# Affection or sex?



## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

I'm curious how different types respond to non- sexual affection from the opposite sex, or from anyone you are attracted to. Do sensing types see physical touch as more sexual? Is type a factor in how we respond to touch?

Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?

Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?


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## Mind Marauder (Nov 12, 2009)

I like non-sexual affection from the opposite sex. For me, intention (sexual or non-sexual) is very easily read through physical touch. I really only feel teased when someone is actively teasing me. I don't feel teased if the other simply doesn't want anything more. That [simply not wanting more] actually leaves me quite cold.


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## Spooky (Oct 30, 2008)

Lilsnowy said:


> I'm curious how different types respond to non- sexual affection from the opposite sex, or from anyone you are attracted to. Do sensing types see physical touch as more sexual? Is type a factor in how we respond to touch?
> 
> Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?
> 
> Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?


I can't help but to view touching (the opposite gender) as somewhat sexual even if it's not intentional; especially if I'm attracted to her.


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## Aerorobyn (Nov 11, 2009)

I agree with everything Spooky said; just scratch out the "her" and replace it with _"him"_.


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

Spooky and Aerorobyn, Is it because being introverted, you're less comfortable with touch, so it's more stimulating? Tyring to understand.


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## Spooky (Oct 30, 2008)

Lilsnowy said:


> Spooky and Aerorobyn, Is it because being introverted, you're less comfortable with touch, so it's more stimulating? Tyring to understand.


No, I'm not uncomfortable with touch at all. I like it.


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## Singularity (Sep 22, 2009)

Even if I am attracted to the person, if the touching is non-sexual, I respond non-sexually. If they hug me, then it's just a hug. I wouldn't take that as them teasing me at all. If they touched me in a sexual way, like caressing me, holding me (not like a friendly hug), or something like that, then I would respond sexually.


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## INFpharmacist (Aug 7, 2009)

Singularity said:


> Even if I am attracted to the person, if the touching is non-sexual, I respond non-sexually. If they hug me, then it's just a hug. I wouldn't take that as them teasing me at all. If they touched me in a sexual way, like caressing me, holding me (not like a friendly hug), or something like that, then I would respond sexually.


I totally agree. It's either sexual or it isn't, meaning I don't see any gray area (even if the other person was trying to incorporate or overlap sexual meaning into what is typically considered non-sexual).

And if someone tries to caress and I don't want to receive it sexually, then I won't. I'll just hug them back or back away entirely.


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## SeekJess (Nov 1, 2009)

I'm not a touchy feely person at all, but when people who are touchy feely with me, and I'm attracted to them.. I think I would take it as they have feelings for me, and I guess I would respond sexually? even if it is out of my nature..


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## addle1618 (Oct 31, 2008)

Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?

I don't respond. Well there was 1 girl I did, but in all generality I am too afraid.

Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?

I have never attempted to follow up or see if they want more. Better a fantasy than an uncomfortable situation. :wink:


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

Hugs or other physical affection feel like love to me. I can seperate affection from sex, but how many times I've hugged a male and he'll want to kiss me too. And I'll think, _why does it have to be about sex? I was just hugging you._

I like it in Scary Movie 3 when Cindy is hugging George and in her worry she's crying and she says, "It's so hard!" and George says, "Well you're a beautiful woman and you're pressed up against me." And of course she wasn't thinking that at all. 

I really appreciate yout thoughts. Thanks.


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## Spooky (Oct 30, 2008)

A woman at my work hugged me tonight and I kissed her neck, but that's because she kissed mine last night when she hugged me. Granted, alcohol was involved on both occasions, but I don't usually take it upon myself to be overly affectionate unless it is reciprocated.


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## HandiAce (Nov 27, 2009)

Spooky, that's one of the reasons why I never touch people because I'm afraid that people will think I would be asking for a sexual response. Hence, scaring them away from me. I think IXFPs sometimes don't like having their space (I.E. bubble space) invaded.

I think I am a cuddly person, I just don't want to risk making someone feel uncomfortable.


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## amanda32 (Jul 23, 2009)

I have a very difficult time NOT touching people I like, even in a platonic way. I guess, that's the borderline E in me?
I'm ALWAYS hugging and kissing people one the cheek and I think absolutely nothing of it except as an expression of friendship. Now, if sb. I was attracted to did this to me, I would respond sexually but I would try not to let it show. Or I would make a joke about it. 
I think it's almost impossible for people to tell if I'm attracted to them or just being friendly. suckers!


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

Amanda, you and me both. I'm so clueless about some things, it's embarrassing: A boy at work, a 19 year old, (guys, no offense intended with the use of the word boy.) kissed my neck when he hugged me and I didn't know; I thought it was just something brash younger people do today. Later on he cornered me and tried to kiss me for real and I said, "What brought that on?" and he said, "Ever since I kissed your neck I was thinking about that." Hello! How would I know? I kiss and hug people, and if someone's taller, he's bound to get one on the jaw inadvertantly because I'm shooting for his cheek. 

I have a friend who is tons taller but he has kissed me on the neck; he's very affectionate so I hated to say anything, but I finally told him I wouldn't be comfortable with him kissing my neck in front of my husband, so he probbaly shouldn't. He stopped for awhile, but then he did again after we hadn't seen each other in a while. I don't think he means anything by it, but I knew my husband wouldn't appreciate it.


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## Essay (Oct 13, 2009)

Lately I've been taking part in a large amount of cheek kissing with Latin Americans and French people. I can't say that it ever drifted towards sexual for me, and I'm definately accustomed to it by this point. Somehow I don't see it as much of a display of affection---just a formal convention like any other.

Otherwise, when I was younger, I probably would've agreed that there wasn't much of a grey area when it came to physical affection; it was either sexual or it wasn't. Now, however, I feel more skeptical about reading any sexuality into things like that, and I will rarely ever act impulsively unless there's a pretty overt understanding between me and the girl.


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

I used to think I was wierd, because no one seemed as affectionate as I am. My brother was, but in our own family we seemed over the top (compared to everyone else!) with our affection for others. Now I see that there are many who love to make contact with others and feel comfortable getting close, even with people we might not know well. As long as you can tell when it's too much. 

Here I go with a another little example from my life: I worked in a store and a regular customer always got _way_ into my personal space. He would stand so close to me that I would step back, and then closer until I would walk backward and run into an obstacle and couldn't go back any farther. One time I literally ended up leaning back wards to get away from him and I finally said, "Sir, please back up. This is way too close for me." He stepped back, but still stayed too close and I wondered if it's possible to not have any idea about social rules. I didn't feel any sexual vibe, but he was very intrusive.

I always like hugging people I meet from other countries. I have worked with people from several and always enjoy the fact that they are quite physical in greetings. But again not sexual, just affectionate and open.

Now if I'm really attracted to someone, I guess I would call it, _Exquisite Torment of the Hugging Kind_. I have no problem with longing. We all experience it at times. :')


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## DevilDoll (Jul 31, 2009)

Affection is something I tend to have trouble with. I am not an incredibly affectionate person (when I am sober). Yes, I will hug my family or my significant other. Yes, I will kiss him and things like that, but typically I don't make the advances. A lot of people tell me that I come accross as cold and hard because of this. I dated an ENFP for three years and we constantly fought because he thought I didn't love him because I wasn't constantly all over him. I simply tend to respect people's personal space. So, if someone I am interested in walks up and hugs me I will assume it is completely platonic. If he comes up and grabs my ass, or kisses me I will assume it is sexual. If he shows that he is obviously making sexual advances I would have no problem returning the favor. Until then I will stick to a little light flirting. 

Now, this does not apply when I am intoxicated. I become much more outgoing and exceedingly affectionate when I am drunk. That doesn't mean I will walk up to some stragner and make out with them, but I do find myself hugging my friends, and being more sexually assertive with people I am interested in. I feel more comfortable making the first move in this situation. Probably because I am less selfconcious.


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## firedell (Aug 5, 2009)

I could deal with hugs and kisses, and less sex. Sex isn't as meaningful. Sex doesn't make me feel complete, but if there is hugs ect in the mixture, I'd feel like there was an emotional connection. That is what matters most to me.


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## Tal (Oct 19, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> I'm curious how different types respond to non- sexual affection from the opposite sex, or from anyone you are attracted to. Do sensing types see physical touch as more sexual? Is type a factor in how we respond to touch?
> 
> Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?
> 
> Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?


For me it depends a lot on who's doing the touching. When I'm interested in someone and they touch me the affection I give back is both sexual and non-sexual, more of a way of letting them know the sexual option is open if they're interested. When there's no interest it isn't. 

I tend to project when it's ok to touch me and when not. People I don't want touching me usually won't, and if they do I make sure it doesn't happen again with my reaction.


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## The Psychonaut (Oct 29, 2009)

Affection makes uncomfortable...there are very very few exceptions. family affection makes me uncomfortable, random affection makes me uncomfortable...friendly affection makes me uncomfortable...

alcohol helps ease the uneasiness. i get affectionate while drunk...

usually i react to random acts of affection with violence...i just dont like being touched.


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## Fractalist (Dec 12, 2009)

I think effection might be more important to me.


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## Ben (Aug 23, 2009)

I'm pretty sure that at this point in my life, affection means more to me than sex.


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

WannaBgonzo, why do you think it's such a strong reaction against it, yet you are affectionate while drunk? 
If you don't want to answer, it's ok. Just wondering if you know why you feel the way you do.


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## Sunrain (Dec 9, 2009)

Funny - I've never thought about this at all. If I love someone I'm very affectionate and hug them all the time. For example family - hug them, stroke their head.. whatever. 
With girl friends, if I care about them and feel a rush of affection for them, I hug them. In those two cases there's nothing sexual about it of course. 

With guys, if I care about them and feel a rush of affection for them, I hug them. If I'm also attracted to them it feels kiinda sexual, if I'm not it doesn't. I imagine it's the same the other way around, so if someone's attracted to me but I'm just being affectionate I could imagine that they could think there was more in it than just affection. If I hug someone attractive and it turns into something then great, if not never mind . 

And finally if I don't want to hug someone, then at the risk of offending them I just simply don't. That way there's no mis-understanding.. I don't like polite hugging - in my opinion hugging should be a spontaneous expression of 'wanting to hug someone'. simple.


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

What Sunrain said.


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## remer (Dec 10, 2009)

I have a need for affection from others to feel at my best.
These can be words, touch, hugs, gentle strokes, massage, cheeck/neck kiss, lips kiss, kissing, sleeping together, having sex.

When the level of intimacy of the affection grows (getting more sexual) I feel only comfortable doing this with a woman (that I am attracted to.)
With a male, I have never gone further than hugging as far for being affectionate. When we have these playful fights, physical contact can sometimes get very rough 

I approach these levels of intimacy as some form of tiers or stages. They are independent and stand alone from each other. Recently I have been exploring a lot with them and my own boundaries, both sexual and non-sexual, in a polyamoursly way. E.g. How do I feel when I kiss a female friend on the lips while I'm in a relationship with somebody else, with whom I have sex and such. Hard experiences, very grateful to have experienced them.

Since I'm single now, things should be less complicated...last time I met a girl at a bar while I was doing a drink with colleagues. Her friend was bartender, while she was alone I kept her company and we had a really connected conversation. She grabbed my hand and said, I want to be your friend. I felt completely comfortable, in fact I was so relaxed that it didn't felt any sexual feeling, it felt completely normal, and I like it that way. Now she is very attractive and eventually over the days we started lip kissing, then full kissing (dont have a clue, how you call this  and then she asked me if I wanted to come over and sleep together, so I was, yea hell why not, so while kissing did was sexual for me, and although I can imagine what sleeping together might meant, I didn't approached it sexually, and I believe that it must have been very uncomfortable for her, because nothing happened beside a lovely sleep together, and I never heard from her again. I regret that she never spoke of it again, so many possibilities, why limit yourself? I hope it did not offended her in any way, that was not my intention. But I am me.

To be affectionate and know your own boundaries, and also perceive the intentions of others and myself isn't always so clear. But that makes life so excited, finding all these lovely things out, together  But i get disappointed too, why is everything so hard, and then I can understand why people limit themselves, just to keep things simple, but I don't like things limited.

Any of you who is doing or considering Polyamory? Myself, I would never have sex with more than one person at a time, but loving more people at once, very possible for me, and I need to shower affection upon all whom I love.

BTW! What about being affectionate towards an animal? I love to gentle stroke a cat, there is nothing better! They love me unconditionally, and the cat never buggers me with, with having a sexual intention, which I of course have not


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

remer, are you familiar with the Love Languages? Is physcial touch the best way for you to feel loved? I think ENFPs in particular are very hands-on physically affectionate people. Your posts are interesting to me because I need physcial affection to feel my best too and understand how you perceive it. But please be cautious; We're notorious for not seeing a situation clearly because we're at the whim of hormones and magical thinking. 

Some types view kissing or even hugs as leading to sex and will want it to become more. Knowing your own boundaries is important for your emotional and physical safety.


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## remer (Dec 10, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> remer, are you familiar with the Love Languages? Is physcial touch the best way for you to feel loved? I think ENFPs in particular are very hands-on physically affectionate people. Your posts are interesting to me because I need physcial affection to feel my best too and understand how you perceive it. But please be cautious; We're notorious for not seeing a situation clearly because we're at the whim of hormones and magical thinking.
> 
> Some types view kissing or even hugs as leading to sex and will want it to become more. Knowing your own boundaries is important for your emotional and physical safety.


Lilsnowy, I am not familiar with the Love Languages, but I just learned from Google there are five of them, maybe you would like to teach me? 
And oh yes, physical touch is VERY important, I couldn't live without it. Happiness is for me hugging my beloved for-ever, oh while gazing intensely into her eyes.

My love once asked me if I was more happy now I met her and we were together, I KNOW I had to say, yes, of course, you are the world to me, but in fact I said, no I don't feel more happier, but I feel for the first time in my life, real happiness, and in fact, I feel so happy, I can die with having had a good life, she found that a bit strange, but hey, maybe that's why I feel like a ghost sometimes, now that I'm single again, I feel like I am already dead. Lol that was so tragic! I keep on editing this post, because I am so enthusiastic speaking to you. now I am going to catch some sleep, ttyl!

Thanks for your warning, I do understand, but right now I don't try to care too much what other types think, last months life is about me, for a change  Need to balance out I believe! Some ladies got very frustrated with me :blushed:Oh well, life isn't always sunshine and rainbows!

All are equal, all are free, (don't mind the contradiction, we're not in critical thinking forum  What I don't get it in my mind is why some types think differently. I know I greet the world expectantly, but their expectations seem so unethical (having sex after a hug). As an ENFP I know ethics, lol


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## WickedQueen (Jun 1, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> I'm curious how different types respond to non- sexual affection from the opposite sex, or from anyone you are attracted to. Do sensing types see physical touch as more sexual?


I don't know about the other Sensors, but yes, I see physical touch as sexual. This is why I don't like being touch by woman, as I see myself as straight, so when my girl friends touching me too much, I feel awkward and disgusted with them.



> Is type a factor in how we respond to touch?


I believe so. I know that some types likes to touch much, like ENFP, and others don't, like INTJ.



> Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?


Depends on how I feel about him. If I liked the guy, I will respond to his action, faster than he could realize. *evil grin*



> Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?


No, I would feel that he's just playing around with me, and that's just being plain lied, so it will make me upset or angry. IMO, If you don't really mean it, then you shouldn't tease.


.


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## Vanitas (Dec 13, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> I'm curious how different types respond to non- sexual affection from the opposite sex, or from anyone you are attracted to. Do sensing types see physical touch as more sexual? Is type a factor in how we respond to touch?


I can't say about other ENTJs/ NTs, but .. no. I touch my friends plenty, and it doesn't mean anything. I expect the same from them, and hope they don't feel that there's more to it.



> Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?


That depends. In general I usually can tell if someone is sexually attracted to me, if it's a sexual touch, it'd show. I'd respond appropriately to what it is, whether positively or negatively. 



> Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?


If they know about my attraction and is stringing me along, it would show the kind of person they are. But I wouldn't get hurt/ get affected much. It's only a hug. 
If they're a friend who I'm attracted to and have been touchy-feely with from the first place, I probably would categorize it into normal friend-affection. I don't tend to... read too much into things unless they *say* something about it.


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

Thank remer. I don't think it's necessarily unethical to think hugs can lead to sex, but our values might tell us promiscuity is unethical, or leading someone on is unethical. It can be complicated, but the differences in perception can cause problems, that's why I started this thread. 

Wicked queen, thank so much! My experience is that sensers do percieve non sexual affection more sexually. Where I perceive it as physcially pleasurable being close to someone, it's more emotional for me.

remer, here's a link for a test to determine your primary love laguage. 

Love Languages Test
http://www.afo.net/hftw-lovetest.asp


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## remer (Dec 10, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> remer, here's a link for a test to determine your primary love laguage.
> 
> Love Languages Test


Lilsnowy, do you think I'm too open? I had hoped to read more personal stories.

Thank you for the test, the Love Language results affirm what I already know:
"You have been requesting that which would meet your deepest need for emotional love. Your requests, however, might have come across as nagging or criticizing and thus drove your spouse away."

If your theory between the S and N is correct, maybe I shouldn't be attracted to S' so much, I love their concrete look upon the world, it is mind boggling to me, but as for a relationship, it clearly doesn't work, when emotional needs are (too) different.


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

No, remer, I don't think you're too open. Your openess to share your life is very typical of our type! And you will hear plenty of personal stories here, depending on the person and the thread. We all feel a sense of freedom to share, but it just depends. 

We ENFPs are often attracted to S because they compliment us. It will always be challenging to be in realtionships with opposites, at least in some ways. But our different ways of processing and loving make us interesting and exciting to people who are different and make them exciting to us. :') 

I meant to ask you earlier and I forgot, by 'full kissing' do you mean 'making out' like we call it here in the US where it's more intense with necks, hands and maybe more involved?

I was hoping the link I sent you would reveal one of these five love languages as your primary type: 

Words of affirmation 
Physcial touch
Quality time
Gifts
Acts of service

I may have sent the wrong link. If I did, I can try to find another one for you.


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## remer (Dec 10, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> I meant to ask you earlier and I forgot, by 'full kissing' do you mean 'making out' like we call it here in the US where it's more intense with necks, hands and maybe more involved?


Yes, I mean making out, I wondered what it meant, thanks for helping 



Lilsnowy said:


> I was hoping the link I sent you would reveal one of these five love languages as your primary type:
> 
> I may have sent the wrong link. If I did, I can try to find another one for you.


The link you sent was the right one, these were my test results if I recall correctly.

Words of affirmation 8 points 
Physcial touch 10 points
Quality time 6 points
Gifts 1 point
Acts of service 3 points

According to the explanation you can get at maximum 12 points. In my case my primary Love Language is Physical Touch followed by a strong secondary Love Language Words of affirmation.

What are your results? I wonder if an ENFP female scores higher on gifts


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## Gracie (Dec 13, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> I'm curious how different types respond to non- sexual affection from the opposite sex, or from anyone you are attracted to. Do sensing types see physical touch as more sexual? Is type a factor in how we respond to touch?
> 
> Do you respond sexually or non sexually, to physical affection and why?
> 
> Do you feel 'teased' if someone you are attracted to hugs you but doesn't want more?


Personally, I love to receive affection from the opposite sex, be it sexual or not. I would not automatically perceive affection as sexual in intent - it can be very innocuous, especially hugs or squeezing someone's hand, etc. I find it immensely comforting and reassuring to get affection from someone I care about, and who cares about me.

However, in the instance of someone I am very attracted to/in love with, I would find it hard to suppress the "longing" I would feel if they hugged/touched me but it was nonetheless clear that it was nothing more. I would find it easier to abstain from touching them altogether, as being overly physically affectionate with them would just bring all of my feelings for them to the fore and I would find them difficult to hide :blushed:


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

Gracie, I am very much like you! But I hate to abstain from affection, even if it hurts to have the longings. 

Words of Affirmation 9
Physical Touch 9
quality time 7
gifts 4
acts of service 1

Remer, I'm usually tied between the first two love languages, sometimes it's almost a three way tie with quality time. 
I can be happy sitting on the couch, or on the floor, talking to someone, but happier if we're making some small physcial contact while we're talking, like toes or arms touching. I'm not big on gifts, but I feel special to receieve one, especially if it's something personal like a poem. 

But I do have a gift story to share: About 9 years ago, I was healing from an emotional trauma and as part of the process it was suggested I write a song or plant a tree (or some other plant) to celebrate the healing. I hadn't told anyone about this, except my husband and he thought it was kind of silly because he isn't an emotional person. And of all the things I _could_ do, I really wanted to plant a tree. However, it was _November_, so I finally resigned myself to waiting until Spring when the ground would be softer. I couldn't plant a tree in frozen soil.

I was sitting there sniffling with tears in my eyes, wishing I didn't have to wait so long when a good girlfriend from down the street called me out of the blue and said, "I know this is wierd, but we want to give you a tree for your birthday." 
I was so shocked and happy, I started bawling! I told her why and then she was crying too! She said, " If it's ok, I'm sending Mark down with it right now. He'll plant it for you." Her husband walked it down in a wheelbarrow, and I stood there watching him plant the tree, crying the whole time. I really felt it was God providing the tree because it was such a miracle. I mean, who gives a friend a tree as a birthday present?


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## remer (Dec 10, 2009)

Lilsnowy said:


> Remer, I'm usually tied between the first two love languages, sometimes it's almost a three way tie with quality time.
> I can be happy sitting on the couch, or on the floor, talking to someone, but happier if we're making some small physcial contact while we're talking, like toes or arms touching. I'm not big on gifts, but I feel special to receieve one, especially if it's something personal like a poem.
> 
> But I do have a gift story to share...I mean, who gives a friend a tree as a birthday present?


Lilsnowy, thank you for sharing your story. She must be a really good friend, knowing you that well.

It really enlightened me to read about these love languages. Yesterday I saw a documentary about people who use dolls to get them company. Bizarre at first, but I got my interest, I found this movie, Lars and the Real Girl (2007). In this movie the protagonist seems to have emotional problems that hinder his ability to date a real woman and bought himself a real doll in search for love. It was a really amazing story, what I observed was that in the story he is at the doctor and explains that when somebody touches him, it gives him a burning feeling. Much like going outside in the cold without gloves and when going inside you feel the burning while your hands thaw. 

I thought I might have been brash while saying earlier that I found it unethical that a hug leads to sex, I hope nobody was offended, I now better understand why people might think so. Still I am a believer of thinking outside the box, and that movie really was out of the box.

How is your tree doing?


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## Lilsnowy (Sep 9, 2009)

Oh! The tree... it was planted next to two other pines and we used to decorate them all, the outside trees in colr and the middle one white! We moved from that house several years back, and it's in another state, but the great thing is, my husband was working there last week and he drove past the house! he said, "The trees are huge now!" So my little tree is doing well. That's sweet that you asked that. The freind who gave it to me is one of my closest friends even though we live apart. I found the concept of lars somewhat disturbing because the nature of sex dolls is somewhat disturbing to me, but I like how the town had such compassion for him. Thats' what I remember most. 

Thinking outside the box! Always a good choice, remer! Thanks for writing today.


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