# ENOUGH with the typist foolishness.



## VioletTru (Jun 24, 2012)

Old Intern said:


> If you have to get super protective about making sure we all know that people are individuals, duh,
> then how is there anything left for learning or using type for anything helpful at all. Categorical thinking does not mean an inability to see exceptions or an inability to take in new information. If you can't be categorical you can't learn anything, because everything is all brand new all over again.


But categorical thinking isn't the same as stereotyping. Clearly, the fact that we are either biologically male/female, Asian/Caucasian/Black/Latino, or xSxP/xSxJ/xNFx/xNTx is going to give us insight on who we are, externally and internally. We can't deny that. However, the problem is when one makes negative assumptions about _personalities,_ which are totally complex, and fail to look past a person's category, solely based on a few people that they've met or out of their biased experiences. 

I guess I haven't made it clear in the OP, reading some of these responses, but my point _isn't_ to turn a blind eye to type. Rather, to seek to understand type, but make sure that we don't leave our perceptions about people at _just _that.


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## War pigs (Sep 12, 2012)

meh meh typical INFP, because everything is about values and ponies and shit..
People are computer programs, 16 types, that's it

PS: I'm just kidding, great point  it does sound lyrical though, INFP..


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## VioletTru (Jun 24, 2012)

SychthIce said:


> meh meh typical INFP, because everything is about values and ponies and shit..
> People are computer programs, 16 types, that's it


Are you and @Sporadic Aura ganging up on me?! How dare you degrade my values and beautiful ponies and turn people into robots, WAHAHAHA *precedes to cry INFP crocodile tears*

(Kidding.)



SychthIce said:


> PS: I'm just kidding, great point  it does sound lyrical though, INFP..


Why tank yoo. But what do you mean by the last part?


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## War pigs (Sep 12, 2012)

TMPEH said:


> Are you and @_Sporadic Aura_ ganging up on me?! How dare you degrade my values and beautiful ponies and turn people into robots, WAHAHAHA *precedes to cry INFP crocodile tears*
> 
> (Kidding.)
> 
> ...


Hahahaha
I meant your point about typism, still came out in the typical poetic infp thing. I missed that


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## Foibleful (Oct 2, 2012)

I totally agree with you. "Do all INFJ women have unibrows?" Seriously??? :laughing:


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## VioletTru (Jun 24, 2012)

Foibleful said:


> I totally agree with you. "Do all INFJ women have unibrows?" Seriously??? :laughing:


 Oh dear, if they weren't kidding, then that's amusing and scary at the same time. Do you have a link to that thread/post?


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## Foibleful (Oct 2, 2012)

TMPEH said:


> Oh dear, if they weren't kidding, then that's amusing and scary at the same time. Do you have a link to that thread/post?


Sorry if that was confusing. I made it up to illustrate my point. There wasn't a real thread on that...yet.


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## Mammon (Jul 12, 2012)

We should try and understand eachother. Oh wait wasn't that the reason personality typing exists in the first place? Hmm.
Just imagine if it became accepted world wide and a new Adolf Hitler person popped into the picture.

Typism is so rediculous. Hey I like to mostly use this, this and this part of my brain to enjoy my existance. What?! YOU [insert bs here]!!!
Fcking hell... Seriously?


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## Laguna (Mar 21, 2012)

I think there is some level of inherent typism that we do simply by talking about our differences- but true typism where others are made to feel shut out or inferior to another Type- definitely has taken place here sadly.


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## Old Intern (Nov 20, 2012)

Symantics, words and people's subjective associations with words. Trends and what people believe is the popular cool thing to be, for this minute or ths year; that is all that is the problem here. If you feel bad about how your type is perceived or described then why bother to even look at the theory or the tests at all? Why don't you just go to someone who knows you in your real life and ask them for a hug?

The reputation an ENTP has for not finishing things, maybe even being an ass full of hot air, Now should I go off somewhere and cry because this makes me inferior to someone who wants to be like mother Theresa?


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## Dejune (Jan 27, 2013)

Thanks for the discussion points everyone. I started looking into mbti because I noticed that there were certain things I really did well and other areas I had great weaknesses in. I also noticed that most of the people I am around all of the time tend to have the same weaknesses and MBTI is really helpful for helping me understand this and helping me figure out who I need to connect with to help me with the things that I frankly suck at. My type has a bit of a history of creating a lot of unfinished projects as you probably know. The thing I like so much about the system is that it helps me understand the people that I have been staying away from. I have been instinctively avoiding people that are controlling and there are literally whole categories of types that I don't have in my life at all. But not I know I need those people. Now I understand why those people act the way they do. Now I understand what motivates them and what they need to feel fulfilled and maybe how we can even create together. Typism makes a lot of sense because we are often coming from such different places and it makes it really hard to understand each other, but I'm choosing to use this information to understand instead of keeping people away and increasing my compassion for them.


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## Inveniet (Aug 21, 2009)

Basically there will always be a divide between those that know and don't know.
The ones who don't know create those threads out of ignorance.
You can't expect ignorant people to act up.
Some are from trolls true, but the amount of thread suggests ignorance.
They see all the threads and decide to copy it as that must obviously be the right way to gain the info.
Then other misguided people join in and spew misinformation.
I don't think that humanity is supposed to be enlightened on a mass scale.
It doesn't seem a likely fate for this race.


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## FlightsOfFancy (Dec 30, 2012)

While we're at it let's rid of:
Racism
Sexism
Cultism 
Jism

and yeah everything else. Humans are going to try to climb the echelon in some way, be it racially or some other abstract means. Just ignore it. Not gonna change.


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## Dejune (Jan 27, 2013)

FlightsOfFancy said:


> While we're at it let's rid of:
> Racism
> Sexism
> Cultism
> ...


Maybe not the masses, but maybe the people around me is a good start.


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## Mai Valentine (Jan 29, 2013)

@Acerbusvenator

Really? Te is not blunt? That's a joke. Then why are there so many confrontations between Te users and Fe users then? Te is a very objective and non-personal function. It is naturally "down to business" and focused on results. It doesn't really care about being seen as "socially friendly" like an Fe user. Yes, Te users can be friendly but it's not the same way that an Fe user does it. Fe users can literally "feel out" a room and see if they are offending people. Te users on the other hand just have to basically learn from experience to know if they are offending people. To many Fe users, Te users come off as "unfriendly" and "impolite".


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## fihe (Aug 30, 2012)

one time I made a jokingly typist post in Spam World and people actually got offended, and the thread was eventually closed. I'm surprised that people would allow themselves to get offended by anything in Spam World


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Mai Valentine said:


> @_Acerbusvenator_
> 
> Really? Te is not blunt? That's a joke. Then why are there so many confrontations between Te users and Fe users then? Te is a very objective and non-personal function. It is naturally "down to business" and focused on results. It doesn't really care about being seen as "socially friendly" like an Fe user. Yes, Te users can be friendly but it's not the same way that an Fe user does it. Fe users can literally "feel out" a room and see if they are offending people. Te users on the other hand just have to basically learn from experience to know if they are offending people. To many Fe users, Te users come off as "unfriendly" and "impolite".


Read up on MBTI.
Being blunt is lack of social skills, MBTI is not about skills.


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## VioletTru (Jun 24, 2012)

huesos said:


> one time I made a jokingly typist post in Spam World and people actually got offended, and the thread was eventually closed. I'm surprised that people would allow themselves to get offended by anything in Spam World


Meh, there's a reason why it's called 'Spam World'- for shits and giggles, and nothing too serious. Heck, even I post there sometimes (i.e. http://personalitycafe.com/gossip/101667-push-nf-off-cliff-4.html#post3353613 )

Although I'm curious, what was the thread that you posted in about?


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## fihe (Aug 30, 2012)

TMPEH said:


> Although I'm curious, what was the thread that you posted in about?


I said I hated feeling types


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## VioletTru (Jun 24, 2012)

huesos said:


> I said I hated feeling types


D'aww. Well I have to admit, if it was just 'I hate feeling types' and nothing else, then I could see how people would take offense to that (even though it was in Spam World). The internet is tricky; a joke will be obvious to certain people, and not so apparent to others unless worded in a certain manner.

Anyway, we're not always %100 responsible for how others interpret what we intended to say, but a little caution (not too much) can help get the message across better.


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## Mai Valentine (Jan 29, 2013)

Acerbusvenator said:


> The T functions have nothing to do with neither values nor emotions.
> The F functions have nothing to do with emotions.
> 
> To be fair, nothing you write is even at the level of being funny or interesting.
> You give attributes to categories that are completely inanimate. That is however kinda funny. It's like saying "chairs are happy people".


You have got to be kidding me! Fi is all about emotions and values and Fe is about the most emotional function you can get! Plus Ti and Te are all about logic. Where the hell did you learn mbti?


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## pizzapie (Oct 23, 2012)

Mai Valentine said:


> You have got to be kidding me! Fi is all about emotions and values and Fe is about the most emotional function you can get! Plus Ti and Te are all about logic. Where the hell did you learn mbti?


Hate to get myself involved in this, but hold on. As a Te user, I find this hilarious. Being blunt has nothing to do with functions. At all. I was going to write a long post with a billion examples but there's just no sense in it. Now just stop arguing, no one even cares anymore if you're right or wrong. People reading this thread just want you to stop so the actual discussion can continue.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Going back to the actual topic.
There is healthy stereotyping/generalizations and then there is unhealthy.

*Examples of healthy stereotyping/**generalizations*
People waving guns at you = you will likely get hurt
Someone with a vicious face might be dangerous
Someone following you in a dark night might mean to do harm

*Examples of unhealthy stereotyping/generalizations*
Men are strong and do all the work.
Women aren't as smart as a man.
Women can’t do as good of a job as a man.
Girls are not good at sports.
Guys are messy and unclean.

The healthy stereotypes helps you survive. It tells friend from foe, safe from unsafe etc.
The unhealthy stereotypes however doesn't help you survive, it doesn't tell friend from foe it has no real applicable use. They are just dirt throwing from one side to the other.

In MBTI the healthy stereotypes would be something like
"ISTJs like it when you talk clearly and to the point with the use of fact."
Whereas unhealthy is something like
"Feelers are dumb"
"Thinkers are smart"

Same goes here. The healthy stereotypes helps you communicate smoother with people, the unhealthy is just throwing dirt at the other side.


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## Entropic (Jun 15, 2012)

Mai Valentine said:


> You have got to be kidding me! Fi is all about emotions and values and Fe is about the most emotional function you can get! Plus Ti and Te are all about logic. Where the hell did you learn mbti?


I hate to tell you, but you're actually incorrect. F and T are about certain ways of evaluating the world around you, or more specifically, the data gathered by your perception functions.


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## Death Persuades (Feb 17, 2012)

Wallmaster said:


> Sensors are inferior.


Lol. Somone let the MBTI get too high up his a... mind....


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## Mai Valentine (Jan 29, 2013)

pizzapie said:


> Hate to get myself involved in this, but hold on. As a Te user, I find this hilarious. Being blunt has nothing to do with functions. At all. I was going to write a long post with a billion examples but there's just no sense in it. Now just stop arguing, no one even cares anymore if you're right or wrong. People reading this thread just want you to stop so the actual discussion can continue.


Yes 378 and 358 Te users are especially blunt. 



LeaT said:


> I hate to tell you, but you're actually incorrect. F and T are about certain ways of evaluating the world around you, or more specifically, the data gathered by your perception functions.


The F functions do involve feeling though and the T functions do involve logic though. Plus the F functions do involve values. I can cite references if you would like, but you're totally wrong.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

Mai Valentine said:


> I can cite references if you would like, but you're totally wrong.


Actually, you're wrong and @LeaT is correct.


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## Mai Valentine (Jan 29, 2013)

koalaroo said:


> Actually, you're wrong and @_LeaT_ is correct.


How do you figure?


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## pizzapie (Oct 23, 2012)

Mai Valentine said:


> Yes 378 and 358 Te users are especially blunt.


Did you miss the whole point of my post...

I can still give those examples. I wasn't bluffing.


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## koalaroo (Nov 25, 2011)

Mai Valentine said:


> How do you figure?


Because both T & F functions are evaluative functions.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

I hate to get involved again, but I found this in Naomi Quenk's book, believe it was said by Jung (do know he said something like this anyways).
You asked for facts Mai and here are some of them.
What's your "facts"? and who wrote them?

*Feeling*
It is true that feelings, if they have an emotional character, are accompanied by physiological effects; but there are definitely feelings which do not change the physiological condition. These feelings are very mental, they are not of an emotional nature.That is the distinction I make. Inasmuch as feeling is a function of values, you will readily understand that this is not a physiological condition. It can be something as abstract as abstract thinking. You would not expect abstract thinking to be a physiological condition. 
Abstract thinking is what the term denotes. Differentiated thinking is rational; and so feeling can be rational in spite of the fact that many people mix up the terminology. (1976b, p. 30)

What I mean by feeling in contrast to thinking is a judgment of value; agreeable or disagreeable, good or bad, and so on. Feeling so defined is not an emotion or affect, which is, as the words convey, an involuntary manifestation. Feeling as I mean it is a judgment without any of the obvious bodily reactions that characterize an emotion. Like thinking, it is a rational function. (p. 219)

*Thinking*
If you know that thinking is highly differentiated, then feeling is undifferentiated. What does that mean? Does it mean these people have no feelings? No, on the contrary.They say, “I have very strong feelings. I am full of emotion and temperament.”These people are under the sway of their emotions, they are caught by their emotions, they are overcome by their emotions at times. If, for instance, you study the private lives of professors it is a very interesting study. If you want to be fully informed as to how the intellectual behaves at home, ask his wife and she will be able to tell you a story! (1976b, p. 18)


The feeling of the introverted thinking type is extraverted. He has the same kind of strong, loyal and warm feeling described as typical for the extraverted thinking type, but with the difference that the feeling of the introverted thinking type flows toward definite objects. (1976b, pp. 18, 19)


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## firedell (Aug 5, 2009)

Mai Valentine said:


> How do you figure?


Fi, Fe, Ti, and Te are all judging functions. One is subjective (introverted) and the other is objective (extraverted). Fi, and Fe aren't emotional, it's that they they consider emotions/values more often when making a decision rather than someone who was a dominant Te or Ti user.

That's not to say Te and Ti user's are robot's. I have met some ISTP's who come off more emotional than I do. I think it's more to do with the person.


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## Mai Valentine (Jan 29, 2013)

They aren't of an emotional nature? Really? That's bullshit. Fi and Fe are definitely emotional functions I like the way that the user @marzipan put it in this thread...

http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/59773-fe-fi-when-emotional-palettes-collide.html


> Fi (empathy) and Fe (sympathy) are: Two value systems; Two emotional palettes.
> Fe says: Social norms; Ethics of the Group (we do what is in the best interest of "us"); Happy, Sad, Sorrow, Loss, Joy...etc.
> Fe is: what "I" want and what "We" want. Fe is social adhesive that binds one person to another. Fe is a feeling of "connection" to another person or group.
> Fi on the other hand is like a sink for all the Fe. Fi tells you: What "they" want. Fi, in this way, isolates the individual from the group. Fi separates the individual from other people.
> ...


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## jontherobot (Sep 11, 2012)

what good is studying a field of dichotomies if i cannot polarize the masses?


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## Old Intern (Nov 20, 2012)

Old Intern said:


> *Fe and Fi are not emotions.
> The example below has emotion in it but I want to point out what is function, where the introversion and extoversion fits in and where the emotion is separate
> *
> *I think you can see that the overall post (*below) is emotional but Fe or Fi is about perspective. Either one could be emotional or non-emotional in the sense of e-motion, your body actually having reaction of physiology.*
> ...


* Te and Fi example


niss said:


> *Woman at the front counter:* Blah, blah, blah (explains long problem of car not working).
> 
> niss: (recognizing symptom and knowing that this repair will involve reprogramming a new PCM, which was not available to anyone but the dealer at that time). To get that repaired, you're gonna have to take it to the dealer.
> 
> Woman now morphed into a crazy alien: (head spinning around like in the exorcist) I don't have to take it anywhere. I can do what I please, you &$*# know-it-all cracker!


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

@Old Intern - 

Unless I am misunderstanding the point you are trying to make, the interactions in the posts you have quoted are less about functions and more indicative of values and experiences.


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## Old Intern (Nov 20, 2012)

*Im giving you an example of Fi - in action. and contrasting with what Fe is. *
Fi is a function that assigns value. This is good, this is bad, right, wrong, worthy of my time or respect, not worthy, etc. *All of our introverted functions are making an internal evaluation* thus I not E. Ti says it is logical, plausiblie useable - or not, Si seeks familiarity without words, in one way or another it is internal processing whereas E is just gathering data about what is out there.

People and the combinations of how they use these functions and how their emotions play off things is another matter. I am describing how Fi is being superimposed or assumed on things when people who are on a site about type but they are getting all bent about being categorized. 

"Entp's don't like to finishing anything" is not different to me than saying my eyes are brown, I mean, eyes provable like Te and type is more like Ti but it is not Fi. 

It is Fi that would say or *hear* the same statement as Entp's are good or Entp's are bad.


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## Acerbusvenator (Apr 12, 2011)

Mai Valentine said:


> They aren't of an emotional nature? Really? That's bullshit. Fi and Fe are definitely emotional functions I like the way that the user @_marzipan_ put it in this thread...
> 
> http://personalitycafe.com/cognitive-functions/59773-fe-fi-when-emotional-palettes-collide.html


Yea, because some random girl on the internet knows more about typology than the "father of modern typology" (Carl Jung).


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## madhatter (May 30, 2010)

TMPEH said:


> *grabs some buttered popcorn and watches own thread*
> 
> Anyone else want some?
> View attachment 61858


Why thank you...don't mind if I do.


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## madhatter (May 30, 2010)

firedell said:


> That's not to say Te and Ti user's are robot's. I have met some ISTP's who come off more emotional than I do. I think it's more to do with the person.


True story...especially if we're in the grip of inferior Fe.


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## madhatter (May 30, 2010)

And madhatter the thread-killer strikes again (lol).


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## BigDaddyPalpatine (Aug 2, 2010)

Excellent point. Now strike me down with all of your personality, and your journey to the Jung side will be complete. Ha ha ha ha....


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