# How YOU perceive your physicality



## Wellsy (Oct 24, 2011)

How has your self perception of your attractiveness changed over time?
This would likely hold a greater range the older one is to have been in a period of romantic attractiveness and life changes, but curious to transitions and the implications, small and large.

Like if you were someone in high school who had really bad acne, wore braces but come adulthood your face has cleared up, got a 10/10 smile. Your self concept likely hasn't changed significantly unless there has been immense change in how you're not treated on the basis of the looks perhaps which cause you to reevaluate.
Maybe you developed early and so you got a lot of attention and this caused you to feel comfortable in your looks or maybe cover up more, trying to downplay them.

Also wondering how this is into older age to, how has your relationship with your body changed and how you perceive others? Like your body isn't how it was when you were 20 though you may still be taking good care of yourself, how do you relate to how you look now to the past? 
It's insignificant? You think you look pretty smashing still? You idealize some aspects in the past with a feeling of nostalgia but comfortable with how you are? Perhaps there isn't an acceptance of how you look and want to change things.


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

I think I'm pretty hot. I've always thought I was pretty hot. Most people agree. I don't judge others by their appearance because I was raised by hippies, who taught me to love the human body in all its forms. It's great; you should try it.


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## Playful Proxy (Feb 6, 2012)

I...look like a frizzy haired hobo. How's that?


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## Slagasauras (Jun 26, 2013)

A pear. With dagger cheekbones.
But a thin pear with a well defined back.
With long flowing blonde hair and a prince on a castle and In going to write fan fiction good bye


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

I consider myself someone who has been in many fazes with that. 

I was a pretty little girl I think I am far enough removed from being five to constructively say I was a cute little girl. 

My preteen years were very uncomfortable it was mainly because I was very dark haired tho from being Italian and my mother would not let me get rid of my unibrow or mustache so I was teased for it. And I dressed and acted aggressive much more like a boy at the time so I did not view myself as pretty or desired in general not like no one liked me. 

Anyways funny how easy wax or nair, and tweezing can cure those sort of insecurities. As soon as my unibrow and mustache was gone I was highly sought after. But I am glad I did have my highly awkward fugly stage because for one I appreciated the attention differently then someone who is just accustomed to always being 'pretty' and I believe I was always more laid back and modest when I did go from ugly duckling more towards swan. 

Anyways I would say tho that the value and substance in what interactions I attracted became different. I was valued much more for being the person I am when I was seen as a homely plain jane, and the boys that liked me liked me because of my personality, after I transitioned I was much more sought after just for sexual gratification and physical attraction. 

I am literally someone that can by one day look unnoticeable if I have a ball cap and baggy sweat pants and another day easily be stunning and highly noticed just by simple changes from male clothes and a ball cap, to not much at all fitted jeans/fitted shirt, mascara and hair that was groomed more then in a pony tail. Its funny how a few minor changes dramatically change sex appeal while not having done much really that different.

Theres a certain level of a basis one probably has to have as far as proportions and a palette. But if I want to put the effort in and transform myself from virtually any look I am able to, production and aesthetics are basically my specialty. So yeah theres gotta be some sort of a foundation. I look okay rolling outta bed, but that said I think a lot standardized attraction is just about knowing techniques in grooming. 

Honestly I think I know what I am capable of and it basically makes me most days not really give a crap. Thus day to day looking casual and not trying that hard with lots of application and grooming. 

Anyways I don't think I am the most attractive person or a 10, I just know my strengths which is an ability to articulate, my strong presence, my versatility in talent, and generally being down to earth and not taking myself that fucking serious, and my ability to go from PJs to a cocktail dress work for me just fine. 

I think nothing has changed with age outside obviously aging, my attractiveness physically is still the same for my age group if anything maybe better as I maintained somethings while aging. I don't pretend to compete with other age groups either direction thats silly. I do think tho that I am not impressed with people that are only impressed with my appearance "your pretty" coming from a 40 year old is lame, I need to have conversing and substance, not hear I am pretty, I mean in our age group I assume naturally someone is physically attracted to me if they are pursuing me, so that does not seem like something one should say, yet some peope are idiots and that's all they care about even when they age.


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## herinb (Aug 24, 2013)

What's your story, Mr. @Wellsy?


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## Wellsy (Oct 24, 2011)

herinb said:


> What's your story, Mr. @_Wellsy_?


I don't feel like I've had to think to much about my appearance too much, I don't think i've been all that appealing in part because of how slack I am in my presentation of self.
Though I did have some interesting experiences in which when I wore tighter fitting clothing that people sometimes made comment. This to me revealed an aspect I had not thought much about before of exaggerating one's figure through one's clothes though I still ultimately dress for comfort more so than anything else.
I think in the past the only concern I really had to my looks was less about muscles or being lean but more my smile, but i've mostly gotten over that and think people are fine with my slightly crooked grin.

It has been rather interesting later in life to have seen compliments from people that i'm handsome and the sort, I appreciate the compliments but still feels a bit at odds with my self concept. Not that I think myself unattractive but it's always felt somewhat neutral and when it wasn't, it was based on the whims of my mood.
Somedays feel like I look good, other days think I look bit crap but overall I think I, as with most people, look average and can improve our looks largely by presenting ourselves in a tidy manner. Kind of hoping at some point I'll take more of an interest in fashion as I take up shopping for clothes more later in life, sounds like im kind of hoping to wake up one day and care XD But think it's been a transition, I care a bit about my appearence but haven't really invested in understanding it.


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## Somniorum (Oct 7, 2010)

I don't recall how I viewed myself, when rather younger... say, a teen or pre-teen. I remember getting a bit upset as I got older and the weight on the scale showed heavier and heavier. : / 

My 20s, somewhat self-conscious as that weight caught up with me, though again I don't remember having *very* strong feelings about how I looked. I was fairly disappointed, however, especially as I realised skin blemishes were *not* just going to completely go away with the passing of teenagerhood. 

Somewhere in my late 20's I lost a fair bit of weight, generally got in better shape (partly on purpose, partly by accident). Got a handle on the blemishes fairly well. Diversified my fashion a bit. I've become *much* more concerned with how I look. Although I'm older - and surely look older - I'm probably more attractive than I've been for most of my life. Which is a bit disappointing to me, as I feel like I've kinda just gotten to being... more or less competent in these matters when I'm going to really start to see a downhill slide : / I nitpick a lot about myself, and get disappointed that I'm *still* not quite where I want to be, weight-wise (not that I'm doing so badly, mind). 

Hasn't really translated into much more positive attention paid to me, *but* I prefer to be in decent shape and have nice clothes and whatnot, as opposed to how things were previously.


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## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

I'm not ugly enough to be considered ugly but not beautiful enough to be considered beautiful.


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## Leviticus Cornwall (Mar 27, 2014)

Well, got out of my fat stage and lost my braces, lots and lots of opportunities came to me then. So I brought myself from like a 4 to a 6. And been an uphill battle since then. I was never called hot or anything until recently, but it is becoming a more common thing. 

Depending on the persons taste Id say I can easily pull an 8.5 to 9.5. While for some people Id still be a 5 haha. Works for me though. Been working out too, so compelte my the package with abs is all I need.


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## Metalize (Dec 18, 2014)

Up until high school, I honestly didn't think about it much, and tried not to because it was an annoying subject. I just wasn't interested yet in dating, others' appearances, or my own, and didn't really see my own body/face as a representation of my personal identity. Just a visible marker that was arbitrarily assigned to me and made me possible to distinguish.

High school ish, I started caring more for some reason; as if there was a sudden integration my external and internal worlds, or maybe I started caring more about what others thought. At least, I tried to wear well-fitting clothes instead of the loose, bland stuff I used to, and try out some different hairstyles. It was alright, didn't appreciate the attention.

Nowadays, I'm back to middle school mentality, lol, with the exception of having gained a better understanding for how our appearances affect the manner in which we are perceived. It's amazing how otherwise amazing individuals who were unfortunate enough to grow up with some "deficiency" (like weight problems, or bad acne) have been consistently getting shit their whole lives from complete strangers (and even acquaintances). Likewise, I use others' appearances to gauge how they want to present themselves to the world - who tries to be perpetually "stylish", who wants to look "tough", and whatever other effects their wardrobe choices are intended to have.

I do my best not to judge people on their innate physical appearances; I know it's not physically possible to be 100% unbiased, but I think I've always been relatively good about that.


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## Vaka (Feb 26, 2010)

I would say I'm ugly or below average tbh. Objectively I know I'm not ugly most of the time, but I do feel that way


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## bigstupidgrin (Sep 26, 2014)

While I was growing up, I tried to justify social anxiety by considering myself unattractive. 

Now? Two words: stud, muffin.


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## Pride49 (Nov 7, 2011)

hmm in high school etc I didn't care. I was too fantasized in my illusions and imagination I couls create anything what I looked like and everything in the real world didn't matter....but now...imagination isn't enough so I am not obsessed with my appearance...many things I want to change...the fact that certain guys are attracted to certain body types...so naturally very confused about that....so I'm going for the skinny smooth faced justin beiber ish look...though my hairstyle? no clue...


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## LostFavor (Aug 18, 2011)

I feel like I have a pretty killer face when combined with the right hairstyle and facial hair (or lack thereof) combo. Not really happy with the fact that I'm somewhat overweight as opposed to when I was lean and in shape when I was in my puberty/lower teens kind of age (did a lot more outdoor activity back then). 

But I don't have any particular problems with my natural body shape. It's difficult to pull off the straight-edge military stance with my shoulders because my spine is a tad weirdly slanted/positioned. But I don't know that I see that as a body image issue - it's annoying sometimes that I can't easily pull off that look, if only because I'm pursuing acting and as an actor I want a pliable body. 

I get a little insecure when I don't invest time into grooming, but that's about it. And it probably stems from the fact that most of the people in my family are pretty anal about grooming themselves. As are most of my friends/acquaintances. So I sometimes feel like the guy who can't get his grooming shit together.


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## SoulScream (Sep 17, 2012)

Same ugleh mofo.


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## Glory (Sep 28, 2013)

I think I look like a dork no matter what I do. But my mind is always elsewhere so I'm not bothered.


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## Thalassa (Jun 10, 2010)

I'm very sexy. I know I am, people have told me my entire life and I know it about myself. However, I am physically not my cultural ideal, I am short, I am very large breasted. My teeth don't quite fit my small mouth, but I have a great smile, and I inherited a nearsighted eye from my father but my large dark eyes are one of my good features. People compliment my soft, thick, young looking skin, but it also breaks out easily. 

I'm definitely imperfect. There are people who don't appreciate me, but that's fine...I mean all people are just people, I'm glad I am attractive enough, I mean some people would consider my sex life a dream come true, so I am not going to cry because I don't look like a supermodel.

I have noticed though that people who have a kind of unconventional sexiness like I do draw hate. It's almost like some people WANT you to hate yourself because you aren't a supermodel but you still manage to attract a lot of people. But generally I am able to get along with both genders. I'm not one of those women who compete with or back stab other women unless that individual has actually invaded my territory. I really hate being around women who tear each other down. I have some really sexy female friends of all shapes and sizes. I think it's about loving your self instead of desperation to be the cultural ideal.


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## Children Of The Bad Revolution (Oct 8, 2013)

Well, during my teenage years I was probably around a 2. Now I'd place myself at a solid 1.

:happy:


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## Twitchie (Apr 2, 2015)

People told me I was really cute as a kid, but I didn't see it. In my teens, I found out I'm unapproachable. For a long time, I thought it was because I was short and ugly. Guys never asked me out at school. I got called a slut a bunch of times. Which was a little frustrating because I never got to find out if I'm a slut because no one talked to me in the first place. Of course, I wasn't brave enough to say it. I have two sisters and my big sister talked me into using Hot or Not site. She didn't know why no one was interested in me, but assured me I'm not hideous. You'd think guys my own age would have flirted with me. But the only attention I got were adult men and I'm pretty sure they thought they were being nice. People on the site rated me at 9.5 and 10. She picked flattering pics. 

I think I'm attractive, but it's worthless because I don't have social skills. I don't smile enough. I spend too long trying to think of something to say and not saying anything. Knowing I'm attractive doesn't help me get from point a to point b. And I don't feel attractive. I feel short.


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## DemonD (Jun 12, 2012)

I used to be a fat fuck.

But today...I'm *even* fatter!


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## Kingdom Crusader (Jan 4, 2012)

I've gained quite a bit of weight during my pregnancy, lost a lot of it, and then gained much of it back. But I like the way my face looks, and judging by the looks I get, some others do too. I'll be content with that until I start going back to the gym regularly and find a healthy diet to stay on.


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## hal0hal0 (Sep 1, 2012)

Piece of cake. I perceive myself by looking into a mirror. Works every time.



Veggie said:


> I look at old pictures and I don't even think that I'm pretty in them. I have been told that I don't photograph well though. That I'm a lot more attractive in person than on camera. So I don't really know. Guess I'll take their word for it. Associating being attractive with your sense of self is a weird thing. There's always someone better looking who's raising the bar. At my most insecure with all that I was tanning (but not tooo much - don't wanna wrinkle, lol, so it was this whole process of mixing that with self tanner - the nicer stuff that comes in wipe form at department stores) year round, dying my hair blonde with light brown lowlights (which everyone can't picture or seems to think would look terrible until they see pictures or video. My mom's a blonde though (sister too, sighs, I hated that growing up around Barbie, lol) and I have a lot of her facial features...just got my dad's coloring (lots of Native American on his side). It's weird, he and I have the exact same color eyes too - and I've gotten compliments that they're unique), annndd suffering from pretty bad eating disorders. I was pretty heavily bulimic for like two years.


This is tied to certain biases (not going to bombard you with them), which can make it difficult for us to objectively view or evaluate ourselves. Like being too close to a work of art or writing to really see how good it is. So outside perspectives & talking to other people I think are more important to growth than I've given them credit for, even if I still tend to find the prospect unpleasant/uncomfortable. 





https://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200505/metaperceptions-how-do-you-see-yourself

For myself, this can work from the standpoint of feeling superior/inferior, which is largely why I've stopped drawing. It's easy to get discouraged when other people are better than you, for me at least, so I've been forcing myself to draw more. But, it won't come magically. Because... at least for skills-based things, you have to put in the hours and you have to practice (which means making mistakes). Even for naturally talented people, they still put in the work. 

But, of course, there is always that doubt that the outsider perspective is even correct; it's a balance, to be sure.






A bit off-topic, however..


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## Macrosapien (Apr 4, 2010)

Hmmmmm physical appearance is always an intriguing thing, isn't it? We only have an appearance, per se, a part from who we are. If we do not have a mirror, can it be said that we really identify with our physical appearance, after all, throughout life, we can not see ourselves without a tool of some sort, be it a mirror, picture, phone, cam. So then, what is ones perception of themselves, a part from appearance, I think this is more interesting, if you ask me. Just think about that, without the image you see every now and then? I have never known my appearance, or what it meant to look a certain way, until people consistently reminded me. How people perceive us is their problem, but it affects us, and then this influence, becomes ours. From a health perspective each person should strive to be their best, if you seek to be healthy, more than likely you will be more physically attractive -- your hair will look better, your skin will, your weight, etc. 

However, this thread isn't about this, so let me take my "deep" cap off and participate. For me I have always thought I was attractive, I have an eye for features, due to my artistic ability. But growing up, I had a mom who simply did not care as much, so I went through things. Not to mention middle school changes were different. The transition to becoming a man was not an easy one. At times, due to peoples own hang ups, I developed identifications due to their influence, with certain aspects of my organism, visually. Primarily a skin condition I had on my hands, in minimal amounts. But it didnt manner if it was minimal, people are very against anything new and different, and they have to identify the person based on this difference. so it is natural to identify with this, till you wear their words on yourself like clothing. You become estranged from the person you are, the person without an appearance, you learn to not love your own flesh, the only one you will ever have. But for me, this was all stupid, after puberty occurred, then I got attention and I identified with that attention, and I have a part of me which thinks I am just pretty damn attractive, then the other part of me which thinks I am not, and to be honest, both are probably true. I've modeled for paintings, on account of my physique and bone structure, I could have done photo modeling, but I could never look at myself that way or even approach such a thing. I try to have pride in my appearance, as this is the physical body I will have, but all of it is merde, it is all shit in the end and doesn't matter. we will all become wrinkly and old.

So I dont really try, well at least not to any real degree lol, I havent brought any clothes for a long time, i have no need for such things lol. life is so interesting, and there is so many more important things than looking good. if you listen to people, it will only separate you from what you actually are, be it if they ae complimentary or not. I think my body physique is amazing, and I only think this because others have said it. I only think I have sexy moments, because others have said it. To what degree are any of these ideas I have about myself from me? Before I knew my approach from others, I had a different concept of myself. When I am living life, I am neither a man, a race, or any other thing by which we identify, which do actually exist, but what I am, is something a little more deeper and spacious than that. just raw consciousness. What is the appearance of consciousness, I wonder? I just want to know myself before all these influences, this identification, and these cares and worries.. makes me want to cry sometimes. In life people look at me and they think I am a player, they think I have run through the woman, but I dont really care about that sort of thing, I want to sometimes care more about my appearance, but then I wonder how productive that is. People are strange things, I tell ya.


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## Veggie (May 22, 2011)

hal0hal0 said:


> This is tied to certain biases (not going to bombard you with them), which can make it difficult for us to objectively view or evaluate ourselves. Like being too close to a work of art or writing to really see how good it is. So outside perspectives & talking to other people I think are more important to growth than I've given them credit for, even if I still tend to find the prospect unpleasant/uncomfortable.


Having your own sense of self is important too though. I've gotten a lot of unsolicited opinions about who I am over the years, lol. When you're kind of...propped up by that, it's confusing when and if it goes away, or shifts.

It's weird how the process of relation forms perception too. I used to work for this company that was pretty young. Everyone was in their 20's/early 30's. Apparently the dudes had formed an email chain where they were comparing all the women in the office to celebrities, lol. One of my girl friends got a hold of it, and everyone had decided that I looked exactly like "a young Kim Basinger". I was like wha? (I was blonde and at my thinnest at that time so it fit better then).










I couldn't see it at all until I pulled up that picture and saw my mom in her when she was younger (and not even just feature wise - but sort of this similar energy or aura or something), and people say I look like her, so, okay, maybe. Then I put it next to some pictures I had taken and I could see it more. Then my face actually sort of transformed whenever I looked in the mirror, lol, it was odd.

I never really got that I looked like my mom until I died my hair though. Then it was double takes from extended family members, like, wow, you look exactly like her, I never noticed it before. Just that simple shift in hair color. (And I was dying my eyebrows too which I think always changes your face a bit...and probably waxing them a little too thin so that in between die jobs they weren't in stark contrast to my hair). I always loved to hear that. It made me feel closer to her or something. It was during that phase where you sort of go through parental loss - you stop seeing them as these infallible archetypal figures and more as just flawed humans. I could see more of myself in the then too though....genes are weird, lol.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

In 10th grad, a galpal said this other dude at the pool had great pecs. I looked at mine, and was sad.

I started working out, lifting, and spending extra time on the butterfly chest machine and bench press to increase peccage.

Great success!! People that knew me as a long distance runner scrawny kid, commented on my physique. Ego stroke, stroke, stroke.

But after it became a habit, didn't really think about it, though I was still pretty vain. And that was really my main motivation for working out.

Around 26 or so, I started getting into some martial arts, and then MMA. I found a pretty rough and tumble scrappy gym with a cage, and I was either bruised up or bleeding (red sweat, we called it) after most training sessions.

All I cared about from then til now, was functional strength, being fit enough to take a punch, strong enough to be injury resistant, having enough endurance to roll (jiu jitsu sparring) for an hour. 

If I gained a little fat, I didn't care, burned too many calories and lost more weight than I would have previously been ok with, I didn't care. I could train.

I unfortunately, haven't consistently trained MMA in quite some time, and I miss it dearly, like nothing can quite compare. And I haven't been as consistent with intense, endorphin inducing exercise. But I run everyday, lift 3 times a week, and am slowly getting back there.

Even though I've received a coupla "hawts" on Hot or Not thread, I honestly have no idea if people find me attractive IRL. I think if they do, like gfs, they don't tell me cuz they think I think I'm hot shit (my theory). I don't. 

SOOOOOOO as it stands today, I feel attractive when I feel vibrantly healthy. Don't care as much how I look in the mirror, though working towards vital healthiness usually has a by-product of looking ok nekkid.

But I am WAY less vain than I was in my teens and early twenties thank god.


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## bionic (Mar 29, 2010)

I had a lot of body issues in my teens but grew out of it in my 20s. I found out a few years ago that I have Celiac disease which caused a lot of damage to my stomach and other organs. Since being on a gluten free diet, I'm as healthy as ever. I've always been very curvy and hated the attention I got when I was younger because I had a butt and boobs at a young age. I'm Latina so curves are considered an awesome thing in my culture. I'm still curvy now but I enjoy my body more than ever. 

I miss running barefoot and being more active. I would really like to work on my strength and gain some lean muscle. Now that the weather is much better, I can get back into jump roping, yoga, and all that.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

Veggie said:


> Having your own sense of self is important too though. I've gotten a lot of unsolicited opinions about who I am over the years, lol. When you're kind of...propped up by that, it's confusing when and if it goes away, or shifts.
> 
> It's weird how the process of relation forms perception too. I used to work for this company that was pretty young. Everyone was in their 20's/early 30's. Apparently the dudes had formed an email chain where they were comparing all the women in the office to celebrities, lol. One of my girl friends got a hold of it, and everyone had decided that I looked exactly like "a young Kim Basinger". I was like wha? (I was blonde and at my thinnest at that time so it fit better then).
> 
> ...


OMFG, young Kim Basinger is probably my #1 woman of all time.


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## Veggie (May 22, 2011)

johnnyyukon said:


> OMFG, young Kim Basinger is probably my #1 woman of all time.


Haha, really? I spent the longest time trying to decide if I thought she was pretty and if it was a compliment or not. Then I was like, hmm, well, she's a famous movie star, so probably, but does that even mean anything necessarily? Then I started breaking down her face by science of attraction stuff, lol.


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## Notus Asphodelus (Jan 20, 2015)

I think being sporty is the only time when I could feel beautiful. I can't at this moment as I'm going through a sedentary month of working on my coursework.


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## olonny (Jun 9, 2014)

This is such an interesting thread. First because it's interesting to see what other people say and second because it allows you a moment to think about self-awareness when on a daily basis you might be much more concerned of what others might think of you rather than what you think of yourself. 

I've always been much more interested in nurturing the mind than the body. It might sound crapy, Disney fairy-taily like, but I honestly believe that beauty comes from inside of you. I used to have A LOT of insecurities. From the typical ones, to some other very specific of my personality and body, and also including the ones any introverted person might have (yeah, I used to be a hard-core-introvert). The thing is, now looking back at those younger years, I used to be quite beautiful, far more than other times in which I was happier with myself, in which I considered myself more attractive and others think the same as well. Hell, I was more attractive.
With this being said, I do like myself right now, I think I am attractive to some extend but it's definitely all "in" me, since I know I used to be much more beautiful especially comparing it to right now that I'm going through some health issues (not the topic now, but still it kind of affects my attractiveness).


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## Veggie (May 22, 2011)

@hal0hal0 - Just watched your videos.



hal0hal0 said:


>


This is interesting, especially at about 3:00 where she says that we often lose the most critical part of the looking glass concept where our sense of self results from how we _imagine_ others are viewing us. Lol, nope. I'm trapped there, if anything. I project a thousand motivations onto everyone. 

I'm rereading my post and I'm realizing how hazy my memory has become in some ways. I feel like it's aggressively annoying, like I'm bragging or something, but I'm sick of this expectation that women should always be humble or coy about what is just their reality. Or that they even assume or know it to be reality. I think I was throwing some of the most extreme stuff out there wondering - what's the probability that these sorts of things happen to other women? And often? Can't figure it out if no one talks about it. I think women tend to get "you're attractive" affirmations a lot more frequently than men do, and I think it's why there isn't always that same hierarchal...respect? in women that you will often see in men. (Most aren't going to contest that they're Brad Pitt - whereas more women are more likely to actually believe it, I think).

Social media is weird. I feel like it's massively devalued the compliment. You see everyone saying the same thing to everyone all the time it seems like. "Everybody gets a trophy" makes it difficult to figure out what's really going on. And then it's like - does it even matter? But yea. Some objective consensus makes determining objective reality possible. How else are we doing that if not by a numbers game? (Mass public opinion creates the likelihood of the probability of something being individual perception). How does anyone ever feel special for something otherwise? And I think that's important to humans. I think it drives a lot of what we do, and it's crucial for intimacy and trust I think. (You know that old adage that's like - don't trust what people say, trust what they do? I don't even necessarily believe in that anymore, lol. I don't know what to believe in with people. I just try to gather as much data as I can and guess). I definitely could stand to care less here, but it is sort of lonely to lose that altogether. Then though - when you aren't on the side of public consensus, how do you convince yourself of your worth in something? How does someone else? I think you've brought that up before - determining how we're ever really connecting with people. 



hal0hal0 said:


>


I very rarely get jealous of people. If anything I get annoyed with them if I feel like they're confusing or deluding what I believe to be reality, because then I'll introject, and, wait, am I the deluded one here?  And it's back down the rabbit hole.

When I do get jealous though, I do try to do what she says. Befriend people, compliment them, see them as a teacher of sorts. It's kinda stimulating. Though, sometimes I wonder if I don't view people as a threat when I should. Is that ever really fair though? That's like Evil Queen stuff, LOL. Or is it just smart? I guess at it's healthiest it just fuels competition in a good way.

In conclusion: I don't know what reality is. Sorry for making that so long winded.

I'm also realizing it's interesting that I brought up my mom since you'd just brought up your dad on another thread, and Beebe. (Almost done reading that stuff - I have read it before, it's just been a while, and it didn't really process as well the first time, lol). I always thought the blonde obsession was a cultural thing (Barbie), but now I'm thinking it's a mommy thing too. I think I always kind of felt like her stepchild in a way, haha, with her and my sister being in their blonde club together, and both middle children. *Peels the onion* I'll probably (will) have more to say about that later.


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## BlackDog (Jan 6, 2012)

I was an unattractive kid. Not like, you'd point out the window at me like a freak show, but I was awkward. Slightly chubby. Braces. Glasses. Nose constantly in a book, and a total tomboy. At about ten I started growing breasts and was mortified. Girls started spreading rumours that I stuffed my shirt with socks. I got my mom to buy me the smallest sports bra I could find by saying it fit, but it actually was super tight and just kind of taped them down. Most of my friends were guys and I didn't want to be seen as different from them. I also didn't want to give the girls another reason to make shit up about me. I always preferred to just fly under the radar, for better or for worse. 

Got to highschool and they, um, just kept growing. Started to lose my baby fat so they were more pronounced. I went through a punky/gothic/skater phase and I wore a lot of baggy shirts. Dyed my hair and got a bunch of piercings. I was not interested in being sexualized at all. I was always very confident though, and I think this pissed a lot of girls off. I never dressed slutty a day in my life, but still got some attention from guys. There were more rumours I padded my bra or had a boob job. I got pretty good at ignoring them or dishing it right back at them. Made me pretty unpopular. Lol. I had a strong group of friends and was perfectly happy, so it didn't bother me what anybody else thought. Then in the twelfth grade we had co-Ed swimming class and the jig was pretty much up. 

I have to say, I don't think I am ugly but it was hard to accept that I might actually be attractive. I sort of assumed I was average at best, not ugly but not hot. Didn't bother me, I had accepted this so young that I was confident in myself anyway. I still don't really know what to think of myself. I think I am reasonably attractive. Other people seem think I am quite good looking, so I guess that's that. Looks aren't particularly important to me, to be honest. 

I went through a brief phase around nineteen or twenty where I just did not want to be attractive at all. I was working at a coffee shop and was starting to experience a lot of sexual... Harassment? I don't know. I earned a nickname for apparently looking like a popular porn actress, and some of the male regulars started making bets on who could get me into bed. None of them won, btw. I was irritated and found this all extremely disrespectful. I reverted back slightly to the baggy shirts and never wore makeup. 

Now I take a certain level of pride in my appearance and just ignore people. I work in an office so I am well groomed and dress nicely, but I still don't wear a lot of makeup or revealing clothing. I am still an awkward tomboy at heart.


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## hal0hal0 (Sep 1, 2012)

Veggie said:


> This is interesting, especially at about 3:00 where she says that we often lose the most critical part of the looking glass concept where our sense of self results from how we _imagine_ others are viewing us. Lol, nope. I'm trapped there, if anything. I project a thousand motivations onto everyone.


Hm, I interpreted when she said we "lose" it, that it was more we may not necessarily be _conscious _of the mind games and imagined/projected assumptions we are making. So that's more a question of self-awareness which probably doesn't apply to you; I just thought the concept was fitting for the thread. 

As in: I think that you think that I think that you think that I think this stuff is correct . It's like: How did we even get here?



Veggie said:


> Social media is weird. I feel like it's massively devalued the compliment. You see everyone saying the same thing to everyone all the time it seems like. "Everybody gets a trophy" makes it difficult to figure out what's really going on.


I've definitely thought that before, but there is a lot that goes on beneath the surface as well, to the point that I've almost entirely dropped my presumptions and just try to talk to people in one-on-one conversations. It's especially interesting talking to those people I've deemed to have "settled down" as if they don't have any dreams or aspirations. I do agree with you that talking it out and breaking the ice can clear the air. I dislike walls. Walls breed paranoid, I find.



Veggie said:


> I very rarely get jealous of people. If anything I get annoyed with them if I feel like they're confusing or deluding what I believe to be reality, because then I'll introject, and, wait, am I the deluded one here? And it's back down the rabbit hole.
> 
> When I do get jealous though, I do try to do what she says. Befriend people, compliment them, see them as a teacher of sorts. It's kinda stimulating. Though, sometimes I wonder if I don't view people as a threat when I should. Is that ever really fair though? That's like Evil Queen stuff, LOL. Or is it just smart? I guess at it's healthiest it just fuels competition in a good way.


Hm, I get jealous all the time about everything. It's terribly petty; I'm such a glass half-empty person. :laughing: I guess not in a possessive sense, but certainly feeling inferior or fraudulent. Like, shit, I just want something that says "this is me" but errbody be better at it than me or stole it from me (which is completely illogical, the more you think about it). I suffer from stage IV Special Snowflake Syndrome. Ofc, that's probably because people only look at the Mona Lisas and not all the sketchbooks and scribbles to get there, that feelings of inferiority arise. People too often only present their best, most perfect self. That's too much pressure, for me. I'd rather people just talk to me, I guess?

I don't befriend them, per se, but simply breaking the ice and engaging is a good way for me to step outside my comfort zone.



Veggie said:


> In conclusion: I don't know what reality is. Sorry for making that so long winded.


Would I have it any other way?

Long-winded responses usually mean one of two things:

1. The person cares enough to give you a thoughtful reply
2. The person is a nitpicking little flame-war monger that gets their kicks off by "winning" internet debates.



Veggie said:


> I just try to gather as much data as I can and guess).


The guess method!

* *












I've been going back to the drawing board (heh) to practice basic skills and found her channel. She talks about those stupid drawing books that tell you to start off with squares and circles and whatnot for like everything and how that method really didn't work for her. I do like the more organic, "sculpting" approach. Starting is often the most difficult to me, so learning just to make mistakes, guess, and go for it is quite liberating.


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

Less attractive than others seem to perceive me to be. It's weird, I can never figure it out.
Maybe it's just because I don't find many people attractive anyway, which I guess could easily include myself. 

Regarding getting older, I'm now slimmer than I used to be which I think makes my face look less attractive. My hair has got darker which I don't like because it makes my skin look paler. Two things changed from having my kids, one of those changes I see as being positive and the other one as negative. That's about it, I think.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

Veggie said:


> Haha, really? I spent the longest time trying to decide if I thought she was pretty and if it was a compliment or not. Then I was like, hmm, well, she's a famous movie star, so probably, but does that even mean anything necessarily? Then I started breaking down her face by science of attraction stuff, lol.


Oh god, her lips, her body. And her personality is cute as a button. Was a Bond girl in Never Say Never Again, no small accolade.









































Of course, it may all have to do with that fateful day I watched My Stepmother Is an Alien at my friends house with his parents and she does a strip tease for Dan Aykroyd's character. Even though my friends parents were in the room, it's the first memory I have of an uncontrollable boner that simply would not go away (warning <tmi, don't read)


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## Veggie (May 22, 2011)

johnnyyukon said:


> Of course, it may all have to do with that fateful day I watched My Stepmother Is an Alien at my friends house with his parents and she does a strip tease for Dan Aykroyd's character. Even though my friends parents were in the room, it's the first memory I have of an uncontrollable boner that simply would not go away (warning <tmi, don't read)


LOL, aren't you about my age? Or did I make that up? Isn't that movie from like the 80's? Actually, never mind. It's not like there was a deadline for seeing My Stepmother Is an Alien - 1990. I guess you could have seen it like last week with your friends parents. Though I'm guessing if you are around my age you didn't get your first boner last week  Or did you.










Yea, so your boner. As a child. Let's talk about it XD I promise it's not weird.


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## stiletto (Oct 26, 2013)

*My perception of myself is/was directly linked to my self-esteem.*

In high school I had thought I was very ugly. I was told by bullies and peers that I was ugly. My parents said I was ugly. Looking back I see how this chipped away at my self-esteem. But NOW, I understand WHY I was told that I was ugly and why I believed it. The bullies who told me I was ugly were being malicious. The peers who indirectly told me I was ugly because they, themselves were insecure. My parents told me I was ugly because I was resisting the changes they forced on me. Looking back at photos of my youth, I can conclude that I was NOT ugly, I was awkward. It was a behaviour that reflected in how I carried myself and allowed others to convince me that it was an accurate representation of my physical attractiveness.

I definitely subscribe(d) to North American standards of beauty when I rate myself. The fact that I don't 100% fit in what I find to be the ideal "docks points" in my perception. But I'm aware of it and content with it.

My husband fell in love with me when I believed I was "ugly". He was adamant that I was not and was in disbelief at how low my self-esteem was. It sounds SUPER cheesy, but he told me I was beautiful every day since high school. At first, I didn't believe him. I was even angry with him because I thought he was being insincere and/or teasing me. Everytime he said the words, I would say "Stop it. *insert sarcastic remark*". Over time, I got less and less uncomfortable with his compliments. Over time, I started just responding with "Thank you". Now? It's usually "Thank you.", a smile, or even "I know."

As I got older, became more competent and confident in different areas of my life, my husband (then boyfriend) continued to tell me daily how beautiful I was. He verbally SAID "You're so beautiful" and sometimes he would do small things that reinforced his sincerity. I would catch him staring. Or he would take a moment to brush the stray wisp of hair from my face. Sometimes, when I wake up in the early morning light, he's already wake and smiling at me. When I'm miserable and sick, I feel and look awful, he will leg-hump me (LOL). No matter what "state" I am in over the past 13 years, he NEVER fails to be attracted to every part of me. 

That made me FEEL beautiful. And as a result, I started carrying myself as a sexy and attractive person. Now... I overcompensated in my early adult years, but I seem to have a realistic grasp on it now. :laughing:

So in my pre-pubescent years, I would have considered my physical attractiveness a 3/10 (now looking back, I was probably more of a 6/10 - ugly duckling years).
In my teen years, I'd say I was a 4/10. Looking back, I was more of a 7/10.
In my early adult years, I would have said I was an 9/10 when I was really more of a 7.5/10. I went through a narcissistic, slutty phase LOL.
Currently, I'm pretty satisfied and consider myself a 7.5 - 8/10 and content to stay that way.
As I age, I expect to drop down to a reasonable 6.5 - 7/10. =)

It is all in how you carry yourself. 
Attractiveness is 70% confidence, 20% genetics, 10% style.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

Veggie said:


> LOL, aren't you about my age? Or did I make that up? Isn't that movie from like the 80's? Actually, never mind. It's not like there was a deadline for seeing My Stepmother Is an Alien - 1990. I guess you could have seen it like last week with your friends parents. Though I'm guessing if you are around my age you didn't get your first boner last week  Or did you.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ahh, my first childhood boner. Totally PC.

You are not imagining things, INFJ, we are close in age, but luckily my friend's parents had major clout at Blockbuster and managed to secure My Stepmother Is an Alien even though it was way past the expiration date.

But we'll talk about my second childhood boner from last week next time :laughing:





Let's see if I can tie this into the topic. So first memorable sexual experiences, I suppose 'twas round this time I subconsciously realized I was heterosexual. And had a serious thing for blondes, still do. 

Also, though I never considered myself sex crazed, as I didn't lose my virginity until late teens, I was definitely girl crazy. Was even told that by friends. Older now, and have been described as highly sexualized, "oozes sex" one gif's best friend said. And maybe that has to do with my sx/sp orientation. And it's kind of true, and it has kind of been a problem in the past. 

My little head, not listening to a damn word my brain said. I've come to terms with it though, and after dating a particularly borderline psychotic girl when I was 28, I have learned to be a better master of my domain. Going a year celibate immediately after, coinciding when I started grad school at a 3:1 girl:guy ratio school. Swore I wouldn't shit where I ate. Was surprisingly successful, though not always easy with a few women basically offering straight up to me. But I commanded my dick to cease and desist. Built some sexual willpower. 





Ok that might have been a stretch relating to physicality.


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## Veggie (May 22, 2011)

hal0hal0 said:


> Hm, I interpreted when she said we "lose" it, that it was more we may not necessarily be _conscious _of the mind games and imagined/projected assumptions we are making. So that's more a question of self-awareness which probably doesn't apply to you; I just thought the concept was fitting for the thread.
> 
> As in: I think that you think that I think that you think that I think this stuff is correct . It's like: How did we even get here?


Lol, no, I don't necessarily  But yea, that stuff that is supposed to be sub/unconscious is definitely in the forefront of my mind. Way too self aware. I feel like my own needs/wants get buried in that other part of the brain, though I've been making contact with them again, finally, lol. Patterns. (Feelings? Christ. Thinking there might be something to INFJ's being the thinkiest of NF types). I get too wrapped up in the idea of things. Lose feeling. Intuition. Instinct. All of that. (Again, feel like a broken record, lol. Maybe that's just part of getting older. Telling your stories again and again).



hal0hal0 said:


> Walls breed paranoid, I find.


Agreed. I try to respect other people's, but damn it when they start creating paranoia in me!!! How much of that am I honestly supposed to respect before I start losing my mind? It's probably a healthy opposition though sometimes. I can be too open.



hal0hal0 said:


> Hm, I get jealous all the time about everything. It's terribly petty; I'm such a glass half-empty person. :laughing: I guess not in a possessive sense, but certainly feeling inferior or fraudulent. Like, shit, I just want something that says "this is me" but errbody be better at it than me or stole it from me (which is completely illogical, the more you think about it). I suffer from stage IV Special Snowflake Syndrome. Ofc, that's probably because people only look at the Mona Lisas and not all the sketchbooks and scribbles to get there, that feelings of inferiority arise. People too often only present their best, most perfect self. That's too much pressure, for me. I'd rather people just talk to me, I guess?


I can feel fraudulent. I have a ginormous fear of being delusional. And - mind you. I know I'm a delusional person XD But that's just it - I like to know. My main fear in life is being crazy and not knowing it. Not being able to level and laugh about it. Causing someone harm in some way, obliviously. Not having some kind of handle on objectivity. BEING the joke. Quasimodo, Carrie.


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## Vanitas (Dec 13, 2009)

I've been told I'm 'striking' (lately a friend seems to prefer the word 'blinding'.. eh.), I do get stared at sometimes --and IF I have to/ am given a comparison I can ...more or less accurately determine whether I'm more attractive or less so than the person. But honestly in everyday life, especially when alone, I don't consider myself that attractive.

It weirds me out when friends point out the potential drama that might happen in my quest of getting male friends. I considered the possibility of me having Ugly Duckling Syndrome, but that would require adopting the idea that the current me is a 'swan'.


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## Laze (Feb 19, 2015)

The Ripper from Last Action Hero.


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## ScarlettHayden (Jun 8, 2012)

I'm still young, but I definitely have a better perception of myself than before. I like looking in the mirror now, I can think "wow she's so pretty".


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## sockratees (Apr 7, 2015)

Even though girls would come up to me, I never saw myself as attractive. I wished physique wasn't an integral part of natural selection .


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## chanteuse (May 30, 2014)

I was pretty critical on my appearance when I was in my 20s, never was happy with it. 

One time I looked at my photos taken from when I was in my 20s. It was a revelation because my physical beauty was in its high glory back then. I should have been more appreciative.

Hind sight is 20/20. I've learned to love what I am "having" right now. Believe me, appearance and physical beauty will go south 5 years from now, often despite your best effort at preserving it.


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## telepariah (Jun 20, 2011)

I like my body just fine. It's tall and athletic. I weigh the same today as I did when I graduated from high school 41 years ago. At 58 it is amazing what my body will still do. Little signs of age are there, but I can also run circles around nearly all my mountaineering and skiing partners who are in their 20s and 30s. 

I've never thought my face was very interesting and I don't like to have my picture taken. It's pretty weathered now from high altitude and sun and wind. But I've always been kind of self conscious and camera shy. I wore a heavy beard for many years but am clean shaven now since when it turned to white it also turned into a wire brush. If I were to grow it out again I would look at least 20 years older than I am.


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## Superfluous (Jan 28, 2014)

I'm borderline narcissistic, but everyone knows behind a narcissist is someone constrantly struggling to keep an inferiority from the surface of their mind. As a kid, I was so ugly omg. I knew it but being a class clown, it kind of worked for me. Around senior year, is where I went from ugly duckling to swan but it seems that I have over matured. I have strong facial features, and an hour glass figure, something that seems to attract older men more than guys my age. A word that's used a lot to describe my looks is elegant, like a queen. I've always been an old soul so sure, I would be a queen before a princess, however - I am only 21. I used to have a baby face -- now I feel like it's all downhill... Women get more beautiful with age, but I feel like I couldn't possibly at this point lol.


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

I think I'm fairly average. But other women tell me they want my skin, or my body shape or whatever. I did okay for myself on he dating circuit. Can't say I'm overly vain, nor do I hate the way I look. It helps that I found the diet and exercise that do best for me. I never have to worry about weight gain again. 

In the past few years though I've come to appreciate the fleeting nature of human beauty and kind of like the fact I'm fast approaching invisibility status as far as women are concerned. It always bothered me intensely that I got unwanted male attention.

And fertility hormones make you carry/store fat. When I look at 20yr olds now I am reminded how I struggled with being pudgy, and I look at their heavy hips, belly fat, water retention and other unwanted and much complained about body parts they never seem happy with and am thankful those days are over. I try to tell these girls that trying to be super skinny in fertile years is a useless endeavour, your body wants to carry little pads of fat, that's natural, its part of being fertile. But they never listen.  It's the same stuff that makes your cheeks plump and collagen plentiful. 

Overall I'm more comfortable in the body I have now than the one I had way back when. I think I was a lot less attractive in my 20's.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

chanteuse said:


> I was pretty critical on my appearance when I was in my 20s, never was happy with it.
> 
> One time I looked at my photos taken from when I was in my 20s. It was a revelation because my physical beauty was in its high glory back then. I should have been more appreciative.
> 
> Hind sight is 20/20. I've learned to love what I am "having" right now. Believe me, appearance and physical beauty will go south 5 years from now, often despite your best effort at preserving it.


Ya know, I was just talking to this lady that has part ownership at this scuba dive shop and we were talking about gear, but as is normal for me, this total stranger began to tell me parts of her life story. 

She was around 50(?), raised on a farm 5 brothers, started a family at 19, tough gal, started talking about beauty and she said that she never really had time to date/explore her sexuality, so busy raising a family, 4 kids. 

Then she says, "I was too busy to go out and flirt with guys, plus I didn't know I was pretty. Looking back at pictures, I realized I was very pretty."


Which reminds me of a line from a movie:


Are you okay?

*You're not how I imagined you'd look.*

Do I know you?

*You're beautiful. Someone should have told you that.*


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## ficsci (May 4, 2011)

I think I have the tendency to be pretty detached from my own appearance, but I'm a very visual person and often obsess about other people's bodies, in creepy surgeon sort of way XD . I had always been curious about sexuality, because my family is so damn repressed and clueless about it. So in my teen years I'd often look it up on the internet, both porn and legit anatomical articles. I think the knowledge partly contributes to my not ever being too insecure of my body.

I've always been pretty androgynous in terms of personality. I'm interested in style, but not it the sense that I want to make myself look better. I'm more interested in the aesthetic itself. In my teen years I was obsessed with weird haircuts, having been exposed to alternative subcultures. I didn't really care whether they look good on me or not, I was interested in the shape themselves and identifying with a culture. I think I still have that same attitude towards fashion now.

When I was 15-16, I seriously thought I might be transgendered. So I'd dress up even more like a tomboy than before. However, again, being a curious person, I read a lot of books/articles/comments on it, and after reading Kate Bornstein's "Gender Outlaw", I became convinced that the sense of not belonging to a certain gender is pretty much an illusion due to social construct. Dressing up, being a "woman" or "man", regardless if you're cisgendered and never questioned it, means you're in a drag. It makes me believe that people should love their bodies as it is instead of striving for some social ideal of what "body" and "gender" is. I think the fact that your functioning body & brain are what confirm your existence in the 3rd dimension is much more important than that.

By the time I was cool with accepting and knowing more about my body, I realized that my boobs are actually kind of big. Again, because of my family and the whole society being repressed, I couldn't find a bra that fits me, which totally explains why they hurt!! D:< I think it's really dumb that people in most parts of East & Southeast Asia (except Japan, lol) just sort of deny that anything above D cups even exist. I mean, sure, it has an entire economic + cultural reason (Illuminati). And if you have big boobs, they assume that by default you also have to be fat. So I'm totally an advocate of well-fitting bras. If only my sister would listen to me.

As to how I view my body now, let's just say that ever since I discovered that pretty metrosexual guys exist, I decided that I don't want to lose. So while it sucks to "lose" to pretty girls, what initially motivated me to care about looking attractive was my wanting to be more feminine than guys. (Because I'm straight, ugh... and also I'm not a dominant cougar. In fact, I'm weirdly submissive, and because submissive is often equated to being femme, I kinda had to roll with appearing like one. Lol, stupid gender roles). I think I'm lucky to have a round, childish face. Also teh bewbs. I'm not overweight, but I tend to look kinda fat. I guess it can look like sexy fat, but I wish I have a smaller waist and lower appetite for food. My overblown Si certainly isn't helping. Comfort > looks.

So I think people who had known me for a long time might find it strange that I want to work in fashion (creating, NOT preaching or selling it). But I think it totally makes sense, because I've been interested in bodies and sexuality. I'm actually most interested in the technical/physical aspect of it.


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## LadyO.W.BernieBro (Sep 4, 2010)

Long, messy story. 

But long story short:When l was about 20, l put on ''the weight'' l'd kept off my body for most of my developing years. 
Realistically, it was maybe 10-15 pounds over the body weight l'd spanned between which is why it was in quotation marks. l was never really trying to delay becoming enormously obese or anything, even with the added weight l was 120.

l did hit that weight a few different times before the age of 20 but it was very short-lived and l think age 20 was when l stayed that size for over a year.

Self-perception doesn't exist in a vacuum...l could talk more about the way l saw my own body or the way l do see it but many women tend to get comments from other people. 

Even when the comments aren't sexual, l'm not sure about other people but it was pretty normal for my family and extended family to comment on developing females, the other women mostly. l probably received most of those comments from my aunts when comparing me to my mother and how my body wasn't lanky like her's.

Then aside from that, comments ranging from actual compliments to unwanted solicitation. For that period of a little over a year, was the time l received the most unwanted solicitation and l know objectively that my body was most 'sexual' during that time. So, l tried it out but l wasn't a huge fan of looking that way.


Since then l'm basically the same body shape but 10 pounds less, l don't think too much about it l just stay fit and may tweak certain things to look the way l want to. l'm usually happy with it, l just don't like my body image being owned by anyone else.

l do try to change things like clothing or style before resorting to try to change my entire body drastically first, though, now.


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## chanteuse (May 30, 2014)

johnnyyukon said:


> Ya know, I was just talking to this lady that has part ownership at this scuba dive shop and we were talking about gear, but as is normal for me, this total stranger began to tell me parts of her life story.
> 
> She was around 50(?), raised on a farm 5 brothers, started a family at 19, tough gal, started talking about beauty and she said that she never really had time to date/explore her sexuality, so busy raising a family, 4 kids.
> 
> ...



I'd say most young women care too much about their perceived flaws (compare to the "perfect girls") to appreciate their unique beauty. A few do not pay heed. They genuinely don't care much about their own physical appearance. Very seldom a 20 something is keenly aware of the fleeting nature of beauty. Human body is a vessel that keeps changing, ever so lightly each month and each year.

It's rather bitter sweet for the lady to come to a realization way after the fact that she didn't have a life in her 20s and 30s. Being a good looking girl is but one aspect. It's more of not have lived like a typical 20/30 something. I hope she come to peace with her lot in life and strive to living in the present.


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## DemonAbyss10 (Oct 28, 2010)

No idea what I would even judge myself as, especially since I am the most socially oblivious twit out there (no fixing that either.)

Yeah, sure I am tall as hell, and statistically women like taller guys, but to me it is a pointless statistic. I despise my height due to living in a world designed around short people and all the health issues and other stuff that entails.
Am I in the best shape? No, I am working on it though and I am not a blob. I do have posture issues but they are being improved on by general fitness levels being raised.

Teeth have always been an issue for me, not due to hygenie causes but not being able to ever afford dental care when I need it (Blame living in the US for it), which has caused an unsightly hole in my one canine. Aside from that, everything is clean and healthy (A cracked molar way in the back isn't noticable and thus rendered moot.). Still has the effect of me never smiling unless something is genuinely funny. Which does go against me pretty bad.

Face wise, still have some baby-fat on the cheeks that just never disappears. I have central heterochromia in my eyes (many people still refer to them a hazel, which it is not. There is no brown or "the hazel effect" in them. Still the only feature of mine I actually like.

Physicality rating wise, my current mental state does have an effect on how I view myself, and pretty heavily factors in at times. Currently I would rate myself as a 4.5/10 and that is me at my most objective. (and no, not a self-esteem issue, just a genuine neutral estimate here. In fact I try to avoid the whole "overinflated sense of self esteem and self-worth" that people try to project so that also might impact my own ratings on myself. I don't factor in fashion either, because I honestly find obsessing over how clothing goes together, etc etc, as a huge part of what is wrong with society.

Not sure if I would classify it as a physicality aspect, but apparently women sometimes go nuts over my voice, no idea why. If true, and it fits physicality, I might just raise that rating to a 5.5/10


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## series0 (Feb 18, 2013)

Oddly my physicality has gotten a raw deal. 

When I was very young all my friends in my neighborhood accepted my steamroller leadership. I ran the show for about 15 other boys and girls, 2 of them my brother and sister. I was upbeat and imaginative and very assertive, but super super polite. I was the model child. That was not an image thing either. It was genuine.

But I was sheltered and not told of the real world. Middle class Methodist suburban upbringing. In short surreal and entirely unprepared for what was to come. My father was 37 when I was born, my mother 34, my birth mother 25. So adopted. The generation gap was insane. My dad fought in World War II for heaven's sake. My parent's musical tastes were classical and Lawrence Welk. Zero cultural readiness for the 70s.

Suddenly, puberty. And we switched school systems from a gifted environment where I was the alpha male of the entire school system delivering detailed intellectual lectures to other kids at age 9, to a public system, amid the Happy Days era of the late 70s.

To make things hideously worse I was tested and double promoted. So I was physically two years smaller than the other boys. So I came in an elite intellectual with a super assertive attitude and very polite with a value set and outlook straight out of the 1950s into the weed culture of the public 70s. 

The very first day of school, a boy turned around and said to me something I will never forget. He said, "You think you're cool. But you're not. You're weird!" Others chimed in. But his direct statement hit me hard. Why? Because I could read the setting and I knew. They were right on some level. Intuition told me that I was surely missing something this type of kid had. All the comments were low brow statements about my size and unique features, and they were wounding. It took me over a decade to figure out what the hell had happened on that one day. I thought I suddenly looked like a space alien. I began to act like one. I was not entirely conquerable but it put a huge dent in my life. 

I was scrawny and tall, too skinny and was told my neck was long. My eyes were deep set and even a scoutmaster called me shifty-eyed. I was so damn nervous from all the SUDDEN turns of everyone in my social world against me. From king to outcast. I knew I was smarter than nearly everyone around me. I always was even at the gifted school with 1 or 2 exceptions there, my closest friends. But my self image became about the physical. The deficiency ruled the day. I retreated inward.

Now here is the really stupid part. I was a natural athlete. My cognitive stacking is Ne - Se - Ti - Te as my first four functions. That is pretty much the second best physical awareness you can have Ne - Se - Te - Ti being the 1st in my opinion. I am enneagram 8. I was just two years behind on growth. Such a hideous thing to do that to a kid. 

So from age 10 through age 16 I suffered in school and was an outcast mostly. Be the end of that time I learned to cope with others by finding my niche rather than really learning charisma (that came later). I joined ROTC and was immediately the Commandant's favorite. But my gym coach, a Green Beret, saved me in some senses. He absolutely forced me (he didn't really have that power but no one stopped him so I guess he did) to take Gymnastics and to join a team. I chose Soccer. I lettered in it and led my team in almost every game in number of assists. I had finally found a physical self still running to catch up to my inner dynamic world.

Physical image still plagued me and remnants last to this day and I am soon to be 50. Although I filled out and was a powerful athlete going with my team to nationals in volleyball almost a dozen times, the social confidence and self-image that were arguably my birthright due to my many talents had been reduced. I just know I could have done so much better with proper guidance psychologically. 

It's hard to blame anyone in particular. Sure my parents dropped the ball. They didn't really know any better. They made some silly choices but whose parents do not? I am certainly partly to blame. I did not adapt, improvise, and overcome. But there were insane odds stacked against me. If no one ever explained cool and you suddenly run into it as a non mainstream ENTP, it's very unlikely you are going to be smoothly accepted into the social pecking order. I won't even get into how that affected my chances with girls. Physicality is a huge part of it. I considered that a barbarian issue. And there was no internet and no PerC! Where were you guys! I needed you!

Anyway, later physicality has not mattered as much. I put on some weight due entirely to beer and have struggled to keep it off. But when I say put on some weight, I mean 10-12 pounds. I used to be able to purge it each year with the Atkins diet but I stopped doing it as that diet is rough on your choices. I need to go back to it as a purge mechanism. It works fantastically for me. 

But now I know wisdom and physical self image does not really have a hold on me in any meaningful way. If anything I know to treat my body as sacred, like every part of the universe, and so I do not do many of the harmful things I used to. The biggest remaining impediment to my physical self image is sugar, or more specifically Coca-cola. 

Anyway, tl;dr drifting post. But it's my situation.


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## OrangeAppled (Jun 26, 2009)

As a child, I was really oblivious to my appearance, although I'm sure many children are. I had something of a disconnect from my body and was not aware of how my hair, face, clothes, etc, appeared to others. When it came to picking out clothes, I thought about what I liked in terms of colors or prints or shapes, not about how it looked to others. I wore giant glasses as a kid and had really crooked teeth, so my image was more of an arty-smart girl to others, and I internalized that. I always thought that being _interesting_ was better than being _pretty_. I still prefer interesting to cookie-cutter pretty.

I also admit to inevitably being influenced by the media's skewed ideals & people's negative comments, but when I don't pay attention to them I feel better about myself.

Stuff that has bothered me at various stages:
- small/narrow mouth, especially when the big lip craze started back in the early 00's. I thought my mouth and area underneath the lip was weirdly formed, and I still do, but it bothers me less now.
- small boobs, although they're a tad fuller with age and getting sized correctly made a BIG difference (no more bands swimming around my rib cage and giving no support), and I've appreciated the advantage of modest boobs in terms of attractiveness.
- being thin and tallish, and hearing comments about it or general criticism of "skinny" women/models/celebrities and how they are not "real", not attractive to men, not womanly or sexy, etc. 
- being jigglier in the thighs/butt with age, as that's where I carry weight, but it's just that I didn't fully appreciate how great they were when I was like 20
- bad skin and teeth, but better now

There's a lot I always liked about myself too though, like my eyes, hair, legs, hips/bubble butt, small waist/flat tummy, etc. I always felt like I had an easy body to dress, that I wear clothes well, and that was preferable to me than being "sexy". That way, I could wear whatever interesting things I wanted, and that made me happy.

Being that I haven't gained much weight/size and haven't aged too much, I'm happier with myself now; and even with more flaws than, say, in my mid 20s, I have a better perspective on things and can better appreciate myself. I have no idea how I compare to others in reality, but like most, in my head I am a bit above average . I attribute a lot of that to my eye for aesthetics though.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

This is strange for me. I'm not entirely sure if my perception of my physicality has ever really steadily changed over the years, even though my appearance has definitely changed. I can say objectively I'm better looking now then when I was a teenager. Or rather than better looking you can say I'm more polished now. I've learned to get my curly hair (somewhat) under control. Waxing and threading and shaving galore. Gotten braces. Know how to put on makeup. My self-perception can change very rapidly on a daily or even hourly basis but not really on a yearly basis. Its like I either think I'm much more attractive than I actually am or much less attractive than I actually am depending on my mood. 

I was never really considered sexy (which in hindsight was a great thing), which I think was one of my biggest insecurities when I was younger. My development seemed so delayed compared to my female peers. I felt behind. I was very skinny (no bewbies or booty) and even now I would say I have a more willowy/athletic type of body, which actually lets me get away with wearing much skimpier clothing without looking overly sexual. Tehe. I'm definitely considered more hot now than when I was younger however. Meaning I get more male attention now. However, I've always gotten compliments from other girls and older adults, even when I was younger and in my more "awkward" stage. I seem to have the kind of pretty that appeals to girls a lot. I actually wouldn't be surprised if I get more random stranger compliments from girls than guys. 

I was pretty jockish in high school and middle school. I played sports all year round, so I didn't really have time to get beautified very often. Even now, like 80% of the time I'm dressed in sweatpants, an old t-shirt, and a ratchet bun. But when I do dress up, my style can actually be very extravagant. Big shiny jewelry, bright colors. I go all out. I can't say I've ever gotten a disproportionately large amount of female hate. I'm not really sure why. I know the stereotype is that girls will be jealous of your looks and hate you but that simply hasn't been the case for me.


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

chanteuse said:


> I'd say most young women care too much about their perceived flaws (compare to the "perfect girls") to appreciate their unique beauty. A few do not pay heed. They genuinely don't care much about their own physical appearance. Very seldom a 20 something is keenly aware of the fleeting nature of beauty. Human body is a vessel that keeps changing, ever so lightly each month and each year.
> 
> It's rather bitter sweet for the lady to come to a realization way after the fact that she didn't have a life in her 20s and 30s. Being a good looking girl is but one aspect. It's more of not have lived like a typical 20/30 something. I hope she come to peace with her lot in life and strive to living in the present.


Yeah, 2 different examples. One being a rural farm girl that never bothered to consider her beauty, the other, a young women raised in a society where being "hot" is everything. Barbie dolls and whatnot. Today, even the former example is a lot more rare. The later is a brainwashing.

If you're talking about the lady I spoke to,ha, oh she seemed at peace. How many older women are comfortable saying that to a stranger? Plus she is very passionate about scuba diving and her family and had a younger person's jeu de vivre.

I suppose we all have regrets, even if we stopped dwelling on them.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> I can't say I've ever gotten a disproportionately large amount of female hate. I'm not really sure why. I know the stereotype is that girls will be jealous of your looks and hate you but that simply hasn't been the case for me.


You have a very well rounded personality. I can see how you would get along with everyone. Your strong and hold your own but very friendly and outgoing from what I have seen here at least.


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## TheProphetLaLa (Aug 18, 2014)

Cinnamon83 said:


> You have a very well rounded personality. I can see how you would get along with everyone. Your strong and hold your own but very friendly and outgoing from what I have seen here at least.


Aww thanks Cinnamon. That makes me very happy. ^.^


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## johnnyyukon (Nov 8, 2013)

TheProphetLaLa said:


> This is strange for me. I'm not entirely sure if my perception of my physicality has ever really steadily changed over the years, even though my appearance has definitely changed. I can say objectively I'm better looking now then when I was a teenager. Or rather than better looking you can say I'm more polished now. I've learned to get my curly hair (somewhat) under control. Waxing and threading and shaving galore. Gotten braces. Know how to put on makeup. My self-perception can change very rapidly on a daily or even hourly basis but not really on a yearly basis. Its like I either think I'm much more attractive than I actually am or much less attractive than I actually am depending on my mood.
> 
> I was never really considered sexy (which in hindsight was a great thing), which I think was one of my biggest insecurities when I was younger. My development seemed so delayed compared to my female peers. I felt behind. I was very skinny (no bewbies or booty) and even now I would say I have a more willowy/athletic type of body, which actually lets me get away with wearing much skimpier clothing without looking overly sexual. Tehe. I'm definitely considered more hot now than when I was younger however. Meaning I get more male attention now. However, I've always gotten compliments from other girls and older adults, even when I was younger and in my more "awkward" stage. I seem to have the kind of pretty that appeals to girls a lot. I actually wouldn't be surprised if I get more random stranger compliments from girls than guys.
> 
> I was pretty jockish in high school and middle school. I played sports all year round, so I didn't really have time to get beautified very often. Even now, like 80% of the time I'm dressed in sweatpants, an old t-shirt, and a ratchet bun. But when I do dress up, my style can actually be very extravagant. Big shiny jewelry, bright colors. I go all out. I can't say I've ever gotten a disproportionately large amount of female hate. I'm not really sure why. I know the stereotype is that girls will be jealous of your looks and hate you but that simply hasn't been the case for me.


I had a girlfriend kind of similar. Blonde, blue eyes, some cute freckles, very pretty. But because of circumstances in her self-perception developing stages (12-teenager), she was forced to move to this kind of crappy butt fucking freezing town in Montana, where tough girls survived and bar fights were normal.

She could eat most people alive (I always go for those chicks) but she didn't have a cruel heart and most girls, I noticed, adored her, wanted her to like them. Though I think there might have been some fear mixed in, haha.

I see some of that in you sweetums


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## WildRaspberries (Jun 7, 2015)

I was never a cute child. Up until I was about 16, I was consistently teased and bullied about the way I looked, as well as my height (i'm very short). Looking back, the bullies were probably attracted by my obvious lack of self confidence, rather than anything else. For a long time, I felt I didn't deserve or want to be in a sexual relationship, because I was so disgusted with my body and my appearance. It was very sad. I'm kind of over that feeling now, although I still have pretty low self esteem. I don't think i'm ugly or incredibly beautiful. I'm just normal, like most people are.


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## Master Mind (Aug 15, 2011)

I've always been indifferent. When I look in the mirror, I just see me. Physical attractiveness is subjective anyway, but I always just thought of myself as better looking than some people, not as good looking as others. I've had my share of women tell me they found me attractive, but I've had a couple of women say they didn't particularly find me attractive as well. Since beauty is in the eye of the beholder, there is no right or wrong answer. I'm older now, so I don't look as good as I did, say, ten years ago, for example. I see the lines in my forehead, around my mouth, etc., but I'm a perfectionist and notice flaws that others wouldn't. It's funny, because when I was younger, people thought I was older than I actually was (though mainly from the way I carried myself), and now that I'm older people think I'm younger than I actually am. People have been surprised when I told them. Though it doesn't really matter at this point in my life, and will matter less as the years pass.


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## Oleni (Jun 25, 2015)

I've always thought that I'm unattractive. I just don't get it when people are attracted to me, and the only reason I can think of is that they're desperate for a vagina. Women are usually really curvy where I live and I don't have any curves, I'm like a 12 years old boy. An ugly and skinny 12 years old boy.

*sigh* I don't think anything has changed over time. But now I realized I actually was a pretty little girl, but other children made me think I was ugly, for years.


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## Macrosapien (Apr 4, 2010)

Oleni said:


> I've always thought that I'm unattractive. I just don't get it when people are attracted to me, and the only reason I can think of is that they're desperate for a vagina. Women are usually really curvy where I live and I don't have any curves, I'm like a 12 years old boy. An ugly and skinny 12 years old boy.
> 
> *sigh* I don't think anything has changed over time. But now I realized I actually was a pretty little girl, but other children made me think I was ugly, for years.



"pat pat" although the past lives on us, and is constantly making its way into the moment, the past is the past, and we are never the things which people suggested in those days.


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## Clare_Bare (Apr 6, 2015)

So this is about perception of body image over our lifetimes?
I am middle-aged, so going backwards in time ...

Currently I have the highest confidence about my appearance and health that i've ever had!
Totally happy with my looks considering my age. Yes, I have the usual signs of aging, but hey, it could be worse!
I keep my body healthy with a reasonable diet (love my sweeet foods tho) and I swim / yoga to stay trim.
I have great self-confidence and a vibrant personality.
I hope i'm attractive all things considered?
Have heaps of friends, but not in a relationship.

From my mid 30's to mid 40's, I was a physical wreck.
Obese, unhealthy, poor diet, high stress levels.
No sane person would have come near me ...
Very unattractive!

From my early 20's to mid 30's, I guess I looked okay.
But I had no self awareness of how I appeared to others and I really didn't think about whether I looked good or not.
Indeed, I made no effort to dress-up, or go with style trends for any reason.
In fact, I was more into being sporty and travelling - not something that was conducive to appearances.
I just existed in terms of my body image.
As for relationships, I wasn't really into them. I was more of a loner just interested in my activities.

In my teenage years, I was extremely shy.
I hated puberty and the way I looked at the time.
Terrible self confidence about my body.
In hindsight I wouldn't say I looked bad, but normal for an awkward teenager.

As i've aged, I have realised that you need to be happy with the body you have.
Having confidence and self awareness helps you realise that there is no perfect shape / looks / lifestyle.
If you believe in yourself, many parts of your life fall into place automatically. And that includes relationships.
In my case, I just wish it had happened 25 years ago!


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## Alpha_Orionis (Jan 18, 2015)

When i was in high school, i was not considered attractive. And i knew it. When i changed my look to better suit my persona i noticed that people were considering me to be more attractive. I think that i was somewhere around 4/10 in high school, but after my change, few years later i think that i am a 7/10 or 7,5/10.


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## EndsOfTheEarth (Mar 14, 2015)

Alpha_Orionis said:


> When i was in high school, i was not considered attractive. And i knew it. When i changed my look to better suit my persona i noticed that people were considering me to be more attractive. I think that i was somewhere around 4/10 in high school, but after my change, few years later i think that i am a 7/10 or 7,5/10.


90% of hotness is grooming anyway. When I look at my partners who I considered hot, they weren't much to look at first thing in the morning with pillow face and bad hair. :tongue: And when I look at women guys consider hot posted online, I have a mental note of what she is likely to look like without the hair and makeup and feel quite satisfied that I'm doing okay. 

The hot guys at my work are the ones who are very particular and good at grooming. It's the attention to detail which makes them stand out as well as their finesse with choosing a suitable look for themselves. Few people are genetically amazing, but there are plenty of highly attractive people walking the planet thanks to good taste.


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## jayoung81 (Jun 21, 2015)

Wellsy said:


> How has your self perception of your attractiveness changed over time?
> This would likely hold a greater range the older one is to have been in a period of romantic attractiveness and life changes, but curious to transitions and the implications, small and large.
> 
> Like if you were someone in high school who had really bad acne, wore braces but come adulthood your face has cleared up, got a 10/10 smile. Your self concept likely hasn't changed significantly unless there has been immense change in how you're not treated on the basis of the looks perhaps which cause you to reevaluate.
> ...


I was a good looking kid and teenager then but I just didn't know it.
It wasn't until around 18 when I got copious amounts of ass that I fully understood. What a wonderful realization it was!
Now, my view has not changed much since then. I am older, not as physically attractive as I was ten years ago, but still very much so.
I think that your perception has a huge part to play in this catagory


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## Aulredigon (Jun 19, 2015)

Whenever I don't feel attractive, I look at nature and turn to apathy and realization just to scrutinize attractiveness until it no longer exists in everyone I get jealous of. It's either we're all attractive or we all aren't. I don't want to feel down about what's natural.


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## jayoung81 (Jun 21, 2015)

Tetsuo Shima said:


> I have the body of a hot chick. And, I hate it. I hate being a woman, I hate being objectified, and I hate having 50-lb breasts (which no bra can support) weighing down on my heart and lungs.


OMG! I think I am in love!

J/k had to try and give you a chuckle :tongue:


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## Tetsuo Shima (Nov 24, 2014)

jayoung81 said:


> OMG! I think I am in love!
> 
> J/k had to try and give you a chuckle :tongue:


I think you just gave me whatever the opposite of a chuckle is.


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## jayoung81 (Jun 21, 2015)

Tetsuo Shima said:


> I think you just gave me whatever the opposite of a chuckle is.


That would be a buckle
Stomach buckling in disgust.
Smile a little. The more you laugh, the more you live.

Life is best approached as one big amusment park. Makes stress super easy to take :exterminate:


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## solitairenoir (Jun 24, 2015)

My perception of my own level of attractiveness has transformed radically over time. I was born with a minor facial disfigurement - nothing "scary" but enough to turn me into an ideal target for bullies. Even my friends told me I was ugly. I had a couple of surgeries which more or less corrected the problem, but the damage was done, and to this day, I still feel pretty insecure. In my teens I started off as what I would classify as maybe above-average, but then I was prescribed lithium for depression, and gained a ton of weight, which exacerbated my low self esteem. After I stopped taking lithium, the weight practically flushed right off, I became more interested in make-up and fashion, and just started to become more interested in the world in general, which led to an accelerated maturation and development of confidence. It was around the age of 21 or 22 where I think I truly started to "blossom". People started noticing me more, complimenting me, and I was scouted by a major modeling agency at 23. So, as cliched as it sounds, although I am conscious of other people's positive assessments of my appearance, and my level of confidence has improved overall, deep down there is still a part of that little girl that feels ugly and unwanted.


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## Tetsuo Shima (Nov 24, 2014)

jayoung81 said:


> That would be a buckle
> Stomach buckling in disgust.
> Smile a little. The more you laugh, the more you live.
> 
> Life is best approached as one big amusment park. Makes stress super easy to take :exterminate:


Stop giving me reasons not to smile.


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## jayoung81 (Jun 21, 2015)

Tetsuo Shima said:


> Stop giving me reasons not to smile.


Lighten up. Life shouldn't be approached so damned seriously all that time. 
This leads to misery


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## Tetsuo Shima (Nov 24, 2014)

jayoung81 said:


> Lighten up. Life shouldn't be approached so damned seriously all that time.
> This leads to misery


Maybe I wouldn't be miserable if the world would stop harassing me.


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## jayoung81 (Jun 21, 2015)

I am sorry you feel that way, that is not my intention. If it is that case then I really do, sincerely apologize.
I really do hope you can look past the negative. You should take a bit of satisfaction in the fact that people who harass really don't have any joy in their life.


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## Fish Launcher (Jan 14, 2013)

Wellsy said:


> How has your self perception of your attractiveness changed over time?
> This would likely hold a greater range the older one is to have been in a period of romantic attractiveness and life changes, but curious to transitions and the implications, small and large.
> 
> Like if you were someone in high school who had really bad acne, wore braces but come adulthood your face has cleared up, got a 10/10 smile. Your self concept likely hasn't changed significantly unless there has been immense change in how you're not treated on the basis of the looks perhaps which cause you to reevaluate.
> ...


Not really. I was born good-looking. I just acquired a better fashion sense and a good dose of charisma over time. Plus, I lost 25 lbs over the past year. That counts for something too.


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## Deus Absconditus (Feb 27, 2011)

I think I'm an extremely attractive man now, when I was younger I thought I was an extremely attractive kid then, and throughout my life I have always been told that I'm extremely attractive even though I'm only 5'6 which has never caused a problem for me in attracting any girl that I have ever wanted, whether they were taller than me on not.

My body presently is nothing compared to what it was when I was 22, but two months in the gym would fix that problem which I plan on doing eventually, hopefully tomorrow lol. I still love my body though, but I understand that its potential is not being reached right now due to my own laziness. 

So yea I never really had a problem in the looks department, and I guess I lucked out in that respect.


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## Wellsy (Oct 24, 2011)

I used to think I was a hottie, but then... I TURNED MAXIM HOTTIE!!!!!


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## pwowq (Aug 7, 2016)

It seems my physical posture is getting more attractive as I get older. I embrace it.


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## Elspeth (Jan 24, 2013)

The thing that bugs me is my face. It's getting wrinkly! and sometimes, such as when I've been (very) ill over the last few weeks, it seems to go a strange greyish sort of colour.
Regards how others see me, my autistic son sees me as old because I have partly grey hair. He doesn't discriminate well on ages, but hair is the thing he goes by.
I don't mind the grey hair, and in some lights it looks more blonde than grey - so I'm returning to the colour of my hair as a child 
I am what I am; my shape hasn't really changed overall for some years.


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## Caveman Dreams (Nov 3, 2015)

Wellsy said:


> How has your self perception of your attractiveness changed over time?
> This would likely hold a greater range the older one is to have been in a period of romantic attractiveness and life changes, but curious to transitions and the implications, small and large.
> 
> Like if you were someone in high school who had really bad acne, wore braces but come adulthood your face has cleared up, got a 10/10 smile. Your self concept likely hasn't changed significantly unless there has been immense change in how you're not treated on the basis of the looks perhaps which cause you to reevaluate.
> ...


I wouldnt even know where to begin answering this question although I would probably be an ideal candidate as I used to hate myself when younger and had a alot of negitive thoughts.

But I cant even recognise that creep anymore and I sure as hell dont identify with him.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

I went from hot/sexy generally speaking at ages 16-30ish
to a shift of 
'Cute' or 'Pretty' 30+

These are both personal opinion of myself as well as labels I seen shift


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## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

* *




I was always a confident-humanoid, I never paid much attention to my appearance - I was a teacher(s) pet. So much so, I matched the teacher(s) outfits. Always stood tall in photos. Chin up (&) a smile. Always recognized above the other student(s) in my classes. I had only one dimple in one cheek; (&) thought it was weird looking. Although, I did not like how my mother dressed me (&) always percieved myself as ugly, she put lots of awful pig-tails in my hair. She wanted me to be 'as girly' as possible - due to the fact I was the ony female-child. 

In later years, I went half blind [it may have came from being engrossed unhealthily in technology / heavy + extreme reading (&) writing) about irrelevant things. I realized my teeth were fucked (&) had those terrible looking metal braces with the rubberbands. My jaw was slightly crooked._ In other words,_ glasses - colored-braces with rubber-bands (matching seasonal holidays), retainers. I started sprouting breast(s) in my uniform shirts. I prehap(s) found the puffy-nipples interesting -- still no strong perception of my appearance. 

Going into puberty, I got chubby & had pimples. Dyed my hair. Still blind as bat. I wore hideous uniform(s); and was always feeling gross (&) had an abnormal paranoia about leaking period into my school uniforms or leaving blood on the seat(s). I wore my braces for (2)-year(s) and got them off. My voice cracked -- it got more mature than the surrounding female specimen(s). So, I was rather self-conscious about my cracky, raspy 'mature' voice. It wasn' manly, just.... "womanly," for my age. I was kicked out of the "high-notes," in a feminine-singing groups. All the female humanoids were altos, I just stuck to instruments. Flutes, clarinets, pianos... in all my awakward nerdiness.

I was in sport(s) when I were younger; golf, gymnastics, tennis, cheer, skating - so I always had a toned-body. I outran all the girls in gym class; & took an interest in track (&) disengaged due to the cliche-y feel. I never liked changing in gym with the other female-humanoid(s); I did not want them looking at me. I changed in a corner with one another chick. It didn't help my case; however, of not appearing so tomboyish.. but it were the only thing working for me at 14. I took a swing. I was a tomboy; (&) not attractive. Not to myself, anyhow. Many female-humanoids wore heels to school; I just wore sneaker(s) and hoodies. Boring ponytails for myself. Cargo-pants. Men's jackets. All the girl(s) would whisper / giggle in the hallway as I passed. I knew what they were making fun off - I looked like a boy. That was the main gossip about myself. I was rather androgynous looking. 

"_Girl or boy?_" they would whisper. In a way, I was doing it on purpose. I did not want to be attractive; much. Still unattractive.

In 10th grade; I had the "emo/punk," phase in a way. Hot Topic was a thing. Band tees, studded belts.. anorexic; eating disorders, still ugly. Towards the end; I was going into another transition - from "emo," into preppy sweaters. I was unattractive, I felt.

In 11th grade, I took a total 360. I got sick of it (&) started wearing more ISTP-y 'feminine' attire but kept a tomboyish/masculinish demeanor. I found light-makeup; (&) took a greater interest in aesthetics. I got made fun of for looking "over-dressed," at school. Like, why are you dressed like that? It's just school. I did not care. I wore small heels, fire-red peacoats. Long, raven curls. Black leather jackets, black heels or black motor boots, bright red lipstick. I loved that they clicked when I walked the halls. I talked to no one but (1)-friend. The stereotypical Grease "bad boy," look however gender-switched. No one messed with me. I lost a lot of my baby-face fat (&) my cheekbones became more apparent. I felt better, however not attractive.

In 12th grade - I had all my credit(s) and got lazy again - (&) did not much anything but wear hoodies (&) sneakers with make-up. Did not feel attractive; nor ugly really. Just ready to leave. 

Entering college - I took "another," spin. I became even more feminine. I became engrossed in black. Fashion. I grew into all my feature(s). Specimens commented on my cheek dimple I hated; that I am now happy to have. I have decent cheekbones; with sufficiently nice lips. A healthy metobolism, so my body looks great in almost anything. My teeth are straight. Not much to complain about.


At this time... regarding my 'perceptions' of appearance, I do not feel that I am ugly as I did when I were younger; I have also grown into my voice. That is all I have to say about that.


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## Nephandus (May 16, 2017)

I went from being called Lurch as a kid to Loony Toons as a teen, BUT I was apparently regarded as a rather singular being with unusual amount of attention for a non-interacting person. By community college, I was a marine and/or a serial killer. In uni, I was a serial killer in half my classes, army grunt to some chicks, or creepy bastard to the Indians that tracked my facebook. Cops seem to find my proximity offensive, so they perceived an equal or greater threat, which clashed with their sense of violent authoritay. Submissive gay dudes seemed to respond positively to much the same image. Most women were dismissive to snooty. Considering how many pulled sexuality out of the blue, when seeking an excuse for offense, I'm guessing plenty found me as arousing as intimidating. Now, I'm smaller and older, so other than fat chicks and grannies, I'm apparently just slightly reviled or willfully ignored.

Otherwise, I'm not gay, so I have no direct experience of my potential attractiveness.


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## changos (Nov 21, 2011)

Wellsy said:


> How has your self perception of your attractiveness changed over time?


I used to be insecure, the average story of any adolescent. Over time I just stopped caring, the benefits of becoming an adult. In the middle, while I was a bit insecure noticed how talking, behavior, etc makes you attractive, in more ways than just looks. Still I just stopped caring. Surprise for me: over the years I get more and more people telling me how attractive I am (I disagree, hard to believe). There is still something in my self perception: I'm 1.90 mts tall, most people in my area are 1.75 tops, 1.60 average, I usually forget the difference but they don't.



Wellsy said:


> Like if you were someone in high school who had really bad acne, wore braces but come adulthood your face has cleared up, got a 10/10 smile. Your self concept likely hasn't changed significantly unless there has been immense change in how you're not treated on the basis of the looks perhaps which cause you to reevaluate.


My smile is not my favorite, I get people telling me is nice, pretty, and sexy... WTF I even feel bad when I'm told about this (women) men? we all are ugly to each other. Still it doesn't matter how much they tell me this I feel the same. My sister had braces, I didn't, and no to me my smile is not 10/10.



Wellsy said:


> Maybe you developed early and so you got a lot of attention and this caused you to feel comfortable in your looks or maybe cover up more, trying to downplay them.


Manly voice here, verbal skills of 26 when I was 16 (measured, I took several tests, I'm native spanish speaker) and got big fast, tall. So I had older women flirting, I felt weird. Then the magic genes of my family hit: we don't age as fast, so I'm 39 but look younger, like 33 



Wellsy said:


> you got a lot of attention and this caused you to feel comfortable in your looks or maybe cover up more, trying to downplay them


Some people are free, they feel free and pretty. While I was a free beast (outdoors and risky sports) socially and in family always felt like the hard working sheep, things were not so easy in my family so while everybody was out flirting I was concerned about many things, taking a more adult role. Yes I get attention today but what I just explained didn't stop, like an old soul. TODAY is way different than in the past, women are more free and perhaps aggressive, and gay culture is more open, so I often get looks, more than in the past, that's new to me, social stuff changed but just like someone said on another thread (regarding becoming big and then thin again) I feel the same way inside. I have noticed other people who become more attractive over the years or instantly on another country, they changed: FAST, I didn't, and sometimes this sounds cool to me, other times it sucks.


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## yentipeee (Jun 19, 2013)

I'm lanky 6'3”, American women like my “voice and mischievous smile”, but I think they're just turned on by European accents. I've had the same weight since I was 18, but I worry about gaining weight. If my belt feels tight I have this fear that I won't fit in my clothes anymore, and that I'd have to throw away all my favorite jeans and go out and buy fat-people clothes. I've always had a hard time finding pants with 36” inseam, and I hate shopping so the thought of trawling big-n-fat stores is scary.


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## Caveman Dreams (Nov 3, 2015)

Nephandus said:


> I went from being called Lurch as a kid to Loony Toons as a teen, BUT I was apparently regarded as a rather singular being with unusual amount of attention for a non-interacting person. By community college, I was a marine and/or a serial killer. In uni, I was a serial killer in half my classes, army grunt to some chicks, or creepy bastard to the Indians that tracked my facebook. Cops seem to find my proximity offensive, so they perceived an equal or greater threat, which clashed with their sense of violent authoritay. Submissive gay dudes seemed to respond positively to much the same image. Most women were dismissive to snooty. Considering how many pulled sexuality out of the blue, when seeking an excuse for offense, I'm guessing plenty found me as arousing as intimidating. Now, I'm smaller and older, so other than fat chicks and grannies, I'm apparently just slightly reviled or willfully ignored.
> 
> Otherwise, I'm not gay, so I have no direct experience of my potential attractiveness.


Lurch is an awesome nickname.
I had it until I was about 17.


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## incision (May 23, 2010)

Haven't really thought about it in terms of age related increase/decrease in attractiveness. In my mind's eye which I consider to be reasonably realistic, my perception of self remains moderately above average.


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## Caveman Dreams (Nov 3, 2015)

Sensational said:


> I went from hot/sexy generally speaking at ages 16-30ish
> to a shift of
> 'Cute' or 'Pretty' 30+
> 
> These are both personal opinion of myself as well as labels I seen shift


This is not aimed at you, but you bought something to my mind.

Thanks to the wonders of FB I have been able to see how some of the people who went to the same school as me have aged.

Funnily the ones who were super popular seem to have aged the worst.
Quite a few of the rejects or misfits (myself included) seem to have gotten better with age. 
I even saw one of my school crushes and all I could think was "Damn she looks like an old lady now".


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## Wolf (Mar 20, 2016)

I guess I was a pretty average looking kid growing up, some people thought I was cute.

In high school I was a little insecure about my looks but I seemed to get a lot of random attention.

Towards the end of high school I had encountered some unavoidable health issues and I lost a bunch of weight which definitely lowered my self-esteem. I think that's why I wasn't being noticed as frequently, because honestly, I probably didn't look much worse.

Nowadays I don't know what to think, I have some good features and a few that could be better in my eyes. I'm still pretty skinny and it's extremely difficult for me to gain weight back though which bothers me a little. All in all, I'm not really sure how I'm perceived. I've posted some pictures on this site... I know some people are bound to think I'm attractive, and vice-versa.


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## fieryelf (Mar 28, 2016)

The way I perceive myself physically has changed tremendously in the past couple years. There was a thread somewhere around here that asked "Do you find yourself attractive" a couple years ago and my answer back then was "I dunno 0_o" I used to be bullied heavily back when I was in high school and I never really saw myself as anything special. Because of that I wasn't taking care of my appearance as much as I should have, I wasn't wearing nice clothes, I wasn't grooming very well. Out of 10 I would've given myself a 5 really.

Nowadays I'll tell you I look damn good compared to most people, I put on muscle mass, I put quite a bit of money in my wardrobe, I grew a short beard, I throw gel in my hairs. Didn't change much to my situation with women but at least I'm happy with myself.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

Caveman Dreams said:


> This is not aimed at you, but you bought something to my mind.
> 
> Thanks to the wonders of FB I have been able to see how some of the people who went to the same school as me have aged.
> 
> ...


Really?

I don't personally take that any which way. I don't think when people see me they think I have dramatically increased or decreased (stayed moderate overall). Granted I was sort of/ kind of, 'popular' I was not in that direct 'in crowd' exclusive I was just more of a mixer. I think possibly as far as topic I should have said my image changed more so than that I look drastically different.

I can see why that brought that to mind though. My experiences have been very mixed all the way around with that stuff. I have come across some people who look the same or close ball park, a few that got hotter, and a lot who aged terribly.

It could be 'we' notice those who were in the 'in crowd' more so when they end up looking shitty if it's a giant shift vs if we would notice some others as much, shrugs maybe


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## Nephandus (May 16, 2017)

Caveman Dreams said:


> Lurch is an awesome nickname.
> I had it until I was about 17.


BOTH Lurch and Looney Toons were hung on me by my second crush. Our biggest class was about a dozen people in 3 grade levels, ignoring when we dropped official grade levels. Most of us were in kindergarten (or the contemporary pre-Ks) together, so it was a long monotonous drag. Lurch was usually coached as a reference to my size and strength, but, by the time Looney Toons caught on, they'd accepted that I wasn't going to assault them, so it was just a slam for the freak. I dropped out at 14. Of course, that was due to not being allowed to progress academically and the new demerit system being damn near used to falsely expel me. Tiny Tim, the principal, didn't like any of us big guys either. Neither did the room "supervisor" who couldn't teach and no longer pretended. Fun times. Community college required waiting till 24 for "independent status", so there's a decade gap. Most of the most beautiful chicks that ever eyed me, much less approached me, showed up in that gap, where I could do absolutely nothing about it.:crazy:



Caveman Dreams said:


> Thanks to the wonders of FB I have been able to see how some of the people who went to the same school as me have aged.
> 
> Funnily the ones who were super popular seem to have aged the worst.
> Quite a few of the rejects or misfits (myself included) seem to have gotten better with age.
> I even saw one of my school crushes and all I could think was "Damn she looks like an old lady now".


They're all old now, but none improved. The betterish ones were a couple of the cuter ones. Hell, that crush I mentioned has a boytoy almost half our age. The only apparently cute one remaining though turned out to be a profile pic of her daughter. Wondered how a couple decades had missed her that completely.


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## succubus (Dec 5, 2012)

I'm Jaba the Hutt 4 lyfe~


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## marybluesky (Apr 23, 2012)

In my teen years I didn't pay ANY attention to my looks. It is weird, I know. Maybe has something to do with me being a philosophical teen INTP. Then I tried to groom myself better around 18-20. 
That said, I hardly ever had any problems with my look. Others haven't considered myself as attractive as I didmy self, though: I haven't been sought after by many guys.


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## atamagasuita (May 15, 2016)

Well, i was a tomboy when i was younger. XD so i don't really care about my looks. But i find myself cute hahaha xD 

Now, i developed boobs and butt so i guess i somehow feel like I'm a woman now.. Because before i feel like I'm just a dude xD 

But feeling like a woman makes me more horny when i was a teen, I'm not that even horny at all. Like below 18yo.. I'm just curious like i ask about sex and read about sex but then i was still a virgin that time.

The moment i became more sexual when i became a woman or when i had sex probably. 

Because sex is addicting i think. I never knew that having a long hard object on your tight wet pussy can feel so good.

So, there. But i think my perception on myself didn't change i think. Probably i just gave more dgaf now about my appearance because when i was a teen i used to be awkward because it's puberty.. I didn't know I'm a girl hahahahahaahhaha. XD 
Now i finally understood that I'm a woman.. So there.. More on understanding yourself and loving yourself better.

I love myself better now i think. XD

Because before i don't know what the fuck is happening to my body... So it's awkward for me........... Real awkward. XD


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## atamagasuita (May 15, 2016)

Caveman Dreams said:


> This is not aimed at you, but you bought something to my mind.
> 
> Thanks to the wonders of FB I have been able to see how some of the people who went to the same school as me have aged.
> 
> ...


True. Saw some of the hot girl's pictures now.. They look like old lady..


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## 00Hikaru00 (Jul 28, 2017)

I didn't change much. School friends who see me now say that I look very much the same. Used to be underweight when I was a teen (family genes). In fact, I'm still a little underweight (lol) but I put on a few kgs over the years and look healthier now. I used to be very tanned from all the weekly swimming but after I started working I became a few shades lighter due to long hours indoors. I still tan easily though.

People have told me I looked cute and pretty since young but somehow I didn't like my appearance. I think it's due to low self-esteem. I think I only became confident of my looks after I became an adult.


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