# SoM's Guide to Weight Loss!



## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

before you begin:
*1) Chill the fuck out:* If you have made the decision to lose weight and become healthier, that's wonderful, but in order to succeed, you need to come at it with a level head, patience and a slow-burn desire. 
*2) Be realistic about your body:* be aware of what your body type is and realize that you are never going to look like Reese Witherspoon if you are a curvy endomorph. Some level of comparison can be helpful, but they must be _realistic_ comparisons, so if you want a little added motivation, look up some pics of hot celebrities with your body type (to get you started on some attractive people of each body type: Beyonce and The Rock for endomorphs, Bradley Cooper and Jillian Michaels for mesomorphs, Uma Thurman and Cillian Murphy for ectomorphs)
*3) Be realistic about your other expectations:* Your body wants to stay at or close to its current weight. As mentioned before, losing weight requires not only weight loss, but time for your body to adjust to the lower weight. If you trim down sustainably, the weight will be more likely to come back. 

now onto diet and exercise
1) *Cut out the obvious crap:* if you don't cut out (or at least seriously cut down on) soft drinks, chips (unless they're kettle cooked chips made from actual potatoes, those aren't too bad) and super sugary desserts, trying to lose weight is going to be a severe waste of time. 
2) *Meat!* No, I don't mean fast food or uber-processed meat. the amount of meat should be in proportion the quality you can afford. organic and/or grass fed are vastly preferable, but if not, go for as high quality as you can (if you have a farmer's market in your area, go there). honestly, I eat about a pound of meat a day (that's about 84+ grams of protein). it's high protein to calorie ratio and fills you up
3) *Green Smoothies:* great way to get your daily dosage of veggies in and put the vitamins on blast without too many calories.
4) *Green Tea:* this by itself is NOT going to make you lose weight, but it can slightly boost your metabolism and decrease appetite and it's great for overall health 
5) *Find an exercise routine which works for you:* this is going to differ for everyeone. personally I recommend staying away from cardio-heavy workouts as they're harder on joints, not great for building lean tissue and can put the body in a catabolic state for periods of time.

....that's all for now, I'll probably have more later


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

I think this is a mix of good and limiting advice. As an advocate of straight-forward opinions I would have thought you can appreciate this somewhat SoM..

I think most weight-loss advice which is cautious, or warns about "gaining your weight back", etc. is BS. Of course you're going to gain your weight back if you go on a diet but return to a previous routine of take-aways, etc. but if you go on a HARDCORE diet, and work even remotely to stay at maintenance afterward, it's perfectly EASY to keep the weight off.. I know, because I've done a 20 day water fast shedding 10+ pounds of fat and kept it off easily. PLUS I'm in the middle of a similar hardcore diet to get down to 12% BF ahead of a big 3000calorie/day bulk until Jan 2016. Not only is the fat tearing off, but I'm retaining enough muscle to get close to a proper 6-pack day by day. I see a bit of muscle loss from arms (not anything I can't regain within 2-3 weeks) and minimal from my core.

So the two things, which are not "necessaries", but merely "options" are these- there is NOTHING wrong with hardcore diets providing you have the health level to do so. The human body is designed to live off storage fat when there is a lack of food. All you will feel is irritable for the first couple of days.
AND- if you workout as and get the required amount of protein, 150-200g, it's actually the easiest way to keep fat lower, but also to increase muscle, for minimal effort since you will be able to eat calorie/day totals up to 3000cal.

90% of the technical crap that sounds unnecessarily complicated is total BS.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Good advice, but too general. Most people who are obese and have never been thin or fit would have a hard time to do much with this advice. I understand the good intentions though.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Tridentus said:


> I think this is a mix of good and limiting advice. As an advocate of straight-forward opinions I would have thought you can appreciate this somewhat SoM..
> 
> I think most weight-loss advice which is cautious, or warns about "gaining your weight back", etc. is BS. Of course you're going to gain your weight back if you go on a diet but return to a previous routine of take-aways, etc. but if you go on a HARDCORE diet, and work even remotely to stay at maintenance afterward, it's perfectly EASY to keep the weight off.. I know, because I've done a 20 day water fast shedding 10+ pounds of fat and kept it off easily. PLUS I'm in the middle of a similar hardcore diet to get down to 12% BF ahead of a big 3000calorie/day bulk until Jan 2016. Not only is the fat tearing off, but I'm retaining enough muscle to get close to a proper 6-pack day by day. I see a bit of muscle loss from arms (not anything I can't regain within 2-3 weeks) and minimal from my core.
> 
> ...


Not everyone is working out as you do, or in the same weight-loss point in their lives, or has the same weight/finess history. This could be very wrong advice for a lot of people. I'm a dietitian and I've seen people with health problems who've tried many crash diets and only got worse in the end, both physically and psychologically. To keep off the weight you'll have to change habits, and habits are very difficult to change, especially after many years of eating crap and having zero fitness level and never knowing any better.
And suggesting numbers, such as 150-200g protein and 3000kcal/d are completely off target for most people when we're talking about weight loss. If I ate this much I'd gain ~2kg of fat per week.


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

Red Panda said:


> Not everyone is working out as you do, or in the same weight-loss point in their lives, or has the same weight/finess history. This could be very wrong advice for a lot of people. I'm a dietitian and I've seen people with health problems who've tried many crash diets and only got worse in the end, both physically and psychologically. To keep off the weight you'll have to change habits, and habits are very difficult to change, especially after many years of eating crap and having zero fitness level and never knowing any better.


I don't know. Maybe I can agree that I don't have the degree of empathy to judge based on my own experiences.. Btw.. at one point I was at around 24% BF around Dec2015, going down to 18% in January, going down to 16%ish by March, going backpacking/drinking and going back up to 20%ish during exam time 3 weeks ago, whilst now I'm around 14%ish.

But based ON my own experiences, which are MORE EXTENSIVE and personal than people who profess to be "nutritionists" and yet have not had these experiences for themselves. It's all exaggerated BS. All of the weight loss has come most naturally to me specifically WHEN I decided to take it very seriously and go hardcore. Half-measures have been the only place where danger-zones have existed.

People who "warn" against more hardcore forms of weight-loss (which btw is almost the universally accepted method in Hollywood) NEEEEVVVVVVVVEEEEEERRRRRR have AAAAANNNNNNNYYYYYYYY PRRRRROOOOOOOOOOFF for what they are talking about. They just say "It's unhealthy" as if they are expelling farts from their backside.. Whilst anthropology states that humans are specifically adapted to live off stored fat efficiently, and HOLLYWOOD shows on a monthly basis that it has NO negative reprecussions whatsoever.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Tridentus said:


> I don't know. Maybe I can agree that I don't have the degree of empathy to judge based on my own experiences.. Btw.. at one point I was at around 24% BF around Dec2015, going down to 18% in January, going down to 16%ish by March, going backpacking/drinking and going back up to 20%ish during exam time 3 weeks ago, whilst now I'm around 14%ish.
> 
> But based ON my own experiences, which are MORE EXTENSIVE and personal than people who profess to be "nutritionists" and yet have not had these experiences for themselves. It's all exaggerated BS. All of the weight loss has come most naturally to me specifically WHEN I decided to take it very seriously and go hardcore. Half-measures have been the only place where danger-zones have existed.
> 
> People who "warn" against more hardcore forms of weight-loss (which btw is almost the universally accepted method in Hollywood) NEEEEVVVVVVVVEEEEEERRRRRR have AAAAANNNNNNNYYYYYYYY PRRRRROOOOOOOOOOFF for what they are talking about. They just say "It's unhealthy" as if they are expelling farts from their backside.. Whilst anthropology states that humans are specifically adapted to live off stored fat efficiently, and HOLLYWOOD shows on a monthly basis that it has NO negative reprecussions whatsoever.



It's great that you've managed to change yourself like that, but it can be harder for a lot of people (if not most). 
The problem with personal experiences is that they are personal and may not apply to many people. For example, even though I'm a dietitian I've had hard time and bad history of following specific diets with predefined macros and such. It just doesn't work well for me, I prefer to listen to my hunger and body, and decide what and how much to have when it's time for my meals, or at the beginning of the day and then plan as needed. But many others prefer to have that specific diet plan so I give it to them.

Since I don't live in US I can't know exactly how the diet industry and the professionals there act and react on things like crash and fad diets and such. The biggest problem with hardcore diets is that most people who are willing to lose weight with such a method have poor knowledge about nutrition and weight loss and therefore, fail in the long term. That lack of knowledge can also lead to unhealthy behavior long term, since the person is likely to repeat the crash diet and go in a cycle of losing and gaining which could last many years and result in bad psychology (even binge eating), self esteem etc and even malnutrition depending on how much they've fasted and what they ate when not fasting. It's not just about losing the fat, but keeping it away for the rest of our lives.

These hollywood stars that go in hardcore diets probably don't do it entirely alone and have someone guide them through the process (they like to pay for these kinds of things anyway). Also, they could have negative repercussions, but not necessarily something that is visible to the public (intentionally or not).


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

@Red Panda

You've just highlighted everything I think is wrong with the nutritionist/dietician industry perfectly.

You're saying people who have a problem with these diets are those who have a poor knowledge of nutrition- but those are the people who are failing with weight loss in the first place.. Of course the people who are bad at losing weight are the people who lack knowledge about losing weight- that is common sense. Also btw- regardless of whether I may or may not have good/bad genes, the thing that stays concrete is surplus/deficit calories- I do not give a TOOOOOSSSS what else you believe in, that thing stays constant..

But how do all these things ACTUALLY change the facts? ALL YOU HAVE DONE has been to requote the same MYTHS that ALL dieticians have regurgitated over the years, which has ALWAYS been WRONG- which assumes that dieting is somehow "complicated" and that most people lack the "intelligence" to maintain it- Let me ask you something- have you been actually been obese and lost the weight to maintain your ideal BF%? No? THEN STFU then, this is a consistent pattern that applies to 95% of so called fitness "experts".
99% of Hollywood stars do not make radical changes to their body because they are accompanied by next-level "experts"- they just do the obvious things that all people can do. IMO the greatest thing holding people back is not the complexity of the fitness "art"- but in fact the BS expelled by the community that complicates a very simple reality of life.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Tridentus said:


> @Red Panda
> 
> You've just highlighted everything I think is wrong with the nutritionist/dietician industry perfectly.
> 
> ...


I don't understand why you are getting so aggressive with me personally and making assumptions and saying I believe things that I've never even mentioned. I never said anything about it not being a surplus/deficit of calories for example, nor did I ever say anything about your genes. 

What you don't seem to be understanding is that dieting can be complicated to someone because of their current behaviors, habits, lifestyle, and life experiences, not because creating a deficit is complicated. And I never said people are not intelligent, just that they may lack the necessary knowledge. 
99% of Hollywood stars have probably never been obese in their lives. And since you're making it personal, yes I have been obese and have lost quite a bit of weight.


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## Peter (Feb 27, 2010)

Here's my advice:

Eat balanced meals.

That is: 30 % protein, 20% fat and 50% Carbohydrates. In this mix *micronutrients* are essential. You get those mostly from fruits and vegetables. So yes, your main warm meal of the day has to be a plate where 30 to 50% of your plate is vegetables.

You eat like that and it's easy to not eat too much. Lack of protein and micronutrients make you hungry because your body is lacking essential nutrients to function properly and thus your body signals for more food (i.e. you get hungry.)

Other benefits of eating decent amounts of micronutrients: Your teeth can heal themselves. No need to go to a dentist to fill a cavity. Feeling something funny in your teeth?.... just eat more vegetables for a couple of days and the problem disapears by itself. (for some strange reason almost nobody believes this but it actually does make sense. Teeth are mostly composed of minerals which you get from vegetables!!!)

Eating crappy food is an addiction. People don't see it like that, but they should!


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

Tridentus said:


> I think this is a mix of good and limiting advice. As an advocate of straight-forward opinions I would have thought you can appreciate this somewhat SoM.


of course, bring it on =)



> I think most weight-loss advice which is cautious, or warns about "gaining your weight back", etc. is BS. Of course you're going to gain your weight back if you go on a diet but return to a previous routine of take-aways, etc.


my friends who were fat and/or are losing weight would all disagree with you. you mention later in the post that you kept off 10+ pounds of fat easily. keeping off 10 pounds is a lot easier than keeping off 60 or 80 (if I recall correctly, you're also pretty young and sound like you were already reasonably athletic. both of those help). for anyone interested, this documentary is quite informative.








> but if you go on a HARDCORE diet, and work even remotely to stay at maintenance afterward, it's perfectly EASY to keep the weight off..


hardcore diets generally take a tremendous amount of willpower to maintain. I'm trying to provide long term solutions and more options for people rather than just "you can either be like Homer Simpson or Jillian Michaels". being healthy, in shape and shedding 10-15 pounds does not require the diet or lifestyle of a competitive athlete. 



> I know, because I've done a 20 day water fast shedding 10+ pounds of fat and kept it off easily. PLUS I'm in the middle of a similar hardcore diet to get down to 12% BF ahead of a big 3000calorie/day bulk until Jan 2016. Not only is the fat tearing off, but I'm retaining enough muscle to get close to a proper 6-pack day by day. I see a bit of muscle loss from arms (not anything I can't regain within 2-3 weeks) and minimal from my core.


that's wonderful if you're willing to go that balls-in with it, but it's kind of like me saying "getting in shape is easy! just work out 90 minutes a day 5 days a week doing circuit training and sprints!" I'm trying to provide more options for people rather than just perpetuating the myth of "you can either be like Homer Simpson or Jillian Michaels". being healthy, in shape and shedding 10-15 pounds does not require the diet or lifestyle of a competitive athlete. 

that said, I'm not opposed to more extreme fitness measures. in fact, I'm working out the details of doing something like that myself at the moment, but, as @Red Panda said, the idea of such drastic lifestyle changes is pretty scary to someone who is overweight, especially if their lifestyle is significantly less healthy (which is not always the case). as such, I wanted to provide a more "gentle" starting point, which will allow them to decide at their own pace whether or not they want to go more extreme. 

while I'm at it, now that I've mentioned you, Red Panda, I am keeping it more general for a reason, because everyone's starting point is going to be different and I am not a dietician, so I can't assess various medical conditions or personalized needs in that department. however, I will be sharing my current workout routine and diet a bit later. 



> So the two things, which are not "necessaries", but merely "options" are these- there is NOTHING wrong with hardcore diets providing you have the health level to do so.


depends on which diet specifically (several rely on extremely unhealthy sources of calories), but yes, some of the more extreme ones are plenty safe. 



> The human body is designed to live off storage fat when there is a lack of food. All you will feel is irritable for the first couple of days.


based on accounts of people on the paleo diet and related diets, that sounds about right



> AND- if you workout as and get the required amount of protein, 150-200g, it's actually the easiest way to keep fat lower, but also to increase muscle, for minimal effort since you will be able to eat calorie/day totals up to 3000cal.


actually, that's only 600 to 800 calories a day from protein, so it's unlikely someone wanting to lose weight will be eating that much. other than that, *agreed completely*! that's the main reason why I put meat in there. that said, the real enemy is not fat (diets high in healthy fat are, counter-intuitively, extremely beneficial for shedding pounds), but carbs (at least ones derived from cereal grains and sugars. having a high amount of veggies and moderate amounts of fruit are great diet habits)



> 90% of the technical crap that sounds unnecessarily complicated is total BS.


I attempted to keep it general for a reason


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

@_Red Panda_ 
I never got aggressive or personal with you, I just pointed out how you got things wrong in the same repetitive manner which I believe is actively HARMING and HINDERING people for no good reason when so many people who don't know what they are talking about are regurgitating the same thing to them. If you can't appreciate that on a logical level, I can't help you.

I certainly never thought we were having a personal conflict on any level other than objective right/wrong, although I changed my impression immediately upon reading your latest post since you make insinuations that come out of the blue, and are incredibly assumptive/wrong about what I am saying.


Considering you don't deny ANYTHING I have to say, and yet deny a lot of things you make up about what I am saying which have nothing to do with what I am saying at all, All I can assume is everything I already think about people who hand out the same advice you do as well.. In the future please address the discussion at hand- e.g. whether people actually take benefit from doing a "slow diet" or whether it is just BS.


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

@_Swordsman of Mana_ 

EHHHH.. I think you make good points.. But I still don't agree with the "arrogance" with which they are mentioned which serves no purpose..

If they are under certain niche circumstances- which make your points very valid- bloody well mention so. Don't DOMINATE health and fitness perspectives with innaccurate ideals which is what I find wrong about it.


I still guarantee that if I were 2-3 stone overweight or something, I could and WOULD be at a healthy range within 1-2 years with hardcore dieting- I would just shape my life circumstances to allow me to focus on something that was so important. The FACT IS that the health advice about moderate dieting, etc. Is all BS. It might be more useful if it added a disclaimer about "motivation", etc. but talking about moderate dieting on the basis of Biology (as it always is) is the biggest load of BS and one of the biggest lies I've ever read.


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## Grandmaster Yoda (Jan 18, 2014)

Drink only water and eat only cereal for 3 weeks. You have now lost much of weight and your ability to work.


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

Tridentus said:


> @_Swordsman of Mana_
> EHHHH.. I think you make good points.. But I still don't agree with the "arrogance" with which they are mentioned which serves no purpose..


when did I accuse you of being arrogant?



> If they are under certain niche circumstances- which make your points very valid- bloody well mention so. Don't DOMINATE health and fitness perspectives with innaccurate ideals which is what I find wrong about it.


"ideals", "domination"....what are you talking about mate? :tongue:



> I still guarantee that if I were 2-3 stone overweight or something, I could and WOULD be at a healthy range within 1-2 years with hardcore dieting- I would just shape my life circumstances to allow me to focus on something that was so important. The FACT IS that the health advice about moderate dieting, etc. Is all BS. It might be more useful if it added a disclaimer about "motivation", etc. but talking about moderate dieting on the basis of Biology (as it always is) is the biggest load of BS and one of the biggest lies I've ever read.


I admire your discipline and strength of will, but this comes across almost moralistic. kinda feels like I'm talking to White Goodman from Dodgeball :laughing: as I said, the main audience for this thread is not people who want to have sculpted, Greek god looking bodies (more power to them), but normal ass people who just want to be healthier and loose 10-25 pounds. 

that said, health and weight loss are _all_ about biology. no, you don't need to a STEM degree to live a healthy lifestyle and make prudent decisions about what you put into your body, but to deny the role of science here is charlatanistic, period.


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## Swordsman of Mana (Jan 7, 2011)

Peter said:


> Here's my advice:
> 
> Eat balanced meals.
> 
> ...


^this. it's a bit basic/general, but 100% true


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Since we are keeping it general, I'd like to add my own successful method so far. I've lost more than 30 pounds and planning to lose a few more. I eat at a 500-600kcal deficit and my exercise varies, but I try to do at least 30 minutes moderate cardio per day. Most days I take walks outside as well (I live on a hill so I take advantage of that), so it amounts to at least an hour a day. Back when I did my internship at the hospital I walked a lot more than that and it helped tremendously, now I'm being a bit lazy. At least I'll be able to swim and bike outside soon, during my vacations. I also used to do light weight training, but the gym is closed now so I do some bodyweight exercises after cardio. It's exciting to see my endurance build up, especially since I live on a hill and I've dreaded those uphill roads for most of my life, but now are almost a breeze. I also take the stairs both at home (live on 3rd floor) and outside. I like keeping track of my activity using Google Fit and an activity bracelet if I don't have my phone with me. They've helped a lot. But the key is starting slow. And also finding something you enjoy to do and keeping in mind that it will likely get easier and more agreeable as you get fitter. I used to hate going 30 minutes on the stationary bike, now sometimes I have to convince myself to get down. Doing outside activities beat any indoor training for me for sure, but that's my preference.

I have a background of both hormonal issues (hypothyroidism) and low self esteem, depression, social anxiety and perfectionism which caused me to binge and punish myself with food for more than 10 years. 

As for the types of foods I eat, I never really had a junk food culture since we eat quite differently here compared to US (Mediterranean diet) so it hasn't been that hard in that area. I didn't really had to cut out much, just regulate my portions for the most part. For me, it was more a matter of mindset rather than eating habits. Back when I was very bad psychologically, I would crave chocolate all the time, yet now I barely eat it once a week. And I am at a place where I can say no to cravings because my goal is now more important than the short mood boost from giving in to a craving. But it's also because my mood and my general psychology is far better than ever.


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

Swordsman of Mana said:


> when did I accuse you of being arrogant?"ideals", "domination"....what are you talking about mate? :tongue:
> I admire your discipline and strength of will, but this comes across almost moralistic. kinda feels like I'm talking to White Goodman from Dodgeball :laughing: as I said, the main audience for this thread is not people who want to have sculpted, Greek god looking bodies (more power to them), but normal ass people who just want to be healthier and loose 10-25 pounds.
> 
> that said, health and weight loss are _all_ about biology. no, you don't need to a STEM degree to live a healthy lifestyle and make prudent decisions about what you put into your body, but to deny the role of science here is charlatanistic, period.


What are you even talking about? "accusing me of arrogance"..? When did I say you did that? I'm talking about the health industry in general. You and me are insignificant by comparison- the proof I'm going by is that every person that has wanted to try to make a big and sudden change has done so very effectively and without all the BS complications the nutrition industry that you are borrowing ideas off will suggest- the only real difference occurs in the Psychological sphere (where you actually make your only valid points, without acknowledging like the rest of the field), which would be FINE if that was what nutritionists were actually highlighting on a regular basis, rather than talking about BS Biology (PLEASE goddamn stay on point if you are going to bother replying).

No you don't need degrees to lose 10-25 pounds, that is EXACTLY my point- you just need a month to three where you are committed to having a serious calorie deficit, and it will be a lot easier to keep to than trying to maintain say a 6 month lifestyle where external influences are going to screw everything up.

My point boils down to two basic things that you simply cannot argue against-

1. Hardcore diet >>>> Slow diet where you are constantly hungry. The only argument against the hardcore diet is based on health, which is BS.
2. Hardcore diet does not have any side-effects- it is actually a natural part of human evolution, and also has no bad effects after the diet as long as you eat normal maintenance for your new level of weight.

The fact that nutritionists try to make it seem like weight loss is more complicated than this, exactly as some of your points have subscribed to- is what I find annoying, because it's just a blatent lie. Like I said, talk about Psychology that's fine, but the Biological crap that overcomplicates simplicity is just straight up BS and always will be.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Tridentus said:


> @_Red Panda_
> I never got aggressive or personal with you, I just pointed out how you got things wrong in the same repetitive manner which I believe is actively HARMING and HINDERING people for no good reason when so many people who don't know what they are talking about are regurgitating the same thing to them. If you can't appreciate that on a logical level, I can't help you.
> 
> I certainly never thought we were having a personal conflict on any level other than objective right/wrong, although I changed my impression immediately upon reading your latest post since you make insinuations that come out of the blue, and are incredibly assumptive/wrong about what I am saying.
> ...


It kinda does get personal when you tell me to "STFU" after you assume that I haven't had any personal experience with the matter. Written communication is harder than interpersonal, so maybe that's your style of writing an impersonal post, but not for me.

I actually did address your "slow vs quick" dieting from both personal and professional standpoint, you just don't seem to want to understand or accept it. You are seeing this as black and white, when it is about about people who have experiences, habits and issues that make up for a rainbow of colours and therefore one tactic does not necessarily apply to everyone. Quick weight loss could work for some, yet fail for others (as it does many times), but the most important part of dieting is keeping the weight off.


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## Tridentus (Dec 14, 2009)

Red Panda said:


> I actually did address your "slow vs quick" dieting from both personal and professional standpoint, you just don't seem to want to understand or accept it. You are seeing this as black and white, when it is about about people who have experiences, habits and issues that make up for a rainbow of colours and therefore one tactic does not necessarily apply to everyone. Quick weight loss could work for some, yet fail for others (as it does many times), but the most important part of dieting is keeping the weight off.


Yes and no. I agree with you some people have Psychological problems with it, and have seen it from this perspective from the beginning, but that is not the issue. The issue is that the whole industry sets up to block people going on hardcore diets or methods without ANY explanation WHY. It's that simple.

Whereas the reality is that anyone with the willpower / the planning / the simple desire to do so WILL NOT suffer any Biological set backs or compromises (as long as they are healthy). In fact, I believe the fact that the industry encourages people to go on an unnecessary routine for 6 months consistently rather than an easier run for 1 month, actually HINDERS a LOT of people from accomplishing their goals because their motivational goals become warped.


This is the simple fact I am campaigning for. I would like to see ANYONE challenge this, because so far *NONE *of you have, and neither have these so called "experts" who have no idea what they are even talking about.


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## Red Panda (Aug 18, 2010)

Tridentus said:


> Yes and no. I agree with you some people have Psychological problems with it, and have seen it from this perspective from the beginning, but that is not the issue. The issue is that the whole industry sets up to block people going on hardcore diets or methods without ANY explanation WHY. It's that simple.
> 
> Whereas the reality is that anyone with the willpower / the planning / the simple desire to do so WILL NOT suffer any Biological set backs or compromises (as long as they are healthy). In fact, I believe the fact that the industry encourages people to go on an unnecessary routine for 6 months consistently rather than an easier run for 1 month, actually HINDERS a LOT of people from accomplishing their goals because their motivational goals become warped.
> 
> ...



I understand your issue with the industry, though things here are quite different in that area. I know dietitians who use low calorie diets, meal replacements, ketogenic diets and such to achieve quick weight loss and work with maintenance and dietitians who prefer a slower approach, unless necessary so maybe it's why I'm not as frustrated as you in that regard, we have different experiences since we live in different places. 

Maybe you misunderstood me, but I never entirely dismissed going on such diets in general, just presented some points as to why it could be very ineffective and even detrimental for many people. For example, you mention here that someone could go 1 month for an easier way, but this could be entirely ineffective and difficult for someone who has to lose 30-60-etc pounds and not 10 like you had, because they would have to do it for 3-4-etc months and could indeed cause biological problems for them (I have a friend who was rushed to the hospital with severe abdominal pain due to condensed bile, after losing 20 pounds in ~2.5 months, and it does happen to many people as well). 
And then most wouldn't have a clue on how to keep off such an amount of weight, because they never got to train themselves on proper eating and portion sizes. 


PS. Maybe I should also mention that the weight loss dietitians expect when using deficit diets are about 9 pounds a month in the best of cases, which is people not giving in to their hunger and following the program. So it's still quite a bit of weight to be so against slow dieting.


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