# Si and Dimensionality



## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

What is the distinct difference between 1D Si and 4D Si? How do Ne ego types use it compared to Si ego types?

I would look up descriptions but they are sometimes too abstract, making it difficult to associate with what an actual person does in reality. I can't grasp the meaning of it. It would be easier to understand they had examples. 

Also, how does Si contrast in the Alpha and Delta Quadra?


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## Mr Oops (Jun 29, 2016)

Well, I can not generate aesthetically detailed art at all everything seems to be abstracted into specific shapes like in math.
I can appreciate it.

I wasn't horrible at woodwork in school. It was basically about specific shapes though. Helps to develop structural thinking about objects. So I could probably build lots of things but I'd be lost at decoration.


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

Mr Oops said:


> Well, I can not generate aesthetically detailed art at all everything seems to be abstracted into specific shapes like in math.
> I can appreciate it.
> 
> I wasn't horrible at woodwork in school. It was basically about specific shapes though. Helps to develop structural thinking about objects. So I could probably build lots of things but I'd be lost at decoration.


Hmm, I was like this in art subjects too. I could produce highly detailed drawings but focused on realistic sensory details was draining, like it took too much mental effort, and therefore gravitated towards a more abstract creativity with my art work that didn't resemble any object in reality at all. But it was detailed nevertheless.

However, I am wondering about the use of Si with comfort and sensations as well as how artsy it might be. For example, Si is often discussed when creating comfort in the environment. Everyone does this, and I don't understand how it changes with intuitive types with weaker Si.


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## owlet (May 7, 2010)

@*Wisteria* I found this page was pretty helpful for function dimensionality.



> *Experience* (_Ex_) = the ability to recognize patterns and make generalizations based on personal experience. This is the first qualitative parameter of information processing of a function. This parameter is present in all functions - all functions are able to gather and use life experience of a person. This is the individual experience of perception of information on some aspect.
> 
> *Norms* (_Nr_) = the ability to recognize and apply standard practices from one's surroundings. This is the second qualitative parameter of information processing of a function. Use of norms is attributable to all functions except for painful and suggestive. This is information concerning the assessment of the aspect by others, i.e. an instrument for evaluating it in terms of "as is customary", "as it should be".
> 
> ...


So 4D Si will cover all of these angles, while 1D will only be based in experience.


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## Mr Oops (Jun 29, 2016)

So how does one experience 4D Si.

Studying and making hypothesis about history of war is not itself 4D Se? 

Te understanding how things work and how to make work through time (something I know a lot about).
Ne understanding how things can be interpreted in new ways all the time. (something I do constantly)


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## Sylas (Jul 23, 2016)

What I've noticed with ILEs is that they expect a kind of continuity in their physical environment, without sudden interruptions or rapid changes, and may be conservative in their tastes and what they'd like to experience. For example, there was a story of an ILE girl who preferred to always sit on the same spot when she was having lunch at school. One day that spot was taken and she got really upset over it and didn't eat her lunch. Since 1D functions are all unconscious, the person doesn't always realize what's the source of the annoyance, and what's gotten into them that they got so worked up or upset over it. ILEs may prefer to order the same thing at a restaurant (ILE - suggestive Si).

The 1D functions are also exhausting to use to solve any complicated situations or problems. Since they focus on the present experience at hand, the information from them doesn't imprint in memory and doesn't integrate past experiences or norms. So you have to come up with a solution from scratch every time and basically from empty space. Their focus is very narrow, thus types with 1D sensing struggle to create any comprehensive and wholesome compositions where you have to put many sensory things together - for 4D sensing types this happens so naturally they don't even have to think about it.

This is about how 4D Se views 1D Se polr but the same can be extended to every 1D function - the information doesn't come together into this large cohesive whole and instead the person gets too fussed about minor details.



> (SEE) When my EII was visiting me and making this dish he was obsessing about how to cut the onions. It was a good dish. Then when I asked for the recipe his process was convoluted. It had attention to detail, and care, but it was just like the whole thing didn't come together into a coherent act or decision. He had problems giving me a concise explanation. ... In my experience EIIs will get really picky and neurotic about small details but when you ask them how these details come together to accomplish the goal or get short with them about their decision making process you are basically hitting their Se polr.
> 
> (SEI) The other week I was cooking with a friend. I went into autopilot. While I was cutting carrots I knew that the pork was already cooking in the pot and I went to stir at the right time. Then I washed the board while checking up on carrots. It was like he wasn't even there, I had to find things for him to do. He wanted to make spiced rice with raisins and asked whether to put in the raisins during or after. I've never made anything with raisins but I knew if they were put in during they would be plump and more of the flavor would seep into the rice, whereas if you put it in after they are not integrated but drier, and while both work I just said "during." He asked me whether to put in the rice right away or later, and I knew that putting it in right away would be fine since the rice cooker would keep it warm, but it might become drier, so I made the decision "in thirty min". All of this was 5-second decisions. See how boring that all was? Si.


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## Lastrevio (Mar 4, 2017)

"Also, how does Si contrast in the Alpha and Delta Quadra?"

Alpha types have Si+ while Delta types have Si-


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

Lastrevio said:


> "Also, how does Si contrast in the Alpha and Delta Quadra?"
> 
> Alpha types have Si+ while Delta types have Si-


I read about the - and + signs a while ago, then avoided it because I thought it was way too complicated. I was thinking more along the lines of Te blocked with Fi vs Ti blocked with Fe and how that affects Si.

Is Si+ positive sensations and Si- more focused on the negative experiences of sensations? Idk


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## Sylas (Jul 23, 2016)

Lastrevio said:


> "Also, how does Si contrast in the Alpha and Delta Quadra?"
> 
> Alpha types have Si+ while Delta types have Si-


Well it's more complicated than that. Signs are still a debated topic. Some say that +/- signs alternate between duals, making dual types be kind of like magnets where opposite poles attract. This means that only half the Alpha quadrant has +Si: SEI and ESE; their duals LII and ILE actually have -Si. This is the way System School of Socionics attributes signs (reference).

+Si is kind of like spotting advantageous positions then reaping and accumulating their benefits, while -Si is about having the negative states catch your attention whereby you can avoid them, prevent them, or work to improve them for the better. So LII for example has -Ti thus LII spots lack of knowledge (ie negative Ti state), the so called "idiocy", and then strives to educate himself and people around him to prevent everyone from living life in a stupid way.


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## Raiza1990 (Mar 30, 2017)

Sylas said:


> Well it's more complicated than that. Signs are still a debated topic. Some say that +/- signs alternate between duals, making dual types be kind of like magnets where opposite poles attract. This means that only half the Alpha quadrant has +Si: SEI and ESE; their duals LII and ILE actually have -Si. This is the way System School of Socionics attributes signs (reference).
> 
> +Si is kind of like spotting advantageous positions then reaping and accumulating their benefits, while -Si is about having the negative states catch your attention whereby you can avoid them, prevent them, or work to improve them for the better. So LII for example has -Ti thus LII spots lack of knowledge (ie negative Ti state), the so called "idiocy", and then strives to educate himself and people around him to prevent everyone from living life in a stupid way.


Could one say that types with + Si in their ego, in their interactions with duals would try to provide positive sensory stimuli to their dual and types with -Si would try to help their dual avoid unconfortable situations?

another question about the +/- thing: if dual types have opposite signs, wouldn´t that make the relationship insatisfactory? i mean the + person would want the positive information and the - person would just be there avoiding the negatives...


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## Wisteria (Apr 2, 2015)

> Situation (St) = the ability to recognize and respond to the subtleties of specific situations. This is the third qualitative parameter of information processing of a function, that is an attribute only of strong functions. This is the ability to develop new solutions within the parameters of a particular situation, i.e. *taking into account situation specific properties and circumstances.*


This reminds me of how I think I use Ne.

I struggle to make decisions because I see so much variance in my options and opinions. There is more than a yes and no answer. Something is not only "good" or "bad". Therefore I am very hesitant about answering questions and trying to give my opinion on something. I can't see things simply, and end up thinking it depends on the situation or the persons you ask. 

For example, If I were an employer looking for new employees, I wouldn't simply choose the best candidate, I would choose based on what the situation is with the current staff. What skills do they execute the best and what areas need improvement? Therefore I would make my choice based on what skills the staff are lacking, not necessarily the person who offers the best performance overall. 

^Is that 3D Ne?

About 1D being based on experience only - I read that Ne base types will try to recreate comfortable environments. That explains why!

2D is experience+norms, so 2D types Si would be relying on previous experiences that brought comfort/pleasure and also following norms like, I don't know, changing your clothing immediately when a new season starts, even if the climate hasn't changed a proportionate amount? Hopefully that makes sense. Only example of what an Si "norm" might be. I can relate to feeling tense and uptight and not knowing how to relieve myself of the pressure (which descriptions often state about weak Si), and probably secretly relying on other people. I like people who have a calm aura about them, because it's sort of contagious and makes me feel relaxed too although I am unaware of what exactly is doing it. However, when I feel under pressure or am experiencing an unpleasant sensation I always know what the source is.


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## DOGSOUP (Jan 29, 2016)

Is this 4D Si?



Thomas Metzinger: The Ego Tunnel said:


> Owning” your body, its sensations, and its various parts is fundamental to the feeling of being someone.
> 
> Your body image is surprisingly flexible. Expert skiers, for example, can extend their consciously experienced body image to the tips of their skis.
> 
> ...


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