# Heightism



## GENIUSandVIOLENCE (Oct 6, 2012)

I am currently in an interesting situation and I would appreciate if people could help me out a little. :] This will be a long and rambling post, so my apologises in advance.

The question is: how much would someone's height influence your view on a person as a romantic partner? I suppose this question is particularly relevant to individuals attracted to males.

When finding a permanent partner, I believe that it is very important to find someone who is compatible with you in a relationship manner, and that you should feel happy emotionally and psychologically. However, it is unreasonable to rule out materialistic requirements such as income, finances, etc. It is also, I believe, difficult if not impossible to ignore the external world's impact on you.

If a man is shorter than average, does that make him less desirable as a partner, even if he is fair in other aspects (e.g. finance, physical appearance apart from height, intelligence, education level, personality, etc.)? Society is heightist. Truth to be told, shorter men have it tough. I suppose it's instinctively programmed into humans that a physically larger male would be stronger, therefore more able to fight off enemies and protect a family from harm. Those were important aspects back in the cavemen era for survival, but we have moved on from that to civilisation where predominantly intelligence and maturity are major factors to leading a successful, comfortable life. But heightism still exists, albeit in varying degrees.

My mother is a particularly heightist individual. According to her, it stems from "innate" desires and it is a very strong value to her. She perceives that I would be at a large disadvantage if I was to settle down with a shorter-than-average man. She argues that it would be difficult for him (and therefore me as well) in society as people may discriminate. This may come into effect at a workplace where he may be withheld a promotion (when competing with taller men with, perhaps, similar abilities) and may limit his (and therefore my) social circles. She claims that she is concerned that people may laugh at him and laugh at me, and talk about us in front of us/behind our backs.

I don't think what she says is untrue. I know that there will be people who do that, and it is particularly frustrating if we were to encounter people like that. Whether or not it may get to that degree of discrimination and bitchiness, I don't know. So that's another question I have: to what degree do you think that sort of discrimination is present? If it is a substantial amount, do you think you will be able to cope with feeling like you're battling against the whole world?

For me, while I am concerned about what other people think and say, obviously it depends on who those people are. I recognise the work problem may be difficult to solve. But personally I wouldn't want to associate with "friends" who were shallow and judgemental enough to be so horrible about someone that I care about (my partner) who they don't really know. And even if they can't see what's good about him, I feel that it's courtesy to at least accept that other people (such as myself) have their own values and that they are allowed to choose what they think is suitable for themselves. I tend to have that way of viewing others. I dislike judging people, and even if people do things which I personally wouldn't do, generally I don't like looking down on them just because I don't understand their viewpoint. Are there so few people out there who would do the same in return for me?

In regards to my family members, they are the closest to me, even though we have very different personalities and values. We are an incompatible family with many problems, but underlying everything is a good intention to each other, even if it does end up working detrimentally (this may become clearer later on). Still, I would say that they are important people to me, and their opinions and reactions to my choices emotionally influence me the most. They are, however, not people who are open-minded and will not seek to know/understand/accept other people's values. They end up trying to force their values on me and disregarding my values as being less important because my values are different. They don't see what they are doing as a bad thing though, because they are so blinded by their "I am doing what I know is best for you and I really want you to listen because otherwise you'll screw up your life and I am doing my job as your parent/guardian" mindset.

My family want what they think is the best for me. If I overlap each member's different desires together, the end result is someone who is fairly attractive, of great financial status, good height, intelligence, "good" personality (whatever that is to them, I have no idea), etc. Basically someone who is of high superficial/societal standard. If I add my standards in, I feel that this person may be impossible to find because I believe I have high standards for a person's internal workings and how comfortable I feel with them. This may boil down to my INTP pessimism and scepticism of humankind, and the fact that I feel I am a somewhat emotionally traumatised individual from being a sensitive and consequently emotionally-neglected child (to what I needed to grow up healthily in that aspect). I know I require someone who is patient and positive to coax me into coming out of my shell and experiencing genuine trust. But because I am mistrustful on a fundamental basis, I think it will take someone quite special to be able to do that, so I personally believe that my personality/emotional/psychological compatibility spectrum is somewhat narrow.

I don't know if I'm considered to be over-compensating, but I am willing to be settle and be happy with someone who is not particularly high in superficial standards so long as they make me feel emotionally and psychologically content. I am willing to sacrifice some other things to a certain degree, height being one example. I am also one of those "the grass is NOT greener on the other side" type, because once I have my own lawn I don't look at other people's lawns at all. My mother says that I am content too easily and that I may be missing out on something much better. Because I am fairly desirable in terms of status, appearance, finance, etc. (all things superficial, and yes I realise that I sounded pretty self-centred there! ) my she would argue that I would have no trouble finding someone that is "better". She doesn't understand my emotional needs though, and although we've had in-depth discussions, she still doesn't accept what my desires, values and needs are different from hers.

Herein lies the paradox. I am willing to accept that society might be cruel to my partner and me and pick the best people to be my friends, but it is a lot more difficult for me to accept that kind of treatment and thought coming from my family members. My family members are acting in a way that is detrimental to me, but they are only doing so because they feel that they want to "guide me off the wrong path". So, as mentioned prior, what they are doing is out of good intention, but they don't see it's making me miserable instead. Another problem I've faced my whole (short, 19 years of) life is that they do not recognise whatever maturity I have. As an INTP, I pride myself in my Ti and Ne abilities. So the truth is that I have considered many factors and possibilities. I don't believe that my family recognises that, and even if they do, as they disagree with my values it doesn't matter anyway. So I am stuck. I grow more and more apprehensive about the matter of finding a romantic partner because in my head, I feel that they will never approve. And even if they did, I probably won't because of my own standards which are narrow in selection.

I know that I am very young and the person that I am with right now (the nice, but short guy) may not be the permanent man in my life. But I think fundamental problem I face with my family is not limited to him specifically, but possibly a problem that will be present to my entire romantic life.

I'm sorry if I repeated myself a lot in this post, but my Si-Fe loop is going around and around in my head and it's driving me nuts. I can't let go of my standards, but it will be so difficult fighting the people I love because they can't accept my values. So could someone please help me find a way I can deal with my family and their stubborn, narrow-minded ways without resulting to extremities? It would also be nice to get a more objective view on whether or not I am indeed limiting myself, and grabbing onto the first person that fits my criteria without having higher standards on other aspects that society would use to judge people. Lastly, it would also be appreciated if you could give some of your own, personal opinions about height and how it would affect how you view someone.

Thank you so much for going through all that. <3


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## Twoshoe (Mar 2, 2011)

Tell your mother society also values youthfulness in women, so she might as well kill herself and free up some space. Problem solved.


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## Kormoran (Mar 15, 2012)

Twoshoe said:


> Tell your mother society also values youthfulness in women, so she might as well kill herself and free up some space. Problem solved.


LOL. I wish her mother no harm, but that rebuke is, quite frankly, refreshingly stingy. Sometimes, people deserve to have the proverbial Rembrandt slammed over their heads.

Anyway. First of all, thank you, @_GENIUSandVIOLENCE_, for paragraphing your post. You have no idea how much I appreciate that.

As a Scandinavian man at 5'9, I'm shorter than most. In fact, I'm shorter than the average woman. This has led to a few remarks here and there, but nobody has ever really done anything, perhaps because I've been quite fit, and because I've always walked away a victor from any youthful fistfight. People tend to respect you, despite your size, when you're able to throw big men around like dummies. Combine that with an otherwise friendly character, and most sensible people will see that you're actually a pretty decent bloke, and that your height is rather irrelevant. And since there is no correlation between height and penis size (can't believe I'm bringing this up, but unfortunately some people still believe that), assertive short people really don't have any disadvantages.

I'm rather average by international standards, though, so I've never gotten any crap when I've been abroad. But in my own country, people, especially other men, have tried to pip me at the post before. They've come away from it with bloody noses, proverbial or not, and painful cheeks, and I've not had any shit from them again.

Go for someone you genuinely like, rather than fitting your mothers description of the ideal man. Not only would you potentially wait forever, but you have to remember that while you parents only want the best for you, they often reflect their own wishes on their children. Ones mother or father may have wanted to become a doctor, but that doesn't mean you should become one. You don't exist to fulfill their unfulfilled hopes and dreams.


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## Sonny (Oct 14, 2008)

As a guy with a grounded centre of gravity I can say it's not stopped me from succeeding in the business world. It matters how you carry your height. From the judgemental around me I often see one guy being called derogatory things with a focus on his height while the next guy of the same height is not, it comes down to attitude and if they value the individual, it is typically someone they were going to bag anyway and his height is simply an easy, cheap shot when it's relevant.

I can't help much on the relationship aspect as society pays more attention to the gayness over height differences for me.

You need to listen to your logic and tune out your family if they are focusing on the superficial over your happiness. If you have physical, mental and emotional attraction the rest is details.


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## Sina (Oct 27, 2010)

You know the answer--height is a superficial and pointless point to hold against a partner. If a person is intelligent, sensitive, understanding and has the qualities you are looking for in a partner, that's all that matters. Your mother is being more than a bit ridiculous, though I understand her "concerns" because society is rather harsh on short men. It doesn't mean anything in the context of professional and relationship success, though. Plenty of shorter than average men are incredibly successful. If your partner is confident and secure in himself and the relationship, why would anyone care about something as inconsequential as his height? As an example, I dated someone who was 5'7. He has a Phd in Aeronautical Engineering from one of the best Universities in the world, and he is doing extremely well for himself. As expected, height has never been an issue in his profession lol. People who snicker and bitch will condemn even the most "conventionally perfect" of couples. These people are irrelevant. As for the evo psych nonsense about "caveman days", that garbage needs to be cut right of your mindset. These height 'standards' are entirely cultural, and it's up to you to buy into these or ignore these as ludicrous.

I am 5'4, and I have dated in the 5'7 to 6'8 range (my SO is 15+ inches taller than I am, and oh yes, we get odd stares all the time, and neither of us gives a fuck since we are confident in ourselves and each other; in fact, we find some people's reactions rather funny). Do what you think is right. Lastly, no one should hold 'society's" arbitrary and shallow standards above their personal standards relating to character, integrity and more.


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## Promethea (Aug 24, 2009)

In the threads I have seen on height and physical preference in the past, there were plenty of people who seemed to not think it matters too much. 

As for the bs about women and their innate desire to only be attracted to tall men who can protect them from saber-toothed tigers, well my response to that is in my signature.


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## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

I'm taller than my boyfriend, I've been taller than a majority of my boyfriends. It hasn't ever factored in to relationships for me.


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## Zletta (Sep 25, 2012)

Thank you for your post, *GENIUSandVIOLENCE*. I read the whole thing. It was a pleasant and untedious read.



Eerie said:


> I'm taller than my boyfriend, I've been taller than a majority of my boyfriends. It hasn't ever factored in to relationships for me.


I wish it wasn't a factor for me.
I'm quite tall, and I feel like I'm under even greater pressure than most to date tall men.
When I hear my two sisters sometimes have a height conversation with each other--something to the effect of "Oh, so-and-so is way too short for her! I know! She should date so-and-so instead"--it really bothers me!

I just started dating a guy who is 6'3" who I've dated before. He's a really nice guy. Part of the reason I feel comfortable around him, is because the two of us can go around together in public and be accepted and appreciated and especially smiled at and even celebrated by others. It's as if people are telling us "Good job; I accept you; you meet my expectations of having the man be about 4-7 inches taller than the woman, and with that prerequisite fulfilled, I consider the two of you to be a cute couple; you are most welcome here."

Society sucks. The expectations of people suck.

One of these days I'm going to present a very special future girlfriend of mine to my family and others, and if and when they give me a problem with it, I will say "well, at least it's not a man who's shorter or even a lot shorter than me."
Heightists can go to hell with the racists and homophobes for all I care.:angry:

But maybe I'm buying into and sometimes following the expectations to make my life less difficult and therefore promoting continued heightism and more? Maybe I'll go to hell too. Oh well.


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## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

Zletta said:


> Thank you for your post, *GENIUSandVIOLENCE*. I read the whole thing. It was a pleasant and untedious read.
> 
> 
> I wish it wasn't a factor for me.
> ...


I'm six feet tall, my boyfriend is around 5'9". But I've been in a relationship with someone who was 5'6" too. We never got weird looks, my family and friends could also care less. And even if my family did say something, why should I care? They aren't in the relationship, I am. My happiness is what matters, not what other people think.


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## Zletta (Sep 25, 2012)

Eerie said:


> I'm six feet tall, my boyfriend is around 5'9". But I've been in a relationship with someone who was 5'6" too. We never got weird looks, my family and friends could also care less. And even if my family did say something, why should I care? They aren't in the relationship, I am. My happiness is what matters, not what other people think.


I envy you.
I've spent way too much of my life trying to be what others wanted me to be. It's been killing me and making me resentful of those others for thinking that their expectations matter more than my dreams.

I've been taught to feel more comfortable around taller men.

When you're with your shorter boyfriends, don't you ever feel like you're looked at more than you want to be?
Whenever I feel like I'm in what may be an uncomfortable situation, I sometimes like to feel protected in the shadow of a taller guy. I mean, what else are men good for? (just kidding:laughing
Sure, I've had shorter guys stand up for me or make me feel safe around them, which is very refreshing, but still, I've been taught that height matters, that I should be with taller guys.


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## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

Zletta said:


> I envy you.
> I've spent way too much of my life trying to be what others want me to be. It's been killing me and making me resentful of those others for thinking that their expectations matter more than my dreams.
> I wish it weren't so, but I've been taught to feel more comfortable around taller men.
> When you're with your shorter boyfriend, don't you ever feel like you're looked at more than you want to be?
> ...


I've never noticed weird looks from people, ever when out with my boyfriend. I don't know why height matters, like they can't protect you if they are short or some crap like that? Because us women need protection and we cannot protect ourselves? I don't buy any of this. Society doesn't determine who I date, and it's stupid to let something artificial get in the way of what could be a great relationship.


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## Zletta (Sep 25, 2012)

Eerie said:


> I've never noticed weird looks from people, ever when out with my boyfriend. I don't know why height matters, like they can't protect you if they are short or some crap like that? Because us women need protection and we cannot protect ourselves? I don't buy any of this. Society doesn't determine who I date, and it's stupid to let something artificial get in the way of what could be a great relationship.


I never said there were "weird looks" with shorter boyfriends, I said that with a boyfriend ~4-7 inches taller than me, I feel more "accepted and appreciated and especially smiled at and even celebrated by others"; I feel like I'm fitting their mold of what a cute couple should be.
I didn't say any of it made sense.
I agree that "it's stupid to let something artificial get in the way of what could be a great relationship".


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## Eerie (Feb 9, 2011)

Zletta said:


> I never said there were "weird looks" with shorter boyfriends, I said that with a boyfriend ~4-7 inches taller than me, I feel more "accepted and appreciated and especially smiled at and even celebrated by others"; I feel like I'm fitting their mold of what a cute couple should be.
> I didn't say any of it made sense.
> I agree that "it's stupid to let something artificial get in the way of what could be a great relationship".


Why does it matter if *other* people "celebrate" *your* relationship?


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## Zletta (Sep 25, 2012)

Eerie said:


> Why does it matter if *other* people "celebrate" *your* relationship?


Probably because I'm insecure (but hey, I might be making progress, I don't think I've called myself insecure before).
Sometimes I feel like I have enough problems or depression as it is, that I need others to validate me or to at least not have a problem with the choices I am making.


Maybe that's why I'm on forums like this, to see if I can find people to accept me for who I am--people to accept my words and the feelings of my heart, instead of judge me on who I date, what I do with my life, etc.


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## Jwing24 (Aug 2, 2010)

Interesting topic.

My goal is to accept myself in all ways, then I can start to grow, in all ways.


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## mitchi_crash476 (Oct 5, 2012)

Well, since I'm all of 5 feet, 2 inches, _everyone_ tends to be taller than me. I've dated a guy who was 6ft 2in, another who was 5ft 10in, I've got a guy I crush on who's 5ft 8in-ish and a guy my mum would like me to date who's 6ft 5in. My only major concern with a partner's height would be if they're shorter than my since they may be mistaken for a high school student... and I'm twenty.


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## bsrk1 (Jul 18, 2012)

easy, survival of the fittest. and being tall definitely has its evolutionary benefits in survival... for all species in the animal kingdom. maybe not so much with modern day humans (other than athletics), but its still programmed into our brains that taller is better. I think its very normal for height to be attractive. Im a pretty tall guy and find tall girls attractive. 

examples - the alpha male of a wolf pack is the biggest in the pack and the alpha female is the biggest female in the wolf pack, the silver back gorilla (the leader of the gorilla pack) is the biggest, even with fish... females are typically larger than the males but the largest females and males get first dibbs when it comes to breeding. its just natural to want to pass on "the best evolutionary genes" on to the next generation. sorry im a bio major.


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

I always find it funny when females complain about their height.
I am 6'3".
Females come in two varieties: short and shorter.


OT: As for dating short males:
Who cares?

If you find someone worth marrying who's short, by then you'll probably have realised how hard it is to find someone worth spending your life with.
Heightism is a pretty stupid thing to give a damn about, when there's actually important things for dating, like whether or not he's a dickwad/racist/drug addict/etc to keep in mind.


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## pinkrasputin (Apr 13, 2009)

I've never cared about a man's height, _ever_. I've definitely had relationships with men shorter than me or just as tall. It didn't bother me. I'm 5'4" and 3/4, and I wear heels all the time. Also, my mom's life partner of 26 years is shorter than her.

However, it seems like men really _love_ women who are shorter than them. I have an ENFP ex boyfriend who is only 5'4", we are very good friends now. It seems he finally found the love of his life (he's 41) and she is finally shorter than him and his family: 5'1". When I ask, he says it's not a coincidence.

My boyfriend is 6 foot. He absolutely _loves_ my height. He loves that he can rest his chin on the top of my head, etc. And he has made many statements about how sexy he finds our height difference.

I don't think I need a man to tower above me in order for me to feel like a woman. I also don't think men need a woman to be way shorter than them in order to feel like a full man. But it does seem like when a man finds a woman whom he really cares about _and in addition_, she is shorter than him, that is just sublime icing on the cake for them.


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## Arclight (Feb 10, 2010)

I am 5'7". I have dated girls as short as 4'11" and as tall as 6'2''. My height has never been a hindrance in this respect. 
I have gotten raises and promotions at work.
If I choose to, I make friends easily.

I think it matters to some people.. But on a larger scale It's probably not too relevant.

On the plus side.. 5'7'' is the average human height and the world is designed with this in mind. Chairs, counters, doorknobs and everything else are just right.. My back is rarely sore


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## Diphenhydramine (Apr 9, 2010)

Sonny said:


> Discrimination must be overt in order to exist?
> 
> 
> 
> Of course.


 I am sure that out there, somewhere, there is someone who discriminates against people who are, say, heterochromic. But the effect is so unimportant that it is not discussed. There are as many kind of discriminations as there are people... for us to attach an 'ism' to it suggests strongly it is an important social issue.

Discrimination is really only an issue when it unjustly robs people of some kind of power or influence that they would normally have or expect to have as an equal, or asserts more power than would otherwise be equal to other people. This is why I object to the rising number of 'isms.'

This to me is a very bizarre concept. People have the right to refuse to be attracted to someone if they aren't what they consider a desirable height. Heightism isn't a serious thing in western culture. If it is true that taller people are employed more, this is only because people find them more attractive, which is a separate issue.


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

Diphenhydramine said:


> for us to attach an 'ism' to it suggests strongly it is an important social issue.


Pray tell, how do you judge the importance of social issues?


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## Diphenhydramine (Apr 9, 2010)

MissJordan said:


> Pray tell, how do you judge the importance of social issues?


 You think all social issues are of equal importance? Really?


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

Diphenhydramine said:


> You think all social issues are of equal importance? Really?


Well, you seem to think there's an arbitrary scale of importance an issue must pass before it gets the privilege of being acknowledged as 'a problem' by yourself.


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## Diphenhydramine (Apr 9, 2010)

MissJordan said:


> Well, you seem to think there's an arbitrary scale of importance an issue must pass before it gets the privilege of being acknowledged as 'a problem' by yourself.


 No-o, I am denying the existence of 'heightism' on a scale worth bothering about. Perhaps I am wrong and in every other country apart from mine this is a serious issue that harms a lot of people, but I don't think so, somehow. 

You're not using this video as an example of 'heightism' are you? I hope not, since this song was written in quite a different context...


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

Diphenhydramine said:


> No-o, I am denying the existence of 'heightism' on a scale worth bothering about. Perhaps I am wrong and in every other country apart from mine this is a serious issue that harms a lot of people, but I don't think so, somehow.


Oh, so problems aren't worth considering if neither you or a significant percent or the population are affected by it?



> You're not using this video as an example of 'heightism' are you? I hope not, since this song was written in quite a different context...


No, I thought it was entertaining.


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## Diphenhydramine (Apr 9, 2010)

MissJordan said:


> Oh, so problems aren't worth considering if neither you or a significant percent or the population are affected by it?


 I have a lisp. This causes me self-esteem issues. Otherwise I am a perfectly privileged WASP. I demand the same attention as victims of child abuse.

Do you understand the problem with this? I am sure that it is true that someone, somewhere was turned down from a job, or was shouted at in the street or whatever for being short. To suggest that this should be an ism is just really ridiculous. I sympathise with short people because social norms say that being tall is better, but that's about all.


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

Diphenhydramine said:


> Do you understand the problem with this? I am sure that it is true that someone, somewhere was turned down from a job, or was shouted at in the street or whatever for being short. To suggest that this should be an ism is just really ridiculous. I sympathise with short people because social norms say that being tall is better, but that's about all.


An '-ism' is a _suffix_, not a cause that you can donate to via charity.
Stop trying to assert a personal value onto a vehicle for communication.

The thread is about prejudices on the topic of height.
You read the topic and knew what it was about, came in more-or-less getting what you expect.
It may not be as far-reaching as racism, sexism or any of your -isms, but it's still a problem and worth discussing without being accused of "lel wightknights"



> I have a lisp. This causes me self-esteem issues. Otherwise I am a perfectly privileged WASP. I demand the same attention as victims of child abuse.


Seriously man, read up for next time:
Slippery slope - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Sina (Oct 27, 2010)

Lol, while height based discrimination does take place (and I am not one to take prejudice lightly), but the term 'heightism' does amuse me a bit. Yes, it's a social problem but its socioeconomic impact or its impact on psychological/emotional health just doesn't register to me as a big enough deal. Now, the large-scale occupational discrimination and other forms of abusive behaviours that are associated with fat shaming do legitimize the use of the term "sizeism", though sizeism in itself includes height based discrimination.


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## Diphenhydramine (Apr 9, 2010)

MissJordan said:


> An '-ism' is a _suffix_, not a cause that you can donate to via charity.
> Stop trying to assert a personal value onto a vehicle for communication.
> 
> The thread is about prejudices on the topic of height.
> ...


 Yes, in the English language you can't just make up words. They go through the process of what is called 'neologism.' There is an established reason for not being able to attach suffixes to anything you want. I won't be so petty or condescending as to link to wikipedia but you can google it, I suppose.


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

Diphenhydramine said:


> Yes, in the English language you can't just make up words.





> you can google it


Oh, how delicious irony is (or is that just hypocrisy? You can tell me, you're the expert on the English language).
Don't act like there's a formal process for using words and then use Google _as a verb_.
How do you think that phrase came to be?
It was through use just like OP's.



> I won't be so petty or condescending


Starting off an argument calling the opposition white knights, then asserting your own moral superiority.
Classy.
Bonus points for calling someone condescending in the most condescending way possible.

This is getting off-topic, so @OP, here's an image I think is funny:


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## Diphenhydramine (Apr 9, 2010)

Except to 'google' is a commonly used verb that has been in the OED for six years.

Yes, that is what is called irony. I used it intentionally. This is what we call a "device." If you do not understand it you can google it.


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## Sonny (Oct 14, 2008)

Diphenhydramine said:


> I am sure that out there, somewhere, there is someone who discriminates against people who are, say, heterochromic. But the effect is so unimportant that it is not discussed. There are as many kind of discriminations as there are people... for us to attach an 'ism' to it suggests strongly it is an important social issue.
> 
> Discrimination is really only an issue when it unjustly robs people of some kind of power or influence that they would normally have or expect to have as an equal, or asserts more power than would otherwise be equal to other people. This is why I object to the rising number of 'isms.'
> 
> This to me is a very bizarre concept. People have the right to refuse to be attracted to someone if they aren't what they consider a desirable height. Heightism isn't a serious thing in western culture. If it is true that taller people are employed more, this is only because people find them more attractive, which is a separate issue.


I don't particularly care what term one uses, I view "heightism" as a quick way to get at a specific form of social discrimination, a descriptor if you will as opposed to a movement or the likes, and it's hardly a new term. 

I agree that any kind of 'difference' can be followed by social discrimination or worse however in the context of heterosexual relationships you cannot downplay that short men are at a disadvantage because of the common expectation from women (and society) that a man should be taller than her, at a minimum, so when you touch on the topic of relationships height is an issue for short heterosexual men, and to be clear I'm not talking about gentlemen who say that they're 5'8" and dislike being of average height, I'm talking about those who are distinctly below average for the typical population where they live. All you need to do is look at the hyper example of Hollywood and someone like Tom Cruise, who really isn't that short at 5'7", and the amount of attention that is paid to his height, that his dating a woman taller than him is seen as not right. Or look at the pressure being placed on the OP.

If you can see the results of discrimination against men who are less than average height then it shouldn't be a bizarre concept, if someone is being discriminated against without doing anything to deserve that then it's only natural that they will care about it.

And I disagree with your previous comment about SMS being a real thing, it's a cheap and easy way for people to dismiss someone, that's all.



> In 2007, research by the University of Central Lancashire suggested that the Napoleon complex (described in terms of the theory that shorter men are more aggressive to dominate those who are taller than they are) may be a myth. The study discovered that short men (below 1.65 m [5 ft 5 in]) were less likely to lose their temper than men of average height. The experiment involved subjects dueling each other with sticks, with one subject deliberately rapping the other's knuckles. Heart monitors revealed that the taller men were more likely to lose their tempers and hit back. University of Central Lancashire lecturer Dr Mike Eslea commented that "when people see a short man being aggressive, they are likely to think it is due to his size, simply because that attribute is obvious and grabs their attention."


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## GENIUSandVIOLENCE (Oct 6, 2012)

My apologises if the terminology I used has caused some debate. My intention behind the word "heightism" is clearly expressed in my original post. Obviously people are allowed to have their own preferences, especially when it comes to romantic relationships. People are allowed to prefer a certain physical form over another. That is natural, and I do not believe that in itself is a form of overt discrimination. There is a fine balance in determining what is appropriate personal preference, and what is considered to be discrimination. However, that is not the central issue that I brought up in this topic, and if people are going to discuss that issue, please do so in a separate thread.

The topic discussed in the original post is whether or not you would judge someone negatively based on your preferences, specifically height. If you happen to prefer tall men, would you judge another couple negatively because the man in that couple is shorter than your own preference? Would you judge that man negatively if he was shorter than the woman? Would your judgement be restricted to certain individuals, or would you place that judgement on all others regardless of they are strangers or people you are close to? If applicable, would you extend the height judgement past romantic relationships and into workforce situations? How about social friendship situations? Please elaborate on the answers to these questions instead of debating the intention behind "heightism" and how that word is appropriately used. If you will, take the term "heightism" as a short form of "the tendency or act of discriminating individuals who do not match up to a person's personal values about height when it comes to workforce situations, social situations and other people's romantic lives". Basically: are you being a nosy bastard and inflicting your personal values on other people where it's not needed/necessary and potentially detrimental to the other people you're judging, especially when you don't understand or have their values.


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## LQ9 (Jul 24, 2010)

I'm sure lots of people have said things similar to what I'm going to say...

I confess to having a serious thing for tall guys. Six feet plus. I'm not sure what to say except that I can't help it, and I'm so sorry to all the short guys--I'm not ruling you out, but I may overlook you... my only excuse is that I'm taller than average and look for a partner who is also taller than average. I also plead guilty for being shallow, like most of humanity.

HOWEVER, if you fall in love with a short man, BY ALL MEANS choose him. You seem like the kind of person who would care enough about your partner to put up with some discrimination in and out of the workplace. And I agree with you that if people don't want to be friends with you/your partner because of his height, they're not worth being friends with. I may like a tall partner but I'll take a good friend of any shape or size. I think most decent people feel the same.


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## MissJordan (Dec 21, 2010)

Diphenhydramine said:


> Yes, that is what is called irony. I used it intentionally. This is what we call a "device." If you do not understand it you can google it.











Also, that time you didn't quote me.
I've the sneaking suspicion that you wanted to get the last word in without me knowing.



> Except to 'google' is a commonly used verb that has been in the OED for six years.


And how'd it _get _there...?


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## 7rr7s (Jun 6, 2011)

I don't know, I have mixed feelings on this. Short men in the west have it stacked against them, in the workplace, in the dating scene ect. like people have mentioned before, not to mention things like finding decent clothes that will fit you (UGHHH!). Not only that, but people might think you have a napoleon complex just for being assertive, ambitious ect. whereas if you were taller they wouldn't think much of it. So it's kind of a double edged sword.

At the same time, I think it's also a matter of perception. Focusing on the problem is just going to increase the problem. You can be a short man with a taller woman and think people are looking at you and making jokes. Or you can think they are looking at you and thinking damn, that guy must have a lot of status, must be a great guy ect. Point is, it dosen't matter what they think, it matters what you think. I dated a woman who was 6'3 before, and I'm dark and hansome, but definantley not tall (I'm 5'4). Yeah people looked at us, and some of my friends made jokes in good fun, but it was nothing serious. 

I will admit though, that for a while it bothered me. It's really the only thing I'm kind of insecure about, but I'm learning to get past that. The more I talk to people about it, the more I'm realizing it's really not that big of a deal. Most people care weather you are a good person, not how tall you are. Height aint shit. It's just perception.


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## Shahada (Apr 26, 2010)

Sonny said:


> If you can see the results of discrimination against men who are less than average height then it shouldn't be a bizarre concept, if someone is being discriminated against without doing anything to deserve that then it's only natural that they will care about it.


What is the actual result of "discrimination against men who are less than average height" though? A lot of people seem to mainly be pointing to the issues this causes for short men in the sexual and romantic realm, which seems a bit queasy to me. If you're getting passed over for a job because you are short, I agree, that's messed up. But if the extent of your problem is "many women prefer taller men, and these women won't have sex with me" then that's not really an issue in my mind. You can't be oppressed by a person just because they don't want to have sex with you.


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## Verthani (May 8, 2012)

I'm 6'0 tall in RL and I don't really care that much about height as long as it doesn't cause problems because of extreme differences. I would say the same goes for tall men dating women though. My mom's decently tall as well (5'9) but my dad is a foot taller than her so it was never an issue in their relationship, but she dated shorter guys before she dated my dad so it wasn't the reason she chose him anyway. Most people I know don't care either unless they're insecure so I figure that the only reason you'd care is if you have a crippling fear of what other people might be thinking.


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## sleepyhead (Nov 14, 2011)

I'm 4'11 and have dated guys from 5'3 to 6'4. I admit, when I was a teen I was really attracted to tall guys (like over 6'). But I quickly outgrew that. You can't tell a damn thing about a person by their height (except that they're short or tall) and it's not gonna help me meet my dream person. 

My family never put pressure on me to be with a particular kind of person so it wasn't really much of a 2nd thought as to how others would react to me being with tall or short guys. I did get comments when I dated the 6'4 guy but they were mostly cheesy jokes and they didn't bother us. I didn't get any comments when I dated the 5'3 guy, but he got them all the time. His height was constantly brought up whether in the context of our relationship or not. One of the things that attracted me most to him was his confidence. His height did not seem to be any kind of issue for him, but he also invested a lot of time and energy into working out and bulking up a bit - he wasn't huge by any means, but it made a difference in how small people perceived him to be. In university a guy who was 5'2 and nice enough had his friend ask me out for him and that was such a huge turn off - if you want to be with me, then ask me yourself - he wasn't my type anyway but I may have given it a chance if he'd done the asking himself.

Having said that, my brother is 23, 5'2 and very slim and young looking. People often think he's 14 or 15 and my mom still says, "he's such a nice boy" sometimes. I don't think she has any idea how much she infantalizes him. He's heading into his mid-20's and he's not a boy - despite how he looks, he's a young man and he's not a teenager. He's been thrown out of the Liquor store more than once because the clerks don't believe his ID is real. He was fired from a grocery stock job because the manager said he was worried about him getting hurt, despite the fact that my brother never had any issues with his workload (I worked there with him). Because he looks so young, people often treat him like he's a perpetual teenager. I look really young too, but it's more acceptable to have a short, young looking woman than a short, young looking man. I really wish he would work on his self esteem and confidence more because it's totally shot. However, he's seeing a new therapist and is in a new relationship with a great girl (same height as him) and he seems like he's growing out of his shell a bit more.

I sent him this article recently and he said it was hard to read because of how much he recognized himself in it. 
It Happened to Me: I'm a Short Guy | xoJane

I ended up with a guy who is 5'6 and that's just fine for me. I do believe short men do experience discrimination in our society because they don't fulfill the ideal of hegemonic masculinity. There's definitely some odds stacked against them.


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## Sonny (Oct 14, 2008)

Shahada said:


> What is the actual result of "discrimination against men who are less than average height" though? A lot of people seem to mainly be pointing to the issues this causes for short men in the sexual and romantic realm, which seems a bit queasy to me. If you're getting passed over for a job because you are short, I agree, that's messed up. But if the extent of your problem is "many women prefer taller men, and these women won't have sex with me" then that's not really an issue in my mind. You can't be oppressed by a person just because they don't want to have sex with you.


Have a look at the article @sleepyhead linked in. This rings true for me (minus the NA bit):



> I’ve come to two major conclusions about being a short man in North American society and they are thus: It sucks and no one wants to hear you complain about it.
> 
> Because of this I tend to mostly shut up about the subject. It’s hard enough trying to explain to people the realities of height discrimination when you have to also convince them it’s an actual thing in the first place.
> 
> ...


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## ForsakenMe (Aug 30, 2010)

How short are we talking here? :wink: I actually had a crush on a man shorter than me when I was younger. He was 17-18 while I was 14-15 but I towered over him by maybe a couple of inches. But then he chose my other shorter female friend over me. :crying:


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## ToxicatedRose (Apr 18, 2012)

I'm 5"5 and approaching 17... I'm fully aware of heightism, and meh, I want to accept myself and be proud of it but how can I in a society where heightism exists a lot of women would label me as "evolutionary weaker" (seriously? Lol) – but I'm 17... I don't know how long I have left before I stop growing, nor how to predict my adult height, but I doubt I'd get to 5"10 :') 
Ah, oh well. That's life.


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## Doom (Oct 25, 2010)

What's really pathetic is that people that think if you're less than 6ft then you're not a "man" and how average is the new short. When I look around I see men both taller and shorter than me and I never felt short in the slightest till people started saying that, of course if you're tall then people are all "short" to you but in really we're not. Regardless height doesn't bother me, I wouldn't be bothered if a girl is taller than me and I haven't had a problem with guys taller or shorter.


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

I know that there is a lot of heightism involved with shorter than average men. I'm not really sure to what extent, but certainly tallness is a characteristic that we view as very important in a male leader. Personally, I've been attracted to both men over 6' and men under 5'8". I prefer very tall men, though, and I can't really explain why. It may have something to do with my father being tall, with having a high sex drive and needing a high-testosterone partner, or something I haven't quite figured out yet. But it's definitely not one of the primary factors that I look for. Personality, confidence, positive energy and respect are WAY higher, followed by things like sexual connection, facial features, etc. Sometimes I'll see a cute little stocky guy who's like 5'4" with a really nice face and be totally interested.


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## Sina (Oct 27, 2010)

@Doom

Technically, 6'0 is above average. I do see people treating even 5'10 or 5'9 as 'short', when this is the average height for men in several countries. It's pretty silly.


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## Ellis Bell (Mar 16, 2012)

I am only 5'1 1/2, so short height has never really been an issue with me. In fact, my most serious relationship was with a guy who was 5'4. But I do agree that it's a rampant problem in society; women like to have that taller, bigger guy that they can feel protected by. It's psychological. Even men are bothered if they're not 6'0 or taller--I recently went out with a guy who was very self conscious about being "only" 5'9. Yet 5'9 is totally normal, at least in the US. I think, being as short as I am, taller men are actually harder to date, physically. But in the end, though, as everyone else has pointed out, height doesn't really matter in the face of considerations of personality and intelligence.


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## sleepyhead (Nov 14, 2011)

I'm really surprised to see what constitutes "short" for some of the people in this thread. I think of a short guy as 5'6 or under and anywhere from 5'6-5'10 as average. I think of short women being 5'3 or under and average women being 5'3-5'8.


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## Mr. Meepers (May 31, 2012)

So I have male genitalia and I am 5' 3.5"/5'4"

I think I have experienced some heightism, but it usually does not bother me ... or maybe I am so used to it that I don't even notice it lol. ... I am me, and I like me, so I like being short ^__^ (I think it is more socially acceptable for me to act cute :tongue.

I have no problem with my shortness and I'll even poke fun at it when I can't reach something (or need a step stool or I have to climb on something in order to reach it lol) and I don't care if people poke fun at that in a non condescending way ... we are all different and I think we should love our diversity and we should be able to laugh at ourselves and our friends ... but I don't like when people put down other people for our physical differences, especially innate ones (I have no control over my height, unless I get surgery, which I am not going to do lol)

The most noticeable heightism, in my life, was probably was probably as a kid and other kids assumed I would not be good with sports lol ... Or my second grade teacher who told me that she would not call on me when I raised my hand because I was too short and I "needed to eat my veggies" lol. .......... In high school my friends would sometimes show a picture of me to single high school girls (I'm not sure where they got the picture of me and I did not ask them too lol) and apparently they thought I was really good looking until my friends told them how tall I was. I even had one of my female friends tell me that on the morning announcement (I had to do them once in a while) I "sounded tall" and that she would have sex with me, except I am short lol.

When it comes to romantic and sexual preferences, individuals will like what they like, but when a society places a lot of a person's worth on how "sexy" they are and has a general consensus that being short is not sexy ... it can feel demeaning to a person. 

I have dated a couple of women who were very noticeably taller (only one woman was shorter than me) than me and they did not care about my height ... sometimes I think I don't care about what others think of my height, but I find I say "I am shorter than you", but once they say that is fine, then I'm okay and happy ^__^ ... 
... Now my longest relationship was with someone who was 4'9" ... People always commented to us about how cute we were, even tons of strangers ... and we were both introverts and she hated the attention lol ... I tried to tell her it was because she was so cute and good looking :kitteh: because I am a man and men are not cute :tongue: ... Well, I think it was a combination of the both of us having cute personalities (at least with our friends) and that we looked like a miniature couple lol ... I don't mind if people think we looked like a miniature couple at the time ... I found it funny lol, but it did bother my ex (gf at the time)

Last year, I had a very tall roommate, that, every time I would joke about how short I was, he would try to comfort me by saying "oh you are not that short" ... well, I don't have a problem with my height, but I appreciated the comfort, even though it was misguided and, in a way felt a little bit like an insult (as if being short is something to feel bad about), but I think he meant well, so it did not bother me ..... What bothered me was that he would try to comfort me about being short, but every other episode of the Daily Show (which we would watch together a lot) he would make a big deal about the host "being so short" because he was "only" 5'6" ... One, although sometimes I can see talking about that, was it really relevant/interesting all the time and two, if you think I need comfort for my self-worth because I am short, why would you make such a big deal about someone, who is taller than me, being so short lol .... I mean he was a nice guy, but sometimes I think he was oblivious to his own actions lol

Of course our language props up being tall with phases like "standing tall", "don't look down on me", "I look up to you", ... I don't know if that has a big impact on who we look at people of varying heights, but I think it can have at least a little affect on our sub-conscious views

All that being said, being short has, in my life, given be challenges and obstacles ... but it has not stopped me from living my life or given me really hard obstacles to overcome (I don't think)


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## Master Mind (Aug 15, 2011)

sleepyhead said:


> I'm really surprised to see what constitutes "short" for some of the people in this thread.


Shortness is relative. For instance, I was 6'1" by the time I was 12, 6'3" at 14, 6'4" at 15. So, seeing how I was already over six feet tall before I was even a teenager, what qualifies as short _from my perspective_ is a lot different than just about everyone else.


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## Up and Away (Mar 5, 2011)

First of all, FUCK HEIGHTISTS!

Secondly, it sucks being tall because I don't feel like I'm genuine of a person yet to be a leader, so I don't like to "fake it" and therefore can't always stand up perfectly tall which would be "largely imposing" because of my height and muscles.


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## Sina (Oct 27, 2010)

Master Mind said:


> Shortness is relative. For instance, I was 6'1" by the time I was 12, 6'3" at 14, 6'4" at 15. So, seeing how I was already over six feet tall before I was even a teenager, what qualifies as short _from my perspective_ is a lot different than just about everyone else.


My partner is nearly 6'8. What qualifies as short from his perspective is a lot different from what qualifies as "short" for most people. Now, of course, he's aware of what constitutes an average height for men and women. But, I have seen him refer to his cousins (like spotting them at a distance and using "short as a descriptor" lol) as short when they were actually about 5'11, which is hardly short. Long back when I asked him, jokingly, if my height (5'4) bothered him, he told me that, from his height (lol), 4'11 to 5'7 looked about the same.

Anyway, yeah, shortness is definitely relative, cross-nationally and, I think, from the perspective of both taller than average as well as shorter than average individuals.


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

It's amazing, the difference that a couple of inches make. I am not short or tall, but I cannot reach things on upper shelves. Then someone who's, like, one inch taller will come over and grab whatever it was for me. I think tall people have some time/space bending ability for getting things off of shelves--it can't be as simple as one or two inches. Also, taller people need to understand that they walk faster. Their legs cover more area in every stride, so it can be annoying to try to keep up with them sometimes, as they can be meandering/swaggering while I feel like I am scurrying.

I've been attracted to one tall man in my life, and that was when I was a teenager.
Recently, I've had this super-limerence on this guy who I guess is shortish for men around here. It's been four or five months since I've seen or spoken to him--but he's still my muse, my aid in celibacy, my male Dulcinea. I don't know anything about him and have only talked to him a couple of times, about the weather. 

I remember this one time when we were in a meeting together, and he stood up, and I admired him. Then the guy next to him stood up and he towered three feet above him--it was like that moment in that movie where the giant, man-eating worm bursts out of the ground and swallows the whole barn--except the guy was just really tall, and he just had normal teeth, not a spiraling maw of destruction. I just pretended not to notice the obvious discrepancy of imaginary power and all that, because I'm unwaveringly devoted to my actual imaginary loves.


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## Mr. Meepers (May 31, 2012)

meltedsorbet said:


> It's amazing, the difference that a couple of inches make. I am not short or tall, but I cannot reach things on upper shelves. Then someone who's, like, one inch taller will come over and grab whatever it was for me. I think tall people have some time/space bending ability for getting things off of shelves--it can't be as simple as one or two inches.


If you don't have a step stool nearby or something long nearby, let's say you are at a supermarket .... what you do is you grab something from a lower shelf that extents your reach (like a box of cereal) and you reach up to the self that you can not reach and you push the item you want closer towards you ... if it is on the edge of the self and you still can not reach it with your bare hands (and it is not breakable or heavy) then use the item that is extending your reach to knock the item over (and try to catch it) ... Alternatively, if you are at a place that sell step stools, you could use them 

There, you now know the secrets of the "short people" :tongue:

Edit:

* *





As far as tall people are concerned, they have the ability to stretch their bodies to amazing lengths ... they are like rubber people (making a reference to a certain character of a certain anime)


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## puppies454 (Nov 14, 2012)

I'm not "heightist" at all. Heck, I don't even care for looks all that much. (and it doesn't mean I'm easy, I just care about personality more.) I'm short though. Which is an alright thing, imo. I mean, I'm a girl. and sorry if that sounded a bit sexist. I'm not too short, but I'm not tall. If someone doesn't like that, too frickin' bad.
sorry but why is this EVEN an issue lol.
i honestly couldn't care less about psychological caveman crap. but that's just my opinion... don't want to impose anything! -.-
Don't hate me.


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## searcheagle (Sep 4, 2011)

devoid said:


> I know that there is a lot of heightism involved with shorter than average men. I'm not really sure to what extent, but certainly tallness is a characteristic that we view as very important in a male leader. Personally, I've been attracted to both men over 6' and men under 5'8". I prefer very tall men, though, and I can't really explain why. It may have something to do with my father being tall, with having a high sex drive and needing a high-testosterone partner, or something I haven't quite figured out yet. But it's definitely not one of the primary factors that I look for. Personality, confidence, positive energy and respect are WAY higher, followed by things like sexual connection, facial features, etc. Sometimes I'll see a cute little stocky guy who's like 5'4" with a really nice face and be totally interested.


So, I don't have a chance because I'm 5' 9" ? :wink:


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## FluffFluff (Nov 18, 2012)

*We're On the SAME Boat! <: )*

This is shockingly similar to my situation; my mother is completely against my relationship, and my dad has yet to find out (he lives else where but my parents are not divorced). 

I came online today because my mother has (again) put me down with her words about my boyfriend. I'm 1 year younger than you roud:, and I've dated my guy for almost 2 years. I think he's right for me, although my mom make sure she convince me to question myself because "I'm still young and I know absolutely nothing of the hardship that may come". Sometimes I feel like she underestimates me... 

My boyfriend is about a head shorter than me (I can rest my chin on his head hehe...) and I'm around 173cm, 5'7" or 8". I really do believe he's for me and I'm for him. I don't want to upset my parents either :frustrating: why is it so difficult?


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## WickerDeer (Aug 1, 2012)

Mr. Meepers said:


> If you don't have a step stool nearby or something long nearby, let's say you are at a supermarket .... what you do is you grab something from a lower shelf that extents your reach (like a box of cereal) and you reach up to the self that you can not reach and you push the item you want closer towards you ... if it is on the edge of the self and you still can not reach it with your bare hands (and it is not breakable or heavy) then use the item that is extending your reach to knock the item over (and try to catch it) ... Alternatively, if you are at a place that sell step stools, you could use them
> 
> There, you now know the secrets of the "short people" :tongue:
> 
> ...


I have a pair of bbq tongs that I use for the upper shelves in my house! For some reason, I have a resistance to stepping stools, so I have to pull things off the shelves with tongs and catch them--otherwise, I'll make sure know one is looking and climb up onto furniture or the counter. We must preserve and continue the ancient arts of the short-people clan.


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## milti (Feb 8, 2012)

Hell, I never cared about the height of my friends/boyfriends. I'm not very tall but I am taller than most of my girl friends, and I have been with a guy who pointed out that I "towered" over him. It amused me that he noticed it so much and would try to overcompensate for it with a swagger. But in reality, height is the last thing I notice about a partner. It's more important to me that they have a lovely personality and treat me gently.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

I don't think there is anything wrong with a preference of height. I'm 5'1" and I always like guys to be taller than me. The shortest guy I ever dated was 5'9" but that wasn't short. Just that my preference is usually tall guys. But I had a male (neutral) friend once who had an infatuation with tall women. His gf (my co-worker at the time) was super tall. I guess you might say he was a "leg man"... 

Heightism. ? .... _Really?_ ... come on now, lol!


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Souled In said:


> First of all, FUCK HEIGHTISTS!


WHO are these HEIGHTISTS that we should passionately hate?!?! 

HAHAHAH!!! 

Seriously! I had NO Clue! :laughing:


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## FluffFluff (Nov 18, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> I don't think there is anything wrong with a preference of height. I'm 5'1" and I always like guys to be taller than me. The shortest guy I ever dated was 5'9" but that wasn't short. Just that my preference is usually tall guys. But I had a male (neutral) friend once who had an infatuation with tall women. His gf (my co-worker at the time) was super tall. I guess you might say he was a "leg man"...
> 
> Heightism. ? .... _Really?_ ... come on now, lol!


It sucks but its true... Even though I don't care about the height of my partner (he's a head shorter than me, I'm 5'7"), my family and society do judge. Sometimes my acquaintances would "jokingly" ask me "why are you dating a short guy?" I think there's nothing wrong with it though, he's my precious! 
But it's could be something you'd experience if you were taller than the average girl :bored:


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## RobynC (Jun 10, 2011)

I've never really been concerned about height that much -- I've dated guys from 5'2" (when I was a about 12-13) all the way up to 6'6".

Many guys might have been uncomfortable in asking me out when I was younger -- some I took the initiative with if they were interesting or attractive. I still seem to be the one doing the asking these days.


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

I like small women because the distance between their body parts is not that big. It saves me a lot of energy because I am only 5'9"-6"

So let's say that when I push you against the wall, pin your wrists above your head, free an arm to get under your skirt and finger you while I kiss you intensely, but if you are very tall and I am not, then we have a problem that can cause a third degree hernia because of those distances I mentioned before. I suck at long distance relationships.


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## qingdom (Apr 5, 2011)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> ... pin your _*wrists*_ above your head, free an arm to get under your skirt and finger you while I kiss you intensely, but you are very tall and I am not, then we have a problem that can cause a third degree hernia because of those distances I mentioned before. I suck at long distance relationships.



So the cons of sitting back from a distance reading with super high resolution low font is, while reading the passage above, I kept reading "pin your waists above your head, free an arm ... ".... I had to do a triple take on that one and think about it... must be one hell of a contortionist maneuver.... like 'WOW!'

but then I caught on and went 'oh.' Do mind me. Carry on.


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## Curiously (Nov 7, 2011)

OP was too long, but I think I got the gist. For me, I've dated short and tall men, and I've noticed height hasn't played much of a role in my attraction to them. I'm either attracted to the guy or I'm not, regardless of his being 5'6" or 6'3" (and yeah, I've dated men from this spectrum). A guy who's tall may have that going for him, but if he doesn't engage my mind and pull me in via his personality, forget it. There's got to be that 'click', so if I have that with a guy who's on the shorter side, so be it; the same applies to a guy who's tall. In other words, height doesn't matter so much to me.


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## MicrobeJug (Nov 11, 2012)

I went out with a girl who was 4'9" (Snooki height) and didn't have a problem with it (I'm 5'7"). She could make me laugh and feel respected - and it's a shame that we were incompatible on some other levels :/ I've been attracted to people taller than me as well, but I think tall women probably have the same problem as shorter men. I mean, it doesn't really matter to me. Funny how love works, but the only thing that height matters for is how standard/photogenic you are in the eyes of others.

One of the more beautiful couples I know of is a 5'2" ish man and a 6'2" ish woman. They're very happy :3


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

qingdom said:


> So the cons of sitting back from a distance reading with super high resolution low font is, while reading the passage above, I kept reading "pin your waists above your head, free an arm ... ".... I had to do a triple take on that one and think about it... must be one hell of a contortionist maneuver.... like 'WOW!'
> 
> but then I caught on and went 'oh.' Do mind me. Carry on.


 Not so sure about waists above heads but, not gonna lie, what woman doesn't want to be tossed about like a rag doll. Let's be real.  
(I'm afraid this comment has much to do with the perception that's coupled w/height) I'm so sorry it's that way


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## qingdom (Apr 5, 2011)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> Not so sure about waists above heads but, not gonna lie, what woman doesn't want to be tossed about like a rag doll. Let's be real.
> (I'm afraid this comment has much to do with the perception that's coupled w/height) I'm so sorry it's that way



Thank you for abusing my eye sight and my mind.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

qingdom said:


> Thank you for abusing my eye sight and my mind.


You're very welcome. I keep telling people I'm evil ... no one ever seems to believe me *shrugs* :tongue:


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## Resolution (Feb 8, 2010)

sleepyhead said:


> I ended up with a guy who is 5'6 and that's just fine for me. I do believe short men do experience discrimination in our society because they don't fulfill the ideal of hegemonic masculinity. There's definitely some odds stacked against them.


I think it's really solid that you feel for your brother on this. Heightism bothers me just as much as classism and sexism, and all the others  

I hear "he's interesting" or "she's interesting" a lot, but people generally don't stop to wonder about why they find that person interesting. 

Is it because of a quality of their character, or is it because they wear interesting clothes, because they have an interesting tattoo, because they're tall, or have accentuated breasts, or because they pulled up in an expensive car, or because they checked the time on a thousand dollar watch? 

There are so many different and inane levels of social value. I try to ignore them all, but what else can one do? I can't exactly try to force my friends to drop certain elements of social categorization just because I deem them to be irrelevant or oppressive. 

Oppression sucks. . . it's all around us, and I don't think it will go away any time soon.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Btmangan said:


> I think it's really solid that you feel for your brother on this. Heightism bothers me just as much as classism and sexism, and all the others


I know the emoticon indicates you being facetious but I'm feeling guilty with this. Seriously? Am I an awful person for preference. I know people who like girls who have less than translucently pale skin than I do. (I'm serious. It's not flattering pale). I don't get offended by that. Or guys who are attracted to tall women or blondes ... that doesn't bother me at all. I'm not saying that I could never fall for a guy shorter. Just that it would take me awhile to get to know him to develop an attraction for him, if that makes sense. I'm making this worse the more I ramble on with this, aren't I ... foot in mouth 

Okay I'll stop. 

But I just want to let everyone know I think this thread is one big fat guilt trip and that's just not cool


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## Resolution (Feb 8, 2010)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> I know the emoticon indicates you being facetious but I'm feeling guilty with this. Seriously? Am I an awful person for preference. I know people who like girls who have less than translucently pale skin than I do. (I'm serious. It's not flattering pale). I don't get offended by that. Or guys who are attracted to tall women or blondes ... that doesn't bother me at all. I'm not saying that I could never fall for a guy shorter. Just that it would take me awhile to get to know him to develop an attraction for him, if that makes sense. I'm making this worse the more I ramble on with this, aren't I ... foot in mouth
> 
> Okay I'll stop.
> 
> But I just want to let everyone know I think this thread is one big fat guilt trip and that's just not cool


You shouldn't be so hard on yourself. 

I'm oppressive too. I'm agist. Ablist, etc. Everyone is oppressive in some stuff. It's pretty much an inevitable by-product of human nature. Better to know that we're all prejudiced jerks deep down.


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

searcheagle said:


> So, I don't have a chance because I'm 5' 9" ? :wink:


No, you don't have a chance because my current partner is 6'4". x3


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## searcheagle (Sep 4, 2011)

devoid said:


> No, you don't have a chance because my current partner is 6'4". x3


lol. I was just pointing out a possible bias that you may have against average height guys. :wink:


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> Not so sure about waists above heads but, not gonna lie, what woman doesn't want to be tossed about like a rag doll. Let's be real.
> (I'm afraid this comment has much to do with the perception that's coupled w/height) I'm so sorry it's that way


Are you trying to make me go blind!!?? *throws bug in your hair*


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## devoid (Jan 3, 2011)

searcheagle said:


> lol. I was just pointing out a possible bias that you may have against average height guys. :wink:


Can't deny it. I've dated a fair amount for what should be obvious reasons, but I tend to go for extremes. x3 It's like how I hate regular sized rooms; I feel much more comfortable in very open or very tight spaces. It might also have something to do with how height effects personality (it actually does more than you'd think).


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

I knew a woman that had to scrape the hard skin of her feet every day because she was terrified of heights...that fear became worse every year and later she only crawled which isnt't not very practical if you need to see what is on the top shelf in your local supermarket. We called her "Captain Crawl the Creepy Crawler" or cccc or sissysissy because she was such a sissy.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> I knew a woman that had to scrape the hard skin of her feet every day because she was terrified of heights...that fear became worse every year and later she only crawled which isnt't not very practical if you need to see what is on the top shelf in your local supermarket. We called her "Captain Crawl the Creepy Crawler" or cccc or sissysissy because she was such a sissy.



SSS-SIC*K*! :mellow:


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Are you trying to make me go blind!!?? *throws bug in your hair*


I haven't the FAINTEST idea of what you are talking about dear good sir 

*notices bug in hair - ensues freakout*


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> SSS-SIC*K*! :mellow:


Yeah, I am somewhat special...mostly I get away with it because I am incredibly handsome. But the interwebz definitely doesn't work to my advantage.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Yeah, I am somewhat special...mostly I get away with it because I am incredibly handsome. But the interwebz definitely doesn't work to my advantage.


 Oh how funny is THAT! I was JUST "teasing" someone in this thread, being a jerk for ironic fun (though they may have not got what I was rambling on and probably just think I'm on crack) but in any case ... I made mention --> *giggling* .. so I could "get away with it" ... but then admitted that, well .. there is NO way that can seriously fly. No one can hear my adorable mischievous giggling!

*sighs* Meh. tis the way the interwenz cookie crumbles


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> Oh how funny is THAT! I was JUST "teasing" someone in this thread, being a jerk for ironic fun (though they may have not got what I was rambling on and probably just think I'm on crack) but in any case ... I made mention --> *giggling* .. so I could "get away with it" ... but then admitted that, well .. there is NO way that can seriously fly. No one can hear my adorable mischievous giggling!
> 
> *sighs* Meh. tis the way the interwenz cookie crumbles


I see you are somewhat special too...*laughs*


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> I see you are somewhat special too...*laughs*


Just like everyone else ... 

Unless that was an insult as in "ssspecial" in which case --> >:/

:tongue:


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> Just like everyone else ...
> 
> Unless that was an insult as in "ssspecial" in which case --> >:/
> 
> :tongue:


Well not like me------>*points eloquently at autograph*. You and I are extra special. On top of that, I am a huge pervert so that makes me potentially dangerous.


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> On top of that, I am a huge pervert so that makes me potentially dangerous.


either that or exceptionally _creepy_

*giggling tee.hee.hee.hee* :tongue:


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> either that or exceptionally _creepy_
> 
> *giggling tee.hee.hee.hee* :tongue:


Are you Asian?


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Are you Asian?


no. do asian people find you creepy or something. 
*looks at you suspiciously* is there something I ought to know? ...hrmmmm :tongue:


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## Azure Bass (Sep 6, 2010)

I stopped growing at 5'10. I used to be sad because I wanted to be 6'0 + when I was going through puberty, I was expected to be 6'2. But I hunched in elementary school due to low self esteem and family problems that obviously followed up on the potential it limited. Later on I found out that I was in the average height range and stopped making such a big deal over it. I'm still jealous of the guys taller than me by a few inches, even though there are people both shorter and taller than me that are also jealous. Strange.


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## Echoe (Apr 23, 2012)

I don't see a reason to "judge" a couple for having an usual height difference.


This being said, I have had only strong discomfort with guys who have been shorter than me. Can't imagine taller bothering me, but for whatever reason the guy being shorter just feels fejshfeufheuifhdjhfdk. Can't do it.


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> no. do asian people find you creepy or something.
> *looks at you suspiciously* is there something I ought to know? ...hrmmmm :tongue:


Hahaha, no, your writing style reminds me of an ex of mine: Cheerful, lots of smileys and generally positive and outgoing. I thought maybe it's an Asian thing. Whenever I see your posts, I know it's you just by the way you express yourself and I don't even have to look at your name of avatar to know it's you.

And there is something you don't WANT to know


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

:kitteh: Why thank you! )

Maybe she was an INFJ, or maybe it's the NF-ness. It's fairly spectacular stuff. *nods*



Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> And there is something you don't WANT to know


:shocked: Oh NO! He tried to bait me with curiosity! Hahah!!!


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## All in Twilight (Oct 12, 2012)

Ningsta Kitty said:


> :kitteh: Why thank you! )
> 
> Maybe she was an INFJ, or maybe it's the NF-ness. It's fairly spectacular stuff. *nods*
> 
> ...



I don't know what you look like but I think you're cute


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## petite libellule (Jul 4, 2012)

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> I don't know what you look like but I think you're cute


 :blushed: that was super sweet. thank you!


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