# People who need chaos



## Aqualung (Nov 21, 2009)

What is that called? People who need chaos & instability. I was reading about Terrell Owen's latest crisis & thought back to his troublesome carrier in the NFL & his latest problems & I thought; It NEVER stops. Becomes he doesn't want it to. He NEEDS chaos. Same with my ex wife. I spent 9 years running around "putting out fires" that she started & I realized, she WANTS chaos. She does NOT want stability or peace. Maybe that's boring to her but the stress was killing me. Which brings me to my question: what is this called? Is there a word/term for it? I'd like to read up on it because I'm curious about it. Or is it just a component of being bi-polar? Found out my ex was bi-polar 8 or 9 years after I divorced her.


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## strawberryLola (Sep 19, 2010)

I have a friend who has bi-polar disorder- she freaks the frack out from chaos. She cannot handle chaos of any sort. 

When people seek/want chaos in their lives without awareness, I'd say that's how they've learned to operate most of their lives through conditioning and somehow normalizing the situation. Meaning, they don't know how to operate any other way.

Sounds like a chronic anxiety-provoking state of mind, PTSD-related. Not everyone who has PTSD responds the same way. I had a friend who was similar and said he needed that chaos in order to find peace in his life because that's how he learned to survive.

Constant trauma becomes a new normal for those who have had multiple traumas.


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## dragonfriend (Feb 24, 2012)

The truth couldn't have been any more sweeter. It's true that one grows accustomed to the average things that would make most grown folk vomit. But as Lola said, it is something one is already accustomed to.


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## LeelaWho (Nov 28, 2011)

It's not always a matter of "needing" chaos.

It's more like cutting. Except of physically cutting your arm though, you sabotage relationships, treat yourself like crap, place yourself in situations where people abuse you, etc. 

Getting emotionally hurt actually gives them a "high" just like a cutter gets when they cut.

The drama is just a substitute for not dealing with something else that they're avoiding.


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

LeelaWho said:


> It's more like cutting. Except of physically cutting your arm though, you sabotage relationships, treat yourself like crap, place yourself in situations where people abuse you, etc.
> 
> Getting emotionally hurt actually gives them a "high" just like a cutter gets when they cut.
> 
> The drama is just a substitute for not dealing with something else that they're avoiding.


Out of curiosity, what would drive a person to behave in such a manner? Is it really as simple as doing it for a "neurochemical fix" to the point of it being a fetish?


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## LeelaWho (Nov 28, 2011)

MNiS said:


> Out of curiosity, what would drive a person to behave in such a manner? Is it really as simple as doing it for a "neurochemical fix" to the point of it being a fetish?


Trauma. It's not a "fetish" so much as a way to cheer one's self up and avoiding thinking about something that's unbearable. 

So, you just can't tell someone "Stop doing that! Look at how it's killing you!" You have to address the thing that they're numbing themselves to and the self-abuse will go away as they learn how to deal with their problems in a healthy way.


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

LeelaWho said:


> Trauma. It's not a "fetish" so much as a way to cheer one's self up and avoiding thinking about something that's unbearable.
> 
> So, you just can't tell someone "Stop doing that! Look at how it's killing you!" You have to address the thing that they're numbing themselves to and the self-abuse will go away as they learn how to deal with their problems in a healthy way.


Sounds pretty terrible situation to be in, if you ask me.


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## Nessie (Jan 6, 2012)

MNiS said:


> Out of curiosity, what would drive a person to behave in such a manner? Is it really as simple as doing it for a "neurochemical fix" to the point of it being a fetish?


If you are curious what drives person behave like above mentioned description, Borderline personality disorder could be one of possibilities. You could google to see how does it look like.
P.s.: better to google than get near to someone with BPD: its not much fun:dry:.


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## MNiS (Jan 30, 2010)

LeelaWho said:


> Trauma. It's not a "fetish" so much as a way to cheer one's self up and avoiding thinking about something that's unbearable.
> 
> So, you just can't tell someone "Stop doing that! Look at how it's killing you!" You have to address the thing that they're numbing themselves to and the self-abuse will go away as they learn how to deal with their problems in a healthy way.


Hm, so I thought about this for a bit and that makes a lot of sense. Take sex addicts for example. Often times people addicted to sex were abused as children or they never had a strong parental figure in their lives (or in some cases had overbearing parents). Addressing the problem would require a stabilizing force in that person's life, or to completely remove the offending conditions causing the problem in order to deal with it in a healthy way.

You could generalize that statement for all addictions or oddities/maladaptive behavior in a person's personality. 


Still, what kind of "trauma" would drive a person to behave this way? There are two ways of looking at it from my perspective:

1) Origin/genetic - They had a terrible childhood or suffer from a mental/psychological disorder.
2) Enormous stress - That would lead to PTSD type symptoms.

Your take?


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

Do I really need a good reason to alleviate boredom?

Ohwait, yes I do.
I missed when things were simpler, but then again I guess everyone does?


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## Mountainshepherd (Feb 23, 2012)

It is called being human, our nervous system requires novelty to adapt and improve, chaos is absolutely necessary for mental growth and development. Now the degree of which, yeah that probably differs from person to person. I suspect the more you are unhappy, unconsciously or consciously, with your circumstances the more likely you are to try to create random events for the hope that they will change things.


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## ersa (Feb 9, 2012)

Aqualung said:


> What is that called? People who need chaos & instability. I was reading about Terrell Owen's latest crisis & thought back to his troublesome carrier in the NFL & his latest problems & I thought; It NEVER stops. Becomes he doesn't want it to. He NEEDS chaos. Same with my ex wife. I spent 9 years running around "putting out fires" that she started & I realized, she WANTS chaos. She does NOT want stability or peace. Maybe that's boring to her but the stress was killing me. Which brings me to my question: what is this called? Is there a word/term for it? I'd like to read up on it because I'm curious about it. Or is it just a component of being bi-polar? Found out my ex was bi-polar 8 or 9 years after I divorced her.


My first thought to chaos and instability is borderline


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## DoIHavetohaveaUserName (Nov 25, 2015)

I love Chaos very much . look around you , the world is in very much of Chaos .


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

Some people are reactive and some are proactive(this is simplification). Those who are proactive can create progress out of nothing. Those that are reactive need something to react to. They can improve existing situations. But if they don't have something to react to they can't improve it, so they will ignore certain parts of their life. Eventually that part of their life turns into chaos(because everything that isn't controlled naturally returns to chaos). Only then they do something about it. Reactive people can't solve problems that don't exist. Proactive people can solve problems that don't exist yet.

Just a thought. It might be bullshit.


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## MisterPerfect (Nov 20, 2015)

People who want Chaos are just very unstable people. 
I simply need a challenge


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## Stickman (Sep 30, 2012)

MisterPerfect said:


> People who want Chaos are just very unstable people.
> I simply need a challenge


Well. If you have a very stable person and he isn't very affected by chaos, but others are, then that person has an advantage when there is chaos.

There's a cyclist that's very good at cycling in the rain. Really he isn't better at cycling in the rain than he is on a clear day, but since he is much less affected by the rainthan the other cyclists, he is more likely to win the race when it rains.


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## MisterPerfect (Nov 20, 2015)

Stickman said:


> Well. If you have a very stable person and he isn't very affected by chaos, but others are, then that person has an advantage when there is chaos.
> 
> There's a cyclist that's very good at cycling in the rain. Really he isn't better at cycling in the rain than he is on a clear day, but since he is much less affected by the rainthan the other cyclists, he is more likely to win the race when it rains.


True


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## FueledByEvil (Aug 6, 2015)

Chaos for the win!!

I live fairly chaotically when it comes to myself.
When I have responsibilities I tend to be sure 
they are at least moderately taken care especially 
if they/it will effect my family,or before I get all squirrely.

Indeed, I will incite chaos in times of 
long term monotony just to get my wheels turning.

I do thrive in chaos and I use it as a way to test my mettle.

Chaos for me can incite panic as well and that leads to fast 
thinking mystery/problem solving. A fun time for sure.

If you can except the fact that it does damage some times
then I would recommend it.


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## Blazkovitz (Mar 16, 2014)

Perhaps some degree of chaos is what separates living things from machines. Chaotic, random thoughts may help with creativity.


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## FearAndTrembling (Jun 5, 2013)

It is called Se. When the going gets tough, the tough get going. Hegel said that a hero is impossible in civilized conditions, they can only exist in natural or chaotic conditions. 






"You have to test yourself every day, gentlemen. Once you stop testin' yourself, you get slow. And when that happens, they kill you."

-Billy the Kid


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## Worriedfunction (Jun 2, 2011)

Stickman said:


> Some people are reactive and some are proactive(this is simplification). Those who are proactive can create progress out of nothing. Those that are reactive need something to react to. They can improve existing situations. But if they don't have something to react to they can't improve it, so they will ignore certain parts of their life. Eventually that part of their life turns into chaos(because everything that isn't controlled naturally returns to chaos). Only then they do something about it. Reactive people can't solve problems that don't exist. Proactive people can solve problems that don't exist yet.
> 
> Just a thought. It might be bullshit.


I think it's a good thought and similar to one I've had before. 

I think part of the reason for our internal strifes vs external progress is the principal behind that thought. The proactive anticipates and creates but the reactive can only precipitate. So we're at a point in time I think where the proactive are in short supply and the reactive are too present, crippling progress because they know underneath that they are the most likely to be left behind and become irrelevant. 

Therefore fear of chaos and losing the illusion of control.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

FearAndTrembling said:


> It is called Se. When the going gets tough, the tough get going. Hegel said that a hero is impossible in civilized conditions, they can only exist in natural or chaotic conditions.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Haha oh good I am not entirely crazy because that was my first thought, "isnt this Se" tehe. 

:happy:

Anyways I would say I would be a great depiction of what your describing BUT I did recognize this pattern in myself a few years back and really reel it in. I channel my challenges in more productive routes rather then gravitating towards things that bring chaos usually more now, but that takes crashing and reflecting I think for an Se dom, before they can see it and even then they have got to recognize it and address it and recognize where they go off route in ways that can impact negative. I totally consider it an unhealthy form of seeking adrenaline and endorphins. On a minimal level its a good thing. Out of control it can be very bad. But yeah I totally think this is a poster child condition of an Se dom/inferior Ni, my eldest sis an ESFP has it bad. 

That said maybe its not just mbti type. My sis and I both grew up in environments where you learn to watch your back. Always angle your back towards a wall, spot cameras, peripheral vision (so you can see em coming). Not sure if I feel I am fully out with my sis if she does not have a public outburst or start an un necessary fight with some stranger (lol). I would be astounded like damn hmm is she ok, does she have a pulse still. If she didnt behave like that.

Young Guns haha love that movie, tribute song,


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## FearAndTrembling (Jun 5, 2013)

SensationalCinnamon said:


> Haha oh good I am not entirely crazy because that was my first thought, "isnt this Se" tehe.
> 
> :happy:
> 
> ...


Been talking a lot about Young Guns lately. Great movie. lol

That is how I see Se as flexible; not that you can push it around but it can survive. It can find a way. Like Eminem for example. Guy seems stubborn as hell but to navigate the environment he did, like that rap world as a white guy in the ghetto, and basically INSIST he succeed. That is how Se is flexible. I am not good at that. I fall apart in those situations. 

Look how cool Billy always is. He goes out looking for trouble and feels comfortable he can handle it.












I think Se fears failure less. It sees it as the cost of doing business. They actually get stronger with each defeat. lol. 

"I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed."

-Michael Jordan

*“There is no better than adversity. Every defeat, every heartbreak, every loss, contains its own seed, its own lesson on how to improve your performance next time.”*


-Malcolm X

There is no easy way out.


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## shameless (Apr 21, 2014)

FearAndTrembling said:


> Been talking a lot about Young Guns lately. Great movie. lol
> 
> That is how I see Se as flexible; not that you can push it around but it can survive. It can find a way. Like Eminem for example. Guy seems stubborn as hell but to navigate the environment he did, like that rap world as a white guy in the ghetto, and basically INSIST he succeed. That is how Se is flexible. I am not good at that. I fall apart in those situations.
> 
> Look how cool Billy always is. He goes out looking for trouble and feels comfortable he can handle it.


:happy:
Our baby sis is INFJ, I always imagine her with my eldest sister and I must be thinking "OMFG these animals again" (especially my eldest sis, I can reign it in a bit if need be, I have more control but am also the bigger hot head I get pissed, my eldest sis is like being at a fair 24/7). 

Eh well theres more poise I think in Ni dominance over Se. 

I totally could see myself loving the wild west (channeling Annie Oakley :wink: )

It is a good movie.


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## FueledByEvil (Aug 6, 2015)

Worriedfunction said:


> Therefore fear of chaos and losing the illusion of control.


It is funny to note that even when people do realize it 
is illusioned control they still digress into that fear.

Once I realized I really only control my immediate actions
I sort of ...let go and let the chaos wash over me.


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