# How could I feel and look attractive as a guy?



## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

I believe there's the usual goals of hygiene, personality, level of physical fitness and consent in order for a guy to be seen as attractive. I could meet those though, but what bothers me more is about what I could wear to appear attractive to others.

Outside of casual situations, I believe there isn't a lot guys can do in this situation. Suits are almost universally considered to be the essential item of clothing that increase a guy's level of attractiveness - they're also considered to be more appropriate for a wider variety of occasions compared to other items or types of clothing. I could appear more attractive to other people, but I wouldn't _feel_ the same way. Suits, to me, signify money and political power - I still might not enjoy wearing a suit because I feel like it's cheating, in those aspects. If money were no object, I believe that suits are soulless pieces of fabric.

I admit, that I'm trying to gain attractiveness through physical means - I've been wearing sleeveless tops frequently, which I also admit that I have a fetish for (I didn't like wearing such tops in the past though); in certain, maybe many situations, such attire would be inappropriate for guys, and may not even be attractive for them. I feel like the same might go with hair length as well as the degree of skin guys can expose. I also admit that I'm envious of what women are appreciated for, but at the same time, I'm quite guilty of how us guys are primarily appreciative of women for their looks - according to online threads, this is a frustration of women, how men will typically only like women for their looks.


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## Belzy (Aug 12, 2013)

Be confident and fake, that's usually the way to go.



Riven said:


> Outside of casual situations, I believe there isn't a lot guys can do in this situation. Suits are almost universally considered to be the essential item of clothing that increase a guy's level of attractiveness - they're also considered to be more appropriate for a wider variety of occasions compared to other items or types of clothing. I could appear more attractive to other people, but* I wouldn't feel the same way*. Suits, to me, signify money and political power - I still might not enjoy wearing a suit because* I feel like it's cheating*, in those aspects. If money were no object, *I believe that suits are soulless pieces of fabric*.


The curse of being an INFP.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

AAADD said:


> Be confident and fake, that's usually the way to go.
> 
> 
> 
> The curse of being an INFP.


I like being an INFP

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## Belzy (Aug 12, 2013)

Riven said:


> I like being an INFP
> 
> Sent from my ZTE BLADE V0800 using Tapatalk


Just be confident then. That's what's (most?) attractive in a guy.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

AAADD said:


> Just be confident then. That's what's (most?) attractive in a guy.


Thing is, I can't pick out cues that someone finds me attractive, unless they tell me explicitly. If they do tell me, I can't believe it for long, or I may believe I'm attracting the wrong people. 

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## Belzy (Aug 12, 2013)

Riven said:


> Thing is, I can't pick out cues that someone finds me attractive, unless they tell me explicitly. If they do tell me, I can't believe it for long, or I may believe I'm attracting the wrong people.
> 
> Sent from my ZTE BLADE V0800 using Tapatalk


Just assume one finds you attractive, and wants to hear all about you.

If one actually will and keeps listening to you, spends time with you, then well, it means you are to her.



Better believe it they do. It's up to them to decide you are attractive to them, not [up to] you.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

AAADD said:


> Just assume one finds you attractive, and wants to hear all about you.
> 
> If one actually will and keeps listening to you, spends time with you, then well, it means you are to her.
> 
> ...


I might keep coming on them and be labelled a creep 

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## clem (Jun 10, 2017)

Aesthetic appearance is subjective and depends on what you are trying to attract and why. INFP seems to care about the feelings more, so feeling attractive is more about self esteem, which is not that related to clothes. Try finding people that boost your ego.


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## VinnieBob (Mar 24, 2014)

cleavage


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## incision (May 23, 2010)

Be comfortable in yourself and if that self is the type of person that others find attractive, they will be attracted. Authenticity is a very attractive quality to many unless the authentic self is an ass which most people aren't.


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## master of time and space (Feb 16, 2017)

there are many things that attractive. 

Physical attributes, beautiful eyes, skin tones, hair style. intelligence, humour, demeanour, the smile, wisdom. Creativity and individualism 

I am sure you are the whole package. I suppose what I am trying to say is; “you are at this time is perfect”. You do not need to aspire to what others want or desire. The old cliché “just be yourself” really is the key to success with women. They love us for being us, it really is that simple


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Your question can essentially be summed up as: how can I attract women?

Let me tell you something I learnt the hard way... women are attracted to *real *men.

Literally ignore a woman who tells you she is attracted to all these homosexual looking soyboys that have even lower testosterone levels than men in their 70s. Ignore her and then put her in her place by telling her to shut up because she doesn't get to tell you how to behave just because it's attractive to her in that moment.

I know it sounds stupid, but fucking believe me, you have got to show dominance (in the form of assertiveness most women call this "boldness" - *shudders*) in order to attract a woman.

You must also show the propensity for success. Note I said _propensity for success. _You don't actually have to be successful (yet!), you just have to have a goal, and be willing to work towards it. Women hate lazy men.

Finally you have to be willing to share. However, the word "share" here means different things to each gender. Unfortunately in regards to men "sharing" means "sacrificing one's self for the benefit of others via hard work" -- aka can you provide for her?

Even the 40 something year old disgustingly ugly slut harpies with a permanent moustache line showing, that pissed away their youth by "working on their career" and sleeping around because "muh feminism" who literally have skin that physically look like ash trays because they smoke like a chimney, yet have fuck all to offer anyone, let alone a man, oh and live with a cat, if not a MALE dog (notice, women never buy female dogs?) prefer to date men who earn more than they do. So that should tell you something.

Once I figured out that most women are basically functionally retarded when it comes to knowing what they want, getting in their pants became a lot easier. The rule can be summated into this axiom: "men test ideas, women test men".

And the last bit of advice: Never. Get. Feelings. 

The less you care about a woman the better.

Note: I didn't say anything about mistreating a woman, I just said ignore her when she tells you what she "wants" cos chances are she doesn't even fucking know cos she's that fucking dumb and you'll be wasting your time.

edit: There is a reason 50 shades of grey was the fastest selling book of ALL TIME.


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## leftover crack (May 12, 2013)

DAPHNE XO said:


> notice, women never buy female dogs?


dat aint true doe


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## leftover crack (May 12, 2013)

in order to appear attractive to females you mustn't worry about your attire but shift your focus on what you could offer in a relationship. You should focus on looking out for willing females in your life and really find the one with whom you have a connection, that is, if you do manage to connect with another sentient being instead of focusing all of your attention on yourself.


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## Penny (Mar 24, 2016)

Riven said:


> I believe there's the usual goals of hygiene, personality, level of physical fitness and consent in order for a guy to be seen as attractive. I could meet those though, but what bothers me more is about what I could wear to appear attractive to others.
> 
> Outside of casual situations, I believe there isn't a lot guys can do in this situation. Suits are almost universally considered to be the essential item of clothing that increase a guy's level of attractiveness - they're also considered to be more appropriate for a wider variety of occasions compared to other items or types of clothing. I could appear more attractive to other people, but I wouldn't _feel_ the same way. Suits, to me, signify money and political power - I still might not enjoy wearing a suit because I feel like it's cheating, in those aspects. If money were no object, I believe that suits are soulless pieces of fabric.
> 
> I admit, that I'm trying to gain attractiveness through physical means - I've been wearing sleeveless tops frequently, which I also admit that I have a fetish for (I didn't like wearing such tops in the past though); in certain, maybe many situations, such attire would be inappropriate for guys, and may not even be attractive for them. I feel like the same might go with hair length as well as the degree of skin guys can expose. I also admit that I'm envious of what women are appreciated for, but at the same time, I'm quite guilty of how us guys are primarily appreciative of women for their looks - according to online threads, this is a frustration of women, how men will typically only like women for their looks.


I think style does matter. I also think that your personal style can say a lot about you and what is most important is that you feel comfortable in what you are wearing in that it expresses your individual personality. I personally don't care for suits because they remind me of my dad, and they are generally for business attire though there are suits for more creative types, but still, suits for everyday wear? if you aren't sure what you want your look to be like i would suggest looking through fashion magazines or maybe watching fashion shows (like maybe try to find some Queer Eye for the Straight Guy shows) or notice what other people are wearing that you like. (You can even ask them where they got it.) If you don't like the styles you see, then at least you will know what you don't like. of course what you wear is going to depend on where you shop as well and what is available. You could always just try on different stuff and see how you feel and look in it. If you put it on and look in the mirror and think "I love this!" then it will probably be a good buy.


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Your question can essentially be summed up as: how can I attract women?
> 
> Let me tell you something I learnt the hard way... women are attracted to *real *men.
> 
> ...


Ignore her when she tells you what shes wants because she is dumb...

But I am so smart that I know what all women want ;D 

Seems logical lmao


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

succ said:


> dat aint true doe



Wow, what a sophisticated and nuanced rebuttal.

Surely, I have been pwned.

Damn, I literally will go hang my head in shame.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> Ignore her when she tells you what shes wants because she is dumb...
> 
> But I am so smart that I know what all women want ;D
> 
> Seems logical lmao


Every woman has essentially the same biological make up, so yes it is possible to generalise about female behaviour, because every woman has a vagina, and the bits that control her instincts/urges to yield the almighty power of that pucci.

You know what is affected by our biology? Our mating and sexual strategies as a species.

Men want to have as much sex as possible, this is mainly due to their levels of testosterone - hence why ****** liberal soyboys are turning away from sex the more and more they behave like women.

Women want to amass resources to ensure the survival of their offspring this is mainly due to their levels of oestrogen and oxytocin - hence why the retarded ugly third wave feminists will demonise men, but still expect the state to pay for all their shit. (Men on the whole pay more taxes than women. Taxation is just a way to transfer wealth from men to women on a societal level.)


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## deaddead (Jan 1, 2018)

smell good! and u will never be forgotten


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Every woman has essentially the same biological make up, so yes it is possible to generalise about female behaviour, because every woman has a vagina, and the bits that control her instincts/urges to yield the almighty power of that pucci.
> 
> You know what is affected by our biology? Our mating and sexual strategies as a species.
> 
> ...


I see you're just another alt-right soldier, but there's nothing I can do about that. I say that liberalism isn't the only thing making men turn away from sex though, since I see especially religious institutions complain about sex in society. 


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Your question can essentially be summed up as: how can I attract women?
> 
> Let me tell you something I learnt the hard way... women are attracted to *real *men.
> 
> ...


I can sort of see why. This animated series I'm watching has the girls obsessed with some rather fucked up dude.

By the way I wish I could look like a homosexual looking soyboy, but I guess my biology made me unlucky in that regard (or lucky in your respect). I wouldn't mind building some muscle though, otherwise. 

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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

And I forgot I could use multi-quote.



General Lee Awesome said:


> Ignore her when she tells you what shes wants because she is dumb...
> 
> But I am so smart that I know what all women want ;D
> 
> Seems logical lmao


I think she's red-pilled :/ 



MsBrightside said:


> I think style does matter. I also think that your personal style can say a lot about you and what is most important is that you feel comfortable in what you are wearing in that it expresses your individual personality. I personally don't care for suits because they remind me of my dad, and they are generally for business attire though there are suits for more creative types, but still, suits for everyday wear? if you aren't sure what you want your look to be like i would suggest looking through fashion magazines or maybe watching fashion shows (like maybe try to find some Queer Eye for the Straight Guy shows) or notice what other people are wearing that you like. (You can even ask them where they got it.) If you don't like the styles you see, then at least you will know what you don't like. of course what you wear is going to depend on where you shop as well and what is available. You could always just try on different stuff and see how you feel and look in it. If you put it on and look in the mirror and think "I love this!" then it will probably be a good buy.


A lot of styles for guys I admit I don't like that much. I guess I could go for more alternative looks though - at least considering where I live, the style might not be embraced as much, even if it is quite a liberal place. As I mentioned, I have a thing for sleeveless tops (used to not like those sort of tops in the past, actually) now, to try and get over my envy of what women can wear and maybe make them envious or something as well with certain tops. 

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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Riven said:


> I can sort of see why. This animated series I'm watching has the girls obsessed with some rather fucked up dude.
> 
> By the way I wish I could look like a homosexual looking soyboy, but I guess my biology made me unlucky in that regard (or lucky in your respect). I wouldn't mind building some muscle though, otherwise.
> 
> Sent from my ZTE BLADE V0800 using Tapatalk


I don't know how old you are. But trust me when you get into your mid 20s the ****** homosexual looking soyboys get ZERO pucci.

ZERO.

period.

End of.

This is non debatable self-evident truth.

That is why male "feminists" are more likely to be rapists and sexual predators - it's almost like they waited too long to realise that being a ****** that acts like a woman, isn't going to attract a woman.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Riven said:


> I see you're just another alt-right soldier, but there's nothing I can do about that. I say that liberalism isn't the only thing making men turn away from sex though, since I see especially religious institutions complain about sex in society.
> 
> 
> Sent from my ZTE BLADE V0800 using Tapatalk



I don't really have a sensible definition of alt-right, because it's called everything and also nothing. So I doubt I'm that.

I'm speaking from my personal experience - the less I cared about a woman, the more pucci I got.

It doesn't take a genius to realise you should keep doing what works to get what you want. Lol

Men talk about sex more than religious institutions do, though sometimes both things are one and the same.


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> I don't know how old you are. But trust me when you get into your mid 20s the ****** homosexual looking soyboys get ZERO pucci.
> 
> ZERO.
> 
> ...


lol, so many unsupported claims.. I wonder when they will be lacing anti-freeze with your kool-aid.


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Every woman has essentially the same biological make up, so yes it is possible to generalise about female behaviour, because every woman has a vagina, and the bits that control her instincts/urges to yield the almighty power of that pucci.
> 
> You know what is affected by our biology? Our mating and sexual strategies as a species.
> 
> ...


you know what affects mating choices? upbringing, society influences, and parents ;D..

You are assuming that we are dictated purely by our genes.. even then, your generalization is far too broad to include all women.


> Women may have evolved to seek out virility, but that doesn’t mean that their preference in a modern context is always for “manly” men (and ditto for men’s attraction to “fertile looking” women). Not all — or even the majority — of women prefer more masculine men. One study found that context matters: Women living in poorer environments may have a greater preference for masculine men, but women in more developed areas prefer more feminine-looking men, according to a study from the Face Research Laboratory


https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704100604575145810050665030


Oh where did you get the idea that men are turning away from sex because of "soyboyism".... just because it contain estrogen class horomone doesn't mean it function the same way in human nor is it actually the same horomone.. This is why you can get infected with plant virus..and be completely ok ;D The soyboy nonsense is largely bullshit. 

I also don't think the wannabe "macho" MGTOWs are getting much action ;D No wonder they bitch and moan about the women today.. if you can't attract them, at least you get to whine about them right?


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> you know what affects mating choices? upbringing, society influences, and parents ;D..
> 
> You are assuming that we are dictated purely by our genes.. even then, your generalization is far too broad to include all women.
> 
> ...


I bet you think gender is a choice too.

I am not saying we are dictated by our genes, it is your failure to abstract individuals from a generalisation that is the issue: women are women, but one woman is not all women. Pretty common sense and obvious.


Men are _not_ turning away from sex, they are turning away from women! Not the same thing!

It is not natural for men to turn away from women en masse. MGTOW is essentially the idea men no longer want to have anything to do with women. Sure probably about 40% of them would have never gotten a woman anyway because they are not considered attractive enough. But the other 60% of them consciously choosing to stay away from women is dangerous to society.

But retard third wave feminists are too stupid to see that, and continue to drive men away even more.


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> I bet you think gender is a choice too.
> 
> I am not saying we are dictated by our genes, it is your failure to abstract individuals from a generalisation that is the issue: women are women, but one woman is not all women. Pretty common sense and obvious.
> 
> ...


Nope, gender is not a choice.. you are born into that gender.. However gender is not necessarly linked with your biological sex ;D 

not according to studies.. what and who we found attractive is changing, largely due to environmental influences..



> Women may have evolved to seek out virility, but that doesn’t mean that their preference in a modern context is always for “manly” men (and ditto for men’s attraction to “fertile looking” women). Not all — or even the majority — of women prefer more masculine men. One study found that context matters: Women living in poorer environments may have a greater preference for masculine men, but women in more developed areas prefer more feminine-looking men, according to a study from the Face Research Laboratory.


A huge flawed generalization that does not take into account to all the environmental influences is not worth engaging.. any "abstraction" from such generalization will be pretty much meaningless. 

No, it is not natural, and it has nothing to do with Soy... We are living in a different world now. Women demand more from men and some weaker men just can't handle it ;D..


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704100604575145810050665030


Let me give you a quick schooling in all print media: if you're reading it, then it's for you.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> not according to studies.. what and who we found attractive is changing, largely due to environmental influences..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you're reading it, then it's for you ;D

But I am 100% certain that this will fly over your head, and you'll miss the point.

It's cool though, you continue in your journeys of soyboyism and call me when you actually want to start getting laid.

As people with brains know, the proof is in the pudding.


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> If you're reading it, then it's for you ;D
> 
> But I am 100% certain that this will fly over your head, and you'll miss the point.
> 
> ...


 @Deprecator hey look dude a non-liberal criticizing the source and not the content of the article itself. ;D 

any attempt at refuting what the study has found? ;D? a shitty attempt will do.. anything is fine at this point lmao ;d 

regular soy consumption doesn't turn men feminine ;D there is no proof of it. Maybe try to support your claims ;D?


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> @*Deprecator* hey look dude a non-liberal criticizing the source and not the content of the article itself. ;D
> 
> any attempt at refuting what the study has found? ;D? a shitty attempt will do.. anything is fine at this point lmao ;d
> 
> regular soy consumption doesn't turn men feminine ;D there is no proof of it. Maybe try to support your claims ;D?


Are you being obtuse on purpose?

The statement is _directly and necessarily _talking about content.

I've said my piece, listen or don't listen. Whatever. Not like I care if you're getting laid or not.


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## leftover crack (May 12, 2013)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Wow, what a sophisticated and nuanced rebuttal.
> 
> Surely, I have been pwned.
> 
> Damn, I literally will go hang my head in shame.


im a natural


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Are you being obtuse on purpose?
> 
> The statement is _directly and necessarily _talking about content.
> 
> I've said my piece, listen or don't listen. Whatever. Not like I care if you're getting laid or not.


lolololol what you said about the content is the equivalent of jamming your fingers into your ears... now please come up with real rebuttals to the content itself and the findings of the study.


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## clem (Jun 10, 2017)

I’m not sure if @Riven ever said anything about attracting females, only about feeling and looking attractive as a guy. 


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> lolololol what you said about the content is the equivalent of jamming your fingers into your ears... now please come up with real rebuttals to the content itself and the findings of the study.


Okay, let me say this another way since apparently all meaning is lost on you: no I don't care to read whatever nonsense is in that article because i don't care what it says at all.

I don't care that you are basing all your hopes of finding a mate on it either and I'm not going to waste my time arguing something that is quite clearly self-evidently false.

You are a waste of my time and a huge one at that. Debating with you is boring, because you never say anything interesting and your arguments are always really shallow too.

It's like picking low hanging fruit. There's no challenge, nothing to learn just, senseless yapping from someone who never says anything but speaks a lot.


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## ChrisLundahl (Dec 11, 2017)

Stop caring about what others think and just do whatever you want. Also the youtube channel teachingmenfashion have some great tips


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

DAPHNE XO said:


> Okay, let me say this another way since apparently all meaning is lost on you: no I don't care to read whatever nonsense is in that article because i don't care what it says at all.
> 
> I don't care that you are basing all your hopes of finding a mate on it either and I'm not going to waste my time arguing something that is quite clearly self-evidently false.
> 
> ...


read you loud and clear. it is not that hard to follow your train of "thoughts". what you are saying is what I am describing.. apparently, you didn't realize it.. but let me explain in a way that a child can understand.

I am saying, if you are going dismiss all the opposing data that shows the opposite of your worldview, then in your mind it would be obvious that your worldview is "self-evident". (this paper is obviously wrong because it is different from what I think is correct) ;D. If you think it is soo obviously wrong, then prove it? wouldn't be so hard right if it was soo obvious? Which is why I said you were jamming your fingers in your ears. So unless you are going to refute the paper's findings.. you are just arguing from feelings. ;D


ofc, you are only interested in things that confirm your bias lmao... I would hardly call that a debate.. I think you are better suited for a circle jerk because any actions that involve you thinking outside your pre-disposed conception is "boring" ;D.

Ofc, what I am arguing has nothing to do with my personal situation ;d..


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## Notus Asphodelus (Jan 20, 2015)

vinniebob said:


> cleavage


Hahahahahahhahaha!! Just unbutton the first few and boom..


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

General Lee Awesome said:


> I am saying, *if you are going dismiss all the opposing data that shows the opposite of your worldview, then in your mind it would be obvious that your worldview is "self-evident"*.


This does not logically follow, so the rest of your argument is invalid.

In fact it doesn't even make sense tbh.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

clem said:


> Oh yes I’m assuming people go to the gym like me.
> 
> I really shouldn’t do that.


I just need to go more - physical activity doesn't particularly excite me as much as something like games do though. 

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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

Mude said:


> To OP,
> 
> Assuming this is about casual style, I would caution against trying to cast too broad a net. Presumably, you want to attract people who are compatible with you so those are the ones you should concern yourself with appealing to. Even then, there's little advantage in wearing clothing that completely contradicts who you are underneath to attract more people. In the end, the underneath is what you want people to be attracted to.
> 
> ...


What if this applied to something beyond casual situations, but not something formal? Something in between? Especially since I'm going for something like sleeveless shirts and cap sleeve tops a lot now, something I didn't like in the past. As I said, I envy how women are appreciated. 

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## Peter (Feb 27, 2010)

Riven said:


> OK, but it looks like I'm kinda stuck with the lame clothes us guys are generally allowed to wear I think. I also envy how women aren't so hooked up about if something looks sexy or not. I wish men could have the same manner of attraction as women do. People complain about men in how they're mostly the perpetrators of sexual abuse.


In discussions about male and female behaviour people always go to extremes. Ignore that.

Normal behaviour is what matters. And sorry, but male attractiveness is different from female attractiveness. That's just the way it is.

Work on your posture. Go to the gym, strengthen your muscles. No need to get your muscles bigger, but simple strength training in order to improve your posture will help a lot. And you'll be amazed how just getting a better posture changes how people respond to you. And in reply to that, your confidence will improve which will make you feel better about your own attractiveness.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

Peter said:


> In discussions about male and female behaviour people always go to extremes. Ignore that.
> 
> *Normal behaviour is what matters. And sorry, but male attractiveness is different from female attractiveness. That's just the way it is.*
> 
> Work on your posture. Go to the gym, strengthen your muscles. No need to get your muscles bigger, but simple strength training in order to improve your posture will help a lot. And you'll be amazed how just getting a better posture changes how people respond to you. And in reply to that, your confidence will improve which will make you feel better about your own attractiveness.


I hope with cybernetics or whatever we can change this though.


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## zombiefishy (May 12, 2013)

Perhaps taking care of your skin as well?

I always feel better about my appearance when I do my skin care routine and feel icky if I don't (cos of laziness).


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## Peter (Feb 27, 2010)

Riven said:


> I hope with cybernetics or whatever we can change this though.


We don't need to change this. Why would you put your hopes in something that at best will be available long after you died? Go the route I mentioned..... but perhaps that's too much hard work?


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## Potatooesunshinerays (Dec 26, 2017)

Study fashion and colors, look at runway


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## clem (Jun 10, 2017)

@Riven you can get an attractive woman friend or girlfriend and that makes you appear more attractive.


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

Peter said:


> We don't need to change this. Why would you put your hopes in something that at best will be available long after you died? Go the route I mentioned..... but perhaps that's too much hard work?


IDK. It just sucks. People complain about how men are the perpetrators of sex abuse (in most cases) enough already. Women complain enough I think about how they're being objectified. I don't want to be part of this.


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## frankfurtboi (Feb 3, 2018)

To me, beauty comes with acceptance and discovery of who one really is or wants to be, in the sense that it helps you solve your moral conflicts in a healthy way and makes oneself happy in the short and long run. I think when we discover ourselves, but most importantly accept ourselves and cultivate our virtues, our inner beauty flourishes. A beauty that is not a rigid standard one can see in a model, or a concept that is too far away from our own experience. It's a weird feeling of knowing this clothes are the ones for you, despite what others think about it, to know what your hair looks better for yourself, and to know what's beautiful for yourself. I think we all have some beauty in the inside, as a taste and reason, but sometimes society puts too much pressure on some standards. I prefer to be myself despite what others could say and... I think I look hotter that way, because I¡m more comfortable and I', always number 1 in my own style :love_heart:


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## Apple Pine (Nov 27, 2014)

Wear what looks good on you, and what feels fine. You are not the guy who would wear suits, if you do, it will look fake. Don't think about it that much. 

You will basically feel terrible in school or wherever with a suit. You don't like it. 

Same if you wear something you love a lot, but others find weird. You will feel stressed.

Balance. Not what you love ONLY, or what others look in people ONLY. 

Seems rather simple logic you should follow. What is hard, is choosing them. 

You said you could meet hygiene "requirements"? What do you mean? I hope you are doing at least basic hygiene.


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## 481450 (Aug 13, 2017)

Get a 2010 Bieber haircut! (please don't)


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## General Lee Awesome (Sep 28, 2014)

Peter said:


> In discussions about male and female behaviour people always go to extremes. Ignore that.
> 
> Normal behaviour is what matters. And sorry, but male attractiveness is different from female attractiveness. That's just the way it is.
> 
> Work on your posture. Go to the gym, strengthen your muscles. No need to get your muscles bigger, but simple strength training in order to improve your posture will help a lot. And you'll be amazed how just getting a better posture changes how people respond to you. And in reply to that, your confidence will improve which will make you feel better about your own attractiveness.


yea the posture is very important


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

TwilightPrince16 said:


> Get a 2010 Bieber haircut! (please don't)


The emoish one or the short back and sides one that every guy started wearing since?  The latter I don't want, but the former no guy older than 29 really wears either because they don't suit it or because they lose hair.


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## Peter (Feb 27, 2010)

Riven said:


> IDK. It just sucks. People complain about how men are the perpetrators of sex abuse (in most cases) enough already. Women complain enough I think about how they're being objectified. I don't want to be part of this.


Maybe you should have your own opinion on these subjects. In the end what matters is how you see yourself, not how others see you.


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## nablur (Mar 9, 2017)

Riven said:


> I believe there's the usual goals of hygiene, personality, level of physical fitness and consent in order for a guy to be seen as attractive. I could meet those though, but what bothers me more is about what I could wear to appear attractive to others.
> 
> Outside of casual situations, I believe there isn't a lot guys can do in this situation. Suits are almost universally considered to be the essential item of clothing that increase a guy's level of attractiveness - they're also considered to be more appropriate for a wider variety of occasions compared to other items or types of clothing. I could appear more attractive to other people, but I wouldn't _feel_ the same way. Suits, to me, signify money and political power - I still might not enjoy wearing a suit because I feel like it's cheating, in those aspects. If money were no object, I believe that suits are soulless pieces of fabric.
> 
> I admit, that I'm trying to gain attractiveness through physical means - I've been wearing sleeveless tops frequently, which I also admit that I have a fetish for (I didn't like wearing such tops in the past though); in certain, maybe many situations, such attire would be inappropriate for guys, and may not even be attractive for them. I feel like the same might go with hair length as well as the degree of skin guys can expose. I also admit that I'm envious of what women are appreciated for, but at the same time, I'm quite guilty of how us guys are primarily appreciative of women for their looks - according to online threads, this is a frustration of women, how men will typically only like women for their looks.


this is probably the last thing most INFP's would do - start eating right and get into a fitness routine


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## clem (Jun 10, 2017)

Another thing I remembered is that sometimes we need to tidy up, give away old clothes and become more organized. If your room and life are more organized, you will feel more attractive and better put together.


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## puppies (Jan 28, 2018)

Seriously man, you do whatever you like, what interests you, be the beast at your skill, and eventually women will be attracted to you. 

I mean, since you've mentioned gaming, alot of girls game too! Be you, embrace your inner self, be friendly and talk about anything- also i think in a guy what attracts a girl/ woman/ preference (hey mane im a girl too, ive got a mans and hehe srsly<3) is when theyre really passionate about something, so yes! be confident in your field, and love yourself, and soon you'll find people attracted to the same things like you and the things you do!

Also what could help is, who are your inspirations, if you need someone, or something to aspire to in hopes of attractiveness (hey, it worked for me... especially on youtube - although i had to dig deep for the "real ones, the real advice" if you know what im sayin aha


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

puppies said:


> Seriously man, you do whatever you like, what interests you, be the beast at your skill, and eventually women will be attracted to you.
> 
> I mean, since you've mentioned gaming, alot of girls game too! Be you, embrace your inner self, be friendly and talk about anything- also i think in a guy what attracts a girl/ woman/ preference (hey mane im a girl too, ive got a mans and hehe srsly<3) is when theyre really passionate about something, so yes! be confident in your field, and love yourself, and soon you'll find people attracted to the same things like you and the things you do!
> 
> Also what could help is, who are your inspirations, if you need someone, or something to aspire to in hopes of attractiveness (hey, it worked for me... especially on youtube - although i had to dig deep for the "real ones, the real advice" if you know what im sayin aha


I've come across one or two girls that game - I guess I'm still envious of them because of how they get to look like compared to guys and how they're appreciated for compared to guys - gaming is a much more informal environment than, say, the corporate and political spaces, but it's still this way I guess.

I'll need to try and get into my personal project though or whatever. I don't know. I mostly come across guys who like girls for looks first before anything else. I don't know.


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## ENTJudgement (Oct 6, 2013)

Riven said:


> I believe there's the usual goals of hygiene, personality, level of physical fitness and consent in order for a guy to be seen as attractive. I could meet those though, but what bothers me more is about what I could wear to appear attractive to others.
> 
> Outside of casual situations, I believe there isn't a lot guys can do in this situation. Suits are almost universally considered to be the essential item of clothing that increase a guy's level of attractiveness - they're also considered to be more appropriate for a wider variety of occasions compared to other items or types of clothing. I could appear more attractive to other people, but I wouldn't _feel_ the same way. Suits, to me, signify money and political power - I still might not enjoy wearing a suit because I feel like it's cheating, in those aspects. If money were no object, I believe that suits are soulless pieces of fabric.
> 
> I admit, that I'm trying to gain attractiveness through physical means - I've been wearing sleeveless tops frequently, which I also admit that I have a fetish for (I didn't like wearing such tops in the past though); in certain, maybe many situations, such attire would be inappropriate for guys, and may not even be attractive for them. I feel like the same might go with hair length as well as the degree of skin guys can expose. I also admit that I'm envious of what women are appreciated for, but at the same time, I'm quite guilty of how us guys are primarily appreciative of women for their looks - according to online threads, this is a frustration of women, how men will typically only like women for their looks.



Take all the money out of your bank account and stick it on your shirt, you have instantly become attractive to many women now.


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## angelfish (Feb 17, 2011)

@Riven is that you in your profile picture? If so, I find you attractive.

I like the androgynous aesthetic personally. Big muscles and macho-ness is a turn-off for me. I like slim/slender bodies, a little curve, big colorful soulful eyes, nice eyelashes, nicely-groomed hair, clean scents, well-cared-for nails, and so on. I dare say I'd rather see a man in a black dress than a dirty t-shirt and thick scratchy jeans (assuming he's cleanly shaven... a lumberjack beard just doesn't mesh well with a dress IMO...)

I agree about suits - I don't really get it. I find them attractive enough but I don't understand why they're the ONE formal option for men. That said, I do like the newer, sleeker suit styling - quite elegant. Like this - 




























* *




I would like to tear that last suit right off of him!






Riven said:


> I also envy how women aren't so hooked up about if something looks sexy or not. I wish men could have the same manner of attraction as women do.


Can you explain this more? Manner of attraction? What do you mean? As a woman who talks to other women - it seems like women are concerned about what looks sexy _all the time._


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

angelfish said:


> @Riven is that you in your profile picture? If so, I find you attractive.


I wish it were me, so sadly you'll be disappointed. I feel like I'm past the point to be able to look like this.



> I like the androgynous aesthetic personally. Big muscles and macho-ness is a turn-off for me. I like slim/slender bodies, a little curve, big colorful soulful eyes, nice eyelashes, nicely-groomed hair, clean scents, well-cared-for nails, and so on. I dare say I'd rather see a man in a black dress than a dirty t-shirt and thick scratchy jeans (assuming he's cleanly shaven... a lumberjack beard just doesn't mesh well with a dress IMO...)
> 
> I agree about suits - I don't really get it. I find them attractive enough but I don't understand why they're the ONE formal option for men. That said, I do like the newer, sleeker suit styling - quite elegant. Like this -
> 
> ...


I think for what would make them look sexy to men, that's the thing.


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## sherlock8311 (Feb 16, 2018)

How do YOU want to dress? However you dress your gonna get flak from someone, whatever you do, someone is gonna give you shit. So just dress how you want and accept your gonna get shit for it regardless. Then give the world a finger and smile because your doing what YOU want to do. Not everyone is gonna be nice and love you, either way. 

Just do your shit and own it.

Or carry on thinking about what you think other people think they want. That sure sounds productive homie.

Ive gotten pucci, wearing an unironed top, ctained with sphagetti and with beer spilled over me. You know why, I didnt give a fuck.

Just remember what ever anyone else says, thats there issues.

And at end of day, what other people think of you is non of your business anyway. Just as your thoughts are non of theirs.


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## puppies (Jan 28, 2018)

very true !!!!!!


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## James Till (Feb 15, 2018)

Love you man! Here are my two INFJ cents.


*The Inside-Out approach:*
People often mistake confidence for purpose. People aren't attracted to simple confidence, they're attracted to people who have purpose! Confidence is a result of having purpose, and feeling comfortable in that purpose.

I want you to dedicate some time, right now, to sit down and consider what influence you want to make in this world. Consider what would fulfill you; what would make you whole. Align your mission statement to that mission. I don't take you for someone who's mission is simply to look good. You want to make a difference in the lives of other people.

If you can create a mission statement that is aligned to that, what would be sexier than living by such a mission?! Write that mission statement on the door to your room, your computer desktop, and your heart. Dude. Every moment you're living by your purpose, you'll radiate confidence. I see the conflict in your statements. You want to be accepted, acknowledged as attractive, appreciated by others! I think you're awesome! Your brain is hardwired right now to be concerned with simple aesthetics, and that's alright. Acknowledge it, and let your neural pathways slowly change as your focus changes to your mission. You will be the sexiest of the sexy if you follow your heart on the path that you consider your purpose.

Much love, James


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## lookslikeiwin (May 6, 2014)

If you've got all the basics down (good hygiene, healthy lifestyle), then you can just wear what you think looks good on other guys with your body type. 

It's 100% okay if it's nerdy, or if you're practically cos-playing, as long as it looks good on you and it is appropriate for the situation. If you aren't sure if something is appropriate, consult google. For many events you might want to select a more "conventional" variation of your favorite style.


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## clem (Jun 10, 2017)

@Riven also if you are with a very beautiful and intelligent woman, then other women will find you attractive. They compare you to a reference rather than abstractly. Men won’t notice you as much though because they will be noticing the woman you are with.


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## angelfish (Feb 17, 2011)

Riven said:


> I think for what would make them look sexy to men, that's the thing.


Yeah, for what would make them look sexy to men. 

I do agree with the general consensus about wearing what makes you feel good. Ultimately unless you're only after temporary flings then you're going to want to attract someone who appreciates your aesthetic preferences. Sure you want to temper it a little to fit reasonably/appropriately into certain social settings, but overall if you practice good hygiene then someone is going to find you naturally attractive sooner or later regardless of what you wear.


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## MoJen (Nov 7, 2017)

Keep in mind that what one person finds attractive, another person may not. I find one of my friends to be so incredibly sexy. He tells me when he looks in the mirror he doesn't see what I see. (I told him that just means we obviously have different taste in men lol) A man who can hold an intelligent conversation and can make me laugh is so much more attractive, to me, than a guy who is conventionally hot, but just vapid. Like you want to pat him on the head and say 'you're so pretty, but shut up because you ruin it when you open your mouth'.

Regarding your style; decide what what you like, what you feel good in, and rock it. Like angelfish said, temper it situationally; work, church, date whatever. Feeling good in what you are wearing makes you exude confidence. There are tons of style blogs out there. Grab someone (in RL or even online) whose aesthetic you like and get some honest feedback. Before I decide my outfit for the next day, I check a few blogs for some outfit ideas because I know I feel my best when I walk out the door put together. Just always remember, just because someone else may not like it, as long as you feel good in it, who cares what they think! Don't be afraid to switch it up, so you're not one note. If I were you, I would check out GQ's Guide to Suits. (great advice on suiting and alternatives that are just as classic, but not quite so It's all about proportions. The last suit makes me twitch. The pants are so ill fitted with the taper of the jacket/vest (which I do like, just not with that tie/shirt. And don't even get me started on those gloves and shoes.). Whatever you do, add some of your own flavor. 

I have a really jacked up sense of humor, so when I went to lunch/shopping with my friends today I had on in a herringbone flippy skirt, tights, thigh high suede boots, black cropped tuxedo jacket and a tshirt that said 'Eat Like No One is Watching. Or Dance ... Whatever'. Cute, totally appropriate for the venues we were haunting; but with that little twistedness that is me!

Best of luck to you!


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

I find that I'm often wearing this:

D-Struct | D-Struct Sleeveless Hooded Sweat (I found a French Connection sleeveless hoodie on here for the same price, a brand I thought would not do this; I didn't get that one though since it lacked the pockets I wanted).

or that I'm trying to wear this:










In some occasions, I might wear this:










I actually didn't like these sort of tops in the past, but now I somehow have an affinity for them. I'm also wearing arm warmers as well with them.

I understand how these can be inappropriate in some situations though and so it kind of depresses me what I am allowed to wear if I not at liberty to wear them, especially compared to women. I could go shirtless in public unlike with women in many parts of the world, but I prefer not to and would rather get toned before I can do that, even though I won't ever really get insulted for it (except for the women who are envious of us men who are able to go shirtless in public).


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## Senah (Oct 17, 2017)

I would say generally in terms of what is appealing, good hygiene (including hair) and good smell are top. Finding a not over the top cologne or deodorant can make someone swoon. I have to say smell is actually one of my biggest turn-ons and biggest turn-offs if it is bad (a sentiment my girlfriends have echoed). It is also the sense that is most strongly linked to memory - I am sure many posters have had someone walk past them and been immediately reminded of a long lost love or relative. 

In terms of attractiveness, confidence (eye contact, posture, smile) is important of course. Clothes also signal something instantly and people form snap judgements about a person based on this. Having a good body (not perfect, but good/healthy) helps you look good in a variety of types of clothing. However, even if someone is overweight for example, if they are dressed stylishly and neatly and they smell nice, are confident and smiling, I am going to have a higher opinion of them than someone who is fitter but sloppily dressed and with greasy hair. I would say that generally women do an instant translation of clothing/grooming --> likely cleanliness of abode --> indicator of satisfaction/comfort derived from sexual experience with said person. This correlation is pretty common and instantaneous. 



Riven said:


> OK, but it looks like I'm kinda stuck with the lame clothes us guys are generally allowed to wear I think.


I think guys actually have a lot of fashion options. I don't know where you live, but I have noticed in western Europe there is great fashion - a lot of color and better tailoring of clothes. You can pair jeans with nice shoes and a white or blue collared shirt and a bright sweater and belt and go to a nice place for lunch/dinner or be casual. Vests, red shorts, fun moleskin trousers - there is a lot of neat stuff going on. Even the suits are beautifully tailored and in great colors if you want to go that dressy. However, I would say that you don't need to go that dressy if you don't want to - for example out west in the US most people never wear suits. It is much more casual. In the US the black community dresses beautifully, especially in the south. Just google "black fashion men south" and you will see some awesome looks. 



> I actually didn't like these sort of tops in the past, but now I somehow have an affinity for them. I'm also wearing arm warmers as well with them.


In terms of this look, I mean, you should be confident and like what you wear. I will say that if you are trying to appeal to women as your desired group these looks are unlikely to be a huge winner. You would likely need to something like this with a very masculine bent. The sleeveless dress shirt is also a very specific look. You should do as you like, but I would say they are definitely not on the masculine side.

In the end, the most important things are hygiene, smell, confidence, and a smile. Dressing neatly as well, regardless of what you actually wear. Just be comfortable, as others have mentioned


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## Riven (Jan 17, 2015)

Senah said:


> I would say generally in terms of what is appealing, good hygiene (including hair) and good smell are top. Finding a not over the top cologne or deodorant can make someone swoon. I have to say smell is actually one of my biggest turn-ons and biggest turn-offs if it is bad (a sentiment my girlfriends have echoed). It is also the sense that is most strongly linked to memory - I am sure many posters have had someone walk past them and been immediately reminded of a long lost love or relative.
> 
> In terms of attractiveness, confidence (eye contact, posture, smile) is important of course. Clothes also signal something instantly and people form snap judgements about a person based on this. Having a good body (not perfect, but good/healthy) helps you look good in a variety of types of clothing. However, even if someone is overweight for example, if they are dressed stylishly and neatly and they smell nice, are confident and smiling, I am going to have a higher opinion of them than someone who is fitter but sloppily dressed and with greasy hair. I would say that generally women do an instant translation of clothing/grooming --> likely cleanliness of abode --> indicator of satisfaction/comfort derived from sexual experience with said person. This correlation is pretty common and instantaneous.
> 
> ...


Thanks, but I'm not sure if I want to go for a masculine look. I'm worried about those that will make me dress in a way I don't want. 

I admit though I want to look more feminine and be more feminine, and be able to attract women who like this feminine stuff more. Sadly this doesn't come to me naturally in terms of how I look and how I am. I guess I also don't like the responsibility of "keeping a clean abode" or whatever as well. 

Sent from my ZTE BLADE V0800 using Tapatalk


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## Trec93 (Jan 31, 2015)

Don't think about it, think about something constructive, thinking is time consuming so don't waste it.


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