# Creepy/Not Creepy



## LostFavor (Aug 18, 2011)

marked174 said:


> I think creepy has become the new anti-male slur. It gets thrown around way too much. This behavior is not "creepy". It is racist and disrespectful, but it is not "creepy".


I would take it a step further and say the word "racist" get thrown around way too much and has become a way of describing any behavior that isn't "political correctness validated diversity." 

Prejudice and discrimination are alive and well, no doubt, but.. well.. I can't say it better than this song: 






I mean, if I prefer to date black people over white people, you can't call that prejudice unless my reasons are based on believing that white people are inherently inferior (or vice-versa). And you sure can't call it discrimination because no individual has an obligation to date another individual. 

So what do you call it? Well some say "racist," but what does that even mean? It's just a blanket way of saying "prejudice and/or discrimination."


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## Cheveyo (Nov 19, 2010)

Everyone saying creepy:

What's your opinion on women who ONLY date black men?


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## chickpea (Sep 20, 2014)

I don't necessarily think it's creepy to have a particular taste, but it's important to remember that our desires do not exist in a vacuum. They have a social and historical context, and we should examine where they come from.

For example, if a white man says he doesn't date black women, it's probably not much to do with his actual desire, and more to do with how black people are undervalued in society due to racism. Or if a white man only dates Asian girls, it probably has more to do with stereotypes and objectification of Asian girls than the man's desires. There are certain patterns we see over and over again that reflect systems of power and oppression in the world.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

Is it creepy if a guy only dates brunettes?
Is it creepy if a girl only dates guys who are about 2 or more inches taller than her?
Is it creepy if a guy learns how to play an instrument because he's attracted to musical girls?
Is it creepy if a guy wants to learn German because he already met a girl he really liked who is fluent in German?

I don't think any of these are inherently creepy, and I wouldn't call the example in the OP inherently creepy either.


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

Cheveyo said:


> Everyone saying creepy:
> 
> What's your opinion on women who ONLY date black men?


I find it creepy either way, but I think what someone else said is important. The motivation matters. If another hispanic man hits on my because he sees it as a common ground for a relationship then fine.

But if some women likes black guys because they are "chocolate kings" then its still fucking creepy.

The context that immediately comes to my mind is someone fetishizing a race because i've seen this happen to me and many of my friends. I even remember this back to like 3rd grade when a a black girl said "hey cutie speak spanish to me". Even as 3rd graders this happened and I remember it making me uncomfortable.

I've seen black guys do it to white girls. It crosses all sorts of ethnic and racial boundaries and I find it offensive and gross.

But like said before a preference is different. Preference is fine, but if the first thing you see when you look at me is my race and how "exotic" you find it then I think that's creepy.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

marked174 said:


> I think creepy has become the new anti-male slur. It gets thrown around way too much. This behavior is not "creepy". It is racist and disrespectful, but it is not "creepy".


Both men and women can do creepy shit. It's not an anti-male slur. It's certainly NOT an anti-male slur in the thread I posted about creepy shit people have said to you. Related, though, in a similar vein to the "yellow fever" example in the OP, I had an Asian guy tell me that he only wants to date white women because of the color of their nipples. It's racist, disrespectful AND creepy. Most men I know who fetishize Asian women do so because they're "more submissive" and "more traditional." Hearing that admission from multiple men has made me VERY uncomfortable. I especially find the "more submissive" reasoning to be really creepy because it reeks of a controlling personality.


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## marked174 (Feb 24, 2010)

koalaroo said:


> Both men and women can do creepy shit. It's not an anti-male slur.


 Men can be bitches too, but the word has traditionally and generally become one that target's a single gender. 



koalaroo said:


> It's certainly NOT an anti-male slur in the thread I posted about creepy shit people have said to you.


 Noted. But I would predict that the overwhelming number of cases in that thread targets male "creeps" instead of female ones (could be wrong about that, but I doubt it).



koalaroo said:


> Related, though, in a similar vein to the "yellow fever" example in the OP, I had an Asian guy tell me that he only wants to date white women because of the color of their nipples. It's racist, disrespectful AND creepy. Most men I know who fetishize Asian women do so because they're "more submissive" and "more traditional." Hearing that admission from multiple men has made me VERY uncomfortable. I especially find the "more submissive" reasoning to be really creepy because it reeks of a controlling personality.


 I'm not sure that's fair. Women on this forum and in general are constantly talking about how they want a dominant man. Does that "reek" of something? If not, why is it okay to want dominant men, but not submissive women?


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

marked174 said:


> I'm not sure that's fair. Women on this forum and in general are constantly talking about how they want a dominant man. Does that "reek" of something? If not, why is it okay to want dominant men, but not submissive women?


I haven't really seen women talk about wanting a dominant man, but if women are wanting a dominant man, then that's a little creepy, too. The only thing I can agree on is wanting an assertive partner and I wonder if this is what people mean when they say they want a dominant man; I want an assertive man, but I don't want one who dominates me. I know that personally I just want an equal who's not going to treat me like shit, who I can recognize as a leader when he's more expert at something than I am, and who can recognize me as a leader when I'm more expert at something than he is. But, it's difficult to find people of either sex who are willing to compromise, as many people view compromising as losing.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

How is this racist? It would be racist if he dated all women except asian women. Its very possibly putting asian girls on an unrealistic pedestal based on false stereotypes, I don't see how you can call this racist though.

Even the example that was brought up of an asian guy who only likes white girls because he likes the color of their nipples, although pretty strange is still not racist. That example is different than say if he only liked white girls because he thought all other girls were dumb and inferior.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

stiletto said:


> Creepy and racist. <_<
> 
> 
> 
> ...


IMHO that article was written by somebody furthering an agenda, there's no journalism from Huff Po, but rather a series of ridiculously biased rubbish articles that may as well have been parroted from social media sites intent upon bashing men & masculinity. Ethan Fedida & Hayden Rockwell are a disgrace to social media, neither are fit to edit a high school newsletter & proof that journalism is nonexistent or censored from within the lame stream media.

There are several reasons other than ridiculous school girl stereotypes or accusations of Asian fever that a western man might prefer an Asian woman. 
If I had it to do over again, one major reason that I may prefer east Asian women rather than western women is due to the traditional values eastern women are raised with.
Yes I'd likely defer from seeking/building a relationship with western women raised within a culture that's hostile or resentful toward me due to my race, sex & country of birth.

I wouldn't give half a f--k what anybody thought of me seeking a traditional Asian woman!


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

I'm really confused why everyone wants to be the victim?

"no men are treated bad too! no what about us!"

I mean. How does this even happen? Why can't we just talk about the topic? It baffles me how this just follows every thread in the world.


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

Sporadic Aura said:


> How is this racist? It would be racist if he dated all women except asian women. Its very possibly putting asian girls on an unrealistic pedestal based on false stereotypes, I don't see how you can call this racist though.
> 
> Even the example that was brought up of an asian guy who only likes white girls because he likes the color of their nipples, although pretty strange is still not racist. That example is different than say if he only liked white girls because he thought all other girls were dumb and inferior.


Its not racist. But its certainly fetishizing a race. If someone said they liked you for the color of your nipples are you telling me you'd be okay with that?


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Kazoo said:


> Its not racist. But its certainly fetishizing a race. If someone said they liked you for the color of your nipples are you telling me you'd be okay with that?


Why is nipples racist and eyes/hair not?


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

Kazoo said:


> Its not racist. But its certainly fetishizing a race. If someone said they liked you for the color of your nipples are you telling me you'd be okay with that?


Honestly, I'd find it incredibly hilarious.

I definitely wouldn't date them, but I wouldn't be offended. The obvious solution is just not to date people who like you only for your nipples, I mean no one is forcing you to date someone like that. And if he does find a girl who doesn't care, then whatever, its her choice, not like its really doing any harm.


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

Stelliferous said:


> Why is nipples racist and eyes/hair not?


I specificly said it was not racist. It was like, the first 3 words.

Anyway it may not be racist, but its demeaning. You can demean people with hair and eye color too. If I see a blonde and only perceive that person as a "blond" rather than a human being then its objectifying them and is wrong. You can fetishize any trait and it will be equally creepy. It has nothing to do with race. Just don't break people down into one physical or mental quality and repsect that they are more then the catagory you broke them down too.



Sporadic Aura said:


> Honestly, I'd find it incredibly hilarious.
> 
> I definitely wouldn't date them, but I wouldn't be offended. The obvious solution is just not to date people who like you only for your nipples, I mean no one is forcing you to date someone like that. And if he does find a girl who doesn't care, then whatever, its her choice, not like its really doing any harm.


I never said I would be offended, but obviously this is not something you want in the potential mate. Which you also confirm by saying you'd break up them.

I'm not saying its wrong. I'm saying its not what most people want and will most likely not lead to a functional relationship. Which I think is the point of the thread.


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## marked174 (Feb 24, 2010)

koalaroo said:


> I haven't really seen women talk about wanting a dominant man, but if women are wanting a dominant man, then that's a little creepy, too. The only thing I can agree on is wanting an assertive partner and I wonder if this is what people mean when they say they want a dominant man; I want an assertive man, but I don't want one who dominates me. I know that personally I just want an equal who's not going to treat me like shit, who I can recognize as a leader when he's more expert at something than I am, and who can recognize me as a leader when I'm more expert at something than he is. But, it's difficult to find people of either sex who are willing to compromise, as many people view compromising as losing.


 I agree that it's hard to find a relationship like that. I also don't like the "dominant" and "submissive" labels. Personally, I always wanted to find an equal too (and I believe I have).

That being said, I think that the dominant/assertive argument is just semantics. A similar distinction could be made between submissive/traditional with a person cherry picking the positive qualities and leaving the bad ones. If we are going to assume that "traditional" means submissive, then I'm also going to assume that "assertive" means dominant. Or, if we are going to separate assertive from dominant then a similar separation should be afforded to traditional and submissive.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

I think it depends how they go about it. Sounds borderline obsessive. But to each their own. I have known alot of guys that have a thing for asian women never heard of any of them going that far to attain one.


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## Brian1 (May 7, 2011)

Here's my question, what if the girl, the Chinese lady, figures out she is being used by the guy who is dating her, while he's learning Chinese, his first semester of it, and he's not very good at it, is the breakup revenge, breaking up with the guy, after the due date to drop your class, and get a full refund has expired? But I spent all this money on you? It's like its own version of flowers that you gave to your loved one, that have now died.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Cinnamon83 said:


> I think it depends how they go about it. Sounds borderline obsessive. But to each their own. I have known alot of guys that have a thing for asian women never heard of any of them going that far to attain one.


My friend who is incredibly into Chinese and Japanese women truly wants to BE Chinese or Japanese. It's not really fully about the women.. For him.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

Kazoo said:


> I specificly said it was not racist. It was like, the first 3 words.
> 
> Anyway it may not be racist, but its demeaning. You can demean people with hair and eye color too. If I see a blonde and only perceive that person as a "blond" rather than a human being then its objectifying them and is wrong. You can fetishize any trait and it will be equally creepy. It has nothing to do with race. Just don't break people down into one physical or mental quality and repsect that they are more then the catagory you broke them down too.
> 
> ...


Yeah I read it wrong.


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## ai.tran.75 (Feb 26, 2014)

I find it odd - but not creepy - people have types that they fell for


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## Mimic octopus (May 3, 2014)

chickpea said:


> I don't necessarily think it's creepy to have a particular taste, but it's important to remember that our desires do not exist in a vacuum. They have a social and historical context, and we should examine where they come from.
> 
> For example, if a white man says he doesn't date black women, it's probably not much to do with his actual desire, and more to do with how black people are undervalued in society due to racism. Or if a white man only dates Asian girls, it probably has more to do with stereotypes and objectification of Asian girls than the man's desires. There are certain patterns we see over and over again that reflect systems of power and oppression in the world.


I would say that most people's desires do exist in a vacuum though and just attributed to biology not society or whatever. If you have a purely aesthetic preference for a group of people I can't see anything wrong with that. However you're probably right that if someone exclusively wants to date a particular race it's probably for racist reasons (or it's a signifier of a mental deficiency or something).


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## MisterD (Feb 24, 2010)

Saying that is creepy is like saying you think someone is creepy for liking dim sim over a burger, or tacos over sushi.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> IMHO that article was written by an asshole with an agenda, there's no journalism from Huff Po, but rather a series of ridiculously biased rubbish articles that may as well have been parroted from social media sites intent upon bashing men & masculinity. Ethan Fedida & Hayden Rockwell are a disgrace to social media, neither are fit to edit a high school newsletter & proof that journalism is nonexistent or censored from within the lame stream media.
> 
> There are several reasons other than ridiculous school girl stereotypes or accusations of Asian fever that a western man might prefer an Asian woman.
> If I had it to do over again, one major reason that I may prefer east Asian women rather than western women is due to the traditional values eastern women are raised with.
> ...


I'm not talking about the article. Watch the video. 

Your post makes a great deal of assumptions about Eastern and Western women. What about what you classify as Eastern women with Western culture? What is that then? Are they not Eastern or Western? That distinction on it's own is problematic. When you say "traditional" values, please specify because it certainly looks from here to be another way of saying "patriarchal". 

If its only their skin colour and "traditions" that you are attracted to, rather than THEM as a person, as a whole (because aesthetics and traditions aren't the only qualities that should make up a mate), then you are being racist. Thus, you clearly don't give a fuck if people think you are racist. Trust me, women come around. Asian women are especially in tune with looking out for, and crossing out men with yellow fever. Maybe you'll be lucky enough to find one that is insecure enough to enjoy fulfilling that role. Good luck!


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## Shahada (Apr 26, 2010)

Nothing creepy or racist at all about preferring Asian women because they haven't been brainwashed by feminism to hate me for being a white man and are meek and submissive as a good traditional wife should be.


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

Shahada said:


> Nothing creepy or racist at all about preferring Asian women because they haven't been brainwashed by feminism to hate me for being a white man and are meek and submissive as a good traditional wife should be.


I know your kidding but this post fucks me up.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

stiletto said:


> I'm not talking about the article. Watch the video.
> 
> Your post makes a great deal of assumptions about Eastern and Western women. What about what you classify as Eastern women with Western culture? What is that then? Are they not Eastern or Western? That distinction on it's own is problematic. When you say "traditional" values, please specify because it certainly looks from here to be another way of saying "patriarchal".
> 
> If its only their skin colour and "traditions" that you are attracted to, rather than THEM as a person, as a whole (because aesthetics and traditions aren't the only qualities that should make up a mate), then you are being racist. Thus, you clearly don't give a fuck if people think you are racist. Trust me, women come around. Asian women are especially in tune with looking out for, and crossing out men with yellow fever. Maybe you'll be lucky enough to find one that is insecure enough to enjoy fulfilling that role. Good luck!


I indicated that if I had it to do over again, I'd very likely avoid dating/marriage with a western woman.
I'd be very hesitant to risk my future or start a family with a western woman. Western society conditions females to despise masculinity & resent men due to their gender.
The result of such societal conditioning is that American families too often crash & burn, resulting in children being raised by single mothers & their occasional partners.
I don't get how you accuse that's racist, but you keep doing you & I'll stick to my preferences regardless of your opinion.

Far eastern women are family orientated & very seldom raised within an environment that's hostile towards men.

I'd prefer to be part of this family

















rather than chancing my future & ending out similar to this family.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

marked174 said:


> I think creepy has become the new anti-male slur. It gets thrown around way too much. This behavior is not "creepy". It is racist and disrespectful, but it is not "creepy".


You can't determine whether such behavior constitutes racism without first knowing the motivation that guides said individual.

Could be a preference for
A particular physical appearance
A preference for a woman raised with far eastern religion
A woman that believes in traditional far eastern family values
A woman that appreciates men/masculinity, ying/yang energy being 2 equal halves of the whole

There are many reasons to prefer a traditional far eastern woman, but those who resent men (white men) & despise masculinity would have you believe that every white man is seeking a raven haired, petite, Asian gal aka Asian Spinner. Individuals spreading such stereotypes are being flagged all over the Internet for hate speech
Example: The Femi-Nazi article linked below specifically targets white men. No mention of Black men, Hispanic men, Native American men or Middle Eastern men, nope just western white men. This thread has a few parrots that are regurgitating a variation of the standard line. White men are the devil. LOL
*
Asian Women Need To Stop Dating White Men | Thought ...*
thoughtcatalog.com/anne.../*asian*-*women*-need-to-stop-dating-*white*-*men*...
Mar 28, 2014 - If they wanna *date* a white man, all the more power to them, right? ...*White men* who chase after *Asian Women* are afflicted with something ... of *White guy's* racist power fantasies, and conversely, *White guys* why *don't* you 


There's a campaign against western white men


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

ai.tran.75 said:


> I find it odd - but not creepy - people have types that they fell for


I wouldn't find it odd were the roles reversed & a woman was attracted to me due to my race or place of origin.


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## ai.tran.75 (Feb 26, 2014)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> I wouldn't find it odd were the roles reversed & a woman was attracted to me due to my race or place of origin.


I think it's fine to have a certain type - but to refuse to like any other type but a specific race is kinda odd, for example I'm only attracted men my age or older and I have a preference for thin men , many people find it odd and I don't disagree with them


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## WamphyriThrall (Apr 11, 2011)

Shahada said:


> Nothing creepy or racist at all about preferring Asian women because they haven't been brainwashed by feminism to hate me for being a white man and are meek and submissive as a good traditional wife should be.


Anyone who thinks Asian or Hispanic women are meek or submissive is in for a huge shock, should they choose to date or marry one. 

But yeah, I'd much rather have someone like me for me, instead of whichever "exotic" traits or stereotypes they see in me.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

ai.tran.75 said:


> I think it's fine to have a certain type - but to refuse to like any other type but a specific race is kinda odd, for example I'm only attracted men my age or older and I have a preference for thin men , many people find it odd and I don't disagree with them


Thin men? So you're not attracted towards very masculine/muscular men?


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## Stasis (May 6, 2014)

WamphyriThrall said:


> *Anyone who thinks Asian or Hispanic women are meek or submissive is in for a huge shock, should they choose to date or marry one. *
> 
> But yeah, I'd much rather have someone like me for me, instead of whichever "exotic" traits or stereotypes they see in me.


Are Hispanic women usually seen as meek or submissive?


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## ai.tran.75 (Feb 26, 2014)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> Thin men? So you're not attracted towards very masculine/muscular men?


Masculine lanky men - difficult and rare i know . I'm not attracted to muscular men and don't find buff physically appealing ; of course this is physically speaking- the way a person present themselves much different , looks only appealing to me for 5 minutes if personality or the way they present themselves is unappealing I can be quickly turn off same goes with somebody whom I find un attractive if chemistry is there their looks will suddenly appear appealing to me


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## WamphyriThrall (Apr 11, 2011)

EDLC said:


> Are Hispanic women usually seen as meek or submissive?


Well, to an extent, and it probably varies from nationality to nationality. I think a lot of Anglo-Americans view the familial and traditional traits of Hispanic cultures as being somehow more feminine, accommodating, and ideal; basically the opposite of how they picture your modern white American woman, without considering how they might have to change to fit into these structures. 

A lot of guys who have dated Hispanic women have complained about their supposed possessiveness, tempers, and obligations to their families. My parents for example were born and raised in the US, but they're more of a mixture of the two cultures, plus their own unique personalities.

Just don't go in thinking everyone is one way, because it usually leads to disappointment.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> I indicated that if I had it to do over again, I'd very likely avoid dating/marriage with a western woman.
> I'd be very hesitant to risk my future or start a family with a western woman. Western society conditions females to despise masculinity & resent men due to their gender.
> The result of such societal conditioning is that American families too often crash & burn, resulting in children being raised by single mothers & their occasional partners.
> I don't get how you accuse that's racist, but you keep doing you & I'll stick to my preferences regardless of your opinion.
> ...



This post is resoundingly and creepily orientalist.


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## 1000BugsNightSky (May 8, 2014)

Limiting for sure, if it he only dates people of 1 race. However, if he is interested and fascinated by that culture, or finds those people more attractive than others (in general/ with exceptions, of course), that's ok to have a preference.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> I indicated that if I had it to do over again, I'd very likely avoid dating/marriage with a western woman.
> I'd be very hesitant to risk my future or start a family with a western woman. Western society conditions females to despise masculinity & resent men due to their gender.
> The result of such societal conditioning is that American families too often crash & burn, resulting in children being raised by single mothers & their occasional partners.
> I don't get how you accuse that's racist, but you keep doing you & I'll stick to my preferences regardless of your opinion.
> ...


You are entitled to your personal preference. But just know that this preference has come from a prejudice and racist value. Do not forget it.


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## Stasis (May 6, 2014)

WamphyriThrall said:


> Well, to an extent, and it probably varies from nationality to nationality. *I think a lot of Anglo-Americans view the familial and traditional traits of Hispanic cultures as being somehow more feminine, accommodating, and ideal*; basically the opposite of how they picture your modern white American woman, without considering how they might have to change to fit into these structures.
> 
> A lot of guys who have dated Hispanic women have complained about their supposed possessiveness, tempers, and obligations to their families. My parents for example were born and raised in the US, but they're more of a mixture of the two cultures, plus their own unique personalities.
> 
> Just don't go in thinking everyone is one way, because it usually leads to disappointment.


Ah, that makes sense. 

Oh, I'm very familiar with the complaints. It's a very popular idea that a man is supposed to tame the woman in the countries I grew up in. I suppose that's why I was surprised by the idea that someone would view Hispanic women as submissive. My upbringing does not support that notion but again, it's all about perspective.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

Koalaroo that's your interpretation & you're entitled to your opinion but I think you're focusing too intently upon an aspect (named location) rather than the motivation.
The motivation would be to meet a compatible woman that's absent conditioning instilled by western society. I kinda dig eastern cultures emphasis upon the family, how kind & affectionate eastern women appear. 
Just my $.05 worth. Based upon western society of today, if I had it to do over again I'd likely opt out from starting a family with a woman raised within western society. Nothing against women but rather western culture sucks & I don't like the odds of divorce, nor of any hypothetical children being raised within a broken family.


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## Shahada (Apr 26, 2010)

Stampede said:


> Would you consider women who only date tall men and actively do things to entice tall men to have a "tall guy fetish"? If so, then the whole idea of sexual fetishism is redundant in my opinion.


Saying you find people of a certain "race" more physically attractive, while it may be influenced by racist stereotypes and ideas about what's attractive and what's not (for example, the global cultural norm of light skin being more attractive than dark skin), is sort of different than saying "I like women of a certain race because they are [racist stereotypes about the behavior of said ethnic group]." While the former example could be and probably is influenced by racist cultural ideas, its largely unconscious and instinctual (for the record I don't think physical attraction is so easily separated and made discreet from other things about a person that makes them attractive, but I'm simplifying this for the sake of argument). In the latter example the person finds the woman desirable because certain racist stereotypes about behavior and personality are associated with her solely on the basis of her race, which I think is quite different.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

Shahada said:


> Saying you find people of a certain "race" more physically attractive, while it may be somewhat influenced by racist stereotypes and ideas about what's attractive and what's not (for example, the global cultural norm of light skin being more attractive than dark skin), is sort of different than saying "I like women of a certain race because they are [racist stereotypes about the behavior of said ethnic group]." While the former example could be and probably is influenced by racist cultural ideas, its largely unconscious and instinctual. In the latter example the person finds the woman desirable because certain racist stereotypes about behavior and personality are associated with her solely on the basis of her race, which I think is quite different.


I'm not defending the latter example. That would be retarded.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

http://www.buzzfeed.com/hnigatu/10-ridiculously-offensive-things-people-tell-asian-women-on#2qrl9yd

FWIW -- Asian fetishism.


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## Shahada (Apr 26, 2010)

Stampede said:


> I'm not defending the latter example. That would be retarded.


 Oh I misunderstood then, sorry.


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## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

spylass said:


> If the only thing you like about a person because of their race that can be problematic, because a)you probably have some kind of racist stereotype that they assume that person fits or b) because you like the "exotic" features of their body and are objectifying them.
> 
> Having preferences is a separate thing, because what the OP mentioned, learning foreign languages to woo someone of the preferred race is further than just a preference, you're actively seeking out people based on a characteristic. And if someone was only interested in me because of my hair color but actually wanted to pursue a legit relationship off them liking my physical aesthetic or the stereotypes that surround my hair color, I would definitely consider that a fetish and I would find it creepy and gross.
> 
> ...


I'd call this an unusual fetish in itself. :/


> But openly talking about race is sexy to me. Admitting your privilege and wanting unlearn racism is sexy to me. If you say it and mean it, you’ll improve your chances of signing my vagina’s guestbook.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

Grandmaster Yoda said:


> I'd call this an unusual fetish in itself. :/


Mmmm, REVOKE that privilege, REVOKE IT, yeah, yeah, unlearn your racism you foolish worm, mmmm!

Sounds hot.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

Stelliferous said:


> Sigh. No he isn't marrying somebody because if this. He's dating them for this. Then marriage comes after they connect. :/ It's just a logical reasoning as to WHERE TO LOOK. It's not a logical reasoning as to whom to marry. It's called looking in the places that he has the best odds of getting results. There is no expectancy, just greater odds.












I don't think you understand. When you say the ODDS of finding a woman to date that produces a desirable and traditional match for a man, can be found through filtering by race, that is *racism (and sexism)*. HELLO?

And to point out you referenced statistical divorces which implies marriage, not simply successful dating partners btw.


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## MisterD (Feb 24, 2010)

If it's racist & sexist to prefer one race over another... I'm a racist, sexist pig ! 

One race is more attractive than another race, for me any way. To say that "attraction" is sexist & racist is just stupid. 

People can date whoever they want & there is nothing wrong with pre-selection/preferences. Nobody has the right to tell someone who they can & can't date.

Some people like tall, some people like short. Some like fat, some like skinny. It's not creepy at all for someone to have any preferences when choosing a partner.


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## Noctis (Apr 4, 2012)

I find women of all kinds of races attractive and I think it is perfectly healthy. People all have their ideas on what is creepy vs non creepy. However when creepy becomes a throw-around word to describe a man or woman who isn't traditionally attractive, then that is very discriminatory.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> I know that you are married, so I hope it's not to personal to ask, what is the race of your wife? And I'm assuming you're a white male american?



My wife is Caucasian (northern European ancestry). 

Yes I'm a white American male.


----------



## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

stiletto said:


> I don't think you understand. When you say the ODDS of finding a woman to date that produces a desirable and traditional match for a man, can be found through filtering by race, that is *racism (and sexism)*. HELLO?
> 
> And to point out you referenced statistical divorces which implies marriage, not simply successful dating partners btw.


No you still don't understand nor does shahada. You are both clearly putting words into my mouth. "All Asian women marry with successful families" No. I didn't say that. I DID NOT SAY THAT. Get that through your minds. Steps 1) wants to get married 2) looks at best odds to get married 3) dates around the odds 4) date turns into either marriage or not working out. It could be either because each woman is different. The woman could easily not want a family.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

MisterD said:


> If it's racist & sexist to prefer one race over another... I'm a racist, sexist pig !
> 
> One race is more attractive than another race, for me any way. To say that "attraction" is sexist & racist is just stupid.
> 
> ...


You joined late into the conversation. Nothing is wrong with being attracted to a certain complexion, hair type, eye colour etc. What I was referring to was going about selecting a mate by assuming certain races and certain cultures produce an X type of woman with X values (these guys were defending that American/Western women do not value family as much as Asian/Eastern women - citing divorce rates as proof - as if unsuccessful marriages are determined by the woman's culture/race?). 

People cannot help who they are attracted to. But people can be aware of their biases and prejudices. That is all.



Stelliferous said:


> No you still don't understand nor does shahada. You are both clearly putting words into my mouth. "All Asian women marry with successful families" No. I didn't say that. I DID NOT SAY THAT. Get that through your minds. Steps 1) wants to get married 2) looks at best odds to get married 3) dates around the odds 4) date turns into either marriage or not working out. It could be either because each woman is different. The woman could easily not want a family.


I don't think you know how to debate. I am talking about your point number 3. To assume those "odds" even exist (and passing it off as a fact) already implies that you have the preconceived notion that these cultures produce "family oriented women". I say family loosely because what men really mean when they say "women with family values" they mean "women who value a man".


----------



## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

stiletto said:


> Every single thing you have posted and said about western/eastern women have been HUGE *generalizations and Stereotypes* both. While you do not make the distinction of a partner through the aesthetics of skin, you are making through the assumption that one race = (not)will like/appreciate you.


It really isn't women that are the cause of my frustration & a bit of my being pissed off had likely leaked into my comments. I'm human, get over it.

Anyhow I wondered whether the opinion that I voiced was off kilter, so I asked an impartial opinion & apparently you have a point regarding the above section of your comment. I'll reflect upon my apparent prejudice for a while & work upon adjustments as necessary.

Hang loose girl.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

You gentlemen with yellow fever need to really step back. Stop becoming defensive and take a moment to look at your own biases. You are doing everyone including any Asian woman you date a huge disservice by being in denial. The prejudices are SO deeply embedded, you cannot and will not see it. It is clearly there and evident. Having someone objectively point out your racial lens is NOT A BAD THING. Having racism identified does NOT vilify you or make you a BAD person. What DOES make you an ignorant person is not having the willingness or ability to see it. Even worse, coming to its defense. I could start an entire conversation about white privilege, however, that is a topic on another thread.

EDIT: I did see your recent post stargazing, and this post would have been the "before" of yours.

Generally speaking to everyone, it doesn't matter if you get upset at me over the internet, or go bitching to your real life friends to rally support. It is simply racism and sexism. At the end of the day, the goal is to stop romanticizing any race/culture because you/or her, will be in for a rude awakening when things get serious and don't turn out to be your "ideal".

And again for those who joined in late. It is perfectly reasonable to be physically attracted to certain attributes, but when race/culture is attached to "ideals" and then used as a requisite, that is racism. And yes, it is creepy. Don't be that guy.


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## spylass (Jan 25, 2014)

Stampede said:


> Would you consider women who only date tall men and actively do things to entice tall men to have a "tall guy fetish"? If so, then the whole idea of sexual fetishism is redundant in my opinion.
> 
> Like, say if height isn't the ONLY thing they're after. If a tall guy is a miserable human being, then she wouldn't date him, but she finds it very difficult to be physically attracted to a man who's shorter than her. Would that be considered a fetish? You don't choose your height, you're just born with it, but it's a vital physical characteristic that people have no problem being openly discriminatory about.


But honestly if a girl is only attracted to a guy's height and nothing else, that's a fetish and that's shallow. 
The thing is- usually when men have fetishes for women it is very much tied into race and stereotypes. You can't think about race as being only purely about physical attributes, there's way more embedded in the representation of races in our culture than that and inevitable that influences people.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

spylass said:


> But honestly if a girl is only attracted to a guy's height and nothing else, that's a fetish and that's shallow.
> The thing is- usually when men have fetishes for women it is very much tied into race and stereotypes. You can't think about race as being only purely about physical attributes, there's way more embedded in the representation of races in our culture than that and inevitable that influences people.


Strawman. That wasn't the example I put forth. She can be attracted to intelligence, abs, eyes, all that other good stuff, but height just makes her panties wet faster than a waterfall. This woman deems physical attraction to be an important part of a healthy intimate relationship, so she filters out guys who aren't tall. Nothing against them personally, she just would have a difficult time being attracted to them on a physical level. Are you saying that this is sick, shallow "fetishism"? I'm not.

To your second point, wut? That's sexist. You're saying that women have more "sophisticated" fetishes than men? What are you basing that on? "Man, when those Japs have fetishes they sure are sick and evil! We're much better than they are!" I do think about race as being purely about physical attributes in this context. I find some races to be more physically arousing than others. I don't think that Asian/Hispanic women are "meek and submissive".

If a guy says "I like black chicks because they make my dick hard" there's nothing wrong with that.

If a guy says "I like black chicks because I want to test drive a wild ****** animal" there's something wrong with that.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

stiletto said:


> You gentlemen with yellow fever need to really step back. Stop becoming defensive and take a moment to look at your own biases. You are doing everyone including any Asian woman you date a huge disservice by being in denial. The prejudices are SO deeply embedded, you cannot and will not see it. It is clearly there and evident. Having someone objectively point out your racial lens is NOT A BAD THING. Having racism identified does NOT vilify you or make you a BAD person. What DOES make you an ignorant person is not having the willingness or ability to see it. Even worse, coming to its defense. I could start an entire conversation about white privilege, however, that is a topic on another thread.
> 
> EDIT: I did see your recent post stargazing, and this post would have been the "before" of yours.
> 
> ...


----------



## marked174 (Feb 24, 2010)

stiletto said:


> I don't think you know how to debate. I am talking about your point number 3. To assume those "odds" even exist (and passing it off as a fact) already implies that you have the preconceived notion that these cultures produce "family oriented women". I say family loosely because what men really mean when they say "women with family values" they mean "women who value a man".


 Well, technically, the odds do exist. They might not fall in line with preconceived prejudices (they might though), but somewhere down the line a certain group will tend to be more one way than another. 

This applies to literally anything. You make an artificial grouping, and one of those groups will be tallest an average, poorest on average, smartest on average etc. Recognizing that a certain group will be more likely to exhibit certain behaviors and values than another group is just being honest.

Now, making a specific claim that group A is the tallest might not be true, but one of the groups definitely will be.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

marked174 said:


> Well, technically, the odds do exist. They might not fall in line with preconceived prejudices (they might though), but somewhere down the line a certain group will tend to be more one way than another.
> 
> This applies to literally anything. You make an artificial grouping, and one of those groups will be tallest an average, poorest on average, smartest on average etc. Recognizing that a certain group will be more likely to exhibit certain behaviors and values than another group is just being honest.
> 
> Now, making a specific claim that group A is the tallest might not be true, but one of the groups definitely will be.


While they odds may exist, it still doesn't address the core issue of the xenophile seeking a mate solely based on their idealized understanding of the values and traditions of a certain culture (racism). Though it is not blatent, obvious, negative racism, it still has a negative overall ripple effect on that particular culture. People have to live with those reinforced stereotypes on a daily basis. Under the guise of looking for women that fit "traditional, male-centered" roles, men with yellow fever fail to demonstrate a genuine understanding and appreciation of both Western and Eastern culture before making those assumptions. Thus (in laymans terms), they are being racist (and sexist depending on context).


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

stargazing grasshopper said:


>


I know you are looking for an out. But I don't need to "hang loose". I am not having an emotionally charged reaction to the topic, rather simply frustrated when I have to explain something that is rather clear. It would be inconvenient for me to have to ironically and angrily defend my non-anger when you guys are inaccurately representing my state of mind. :dry:


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> That's every woman on earth.


What was the point of your asinine comment? It's not witty, just makes you sound bitter.


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## spylass (Jan 25, 2014)

Stampede said:


> Strawman. That wasn't the example I put forth. She can be attracted to intelligence, abs, eyes, all that other good stuff, but height just makes her panties wet faster than a waterfall. This woman deems physical attraction to be an important part of a healthy intimate relationship, so she filters out guys who aren't tall. Nothing against them personally, she just would have a difficult time being attracted to them on a physical level. Are you saying that this is sick, shallow "fetishism"? I'm not.
> 
> To your second point, wut? That's sexist. You're saying that women have more "sophisticated" fetishes than men? What are you basing that on? "Man, when those Japs have fetishes they sure are sick and evil! We're much better than they are!" I do think about race as being purely about physical attributes in this context. I find some races to be more physically arousing than others. I don't think that Asian/Hispanic women are "meek and submissive".
> 
> ...



You can't equate race to other things like intelligence. Intelligence has to do with what a person has to say, race is just something they were born into. Also race has a history behind it- there are many many power dynamics and stereotypes at work when people fetishize someone for their race. 

The last two examples you gave are both examples of fetishizing and objectifying a woman. The second one uses an offensive slur but both are problematic.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

spylass said:


> You can't equate race to other things like intelligence. Intelligence has to do with what a person has to say, race is just something they were born into. Also race has a history behind it- there are many many power dynamics and stereotypes at work when people fetishize someone for their race.
> 
> The last two examples you gave are both examples of fetishizing and objectifying a woman. The second one uses an offensive slur but both are problematic.


I can equate race to other things like intelligence. They're variables of attraction. You're born into your IQ, your eye color, and your hair color just as you're born into your race. I'm not stereotyping or "fetishizing" (whatever that means) people based on their race. Physical attraction does not = stereotyping.

Being attracted to a woman because of a physical characteristic she possesses is "objectifying" her? K, go tell all the women who are attracted to tall men or white men that they're "objectifying" them.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

[No message]


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> That's the basic nature of every woman. Women seek men who have resources greater than their own. How many women would prefer to marry a man who has considerably less than her? None. Some may settle. But, they would prefer to have a man with WAY more than themselves.


If you have a penis, you are in no position to tell me anything about the "basic nature of every woman."
Stop talking, you're making yourself sound ridiculous and petulant. Like you're pissed off you can't actually do these things. You're not making women sound bad, you're making _yourself _sound bad.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

[No message]


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> *I'll speak as much as I want to about anything I wish.* To deny such basic aspects of human nature is silly. Men and women seek mates for certain reasons instinctively. Women seeking men with resources (in greater abundance than her own) is one of those.


If you want to continue your ignorant spiel, be my guest. It's not like your opinions are reality anyway.

You know zilch about the basic aspects of human nature I can guarantee it. You know how I know this? No one ever has definitively told us what basic human nature is, the best we have are theories people come up with to suit our emotional states/desires at the time. 

So once again, stop talking like you know things you clearly know nothing about.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> If you want to continue your ignorant spiel, be my guest. It's not like your opinions are reality anyway.
> 
> You know zilch about the basic aspects of human nature I can guarantee it. You know how I know this? No one ever has definitively told us what basic human nature is, the best we have our theories people come up with to suit our emotional states/desires at the time.
> 
> So once again, stop talking like you know things you clearly no nothing about.


Yes, I do know what I'm talking about. You don't.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> Yes, I do know what I'm talking about. You don't.


Said the guy telling me about "basic women nature of every woman". K.
Tell me Mr Genius, how do bisexual or lesbian women factor into your stupid conjecture? Or do they not count because they're not real women?

And what about cougars? The women that specifically go for younger men who, by nature of their age, have less considerably less than her?

And what about tribes in which women were the more dominant/powerful gender, and men the more submissive?

And what about women who have no desire to marry at all?

And what about women from rich, powerful families who fall in love and marry men from less privileged backgrounds? They too want someone with "WAY" more than themselves?

There's a reason I don't assert such biased and uninformed claptrap like you, and it's because I know that the world isn't black and white.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Said the guy telling me about "basic women nature of every woman". K.
> Tell me Mr Genius, how do bisexual or lesbian women factor into your stupid conjecture? Or do they not count because they're not real women?
> 
> And what about cougars? The women that specifically go for younger men who, by nature of their age, have less considerably less than her?
> ...


My assertion bothers you doesn't it?


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> My assertion bothers you doesn't it?


No, you do.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> No, you do.


It's my pleasure.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

WillyT said:


> That's the basic nature of every woman. Women seek men who have resources greater than their own. How many women would prefer to marry a man who has considerably less than her? None. Some may settle. But, they would prefer to have a man with WAY more than themselves.


I disagree. I find women have more resources than men (but YOU are going to have to state your definition and clarify your understanding of the term before we discuss this). It's a societal constructed ideology that men have greater resources. There is also no evidence to support that a woman's basic nature is to seek a mate with more resources than her own. If anything, the ideal mate is able to bring the necessary resources that compliment ones she does not already have. How foolish would it be for any creature to find a mate with quote, "WAY more than themselves", putting themselves in an undesirable place of power within the partnership? Illogical.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> It's my pleasure.


Good for you, nothing like getting off on the idea you chat so much rubbish, people find it irritating.
Sounds like a great goal to aim for.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Good for you, nothing like getting off on the idea you chat so much rubbish, people find it irritating.
> Sounds like a great goal to aim for.


It passes the time.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

stiletto said:


> I disagree. I find women have more resources than men


I'm not talking about "men." I'm talking about a "man."


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> It passes the time.


It doesn't surprise me that such a valiant, outstanding Alpha™ male like yourself passes his time in this way.
Not one bit.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> It doesn't surprise me that such a valiant, outstanding Alpha™ male like yourself passes his time in this way.
> Not one bit.


And who am I having an exchange with?


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## Fern (Sep 2, 2012)

Everything is creepy if you aren't handsome.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> And who am I having an exchange with?


Someone who doesn't feel need to deflect criticism when they're feeling hard done by.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Someone who doesn't feel need to deflect criticism when they're feeling hard done by.


Really? You always have to have the last word, don't you?


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## marked174 (Feb 24, 2010)

WillyT said:


> That's the basic nature of every woman. Women seek men who have resources greater than their own. How many women would prefer to marry a man who has considerably less than her? None. Some may settle. But, they would prefer to have a man with WAY more than themselves.


I know that this might be hard for you to believe, but there are some women out there who care about more than how much money a guy has.

Some women just want to find a guy who TREATS HER RIGHT, and could care less about pretty much everything else besides that.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> Really? You always have to have the last word, don't you?


K


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

Fern said:


> Everything is creepy if you aren't handsome.


Or rich.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> K


I knew it.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

WillyT said:


> I knew it.


:kitteh:


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

Up and down and all around.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

WillyT said:


> I'm not talking about "men." I'm talking about a "man."


Regardless, your position lacks reason and points are shoddy at best.


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## WillyT (Jul 22, 2013)

stiletto said:


> Regardless, your position lacks reason and points are shoddy at best.


So, female doctors tend to marry men who work at convenient stores?


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

WillyT said:


> So, female doctors tend to marry men who work at convenient stores?


People of both sexes tend to marry within their own socioeconomic bracket or educational backgrounds. I don't date anyone without at least a bachelor's degree because the union would be very likely to be an unequal partnership. What would I as an epidemiologist have to discuss with a construction worker? I tried dating a firefighter; I talked over his head and he constantly complained that I talk like I'm writing a book and said he felt inadequate in conversations with me. The unequal partnership made us both feel like shit.


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## Fern (Sep 2, 2012)

WillyT said:


> Or rich.


Or possessing lactating man-nipples!


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

WillyT said:


> So, female doctors tend to marry men who work at convenient stores?


You are going to need to define "resources" as you understand it to me or this debate is pointless. Do you mean income? Is that how you are coming up with these irrelevant scenarios? Do you see male doctors tending to marry women who work convenient stores? Poor use of reasoning with this example. 

It is really worth my time to have an intellectual conversation with you about this topic? Or are you simply baiting? Do you actually believe the words you are typing? The original topic is about race, you have cherry picked one thing someone said in a different post to address. I don't think it is worth engaging you if you are this scattered in thought.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

Fern said:


> Everything is creepy if you aren't handsome.


I've had some handsome dudes tell me some pretty creepy shit, like wanting to father five children on me, or wanting to put a bun in my oven. If you're a weirdo, you're a weirdo.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Your reasoning is so odd and just unsound. In this thread you've said: "Western society conditions females to despise masculinity & resent men due to their gender."
> 
> So, how about the part of society that conditions men like you to have biases/prejudices against Western women?


Western society is comprised of many different races including Caucasian & Asian, so I highly doubt that my issue with western society is rooted within racial discrimination. 
My alleged prejudice is likely a hypocritical reaction to the contempt & resentment that society perpetrates against my gender/race demographic. Maybe it's as simple as a defensive reaction "I resent society because society resents me", hence I turn my back upon a society that villainizes my demographic. I was so damn tired of seeing white men belittled on television that I just stopped watching it except for some sports coverage & a few exceptional shows. 





DaphneDelRey said:


> Do you not realise that Asian women aren't all the same also? Does it not cross your mind that just as you desire someone who is more "submissive" to your tastes, she'll probably only see you for your money or what you can do for her - rather than who you are as a person?
> 
> 
> > Firstly, my marriage isn't perfect, especially lately but I'm not in the market for a new wife.
> ...


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> It's not about what you find appealing, but about the reasoning the other posters have given for their preferences. They're really off the wall and absurd like "Asian women have better family values." It's clearly not true across the board and it sounds incredibly racist.


The reasoning that I offered was neither racist or sexist. My preference is for Asian society/culture which places high value upon family & especially children.

I didn't see any statistics regarding China or South Korea, but I'd expect their percentages ought to be similar to those of Japan.
*APRIL 4, 2011 **Why are there so few Japanese unmarried mothers?*

... All around the ‘advanced’ world, births outside marriage have grown astonishingly in the past forty years. But not in Japan. Here in Britain, 46% of all births are outside marriage. In America it is 41% and in France 54%. But in Japan? The figure barely scrapes above two per cent...
Why are there so few Japanese unmarried mothers? | The Welfare State We're In


http://hailtoyou.wordpress.com/2010/12/30/share-of-births-to-unmarried-mothers-by-race-1990-2010/
*A Post-Marriage World?*
A poll in November 2010 found that 4-in-10 Americans believe marriage to be “obsolete”. A few months before that, “40% of Births to Unmarried Mothers” was the headline. That was 2008 data. The statistics were released in 2010, and are broken down by race above.
Commentator Lawrence Auster notes that one almost never hears any criticism of this phenomenon anymore from “conservatives”. It _does_ seem highly anachronistic today, doesn’t it, to actually say or even write “the illegitimacy rate”, or — God forbid — “bastardy rate”.











There's a likelihood that my views are prejudicial due to generalizing & stereotyping because I lumped the majority of women from western society into a single bushel of undesirable apples.





DaphneDelRey said:


> It sounds like stuff you read on PUA forums.


Bahahahaha You've gotta be kidding me, now you're alluding that a preference towards women from outside your own culture is indicative of PUA. Geez I kinda interpreted PUA as being men/women that use others to satisfy their wants & have no regard for those individuals that they leave in their wake. Heck why not lump those of us you disagree with into the neckbeard category?

Fact: I'm attracted to women, my sexual preference is hetero. Therefore whether I'd chose to date women from within my own culture of from a far east culture, sexism isn't an issue unless you've an issue regarding men & women dating their opposite sex.


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## Fern (Sep 2, 2012)

koalaroo said:


> I've had some handsome dudes tell me some pretty creepy shit, like wanting to father five children on me, or wanting to put a bun in my oven. If you're a weirdo, you're a weirdo.


I was being sarcastic. I've met _*plenty *_of conventionally handsome creeps :/


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## Stasis (May 6, 2014)

Fern said:


> Or possessing lactating man-nipples!


My personal favorite.


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## Fern (Sep 2, 2012)

EDLC said:


> My personal favorite.


Isn't it everyone's?


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## perpetuallyreticent (Sep 24, 2014)

I wouldn't necessarily say it's 'creepy'. But that's not me undermining this, either. It's still problematic and gross. It's fine if a person finds themselves only attracted to a certain race of people- there's nothing wrong with that. But to box yourself into this stigma of 'I'll only date (for eg) chinese girls.' then yes, that's really weird. Because it doesn't usually stop at that. There's usually fetishizing that comes along with wanting to date one specific race. Stereotypes included, it doesn't seem healthy to me.

For example, a guy only wants to date Asian girls because of the stereotypes that they're submissive and quirky. Because they're supposedly quiet. No, just no. That's racially oppressive and racist, and it's very wrong. (This isn't to be confused with if a person of one ethnicity only wants to date within their ethnicity. I'm speaking of people of different ethnicities only wanting one specific race for clouded, ignorant reasons.)

I mean, I personally am attracted to men of Native American decent. I find they have very attractive features. But I don't fetishize them or their culture. I don't actively look for them. That's gross.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

Fern said:


> I was being sarcastic. I've met _*plenty *_of conventionally handsome creeps :/


Ah, that sans serif sarcasm font.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> I agree with you Daphne. I've seen multiple posts of his on the forum and they all point to this type of thinking. I'm 100 percent sure of it. Still, I don't think its fair for us to tell him that his self esteem issues makes him inferior somehow because we all suffer from lack of self esteem in different times during our lives. It's completely normal.


I'd say that you're mistaken, but let's see the comments that you're referring to sweetie. Post links to the comments.

You'd require a bigger hook to bait me, but here's the link to my comments going back to page 20, so let's see your examples of my inferiority complex.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> I hope that's not what is coming across in my posts, because I don't think that at all. What I do think is that he needs to stop whining and start making some changes in his life. Chiefly by not externalising the source of his pain and projecting it outward, but rather looking inward to see what needs fixing and then do that.
> 
> It's normal to have self-esteem issues, but what's not normal (or rather acceptable) is blaming everyone else for them. It only serves to alienate you even more and makes you more miserable in the long run.
> 
> ...


Nah that's not the theme of your comments, keep going you were on a roll there for a while.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> Nah that's not the theme of your comments, keep going you were on a roll there for a while.


If I keep going, I'll be given an infraction. No thanks.
You do whatever it is that makes you happy, but I will forever say that finding news segments online showcasing how "masculinity is being eroded" is propaganda. It's not true, and the media are making a hype out of nothing. If the medium is the message, how can you trust what they say?

The woman in the show is a broadcaster for the love of god, news spin is her life.

Think about it for a second, are the news trying to help you with this sort of thing? Or are they trying to sell you this message in order to erode your self-confidence as a man on purpose?

(They benefit with the latter, and not so much on the former.)


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

DaphneDelRey said:


> If I keep going, I'll be given an infraction. No thanks.
> You do whatever it is that makes you happy, but I will forever say that finding news segments online showcasing how "masculinity is being eroded" is propaganda. It's not true, and the media are making a hype out of nothing. If the medium is the message, how can you trust what they say?
> 
> The woman in the show is a broadcaster for the love of god, news spin is her life.
> ...


I've never complained to a moderator, they're busy enough without having to referee me or this thread. I'm not upset or angry & you'd likely benefit from more venting. I know you can give it better than that, so you can send it in a PM if you'd feel safer from receiving an infraction.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> I've never complained to a moderator, they're busy enough without having to referee me or this thread. I'm not upset or angry & you'd likely benefit from more venting. I know you can give it better than that, so you can send it in a PM if you'd feel safer from receiving an infraction.


Your personal problems are not something I care to vent about. Sorry.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> I'd say that you're mistaken, but let's see the comments that you're referring to sweetie. Post links to the comments.


I have absolutely no intentions of going back to find specific comments to give you for reference tootsie roll. You and I both know I'm not mistaken.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> I have absolutely no intentions of going back to find specific comments to give you for reference tootsie roll. You and I both know I'm not mistaken.


LOL I know the game, you would if you could sweetie.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> LOL I know the game, you would if you could sweetie.


Absolutely not, but it would be unnecessary and cruel for me to lay everything out on this thread. If you _really_ want to know my opinion on the matter then let me know and I'll pm you my thoughts.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> Absolutely not, but it would be unnecessary and cruel for me to lay everything out on this thread. If you _really_ want to know my opinion on the matter then let me know and I'll pm you my thoughts.


Sure thing, have at it, no worries regarding complaint.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

We've established that a number of women, do indeed, find this CREEPY. 

No matter what people do to defend this, bottom line is that those who don't put up with this garbage (as we are talking odds and number ROFL) will end up finding someone who appreciates them as an equal. 

I suppose someone's got to take the crap at the bottom of the barrel. Personally, I'd rather be single, but there are always those who are desperate to settle for a guy with yellow fever. :laughing:


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## Arcane (Oct 9, 2014)

Why would it be creepy? 

It's not creepy, he's just into that sorta girl. If he's moving there then that's cool. To each is own.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

stiletto said:


> We've established that a number of women, do indeed, find this CREEPY.
> 
> No matter what people do to defend this, bottom line is that those who don't put up with this garbage (as we are talking odds and number ROFL) will end up finding someone who appreciates them as an equal.
> 
> I suppose someone's got to take the crap at the bottom of the barrel. Personally, I'd rather be single, but there are always those who are desperate to settle for a guy with yellow fever. :laughing:


That's what's great about having a choice, guys will pursue who they choose to without requiring your approval & your preference not to compromise & remain single is your own business.
One thing which this thread made me aware of is that an increasing percentage of European guys are declining relationships & marriage with European women. 
Whoda thunk that there are areas of England & Wales referred to as "Man Deserts", where children have almost no contact with adult male role models until they begin their education. 






Oh well, so much for those early formative years eh. Apparently European guys are opting out from relationships with local women for some reason. I kinda doubt there's a movement towards celibacy since 46% of children in England are born into single (mother) parent households, so I wonder how many guys are dating & marrying women from outside of Europe.





Hey did I stumble upon a sore topic that's affecting some here? Sorry if you're one of those single mothers raising a child on her own.
Hey I gotta respect these guys values.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

Hmm I internet searched Do Asian Women Prefer Caucasian Men? I wonder if the haters would have the same disgust when the sexes are reversed & an Asian woman is pursuing a Caucasian male


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

^ You mean women can objectify and generalise people too?
:shocked:


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> That's what's great about having a choice, guys will pursue who they choose to without requiring your approval & your preference not to compromise & remain single is your own business.
> One thing which this thread made me aware of is that an increasing percentage of European guys are declining relationships & marriage with European women.
> Whoda thunk that there are areas of England & Wales referred to as "Man Deserts", where children have almost no contact with adult male role models until they begin their education.
> 
> ...


How dare you spout this nonsense on here. You should be ashamed of yourself for belittling what single mothers have to go through raising their children on their own. You're a grown man so act like one.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Lol this thread.... If there's one thing YouTube has taught me, it's that if you are trying so desperately hard to fluff up your ego and find people who agree with your nonsense, there will always a video to do that for you.

3 Youtube videos is all it takes to make something that's false, true? Well, I better start searching for UFO videos then! 
:kitteh:


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

I think it would be interesting if we sepeated the yes and no results between men and women.

Based on the post it seems white men tend to think its fine and minorities and women tend to find it creepy.

Its really easy to say something isn't creepy when you don't have to deal with it.


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

Kazoo said:


> I think it would be interesting if we separated the yes and no results between men and women.
> Based on the post it seems white men tend to think its fine and minorities and women tend to find it creepy.


That's not an entirely accurate assumption.
After looking around the net, it's apparent to me that men of all races (except if the same race as the desired women) are open to preferring eastern women. I'm kinda surprised at the widespread trend of men being adverse to a dating relationship & outright refusal to consider marriage or fathering children. 



Kazoo said:


> Its really easy to say something isn't creepy when you don't have to deal with it.


OP question "I was wondering what you guys thought about this: A guy likes one sort of girl, defined by xxxx xx xx where she's from."

Based upon a preference towards where a woman is from, I don't find it creepy at all.


"Its really easy to say something isn't creepy when you don't have to deal with it." 

The question doesn't effect me personally nor would it negatively effect me were I single & a woman were especially interested in me due to where I'm from. 

I personally don't think it's anybody's damn business regarding others interracial or cultural dating preferences & I wouldn't attempt to impose others morality upon an individuals personal preferences. However if they're seeking to open Pandora's box, then their prejudice restrictions should be equally applied to all demographics LOLOL!


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

I'm a white male, and I don't think it's creepy. For some people, physical preference is a deal breaker. I don't demonize women for making physical characteristics prerequisites for dating, and I don't demonize men for making physical characteristics prerequisites for dating. I judge people for thinking that race = culture. I denounce and reject that, and I see no evidence that the guy in the OP's example was doing that.

"As a White male, eating strawberry jam is creepy. What do you mean it isn't?! IT'S A GRAVE INJUSTICE!!! Easy for you to say when you don't have to deal with it! Damn Hispanic people are so arrogant." Argument 2 legit 4 me.

If this is the majority attitude I can definitely see the herbivore phenomenon spreading west. Men are allowed to sexually discriminate. Women don't get to be butthurt about it, sorry. You aren't all special princesses. We aren't obligated to be attracted to all women equally. 

I'll have yellow fever, brown fever, orange fever, turquoise fever, or whatever the fuck fever I choose. Feel free to play the victim and cry about it.


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## Kazoo The Kid (May 26, 2013)

stargazing grasshopper said:


> That's not an entirely accurate assumption.
> After looking around the net, it's apparent to me that men of all races (except if the same race as the desired women) are open to preferring eastern women. I'm kinda surprised at the widespread trend of men being adverse to a dating relationship & outright refusal to consider marriage or fathering children.
> 
> 
> ...



You are really invested in this thread. u okay


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## stargazing grasshopper (Oct 25, 2013)

Kazoo said:


> You are really invested in this thread. u okay


 Nah I was kinda surprised by the reply to my first comment, so I probed & listened to a bit of venting.
Now I'm just keeping the conversation rolling along, after all you wouldn't want this thread to whither away into obscurity would you? 

This video of mixed couples dating in Singapore is kinda interesting.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> How dare you spout this nonsense on here. You should be ashamed of yourself for belittling what single mothers have to go through raising their children on their own. You're a grown man so act like one.


How did that belittle what single mothers have to go through? At all?


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

DaphneDelRey said:


> 3 Youtube videos is all it takes to make something that's false, true? Well, I better start searching for UFO videos then!
> :kitteh:


Just curious.. what exactly is the "false" thing, that he's trying to say is "true" with those youtube videos?

Its not false that lots of children are growing up with single mothers, thats definitely true, and kind of troubling.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Sporadic Aura said:


> Just curious.. what exactly is the "false" thing, that he's trying to say is "true" with those youtube videos?
> 
> Its not false that lots of children are growing up with single mothers, thats definitely true, and kind of troubling.


That white women are demonising men and somehow making them leave. Even if some are, most white women a_re not._

I don't even know what his story is to be honest, it seems to change depending on how he's feeling in that moment in time.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> How did that belittle what single mothers have to go through? At all?


If you have to ask that question than theres no explaining I can do that will answer it for you. It was very clear.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> If you have to ask that question than theres no explaining I can do that will answer it for you. It was very clear.


Humor me, answer it.

If its so clear to you, then you should easily be able to clearly explain it to someone else. Stop with the 'its so obvious I don't have to explain myself' thing, it sets up a situation where you can dismiss people of a certain opinion without even having any debate at all. It leads to an attack on peoples character and not an actual discussion.


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## BrokenBricks (Oct 19, 2014)

Creepiest thing that ever happened to me was my old uncle Caesar stabbed me in the hand with a fork and tried to eat my fingers.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> Humor me, answer it.


This is the last time I will do so, because its clear to me no matter how neutral and fair you pretend to be that it is far from the truth.

He begins his spiel by stating that an increasing number of European men have begun declining relationships and marriage with European women. Implying, in other words, that there must be something wrong with the mentality of these European women, that their men are going elsewhere for relationships and marriage. 

He mentions the supposed "man deserts" in England where children presumably have no contact with adult male role models until they begin their education. He then goes on to say "so much for those formative years eh?" Implying that these children are being raised by single mothers with no proper male figure for them to develop fully and properly and continuing on in a vicious cycle (the blame still lies with women). Because _clearly_ these women don't value the men in their lives and are selfish beings that only value their own independence and well-being. Having forgotten their feminine roots and straying out into self-serving/man repelling territories that throw the balance of family off kilter, thus affecting future generations of society. 

He states that men are not taking part in a movement of celibacy seeing as 46% of children are born into single (mother) parent households and so he wonders how many are looking for relationships and marriage outside of Europe? Heavily implying that the answer is a lot, alongside a nice video of a woman explaining to us that western men are leaving women in the west for eastern women because the eastern women have retained their femininity and traditional values. 

He finishes it all off with a condescending "Hey did I stumble upon a sore topic that's affecting some here? Sorry if you're one of those single mothers raising a child on her own. Hey I gotta respect these guys values." Clearly he's not sorry at all and is trying to place the blame on these "single" mothers as they are bringing their single motherhood on themselves with their under appreciation of men and loss of femininity and traditional values. And you can't fault these oh so "good" men from sticking to their guns and refusing to get tied down into relationships with these ungrateful women. 

I especially liked that last video where one of these so called "good" men goes on to say "I want someone to be just like my mother because to me my mother is perfect. Like I don't see a flaw in my mother."…..:/ LOOOL. What? Is this supposed to be a satirical video or something….


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

@TheProphetLaLa



> This is the last time I will do so, because its clear to me no matter how neutral and fair you pretend to be that it is far from the truth.


How can someone pretend to be neutral? If you state an opinion, which I'm not shy in doing, then you're automatically not neutral.

Not sure how you could pretend to be fair either. Unless I guess you're implying that I word my posts in a way to look more 'balanced' but in reality you think I'm pushing some sort of agenda? You'll see what you want to see, you can paint someones words anyway you want to based on your perception of them.



> He begins his spiel by stating that an increasing number of European men have begun declining relationships and marriage with European women. Implying, in other words, that there must be something wrong with the mentality of these European women, that their men are going elsewhere for relationships and marriage.


To me it just implies a disconnect between western men and western women. The 'something wrong with the mentality' he was referring to was a lesser value on family, which to at least give him a little bit of credit he provided statistics to back it up. I don't know anything about this, so I won't make any type of assumption on whether asian societies and women value family more than western societies and women. Either way, I don't personally believe that its a reason to decline western woman. But my original question to you was how was he being belittling to single mothers. I fail to see how this is about single mothers.



> He mentions the supposed "man deserts" in England where children presumably have no contact with adult male role models until they begin their education. He then goes on to say "so much for those formative years eh?" Implying that these children are being raised by single mothers with no proper male figure for them to develop fully and properly and continuing on in a vicious cycle (the blame still lies with women). Because _clearly_ these women don't value the men in their lives and are selfish beings that only value their own independence and well-being. Having forgotten their feminine roots and straying out into self-serving/man repelling territories that throw the balance of family off kilter, thus affecting future generations of society.


This paragraph is making lots of assumptions about what he believes that he didn't actually say. I will ask you one thing though, do you not agree that its healthier to grow up with both parents than to grow up with only 1? There are plenty of single mothers who raise awesome, healthy kids, but as a whole its definitely better for society if the majority of children grow up with both parents. That was what my take on the 'so much for the formative years' meant. 



> Clearly he's not sorry at all and is trying to place the blame on these "single" mothers as they are bringing their single motherhood on themselves with their under appreciation of men and loss of femininity and traditional values. And you can't fault these oh so "good" men from sticking to their guns and refusing to get tied down into relationships with these ungrateful women. [/COLOR]


You're still putting your own interpretations onto his words. I saw his whole post as 'showing examples of why western men might be declining western women'. I don't really care about his points regarding western women and asian women, but I also don't think he was trying to attack single mothers. I think saying that is just a way to get a personal attack in on him. I think people have already painted him a certain way (sexist, racist, disrespectful), and will paint everything he says in that light because they already have their mind made up. I've seen this before on debate forums, and its just frustrating to see.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> @_TheProphetLaLa_
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm sorry but no. I don't agree with anything you're saying.


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## Turlowe (Aug 4, 2014)

I wouldn't call it creepy really, though I can't imagine why someone would choose to have such a narrow focus.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> I'm sorry but no. I don't agree with anything you're saying.


Well the first part of my post wasn't something to even agree or disagree with. I was asking you a genuine question. How can someone pretend to be neutral and fair but actually not be? I'm genuinely interested how you perceive me that way, it's funny to me, but also interesting.

I'm curious though, do you disagree with me that its healthier for society if the majority of children grow up with both their parents? I know its just my experience, but people I know who have grown up without a mom or dad in the picture seem a lot more prone to have problems or struggle with their identity.

I'm guessing the main thing you're disagreeing with is that Stargazers words are up for interpretation. In your mind Stargazer was definitely being intentionally disrespectful towards single mothers. What frustrates me though sometimes about debate forums is I see peoples words get misinterpreted and then they receive personal attacks or attacks on there character because of it. I think things would go more smoothly if people spent more time on understanding opposing viewpoints and less time going on the attack. Do you disagree with me on this too?


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> Well the first part of my post wasn't something to even agree or disagree with. I was asking you a genuine question. How can someone pretend to be neutral and fair but actually not be? I'm genuinely interested how you perceive me that way, it's funny to me, but also interesting.
> 
> I'm curious though, do you disagree with me that its healthier for society if the majority of children grow up with both their parents? I know its just my experience, but people I know who have grown up without a mom or dad in the picture seem a lot more prone to have problems or struggle with their identity.
> 
> I'm guessing the main thing you're disagreeing with is that Stargazers words are up for interpretation. In your mind Stargazer was definitely being intentionally disrespectful towards single mothers. What frustrates me though sometimes about debate forums is I see peoples words get misinterpreted and then they receive personal attacks or attacks on there character because of it. I think things would go more smoothly if people spent more time on understanding opposing viewpoints and less time going on the attack. Do you disagree with me on this too?


I perceive you to be that way, because thats the way you are. You're avoidant of conflict so you're not very explicit in your wording, making sure its all very politically correct, therefore making sure people have very few angles to confront you on. BUT you thank some of the most ridiculous and illogical posts that I've seen written, although you've never personally voiced your own thoughts in such a harsh manner. This shows me that you agree with the more extreme points of view but you yourself won't verbalize them. You're hiding your true feelings on a subject behind a veneer of fairness and neutrality, when in actuality your inclinations are very much set in stone and not likely to change. Thus its pointless to discuss with you.

Grasshoppers words are not up for interpretation, I've interpreted them the way he meant them to be interpreted. I'm sure that he felt insulted by stilleto's post when she insinuated that those that had asian fetishes were at the bottom of the barrel and so he retaliated with a veiled insult of his own. I'm 100% certain of this. Its seems pretty obvious to me, and the only way you can misinterpret his intentions are if you're willfully doing so, which you are.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> I perceive you to be that way, because thats the way you are. You're avoidant of conflict so you're not very explicit in your wording, making sure its all very politically correct, therefore making sure people have very few angles to confront you on. BUT you thank some of the most ridiculous and illogical posts that I've seen written, although you've never personally voiced your own thoughts in such a harsh manner. This shows me that you agree with the more extreme points of view but you yourself won't verbalize them. You're hiding your true feelings on a subject behind a veneer of fairness and neutrality, when in actuality your inclinations are very much set in stone and not likely to change. Thus its pointless to discuss with you.
> 
> Grasshoppers words are not up for interpretation, I've interpreted them the way he meant them to be interpreted. I'm sure that he felt insulted by stilleto's post when she insinuated that those that had asian fetishes were at the bottom of the barrel and so he retaliated with a veiled insult of his own. I'm 100% certain of this. Its seems pretty obvious to me, and the only way you can misinterpret his intentions are if you're willfully doing so, which you are.


I'm conflict avoidant? How many of my posts have you actually read? I end up in lots of silly conflicts on here, mostly because I'll debate and discuss just about anything.

But anyways, you're basing your opinion on who I actually am based on the posts I thank? Isn't the assuming quite a lot? Especially assuming the reason why I actually thank posts. I mean, I don't agree with you that I thank a bunch of illogical and crazy posts.. but I actually do like to thank posts that are different or go agains the norm. Especially if I found them interesting or if other people are ignoring it, I definitely do not agree with all the posts I thank. My 'thanks' a lot of the times is my way of saying 'hey, I found your point of view interesting even if others are ignoring it, thanks for putting yourself out there'. If a post already has a lot of thanks or attention I'm way less likely to thank it, even if I agree with it, because it seems a lot less meaningful.

As for grasshopper, your reasoning is circular. Read what you're saying. The only reasoning you can provide for your interpretation of his words being right is because they were your interpretation and they must be right. This isn't something that can be proven, at least you can admit that, right? I get frustrated when people make personal attacks on others based on their own perceptions that can't be proven.

Also, why would an attack on single mothers be an attack towards Stilleto? Is stilleto a single mother? Based on what I've seen she isn't, she said in another thread that she is currently with the same man she was with in high school.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> I'm conflict avoidant? How many of my posts have you actually read? I end up in lots of silly conflicts on here, mostly because I'll debate and discuss just about anything.
> 
> But anyways, you're basing your opinion on who I actually am based on the posts I thank? Isn't the assuming quite a lot? Especially assuming the reason why I actually thank posts. I mean, I don't agree with you that I thank a bunch of illogical and crazy posts.. but I actually do like to thank posts that are different or go agains the norm. Especially if I found them interesting or if other people are ignoring it, I definitely do not agree with all the posts I thank. My 'thanks' a lot of the times is my way of saying 'hey, I found your point of view interesting even if others are ignoring it, thanks for putting yourself out there'. If a post already has a lot of thanks or attention I'm way less likely to thank it, even if I agree with it, because it seems a lot less meaningful.
> 
> ...


I never said he was lashing out at Stilleto in particular, but her comment probably burned a bit. Also, these posts that you find "interesting" are all of one flavor. That speaks to me of preference. You can swirl and whirl around all you like Flora but when I say something I mean it. And I mean what I said. Whether or not you accept it as truth is up to you to decide. I'm certainly not forcing anything on you and you're the one who asked me to expand on what I meant twice. That was my explanation so take what you will out of it.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> I never said he was lashing out at Stilleto in particular, but her comment probably burned a bit. Also, these posts that you find "interesting" are all of one flavor. That speaks to me of preference. You can swirl and whirl around all you like Flora but when I say something I mean it. And I mean what I said. Whether or not you accept it as truth is up to you to decide. I'm certainly not forcing anything on you and you're the one who asked me to expand on what I meant twice. That was my explanation so take what you will out of it.


I'm glad you're still calling me Flora, its a very flattering nickname, you know. I thought that it died somewhere into a distant memory, but I'm glad to see its still alive and kicking. You're probably thinking I'm joking about this, but no, I laughed hard when I first heard you call me that and it still makes me smile a little bit.

I actually don't really want to bring up the type of preference you think I have..because I hate how lots of threads find there way back to this, but just so we're being clear.. You think I have an anti-feminist preference, right? I mean, to me this thread isn't even remotely about feminism, but thats besides the point.. I can assure you I don't, but I don't really see a way of convincing you of that, if you already have that opinion of me its probably not going to change.

Btw, I did ask you to expand on your opinion on me, and I'm glad you did. I knew you were going to be harsh. You are usually harsh. I almost brought that up in my last post actually.. if I knew you were going to be harsh and I wanted to avoid conflict why would I have even asked you to expand on your opinion of me? I also assure you I'm not conflict avoidant or try to 'swirl and whirl' my words to seem like something they aren't. But again, I can't really convince you of that. I guess we should probably stop spamming this thread now? I'm just disappointed that I can't come up with an apt nickname for you to rival your nickname for me.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> I'm glad you're still calling me Flora, its a very flattering nickname, you know. I thought that it died somewhere into a distant memory, but I'm glad to see its still alive and kicking. You're probably thinking I'm joking about this, but no, I laughed hard when I first heard you call me that and it still makes me smile a little bit.
> 
> I actually don't really want to bring up the type of preference you think I have..because I hate how lots of threads find there way back to this, but just so we're being clear.. You think I have an anti-feminist preference, right? I mean, to me this thread isn't even remotely about feminism, but thats besides the point.. I can assure you I don't, but I don't really see a way of convincing you of that, if you already have that opinion of me its probably not going to change.
> 
> Btw, I did ask you to expand on your opinion on me, and I'm glad you did. I knew you were going to be harsh. You are usually harsh. I almost brought that up in my last post actually.. if I knew you were going to be harsh and I wanted to avoid conflict why would I have even asked you to expand on your opinion of me? I also assure you I'm not conflict avoidant or try to 'swirl and whirl' my words to seem like something they aren't. But again, I can't really convince you of that. I guess we should probably stop spamming this thread now? I'm just disappointed that I can't come up with an apt nickname for you to rival your nickname for me.


No no no, my friend, this is simply not true. I don't believe you're "anti-feminism". I believe, as I said, that you have your preferences and that you don't voice those entirely in a clear and straightforward way, preferring to take the roundabout route. Being anti-feminist is a very strong word and I wouldn't use it on you, I would use that word on someone like our dear trooper Chevy, bless his persistent soul.

Let me give you an example. Lets say that there is a user who is a monotheist religious believer. She may believe that abortion is wrong and this stems directly from her religious beliefs. So basically, this is the primary source of her stance on abortion. Now, she won't state this on the debate thread on abortion. Instead she'll find many convincing statistics and definitions that support her point of view. She may also point out flaws or inconsistencies in the other sides arguments, seeming like the most logical one in the discussion. She will state that she is pro-life because of the valid research and arguments she has presented. BUT this is false, pure fiction. Because truthfully, she believes abortion is wrong not because of these statistics but because of her religious beliefs. And so no matter how you bring down her arguments, she will never falter in her beliefs because those arguments are not the base of her beliefs in the first place. Do you understand what I'm saying?


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> No no no, my friend, this is simply not true. I don't believe you're "anti-feminism". I believe, as I said, that you have your preferences and that you don't voice those entirely in a clear and straightforward way, preferring to take the roundabout route. Being anti-feminist is a very strong word and I wouldn't use it on you, I would use that word on someone like our dear trooper Chevy, bless his persistent soul.
> 
> Let me give you an example. Lets say that there is a user who is a monotheist religious believer. She may believe that abortion is wrong and this stems directly from her religious beliefs. So basically, this is the primary source of her stance on abortion. Now, she won't state this on the debate thread on abortion. Instead she'll find many convincing statistics and definitions that support her point of view. She may also point out flaws or inconsistencies in the other sides arguments, seeming like the most logical one in the discussion. She will state that she is pro-life because of the valid research and arguments she has presented. BUT this is false, pure fiction. Because truthfully, she believes abortion is wrong not because of these statistics but because of her religious beliefs. And so no matter how you bring down her arguments, she will never falter in her beliefs because those arguments are not the base of her beliefs in the first place.*Do you understand what I'm saying?*


I do now that you added that example.

You're basically saying that I form my opinions or my preferences based on emotional reasoning but I'm just good at pretending to be logical, even though I will never be swayed from my preferences or beliefs if someone else presents equally logical arguments from the other side?


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Sporadic Aura said:


> I do now that you added that example.
> 
> You're basically saying that I form my opinions or my preferences based on emotional reasoning but I'm just good at pretending to be logical, even though I will never be swayed from my preferences or beliefs if someone else presents equally logical arguments from the other side?


Aaa still with the twisty turny ehh?? I don't believe you're good at pretending to be logical, you _are_ logical. Also, don't feel like such a special snowflake because we ALL base our preferences and beliefs on emotional reasoning. Emotion and logic go hand in hand, one doesn't exist independent of the other. But some of us, especially thinkers, are not as adept at realizing the emotional reasoning that influences our preferences and beliefs. It's not necessarily bad a thing, just something we're not as good at.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Stampede said:


> I'm a white male, and I don't think it's creepy. For some people, physical preference is a deal breaker. I don't demonize women for making physical characteristics prerequisites for dating, and I don't demonize men for making physical characteristics prerequisites for dating. I judge people for thinking that race = culture. I denounce and reject that, and I see no evidence that the guy in the OP's example was doing that.
> 
> "As a White male, eating strawberry jam is creepy. What do you mean it isn't?! IT'S A GRAVE INJUSTICE!!! Easy for you to say when you don't have to deal with it! Damn Hispanic people are so arrogant." Argument 2 legit 4 me.
> 
> ...


No one could give a flying fuck what your personal preferences are, so beating your chest like some sex-crazed Tarzan just to try and prove you have balls of steel isn't working out for you boo.

But if your personal preferences involve objectifying individuals and then making assumptions about individuals based on stereotypes, yeah people will have a problem with that. It's almost like if you really want to have creepy tendencies people should keep their mouths shut and their opinions to themselves.

Saying things as ignorant as "Asian women have better values" is so stupid I feel I lost 10 IQ points just by reading it. _This _is why I am truly the victim in this situation - I'm having to suffer wilful ignorance at the hands of insecure people. What he really means is "I don't think I'm good enough for Western women because they're too demanding of me and that hurts my male pride. Better settle elsewhere where women are easier because I don't know what else to do."

Slice and dice it however you want, quote whatever moronic "data" you can find, but the FACT will always remain: most people of any race will prefer people of their _own _race. So if you have a preference for a race that isn't yours, while it's not necessarily sexist or racist, what _is _sexist or racist is rationalising it with dumb stereotypes and ignorant assumptions quoted from people in CNN interviews (the pinnacle of intellectual reporting and honest news), or whatever link you had to trawl through Google to find because confirmation bias is a bitch.

^ 

That's what desperate people do.
And if his interest in Asian women _genuinely originated from _an interest in their culture, then why does he feel the need to qualify his preference with "it's because Western women are shit (basically)"?

Does that sound like a genuine preference to you, or someone who is just bitter and insecure?

Truth be told I have dated more white women than I have black, but in dating white women I never *once *felt the need to let white women know I only have a preference for them because I hate black people because they're "conditioned" for whatever. All I have said is "it's just different and exciting" and _that _was it. No other qualifier needed, no other justification needed. Why? Because I'm not looking to other races to buffer my fragile ego since I feel rejected by my own race. No boo, I choose what I want because I want it, not because I felt the need to settle for it.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

DaphneDelRey said:


> No one could give a flying fuck what your personal preferences are, so beating your chest like some sex-crazed Tarzan just to try and prove you have balls of steel isn't working out for you boo.


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## Loaf (Mar 27, 2014)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Saying things as ignorant as "Asian women have better values" is so stupid I feel I lost 10 IQ points just by reading it.


Fuck me I can't stop laughing.
.....

*get a grip*


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

There is clear distinction in this thread about who is okay with Yellow Fever and who is not. HAHAH


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

stiletto said:


> There is clear distinction in this thread about who is okay with Yellow Fever and who is not. HAHAH


And the ones who are OK with it will still keep rationalizing their racism.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

stiletto said:


> There is clear distinction in this thread about who is okay with Yellow Fever and who is not. HAHAH





koalaroo said:


> And the ones who are OK with it will still keep rationalizing their racism.


Its possible to be OK with things you don't agree with. I don't believe in policing other peoples dating lives or preferences. 

If a guy has yellow fever and his reasons for liking asian girls are soaked in prejudice its going to be massively transparent anyways. The women he is pursuing will probably figure out quickly, and likely leave him anyways. Its their dating life not mine, if they want to go about it in a seemingly very flawed way then I'm really not going to get up in arms over it.

Anyways, the only person in this thread who might possible have yellow fever is Stargazer. And he is already married to a white woman and just talking about hypotheticals that might never happen.

So I can probably say I'm OK with yellow fever even though I don't agree with it and definitely don't have it myself, and I can say that I'm definitely not rationalizing any racist beliefs. I don't even really like submissive women and certainly don't care at all about family values, I don't even have an opinion on western culture vs asian culture as I don't know enough about asian culture to have an informed opinion.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

DaphneDelRey said:


> No one could give a flying fuck what your personal preferences are, so beating your chest like some sex-crazed Tarzan just to try and prove you have balls of steel isn't working out for you boo.
> 
> But if your personal preferences involve objectifying individuals and then making assumptions about individuals based on stereotypes, yeah people will have a problem with that. It's almost like if you really want to have creepy tendencies people should keep their mouths shut and their opinions to themselves.
> 
> ...


You obviously do give a fuck, because you're demonizing me for them.

I don't have a preference for objectifying people or making assumptions about them based on stereotypes.

I didn't say any of those things.

The dude in the OP's example didn't say any of those things.

I didn't quote CNN or any other source.

I've never felt the need to let women know that either.

Your pop psychology about ego is foolish.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Stampede said:


> You obviously do give a fuck, because you're demonizing me for them.


Yeah see, you've written all those words, and all I see is "victim-complex"



> I don't have a preference for objectifying people or making assumptions about them based on stereotypes.
> 
> I didn't say any of those things.
> 
> ...


You're the one with the ego, because I wasn't even talking about you in the post :wink:


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Yeah see, you've written all those words, and all I see is "victim-complex"
> 
> 
> You're the one with the ego, because I wasn't even talking about you in the post :wink:


K. Some people will look at 2 + 2 and see 7, that doesn't mean anything.

Irrelevant. How does that make me have an "ego"?

Also, if you weren't talking about me in the post, you shouldn't have quoted me and only me.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Stampede said:


> K. Some people will look at 2 + 2 and see 7, that doesn't mean anything.
> 
> Irrelevant. How does that make me have an "ego"?


Request denied: I'm bored now, sorry.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

DaphneDelRey said:


> Request denied: I'm bored now, sorry.


I accept the concession of defeat.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Stampede said:


> I accept the concession of defeat.


LOL, okay, sure, whatever.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Stampede said:


> I accept the concession of defeat.


Sorry dude, but if we're talking about losing or winning…then you lost big. Maybe next time. ^-^


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> Sorry dude, but if we're talking about losing or winning…then you lost big. Maybe next time. ^-^


My points were not rebutted.

Unsurprising that a participant in this thread's feminist circle-jerk would post something condescending.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Stampede said:


> My points were not rebutted.
> 
> Unsurprising that a participant in this thread's feminist circle-jerk would post something condescending.


Maybe so, but I at the very least am only being condescending to one individual, and not an entire demographic of people.


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## Gentleman (Jun 14, 2014)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> Maybe so, but I at the very least am only being condescending to one individual, and not an entire demographic of people.


Who's doing that? Certainly not I.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Stampede said:


> Who's doing that? Certainly not I.


:ninja:


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

DaphneDelRey said:


> No one could give a flying fuck what your personal preferences are, so beating your chest like some sex-crazed Tarzan just to try and prove you have balls of steel isn't working out for you boo.





DaphneDelRey said:


> Yeah see, you've written all those words, and all I see is "victim-complex"


Wait, is this demonizing him or not? It at least seems pretty borderline to me, especially considering you misinterpreted his words just get this in on him.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> Maybe so, but I at the very least am only being condescending to one individual, and not an entire demographic of people.


Where did stampede do this?

dajkgagds. This thread is making me kind of dislike people who I think are probably pretty cool (outside this thread). I probably should just leave this thread for good.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Sporadic Aura said:


> Wait, is this demonizing him or not? It at least seems pretty borderline to me, especially considering you misinterpreted his words just get this in on him.


No I wasn't demonising him, it was sarcasm. I'm not sure why you didn't get it while others do. In order to demonise him, I'd have to be very invested in his preferences, which I'm not, and have no reason to be.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

DaphneDelRey said:


> No I wasn't demonising him, it was sarcasm. I'm not sure why you didn't get it while others do.


I understood it was sarcasm, harsh sarcasm. Sarcasm usually has a purpose behind it, in that instance the sarcasm was used to attack him.


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