# telling the difference between various F types



## Judas (Aug 11, 2010)

Well yah.. I wouldn't say that basing decisions on feeling instead of logic is necessarily worse, generally. It depends on in what arena you make the decision, and for what purpose. For some kind of things and purposes, F make better decisions, in others T:s. One of the most "intelligent" people i know is also an F. 

This is how i view feelers from my viewpoint of being an ENTP, dunno if it is what you meant thou: 

*INFPs*: Big difference between women and men of the kind, the ones i know at least. I usually get a long well with them, they are usually smart, pretty verbal, analytical, and i always have a good time with them. They usually have a laidback nature, are calm, and are very very good-hearted, at least the ones i know. They like to speculate and talk philosphy with me, i kinda feel bad when i shut down their unreasonable ideas with logics. For example, "i wonder what the world would be like without gender roles", for which i argue that it would be completely impossible because of our biology and psychology and so on.. But yeah, i like them.

The INFPs i know might sometimes be stuck in interpreting everybodys actions through their own emotional world and perspective, which leads to some unobjective biases. 

I have great relations with them usually. They are interested in discussing things i am too, but mostly our discussions just end in imaginging fun scenarios.

*ENFPs*: very alike ENTPs , really. Not that outwardly emotional at all. Very fun, usually verry bright. Their perspectives on things differ from mine in a very interesting way, i learn a lot from conversations with ENFPs. We also have a little different ways to reaching the same conclusion. Great fun to be around usually. Their Fi lends them interesting analytical capabilites about people. They still feel pretty logical to me, just more focused at the "emotional" or "warm" side of things, humans, and reality. More "poetic/dramatic" in their thinking, i'm more for logic.

Very perceptive and "deep". I can have GREAT conversations with them.

A relationship with one i wouldn't consider though, I feel we are too similar. I need a J 

*ESFPs*: In my childhood and teenage years, i didn't know any Ns to speak of. The people i best got along with was ESFPs. Great fun, might be very good with language at times, good showmen. Can have pretty good analytical abilites at times, but nothing too abstract. Might be easily hurt. More dependant on approval, more prone to following their feeling-whims than ENFPs for example. 

More showoff than ENFP. "live and let live" attitude between us, usually find my stuff interesting (the ideas i talk about)

*ISFPs*: Real cuties. very warm. Very "cool" in a good way. The most emotional of the types i've yet mentioned, at least what i've come across. Might get hurt easily, spend a lot of time analysing people and their actions. Very stylish, and artistic.
I've got a guy ISFP friend who is very artistic, and very smart. He is very genuinely warm, artistic and chill. Also quite logical and has "depth". 

more artsy. Can sometimes be bothered listening to my stuff.

*ISFJs*: My mother and sister are ISFJs. They have genuine care for people around them, but i feel their "logic" is too clouded by their emotional judgement, and biased to the favor of past judgement, that i really can't think of them as "smart" in THAT way. My sister is in no way stupid, she is well above average, but not quite an original thinker. Bound by convention.

These people also care A LOT about what people think of them. They can talk about things that interset them in a very logical way, but they are quick to anger if i play devils advocate with their favorite beliefs. too conventional to be too interesting conversational partners.

*INFJs*: I only think i know one, and damn she is good. Smart, fun, intuitive, goodnatured, caring. 

I know too few of them to make any generalized statements. The only one i know is awesome though, i was in love with her.
I'm kinda biased here. 

*ENFJs*: Warm, GREAT social skillz, one of the only types who can generally "outmanouver" me socially, at least who i've met. More outwardy emotinal than the other types i've mentioned (ISFJs are outwardly emotinal only to people close to them). ENFJs seem to have a natural feeling for how to make other people feel liked and they have this thing, that whenever they put their focused attention and charm on me I feel like the greatest man in the whole world. And they can charm almost everyone. Might be manipulative if immature.

Also awesome. More outwardly emotional than ENFPs and ESFPs, more intuitive and in a way "deeper" than ESFJ:s. I love them. Their constant emotional ups and downs can be quite wearisome for me, i'm pretty even tempered.

My ex was ENFJ and in her opinion, i was thinking too much about weird things, for example how to develop oneself. I let that opinion stand for her. The other ENFJ i know loves the fact that i care for more complex ideas, and the way i understand things.

*ESFJs*: Charming, but the ones i know are too conventionally minded and "superficial", in the way that they constantly try to attain and display conventionally perceived status and coolness. As superficial aqcuantancies (spelling mf) i can stand them though. 

Never gotten around to talking more "deep" stuff with one. Always happy go lucky pointless conversation and kidding around.


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## DarkSideOfLight (Feb 15, 2011)

darksoul said:


> When feelers get "too emotional", I feel the need to buy them a beer. But that seems to make things worse, for some reason... :mellow:


I have seen this type of solution in one of ENTP's threads. It was something along the lines how to get Fs in a bed naked and happy. So it could mean some happy times though. You must just focus on the steps AFTER the beer has been given to the poor Feeler. Good luck.


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## nottie (Mar 2, 2011)

TiNeSi said:


> I have mentioned ENFPs, but to expand on that and bounce on this post. The ENFP I've known (and for some reason I seem to attract a lot of ENFPs) are much more outwardly emotional than the INFP and ISFJ I've known. They like to hug a lot for instance. (Nothing wrong with that, but I'm not very touchy feely) They might also make me uncomfortable at time by wanting to discuss intimate things in public.
> 
> I actually think that beyond these different ways we express ourselves, the Te vs Ti thing is a cause of bickering for INTP and ENFP, so I'm not sure that strong Te would help! Why do you think that NT see the term "intelligent" only in one way?
> 
> Also, I wouldn' t equate pouting or venting with being emotional, depending on what caused that behaviour. I only find it emotional if it's out of proportion. Venting can be a healthy way to deal with a stressful situation. Pouting might avoid needless outbursts at times.


This whole post is funny to me. xD Ah, perhaps it explains some things about my ENTP friend.

I see her as "emotional" when she's venting about something. After a certain point in the rant I want to slap her. :| Instead, I tell her to deal with the damn problem instead of grumbling about it. (I know some venting is necessary, but often she'd rather vent than do anything, which confuses me. That doesn't make the problem go away!)

On the flip side, I'll mope a lot about things, but I'll try to hide it. xD She views me hiding from problems in my life as being overemotional. I see it as me working out my emotions privately rather than bothering others with 'em.

My INTP friend also likes to wallow over things.. but I won't try to fit how she handles emotions into this. Her bipolar disorder muddies it up.

What you said about wanting to discuss intimate things in public, though.. bah, can't relate to that at all. If one of my friends so much as brings up a crush I have in public, I'm prone to running off. And I have a clear memory of my ENTP trying to hug me in public, and me freezing up over the awkward. She got annoyed with me for a bit.. xD Just goes to show variance in the types, I suppose.


It appears this thread has been dead awhile.. ohwell, already wrote the long post. >_>


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## Istbkleta (Apr 30, 2011)

hmwith said:


> And in terms of "venting", ENTPs are more open about their feelings with the general public than ENFPs, who save such personal feelings for SOs, if anyone.
> 
> See? NTs can feel too!


Thank you! Of course we feel. Just about different feelings like anger, frustration, sulking.

Also ENTPs have a very strong Fe so we might be something like rational ENFJs or something. We are very warm and friendly, unlike most other NT types :tongue:



nottie said:


> my ENTP trying to hug me in public, and me freezing up over the awkward.


That's because we spread the love and hugs even better than ENFPs. Yeah! I am stealing this


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## Protagoras (Sep 12, 2010)

What I dislike about certain Feelers I have met over the years is their tendency to monopolize all emotional matters and act as though I am too unfeeling and can't possibly understand the depths of their emotions. Most Feelers don't do this, but I have met quite a few who do act as though they are morally, socially or culturally superior to me because of their strengths in the 'Feeling trades' (especially NFs tend to do this). Maybe this is just me though...


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## Monte (Feb 17, 2010)

Won't lie, I group a lot of you together... but that's because you all annoy me in the same way so far.

I'm not saying there isn't hope or that I'm closed to idea of meeting a not annoying, high scoring feeler... but I have YET to meet a feeler who didn't annoy the fuck out of me.


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## very bored (Jul 6, 2009)

Monte said:


> Won't lie, I group a lot of you together... but that's because you all annoy me in the same way so far.
> 
> I'm not saying there isn't hope or that I'm closed to idea of meeting a not annoying, high scoring feeler... but I have YET to meet a feeler who didn't annoy the fuck out of me.


I guess I agree with Monte on this, but I think I've liked a lot of the feelers I've met.


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## Istbkleta (Apr 30, 2011)

Elwood92 said:


> What I dislike about certain Feelers I have met over the years is their tendency to monopolize all emotional matters and act as though I am too unfeeling and can't possibly understand the depths of their emotions. Most Feelers don't do this, but I have met quite a few who do act as though they are morally, socially or culturally superior to me because of their strengths in the 'Feeling trades' (especially NFs tend to do this). Maybe this is just me though...


I can confirm your feelings on this 
It gets to some point so unhealthy that I felt the need to stir up trouble on the ENFP subforum.

But of course, in most societies in business and sciences NT's are viewed more positively than feelers, so there is a bright side to all this. Cheer up.


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## nottie (Mar 2, 2011)

Elwood92 said:


> What I dislike about certain Feelers I have met over the years is their tendency to monopolize all emotional matters and act as though I am too unfeeling and can't possibly understand the depths of their emotions. Most Feelers don't do this, but I have met quite a few who do act as though they are morally, socially or culturally superior to me because of their strengths in the 'Feeling trades' (especially NFs tend to do this). Maybe this is just me though...


Really? I usually see thinkers talk about how they're so much better for being able to reason~ things out unlike us girly, whiney feelers.

I didn't think it would spin the other way. xD I like being a feeler, but it usually feels like you guys are in the better position, not gonna lie..


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## Protagoras (Sep 12, 2010)

nottie said:


> Really? _*I usually see thinkers talk about how they're so much better for being able to reason~ things out unlike us girly, whiney feelers.*_
> 
> I didn't think it would spin the other way. xD I like being a feeler, but it usually feels like you guys are in the better position, not gonna lie..


No, I think that is a myth too: that Feelers are somehow so Feeling that they are more social and nice. I actually think that it's the other way around for most Thinkers, when Thinkers hurt each other emotionally there is always a reason, we hurt each other for a logical reason or because we simply didn't notice that we were hurting the other out of social insensitivity. In both scenarios a Thinker would accept that reason as justifiable. If someone has a reason for hurting me and can explain it to me, I feel better because I can assess the situation and treat him/her as an equal. If someone was simply oblivious to my emotions it is justifiable too.

However, it doesn't work like that with Feelers. They can deliberately hurt you out of sheer wrath or out of other emotional motives unknown to me and sometimes even unknown to them. When I confront them with this they usually get very arrogant about their emotional life. They'll say things like "you wouldn't know" and "you don't understand" and when I push them to explain their actions they get more and more defensive about it and usually end up seeking emotional support from others in order to 'outnumber' me in conflict situations. Which doesn't work on me because I'm not a Feeler, but it does strengthen their emotional arrogance if they're supported by friends.

I don't know if you recognize this situation, but this happens a lot between me and Feelers.


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## Istbkleta (Apr 30, 2011)

Elwood92 said:


> No, I think that is a myth too: that Feelers are somehow so Feeling that they are more social and nice. I actually think that it's the other way around for most Thinkers, when Thinkers hurt each other emotionally there is always a reason, we hurt each other for a logical reason or because we simply didn't notice that we were hurting the other out of social insensitivity. In both scenarios a Thinker would accept that reason as justifiable. If someone has a reason for hurting me and can explain it to me, I feel better because I can assess the situation and treat him/her as an equal. If someone was simply oblivious to my emotions it is justifiable too.
> 
> However, it doesn't work like that with Feelers. They can deliberately hurt you out of sheer wrath or out of other emotional motives unknown to me and sometimes even unknown to them. When I confront them with this they usually get very arrogant about their emotional life. They'll say things like "you wouldn't know" and "you don't understand" and when I push them to explain their actions they get more and more defensive about it and usually end up seeking emotional support from others in order to 'outnumber' me in conflict situations. Which doesn't work on me because I'm not a Feeler, but it does strengthen their emotional arrogance if they're supported by friends.
> 
> I don't know if you recognize this situation, but this happens a lot between me and Feelers.



I can absolutely relate to this. I especially liked your explanation on how Feelers hurt "deliberately" because there is no logic. An ENTJ can piss me off but I understand them.

But you know what, with the mbti we can kind of understand feelers too 

And I thought you've learned to fake it by now (chameleon effect). Outward expression of emotions, even if those don't have internal representation, makes things so much easier. It's not lying. You are just translating your logical output into the feelers' language so they understand what you "feel".

@nottie The grass is always greener on the other side. Plus you have Te.


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## MuChApArAdOx (Jan 24, 2011)

Istbkleta said:


> I can confirm your feelings on this
> It gets to some point so unhealthy that I felt the need to stir up trouble on the ENFP subforum.
> 
> But of course, in most societies in business and sciences NT's are viewed more positively than feelers, so there is a bright side to all this. Cheer up.


Would love for you to provide a link with your theory that within societies and business, sciences, NT are viewed more positively than feelers. Please provide and share with the rest of us feelers, thanks. I'm sure you wouldn't assume this , there is a link with valid information.


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## Istbkleta (Apr 30, 2011)

open a job posting in those areas, too lazy

this my personal opinion/perception, so it's prob different for you

cheers

Edit: @MuChApArAdOx, and also I was trying to make him feel better about his type (Fe) and see the logical positive side of this (this is what ENTPs do all the time). As an NTP I know "everything" is subjective, so my statement is as true as exactly the opposite statement. I can successfully argue and defend both of them  

But given his distressed emotional state, I felt the need to take a position that would be beneficial to him and make him feel better, rather than make him feel miserable. There is a "always" a positive and a negative. Makes no sense to me not to choose the one that is more "productive" for the individual, the way my NT defines "productive".

Chill.


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## MartyMcFly1 (Nov 14, 2010)

I've noticed the following F types can seem pretty similar at first glance.
ISFP - INFJ
INFP - ISFJ
ENFP - ESFJ
ENFJ - ESFP
Not sure why, but if you add T's to all the types it still makes sense.


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## nottie (Mar 2, 2011)

Elwood92 said:


> No, I think that is a myth too: that Feelers are somehow so Feeling that they are more social and nice. I actually think that it's the other way around for most Thinkers, when Thinkers hurt each other emotionally there is always a reason, we hurt each other for a logical reason or because we simply didn't notice that we were hurting the other out of social insensitivity. In both scenarios a Thinker would accept that reason as justifiable. If someone has a reason for hurting me and can explain it to me, I feel better because I can assess the situation and treat him/her as an equal. If someone was simply oblivious to my emotions it is justifiable too.
> 
> However, it doesn't work like that with Feelers. They can deliberately hurt you out of sheer wrath or out of other emotional motives unknown to me and sometimes even unknown to them. When I confront them with this they usually get very arrogant about their emotional life. They'll say things like "you wouldn't know" and "you don't understand" and when I push them to explain their actions they get more and more defensive about it and usually end up seeking emotional support from others in order to 'outnumber' me in conflict situations. Which doesn't work on me because I'm not a Feeler, but it does strengthen their emotional arrogance if they're supported by friends.
> 
> I don't know if you recognize this situation, but this happens a lot between me and Feelers.


Hm, that's an interesting way to look at it. I don't think Feelers are the only ones that can hurt people just because they're feeling wounded, though.. xD I have a distinct memory of an INTP friend breaking up a couple just because she was jealous of half of it. I'm not sure what to call that, if not an emotional response. On the other hand, I have numerous instances of my ENFJ mom talking about how just because she's mad at someone, she has a right to yell at them to make her feel better. >_> Doesn't make a lick of sense to me, but I've given up on arguing that point with her. I will agree it happens more often from Feelers, however, so you have a point. 

I don't think I've ever been shut out to that extent because "I wouldn't understand", though, so I'm sorry for that having to happen. D: It sounds like a lot of immaturity. The friend I find to understand everything best is an ENTP, so I certainly disagree with that. :/

Still, I think a lot of what you are saying, I can relate to as well. I keep a pretty tight lid on my negative emotions, and it bothers me when others don't do the same. I'd rather be hurt because someone forgot to consider my feelings on a matter or because they saw a good reason for it. Then it's much more easily solvable, and we can all move on with our lives. If I'm feeling something I consider to be an unreasonable emotion, I tend to process the hell out of it to try and solve it, or I ignore the source of the emotion until that goes away. If I don't do either of those and I do let it out, I'll beat myself up for the perceived weakness so I don't do it again.

Perhaps a lot of the disconnect comes from what each side considers to be an "overly emotional" response. 



Istbkleta said:


> nottie: The grass is always greener on the other side. Plus you have Te.


This is very true. I like to think I use the Te well, but of course I wouldn't be objective about that. xD


Sorry for the long word vomit. <_<; This is an interesting topic, and I'm appreciating the distinct lack of BS in the discussion so far.


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## MuChApArAdOx (Jan 24, 2011)

Istbkleta said:


> open a job posting in those areas, too lazy
> 
> this my personal opinion/perception, so it's prob different for you
> 
> ...


Your answer makes no sense to me, sorry. You seem to have a high Fe, i don't relate to why you would do that, it wouldn't be what i would do. No need to respond, leave it as i can't relate.


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## TiNeSi (Jan 10, 2011)

Interesting. INFP and ISFJ are my favourite "feeler" types.

Edited to specify I was anwsering to MartyMacFly statement, but something came up and it took me that long to hit the reply button!


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## Istbkleta (Apr 30, 2011)

MuChApArAdOx said:


> Your answer makes no sense to me, sorry. You seem to have a high Fe, i don't relate to why you would do that, it wouldn't be what i would do. No need to respond, leave it as i can't relate.


Most ENTPs have a high Fe.

Don't worry. I am sure you'll grasp it with perseverance! Stay brave and positive.


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## Protagoras (Sep 12, 2010)

nottie said:


> Hm, that's an interesting way to look at it. I don't think Feelers are the only ones that can hurt people just because they're feeling wounded, though.. xD I have a distinct memory of an INTP friend breaking up a couple just because she was jealous of half of it. I'm not sure what to call that, if not an emotional response. On the other hand, I have numerous instances of my ENFJ mom talking about how just because she's mad at someone, she has a right to yell at them to make her feel better. >_> Doesn't make a lick of sense to me, but I've given up on arguing that point with her. I will agree it happens more often from Feelers, however, so you have a point.


Well, as I have indicated: it is a generalization based on my experiences with Feelers. So, you are right to point out the exceptions to the rule I have stated. However, there does seem to be this tendency of Feelers to act in this manner. It's very much a personal matter for me though.



nottie said:


> I don't think I've ever been shut out to that extent because "I wouldn't understand", though, so I'm sorry for that having to happen. D: It sounds like a lot of immaturity. The friend I find to understand everything best is an ENTP, so I certainly disagree with that. :/


No, it's not that they seriously mean that I don't understand them, it's that they act like it to avoid their responsibilities. They use this 'emotional arrogance' more as a shield in these situations than an actual sentiment. I know Feelers who think very highly of me too, so that's not what I meant to say. I was addressing a certain kind of coping mechanism that I have observed in some Feelers.



nottie said:


> Perhaps a lot of the disconnect comes from what each side considers to be an "overly emotional" response.


That might indeed be true. I have a very low tolerance level for any kind of "unwarranted emotional display"; that might be wrong of me too..


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