# So smart you make others uncomfortable



## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

How many NTs have this as a problem?


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## Madman (Aug 7, 2012)

I have never been called smart, or intelligent so this problem does not apply to me. Also I am not very good at introspection, so I am unable to make an adequate assessment of my own intelligence. How do you know that they are uncomfortable because of your level of intelligence? Have they told you that is why they are uncomfortable?


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

Saying something you think to be easy to understand only to have other people asking what you mean. Then you have to explain what you mean in simpler terms, which more often than not takes more time than the initial statement.

It gets tiring really fast. So much so that I stop talking about relatively difficult subjects. And since those subjects are the majority of my interests, I tend to stop talking to people on a deeper level.

Isolation through intelligence.

And you can't talk to people about it because they don't understand.

I'm sad now...


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Madman said:


> I have never been called smart, or intelligent so this problem does not apply to me. Also I am not very good at introspection, so I am unable to make an adequate assessment of my own intelligence. How do you know that they are uncomfortable because of your level of intelligence? Have they told you that is why they are uncomfortable?


No. It's just whenever I open my mouth about something intellectual people seem to get awkward and defensive. It's gotten annoying, getting called arrogant or weird by classmates every time I happen to be reading a novel in Japanese during lunch or watching a documentary on megfauna after school. My English teacher, the first week of my senior year, told me, "Don't think that just because your smart and have fantastic writing skills that the rules don't apply to you." As if I was defying him... I'm not a rebellious kid, rather shy and disorganized actually, but this isn't the first time this has happened to me, it's just the first time that it's happened to me in front of the class before. Each year, virtually all of my teachers tell me that I'm an arrogant genius. It upsets me because I'm not trying to be. Also, being a girl, it's not only authority figures that I have to deal with, but other catty girls and 'sensitive' guys that like me and want to dumb me down because they feel inferior. 

Really, I don't get it. What's so wrong about being smart? Never in my life have I felt intimidated by smart people, only fascinated. They give me an opportunity to learn and grow as a person... Isn't that what everyone wants? Isn't that what we're all striving for?


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## starscream430 (Jan 14, 2014)

Not really...

To be honest, I don't consider myself that smart, though I apparently look the part because I'm quite stoic in real life...and can write decently well :frustrating:. I'm willing to consider myself hard-working, but there are much smarter people than me among my peers...


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

starscream430 said:


> Not really...
> 
> To be honest, I don't consider myself that smart, though I apparently look the part because I'm quite stoic in real life...and can write decently well :frustrating:. I'm willing to consider myself hard-working, but there are much smarter people than me among my peers...


Well, that's the thing. Intelligence isn't something that can be effectively quantified. I honestly don't think I'm that smart either, that's just what I've been told for majority of my life. This week the guy that sits next to me in art class said, "Aren't you like, super smart though?" for the second time to me... I got flustered and responded with, "What makes you think that?" He explained that he could hear it in my voice, the way I spoke, the words I used. I still seriously don't think I'm all that intelligent, rather I think I'm victimized for being intelligent because I'm more curious than most people.


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## with water (Aug 13, 2014)

Not an NT, but I get stupid comments all the time about how smart or insightful I am.


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## Doktorin Zylinder (May 10, 2015)

Join the club. 

I'm going to echo what @Stickman said in regards to the fact that having to explain things to people who don't care being very tiresome and getting there very quickly. I don't see the point in speaking to someone who has no knowledge nor background on a subject and having to get them crash courses in several topics just to answer their simpleminded questions. You get what I give you; do with it what you will. It's so much easier not to talk to people. Mind you, they're still going to be annoyed with you because you don't talk and pander to them. You can't please them. These are the type of people who will call you pretentious without knowing its meaning. They feel inferior, ergo you get picked on. 

Unlike you, I was well liked by most of my teachers for some reason unbeknownst to me. I was also allowed to skirt the rules quite often. I barely spoke to my classmates. We had nothing in common. It was pointless in my mind and probably in theirs, as well. Having been scooped up by a university at the age of fifteen didn't exactly give me a lot of time to socialize with people in my age group, anyhow. My professors hated me, blatantly, as did some of my classmates. It is assumed that intelligence comes with age when that is not always the case. Just because I won the intelligence lottery doesn't mean that I should be shunned for it. I was quite isolated for a very long time, nearly a decade. Having other issues didn't help, either. My father used to ask me if I'd ever come in contact with anyone smarter than myself. The answer was, and still is, no. 

It seems to me that a lot of people think of those with great intelligence to be not deserving of it. Why can't they have it instead or why can't we just raise everyone's a little? There will always be people who want to bring you down. Don't let them. Ignore them or interact with the minimum amount required. It's not worth being someone other than yourself for the sake of others. It puts undue stress on you and your life to your detriment, and those outside will never be pleased; they always want more.


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## ChrisTeam (Apr 17, 2013)

Smart, as in high IQ, doesn't make people uncomfortable. If people are pretentious, condescending or patronizing, then sure others get uncomfortable very fast (which isn't surprising). I find myself in a room where I know most about a particular subject sometimes but I think it's great responsibility to distribute knowledge and break complicated things down so everyone can easily digest them. And you can get people up to speed quickly and then they can participate and add to the topic at hand.

And when I'm not the one in the room with the most knowledge I usually soak up all information I can and look at the topic form any angle. And I usually grasp things quickly and can join a discussion in little time.

Am I very smart? Not neccessarily. I won't rule it out because I'm vain that way, but I haven't really tested for it. So I don't know, might be average. I think we ENTP are very well suited to grasp the big picture and important aspects of things and can easily look at them from any direction. So we get a good sense of the thing in little time. Doesn't mean we're smart, just means our brains are wired that way in a sense and that can be quite handy 

I've been known to get a room of drunk people immersed in some abstract intellectual discussions at 3 am in the morning and I even feel a little bit proud about that.


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## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

RestlessCryptid said:


> How many NTs have this as a problem?


I only get such remarks - rather snide, in nature - or _passive aggressive_, online; as if I am purposely talking down to / trying to harm these individuals. This no such thing - nor superiority complex whatsoever, I only understand such reactions are results of underlying insecurities within oneself (re: inaccurate assumptions / misconceptions) - usually emotionally fueled; thus have no direct involvement with myself.

Some individuals, seem to irrationally think, _just being yourself_ - is an *attack* on their persona; thus you must adjust yourself - to be more ''suitable'' for them. I don't think so.

Any scenario offline, I cannot pinpoint a time when someone has directly told me it makes them '_uncomfortable_' - however, I had an extremely smart mouth - and high tendency to _talk back_ or question the accuracy of one's authority. 

My mother would go...

''_Sweetie,_ - you need to learn how to tone yourself down; as many people will interpret you as being defiant - disobedient / rude, et al.'' I just wanted to make sense of things, wanting direct, solid answers - REASONS. ''Because I say so'' - ain't going to fly but so far with me in this regard if it not demonstrated how it is rational.

These circumstances, in formal scenario's, where it is inappropriate to question the 'boss' - however, I find such situations illogical + irrational for me to _comply_ to if they simply make no sense. 

(Ex: A) --> What kind of _fool_ would submit to _foolishness_ to fit in with the fools? I ended up withdrawing from that situation, thus loosing a lot of benefits when I did.

The only other occurrence, I could think of, is possibly in my class settings where I am the only one questioning lectures + asking / answering questions of said lectures; or perhaps, talking to the point + exaggerating where I must get *cut-off*. People are usually respectfully quiet in this time of interrogation for anyone, so it is hard to determine such formulated opinions one may hold of me.

I would like to think I am rather respectful in my persona - should said person give me the equal amount of willingness to compromise. I understand in person, I am calm, cool and collected - and, as an understanding of myself, and don't turn my nose up to the air - there is no need to flaunt anything aggressively.


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## starscream430 (Jan 14, 2014)

RestlessCryptid said:


> Well, that's the thing. Intelligence isn't something that can be effectively quantified. I honestly don't think I'm that smart either, that's just what I've been told for majority of my life. This week the guy that sits next to me in art class said, "Aren't you like, super smart though?" for the second time to me... I got flustered and responded with, "What makes you think that?" He explained that he could hear it in my voice, the way I spoke, the words I used. I still seriously don't think I'm all that intelligent, rather I think I'm victimized for being intelligent because I'm more curious than most people.


That sounds like my situation as well. People think I'm smart because I speak properly, write well, and tend not to make a fool of myself in public. That being said, I do consider that a liability since people then expect more from me since I'm supposedly "smart."


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Cagnazzo said:


> Not an NT, but I get stupid comments all the time about how smart or insightful I am.


ENFPs are ridiculously smart though. My best friend is an ENFP... I would argue that she's one of the smartest people I've ever met.


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## Sonderous (May 29, 2015)

Maybe in a way. I got a ton of negative reception when I was really dejected about getting 2310 on the SAT because it was significantly lower than what I thought I was capable of (I also lost 30 points for forgetting to answer a question that I knew the answer to, but even with that I would not have been really happy).

In the past, I was definitely resented for my supposed intelligence because I tended to be very condescending about it and because I valued intelligence above all else. Currently, that is not an issue. I behave more casually now than I did before, and I have found that there are things just as important as (if not more important than) intelligence. Also, talking about my intelligence feels kind of wrong to me now, because I do not believe that I am necessarily intelligent. Or at least, I know that there are people more intelligent than me in the world, and I am personally more inclined to measure myself against them. I may be big fish in the small pond of my immediate community, but there is probably a pond somewhere in which I would be one of the smallest fish, so I do not think that I am actually a big fish at all. If that makes sense...

But I am not an NT.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Doktorin Zylinder said:


> Join the club.
> 
> I'm going to echo what @Stickman said in regards to the fact that having to explain things to people who don't care being very tiresome and getting there very quickly. I don't see the point in speaking to someone who has no knowledge nor background on a subject and having to get them crash courses in several topics just to answer their simpleminded questions. You get what I give you; do with it what you will. It's so much easier not to talk to people. Mind you, they're still going to be annoyed with you because you don't talk and pander to them. You can't please them. These are the type of people who will call you pretentious without knowing its meaning. They feel inferior, ergo you get picked on.
> 
> ...


Sounds like you have the same problem I have. My gosh, I wish I knew someone like you in real life x) Also, my teachers do like me, love me even---it's more like a love-hate relationship. They can't hate me because the work I do is so high-quality, but I never turn anything in on time so they get frustrated. See, the right hemisphere of my brain works about ten times faster than the left side, so I understand complex knowledge accordingly ten times faster than normal people but it's very difficult for me to apply it. I'm too impatient. (getting therapy for this right now, it's been proven on EEG scans) 

I agree with you that people shouldn't be punished for being smart. It's the same thing with money. People think the well off individuals somehow just magically have money, but they don't. They work hard for it. NTs are just more curious than most other typings.. I certainly didn't wake up knowing all the things that I do... I'm just always learning.


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## 66393 (Oct 17, 2013)

I've been accused of this plenty of times. My accusers will rue the day when they meet _actual_ smart people. lolz.


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## Who (Jan 2, 2010)

@_ChrisTeam_ kind of said what I was going to, if a little more bluntly.

If you'll forgive me for leaping to conclusions, I will say that I've seen similar complaints before about people being "too smart" for other people. Of course it's always other people's fault for not being smart enough and not the fault of the person complaining's social skills.

Most people are not put off by intelligence in and of itself. However, there are some people who are undeniably intellectually gifted, but express themselves in a way that others see as showy or pretentious. The best way to not be "too smart for other people" is to make yourself relatable to others. This does not entail dumbing yourself down; on the contrary, it sort of challenges others to get on your level, so to speak. Being a stereotypical ENTP, I tend to do this through humor. A lot of people seem to think I'm funny and I've found people don't mind a little intellectual stimulation if you can make them laugh along the way. It's pretty neat - it's like you can trick people into thinking!

Of course, don't force yourself to crack jokes if it doesn't come natural to you. Still, you have to find a way to get people to find you and/or the subject matter interesting before they care for more intellectual-oriented conversation.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Who said:


> @_ChrisTeam_ Being a stereotypical ENTP, I tend to do this through humor. A lot of people seem to think I'm funny and I've found people don't mind a little intellectual stimulation if you can make them laugh along the way. It's pretty neat - it's like you can trick people into thinking!
> 
> Of course, don't force yourself to crack jokes if it doesn't come natural to you. Still, you have to find a way to get people to find you and/or the subject matter interesting before they care for more intellectual-oriented conversation.


So much like an ENTP... They're hilarious. We have one in my class and he's always cracking jokes in a very witty, sarcastic way. Since I'm INTP, I'll join in or trigger him a lot, but I have to be in the right _mood_ for it. The other day I hadn't slept all that much so I yelled something about beating kids with a black rod of justice in class and that definitely sparked some tomfoolery from him. He began with, "How does one acquire a black rod of justice?" and the game between ENTP and my short-temped religion teacher commenced. A male INTJ friend and I helped of course... I love those guys.


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


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## Sonderous (May 29, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


This is an important point, in my opinion. I feel like an intelligent enough person should know how to explain things to others without going over their heads. An intelligent person should also understand that sounding intelligent is significantly less important than being understandable.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Yes, some people, the majority tend to be a bit "rude" towards naturally intelligent people. I would have never thought I am smarter than some if I wasn't told so by different people throughout my life. However, the biggest challenge for me was to understand that instead of growing ears I should be growing alongside those same people.....I should also try to understand them too because certainly I admire some of their abilities as much as they are jealous of mine. No one has it all....
It's one human race, one universe and everything is related. So let's stop gloating and boasting but do something about making people understand each other and work for each other, not against.


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## Danse Macabre (Oct 30, 2009)

I think that if someone is intimidated by your intelligence, that says more about their insecurity than it does your intelligence. 



Neverontime said:


> The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


Exactly.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


First of all I have to say your reasoning sounds nice at first glance....And I've heard it before many times....

"The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable"- *are you talking about "God"?.....*

"They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood."- *poor us mortals that are not like this "intelligent" person and feel misunderstood all the time......no matter how well we explain, no one seems to listen....
*

"They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with. " -*So they know that they are intelligent.....sounds a bit the lines of the posts in this thread so far...Quiet but extreme confidence, even worse as it's a narrow road from there thinking that you know it all....*


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

IENTP said:


> First of all I have to say your reasoning sounds nice at first glance....And I've heard it before many times....
> 
> "The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable"- *are you talking about "God"?.....*
> 
> ...


Huh? God?



I don't have a clue what you're talking about. Perhaps you could 'dumb down' your response so I can understand it.


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## The Thinking Teen (Nov 21, 2015)

Stickman said:


> Saying something you think to be easy to understand only to have other people asking what you mean. Then you have to explain what you mean in simpler terms, which more often than not takes more time than the initial statement.
> 
> It gets tiring really fast. So much so that I stop talking about relatively difficult subjects. And since those subjects are the majority of my interests, I tend to stop talking to people on a deeper level.
> 
> ...


I think that's why Jane at school won't talk to me.


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## Alpha_Orionis (Jan 18, 2015)

This will sound arrogant, but there was a number of times when people said that they feel stupid when they are around me, and they compliment me on my intelligence. I find that to be flattering. But, i am not really very smart. I just know lots of trivia because i read a lot and i never speak about something that i am not an expert in. That is about it.


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## adultchildofalieninvaders (Aug 29, 2014)

Neverontime said:


> The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


Thank you, this.

Another thought: if you think you're the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room. Or full of yourself. Intellect is a pointless ego wank unless you can use yours in a meaningful way.

I used to go out drinking with grad students from the physics/math department of our local Uni a lot, and the one thing that struck me was how funny, pragmatic and entertaining they tended to be, not at all obsessed about how they were perceived by others. Probably because they had nothing to prove. The drunken rambles about injection locking... oh man. Good times.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> Huh? God?
> 
> 
> 
> I don't have a clue what you're talking about. Perhaps you could 'dumb down' your response so I can understand it.


You were trying to say in my opinion(correct me if I am wrong) that bragging about being intelligent is not being intelligent or smart enough, i.e only dumb people need recognition. Intelligent people try to dumb themselves down to make others feel comfortable apparently... 
My opinion is that your quote is contradictory because in order for one to hide they are intelligent they should hide who they are all the time, e.g. they should avoid explaining things to others as it's a form of bragging some don't like.

Intelligence comes from within. People around your every day life would notice it and it can make certain other people uncomfortable. An intelligent person would have evaluated everything around them eventually as they grow and would figure out they may be more intelligent than the average person. It's part of the thinking process. Having the bravery of admitting it to others is difficult in itself because people perceive this as bragging. But others don't understand the heavy burden of pretending in order to be accepted. 
I doubted that the majority of people who posted here go out in the real world and shout out loud how smart they are. There are different forms of intelligence and all people are intelligent in their own way but there's a form of intelligence that appeals to others the most, similar to physical beauty. And as noted already by posters, it gets noticed, others keep telling them how smart they are... In my opinion, it is extremely annoying being told you are smart or perceived as smarter than others because within yourself you know it makes no difference to anything at all. People tend to track your failures and successes to prove eventually that you aren't as smart as you thought or they thought you are. 

You become a yardstick. And that person that you are describing in your previous quote is your personal yardstick you measure yourself or others against. Keep in mind that this person may get fed up eventually of keeping up with the expectations you have for them. Making all other people feel comfortable all the time is a heavy burden to carry.


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## Purrfessor (Jul 30, 2013)

I'm confused about your teachers. For me, I don't do homework and I never liked to participate in presentations. I never studied and I had poor attendance. You would think a teacher wouldn't like me then right? Wrong. Teachers loved me. You know why? Because I actually paid attention in class. All you have to do is listen to teachers. I got 90-100% on every test and passed all my classes strictly through tests while ignoring everything else about my grades. All I did was listen. It sounds simple... But it's rare to see a kid with that level of attentiveness and focus and auditory understanding. And that's why teachers really appreciated me. Even though I never followed rules. In my experience, teachers were on my side. Especially the math ones. 

Your problem may be either a) your gender or b) shitty teachers. But don't let that stop you from pursuing your mind.


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

IENTP said:


> You were trying to say in my opinion(correct me if I am wrong) that bragging about being intelligent is not being intelligent or smart enough, i.e only dumb people need recognition. Intelligent people try to dumb themselves down to make others feel comfortable apparently...
> My opinion is that your quote is contradictory because in order for one to hide they are intelligent they should hide who they are all the time, e.g. they should avoid explaining things to others as it's a form of bragging some don't like.
> 
> Intelligence comes from within. People around your every day life would notice it and it can make certain other people uncomfortable. An intelligent person would have evaluated everything around them eventually as they grow and would figure out they may be more intelligent than the average person. It's part of the thinking process. Having the bravery of admitting it to others is difficult in itself because people perceive this as bragging. But others don't understand the heavy burden of pretending in order to be accepted.
> ...


People don't judge others as arrogant for being intelligent. They judge others as arrogant for being arrogant. Refusing to explain something in a way that others can understand, because 'why should you dumb yourself down?' is arrogant. 
Why would anyone want to communicate without being understood anyway?
It's not about making people feel comfortable, it's about effectively communicating with people. If mutual understanding isn't the purpose of communication, then what's the point of communicating? 
Also, why would others even want to listen to something that's being presented in such a way that they're unable to comprehend it?

If levels of comprehension aren't equal, then the smartest or the most knowledgeable person always has to be the one to adjust the most, in order to express themselves effectively. That's true for everyone, not just for the highly intelligent.
If someone isn't able to do this, then they should be more concerned with learning how to improve their own communication. There are plenty of very intelligent people who are respected for their intelligence. If you are seen as arrogant, find out what it is about you that gives that impression. Blaming it on what you perceive to be other peoples insecurities resulting from their lower intelligence is not a very smart perspective to ignorantly cling to. There's enough objective evidence to the contrary.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

> If levels of comprehension aren't equal, then the smartest or the most knowledgeable person always has to be the one to adjust the most, in order to express themselves effectively. If someone isn't able to do this, then they should be more concerned with learning how to improve their own communication.


 So the most intelligent and knowledgeable person is the one that always has to adjust to others. And this is exactly what happens in reality. The others don't want to adjust to you, you are the one that needs adjusting...and you are being told so every so often...Who's the arrogant one I wonder..


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

IENTP said:


> So the most intelligent and knowledgeable person is the one that always has to adjust to others. And this is exactly what happens in reality. The others don't want to adjust to you, you are the one that needs adjusting...and you are being told so every so often...Who's the arrogant one I wonder..


What's your problem?

Do you want to look at the situation objectively or do you just want your ego stroking?


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> What's your problem?
> 
> Do you want to look at the situation objectively or do you just want your ego stroking?


I've no problem. I am bored perhaps. I don't need ego stroking but I don't need ego destroying either. I am just tired of idealistic demands.


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

IENTP said:


> I've no problem. I am bored perhaps. I don't need ego stroking but I don't need ego destroying either. I am just tired of idealistic demands.


I apologize if what I said was hurtful or offensive, it wasn't my intention.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> I apologize if what I said was hurtful or offensive, it wasn't my intention.


No worries. I didn't take any of this personally. I apologize as well. I hope I didn't offend you. It was just a discussion for me, a difference of opinions.


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

IENTP said:


> So the most intelligent and knowledgeable person is the one that always has to adjust to others. And this is exactly what happens in reality. The others don't want to adjust to you, you are the one that needs adjusting...and you are being told so every so often...Who's the arrogant one I wonder..


The most intelligent person has to adjust, because the less intelligent person can't, because they're less intelligent. Of course you only have to adjust if you want to communicate with that person.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

The sad thing is majority of extremely smart people don't care about reputation and fitting in, they just get annoyed with being ostracized for using the talents they were gifted with. I mean, imagine being a star soccer player and every time you scored a goal someone yelled at you for being an arrogant show off. Genius is simply just another talent that some people were blessed with and it's wrong to make them uncomfortable in their own environment to contemplate for personal insecurities. I mean, there are a lot of things I can't do but I don't go around bashing on the people who are phenomenal at it because I can't. 

Another thing to note is that intelligent people aren't born intelligent. Rather, they're born with an extra dose curiosity in place of the irrational need to impress everyone around them. It's because of this that they go above an beyond what the more shallow people will do simply to gain social acceptance. Honestly, be thankful these people exist. Where do you think your iPhone came from? What about modern medical procedures? Agricultural innovation?


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## Doktorin Zylinder (May 10, 2015)

RestlessCryptid said:


> The sad thing is majority of extremely smart people don't care about reputation and fitting in, they just get annoyed with being ostracized for using the talents they were gifted with. I mean, imagine being a star soccer player and every time you scored a goal someone yelled at you for being an arrogant show off. Genius is simply just another talent that some people were blessed with and it's wrong to make them uncomfortable in their own environment to contemplate for personal insecurities. I mean, there are a lot of things I can't do but I don't go around bashing on the people who are phenomenal at it because I can't.
> 
> Another thing to note is that intelligent people aren't born intelligent. Rather, they're born with an extra dose curiosity in place of the irrational need to impress everyone around them. It's because of this that they go above an beyond what the more shallow people will do simply to gain social acceptance. Honestly, be thankful these people exist. Where do you think your iPhone came from? What about modern medical procedures? Agricultural innovation?


I was ostracized when I was very young, seven. I had figured out I wouldn't do all that well in the social environment two years earlier when I started first grade. I was hated for been intelligent as well as other things. I wasn't allowed to play a lot of the trivia games because I would always win. I was sent to the library, instead, which probably just made the issue worse since I would read. 

I'm also despised in certain professional circles due to my abilities. I get called in to fix things or do research. I've been changing career paths over the last year to get away from consulting, but I still get calls for emergencies and whatnot. I'm not liked; I'm tolerated because I can produce results in a timely fashion and am one of the few people around qualified to do specific things. 

It has been said to me that people don't like you being better than them, with which I am inclined to agree. Not all people, mind you, but a great number. In my experience, people with whom I interact usually ask what I do for a living, look at my clothes, ask where I live, and what I drive so they sum me up and put them in their little mental gauge as to how much better or worse they are than me. If I'm too high above them, I'm seen as a threat and they will be curt with me or outright hostile. I've gotten to the point where I just ask them if all those questions actually matter. They seem taken aback by it, too. People are strange.


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

All my friends think i'm smart, and whenever i'm making a point to persuade them, they all listen so quietly i would've sworn none of them were ever extraverted. (But most of them are just introverts who talk a lot around people they're familiar with.) I don't think i make anybody uncomfortable, but i also don't consider myself that smart. Sure, i'm good at academics, but that doesn't make me smarter than anyone unless you specify what _kind_ of smart you're talking about. I suck at sports, i suck at visual arts, i suck at trying to make people act less condescendingly. But i'm good at using correct grammar and numbers and memorizing stuff and trying to make people _proud_ of their achievements. You can't just say somebody is "smart" or "not smart" based on their IQ. IQ seems to be everyone's definition of intelligence, and it is rather misnomered (it should be something like Academic Ability Quotient), unfortunately.

And please don't assume that just because you're NT, it means you're smart. It just means you like to think about the abstract, and you like to use logic to go along with that. It's not like i've never met a not-very-smart NT.

"INTPs are predicted to perform best on IQ tests," they said.

"I am ESFJ and i got 144 when i was twelve years old so screw all these stereotypes," i said.

Again, IQ doesn't mean you're smart. But IF academic intel is what you're talking about, then yes, i have trouble with what is mentioned in this thread as well, even if i am not NT. Far from it.

Sorry if i sound redundant, if you already know my point. But i just had to vent there ^_^


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## Yasminec19 (Sep 16, 2015)

Lol


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## Yasminec19 (Sep 16, 2015)

You can't be that smart if you didn't learn to communicate your message the right way to the right audience.


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## voron (Jan 19, 2015)

Hmmm. I probably wouldn't say because of being necessarily smart but because of having wide knowledge. I've made people uncomfortable by my knowledge quite often, from my friends to my dad. My dad sometimes may start to try being more knowledgeable and starts to tell me about car technology, which I don't really have that much knowledge on. That's actually a bit funny.


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## Solrac026 (Mar 6, 2012)

Neverontime said:


> The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


I wished my INTJ co-worker would get this point. He has a neurotic need to be known as the smartest person. Symptoms include: always stating things as facts (even though they are really his opinions), answering questions that aren't directed to him, cutting people off as they are talking, and continuing to talk even after the conversation is over.


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## auroraborealis (Nov 27, 2015)

Stickman said:


> The most intelligent person has to adjust, because the less intelligent person can't, because they're less intelligent. Of course you only have to adjust if you want to communicate with that person.


Actually, from a psychological perspective, according to various theories of knowledge and the zone of proximal development, one could argue the case for individuals operating within their respective intellectual levels. Less intelligent people should simply have to educate themselves in order to communicate with those residing at a higher plateau. That doesn't mean this argument should, in fact, be proposed, as in doing so you'd more than likely establish yourself as rather pretentious. And reading through this thread, it's just that--arrogance, pretentiousness, not intellect--which seems to be the actual issue. Personally at least, I believe condescending attitudes toward intellectuals are predominantly rooted in the individual's lack of humility rather than in his/hers/theirs IQ itself. Logical intelligence does not endorse ostentation.


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

auroraborealis said:


> Actually, from a psychological perspective, according to various theories of knowledge and the zone of proximal development, one could argue the case for individuals operating within their respective intellectual levels. Less intelligent people should simply have to educate themselves in order to communicate with those residing at a higher plateau. That doesn't mean this argument should, in fact, be proposed, as in doing so you'd more than likely establish yourself as rather pretentious. And reading through this thread, it's just that--arrogance, pretentiousness, not intellect--which seems to be the actual issue. Personally at least, I believe condescending attitudes toward intellectuals are predominantly rooted in the individual's lack of humility rather than in his/hers/theirs IQ itself. Logical intelligence does not endorse ostentation.


Well said. Neither IQ, nor any other type of socially established "intelligence", causes one to have any difficulty communicating with "less intelligent" people comfortably. It is simply one's grandiosity that is, credibly, the cause and effect of cognitive processes suggesting a sort of bigotry, such as: "I am an NT type, so does any other NT here feel that you're so smart you make other people uncomfortable?" I mean no offense. I apologize for offending anyone with the truth that some are reluctant to acknowledge, the truth that some even regard as something they refuse to capitulate, given their aforementioned bigoted perspective.

However, psychology and philosophy are rather ambiguous, and it would not be too acceptable for me to argue regarding the stages of intelligence. Intelligence, on its own, is just as ambiguous - as previously mentioned, there are certain types of intelligence which society regards as "smart". These usually include anything related to IQ, an admirable collection of worldly knowledge, and maybe the wit found in quick comebacks. An athlete can be a "genius" at his/her sport, but athletes are (unfairly) stereotyped as _not very intelligent_, and so the argument for the meanings of intelligence goes on.

I, personally, feel that intelligence can be defined in many ways, and that there is no point discussing whether one makes another uncomfortable with one's so-called "smartness". Unless we're debating whether a football (soccer) attacker is embarrassing opponents with her/his skilled nutmegs, or a corresponding topic, then honestly, there is no point of this.

And no, you're not blind, in case you're glancing at the space underneath my name - it says ESFJ. I am 100% sure of my type, yet this whole NT-sounding post was typed by me. So to any NTs who still believe their intelligence transcends the comfort zone of others, please stop categorizing intelligence by type as well as thinking you are superior to people you (not very humbly) believe to be unintelligent.

Just a little friendly advice!

Love, Jess roud:


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

@Beatriz - check this out ^^^ re: iNtuitives thinking Sensors are stupid, which we discussed in the stereotypes thread. Enjoy my rant haha :laughing:


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## Beatriz (Oct 18, 2015)

People also tell me I'm smart. At school, I was a big history nerd, so my friends would ask me for help in their history studying, and of course I was very glad to help. I was also good at geography, philosophy, sociology, biology, English and Portuguese (my native language). I remember many times my friends would say "wow, you're so smart!"

But then I woud start doing math, chemistry and physics homework and just... meh. I completely sucked at it, to the point I felt embarrassed of asking others for help on homework, LOL.

My point is: *there are different types of intelligences*. When I talked about history with my friends they would think I was super smart. However, if the subject was chemistry, I was the dumbest person in the room. These people you think are so dumb may be more intelligent than you in other subjects.

I never feel "uncomfortable" when people tell me I'm smart. *I don't believe you should feel bad when people say you're smart, but feel glad they think that way*.

Some people on this thread are really full of themselves though. "Oh I'm so smart, other people are so dumb, no one understands me, poor me for being so smart". I just think that's rather arrogant. You can _always_ learn from others, no matter how smart you think you are.

As for communication, yes I believe that if people don't understand what you say you should find a way to explain it better. You will not " dumb yourself for others". It's simply about learning how to express yourself. You don't go to the doctor and hear him using hard scientific names about the disease you might have; no, he tries to explain it in a way that his patients can understand. Simple as that. If you can't express yourself correctly, maybe improving your communication skills might help. After all, we always have new things to learn.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

> I don't believe you should feel bad when people say you're smart, but feel glad they think that way.


Why? People say things all the time. Should I trust everyone's opinion all the time and feel glad when it flatters me or feel bad when it doesn't?



> You can always learn from others, no matter how smart you think you are.


Which is the truth. No one is too smart.



> As for communication, yes I believe that if people don't understand what you say you should find a way to explain it better. You will not " dumb yourself for others". It's simply about learning how to express yourself. You don't go to the doctor and hear him using hard scientific names about the disease you might have; no, he tries to explain it in a way that his patients can understand. Simple as that. If you can't express yourself correctly, maybe improving your communication skills might help. After all, we always have new things to learn.


Communications skills and ability to express oneself are not necessarily a measure of intelligence or non-intelligence. 
The misunderstanding comes from the different ways of thinking about the same thing or topic. And both sides can feel the other side is either too dumb or too smart for them. Who's the dumb and who's the smart one is a different question. 

Some people like using big words to impress. I didn't mean about this type of misunderstanding. This type of misunderstanding is a language barrier and I know too well about it as I've had to learn three languages. The simplest words have sounded complex to me at certain times in my life but one learns eventually. Better vocabulary, better understanding of language though can in fact improve one's communication ability, rather than make them sound "too smart". If you know the big words, you surely know a couple of other synonyms to use when needed. If you don't, then...you know nothing..
Misunderstanding, however, can come in the simplest of scenarios and unrelated to one's academic or language knowledge.
When I was a kid and we were "discussing" something, even simple things, I was blamed for changing the topic to prove myself right by pointing out unrelated things. As far as I was concerned, I was still strictly on the same topic. And I had to constantly explain myself why A is related to C in a more understandable manner, in order to prove my point, when I had the patience to do it. It became frustrating.
As an adult now, because of eventually learning to explain myself well.... It is a learned ability I reckon..... I can now claim I can explain myself to others. Perhaps I was too dumb and needed more time than others to put my point across. 
However, at the same time, in school and college my friends asked me all the time to explain certain things to them they couldn't catch at classes and lectures. For one or another reason, I was capable again at going from A to C on my own where some of my friends were at B and needed C. So in time you learn you aren't as dumb as you thought and what was considered "irrational" thinking is no longer irrational in the eyes of others. At the same time I learned things from my friends that would have never crossed my mind and I admired them for that. We humans are not all the same but we compliment each other and have different set of abilities no one can encompass in one person. We should respect each other because of that, because we need each other. But we don't always understand each other.


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## Beatriz (Oct 18, 2015)

IENTP said:


> Why? People say things all the time. Should I trust everyone's opinion all the time and feel glad when it flatters me or feel bad when it doesn't?


Why feel bad for being told you're smart? It's a good thing, isn't it? People on here makes it look like being smart it's a bad thing. If you know you're smart, good -- then use your intelligence to do the good for others. It's more useful than sit there and just complain that you're oh so smart.




> Communications skills and ability to express oneself are not necessarily a measure of intelligence or non-intelligence.
> The misunderstanding comes from the different ways of thinking about the same thing or topic. And both sides can feel the other side is either too dumb or too smart for them. Who's the dumb and who's the smart one is a different question.


I agree that people misanderstand each other because of different point of views, after all, everyone thinks differently. The point here is that some people are saying they're misanderstood for being "too smart", implying that others are "not smart enough" to understand them, which I don't believe it's quite the truth, and it's kinda arrogant to think that way.



> As an adult now, because of eventually learning to explain myself well.... It is a learned ability I reckon..... I can now claim I can explain myself to others.


Good for you. My message was directed towards those who claim they can't explain themselves to others. And I think they should try to explain in a way others can understand. I'm not trying to sound rude or anything, it's just an advice.



> At the same time I learned things from my friends that would have never crossed my mind and I admired them for that.


That's good. It's always nice to learn new things from other people. I also love when that happens.



> We humans are not all the same but we compliment each other and have different set of abilities no one can encompass in one person. We should respect each other because of that, because we need each other.


I agree.




> But we don't always understand each other.


That's right, everyone has their own way of thinking.


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## Beatriz (Oct 18, 2015)

Double post -- sorry.


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## Bricolage (Jul 29, 2012)

I notice glazed eyes when I start talking about music theory or Donald Barthelme, so I don't, which is fine. 

It's annoying, though, when people talk about quantum mechanics like it's an unspoken yet indisputable ticket to the "smart" club. I might talk back, without much true enjoyment. 

To be honest, I'm much more interested in consciousness and phenomenology than quantum mechanics. I don't find "objective" facts about the larger universe that compelling.


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

MessyJessie103 said:


> Well said. Neither IQ, nor any other type of socially established "intelligence", causes one to have any difficulty communicating with "less intelligent" people comfortably.


Except of course of you're using terminoligy that the other isn't familiar with even though you use it all the time. This means that in order to accurately convey your meaning, you have to either choose a different word or explain the meaning of the term you use. This interrupts the conversation and distracts from the actual point you were trying to make. That's pretty uncomfortable.

Or when you make a joke that relies on the other's ability to make the connections and then when they don't, they don't understand the joke. Then you look like the idiot who doesn't make sense. That's also pretty uncomfortable.

So really, sometimes it can be uncomfortable to communicate with someone who doesn't understand you(and that is more likely to happen with someone that's less intelligent).


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

Stickman said:


> Except of course of you're using terminoligy that the other isn't familiar with even though you use it all the time. This means that in order to accurately convey your meaning, you have to either choose a different word or explain the meaning of the term you use. This interrupts the conversation and distracts from the actual point you were trying to make. That's pretty uncomfortable.
> 
> Or when you make a joke that relies on the other's ability to make the connections and then when they don't, they don't understand the joke. Then you look like the idiot who doesn't make sense. That's also pretty uncomfortable.
> 
> So really, sometimes it can be uncomfortable to communicate with someone who doesn't understand you(and that is more likely to happen with someone that's less intelligent).


It depends on how you define "uncomfortable". Some people may not find it that troublesome to have to explain their vocab, or their jokes, because sometimes those have to be explained, no matter how "smart" you are. Maybe you feel like you're doing it often and it bothers you, but tolerance is different for every person. I can't stand it when people criticize my friends, but explaining things over and over again is nothing. (I am bilingual and have been translating for many newcomers at our school over thhe past few years, and that takes/has taken more explaining than my 8-year-old self could've possibly imagined.)

It definitely defines on your personal level of tolerance, because in my group of friends and acquaintances, we are happy to laugh at ourselves when we look like we don't make sense. We try not to make complicated jokes in front of the entire class, so we know our comfort limits well and use them to our own benefits - who doesn't like to laugh at themselves making a small mistake with only their friends around? Well, okay, maybe that's just my opinion. But honestly, it all depends.

I personally feel uncomfortable discussing the topic of intelligence. I hate judging people, and am more likely to compliment/criticize others in certain areas rather than just claim that somebody is smart or not smart. But everybody is at least a little intelligent in something, and based on their comfort zones, there are times when EVERYBODY has caused some sort of misunderstanding this way.

So what is this thread stating? That NTs are more likely to feel uncomfortable in those moments that everybody has? That NTs are more likely to be intelligent in the department of knowledge and joking? I don't really get this...


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

MessyJessie103 said:


> It depends on how you define "uncomfortable". Some people may not find it that troublesome to have to explain their vocab, or their jokes, because sometimes those have to be explained, no matter how "smart" you are. Maybe you feel like you're doing it often and it bothers you, but tolerance is different for every person. I can't stand it when people criticize my friends, but explaining things over and over again is nothing. (I am bilingual and have been translating for many newcomers at our school over thhe past few years, and that takes/has taken more explaining than my 8-year-old self could've possibly imagined.)
> 
> It definitely defines on your personal level of tolerance, because in my group of friends and acquaintances, we are happy to laugh at ourselves when we look like we don't make sense. We try not to make complicated jokes in front of the entire class, so we know our comfort limits well and use them to our own benefits - who doesn't like to laugh at themselves making a small mistake with only their friends around? Well, okay, maybe that's just my opinion. But honestly, it all depends.
> 
> ...


I don't think this thread is about NT's specifically. It just asks in what way communicating with someone less intelligent causes you to be uncomfortable.

Also note that 'less intelligent' doesn't mean 'not intelligent'.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

MessyJessie103 said:


> And please don't assume that just because you're NT, it means you're smart. It just means you like to think about the abstract, and you like to use logic to go along with that. It's not like i've never met a not-very-smart NT.
> 
> "INTPs are predicted to perform best on IQ tests," they said.
> 
> ...


My sister is and ESFJ and she's the same way. Genius IQ, witty sense of humor, outstanding grades in school. My point is, I don't think type has to do much with intelligence, you can be smart with any type, it's just NTs tend to follow more intellectual pursuits by nature.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Stickman said:


> I don't think this thread is about NT's specifically. It just asks in what way communicating with someone less intelligent causes you to be uncomfortable.
> 
> Also note that 'less intelligent' doesn't mean 'not intelligent'.


No. It has to do with anyone really. I just know several NTs who have this problem, so I decided to post it here versus just the INTP forum where I usually post things... More people would see it.


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## peter pettishrooms (Apr 20, 2015)

I don't wear glasses so no, I don't look smart. I look like that stuck up bitch on the streets that uses my stilettos as weapons.


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

RestlessCryptid said:


> Another thing to note is that intelligent people aren't born intelligent. Rather, they're born with an extra dose curiosity in place of the irrational need to impress everyone around them. It's because of this that they go above an beyond what the more shallow people will do simply to gain social acceptance. Honestly, be thankful these people exist. Where do you think your iPhone came from? What about modern medical procedures? Agricultural innovation?


Excuse me for saying this, but i have this _tiny_ feeling that you're hinting at S types...

And excuse me for saying this also (RestlessCryptid, this is not directed at you, i'm just saying this because i'm in the mood to rant), but to *anybody* who ever feels like Sensors are always talking about cars and clothes and not things that really "matter", S does not stand for _Stupid_. Oh wait! I almost forgot - it doesn't stand for _Shallow_, either!! And WHOA, how very surprising this is, it's getting hard for me to process it all - it _*ALSO*_ does not stand for _Superficial_!!! It stands for _*Sensing*_. GET OVER IT. Thank you very much for your kind consideration  #passiveagressivehumour

It's absolutely okay for anyone to want to gain social acceptance - are we taught in kindergarten to follow our own deep-down desires to learn and be ourselves, instead of follow the rules we are given in order to not seem "rude" and "undisciplined"? No. And because we are not taught that way, many of us are _not_ that way. I agree with you - it is sad that so many people can't look past social acceptance. But that is ALSO what we are told to be what's important from the first time we ever cried in front of a guest in the house as a toddler: _Be good. Be nice. Be polite, for goodness's sake! Stop throwing that fit. Go to your room and think about what you did. It doesn't matter if you don't like him, you have to be NICE to him. My goodness, that is completely unacceptable!_

While it is true to be grateful for people who can fight their human nature of wanting to fit in to society, we should also be grateful that there _are_ people who really care about society's expectations, even if it is superficial, because sometimes things just have to run that way. Anyhow, people being unable to get away from "the irrational need to impress everyone around them" were taught by the adults in our society to be that way, intentionally or unintentionally.

I'm sorry, you probably didn't mean it that way, but it just reminded me of the entire MBTI bias on how possessing the traits N and/or T makes you smart and not superficial. Innovation is important, but so are rules. What we should try to do is maybe find a balance in between, and also stop dismissing those who follow conventions as unintelligent. It's not our fault we're not as innovative as Albert Einstein or Steve Jobs, and _*we are all smart in different ways*_, no matter how reluctant you are to admit that THAT annoying neighbour is smart in their own way, as well.

Again, RestlessCryptid, this is NOT directed at you, unless you _do_ think all Sensors are stupid and shallow. In that case, please take this friendly tip and maybe try to assess your perspective slightly :happy:


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## Parrot (Feb 22, 2015)

@MessyJessie103 I am currently stalking you because your posts are my favorite.


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

RestlessCryptid said:


> My sister is and ESFJ and she's the same way. Genius IQ, witty sense of humor, outstanding grades in school. My point is, I don't think type has to do much with intelligence, you can be smart with any type, it's just NTs tend to follow more intellectual pursuits by nature.


THANK you for saying that! lol i'm just really annoyed at the stereotypes for about the 2,957,890,257,984th time this year. That's about three trillion, right? :laughing: maybe i was just hypersensitive about the fact that this was posted in the NT forum because the MBTI community in general can be _kinda_ biased about the N trait sometimes...Sorry if i offended you or anything :/


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

Drunk Parrot said:


> @MessyJessie103 I am currently stalking you because your posts are my favorite.


Lol that's both funny and so nice to hear! :laughing: since i'm not even allowed to post selfies, my address, full name,etc. online, i'm not too concerned about online stalking :happy: and the internet i use is complicated, so you prolly won't even find me if you use advanced hacking hahahah


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## Parrot (Feb 22, 2015)

MessyJessie103 said:


> Lol that's both funny and so nice to hear! :laughing: since i'm not even allowed to post selfies, my address, full name,etc. online, i'm not too concerned about online stalking :happy: and the internet i use is complicated, so you prolly won't even find me if you use advanced hacking hahahah


I don't like you that much to find you in real life. I'm just stalking you on PerC :kitteh:

I just love how you're like PC Principal, going after MBTI stereotypes. Somebody's like "ISTPs are so mechanical" and you come in *sirens* "ISTPs are not all the same!" I just love the energy level.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

MessyJessie103 said:


> So what is this thread stating? That NTs are more likely to feel uncomfortable in those moments that everybody has? That NTs are more likely to be intelligent in the department of knowledge and joking? I don't really get this...


*Maybe it's just because there are less of us than any other temperament and that singles us out some.* For example, I go to a school of ninety kids in my grade and only three intellectuals. Used to be just this ENTP guy and I until my INTJ friend transferred in last year. Sometimes I really feel like the three of us have a secret language that makes everyone else around us uncomfortable and possibly even pissed off.

*If there were only three SFs in a grade they'd feel the same way I'm sure, in fact I think it would be harder and lonelier for them since they care about things like fitting in nine times more than we NTs do... Interesting how nature all works out for the better sometimes though... *

To quote The Great Gatsby, *"She thought I knew a lot because I knew different things from her."*


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

RestlessCryptid said:


> No. It has to do with anyone really.


 Wasn't that what I said?


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Stickman said:


> Wasn't that what I said?


Absolutely, it's just since I started the thread I thought I'd say it as well.


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## Peter (Feb 27, 2010)

RestlessCryptid said:


> How many NTs have this as a problem?


If that's your problem then you´re not that smart.


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## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> The smartest people I know don't make people feel uncomfortable. They easily assess the other persons level of comprehension and explain things in a way that will be understood. They know they're intelligent and so they don't need recognition for it from everyone they have a conversation with.


What about intellectual individuals (re: strong abilities of knowledge) -- that are socially impaired, thus cannot express themselves in ways that 'cater-to' - the majority; this is such a narrow view - I have met a few intellects that are impaired socially, thus cannot make other personas comfortable in the aura they radiate - even individuals with NPD (re: other mental malfunctions) - simply are not capable of understanding, thus, ''adjusting'' in a manner for those that hold inferiority complexes - and mind you, quite a few individuals harbor_ inferiority complexes_ - thus, the ''intellect'' _*must*_ adjust.

However, while a 'mental malfunction' - is surely the _problem_ at hand; we must consider that said individuals do not harbor sets of social intelligence / strong emotional intelligence (re: Aspies) - to communicate + express said notions effectively; like say, you for example. 

Thus, using your own words - we conclude that personas in the name lower 'social / emotional intelligence' - *you* must adjust to _them_. :wink:

Anyway, instead of *dismissing* a different individual off as arrogant - perhaps, instead of being intellectually lazy - make an analysis of what this _might be_.

Complied.


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## Catwalk (Aug 12, 2015)

Neverontime said:


> People don't judge others as arrogant for being intelligent. They judge others as arrogant for being arrogant. Refusing to explain something in a way that others can understand, because 'why should you dumb yourself down?' is arrogant.
> Why would anyone want to communicate without being understood anyway?
> It's not about making people feel comfortable, it's about effectively communicating with people. If mutual understanding isn't the purpose of communication, then what's the point of communicating?
> Also, why would others even want to listen to something that's being presented in such a way that they're unable to comprehend it?
> ...


;headshake 

The intellectuals - are not _responsible_ for the intellectually lazy - thus; there is no innate ''responsibility'' here for a said intellectual individual to adjust - when the 'lazy' individual is purely able to catch up. 

I do, indeed, find individuals that are _intellectually lazy_ with a nature of entitlement that the one above must compromise said persona to make another individual 'comfortable' - as such, this same arrogance is seen from the travelling American (re: French - different languages / stimuli); that all individuals within another country _must_ compute + articulate *English* - solely for their sake, however, said American had no desire to study the foreign language prior to entering said country. 

No, individuals of higher knowledge capacity do not have to adjust themselves to the lazy - because they are lazy; this does not make them _arrogant_ (e.g ego fishing) - such a notion of assumption only makes me speculate the inferiority within said individual + their lazy entitlements for benefit. 

(ex) 1 --> Intellectually laziness person asks _moderately_ intellectual person (e.g pertaining to said subject) -- to use a more simple word, when, said ''lazy'' individual, has full access to a dictionary - thus, can increase own said intellect as well. I find individuals that reject knowledge gain to not be individuals of my interest, but rather, should be _left_ in wonderment. There are no responsible amends to hold the hands of the lesser. 

As for communication errors - see previous post. ^ (re: Lazy person has no intentions of meeting person halfway, thus the non-lazy should not either).


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

Catwalk said:


> What about intellectual individuals (re: strong abilities of knowledge) -- that are socially impaired, thus cannot express themselves in ways that 'cater-to' - the majority; this is such a narrow view - I have met a few intellects that are impaired socially, thus cannot make other personas comfortable in the aura they radiate - even individuals with NPD (re: other mental malfunctions) - simply are not capable of understanding, thus, ''adjusting'' in a manner for those that hold inferiority complexes - and mind you, quite a few individuals harbor_ inferiority complexes_ - thus, the ''intellect'' _*must*_ adjust.
> 
> However, while a 'mental malfunction' - is surely the _problem_ at hand; we must consider that said individuals do not harbor sets of social intelligence / strong emotional intelligence (re: Aspies) - to communicate + express said notions effectively; like say, you for example.
> 
> ...


Then the issue is caused by a misunderstanding which is due to people not realizing that intelligent person has impairments in the areas of communication and/or social interaction. 

It's still not due to their high intelligence. If 'person A' has social and communication difficulties, then they need to understand that when 'person B' becomes uncomfortable, it's likely because of 'A's poor communication abilities, not their superior intellect. 

If 'B' has average or above average social/communication skills and ability, then yes, it's up to 'B' to adjust to accommodate for 'A' socially. 

Social impairments weren't however, mentioned in this thread as being a factor influencing how people are perceived, only high intelligence was mentioned.


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## Kynx (Feb 6, 2012)

Catwalk said:


> ;headshake
> 
> The intellectuals - are not _responsible_ for the intellectually lazy - thus; there is no innate ''responsibility'' here for a said intellectual individual to adjust - when the 'lazy' individual is purely able to catch up.
> 
> ...


They're not responsible for the 'intellectually lazy', no. They're also not responsible for those of lower intelligence, who simply don't have the same intellectual capabilities. If intelligent person wants others to perceive them in a certain way, ie. not arrogant, then intelligent person is responsible for presenting themselves as such, as far as they're possibly able. 

Learning a new word is one thing, learning a whole new topic along with numerous new words is another thing and is an unreasonable expectation. For example, nobody would find it necessary to attend medical school in order to understand what their doctor is talking to them about. That doesn't make them intellectually lazy, even if they are cognitively capable of learning it all. There are many people who aren't capable and therefore, intelligent person *refusing* to adjust (as opposed to being incapable of adjusting), in order to communicate with those people when necessary, is arrogant.


----------



## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Let's talk about children. Children that some of you insist should adapt unless they have speech problems....Read the lines in bold how these kids feel in a society that only demands and gives back nothing...

_*Gifted and talented children may:*

Become bored and frustrated; dislike repetition and shallow curriculum; hide abilities to gain acceptance; receive negative adult attitudes to smartness

Dominate discussion; have difficulty with listening skills; exhibit manipulative behaviour

Need less sleep; become frustrated with inactivity, lack of challenge or active inquiry

Take on too many activities

Disrupt class routine; feel stifled by restrictions; resist interruption or schedules; be perceived as stubborn, uncooperative

Become frustrated with absence of progress; be prone to being 'overdriven' and/or not be motivated by results; be resistant to interruption; be seen as time wasting or preoccupied

*Be unusually vulnerable*;feel confused if thoughts and feelings not taken seriously

Be perceived as immature; *try to mask feelings to conform; be vulnerable to criticism*

Attempt unrealistic reforms; *feel frustrated, angry. Depressed; develop a cynical attitude; receive intolerance from age peers*

Set unrealistically high goals;* feel inadequate; feel frustrated with others; fear failure, inhibiting attempts in new areas
*

Have a tendency to challenge and question indiscreetly; *have difficulty with rigid conformity; may be penalised; exhibit rebellious behaviour
*

*Have heightened self awareness, feelings of being different*

*Experience social isolation; regard difference as bad, worthless, resulting in low self esteem*

*Use humour inappropriately or to attack others; feel confused when humour not understood; feel rejected by others
*

*Be seen as weird; feel stifled by lack of creative opportunities*

*Experience social isolation; be seen as show off, odd, superior, critical; be rejected by older children*

_


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## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

Drunk Parrot said:


> I don't like you that much to find you in real life. I'm just stalking you on PerC :kitteh:
> 
> I just love how you're like PC Principal, going after MBTI stereotypes. Somebody's like "ISTPs are so mechanical" and you come in *sirens* "ISTPs are not all the same!" I just love the energy level.


That's good to hear too. I wouldn't like real-life stalking as much as PerC stalking roud:

Wow, thank you for the compliments, really! It's cool to see someone describe me that way, sirens and all :laughing: maybe that's why some of my friends think i'm ENTP - i'm always "ranting" and "debating". Ehh, i like my aux and inf functions well enough to keep them around to help me fight for justice in the world of MBTI and the pusillanimous stereotypes that came in the same package as all the mysterious letters :happy:


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

MessyJessie103 said:


> That's good to hear too. *I wouldn't like real-life stalking as much as PerC stalking roud:*


So you like Perc stalking better, but you'd still like real-life stalking.

Tell me,

Where do you live?:crazy:


----------



## RubiksCubix (Oct 29, 2014)

From my experience, its mostly XNTJ's who have this problem and it's about 50% real and 50% in their head.


----------



## Hottest_Commie_Ever (Nov 11, 2015)

Stickman said:


> So you like Perc stalking better, but you'd still like real-life stalking.
> 
> Tell me,
> 
> Where do you live?:crazy:


Hmm. If you really wanted to stalk me, you would've checked my profile :wink:


----------



## ChrisTeam (Apr 17, 2013)

This threat is all over the place, and I really want to clear something up:



RestlessCryptid said:


> [...]Another thing to note is that intelligent people aren't born intelligent. [...]


Yes they are.



MessyJessie103 said:


> [...]Again, IQ doesn't mean you're smart. [...]


Yes it does.

Infact thats the whole idea behind the IQ. We try to measure how smart you are with the IQ value. And yes you have your max IQ at birth and yes it never changes.

IQ is a trait, like your eye colour, your hair colour, your skin colour, your gender, your sexual orientation, your max height. You are born with all that, and you can't change those.

So a higher IQ is not better than a lower IQ just as white skin is not better than black skin, no matter how many racists tell you otherwise.

In a world aimed for average people the best traits would be exactly that: average. The more average you are the better the world is suited to you.

Social Intelligence is different from IQ in the sense that they are abilities and those can be learned. And that is a major difference. Any average person can learn an ability.

You might be born with a number sense that makes learning math easier but you don't need it to learn math. And also if you don't practice an ability then you don't have it. Even if you have an math-gene you still have to learn all the rules and formulas and practice to be good at it.

And at last back to IQ. Getting your IQ value is difficult. Any test is flawed and can be influenced but we don't know any other way to estimate one's IQ. Bear in mind though that many free tests are either deeply flawed because they were made by amateurs or designed to give you a high IQ result so you share the test result on social sites.

By definition the average result in an IQ test is 100. So a big portion of people taking the tests should be below average and only a fraction should be very high. Yet pretty much anyone I know who took a free IQ test scored above 120. I know thats not very scientificly sound reasoning but it sure makes me a sceptic.

Many free tests that I checked out only went up to 135. So if you made 0 mistakes in a test you get a 135. And still I see people claiming they scored higher in those tests. I have even seen tests that had answers wrong - one such test was even at the website of a pretty respectable institute.

So when you do take those tests, bear in mind that results might vary and not be very precise. If you want a precise answer you need to do a proper test, like at mensa.

You can practice for those tests of course. So if you need a good result for your ego then you can obtain one. Simple as that. Thats one of the problems of those tests. They all test with very similar questions, so you can train for that kind of thinking.

And back to the topic of the thread: A higher IQ should not make others feel uncomfortable. Infact I doubt you can easily tell who is the smartest person in a room because that gets easily obscured by knowledge. You can usually tell pretty quickly who has the most knowledge in a room but that tells you nothing about intelligence.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

ChrisTeam said:


> This threat is all over the place, and I really want to clear something up:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I understand. 

I simply tend to notice a bigger group of stupid people that have no interest in learning than smart people that have no interest in learning. 

*People do not become smart from acquiring knowledge, rather because they're smart they will invest time in seeking it out.*


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## maust (Jul 14, 2014)

"Stupid" and "Smart" are meaningless terms. There are tons of kinds of intelligence. That being said, I'll join the train of extraverts who think it might not be a people problem- it might just be a you problem. 

Story time. 

I joined debate in high school of freshman year. I was really enthusiastic and I did very well. Unfortunately, in sophomore year, I started to believe talking fast and spewing statistics was the way to win. I read a lot and thought everyone should know as much as I did- because they _just should_!!! I was factually right in almost every debate I participated in. Know what happened instead? Right. I lost. Because my arguments weren't explained logically and didn't make any sense- they were just numbers. Know what fixed that problem? _Slowing down and explaining to people what the hell I was talking about._ 

You can be as smart as you want in your head, but it doesn't mean anything if you don't _use_ it well enough. My INTP ex had to learn this lesson as well- he was aware he often came off as pretentious, so he worked very hard to explain himself to people. It's really not that difficult to add five second explanations to concepts, and it helps more people like you. You're not going to succeed in life if you let your ego get in the way of talking to people. 



ChrisTeam said:


> Smart, as in high IQ, doesn't make people uncomfortable. If people are pretentious, condescending or patronizing, then sure others get uncomfortable very fast (which isn't surprising). I find myself in a room where I know most about a particular subject sometimes but I think it's great responsibility to distribute knowledge and break complicated things down so everyone can easily digest them. And you can get people up to speed quickly and then they can participate and add to the topic at hand.
> 
> And when I'm not the one in the room with the most knowledge I usually soak up all information I can and look at the topic form any angle. And I usually grasp things quickly and can join a discussion in little time.
> 
> ...


^

If you're surrounded by people, find those who are smarter than you. I can almost guarantee they exist. And even if they're not smarter than you, they're as intelligent/can keep up/at least know something you don't. Listening more is really helpful- you don't learn anything from talking. 



RestlessCryptid said:


> My sister is and ESFJ and she's the same way. Genius IQ, witty sense of humor, outstanding grades in school. My point is, I don't think type has to do much with intelligence, you can be smart with any type, it's just NTs tend to follow more intellectual pursuits by nature.


Same. She's wicked smart and works really hard. She's much more motivated than I ever was at her age.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

maust said:


> Same. She's wicked smart and works really hard. She's much more motivated than I ever was at her age.


And my brother is an ENTJ.


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## IENTP (Nov 13, 2015)

Perhaps we should look at "fluid intelligence" and "crystalized intelligence" . One may have one and not necessarily the other to the same degree. Crystalized intelligence, e.g. knowledge build up apparently increases with age. As for fluid intelligence, it's still debated whether you can learn it/develop it but apparently it decreases with age. Fluid intelligence was considered static before, you either have it or you don't, and it expresses one's capacity to think abstractly and logically in novel situations.

A lot of people here seem to associate intelligence with college degrees, learned knowledge, high grades, language skills, etc..Yes, following that path will open a lot more doors for one. But this is all crystalized intelligence. These people may not necessarily have the same level of fluid intelligence to take the reigns afterwards and steer the vehicle in their own direction. 

I am pretty certain that almost all people, given the opportunity to stick through college for a few years without financial or other strains, will finish a degree of their choice. I come from a society where 99% of people I've ever known have degrees. Not all of them are clever though. Yes, they are intelligent people. They know a lot, read a lot. They can learn the syllabus or any syllabus well enough. From there on people differ in their abilities and what they can do or want to do with that knowledge. Can they apply it in the big scheme of things or are they limited to what they know and can't think outside the box? Can they think for themselves, or do they always need to go read what they think in a book? There's a tendency in my opinion for people to rely on available written knowledge and other's people opinion, and forget to think for themselves. 

I think intelligence is not about how much one can learn from others. It's about how much one is capable of being a unique source of knowledge for others.


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

If you really want to talk to people who don't have as much trouble understanding you, try visiting a high IQ society. Or if you just want to talk about a particular subject without having to give a crash course first, try to find a community online about that subject.

It may not work out, but you can at least try. It has worked out pretty well for me.


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## karmachameleon (Nov 1, 2015)

Pifanjr said:


> I propose that you don't need to be socially awkward to make other people uncomfortable though. Some people will feel uncomfortable merely from knowing someone is (significantly) more intelligent than they are, because they are insecure about their own intelligence. Basically, these people are already uncomfortable about their own intelligence even without being in the presence of someone who is more intelligent, it's just harder to ignore when they are.


Yeah you do. You're just trying to find an excuse for your social awkwarness. :kitteh:


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

karmachameleon said:


> Yeah you do. You're just trying to find an excuse for your social awkwarness. :kitteh:


Doesn't the same phenomenon occur with people who have a bad self-image in the presence of people they view as more beautiful? Are you proposing that social awkwardness is the underlying cause of all discomfort between two people? Or at least that inherent differences in qualities (such as perceived intelligence or beauty) are never the cause of the discomfort?


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## karmachameleon (Nov 1, 2015)

Pifanjr said:


> Doesn't the same phenomenon occur with people who have a bad self-image in the presence of people they view as more beautiful? Are you proposing that social awkwardness is the underlying cause of all discomfort between two people? Or at least that inherent differences in qualities (such as perceived intelligence or beauty) are never the cause of the discomfort?


If you get uncomfortable around someone more beautiful than you than thats really strange. But there's a difference, someone who is smart doesnt have to brag to everyone how smart they are, beautiful people cant hide their beauty.


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

karmachameleon said:


> If you get uncomfortable around someone more beautiful than you than thats really strange. But there's a difference, someone who is smart doesnt have to brag to everyone how smart they are, beautiful people cant hide their beauty.


Good for you not to have low self esteem I guess :tongue:. But not everyone is as secure about themselves and some get uncomfortable when faced with their flaws.

You don't have to brag about your intelligence for your intelligence to be noticeable. It's possible to dumb yourself down to hide it, but that isn't that easy and I don't think that not hiding a part of yourself should be considered as socially awkward inherently.


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## frogs (Jan 11, 2016)

Not an NT (an NF) but I do the same thing to others, especially SP types.


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## SilverKelpie (Mar 9, 2015)

Pifanjr said:


> Doesn't the same phenomenon occur with people who have a bad self-image in the presence of people they view as more beautiful? Are you proposing that social awkwardness is the underlying cause of all discomfort between two people? Or at least that inherent differences in qualities (such as perceived intelligence or beauty) are never the cause of the discomfort?


You are comparing here people who have a bad self-image and are around someone beautiful to people in general being around someone highly intelligent. I don't think this comparison is consistent because you are specifying "bad self-image" and comparing it to a scenario involving people in general. Now, if someone who had low self-esteem regarding their intelligence was around someone intelligent, they may feel uncomfortable, but that was not the premise of the original post. So, if this argument was to work, it would be: "So smart you make others with low self-esteem regarding their intelligence uncomfortable?" Which, well, yeah. That would be the case for any attribute someone may be upset that they don't have.

Also, society values beauty more than it values great intelligence, so I think that in general, more average people would be likely to be uncomfortable around a very beautiful person for their beauty than average people uncomfortable around an intelligent person because of their intelligence. 

Just for a real life situation: I'm pretty bright, and I have a reputation around the office for being "brilliant, but very cold" (according to a friend who got a job here). I make people a bit uncomfortable, but I think it has much less to do with my actual intelligence and much more to do with my lack of charisma. My husband (ENFJ), on the other hand, is also known as brilliant (and really is), and people love him. He has his pick of friends and every company he's come in at at the bottom level (he doesn't have a great degree), he zips up to near the top very quickly because he is both extremely intelligent and extremely charismatic. His intelligence doesn't make people uncomfortable at all. I think they admire it.


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

SilverKelpie said:


> You are comparing here people who have a bad self-image and are around someone beautiful to people in general being around someone highly intelligent. I don't think this comparison is consistent because you are specifying "bad self-image" and comparing it to a scenario involving people in general. Now, if someone who had low self-esteem regarding their intelligence was around someone intelligent, they may feel uncomfortable, but that was not the premise of the original post. So, if this argument was to work, it would be: "So smart you make others with low self-esteem regarding their intelligence uncomfortable?" Which, well, yeah. That would be the case for any attribute someone may be upset that they don't have.


I'm not sure what the premise of the original post was, since it's not very detailed. However, my argument was merely made to question karmachameleon's argument, that all discomfort from the people around you is caused by your social awkwardness. I took a very specific, extreme stance on purpose because it's easier to defend. Only when karmachameleon would've admitted that that extreme case was true could I have tried to show that insecurity about intelligence is analog, a scale, and that there are a lot of people who feel at least somewhat uncomfortable around people they perceive as a lot smarter. So even though social awkwardness might play a role too, a really smart person will have to be more socially gifted to balance the inherent level of discomfort people have around people they perceive as really smart. At least, that is my theory.



> Also, society values beauty more than it values great intelligence, so I think that in general, more average people would be likely to be uncomfortable around a very beautiful person for their beauty than average people uncomfortable around an intelligent person because of their intelligence.


I think so too.



> Just for a real life situation: I'm pretty bright, and I have a reputation around the office for being "brilliant, but very cold" (according to a friend who got a job here). I make people a bit uncomfortable, but I think it has much less to do with my actual intelligence and much more to do with my lack of charisma. My husband (ENFJ), on the other hand, is also known as brilliant (and really is), and people love him. He has his pick of friends and every company he's come in at at the bottom level (he doesn't have a great degree), he zips up to near the top very quickly because he is both extremely intelligent and extremely charismatic. His intelligence doesn't make people uncomfortable at all. I think they admire it.


Yeah, I think charisma can make up for it. Maybe I'm wrong and it's all about social skill and smart people just have less of it because for most of them it's harder to connect to other people. But maybe smart people need more of it to offset the discomfort they cause in other people, where some people get more uncomfortable than others


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## lil intro vert (Jan 14, 2016)

"Smartass" is my nickname for some reason.


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## lil intro vert (Jan 14, 2016)

kinkaid said:


> I do feel like I have to edit myself with most everyone. I hate coming off like a know-it-all. I don't look for arguments or chime in on every topic. I find myself having to try to not make people uncomfortable when they are wrong (gulp)... It's something I dislike more than I like.


It's like a dog looking at steak on the table during dinner or it feels like wearing an itchy sweater with no undershirt. Sometimes that shit gotta come out lol but I do find myself doing what you do. I sometimes catch myself acting a bit too calculated and go back to hermit crab mode. 



> I've beat myself up over things like this over and over again. "You should've just left it alone when they said New York City was the capitol of New York. Why did you have to correct them and tell them that it's Albany".


I feel for you, it's pure torture :frustrating:.


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## daleks_exterminate (Jul 22, 2013)

karmachameleon said:


> If you get uncomfortable around someone more beautiful than you than thats really strange. But there's a difference, someone who is smart doesnt have to brag to everyone how smart they are, beautiful people cant hide their beauty.


Beauty is extremely subjective. In moden society unattractive people can easily pretend to be with the help of a lot of make up. 

Tbh, based on your responses to this thread- I think you're projecting how you think you'd feel in a situation and not realizing that other people process differently than yourself or even value things differently that you do. Not to mention there are different types of intellegence. Some people care more about one type than others.


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## karmachameleon (Nov 1, 2015)

daleks_exterminate said:


> Beauty is extremely subjective. In moden society unattractive people can easily pretend to be with the help of a lot of make up.
> 
> Tbh, based on your responses to this thread- I think you're projecting how you think you'd feel in a situation and not realizing that other people process differently than yourself or even value things differently that you do. Not to mention there are different types of intellegence. Some people care more about one type than others.


Nope. Try again.


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## daleks_exterminate (Jul 22, 2013)

karmachameleon said:


> Nope. Try again.


okay sure. 

Think of this as "the big kids table". You can come back when you have something to say that is intelligent and isn't completely condescending to everyone whose posted in this thread. The world doesn't revolve around you. Ignoring the reality that other people aren't you and don't think the same way doesn't make that reality false. 

Get your head out of your ass. 

Is that easier to understand for you?


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## Vahyavishdapaya (Sep 2, 2014)

daleks_exterminate said:


> okay sure.
> 
> Think of this as "the big kids table". You can come back when you have something to say that is intelligent and isn't completely condescending to everyone whose posted in this thread. The world doesn't revolve around you. Ignoring the reality that other people aren't you and don't think the same way doesn't make that reality false.
> 
> ...


:laughing: Welcome back daleks!


----------



## daleks_exterminate (Jul 22, 2013)

Big Daddy Kane said:


> :laughing: Welcome back daleks!


I...oh....thanks.


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## Sporadic Aura (Sep 13, 2009)

I'm SO smart I know how to be smart even without making others uncomfortable. I have transcended.


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## Vahyavishdapaya (Sep 2, 2014)

daleks_exterminate said:


> I...oh....thanks.


You forgot who I am, DIDN'T YOU?!?! :crying:


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## daleks_exterminate (Jul 22, 2013)

Big Daddy Kane said:


> You forgot who I am, DIDN'T YOU?!?! :crying:


No of course not. And it's nice to see you as an infj again instead of an estp


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## Vahyavishdapaya (Sep 2, 2014)

daleks_exterminate said:


> No of course not. And it's nice to see you as an infj again instead of an estp


:laughing:

Nice to see you back, hope you stick around!


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## karmachameleon (Nov 1, 2015)

daleks_exterminate said:


> okay sure.
> 
> Think of this as "the big kids table". You can come back when you have something to say that is intelligent and isn't completely condescending to everyone whose posted in this thread. The world doesn't revolve around you. Ignoring the reality that other people aren't you and don't think the same way doesn't make that reality false.
> 
> ...


Haha someones offended.  I don't see how that was condescending to everyone, it was just you taking it personally.
I keep my head wherever I want, thank you. You need to not get so butthurt for nothing, though.
Sorry I made you uncomfortable with my intelligence.


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## Strelok (Aug 16, 2013)

karmachameleon said:


> Haha someones offended.  I don't see how that was condescending to everyone, it was just you taking it personally.
> I keep my head wherever I want, thank you. You need to not get so butthurt for nothing, though.
> Sorry I made you uncomfortable with my intelligence.


We have located the dickhead xxTJ type


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Pifanjr said:


> How is everyone so full of themselves? Do you think we perceive making others uncomfortable as a good thing, like we're better than them? Maybe some people who respond here think they're too good to lower themselves to the level of other people, but I know a lot of smart people view their intelligence as a burden sometimes.


Well, being a minority in anything can be a burden. Be it you're religion, you're sex, you're race, you're lifestyle, or you're IQ, *there are people out there that are going to think you're wrong or defected simply because to them the majority is always right.* This is false, unethical, immoral, not to mention very illogical, but truly what a good fraction of the population thinks.



> The poor communication skills are often caused by being more intelligent. And yes, it can be learned, but especially in the beginning it's a lot of effort to have to translate your thoughts. Most smart people eventually figure it out, but it still takes effort. And it's not just about topics you know a lot about, even when discussing topics the other person knows more about can it happen that the higher intelligence can be intimidating for the other person. Because some people don't want everything to be questioned, while that's what smart people typically do.
> 
> I agree that you can't just blame other people for not understanding you, they can't help not understanding you while you can help making them understand you, even if it takes effort. I agree that feeling superior because other people don't understand you doesn't help. But that doesn't mean these problems don't exist or are just the fault of the smart person, as if they're just lazy.


Even my sister, she's ESFJ and we can't see eye to eye, mainly because she follows the crowd to the point where she's never been an outcast before. I'm not saying she's racist, sexist, or anything else. Her Fe-Si simply disrespects my Ti-Ne lifestyles since it so different from the majority of normal people out there.

It's hurtful, sure, but I love her. In fact I find her mystifying. She's good at things that I'll never be good at, and on top of that she's classy, smart, funny, beautiful. I'd never admit it, but I see myself in her. Remembering back to when I was fourteen... She disregards logic just as much as I disregarded feelings. This Ti hatred, I think she'll grow out of it, but for now, I treat her with kindness. 

*What I'd like to say is that I don't think people realize why they get frustrated with individuals who are different from them, they just do. *That's why I don't blame my sister, she's simply looking at things through her own eyes.


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## Rags (Apr 11, 2015)

I wish. I'm not smart, just logical and indifferent. It shows a lot when I'm telling advice since people normally expect an emotional response. They usually end up suprised, maybe even uncomfortable.
However my INTJ friend does have this problem. His high IQ along with his Ni-Te intimidates everyone


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## IDontThinkSo (Aug 24, 2011)

I'm so smart I make no one uncomfortable.

Because people can't grasp my intelligence until they have an in-depth understanding of my achievements. Then things become awkward, since they still can't help thinking I'm not that inaccessible and they couldn't be that wrong. The first thing people think of me is I'm a dreamer, not a genius. If my intelligence required a normal intelligence to be noticed, I would be normal myself.


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## starwars (Sep 5, 2014)

I think I may....
cant remember who or what, but I have been told that sometimes I do that. I am quite unaware of it, partially because I dont feel so smart at times, esp for academics. I tend to be a dumb one from that.


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## WakeTheUndead (Apr 5, 2016)

YES YES YES this is totally me. At school, I'm that one kid... "Oh, ask so-and-so, they'll know..." People who I'm not friends with have been hesitant when it comes to speaking with me because they are afraid they will embarrass themselves, apparently. I'm only really friends with other rationals for this reason.
I'm really not that smart, but oh well- I suppose people call you a walking dictionary for a reason.


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## TheVerb (Mar 4, 2015)

I'm not pretentious enough to refer to myself as "intelligent". BUT, I have noticed that I tend to steer the conversation into philosophical waters and away from trending events. Whether this is perceived as some sort of freak intelligence by people or just convoluted drivel I have no idea.


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## illuminuxi (Apr 8, 2016)

If you really are smart, you should know how to put others at ease. Just my two cents.


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## LandOfTheSnakes (Sep 7, 2013)

"Book Smart But Lacking in Emotional Intelligence"


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## CTRLvector (Jan 28, 2016)

I regularly make myself uncomfortable, if anyone could get inside my head I'd imagine that they would hate it. I hate it, ceaseless, from the moment I wake till when I sleep, just pure unadulterated processing of what if and why.


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

CTRLvector said:


> I regularly make myself uncomfortable, if anyone could get inside my head I'd imagine that they would hate it. I hate it, ceaseless, from the moment I wake till when I sleep, just pure unadulterated processing of what if and why.


Why do you hate it?


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

CTRLvector said:


> I regularly make myself uncomfortable, if anyone could get inside my head I'd imagine that they would hate it. I hate it, ceaseless, from the moment I wake till when I sleep, just pure unadulterated processing of what if and why.


Ti sometimes makes me feel like I'm a machine and not a person... Especially with the array of mental issues I had for a while... and still kind of have to a lesser degree. 

I had OCD and doctors thought I had ADD so they put me on adderall and made me into a zombie. Stimulants do no go well with Ti... I hardly slept, and I only eat enough to ease the headaches.


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## CTRLvector (Jan 28, 2016)

Yeah ever since my anhedonia symptoms, things have been really tedious. I think the personality side effects get worse as you get older, at least they have for me.


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## Antipode (Jul 8, 2012)

I kinda like the reasoning.

"People just don't like me because I'm smart."


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## Strelok (Aug 16, 2013)

CTRLvector said:


> Yeah ever since my anhedonia symptoms, things have been really tedious. I think the personality side effects get worse as you get older, at least they have for me.


How do you get rid of anhedonia?


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## west0rn (Mar 21, 2016)

Very often. I am very extroverted and express my opinions and articulate my thoughts about abstract topics frequently. I passed a placement test to skip a grade when I was in fourth grade. I've been called a genius by others on several dozen occasions, and I am not saying that to brag, since I believe a compliment like that is wasted on someone like me, but I think that sharing personal information like this shows that my perspective has some merit. I have often been told by friends and acquaintances that I make them feel stupid, usually because I am able to prove them wrong about nearly any subject using reason.

In both my interpersonal relationships and closely held beliefs, my opinions are very complex and pragmatic compared to others. My beliefs are difficult to put into words and seem paradoxical when my words are taken out of context, and very few people truly know me well enough to have reasonable insight of my way of thinking, including my own family. The fact that I am very pragmatic in my way of thinking and acting creates a lot of conflict, confusion, and drama in my life. People see it as being manipulative and contradictory, but I only agree with it as being manipulative because I don't think that moral beliefs are set in stone and it sometimes it is necessary to deviate from them in order to solve a problem.

My way of thinking follows many different styles of logical progression, and it confuses people. I have a much deeper understanding of interpersonal relationships, intellectual topics, and abstract concepts than the average person simply because I am able to obtain the necessary insight in order to think of topics in a way that allows me to understand them.

I am able to draw parallels between situations in ways that most people do not. Finding relationships between situations based on my experience and identical circumstances surrounding them is one of my strongest talents.

People have told me that I give them the impression that I hate them, which isn't true. People have told me that I'm a very clever and funny person once they actually get to know me, but I feel very indifferent towards most people which is often mistaken as hostility.


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## Necrofantasia (Feb 26, 2014)

Yeah, I used to, and I got bullied for it so thoroughly and extensively that I became clinically depressed. It certainly paid off.

I have Asperger's so it took me a while to understand that you're only truly smart if you have the sense to play it in ways that don't make others uncomfortable. It's part of why I tend to be goofy and crack jokes, sure, it's cringe-inducingly awkward, but I'm lazy and friction from others just gives me extra work. If I find it's inevitable for friction to occur, I just refrain from being around the other party. If it's a work situation, then I'm SOL because I am the crappiest liar humanity has ever produced and I don't notice my own blunders until it's too late. 

The reason human brains evolved to have the capabilities they have was not for the sake of IQ, it was for the sake of EQ, this is a case in point. Whether you see it as dumbing yourself down or just disclosing as much as the occasion calls for, it's your call. The former perspective just gave me unnecessary aggravation. 

BTW I can only imagine anyone who hovers on this board and sees this thread title at the top must think we NTs are grade A pricks, hell, I thought that the first time I saw it.


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## Strelok (Aug 16, 2013)

Nell said:


> BTW I can only imagine anyone who hovers on this board and sees this thread title at the top must think we NTs are grade A pricks, hell, I thought that the first time I saw it.


Well, half of us (the NTJs) are pricks and think it's a badge of honor... Then the other half, it depends on the person and who you ask.


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## ShadowsRunner (Apr 24, 2013)

Yes, I am so fantastic, gorgeous, and fantabulas, that I make my uncomfortable. :chat02::chat02::chat02:uffer::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13::smiley-cool13:uffer:




I mean wait...yes.


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

Nell said:


> The reason human brains evolved to have the capabilities they have was not for the sake of IQ, it was for the sake of EQ, this is a case in point.


Why do you think this/How did you reach this conclusion?


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## Necrofantasia (Feb 26, 2014)

Pifanjr said:


> Why do you think this/How did you reach this conclusion?


It isn't something I made up

As far as vertebrates are concerned (I am not touching cephalopods cuz they cray) the most intelligent life forms on the planet happen to be the most socially _complex_ (cetaceans even have multiple dialects). It makes sense that superior brain capabilities were developed as a result of/to keep up with regular, complex interactions with many different individuals ( elephant herds involve around 10-20 individuals, chimp troops can go as high as 80, dolphins can form 12 member pods to (rarely) >1k member superpods, rats are on average even worse) . 

In the case of human beings our social interactions are more ridiculously nuanced than those of any animal (body language, verbal language and verbal content, and other circumstantial details) , the way I see it it adds up and goes a long way towards explaining why we turned out the way we did, especially when you consider the effects of isolation in human development (see feral children). The fact social interaction is needed for human happiness, and that we become depressed and otherwise mentally ill in prolonged isolation also makes sense in light of this. 

The thing is, though, a lot of the skills required for sustaining social relationships (Memory , attention to detail, pattern recognition, ingenuity, idea refinement and quick thinking) are directly transferable to IQ related purposes, so the connection to EQ isn't readily made as a result.


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## Scarlet.Black (Jan 6, 2016)

RestlessCryptid said:


> How many NTs have this as a problem?


I have never seen anyone to be uncomfortable because someone else is smarter. And I hang out with Thinkers all the time. But I have seen people been uncorfortable when people say something "smart" but totally abrupt or ill-timed. So it is not the smartness that makes people uncomfortable. We Feelers often prefer social intelligence so it's not smartness that makes us uncomfortable but the lack of social awareness. Those ST I know don't focus on things like that neither so they probably don't feel uncomfortable neither. Maybe other NTs would be uncomfortable... but then they seems to think that they are the smartest one in the room themselves so.. nope. I just really can't see this happening. It is probably not what you think it is 

But don't take me wrong - I love the way my INTP confuse people and make so "smart and ill-timed comments" that I can only laugh. She is adorable.


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## txstats (Mar 20, 2016)

I could definitely be much smarter. I think it's my demeanor that makes people uncomfortable.

Once, an INTJ said I was very intimidating and that he found it very off-putting - I very much doubt that he was an INTJ. Of course my response at the time was, "If I intimidate you and you find it off-putting, why are we here?" 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## marbleous (Feb 21, 2014)

Some people become uncomfortable when you correct them because they were really confident that they did everything right and got upset that perhaps their thinking needs to be changed fundamentally. It can be really exhausting to have to fix the concepts in your head all of the time.

Though the smartest people I have known have had the most adaptable brains; instead of becoming uncomfortable at a possible correction or challenge to their thinking, they welcome it graciously as it they see it as an opportunity to fortify their way of thinking and to stretch their understanding of something. Rather than feeling threatened by other smart people, they are curious about other intelligent people, like you, and glad to share their curiosity.


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## Judgment_Knight (Feb 1, 2015)

Whenever I say something pretentious, I always make sure to disown the comment by saying I ripped it off of Youtube or some other source.


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## jvsummit101 (Apr 22, 2016)

In school, I would usually just sit there and get lost in my own plans to blow the building up. But, when I did say something it would just go right over people's heads. One time, somebony actually came up to me during class and said "I don't even understand what you just said. I feel like I'm not even smart enough to be in this class anymore". It makes having friends difficult because I scare everyone away. My friends were always the punks who didn't care that I was smart, just that I was a lot of fun to be around.


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## Derange At 170 (Nov 26, 2013)

It's not that I necessarily think of myself as intelligent, but I have noticed that people think I'm intimidating because of that reason. Mostly in group settings. And the annoying thing is, this happens at a fucking university.

When we had to debate things one-on-one for an assignment during philosophy they were actually very, very curious about my thoughts and really interested in what I thought and how my thought process worked. I think it all depends on the situation.


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## Jamaia (Dec 17, 2014)

This is pretentious trolling unless there's an intelligent point to all this. How to Have a Great Conversation (with Examples) - wikiHow tells us how the more attractive and therefore more intelligent people converse without making others uncomfortable.

Have your pick on these likeable conversation starters:

I just learned two new words today, haecceity and quiddity. What are your thoughts on medieval philosophy? 
(This offers an interesting topic and tells something about me without over-sharing. Asking an open-ended question allows the conversation to develop naturally.)

OR

I love the coffee here. What's your favorite roast?
(This shows that I'm interested in talking and am beginning the conversation in a completely natural way with an open-ended question.)


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## Pifanjr (Aug 19, 2014)

I'm surprised by the number of people who react negatively to this thread, as if the people who struggle with this are to blame because they haven't managed to develop the skills to make other people comfortable. Developing those skills isn't trivial and most people who complain here probably are trying or have tried to work on that skill, because it's not like making other people uncomfortable is fun.

The idea that smarter is always better is harmful for both smart and dumb people.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

I don't waste my time with people who are not able to understand me or my point of view. I speak fast and to the point, using the right word for the right thing, and not simplifying for the sake of convenience. I accept to loose time by doing it for only one reason, I'm paid for it, and the guy is my client, more than that, I'll make him believe the idea is from him.

When I feel that people are not understanding me, or if he stands on short sight, I feel bored (at least), I kill the conversation politely and I leave the guy, trying to find someone more interesting. Like that nobody feels uncomfortable.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

Jamaia said:


> This is pretentious trolling unless there's an intelligent point to all this. How to Have a Great Conversation (with Examples) - wikiHow tells us how the more attractive and therefore more intelligent people converse without making others uncomfortable.


I honestly couldn't find anything interesting into this article... Such 'new perfect pseudo PNL manager' make me feel i'm talking with a wall...


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## Jamaia (Dec 17, 2014)

Ultr4 said:


> I honestly couldn't find anything interesting into this article... Such 'new perfect pseudo PNL manager' make me feel i'm talking with a wall...


I don't know what PNL means. I challenge you to find a conversation guide with more attractive (intelligent, good) people in it. Like this one, gorgeous:










She's not into your argumentative style. Would you rather talk about Thomas Aquinas or your favorite PerC roast? Aquinas is safe as long as you don't make it about Christianity or books, she doesn't like that kind of topics.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

I would first start with the weather easy one, whatever she answers I make an analogie with the strike that are a pain in the ass for lot of people actually, and then whatever she answered, the debate has started and derives on politics, economics, and she didn't saw it coming. After a few time, she will see that she have opinions, and when she feels she's got the right one. If she's sexy i let her the last word, if not.. I'm right (whatever is my side).
Second way she has a job related to mine, I take as many info as I can on challengers, customers, she talk about herself, her problems, I make her laugh in order to keep the flow of info continue, etc. then $$$ opportunities.

There are plenty way to discuss without being as empty as a "friends" character.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

Jamaia said:


> I don't know what PNL means. I challenge you to find a conversation guide with more attractive (intelligent, good) people in it. Like this one, gorgeous:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


5 Steps to Start a Tinder Conversation Smoothly EVERY Time | Tinder Seduction

and 

Indirect Vs. Direct Game: Which Is Really Better When You Approach A Beautiful Girl?


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## Jamaia (Dec 17, 2014)

Ultr4 said:


> 5 Steps to Start a Tinder Conversation Smoothly EVERY Time | Tinder Seduction


Emily, 23, is not hotter than my girl and the rest (except the horse) seemed to have oddly distorted features. 


> Indirect Vs. Direct Game: Which Is Really Better When You Approach A Beautiful Girl?


The girls were just objects, they didn't speak so this doesn't count.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

Jamaia said:


> Emily, 23, is not hotter than my girl and the rest (except the horse) seemed to have oddly distorted features.
> 
> *The girls were just objects*, they didn't speak so this doesn't count.


What did you expect?


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## Jamaia (Dec 17, 2014)

Ultr4 said:


> What did you expect?


:shocked:

In my link they were active subjects...


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

Jamaia said:


> :shocked:
> 
> In my link they were active subjects...


I'm not into cartoon, I prefer flesh.


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## Jamaia (Dec 17, 2014)

Ultr4 said:


> I'm not into cartoon, I prefer flesh.


You mean to say you are giving up? I've got something for you, for the next time you feel like a challenge is too much: How to Face Challenges (with Pictures) - wikiHow :happy:


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

Jamaia said:


> You mean to say you are giving up? I've got something for you, for the next time you feel like a challenge is too much: How to Face Challenges (with Pictures) - wikiHow :happy:


You're full of internet wikihow knowledge. Exciting.


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## Jamaia (Dec 17, 2014)

Flattering will get you far, @Ultr4 :happy:


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## smokeafish (Jun 21, 2014)

I make people uncomfortable for many reasons, being smart is one of them lol. The others include my absolute refusal to follow anybody else's codes of conduct, not standing on ceremony, my tendency to intensely stare in someones eyes for a minute a time without looking away (I forget that that's not ok lol), my questioning anything I see as illogical and my conviction in my beliefs and the temerity with which I argue them. 
Occasionally I deem somebody worthy of hearing my stream of consciousness, that usually unnerves them, not that it's necessarily being really smart but they can't really handle the depth of analysis/deductive determinism, which I guess is actually kind of smart by most peoples standards. I am irked that the standards are so low.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Pifanjr said:


> I'm surprised by the number of people who react negatively to this thread, as if the people who struggle with this are to blame because they haven't managed to develop the skills to make other people comfortable. Developing those skills isn't trivial and most people who complain here probably are trying or have tried to work on that skill, because it's not like making other people uncomfortable is fun.
> 
> The idea that smarter is always better is harmful for both smart and dumb people.


There is much truth to this statement.

I don't really get "offended" by anything though... must be something of a feely-person's issue, since I like people to question and critize me about things I've never thought of before.

For example, all those radical religious people. Never once in their life taking the time to question their beliefs, morals, priorities, ethnics. I'm not saying religion is bad, I myself am Catholic but I started out agnostic, and I certainly don't believe anyone can ever be truly solid in their faith if they haven't doubted it at least once.

Knowing oneself consists of knowing you're pick out of all the various other options. In other words, you won't know what flavor you like best until you try all of them and see.

But a lot of times people are just running from things. Maybe even some of of those super smart people are just nervous because previous social attempts haven't worked out for them before.

Yes, it's likely insecurity. People like to think they're good at everything and when someone comes in and rocks the boat they lash out negatively. Simple as that.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

RestlessCryptid said:


> There is much truth to this statement.
> 
> I don't really get "offended" by anything though... must be something of a feely-person's issue, since I like people to question and critize me about things I've never thought of before.
> 
> ...


1: What does it mean? Faith is a jail. I can't understand how we can stand on strong belief, more than that, especially regarding religion nor those spiritual bullshit. Life is just a specific arrangement of mater. Nothing can demonstrate that life is more than that actually.


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## Hunter512 (Aug 29, 2014)

I accidentally posted a duplicate when trying to edit this reply, ignore it.


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## Hunter512 (Aug 29, 2014)

I constantly get remarks on my intelligence. I don't see myself as much of an intelligent person, though. I'm especially illiterate when it comes to social and romantic things, and I am a poor speaker. But I feel like people see me as intelligent because I actually think, I actually care about things, I actually pursue my interests. I don't see why these things are praised for. To me they seem like some of the basic things that make people human. It puzzles me.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Ultr4 said:


> 1: What does it mean? Faith is a jail. I can't understand how we can stand on strong belief, more than that, especially regarding religion nor those spiritual bullshit. Life is just a specific arrangement of mater. Nothing can demonstrate that life is more than that actually.


Uh... I kind of set the Atheist bait out didn't I... I guess I'll take responsibility then and give you an answer.

When I said solid, I meant not just blindly following whatever you were raised as, or whatever other people want you to follow.

I was agnostic as a child, I questioned everything, and no matter how much certain religions bash on agnostics, doubt is very natural. It even says in the bible, Peter denied Jesus three times. 

In a way I guess I'm still a little agnostic in that I don't think people _know_ anything. I mean we can try but our brains weren't exactly meant to understand such depths. When it comes down to it we're all only human. Trying to judge the whole eternity of the universe is pretty arogant. That's why I don't put myself up on a pedistal for being better than anyone else in that feild.

In my last post, I was simply trying to say I think people should question themselves more.

An example of what happens when people don't question themselves is creationism. People blowing over the beauty of evolution... That pisses me off. We _have_ tangable evidence supporting it, and it's just ignorant to reject that. 

Science shouldn't distract from your religious life, it should co-exist with and amplify it. 

Atheists are always asking to have proof for everything, but in my humble opinion, proving something like whether or not a God exists is pretty futile, since faith was never about knowing in the first place, it was always about believing. You either believe or you don't, it's your choice, I just think when it comes down to making a descision it should be one that was well thought out.


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## Ultr4 (Feb 11, 2015)

I'm always asking myself, how can it be possible to be NT and christian.. For me it would be like living with a black hole in my mindset.


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## RestlessCryptid (Apr 6, 2015)

Ultr4 said:


> I'm always asking myself, how can it be possible to be NT and christian.. For me it would be like living with a black hole in my mindset.


My brother's an ENTJ and he's in the same boat I'm in. Sort of agnostic, sort of Catholic.

I know several theistic NTs, we just tend to be a little more laid back.

It really depends on how you were raised. Like, I think I'd probably have some harder feelings with religion if I'd been raised by certain denominations of Christianity that incouraged not questioning things, and a lot of them do. 

But the Catholic Church accepts the big bang, as well as evolution, Pope Francis litterally said, "God is not a magician." This is because the Vadican is open to new ideas, and uses scientific studies to help enhance faith. 

Most Jehovah's witnesses, Mormons, and Evangelicals still hold firm on their creationist ideas though. They take a litteral interperetaion of the bible. 

I get sort of annoyed with Baptists. It seems whenever I meet one they try and convert me. First question they'll often ask is, "Do you go to Church?" Then when I answer innocretly that I got to Mass they go about trying to bring me over to the light side. It's super annoying... Catholicism doesn't do this, at least we're not supposed to. We also don't condemn or persecute against gays, we simply accept that they think differently and treat them how one would treat any other human being.


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## Artificial_Lifeform (Jul 22, 2015)

It's not my intelligence that makes people uncomfortable - it's the fact that I'm always honest about what I think, and don't really care that much about social conventions unless they make sense.


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## Aladdin Sane (May 10, 2016)

RestlessCryptid said:


> How many NTs have this as a problem?


I don't think many people have this problem to be honest. Unless you are Stephen Hawking.


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## Wolf (Mar 20, 2016)

I don't think that I'm so smart or intelligent that it makes other people uncomfortable.

If I made someone feel uncomfortable, it is probably because of my objective / to-the-point mindset. I guess that some might call it "smart", I wouldn't label it as that though. I don't like to bother with small-talk and meaningless interaction, and I'm going to cut it off if I get bored or just can't be bothered. You'll start getting a lot of brief, one-word answers and I will probably look very indifferent and unconcerned with you. 

I can't apologize for it. I just don't have time or energy to waste doing things that I don't enjoy.

:tongue:


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