# INTP or INTJ?



## cat123 (Jan 11, 2015)

I have been trying to figure out what type i am for quite some time now. And i have now managed to narrow it down to two types but i am stuck at that point. 

I am quite messy which is a INTP trait, but on the other hand im very much turned inward and doesn't notice the environment around me much.

I rely alot on intution when making decisions, especially when it comes to 
everyday decisions like what food to get at a restaurant and such. When it comes to more important decisions i prefer to think them trough first to sort out the pros and cons of each of my options and then use my intuition to make the final decision.

When trying to figure out a problem i often get a flashback to how i solved it the last time if i have encountered it before. I usually dont recall exactly what happened but just how i solved or if i failed miserably somehow.

I do not like major change in my outside world. I switching schools soon and i am not excited at all. I am attached to my everyday routine at school and i like seeing the same people day after day. Even though it know it will open up new doors and let me focus more on the things im intrested in the feelings are mixed and it feels like the balance in my world is being destroyed. 

I like making list. I in fact love making lists. My lists most often consists of schoolwork or other tasks i need to get done.It makes me feel like im in control of the situation. Me and my friends went to a festival a while ago and i just wanted to make lists and schedule the whole thing, once again to feel in control. I even like to plan my actions, i happen to be intrested in a super intelligent mathematician with a Ph.D, and i plan alot of the things i say to him in advance. 

But on the other hand i can sometimes procrastinate alot if i find something to be boring or unimportant. And i can also be spontaneous at times.
I also sometimes have a hard time finishing my projects, either because i've gotten bored of them or because something more important turned up.

Especially in mathematics i have a tendency to connect things to eachother.
It is one of those things that are incredibly hard to understand. I just see the letters or numbers of one formula in my mind and suddenly i just understand how they are connected to another formula. Quite fussy description, but i thought it might help.

I am very curious about how stuff works. I started watching discovery channel when i was 8 and was totally obsessed with Egyptian archeology from the age of 8-9 to the age of 12, i still am, but im not as obsesses as i was back then. Back to topic, i always think about the most random stuff like 'how does rice grow?' 'How did that grafitti get up on that bridge?' 'What is it like inside the mind of a cat?' And so on.

I like to be in charge. I have always had a bit of a leader personality even though im quite introvert. I tend to be very harsch on others if we are working in a group and push them to work according to my standards. If i catch someone slacking i will get quite pissed at times. 

Thanks in advance for your help.

By the way, i have already taken several cognitive functions tests and mbti tests. But i learned how to manipulate them way too fast and now they are useless.


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## Dante Stark (Feb 15, 2014)

If you can understand this image without any explanation at all, then you are probably a Ni user, an INTJ


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## Green Girl (Oct 1, 2010)

I'd add ISTJ to your list of possible types to investigate. Your description sounds like you could be an Si user, and the ISTJs that I know could definitely relate to most of what you wrote. Many ISTJs mistype as INTJs. We're very similar.


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## Sygma (Dec 19, 2014)

Dante Stark said:


> *If you can understand* this image without any explanation at all, *then you are probably* a Ni user, an INTJ


Thats a bit vague 

besides Ne can analyze this without problems, and ESFP wouldn't have troubles too I think ... why a Ni user specifically ?


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## ae1905 (Jun 7, 2014)

cat123 said:


> I have been trying to figure out what type i am for quite some time now. And i have now managed to narrow it down to two types but i am stuck at that point.
> 
> I am quite messy which is a INTP trait, but on the other hand im very much turned inward and doesn't notice the environment around me much.
> 
> ...


I've found that one of the best ways--if not _the _best way--to determine your type is to actually do something, like debate or solve a problem, and see how you go about doing it. It is better, I believe, because it doesn't rely on what _you _think you are--ie, self-reporting, an acknowledge weakness in most of the tests you will find in typology--but directly on _how you use _your functions irl. 

A common difference between INTPs and INTJs in debates, to take an example, is that the latter will hold a position that is largely based on their Ni perceptions and these perceptions will undergo relatively less complete analysis after being passed down into their auxiliary thinking function. The former, otoh, may also use intuitive perceptions, but these will be passed _up _into their dominant thinking function where Ti will more exhaustively examine these perceptions to tease out the meaning of and the relationships between them. It's from this analysis that INTPs' arguments emerge. (Note I've discussed the top two functions in both types, but both will also draw on their stores of knowledge in defining and refining their arguments--ie, the functions are used together.)

An example is a recent debate thread titled, "Are INTPs more logical than ISTJs". Sexy title, right?  One INTJ made the argument that "because he had observed on several occasions that the minority position in debates always lost (because they were overwhelmed by the sheer volume of majority arguments), he therefore concluded that because the thread was posted in the INTP subforum the ISTJ argument had no chance of receiving a proper hearing from the largely INTP audience". That was the argument. The INTJ didn't read the actual arguments being presented by either side. He simply looked at where the thread was posted and drew his conclusion. It should be self-evident why his inference and this conclusion are fallacious, so I won't go over that. What makes this a distinctly INTJ argument is that it started with Se perceptions (of several debates), moved quickly to Ni intuition (that the outcome of debates depend only on the balance of sides), and received peremptory consideration in Te thinking where he inferred a Universal Law of Debates from his limited and uncontrolled sample of data points (these are two of the problems I alluded to). That's Ni-Te analysis in a very simple example. (Note this is a simple example and doesn't mean INTJs always or can only think in this limited fashion; far from it; I know INTJs, for example, with advanced degrees from fancy schools like MIT and Princeton who can certainly do much better. So no flame wars, please. 

INTPs, otoh, started by asking, "what defines INTPs and ISTJs, and how does this pertain to the OP's question?". In other words, their analysis began in Ti, their dominant function. This opening question produced answers that naturally lead to other questions, and more answers, until one INTP (yours truly  concluded that because INTPs and ISTJs are defined by Ti-Ne and Si-Te, respectively; and Ti is both a dominant and a thinking function concerned with logical consistency (ie, contradictions); therefore, INTPs should be more logical. (This is the short version of the argument; the gruesome details can be found in the thread--read at your own risk  This is a thinking process that relies on the use of simple logic and some basic knowledge of MBTI, but no intuition (except the final "does this conclusion make sense" test I usually apply in my thinking). INTP process will not always follow this particular pattern, but it will be very similar, depending heavily on Ti.

My point here is that you could read these arguments and see what cognitive functions were at work. So even if you didn't know what types the INTJ and I are, you could easily determine this just by reading our posts. So I encourage you to go to the debate thread and join a debate. Then go back and look at your arguments to see what patterns of cognition emerge. INTP and INTJ typically use distinctly different patterns. You should probably be able to quite quickly decide your type this way. (Note: I've found that solving a problem can reveal type just as well and maybe even better than debating. So I encourage you to find one, like a logic puzzle, and write your answer out so you can analyze it later.) 

Good luck! And remember: don't say I didn't warn you about that thread! It's _fugly! _


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## aendern (Dec 28, 2013)

1. Are you German?

2. I totally agree with green girl that you are showing a lot of ISTJ attitudes and preferences. 

3. I agree with ae1905.


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## XZ9 (Nov 16, 2013)

You can't articulate your thoughts well. You're probably an INTP.


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## ninjahitsawall (Feb 1, 2013)

ae1905 said:


> I've found that one of the best ways--if not _the _best way--to determine your type is to actually do something, like debate or solve a problem, and see how you go about doing it. It is better, I believe, because it doesn't rely on what _you _think you are--ie, self-reporting, an acknowledge weakness in most of the tests you will find in typology--but directly on _how you use _your functions irl.
> 
> A common difference between INTPs and INTJs in debates, to take an example, is that the latter will hold a position that is largely based on their Ni perceptions and these perceptions will undergo relatively less complete analysis after being passed down into their auxiliary thinking function. The former, otoh, may also use intuitive perceptions, but these will be passed _up _into their dominant thinking function where Ti will more exhaustively examine these perceptions to tease out the meaning of and the relationships between them. It's from this analysis that INTPs' arguments emerge. (Note I've discussed the top two functions in both types, but both will also draw on their stores of knowledge in defining and refining their arguments--ie, the functions are used together.)
> 
> ...


I would have probably asked how do you define "logical", in a way that this definition can be tested in terms of INTP and ISTJ's functions. I don't know if that points to Ni-Te process. Though if you've heard of Dr Mike on YouTube, he says in a video with an INTP that INTP's ask more open-ended questions, whereas INTJ's have an "answer" in mind. (I didn't really like how he described it because that sounds like circular reasoning.. lol, but I get what he's saying). Starting out asking for an operational definition is essentially asking a question in attempt to get to a solution. I think it's possible a Te user may also have a more "solution-focused" argument or debating style than a Ti user. I don't know. When I talk to Ti users I kinda feel like I'm winging it sometimes. I wonder if they feel we're a step ahead or trying to bullshit them or something as we tend to think in sort of a forwards trajectory?


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## ficsci (May 4, 2011)

The part where you talked about math makes it sound like you use Ni as opposed to Ti, thus making you an INTJ. (But since I have neither, can anyone who does have either confirm this?)

Or you can find out whether you use Ne, which would make you an INTP:
Do you tend to think of multiple possible answers to some questions? Do you sometimes have a difficulty choosing from multiple possibilities, perhaps even sometimes overwhelmed by the number of them? Do you sometimes get into crazy inspired phases when ideas just grow at an exponential rate in your mind (and then possibly followed by phases where you're just exhausted and want to be braindead and alone?)

Lol that's kind of an Ne carricature, but hope you get the idea.


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## Fascist (Dec 22, 2014)

INTJ or INTP Test - CelebrityTypes.com


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

Your post irritated me, INTP. :laughing:


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## BloodSky (May 17, 2015)

Between INTP and INTJ, you sound more INTP.


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## xForgottenOne (Mar 7, 2015)

Try to have a look at cognitive functions, maybe take a test?


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## desire machine (Jan 13, 2015)

Dante Stark said:


> If you can understand this image without any explanation at all, then you are probably a Ni user, an INTJ


that image is awesome 

I think it explains it so well, and anyone could get that image. But I think you'd have to 1st have to have the basic MBTi concepts presented to you, more a teaching aid, don't think most would be able to figure it out from that pic alone, but that pic shows it so well in mho


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## cat123 (Jan 11, 2015)

ficsci said:


> The part where you talked about math makes it sound like you use Ni as opposed to Ti, thus making you an INTJ. (But since I have neither, can anyone who does have either confirm this?)
> 
> Or you can find out whether you use Ne, which would make you an INTP:
> Do you tend to think of multiple possible answers to some questions? Do you sometimes have a difficulty choosing from multiple possibilities, perhaps even sometimes overwhelmed by the number of them? Do you sometimes get into crazy inspired phases when ideas just grow at an exponential rate in your mind (and then possibly followed by phases where you're just exhausted and want to be braindead and alone?)
> ...


Ne sounds just like me. Trying to choose a movie on Netflix is a pure nightmare, and sometimes I'm almost drowning in ideas and projects


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## cat123 (Jan 11, 2015)

emberfly said:


> 1. Are you German?
> 
> 2. I totally agree with green girl that you are showing a lot of ISTJ attitudes and preferences.
> 
> 3. I agree with ae1905.


1. No, im Swedish, how come that you ask? 

2. I'll look into it

3. It's some really good advice, and i will take it


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## cat123 (Jan 11, 2015)

ae1905 said:


> cat123 said:
> 
> 
> > I have been trying to figure out what type i am for quite some time now. And i have now managed to narrow it down to two types but i am stuck at that point.
> ...


This is some great advice, thank you!


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