# I think i'm infj. Can you help?



## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

about the enneagram type conversation earlier in this thread, what do you think mine would be? This won't take as long. some ppl thought 9w1. Whats tge difference between 9w1 and 1w9. Its either one of those.


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## petitpèlerin (Apr 23, 2012)

She seems pretty cool and level-headed for an Fi-dom who just got out of an abusive situation, doesn't she? I would believe ISFP but I'm just not convinced of the Fi. I think it's possible she's an INFJ. Especially the part about having things arranged exactly on her nightstand. I don't know of any IxFP who does that. It sounds like a J thing. Also, she says she's a daydreamer, and early on she mentioned that she sees future possibilities. My first impressions were that she sounds strongly Fe, anyway. I wouldn't rule out INFJ.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> about the enneagram type conversation earlier in this thread, what do you think mine would be? This won't take as long. some ppl thought 9w1. Whats tge difference between 9w1 and 1w9. Its either one of those.


The Enneagram deals with identifying what underlying motivation informs your core the most, _and the most deeply_.

Type 9 is motivated to stay in harmony with the world outside them, and tends to forego introspection for making peace. You could say that "inward laziness, outward action" is part of the theme of this type, especially at levels that are average to unhealthy. To read more: http://personalitycafe.com/type-9-f...ype-nine-peacemaker-timeless-description.html

Type 1 is motivated to mitigate the imperfection in the world or in oneself, according to an inner critic that is constantly on. The type is heavily perfection seeking, especially at average to unhealthy. To read more: http://personalitycafe.com/type-1-forum-reformer/65601-type-one-reformer-timeless-description.html

The whole idea of the Enneagram is to present you with your flaws as a person, so that you can recognize and start to deal with them. If you look at it as just a typing system, you miss most of its benefit.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

ltldslwmn said:


> She seems pretty cool and level-headed for an Fi-dom who just got out of an abusive situation, doesn't she?


That sort of thing doesn't seem reliant on functions to me, though; it just seems like a standard psychological response to what's going on. Distancing.


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## Pointless Activist (May 22, 2012)

Already got addressed. Sorry.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

*:3*



ltldslwmn said:


> She seems pretty cool and level-headed for an Fi-dom who just got out of an abusive situation, doesn't she? I would believe ISFP but I'm just not convinced of the Fi. I think it's possible she's an INFJ. Especially the part about having things arranged exactly on her nightstand. I don't know of any IxFP who does that. It sounds like a J thing. Also, she says she's a daydreamer, and early on she mentioned that she sees future possibilities. My first impressions were that she sounds strongly Fe, anyway. I wouldn't rule out INFJ.


Yeah, the stuff on my table has to be perfectly straight and my bed has to be set, then i'm satisfied. Perceivers like to go with the flow. Judgers like to plan. I prefer to know what i'm getting into. If i'm in a troubled situation, like if i forgot to do homework, i could make up a plan to get it done fast. I would make it something like this, Wake up, get dressed, brush teeth/hair, eat breakfast, pack backpack, do some homework, do homework on the bus, do more outside my locker in the extra 10 mins before classes start, if the homework is for an afternoon class, i finish it at lunch. I can usually guess how the solution will turn out.


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## Helios (May 30, 2012)

ltldslwmn said:


> She seems pretty cool and level-headed for an Fi-dom who just got out of an abusive situation, doesn't she? I would believe ISFP but I'm just not convinced of the Fi. I think it's possible she's an INFJ. Especially the part about having things arranged exactly on her nightstand. I don't know of any IxFP who does that. It sounds like a J thing. Also, she says she's a daydreamer, and early on she mentioned that she sees future possibilities. My first impressions were that she sounds strongly Fe, anyway. I wouldn't rule out INFJ.


Well I'm not seeing an ounce of Ni going on in here. And I'm seeing more of the self-righteousness of an Fi-Dom going on in here.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> Yeah, the stuff on my table has to be perfectly straight and my bed has to be set, then i'm satisfied. Perceivers like to go with the flow. Judgers like to plan. I prefer to know what i'm getting into. If i'm in a troubled situation, like if i forgot to do homework, i could make up a plan to get it done fast. I would make it something like this, Wake up, get dressed, brush teeth/hair, eat breakfast, pack backpack, do some homework, do homework on the bus, do more outside my locker in the extra 10 mins before classes start, if the homework is for an afternoon class, i finish it at lunch. I can usually guess how the solution will turn out.


"Perceivers" and "Judgers" are based on the predominant _extraverted_ function. "Perceiving" behaviors supposedly match Ne and Se, and "Judging" behaviors supposedly match Te and Fe, and all of that may not actually be true anyway because these are simply perspectives on the world, not arbiters of how you will act.

Even assuming these stereotypical behaviors did hold, MBTI makes the poor assumption that your introverted function doesn't show up as much in your behavior as your extraverted one. For an _introvert_? I wouldn't rely on it.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

First, what would it sound like with Ni going on in something? Second, I write WAY different than how i talk in real life. I just try to write in a way that other people will be able to understand what i'm trying to say.Just trying to consider all possibilities :3


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

lol sorry if it seems like i'm arguing in a way. I'm just trying to find my type and i just want to know the truth


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## Dino (Mar 25, 2011)

You seem like an ISFP to me and I wouldn't say your Se is underdevelopped.

By the way, ISFP =/= artist hobo.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> lol sorry if it seems like i'm arguing in a way. I'm just trying to find my type and i just want to know the truth


Don't worry about it. You're entitled to argument on your own thread, of all places. Hopefully the process is helping you learn.


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## petitpèlerin (Apr 23, 2012)

Flatlander said:


> That sort of thing doesn't seem reliant on functions to me, though; it just seems like a standard psychological response to what's going on. Distancing.


You could be right. I'm just thinking of my IxFP friends and can't imagine any of them not being basketcases after such a terrible situation. The way she handles the situation by understanding the people involved sounds IxFJ to me: she doesn't seem to look at the situation in terms of how it affects herself, but in terms of how it affects everyone involved, and accepts it for what it is. As unselfish and thoughtful of others as my IxFP friends are, I think they'd naturally process it primarily in terms of how it affects themselves, and they'd need some serious wound-licking and telling-themselves-it's-over-and-okay-now time in order to get to a level of acceptance that fireheart96 seems to have had for a while now. I'm no psychologist, I could be wrong, I'm just stating my own thoughts.

Edit: All that said, I don't think ISFP is impossible. I'm just thinking out loud.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^)


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^)


It can absolutely impact your self-expression, which is why an MBTI professional probably wouldn't type you at this time - they rely on observing you in a natural state. I think it can also have some deep effects on cognition.


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## Dino (Mar 25, 2011)

fireheart96 said:


> just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^)


Enneagram yes, MBTI no.


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## Helios (May 30, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^)


Unless you sustained brain injuries, I don't think it would. It would probably change the functions you use though. You'd probably rely more heavily upon the lesser functions under stress. Read these and tell me which seems more like you:

http://personalitycafe.com/intj-articles/76896-recognizing-inferior-function-intj.html (INFJ is mentioned in this one)
http://personalitycafe.com/infp-articles/76770-recognizing-inferior-function-ifps.html (INFP and ISFP here)


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## petitpèlerin (Apr 23, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^)


It's not at all off-topic. I don't think it would change your actual personality, but it could affect what functions you rely on and how you develop functions that may not naturally be your strongest ones, so then of course that would affect the outcome of any test you would take. I think what we're trying to do here is see through all of those possibilities to find out what you really are.

By the way, I like this thread and I like learning about you. You're sweet. Maybe you are an Fi-dom after all.


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## Pointless Activist (May 22, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^)


It doesn't affect the type, no, but it can affect which functions(that are already part of your type ie ISFP Fi, Se, Ni, and Te. When under stress, you might be forced to develop a function you wouldn't normally develop at that time, such as developing Ni much earlier than you would normally) are developed a whole lot.

Hope this helped.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

just wondering.. do you think that being abused could effect what personality you have? (sorry if its off topic ^-^) being abused is probably why my feeling is highly developed. i actually don't think of being abused as anything serious, as crazy as it sounds. I just think of it like, its in the past now and i accepted that fact. I'm just happy that i didn't turn out to be a brat lol. The day we left to go to our dad's house i knew we were going to stay, i was fine with that. The hardest part isn't from remembering memories for me. For me its separating the truth from the lies. My mom was a major liar. She was also an alcoholic. I can't believe i'm related to her. I feel like some of my personality was lost during when i was abused. I was never listened to. When i cried, she told me to shut up and stop being a baby. Because of her its hard for me to discuss my opinions on anything because there i couldn't have one. She tried to teach me to lie to the cops. I never did because i knew it was wrong. I don't know how i knew lying was wrong when i lived in that situation. I'm actually really happy right now. Like i said i'm fine with it because its something i can't change.


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## Le9acyMuse (Mar 12, 2010)

LeaT said:


> Then please tell me why you were unable to type her or even offer a suggestion in this thread if you think it's so easy to always discern a type, loop or not. I don't personally think the questions you asked even provided with much useful data to work with.


 e__o Pretty sure I proposed INFP. I may not be as thorough as may be recommended, but I deliberate my every step. I've also worked on a method with which to use to surmise an approximate type (if not the accurate type) based on one's flow of ideas in their writing. It's not necessarily easy for me. I'm a perfectionist, but also mortal, thereby imperfect. Sometimes I'm simply stumped. But it won't necessarily be because of a loop. I suppose we just differ in approach. I couldn't gather much from previously asked questions just the same as you couldn't gather from mine.



> And no, miss-education (wtf this word) cannot do this. If you're however going through a tough time in life you can fall back on using your tertiary and inferior functions because we always use our tertiary and inferior functions during times of stress. It's not like people do it consciously or on purpose. You don't control what cognitive functions you use and when. If so then people could just go change type at will but we can't.
> 
> Then please tell us what should we look for that we are so overlooking according to you?
> 
> And I don't see how identification with other types have anything to do with it. Why do you even think that question is included in my questionnaire? It's to inform us about bias!


 I'm just saying it's capable of being indicated in spite of the symptoms you're stating. Just for the fact that every function is always used in cognitive processes, for better or for worse. It may not always be obvious which functions are being used since people do differ, but adequate observations usually do the trick for me. If not (as I say, I'm not perfect) then I improve my methods by backtracking. Pondering what I'm missing.

I paid no mind to any questionnaire after finding they didn't help me. I regarded that, saying that though they don't do crap for me that I hope they help others find truth. Identification with other types is a hotspot for mistyping. Just because she identified with INXJ doesn't indicate a loop. But then again, I don't study the loop phenomenon anymore. What I look for is Pi, Je, Ji, and Pe style in demeanor, writing or other implicit orientations. Physiological cues, even. Pi and Je are more demanding/assertive than Ji and Pe are on average, and especially about different things. Quoting myself from another thread:



> There _are _side-effects to using these functions: whether one is a *Pi *(Ni-Si-dom), *Je *(Te-Fe-dom), *Ji *(Ti-Fi-dom) or *Pe* (Se-Ne-dom) can be indicated by how they deal with information through their function orders.
> 
> Pis will mold world order to fit their ideals.
> Jes will mold their ideals to fit world functionability/order.
> ...


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## Le9acyMuse (Mar 12, 2010)

"Fucked up"? Hm, is this getting serious? Sorry if I bothered anyone. Just like to debate. If I'm disagreed with, I don't really look to fight to the death. Just trade thoughts. Learn in the process if it so happens. I'm not really taking this aggressively right now.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

Le9acyMuse said:


> "Fucked up"? Hm, is this getting serious? Sorry if I bothered anyone. Just like to debate. If I'm disagreed with, I don't really look to fight to the death. Just trade thoughts. Learn in the process if it so happens. I'm not really taking this aggressively right now.


The one problem with it is that it's in a type me thread. Type me threads can get sensitive and personal. So you ought to gauge the sensitivity of the original poster to extraneous activity going on in their thread - some will not care, others will.


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## Le9acyMuse (Mar 12, 2010)

Flatlander said:


> Why is this even relevant? When did anyone claim that functions are "dropped"?
> 
> Seriously, this is going too far off track.


 I knew that sentence I typed could be misinterpreted. I should've redone it, but I thought I did well enough to say that "What I mean to say is, the auxiliary is always, always, always working. Even if poorly." My first sentence was more inferential, I suppose. I feel the way the loop was being discussed made it seem the auxiliary could go so far below threshold that it could go unnoticed or something. I wasn't being very literal. My bad.

I didn't intend to put words in your mouth @LeaT. I apologize.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

Le9acyMuse said:


> I knew that sentence I typed could be misinterpreted. I should've redone it, but I thought I did well enough to say that "What I mean to say is, the auxiliary is always, always, always working. Even if poorly." My first sentence was more inferential, I suppose. I feel the way the loop was being discussed made it seem the auxiliary could go so far below threshold that it could go unnoticed or something. I wasn't being very literal. My bad.


Yeah, that sort of thing is why you have to remain aware of the fact that all this is conscious and self-reporting. To find the functions that aren't quite as predominant, you sometimes need to read between the lines, especially in the case of excessive intro- or extraversion. I should know, I've been subject to this phenomenon for a long time; my mind is very Ni/Ti, and to find the Fe I really had to observe myself in the external world.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Flatlander said:


> Yeah, that sort of thing is why you have to remain aware of the fact that all this is conscious and self-reporting. To find the functions that aren't quite as predominant, you sometimes need to read between the lines, especially in the case of excessive intro- or extraversion. I should know, I've been subject to this phenomenon for a long time; my mind is very Ni/Ti, and to find the Fe I really had to observe myself in the external world.


I would say that I don't really spot the Fe in you when you write for example, so that would be nigh to impossible for me to say. I see lots and lots of Ti from you and that's about it. I suspect it's your enneagram causing it. If I had just typed you based on a questionnaire and how you write I would probably have said INTP.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

LeaT said:


> I would say that I don't really spot the Fe in you when you write for example, so that would be nigh to impossible for me to say. I see lots and lots of Ti from you and that's about it. I suspect it's your enneagram causing it. If I had just typed you based on a questionnaire and how you write I would probably have said INTP.


I did post a questionnaire response, in that other thread. Feel free to respond if you like, I can't help but admit my curiosity.


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## Le9acyMuse (Mar 12, 2010)

Flatlander said:


> Yeah, that sort of thing is why you have to remain aware of the fact that all this is conscious and self-reporting. To find the functions that aren't quite as predominant, you sometimes need to read between the lines, especially in the case of excessive intro- or extraversion. I should know, I've been subject to this phenomenon for a long time; my mind is very Ni/Ti, and to find the Fe I really had to observe myself in the external world.


 I feel you. However, I tend not to get thrown off by it for some reason. If I encounter a difficult specimen, I'm at least able to differentiate between P and J. I can tell usually which visions (N or S) they prefer or which order (T or F) they observe. Not all the time, but I'm always improving. I tell by body language, their inner-outer relationships (self and environment), level of awareness of certain systems or objects... It just falls together in this way, in my opinion. Loops do not throw me off when I know what I'm looking for. And if I don't see the pattern at one point, I'll see it at another, or eventually learn to.

I don't want to go ISFP over INFP just yet. There are too many mistyped "ISFPs" around here. Much of what is read from MBTI is biased, and I have reason to believe she's likely not an ISFP. Yet.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Flatlander said:


> I did post a questionnaire response, in that other thread. Feel free to respond if you like, I can't help but admit my curiosity.


Right. I completely forgot!


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Le9acyMuse said:


> I feel you. However, I tend not to get thrown off by it for some reason. If I encounter a difficult specimen, I'm at least able to differentiate between P and J. I can tell usually which visions (N or S) they prefer or which order (T or F) they observe. Not all the time, but I'm always improving. I tell by body language, their inner-outer relationships (self and environment), level of awareness of certain systems or objects... It just falls together in this way, in my opinion. Loops do not throw me off when I know what I'm looking for. And if I don't see the pattern at one point, I'll see it at another, or eventually learn to.
> 
> I don't want to go ISFP over INFP just yet. There are too many mistyped "ISFPs" around here. Much of what is read from MBTI is biased, and I have reason to believe she's likely not an ISFP. Yet.


Such as...? What is not congruent with how she writes that does not fit the attitudes and modes of thinking of an Se user?


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## Astrali (Mar 28, 2012)

@fireheart96

I like your username. 

You are surely an INFP or ISFP 
Hope this will answer your questions. 

INFPs are always dreamers.

INFP - The Dreamer

ISFP are not always artists 

ISFP - The Aesthete


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## Le9acyMuse (Mar 12, 2010)

LeaT said:


> Such as...? What is not congruent with how she writes that does not fit the attitudes and modes of thinking of an Se user?


 Typical side-effects I find from Intuition are simply less of a focus on direct encounters. Sensation, although one may not say it's similar to categorization, comes off, to me, as storing data in a localized way. Intuition comes off as dreamy because of that. It's a vague characteristic, but it's a demeanor I consistently find. Because of how it has roots in imagination. In my opinion, in case I'm alone in feeling so. Also, in my view, Ni is circumspective and Ne is innovative. Si is elaborate and Se is resourceful.

MBTI descriptions of ISFPs tend to make them sound pretty imaginative, and for no particular reason besides saying Fi is like that. But it's not. I feel MBTI descriptions bias Fi with Intuition and that this is at least partly why there's an overrepresentation of Sensation in statistics. And there's no reason to believe Intuition is rare. The ISFP forum is most likely inundated with Intuitive Feelers. I'm surprised if I ever actually encounter an ISFP there, because I relate to their idea flows so similarly.

Overall, she doesn't fit the bill, to me. That external visional focus of Se isn't apparent to me. I guess my Intuition isn't convinced, though I can't quite say why very specifically.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Le9acyMuse said:


> Typical side-effects I find from Intuition are simply less of a focus on direct encounters. Sensation, although one may not say it's similar to categorization, comes off, to me, as storing data in a localized way. Intuition comes off as dreamy because of that. It's a vague characteristic, but it's a demeanor I consistently find. Because of how it has roots in imagination. In my opinion, in case I'm alone in feeling so. Also, in my view, Ni is circumspective and Ne is innovative. Si is elaborate and Se is resourceful.
> 
> MBTI descriptions of ISFPs tend to make them sound pretty imaginative, and for no particular reason besides saying Fi is like that. But it's not. I feel MBTI descriptions bias Fi with Intuition and that this is at least partly why there's an overrepresentation of Sensation in statistics. And there's no reason to believe Intuition is rare. The ISFP forum is most likely inundated with Intuitive Feelers. I'm surprised if I ever actually encounter an ISFP there, because I relate to their idea flows so similarly.
> 
> Overall, she doesn't fit the bill, to me. That external visional focus of Se isn't apparent to me. I guess my Intuition isn't convinced, though I can't quite say why very specifically.


And that's why you must consider that she's in an NiFi loop so she appears more as an INFP to you to the point where it completely overpowers Se. But if you study the way she for example analyzes pictures there is an obvious detail-focus. INFPs tend to fall back on Si when studying pictures so the end result is something completely different.

Did you ever consider that the reason why you connect to ISFPs at all is because of their tertiary Ni? And Fi IS imaginative. Imagination is not unique to NF users. All introverted types daydream. Fi users dream about their Fi values. Ti users about their Ti facts. 

I do think you exaggerate or have a flawed image of INFPs. I think an INFP is far more likely to be confused with an INTP or ENFP. There are a lot of ENFPs and INFPs in the INTP subforum who think they are INTPs because idealize the INTP type. 

S and N is as clear as night and day. Ti and Fi are much harder to discern between than Se and Ne.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

ok, i'm back. I would like to point out some things after reading the last few pages. I know that I am probably either infp or isfp. Now about my writing style. My natural writing style is different from this. I used to write with alot of "..." inbetween sentences and words. I found out my abusive mom wrote like that so i stopped. Before i stopped people would tell me i wrote like an infp. Like it was mentioned earlier, isfp's live in the here and now and infp's daydream of the future. With me, i often catch myself staring into space thinking and i didn't even realize it. I often think things like, i wonder where i will be in 10 years. I saw you talking about bringing more people in the thread to help thing.. The reason why i keep posting is that, firstly, i want to help you guys type me. Secondly, I wouldn't mind if more people come in. It takes me a while to decide on things.. expecially this whole type situation. At my mom's house, all i had to depend on was my Fi, because i felt bad for any person or creature that went through anything similar to my situation.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> With me, i often catch myself staring into space thinking and i didn't even realize it. I often think things like, i wonder where i will be in 10 years.


The interesting part about this is, in his research, Nardi found people with predominant Ni would be quite stimulated by just such a question.

Edit: To get more specificity, you're going to need to describe what kind of thinking or envisionment you were doing, though.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

i will catch myself at dinner thinking about when i go on vacation, when i do that sometimes i'm too busy picturing things that i forget whats going on in my surroundings. Before bed i often can't sleep (almost every night because of this) because i'm too busy thinking. I often imagine things too much before bed and then i can't sleep because my mind is more awake than my body is.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> i will catch myself at dinner thinking about when i go on vacation, when i do that sometimes i'm too busy picturing things that i forget whats going on in my surroundings. Before bed i often can't sleep (almost every night because of this) because i'm too busy thinking. I often imagine things too much before bed and then i can't sleep because my mind is more awake than my body is.


Here's the thing, though.

Are you idealizing, i.e. are you thinking about what you _want_ to happen?

Are you planning, thinking about what you are going to _make_ happen?

Are you envisioning what will _probably_ happen, given whatever variables are at hand?

Or is it random imagining? Or something else entirely?

You mentioned images. What kind of images? Are they detailed?

And so forth.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

oh yeah.. the things i think about are just random. One minute i'll be sitting and thinking about a "what would happen if this happened" kind of thing, the next minute someone will distract me and i get frustrated. I usually make up things. Stuff like that.


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## fireheart96 (Jul 30, 2012)

ok i will answer that now. I usually make up things i want to happen in the future (nomatter how rediculous) and i can picture these things. For example, if i wanted to, i could picture a tree. It would seem like i'm looking at a tree, but i don't see it. Its REALLY HARD to describe. I can see it like it's there, but not like i can reach out and touch it.


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## Flatlander (Feb 25, 2012)

fireheart96 said:


> ok i will answer that now. I usually make up things i want to happen in the future (nomatter how rediculous) and i can picture these things. For example, if i wanted to, i could picture a tree. It would seem like i'm looking at a tree, but i don't see it. Its REALLY HARD to describe. I can see it like it's there, but not like i can reach out and touch it.


So you have a very visual mind?

What kinds of things do you envision happening in the future?


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