# Whats your religion? (Religion and Personality)



## nat2424

I've heard things about certain religion correlating with personality type but would like to hear your thoughs, see some stats, and know your religion! Throw in what religion you were raised too 

I am an INFP

I am agnostic... 

I believe all religions and all Gods are right because they were all created for the greater good. I could never say one religion is right and one is wrong.

There may be a god though I don't think there will be an afterlife.. but if there was I'd be going to heaven 

Oh I was raised Catholic but had a hard time believing any of it once I got to about high school, and trust me I tried!


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## Le9acyMuse

Cool, let's see...

I'm an IsFP

I...hm... I'm a Christian, I think. I know, "what," right? I don't want to be like any of the Christians I've met in my lifetime. I used to be an atheist. Raised in Christian faith.

I can understand about having second thoughts. oy... I don't even wanna concentrate on the afterlife stuff.


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## Lucretius

I am an INTP.

I am a contemporary Stoic, of the atheist variety.

I was raised as a Protestant, but began to question my beliefs during the latter half of high school. I went through various spells of faith and skepticism, but never really made any progress until I started to study philosophy. This basically started a chain reaction that led to my deconversion from Christianity, deconversion from theism, and abandonment of faith-based beliefs altogether.

I've never felt better! :happy:


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## Raakakaakao

I believe in a higher power, but find dogmatic following of some religion just plain F''king silly.In my experience the people who have the need to promote their faith all the time, are the ones who's faith is the most feeble.Like putting the words god or Jesus in every one of your sentences and reasoning, just makes me think of a brainwashed zombie immediately. I am very interested in theology and different religions especially ancient beliefs of my people.I feel that christianization and the spread of other big religions has done harm to many indigineous cultures throughout history. I feel that I would be more comfortable celebrating the original holy-days of my people instead of the ones put on the same places by christians. Sometimes I just can't but wonder why people in Finland for example, would conform so freely and unquestionably to a thousands of years old middle-eastern belief system. Basically I think every religion is the same and they're cool, as long as they are not used to oppress people.


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## Rommel

I'm an INFP

I'm Mormon.

Born and raised. Did my own thing for awhile but decided it was the right place for me. A conservative mormon non artsy person. I feel like an odd duck INFP lmao....


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## Imagine

Buddhist and Chirstian


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## Gracie

INFJ, agnostic.


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## apathy ends the world

INFP, grew up Catholic, now agnostic.


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## BrokenSticks

INFP

Not religious (I prefer to say that than "Atheist", because most atheists I meet are just angry former religious people). I mostly just don't care what anyone is unless they're trying to push it on me.

I did not have religion in my home as a child. I am thankful. Otherwise I'd probably be an atheist right now. lol.

The world can look like a crazy place to the non-religious. It's like, everyone around me has an imaginary friend... but these people are not children... and they don't seem to have schizophrenia... it's just weird.


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## Unnursvana

*sigh* religion is always been a puzzle for me in a way, I believe in existence of a God but I believe in any specific God like the Christian God or any other God but I do believe in higher power and stuff like that, behind every myth or legend is some sort of truth I guess or that is what I think. I believe in elves, magic and stuff like that so who wouldn't I believe in a higher power. 

I don't know where I stand in the religion world, I have never had a religion and I didn't grow up with any but I used to pray to go when I was little and I went to Sunday school or whatever you call it every Sunday when I was little but I have never had any specific religion or anything like that, because to me most religions have the same morals or the same meaning _that we should not hurt others or kill others_ or something like that and I find that beautiful and I like there morals but I don't approve of the _you can not have another god_ or something like that, if we can only believe in one God and no one else then why did God bother to give us free will. 

I do not believe in everything that is said in the bible, not all of it is true and some words there can't be Gods words because God didn't write the bible, priest back in the day did and they must have made some rules just so they could get more money out of the poor and control them even more because the Church had so much power back in the day.... 

anyway, like I said religion is a puzzle for me really. I think it is good and beautiful to some extent and it has helped many people and now I am talking about all religion but it also has some very dark history and people were and still are killed because of there religion and I think that is so wrong.

I am fine with any religion really, it doesn't bother me and I think it is beautiful thing but I just have never and I probably will never believe in just one God or that this gods way is righter then the other gods way, even if I do believe in a higher power and I am fine with any religion as long as it doesn't involve killing people or something and I don't like it when people's minds are closed by religions and they don't respect other peoples religions. 

I would rather have my mind open by wonders then closed by religion but that is just me. 

I hope I didn't offend anyone, that wasn't my attention at all, just sharing my thoughts really on the matter and I am sorry about how long this is :wink: I have a lot on my mind and I express me better this way then talking.


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## hazzle92

INFP - I'm Agnostic right now, was raised Anglican (Christian). I don't have a clue what to believe so yeah Agnostic.


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## mutton

ENFJ - very Christian- Protestant but basically non-denominational.


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## skycloud86

I'm an INTP and an agnostic atheist.


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## mutton

skycloud86 said:


> I'm an INTP and an agnostic atheist.


How can you be both? I thought an agnostic believed there could be a "higher power" but is either undecided or thinks it doesn't matter, while an atheist is certain that there is nothing?


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## danicx

ENTP, atheist



mutton said:


> How can you be both? I thought an agnostic believed there could be a "higher power" but is either undecided or thinks it doesn't matter, while an *atheist is certain that there is nothing*?


No, you're thinking of "stupidity". Atheism is a lack of belief, it's simply skepticism.


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## Penemue

INTJ. I believe that even if there was a God then we could not possibly comprehend his full power or begin to understand what he wants or has planned for us. So i'm going to just have fun.


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## RetardedMonkey

I'm an ENFJ and a HumaChrisBuddInduEist
It's my own homemade religion of Humanism, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism and Atheism all rolled into one. 
It works for me. :tongue:


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## mutton

oneoutside said:


> ENTP, atheist
> 
> 
> No, you're thinking of "stupidity". Atheism is a lack of belief, it's simply skepticism.


 
I just assumed that atheists were certain on this belief. Confirmation bias, perhaps, as every atheists I've known seem very sure that there isn't anything supernatural at all. I thought that "lack of belief" would be lumped under the category of agnosticism.


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## Third Engine

INFP
Agnostic

I was born a Catholic and converted to Protestantism around the age of 10. Stayed a fundamentalist Christian until I was about 17, when I started to question my beliefs. I eventually deconverted from Christianity, and now I don't believe in a specific God, but I'm open to there being one out there. Actually, pantheism/panentheism sounds really cool to me, but I don't know if I actually believe it.


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## Cthulhu

ENTP - Atheistic Skepticism is what i call my thoughts. I dont completely throw out the notion of a god, but i push it to the side when im in the real world because science has been demonstrably better at giving reasons why things happen. I do question about anything and everything until it can be proven to be true, and since religion cant be proven to be true by science, i am an Atheist.


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## vel

atheist - INFJ

i respect other people's right to believe, as long as they don't try to impose those beliefs on me in way, especially nterfering with our government and mixing secular (what works) and their opinions (what they feel will work)
i have been religious in past so can understand it - when religious people try to make the rest of use use rely on religion, it really does more harm than good


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## Shawn

ISTJ. Pentecostal Christian (a denomination more suited for the ESFP/ENFP crowd, really.)


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## PorlockVisitor

INFP

Catholic


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## icicle84

INFP. Christian.

I'll say non-denominational. I'm equally as comfortable in some Baptist and some (milder) charismatic churches. Also been in Presbyterian churches I like, and I like the reverence I usually see in Catholic churches.

The most important thing is this: "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God sent not His son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world, through Him, might be saved."


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## icicle84

Shawn said:


> ISTJ. Pentecostal Christian (a denomination more suited for the ESFP/ENFP crowd, really.)


I've been in Pentecostal churches before, and I think just about every type was represented there.

I think the misconception is that everyone there will be handling snakes, running around shoeless or swinging from chandeliers - when it's more about being in agreement with the more "charismatic" elements of Christianity, regardless of how they manifest themselves in your demeanor at church.

Out of curiosity, are you UPCI or IPHC (or just "Pentecostal" in the general sense)?

I attended an IPHC church for a while.


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## Shawn

icicle84 said:


> I've been in Pentecostal churches before, and I think just about every type was represented there.
> 
> I think the misconception is that everyone there will be handling snakes, running around shoeless or swinging from chandeliers - when it's more about being in agreement with the more "charismatic" elements of Christianity, regardless of how they manifest themselves in your demeanor at church.
> 
> Out of curiosity, are you UPCI or IPHC (or just "Pentecostal" in the general sense)?
> 
> I attended an IPHC church for a while.


I don't know what those letters stand for. If it helps at all, I'm part of the Assemblies of God subdenomination.

@Ice Ghost: Catholicism is pretty awesome, although it's possible to get discouraged by the ritualistic ways of their Masses unless you understand the meaning behind them.


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## The Scorched Earth

icicle84 said:


> I've been in Pentecostal churches before, and I think just about every type was represented there.
> 
> I think the misconception is that everyone there will be handling snakes, running around shoeless or swinging from chandeliers - when it's more about being in agreement with the more "charismatic" elements of Christianity, regardless of how they manifest themselves in your demeanor at church.


Please, I grew up Southern Baptist. That type of thing happened every Sunday...


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## The Scorched Earth

Shawn said:


> @Ice Ghost: Catholicism is pretty awesome, although it's possible to get discouraged by the ritualistic ways of their Masses unless you understand the meaning behind them.


I've been to enough Masses to know the meaning of each ritual. Honestly, I find comfort in the routine, probably because everything else in my life is so chaotic...Typical ENFP.


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## icicle84

Shawn said:


> I don't know what those letters stand for. If it helps at all, I'm part of the Assemblies of God subdenomination.


I gotcha. IPHC is International Pentecostal Holiness Church. UPCI is United Pentecostal Church International.

Assemblies of God makes sense - definitely not as much a reputation for snakes and chandeliers as IPHC.


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## obz900

INFP. Agnostic.


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## Daydream Believer

INFP. In a sort of transition period.
Raised Lutheran-parents kept me very involved in church activities.
Stepped away from church during high school when I was able.
Today I really feel I want to convert to Judaism.
I always felt drawn to Judaism and will finally have a chance to actually be around a Jewish community this fall and not just study on my own as I've been doing.


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## katerp

I don't really know where I stand on religion, though I probably sound agnostic. I have my doubts from time to time, but I guess I would say most of the time I believe in God (this usually comes out when I have a bone to pick with him... "Really God? I have to hit _every_ red light in the world when I'm running late? A little help down here please," or "C'mon Universe, the Daily Show isn't supposed to be depressing. Can you toss a little good news our way?") My father is a lapsed Catholic who adamantly did NOT want me raised Catholic and my mother is a non-practicing Protestant. I was christened in the Methodist Church - which is fine with me since they're pretty laid-back and undemanding as far as organized religions go - but I haven't been to church since I was four and grew up pretty much without religion. 

All in all I don't really understand the concept of organized religion as it exists today. If it was just a congregation of people sharing the same beliefs who used the organization as a vehicle to provide people with peace of mind and maybe do humanitarian work then I would understand. But the whole idea of having a belief system so bloated with unnecessary tradition and detail that it actually brands seemingly neutral activities or beliefs as being "good" or "evil"... I'll never get that. I don't understand how someone can come to believe something just because their religion says they should. I want the freedom to believe whatever I believe naturally and have that be accepted as long as I'm a good person. It's when people surrender their freedom of belief to the dictates of a radical religion (or more likely a radical religious leader) that organized religion becomes detrimental rather than healthy (Note: I don't mean to offend anybody who belongs to an organized religion and I don't believe there is anything wrong with organized religion. It's just unfortunate that many corrupt people use the power of religion to carry out their own agendas). I have been interested in Unitarian Universalism as of late because it really seems like the non-religion. Essentially "believe whatever you want, find your own truth, just be a good person and be tolerant of others". That's a system I can get behind.


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## Kitten

I'm an ENFP and I have no idea what I believe in. It's not that I don't care - I DO care. I just don't know what to believe. ^^;;

I don't consider myself an atheist, because it's not that I don't believe God exists - I just DON'T KNOW if he exists. There may be a God or there may not be. I don't know.

In a way, I like not having any set religion because it gives me more freedom... but there are also times when I wish I had a definite belief that I could stick to. :mellow:


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## bokanovskified

ENTP and a nontheist. I'm not the kind of atheist who thinks all religion should be abolished. I think that humanity will always find a need for some kind of religious thinking, involving a god or not, for better and for worse.


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## VenusMisty

I'm a pantheist, who believes that god is energy, particles, power, loving yet fairly disinterested until it wakes up and goes WTF I NEED TO DO SOMETHING. I think god is chaotic neutral --chaotic good, depending on how it feels. It sees everything. It's a total voyeurist and is awesome. I think God has a raucous sense of humor. Sometimes it makes clouds look like things--not fuzzily, but clearly--an eye, a hand, a racing panther dissolving into a face. I don't like organized relgious ceremonies. I like paganism, but not necessarily the people it attracts. What's important to me is developing better understanding and compassion and maybe one day becoming less jaded and misanthropic.


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## ArielG

I am ISFJ and a Classical Polytheist + Platonist.

I believe that the deities worshiped in ancient Rome do exist and I worship them today. Some of the teachings of Socrates that are found in the Platonic dialogues are beliefs that I subscribe to.

But ISFJ may not seem SPQR to most. lol. =p


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## 4everCharmed

>.>; I keep questioning what religion I actually am lol.. still a bit confused as to what accurately represents what I think.. 


anyways, I'm an INFP


and I think what Best fits me is Agnostic. Even though I think I should be Atheist since I feel like I view things more realistically.. I don't really believe in gods or spirits or anything like that. I believe that religion was created mostly by humans trying to give a meaning in their lives, answer to their problems, explanations for the unknown and a guide to life. It's also a tool that can be manipulated by people to control the masses. So in general, I think no religion is more right than another, they all basically function the same way. And when people talk about their belief in god and such :mellow: I don't really take them seriously sometimes because it just doesn't seem to make sense to me. I notice that when I debate with religious people and question their beliefs, they can't really ever give me a good answer as to Why I should believe it to be real. There's no proof. They just go 'it just is!' 'you just have to believe' or something like that.


The reason why I think I'm Agnostic though is because... even though I don't believe in any of that stuff... I seem to always Fantasize about it and Wish that it were real. :crazy: like I'll think to myself 'what if' and plus.. it's not like I know Everything, so I'd keep an open mind. I mean if i was truly Atheist :tongue: wouldn't that mean I wouldn't be scared of ghosts and such.. yet if someone were to dare me into living in a supposedly haunted house or stay at a graveyard or w/e I'd be hesitant and rather not mess with that stuff. I do feel like I'm attracted to the paranormal sometimes and want to find out if it's real or not, but at the same time I don't think it is.  Could be why roud: I like watching fantasy and such like Charmed tv show.


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## echidna1000

venusmisty said:


> i'm a pantheist, who believes that god is energy, particles, power, loving yet fairly disinterested until it wakes up and goes wtf i need to do something. I think god is chaotic neutral --chaotic good, depending on how it feels. It sees everything. It's a total voyeurist and is awesome. I think god has a raucous sense of humor. Sometimes it makes clouds look like things--not fuzzily, but clearly--an eye, a hand, a racing panther dissolving into a face. I don't like organized relgious ceremonies.


i totally agree!!!!


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## Linus

INFJ.. born Catholic

I don't think I'm really anything in particular now, I believe in God but it's not the same kind maybe or maybe I finally know who God is now. Also I like to hang on to religious images, like Mary and the saints..because it's beautiful to look at and is full of good memories (*_*) I guess they also stand for something for me


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## Andrea

i am not care.

really though, i guess i was supposed to be Catholic, but i never got the memo.


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## The Great One

I am a Christian, but also believe in some Taoist, hindu, and Buddhist philosophys. I am indeed a Christian and believe that I will go to heaven when I die. I believe in the death, resurrection, and coming again of the Jesus Christ. However, lol, I'm not that moral of a person. I have very strong personal values, but however, I'm not the best at staying away from temptation; I'm a hedostic pleasure seeker. I think that that about sums it up.


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## Essay

ENFP, and I'm a Theravada Buddhist, but I'm heavily influenced by long-gone Gnostic belief-systems like Catharism.


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## amanda32

NatetheGreat said:


> I am a Christian, but also believe in some Taoist, hindu, and Buddhist philosophys. I am indeed a Christian and believe that I will go to heaven when I die. I believe in the death, resurrection, and coming again of the Jesus Christ. However, lol, I'm not that moral of a person. I have very strong personal values, but however, I'm not the best at staying away from temptation; I'm a hedostic pleasure seeker. I think that that about sums it up.


It's extremely hard to resist some forms of temptation. Even once denied is a victory.


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## The Great One

amanda32 said:


> It's extremely hard to resist some forms of temptation. Even once denied is a victory.


Yeah, I believe that I'll go to heaven, but LOL I'm going to wind up in heaven's ghettos. Instead of gold, the section of heaven that I'll live in will be paved with stainless steel.


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## SeeNbetween

grew up Christian till I was about 16, I can't say exactly when it changed but I can say that I'm now an atheist. I guess if I had a philosophy it would be somewhere between Hegel and Buddha


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## HeadInClouds84

INFP - Athiest


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## MadameBovary

Raised Russian Orthodox... dabbled in general Christianity... turned agnostic for a while... and finally decided that non-religious paganism is where my heart is... I find more holiness in nature, cosmos and animals than I do in anything else.


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## MensSuperMateriam

INTP. Weak atheist.



MadameBovary said:


> Raised Russian Orthodox... dabbled in general Christianity... turned agnostic for a while... and finally decided that non-religious paganism is where my heart is... I find more holiness in nature, cosmos and animals than I do in anything else.


Well, that cannot be called paganism while you don't believe in "supernatural entities". Maybe the word pantheism matches better with your description.


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## RhoAlphaNuAlpha

Agnostic-ENTJ


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## Socrates

Agnostic atheist.

I do not believe any god exists, but I could be wrong.

I am rather firm in by belief that god does not exist, in fact I view it as a near certainty. As certain as I'm sitting here and listening to the Melvins, there is no god. On the other hand, I will fully accept as well that I could very well be living in someone else's dream or in a simulated reality and not actually be here in this chair or listening to the Melvins. In that sense, god could exist. I do not, however, believe such is the case. 

I have asked for wisdom, knowledge, proof of existence, proof of being, a connection, a spirit, a dwelling, a voice, a true sign, a sudden enlightenment, the holy spirit, Jesus, various gods, so on, so forth.

I looked to the sky for answers, but none came. Now I'm afraid I must look to my mind and my heart. Both have lead me to atheism.

:wink:


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## MadameBovary

MensSuperMateriam said:


> INTP. Weak atheist.
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that cannot be called paganism while you don't believe in "supernatural entities". Maybe the word pantheism matches better with your description.


That's not entirely true. For example, Buddhism is paganism (most people don't know this), and they are not concerned too much with deities.
I do, kind of believe in Gaia, the mother earth...


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## MensSuperMateriam

MadameBovary said:


> That's not entirely true. For example, Buddhism is paganism (most people don't know this), and they are not concerned too much with deities.
> I do, kind of believe in Gaia, the mother earth...


I understand what you say, but I disagree. Buddhism is not paganism, because in their teachs (well, at least as I know) there are no references to deities or supernatural beings beyond "conscience=soul" and this things. The inclusion of supernatural beings is not a part of buddhism itself, is a sort of sincretism between its teachs and local religions.
Buddhism is defined as nontheistic religion.

The concept of Gaia is a vision of a high spiritual pantheism. Only if you see it as a separated conscious being could be properly defined as paganism, which requires conscious entities to be prayed. Recognizing Nature as a mistery, wonderful and admirable thing is not strictly paganism.


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## DestinyStarX

Christian for me

God the father God the son and God the holy ghost


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## MensSuperMateriam

DestinyStarX said:


> Christian for me
> 
> God the father God the son and God the holy ghost


Clearly you're a sensor  (not because your beliefs, but the way you believe)


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## brokendream

I'm an INFP, and I'm agnostic. I have a hard time believing that a benevolent higher power could exist, in light of the atrocities which are allowed to occur throughout the world, but there is no scientific method which could prove beyond doubt that I am right or wrong.


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## lib

..........


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## General Lee

Christianity

"May the Lord bless you and keep, the Lord make his face shine upon you and be gracious to you, the Lord give you his counteance and peace."

"I have fought the good fight, I have finished the course, I have kept the faith. In the future there is laid up for me the crown of righteouness which the Lord the righteous judge will award to me on that day but not only to me but also to all who have loved his coming." 

ISTJ


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## nevermore

INTP

Atheist (though I don't usually call myself atheist; I'm just not religious). But somewhat spiritual and have had a passing interest in alternative religions.


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## Judas

"Atheist (though I don't usually call myself atheist; I'm just not religious). But somewhat spiritual and have had a passing interest in alternative religions."

^ Kinda the same for me. Agnostic Atheist, but i like the daoist teachings and zenbuddhism, though i don't practice any religion or have any beliefs in anything "supernatural".


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## streetlightfancy

INFJ

"spiritual Christian"


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## Shine

ENFP / Agnostic


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## xezene

INFP - agnostic

Sorting out of religion is only the first step of discovery though -- it may be the hardest step, but it is only the first step. It is much more mind-blowing, things of Zen and reflections of ourselves & our culture coming to light. So I am agnostic/atheist in the Western sense, and I certainly do not belong to any religion, but in learning of Zen and the universe and the present moment, I am basically becoming less Western with every passing day.


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## Neon Knight

ESFP: Ex-Catholic (a terrible one, but still..) now Ignostic/Igtheist Buddhist of the nihilistic sort.


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## Lucretius

I posted here awhile back, but I'll give an 'update.'

I'm a Secular Humanist and an igtheist.
I don't usually call myself a Stoic recently, but I am still fond of this philosophy. (I'm reminded of a quote that describes me fairly well: "I am a Stoic...an Epicurean one.")
Also, I've begun to take an interest in Taoism (which has many surprising similarities to Stoicism) and may begin to practice it in a non-religious way.


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## Valdyr

Like Azrael, I posted here awhile ago, but I shall provide an update, having learned more about my personality. 

ENTJ, Atheist.


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## Blanco

I was raised Catholic but I don't really consider myself religious, maybe spiritual but not religious... because I don't like hierarchical institutions. I do believe, however, in God, the All, the Universe, Mother Earth, the Absolute, or whatever you want to call it, in a pantheist or panentheist sort of way.

I might of been agnostic at some point... but I've come to a point where I prefer to think there is something spiritually greater than us out there because otherwise it makes things kind of boring, frankly.


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## Paradox of Vigor

INTJ - Christian


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## devoid

Don't know what personality type really. My best idea is ENFP. I'm a Theist, nonreligious.


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## SnnyYellow

ENFJ-- Hindu(Those more of a spiritual Hindu not a dogmatic one); also: definitely a humanist. Humanist Hindu? (If that makes sense?)


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## IceCube

I have no religion.


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## Zdorobot

ENTP. Atheist. 

I tried being religious back in the day so I could pray to get a greencard but it wasn't working so I was like "wow God you're really being a jerk. You know what? You don't exist to me." Then a greencard appeared. It's a sign!


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## tabbee

i was raised into a 'christian family'
wasnt 'into' it until 10th grade.
i dont like telling people im 'christian'.
i dont like labels.
i dont like religion.
im spiritual.
when you're relationship with God becomes religious you know its all wrong.
i believe in one God and everything the bible says, in which Jesus died for our sins and I quote "for whomever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life [in Heaven]."
i wont shove my beliefs down you're throat.
but i do befriend people and have "deep conversations" with them about it as i believe it is my duty to "spread the word"
i can be honest with you though. as an INFP, if you attack my personal beliefs and/or i believe it to be negative, i will backfire


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## Ray Mabry

ENTP: Agnostic...borderline atheist lol.


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## human

INFJ here. Stories are my religion, I guess. They help me understand human experience, build appreciation of uncertainty, see the world through new lenses, and (through metaphor and symbolism) arrive at unexpected meanings. 

So.... agnostic.


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## seechiyun

INFJ. Christian.


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## Maverick45

Religion? Or do you mean the manner in which I choose to live my life to preserve a healthy conscience? I maintain a Christ conciousness, but am open to many things like shamanism, and buddhism and so on.


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## nallyha

Apostolic ok


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## TheLightningKid

INTP. Misotheism. 

Not too sure what kind of mix others would classify this to be.


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## Peacock

INFP
I'm Agnostic, I guess.
I do plan to follow a spiritual path once I find one I like(I'll probably just keep on wondering around metaphysical stores) , but I will never let religion rule my life and make my decisions for me.


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## Disfigurine

INFP.

Non-religious.
I'm not an atheist either, though.

I'm a nice mixture of open-minded and skeptical.
Highly spiritual.

More old old school than new age. I will not expand on that.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> Not everyone believes that Jesus was the son of God, and your argument really has no base, since you cannot make assumptions about people not believing in God.


Sadly, I'm forced to admit that there may well be a few who do believe in Yahweh (extremists/fanatics/priests), and we can only wish them a speedy recovery from their misguided reveries.

My argument is that regardless of whether anyone believes in God or not, in the end it is either real or fancied. And if it is real then it could be scientifically proven. It has not been scientifically proven, therefore we should regard it as false until it can be proved otherwise, not the other way around.

Do you believe in God?


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## CCCXXIX

I'm a non-denominational christian


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## Jidoasfdojais

Being Muslim implies my belief. My argument is that when so many people who have studied the matter believe, why do you think that you are absolutely correct? Also the argument that you cannot disprove the existence of God is just as valid as their is no scientific proof. I have no problem with your being Atheist, my problem lies with you thinking that any religious person is wrong, as I thought you implied here


> You should only respect other people's beliefs if they are correct. For eg. if a child in school had the belief that 2+4=Octopus instead of 6 then it is unreasonable that the teacher should respect this.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> Being Muslim implies my belief. My argument is that when so many people who have studied the matter believe, why do you think that you are absolutely correct? Also the argument that you cannot disprove the existence of God is just as valid as their is no scientific proof. I have no problem with your being Atheist, my problem lies with you thinking that any religious person is wrong, as I thought you implied here


Yes, you are quite correct - I do believe that people who believe in God are wrong (not necessarily in their general lives, of course. I just mean that their viewpoint is based on an incorrect premise in regards to their theological beliefs.) 

Firstly, on the question of the "no hard evidence either way means that it's 50/50 chance" is a very old argument indeed. It shows a total lack of understanding of the scientific method and also of mathematical probability. God is very VERY unlikely - about 99.9999999999+% (so unlikely, in fact, that I doubt it's ever come out of the Improbability Drive in Hitchhiker's Guide). Also, it's a silly concept too because it doesn't explain anything (if God made the universe - who made God? If he did exist then the laws of evolution would need to come into play in regards to him too, which means that only a Pantheon of Gods, like the Greek gods, can ever be possible. And they CERTAINLY wouldn't have any human characteristics, as they didn't evolve from apes.) It's a bit like someone saying to you that there's an invisible man standing in the room with you - it can be either true or false, but it isn't 50/50. Also, it can be proven whether there's an invisible man in your room, but no scientists would do a serious study on it, because it's TOO UNLIKELY to be worth bothering with.

And as for your first point, it's because I have confidence in my own judgment, and consider myself at least as intelligent as these people.


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## Jidoasfdojais

> God is very VERY unlikely - about 99.9999999999+%


This is very flawed, and seems opinionated; however, you seem very rigid and inflexible in terms of what you think, as am I , and so continuing this argument is pointless.


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## Peter

Silent Chameleon said:


> Yes, you are quite correct - I do believe that people who believe in God are wrong (not necessarily in their general lives, of course. I just mean that their viewpoint is based on an incorrect premise in regards to their theological beliefs.)
> 
> Firstly, on the question of the "no hard evidence either way means that it's 50/50 chance" is a very old argument indeed. It shows a total lack of understanding of the scientific method and also of mathematical probability. God is very VERY unlikely - about 99.9999999999+% (so unlikely, in fact, that I doubt it's ever come out of the Improbability Drive in Hitchhiker's Guide). Also, it's a silly concept too because it doesn't explain anything (if God made the universe - who made God? If he did exist then the laws of evolution would need to come into play in regards to him too, which means that only a Pantheon of Gods, like the Greek gods, can ever be possible. And they CERTAINLY wouldn't have any human characteristics, as they didn't evolve from apes.) It's a bit like someone saying to you that there's an invisible man standing in the room with you - it can be either true or false, but it isn't 50/50. Also, it can be proven whether there's an invisible man in your room, but no scientists would do a serious study on it, because it's TOO UNLIKELY to be worth bothering with.
> 
> And as for your first point, it's because I have confidence in my own judgment, and consider myself at least as intelligent as these people.


I agree with you that God doesn't exist, at least not in the way most religions present Him.

But like you said, God is a concept.

Simple knowledge can move a whole population, regardless of if that knowledge is correct. Concepts can have a lot of power and for that reason alone it can be argued that God does exist. So the real discussion is not about whether or not God exists, but in what form He exists.

The idea that God is the creator of everything is flawed in my opinion. But I understand the (human) need for purpose and without a god, there is no purpose. At least not for most people. This is why people are herd animals and why most people like to work for a boss. It gives them purpose. Something they can not give themselves.


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## Silent Chameleon

Peter said:


> I agree with you that God doesn't exist, at least not in the way most religions present Him.
> 
> But like you said, God is a concept.
> 
> Simple knowledge can move a whole population, regardless of if that knowledge is correct. Concepts can have a lot of power and for that reason alone it can be argued that God does exist. So the real discussion is not about whether or not God exists, but in what form He exists.
> 
> The idea that God is the creator of everything is flawed in my opinion. But I understand the (human) need for purpose and without a god, there is no purpose. At least not for most people. This is why people are herd animals and why most people like to work for a boss. It gives them purpose. Something they can not give themselves.


I understand what you're saying. But just because there is "no purpose" in the Atheistic view, does not mean the religious view is correct. Actually, it's the same - regardless of your beliefs, your life is just as meaningful or pointless as it would be if you believed in a giant space-squid as much as anything else because everyone exists in the same reality. In other words, whether your life turns out to be meaningful or pointless has nothing to do with your beliefs, it's about the reality of the context in which you live. 

If you're using God as a concept then that just remains a concept or imagination. Magic is a concept too - nobody thinks that exists IN THE REAL SENSE OF THE WORD  False knowledge is never a good thing if the real knowledge is an alternative at the same time.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> This is very flawed, and seems opinionated; however, you seem very rigid and inflexible in terms of what you think, as am I , and so continuing this argument is pointless.


What I say is not just the opinions of the moment, but has come from a great many hours of open-minded intense study around the topic. My views are solid because I have thought them through in depth, but I'm more than willing to change my view if someone can bring something to the table I haven't thought about before.


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## Jidoasfdojais

I have one proof that God exists that has so far been unrefutable. When the Quran first came to the prophet, the people in the region were known for their linguistic capabilities, poetry and the like. Yet when challenged to come up with one chapter with the same linguistic depth, they have all failed, and no one has succeeded so far. Other challenges included how the Quran has scientific knowledge that was not "discovered" by the scientific community until much later. There are many arguments such as these. I do not doubt your intelligence or studying, but you are one person, you cannot be right about everything. One may even say it is human nature to err.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> I have one proof that God exists that has so far been unrefutable. When the Quran first came to the prophet, the people in the region were known for their linguistic capabilities, poetry and the like. Yet when challenged to come up with one chapter with the same linguistic depth, they have all failed, and no one has succeeded so far. Other challenges included how the Quran has scientific knowledge that was not "discovered" by the scientific community until much later. There are many arguments such as these. I do not doubt your intelligence or studying, but you are one person, you cannot be right about everything. One may even say it is human nature to err.



If you're interested in reading a truly great book try Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials trilogy. Modern fantasy fiction is far better than ancient fantasy fiction in my opinion - although some of the Arabian Nights short stories are fantastic!


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## Jidoasfdojais

It is settled than, you are as inflexible as I said you were.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> I have one proof that God exists that has so far been unrefutable. When the Quran first came to the prophet, the people in the region were known for their linguistic capabilities, poetry and the like. Yet when challenged to come up with one chapter with the same linguistic depth, they have all failed, and no one has succeeded so far. Other challenges included how the Quran has scientific knowledge that was not "discovered" by the scientific community until much later. There are many arguments such as these. I do not doubt your intelligence or studying, but you are one person, you cannot be right about everything. One may even say it is human nature to err.


This is not proof of God at all. It's only proof that the author of the Koran was a genius. Nothing more or less than that. You could say that Shakespeare or Mozart are proofs of God on this premise too. I don't see the logic. How do you get from great writing to God in one leap?


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## Jidoasfdojais

The Prophet was illiterate, and he had no way of knowing some of the things that were written in the Quran without the existence of God.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> The Prophet was illiterate, and he had no way of knowing some of the things that were written in the Quran without the existence of God.


Two possibilities then: either Muhammad was illiterate in writing but a great orator and public speaker (in much the same way as Socrates); or he lied about being illiterate. Again, genius is capable of many things - Newton had no way of "knowing" about the forces of gravity; Einstein had no way of finding out about Relativity in space-time until they figured it out for themselves. Are you saying that Muhammad was not capable of possessing an imagination? I think you ought to give a little bit more credit - he was a clever guy.


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## Jidoasfdojais

You have a good point; however, the Prophet was not a scientist. His skills in language did not match the perfection with which the Quran was written with. The Quran mentions things like Galaxies and shifting tectonic plates. How could he have known any of that?


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> You have a good point; however, the Prophet was not a scientist. His skills in language did not match the perfection with which the Quran was written with. The Quran mentions things like Galaxies and shifting tectonic plates. How could he have known any of that?



Find these excerpts for me. I've read the Koran twice and never came across these (I doubt very much that these were explained explicitly and in depth). I'd be quite happy to offer an explanation once I actually read these. But, either way, it still isn't ANY proof of God. And as far as the question of "they couldn't possibly know this at the time" sort of thing - well, you could say the same about the ancient greeks (Empedocles, for example, was onto the theory of evolution over 2000 years before Darwin was even born). It really is incredible what the human brain is capable of in the minds of geniuses, why can't you just accept that human beings are capable of incredible things without help from some higher being?

Do you actually believe in Allah, as he is presented? If so, do you not agree that it would be a very depressing thought indeed if such a horrible tyrant did turn out to be real? There is no danger at all about this of course, because he doesn't actually exist, but isn't it a depressing thought to think of it?


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## Jidoasfdojais

Of course I believe in Allah, but I do not see him as a tyrant. Either way this argument is not going anywhere. I don't think I can change your mind no matter what kind of proof I show you.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> Of course I believe in Allah, but I do not see him as a tyrant. Either way this argument is not going anywhere. I don't think I can change your mind no matter what kind of proof I show you.


I'm yet to see any proof at all! Anyway, I'm off to work now. Thanks for the conversation - I enjoyed it.

I'll leave you with this question: where does Allah come from?


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## peacemelody

INT(P?) raised conservative christian/catholic. atheist/agnostic for a few years. always a spiritual seeker. drawn to eastern religions/new age thought. consider myself a Buddhist now


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## Jidoasfdojais

Allah does not "come from." Allah simply exists.


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> Allah does not "come from." Allah simply exists.




Really? Goodness. And how, may I ask, is this possible?

We both agree that you believe in Allah as he is presented in the Koran, yes? Well, in the Koran he appears to be quite a complex being, yes? An uncomplicated being would not be able to "dictate" to Muhammad, or create a Universe. So, because he is complicated, it therefore follows that he MUST have evolved. And for a being of that magnitude, he must have been evolving for many many billions of years. If he did not evolve and just "existed", then that is actually a proof for God NOT existing, so you're treading on thin ice here. If God exists, within this Universe, then he will be subject to exactly the same laws of physics as anything else. You can also not argue that Allah/Yahweh IS the Universe as this is not at all as he appears in any religious text of a monotheistic religion - it's more along the lines of Pantheism or "Einsteinian religion" which is not religion at all but Spirituality. And then, if you argue that he exists OUTSIDE the Universe, then that also is a proof that he doesn't exist because the Universe is the only place that he can exist (by definition), so if he doesn't exist within the Universe then he doesn't exist PERIOD.

And apart from that there's also the question of why does he have human characteristics if he never evolved from apes? This, again, is proof for the non-existence of a creator God, as humans have only been around for about 150,000 years, whereas the Universe is 13.7 BILLION years old. Therefore, how in the world can a God that has so many human-like characteristics (including language apparently) have created the Universe 13.7 billion years ago when he can only be, at maximum, about 100,000-200,000 years old as he evolved from apes?


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## Jidoasfdojais

What leads you to think he has human characteristics? Besides, your theory of existence is limited, he created this Universe, so its laws do not govern him, they only govern those he made subject to them. I may not reply to whatever you reply in a while, I have to go to sleep since I have classes early in the morning.


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## Peter

Silent Chameleon said:


> I understand what you're saying. But just because there is "no purpose" in the Atheistic view, does not mean the religious view is correct. Actually, it's the same - regardless of your beliefs, your life is just as meaningful or pointless as it would be if you believed in a giant space-squid as much as anything else because everyone exists in the same reality. In other words, whether your life turns out to be meaningful or pointless has nothing to do with your beliefs, it's about the reality of the context in which you live.
> 
> If you're using God as a concept then that just remains a concept or imagination. Magic is a concept too - nobody thinks that exists IN THE REAL SENSE OF THE WORD  False knowledge is never a good thing if the real knowledge is an alternative at the same time.


You are confusing 2 things which is why you have so many discussions with people. You are looking at the physical reality and judge based on that if something is real or not. Most people look at their own perception of reality and judge based on that if something is real or not. If in their perception something is real, (because they can feel it or see prove of it, depending on their preferences) then to them it is as real as the pain they feel when they hit their head against a wall.

You saying that it isn't real is like saying that the wall they just hit their head against isn't real. They felt the pain, therefore it is real. They don't research if the wall is really there.

You say that false knowledge is never a good thing and that real knowledge is always the better alternative. But that just means you haven't figured out people yet. Everybody (including you) has some level of false knowledge. Not because they want to fool them selves, but because they actually believe that their perception of reality is correct. In the end what you are discussing with people is perception of reality. Since everybody has their own perception of reality, these kinds of discussions are never ending and usually only end when at least 1 of the 2 parties is either upset or tired of the discussion.


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## Razvan

Silent Chameleon said:


> Isn't that a bit of a contradiction? I thought the whole point of religion was that religious people think that if there wasn't a god to stop them (and there isn't, by the way) they'd just go out and slaughter everyone. For this reason I see athiests being FAR more moral than Christians or Muslims (or most other religions). If you really did believe in morality you'd have the confidence to decide these things yourself.


Actually, I don't think you can say that, that the point of religion is that. The point of religion is to describe certain spiritual matters. If you are a conspiracy theorist, yes you will see conspiracies in everything, but the point of religion as a domain is different, it's to explain certain spiritual matters. You can consider it fiction if you don't believe them, or you can believe them, but it's not here to control masses. If it were, there would have been other more appropriate conceptual models for this. Like the egyptians believing their pharaohs are descendents of gods and you must obey them.



Silent Chameleon said:


> Really? Goodness. And how, may I ask, is this possible?
> 
> We both agree that you believe in Allah as he is presented in the Koran, yes? Well, in the Koran he appears to be quite a complex being, yes? An uncomplicated being would not be able to "dictate" to Muhammad, or create a Universe. So, because he is complicated, it therefore follows that he MUST have evolved. And for a being of that magnitude, he must have been evolving for many many billions of years. If he did not evolve and just "existed", then that is actually a proof for God NOT existing, so you're treading on thin ice here. If God exists, within this Universe, then he will be subject to exactly the same laws of physics as anything else. You can also not argue that Allah/Yahweh IS the Universe as this is not at all as he appears in any religious text of a monotheistic religion - it's more along the lines of Pantheism or "Einsteinian religion" which is not religion at all but Spirituality. And then, if you argue that he exists OUTSIDE the Universe, then that also is a proof that he doesn't exist because the Universe is the only place that he can exist (by definition), so if he doesn't exist within the Universe then he doesn't exist PERIOD.
> 
> And apart from that there's also the question of why does he have human characteristics if he never evolved from apes? This, again, is proof for the non-existence of a creator God, as humans have only been around for about 150,000 years, whereas the Universe is 13.7 BILLION years old. Therefore, how in the world can a God that has so many human-like characteristics (including language apparently) have created the Universe 13.7 billion years ago when he can only be, at maximum, about 100,000-200,000 years old as he evolved from apes?


You are drawing your own conclusions here, just because something is complex it doesn't mean it evolved. Maybe it did, maybe it didn't...Also you talk about things you have no knowledge of, you know there is nothing outside this universe? Can you honestly say you KNOW that? We don't even know what are the limits or the composition of the universe, yet you make such claims... How do you know there is nothing outside this universe? How do you know how this universe works? You don't and seriously, a wise man would not draw conclusions based on assumptions, a wise men would only emit theories and leave room for being wrong. You cannot define something that is beyond our power of comprehension with our knowledge. It's like trying to define a 11 dimension universe by using only 2 dimensions. :happy: You try to use science instead of using your spirit and the only result you can achieve in this way is utter failure.

And I don't even want to know how you draw this silly conclusion that God emerged from apes, when God created them. Or you talk about time in such a linear fashion....time is not linear, we just "see" it this way.


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## PlushWitch

I don't really see the point in discussing whether or not God exists or whether or not Jesus was the son of God or whether or not there is reincarnation or something like that...it's always going to be irrational from all sides. :tongue:


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## Pendragon

I don't think it will always be irrational from all sides, it just seems that way because people tend to be very passionate about their belief. However, the fact is that we probably won't ever reach an agreement, because (correct me if I'm wrong), the basis for believing in a God is generally faith. And while that does seem irrational to me, the very nature of the argument means that the existence of God, to believers, is impossible to disprove. And despite the fact that it's also impossible to prove, it's enough for some people, which, I believe, is simply a difference of how we perceive the world. And it also has a lot to do with how one is raised, obviously.


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## Bast

It's amazing to me how civilly you two were debating. You both brought up good points and no one resorted to childish fit-throwing and obscenities. I am so proud of my fellow NTs 

I must say that I find social constructs such as religion to be totally fascinating. I'm really interested in peoples' views on the subject, so this has been a very interesting thread to read. Thanks for that!


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## Jidoasfdojais

Bast said:


> It's amazing to me how civilly you two were debating. You both brought up good points and no one resorted to childish fit-throwing and obscenities. I am so proud of my fellow NTs
> 
> I must say that I find social constructs such as religion to be totally fascinating. I'm really interested in peoples' views on the subject, so this has been a very interesting thread to read. Thanks for that!


If someone starts having a fit and uses obscenities then it is not only obvious that that person has long lost, it also implies something else about their personality. Anyway, I do believe that we have abused this thread, it was meant for people to state their Religion and not debate it. If you want to continue this debate, take it to a more appropriate thread or perhaps personal messages.


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## Hokahey

INFJ - Independent Christian


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## Silent Chameleon

Hudifah Rabie said:


> Besides, your theory of existence is limited, he created this Universe, so its laws do not govern him, they only govern those he made subject to them.


Ah - that's beautifully close to the Invisible Pink Unicorn argument!  I was wondering when you'd get to that. Where is your proof that this is scientifically plausible?


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## Silent Chameleon

Peter said:


> You are confusing 2 things which is why you have so many discussions with people. You are looking at the physical reality and judge based on that if something is real or not. Most people look at their own perception of reality and judge based on that if something is real or not. If in their perception something is real, (because they can feel it or see prove of it, depending on their preferences) then to them it is as real as the pain they feel when they hit their head against a wall.
> 
> You saying that it isn't real is like saying that the wall they just hit their head against isn't real. They felt the pain, therefore it is real. They don't research if the wall is really there.
> 
> You say that false knowledge is never a good thing and that real knowledge is always the better alternative. But that just means you haven't figured out people yet. Everybody (including you) has some level of false knowledge. Not because they want to fool them selves, but because they actually believe that their perception of reality is correct. In the end what you are discussing with people is perception of reality. Since everybody has their own perception of reality, these kinds of discussions are never ending and usually only end when at least 1 of the 2 parties is either upset or tired of the discussion.


The physical reality is all there is. Otherwise you're just talking about mental constructs, or memes. In order for God to exist, it must exist in the real external universe - that's how all mono- and poly-theistic religions present them. In the Bible it doesn't say "God doesn't really exist but the idea of him does" but it presents God as an actual being with an intellectual capacity and a personality. Therefore, the question of whether or not God exists is a scientific question, and ALL the current data suggests that he almost certainly doesn't. It's the most improbable thing you can ever think of; therefore probability alone proves its non-existence.

I don't care what other's "views" are, I'm interested in the scientific question: does a creator-God exist?


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## Silent Chameleon

Razvan said:


> You are drawing your own conclusions here, just because something is complex it doesn't mean it evolved. Maybe it did, maybe it didn't...Also you talk about things you have no knowledge of, you know there is nothing outside this universe? Can you honestly say you KNOW that? We don't even know what are the limits or the composition of the universe, yet you make such claims... How do you know there is nothing outside this universe? How do you know how this universe works? You don't and seriously, a wise man would not draw conclusions based on assumptions, a wise men would only emit theories and leave room for being wrong. You cannot define something that is beyond our power of comprehension with our knowledge. It's like trying to define a 11 dimension universe by using only 2 dimensions. :happy: You try to use science instead of using your spirit and the only result you can achieve in this way is utter failure.
> 
> And I don't even want to know how you draw this silly conclusion that God emerged from apes, when God created them. Or you talk about time in such a linear fashion....time is not linear, we just "see" it this way.


To the contrary; the fact that something is complex means that it MUST have evolved. Nothing complex has ever just "appeared" out of nowhere. Complexity appears over long periods of time by degrees, and this does not just go for living things. The Universe itself is slowly evolving - if you compare the types of stars and star structures that were prevalent in the early universe to the stunning galaxy structures that have developed in the last few billion years you see a remarkable difference. G-type stars, like our sun, for instance, just weren't possible back then.

I know that there's nothing outside the Universe because the word "universe" automatically means the view with the largest perspective possible. So even if you prescribe to the multiverse-theory, for example, the universe would then mean "all the little universes in the multiverse". 

Use my "spirit" instead of science? I don't think that that would lead to very logical conclusions to be honest.


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## Razvan

Silent Chameleon said:


> To the contrary; the fact that something is complex means that it MUST have evolved. Nothing complex has ever just "appeared" out of nowhere. Complexity appears over long periods of time by degrees, and this does not just go for living things. The Universe itself is slowly evolving - if you compare the types of stars and star structures that were prevalent in the early universe to the stunning galaxy structures that have developed in the last few billion years you see a remarkable difference. G-type stars, like our sun, for instance, just weren't possible back then.
> 
> I know that there's nothing outside the Universe because the word "universe" automatically means the view with the largest perspective possible. So even if you prescribe to the multiverse-theory, for example, the universe would then mean "all the little universes in the multiverse".
> 
> Use my "spirit" instead of science? I don't think that that would lead to very logical conclusions to be honest.


I'll pm you to keep this thread to it's purpose, it's a matter of how you view things.


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## Cloudy

Silent Chameleon said:


> Firstly, I apologise for singling you out (I could have chose nearly any of the "religious people"), it's just that your post made a point of saying something along the lines of "the fact that I'm religious means that I'm a more moral person than a non-religious one," or, at least, that's how it appeared. Whereas I simply think that religion and morality are completely unrelated.
> 
> You should only respect other people's beliefs if they are correct. For eg. if a child in school had the belief that 2+4=Octopus instead of 6 then it is unreasonable that the teacher should respect this.
> 
> I too believe that we should treat others well (but not necessarily as we would like to be treated - what if you're a sadomasochist?) and I believe in fairness.
> 
> The slaughtering comment was a joke :crazy:
> 
> I believe that there is no God, and no evidence has ever been found to dispute this. And the argument "there's no evidence to suggest otherwise" is a shallow one. It is not the job of scientists to disprove ideas that nobody truly believes in anyway. Ditto in regards to the soul - there is only a body, and within that, a brain. And, just as an aside, why would God have any human characteristics whatsoever if he never evolved from anything? He's just as likely to be a giant vicious insectoid gulping up galaxies in the unknown realms of the inner universe as he is to have any kind of Charles Dickens-esque humanitarian interests.
> 
> Also, morality has its origins in evolution. Human beings are good to one another because over 150,000 years of human evolution has shown us that this is positive for the group.
> 
> PS: Have you ever actually read the Bible? God is certainly not someone I'd want a hug from - he's the most despicable character in the history of fiction! I'd pefer a hug from Lord Voldemort :crazy:


Maybe It's because it's not my native language u misunderstand me or maybe u have that idea stick in ur head that all religious people think we are better than others and well I 'm not the case..! I meant that some people who called themselves 'Catholics' don't apply values

2+4=Octopus...???? o.o that's different
But how to know what is correct??? everyone has different beliefs which they would die for so I respect that feeling and also each belief can provide something good for yourself. I just love to see different perspectives and that's my personality but u are totally different maybe because u are an INTP 

and well when I begin to believe u are kind of nice u have to say " Have you ever actually read the Bible? God is certainly not someone I'd want a hug from - he's the most despicable character in the history of fiction! I'd pefer a hug from Lord Voldemort "
that really make me want to kick u :angry: *stay calm* sorry ....you also remember me of some of my closest friends 

Yes I have the read it, and well I experience God's love and I know what I'm talking about 

pd: what do u study???? it has to do with religion or something? u seem very well informed


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## Silent Chameleon

Claudia said:


> Maybe It's because it's not my native language u misunderstand me or maybe u have that idea stick in ur head that all religious people think we are better than others and well I 'm not the case..! I meant that some people who called themselves 'Catholics' don't apply values
> 
> 2+4=Octopus...???? o.o that's different
> But how to know what is correct??? everyone has different beliefs which they would die for so I respect that feeling and also each belief can provide something good for yourself. I just love to see different perspectives and that's my personality but u are totally different maybe because u are an INTP
> 
> and well when I begin to believe u are kind of nice u have to say " Have you ever actually read the Bible? God is certainly not someone I'd want a hug from - he's the most despicable character in the history of fiction! I'd pefer a hug from Lord Voldemort "
> that really make me want to kick u :angry: *stay calm* sorry ....you also remember me of some of my closest friends
> 
> Yes I have the read it, and well I experience God's love and I know what I'm talking about
> 
> pd: what do u study???? it has to do with religion or something? u seem very well informed



Haha no, I'm a fantasy novelist - I'm not very interested in religion to be honest, it's not one of my main areas of interest. 

It's just that it seems to do far more harm than good because it actually DISCOURAGES LOGICAL DEBATE (the idea that I should "respect" without questioning them someone's garbage beliefs about some Flying Spaghetti Monster, when they have not provided any evidence to back them up, is absurd to me). And this, frankly, is something I find intolerable.

How do I remind you of your friends? 

How is 2+4=Octopus any different from saying there's a God? Neither of these are based on logical reasoning. 

I'm also very interested in looking at things from different perspectives, but you must understand that only one perspective is the right one to any given question? You can't just disregard the facts and say "well all of these views are correct because people believe them."


----------



## Cloudy

Silent Chameleon said:


> Haha no, I'm a fantasy novelist - I'm not very interested in religion to be honest, it's not one of my main areas of interest.
> 
> It's just that it seems to do far more harm than good because it actually DISCOURAGES LOGICAL DEBATE (the idea that I should "respect" without questioning them someone's garbage beliefs about some Flying Spaghetti Monster, when they have not provided any evidence to back them up, is absurd to me). And this, frankly, is something I find intolerable.
> 
> How do I remind you of your friends?
> 
> How is 2+4=Octopus any different from saying there's a God? Neither of these are based on logical reasoning.
> 
> I'm also very interested in looking at things from different perspectives, but you must understand that only one perspective is the right one to any given question? You can't just disregard the facts and say "well all of these views are correct because people believe them."


For someone who says it's not really interested in religion , u seem really eager about it o.o

at least u made me laugh with ur comment ´Flying Spaghetti Monster' but u are sooooooooooo ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh :frustrating: and please don't compare God with mutant food.... 

You remind me of some of my friends because one was really logical like u and he also had an opinion for everything and other one also call God an insect u_u 

But why your perspective must be the right one?? who can assure u that??? who has the absolut truth??? do u ? what in a box??!!! 
I wonder why I'm so tolerant and searching a little in philosophy I´m kind of a relativist I´m still in the search of truth so for now I don`t have all the answers but I'm looking for them. 

I just have noticed that everyone is sooooo intolerant with other people´s beliefs !!! and this has provoked wars, discrimination, deaths because everyone is so closed minded and deeply believe they are RIGHT! so I have chosen to respect that feeling and avoid all that hatred. I'm a pacifist roud: so this is what we do!

Pd: mmm have u always being like this?????


----------



## Tootsie

I am still looking for other UUs. There must be at least another one of us!!


----------



## Silent Chameleon

Claudia said:


> For someone who says it's not really interested in religion , u seem really eager about it o.o
> 
> at least u made me laugh with ur comment ´Flying Spaghetti Monster' but u are sooooooooooo ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh :frustrating: and please don't compare God with mutant food....
> 
> You remind me of some of my friends because one was really logical like u and he also had an opinion for everything and other one also call God an insect u_u
> 
> But why your perspective must be the right one?? who can assure u that??? who has the absolut truth??? do u ? what in a box??!!!
> I wonder why I'm so tolerant and searching a little in philosophy I´m kind of a relativist I´m still in the search of truth so for now I don`t have all the answers but I'm looking for them.
> 
> I just have noticed that everyone is sooooo intolerant with other people´s beliefs !!! and this has provoked wars, discrimination, deaths because everyone is so closed minded and deeply believe they are RIGHT! so I have chosen to respect that feeling and avoid all that hatred. I'm a pacifist roud: so this is what we do!
> 
> Pd: mmm have u always being like this?????



Your friends sound interesting!

Oh no... I was just about to compare God with mutant food. 

But a LOGICAL argument isn't the same as a PERSONAL argument. Logic can be shown and illustrated to others. It can be agreed upon. Whereas subjective feelings only exist within that person - once that person dies their feelings no longer exist, whereas logic continues to apply. 

I'm actually VERY open-minded!  YOU'RE the closed-minded one Miss!  And I don't really think you can say that any INTPs are ever totally convinced we're right - I love being proved wrong if someone can explain the logical reasons for it as it means I learn something, which is always fun. 

Science is the place you'll find all the answers available. Although I do like to read a bit of philosophy now and again.

I'd also describe myself as a Pacifist, even if it isn't a very well-defined term. 

PS: "mmm have u always being like this????? "

By this I take it you mean handsome, witty, and extremely intelligent? If so then yes, this HAS always been the case.


----------



## Silent Chameleon

And The Flying Spaghetti Monster is REAL by the way!  I haven't made it up. No reasonable person can argue against all this PROOF! =D

Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster


----------



## Lettusaurus

entp - Christian


----------



## Cloudy

Silent Chameleon said:


> And The Flying Spaghetti Monster is REAL by the way!  I haven't made it up. No reasonable person can argue against all this PROOF! =D
> 
> Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster


This is really offensive...... I feel so naive... I will never ever think that people would do something like it..(I feel like I live in a bubble :shocked there are even pictures mmmm I don´t want to read it...............
It made angry and sad :sad:
venganza??????????????????????????? OMG that means revenge in your language
(why would people do something like that *thinking*)


----------



## Cloudy

Silent Chameleon said:


> Your friends sound interesting!
> 
> Oh no... I was just about to compare God with mutant food.
> 
> But a LOGICAL argument isn't the same as a PERSONAL argument. Logic can be shown and illustrated to others. It can be agreed upon. Whereas subjective feelings only exist within that person - once that person dies their feelings no longer exist, whereas logic continues to apply.
> 
> I'm actually VERY open-minded!  YOU'RE the closed-minded one Miss!  And I don't really think you can say that any INTPs are ever totally convinced we're right - I love being proved wrong if someone can explain the logical reasons for it as it means I learn something, which is always fun.
> 
> Science is the place you'll find all the answers available. Although I do like to read a bit of philosophy now and again.
> 
> I'd also describe myself as a Pacifist, even if it isn't a very well-defined term.
> 
> PS: "mmm have u always being like this????? "
> 
> By this I take it you mean handsome, witty, and extremely intelligent? If so then yes, this HAS always been the case.



Man is the Measure of All Things

You need FAITH!!! 

PS: "mmm have u always being like this????? "
By this I take it you mean handsome, witty, and extremely intelligent? If so then yes, this HAS always been the case. 
at least It seems u have a self-esteem :dry:

I meant atheist and ANNOYING :wink:


----------



## GunTotingBastard

Religion has more to do with origin.
I live in Sweden, you'll have a hard time finding any even slightly religious person here. I can actually only think of two people I know, and one of them is from America.

Maybe I'm stating the obvious...

Oh, and atheist is not "there is probably not a god" atheism is "there is no god"

ESTP atheist.

Sent from my htc Desire


----------



## deeter

INFJ - Pagan

This is a religion that can be practiced in solitude or in a coven. It's deeply spiritual int it's connection to the earth. It focuses on harnessing the energy around us and using it for good purposes. It has one rule - do no harm.

Blessed Be


----------



## itssoOHMYGOD

INFP. athiest but not an angry anti-theist people associate us to be. although i think religion can be VERYVERY harmful. i do not believe in souls or an after-life.


----------



## xDestinyx

INTJ, Atheist


----------



## Romascu

mutton said:


> I just assumed that atheists were certain on this belief. Confirmation bias, perhaps, as every atheists I've known seem very sure that there isn't anything supernatural at all. I thought that "lack of belief" would be lumped under the category of agnosticism.


Not 100% certain, just very close to that number---the evidence or lack thereof point that way.

You can't disprove god 100% just like you can't disprove zeus or the god of war.


----------



## Levitas

INTP - atheist 

No afterlife, no gods, no souls


----------



## Toru Okada

INFP - atheist








GunTotingBastard said:


> Oh, and atheist is not "there is probably not a god" atheism is "there is no god"


Nope. But surely it's been painstakingly mentioned somewhere 100 times in this thread, on this board, and all over the internet that atheism makes no such positive assertions (although there are people who are atheists that do). I won't get into campaigning it again, cause it's becoming a boring hobby.


----------



## MrShatter

INFJ - Complex set of secular beliefs.


----------



## unico

I'm an INFJ and attend a Unitarian Universalist Church. I believe in God and panentheism (that God is everywhere in the universe and also beyond it). I believe in immortal souls for all living things and that time is an illusions. Some people find my beliefs far-fetched, but they are what feels right to me.


----------



## ardentauthor

I'm a Protestant...although I'm thinking about converting to Catholicism...


----------



## amucha

INTP and atheist. I have never truly believed in an "afterlife", simply because it makes no sense to me. 
I have gone over it many, many times in my head, mostly to try and figure out how people can believe in a god, but in particular organized religion strikes me as odd (I am not trying to disrespect anyone, don't worry). 
I am comfortable with the fact that (I believe) there is no all-loving gods or godesses watching over me, and that once I die it will be final and I will never awaken again. I wouldn't want it any other way.


----------



## Narcissist

I have no religion . It is my 'way' of life that I define as religion .


----------



## OwLY

INXJ - Non-religious, nihilist (but a happy and non-apathetic one! :laughing


----------



## Valdyr

UPDATE: INTJ, atheist. Though the term "atheist," as most people understand it, doesn't do justice to the nuances of my philosophical thought.


----------



## Freyja

INTJ and non-denominational Christian.


----------



## Confounded

INFP and Catholic.

Though I struggle with some of the more detailed and traditional aspects of Catholicism, I couldn't live without Jesus Christ and the Eucharist that I consume every Sunday.

On second thought, I suppose that I could, but it would be rather miserable.


----------



## 1987

ISTJ, agnostic with large chunks of Buddhism and little bitty sprinklings of Wicca, Jainism, and whatever else I find to be wise and good. My general policy towards the unknown is that I only believe in things if I have seen sufficient proof of their existence, and only disbelieve in things if I have seen sufficient proof of their non-existence, but I tend to veer to the side of scepticism without concrete proof either way.


----------



## Rhee

ISTJ, atheist.


----------



## randomcouchpotato

INFP
Christian (Protestant) due to several near death experiences that I would rather not talk about.


----------



## Ubuntu

INFJ (?), metaphysical naturalism.


----------



## BearRight

ENTJ and atheist. Atheism shouldn't be thought of as another religion: it's just another word for sound reason that denies all organized and unorganized forms of religion with the use of said reason. This is how I see it. Nothing wrong with philosophic inquiry, values and ethics, but drawing them from some age-old book and self-titled holy men that lead groups of people isn't my cup of tea that's for sure.


----------



## jaenelldeana

INFP 

agnostic with hints of buddhism and shintoism
i was raised christian but it just didn't fit me or at least not the way it was presented to me..


----------



## Monkeeman

Agnostic atheist INFP reporting in.

I wasn't born into a particularly religious family, so I was never indoctrinated into a religion as a child, and never had a belief in a higher power as a kid. We did start going to a new-age-y starting around the time I was about eight or nine, but by then I was old enough to realize religion was all kinds of ridiculous.


----------



## woodpeace

INFP.

Catholic - to be more specific progressive/liberal Catholic. I also attend Quaker Meetings for Worship.


----------



## streetsweeper

INTP- weak agnostic 

(and just to clarify, I have no respect for atheists and nihilists but I adore Religion, it's ever so lovely, I make a habit of seeking it out, and I envy those who have faith)


----------



## lib

streetsweeper said:


> INTP- weak agnostic
> 
> (and just to clarify, I have no respect for atheists and nihilists but I adore Religion, it's ever so lovely, I make a habit of seeking it out, and I envy those who have faith)


Why is it that whenever I have someone down as a feeler/XXFJ and they're not - it always turns out to be an INTP? There are 8 non-feeler MBTI types, after all!

As for myself - see signature.


----------



## AussieChick

Apolstolic and I am an ISFJ


----------



## streetsweeper

lib said:


> Why is it that whenever I have someone down as a feeler/XXFJ and they're not - it always turns out to be an INTP? There are 8 non-feeler MBTI types, after all!
> 
> As for myself - see signature.


I don’t know, stop judging us! *bursts into tears* 

Edit: maybe INTP’s just find it easier to communicate our emotions over the internet, anonymously. I rarely express emotions when I am with others in real life situations (60% more energy needed)


----------



## 22857

Christianity/Taoism 

ENTP


----------



## AntiPro

Atheist INTj


----------



## NaughyChimp

Low Protestant - will go to Methodist, Presbyterian or Baptist churches: ENFP


----------



## Turelie

ESFJ.

Partly raised Christian, partly raised agnostic/new age.

I consider myself to be Christian; I tend to not treat the Bible so strictly and attend most to Christ's words. I'm more focused on this life and am not really concerned with people's souls.


----------



## SpiralOut

INTJ.

I am Presbyterian (Protestant). I'm not entirely sure of my faith. At this point I'm going off of Pascal's Wager.


----------



## sub_liminal

ISFP, was a Christian for most of my life. Admitted to myself I was living a lie, been almost a year. Glad I got out when I did. I feel like I'm waking up to the world around me. I'm home. It feels great. I love Buddhism, specifically Zen. Really helped me start my path on self-reflection. I've learned so much about myself that I didn't know it's crazy. Some people say religion helps their life out, but really, I wish the amount of energy that went into churches would just go into therapy centers. I feel like that'd be much more effective than dogma. Completely individualize the spiritual healing process instead of feeding it to the masses like opium. Oh to dream.


----------



## StrixAluco

No religion - Agnostic and somewhat theist.

People tend to consider that I am an atheist because they just don't bother listening to my explanation especially since it's confusing and does not correspond to the typical argument in this debate but basically, I am a Truth/Principle seeker therefore I cannot be purely atheistic.

I am considered catholic (thanks to traditional ceremonies) but was raised by atheist parents who are anti-religion.


----------



## BloodiedDenizen

BrokenSticks said:


> Not religious (I prefer to say that than "Atheist", because most atheists I meet are just angry former religious people).


What atheists have you met?  Or heard of. Etc. Sure, some of them are like that, but not most of the ones I've talked or listened to. 

INTP, and I don't really fucking know. Somewhere between deist and atheist, but I reject organized religion. Personally. But all beliefs hold some truth for someone, so... feh. Have your beliefs, whether you're wrong or right, just don't try to legislate those beliefs or force them down my throat. Or up anything else.


----------



## highflyer

I'm a Muslim,
Though badly viewed in the west, Islam itself , i see, is very rational unlike alot of muslims now. In a verse at the Qur'an, Allah says wt could be translated as *"Let everyone work by his own trait, as your God knows better whose way is better"* and the prophet Mohammed says wt could means *" Everyone one is facilitated to what he is created for*" So Islam aknowledges varieties in personality and hence functions Yet it emphasis on being Moderate in all life aspects. So it may influence some aspects of personality.
I think what counts is the degree of committment to one's religion. As a committed muslim i think this affects the following sides: 

Introversin: Because Islam, like almost all religions, encourages follwoers to visit relatives and share people thier events, in fact this influnces me personally. Sometimes i dont find a motive to push myself out except this one. 

Sensing: Because all religions try to make followers look to wt could be and wt should be done, I think religions are in favor of intuition and they enforce this trait.

just some reflections maybe right maybe wrong...!


----------



## clicheguevara

INFP (most likely)

I was baptised Roman Catholic as a kid but I strongly dislike the importance of symbols and gestures as well as the dogmatism.


----------



## Loki Grim

INTJ - Agnostic, I believe in the possibility of there being a god(s), As far as organized religion.. Lol why is this still around? I guess would be my out look on that.


----------



## Chris Gill

INTJ- Possibilian. 
Was raised Roman Catholic and dropped it when I got to college and could easily quit attending church.


----------



## wisefaery

hindu- enfp.
i am not a practicing hindu. i dont really believe in religions.


----------



## absent air

INTP-muslim

I suppose I have to write a little backstory here, but I don't wanna :shocked:


----------



## Night & Day

Chrisitan, INTP


----------



## 3053

I have no idea yet what I should believe


----------



## Cosmopop

I'm ENFJ, and Christian.

I've heard ENFJ are usually religious, so.
And I'm younger, so I haven't really gotten out of my Christian home. 
But hopefully I'll stay a Christian when I get out in the world.


----------



## to08kazu

ISFP, Christian.


----------



## Dashing

Religion is a money making machine. I find it illogical to have faith in a brand or product, you don't go worship at the altar of glow in the dark yoyo's right? (would if I could) I hope I've made my point with that statement.

The belief in a higher power or 'god' is merely arrogance and fear of death.


----------



## slyspy

INTP- Ignostic, agnostic, atheist, secular humanist, free-thinker. REPRESENT! :kitteh:<--why does the kitty one look like a happy demon???



shh......secret pastafarian. don't tell anyone.


----------



## fn0rd

NTJ - Atheist, unless you are referring to Cthulhu.


----------



## csp40

INTP, (Pan)Deist


----------



## MCRTS

ISFJ and Catholic. Yeah, I fit into the stereotype of an ISFJ being in an organized religion. I don't mind. I never seem to fit into any stereotypes, so it's cool for me.


----------



## Dustdevil

Rommel said:


> I'm an INFP
> 
> I'm Mormon.
> 
> Born and raised. Did my own thing for awhile but decided it was the right place for me. A conservative mormon non artsy person. I feel like an odd duck INFP lmao....


Another INFP Latter Day Saint (aka Mormon)


----------



## kiwigrl

ENFJ - Christian

I am non-denominational. I was raised in a non-christian home, though about 3-4 years ago my parents got saved too. It would be sheer stupidity for me to deny the existance of God with all that I have seen and know, there is no going back for me. I have a relationship with the Lord so it would be like saying that my best friend doesn't exist because my other friends have never seen him. 

For me I _felt_ it was right. I knew from the first time I heard about God that he was real. I just believed, and I have not been disappointed. Other christians have disappointed me of course, they're only human, but I refuse for that to let my relationship with God be ruined.


----------



## atwood

I get ESFJ a lot and am an atheist.


----------



## Gravitas

oneoutside said:


> ENTP, atheist
> 
> 
> No, you're thinking of "stupidity". Atheism is a lack of belief, it's simply skepticism.


oneoutside you're wrong, mutton is right:
Atheism | Define Atheism at Dictionary.com

dang, one for the ENFJs


----------



## 3053

I'm just a hippy.


----------



## SilentScream

ENFJ ... and I have beliefs that cannot be boxed in under any label.


----------



## MicheleInHarmony

I'm an INFJ. I am an active member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints also known as the Mormons.
My INTJ son is probably stronger in the religion then me.


----------



## Zerosum

ENTP ---- no religion!


----------



## 21954

INFP. I've given religion plenty of thought and yes prayer and the "old college try" but... identifying with any one religion just doesn't seem to be something I can do. Sometimes I harbor a little bit of envy for people who do have faith in whatever religion they profess, because then they don't have to keep wondering about it. LOL I know, that's a stupid reason to be envious, but what can I say - I like it when things are "settled." My heart wants to believe but then my brain steps up and says "you're kidding, right?"

So I live in a sort of religious limbo; my only really strong belief is believing there is room for all beliefs and no beliefs. Live your beliefs or don't, either way doesn't bother me. The only thing that bothers me is if you try to control me or tell me what to believe.


----------



## Callie Rose

ESTP and Reform Jewish. It's what I grew up with and while I'm not a super-religious person and most of the time don't believe that God and common sense overlap, my Ni helps me to feel a little more spiritual and connected with the idea of a higher power. I'm not sure exactly what I believe (I was an atheist for years as a teenager), but I know that I like what I'm doing right now.


----------



## CosmicRush

koalaroo said:


> INTP - vacillating between agnosticism and Catholicism


Something that I bet happens frequently with INTP, may I help you?


----------



## Perseus

Good God

Monotheism
Definition: there is one God.
Adherents: Christian, Jews, and Muslims

Polytheism
Definition: there are many gods.
Adherents: Hinduism, Greek / Romans Religion

Pantheism
Definition: God is everything
Adherents: Some forms of Buddhism

Animism
Definition: God is in everything.
Adherents: Tribal religions

Henotheism
Definition: There are many gods, but only one
God is meaningful to its adherents and worthy of
worship
Adherents: Mormonism

Agnosticism
Definition: God is an unknowable

Atheism
Definition: There is no God

http://www.ewabaptist.org/theismhandout.pdf


----------



## CosmicRush

Atheist and INTP. My story is weird. I was hyper religious but kind of just slowly learned my way out. I never rejected or rebelled against my religion when I was Christian. I was way to believing it. Then my famous INTP skeptical ability got developed. And the more science I took in like quantum physics and genetics and biology the more I didn't believe in god. Now I'm frustrated with how many people are being abused, manipulated, and educationally halted by religion. It's kind of weird knowing that people will look back at us in history and see how stupid humans are. Not sure if humans will make it much longer tho hah!


----------



## CosmicRush

Paheli said:


> INFP. I've given religion plenty of thought and yes prayer and the "old college try" but... identifying with any one religion just doesn't seem to be something I can do. Sometimes I harbor a little bit of envy for people who do have faith in whatever religion they profess, because then they don't have to keep wondering about it. LOL I know, that's a stupid reason to be envious, but what can I say - I like it when things are "settled." My heart wants to believe but then my brain steps up and says "you're kidding, right?"
> 
> So I live in a sort of religious limbo; my only really strong belief is believing there is room for all beliefs and no beliefs. Live your beliefs or don't, either way doesn't bother me. The only thing that bothers me is if you try to control me or tell me what to believe.


I won't tell you what to believe! Believe me!


----------



## Perseus

Worth looking @

Absurdism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Peter

Axe said:


> By not believing that there is a god. It's quite simple really.


Not believing there is a God means believing there is no God. But do you know there is no God or do you believe there is no God?

How sure are you?


----------



## Donkey D Kong

Peter said:


> Not believing there is a God means believing there is no God. But do you know there is no God or do you believe there is no God?
> 
> How sure are you?


It's impossible to know for sure if there is no God, but I personally don't believe in a god.


----------



## sly

CosmicRush said:


> Atheist and INTP. My story is weird. I was hyper religious but kind of just slowly learned my way out. I never rejected or rebelled against my religion when I was Christian. I was way to believing it. Then my famous INTP skeptical ability got developed. And the more science I took in like quantum physics and genetics and biology the more I didn't believe in god. Now I'm frustrated with how many people are being abused, manipulated, and educationally halted by religion. It's kind of weird knowing that people will look back at us in history and see how stupid humans are. Not sure if humans will make it much longer tho hah!


Thats funny, the exact same subject strengthened my belief in God (equal to the development of skepticism/sense).


----------



## magnumta

I belive in God but do not follow any one religion. If my studies servers me right, religions are man made, therefore thats why they all have serious flaws.


----------



## Peter

Axe said:


> It's impossible to know for sure if there is no God, but I personally don't believe in a god.


So you allow yourself to be influenced by the masses? Just because billions of people believe a God exists, you are not able to tell yourself anymore that it is possible to know for sure if there is no God.

Because when 1 man claims that his dog has healing powers, it's a lot more easy to dismiss that it's impossible to know for sure he's not crazy. But when it's a billion people that believe this,..... not that easy anymore.


But that's really the only difference: The number of people that believe something.


----------



## CosmicRush

Peter said:


> So you allow yourself to be influenced by the masses? Just because billions of people believe a God exists, you are not able to tell yourself anymore that it is possible to know for sure if there is no God.
> 
> Because when 1 man claims that his dog has healing powers, it's a lot more easy to dismiss that it's impossible to know for sure he's not crazy. But when it's a billion people that believe this,..... not that easy anymore.
> 
> 
> But that's really the only difference: The number of people that believe something.


Hey there is a possibility that a scientist created the universe. He may not even know he created. It could have been an accident. It most likely has properties different than anything we know. Not better necessarily. But different. Or what if this scientist created us on purpose but does not realize we are actually alive? We could be the result of computer simulator or a "graphing calculator" which graphs all possible results of physics onto a graph of 11 dimensions. We have no capability to see all dimensions flat like this scientist most likely sees. (not sees but is aware of.) Lastly, this universe in my opinion is a huge web of all possibilities of every particle every. And I think there also exists every possible universe. Maybe it goes farther than that too but that's as far as I can really speculate.  maybe there is a creator but never will the god from our books be real. It's such ignorance to think a god could exist like that. Giant monkey in sky that has questionable morals compared to some humans even. He has less control of himself than some humans. Embarrassing! Anyways sorry for rant. Just making sure you understand that its possible to think that god is possible regardless of the masses. Most of my ideas are very radical and contrast the masses. I believe one day I can show the world my ideas for change. We are following too many corrupt morals and traditions!


----------



## Donkey D Kong

Peter said:


> So you allow yourself to be influenced by the masses?





Peter said:


> it's a lot more easy to dismiss that it's impossible to know for sure he's not crazy. But when it's a billion people that believe this,..... not that easy anymore.


Looks like someone is contradicting themselves a bit!


----------



## Peter

Axe said:


> Looks like someone is contradicting themselves a bit!


lol, no. You just have to read it right.


----------



## Peter

CosmicRush said:


> Hey there is a possibility that a scientist created the universe. He may not even know he created. It could have been an accident. It most likely has properties different than anything we know. Not better necessarily. But different. Or what if this scientist created us on purpose but does not realize we are actually alive? We could be the result of computer simulator or a "graphing calculator" which graphs all possible results of physics onto a graph of 11 dimensions. We have no capability to see all dimensions flat like this scientist most likely sees. (not sees but is aware of.) Lastly, this universe in my opinion is a huge web of all possibilities of every particle every. And I think there also exists every possible universe. Maybe it goes farther than that too but that's as far as I can really speculate.  maybe there is a creator but never will the god from our books be real. It's such ignorance to think a god could exist like that. Giant monkey in sky that has questionable morals compared to some humans even. He has less control of himself than some humans. Embarrassing! Anyways sorry for rant. Just making sure you understand that its possible to think that god is possible regardless of the masses. Most of my ideas are very radical and contrast the masses. I believe one day I can show the world my ideas for change. We are following too many corrupt morals and traditions!


Yes I agree. It is possible for a man to believe god is possible regardless of the masses. But what I was saying is that it's difficult to know for sure that God doesn't exist because of the masses. Not the same thing. :happy:


----------



## rockface

im an estp and im an athiest however i was raised cristian and soon abandoned that by nine years old thinking their ideals and storys were somwat flawed and it just wasnt for me:ninja:


----------



## claraliu

ENTP, can't stay focused long enough to commit to a religion


----------



## Shazbot

INTP here.

I don't know for sure if there's a God out there, although there could've been something/someone that created the whole universe...

Grew up in an agnostic family and I generally try to stay away from religions, even though I've been in close contact with Catholics and Jehovah's witnesses(!) in the past. Religions just seem to condition some people's lives to the point they seem to lose contact with actually meaningful values. Not to mention the various flaws that characterize them, which makes it clear to me they're man-made. I don't believe we humans are any more special than other intelligent forms of life in the universe.


----------



## Grunfur

CosmicRush said:


> Atheist and INTP. My story is weird. I was hyper religious but kind of just slowly learned my way out. I never rejected or rebelled against my religion when I was Christian. I was way to believing it. Then my famous INTP skeptical ability got developed. And the more science I took in like quantum physics and genetics and biology the more I didn't believe in god. Now I'm frustrated with how many people are being abused, manipulated, and educationally halted by religion. It's kind of weird knowing that people will look back at us in history and see how stupid humans are. Not sure if humans will make it much longer tho hah!


Your story is rather like mine in a way. When I was younger there were circumstances where I'd be forced into religion. I always questioned the church (or whatever it was called back then). And was even when younger was somewhat skeptical. I can't remember so clearly, but am sure that I believed in religion when I was younger. I suppose when I was around 13 I stopped believing in religion and in fact started to argue against it. 

I'd probably consider myself an atheist based on all the evidence given, but technically I am considered agnostic. There are so many scientists who are really agnostic. Nobody can be too sure. Many of the modern scientists like Stephen Hawking and Richard Dawkins are technically agnostic. 

Religion is horrible. Its just not that big of concern for me anymore, because I am pretty sure that people are probably going to move away from it. That is certainly the case for Christianity. Islam is growing, but it will most likely fully drop once people move away from war and whatnot. It'll take a long time. I probably won't see religion vanish in my lifetime. But it'll most likely go away. I still respect Dawkins and others for trying to voice that religion leads to corruption or irrationality. 

I guess a lot of famous people that I enjoy are atheists or agnostics. Some of them may even be INTPs.


----------



## Donkey D Kong

Peter said:


> Yes I agree. It is possible for a man to believe god is possible regardless of the masses. But what I was saying is that it's difficult to know for sure that God doesn't exist because of the masses. Not the same thing. :happy:


Difficult for that reason? Not at all. Anything is entirely possible. However, it's not difficult to believe that the entire religion was created by some schizophrenic man claiming to be the son of Yahweh and attained a cult following that spread because of human nature and the need to feel like they actually have a reason to live.


----------



## Peter

Axe said:


> Difficult for that reason? Not at all. Anything is entirely possible. However, it's not difficult to believe that the entire religion was created by some schizophrenic man claiming to be the son of Yahweh and attained a cult following that spread because of human nature and the need to feel like they actually have a reason to live.


He wasn't alone and you have to look at the situation back then and then you'll find why and that it was in the couple of hundred years after his life that the religion really was created. So he didn't really create anything. He just went against society as it was at that time and triggered something which eventually led to the emergence of a whole religion.

And yes, believing in something bigger than ourselves is a human need. Not for all humans though, but for most of them indeed.


----------



## airship_nebula

Unnursvana said:


> *sigh* religion is always been a puzzle for me in a way, I believe in existence of a God but I believe in any specific God like the Christian God or any other God but I do believe in higher power and stuff like that, behind every myth or legend is some sort of truth I guess or that is what I think. I believe in elves, magic and stuff like that so who wouldn't I believe in a higher power.
> 
> I don't know where I stand in the religion world, I have never had a religion and I didn't grow up with any but I used to pray to go when I was little and I went to Sunday school or whatever you call it every Sunday when I was little but I have never had any specific religion or anything like that, because to me most religions have the same morals or the same meaning _that we should not hurt others or kill others_ or something like that and I find that beautiful and I like there morals but I don't approve of the _you can not have another god_ or something like that, if we can only believe in one God and no one else then why did God bother to give us free will.
> 
> I do not believe in everything that is said in the bible, not all of it is true and some words there can't be Gods words because God didn't write the bible, priest back in the day did and they must have made some rules just so they could get more money out of the poor and control them even more because the Church had so much power back in the day....
> 
> anyway, like I said religion is a puzzle for me really. I think it is good and beautiful to some extent and it has helped many people and now I am talking about all religion but it also has some very dark history and people were and still are killed because of there religion and I think that is so wrong.
> 
> I am fine with any religion really, it doesn't bother me and I think it is beautiful thing but I just have never and I probably will never believe in just one God or that this gods way is righter then the other gods way, even if I do believe in a higher power and I am fine with any religion as long as it doesn't involve killing people or something and I don't like it when people's minds are closed by religions and they don't respect other peoples religions.
> 
> I would rather have my mind open by wonders then closed by religion but that is just me.
> 
> I hope I didn't offend anyone, that wasn't my attention at all, just sharing my thoughts really on the matter and I am sorry about how long this is :wink: I have a lot on my mind and I express me better this way then talking.


Basically, you just summed up my situation when it comes to religion. For all my life, I've attended Catholic school where our morals are shoved down our throats. I was about to go to a Catholic high school (gag!!!) which I knew wouldn't be the right thing for me.

There were so many things with the Bible I kind of went against. I mean, why would God say he love everybody, but not condone homosexuality? And sometimes I think abortion might be the better choice, even though it might be a very horrid thing to suffer. I have casual conversations to God when I pray (etc. "Hey God.. so about this week...") and I don't even know if that's even the "right" way to pray. And like Unnursvana said, I would also rather have my mind open by wonders than closed by religion.

I mean, I do believe in God, but I just question religion, higher beings, etc. Heck, I don't refer to "religion", just "faith". I run by my faith in something or someone like God, but "religion" just seems a bit like categorizing.

I also do hope I didn't offend anyone as well. I'm just so conflicted when it comes to topics like this. :\


----------



## IBS

I am an ENFJ [probably].

I am a devout Lutheran.

I was raised in a very theologically liberal family, so my family never mentioned religion. I would go to church, and that would be all. Since my dad was always away and my mom hated waking up to go to church, I would never go to church. I ended up becoming from age 8 to 16 a neo-pagan, then a pantheist, then an agnostic/atheist. In my last two years I was almost exclusively an over-zealous Stoic and dreamed of purging Epicureanism from the world haha! Then I really read into all the world's religions and their theories and proof [I had done this since meeting very nice Christians who took all my theological abuse and dished it back as good as it came]. I first considered becoming buddhist, then decided against it. Then I looked very much into Islam. I came to greatly and deeply respect the religion and their followers, and many of my friends are Muslim, but I never converted. I then looked into Hinduism but that just wasn't it. After a few other religions and non-religion too, I decided to look into Christianity. The logic and philosophy and apologias I found were simply amazing. I'm tired though, so if anyone wants to know what they were they'd have to look them up for themselves. Anyways, after years of searching and trying to find logic in belief, I am now a Lutheran again, but not the ultra-liberal type my parents are.


----------



## The King Of Dreams

Christian-Jehovah's Witness:happy:roud:


----------



## CyberHiker

INTP 

Some sort of Pandeist/Own Spirituality (Science dictates it above all)

Many people don't explore other beliefs. I find that coming from a mixed religious (as well as cultural background) changes that.
My dad is Muslim (seems to be devout but is actually a 'soft' Muslim: drinks alcohol, has doubts about God) and my mom is agnostic. Most people however just accept the background that they are born into without questioning the system and that just appalls me. As a child I have always wanted to learn about different mythologies, religions and cultures because I am interested in the diversity of humanity. My fascination now is Hindu and Incan mythology.


----------



## Owfin

Ignostic (The question or the answer is meaningless until you define what God is first)

Not really raised as any particular religion. My parents left me to basically choose whatever faith or non faith I wanted.


----------



## JungyesMBTIno

INTJ and atheist since age 12! Only this year did I find my theoretical reasoning for being an atheist expanded - from the age of 13 onward, I hadn't seriously thought about my position until over 5 years later.


----------



## Nintaku

I am an INFP, and I am agnostic.
Religion is a human construct. My beliefs are characterized in my literary works with the Sea of Souls, which is where spiritual essence is pulled from when things are born and where the essences go when life ends. In short, life is an unending cycle where those who died will live again in some way, shape, or form.


----------



## magnumta

I don't see any logical reason to be atheist. I mean to an atheist death = nothingness because they have no God. So that means if they don't have a happy life now, they won't have a chance at another. In a way it's living life with a time limit on hope. That's depressing as hell. So what do I have to lose? I wonder what the percentages are for people who are agnostic who change there minds in there old age. Or atheist people that were faced with a life or death situation that remain atheist. As a side note, I allways thought people put too much stock in religions and not in a "God". There is a difference to me. I just don't have the time or space to type it all here, but as far as I've found out, God came before religion. Religions were written my man so they are flawed. But everyone has there own God if they choose to have one. I do believe that everyone should have the choice to do what they want with there lives. And I do hate it when a Jehovah's Witness or agnostic or whoever it is tries to push there ways on me.


----------



## tentoedsloth

ISFP. My religious life has had three phases:

1. Raised Lutheran (Christian)
2. Became agnostic for the middle of my life
3. Now giving the idea of God another try: Christianity as the launching point, but still looking and listening


----------



## JWhitsitt

ISTJ.

Raised in very religious household; I'm a PK.

Now atheist


----------



## Eliyahu

ENTP and Jewish


----------



## chill.take.over

INTJ
Christian


----------



## sherona

ENFJ and a Christian.


----------



## Riverlioness

Here are some interesting statistics on this thread regarding atheism/agnosticism/non religious

Which was the majority was 58.04% non religious

Characteristics among atheist/agnostic/non religious posters
*Extroverted* 24.32% 
*Introverted* 75.68% *
Intuitive* 88.96% 
*Sensing* 11.04% 
*Thinking* 57.45% 
*Feeling* 42.55% 
*Judging *33.71% 
*Perceiving* 66.29% 


Atheists/agnostic/non religious percentage by personality type


*INTJ* 14.36% 
*
INTP* 23.20% 
*
ENTJ* 3.87% 
*
ENTP* 11.05% 
*
ISTJ* 2.76% 
*
ISFJ *2.76% 

*ESTJ* 0% 

*ESFJ * 0.55% 

*ISTP* 1.66% 

*ISFP * 2.21% 

*ESTP* 0.55% 

*ESFP* 0.55% 

*INFJ* 8.29% 

*INFP* 20.44% 

*ENFP *6.63% 

*ENFJ* 1.12% 









Very interesting points

Feeling types and thinking types were very close in percentage of atheists and agnostics.

INFPs were the second highest percentage of atheists/agnostics

ESTJs had the lowest number of atheists: 0

The intellectuals had the highest percentage of skeptics: 52.48%

Dreamers (NFs) came in second place : 36.48%

The highest percentage of non religious posters were intuitives.


----------



## Riverlioness

mutton said:


> How can you be both? I thought an agnostic believed there could be a "higher power" but is either undecided or thinks it doesn't matter, while an atheist is certain that there is nothing?


Agnostic atheist is a type of agnosticism (yes I took this from the Wikipedia): 

*Types of agnosticism*

Agnosticism can be subdivided into several categories. Variations include:
*

Agnostic atheism*Agnostic atheists are atheistic because they do not have belief in the existence of any deity, and agnostic because they do not claim to know that a deity does not exist.


*Agnostic theism*The view of those who do not claim to _know_ of the existence of any deity, but still _believe_ in such an existence.*


Apathetic or pragmatic agnosticism*The view that there is no proof of either the existence or nonexistence of any deity, but since any deity that may exist appears unconcerned for the universe or the welfare of its inhabitants, the question is largely academic.[16]


*Ignosticism*The view that a coherent definition of a deity must be put forward before the question of the existence of a deity can be meaningfully discussed. If the chosen definition is not coherent, the ignostic holds the noncognitivist view that the existence of a deity is meaningless or empirically untestable.[17] A.J. Ayer, Theodore Drange, and other philosophers see both atheism and agnosticism as incompatible with ignosticism on the grounds that atheism and agnosticism accept "a deity exists" as a meaningful proposition which can be argued for or against.*


Strong agnosticism* (also called "hard," "closed," "strict," or "permanent agnosticism")The view that the question of the existence or nonexistence of a deity or deities, and the nature of ultimate reality is unknowable by reason of our natural inability to verify any experience with anything but another subjective experience. A strong agnostic would say, "I cannot know whether a deity exists or not, and neither can you.


"*Weak agnosticism* (also called "soft," "open," "empirical," or "temporal agnosticism")The view that the existence or nonexistence of any deities is currently unknown but is not necessarily unknowable; therefore, one will withhold judgment until/if any evidence is available. A weak agnostic would say, "I don't know whether any deities exist or not, but maybe one day, when there is evidence, we can find something out."


----------



## intrasearching

My religion is called Yodingamel (yo-dinj-uh-mull). I practice worship as per the commandments of Yodingamel by killing a camel, hollowing it out and crawling inside its corpse, and then yodeling for three hours or until I pass out. It is believed that by yodeling one can create ripples and tears in the space-time continuum. Upon prolonged yodeling, the individual may be so lucky as to fall through a tear into the Oneness Dimension, or, what may be called Heaven in many other religions. Yodingamites believe that the cover of a recently killed camel corpse is the perfect vessel with which to safely and swiftly cross into the Oneness Dimension. The residual warmth, the blood and innards of the camel provide a material which will burn and fuel one's travel through the space-time continuum, as any naked person who did so would burn up. The materials of the camel burn and mix together to form matter similar to whale oil.

I am set to make my voyage with my camel next July. Please everyone wish me well. I am quite apprehensive. Many times the ritual does not work and the individual dies of diseases contracted from the innards of the camel.


----------



## Riverlioness

Percentage of non religious/religious posters within personality types


*INTJ *67% non religious/ 33% religious

*INTP *88% non religious/ 13% religious

*ENTJ *70% non religious/ 30% religious

*ENTP *71% non religious/ 29% religious

*ISTJ *50% non religious / 50% religious

*ISFJ *56% non religious/ 44% religious

*ESFJ* 50% non religious/ 50% religious

*ESTJ *0% non religious/ 100% religious

*ISFP *33% non religious/ 67% religious

*ISTP *43% non religious/ 57% religious

*ESTP *50% non religious/ 50% religious

*ESFP *50% non religious/ 50% religious

*INFJ *44% non religious/ 56% religious

*INFP* 51% non religious/ 49% religious

*ENFJ *22% non religious/ 78% religious

*ENFP *50% non religious/ 50% religious


----------



## Boxter9

ENTP and United Methodist. You can also call me Protestant and/or Christian but I don't like associating myself with the connotations of those words.


----------



## ENTJam

ENTJ and Christian (Roman Catholic).


----------



## .30691

ENTJ non-religious


----------



## Reicheru

magnumta said:


> I don't see any logical reason to be atheist. I mean to an atheist death = nothingness because they have no God. So that means if they don't have a happy life now, they won't have a chance at another. In a way it's living life with a time limit on hope. That's depressing as hell. So what do I have to lose? I wonder what the percentages are for people who are agnostic who change there minds in there old age. Or atheist people that were faced with a life or death situation that remain atheist.


(disclaimer: "IMHO" all over this post. )

no god and no afterlife means you must make the most of this life and ascribe your own meaning to it. that is what makes life so precious and its meaning so personal. so, no. death isn't "nothing," it's the loss of the most VALUABLE thing in the world!

yeah, i'm disillusioned. scientifically, life is a struggle for the best genetic material to copy itself over and over, serving as both cause and effect to our existence, nothing more. but in the process we've become emotional, self-aware, intelligent beings. in a way, we've evolved souls: that extra, indefinable "something" that gives us our humanity and the capacity to love and give even when we needn't.

it's what makes us give to charity for example: no immediate/tangible reward (besides a small burst of dopamine).
personally, i give to others because it is my choice. not because god told me to. not for the reward of Heaven or under threat of Purgatory. i give because i want to make life as enjoyable and comfortable as possible - both for myself, and for others. 

so yeah... we're not all angry godless nihilists. 

INFJ. athiest / agnostic. i teeter toward existentialism and i'm quite the admirer of the Buddhist way of thinking, and the rather dystheistic Teutonic gods. what characters!


----------



## Lucretius

magnumta said:


> I don't see any logical reason to be atheist. I mean to an atheist death = nothingness because they have no God. So that means if they don't have a happy life now, they won't have a chance at another. In a way it's living life with a time limit on hope. That's depressing as hell.


 Hmm.._.déjà vu_. I'm almost certain I've replied to this exact comment at some point in the semi-recent past, yet I cannot seem to find any evidence of this. Strange. My reply essentially was (or would have been):

"Logical" is certainly _not _an adjective befitting an appeal to consequences, a most overt fallacy. If you possess the rather impressive capacity to choose your beliefs as you would the flavour of your ice cream, then good for you; however, don't assume there is anything logical about choosing them on the basis of what is or isn't "depressing."


----------



## shadowcookie

Buddhist and INTP

Buddhism is an interesting religion, but to me, it doesn't really seem to be a religion at all. From several articles I've read, it is more of a "way of life". Buddha himself, clearly stated that he wasn't a god, although many people worship him as one. He also taught that gods were irrelevant to enlightenment, and he didn't believe in one either, stating that there was no evidence to support it. 

He believed that a "god" was created by human beings based on fear, finding comfort by praying. For the origins of the world, Buddha had a belief quite similar to the scientific one. 

"No one saves us but ourselves, No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path, but Buddhas clearly show the way." ~Buddha 

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.


----------



## Owuguffu

ENTP and Atheist.


----------



## Vanitas

ENTJ and negotiable. As in, (for most of the time) it's somewhere near the clusters of Agnosticism, Tibetan/Zen Buddhism, Animism and Catholicism.

In daily/ casual/ IRL conversations usually I just say that I'm Agnostic.


----------



## Boxter9

shadowcookie said:


> Buddhist and INTP
> 
> Buddhism is an interesting religion, but to me, it doesn't really seem to be a religion at all. From several articles I've read, it is more of a "way of life". Buddha himself, clearly stated that he wasn't a god, although many people worship him as one. He also taught that gods were irrelevant to enlightenment, and he didn't believe in one either, stating that there was no evidence to support it.
> 
> He believed that a "god" was created by human beings based on fear, finding comfort by praying. For the origins of the world, Buddha had a belief quite similar to the scientific one.
> 
> "No one saves us but ourselves, No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path, but Buddhas clearly show the way." ~Buddha
> 
> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.


IMO, religion should always be a way of life. I was raised United Methodist. Here's a John Wesley quote:

"Do all the good you can,
By all the means you can,
In all the ways you can,
In all the places you can,
At all the times you can,
To all the people you can,
As long as you ever can."

That doesn't sound like something that should only be implemented one day per week. An enormous part of my religious life is social responsibility. For me, faith is a separate but related matter; why somebody does good is irrelevant to me. What somebody thinks only matters insomuch as they are acting in a manner congruent with what they say the believe. Don't talk the talk if you're not walking the walk. I don't necessarily believe in the virgin birth of Christ. I don't necessarily believe that he was resurrected from the dead after three days in the tomb. I do believe in a higher power, and I do believe that there was a man named Jesus who was crucified to demonstrate that in all things we should love one another unconditionally. I try my hardest to live by that principle.


----------



## WiseloveWoman

Deist, from a humanist perspective.


----------



## shadowcookie

Boxter9 said:


> IMO, religion should always be a way of life. I was raised United Methodist. Here's a John Wesley quote:
> 
> "Do all the good you can,
> By all the means you can,
> In all the ways you can,
> In all the places you can,
> At all the times you can,
> To all the people you can,
> As long as you ever can."
> 
> That doesn't sound like something that should only be implemented one day per week. An enormous part of my religious life is social responsibility. For me, faith is a separate but related matter; why somebody does good is irrelevant to me. What somebody thinks only matters insomuch as they are acting in a manner congruent with what they say the believe. Don't talk the talk if you're not walking the walk. I don't necessarily believe in the virgin birth of Christ. I don't necessarily believe that he was resurrected from the dead after three days in the tomb. I do believe in a higher power, and I do believe that there was a man named Jesus who was crucified to demonstrate that in all things we should love one another unconditionally. I try my hardest to live by that principle.


Aye. 

Doing good doesn't necessarily mean we must donate hundreds of dollars to charity a month (or something along those lines), it could be something small (e.g. not bullying another, explaining a maths problem to someone, etc). After all, eventually, when we add up all our small deeds, they might make something a lot bigger than we might think. 

As Aesop said: "No act of kindness, no matter how small, is ever wasted." 

And, even if it may sound cliché or superficial, it really does feel rewarding. For me, when I see the look of understanding pass by their face, even if they don't always say a "thanks" to me, I still feel rewarded. However, it's harder to help others when they begin to take you for granted. 

"It's easy to make a buck. It's a lot tougher to make a difference." ~Tom Brokaw


----------



## KateMarie999

INFP and Evangelical Free Christian (which pretty much means I believe all Christians are Christians no matter how they pray or how they worship)


----------



## nutmeg421

Christian. Specifically Mormon.


----------



## strangestdude

INFP and religious naturalism.


----------



## nofynofy

INFJ, Roman Catholic


----------



## Leeoflittlefaith

ISFP, brought up Catholic but now agnostic.


----------



## TheMilitantAtheist

No one will EVER know this INFP's religious beliefs! Such a discovery would be done by that of a genius!


----------



## The Great One

I am currently a Christian but am questioning my religion. Religion is an issue that drives me insane.


----------



## jdathome

INFJ – Christian. I was raised and baptized in the Baptist Church. I was also exposed to Lutheran and Catholic Ideologies. Later in life my studies and testimony were expressed in a Presbyterian and Reformed atmosphere.Today, I don’t attend Church. But I pray to Jesus and God. I once was electrocuted and would have certainly perished had a close by friend not somehow knocked me off the 480/3 phase circuit. I didn’t see God, or angels, or Jesus, while I hovered above myself for an instant. But as I was being drawn away everything turned white. I then came too, rolling on the ground in horror, unable to breathe,or speak. At the moment the current was cut from my body, something was about to happen to my “soul”, if you will?

I believe…!!


----------



## Smiling Aria

INFP Buddhist mainly. I also believe a few wiccan related things, most of hinduism, some "new-agey" stuff, and a few other beliefs. Being spiritual with a few guidelines to point in the right direction is nice :3


----------



## Tristan427

INTJ Non denominational Christian.


----------



## ToxicSilver

I'm an INXP (leaning more towards T though) and I am an atheist. I have never been at all religious, as a child at primary (elementary) school I hated being forced to pretend to be religious - I went to a C of E primary school and all the teachers were very Christian.


----------



## Lev

I'm agnostic.

Can't rule out that there's some order to everything beyond our control and that the truth is not limited by our lack of understanding, but I'm not about to start acting like I give a crap either.


----------



## Hirschkorn

INTJ, Christian. Not a churchgoer though.


----------



## TVines

I'm Episcopalian of the Anglo Catholic sort. I grew up Roman Catholic, but after I began to accept certain things like the moral neutrality of one's sexual orientation (I'm gay by the way), women's ordination, and contraception I switched over. I tend to have a secular humanist out look on life, but I am in love with rich ritual and spirituality.


----------



## WolfStar

INTJ and ignostic.


----------



## RaptorWizard

There is an interesting religion developed by a man named Wayne Herschel called Oneism. Personally I consider myself a Dragon Architect Wizard Jedi Oneist. I also believe in the philosophies of Plotinus and Spinoza.


----------



## silberlied

I am an INTJ spiritual atheist.


----------



## zerocrossing

ENTP Catholic. I tried to be an atheist in college, but I had a hard time believing it.


----------



## deSouza

silberlied said:


> I am an INTJ spiritual atheist.


Ever heard of jainism?


----------



## WolfStar

INTJ and ignostic. I think life is about being good, which leads to wisdom. Beliefs are irrelevant.


----------



## silberlied

deSouza said:


> Ever heard of jainism?


I hadn't before today, but I just looked it up and I can definitely respect it.


----------



## Dark Romantic

I have complicated religious views (I'm an ENTP); on the one hand, looking at things from an objectively rational perspective, I think that the wisest perspective to take is one of agnostic atheism. Nothing I have seen indicates that there is a God or gods, therefore, there is no reason to believe that any specific one exists (though I am of the opinion that it is likely that there are beings that are of a totally different material nature than we are, since none have been observed, they remain a purely theoretical construct). We have observed natural phenomena which operate according to natural principles; we have no reason to assume that things will change.

However, if I _were_ to be religious... I would take a monotheistic approach; now, logically, I don't see why there wouldn't be multiple spiritual beings if they were created by natural (according to whatever nature they were bound by) processes, but if there was a being of the same nature as the Abrahamic God, then this would not necessarily be the case, as the Abrahamic God exists as, among other things, a first cause for everything that is, was, or ever will be. It would then follow that there could not be multiple first causes, ergo, there could not be multiple creatures of God's nature, since its main role is _as_ a first cause for everything; if one posited the idea of multiple universes (not the multiple universes of string theory, which I do admit I haven't tried to fully understand; I mean real, unobservable, separate cases of reality), then one would just have to extend the concept of God to cover all possible forms of existence, as well, since the other universes would also be in want of a first cause.

Now that I've explained the monotheistic aspect, I'll get into what I think the nature of this being would, in fact, be. Many people, when they look at the God of the Old Testament, are being given an interpretation that is clouded by the perceptions of the people writing the various books of the Bible. Think of it this way; a child being disciplined by a parent would only see the parent's wrath and anger, not the love behind it. This is slightly different; this is people confusing a prediction (if you do this, x will happen) with a threat (if you do this, I will MAKE x happen). Now, one could look at these AS threats, since in many prophecies, God (or, the prophet claiming to be speaking with God) says that he will cause things to happen; however, if one thinks of God as being more like the author of a story (who keeps his world entirely in his mind) that works like an MMORPG (where everyone is an agent with free will), you could say that he _would_ be causing things to happen, since he would simply be causing the rules that he had put into place to arrive at a certain consequence. I do not think that this God is a moral absolutist, except for the fact that he seems to be working for the good of all; many of the things which are done in the Bible are not spoken of with any judgement in mind, but are rightly looked at as necessities of a brutal age, but it would be difficult for a supposed source of absolute morality to justify quite a few of the nastier actions that take place. However, he does condemn causing unnecessary suffering to your fellow man, and he does seem to condemn selfishness to the point where it harms one's fellow man, unless one's life is in danger. Therefore, my conclusion is that this God is one which is generally utilitarian, and encourages people to act in a way which maximizes happiness among everybody, including themselves (as long as this pursuit of one's own happiness does not cause more suffering than happiness). Now, given the fact that this being wants everyone to be happy, one may ask why it did not simply create beings that would act in a manner that would automatically guarantee optimal happiness; I think that the answer is, this God does not want to be a god of robotic mind-slaves. It would want people to come to it of their own free will, because adding free will would automatically make the experience much more rewarding to those who had chosen God in the end than it would for those who had been forced to do so. Giving people the choice to turn against it, while it would lead to suffering, is what gives meaning to the happiness of those who choose this God. It would make this God happy to see us all happy, but it would mean nothing to us, because we would not understand what it meant NOT to be happy, since we would be unable to make a choice not to be. So, free will would be the gift given to humans in order for us to choose happiness, and unity with this God (which is what I think heaven would be strictly defined as), or misery, and separation from this God (which is what I think hell would be). 

Think of it this way; picture your mother, or your father (whichever parent you were closest with), and imagine how much they love you (or, if you're a parent, think of your own child, and how much you love them), all the sacrifices they've made for you, all the blood, and sweat, and tears that went into raising you, and how they only ever wanted the best for you... and yet, you hated them, cursed them, abused them, thought of them with the utmost contempt, ignored what they said, told them that they should die, that you never cared about them, that you'd never miss them if they were gone. Now, imagine that this parent suddenly died, and you learned about just how much they loved you, even when you rejected their love, how much they cared about you, even when you ignored and abused them, how they never stopped wanting the best for you, even as you wished they would die. Now, imagine how you would feel as you realized exactly how much pain you had caused the person who had loved and cared for you the most, and that they still loved you enough to allow you to hurt them, still loved you enough to try and help you, and still loved you enough to let you be free. Imagine how horrified, and how unbelievably sad and miserable you would feel, knowing that you would never get the chance to thank your parent for everything they had done, that you would never get the chance to reciprocate at least some of that love back to the person who had given you more than you had ever deserved... and most of all, never, ever, get the chance to tell your parent that you were sorry. Now, imagine that instead of it being your parent, it was a being with a much, much greater capacity for love, offering you unfathomable joys and boundless ecstasy, and peace, happiness, and safety beyond your wildest dreams. Imagine that you had forever rejected that being, and that this being was now dead (which is what eternal separation ends up becoming, in practice), forever removed from any effort you might want to take towards earning forgiveness (this assumes that you are granted full understanding of what you had now cut yourself off from: someone who was unable to feel remorse would, naturally, not suffer in this case). THAT... would be the very definition of a hell of one's own making.

Bear in mind that I would subscribe to the Jewish (and certain Christian sects') view of no afterlife, but simply a resurrection after death; I have come to the conclusion that the idea of an afterlife does not come from anywhere in the Bible, but resurrections have been mentioned more than once (I'm going with the Abrahamic tradition of monotheism here, mostly because it's the one I'm most familiar with). So, I would expect a final resurrection, where those who had chosen to be with the God would simply be carried off to whatever fate awaited them, while those who had chosen separation would simply be left behind wherever this would take place (or, they might possibly just stay dead, never waking up and essentially ceasing to exist as thinking, feeling, conscious agents. This could explain why the choice would be permanent). Now, the biggest question here would be; how does one choose this deity? It seems like the answer simply leads to doing as this deity desires (which is, trying to do what would lead to the greatest amount of happiness in the end), and actually wanting to be with this god. Presumably, if the first criterion wasn't fulfilled, you would be a source of misery, a cancer that would ruin everyone else's experience and corrupt whatever paradise this deity had in store, and if the second criterion wasn't fulfilled, you would have made a choice not to be with it, and again, this God would not want to enslave you by forcing you do act against your will.

As for the next question, which would be "how would we know that this deity would want to contact us", it would probably not be fair to create beings without giving them a chance to learn how to make everyone happy. Presumably, he would create us with impulses leading toward seeking happiness, and would give us empathy in order to desire happiness in others. From there, it might try to correct our behaviour using a method that would not prove his existence, since if it were to show itself and give us irrefutable proof that it was exactly what it said it was, there would be a much less powerful choice to make: everyone would believe in its existence and would be faced with its presence. It would ruin the experiment, which I think might be "what would they do if they didn't know for certain that I existed?"

So, those would be my religious beliefs; as rational as I can make them while assuming the existence of a supernatural power.


----------



## DJeter

INFJ Atheist Semi-Platonist


----------



## BlackDog

INTJ Atheist.


----------



## traceur

ENTP - for the longest time i was purely agnostic, giving every explenation an equal chance of being right or wrong, but i had a few discussions that covinced me that when you apply the same level of scrutiny to all beliefs and break them down to their elements and try to explain them in full details, they do not all have the same number of agnostic assumptions, and a belief that has 20 assumptions that all need to be true in order for the theology to function is a lot less likely then a belief that has 3 or 4 assumptions - the more coin tosses it needs, the less likely it is... so now i am a converted tea pot agnostic, a.k.a. atheists for all practical matters.

(someone should really collect statistics about this btw)


----------



## Emily Riddle

I'm an INFP. 

I was baptized Born-Again (because my parents used to be one) but was taught of the teachings of a Filipino Christian religion called _Members of the Church of God International_ by my father. My mother is not religious but my father is the complete opposite. I consider myself as Agnostic at the present time. I'm still skeptical about God's existence but I do not close my mind in the possibilities that He may be real.


----------



## Emily Riddle

I'm an INFP. 

I was baptized Born-Again (because my parents used to be one) but was taught of the teachings of a Filipino Christian religion called _Members of the Church of God International_ by my father. My mother is not religious but my father is the complete opposite. I consider myself as Agnostic at the present time. I'm still skeptical about God's existence but I do not close my mind in the possibilities that He may be real.


----------



## Dylio

Im an ESTP and I was baptized Anglican. Then I went to a Catholic school for 12 years, where I discovered the lovely world of Buddhism and Enlightenment (Ironic huh? Who would expect to learn such a thing at a catholic school).

Im not religious, but i consider myself to be spiritual. My personal view of God is the universe acting as an interconnected whole.


----------



## Gyepitokki

INFJ and a buddhist.

It's actually a funny story, considering I was christened when I was a baby. I was never really a true atheist, I just wasn't sure about what was real and what wasn't; during the harder part of my teenage years I ran away and came across a buddhist temple in the outskirts of the city. They took me in for the night, fed me and taught me some valuable life lessons. When I left the next morning it was a big change for me, I decided to read into Buddhism and here I am today.


----------



## TheOwl

INTP.

Pagan.


----------



## Perhaps

INTJ; atheist.


----------



## Shantkn

INFx, Agnostic.

I hate religious discussion because it's a topic people can't seem to discuss calmly, on any side of a "debate". Typically, at least.

I was raised Christian. I used to be a heavily self-righteous child, probably a personality trait inherited from my father. My beliefs changed over time, eventually I became a more "liberal" Christian Universalist, not believing in hell but eternal salvation for all. I would've held onto that belief for a long time, but my parents had problems with it because it apparently made me a heretic. I couldn't go back to general Christianity, it just felt too unbalanced for me. I became Agnostic and continue to tell my Christian parents that I'm Christian.

Meh. So yeah, Agnostic. I believe it's possible that there is a God, and possible that there isn't a God. I just don't think we can know truly for sure. Furthermore, if there is a God, I'm not convinced that any pre-existing religions may even be correct about what God that God really would be. Then there's the possibility that there's more than one God. Or it's a Goddess. I have enough trouble worrying about getting through the day, to worry about the afterlife. Besides, I have major depression and have a history of suicidality. If you want to scare someone about hell, you'd have better luck with a brick wall.


----------



## Zyforb

INTP, Agnostic-Atheist.


----------



## sky777

I am an INFP...I come from a background where my parents and siblings are not religious at all (father is an atheist, mother agnostic, and sisters either agnostic or atheist but none of them like the Bible) but I have been a believer in Christ ever since I can remember. I don't go to church and don't trust churches. I am in religious "no man's land" to an extreme degree because most people don't believe what I believe... I believe in Jesus but don't believe He did away with the Torah and I also believe paul was a false apostle...so i totally am unconventional in my religious beliefs... back when I was about 12 I was totally freaked out by the churches and saw a lot of hypocrisy in them...


----------



## CultofRowsdower

Im an INFP and was raised as a Jehovah's Witness which come to find out is a crazy cult, lol. Anyway I went from true believer to agnostic and now I am back to a believer in god/gods. I have been studying the parts in religions that center around love and truth. For the first time in my life I feel some sort of connection to spirituality. I will probably never join another religion though.


----------



## Probably Unresolved

ISFJ, agnostic but raised southern Baptist. There are times I wish there was, and sometimes even pretend there is, a higher power of some sort, some great universal equalizer, nothing really specific though... but on a conscious level I'm aware those things probably don't exist, or that there isn't really any reason to believe there actually is one, at least. It's kind of like... whenever you talk to a pet or something, and you go about it like they can actually understand what you're saying as well as a person can, even though it's likely that they can't. That's sort of how I feel about anything supernatural. And I certainly don't try to impose my beliefs (or lack thereof) on others. The only problem I really have with religion stems from some practitioners who feel the need to impose it on everyone else, legally or otherwise.


----------



## NaughyChimp

ENFP - Methodist.


----------



## Coonsy

INTJ - atheist

I was raised fundamentalist Christian and believed that stuff for nearly 20 years of my life. I went through a transition that looked something like this: Fundamentalist Christian>Liberal Christian>Christian with Buddhist leanings>Zen Buddhism (at least the philosophies)>agnostic>atheist.

I've been an atheist for a number of years now, and find it suits my views the best. Once I shed the brainwashing and managed to engage my own brain outside of that, I took some time to explore other options. This was the one that finally made the most sense, although there are ideas in most religions that I've studied that I feel can be applied to humanity in general. Unless someone were to ask my beliefs, chances are they wouldn't tell the current me from the past me other than the fact that I have a lot more self-confidence now than I ever did when I was younger (some of that may just be age, too).


----------



## Pinkie Pie

ENFP-- Mormon


----------



## jdbullet23

ESTP & an atheist.

(BTW, in all actuality there is no difference between an agnostic & an atheist, as long as you're not a strong atheist. Strong atheists completely deny any existance of any higher being or god, while simple atheists are sceptics, but not totally denying any gods because they have no knowlege of it.)

I'm a somewhat spiritual atheist. I believe in a universal spirit which lives throughout us making us all connected in some way. I believe in reincarnation and some form of an afterlife, & I also believe in soulmates.


----------



## timeless

ENTP, non-denominational Christian


----------



## Apocalypse kid

INTJ and a proud follower of the Baha'i Faith, the latest religion for our time.


----------



## T.N.D.

INTP and atheist


----------



## Phoenix0

ENTP and strong atheist


----------



## Sanskrit

INTJ, agnostic atheist.
I don't know 100% sure there is not some superpowered ultradimensional entity but I am 100% sure it is not any god humans know or even any entity that would give a flying fuck about human beings. I also do not think humans have anything that transcends death, we are sorry sacks of meat with pretty impressive brains on top of that sack and it is all we have to go with until science and technology finds a way to separate our personality from our flesh computer.

Therefore I am atheist as far as it comes to any religion, deity or paranormal, but I am agnostic about the possibility of there being something so vastly beyond our level of existence that we would end up calling it a God on the basis of mere gap in capabilities to our own.
Religion however still is bull and anyone who thinks otherwise is just deluding themselves because they would likely cripple themselves with the fear of death otherwise as the weak pathetic beings they are without this self delusion of afterlife. Such weakness is pathetic and the lack of attempts to overcome it and instead reliance to a stupid, irrational and rather convoluted crutch of guilt and judgment that is religion is depressing.

Not to mention how good of an excuse it makes to justify ignorance, hate, inhuman treatment of people who have different opinions of reality and stealing of their resources and lives is just sickening.

But hey, since we live in politically correct bullshit society and everyone has a freedom to do what ever even if it harms other people like religions and large corporations and apparently even sports teams do, each to their own. Don't worry, all your bullshit won't be judged by any divine deity, so you lying to yourselves and others, hating, mistreating and just acting like jackasses will go unpunished and you will fade into nothing as you croack and the same bullshit will be carried on by others in the name of same heap of crap shoveled down the throats of children generation after generation just to keep someone tall-hat on a golden chair crapping out poorly thought morals to masses to follow.


----------



## bubbamamma

INTJ, Eastern/Byzantine Catholic


----------



## bowieownsmysoul

I'm INTP and an agnostic. I don't really care that much about religion either way.


----------



## pneumoceptor

INFJ, skeptical, PhD scientist, and follower of Jesus

(The middle two descriptors make the points that I don't believe myself to be unthinking or brainwashed, and that I spend ample time wrestling with the *apparent* paradoxes of science and faith.)


----------



## VertigoH

INFP and pagan/neo-pagan. Leaning towards something along the lines of pantheism, but still doing my research. I love learning about all different religions.


----------



## Jewl

ENFP. Christian. Definitely. I definitely hate the stereotype of Christians out there. I am quite familiar with all of the objections against it. But I want answers. Science and philosophy are two things that are often separated -- however, I think it is impossible to separate them. They are completely intertwined. You can't pay attention to one and then forget about the other. So many things to me only answered one aspect and then forgot about the other side of the equation. I didn't want something that answered only one half or perhaps 2/3 of the questions. 

I wanted something that answered all of them. I also dislike calling Christianity a "religion". Religion implies, "It's your own personal belief. It works for you." It kind of makes it sound as though it's some unnecessary add-on in life. You know, we all start out as atheists or agnostics and that is the "Neutral Zone".

I believe in Christianity because it is truth. It is the thing that fits best with science, logic, philosophy, and reason. In other words, please don't think I haven't thought this matter through. Some people just think I leap into this. Another stereotype that grates me. 

Of course, I am not one to shove this down other peoples' throats, and I don't go around calling people idiots because this said truth is so "obvious". Because I think truth is never obvious -- at least to _us_. We are often blind to things sitting right in front of our noses. I'm sure an atheist would agree to that. I definitely respect other beliefs.


----------



## Dark NiTe

INTJ - atheist


----------



## Recalibar

INTP - Atheist.


----------



## renna

INFJ - Jehovah's Witness


----------



## Impermanence

ENFJ- Buddhist


----------



## Sunbeam

ENFP- New agey spirituality. My beliefs contain a lot of elements of Buddhism, Hinduism, and panentheism.


----------



## ghenwa

INTP, agnostic apatheist. No one will ever know if there is a god for sure, and the fact is the universe is still running when at the moment there could be a god, or could be none. I'd say no use wondering, but even I can't help myself at times.


----------



## Tyrant

INTP - Theravada Buddhist


----------



## Akbar2k7

ENFP Muslim


----------



## EdR

INTJ

The Pope would term me apostate.

Neither athiest nor agnostic seem to fit my viewpoint, yet both sort of apply. I know what I don't believe in, and that is a kind, caring omnipotent diety that gives a rats patootie about anyone or anything that exists.

I do think that I would be much more likely to accept something like the Greek or Roman pantheon. Gods with magical, yet limited powers and abilities. Gods with human flaws and foibles and dieties that do not pretend to guarantee any rewards to their worshippers. The reason this type of god would be acceptable is that they actually deliver what they promise: nothing.


----------



## Surreal Snake

Unknown,Atheist


----------



## Elveni

ENTP, atheist who acknowledges spirituality


----------



## Steel Magnolia

Agnostic, usually test out as ISTJ, but am currently questioning my type.


----------



## Coldspot

INFP, No idea

I am not sure what I'd be classified as, but I don't believe in gods or personified deities. My beliefs are more in line with forces.


----------



## Kathrine

INTP, atheist, not raised in a religious family..


----------



## Zombie Devil Duckie

ESFJ - Eastern Orthodox (Christian)


----------



## happyrain

ENTJ, I believe in the Christian, Jewish, and Muslim God, as I was raised Christian, but I do not believe in an afterlife.


----------



## stardust9

INFJ, raised Catholic but questioning it and recently rejected it- and trust me, I'm an INFJ, it wasn't me who broke the news to my folks. I'm not sure exactly what I am now, somewhere between agnostic and atheist, however, I'm sure I'm not Catholic.


----------



## SwordfishTrombone

I'm an INTP and an agnostic atheist. I was raised a Catholic.


----------



## Sayonara

I am an ISFP

I am at most, a very lax Buddhist. There are days though when I feel I really have no religion except...following the golden rule. I believe very strongly in treating others with respect. Regardless of that fact though, I still find religion very fascinating, as it seems to bring out the best, as well as the worst in humanity.


----------



## musicalmeggie

I'm a Mormon ENFP.


----------



## SophiaScorpia

INTJ and a Roman Catholic.


----------



## EternalNocturne

I'm an ENFP, Non denominational Christian.
I value relationship, rather than trying to force a religion that doesn't resemble Christianity, down everyone's throats.
Basically, I try my best to live morally.. Most of all, I try my best to love God, and love people.


----------



## Aqualung

I may be Cathlyterian, not really sure anymore. I was raised Presbyterian, converted to the Catholic faith a few years ago & lately my beliefs are shifting back to the Protestant church's teachings. I am a Christian (I know, hard to believe : ) either way. Which denomination doesn't matter to me all that much anymore.


----------



## Sayonara

IFSP and the closest would be Buddhist, though I can't say I really follow any one religion. All seem to have limitations.


----------



## Jubeanation

INTP. Discordian.


----------



## Aleksandra

INFJ, Roman Catholic.


----------



## Christie42476

INFJ, Deist. 

I like many (though not all) of the original moral precepts of Christianity, and I wish that all -- and not just some -- of the Christians I've encountered actually practiced them. But I don't believe in their version of God or any of their "origin" stories. I also appreciate much of what Buddhism has to offer and find Buddhists to be some of the most comfortable and fascinating people to be around and to discuss philosophy and religion with.


----------



## AmazonGea

INFP
Raised Mormon
Now simply optimistically agnostic
I don't imagine one ultimate being however, but wonder if perhaps we are much more powerful than we believe and together we join as a collective soul. Do you think I'm weird?


----------



## Devalight

Raised Christian now Vajarayana Buddhist.


----------



## The Nth Doctor

INTP, agnostic/atheist. I think that some type of higher power is possible, but very unlikely, with what we know about the universe.


----------



## NingenExp

INFJ, raised catholic, apatheist/universalist maybe. I believe there exists (or not) a personal concept that enshrines the unknowing, the origin, the end, a spiritual guide, an ideal, someone whom each one can deposit faith or a romantic reference and that concept can be labeled into whichever each one want and can or cannot be used depending of each one's religious needs. I named that concept God and thinking about its existence has no relevance in my life.


----------



## Tad Cooper

Animism/panenthism/buddhist and ISTJ


----------



## Nastorm

If I were religious I would probably be a Sun worshiper. The closest thing to god that we know of.


----------



## tberg

INTP, 6w5 (phobic), anti-theist, moral realist.


----------



## Rauder

INTJ, Pantheist.


----------



## zerocrossing

ENTP and Catholic... by choice.


----------



## SenhorFrio

ENFJ
Raised Pseudu Catholic
Now an Apathiest


----------



## tangosthenes

I am a Leo of the great Mithras, protector of Truth, Justice, and the Waters of the World.


----------



## La Li Lu Le Lo

antahon said:


> If I were religious I would probably be a Sun worshiper. The closest thing to god that we know of.














zerocrossing said:


> ENTP and Catholic... by choice.


When is it not a choice?

Anyways, I'm INFP, and Catholic.


----------



## Leora

CaptainWayward said:


> Depends on God is defined. Personally, religion is just a tool to describe the experience of living. I used to find religion quite interesting, but have since grown bored of it.
> 
> On the edge of the matter for me it comes down to a few possibilities:
> 1) There is no god.
> 2) There is a God, it represents the collective narrative, and plays out through biochemical reactions.
> 3) There is a God, it represents the collective narrative, it plays out through biochemical reactions, and flips uncertainties such as the decay of particles to abide by the global narrative. This would imply the symbols used to describe the narrative are a fundamental part of the universe. Might also imply there is infinite complexity that serves as a tool to bring this symbolism into reality. Very abstract relationships inherently have very complex implications.
> 
> I'm quite comfortable with 2, since stories have a way of affecting people's decisions.



Lol. Love this quote, I didn't even have to look at your type to know you are an INTP. Keep posting, INTP's are wonderfully interesting and passionate about thought. I try to catch every available window into your busy brains


----------



## SunSoul

CaptainWayward said:


> Depends on God is defined. Personally, religion is just a tool to describe the experience of living. I used to find religion quite interesting, but have since grown bored of it.
> 
> On the edge of the matter for me it comes down to a few possibilities:
> 1) There is no god.
> 2) There is a God, it represents the collective narrative, and plays out through biochemical reactions.
> 3) There is a God, it represents the collective narrative, it plays out through biochemical reactions, and flips uncertainties such as the decay of particles to abide by the global narrative. This would imply the symbols used to describe the narrative are a fundamental part of the universe. Might also imply there is infinite complexity that serves as a tool to bring this symbolism into reality. Very abstract relationships inherently have very complex implications.
> 
> I'm quite comfortable with 2, since stories have a way of affecting people's decisions.


Yes Yes Yes.


----------



## Cerebro

Went from Christian by tradition, to agnostic. But when my blatantly atheistic philosophy professor tried to convince my whole class that God does not exist, I came out of it with more faith in God than ever before, so now, I'm a Christian by realization.


----------



## laikta

I am Buddhist and my type ... please see below... :wink:


----------



## CataclysmSolace

ISTJ, Agnostic

Also, technically it's not a religion, but an irreligion. I dislike talking about religion because it deals with beliefs. 

Also, when agnosticism comes up among my friends they think of this: 







 





and the episodes for it.


----------



## tangosthenes

Cerebro said:


> Went from Christian by tradition, to agnostic. But when my blatantly atheistic philosophy professor tried to convince my whole class that God does not exist, I came out of it with more faith in God than ever before, so now, I'm a Christian by realization.


Hardcore atheists have a tendency to overlook doubt and move into "certitude." But just because you saw one side say something stupid, doesn't mean that there is any certainty or truth in the other side. I think you were right when you recognized agnosticism. Just a little intuition that popped up when I read your statement.


----------



## Raichan

INFJ, Muslim


----------



## Persephone

INTJ Pantheist.

Other titles (they do NOT contradict each other!): atheist, agnostic, apatheist

I believe there is something higher than what we can see but it is neither separable from nature, nor is it conscious.


----------



## mrserre

I am basically with Captain Wayward on this. My type also happens to be closest to INTP, as far as I can tell, though there are doubts. 



> has better answers than me. Therefore, until I see proof




This is an attitude which is somewhat troubling. If someone will yield only to "better answers," that's fine, but should be forthright as to what is meant by "better" in the first place. This isn't even nitpicking; rather, it is about discouraging the posing of tasks which doom the pursuer to failure from the start. If one has decided on a very few number of avenues of being possibly convinced, especially on such topics, there's almost no point even posing the challenge. 

There doesn't appear to be an easy way to prescribe what is the best way to live life in general. On that note, I can't imagine there being an easy answer to a question involving words like "God" and "truth" .. .

I'd say if one is skeptical, perhaps it is better to consider what other perspectives do offer that one's own does not, because the challenge of defining what kind of proof one is seeking may be too great in the first place. 

Someone mentioned infringing rights - I personally think what rights one has are unclear. I am not in favor of telling others how to live their lives; however, whether religious or not, it seems common that some people are more likely to look down on various ways of living than others, and some will suggest invariably that those who are too stupid to make the right decision should have no choice, because they will merely harm themselves and others. 

That is, I like to separate the question of "when is it OK to tell someone what to do" from religion entirely, much as someone suggested separating the God questions from religion. Those who fervently believe they are doing good to others by acting a certain way without any justification exist whether in the name of a religion or in the name of some ideal. 

So ultimately, my answer to the question of this thread: those who believe in something like God .. what they believe in will in all likelihood be something they can't articulate sufficiently. It is better to stick with what one identifies or sympathizes with in a majority of cases than what one believes in. I am myself possibly agnostic, but in reality what I am agnostic about is whether there is a particularly meaningful distinction between theism and atheism, rather in line with how I wonder if there's any definition of "God" in words worth debating the existence of.


----------



## Vianna

ENFP- atheist ... I believe, that there is something more, than we can see and i believe, that things happen for some reasons, but just that idea of organized religion and Heaven, Hell, God, Satan seems strange to me. Maybe if i could choose a religion it would be budhism.


----------



## millestelle

ENFP and a Buddhist.

Raised in a Buddhist family, went to Catholic and then Christian School. I was pretty much non-religious when I was a teenager because I didn't see a point in going to temples, praying to god or doing any other religious activities for that matter. After starting University, I have gained many good friends that are firm believers in many religions, so I began to search for my own. Found myself back with Buddhism ever since.

I think religion is subjective, if you feel that it's right for you then there's no reason why you shouldn't believe in it.


----------



## All in Twilight

millestelle said:


> ENFP and a Buddhist.
> 
> Raised in a Buddhist family, went to Catholic and then Christian School. I was pretty much non-religious when I was a teenager because I didn't see a point in going to temples, praying to god or doing any other religious activities for that matter. After starting University, I have gained many good friends that are firm believers in many religions, so I began to search for my own. Found myself back with Buddhism ever since.
> 
> I think religion is subjective, if you feel that it's right for you then there's no reason why you shouldn't believe in it.


Buddhism is not a religion but a lifestyle unless you look at the "true meaning" of the word religion which stems from Latin and translates as "to reconnect".


----------



## Dragearen

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Buddhism is not a religion but a lifestyle unless you look at the "true meaning" of the word religion which stems from Latin and translates as "to reconnect".


It depends on the form of Buddhism. If you mean Zen or many Mahayana forms, it's definitely a lifestyle. If you mean Theravada or Vajrayana (includes Tibetan Buddhism), then it's definitely a religion.

As for myself, I'm an INFP. I don't subscribe to any organized religion, and I've incorporated aspects from many religions. However, most of my influence comes from a smattering of Christianity (Episcopal & Mormon), Huna (Egyptian), and here and there some Taoism and Zen, as well as a bit of Hinduism (especially from Shabda Yoga).


----------



## gammagon

Agnostic intp.


----------



## millestelle

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Buddhism is not a religion but a lifestyle unless you look at the "true meaning" of the word religion which stems from Latin and translates as "to reconnect".


Well yes, it really depends on how you define the word 'religion'. It is not a religion in a sense that there is no actual 'creator' that we have to worship, but it is still considered a religion because certain aspects of the practices are similar to other religious practices. Educational textbooks still consider Buddhism as a religion and you can choose this option when filling in forms asking for it.


----------



## All in Twilight

Dragearen said:


> It depends on the form of Buddhism. If you mean Zen or many Mahayana forms, it's definitely a lifestyle. If you mean Theravada or Vajrayana (includes Tibetan Buddhism), then it's definitely a religion.
> 
> As for myself, I'm an INFP. I don't subscribe to any organized religion, and I've incorporated aspects from many religions. However, most of my influence comes from a smattering of Christianity (Episcopal & Mormon), Huna (Egyptian), and here and there some Taoism and Zen, as well as a bit of Hinduism (especially from Shabda Yoga).



*re·li·gion (r







n)_n._*1. **a. * Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
*b. * A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.

*2. * The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
*3. * A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.
*4. * A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

*religion - definition of religion by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

Of course the dictionary is wrong as I actually indirectly stated before and that makes you right. I do think Buddhism is a religion as well. It's all about getting reconnected with X. 

Since you seem well informed, I am going to test the water a bit. Not because I want to make you look foolish but because I am interested in your beliefs. 

Did you notice the correlation between Christ and Buddha? Think about the the number 40 for example that takes a prominent place in their life or is it just me?

I am an ENTP and highly fascinating and sexy. I don't subscribe to organized religions as well. Besides, who wants to believe in the teachings of Cathol nowadays after you have familiarized yourself with the works of Erasmus?


----------



## Raichu

ISTP, Roman Catholic


----------



## Dragearen

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Of course the dictionary is wrong as I actually indirectly stated before and that makes you right. I do think Buddhism is a religion as well. It's all about getting reconnected with X.
> 
> Since you seem well informed, I am going to test the water a bit. Not because I want to make you look foolish but because I am interested in your beliefs.
> 
> Did you notice the correlation between Christ and Buddha? Think about the the number 40 for example that takes a prominent place in their life or is it just me?


Of course, the exact definition of religion can be debated all day long. I'm just using the more common definition, though I personally like yours a lot better.

And yeah, I have noticed a correlation, though I haven't looked into it very deeply. I'd like to at some point, but mostly I've just noticed some things in their core teachings. Also, the number 40?


----------



## marckos

Atheist/ Panteist. XNTP until know.


----------



## jennzthejust

I am a Christian Methodist... 
I respect (or I try my best to), everyone's beliefs...
My theory with Athiests: Isn't believing in something better than believing in nothing?
I love you all! There are so many lost people out there...
Even if you are skeptical, love people with all your heart, even those that have wronged you. When you love people, everything else will follow: the good deeds, the kind words, the desire to do right. This is the Christian way, and I intend to walk down the path of doing what Jesus called all of us to do.



  TWO roads diverged in a yellow wood,And sorry I could not travel bothAnd be one traveler, long I stoodAnd looked down one as far as I couldTo where it bent in the undergrowth;_ 5_  Then took the other, as just as fair,And having perhaps the better claim,Because it was grassy and wanted wear;Though as for that the passing thereHad worn them really about the same,_ 10_  And both that morning equally layIn leaves no step had trodden black.Oh, I kept the first for another day!Yet knowing how way leads on to way,I doubted if I should ever come back._ 15_  I shall be telling this with a sighSomewhere ages and ages hence:Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—I took the one less traveled by,And that has made all the difference. 
 -Robert Frost


----------



## JoanCrawford

millestelle said:


> ENFP and a Buddhist.
> 
> Raised in a Buddhist family, went to Catholic and then Christian School. I was pretty much non-religious when I was a teenager because I didn't see a point in going to temples, praying to god or doing any other religious activities for that matter. After starting University, I have gained many good friends that are firm believers in many religions, so I began to search for my own. Found myself back with Buddhism ever since.
> 
> I think religion is subjective, if you feel that it's right for you then there's no reason why you shouldn't believe in it.


Buddhists are so cool. >.< 

I am an INTP and am Agnostic at the moment.


jennzthejust said:


> My theory with Athiests: Isn't believing in something better than believing in nothing?


*Grits teeth together, trying not to point out obvious mis-definition of Atheism.*


----------



## Planisphere




----------



## All in Twilight

Dragearen said:


> Of course, the exact definition of religion can be debated all day long. I'm just using the more common definition, though I personally like yours a lot better.
> 
> And yeah, I have noticed a correlation, though I haven't looked into it very deeply. I'd like to at some point, but mostly I've just noticed some things in their core teachings. Also, the number 40?


Buddha meditated for 40 days under a tree to reach...Jesus went to the desert to pray/contemplate (basically meditate but the West preferred to gave it another word) but they were both inaugurations. Stuff like that. There are many parallels like that to be found. It's very interesting to go deeper into that. Some say Jesus had a brother, like da Vinci and the famous painter Rafael who depicted them both with John and virgin Mary. That brother is supposed to be the reincarnation of Buddha. And the other Jesus is supposed to be a reincarnation of Zarathustra. Just a rumour. But a fun rumour.


----------



## Devalight

I am Buddhist. I was raised Christian - Methodist and Baptist, converted to Buddhism in 2008.


----------



## Kincsem

I am "up in the air" when it comes to religion. I love the idea of it, and certain religions [Taoism, Buddhism, Wiccan] are beautiful. I cannot rationalize the existence of a higher power. I have more faith in science than religion.-Anna


----------



## ESTJ

Pantheist.


----------



## MrMagpie

Agnostic Atheist, INTP.


----------



## MrMagpie

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> Buddha meditated for 40 days under a tree to reach...Jesus went to the desert to pray/contemplate (basically meditate but the West preferred to gave it another word) but they were both inaugurations. Stuff like that. There are many parallels like that to be found. It's very interesting to go deeper into that. Some say Jesus had a brother, like da Vinci and the famous painter Rafael who depicted them both with John and virgin Mary. That brother is supposed to be the reincarnation of Buddha. And the other Jesus is supposed to be a reincarnation of Zarathustra. Just a rumour. But a fun rumour.


Jesus had brothers and sisters - his brothers were Joseph, James, Judas, and Simon. Jesus also had two sisters, who were never named in the Bible.


----------



## FiNe SiTe

Pantheist maybe?
I don't know.
Most likely Apatheist.


----------



## All in Twilight

MrMagpie said:


> Jesus had brothers and sisters - his brothers were Joseph, James, Judas, and Simon. Jesus also had two sisters, who were never named in the Bible.


I am sorry, I meant that there were 2 Jesusses basically. 
I did not know he had two sisters though. Can you give me your source? I would like to get to know more about that.
Thanks!


----------



## Mammon

Agnostic Theist -ISFP


----------



## Iridescent

ISTP. Apatheist. Used to be a Roman Catholic, then an Atheist, then an Agnostic, then just decided that I don't really give a shit. roud:


----------



## millestelle

JoanCrawford said:


> Buddhists are so cool. >.<


lol Why do you think so?


----------



## JoanCrawford

millestelle said:


> lol Why do you think so?


I don't know, I just like them. They are so easy-going and mind their own business. Plus, their religion is about finding peace and nirvana rather than going by a book of set rules.


----------



## ebullientcorner

DubLeWoble said:


> Agnostic Theist -ISFP


Me too!

I was raised very Mormon. My parents, and most of my family practice. It's an amazing religion, and if I could practice it I would. I don't fit. I carry a lot of it's views---er philosophical views but little to none of it's practicalities. I have a strong tension with dogma, despite myself.
For instance, one of their philosophies is ultimate free agency as the push behind the forces of good. However, it doesn't seem to be practiced as much, but I think that is just human nature. They're very loving, but too absolute. Gay marriage for instance is not just something that should be "allowed" for me, but something that should not be questioned if it should be allowed. People are people, love is love. 
But it has been hard reconciling myself culturally. Most don't realize that the Mormon culture is almost as exacting as the Orthodox Jewish one. Very family oriented, and if you are in the religion it means you are with your family for eternity. It's hard for them to accept you leaving it.

In most arguments on religion, I find myself defending it as I feel that it can be very helpful and peaceful and that most of the bad that people feel that it does is more of a cultural issue. Obviously more complex than I want to go into right now. Mostly a "don't throw the baby out with the bath water thing", and the majority of the time the circles I run in tend to throw it out entirely because of, labeling it as wholesale evil. Which being the most possible agnostic person in the world makes my soul squeal.

However, if you put me in a room of intolerant religious folk, my song changes and my atheist friends wonder who's talking. I suppose I may just be contrarian.

But as to my personal beliefs, I believe in God. I believe in Christ actually too, but all very vague and benign loose terms. I find it difficult to pray, and I've been having a hard time with the concept of death recently. However I find a great deal of peace when I do reach to God.

*shrug


----------



## staticmud

IridescentDream said:


> ISTP. Apatheist. Used to be a Roman Catholic, then an Atheist, then an Agnostic, then just decided that I don't really give a shit. roud:


This. I'm an ISTP Apatheist.


----------



## Mammon

ebullientcorner said:


> Me too!
> 
> I was raised very Mormon. My parents, and most of my family practice. It's an amazing religion, and if I could practice it I would. I don't fit. I carry a lot of it's views---er philosophical views but little to none of it's practicalities. I have a strong tension with dogma, despite myself.
> For instance, one of their philosophies is ultimate free agency as the push behind the forces of good. However, it doesn't seem to be practiced as much, but I think that is just human nature. They're very loving, but too absolute. Gay marriage for instance is not just something that should be "allowed" for me, but something that should not be questioned if it should be allowed. People are people, love is love.
> But it has been hard reconciling myself culturally. Most don't realize that the Mormon culture is almost as exacting as the Orthodox Jewish one. Very family oriented, and if you are in the religion it means you are with your family for eternity. It's hard for them to accept you leaving it.
> 
> In most arguments on religion, I find myself defending it as I feel that it can be very helpful and peaceful and that most of the bad that people feel that it does is more of a cultural issue. Obviously more complex than I want to go into right now. Mostly a "don't throw the baby out with the bath water thing", and the majority of the time the circles I run in tend to throw it out entirely because of, labeling it as wholesale evil. Which being the most possible agnostic person in the world makes my soul squeal.
> 
> However, if you put me in a room of intolerant religious folk, my song changes and my atheist friends wonder who's talking. I suppose I may just be contrarian.
> 
> But as to my personal beliefs, I believe in God. I believe in Christ actually too, but all very vague and benign loose terms. I find it difficult to pray, and I've been having a hard time with the concept of death recently. However I find a great deal of peace when I do reach to God.
> 
> *shrug


I just only recently went from Agnostic to an Agnostic Theist and am slowly becoming an Theist really. I was raised an Evangelist but it felt wrong, oh so wrong. It felt dark instead of uplifting, supressing instead of enlightning. So I went about and walked my own path in search of the Truth. Truth, that to me, feels right.


----------



## MrMagpie

Usernamefoundyeyme said:


> I am sorry, I meant that there were 2 Jesusses basically.
> I did not know he had two sisters though. Can you give me your source? I would like to get to know more about that.
> Thanks!


The existence of his siblings is mentioned explicitly in Matthew 13:55-13:56. "Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not His mother called Mary, and His brothers, James and Joseph and Simon and Judas? And His sisters, are they not with us?"

Although the names of his sisters are never mentioned in the New Testament, early Christian literature identified them as Mary and Salome, two very common names for Jewish women at that period of time.


----------



## Northcrest

INFJ - Agnostic. Religion is just too much of a hassle for me.


----------



## Cloudlight

ISTP and I am a member of the Skoptsky religion.

Skoptsy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## All in Twilight

MrMagpie said:


> The existence of his siblings is mentioned explicitly in Matthew 13:55-13:56. "Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not His mother called Mary, and His brothers, James and Joseph and Simon and Judas? And His sisters, are they not with us?"
> 
> Although the names of his sisters are never mentioned in the New Testament, early Christian literature identified them as Mary and Salome, two very common names for Jewish women at that period of time.


If you look at the family tree of Jesus, one goes back to Salomo and the other goes back to Nathan. That is what struck me the most. THIS is mentioned in the bible: Matthew=Salomo and Luke=Nathan. In the St. Ambrosius Church in Milan there is a painting by Borgognone (1450-1523) where the two Jesus children are depicted. Just like in many other paintings although sometimes the other child is John the Baptist.


----------



## littlemouse

INFP and atheist. I didn't grow up with any sort of religion, so that might be part of that as well. 
Although, New Atheism and other atheism-related movement things seem to suck pretty badly.


----------



## andreea00

ENTP - and i'm a Protestant Christian...
i know it's odd, cause ENTPs that are christian (or any kind of believers) are rare...or so i've heard..
i was raised in a house where no one cared about religion..so i was never interested either, until experiences drove me to christianity and now i'm a strong believer.


----------



## Cristy0505

IXTP - Agnostic 
I don't really care or question if either a god exist or not... None of my business. Nothing I should be bothered off.


----------



## leafling

INFP - agnostic atheist


----------



## shakti

An ENFJ wannabe mystic whose spirituality is very important to her :kitteh: Spirituality as in - exploring my own path and not being affiliated with any religion


----------



## Sigma

ENFP - Deist


----------



## stilldaydreaming

I'm muslim. A proud muslimah . 

I found that the teaching is related to our live. For example how Islam said about controlling your nafs. And your "private" will justify the nafs. Yeah ... that's so true ._. And so many cool things here in this religion. One of my favorite thing is well, how Islam emphasize that you can't be pious by yourself. Reminding each other in goodness for the sake of God. And God also want us to be kind and just to anyone. We also got humanism IF you study the real Islam. If you KNOW the real history of The Prophet (pbuh). If you study Quran and Sunnah. Also I like the concept of tolerance in Islam. That you didn't "hurt" the feeling of God (Allah), and you do just to other human. Lakum diinukum wa liyadiin. For you is your religion, and for me is my religion. . Oh one more one more. Islam is knowledge. So many things to learn but you can do it step by step. Like what I'm, doing rite now. Step by step . And how everytime muslims meet each other they pray to each other by their salaam. Yeah many do's and don'ts but I believe to actually enter the heaven must be tough one :|. Just like wanting to past a college entrance examination . And in Islam I also learn that you can't judge that others muslims worst than you, because the real judger is Him. If you find your brother doing wrong things, help him, remind him. Those are things from my religion that I know


----------



## Mr. Meepers

INFP .... I am an agnostic theist with an emphasis on agnostic. ... I am a Catholic, but I pick and choose what I believe and how I interpreted it. ... If their seems to be a discrepancy between my morals and the religion I choose, I try to find a way to solve the apparent discrepancy (I don't change my morals because of religion, I change and/or refine my religion to fit my morals).

As far as science and religion are concerned, I find the concept of "God" to be unfalsifiable (even given certain natural assumptions .... I also find the negation "There is no God" to also be at the very least, not practically falsifiable ... as any outcome from "God" or vision of "God" can have alternative explanations and science looks for alternative explanations), and therefor outside the realm of science. I think that is a benevolent God gave us great minds, then he would not just tell us how the world works, unless it was an important detail ... I think the "sun stopping" instead of the "Earth stopping" was not meant as the sun literally stopped (although it matters from perspective), but that it means the perception of the time of the event was that the Earth stopped. There was no need to take the time to explain how the universe actually works, and possibly confuse some of the readers when that "book" was first created, just tell them it by how they would perceive it. ... If God can do anything, then he/she/it should be a great story teller and explainer too.
Now, the idea of science is to go on a quest for truth, but only under a few basic and natural assumptions, that it may try to question later (Yes, I said assumptions ... I am skeptical of all external knowledge, so you may call be a double agnostic theist if you like  ... But, I do believe that some assumptions are more natural that others to make and should be given priority ... such as assuming light and the communication from our eyes to our brain are both functions that almost preserve properties .... or assuming a universe exists outside of our minds is a necessary assumption to start talking about the universe ... ). Science is a human enterprise and it is about finding truth, or our perception of it, without just accepting claims, God-given or not ... we, as humans, have to "prove" them, or at least fail to disprove them after many attempts (where no "better" and/or older theory already exists to explain the same events). ... Now, I am more into the theory aspect of science, but science is not science without "reproducible" experiments and observation. 


.... Blah blah blah .... INFP - Agnostic Theist/Catholic


----------



## EllieBear

I'm (I believe) an INTP. I am agnostic. I believe in the possibility on an ultimate maker, but we cannot prove it, so it's illogical to believe in that theory alone. 

However I do not believe "God" can exist.


----------



## hulia

IXFP - Agnostic.


----------



## Alvis Oswin

I'm going to classify myself as a weirdo. I change my beliefs ever-so-frequently. However, I am always agnostic, I will say that.


----------



## Bulhakov

ENTP - full atheist, we're just very smart monkeys


----------



## AnCapKevin

INTP. Atheist-leaning agnostic, but I have some spirituality. I believe we're all spiritually connected, and I believe in the law of attraction and some things like that. I don't really know how to easily define my beliefs, and I don't put a whole lot of emphasis on spirituality, but I should meditate more.


----------



## Wonderland Sunflower

Possibly ENTP, though scientists haven't confirmed that yet!

Not believing in The Omnipotent, Omniscient, Omnibenevolent God. Those traits don't really sum up for me.
Considering the possibility of Very Potent (like, able to create universes), Very Knowledgeable and Generally Benevolent Creator. Though that universe might be someone's very first project made with Create Your Own Universe tool, which would be recently rather popular up there. With said project being currently abandoned, because the creator happened to have a better idea.
There's something perverse about thought of universe being neither the result of some random processes in energetic space thingy nor a carefully designed project, but something sloppily made and missing important features, don't you think? ^^'

As for souls, I do believe that they exists, as in, at least in the form of carriers of conscience. Or rather, I can't really imagine that after death there would be absolutely nothing, because in such case there would be no perception of time, either, and staying in such state for eternity would mean that we wouldn't even be able to be affected by death-ish thingy, or something. That would be like multiplying zero by infinity.
It's easy to say that "you don't feel anything" or something, but when you try to imagine that, it doesn't really work. Whether we would carry memories of previous lives or that would be completely cleared, I'm not really sure of, but I'd prefer it to remember at least something. ^^'


----------



## PinkiePie

ENFP

Well, I'm sort of a Deist/Christian. Somewhere in the middle. I do believe in God and the soul, but it's God's role in our lives that I'm more confused about.


----------



## outofplace

ISTJ-Conservative Christian


----------



## Adversary

INTP - (Agnostic) Atheist


----------



## Devalight

Grew up Baptist Christian, became Buddhist in 2008.


----------



## NightFire

INTP
Christian. I am very lucky to go to a church that takes the proof of Christianity and the reasoning behind it very seriously. I have studied my faith a lot and looked at atheism especially to see if it is correct (I try with all my rational might to be objective about these things) I see a theory filled with holes compared with what I believe. I think it would be the exact reversal of what many of the intp's before me have stated. I think it's really sad a lot of churches have no idea what they believe.


----------



## Knight_In_Rags

Amaru said:


> I'm Buddhist, Theravada Sect.
> 
> I believe the universe is conscious, Self aware. I haven't decided what we are in relation to the universe though.


DUDE! Fellow Theravada Buddhist!  
And we're actually one with the universe but separated by the boundaries that are our bodies.


----------



## killemdeader

xNFx, leaning ENFP here. 

I'm an Agnostic, with a Jewish heritage and a bit in practice. I don't really think we know anything about a God, if it does exist, there's really no point in being set in a point of view. I do enjoy Jewish culture though, and I can't say I felt nothing when it came to getting Bar-mitzvah'd, and recieving the tallit, and rarely during the few services I have attended. Maybe a bit SBNR, but even there I'm pretty agnostic/undecided.


----------



## xEmilyx

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (LDS for short or mormon)
I was raised in it. 
I'm an INFJ
and I've actually found that there's a LOT of INFJ guys in this church....that or I'm just surrounded by a looot of infj's lol
or there's a bunch of INFJ's in utah...
I've actually wanted to do a study on religion and personality type. hmmm
but that's my hypothesis right now is that there's a lot of infj's in the mormon church, but eh I'm not really sure I could be wrong....just an observation though.


----------



## hailfire

ISTP, raised Catholic, still Catholic, but not without question. I think question is good for a faith. As much as I can't say that I'll even have a religion tell me _what_ to do or think in any respect, I do allow it to reinforce my thoughts and actions as far as morals go. But there are things in the religion that I believe and willfully choose not to question them as it makes some things easier. And I go to church twice a year now - tomorrow will be the second time this year. So some might say I'm a bit of a loafy Catholic or something I guess. I'm willing to accept many of the beliefs others have as their own, but I just cannot stand the narrow, pushy people of any faith, especially of my own.


----------



## InspectorDoohickey

Knight_In_Rags said:


> DUDE! Fellow Theravada Buddhist!


Sweet! Every other Buddhist I know is Zen, or Mahayana. 



Knight_In_Rags said:


> And we're actually one with the universe but separated by the boundaries that are our bodies.


Yeah I was taught that, but that would mean the universe created me from itself right? And therefor created everything from itself. And the only thing *I* have to offer the universe, once I'm able to cross the boundary is my personal experience. That's our purpose, that's my purpose. That's the only reason it would need me (...My Enneagram is type 2, this is the way I think). However, the Buddha created a clear path for his followers to follow. If I follow that path, which countless have, what am I adding to the greater conscious, nothing new.

I've been searching for scriptures addressing this, but have found none.


----------



## WardRhiannon

INFP and atheist. I was Catholic for most of my childhood, then I started questioning my faith in college. I went from deist to agnostic to atheist.


----------



## iron4umx

Good topic, I was raised in a *catholic* household, then I reached to the conclusion that there was nothing, it all was an ilusion, then I became *Nihilist*, then i realized that an ilusion is something as well as nothing so i changed to *Atheist*, then I created my own religion based on lyrics from heavy metal songs, in my religion I am my own God and savior, there is no afterlife, no angels, demons or such things, the only moral code is believe in one self, yeah, it is pretty much Atheism, although, i'm still writing my own bible, I call it Bible Black.


----------



## EmpireConquered

ENTP, agnostic.


----------



## ViktorNrv

Infp.I don't believe in any religion, but I believe in a god, one different from the god in religions.


----------



## Atherys

INTP Atheist

Gods are are merely human constructs used to explain our existence with something familiar, something we humans can relate to.


----------



## Giratina

INTJ, Atheist.
Raised as a catholic by a catholic family in a community where the majority is catholic..
Enrolled to a catholic school from the nursery to high school.. 
Didn't stop me from questioning.
:dry:




iron4umx said:


> ....i'm still writing my own bible, I call it Bible Black.


Isn't "Bible black" a title of a hentai?


----------



## Sporadic Aura

I don't practice a religion. I was raised as a catholic and still appreciate some aspects of catholism, I enjoy studying other religions and the history behind religions. I also like pondering about the universe and have an open mind, but as for what I believe, I don't really have a set of beliefs. I also wouldn't consider myself an atheist or agnostic because that to me is rejecting the possibility of a god, which I don't, I think there is a good chance of some form of higher intelligence.

I'm an ENTP.


----------



## Mr. Meepers

Sporadic Aura said:


> I don't practice a religion. I was raised as a catholic and still appreciate some aspects of catholism, I enjoy studying other religions and the history behind religions. I also like pondering about the universe and have an open mind, but as for what I believe, I don't really have a set of beliefs.* I also wouldn't consider myself an atheist or agnostic because that to me is rejecting the possibility of a god*, which I don't, I think there is a good chance of some form of higher intelligence.
> 
> I'm an ENTP.


Um, atheist believe there is no God. That doesn't necessarily mean that they don't think it is possible, they could think that it is just unlikely. I mean believing in God(s) or believing there is no Gods (or even just not caring about the ideas altogether) is a different question than if you are certain there is or is no God. For instance, I am a theist, but I am also agnostic (I believe in strong agnosticism meaning I don't think it is possible to know instead of weak agnosticism which means that it is possible to know and that we just don't have enough evidence yet).
So I am an agnostic theist, basically you don't have to be gnostic to be a theist or atheist.
Agnostic theism - Wikipedia, the free ************


----------



## Aquamarine

INTJ agnostic.


----------



## Collie

INTJ here. Could be called an agnostic atheist and a secular humanist and yadda yadda, but the fact is that I don't really care. I have more important things to worry about.


----------



## Jessy Lashway

Sirius said:


> Isn't "Bible black" a title of a hentai?


Yes. Those crazy Japanese school girls. 

INTJ. I'm a theistic rationalist. It's a broad term describing those of us who believe that God exists, but awknowledges the existence of reason and logic. Consider for example that God used The Big Bang in order to create the universe(s). Most scientists and dare I say most religious people want to keep the two as far apart as possible. I find putting them together to be at least sensible.


----------



## Pyromaniac

INTJ, changed atheist.


----------



## Pyromaniac

Mr. Meepers said:


> Um, atheist believe there is no God. That doesn't necessarily mean that they don't think it is possible, they could think that it is just unlikely.


Wrong, but if that was the case, you'd still be wrong.


----------



## ThatOneWeirdGuy

This thread needs a poll. 

Agnosticism.


----------



## Mr. Meepers

Pyromaniac said:


> Wrong, but if that was the case, you'd still be wrong.


Could you expand? I mean, yes there are some definitions of atheism that try to encompass agnostics and others (such as people who think the term "God" is ill-defined) who just lack the believe in God as being atheist, but I'm trying not to use such a broad definition as, ime, many people in those categories don't identify as atheists.
I was also trying to point out that not all atheists are gnostic, there exists agnostic atheists


----------



## LibertyPrime

Either ISFP or INFJ Agnostic agnostic.


----------



## Pyromaniac

Mr. Meepers said:


> Could you expand? I mean, yes there are some definitions of atheism that try to encompass agnostics and others (such as people who think the term "God" is ill-defined) who just lack the believe in God as being atheist, but I'm trying not to use such a broad definition as, ime, many people in those categories don't identify as atheists.
> I was also trying to point out that not all atheists are gnostic, there exists agnostic atheists


Revise the ancient Greek etymology of the word; 'a', as a confix, translating to 'without' or 'lacking', and 'theos', literally 'gods'. 'Without gods', or in the context of it's usage, without belief in gods.
Thus, atheism is a lack of belief in gods. Now, this isn't to mean that atheists deny the existence of gods, so to speak; the sub-category 'strong atheism' covers that. The only meaning you may validly derive from the word atheism alone, is a lack of belief in presence, not a belief in absence.

Thus, everyone who does not believe in god, is an atheist. Those who believe there is no god, are also atheists, selectively referred to as strong atheists. This means that agnostic atheists, or those with a complete neutrality of belief, are also atheists, but seen as atheism is so typically taken as the denial of existence of a god, prefer to clarify that they don't, which effectively tends to filter out atheists to those who do deny the existence of a god, and thus the term was misconstrued.


----------



## Collie

To simplify, here's a handy-dandy graph explaining the difference.


----------



## Tony Liu

ENTJ. Strong Atheist.


----------



## Mr. Meepers

Pyromaniac said:


> Revise the ancient Greek etymology of the word; 'a', as a confix, translating to 'without' or 'lacking', and 'theos', literally 'gods'. 'Without gods', or in the context of it's usage, without belief in gods.
> Thus, atheism is a lack of belief in gods. Now, this isn't to mean that atheists deny the existence of gods, so to speak; the sub-category 'strong atheism' covers that. The only meaning you may validly derive from the word atheism alone, is a lack of belief in presence, not a belief in absence.
> 
> Thus, everyone who does not believe in god, is an atheist. Those who believe there is no god, are also atheists, selectively referred to as strong atheists. This means that agnostic atheists, or those with a complete neutrality of belief, are also atheists, but seen as atheism is so typically taken as the denial of existence of a god, prefer to clarify that they don't, which effectively tends to filter out atheists to those who do deny the existence of a god, and thus the term was misconstrued.


Although I agree with you that the original meaning of the word atheism was to mean the negation of theism, I would argue that the word (as a whole and not the sum of its parts, its parts being "a" and "theism") has evolved in meaning culturally to mean the opposite of theism (the believe in no God) and is not used to mean its original meaning (the negation of theism) that much anymore. I would argue that a words dictionary definition does not necessarily apply to the usage of the term and the usage of the term is what matters when it comes to meaning (and some agnostics that I have talked to like this meaning as it clearly separates a lack of believe from an actual belief). I get the impression that you would claim that many people are misusing the word. ... I would say that we are both right, it is just different perspectives and points on the same idea, but since this is a word in a natural language and not a word in a formal language, I prefer to let words evolve with the culture (evolve with the culture) that they are used in if that makes sense.


----------



## Pyromaniac

Mr. Meepers said:


> Although I agree with you that the original meaning of the word atheism was to mean the negation of theism, I would argue that the word (as a whole and not the sum of its parts, its parts being "a" and "theism") has evolved in meaning culturally to mean the opposite of theism (the believe in no God) and is not used to mean its original meaning (the negation of theism) that much anymore. I would argue that a words dictionary definition does not necessarily apply to the usage of the term and the usage of the term is what matters when it comes to meaning (and some agnostics that I have talked to like this meaning as it clearly separates a lack of believe from an actual belief). I get the impression that you would claim that many people are misusing the word. ... I would say that we are both right, it is just different perspectives and points on the same idea, but since this is a word in a natural language and not a word in a formal language, I prefer to let words evolve with the culture (evolve with the culture) that they are used in if that makes sense.


I agree to an extent. I wouldn't say it evolved to it's social usage, but it was misconstrued; it would be much more efficient to just stick with the actual definition, rather than diverging into sub-definitions and creating confusion, as some will still stand true to the etymologically dictated definition. 

So, I agree that definitions are not necessarily the modern usage of the word, but I wouldn't agree that the definitions be molded to misconceptions. Otherwise, we may well be using slang in formal terms.


----------



## Pyromaniac

Mr. Meepers said:


> Although I agree with you that the original meaning of the word atheism was to mean the negation of theism, I would argue that the word (as a whole and not the sum of its parts, its parts being "a" and "theism") has evolved in meaning culturally to mean the opposite of theism (the believe in no God) and is not used to mean its original meaning (the negation of theism) that much anymore. I would argue that a words dictionary definition does not necessarily apply to the usage of the term and the usage of the term is what matters when it comes to meaning (and some agnostics that I have talked to like this meaning as it clearly separates a lack of believe from an actual belief). I get the impression that you would claim that many people are misusing the word. ... I would say that we are both right, it is just different perspectives and points on the same idea, but since this is a word in a natural language and not a word in a formal language, I prefer to let words evolve with the culture (evolve with the culture) that they are used in if that makes sense.


I'll add that the usage of a term can validly determine it's social perception. But meaning is an a and not an it; there can be several meanings of a word, always one being the definition, which is of course the verity, and then there comes general informalities, jargon, slang etc.
You can argue that the misconstruing of atheism had led to a change in the meaning of it's most popular intended usage, but you can't argue that this would alter the word's definition.

For example, to a white supremacist's understanding you can argue that 'blacks' would be synonymous with words I'd rather not mention, but to the majority it remains an ethnicity or colour, as is it's originated definition.


----------



## benoticed

Collie said:


> To simplify, here's a handy-dandy graph explaining the difference.



And where must i add is the Agnostic "i dont know if a god exists" box? Im guess im between Agnostic Atheist/Agnostic Theist. I believe both in different situations. Depending on the situation. But altogether i dont know.


----------



## Mr. Meepers

Pyromaniac said:


> I'll add that the usage of a term can validly determine it's social perception. But meaning is an a and not an it; there can be several meanings of a word, always one being the definition, which is of course the verity, and then there comes general informalities, jargon, slang etc.
> You can argue that the misconstruing of atheism had led to a change in the meaning of it's most popular intended usage, but you can't argue that this would alter the word's definition.
> 
> For example, to a white supremacist's understanding you can argue that 'blacks' would be synonymous with words I'd rather not mention, but to the majority it remains an ethnicity or colour, as is it's originated definition.


Well, I think you make good points, but your argument inspires certain questions (I feel like this conversation is getting more interesting ^__^). What is the role of a definition? What is the relationship between definitions and meaning? Are there times that you can change a definition?

You said a word has only one definition, but that is not entirely true. Many words have multiple definitions, and some definitions won't show up in a standard dictionary. For example, I am pretty sure you won't see the mathematical definitions for a group, ring, or field in a standard dictionary. You may see Addition and what not simply defined though. Although, to be far, mathematics is its own language, but we sometimes mix it in with on of our natural languages. But still, other words have multiple definitions (such as the word "light") and the meaning we interpret depends on the context. On form of context is the subject matter (such as are you talking about identity and how one takes on an identity versus a conversation on more philosophical grounds). I would also argue that your audience also defines the context. I am reminded of this time where people were saying "there is no X against men" (I can't remember the exact word, so I am just going to call the word "X"). It was inflammatory and was denying the experiences of a group of people. Eventually they sociological/anthropological definition of the word (which was different that the dictionary definition outside the fields of sociology and anthropology) and what they said was no longer a problem and the claim became true. Now their argument was that the sociological definition trumps other definitions, but the problem was that most of the people they were talking to never heard that definition of the word. Now if they had say "sociological X" (hinting that the word may not mean what it means to people outside of such a field) or giving the more obscure definition first, that would be fine, but, instead, I would say that by just saying that definition trumps others, they ran the risk of spreading misinformation (when people got made with them they did clarify what they meant, but this was something that I think should have been foreseeable).

So a word can have multiple definitions (and in the last case, similar definitions that were different enough to change the meaning), but what does a definition do? I suppose we could say that a definition gives us an agreed upon meaning to a word so we can communicate with others. I imagine its goal would be to create the meaning of the word and have that meaning be a very common meaning. But what happens when the common meaning no longer matches the definition (or, in certain common contexts, the word is used in a way that does not follow the meaning derived from the definition)? Should the definition change to match this new meaning? I suppose that may depend on who makes the definition of a world, how is the language used, and what are the goals of a language? For instance, mathematics is a very formal language and one of its goals is to give everlasting truth. In order to make sure all its terminology (which most is defined by other terminology) is well defined and its theorems are always true, it can not change its definitions. You could say the same for scientific terminology, except when a change in theory and/or discover makes a certain no longer useful and/or applicable to reality. ... What about modern language? I would imagine its goal is mainly to add in the communicate of people, especially people alive today (verses people whose only current communication exists in books, which could have a preface or something alerting to the changes in meanings of some words and the cultural background/setting to give the book context). I suppose all languages are about communication, but formal languages tend to have other goals that can be applied to specific fields and their main goals may involve learning and building knowledge from the past. That may be a tool that the English language can do, but I am not sure it is its goal. I suppose it could be a goal though, but I am of the belief the main goal is to aid in the communication of people in the here and now that speak that language. ...... Well who creates definitions? The people (who speak the language)? The experts at a dictionary company? Perhaps both. Good or bad, dictionary companies alter the definitions of words over the years when they think the usage of a term has changed. According to Webster (the first dictionary that showed up on my Google search of "atheist") an atheist is "one who believes that there is no deity"
- Atheist - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
See, I win :tongue: Just kidding, I pre-concede to the point that other dictionaries and ency_c_lopedias have different definitions of a word (which brings up the question, "what definition do we take?")
Although its definition and concise ency_c_lopedia on the word atheist seem to agree with both of us (depending on how one defines disbelief)
- Atheism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

So, even now I would say it may be unclear what the definition is (I mean what dictionary should we use) and what an individual means can always have the potential to be unclear. But, I would still think that we should define these identifying words using the common meanings of those who take on such an identity to allow for effective communication when someone says, "I am _____"






For fun, I went to a philosophical website (The Stanford Ency_c_lopedia of Philosophy) assuming they would agree with you being that they need more precise meaning of the words that might be more lasting. I would not use this as an argument to say what a word should mean/be defined as in an everyday sense, but I was just interested in the philosophical background.
I should note that the article did seem to be a lot about identity and how one identifies themselves as well.

* *





At first the article agrees with you "‘Atheism’ means the negation of theism", but then seems to contradict itself by saying "the denial of the existence of God" ... it also says "Perhaps such a logical positivist should be classified as *neither a theist nor an atheist*, but her view would be just as objectionable to a theist. ‘Agnostic’ is more contextual than is ‘atheist’, as it can be used in a non-theological way, as when a cosmologist might say that she is agnostic about string theory, *neither believing nor disbelieving it.*"
More Quotes

* *





" I would suggest that if Philo estimates the various plausibilities to be such that on the evidence before him the probability of theism comes out near to one he should describe himself as a theist and if it comes out near zero he should call himself an atheist, and if it comes out somewhere in the middle he should call himself an agnostic. There are no strict rules about this classification because the borderlines are vague."
"Sometimes , at least in social contexts, it can be misleading not to say ‘yes’ or ‘no’ if some believer asks ‘Are you an atheist?’ "
"Here it has been assumed that Philo regards ‘God exists’ (vagueness apart) as an intelligible sentence to which truth or falsity can be ascribed. If he thinks that the conception of deity is so obscure or so permissive that no truth value can be ascribed to ‘God exists’, perhaps he should extend the notion of ‘atheist’ to cover his position also. ‘Agnostic’ might suggest that there is something to be agnostic about."
"Even if various philosophers or theologians use the word ‘God’ in different ways and are such that their words are quite unintelligible then they can hardly be said to defend theism. As I have suggested, a logical positivist such as the young A. J. Ayer (Ayer 1936) would have at least been less misleading if he called himself an atheist rather than an agnostic. He neither believes nor disbelieves in God, like the agnostic, but he does not think, as I take it that someone who called himself an agnostic would, that God either exists or does not exist but he does not know which."



- Atheism and Agnosticism (Stanford ************ of Philosophy)


----------



## Pyromaniac

Mr. Meepers said:


> ....


I don't have a lot of time right now, but shoot me a PM if I don't respond within a few days


----------



## Van Meter

Infj, believer in the general Biblical narrative and message


----------



## jcbrdn

ISFP - Follower of the Lord, Jesus Christ.


----------



## rarelyrachel

INFx I don't consider myself to be religious, but I love studying all of the different religions and seeing how they connect and intertwine with each other. I think that each religion contains a bit of truth, but they are all missing something very important-somehow they aren't seeing the big picture. I'm not sure what this missing piece is, but I guess that's point of religion and spirituality in general. People want to feel like they're more than upright-walking, fleshy, creatures and religion is in its own way means of feeling like something more. It is a way to find the missing piece. Just some thoughts. Oh my, I'm rambling again.


----------



## countrygirl90

I,m an ESTJ and I,m a Hindu .
I grew up hearing lots of mythological stories and teachings of Hindu religious gods and goddesses.Those epics and stories always fascinated me but they are just stories ,what I truly like is the teachings and morals reflected by them . I am specially fond of learning various Sanskrit mantras ,I recite and chant them in my mind whenever I,m having some turmoil or negative feeling within myself .It brings a feeling of peace and security in my spiritual self. 
Though I don't follow all the religious rites and customs of Hindu religion like keeping fast , going to temples or presenting offerings to god's idols in temples ,instead I prefer giving that money and food to a poor disabled or needy person which I feel is a right thing to do in my opinion. And that is the right way to please a god ,as said in every religion of the world ,god never wants materialistic offering from humans .What he really wants is ,for human to know the values of life that he has bestowed everyone of us with and treat every person ,animal and nature with respect and compassion ,do their work with honesty and positive attitude .


----------



## intjonn

Religions are like vaginas........its a great place to start out in Life but eventually you have to grow up and move on.


----------



## Pyromaniac

Mr. Meepers said:


> Well, I think you make good points, but your argument inspires certain questions (I feel like this conversation is getting more interesting ^__^). What is the role of a definition? What is the relationship between definitions and meaning? Are there times that you can change a definition?


The role of a definition is to give a legitimate, widespread meaning and understanding to a word.

That definitions ARE meanings, but do not encompass ALL meanings.

Yes. There are times that the social usage of a word is so widely used that it becomes accepted as an informal definition. Then, since the most recently coined words will belong to a lesser-studied subject, there's the changes in understanding. For example, Pluto is no longer considered a planet.
There are several criterias which can justify the changing of a definition.


* *






> You said a word has only one definition, but that is not entirely true. Many words have multiple definitions, and some definitions won't show up in a standard dictionary. For example, I am pretty sure you won't see the mathematical definitions for a group, ring, or field in a standard dictionary. You may see Addition and what not simply defined though. Although, to be far, mathematics is its own language, but we sometimes mix it in with on of our natural languages. But still, other words have multiple definitions (such as the word "light") and the meaning we interpret depends on the context. On form of context is the subject matter (such as are you talking about identity and how one takes on an identity versus a conversation on more philosophical grounds). I would also argue that your audience also defines the context. I am reminded of this time where people were saying "there is no X against men" (I can't remember the exact word, so I am just going to call the word "X"). It was inflammatory and was denying the experiences of a group of people. Eventually they sociological/anthropological definition of the word (which was different that the dictionary definition outside the fields of sociology and anthropology) and what they said was no longer a problem and the claim became true. Now their argument was that the sociological definition trumps other definitions, but the problem was that most of the people they were talking to never heard that definition of the word. Now if they had say "sociological X" (hinting that the word may not mean what it means to people outside of such a field) or giving the more obscure definition first, that would be fine, but, instead, I would say that by just saying that definition trumps others, they ran the risk of spreading misinformation (when people got made with them they did clarify what they meant, but this was something that I think should have been foreseeable).






I intended to mean that definitions are only one _branch_ of meaning, sorry for not making that clear. Of course, several words have several meanings which are dictated by context, totally agreed.


* *






> So a word can have multiple definitions (and in the last case, similar definitions that were different enough to change the meaning), but what does a definition do? I suppose we could say that a definition gives us an agreed upon meaning to a word so we can communicate with others. I imagine its goal would be to create the meaning of the word and have that meaning be a very common meaning. But what happens when the common meaning no longer matches the definition (or, in certain common contexts, the word is used in a way that does not follow the meaning derived from the definition)? Should the definition change to match this new meaning? I suppose that may depend on who makes the definition of a world, how is the language used, and what are the goals of a language? For instance, mathematics is a very formal language and one of its goals is to give everlasting truth. In order to make sure all its terminology (which most is defined by other terminology) is well defined and its theorems are always true, it can not change its definitions. You could say the same for scientific terminology, except when a change in theory and/or discover makes a certain no longer useful and/or applicable to reality. ... What about modern language? I would imagine its goal is mainly to add in the communicate of people, especially people alive today (verses people whose only current communication exists in books, which could have a preface or something alerting to the changes in meanings of some words and the cultural background/setting to give the book context). I suppose all languages are about communication, but formal languages tend to have other goals that can be applied to specific fields and their main goals may involve learning and building knowledge from the past. That may be a tool that the English language can do, but I am not sure it is its goal. I suppose it could be a goal though, but I am of the belief the main goal is to aid in the communication of people in the here and now that speak that language. ...... Well who creates definitions? The people (who speak the language)? The experts at a dictionary company? Perhaps both. Good or bad, dictionary companies alter the definitions of words over the years when they think the usage of a term has changed. According to Webster (the first dictionary that showed up on my Google search of "atheist") an atheist is "one who believes that there is no deity"
> - Atheist - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
> See, I win
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just kidding, I pre-concede to the point that other dictionaries and ency_c_lopedias have different definitions of a word (which brings up the question, "what definition do we take?")
> Although its definition and concise ency_c_lopedia on the word atheist seem to agree with both of us (depending on how one defines disbelief)
> - Atheism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
> 
> So, even now I would say it may be unclear what the definition is (I mean what dictionary should we use) and what an individual means can always have the potential to be unclear. But, I would still think that we should define these identifying words using the common meanings of those who take on such an identity to allow for effective communication when someone says, "I am _____"





I follow you.
What happens when the social perception of the word changes is the question you pose, but hasn’t that already been addressed? To repeat, I maintain a conservative stance on language, and I believe that it would be quite tumultuous to constantly adapt a word to its usage, and that it is more efficient to stay true to the original definition and create a sub-category of social terms to classify such language, which is already being done just fine.
Who creates definitions? I would argue, no one. Definitions are the pieces of a puzzle being fitted together, and the pieces are the preceding languages that serve to inspire today’s English and indeed most languages.
What definition do we take? When a word is as disputed as is that of atheism, we refer to the etymology of the word; it's origins and thus, it's fundamental nature, which in this case is indicative of a lack of belief in presence rather than a belief in absence.



* *






> For fun, I went to a philosophical website (The Stanford Ency_c_lopedia of Philosophy) assuming they would agree with you being that they need more precise meaning of the words that might be more lasting. I would not use this as an argument to say what a word should mean/be defined as in an everyday sense, but I was just interested in the philosophical background.
> I should note that the article did seem to be a lot about identity and how one identifies themselves as well.
> 
> * *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At first the article agrees with you "‘Atheism’ means the negation of theism", but then seems to contradict itself by saying "the denial of the existence of God" ... it also says "Perhaps such a logical positivist should be classified as *neither a theist nor an atheist*, but her view would be just as objectionable to a theist. ‘Agnostic’ is more contextual than is ‘atheist’, as it can be used in a non-theological way, as when a cosmologist might say that she is agnostic about string theory, *neither believing nor disbelieving it.*"
> More Quotes
> 
> * *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> " I would suggest that if Philo estimates the various plausibilities to be such that on the evidence before him the probability of theism comes out near to one he should describe himself as a theist and if it comes out near zero he should call himself an atheist, and if it comes out somewhere in the middle he should call himself an agnostic. There are no strict rules about this classification because the borderlines are vague."
> "Sometimes , at least in social contexts, it can be misleading not to say ‘yes’ or ‘no’ if some believer asks ‘Are you an atheist?’ "
> "Here it has been assumed that Philo regards ‘God exists’ (vagueness apart) as an intelligible sentence to which truth or falsity can be ascribed. If he thinks that the conception of deity is so obscure or so permissive that no truth value can be ascribed to ‘God exists’, perhaps he should extend the notion of ‘atheist’ to cover his position also. ‘Agnostic’ might suggest that there is something to be agnostic about."
> "Even if various philosophers or theologians use the word ‘God’ in different ways and are such that their words are quite unintelligible then they can hardly be said to defend theism. As I have suggested, a logical positivist such as the young A. J. Ayer (Ayer 1936) would have at least been less misleading if he called himself an atheist rather than an agnostic. He neither believes nor disbelieves in God, like the agnostic, but he does not think, as I take it that someone who called himself an agnostic would, that God either exists or does not exist but he does not know which."
> 
> 
> 
> - Atheism and Agnosticism (Stanford ************ of Philosophy)





Precisely; it contradicts itself, but I assume I’ve just now cleared things up with this.
I don’t see how you can be neither a theist nor atheist. For the same reason that everyone is either a golf player or not a golf player, the definitions of theism and atheism are universally binding and are binary. Then again, the encyclopedia takes atheism to mean the denial of a deity, in which context this would be valid, but you need only refer to the word’s etymology to refute such an understanding.
The borderlines are not vague at all; the word derives from a confix, and a main body. It’s really quite simple. Ponder as I may, I cannot conclude why this misconception is so pervasive, even on an academic level; some universities have been very harshly critiqued for their misuse of the language.

The ever-so-varied nature of language is such that you may present a hundred agreeing sources and your assertions still be illegitimate; it comes down to the reasoning of them. The nature of language, thus, reflects the nature of rationality itself, in it's most decisive form; the views of a thousand may be pitted against that of one, but the views of the one hold equal chance of validity.


----------



## ZMX

INTP.

Atheist. 100%.


----------



## Midknight5000

INFP and atheist. I was raised Christian but I started having doubts in 7th grade and made my decision not long after.


----------



## meaganpat

INTP, agnostic at times and atheist at others. I think the agnosticism (is that a word?) is just wishful thinking, though. I was raised Christian, and thus I still celebrate Christmas, but I view it as a family celebration instead of a religious one. I always feel like a bit of a hypocrite at Christmas.


----------



## Carsomyr Khan

INTP, Atheist, although I prefer non-theist since atheism has become such a buzz word. I am certain that gods exist only as an idea in the minds of humans, and exist as an attempt to explain the unknown.


----------



## arrpirate1

INFJ and a Christian, more specifically a Mormon. I absolutely love my religion. It brings so much peace and joy into my life, and helps me deal with and lessen the inevitable cycles of depression I go through every few months. Without it I know I would be lost, depressed, confused, and angry at the world. With it I find peace and happiness and hope.


----------



## Sun Lips

I'm not sure if I've replied to this, but INFP and Atheist.



Pyromaniac said:


> I don’t see how you can be neither a theist nor atheist. For the same reason that everyone is either a golf player or not a golf player, the definitions of theism and atheism are universally binding and are binary.


I agree very strongly with this. I like the way Penn Jillette puts it in this video. Agnosticism/gnosticism and atheism/theism are not on the same spectrum. I don't really see how agnosticism functions as a religious standpoint - unless one is just indifferent, I suppose?

But agnosticism is based on the question of whether a god exists, objectively. "Do you _know_ that God is real and that your god is the true god?" Most reasonably, the answer to that is going to be no. Even religious people are often aware of the possibility of being wrong (though there _are_ gnostics on both ends of the spectrum).

Atheism and theism, on the other hand, are based on the question of whether or not you believe in God. "Do you believe that God exists?" A religious person is going to say yes to this. And it seems reasonable to me that anyone who cannot assert that they do believe in god is a non-believer. They might not assert the non-existence of a god, but they aren't firm in believing there is one, either. I think that's a sect of atheism. You might not know; most people admit they don't. But you either do believe there is a god, or you don't believe there is a god. That's the difference between agnosticism and atheism.

Great video, he says it a lot better than I do.


----------



## studio.basecat

INTP / a Buddhist / Agnostic.

As you sow, so you reap.


----------



## aphinion

I'm an ENTJ, and I'm agnostic. At least right now I am. 

My mother's side is Christian, and my father's side is Atheist. I can't decide on either.


----------



## Eos_Machai

INFP, atheist. Positive to many aspects of religious belief, hostile to many others. 






Sun Lips said:


> But agnosticism is based on the question of whether a god exists, objectively. "Do you _know_ that God is real and that your god is the true god?" Most reasonably, the answer to that is going to be no. Even religious people are often aware of the possibility of being wrong (though there _are_ gnostics on both ends of the spectrum).
> 
> Atheism and theism, on the other hand, are based on the question of whether or not you believe in God. "Do you believe that God exists?" A religious person is going to say yes to this. And it seems reasonable to me that anyone who cannot assert that they do believe in god is a non-believer. They might not assert the non-existence of a god, but they aren't firm in believing there is one, either. I think that's a sect of atheism. You might not know; most people admit they don't. But you either do believe there is a god, or you don't believe there is a god. That's the difference between agnosticism and atheism.



Hmmm... But I think we should separate between believing _that_ God exists and beliving _in_ God. Having positive knowledge about something and having faith in something are quite different things. 

If God tomorrow would write the words "I'M UP HERE, YOU IDIOTS!" in mile-high letters in the sky this would not necessarily make any difference at all to the question of faith.


----------



## Sun Lips

Eos_Machai said:


> If God tomorrow would write the words "I'M UP HERE, YOU IDIOTS!" in mile-high letters in the sky this would not necessarily make any difference at all to the question of faith.


I think I'd be quite fond of God if he presented himself that way. 

I do still think there is a distinction - I'd technically say I'm an "agnostic atheist" as I don't claim to know the ultimate truth. But I do not believe there is a god.. In my mind, that means I default to non-believer. I know a lot of people disagree, though, it's a pretty sharp way to look at things. It just makes sense to me.


----------



## Masochistic Tendencies

INFP and agnostic atheist. I kind of miss being a believer but belief isn't a choice


----------



## Trajan117

INTP. I am a Muslim born and raised. I find it to be a good fit because I get to embrace all religious teachings of other faiths as being connected to the same source and so I never feel like I am restricted from exploring philosophy and the ways of other faiths or exploring the truth of the universe in general. I feel fewer people would leave their religions if they felt so liberated like I do


----------



## Blickwinkel

I suppose if I were to be honest with myself, agnostic theist. I like to believe God exists, but it also raises many questions and doubts and even fears. The prime question being, how can I trust/believe in a god that allows so many terrible things to happen in our lives if this god is supposed to be benevolent? The possible answer to that could be that God is not benevolent, but actually neutral or evil.....in which case I have no use for a god like that. I try to hold out hope that there is a good god out there, but its something I go back and forth on.

Which is funny. I actually had a dream last night about this sort of. I dreamed my dad had passed away and had come back as a ghost. He looked exactly like he did as he does now, talked and felt exactly like he does now, and the only thing that even hinted that he was a ghost was how people were ignoring him in my dream. I asked him many questions about what it was like to have passed on, and what its like on the other side. The answers he gave me were reassuring but sort of vague. Maybe even he didn't know even in death, despite claiming to have known the absolute truth while he was alive. But the one thing he did make clear was that he wasn't suffering, and that he was actually at peace. That he was okay. 

I think hearing that was more important to me than finding out if God exists or not. Yes, I still pray sometimes in hopes that God hears me, but really I want to be comforted. I'm anxious about a lot of things in life and where we're all headed and what we're doing here now, and hearing that I...that we are all going to be okay, even when we die and aren't around anymore, that really does help.


----------



## Bakedgoods

I was raised Mormon until the age of 8. Once my parents divorced there was no religion or faith in my household. I remember Sunday school but none of the teachings. All my life the subject of faith or religion has made me uncomfortable, don't know why, it just did (does). When the Mormons or Witnesses come to the door, it's takes all my strength to answer the door AND be kind, rather than run and hide in the closet. As a young adult I tried to find faith by converting to Catholicism. That did not last either. In the end I just could not believe what could not be proven to me. The idea of giving one's self over to the teachings of a book that has been changed, edited, redacted and the like over thousands of years just seems silly to me. It seems more political, religion that is, than faith based or even a belief system. I guess I just don't understand why. Why people choose to believe in a system that preaches peace and love yet it has caused more destruction and human suffering than anything else known to man. All in the name of God. I'm a Humanist/Atheist but not an angry one. To each his own, I don't judge and could care less what your belief system is or consists of. All I ask is that you treat me with the same respect and kindness you expect from me. I'm a big proponent of the Golden Rule. Furthermore, I have always found theology interesting and am always interested in learning about the different religions or faiths. Right now I am reading the Qur'an. I find it interesting that it contains stories almost identical to the Bible...go figure.


----------



## birdsintrees

INTJ - Agnostic. 

I simply can't form an opinion on something that nobody on this planet can back up with irrefutable evidence. I understand that the whole concept of faith is about believing without actual proof but that just doesn't cut it for me. I am open to the idea that a god or multiple gods can exist... I can't rule it out and I can't confirm it until I actually die. (which hopefully isn't tomorrow, I've got plans..)

The thought of an afterlife where justice is applied, good deeds are merited and bad deeds are punished and mercy is applied in abundance would be comforting though. Yet there is about as much chance that when the lights go out in my brain, I cease to exist and my body starts disintegrating and I become part of the planet again.


----------



## 22857

Enfp

I believe in God. 

I believe that we're all connected on a level of mechanics that drives a complex infrastructure between everything in this universe. 

That a religion fully complete would not even be expressible. There could be no physical communication. Spirituality at it's height is such a disconnection beyond us. The mind at its peak of understanding is grasping so much more than can ever be expressed properly. 


...so yeah, idunno, that's like agnostic right?


----------



## Juggvard

*INFJ* - atheist(Humanist)


----------



## DistractedDayDreamer

ISFP, Jehovah's Witness


----------



## Dragheart Luard

I'm INTJ and I'm atheist, I tried to read about christian religion, but it made no sense to me, and I don't believe in the existence of a God.


----------



## liberty135

Atheist & Buddhist


----------



## belis

I am an INFJ and don't practice a religion at the moment. I was baptised Roman Catholic but my parents were not particularly religious. As a teenager I decided that it was not for me because I strongly disagreed with some aspects of the doctrine. I feel that there is some sort of a 'higher power' but don't have a name for it at the moment. I may start practising a religion in the future if it feels right.


----------



## Crimsonscissors

INFP - Humanist/Agnostic/Thingamajig

I was raised Catholic by my moderate father (ESTP) and Agnostic mother (INFJ) And I'm very glad! I dislike a lot of religious teaching from all religions, but I like the fact that there are some parts that I like and I adapt them as my own. In the bible it said "A coin held close to the eye can even blot out the sun" or something like that. It's about how if you value money above all else it can make you blind to even the most important things and I really like that. I stopped believing when I was twelve, but then it was more of a disagreement with the Catholic church, not a disbelief in it. Then the "his Dark Materials" trilogy, Terry Pratchett, Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens brought me to the dark side >


----------



## Lurianar

INTP and agnostic.

I just don't believe in things that haven't been proved, but I don't deny the possibility of them existing. I just go with the flow.


----------



## Chesire Tower

I am an enneatype 5w4, INFP.

I was born into a non-religious Jewish family. I used to be an agnostic/atheist before beginning a psycho-spiritual quest, starting with existentialism - which I'm still fascinated by, which led me to start researching mysticism and Eastern philosophy. 

This eventually led me to Buddhism, which changed my conception of God from some patriarchal anthropomorphic creation
to a universal metaphysical spiritual force.
I investigated different forms of Buddhism: Zen, Tibetan - with a brief foray in to Kabbalism, 
before eventually finding my calling in SGI Nichiren Buddhism and I have never looked back.

One of the main reasons I joined PerC was because I am fascinated with the Enneagram and want to spiritually integrate it with my regular Buddhist practice.


----------



## zallla

I'm Ne-dom for sure and I'm more spiritual than religious. I believe there is God but I'm not following any particular religion, I'm more into universalism and thinking that all the main religions origin from the same.


----------



## phonethesun

ISTJ, plain agnosticism. 

I know it's common for SJs to have a set religion for its sake of familiarity, but n my experience, many SJ's also run on the principle that they don't understand everyone or everything, so they shouldn't make judgments about it merely on what they want. So I'm guessing this tendency , coupled with my undeniable pessimism, is exactly what keeps me out of the life of religion, and from ever really devoting myself to any new way of life or perception. Yep, seeing the future form here, I really can't imagine how I could be any different from how I am now...


----------



## phonethesun

Mugino Shizuri said:


> I'm INTJ and I'm atheist, I tried to read about christian religion, but it made no sense to me, and I don't believe in the existence of a God.


Strange, I'd think your Ni-dom would definitely make you see some kind of meaning in the Bible. Unless of course it all just seems to simple for your interpretations. Even me, being Si dominant and agnostic, can see that the bible has a definite meaning to it even outside of religious belief. It's mostly a way of life, explaining why populations and people act the way they do, and how to fix it all. Read some of the New testament books, they contain a lot of new ways to look at how to live your life and even gives it's own argument as to why it's the only way that works, which I know annoys many including me.


----------



## Dragheart Luard

phonethesun said:


> Strange, I'd think your Ni-dom would definitely make you see some kind of meaning in the Bible. Unless of course it all just seems to simple for your interpretations. Even me, being Si dominant and agnostic, can see that the bible has a definite meaning to it even outside of religious belief. It's mostly a way of life, explaining why populations and people act the way they do, and how to fix it all. Read some of the New testament books, they contain a lot of new ways to look at how to live your life and even gives it's own argument as to why it's the only way that works, which I know annoys many including me.


Mostly the no sense part is referred to all topics related to the existence of a superior being, miracles and similar stuff. I know that there are some useful information, but I've got useful info without reading any religious book in depth. Besides the context isn't exactly similar to the context of this century, so if you apply those meanings, first you should try to see if they pass or not to the current era. I would prefer to read other sources, because I doubt that only the New Testament can give you such key information, considering that there are lots of philosophers that can give you other clues.


----------



## theteflonslacker

please explain.


----------



## theteflonslacker

atheist. and the more I study the more I sink into it and become at peace


----------



## LibraLibrarian

Agnostic. I grew up in a fundamentalist Christian home, which was like poison for a female INTJ. Sometimes I will identify as an atheist so people realize I am not open to being thwacked on the head with their holy book. As you can tell, I still hold anger towards the patriarchal system in which I was raised. I am exploring Buddhism currently, and I incorporate some pagan practices because they feel good to me. I tend to be skeptical of most truth claims - humans understand very little about the universe or even our own brains.


----------



## Watch Key Phone

INTP, atheist. My upbringing was secular but with a smattering of Jewish and Christian traditions.


----------



## PrimroseMind

INFP here. I can't assign myself to any religion but I do believe in a God/higher power/energy/greater good/the universe or whatever you may call it.


----------



## lightwing

ISTJ - Christian

I grew up fundamentalist Baptist (no, not Westboro Baptist type fundamentalist - they're just wrong).

Currently I go to a Free Methodist church, though I believe that nearly all denominations are corrupt and have or are in the process of departing from the truth. There are few "good" churches left.

That said, what is my religion? This is what I attempt my religion to be, though I'm not very good at it: "Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world."


----------



## Recon777

INTJ - Christian.

Grew up in a new-age home, with hippie parents (ISFP mother [artist] and ESFP father [musician]). With me as a science geek who didn't really relate to either of them. Didn't really take an interest in anything spiritual, but was curious why the world's religions seemed to contradict so much and what the truth might be. Was a flaming atheist for a couple years in my early 20's.

Someone at work actually bothered to explain the Gospel message to me when I was 24, and I was quite shocked I had never actually heard it presented in a rational way before. No mysticism hocus pocus bs. Just straight up how it went, what it means, what I needed to do, and the results thereof. Very appealing for an INTJ like myself. Later on, I grew to understand and accept the Bible as axiomatic truth, and the entire world suddenly made sense, with many of what I considered life's greatest mysteries solved simply and elegantly. Again, very appealing for an INTJ.

I'm not into the mystical stuff (tongues, etc) like many are. Not into the religious stuff either (traditions, rote prayers, etc). I just want to know what is real, and go with it. For me, I don't give a rip about any subjective reasons for having the faith. Its all about knowing what is real because I think everything the Bible says is true and if that's the case, I need to adjust my life accordingly and not be so subjective about it. It doesn't matter what my personal preferences are, or how "appealing" the faith is to me. It only matters what is real. So again, as an INTJ this appeals to me a great deal.

I really do think that a lot of the denominations are heavy in one personality type or another. The Charismatic/Pentecostal churches seem to attract the F types, where the Calvinist/Baptist churches tend to attract the T types. I don't subscribe to a denomination, and I take my faith straight-up from scripture without human diluting, so my church is much smaller and more personal, and we don't have any dogmas or even pay tithes. We just study scripture, apply it to our lives, and have a fellowship together that's very tight. With only perhaps a dozen families at most in my church, there's quite a few NT types. Two of us guys are INTJ and even one of the women is INTJ if you can believe that. She and her INTP husband are great people. Our first elder is ENTJ, which makes for an excellent leader, but recently we appointed a second elder (INTJ with heavy Fe training, oddly) who brings a great deal of balance to things, and softens the ENTJ's sometimes insensitive style. I really like this group of people, and consider them family. 

As for Christianity and personality in general, I think its fairly independent. I don't think any personality is more or less prone to becoming a Christian. But then again, I believe that a person becoming a Christian is actually God's choice to influence them, rather than their own choice. Not going to debate that here but it makes sense to me and fits the observable evidence. I've seen pretty much all types within the faith. I also have a theory that the "perfect" personality is God's, and that each of our individual types are actually selective deficiencies which shape our type. So each of us has imperfections, and reduced traits, and that makes us favor this or that way of thinking. Take the classic Jung style function chart, with the colored ovals, and see how everyone has a dominant function, and 3 further functions of a lesser degree. Imagine a personality which was able to have _all eight_ functions fully developed. This in theory, would be the perfect personality, and I think that is the personality of God. Anyway, I thought that's an interesting theory.


----------



## Guiap

INTJ - Atheist
I had a catholic family and right after my first comunion, at the age of 12, I started questioning the religion, i've read a lot about different religions and none of them made much sense, so for a while I still believed in a higher power but that wouldn't judge me based on things like going to the church every sunday. Around 3-4 years later I finally came to the conclusion that there isn't enough evidence to support the existence of a god.


----------



## GentlemanKnight

INFJ

Non-Denominational follower of Jesus / Yeshua, but leaning more to Messianic Judaism.


----------



## remmycool

Is anybody collecting and organizing the responses?


----------



## Acerbusvenator

INTJ - Apathist.
My ESFP sister is an atheist, but I just don't care enough.


----------



## HouseOfFlux

INTJ.

None.


----------



## Mschievious

I am an INFJ and am a Christian. However I'm NOT religious at all. I do not agree with each religion taking their "view" of what they interpret from the bible and then slap us around with what they think is right and or wrong. I believe each of us has to find our own way, our own path. Plus in reading the bible through a couple of times, I believe the bible shows us the ultimate love story, which is more than our human minds can comprehend. For that I'm grateful, and I can rest in my faith in Jesus and our Father.

Was raised in the church of Christ, and attended until about 10 years ago. In case you wonder, yes, they've got their own set of rules they want followed to make sure one gets to heaven. 

A whole bunch of them will be quite shocked to see me there one day! hahahahaha
Shalom


----------



## MelBel

ENFP 

Protestant Christian- no denomination.
My favorite church is nature where I can talk to God among the things he made, rather that a stuffy church that starts in the morning before I've fully waken up! :wink:


----------



## Devrim

I'm an ENFJ,
I'd say I am spiritual,
A bare basic theist!

Nothing more,
Nothing less xD

I don't buy into any religious doctrine,
And I don't buy into any non-belief either xD


----------



## KaylanKonnor

INFP - Christian

I believe that God loves everyone no matter what and wants whats best for everyone, in spite of how we feel. 

 You just gotta believe.


----------



## Mschievious

MelBel said:


> ENFP
> 
> Protestant Christian- no denomination.
> My favorite church is nature where I can talk to God among the things he made, rather that a stuffy church that starts in the morning before I've fully waken up! :wink:


Your post makes me smile:happy: 
I've had (and continue to) the most sublime spiritual moments when walking and talking with God... just me and Him.
As for church... it's difficult to find one that doesn't whack you upside your head with the bible! 
Shalom


----------



## Mschievious

Mzansi said:


> I'm an ENFJ,
> I'd say I am spiritual,
> A bare basic theist!
> 
> Nothing more,
> Nothing less xD
> 
> I don't buy into any religious doctrine,
> And I don't buy into any non-belief either xD


I truly appreciate the straightforward clarity and the purity of truth in your response.
Shalom


----------



## GentlemanKnight

There is a BIG DIFFERENCE between Religion and a Relationship with God through Jesus/Yeshua.
Being a member of a church or denomination does not mean you are saved...
Just had to add that as I have read others explaining their beliefs.......


----------



## MelBel

Mschievious said:


> Your post makes me smile:happy:
> I've had (and continue to) the most sublime spiritual moments when walking and talking with God... just me and Him.
> As for church... it's difficult to find one that doesn't whack you upside your head with the bible!
> Shalom


Aww, thank you :happy:

Those are the moments, aren't they, where you are in peaceful nature, eveything else melts away, and seems to almost cease to exist, people, politics, problems, struggle, evil, etc... it's like all is well with the world and your soul during that time. Medatative time. Also, a good time to stimulate your imagination which is so helpful with writing and art, etc.
I'm with you about the church thing. Church has almost no appeal to me anymore, though I hope to find one that totally changes my feeling. SOme churches are opressive. I know what you mean. I've come to the point where I no longer have any tolerance for that. they may not mean any harm, but are capable of causing it nonetheless. 
Less rules and more love... it can be an inspiring thing, not something that weighs you down....


----------



## MelBel

GentlemanKnight said:


> There is a BIG DIFFERENCE between Religion and a Relationship with God through Jesus/Yeshua.
> Being a member of a church or denomination does not mean you are saved...
> Just had to add that as I have read others explaining their beliefs.......


Right on!


----------



## Mschievious

GentlemanKnight said:


> INFJ
> 
> Non-Denominational follower of Jesus / Yeshua, but leaning more to Messianic Judaism.


Jesus / Yeshua Amen 

Aleph Tav

Shalom


----------



## GentlemanKnight

Mschievious said:


> Jesus / Yeshua Amen
> 
> Aleph Tav
> 
> Shalom


Yes, The Old Testament is The New Testament CONCEALED,
and The New Testament is The Old Testament REVEALED.


----------



## GentlemanKnight

Mschievious said:


> Jesus / Yeshua Amen
> 
> Aleph Tav
> 
> Shalom


If you ever change your settings, please consider adding me as a friend, or sending a PM....
Thanks.....


----------



## RaidenPrime

Raised Protestant. Graduated Sunday School. Announced myself Atheist at my Sunday School graduation party, but no-one gave me crap for it since my mom wanted me to have something to fall back on in event one day I decided I needed religion in my life. So Atheist until I hit about age 21. Was showing severe signs of PTSD, got pulled to Buddhist meetings by my Buddhist neighbor at the time, because she believed the meditation would help the symptoms. Indeed it did. So I practiced several types of Buddhist meditation and explored Buddhism to see what resonated with me best. Then I got influenced by a businessman who used Taoism as part of the philosophy behind running his business, so I explored Taoism for a while, because I was intrigued by his success. Right now, I'm not really sure where I'm at. There's a lot of aspects of Buddhism and Taoism that resonate with me, but then I could tell you those were always in me before, because I always had Buddhist potential. But, I really don't know where I'm at. I don't believe in god, there's been several instances in my life where me and family have sworn to have ghost/spirit encounters. I really don't know where I'm at right now. I see a cosmos and an over-populated world that influence the cosmos development.


----------



## LucasM

Might as well come out of my shell and say Jehovah Witness. Raised in it, wasn't too serious for a bit (rote) and have had depression/self-esteem issues, questioning, and so far other paths haven't been up to snuff so am maintaining. Lots of misconceptions and I sure don't have ALL the answers. But that's about it.

INFP - Though initially thought intp and still fluctuate occasionally as an INTP on tests. Raised with a bunch of Te type siblings.


----------



## Mschievious

I wish there was a thread venting with regard to religion. However since there is not and I've not been around long enough to determine if there needs to be one, here I go.

I've been on a long, and sometimes treacherous spiritual journey determining my faith, and to be completely honest, whether I did truly believe in Jesus, God or not.

Raised in a home where the bible was used only when it could smack someone into submission, otherwise it collected dust and was useless.

College, where I followed the path of going to church so that professional people could smack me around with their interpretation of the bible. 

A divorce and learning that there are people at church that do not believe you can get divorced and if you do, you're automatically condemned to hell, why are you still here?

Then I walked a path of no faith, and made a series of heart breaking/shattering decisions. While living a midst one of those decisions, I accidentally stumbled across a pastor who did not beat people up with a bible. Being somewhat of a skeptic (Ha - understatement extraordinaire!) I thought, give him time and he'll smack people too. Wrong. He simply tells people the truth as he sees it, that God loves us, and is an ever present help in our time of need. 

After occasionally listening, with almost total skepticism living in my heart, I prayed an impossible prayer given the decision I had made and my life situation. And that is all I prayed, a simple one line prayer, that I knew was impossible, but I prayed it anyway, through tears, and total unbelief in my heart.

One year and one month later, I was living the exact thing I had prayed. 

While I completely understand and get why people are atheist, or agnostic, I came to believe in Jesus / God fully. I still do not go to church often if at all. There are not many churches who do not beat you up with their version of grace and law, their set of dogmas they conveniently pull from the scripture that fits what they want.

At this point in my life I have a solid, I'd even say strong belief and faith in Jesus, the cross, and God. With that said, I'm not interested, nor will I enter into an intellectual discussion regarding faith. Faith is just that, faith. I don't enter into intellectual discussions regarding faith because in my opinion, faith is not an intellectual pursuit.

So why the "vent" this a.m. Well.... I "liked" something on FB, made a small comment that was misread, and got bible slapped. And I thought, I get it, I totally get why people walk away from religion. I understand being an atheist, an agnostic. 

The truth for me now is my faith in God, and prayer. 

There are very very few who don't use religion as a dogma, and basically a guilt trip way to control people and manipulate them into doing what they want them to do. And that is a flat lie, and has NOTHING to do with what Jesus came to this earth for.
Sigh.

Ok, I wanted to share a pic with a saying but am too new to know how so maybe I'll save it as my avatar. :wink:


----------



## Mschievious

Uploaded as my avatar, it's a great day! hahaha


----------



## Aqualung

@Mschievious , exactly! That mirrors my experience almost perfectly. The Bible was used to attack me when I was growing up. It was never meant to be a weapon but so many dysfunctional, outspoken "Christians" misinterpret what the Bible says & scramble the message. It's no wonder that more people aren't Christians. I was told that if I wasn't trembling in fear of God everyday I would go to hell. The God I know today wants me to be at peace, not trembling in fear. Or wallowing in guilt & shame. The God I know today has taken away the guilt, shame & fear. I didn't even know why Jesus died on the cross until I was 22. I had to sidestep all the clueless people of my past to understand who God really is. And unlike so many Christians I grew up with, the more I learn about God, the LESS judgemental I am of others. Through reading the Word & prayer I gained faith & that opened up a whole new level of understanding that continues to this day. Before I had faith I was basically deaf, dumb & blind & limited to my finite human capacity for reason concerning my beliefs about God. Faith transcends that barrier. When that happened, the Bible took on an entirely new meaning. It was no longer a weapon. It's a gift. Funny but sometimes people I meet are surprised that I'm a Christian. I'm not uptight & cringing with a furrowed brow or wagging my finger at people. They expect me to act "religious", especially for an old guy. I'm just an easygoing, goofy eccentric with beliefs not rooted in this world as I once knew it. Anyway, sorry I hijacked the thread everyone, back to the original topic once again....:happy:


----------



## Hal Jordan Prime

Aqualung said:


> @_Mschievious_ , exactly! That mirrors my experience almost perfectly. The Bible was used to attack me when I was growing up. It was never meant to be a weapon but so many dysfunctional, outspoken "Christians" misinterpret what the Bible says & scramble the message. It's no wonder that more people aren't Christians. I was told that if I wasn't trembling in fear of God everyday I would go to hell. The God I know today wants me to be at peace, not trembling in fear. Or wallowing in guilt & shame. The God I know today has taken away the guilt, shame & fear. I didn't even know why Jesus died on the cross until I was 22. I had to sidestep all the clueless people of my past to understand who God really is. And unlike so many Christians I grew up with, the more I learn about God, the LESS judgemental I am of others. Through reading the Word & prayer I gained faith & that opened up a whole new level of understanding that continues to this day. Before I had faith I was basically deaf, dumb & blind & limited to my finite human capacity for reason concerning my beliefs about God. Faith transcends that barrier. When that happened, the Bible took on an entirely new meaning. It was no longer a weapon. It's a gift. Funny but sometimes people I meet are surprised that I'm a Christian. I'm not uptight & cringing with a furrowed brow or wagging my finger at people. They expect me to act "religious", especially for an old guy. I'm just an easygoing, goofy eccentric with beliefs not rooted in this world as I once knew it. Anyway, sorry I hijacked the thread everyone, back to the original topic once again....:happy:


Religion. Guns. They're the same. They're two of the greatest weapons known to man too often used by people who shouldn't be using them and for the wrong purposes.

And I'm Catholic to answer the question but hardly practicing or "practicing only because of mother who still is unable to let go of the tradition and blindly follows it"


----------



## chaosagogo

INTP, atheist.
Just because I see no real evidence of a God, and therefore, I don't want to spend the one life I have being afraid of a powerful divine being that probably doesn't exist anyway. Some people are okay with just relying on faith, which is great, but I can't do that.


----------



## Mschievious

Well once again, I'm venting regarding religion because I'm still unsure for the need for a whole new thread. I may yet create one.

I guess I'd just really like a place to come and discuss/share belief in God & Jesus with out "religion" thrown in and dogma, and the mixing of law and grace. And I'd like a place to do that were I wouldn't be slapped because of my faith, and I wouldn't be looked down on or viewed as less intelligent because I have faith. I guess what I'm wanting is the same as an Atheist or an Agnostic would want and that is to be able to hold their belief without attack from others who believe different. 

It does seem that for so long in history "Christians" attacked anyone who didn't believe as they did. Imho, they were wrong. However it's now come to a place where the attacks are reversed. Again, imho, this too is wrong.

Sigh, I guess I'll just keep coming here and occasionally venting until I decide whether I will create my thread or not. Until then, thank you because I feel I can learn from everyone and all beliefs. :wink:


----------



## SystemEater

ENTP... atheist. I see absolutely no evidence of a presiding deity of any kind, cute analogies regarding clocks and clockmakers and spiral galaxies aside.


----------



## Tru7h

You know, I have been exploring into contradictions with the Bible and information that supports it and all I have to say is I am always reminded of a quote I heard that really resonated truth with me:

_"There is a big difference between what you see and what is."
_
I personally like to modify that to the following:

_"There can be a big difference between what you see and what is." 
_
Allowing yourself to be open-minded has its benefits, but sometimes ignorance is bliss since trying to understand ALL of the information is just draining time and energy from your life.


----------



## bombsaway

ISFJ Atheist. 

This blog post pretty much sums up what my reasons would be.

I used to identify as agnostic but a run in with a few particularly bad Christians made me realise the importance of identifying as an atheist. Obviously not saying all religion and all christians are awful but I cannot see the church as a force for good. Basically, I'm not going to get up on my soap box and preach that everyone should throw away their religious texts etc but I am going to stand up against things I perceive as morally wrong and unfortunately, quite a lot of those things are preached in various religious organisations.


----------



## Mycroft H

INTJ- Atheist. I was raised a Roman Catholic but I set out to study my faith and strengthen it. My moral code and my strict adherence to logic would not be contradicted. (Pesky little things, they are) I still live with many of the moral ideas of RC but I do what feels right with my Fi and Ti.


----------



## absyrd

I am an atheist.

I did not come to this conclusion lightly. In fact, it may be the most emotionally harrowing topic of my life so far. But atheist it is.


----------



## Vianna

I am agnostic ENFP. I don't very much like churches, but I do personalize with some of asian religions such as buddhism. I am very interested in meditation, their viewing of health, psychology and lifestyle.


----------



## absyrd

SophiaDeep said:


> I am agnostic ENFP. I don't very much like churches, but I do personalize with some of asian religions such as buddhism. I am very interested in meditation, their viewing of health, psychology and lifestyle.


If I had to pick a religious lifestyle, Buddhism would totally be it. I would just cut down a little bit on the enlightenment/karma/dharma/reincarnation crap. Other than that, it's a perfectly reasonable lifestyle.

Also, I don't think Buddhism has been the origin to a single war in human history. Correct me if I'm wrong, smarter-people.


----------



## Vianna

absyrd said:


> If I had to pick a religious lifestyle, Buddhism would totally be it. I would just cut down a little bit on the enlightenment/karma/dharma/reincarnation crap. Other than that, it's a perfectly reasonable lifestyle.
> 
> Also, I don't think Buddhism has been the origin to a single war in human history. Correct me if I'm wrong, smarter-people.


Well I think the enlightenment is pretty simple and realistic thing. I bet a lot of people imagine an enlightenment like you'll be hit with a super bright spiritual light and everything will suddenly make a sense, but in budhism enlightenment means you've freed your mind from prejudices and blind "ego block", which holds us back from seeing the world as it is. When you'll free your mind to all the possibilities and you'll see the world as it really is. So in budhism the enlightenment is opening up the mind. If you're an Ne dominant I think it has to be pretty close to your pattern of thinking. Karma also meakes a good sense. You will think negative, do the negative things you'll will create a negative energy around you. It makes a perfect sense to me, everything is energy, we are energy, if this theory works for electricity why not for human's society? Just simple physics I believe. What I don't like about budhism is, that it's a basicly a relegion built on a theory how to become spiritualy and physically free, but it has rules and prohibitions anyway. I understand, that people need them to know, what to do, but if someone wants to be really free, he should have a space to create moral standards in his own according to what is good and willing for his own self to discover the true inner peace and way to freedom.


----------



## absyrd

SophiaDeep said:


> Well I think the enlightenment is pretty simple and realistic thing. I bet a lot of people imagine an enlightenment like you'll be hit with a super bright spiritual light and everything will suddenly make a sense, but in budhism enlightenment means you've freed your mind from prejudices and blind "ego block", which holds us back from seeing the world as it is. When you'll free your mind to all the possibilities and you'll see the world as it really is. So in budhism the enlightenment is opening up the mind. If you're an Ne dominant I think it has to be pretty close to your pattern of thinking. Karma also meakes a good sense. You will think negative, do the negative things you'll will create a negative energy around you. It makes a perfect sense to me, everything is energy, we are energy, if this theory works for electricity why not for human's society? Just simple physics I believe. What I don't like about budhism is, that it's a basicly a relegion built on a theory how to become spiritualy and physically free, but it has rules and prohibitions anyway. I understand, that people need them to know, what to do, but if someone wants to be really free, he should have a space to create moral standards in his own according to what is good and willing for his own self to discover the true inner peace and way to freedom.


My beef with enlightenment is that once I discovered and attempted to eliminate the ego block within myself, I was unable to see other people the same way. They were just robots functioning by some non-genuine self-ordained impulse. It was a really baffling and terrifying and lonely feeling to walk to the cafeteria at my college and watch others communicate the day after I had "realized" that the ego was a complex system formed within what is merely a self-sustaining biological organism.

To me, that isn't enlightenment. It's oblivion. It's disconnection when I should be connecting. It's mindlessness when I should be experiencing a calming mindfulness.

Perhaps I did it wrong xD


----------



## Vianna

absyrd said:


> My beef with enlightenment is that once I discovered and attempted to eliminate the ego block within myself, I was unable to see other people the same way. They were just robots functioning by some non-genuine self-ordained impulse. It was a really baffling and terrifying and lonely feeling to walk to the cafeteria at my college and watch others communicate the day after I had "realized" that the ego was a complex system formed within what is merely a self-sustaining biological organism.
> 
> To me, that isn't enlightenment. It's oblivion. It's disconnection when I should be connecting. It's mindlessness when I should be experiencing a calming mindfulness.
> 
> Perhaps I did it wrong xD


I can relate to this so much! I tried to view the things the way they are, view the people the way they are without any idealisations...just simple natural trues and now I am fighting with feelings of total emptiness of entire existence which makes me feel almost panicly scared. I think discovering these things without some good spiritual leader and developing yourself to understand and accept them is very dangerous for your mental health and happiness.


----------



## absyrd

SophiaDeep said:


> I can relate to this so much! I tried to view the things the way they are, view the people the way they are without any idealisations...just simple natural trues and now I am fighting with feelings of total emptiness of entire existence which makes me feel almost panicly scared. I think discovering these things without some good spiritual leader and developing yourself to understand and accept them is very dangerous for your mental health and happiness.


I was able to escape that thought train through simple logic. See, if this total emptiness of entire existence frightens you, then it's just a continuation of the narrative stream of consciousness you always belonged to. Nothing has changed except your perception, and this perception is one that causes you distress. Distress causes powerful negative emotions and mood changes within the human psyche. Thus, you have not "escaped" reality. You are merely responding to the possibility of one particular worldview. In reality, there is no "correct" perception. People haven't changed, you haven't changed, it's merely your thoughts and emotions that have changed, and that's the pattern of human nature that will never break.

This ended the nightmare for me. If you want further explanation, feel free to ask me anything, because I don't think I articulated that as best as I could have.


----------



## PoosyWrecker

Raised without religious beliefs, Christian convert for about 2 years until further study into religion and history. Atheist for the last 9 years.


----------



## Vianna

absyrd said:


> I was able to escape that thought train through simple logic. See, if this total emptiness of entire existence frightens you, then it's just a continuation of the narrative stream of consciousness you always belonged to. Nothing has changed except your perception, and this perception is one that causes you distress. Distress causes powerful negative emotions and mood changes within the human psyche. Thus, you have not "escaped" reality. You are merely responding to the possibility of one particular worldview. In reality, there is no "correct" perception. People haven't changed, you haven't changed, it's merely your thoughts and emotions that have changed, and that's the pattern of human nature that will never break.
> 
> This ended the nightmare for me. If you want further explanation, feel free to ask me anything, because I don't think I articulated that as best as I could have.


You're right nothing actaully changed expect my thoughts and emotions. I know this, but I just can't regulate the negative thoughts. I just wish I could go back to my old perception of world and never experiment with such things. Since I lost the sense of meaning of the world I try to return it to myself, reread texts from budhism, other philosophies and I just try to find some concept to believe in, but it seems I just can't go back. :-/ I really made a terrible mistake when I tried to understand the things beyond my understanding.


----------



## absyrd

SophiaDeep said:


> You're right nothing actaully changed expect my thoughts and emotions. I know this, but I just can't regulate the negative thoughts. I just wish I could go back to my old perception of world and never experiment with such things. Since I lost the sense of meaning of the world I try to return it to myself, reread texts from budhism, other philosophies and I just try to find some concept to believe in, but it seems I just can't go back. :-/ I really made a terrible mistake when I tried to understand the things beyond my understanding.


"Knowledge does not enrich us; it removes us more and more from the mythic world in which we were once at home by right of birth." - Carl Jung

Do not be discouraged for your insight. Find a way to use it. What are some realizations that you have made?


----------



## Vianna

absyrd said:


> "Knowledge does not enrich us; it removes us more and more from the mythic world in which we were once at home by right of birth." - Carl Jung
> 
> Do not be discouraged for your insight. Find a way to use it. What are some realizations that you have made?


Well I realised, that the world we live in itself is an illusion. The illusion created by humanity such as moral standards, laws, philosophies... Everything is basicly an ilusion of someone else' mind. So our society can't be called real, or true, becuase it represents the existence of ego block. And after this I felt like I discovered something great, that can make me free, but I also started to feel lonely and there came the doubting if the reality itself is really real and doubting what is the fake and untrue illusion and what is real. I realised I can never know what is real and what is just an illusion, becuase I am trapped in the known sense of reality and I can't get out from it, which made me feel I am trapped in reality and can never be actaully free. So I feel like I am trapped in reality, that is not real... And it's scary as hell.


----------



## absyrd

SophiaDeep said:


> Well I realised, that the world we live in itself is an illusion. The illusion created by humanity such as moral standards, laws, philosophies... Everything is basicly an ilusion of someone else' mind. So our society can't be called real, or true, becuase it represents the existence of ego block. And after this I felt like I discovered something great, that can make me free, but I also started to feel lonely and there came the doubting if the reality itself is really real and doubting what is the fake and untrue illusion and what is real. I realised I can never know what is real and what is just an illusion, becuase I am trapped in the known sense of reality and I can't get out from it, which made me feel I am trapped in reality and can never be actaully free. So I feel like I am trapped in reality, that is not real... And it's scary as hell.


I understand exactly where your fear is coming from. But remember this: your perception that reality is just an illusion is just one single perspective among millions. Defining reality as an illusion ("deceptive appearance or impression") is, in itself, ascribing HUMAN concepts to what we both know is something that the human consciousness cannot truly comprehend. To say that it is an illusion you can not escape is an unhealthy and pessimistic perception if you let it linger for too long.

You feel like you are trapped in reality... because you are trapped in reality! I'm trapped in reality! My dog is trapped in reality! We're all trapped in reality :tongue:. Learn to laugh at your elevated awareness. We're all in this stupid bullshit together. Endear those around you, because they are what this trapped reality offers us. This illusion can be fun even if you are aware of it!





 - This man gets it. And it's okay


----------



## AustenT09

Good grief! That whole exchange has totally gone over my head, haha.


----------



## susiesusie

ISFP and agnostic, or as I like to call myself..a fence-sitter. There is no hard proof either way whether there is, or whether there is not a deity.


----------



## The Nerdette

INTP Muslim


----------



## purrmonsterr

INTx - Raised Christian until I had a choice... I don't practice any religion but I suppose I could consider myself atheist, although buddhism most closely aligns with my ideals.


----------



## SpartanKendoka

Type:ENFJ

Believe:Agnostic

I am of the belief that religions are a philosophy/mythology. That is not to say that they don't have merit, but that they are instead fictitious recreations to help rationalize and justify why we act and should act the way we do in socially constructed civilizations. As a result of this the idea of an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent deity isn't a necessary inference.


----------



## Debaser

I'm an ENTP and an Agnostic Atheist/Deist. Why Atheist/Deist? Because half the time I don't believe in a god at all, and the other half of the time I believe in a supernatural force that set the laws of nature in motion and has not interfered since. Sometimes I think it's more like such a force exists, but that one day we will be able to understand it with science like we do all sorts of things now that we didn't centuries and millennia ago.

Oh, and organized religion is complete and total bullshit that was invented for no other reason than to control the masses. To quote Mark Twain, "Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool." If you need that structure in your life to get by, fine. But please, just don't push it on the rest of us.


----------



## Debaser

SophiaDeep said:


> Well I realised, that the world we live in itself is an illusion. The illusion created by humanity such as moral standards, laws, philosophies... Everything is basicly an ilusion of someone else' mind. So our society can't be called real, or true, becuase it represents the existence of ego block. And after this I felt like I discovered something great, that can make me free, but I also started to feel lonely and there came the doubting if the reality itself is really real and doubting what is the fake and untrue illusion and what is real. I realised I can never know what is real and what is just an illusion, becuase I am trapped in the known sense of reality and I can't get out from it, which made me feel I am trapped in reality and can never be actaully free. So I feel like I am trapped in reality, that is not real... And it's scary as hell.


...Schizophrenia? Hallucinogens? Or just super deep philosophical thinking?


----------



## Pau7

ISFP and Christian. I'm not very religious, though.


----------



## Kysinor

absyrd said:


> So you just lost your faith? What caused the leap to such sudden use of logic?


Human ancestry.


----------



## ScientiaOmnisEst

INTP Buddhist-Pandeist


----------



## Modal Soul

ENTP and i'm a firm believer in Based God


----------



## .17485

ISFP and I'm a christian


----------



## Meekers

INFJ and atheist/apatheist. Raised Catholic.


----------



## MRH3LLMAN

INTP and I'm an Atheist but roughly follow Humanism and Stoicism.


----------



## Jessica1173

I was raised Christian- Baptist and Charismatic-- and I am still a very committed Christian.


----------



## Jessica1173

123itsmarie said:


> I'm an EN?P and I'm Catholic. I was raised atheist but I always believed in God.


My dad was raised atheist or agnostic and became a Christian later in life- right after I was born. He is an ISTJ. He is not a typical church going believer and that has always given me hope that I don't have to fit the mold to be a Christian. My mom is an XNFP and she was raised nominal Christian to agnostic. She became a Christian around the same time as my dad. It really changed their lives. Every sibling in my dad's family ended up divorcing but my dad did not. I am really proud of my parents and how they really do practice as well as preach their faith to my sisters and I.


----------



## KaiteW

I am an ENFP and I'm a strong follower of Christianity, nondenominational. 

I grew up in an atheist household, but began to follow Christianity/God/Jesus.


----------



## Jessica1173

purrmonsterr said:


> INTx - Raised Christian until I had a choice... I don't practice any religion but I suppose I could consider myself atheist, although buddhism most closely aligns with my ideals.


I had an exploratory time in my life with religion. I read some things about Buddhism but always hated the push to be good in that faith without Jesus, as well as the detachment from desire. I did not like that it was all created by a man who abandoned his family and never really accomplished anything as far as making the world a better place. It is not even sure what he actually taught outside of the tradition which was handed down over a very long period of time and finally written down hundreds of years later ( I believe). I am not saying you are wrong in believing what you do. I don't mean to be offensive it was just never a fit for me.


----------



## question my existence

I'm an INFP and a deist, was raised pentacostal.


----------



## Blacktron109

I'm an INTJ and an atheist.


----------



## Faunae

I believe in the power of the universe (sheesh, that sounds dramatic, huh?). Organisms are an expression of the universe; we are all the same, simply taking on different forms and intelligences. So I place a lot of importance on being kind to every living thing, as I think that sabotaging Nature is, essentially, sabotaging myself.


----------



## SoulRefugee

XSTP, Atheist/Agnostic. Was raised catholic until I was 12 and we stopped going. I had a time period where I was trying out different faiths (Orthodox & Non Denom Christianity) but in reality, I couldn't convince myself to believe in anything. I'm still open if there is proof out there that could possibly change my view. What makes laugh though is thinking how my family is going to react at the idea of me more than likely not getting married in a church :laughing:.


----------



## Grandmaster Yoda

intp agnostic, Eastern Orthodox Christianity. Started my own religion and it was quite successful for a few days before being dismantled and it is still mentioned today.


----------



## Torrnickel

INTJ deist, but raised Lutheran.


----------



## nebnobla

Agnostic; insufficient data for a meaningful answer [as to whether religion has realistic merit or not].


----------



## AST

Orthodox Christianity, although I find organized Christianity to be a massive bastardization.

I'm an ISTP 8w9.


----------



## Melogene

I'm a Roman Catholic INFP. I grew up around non believers, but a Christian church invited me to attend their worship service when I was younger. Basically, I acquired plenty of morality and values from them more than my family so I've got lots of respect to people like them. It is likely to always tear me down whenever I encounter immoral Catholics or Christians because I do look up to them to the point of giving me hope that they are the people of a better world. When I'm on my younger teenage years, I started to abandon any religion for some specific reason. But now I'm trying to go back deeper spiritually in the perspective of an Agnostic.


----------



## piscesfish

INFJ Jew


----------



## RiseAgainst55

INFP, agnostic, but leaning towards unitarian universalist


----------



## Super-Yoshi

ITSJ. Raised in a non-religious family who could care less if God existed or not. But then I converted to Mormonism. Love the church but the people that live around me frequently drive me nuts.


----------



## theredpanda

ENTP Christian- I believe that love is the center of the religion and that love is the true religion- I'm not a legalist at all.


----------



## Kacamata

INTP - Follower of Jesus (e.i. Christian)

My parents were missionaries, so I got to see what it was like, firsthand, to be Christians genuinely living for God. My parents taught me to think for myself, never forced their beliefs on me, told me I didn't have to go to church if I didn't want to, and basically gave me the freedom to choose for myself. I'd always been that annoying child in Sunday school who asked difficult questions, I was a bit of a skeptic. I didn't really have a faith until a couple of years ago, when I had some struggles with God. Now, after long considerations and struggles, I've given my life to Jesus. I'm doing my best to live out what I believe in, so that it's not just a set of rules as some people assume, but a lifestyle. 

Yes, whenever I hear about how hypocritical Christians are, I cringe. I hope I won't ever, ever be hypocritical.
I still give my Bible Study leaders headaches from my difficult questions now, haha....


----------



## DeadlyRefridgerator

ITP - Atheist


----------



## Hollow Man

Skeptial christian because i trust a lot of christians....though, i trust a lot of other people too.ISFJ...more accurately this is GLAD TO BE ALIVE AND EXISTENCING and maybe agnostic.


----------



## DropDeadDollFace

ENFP, raised in a Catholic family, atheist


----------



## conflictingdusk

ISTJ, still staying close to my family's religion (Buddhism), but I'm slowly fading out of it.


----------



## Lexicon Devil

Deist is my outlook. I was raised Lutheran as a child and went to a fundamentalist Christian church during my teenage years. Then I started to think for myself. My non-Christian friends and family members love for me made me realize that they will not go to a place of eternal torment when they die. I still have Christian friends and family members of course both evangelical and mainline.

I'm very much into eastern philosophy.


----------



## TheINFJ

INFJ and Christian.


----------



## Raichu

INTP, raised Catholic, currently non-religious. I don't like to call myself an atheist because I don't like to be associated with atheists because atheists have a reputation for being pretentious assholes.


----------



## hannahgracex

ENFP, and I'm agnostic.


----------



## ChaosEpsilon

I'm a Holy Ghost filled, demon-chasing, Bible-believing, tongue-speaking Christian

ISTP.


----------



## Just a Fox

Somewhere between Atheist and agnostic, basically if there is a god and I've led a good life (which I plan to anyway) then I don't see any reason he would prejudice against me for not believing in him and if not then its oblivion for me whatever I believe now. I guess religion would be a good bet if A. There weren't so damn many of them and B. I can't see myself ever being convinced as its a win - win situation. Also I let others believe whatever they want as long as they don't force it upon me.

istj


----------



## Valkyrie_feathers

INFP - Agnostic, similar values as Buddhism, though


----------



## ai.tran.75

Enfp- Agnostic -as in I don't know nor do I care if god exist 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Praealtan Mind

INFP - Catholic all the way. When you have felt a Eucharistic Procession while chanting in Latin, at the end of two weeks of being out in a beautiful secluded northern valley... Well, it rather feels like there's a God.

Also, there are a few things that don't hurt... Me being a more logically inclined INFP, there's the fact that I think my religion can be explained with reason better than every other one I've studied; I've studied Buddhism, Confucianism, Hinduism, Islam, Paganism, etc. In fact, I'm reading the Qur'an for the third time now. However, all of them fall short in my mind - they all have issues better resolved by the teachings of Jesus Christ. 

There's also my natural philosophical lean. When one has studied every relevant (and some non) philosopher under the sun, then studies Christianity, one generally comes to the same conclusion as St. Justin Martyr (read about him!); Christianity is the ultimate philosophy. In it, you find The Good, The True, and The One. Not to mention The Beautiful.

(All this study, by the way, came from a simple thought process; The question of religion is the most important question of humanity. I would explain, but I currently have too little time. I'll explain later if anyone asks for an explanation.)


----------



## spookyfornever

INTP, Athiest.
Sick of people that act like athiests are amoral mosters. The way I see it, I don't need some cosmic law or threat of eternal suffering to be a good person. And I can't stand people that complain about religion, especially other athiests that bitch about division of church and state. :\Live and let live, we'll figure it out when we die.


----------



## codydraco

I'm a Gnostic INFP.


----------



## codydraco

BleuBlake said:


> INFP. Raised chatholic, then atheist, now "something". I see the spirituality as something as free and personal, i am generally suspicious about institutionalized/dogmatic religions, however i find myself in certain ideas of pantheism and of zen buddhism.


I agree with what you said about institutionalized religion and I find Buddhism very interesting.


----------



## b_h

ISTP: Mainly atheist with a dash of Zen Buddhist teachings that resonate with me.


----------



## Stavrogin

INFJ - Eastern Orthodox Christian. I find it to be very fulfilling philosophically and theologically while being historically consistent and true to its self. But I must confess I can't relate to many who share my faith because I feel many of them don't understand the things that really make it stand out.


----------



## metaphor

INFP and agnostic and secular humanist (philosophy)


----------



## mikan

I'm an atheist.
I don't believe in a God, and religion is a waste of time. Who needs to be told what's right and what's wrong?


----------



## Draki

INTP I'm christian on the paper.. but I'm agnostic


----------



## HeellooooooEvrbdy

ENFP, agnostic atheist.


----------



## VersatileExplorer

INTJ (not definitively so yet)

I was raised as a Catholic. I even went to a Catholic school from preschool to 5th grade. I've been agnostic since middle school. I've identified as atheist for 1 - 2 years. 

I've never thought one religion was more right than another. I always thought it was silly how people were anti-other religions. Typically the reason people identify with a particular religion is because that's what they were exposed to at a young age.

Since high school I've viewed religion as a cultural thing. I would respect it and may even be tempted to learn about it, but I didn't have to believe it. I admire those who have "their own relationship with God(s)" versus trying to be the "perfect" [insert religion here]. I've never had any qualms with the concept of God. I have never and will never say God does not exist to a person who believes. Technically I can't disprove most things, but others can't really prove them either.

I just can't (what I perceive as) blindly believe in something with no factual evidence to suggest it's true. There's so much hypocrisy and inconsistency. As far as written text goes, I think it reflects subjective cultural norms during the times they were written by (humans), so I don't think it could be the most accurate representation of the "word of God". Okay I'll stop now. Warm and fuzzies guys... :tongue:

I think the concepts associated with religion can be good coping mechanisms for people. For example, many people have issues dealing with mortality (whether heaven exists or not). I don't have a problem with the idea that there's no "afterlife". I also think there's some intriguing evolutionary psychology theories.

Edit: I realized I kind of wrote more then was asked for.I probably shouldn't, but I'm leaving it darn it.


----------



## Emerson

ENTP, Jewish, British Reform.


----------



## Mamoru

INFJ. Raised in a Christian household, but I'd be an agnostic deist I guess, though I don't really identify myself with any label


----------



## Agelastos

INTP. Raised in an agnostic/"spiritual but not religious" household. 
Ignostic/agnostic atheist with a fondness for Indo-European religions (including the Dharmic faiths).


----------



## Northance

ESFJ atheist. Raised as a Christian but never really went to church, or prayed. Fascinated by Buddhism.


----------



## Magnus von Grapple

Agnostic atheist.


----------



## Sevenblade

INTJ. Raised in religion - very traditional, conventional lifestyle - and kicked the whole thing to the curb early on. I refused to attend any prayer groups, services, youth groups, etc., from my elementary school days, and despised it all from ~4. 

"Explored" different religions, partly out of spite, perhaps... I think I'm growing tired of it all.


----------



## ThoughtfulThinker

I guess I am one of the view INTPs that are not some form of atheist, but I probably would be if I hadn't been introduced to Jehovah's Witnesses. I am by no means one yet but it's a goal. 

Here is a website they have that sums up what they are all about: www.jw.org 

Unlike most churches they don't have a pope or anything like that and the whole organization is one not a bunch of random subchurches with different beliefs under the same title. Oh and they are funded strictly by donations to make literature among other things. The people are not paid either. So yes I think this is the right course for me.. 

Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using Tapatalk


----------



## mirrorghost

INFP

agnostic with witchy/occult tendencies.

i wasn't really raised with religion. my mom occasionally dragged me to her parents' church but it was uninteresting to me and i just don't like organized religion. my dad isn't religious, he just talks about the energies of light and dark and reads about buddhism. he told me that he felt that spirituality and patriotism are private as opposed to public things and i agree.


----------



## TootsieBear267

I love studying religion and learning how different religions can be so organized and adaptable. But I'm one of the biggest anti-theist you'll ever meet. 

ENTJ atheist.


----------



## COcowboy

ENTP - Paul following Christian (non-denom is its own denom nowdays). Raised agnostically.


----------



## Reim Antoinette

Agnostic is probably the closest 'real' term, though I've always prefered the 'Nay-theist' trope, which would be acknowledgeing that there is some sort of 'higher being' but not worshipping them for whatever reason. Still, it's not perfect. So, agnostic. I really don't care whether or not there's a god or what they want. 

I was raised in a fundementalist Christian family, though I think I only 'believed' out of fear, not genuine belief. I always wondered why I had to believe all of this stuff and why God wanted me to spend my Sundays with a bunch of people I disliked. Honestly, I think that Christianity kinda screwed me up.


----------



## So Long So Long

ENTP, some vague state of being in which I believe in the Judeo-Christian God.


----------



## Lyft

INTJ,
Agnostic, non-religious atheist. I'm good at creating mouthfuls.

I was raised in a Evangelical Catholic household, but rarely attended church. There was a brief time spent in a Lutheran school (kindergarten) which later kicked me out for disrespecting the church customs. Homeschooling kept me segregated from thought, and free internet access, but I never put much in store by religion nor its spirituality; not even fully recognizing it. Around the age of seven, I came to terms with my atheism and what it meant in regards to my family's impression of me. 
I don't feel a connection to spirituality, the supernatural or, concisely, that which is not proven.


----------



## GisselleHelena

INFJ here. I was raised just a "believer" in a catholic culture, so I was able to explore by myself. Then I discovered deism, which was very convenient to my struggle against the falseness of churches. But currently I'm studying with Jehovah's Witnesses and I feel I've found the answers I had been strongly looking for . So I'm not baptized, but I feel part of them anyway.


----------



## blood roots

ENTP, Atheist/Agnostic/IDC ultimately. Raised Catholic but wasn't logically feelin it.


----------



## emmamadden

ESTP Agnostic. I don't believe in a higher power, but I don't reject the possibility either. No one knows for sure, after all.


----------



## GoosePeelings

IxTP

Something between ignostic and apatheist, I generally don't care.


----------



## Hollz22

INFJ and Christian. 
I love church and being involved in the church. I really struggle with the people, i've seen some awful people abuse their positions. Society drives me crazy, but I love people when I get a chance to known them as individuals. People as a whole make the church and christianity seem like a joke and that really bothers me, but when you meet christians one on one and truly get to know them, I understand them better, and why they do the things that they do. 
I grew up in the Catholic church and even attended a very legalistic christian school, so I have seen the awful things the church and its people have done. I also strongly believe in Justice, so when people get away with destroying others, and being the reason those people never want anything to do with the church ever again, it makes me very angry. 
It's very complicated, but I will never walk away from God, even if the people in the church have done a countless amount of damage to me. 
I also have the gift of prophecy, which I think is totally part of INFJ as well, with our introverted intuition.


----------



## Lunar Lamp

INFP / Agnostic 

Leaning towards agnostic theist. I can't be sure if there is a higher power, but I kinda believe in ghosts, so the possibility of a divine spiritual being kind of comes with it, in my mind. I did go to a Catholic school, which might have influenced me even though I'm not really religious...


----------



## Jenko

ENTP I guess agnostic because I dont deny that maybe there is a high power, but something more like energy or somthing natural, not gods... I was raised christian but about 11 years old I stopped believing cause I gave myself a time to think about it!


----------



## lawsfallmute

INTJ, spiritual atheist. I have the word 'ἄθεος' tattooed at the back of my neck.


----------



## Paxis

INTJ
Agnostic Spiritualist


----------



## Fenty

ENTP Jehovah Witness


----------



## haephestia

ENFP. I was raised in a fundamentalist evangelical household and was forced under loads of lovely emotional blackmail and borderline physical abuse to attend church (to the point that I remember at 11 being physically carried to and thrown in the car). Needless to say I can't stand any tenet of how Christianity is practiced in the modern world and will never support anything to do with that religiosity. Christ seemed like a pretty cool g but screw Christianity. 

At this point I'm experimenting in a very eclectic pagan naturalistic kind of viewpoint. Nature is beautiful, space is beautiful, that probably means something and if not, I'm living a good life regardless and I think that should be all that matters.


----------



## xLeonhart

We can only know that we know nothing. The assumption that science delivers objectivity to us is a belief itself. I, personally, do not believe in any higher-beings that judge and control us. I do, however, believe that our minds are the rulers, "Gods" our internal worlds.


----------



## DaBronco

ENTP. More agnostic than anything, there's really no way to know. 

Recently at church (Christian church), I found a "plot hole" in the bible. Jesus condemns those who betrayed him to the Romans for the purpose of being crucified. (John 18). But if it was god's ultimate plan for him to be crucified, why were the actions that led to him being crucified condemned? If those who betrayed him did not betray him (and therefore did not sin), then Jesus is never crucified, and Christianity is dead before it even starts. Basically this is a reason I believe that man is fallible, man put the bible together (just like any "holy book") and its possible that the bible is fallible because of this. 

I believe that religions can provide a moral code, and if there is a god, he's smart enough to know that there's really no way for us to know based on old texts that people with ambiguous motives may have assembled (no matter the religion).


----------



## Glory

ordinary person... nothing fancy.


----------



## DaBronco

^ Someone else is on here!! WOOHOO!


----------



## Glory

wut


----------



## Squirrel

INTJ - Roman Catholic


----------



## DaBronco

For some reason, I am thinking that xxFJ is infinitely more likely to be more religious than an xxTP


----------



## pagodite

Istp. Atheist. I was catholic but turned atheist my freshman year of high school.


----------



## perpetuallyreticent

ISFP, Agnostic.


----------



## TheProphetLaLa

ESFP Agnostic.


----------



## naburu

xLeonhart said:


> We can only know that we know nothing. The assumption that science delivers objectivity to us is a belief itself. I, personally, do not believe in any higher-beings that judge and control us. I do, however, believe that our minds are the rulers, "Gods" our internal worlds.


See I respect this here so much for so many reasons. Respect dough. I am a Christ consciousness christian raised unlabeled who practices yoga and see's divinity in all cultures and goodness, but one love, and biggups to you for what you said about subjectivity.


----------



## vonunov

ISTP. 

As far as the question of deity: Agnostic and negative atheist. 

- Believe it's impossible or irrelevant to know whether there is a god
- By default, have no belief that there is a god, but don't positively believe that one can't or doesn't exist (on what basis would I?)

I lack faith, but I admire and somewhat follow the practical sides of things like Buddhism, Taoism, and Stoicism. 
LaVeyan Satanism is a fun idea and the scripture makes for good lunchtime reading, but it seems reactionary and incomplete. 
I was raised a Christian and rebelled against it, but I've come to appreciate the ideals of the more sane and moderate majority in such religions.

I sometimes toy with the idea that we're all connected and integral to something higher, with a greater purpose, in a way that we individually can't comprehend, and that this higher thing is the closest thing there may be to a god.


----------



## 18skeltor

INTP, Pastafarian.


----------



## annikafrom

INFJ, raised Presbyterian, still am Presbyterian


----------



## f8alz28

ESTP

Pastafarian

Our only dogma is the rejection of dogma. It's good to see more and more Pastafarian publicly saying it. For too long have our people had to resort to secrecy. May FSM touch all of you with his noodley appendage. RAmen.


----------



## freesiavalerieserenade

INFP Christian. I'm so happy to see so many INFPs up there


----------



## Mark R

I believe in the Resurrection of Jesus, so I'm resurrecting this thread. INTP, Christian.


----------



## Rabid Seahorse

ENTP Lutheran. I rarely practice my religion but do talk to the big man upstairs if a tragedy happens to one of my loved ones.


----------



## SapphireBlue

INFJ, Christian.


----------



## AltruisticMisanthropist

INTJ
Anti-theist

I understand why other intuitives would believe in a higher power, but why Christianity and Catholicism? In my opinion, Christianity along with Islam are the two worst religions you could possibly follow. I mean, religion is bad enough on its own, but Christianity? You follow a God that would commit genocide against his own children. Seriously. And your religion incriminates Satan who has killed ten people. Three of which, I may add, were because your "God" ordered him to. And your "God" has killed countless people and animals and you all blame it on Satan unless it's because "it was his/her time to meet Jesus." I just don't understand how other people can believe this BS. Especially other intellectuals. I mean, I'd think an NT would just start his or her own cult/religion if they really wanted to be so delusional. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Miss Bingley

Unknown (though some sort of SP, most likely) and agnostic. 

Most of my family is religious (literally as SJs, pretty much), especially the xSFJs. There are a few NFs thrown in there that are very Catholic, too. The only exception is my father, an ENFP, who is also agnostic.


----------



## The Guitar Hero

ENFP

I believe in some kind of supernatural entity. I guess that makes me agnostic.


----------



## Silent Theory

Infj-agnostic. Grew up in a Roman Catholic household, though was undefined religiously until I knew a label to put to my thoughts which ended up being of agnostic orientation.


----------



## This Username Is Taken

AltruisticMisanthropist said:


> INTJ
> Anti-theist
> 
> I understand why other intuitives would believe in a higher power, but why Christianity and Catholicism? In my opinion, Christianity along with Islam are the two worst religions you could possibly follow. I mean, religion is bad enough on its own, but Christianity? You follow a God that would commit genocide against his own children. Seriously. And your religion incriminates Satan who has killed ten people. Three of which, I may add, were because your "God" ordered him to. And your "God" has killed countless people and animals and you all blame it on Satan unless it's because "it was his/her time to meet Jesus." I just don't understand how other people can believe this BS. Especially other intellectuals. I mean, I'd think an NT would just start his or her own cult/religion if they really wanted to be so delusional.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


1) You are giving off the impression that you are a Tumblr user by saying "Christianity and Catholicism". For your information, Catholic is a type of Christian religion. Before exclaiming your opinion (which if it's on the topic of religion shouldn't be mentioned), do your research.

2) It's funny how you mention only Christianity when talking about a God who has committed genocide. Did Pope Francis mock you at the time of your period? Also, might I add that the Bible was created by humans who had no idea what God's intentions were? The bible isn't supposed to record ancient history, it was a series of stories that foretold morals people believed were correct during that age, but now as humans develop, we perceive these morals in a negative light. That's why there is a New Testament in contrast to the old one.

You can't prove that God doesn't exist as much as I can't prove God does exist. Now, have fun being the theophobic pig you are.


----------



## Cthulhu And Coffee

?NFP, and I'm not actually religious. Agnostic


----------



## AltruisticMisanthropist

This Username Is Taken said:


> 1) You are giving off the impression that you are a Tumblr user by saying "Christianity and Catholicism". For your information, Catholic is a type of Christian religion. Before exclaiming your opinion (which if it's on the topic of religion shouldn't be mentioned), do your research.
> 
> 2) It's funny how you mention only Christianity when talking about a God who has committed genocide. Did Pope Francis mock you at the time of your period? Also, might I add that the Bible was created by humans who had no idea what God's intentions were? The bible isn't supposed to record ancient history, it was a series of stories that foretold morals people believed were correct during that age, but now as humans develop, we perceive these morals in a negative light. That's why there is a New Testament in contrast to the old one.
> 
> You can't prove that God doesn't exist as much as I can't prove God does exist. Now, have fun being the theophobic pig you are.


 
I actually already knew that Catholicism is a branch of Christianity, thanks. I have done my research. 

I mentioned only Christianity, because it's the most popular religion. And I didn't want to write an essay about all of the different gods that have committed genocide. And it's quite hilarious that you made a snide comment about Pope Francis "mocking me at the time of my period," because it seems like you're the one getting butthurt. 

You're correct. The Bible was created by humans ignorant of "God's" intents. What? So I'm supposed to believe in God just because some idiots might have gotten his purpose wrong? Really? And those morals should have always been perceived in "a negative light." Are you crazy? We could have been saved the trouble of cleaning up Christianity's mess had those morals just never been introduced by your beloved Bible. 

So you're implying that the New Testament is here to paint Christianity in a brighter picture? *hysterical laughter*

I never stated that I could disprove god(s) existence. I know that I can't. I was simply stating that I don't understand why anyone would follow a religion so hateful.

Aw, did I hurt the little theist's feelings. Why don't you go pray about for me to stop being a "theophobic" pig? 

By the way, theophobic isn't a word.


----------



## Mercedene

INFP and I'm a muslim. But I'm not that religious.


----------



## xfatalxsnipez

This Username Is Taken said:


> 1)
> 
> You can't prove that God doesn't exist as much as I can't prove God does exist. Now, have fun being the theophobic pig you are.


You cannot disprove a giant invisible 6 legged omniscient elephant that controls the United States Government but I assume you do not believe in one


----------



## xfatalxsnipez

ISTP, atheist. I'm interested in the history of religion and think it is ridiculous to not recognize the substantial contribution religion has made to world culture and the effect, both good and bad it has done. However, saying that, I am not at all convinced by any arguments for any religion. If you are not bothering me, cool, believe in what you want but if you insist on pushing your religion on me, I will shut that shit down.


----------



## This Username Is Taken

AltruisticMisanthropist said:


> I actually already knew that Catholicism is a branch of Christianity, thanks. I have done my research.
> 
> I mentioned only Christianity, because it's the most popular religion. And I didn't want to write an essay about all of the different gods that have committed genocide. And it's quite hilarious that you made a snide comment about Pope Francis "mocking me at the time of my period," because it seems like you're the one getting butthurt.
> 
> You're correct. The Bible was created by humans ignorant of "God's" intents. What? So I'm supposed to believe in God just because some idiots might have gotten his purpose wrong? Really? And those morals should have always been perceived in "a negative light." Are you crazy? We could have been saved the trouble of cleaning up Christianity's mess had those morals just never been introduced by your beloved Bible.
> 
> So you're implying that the New Testament is here to paint Christianity in a brighter picture? *hysterical laughter*
> 
> I never stated that I could disprove god(s) existence. I know that I can't. I was simply stating that I don't understand why anyone would follow a religion so hateful.
> 
> Aw, did I hurt the little theist's feelings. Why don't you go pray about for me to stop being a "theophobic" pig?
> 
> By the way, theophobic isn't a word.


So despite knowing how many other religions have supernatural, superior beings who have committed genocide among their creations, you chose Christianity to be "one of the two worst religions"? Just because it has a more popular following? Wow, somebody is a special snowflake today. What, now are you going to hate on whites for being a common race?

"We could have been saved the trouble of cleaning up Christianity's mess had those morals just never been introduced by your beloved Bible"

Oh my, did this make me laugh. So are you exclaiming that those who have done wrong should've never existed? Since its heavily implied by what you have said.

As I said before, humans develop as time passes on, expanding their comprehension on the topic of how society should be. Nobody is born with a sense of right and wrong, they are taught. Though I don't know about your idealized perception of the world, where everyone is born with a perfect understanding of how civilization should be. This should also provide an answer to what I was actually explaining when I mentioned the New Testament.

"I was simply stating that I don't understand why anyone would follow a religion so hateful"

**bursts of laughter** I can't believe a person who had stated that "Christianity is one of the worst religions" would have the audacity to call the religion "hateful". But seriously, you really got to stop generalizing things based on its first impression. Maybe all INTJs jump to conclusions **sarcasm**

Theophobic dictionary definition | theophobic defined
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/theophobic
Here are some websites featuring my non-existent word, for you


----------



## This Username Is Taken

xfatalxsnipez said:


> You cannot disprove a giant invisible 6 legged omniscient elephant that controls the United States Government but I assume you do not believe in one


You can also not disprove that a range of colleges had suddenly appeared one day and coincidently took place on a sunny day with a bunch of used cigarettes decaying on the ground, can you?


----------



## xfatalxsnipez

This Username Is Taken said:


> You can also not disprove that a range of colleges had suddenly appeared one day and coincidently took place on a sunny day with a bunch of used cigarettes decaying on the ground, can you?


Well I can ask you for some evidence for said colleges, where are they? how they did they come to exist? what day it was? who smoked the cigarettes? why did they litter? was the day humid? what day was it? what date? how long have the cigarettes been there? etc And then I shall do my best to come to a conclusion about if these colleges exist and if so, how they came into existence. If there is not enough evidence to prove their existence, I will simply assume they do not exist.


----------



## charlie.elliot

Sheesh this is a popular thread.

I'm an atheist!


----------



## PowerMechGuy

I'm an INFJ

But regardless my type, I believe in the most High God of Heaven.

Religion is an interesting topic, and in my walk with faith, I've found that it is better to learn for yourself.

I am a Christian, but my version of Christianity is unique and may not resonate with the average believer.

In short: INFJ Christian, Hallelujah!


----------



## This Username Is Taken

xfatalxsnipez said:


> Well I can ask you for some evidence for said colleges, where are they? how they did they come to exist? what day it was? who smoked the cigarettes? why did they litter? was the day humid? what day was it? what date? how long have the cigarettes been there? etc And then I shall do my best to come to a conclusion about if these colleges exist and if so, how they came into existence. If there is not enough evidence to prove their existence, I will simply assume they do not exist.


Ah, yet the problem is that there is little to no evidence of what had exactly happened other than those accusations. In addition, what we currently acknowledge about cigarettes and sunny days does not explain why the colleges started to all of a sudden appear, with its contents inside of it. Let's just say, I prefer to play with a scratched up doll rather than a puzzle with half of its pieces missing.

Beliefs are merely an aspect that makes up a person's individuality, and should not be mistaken as the impeccable truth, since all beliefs are flawed. Keep that in mind, especially if you haven't already turned to the face of arrogance.


----------



## shameless

Estp

Currently agnostic slash non denominational. I keep the possibility open in most directions. Spiritual.

I grew up in different fazes depending on what stage my parents were at in their beliefs. In my very young youth my mother was a practicing Jeahovahs Witness which meant we went to services of worship and knocked on doors and no holidays. In my older elementary years and up she was a non practicing JW which meant she preached but did not practice. My dad was denounced catholic. 

My ex. Hubby was a psychotic catholic total hypocrite. When we married I thought I could handle it because I was non denominational but it was a huge source of contention. Apparently estp is heathens


----------



## Baron Rockmore

I am ENTJ.

My religious view is simple : even if God does exist, i would rather stand against him than submit to him.

In general, i have nothing against any religion. I mean, any religion and not popular faith. I think all religion is neutral. The righteousness, the kindness, the badness and the honor is in the person itself. Not in his/her religion.


----------



## isamanthax

INFP
Christian raised, church was the best part of my week when I was little, but that's due to family problems, late middle school early high school I totally slipped with everything. As of right now I wouldn't define myself to a religion.


----------



## xfatalxsnipez

This Username Is Taken said:


> Ah, yet the problem is that there is little to no evidence of what had exactly happened other than those accusations. In addition, what we currently acknowledge about cigarettes and sunny days does not explain why the colleges started to all of a sudden appear, with its contents inside of it. Let's just say, I prefer to play with a scratched up doll rather than a puzzle with half of its pieces missing.
> 
> Beliefs are merely an aspect that makes up a person's individuality, and should not be mistaken as the impeccable truth, since all beliefs are flawed. Keep that in mind, especially if you haven't already turned to the face of arrogance.


It's quite a step to say we don't know therefore God/s.


----------



## Aridela

INTP and agnostic.


----------



## Karolina

INTJ atheist


----------



## Danni757

I was raised as an Orthodox Christian and am now an apathetic Atheist. INTJ btw.


----------



## Sour Roses

Christian - INFJ

(born again, grace based, non-denominational Christian)


----------



## ducksrain

INFJ
Now: Christian- It's about God, love, and following Jesus. 
Grew Up: Religiously Christian? Form without much of the substance, I guess?


----------



## verajessa

ENFP & an agnostic atheist. I was loosely brought up as Muslim (in a modernized sect) but I like being open to new possibilities of what is out there. I think of God as the unknown in my mind.


----------



## compulsiverambler

INTP - Unitarian Universalist 

That doesn't tell you much at all about my beliefs because we have seven principles we agree on rather than factual doctrines to believe in, so I'll explain what I personally believe:

-Atheist
-Non-dualist (i.e. there are no separate "things" or events, everything including human beings and conscious awareness, are part of one giant continuous mechanistic process)
-As is logically implied by the above, there is no "free will" by any useful definition, so punishment and revenge are irrational and immoral.
-It is worthwhile to destroy the illusion of the separate identity of things and events, including the illusion of a separate self and a single consciousness through time, by Buddhist meditation, psychedelics with that property, or other means. 

I could probably fit in well in the average Humanist group, but I'd be bored. I like the symbolic rituals and inspirational sermons and hymns, and I like the greater variety of both personality types and beliefs found among and acceptable for Unitarians. There is just the right combination of differences and similarities between us all: socially left-wing (which allows us to all pull in the same direction as a politically active religion), with just a few underlying principles uniting our wide range of beliefs about everything else.


----------



## Rabid Seahorse

ENTP Lutheran, although unfortunately it's in a lukewarm way. I was raised that way and my family is from the Bible Belt region, so I internalized it and went through all the cultural rites of passage. When I am at my very lowest or a loved one of mine is, I pray. Internally, I fear the Christian God enough that I am only comfortable experimenting with alternative religions from a detached, intellectual way and I agree with the basic moral principles of Christianity. 



The lukewarm aspect stems from my uncertainty regarding the nuances of my religion. I know there's a way to reconcile Christianity and things such as gay rights, as many of my relatives are gay, Christian, and accepted by my family and their churches. Politically, I think "separation of church and state" should be a two-way street: gay marriage should be recognized by the government but churches should not be obliged to perform the ceremonies or recognize them if they do not wish to. However there are other aspects I still need to learn and reflect from to form a more mature view of life.


----------



## compulsiverambler

Rabid Seahorse said:


> The lukewarm aspect stems from my uncertainty regarding the nuances of my religion. I know there's a way to reconcile Christianity and things such as gay rights, as many of my relatives are gay, Christian, and accepted by my family and their churches. Politically, I think "separation of church and state" should be a two-way street: gay marriage should be recognized by the government but churches should not be obliged to perform the ceremonies or recognize them if they do not wish to. However there are other aspects I still need to learn and reflect from to form a more mature view of life.


Why bother to point that out though when there is no one arguing that they *should* be forced to? Are you under the impression that this is a situation that anybody with power had been arguing for? In case so, I'll take a quick off-topic detour to correct that:

No law obliging churches to officiate any marriage they don't want to, for any reason, has ever been proposed or passed in any country, to my knowledge. Everywhere that same-sex marriage is legal, churches are perfectly at liberty to refuse to marry a couple because they're interracial, inter-religious, divorced, infertile, child-free-by-choice, not virgins or any other nonsensical reason they like, and that includes the couple being same-sex. Only registry staff are contractually obliged to sign marriage certificates whether they personally approve or not, and again, that applies to disapproval for *any* reason, so civil servants have *always* had to sign off on marriages they disapprove of for religious reasons or get another job, it's not a new problem introduced by same-sex marriage.

So when same-sex marriage is legalised, the government is not telling churches what to do, it is *stopping* telling them what they *can't* do. The churches that don't want to perform same-sex marriages are completely unaffected, the only churches affected are those, like mine, who are finally allowed to officiate legally recognised and certified same-sex weddings after asking the government to allow us to since the 1970s. Thus, *our* religious freedom has been infringed upon by the government, acting on behalf of the religious majority, for decades. When governments legalise it, they simply stop taking the side of one set of churches over all the others by imposing the former's prohibitions on to all.


----------



## superlimelolz

how can you be atheist and have a religion at the same time


----------



## WorldzMine

INTP and Atheist as all people are born until most end up corrupted by unquestioningly accepting the irrationality of the people around them.


----------



## ak47

leictreon said:


> Deist: I believe there's a higher power, but its true nature is just beyond human understanding. It might as well be a technologically advanced alien lifeform from another universe, or just a force of nature. Regardless, we can't claim to understand God, as we're mere mortals in this vast, endless universe, or multiverse.


Never knew there was a word for it. I'm an ENTP and have the same belief


----------



## blondemaiden

INxJ, grew up in a semi-religious Lutheran family. I, myself, have never really been religious. I respect people who ARE religious, but I don't believe in God, though I don't deny him existing completely either. My point is, it's not that important to me, so I never really dwell on it.


----------



## IdealTruths

I don't really follow an organized religion, but I definitely have beliefs that are "out there." I find that I'm attracted to New Age-y, Buddhist-type stuff.

Also, person reading this, you're actually God.


----------



## riotgrrrl

Christian INFP- I did a lot of "seeking", I was Catholic as a child, then Wiccan then agnostic before finally coming back to Christianity after a lot of soul-searching.


----------



## LuciferSam

Does anyone think Religion is NOT a social evolutionary construct to ensure survival of the species?

I think it's impossible to track how often generally accepted religious truths have changed through time and cultures. Meaning the only truth is instability of truth.


----------



## meaningless

INTP, agnostic leaning toward the atheist side.


----------



## Im FiNe

LuciferSam said:


> Does anyone think Religion is NOT a social evolutionary construct to ensure survival of the species?
> ...


If your focus on the use of _Religion_ is regarding human organizations, hierarchical constructs, and the like, then I would concur that there is an element of social construct going on.

If your focus is on faith and belief, then I disagree completely with your assertion.


----------



## LuciferSam

Im FiNe said:


> If your focus on the use of _Religion_ is regarding human organizations, hierarchical constructs, and the like, then I would concur that there is an element of social construct going on.
> 
> If your focus is on faith and belief, then I disagree completely with your assertion.


I actually did mean both, but I'd like to hear why you disagree?


----------



## He_That_Burns_For_lolz

I'm an ENTP Mormon. That always bothered my parents as they've hated my scrutiny and any argument against any hierarchical construct, specifically my dad. I've been able to get answers and rationalise 99% of the questions I've had about my faith and the other 1% were just too boring or unimportant for me to keep intrest in that I forgot about them. I like my faith but even for someone as argumentative as me it gets annoying arguing with those from the outside of the faith who don't understand it completely or get too emotionally involved.


----------



## LuciferSam

He_That_Burns_For_lolz said:


> I'm an ENTP Mormon. That always bothered my parents as they've hated my scrutiny and any argument against any hierarchical construct, specifically my dad. I've been able to get answers and rationalise 99% of the questions I've had about my faith and the other 1% were just too boring or unimportant for me to keep intrest in that I forgot about them. I like my faith but even for someone as argumentative as me it gets annoying arguing with those from the outside of the faith who don't understand it completely or get too emotionally involved.


One of my best friends is ENTP and also LDS, I actually sometimes envy him because I think there are parts of his religion that help him keep it all together and focus his talents in a good way.

And I lash out at religion more than I say anything nice about it, but I'm glad it works for him. Although I will say I know he breaks some of the rules, and so I think it's not as much about belief as much as it's about community and the church.


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## chicanai

ISFP, raised in Christian faith but question my religion so I don't go to church.  Actually, I don't just question my religion but question religion as a whole. I don't dispute the possibility of there being a greater power out there but until I've experienced/seen it myself, I don't actually believe it although I'd like to believe in the possibility of an afterlife (as a human being, not a cockroach!).  It'd be nice to be reincarnated as a human again and experience all of what life has to offer again instead of just 1)disintegrating into nothingness 2)being stuck in heaven/hell 3)being reincarnated as a cockroach.


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## Im FiNe

LuciferSam said:


> I actually did mean both, but I'd like to hear why you disagree?


My foundation is a belief that God created all things and as such it is purposeful. I believe that people were created to be relational and that the foundational relationship is people relating to God. Not a god. Not some impersonal force. Not the universe splintering itself off into life forms in an attempt to understand itself. I believe in Yahweh. I believe that the only solution to repairing the broken relationship with God is through Jesus, through his merit and not our own.

We are created to be in relationship to God. When we don't try to enter that relationship, then we are left to fill the vacuum by injecting something else or someone else. Something or someone else becomes our god whether it be some being, some ideology, some desire, or even oneself. How one acts out that belief system especially in a social context (interacting with others) brings rise to all manner of religions including "secular religions".

Your assertion seems to me to arise from a belief that people created all gods (including the one true God) rather than God having created people. It seems to be set upon a belief that no gods exist. If one starts from, "God doesn't exist; it's a human invention", then your assertion can be considered. If one (such as I) starts from a position that God does exist, then your assertion starts from (what would be to me) an errant assumption. That's the part about _Religion_ being used to mean faith and belief as opposed to a systemic structure (the essence vs. the materialization, the cause vs. an effect, the invisible vs. the visible).


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## LuciferSam

Im FiNe said:


> My foundation is a belief that God created all things and as such it is purposeful. I believe that people were created to be relational and that the foundational relationship is people relating to God. Not a god. Not some impersonal force. Not the universe splintering itself off into life forms in an attempt to understand itself. I believe in Yahweh. I believe that the only solution to repairing the broken relationship with God is through Jesus, through his merit and not our own.
> 
> We are created to be in relationship to God. When we don't try to enter that relationship, then we are left to fill the vacuum by injecting something else or someone else. Something or someone else becomes our god whether it be some being, some ideology, some desire, or even oneself. How one acts out that belief system especially in a social context (interacting with others) brings rise to all manner of religions including "secular religions".
> 
> *Your assertion seems to me to arise from a belief that people created all gods (including the one true God) rather than God having created people.* It seems to be set upon a belief that no gods exist. If one starts from, "God doesn't exist; it's a human invention", then your assertion can be considered. If one (such as I) starts from a position that God does exist, then your assertion starts from (what would be to me) an errant assumption. That's the part about _Religion_ being used to mean faith and belief as opposed to a systemic structure (the essence vs. the materialization, the cause vs. an effect, the invisible vs. the visible).


The bold is correct. But I have an open mind. I just can point to history and show that there have been numerous ideas of what "God" is, but definitely all have the ability to believe in something like God (either monotheistic or polytheistic) - during that time, human beings haven't really changed genetically in any way. So if I'm keeping an open mind, I have to statistically acknowledge the fact that most religions are wrong at best, more likely all are fictitious. 

The beliefs you have, their strength and attachment to character have existed in others before, for gods that only exist in history books. I'm not attacking you, and I hope it's not perceived that way - but without suspending logic, I can't get there. And I'm also forced to recognize that it would not make much sense for god to afford us intellect he wishes us to forgo, it seems directly counter intuitive.

I've always seen religion as more of a political group with a fundamental belief that it is unassailable, and so is related to human beings the same way ants have a queen. The belief in some kind of god is valuable to humans rather than which one, because it controls our behavior in a way synonymous with continuous evolution.


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## sullenriot

INTP, atheist, kind of. I don't believe that there is a God but I believe there is something. If you built a human body in a lab, it wouldn't be alive so there has to be something more. Maybe some type of energy we haven't discovered yet. I used to be a Muslim. My parents aren't very religious, my dad is a pantheist and my mom is undecided. But you know how Islamic countries are, I was still heavily exposed to it.


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## Abby_Hough1230

I'm an agnostic INFP- Seems kinda typical for the INFP are quite open-minded. 

It's not that I doubt the existence of god/s; it's just not 'real'. Well gods are real only because of the human mind is how I see it to be so. Physically there is no manifested God/s; It's a mental thing but because we've created these so called Gods has helped paved road for mankind's ethics and morals and diversified cultures and beliefs. So it is an understatement to say that God/s aren't real because they are very real to those who believe in a higher life. But really it has helped all kinds of people to change for the better and have someone they can rely on; and sadly has also given the idealism for 'Evil' to create their own religion either based on murder/sacrifice and harming of life.

I really hold no belief but fascination for learning other 'God/s'. I adore Greek Gods I must say and honestly I just love to see the different perspectives of life!


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## angelfish

I'm an INFP and panentheist. The term literally means "all-within-god". I believe that all that exists has fundamental divine within it (similar to pantheism) but that g/God goes beyond all that we know, as well. I choose to believe that existence is fundamentally good in some way and that there is meaning and purpose to our consciousness. 

Ultimately I suppose I'm also agnostic because I don't claim to be ultimately correct. I just think this is what makes the most sense to me and what makes me the happiest and most at-peace to believe.


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## Vahyavishdapaya

Neopythagoreanism/Neoplatonism


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## INFJalltheway

I'm an INFJ and a Catholic, although, I consider myself to be a "casual" Catholic, in the sense that I do not strictly follow doctrinal beliefs and I think that sometimes you have to find God yourself and discover what you think is right and wrong for yourself, rather than just following a 2000 year old book written by ordinary humans.


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## He_That_Burns_For_lolz

LuciferSam said:


> One of my best friends is ENTP and also LDS, I actually sometimes envy him because I think there are parts of his religion that help him keep it all together and focus his talents in a good way.
> 
> And I lash out at religion more than I say anything nice about it, but I'm glad it works for him. Although I will say I know he breaks some of the rules, and so I think it's not as much about belief as much as it's about community and the church.


I've gotta say it's definitely held me together too, entps have addictive personalities and man, this religion is good at helping me keep out of lots of stuff that would destroy me. The other thing is if I was a traditional Christian (catholic, protestant, etc) there'd be no way I would stay that way. The Lds faith doesn't actually have the traditional view of "believe, be baptized, or repent or you'll go to hell" and that's part of the reason why I believe in it. I have a lot of philosophies about my faith and the specifics therein but sadly most people either can't go that deep if they are LDS and anyone else has issues talking about it objectively.


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## Banned Boy

Don't think about it too much but overall I would say I'm an agnostic deist/Christian. Sometimes I just can't help but feel like sonny Jesus has my back.


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## Banned Boy

Don't think about it too much but overall I would say I'm an agnostic deist/Christian. Sometimes I just can't help but feel like sonny Jesus has my back.


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## Banned Boy

Didn't mean to post that twice haha


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## Gossip Goat

Atheist


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## Eset

I'm religious to the booty.


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## junofirst

INFJ
No religion. Never believed in a diety & always felt it's hokum. 
Pity the weak minded who are brainwashed into serving one of the God's. Fear those who believe their cult is the truth & hate others as a result. Blame religion for millions of deaths & torture throughout history, but hey, maybe those wanting to hurt others would have found another reason.
I just want a utopian society without hatred. 

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


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## Mad Scientist

INTJ, Haven't read through all the post (don't have that much time), but I might be the just a small percentage of the intuitives to just say 'Christian'. Just some word for thought for my fellow intuitives: if you truly look at the future like almost every N does, the best decision is to just choose a religion with the fact that a religious person won't regret if there isn't a god and they die, but you will if there is one and you didn't believe in one. Don't let sensor logic ruin religion &#55357;&#56899;, jk.


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## Mad Scientist

Heaven...&#55357;&#56836; Religion has been an excuse not a cause and only extremist express hate with religion, because they don't read their holy books. Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Bhudism, Hinduism, esc. almost throuhout preach peace, many ideas are just not in agreement with the politically correct society where the definition of tolerance means everyone must hold an external opinion that no one can have an external opinion &#55358;&#56596;. Not meaning to start an argument, but when people don't choose a religion, it would be nice if they just said I didn't want to believe in one, instead of blaming extreme situations. Brainwash is an awful term. Neither the belief that someone created the universe or the belief that the universe is just a random coincidence is logical. I have thought about my religion and don't allow any other views to affect my own. One more point, people have these logical explanations on both sides. If there is something higher than their reasoning is beyond our own and we probably can't apply the 100% logic needed to justify the existence or non existence of that higher being.


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## Clueing For Looks

agnostic


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## Bel Esprit

I'm atheist so I do not have a religion. I believe the word will soon come to be comical.


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## pwowq

ISTP. No religion. (atheism is not a religion)


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## INFJenNiFer

junofirst said:


> INFJ
> No religion. Never believed in a diety & always felt it's hokum.
> Pity the weak minded who are brainwashed into serving one of the God's. Fear those who believe their cult is the truth & hate others as a result. Blame religion for millions of deaths & torture throughout history, but hey, maybe those wanting to hurt others would have found another reason.
> I just want a utopian society without hatred.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


Wow, those people you met must suck lol

They shouldn't hate other people who doesn't have the same beliefs as them. They also shouldn't shove it to other people's throats so they can join. If you want people to believe what you believe just lead by example lol

Answering the question, I am INFJ and I am a Christian.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## junofirst

INFJenNiFer said:


> Wow, those people you met must suck lol
> 
> They shouldn't hate other people who doesn't have the same beliefs as them. They also shouldn't shove it to other people's throats so they can join. If you want people to believe what you believe just lead by example lol
> 
> Answering the question, I am INFJ and I am a Christian.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hi fellow INFJ'er. 
Noo I've not met religious ppl that suck. Just I've always believed from a child there is no God etc. 
Sure it's fine if ppl need to believe in such things. I'm just so independent myself I feel sorry for ppl bound by their religion. That they're not strong enough stand on their own 2 feet. Though maybe some personality types it makes them stronger to believe in something higher than themselves. 
It annoys me when religious folk say things like there is a God etc & others are wrong... It's so sad. Just be a good person

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


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## Rezza

My religion is Islam and my supposed type is INFP but I don't think my type determines much because I believe that after all,we can always change our behaviours.


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## The red spirit

ISFP. Nothing at all.


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## TangoLikeAMango

I'm an ENTP, and I'm for the most part atheist. I don't believe there's a God or afterlife, purely science. Still there are some holes in science and I'm constantly trying to come up with theories and I'd be lying if I said some of them don't involve God. But even in my theories that involve God, it's agnostic, not a specific God or anything. I appreciate religion for the morals and organization it provides in people's lives XD, but it's just not for me. *flies away on robot pegasus*


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## Jaune

ISTJ, de facto atheist.


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## AndyMartinova

Entp, raised catholic, now I just believe that there is higher power. I don't go to church anymore


----------



## Miss Nightingale

xNTJ. None.


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## Ulta

INFJ, Atheist


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## Stormyred13

I'm an ENTP and a Muslim. 

Sent from my A1601 using Tapatalk


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## 100_the_cat

INFJ

My daily life is the universal mystical core that all religions are built on, so they're all the same to me. I don't identify as any religion, but for ease of communication often describe myself as having a pact with Satan or being a Kundalini mystic. I was raised Southern Baptist.


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## WhoIsJake

I just feel sooooooooo unique saying I'm an INTP Atheist :mellow:


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## Epic Love

I'm an INFJ and a Christian but I'm not too into it, or go to church.


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## Kreeps

INFP, and Quaker. 

Basically, Quakerism is a pacifist group that is dominantly Christian, however anybody can join regardless of race, gender, ethnicity, or even religion. There's a lot more to it than that, but I suppose you got the gist.


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## heymoon

IxFP and Christian?? I'm pretty sure I fit the description of "Christian", but I don't really fit the stereotypes or anything. I'm pretty liberal and id as biromantic, which gets me a lot of hate and disrespect from others (it amazes me how many people call themselves non-judging and accepting but they have the infamous "love the sinner, hate the sin" mindset. yikes), and even myself sometimes. (sidenote: I'm pretty sure 95% of my self-hatred and self-doubt comes from the fact that I was raised in a strict Christian household where I was taught I'd burn in the fiery pits of Hell(tm) if I was anything but a good, pure, straight girl who went to church every Sunday and all that shiz.)

I dunno, it sort of gives me comfort to think that someone is up there listening to me and can help me when I need it, but I just hate all these stereotypes associated with religion, which is why I usually keep to myself about it.


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## GentleLions

INFJ and Christian. For me its about a relationship with God / Creator. I believe Jesus Christ was God in human form (without sin nature) and proved how much He loved humanity by going through the crucifixion. He wants relationship with every single one of us.


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## moeslayer

Infj - agnostic atheist


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## YourMomIsABlueWhaleXXL

Religion is for the weak and the ignorant.


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## versace

INFP and idk a God believer????? I feel like such a special snowflake saying that lol


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## LinneaS

I'm an ISFJ agnostic, leaning to atheist.


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## He's a Superhero!

YourMomIsABlueWhaleXXL said:


> Religion is for the weak and the ignorant.


I thought that is what prejudice is for.


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## bremen

Atheist, but I would probably be religious if my parents raised me that way.


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## YourMomIsABlueWhaleXXL

He's a Superhero! said:


> I thought that is what prejudice is for.


I'm going to read the bible, read the bullshit that is written by human hands, thinking that they see a old man in the sky. 
Oh look, it's Jesus Christ with a cross in his hand! Just kidding, it's my fake imagination. Of course it's a fake imagination, you're drunk, Toby! And the book you wrote is absolutely donkey piss! You bloody twat. Yeah? Well I can at least write a book that has been believed by people for 1000 years and then been edited by other people with more bullshit and people then believe in more bullshit! Shut the fuck up you pile of stocked up piece of crap. You're spitting more bullshit out of your mouth than before. Then don't believe it because I have my own opinion and reason to believe in! Yeah, in bullshit because you can't handle the reality you prick. Toby? Oh, he got a heart attack. Where is Jesus Christ that can revive Toby? Where is my god damn cake!


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## Kaden

I am an ISFJ. I was raised in a Roman Catholic family, but rejected the belief early on in my life. I neither follow nor believe in any religion. I am an (agnostic) atheist.


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## Shinnicakes

I'm an ENFJ and honestly I don't know what I am. I don't actively pray to one god? I believe in spirits and energy - whatever you put out into the universe you'll get it back in threefold. I do believe that there could be several different gods - gods of safe passage, gods of luck and etc. I like going to all the shrines in Japan and learning about the gods that each shrine honors. I was never raised in a religion, just raised to be a good person and to treat others with compassion.


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## Crowbo

ENTP

Agnostic atheist


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## Westy365

ENFJ, Christian


----------



## shameless

I follow the good book of Ti.

Non Denomination/Agnostic


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## jcal

ISTJ... I was raised as a Dutch Reformed (very similar to Presbyterian) Protestant, but it was more to be exposed to it than due to any fervent beliefs of my parents, neither of which actively practiced (Mom>Dutch Reformed, Dad>Catholic). I was required to attend Sunday School and confirmation classes until I was confirmed at age 14, after which I was free to do as I pleased... I have not been to a church service other than weddings and such in the 47 years since I was confirmed.

I would consider myself an Apatheist more than anything. The whole subject of religion is both unimportant and uninteresting to me so I really don't care enough to give it any thought. I do strongly believe in "to each his own", so I respect other's beliefs (or non-beliefs). It's really of no concern to me, right up to the point when they get evangelistic about it, which really annoys the hell out of me. 

My ESFJ wife was raised Catholic but does not actively participate at all. My two children were raised as Catholics (primarily to appease my wife's parents) and attended Catholic school through the end of high school (mainly because the public schools around here leave quite a bit to be desired and the Catholic schools were the least expensive quality alternative). 

My 34 year-old ESTJ son is probably in the same boat as me... but I don't know for sure because none of us really care enough about it to discuss.

My 31 year-old INFJ daughter is the one true Atheist in the family... she is absolutely convinced that there is no God of any description.


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