenarios you gave are not really similar, imo. I think there is a huge difference between not taking no for an answer with a stranger and maintaining interest with an overworked significant other


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## Vincent Trujillo (Nov 14, 2014)

If you are just naturally aloof then well...you're aloof, and if you're a warm-hearted tell it to 'em strait kind of girl, then go for it!

If you ACT rather than BE.

Good fuckin' luck.

That's all I got to say.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

CherishYourHeart said:


> I'm sorry, but I'm confused if you're sarcastic or being serious (I'm very literal). Maybe im misunderstanding. im not trying to imply all men want sex, or that all women want relationships. Yentipee is correct that some women will also string men along, or pretend to be serious when they're not. I'm using specific examples based on some things I've seen. With my little rant about women's relationship advice of putting your cards on the table, Im also just venting on personal experience and don't mean to generalize.


Whoa there lil lady. While my post was indeed a mix of sarcasm and truth, one thing you should know about ENTPs- being offended is not in our lexicon.

Furthermore, YES, what you said, suggests a wise woman. No sarcasm.

And you're 100% right MANY men, especially young men, just want sex and a casual companion. With no plans for a future with that person. Day to day. And again, I'M generalizing here, and also speaking from my own attitudes, when younger and now.

That was where the "men can fake an entire relationship" quote came in. I've done that. Purely for the sex, knowing she had fallen for me. Granted, I was 25. A similar relationship at 28, but had grown up a bit and told the girl from the beginning and throughout that I had no future plans and was just enjoying our relationship day-to-day. I was completely transparent. And she eventually did leave me because of it. 

For the record, ha, I am a pretty stereotypical male, with some flagrant womanizing in my past, that's trying to grow up.


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

johnnyyukon said:


> CherishYourHeart said:
> 
> 
> > I'm sorry, but I'm confused if you're sarcastic or being serious (I'm very literal). Maybe im misunderstanding. im not trying to imply all men want sex, or that all women want relationships. Yentipee is correct that some women will also string men along, or pretend to be serious when they're not. I'm using specific examples based on some things I've seen. With my little rant about women's relationship advice of putting your cards on the table, Im also just venting on personal experience and don't mean to generalize.
> ...


Thanks for clarifying.


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## renna (Jan 28, 2011)

Ugh, I was just told to "play the game". and I'm like, what fucking game? 

Be real. Because I am.


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## Son of Mercury (Aug 12, 2014)

The most annoying thing any woman can do. Ever. In my opinion.


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## sleepingnereid (Oct 31, 2014)

foodcourtfrenzy said:


> I feel your pain; I'm not trying to be a dick at all (although it may sound that way). But anyone over the age of 25 has gotten stomped on at least once. For all you know, this guy you're speaking about got cheated on years ago, and he vowed to never trust another girl again. He'll cheat at will because he knows that any girl he loves cannot be relied on. I'm sure he has a way to justify everything he does.
> 
> Everyone walks around with past relationship baggage. It's like mixed martial arts or boxing. I got punched in the face so many times training for MMA that I'm not afraid of the pain anymore. You will get hit in literally every fight you ever have, regardless of winning or losing. Relationships and love hurt, and it's going to hurt no matter what you do. There's nothing you can do but just let go and try. People mess themselves up trying too hard to protect themselves, and end up rationalizing playing dumb games. As the old saying goes, "play stupid games, win stupid prizes".


some people are really sensative and are shy
the few men that i persued and showed real interest in took it as a sign that they could do anything also, to me, which i did allow...also they tended to stay around when they didn't want to just to milk the situation...nightmare! actions can tell the truth, I am kind in action when I love and it is so much more reliable I think


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## CherishYourHeart (Nov 2, 2014)

What are some examples of "playing hard to get" that are obvious?

I did something daring and told a man that I am getting to know for the past month and a half that I feel a spark with him. I hope it didn't scare him off, even though my good guy buddies said that I did the right thing. The man I'm dating said he would like to still get to know me, and appreciated my text.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

Best/longest relationship I ever had was from a friendship beginning. I could tell she was interested in more but I didn't want to mess with our friendship. I told her as much, she respected it, but we slowly evolved into lovers. I initially avoided and tried to prevent things from ever getting sexual, and I think that's what gave us time to really bond without the weird side effects of "sex too soon."

I suppose one or even she could perceive that as hard to get, but it wasn't at all.


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