# type interaction videos



## Hastings

Just chiming in to say that interaction videos are my favorite MBTI videos. So I'm looking forward to this!


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## formal riot

cactus_waltz said:


> Just chiming in to say that interaction videos are my favorite MBTI videos. So I'm looking forward to this!



Slightly off topic but I thanked you just because of your signature


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## Laeona

Living up to my INFP-ness, I love this idea...but can I just sit on the dock and observe for awhile? This would be so fun. And I do like the idea of mystery personalities, where we have to guess what they are. It makes it fun to see how much we know about our Personality Cousins!


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## Eleventeenth

Don't make me interject some Ne into these videos, cuz I will. Or...maybe I won't...but still. Someone needs to represent Ne. Anyone? Hello?


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## Kilgore Trout

I like this idea. Google chat with four people of the SJ, SP, NF, and NT types would be interesting. No, this isn't going to be Hunger Games with one person representing their type in a digital battle to the death. But I could definitely see the informal conversation turn out well, if there are questions asked from members on this forum beforehand or made from the moderator. Maybe after the first video, I'd do one, but it depends on the time zone everyone is in and when they agree to do it. (Note: The NFgeeks would probably collaborate with you on a video. They seem open to making such things and have been producing a lot of videos with different types lately)


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## Coburn

I'll be the SJ participant, if you're up for it. Let me know when and how you plan to set it up.


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## Kito

Kilgore Trout said:


> No, this isn't going to be Hunger Games with one person representing their type in a digital battle to the death.


That sounds fun. I'm imagining it Pokemon style.

SJ used Concrete Fact!
It's super effective!
NF fainted!


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## pneumoceptor

Kitzara said:


> Maybe we could all start off just making an introductory video on Youtube? Just so we know who we all are.


That sounds like a great idea. Whoever's game, go for it!


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## pneumoceptor

Wow guys, I'm loving your responsiveness!

So I definitely won't have time to undertake this until after Tuesday. I may not have time until a couple of weeks after that... but definitely come early June, my schedule will open up. I will get in touch with everyone who's responded as soon as I have time. I won't forget about it, and my Je will follow through . In the meantime... tawk amongst yourselves?

Really looking forward to this...


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## Cloudlight

I am interested in this concept, though ISTP representation has not yet been found, but I'm durn sure one of them would be up for it. 
*looks left, looks right, sees no one*
*sigh* 
ISTP representation reporting in for duty.
Please PM me or message me to set up times.


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## pneumoceptor

Hey kids!

Here's a quick vid wrapping up my PhD (just cuz I wanted to share) and briefly commenting on gearing up for these type interaction videos. I expect to start sending out some messages to set things up with interested people within a week or so.

Looking forward to it, and for anyone who has interest but hasn't expressed it yet, please do!


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## CaptainMauzer

Awesome video, I think you highly underestimate your ability to talk cohesively and tell a story on the fly, as I legitimately sat here for 12 minutes listening to you talk (and trust me, I honestly didn't think i was going to). Anywho, congrats on your PhD (hopefully :tongue

So to get back on topic; if you need an ISFJ I'd be more than happy. I have google+ or skype, so whatever you do end up using will work fine. Lemme know


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## Kito

I love it! Not being able to talk on the fly is kinda Ni-ish, I think. Se is probably much more useful for it so perhaps that's why it's difficult for you?


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## Empurple

Ya know...the fact that you're 32 and pulling all night-ers like a college student is a clear indicator that you have retained a great deal of the wide-eyed passion and zeal so many people lose at a certain point, replacing enthusiasm with cynical realism or...safety and security. I'm inspired and challenged after hearing you talk. Life is meaningless without these types of challenges, even if, at the moment, this one seems overwhelming or not worth the stress. It makes me want to challenge myself with something way outside my wheelhouse. As far as spontaneous responses go (answering on the fly), you might want to engage your Se. So...maybe go for a swim in a lake or do a spontaneous interpretive dance to a favorite song or ... some roundhouse kicks, that type of thing. Um...just kidding. Do not listen to a word I just said!


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## Hastings

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey kids!
> 
> Here's a quick vid wrapping up my PhD (just cuz I wanted to share) and briefly commenting on gearing up for these type interaction videos. I expect to start sending out some messages to set things up with interested people within a week or so.
> 
> Looking forward to it, and for anyone who has interest but hasn't expressed it yet, please do!


Dr pneumoceptor!

I think this was easily your best video so far. It was extremely interesting to hear about all the work that you've put into your thesis and your toughts and feelings on the matter. I hope there will be conversation videos up in not too long.


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## pneumoceptor

Hello all you types!

@Geoffrey and I have just made the first (two part) chat in what I hope will become an expansive MBTI interaction series. We're both INFJs, so get ready for some introverted intuition. In the future, we *may* want to tighten things up and have shorter videos... I welcome feedback about this.

Thanks to everyone who expressed interest in doing similar videos with me. I have a hard time remembering whom I have and haven't gotten in touch with, so sorry if you expressed interest and I haven't set something up with you yet. If you are still interested, let me know!


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## Geoffrey

pneumoceptor said:


> Hello all you types!
> Geoffrey and I have just made the first (two part) chat in what I hope will become an expansive MBTI interaction series. We're both INFJs, so get ready for some introverted intuition. In the future, we *may* want to tighten things up and have shorter videos... I welcome feedback about this.
> Thanks to everyone who expressed interest in doing similar videos with me. I have a hard time remembering whom I have and haven't gotten in touch with, so sorry if you expressed interest and I haven't set something up with you yet. If you are still interested, let me know!


Hello, (Dr.) pneumoceptor,
-----Thank you for putting so much work into this. It was a pleasure meeting (and conversing with) you! I hope many more people get a chance to chat with you. It'll be interesting to see all the interesting things people learn. I wish you all the best as you pass this milestone (which is a very, very big and celebration-and-reward-(yourself)-worthy milestone) and move forward toward the next milestone, and ever closer to your personal vision. 
All the best,
Geoffrey


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## Empurple

Whoo-hoo! That was such an awesome video! I'm literally (well maybe not literally) shaking with excitement after having watched you two talk. I related so much with ALL OF IT...esp. the paradox of INFJs behaving like P's in certain ways and the thought processes underlying that behavior. I found myself laughing, because right when you (Pneumoceptor) said, "I feel like I could have been sitting there saying the same things you just said.." I was saying THAT same thing in MY mind. Anyway, you both are so very articulate and GREAT representatives of our controlled chaos. Thanks!


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## pneumoceptor

Empurple said:


> Whoo-hoo! That was such an awesome video! I'm literally (well maybe not literally) shaking with excitement after having watched you two talk. I related so much with ALL OF IT...esp. the paradox of INFJs behaving like P's in certain ways and the thought processes underlying that behavior. I found myself laughing, because right when you (Pneumoceptor) said, "I feel like I could have been sitting there saying the same things you just said.." I was saying THAT same thing in MY mind. Anyway, you both are so very articulate and GREAT representatives of our controlled chaos. Thanks!


Fun! I'm glad you enjoyed it . Yes, controlled chaos... absolutely. 


Who's up next? @Empurple? @CaptainMauzer? @Cloudlight? @JuliaRhys? @Kilgore Trout? @formal riot? @Jubeanation?


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## Coburn

pneumoceptor said:


> Fun! I'm glad you enjoyed it . Yes, controlled chaos... absolutely.


do you want just a video, or do you want to video chat?


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## pneumoceptor

JuliaRhys said:


> do you want just a video, or do you want to video chat?


You are very welcome to do your own video for this series. But I was thinking more along the lines of video chatting, so we can see the interactions between types.


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## CaptainMauzer

I'm free most nights after 9pm central time, other than that it just is random and you would have to verify with me. But a more immediate way to get ahold of me would be to email me at [email protected], or you can PM me and i can give you my number (since i have a generally only check my email once/twice a day)


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## illicit iridescence

pneumoceptor said:


> @_Geoffrey_ and I have just made the first (two part) chat in what I hope will become an expansive MBTI interaction series. We're both INFJs, so get ready for some introverted intuition. In the future, we *may* want to tighten things up and have shorter videos... I welcome feedback about this.


Awesome, so obviously awesome.


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## formal riot

yes Im still alive and keen although it may have to wait a bit longer, have a final exam this week followed by a trip to the states. Once Im in the states it may actually be easier because of timezones as well so yea Ill keep in touch


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## Hastings

I'm extremely curious to hear non-INFJs thoughts on the new video. I mean, I could definitely relate to @Geoffrey and @pneumoceptor both, the communication style is so much like my own. 

@pneumoceptor : I don't know if it's possible, but do you think it would be a good idea to make it so that the first post in this thread is updated with links to each new video? Perhaps a mod could arrange that.


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## Coburn

@pneumocepter

I live in California, and anything after 7:30 PM Pacific Time works for me.



EDIT: This is JuliaRhys. I just changed my username.


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## Cloudlight

@pneumoceptor , I am free to chat with whomever tomorrow between 10am and 3pm Mountain Time. Are you the one who chooses who chats with who?


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## pneumoceptor

@_Marlowe_ and I just shot the second installment of the type interaction videos. Enjoy!
















(Side note: I love how the pic for the second video looks like we're about to do a Blossom pose... Hmm, wonder if that reference is too old for most of the people here...)


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## pneumoceptor

Cloudlight said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ , I am free to chat with whomever tomorrow between 10am and 3pm Mountain Time. Are you the one who chooses who chats with who?


Hey Cloudlight,

Let's do it! Are you free sometime Sunday?


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## Empurple

Oh, more brilliance! Great interview, both of you. I really enjoyed both perspectives. I always feel challenged by the Te perspective, in a good way, like a "Why can't I just be more that way; it makes so much sense!" And then hearing the INFJ perspective, I have a sort of sudden remembrance of who I am at the core, like a "deep calling unto deep" sort of feeling. Also, I don't know if I was the only one watching who felt this way, but when Marlowe talked about compassion I almost started to tear up. The emotions came out of no where, but that answer touched me for some reason; took me off guard. Inspiring! I was kind of wondering if you, Pneumoceptor may have felt the same sort of chill go up the spine during her explanation of beauty. Compassion is so very transcendent and central to our humanity'; it's the natural outflow of love, and it points to something far greater than the sum of our parts. It points to perfection itself. Anyway, great jobs!


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## Worriedfunction

pneumoceptor said:


> Shortened




Id still love to get in on this but I need to get a webcam of some kind.


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## pneumoceptor

Empurple said:


> Oh, more brilliance! Great interview, both of you. I really enjoyed both perspectives. I always feel challenged by the Te perspective, in a good way, like a "Why can't I just be more that way; it makes so much sense!" And then hearing the INFJ perspective, I have a sort of sudden remembrance of who I am at the core, like a "deep calling unto deep" sort of feeling. Also, I don't know if I was the only one watching who felt this way, but when Marlowe talked about compassion I almost started to tear up. The emotions came out of no where, but that answer touched me for some reason; took me off guard. Inspiring! I was kind of wondering if you, Pneumoceptor may have felt the same sort of chill go up the spine during her explanation of beauty. Compassion is so very transcendent and central to our humanity'; it's the natural outflow of love, and it points to something far greater than the sum of our parts. It points to perfection itself. Anyway, great jobs!


Yeah, the compassion answer nailed me, too. I just wasn't expecting it, based on all the other stuff we talked about... not particularly valuing harmony, etc, etc. But stepping back and thinking about it, compassion has nothing to do with that. And it has nothing to do with being a feeler or thinker. Rather, it's something that we can all strive for as human beings and that most of us see as beautiful, inspiring, and life-changing. I loved @_Marlowe_'s response there.


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## pneumoceptor

Worriedfunction said:


> Id still love to get in on this but I need to get a webcam of some kind.


Well, let me know if you get one! The cheapest on Amazon are under $10...


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## mushr00m

I would love to do this but will not be able to get a webcam for a couple of months. I could make a video perhaps. Great idea!


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## pneumoceptor

I just watched the first EXTJ INFJ vid in its entirety. And then I found this: The Codependency Quiz | Codependency Quiz. I thought of my convo with @_Marlowe_. I just took it, and I got a 45%. I think ten years ago, I would have gotten a 75%. @_Marlowe_, I bet you'd get less than 25%!


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## Jewl

I'm interested in this. Perhaps sometime in July. I have a webcam, it's part of my laptop. I'm actually an ENFP. I'm not entirely sure how to work technology. I have skype and everything. Not sure how to do that awesome recording-of-the-video, but I'm sure that lack of knowledge can be cured. ^_^


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## Kabosu

Any ENTPs been on board yet? I can fill that one in.


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## caraez

Soo, I'm totally up for this if it's not too late to sign up. Sounds completely awesome.

So to clarify: is someone organizing who's matching with who, or are we just going at this on our own?


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## thunder

@Marlowe -- watching your interaction and discussion, I see you as an ENTJ -- my ENTJ friend also has a natural "leadership" vibe that makes people automatically (consciously and subconsciously) assign her the role as the leader. Also, your answer to the "what do you think of when your mind wanders" being "future oriented" and the perspective of having a future goal and then building steps to reach the goal likens to the way my ENTJ friend's mind works with Ni-Se. I don't really see a use of Si-Ne in the videos, but that's just my opinion.


@pneumoceptor: This series is excellent so far. It is so fun to talk about interaction/thought processes with someone else, and now to see other people as eager and interested in such discussions. I look forward to the future videos!


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## Cloudlight

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey Cloudlight,
> 
> Let's do it! Are you free sometime Sunday?


Indeed! I can set something up anytime Sunday. PM me to create a strategy for world domina- ...erm. For a time to chat.


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## Coburn

@dejavu @benr3600

This reminds me of a video I once saw:


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## Dark NiTe

dejavu said:


> Typical INTJ... :tongue: You guys like to think that you can handle ENTPs, but we can always throw a wrench in your well thought out plans.
> 
> But yeah, no, totally. Battle royale. It's on like donkey kong.
> 
> And we need an INTJ in a type interaction video.


That's okay, because Ne ness cannot derail me from breaking my one rule. Which is, to be the uber-NT :tongue: Nothing to do with all your tangential and spontaneous strengths. Okay, so they are impressive. :tongue:


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## Dark NiTe

Marlowe said:


> @_dejavu_ @_benr3600_
> 
> This reminds me of a video I once saw:


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## Hastings

Considering Marlowe's functions, it would make sense to see if she prefers Ni/Se or Si/Ne, yes? She leads with Te in any case.


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## Worriedfunction

So....should we have a group session at some point or is it still going to be one on one?

Im going to put my skype info in my profile so it can be contacted.


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## pneumoceptor

Worriedfunction said:


> Well I finally got a cheap camera, not sure on the mic and if it works yet, but ive got a headset if it doesnt.
> 
> Unfortunately my lack of certainty on my own type means you will be talking to an unknown and I dont want to put people in a position of knowledge deprivation.


Sweet . So I'm booked every weekend day for three weeks with people who want to do vids, so maybe I can get in touch a bit later to set something up? Or you can strike up a convo with someone else... do it!


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## pneumoceptor

benr3600 said:


> Well, I'm sold. And I'm gonna throw you a fundraiser. :happy:


Ooh, for an HD camera? I accept ... 

And then I'd probably feel guilty and give everything to charity... blasted Fe...


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## pneumoceptor

dejavu said:


> I'm up for this. Even though I am something of a socially awkward penguin.
> 
> Part of me wants to do less of a one-on-one thing and more of a several types interacting at once kind of thing...the chaos of it would be interesting.


This type of thing would be perfect for Google Hangouts. I considered using this platform for the 1:1, but it doesn't seem to be able to do a split screen. You should set something up! It can stream straight to youtube.


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## pneumoceptor

Worriedfunction said:


> So....should we have a group session at some point or is it still going to be one on one?
> 
> Im going to put my skype info in my profile so it can be contacted.


Google Hangouts would be great for this. If you're considering heading something up, give it a look...


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## pneumoceptor

Marlowe said:


> Everyone I've ever interacted with on here via video/instant messaging has come to the same conclusion.
> 
> Through my own research, I've found fall more in line with the ESTJ along cog function lines, but ENTJ when it comes to personality descriptions.


FYI, there's a youtube comment for your vid from another INFJ, and she thinks you're an ESTJ. Two votes .


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## Dark NiTe

pneumoceptor said:


> Ooh, for an HD camera? I accept ...
> 
> And then I'd probably feel guilty and give everything to charity... blasted Fe...


lol. If you haven't yet twisted an INTJs arm, I may volunteer to represent the clan.


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## Kabosu

Next weekend I should order a handset or headset and after getting that, maybe I can get this Skype thing rolling.


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## Coburn

cactus_waltz said:


> Considering Marlowe's functions, it would make sense to see if she prefers Ni/Se or Si/Ne, yes? She leads with Te in any case.


I'm inclined to say probably Si/Ne. Perhaps it's just my super awesome swag that throws everyone off. 


And on a general note, I'm willing to chat again with anyone up for it.


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## dejavu

pneumoceptor said:


> This type of thing would be perfect for Google Hangouts. I considered using this platform for the 1:1, but it doesn't seem to be able to do a split screen. You should set something up! It can stream straight to youtube.


I'm pretty unfamiliar with Google stuff. Never heard of this Hangouts thing, but it could work...the lack of a split screen is a turn off though. Still....I shall look into it!


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## Dark NiTe

Tinychat is also an excellent venue for group chats. Not that I would know how it compares to the others :tongue: but I would think it is sufficient for this task. I don't know about recordability though, I just know you can take and save screenshots lol.


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## Worriedfunction

benr3600 said:


> Tinychat is also an excellent venue for group chats. Not that I would know how it compares to the others :tongue: but I would think it is sufficient for this task. I don't know about recordability though, I just know you can take and save screenshots lol.


I think tinychat is actually a pretty good idea, but like you im not sure on methods of recordability of such an environment.

Oh yeah I also downloaded the Google Hangout's plugin as well.


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## thunder

I know that (the free version of) Debut Video Capture has the ability to record whatever is happening on your screen as well as the audio of the environment. I've never tried it though.


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## pneumoceptor

@formal riot and I have at it in an NFJ extravaganza...


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## caraez

dejavu said:


> I'm up for this. Even though I am something of a socially awkward penguin.
> 
> Part of me wants to do less of a one-on-one thing and more of a several types interacting at once kind of thing...the chaos of it would be interesting.





Worriedfunction said:


> So....should we have a group session at some point or is it still going to be one on one?
> 
> Im going to put my skype info in my profile so it can be contacted.





benr3600 said:


> Tinychat is also an excellent venue for group chats. Not that I would know how it compares to the others :tongue: but I would think it is sufficient for this task. I don't know about recordability though, I just know you can take and save screenshots lol.





Worriedfunction said:


> I think tinychat is actually a pretty good idea, but like you im not sure on methods of recordability of such an environment.
> 
> Oh yeah I also downloaded the Google Hangout's plugin as well.





thunder said:


> I know that (the free version of) Debut Video Capture has the ability to record whatever is happening on your screen as well as the audio of the environment. I've never tried it though.




Since Pnumoceptor already has a full schedule, we should get this going, at least with one on one chats between us who are interested while we figure out a viable way to do group chats. Sorry if I missed quoting someone who was interested. But anyways, if y'all are willing, I'd be willing to be an organizer of sorts. People could PM me that they want to be in the separate chats and I could match people up. I could also figure out the group chat thing and set that up eventually, though I don't have a lot of experience with group video chatting.

Or we could just personally PM people we're interested in chatting with and do it that way.


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## Dark NiTe

I call dibs on the ENTP/INFPs :tongue:


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## pneumoceptor

dejavu said:


> ...You'd think so. >_<
> 
> I uninstalled skype and supertintin. Restarted the computer, then installed skype, then supertintin. Supertintin is still saying that Evaer is conflicting with it.


How frustrating. I think you have some residual registry entries. Maybe this will help: How to Completely Remove Skype and Other Applications from your Computer - The Tech Repo. (You may need to reinstall Skype before you can uninstall it with this protocol...)


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## Lady Lullaby

Cloudlight said:


> Indeed! I can set something up anytime Sunday. PM me to create a strategy for world domina- ...erm. For a time to chat.


Thanks so much for taking the time. Your videos were wonderful! I think nothing compares to learning about MBTI types than watching each type in the flesh! Fun stuff!


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## Feelings

y u no interview Feelings?


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## Dark NiTe

Feelings said:


> y u no interview Feelings?


Because, no hard feelings.


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## Dark NiTe

No but seriously, there are a couple Ne-doms that aren't matched up yet, at least not publicly, including one that just posted in here today. Ask caraez via PM :happy:


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## Resolution

Any need for another INFJ? I'm down.


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## Worriedfunction

Feelings said:


> y u no interview Feelings?


Go out on the street and proclaim your man-love for children, you will get all the interview with feelings you will need.


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## Lady Lullaby

firedell said:


> Damn it, I would love to do this. Lack of webcam is annoying.


I don't know if pneumoceptor already has an ISFP, but I'd really like to see an ISFP video because I am pretty sure my lil 5 year old is ISFP. I don't know any others IRL and it would be fun to hear someone older than her articulate what she maybe can't yet. Any friends to borrow a webcam from? (I understand if not. :wink


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## firedell

Lady Lullaby said:


> I don't know if pneumoceptor already has an ISFP, but I'd really like to see an ISFP video because I am pretty sure my lil 5 year old is ISFP. I don't know any others IRL and it would be fun to hear someone older than her articulate what she maybe can't yet. Any friends to borrow a webcam from? (I understand if not. :wink


I think @Inguz has already stated he might.


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## Inguz

firedell said:


> I think @_Inguz_ has already stated he might.


Don't even for a second think that I'm not aware of what you are up to! 

I will do it, but the first reliable time to do it now won't be until 3-5 weeks from now.


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## firedell

Inguz said:


> Don't even for a second think that I'm not aware of what you are up to!
> 
> I will do it, but the first reliable time to do it now won't be until 3-5 weeks from now.


I don't know what you're on about.... xD


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## Figure

Here's one with myself, an INTJ, and @_Tubthumpin_, an ENFP. It's just a bunch of snippets of a much longer conversation we were having about typology. We talk about it _all _the time, so this actually is a "normal" conversation. Sorry my voice is so soft, I think something was wrong with the microphone.


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## pneumoceptor

Hey guys,

First and foremost, I'm really looking forward to some videos without my face . I'd love to see other combos interact, so please consider making some vids! (I can try to help out with technical issues if you have questions, and please persevere through all the inherent frustration in getting these things going.)

@_Lady Lullaby_ (http://www.youtube.com/user/brackenck/videos) and I chatted it up yesterday for ALMOST FOUR HOURS. She's a kindred spirit, and I knew it would be that way. So if you're interested in another INFJ-fest, here are some videos. I recorded over three hours of conversation, and I will maybe put some more segments up if there's interest. This weird thing happened this time where her sound wasn't recorded when any sound was coming from my end, so sorry for that... technical issues abound. Anyway, enjoy!


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## pneumoceptor

LXPilot said:


> Here's one with myself, an INTJ, and @_Tubthumpin_, an ENFP. It's just a bunch of snippets of a much longer conversation we were having about typology. We talk about it _all _the time, so this actually is a "normal" conversation. Sorry my voice is so soft, I think something was wrong with the microphone.


 @_Tubthumpin_, I love it when Ne goes off "talking about random crap". Please keep it up... some of us listen!

@_LXPilot_, great job with the video. Your Ni shined through . Also, oh how I wish that Fe wasn't so hard for people to deal with... I really think that what most people describe is an unhealthy version of it, just like the Te-haters have probably experienced unhealthy versions of it. I hope that you get some experience with the non-dark side of Fe.


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## Figure

pneumoreceptor said:


> great job with the video. Your Ni shined through . Also, oh how I wish that Fe wasn't so hard for people to deal with... I really think that what most people describe is an unhealthy version of it, just like the Te-haters have probably experienced unhealthy versions of it. I hope that you get some experience with the non-dark side of Fe.


Thanks  

You know, deeper in thought (a.k.a. outside of a video) it's easier to see that it's dominant Fe that's difficult for our type much more than its place in any other functional arrangement. It's just challenging to imagine deriving our sense of selfhood from the well-being of others as poignantly as they do - and perhaps misinterpreting this to be the primary "mode" of the function to begin with. 

Fe can be quite disorienting to Te's - not necessarily in a "bad" way all the time, though at best I'm usually admirable of it in others knowing that I'm terrible at it. Then there's the problem of attempting to use Fi to compensate for it, and not having such actions be understood the way they were intended to be. This usually takes the form of doing "secret" things on others' behalf that we hope they find meaningful later on, or in general attempting to establish deep, "oasis-like" friendships, where the power of the friendship is based on two people loving each other quietly. This is sort of like what you guys mentioned in part 3 of your video, with Lady Lullaby's ESTJ daughter. I'm sure there's a Ti/Te side to it too


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## Coziene

LXPilot said:


> Thanks
> 
> You know, deeper in thought (a.k.a. outside of a video) it's easier to see that it's dominant Fe that's difficult for our type much more than its place in any other functional arrangement. It's just challenging to imagine deriving our sense of selfhood from the well-being of others as poignantly as they do - and perhaps misinterpreting this to be the primary "mode" of the function to begin with.
> 
> Fe can be quite disorienting to Te's - not necessarily in a "bad" way all the time, though at best I'm usually admirable of it in others knowing that I'm terrible at it. Then there's the problem of attempting to use Fi to compensate for it, and not having such actions be understood the way they were intended to be. This usually takes the form of doing "secret" things on others' behalf that we hope they find meaningful later on, or in general attempting to establish deep, "oasis-like" friendships, where the power of the friendship is based on two people loving each other quietly. This is sort of like what you guys mentioned in part 3 of your video, with Lady Lullaby's ESTJ daughter. I'm sure there's a Ti/Te side to it too


I find it hard to put Fe into perspective. Sure, I can understand that people should be...taken care of? I look at it like this: If people aren't well, emotionally or physically, it detracts from plans and objectives, and decreases efficiency. It will have a negative impact on me. But I do not understand the need to, for example, uproot my life, move to some small decrepid place with people constantly suffering, and then to help them out simply because their cries hit me from the external environment. 
But yet Fe would have no issue with doing that. I am not saying that I have no feelings for people. I feel bad for poor people out on the streets, but my Ni and Te thinks that they are on the street either because it is their fault, or they aren't being too serious in fixing their issue. I mean, if I were out on the streets, I would know it is either my fault, or if it wasn't (even if it was) I would strive to fix it. If I didn't strive to fix it, then I would instead waste away and die.

People like ENFX have always thrown me off. They confound me a lot too. I was at a store once, and two ENFP teenage girls in front of me were whispering and giggling while looking at me. Now, I was in my head at the time while waiting in line, and that brought me out. I know I am terrible at my appearance (I just toss on a polo shirt and jeans, even if they are wrinkled) and go out, and I wondered if that was it. Then I wondered if I had somethng on my face...my clothes. Was it the way I was standing? Was it my facial expression? On the way out the door, they were still giggling about something to do with me when they were at their car.

It boggled my mind. I could not make heads or tails of it. I could not even grasp what is was, if not for my appearance. Fe, you confound me!


----------



## caraez

benr3600 said:


> No but seriously, there are a couple Ne-doms that aren't matched up yet, at least not publicly, including one that just posted in here today. Ask caraez via PM :happy:


Yes, please! If you're interested I'll match you with someone, even if it's little INFP me.

I'll make this big and colorful so everyone sees:

If you want to be matched with someone for a video, please PM me and I'll help you out!




Coziene said:


> I find it hard to put Fe into perspective. Sure, I can understand that people should be...taken care of? I look at it like this: If people aren't well, emotionally or physically, it detracts from plans and objectives, and decreases efficiency. It will have a negative impact on me. But I do not understand the need to, for example, uproot my life, move to some small decrepid place with people constantly suffering, and then to help them out simply because their cries hit me from the external environment.
> But yet Fe would have no issue with doing that. I am not saying that I have no feelings for people. I feel bad for poor people out on the streets, but my Ni and Te thinks that they are on the street either because it is their fault, or they aren't being too serious in fixing their issue. I mean, if I were out on the streets, I would know it is either my fault, or if it wasn't (even if it was) I would strive to fix it. If I didn't strive to fix it, then I would instead waste away and die.
> 
> People like ENFX have always thrown me off. They confound me a lot too. I was at a store once, and two ENFP teenage girls in front of me were whispering and giggling while looking at me. Now, I was in my head at the time while waiting in line, and that brought me out. I know I am terrible at my appearance (I just toss on a polo shirt and jeans, even if they are wrinkled) and go out, and I wondered if that was it. Then I wondered if I had somethng on my face...my clothes. Was it the way I was standing? Was it my facial expression? On the way out the door, they were still giggling about something to do with me when they were at their car.
> 
> It boggled my mind. I could not make heads or tails of it. I could not even grasp what is was, if not for my appearance. Fe, you confound me!


While Fi is clearly my dominant, I have a somewhat developed Fe, according to cognitive tests and IRL experience. While I don't cry at the movies like my Fe friends, I understand where they're coming from.

How my Fe complements my Fi (and Ne) usually goes like this: There are poor people living on the street! That's not right (Fi). How did they get there? What if something horrible happened? (Ne goes off on ideas about how they're helpless victims of capitalism or something). Fi says, I can't really justify not helping. Then when I'm helping and talking to a victim or hearing a specific story about someone, Fe kicks in and adds motivation to my helping.

Fe doesn't kick in unless I'm dealing with a personal, specific situation. The rest of the time, it's Fi driving me to do good.

Fe also kicks in when it feels like doubling my social anxiety, haha.

[[Also, I'm almost certain those girls just thought you were cute. ENFPs use Fi, btw. All types, even NFPs indulge in shallow man-oogling sometimes, plus we're more likely to be drawn to the shabbily dressed N types. Out of curiosity, how did you know they were ENFP?]]


----------



## Coziene

> While Fi is clearly my dominant, I have a somewhat developed Fe, according to cognitive tests and IRL experience. While I don't cry at the movies like my Fe friends, I understand where they're coming from.
> 
> How my Fe complements my Fi (and Ne) usually goes like this: There are poor people living on the street! That's not right (Fi). How did they get there? What if something horrible happened? (Ne goes off on ideas about how they're helpless victims of capitalism or something). Fi says, I can't really justify not helping. Then when I'm helping and talking to a victim or hearing a specific story about someone, Fe kicks in and adds motivation to my helping.
> 
> Fe doesn't kick in unless I'm dealing with a personal, specific situation. The rest of the time, it's Fi driving me to do good.
> 
> Fe also kicks in when it feels like doubling my social anxiety, haha.
> 
> [[Also, I'm almost certain those girls just thought you were cute. ENFPs use Fi, btw. All types, even NFPs indulge in shallow man-oogling sometimes, plus we're more likely to be drawn to the shabbily dressed N types. Out of curiosity, how did you know they were ENFP?]]


At the time I did not know about MBTI. It wasn't until the fact that I remembered today, that I attempted to classify them. I'm not sure why I thought ENFPs have Fe as their four primary functions; I should know better...
I consider them ENFPs, now that I remember them, because they were a very bubbly and very talkative. Of course a lot of women are regardless, but I just _know_ they were ENFP.
That laughing at, or about, me was the most peculiar thing of the day. I did not even consider they they might've liked me. If I were with a friend, I would not point at a girl in plain view, who was looking at me, and whisper or even speak aloud that she was cute or pretty. I would be discreet, and if she didn't know then all the better.
These girls made it very obvious, and I was getting very annoyed because I was under the impression by the end that they were making fun of me.
If they did like me, that was not the best way to go about expressing it. Why are N's more likely to go for shabbily dressed N's? Btw, a polo shirt, jeans, and falling-apart tennis shoes (I know I need to get them replaced...) are a great style. Just saying.

Yeah, I do have Fe as well. But I don't let it surface very often. Fe is the one function that if it pops up squealing, I grab my tranquilizer darts and put it back down. Fi I like to analyze, consider, and evaluate due to the strange emotions it can bring up. Fe makes me human; I haven't entirely erased humanity yet!

With regards to your experiment, I wonder how many INTJs would come forward.


----------



## pneumoceptor

LXPilot said:


> Thanks
> 
> You know, deeper in thought (a.k.a. outside of a video) it's easier to see that it's dominant Fe that's difficult for our type much more than its place in any other functional arrangement. It's just challenging to imagine deriving our sense of selfhood from the well-being of others as poignantly as they do - and perhaps misinterpreting this to be the primary "mode" of the function to begin with.
> 
> Fe can be quite disorienting to Te's - not necessarily in a "bad" way all the time, though at best I'm usually admirable of it in others knowing that I'm terrible at it. Then there's the problem of attempting to use Fi to compensate for it, and not having such actions be understood the way they were intended to be. This usually takes the form of doing "secret" things on others' behalf that we hope they find meaningful later on, or in general attempting to establish deep, "oasis-like" friendships, where the power of the friendship is based on two people loving each other quietly. This is sort of like what you guys mentioned in part 3 of your video, with Lady Lullaby's ESTJ daughter. I'm sure there's a Ti/Te side to it too


I guess I can see how dominant Fe can be jarring... but I think I'd still contend that healthy, non-codependent, non-over-arching Fe shouldn't come across as jarring to other types. Weird, maybe, but not jarring. Or I hope so, anyway.

Interestingly, I would say that dominant Te doesn't really bother me unless it comes across as too "mean". But maybe I'm saying something parallel to what you are about dominant Fe. I don't mind forthright, direct, system-driven (as opposed to people-driven) Te. I might disagree with it if it values the people side too little, but I don't inherently mind it. And I value that it lets you know where you stand without any holds barred.

I hadn't thought about the Ti/Te aspect of INFJ/ESTJ relationships. Good insight.

BTW, your description of quiet, "secret" Fi love is beautiful to me. So that is something that we share a respect for.


----------



## caraez

Coziene said:


> At the time I did not know about MBTI. It wasn't until the fact that I remembered today, that I attempted to classify them. I'm not sure why I thought ENFPs have Fe as their four primary functions; I should know better...
> I consider them ENFPs, now that I remember them, because they were a very bubbly and very talkative. Of course a lot of women are regardless, but I just _know_ they were ENFP.
> That laughing at, or about, me was the most peculiar thing of the day. I did not even consider they they might've liked me. If I were with a friend, I would not point at a girl in plain view, who was looking at me, and whisper or even speak aloud that she was cute or pretty. I would be discreet, and if she didn't know then all the better.
> These girls made it very obvious, and I was getting very annoyed because I was under the impression by the end that they were making fun of me.
> If they did like me, that was not the best way to go about expressing it. Why are N's more likely to go for shabbily dressed N's? Btw, a polo shirt, jeans, and falling-apart tennis shoes (I know I need to get them replaced...) are a great style. Just saying.
> 
> Yeah, I do have Fe as well. But I don't let it surface very often. Fe is the one function that if it pops up squealing, I grab my tranquilizer darts and put it back down. Fi I like to analyze, consider, and evaluate due to the strange emotions it can bring up. Fe makes me human; I haven't entirely erased humanity yet!
> 
> With regards to your experiment, I wonder how many INTJs would come forward.


I know what you mean, because it bugs me when I think someone's talking about me. But if you're sure they're NFP, then it reminds me of how me and my INTP chick friend will on occasion see someone interesting/cute, then make up stories about them all Ne like, turn him into some bad-ass guy, and just have fun with it, which usually results in giggling that I'm sure drives the subject of our ideas crazy. Sorry, haha. It doesn't even have to do with wanting to flirt with them or anything. The other day my NTP friend and I saw two cute guys and we imagined they were a gay hipster couple who lived in a studio apartment and etc. Like I said, it's just fun because they're cute, captured our attention, excited our Ne. Also I'm totally ashamed of how shallow and immature this all is, so forgive me for sharing :O Consider it a guilty pleasure I don't indulge in very often at all.

I'm drawn towards the shabbily dressed ones (or the quirkily dressed ones) cause I knew deep down, even before I knew MBTI, that they were N like me and I was more likely to relate to them. Also, it just makes them more interesting and intriguing. Polo and jeans and tennis shoes are definitely awesome, by the way. I once had a huge crush on an INTJ. He was such a dork and so adorable in his glasses and polos and sweaters and sneakers.  

The experiment: I already have at least one INTJ!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Kito said:


> That sounds fun. I'm imagining it Pokemon style.
> 
> SJ used Concrete Fact!
> It's super effective!
> NF fainted!


LOL


----------



## Hastings

Quite fascinating to see @Lady Lullaby and @pneumoceptor in the same video. It feels like an INFJ internet celebrity matchup. Or maybe not _celebrity_. But you know what I mean. I think.


----------



## amongfirstslugs

Your eyes are enthralling. 

I like the idea. Am I too late?


----------



## Figure

pneumoceptor said:


> I guess I can see how dominant Fe can be jarring... but I think I'd still contend that healthy, non-codependent, non-over-arching Fe shouldn't come across as jarring to other types. Weird, maybe, but not jarring. Or I hope so, anyway.
> 
> Interestingly, I would say that dominant Te doesn't really bother me unless it comes across as too "mean". But maybe I'm saying something parallel to what you are about dominant Fe. I don't mind forthright, direct, system-driven (as opposed to people-driven) Te. I might disagree with it if it values the people side too little, but I don't inherently mind it. And I value that it lets you know where you stand without any holds barred.
> 
> I hadn't thought about the Ti/Te aspect of INFJ/ESTJ relationships. Good insight.
> 
> BTW, your description of quiet, "secret" Fi love is beautiful to me. So that is something that we share a respect for.


Oooooo excellent topics there  I'd address them all, but perhaps on video will be even better!


----------



## amongfirstslugs

LXPilot said:


> Thanks
> 
> Then there's the problem of attempting to use Fi to compensate for it, and not having such actions be understood the way they were intended to be. This usually takes the form of doing "secret" things on others' behalf that we hope they find meaningful later on, or in general attempting to establish deep, "oasis-like" friendships, where the power of the friendship is based on two people loving each other quietly.



In what ways are they misunderstood?


----------



## pneumoceptor

amongfirstslugs said:


> Your eyes are enthralling.
> 
> I like the idea. Am I too late?


Nope! Send me a PM and we can arrange something .


----------



## dejavu

At long last, the interaction videos between myself and @benr3600. Apologies for the echo. I think I've worked out what caused it, but I can't do anything about it now.


----------



## Coziene

Is it me misinterpreting it, or does he look like he has second thoughts and is disliking being filmed? I certainly wouldn't be comfortable before a camera.


----------



## Dark NiTe

lulz. Finally the NTs gonna represent :tongue: 

Thank you based @dejavu for really picking up my slack and practically quarterbacking this whole thing, from the technical stuff to facilitating the conversation. I was actually pretty prepared for this last week when we first planned on doing this, and then over the weekend when our schedules weren't compatible I kind of lost motivation and was dreading doing a live interview for everybody to watch. Hopefully it turned out better than I think it did.


----------



## Dark NiTe

Coziene said:


> Is it me misinterpreting it, or does he look like he has second thoughts and is disliking being filmed? I certainly wouldn't be comfortable before a camera.


Yeah, it's one of those things where the more time I had to think about it, the more I was regretting volunteering to make a long video interview like this. I don't regret doing this at all, I just wish we didn't have the technical issues last week; I was much more comfortable jumping in the deepend than slowly dipping myself in the cold water. Honestly, I think it could have been much worse for me if I weren't interviewing an ExxP type that kept the flow going well.


----------



## Coziene

benr3600 said:


> Yeah, it's one of those things where the more time I had to think about it, the more I was regretting volunteering to make a long video interview like this. I don't regret doing this at all, I just wish we didn't have the technical issues last week; I was much more comfortable jumping in the deepend than slowly dipping myself in the cold water. Honestly, I think it could have been much worse for me if I weren't interviewing an ExxP type that kept the flow going well.


That is one of my biggest issues so I see your point: When I have time to think, I begin to really consider what I'm getting in to, and then psyche myself out. At least you stuck to it; you can celebrate that it is done and over with.


----------



## dejavu

Coziene said:


> At least you stuck to it; you can celebrate that it is done and over with.


XD

Now I feel like I was torturing the poor guy.


----------



## Dark NiTe

dejavu said:


> XD
> 
> Now I feel like I was torturing the poor guy.


lol. I'm not sure if this would have been a success without someone like you. Can you imagine if it were me and another INTJ? 

Besides, nobody put a gun to my head and made me volunteer/proceed with doing this  :tongue:


----------



## pneumoceptor

dejavu said:


> At long last, the interaction videos between myself and @_benr3600_. Apologies for the echo. I think I've worked out what caused it, but I can't do anything about it now.


Excellent job, guys. I always enjoy talking to ENFPs. I've only watched your first vid so far... I couldn't tell whether benr3600 feels the same way about a conversation with an ENTP, but I'd like to think so .

observations/questions:

1. Your surroundings are color-coordinated. What a cosmic connection. Brown and brown.

2. dejavu, why on earth do you think you were mistyped as INFJ??

3. benr3600, you are indisputably INTJ (not that you were questioning it). You ooze Ni, but with a thinker flavor rather than my feeler flavor.

4. dejavu, I would love to get you talking but not as the host/facilitator... I would want to get your Ne going.

5. dejavu, your comment is fascinating about being torn because you're both drawn to people (for stimulation) but have a hard time finding people to relate to. I think I have an analogous problem... I'm drawn to people (for connecting) but have a hard time finding people to relate to. And I'm simultaneously drawn to be alone. I think INFJs are called the most extraverted of the introverts? And you're the most introverted of the extraverts. Parallels abound.


----------



## Karen

pneumoceptor said:


> 5. dejavu, your comment is fascinating about being torn because you're both drawn to people (for stimulation) but have a hard time finding people to relate to. I think I have an analogous problem... I'm drawn to people (for connecting) but have a hard time finding people to relate to. And I'm simultaneously drawn to be alone. I think INFJs are called the most extraverted of the introverts? And you're the most introverted of the extraverts. Parallels abound.


I've watched part to all of every video and I think everyone is doing a great job, much better than I could. And no, I'm not volunteering, lol.

I'm also torn by being drawn to people because I need connections and the stimulation of discussing ideas, but finding very few who are enough like me to enjoy more than a short conversation. Then when I find someone I feel understands the world the way I do, I'm so excited that I'm bouncing off the walls, and that's totally weird! 

I also take up the slack with nature and wild animals, which isn't a great compromise since I'm an extrovert, but I don't know what else to do. I'm just lucky I live near beautiful nature and have a great connection to plants and animals. So I totally understand what you were saying in the video, dejavu.


----------



## dejavu

pneumoceptor said:


> 2. dejavu, why on earth do you think you were mistyped as INFJ??


The main reason is an immense lack of self awareness, but it was also partly due to being very depressed. By the time I'd taken the test, I was depressed for about 6 years without realizing it and I was not being myself. That seemed to have brought out my shadow type, ISFJ (not a nice one though.) And that seemed to translate to INFJ when I took the test.



> 4. dejavu, I would love to get you talking but not as the host/facilitator... I would want to get your Ne going.


In my experience, INFJs are good at that. :tongue: You wanna chat? I'm up for anything.



> 5. dejavu, your comment is fascinating about being torn because you're both drawn to people (for stimulation) but have a hard time finding people to relate to. I think I have an analogous problem... I'm drawn to people (for connecting) but have a hard time finding people to relate to. And I'm simultaneously drawn to be alone. I think INFJs are called the most extraverted of the introverts? And you're the most introverted of the extraverts. Parallels abound.


Yeah, I see what you're saying. That's interesting to think about. It's a similar problem while being a bit opposite. I always saw my inability to relate as being an Intuitive problem, for the most part, but compounded by being a Thinker female. Maybe I'm wrong, and the situation is just as difficult for Intuitive Feeler girls.


----------



## Coburn

@benr3600

Nice interview. You are exactly like my INTJ housemate, so it's doubly entertaining for me because I get to imagine his responses through yours.

@dejavu

I would love to set up an interview with you. If you're interested, PM me.


----------



## donkeybals

@benr3600 Are you sure you are an intj? I think you might be a mistype, a true esfp at heart. XD Kidding! I also found it funny how you clash with istjs.  Proficiency vs sufficiency.


----------



## Dark NiTe

Marlowe said:


> @_benr3600_
> 
> Nice interview. You are exactly like my INTJ housemate, so it's doubly entertaining for me because I get to imagine his responses through yours.


lol, thank you :happy:


----------



## Doctorjuice

This sounds like a great idea! How do I get in on it?


----------



## pneumoceptor

dejavu said:


> The main reason is an immense lack of self awareness, but it was also partly due to being very depressed. By the time I'd taken the test, I was depressed for about 6 years without realizing it and I was not being myself. That seemed to have brought out my shadow type, ISFJ (not a nice one though.) And that seemed to translate to INFJ when I took the test.


OK, that makes sense. Wow. Yeah, the idea of an ENTP seeming/feeling like an ISFJ sounds very very off. I'm glad you're at a different place now.



> In my experience, INFJs are good at that. :tongue: You wanna chat? I'm up for anything.


Absolutely (or as the kids say, totes). Send me a PM?



> Yeah, I see what you're saying. That's interesting to think about. It's a similar problem while being a bit opposite. I always saw my inability to relate as being an Intuitive problem, for the most part, but compounded by being a Thinker female. Maybe I'm wrong, and the situation is just as difficult for Intuitive Feeler girls.


I think you're dead on, that being a thinker girl poses unique challenges in at least our culture. People probably often don't get where you're coming from. Then again, I would think it could offer unique strengths... being a girl allows you to charm people a bit more than being a guy (because people are less on guard for aggression), and that could be used to your advantage in selling your ideas, starting your business(es), etc. As far as intuitive feeler girls having it hard... meh... every type has their own set of difficulties, I suppose.


BTW, I watched a little bit of one of your game walkthrus on your youtube channel. It was fun to see your sarcastic Ne poke through from time to time. Enjoyed it .


----------



## Dark NiTe

Doctorjuice said:


> This sounds like a great idea! How do I get in on it?


PM @caraez, she has posted in the last couple pages or so. Since pneumoceptor is pretty much booked with interviews for many weeks, caraez has been matching up willing participants with each other. 

Funny, I actually thought about recommending you participate in this after watching the INFJ vs. INFP video you recently made. #1. I don't think we have an INTP volunteer that I know of yet, #2. you seem like a much better communicator in this type of thing than I am.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Doctorjuice said:


> This sounds like a great idea! How do I get in on it?


Let's set something up! PM me?


----------



## Doctorjuice

benr3600 said:


> *I don't think we have an INTP volunteer that I know of yet*


Shocking.


----------



## Dark NiTe

Doctorjuice said:


> Shocking.


Yeah I know. Maybe we could setup an interview between you and me/the other INTJ who posted in here so that we can finally see what happens when you divide by zero :tongue:


----------



## Doctorjuice

benr3600 said:


> Yeah I know. Maybe we could setup an interview between you and me/the other INTJ who posted in here so that we can finally see what happens when you divide by zero :tongue:


I think the universe would implode. It wouldn't be able to take the sheer concentration of intellectualism and social awkwardness.


----------



## caraez

benr3600 said:


> PM @_caraez_, she has posted in the last couple pages or so. Since pneumoceptor is pretty much booked with interviews for many weeks, caraez has been matching up willing participants with each other.
> 
> Funny, I actually thought about recommending you participate in this after watching the INFJ vs. INFP video you recently made. #1. I don't think we have an INTP volunteer that I know of yet, #2. you seem like a much better communicator in this type of thing than I am.


Yes, for anyone who's interested I'm attempting to set people up, and I always need more people to match.


----------



## Doctorjuice

@_caraez_ @_benr3600_

I have the desire to talk to the following types most (Most desired at the top):
1. INFJ or ENFJ
2. ENTP
3. xxNP
4. All other Ns (Although I'm open to conversing with Sensors.)

I _really _need to converse with xNTJs though, my understanding of them needs to be better. In order for that to work I think it would be best to list out topics we'd both be interested in talking about beforehand and/or list some goals we wish to achieve in the conversation.

With the other types I think it would be more exciting _not_ to do that.


----------



## Coziene

Doctorjuice said:


> @_caraez_ @_benr3600_
> 
> I have the desire to talk to the following types most (Most desired at the top):
> 1. INFJ or ENFJ
> 2. ENTP
> 3. xxNP
> 4. All other Ns (Although I'm open to conversing with Sensors.)
> 
> I _really _need to converse with xNTJs though, my understanding of them needs to be better. In order for that to work I think it would be best to list out topics we'd both be interested in talking about beforehand and/or list some goals we wish to achieve in the conversation.
> 
> With the other types I think it would be more exciting _not_ to do that.


Yeah, INTJs need the structure there; improvising through the entire video would be disastrous. I could just see the INTJ nodding, saying "Yeah, yeah" throughout the entirety of the conversation. I'd be interested to see how you interact with an INTJ; I've really enjoyed, and benefited, from your videos so far. You've done a good job in expressing the different functions. I stumbled upon your videos in my continued research into MBTI back when I was getting a handle on them.


----------



## CaptainMauzer

*surpise* new interaction video for anyone interested. Me and @Marlowe got paired up and we decided to just go for it last night. I had to edit out alot because we ended up recording two hours of conversation, and I had to whittle it down to about 45 minutes (because really, who wants to watch us talk for 2 hours) :laughing:


----------



## pneumoceptor

CaptainMauzer said:


> *surpise* new interaction video for anyone interested. Me and @_Marlowe_ got paired up and we decided to just go for it last night. I had to edit out alot because we ended up recording two hours of conversation, and I had to whittle it down to about 45 minutes (because really, who wants to watch us talk for 2 hours) :laughing:


Yay!! Can't wait to watch .


----------



## pneumoceptor

OK, so just watched the first vid with @Marlowe and @CaptainMauzer. Loved it.

My two favorite parts so far:
1. when Marlowe says that XXXX makes you Jesus
2. when CaptainMauzer is describing why he likes The Hunger Games and relates to Catniss, because she's so in her head and analytical. He says that others might not like the series as much because she just seems weird and over-analytical. He says he can imagine there might be people want more action. Marlowe says, "Me!"

Great job, guys. Looking forward to watching the rest.


----------



## pneumoceptor

favorite parts/quotes from the second video:

1. when CaptainMauzer puts "failure to yield ticket" in quotes, as though it's figurative
2. that both of you fear falling off a treadmill, one for social embarrassment and one for the cost of reconstructive surgery
3. the Parthenon plateau
4. "science is magic"
5. "If your dream was to be a janitor, I'd be like, your dream kinda sucks."
6. "I'm going to DeVry University." "I heard that was a really good school." [shakes head emphatically] "No."


----------



## Kito

Awesome video you two. xD

I decided on my type not long ago so if anyone wants to do a video with an INFP then I'm up for it (although I imagine there's probably plenty of INFPs here already).

If anyone wants to do any Enneagram ones too then I'd love to do that!


----------



## FacePalm

@CaptainMauzer

Try Camstudio for screen video capture. Free and doesn't stop every 5 minutes.


----------



## CaptainMauzer

FacePalm said:


> @CaptainMauzer
> 
> Try Camstudio for screen video capture. Free and doesn't stop every 5 minutes.


Thanks haha, in the beginning when I said we were winging it, I mean literally I had no recording software and we did not have a scheduled meeting. Marlowe messages me back and 20 min. later we are recording xD


----------



## pneumoceptor

I present... @caraez and pneumoceptor:


----------



## Coziene

Interesting INFJ-INFP videos. I will play them all the way through soon; I did play about 5 minutes worth, and I am liking the INFP and INFJ collaboration. I observed a very big difference in expression, but can't adequately explain it yet. 
Good work with the videos; they really expand on things.


----------



## thunder

Nice. I enjoyed the discussion on Fi/Fe and Fi-Ne vs Ni-Fe in the 3rd part.


----------



## caraez

Something I kind of noticed but couldn't really put into words during that video was that she kept saying relationships were external things for her, while for me deep relationships are more internal. I think: "How do I feel about this relationship? What can I learn from our differences? Is this relationship no longer working for me? What should I do about it?" etc.

But yay! I'm on the internet! I'm surprised it got put up so quickly.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Sooo many videos... yessss... here is the seventh installment, where I chat it up with ISTP @CaptainMauzer.


----------



## Kabosu

atypeofuser said:


> Next weekend I should order a handset or headset and after getting that, maybe I can get this Skype thing rolling.


Now I have 2 devices and 1 of those for backup purposes. I just hope I can be heard for this. 

EDIT: Upon testing the communication headphones, the mic sounds pretty good.


----------



## caraez

A couple notes/ideas:

1. If I've already matched you and you want to be matched again, please let me know so I can match you with other interested parties! I'm assuming that you don't want to be matched again unless you tell me.

2. Since there seems to be a lack of new people who are making videos, I wonder if we should make a new thread with a link to this one with detailed instructions on doing a video in the first post so we could draw in more people? It might be easier for people to jump in without browsing through pages on this thread to figure out exactly how to get in on it.

Also, does anyone know a good skype recorder for mac? The only free one I can find puts their brand all over the video.


----------



## pneumoceptor

^^
Speaking to #2, I will say that I have four more video chats lined up, three of which are with new faces. And also, yes, new ways to bring in more people sound good.


----------



## Doctorjuice

caraez said:


> 2. Since there seems to be a lack of new people who are making videos, I wonder if we should make a new thread with a link to this one with detailed instructions on doing a video in the first post so we could draw in more people? It might be easier for people to jump in without browsing through pages on this thread to figure out exactly how to get in on it.


I would love to get paired up with more people. Though only one or two more for now.


----------



## Bast

I love these videos, what a great idea!


----------



## Geoffrey

-----I've learned so much from this video series, and enjoyed it, so I took it upon myself to share them through PerC's Media Library. The playlist is here: PersonalityCafe - Pneumoceptor's MBTI Interaction Series
-----What I didn't see coming is that comments on the videos would be e-mailed to me--instead of to the people in the videos, lol. I am working on setting something up with cityofcircuits. However, if you don't have an ISFP lined up, yet, perhaps you would like to speak with cityofcircuits. Anyway, here they are:




Media Library - MBTI interactions: ISTP and INFJ part 2



FearsomeCritter said:


> People that i genuinely enjoy being around are.... Rare.
> I can be polite with most but friendly with very few. However, I also don't make an effort to make enemies.





JJ4000 said:


> I'm really enjoying this considering I'm an INFJ and one of my best friends is an ISTP. I'm an INFJ 5, which probably helps me get along with them.





Lady Lullaby said:


> I've left lots of comments on the youtube channel. I love this series and I particularly enjoyed this interaction. I have a very sweet spot for ISTPs. This one she interviews is quite a gem too!





Media Library - ENFP and INTJ on Typology



Lunarprox said:


> I hate it when you're on a topic and Ni starts the guessing -- then you're like, wait hold on, maybe it's.. Ahh whatever.





Media Library - Type Interaction ISTP-ESFJ Part 3



slyspy said:


> After watching this whole thing (because I obviously have no life), I would say that the woman on the left of the screen (I am SO sorry I can't remember your name) is an ESTJ. You seem to have Si-Ne rather than Ni-Se just because all of the detailed scenarios that you have lead me to that conclusion. I have NO idea about the guy though....Great conversation.





cityofcircuits said:


> Thanx for the upload. Interesting interaction to be sure. I mean that in a good way.
> 
> I wonder what an interaction between an isfp and an xxxx would be? lol.





Media Library - MBTI interactions: INFP and INFJ part 2



bigtalljay said:


> Well, I ended up watching all four of these. I found it very interesting to actually see and hear you two "compare notes," so to speak. One of my very best friends happens to be an INFJ, and I absolutely love the connection that we have. So many things seem similar (the NF thing), but like you pointed out, the two types are indeed very different. I could definitely relate to @caraez in how she thinks and explains things, even in speech patterns and overall gentleness. I also love the characteristic INFJ intensity (yeah, it's here) that I seem to frequently see in my friend. I can imagine our conversations going somewhat like yours. Except we get veeery silly.
> Thanks so much for posting.


----------



## caraez

Doctorjuice said:


> I would love to get paired up with more people. Though only one or two more for now.


Does that mean you'd like ME to pair you up?



Bast said:


> I love these videos, what a great idea!


Wanna do one? 




> Speaking to #2, I will say that I have four more video chats lined up, three of which are with new faces. And also, yes, new ways to bring in more people sound good.​




Ok, yay! And then I shall create a thread soon with instructions and links. Maybe a mod will sticky it? :O


One more note: Are there links between the different you tube channels with the different videos? That might help people who are finding this on youtube?


----------



## Doctorjuice

caraez said:


> Does that mean you'd like ME to pair you up?


Sure.

And if anybody wants to do one with me, PM me.

Btw, with all the talk about ISTPs, I thought I'd mention that my best friend is an ISTP.



caraez said:


> One more note: Are there links between the different you tube channels with the different videos? That might help people who are finding this on youtube?


 @pneumoceptor
I thought it would be a good idea to put all the mbti-interaction videos in a playlist.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Sooo many videos... yessss... here is the seventh installment, where I chat it up with ISTP @_CaptainMauzer_.


Great job you guys! I like how just simple questions can so clearly contrast the differences between function use and personality. I wanted to be in the room and ask more questions as you guys were talking - I was very interested in the discussion about being more extraverted as a child (@CaptainMauzer). My theory is that it may have been partially due to bullying in childhood, but also I think Se is very natural for children. That is a big part of how they learn about the world and they aren't as socialized yet to have the same kind of boundaries etc. as we are as adults. So the Ti starts to increase with more education and socialization and life experience (this is just a Lady Lullaby theory :tongue. I think there are exceptions, but I wouldn't be surprised if many ISTPs and even INTPs would say they were more social and comfortable in social settings as children and grew to behave in a more introverted fashion. (At least the INTPs and ISTPs I know IRL could say the same.) I think in society it is almost as if we don't realize we can withdraw, when we're children, if we live in a very extraverted environment, until we're older. But slowly our natural need for private energy becomes more conscious and we learn that it recharges us. I also think that when we are young adults and often become interested in having a significant other etc. we are then drawn to become more engaged socially again. Captain Mauzer - I just wanted to commend you for your intelligent approach to tackling social anxiety. I have a brother-in-law (I think he is ISTJ) that I wish could hear what you said and try it out. I admire your approach and perhaps you've read some on the topic, but it is exactly what Cognitive Behavioral Therapy would help people practice to overcome it. Bravo!

I love, love love, music and hope to become a music therapist so my favorite part of these videos was when you both talked about how you use music, when and how it is cathartic etc. It is so multi-faceted and has so many forms of expression, I believe this is why it is a universal healing tool! I related to you both! I use music as a background without lyrics when I am working on a project, reading, relaxing, introspecting etc. I use it as a form of conscious analysis with lyrics as well as a soothing to my soul. I have music playing a lot too. My girls both love to dance too so I find if I have it on in the house, they will come into the room and just start dancing and then it becomes a way we connect with each other. I appreciate so many different styles and forms of music and really liked hearing about the personal ways you both enjoy and use it. Thanks again!

The J and rules thing made me smile. It is a common misconception that J's are organized and rule-abiding and P's are messy and rule-breakers. It obviously isn't what these letters mean so it was fun to hear examples of how you both are more similar in that way then you think. The J simply means you engage your world with the Judging function of T or F (in INFJs case it is Fe), and the P means you engage your world with the Perceiving function N or S (in ISTPs case it is Se). 

Good luck in Chicago next year CaptainMauzer! Hopefully you can post some pictures - - cities can definitely be beautiful! (I especially enjoy seeing/watching them at night!)


----------



## pneumoceptor

caraez said:


> One more note: Are there links between the different you tube channels with the different videos? That might help people who are finding this on youtube?





Doctorjuice said:


> I thought it would be a good idea to put all the mbti-interaction videos in a playlist.



I'll do this soon...


----------



## Kuthtuk

I'd like to participate! xD!

ENTP - Brazilian with allot of spare time since i'm jobless now =D


----------



## Bast

caraez said:


> Wanna do one?



Well... I would if it weren't for two things: One, my type is sort of nebulous, and two, my huge fear of my face appearing online LOL!!


----------



## pneumoceptor

I present an Ni supernova! Here's my chat with INTJ @LXPilot:


----------



## pneumoceptor

Doctorjuice said:


> I thought it would be a good idea to put all the mbti-interaction videos in a playlist.


I present: the playlist.

(eleven hours of swirling cognitive functions and counting...)


----------



## Doctorjuice

pneumoceptor said:


> I present: the playlist.
> 
> (eleven hours of swirling cognitive functions and counting...)


Eleven hours is impressive, you should be proud.

@_LXPilot_
You seem so confident. I'm envious!


----------



## thunder

The INTJ-INFJ videos make me like Ni-users even more than I already did. @_LXPilot_, you pulled the question about @_pneumoceptor_ 's username out of my head, which I was thinking just the other night.

I find the Ti/Te difference very interesting, and how Ti can annoy Te at times.

My ENTJ friend sometimes tells me that I surprise her because once she thinks she's got me figured out, I somehow do something that doesn't seem consistent. On the other hand (<--haha, supposed Ti-favored language!), I see myself as perfectly consistent and have no idea what she means when she says I am not consistent or surprising. 

I've also observed that many of the introvert interactions seem more "extroverted" in a way, and I do agree with pneumocepter that it has to do with the "forced intimacy" with the common interest in MBTI. That and the fact that all of you are volunteers and willing to converse.


----------



## esoterictimes

Regarding the question asked in Part 4 of LXPilot and Pneumoceptor, I think LXPilot is right when he says that Fi people have a feeling of not completely understanding themselves, so feel like no one else can either. Which is probably untrue. When you nitpick every thought and feeling to the point of exhaustion, it often times takes someone to point out the simple obvious truth to you. Whether or not the Fi user will accept the help is another matter though. I know I've been resistant to any help of any kind.

The question asked by Pneumoceptor directly afterwards I think is different than what LXPilot was talking about though. I personally always know what my internal valuations are, though if I'm in distress it can be nebulous....or even illogical. I'd imagine a Fi user under a lot of stress can be overly aggressive and protective I think. At least that's how it is with me sometimes.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> I present an Ni supernova! Here's my chat with INTJ @_LXPilot_:


Loved This!!! (And how fun to be mentioned woot woot! Thanks for 'getting' what I meant about masking @_LXPilot_.) Thumbs up for another ISFJ Mom LOL! 
I took a couple of linguistic classes in college and loved them too! (Too bad it was back when I was choosing my major to please others in my life....)

I have tried to study Socionics, I think I may visit it again thanks to your contrasting description here LXPilot. LOL Te vs. Ti with the INTJ/INTP 'if you duct-tape a plane and it flies...' I can hear the INTPs running towards you with fury intending to show you 'a better wayyyy!' hehe 

Gotta put another shout out for Ni-doms always wanting to go deeper! 'Dig a Little Deeper!'

Ooh...I liked the Ni-box metaphor...very much!


----------



## thunder

Bast said:


> Well... I would if it weren't for two things: One, my type is sort of nebulous, and two, my huge fear of *my face appearing online* LOL!!


^ exactly why I am so hesitant to do a video! Maybe if my face/skype screen got cut out post-conversation and there was only my audio posted... hmm (hides to go *cough* "think" *cough*)


----------



## Figure

Lady Lullaby said:


> I showed INTP hubby my pic and what it was in reference to and he said, "No, I think HE (meaning you, the INTJ) had it all planned out from A-Z and someone else came in and wanted to duct-tape it another way! I think the INTJs are the ones who get annoyed and the INTPs are thinking - that's funny that you're annoyed." :laughing:
> 
> Can't we/you all (INTJs/INTPs) just get along?


Ha, you know, you timed that hilariously because @Doctorjuice and I are going to film one soon - should we call the police and let them know? 

INTP/INTJ actually get along quite well most of the time - it's just a funky kind of "getting along" - but nonetheless, real


----------



## Lady Lullaby

LXPilot said:


> Ha, you know, you timed that hilariously because @_Doctorjuice_ and I are going to film one soon - should we call the police and let them know?
> 
> INTP/INTJ actually get along quite well most of the time - it's just a funky kind of "getting along" - but nonetheless, real


I can't wait to watch!  

I'm sure it will be both fun and enlightening!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

LXPilot said:


> Thanks  I love your videos too - they usually manage to illuminate something I was thinking about but couldn't describe explicitly - must be our Ni powers haha. You guys are the masters at explaining in a collective way, so I'm not sure my description would have been as clear without @_pneumoceptor_ to take it further!



Thank you - - In that case, you might want to avoid the MBTI Basics vids I just added then, because they are meant for 'beginners' to MBTI. (I've had questions on my youtube channel that lead me to make those.) It is just nice to talk to people who appreciate 'collective explanations'. Mike on NF-geeks says all the time that INFJs are notoriously bad at explaining things LOL.




LXPilot said:


> This is a great example of the above. Watching this video, I feel almost as though I was a watered-down ESFP - which is typically how I would behave towards someone I know is a feeler, to find common ground at first. It's not that using Fi, or if you feel similarly with Ti in your case, is "faking," as it really only requires a bit more energy to show outside. It's more that I'll put a bit more effort in to use it for everyone's social comfort. This may be a bit different for you guys, since Fe comes more naturally to INFJ - but maybe in more thinker-dominated situations, you'd use Ti more readily? No idea, just random musings here.
> 
> 
> Either way, I think our "masking" habits _may _have something to do with Se - knowing what the moment calls for, and implementing tangibly in the present.


That's interesting because I have an INTJ friend who I relate to really well but when we get together with an ESFP we both know, I don't recognize said INTJ! She gets really animated and laughs A LOT and I start wondering - hmmm...do I even know her like I think I do? haha I liked that you said it isn't 'faking' anything, and that it just takes more energy to show outside; because that is just what I'm doing when I discuss things that interest my INTP husband. Ti is in me 'somewhere', but I just really struggle to keep up with him. I would agree that it might be using our Se when we 'mask' because I have soo many more memories about things in high school when I was operating through Fe constantly - it really did 'put me in the moment.'



LXPilot said:


> Yeah, you know, the real advantage Model A has over our typology is that it describes the way functions interact together - not just what they are by themselves. A lot of people seem to confuse a function's appearance with what it's essence really is. Here's a good article to start with, though it's a bit wordy. I think, overall, socionics has a lot of trouble here because of the translation errors from Russian, and a lot of the sources we have to read from are really weird and off-setting. The theory itself, though, seems pretty dead-on. It's a lot more "mechanical" too, for better or worse. The key, though, is that the function "numbers" are different than they are with Beebe, so for that bottom part (I think the most useful part), you'd have to look up the functional numbers for an INFp (MBTI INFJ).


Cool! Where would you suggest looking them up? Any handy link by chance?


----------



## Doctorjuice

LXPilot said:


> Ha, you know, you timed that hilariously because @_Doctorjuice_ and I are going to film one soon - should we call the police and let them know?
> 
> INTP/INTJ actually get along quite well most of the time - it's just a funky kind of "getting along" - but nonetheless, real


I have only interacted with one INTJ in real life and he was a sixty-something man. We talked about how some machine used bar codes from cardboard boxes to triangulate its position and what the future of automobiles would be like - how automated vehicles wouldn't mix too well with manually-controlled vehicles. People driving adds in a lot of variables into the mix, it would be far easier to have an all-or-none system.

We got along well enough.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Doctorjuice said:


> I have only interacted with one INTJ in real life and he was a sixty-something man. We talked about how some machine used bar codes from cardboard boxes to triangulate its position and what the future of automobiles would be like - how automated vehicles wouldn't mix too well with manually-controlled vehicles. People driving adds in a lot of variables into the mix, it would be far easier to have an all-or-none system.
> 
> We got along well enough.



(Sorry, sometimes I get in a gif-addiction-burst and can't help but do this a lot....)

I wonder if discussing theoretical ideas and actually having to collaborate on a project are where the differences might present more of a contrast?


----------



## Doctorjuice

Lady Lullaby said:


> I wonder if discussing theoretical ideas and actually having to collaborate on a project are where the differences might present more of a contrast?


You could see a Ti-Te contrast in how we came to judgements about what future automobiles might be like. When he was explaining the machine that triangulated its position it was like I had to translate it from his language to my language. Though at the end of it all I walked away with a very good understanding of what he was talking about.

I think collaborating on a project would highlight the most differences. Would it work? Idk. I have read that INTJ-INTP collaboration turns out extremely well, that they're capable of achieving almost any task together. On the other hand, I have heard people say that there's a lot of clash and that the large differences in thought process make things difficult.


----------



## Coburn

Lady Lullaby said:


> These were so fun. I liked seeing you guys laugh and smile as much as you did...not all videos with Ti/Te users have that engaging aspect for me. I found myself intrigued that Marlowe can see her task-oriented focus in her life and relate to the idea in movies that she's missing the emotional/relational aspect; but she also *doesn't seem *as sad about it as I might be in her shoes.


Glad you enjoyed it! To address your comments:

I think it's these kinds of things that inferior Fi really screws up sometimes when it comes to communication. It's not that I'm not sad about it-- I do feel a sort of nostalgic sadness regarding my lack of emotional attachment/openess. But I don't know how to show it. How do I show in a video that I wish I were better at being emotionally aware? Cry on camera? Whine? Those reactions feel silly and demeaning-- they simplify and trivialize the emotion that lingers behind it. 

You have to remember with Fi-- just because we can talk about something calmly and offhandedly (even dismissively) doesn't mean there isn't an emotion behind our words.

Unfortunately, this can create a cyclical problem-- I express how I feel about something (by talking about it, even in a casual manner), the person I'm talking to thinks "well, they seem pretty calm, so it's probably not that big a deal," leading them to treat it in the same dismissive manner, which in turn makes me think "oh, they don't get it. okay, then. I won't bother bringing it up again." And thus the emotional closed-ness becomes even stronger.

I'm not sure how to reverse this cycle, so I've simply grown to accept it as an expected communication problem with others. This is one of the reasons I so appreciate my father-- he doesn't let the way I say something throw him off. He just inherently understands the underlying emotion. 



> I definitely relate to Marlowe's comment about exercising keeping yourself out of getting depressed after being laid off, and giving you a sense of accomplishing something for the day as well as a chemical high. (I definitely use/enjoy exercise for the same reasons).


Yay for exercise!



> Wow Marlowe - Astronaut for NASA? Not what I expected; and Parthenon on a plateau in AZ? What a picturesque idea! I would have thought your answers were more in line with what you're already pursuing; i.e. becoming an award winning screen writer etc. Hmmm. I love when these things reveal how people are more than meets the eye.


I have crazy dreams. Just because reality doesn't coincide with them doesn't mean I like to give them up. I'm a greedy dreamer. 



> Zion is gorgeous! I hope you go!! Heck - let's get pneumoceptor, you and I to do it (I live in UT btw). Or maybe get my ESTP brother-in-law to be our tour guide - he's done everything! Definitely would be something you'd be glad you did.


Oh my gosh. Say the word and I will get in my car and drive there, no questions asked. I love adventure!



> Thanks to you both! Very great videos.


Glad you liked it! Although to be honest, all credit goes to @CaptainMauzer. He did a wonderful job recording this and keeping the conversation within the recording limits. Way to be awesome, CM!


----------



## Nomenclature

Dagger said:


> I'll consider it. I'm not even sure if I'm really ISTJ or not; I feel like such an outlier xD
> 
> And I'm not old! lol


I'm not sure if I'm ISTP either! As my signature would suggest, I'm ESFp in Socionics. Let's try it anyway, haha. And nah, I'm just young.


----------



## Hastings

Perhaps a bit late, but I thought it was funny how @LXPilot and @pneumoceptor when discussing dynamics between INTPs and INFPs respectively, Lx talked about differences of thinking and taking action, while pneumo talked about differences in understanding values. It was simply very telling of the T/F dichotomy and it was interesting to see it play out that way.


----------



## Kabosu

Ok, so I did my first video yesterday. :happy: There is a bit of technical fail :dry: due to the fact that I didn't realize the effect of the echo on other party's end and somewhat static non-clarity to my side. (however, I might use other headsets that I think would take care of said echo problems.)

I will post it when I have finished editing the videos. I will also clarify some of the statements in the videos and questions and explanations I forgot... Ne w/ prolonged periods w/o sleep is a bit... awkward I know.

Next time I record a video, I'll make sure other party's web cam looks as clear on the screen as mine does. :dry:

I enjoyed interacting with said person.

I wouldn't mind getting paired with a Ne or Fe dom. user just because I think my conversations flow a lot more easily with those than not (post-script: The Te-dom in these seems assertive enough that would likely work as well). Still, any type is ok and I wanted to explore a different one for first interaction video.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Marlowe said:


> Glad you enjoyed it! To address your comments:
> 
> I think it's these kinds of things that inferior Fi really screws up sometimes when it comes to communication. It's not that I'm not sad about it-- I do feel a sort of nostalgic sadness regarding my lack of emotional attachment/openess. But I don't know how to show it. How do I show in a video that I wish I were better at being emotionally aware? Cry on camera? Whine? Those reactions feel silly and demeaning-- they simplify and trivialize the emotion that lingers behind it.
> 
> You have to remember with Fi-- just because we can talk about something calmly and offhandedly (even dismissively) doesn't mean there isn't an emotion behind our words.
> 
> Unfortunately, this can create a cyclical problem-- I express how I feel about something (by talking about it, even in a casual manner), the person I'm talking to thinks "well, they seem pretty calm, so it's probably not that big a deal," leading them to treat it in the same dismissive manner, which in turn makes me think "oh, they don't get it. okay, then. I won't bother bringing it up again." And thus the emotional closed-ness becomes even stronger.
> 
> I'm not sure how to reverse this cycle, so I've simply grown to accept it as an expected communication problem with others. This is one of the reasons I so appreciate my father-- he doesn't let the way I say something throw him off. He just inherently understands the underlying emotion.


@_Marlowe_
I need to apologize for sounding judgmental and misunderstanding you. When I said 'doesn't seem as sad as I might be in her shoes' I used the word 'seem' because I could tell it wasn't that you weren't sad about it. I actually presumed it did bother you, and I could tell you'd thought about it a lot. The very fact you gave the examples of movies you did and shared something so vulnerable meant it was not something you fully understood but were considering; and that if something bothered me I wouldn't know how to talk about it in a way that didn't show that. I was emphasizing my amazement at the very difference you're describing - Fi - 'how do I show it'? and Fe - 'how do I not show it'?



> I have crazy dreams. Just because reality doesn't coincide with them doesn't mean I like to give them up. I'm a greedy dreamer.


I love that!



> Oh my gosh. Say the word and I will get in my car and drive there, no questions asked. I love adventure!


We are only 4 hours away from St. George where my in-laws live. I could leave my girls with them anytime. Tell @_pneumoceptor_ (because she wants to be your friend too, we talked about how cool we think you are) and we'll do it!! :crazy:


----------



## Figure

cactus_waltz said:


> Perhaps a bit late, but I thought it was funny how @_LXPilot_ and @_pneumoceptor_ when discussing dynamics between INTPs and INFPs respectively, Lx talked about differences of thinking and taking action, while pneumo talked about differences in understanding values. It was simply very telling of the T/F dichotomy and it was interesting to see it play out that way.


That's a nice observation. You INFJ are really good at catching little patterns between things (there are infinitely more, I'm sure, in our videos). What's interesting, though, is when you step back and think about how the conversation would appear if you didn't know anything about typology. I'm thinking we wouldn't look _that _different, on the basis of Ni.


----------



## Kabosu

A couple days ago, I did one with @_caraez_ and I am _so_ sorry about the look of the camera on her side and didn't fully realize that until seeing the video. :-/ She possibly could have done better "edits" than what I have up here from friend, but I just did it myself, so this is also the first time I've really "edited" such a video (didn't do much).
Sorry about echo on her side/static on mine. We heard each other fine during the recording. 














On some of this, I feel like a bit of an ass, unfortunately. I will come back later and clarify, etc. on other thing.
Actually, @_pneumoceptor_ 's cloud analogy is when Ni started making sense to me.. my bad. I flaked on that bit anyway.
After hearing it finally explained, Fi seems _really_ deep.
I probably did know ENTPs after that, but I couldn't think of them on the spot.
As for final thought: I know there are a lot of "not spiritual" NTs, but I guess that being it or not never struck me as overly type-related. One of my school's campus ministers is very most likely an NT as well (might be xNTP come to think about it). It isn't an exclusive thing, but I seem to notice a "free thinking" vibe with Ne-Ti in any order (well to put it more fairly, less absolutes).
If anything sounds typist, I must clarify that most of my complaints are generally in my _conflicts_ with said types, not whole people/types themselves.
I talk about ENFP like, but I think lots of Ne-doms are likely to find where my Ne is going and tend to speak with me naturally due to the fact.
She does seem pretty balanced. 
I see the 2 vid is still editing. That is when the camera went whack.


----------



## parazep

This sounds cool! And I would be interested maybe, but I'm not a great talker :/ So that probably rules me out.. But I love watching the interaction videos anyways!

-Pete


----------



## caraez

Oh my gosh, why did my video look like that? It certainly didn't from my side! When you told me the video looked weird, I didn't realize it was that bad. Sorry about the technical errors everyone! I don't know where the echo came from either, I used the headphones. 

But anyways, thanks for recording it and putting it together!


----------



## Fridays

Very interesting!! WOW!! I really like this thread.:happy:


----------



## esoterictimes

pneumoceptor said:


> Oh, you're right about them being two different questions. Thanks for the clarification here. Can you explain a bit more about feeling like you don't completely understand yourself? What does that mean, and how does it tie in with being Fi-dom?


I think caraez did a pretty good job of answering the questions. I'd just add that for me personally, it's digging so deep that I can see different reflections of myself. Different versions of me, ideas of myself, etc. that can all hold some validity. It's hard to describe, but I really don't think I have a concretized idea of who I am. Not as concrete as most people anyways. It can help in many areas of life, but causes some angst as well. One thing it definitely has helped me in is that given new information I can change my ideas (even deeply held ones) on their head and end up believing/thinking something almost the opposite. In other words, less rigidity. I've also been able to be like a chameleon and fit in with different crowds, but I think that might have more to do with Ne.

To add to this, if you look at these things I think it becomes obvious that it would be easy to feel like your just some ethereal, nebulous construct that even you don't know yourself. It's kind of like stranger in a strange land syndrome in a way. Maybe that's even actually more to the truth. Maybe those who feel like that see most people acting as if everything is fine, so they dig deep inside of themselves to find out what it is about them that doesn't fit?


----------



## Celebok

Ah, so THIS is where all you type-interaction video chatters are hanging out! 



pneumoceptor said:


> I have to say, one of my hopes for this series is to get more Js vs Ps of otherwise the "same type" talking to each other. I would love to see an INTJ/INTP video, for example. I'd also really like to see ISTJ/ISTP, ESTJ/ESTP, and ENFJ/ENFP (although the latter might make my mind explode).


I would LOVE to see an ISTJ/ISTP video... as long as the ISTP isn't me!  I already feel like I'm constantly being judged by my own SJ upbringing, especially after being mistyped as an ISTJ for most of my adult life, all the way up until last week!



pneumoceptor said:


> I just scanned through this entire thread, and there was not one ISTJ reponse. This is interesting in and of itself... especially because the total number of threads for ISTPs and ISTJs in their subforums are the same. A very broad generalization (which could be flawed for a number of reasons) would say that there are the same "chat levels" for ISTPs and ISTJs, so it's interesting that so many ISTPs have wanted to do these video chats, whereas no ISTJs have mentioned a desire at least publicly. @_caraez_, have you had any ISTJ bites?


Perhaps the ISTJs don't feel that there would be enough benefit of a video chat session that would justify the pressure of being "talkative"? Also, since introverts tend to communicate much better in writing than through talking, a video chat would not seem to be a very useful means of communication. For the SP side of me, though, I think it would be a fun experience, despite the awkwardness. Too bad I don't have a webcam.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

dejavu said:


> Part 2 of the interaction video with Marlowe! To be honest, I'm not sure if I can get a part 3 out there. The footage started getting really choppy at the end and there wasn't much more...we'll see.


My ENTP sis has been my best bud since childhood and we are still close. She had like 1 best friend who was a female, and the rest of her friends growing up were guys. It was interesting hearing you both talk about feeling-females because I've seen it in action with my own friends. But hopefully you guys know that we-feeler-girls really enjoy you thinker girls (maybe it is easier if Fe or Fi is auxiliary or lower....) but I really like hanging out with all thinkers!

YES! Sci-Fi Rocks!  OMG(osh)! All the good series Doo die first! UGH! 

So @_Marlowe_, I'm thinking the video I watched with CaptainMauzer and you and this one has really shaken my 'ESTJ' decision about you and I can tell why you say EXTJ. You've definitely got a lot of N in there too!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Celebok said:


> Ah, so THIS is where all you type-interaction video chatters are hanging out!
> 
> I would LOVE to see an ISTJ/ISTP video... as long as the ISTP isn't me! I already feel like I'm constantly being judged by my own SJ upbringing, especially after being mistyped as an ISTJ for most of my adult life, all the way up until last week!
> 
> 
> Perhaps the ISTJs don't feel that there would be enough benefit of a video chat session that would justify the pressure of being "talkative"? Also, since introverts tend to communicate much better in writing than through talking, a video chat would not seem to be a very useful means of communication. For the SP side of me, though, I think it would be a fun experience, despite the awkwardness. Too bad I don't have a webcam.



I went to insert the nfgeeks vids of ENFP Mike with his ISTJ son Noah...but he's doing a funny 'SJ Enforcer' thing right now where the 'SJ's' have taken over his channel and he made all his NF videos private! Awww! I'm sure they'll come back when he's done with this SJ tribute. But you'll have to watch for it - Noah/ISTJ actually talked in 3 videos with his dad. I haven't laughed so hard in ages! He reminded me soooo much of my ISTJ brother-in-law. He was such a good sport, really funny and the interaction with him and his ENFP dad was priceless!


----------



## trvlgrl1981

atypeofuser said:


> I am underwhelmed at all my "I guess, uhh"-s, which are like 1/3 of my spoken part. :-/
> .


...wait till you hear mine, that I did with pneumceptor yesterday. must be an ENTP thing


----------



## esoterictimes

pneumoceptor said:


> This is fascinating. I draw strong parallels with Ni... but the different reflections I see are focused on ideas or others rather than myself.


Can you elaborate what you mean by being focused on others?


pneumoceptor said:


> Is feeling ethereal/nebulous uncomfortable to you, or is it comfortable? I'm ok with my internal Ni model being nebulous. Are you ok with your self evaluations being nebulous?


It's fairly comfortable, and not a constant thing. As I've gotten older I've tried to analyze myself and the world around me more, so I'm not sure if it's completely related to Fi. If anything, it feels like Te and even Ti colored by Fi, which makes it difficult sometimes. Regarding my self evaluation being nebulous.....it's not as though I don't have certain ideas of myself that I accept as reality. I know there is an objective reality and truth even about myself. I just don't assume I know what that is in all cases (intentionally stay nebulous), yet Fi can seem to short circuit logic sometimes. Maybe that makes sense, probably not lol. I feel like I'm rambling.


----------



## pneumoceptor

^^Thanks for the more detailed explanation.

As far as being focused on others, I mean that my Ni has a people bent... and it's not so much about knowing myself (or wasn't until fairly recently), but is/was more about understanding others, their roles in my life, and my roles in theirs.


----------



## pneumoceptor

viva said:


> Okay, me and @_innovati_ are going to do this :kitteh:
> 
> Any requests/ideas about what an ENFP & INFJ should discuss?


Life, love, others' insides, and your insides .


----------



## pneumoceptor

atypeofuser said:


> After looking @ my video again: I thought I got the beginning of first video trimmed. :dry:
> That zoom-in on the second part was utter technical fail.
> I hope this video did not ruin future talks from those who viewed it. I am underwhelmed at all my "I guess, uhh"-s, which are like 1/3 of my spoken part. :-/
> I thought part 3 would be least painful; unfortunately, there's kind of a duplicate. :blushed: :angry:*trims*
> 
> Did SuperTinTin not like Mac or something? I know that caraez told me she was on a Mac.


Sorry you had such a hard time with the video. I didn't have a hard time with the video with caraez, so I don't think it's that she's on a Mac. I did have a hard time with an ENFP that I just chatted with... had the same problem you did, and he didn't look weird on the screen during Skype, but rather only in the recording. I don't know what was wrong, but I think it may have had to do with resolutions settings being wacky. I uninstalled and reinstalled the latest versions of Skype and Supertintin. I did another chat, and there was no problem. So don't give up!


----------



## pneumoceptor

Geoffrey said:


> @_pneumoceptor_:
> -----Hello! I have a video request. You've mentioned at least a couple of things that got me thinking, and I'd like to hear more about what you have to say on the subjects. First, you mentioned that one of the reasons you got into MBTI is because of some communication issues between you and your best friend (INFP). If you are comfortable doing so, can you speak to 1. what some of those problems were, 2. solutions, and 3. their resolutions, if any. Also, you mentioned being more "touchy-feely" around INFPs--and possibly changing your communication style accordingly. Is that the "right" way to communicate to INFPs--or should I say, the way in which to minimize miscommunications and misunderstandings?
> -----My NF/NT Meetup has been growing over the last few months, and I've noticed that the population of INFJ regulars has increased (which I of course love), but the population of regular INFPs (great people) has decreased (which I am trying to understand). I've always had trouble getting NTs interested, though a few INTJs and INTPs (also great people) will participate. We just had out first ENFJ (great guy) stop by. I keep the door open for ENFPs (always great!), and they do stop by here and there (more than a one time thing). But the core of the group has always been INFJs and INFPs. I would like to know why my population of INFPs is decreasing. Of course,I know you can't answer that question, but I thought your experience with your friend might shed some light on what is happening.
> -----Should you decide to address this request, thank you! Thank you, anyway, for making these great videos!


Whew, this is a tough request... for the reasons (a) that it's still pretty raw (and unresolved, and I fear I've lost the friendship), and (b) that i had a video up before talking about it, and my friend randomly found it (by searching my obscure username) and got very upset that I'd talked about her in a video. I don't think I have it in me to tackle that video request right now. Maybe in a few months/years... But to concisely summarize it, I think our problems boiled down to codependency (from both of us), idealization of our relationship (from both of us), and inability to surmount the Fe/Fi differences in communication when things went south.

That said, for three years, we were super tight. And my friend appreciated my touchy-feely way of communicating with her. She felt safe and loved and often told me that I was the first person who made her feel special and interesting. She also often told me that I was very "symbolic" to her. I never really knew what that meant...

As far as your meetup is concerned, it might be good to ask some INFPs on the forum, along with describing what the format etc. is like.

Keep at it with the meetups... those sound great and like they would be very connecting/meaningful for many people!


----------



## Geoffrey

pneumoceptor said:


> Whew, this is a tough request [. . . .]



-----I'm very sorry to hear that things have gone downhill with your friend. That friendship obviously means so much to you, so I know you are going through a tough time.
-----For some reason, I thought you had been speaking in retrospect when talking about your friend--that you two had managed to work it out. Since that is incorrect, of course, forget about the request.


pneumoceptor said:


> As far as your meetup is concerned, it might be good to ask some INFPs on the forum, along with describing what the format etc. is like.



-----That's a good idea. Thank you. I guess I was aiming for someone who had "been there." I like and respond to feedback, but being shown the back of someone on their way out--that's not feedback--that's a final judgment.
: (


pneumoceptor said:


> Keep at it with the meetups... those sound great and like they would be very connecting/meaningful for many people!



-----Thanks! I envisioned these Meetups being a unifying thing, so I don't want to unwittingly drive people off. My fellow INFJs (as well as ENFPs and most INFPs) have been very encouraging in this regard--reminding me to just be myself, and those who are understanding--those who matter--will always remain. : )


----------



## innovati

Okay okay, I'm down for this video @_viva_, but I think we might need a list of questions—INFJ's love our lists after all


----------



## pneumoceptor

Come take a trip with me and @_trvlgrl1981_:


----------



## trvlgrl1981

ahh... my Fe is all over the place, with my facial expressions and hand gesture.. and I haven't even watched the videos yet.


----------



## innovati

Ooh good point with the hand gestures @trvlgrl1981, I think @viva and I need to capture body language with this; waist-up seated (with nothing for me to hide behind) will make _this_ INFJ squirm :O We've never video chatted before!

Thanks for the great video(s) @pneumoceptor, I'm watching them now


----------



## trvlgrl1981

note to self: next time laptop goes on a table. that angle has me looking quite horrible lol


----------



## pneumoceptor

trvlgrl1981 said:


> note to self: next time laptop goes on a table. that angle has me looking quite horrible lol


You look fine, and I enjoyed what you had to say. (And I'm the one who asked you to find better light, which is why you moved in the first place.) It's a great series of vids... and I have another ENTP lined up for tomorrow night, so it'll be fun to compare and contrast those two sets of chats. Thanks again for doing it!


----------



## Chela

DUDE!! Good for you I glanced at the page and saw you had like 58 videos! I have only watched your intro one so far, but I'll check out more after my physics midterm on wednesday hahaha (summer classes ftw....not T-T XD!). I'm happy this took off!


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

viva said:


> Okay, me and @innovati are going to do this :kitteh:
> 
> Any requests/ideas about what an ENFP & INFJ should discuss?


I would be interested in hearing about how the opposite attitudes of each function in the same order affects the way you both think. Include the thinking and sensing functions too because I feel that talk about the lower functions in types gets neglected.


----------



## innovati

"*Join Date: Jun 2012*" -> I'm a little new here, and I came on here to learn about how to deconstruct the operation the personalities function by function… but I haven't figured that it out _yet_. I'm not sure how insightful my attempt would be, but I _can_ easily and honestly answer any questions written by somebody who _does_ understand the differences between them. You guys might have to feed me some leading questions hope my intuition answers them the right way?

I'm getting a little nervous about this  It'll be fun though, my roommate (of four years) and my ex were both ENFPs so I know we should get along just fine, I just worry @viva's going to be a lot prettier/distracting than my (male) roommate to talk to haha :tongue:

/me hides


----------



## Kabosu

pneumoceptor said:


> Sorry you had such a hard time with the video. I didn't have a hard time with the video with caraez, so I don't think it's that she's on a Mac. I did have a hard time with an ENFP that I just chatted with... had the same problem you did, and he didn't look weird on the screen during Skype, but rather only in the recording. I don't know what was wrong, but I think it may have had to do with resolutions settings being wacky. I uninstalled and reinstalled the latest versions of Skype and Supertintin. I did another chat, and there was no problem. So don't give up!


I wonder if my audio settings had to do with the sound (set it as "both" on SuperTintin). I did uninstall & reinstall both programs.

Also, shortly after I got the prevous post down, I successfully trimmed down the "duplicate" part of part 3 - so now it's as it should be. 
...

For anyone: As for the future, about the next 4-5 weeks would be fine for pairings, etc., but if you don't mind weekends, it can be any time.


----------



## thunder

Marlowe said:


> You have to remember with Fi-- just because we can talk about something calmly and offhandedly (even dismissively) doesn't mean there isn't an emotion behind our words.
> 
> Unfortunately, this can create a cyclical problem-- I express how I feel about something (by talking about it, even in a casual manner), the person I'm talking to thinks "well, they seem pretty calm, so it's probably not that big a deal," leading them to treat it in the same dismissive manner, which in turn makes me think "oh, they don't get it. okay, then. I won't bother bringing it up again." And thus the emotional closed-ness becomes even stronger.
> 
> I'm not sure how to reverse this cycle, so I've simply grown to accept it as an expected communication problem with others. This is one of the reasons I so appreciate my father-- he doesn't let the way I say something throw him off. He just inherently understands the underlying emotion.


My ENTJ friend has/had this cyclical problem. What she's done is to tell her circle of close friends about it -- that when she says she's "fine" she may not really be and is trying to see if we care enough to dig deeper. On her part she works harder at being more open about her emotional state with us, and on our part we try to be more probing. So if she says calmly she's "not OK" but "doesn't want to talk about it", I follow with "OK, but let me know about it later" and then ask again later on. I've learned to be more observant of her habits and reading between the lines so I can better read when she's annoyed or upset (though it's still hard to read and I don't always catch it...).


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

atypeofuser said:


> I wonder if my audio settings had to do with the sound (set it as "both" on SuperTintin). I did uninstall & reinstall both programs.
> 
> Also, shortly after I got the prevous post down, I successfully trimmed down the "duplicate" part of part 3 - so now it's as it should be.
> ...
> 
> For anyone: As for the future, about the next 4-5 weeks would be fine for pairings, etc., but if you don't mind weekends, it can be any time.


You might need to boost your microphone volume in your Skype settings.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

trvlgrl1981 said:


> ahh... my Fe is all over the place, with my facial expressions and hand gesture.. and I haven't even watched the videos yet.



You think so? I didn't feel that way at all! I could definitely see the NT in you! (I thought my Fe was too much in my vid - - so that's interesting that we both aren't used to watching out own Fe in action LOL).


----------



## Celebok

Dang, @pneumoceptor, you've been busy! If I wasn't unemployed right now, there's no way I could keep up with all these videos!  But I'm really enjoying them so far!

One moment that I found interesting was that @dejavu seemed a bit reluctant to reveal what her typical ideas were about, and when pneumoceptor probed a bit, seemed rather ashamed that her ideas weren't worthwhile, were impractical, wouldn't earn her any money, etc. I'm wondering if that's coming from some external values telling her that an idea has to somehow be constructive in order to be worth thinking about (Ti) or talking about (Fe). It's a bit different for me as an ISTP, because my only reluctance to share details with people is just because I don't like to talk about something if I don't think the person I'm talking to is going to appreciate it the same way I do. I wouldn't care whether they thought my ideas were impractical or a waste of money (and it doesn't usually cross my mind that people may judge me about that), but I just wouldn't enjoy talking about it.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Celebok said:


> One moment that I found interesting was that @dejavu seemed a bit reluctant to reveal what her typical ideas were about, and when pneumoceptor probed a bit, seemed rather ashamed that her ideas weren't worthwhile, were impractical, wouldn't earn her any money, etc. I'm wondering if that's coming from some external values telling her that an idea has to somehow be constructive in order to be worth thinking about (Ti) or talking about (Fe). It's a bit different for me as an ISTP, because my only reluctance to share details with people is just because I don't like to talk about something if I don't think the person I'm talking to is going to appreciate it the same way I do. I wouldn't care whether they thought my ideas were impractical or a waste of money (and it doesn't usually cross my mind that people may judge me about that), but I just wouldn't enjoy talking about it.


It really depends on the ENTP. Myself I am acutely aware of the possible backlash I can receive from people for sharing some of my more outlandish ideas. I don't have many people with such a breadth of interest as I do, so I generally don't receive very good feedback from others. People have gotten really angry at me about me sharing my ideas and some of my ideas themselves.


----------



## iscem42

MegaTuxRacer said:


> It really depends on the ENTP. Myself I am acutely aware of the possible backlash I can receive from people for sharing some of my more outlandish ideas. I don't have many people with such a breadth of interest as I do, so I generally don't receive very good feedback from others. People have gotten really angry at me about me sharing my ideas and some of my ideas themselves.


I relate to this a lot, as well. A lot of us (NP or otherwise, I'd suspect) are just used to most people not really caring to step outside their intellectual comfort zones, for whatever reason, and may just be more guarded with new acquaintances as a result. I agree that it'd vary a lot based on the individual and their environment, though.


----------



## Celebok

MegaTuxRacer said:


> It really depends on the ENTP. Myself I am acutely aware of the possible backlash I can receive from people for sharing some of my more outlandish ideas. I don't have many people with such a breadth of interest as I do, so I generally don't receive very good feedback from others. People have gotten really angry at me about me sharing my ideas and some of my ideas themselves.


Angry? In what way? Do they feel that your ideas are somehow immoral or something? Or just so ridiculous that they feel like you're wasting their time talking about it? Or are you talking about ideas that directly involve those people, and they just don't want to participate? Usually when I tell people my crazy ideas, they just laugh. Dejavu said her ideas were mostly about travelling and doing fun stuff, though she didn't go into any detail beyond that, so who knows how crazy her ideas tend to be.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

iscem42 said:


> I relate to this a lot, as well. A lot of us (NP or otherwise, I'd suspect) are just used to most people not really caring to step outside their intellectual comfort zones, for whatever reason, and may just be more guarded with new acquaintances as a result. I agree that it'd vary a lot based on the individual and their environment, though.


I can relate to people being unwilling to step out of their intellectual comfort zones, but I even have well-established friendships where they just don't care from the start. If I persist, they get annoyed and lash out. This seems to be more of the rule than the exception. They generally just don't want to think about it.



Celebok said:


> Angry? In what way? Do they feel that your ideas are somehow immoral or something? Or just so ridiculous that they feel like you're wasting their time talking about it? Or are you talking about ideas that directly involve those people, and they just don't want to participate? Usually when I tell people my crazy ideas, they just laugh. Dejavu said her ideas were mostly about travelling and doing fun stuff, though she didn't go into any detail beyond that, so who knows how crazy her ideas tend to be.


Like I said, it depends on the ENTP. @dejavu's answer may be entirely different than mine. Or she may not have been hesitant. Many ENTPs, and I am one of them, simply do not care to recall information that is now boring to them. It's kind of an out-with-the-old-in-with-the-new thing. Though, if I may begin to theorize, @dejavu mentioned earlier in the thread that she mistyped INFJ because of a long period of depression that she went through. I think she mistyped INFJ specifically because I believe she was going through an Si grip period. I went through one of those too. My Si grip was caused basically because people would lash out at my ideas. If she was hesitant to go into more specifics because of or in part because of a similar experience, it is because she has learned not to do so with people whom she does not trust. At least that's the way I am. Her mannerisms are very similar to mine, and her thought processes are similar as well. Maybe these connections I am making are folly.

As to why others lash out, basically all of the above at one point or another. Another is a simple lack of interest or frustrated that I am detached from them and absorbed in my idea.


----------



## Celebok

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Many ENTPs, and I am one of them, simply do not care to recall information that is now boring to them. It's kind of an out-with-the-old-in-with-the-new thing.


Oh, so basically the Ne bouncing-around-from-one-idea-to-the-next thing, and then afterwards it becomes, "Oh, that thing back then, who cares?"



> As to why others lash out, basically all of the above at one point or another. Another is a simple lack of interest or frustrated that I am detached from them and absorbed in my idea.


Ah, I see, interesting. I can kind of see that happening, if the ENTP tends to ramble on and on about their ideas in front of people who aren't interested and feel like they've heard enough. Kind of reminds me of a guy I knew in college (I don't know his personality type, but he very well could've been an ENTP now that I think about it), whom I often regarded as "the loud version of me". I sometimes consciously chose to stay quiet, after seeing how people reacted negatively to that guy.


----------



## Pier 56

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> First and foremost, I'm really looking forward to some videos without my face . I'd love to see other combos interact, so please consider making some vids! (I can try to help out with technical issues if you have questions, and please persevere through all the inherent frustration in getting these things going.)
> 
> @_Lady Lullaby_ (Lady Lullaby - YouTube) and I chatted it up yesterday for ALMOST FOUR HOURS. She's a kindred spirit, and I knew it would be that way. So if you're interested in another INFJ-fest, here are some videos. I recorded over three hours of conversation, and I will maybe put some more segments up if there's interest. This weird thing happened this time where her sound wasn't recorded when any sound was coming from my end, so sorry for that... technical issues abound. Anyway, enjoy!


Wow, great vids! Thank you for sharing!


----------



## hasenj

Lady Lullaby said:


> You think so? I didn't feel that way at all! I could definitely see the NT in you! (I thought my Fe was too much in my vid - - so that's interesting that we both aren't used to watching out own Fe in action LOL).


Yea me neither. I got ENTJ vibes from her. I didn't see any Ne or Fe.

@trvlgrl1981 are you sure you're an ENTP and not an ENTJ? Your mannerisms remind me a lot of an ENTJ coworker/boss I had.


----------



## Kabosu

lol she came off more ENTP-ish to me, but maybe that was just me.


----------



## dejavu

Celebok said:


> One moment that I found interesting was that dejavu seemed a bit reluctant to reveal what her typical ideas were about, and when pneumoceptor probed a bit, seemed rather ashamed that her ideas weren't worthwhile, were impractical, wouldn't earn her any money, etc. I'm wondering if that's coming from some external values telling her that an idea has to somehow be constructive in order to be worth thinking about (Ti) or talking about (Fe). It's a bit different for me as an ISTP, because my only reluctance to share details with people is just because I don't like to talk about something if I don't think the person I'm talking to is going to appreciate it the same way I do. I wouldn't care whether they thought my ideas were impractical or a waste of money (and it doesn't usually cross my mind that people may judge me about that), but I just wouldn't enjoy talking about it.





MegaTuxRacer said:


> Like I said, it depends on the ENTP. dejavu's answer may be entirely different than mine. Or she may not have been hesitant. Many ENTPs, and I am one of them, simply do not care to recall information that is now boring to them. It's kind of an out-with-the-old-in-with-the-new thing. Though, if I may begin to theorize, dejavu mentioned earlier in the thread that she mistyped INFJ because of a long period of depression that she went through. I think she mistyped INFJ specifically because I believe she was going through an Si grip period. I went through one of those too. My Si grip was caused basically because people would lash out at my ideas. If she was hesitant to go into more specifics because of or in part because of a similar experience, it is because she has learned not to do so with people whom she does not trust. At least that's the way I am. Her mannerisms are very similar to mine, and her thought processes are similar as well. Maybe these connections I am making are folly.
> 
> As to why others lash out, basically all of the above at one point or another. Another is a simple lack of interest or frustrated that I am detached from them and absorbed in my idea.


^ Basically what MegaTuxRacer said up there. When it comes to deterrents to sharing my ideas, there's a whole mix of factors that come into play. Celebok was right when he suggested that there seemed to be some shame involved. I have always been surrounded by people who do not appreciate my ideas. At best, I've been humored and politely listened to when I've spouted off about whatever random thing is going through my head.

To give an actual example...when I first got into the lucid dreaming kick, this was the response I got when sharing it with people around me.

Friend 1, knowing I would be on to some new thing in a month, nodded politely and basically gave me a, "That's nice, dejavu."
Friend 2: "That's a waste of time. Why not take up kayaking or something real like that?"
Friend 3: "You know I don't believe in that supernatural stuff..." which devolved into an argument over whether or not it was supernatural.

My ideas also tend to center around things that the majority of people around me just don't get. Like the time I started coming up with an idea for a comic book. Explaining it to people was very difficult, because they had no idea what I was talking about. I'd start out with, "You know the Doctor Who universe?" or "You know the character Deadpool?" and they wouldn't. So I'd take the time to explain, and by the end I learn they weren't actually interested. I'd wasted their time, and my own. I get tired of that same thing happening time and time again.

So yeah, my ideas are rarely well received. There's probably a bit of low self esteem involved in there too. And as MegaTuxRacer mentioned, there is this thing where I do get bored with relaying old information. Old ideas are not so interesting to me anymore, especially when I'm into something new.


----------



## iscem42

MegaTuxRacer said:


> I can relate to people being unwilling to step out of their intellectual comfort zones, but I even have well-established friendships where they just don't care from the start. If I persist, they get annoyed and lash out. This seems to be more of the rule than the exception. They generally just don't want to think about it.





Celebok said:


> Ah, I see, interesting. I can kind of see that happening, if the ENTP tends to ramble on and on about their ideas in front of people who aren't interested and feel like they've heard enough. Kind of reminds me of a guy I knew in college (I don't know his personality type, but he very well could've been an ENTP now that I think about it), whom I often regarded as "the loud version of me". I sometimes consciously chose to stay quiet, after seeing how people reacted negatively to that guy.





dejavu said:


> ^ Basically what MegaTuxRacer said up there. When it comes to deterrents to sharing my ideas, there's a whole mix of factors that come into play. Celebok was right when he suggested that there seemed to be some shame involved. I have always been surrounded by people who do not appreciate my ideas. At best, I've been humored and politely listened to when I've spouted off about whatever random thing is going through my head.
> 
> To give an actual example...when I first got into the lucid dreaming kick, this was the response I got when sharing it with people around me.
> 
> Friend 1, knowing I would be on to some new thing in a month, nodded politely and basically gave me a, "That's nice, dejavu."
> Friend 2: "That's a waste of time. Why not take up kayaking or something real like that?"
> Friend 3: "You know I don't believe in that supernatural stuff..." which devolved into an argument over whether or not it was supernatural.


Yeah, I relate pretty strongly to everything in here. Celebok 's example was actually a bit like how people in my main social circle in college reacted to me. Like Megatuxracer said, I've had a good number of established friendships where there's a boundary to what people want to listen to — even cases where people will politely go "that's such a cool / unexpected / intellectual way of looking at it" while still obviously wanting to change the topic and then complaining about those types of conversations later on. 

I don't necessarily get bored relaying old information (this may be a difference between Si inferior and Si tert), but I try to keep it interesting for myself by putting a new spin on it so that it can be conceived from a different angle, hopefully helping my "audience" to absorb it in the process. 



MegaTuxRacer said:


> As to why others lash out, basically all of the above at one point or another. Another is a simple lack of interest or frustrated that I am detached from them and absorbed in my idea.


And something that I've experienced is that people can read some very impersonal theory or justification that I come up with and then assume that it's a passive-aggressive attack against them in particular, when in reality they simply weren't on my mind to begin with, at least not in that way. The disconnect here is that they think I'm directly criticizing some specific action or principle of theirs, while I'm just talking about something more fluid and not even attaching strong value-judgments.

Despite all this, I'm pretty sure I'm Ti-dominant and mostly use Ne to feed information to Ti. Still, it's funny how I can see some Si grip triggers in myself, because whenever these types of situations happened for an extended period of time, I became withdrawn and apathetic. It almost makes me think that our tertiary functions can be inferior-like, at least when we're younger and experience enough protracted conflict with them.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

dejavu said:


> ^ Basically what MegaTuxRacer said up there. When it comes to deterrents to sharing my ideas, there's a whole mix of factors that come into play. Celebok was right when he suggested that there seemed to be some shame involved. I have always been surrounded by people who do not appreciate my ideas. At best, I've been humored and politely listened to when I've spouted off about whatever random thing is going through my head.
> 
> To give an actual example...when I first got into the lucid dreaming kick, this was the response I got when sharing it with people around me.
> 
> Friend 1, knowing I would be on to some new thing in a month, nodded politely and basically gave me a, "That's nice, dejavu."
> Friend 2: "That's a waste of time. Why not take up kayaking or something real like that?"
> Friend 3: "You know I don't believe in that supernatural stuff..." which devolved into an argument over whether or not it was supernatural.
> 
> My ideas also tend to center around things that the majority of people around me just don't get. Like the time I started coming up with an idea for a comic book. Explaining it to people was very difficult, because they had no idea what I was talking about. I'd start out with, "You know the Doctor Who universe?" or "You know the character Deadpool?" and they wouldn't. So I'd take the time to explain, and by the end I learn they weren't actually interested. I'd wasted their time, and my own. I get tired of that same thing happening time and time again.
> 
> So yeah, my ideas are rarely well received. There's probably a bit of low self esteem involved in there too. And as MegaTuxRacer mentioned, there is this thing where I do get bored with relaying old information. Old ideas are not so interesting to me anymore, especially when I'm into something new.


My friends will do that and say things like "You're weird", "...okay?", and "You think too much" among others.



iscem42 said:


> Despite all this, I'm pretty sure I'm Ti-dominant and mostly use Ne to feed information to Ti. Still, it's funny how I can see some Si grip triggers in myself, because whenever these types of situations happened for an extended period of time, I became withdrawn and apathetic. It almost makes me think that our tertiary functions can be inferior-like, at least when we're younger and experience enough protracted conflict with them.


Yours would be an Fe grip since it is the inferior function that grabs hold of you backed up with the tertiary function.


----------



## Figure

Okay, so here is the lovely 90 minute conversation @Doctorjuice and I shared. Some interesting contrasts in thinking style, I think!


----------



## Figure

Woops, double post!

Series with @_MegaTuxRacer_ - so INTJ/ENTP - coming next!


----------



## pneumoceptor

@_Geoffrey_:

Glad you enjoyed the chat!

Yeah, I always wonder how it is for NF guys in terms of friendships. That seems hard, because I have observed that fewer men want to connect on that feeling level with anyone other than their spouse. This mindset has always puzzled me.

I would agree that higher tier universities are interested in research rather than teaching abilities for their professors. It makes sense. The university brings in money based on grants funding research (about half of which goes to overhead)... I don't know how this compares to the money brought in by students, but as an undergrad, for quite a while I had no idea how to evaluate my profs. If I didn't get something or found it poorly presented, I thought it was my issue.

@_Lady Lullaby_:

I like my laugh too . And as far as an NF-Scientist-Ambassador... well, that's actually kind of what I want to do, although I'm a bit more invested in matters of faith than I am in MBTI (gasp). Nevertheless, I'll see what I can do ...


----------



## Celebok

dejavu said:


> ^ Basically what MegaTuxRacer said up there. When it comes to deterrents to sharing my ideas, there's a whole mix of factors that come into play. Celebok was right when he suggested that there seemed to be some shame involved. I have always been surrounded by people who do not appreciate my ideas. At best, I've been humored and politely listened to when I've spouted off about whatever random thing is going through my head.


Hey, thanks for responding. I know the question I brought up wasn't really the point you were discussing, but it just sort of struck me as I was watching, and I find it really interesting to find out why various people are reluctant to share certain things. I can actually relate a lot to what you've experienced, even though it's manifested in slightly different ways for me.



> My ideas also tend to center around things that the majority of people around me just don't get. Like the time I started coming up with an idea for a comic book. Explaining it to people was very difficult, because they had no idea what I was talking about. I'd start out with, "You know the Doctor Who universe?" or "You know the character Deadpool?" and they wouldn't. So I'd take the time to explain, and by the end I learn they weren't actually interested. I'd wasted their time, and my own. I get tired of that same thing happening time and time again.


Yes, I find myself in that situation a lot, moreso with just topics or hobbies I'm obsessed with at the time, so I can totally understand your frustration. That really bugs me when people pretend to be interested in something I'm talking about just to try to make conversation. Neither one of us will be better off after I've explained it to them, so it's a waste of time, just like you said. I guess that's the whole reason I picked up on it while watching the video, because I relate to that reluctance to talk about my interests, but I very rarely notice that same type of reluctance in other people.

By the way, just as a side note, I'm just curious, since you mentioned the negative reactions you've gotten to your lucid dreaming, were you surprised that @pneumoceptor was actually interested in learning more about your lucid dreaming techniques?


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Well @LXPilot and I just finished recording our series of videos. There's some really interesting stuff that is in there and I think that it was a very stimulating experience for the both of us. I can't wait for him to get all of this edited together! It was that good.


----------



## dejavu

Celebok said:


> By the way, just as a side note, I'm just curious, since you mentioned the negative reactions you've gotten to your lucid dreaming, were you surprised that pneumoceptor was actually interested in learning more about your lucid dreaming techniques?


A little, but the lucid dreaming thing has generally been a little better received on the internet than it has in real life. Since she asked, I was going to explain whether or not she was very into it. :tongue: But I think I'm pretty good at reading people and I got the feeling it would go over okay. So yeah.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

LXPilot said:


> Okay, so here is the lovely 90 minute conversation @_Doctorjuice_ and I shared. Some interesting contrasts in thinking style, I think!


I would be interested to read more about inferior functions being core to our personalities. I started to get a handle on the idea from watching you both discuss it, but it is a new idea to me.

These vids were a great demonstration of Ti vs. Ni in action. I found myself really relating to what LXPilot said - my thoughts followed his course very naturally, but then I found myself appreciating the insight of Doctorjuice as well and realizing I was definitely not on that path and thank goodness for the perspectives of others. I think the interest you have, LXPilot, in Socionics is because of the drive to go deeper - just the theory of interactions between functions is fascinating to me as well. But when Doctorjuice questioned their premise I laughed because it is an example of what the blog he mentioned (The Clarity of Night) has said:


> " The now deconstructed masterpiece doesn't feel so magical anymore, does it? Mindfulness can be the magic-killer"​


 I was like - oh...but just the theory and idea was so fun! Now I wonder if it is worth the time anymore...hmmm.... :tongue:

I think the videos were a very accurate depiction of the interaction style between INTPs and INTJs here on the forum actually. So it was not only enlightening and educational, but entertaining as well. I'm watching for the links you guys mentioned you plan on sharing with each other. 

Thanks for posting!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Fridays said:


> Ok, this is my videos! :tongue:
> *PS. Activate English subtitles by pressing the 'CC' button on the bottom of the video. DS.*




I've commented on your youtube channel, but had to stop by here and say again how interesting it is to see people that appear so different in temperament etc. relate and understand each other on a deeper level thanks to as you've said - preferring the same cognitive functions, despite the different stacking. You're also a great example of the reason why we shouldn't make pygmalion projects out of each other because we're attracted to our differences for good reason. I loved seeing that in your interactions. It is fantastic that you can be the ying to each other's yang. Thanks for sharing!


----------



## Kabosu

Looking at this one was fascinating. I haven't delved deep in the Jung definition of Ni but the ISFP I recently talked with seemed like he was kind of able to put Ni into words. I think that sharp-dressed person anecdote was intuition, but it seems like Ni was described in other videos. You strike me as more Ni. (Yeah, in Jung's theory their type name was the dom. function and what's now aux. and tert. were both auxiliaries since they support the dominant function.) The way the theory was questioned due to the uncertainty of knowing it seemed pretty Ti.
I think it's just easier for everybody to use shortened codes these days when describing another person's type.
I think @_hasenj_'s comments in the first part kind of show the inferior function: It's present and in us, but it's the one that is the least conscious.
He's yet another person who heard about MBTI from the family.
This site is so awesome; women who prefer sci-fi to romantic comedies! :happy: (I also remember the discussion of the former genre in the Marlowe/dejavu video).

Add'l note: Skype is _so_ picky!


----------



## vep94

Interested in contributing if help is still needed


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey kids, here's another video chat. I'm shooting the breeze with @_hasenj_, an INTP:


Interesting stuff! 
Still processing it internally, the ending with the beautiful moment was an eyeopener!
Now I understand why INTPs are drawn to anime!


----------



## StellarTwirl

@_pneumoceptor_ Currently watching the first video, and wanted to respond to your query about intuition. I absolutely do not take a perception for how it appears ... it's not in the sense of paranoia/suspicion, because I'm actually a pretty trusting person. It's more that I find it more open-minded to consider various possible interpretations.

A lot of times, when I hear someone just take the most obvious one and run with it, in my mind I'm like: "Hey, wait a second. There are more ways to look at that. What are you doing?" And when I notice myself doing that, I self-correct to look for more possibilities.

Every time I ask people here which functions they see me using (for instance: on the photo-response test), they tell me "NeNeNe", but I often find myself relating to things posted by Ni-doms.

That probably wasn't helpful, but I tried. 


(also: you have an incredibly soothing voice)


----------



## Inveniet

atypeofuser said:


> I haven't delved deep in the Jung definition of Ni but the ISFP I recently talked with seemed like he was kind of able to put Ni into words.


Yeah Ni seems to be within reach for me verbally.
Maybe because I use Fi and it is easier to separate idea from value?!
That should be discussed further in a vid. 

@_vep94_ @_cityofcircuits_
ISFP vs ISFP would be interesting! 
I have lots of time right now! It only rains anyway... 
PM me if you are interested.


----------



## Fridays

I Love the INTP and INFJ video!! Very interesting. :happy: Wow!! :happy:


----------



## vep94

It's funny, just glanced over cityofcircuits profile and we both write music  that would be interesting.


----------



## hasenj

hornet said:


> Interesting stuff!
> Still processing it internally, the ending with the beautiful moment was an eyeopener!
> Now I understand why INTPs are drawn to anime!


My ISFP sister is into more dark and hardcore anime (death note) and even outside anime (game of thrones).

The way I explain it is: I use a *lot* of Ti in my line of work (programming/hacking/"software engineering") and at the end of the day, my Ti is exhausted and my Fe is thirsty, so I look for something that feeds my Fe. 

Where as my ISFP sister (who's a teacher and deals with kids a lot) experiences the exact opposite. At the end of the day, her Fi is exhausted and she needs something to feed her Te.


----------



## pneumoceptor

atypeofuser said:


> Looking at this one was fascinating. I haven't delved deep in the Jung definition of Ni but the ISFP I recently talked with seemed like he was kind of able to put Ni into words. I think that sharp-dressed person anecdote was intuition, but it seems like Ni was described in other videos. You strike me as more Ni. (Yeah, in Jung's theory their type name was the dom. function and what's now aux. and tert. were both auxiliaries since they support the dominant function.) The way the theory was questioned due to the uncertainty of knowing it seemed pretty Ti.
> I think it's just easier for everybody to use shortened codes these days when describing another person's type.
> I think @_hasenj_'s comments in the first part kind of show the inferior function: It's present and in us, but it's the one that is the least conscious.
> He's yet another person who heard about MBTI from the family.
> This site is so awesome; women who prefer sci-fi to romantic comedies! :happy: (I also remember the discussion of the former genre in the Marlowe/dejavu video).
> 
> Add'l note: Skype is _so_ picky!


It's too bad that Skype or Supertintin is being such a jerk lately, because @hasenj and I had a good discussion on Ne vs Ni, and he gave a great metaphor for intuition. Alas, it was lost to no audio recording. I'm thinking of switching to different video chatting software at this point...

Haha, well I think I'm not a normal NF woman, not enjoying rom-coms. But maybe I am, enjoying sci-fi .


----------



## pneumoceptor

Just wanted to reiterate: for people not matched up for chatting partners who would like to be, @caraez has kindly taken up match-making.


----------



## pneumoceptor

StellarTwirl said:


> Currently watching the first video, and wanted to respond to your query about intuition. I absolutely do not take a perception for how it appears ... it's not in the sense of paranoia/suspicion, because I'm actually a pretty trusting person. It's more that I find it more open-minded to consider various possible interpretations.
> 
> A lot of times, when I hear someone just take the most obvious one and run with it, in my mind I'm like: "Hey, wait a second. There are more ways to look at that. What are you doing?" And when I notice myself doing that, I self-correct to look for more possibilities.
> 
> Every time I ask people here which functions they see me using (for instance: on the photo-response test), they tell me "NeNeNe", but I often find myself relating to things posted by Ni-doms.
> 
> That probably wasn't helpful, but I tried.
> 
> (also: you have an incredibly soothing voice)


Thanks for the explanation of how perception/intuition works for you. I don't know that I'd say that I'm suspicious (without prior reason, but then, watch out)... I would agree with how you described it. Although I'm not as interested in being open-minded as I am in getting to the heart of the matter/the truth. 

I love the open-ended "what ifs" of Ne types. It's really fun and often throws me for a loop.

Thanks about my voice... I sound about 14, but I'll take it!


----------



## Celebok

Argh, too many videos to keep up with!! I only just now finished watching the latest INFP-INFJ interaction series. I'll probably watch the first of the INTP-INFJ videos tomorrow. I'm looking forward to it, though.

Oh, and my webcam that I ordered is supposed to arrive tomorrow, so hopefully I can get that and Skype set up soon and join in on one or more of these conversations!


----------



## pneumoceptor

Celebok said:


> Argh, too many videos to keep up with!! I only just now finished watching the latest INFP-INFJ interaction series. I'll probably watch the first of the INTP-INFJ videos tomorrow. I'm looking forward to it, though.
> 
> Oh, and my webcam that I ordered is supposed to arrive tomorrow, so hopefully I can get that and Skype set up soon and join in on one or more of these conversations!


I know, I still haven't watched INTJ/INTP. It's next on the list... what a horrible problem we have, with too many videos.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey kids, here's another video chat. I'm shooting the breeze with @_hasenj_, an INTP:


These were really fun to watch. I could see some personality traits that @_hasenj_ shares with my INTP husband - smiles a lot when he feels uncomfortable, very polite and very non-committal (this was probably the most similar - my INTP says 'I don't know' multiple times a day. :laughing: He probably does know what he thinks, he just isn't sure it is perfectly accurate so he will not commit to it). Other traits in common that may not necessarily be personality related because there is cross-over - my husband is also a 'Software Engineer,' he spends a decent amount of time on technical forums, and he finds beauty in sad but sweet relationship connections (as do I). I will say this, @_hasenj_ does seem much more willing to talk to strangers than mine ever has been, and he shared his personal tastes (i.e. Anime) much more freely. Perhaps anonymity helped there. Bravo for venturing out hasenj!! You did great! 

@_pneumoceptor_ - I am a middle of the road girl - I can enjoy a romantic comedy if it has a bit more build-up than 'met you yesterday let's get married,' I am a Next Generation Star Trek die-hard fan! (sad your INTP friend doesn't join you - dh and I have watched these together for years) I've also enjoyed (along with you know who) SG-1, Stargate Universe, Doctor Who (I haven't seen them all though), and who doesn't love The Twilight Zone (old and new!) ? I think I'll stick to the written descriptions of functions for now (as found on typology websites, wiki, especially those from Socionics sites....) We aren't very 'clear' in our attempts here are we.....LOL

P.S. I think it would be insightful if people were to discuss their inferior function, when it causes them trouble, what they do to get balanced again, etc. Naomi Quenk seems to be the only one (or one of few) who is paying much attention to the impact of our inferior functions. What think ye??


----------



## sodden

@pneumoceptor and @_sleeper_, thanks for that. Something I found particularly interesting was how pneumoceptor seemed to make connections more internally, which I guess is Ni, while sleeper was doing it more externally, I guess Ne, kind of like he was sculpting his ideas, it had so much more of an artistic feel to it, but then he'd pause, kind of like he was hesitating, _does this align with my Fi?_, while for her it really did seem more left-brained, more verbal and then it came out in this very warm, very appropriate way.

As far as enneagram goes, that 5 wing (on the 4 for sleeper; I don't know pneumoceptor's type) really brings a reserve to it, a cautiousness, kind of like a deer poking it's nose out from behind the tree to smell the air in the meadow. I think this confuses people who don't understand what sort of influence the 5 wing can have on the core four, that even a sexual-dom four (especially an INFP) if placed in an uncomfortable or overwhelming position will seem pretty hesitant and a bit closed off. One thing, though, it really seemed like he was earnestly trying to overcome this tendency in himself for the sake of connection. I don't think a sp/sx 4w5 would seem like that so much, they'd probably seem more aloof.

Sorry this is incredibly inarticulate. I'm sick and my brain refuses to work properly. Anyway, thanks again. I feel like I understand how the INFJ brain works a little better now.


----------



## Fridays

Hasenj, I think You are really cool and funny! roud: I think I like INTPs a lot! :happy:


----------



## pneumoceptor

I just finished a chat with ISFP @hornet. We did it using Google+ Hangouts... which was sooooo much easier than Skype! What do you all think of the format? Does not having side-by-side might make it a bit less watchable?


----------



## Inveniet

Wow one vid...
Cool! =D
Will watch it later.


----------



## Kabosu

I don't mind that viewing format at all myself, esp. since there's even the split screen thumbnail toward the bottom of the screen. Honestly, I like the look of this a lot more. Maybe I'm a bit quick to my statement, as I'm only 8+ min. into it. Also, this is coming from a guy who tends to have multitasking periods online while these are going on.


----------



## Subtle Murder

pneumoceptor said:


> I just finished a chat with ISFP @_hornet_. We did it using Google+ Hangouts... which was sooooo much easier than Skype! What do you all think of the format? Does not having side-by-side might make it a bit less watchable?


I definitely like this format.  It's cool coz it's almost as though it's edited, like a back-and-forth tennis match, if that makes sense.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@_MegaTuxRacer_, yes, our chat may not have the cuteness factor of my chat with @_Lady Lullaby_. And yes, anyone who tosses ou the phrase "kidnap a child" is a bit rough-spoken .

@_hornet_, touché. No, I would not be able to answer the wine question at all. Very nice parallel example.

Oh, and @_Fridays_ made some interesting commentary in the youtube comments section for this vid...


----------



## pneumoceptor

Celebok said:


> I just now finally finished watching parts 2 and 3 of the INFJ-INTP interactions ( @_pneumoceptor_ and @_hasenj_ ), and I saw an example of a benefit of the split-screen format. When Hasenj theorizes that INTPs spend time online because "real life sucks so bad", Pneumoceptor asks, "Why does real life suck?" and she has a genuinely concerned look on her face as Hasenj attempts to answer. That concerned look is possibly a good example of the Ni and Fe in action. Even though Hasenj didn't directly state that HIS own life sucks, Pneumoceptor's dominant Ni immediately recognizes that it's a very possible implication from what he did say, and her concern for his well-being is expressed through her Fe. It's a very valuable gift that I've come to appreciate in INFJs (and ENFJs).


You're right... those subtle expressions don't show up at all without the split screen. I'm thinking of trying something like ooVoo... the catch is that it requires a software download. Then again, so does Skype. Hmm... The bottom line is that I really don't want to go back to SuperTinTin and Skype, because it is just so much work to fix all of the audio and video problems that seem to be happening more and more. I'll keep searching for some good alternatives...


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

pneumoceptor said:


> @MegaTuxRacer, yes, our chat may not have the cuteness factor of my chat with @Lady Lullaby. And yes, anyone who tosses ou the phrase "kidnap a child" is a bit rough-spoken .


Hoisted by my own petard. :sad:


----------



## pneumoceptor

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Hoisted by my own petard. :sad:


I've always thought that was an icky sounding word. It's pretty clear what two words it's a combination of .


----------



## pneumoceptor

@_Lady Lullaby_, regarding the vid I did with @_hornet_, did you see similarities between hornet and your little ISFP?

Also, your quote, "I wonder what an INFJ's demonstration of Se looks like to say an ISTP"... I second the wondering. Hornet?

Re: post-apocalyptic/dystopian (I guess those are two categories, but they're very similar in my mind) books that I enjoy, I would mention _Brave New World_, _1984_, _Fahrenheit 451_, _Lord of the Flies_, _Cat's Cradle_, _The Stand_, and _The Road_.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

pneumoceptor said:


> I've always thought that was an icky sounding word. It's pretty clear what two words it's a combination of .


Petard - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

New topic: find a connection between what a petard actually is and the conjugation of "penis" and "retard".


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> Also, your quote, "I wonder what an INFJ's demonstration of Se looks like to say an ISTP"... I second the wondering. Hornet?/QUOTE]
> 
> I would think that the ISTP would go something like. "Hey snap out of it! Pay attention!"
> My ISTP dad has little patience with people who don't pay attention in the moment.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> @_Lady Lullaby_, Re: post-apocalyptic/dystopian (I guess those are two categories, but they're very similar in my mind) books that I enjoy, I would mention _Brave New World_, _1984_, _Fahrenheit 451_, _Lord of the Flies_, _Cat's Cradle_, _The Stand_, and _The Road_.


Niice! I enjoyed many of those too. I haven't read 'The Stand' or 'The Road'.....but....before I venture - what would you say to my bookclub member's Goodreads review of 'The Road' by Cormack McCarthy:


> In an effort to finish this book before leaving on vacation (this is most definately NOT a vacation book)I decided to read last night before bed. I ended up coming to a scene so disturbing (and now unfortunately etched into my brain) that I could not fall asleep for hours. I am done with this book. It is depressing, it is bleak, it is disturbing and I can honestly say I really wish I had not read the 2/3rds of this book that I read. I gave it one star because the author does a good job of conveying the coldness and bleakness of the life of the characters in this book through his writing style and imagery. I however hated the writing style. No names of characters, no real conversation, no real background or information about characters. Ultimately, I would not recommend this book to anyone. DEPRESSING and DISTURBING!!!


LOL - - kind of scares me away lol. Did you read Hunger Games? How about Lois Lowry's 'The Giver' (all 3 - - gotta read all 3 to get the whole picture)....or for me - a GUILTY Pleasure is Scott Westerfeld (shhhh lol)


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> @_Lady Lullaby_, regarding the vid I did with @_hornet_, did you see similarities between hornet and your little ISFP?


I didn't as much as I did while talking to an ISFP here (we're having technical difficulties -- warning - do NOT use Vodburner LOL -- hopefully vids will be posted later this week). As far as what I saw in your video, @_hornet_'s love of nature and complete comfort in the present moment holds true for my ISFP daughter....I think you guys had a 'deeper' analyzing type of conversation which made it a bit hard to 'see' the ISFP in their element. It was interesting to hear his take on Typology theories and contrasts with others in his life. I'll just say that after talking to @_cityofcircuits_ I was pretty confident I've typed my lil one correctly. It was a lot of fun to see the similarities as well as the unique individual differences. (Stay tuned...)


----------



## pneumoceptor

Lady Lullaby said:


> Niice! I enjoyed many of those too. I haven't read 'The Stand' or 'The Road'.....but....before I venture - what would you say to my bookclub member's Goodreads review of 'The Road' by Cormack McCarthy:
> 
> LOL - - kind of scares me away lol. Did you read Hunger Games? How about Lois Lowry's 'The Giver' (all 3 - - gotta read all 3 to get the whole picture)....or for me - a GUILTY Pleasure is Scott Westerfeld (shhhh lol)


Haha. It _was_ depressing and disturbing, as is true for any good post-apocalyptic book. I'm drawn to the sad, like a moth to flame . And as far as overly disturbing... well, I don't remember any scenes in particular from the book, so it didn't affect me the way it affected your bookclub member. 

I did read _The Hunger Games_. I enjoyed the first novel. I started the second and put it down about a third into it, because it was too focused on the romance aspect for my tastes. And no, I've never heard of _The Giver _or Westerfeld. I'll have to check them out!


----------



## Fridays

Lady Lullaby, I think you are a loving mother. Your daughters will be brave girls who will believe in themselves. *<3 <3 *


----------



## Fridays

Lady Lullaby, I think you are a loving mother.
Your daughters will be brave girls who will believe in themselves. *<3 <3 *


----------



## pneumoceptor

Hey all, here's the chat I had with @MegaTuxRacer this weekend. No children were kidnapped in the production of these videos.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Fridays said:


> Lady Lullaby, I think you are a loving mother. Your daughters will be brave girls who will believe in themselves. *<3 <3 *


Awww!


----------



## pneumoceptor

I finally updated the youtube playlist for all of these interaction videos: MBTI interaction videos - YouTube. We're approaching 100 videos!

Moderators, if you come across this, would you please put the playlist link in the first post in this thread?


----------



## Curiously

@pneumoceptor, I enjoy your interaction vids! Just wanted to let you know. Can't wait to check this new one out! Keep 'em coming and thank you so much for creating them.


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey all, here's the chat I had with @_MegaTuxRacer_ this weekend. No children were kidnapped in the production of these videos.


This interaction was just a treasure trove of information and distinctions on all sorts of great stuff.
Well most of the videoes are, but in this one I had so many aha's that it was silly.
The Si explaination vs Ni was just golden.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey all, here's the chat I had with @_MegaTuxRacer_ this weekend. No children were kidnapped in the production of these videos.


 @_MegaTuxRacer_ -- UGH! Insomnia sucks! It has been coming and going in my life since college...But if I can take a unisom and really, really 'catch up' on the sleep, then take a 1/2 the next day and then just switch to a Melatonin the rest of the week (assuming I'm following a pretty regular sleep routine at the same time) I can pull myself out. I have to keep a notebook by the side of my bed and write down whatever keeps 'repeating' and then I can fall asleep. I've also found that it has to do with dragging my butt out of bed in the morning - going to bed 'early' just doesn't work! HA! (But listening to an audiobook or soothing sounds (ditto @_pneumoceptor_ with white noise) helps too....I feel ya!) So MegaTux are you reading something that is leading you in your quest to get in touch with your subconscious? I'm always looking for new reading material.....Wonderful topic about Fe needing a 'dialogue' - - so, so true! I think @pneumoceptor was saying that a Fi user is more comfortable 'sitting in their own emotion' without the dialogue than an Fe user is, but yes - the Fi user benefits from getting it out (but is not as comfortable doing so as an Fe user might be). Having 'safe harbors' helps both Fi/Fe users to to have the dialogue obviously! I would say that 'staying with your heart' and really 'sitting in your emotions privately' does work on an Fi-muscle. At least it is not as natural and comfortable for me to do than say analyzing it through journaling or expressing it to a friend. But do Fi users 'sit' in their emotions when they are expressing them through art? It seems I want the emotion to pass, to return to homebase/peaceful feelings whereas an Fi user might be more prone to acknowledge, look at, and really allow the emotion to stand on it's own. Perhaps that's what they're trying to capture in their art....(total speculation here ). Does this mean an Fe user's art is more about evoking emotion from others? That is more their intent? Whereas an Fi user is simply stating their own emotion and if others connect to it - bonus! Hmmm...sounds like we both have a wrestling match with our Ti - ENTP's Ne tugging and pulling against it or INFJ's Fe doing so too! Sounds like our Ne or Fe are so ill-behaved and Ti is the wise and appropriate parent. :dry: What is an appropriate nickname for Ti @_MegaTuxRacer_? 'Puzzle Master'? (My ENTP sister has the best nicknames for her kids - always so fitting yet goofy LOL!) @_MegaTuxRacer_ - - I'm sure you know this already - but it was just interesting to hear you say that INFPs are harder for you to get along with because in Socionics the MBTI ENTP/Socionics ENTp and the MBTI INFP/Socionics INFj have the 'Supervisory' intertype relationship. (You can put in any 2 to find out the relationship with this nice doo-hickey.) I feel the same things you described in the vid with my ENTJ dad because our intertype relationship is supervision too. You were also very accurate (imho) in describing Si with what I've seen with my ISTJ brother-in-law and my ISFJ mom. It appears to me as them being so very 'cautious' and 'careful' but to them it is just using common sense LOL. But I find that this Si-dom existence is why change and unexpected things are soo hard for them to swallow. When I try to warn my mom about a possible outcome with a family member for example, she'll aruge about how they've never done that and I'll try to explain why it is different now with such and such going on in their lives and she always says - 'we'll see.' She also says that my dad has said similar things and before MBTI I didn't understand how that was the case because I'm so different from him right? But obviously it is because as an ENTJ he also uses Ni....So anyway - long way of saying - yep - good description. I think I've ignored the fact that my ENTP sis and ENTP friend and ENTP BIL all have inferior Si - - I'm going to start paying attention to that. It seems so obvious to me how my INTP's inferior function Fe plays out, and my own with Se. Hmmm.....Back to the lab for observation  @_pneumoceptor_ - you don't wanna pass out - - it isn't painful in the moment but the 'waking up' is soo strange! You feel so disoriented and feel like you've lost something - - 'how did I get here???' I passed out after falling off the monkey bars in kindergarten, and another time around 10 years when I fell down the stairs running from a cousin on Thanksgiving and hit my head on the wall. And my ESTJ daughter passed out when she was a baby after crying really hard and a few times as a little kid too. Horrible to watch your kid's skin turn blue and their eyes roll back - - sweet revenge for my mom I guess! LOL :tongue:Wow this is getting long - - guess I'll just keep watching and post this as is....


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey all, here's the chat I had with @_MegaTuxRacer_ this weekend. No children were kidnapped in the production of these videos.


 Part 2 (after watching 3 and 4)

HAHAHA - @cityofcircuits felt the same way @MegaTuxRacer (IF and when we get our vid figured out) you'll see that I did the same thing as @pneumoceptor! I was so interested I kept the questions firing and when time ran out he felt he'd done all the talking and hadn't asked me anything LOL. So he DID PM his questions to me. That's soo funny! I don't think I have noticed this about myself as much as I do in these vids and probably why with pneumoceptor we talked for so dang long! We kept each other going with us both being question-asking-masters! LOL

Anyway - I really enjoyed this installment.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

hornet said:


> This interaction was just a treasure trove of information and distinctions on all sorts of great stuff.
> Well most of the videoes are, but in this one I had so many aha's that it was silly.
> The Si explaination vs Ni was just golden.


I totally agree!! :ninja:


----------



## teddy564339

Lady Lullaby said:


> I really, really liked this you guys!
> 
> Hooray for getting another sensor to join this thread. You seem like a really cool guy @_teddy564339_! When you said you may have a perception (as Si-dom) that 'things [you] do are things everybody does,' it made me smile because I think that perception is something my ISFJ mom definitely carries. She is often very hard to convince that she is unique in some aspects, or different from me for example. It is easier now that I'm older and don't live in my parents' home, but I remember as a teenager having my mom talk like she had me figured out and thinking that she was talking about things she liked and that I appreciated about her, but that weren't necessarily about me too. :tongue:


Yeah, I think this is particularly true when ISFJs (and maybe SJs in general) are parents. They naturally use their Si to remember what things were like when they were kids, and they think that the same things are true with their own kids. And even if they're not, they'll think that the kids are just "going through a phase" or will grow out of it. 

I think that's a large reason why SJs have so many conflicts with other types...our Si just creates a barrier that makes it difficult.

But looking back on the first portion of the video, I don't think I described Si as well as I could have, since I think I was still processing a lot of stuff. But I think something I didn't touch on at all was how inferior Ne probably led to a lot of apprehension that ISJs would have about these videos; we would over-worry that something would go wrong and we would make a mistake. I think that probably is the biggest reason for our reservations (and maybe combined with the hesitancy of trying something new), and I don't think I thought to touch on that at all in the conversation.






Lady Lullaby said:


> My INFP brother had an argument with my ISFJ mom about the exact perspective of 'selfishness' you mentioned; and it was totally a Fi/Fe difference. Sigh...knowing what is going on helps me understand the Fi-perspective; but sometimes it seems Fi users don't find the same 'understanding' of 'Fe' and our 'perspective' through MBTI. Or at least they don't vocalize that it makes more sense to them. And that was mentioned in another video - that Fe wants a dialogue! We'd like to hear Fi-user say 'I see how you feel, it is different than me, but I can understand it.' Anyone out there ever had an Fi-user say something like that before?


I think pneumoceptor touched on this in a pretty insightful way by talking about how Fi users don't always open up as easily in terms of sharing their values. She mentioned how she felt oftentimes that she was "taking the high road" by trying to bring up a conflict and work through it with an Fi user, but how the Fi user was much more guarded about it.

I think as Fe users, we have to be very patient with Fi users in this regard and not try to push this on Fi users. It takes Fi users time to build the depth of a relationship. I do think that my INFP friend understands me very well despite our differences. But I think it took us some time to get to that point; I think we really had to find a lot of things we had in common first before we felt as comfortable looking into our differences.





Lady Lullaby said:


> Also, when you, @_teddy564339_, described what you like about communicating on the forum and the ability to control the use of it etc., it reminded me of how my mom loves using instant messaging or e-mail wayy more than calling. I like it a lot too so I don't mind. But my ESFJ sister really gets annoyed that my mom is hard to get on the phone. When you @_teddy564339_ talked about getting quiet at parties and wanting to be perfect, caring too much what everybody thinks, and 'feeling there is nothing you can say that wouldn't bother somebody' - - I feel like you totally put into words what my mom feels! I just wanted to give you a big hug when you said that because I really 'get that' and have seen it with my mom and I love her for it, such a big heart! When we are at big family gatherings she gets really quiet. And I know as soon as we get in the car she'll be chatting a lot - talking about what she noticed about everything at the gathering. My mom 'hates' to 'host' and yet she keeps saying she wants to do it more. haha She's so sweet. She just cares so much and wants to please all the people all the time. I don't like hosting either, but I also hate cooking LOL so we've learned to have things at my house because it takes some of the pressure off of her, and we cook together to help take the pressure off of me. As a team it seems to relieve a lot of our stress for big gatherings like Thanksgiving or Christmas....My mom detests being in the spotlight or 'in-charge' - but she married an ENTJ so problem solved right? :laughing:



Yeah, it is quite interesting, and we've discussed it a fair bit in different places on the ISFJ forum...I think these attributes are quite common among ISFJs. I also think this is another area where inferior Ne plays into it as well, which like I said, I didn't think to touch on during the conversation.






Lady Lullaby said:


> Hearing you talk about how your perception of NTs has changed a bit after learning about MBTI sounds a lot like what my mom tries to convince me of about my ENTJ dad. I can find something he said to be downright cruel and she'll explain how he doesn't intend it that way and I admit, I still have a hard time agreeing with her on this. I think she just loves my dad and supports him no matter what, and I just change the subject most of the time. But she's been married to him 30+ years so I should give her more credit right? Maybe she's uncovered something I haven't when it comes to the ENTJ personality at least.... I know she's felt hurt by his rants before but through the years she has done better to clarify and look for the 'intent' which she tells me, his intent is always to be helpful and have integrity. I have seen that to be true in some cases, but I also wish my dad could be more lax on his Te-preaching (LOL) and allow room for human error - to simply value relationships more than always having to speak his truth. Most the time we've all heard it all before - - we just disagree - - why can't we just focus on what we share as far as beliefs go than spend so much time trying to convince others of our own view??


Well, it's interesting...you might have caught what came up about how I felt about ESTJs compared to ENTJs in the video. I think the Ni in ENTJs really pushes them to want to keep on "fixing" something until it's perfect. I think when you take Ni and combine with with a Te/Fe clash, it can really be tough because the Te or Ne will always be trying to "control" the other person. It's really very similar to what you mentioned earlier in your post about an Fe user wanting to change an Fi user...if you can see how frustrating it is for your dad to do that to you, you can get an idea of what an Fi user feels.

But that's why I do still have a tough time with ENTJs. With ESTJs it's easier for me because we both like that consistency and structure. With INFJs, I imagine that it would be equally (if not more) tough with ESTJs.




Lady Lullaby said:


> And as an ISFJ - you focus on what you have in common and then say 'do your own thing' when it is different and I guess that is why my mom can stay close emotionally to my dad so much easier than I can! Anywaay lol - - you obviously don't need to answer that 'why' question. Just the discussion you had triggered these thoughts and I wanted to share with anyone who bothers to read my long-winded posts.


Yeah, I definitely think the Si and Ni difference pops up there with INFJs and ISFJs, and I had never thought abou that until pneumoceptor brought it up. I do think sometimes the ISFJ way is just sweeping a problem under the rug and not dealing with it, so sometimes the INFJ way is better in the long run. But I also think sometimes yo have to choose your battles.

I also think that ISFJs have a harder time keeping their Fe in check when they're a parent or in a situation where they feel responsible...that's why so many people have trouble with ISFJ mothers, I think...the Fe starts becoming very overbearing. That's another topic we didn't talk about...how Fe does become more controlling in those situations.



Lady Lullaby said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ - my feedback isn'g going to be as long-winded to you because as you know - you're so often saying what I might say. Gorgeous answer about 'Fe' being 'really good at helping others to be known, and heard and cared for' - and emphasizing that it's at its best doing that and not 'fixing or changing'. Hooray! Loved the 'prism' analogy for showing parts of ourselves in different situations too. Mmmm...very lovely imagery.


I totally agree...those two things stood out the most to me as things that I learned, along with the Ni/Si difference in desiring change.




Lady Lullaby said:


> In the last video you guys talked about ISFJs and their loyalty and that they could be called 'The Loyalists' and the Ennegram Type 6 is called 'The Loyalist' and many Type 6's are ISFJs so there ya go!


That's a fantastic point, especially because I'm a type 6 and I was the one who brought up loyalty. I think I tend to forget about the Enneagram very often in these discussions because I don't understand it very well.



Lady Lullaby said:


> The part about @_teddy564339_ valuing the confidence in ESTJs and ESTPs - - perhaps that is ultimately what drew my ISFJ mom to my ENTJ dad - - I wonder what a marriage to an ESTJ would have looked like for her. She gets along sooo well with my ESTJ daughter. It is both sad and beautiful to me that my mom and dad have had the inevitable struggles in their marriage that they do, loyalty is definitely something my mom brings to the table, as is confidence from my dad. Fun to hear the discussion - it brought a lot of the people in my life - To Life.


Yeah, it is very interesting. I definitely don't think ISFJs will always get along better with ESTJs than they will ENTJs...but in my personal experience it's been overwhelmingly true. I think that Si connection just helps so much and makes things so much easier to understand. But as your parents' case shows, this isn't always true.




Lady Lullaby said:


> roud: Thank you! Hooray for Fe-Resonance!


Yeah, I totally felt like the Fe connection made this conversation flow so much, and it helped me learn a couple of really cool new pieces of information.

And I love the little Pooh/Tigger image...it's very cute. :happy: A great little symbol of Fe. :happy:


----------



## Inguz

Kito said:


> Oh, there's some site which pneumoceptor uses to record hers. I'll go back a few pages and try to find it.


Ok, add "Inguz Troll" on Google+ then.


----------



## Inveniet

@_teddy564339
_A face to the teddybear! =D
I wish all ISFJs where as developed as you...

Now I understand some things so much better.
Now I know what male ISFJ look likes.
And I suddenly realize that I've run into several of them trough my life. XD

***Deleted rant about personal issues with ISFJs, cause it isn't nice, it never will be, and it will probably only offend...***


----------



## teddy564339

hornet said:


> @_teddy564339
> _A face to the teddybear! =D
> I wish all ISFJs where as developed as you...
> 
> Now I understand some things so much better.
> Now I know what male ISFJ look likes.
> And I suddenly realize that I've run into several of them trough my life. XD
> 
> ***Deleted rant about personal issues with ISFJs, cause it isn't nice, it never will be, and it will probably only offend...***


Ha ha...well, you know, it was your thread about "Fe from an outside perspective" that first got me thinking about and understanding Fi vs Fe. That thread was one of the ones that motivated me to ask pneumoceptor the question I did about Fe, and I really like her answer. 

We also didn't get to touch on the idea that she's mentioned in other videos about how "Everyone's mom seems to be an ISFJ". Because if it really is as common as it seems, it would make sense that a lot of people would have issues with ISFJ behavior...because as a mother, I would imagine that would be the ultimate situation where Fe is trying to control (which, if pneumoceptor is right, is usually where the problem is). Mothers are protective by nature, and I think if an ISFJ mom knew nothing about the MBTI, she would likely be very controlling (kind of like I mentioned in my last post).


----------



## Kito

I think it's pretty common for people to see their mum as xSFJ and their dad as xSTJ. In reality it's probably just general parental behaviour.


----------



## teddy564339

Kito said:


> I think it's pretty common for people to see their mum as xSFJ and their dad as xSTJ. In reality it's probably just general parental behaviour.


That's a really good point, and I think it would have been one of the first things that would have popped into my mind had we talked about the ISFJ parent thing. 

I think this extends a lot into situations of people being under authority...I think a lot of times they view the authority figure as an SJ. But I think a lot of it is that usually authority figures have to take on at least a few "SJ behaviors" in order to get anything done. I've noticed that a number of P types don't seem to be too comfortable being in authority for that reason, no matter how loosely they may feel they're able to run things.


That's why I always like hearing from parents that are perceivers...to kind of hear how they're parenting style works, both with P and with J children.


----------



## Kito

teddy564339 said:


> That's a really good point, and I think it would have been one of the first things that would have popped into my mind had we talked about the ISFJ parent thing.
> 
> I think this extends a lot into situations of people being under authority...I think a lot of times they view the authority figure as an SJ. But I think a lot of it is that usually authority figures have to take on at least a few "SJ behaviors" in order to get anything done. I've noticed that a number of P types don't seem to be too comfortable being in authority for that reason, no matter how loosely they may feel they're able to run things.
> 
> 
> That's why I always like hearing from parents that are perceivers...to kind of hear how they're parenting style works, both with P and with J children.


Yeah, I don't think I've met many perceiver parents (or at least ones that actually look perceiver-ish). I've always felt uncomfortable being in authority, it just doesn't work out. 

I used to think my dad was ISTJ and my mum ESFJ, but in reality they might be ISTP and INFJ, respectively. It feels weird to see them underneath the 'protective parent' guise, but I've learned that they both had SJ behaviours forced upon them by their parents. I hope we can get some more parents on this site to do these videos!


----------



## Inveniet

Kito said:


> I think it's pretty common for people to see their mum as xSFJ and their dad as xSTJ. In reality it's probably just general parental behaviour.


Yeah how many people can actually type people accurately?
So it might be many people knee-jerk reacting to perceived stereotypes.

I've analyzed my own mum and I'm 95% positive on the ISFJ label.
Si/Fe trough the roof, the lighting is never okay, the heat is never okay, 
lets have a tea-party and sit down and connect over mundane topics.

She collect all birthday cards ever received and wanted me to do the same.
I remember the blissful day I rebelled and threw them all away in the name of saving space. }:-D

My dad is ISTP and that is just as sure. Ti/Se all the way, he is actually trying to use his Fe rightnow
and it is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO painful to watch from an Fi-dom perspective. XD
My mum loves it so I guess it will be okay in a larger picture sense.... :-/

***Shameless Bragging***
I'm actually starting to get pretty good at typing people, especially after watching all these type interactions. =D


----------



## teddy564339

Kito said:


> Yeah, I don't think I've met many perceiver parents (or at least ones that actually look perceiver-ish). I've always felt uncomfortable being in authority, it just doesn't work out.
> 
> I used to think my dad was ISTJ and my mum ESFJ, but in reality they might be ISTP and INFJ, respectively. It feels weird to see them underneath the 'protective parent' guise, but I've learned that they both had SJ behaviours forced upon them by their parents. I hope we can get some more parents on this site to do these videos!



Not to derail the thread too much, and you may have already seen this one, but this is a really fun video (IMO). It's Mike from NF Geeks (an ENFP) talking with his son who is an ISTJ. It's really fascinating to see a few things here...like how the son is the one pushing the father to get him to school on time! It's quite a funny video, I think.

So it's interesting to see how it's not always the case that a P parent could have "SJ traits", though I would imagine they still pop up from time to time.


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## Celebok

I made a thread recently about XSFJ moms, offering my theory about why there seem to be so many, and others chimed in with their own theories. If you combine all these possible explanations, it's really no surprise at all that there are so many reported xSFJ moms.


----------



## Inveniet

teddy564339 said:


> Ha ha...well, you know, it was your thread about "Fe from an outside perspective" that first got me thinking about and understanding Fi vs Fe. That thread was one of the ones that motivated me to ask pneumoceptor the question I did about Fe, and I really like her answer.


Yeah that thread made a lot of things click on a lot of levels, although it was a pretty painful process,
not to mention the unmentionable toxic threads that inspired the thread to begin with. XD


----------



## Celebok

Kito said:


> I used to think my dad was ISTJ and my mum ESFJ, but in reality they might be ISTP and INFJ, respectively. It feels weird to see them underneath the 'protective parent' guise, but I've learned that they both had SJ behaviours forced upon them by their parents.


If that's true that your dad is an ISTP, then what happened to your dad is basically the same thing that happened to me -- I grew up with SJ behaviors and values passed onto me by my parents, and I ended up with an ISTJ persona and even tested as ISTJ on multiple tests. It wasn't until just a month ago when I studied the functions and got past the stereotypes that I figured out that I'm actually an ISTP.

Hmm, you know... since none of the ISTJs seem willing to participate in these type interactions, I suppose maybe I could pretend to be an ISTJ, since I already did that for most of my life. ;-)


----------



## Lady Lullaby

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Also, is there a correlation between Fe and length of posts?


Hey man - you dissin' my posts?! LOL We Fe-users - -


----------



## Kabosu

Fridays said:


> There is two different videos with (different) INTJs, *atypeofuser. *:happy:


I know & good point, but it looked like Kito was suggesting that being a Fi-dom interacting with another Fi-dom would maybe be similar, though they were not the same MBTI type. That made the analogy work for me.


----------



## tangosthenes

Wouldn't mind doing this, if someone knows how to set one up?


----------



## Fridays

Oooh sorry, I misunderstood :crazy:


----------



## pneumoceptor

Sorry I haven't been super involved in the discussions of the videos... I'm fairly busy IRL right now. I hope to catch up soon.

Here's a chat I had with ENTJ @Thomas60 this weekend .


----------



## Celebok

teddy564339 said:


> Looking back on the conversation, I feel a little bad because the one type we pretty much didn't mention at all was ISTPs! I think part of it is that ISTPs may be the type that I know the least about...though from my experience, they seem to be the most chilled out and relaxed type, just going with the flow and not letting anything get to them. We do talk about SPs in general a good bit in video # 4.


I finally got around to watching part 4 just now. I loved your Grasshopper and Ant analogy for SJs and SPs! Except as I recall, the grasshopper was presented as the foolish and irresponsible one, because all he wanted to do was play, and it resulted in him being out in the cold and starving when winter came, while all the ants were fully prepared for winter. (You think that story was written by an SJ?) But obviously that story left an impression on me, considering I still remember it and I haven't heard it since kindergarten! Probably just one more thing that contributed to the SJ persona I took on while growing up.

On the other hand, perhaps that story was written for the SP types like me who otherwise wouldn't see the value of taking the time to plan ahead for the future. It makes me kind of sad when I look at the ISTP forum and see these young 20-year-olds who have no idea what they want to do with their lives, and they don't have the means to really enjoy life the way an SP would want to.


----------



## teddy564339

Celebok said:


> I finally got around to watching part 4 just now. I loved your Grasshopper and Ant analogy for SJs and SPs! Except as I recall, the grasshopper was presented as the foolish and irresponsible one, because all he wanted to do was play, and it resulted in him being out in the cold and starving when winter came, while all the ants were fully prepared for winter. (You think that story was written by an SJ?) But obviously that story left an impression on me, considering I still remember it and I haven't heard it since kindergarten! Probably just one more thing that contributed to the SJ persona I took on while growing up.


Well, here's what I find so fascinating about it...when I read the story as a kid, I got the same impression that you're describing...that the ant is responsible, the grasshopper is lazy, and the moral of the story is that the ant is right. So you may be right in the aspect that it was written by an SJ.

However, when I read Keirsey's analogy of it in _Please Understand Me_, he presented it in a different way...like the ant wasn't the "right" one, but that each of them had their strong points. So it made me think that the only reason why I valued the ant's way more as a kid is because I was an SJ. The way Keirsey presents it, he shows both arguments. The ant's argument is that it's better to plan for the future. But the grasshopper's argument is that the ant is going to overstrain himself working so hard that he's going to have a heat stroke/heart attack (or whatever it was), and that he's never going to live to see the results of all of his hard work.

So I took it as the advantage of the "SP way" of looking at life as saying to make the most of the present. And it's true...all of the time you hear stories of older people saying that when they looked back on their lives, they never wish they "worked harder". It's always that they wish they had had more fun, or took out more time to live out their dreams, or just enjoyed life more. I think especially in our current society, there's so much pressure to work long hours and prepare for the future that a lot of us end up forgetting to enjoy the moment.

So for me, I've always felt that it's a perfect balance. You want to plan for the future so you don't wind up in a really horrible predicament, but you also want to enjoy the moment enough so that you don't look back on your life and feel like you wasted it working too much. And to me, that's what Keirsey was saying about the fable...that it's an opportunity for both types to learn from each other, rather than one type being right. And that's why I enjoyed the analogy so much....because it explained why there were other people who were able to enjoy the moment so much more easily than me, and that there was a lot of value in that, and that I could learn that from them. It made me re-evaluate my childhood notion that "my way" was the right one.




Celebok said:


> On the other hand, perhaps that story was written for the SP types like me who otherwise wouldn't see the value of taking the time to plan ahead for the future. It makes me kind of sad when I look at the ISTP forum and see these young 20-year-olds who have no idea what they want to do with their lives, and they don't have the means to really enjoy life the way an SP would want to.


Well, this goes back to what I was saying about balance. SPs can learn more about planning and setting up long term goals from SJs, and SJs can learn to loosen up and enjoy life more from SPs.


----------



## Celebok

teddy564339 said:


> Well, here's what I find so fascinating about it...when I read the story as a kid, I got the same impression that you're describing...that the ant is responsible, the grasshopper is lazy, and the moral of the story is that the ant is right. So you may be right in the aspect that it was written by an SJ.
> 
> However, when I read Keirsey's analogy of it in _Please Understand Me_, he presented it in a different way...like the ant wasn't the "right" one, but that each of them had their strong points. So it made me think that the only reason why I valued the ant's way more as a kid is because I was an SJ. The way Keirsey presents it, he shows both arguments. The ant's argument is that it's better to plan for the future. But the grasshopper's argument is that the ant is going to overstrain himself working so hard that he's going to have a heat stroke/heart attack (or whatever it was), and that he's never going to live to see the results of all of his hard work.
> 
> So I took it as the advantage of the "SP way" of looking at life as saying to make the most of the present. And it's true...all of the time you hear stories of older people saying that when they looked back on their lives, they never wish they "worked harder". It's always that they wish they had had more fun, or took out more time to live out their dreams, or just enjoyed life more. I think especially in our current society, there's so much pressure to work long hours and prepare for the future that a lot of us end up forgetting to enjoy the moment.
> 
> So for me, I've always felt that it's a perfect balance. You want to plan for the future so you don't wind up in a really horrible predicament, but you also want to enjoy the moment enough so that you don't look back on your life and feel like you wasted it working too much. And to me, that's what Keirsey was saying about the fable...that it's an opportunity for both types to learn from each other, rather than one type being right. And that's why I enjoyed the analogy so much....because it explained why there were other people who were able to enjoy the moment so much more easily than me, and that there was a lot of value in that, and that I could learn that from them. It made me re-evaluate my childhood notion that "my way" was the right one.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, this goes back to what I was saying about balance. SPs can learn more about planning and setting up long term goals from SJs, and SJs can learn to loosen up and enjoy life more from SPs.


Wow!! That is simply an awesome way of looking at it! Since I only figured out that I'm an ISTP a little over a month ago, I'm still in the process of figuring out how to best use that to benefit myself and others, after having been taught all my life that the SJ way is better, and not really having any good SP role models. I really appreciate hearing this idea about finding a good balance and making the most of the present. I mean, not that it's the first time I've ever heard it, but just to hear it in this context seems to give the SP perspective some real merit that I've been struggling to find.

It's also very encouraging to hear this coming from an SJ! I've had this impression that SJs had the least incentive to seek out another perspective, besides that the ant succeeded, the grasshopper screwed up, end of story -- you already know what works for you. The fact that you accepted and embraced this other perspective gives me hope that maybe I can inspire and motivate others to use their gifts and be who they are meant to be.

Wait... did I say inspire and motivate? It's... it's... inspirationally and motivationally beautiful!! Wow... I finally figured out the answer to that question!! @pneumoceptor!!! I'm ready!!! LOL!!! ;-)


----------



## teddy564339

Celebok said:


> Wow!! That is simply an awesome way of looking at it! Since I only figured out that I'm an ISTP a little over a month ago, I'm still in the process of figuring out how to best use that to benefit myself and others, after having been taught all my life that the SJ way is better, and not really having any good SP role models. I really appreciate hearing this idea about finding a good balance and making the most of the present. I mean, not that it's the first time I've ever heard it, but just to hear it in this context seems to give the SP perspective some real merit that I've been struggling to find.


You should definitely look through the SP forums in detail, because there are a lot of members on there that have really good insight into all of the strengths and awesome qualities of SPs. @_fourtines_ , @_njchick_ , and @_elvis2010_ are a few that I can think off the top of my head that have given me really good insight before.



Celebok said:


> It's also very encouraging to hear this coming from an SJ! I've had this impression that SJs had the least incentive to seek out another perspective, besides that the ant succeeded, the grasshopper screwed up, end of story -- you already know what works for you. The fact that you accepted and embraced this other perspective gives me hope that maybe I can inspire and motivate others to use their gifts and be who they are meant to be.


I hope that you're able to. 

Unforunately, as I mentioned at the beginning of the video...Si (which is a top 2 function of all SJs) has a way of making SJs have a hard time seeing how others are different than they are, and it also makes new ideas/change difficult for SJs to see unless they can see concrete evidence of it. Particularly with NPs, SJ parents have a tendency to believe that the NP will simply "grow out" of their individualistic desires and one day grow up to be just like the SJ (and it's very difficult to convince the SJ otherwise until the NP has actually grown up). 

I think this is why SJs are often viewed as very closed-minded (and in many cases, they are). Particularly if they have never heard of something like the MBTI, they will have a harder time seeing how others can thrive in ways that they cannot.


This doesn't mean there's no hope, however. As I mentioned, SPs thrive so well at adapting in the moment, whereas SJs don't. My mom is an ISTJ, and my mom usually does a lot of house/land projects with a family friend of ours who's an ISFP. When I first figured all of this out with my mom, she pointed out how his lack of planning drives her crazy and stresses her out...but how she sees that in his line of work (construction)...it's absolutely necessary for him to be able to adapt quickly to clients. 


But I also think any SJ, especially as they get older, will be able to relate at least somewhat to the idea I mentioned in my last post...that they shouldn't waste away their lives working at their job and need to find time to enjoy the moment and pay attention to their joys and desires (apart from work). I've read about that in many articles that have nothing to do with the MBTI. So sometimes I think that might be a good starting point...particularly if an SP is able to show that despite their tendency to live in the moment, they can still be responsible (like the ISFP family friend I mentioned, for example).


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> Sorry I haven't been super involved in the discussions of the videos... I'm fairly busy IRL right now. I hope to catch up soon.
> 
> Here's a chat I had with ENTJ @_Thomas60_ this weekend .


GOLDEN!!!! =D

Man did I like the ENTJ perspective! 
I'm soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
*envious *


----------



## Fridays

_Thomas60 _I really liked your videos!!! Thank you! :happy:


----------



## Northwind

*@pneumoceptor:* In one of the videos I heard you say that you pick up different accents extremely fast. You may be interested to know (or not) with a persons musicality. The other day I read an incredibly interesting article about linguistics, and it said that scientists strongly suspect there is a link in people's ability to pick up minor variants in speech and their musicality. 

Well. I thought that was a fun fact... :kitteh:


----------



## Inveniet

Fridays said:


> _Thomas60 _I really liked your videos!!! Thank you! :happy:


I find it funny that you ESFPs react in the same manner to ENTJs as I do to INTJs.
In the presence of ENTJs I feel like an ultimate loser even though I also find them very inspiring.
It is very ambiguous...


----------



## Fridays

I dont really understand you right now hornet..?  haha!!..??


----------



## Inveniet

Fridays said:


> I dont really understand you right now hornet..?  haha!!..??


Well thats alright! 
Nobody really understands us ISFPs 
At least you have the decency to tell me how it is! =D
I get so annoyed when people pretend to understand me.

What I meant was simply that ENTJs (Te, Ni, Se, Fi) seem to inspire you ESFPs (Se, Fi, Te, Ni) about as much
as INTJs (Ni, Te, Fi, Se) makes me the ISFP (Fi, Se, Ni, Te) inspired.
Many a time an INTJ have made me go


> wow thank you!  I liked that!


ENTJs and ESFPs have the *"supplement"* archetypal relationship,
just as ISFPs and INTJs also have the* "supplement"* relationship with each other.

However

ENTJs and ISFPs have the *"anima"* archetypal relationship, so we tend to floor each other in both good and bad ways.
Just as INTJs and ESFPs also have the *"anima"* relationship.

http://personalitycafe.com/myers-br...-type-relationships-you-not-about-dating.html

In trying to dig out this thread I had an aha that there might be similar treasures hidden deep in that sub-forum. }:-D


----------



## teddy564339

I think I enjoyed the 3rd part of the video with Thomas60 the most because I felt like I was really seeing how the functions of NJs played out.


I could definitely see the Te and Ti difference between pneumoceptor and Thomas60. He was discussing the idea of wanting to create a coordinated effort to achieve results in the workplace and work, which to me was a great example of dominant Te. She, meanwhile, was saying how she always had a desire to study something to find out what it really was...almost like it was a never ending quest. This was definitely very Ni, but also Ti...since she was studying all of the details of it. I found this particularly interesting because it was different than the use of Fe that she had described to me earlier...in her relationships and how she interacted with other people, she felt a need to "take action"...but when it came to understanding something or studying it, it was more of an internal quest for understanding.


I also found the idea of an ENTJ creating a "regime" to be quite interesting, because all in all I think ENTJs have a very strong desire to lead in some way...I think it's a mix of dominant Te combined with Ni's desire for improvement. 

But it's interesting how ENTJs' goals in leadership are different than those of ENFJs. An ENTJ seems to want to lead and coordinate things in terms of work...or in terms of creating things or accomplishing tasks or just getting something done. With ENFJs, I thought back to the video with the member formal riot...and how he seemed to almost lead more in a social manner. I also think about MLK being an ENFJ social leader...a leader trying to create cooperation in relationships.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Sorry I haven't been super involved in the discussions of the videos... I'm fairly busy IRL right now. I hope to catch up soon.Here's a chat I had with ENTJ @_Thomas60_ this weekend .


Excellent! This was a wonderful installment. I think it is fascinating to hear an ENTJ and INFJ interact. 

@_Thomas60_ you have a great presence about you - I think all the ENTJs I know give off a presence of leadership and confidence...(anyone else agree out there?) I think the way you described your natural flow of networking really matched what I've seen with my ENTJ father and associates. I really value the clear-headed and focused style of ENTJs and I think listening to you talk shows this is something ENTJs and INTJs have naturally. 

@_pneumoceptor_ I liked hearing more about the ENTJ you work with and the contrast of your working style. I appreciated hearing your awareness of why you work the way you work and the confidence you had when you expressed why it is different but why it is preferable for you. 

So I know I've mentioned a video in the making weeks ago. It may be a little bit longer but it is still in the making. The vid partner used a free software that created a file only useable with their program that turned out to be 40 GB!! His memory on his computer was full and so we tried to send it to me to convert it but even with uTorrent it only got up to 38% transferred and then stopped and we couldn't get it going again (and that was after a full day and a half of keeping everything on and flowing). Long story short, he decided to buy the license, buy a bigger hard drive and after cleaning up files and moving things over he will be converting and then uploading. He works full-time so this is done in the other cracks of life. I so appreciate all his hard work and feel so bad it turned out to be such a ridiculous hassle. But it's been a fun way to get to know each other better and really compare how we tackle problems as an ISFP and INFJ! Ha! Very cool!

Thanks again to everyone who is participating in this thread - it is obviously my favorite spot in PerC!


----------



## Inveniet

@Lady Lullaby


> (anyone else agree out there?)


I can second that no problem! 

Looking forward to seeing the ISFP vid! 
I was wondering if it got cancelled or something. :-o


----------



## Fridays

_(((My oldest (biggest!?) sis is an ENTJ. And she *really* loves me ~ and she *really* cares about me. <3 I (almost) always feel secure with an ENTJ.)))_


----------



## Thomas60

Fridays said:


> _(((My oldest (biggest!?) sis is an ENTJ. And she *really* loves me ~ and she *really* cares about me. <3 I (almost) always feel secure with an ENTJ.)))_


Aww :kitteh:
Watching myself in the conversation is a bit like feeling awkward infront of a photograph. What I do see is how i'm trying to force out concepts and language quicker that i'm currently capable of, but once the right vocabulary is obtained or I gain experience in communicating the same thoughts, then the speed and precision is like firing crystal from a gun.

Recollecting the message of our conversations *and* literally watching back on the conversation helped to reshape my perception of an INFJ's modus operandi.

Also it is interesting to see how two Ni/Se feelers ( @hornet and @Lady Lullaby) concur with their sense of leadership 'presence'. If I am dealing with Si-Te & Te-Si users, I have to reference my thoughts to real world actions, otherwise that confidence will probably come off as talking 'bull' or they can't absorb what i'm saying in a meaningful way to them.


----------



## Zjin

@_pneumoceptor
@others

_Thanks for the great videos. I loved to watch the vids and gain more insight!


----------



## teddy564339

Thomas60 said:


> Aww :kitteh:
> Watching myself in the conversation is a bit like feeling awkward infront of a photograph. What I do see is how i'm trying to force out concepts and language quicker that i'm currently capable of, but once the right vocabulary is obtained or I gain experience in communicating the same thoughts, then the speed and precision is like firing crystal from a gun.


You know, I actually kind of felt the same way. Looking back on it, it made me realize how hard it was to say things exactly the way I wanted to on the spot...when I post on PerC, I have all of the time I need to think about what I want to say and word it just right. It was interesting to have to respond quickly and say what came into my mind...but like you said, once I got into the groove, it became much easier. I'm surprised that I managed to think of as many things as I did! But I think it also helps that pneumoceptor is good at keeping a conversation going with a variety of types.


----------



## CutoutPanda

Interesting videos.


----------



## Fat Bozo

innovati said:


> I'm a little new here, and I came on here to learn about how to deconstruct the operation the personalities function by function…


I would advise you to NOT do that.


----------



## dylanshae

Hey! I posted a comment on your part 1 video with the ENTJ male. I was just wondering since I didn't see you have any videos pertaining to a "What's my type?" concept, if you were interested in doing one. I posted a full questionnaire but with so far no replies or input. I personally if you're interested would love to do the first one as I'm a bit conflicted with my traits being very strong in both ENTJ and ENTP territory.

Let me know!


----------



## Celebok

I'm going thru type-interaction-video withdrawal...


----------



## tangosthenes

Fat Bozo said:


> I would advise you to NOT do that.


why?


----------



## Fridays

tangosthenes said:


> why?


I'm pretty sure he's just kidding. :laughing: :kitteh: 
_(PS. You know esfps, they are like that!! :wink_


----------



## Fat Bozo

tangosthenes said:


> why?


Because I don't believe people are just piles of functions to be "deconstructed."



Fridays said:


> I'm pretty sure he's just kidding. :laughing: :kitteh:
> _(PS. You know esfps, they are like that!! :wink_


No, I'm most definitely not kidding. It's a real pet peeve of mine for people to rob others of their humanity by reducing them to machine-like function carriers. I am not suggesting that this was the purpose of the original person I responded to, but it's one of the dangers of pursuing that line of thought and it happens way too often on forums like this.


----------



## tangosthenes

Fat Bozo said:


> Because I don't believe people are just piles of functions to be "deconstructed."
> 
> 
> 
> No, I'm most definitely not kidding. It's a real pet peeve of mine for people to rob others of their humanity by reducing them to machine-like function carriers. I am not suggesting that this was the purpose of the original person I responded to, but it's one of the dangers of pursuing that line of thought and it happens way too often on forums like this.


You like thinking about things your way, others like thinking about things their way. If it works, what's the problem? Nobody is suffering for it.

Or actually, just curious, what are you worried about happening?


----------



## Fat Bozo

teddy564339 said:


> That's why I always like hearing from parents that are perceivers...to kind of hear how they're parenting style works, both with P and with J children.


Well, any time you want to chat, I'd be glad to overwhelm you with my PPPPParenting styles. =P



tangosthenes said:


> You like thinking about things your way, others like thinking about things their way. If it works, what's the problem? Nobody is suffering for it.
> 
> Or actually, just curious, what are you worried about happening?


What I have seen happen is assumptions made about people instead of getting to know them for the individuals they are. I think that's one of the biggest sources of miscommunication when people assume rather than listen.


----------



## Inveniet

So what happened with the vids?
No one else making any?
I would like to make one more if it can be arranged,
any type would be interesting.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Celebok said:


> "I forget that you're a scientist because you're so mushy." - @_MegaTuxRacer_ to @_pneumoceptor_
> 
> LOL!!!! Best line in the interaction series yet!! :-D


I know . That made me smile a lot.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Hey guys, I'm back .

First off, yeah, I'd love to see some other pairs do some chats. It's really soooo easy with Google Hangouts and a youtube account. It basically does it for you. So go for it, if you're thinking about it!

It's cool to read all of the conversation about my chat with @_teddy564339_. It was a very enjoyable chat, and we Fe connected, and it was nice to see the Si vs Ni differences and think about how to apply them to my relationships with Si-doms. I'll just comment on a few things below...

I second @_Lady Lullaby_'s question: "We'd like to hear Fi-user say 'I see how you feel, it is different than me, but I can understand it.' Anyone out there ever had an Fi-user say something like that before?" To you Fi users, does that just seem really foreign and weird, or could it make sense in certain contexts?

Teddy, yes, you're definitely a Southern boy . I didn't comment on it, not because I didn't want to, but because some people feel like I'm criticizing or making fun, or they don't know how to respond. But I enjoy hearing different accents, so that was an added plus for me in our chat. And I have a hint of southern too, not because I grew up there, but because my great-grandparents did. I know, weird... it only comes out in pronouncing things like ten vs tin (certain vowels before nasal consonants)... when I'm tired, I say them both the same. Very southern.

I also find it very sweet and ISFJ (and useful) that you like to summarize the videos, Teddy. Thanks for doing that, and I enjoy your structuring of your environment .

Teddy, I like your observation that maybe inferior Ne is the reason you Si users hesitate to make these videos. It's so much more pronounced in ISTJs, where there's not the Fe there that wants to connect relationally (maybe?). I can't get any of them to do this with me!

I want to clarify my 'high road' point and Fi vs Fe.... It's not that only Fe users take the high road or only Fi users take the high road. Rather, it's that I think we define the high road differently. For me, the high road is sacrificing harmony for the conflict that might bring a deeper understanding/connection. I think that for Fi userse, the high road is more often to suck it up and absorb the conflict for the sake of peace and the other's feelings. So each of us, when there's a relational conflict between an Fi user and an Fe user, thinks we're taking the high road and the other person is being selfish. This is a caricature, but I think there's some truth in it. I'd love to discuss this more with Fi users...

I've also enjoyed looking at Teddy's XSFJ mom thread http://personalitycafe.com/myers-briggs-forum/110784-perc-members-xsfj-moms.html... some good theories as to why it seems that so many of us have XSFJ moms, for anyone who's interested.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Northwind said:


> *@pneumoceptor:* In one of the videos I heard you say that you pick up different accents extremely fast. You may be interested to know (or not) with a persons musicality. The other day I read an incredibly interesting article about linguistics, and it said that scientists strongly suspect there is a link in people's ability to pick up minor variants in speech and their musicality.
> 
> Well. I thought that was a fun fact... :kitteh:


Oh yeah? I'd believe it... maybe similar brain centers are applied. My dad's a pretty amazing musician, and I grew up with a lot of music. Could be! I guess to test the theory, I'd have to try to see how long it takes him to distinguish between say a Swedish and a German accent. This could be fun. Except I don't think he'd pay attention long enough to actually do the experiment. Se gets the best of him often .


----------



## pneumoceptor

CutoutPanda said:


> Interesting videos.


Not to call an ISTJ out, but I'm desperate ... Interested in doing one with me??


----------



## pneumoceptor

teddy564339 said:


> I could definitely see the Te and Ti difference between pneumoceptor and @Thomas60. He was discussing the idea of wanting to create a coordinated effort to achieve results in the workplace and work, which to me was a great example of dominant Te. She, meanwhile, was saying how she always had a desire to study something to find out what it really was...almost like it was a never ending quest. This was definitely very Ni, but also Ti...since she was studying all of the details of it. I found this particularly interesting because it was different than the use of Fe that she had described to me earlier...in her relationships and how she interacted with other people, she felt a need to "take action"...but when it came to understanding something or studying it, it was more of an internal quest for understanding.



Very astute observation. I totally agree.


----------



## CutoutPanda

pneumoceptor said:


> Not to call an ISTJ out, but I'm desperate ... Interested in doing one with me??


Oh I don't know enough to talk extensively about it. Sorry. I've only recently come to this forum and I haven't read any books on the matter, you would be better off with someone more knowledgeable.


----------



## hallrann

I have limited access to a computer so timing and such may be difficult to get around to (I think I'm in a pretty good spot as of recent...) so I'm interested. What all need I do on my end to help get this going?


----------



## teddy564339

pneumoceptor said:


> I second @_Lady Lullaby_'s question: "We'd like to hear Fi-user say 'I see how you feel, it is different than me, but I can understand it.' Anyone out there ever had an Fi-user say something like that before?"


I definitely have, though the only ones I can think of have been PerC members...and they may be more biased in terms of having a strong desire to understand others. 



pneumoceptor said:


> Teddy, yes, you're definitely a Southern boy . I didn't comment on it, not because I didn't want to, but because some people feel like I'm criticizing or making fun, or they don't know how to respond. But I enjoy hearing different accents, so that was an added plus for me in our chat. And I have a hint of southern too, not because I grew up there, but because my great-grandparents did. I know, weird... it only comes out in pronouncing things like ten vs tin (certain vowels before nasal consonants)... when I'm tired, I say them both the same. Very southern.


It's interesting, because some people from California or New England have told me I have a very strong Southern accent. But compared to most people around me, I only have a slight one. Some people down here have even told me they thought I didn't have one at all and they were surprised to hear I've lived in the South my whole life. So it's interesting to hear how different an accent can sound to different people. 




pneumoceptor said:


> Teddy, I like your observation that maybe inferior Ne is the reason you Si users hesitate to make these videos. It's so much more pronounced in ISTJs, where there's not the Fe there that wants to connect relationally (maybe?). I can't get any of them to do this with me!


I agree that the Fe has a desire to connect with others that may have motivated me more than the ISTJs. I've read about inferior Ne in a few different MBTI books, and even though it doesn't explain everything, I do think it's a big part of apprehension that plays into it. In the ISTJ thread about this, a few of them mentioned things they were worried about that even I hadn't considered. I know some people believe that there's more to it than inferior Ne, and I'm sure there is...but I definitely think it's a factor. 




pneumoceptor said:


> I want to clarify my 'high road' point and Fi vs Fe.... It's not that only Fe users take the high road or only Fi users take the high road. Rather, it's that I think we define the high road differently. For me, the high road is sacrificing harmony for the conflict that might bring a deeper understanding/connection. I think that for Fi userse, the high road is more often to suck it up and absorb the conflict for the sake of peace and the other's feelings. So each of us, when there's a relational conflict between an Fi user and an Fe user, thinks we're taking the high road and the other person is being selfish. This is a caricature, but I think there's some truth in it. I'd love to discuss this more with Fi users...



Yeah, I'd definitely have to hear more from Fi users about this too. I don't know if the Fi users I can think of necessarily had a problem with the conflict. But I think they were more comfortable in there being differences that never get resolved than even I am. I think I have a stronger desire than they do to be on the same page in terms of values, whereas they would rather there be more separation. 

But it's hard to say.



pneumoceptor said:


> I've also enjoyed looking at Teddy's XSFJ mom thread http://personalitycafe.com/myers-briggs-forum/110784-perc-members-xsfj-moms.html... some good theories as to why it seems that so many of us have XSFJ moms, for anyone who's interested.


Yeah, I've enjoyed that thread as well, though it was @Celebok that created it and came up with the main theories in it.


----------



## Inveniet

hallrann said:


> I have limited access to a computer so timing and such may be difficult to get around to (I think I'm in a pretty good spot as of recent...) so I'm interested. What all need I do on my end to help get this going?


Need a webcam and a google+ account with hangouts and another person on the other end.
Who starts the recording and puts it on youtube and here is optional.


----------



## pneumoceptor

teddy564339 said:


> Yeah, I've enjoyed that thread as well, though it was @_Celebok_ that created it and came up with the main theories in it.


Oops! My Fe is quite upset about not giving proper credit. Sorry, @Celebok!


----------



## pneumoceptor

A little while ago, @_jendragon_ got in touch with me about doing a video in which we discuss MBTI subtypes. I thought it was a great idea. I'm not sure how many conclusions we were able to draw, but it was an interesting conversation. Here it is...






And in going along with our discussion, here are my cognitive functions test results from today:

Introverted Intuition (Ni) ||||||||||||||||||||||||||| 12.635
Extroverted Feeling (Fe) ||||||||||||||||||||||| 10.91
Extroverted Intuition (Ne) ||||||||||||||| 6.865
Introverted Feeling (Fi) ||||||||||||||| 6.85
Introverted Thinking (Ti) ||||||||||| 4.99
Extroverted Thinking (Te) ||||||| 2.93
Introverted Sensation (Si) || -0.76
Extroverted Sensation (Se) |||| -3.43


----------



## Inveniet

> Originally Posted by *pneumoceptor* I want to clarify my 'high road' point and Fi vs Fe.... It's not that only Fe users take the high road or only Fi users take the high road. Rather, it's that I think we define the high road differently. For me, the high road is sacrificing harmony for the conflict that might bring a deeper understanding/connection. I think that for Fi userse, the high road is more often to suck it up and absorb the conflict for the sake of peace and the other's feelings. So each of us, when there's a relational conflict between an Fi user and an Fe user, thinks we're taking the high road and the other person is being selfish. This is a caricature, but I think there's some truth in it. I'd love to discuss this more with Fi users...





> Yeah, I'd definitely have to hear more from Fi users about this too. I don't know if the Fi users I can think of necessarily had a problem with the conflict. But I think they were more comfortable in there being differences that never get resolved than even I am. I think I have a stronger desire than they do to be on the same page in terms of values, whereas they would rather there be more separation.
> 
> But it's hard to say.


 @teddy564339

I think this is where the enneagram comes in partly.
As a nine I would be less wanting to have the conflict, but it wouldn't be Fi in particular who didn't care for the conflict.

If there is a Fi/Fe highground divide over this, I would say that Fi don't want to get into the issues because
we see that things from our perspective can only get worse by focusing on the issue.
Fe sometimes resorts to using "bonding" as some sort of conflict healer. 
Fi finds that way shallow as from our point of view no issue has necessarily been fixed by the unity process.
Just because we watched a movie together doesn't fix our underlying schism.... XD
Now that would be taking it to the extreme and I don't want to say that Fe can't resolve conflicts.
But many times the methods adopted by Fe to resolve things leave Fi going, great another 
"lets pretend that everything is nice and dandy". So Fi users can develop a mistrust in Fe users methods.
Fi users also know that if they where to use their own methods, the friendship is surely lost forever,
as they know from bitter experience that Fe users mostly don't take kindly to the truth according to Fi.
Most Fe users don't know MBTI and even the ones that know it have a hard time swallowing our pills
unless we dissolve them in tons of water.... XD

I dunno if this helped, but it is kinda how I experience the whole thing.


----------



## teddy564339

hornet said:


> @_teddy564339_
> 
> I think this is where the enneagram comes in partly.
> As a nine I would be less wanting to have the conflict, but it wouldn't be Fi in particular who didn't care for the conflict.
> 
> If there is a Fi/Fe highground divide over this, I would say that Fi don't want to get into the issues because
> we see that things from our perspective can only get worse by focusing on the issue.
> Fe sometimes resorts to using "bonding" as some sort of conflict healer.
> Fi finds that way shallow as from our point of view no issue has necessarily been fixed by the unity process.
> Just because we watched a movie together doesn't fix our underlying schism.... XD
> Now that would be taking it to the extreme and I don't want to say that Fe can't resolve conflicts.
> But many times the methods adopted by Fe to resolve things leave Fi going, great another
> "lets pretend that everything is nice and dandy". So Fi users can develop a mistrust in Fe users methods.
> Fi users also know that if they where to use their own methods, the friendship is surely lost forever,
> as they know from bitter experience that Fe users mostly don't take kindly to the truth according to Fi.
> Most Fe users don't know MBTI and even the ones that know it have a hard time swallowing our pills
> unless we dissolve them in tons of water.... XD
> 
> I dunno if this helped, but it is kinda how I experience the whole thing.



You may be right about this being Enneagram related. In the case of pneumoceptor and I, I also think that our Si and Ni difference plays a part as well. I say this because as we talked about in our video, she seemed to be much more driven to resolve conflicts head-on than I am.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

hornet said:


> @_teddy564339_I think this is where the enneagram comes in partly.As a nine I would be less wanting to have the conflict, but it wouldn't be Fi in particular who didn't care for the conflict. If there is a Fi/Fe highground divide over this, I would say that Fi don't want to get into the issues becausewe see that things from our perspective can only get worse by focusing on the issue.Fe sometimes resorts to using "bonding" as some sort of conflict healer. Fi finds that way shallow as from our point of view no issue has necessarily been fixed by the unity process.Just because we watched a movie together doesn't fix our underlying schism.... XDNow that would be taking it to the extreme and I don't want to say that Fe can't resolve conflicts.But many times the methods adopted by Fe to resolve things leave Fi going, great another "lets pretend that everything is nice and dandy". So Fi users can develop a mistrust in Fe users methods.Fi users also know that if they where to use their own methods, the friendship is surely lost forever,as they know from bitter experience that Fe users mostly don't take kindly to the truth according to Fi.Most Fe users don't know MBTI and even the ones that know it have a hard time swallowing our pillsunless we dissolve them in tons of water.... XDI dunno if this helped, but it is kinda how I experience the whole thing.


Fascinating! Because the reverse has been true for me. I've been experiencing what seems to be an Fe/Fi conflict with an INTJ friend, but I've been the one feeling that she is more comfortable 'pretending that everything is nice and dandy' and I'm the one not ready or comfortable to spend time with her because I can see that we're just not going to see eye-to-eye. She is reaching out - that's big for an INTJ right? I am cordial. But I'm still too wounded. I no longer trust her emotionally and I don't have an 'off-switch' to 'connecting' when I'm with people. So I have to stay away until it doesn't hurt anymore. Hmmm....maybe there are too many variables to really pinpoint what I might have hoped to discover. I admit that with auxiliary Fe I am more 'sensitive' and 'lose trust' pretty quickly. I don't know how to get around that. I'm guessing Fi-users don't know what to make of it either and sadly the friendship fades out. Perhaps it is a 'pipe-dream' to hear her or another Fi-user say: "I see how you feel, it is different than me, but I can understand it."


----------



## Celebok

pneumoceptor said:


> Oops! My Fe is quite upset about not giving proper credit. Sorry, @_Celebok_!


Awww, hehe, it's okay!  And thank you @teddy564339 for pointing it out!


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> Fascinating! Because the reverse has been true for me. I've been experiencing what seems to be an Fe/Fi conflict with an INTJ friend, but I've been the one feeling that she is more comfortable 'pretending that everything is nice and dandy' and I'm the one not ready or comfortable to spend time with her because I can see that we're just not going to see eye-to-eye. She is reaching out - that's big for an INTJ right? I am cordial. But I'm still too wounded. I no longer trust her emotionally and I don't have an 'off-switch' to 'connecting' when I'm with people. So I have to stay away until it doesn't hurt anymore. Hmmm....maybe there are too many variables to really pinpoint what I might have hoped to discover. I admit that with auxiliary Fe I am more 'sensitive' and 'lose trust' pretty quickly. I don't know how to get around that. I'm guessing Fi-users don't know what to make of it either and sadly the friendship fades out. Perhaps it is a 'pipe-dream' to hear her or another Fi-user say: "I see how you feel, it is different than me, but I can understand it."


Well, but if you're talking about an INTJ, then I would think that's more of an Fe/Te conflict than an Fe/Fi conflict. The Te user wouldn't have the kind of emotional impact from the conflict that the Fe user does. The Te just says, "This is what's logically correct, now I've stated my case, and that's all there is to it. What more do you want?" But the Fe user may still feel hurt by the Te user's cold way of presenting it and the lack of consideration for feelings, thus the Fe user still sees a conflict, while the Te user thinks there's nothing more to be resolved.

If I bring my own type into the mix, it can get even more confusing, because I've dominant Ti analyzing the situation and going, "Yeah, this is logically correct, it totally makes sense!" and then my inferior Fe is like, "Oops..."


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Celebok said:


> Well, but if you're talking about an INTJ, then I would think that's more of an Fe/Te conflict than an Fe/Fi conflict. The Te user wouldn't have the kind of emotional impact from the conflict that the Fe user does. The Te just says, "This is what's logically correct, now I've stated my case, and that's all there is to it. What more do you want?" But the Fe user may still feel hurt by the Te user's cold way of presenting it and the lack of consideration for feelings, thus the Fe user still sees a conflict, while the Te user thinks there's nothing more to be resolved.
> 
> If I bring my own type into the mix, it can get even more confusing, because I've dominant Ti analyzing the situation and going, "Yeah, this is logically correct, it totally makes sense!" and then my inferior Fe is like, "Oops..."


I can see what you're saying and that may very well be the case. I guess as an Fe-user I don't understand what happens inside an INTJ's brain when we're actually discussing feelings. How can the Te claim what is logically correct when it is about emotions? I guess they'd basically just state what is true for them (Fi) and that's why I've been saying it's an Fe/Fi clash. Especially because I've talked to other Fe-users who have experienced something similar with Fi-doms as well as Fi-aux, tert, inf. Anyway, I am very open to any Te-user or Fi-user offering another perspective of what is the 'missing link' when clashing with an Fe-user. I've reached the point in this particular relationship where I'm keeping it 'polite' and closing off my heart. I think I've probably played this part too well though because they seem to think we can 'chat' like old times and the 'friendliness' is actually painful for me. Ahhh the complexities of emotions and public and private personas...


----------



## Inveniet

Lady Lullaby said:


> Fascinating! Because the reverse has been true for me. I've been experiencing what seems to be an Fe/Fi conflict with an INTJ friend, but I've been the one feeling that she is more comfortable 'pretending that everything is nice and dandy' and I'm the one not ready or comfortable to spend time with her because I can see that we're just not going to see eye-to-eye. She is reaching out - that's big for an INTJ right? I am cordial. But I'm still too wounded. I no longer trust her emotionally and I don't have an 'off-switch' to 'connecting' when I'm with people. So I have to stay away until it doesn't hurt anymore. Hmmm....maybe there are too many variables to really pinpoint what I might have hoped to discover. I admit that with auxiliary Fe I am more 'sensitive' and 'lose trust' pretty quickly. I don't know how to get around that. I'm guessing Fi-users don't know what to make of it either and sadly the friendship fades out. Perhaps it is a 'pipe-dream' to hear her or another Fi-user say: "I see how you feel, it is different than me, but I can understand it."


I think that since Fi/Fe can't see eye to eye, we come off as 'pretending that everything is nice and dandy'* to each other.*
There is a* huge* communications gap, that only a good understanding by both parties can bridge.
Having tertiaty Fi doesn't help at all either, as INTJs are in exploratory mode and will say and do things cause they don't
understand the ramifications. When a person uses the tertiary they are like a child with a new toy.
Playing with the foreign kids (Fe) next door can become a messy affair due to cultural differences.


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> I can see what you're saying and that may very well be the case. I guess as an Fe-user I don't understand what happens inside an INTJ's brain when we're actually discussing feelings. How can the Te claim what is logically correct when it is about emotions? I guess they'd basically just state what is true for them (Fi) and that's why I've been saying it's an Fe/Fi clash. Especially because I've talked to other Fe-users who have experienced something similar with Fi-doms as well as Fi-aux, tert, inf. Anyway, I am very open to any Te-user or Fi-user offering another perspective of what is the 'missing link' when clashing with an Fe-user. I've reached the point in this particular relationship where I'm keeping it 'polite' and closing off my heart. I think I've probably played this part too well though because they seem to think we can 'chat' like old times and the 'friendliness' is actually painful for me. Ahhh the complexities of emotions and public and private personas...


When you say you're discussing feelings, do you mean your feelings or theirs? That's the thing, I don't imagine an INTJ wanting to discuss anyone's feelings, unless someone else brings it up. Of course, since I don't know what your actual situation was, I could have an entirely wrong picture. But from what I've observed in INTJs, and from what others have described, they generally don't seek out conflict, but when directly challenged, they will not hesitate to fire back a logical argument (Te) to support their personal beliefs (Fi), without regard for the other person's feelings (!Fe). In fact, there was a time when I thought I was an INTJ and acted like an unhealthy one, and my attitude was basically, "I'm just telling you what's true, so don't blame me if you're hurt by it," which ended up hurting the other person even more. (I'm still guilty of this occasionally when I get frustrated.) But the other thing is, I had no bad feelings toward the other person, and I was completely willing to just let bygones be bygones and continue being friends, while they still felt hurt by my words. Usually by this time, they were afraid to bring it up again, for fear of getting hurt again, so the friendship pretty much died.

I don't know if what I just described is anywhere close to your situation with the INTJ friend. Ultimately, you need to do what's best for you, even if it means putting distance between you and her (which may or may not end up being permanent), for your own emotional health. If the INTJ cannot see your point of view, then continuing to work on the conflict is just going to get yourself hurt. The INTJ will probably see it as you being unable to let go of the past, but it's probably not worth the trouble to try to make her understand why you feel the way you do. (However, if you have any mutual friends who are not emotionally invested in the conflict, they may be able to communicate your position to her.)

I know you've watched a lot of MBTI videos on YouTube, so maybe you've seen one by @InterPersonality (an Aussie INTJ woman) called "How INFJs see INTJs and vice versa", which may be of interest to you. (I'd post the link, but that particular video has received enough flack from trolls already, but you can easily search for it if you're interested.)


----------



## Fat Bozo

hornet said:


> So what happened with the vids?
> No one else making any?
> I would like to make one more if it can be arranged,
> any type would be interesting.


I'd love to chat with ya, man. Pneumo hasn't gotten back to me about when we're doing our chat yet!


----------



## Inveniet

Fat Bozo said:


> I'd love to chat with ya, man. Pneumo hasn't gotten back to me about when we're doing our chat yet!


Yeah that would be cool, we need an ESFP-ISFP interaction!
I'll PM you and we can figure out how to get going!


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> A little while ago, @_jendragon_ got in touch with me about doing a video in which we discuss MBTI subtypes. I thought it was a great idea. I'm not sure how many conclusions we were able to draw, but it was an interesting conversation. Here it is...


I loved this video, especially the part about how Intuitives will prefer intuition of "either kind" over sensing, and Sensors will prefer both sensings over intuition. My experience has been the same and it's why I don't buy most of these set-in-stone "function model" things because it seems like trying to force symmetry onto something that isn't symmetrical. Another thing that breaks the model is STJs, who in my experience tend to use a "group" way of feeling (what I think of as "Fe") more than the individualist feeling that I use ("Fi") just like the SFJs do. 

My function tests turn out the same way as well, with both "forms" of intuition as "unused" or "limited use."


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> A little while ago, @_jendragon_ got in touch with me about doing a video in which we discuss MBTI subtypes. I thought it was a great idea. I'm not sure how many conclusions we were able to draw, but it was an interesting conversation. Here it is...
> And in going along with our discussion, here are my cognitive functions test results from today:
> 
> Introverted Intuition (Ni) ||||||||||||||||||||||||||| 12.635
> Extroverted Feeling (Fe) ||||||||||||||||||||||| 10.91
> Extroverted Intuition (Ne) ||||||||||||||| 6.865
> Introverted Feeling (Fi) ||||||||||||||| 6.85
> Introverted Thinking (Ti) ||||||||||| 4.99
> Extroverted Thinking (Te) ||||||| 2.93
> Introverted Sensation (Si) || -0.76
> Extroverted Sensation (Se) |||| -3.43


I have always been higher on the E/I sliding scale towards more E than I; even though I am certain I am Ni-dom. I believe I test high on Fe because I'm an enneagram Type 2, I was the oldest child of 7 and was relied on a lot to be 'mommy # 2', and because of the E/I slide it calls on my preferred extraverted function. But I am the most 'me' when I'm in Ni-mode. That is where my soul sits. :kitteh:

I would like to take the same test as you @_pneumoceptor_ - what test did you take? @_jendragon_ It seems from my results (see below) that although I consistently test higher on Fe than Ni, it is very close but Se is ALWAYS my lowest and that is (I'm assuming) why I am given INFJ as my most likely MBTI type. If you look at my results, you'll see that it is not conclusive as far as the questions you both discussed in the video. It also shows what you both mentioned - that wording questions in order to get to the desired result is not easy! How we think, what is happening in our life in the moment, etc. all influences our perspective while taking the test.

OK - here we go. . .

*Most Recent Results:*

Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ************************************* (37.2)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ************************************ (36.1)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ********************************* (33.1)
good use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ******************************* (31.2)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti) ***************************** (30)
average use
introverted Sensing (Si) ************************** (26.1)
average use
extraverted Thinking (Te) ************************** (26)
average use
extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************* (19.9)
limited use

Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: INFJ

*Same test another time:
*
Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use):
extraverted Feeling (Fe) ***************************************** (41.1)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) ************************************ (36.1)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) *********************************** (35)
good use
introverted Sensing (Si) **************************** (28.8)
average use
extraverted Thinking (Te) **************************** (28.8)
average use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************** (26.9)
average use
introverted Thinking (Ti) *********************** (23.5)
limited use
extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************* (19.6)
limited use

Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: INFJ

*Taken another day:
*
Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Feeling (Fe) *************************************** (39.7)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************************* (37.8)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni) *********************************** (35.8)
good use
extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ***************************** (29.8)
average use
extraverted Thinking (Te) **************************** (28.5)
average use
introverted Thinking (Ti) *********************** (23.5)
limited use
introverted Sensing (Si) *********************** (23.4)
limited use
extraverted Sensing (Se) ********************* (21.5)
limited use

Summary Analysis of Profile
By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: INFJ

*ANOTHER TEST:
*

Extroversion (54%) / Introversion (45%)
Sensation (39%) / Intuition (41%)
Thinking (30%) / Feeling (69%)


*Fe (Extroverted Feeling)* (62%) 
your valuation of / adherence to external morals, ethics, traditions, customs, groups
*Fi (Introverted Feeling)* (55%) 
your valuation of / adherence to the sanctity of your own feelings / ideals / sentiment
*Ni (Introverted Intuition)* (37%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity
*Ti (Introverted Thinking)* (37%) 
your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational
*Te (Extroverted Thinking)* (36%) 
your valuation of / adherence to logic of external systems / hierarchies / methods
*Ne (Extroverted Intuition)* (36%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli
*Si (Introverted Sensing)* (32%) 
your valuation of / focus on internal sensations and reliving past moments
*Se (Extroverted Sensing)* (31%) 
your valuation of / tendency to fully experience the world unfiltered, in the moment
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
based on your results your type is likely - *enfj

Taken another day:

*
*Fe (Extroverted Feeling)* (70%) 
your valuation of / adherence to external morals, ethics, traditions, customs, groups
*Ni (Introverted Intuition)* (65%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity
*Ti (Introverted Thinking)* (60%) 
your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational
*Fi (Introverted Feeling)* (60%) 
your valuation of / adherence to the sanctity of your own feelings / ideals / sentiment
*Te (Extroverted Thinking)* (55%) 
your valuation of / adherence to logic of external systems / hierarchies / methods
*Ne (Extroverted Intuition)* (50%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli
*Si (Introverted Sensing)* (35%) 
your valuation of / focus on internal sensations and reliving past moments
*Se (Extroverted Sensing)* (15%) 
your valuation of / tendency to fully experience the world unfiltered, in the moment
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
based on your results your type is likely - *enfj*

*And one more time:

*
*Fi (Introverted Feeling)* (75%) 
your valuation of / adherence to the sanctity of your own feelings / ideals / sentiment
* Fe (Extroverted Feeling)* (70%) 
your valuation of / adherence to external morals, ethics, traditions, customs, groups
*Ti (Introverted Thinking)* (70%) 
your valuation of / adherence to your own internally devised logic/rational
*Ni (Introverted Intuition)* (65%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards internal/original free association and creativity
*Ne (Extroverted Intuition)* (60%) 
your valuation of / tendency towards free association and creating with external stimuli
*Te (Extroverted Thinking)* (55%) 
your valuation of / adherence to logic of external systems / hierarchies / methods
*Si (Introverted Sensing)* (45%) 
your valuation of / focus on internal sensations and reliving past moments
*Se (Extroverted Sensing)* (10%) 
your valuation of / tendency to fully experience the world unfiltered, in the moment
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
based on your results your type is likely - *infp*


----------



## pneumoceptor

Fat Bozo said:


> I loved this video, especially the part about how Intuitives will prefer intuition of "either kind" over sensing, and Sensors will prefer both sensings over intuition. My experience has been the same and it's why I don't buy most of these set-in-stone "function model" things because it seems like trying to force symmetry onto something that isn't symmetrical. Another thing that breaks the model is STJs, who in my experience tend to use a "group" way of feeling (what I think of as "Fe") more than the individualist feeling that I use ("Fi") just like the SFJs do.
> 
> My function tests turn out the same way as well, with both "forms" of intuition as "unused" or "limited use."


I want to understand more what you mean that STJs use a group way of feeling. Can you elaborate?


----------



## pneumoceptor

@Lady Lullaby, your results seem in line with what jendragon and I were talking about in the vids, at least as far as sensing being on the bottom for an Ni-dom. (except for that one test where your Si was high... what was up with that?!) 

I just took the cognitive functions test on this site...


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Celebok;2885967
I don't know if what I just described is anywhere close to your situation with the INTJ friend. Ultimately said:


> InterPersonality[/I] (an Aussie INTJ woman) called "How INFJs see INTJs and vice versa", which may be of interest to you. (I'd post the link, but that particular video has received enough flack from trolls already, but you can easily search for it if you're interested.)


You summarized it pretty well -yes - very close to my experience. I had seen that video before but it had been a while. I re-watched it and commented too. Thanks for your responses. I am glad there are people like her sharing and making vids.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> @_Lady Lullaby_, your results seem in line with what jendragon and I were talking about in the vids, at least as far as sensing being on the bottom for an Ni-dom. (except for that one test where your Si was high... what was up with that?!)
> 
> I just took the cognitive functions test on this site...


LOL! I know, right? Ha! I have no idea! Maybe I had spent the day with my ISFJ mom? :tongue:


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> I want to understand more what you mean that STJs use a group way of feeling. Can you elaborate?


Sure, I'll try. The STJs I have known and encountered (quite a lot of them, in fact I work with 3 on a daily basis) talk a lot about people not conforming to the way they think people should act in society. All the thoughts and feelings they express seem to be geared toward that same kind of "group think" mentality. According to their values, everyone is supposed to have a job, save their money, take care of sick family members while working through their own illnesses or discomfort, "stiff upper lip" kind of mentality. I see this same mentality in the SFJs. The main difference to me is the SFJs seem to have slightly more tolerance but really not much. SJs seem to all be very similar to each other in their basic philosophies, even in their interests and other superficial stuff is different.

So, the idea of people are like others just turned inside out doesn't hold true in my experience. Sensors break the system. Maybe it works for some Ns because they have to develop some sensing just to survive in the world but most Sensors don't really develop intuition unless circumstances in their life kind of force them to.

Hopefully that made some sort of sense, I feel like I'm not good at explaining it at all.


----------



## Celebok

pneumoceptor said:


> @_Lady Lullaby_, your results seem in line with what jendragon and I were talking about in the vids, at least as far as sensing being on the bottom for an Ni-dom. (except for that one test where your Si was high... what was up with that?!)
> 
> I just took the cognitive functions test on this site...


The same thing happened to me, only with sensing and thinking functions...

*Ti Si Te Se Fi Ni Ne Fe
*


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> You summarized it pretty well -yes - very close to my experience. I had seen that video before but it had been a while. I re-watched it and commented too. Thanks for your responses. I am glad there are people like her sharing and making vids.


Yeah, I stumbled upon her channel shortly after I began studying typology and figuring out my type, and I found her videos to be very interesting and informative, and she obviously knows a lot about type theory. And she's usually really good at responding to comments and answering questions. (Plus I love Australian accents!)


----------



## teddy564339

Fat Bozo said:


> I loved this video, especially the part about how Intuitives will prefer intuition of "either kind" over sensing, and Sensors will prefer both sensings over intuition.


Perhaps I'm more of the exception, but I definitely fine Se much more foreign to me personally than Ne. I think inferior functions are kind of tricky; I've read a few articles and books that describe inferior Ne that lines up perfectly with my own behaviors, though. I think in general, we use our inferior functions in a weakened state that often is kind of like a "negative" version of the function...and I think that kind of turns us away from it. 

I'm not an expert on the CFs and how tertiary and inferior functions are used, though...and I've never understood the "shadow function" theories. But I've never been one to feel like I can relate to Se at all.



Fat Bozo said:


> My experience has been the same and it's why I don't buy most of these set-in-stone "function model" things because it seems like trying to force symmetry onto something that isn't symmetrical.


Well, where I see the symmetry lining up is how two functions are "opposite" and work to balance each other out. In dominant/inferior cases I think it's more of a battle where the two functions fight for opposite needs, but I don't see it nearly as much in the auxiliary/tertiary case.



Fat Bozo said:


> Another thing that breaks the model is STJs, who in my experience tend to use a "group" way of *feeling* (what I think of as "Fe") more than the individualist feeling that I use ("Fi") just like the SFJs do.
> 
> Sure, I'll try. The STJs I have known and encountered (quite a lot of them, in fact I work with 3 on a daily basis) talk a lot about people not conforming to the way they think people should act in society.


I actually think this is a strong example of Te much more than a form of "feeling", and I actually see very similar mentalities in NTJs that I do in STJs. My ENTJ dad/brother have very similar mentalities to my ISTJ mom in this regard. I don't really think it's about feeling as much as it is about the logical structure that they see in life.

I think the difference is that it's extroverted judging compared to your introverted judging. I think Fe and Te can both feel very controlling to Fi and Ti, because it's almost like an outward expression of structure and cohesiveness.

I also think it's more about action than it is about belief. I have an INFP friend who probably could fit into categories of "group think" in topics he's passionate about. For example, he thinks every person should be a feminist, and if he were around others who believed the same as he would, I'm sure he would have no problem vocalizing this and saying what others "should be doing". I think the difference is that he doesn't exert this onto other people as much as Je users might...he's fine with there being separation on the topic because if someone doesn't agree with him, he just shuts them out. 

So I think it kind of depends on what you mean by "individualistic". 


I also think Fe kind of gets a bad rap for being a proponent of "group think". I don't think Fe wants or expects everyone to feel the same way about things. I think it's moreso that Fe wants people to sacrifice their own values for the sake of a group getting on the same page and getting along. Fe can become controlling when it either makes someone feel that their own values are more important than someone else's who are different, or when it feels it's sacrificing more than someone else...then it pushes others to conform to itself. 

I don't think Te really works like that...I think Te basically says "My logic tells me this is right. Unless you can convince me that my logic is wrong, you need to have the same logic that I do." I think this tends to be quite similar in STJs and NTJs...I think the difference is NTJs will sometimes change their own logic as they understand a topic more and more, whereas an STJ is more likely to find a comfortable place and stick to it.




Fat Bozo said:


> All the thoughts and feelings they express seem to be geared toward that same kind of "group think" mentality. According to their values, everyone is supposed to have a job, save their money, take care of sick family members while working through their own illnesses or discomfort, "stiff upper lip" kind of mentality. I see this same mentality in the SFJs. The main difference to me is the SFJs seem to have slightly more tolerance but really not much. SJs seem to all be very similar to each other in their basic philosophies, even in their interests and other superficial stuff is different.


For STJs, while I think the mentality you're describing is pretty common/accurate, I don't see Fe in it...I see a combination of Si and Te. 

There certainly are similarities in SJs (due to having Si as well as some form of Je), but I think some of these same tendencies are shared by NJs. I think it's interesting comparing my conversation with pneumoceptor to my relationship with my mom...it's quite fascinating to see how I connected so well with pneumoceptor in terms of Fe (and saw some interesting Ni/Si differences), whereas with my mom (ISTJ) I can see so many Si connections and a pretty strong Fe/Te difference.


I think the similarities you see in SJs are probably due to their Si clashing with your Se, as well as their Je infringing on your Fi. 


This is all just my opinion based on my own experiences with different types as well.





Fat Bozo said:


> So, the idea of people are like others just turned inside out doesn't hold true in my experience. Sensors break the system. Maybe it works for some Ns because they have to develop some sensing just to survive in the world but most Sensors don't really develop intuition unless circumstances in their life kind of force them to.
> 
> Hopefully that made some sort of sense, I feel like I'm not good at explaining it at all.


Again, I don't know tons and tons about CF relationships or how they work, particularly with the detailed parts of Jung's work. And certainly things like experience and the Ennegram can contribute to differences within types. But I can at least see and feel how my Ne affects me and how I use it (even if it's not in beneficial ways), whereas I don't see myself using Se in any way, really.


----------



## Kabosu

^I can kind of actually pick up on Se from others because sometimes I feel like we process in such different ways and may as well speak foreign languages to each other at times when we speak. In better cases, I find the difference to be a pretty refreshing one. I feel a tad derpy though when they say something obvious and I miss out on it during the moment. :-/ In lesser cases, social situations might be awkward for both the Se and Ne side.


----------



## Inveniet

*Okay! =D*

Me (ISFP) and @luemb (INTJ) just did a vid!
It was a great interaction and we got to go into some very interesting topics.
I can totally see how ISFP/INTJ is the *supplement* relation. 
It got to be a two hour convo, but that shouldn't scare away anyone. }:-D






Here is the thread I promised you luemb. 
http://personalitycafe.com/myers-br...-type-relationships-you-not-about-dating.html


----------



## luemb

hornet said:


> *Okay! =D*
> 
> Me (ISFP) and @luemb (INTJ) just did a vid!
> It was a great interaction and we got to go into some very interesting topics.
> I can totally see how ISFP/INTJ is the *supplement* relation.
> It got to be a two hour convo, but that shouldn't scare away anyone. }:-D
> 
> Here is the thread I promised you luemb.
> http://personalitycafe.com/myers-br...-type-relationships-you-not-about-dating.html


It was fantastic talking to you Hornet, I think it ended up being more of a learning experience for both of us rather than an explaining or "just talking about things" situation. It was great to experience that supplemental relation in action. 

Also, if you go back through and watch, there are a few moments where you zoned out for a bit to think about something I said. I think that's Ni in action.


----------



## Inveniet

luemb said:


> It was fantastic talking to you Hornet, I think it ended up being more of a learning experience for both of us rather than an explaining or "just talking about things" situation. It was great to experience that supplemental relation in action.
> 
> Also, if you go back through and watch, there are a few moments where you zoned out for a bit to think about something I said. I think that's Ni in action.


Yes the nice things about the supplement is how the function order lines up.
Ni, Te, Fi, Se
Fi, Se, Ni, Te

We each have the others weakest two as our two strongest functions.
So every word the other person says becomes interesting and inspirational almost.

Yeah I know, and I noticed that I was expecting external resistance when I did it,
cause many people find it weird that I need to zone out to reorient myself when I've gotten
more Ni "buffered" than I can handle. I need to go and sort it to some degree before I can continue.
It is Fi needing to reassert dominance over an over-active Ni.
Can't have unjudged information lying around.


----------



## Geoffrey

Congratulations on your 20th type interaction! 

How many more types have you yet to interact with?


----------



## Leonyc14

@pneumoceptor , I really think you are an ISFJ. I have met other ISFJ's and I believe this is your type. Of course, I may be wrong, but I feel pretty sure of this. I also think this is why you are attracted to dominant Ne as you've said before - because it is your inferior function.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Geoffrey said:


> Congratulations on your 20th type interaction!
> 
> How many more types have you yet to interact with?


Thanks! I still have some sensor gaps in my MBTI menagerie... after this weekend's ESFP chat (many thanks to @Fat Bozo in advance), I would still like to find willing ISTJs, ESFJs, and ESTPs.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Leonyc14 said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ , I really think you are an ISFJ. I have met other ISFJ's and I believe this is your type. Of course, I may be wrong, but I feel pretty sure of this. I also think this is why you are attracted to dominant Ne as you've said before - because it is your inferior function.


I really think I'm an INFJ, and I have also met many ISFJs! 

It's interesting that you say this, because ISFJ and INFJ are much more different than say INFJ and INTJ... not on the outside, but miles apart on the inside. Anyway, I respectfully disagree, due to my consuming internal models, my inattention to the past, my inattention to detail, and my preference for metaphor. But I'd be interested to know if any others agree with Leonyc14.


BTW, not to go all Fe on you, but be careful... many people do not appreciate being told they're a different type without asking for such analyses. It's akin to giving unsolicited advice.


----------



## teddy564339

Leonyc14 said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ , I really think you are an ISFJ. I have met other ISFJ's and I believe this is your type. Of course, I may be wrong, but I feel pretty sure of this. I also think this is why you are attracted to dominant Ne as you've said before - because it is your inferior function.





pneumoceptor said:


> I really think I'm an INFJ, and I have also met many ISFJs!
> 
> It's interesting that you say this, because ISFJ and INFJ are much different than say INFJ and INTJ... not on the outside, but miles apart on the inside. Anyway, I respectfully disagree, due to my consuming internal models, my inattention to the past, my inattention to detail, and my preference for metaphor. But I'd be interested to know if any others agree with Leonyc14.
> 
> 
> BTW, not to go all Fe on you, but be careful... many people do not appreciate being told they're a different type without asking for such analyses. It's akin to giving unsolicited advice.



Yeah, I'm with pneumoceptor on this one...even though I don't know her extremely well, I got a much stronger INFJ vibe from her than ISFJ. Much stronger. 


And I'm ISFJ and I'm not attracted to dominant Ne. In fact, the Si/Ne conflict seems to be rampant on PerC....when a dom Si user and a dom Ne user gets together, there's a whole lot of friction and it can be very hard to work through it. 

If anything, I would guess pneumoceptor likes Ne because she's a dominant Ni user herself, and I think we often admire something that is foreign to us, yet in some ways similar. That's how I feel about Se; I greatly admire it, but I could never picture using it myself. It's a world apart from what I do; but yet, I can see how I can share some sensory vibes with SPs as opposed to how I relate with Ns.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Leonyc14 said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ , I really think you are an ISFJ. I have met other ISFJ's and I believe this is your type. Of course, I may be wrong, but I feel pretty sure of this. I also think this is why you are attracted to dominant Ne as you've said before - because it is your inferior function.


"I have met other ISFJs" isn't a real solid piece of evidence. pneumo's talked several times about all the ISFJs in her life. She's also said she's quite a bit different when she's not on camera "hosting" so to speak. And as to the last point, I am also attracted to "dominant Ne" and it's not my inferior function, so there goes that theory out the window too. :wink:



pneumoceptor said:


> Thanks! I still have some sensor gaps in my MBTI menagerie... after this weekend's ESFP chat (many thanks to @_Fat Bozo_ in advance), I would still like to find willing ISTJs, ESFJs, and ESTPs.


You're welcome in advance. It's been a while since I got to video chat with a hot internet celebrity chick! :happy:


----------



## Celebok

pneumoceptor said:


> BTW, not to go all Fe on you, but be careful... many people do not appreciate being told they're a different type without asking for such analyses. It's akin to giving unsolicited advice.


I would certainly encourage you or any one else with dom or aux Fe to go all Fe on us!  Besides, what you said is absolutely right! And Fe does a great job at communicating it in a respectful and non-harsh way.


----------



## Celebok

teddy564339 said:


> If anything, I would guess pneumoceptor likes Ne because she's a dominant Ni user herself, and I think we often admire something that is foreign to us, yet in some ways similar. That's how I feel about Se; I greatly admire it, but I could never picture using it myself. It's a world apart from what I do; but yet, I can see how I can share some sensory vibes with SPs as opposed to how I relate with Ns.


That's a really interesting observation. I seem to fit the same pattern -- I'm a dominant Ti user, and I happen to admire Te! I love watching when someone tries to start an argument with an INTJ, and the INTJ fires back a simple straightforward logical argument that makes the other person look stupid. (unless, of course, I'm that other person)


----------



## Leonyc14

Sorry for offending all you SF's here LOL... Me being INTP, this is nothing new to me... just confirms you're all SF... sorry!! Anyway, peace guys!! lol


----------



## Celebok

Speaking of which...



> Sorry for offending all you SF's here LOL... Me being INTP, this is nothing new to me... just confirms you're all SF... sorry!! Anyway, peace guys!! lol


Where's an INTJ when you need one? ;-)


----------



## Fat Bozo

Leonyc14 said:


> Sorry for offending all you SF's here LOL... Me being INTP, this is nothing new to me... just confirms you're all SF... sorry!! Anyway, peace guys!! lol





Celebok said:


> Speaking of which...
> Where's an INTJ when you need one? ;-)


No INTJ necessary on this one. :wink: 

Leo, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and just assume you're just messing with us. Because if not, you got a lot to learn about personality types...and...you know, people.


----------



## luemb

Celebok said:


> That's a really interesting observation. I seem to fit the same pattern -- I'm a dominant Ti user, and I happen to admire Te! I love watching when someone tries to start an argument with an INTJ, and the INTJ fires back a simple straightforward logical argument that makes the other person look stupid. (unless, of course, I'm that other person)


Thank you. I need to meet more people who appreciate Te... I'm always trying to hide it or something. 


Anyhow, no Te needed on this one, everyone behaved logically ;-)


----------



## luemb

hornet said:


> Yes the nice things about the supplement is how the function order lines up.
> Ni, Te, Fi, Se
> Fi, Se, Ni, Te
> 
> We each have the others weakest two as our two strongest functions.
> So every word the other person says becomes interesting and inspirational almost.


I agree! You gave me so many more ideas and tools about how to handle situations, and some helpful comments on how I appear to others. I've already used some of what you showed me to have a better idea of how I was coming across to others and try to make myself more clear through it. Even watching myself I could see that I don't display what I'm thinking very much, (which is a bit of a relief for me somehow... maybe because I'm usually anxious and am thinking a lot of different things so I'm glad that doesn't show) so I can express myself a bit more and still be "safe" I guess. And that's why a lot of people are uncomfortable around me, they don't know what I'm thinking/feeling so I should work on that. 



> Yeah I know, and I noticed that I was expecting external resistance when I did it,
> cause many people find it weird that I need to zone out to reorient myself when I've gotten
> more Ni "buffered" than I can handle. I need to go and sort it to some degree before I can continue.
> It is Fi needing to reassert dominance over an over-active Ni.
> Can't have unjudged information lying around.


It's fascinating watching someone else use Ni.  I knew what it was because that's what I look like when I'm thinking.

Also interesting that it needs to be handled like in a buffer for you, it comes from somewhere and needs sorted. For me it's simply drawn up, like from a well, or looking into a huge bucket of it and choosing what to go with.


----------



## Celebok

luemb said:


> Thank you. I need to meet more people who appreciate Te... I'm always trying to hide it or something.


That sucks. Pneumoceptor trying to hide her Fe, and now you trying to hide your Te... I really wish more people learned to appreciate each other's gifts and different ways of thinking. Ironically, I've felt pressured to be more of a judger than a perceiver throughout most of my life, and it even caused me to be mistyped as ISTJ multiple times because I'd taken on a judging persona. So that's kind of the opposite of wanting to hide an extraverted judging function.


----------



## Zero11

Leonyc14 said:


> Sorry for offending all you SF's here LOL... Me being INTP, this is nothing new to me... just confirms you're all SF... sorry!! Anyway, peace guys!! lol


*Troll detected*


----------



## Inveniet

luemb said:


> I agree! You gave me so many more ideas and tools about how to handle situations, and some helpful comments on how I appear to others. I've already used some of what you showed me to have a better idea of how I was coming across to others and try to make myself more clear through it. Even watching myself I could see that I don't display what I'm thinking very much, (which is a bit of a relief for me somehow... maybe because I'm usually anxious and am thinking a lot of different things so I'm glad that doesn't show) so I can express myself a bit more and still be "safe" I guess. And that's why a lot of people are uncomfortable around me, they don't know what I'm thinking/feeling so I should work on that.


Glad to hear that! I felt that what I was said was self-evident and was thinking.
Here she is saying all this great stuff and all i have to say are mundane stuff like this.




> It's fascinating watching someone else use Ni.  I knew what it was because that's what I look like when I'm thinking.
> 
> Also interesting that it needs to be handled like in a buffer for you, it comes from somewhere and needs sorted. For me it's simply drawn up, like from a well, or looking into a huge bucket of it and choosing what to go with.


You kinda get a mirror held up to yourself, i was surprised on my own reaction to Ni/Fi it was like wow.
Is this like how i sometimes come of? No wonder some people are scared off. 
however many of them I'm better off without...

Yeah i got the buffer idea from that interaction as I got more space to deal with it.
Usually i feel pressured to be done already... XD


----------



## luemb

hornet said:


> You kinda get a mirror held up to yourself, i was surprised on my own reaction to Ni/Fi it was like wow.
> Is this like how i sometimes come of? No wonder some people are scared off.
> however many of them I'm better off without...
> 
> Yeah i got the buffer idea from that interaction as I got more space to deal with it.
> Usually i feel pressured to be done already... XD


Why do you think people are scared off? I'm just trying to sort through an ocean of ideas, that shouldn't be harmful to anyone...


----------



## Inveniet

luemb said:


> Why do you think people are scared off? I'm just trying to sort through an ocean of ideas, that shouldn't be harmful to anyone...


Mostly because Fe users are trying to call you, but the number they are calling is not in use.
So they get scared and think that it means something really bad.
If they use Ne as well they might conjure up all sorts of scary stuff to scare them self to death
while you think about your stuff, oblivious to the trauma they create by all the projecting onto you.


----------



## luemb

hornet said:


> Mostly because Fe users are trying to call you, but the number they are calling is not in use.
> So they get scared and think that it means something really bad.
> If they use Ne as well they might conjure up all sorts of scary stuff to scare them self to death
> while you think about your stuff, oblivious to the trauma they create by all the projecting onto you.


Makes sense. I do try to keep the Fe line closed... I respond really negatively to Fe. 

Reminds me of the thread "feelers are blind to neutrality" where the INTJs were talking about what is actually a neutral statement is taken as a positive or a negative by F types simply because they see everything as either "good" or "bad." Not to restart that conversation, but I'm pretty sure I go for a neutral expression most of the time, and it's completely strange to me that people see that as negative. Heh. I'm completely harmless.

Fascinating learning that people experience the world in so many different ways. I would have never guessed on some of this stuff, especially if it doesn't make sense with Te. 

Anyhow, I'm heading out to visit friends for the weekend, lots of socializing, so I'll try out some of the ideas.


----------



## viva

Note: me and @innovati _did_ do a type interaction video last weekend (and it's not split-screen, but actually sitting side-by-side!) 

Buuuut it's currently sitting on his computer, unposted, waiting to be edited by him because he craves perfection and deeply fears authenticity and candor.

Just kidding, but actually it's over an hour long and nobody really wants to see that. Whenever he gets bored and edits it, it will be posted here. :kitteh:


----------



## Inguz

Hello again!

Me and @firedell has decided to make an ISFP-ISFP video, so we'll need some questions that will get people interested. Otherwise it will be two ISFP's rambling about and not making any progress or giving people any insights. There has to be fun questions as well!

So, from now until we record the video I'll write down questions and save them for the discussion. Ask on!


----------



## firedell

Inguz said:


> Hello again!
> 
> Me and @_firedell_ has decided to make an ISFP-ISFP video, so we'll need some questions that will get people interested. Otherwise it will be two ISFP's rambling about and not making any progress or giving people any insights. There has to be fun questions as well!
> 
> So, from now until we record the video I'll write down questions and save them for the discussion. Ask on!


Muhahaha! You made the post. I win.


----------



## Inguz

firedell said:


> Muhahaha! You made the post. I win.


Tsk, it makes me look crafty and you lazy, so win all you want.


----------



## firedell

Inguz said:


> Tsk, it makes me look crafty and you lazy, so win all you want.


Sad times.


----------



## Hycocritical truth teller

Wow this is really interesting.


----------



## teddy564339

luemb said:


> Makes sense. I do try to keep the Fe line closed... I respond really negatively to Fe.
> 
> Reminds me of the thread "feelers are blind to neutrality" where the INTJs were talking about what is actually a neutral statement is taken as a positive or a negative by F types simply because they see everything as either "good" or "bad." Not to restart that conversation, but I'm pretty sure I go for a neutral expression most of the time, and it's completely strange to me that people see that as negative. Heh. I'm completely harmless.
> 
> Fascinating learning that people experience the world in so many different ways. I would have never guessed on some of this stuff, especially if it doesn't make sense with Te.
> 
> Anyhow, I'm heading out to visit friends for the weekend, lots of socializing, so I'll try out some of the ideas.



I don't want to derail things, and I know you won't be able to respond for a few days. But this is one topic that I'm still working on getting a better feel for.


I think what's confusing to me is that "positive", "negative" and "neutral" are all so dependent upon one's perspective (and this may be my Ti telling me this). I've noticed that with NTJs this is much more confusing to me than with STJs. I'm assuming that NTJs do find things negative, neutral and positive, but it's much harder for me to tell which is which for them. With STJs, it feels much more clear to me...I understand how they value things. With NTJs, I think I can get a feel for how they view others' emotional reactions as negative, but not as much as positive...and I can't get a feel for how they view their own actions as positive or negative either. 


A recent example of this is the INTJ Razor's post # 16 in this thread:

http://personalitycafe.com/isfj-forum-nurturers/50652-married-intj-2.html

I think as the INTJ LXPilot described in post # 14 in that thread, I think Fe and Te have a way of both thinking they're helping the other, whereas the other side usually doesn't feel that way.

I found Razor's post to be negative, but I imagine he not only found it neutral, but that his intentions were positive. And I do see some positive in his post, because I think there was some sound advice at the end. But I didn't know how else to feel about his post other than negative. Knowing how INTJs think, I've been able to learn to not respond emotionally, and not engage in a Te/Fe set of frustrations.


So it's a topic I'm still working my way through.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Zero11 said:


> *Troll detected*


I think this thread has finally made it!


----------



## pneumoceptor

luemb said:


> Makes sense. I do try to keep the Fe line closed... I respond really negatively to Fe.


You knew it was coming (maybe)... *all* Fe?


----------



## pneumoceptor

W00t for another intuitive-sensor video. I present my chat with (the very funny and articulate) @Fat Bozo:


----------



## teddy564339

Another fantastic video chat. I really enjoyed hearing a conversation so focused on SPs in general because I think it's something I've read about in books much more than seen discussed on PerC.


The first thing that jumped out to me is that I got a better sense of what Fat Bozo meant about feeling more "individualistic" in one of his earlier posts in this thread. I know he said he hated it when people try to name functions in conversations, but I really did pick up a bit of an Fi vibe from that vs. my own feeling of Fe. For me, I feel a very strong drive to connect with people...though in my case, I think it's very activity driven, tapping into my S side. I really like knowing that I can enjoy an experience with someone who is just as into it as I am. I appreciate diversity too....but I don't think I strive to be unique nearly as strongly as how Fat Bozo described he felt. 




The education discussion I found very fascinating because I'm actually a high school math teacher myself (I didn't want to bring it up too much in this thread because I hate getting into exact discussions about how teaching involves certain types, just because of the extreme limitations of our education system on teaching and learning for all kids). But I completely agreed with the points both Fat Bozo and pneumoceptor made about the system in general...the whole idea that it tries to make all kids the same and doesn't adhere to their individual needs. This is an immensely complex topic, but I really think that it would take a whole lot more money and resources to do this...and not only are we currently in hard economic times, but I personally don't think the average person cares all that much about education to support that kind of financial investment. In my experience, people care about the education system when they're in it, forget about it once they get a job, and then care about it again when their kids go through it. 

Anyway...I do completely agree with the points made about how hard it is to cater to kids' needs when there are so many different kids of different types among other things. Even the part about Fat Bozo mentioning how trapped he felt as a kid when his dad told him to be quiet in the car. I see these conflicts every day; some kids like being noisy, some want it quiet. The nosiy ones get on the quiet ones' nerves, and the noisy ones get frustrated when they have to be quiet. All I can do as a teacher is try to find a compromise, and that's hard because everyone then has to accept being frustrated sometimes.

And the whole N vs. SJ thing that pneumoceptor mentioned pops up all of the time too; it's so hard to teach when kids all go at their own pace. Some are bored because they want to move on, some are frustrated because they're being left behind. It's so tough when each kid has their own needs. So I'm really glad to hear the input you guys had on it.

But I also really liked how Fat Bozo mentioned how every kid, no matter who their type is, has trouble with things. Not only is he right about how SPs have trouble like Ns do, but sometimes people act like SJs have it easy in life because we're "in control". I'm not going to deny that SJs benefit from a lot of things about society, but sometimes I think PerC members ignore some of the things that are difficult for us as well. 

And I also found it interesting to see how Fat Bozo balanced out the SP individuality of he and his son with the reality of needing to go through school to keep opportunities open.


I enjoyed the college discussion as well, especially because it drives what happens in high school classes as well. It's tough when professors teach because they have to and may not care about it at all...and that's the model that high school is designed to "prepare" kids for.

And it's tough because when there are so many kids, there has to be a certain amount of structure....which leads to it being so SJ dominated. It's a tough thing to balance out individuality and organization as well. You don't want utter chaos, but you don't want fascism either.


I found the N desire to list out all of the possibilities to be an interesting one, because just like Fat Bozo, I don't need all of those extra possibilities. And unlike Fat Bozo, I wouldn't like the idea of changing on the spot in the car. For me, I'm more simple than either of the two; I just need one thing and will stick with it. That's the "boring" aspect of having dominant Si. 

So it's funny to hear that J vs. P different. 

And to answer pneuo's question, I think SJs are more rigid than NJs in that regard. :tongue: I can admit that much. 


I found the SJ vs. SP work environment was another very interesting topic. It was interesting to hear how the SJs got frustrated from having their plans changed, because I really do think Si makes it hard for us to adapt on the spot. We just have so much we have to plan out and take our time with to succeed. 

I do think it was interesting to hear the STJs being frustrated by the details not being in place as well. I'm probably more chilled out about that kind of thing...I even find a number of SJs at work to be too uptight over little things. But it goes back to what I said about different things irritating different people...SJs being irritated by details not being in place, and SPs being irritated by being confined. It's always interesting to hear about the different difficulties that people have with things. 

I think Fat Bozo is exactly right about feeling the desire to grit their teeth and just work through something to stay steady. For the most part, despite our complaints, we would much rather do that than deal with things being up in the air. It's like you said, it's our strength.


Finally, it was interesting to hear Fat Bozo talk about how in the present he was...because to me it was a great example of Se. It's funny because I do think my Si makes me focus on the past a lot. The funny thing is that one of the best ways for me to enjoy the moment is to reflect on the past! For me, this doesn't make me feel like I'm wasting the moment like an Se user would feel. So I love seeing the Se/Si difference...I'm continually fascinated by how different SJs and SPs are.



So that was a cool chat! To be honest, I found it easier to understand than some of the really deep N conversations that have been in some of the other chats...things didn't go over my head as much!


----------



## Fridays

pneumoceptor said:


> W00t for another intuitive-sensor video. I present my chat with (the very funny and articulate) @_Fat Bozo_:



I laugh and I cry.. I recognize myself in this ~ so much. It pained, and it was healing in many ways. More than you can imagine. Thank you!


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> W00t for another intuitive-sensor video. I present my chat with (the very funny and articulate) @_Fat Bozo_:


best videos EVERRRRRRRR


----------



## Fridays

We really need you ISFJ's. Please do not think you ISFJ are boring, *teddy564339.

*


----------



## Inveniet

New vid, with @_hallrann_ INFJ.
It was a very interesting conversation about lots of stuff. Ni/Se Fe/Fi and so on, all that good stuff.
2 hours seem to be the norm so that what it became.
Enjoy! =D

***Ignore the tech issues the first 3 minutes*** XD


----------



## Inguz

Inguz said:


> Hello again!
> 
> Me and @_firedell_ has decided to make an ISFP-ISFP video, so we'll need some questions that will get people interested. Otherwise it will be two ISFP's rambling about and not making any progress or giving people any insights. There has to be fun questions as well!
> 
> So, from now until we record the video I'll write down questions and save them for the discussion. Ask on!


^ Important message!


----------



## Inveniet

Inguz said:


> ^ Important message!


Do the other person strike you as what you would expect an ISFP to be?
(In other words how do they match or break the stereotype)


----------



## Inveniet

So I got the opportunity to have two vid chats today! =)
Yeah I know lucky me!! ;p

This time it was with @_Fat Bozo_ ESFP
The nice thing about this conversation was that we got to lift the converstaion to a more 
*real* level than many of the other abstract vids and attack it from a more concrete view.
I definately got a lot out of this talk and i hope everyone else does too.
And guess what?
We managed to keep it at only 2 hours, even though Fat Bozo *kinda wanted* to do 4! XD


----------



## viva

Okie doke, below is the video of me and @innovati :kitteh: (ENFP + INFJ interaction) I edited it down from over an hour of footage so please don't be alarmed if it seems a bit jumpy in spots!


----------



## Fridays

hornet said:


> So I got the opportunity to have two vid chats today! =)
> Yeah I know lucky me!! ;p
> 
> This time it was with @_Fat Bozo_ ESFP
> The nice thing about this conversation was that we got to lift the converstaion to a more
> *real* level than many of the other abstract vids and attack it from a more concrete view.
> I definately got a lot out of this talk and i hope everyone else does too.
> And guess what?
> We managed to keep it at only 2 hours, even though Fat Bozo *kinda wanted* to do 4! XD


*I watched the whole video! *hihi! Interesting!









Good to see and hear you communicate.
Thank you for making this.









_(I have a lots of fun experience of ISFP in my life, it is good to see ISFPs and ESFPs communicate.)_


----------



## luemb

pneumoceptor said:


> You knew it was coming (maybe)... *all* Fe?


No idea. I have no idea what the clear boundaries of Fe and not-Fe are. Does such a thing exist?

I respond very negatively to people trying/expecting me to share my feelings about something, or to participate in group sharing of values and feelings, or to participate in group emotional gossip and judgement. I probably appear to get a really frustrated look on my face and then storm away (at least, that's what a Fe user would see, from my perspective I'm just removing myself from a situation with no judgement on the people in question, I just don't want to participate in the activity). I am probably better at handling little bits of Fe in a one-on-one situation (as I'm an sp/sx), but, even, especially, with my closest friends, if they *ask* me (or make me feel like I'm being forced) to tell or engage in sharing my feelings about something when I don't want to or don't have any I would probably exit stage left or express my complete distaste for doing that. 

That's not to say I don't have feelings, I do, but I hate feeling compelled to share them, especially since I don't always have well-thought-out feelings about everything... most of the time they are just a tiny voice in the back of my head. 

EDIT: I don't mind watching Fe in action, and can use logic to understand what the Fe users are communicating to each others. I can try to fake some "simple Fe" (like validating others if I think they are right) but I'm pretty sure it comes across as fake, but the "strong Fe" I can't compel myself to participate in, even if I wanted to.

I also have no idea why you are asking this question. I'm hoping my Ni will kick in soon.


----------



## Juggernaut

I want to do this, BUT I HAVE NO ONE. Unless I get my INFP friend to do it... But then it'd just be us being nerds... I... HOW DO.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Juggernaut said:


> I want to do this, BUT I HAVE NO ONE. Unless I get my INFP friend to do it... But then it'd just be us being nerds... I... HOW DO.


What do you mean you "have no one?"


----------



## pneumoceptor

luemb said:


> No idea. I have no idea what the clear boundaries of Fe and not-Fe are. Does such a thing exist?
> 
> I respond very negatively to people trying/expecting me to share my feelings about something, or to participate in group sharing of values and feelings, or to participate in group emotional gossip and judgement. I probably appear to get a really frustrated look on my face and then storm away (at least, that's what a Fe user would see, from my perspective I'm just removing myself from a situation with no judgement on the people in question, I just don't want to participate in the activity). I am probably better at handling little bits of Fe in a one-on-one situation (as I'm an sp/sx), but, even, especially, with my closest friends, if they *ask* me (or make me feel like I'm being forced) to tell or engage in sharing my feelings about something when I don't want to or don't have any I would probably exit stage left or express my complete distaste for doing that.
> 
> That's not to say I don't have feelings, I do, but I hate feeling compelled to share them, especially since I don't always have well-thought-out feelings about everything... most of the time they are just a tiny voice in the back of my head.
> 
> EDIT: I don't mind watching Fe in action, and can use logic to understand what the Fe users are communicating to each others. I can try to fake some "simple Fe" (like validating others if I think they are right) but I'm pretty sure it comes across as fake, but the "strong Fe" I can't compel myself to participate in, even if I wanted to.
> 
> I also have no idea why you are asking this question. I'm hoping my Ni will kick in soon.


I appreciate your candor. What you're describing actually sounds negative to me as well. I balk when others expect me to share my feelings about things (key word: expect). I don't mind if they ask me what I think, but I want to feel the freedom to respond or not respond, depending on any number of factors.

I actually wouldn't define Fe as "pushing for sharing" or "expecting others to divulge feelings". I would define Fe as drawing conclusions based on personal evaluations, often relational, about one's environment. In effect, judging based on external evaluations, with a bent toward people/relationships and the desire to affect one's environment. I'd define Te as drawing conclusions based on impersonal evaluations, often based on systems/concepts, about one's environment... judging based on external thoughts, with a bent toward systems/the impersonal and the desire to affect one's environment. I think healthy Fe takes into account others' desires and doesn't push in the ways you described.


----------



## luemb

teddy564339 said:


> I don't want to derail things, and I know you won't be able to respond for a few days. But this is one topic that I'm still working on getting a better feel for.
> 
> 
> I think what's confusing to me is that "positive", "negative" and "neutral" are all so dependent upon one's perspective (and this may be my Ti telling me this). I've noticed that with NTJs this is much more confusing to me than with STJs. I'm assuming that NTJs do find things negative, neutral and positive, but it's much harder for me to tell which is which for them. With STJs, it feels much more clear to me...I understand how they value things. With NTJs, I think I can get a feel for how they view others' emotional reactions as negative, but not as much as positive...and I can't get a feel for how they view their own actions as positive or negative either.


Hmmm NTJs use Ni-Te or Te-Ni. 

You understand neutrality though? I'll just recap for everyone else. 

Easy example: "The apple is red." It's easy to see there is nothing good or bad about that, it's just a fact. 

Hard example: "You should let me drive." This happened tonight. The driver was tired after driving for a long time, I could tell he was feeling tired because he was adjusting his positions and rubbing the back of his neck, ect. I could sort of see something bad happening. Because I hadn't driven yet my mind was fresher, and, although tired myself, I wasn't burnt out yet. But because he felt responsible, like he expected himself to drive it all the way, he insisted on driving the rest of the way. I should have insisted though, because later he nodded off and we just about hit the ditch. It was not a judgement on him or calling him weak or anything, it was simply a fact that he was getting tired, and it was unsafe for him to drive, and it would have been better for me to drive. (I've used qualifiers throughout this explanation, to highlight that I can use these in neutral (ie pure logic) ways.)

Ok so back to NTJs. With Ni, it's really hard for things to be negative or positive... things are simply understood as a way of the world. Not to say that NTJs will accept "because that's the way it is" which they won't, but Ni is willing to accept all possible personal perspectives to be right, in some way or another.

For example, I can't say it's wrong for water to flow downhill, it just does. I can't say "Fe is wrong" because it's not. It's just different. 

I can't speak for INTJs in general, but I can share how I think. 

It's hard to judge someone. I can tell that someone is being childish, but, because I only see that, and not their specific actions, I can't say "don't say X." All I think is "Person X is in a state of childishness. It's not good to be childish because you could be mature, logical and reasonable." (where _childishness_ is an inner state of selfish feelings and making demands on others and whining.) *I understand other people's perspectives and inner states, and how that is influencing what they are saying, and I can't judge them for it, because that's just the way it is*. I might try to change external circumstances to promote growth, or to help them see what is going on in themselves, but just telling them straight-up "You're being childish" isn't going to work. (I speak from experience. Patience, gentleness, or sarcasm generally work better than straight-up conversation, unless they ask, then straight-up, honest, conversing is good.)

I'm not saying I understand everything, just that I look at the world and see it from other people's perspectives and I can see how it makes sense to them to do what they did. If that is some idea or perspective that I believe is undeveloped, or needs changed, (usually Fi helps me with this) then I will perhaps feel that personally, and state that personally I believe that their perspective is wrong and it could be looked into to be updated. If it's leading to some illogical (contrary to logical reason, or to the present data) conclusion, then I can help them sort that out. Also, if it's contrary to something else they've already said, then I might point that out. Otherwise, most things are accepted as "that's their perspective, and it's fine."


----------



## luemb

pneumoceptor said:


> I appreciate your candor. What you're describing actually sounds negative to me as well. I balk when others expect me to share my feelings about things (key word: expect). I don't mind if they ask me what I think, but I want to feel the freedom to respond or not respond, depending on any number of factors.
> 
> I actually wouldn't define Fe as "pushing for sharing" or "expecting others to divulge feelings". I would define Fe as drawing conclusions based on personal evaluations, often relational, about one's environment. In effect, judging based on external evaluations, with a bent toward people/relationships and the desire to affect one's environment. I'd define Te as drawing conclusions based on impersonal evaluations, often based on systems/concepts, about one's environment... judging based on external thoughts, with a bent toward systems/the impersonal and the desire to affect one's environment. I think healthy Fe takes into account others' desires and doesn't push in the ways you described.


Ok. I've felt required to engage in group sharing before and always associated that with Fe... mostly I just leave anyhow. Even if the shared value is a value that I also hold. It just feels wrong to me somehow, devalued or something. 

Just to clarify, Te can also take other's needs/desires into account, especially in tandem with Fi. 

Hmmm I have that odd feeling of reading words and not really understanding what they are saying... "I would define Fe as drawing conclusions based on personal evaluations, often relational, about one's environment." By personal evaluations you mean labelling things "good" or "bad" and by relational you choose these labels based on how one thing relates to another, like X is better than Y? How does this even work if you don't have a reason on which to base these evaluations? (or is this a silly question to ask...)

So because I don't do personal evaluations of things at all (it's in complete contrariness of Ni-Te to do that) this really confuses people on where I stand?


----------



## Inveniet

Fat Bozo said:


> What do you mean you "have no one?"


I'll make a set of assumptions here. 
@Juggernaut is trying to hint that it would be nice to chat with someone here!
Cause she feels that catting with INFP friend just wouldn't cut it.
If so, I could probably chat with you Juggernaut, maybe we will solve an enigma or two. =)


----------



## pneumoceptor

luemb said:


> Ok. I've felt required to engage in group sharing before and always associated that with Fe... mostly I just leave anyhow. Even if the shared value is a value that I also hold. It just feels wrong to me somehow, devalued or something.


Makes sense to me. Again, I can feel that way too. Not always, but I have before, depending on the group and the level of rapport/vulnerability/what have you.



> Just to clarify, Te can also take other's needs/desires into account, especially in tandem with Fi.


Agreed!



> Hmmm I have that odd feeling of reading words and not really understanding what they are saying... "I would define Fe as drawing conclusions based on personal evaluations, often relational, about one's environment." By personal evaluations you mean labelling things "good" or "bad" and by relational you choose these labels based on how one thing relates to another, like X is better than Y? How does this even work if you don't have a reason on which to base these evaluations? (or is this a silly question to ask...)


Yeah, my sentence was pretty clunky. I guess I'd say that my Fe judgments are not necessarily black and white, good or bad. There's plenty of gray. 

But on a more fundamental level, I would say that Fe is simply a judging function that focuses more on the external than Fi does and pays more attention/places more weight on interpersonal dynamics than Te or Ti do. 



> So because I don't do personal evaluations of things at all (it's in complete contrariness of Ni-Te to do that) this really confuses people on where I stand?


I'm interested in this. You don't think your statement that group sharing feels wrong is a personal evaluation? I mean, you don't think it is an Fi judgment?


----------



## Inveniet

Fridays said:


> *I watched the whole video! *hihi! Interesting!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good to see and hear you communicate.
> Thank you for making this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _(I have a lots of fun experience of ISFP in my life, it is good to see ISFPs and ESFPs communicate.)_


You are welcome!
I felt I got to understand ESFPs so much better from this.
It was funny that @Fat Bozo didn't trust or care about anything more that the most basic Ni usage.
Do you resonate with his sentiments in that area?


----------



## Juggernaut

hornet said:


> I'll make a set of assumptions here.
> @_Juggernaut_ is trying to hint that it would be nice to chat with someone here!
> Cause she feels that catting with INFP friend just wouldn't cut it.
> If so, I could probably chat with you Juggernaut, maybe we will solve an enigma or two. =)


This is exactly what I mean. Take an INTP such as myself out of the familiar. I think that is much more interesting... That would definitely work when I have time.... I am a big procrastinator. I am genuine when I say I would love to chat D: just... Nervous... Kind of.


----------



## Inveniet

Juggernaut said:


> This is exactly what I mean. Take an INTP such as myself out of the familiar. I think that is much more interesting... That would definitely work when I have time.... I am a big procrastinator. I am genuine when I say I would love to chat D: just... Nervous... Kind of.


I know what you mean, I felt nervous too the first time I was to do a vid a couple of years back.
Let me know when you feel ready and have time to do one by sending me a PM. =)
Hopefully I'll have time too!


----------



## Calvaire

This is the FIRST time I've ever even came across this thread Why?

I Want to do one of these.

Anyone down for interacting with a female INFP?


----------



## Inveniet

Calvaire said:


> This is the FIRST time I've ever even came across this thread Why?
> 
> I Want to do one of these.
> 
> Anyone down for interacting with a female INFP?


I feel on a roll right now, so why not. =)
Well work it out over PM.


----------



## fihe

I think I'd be willing to participate in this project. I've been typed as an INTJ but sometimes I wonder if I could be S or P instead. maybe it would help to have someone else see how I behave. I HATE how I sound on video but I'll suck it up.


----------



## luemb

pneumoceptor said:


> I'm interested in this. You don't think your statement that group sharing feels wrong is a personal evaluation? I mean, you don't think it is an Fi judgment?


I guess I was a little unclear. What I meant was I don't usually express my personal evaluations, especially not on my face or with body language in the moment. Usually I'm trying to express that I'm accepting people the way they are by using a neutral look on my face and a smile, Most of the time I'm concentrating on understanding and accepting what's going on, not on expressing a feeling valuation of whatever is being expressed. 

When I say that group sharing feels wrong, it isn't an intellectual or mental feeling. It's more like a body or gut feeling. It's connected to some of my 9 and 1 boundaries on what I am comfortable doing. I've tried to explain it to myself by saying it is probably a sense of Fi being devalued in a large group situation, but I don't actually think that in the moment. I just think "this is stupid, I don't want to be here" and walk away. 

Yes I do do personal evaluations, but they are often Fi evaluations of possible Ni concepts. Some ways of looking at the world I have decided are the wrong way to look at the world because they are disrespectful to the individuals that I interact with and because I would hate to be treated that way myself. I avoid thinking about the world that way and have alternative ways to look at the world.

For example, I don't believe that lying is right. However, I don't believe that being serious and only speaking the exact truth all the time is right either, you can speak a truth through sarcasm or joking, even though it's not a literal truth. I don't hold any one else to this belief, this is something that I figured out to guide myself.

Since I don't normally feel comfortable to talk about what Ni realized, and since Fi's basic principle is respect of other's individuality, I don't usually express my value judgements.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Calvaire said:


> This is the FIRST time I've ever even came across this thread Why?
> 
> I Want to do one of these.
> 
> Anyone down for interacting with a female INFP?


Yes. Yes I am. You had me at female. :wink:


----------



## Calvaire

Fat Bozo said:


> Yes. Yes I am. You had me at female. :wink:


lol It would be interesting to interact with an ESFP (well on this site) my teenage best friend/first love was one of you guys and I think ESFP's are prety awesome : )


----------



## pneumoceptor

@luemb, thanks for the detailed explanation. That makes sense to me, and I appreciate you sharing your insides.


----------



## Juggernaut

hornet said:


> I feel on a roll right now, so why not. =)
> Well work it out over PM.


"On a roll," huh? AND I THOUGHT I WAS SPECIAL, I jest. I knew you had a video with others. But inwardly my mind is saying "DON'T SPOIL HIM WITH ACCEPTING A INTERACTION... THING."



fihe said:


> I think I'd be willing to participate in this project. I've been typed as an INTJ but sometimes I wonder if I could be S or P instead. maybe it would help to have someone else see how I behave. I HATE how I sound on video but I'll suck it up.


INTJ, huh? As an INTP I'm sure we might notice subtle differences or we might be exactly the same. Then that'll leave me in confusion.. And then who would start the conversation? Oh god. In any case, I am hoping to get out of my fear of social interaction and I think one of these would be good... Maybe? Thing is: trying to get me to actually do it.


----------



## Inveniet

Juggernaut said:


> "On a roll," huh? AND I THOUGHT I WAS SPECIAL, I jest. I knew you had a video with others. But inwardly my mind is saying "DON'T SPOIL HIM WITH ACCEPTING A INTERACTION... THING."


Well if you hurry you will become my first INTP interaction vid. ;-)


----------



## pneumoceptor

teddy564339 said:


> Another fantastic video chat. I really enjoyed hearing a conversation so focused on SPs in general because I think it's something I've read about in books much more than seen discussed on PerC.
> 
> 
> The first thing that jumped out to me is that I got a better sense of what Fat Bozo meant about feeling more "individualistic" in one of his earlier posts in this thread. I know he said he hated it when people try to name functions in conversations, but I really did pick up a bit of an Fi vibe from that vs. my own feeling of Fe. For me, I feel a very strong drive to connect with people...though in my case, I think it's very activity driven, tapping into my S side. I really like knowing that I can enjoy an experience with someone who is just as into it as I am. I appreciate diversity too....but I don't think I strive to be unique nearly as strongly as how Fat Bozo described he felt.


Agreed... I got a lot of Fi from Fat Bozo. I actually find it to be beautiful in many ways.



> The education discussion I found very fascinating because I'm actually a high school math teacher myself (I didn't want to bring it up too much in this thread because I hate getting into exact discussions about how teaching involves certain types, just because of the extreme limitations of our education system on teaching and learning for all kids). But I completely agreed with the points both Fat Bozo and pneumoceptor made about the system in general...the whole idea that it tries to make all kids the same and doesn't adhere to their individual needs. This is an immensely complex topic, but I really think that it would take a whole lot more money and resources to do this...and not only are we currently in hard economic times, but I personally don't think the average person cares all that much about education to support that kind of financial investment. In my experience, people care about the education system when they're in it, forget about it once they get a job, and then care about it again when their kids go through it.
> 
> Anyway...I do completely agree with the points made about how hard it is to cater to kids' needs when there are so many different kids of different types among other things. Even the part about Fat Bozo mentioning how trapped he felt as a kid when his dad told him to be quiet in the car. I see these conflicts every day; some kids like being noisy, some want it quiet. The nosiy ones get on the quiet ones' nerves, and the noisy ones get frustrated when they have to be quiet. All I can do as a teacher is try to find a compromise, and that's hard because everyone then has to accept being frustrated sometimes.


Yeah, it's a very difficult problem, mainly due to lack of resources. Although we can point out all of the ways in which the system fails, we don't have any good solutions to fix those within the confines of the resources available.

I enjoy your thorough assessments of chats, teddy!


----------



## Fridays

hornet 
I must say it was *TOUGH* recognition - overall.








It's probably the first time that I experienced it. Even my partner was surprised at the similarities in thought, and in the way to be "one step a head" with a joke







_(but not all understand the "serious" jokes at first, but you're ISFP so you got them almost at once!)_
I think it's great that more sensor videos gets available on youtube.

And to see you talking to each other was like (almost) "being with myself", hehe! Yeah I think you get what I'm trying to say. 
I hope so!


----------



## renna

viva said:


> Okie doke, below is the video of me and @innovati :kitteh: (ENFP + INFJ interaction) I edited it down from over an hour of footage so please don't be alarmed if it seems a bit jumpy in spots!


This was pretty fun to watch, I must say!! You guys seem really close which changed the dynamics of this whole "interaction" concept. I dig, I dig ;-)


----------



## teddy564339

luemb said:


> Hmmm NTJs use Ni-Te or Te-Ni.
> 
> You understand neutrality though? I'll just recap for everyone else.
> 
> Easy example: "The apple is red." It's easy to see there is nothing good or bad about that, it's just a fact.
> 
> Hard example: "You should let me drive." This happened tonight. The driver was tired after driving for a long time, I could tell he was feeling tired because he was adjusting his positions and rubbing the back of his neck, ect. I could sort of see something bad happening. Because I hadn't driven yet my mind was fresher, and, although tired myself, I wasn't burnt out yet. But because he felt responsible, like he expected himself to drive it all the way, he insisted on driving the rest of the way. I should have insisted though, because later he nodded off and we just about hit the ditch. It was not a judgement on him or calling him weak or anything, it was simply a fact that he was getting tired, and it was unsafe for him to drive, and it would have been better for me to drive. (I've used qualifiers throughout this explanation, to highlight that I can use these in neutral (ie pure logic) ways.)


I think one thing I've noticed that sometimes contributes to a problem, at least on my end, is the S/N communication in terms of how many details are offered. Upon reading your description here with all of the details included, then I find the statement not only neutral and logical, but also extremely helpful and necessary.

However, if the statement had been by itself, without all of the explanation behind it, then I would be more confused about the intent behind it, and I wouldn't be sure what other thoughts went with it. As you mentioned, I would want to put a positive or a negative intent behind it. And I think what happens sometimes in reality my Si would desire more clear details (especially since my inferior Ne would have a lot of trouble filling in the gaps), and I think sometimes Ns find these details very cumbersome and irritating, since their intuition helps them to make some of these jumps without them. So I think that definitely contributes to me getting along better with STJs rather than NTJs...because the details help me get a further understanding of the intent.


So for me, when I hear a statement of a situation and I'm unclear on the details, sometimes I can interpret a neutral statement in a negative way....because I guess it just unsettles me not knowing what the intent of the person is. 





luemb said:


> Ok so back to NTJs. With Ni, it's really hard for things to be negative or positive... things are simply understood as a way of the world. Not to say that NTJs will accept "because that's the way it is" which they won't, but Ni is willing to accept all possible personal perspectives to be right, in some way or another.
> 
> For example, I can't say it's wrong for water to flow downhill, it just does. I can't say "Fe is wrong" because it's not. It's just different.


It's interesting, because in some ways I feel the same as you do and in some ways I don't. In general I try to understand where people are coming from and why they feel/think/do things the way they do (and in my case, I think this is a result of Fe). At the same time, though...there are times when I get overwhelmed by emotional feelings of hurt that make it difficult for there not to be negative feelings (or positive ones when the situation involves joy). 



luemb said:


> I can't speak for INTJs in general, but I can share how I think.
> 
> It's hard to judge someone. I can tell that someone is being childish, but, because I only see that, and not their specific actions, I can't say "don't say X." All I think is "Person X is in a state of childishness. It's not good to be childish because you could be mature, logical and reasonable." (where _childishness_ is an inner state of selfish feelings and making demands on others and whining.) *I understand other people's perspectives and inner states, and how that is influencing what they are saying, and I can't judge them for it, because that's just the way it is*. I might try to change external circumstances to promote growth, or to help them see what is going on in themselves, but just telling them straight-up "You're being childish" isn't going to work. (I speak from experience. Patience, gentleness, or sarcasm generally work better than straight-up conversation, unless they ask, then straight-up, honest, conversing is good.)


I actually overall feel the same way that you about this. I think it's interesting because I can definitely see variation in type regarding it...I have seen/heard about both ISFJs and INTJs who don't seem to feel the same way. 



luemb said:


> I'm not saying I understand everything, just that I look at the world and see it from other people's perspectives and I can see how it makes sense to them to do what they did. If that is some idea or perspective that I believe is undeveloped, or needs changed, (usually Fi helps me with this) then I will perhaps feel that personally, and state that personally I believe that their perspective is wrong and it could be looked into to be updated. If it's leading to some illogical (contrary to logical reason, or to the present data) conclusion, then I can help them sort that out. Also, if it's contrary to something else they've already said, then I might point that out. Otherwise, most things are accepted as "that's their perspective, and it's fine."


Again, overall I feel pretty much the same way. I think the only "blind spot" I have in this area is if I feel like someone has a false perception of me personally...I think I tend to feel a need to "change" their perception of me, since I have a hard time letting go of anyone viewing me in that way.


----------



## fihe

um...I guess any of you just send me a private message if you'd like to do videos together. I'm not sure of who to select myself.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

viva said:


> Okie doke, below is the video of me and @_innovati_ :kitteh: (ENFP + INFJ interaction) I edited it down from over an hour of footage so please don't be alarmed if it seems a bit jumpy in spots!


Funny, cute, silly NFs! So fun. I definitely relate to the 'good/bad person radar'! I also am an INFJ enneagram Type 2 and I really hated having to tell people what I charged when I was teaching voice lessons - blah! I am very impressed @innovati that you are tackling that beast of freelancing! Way to go! I have a feeling that all the best parts of the conversation either happened off camera or were edited out - but there was still a lingering 'NF' 'in-sync-ness' in the air so I think it helped get the picture across. What do you guys think - - is it an N/S or T/F or any function thing for people to pick up on the unspoken? So much is said when it isn't said right??

Anyway - my INTP was laughing at me watching this because I had my earphones in and he pointed at me and said - 'you're smiling'....I had forgotten he was in the room because I had so many things going on in my head while I smirked and laughed with you guys. One of my long-term friends (going on 15+ years!!) is an ENFP. Hooray for the INFJ/ENFP connection! Ciao ~


----------



## luemb

@teddy564339

Yes I purposely put the details in for you. It wouldn't be clear if it was positive, negative, or neutral unless you knew the reasoning behind it. In real life, you can tell what the reasoning behind something must be once you get to know someone and see how they think. Hopefully. Like how I mentioned that he probably felt responsible to drive all the way... I guessed that because I know him, not because he said it. On the other hand, if a feeler can't imagine making a statement that isn't positive or negative, then they are missing out on a ton of understanding of what a T is thinking. But you understand that. 


I guess I never really answered your original question about how NTJs view feelings as positive or negative or neutral, or view their own actions as positive, negative or neutral. The reason I couldn't answer it is because I had no idea. I think the reasoning is, if emotions get in the way of logic, then they are bad. Anything else is neutral. Personally, I like feeling peaceful. But that's not a Feeling-value, that's a bodily state. As to my own actions... many different NTJs have different sets of morals as to what are the right things to do. In fact, every NTJ has their own morals. How do I express myself when my own actions have gone against my morals? I feel pretty bad, I would apologise if I've hurt anyone through it, and I would look into making sure it never happens again. When my own actions are correct, there is no positive to it. I simply expect that. I guess even if I did want to express a feeling-value to someone else, unless I was really really close to them it would only be through the lens of Te.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> W00t for another intuitive-sensor video. I present my chat with (the very funny and articulate) @_Fat Bozo_:


Hey cool! I recognize you @Fat Bozo from Youtube! I've enjoyed your vids there and it was really fun to hear you elaborate and add more with pneumoceptor. What a fascinating thing to have an ESFP parent with an XSTP! Hmm....(*Ni tangent.....) My ISFP kiddo is only 5 but we call her our free spirit and she for sure is an individual! I love SPs! (I envy them in ways actually.) I'm going to work on letting her 'have her stage' more often. She can sure be noisy and there are times where she gets 'shhhh'd'; but, your story about your dad made me sad so I'll pay more attention to that. :wink: You sound like a fantastic dad btw!

So @Fat Bozo, is it weird to say that it seems that in your videos here you showed your 'Te' a lot? I could 'hear' your Fi for sure, but there was something in the way you speak that reminded me a lot of my ENTJ dad! What? haha (but ENTJs and ESFPs have the same functions in diff. order so....) But it was cool because the topics were much more ESFP-ish than anything he'd talk about. Just the way you spoke with confidence and 'explained' everything. Anyway, just something I noticed. I think since it's your tertiary function and because you're past your 20's, Te is probably more developed which is cool to see personified! (But your hilarity made sure I wouldn't make the mistake to think it was higher up the stack :tongue

I agree that there *is* a split between the 'SJ' world (corporate/school etc.) and the 'SP' world (i.e. what we see portrayed in the public arena - Hollywood/Concerts/Adrenaline-Junkie-Reality-TV); and the stereotypes, of what it 'is' to be SP, do create a feeling of there being something 'wrong' with SP behavior. I really liked what you both had to say about this conflict within the school system and the topic in general.

LOL - the whole going to lunch thing - hahahaha!


So I guess I can stop asking my ISFP why she kicked the kitty - - the opportunity presented itself eh? She never does it really hard - she's puny anyway - but it always surprises me because she's such a sweetheart and then oof- - what was that for?? LOL Boredom perhaps?


'Anything can be beautiful - it's what you make out of it!' Love that! That's for sure what SPs are awesome at!

Great vids guys!


----------



## Inveniet

Today I have a special treat for you guys!
Double Fi-dom vid with @Calvaire INFP =D






And here are the Vinnie the Pooh thread that I mentioned. 

http://personalitycafe.com/articles...-understand-cognitive-functions-pictures.html


----------



## Calvaire

Oh Lord,I look horribly fatter than normal  Please no one use my appearance against me it was 3am my time and the worst camera angle ever and yes I am chubby 14/15US size but in that video I know I feel like I look like i'm 400 pounds : /


*okay that aside:*
it was really great talking to @hornet and after it I really am going to look into cognitive functions more to better understand my Ne usage.Also I feel like I came off a bit typist on some parts,I do however look up to those who are more organized and are more on the T side than I am : ) also rabbit was bossy but he also does have some admirable qualities.


----------



## Inveniet

Calvaire said:


> Oh Lord,I look horribly fatter than normal  Please no one use my appearance against me it was 3am my time and the worst camera angle ever and yes I am chubby 14/15US size but in that video I know I feel like I look like i'm 400 pounds : /
> 
> 
> *okay that aside:*
> it was really great talking to @_hornet_ and after it I really am going to look into cognitive functions more to better understand my Ne usage.Also I feel like I came off a bit typist on some parts,I do however look up to those who are more organized and are more on the T side than I am : ) also rabbit was bossy but he also does have some admirable qualities.


Well we live we learn. 
I remembered looking at myself in my first vids and thinking, 
man I didn't realize how bald I was becoming.
So I just cleared it all out.

Camera angle and time of day have a lot to say for how you come across. :-/
But don't worry, it didn't cross my mind when I talked to you or anything.
It could have been worse!


----------



## Kabosu

One day I'd like to make a re-entry to these videos, maybe in the weekend or so. However, I'm sort of focused with other things.

And now I have to say I like splitting the videos a bit more since it's less time consuming. :tongue:


----------



## leafling

This seems like a fascinating thread! I took a peek at a few videos, but I stopped because I really should be working instead.
I might take a better look when I'm done with all this work, ughhh.


----------



## renna

Calvaire said:


> Oh Lord,I look horribly fatter than normal  Please no one use my appearance against me it was 3am my time and the worst camera angle ever and yes I am chubby 14/15US size but in that video I know I feel like I look like i'm 400 pounds : /


You did great for your first video! You are a very charming INFP  I also enjoyed seeing the more "assertive bossy side to the ISFP". My dad is an ISFP and if it wasn't for me living w/ him, I never would of thought ISFPs have that quality in them... you know what I mean w/ no offense being taken ;-) Good video


----------



## renna

luemb said:


> Ok. I've felt required to engage in group sharing before and always associated that with Fe... mostly I just leave anyhow. Even if the shared value is a value that I also hold. It just feels wrong to me somehow, devalued or something.
> 
> Just to clarify, Te can also take other's needs/desires into account, especially in tandem with Fi.
> 
> Hmmm I have that odd feeling of reading words and not really understanding what they are saying... "I would define Fe as drawing conclusions based on personal evaluations, often relational, about one's environment." By personal evaluations you mean labelling things "good" or "bad" and by relational you choose these labels based on how one thing relates to another, like X is better than Y? How does this even work if you don't have a reason on which to base these evaluations? (or is this a silly question to ask...)
> 
> So because I don't do personal evaluations of things at all (it's in complete contrariness of Ni-Te to do that) this really confuses people on where I stand?


______________________


pneumoceptor said:


> Makes sense to me. Again, I can feel that way too. Not always, but I have before, depending on the group and the level of rapport/vulnerability/what have you.
> 
> Agreed!
> 
> Yeah, my sentence was pretty clunky. I guess I'd say that my Fe judgments are not necessarily black and white, good or bad. There's plenty of gray.
> 
> But on a more fundamental level, I would say that Fe is simply a judging function that focuses more on the external than Fi does and pays more attention/places more weight on interpersonal dynamics than Te or Ti do.
> 
> I'm interested in this. You don't think your statement that group sharing feels wrong is a personal evaluation? I mean, you don't think it is an Fi judgment?


_____________________

I know this convo is over with, but I found this video recently and it really help bring more insight to the table. I'm not accusing anyone of faking their type, just wanted to share with you two. 

I'm listing Part 2, but there is a link for part 1 if you want to watch both. 

"INFJs who think they are INTJ/INTP" aka certain personality types not matching description of INFJ on Personality Page website, thus excluding NF completely for plausible type.


----------



## Inveniet

renna said:


> You did great for your first video! You are a very charming INFP  I also enjoyed seeing the more "assertive bossy side to the ISFP". My dad is an ISFP and if it wasn't for me living w/ him, I never would of thought ISFPs have that quality in them... you know what I mean w/ no offense being taken ;-) Good video


Funny that you should point that out as I've been thinking a lot about assertiveness
and what it means from a Fi perspective. 
I kinda think that a lot of stuff has been projected onto the functions/types that doesn't belong there.
Just because butter is being used a lot with bread, doesn't mean that butter is a part of bread.


----------



## luemb

renna said:


> ______________________
> 
> _____________________
> 
> I know this convo is over with, but I found this video recently and it really help bring more insight to the table. I'm not accusing anyone of faking their type, just wanted to share with you two.
> 
> I'm listing Part 2, but there is a link for part 1 if you want to watch both.
> 
> "INFJs who think they are INTJ/INTP" aka certain personality types not matching description of INFJ on Personality Page website, thus excluding NF completely for plausible type.


I started listening to her part one on this subject but I couldn't make it more than a few minutes. If you want to sum it up for us that would be great. Basically she seems to be saying "don't just read the description, learn the cognitive functions" which is something I've done very carefully.


----------



## Zeitgeist

@pneumoceptor I sooo love to do one of these vids!


----------



## teddy564339

luemb said:


> I guess I never really answered your original question about how NTJs view feelings as positive or negative or neutral, or view their own actions as positive, negative or neutral. The reason I couldn't answer it is because I had no idea. I think the reasoning is, if emotions get in the way of logic, then they are bad. Anything else is neutral. Personally, I like feeling peaceful. But that's not a Feeling-value, that's a bodily state.


I think it's interesting hwo you view feeling peaceful as a bodily state, as you refer to it, because for me I equate with with emotions. And perhaps that's why I find this such a complex difference between myself and NTs in general...because for me, my logic serves my emotions (as well as the emotions of other people). For me, the only purpose of my logic is to improve the emotions of myself or others. So when making logical decisions, the choice isn't necessarily if I should choose emotion over logic...it's how I can logically choose a choice that yields the highest amount of positive emotion.

For example, let's compare eating something healthy vs. eating something unhealthy that tastes good. If I were to make choices that were strictly logical, then every single thing I would eat would be something healthy (and I'm sure there are some people that live that way)...because eating something unhealthy is completely illogical...the only purpose is to create a happy experience. But...I choose to eat healthy enough to sustain a long-term lifestyle...but not so healthy that I never eat anything unhealthy. Basically, I'm using my logic to create a solution that gives a long term sense of happiness...but also to balance it out with a present amount of happiness. The only reason to eat healthy in the first place is to have a long term sense of happiness rather than pain and worry. So my logic is serving my emotions.

However, you may distinguish between the two by referring to "bodily states", as you worded them earlier. And perhaps that's where some of the confusion comes from...for me, it's really one big web of emotions. 





luemb said:


> As to my own actions... many different NTJs have different sets of morals as to what are the right things to do. In fact, every NTJ has their own morals. How do I express myself when my own actions have gone against my morals? I feel pretty bad, I would apologise if I've hurt anyone through it, and I would look into making sure it never happens again. *When my own actions are correct, there is no positive to it. I simply expect that.* I guess even if I did want to express a feeling-value to someone else, unless I was really really close to them it would only be through the lens of Te.


It's interesting how I can relate to everything before the bold part. However, the bold part is completely different for me, and that's a difference I've noted between myself and NTs. I think that's where a lot of the frustration and difficulty comes in sometimes. 

The last line is different as well, but I think it makes sense.


I hate getting so off topic in this thread, but I haven't had enough time to watch all of the new videos that were suddenly posted all at once anyway.


----------



## Death Persuades

I could be in a video chat... But I don't really talk much... And I smile awkwardly if I'm nervous, sometimes.


----------



## Celebok

@hornet looks a lot more intimidating with his head shaved!


----------



## fihe

I've already decided to do a video with a certain PerC user, but what I forgot to ask and didn't notice an answer to in this thread is: what exactly should we talk about in the video?


----------



## Inveniet

luemb said:


> So @_bigtex1989_ (ENTP) and myself (INTJ) made a video.
> 
> Here it is.


Ah a new vid! 

But I have to wait for processing... :-s

Way to go to get peoples hopes up, just to crush their dreams. =(


----------



## luemb

hornet said:


> Ah a new vid!
> 
> But I have to wait for processing... :-s
> 
> Way to go to get peoples hopes up, just to crush their dreams. =(


Haha well three hours of happiness should make up for it.... haha.

It's up now


----------



## Inveniet

luemb said:


> Haha well three hours of happiness should make up for it.... haha.
> 
> It's up now


It's off to a good start!
With you sounding like an angry goddess from the echo! 
You will suffer for your insolence petty humans! }:-D


----------



## luemb

hornet said:


> It's off to a good start!
> With you sounding like an angry goddess from the echo!
> You will suffer for your insolence petty humans! }:-D


Lol! I guess everyone will have to suffer from my ignorance about echoes. 

I hope you enjoyed the part you saw, and I will make a shorter version, when I get the time.


----------



## Inveniet

luemb said:


> Lol! I guess everyone will have to suffer from my ignorance about echoes.
> 
> I hope you enjoyed the part you saw, and I will make a shorter version, when I get the time.


Part I saw? I have 10 minutes left of the whole thing.
You are talking about people as an end in them self.

The ENTP is to blame for the echo!
Not wearing earbuds... 

Edit:
But yeah I enjoyed the vid, unless you guys screw it up the next 5 mins... XD


----------



## bigtex1989

Yes yes it was all my fault! But while making the video, I heard no echoes, so I'm good


----------



## fihe

^ 2:55:23? holy crap, that's about as long as a weekly college lecture


----------



## Kabosu

Do some of you all care to divide these in installments? I could see 20-30 minutes but then after that the loading can sometimes be a pain, and I don't have as much free time as I used to.


----------



## luemb

bigtex1989 said:


> Yes yes it was all my fault! But while making the video, I heard no echoes, so I'm good


It's not your fault at all, I was the one who could hear the echoes and didn't say anything. Silly 9ishness.


----------



## bigtex1989

fihe said:


> ^ 2:55:23? holy crap, that's about as long as a weekly college lecture


I like to talk a lot


----------



## pneumoceptor

It's fun to see all the activity on this thread! I'm glad people are going for it with their own chats.

Here's a chat I had today with ISFP DominicIgnatiusMarie from youtube:


----------



## teddy564339

Damn you, @hornet , for putting up four videos in the last week! There’s no way I’ve been able to keep up with them. But I didn’t want to get too far behind, so I decided to watch the first 20 minutes of each of the last six videos posted and I at least got to hear some interesting things:





hornet/hallrann: I found it interesting how hornet said introverts tended to kind of have a mess of disorganized thoughts inside. For me, I think this is true to a degree, but I think it’s probably more structured than it is for other introverts. Pneumoceptor and I talked about this a bit…for me, Si makes me need to keep a lot of my thoughts organized. I think Ni is much more messy, and you and hallrann shared that. Fi and Ti may be more that way as well…but I get the impression it comes more from Ni than anything else.



I also found it funny how hallrann said there’s a perception that INFJs aren’t as strongly judgers as other Js, but that she was very much a judger…and then she also says she had trouble keeping track of time! But I know that’s just one aspect of judging. I do think that since time has to deal more with physical organization, SJs probably do pay more attention to time than NJs do, at least in general.







hornet/FatBozo: This one was quite interesting, and at some point I may try to finish this one. I think it was very interesting to hear how Fat Bozo had to suppress his Se as a kid. I think it tends to be our extroverted functions that we feel we have to suppress more. For me, I never felt like I had to suppress my Si…but I definitely felt like I did for my Fe…because I was a male, and I didn’t feel comfortable being a sensitive and soft boy growing up…I always felt pressure to be “tough”. 



Again, I know Fat Bozo hates this…but again, I can see the Ji and Je difference between us (though one could argue this is just the J/P difference, which is basically the same thing). I definitely see how Js (Je users) focus more on group cohesion and togetherness, whereas Ps (Ji users) focus more on everyone being able to do their own thing.



I mean, I want to be able to do my own thing too….but in group situations, I’m ok with temporarily putting my own wants on hold for the sake of the group accomplishing its goal. However, that’s also why I tend to like to spend a lot of time alone…it kind of fuels my need for introversion.
I also found it interesting how Fat Bozo had an issue with people making intuitive jumps without past information. But I also liked how he said that type doesn’t dictate how well you can get along with someone…there’s so much diversity among the people within one type.





viva/innovati: I did like the point viva made about every type having some kind of complaint, because I think it’s true that every type has its own set of difficulties. I think sometimes people get a “grass is greener” mentality when they think that another type has things easy in life. 
I do think this is a funny video because it’s all over the place…just a bunch of different topics and directions. Very ENFP. 




hornet/Calvaire: I found it very fascinating to hear how Calvaire said there were times when she felt like the external world didn’t matter…because I think that is a great representation of the S/N divide. I really have a hard time focusing on something that isn’t right in front of me in my immediate life. But I have an INFP friend who always enjoys talking and thinking about “deeper” philosophies and ethical situations that are in news stories he reads or things that feel very far off to me.



I think it was interesting too to hear about the conflicts with the INFP/ISTP pairing…especially since they seemed to be over sensory, nitpicky things. Then again, roommates at any point tend to have conflicts in general. But I can see how the P philosophies can line up some too.
I also found it interesting hearing hornet describe his ISTP dad just wanted to mess around with things for the sake of it…a kind of interesting display of using Ti, and also it seems like an SP type of thing to do.



I also related to the idea that inferior feeling types have trouble expressing emotions, and how an ISTP would want to be respected for solving a problem…and not wanting to focus on their own. I actually have noticed a similar trend in ESTJs…they also like to handle problems on their own.





hornet/fihe: I found it interesting to hear that hornet has a very close ESFJ friend. And for fihe, it sounds like the SFJ parent situation strikes again! I think it was interesting too to hear about how fihe felt the need to be productive. I think that really tends to be a Te trait, particularly among STJs. I don’t mean to type her as an ISTJ…but I do think the Si/Te combination has a tendency. But the Enneagram type 1s tend to align with ISFJs and ISTJs as well. 



It’s interesting to hear about fihe applying for teaching jobs, since I’m a high school teacher myself. I think it’s a lot harder to get teaching jobs in certain parts of the US compared to others. I’ve heard it’s very difficult in Michigan, for example. But it’s also gotten much worse in the last four years since the economy dropped. 




Luemb/Bigtex1989: I loved seeing the E/I difference right from the very beginning of this video. I really like seeing ENTPs in these videos because you can really see their energy come out in a way that you don’t when you read on the forums. And I hate saying this, but I couldn’t help but get a bit of a “Texas swag” vibe from Bigtex. 



I also liked how yet again, the Ne is bouncing around to different topics…the spider conversation just bounced right off of an offhand comment. No wonder the video went 3 hours…there were so many little side topic mini-conversations just within the first 20 minutes I watched! 
I also saw the strong difference between ENTPs being pretty happy-go-lucky compared to the more “serious” way an ISFJ kind of goes about things sometimes.


----------



## Thomas60

*whew* busy week, what's new? haven't posted anywhere much at all.
*browses back*


----------



## Inveniet

atypeofuser said:


> Do some of you all care to divide these in installments? I could see 20-30 minutes but then after that the loading can sometimes be a pain, and I don't have as much free time as I used to.


If you install download helper in firefox you can download it from youtube and do whatever you want with it.


----------



## tangosthenes

If anybody wants to do a video with an INTP tomorrow, let me know.


----------



## Inveniet

I like you new spaced out style of writing, even though you write long posts, it kinda gives you hope,
that it will be possible to read trough without a stroke. 



teddy564339 said:


> Damn you, @_hornet_ , for putting up four videos in the last week! There’s no way I’ve been able to keep up with them. But I didn’t want to get too far behind, so I decided to watch the first 20 minutes of each of the last six videos posted and I at least got to hear some interesting things:


You where just lucky there weren’t more. 
Many have backed out and others have dragged their feet, and since I'm not the one to push anyone
there wasn't as many as there might have been.






> hornet/hallrann: I found it interesting how hornet said introverts tended to kind of have a mess of disorganized thoughts inside. For me, I think this is true to a degree, but I think it’s probably more structured than it is for other introverts. Pneumoceptor and I talked about this a bit…for me, Si makes me need to keep a lot of my thoughts organized. I think Ni is much more messy, and you and hallrann shared that. Fi and Ti may be more that way as well…but I get the impression it comes more from Ni than anything else.


Yeah well messy is a loaded word. I guess I'm quite ordered in my head. 
A better way to describe it is that introverts have more activity going on inside.
It doesn't have to be messy activity, but it sure can be.



> I also found it funny how hallrann said there’s a perception that INFJs aren’t as strongly judgers as other Js, but that she was very much a judger…and then she also says she had trouble keeping track of time! But I know that’s just one aspect of judging. I do think that since time has to deal more with physical organization, SJs probably do pay more attention to time than NJs do, at least in general.


In general I think Te and Si is way more stereotypical judger'ish.
Ni tends to be more flexible towards many things and Fe is more concerned with people.
So the Ni/Fe combo will appear less judger than say the Si/Fe combo or very much the Si/Te combo.






> hornet/FatBozo: This one was quite interesting, and at some point I may try to finish this one. I think it was very interesting to hear how Fat Bozo had to suppress his Se as a kid. I think it tends to be our extroverted functions that we feel we have to suppress more. For me, I never felt like I had to suppress my Si…but I definitely felt like I did for my Fe…because I was a male, and I didn’t feel comfortable being a sensitive and soft boy growing up…I always felt pressure to be “tough”.


I see what you mean, but even though he had to suppress it, it just came back with a vengeance.
I understand the though pressure thing. As I too felt that a lot.
I find MBTI has helped me heal that suppressed part of myself, and made it possible to embrace it more.
Still I often find that some wounds go deep.



> Again, I know Fat Bozo hates this…but again, I can see the Ji and Je difference between us (though one could argue this is just the J/P difference, which is basically the same thing). I definitely see how Js (Je users) focus more on group cohesion and togetherness, whereas Ps (Ji users) focus more on everyone being able to do their own thing.


Yep!



> I mean, I want to be able to do my own thing too….but in group situations, I’m ok with temporarily putting my own wants on hold for the sake of the group accomplishing its goal. However, that’s also why I tend to like to spend a lot of time alone…it kind of fuels my need for introversion.
> I also found it interesting how Fat Bozo had an issue with people making intuitive jumps without past information. But I also liked how he said that type doesn’t dictate how well you can get along with someone…there’s so much diversity among the people within one type.


The issues with using Ni really drives home the point the differences between ESFP and ISFP.
I relish the use of Ni and sometimes overuse it and become slightly paranoid.
While he didn't want to use it unless it was for the most basic of things.
I respect his view and find it really enlightening to see how mistrust in the inferior manifest in the different types.



> hornet/Calvaire: I found it very fascinating to hear how Calvaire said there were times when she felt like the external world didn’t matter…because I think that is a great representation of the S/N divide. I really have a hard time focusing on something that isn’t right in front of me in my immediate life. But I have an INFP friend who always enjoys talking and thinking about “deeper” philosophies and ethical situations that are in news stories he reads or things that feel very far off to me.


INFPs can be dangerous for me cause they drag me down into their submarine for deep ethical dives.
And if I'm not careful they can lead me to too much Fi/Ni usage, making me mentally unstable.




> I also found it interesting hearing hornet describe his ISTP dad just wanted to mess around with things for the sake of it…a kind of interesting display of using Ti, and also it seems like an SP type of thing to do.


I'm sooo upset with that... It seems like all he cares for is playing with codes and frameworks on his computer.
And every time he gets closer to a real solution, he will just throw everything out and complain about some
seeming bona_fide reason to start over.




> hornet/fihe: I found it interesting to hear that hornet has a very close ESFJ friend. And for fihe, it sounds like the SFJ parent situation strikes again! I think it was interesting too to hear about how fihe felt the need to be productive. I think that really tends to be a Te trait, particularly among STJs. I don’t mean to type her as an ISTJ…but I do think the Si/Te combination has a tendency. But the Enneagram type 1s tend to align with ISFJs and ISTJs as well.


Yeah that ESFJ/ISFP contrast relation is a strange one, but it wouldn't be any stranger than you being friend with an ESFP. 
What I find about that relation is that he effortlessly finds a way to ping me to check where I'm at.
And if I'm standoffish he will come running to fix it. He is probably the easiest person to manipulate I've ever met.
And I think the reason he likes me is that I only manipulates him with his consent.
I'll just tell him that I'm about to manipulate you in direction X, what do you think about that?
Everyone else is giving him shit, and making an effort to control him.
Now if you are found out, he will use his Fe to really make you hurt, as he has a lot of social leverage.
I only understand him on an MBTI basis as from a real life basis he is like a flying pig to me.
The laws of the universe has been broken and somehow made him. And he works in a messed up way.
In that despite all his perceived flaws from my perspective, he lives a good and happy life.
It is very weird to me that someone can operate on the level he does and get away with it happy.


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> It's fun to see all the activity on this thread! I'm glad people are going for it with their own chats.
> 
> Here's a chat I had today with ISFP DominicIgnatiusMarie from youtube:


Wow that was interesting. :-o
It was like listening to myself if I took a different path in life! 
I resonated with so much of what he said, although I don't hold all his values, 
I can defiantly see his reasoning behind them and their validity for his life.

When he talked about objective beauty in art, I knew exactly what he meant without having ever really thought about
that subject very closely. I have noticed the difference between Mozart and Wagner in a felt sense, 
but never took it further than that Mozart was better. I didn't know about MBTI at that time either so...

I found it funny that he went trough the INTJ delusion and felt he became more abstract during that period.
I had a similar experience with mistyping as INTJ.

It is so many things that struck me about what he said and I don't feel like going too much into it right now.
I need to do other stuff too... :-/


----------



## teddy564339

hornet said:


> I like you new spaced out style of writing, even though you write long posts, it kinda gives you hope,
> that it will be possible to read trough without a stroke.


Ha ha..it actually happened a little by accident. Since I was typing as I was watching each video, I typed my original post in Word, where the spacing was different. However, I also tried to separate my comments on each video with spacing between each one as well.



hornet said:


> You where just lucky there weren’t more.
> Many have backed out and others have dragged their feet, and since I'm not the one to push anyone
> there wasn't as many as there might have been.


Good! It's been video overload! I love watching them, but I currently only have so much time. 

But I'm also glad that you're doing them...it's always fun to actually see how the personalities play out visually and audibly, seeing all of the mannerisms that different people have.






hornet said:


> Yeah well messy is a loaded word. I guess I'm quite ordered in my head.
> A better way to describe it is that introverts have more activity going on inside.
> It doesn't have to be messy activity, but it sure can be.


Yeah, I would definitely agree with that. 

That's the tough thing about talking on video, at least for me...it's harder to word things exactly the way you want when speaking on the spot. My posts always more clearly lay out what I mean than when I talked in the video, where I was saying the first thing that popped into my head.



 hornet said:


> In general I think Te and Si is way more stereotypical judger'ish.
> Ni tends to be more flexible towards many things and Fe is more concerned with people.
> So the Ni/Fe combo will appear less judger than say the Si/Fe combo or very much the Si/Te combo.


Yeah, that came up in my chat with pneumoceptor. Si just has a certain structure to it that's different than Ni. But I think it's also because IRL, there are so many more "S" situations involving people living together or having to do things together, so I think it's more common for Si to feel imposing. 






hornet said:


> I see what you mean, but even though he had to suppress it, it just came back with a vengeance.
> I understand the though pressure thing. As I too felt that a lot.
> I find MBTI has helped me heal that suppressed part of myself, and made it possible to embrace it more.
> Still I often find that some wounds go deep.


Yeah, it's interesting how as we grow into adults and become more independent, we get a chance to kind of embrace things we may have felt we needed to suppress. I've definitely become more comfortable being a feeler since I learned about the MBTI. 





hornet said:


> The issues with using Ni really drives home the point the differences between ESFP and ISFP.
> I relish the use of Ni and sometimes overuse it and become slightly paranoid.
> While he didn't want to use it unless it was for the most basic of things.
> I respect his view and find it really enlightening to see how mistrust in the inferior manifest in the different types.


Yeah, I found that very fascinating too. My inferior Ne definitely pops up a lot. It's funny to see how there can be such a huge difference between the same function being tertiary for one person and inferior in another. 



hornet said:


> INFPs can be dangerous for me cause they drag me down into their submarine for deep ethical dives.
> And if I'm not careful they can lead me to too much Fi/Ni usage, making me mentally unstable.


Yeah, it's interesting to see how two people with the same dominant function can do that. I very often feel on the same page with ISTJs. 




hornet said:


> I'm sooo upset with that... It seems like all he cares for is playing with codes and frameworks on his computer.
> And every time he gets closer to a real solution, he will just throw everything out and complain about some
> seeming bona_fide reason to start over.


Yeah, it's funny seeing how Ti and Fi are so different despite the Se connection.




hornet said:


> Yeah that ESFJ/ISFP contrast relation is a strange one, but it wouldn't be any stranger than you being friend with an ESFP.
> What I find about that relation is that he effortlessly finds a way to ping me to check where I'm at.
> And if I'm standoffish he will come running to fix it. He is probably the easiest person to manipulate I've ever met.
> And I think the reason he likes me is that I only manipulates him with his consent.
> I'll just tell him that I'm about to manipulate you in direction X, what do you think about that?
> Everyone else is giving him shit, and making an effort to control him.
> Now if you are found out, he will use his Fe to really make you hurt, as he has a lot of social leverage.
> I only understand him on an MBTI basis as from a real life basis he is like a flying pig to me.
> The laws of the universe has been broken and somehow made him. And he works in a messed up way.
> In that despite all his perceived flaws from my perspective, he lives a good and happy life.
> It is very weird to me that someone can operate on the level he does and get away with it happy.


Yeah, Fe is funny in that way. I can kind of see that happening to a degree in me, but much less so. 

But I think learning about the MBTI helps out so much too, becaues you get a chance to learn about things you do that you may have not even been aware of before. It's helped me out to control certain things in me, as well as understand how I can adapt my behavior to get along with others' different needs.


----------



## Kabosu

hornet said:


> If you install download helper in firefox you can download it from youtube and do whatever you want with it.


How does it work for Chrome users? :tongue:


----------



## Inveniet

teddy564339 said:


> But I'm also glad that you're doing them...it's always fun to actually see how the personalities play out visually and audibly, seeing all of the mannerisms that different people have.


I'm doing them for all these selfish reasons, but it is a bonus to know that others like them too. }:-D




> That's the tough thing about talking on video, at least for me...it's harder to word things exactly the way you want when speaking on the spot. My posts always more clearly lay out what I mean than when I talked in the video, where I was saying the first thing that popped into my head.


Yes you definitely feel put on the spot a lot in these vids, 
but I've noticed that the more i do of them the less stressful it becomes.



> Yeah, that came up in my chat with pneumoceptor. Si just has a certain structure to it that's different than Ni. But I think it's also because IRL, there are so many more "S" situations involving people living together or having to do things together, so I think it's more common for Si to feel imposing.


 True I'm on a covert crusade against Si in my life right now. XD
I use my mild sciatica as an excuse to break up external Si patterns imposed on me from childhood.
I disarm the ones around me by talking about 2012 and the potential end of the world.
It's funny how that makes Si users forget all about my blatant disregard for common behaviour. 




> Yeah, it's interesting how as we grow into adults and become more independent, we get a chance to kind of embrace things we may have felt we needed to suppress. I've definitely become more comfortable being a feeler since I learned about the MBTI.


I hear you about that, it is so much easier to revolt when you know why you are doing it in the first place. =D




> Yeah, I found that very fascinating too. My inferior Ne definitely pops up a lot. It's funny to see how there can be such a huge difference between the same function being tertiary for one person and inferior in another.


Well people try to ignore their inferior and play with their tertiary.




> Yeah, it's funny seeing how Ti and Fi are so different despite the Se connection.


Seeing the same thing, but having different takes on it.




> But I think learning about the MBTI helps out so much too, becaues you get a chance to learn about things you do that you may have not even been aware of before. It's helped me out to control certain things in me, as well as understand how I can adapt my behavior to get along with others' different needs.


You kinda get superpowers once you figure things out! 




atypeofuser said:


> How does it work for Chrome users? :tongue:


Not at all...
This one claims to work, but no promises.
DownloadHelper for Chrome: Online Video Downloader for Google Chrome

But still, it probably wouldn't kill you to use firefox as a download tool.


----------



## Celebok

Looks like @pneumoceptor is on some kind of SP kick -- ESFP last week, ISFP this week... what's next, ISTP? ESTP? ;-)


----------



## Kabosu

I had one just now with @tangosthenes, but I'll post it when I finally edit it.


----------



## tangosthenes

atypeofuser said:


> I had one just now with @_tangosthenes_, but I'll post it when I finally edit it.


The world could not handle it in its current state, it would shake the foundations of the earth...


----------



## Fridays

pneumoceptor said:


> It's fun to see all the activity on this thread! I'm glad people are going for it with their own chats.
> 
> Here's a chat I had today with ISFP DominicIgnatiusMarie from youtube:


Great videos. 







I enjoyed watching all 4 of them.




ISFPs are very nice people. I like them a lot. I know many isfps. We have fun everytime we meet. And deeeeep-talks included!


DominicIgnatiusMarie, looks like Elvis! Ohmy!! Don't you think?


----------



## renna

Celebok said:


> Looks like @pneumoceptor is on some kind of SP kick -- ESFP last week, ISFP this week... what's next, ISTP? ESTP? ;-)


I wish ESTP! I wish, I wish!
I can't seem to find one who is interested!!!!


----------



## Kabosu

Ok, I feel derpy about the use of Google hangouts and how they record. I'd been resting and jogging and got back and don't really get what happens with the hangout. Why couldn't it had just been with the ISFP who told me she didn't want it to be public. meh. Well, now I know how to do it if you want to some time.


----------



## fihe

hi guys, I'm available tomorrow after 5pm and Tuesday after 5:30pm in case anyone would like to do a video chat. I'm in the Eastern time zone.


----------



## MissWendy

Hi guys, I just started digging the whole functions things.

I watched a very great video that posted here. Realizing that INTP & INTJ processing everything in totally different way.

I test myself over and over and always got the result as INTP. Which means my functions is Ti>Ne>Si>Fe
But P & J got me confused. Is it means impossible for someone with Dominant (Ti), Auxiliary (Ne), Tertiary (Si), Inferior (Fe) to be a J? That we have to be a Perceiver? Isnt P & J used to classify whether a person prefer a well organize plan or leaving the possibility opens?

Because if I am J the functions will be Ni>Te>Fi>Se? How could P & J change the sequence of the function?


----------



## bigtex1989

teddy564339 said:


> And I hate saying this, but I couldn’t help but get a bit of a “Texas swag” vibe from Bigtex.


I hate asking this, but what is "Texas swag"? XD


----------



## Inveniet

MissWendy said:


> Hi guys, I just started digging the whole functions things.
> 
> I watched a very great video that posted here. Realizing that INTP & INTJ processing everything in totally different way.
> 
> I test myself over and over and always got the result as INTP. Which means my functions is Ti>Ne>Si>Fe
> But P & J got me confused. Is it means impossible for someone with Dominant (Ti), Auxiliary (Ne), Tertiary (Si), Inferior (Fe) to be a J? That we have to be a Perceiver? Isnt P & J used to classify whether a person prefer a well organize plan or leaving the possibility opens?
> 
> Because if I am J the functions will be Ni>Te>Fi>Se? How could P & J change the sequence of the function?


You are attacking the problem from the wrong end.
Wanting to keep the situation open or organize a plan is such oversimplifications
to cater to people who would rather *just kinda understand*.

The four letters is like a label in code that represents cognitive function sets.
Now that you know this fact, it is time to let go of all the stereotypical assumptions
that have been associated with each label.

The reason the J/P change everything so much, 
is that the labelling method that Isabel came up with is misleading.
A better label would be ITN for INTP and INT for INTJ.
All J and P means is that the judging or perceiving function is the extroverted one.
Everything else is just noise.


----------



## MissWendy

hornet said:


> All J and P means is that the judging or perceiving function is the extroverted one.
> Everything else is just noise.


Could you pls explain more abt the Extrovert Judging & Perceiving? I started to understand the Ti vs Te and Ni vs Ne thing. I hope I can absorb this P & J ideas as well

Is it happen to have a connection with Intuition & Sensing which are Perceiving traits and Thinking & Feeling as Judging traits.

So I am an INT"P" for my N(e) this Extroverted in my Intuition made me labeled as P?

An since you seems to know the details well, can I ask why MBTI classified as NTp and NTj traits, and SJ & SF traits? instead of NTj, NF, ST, and SF?


----------



## Inveniet

Well its really simple.
The first letter tells you if the first function is extroverted or introverted.
E or I
The last letter tells you witch function is the extroverted one.
J or P
The second letter is the perceiving function.
The third letter is the judging function.

So in you case INTP
We would have
I: First function is an introverted function.
P: The perceiving function is extroverted.
N: This is the perceiving function, it is therefore Ne.
T: Since the first function is introverted and we have established that N is not introverted, Ti is the first function.

Now we know the two first functions. Ti and Ne
The rules then state that the third function is the function pair of the second (Ne in this case), namely Si
And the fourth inferior is the function pair of of the first (Ti in this case), namely Fe

Functions in order:
Ti, Ne, Si, Fe

Edit: @_MissWendy_


> An since you seems to know the details well, can I ask why MBTI classified as NTp and NTj traits, and SJ & SF traits? instead of NTj, NF, ST, and SF?


I think Isabel did it to torment us, you could equally well do it in lots of other ways. 
But guess what it became a standard, like the qwerty keyboard and now we have to suffer. XD


----------



## MissWendy

Yes its confusing. They called the The Overseers & Creators based on SJ or SP traits. But Intellects and Dreamers based on NT or NF.

I cant help to not question? XD

Thanks anyways guys


----------



## Inveniet

MissWendy said:


> View attachment 48343
> 
> 
> Yes its confusing. They called the The Overseers & Creators based on SJ or SP traits. But Intellects and Dreamers based on NT or NF.
> 
> I cant help to not question? XD
> 
> Thanks anyways guys


Oh that! XD
It is imported from this other guy named Keirsey.
David Keirsey - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Basicly they say that the 
NTs like reasoning and strategy.
NFs like harmony and diplomacy
SPs like living life and tactics
SJs like stability and logistics

It is another theory that seem to hold up to an certain extent.
But I generally find that the cognitive functions trump those generalizations.
It is a nice introduction and can work as a quick fix labelling of people
when you don't have time to think things trough in any serious way.


----------



## renna

hornet said:


> You are attacking the problem from the wrong end.
> Wanting to keep the situation open or organize a plan is such oversimplifications
> to cater to people who would rather *just kinda understand*.
> 
> The four letters is like a label in code that represents cognitive function sets.
> Now that you know this fact, it is time to let go of all the stereotypical assumptions
> that have been associated with each label.
> 
> The reason the J/P change everything so much,
> is that the labelling method that Isabel came up with is misleading.
> A better label would be ITN for INTP and INT for INTJ.
> All J and P means is that the judging or perceiving function is the extroverted one.
> Everything else is just noise.


P.S. - Now reading ANYTHING you write - I read it in your accent/voice after watching your videos, HA ;-)


----------



## Inguz

pneumoceptor said:


> It's fun to see all the activity on this thread! I'm glad people are going for it with their own chats.
> 
> Here's a chat I had today with ISFP DominicIgnatiusMarie from youtube:


wow, in many ways he seems a lot like me.



MissWendy said:


> View attachment 48343
> 
> 
> Yes its confusing. They called the The Overseers & Creators based on SJ or SP traits. But Intellects and Dreamers based on NT or NF.
> 
> I cant help to not question? XD
> 
> Thanks anyways guys


That split is to make it easier to stereotype based on behavior.


----------



## luemb

teddy564339 said:


> Luemb/Bigtex1989: I loved seeing the E/I difference right from the very beginning of this video. I really like seeing ENTPs in these videos because you can really see their energy come out in a way that you don’t when you read on the forums. And I hate saying this, but I couldn’t help but get a bit of a “Texas swag” vibe from Bigtex.
> 
> I also liked how yet again, the Ne is bouncing around to different topics…the spider conversation just bounced right off of an offhand comment. No wonder the video went 3 hours…there were so many little side topic mini-conversations just within the first 20 minutes I watched!
> I also saw the strong difference between ENTPs being pretty happy-go-lucky compared to the more “serious” way an ISFJ kind of goes about things sometimes.


There were stories within stories, it was awesome. Like Arabian Nights. It was hard remembering where we were, even for me and I'm usually on track with stuff. 

The surprising part to me was that Tex didn't seem to have an accent, at least relative to me.

And I agree about how Tex's energy comes out so much clearer on video. In writing it's harder to tell who is the extrovert and who is the introvert.


----------



## Inveniet

renna said:


> P.S. - Now reading ANYTHING you write - I read it in your accent/voice after watching your videos, HA ;-)


Thanks for the confidence! 
I think my most insightful posts are in entertainment plaza...
Just so you know!


----------



## teddy564339

bigtex1989 said:


> I hate asking this, but what is "Texas swag"? XD





luemb said:


> The surprising part to me was that Tex didn't seem to have an accent, at least relative to me.



I don't know exactly. My oldest brother grew up in Texas, and so did his best friend (my brother is ENTJ, and if I had to guess, his friend would be ENTP or maybe ENTJ as well). Something about your mannerisms, and your hat...just reminded me of them. There's just this kind of sense of pride combined with a "party" type vibe I got...I don't really know how to describe it in words. They don't have accents either...and they don't have any of the "cowboy"/western stereotypical attributes. But there's just something about it that I saw a similarity in that I can't quite put my finger on.

They're also really big into watching sports, drinking, intellectual/political conversations, and old college sex stories too, which I know might be far removed from your personality. I know a lot of it is just the stereotypical male attributes too. But it's just interesting seeing how Texas has its own kind of unique culture.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> Looks like @_pneumoceptor_ is on some kind of SP kick -- ESFP last week, ISFP this week... what's next, ISTP? ESTP? ;-)


Well, we are the coolest.



fihe said:


> hi guys, I'm available tomorrow after 5pm and Tuesday after 5:30pm in case anyone would like to do a video chat. I'm in the Eastern time zone.


I can probably do it tomorrow. I get off work at 6 your time, so sometime after that.


----------



## renna

atypeofuser said:


> Ok, I feel derpy about the use of Google hangouts and how they record. I'd been resting and jogging and got back and don't really get what happens with the hangout. Why couldn't it had just been with the ISFP who told me she didn't want it to be public. meh. Well, now I know how to do it if you want to some time.


soo... does that mean we can't see it after all? maaaan :-(


----------



## Lerickal

Love the videos!


----------



## fihe

@Fat Bozo yay, just PM me to confirm


----------



## Hollow Man

*@*pneumoceptor* Hey, I wanted to formally apologize for missing our scheduled chat. It wasn't right of me, and I wanted to take *responsibility* for it. I don't know the effects of apologizing in public, but I thought it'd be OK. I am up to do if you're still interested. I'll admit I am a bit shy of it. Though, at the same time it's an exciting thing for me to try! *


----------



## Inveniet

@Slogo
We forgive you since you are the first ESFJ in this thread seriously contemplating making a vid. 
Just lay back and think of the queen, it will soon be over!


----------



## renna

Hey guys,

So I wanted to do a brief "interaction video" with my best friend - an INTJ. I've known her since I was 2yo. I didn't get really in-depth w/ type talk because she's not that into it. We recorded about 1hrs worth, but somehow I'm missing 30 min of footage, which I'm a bit bummed about because we discussed some in-depth things. Oh well. 

Again, I held back using typology terms (and explaining certain things to her because I wanted this to be an interaction) w/ her because she wouldn't of understood them.... She would of just made fun of me, like always. :tongue:

What I'm excited for the audience to see here is:

1) An INTJ comfortable in her surroundings w/ a warm personable affect. 
2) Her explaining growing as an INTJ over time since being married to an ENFP.
3) Her description of experiencing (at the moment) the shadow function Ne, since she's currently stressed out badly.
4) Her opinion of self and her type.





Enjoy! 
(I left the bloopers at the end ;-P )


----------



## Lady Lullaby

renna said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> So I wanted to do a brief "interaction video" with my best friend - an INTJ. I've known her since I was 2yo. I didn't get really in-depth w/ type talk because she's not that into it. We recorded about 1hrs worth, but somehow I'm missing 30 min of footage, which I'm a bit bummed about because we discussed some in-depth things. Oh well.
> 
> Again, I held back using typology terms (and explaining certain things to her because I wanted this to be an interaction) w/ her because she wouldn't of understood them.... She would of just made fun of me, like always. :tongue:
> 
> What I'm excited for the audience to see here is:
> 
> 1) An INTJ comfortable in her surroundings w/ a warm personable affect.
> 2) Her explaining growing as an INTJ over time since being married to an ENFP.
> 3) Her description of experiencing (at the moment) the shadow function Ne, since she's currently stressed out badly.
> 4) Her opinion of self and her type.


Happily I'm subscribed to you on youtube and that's how I saw this one.

That was awesome! How fun! At first when she was just smiling and not talking very much I didn't think she seemed very much like an INTJ - I was expecting a more stoic demeanor. But I know there are various INTJs in the world and this one is pretty warm and relaxed. I could see that she is just a nice person and very different from the few INTJs in my own life. I really liked how honest she is about admitting that she could be mean and that she does say things and people are stupid sometimes etc. It made me laugh because I guess that is a common theme among INTJs. 

So do you think that with people we've known forever they become like family and we sort of let things 'slide' that we might not otherwise if we were only recently acquainted? It seems that friends I've had for years and years get away with junk that I wouldn't put up with from someone I was just getting to know. Your INTJ friend here seems like a great find. Nice to see not ALL INTJs are opposed to the idea of having 'a best friend'. . . .(yeah, I couldn't help but compare to my recent personal experience.)
@renna you're such a class act. Gorgeous and sweet and smart all together - it is always a pleasure watching your vids!


----------



## renna

Lady Lullaby said:


> Happily I'm subscribed to you on youtube and that's how I saw this one.
> 
> That was awesome! How fun! At first when she was just smiling and not talking very much I didn't think she seemed very much like an INTJ - I was expecting a more stoic demeanor. But I know there are various INTJs in the world and this one is pretty warm and relaxed. I could see that she is just a nice person and very different from the few INTJs in my own life.


Hey, there Lady Lullaby, I thought about you today while this video was uploading ;-) I have mentioned my relationship w/ my INTJ friend before to you and now you have a persona to match the stories  

So here is the thing, you just saw a really nice warm INTJ because she sees me as her sister... so she was able to be loosen up and be silly for the camera. Plus she vlogs a lot w/ her hubby. Also, her parents made sure she got a lot of socializing in as a child/teenager because she was homeschooled. 



Lady Lullaby said:


> I really liked how honest she is about admitting that she could be mean and that she does say things and people are stupid sometimes etc. It made me laugh because I guess that is a common theme among INTJs.


I'm glad she mentioned that a couple times, that really proved her INTJness on camera ;-) 




Lady Lullaby said:


> So do you think that with people we've known forever they become like family and we sort of let things 'slide' that we might not otherwise if we were only recently acquainted? It seems that friends I've had for years and years get away with junk that I wouldn't put up with from someone I was just getting to know. Your INTJ friend here seems like a great find. Nice to see not ALL INTJs are opposed to the idea of having 'a best friend'. . . .(yeah, I couldn't help but compare to my recent personal experience.)


I'm sorry about your experience. It really is disappointing about your your ex INTJ friend because obviously they are all not the same. This is EXACTLY why I wanted to post this video. I hate the bad wrap that INTJs get on here. Okay yes, sometimes they cause it but other times stereotypes take over. 

There was a clip that didn't get to make the video (lost footage) that she apologized for making ppl cry in the past for being so mean...(She explained once in a group, she made a girl cry for acting ditzy and air-headed to be cute but it was killing the mood, so she called the girl out on it in front of everyone.) She's a lot nicer now!!! She doesn't tell ppl off anymore like she used to (lol) and she has learned to deal and respect other peoples feelings. She's learned the value of that. YES, I've had to let a lot slide from when she's hurt my feelings but on the flip side, I really don't get my feelings hurt anymore. We're better as resolving conflict than we used to be. Also, she's has had to let things slide on her end regarding me.

HOWEVER, with that being said, I do not expect in our friendship much affection - verbally or physically or much attention (like when we were teenagers). We just check in on each other. See each other from time to time, hang out whenever (sometimes once a month other times once a week). We pick right up where we left off. But we're there for each other whenever and what we have is solid gold. That's why her husband says we have a bizarre relationship 

I am positive if I was recently acquainted with an INTJ, it would take a considerable amount of time for us to build a solid comfortable relationship because both types (INFJ/INTJ) are slow to build trust. 



Lady Lullaby said:


> renna you're such a class act. Gorgeous and sweet and smart all together - it is always a pleasure watching your vids!


You're always so sweet and genuine (not to mention just as composed and beautiful yourself in all your vids)... Thank you. I'm so happy you enjoyed this! :-D


----------



## Fat Bozo

renna said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> So I wanted to do a brief "interaction video" with my best friend - an INTJ.


This is a great video. Only problem with it is the title. It should be called "Two Hot Chicks & A Baby." It's more descriptive and attracts more viewers.

You're welcome in advance.


----------



## Inveniet

Fat Bozo said:


> This is a great video. Only problem with it is the title. It should be called "Two Hot Chicks & A Baby." It's more descriptive and attracts more viewers.
> 
> You're welcome in advance.


I see! 
So what I should have done when I was uncertain what to call the last vid with @fihe
was call it

"ISFP/Babe Vid chat"

instead of boring IXTJ...


----------



## Fat Bozo

hornet said:


> I see!
> So what I should have done when I was uncertain what to call the last vid with @_fihe_
> was call it
> 
> "ISFP/Babe Vid chat"
> 
> instead of boring IXTJ...


That's an improvement, yes. Even better would be "American Babe Gets Grilled by Norwegian Spy." :wink:


----------



## renna

Fat Bozo said:


> This is a great video. Only problem with it is the title. It should be called "Two Hot Chicks & A Baby." It's more descriptive and attracts more viewers.
> 
> You're welcome in advance.


Lol! 

But would it attract the right viewers?! Hmmm.... They'd be like, "wtf, this isn't what I thought this would be? What are they talking about? An interview? Whaaat?"


----------



## renna

Fat Bozo said:


> That's an improvement, yes. Even better would be "American Babe Gets Grilled by Norwegian Spy." :wink:


... So what's your occupation again @Fat Bozo? I'm beginning to wonder? Ha.


----------



## Inveniet

renna said:


> ... So what's your occupation again @_Fat Bozo_? I'm beginning to wonder? Ha.


Well since I'm Bond he would have this role!


----------



## Fat Bozo

renna said:


> Lol!
> 
> But would it attract the right viewers?! Hmmm.... They'd be like, "wtf, this isn't what I thought this would be? What are they talking about? An interview? Whaaat?"


In Youtube land, there's no such thing as "right" or "wrong" viewers. All viewers are equal. Well, unless one of the viewers is a talent scout, in which that might be more of a "right" viewer if they could get you a career in entertainment of some sort.

But if you gave it my title then no one should say it isn't what they thought it would be. "Two Hot Chicks & A Baby" indicates exactly what's in the video. 



renna said:


> ... So what's your occupation again @_Fat Bozo_? I'm beginning to wonder? Ha.


I'm an office manager for a fast food franchise. Obviously, you can tell it's a real busy day for me, since I'm posting messages on forums.


----------



## Figure

Okay, so in honor of getting past my 999th post, a set of enneagram 9 INTJ's - myself, and @_luemb_! What should be interesting is the validity of _tritype theory_, since we share core types and MBTI - but not the other two parts of the enneagram (3w2 5w6 vs. 6w5 2w1)


----------



## luemb

LXPilot said:


>


Here's a link to the article about enneagram body types and boundaries (It explains all the enneagram types). http://personalitycafe.com/articles/109144-triads-enneagram-explained.html


----------



## Helios

LXPilot said:


> Okay, so in honor of getting past my 999th post, a set of enneagram 9 INTJ's - myself, and @_luemb_! What should be interesting is the validity of _tritype theory_, since we share core types and MBTI - but not the other two parts of the enneagram (3w2 5w6 vs. 6w5 2w1)


You both have amazing smiles. By the way. :wink:


----------



## Inveniet

Great interaction @luemb and @LXPilot =D
You INTJs always generate so much interesting content!



luemb said:


> Here's a link to the article about enneagram body types and boundaries (It explains all the enneagram types). http://personalitycafe.com/articles/109144-triads-enneagram-explained.html


Wow I finally get this thread now!
I've seen it multiple times before and was like whatever...
I've always chalked it down to @MBTI Enthusiast being ISTJ, 
not that I lacked the understanding of the Enneagram that I have now.

This kinda explains wings pretty neat for the 9 too,
like how much do you choose to repress the anger vs express.
I have no idea what that means for say 1 and 8 since they cross triads in 8w7 and 1w2. :-/


----------



## MBTI Enthusiast

Aww I wanna talk to my Niney friends, @LXPilot and @luemb! :crying:

lol @hornet - Yes, we ISTJs are cray-cray. :laughing: We pretty much speak in code all the time.


----------



## Inveniet

MBTI Enthusiast said:


> lol @_hornet_ - Yes, we ISTJs are cray-cray. :laughing: We pretty much speak in code all the time.


In code eh...
Well I'm glad to know that I've cracked that code with some INTJ help!


----------



## teddy564339

@LXPilot and @luemb


This is really fascinating hearing about how the Enneagram fits into INTJs! I really think it gives me some insight on why I get along and get happy vibes from some INTJs more than others.

I think when I think of type 5s, I think of NTs, particularly INTJs. I think I have the most conflicts with type 5s, particularly if they are NTs as well.


But even though I don't understand a lot about the Enneagram and I don't quite get my whole tri-type thing...I do know that I feel mostly like I'm a 6 but can also relate to the type 9 and type 2 descriptions. I think I often feel like a peacemaker, and even though I feel like this is related to my Fe, not all Fe users seem to be like that. 

So I thought it was really cool to see type 9 INTJs! It explains so much why I have such an easier time talking with the two of you than I do for a number of INTJs, who are most likely type 5s.


I think it's really cool to see how the Enneagram affects type relations between different MBTI types. It's a great help in overcoming the barriers that sometimes people use MBTI type to create.


It is funny...as I kept listening to the conversation and how both of you understand how people have their own perspectives and you want both people to understand each other...I completely related to it. It's funny, because I had always attributed that to my Fe, and I felt that me wanting people to do it was an example of Fe being controlling. But even though I don't think I'm truly a type 9, it makes me feel like some of these things are more Enneagram related rather than CF related.



The problem is that this just complicates everything even further! It's hard for me to keep together all of these different types and stuff! Damn my poor little Si! :tongue:


----------



## luemb

@teddy564339

Yeah I actually relate really well to the type 9 ISFJs that I've talked to. I'm more of a 9 than an INTJ. 

I think Ni-Te and Si-Fe try to get people to understand each other in differing ways.

For me, at least, Ni-Te understanding comes by understanding what state people are in, how they are reacting to the push-pull factors in their environment, and how that will progress into the future. Ie understanding the archetypes that people are experiencing and living out. So you might see me grin a bit about someone behaving in a certain way because I know that they are acting out a certain archetype and what it will lead to (not that they really are acting a certain archetype, my brain just remembers things in archetypes). Te comes into play when adding some reasoning, looking for facts, or explaining what the steps are to someone else. A couple times friends have come to me wondering about social relations and it's lead to flashes of insight and a sudden ability to explain what I knew (in a vague knowing-sense) was going on. 

Si-Fe would seem like it is more focused on social harmony, agreement of morals and correct actions, on the basis of understood facts.


----------



## renna

teddy564339 said:


> @LXPilot and @luemb
> This is really fascinating hearing about how the Enneagram fits into INTJs! I really think it gives me some insight on why I get along and get happy vibes from some INTJs more than others.


That's basically what I was going to say  I've always noticed that @LXPilot was the classic super sharp INTJ, but had this unique soft "approach" to him. I don't know how else to explain it, lol... Less intimidating but extremely intellectual (I've watched his solo videos)... And in the back of my mind that would always stick out to me about him - a "soft" INTJ, you know? Maybe "soft" is the wrong word here, but it's the only one my Ni/Ti can come up with right now  But you get the idea ;-) 
ANYWAY, my point is - WOW, I never realized how much Enneagram type had so much to do with this "persona/approach" to a person. I read the book 5 years ago, but never really got into it, but NOW it's hitting home for the first time. 

Great videos, great idea...really. 



LXPilot said:


> Okay, so in honor of getting past my 999th post, a set of enneagram 9 INTJ's


Congrats, btw


----------



## Figure

@_renna_

You're giving me way too much credit - but thank you for your kind words! So glad you're enjoying the videos - I haven't seen as many of yours yet, but I _loved_ the one you did with your INTJ earlier. We're all pretty lucky on here to have such resources from each other.

About five minutes ago, I took a run through things, and realized I'm definitely 9w8, not 9w1. The difference might be that an 8 wing will be firm and "sharp" if they get annoyed with their 9 side - which would explain my aversion to being a 9. The 9w1 is usually calmer and more of a reformer - whereas the 8 doesn't care about _changing _you unless it's impeding on what they find important. I think the 8 probably accounts for the "edge" - I subconsciously noticed that during our video, and mistook it for 3w2.

@_teddy564339_

Same as renna - thank you for your comments. It's great to know these videos are helping people see real-life examples of type theory. It's so much better in-person than it is just as theories on a website!

It is interesting, how big of a difference the enneagram makes, isn't it?! Part of our connection may be the integration path from 6 to 9, where we can understand each others' states of mind despite using entirely different functions to get to those points. When 6 becomes confident, it helps you quit worrying about every detail of something, and just relax  When 9 deteriorates, we become very skeptical of others' support. There's something very shared between the two types, as if they can relate to each others' joys and concerns despite the actual cognitive functions dictating them being very different. 

I actually really relate closely with your troubles with INTJ 5's. I find it really hard to excuse them for being "socially clueless" - no, get a clue, you're around people _every day_, and not everyone thinks, or needs to think _like you_. (lol see, it is an 8 wing XD)


----------



## pneumoceptor

Fridays said:


> DominicIgnatiusMarie, looks like Elvis! Ohmy!! Don't you think?


Absolutely! (Sorry for the late response...)


----------



## pneumoceptor

@Celebok (ISTP) and I had a chat this morning that I hope you'll enjoy:
















Despite the awesome random pic youtube chose for the second part, my favorite part of the chat was the third, where Celebok asked a great question about cognitive functions and our faith.


----------



## teddy564339

Yay for @_Celebok_ ! I loved seeing you in a video after chatting with you a little in this thread (and others).


I really enjoyed hearing the whole story of how you thought you were ISTJ instead of ISTP for a while, especially since it was driven by your SJ parents instilling those values in you. I completely agree about how biased some of the "test" questions are, and about how everyone would "prefer" to be organized. I had never thought about how that could make a P type themselves as a J. It is interesting how our culture kind of drives home those J values.

I also agree about how hard it is to type people based on their behavior. I have an online friend that I just met a few months ago. I was thinking that he was an ISFP, or maybe an ISTP. Well, I had him take an MBTI test today, and talked with him about what thinks about things...and it turns out he's an ENTJ! Even though I know that's partly because it's online and it's hard to gauge people....it goes to show how hard it is to type other people. I mean, people sometimes even go through long processes just typing themselves, kind of like you. But yet we often try to type other people and feel very confident about it. I myself am porobably guilty of talking about people that I know as being one type and using them as an example in PerC threads...but I could be completely wrong and my example would mean nothing in the thread. 



The S/N elitism topic is a very interesting one. I honestly believe that the Ns who tend to feel "superior" are probably ones who feel like IRL that S types find them to be inferior...so I feel like sometimes it's some backlash based off of frustration. It's probably very rare for an S to feel talked down to by Ns IRL, so they probably don't feel nearly as much resentment to people that they know IRL who are Ns. So that's my theory.


However, I completely agree with pnuemoceptor that balance is best. Not just with the S/N difference, but with all different combinations of preferences and types.


It was neat to hear about Celebok's road trips. I actually have started doing stuff like that more these last few years or so...but not quite that spontaneous! I feel like I have to reserve hotel rooms and feeling safe...so it's cool to hear that Se way of finding things exciting! It's funny, because it really strikes me as bravery, because it would be hard for me. And yet, for you, it's probably just exciting, and feeling like you can't make you feel like you're being held back.

However, I can completely relate to soaking in the "S" type experience and beauty of nature. Like you, I can't quite describe the feeling of joy I get out of taking in the sights. 

And I'm not saying that N types don't enjoy these things, because they do. But to me, it's almost like a feast for the senses...there's nothing really "deep" about them in terms of abstract theory, but like you...I live for those kind of sensory moments. They're so simple, and yet so powerful.


But like Celebok, I can totally enjoy soaking these things in by myself! And I've *always* felt weird for enjoying these things by myself! I've always felt like this is an awkward thing, and they think I must be lonely to do them by myself. But I oftentimes enjoy them more by myself. I'm so glad to hear that I relate to you in this regard. 

I totally agree that another person would be a hindrance! And that I can't do what I want because someone else is there. 

That's not to say I don't also enjoy doing these things with other people...becuase that's really fun too. But I really love doing them by myself so often too...and I love finally hearing someone else who enjoys that too. I'm just not quite as spontaneous as you are about it...i have to plan them out more.


I thought it was funny to hear pneumoceptor describe her N way of watching IMAXs...because I don't think I do that. I really do immerse myself in it. I love just seeing all of the different animals and be amazed by their behaviors. That's why I love watching nature things on Animal Planet. :happy:


And by the way, pneumo, Bruce Willis is supposedly an ISFJ. :happy:



I don't have a whole lot to comment about the topic of religion, other than the fact that I think it's neat to see people of different types have faith in ways that are similar and yet different. I don't really talk about it a whole lot in relation to type, but I myself am also a Christian...and it's neat to see me (SJ), pneumo (NF) Celebak (SP) and pneumo's friend (NT) all kind of have at least similar faiths. It's interesting to see how all kinds of different people could be Christians, or all kinds of different types could be atheists....or really anything.


I do think some of the things mentioned lined up with 1 Corinthians 12, about how different people do have different strengths and purposes, and that no one is better than any other. But they're like different parts of the body...they all are needed and dependent upon each other (though that also sounds kinda Fe to me :wink: ).

But I think it's really cool to hear about Celebok's ISTP Christian experience. It was funny how using pneumo's 3 categories, I have the most trouble trusting in Truth and the least trouble trusting in Goodness, which is funny since she brought up her ISFJ mom. :wink:



Overall this was a really awesome chat! I loved it!


----------



## renna

teddy564339 said:


> Yay for @_Celebok_ !


Right! I can't wait to get some down time to watch time!! :-D


----------



## Celebok

Thanks, @_pneumoceptor_! It was just as fun chatting with you as I knew it would be! 

LOL at the second YouTube thumbnail!! I should make that my new avatar! Hahaha!! :-D

@_teddy564339_ - Great observations, as usual! That's really cool that you can relate to the enjoying road trips alone! The funny thing is, I don't even think about how weird it is, until I tell people about a road trip I've just done, and they react like, "BY YOURSELF??!?" like it's the craziest thing they've ever heard.

Yeah, I was thinking about the 1 Corinthians 12 analogy, or any of the other passages that talk about spiritual gifts like Romans 12 or Ephesians 4. I was almost going to recite an MBTI version, like, "It was he who gave some to be nurturers, some to be protectors, some to be mechanics, some to be duty fulfillers..." but thought it was too cheesy.


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> @_Celebok_ (ISTP) and I had a chat this morning that I hope you'll enjoy:
> 
> Despite the awesome random pic youtube chose for the second part, my favorite part of the chat was the third, where Celebok asked a great question about cognitive functions and our faith.


I'm commenting as I watch as I've found I forget half of what I'm thinking otherwise.


It was very interesting hearing abut the newbie experience of the type me thread.
I've been involved with several threads where we have been debating a poor persons perspectives.
If you do it enough every thread becomes a platform for your view of MBTI/JCF.
The problem with the type my thread forum is that anybody can comment.
So when you come as a newbie it is random who will show up.
You may get typed by someones stereotypical take on profile descriptions/tests or a strict interpretation of Jung.
Depending on who spots your thread, you may luck out and find you true type, 
or be even more confused and deluded.
Cause the experts may get bored by the inane repetition, and go more fruitful places like this thread. XD
Typing people is hard work, the people with no clue don't get bored and tired as fast, they don't have to work
as hard to front their stereotypical reality.
It is easy to spot the clueless, cause they cannot qualify their assumptions in detail when prompted.
I see a lot of J/P is a dead give away.


Celeboks rapid learning is interesting, it took me quite a while to get up to speed on the cognitive functions.
It is probably easier for a dom Ti user to get the logic than an tert Ni user to infer what is going on.
Especially when the Ti user has has tert Ni to assist with inferences.
Actually much of this didn't click for me, 
before I went out in the real world and used Fi/Se to verify Ni assumptions on real people.


I can relate to having SJs ring to impart their values onto me, however I think my ISTP father,
ESTP cousin and ENFP grandmother offset some of that as they offered different views on the issues
and I could see that the SJs didn't have the supreme answer to everything.


You haven't seen a sensor being frustrated with N's pneumoceptor?
I can get rather annoyed by Ne users, though I don't verbalize it too often.
I remember giving Ne users some flack especially in the enneagram section.
I think the N vs S is too simplistic. 
Those that complain about S users don't understand cognitive functions to begin with, 
or they would specify Se or Si users and their specific problem with that function.
And since they are so clueless to begin with, the person my be an S them self, 
being annoyed by "dumb" people and using the label of S or represent everything they feel are "dumb". :-/


The Se stereotype...
Well yeah everything that Se "should" do sounds exciting and I could and have done many of the things implied.
However Se isn't reckless it just want direct sensory stimuli, the more the better.
I like how Celebok said indulge his senses, that rings very true to me. =)
Whatever you do with Se you let yourself get immersed in the moment of that experience.
Your road trips sound so cool and awesome and I'm kinda inspired to do something similar now.
Another person a hindrance! YES!!! My ISTP father can be such an annoyance when we are out and about.
Did you see this and that and whatever! It becomes this look where i point tyranny.
Generally sharing an Se moment kinda ruins it, as if I have to go inside to judge it and validate it
the general impression is lost on me, I don't get to experience it as fully.
If the other person can keep their mouth shut and only Se for them self I guess it would be alright to share.


The extroverted sensor thing was interesting, cause my dad do comment a lot. Is he an ESTP maybe?
Hmm need to think about that some more.


About the Ni/Se I think Ni gets a lot of it's context from Fe judgements and calibrates that with "small" amounts of Se.
I think Ni high up have a much more developed assumption framework that everything gets parsed trough.
So small amounts of Se + major external judgements is enough to make quite large assumptions that generally work out.
While a Ni tert has a smaller assumption framework and need more Se + minor external judgement to make things work out.


The relating to god part was enlightening, since I'm a Taoist I view that as becoming one with the Tao.
Tao being the origin of everything, and can certainly be equated with god if one is so inclined.
Se in nature can be an "religious" experience for me if it is intense/beautiful enough.
Jung commented a bit on how this relates to religion.


As for Christianity and type I would say that different churches come from different cognitive perspectives.
Some are really conservative SJ while others are more NF liberal. I was raised in a SJ church setting,
and I rebelled against it (Fe/Si). I later discovered more liberal churches, although I resonated with
the general vibe and attitude (Fi/Ni), I couldn't reconcile the dogmatic differences in scripture,
so I just went my own way with Taoism.


Several people on hangout!!? XD 
I've tried it with like three people and it was a mess...
Maybe if you J's could organize it and set an agenda it would work.
Like on person is the leader and controls who should speak and stuff.


----------



## pneumoceptor

teddy564339 said:


> And I'm not saying that N types don't enjoy these things, because they do. But to me, it's almost like a feast for the senses...there's nothing really "deep" about them in terms of abstract theory, but like you...I live for those kind of sensory moments. They're so simple, and yet so powerful.


I think this sounds like a lovely way to be .



> But like Celebok, I can totally enjoy soaking these things in by myself! And I've *always* felt weird for enjoying these things by myself! I've always felt like this is an awkward thing, and they think I must be lonely to do them by myself. But I oftentimes enjoy them more by myself. I'm so glad to hear that I relate to you in this regard.
> 
> I totally agree that another person would be a hindrance! And that I can't do what I want because someone else is there.


This surprises me for an Fe-aux! There are lots of things that I enjoy doing along... but I guess for a bigger experience, like a road trip, I'd want someone (who wasn't always noisy and gave me plenty of reflection time) to experience them with me. 


> And by the way, pneumo, Bruce Willis is supposedly an ISFJ. :happy:


This is completely unrelated, but I have to share it because I find it so hilarious. Zach Galifianakis is a comedian who specializes in awkward, uncomfortable humor. He has a web series talk show called Between Two Ferns. Celebrities go on it and play along with the awkward bit. Bruce Willis was on one time. At the end, Zach told him he must be very proud of his son Ashton Kutcher and how well his career is going. Bruce just squinted. I lost it.



> I don't have a whole lot to comment about the topic of religion, other than the fact that I think it's neat to see people of different types have faith in ways that are similar and yet different. I don't really talk about it a whole lot in relation to type, but I myself am also a Christian...and it's neat to see me (SJ), pneumo (NF) Celebak (SP) and pneumo's friend (NT) all kind of have at least similar faiths. It's interesting to see how all kinds of different people could be Christians, or all kinds of different types could be atheists....or really anything.
> 
> I do think some of the things mentioned lined up with 1 Corinthians 12, about how different people do have different strengths and purposes, and that no one is better than any other. But they're like different parts of the body...they all are needed and dependent upon each other (though that also sounds kinda Fe to me :wink: ).
> 
> But I think it's really cool to hear about Celebok's ISTP Christian experience. It was funny how using pneumo's 3 categories, I have the most trouble trusting in Truth and the least trouble trusting in Goodness, which is funny since she brought up her ISFJ mom. :wink:


Yeah, the 1 Cor 12 stuff seems like a wonderful framework to think about MBTI... and vice versa!


----------



## renna

pneumoceptor said:


> Despite the awesome random pic youtube chose for the second part


That's like my all time favorite thumb nail pic for the ENTIRE series of this interaction thread. 

Anyway, this is one of my favorite chats to watch. I felt like I was involved the entire time. Perhaps it's because I was on the same page the entire time between both parties. After all, I share the same cognitive functions with you both (Ni, Fe, Ti, Se/ Ti, Se, Ni, Fe)... 

I don't have an ISTP in my life that I have confirmed (suspected, but not confirmed by test).... but after this I'm pretty sure she's an ISTP... which really builds my appreciation for these videos in the first place!!! 

Very fun to watch, thanks guys for putting the time in for this


----------



## MissWendy

Hi guys, I've been rapping videos about MBTI function this few days. Found a great one in youtube under DaveSuperPowers user.

And now im in doubt if I am an INTP or INTJ (I've been questioning between this two for a long time) :frustrating:
Im not questioning abt my type to you guys, but i've found this site 
Relations between Psychological ("personality") Types

If im not an INTP, then it would totally change every relationship that I have. My question is:
1. Do you guys find their description to be proper? You have mirror relationship with this type, delusional relationship with this type etc etc
2. How do you guys decide other ppl type? (I used to force everyone around me to take the test to find out but now since so many ppl says test result is often times incorrect how could I say?) And its so much harder to tell after I find out letters DO NOT represent you.

I hope I can learn from your experience.


----------



## Celebok

hornet said:


> It was very interesting hearing abut the newbie experience of the type me thread.
> I've been involved with several threads where we have been debating a poor persons perspectives.
> If you do it enough every thread becomes a platform for your view of MBTI/JCF.
> The problem with the type my thread forum is that anybody can comment.
> So when you come as a newbie it is random who will show up.
> You may get typed by someones stereotypical take on profile descriptions/tests or a strict interpretation of Jung.
> Depending on who spots your thread, you may luck out and find you true type,
> or be even more confused and deluded.
> Cause the experts may get bored by the inane repetition, and go more fruitful places like this thread. XD
> Typing people is hard work, the people with no clue don't get bored and tired as fast, they don't have to work
> as hard to front their stereotypical reality.
> It is easy to spot the clueless, cause they cannot qualify their assumptions in detail when prompted.
> I see a lot of J/P is a dead give away.


That's a really interesting analysis of what goes on in the Type Me threads, and I have to agree with your assessment. It's an unfortunate situation, because the newbies have no way to know this going in, and not all of them are going to figure out how to sort through all the chaos. I'm sure many just get frustrated and leave even more confused than when they started, or just give up on MBTI altogether because they think it's all bogus based on their experience in that thread.



> Celeboks rapid learning is interesting, it took me quite a while to get up to speed on the cognitive functions.
> It is probably easier for a dom Ti user to get the logic than an tert Ni user to infer what is going on.
> Especially when the Ti user has has tert Ni to assist with inferences.
> Actually much of this didn't click for me,
> before I went out in the real world and used Fi/Se to verify Ni assumptions on real people.


I was actually surprised when I figured out the functions. They were way over my head when I first heard about them, and even when I first learned what they were, I figured it would take a long time to learn which functions went with which types and that I'd have to use cheat sheets for a long time. But at some point, I spotted the pattern, and it just somehow clicked in my head how it worked. You're right that it's probably my Ti coupled with Ni that allowed me to figure it out.



> I can relate to having SJs ring to impart their values onto me, however I think my ISTP father,
> ESTP cousin and ENFP grandmother offset some of that as they offered different views on the issues
> and I could see that the SJs didn't have the supreme answer to everything.


You're fortunate that you had multiple "P" types in your family that you respected enough to help you look beyond the SJs' views. My dad scored ISTJ on the test I gave him, but based on everything I know of him, I strongly suspect he's an ISTP who took on an ISTJ persona just as I did. My mom, being an ESFJ, is always very vocal about her views of the way things are and the way things should be, and my dad just kind of goes along with it to keep the peace. So even if my dad is an ISTP, I never got any support from him to offset my mom's "J" values.

I'll just add this, though: If the WORST thing my parents ever did to me was impose SJ values on me, I consider myself to be pretty lucky!



> The Se stereotype...
> Well yeah everything that Se "should" do sounds exciting and I could and have done many of the things implied.
> However Se isn't reckless it just want direct sensory stimuli, the more the better.
> I like how Celebok said indulge his senses, that rings very true to me. =)
> Whatever you do with Se you let yourself get immersed in the moment of that experience.
> Your road trips sound so cool and awesome and I'm kinda inspired to do something similar now.
> Another person a hindrance! YES!!! My ISTP father can be such an annoyance when we are out and about.
> Did you see this and that and whatever! It becomes this look where i point tyranny.
> Generally sharing an Se moment kinda ruins it, as if I have to go inside to judge it and validate it
> the general impression is lost on me, I don't get to experience it as fully.
> If the other person can keep their mouth shut and only Se for them self I guess it would be alright to share.


Haha! Yep, that's exactly right! I want to experience the moment in my own way, and hearing someone else's interpretation of that same moment basically contaminates the experience. I'm really happy to hear that my road trip descriptions have inspired you! 



> As for Christianity and type I would say that different churches come from different cognitive perspectives.
> Some are really conservative SJ while others are more NF liberal. I was raised in a SJ church setting,
> and I rebelled against it (Fe/Si). I later discovered more liberal churches, although I resonated with
> the general vibe and attitude (Fi/Ni), I couldn't reconcile the dogmatic differences in scripture,
> so I just went my own way with Taoism.


Ideally, any Christian church should be made up of a large enough diversity of different types of people that it shouldn't take on its own SJ or NF or whatever identity (which is what those passages of Scripture about the "body of Christ" are basically talking about, all the different parts working together), but the reality of churches, both today and throughout history, is unfortunately much like how you described. But there's a saying I've heard from my pastor and others that says, if you ever find a perfect church, don't go there, because you'll mess it up!  So my approach to the Christian life is to trust in the Bible as God's ultimate authority and live my life based on that, and the church I attend is just there to help me grow in my relationship with God and provide a place for me to help my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ do the same.


----------



## Celebok

renna said:


> That's like my all time favorite thumb nail pic for the ENTIRE series of this interaction thread.


Hehehe! :-D



> Anyway, this is one of my favorite chats to watch. I felt like I was involved the entire time. Perhaps it's because I was on the same page the entire time between both parties. After all, I share the same cognitive functions with you both (Ni, Fe, Ti, Se/ Ti, Se, Ni, Fe)...
> 
> I don't have an ISTP in my life that I have confirmed (suspected, but not confirmed by test).... but after this I'm pretty sure she's an ISTP... which really builds my appreciation for these videos in the first place!!!
> 
> Very fun to watch, thanks guys for putting the time in for this


Awww, your response really made my day! Thanks! :-D I always think people are going to be bored listening to me talk, so I'm glad to know that you enjoyed it!


----------



## Celebok

Here are a few sample pics from my most recent "random" road trip I did back in July. It kinda shows the variety of places I saw that I didn't plan to visit any more than 24 hours in advance.


----------



## pneumoceptor

MissWendy said:


> Hi guys, I've been rapping videos about MBTI function this few days. Found a great one in youtube under DaveSuperPowers user.
> 
> And now im in doubt if I am an INTP or INTJ (I've been questioning between this two for a long time) :frustrating:
> Im not questioning abt my type to you guys, but i've found this site
> Relations between Psychological ("personality") Types
> 
> If im not an INTP, then it would totally change every relationship that I have. My question is:
> 1. Do you guys find their description to be proper? You have mirror relationship with this type, delusional relationship with this type etc etc
> 2. How do you guys decide other ppl type? (I used to force everyone around me to take the test to find out but now since so many ppl says test result is often times incorrect how could I say?) And its so much harder to tell after I find out letters DO NOT represent you.
> 
> I hope I can learn from your experience.


This thread is mainly about interaction videos between personality types. But here might be a good place for you to start honing in on your type: What's my personality type?


----------



## Inveniet

Celebok said:


> That's a really interesting analysis of what goes on in the Type Me threads, and I have to agree with your assessment. It's an unfortunate situation, because the newbies have no way to know this going in, and not all of them are going to figure out how to sort through all the chaos. I'm sure many just get frustrated and leave even more confused than when they started, or just give up on MBTI altogether because they think it's all bogus based on their experience in that thread.


Yes that is the way it goes.
You can't "save" everyone, I go to the type me threads when I'm bored or I want to practice typing skills.
Obviously I make my best predictions from the practice frame, as I have a more structured and methodical approach.
If I'm bored it becomes more like a shotgun typing.
Ready, aim, *FIRE!!!*




> I was actually surprised when I figured out the functions. They were way over my head when I first heard about them, and even when I first learned what they were, I figured it would take a long time to learn which functions went with which types and that I'd have to use cheat sheets for a long time. But at some point, I spotted the pattern, and it just somehow clicked in my head how it worked. You're right that it's probably my Ti coupled with Ni that allowed me to figure it out.


Yeah Ni is nice in that it does the work without your awareness much of the time.
It can be used consciously knowing it is about seeing patterns and "guessing",
but it is draining.



> You're fortunate that you had multiple "P" types in your family that you respected enough to help you look beyond the SJs' views. My dad scored ISTJ on the test I gave him, but based on everything I know of him, I strongly suspect he's an ISTP who took on an ISTJ persona just as I did. My mom, being an ESFJ, is always very vocal about her views of the way things are and the way things should be, and my dad just kind of goes along with it to keep the peace. So even if my dad is an ISTP, I never got any support from him to offset my mom's "J" values.
> 
> I'll just add this, though: If the WORST thing my parents ever did to me was impose SJ values on me, I consider myself to be pretty lucky!


I understand what you mean!
You could have a much worse fate than being told to make your bed every morning...
Still when you understand the energy drain that certain things put on you,
you kinda need to rebel against it, *in a mild way,* to establish a balance in your life.


----------



## Fat Bozo

By the way, in case I didn't make it abundantly clear earlier in this topic, I will chat with ANYONE, so if you want to babble with the Bozo, just let me know! 

I'm getting behind on the video watching again, I never finished the one with hornet and fihe! Better get back on the horse! Haha.


----------



## renna

Celebok said:


> Here are a few sample pics from my most recent "random" road trip I did back in July. It kinda shows the variety of places I saw that I didn't plan to visit any more than 24 hours in advance.
> 
> View attachment 48923
> View attachment 48924
> View attachment 48925
> View attachment 48926
> View attachment 48927


Those are awesome!!!

BUuuuuuuuuut are these the road trips taken by yourself? And if so, did you ask a random stranger to take the picture of you posing like that? Just wondering ;-)


----------



## pneumoceptor

renna said:


> Those are awesome!!!
> 
> BUuuuuuuuuut are these the road trips taken by yourself? And if so, did you ask a random stranger to take the picture of you posing like that? Just wondering ;-)


Those were my thoughts too. But then I figured, maybe he set the pics up himself. Which is also fun.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@viva and @innovati, I just watched your vid. Loved it. It's really fun to see interactions between friends... It brings out the goofiness and the non-verbals. I wish some of my real life friends were more into this. Maybe I'll start proselytizing. 

Thank you!


----------



## Celebok

renna said:


> Those are awesome!!!
> 
> BUuuuuuuuuut are these the road trips taken by yourself? And if so, did you ask a random stranger to take the picture of you posing like that? Just wondering ;-)


Yep, I was by myself that entire trip. I took those pics by setting up my camera on a tripod and using the timer. I've been doing it that way for years. 

By the way, I forgot to mention, my current avatar is from a similar random road trip I did last year, and kind of represents the more typical random aspect of it, where I just happen to see something unusual as I'm driving, so I pull over to see what it is and take a picture.


----------



## renna

Tri-pod - Ding ding ding! I was imagining all kinds of things you were setting that camera on >.< :-D Ha! That would of been my way of doing it... the hard way. I would know because I have never used a tripod. Yeah, my INTP ex used to take random road trips like this. Sometimes w/ ppl, sometimes without. Sometimes, I didn't even know he was gone until days in - that's how it was - he would just get up and go. I like that about the free spirit. 

INTPs & ISTPs have this deep free spirit that is hard to describe but there inside for a purpose.


----------



## Celebok

renna said:


> Tri-pod - Ding ding ding! I was imagining all kinds of things you were setting that camera on >.< :-D Ha! That would of been my way of doing it... the hard way. I would know because I have never used a tripod.


Hehe, before I bought the tripod, I used to set my camera on whatever objects were around, and use coins or whatever to raise the camera angle. But after a while I got frustrated when there were certain shots I wanted, and I was by myself, and there was absolutely nothing to put my camera on, so I went and bought a simple but sturdy tripod, and it's served me well. I even used it to mount my webcam for my type interaction video!



> Yeah, my INTP ex used to take random road trips like this. Sometimes w/ ppl, sometimes without. Sometimes, I didn't even know he was gone until days in - that's how it was - he would just get up and go. I like that about the free spirit.
> 
> INTPs & ISTPs have this deep free spirit that is hard to describe but there inside for a purpose.


That's cool, I wasn't sure if INTPs would have that same desire. So maybe it's the aux perceiver wanting to be spontaneous and get up and go somewhere. I guess I can see how the Ne would be imagining all the possibilities of places to visit, while my Se is just interested in seeing whatever comes up.

My (ESFJ) mom hates it when I just decide to go take a trip without telling her, because she's worried that something might happen to me, especially after that movie "127 Hours".


----------



## innovati

@pneumoceptor -> I think the thing that's understated here is that I met @_viva_ in person for the first time a day before that video was recorded…


----------



## renna

innovati said:


> @pneumoceptor -> I think the thing that's understated here is that I met @_viva_ in person for the first time a day before that video was recorded…


That was completely UNDERSTATED. I had no idea! You guys seemed so comfortable w/ each other.


----------



## innovati

@renna *that* is the magic of the _INFJ–ENFP_ connection and why it's so special. It's like having a telepathic link; imagine your inner monologue was having a conversation in two different voices - only it's two entirely different _people_, but totally in sync at all times.

Can't wait…


----------



## renna

innovati said:


> @pneumoceptor -> I think the thing that's understated here is that I met @_viva_ in person for the first time a day before that video was recorded…


May I ask, are you guys dating?


----------



## viva

renna said:


> May I ask, are you guys dating?


We are now. :kitteh:


----------



## Lady Lullaby

renna said:


> Yeah, my INTP ex used to take random road trips like this. Sometimes w/ ppl, sometimes without. Sometimes, I didn't even know he was gone until days in - that's how it was - he would just get up and go. I like that about the free spirit.
> 
> INTPs & ISTPs have this deep free spirit that is hard to describe but there inside for a purpose.





Celebok said:


> That's cool, I wasn't sure if INTPs would have that same desire. So maybe it's the aux perceiver wanting to be spontaneous and get up and go somewhere. I guess I can see how the Ne would be imagining all the possibilities of places to visit, while my Se is just interested in seeing whatever comes up.


Interesting! Everyone is so different. My INTP hubby HATES traveling. He is SUCH a homebody :wink:! Just taking the 4 1/2 hour trip to see his parents for holidays gets him griping. . . .and I asked him the other day (in reference to something else) if he would call himself more 'scheduled' or 'spontaneous' and he said...'well, I'm not really spontaneous...so....' LOL

But he doesn't like to be 'pinned down'. He always keeps his options open - getting him to commit to an appointment is near impossible! I have to tell him a week in advance, be sure he knows how important it is to me and once he's agreed then at least 2 days before I have to remind him he said yes. hehehe Good thing I don't ask him to 'go' places with me that often!


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> Interesting! Everyone is so different. My INTP hubby HATES traveling. He is SUCH a homebody :wink:! Just taking the 4 1/2 hour trip to see his parents for holidays gets him griping. . . .and I asked him the other day (in reference to something else) if he would call himself more 'scheduled' or 'spontaneous' and he said...'well, I'm not really spontaneous...so....' LOL
> 
> But he doesn't like to be 'pinned down'. He always keeps his options open - getting him to commit to an appointment is near impossible! I have to tell him a week in advance, be sure he knows how important it is to me and once he's agreed then at least 2 days before I have to remind him he said yes. hehehe Good thing I don't ask him to 'go' places with me that often!


I think whether or not a person likes to travel has more to do with their traveling experiences and exposure, way moreso than type. If your husband automatically thinks of the boring 4 1/2 hour drive to his parents' house when he thinks of traveling, then that would certainly create a negative impression. @pneumoceptor mentioned something similar in my recent interaction with her, about how she made the long boring drive from New Mexico to Colorado several times during her senior year in high school to visit her parents. I used to think I absolutely hated long drives, because I had the same experience as a kid, having to tag along with my parents on a 4 hour drive from LA to central California for family gatherings. I started appreciating road trips a lot more when I started planning the routes myself and got to explore new places, instead of seeing the long drive as just a means of getting somewhere.

And on the ISTP forum, there was recently a thread started by a teenage boy who was trying to understand the appeal of taking vacations to go see different parts of the world, when his only experience was being dragged to vacation spots by his parents against his will. Us older ISTPs all agreed that travelling is much more fun when you're the one in complete control during the entire trip and get to do whatever you feel like doing at any moment of the day. 

I'd imagine a similar concept applies to other personality types, which are more likely to enjoy traveling for different reasons.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Celebok said:


> I think whether or not a person likes to travel has more to do with their traveling experiences and exposure, way moreso than type. If your husband automatically thinks of the boring 4 1/2 hour drive to his parents' house when he thinks of traveling, then that would certainly create a negative impression. @_pneumoceptor_ mentioned something similar in my recent interaction with her, about how she made the long boring drive from New Mexico to Colorado several times during her senior year in high school to visit her parents. I used to think I absolutely hated long drives, because I had the same experience as a kid, having to tag along with my parents on a 4 hour drive from LA to central California for family gatherings. I started appreciating road trips a lot more when I started planning the routes myself and got to explore new places, instead of seeing the long drive as just a means of getting somewhere.And on the ISTP forum, there was recently a thread started by a teenage boy who was trying to understand the appeal of taking vacations to go see different parts of the world, when his only experience was being dragged to vacation spots by his parents against his will. Us older ISTPs all agreed that travelling is much more fun when you're the one in complete control during the entire trip and get to do whatever you feel like doing at any moment of the day. I'd imagine a similar concept applies to other personality types, which are more likely to enjoy traveling for different reasons.


I gave my husband's attitude as an example of the how there can be differences between INTPs because @_renna_ had mentioned her INTP-ex. I totally agree with you. The thing is, my hubby was even groaning when we went to Hawaii! He liked pieces of it while we were there, he just really hated being on the plane with other people, and he doesn't like leaving all his gadgets behind LOL. I personally love to see new places and mix things up. When we would visit my sister in CA he'd sit on the beach with his eyes closed listening to his audiobook the whole time. I would poke him and and say - 'hey - isn't the ocean gorgeous?' he'd peek at it over his sunglasses, nod, and then put his glasses back on. I just get a kick out of how different we are. 

I understand your point about our experiences shaping our attitudes about things, i.e. travel. I'm sure there are INTPs, and any other personality type out there who enjoys travel for their own reasons. I just thought it was funny in contrast to how much I'd love to just 'hit the road' for the fun of it now and then and how his idea of fun can occur at home with his laptop or other gadgets. I rarely see him get excited about anything - the latest glimmer of 'excitement' he showed was when he sold 15 apps, in one day, of his audiobook player that he created.

P.S. I saw your vid and posted a comment on youtube. I really, really enjoyed it!


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> I gave my husband's attitude as an example of the how there can be differences between INTPs because @_renna_ had mentioned her INTP-ex. I totally agree with you. The thing is, my hubby was even groaning when we went to Hawaii! He liked pieces of it while we were there, he just really hated being on the plane with other people, and he doesn't like leaving all his gadgets behind LOL. I personally love to see new places and mix things up. When we would visit my sister in CA he'd sit on the beach with his eyes closed listening to his audiobook the whole time. I would poke him and and say - 'hey - isn't the ocean gorgeous?' he'd peek at it over his sunglasses, nod, and then put his glasses back on. I just get a kick out of how different we are.
> 
> I understand your point about our experiences shaping our attitudes about things, i.e. travel. I'm sure there are INTPs, and any other personality type out there who enjoys travel for their own reasons. I just thought it was funny in contrast to how much I'd love to just 'hit the road' for the fun of it now and then and how his idea of fun can occur at home with his laptop or other gadgets. I rarely see him get excited about anything - the latest glimmer of 'excitement' he showed was when he sold 15 apps, in one day, of his audiobook player that he created.


Hehe, yeah, that sounds like the more stereotypical INTP that I've read about.  I can actually relate to a lot of that myself. I don't own a ton of gadgets that I use all the time -- my Android phone that I've had for nearly two years kind of elimates the need for that... but I do take it everywhere I go, and I'm constantly using it for Facebook, Twitter, e-mail, maps, weather, calendar, notes, or whatever. And I do take my laptop on vacation if it's for more than a few days. So I can relate to the INTP's desire to use high-tech tools to keep my world organized, which might be partly because we share dominant Ti, but most likely it's just a matter of interests.

As for Renna's INTP ex-boyfriend going off on spontaneous trips without warning... I don't know, maybe he was just trying to get away from HER? (Just kidding, @renna!!!!) ;-)



> P.S. I saw your vid and posted a comment on youtube. I really, really enjoyed it!


Oh, cool! Thanks!


----------



## renna

Celebok said:


> As for Renna's INTP ex-boyfriend going off on spontaneous trips without warning... I don't know, maybe he was just trying to get away from HER? (Just kidding, @renna!!!!) ;-)


:-O Oh no you Didn't! *waving finger* ;-) Yeah who knows why he did this. He was a workaholic for shamed based reasons, I think he just needed to get away from it all, including me - yeah. Plus he smoked pot all the time and just wanted to be secluded, these trips combined the two. Yeah, I dated an interesting person, lol. So maybe my example just doesn't count at all.


----------



## Celebok

renna said:


> :-O Oh no you Didn't! *waving finger* ;-)


Hehehehe. I couldn't resist. 



> Yeah who knows why he did this. He was a workaholic for shamed based reasons, I think he just needed to get away from it all, including me - yeah. Plus he smoked pot all the time and just wanted to be secluded, these trips combined the two. Yeah, I dated an interesting person, lol. So maybe my example just doesn't count at all.


Wow. Definitely interesting. Yeah, it definitely sounds like his reasons had nothing to do with his type. But it's a really good example of differences in people of the same type (comparing him with Lady Lullaby's husband) and how there are many different reasons why a person would choose to travel on a whim -- psychological, environmental... and apparently chemical.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Here's my chat from tonight with atypeofuser-


----------



## Kabosu

Ok, I finally realized I had to "enable hangouts on air" and other things in order for that broadcast option to be available haha. So now if someone wants me to record instead on something I think I could do that.

Maybe if the one I failed wouldn't mind doing a condensed version of what we attempted last time, that'd work.


----------



## Inveniet

innovati said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ -> I think the thing that's understated here is that I met @_viva_ in person for the first time a day before that video was recorded…





renna said:


> That was completely UNDERSTATED. I had no idea! You guys seemed so comfortable w/ each other.





Fat Bozo said:


> Here's my chat from tonight with atypeofuser-


Nice one!
It was funny watching two people I've talked to chatting.
A bit weird being referred to also... XD

I get where @Fat Bozo is coming from as I share his sentiment about typing people to a certain extent.
I found it interesting that it was the issue of dismissing people on type that was the main grudge.
It is easy to fall into the trap of dismissing people based on MBTI,
but you don't have to come from that frame. I try to view it as certain misunderstandings and issues tend
to arise with certain types, so when those things happen I can be fairly certain that they are in that type range.
I don't really mention this to people out in the real world anymore.
I just think in my head, oh look this must be that type since x, y, z.
Will that be a problem, or doesn't it matter.

I was so happy when my driving instructor was a fellow ISFP, made me learning a ton easier. =D
If I had gotten say a type that had communication issues with me I might have had to switch instructor.
Of course other factors play in also and I don't react the same to every person of the same type.
But when you have a *conflict of information* you can be pretty sure that MBTI can explain it well.

Enneagram is more about negative emotions and how you deal with them from what I can gather at this point in time.
I agree that the enneagram profiles are even more random and messed up than the MBTI profiles.
Quality information is a scarce resource in enneagram land. :-/


----------



## DimensionX

These are some great interaction videos! 

I'd love to do an interaction video with someone, I'm pretty new here though, hope that's okay


----------



## Fat Bozo

DimensionX said:


> These are some great interaction videos!
> 
> I'd love to do an interaction video with someone, I'm pretty new here though, hope that's okay


No, it's not okay to be new, you should be ashamed of yourself. 


=P

But seriously, I'd love to vid-chat with you, how's tomorrow for you?


----------



## MrMagpie

I'm fairly interested in the idea of participating in an interactional video - however, I'm not well-versed in the details of Typing, so having a conversation concerning solely that subject wouldn't really be feasible.


----------



## DimensionX

Fat Bozo said:


> No, it's not okay to be new, you should be ashamed of yourself.
> 
> 
> =P
> 
> But seriously, I'd love to vid-chat with you, how's tomorrow for you?


Tomorrow being Sat 20th? That's good, can't do Sunday though unfortunately. Did you have a time in mind? Also, what time zone are you in? (I'm GMT, so +5hrs from EST)

I'd like to do a number of these, actually not necessarily to "make an interaction video" but also just to get to know some of the members here


----------



## Fridays

Fat Bozo said:


> No, it's not okay to be new, you should be ashamed of yourself.
> 
> 
> =P
> 
> But seriously, I'd love to vid-chat with you, how's tomorrow for you?


LOL!!!!!!!!!! :crazy: :laughing:


----------



## Celebok

Those of you who have done type interaction videos so far, I'm wondering, have you gained any interesting insights from watching your own interaction? I hate watching myself on video, but as I rewatched the interaction I did with @pneumoceptor, some interesting thoughts crossed my mind.

In a nutshell, my conversational skills suck. It's something I've known for a long time, but listening to myself in an actual conversation, I was able to analyze what was really going on. Basically, most of my thoughts are self-centered, and whenever the other person says something, I immediately process it and then figure out how I can relate to it, and then I spit out the result. The unfortunate result is that I end up not asking the other person enough questions and therefore don't get to know that person better through our conversation. The thing that made me realize this upon rewatch was that since I was no longer thinking of things to say, I was a lot more focused on listening to what Pneumoceptor was saying, and everytime she said something about herself, a followup question immediately popped into my mind that I expected to hear myself ask, but instead, I would hear myself launch into some other comment about how that relates to my life. So it's like, during the actual conversation, my Ti and Se were operating at full capacity, leaving no room for Ni or Fe, but when rewatching, my Ni and Fe were allowed processing time, thus making me want to know more about Pneumoceptor and ask followup questions.

Anyway, I'm just curious to know if anyone else has gained any interesting insights from watching your own interaction video that you'd like to share.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Celebok said:


> Those of you who have done type interaction videos so far, I'm wondering, have you gained any interesting insights from watching your own interaction? I hate watching myself on video, but as I rewatched the interaction I did with @_pneumoceptor_, some interesting thoughts crossed my mind.
> 
> In a nutshell, my conversational skills suck. It's something I've known for a long time, but listening to myself in an actual conversation, I was able to analyze what was really going on. Basically, most of my thoughts are self-centered, and whenever the other person says something, I immediately process it and then figure out how I can relate to it, and then I spit out the result. The unfortunate result is that I end up not asking the other person enough questions and therefore don't get to know that person better through our conversation. The thing that made me realize this upon rewatch was that since I was no longer thinking of things to say, I was a lot more focused on listening to what Pneumoceptor was saying, and everytime she said something about herself, a followup question immediately popped into my mind that I expected to hear myself ask, but instead, I would hear myself launch into some other comment about how that relates to my life. So it's like, during the actual conversation, my Ti and Se were operating at full capacity, leaving no room for Ni or Fe, but when rewatching, my Ni and Fe were allowed processing time, thus making me want to know more about Pneumoceptor and ask followup questions.
> 
> Anyway, I'm just curious to know if anyone else has gained any interesting insights from watching your own interaction video that you'd like to share.


I think it's actually quite beautiful that, just now, you looked at yourself critically and that you shared something vulnerable in hopes of processing it and maybe offering insight to others.

I would say that EVERYONE'S thoughts are self-centered. Of course this is always our default... how could it be any other way? Mine are self-centered during these conversations, too... unless I'm drawn in (based on empathy or keen intellectual interest) to what the other person is saying. That said, there is an "art" to conversation . Some of it is genuine, and some is a facade. There's nothing "pure" coming out of any of us. 

Anyway, I agree that Fe (and Te?) might help to engage more in the outside rather than the inside of oneself. But the fact that you are thinking about this really means everything. Being aware of it allows sloooooow change, if you want change. And to the extent that it's just who you are, to be more internally than externally focused, well, bravo! Being an introvert has its perks too .


----------



## Celebok

pneumoceptor said:


> I think it's actually quite beautiful that, just now, you looked at yourself critically and that you shared something vulnerable in hopes of processing it and maybe offering insight to others.
> 
> I would say that EVERYONE'S thoughts are self-centered. Of course this is always our default... how could it be any other way? Mine are self-centered during these conversations, too... unless I'm drawn in (based on empathy or keen intellectual interest) to what the other person is saying. That said, there is an "art" to conversation . Some of it is genuine, and some is a facade. There's nothing "pure" coming out of any of us.
> 
> Anyway, I agree that Fe (and Te?) might help to engage more in the outside rather than the inside of oneself. But the fact that you are thinking about this really means everything. Being aware of it allows sloooooow change, if you want change. And to the extent that it's just who you are, to be more internally than externally focused, well, bravo! Being an introvert has its perks too .


Thanks, @pneumoceptor!! I really appreciate the encouragement!  Yeah, I do hope to improve on this now that I've realized it, but it's definitely going to take a while to break old habits. I probably just need to keep practicing in live conversations, which is something that online and text communication has deprived me of, even though I'm MUCH more comfortable and articulate in writing.

They say that one of the best ways to develop your lower functions is to hang around people who use those functions as their dominants, so it's probably good for me to be talking with INFJs and ENFJs, as well as perhaps INTJs, ISFJs, or ESFJs. (Anyone want to volunteer?)


----------



## Celebok

Celebok said:


> so it's probably good for me to be talking with INFJs and ENFJs, as well as perhaps INTJs, ISFJs, or ESFJs. (Anyone want to volunteer?)


By the way, I won't limit myself to ONLY those types, if anyone else wants to do a video chat with me.


----------



## pneumoceptor

This morning, I had a lovely conversation with INFP @rshortman. It's looong... mostly because I didn't want to stop . Hope you enjoy at least some of it!


----------



## teddy564339

@Celebok

I actually got the impression from your conversation that you were very personable and that the conversation flowed perfectly. It was a very easy conversation for me to listen to and I felt like I would get along with you quite well.


I think pneumoceptor was exactly right when she said this:





pneumoceptor said:


> I would say that EVERYONE'S thoughts are self-centered. Of course this is always our default... how could it be any other way? Mine are self-centered during these conversations, too... unless I'm drawn in (based on empathy or keen intellectual interest) to what the other person is saying. That said, there is an "art" to conversation . Some of it is genuine, and some is a facade. There's nothing "pure" coming out of any of us.



*All* people do this in conversation. I'm an Fe user, and I still almost always think a lot about what I'm going to say when someone else is talking.

I actually went to a staff development thing a while ago where this was mentioned...and in part of our training we practiced having a conversation with someone where you focus entirely on what the other person is saying. It is extremely hard. The only time when I can do it is when I am try extremely hard to.

In conversations, the other person says so many things...and it makes all kinds of memories and thoughts pop up in your head. You want to respond to one thing they say and share what you're thinking before they're done. So you want to make sure you don't forget it, but you also don't want to interrupt. So often you can't listen to everything they're saying.

But no one wants to regulate a conversation by limiting how long one person can talk either.


So honestly...I think it's damn near impossible for anyone to listen to everything someone else says without there being a lot of long pauses in the conversation...and in these video chats, it's hard to have those. 

I think your conversation with pneumoceptor flowed beautifully and I didn't notice at all that you were "dominating" the conversation or steering it away from her points.


The other thing I'll say is...I think because pneumoceptor has done so many of these, and because she's the one leading it...I think the conversation is always more focused on the other person. It's not that we don't want to hear all of the stuff that pnuemo has to say...but we've also heard a lot from her in each of these videos. So I think she (either consciously or sub-consciously) makes the conversation more focused on the other person. She did the same with mine...I felt like I talked more than she did, but I also think she encouraged that by asking a lot of questions. And as I admitted in the conversation...I had trouble thinking of my own.

But I also think she likes the idea of differnet types being able to express things about their types. We get to hear her INFJ take in every video...but each one highlights a different type, and she's said that she wants to have someone of every type in there eventually. So it's very natural for the conversation to be more focused on the other person in her chats.



As far as my own...I actually have greatly enjoyed watching my own again a few times to think about some stuff. I don't think I saw anything about me that bothered me (other than the fact that I don't pronounce L sounds right...it's something I've done wrong since I was a kid, and the video has made me constantly work on improving it again). I did think it was funny how Southern I sound.

I do think there were some things that I would either elaborate on or edit in retrospect, though. However, as LXPilot mentioned...that's the great things about these chats, that they're imperfect. On the spot, you can't remember everything that you really want to say....you have to kind of react instantly. So that makes it tougher to say everything that you want to. But that's what I like about them too...you really get to see what people would be like in person rather than through text.



So it's really fun.



I'm planning on watching Fat Bozo's latest one and pneumo's latest one later...hopefully I'll be able to comment soon.


----------



## renna

teddy564339 said:


> @Celebok
> 
> I actually got the impression from your conversation that you were very personable and that the conversation flowed perfectly. It was a very easy conversation for me to listen to and I felt like I would get along with you quite well.


Agreed!  

Do you remember me saying that I felt like I was right there in the conversation the entire time? I've never said that before so obviously both of you had to be on the same page w/ convo (as well as fluent). 

@pneumoceptor said:


> I would say that EVERYONE'S thoughts are self-centered. Of course this is always our default... how could it be any other way? Mine are self-centered during these conversations, too... unless I'm drawn in (based on empathy or keen intellectual interest) to what the other person is saying. That said, there is an "art" to conversation . Some of it is genuine, and some is a facade. There's nothing "pure" coming out of any of us.


 @Celebok - Again, agreed.

Also, It may feel like you are very self centered in your convo but you are mistaken that "feeling" for Ti. (Which I've heard and seen people mistaken Ti for Fi and link that together, weird huh?) You asked pneumoceptor personable (and believe it or not) inspirational like questions to her as well. Questions that were asked about HER faith and NOT centered on you, that was your Fe's doing, you know? Just saying in NO WAY did you appear self centered with your convo style ^.^


----------



## Zeitgeist

pneumoceptor said:


> This morning, I had a lovely conversation with INFP @_rshortman_. It's looong... mostly because I didn't want to stop . Hope you enjoy at least some of it!


I had a good time! Thanks Pneumoceptor!


----------



## Zeitgeist

renna said:


> Agreed!
> 
> Do you remember me saying that I felt like I was right there in the conversation the entire time? I've never said that before so obviously both of you had to be on the same page w/ convo (as well as fluent).
> 
> @_pneumoceptor_ said:
> @_Celebok_ - Again, agreed.
> 
> Also, It may feel like you are very self centered in your convo but you are mistaken that "feeling" for Ti. (Which I've heard and seen people mistaken Ti for Fi and link that together, weird huh?) You asked pneumoceptor personable (and believe it or not) inspirational like questions to her as well. Questions that were asked about HER faith and NOT centered on you, that was your Fe's doing, you know? Just saying in NO WAY did you appear self centered with your convo style ^.^


I felt pretty critical of myself watching the videos too. I take way too long to think about what I'm saying and what comes out is so droll and void of sustance (because I over-censor) that I actually felt impatient listening to myself. I hold people on the brink of suspense a lot probably! How annoying, lol.


----------



## teddy564339

@_Fat Bozo_ @_atypeofuser_


This was definitely a fascinating video. I have a number of thoughts about it.


I do think the N/S difference came out a little in the beginning. I think it was interesting how Fat Bozo said that he felt like he was losing time if he wasn't doing anything...because a large number of Ns have told me the opposite...they really enjoy thinking a lot about various topics and just doing a lot of "mind wandering".


It always interests me to hear how much SPs focus on life in the moment. For me, I get a whole lot of pleasure and joy focusing on the past and reminiscing about things...I do it all of the time. I really think in general SJs are much more "past oriented" than SPs are.


Fat Bozo's hornet impression really made me laugh...it was quite funny and good natured. 


But as far as the CF conversation goes...I kind of agree and kind of don't. On one hand, I do agree that a lot of PerC people, myself definitely included, use the CFs too much for explanations, and we kind of over simplify things. I think we do sometimes look for the functions as a quick answer. We sometimes jump to identify any behavior with a CF...especially considering that a lot of behavior can fit with a lot of other functions.


However, I do believe that each type does have a stacking of their CFs. I think some of the diversity of each type is how well they've developed their functions, though.

Of course, there's a lot more that plays into it. The Enneagram is a big part, and also people's environment/experiences have a huge impact on personality.


But...I do think that the CFs help explain the differences in type. I really do think that Se vs. Si explains the differences in SJs vs. SPs (though Ji vs. Je is also a big part of it).

I also think that in general I would have a lot more in common with an ISTJ than an ISFP. Even though we only have one preference different...an ISFP has very different CFs than I do.

You could say that's also because our temperaments are different...but I don't know if that's as true for NFs and NTs. For example, I think an ENFP has more in common with an ENTP than an ENFJ because they both share Ne.


However, I do think that the CFs are just a starting point...just a natural preference. It doesn't dictate or control one's behavior...it just describes what naturally drives them. There is still a lot of diversity among people with the same CFs.


But I do think that a lot of the Keirsey differences in termperament actually line up quite strongly with the CFs...especially since the CFs help explain the differences between the types within the same temperament.



However, I greatly agree that people shouldn't use their type as an excuse for any behavior, and I think that many MBTI books are good at emphasizing this.


But I think it's like you said about how SJs crave security the most and SPs crave sensations the most. I think that really does line up with the Si and Se descriptions.


But I do agree that for me, security does motivate me for living...so I totally related when you said that experiences/sensations are what motivate you the most.


I also relate to the idea that I've reached the point where I'm able to greatly enjoy life, even though there are some ups and downs. However, I think I have a greater desire for stability that you do.


I think the I/E difference in conversation is kind of dependent on other factors too...maybe the Enneagram plays into it some too. I've definitely noticed a difference in the introverts in these videos in that area.


I do agree that the Enneagram is a lot tougher...but I think that's why people have "tri-types" most of the time. I feel like I'm a 6, but I also relate to the 9 and 2 descriptions.

I do have one MBTI book that lines up which MBTI types are likely to be certain Enneagram types. It did say that ESFPs are most likely to be 2s and 7s, and that ESTPs are most likely to be 3s and 7s.



So a lot of interesting topics in the chat!


----------



## Celebok

@teddy564339 and @renna, thank you so much for your kind comments!  That's good to know that you didn't perceive any self-centeredness from me during that conversation. But it's something that I caught while rewatching that I feel I could try to improve on in future conversations with other people.



teddy564339 said:


> I actually went to a staff development thing a while ago where this was mentioned...and in part of our training we practiced having a conversation with someone where you focus entirely on what the other person is saying. It is extremely hard. The only time when I can do it is when I am try extremely hard to.
> 
> In conversations, the other person says so many things...and it makes all kinds of memories and thoughts pop up in your head. You want to respond to one thing they say and share what you're thinking before they're done. So you want to make sure you don't forget it, but you also don't want to interrupt. So often you can't listen to everything they're saying.
> 
> But no one wants to regulate a conversation by limiting how long one person can talk either.
> 
> 
> So honestly...I think it's damn near impossible for anyone to listen to everything someone else says without there being a lot of long pauses in the conversation...and in these video chats, it's hard to have those.


Yeah, that's really interesting. I figured it was a common thing with people in general, but I also know that some people are quite skilled at the art of conversation, and there was obviously a reason why that staff training had that exercise.



> The other thing I'll say is...I think because pneumoceptor has done so many of these, and because she's the one leading it...I think the conversation is always more focused on the other person. It's not that we don't want to hear all of the stuff that pnuemo has to say...but we've also heard a lot from her in each of these videos. So I think she (either consciously or sub-consciously) makes the conversation more focused on the other person. She did the same with mine...I felt like I talked more than she did, but I also think she encouraged that by asking a lot of questions. And as I admitted in the conversation...I had trouble thinking of my own.
> 
> But I also think she likes the idea of differnet types being able to express things about their types. We get to hear her INFJ take in every video...but each one highlights a different type, and she's said that she wants to have someone of every type in there eventually. So it's very natural for the conversation to be more focused on the other person in her chats.


That's true, I did consider that we've gotten to know Pneumoceptor really well after seeing so many of her chats with other people, which was why I didn't ask her any of the introductory questions like what she does for a living and how she got interested in MBTI, which I already knew. INFJs, and especially Pneumoceptor in particular, tend to be skilled at conversation and are genuinely interested in what other people have to say, and this definitely occurred as Pneumoceptor encouraged me to talk about myself. I guess that could be another reason why I felt the conversation was imbalanced upon rewatch.



> As far as my own...I actually have greatly enjoyed watching my own again a few times to think about some stuff. I don't think I saw anything about me that bothered me (other than the fact that I don't pronounce L sounds right...it's something I've done wrong since I was a kid, and the video has made me constantly work on improving it again). I did think it was funny how Southern I sound.


Hehe, I certainly didn't notice anything odd about the way you talked. I don't think I would've even noticed the Southern accent, if you hadn't mentioned it in your comments before I watched it.



> I do think there were some things that I would either elaborate on or edit in retrospect, though. However, as LXPilot mentioned...that's the great things about these chats, that they're imperfect. On the spot, you can't remember everything that you really want to say....you have to kind of react instantly. So that makes it tougher to say everything that you want to. But that's what I like about them too...you really get to see what people would be like in person rather than through text.


That's actually a big reason why I'm much more comfortable communicating through text, instead of verbally. I've never been good at verbally expressing the exact thought I want to convey, and I always think of a better way I could've said something after the fact. Of course, I know that this is common among introverts. But I do agree that since the purpose of these videos is to demonstrate real-life interactions between different types, this live interaction is the best way to do that.




renna said:


> Agreed!
> 
> Do you remember me saying that I felt like I was right there in the conversation the entire time? I've never said that before so obviously both of you had to be on the same page w/ convo (as well as fluent).


Yeah... and I was rather surprised when you said that! 



> Also, It may feel like you are very self centered in your convo but you are mistaken that "feeling" for Ti. (Which I've heard and seen people mistaken Ti for Fi and link that together, weird huh?) You asked pneumoceptor personable (and believe it or not) inspirational like questions to her as well. Questions that were asked about HER faith and NOT centered on you, that was your Fe's doing, you know? Just saying in NO WAY did you appear self centered with your convo style ^.^


Well, sure, I agree that it was my Ti that was processing information and coming up with the thoughts I wanted to express. I'm not saying the Ti itself was being self-centered, but just the fact that it was my own thoughts about myself that I was expressing. But I'm glad to hear that I didn't come across to you as self-centered. Thanks!


----------



## Celebok

rshortman said:


> I felt pretty critical of myself watching the videos too. I take way too long to think about what I'm saying and what comes out is so droll and void of sustance (because I over-censor) that I actually felt impatient listening to myself. I hold people on the brink of suspense a lot probably! How annoying, lol.


I get that same impatient feeling when I watch my own videos, but not when I watched your chat -- at least not in the first half-hour segment that I've watched so far, anyway. Your conversation seemed to flow just fine to me. If I had to guess, I'd say that when we watch ourselves, the impatience comes more from already knowing what we wanted to say and just wanting to hear it come out a lot faster than it did when we were first thinking it on the spot.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Celebok said:


> Those of you who have done type interaction videos so far, I'm wondering, have you gained any interesting insights from watching your own interaction? I hate watching myself on video, but as I rewatched the interaction I did with @_pneumoceptor_, some interesting thoughts crossed my mind.
> 
> In a nutshell, my conversational skills suck. It's something I've known for a long time, but listening to myself in an actual conversation, I was able to analyze what was really going on. Basically, most of my thoughts are self-centered, and whenever the other person says something, I immediately process it and then figure out how I can relate to it, and then I spit out the result. The unfortunate result is that I end up not asking the other person enough questions and therefore don't get to know that person better through our conversation. The thing that made me realize this upon rewatch was that since I was no longer thinking of things to say, I was a lot more focused on listening to what Pneumoceptor was saying, and everytime she said something about herself, a followup question immediately popped into my mind that I expected to hear myself ask, but instead, I would hear myself launch into some other comment about how that relates to my life. So it's like, during the actual conversation, my Ti and Se were operating at full capacity, leaving no room for Ni or Fe, but when rewatching, my Ni and Fe were allowed processing time, thus making me want to know more about Pneumoceptor and ask followup questions.
> 
> Anyway, I'm just curious to know if anyone else has gained any interesting insights from watching your own interaction video that you'd like to share.


I saw my 'Fe'/'extravert mask' in living color with my vids. I remember when I was growing up that my younger ENTP sister would be annoyed with me when we'd go to a dance or something together. I didn't know myself as well then and I didn't know how to contain my energy and the energy I'd pick up from others. I would get really bubbly and she'd tell me I was acting weird LOL. I think now that I'm more comfortable in my own skin I can see that it was simply nervousness. I had always hung out with extraverts and given 'social' advice from an ENTJ father. So hiding in a corner wasn't on my 'list of options'. I think because of the desire to find safety with people around me, when I'm in an uncomfortable situation I turn on the 'Fe-charm' as a deflector from myself...hoping to do a lights and mirrors trick to distract onlookers from the difficulty I feel in containing the 'buzz' of being in the spotlight or being in an unknown environment.

All that to say, when I watch myself in the interaction vids I did with @_pneumoceptor_, I feel like I'm so much more animated than is natural for me. I am sure I have moments with close friends and family where I get animated on a topic I care about. But I also have a monotone, relaxed tone of voice and style when I feel more safe. It's a little embarrassing to see myself 'put on my happy face'. It doesn't mean I am not warm or cheerful normally, but there is just a heightened level of it. I asked my INTP about it. Asked if he's seen this in me. He thought for a minute and said, "yes, sometimes I see you get that way when you're in a big crowd, or talking to someone you don't know very well." I think it is useful to be aware of, to consciously reign in my nervousness and learn to be more centered within myself. That is still scary to consider though, I feel nervous just imagining letting someone 'see me' that 'soon.' Hmmmmmm......food for thought.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> This morning, I had a lovely conversation with INFP @_rshortman_. It's looong... mostly because I didn't want to stop . Hope you enjoy at least some of it!


Loved this! Adorable! Endearing! Insightful! Very fun to watch.

I related to so much in this video - all that was said about the social services industry, things about an INFJ mom, relationships with INTJs, the frustrating pattern of sensor-typism, different styles of structuring one's inner and outer world . . . lots of good stuff you guys! Thanks so much for this one! It made me miss my INFP brother!! :wink:


----------



## Calvaire

I'm Willing to do another video,so again anyone up for interacting with a female INFP?

: )


----------



## Fat Bozo

Calvaire said:


> I'm Willing to do another video,so again anyone up for interacting with a female INFP?
> 
> : )


Yes.


----------



## DimensionX

Fat Bozo said:


> Yes.


Oi, you haven't replied to me yet! I got stood up! Calvaire, don't do it, he'll build up your hopes and knock them down!  ( @Fat Bozo; What's your schedule like mate?)

Actually, I wouldn't mind doing a vid with you, we've briefly talked over tinychat (Perc INFPs - Tinychat) before and it would nice to get to know you better if you're interested


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> This morning, I had a lovely conversation with INFP @_rshortman_. It's looong... mostly because I didn't want to stop . Hope you enjoy at least some of it!


Haha! Fi is not your friend in a relationship!
Sooooooooo true! XD

Great vid once again! =D
I feel like a select lucky person to have access to all these type interactions,
you get so many perspectives and points of views on the same stuff.
It was interesting hearing about the ENTJ doing social work.


----------



## renna

*ENTP & INFJ Discuss Dynamics in Marriage​*


----------



## Calvaire

Fat Bozo said:


> Yes.


I just P'Med you to work out available times xD


----------



## Calvaire

DimensionX said:


> Oi, you haven't replied to me yet! I got stood up! Calvaire, don't do it, he'll build up your hopes and knock them down!  ( @_Fat Bozo_; What's your schedule like mate?)
> 
> Actually, I wouldn't mind doing a vid with you, we've briefly talked over tinychat (Perc INFPs - Tinychat) before and it would nice to get to know you better if you're interested


If you were asking me,which I assume since I frequent that chat xD then I wouldn't mind doing one at all : )


----------



## Inveniet

renna said:


> *ENTP & INFJ Discuss Dynamics in Marriage​*


But...but...but I've already watched an interaction vid today...


----------



## renna

hornet said:


> But...but...but I've already watched an interaction vid today...


ahhhh you can watch this another time


----------



## Inveniet

renna said:


> ahhhh you can watch this another time


If I wait 12 minutes it will be another day! :crazy:
I'm afraid it will be gone if I let it out of my sight...
It's a Se thing! :-/


----------



## DimensionX

hornet said:


> If I wait 12 minutes it will be another day! :crazy:
> I'm afraid it will be gone if I let it out of my sight...
> It's a Se thing! :-/


Hey Hornet, it's worth it, it's fun


----------



## Inveniet

DimensionX said:


> Hey Hornet, it's worth it, it's fun


Yes it was! 

@_renna_
It was interesting how much the Pedagouge relation has coloured your relationship with your husband.
How you where learning from each other all the time and how you approached conflict.

Damn... why did I let that ESTJ I met at that party slip trough my fingers... XD


----------



## pneumoceptor

@renna, I loved this N-heavy conversation, and I loved seeing your dynamic. Thanks so much for posting this.

One of my favorite things you talked about was that ENTPs burn hotter and faster, and they burn out more quickly... whereas INFJs might not burn as hot, but they don't cool off about things they're truly passionate about. I've often thought of myself as smoldering coals... there's a lot of passion under the surface, and it might not be evident to most, but it's going to stay that way for a long time.

I think it's beautiful that your thinker husband has decided that approaching you from a feeling perspective sometimes is an investment in your relationship and allows for self-improvement. And I think it's beautiful how you both get the differences between you and allow for them.


Lovely lovely video .


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> I saw my 'Fe'/'extravert mask' in living color with my vids. I remember when I was growing up that my younger ENTP sister would be annoyed with me when we'd go to a dance or something together. I didn't know myself as well then and I didn't know how to contain my energy and the energy I'd pick up from others. I would get really bubbly and she'd tell me I was acting weird LOL. I think now that I'm more comfortable in my own skin I can see that it was simply nervousness. I had always hung out with extraverts and given 'social' advice from an ENTJ father. So hiding in a corner wasn't on my 'list of options'. I think because of the desire to find safety with people around me, when I'm in an uncomfortable situation I turn on the 'Fe-charm' as a deflector from myself...hoping to do a lights and mirrors trick to distract onlookers from the difficulty I feel in containing the 'buzz' of being in the spotlight or being in an unknown environment.
> 
> All that to say, when I watch myself in the interaction vids I did with @_pneumoceptor_, I feel like I'm so much more animated than is natural for me. I am sure I have moments with close friends and family where I get animated on a topic I care about. But I also have a monotone, relaxed tone of voice and style when I feel more safe. It's a little embarrassing to see myself 'put on my happy face'. It doesn't mean I am not warm or cheerful normally, but there is just a heightened level of it. I asked my INTP about it. Asked if he's seen this in me. He thought for a minute and said, "yes, sometimes I see you get that way when you're in a big crowd, or talking to someone you don't know very well." I think it is useful to be aware of, to consciously reign in my nervousness and learn to be more centered within myself. That is still scary to consider though, I feel nervous just imagining letting someone 'see me' that 'soon.' Hmmmmmm......food for thought.


Now THAT is definitely interesting, and certainly not something that would've been apparent to any of us watching. I'm sure most people would automatically think it's great to see your "Fe charm" and putting on a happy face, figuring that you're just a naturally warm person when you engage with people. But only you know what you're really feeling inside when that's happening and your underlying reasons for acting a certain way, especially when you're not intending to. It's also really interesting that you pinpointed an exact cause from your childhood that led you to associate that behavior with that emotion. In any case, we know that none of us are perfect, but it's great when we can identify certain things in ourselves that we decide we can and want to change. Thanks for sharing!


----------



## Meadow

I'm new to the forum and haven't watched all the videos, but in the ones I have every person did very well and should have no concerns about how they come across. People don't seem slow or self centered, among other concerns, rather everyone has been interesting to listen to and personable. I keep wishing you all lived nearby.
@Celebok, I love taking off on trips on a moment's notice and will drive for hours looking at scenery. I'm likely an extrovert (haven't sorted out my type yet), so I need someone to share my discoveries with, in fact to talk with the entire time.


----------



## renna

hornet said:


> If I wait 12 minutes it will be another day! :crazy:
> I'm afraid it will be gone if I let it out of my sight...
> It's a Se thing! :-/


Can I just say.... I think this is an ISFP thing??? My dad is an ISFP and he would have said this exact same thing! >.< hahaha. I swear it to be true! :-D


----------



## renna

DimensionX said:


> Hey Hornet, it's worth it, it's fun


Aww Thanks!!! You're too sweet :-D We had a blast making this. But I always have a blast with my best friend. He said to me after making this, "Man I feel so in love with you today. Maybe because I just talked 30minutes thinking through all the reasons why we work so well together." 

;-) ANYWAY you can go throw up now, haha 
Point is, we had so much fun making this. We had like ten takes in the beginning though because we kept laughing so much... ha.


----------



## Celebok

Meadow said:


> I'm new to the forum and haven't watched all the videos, but in the ones I have every person did very well and should have no concerns about how they come across. People don't seem slow or self centered, among other concerns, rather everyone has been interesting to listen to and personable. I keep wishing you all lived nearby.
> @_Celebok_, I love taking off on trips on a moment's notice and will drive for hours looking at scenery. I'm likely an extrovert (haven't sorted out my type yet), so I need someone to share my discoveries with, in fact to talk with the entire time.


Thanks! I'm glad you're enjoying these videos!


----------



## renna

pneumoceptor said:


> @renna, I loved this N-heavy conversation, and I loved seeing your dynamic. Thanks so much for posting this.


Sorry I mean to reply to this and realized I only replied to the Youtube message. 

First off, I'm soo glad you liked this. Really. You of all people too. I respect what you think and have to say. We may be at different stages and places in our lives but we all have experiences and wisdom to offer each other - and that's the beauty of life. 



pneumoceptor said:


> One of my favorite things you talked about was that ENTPs burn hotter and faster, and they burn out more quickly... whereas INFJs might not burn as hot, but they don't cool off about things they're truly passionate about. I've often thought of myself as smoldering coals... there's a lot of passion under the surface, and it might not be evident to most, but it's going to stay that way for a long time.


YES! I don't think many people see this side to the INFJ unless they actually live with them. I like how you worded that "smoldering coals". I'm picturing that right now...A bed of ashy coals smoldering slowly, with an under layer of red heat. And even though it's smoldering and there is technically no fire - it doesn't mean that it cannot cause fire! It's nonetheless powerful and very intense! Some of the worst forest fires were caused my smoldering heat. With that illustration you can only imagination in our marriage sometimes how his fire burns out very quickly and mine can preserve for a very long time; there is this balance between our passions or shall I say obsessions, ha.



pneumoceptor said:


> I think it's beautiful that your thinker husband has decided that approaching you from a feeling perspective sometimes is an investment in your relationship and allows for self-improvement. And I think it's beautiful how you both get the differences between you and allow for them.


Again, thank you for those kinda words. *blushes* I'm so blessed (and i don't used that word very often) for such an amazing man in my life. I truly have the best type/natural partner in my life. We fit very well together. Our brains our like puzzle pieces and they just "get" each other!! We are very young and we have so much more to learn together. However, with that being said - my goal in making this video was to show that you can be any age in your marriage and be any type and* be determined *to have a successful marriage. We have been through* a lot i*n our marriage believe it or not. Two spinal surgeries, (me), him getting laid off once, we had to get guardianship of my 16 y/o sister for almost a year ...._ so yeah.... talk about conflict resolutions!!!! WHEW~~_
However, I'm more in love with him than I ever have been... so It's working 

Lovely lovely video .[/QUOTE]
Thank you for watching. I'm so thrilled you liked it.


----------



## pneumoceptor

It seems like it's been a busy MBTI video weekend...
@jendragon and I had another MBTI theory chat, this time about Keirsey's temperaments and their asymmetries. We'd love to hear what others have to think, particularly sensors, because we weren't sure if you all agree with the SP vs SJ subgroups, as opposed to SF vs ST. Hope it wasn't tooooo intuition-dominant heavy!


----------



## Fat Bozo

DimensionX said:


> Oi, you haven't replied to me yet! I got stood up! Calvaire, don't do it, he'll build up your hopes and knock them down!  ( @_Fat Bozo_; What's your schedule like mate?)


LOLLERLOL! Good ol' reliable SPs, ehhh? It's totally not like me to bite off more than I can chew! :laughing:

Didn't you say you're in GMT? That's like six hours ahead of me, why don't you tell me when you can do it, and spare me the math? Haha.

Same for you Calvaire, just tell me when you want to do it. 

And also what time you want to chat. Ha!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Geoffrey said:


> -----Longtime friend @_eyenexepee_ (INFJ) and I (INFJ) have a Ni-dom party in the first installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions! I'd love a chance to speak with more iNtuitives and/or Feelers--please contact me if you're interested.


I've heard another INFJ say that her feelings﻿ are one thing she 'thinks outloud' for but the other thoughts are most definitely processed internally first. What do you think about that?


I also think that forums tend to have a great influx of people based on﻿ seasons (summer, holidays, weekends etc.) and that if an extravert is having a transition in their life or looking to connect when they're lonely they might come to a forum, and an introvert may come for the same reason, but they may also come because they just enjoy taking in more information on a 'pet topic' (i.e. typology) and like for me, it is just a place for learning and discovery (not always about making friends, although that does happen on occasion).

I felt a lot of resonance with what you both said: I have observed in forums, my personal perspective on the topics, and just the cool fact of listening to 2 male INFJs! I really liked this video and while watching felt, "I want to do skype chats or something with both of you - I would have wanted to be your friend if I'd met you IRL." So that is simply a compliment. It made me feel a part of a 'community' to feel like I related to you both so well - kind of like Noah mentions in the nfgeeks 'Brony Episode' video. (I had never heard of it before the vid btw - kind of interesting to listen to.)

If you, @eyenexepee ever want to talk enneagram - I'd really enjoy that because I'm still sorting that part out for myself. It was nice to see you finding peace and confidence in knowing that about yourself. What was the name of the book you said you've been reading? Transformation is exactly what's on my mind these days.... @Geoffrey, I think my INTP has 9w1 in his tri-type and I really appreciate people with those traits. I have a degree of 'envy' for it actually :laughing:

If it means anything - I think you both could be a poster-child for True INFJs :kitteh: - I felt soo at home watching this!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Little Tangent:

I'd enjoy a PM or something with anyone interested in talking more about this thread on the topic of Fi/Fe. I wrote:


> "Sometimes this topic overwhelms me because it feels like we're all splitting hairs.
> 
> I wish every typology book adhered to the same vocabulary list with agreed upon definitions of each word (i.e. values, morals, emotions, feelings, Fe/Fi). I guess that's what many are doing here on the forum, trying to clarify. But everyone's clarification is unique to them - so it seems to me. And that is only natural. I like parts of what I read of Jung, and parts of Hillman, and parts of Keirsey, and parts of Myers-Briggs....so what if I'm discussing the topic with someone who likes (for example) the opposite ideas from me of each author? How are we to ever really know if we're even talking about the same thing when we say 'Fe' or 'Fi'? I guess it is just a matter of finding consensus or understanding within each thread we participate in and accepting our own understanding at that moment and seeking to build upon it little by little."


----------



## pneumoceptor

hornet said:


> I would say that they are both valid.
> 
> SF, ST, NF, NT
> 
> measure different characteristics than
> 
> SP, SJ, NJ, NP
> 
> Like the first is about how we judge our perceptions.
> SF judge the concrete world in a personal way
> ST judge the concrete world in an impersonal way
> NF judge the idea world in a personal way
> NT judge the idea world in an impersonal way
> 
> This is divorced from cognitive functions and so even though they end up seemingly
> having the same approach they really don't.
> 
> SP rely on Se for primary information
> SJ rely on Si for primary information
> NJ rely on Ni for primary information
> NP rely on Ne for primary information
> 
> All these four have this function as either dom or aux.
> They have perception in common.
> 
> We could just as easily divided the types up on criteria of dom aux judgment.
> 
> TJ Te users
> FJ Fe users
> FP Fi users
> TP Ti users
> 
> And finally this to leave out specific functions altogether.
> 
> IP Introverted perceivers
> EP Extroverted perceivers
> IJ Introverted judgers
> EJ Extroverted judgers
> 
> But since we now have lost so much information we don't have very much to go on,
> but can probably find some trends.
> 
> Kersiey mixed two different systems for whatever reason, and that was a bit messed up of him on one level.
> Very inconsistent, but I suspected that he felt he could see more evidence of the four he chose
> in society than if he used a symmetrical breakdown.
> Cause the truth is that just because someone uses some of the same cognitive functions as you doesn't
> mean that they will want to play with you.
> 
> The keirseiy set play well together, by function of being drawn to the same realm.
> SPs focus on the moment NOW. (Se)
> SJs focus on the past, security etc (Si)
> NT focus on logic, knowledge (Te/Ni and Ti/Ne)
> NF focus on world peace and stuff (Ne/Fi and Fe/Ni)
> 
> So they have something obvious in common, regardless of any asymmetry in the random lettering of MBTI.
> MBTI lettering being messed up to begin with.
> 
> I view these groupings as a big cop out from dealing with the cognitive functions.
> Cop outs are ok when you are in a hurry, but you need the underlying details
> to make sense of what is really going on in the big picture.
> 
> To answer the original questions, STs annoy me,
> but I find them willing to participate in many activities that N types shun.
> So SP is truer for acquaintances, but SF is more true for close friendships.
> I don't want STs, NTs and NFs too close as *they just don't get certain things.*


I like the way you've broken down the different subcategories. I agree that they each measure different characteristics. I guess my underlying question is, which categories seem like the 'best' categories to you? Which group personality types in the most cohesive way? Or is there no best, as far as you're concerned?


----------



## pneumoceptor

Fat Bozo said:


> From Please Understand Me II , page 18--
> 
> "Crossing paths with Isabel Myers got me in the habit of typewatching way back in 1956....I soon found it convenient and useful to partition Myers's sixteen types into four groups, which she herself suggested in saying that all four of what she referred to as the "NFs" were alike in many ways, and that all four of the "NTs" were alike in many ways -- although what she called the "STs" seemed to me to have very little in common, just as the "SFs" had very little in common. However, four earlier contributors, Adickes, Spranger, Kretschmer, and Fromm, each having written of four types of character, helped me to see that Myers's four "SJs" were very much alike, as were her four "SPs." Bingo! Typewatching from then on was a lot easier, the four groups -- SPs, SJs, NFs, and NTs -- being light years apart in their attitudes and actions..."
> 
> So, in short, Keirsey observed groupings that seemed to form more common behavior patterns then the way that Myers had divided them, contending just what pneumoceptor said in the video, that an ISFJ is closer to an ISTJ than ISFP, an INFJ closer to an INFP than an INTJ, and an ESFJ closer to an ESTJ than an ESFP and so on.
> 
> My personal observations have largely mirrored Keirsey's as I think the SJ-Guardians tend to "flock together" more than any grouping of STs or SFs. It doesn't mean there's no other valid way of grouping people, as hornet says it's just different ways of looking at things, but the Keirsey temperaments to me play out in real life much more often than any of the other ways of making four groups.
> 
> There are forums that group people in ways other than Keirsey's by the way, Jen was saying she hadn't seen any. I have seen both a forum that groups by Jungian function and another by Socionics quadra. So they are out there, should one desire to check them out.
> 
> By the way, just FYI, the correct way to pronounce Keirsey is actually "kerr-zee" as in rhymes with "jersey." I learned this from talking to Dave M. Keirsey, son of Dr. Keirsey, who runs Keirsey.com and the associated forums and blogs.
> 
> Here's a discussion from a while back on that forum on this very subject of groupings! -- Keirsey.com • View topic - Unorthodox Subdivisions


Way to do your research, Mr. ESFP! Very very useful information here...

So you'd agree with SP and SJ as the sensor groupings, and you feel more of an affinity/relatability/similarity with say an ESTP than an ESFJ?

Thank you for the pronunciation correction. These types of things matter a great deal to me . How on earth did it happen that you were chatting with Dave Keirsey?


----------



## Geoffrey

-----I tried to respond to your comments on my Youtube page--but the space limitations there really strangled my expression. I'll try again, here.


Lady Lullaby said:


> I've heard another INFJ say that her feelings are one thing she 'thinks outloud' for but the other thoughts are most definitely processed internally first. ﻿ What do you think about that?



-----I think﻿ my first instinct in dealing with thoughts and feelings is to process them internally. I don't think out loud, really. There are about 10-15 INFJs who regularly or somewhat regularly attend my Meetup events, and this topic has come up a few times. Many of us seem to have a problem processing our own personal feelings--we tend to deal with them by detaching and analyzing--which does not deal with the feeling directly. Feelings cannot be intellectualized away. Taking a moment to just feel the feeling before trying to understand it--that really makes a world of difference. 
-----I think it may be more of an Enneagram thing. INFJ 4s are different--more focused on achieving a congruence of inner complexity of feeling (and intellect) and external expression. INFJ 8s, 9s, and 1s all try to disown unpleasant parts of themselves--repression. Of course, repressing feelings and thoughts (but especially feelings) makes them more powerful--and they will eventually be expressed--like it or not. We have trouble just feeling, sometimes, because we are naturally attracted to trying to control feelings and thoughts--instead of just feeling and experiencing them.



Lady Lullaby said:


> I also think that forums tend to have a great influx of people based on seasons﻿ (summer, holidays, weekends etc.) and that if an extravert is having a transition in their life or looking to connect when they're lonely they might come to a forum, and an introvert may come for the same reason, but they may also come because they just enjoy taking in more information on a 'pet topic' (i.e. typology) and like for me - it is just a place for learning and discovery (not always about making friends).



-----I think you are correct that an extravert may _temporarily _come to a forum looking for connection. However, forum interaction will always be insufficient for them. They need people almost all the time. Therefore, the amount of connection is always more important than the quality--even if you have a smart and/or iNtuitive extravert who would _prefer _deeper interactions. Both pneumoceptor and I have essentially said we would rather have no interaction than shallow interaction--that's an introvert attitude (though not all introverts have this attitude, I think only introverts _can _have this attitude). Feel free to correct me, pneumoceptor, if I am speaking out of turn.
-----I know a few ENFJs in real life--and in speaking with them, I realize (they too realize) that there is no way I'm an extravert. While aux-Fe causes INFJs to reach out, we confuse even ourselves when we then withdraw for long lengths of time. Being a 9, I hold rigid boundaries (see The Triads of the Enneagram Explained by MBTI﻿ Enthusiast--above). As pneumoceptor mentioned, it is unhealthy for us (INFJs) to succumb to total social isolation. She deals with this by trying to have one good/quality conversation per day. I don't have the energy for that, but I make sure to attend one Meetup per week so that I can get quality iNtuitive interaction. However, most of the time, I am alone--and I enjoy that time, for the most part. I think forums (and iNtuitive Meetups) give us a chance to be iNtuitives, as well as to connect. There is no space for that in _any _other setting.


Lady Lullaby said:


> I felt a lot of resonance with what you both said: I have observed in forums, my personal perspective on the topics, and just the cool fact of listening to 2 male INFJs! I really liked this video and while watching felt, "I want to do skype chats or something with both of you - I would have wanted to be your friend if I'd met you IRL." So that is simply a compliment. It made me feel a part of a 'community' to feel like I related to you both so well - kind of like Noah mentions in the nfgeeks 'Brony Episode' video. (I had never heard of it before the vid btw - kind of interesting to listen to.)



-----Thank you! I'm glad that you feel like a part of a special community--and let me let you in on a secret--you ARE a member of a special community. BTW, _Community _is one of my favorite shows. I haven't seen the "Brony" episode, but I am going to check it out.
-----I have no idea where you are located, but I wanted to share that we are having an INFJ Meetup on October 28th in Long Beach, CA ([INFJ Tribe @ Ty's Residence] INFJ Potluck (Long.) - Myers-Briggs iNtuitive Feelers (NF) Meetup Group (Pasadena, CA) - Meetup; last INFJ Meetup: [INFJ Tribe @ Charlie's & Zankou Chicken] Converse with other INFJs (Pas.) - Myers-Briggs iNtuitive Feelers (NF) Meetup Group (Pasadena, CA) - Meetup). Our Meetup next Thursday night (October 11th) in Pasadena is a general iNtuitive Meetup, but as of now 4 INFJs and 1 ENFJ are signed up. These events are also posted in Myersly. Such Meetups exist across the world, and if there is not one in your neck of the woods, I encourage you to start a small one.


Lady Lullaby said:


> If you, @_eyenexepee_ ever want to talk enneagram - I'd really enjoy that because I'm still sorting that part out for myself. It was nice to see you finding peace and confidence in knowing that about yourself. What was the name of the book you said you've been reading? Transformation is exactly what's on my mind these days.... @_Geoffrey_, I think my INTP has 9w1 in his tri-type and I really appreciate people with those traits. I have a degree of 'envy' for it actually :laughing:



-----If you would like to talk Enneagram or Fe/Fi (or cognitive functions), I'd love to. I can't speak for _eyenexepee_, but it would be worth a PM. I think definitions are very helpful--and while they only have meaning within the context of our own personal understanding--the more we agree on certain shared/default definitions, the easier it is to start "higher up" in a conversation (with some mutual framework/foundation), and also to identify where personal understandings converge or diverge. 
-----Yeah, Enneagram seems to be a worthwhile investment for NFs (not sure if NTs get the same value out of it). I can't remember the name of the book @_eyenexepee_ is reading--perhaps he will enlighten us. I've looked though the video a couple times trying to find that comment--but as usual--when I try to look for something specific--I can't find it! I keep a list of helpful books here: My (MBTI, Enneagram & Relationship) Bookshelf - Blogs - PersonalityCafe. One of my favorite Enneagram books (besides Wisdom of the Enneagram) is The Positive Enneagram--which focuses on the strengths of the Enneagram types--rather than exclusively on childhood trauma and adult coping methods.
-----Every type has its value--and being a 9 is no bowl of cherries. However, the path to inner-peace is open to all--not just 9s.
-----INFJs are always growing--it's a biological imperative, for us, I think. I wish you all the best in your journey.


Lady Lullaby said:


> If it means anything - I think you both could be a poster-child for True INFJs :kitteh: - I felt soo at home watching this!



-----Thanks! I appreciate your openness, warmth, and ability to express appreciation.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Meadow said:


> First, Keirsey only seems to be asymmetrical because he tied it to MBTI. If from the start he'd come out with 4 temperaments that were assigned names rather than MBTI letters, I think his system would have been more easily accepted in the MBTI community, since I believe his temperaments are easier to spot in real life than the 4 MBTI functions (SF, ST, NF, NT), though by outwardly basing his groups on MBTI, his system likely got more attention, discussion and book sales from the community. There are a few books based on the 4-function system, rather than Keirsey's method, and the authors seem convinced it's the best method of telling people apart (but then don't all authors think that about their systems? lol). I'm specifically interested in 4-temperament systems, so I love talking and thinking about this stuff.


This is a valid point, that the MBTI four letter system obscures these things. If we broke it down based on cog functions, though, it still would be asymmetrical:

SJs: Si in first or second position, Ne in third or fourth position
SPs: Se in first or second position, Ni in third or fourth position
NFs: no cognitive function present in (top four functions of) all four types
NTs: no cognitive function present in (top four functions of) all four types

As far as temperaments being easier to spot than MBTI types... I think this might be true of extraverts, but I'm not sure how true it is of introverts. Maybe it's still true, but just to a lesser extent than with extraverts... To a casual observer, INTP looks like INFP, for example. You have to get to know the person and peel back some strong outer introvert shells before you get at which judging function is being used.



> There's a booklet I received when I took an official MBTI test many years ago called "Introduction to Type, Fifth Edition," by Isabel Briggs Myers. There are a couple pages where the types are divided various ways with brief descriptions, such as TJ, TP, FP, FJ, and IJ, IP, EP, EJ. The division between ST, SF, NT, NT is more extensive and this is part of the info, for anyone who doesn't have the booklet:
> 
> Focus on:
> ST: Facts
> SF: Facts
> NF: Possibilities
> NT: Possibilities
> 
> Handle these with:
> ST: Applying facts and experience
> SF: Meeting the daily concerns of people
> NF: Understanding the aspirations of people
> NT: Developing theoretical concepts
> 
> Thus tend to become:
> ST: Practical and analytical
> SF: Sympathetic and friendly
> NF: Enthusiastic and insightful
> NT: Logical and analytical
> 
> Find scope for their abilities in:
> ST: Technical skills with facts and objects
> SF: Practical help and services for people
> NF: Understanding and communicating with
> NT: Theoretical and technical developments
> 
> Help with assessing career options:
> ST: The "bottom line," results-oriented people
> SF: Drawn to opportunities for practical service to people
> NF: See and want to facilitate possibilities for people
> NT: Drawn to opportunities for problem solving, analysis, and design


Ooh, I want to read this booklet. Yeah, that's very useful information, and I like the way it's laid out.



> That might be more info than is wanted for these divisions but since it was from an official MBTI source, I thought it was especially interesting. I also skimmed the book "Compass of the Soul," by John Giannini, and the second half of the book seemed to be based on trying to prove that the above MBTI way of dividing types is a true archetypical method.


What does this mean? As in there's an actual, concrete feature of people that correlates with certain subgroupings?



> One confusion with the Keirsey SP/SJ vs the MBTI ST/SF divisions is that, for example, ESTP's in Keirsey's system would be focused on spontaneity and openness where in the latter system ESTP's would be in what is typically called the "Stabilizer" temperament. Since the 2 divisions somewhat conflict, different lenses are being used with the result that people could test as different types in the two systems. This happens even with the 16 MBTI types, authors having different ideas about what a type encompasses. With so many people, including me, having trouble spotting their type, my conclusion is that MBTI only works for people who are closer to the 16 archetypes so that their type is fairly consistent even with slightly different lenses being used. I'm with pneumoceptor in not being sure if MBTI has inherent validity/truth, though it's still fun to study and has some workability, imo. I spotted my personality/motivation quickly in Enneagrams: 7w6, tritype 712 Teacher. Maybe my focus on change, variety and gathering information is getting in the way of discovering my MBTI type.


Yeah, these different categorizations definitely push the impressions of specific types in different directions. This is why I think that one subgrouping must be the best. If it's not, and a certain type doesn't jive better with one subgrouping or another, this means to me that it's not a 'true' type... if it can't be generalized. I don't know if this makes sense...



> The S/N division does seem most important overall, though for my personality the J/P divide is strongest. It's important for me to have openness in thoughts and spontaneity in lifestyle and J's fairly consistently close both down before I'm ready. I'm capable of talking for hours, not to mention weeks to years, gathering information without coming to a definitive conclusion, instead having greater or lesser possibilities for truth.


OK, J/P is the strongest for you. Hmm. But do you mean in terms of cog functions? Because underlyingly, that's what J vs P dictates.

What do you think your type is ?


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Thanks @hornet for your entire breakdown. Very clear.



hornet said:


> NF focus on world peace and stuff (Ne/Fi and Fe/Ni)


LOL sounds like nfgeeks when he makes fun of his own temperament of NFs as being in a 'crystal sky castle'. Is it too mystical to explain?? haha

I'd say:
NF focus on life's meaning and human relationships Ne/Fi and Fe/Ni

Sorry for adding to what you wrote, but the "and stuff" part made it feel like it 'didn't really count' or was a subjective judgment of it as being less important.



hornet said:


> I view these groupings as a big cop out from dealing with the cognitive functions.
> Cop outs are ok when you are in a hurry, but you need the underlying details
> to make sense of what is really going on in the big picture.


I definitely agree that cognitive functions add so much more to our understanding of type.



hornet said:


> To answer the original questions, STs annoy me,
> but I find them willing to participate in many activities that N types shun.
> So SP is truer for acquaintances, but SF is more true for close friendships.
> I don't want STs, NTs and NFs too close as *they just don't get certain things.*


Could you say instead of 'don't want' those types too close, that you ''just don't connect as easily"? The 'don't want' part makes it sound like no matter who they are, if you know they are that type you won't give them a chance, you've made up your mind that you dislike them. . .I didn't want to assume that is what you meant without clarification. :wink:


----------



## Inveniet

pneumoceptor said:


> I like the way you've broken down the different subcategories. I agree that they each measure different characteristics. I guess my underlying question is, which categories seem like the 'best' categories to you? Which group personality types in the most cohesive way? Or is there no best, as far as you're concerned?


No there really are no best in my view.
It is like pick random trait and stereotype from that perspective.
@pneumoceptor has long hair. @renna has long hair. @Lady Lullaby has long hair.

All are female, all females have long hair.
Now you don't have to make go down the shallow road,
but it is very tempting* cause it saves energy.*
Everybody loves the shortcut... :-/

Looking for the best category kinda implies that you are looking for a magic bullet.
If we find the best we don't have to do all that hard work.
And it's fun cause you feel you are getting somewhere, but really the longer you rely on the crutch of the magic bullet
the more deluded you become and the more the errors builds up over time.

If you have watched the NFgeeks you should know what I'm talking about.
Two people relishing in stereotypes. 
It is funny, interesting and a lot of other things, but not very accurate, beyond the surface stereotypes.
Basically what the Kersiey divide does is hold N's and S's to two different standards.


----------



## Inveniet

Lady Lullaby said:


> Thanks @_hornet_ for your entire breakdown. Very clear.
> 
> 
> 
> LOL sounds like nfgeeks when he makes fun of his own temperament of NFs as being in a 'crystal sky castle'. Is it too mystical to explain?? haha
> 
> I'd say:
> NF focus on life's meaning and human relationships Ne/Fi and Fe/Ni
> 
> Sorry for adding to what you wrote, but the "and stuff" part made it feel like it 'didn't really count' or was a subjective judgment of it as being less important.
> 
> 
> 
> I definitely agree that cognitive functions add so much more to our understanding of type.
> 
> 
> 
> Could you say instead of 'don't want' those types too close, that you ''just don't connect as easily"? The 'don't want' part makes it sound like no matter who they are, if you know they are that type you won't give them a chance, you've made up your mind that you dislike them. . .I didn't want to assume that is what you meant without clarification. :wink:


Yeah I get where you are coming from and what I'm basically doing is like I just said to pneumoceptor...
It saves me energy to think.


> Stuff...
> Certain things...


These are shortcuts cause I don't have the time or inclination to elaborate.
I just don't care enough to sit down and get into it at the time.

What they generally don't get is my feelings and/or my focus on the moment.
But then again and this is the danger of shortcuts, neither does half of the SFs and the SPs.
The only other type that even remotely gets what that is like is the ESFP...
So if you take shortcuts, like we all do, we pay with errors, errors in droves...
Thanks for driving down the point of my last post so brilliantly. :wink:

I probably irk some people to no end when I do this.
Why people get upset probably wary a bit.
But it usually comes down to a this is so important to me, why don't you respect what I find important.

It is funny that you brought up NFgeeks as I've been watching them lately.
The irony is that they are just as shortcut prone in some areas as I'm in others.

Oh weeeelll...
Time to once again try to wrestle myself into bed... XD


----------



## DimensionX

hornet said:


> No there really are no best in my view.
> It is like pick random trait and stereotype from that perspective.
> @_pneumoceptor_ has long hair. @_renna_ has long hair. @_Lady Lullaby_ has long hair.
> 
> All are female, all females have long hair.
> Now you don't have to make go down the shallow road,
> but it is very tempting* cause it saves energy.*
> Everybody loves the shortcut... :-/
> 
> Looking for the best category kinda implies that you are looking for a magic bullet.
> If we find the best we don't have to do all that hard work.
> And it's fun cause you feel you are getting somewhere, but really the longer you rely on the crutch of the magic bullet
> the more deluded you become and the more the errors builds up over time.
> 
> If you have watched the NFgeeks you should know what I'm talking about.
> Two people relishing in stereotypes.
> It is funny, interesting and a lot of other things, but not very accurate, beyond the surface stereotypes.
> Basically what the Kersiey divide does is hold N's and S's to two different standards.


This guy, I like. 

Just sayin'


----------



## illicit iridescence

Lady Lullaby said:


> I've heard another INFJ say that her feelings﻿ are one thing she 'thinks outloud' for but the other thoughts are most definitely processed internally first. What do you think about that?


OH! Hahaha, definitely! 

In general, I'm not really aware of what I'm feeling. In general, I just don't "busy" myself with that, until someone asks me. And then I have to *think* about it. But, the more I actually *speak* about it, the clearer my own feelings become to me.



> I also think that forums tend to have a great influx of people based on﻿ seasons (summer, holidays, weekends etc.) and that if an extravert is having a transition in their life or looking to connect when they're lonely they might come to a forum, and an introvert may come for the same reason, but they may also come because they just enjoy taking in more information on a 'pet topic' (i.e. typology) and like for me, it is just a place for learning and discovery (not always about making friends, although that does happen on occasion).


I totally relate to that ^^ Also, me being a 'semi-permanent' resident of the INFP forums, I noticed a great deal of "INFP's" come and go. Most of the INFP's that do stay for a long time and post regularly do have an INFP-vibe to me. Not that all of the seasonal ones are not INFP's, but I do often wonder if they typed themselves correctly, more than those who stay. Then again, I may be biased because those who stay and post often at least provide 'material' for me to analyze xD



> I felt a lot of resonance with what you both said: I have observed in forums, my personal perspective on the topics, and just the cool fact of listening to 2 male INFJs! I really liked this video and while watching felt, "I want to do skype chats or something with both of you - I would have wanted to be your friend if I'd met you IRL." So that is simply a compliment. It made me feel a part of a 'community' to feel like I related to you both so well - kind of like Noah mentions in the nfgeeks 'Brony Episode' video. (I had never heard of it before the vid btw - kind of interesting to listen to.)


I do take that as a compliment :3 I would love to talk with you sometime over Skype. ^^ We could...



> If you, @_eyenexepee_ ever want to talk enneagram - I'd really enjoy that because I'm still sorting that part out for myself. It was nice to see you finding peace and confidence in knowing that about yourself. What was the name of the book you said you've been reading? Transformation is exactly what's on my mind these days.... @_Geoffrey_, I think my INTP has 9w1 in his tri-type and I really appreciate people with those traits. I have a degree of 'envy' for it actually :laughing:


... talk about enneagram  I'm not the most knowledgeable, but whatever knowledge I do have I would happily share with you ^^ The book is called "The Enneagram of Passions and Virtues" by Maitri. It's not so much a book on the types, but as the title says, it's about the passions and virtues, the fixations and holy ideas of each type. It's much more a book on what "moves" any type than it is about "how to recognize type X", so to speak. And, how each type could get rid of their fixation and move back to their holy idea, how to transform passion into virtue.

For instance, for type Ones, we're born with the holy idea of holy perfection. As we grow older, we develop a personality structure, and the holy idea becomes distorted/warped into a fixation. Our One-fixation is to see things as they could or should be (I would say it's definitely influenced by whether you're a Fi/Te or Ti/Fe type). Seeing that things are often not the way we think they should be, we resent those things. Our superego has a great share in those judgments. Through understanding that the superego does have a point, but at the same time knowing that things (including ourselves) do not necessarily need improvement/correcting, we learn to let go of our fixation. Our fixation then transforms into serenity: being at peace with the way things are, whether they're imperfect or perfect or something in between. It doesn't take away our drive to actually improve things, it's just that we let go of our resentment and anger.

To sum it up, more or less. ^^'


> If it means anything - I think you both could be a poster-child for True INFJs :kitteh: - I felt soo at home watching this!


Awh <3 That's so awesome! Yes it means something to me (another reason to defy my superego who wants to tell me I'm incompetent at typing myself)! :3 If you want to Skype with me sometime, just PM me, we'll see what we can set up 



> Little Tangent:
> 
> I'd enjoy a PM or something with anyone interested in talking more about this thread on the topic of Fi/Fe. I wrote:


That's why I like taking it back to Jung. One source I like using for Jungian terms: Jung Lexicon | New York Association for Analytical Psychology - though, PM me if you have specific questions and I'll tell you my take on it 



Geoffrey said:


> -----I think﻿ my first instinct in dealing with thoughts and feelings is to process them internally. I don't think out loud, really. There are about 10-15 INFJs who regularly or somewhat regularly attend my Meetup events, and this topic has come up a few times. Many of us seem to have a problem processing our own personal feelings--we tend to deal with them by detaching and analyzing--which does not deal with the feeling directly. Feelings cannot be intellectualized away. Taking a moment to just feel the feeling before trying to understand it--that really makes a world of difference.
> -----I think it may be more of an Enneagram thing. INFJ 4s are different--more focused on achieving a congruence of inner complexity of feeling (and intellect) and external expression. INFJ 8s, 9s, and 1s all try to disown unpleasant parts of themselves--repression. Of course, repressing feelings and thoughts (but especially feelings) makes them more powerful--and they will eventually be expressed--like it or not. We have trouble just feeling, sometimes, because we are naturally attracted to trying to control feelings and thoughts--instead of just feeling and experiencing them.


For Ones, it's not so much repression, it has a more aggressive feel to me: Splitting (psychology) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (Fours split too, from what I understand.) I think Nines do repress, whereas I would expect Eight to actually act. But I'm not too familiar with type Eight ^^;



> -----I think you are correct that an extravert may _temporarily _come to a forum looking for connection. However, forum interaction will always be insufficient for them. They need people almost all the time. Therefore, the amount of connection is always more important than the quality--even if you have a smart and/or iNtuitive extravert who would _prefer _deeper interactions. Both pneumoceptor and I have essentially said we would rather have no interaction than shallow interaction--that's an introvert attitude (though not all introverts have this attitude, I think only introverts _can _have this attitude). Feel free to correct me, pneumoceptor, if I am speaking out of turn.


Interesting  I've been wrestling with identifying my instincts lately and I've come to suspect that I use Sx secondary (deep one-on-one connection) to 'secure' my place in groups and societies, my So dominant. While I can easily be in groups, observing group dynamics and getting a kick out of helping a group grow or realize shared goals, I prefer one-on-one communication. Face to face is simply where I feel I can represent myself the best way.



> I don't have the energy for that, but I make sure to attend one Meetup per week so that I can get quality iNtuitive interaction. However, most of the time, I am alone--and I enjoy that time, for the most part. I think forums (and iNtuitive Meetups) give us a chance to be iNtuitives, as well as to connect. There is no space for that in _any _other setting.


Actually makes me wonder if you don't have Sp as dominant or secondary. How sure are you about your instincts :wink:



> -----If you would like to talk Enneagram or Fe/Fi (or cognitive functions), I'd love to. I can't speak for _eyenexepee_, but it would be worth a PM. I think definitions are very helpful--and while they only have meaning within the context of our own personal understanding--the more we agree on certain shared/default definitions, the easier it is to start "higher up" in a conversation (with some mutual framework/foundation), and also to identify where personal understandings converge or diverge.


Sounds like one of us will start a new thread soon :3 Mention me please as a notification? 



> -----Thanks! I appreciate your openness, warmth, and ability to express appreciation.


The openness, warmth and expressed appreciation of both of you


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## Geoffrey

eyenexepee said:


> For Ones, it's not so much repression, it has a more aggressive feel to me: Splitting (psychology) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (Fours split too, from what I understand.) I think Nines do repress, whereas I would expect Eight to actually act. But I'm not too familiar with type Eight ^^;



-----Very interesting. You and the other INFJ Type-1 I know strike me as two of the most gentle people I know, but I suppose perhaps it is the fear of aggression (inner-aggression), as unfounded or founded as it might be, that might contribute to that outer-gentleness. The Positive Enneagram talks about the relevance of the positioning of a type within a a triad. The center types they call atypical because they are quite unlike the adjoining types in--I still haven't figured out why. Yet anger is still my challenge emotion--oh yes--and in that way the lava within the body types unites us.


eyenexepee said:


> Interesting  I've been wrestling with identifying my instincts lately and I've come to suspect that I use Sx secondary (deep one-on-one connection) to 'secure' my place in groups and societies, my So dominant. While I can easily be in groups, observing group dynamics and getting a kick out of helping a group grow or realize shared goals, I prefer one-on-one communication. Face to face is simply where I feel I can represent myself the best way.
> Actually makes me wonder if you don't have Sp as dominant or secondary. How sure are you about your instincts :wink:



-----When I read the description in The Positive Enneagram, everything clicked. Here is what happened: I am an SX/SO. I tend to enter the social arena in order to find someone with whom I can forge a deep/non-superficial relationship. I don't mean (just) for a romantic partner (that was nearly 20 years ago, now, anyway)--I mean for friends, too. I was very happy in my very few SX relationships. But life happened. This is difficult for me to share, and I am not sharing in hopes of getting sympathy--it just explains who I am. When I got sick, initially I went to those relationships for help/support, but I found no sympathy, empathy, or compassion. Next, I looked for medical help--venturing outward into the larger social arena. However, this lead nowhere (until last January). I realized that contrary to what I had always believed, that in reality I could depend on no one but myself (that's SP but also Type-7 (3rd in my tritype)). I believe that my journey took me from light (SX) to gray (SO) to darkness (SP). The lightness or darkness of a place is dependent on one's personal instinctual stacking. In darkness, I was in _total _isolation--not a good place for me.
-----When I began seeing a therapist (the only one to ever actually help me) (again, in January), she urged/commanded me to go out an socialize. Initially, I strongly resisted that. I had _absolutely _no desire to see anyone. The people who remained in my life were already draining what energy I had. But then this therapist, an xNFJ herself, shared something with me that would forever change my life: MBTI. I will forever be grateful to her for that. 
-----I found Meetup.com, and I attended a Meetup with MBTI iNtuitives of Los Angeles. _Finally_, I found a space for me--to be who I am--a place that now seems like home. 
-----And now I am working on coming home in other ways. I no longer believe that "I can depend on no one but myself." No. The truth is, I had just depended on the _wrong _people. I was barking up the wrong tree--as one of my other INFJ friends puts it. I no longer live in the darkness, but I am not yet back to the light.
-----This is the journey of an SX/SO. 


eyenexepee said:


> Sounds like one of us will start a new thread soon :3 Mention me please as a notification?



-----If I'm the one to start it, you betcha! I still "owe" quite a bit of work on two or three threads though.


eyenexepee said:


> The openness, warmth and expressed appreciation of both of you



-----Hey, let's include you in that too! Thank you for your openness, warmth, and expressed appreciation!


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> Way to do your research, Mr. ESFP! Very very useful information here...
> 
> So you'd agree with SP and SJ as the sensor groupings, and you feel more of an affinity/relatability/similarity with say an ESTP than an ESFJ?
> 
> Thank you for the pronunciation correction. These types of things matter a great deal to me . How on earth did it happen that you were chatting with Dave Keirsey?


Well, like I said, he's the head honcho over at the Keirsey.com website, the forum, the Facebook page, etc. So I've interacted with him on there.

I am definitely, in most ways, more like an ESTP than ESFJ. The main similarity between me and the ESFJ is the aspect of showing sympathy for others' feelings, but even that we show much differently. Like Teddy was saying, that SJ "security seeking" personality comes out in all SJs and runs very contrary to my "sensation seeking." The ESTP is kind of like the more "doesn't give a damn" version of the SP. And I realize that's also a stereotype, but like hornet said, who doesn't like a shortcut? :wink: I both admire and am annoyed by ESTPs on a regular basis, including my son!


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## Meadow

pneumoceptor said:


> This is a valid point, that the MBTI four letter system obscures these things. If we broke it down based on cog functions, though, it still would be asymmetrical:
> 
> SJs: Si in first or second position, Ne in third or fourth position
> SPs: Se in first or second position, Ni in third or fourth position
> NFs: no cognitive function present in (top four functions of) all four types
> NTs: no cognitive function present in (top four functions of) all four types
> 
> As far as temperaments being easier to spot than MBTI types... I think this might be true of extraverts, but I'm not sure how true it is of introverts. Maybe it's still true, but just to a lesser extent than with extraverts... To a casual observer, INTP looks like INFP, for example. You have to get to know the person and peel back some strong outer introvert shells before you get at which judging function is being used.



I've noticed that about Keirsey's types, that N's don't have cognitive functions in common. I meant that if Keirsey had divorced his method entirely from MBTI at the beginning and just had 4 temperaments called Rationals, Idealists, Artisans, Guardians, there likely wouldn't have been an issue of asymmetry. It's like dividing people into such categories as Teachers, Healers, Warriors, Visionaries (Angeles Arrien) where there isn't an issue of asymmetry, more a concern that the 4 types cover everyone. Also, I'm not sure if I'm understanding but I meant that Keirsey's types might be easier to spot than the way classic MBTI authors tend to divide into temperaments (NT, NF, ST, SF).




> What does this mean? As in there's an actual, concrete feature of people that correlates with certain subgroupings?



The full name of the book I was referring to was "Compass of the Soul; Archetypal Guides to a Fuller Life," by John L. Giannini (with a foreword by John Beebe and a Preface by Mary McCaulley). I haven't read the book but am borrowing it from a friend. The second half seems to be divided into various chapters which are reporting on different authors' views of MBTI's NT, NF, ST, SF temperaments. For example, there's a chapter based on a method from a book called Psychetypes, by Michael Malone, which divides in this way:

NT: Aetherials
NF: Oceanics
SF: Volcanics/Experials
ST: Territorials/Structurals


The S's have 2 names because I guess they've been updated since the book. As an aside, that system seems fascinating in that it's another method of translating Jung. The SF's and NT's are said to be focused on internal substance (SF concrete vs. NT abstract) and the ST's and NF's are focused on structure (ST structured and doing vs. NF without boundaries and being). Another section of Giannini's book divides the 4 types into:

NT: Magician
NF: Lover
SF: King/Queen
ST: Warrior

Giannini's point seems to be that Jung meant for function "couplings" (the 2 functions together, such as SF) to be archetypes, with the first part of the book discussing Jung and the second part trying to prove Giannini's archetypal theory. The book is about 550 pages. One thing of interest is that various authors are introduced in the book, such as the Osmond Group/Michael Malone, off of which there seems to be much new info to follow through with. 





> Yeah, these different categorizations definitely push the impressions of specific types in different directions. This is why I think that one subgrouping must be the best. If it's not, and a certain type doesn't jive better with one subgrouping or another, this means to me that it's not a 'true' type... if it can't be generalized. I don't know if this makes sense...


I've always thought it odd that in my search for 4-temperament methods, I'll find one that has 3 categories exactly the same as another method, but the 4th categories in the 2 methods have nothing in common. How could that be? It frequently has me shaking my head over the weirdness of it all. 




> OK, J/P is the strongest for you. Hmm. But do you mean in terms of cog functions? Because underlyingly, that's what J vs P dictates.
> 
> What do you think your type is ?


I have no idea what my type is. I seem to be a half-as***, or more politely half-hearted, N, S, T, F, doing all of them pretty much equally yet not being particularly good at any. I've always thought of myself as a generalist. When I took the official MBTI test plus every test I could find online, I always test strongly T, yet I seem to fit F descriptions better. I also seem to see the world through many of Jung's functions, such as Fi and Ti. I tend to be more focused on ideas than on relationships, though the ideas are frequently about relationships. If someone can give me a blood test or brain scan with the definitive answer, I'd be a happy camper.  The one thing I know for sure is that I spend quite a bit more time taking in information than deciding and I've found it best to have friends who are happy to research and talk ad infinitum about everything from the state of the world to conspiracy theories to is there life after death or even reincarnation to the best biking trails and states to visit. It's not that I never decide, but I sometimes base my decisions on logic, sometimes on values, and many ideas are open to revision with more info.


@Fat Bozo, do you happen to know much about Keirsey's system or are able to ask? After reading Personology, I realized I act like SP's, have beliefs like NF's, and think like NT's, so I'm not sure which to put the most emphasis on. When I take his tests in the book the 3 come out equal.


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## Lady Lullaby

@Geoffrey and @eyenexepee I'll reply to these lovely posts further via PM so as not to derail the thread. Thanks sooo much for the indepth and thoughtful replies you've shared here. :happy:


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## Meadow

To add to Fat Bozo's #865 post, in the book _Personology_, Keirsey says on page 18, "I soon found it useful to sort Myers's sixteen so-called 'psychological types' into four bins, two of which she herself suggested that all four of what she referred to as the 'intuiting-feeling' type ('NF') were alike in many ways, and that all four of the 'intuiting-thinking' type ('NT') were alike in many ways. *Unfortunately*, she added that the 'sensing-feeling' ('SF') types were alike in many ways and that 'sensing-thinking' ('ST') types were alike in many ways. I say 'unfortunately' because there is no way to observe what thoughts and feelings people have, whether, as she guesses, such thoughts and feeling are intuitive or sensory."

Keirsey also goes on to say, "Owing to Jung's rambling account of 'psychological processes' in his book _Psychological Types_ (1920), what Myers called 'sensing-thinking' types do not act alike, nor do what she called 'sensing-feeling' types act alike. Indeed, the _action_ of the two groups is _observably_ different and even radically so."

Edit: When I posted the above I thought it said something different than it does and would bring more clarity. The site doesn't allow "unposts" so I'm leaving it here even though it doesn't really clear things up, since we can't observe thoughts and feelings in N's yet that's what we're expected to do. But I guess what he's trying to say is that the actions of NF's and NT's are different enough to distinguish, as are the actions of SP's and SJ's, but for some reason not those of SF's and ST's.


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## pneumoceptor

@_amanda32_ and I had a Beijing-San Diego INFP-INFJ conversation about friendships/relationships between, you guessed it, INFPs and INFJs. It's a super feely, people-oriented two-hour conversation, so be warned!


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## StellarTwirl

I just want to say that, among the videos I've seen, this set is the one that resonated with me the most. When you mentioned knowing there's a shift in a relationship despite being reassured by the other person, the lump crept into my throat.

I've been pretty much a quiet observer of these interactions, but I felt like the "Thanks" button wasn't enough this time.


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## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> @_amanda32_ and I had a Beijing-San Diego INFP-INFJ conversation about friendships/relationships between, you guessed it, INFPs and INFJs. It's a super feely, people-oriented two-hour conversation, so be warned!


This might be cliche - but it's still very true:









I want to just send out a big NF ((Hug)) to both of you! There was a lot of hurt and disappointment and sad stuff hidden behind smiles and smirks in this video. Why do we do that? hehe Why do we smile when we want to cry? We feel silly right? We wish we weren't feeling so deeply. . .sigh. . .

Right off- I wanted to give my two-cents worth on the compliments question at the beginning from @_amanda32_. I think I was only suspicious of compliments given from males when I was single LOL. Not so much now because they can't have an ulterior motive because I'm taken. Also, I am suspicious of compliments if given by strangers or in the workplace etc. But if it is from family and friends, I simply feel loved and noticed. The times I'm embarrassed from receiving compliments is if it is in front of others, especially a bigger group. If it is in private just one-on-one, again, I'm very touched and feel loved and noticed.

As an INFJ - to add to the 'numbers' of who feels what way, to help determine if it is MBTI or not - when it comes to others coming to me and wanting to talk about an issue in our relationship - - I don't ever have anyone do that! Seriously! I feel like I'm always the one bringing things up. Maybe they Think they are bringing something up and it went over my head because it wasn't asked directly and I had no clue there was an issue (which would surprise me honestly) - - but I am not a mindreader (sorry NFs, we're really not, although we feel we are lol) and that could very well have happened. My ENTP sister once shared some hurt feelings and we worked it through but it was after I was bringing up something with her first. The only time I can imagine avoiding relationship issues would be if all trust was lost, I was hurting too much and I needed to let the pain settle a bit so I could think clearly. But usually that sort of pain is happening in private and only when I'm ready to talk about it does it come out because others usually don't seem to know until I say something.
@_amanda32_ - I'm loving your questions!! roud: 

I wasn't ever jealous in a friendship until this year with an INTJ. I know I've witnessed an ISTJ friend of mine become jealous when I was making other friends and I felt so sad that she didn't want to know the friends I was making or know that our relationship was still treasured and not threatened by me meeting new people. Well - when I found that I had seen my INTJ friend as more special to me than she saw me in her life - I was (I'm embarrassed to admit) jealous of her friendship with a different neighbor. I think in this tender state, when my ENTP sister talked about her sister-in-law that she misses a lot after moving away and living closer to me - I found I was jealous of that to a degree. I still liked her sister-in-law and was happy they were close, but felt bad that I wasn't 'enough' once she was here to help her 'not miss' her sister-in-law. I see how silly that is now. After admitting my feelings to my ENTP sister I felt better. It became a non-issue. For me, just expressing it and feeling it for the moment made it 'swim away' on its own. I think it bothered my ENTP sister - she admitted keeping some of what she'd been feeling about her move from me because she didn't want to increase my jealousy and then that created distance for us for a time. If someone else told me they were jealous I'd feel sad for them and just want to encourage them. (I'm answering these before I hear @_pneumoceptor_'s responses btw because I want to see if how I feel is similar before knowing her answer.)

I probably should stop here though - nobody wants to hear my personal opinion on every little question. Sigh. . .just one of my favorite topics - 'friendships' - so it's hard to hold back. If either @_pneumoceptor_ or @_amanda32_ wants to talk about it further, I'd enjoy a PM chat. Time to just keep watching and enjoying.

Thanks for sharing and being vulnerable and open with us!! :wink:

Edit: There are also a lot of adorable smiles and smirks of mutual 'like' about each other in this video. Mmmm...so fun....I was giggling and smiling a lot while I watched this second video.


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## Geoffrey

[email protected]_amanda32 & @pneumoceptor_: Thanks for a great video you two!
-----pneumoceptor, I know this must have been a difficult video to make, so I really appreciate you doing it. I think it will be helpful to many INFPs and INFJs.
-----Compliments: I agree that an inability to accept compliments is a symptom (see: Top Ten Facts about Low Self Esteem). Now, if someone gives me a compliment, before I say anything else, I just say, "Thank You." It is just as important to receive the love and affection of others as to give it.
-----Methodology: pneumoceptor, in watching you try to understand amanda32's perspective, I saw you use the same methodology as I do. The way you ask questions--always trying to get to what's behind it all.
-----Te/Ti: Recently, I've come to the conclusion that the miscommunication my wife (ISTJ) and I end up stuck in results more from a Te/Ti conflict than anything else. Ti is about understanding the "why"--about understanding how another person thinks. Te doesn't care about how another person comes to a conclusion--it just wants agreement. I believe that this difference is part of what causes some of the INFP/INFJ conflict. We use Ti, and Ti is often found offensive to Te. INFPs have inferior Te, so they hate it (until the process of integration) but they unconsciously use it. 
-----Spontaneous time: I found what you said to be very true. That time is indeed precious--I can't be spontaneous all the time--so I have to save it for the special people in my life.
-----INFJs and their Relationship Expectations: Andrea suggests that INFJs get dissatisfied in relationships because they approach it as a problem to be solved--and people are not merely problems to be solved. In fact, people cannot be solved ("I suspect it isn’t the relationship problems themselves that lead to the INFJs’ dissatisfaction; it’s the fact that the problems can’t be solved": The INFJ Personality and the Search for the Perfect Relationship « Andrea J. Wenger: Write*with*Personality). 
-----Personally, I've not had the same "relationship expectations" problem that so many INFJs seem to have. Stephen Montgomery's The Pygmalion Project III helped me realize that everyone, Idealists concluded, are prone to starting Pygmalion projects. I encourage a search for inner depth in people--and I have come to realize that I was indeed assuming that that journey is right for everyone. But it is not. Personal autonomy is extraordinarily important to me, so I don't project expectations, and I am not easily disappointed with people. They have to live with their choices, so it is totally up to them what choices they make. I wonder if this is an Enneagram thing? My other theory is that the INFJ brain is wired to be OCD-like (or often just OCD). There is a form of OCD called Relationship OCD (R-OCD) (ROCD.ORG) that sounds a lot like the issues some INFJs face. I'm not diagnosing anyone--I'm just saying that the "locked in" way of thinking associated with OCD is very similar to what some INFJs report. I read somewhere that the harder one is on oneself, the easier it is to be hard on others. My OCD-like or OCD behavior is far more inner-directed: I hold myself to extraordinarily high standards, but I see others as unique--with every experience chipping away at a block of marble and creating a masterpiece beneath. I don't see others as flawed--but instead as masterpieces. I don't know what to make of it all, but I thought I'd share.
-----Again, thanks to you both for sharing--it is truly appreciated.


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## Meadow

LOL @_Lady Lullaby_, I felt the same way about the video, saving up much in my mind to say, even wishing I had my own microphone, and I've only watched Part 1 so far. I'm likely Pe and wish I knew more so it could help with understanding MBTI functions.

I didn't realize until watching the video that I don't compliment people very much, or maybe it's hidden in with my enthusiastic supporting of people and belief in their being able to create what they want with their lives.

Listening to jealousy issues between females was interesting. Since I mainly have male friends, not easily understanding how females think overall, it was a surprise when I ended up with a best female friend on the internet for 2 years. It was my first adult female friendship and I loved her like a sister. She was INFP and, like another INFP friend I had, she could shine her spotlight of caring on me so strongly that it made me feel the most special person in the world. When she'd head off and do it with someone else, and on forums you can watch everything, lol, I'd sometimes feel jealousy, to the point where I even cried once. I kept rolling my eyes at myself because this person was female, not male, and what the heck was I thinking? It helped that my husband understood I rarely had female relationships and helped me through the difficult times. She eventually left forum land and since writing dozens of PMs most days was tiring and she didn't want to phone, it was fine that our relationship ended, though I miss her at times. I'd always felt strange being jealous about a female - I hardly ever feel jealousy even with males - so I was glad to hear I'm not the only person who has experienced this emotion with regard to the same gender.

As to the smothering issue, I've been on both sides and know it's uncomfortable no matter what side you're on, but maybe more with the needy person since they're likely more concerned with the possibility of loss. When I pulled out of one of those relationships where I was smothering, I realized that I'd been using him to avoid my own issues, so it was a helpful relationship in terms of understanding myself better. On the other side, I broke off an engagement with one of the the best relationships I've had because I was too young to know how to deal with his smothering issues.

I agreed with @_pneumoceptor_ when she said she needs to have relationships transparent, straightforward, understood, or however it was phrased. I'm the same way, to the point if someone isn't willing to deal with issues no matter how long it takes, I can't be a serious friend. Communication is center to my life and I've been able, with some persistence, to work out many issues, but I've found it to be a little difficult to find people willing to work out issues to that extent - sometimes willing to work them out at all - in order to have the most stress-free relationship. 

Many of the ways I view the world are enough like pneumoceptor's that I wonder if I have a strong Ni or a Ti or Fe in common or if it's something outside MBTI.

I just remembered another issue and wanted to give feedback. In this way pneumoceptor and I are very different. In my personal life, almost everything is spontaneous and I need that as much as pneumoceptor needs daily structure. Since I live that constantly, I would never have known how important I was to a friend who was willing to give up their structure for my spontaneity needs. I would have just thought it was life as usual.  Before learning about MBTI, I thought the entire world was somewhat spontaneous since I just naturally chose friends who were, or at least seemed to be, that way.

A very interesting video. Thanks to both!

Edit: I just read @_Geoffrey_'s post and it seems like the videos have touched on something many people have an interest in. It was a good idea to share ideas on a subject outside MBTI to compare how different types see the world.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Meadow said:


> LOL @_Lady Lullaby_, I felt the same way about the video, saving up much in my mind to say, even wishing I had my own microphone, and I've only watched Part 1 so far. I'm likely Pe and wish I knew more so it could help with understanding MBTI functions.
> 
> I didn't realize until watching the video that I don't compliment people very much, or maybe it's hidden in with my enthusiastic supporting of people and belief in their being able to create what they want with their lives.
> 
> Listening to jealousy issues between females was interesting. Since I mainly have male friends, not easily understanding how females think overall, it was a surprise when I ended up with a best female friend on the internet for 2 years. It was my first adult female friendship and I loved her like a sister. She was INFP and, like another INFP friend I had, she could shine her spotlight of caring on me so strongly that it made me feel the most special person in the world. When she'd head off and do it with someone else, and on forums you can watch everything, lol, I'd sometimes feel jealousy, to the point where I even cried once. I kept rolling my eyes at myself because this person was female, not male, and what the heck was I thinking? It helped that my husband understood I rarely had female relationships and helped me through the difficult times. She eventually left forum land and since writing dozens of PMs most days was tiring and she didn't want to phone, it was fine that our relationship ended, though I miss her at times. I'd always felt strange being jealous about a female - I hardly ever feel jealousy even with males - so I was glad to hear I'm not the only person who has experienced this emotion with regard to the same gender.


Lovely to hear from you. I think jealousy can take us by surprise. It does make you feel silly when it is for a female friend when you know your feelings are not romantic. But, if the intensity of this type of love can create jealousy, for me, initially, it just points to the reality of the depth of care you have for that person. I agreed with @pneumoceptor when she said that if there is this fear of losing your place with someone that it may be unhealthy; only because if we add some reason to this jumble of emotions we can see that real relationships are unique to each pair of people and the existence of another friendship doesn't eliminate or demean our own unique pairing of friendship. When the jealousy doesn't go away with thinking about this logically, it usually just means there is insecurity there and usually for NFs, it is with good reason because we've picked up something intuitively and just are searching for what and why. All that to say, yes - you're normal and it sure is a time of personal learning when it happens. I think for me it felt especially embarrassing because I'd always attributed it to happening in one's youth - i.e. adolescence - but I'm a married adult - where is this coming from? haha I guess we NFs never outgrow that desire for having a special friend. (Probably why I was in love with the Anne of Green Gables show as a girl - loved their 'kindred spirit' friendship. hehehe My husband has to remind me - 'people come and go, that's normal life, it doesn't mean there is something wrong with you. There are so many reasons why - but basically, change is the only constant.')

Good luck in your study of cognitive functions and discovering your type. I'd enjoy doing a video chat with you sometime if you wanted to discuss it. Or maybe you can just send a PM and we can talk about it. I promise not to tell you what I think you are because you know you best.


----------



## Celebok

Welcome to the world of Introverted Sensors! I present to you 105 minutes of two guys talking about their respective ISTP and ISFJ experiences: myself and @teddy564339!


----------



## Fridays

(Teddybear) :happy: or @_teddy564339_








Oh, you caught it very well, this thing with SPs and work, that we can go back and forth with fun and work! 







Good observation. 









Have only seen the first part, now I will see the rest! It is really great! <3
*HUGS TO YOU! You are so cute ~ both of you! *:tongue: 



_


_


----------



## Fridays

*Seen the part 2*



I sometimes see it like this:
Me as an ESFP (Se dominat) has a faster graphics card and sound card than you who has the function Si (or Ni / Ne). roud: 
I can receive more impressions and stimuli at the same time and even enjoy it. Multitask! :tongue: 

And you instead, have a really good processor that works on what you already know. And can hold a lot of information, and grind on and on. Over and over again.

And* NONE *of us can do it without each other! Because then, the whole machinery will stop. (Computer fatal error). :bored:


----------



## Fridays

*By the way:*
One of my big sisters are ISFJ, (we are not only siblings, she is like a really good friend of mine).
She is the kind who even remember* MY *ex boyfriends birthdays, haha! I think it's funny. We often laugh about it because it is so unnecessary to remember. :laughing:
She knows all the possible dates, and names. She is really good at it.
And she's a devil on sudoku.
Do you like sudoku too? :happy: I bet you're damn good at it too.


And then one more thing that is interesting, she loves puzzles._ * Oooh, I really hate puzzles! *_
I wonder why the image can not be completed at the beginning (??) :laughing: Seems so very pointless to have to put it together yourself. LOL ** irony ** Not that I think puzzles are difficult, but I just feel stressed out by it. I can not relax with puzzles anyway. :angry: 


*
( *One question I have been wanted to ask for quite some time. Now I would like to ask it, since atleast one ISFJ is nearby and you others who know lots about "children + MBTI." *)*
In broad outline only:
My daughter also likes puzzles. <3 * My little princess * <3 
She's _probably_ Si dominant. Hmm.. :happy: Can you already notice these things on small children..? She is a bit over 2.5 years old. She is very different that me. My mother often tell me this as well.
Anyway. She already makes 50 pieces puzzle. It's not normal from my perspective ..!?? <3
She does not even need any help. She does it herself. <3 My little Heart <3
For her it is so easy to concentrate. And she is so tiny! She's really intelligent.
What makes me think that she is an introvert is that she has giant need for solitude. When she comes home from kindergarten. She often goes into her room, close the door and want to do puzzles. We will not go into her room, she wants to be alone for about 30 minutes. Then she comes out and wants to cuddle and watch TV or go outdoors and play with me and our dog.
Oh, if you knew what discipline she has on me and my INTJ husband.
Personally, I want it clean and tidy. I can almost be manic in cleaning. But she has an eye on where things should be and where she had seen something before. She is good at it to be so young.
The funny thing is that she knows all the rules I told her and she points out, and rebukes me about them when I suddenly do something else, that is, she points me of my own rules as I told her. She's like my echo. Really funny little girl.
Very shy! Very introverted. But she has her friends, and with them, she is active and plays well with them. I'm not worried about her future if it continues like this.


----------



## teddy564339

@_Celebok_


So I just watched our video and I have to say it's a lot more enjoyable to watch afterwards since it's so much easier to sit back and listen to it. It's a lot harder to listen and think about what I'm gonna say at the same time.

But we talked about so much that I'm gonna have to watch it a few more times before I can really process everything!


Overall, though, I just think it was really fun to have a chat centered around SJs vs. SPs. I got so much insight out of it and it was fun to learn about all of it firsthand. I definitely got a better handle on ISTPs and it was cool being able to test out some of my theories and learn about things.


But yeah...I'm definitely gonna have to listen to it a few more times. We talked so in depth and had so many different topics we touched on. I thought it was interesting how we each talked for longer chunks at a time...that's why it's so much easier to take in watching it afterwards!

But I'm so glad we did this...it's just a really cool thing.





Fridays said:


> *By the way:*
> One of my big sisters are ISFJ, (we are not only siblings, she is like a really good friend of mine).
> She is the kind who even remember* MY *ex boyfriends birthdays, haha! I think it's funny. We often laugh about it because it is so unnecessary to remember. :laughing:
> She knows all the possible dates, and names. She is really good at it.
> And she's a devil on sudoku.
> Do you like sudoku too? :happy: I bet you're damn good at it too.




I don't play sudoku, but my mom (an ISTJ) absolutely loves it and is obsessed with it. She plays it all of the time. 




Fridays said:


> And then one more thing that is interesting, she loves puzzles._ * Oooh, I really hate puzzles! *_
> I wonder why the image can not be completed at the beginning (??) :laughing: Seems so very pointless to have to put it together yourself. LOL ** irony ** Not that I think puzzles are difficult, but I just feel stressed out by it. I can not relax with puzzles anyway. :angry:



I love puzzles so much! Not just jigsaw puzzles (though I love those too), but just about any kind of organizational/logical puzzle. I had never thought about how that might be related to type. It's possible that it's related to Si, possible it's related to Ti, it could be both, or it could be neither. I don't know...but I do know that I love puzzles. :happy:




Fridays said:


> In broad outline only:
> My daughter also likes puzzles. <3 * My little princess * <3
> She's _probably_ Si dominant. Hmm.. :happy: Can you already notice these things on small children..? She is a bit over 2.5 years old. She is very different that me. My mother often tell me this as well.
> Anyway. She already makes 50 pieces puzzle. It's not normal from my perspective ..!?? <3
> She does not even need any help. She does it herself. <3 My little Heart <3
> For her it is so easy to concentrate. And she is so tiny! She's really intelligent.
> *What makes me think that she is an introvert is that she has giant need for solitude. When she comes home from kindergarten. She often goes into her room, close the door and want to do puzzles. We will not go into her room, she wants to be alone for about 30 minutes. Then she comes out and wants to cuddle and watch TV or go outdoors and play with me and our dog.*
> Oh, if you knew what discipline she has on me and my INTJ husband.
> Personally, I want it clean and tidy. I can almost be manic in cleaning. But she has an eye on where things should be and where she had seen something before. She is good at it to be so young.
> The funny thing is that she knows all the rules I told her and she points out, and rebukes me about them when I suddenly do something else, that is, she points me of my own rules as I told her. She's like my echo. Really funny little girl.
> Very shy! Very introverted. But she has her friends, and with them, she is active and plays well with them. I'm not worried about her future if it continues like this.


While I can't remember anything from when I was 2.5 years old...the bold part completely describes me as a kid (around 5 years old or so). I've always been introverted, and I've always enjoyed playing by myself and doing puzzle type things.


I don't want to say that she has to be an Si dom....I think other introverts can do these kinds of things too. But at least in that regard, I can greatly relate to what you're describing. 


The rule aspect does sound very J-like, though...particularly SJ like. So you might have a little Si dom on your hands! There's no way to know for sure this early, but I find that very fascinating...an SJ child with an SP mom.


----------



## Celebok

Fridays said:


> *Seen the part 2*
> 
> 
> 
> I sometimes see it like this:
> Me as an ESFP (Se dominat) has a faster graphics card and sound card than you who has the function Si (or Ni / Ne). roud:
> I can receive more impressions and stimuli at the same time and even enjoy it. Multitask! :tongue:
> 
> And you instead, have a really good processor that works on what you already know. And can hold a lot of information, and grind on and on. Over and over again.
> 
> And* NONE *of us can do it without each other! Because then, the whole machinery will stop. (Computer fatal error). :bored:


As a computer geek, I love this analogy! ;-) However, I might say that Ti is the powerful processor, and Si is simply a lot of RAM. ;-)


----------



## Celebok

teddy564339 said:


> So I just watched our video and I have to say it's a lot more enjoyable to watch afterwards since it's so much easier to sit back and listen to it. It's a lot harder to listen and think about what I'm gonna say at the same time.


Yep, I've had that same feeling with the previous two interaction videos I've done. I can take in a lot more of what the other person has said. But I still hate listening to myself talk.



> Overall, though, I just think it was really fun to have a chat centered around SJs vs. SPs. I got so much insight out of it and it was fun to learn about all of it firsthand. I definitely got a better handle on ISTPs and it was cool being able to test out some of my theories and learn about things.


Cool! Yeah, I definitely enjoyed the topics we discussed. The conversation seemed a bit slow in the beginning, but once we got onto those SJ vs. SP issues, we really got going and had a lot to say.



> But yeah...I'm definitely gonna have to listen to it a few more times. We talked so in depth and had so many different topics we touched on. I thought it was interesting how we each talked for longer chunks at a time...that's why it's so much easier to take in watching it afterwards!


Hehe, yep, I noticed that as I was editing and splitting up the video. I had to really work around those large chunks.




> I don't play sudoku, but my mom (an ISTJ) absolutely loves it and is obsessed with it. She plays it all of the time.


I love doing sudoku puzzles, but I haven't done them in a while. But my dad (a suspected ISTP who's retired) is totally addicted to sudoku and can spend hours doing them! It does seem more like something a thinking type would be interested in (Ti or Te), so I find it interesting that @Fridays's ISFJ sister is into them. I guess I can _kind of_ see how Si might be used, since a lot of it is about keeping track of what numbers you've used in each of the rows, columns, and squares, but I would think I'd be using my Ti more than anything to solve them. But then it's likely not something you can narrow down to any one specific function.


----------



## firedell

If anyone wants a female ISFP intereaction chat, I'm now able to do it! I should be doing my first one with @Inguz today. But other types are welcome. PM me, so we can set up things ect:


----------



## Inguz

firedell said:


> If anyone wants a female ISFP intereaction chat, I'm now able to do it! I should be doing my first one with @_Inguz_ today. But other types are welcome. PM me, so we can set up things ect:


Before we even have done it, you want to do it with someone else. :'(


----------



## firedell

Inguz said:


> Before we even have done it, you want to do it with someone else. :'(


What can I say? I move fast.


----------



## Inguz

Me and @firedell finally got to do this thing. "Last minute" as usual.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@renna and @Celebok, just wanted to say that I thoroughly enjoyed your chat.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@Meadow, the quotes you posted regarding MBTI subgroupings are thought-provoking. I'm mulling them over... thanks for all the info. At least the proponents of more symmetrical subgroupings address the fact that they are asymmetrical...


----------



## pneumoceptor

StellarTwirl said:


> I just want to say that, among the videos I've seen, this set is the one that resonated with me the most. When you mentioned knowing there's a shift in a relationship despite being reassured by the other person, the lump crept into my throat.
> 
> I've been pretty much a quiet observer of these interactions, but I felt like the "Thanks" button wasn't enough this time.


Thank you. It was by far the rawest and most revealing of my interaction videos so far. And I kept myself under very tight emotional reins! But that's because I had to be very careful what I said or emoted, for the sake of not losing it during the conversation. I didn't know whether it wouldn't just seem like an emotional mess to viewers, but it seems like it really resonated with some, at least the NFs . Thanks for telling me that it did. 

Shifts in relationships are the *worst*.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Lady Lullaby said:


> There are also a lot of adorable smiles and smirks of mutual 'like' about each other in this video.
> Mmmm...so fun....I was giggling and smiling a lot while I watched this second video.


I definitely noticed this at least on my end... I wonder if it was moreso than with other vids. One of the wonderful things about talking with introverted feelers... maybe especially INFPs... is the 'space' they provide. I don't feel like I have to answer a question right away. I feel like I can observe and respond to non-verbal cues in non-verbal ways myself. And I feel like my own joy or sadness about a particular topic will be *noticed* and *accepted*, even acknowledged. It's nice.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@Geoffrey, I particularly enjoyed perusing Andrea Wenger's site. Thanks for that link! And thanks for all of your comments re: the video. They resonate with me very much .


----------



## pneumoceptor

Meadow said:


> Listening to jealousy issues between females was interesting. Since I mainly have male friends, not easily understanding how females think overall, it was a surprise when I ended up with a best female friend on the internet for 2 years. It was my first adult female friendship and I loved her like a sister. She was INFP and, like another INFP friend I had, she could shine her spotlight of caring on me so strongly that it made me feel the most special person in the world. When she'd head off and do it with someone else, and on forums you can watch everything, lol, I'd sometimes feel jealousy, to the point where I even cried once. I kept rolling my eyes at myself because this person was female, not male, and what the heck was I thinking? It helped that my husband understood I rarely had female relationships and helped me through the difficult times. She eventually left forum land and since writing dozens of PMs most days was tiring and she didn't want to phone, it was fine that our relationship ended, though I miss her at times. I'd always felt strange being jealous about a female - I hardly ever feel jealousy even with males - so I was glad to hear I'm not the only person who has experienced this emotion with regard to the same gender.


Yeah, this part is difficult for me to discuss, and I wouldn't have brought it up myself, so I was glad that @_amanda32_ did. It's been easy for me to invalidate how I was feeling as weird or any number of negative descriptors... The bottom line, though, is that if something strikes a strong emotional chord, be it positive or negative, it's indicative of something real and important going on inside. The jealousy has been indicative of codependency issues, identity issues, fears of rejection, and so on. That it was with a female friend made it harder for me to navigate, because it's easy to feel like something's wrong because this is 'abnormal'. I guess I'm so far into that arena anyway that I just shouldn't worry about what's normal, though .


----------



## pneumoceptor

Lady Lullaby said:


> Probably why I was in love with the Anne of Green Gables show as a girl - loved their 'kindred spirit' friendship.


What is it about that book/show that's sooooo appealing?!!! (particularly regarding the 'bosom friends')


----------



## Meadow

pneumoceptor said:


> Yeah, this part is difficult for me to discuss, and I wouldn't have brought it up myself, so I was glad that @_amanda32_ did. It's been easy for me to invalidate how I was feeling as weird or any number of negative descriptors... *The bottom line, though, is that if something strikes a strong emotional chord, be it positive or negative, it's indicative of something real and important going on inside.* The jealousy has been indicative of codependency issues, identity issues, fears of rejection, and so on. That it was with a female friend made it harder for me to navigate, because it's easy to feel like something's wrong because this is 'abnormal'. I guess I'm so far into that arena anyway that I just shouldn't worry about what's normal, though .


Per the bolded part, since watching the video and discussing this type of relationship on the forum, I've come to see the same thing. It doesn't matter what is loved, if it strikes a chord then it says something about who we are and what has importance to us and shouldn't be brushed away or denied. Though I read about a woman marrying a building and I'm not sure I'd put their relationship in this category. 

I agree with what you said about the issues involved with jealousy and don't kid myself that jealousy equates to love, more that it points out areas for growth, though sometimes I don't particularly want that growth, at least until it's over.  I also didn't know how to respond to my jealousy. It's not the same as with a boyfriend who is obviously flirting with someone, where you can say that's not cool. It's an in-between relationship in a way, and difficult to know how to navigate, but then relationship issues are always interesting no matter how they turn out, frequently saying more about who we are than who the other person is. And yeah, "normal" and I don't have a close relationship. 

@_Lady Lullaby_ offered to PM and help me with my type, so I took her up on it. By coincidence, today I came to the same type for myself as Lady Lullaby did, so her answer was a good double check. I've never seen such a good job of analysis as she did.  I'm posting this because you had asked my type a couple days ago. In my signature line I show that I sometimes come across as F, likely because I'm female and was brought up as an F, as well as enjoying that aspect of myself.


----------



## fihe

@Celebok Lol. they are probably too busy with other things that are of more importance.


----------



## Entropic

Any suspect INFP victim wants to do a video with me (INTP)? I would love to see the differences.


----------



## Celebok

fihe said:


> @_Celebok_ Lol. they are probably too busy with other things that are of more importance.


Hehe, yeah... "Expose myself on YouTube for all the world to see? What purpose would that serve? I've got better things to do with my time!"


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Celebok said:


> Last week, ISFPs @_Inguz_ and @_firedell_ showed us what happens when two ISFPs interact on video. So what happens if you replace one of those two ISFPs with an IS*T*P?
> 
> THIS happens...


:kitteh: Will you guys hate me if I say I thought you both were adorable in this? Loved the 'sleepy' beginning! :laughing:
@Celebok - I got a kick out of you talking about your mom cleaning your place and lecturing you - there probably should be a clause in the mother-son contract that once he moves away from home and is living as a bachelor that he can visit home, but that she needs to stay away from his pad. Right? Soo funny to me because I could visualize a sitcom about the interaction/situation you described. 

Speaking of sitcoms...ever wath Everybody Loves Raymond? The Mom, Marie, is very particular about everything! LOL


----------



## Entropic

Celebok said:


> Hehe, yeah... "Expose myself on YouTube for all the world to see? What purpose would that serve? I've got better things to do with my time!"


That's why you make the video unlisted


----------



## Kabosu

Currently, I haven't gotten to split up my interaction with @_fihe_ so temporarily I'm showing this in full:






btw, I'm amused by the mondegreens of the "transcribed" section of the vid.


----------



## Celebok

Can a rookie ISTP help an IxTx figure out her type? Will you come to the same conclusions? Find out as I join @fihe in an ISTP-IxTx interaction!


----------



## fihe

@Celebok ewwww I look disgusting. I guess that's what happens when I don't put my face on (makeup) and wear stupid glasses


----------



## Celebok

fihe said:


> @_Celebok_ ewwww I look disgusting. I guess that's what happens when I don't put my face on (makeup) and wear stupid glasses


WHAT?!? You do not!! You look just fine! In fact, you're apparently one of those girls who looks good even without makeup! And the glasses give you a bit of a sexy look.


----------



## Entropic

@fihe You strike me as an Te-Fi type based on how you look and your manners alone. Based on about 10 minutes of watching you, I think you are likely an ISFP rather than a IxTx type, honestly. You are so driven by Fi logic. I can see why you'd confuse yourself for a T type based on online tests because you have very strong enneagram 1 and 3 fixes in you, and they are both part of the compentency triad along with 5. This is noticeable in how you are extremely focused talking about production and the values of production and work in general. The values of 3 and 1 drive you forward and because online tests tend to test these things for T and F, it means that you would naturally have a preference for T on any online test taken. Inferior Te does seem to describe you though, because at some point you say that you don't like to grade students after work and the reasoning you use to describe this strikes me as inferior Te-esque to me. You don't want to deal with your inferior which I think grading would force you to interact with one for one. 

Then there's the part about school and how you seem to not relate that well about theory in the end and how you don't really enjoy reading (about theory). I think most NTs will find that going to college is like heaven to them because they can finally be in an environment that fully encourages the use of their dominant functions. Instead you always say that you have troubles grasping theory for one reason or another, whereas T types, especially NT types, tend to in general grasp theory rather quickly and easily and also thrive on and enjoy theory. There's also the part where you talk about how you fared in college and how you would often cop-out your history classes which strikes me something a P type (not to be confused with a P dominant) would do.

There's also the part where you remind me a lot of @hornet who is a self-identified and confirmed ISFP. I'm sorry, but I really don't see the T in you more than in an inferior position. Your image focus seems to want to tell you that you're a T type but I really don't think you are. Of course, only you can truly confirm and verify your type deep down but you would have to actually dig into the cognitive function theory then and see which dominant function actually describes your thinking the most.


----------



## Entropic

With that said, I would still like to make an interaction video with someone. If you know your socionics type it'd help tons! INFP/INFj would be ideal but heck, I don't care <.<


----------



## fihe

hey @_LeaT_, you think that I am an ISFP? that's interesting, because I wouldn't think of myself as Fi-dom in the least. and I wouldn't have thought of not wanting to grade student work as having to do with an inferior Te. it's more like I believe in leaving my work at work and just want to relax at home 

as for grasping theories, I just don't really consider myself a smart person. I feel like the increased stress I've had since I've been in college has caused my brain to deteriorate. when I am under too much stress, I feel like my mind is just completely gone and I can't concentrate unless I am allowed to rest for a bit and focus on just one thing at a time.


----------



## Entropic

fihe said:


> hey @_LeaT_, you think that I am an ISFP? that's interesting, because I wouldn't think of myself as Fi-dom in the least. and I wouldn't have thought of not wanting to grade student work as having to do with an inferior Te. it's more like I believe in leaving my work at work and just want to relax at home
> 
> as for grasping theories, I just don't really consider myself a smart person. I feel like the increased stress I've had since I've been in college has caused my brain to deteriorate. when I am under too much stress, I feel like my mind is just completely gone and I can't concentrate unless I am allowed to rest for a bit and focus on just one thing at a time.


And I know an INFP who reasoned the same way. If it's something T types tend to not think of themselves as is being incapable of thinking logically or not be capable of dealing with something logical because they are tired. I made a poll in the INTP forum where it was revealed that most INTPs for example suffer from sleep deprivation. F types tend to think of themselves as logically incompetent and T types emotionally incompetent.


----------



## fihe

LeaT said:


> F types tend to think of themselves as logically incompetent and T types emotionally incompetent.


eh, I think I'm both. I'm just all kinds of defective!
and I've also had a problem with my sleep schedule lately from my two jobs. this past week I've been pretty dazed, especially while driving. that's probably dangerous but welp


----------



## Entropic

fihe said:


> eh, I think I'm both. I'm just all kinds of defective!
> and I've also had a problem with my sleep schedule lately from my two jobs. this past week I've been pretty dazed, especially while driving. that's probably dangerous but welp


I know and understand that and I can just go off what you give me and the vibes I get and those vibes seem to point more toward Fi than Te. I get very strong Fi vibes.


----------



## fihe

LeaT said:


> I know and understand that and I can just go off what you give me and the vibes I get and those vibes seem to point more toward Fi than Te. I get very strong Fi vibes.


oh dear, I hate feelings


----------



## Fat Bozo

LeaT said:


> @_fihe_ You strike me as an Te-Fi type based on how you look and your manners alone. Based on about 10 minutes of watching you, I think you are likely an ISFP rather than a IxTx type, honestly. You are so driven by Fi logic. I can see why you'd confuse yourself for a T type based on online tests because you have very strong enneagram 1 and 3 fixes in you, and they are both part of the compentency triad along with 5. This is noticeable in how you are extremely focused talking about production and the values of production and work in general. The values of 3 and 1 drive you forward and because online tests tend to test these things for T and F, it means that you would naturally have a preference for T on any online test taken. Inferior Te does seem to describe you though, because at some point you say that you don't like to grade students after work and the reasoning you use to describe this strikes me as inferior Te-esque to me. You don't want to deal with your inferior which I think grading would force you to interact with one for one.
> 
> 
> There's also the part where you remind me a lot of @_hornet_ who is a self-identified and confirmed ISFP. I'm sorry, but I really don't see the T in you more than in an inferior position. Your image focus seems to want to tell you that you're a T type but I really don't think you are. Of course, only you can truly confirm and verify your type deep down but you would have to actually dig into the cognitive function theory then and see which dominant function actually describes your thinking the most.


Having chatted at length with fihe myself last night, I respectfully, but vehemently disagree. I'm not going to say that by virtue of being an SFP that I can automatically identify others of my type, but I think I can tell when someone is far away from my type, and I got absolutely no "SFP" from fihe.


----------



## Kabosu

Yeah, I've watched her "video challenge" video, interaction with hornet and did an interaction video with her and I don't think she's an SP, period.

From a cognitive perspective, I saw Ne/Si > Ni/Se for sure.


----------



## Celebok

LeaT said:


> @fihe You strike me as an Te-Fi type based on how you look and your manners alone. Based on about 10 minutes of watching you, I think you are likely an ISFP rather than a IxTx type, honestly. You are so driven by Fi logic. I can see why you'd confuse yourself for a T type based on online tests because you have very strong enneagram 1 and 3 fixes in you, and they are both part of the compentency triad along with 5. This is noticeable in how you are extremely focused talking about production and the values of production and work in general. The values of 3 and 1 drive you forward and because online tests tend to test these things for T and F, it means that you would naturally have a preference for T on any online test taken. Inferior Te does seem to describe you though, because at some point you say that you don't like to grade students after work and the reasoning you use to describe this strikes me as inferior Te-esque to me. You don't want to deal with your inferior which I think grading would force you to interact with one for one. Then there's the part about school and how you seem to not relate that well about theory in the end and how you don't really enjoy reading (about theory). I think most NTs will find that going to college is like heaven to them because they can finally be in an environment that fully encourages the use of their dominant functions. Instead you always say that you have troubles grasping theory for one reason or another, whereas T types, especially NT types, tend to in general grasp theory rather quickly and easily and also thrive on and enjoy theory. There's also the part where you talk about how you fared in college and how you would often cop-out your history classes which strikes me something a P type (not to be confused with a P dominant) would do.There's also the part where you remind me a lot of @hornet who is a self-identified and confirmed ISFP. I'm sorry, but I really don't see the T in you more than in an inferior position. Your image focus seems to want to tell you that you're a T type but I really don't think you are. Of course, only you can truly confirm and verify your type deep down but you would have to actually dig into the cognitive function theory then and see which dominant function actually describes your thinking the most.


This is a really interesting observation! The T part was the one thing I didn't question about @fihe's type, because she scored 100% on T, and I figured even an inaccurate test wouldn't be 100% inaccurate on one of the dichotemies! But now that you've mentioned it, when I rewatch parts of the video, I totally see the Fi value system being expressed, and the Te in her communication style! I still think her perception functions are Ne-Si, rather than Se-Ni. I think more of this was expressed in the later parts of the video, so if you only watched the first ten minutes, then maybe that's why your initial impression was ISFP. So I'd say it's very possible that Fihe is an INFP. Totally not what I would've expected!As for why she would score 100% T, I don't really know much about enneagrams, so I can't really comment on whether it's that, or some other influences making her want to believe she's a T. But I definitely think it's worth exploring.


fihe said:


> oh dear, I hate feelings


That statement really says a lot. Obviously something is making you detest the idea of having your feelings influence your actions, and only you would know what that is. But if it's any comfort to you, the word "feeler" is a bit misleading in Jungian terms, as well as in the common Myers-Briggs type explanations. Contrary to what you've probably heard, being a "feeler" doesn't just mean that you make your decisions based on your feelings, nor does it mean that you're an emotional person. When you break it down by functions, having a preference for using Fi means that your internal focus is on a strong set of personal values, or things that are important to you that can be classified as right and wrong, or as good and bad. This is in contrast to Ti, in which the emphasis is on an internal map of logically organized concepts, completely separate from any personal value system.It's actually fairly common for people to mistype themselves if they don't like the sound of a certain type definition or description.


----------



## fihe

@Celebok, I'd love to thank your post but right now PerC is giving an error message when I try to do so. I'm also not able to view my thanked posts or post quotes


----------



## Inveniet

Celebok said:


> Those sound like good clues to consider, but to me it sounds like a bit of a leap to take a lack of interest in something as a firm indicator of something else. For all we know, @_fihe_'s mind might've been distracted while you were discussing the Ni perspective. Maybe you mentioned a specific topic that didn't interest her and it had nothing to do with the Ni perspective of that topic. I think it would be worth it to figure out WHY she wasn't interested in that part of the conversation, before going down the rabbit trail of assuming it indicates high Si. (As an example, it would be like taking me into a women's shoe store and pointing out all the details of the various shoes in front of us, and then assuming that my lack of interest means I don't prefer to look at real-world details, and therefore is an indicator of Ne.)


Using the words disinterest was the best I could come up with on the fly. It goes far deeper than that. 
It was the whole vibe between us that changed when I brought up Ni usage.
And my gut gave me the sinking feeling I always get when your information has been "cognitively rejected".
So it is more a gut feeling thing. The body language I picked up on a rewatch and remembering how I felt at that time.
The topic was about something that she didn't perceive as real. I can't say for sure, but I get the impression that Si/Te
heavy people lack an affinity for things that isn't real, like anime.

Anyway after that I moved the topic towards topics I knew high Si users revel in (safety etc) and guess what, 
her interest spiked significantly. And she kept going on about possibilities from a safety perspective.
That is very Ne. INFP is a possibility for sure, but I did get the feeling that she was more playful and explorative with her Fi
than an Fi dom would be. We are more firm and set in our Fi ways. My INFP friend is way more opinionated about Fi topics
than I got the impression from her.
@fihe
No you wasn't rude. I was able to pick up on your internal state and discern that you was unable to relate to the information.
Rudeness implies that you *consciously chooses to display disrespect.*
In your case you had a process outside your awareness make you behave in a certain way.
I only picked up on it since I'm very much in tune with the state of what the other person is about in the moment.
It is an ISFP/9 blessing and curse.



> Still, your theory doesn't actually contradict any of the cognitive functions we've been seeing in @_fihe_. The leading contender is INFP, which has the same functions as ISTJ, in a different order. It's just a matter of whether the Si+Te pair is more dominant than the Fi+Ne pair. I personally still see more Fi+Ne than Si+Te.


I'm sticking with ISTJ as your Ti logic reasoning seems as irrelevant to me as Ni seemed to fihe in our chat. 
Just as my Fi reasoning probably irks Ti doms the wrong way too.


----------



## Inveniet

StellarTwirl said:


> Wow, this is interesting! (This might be why I'm always so interested in what Ni-doms have to say.) I wonder if dom/aux Ni feels the same way about Si.


In my experience they do and can be very verbal about it. 
Just try to force them to endure a tea-party centred about the topic of the splendidness of the china used to serve the tea. XD
I can endure it if I must as I can just Se my way trough it. Dom Ni don't have that option.
Forced Se for an hour is a guaranteed path to exhaustion.

Think about how you would feel about forced Se for an hour.
Ne/Se is equivalent to Si/Ni.
Everytime I go Se on my ENTP friend he has this dazed and confused look on his face.


----------



## Entropic

hornet said:


> Using the words disinterest was the best I could come up with on the fly. It goes far deeper than that.
> It was the whole vibe between us that changed when I brought up Ni usage.
> And my gut gave me the sinking feeling I always get when your information has been "cognitively rejected".
> So it is more a gut feeling thing. The body language I picked up on a rewatch and remembering how I felt at that time.
> *The topic was about something that she didn't perceive as real. I can't say for sure, but I get the impression that Si/Te
> heavy people lack an affinity for things that isn't real, like anime.*


I really don't think an interest in anime or not has anything to do with Si...


> *Anyway after that I moved the topic towards topics I knew high Si users revel in (safety etc) and guess what,
> her interest spiked significantly. And she kept going on about possibilities from a safety perspective.*
> That is very Ne. INFP is a possibility for sure, but I did get the feeling that she was more playful and explorative with her Fi
> than an Fi dom would be. We are more firm and set in our Fi ways. My INFP friend is way more opinionated about Fi topics
> than I got the impression from her.


I really don't think an interest in safety has anything to do with Si either. An interest in safety is enneagram-related. Sp doms and 6s are in general more interested in safety than other types and I definitely see the 3-6 axis in her and sp dom so. Go ahead and try me, try to discuss safety issues with me and you will see how disinterested I will be in favor for discussing theoretical subjects or anime (and I will theorize anime which is again part enneagram-related). 

It's like saying her focus on career must be an indicator of dominant or auxiliary Te when it's just her 3 image fix shining through. She seems to be 136 tritype based on what I've seen.


----------



## Inveniet

LeaT said:


> I really don't think an interest in anime or not has anything to do with Si...
> 
> I really don't think an interest in safety has anything to do with Si either. An interest in safety is enneagram-related. Sp doms and 6s are in general more interested in safety than other types and I definitely see the 3-6 axis in her and sp dom so. Go ahead and try me, try to discuss safety issues with me and you will see how disinterested I will be in favor for discussing theoretical subjects or anime (and I will theorize anime which is again part enneagram-related).
> 
> It's like saying her focus on career must be an indicator of dominant or auxiliary Te when it's just her 3 image fix shining through. She seems to be 136 tritype based on what I've seen.


You are misinterpreting my message.
(I'm not trying to be nitpicky accurate either )



> I can't say for sure, but I get the impression that Si/Te
> heavy people *lack an affinity for things that isn't real,* like anime.


Focus on the *affinity for real*. 
In my experience the Si and Te combined together in dom/aux makes for an individual who
don't like to venture very far from what is perceived as real and concrete.

As for the enneagram I won't say either way what is going on in that realm.
I don't care for a Ti exploration of something I don't feel well grounded in.

Si doms focus on safety since anything new reeks of Ne and safety is a concept that contains *an element of stability*.



> Go ahead and try me, try to discuss safety issues with me and you will see how disinterested I will be in favor for discussing theoretical subjects or anime (and I will theorize anime which is again part enneagram-related).


How exactly does you revelling in your auxiliary Ne, prove your point about Si dom/aux users?

I get the impression that you don't bother to read my post and think about the meaning I'm trying to convey. 
You just react to them and cause you can't stand the Fi message they carry. 
Much like my ISTP father who I have to go stone cold Te on every time I've made some Fi carrying statement to shut him up.

Here is the truth.
*I don't give a damn* if my statments don't balance like a math equation.
I have a message between the lines and I don't expect anyone to take my words as gospel truth.
Nor do I want my words to be held to the standard of gospel truth.

Now these statements are teased out from reacting to your Ti statements who in fact repulse me.
I've noticed lately that people on this forum try to erect this political correct atmosphere around the fact that
certain perspectives tick us off more than others.

In my view most conflicts stem from the fact that we aren’t aware of how much these perspectives affect us.
We react negatively because we have rejected them so deeply.

Every time I have a discussion with you LeaT I feel unbalanced since the frame you are coming from doesn't
sit well with me. The information seems almost irrelevant. Only the knowledge of you being a Ti dom makes
me reconsider and try to respond in a polite tone and with as little defensiveness as possible.

Now what I've written here is very Fi. It contains *no major fact checking, no checking of internal consistency....
All it does is represent very accurately what I feel and mean!
*
When you try to nitpick those statements for whatever standards you try to hold me to.
All I feel is trampled by a general disregard.

I can go Te and check the facts, open the relevant books and refresh my memory.
However I still won't try to make my statments balance like an equation.
I don't have the time, energy nor the inclination.
It won't serve anyone else than you LeaT if I do it.
No one will be better educated if I make everything nitpicky correct.

In fact all I care about is that someone is able to infer what I mean from the abstract meaning contained in my statements.
I'm pointing to concepts, you have to deal with those concepts yourself not expect me to point out every connection for you.
But that is very Ni of me. I'm expecting everyone to take the information as I'm used to it.
Here is a concept, *try to see if that point of view will enlighten you more.*

Then the Ti user comes, your points of view isn't internally consistent.
Well no, they aren’t and I like it that way.

Hope someone was able to gleam something useful from my rant as I've been severely stressed lately and can't deal with
the perspective of Ti in any other way than long rants.

BTW:
In case anyone got the wrong message I respect @_LeaT_ highly.
But that doesn't matter at all when it comes to how I react to Ti under stress.
Those reactions isn't personal and shouldn't be interpreted as such.
Just as @_fihe_ shouldn't feel like she was rude for her reactions to Ni.


----------



## Entropic

@hornet, it has nothing to do with your Fi but it has to do with how you convey your points. That you think I just attack you because of your Fi-reasoning however reeks very much of projection on your part. You are writing your posts on an online forum public for everyone to see; if you can't deal with people disagreeing with your points and deflecting that it's people simply reacting to your Fi then you're just being dishonest and refuse to take responsbility of what you say and write. So let's say I would do the same and say that you can't understand me because Ti is so much logical than any function, wouldn't you think I come off as a know-it-all prick? That's essentially what you're doing here by playing up the whole "I'm right but you can't possibly understand me because I'm Fi dom". That's just a refusal on your part to communicate. Not everything is about Fi.



> Focus on the *affinity for real*.
> In my experience the Si and Te combined together in dom/aux makes for an individual who
> don't like to venture very far from what is perceived as real and concrete.


But that's your subjective understanding of what real and concrete is. You're an Se auxiliary user, by that token shouldn't you equally be disinterested in fiction because fiction isn't real? Ni is your tertiary function but the tertiary is weak. There is a big difference between auxiliary and tertiary alone. The tertiary is considered a part of the unconscious, just less unconscious as the inferior. 

No, the question is how we understand fiction itself. @itsme45 is for example an ESTP with inferior Ni and she likes fiction and even likes to come up with stories but she is careful to not find any hidden meaning in fiction which would be an N-thing to do. In class I'm fairly sure you had to do literature analysis at some point when studying a language where you have to figure out the metaphorical meaning of the narrative and so on, and that's how an N would approach fiction. 

Of course, I haven't actually seen the video between you and fihe and while I understand what you are trying to say, I don't think an interest in fiction or not _per se_ can be indicative of S/N. It's rather how we approach fiction that's indicative - does she write it off because she has no interest in the symbolic and hidden meanings?



> Si doms focus on safety since anything new reeks of Ne and safety is a concept that contains *an element of stability*.


See, now that's a reasoning I can buy and yes I agree that Si-dominants can potentially be more risk-averse in this sense although I think there's an unfortunate overlap here with enneagram descriptions.


----------



## Inveniet

LeaT said:


> @_hornet_, it has nothing to do with your Fi but it has to do with how you convey your points. That you think I just attack you because of your Fi-reasoning however reeks very much of projection on your part. You are writing your posts on an online forum public for everyone to see; if you can't deal with people disagreeing with your points and deflecting that it's people simply reacting to your Fi then you're just being dishonest and refuse to take responsbility of what you say and write. So let's say I would do the same and say that you can't understand me because Ti is so much logical than any function, wouldn't you think I come off as a know-it-all prick? That's essentially what you're doing here by playing up the whole "I'm right but you can't possibly understand me because I'm Fi dom". That's just a refusal on your part to communicate. Not everything is about Fi.


Haha I find it funny that the more honest and direct I become the more dishonest and evasive you perceive me.
Proving my point perfectly.
Dishonesty implyes saying something you don't belive to be true.
I believe in every one of my statements in the last post, so dishonest? I don't think so.
As for know-it-all-prick? I won't even comment that one.

Now I remembered why we disagree, I subscribe to the Beebe model...
You don't. It is that simple.
So I deleted long angry retort.

Instead I ask why is the Beebe model wrong on peoples reaction to different functions in your view?



> But that's your subjective understanding of what real and concrete is. You're an Se auxiliary user, by that token shouldn't you equally be disinterested in fiction because fiction isn't real? Ni is your tertiary function but the tertiary is weak. There is a big difference between auxiliary and tertiary alone. The tertiary is considered a part of the unconscious, just less unconscious as the inferior.


The tertiary is the playful function, so I play with fiction and such. There is also a big difference between tertiary and inferior,
just as Ni and Ne are very different. Many ISFPs dig sci-fi anime and such as long as the feeling content are believable.
Hence I like Star Wars over Star Trek as the interactions in Star Trek comes of quite fake to me.

Not that Star Wars is totally non fake, but it is a step in the right direction not having every convo politically correctly scripted.



> No, the question is how we understand fiction itself. @_itsme45_ is for example an ESTP with inferior Ni and she likes fiction and even likes to come up with stories but she is careful to not find any hidden meaning in fiction which would be an N-thing to do. In class I'm fairly sure you had to do literature analysis at some point when studying a language where you have to figure out the metaphorical meaning of the narrative and so on, and that's how an N would approach fiction.


Yeah but that is *Ni*... Not *Ne* BIG difference....



> Of course, I haven't actually seen the video between you and fihe and while I understand what you are trying to say, I don't think an interest in fiction or not _per se_ can be indicative of S/N. It's rather how we approach fiction that's indicative - does she write it off because she has no interest in the symbolic and hidden meanings?


Yeah that was my impression exactly. I was talking about how INTJs was usually the villain in many shows.
And the inferences needed to come to those conclusions gave her the quaint look of I don't even want to consider
that any aspect of anything can have any meaning whatsoever beyond that is plainly there.
In other words the convo got real tense/stale/uptight as soon as a Ni inference was expected.
And I got to that lovely part that makes all Ni users love SJs so much where I had to drop the topic and find another
more down to earth since she was plainly not interested in having a convo about more wishy washy stuff.
Having just had a convo with an INTJ the contrast was very intense for me. And it was nothing like the mistrust
the ESFP with Ni in inferior either. There we could meet halfway and agree that I put more stock in guesses than he did.

This was more a that isn't real so why are we even discussing it.... All said in body language and general awkwardness.
Now I'm an Fi user and notice the level of awkwardness a convo have and quickly move away from it.
So from her perspective she seems to have no recollection of there being an issue, cause I solved it instantly by moving the topic to a more down to earth topic. I mean the INTJ convo was taking place in a whole other realm, likewise with the INFJ convos.

Now I have no problem with going down to earth, being an S and all. I was just taken by surprise by encountering
Si when I was expecting Ni. Anyone who watches that vid closely should see that I'm taken totally of guard in my expectations
and I'm having to totally rethink where I'm going with the convo as what I'm saying does not get any response on any
level. Cause the information is irrelevant to her.

At least if you go by the Bebee model, and I know you reject it and that is unfortunate cause it really works in the real world.
Explaining why people don't like what other people are saying perfectly.



> See, now that's a reasoning I can buy and yes I agree that Si-dominants can potentially be more risk-averse in this sense although I think there's an unfortunate overlap here with enneagram descriptions.


Glad we can agree on something.
I would like to untangle the enneagram from my JCF understanding some day in the future.
But if I'm to keep my sanity I think I need to do it with an INTJ.


----------



## Entropic

@_hornet_, what you really need to understand is that disagreement isn't necessary because of functions alone. If that's true then I would never disagree with an INTP either because we use the same functions but that's not true. There's much more to people than the system you ascribe to suggests; that's my entire point. Ironically you seem to not take in enough information with your perceiving functions to make you realize this. Reality is not only how you think of it in your head, it's multi-faceted.

For example, one of the reasons why I cannot agree with the Beebe model is because it cannot describe my high Fi use which is very much recognized by all those that actually know me well. It furthermore does not seem to truly describe Ne and Si as parent and child functions. My Si is in general quite under-developed and I don't really notice much of my Si-use or even look consciously look for an Si-perspective from a recreative point of view with the only exception perhaps being my fiction-writing, but that is not because I wish to engage Si actively. Rather my fiction often seems to stem from already being in an Si-mood and just like Jung suggested, Si must often be expressed creatively due to the complexity of Si-impressions. This doesn't mean that it fulfills the child archetype though. 

I do not feel the Beebe model can truly describe my reality and why should I subscribe to a model that doesn't? I also have troubles with how the Beebe model assumes that every person thinks or cognitively behaves the same. I don't think people are that stereotype and that people are much too complex for such a thing. This is why I have explored both enneagram and the MBTI and I am now exploring socionics more. These three models all have a different approach in trying to explain the reality of human cognition and behavior and learning more about each model gives a much more deeper idea of how human cognition works like. In the socionics model the 8th function is Te, not Fi for a Ti dominant. Which model is right and wrong here? So if the Beebe model works for you, then good, but don't assume it will work for everyone else. The Beebe model can't explain people such as Flatlander who seems to be dominantly Ni and Ti, but if that's true, then where's the Se and Te? I just don't put so much stock into theory if it cannot capture every aspect of reality. Then it clearly lacks fluidity and complexity.



> Hence I like Star Wars over Star Trek as the interactions in Star Trek comes of quite fake to me.
> 
> Not that Star Wars is totally non fake, but it is a step in the right direction not having every convo politically correctly scripted.


I really fail to see how you identifying authentic social expressions in science fiction shows has anything to do with Ni? 



> Yeah but that is *Ni*... Not *Ne* BIG difference....


I think Ni is as likely to look for the symbolic and archetypal in fiction like Ne is. That's pretty much how Ni is described as a function; a desire to look for the symbolic and archetypal. The difference is how they tie ideas together. 


> At least if you go by the Bebee model, and I know you reject it and that is unfortunate cause it really works in the real world.


And that's the problem exactly - I haven't noticed it. I feel enneagram describes our behavior better. I'm currently struggling with finding my sociotype because I cannot fit that model entirely either for example. Of course, I also wonder how much of the Forer effect is at play here; that we experience a phenomenon and think that it must be because of X because the model says so and then we already ignore that it could be because of a whole load of other causes or explanations but instead we choose to reinforce the model's point of view instead of unveiling the actual truth of things. And that's just my enneagram speaking.



> I would like to untangle the enneagram from my JCF understanding some day in the future.
> *But if I'm to keep my sanity I think I need to do it with an INTJ. *


I think you put too much stock into type and less stock in individuals 

*EDIT*
I actually think our differences has to do with enneagram perspectives rather than functions. 9s tend to want to see the place as something ideal and idyllic but 5s want to see the place as how things actually are. Obviously those views will clash because 5s think 9s over-idolize and romanticize the world and 9s will find the way 5s want to deconstruct their idyllic 9-world threatening. I also wouldn't overlook a potential wing 1 for you rather than 8 wing. There's definitely more super-ego influence in how you reason (how things should be in a universal sense) than gut-influence. I would also strongly look into your headfix being 6w5 over 5w4.


----------



## Inveniet

> For example, one of the reasons why I cannot agree with the Beebe model is because it cannot describe my high Fi use which is very much recognized by all those that actually know me well. It furthermore does not seem to truly describe Ne and Si as parent and child functions. My Si is in general quite under-developed and I don't really notice much of my Si-use or even look consciously look for an Si-perspective from a recreative point of view with the only exception perhaps being my fiction-writing, but that is not because I wish to engage Si actively. Rather my fiction often seems to stem from already being in an Si-mood and just like Jung suggested, Si must often be expressed creatively due to the complexity of Si-impressions. This doesn't mean that it fulfills the child archetype though.
> 
> I do not feel the Beebe model can truly describe my reality and why should I subscribe to a model that doesn't? I also have troubles with how the Beebe model assumes that every person thinks or cognitively behaves the same. I don't think people are that stereotype and that people are much too complex for such a thing. This is why I have explored both enneagram and the MBTI and I am now exploring socionics more. These three models all have a different approach in trying to explain the reality of human cognition and behavior and learning more about each model gives a much more deeper idea of how human cognition works like. In the socionics model the 8th function is Te, not Fi for a Ti dominant. Which model is right and wrong here? So if the Beebe model works for you, then good, but don't assume it will work for everyone else. The Beebe model can't explain people such as Flatlander who seems to be dominantly Ni and Ti, but if that's true, then where's the Se and Te? I just don't put so much stock into theory if it cannot capture every aspect of reality. Then it clearly lacks fluidity and complexity.


 @LeaT
Ah well...
That is all I really wanted. 
*Lets agree to totally disagree on the fabric of reality.*
Cause that is how deep the disagreement goes... XD
However I wish you well in your search for a meaningful perspective. 

Basically the Bebee model predicts quite well for me who has such alternate realities.
So I can be forewarned the inevitable clash. :-/


----------



## Entropic

Still looking for someone to do a video with me by the way.


----------



## fihe

LeaT said:


> I was also considering if she's a P dom but I don't think she's an ISTJ. Then she would have tertiary feeling but her Fi is too strong to be tertiary in my opinion. Once you notice her Fi it's pretty much all over the place. ENFP could work.


me, an extrovert? ROFLCOPTER

it's been interesting seeing you and @hornet discuss. I'd do a video with you but I'm afraid I'll confuse you since I'm of an unknown type.

btw, this thread now has 1984 thanks! like the legendary book that I've never read :O


----------



## itsme45

LeaT said:


> No, the question is how we understand fiction itself. @_itsme45_ is for example an ESTP with inferior Ni and she likes fiction and even likes to come up with stories but she is careful to not find any hidden meaning in fiction which would be an N-thing to do. In class I'm fairly sure you had to do literature analysis at some point when studying a language where you have to figure out the metaphorical meaning of the narrative and so on, and that's how an N would approach fiction.
> 
> Of course, I haven't actually seen the video between you and fihe and while I understand what you are trying to say, I don't think an interest in fiction or not _per se_ can be indicative of S/N. It's rather how we approach fiction that's indicative - does she write it off because she has no interest in the symbolic and hidden meanings?


It was probably just bad wording from your part but I'm not actually "careful" consciously, I just automatically don't focus on that aspect. Nothing to do with being careful in that sense 

You mention hidden meanings and symbolic stuff, well as for symbolic things, I just look at them as is  so often it all makes no sense to me... though they can be interesting to look at if it's visual. 

And this hidden meaning stuff, that would only apply to fiction that's not of the common easy-to-read-have-fun kind but something more weird right?  What comes off to me when reading/watching such non-mainstream fiction is a kind of mood only. I do like certain weird literature or films because they cause moods that I like in some unexplicable way. I can't put it into words, I don't try to analyse what it is, I see no point for that  I do like them without that too. Sometimes it can be enjoyable reading philosophical stuff for the same reason.

Oh and as for the easy-to-read low quality fiction or movies, I enjoy that just as fun action stuff or fun/interesting drama, no more, I have a good enough imagination or something to "live through" the happenings when reading or watching such easy stuff, but I don't think of any meaning for sure. 

Overall I do agree that just an interest in fiction doesn't say anything definitive about the person's cognitive profile.


----------



## esq

I would of course recommend @_LeaT_ to webchat with @_Fat Bozo_ because I have certain opinions on this matter and you know what they are.

Also apologies to @_fihe_ for my offenses. You sometimes make weird jokes and you sometimes say sincere things that are also weird and so I dunno. I can't tell what's cooked versus what's raw.


----------



## Entropic

fihe said:


> me, an extrovert? ROFLCOPTER
> 
> it's been interesting seeing you and @_hornet_ discuss. I'd do a video with you but I'm afraid I'll confuse you since I'm of an unknown type.
> 
> btw, this thread now has 1984 thanks! like the legendary book that I've never read :O


Cognitive extraversion is not the same as social extraversion. You think of the latter rather than the former. Also many ENxPs tend to mistake themselves for introverts because ENxPs are the most introverted out of the extraverted types.

And the reason why I want to do a video is because I want to be able to tell my sociotype. Your type is less relevant  I think you're a gamma type in socionics though.

The last sentence was actually very Ne by connecting two unrelated ideas into something that appeared coherent to you.


----------



## Fat Bozo

LeaT said:


> I also have troubles with how the Beebe model assumes that every person thinks or cognitively behaves the same. I don't think people are that stereotype and that people are much too complex for such a thing.


Isn't that exactly what you are doing when you make this assumption though?--



LeaT said:


> I was also considering if she's a P dom but I don't think she's an ISTJ. Then she would have tertiary feeling but her Fi is too strong to be tertiary in my opinion. Once you notice her Fi it's pretty much all over the place. ENFP could work.


You assume if her best fit type was ISTJ that she would automatically "have tertiary feeling" which is an assumption without basis and really kind of a nonsense phrase.



LeaT said:


> Still looking for someone to do a video with me by the way.


I'd love to!


----------



## Entropic

Fat Bozo said:


> Isn't that exactly what you are doing when you make this assumption though?--
> 
> 
> 
> You assume if her best fit type was ISTJ that she would automatically "have tertiary feeling" which is an assumption without basis and really kind of a nonsense phrase.


No, because tertiary feeling is a very differnet thing in my model than the Beebe model. To me tertiary feeling is merely the relationship Fi plays with the auxiliary function but it can be way, way down the function stack depending on the person. A person can for example exhibit a wide array of other functions that seem more developed than tertiary Fi or engage other functions than Fi, but when trying to type people it's best to try to filter out other functions that don't seem to be as predominant. 



> I'd love to!


Well, you can send me details and stuff then. What type are you in socionics? SEE?


----------



## Ellis Bell

fihe said:


> me, an extrovert? ROFLCOPTER
> 
> it's been interesting seeing you and @_hornet_ discuss. I'd do a video with you but I'm afraid I'll confuse you since I'm of an unknown type.
> 
> btw, this thread now has 1984 thanks! like the legendary book that I've never read :O


I'm waiting until it has 2001, then we can do a space odyssey. 

Sorry, I got nothing interesting to add. But a lot of these videos have been fascinating.


----------



## Fat Bozo

LeaT said:


> No, because tertiary feeling is a very differnet thing in my model than the Beebe model. To me tertiary feeling is merely the relationship Fi plays with the auxiliary function but it can be way, way down the function stack depending on the person. A person can for example exhibit a wide array of other functions that seem more developed than tertiary Fi or engage other functions than Fi, but when trying to type people it's best to try to filter out other functions that don't seem to be as predominant.


That's awesome, I understand like exactly half of each of your sentences, and the other half makes no sense to me. And that's exactly what happens when I talk to my INTP older brother, so I have to laugh. I would most definitely enjoy talking more about your model.




> Well, you can send me details and stuff then. What type are you in socionics? SEE?


Details as in time and date? Well, for me evenings and weekends are best, I'm in Central time, so just let me know when's a good time for you to chat.

Your guess is as good as mine on the socionics. No, I DON"T SEE! :tongue:


----------



## Entropic

Fat Bozo said:


> That's awesome, I understand like exactly half of each of your sentences, and the other half makes no sense to me. And that's exactly what happens when I talk to my INTP older brother, so I have to laugh. I would most definitely enjoy talking more about your model.


I can't even begin to transform my abstract thinking into something Se-esque for you to understand. I can try, but I have little doubt about me being able to convey it to you sigh. It's hard enough for me to try to explain things to itsme45 and I think the only reason she understands me at all is because her N is decent and she's got Ti lol.


> Details as in time and date? Well, for me evenings and weekends are best, I'm in Central time, so just let me know when's a good time for you to chat.


Well, I am not entirely sure what central time is actually... But you can probably add about 6+ hours for my time so evening for me is probably your afternoon. So if that works for you, ok. I can't stay up past midnight bceause I got work in the morning during weekdays.


> Your guess is as good as mine on the socionics. No, I DON"T SEE! :tongue:


I see. I suspect esq thinks I might be ILI and you SEE so he wants to rule out whether you fit the bill of dual type I guess. I am not sure I am seeing it


----------



## Celebok

hornet said:


> Using the words disinterest was the best I could come up with on the fly. It goes far deeper than that.
> It was the whole vibe between us that changed when I brought up Ni usage.
> And my gut gave me the sinking feeling I always get when your information has been "cognitively rejected".
> So it is more a gut feeling thing. The body language I picked up on a rewatch and remembering how I felt at that time.
> The topic was about something that she didn't perceive as real. I can't say for sure, but I get the impression that Si/Te
> heavy people lack an affinity for things that isn't real, like anime.
> 
> Anyway after that I moved the topic towards topics I knew high Si users revel in (safety etc) and guess what,
> her interest spiked significantly. And she kept going on about possibilities from a safety perspective.
> That is very Ne. INFP is a possibility for sure, but I did get the feeling that she was more playful and explorative with her Fi
> than an Fi dom would be. We are more firm and set in our Fi ways. My INFP friend is way more opinionated about Fi topics
> than I got the impression from her.
> 
> I'm sticking with ISTJ as your Ti logic reasoning seems as irrelevant to me as Ni seemed to fihe in our chat.
> Just as my Fi reasoning probably irks Ti doms the wrong way too.


Heh.

Well, I guess I can't really dispute the actual Fi-dom person over what Fi should look like. I would prefer to think that your Fi and my Ti simply offer different perspectives on the same observations (we both share aux Se, after all), rather than butt heads with each other. So I'm going to suggest that while you don't see @fihe displaying as strong Fi as you would expect from Fi-dom, particularly in comparison to your INFP friend, it may just be that Fihe is choosing to hold some of it back. I'm guessing your INFP friend is a lot more comfortable expressing Fi opinions with you than Fihe is with us, whom she just met over a first-time video chat. Fi is internal, so it doesn't have to be fully communicated to the outside world if the Fi user doesn't want to for whatever reason. You're obviously much more comfortable displaying your Fi than Fihe is with hers, considering she still preferred to think of herself as a logical thinker as of her last video. Nevertheless, from what I saw, and from what @LeaT saw, Fihe did definitely display a lot of Fi whenever she expressed her views, moreso than even what little Te we could hear in her communication style. Her Ne still seems to be her primary external interface.


----------



## Teybo

Celebok said:


> Heh.
> 
> Well, I guess I can't really dispute the actual Fi-dom person over what Fi should look like. I would prefer to think that your Fi and my Ti simply offer different perspectives on the same observations (we both share aux Se, after all), rather than butt heads with each other. So I'm going to suggest that while you don't see @_fihe_ displaying as strong Fi as you would expect from Fi-dom, particularly in comparison to your INFP friend, it may just be that Fihe is choosing to hold some of it back. I'm guessing your INFP friend is a lot more comfortable expressing Fi opinions with you than Fihe is with us, whom she just met over a first-time video chat. Fi is internal, so it doesn't have to be fully communicated to the outside world if the Fi user doesn't want to for whatever reason. You're obviously much more comfortable displaying your Fi than Fihe is with hers, considering she still preferred to think of herself as a logical thinker as of her last video. Nevertheless, from what I saw, and from what @_LeaT_ saw, Fihe did definitely display a lot of Fi whenever she expressed her views, moreso than even what little Te we could hear in her communication style. Her Ne still seems to be her primary external interface.


Not to muddy the waters, but I went back and watched the @_hornet_ and @_fihe_ interaction video, and I have to say, it's now pretty clear to me that she is closer to ISTJ than she is to INFP. The Si and Te came through quite powerfully. For reference: http://youtu.be/0X-z5Io8lSs

Now I'm thinking that it might be helpful for me to do an interaction video for comparison...


----------



## Meadow

Teybo said:


> Not to muddy the waters, but I went back and watched the @_hornet_ and @_fihe_ interaction video, and I have to say, it's now pretty clear to me that she is closer to ISTJ than she is to INFP. The Si and Te came through quite powerfully. For reference: IXTJ/ISFP Vid chat - YouTube
> 
> Now I'm thinking that it might be helpful for me to do an interaction video for comparison...


I watched about a half hour of the video and got a J vibe for @_fihe_, and a little more of a "tell" vs. "ask" feel to the communication. At one point she said something about it being good to have a P adaptability, as if it didn't necessarily belong to her but might be handy at times, then said she'd be a little unsure of herself if her daily routine wasn't structured. Also, T seemed stronger than F, such as when she was discussing that her mother should use more objectivity about people. I frequently got the feeling of fihe weighing different sides in a more objective manner before making a decision. Also, I didn't get an Ni vibe, more a working out of daily issues, so I'm also going with ISTJ. Not having watched the whole video, this is very tentative, and fihe is the only one who can say for sure what type she is.


----------



## Meadow

A quick message to @_Lady Lullaby_: I tried PMing but it wouldn't go through, something about a space issue.


----------



## Entropic

I think a big problem when trying to type fihe is that she seems very stressed right now so it's hard to say if she's looping a little or gripping. All these things can affect typing as well. If she really wants more feedback I would suggest that she makes a thread in the type me forum and fillls out at least one or more of the questionnaires in the stickies section.


----------



## Meadow

Good idea. Logic told me ISTJ, but there was something I couldn't put my finger on that said maybe she's a different type. I was hoping she'd do a video with an ISTJ as a comparison.


----------



## Celebok

Meadow said:


> I watched about a half hour of the video and got a J vibe for @_fihe_, and a little more of a "tell" vs. "ask" feel to the communication. At one point she said something about it being good to have a P adaptability, as if it didn't necessarily belong to her but might be handy at times, then said she'd be a little unsure of herself if her daily routine wasn't structured.


This was probably because at the time of her video with @hornet, @fihe was still convinced she was a J. She became more open to considering P when I helped her understand the true difference between J and P.



> Also, T seemed stronger than F, such as when she was discussing that her mother should use more objectivity about people.


It's possible for T to seem stronger than F if the T is extraverted and the F is introverted, which is the case for xxFPs.


----------



## Celebok

LeaT said:


> I think a big problem when trying to type fihe is that she seems very stressed right now so it's hard to say if she's looping a little or gripping. All these things can affect typing as well. If she really wants more feedback I would suggest that she makes a thread in the type me forum and fillls out at least one or more of the questionnaires in the stickies section.


Sure, as long as she doesn't mind sorting through as many conflicting responses there as she's been getting here. When I first joined, I filled out a questionnaire and posted a "what's my type" thread, and half the people who responded were convinced I was an ISTJ.


----------



## Kabosu

I think there's evidence in other videos that Fi not really @fihe's dominant function, not just the one with @_hornet_. There's other things people forget are involved with the Feeling function, and that's value decisions. Sometimes this does involve things you decide to buy at a store. She mentioned needing to take a lot of time which sometimes is the case for me, and I imagine a judgment dominant would come up with a choice quicker.

Doesn't she have non-interaction videos? I think those would be the best to pick up from since we aren't dissecting type in those videos. Maybe we can rest on the typing fihe thing for just a bit.

Also, everyone's over-analyzing this one.


----------



## Entropic

atypeofuser said:


> I think there's evidence in other videos that Fi not really @_fihe_'s dominant function, not just the one with @_hornet_. There's other things people forget are involved with the Feeling function, and that's value decisions. Sometimes this does involve things you decide to buy at a store. She mentioned needing to take a lot of time which sometimes is the case for me, and I imagine a judgment dominant would come up with a choice quicker.
> 
> Doesn't she have non-interaction videos? I think those would be the best to pick up from since we aren't dissecting type in those videos. Maybe we can rest on the typing fihe thing for just a bit.
> 
> Also, everyone's over-analyzing this one.


I want to add though that I'm not a dominant P type but I have issues deciding what I need to buy at the store as well, although I suspect that's just my general P-ness being an INTP XD I don't write a list or anything and unless I decided beforehand I don't know what I need.


----------



## itsme45

atypeofuser said:


> There's other things people forget are involved with the Feeling function, and that's value decisions. Sometimes this does involve things you decide to buy at a store. She mentioned needing to take a lot of time which sometimes is the case for me, and I imagine a judgment dominant would come up with a choice quicker.


I dunno, I doubt this only depends on J/P..... if it's everyday shopping then I don't have a problem choosing quickly, I usually know what I want to buy before I get into the store because it's items that I often need for daily life anyway. Though once I'm in there, I might pick up a few more items I didn't plan to get but when I see them in the shop, I figure it'll be actually a good idea to buy them too. My plans are usually pretty makeshift anyway so no wonder if I don't think of everything before getting into the shop. I still do the shopping job quickly and purposefully though.

If it's clothes or other items that I don't buy daily, I don't always have an idea beforehand of what I want to buy exactly (though I might), in such cases I can be picky about what I want, I'll go through a lot of shops scanning them very quickly and decisively and moving on instantly until I find the right stuff as I don't like to spend too much time on this. I do end up spending some time on this as I'm picky but I try hard to minimize the time factor. Again impatiently purposeful here. 

Still, in general I'm a P... I doubt this impatience is to do with J, shopping is just not my favourite pastime. So clear idea of what you need and willingness to spend time on something you may dislike to do can be additional factors here.




LeaT said:


> I can't even begin to transform my abstract thinking into something Se-esque for you to understand. I can try, but I have little doubt about me being able to convey it to you sigh. It's hard enough for me to try to explain things to itsme45 and I think the only reason she understands me at all is because her N is decent and she's got Ti lol.


Meh!


----------



## Fridays

It does not matter what type she is, she's fine as she is. <3
It can be very stressful to be under "the microscope".
Time will tell..


----------



## Meadow

Celebok said:


> Sure, as long as she doesn't mind sorting through as many conflicting responses there as she's been getting here. When I first joined, I filled out a questionnaire and posted a "what's my type" thread, and half the people who responded were convinced I was an ISTJ.


This thread has turned into "What type is @_fihe_?" It's interesting to exchange information and make guesses, so I hope she doesn't mind. 

I didn't see your thread, but it goes to show that a video combined with a questionnaire would be much more accurate, since trying to type and explain who you are leaves out so much. After watching you in multiple videos, I'd never peg you as a J.

BTW, I've been to many places you have, since I also like road trips.


----------



## fihe

eek, I didn't mean to accidentally hijack the thread  I did make a topic in the "What's my personality type?" forum a while back but I shall need to make a new, updated one.


----------



## Meadow

fihe said:


> eek, I didn't mean to accidentally hijack the thread  I did make a topic in the "What's my personality type?" forum a while back but I shall need to make a new, updated one.


You didn't, everyone else got carried away with the mystery and fascination of typing.


----------



## Entropic

fihe said:


> eek, I didn't mean to accidentally hijack the thread  I did make a topic in the "What's my personality type?" forum a while back but I shall need to make a new, updated one.


Blame Celebok and the lack of moderation on this site.


----------



## Celebok

Meadow said:


> This thread has turned into "What type is @_fihe_?" It's interesting to exchange information and make guesses, so I hope she doesn't mind.


Well, this thread is basically for posting interaction videos and then discussing them, and there have only been two interaction videos within the last week, and @fihe was in both of them, so I'd say it kind of makes sense that this would be "Fihe Week" in this thread.



> I didn't see your thread, but it goes to show that a video combined with a questionnaire would be much more accurate, since trying to type and explain who you are leaves out so much. After watching you in multiple videos, I'd never peg you as a J.


Well, that wouldn't surprise me, since I started recording MBTI-related videos _after_ I realized I was an ISTP, so I'd pretty much dropped the J persona by then. Though I'm not even sure if I ever really displayed any J persona in any of my earlier videos, since I was mostly just acting crazy in them.



> BTW, I've been to many places you have, since I also like road trips.


Cool!


----------



## Inveniet

@_Celebok_


> Welcome to the world of Introverted Sensors! I present to you 105 minutes of two guys talking about their respective ISTP and ISFJ experiences: myself and @_teddy564339_!


Wow this was a really interesting chat!
I've watched the two first and must say I've realized several things.
I can see how Celebok is similar to my father, but I think my father is a type 1 so there are differences.
Ti pointing out, *your doing it wrong*, can be a pain in the butt... :-/

I too identify with flowing from work to play, and the adapting thing is really true for me.
Hit me with every crisis that you can think of and I'll land on my feet.
Last three weeks I've gone trough several big issues, to protect my privacy somewhat
I will only say that one was the bankruptcy of my company.
But hey... all I need to do is hand over some papers to the authorities, pay a nasty fine 
and appear in a house called "court" on a certain date, I can handle that. 
Then it's on to the next thing... =D

Actually the personal issues in my life got to me more, how I gather money isn't really that important to me.
As long as it isn't too much of a hassle I could really do anything. 
But since a lot of things needs an SJ stamp of approval, my options get more limited than I would like. :-(

Oh well now I'll go watch the last two, I've feel that I've lagging behind on the watching since I've been
so busy putting out flames in the real world lately.


Edit:
I've wanted to point out that ISFJ/ISTP is the Advisor archetypal relation.
And you seem to have ended up giving each other great advice. 

Celebok mentioned having a hard time seeing the S/N divide and as a fellow ISXP I agree.
Having access to both Se and Ni makes me able to talk equally to N and S types.
Actually I have a harder time with Si/Ne than anything.


----------



## Inveniet

Inguz said:


> Me and @_firedell_ finally got to do this thing. "Last minute" as usual.


AHA!!!
Nice one!
This has been very educational for me on the Enneagram since I didn't have to worry about accounting for MBTI.
I found it interesting how you have traits I only display when my life is going to hell, while being stable about it.
(9 disintegrating to 6)
The difference between 6w5 and 6w7 was also enlightening and how @firedell didn't feel like 7 was
a lets go on an Indiana Jones expedition perspective.
It displayed itself in a more lets get away from all the stuff that annoys me, *and fast please.*

I found the comment on long winded endings hilarious. XD
And way to go with the special effects @Inguz priceless, just as firedells strategy for avoiding them was equally priceless.


----------



## Inveniet

Geoffrey said:


> -----New friend @_lizrcasanova _(ENFJ), who is also a PerC newcomer, and I (INFJ) have a nice Fe-Ni/Ni-Fe interaction in the second installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions! I'd love a chance to speak with more iNtuitives and/or Feelers--please contact me if you're interested.


Very insightful.
At the end when @lizrcasanova said I have a meeting in 30 minutes I was thinking.
Did she not make the meeting? Cause this goes on for over 30 minutes more.
Then there was 30 minutes of nothing... XD HAHA!!!


----------



## Inveniet

atypeofuser said:


> Currently, I haven't gotten to split up my interaction with @_fihe_ so temporarily I'm showing this in full:
> btw, I'm amused by the mondegreens of the "transcribed" section of the vid.


Okay.
That was interesting!
It was funny how @atypeofuser managed to talk more deeply with @fihe about stuff trough Ne than me trough Ni.
Still it was obvious that she was pretty taxed from having to engage her inferior for so long.

I found it interesting to see how on an enneagram level she kinda had a unhealthy 4 thing going on that supports
what I suspect to be a type 1 being stressed. When the talked turned to pessimism, it really ticked of his 6, what if mode.
You could see him stopping in his tracks to consider the negative information offered and trying to figure out
how it would affect him negatively. I found it hilarious saying that he still felt safe going to sleep even though she
felt the world was a cruel place. He was like "Yeah the world is cruel, my bed is still safe!" 

When you get past the 6 layer atypeofuser has a very external take on the world, just because he isn't saying anything
doesn't mean that his Ne isn't doing it's usual crazy thing. Ne is odd that way since it is the most hidden external function.

All in all a very watchable vid and I enjoyed seeing fihes reserved, but pretty face again. 
And for the record my ISTJ verdic stands. =D


----------



## Inveniet

@_Celebok_
So I've started watching this vid of you and @_fihe_.

And I'm doing the thing where I have a extra tab of the same thread typing in my ideas in the response field
since you seem to be on a path of giving me several ahas.

First I noticed you trying to justify her type in terms of P vs J this in spite of knowing cognitive functions.
Let me tell you. That is not a good idea, IMO. You are entitled to think otherwise of course.

Thing is MBTI is a model call it MBTIville. A happy little stereotypical village.
Then you have cognitive town. A more functional serious place.
Between them are a big river. 
Now if you swim around all day long unsure what place to pick you are going to get tired and frustrated.
And if you are weak to begin with you might even drown one day while trying to cross.

So saying that fihe being a introverted sensing dominant is a perceiver is true in cognitive town,
but not true in MBTIville. So you get confused and tired and swim around in circles.
Yes a introverted perceiver will in their mind act very perceiverish.
But to an outside observer all that is apparent is auxiliary judgement apparently making a choice.
Even though internally the action has been postponed nobody but the subject in question can spot that.
Externally it comes off as a rejection.

So Isabel Briggs Myers while thinking that it was a good idea to make the J/P divide,
and arguably it was since it opened up the idea to the masses, also made it hard to transition
from her work to Jungs work, since she took the liberty to base her system on *how things appear to be on the surface.*

Then again as I've observed in among others @_LeaT_, Ti users seem to like swimming around in that river.
Each to their own! XD

I've noticed that @_fihe_ is stuck in a type 4 kinda, how am I special, kinda place.
When she would be more served doing a more type 7 approach, thinking about how to strike out a new path.
For what it's worth I would say that learning Jungian cognitive functions and how to apply them might be
such a new path. Being able to better deal with all types of people can open doors to promotions.
Giving people *what they view as valuable* as opposed to what you feel has value can really help you get noticed.

What the very pragmatical approach means is that she has a very Te approach to the world around her.
If it works it works, she has a very functional approach to things, what tool accomplishes the task?
The usefulness focus really says it all.
And even imagining how it would be useful to her brother after she doesn't need it any more, that is so STJ.
Applied usefulness. 

Haha! So SJ what do you mean skill?* Life is a schedule! *
The worthless over achieving nothing is probably tied more to enneagram, what do others think about that?

It is obvious that fihe craves to be useful and if she is just lying around doing nothing she is kinda miserable.
As opposed to a real perceiver who would not give a damn if there no objective way to point out usefulness that day.
She has an internal standard. I need to be useful for myself. You Celebok come of as trying to please environment.
Look mom how useful I've been today! 
And you mention earlier that you relish the process of dismantling that programming.

Yes she does "P" type stuff, but when? When she is down, depressed and stressed.
ISTJ reverses into ENFP in the grip, her P'ness have to be seen trough the context of is this from a healthy frame.
If you can do your P'ness from a healthy frame, then you arguably are a P type. If it is a response to stress, not so much.

But now I've kinda swam over to MBTIville and left the cognitive functions behind.
In an ISTJ example J means Si-Te and P means Ne-Fi
Losing track of that and arguing J and P as independent concepts that can stand on their own is a very slippery slope.
Like what kind of P are you talking about? Ti-Se? That would create a very big mismatch.
How are you going to generalize your observations about your own Ti-Se behaviour to match a potential Ne-Fi behaviour?
Do you see the problem? It is a mismatch.

Cleaning is a very interesting stereotype. 
I don't think any cognitive function set is geared towards cleanliness by default.
If any it have to be Si/Fe trying to maintain a static situation of apparent social success.
But then *only if cleanliness is the norm that everyone is being judged by.*

Tertiary Fi shines trough when she don't feel she has the right to tell others what to do in certain areas.
However she also put in best for society, a Te perspective. Laws override choice when necessary.

The problem solved over hiding the mess is very Si-Te, a dom Ne user would not care at all about if there was stuff lying around
and people saw it. As there have been some examples of from other vids.

"Why are the shirts on the floor?! Is the floor clean enough to have shirts on the floor?"
*PRICELESS!!!!*

Yeah that was a very J resonse to shirts on the floor. Si-Te response actually.
Goal clean shirts. If floor is clean then shirts can be on floor.
Floors is traditionally unclean therefore *no shirts on the floor as a rule.*

I find it funny how Celebok is with inferior Fe trying to keep up apearances, 
but are proud to be able to break all the SJ rules and have it work.

I'm very doubtful that the MBTI statistics are real when you think about how inacurate the tests generally are.

To be totally honest this whole convo apears to me to be @_fihe_ giving really ISTJ answers and @_Celebok_ trying
to find a way to make her a P no matter the cost. I think your affinity for P due to your own benefits leads
you to believe that everyone else would benefit from it too. 

fihes pragmatism is very STJ making money from stuff by selling them.
And feeling bad that she didn't sell some. Haha... 
Make myself useful and doing something else too. Te is so obvious.

If fihe realized that if she understood other peoples type she would have a competitive advantage in the marketplace
maybe she would take it more seriously.
But then again she has the view of Si-Te equating skill with certification, as she views that as more valuable in society
a very true and also a very STJ view.

Future looks bleak because she has Ne in inferior and that is why she can't be very excited over the possibilites.
A Ne dom would be more confident about the possibilities and act on them. Sure she may be an ENFP in the grip,
but that doesn't account for the childlike exploratory Fi and the very active and solid Te.
And the Si is generally of the charts and seem quite stable. The stress is manifesting more on an enneagram level than anything.

No INTP is not an option!
Ti dom???
With Ne as aux?
Fe inferiour? 

After three vids my view is a very firm *ISTJ!!!*

Seriously, anything else is IMO lack of knowledge or trolling.
And @_fihe_ *you are not a Ti dom* really, you use Te......:frustrating:

Edit:
And with that I'm done!
I've back up to date with the interaction vids! 
=D


----------



## Inveniet

LeaT said:


> And you don't stereotype you mean? As I said, the problem is when you focus so much on how people act and not enough on how they think.





> Most people do not (myself included) and get in trouble for it.





> Actually my own stereotypes (that I'm trying to shake)
> I picked up with MBTI before I learned about the cognitive functions.
> Watching wondrous clips like these. XD


Please don't be annoying right now @_LeaT_... :-/


----------



## esq

Stereotypes gathered from personal experience. Tell me if I'm wrong here. 

ESFPs: flirty, show offs, diplomats, good with handling people, making friends and getting favors, they admire intelligence, love sex, like to be admired, physically adventurous, physically confident, affectionate, love laughing with people, good hearted, they won't prey after the weak, capable of friendly confrontation for the sake of humor or justice

ISFPs: sensual and physically sensitive, goofy and strange, they do their own thing, also love sex, love making people happy, lack bad intentions, can be emotionally volatile, sensitive to large crowds, to disagreements, to other people's emotions, to perceived hostility; greatly enjoy cute things and animals, have a sense of aesthetics, modest, self doubting, crave novelty, travel and adventure


----------



## Ellis Bell

esq said:


> Stereotypes gathered from personal experience. Tell me if I'm wrong here.
> 
> ESFPs: flirty, show offs, diplomats, good with handling people, making friends and getting favors, they admire intelligence, love sex, like to be admired, physically adventurous, physically confident, affectionate, love laughing with people, good hearted, they won't prey after the weak, capable of friendly confrontation for the sake of humor or justice
> 
> ISFPs: sensual and physically sensitive, goofy and strange, they do their own thing, also love sex, love making people happy, lack bad intentions, can be emotionally volatile, sensitive to large crowds, to disagreements, to other people's emotions, to perceived hostility; greatly enjoy cute things and animals, have a sense of aesthetics, modest, self doubting, crave novelty, travel and adventure


Stereotypes, shmereotypes.


----------



## esq

They're only shmereotypes if they're wrong. Otherwise, the system gives us simple insight into ourselves and other people. It aids our introspection, our interactions, gives us a sense of not being so alone. Why do we all support typology? Are there reasons I'm not aware of? 

Of course I wish to be a realist, to see people for what they show me, not to be a crockpot, not to be so stubborn. Yes, stereotypes can be wrong, and we are all ready to be wrong, because we can grow for it. When we apply the system, we are not asserting a theory, we're only looking to see if we are wrong, and where we are wrong. But if there is some universal truth in the system, we can find that too. Is there something that connects all ISFPs? All ESFPs? 

Were there specific parts that offended you? Or what is typology to you, if it is not a collection of stereotypes and observations?


----------



## Ellis Bell

Nope, nothing offensive in your stereotypes. I just don't like the idea of judging a whole group of people based on one person or group of people. I think that everyone even within type is very different, so it's not wise to make generalizations. But yes, i do agree, it can be a very good system for helping us to understand people and their surface behavior.


----------



## Fat Bozo

esq said:


> Stereotypes gathered from personal experience. Tell me if I'm wrong here.
> 
> ESFPs: flirty, show offs, diplomats, good with handling people, making friends and getting favors, they admire intelligence, love sex, like to be admired, physically adventurous, physically confident, affectionate, love laughing with people, good hearted, they won't prey after the weak, capable of friendly confrontation for the sake of humor or justice
> 
> ISFPs: sensual and physically sensitive, goofy and strange, they do their own thing, also love sex, love making people happy, lack bad intentions, can be emotionally volatile, sensitive to large crowds, to disagreements, to other people's emotions, to perceived hostility; greatly enjoy cute things and animals, have a sense of aesthetics, modest, self doubting, crave novelty, travel and adventure


I would say most of those apply to me. I wouldn't consider myself a show off or a diplomat, and it doesn't seem like I'm very good at making friends to me. But pretty much everything else in both lists.


----------



## cue5c

I'm game for doing a type interaction video at some point in time. Although I don't really have the means to record it, unless I do and am completely oblivious to the fact. Also I'm just lazy. roud:


----------



## lizrcasanova

hornet said:


> Very insightful.
> At the end when @_lizrcasanova_ said I have a meeting in 30 minutes I was thinking.
> Did she not make the meeting? Cause this goes on for over 30 minutes more.
> Then there was 30 minutes of nothing... XD HAHA!!!



hahaha. I sure did make it to the meeting. Thank you for checking though .


----------



## Fat Bozo

cue5c said:


> I'm game for doing a type interaction video at some point in time. Although I don't really have the means to record it, unless I do and am completely oblivious to the fact. Also I'm just lazy. roud:


If you have a Google account, we can use Google hangouts, and it automatically records it as long as the person starting the hangout checks the "enable Hangouts on air" box. So, just let me know when you want to do it, I can make some time this weekend.

This goes for anyone else who wants to chat with me too.


----------



## Celebok

Lady Lullaby said:


> HAHAHA - I would wager that one of the biggest pet peeves NTs have about NFs is that we NFs don't take things at face value. They assume we do because they do and don't see it as helpful to do anything but take things people say just as they say them right NTs?? I feel like this is something MBTI can explain - but it doesn't seem to be much use by way of solving anything in relationships! Sigh...I want MBTI to give me a better answer than 'you're just different'! HAHA An NT's solution might be to just teach NFs how to take things at face value. I find that is very useful in the workplace or in a casual interaction - gives me a lot less to think/wonder about. But when it comes to my closer relationships, I don't know how I could possibly turn off the Ni- radar in order to stop looking deeper for the hidden! hahah I won't explain my personal histories for why, but this just is incredibly humorous and ironic to me. :laughing:


I posted a comment about this on the video, but even though my natural tendency is to take people's words at face value (because as a sensor, I don't know how else to take it), when someone talks about their problems with another person, I know from experience that there are two sides to every story. So as the person's talking, I'm thinking in the back of my mind that some of the facts I'm hearing might be slightly inaccurate, and some of their interpretations of the facts might be grossly inaccurate. But since I likely won't ever hear the other side of the story, and I'd rather not make things worse by guessing, I basically have to deal with what info I do know, and I'll advise the person based on that.


----------



## Elaminopy

Are the videos recorded so far only being posted in here? Is there somewhere I can view them without going through all the pages?

Also, I'm game when I'm at lunch. I'll need to use my laptop camera. What has been found to be the most preferred program? Also, who am I talking to? Or, who will talk to me?


----------



## cue5c

Fat Bozo said:


> If you have a Google account, we can use Google hangouts, and it automatically records it as long as the person starting the hangout checks the "enable Hangouts on air" box. So, just let me know when you want to do it, I can make some time this weekend.
> 
> This goes for anyone else who wants to chat with me too.


I'll look into getting one and I'll let you know!


----------



## Kabosu

Elaminopy said:


> Are the videos recorded so far only being posted in here? Is there somewhere I can view them without going through all the pages?
> 
> Also, I'm game when I'm at lunch. I'll need to use my laptop camera. What has been found to be the most preferred program? Also, who am I talking to? Or, who will talk to me?


Google Hangouts is seemingly the preferred program. I'm willing to talk to most people on here if I'm not too busy on other things.


----------



## Elaminopy

Okay, I've started a hangout. I suppose people need my email address, right? sdawkminn at gmail.com


----------



## Kabosu

https://plus.google.com/u/0/110031241254713636859/posts

Profile for my + page.


----------



## Elaminopy

My google+ page is https://plus.google.com/u/0/115753246408474249278/posts

I'm here right now, online. Why is no one talking to me right now?


----------



## Kabosu

Non-modified interaction with @Elaminopy:





On my behalf, I'd add:
Digital media mention was a bit tangential, but _another_ hobby I had (i.e. photography, design, etc.). I kind of wish I would be majoring in like graphic design or photography rather than journalism atm.
Incidentally, I'd forgotten I have an electronic album in my avatar, but more for the cover art.
The music I listen to probably goes in a more reversed way of what I was saying - but I see it in some modern indie rock even. As for the 90s, I was referencing what U2 and Depeche Mode were doing in that era, some of Garbage, etc. Big beat acts of the mid-late 90s kind of had elements of hip-hop and rock in their music.
I guess the better way of describing Se is that it's a sensation that is not self-referencing or self-important as Si and that instead of looking for future realities out of present situations like Ne, Se will kind of take what it sees or experiences and tangible, visible, etc. experiences will maybe stand out to them. Not that great a description either, but maybe an extension of that simple one described. I'll let the conscious users of the function or people better versed in JCF talk about it as well as Keirsey subscribers who can talk about SP (while temperament, the MBTI functions have aux./dom Se for that).
Despite some distractions you had that evening, I thought it went alright. Also, since it's not SO long like the other videos, it might be a more watchable one in the series lol.


----------



## Elaminopy

atypeofuser said:


> Non-modified interaction with @_Elaminopy_:


Well that was fun. Sorry I kind of dominated the conversation about myself. A bad habit of mine. Not very introverted of me, especially when talking to an extrovert. Still, hopefully it will give some more insight into type interaction.

After getting off the video chat I talked with my brother and I realized how easily and fluidly we communicate. I had the idea of making a video of him and me talking and see how that would be. It would consist of me introducing a board game idea have and us discussing different ideas regarding it.


----------



## Celebok

Fat Bozo said:


> Well, after my editing hackjob to trim out some interruptions, I present my epic chat with fihe, where we cover such topics as money, security, authority, family, and status symbols. Yeah, tell me again that she's not SJ. :tongue:


Interesting... apparently Ti users like myself and @atypeofuser bring out @fihe's Fi, while Fi users like you and @hornet bring out her Si and Te.

I actually enjoyed the conversation in parts 1 and 3 where you two were talking about the differences between Texas and New Jersey. But I suppose that's mainly because of my own travelling experiences and comparisons I've made between different places. I especially thought it was interesting how Fat Bozo described where he lived according to climate and topology of the land, while Fihe was more interested in his geographic location relative to major cities. I was actually thinking the same thing as Fihe at first, but usually once I learn where a town is physically located on the map, then I'll be more interested in learning about the physical characteristics of the land and what it's like to live there. What all this has to do with personality type differences, I have no idea, but I'm sure it's something.

Also, I'm guessing that this was recorded later on the same day that I did my video with Fihe, considering she's wearing the same shirt and glasses, and she mentioned at the very end that she did another video before this one. Just another observation that has no consequences, but I'm just pointing it out because I noticed it.

I was still on the fence about Fihe until I watched this video, but now I think I'm ready to switch my vote to *ISTJ*.


----------



## Elaminopy

Fat Bozo said:


> Well, after my editing hackjob to trim out some interruptions, I present my epic chat with fihe, where we cover such topics as money, security, authority, family, and status symbols. (videos)


Just after watching the first minute of the first video, I now really want to talk to you, @Fat Bozo.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

jendragon said:


> Three ENTPs in one conversation?
> 
> Bwahahahahahahahaha!!!
> 
> Ahem. Did I type that out loud? I meant *UNLIMITED POWER!*
> 
> Or, The same thing we do every night Pinky...
> 
> Yes. One question: How can I get you all into the hangout? I need email addys, no?


Will drop you a PM right now.


----------



## Kabosu

I look forward to it. Four would have been too much haha. (Would have made a response earlier myself but let finals week get in the way.)


----------



## trvlgrl1981

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Will drop you a PM right now.


send me the details as well


----------



## renna

jendragon said:


> And/or, @MegaTuxRacer, why should the NFs be the only ones to do a mirror-vid? How 'bout some clinically insane ENTP-on-ENTP interaction?


What's funny is that a long time ago me and my husband (who is an ENTP) and @MegaTuxRacer got to chat on the google hang outs and then we decided not to post it because it was too offensive. I think at point I got really embarrassed too LOL but now that (months later) we three are pretty good friends. A couple weeks ago, @MegaTuxRacer had this awesome idea he wanted my husband and I to go over and after I was done (literally, I started brushing my teeth aka getting ready for bed), Mike (MegaTuxRacer) was like wanting to tell Chris (my hubby) another idea he had because after ENTPs are excited and get "the ball rolling" with Ne, it's this rush for them, right? So I told Chris "welcome to my life"; I was this basically insinuating the point of an ENTP who cannot help himself and will not shut up sometimes because the juices are flowing. Sitting back and listening to two ENTPs is enlightening but exhausting all at the same time for an introvert because the ENTPs are playing pin pong with subjs and ideas, yet are on the se page the ENTIRE time. It's like a natural form of crack LOL. So yeah if the two ENTPs are comfortable with each other, it will be hilarious a d perhaps offensive at tes to watch, therefore it must be edited ahead of time ;-P


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

trvlgrl1981 said:


> send me the details as well


 @jendragon is taking care of that actually.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

renna said:


> What's funny is that a long time ago me and my husband (who is an ENTP) and @_MegaTuxRacer_ got to chat on the google hang outs and then we decided not to post it because it was too offensive. I think at point I got really embarrassed too LOL but now that (months later) we three are pretty good friends. A couple weeks ago, @_MegaTuxRacer_ had this awesome idea he wanted my husband and I to go over and after I was done (literally, I started brushing my teeth aka getting ready for bed), Mike (MegaTuxRacer) was like wanting to tell Chris (my hubby) another idea he had because after ENTPs are excited and get "the ball rolling" with Ne, it's this rush for them, right? So I told Chris "welcome to my life"; I was this basically insinuating the point of an ENTP who cannot help himself and will not shut up sometimes because the juices are flowing. Sitting back and listening to two ENTPs is enlightening but exhausting all at the same time for an introvert because the ENTPs are playing pin pong with subjs and ideas, yet are on the se page the ENTIRE time. It's like a natural form of crack LOL. So yeah if the two ENTPs are comfortable with each other, it will be hilarious a d perhaps offensive at tes to watch, therefore it must be edited ahead of time ;-P


Well this was just cruel - how are we supposed to not want to see your hangout vid now!! What if we promise to not hold anyone to anything they said?? I wanna watch! :laughing:


----------



## Kabosu

Yeah, after that statement it made me curious as to what was actually said lol.


----------



## jendragon

trvlgrl1981 said:


> send me the details as well


just PM me with you email address, and I'll send you an invite at about 7:50 CST. Accept, and we're rolling!


----------



## trvlgrl1981

Lady Lullaby said:


> Well this was just cruel - how are we supposed to not want to see your hangout vid now!! What if we promise to not hold anyone to anything they said?? I wanna watch! :laughing:


Yeah just send it to.the NTs. We can handle anything.. And won't be offended


----------



## Kabosu

^Would you all mind one with more than 3 in it? didn't know it hadn't happened or I would have left a less half-hearted reply but even if I am not in it I will watch it.


----------



## jendragon

atypeofuser said:


> ^Would you all mind one with more than 3 in it? didn't know it hadn't happened or I would have left a less half-hearted reply but even if I am not in it I will watch it.


Completely unsatiated by having pioneered the 3-fold interaction, ENTP boldly pushes the envelope of time and space. PM me your email, and I'll send you an invite


----------



## Kanerou

I'm still up for doing a vid with someone. Si-dom, especially ISTJ, would be nice, but it isn't necessary.


----------



## trvlgrl1981

atypeofuser said:


> ^Would you all mind one with more than 3 in it? didn't know it hadn't happened or I would have left a less d reply but even if I am not in it I will watch it.


totally! Will be epic !


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Lady Lullaby said:


> Well this was just cruel - how are we supposed to not want to see your hangout vid now!! What if we promise to not hold anyone to anything they said?? I wanna watch! :laughing:


I am watching it right now, and...I don't think that's such a good idea.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

MegaTuxRacer said:


> I am watching it right now, and...I don't think that's such a good idea.


PSSSHHHH~ Rub it in why don't ya! So you have access...whoop-dee-doo! LOL (Okay - so I am a little jealous....)


----------



## Elaminopy

MegaTuxRacer said:


> I am watching it right now, and...I don't think that's such a good idea.





Lady Lullaby said:


> PSSSHHHH~ Rub it in why don't ya! So you have access...whoop-dee-doo! LOL (Okay - so I am a little jealous....)


I wanna watch. :sad:


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

It's a bit different than what was promised, but here it is.


----------



## trvlgrl1981

MegaTuxRacer said:


> It's a bit different than what was promised, but here it is.


ugh! so sorry I missed it! lame computer


----------



## Lady Lullaby

So as a lovely contrast to the very NT-ness of the above video - I will now share a very NF video!
@Teybo and I chat it up about MBTI and our siblings:


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Second part is up.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

MegaTuxRacer said:


> It's a bit different than what was promised, but here it is.



LOL! You both are very entertaining and interesting to watch/listen to. One word comes to mind for me: Competitive.

Is it just an INFJ thing to 'feel' that while watching this or did either of you 'feel' it too?


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Lady Lullaby said:


> LOL! You both are very entertaining and interesting to watch/listen to. One word comes to mind for me: Competitive.
> 
> Is it just an INFJ thing to 'feel' that while watching this or did either of you 'feel' it too?


When we were debating sure but other than that no.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Wow, tons of videos tonight... 'tis the season...

I recently "made" a gingerbread "house" with my NF buddy Lisa, and we videotaped it. Lisa's specific NF type is currently under debate. Maybe this will make for some interesting discussion here. I won't put in my two cents yet, so as not to sway anyone.

short and sweet version:






extended version:


----------



## Lady Lullaby

MegaTuxRacer said:


> When we were debating sure but other than that no.


(So sorry I PM'd you on this first and then decided to share here too.)
I think it was fun to watch from the privacy of my own home where I could pause and take breaks (For my poor lil Fe :tongue and wasn't there to jump in and share the thoughts I kept having: "can't we all just get along?" or "I think you like the fact that this has turned into an argument - you are suddenly in a power play!!" hahaha


I appreciated the topic about 'fiercely individualistic.' I found this list of synonyms enlightening: Individualistic Synonyms, Individualistic Antonyms | Thesaurus.com I found it also interesting that individualistic is also a synonym for independent: Independent Synonyms, Independent Antonyms | Thesaurus.com but there were different connotations in the way you each meant independent or individualistic. 


If you ever compare notes with your ESFJ friend or SJ brother, I'd be interested in their views. I have an ESFJ sister, ISFJ mom, ISTJ brother-in-law, ESTJ daughter, ESTJ mother-in-law and feel they are independent in the context of being self-sufficient, yet they are not as self-serving in ways that would resist authority. I wonder if Jen maybe meant that 'fiercely individualistic' people are more prone to fight authority - I think, on average, Perceivers in general do this more than Judgers. I loved this from wiki:




> Low Power Distance
> 
> 
> Individualistic cultures are classified as low power distance, or horizontal, cultures. Low power distance cultures are characterized by relatively equal power sharing and discourage attention to status difference and ranking. Low power distance cultures challenge authority, encourage a reduction of power differences between management and employees, and encourage the use of power legitimately. Despite this, these cultures don't expect to completely eliminate power difference. People within this low power distance culture, however, are more likely to respond to such imbalances in power with more negative emotional responses than in the alternative, high power distance cultures. Low power distance cultures include Austria, Israel, Denmark, New Zealand, the Republic of Ireland, and Sweden. The U.S. ranks 38th on the scale


I think 'fiercely individualistic' people are all about reducing power differences whereas most SJs are in favor of supporting the existing power systems if they believe they are just and reasonable. BUT - I feel like at least the 'hipsters' are all about encouraging attention to the 'status' difference as far as how 'unique' they are or how 'special' they are. SJs don't usually do that - and in that way they are more individualistic than a hipster because they derive their worth and identity internally and independent of anything they put on, or anything they do for show. So I think this is what causes the argument but you both were basically saying the same thing, just each focusing on the other side of the same coin. My Ti still wishes we could find the right words to distinguish the connotations you were expressing vs. hers. I feel I 'know' what they are better than I can articulate them.


I'm just starting the 2nd video now. . :ninja:


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

pneumoceptor said:


> Wow, tons of videos tonight... 'tis the season...
> 
> I recently "made" a gingerbread "house" with my NF buddy Lisa, and we videotaped it. Lisa's specific NF type is currently under debate. Maybe this will make for some interesting discussion here. I won't put in my two cents yet, so as not to sway anyone.
> 
> short and sweet version:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> extended version:


It's like the voice of reason and the voice that cannot be reasoned with. Sounds like an Ne dominant.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

MegaTuxRacer said:


> It's a bit different than what was promised, but here it is.





MegaTuxRacer said:


> Second part is up.


My ENTP sis just moved here after living out of state for 13 years. She said basically the same thing about it 'not being worth it to foster new friendships.' She feels she has close friends here, though fewer than back at her old home, and she can keep in touch with them long-distance and that is enough for her. I think this is a prime example of the ENTP's complex combination of being an extravert, having Fe-tert and yet being Ti-aux! The pull for really close/daily friendships isn't as strong for the ENTP as say it is for me as an INFJ Type 2. I will do more reaching out to friends - even though I'm introverted - than she will, even though she's extraverted. I think the thinking introverts follow this pattern and so they keep to themselves more than the feeling extraverts.

LOL @_MegaTuxRacer_ - - That could be a new poster for extraversion - 'just need to go out and be in the world'!! Precisely! It charges you to be OUT! We introverts love to be homebodies!! (Until my inferior Se says time to shake off the stillness and get things moving again.) You could be as happy out there even without others and we INFJs are happier at home, with moments spent with others. 

LOL 'You are in the middle of a brilliant form of thought and you just ruined it' LOL :crazy: EPIC! :laughing:

I can kinda relate to what you said about when Ti gets interrupted, 'It's just gone!' YESS! Very true! Even for Ti-tert.

And we NFs *know* you have emotions! We like you for it! We also like you for your intellect!! 

Darn - have to leave, will have to finish later. Good stuff guys. :wink:


----------



## Elaminopy

Lady Lullaby said:


> So as a lovely contrast to the very NT-ness of the above video - I will now share a very NF video!
> @_Teybo_ and I chat it up about MBTI and our siblings:


Sorry, @Teybo, I guess our schedules are just too out of sync. I'm glad you got to do one, though.


----------



## jendragon

Lady Lullaby said:


> LOL! You both are very entertaining and interesting to watch/listen to. One word comes to mind for me: Competitive.
> 
> Is it just an INFJ thing to 'feel' that while watching this or did either of you 'feel' it too?


I agree with @MegaTuxRacer. While there's an idea at stake, the desire to outbid the other is distinct, but while chatting, nah. We were trading quips off broadcast, and there we played off each other, building more randomness through cooperation, as it were. That's the essence of preferring T over F: our semantic sparring doesn't translate into personal sparring.


----------



## jendragon

AND we publicly apologize to @trvlgrl1981 and @atypeofuser--we seriously tried for 45 minutes to make that 4-way conversation happen, with different email addresses and the whole ball of wax, but it seems that the time-space continuum was preserving itself against ENTP^4-level paradox. If you're still down, I'd like to try again after the New Year.


----------



## Elaminopy

jendragon said:


> AND we publicly apologize to @_trvlgrl1981_ and @_atypeofuser_--we seriously tried for 45 minutes to make that 4-way conversation happen, with different email addresses and the whole ball of wax, but it seems that the time-space continuum was preserving itself against ENTP^4-level paradox. If you're still down, I'd like to try again after the New Year.


I could temporarily set my type on here to ENTP.


----------



## jendragon

Elaminopy said:


> I could temporarily set my type on here to ENTP.


If you want in on...dang, it's really hard not to make six innuendos here...the convo, we can set something up. Doesn't have to be ENTP exclusive


----------



## BPReed92

ENTPs and an ISTP, nothing too weird about that. Possibly throw in an INTP too.

I see a trend here...


----------



## jendragon

BPReed92 said:


> ENTPs and an ISTP, nothing too weird about that. Possibly throw in an INTP too.
> 
> I see a trend here...


Three for T...i, that is? Indeed  INTPs also welcome. 

And anyone else--open invite for an interview with Jendragon--just post on my visitor wall. Warning: technical prowess limited, but I promise I'll try!


----------



## Teybo

Elaminopy said:


> Sorry, @_Teybo_, I guess our schedules are just too out of sync. I'm glad you got to do one, though.


Oh, I was hoping we could still do one! Let me know when you're available.


----------



## trvlgrl1981

jendragon said:


> AND we publicly apologize to @_trvlgrl1981_ and @_atypeofuser_--we seriously tried for 45 minutes to make that 4-way conversation happen, with different email addresses and the whole ball of wax, but it seems that the time-space continuum was preserving itself against ENTP^4-level paradox. If you're still down, I'd like to try again after the New Year.


it's all cool! totally still up for it post-new year! and at least i made it on there verbally lol.. When you mentioned me being low key, I got thinking. it's really depends who i'm with and, as you said, the topic. When I'm with something more quiet, I become quiet, around someone loud and i'm more extraverted than anything. When I'm around someone I can bounce Ideas off of - there's no stopping me. It's also a comfort level, I tend to seem more introverted to people who I just meet, but when I get to know them, they hardly remember I was once "shy" or "quiet". I wonder if this is a uniquely ENTP thing (the former point atleast) - there are some people who, no matter who they are around, are quiet and more reserved (ISTJs, maybe?). and others who are constantly over the top loud (ESFPs?) 

so with @_pneumoceptor_, since she was more reserved, as was I. but had I been on the chat with you guys last night, it probably would have been different. 

great debate, btw!


----------



## magi83

Anyone else disappointed that @MegaTuxRacer doesn't actually look anything like Kim Jong-il?


----------



## trvlgrl1981

magi83 said:


> Anyone else disappointed that @_MegaTuxRacer_ doesn't actually look anything like Kim Jong-il?


ha.. was totally thinking that too!


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

magi83 said:


> Anyone else disappointed that @MegaTuxRacer doesn't actually look anything like Kim Jong-il?


Not me.


----------



## glimmerfoot

Well im not sure as to how full your schedule is when it comes to interviews has become, but if you need a third INTp to volunteer, I'd be up to it.

If your at all worried about putting too much of the same on your feed, I might be able to give you a few points of incentive.

Im in a field of study not often pursued by INTps or NTs in general (traditional animation),

Im a french american, and many would say well travelled

For an INTp I would guess my inferior function has been either more pervasive, intense, or explored than in most INTps

lastly, with all the respect i can possibly muster, the individuals you interviewed were not native english speakers, and i know this can make the conversation often seem more conservative than their personalities really are, I know this too well because i despite being half french and speaking it fluently enough to discus very abstract topics i often get trumped by my lack in specific vocabulary or more mundane words like forgetting how to say "spoon." I have a friend who has it worse by speaking two versions of chinese, good english and workable french. - The thing is that word choice is very important to many INTps and an interview in a second language can be taxing to second language speakers even those who have worked hard on it.

If your interested im all ears.

(if your wondering about timezones im in france so that would be +1 GMT if i remember correctly)


----------



## jendragon

glimmerfoot said:


> Well im not sure as to how full your schedule is when it comes to interviews has become, but if you need a third INTp to volunteer, I'd be up to it.


Who do you want to talk to, me or @pneumoceptor? Or does it matter? You're welcome to join my crew--we won't be rolling again until after Christmas, at least, possibly the week after New Year, as I will be without reliable internet from tomorrow until then. Just post a visitor message to my wall if you want in


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Just did an interaction vid with Probably Not about Enneagram but we both use Ni so it wandered into MBTI and Socionics too....

For all interested - you may watch here.


----------



## Geoffrey

Teybo said:


> I want to respond in a non-linear order, so I'm kind of chopping up your post a bit. Hope you don't mind.



-----Not at all, : )


Teybo said:


> Yes. Mostly yes, anyway. Hopefully I can explain what I mean; I haven't expressed these thoughts externally before.
> By psychological distance I'm referring to the difference in perception and reaction between myself and another person. Of course, distances can be large ("I really don't see things that way! How could you even come to that conclusion?") or they can be small ("Wow, we really think alike! It's like you read my mind."). Sometimes, when I ask someone a question about what's going on in their head, it feels to me like I'm calling attention to this distance.
> But I think watching your exchange with @_lizrcasanova_ has led me to realize that even if it's true that these sorts of questions call attention to the psychological distance (and I'm not sure that's always true), there's at least more going on than just that. A question can cause you to feel the distance and cause it to shrink at the same time. Importantly, there are more aspects to it as well, like helping people feel comfortable or prompting modifications in thought or action. So, yeah, it can invite intimacy and close the distance.



-----Thank you for your thoughts!


Teybo said:


> Absolutely, and I think that's another important part. Feeling that distance is part of feeling your own identity.



-----That's a great way to put it. Perhaps many INFJs feel the pull to connect on one hand (Fe) and the pull to be centered in the unique self on the other (Ni? Ti? Enneagram type?).


Teybo said:


> I agree that it can be seen as an invitation to vent, though I don't think it's really exclusive to Sensors. For instance, I get vented at by my (admittedly mentally unhealthy) INFJ mother, my INFP sister, and my INTP boss. I do, however, tend to find the venting of my ISFJ best friend to be the most draining.
> I've learned how to shut it down, too, and create healthier boundaries, though that's hard and makes me feel a bit guilty sometimes.



-----Wow--that's a lot of venting! I think that INFJs often do end up in the role of "counselor," but I wonder how much of it is based on how others perceive us versus how much we invite and/or welcome the role of counselor. You are quite correct that healthy boundaries are mandatory to survive as an INFJ. I mainly have to remember to do a self-check to make sure I am doing something because I want to be doing it--not because I feel compelled to do it (and don't actually want to do it).


----------



## Geoffrey

-----In the third installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions, @renna (INFJ) and I chat it up!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Geoffrey said:


> -----In the third installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions, @_renna_ (INFJ) and I chat it up!


Hooray! Ni-Food! 

@_Geoffrey_ - very interesting comment about the people surrounding us doing the Pygmalion Project as the cause of boundary issues....this is insightful. I wish I could tease out the natural stuff of my preference for Fe from the Pygmalion Project experiences I've had, from my parents, for example. It would be fascinating to know how my Fe would have played out in my life if I'd had a different upbringing....But I'm slowly giving up the need to know the cause of everything (easier to see correlations than causes) and to focus more on the progress and change I want today and take steps towards that without as much looking back. I appreciated your point about not expecting everyone to need to take the same journey we do, (i.e. understanding others) and that as an Idealist, my journey will be unique to those preferences. 

@_renna_ - yeah! I love to see your lovely face in these vids! I think because you're Enneagram Type 1 you give off a stronger vibe than perhaps other INFJs of a different E-type and so I wonder if anyone that has tried to question you being an Introvert would read about E-1 they may be able to see yes - she does lead with Ni, is an introvert and the differences they notice are more likely what they see from you being directed by Type 1 motivations than extraversion. That's my opinion at least. What'cha think?

I won't bother the rest of the readers with my every Ni-thought following both of your thoughts :tongue: (It seems whenever I make a long post that thread dies for a while! LOL I don't know how else to express myself dang it! haha) 
But yeah - I'm watching the whole thing - it's a great vid! :kitteh:

P.S. The book is called: "Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy: David D. Burns"


----------



## Younique

@_renna_ & @_Geoffrey_

Great video! I love to see the interaction between INFJ's. 
I agree'd with basically all that you two have said in the video. The only thing I didn't necessarily agree with (and this could be my own sub-conscious blocking) was not being efficient because I'm very good with using as little as possible and making the most out of it. But very good video guys! I would love to do one in the future. Kudos to you all!


----------



## renna

Geoffrey said:


> -----In the third installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions, @renna (INFJ) and I chat it up!


I love love the thumbnail where i'm holding up the book. This is a sign to ALL INFJs!!!! Have some boundaries all you INFJs, it's okay to have them! ha jk, but seriously too! ;-) 

Thanks again Geoffrey!! :-D


----------



## renna

Lady Lullaby said:


> Hooray! Ni-Food!


roud: :-D Right!!! I feel that way sometimes too. I'm sooo excited to watch your siblings video!! 



Lady Lullaby said:


> @renna- yeah! I love to see your lovely face in these vids! I think because you're Enneagram Type 1 you give off a stronger vibe than perhaps other INFJs of a different E-type and so I wonder if anyone that has tried to question you being an Introvert would read about E-1 they may be able to see yes - she does lead with Ni, is an introvert and the differences they notice are more likely what they see from you being directed by Type 1 motivations than extroversion. That's my opinion at least. What'cha think?


OMG WOW! Yes, I love love love that you pointed this out. Your Ni insight really just brought a whole new light to my world. Thank you thank you thank you!!! I need to checked out more enneagram books, especially that one you read and posted all your videos on. Do you suggest anymore Enneagram books? I have felt your point exactly, but more in my passion and not in exact thought as in how you described above. I'm amazed now. My *Type 1 Passion and leadership* makes me appear to be extroverted soooo much but you have to be involved in my life to see those moments where I have melt downs because I need quiet time or because I have had too much "E"s around me all day. OR I too volunteered too long that day because of my Type 1 tendencies, haha! 



Lady Lullaby said:


> I won't bother the rest of the readers with my every Ni-thought following both of your thoughts :tongue: (It seems whenever I make a long post that thread dies for a while! LOL I don't know how else to express myself dang it! haha)
> But yeah - I'm watching the whole thing - it's a great vid! :kitteh:


Wait, hey now! Do you think me or @Geoffrey would mind?! Noooooo please do not deprive us of your mind and wonderful thoughts. We appreciate your Ni dom long posts. Usually, I don't respond much the ones you post one the videos on because I haven't had time to watch the ones you watched but I think it's adorable and sweet how supportive you are of everyone in their videos. But yeah I'm super excited to watch your video and I can't wait to make a long post about yours. So please, don't be scared or timid to make a long post here. That's what this thread is for my dear! You are a type 2w1, you do what you need to do!! I understand, EXPRESS YOURSELF!!!! :-D 



Lady Lullaby said:


> P.S. The book is called: "Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy: David D. Burns"


YAY, See @Geoffrey there it is!! You HAVE to get it! 
In fact, I think I'll recheck it out too!!! It's time again!


----------



## renna

Younique said:


> @_renna_ & @_Geoffrey_
> 
> Great video! I love to see the interaction between INFJ's.
> I agree'd with basically all that you two have said in the video. The only thing I didn't necessarily agree with (and this could be my own sub-conscious blocking) was not being efficient because I'm very good with using as little as possible and making the most out of it. But very good video guys! I would love to do one in the future. Kudos to you all!


Well I'm glad that you can at least tell us what you didn't agree with. My INFJ friend has problems with telling others (only not me because we have a deeper understanding and she feels safe with me) what she doesn't agree with. She feels attacked with people question her disagreement. She is a Type 9w1, so you can see why. 

Thank you, I'm sooo glad you liked the video! Yes you should do a video, we'd love to see you chat it up!


----------



## Younique

renna said:


> Well I'm glad that you can at least tell us what you didn't agree with. My INFJ friend has problems with telling others (only not me because we have a deeper understanding and she feels safe with me) what she doesn't agree with. She feels attacked with people question her disagreement. She is a Type 9w1, so you can see why.
> 
> Thank you, I'm sooo glad you liked the video! Yes you should do a video, we'd love to see you chat it up!




Maybe me & @Lady Lullaby will do one soon If she's game for it.


----------



## Brownicus

Hey, if anyone is up for it I think it'd be fun to get interviewed by someone in here, If it means anything think I'm Intp.


----------



## Geoffrey

Lady Lullaby said:


> Hooray! Ni-Food!
> @_Geoffrey_ - very interesting comment about the people surrounding us doing the Pygmalion Project as the cause of boundary issues....this is insightful. I wish I could tease out the natural stuff of my preference for Fe from the Pygmalion Project experiences I've had, from my parents, for example. It would be fascinating to know how my Fe would have played out in my life if I'd had a different upbringing....But I'm slowly giving up the need to know the cause of everything (easier to see correlations than causes) and to focus more on the progress and change I want today and take steps towards that without as much looking back. I appreciated your point about not expecting everyone to need to take the same journey we do, (i.e. understanding others) and that as an Idealist, my journey will be unique to those preferences.



-----I am glad you took something away from our conversation. My mother is an ESFJ, and because of the way Fe is expressed in an ESFJ (a rigid structure of Jane Austen-like (a.k.a. what I perceive to be superficial) rules), I did not initially recognize that I myself also used this function (though I use it in a very different manner (I don't care which side of the plate the knife goes on--or whether anyone uses one at all!)). Like you, I have decided to let go of knowing the precise cause-and-effect relationship of things (Ti) and instead accept the correlations (and probabilities) I see as right for me (Ni) and to act on them (Je-Fe). Ni is holistic vision, attempting to tackle the infinitely complex, and Ti's precision often acts like an anchor (similar to Se), which can sometimes be good, but oftentimes simply works against Ni.
-----While I do believe Fe makes one more receptive to "being Pygmalioned" by others, I think Ni and the NF desire to grow and understand allows us to re-reform ourselves into who we really are--thus, this ability to self-form, gives us the exact tool (and desire to use it) to learn from and undo the damage of Pygmalion Projects--and to discover our spirit, soul, and Essence. For this reason, I think even an unsupportive upbringing is at most a temporary delay.
-----That desire to grow is so central to our being, it is sometimes hard to understand why others do not want to. However, I suppose that is the same reason the other quadrant types so readily engage in Pygmalion Projects of their own.


Lady Lullaby said:


> But yeah - I'm watching the whole thing - it's a great vid! :kitteh:
> P.S. The book is called: "Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy: David D. Burns"



-----Thanks for the book title!


Younique said:


> @_renna_ & @_Geoffrey_
> Great video! I love to see the interaction between INFJ's.
> I agree'd with basically all that you two have said in the video. The only thing I didn't necessarily agree with (and this could be my own sub-conscious blocking) was not being efficient because I'm very good with using as little as possible and making the most out of it. But very good video guys! I would love to do one in the future. Kudos to you all!



-----Thank you! 
-----I am glad that you do not have the same issues with efficiency. Certainly efficiency is a wonderful trait to have in this world. 


renna said:


> I love love the thumbnail where i'm holding up the book. This is a sign to ALL INFJs!!!! Have some boundaries all you INFJs, it's okay to have them! ha jk, but seriously too! ;-)
> Thanks again Geoffrey!! :-D



-----Thanks to you, too, renna. I really learned a lot about personal growth from our talk (and correspondence). 


renna said:


> Wait, hey now! Do you think me or @_Geoffrey_ would mind?! Noooooo please do not deprive us of your mind and wonderful thoughts. We appreciate your Ni dom long posts. Usually, I don't respond much the ones you post one the videos on because I haven't had time to watch the ones you watched but I think it's adorable and sweet how supportive you are of everyone in their videos. But yeah I'm super excited to watch your video and I can't wait to make a long post about yours. So please, don't be scared or timid to make a long post here. That's what this thread is for my dear! You are a type 2w1, you do what you need to do!! I understand, EXPRESS YOURSELF!!!! :-D



-----I absolutely concur.


renna said:


> YAY, See @_Geoffrey_ there it is!! You HAVE to get it!
> In fact, I think I'll recheck it out too!!! It's time again!



-----It is definitely on my "buy the next visit to the bookstore" list!


----------



## Female INFJ

Geoffrey said:


> -----In the third installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions, @_renna_ (INFJ) and I chat it up!


Great video, thanks! 

I've learned so much


----------



## perfectcircle

Hahahahahahahahaha..ha so in an ironic twist of fate, before I got around to working out skype & scheduling a defiinite time with my chat partner @LeaT, she retired! This highlights the pitfalls of P decision making to me very clearly so let this be a lesson to all of you- wait so long for the fruit to fall it may rot!! So I need a new person to chat with. I will be available every day at all times day and night after THIS FRIDAY. I am willing to do a chat with any type! I want to let you know my jokes are not funny & I am boring in advance, so your opinion of me can only go up. My Skype is robinganahl. if u are a weird person i do not know who doesnt wanna chat me, please do not look me up because that is my real name.
I AM SO READY I WANNA CHAT ALL 16 TYPES
GOTTA CATCH EM ALL GOTTA CATCH EM ALL

i was also thinking me and @kaleidoscope might have a very interesting chat?! you game?


----------



## magi83

adverseaffects said:


> Hahahahahahahahaha..ha so in an ironic twist of fate, before I got around to working out skype & scheduling a defiinite time with my chat partner @_LeaT_, she retired! This highlights the pitfalls of P decision making to me very clearly so let this be a lesson to all of you- wait so long for the fruit to fall it may rot!! So I need a new person to chat with. I will be available every day at all times day and night after THIS FRIDAY. I am willing to do a chat with any type! I want to let you know my jokes are not funny & I am boring in advance, so your opinion of me can only go up. My Skype is robinganahl. if u are a weird person i do not know who doesnt wanna chat me, please do not look me up because that is my real name.
> I AM SO READY I WANNA CHAT ALL 16 TYPES
> GOTTA CATCH EM ALL GOTTA CATCH EM ALL
> 
> i was also thinking me and @_kaleidoscope_ might have a very interesting chat?! you game?


I am still keen to do a video although I live in Australia so finding that brief window when two people in completely different time zones are neither working nor sleeping can be an issue. I'm sure we could work something out though.


----------



## Geoffrey

-----In the fourth installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions, @_DimensionX_ (INFJ) and I chat it up!


----------



## perfectcircle

magi83 said:


> I am still keen to do a video although I live in Australia so finding that brief window when two people in completely different time zones are neither working nor sleeping can be an issue. I'm sure we could work something out though.


I'm up now, we can do one spur of the moment in 2 hours?! Would you be around for that?


----------



## magi83

I would be very keen but I have to pick up my wife from work shortly and by the time I get back it's going to be pretty late (it's 10 p.m. here now and I start work at 7:30 a.m.). I'm pretty open over the weekend though.


----------



## perfectcircle

magi83 said:


> I would be very keen but I have to pick up my wife from work shortly and by the time I get back it's going to be pretty late (it's 10 p.m. here now and I start work at 7:30 a.m.). I'm pretty open over the weekend though.


hm i'll see if that works, i know the australia time zones well enough to make this easy so we'll keep posted


----------



## Celebok

Geoffrey said:


> -----In the fourth installment of iNtuitive & Feeler Interactions, @_DimensionX_ (INFJ) and I chat it up!


*3 hours??!??!? :shocked:*


----------



## Geoffrey

Celebok said:


> *3 hours??!??!? :shocked:*



-----"Despite their refined or sophisticated tastes, INFJs are typically not overly pretentious or serious individuals. They regularly enjoy spending time with other people, listening to music, and watching movies. *Perhaps more than anything, INFJs love spending time engrossed in meaningful conversation*. Because of their verbosity and enjoyment of others’ company, they can easily be mistaken for Extraverts." See Personality Junkie | INFJ. :laughing:


----------



## Teybo

I want to say thank you to everyone who has participated in videos recently. I'm a bit behind in watching, but perhaps in the lulls of my holiday season I'll be able to catch up a little. Please keep them coming!


----------



## BPReed92

Does anyone want to do a video with me sometime? I'm looking for someone who is knowledgeable about the cognitive functions.

While I am not the most knowledgeable about the functions, I think I could keep up in our conversation. I think I would have some good thoughts to bring to the table too. One of my goals would be to bring up real life situations when talking about the functions. I can grasp some of the complex, general descriptions of the functions, but I usually struggle with them and need real examples of them in use. I'm sure others can relate, so the video could also serve for educational purposes.

If nothing else, I can serve as a test guinea pig. So if anyone is interested, let me know. Thanks!


----------



## MissBlossom

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey PerCers. I had a lovely chat this afternoon with ENFP @Chela. Hope you enjoy watching it.


I loved this. I should get me some ENFP friends


----------



## MissBlossom

pneumoceptor said:


> Here's a chat I had yesterday with INTJ @Cetanu...


Thanks so much both of you! That was a very insightful and helpful video. 

Thanks, pneumoceptor, for making this thread!


----------



## MissBlossom

pneumoceptor said:


> W00t for another intuitive-sensor video. I present my chat with (the very funny and articulate) @Fat Bozo:


I loved this interview. I would love to have this kind of a father. Very nice and considerate person.


----------



## MissBlossom

pneumoceptor said:


> Yay, another intuitive-sensor chat!!! For your enjoyment, I present my conversation with ISFJ @teddy564339:


I enjoyed this a lot as well! Such a sweet teddy  I got a lot of useful insight from this. 

I love watching these videos. It helps to understand other people's perspectives and gives you an opportunity to see how every personality is amazing in their own way.


I feel like spamming, writing after every single video that impresses me. roud: but I need to acknowledge every person individually. You guys are amazing and this is a great thread!


----------



## pneumoceptor

Happy Almost New Year to everyone.

I chatted with my first ISTJ interaction partner today, @_CataclysmSolace_. Here's our talk:


----------



## MissBlossom

pneumoceptor said:


> @Celebok (ISTP) and I had a chat this morning that I hope you'll enjoy:
> ...


The road trips sounded so cool! I would love to join. Thanks for the video! Again, very insightful. 

I love how these videos are about real people and allow you to understand the types so much better. Reading the forums just leads you to a lot of stereotypes and leaves you confused what does the type really look like  Now I'm getting the real feel of the differences and similarities.


----------



## Fat Bozo

MissBlossom said:


> I loved this interview. I would love to have this kind of a father. Very nice and considerate person.


Well, thank you, Miss Blossom! Having me for a father is probably good unless you're one of those people who needs really strict boundaries applied to you and help with scheduling all the little details of your life. Then it would probably not be good to have me as a father!

By the way...

ATTENTION PEOPLE

This is another reminder that I, Fat Bozo, will "interact" with anyone who wants to on the Google chat, I have most of this weekend free, and then next week I can chat in the evenings, probably any time after 6pm central time most days, so just let me know when you wanna do it. (and also when you wanna chat. =P)


----------



## renna

My ENTP husband and I (INFJ) chatted it up with an ENFP member - @The King Of Dreams


----------



## Fat Bozo

renna said:


> My ENTP husband and I (INFJ) chatted it up with an ENFP member - @_The King Of Dreams_


When do I get to do a video with you, renna? Hmmmmm? :kitteh:


----------



## downsowf

renna said:


> My ENTP husband and I (INFJ) chatted it up with an ENFP member - @_The King Of Dreams_


That was good. You two make a good couple. Admittedly, I did not watch the whole thing  Almost all of it. I kept on expecting your husband to take a bite out of your hand the whole time since you kept on putting it in front of his face though


----------



## Im_not_a_brad_guy

bump


----------



## scorpion

@Im_not_a_brad_guy:


----------



## renna

downsowf said:


> That was good. You two make a good couple. Admittedly, I did not watch the whole thing  Almost all of it. I kept on expecting your husband to take a bite out of your hand the whole time since you kept on putting it in front of his face though


Thank you ;-) And just to defend myself here - he was in MY space - that boy chose to be there and I subconsciously was not paying attention to my hand being in front of him aka not aware of surroundings... even if he did bite me, wouldn't be the first time. we're a very playful couple, lol. Glad you enjoyed it, we had so much fun making it... ^.^


----------



## renna

Fat Bozo said:


> When do I get to do a video with you, renna? Hmmmmm? :kitteh:


Ha, I'm a hard one to pin down Soon! I promise  I still have two more scheduled to do and I'm wanting to do one with a female soon to balance some of my videos out... so far they have all been with men (except with my INTJ best friend)... which just kind of happened to be that way so I'm waiting for some women to come through for me to balance it out... I'd love to do one with @Lady Lullaby too in the future. We've been good friends for some time now. Anyway, my point is... SOON!! :-D


----------



## The King Of Dreams

renna said:


> My ENTP husband and I (INFJ) chatted it up with an ENFP member - @The King Of Dreams


Haha this was awesome! I haven't laughed this much in long time.


----------



## MissBlossom

Celebok said:


> My last video chat with an INFJ left me wanting some more of that Ni+Fe goodness, so I did a fun interaction video with another awesome INFJ from PerC: @renna!


You guys are fun. 


I wish to see a female ISTJ in here.


----------



## BPReed92

Currently, I am 41 minutes into the video. I love it so far! @The King Of Dreams, how can they not know/care about Emperor's New Groove? That movie is awesome!

I want to do another video sometime, but I'm not quite ready yet.

@_hornet_, I will try to post our video soon.


----------



## Inveniet

BPReed92 said:


> Currently, I am 41 minutes into the video. I love it so far! @The King Of Dreams, how can they not know/care about Emperor's New Groove? That movie is awesome!
> 
> I want to do another video sometime, but I'm not quite ready yet.
> 
> @_hornet_, I will try to post our video soon.


Well I've seen it, so take your time! :wink:
It is only us babbling about cognitive functions...
Everyone should know them by heart now if they've made it this far into the thread. :dry:


----------



## Villainous

Is there an ENTJ interaction video somewhere?


----------



## Geoffrey

Villainous said:


> Is there an ENTJ interaction video somewhere?


-----Here: PersonalityCafe - MBTI interactions: ENTJ and INFJ part 1
-----There may be more on YouTube, but this is the only one on this thread.


----------



## magi83

Pneumoceptor did an interaction video with an ENTJ. I can't link to it on my mobile but it's easy to find if you type 'INFJ ENTJ' into a YouTube search.


----------



## Geoffrey

Cassieopeia said:


> At first, I started around like page seventy or eighty, but then, I decided to start from the beginning (kinda just skimming through and watching bits of videos), and I'm on page fifty-five now.



-----For your convenience, the following playlists contain all of the videos posted on this thread:

PersonalityCafe - Pneumoceptor's MBTI Interaction Series
PersonalityCafe - MBTI Interaction Videos
PersonalityCafe - Geoffrey's iNtuitive & Feeler (MBTI) Interaction Series


----------



## thunder

@MegaTuxRacer and @jendragon What a fantastic display of Ti-ness. I like how jendragon said "I think the only people who would be interested in watching all of this are Ti-doms" because I usually don't watch the entirety of all these interaction videos, but it was hilarious how I got sucked into seeing how the semantics debate would turn out that I got to the end...


----------



## BPReed92

Anyone looking to do an interaction video with an unknown personality type (me)? If so, let me know.


----------



## Fat Bozo

BPReed92 said:


> Anyone looking to do an interaction video with an unknown personality type (me)? If so, let me know.


Sure!


----------



## BPReed92

@Fat Bozo, alright, sounds good. What time works best for you? I have a lot of free time, so it shouldn't be much of a problem for me to find available time. I'm Pacific Time by the way.

Thanks!


----------



## Celebok

MissBlossom said:


> My husband's ESFJ mother is exactly like you described yours, Celebok. It drives me crazy when she comes to our home and gives a lecture of how I should take care of it. I always think "omg, have I got nothing better to do than cleaning all the time??". And she starts cleaning my balcony which I always leave abandoned and says "your neighbors will think no one lives here, it's a shame to leave it so dirty". Also her never-ending comments "go out and have some social life"... oh, and never-ending unnecessary decorating advice! Gossip is definitely her thing too. It seems that all ESFJs talk about are other people, their weirdness and pointing out obvious things to which I have no idea how to answer.


LOL!! You just pointed out a few more of my mom's habits! She always thinks she knows exactly what others are going to think, and that I need to do as she says in order to prevent people from thinking those things. Like cleaning the balcony because the neighbors will think no one lives there. One time when I went a few months without a haircut, she was worried that the length of my hair might be a deciding factor if there were layoffs at work! A job that involves no public interaction, with a team of mostly NTs. I'm pretty sure my appearance is the last thing people care about!

Oh, don't get me started on the unnecessary decorating advice. Or worse, functional organizing advice, i.e. "You should set up some nice desk furniture in your spare bedroom and turn that room into an office." Um, no, if I wanted to, I would have. The fact that I haven't means I don't want to. Why is that so hard to understand?


----------



## BPReed92

Celebok said:


> LOL!! You just pointed out a few more of my mom's habits! She always thinks she knows exactly what others are going to think, and that I need to do as she says in order to prevent people from thinking those things. Like cleaning the balcony because the neighbors will think no one lives there. One time when I went a few months without a haircut, she was worried that the length of my hair might be a deciding factor if there were layoffs at work! A job that involves no public interaction, with a team of mostly NTs. I'm pretty sure my appearance is the last thing people care about!
> 
> Oh, don't get me started on the unnecessary decorating advice. Or worse, functional organizing advice, i.e. "You should set up some nice desk furniture in your spare bedroom and turn that room into an office." Um, no, if I wanted to, I would have. The fact that I haven't means I don't want to. Why is that so hard to understand?


You sound just like my ISTP brother. ISTPs are interesting characters for sure. Smart, witty characters.


----------



## Celebok

firedell said:


> That was much better than what I thought. I shall take that as a compliment.
> 
> I felt more like Kristen Stewart, where I essentially nodded and didn't talk much. I was listening so much to what @_Celebok_ had to say, I forgot I had to actually interact. xD


I think Kristen Stewart is actually an ISTP. I got that sense when I saw her on a late night talk show a few weeks ago, then I did some Googling and found that an overwhelming majority of celebrity type threads agree with that assessment.

Now that the Twilight saga is over, maybe she'll finally star in something that I'll actually go see.


----------



## MissBlossom

Celebok said:


> LOL!! You just pointed out a few more of my mom's habits! She always thinks she knows exactly what others are going to think, and that I need to do as she says in order to prevent people from thinking those things. Like cleaning the balcony because the neighbors will think no one lives there. One time when I went a few months without a haircut, she was worried that the length of my hair might be a deciding factor if there were layoffs at work! A job that involves no public interaction, with a team of mostly NTs. I'm pretty sure my appearance is the last thing people care about!
> 
> Oh, don't get me started on the unnecessary decorating advice. Or worse, functional organizing advice, i.e. "You should set up some nice desk furniture in your spare bedroom and turn that room into an office." Um, no, if I wanted to, I would have. The fact that I haven't means I don't want to. Why is that so hard to understand?


OMG, exactly!  The funny thing is their predictions of what others are going to think do not follow any logic. The second paragraph is entirely true for my mother-in-law too, including my thought process after her advice 

And yes, Kristen Stewart is an ISTP. I agree.


----------



## MissBlossom

Celebok said:


> Can a rookie ISTP help an IxTx figure out her type? Will you come to the same conclusions? Find out as I join @fihe in an ISTP-IxTx interaction!


My verdict is - absolutely an INTJ with a short attention span. I see myself in fihe. The style of talking is also very female INTJ. Lots and lots of what you were talking about were absolutely my thoughts. My husband is an INTP so I know the difference!

Making lists and doing other things instead... It's not adapting to the situation, but having more interesting priorities. I think we are undisciplined Js who would rather just do what we love and avoid doing all the meaningless "must" stuff. I thought maybe it is because of my N preference which makes me uninterested in the physical world. I always prefer to sit and explore theories: read or listen to something and analyze.
And all the situations which Celebok called spontaneous, weren't spontaneous at all. They were all well calculated decisions for that particular moment. They were thorough assessments of the situation at hand followed by the appropriate decision. Reasons for not wanting to be a mom: too much work, too much commitment, this world is an awful place. These are my thoughts exactly and therefore I refuse to become a mom. If I ever do decide to such a huge commitment and such a huge confinement of my freedom, I will take a child from orphanage. At least I will do something logical and helpful. I don't want to bring a new person to this world when there are a lot of them left out. This is a cost-effective thinking. I hate commitments. I avoid most of them and take up only the ones that are absolutely necessary and are unavoidable. 
And yes! I can't take online classes because they are too unstructured and I lose the track of them.

I think we'll have to re-type Celebok instead (joking, haha). I see I would get along very well with ISTPs. We have a lot in common. I also read somewhere that ISTPs admire INTx. Thanks for the tip about the wrinkled shirts and shower! I can relate with your situation "shirts on the floor left for few days". When I do the laundry and hang the clothes, I don't pick them up until I have to do the laundry again. They can hang there even for two weeks. I simply have other priorities and I don't want to bother sorting them out and putting them to where they belong. And I also hate unpacking after the trip. I take the things out gradually according to my needs haha.

My theory is... we all three are so alike because of our ESFJ moms! We got tired by their imposed structure and prefer to let ourselves free. ESFJs do a lot of unnecessary actions. They spend their efforts for things that could wait or are unimportant. Also we learnt to be disciplined on force. They failed to teach us how to manage ourselves on our own. Or it is just our personalities loose like that.

You were talking about quick fixing. My in-laws are ESFJ and ISTJ. ESFJ always wants a replacement with a new one, ISTJ always prefers to repair and save the money. ESFJ is very frustrated with that because for her everything must look nice! As an INTJ, I don't have one preference. I will always think: does a new one cost the amount I am willing to spend? do I want to change this for a new one? So I will make the decision according to the circumstances. So, the summary would be like that:
ESFJ - give me a good looking new one!
ISTJ - I must make the cheapest decision possible! I don't care about the satisfaction part!
INTJ - hmm... do I want something new right now? Do I have other priorities and want to spend my money on something else? I will make a cost-effective decision. Maximum satisfaction for minimum price. Necessity vs cost.


----------



## Cassieopeia

Geoffrey said:


> -----For your convenience, the following playlists contain all of the videos posted on this thread:
> 
> PersonalityCafe - Pneumoceptor's MBTI Interaction Series
> PersonalityCafe - MBTI Interaction Videos
> PersonalityCafe - Geoffrey's iNtuitive & Feeler (MBTI) Interaction Series


Thank you


----------



## MissBlossom

I am reading all the completely off the mark discussions about fihe's type. It's amazing how no one even suggests that she is an INTJ. We are such a misunderstood type, it's depressing!


----------



## Fat Bozo

BPReed92 said:


> @_Fat Bozo_, alright, sounds good. What time works best for you? I have a lot of free time, so it shouldn't be much of a problem for me to find available time. I'm Pacific Time by the way.


I'm gonna have to put together a form letter. :laughing:

Here ya go, from just up the same thread:




Fat Bozo said:


> The great state of Texas, Central time.





Fat Bozo said:


> Weekdays, after 6pm. Next weekend, pretty much any time.


So, same answers.




MissBlossom said:


> I am reading all the completely off the mark discussions about fihe's type. It's amazing how no one even suggests that she is an INTJ. We are such a misunderstood type, it's depressing!


Well, as I said, in most of what I've heard she seemed much more security seeking than knowledge seeking. Her interest in college seemed entirely about what job she was going to get, not anything about what she was learning there. There was no talk of mastering skills or discovering anything, or even tinkering around with things. It was entirely about having a job, family security, proper status in society. All these things point to SJ much more than NT.

Now the one thing going for NT was her doing a bunch of other stuff on her computer while having a conversation with me. That seemed a bit bizarre for an SJ to do, but then I chalked some of that up to her age/generation. That "short attention span" you talked about is certainly not an INTJ thing, it seems just to be a "today's society" thing. I have known plenty of INTJs who are intense and precise in their focus at pretty much all times and have some of the longest attention spans I've ever witnessed. There was an INTJ on a different personality forum who frequented our Ventrilo chats, and he would come in the chat room, sit there for an hour taking everything in, and then reply point by point to everything that had been discussed during that hour. That's not the mark of a person with a short attention span.

If you relate a lot to fihe, you might consider whether you have typed yourself accurately. I'm not saying you haven't, but it is a possibility to consider.


----------



## MissBlossom

Fat Bozo said:


> ...
> If you relate a lot to fihe, you might consider whether you have typed yourself accurately. I'm not saying you haven't, but it is a possibility to consider.


That "security seeking" is acknowledging the reality. She is forced to think like that. Unfortunately, you can't live your life seeking information, and analyzing/generating theories. You must do something real to get money. Unfortunately, INTJs can't do what they were meant to be doing and make a living. Her ISTJ stance of life is heavily influenced by her current situation. She has a debt for her studies, she found out that it is not only hard to find a job but also the job is too draining/not suitable for her. She is forced to "go down to Earth" and make something out of that situation. This kind of situation is very depressing for an INTJ. It says that you failed to make correct choices that were crucial to your life; it is an attack on your logic reasoning - the main tool you use to survive. Such situation brings suicidal thoughts. Her constant wish to be useful and make every moment as efficient as possible is another INTJ trait. 

I said she is an INTJ + short attention span. Short attention span does not come together with being an INTJ, but there's a separate breed of INTJs like that. It must be the side effect of this generation. She is surfing around while talking because she is unable to sit still and completely listen. I can never sit still and listen to another person talk. It's not interesting enough to ground me. I always play a game or surf the internet while watching interaction videos. I frequently space out and have to rewind and listen to what I have missed. 

I am entirely sure of my type. I have questioned it many many times and I always have to come back to INTJ because there is absolutely no alternative.


----------



## MissBlossom

Fat Bozo said:


> Well, after my editing hackjob to trim out some interruptions, I present my epic chat with fihe, where we cover such topics as money, security, authority, family, and status symbols. Yeah, tell me again that she's not SJ. :tongue:


I should say that I identify a lot with what Fat Bozo is saying. It's like you are a more eloquent, down to Earth/practical version of me. We use the same functions but in the reverse order. It's definitely evident. Now I can understand how ESFP-INTJ pairings work.


----------



## BPReed92

@_Fat Bozo_, thanks, ha ha. I forgot you had posted those.

I'll probably try for next week, Monday or so. My weekend is booked. But normally, my schedule isn't full.


----------



## teddy564339

Cassieopeia said:


> I saw a video with him in it and one with you in it but not the one together yet. At first, I started around like page seventy or eighty, but then, I decided to start from the beginning (kinda just skimming through and watching bits of videos), and I'm on page fifty-five now. Talk about no life. xD Lol but it's good entertainment and education since I've been stuck at home a lot.
> 
> We should chat too sometime if you want! c: I feel creepy saying it, but I do feel like I've gotten to know you from having read so many posts, talking a few times, and also hearing you talk in a video, and I feel like we'd have good conversations.




If you want to see the chat between me and Celebok, I posted it at the end of this thread too:

http://personalitycafe.com/isfj-forum-nurturers/111303-mbti-interaction-series-2.html



And at some point I do think it would be fun to do a chat. It may not be for a while, though....but that would give you time to do one with Celebok first. :happy:


----------



## Fat Bozo

hallstrigity and I chew the fat.

So to speak.

Enjoy! =)


----------



## rd93

@hallstrigity you don't have to answer this if you don't want to, but are you an INFJ?


----------



## hallstrigity

rd93 said:


> @_hallstrigity_ you don't have to answer this if you don't want to, but are you an INFJ?


In short - I don't think so, but it has been my third possibility. Its not a type I would be negatively surprised or offended to end up having been - so I am trying to tease out the truth of the matter for myself going forward. I'll PM you my official test results, etc. and a blurb just to keep the commentary off the forum for a more fun video with @Fat Bozo in the future. 
@Fat Bozo That being said - When do you want to do a discovery video that way? Tonight, Sunday night or sometime nxt week would work for me. 

Lastly - if anyone else wants to do a video - let me know. I have some users in mind for after the "discovery" video and I'll petition people individually at that time.


----------



## jendragon

@hallstrigity, I'm always down. Lemme know!


----------



## rd93

Fat Bozo said:


> hallstrigity and I chew the fat.
> 
> So to speak.
> 
> Enjoy! =)


I know I keep mentioning this, but the way you describe Fi and Se collaborating in tandem with other people is spot on with my mother. She loves finding ways to connect with people spontaneously but always remembers the specifics of their interests. She's likes finding little things to show people and to talk about associated with their taste. It's incredibly harmonizing when she interacts with people, especially in awkward situations (I think her Fi pushes past that comfortably, whereas Fe would kind of cringe and shrink back). Always much enthusiasm too.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Fat Bozo said:


> And then at the end of the video he said something about how the conversation had been pretty much all "sensor talk." So, it was funny to me for two reasons. One - that he had specifically asked to talk to a Sensor so I would think he would've been expecting that but Two - is that I actually thought before he said that something along the lines of "whew, all this vague abstract stuff is wearing me out, but I'm proud of myself for being able to do it for this long." :laughing:
> 
> So, once again it just shows the tremendous difference in perspective, because I noticed I was giving very few specific examples and in my mind speaking very conceptually, but MTR was experiencing it still as "Sensor Talk."


Well abstract does not mean vague. You can still be specific and abstract. Vagueness can still be exhausting. :smile:

And I think it was the particular type of sensing. I think a ton of Se can just sap me really quickly. I have a better endurance with Si.


----------



## Fat Bozo

MegaTuxRacer said:


> And I think it was the particular type of sensing. I think a ton of Se can just sap me really quickly. I have a better endurance with Si.


Hmmm, can you elaborate on this? In the context of a chat, what is the difference to you? If I had talked more about the past than the present? I'm curious what you mean and how one would be more endurable than the other.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Fat Bozo said:


> Hmmm, can you elaborate on this? In the context of a chat, what is the difference to you? If I had talked more about the past than the present? I'm curious what you mean and how one would be more endurable than the other.


Se tends to focus on what is exactly as it is. Si translates what is to what is meaningful to "me". Both can be a drain since only a specific type of sensing is last in my function stack.  Being bombarded with a ton of sensory data simply as it is eventually just drains me. Same with Si, but I have a better endurance for that.


----------



## jendragon

@Fat Bozo & @hallstrigity--

Very cool. And yes, Fat Bozo, power to the P-e's for doing something unexpected just because we can  Like turning a soap dispenser into a Dalek miniature. Sometimes, "Because it's cool" is the only explanation you need.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Myself and @rd93. Enjoy!


----------



## Celebok

I think it's about time I had a chat with another SP. Particularly one of the following:

*ISTP *-- to see if talking with another ISTP is as awkward as I've been thinking it would be, and to compare similarities and differences within my own type.

*ESFP *-- because I see it as the most SP of the SPs, while I'm the least SP of the SPs. ( @Fat Bozo?)


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Celebok said:


> *ISTP *-- to see if talking with another ISTP is as awkward as I've been thinking it would be, and to compare similarities and differences within my own type.


If I just change my badge will you talk to me? I have actually been wanting to talk to one of you.


----------



## Fat Bozo

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Se tends to focus on what is exactly as it is. Si translates what is to what is meaningful to "me". Both can be a drain since only a specific type of sensing is last in my function stack. Being bombarded with a ton of sensory data simply as it is eventually just drains me. Same with Si, but I have a better endurance for that.


I think I sorta understand the contrast you're making, but I definitely still don't understand the whole drains/endurance thing.



Celebok said:


> I think it's about time I had a chat with another SP. Particularly one of the following:
> *ESFP *-- because I see it as the most SP of the SPs, while I'm the least SP of the SPs. ( @_Fat Bozo_?)


Not sure that I agree that any type of SP is "most" or "least", but I'd definitely be happy to chat with you. We could do it Friday night or Saturday, lemme know when's good for you.


----------



## hallstrigity

@rd93 and I talk out some quite interesting issues.


----------



## rd93

Two interactions in one day. That's extrovert business.


----------



## pneumoceptor

rd93 said:


> Two interactions in one day. That's extrovert business.


Not to mention A THREE HOUR CHAT.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

pneumoceptor said:


> Not to mention A THREE HOUR CHAT.


Dayum. I thought people were going to hate us for what we did. Props @rd93


----------



## rd93

Alright who wants to continue the streak and go at it with me until the sun rises?


----------



## rd93

That one was a joke^


----------



## Fat Bozo

rd93 said:


> Alright who wants to continue the streak and go at it with me until the sun rises?






rd93 said:


> That one was a joke^


:sad:


----------



## rd93

Fat Bozo said:


> :sad:


I don't doubt your enthusiasm haha


----------



## hallstrigity

MegaTuxRacer said:


> If I just change my badge will you talk to me? I have actually been wanting to talk to one of you.



This interaction has my vote - I'd love to see it. But enthused at the idea of seeing any ISTP interaction that surfaces.

@MegaTuxRacer I was wondering if you might want to do a video sometime. I'd love to get your take on the differences between 7wx and 3wx ENTP's and i did see a video where you mentioned both so you seemed to be familiar with the subject. Morality might be on the table as well as whatever else we could come up with. Let me know what you think.


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

hallstrigity said:


> This interaction has my vote - I'd love to see it. But enthused at the idea of seeing any ISTP interaction that surfaces.
> 
> @MegaTuxRacer I was wondering if you might want to do a video sometime. I'd love to get your take on the differences between 7wx and 3wx ENTP's and i did see a video where you mentioned both so you seemed to be familiar with the subject. Morality might be on the table as well as whatever else we could come up with. Let me know what you think.


I am not sure. I have a pretty full schedule ahead of me now that I think about it.


----------



## wormy

Fat Bozo said:


> Here's my epic Sensor tug-of-war chat with teddy123456 (*note: not actual numbers)
> 
> Even if you have to take breaks, it's worth it to watch the whole thing because there's a cliffhanger ending! :tongue:


I've been combing this thread for ISFJ interaction videos. @_teddy_123456, you're a star. I think the ISFJs I'm acquainted with would require a lot of coaxing.
It is really interesting to see which types are most willing to participate in these videos.


----------



## jendragon

Too late! I accept your challenge. I'm trying to work out a sched with auclairedelune00 and replying shortly to @hallstringity, but would you mind adding yet another ENTP to your list?

Also: CALLING ALL N-AUX and F-AUX's!!!
@Celebok and I are putting together a chat group to discuss child functions. He's N-tertiary, I'm F-tertiary, and getting an S- and a T-tertiary would be _fabulous_. I or E, doesn't matter. Some idea of cognitive functions a bonus, but not required. For those of you who would be willing, but aren't sure, S-tertiary types include ENFJ, ENTJ, INFP and INTP. The T-tertiary types are INFJ, ISFJ, ENFP and ESFP. (@pneumoceptor, @teddy, @Fat Bozo?) Just let me know!


----------



## pneumoceptor

jendragon said:


> Too late! I accept your challenge. I'm trying to work out a sched with auclairedelune00 and replying shortly to @hallstringity, but would you mind adding yet another ENTP to your list?
> 
> Also: CALLING ALL N-AUX and F-AUX's!!!
> @_Celebok_ and I are putting together a chat group to discuss child functions. He's N-tertiary, I'm F-tertiary, and getting an S- and a T-tertiary would be _fabulous_. I or E, doesn't matter. Some idea of cognitive functions a bonus, but not required. For those of you who would be willing, but aren't sure, S-tertiary types include ENFJ, ENTJ, INFP and INTP. The T-tertiary types are INFJ, ISFJ, ENFP and ESFP. (@pneumoceptor, @_teddy_, @_Fat Bozo_?) Just let me know!


I'm down, if it works with my schedule. Also, why didn't your mention of me mention me?


----------



## jendragon

pneumoceptor said:


> I'm down, if it works with my schedule. Also, why didn't your mention of me mention me?


Yay! Will try to set up times as soon as we get word on an S-tertiary. 

And I can only assume that it's the physical object consortium at work once more. I'm under a life-long ban for insufficient S.


----------



## Fat Bozo

jendragon said:


> Too late! I accept your challenge. I'm trying to work out a sched with auclairedelune00 and replying shortly to @hallstringity, but would you mind adding yet another ENTP to your list?
> 
> Also: CALLING ALL N-AUX and F-AUX's!!!
> @_Celebok_ and I are putting together a chat group to discuss child functions. He's N-tertiary, I'm F-tertiary, and getting an S- and a T-tertiary would be _fabulous_. I or E, doesn't matter. Some idea of cognitive functions a bonus, but not required. For those of you who would be willing, but aren't sure, S-tertiary types include ENFJ, ENTJ, INFP and INTP. The T-tertiary types are INFJ, ISFJ, ENFP and ESFP. (@pneumoceptor, @_teddy_, @_Fat Bozo_?) Just let me know!


As I've said before, I'd love to be a part of a group chat any time. =)


----------



## Figure

I haven't visited this thread in such a long time! We've had type fights, we've had crazy combinations like ESFP and ENTP, and now we've got multiple representatives of the tertiary in the works, all since June - bravo!

Does anyone know if there is a video on here between types who have opposite MBTI letters (maybe Teddy and MegaTux, other frequents here)? Or, at least where the dominant functions and inferior are reversed (Ti/Fe, etc)? I'm trying to study the ways in which reversed function stacks "complement" each other.


----------



## jendragon

Figure said:


> Does anyone know if there is a video on here between types who have opposite MBTI letters (maybe Teddy and MegaTux, other frequents here)? Or, at least where the dominant functions and inferior are reversed (Ti/Fe, etc)? I'm trying to study the ways in which reversed function stacks "complement" each other.


Teddy and I did an ISFJ-ENTP chat--check it out: 




(The rest is further up this thread, or go to my YouTube channel-- jendragon42)


----------



## Figure

@_jendragon_

AWESOME!!!!! That helps so much, great video (from the couple minutes I've seen so far) and thanks!


----------



## Celebok

hallstrigity said:


> This interaction has my vote - I'd love to see it. But enthused at the idea of seeing any ISTP interaction that surfaces.


Wow, now we're actually getting viewer requests!

Hey @Fat Bozo, are you still available for a chat sometime this Saturday?
@MegaTuxRacer, let me know when you're available too.


----------



## firedell

Figure said:


> I haven't visited this thread in such a long time! We've had type fights, we've had crazy combinations like ESFP and ENTP, and now we've got multiple representatives of the tertiary in the works, all since June - bravo!
> 
> Does anyone know if there is a video on here between types who have opposite MBTI letters (maybe Teddy and MegaTux, other frequents here)? Or, at least where the dominant functions and inferior are reversed (Ti/Fe, etc)? I'm trying to study the ways in which reversed function stacks "complement" each other.


I know I would love an interaction with an INTJ or ENTJ. I just haven't had the time as of late, and the time differences can be a pain. Plus, I haven't seen many INTJ's and ENTJ's putting their hands up for these things. :/

Because of the time zone problems, I am currently trying to persuade an ESTP to partake in one with me. Be on the look out for a possible ISFP and ESTP interaction video.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Figure said:


> I haven't visited this thread in such a long time! We've had type fights, we've had crazy combinations like ESFP and ENTP, and now we've got multiple representatives of the tertiary in the works, all since June - bravo!
> 
> Does anyone know if there is a video on here between types who have opposite MBTI letters (maybe Teddy and MegaTux, other frequents here)? Or, at least where the dominant functions and inferior are reversed (Ti/Fe, etc)? I'm trying to study the ways in which reversed function stacks "complement" each other.


I did one with an ESTP a while back...


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> Hey @_Fat Bozo_, are you still available for a chat sometime this Saturday?


Yes! I just found out a few hours ago that I have to work tomorrow, but I should be home by around mid-afternoon. I'll send you a quick message when I get home. =)


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Celebok said:


> Wow, now we're actually getting viewer requests!
> 
> Hey @Fat Bozo, are you still available for a chat sometime this Saturday?
> @MegaTuxRacer, let me know when you're available too.


I actually might not be able to. I overbooked by schedule.


----------



## yet another intj

Fictional but a good one. 

INTJ-INFJ

http://tinyurl.com/cbl6rug


----------



## Figure

firedell said:


> I know I would love an interaction with an INTJ or ENTJ. I just haven't had the time as of late, and the time differences can be a pain. Plus, I haven't seen many INTJ's and ENTJ's putting their hands up for these things.


I'm usually a pretty early riser, even on weekends. If you want to add an ISFP/INTJ interaction to the collection, I'd be happy to join you in a video! Did a few _way _back, but got a tad winded from them after awhile. Unfortunately, the stupid camera on my comp is broken too but I'm still down for it if there's a way to use a mobile/Android (there must be). 



> Because of the time zone problems, I am currently trying to persuade an ESTP to partake in one with me. Be on the look out for a possible ISFP and ESTP interaction video.


That would be an interesting one - good luck with it, I haven't seen many ESTP willing to make videos around here. 

Coincidentally though, @_pneumoceptor_ - what a hysterical video! I'm not one to watch these things in entirety, but this one was great. I think we have a lot in common with placing more emphasis on the auxiliary than usual (despite getting tired with it), and I was really intrigued to see how you would handle the typical ESTP "interrogations" I usually struggle with. Did you get sort of an "justifying" tone to the convo like I did? As if you were using your T/F functions to compare each others' ways of handling the world? I don't mean "justifying" in a bad way, it just seemed as though both of you placed more emphasis on functions #2 and 3 in deciding what to say, despite using your dominants to actually say it. 

This would contrast with what I noticed with @_jendragon_ and @_teddy564339_ who demonstrated more emphasis on the dominant Si/Ne combo - and that one being less advisory, and more exploratory in tone. You guys didn't seem like you had to expend a lot of energy to receive the others' natural way of thinking - did you actually feel that way during the video? 

Sorry if these videos were made a long time ago, it's still really interesting to compare them side by side!


----------



## teddy564339

Figure said:


> I
> Coincidentally though, @_pneumoceptor_ - what a hysterical video! I'm not one to watch these things in entirety, but this one was great. I think we have a lot in common with placing more emphasis on the auxiliary than usual (despite getting tired with it), and I was really intrigued to see how you would handle the typical ESTP "interrogations" I usually struggle with. Did you get sort of an "justifying" tone to the convo like I did? As if you were using your T/F functions to compare each others' ways of handling the world? I don't mean "justifying" in a bad way, it just seemed as though both of you placed more emphasis on functions #2 and 3 in deciding what to say, despite using your dominants to actually say it.
> 
> This would contrast with what I noticed with @_jendragon_ and @_teddy564339_ who demonstrated more emphasis on the dominant Si/Ne combo - and that one being less advisory, and more exploratory in tone. You guys didn't seem like you had to expend a lot of energy to receive the others' natural way of thinking - did you actually feel that way during the video?
> 
> Sorry if these videos were made a long time ago, it's still really interesting to compare them side by side!



I think there are a couple of things going on here that might help to explain the differences in the two videos.


Part of it may be Enneagram related, and as I've learned from you and one of your videos, that can make a huge difference. I have no idea what Enneagram types Almost and pneumoceptor are (they may have mentioned it in the video, but I don't remember), but jendragon said she was a 2. Even though I'm not a 2, I definitely relate to it, and it may even be part of my tri-type.


Another part of it may also be that both jendragon and I had done a few of these videos before chatting with each other. We seem to be a little more invested in this thread in particular. Not only does this give us a bit of practice, but it also gave us a chance to watch each others' previous videos too...I know I watched a few of jendragon's beforehand to get an idea of what she was like.

Even though pneumo has done tons of these, if I'm not mistaken, that was the only one that Almost did. So that may have contributed to it.




Just some things I thought of, don't know if they relate or not. I'm sure there are other factors that played into it as well.




To be honest, I was actually a little worried going into the chat with jendragon that there might have ended up being some friction or awkward silences, just because our two types are so different. But it was actually just as easy for me as chatting with pneumo or Celebok or anyone else.


I think part of it is that I got a vibe from her in particular that I might feel pretty comfortable. The funny thing is...after watching her chat with @MegaTuxRacer , I actually felt a little intimidated by MegaTuxRacer, just because he knew so much about the MBTI and they got into a pretty strong Ti debate/conversation. But after watching MegaTuxRacer's chats with Fat Bozo and especially rd93, I feel like I could actually have a pretty good one with him and feel comfortable with him too (though I think we're both probably going to be busy for a while anyway).


----------



## hallstrigity

MegaTuxRacer said:


> I am not sure. I have a pretty full schedule ahead of me now that I think about it.


Hmm... Well i probably wouldn't be looking to do so until after the weekend and I also look to be setting one up with jendragon. I am also just catching your INTJ vid in pre-release. 

The enneagram questions may prove pointless in the end anyhow. I took it on Eclectic Energies: Chakra test, I Ching, Mudras, Acupressure, Exercises, Articles in order to get the sx/so/sp deal that many were talking about and it rates me much differently than 9types.com - Enneagram tests, type descriptions, forums (anyone have a recommended or more trusted site? For free?)

Instead I come up as 7w8 sx/so. Furthermore, changing the 4 more iffy questions i felt like checking out of 52 total yields 3w4 sx/sx - leading me to believe that there's not a hell of a lot of difference between the two or at least as it relates to me. 


Anyway PM me if you change your mind in the future.


----------



## hallstrigity

pneumoceptor said:


> Glad you enjoyed it . I'm not sure what you mean by signature hand rub of anticipation? In general, are you saying that her external emotional expressions are more overt than mine? She actually told me today, after having watched the interaction, that her face was always moving, and she really needed to tone that down. I said why on earth would you want to do that -- I love your expressions.



What I mean here is that there are times when it is apparent that she is feigning an emotion or exaggerating an emotion by using an associated physical expression from her Si. The hand rub happened when you proposed something and she rubbed her hands to show anticipation that from an Fe level did not seem commensurate with the physical response. Perhaps an internal thought process to the extent of "I am now expected to demonstrate my excitement" [demonstrates excitement] "yes i am quite excited by that prospect....."

I scanned the videos but i couldn't find it. There are other facial expressions, etc that fit into this situation as well. All of this being said - I'm digging in way too deep here and not looking to be critical of or imply necessary changes in Lisa's behavior. I'm with @pneumoceptor @Fat Bozo on that aspect. 

Here's a postover from another thread with and INTJ talking about an ISTJ sig other on the topic. 



hallstrigity said:


> Fair - I'm thinking I should look into ISTJ understanding and mimicry of emotional expressions. Perhaps it is by having an inventory of common emotional expressions that your ISTJ would act this way. I appreciate the measured response, which is probably more proper to true INTJ's though not always my experience- I was feeling confrontational when wrote the first comment but it passed. :kitteh:





vikingbitch said:


> I would agree with the inventory theory. He has certain responses and facial expressions that he uses specifically for certain social situations or when he is uncomfortable. Most people fail to catch on, but it is clearly an act when he reaches into this inventory. I guess I just notice it because I know him fairly well. He seems to subtly project the emotion he is truly feeling while acting out the one that is "appropriate" for everyone else.


----------



## rd93

hallstrigity said:


> @*pneumoceptor* Great interaction! I really liked the signature hand rub of anticipation and other seemingly exaggerated displays/mimicries. Have you noticed this and ever mentioned it to Lisa to get her perspective while the action is in progress? Also understandable if this is not a prudent line of questioning. roud: Again great video and my thanks to the participants!
> 
> 
> 
> @_rd93_ No need to apologize in any way. Our interaction was both meaningful and instructive - best of both worlds. I'd be up for a recap/video 2 sometime in analysis of vid 1 if you wanted or even and unrecorded chat recap if you prefer. I would love to pursue lines of questioning involving which aspects in the video were predominately displaying mirror images of the emotion you were pulling from within me - if that was at all the case, and similar lines of questioning.
> 
> 
> Glad that there was something to be learned in the video with @_jendragon_ ! Do I hear a vote for the terrifying panel discussion?


I'd certainly be up for that, this just gets more interesting. 
I kind of like that personification; Fe's coercion can be dangerous too. Maybe I can harness it as a tactical weapon.


----------



## Meadow

rd93 said:


> I kind of like that personification; Fe's coercion can be dangerous too. Maybe I can harness it as a tactical weapon.


That wouldn't work with me. Having two dom Fe siblings with aforementioned dangerous weapon, I just go home and put a pillow over my head until I recover.


----------



## thunder

Anyone else thinking that @Fat Bozo's video with @Celebok should be linked to the Type Me thread..?


----------



## Fat Bozo

thunder said:


> Anyone else thinking that @_Fat Bozo_'s video with @_Celebok_ should be linked to the Type Me thread..?


What specific thread are you talking about?


----------



## thunder

Fat Bozo said:


> What specific thread are you talking about?


In general: What's my personality type?


----------



## Ozman2988

I would love to participate in one your sessions!


----------



## hallstrigity

Ozman2988 said:


> I would love to participate in one your sessions!


Dunno if you had a pairing in mind or target for the statement. Wanna to do an ENFP ENTP Ne Awesomeness interaction?


----------



## Meirsho

anyone in for some vid chat? estp 3w4 in the house


----------



## jendragon

Meirsho said:


> anyone in for some vid chat? estp 3w4 in the house


ENTP 2w3 answering the call  I've got two vids lined up currently, but if you don't mind a little wait, I'm game


----------



## Figure

Meirsho said:


> anyone in for some vid chat? estp 3w4 in the house


I'll do one! Work from 9-6P East Coast, or we could wait until the weekend, your call. I've got 3w4 in my tritype, so maybe an interesting combo there. Plus, I'm almost positive there are no ESTP-INTJ videos so far.


----------



## Meirsho

@*jendragon and @**Figure 

i'll love to do a vid with *either of you but i can't plan it ahead, my RL time here is for sure diffrent then yours so from now (moment of this post)for the next about 7 hours or so i'm able^^ what program should i have?skype? pm me when you can 
--waiting


----------



## Ozman2988

hallstrigity said:


> Dunno if you had a pairing in mind or target for the statement. Wanna to do an ENFP ENTP Ne Awesomeness interaction?


I am always down for interacting with another Ne user. lol


----------



## Ozman2988

I am down if anyone else wants to Skype/video chat as well. ENFP 2w3.


----------



## frabjuosity

Ozman2988 said:


> I am down if anyone else wants to Skype/video chat as well. ENFP 2w3.


Double ENFP? All the way across the sky... :tongue:

I'd quite like to do an interaction video with whoever - never done one before though, and I have no idea what my enneagram is. Tried to work it out at one point and got very confused!


----------



## Ozman2988

frabjuosity said:


> Double ENFP? All the way across the sky... :tongue:
> 
> I'd quite like to do an interaction video with whoever - never done one before though, and I have no idea what my enneagram is. Tried to work it out at one point and got very confused!


Add me on skype if you wish...my username is Ozman2988...btw LOVE the double rainbow reference!! HAHA I loved that video


----------



## Meirsho

heyyyy i'm in for a vid chat..but i'm in for it now..donno how i'll be later  who is for it now? and btw estp 3w4 here..


----------



## jendragon

@Fat Bozo & @Celebok

Finished your video, and loved it, of course. Jeff, I think you get NTP pretty darn well. Having achieved five guru levels myself  I have, in fact, encountered the exact experience where people have suggested that I was either ENFP or INFJ in disguise. I dispassionately considered their arguments, recognized why they were insufficient, and that yes, despite my huge arsenal of tactical Fe, I am an NT, and smiled. 

Has anyone ever thought that your Aux function was the only truly healthy function in your arsenal? It seems that people can be kind of at the mercy of their dominant function, and have inherited all of its positive and negative attributes, while the auxiliary is more under control and useful. 

Back on topic--re: NT actors, I'm only claiming George Carlin and Eddy Izzard. I defy you to take them from me.

And for NT acting, I approach it from the angle of what does my character know, and how does that motivate them, cause them feelings, familiarity, conflict, curiosity, etc. I'm working on adding 'believe' to 'know', as I continue to improve my craft. 

And speaking of craft, it has recently occurred to me that I spend a great deal of care on improving my arts--theater and music, especially. I spend as little effort as possible on my work. I know what the NFs are going to say to that, but it's far easier to make a living in ESL and act on the side than to make a living as a professional performer and keep up on linguistics on the side! This is similar, I would guess, to the SP perspective. Am I correct?


----------



## Meirsho

startin a vid now..any1 up for joining?


----------



## hallstrigity

@Meirsho and I rock it out! - ESTP & ENTP interaction








This interaction was great. Sorry to cut it short at the end. I'll be linking this over to my little brother to watch if he'd like. You remind me just how important it is I keep in touch with him. His enthusiasm and his sadness to see the time end. Wish your brother well for me - just don't let him know how cool u think he really is!


----------



## Meirsho

good times


----------



## Immerseyourself

Love the videos. It'd take me a long time to go through them all, but I'll make an effort. Its interesting to see how each MBTI type (and how it differs per individual) interact with each other. 
Keep up the good work everyone.


----------



## hallstrigity

Immerseyourself said:


> Love the videos. It'd take me a long time to go through them all, but I'll make an effort.


So I don't have a clue how to do the nice video editing or even the hyperlink menu set up - but ill get there someday. I made an attempt to cut to some issues in the 3hr video with @rd93. Here are two shorter, more intense clips from our conversation. Enjoy!


----------



## hallstrigity

Here's an abundance of Ne AWESOMENESS from both sides of the T/F street with me and @Ozman2988. Hope people enjoy the insights and pardon the crazy!


----------



## perfectcircle

jendragon said:


> Last call for ENTJs, ENFJs, INTPs or INFPs to join the Great Child Function Symposium and Knowledge Expansion Vortex!
> @Celebok, @pneumoceptor, @Fat Bozo, I will pm you with possible times by Wednesday, either way.


Wow wait what, do you wanna chat with an infp?!
:3 I can do tonight.


----------



## perfectcircle

Meirsho said:


> startin a vid now..any1 up for joining?


I could :3 I've rarely talked to an estp, it might be awkward but hey why not.


----------



## Death Persuades

I would like to interact with other types... I don't have cam, though.


----------



## hallstrigity

adverseaffects said:


> I could :3 I've rarely talked to an estp, it might be awkward but hey why not.


If you are looking for a vid tonight- i'd be up to making one after I make a quick phone call. If anyone else steps in first that's cool b/c I've kinda overpopulated the thread. ENTP by the way and I'm not sure if I know any INFPs in RL or not.




ISFjosue0098 said:


> I would like to interact with other types... I don't have cam, though.


You should buy one - they are so much fun!


----------



## Death Persuades

hallstrigity said:


> If you are looking for a vid tonight- i'd be up to making one after I make a quick phone call. If anyone else steps in first that's cool b/c I've kinda overpopulated the thread. ENTP by the way and I'm not sure if I know any INFPs in RL or not.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You should buy one - they are so much fun!


I'd be too shy to talk >_<


----------



## hallstrigity

ISFjosue0098 said:


> I'd be too shy to talk >_<


C'mon who better to talk to than MBTI geeks that have an idea of your cognitive preferences?


----------



## jendragon

adverseaffects said:


> Wow wait what, do you wanna chat with an infp?!
> :3 I can do tonight.


Yes, yes we do! Not tonight, thought--you available Saturday morning? If not, we can set something else up


----------



## Meirsho

ok..I can  who's up now for vid chat? (if you can't now-in the next 12hrs/no worries^^)


----------



## Fat Bozo

akonlki231 said:


> Besides im not a different type heh. At least until another hunch or idea comes along.


Eh?


----------



## hallstrigity

Meirsho said:


> ok..I can  who's up now for vid chat? (if you can't now-in the next 12hrs/no worries^^)


Srry bud, yesterday was a busy day for me. If you're still looking for more air time - i have about an hour free right now or I could do something between 18hrs from now and 21hrs from now. I'm gonna run low on topics though unless we cross over into a bit of controversy - I wouldn't mind crossing into religion for STP's and also as it might relate to the series I am looking to do.


----------



## Celebok

Today I had a fun and interesting chat with @jendragon and @Fat Bozo about our "child functions".


----------



## hallstrigity

I only got through vid 3 but good stuff. What do you use to edit videos @Celebok -ur showing me up man!


----------



## Celebok

hallstrigity said:


> I only got through vid 3 but good stuff. What do you use to edit videos @_Celebok_ -ur showing me up man!


Nothing sophisticated at all, just a combination of Windows Movie Maker and YouTube's video editor. It's kind of the ISTP thing to figure out how to do cool stuff with very limited resources.


----------



## Teybo

Watching the group video about child functions, I have had lots of thoughts. The first is that extraverts always take up all the oxygen in the room (I love you extraverts, but you're better at talking than listening!). The second is that I wish there was at least one more introvert in the discussion just so we could have more introverts discussing their views on things. 

The third is that I have a love-hate relationship with Fat Bozo's opinions regarding type. I usually find discussions of "functions" to be somewhat tedious. Other people seem to ascribe more to functions than seems reasonable, and there seems to be a rigidity in this community and perhaps others in terms of outlining the "use" (oh god) of functions and their "ordering" (double oh god) that I cannot find any strong basis for. I'm an INFJ, and it took me a while to figure that out; I think that there's a certain rigidity that some people put on types that made me struggle to identify as INFJ. Not everyone fits so neatly, and I think it's worth asking why. But, I'm an intuitive, and so I'm willing to dive into the theoretical bullshit (and let's be honest, it's mostly bullshit) in order to try to see if there's some truth there. I don't think @Fat Bozo will be offended by me saying this, but it seems that he (and the multitude of SFP's I know) actually have a high tolerance for bullshit, but it is a very different kind of bullshit. So, yeah, a little love-hate thing going on, more love than hate, though.

But, in a very self-centered way, I was really frustrated by the description of introverted intuition as being hard to describe. I was wishing that pneumoceptor was in the video to dispel things, and then I was wishing that I was in the video to just to chime in on this point, but regardless, here's my view: introverted intuition is not mysterious. It's not magical, mystical, or inexplicable. It's just not common, so society doesn't have a lot of reference points with which to talk about it. In my opinion, Ni is stupidly simple to explain (just like every other function!). An Ni-dominant person is going to first bring into their consciousness the subjective meaning of something before the objective reality of what they are seeing (or smelling, or hearing, or whatever) enters their consciousness. The meaning of a sensory experience is unconnected from the literal reality of sensory experience. That's all that Ni is. It's a perceptive perspective, and so whatever judgment is placed on the perceptions is secondary (in challenge to some of what was said in the video).

To me, that's a crystal clear explanation, but then again, I'm an INFJ who has dwelled much longer in the introverted intuition realm than some other INFJ's due to my stunted extraversion (But I won't go on about my personal flaws; they are too obvious). Maybe my views are twisted and warped. I don't know.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Teybo said:


> Watching the group video about child functions, I have had lots of thoughts. The first is that extraverts always take up all the oxygen in the room (I love you extraverts, but you're better at talking than listening!). The second is that I wish there was at least one more introvert in the discussion just so we could have more introverts discussing their views on things.
> 
> The third is that I have a love-hate relationship with Fat Bozo's opinions regarding type. I usually find discussions of "functions" to be somewhat tedious. Other people seem to ascribe more to functions than seems reasonable, and there seems to be a rigidity in this community and perhaps others in terms of outlining the "use" (oh god) of functions and their "ordering" (double oh god) that I cannot find any strong basis for. I'm an INFJ, and it took me a while to figure that out; I think that there's a certain rigidity that some people put on types that made me struggle to identify as INFJ. Not everyone fits so neatly, and I think it's worth asking why. But, I'm an intuitive, and so I'm willing to dive into the theoretical bullshit (and let's be honest, it's mostly bullshit) in order to try to see if there's some truth there. I don't think @_Fat Bozo_ will be offended by me saying this, but it seems that he (and the multitude of SFP's I know) actually have a high tolerance for bullshit, but it is a very different kind of bullshit. So, yeah, a little love-hate thing going on, more love than hate, though.
> 
> But, in a very self-centered way, I was really frustrated by the description of introverted intuition as being hard to describe. I was wishing that pneumoceptor was in the video to dispel things, and then I was wishing that I was in the video to just to chime in on this point, but regardless, here's my view: introverted intuition is not mysterious. It's not magical, mystical, or inexplicable. It's just not common, so society doesn't have a lot of reference points with which to talk about it. In my opinion, Ni is stupidly simple to explain (just like every other function!). An Ni-dominant person is going to first bring into their consciousness the subjective meaning of something before the objective reality of what they are seeing (or smelling, or hearing, or whatever) enters their consciousness. The meaning of a sensory experience is unconnected from the literal reality of sensory experience. That's all that Ni is. It's a perceptive perspective, and so whatever judgment is placed on the perceptions is secondary (in challenge to some of what was said in the video).
> 
> To me, that's a crystal clear explanation, but then again, I'm an INFJ who has dwelled much longer in the introverted intuition realm than some other INFJ's due to my stunted extraversion (But I won't go on about my personal flaws; they are too obvious). Maybe my views are twisted and warped. I don't know.


Haha. I'm not offended in the slightest. Quite the opposite, I'm thankful for your perspective on these matters. I'm very much a "what you see is what you get" kind of guy, and when I don't see something, I don't pretend I do just for the sake of "getting along." I probably won't ever fully understand "Ni" (or "Ne" for that matter) but I have genuinely tried to listen to anyone's explanations that has been willing to try to help me with it.

I think I'm a pretty good listener, actually. But I'm more that way when I'm having a discussion with somebody about something really important to them personally, such as relationship issues or things like that. There's a personal connection there and something that surely holds my attention. The reality is that in the context of a video chat that's a lot more relaxed, I'm likely to talk more just to keep myself interested, as well as to get out everything I think about a subject when I have the opportunity.

I'm curious to know what "bullshit" you think I have a high tolerance for, if you want to elaborate on that. I think, in general I have a high tolerance for most things, really anything that doesn't push my emo-feeler buttons. :tongue:


----------



## Teybo

Fat Bozo said:


> Haha. I'm not offended in the slightest. Quite the opposite, I'm thankful for your perspective on these matters. I'm very much a "what you see is what you get" kind of guy, and when I don't see something, I don't pretend I do just for the sake of "getting along." I probably won't ever fully understand "Ni" (or "Ne" for that matter) but I have genuinely tried to listen to anyone's explanations that has been willing to try to help me with it.


Before I say anything more, I just want to say that I am grateful for the open and safe environment you create with your words. Thank you for that. Ok, moving on.

I think you've laid out quite an adequate explanation of introverted intuition here, but in opposites. In my experience (having an INFJ mom, an INFJ acquaintance, and being INFJ myself) I find that Ni-dominant people are very much at home with pretending (maybe not the right word) that they have some sort of expertise when they may actually not. Again, my wording is not precise here, but I think the gist is.



> I think I'm a pretty good listener, actually. But I'm more that way when I'm having a discussion with somebody about something really important to them personally, such as relationship issues or things like that. There's a personal connection there and something that surely holds my attention. The reality is that in the context of a video chat that's a lot more relaxed, I'm likely to talk more just to keep myself interested, as well as to get out everything I think about a subject when I have the opportunity.


Ah sorry, my statement was insensitive and broad. I agree with you that extraverts can be in tune with others (sometimes very in tune!). In the context of a video like this, though... yeah... introverts have to be quite pushy to even get a chance with extraverts.



> I'm curious to know what "bullshit" you think I have a high tolerance for, if you want to elaborate on that. I think, in general I have a high tolerance for most things, really anything that doesn't push my emo-feeler buttons. :tongue:


I don't know. I don't know you personally. And, as always, I don't really know what I'm saying. But, I don't know (ha!), you seem to just roll with the punches a bit more some people I know (and I'm associating this with your SFPness). Like your video with fihe where she just started doing something else while you were chatting. Or that video with jendragon (I think) where you guys had some sort of poor connection and you both kept having to jump in where the other was absent due to technical difficulties.

I guess I see theoretical discussion as one kind of bullshit, and the spontaneous improvisation you're capable of as another. Both bullshit, but two very different kinds. Is that fair?


----------



## Fat Bozo

Teybo said:


> Before I say anything more, I just want to say that I am grateful for the open and safe environment you create with your words. Thank you for that.


:happy: No problem.



> I think you've laid out quite an adequate explanation of introverted intuition here, but in opposites. In my experience (having an INFJ mom, an INFJ acquaintance, and being INFJ myself) I find that Ni-dominant people are very much at home with pretending (maybe not the right word) that they have some sort of expertise when they may actually not. Again, my wording is not precise here, but I think the gist is.


Are you talking about a comment I made in the "child function" video or something else?





> Ah sorry, my statement was insensitive and broad. I agree with you that extraverts can be in tune with others (sometimes very in tune!). In the context of a video like this, though... yeah... introverts have to be quite pushy to even get a chance with extraverts.


Ironically, it was another extravert - MegaTuxRacer - who was the first to actually tell me he felt like he couldn't get a word in edgewise with me. Actually, now that I think about it, I suppose that's not ironic at all, it makes sense that another E would be more bothered by that! But anyway, since then I've tried to be more aware of whether everybody involved in a conversation feels like they have had the chance to have their say, and I even asked Celebok that when we had our one-on-one chat. But yeah, sometimes it might take just interrupting me - Chrissy, the INTP I talked to last night had no problem doing that which is probly why we talked so long! (well that and we're both just so darn interesting!)





> I don't know. I don't know you personally. And, as always, I don't really know what I'm saying. But, I don't know (ha!), you seem to just roll with the punches a bit more some people I know (and I'm associating this with your SFPness). Like your video with fihe where she just started doing something else while you were chatting. Or that video with jendragon (I think) where you guys had some sort of poor connection and you both kept having to jump in where the other was absent due to technical difficulties.
> 
> I guess I see theoretical discussion as one kind of bullshit, and the spontaneous improvisation you're capable of as another. Both bullshit, but two very different kinds. Is that fair?


Yeah, fair enough. The thing with fihe did throw me a bit, but I wasn't offended in a "how could she do this to me?" kinda way, but more of a "hey, if you got something better to do, just tell me" kind of way. I have my buttons that can be pushed but I'm generally gonna always default to "no big deal, life goes on" when it comes to most issues that arise.


----------



## Teybo

Fat Bozo said:


> Are you talking about a comment I made in the "child function" video or something else?


Your comment in your reply to me just now:


Fat Bozo said:


> "I'm very much a "what you see is what you get" kind of guy, and when I don't see something, I don't pretend I do just for the sake of "getting along."


It seems like a great description of Se and why Ni is the opposite of Se. An Ni-dominant might "pretend" (again, maybe the wrong word) they see something just to see where it leads them. Lenore Thomson described Introverted Intuitions as not really ideas, but as...



Lenore Thomson said:


> trains at the edge of articulated knowledge. You can't claim them or advocate them. You put on a hat, grab hold of a boxcar door, and see where they go. Until these types (_Ni-dominants_) acquire enough information to map out the path they're taking, all they can do is insist on their need to take it.


So maybe two different kinds of improvisation? Se is improvisation in one meaning of the word, while Ni is improvisation in another? I don't know, just throwing it out there.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Teybo said:


> Your comment in your reply to me just now:
> 
> It seems like a great description of Se and why Ni is the opposite of Se. An Ni-dominant might "pretend" (again, maybe the wrong word) they see something just to see where it leads them. Lenore Thomson described Introverted Intuitions as not really ideas, but as...
> 
> 
> 
> So maybe two different kinds of improvisation? Se is improvisation in one meaning of the word, while Ni is improvisation in another? I don't know, just throwing it out there.


Ah ok. Interesting. I guess that kinda touches on what has frustrated me about the behavior of "Ni-dominants." But knowing that this is actually the first instinct of people has actually helped me to not get as upset at people like my parents (INFJ mom and INTJ dad) as well as a couple of INFJ friends/co-workers. It's like I've said in several different contexts - I may not ever fully understand it, and it may always frustrate me to a point, but I can live with it and learn to get along with people who have this as their primary function.


----------



## Teybo

Fat Bozo said:


> Ah ok. Interesting. I guess that kinda touches on what has frustrated me about the behavior of "Ni-dominants." But knowing that this is actually the first instinct of people has actually helped me to not get as upset at people like my parents (INFJ mom and INTJ dad) as well as a couple of INFJ friends/co-workers. It's like I've said in several different contexts - I may not ever fully understand it, and it may always frustrate me to a point, but I can live with it and learn to get along with people who have this as their primary function.


Oh, I enjoyed discussing this with you. I hope I wasn't too insistent or frustrating. I'm quite fascinated by your thoughts on introverted intuition, having had a lot of personal relationships with SFP's. If you don't mind me asking, what part of interacting with INJ's is frustrating to you? That they seem to be pulling stuff out of their asses all the time?


----------



## Ozman2988

Any INFP's or INFJ's or ENFJ's want to skype/google hangout?


----------



## Celebok

Teybo said:


> But, in a very self-centered way, I was really frustrated by the description of introverted intuition as being hard to describe. I was wishing that pneumoceptor was in the video to dispel things, and then I was wishing that I was in the video to just to chime in on this point, but regardless, here's my view: introverted intuition is not mysterious. It's not magical, mystical, or inexplicable. It's just not common, so society doesn't have a lot of reference points with which to talk about it. In my opinion, Ni is stupidly simple to explain (just like every other function!). An Ni-dominant person is going to first bring into their consciousness the subjective meaning of something before the objective reality of what they are seeing (or smelling, or hearing, or whatever) enters their consciousness. The meaning of a sensory experience is unconnected from the literal reality of sensory experience. That's all that Ni is. It's a perceptive perspective, and so whatever judgment is placed on the perceptions is secondary (in challenge to some of what was said in the video).


Thanks for that explanation. I think it's pretty unrealistic to get a decent explanation of Ni when the highest it ranks out of all the participants is tertiary, but we would've loved to have you or any other Ni-dom participate in the chat, for that very reason. 

But also, it was @pneumoceptor herself that I recall saying that Ni was hard to describe, but she was having trouble separating her Ni from Ti, which I suspect is mainly due to her profession and the people she works with, causing heavy use of her Ti.


----------



## Celebok

Fat Bozo said:


> Ironically, it was another extravert - MegaTuxRacer - who was the first to actually tell me he felt like he couldn't get a word in edgewise with me. Actually, now that I think about it, I suppose that's not ironic at all, it makes sense that another E would be more bothered by that!



I think you nailed it there! My lack of willpower to force myself into the conversation was typical of what I experience among extraverts in real life ALL THE TIME, so I'm pretty much used to it and didn't think it was anything unusual. So I can see why it would be another extravert who would notice when it happens to them.


----------



## firedell

@Celebok, thank you for the comedy at the beginning.


----------



## Celebok

firedell said:


> @_Celebok_, thank you for the comedy at the beginning.


Glad you liked it! :happy:


----------



## jendragon

Celebok said:


> I think you nailed it there! My lack of willpower to force myself into the conversation was typical of what I experience among extraverts in real life ALL THE TIME, so I'm pretty much used to it and didn't think it was anything unusual. So I can see why it would be another extravert who would notice when it happens to them.


And moderator fail. Going back over the videos, I saw a few times where you started to say something and I never gave you the floor, but in real time, I was trying so hard to give you an opening when you needed one--I just didn't always hear you. I think that was partially because your mic was set so much lower than ours, but I could have been looking for other cues instead of sound. And, @Teybo, the original plan was to have another introvert, partly for that reason, but schedules just didn't work out. {sigh} The best-laid plans of mice and dragons. I will do better, next time!


----------



## Meirsho

well i'm up for the next time..or any1 else that's in for a vid chat  i'm free for the next few hours


----------



## Teybo

jendragon said:


> And moderator fail. Going back over the videos, I saw a few times where you started to say something and I never gave you the floor, but in real time, I was trying so hard to give you an opening when you needed one--I just didn't always hear you. I think that was partially because your mic was set so much lower than ours, but I could have been looking for other cues instead of sound. And, @_Teybo_, the original plan was to have another introvert, partly for that reason, but schedules just didn't work out. {sigh} The best-laid plans of mice and dragons. I will do better, next time!


It was a great video! I hope I didn't come across as being mean or critical. All of you guys are fun to watch. And, of course, introverts gotta introvert and extraverts gotta extravert. Extraverts are nice to have around to take the attention and pressure off of us introverts


----------



## Celebok

jendragon said:


> And moderator fail. Going back over the videos, I saw a few times where you started to say something and I never gave you the floor, but in real time, I was trying so hard to give you an opening when you needed one--I just didn't always hear you. I think that was partially because your mic was set so much lower than ours, but I could have been looking for other cues instead of sound.


You may be right about the mic levels. I turned my mic level down a bit before the chat, in an attempt to eliminate the "Celebok Effect", as Fat Bozo calls it, that weird annoying distorted feedback that my channel produces when other people talk. And now I'm thinking maybe that was the wrong solution, because as I watch parts of the video, it seems that my sound level is way low whenever I start to talk, then it gradually comes up to a normal volume, as though Google+ is compensating for it. So my new theory is that my sound level is TOO low, and that Google+ is trying too hard to handle the inconsistency, thus causing the distorted feedback. It's all a matter of trial and error at this point.

All that to say, if technical issues were the main cause, then it's certainly not your fault for failing to hear when I'm trying to say something, especially if one of you is talking at the same time.


----------



## Kastor

I'd love to do this with someone as well


----------



## Fat Bozo

Kastor said:


> I'd love to do this with someone as well


Just let me know when, I'm pretty much always up for it!


----------



## Ozman2988

Kastor said:


> I'd love to do this with someone as well


Same here! I am always looking for people!


----------



## renna

Hey everyone, The ESTP, EJArendee, I did the interview with: 






wants to do an interaction video again with* ANYONE *who is interested. Message him on Youtube if you are interested


----------



## hallstrigity

@rd93 and I have a follow up video. Its a bit of a recap and then we cover some new material. Enjoy!


----------



## rd93

I started that video with "maybe not three hours this time" 

but then.....


----------



## hallstrigity

Yep - that's how we roll!

This thread relates to the Ne/Fe loop we talk about. It has the two types paired for looping. http://personalitycafe.com/articles/25205-dominant-tertiary-loops-common-personality-disorders.html


----------



## twstdude0to1

Anyone up for an all Feeler video/chat? Maybe all variations or just a few? Would love to interact and get to know all of my fellow Feelers out there! 

>>>ISFJ<<<


----------



## Fat Bozo

twstdude0to1 said:


> Anyone up for an all Feeler video/chat? Maybe all variations or just a few? Would love to interact and get to know all of my fellow Feelers out there!
> 
> >>>ISFJ<<<


Sure. It doesn't get any more Feeler than me! :tongue:


----------



## Ozman2988

Fat Bozo said:


> Sure. It doesn't get any more Feeler than me! :tongue:


Its a showdown  Anyways, Fat Bozo, I am really interested in having a video chat with you! Just let me know if you are down for that


----------



## twstdude0to1

Alright Bozo and Ozman, if you have Google+ add me (twstdude0to1). We'll figure out a good time to do the chat from there. Any other feelers are also welcome!


----------



## Fat Bozo

Ozman2988 said:


> Its a showdown  Anyways, Fat Bozo, I am really interested in having a video chat with you! Just let me know if you are down for that


Absolutely!



twstdude0to1 said:


> Alright Bozo and Ozman, if you have Google+ add me (twstdude0to1). We'll figure out a good time to do the chat from there. Any other feelers are also welcome!


Coolness.


----------



## Celebok

This place is about to get F'd up!!

(I stole that phrase from @Fat Bozo.)


----------



## Meirsho

*_feeling _left out *


----------



## Kabosu

I'd be cool with any potential interactions this week(end) and esp. next week.


----------



## twstdude0to1

Everyone who wants to do a Feeler videos with us just add me on Google+ @ twstdude0to1, we'll do a Google hangout. Also, let me know what time of day works for you, I'm looking at this weekend.


----------



## renna

Meirsho said:


> *_feeling _left out *


awww when I have time and after I promised I couple people to do an interaction vid, I'd love to do one with you!! It's just been crazy around here. It really has.


----------



## Meirsho

today-tommorow i'm able to actually push in when ever is compftrable for you a vid chat so who's game?


----------



## rubber soul

twstdude0to1 said:


> Alright Bozo and Ozman, if you have Google+ add me (twstdude0to1). We'll figure out a good time to do the chat from there. Any other feelers are also welcome!


I'm interested, but I have no idea how this works..? I'll just go ahead and add you on Google.


----------



## Ozman2988

Anyone available for some video chat?


----------



## Meirsho

who is in for a vid chat? like now?


----------



## donkeybals

hallstrigity said:


> ENTP ESTP interaction between me and EJArendee - Topics such as fame, competition, narcissism, histrionic tenancies and more fun!


Wow, great video! I think the NT video would work, and is a good idea. Not necessarily the topic - but just having NTs together to see how they interact is something I would definitely watch! Same with other types, NF's SJ's and SP'S.

Also, I've seen a lot of your video's in the past @EJARENDEE and they have all been very good and entertaining! Also, if I ever meet you on the streets' I look forward to walking into your house uninvited and playing your video games muwhaha! JK


----------



## Calvin

Anybody need an INTP for an interaction video? I'm in


----------



## hallstrigity

Calvin said:


> Anybody need an INTP for an interaction video? I'm in


Yes actually. Either one or more of the following 

4 Ne users video with 
ENFP Ozman2988
INFP - ?
ENTP - me
INTP - you 


4 NT's video

ENTP - Me
INTP - You
ENTJ - ?
INTJ - ?

or even just a one on one. Let me know what you think I've got some availability over the next few days and some of the weekend.


----------



## Calvin

Ok, what is required to do these videos?


----------



## hallstrigity

Calvin said:


> Ok, what is required to do these videos?



A webcam/mic/headphones and a Google/youtube account. Then a couple sec dl of google hangout app - https://tools.google.com/dlpage/hangoutplugin

If you want to do a quick one on one vid - i'm around for the nxt two hours - send me a gmail address for the invite. Otherwise I should be free like 9pm or so tonight, early morning tomorrow, midday Friday. Saturday/sunday afternoon. 

Calling all NTJ's or an INFP for one of the group options -- NE 1 out there?


----------



## Calvin

On second thought, my home isn't private enough for an interaction vid; too many people right now. Better count me out


----------



## Meirsho

back home  who's in for a chat today?


----------



## Kabosu

spring break is essentially starting for me - sure.


----------



## Kabosu

Video @Meirsho and I did yesterday:





Didn't bother doing any real edits from the real thing, but I think this can be followed rather easily.


----------



## Dan E

hallstrigity said:


> A webcam/mic/headphones and a Google/youtube account. Then a couple sec dl of google hangout app - https://tools.google.com/dlpage/hangoutplugin
> 
> If you want to do a quick one on one vid - i'm around for the nxt two hours - send me a gmail address for the invite. Otherwise I should be free like 9pm or so tonight, early morning tomorrow, midday Friday. Saturday/sunday afternoon.
> 
> Calling all NTJ's or an INFP for one of the group options -- NE 1 out there?


"Ne 1 out there"

Was that intentional?


----------



## hallstrigity

Dan E said:


> "Ne 1 out there"
> 
> Was that intentional?


Mayhaps? I remember writing it and asking myself "why? wouldn't be easier the normal way?" in the action and just going -nope that's how I want it. I think the subconscious process was probably replacing "any" with "NE" as a natural consequence of the fact one of the groups was NE purposed. Sequentially to the fact that any was being replaced one could no longer be one so its 1. So if that's why its weird - that's my best explanation for why but that's just how i wanted it to come out - its not trying to be funny or stupid. Am I missing another angle? Plural vrs singular? I think people think ENTP's make a lot of jokes in their communication when in fact they are just talking and it just falls out the way it does. Although "mayhaps" is fully intentional/premeditated..... but the NE 1 just was and i didn't feel like changing it.


Well anyhow - wanna join the panel? or do a simple interaction vid sometime?


----------



## Dan E

hallstrigity said:


> Mayhaps? I remember writing it and asking myself "why? wouldn't be easier the normal way?" in the action and just going -nope that's how I want it. I think the subconscious process was probably replacing "any" with "NE" as a natural consequence of the fact one of the groups was NE purposed. Sequentially to the fact that any was being replaced one could no longer be one so its 1. So if that's why its weird - that's my best explanation for why but that's just how i wanted it to come out - its not trying to be funny or stupid. Am I missing another angle? Plural vrs singular? I think people think ENTP's make a lot of jokes in their communication when in fact they are just talking and it just falls out the way it does. Although "mayhaps" is fully intentional/premeditated..... but the NE 1 just was and i didn't feel like changing it.
> 
> 
> Well anyhow - wanna join the panel? or do a simple interaction vid sometime?



That sounds lovely. I'll be available this weekend and for most hours of the following week.


----------



## hallstrigity

Calvin said:


> On second thought, my home isn't private enough for an interaction vid; too many people right now. Better count me out


I hope I wasn't overbearing -but I'll try harder to be anyway - Up to joining the NT version this weekend? We seem to have procured an INTJ.




Dan E said:


> That sounds lovely. I'll be available this weekend and for most hours of the following week.


Great! Lets see if we can assemble a group or we can just roll w/o if it fails.



So this would mean that we are looking for a willing ENTJ at least yet, possibly an INTP as well. Let me know!


----------



## Boy Wonder

Ahh, so i have found the melting pot of gold, at the end of a 16 color rainbow...wonderful. I had no idea that those youtube videos had an actual thread!

...The catalyst for wild times has arrived.


----------



## hallstrigity

Dan E (INTJ) and I talk about our types covering things such as opposing intuitive functioning, moral/ethical value systems and teamwork. Enjoy!


----------



## twstdude0to1

ISFJ looking for someone to do a Google hangout video with! Preferably some other feelers  Google plus twstdude0to1 for username and Bob Dole (dummy full name)


----------



## Fat Bozo

twstdude0to1 said:


> ISFJ looking for someone to do a Google hangout video with! Preferably some other feelers  Google plus twstdude0to1 for username and Bob Dole (dummy full name)


I'd love to, Bob! :tongue:

I'm about to do one with somebody else on a specific topic, but after we get done, I'd be happy to chat with you if you're still available.


----------



## twstdude0to1

Fat Bozo said:


> I'd love to, Bob! :tongue:
> 
> I'm about to do one with somebody else on a specific topic, but after we get done, I'd be happy to chat with you if you're still available.



Aha, sounds good. I'll be around for a few hours


----------



## Fat Bozo

twstdude0to1 said:


> Aha, sounds good. I'll be around for a few hours


Hey, are you still up for it tonight, or is it too late?


----------



## twstdude0to1

Fat Bozo said:


> Hey, are you still up for it tonight, or is it too late?


Nope, I'm still up!


----------



## Fat Bozo

twstdude0to1 said:


> Nope, I'm still up!


Okay, well I'm starving, so I gotta eat something. But I eat fast, so I'll send you a PM here when I get done, and I've got the Hangout started.


----------



## twstdude0to1

Fat Bozo said:


> Okay, well I'm starving, so I gotta eat something. But I eat fast, so I'll send you a PM here when I get done, and I've got the Hangout started.


Okay sweet


----------



## Fat Bozo

Well, I had a very full day yesterday, and it included two video chats, the first of which actually had a theme, and I realize is very long, I plan to chop it into parts at some point for easier digestion, but in the meantime here's the unedited version in all its glory:


----------



## Fat Bozo

And then after I got done with that, I had a nice chat with twstdude0to1 which was more general and about half as long but still very fun:

​




Feedback is welcome as always, and drop me a line if you'd like to be part of my "Faith and Type" video series, because I'm open to all types and all faiths for that, and would love to get more people willing to talk about those subjects with me. :happy:


----------



## Fat Bozo

And today I got to chat with the sweet and lovely kfarb (INFP) and here is the evidence:


----------



## teddy564339

@Fat Bozo @twstdude0to1


Wow, this is really cool! This is the first time I get to see someone of my own type do a video chat. This is especially true because as Evan mentioned, there are some really interesting differences between ISFJ males and ISFJ females, so it made it even better having the gender the same as well.

And that’s what I think is so cool about type…I like seeing how two people of the same type can have so many similarities and yet so many differences at the same time.

One point that stood out to me a bit was how Fat Bozo said he felt differently than NFPs in the aspect that he doesn’t feel like people should be anything. Even though this came up in other chats, I think it’s interesting to see that difference in SFPs and NFPs. The NFPs I know feel very strongly and very passionately about changing things to make improvements…they focus very much on how things should be. In that regard, SFPs are much more easy-going and accepting. Of course, there are downsides to that as well, just like with anything concerning type.

I can see the aspect of an ESTP being difficult to handle as a child/teenager. I would imagine that there is some more rebellion among P types in general. Of course, being a parent of any type presents its own kind of challenges too, I’m sure.

It was interesting to hear Fat Bozo talking about STPs messing with people. It makes me wonder what motivates them exactly. I see some similar things in NTPs sometimes. 

Fe vs. Fi is always an interesting topic to look into and talk about. I do think the main difference is that Fi is so deep and so personal. I think that’s why Fat Bozo said it could be more explosive. Fe tends to be more of a universal way of feeling where everyone is on the same page, which is probably why it comes across as more even-keeled. 

But I also agree with Fat Bozo that Fe tends to suppress emotion more, whereas Fi is probably more open to everyone just feeling what they naturally feel. I think that’s why Fe causes trouble for me sometimes too, because I feel the need to repress my feelings to be accepted by others.

I do think it’s interesting to think about how NTs’ emotions manifest themselves. It’s a complex topic, at least to me.

I can see the notion of SFPs getting along with kids better than SFJs, only in the regard that like we said, Fe kind of suppresses emotions and kind of sets up “social rules”. So I think for me, even though personally I still feel very child-like, I often feel a need to come across as more mature and more serious than I often truly feel.


But I definitely agree that when two SJ (or even just J) types disagree on something, then the potential for conflict is completely huge, and both are likely to be very stubborn. 


So yeah, cool chat!


----------



## Meirsho

Fat Bozo said:


> And then after I got done with that, I had a nice chat with twstdude0to1 which was more general and about half as long but still very fun:
> 
> ​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Feedback is welcome as always, and drop me a line if you'd like to be part of my "Faith and Type" video series, because I'm open to all types and all faiths for that, and would love to get more people willing to talk about those subjects with me. :happy:


jeff,this is the frist chat vid (ever done by any1) that i actualy enjoyed watching  great job guys^^


----------



## Fat Bozo

Meirsho said:


> jeff,this is the frist chat vid (ever done by any1) that i actualy enjoyed watching  great job guys^^


Hey, thanks! Was there something in particular that made it different from other chats to make it more appealing?


----------



## Meirsho

well mainy the chemistry between the 2 of you and you talked a lot about estp's and i really enjoyed that, i mean it was too slow paced and calm for my taste but listening to you guys while photoshoping some new pics i took was realy cool..


----------



## Meirsho

who's up for some vid chatting now? like right now!!


----------



## twstdude0to1

Meirsho said:


> well mainy the chemistry between the 2 of you and you talked a lot about estp's and i really enjoyed that, i mean it was too slow paced and calm for my taste but listening to you guys while photoshoping some new pics i took was realy cool..



Yeah, I think the both of us seemed to articulate our point too much. If we hadn't, I'm sure the video could have been half as long. In the end, it was fun doing my first type interaction video. I'm up for some more whenever anyone wants to do one. Just PM me!


----------



## Teybo

Meirsho said:


> jeff,this is the frist chat vid (ever done by any1) that i actualy enjoyed watching  great job guys^^


Leave it to an ESTP to put it bluntly.


----------



## Dyslexicon

I enjoy these interaction videos very much! Thanks a lot!


----------



## Dyslexicon

teddy564339 said:


> @_Fat Bozo_ @_twstdude0to1_
> I do think it’s interesting to think about how NTs’ emotions manifest themselves. It’s a complex topic, at least to me.


I think we do it by messing with people.


----------



## yarrboots

INTP...and everybody else


----------



## Ozman2988

Meirsho said:


> who's up for some vid chatting now? like right now!!


Hey let me know when you are down for a interaction video


----------



## PurpleApple

I would be willing to do one sometime.


----------



## hallstrigity

The ozman and I rock it out in the early morning hours - in pure Ne defiance.


----------



## Kitfool

I wanted to do this before, but I was scared. Also, I have a very vague understanding of how a webcam works. I still really want to do it at some point, but those same hangups are still present. XD 

List of types I would love to chat with specifically:
INFP
ISFJ
ISTJ
ENFP
Another ESFP?
ESTP? (might be scary but maybe not)
ISTP?
ESFJ

Anything I did not list sounds kind of stressful, but could be interesting.  Let me know if you are interested.


----------



## Fat Bozo

roastingmallows said:


> I wanted to do this before, but I was scared. Also, I have a very vague understanding of how a webcam works. I still really want to do it at some point, but those same hangups are still present. XD
> 
> List of types I would love to chat with specifically:
> 
> *Another ESFP?*
> 
> 
> Anything I did not list sounds kind of stressful, but could be interesting.  Let me know if you are interested.


Here I am, babe. I'll chat any time.


----------



## Meirsho

hey 
i'm in for some chatting^^ just got back from work so i'm in for ome chatting for like the next 6 hrs 
i'm in for any1 i've not chatted with- @*roastingmallows @**Ozman2988 - i don't bite  send me a pm if you can in the next 6 hrs from the posting of this post^^*


----------



## Kitfool

@FatBozo and @Meirsho were actually at the top of my list. Lets do eet.


----------



## Fat Bozo

roastingmallows said:


> @FatBozo and @_Meirsho_ were actually at the top of my list. Lets do eet.


Don't forget pneumoceptor too, she just posted in the esfp section that she's looking for an esfp female!

But yeah just tell me when's good for you and I'm there.


----------



## PurpleApple

roastingmallows said:


> I wanted to do this before, but I was scared. Also, I have a very vague understanding of how a webcam works. I still really want to do it at some point, but those same hangups are still present. XD
> 
> List of types I would love to chat with specifically:
> INFP
> ISFJ
> ISTJ
> ENFP
> Another ESFP?
> ESTP? (might be scary but maybe not)
> ISTP?
> ESFJ
> 
> Anything I did not list sounds kind of stressful, but could be interesting.  Let me know if you are interested.


i'd be interested. INFP here


----------



## Fat Bozo

Here's my on-the-road "video apology" to Celebok for missing our planned chat on Saturday:






...and here's the actual chat that we got to today!


----------



## Fat Bozo

I drove 100 miles (and back) for this very special interaction video with my younger brother (ISTP):


----------



## Kitfool

PurpleApple said:


> i'd be interested. INFP here


Alright, an INFP, my favorite! When are you available?


----------



## Kitfool

@pneumoceptor I'm down! I even know how to use my webcam now thanks to @Meirsho haha


----------



## Kitfool

Oh yeah, I'd be available later tonight if anyone else is.


----------



## pneumoceptor

roastingmallows said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ I'm down! I even know how to use my webcam now thanks to @_Meirsho_ haha


Hey, thanks for responding! I already scheduled a chat with an ESFP a bit closer to my age, but I'll keep you in mind for future 'group work' that I'm planning...


----------



## voicetrocity

Fat Bozo said:


> Here's my on-the-road "video apology" to Celebok for missing our planned chat on Saturday:


I consider myself a "scanner" when I'm driving as well. Really interesting video, and I saw some Te in there!


----------



## hallstrigity

Looking for ENFJ female for interaction video per specific viewer request - I know some that don't know MBTI in RL but don't know of any off hand on here. Also still looking for ENTJ for interaction video and possible future NT panel. Well hell how about I make a list 




I'd like to do interaction vids with one or more of the following sometime in the near future:

ENFJ - female if possible per viewer request
ENTJ
INFJ

Hit me up if you wanna make a vid!


----------



## twstdude0to1

Anyone want an ISFJ to be apart of their chats? I'd love to chat with some other types


----------



## twstdude0to1

roastingmallows said:


> I wanted to do this before, but I was scared. Also, I have a very vague understanding of how a webcam works. I still really want to do it at some point, but those same hangups are still present. XD
> 
> List of types I would love to chat with specifically:
> INFP
> ISFJ
> ISTJ
> ENFP
> Another ESFP?
> ESTP? (might be scary but maybe not)
> ISTP?
> ESFJ
> 
> Anything I did not list sounds kind of stressful, but could be interesting.  Let me know if you are interested.


Add me to your ISFJ  I'll do a chat!


----------



## Figure

I finally have the time for this again. Anyone interested, shoot a message


----------



## clairdelunatic

I am an NF AND a Geek. Where. Do. I. Sign. Up.


----------



## Kitfool

twstdude0to1 said:


> Add me to your ISFJ  I'll do a chat!


Hellz yeah!


----------



## twstdude0to1

Hey all, 

I was wondering if there are ESTP's out there that would chat with me? Specifically a Female ESTP (if possible). I need some advice about dealing with an ESTP...


----------



## rd93

roastingmallows said:


> I wanted to do this before, but I was scared. Also, I have a very vague understanding of how a webcam works. I still really want to do it at some point, but those same hangups are still present. XD
> 
> List of types I would love to chat with specifically:
> INFP
> ISFJ
> ISTJ
> ENFP
> Another ESFP?
> ESTP? (might be scary but maybe not)
> ISTP?
> ESFJ
> 
> Anything I did not list sounds kind of stressful, but could be interesting.  Let me know if you are interested.


I'd love to fill that last spot on your list. But it might take a while (maybe a week).


----------



## pneumoceptor

Hello!

The lovely ESFP @voicetrocity and I had a chat the other day...


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> Hello!
> 
> The lovely ESFP @_voicetrocity_ and I had a chat the other day...



BOUT TIME! :wink:

I caught the end of this live the other day, but I'm looking forward to seeing it from the beginning.


----------



## Kitfool

rd93 said:


> I'd love to fill that last spot on your list. But it might take a while (maybe a week).


Yes! Please remind me when you're ready. I am always down for doing stuff, but I usually need a reminder!


----------



## Fat Bozo

roastingmallows said:


> Yes! Please remind me when you're ready. I am always down for doing stuff, but I usually need a reminder!


okay HERE'S YOUR REMINDER YOU SAID YOU'D CHAT WITH MEEEEEE... :wink:


----------



## Kitfool

Fat Bozo said:


> okay HERE'S YOUR REMINDER YOU SAID YOU'D CHAT WITH MEEEEEE... :wink:


I would love to make it happen! I'm available for the next three hours today, possibly tomorrow in the day time, and monday and tuesday afternoon.


----------



## Fat Bozo

roastingmallows said:


> I would love to make it happen! I'm available for the next three hours today, possibly tomorrow in the day time, and monday and tuesday afternoon.


I'd love to do it tomorrow if that works out for you, just let me know when you're available!


----------



## Kitfool

Fat Bozo said:


> I'd love to do it tomorrow if that works out for you, just let me know when you're available!


Sometime between 1 and 3 pm would be best, I think.


----------



## Kitfool

That's central time


----------



## Fat Bozo

roastingmallows said:


> Sometime between 1 and 3 pm would be best, I think.


Okie doke! Just send me a PM tomorrow when you're ready to start with your Gmail address and I'll send an invite! :happy:


----------



## Fat Bozo

My life is just a little more complete tonight, as I had my long-awaited appearance on NF Geeks!! roud:





















May you enjoy watching them as much as I enjoyed being a part of them!! :happy:


----------



## hallstrigity

Interaction vid with thehotavocado (INFJ) God i need to go to bed.


----------



## Meirsho

monica!!!so sweet  i actually saw more then 15min...


----------



## hallstrigity

Lol glad I got your attention there @Meirsho lol!. Still looking for following types -especially with the upcoming Friday holiday

ENTJ
ISTJ
ENFJ
INTP

Hit me up!


----------



## Kabosu

anyone who hasn't interacted with me want to do one? is anyone who has in a decent mood to do another one? not required but fun.


----------



## Dyslexicon

I wish my English was better, than I'd definitely be up for one. 
I very much enjoy watching these interactions - very interesting and great fun too^^ Your are all so cute!


----------



## hallstrigity

atypeofuser said:


> anyone who hasn't interacted with me want to do one? is anyone who has in a decent mood to do another one? not required but fun.



ENTP -ENTP vid sometime?


----------



## hallstrigity

Dyslexicon said:


> I wish my English was better, than I'd definitely be up for one.
> I very much enjoy watching these interactions - very interesting and great fun too^^ Your are all so cute!


C'mon I bet its better than you think. Tho i do tend to bounce topically so I might be rough.


----------



## Dyslexicon

hallstrigity said:


> C'mon I bet its better than you think. Tho i do tend to bounce topically so I might be rough.


Haha, especially with my fun spelling mistakes in the first post. :tongue:
Bouncing is OK, but I think I'll just watch and sip my coffee for now :kitteh:


----------



## Kabosu

hallstrigity said:


> ENTP -ENTP vid sometime?


That sounds good to me. Most times from now through the weekend are fine for me so far.


----------



## Quietude

hallstrigity said:


> Interaction vid with thehotavocado (INFJ) God i need to go to bed.


Talking bad about WI? I'm offended..






...nah, I'm not, I just had to say that.:tongue:


----------



## Choice

Anybody able to record vid + explain Fi who's not busy next weekend?


----------



## perfectcircle

This time, I'm really going to do one of these.

I will set a time. Tomorrow at 5:00 PM.

Anyone want to do one with me? I will take any and all types, but I'd prefer to do a type that is not an NFP.

Also my time zone is Pacific Time Zone in case you are somewhere else on this Earth.


----------



## rd93

Here is an interaction series I did with an INTP today (youtube user 999GreenEyes). The first two parts are a bit shaky because we were having connection difficulties, but parts 3/4 are pretty good.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Choice said:


> Anybody able to record vid + explain Fi who's not busy next weekend?


I'll do my best! :happy:


----------



## hallstrigity

adverseaffects said:


> This time, I'm really going to do one of these.
> 
> I will set a time. Tomorrow at 5:00 PM.
> 
> Anyone want to do one with me? I will take any and all types, but I'd prefer to do a type that is not an NFP.
> 
> Also my time zone is Pacific Time Zone in case you are somewhere else on this Earth.



No promises - but we'll see what I'm up to around that time - I also owe an interaction to @atypeofuser so perhaps he'd be up to joing or even might want to join in the fun or something. No promises - i've had to neglect my mbti hobby for a bit due to life


----------



## Kabosu

Wouldn't mind it being done all as one.
Possibly in the night, as that's 7pm my time and I may have other plans earlier on.


----------



## hallstrigity

adverseaffects said:


> This time, I'm really going to do one of these.
> 
> I will set a time. Tomorrow at 5:00 PM.
> 
> Anyone want to do one with me? I will take any and all types, but I'd prefer to do a type that is not an NFP.
> 
> Also my time zone is Pacific Time Zone in case you are somewhere else on this Earth.



Hmm I seem to have miffed this - But i am around and will keep tabs on the cafe. anyone else up for a hangout -maybe make a group even even -lol.


----------



## hallstrigity

heres a vid not sold on the ENFJ but it may be an interesting watch. I downplay visual cue typeing as this girl has been told that by visual reading she is ENFP, I would argue INFJ as I do in the vid and she doesn't seem to mind. But yeah not a fan of visual reading or Podlair, period.


----------



## MxBlinkPx

I didn't really get the intuitive vibe from her. Reminded me of interactions with @fihe. I'd go XSFJ with an introvert lean. Seemed like a few disconnects during the conversation, like the cat parasite/virus part.


----------



## Teybo

Makes me sad to see that the pod people have confused that young woman.


----------



## hallstrigity

Teybo said:


> Makes me sad to see that the pod people have confused that young woman.



Yes it is quite frustrating - for this reason I contacted her a few weeks back and am not exactly supportive of the witchdoctor typing which has been pitched at her - while also trying to remain amiable for effect.




MxBlinkPx said:


> I didn't really get the intuitive vibe from her. Reminded me of interactions with @fihe. I'd go XSFJ with an introvert lean. Seemed like a few disconnects during the conversation, like the cat parasite/virus part.


I think you are likely right - and at one point I considered changing the argument in this direction - but was still having enough cover with even asserting Aux Fe - that I felt taking N from someone might end up being even less well received - perhaps another time, I am patient in things such as this. Her explanations from school seemed to try to be coming from an intuitive perspective - but don't quite hit the mark which definitely did have me thinking about likely low Ne as opposed to higher Ni. Don't specifically remember what she said in response to the T. Gondii - but I do agree that you have a point.


----------



## rd93

Fat Bozo said:


> I realized I never posted my video with INTP Chrissy.


This is a bit late, but she reminds me so much of one of my INTP friends. Everything down to her physical mannerisms is almost exactly the same.


----------



## Geoffrey

@Iustinus and I talk MBTI, including about some INFJ-INFP communication issues and differences.


----------



## Geoffrey

@Teybo and I talk MBTI!


----------



## Geoffrey

@Brownicus and I talk MBTI!


----------



## lordmercurio

roastingmallows said:


> I wanted to do this before, but I was scared. Also, I have a very vague understanding of how a webcam works. I still really want to do it at some point, but those same hangups are still present. XD
> 
> List of types I would love to chat with specifically:
> INFP
> ISFJ
> ISTJ
> ENFP
> Another ESFP?
> ESTP? (might be scary but maybe not)
> ISTP?
> ESFJ
> 
> Anything I did not list sounds kind of stressful, but could be interesting.  Let me know if you are interested.


entjs are not stressfull


----------



## Meirsho

any1 in for an estp?


----------



## Fat Bozo

My latest video in the "Faith and Type" series was with INFP John:






Some really fascinating stuff here, I hated to bring it to an end but I was about to pass out from hunger so I had to go! :tongue:


----------



## hallstrigity

ne 1 around the good ole udtubes about now?


----------



## hallstrigity

Well golly geeze folks thespspazz and I just be bringing down the house with our vids! Here's a vid with me and Visionary Lust Enjoy!. @Fat Bozo u realize you created a monster just two months ago - right?


----------



## Fat Bozo

hallstrigity said:


> Well golly geeze folks thespspazz and I just be bringing down the house with our vids! Here's a vid with me and Visionary Lust Enjoy!. @_Fat Bozo_ u realize you created a monster just two months ago - right?


Just call me Dr. Frankenstein? This one is definitely in my "watch later" list. But I think I'm still like 2 hours in to one of your previous 3 hour marathons! :wink:


----------



## Finaille

I have been on the site for quite a while; how in the world did I miss this awesome thread?!?!?!

I'd really like to have a chance to talk to somebody extremely well versed in MBTI and Enneagram, doesn't matter what type, I love perspective. 

Long story short, I went through a very rough time period a few years ago. In that time, I typed Enneagram 6w7. My therapist typed me ENFP through letter defintion, not functions (though I highly agree that I am likely a Ne-dom or aux). Now that I'm out of the clutches of a poor parent-child relationship and have fostered independence and ability to make my own decisions without guilt influence, I retook MBTI (and cognitive order, Enneagram...), I got some wild results. 

I would certainly love to have general conversation as well!


----------



## Fat Bozo

Well, it's only fitting that the person who has made me work the hardest in my life, my son Morgan, would also be the one whose video was the hardest to edit. iMovie was a real punk with this one but after 2 weeks of fighting with it, I gave up and uploaded what I have to Youtube. So, enjoy this 3-part chat with my son. DISCLAIMER: VIDEO CONTAINS RELENTLESS ESTP TEENAGER. VIEWER DISCRETION IS ADVISED.

If you think you can handle it...

​




Part 2 (hacked down to 10 minutes due to audio sync issues):






And finally...Part 3:


----------



## Ellis Bell

@Fat Bozo, your son is hysterical! I enjoyed these.


----------



## Teybo

Your son reminds me very strongly of my best guy friend in high school. Before we were close friends, he bullied me in a really emotionally scarring way, but we ended up patching things up, I forgave him, and we became best friends. I feel pretty certain he was an ESTP, even though he was very shy in school (and was labeled with a "learning disorder" but I think he was actually a pretty smart guy, just not interested in paying attention to teachers and doing homework). In his 20's he really came out of his shell. (a little too much, actually. Maybe he was making up for lost time?)

Anyway, the resemblance is quite apparent to me, and it's absolutely fascinating to hear and see a young ESTP (also, a bit exhausting!). Thank you to the two of you for the vids.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Did my latest "Faith and Type" video yesterday with INTP Raymond. This was interesting because it was the first one I've done with somebody who no longer considers himself a Christian. So we get into his personal journey, as well as whether spirituality really exists outside of the "thinking vs feeling" dichotomy.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Yikes! Look at how much I've been missing by being offline for a while! I've gotta lot of vid catching up to do!
@Fat Bozo - I've been reading "Please Understand Me II" and keep thinking about how well you know your Keirsey stuff, I'm in love with their NF section... :kitteh:


----------



## hallstrigity

Allright everyone here is the interaction of the year! SOME of us don't even need other types to interact with. I present to you --- *THE ENTP / PAN* interaction. :laughing: Enjoy!


----------



## hallstrigity

Well geeze folks nada on the pan huh... Here's a real person tho- A long awaited interaction with a reputable PerC you-tuber 

http://youtu.be/wiCXQ4oYxUk


----------



## magi83

Been away from the boards for a while but funnily enough have still been thinking about MBTI a lot, usually on the bus to and from work.

I keep thinking that I would really like to do an interaction video. Happy to speak to any type but my ulterior motive is to clarify my thinking around my own type so ideally an NF. Send me a PM if you're keen.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

So I'm not sure why but there is no picture - is that right? I can't really pause it either, I can hear people talking but .....




hallstrigity said:


> Well geeze folks nada on the pan huh... Here's a real person tho- A long awaited interaction with a reputable PerC you-tuber
> 
> http://youtu.be/wiCXQ4oYxUk


----------



## Lady Lullaby

hallstrigity said:


> Well geeze folks nada on the pan huh... Here's a real person tho- A long awaited interaction with a reputable PerC you-tuber
> 
> http://youtu.be/wiCXQ4oYxUk


Really cool to see Ne/Ti and Ni/Te flow!! Lots of fun! I was definitely on an enneagram stint a while back -- and after a few months break I returned to typology really loving the idea of 'the grip'. Been reviewing Naomi Quenk's "Was That Really Me?" My ESTJ daughter puts her ISFP sister in her grip and vice versa LOL! I just have to be careful to not put my INTP into his grip....luckily, no Se-doms in the household to put me into mine 
@hallstrigity I want to talk more about the Fe-defensive use - just to have you clear it up for me a bit maybe....

It was interesting to hear when each of you turn inward and when you branch out. It was also interesting to hear you both have a good vent about your Fe-preferring moms hahah. Makes me a little glad I only have daughters - - I think I've seen all 4 of my brothers have the same reactions towards my ISFJ mom so maybe it's just a son vs mom thing and not always a thinking/feeling thing....but that is sort of the classic male/female generalization too isn't it? (men=thinking, women=feeling). I wonder what a feeling son feels with a thinking mom.....or is the mom the one thinking 'give me some flippin' space! ? Hahahaha. hmmmmm


----------



## Doctorjuice

Looking for ENTJs to converse with or do a video correspondence with. Any takers?


----------



## Fat Bozo

It was about time I did a video with Lady Lullaby! :happy:






It was lots of fun. The time flew and we covered some good topics.

Don't just watch the first few minutes or else you'll miss which letter of the alphabet I don't trust to begin an author's name. :wink:


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Fat Bozo said:


> It was about time I did a video with Lady Lullaby! :happy:
> 
> 
> It was lots of fun. The time flew and we covered some good topics.
> 
> Don't just watch the first few minutes or else you'll miss which letter of the alphabet I don't trust to begin an author's name. :wink:


 It seems like for most vids it takes getting to the 2nd half for things to really get rolling and to talk about the good stuff...or maybe it just takes that long for the introverts to really get rolling? What do you think? I appreciated the food for thought from our chat. I also think it is really cool how MBTI can bridge the S/N divide, or the SP/NF divide. I think it is a really awesome resource. I can tell that your sharing of typology with others in your life has really benefited them and improved your relationships, and my own experience has been similar. I feel all warm and fuzzy today with being apart of the PerC/MBTI club! Thanks again - it was fun. :kitteh:


----------



## Celebok

Fat Bozo said:


> It was about time I did a video with Lady Lullaby! :happy:


Okay, well, I'm feeling pretty stupid right about now. I've been talking online with @Lady Lullaby on and off for like 7 months, and I've never asked her to do an interaction video with me! That is just somehow... not right! Anyway, I'm really looking forward to watching this!


----------



## Flatlander

Celebok said:


> Okay, well, I'm feeling pretty stupid right about now. I've been talking online with @_Lady Lullaby_ on and off for like 7 months, and I've never asked her to do an interaction video with me! That is just somehow... not right! Anyway, I'm really looking forward to watching this!


I'd be interested in watching it.


----------



## kfarb

Here's the video of Kev (ISTP) and I chatting. We've been married for 3 years and friends for 14, though we're about to go back to just being friends. I think he does a great job explaining his personality though.


----------



## magi83

Doctorjuice said:


> Looking for ENTJs to converse with or do a video correspondence with. Any takers?


Well, I'm not an ENTJ but the rate of volunteers seems to have slowed so if you're keen to have an interaction with a "common as muck on Personality Cafe" INFJ let me know.


----------



## Doctorjuice

magi83 said:


> Well, I'm not an ENTJ but the rate of volunteers seems to have slowed so if you're keen to have an interaction with a "common as muck on Personality Cafe" INFJ let me know.


I'm up for that.


----------



## magi83

Doctorjuice said:


> I'm up for that.


Cool. 

I'm GMT +10 (East Coast Australia). I'm more or less free all day tomorrow (Sunday) after 10 a.m. Might be a bit difficult during the week due to time differences.


----------



## lordmercurio

magi83 said:


> Well, I'm not an ENTJ but the rate of volunteers seems to have slowed so if you're keen to have an interaction with a "common as muck on Personality Cafe" INFJ let me know.


i was expecting some entj answer this, i dont have too much knowledgment about mbtiand thats why i dont answer it; there is many entjs that know more than me about this subject


----------



## Doctorjuice

magi83 said:


> Cool.
> 
> I'm GMT +10 (East Coast Australia). I'm more or less free all day tomorrow (Sunday) after 10 a.m. Might be a bit difficult during the week due to time differences.


Haha, tomorrow will probably not work, but if I find myself with time I will let you know.



lordmercurio said:


> i was expecting some entj answer this, i dont have too much knowledgment about mbtiand thats why i dont answer it; there is many entjs that know more than me about this subject


I'll take any ENTJ I can get. Lol


----------



## koenigscat

OP, I could stare at your avatar for hours, so hypnotizing


----------



## Figure

hallstrigity said:


> Well geeze folks nada on the pan huh... Here's a real person tho- A long awaited interaction with a reputable PerC you-tuber
> 
> http://youtu.be/wiCXQ4oYxUk


Haha thanks for putting this up. I still hate the fact that the audio absolutely sucked for it. 

Anyone want to take a swing at another one?


----------



## Teybo

Figure said:


> Haha thanks for putting this up. I still hate the fact that the audio absolutely sucked for it.
> 
> Anyone want to take a swing at another one?


Would you be interested in talking to an INFJ? 

I have some topics in mind: 

Being an NJ and coping with the tug between intuition and judging
NJ values
Love and relationships through the eyes of an NT vs NF
Careers and intuitives
What J's can learn from P's (and vice versa)
How INTP's differ from INTJ's
And of course, there are my favorite topics: siblings, family, and type

EDIT:

Oops, forgot two big ones that have been on my mind:
INTJ's and the arts
Emotional Stability and INTJ's

EDIT2, EDIT HARDER:

If you are a reader of this thread (surprise, you are!) and you are interested in any of these topics, PM me.


----------



## Snolanda

I think this is a really cool idea and I would love to partake, (That is if you don't mind a newbie) granted my appearance is rather... different. I love to theorize about and around personality theory, I know the most about myself and currently I'm learning about ENFPs. I think I could provide good insight into my type if anyone wanted to pick my brain apart. I've been through depression recently and am at the heart of my late teens where emotions still run high. 

So yea, sign me up :3 I have Skype so if you do want to chat just drop me a message in my inbox or on my wall (in the event I don't check back here):wink:


----------



## renna

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Guess who visited me?


Gotta love those thumbnails


----------



## hallstrigity

Catchin up on vids there are some cool ones out there - and here's another interaction just for fun


----------



## pneumoceptor

@teddy564339, your analyses were fun to read. I'm gonna show them to my mom .


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> @_teddy564339_, your analyses were fun to read. I'm gonna show them to my mom .


Yeah, I agree.

I enjoyed your video a lot too but I'm not about to write a point by point breakdown of it.

Se vs Si or something, whatever. :tongue:


----------



## MegaTuxRacer

Fat Bozo said:


> Se vs Si or something, whatever. :tongue:


Subjective relevance to what is vs. what is.


----------



## Fat Bozo

MegaTuxRacer said:


> Subjective relevance to what is vs. what is.


I don't know what this means, but since you quoted me, it gave me a notification, so I like it. :happy:


----------



## renna

Fat Bozo said:


> I don't know what this means, but since you quoted me, it gave me a notification, so I like it. :happy:


I laughed out loud. That's worthy of telling.


----------



## Fat Bozo

renna said:


> I laughed out loud. That's worthy of telling.


Thanks, I agree!

Great video by the way. Of course it would have been even better without the dude in it, but that's a minor quibble. :wink:


----------



## Doctorjuice

Okay INTJs, let's talk!

I'm free on weekends. My Skype username is doctorjuice (how surprising). I'm open to using google hangout as well.

Reply or PM or whatever if you want to chat.

If you want to chat with me but you're a different type, that's fine too.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Doctorjuice said:


> Okay INTJs, let's talk!







> If you want to chat with me but you're a different type, that's fine too.


:happy:


----------



## pneumoceptor

Last night, I had a super fun N-teraction with three other iNtuition dominants, @_jendragon_ (ENTP), @_bprett_ (ENFP), and @_ServiceR_ (INTJ). N-joy!


----------



## Dyslexicon

pneumoceptor said:


> N-joy!


I certainly did. :kitteh:

My brain was talking with you. This was really interesting and really enjoyable. I also made some new connections between my own type in relation to your N-dom types. Thank you so much!


----------



## Teybo

@pneumoceptor

Absolutely stellar chat. I've watched the first segment and the others are on my watch list. I found the conversation that stemmed from @jendragon 's observation about T/F processing things holistically vs discretely to be very, very interesting, and tracks well with my own experiences. Thank you for organizing, hosting, and sharing the session.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Dyslexicon said:


> I also made some new connections between my own type in relation to your N-dom types.


Are any of them articulatable?


----------



## pneumoceptor

Teybo said:


> I found the conversation that stemmed from @_jendragon_ 's observation about T/F processing things holistically vs discretely to be very, very interesting, and tracks well with my own experiences.


Yeah, that was a paradigm-shifter for me. Very very interesting.


----------



## Dyslexicon

pneumoceptor said:


> Are any of them articulatable?


Probably. Although you'll have to give me some time, cause I can't go as fast as @_jendragon_ :tongue: Will post some thoughts later unless I get distracted and don't do it. Also, I have to say it's so interesting to observe the kind of energy (in lack of a better word) you all give off. Especially for you, Amber, since my SO is also an INFJ. I see it as very similar to him, especially when introspecting.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

renna said:


> Gotta love those thumbnails


What a fun video! You guys have always had a 'clicking' between you even when 'in different frames' during interaction vids. It's fun to see it still goin' strong in person.

I loved your facial expression @_renna_ when he said, 'if you can laugh at your issues you can overcome your issues.' My ENTP sister totally could have been the one saying that! She admirably lives by this and it is amazing to me. It's just so cut and dry to them though ya know??? If I could laugh at my issues I agree - I would overcome them. To me it seems that I have to have already overcome them and THEN I can laugh at them - - in hindsight. I think when she tries to get me to laugh too soon it hurts. But then when I'm by myself I might find myself chuckling later. I think perhaps their Ne serves them well this way....I can laugh at my problems if someone else helps me see how it is funny! I just don't necessarily go there on my own :tongue:


----------



## Lady Lullaby

hallstrigity said:


> Catchin up on vids there are some cool ones out there - and here's another interaction just for fun


I liked what you said: "When I'm going out and interacting with people in fake mode I'm selling out my Ti. ....For the sake of interaction, I'm going to chain myself to extraverted feeling needs and wear whatever mask I need to and sell my Ti-short; just so I can have this interaction."

That is fascinating to me because I have definitely seen my ENTP sister do this with certain friends. In short, they don't know her well - even after years of being friends because she has to 'sell her Ti-short' to click with them. I would go so far to say that she rarely enjoys the satisfaction of really utilizing her Ti in social situations - it is just something she has to wait to be alone to enjoy. And she does in her work . . .but it makes me a bit sad for her to not be able to have her whole self 'come to the party.' But really - do any of us always bring all of ourselves to the party? 

I think it's intriguing to see that each personality has ways their style can either enhance or interfere with being known and knowing others. For me, it's often just a protection of vulnerability, living in my introverted space where I'm comfortable, keeping me at a distance while those around me are convinced they're in the 'inner-circle'. This way we're all happy. 


It seems that each of us has our own reason to feel unsatisfied in both short and long-term interactions. NFs - maybe want more depth of feeling and connection, NTs want more detached evaluation and investigation, etc. I guess we're all making compromises in relationships even if they are for short periods of interacting. It's all a matter of what we're there for in combination with what they're looking for.

My INTP hubby can do what you do (wear a hat to work in a group, that's why it could be said he can get along with anyone) but his inferior Fe makes it such that his tolerance for staying in 'fake mode' (turning on the Fe) is much lower and runs dry much faster.


Thanks for the vid!


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Last night, I had a super fun N-teraction with three other iNtuition dominants, @_jendragon_ (ENTP), @_bprett_ (ENFP), and @_ServiceR_ (INTJ). N-joy!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> /QUOTE]
> 
> Watching # 1 - Love - Love - Love this so far!!
> 
> I think it is fabulous how clear Ni vs Ne was displayed here. (But maybe it is only clear because I too think in analogies and models. . .)
> 
> @_bprett_ My ENFP friend does that too (blurts out an observation with a value judgement) - it's fun to hear there's a chance she doesn't mean it LOL. I know I'm an opinionated person, but I told my INTP husband just tonight (after blurting out a very critical statement about someone I was watching on TV) that I hope he doesn't think less of me for always sharing my opinions so blatantly while we watch shows. He laughed and said 'yes, you are a very opinionated person, but I'm used to it. It doesn't change my view or anything.' And I laughed and said, 'but you're like the only person I actually share my opinions with!!!'
> 
> I was watching @_hallstrigity_ 's last video and he actually talks about that very thing, that ENFPs will blurt things out that might offend people but they don't mean offense, they're just expressing it with their Te so it can come off as harsh as if an ENTJ had said it even though they are a feeler. I think because the source is coming from their Ne - - it usually just takes me by surprise and delights me because of it's randomness, and makes me chuckle (despite their unintentional judgement). So I think that's a great Ne/Fi real-life example.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

pneumoceptor said:


> Last night, I had a super fun N-teraction with three other iNtuition dominants, @_jendragon_ (ENTP), @_bprett_ (ENFP), and @_ServiceR_ (INTJ). N-joy!


Watched 2 and finishing 3 - - too too much awesomeness to comment on! Just thank you!

I will say that when @bprett talked about having to turn robotic when talking to INTPs at work because they think she is giving too much context I almost fell off my chair from laughter. I'm married to an INTP and yeah - - they don't really want that LOL and I'm close friends with an ENTP and she really does always give a huge amount of background to every story - but I find her delivery so entertaining that I don't mind it at all. Sigh...you're making me miss my friend! (Haven't seen her in a while.)
@ServiceR I have a neighbor who is INTJ and we get along great. She has said that very thing when I explain some of my thought processes: "That just sounds exhausting!!" and @pneumoceptor - I said that very thing to her: "It* is* exhausting!"    @jendragon Talk about parallel universes eh?? (INFJ/INTJ here and another INFJ/INTJ there . . . What is the philosophy called that explains this phenomenon?. . . . and if this is a dumb question, sorry - I just didn't know what else to say to make sure I included you in my tagging - I think you got tons of laughs from me through this, tons of thought sparks and lightning triggered . . . but I'll need the rest of the night to process it so I'll have to get back to you. :wink

I wanted to chime in on the topic of public speaking/debate/performance. I have sung in public since I as 8 yrs old (or younger) and so it is second nature to me now. I am like Amber - I cannot speak off the fly - I get tongue tied and should just be put out of my misery - very painful to watch Ha! I need to prepare-prepare-prepare. (But when teaching - no problem speaking off the fly because I get to facilitate discussion - that's a whole other ballgame. I love teaching!) My INTJ neighbor friend is in my opinion a phenomenal public speaker but perhaps it is because I love her writing style and she basically reads what she's written. But she would say it is very anxiety inducing and she dreads it. . . She too is good at debate. For me, debate is just a minefield for Fe-damage, and Ti-frustration. :laughing: I admire those of you who can speak off the cuff and debate well!!!!
@pneumoceptor - Thanks for such a fabulous demonstration of all things N and such diversity thanks to differing auxiliaries! Too much fun! :kitteh: You found very stellar examples of each type - I think each type would be pleased with their type's representation here. (P.S. I think my new boss is ENTP and I have begun to adjust to the new pattern that like your boss, he is going to talk long and often and I'll learn a lot, but it isn't a 'you're new, this is temporary' - thing. It's a - this is how he works and I think he likes bouncing ideas off of me so get used to it - thing. (What do you do when it is keeping you from moving past the ideas into the actual working??? He's the boss afterall.....:ninja


----------



## zerocrossing

Teybo said:


> @_pneumoceptor_
> 
> Absolutely stellar chat. I've watched the first segment and the others are on my watch list. I found the conversation that stemmed from @_jendragon_ 's observation about T/F processing things holistically vs discretely to be very, very interesting, and tracks well with my own experiences. Thank you for organizing, hosting, and sharing the session.


I watched 2 of the videos (I'll get to the third later).

I found the holistic/discrete processing part interesting too. What I think happens with me is that I do get non-linear big picture perception, but my brain immediately kicks into analysis/deconstruction/explanation mode. I don't usually find it difficult to break down the non-linear into discrete units and then explain them in linear terms. So I seem to be operating in both spheres to some extent - though my immediate default is towards breaking it down into tangible and discrete analytical units.

It was interesting watching BLEAK HOUSE this past weekend. I've never read the novel, so I was experiencing it for the first time. Some element of the plot would prompt me to come to a conclusion about where the whole plot was going. But the conclusions were based on what I know about the way plots work, and particularly what I know about the conventions driving mid-19th century plots. 

So here's the way I experienced it: first there was plot (perception), leading to connections with plot conventions (perception ---> judgment), leading to a big picture perception, leading to an immediate ongoing analysis adjusted according to new plot developments, leading to new big picture perception. At every break, I would tell my husband where I thought the plot was going and precisely why. It was sort of like getting a quasi-holistic view that was preceded and succeeded by discrete analysis. 

Does this happen to anybody else? What I think I do NOT get is a holistic perception that is essentially ineffable - which seems more along the lines of what @bprett and @pneumoceptor were describing. Would that be a fair description of the more "F" way of processing - i.e. holistic _and_ largely ineffable?

Anyway... cool videos!


----------



## renna

pneumoceptor said:


> Last night, I had a super fun N-teraction with three other iNtuition dominants


AND female N doms at that!
I can't even get one girl to do an interaction with me, let alone three other ones! 

Good vids


----------



## Fat Bozo

renna said:


> AND female N doms at that!
> I can't even get one girl to do an interaction with me, let alone three other ones!
> 
> Good vids


If I was a girl, I totally would do one with you.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@zerocrossing, how you described watching movies is familiar to me. I do the meta analysis. But if there's a strong emotional draw to the movie, then that falls by the wayside and I'm just "in it" rather than analyzing it. 

And yes, the holistic impression often feels ineffable to me.


----------



## ToxicatedRose

@pneumoceptor -- I love your videos a lot! They give me a great glimpse into types and how they interact  It's nice to see an existing INFJ too ... I have never met a fellow INFJ before, they're so rare.

I'd love to do/be part of something like this ... I think social awkwardness wouldn't make me too exciting though, but y'know, my friends like MBTI (and find that their types fit them a lot) but they're not really passionate about it. I love PerC because there are so many passionate people here !


----------



## Celebok

So having watched the entire 4-way N-dom interaction, and reading the comments about it here, I think I've finally figured out how we sensors perceive the S/N divide, and why we don't often realize there _is _such a divide. From what I recall, I overall enjoyed listening to the interaction between those four N-dominant women. I don't remember ever getting bored or drained or overwhelmed by the deep intuitive talk. But rather... _I don't remember any of the conversation at all!_ I know I listened to the whole thing, and laughed at all the funny moments, and yet when I read Lady Lullaby's commentary, for example, I'm like... I don't remember any of THAT! But looking back now, I can't for the life of me remember what you actually talked about! So apparently I must've mentally tuned out without even realizing it. I can imagine how frustrating it must be for an intuitive to bring up a deep topic and then ask me what I think, and I just say, "That's cool." And yet I'd remain oblivious to their frustration, because as far as I'm concerned, we just had a fun conversation! So intuitives, the next time a sensor denies that there's an S/N divide, just ramble for a minute about your favorite intuitive topic and then ask them what they think, and when they say, "That's cool, I guess," or, "I don't know, I never thought about it," then you can say, "There you go!"


----------



## pneumoceptor

Hahahaha. @Celebok, you're great. How fascinating. I'd be interested to hear if other sensors also tuned out. I know I definitely tune out when provided with many concrete details in a conversation. It's like they weren't even said. Maybe our brains are protecting us from being drained .


----------



## Teybo

@Celebok

That's exactly how I experience "S-based" conversations. I have a hard time knowing what to focus on and so it all just kind of goes in one ear and out the other, and then I get chided for being "forgetful". Of course I forgot it! I had no idea that what was "it" and what wasn't. :tongue:


----------



## zerocrossing

@Celebok - Excellent insight into the S/N divide. I felt completely at home watching the N-dom video. I can get overwhelmed, though, with too many concrete, sensory details - unless I can see them in writing. But in a conversation, I just can't follow that stuff at all.


----------



## zerocrossing

@_pneumoceptor_ - Thanks for confirming the "ineffable" nature of your holistic perception. As for movies... well, yeah, I can get caught up in an emotional plot too, especially if it's well done. If an emotional plot is not well done or is merely manipulative, though, I usually become more emotionally distanced from it than I would if the plot had no emotional content at all. 

In fact, I can actually get angry if I feel I'm being emotionally jerked around in a completely transparent and poorly executed way. I ranted for a couple of days over the ending of the DOWNTON ABBEY Christmas Special - not because of what happened but because of how it was executed.


----------



## pneumoceptor

zerocrossing said:


> @_pneumoceptor_ - Thanks for confirming the "ineffable" nature of your holistic perception. As for movies... well, yeah, I can get caught up in an emotional plot too, especially if it's well done. If an emotional plot is not well done or is merely manipulative, though, I usually become more emotionally distanced from it than I would if the plot had no emotional content at all.
> 
> In fact, I can actually get angry if I feel I'm being emotionally jerked around in a completely transparent and poorly executed way. I ranted for a couple of days over the ending of the DOWNTON ABBEY Christmas Special - not because of what happened but because of how it was executed.


Yes, Downton Abbey is totally pissing me off. Too much overt emotion and not enough nuance. I'm basically done with that show .


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> So having watched the entire 4-way N-dom interaction, and reading the comments about it here, I think I've finally figured out how we sensors perceive the S/N divide, and why we don't often realize there _is _such a divide. From what I recall, I overall enjoyed listening to the interaction between those four N-dominant women. I don't remember ever getting bored or drained or overwhelmed by the deep intuitive talk. But rather... _I don't remember any of the conversation at all!_ I know I listened to the whole thing, and laughed at all the funny moments, and yet when I read Lady Lullaby's commentary, for example, I'm like... I don't remember any of THAT! But looking back now, I can't for the life of me remember what you actually talked about! So apparently I must've mentally tuned out without even realizing it. I can imagine how frustrating it must be for an intuitive to bring up a deep topic and then ask me what I think, and I just say, "That's cool." And yet I'd remain oblivious to their frustration, because as far as I'm concerned, we just had a fun conversation! So intuitives, the next time a sensor denies that there's an S/N divide, just ramble for a minute about your favorite intuitive topic and then ask them what they think, and when they say, "That's cool, I guess," or, "I don't know, I never thought about it," then you can say, "There you go!"


Yeah, to be perfectly honest, if they weren't hot ladies, I wouldn't have watched the whole thing.


But don't get me wrong, like Celebok, I very much enjoyed the stuff they talked about.


You know, whatever it was.


----------



## Celebok

See, that's the thing, you intuitives are already well-aware that you have difficulty focusing on concrete details in a conversation. Whereas, I didn't even realize that I was tuning out all the abstract concepts being discussed. I was just sitting back and enjoying the conversation. It wasn't until I started reading all the comments, both here and on YouTube, that I realized that there was a lot of stuff being talked about in there that I totally missed because I wasn't paying attention.

I see this happen a lot with a married couple I know -- the husband is an ISFJ and the wife is an INFJ. Whenever they experience S/N communication problems, it's always the INFJ wife who complains about them. The ISFJ husband says he's listening to her, claims he has no problems understanding, but then when the wife asks him about it five minutes later, she finds that he has no clue what she's talking about, and it frustrates her. She's also said to him, "Must you always obsess about every little detail when we watch something together?" The ISFJ just kinda laughs it off. He just enjoys being himself around her.

So it seems that in general, the S/N divide is real for both sensors and intuitives, but it's almost always the intuitives who will notice it first.


----------



## Celebok

Fat Bozo said:


> Yeah, to be perfectly honest, if they weren't hot ladies, I wouldn't have watched the whole thing.
> 
> But don't get me wrong, like Celebok, I very much enjoyed the stuff they talked about.
> 
> You know, whatever it was.


I guess that would be the Fi version of what I said. :wink:


----------



## Ballast

Celebok said:


> See, that's the thing, you intuitives are already well-aware that you have difficulty focusing on concrete details in a conversation. Whereas, I didn't even realize that I was tuning out all the abstract concepts being discussed. I was just sitting back and enjoying the conversation. It wasn't until I started reading all the comments, both here and on YouTube, that I realized that there was a lot of stuff being talked about in there that I totally missed because I wasn't paying attention.
> 
> I see this happen a lot with a married couple I know -- the husband is an ISFJ and the wife is an INFJ. Whenever they experience S/N communication problems, it's always the INFJ wife who complains about them. The ISFJ husband says he's listening to her, claims he has no problems understanding, but then when the wife asks him about it five minutes later, she finds that he has no clue what she's talking about, and it frustrates her. She's also said to him, "Must you always obsess about every little detail when we watch something together?" The ISFJ just kinda laughs it off. He just enjoys being himself around her.
> 
> So it seems that in general, the S/N divide is real for both sensors and intuitives, but it's almost always the intuitives who will notice it first.


This is pretty insightful, actually! I'm rather fascinated with the differences between S and N types. And as an N dominate I'm pretty aware of the immediate differences, so I'm glad I have the language to describe it now.

I myself have trouble focusing at times when information being presented goes off topic or veers into areas I don't consider directly relevant to something I'm trying to learn. That means I end up missing whole chunks of information, to the chagrin of my loved ones who remind me _again_ what they already said with a "Damn, you only pay attention when you think it'll be relevant to you!"

The other problem I have (and this a reason why I don't like to watch movies/TV shows with other people) is that it takes me longer to process what is being said. Someone will say something interesting and I'll be stuck on that for a few minutes, only to realize they are right in the middle of another interesting statement and _oh, I wish I had caught that! Rewind! Pause, I have to think about this for a minute._ I get like a queue of thoughts that need to be processed and I can't concentrate fully until I've gone through them all. Makes reading/watching TV slower for me.

****
These videos were great because it's awesome seeing this all in action, especially with my type being represented and compared/contrasted with the thinking styles of others. Also, I found myself thinking _man, I wish I knew an ENTP in real life!_ This is totally a conversation I would want to be a part of.


----------



## perfectcircle

pneumoceptor said:


> My ISFJ mom and I did a video over the weekend .


This is so sweet & also brave to do & share! Thanks for sharing.

edit: Also, I think in the second video when giving your mom a relational example of Ni, your interest in mbti would have been a prime example. That's very conceptual & not specific, even more so than strengths & values of a person-- an abstract system of categories to understand human dynamics.

BTW I totally got what your mom was saying regarding the writing. Part of writing is to communicate to others and also to express yourself, which feels like pure motives, but what comes with that is also getting recognition and how it impacts our identity, which feels good. I get some positive attention on the forum for posting, and part of that is a spiritual exercise with myself, thinking, my own thoughts, writing, expressing, articulating, and that impact my own identity because it's a way of coming into contact with yourself. But if I think "Am I just doing this because other people will think well of me?" Then it feels less pure or spiritual; then can I say it's about expression anymore? Especially since writing one's thoughts is a personal revelation in the self, it really is about "you" in that moment but then we share it with others and want them to like it-- so do we do it for them or ourselves? I get it isn't necessarily one or the other but I do get what your mom was saying; I think she was prompted to think maybe it was something she did for recognition and not for "pure motives" because she felt she wouldn't write if no one could read it. I don't think it is selfish though, because as an introvert, it's a way to express oneself and define our image to others, and I think everyone desires to control their image and express and communicate with others and define a "self"-- so even if writing is done in some way for others and that seems at odds with an attempt express your "pure self" free from external constraints, perhaps the reason it feels good is because it finally allows one to combine the two; the desire to be your "true self" free of social value/obligation/motive, and also to communicate that self.

BTW2: Is it possible your mean co-worker has social anxiety or is shy around you and so comes off awkward? You come off as intelligent, confident, and attractive; is this person new here? You might intimidate her. I sometimes have a hard time seeming warm to people I don't know very well, ironically if I am impressed by them/admire them. I also get very tense and feel closed off in a new situations if I haven't made a "breakthrough" with people around me and don't know how to interact with others. Her body language might be to hide her anxiety more than to reject you; I know when I feel that way, my voice sounds harsh, short, and maybe even critical, because of how uncomfortable & nervous I am. She may just be a meanie but just food for thought.


----------



## pneumoceptor

@adverseaffects, your message gave me lots of brain food for thought!

Regarding your "BTW1", I can see what you mean. Yes, that could feel inauthentic if the writer was hyper-aware of the audience's view of him/her. And I totally agree that the motives would never be fully "pure".

Regarding your "BTW2", no, this co-worker has been around for a long time and has had many HR problems with many people. She is anything but shy. My first week on the job, she basically yelled at me not to touch her stuff and to go get my own, when I didn't even know what was communal and what was "hers". (Aside: she's definitely Te-dom.) That said, I don't intend to have an HR problem with her, because I'm not going to play her game. But man am I hyper-aware of her at all times! And underlyingly, there may be something to her feeling threatened by me. I sure as bleep feel threatened by her. So perhaps it's mutual .


----------



## Ellis Bell

@pneumoceptor, I enjoyed these two videos with your mom! it was interesting to see how you connect on a Fe level... but when it comes to the Si/Ni differences, there's definitely a disconnect. 

(with regards to your coworker, my ESFJ mom has a saying about people like that: "wherever you go, there you are." No matter where your coworker goes, her attitude will follow. Nightmare coworkers are ubiquitous, though; I have one who yells at everybody when someone puts recycling in the regular trash or regular trash in recycling).


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> And yes, the holistic impression often feels ineffable to me.


It's totally effable. EFF IT!

:tongue:


----------



## LadyO.W.BernieBro

Your mom is exactly like one of my family members :laughing:l'd typed her as a few different types...l was thinking ISTJ. Maybe the Si is what seems ''rational'' to me, l can see ISFJ now.


----------



## Grain of Sugar

pneumoceptor said:


> I hate my voice too! Let's start a club .


I guess this club would include almost everyone. Huge club, very huge.


----------



## nickvold

nickvold said:


> Hey guys!  I'm an INTJ 5w6 (5-6-1) sp/sx. I'd love to do an interaction video with someone! Especially INTJ, INTP, INFJ, ENTP, ENFJ, ENFP, ISFP or ESTP.
> 
> I'm also new here on PerC, so please message and say hi! =)


I ended up finding an INFJ to make a video with. Maybe some of you know him? He's ToxicatedRose on this forum. We ended up talking for like 5 hours, and it was really nice . Sadly, only 40 mins or so were recorded. I'm just gonna leave the video here... 

[video=youtube;AlEMttIxSGw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlEMttIxSGw"]<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlEMttIxSGw">[video=youtube;AlEMttIxSGw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlEMttIxSGw[/VIDEO[/video]


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## nickvold

@Fat Bozo @monemi I'd love to include you both in a Hangout!  Sure do! 
I have this issue atm, though. My net is capped at 20gb download space, and I've used up that quota for this month. Basically this means my net is like at 200kbps until November. A solution could be for me to hang out at University and make the hangout using the net there, though. Either way: to get one done in October, it'll require some planning 

I'll try to be more concrete: I think we should all get in touch and agree upon a time to make the hangout. Then we'll stick with that time, and all meet up separately in front of our computers, in the true internet fashion x).


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## Xenograft

@nickvold, do you want an SJ in there? I'd love to participate in another one of these!


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## ToxicatedRose

@nickvold -- lovely talking to you, would love to do it again


----------



## Celebok

pneumoceptor said:


> Thanks a bunch for participating. And yes, ENFJs are rough to find for these things, so I may ring your doorbell in the future.


And if I add myself and if we can find an ESTP to add to the mix, we could do an interesting Ni-Fe-Ti-Se hangout!


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## nickvold

@_ToxicatedRose_ @_Lazy Bear_ Sure! You're all welcome!
All it takes to me is that we agree upon a time! 

Thanks a lot for the talk, TR! It was nice!


----------



## Fat Bozo

BlueberryCupcake said:


> I guess this club would include almost everyone. Huge club, very huge.


Not me. I love my voice. I could listen to myself for HOURS.

Possibly DAYS.


----------



## Fat Bozo

nickvold said:


> @_Fat Bozo_ @_monemi_ I'd love to include you both in a Hangout!  Sure do!
> I have this issue atm, though. My net is capped at 20gb download space, and I've used up that quota for this month. Basically this means my net is like at 200kbps until November. A solution could be for me to hang out at University and make the hangout using the net there, though. Either way: to get one done in October, it'll require some planning
> 
> I'll try to be more concrete: I think we should all get in touch and agree upon a time to make the hangout. Then we'll stick with that time, and all meet up separately in front of our computers, in the true internet fashion x).


Alright, well just let me know.


----------



## twstdude0to1

ISFJ 2w1 here game for a type video with just about everyone. PM me if interested.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> And if I add myself and if we can find an ESTP to add to the mix, we could do an interesting Ni-Fe-Ti-Se hangout!


----------



## Grain of Sugar

Fat Bozo said:


> Not me. I love my voice. I could listen to myself for HOURS.
> 
> Possibly DAYS.


Okay, let's swap it(;


----------



## hallstrigity

Been out of the loop for a while but here's an edited vid with and ENFP in real life. Enjoy!


----------



## nickvold

@monemi @Fat Bozo @_ToxicatedRose_ So I'm gonna be busy this week. We should look at the possibility of doing it next week. Check your calendars, people!


----------



## monemi

nickvold said:


> @_monemi_ @_Fat Bozo_ @_ToxicatedRose_ So I'm gonna be busy this week. We should look at the possibility of doing it next week. Check your calendars, people!


9-2 mon tues and fri.


----------



## nickvold

monemi said:


> 9-2 mon tues and fri.


Nice stuff, monemi! What's ur time zone? Mine's GMT+1, and I believe Toxic's timezone is GMT(+0) because he lives in London.


----------



## Celebok

I almost don't even recognize @hallstrigity in a different room. ;-)


----------



## monemi

nickvold said:


> nice stuff, monemi! What's ur time zone? Mine's gmt+1, and i believe toxic's timezone is gmt(+0) because he lives in london.


gmt -5


----------



## Fat Bozo

nickvold said:


> @_monemi_ @_Fat Bozo_ @_ToxicatedRose_ So I'm gonna be busy this week. We should look at the possibility of doing it next week. Check your calendars, people!


Calendars? Oh, those are those things with dates on them, right? What am I supposed to be checking it for? :tongue:


----------



## monemi

Fat Bozo said:


> Calendars? Oh, those are those things with dates on them, right? What am I supposed to be checking it for? :tongue:


It's complicated, I know. Sit down and open up google calendar. Take your time. Did you put anything on it? :tongue:


----------



## PaladinX

monemi said:


> It's complicated, I know. Sit down and open up google calendar. Take your time. Did you put anything on it? :tongue:


Every time I see your posts now I keep thinking that you are replying with "You know nothing, Jon Snow."


----------



## monemi

PaladinX said:


> Every time I see your posts now I keep thinking that you are replying with "You know nothing, Jon Snow."


I'm not sure if that's a good or bad thing. :laughing: And you've got old men laughing at me in your sig.


----------



## PaladinX

monemi said:


> I'm not sure if that's a good or bad thing. :laughing: And you've got old men laughing at me in your sig.


It's not a bad thing. It's a funny thing. To me. Every time I see one of your posts where you are correcting someone with the facts, banter, or other such, I envision you saying "You know nothing, Jon Snow" at the end of it.

I'm not sure if you really don't know who Statler and Waldorf are, but here's a clip:


* *




The original trolls from the muppet show:


----------



## Fat Bozo

monemi said:


> It's complicated, I know. Sit down and open up google calendar. Take your time. Did you put anything on it? :tongue:


Google has calendars now?


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## nickvold

monemi said:


> gmt -5


 Right! That means monday or friday from 9 (gmt-5) works best for me. We'll also have those extra three hours till 2 then. This translates to 14:00 (gmt+1) for me, and 13:00 (gmt+0) for @ToxicatedRose. @Fat Bozo: GET WITH THE PROGRAM!


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## Xenograft

I am GMT -7, so would that be 7:00 for me?


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## nickvold

@Lazy Bear: sorry for completely not replying at all. Apparently I lost your post scrolling through this shit. You're definitely welcome. Yup, I think that'd be 07:00 for you.


----------



## Xenograft

@_nickvold_, what day is this, also? Monday or Friday? Do we have an absolute date?


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## Fat Bozo

nickvold said:


> Right! That means monday or friday from 9 (gmt-5) works best for me. We'll also have those extra three hours till 2 then. This translates to 14:00 (gmt+1) for me, and 13:00 (gmt+0) for @_ToxicatedRose_. @_Fat Bozo_: GET WITH THE PROGRAM!


eh? what program?


----------



## nickvold

@Fat Bozo @Lazy Bear We can do both Monday and Friday actually. I want to try on Monday. Um mr. ESFP just check your calendar if anything's up, that's what I meant. Also, figure out the time zone stuff, so it's easy to be there on time.


----------



## Fat Bozo

nickvold said:


> @_Fat Bozo_ @_Lazy Bear_ We can do both Monday and Friday actually. I want to try on Monday. Um mr. ESFP just check your calendar if anything's up, that's what I meant. Also, figure out the time zone stuff, so it's easy to be there on time.


Heh, I wasn't kidding when I said I didn't have a calendar to check. :tongue: I'm in US Central time zone. Monday through Friday I work from 8am to 5pm, so I can only do a video in the evenings, which if you guys are in Europe, would be pretty late for you. Weekends I'm available a lot more.


----------



## Celebok

It's been a question that's been asked multiple times -- how do sensors relate to the S-N divide, or do they at all? Now you get to hear it first-hand from an ISTP (myself) and an ESFP ( @Fat Bozo) as they tackle the tough questions asked by a couple of inquisitive INFJs ( @pneumoceptor and @_Lady Lullaby_)!

In Parts 1 & 2, I face the N-force head-on as Pneumoceptor and Lady Lullaby waste no time in bringing the real intuitive issues to the surface.

In Part 3, Pneumoceptor has left the discussion, leaving Lady Lullaby and myself to continue our unfinished business one-on-one.

Then, in Parts 4 & 5, in a shocking turn of events, Fat Bozo makes a surprise appearance to give a different perspective on the S-N divide, in his own unique ESFP sort of way.

Will the S-N divide finally be bridged? Who will come out on top? Watch these videos to find out!


Part 1: 




 
Part 2: 




 
Part 3:




 
Part 4:




 
Part 5:


----------



## nickvold

Fat Bozo said:


> Heh, I wasn't kidding when I said I didn't have a calendar to check. :tongue: I'm in US Central time zone. Monday through Friday I work from 8am to 5pm, so I can only do a video in the evenings, which if you guys are in Europe, would be pretty late for you. Weekends I'm available a lot more.


Right. Thanks. Will check opportunities for that later. Will keep in mind everyone who said yes to come along for an interaction video.


----------



## nickvold

@_ToxicatedRose_ @_Fat Bozo_ @_monemi_ @_Lazy Bear_ When do you guys wanna do a Hangout? On a Monday or a Friday? Friday this week is definitely a good opportunity for me. We'll do it at the time of the day we agreed on in earlier posts.


----------



## monemi

nickvold said:


> @_ToxicatedRose_ @_Fat Bozo_ @_monemi_ @_Lazy Bear_ When do you guys wanna do a Hangout? On a Monday or a Friday? Friday this week is definitely a good opportunity for me. We'll do it at the time of the day we agreed on in earlier posts.


How does Friday sound then?


----------



## Xenograft

@nickvold Friday sounds good. 7:00 GMT-7, right?


----------



## nickvold

@Lazy Bear @monemi @ToxicatedRose: This just in: my laptop has been the victim of a scam, and I need to get it formatted. I don't know how long it'll take. Hopefully no more than a day. Will get it to service asap. Hopefully it'll be ready by Friday. Yup Lazy Bear that would be 7:00.


----------



## nickvold

@monemi Just to be clear here, you meant 9-12 am or pm? There is a party on friday as well, but no uni so 9-12 fits best for me given my pc is also ready.


----------



## monemi

nickvold said:


> @_monemi_ Just to be clear here, you meant 9-12 am or pm? There is a party on friday as well, but no uni so 9-12 fits best for me given my pc is also ready.


9am-12pm -5GMT Is that okay?


----------



## Kabosu

how many weeks worth of watching is left out from being out of here for months? haha. At this point I'm sort of more interested in maybe watching videos and stuff and I think from here on out if I do one with anyone I'll only post it if they want it to be posted.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> Then, in Parts 4 & 5, in a shocking turn of events, Fat Bozo makes a surprise appearance to give a different perspective on the S-N divide, in his own unique ESFP sort of way.


I figured I'd post a link to the video clip I referred to with Lady Lullaby when I was talking about ESFPs not wanting to talk about their dark "inner selves" and all that. It's from the long-running daytime drama, One Life To Live, circa 1980 when 18-year-old Tina is called out for flirting with a guy who already has a girlfriend and her ESFJ older sister Viki tells her she should probably see a shrink, which doesn't go over too well with Tina:






(scene starts at 13:41 mark in case in doesn't jump there automatically for you.)

I feel like Tina could've been speaking for all ESFPs when she says "I don't want some doctor digging up all these things that are hidden inside of me." I felt the same way when I first got sent to a therapist when I was 12 years old. The whole experience was awful for me.


----------



## Tynen

ENFP here.. if you need me, let me know.


----------



## Celebok

INFJs... I just can't get enough! It's @FayWray from YouTube!

Part 1: 



 
Part 2: 



 
Part 3: 



 
Part 4: 



 
This is the longest interaction video I've done yet! (But certainly not the longest overall.)


----------



## Kabosu

Saw parts of it during the broadcast. Since I'm too lazy to go look for the parts that are what I saw and appropriately comment time-wise :mellow: (probably 3rd part? some of 4th?) I'll just mention some things:
It's great that the thing about generalized descriptions of the cognitive functions was brought up. This is one reason I was the DaveSuperPowers channel did not exist, and that's even the nicer version of it.
It was cool when what was almost the MBTI version of duality was mentioned. It's something I pick up on slowly but surely and after a brief vacation from it, that's what's stood out the most.


----------



## Celebok

atypeofuser said:


> Saw parts of it during the broadcast. Since I'm too lazy to go look for the parts that are what I saw and appropriately comment time-wise (probably 3rd part? some of 4th?) I'll just mention some things:
> It's great that the thing about generalized descriptions of the cognitive functions was brought up. This is one reason I was the DaveSuperPowers channel did not exist, and that's even the nicer version of it.
> It was cool when what was almost the MBTI version of duality was mentioned. It's something I pick up on slowly but surely and after a brief vacation from it, that's what's stood out the most.


Ugh, yeah, DaveSuperPowers... what's worse is that he SOUNDS like he knows what he's talking about, so it's easy for someone who's looking for answers to take in what he says. His "ISTP vs ISTJ" and "ISTP vs INTP" videos did nothing but confuse me even more when I was trying to figure out my type. (I wouldn't be surprised if those videos are the reason why trolls on YouTube keep telling me I'm an ISTJ or INTP.) That said, I agree with that one video where he shows why online personality tests are unreliable.


----------



## ChosenOne

Hey I'm an INFP. I have some videos on my youtube. I would love to do a web talk with another person. From any of the 16 types. My channel is youtube.com/user/ternak001


----------



## Celebok

A few of you who follow my channel might've seen these, but I've started making a series of approximately one-minute "Type Interaction Moments" videos, featuring clips of some of the memorable moments from these type interactions. Here's a link to the playlist:

Type Interaction Moments - YouTube


----------



## Anon317

ChosenOne said:


> Hey I'm an INFP. I have some videos on my youtube. I would love to do a web talk with another person. From any of the 16 types. My channel is youtube.com/user/ternak001


i would love to but i am not very good at speaking english ^^"


----------



## twstdude0to1

If anyone is up for a type interaction video with an ISFJ 2x1. You can hit me up at tttekev - YouTube, PM me, or hit me up on Skype at twstdude0to1. I'm happy to do a type interaction video with any type!


----------



## nickvold

My pc is repaired again, and I'm up for a new interaction soon. As long as it's before the first of december - that's when my exams are x)


----------



## tangosthenes

hello. INTP type person at your service. PM me if you'd like to do a video. Please have some idea of what program you'd like to use so we don't have any technical hiccups. :crazy:


----------



## pneumoceptor

I got to chat with INTJ Josh today about communication styles, ministry/faith, learning styles, and other ideas...


----------



## modernclassical

Hi guys! I've been obsessively watching all of @pneumoceptor 's type interaction videos, and a bunch of the ones others have posted as well, and now I'd really like to participate. I'm an INFJ, 26 year old woman. I have a basic understanding of cognitive function, and have lately become a bit more obsessive about cognitive function theory, now that I feel like it's finally beginning to click. If there are any other INFJs interested, I think that would be really great, since I don't know any others. I've lately become really interested in ENFJs who are grossly underrepresented on YouTube. The more you hide, the more I want to know about you! All of my coworkers are INFPs, and I adore them. Most of the people closest to me are INFP, ENTP, and INTJ, and I'm fascinated by them, but I would also love to talk to other types to discuss how our brains work. Fun!

I don't have a webcam yet, but they're really cheap, so just let me know if you're interested, and I'll pick one up. I'm a newb to videos and chats, but I'll do whatever I need to get the ball rolling.

Thanks!


----------



## Celebok

I present to you... the long-awaited ESFJ-ISTP interaction, between myself and @rd93!!

(Those who watch my channel might appreciate the intro for each of these videos.)

Part 1:




 
Part 2:




 
Part 3:




 
Part 4:




 
Interestingly, in at least parts 1 and 2, it seemed like rd93 was asking all the questions!


----------



## Figure

I think an Ni dom - Se dom four person video would be pretty unique/entertaining. 

Anyone in for that?


----------



## magi83

modernclassical said:


> Hi guys! I've been obsessively watching all of @_pneumoceptor_ 's type interaction videos, and a bunch of the ones others have posted as well, and now I'd really like to participate. I'm an INFJ, 26 year old woman. I have a basic understanding of cognitive function, and have lately become a bit more obsessive about cognitive function theory, now that I feel like it's finally beginning to click. If there are any other INFJs interested, I think that would be really great, since I don't know any others. I've lately become really interested in ENFJs who are grossly underrepresented on YouTube. The more you hide, the more I want to know about you! All of my coworkers are INFPs, and I adore them. Most of the people closest to me are INFP, ENTP, and INTJ, and I'm fascinated by them, but I would also love to talk to other types to discuss how our brains work. Fun!
> 
> I don't have a webcam yet, but they're really cheap, so just let me know if you're interested, and I'll pick one up. I'm a newb to videos and chats, but I'll do whatever I need to get the ball rolling.
> 
> Thanks!


I have been trying to do an interaction video for ages but time it never seems to happen. PM me if you want to organise something. I live in Australia so realistically it would have to be at the weekend.


----------



## Kabosu

I've done both Fi doms, both Se doms, Ti doms and ISTJ.
Wouldn't mind repeats or more of those but people interested could maybe eventually do one.
Wouldn't mind a 3-4 group interaction, or if fellow ENTPs would do what I inadvertently missed on.


----------



## EyesOpen

Figure said:


> I think an Ni dom - Se dom four person video would be pretty unique/entertaining.
> 
> Anyone in for that?


I haven't done any vids yet but I have been thinking about it. Might be fun..I'd be up for it (or for others on here looking to do one!) depending on timeline. If you'd have me, when are you thinking?


----------



## Fat Bozo

Figure said:


> I think an Ni dom - Se dom four person video would be pretty unique/entertaining.
> 
> Anyone in for that?


Yes.


----------



## emilyl

I haven't been through all the videos yet, but I'd love to do one if anyone's looking for a female ENTP!  I'd especially like to do one with a male INFJ if there are any out there, since it's such a sought after/little observed pairing.


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> I present to you... the long-awaited ESFJ-ISTP interaction, between myself and @_rd93_!!
> 
> (Those who watch my channel might appreciate the intro for each of these videos.)


Finished this today. I love what y'all did with the intros. Fun stuff and a lot of interesting topics brought up. rd93, I'd love to do a video with you sometime if you're up for it. You can compare and contrast me with your mom all you want. :wink:


----------



## rd93

Fat Bozo said:


> Finished this today. I love what y'all did with the intros. Fun stuff and a lot of interesting topics brought up. rd93, I'd love to do a video with you sometime if you're up for it. You can compare and contrast me with your mom all you want. :wink:


Hahah yea I'd like to do one sometime. It might be a while though I've currently got my hands tied.


----------



## Fat Bozo

rd93 said:


> Hahah yea I'd like to do one sometime. It might be a while though I've currently got my hands tied.


Kinky! :tongue:


----------



## modernclassical

Figure said:


> I think an Ni dom - Se dom four person video would be pretty unique/entertaining.
> 
> Anyone in for that?


I want in on this, please! roud:


----------



## Fat Bozo

modernclassical said:


> I want in on this, please! roud:


Sounds like we've got 3 out of 4. Who dares enter the ESTP forum to get our 4th? :tongue:


----------



## Celebok

Fat Bozo said:


> rd93 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hahah yea I'd like to do one sometime. It might be a while though I've currently got my hands tied.
> 
> 
> 
> Kinky!
Click to expand...

I think we just witnessed a small example of Si-Se communication breakdown. :wink:


----------



## Fat Bozo

Celebok said:


> I think we just witnessed a small example of Si-Se communication breakdown. :wink:


I didn't see a breakdown. :tongue:


----------



## Fat Bozo

Hey..uhh…anybody know why pneumoceptor set all her videos to private? :ninja:


----------



## Figure

If you've never seen an INTJ speak in person, here is a two hour video with the basics. A great video with @_EyesOpen_ - we both really enjoyed it 

Topics include INTJ and enneagram, what is enneagram and what is MBTI, how we recognize Ni (the "you just know it" connection), how we are different from INTJ stereotypes, and whether INTJ really are as antisocial and hapless as they put themselves off to be.


----------



## modernclassical

Fat Bozo said:


> Hey..uhh…anybody know why pneumoceptor set all her videos to private? :ninja:


I don't know, but I am extremely bummed about it.


----------



## Choice

Fat Bozo said:


> Sounds like we've got 3 out of 4. Who dares enter the ESTP forum to get our 4th? :tongue:


Hmm, is this still on? (If anybody wants to jump the queue, let em replace me)
----
Private vids: Did somebody complain about privacy issues? 

Weird. Well, there's an unlisted option.


----------



## Choice

edit: double post.


----------



## Figure

Choice said:


> Hmm, is this still on? (If anybody wants to jump the queue, let em replace me)
> ----
> Private vids: somebody complained about privacy issues?
> 
> Weird. Well, there's an unlisted option.



As far as I knew, we were looking for an ESTP. Want in?
@modernclassical @Fat Bozo are you still in as well?


----------



## modernclassical

Figure said:


> As far as I knew, we were looking for an ESTP. Want in?
> @modernclassical @Fat Bozo are you still in as well?


I would love to, yes!


----------



## Fat Bozo

Figure said:


> As far as I knew, we were looking for an ESTP. Want in?
> @_modernclassical_ @_Fat Bozo_ are you still in as well?


Yeah! I could do it sometime this weekend. :happy:


----------



## EyesOpen

Figure said:


> If you've never seen an INTJ speak in person, here is a two hour video with the basics. A great video with @_Eyes Open_ - we both really enjoyed it
> 
> Topics include INTJ and enneagram, what is enneagram and what is MBTI, how we recognize Ni (the "you just know it" connection), how we are different from INTJ stereotypes, and whether INTJ really are as antisocial and hapless as they put themselves off to be.


 @EyesOpen all together, no space. Didn't know there was another me around though..haha  
Fun chat!


----------



## Choice

Figure said:


> As far as I knew, we were looking for an ESTP. Want in?
> @_modernclassical_ @_Fat Bozo_ are you still in as well?


Sure, as long as you're not looking for a gold star representative who's extra nice... like Dylio or ( @monemi do you do vids? ) 

How would you like to do the three quarter 7-FEST? Google+? Skype? 
@EyesOpen @modernclassical @Fat Bozo @Figure-> Doodle: MERRY CHRISTMAS.


----------



## tangosthenes

Someone who wants to do these videos... message me.


----------



## pneumoceptor

Hey cyber pals, just wanted to briefly explain that I decided to retire the channel. It's felt like more of a crutch than a contribution to me for the last several months. And with the google youtube merger, it's hard to maintain privacy... I've learned so much about myself and other through this endeavor, and I'm very grateful for all the conversations. So long, and thanks for all the fish!


----------



## Fat Bozo

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey cyber pals, just wanted to briefly explain that I decided to retire the channel. It's felt like more of a crutch than a contribution to me for the last several months. And with the google youtube merger, it's hard to maintain privacy... I've learned so much about myself and other through this endeavor, and I'm very grateful for all the conversations. So long, and thanks for all the fish!


Well, thanks for the explanation, even if I don't understand it. It's probably not a shock that I'm hugely disappointed by your decision, especially since there were several of the interaction videos I either hadn't watched at all or hadn't finished. If you haven't actually deleted the videos though, maybe I can still acquire them from you? If nothing else, I'd like to get the original chat that you and I did together because I'm pretty sure I never downloaded it. If it's still on there but just set private, you could just set them to viewable with direct link only and PM me the links and I could download them. I would really appreciate that, and if you're willing to make some of the others available so I could download them, that would be great too.

I hope things are good for you otherwise and that you won't be a stranger. I am grateful for the conversations also and I hope this doesn't mean you aren't willing to consider being in more videos in the future, because I think your contributions are always valued. :happy:


----------



## Celebok

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey cyber pals, just wanted to briefly explain that I decided to retire the channel. It's felt like more of a crutch than a contribution to me for the last several months. And with the google youtube merger, it's hard to maintain privacy... I've learned so much about myself and other through this endeavor, and I'm very grateful for all the conversations. So long, and thanks for all the fish!


Hey, any chance you'd be willing to set your videos to unlisted instead of private? That way nobody would find them through a search, but those of us who still wish to view them would still have access.


----------



## shiny

I just wanted to chime in (I did post on the youtube page before I thought of checking here) and throw my vote into the "unlisted" side. I was still working my way through them, and I hadn't had the chance to get my husband to watch the entj ones yet.  The videos are a really amazing resource, and it would be a shame to lose them completely.


----------



## EyesOpen

Next week I have a ridiculously open schedule and no plans. I would be up for a chat with whatever type if anyone wants. I'm not really up for "leading" a vid yet but I am a wiling participant.


----------



## Empurple

Aww man! Well, you did what you thought you needed to do. That's cool. But those videos were so cool. Anyway, God bless, Amber.


----------



## Celebok

I think she INFJ-doorslammed us.

(Sorry, couldn't resist.)


----------



## renna

I've just accepted the fact that it's modern times! Being social online is apart of that!! "Regular" people will not understand. Unless this is their interest, appreciation will be lacking. Please don't throw away ALL those hard working hours of time devoted to interacting! If unlisted is the way to go, then so be it. At least people on here will understand 

And again, who cares what ppl think. We weird before MBTI anyway.... ;-)


----------



## Im FiNe

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey cyber pals, just wanted to briefly explain that I decided to retire the channel. It's felt like more of a crutch than a contribution to me for the last several months. And with the google youtube merger, it's hard to maintain privacy... I've learned so much about myself and other through this endeavor, and I'm very grateful for all the conversations. So long, and thanks for all the fish!


You helped me learn much about MBTI and appreciate the diversity of personalities. Although I have known you in a limited way and for only a few months through your interaction videos I will miss you.


----------



## Jemster

pneumoceptor said:


> Hey cyber pals, just wanted to briefly explain that I decided to retire the channel. It's felt like more of a crutch than a contribution to me for the last several months. And with the google youtube merger, it's hard to maintain privacy... I've learned so much about myself and other through this endeavor, and I'm very grateful for all the conversations. So long, and thanks for all the fish!


Well that's a major bummer but you have to do what you have to do. You were one of the better people who made typology vids so I'll miss seeing new ones pop up in my YT notifications (which says a lot coming from me). You know my email address if you ever want to contact me for..um..well.. not sure but either way you know where I am. :tongue:


----------



## The Alternate

I am so sad they are all set to private. I was going to go back and start watching some, but now there's no way. They were really good resources and the people she talked to were diverse and interesting. If privacy is such an issue, why not just upload them in an archive somewhere on the internet? No associated name or profile or anything, just a download link for people who really care. Or dump them at Vimeo? That way your real name will not be connected. You could also just disable comments for all of them as well.

I really hate when this kind of thing happens. It reminds me of artists who disown their past work. Even if they don't say it like this, I feel it comes off like "I'm above all that now. Go check out the new shit instead.", when the fans still might be invested or interested in past work. Imagine if every time a new album was released, the old ones by the same person were destroyed, and there was no way to circumvent it. A lot of interesting, thoughtful work would be gone for no reason.


----------



## Tellus

"It's felt like more of a crutch than a contribution to me for the last several months." INFJ perfectionism? You are an excellent science communicator and I think you should keep on making (high quality) videos. / P L


----------



## Choice

@pneumoceptor If you ever return - I vote unlisted (if it remains an option)

@EyesOpen @modernclassical @Fat Bozo @Figure
Is the plan still in motion?


----------



## Figure

Choice said:


> @_EyesOpen_ @_modernclassical_ @_Fat Bozo_ @_Figure_
> Is the plan still in motion?



Bahh, I forgot all about this over the holiday - yes. I'm free this weekend, is anyone else?


----------



## Fat Bozo

Figure said:


> Bahh, I forgot all about this over the holiday - yes. I'm free this weekend, is anyone else?


I'm sure I could find a bit of time. :happy:


----------



## EyesOpen

I think we decided since Figure is INTJ as am I that there would only be one (him, since he's running it) in the video.  I am always up for other chats another time!


----------



## Choice

Figure said:


> Bahh, I forgot all about this over the holiday - yes. I'm free this weekend, is anyone else?


Possibly Sunday?


----------



## Figure

Choice said:


> Possibly Sunday?


Sounds good to me. @Fat Bozo how's Sunday work for you?

Earth to @modernclassical do you read?


----------



## modernclassical

Dammit, you guys, I totally forgot about this. YES. Let's do it. On Sunday, I guess? It would have to be in the evening. I work that morning. 

I'm noivus!


----------



## Choice

@EyesOpen @modernclassical @Fat Bozo @Figure

Could someone give me an approximate UTC? Pretty Please?


----------



## Figure

Choice said:


> @_modernclassical_ @_Fat Bozo_ @_Figure_
> 
> Could someone give me an approximate UTC? Pretty Please?


Sure - where's everyone located, just in case we've got weird time gaps between us?


----------



## Fat Bozo

Figure said:


> Sure - where's everyone located, just in case we've got weird time gaps between us?


Texas, US Central time


----------



## Straystuff

I'm really not a morning person and I'm pretty sure talking to me that early would be like talking to a zombie :s


----------



## Fat Bozo

Straystuff said:


> I'm really not a morning person and I'm pretty sure talking to me that early would be like talking to a zombie :s


Sounds like probably aiming for a weekend would be best then because of the time differences.


----------



## Straystuff

Would sunday be ok maybe? I'm moving to Japan next week and I have this farewell party on friday/saturday so...

(I'm so sorry for the inconvenience, I feel like I'm making this really of hard for you guys  )


----------



## ThomThom1

tangosthenes said:


> I'd like to interview a feeler with spiritual or religious beliefs. I'm curious about you guys.


I'm an ENFP. I love to talk about my faith. However, I do not like to debate about it. What I believe is my own and it has to be respected as such. If I'm to be raked over the coals about it, I'd rather keep my thoughts to myself. I never go in looking for a fight but it often gets an NT lit up.


----------



## tangosthenes

ThomThom1 said:


> I'm an ENFP. I love to talk about my faith. However, I do not like to debate about it. What I believe is my own and it has to be respected as such. If I'm to be raked over the coals about it, I'd rather keep my thoughts to myself. I never go in looking for a fight but it often gets an NT lit up.


I go through cycles where I'm interested in it for the sake of symbolism and psychology. When I posted that this was true. But right now I'm lacking the curiosity/patience.

I'd say we get annoyed by it because it often looks like a jungle of statements that aren't meant to be comprehended logically, and obviously we don't (usually) value things like that. But you may approach it in a different way than most. Damn, there's my curiosity. What's your ...metaperspective of faith and what you try yo do when talking about it?


----------



## magi83

I know that the MBTI type interaction seems to have gone out of fashion a little but I'm still slightly frustrated that my previous attempts to arrange an interaction all failed.

If anyone is keen, just let me know what time suits for you and I will do my best to facilitate. Just bear in mind that I am GMT+10.


----------



## Musiqientist

Hi there everyone,

sorry to hear it if it's true that this awesome thread has lost popularity. Seems like it has though since the last post was in August. Either way just in case some people are still active on here, I'd be interested to do one. I'd prefer to try an interaction with an intuitive type as I think we will share more topics of interest in terms of type but anyone can feel free to contact me if your interested! Thanks.


----------



## B00Bz

I would be interested in this. I am GMT -8.


----------



## perpetuallyreticent

Ergh, sounds fun but.... soo.... awkward. So out of my comfort zone.


----------



## BluIon

Kito said:


> I love your eyes!
> 
> Anyway, I'll do it but I'll have to make my videos private, don't want anyone I know in real life finding them haha. I hope that's fine.


hahhaa what a enfj thing to say


----------



## Choice

magi83 said:


> I know that the MBTI type interaction seems to have gone out of fashion a little but I'm still slightly frustrated that my previous attempts to arrange an interaction all failed.
> 
> If anyone is keen, just let me know what time suits for you and I will do my best to facilitate. Just bear in mind that I am GMT+10.


I'm looking for GMT 12pm to 3pm timeslots (or GMT 12am to 3pm on Sundays). 

Preferably people who do the recording for me + post video as unlisted.

PM if interested.


----------



## I_am_the_NiTe

My editing skills aren't the greatest this time around, but I think you all might enjoy this.
I interviewed two of my good friends, who I've had some difficulty typing (although ISTJ and INTJ are reasonable explanations)






Part 2:

https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&video_id=43awYJSS9q0


----------



## Morn

INTJ vs ESFP

I've actually had this conversation or rather something very similar with my ESFJ mother...


----------



## Straystuff

Still up for this if anyone can handle GMT+2 :'D


----------



## Morn

I'm also in GMT+10.


----------



## Willsgotbeer

Let me know if any of you guys are interested in doing a interaction with a ENTP I'm itching to participate!


----------



## Willsgotbeer

RARE ENTP INTERACTION WITH ENTP! will do more if anyone is interested.


----------



## katsux

this is an interesting concept. No time to look through all 200 pages to see how it works but maybe if I get a better understanding I'll do one with my ISFJ sister.


----------



## Choice

Straystuff said:


> Still up for this if anyone can handle GMT+2 :'D





Morn said:


> I'm also in GMT+10.





Willsgotbeer said:


> Let me know if any of you guys are interested in doing a interaction with a ENTP I'm itching to participate!



What times are you available?

Any chance we could do a quartet or a trio?


----------



## Straystuff

Choice said:


> What times are you available?
> 
> Any chance we could do a quartet or a trio?


This might interesting, but keep in mind I am GMT +2 :'D With some exceptions I'm available from 12pm to 12am my time. If someone can make that work I'm in


----------



## Morn

Pretty much only weekends!


----------



## Choice

Straystuff said:


> This might interesting, but keep in mind I am GMT +2 :'D With some exceptions I'm available from 12pm to 12am my time. If someone can make that work I'm in





Morn said:


> Pretty much only weekends! Workaholic.



How does this coming Sunday 11:00 A.M GMT sound? That shound be 1pm for Stray & 9pm for Morn (Time can be shifted a bit. I'm GMT +8 and good for all of Sunday)

Have you both got google hangout accounts?


----------



## Straystuff

Choice said:


> How does this coming Sunday 11:00 A.M GMT sound? That shound be 1pm for Stray & 9pm for Morn (Time can be shifted a bit. I'm GMT +8 and good for all of Sunday)
> 
> If not, any upcoming Saturday 12pm GMT works too.
> 
> Have you both got google hangout accounts?


Sounds cool to me 

Also yup, I have an account there.


----------



## Choice

*Intj, enfj, estp*






@Straystuff @Morn
If you'll excuse my stuttering.


----------



## Straystuff

Choice said:


> @Straystuff @Morn
> If you'll excuse my stuttering.


It's ok if you excuse my english and the fact that I didn't hear everything you said :'D I don't know if I have bad headphones or what but the voice quality in my end was really bad :/

Also I'm sorry if I talked too much in the end?? I wasn't sure who was leading the conversation so I paniced a bit :'D


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## Willsgotbeer

I'm on it, pm me for details if you are serious about it.


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## linatet

Double post


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## linatet

Hey I am in for a chat!
Probably INFJ here
I would like to understand more of INTP, INTJ, ENFJ, INFP, INFJ (because these are the types of my family and friends)


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## Dixie

I'm okay with chatting a little bit, but i cba to organize a hangout meeting..


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## aef8234

So how would this work exactly? I.. really don't want to read 200+ pages to see.


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## Im FiNe

aef8234 said:


> So how would this work exactly? I.. really don't want to read 200+ pages to see.


It's up to the participants to agree on time, method for connecting, and content. Somebody has to record the interaction, upload the video, and link to it here. Here's an example from a 4-part interaction (one long interaction subsequently broken into 4 videos) that I enjoyed watching.

* *


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## aef8234

Im FiNe said:


> It's up to the participants to agree on time, method for connecting, and content. Somebody has to record the interaction, upload the video, and link to it here. Here's an example from a 4-part interaction (one long interaction subsequently broken into 4 videos) that I enjoyed watching.
> 
> * *


So who's doing the organizing right now?


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> So who's doing the organizing right now?


from what i'm noticing it seems anyone can volunteer to organize it, whether it's on here or PM, hell make a group.
it's just, who's willing to do it is all.


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> from what i'm noticing it seems anyone can volunteer to organize it, whether it's on here or PM, hell make a group.
> it's just, who's willing to do it is all.


In that case, icallnotitonthegruntwork.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> In that case, icallnotitonthegruntwork.


how cute. 

i'm willing to set something up on Skype, but someone else is going to have to set up a recording and put the video out here because i'm not as familiar, and my computer might not be able to handle it. kind of old, has less than the normal amount of specs an average computer has, and it lags like crazy at times.


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> how cute.
> 
> i'm willing to set something up on Skype, but someone else is going to have to set up a recording and put the video out here because i'm not as familiar, and my computer might not be able to handle it. kind of old, has less than the normal amount of specs an average computer has, and it lags like crazy at times.


No idea how to record, but I know how to upload, and my computer should be able to handle it.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> No idea how to record, but I know how to upload, and my computer should be able to handle it.


should we wait for more people? (which i'm somewhat in favor for due to diversity. up to 4 people is my limit )


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> should we wait for more people? (which i'm somewhat in favor for due to diversity. up to 4 people is my limit )


We should get 80 PEOPLE.
Or at least a lot more than 2


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> We should get 80 PEOPLE.
> Or at least a lot more than 2


eh-

if we have a lot of people then i won't be able to talk to everyone all at once in a manner that's more involved so to speak.


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> eh-
> 
> if we have a lot of people then i won't be able to talk to everyone all at once in a manner that's more involved so to speak.





Dixie said:


> I'm okay with chatting a little bit, but i cba to organize a hangout meeting..





linatet said:


> Hey I am in for a chat!
> Probably INFJ here
> I would like to understand more of INTP, INTJ, ENFJ, INFP, INFJ (because these are the types of my family and friends)


These people might be interested.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

@Dixie @linatet @aef8234

alright then, time to get serious. 

I can host the call on Skype, but i'm not familiar with recording. Can any of you guys record the talk here? 

there's also Timezones as well. what are yours, so that i can find a time to arrange the meeting.


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## aef8234

If no one volunteers I'll just wing it, but like I said, preferably more than two people.
Also my time zones... like..
UTC -8:00?


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## aef8234

Im FiNe said:


> It's up to the participants to agree on time, method for connecting, and content. Somebody has to record the interaction, upload the video, and link to it here. Here's an example from a 4-part interaction (one long interaction subsequently broken into 4 videos) that I enjoyed watching.
> 
> * *


Welp, considering everything's almost square and we just need more people, wanna join?


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> If no one volunteers I'll just wing it, but like I said, preferably more than two people.
> Also my time zones... like..
> UTC -8:00?


I perfer more than two people as well. my time is PST.


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## Angina Jolie

Hola. I would like to join in too. INFP. Time zone +1


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

@Shameless Nation @aef8234

i should follow the same standards then. UTC -8:00. 

I'm saying we should wait for at least 1 or 2 more guests.


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## Im FiNe

aef8234 said:


> Welp, considering everything's almost square and we just need more people, wanna join?


Thanks for the invite, but I don't have the tech to join (no microphone, no camera) ... and .... would be rather .... uncomfortable ... being so .... visible. :blushed:


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

Im FiNe said:


> Thanks for the invite, but I don't have the tech to join (no microphone, no camera) ... and .... would be rather .... uncomfortable ... being so .... visible. :blushed:


i understand you. tbh i'm not even going to show my face, just the avatar. and i've started teaching myself the tech. 

i know how to get everyone on Skype, but i just need to find a way to stream the video, which is with software i need to teach myself how to work with-


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> i understand you. tbh i'm not even going to show my face, just the avatar. and i've started teaching myself the tech.
> 
> i know how to get everyone on Skype, but i just need to find a way to stream the video, which is with software i need to teach myself how to work with-






Without the game, of course, or with.


----------



## aef8234

Im FiNe said:


> Thanks for the invite, but I don't have the tech to join (no microphone, no camera) ... and .... would be rather .... uncomfortable ... being so .... visible. :blushed:


 You get used to being visible the more you do it. Not to mention it'll be fun.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> Without the game, of course, or with.


i have checked around with fraps, apparently in order to do the things needed i'd need to buy that. Not going to go through that.
i'm looking up tutorials on OBS, and reached a few tech difficulties (hooray for having crappy computer) might need to install a few things to support it


----------



## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> i have checked around with fraps, apparently in order to do the things needed i'd need to buy that. Not going to go through that.
> i'm looking up tutorials on OBS, and reached a few tech difficulties (hooray for having crappy computer) might need to install a few things to support it


You could torrent fraps or use the demo version?


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> You could torrent fraps or use the demo version?


i could do that, although i'm already tinkering with OBS xD


----------



## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> i could do that, although i'm already tinkering with OBS xD


Never heard of that before


----------



## EyesOpen

I might be up for it.. I'm also PST or -8 UTC. I think I'm available late Sunday (tomorrow) and pretty much any time this Monday or Tuesday.

As far as I know, the Google+ Hang Out with "on air" function is the easiest free way to record but I don't know for sure how it works..you might have to have a linked YouTube account at the least.


----------



## InsertCreativeNameHere

EyesOpen said:


> I might be up for it.. I'm also PST or -8 UTC. I think I'm available late Sunday (tomorrow) and pretty much any time this Monday or Tuesday.
> 
> As far as I know, the Google+ Hang Out with "on air" function is the easiest free way to record but I don't know for sure how it works..you might have to have a linked YouTube account at the least.


time to check out google plus then. 

nice to know most of us are -8 that makes things easier xD


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## Im FiNe

aef8234 said:


> You get used to being visible the more you do it. Not to mention it'll be fun.


It's not the visibility to other people on the conference...or even to those really interested in personality theory like many seem to be at PerC...but rather that the internet is highly public and persistent such that even good things about people can be twisted and used against them. :crying:


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## aef8234

Im FiNe said:


> It's not the visibility to other people on the conference...or even to those really interested in personality theory like many seem to be at PerC...but rather that the internet is highly public and persistent such that even good things about people can be twisted and used against them. :crying:


You do realize that there are billions of internet users, right?
And only about 4000-ish come here.


----------



## InsertCreativeNameHere

Im FiNe said:


> It's not the visibility to other people on the conference...or even to those really interested in personality theory like many seem to be at PerC...but rather that the internet is highly public and persistent such that even good things about people can be twisted and used against them. :crying:



i mean sure it'll be seen, but it's not like it's going to be a viral video or anything. that's a rare phenomenon. not many people are going to care besides the people here. If you don't have family members subscribed to you, and if they're not tech savvy, they'll probably not see it.


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## Inveniet

I've done this before way back in this thread.
Deleted all the interaction back then though on my side.

I could be open to doing it again, google hangouts is pretty easy and my youtube is linked up.

Only question is who do I talk to and about what?


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## aef8234

hornet said:


> I've done this before way back in this thread.
> Deleted all the interaction back then though on my side.
> 
> I could be open to doing it again, google hangouts is pretty easy and my youtube is linked up.
> 
> Only question is who do I talk to and about what?


 *@InsertCreativeNameHere *<-


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## Inveniet

aef8234 said:


> *@InsertCreativeNameHere *<-


Now I don't want to partake anymore.


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## aef8234

hornet said:


> Now I don't want to partake anymore.


khavefun


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## Angina Jolie

Just checking in again, cuz I'm still interested. Please, if it's happening, PM me


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## Lord Fudgingsley

hornet said:


> I've done this before way back in this thread.
> Deleted all the interaction back then though on my side.
> 
> I could be open to doing it again, google hangouts is pretty easy and my youtube is linked up.
> 
> Only question is who do I talk to and about what?


I could speak to you. We could discuss typology if all other topics fail. I'd gladly discuss typology in itself, actually.


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> i mean sure it'll be seen, but it's not like it's going to be a viral video or anything. that's a rare phenomenon. not many people are going to care besides the people here. If you don't have family members subscribed to you, and if they're not tech savvy, they'll probably not see it.


Sooo two more prospective people came in, and this one dude grumped out, think this is enough?


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> Sooo two more prospective people came in, and this one dude grumped out, think this is enough?


 @Lord Fudgingsley @Shameless Nation

four people is enough. i need hangout contacts, since hangouts Air seems Easier to work with. i could talk now, but that would give me around 2 hours at most since it's currently 1 am for me right now, and tomorrow i have summer school until 4pm at PST (-8 UST)


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> @_Lord Fudgingsley_ @_Shameless Nation_
> 
> four people is enough. i need hangout contacts, since hangouts Air seems Easier to work with. i could talk now, but that would give me around 2 hours at most since it's currently 1 am for me right now, and tomorrow i have summer school until 4pm at PST (-8 UST)


 Same time as ever, after 3pm PST, but before 6pm PST Mon/Wed, 12pm - 6pm Tues/Thur, ask me ahead of time during weekends.


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## Lord Fudgingsley

I'm GMT. I'm best accessed 5pm-midnight my time.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

@Lord Fudgingsley @Shameless Nation @aef8234
i am available this week After 4 pm PST on wed, which is around 11 GMT. 

that can give us a duration of 1-2 hours which i thought is enough considering both your time and aef's time, doing the interaction this week

Aef are you free on friday?


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> @_Lord Fudgingsley_ @_Shameless Nation_ @_aef8234_
> i am available this week After 4 pm PST on wed, which is around 11 GMT.
> 
> that can give us a duration of 1-2 hours which i thought is enough considering both your time and aef's time, doing the interaction this week
> 
> Aef are you free on friday?


Yep


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

aef8234 said:


> Yep


i'm free all day on friday as well, so i think we should do it at that time. Much less of a hassle than during any other day. 
@Lord Fudgingsley @Shameless Nation


----------



## Angina Jolie

Im thinking of the time zones now, but friday I'm busy all day.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

@Lord Fudgingsley @Shameless Nation @aef8234

i have more time on Wednesday and the weekends. 

i'm more busy on Teusdays and Thursdays and it doesn't give me as much leeway for the talk, give or take when something comes up when i come home.


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## Lord Fudgingsley

Wednesday is not problematic. I am "[email protected]". I think I am, at least.

I will confirm this when I am on my laptop.


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## kmn1999

Awesome idea - I'd love to try this.


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## bleghc

Hey, sorry for the random question but not sure who to bring it up with… I'll just ask here. Whenever I try watching any of the videos you guys post, it always gives the black static and says to sign in to view the video… do they mean on Youtube? Or are they private videos that may have all coincidentally been deleted because of the period of time since it's been posted? 

Thank youu.  (Also willing to do a video with someone on Google Hangouts. I probably wouldn't be the best organizer for that but maybe someone who happened to be looking for an ENFP? OR an NF of some sort, I don't know. xD)


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## Lord Fudgingsley

I'm gonna have to back out of this one. I've had a sudden influx of workload, and I'm not going to have the time to have a prolonged discussion.


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## aef8234

InsertCreativeNameHere said:


> @_Lord Fudgingsley_ @_Shameless Nation_ @_aef8234_
> 
> i have more time on Wednesday and the weekends.
> 
> i'm more busy on Teusdays and Thursdays and it doesn't give me as much leeway for the talk, give or take when something comes up when i come home.


PRetty much swamped on all weekdays, s=except for firdays. Unless you guys wanna talk at like, 9pm or something.


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## InsertCreativeNameHere

@Shameless Nation @aef8234 

i'm kinda swamped mon-thu as well. Friday doesn't work either due to schedule conflictions here. 
@Hella Rad Trash @kmn1999

care to join?


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## bleghc

@InsertCreativeNameHere Yeah, sure - thanks! How are we going to communicate (ex. Skype or Google Hangouts)? I'll send you my usernames for both. I'm free all weekend as well, though around afternoon to the evening would probably work well. 1-7 in EDT, so 5-11 in GMT. But I'm flexible so. What's the topic of the discussion going to be, by the way?


----------



## InsertCreativeNameHere

Hella Rad Trash said:


> @InsertCreativeNameHere Yeah, sure - thanks! How are we going to communicate (ex. Skype or Google Hangouts)? I'll send you my usernames for both. I'm free all weekend as well, though around afternoon to the evening would probably work well. 1-7 in EDT, so 5-11 in GMT. But I'm flexible so. What's the topic of the discussion going to be, by the way?


oh you already said it here. excuse my PM then please. 
i'm also available on the weekends, but sunday would be a better day for me. 

we're doing this on google Hangouts. 

the topics are something i have not planned, although i assume it would just be about Type and relation to certain things and why.
anybody else can come up with topics on the go if they wanted to.


----------



## Abigail1509

I may be unopposed to doing this!


----------



## Willsgotbeer

Bumpity Bump!


----------



## Korvyna

Oh man... I should film some of the conversations between my husband (INTJ) and I (ENFP). Sometimes it totally flows smoothly, and other times it's totally awkward.


----------



## Amadis

that's annoying how a lot of videos on here are not watchable anymore... 

actually I'm terrified of doing a chat video but at the same time, I see it somewhat like a challenge and I'm curious of what stuff would come up from a conversation with another person somewhat or quite knowleadgeable about MBTI stuff about whatever we will feel like talking about...(also btw I'm fluent in English but not a native English-speaker) if anyone wants to give that experience a shot with an ENFP, here I am :crazy:



Korvyna said:


> Oh man... I should film some of the conversations between my husband (INTJ) and I (ENFP). Sometimes it totally flows smoothly, and other times it's totally awkward.


I would watch that!


----------



## aef8234

Holyshitiforgotaboutthis.

Did it actually go?


----------



## Lady Lullaby

I speak with Jonathan and Iris, both INFJs, about being Enneagram 1 and 9 in the Instinct/Gut Triad.﻿

Looking for INFJs from the other two triads if you're interested! (Including INFJ 8 to complete the Body/Instinct/Gut triad)

https://youtu.be/ro4ALk052KA

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## Choice

Korvyna said:


> Oh man... I should film some of the conversations between my husband (INTJ) and I (ENFP). Sometimes it totally flows smoothly, and other times it's totally awkward.


Awkward in what ways?


----------



## Korvyna

Choice said:


> Awkward in what ways?


Sometimes our differences get in the way. We share the same values, but when it comes to our interests, some are very different. So when we talk about them, and the other one just doesn't get it, the conversation kind of just dies out and we sit in awkward silence.... Until one of us finally asks something like "so, how's your mom?" or "do we have any plans this weekend?" 

And then sometimes, it's just me not understanding him and poking fun at him because he's an easy target. :wink:


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## Lady Lullaby

Here's my INFJ Heart Triad Hangout: https://youtu.be/gkJ8vR19Lbc

I speak with Brenda & Damian, both INFJs, about being Enneagram 2 and 4 in the Heart Triad.

I was not able to find an INFJ E3 to join the hangout - if I find one I'll sure hope to interview them too!

Now I am ready to start scheduling a hangout with INFJs who are from the Head Triad - - any 5, 6, or 7 INFJs here who would like to join me? (Feel free to reply here or in a PM)

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## renna

Lady Lullaby said:


> Here's my INFJ Heart Triad Hangout: https://youtu.be/gkJ8vR19Lbc
> 
> I speak with Brenda & Damian, both INFJs, about being Enneagram 2 and 4 in the Heart Triad.
> 
> I was not able to find an INFJ E3 to join the hangout - if I find one I'll sure hope to interview them too!
> 
> Now I am ready to start scheduling a hangout with INFJs who are from the Head Triad - - any 5, 6, or 7 INFJs here who would like to join me? (Feel free to reply here or in a PM)
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


I'm for sure a type 6! I would love to


----------



## Lady Lullaby

renna said:


> I'm for sure a type 6! I would love to


HOORAY!!

Hi! Will you PM or email me so I can add you on FB - that's where I'm doing a group chat to schedule it. I'm excited!!! :carrot:

I have 2 other INFJs that will be joining us if we get it all worked out!


----------



## renna

Lady Lullaby said:


> HOORAY!!
> 
> Hi! Will you PM or email me so I can add you on FB - that's where I'm doing a group chat to schedule it. I'm excited!!! :carrot:
> 
> I have 2 other INFJs that will be joining us if we get it all worked out!


I don't have Facebook  only access to google hangouts. Is that an issue ?


----------



## Rafiki

I want a video interaction!


----------



## rice_assrust

I want one too. You wanna skype me?

autonomy.debate


----------



## rice_assrust

*ENTP interacts with ENTP - Father and Daughter*

My daughter and I discuss life as ENTP's from the male and female perspective. My daughter talks about how hard it is to find guys.


----------



## Lady Lullaby

renna said:


> I don't have Facebook  only access to google hangouts. Is that an issue ?


Nope not a problem at all. We're doing it on the 5th. I'll find you on Google+ If not - email me! Let's do this!


----------



## Frenetic Tranquility

I want to join


----------



## Lady Lullaby

Frenetic Tranquility said:


> I want to join


:happy: I'd be happy to do an interaction video with you sometime with others too! This particular video is for INFJs of the Enneagram Head Triad - - seeing as you're ENTP it'll have to be a different set!

Thanks for the interest though! :kitteh:


----------

