# Can Someone Explain Introverted Sensing



## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

inevitabilis said:


> I heard Si mostly uses the "five senses".


Everyone uses the five senses to take in data. We have no other method to receive stimuli.


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

The_Cold_Apple said:


> Hello,
> 
> Can someone or several people explain to me how introverted sensing works. How can you sense internally? That doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> ...


*Si:*












niss said:


> Everyone uses the five senses to take in data. We have no other method to receive stimuli.


Humans have more then 5 senses


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

Dumaresq said:


> What? Where in the world did that last statement come from?





olias said:


> in response to your comment: "good lord, how do you do it? i think i'd break down and melt if I tried to answer every single Si thread that pops up here. there's literally hundreds of Si threads, some even still on the first page right now.
> 
> you must have oceans of patience."
> 
> I observe that we often denigrate other types because we don't personally like their style. ISTJ's especially get a lot of shit for just being themselves, but like you observed - they're patient and steady. The world takes all types.





Dumaresq said:


> I'm still missing the "appear simple people" and "needed just as much as ENTJs and ESFPs."
> 
> Also, the inclusive plural pronoun "we" is a little strange. As far as I'm aware, I haven't denigrated @niss. If anything, it was a compliment?





olias said:


> We being the community of human kind. A generalized we. It was an observation of my generalized experience with types, and listening to others discuss various types. ISTJ's get a lot of shit for being boring or uninteresting in my experience. The flip side to what some see as boring is patience and perseverance, and reliability.
> 
> ENTJ's are strong, out front, domineering types sometimes. ESFPs can be loud, flashy, attention getting types. Because it's not uncommon for more extroverted types to draw attention, they also draw more energy in the form of analysis and understanding.
> 
> And this, ladies and gentlemen, has been a demonstration of the challenges in communication between INTJ's and ESTJ's ;-)


Basically, Si-doms are viewed in this manner because of our focus on the past. It is a natural extension of our cognitive functions that we will do so, because that is how we interpret data. Hence our tendency to disregard as irrelevant theoretical and abstract discussions (using the past to interpret the present leaves little room for "what if" discussions that lack immediate applicability).

Of course, the argument could be made that we are being judged as "simple" merely because we are not focused on the new and fashionable in arenas of thought. What is considered avant-garde in arts, architecture, or science is not so far removed from the ridiculous fashions we've all seen on the runway.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

FreeBeer said:


> *Si:*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The gif is not Si - that's absurd.

The other senses are derived from the five senses. (e.g. pain comes from touch, etc.)


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

niss said:


> The gif is not Si - that's absurd.
> 
> The other senses are derived from the five senses. (e.g. pain comes from touch, etc.)


._. how do you touch your internal organs or nerves etc? Also what about your sense of time or balance?

The gif is relevant:


> We view an object's internal state as the relationship between events that precondition one another. This element perceives information about how processes are reflected by one's internal state (Si). This includes the sense of one's own condition and the sensations of people evoked by this interdependence. Interaction in space is nothing more than a reflection of one object in another. Objects reflect in other objects, evoking certain sensations in one another. Such an individual perceives external information in form of sensations evoked by ongoing events. *For example, the sensation of pain is essentially the reflection within a person's mind of a relationship between his functioning body and a process occurring in some part of the body that impedes this functioning.*


Source: http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Introverted_sensing

o.o I was being quite serious. Si introverted sensing aka experiential sensing: subjective physical experience through the senses. This is probably why a Si dom can tell the difference between his mother's cooking and the restaurant if the dish is the same one & evaluate both relative to one-another without sampling both at the same time.

Se on the other hand is all about non subjective sensing:


> Unlike Si, which is about one's subjective sensory experience (how intense or enjoyable it is), Se is about achieving an object of desire. It gives one the ability to influence, bend, and push situations and people in order to achieve such an object, rather than to enjoy the situation one is in.


*Example of Se: *









All objective functions: Se Ne Te Fe have something to do with external stuff aka the object. Subjective functions Si Ni Fi Ti have everything to do with the subject.

*This means pain is a subjective sensory experience that happens in the nervous system of the subject, which makes it the domain of Si. Taste, sight, hearing, smell & touch are all conduits for Si.*
*
Having a Si base preference means one focuses primarily on subjective sensory experience. Its in the foreground, nice and sharp/clear:*


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## Recede (Nov 23, 2011)

People type me as SLI (Si-Te) in socionics, yet I can't relate to what anyone writes about Si. I don't rely on past data or notice changes in the environment any more than anyone else. Quite possibly less because I'm often oblivious to what's going on around me. And I don't perceive things subjectively, I perceive them exactly as they are while residing in an internal mode. I think what my Si does is passively absorb sensory input and experiences (in contrast to Se which actively seeks stimulation). My experiences can feel hazy because I'm not fully focused on the external, it's like I'm half there and half within myself.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

FreeBeer said:


> ._. how do you touch your internal organs or nerves etc? Also what about your sense of time or balance?


*I* don't have to touch them. They respond to the pressure of something touching them.

Time is learned.

Balance is related to touch. (little sensory hairs in your inner ear ... the ones that give you vertigo if a small piece of something starts floating around inside there...)



> The gif is relevant:
> 
> Source: Introverted sensing - Wikisocion


Relevant to what? That all people experience pain when pinching/twisting their nipples? You're kidding, right? You don't need Si to feel pain.



> o.o I was being quite serious. Si introverted sensing aka experiential sensing: subjective physical experience through the senses. This is probably why a Si dom can tell the difference between his mother's cooking and the restaurant if the dish is the same one & evaluate both relative to one-another without sampling both at the same time.


No. Just no. Si is merely using past experiences to interpret the present. It is not a person gifted with super powers of memory and the five senses.



> Se on the other hand is all about non subjective sensing:
> 
> *Example of Se: *


So, anytime I crush a beer can I'm using Se? Really? In spite of the fact that it is extremely low in my cognitive stack? And how does this play out in applying torque to a bolt - something I am very good and and do on a daily basis? 

Sorry, but this is no more Se than it is Si. Crushing a can is not a cognitive function.



> All objective functions: Se Ne Te Fe have something to do with external stuff aka the object. Subjective functions Si Ni Fi Ti have everything to do with the subject.


All perceiving/judging functions have to do with the object. All of them.



> *This means pain is a subjective sensory experience that happens in the nervous system of the subject, which makes it the domain of Si. Taste, sight, hearing, smell & touch are all conduits for Si.*
> *
> Having a Si base preference means one focuses primarily on subjective sensory experience. Its in the foreground, nice and sharp/clear:*


Well, I'll say that you are consistent.

All senses are conduits for all perceiving functions. Without them, there is nothing to perceive.


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

@niss










...you didn't understand half of what I said...but I think I was crystal clear enough.
What part of type=cognitive function *preference* / everyone uses all 8 functions constantly is difficult? The functions are abstractions that describe how cognition works in humans.

Jung split the 4 primary functions: SENSING, FEELING, INTUITING & THINKING into 8. The differentiation was made through the relationship of the subject (in this case the self) with the object (in this case everything else).

If one has strong THINKING preference, then one has strong Ti & Te, but 1 is preferred over the other...etc..


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

FreeBeer said:


> @niss
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I understood your points pretty well. I just find that they are obviously incorrect.


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

niss said:


> I understood your points pretty well. I just find that they are obviously incorrect.


If you understood them, then describe Se plz.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

FreeBeer said:


> If you understood them, then describe Se plz.


You are saying that Se is sensory interaction with the object outside of self - where the object resides. A measure of what is needed to interact with or act upon the object at some objective level.


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

niss said:


> You are saying that Se is sensory interaction with the object outside of self - where the object resides. A measure of what is needed to interact with or act upon the object at some objective level.


Yeah, sort of it you consider perceiving interaction (which it is). Se is perception of the state of objects in the external world without subjective bias. The sensory interaction (as in acting) is the result of understanding this and acting upon it, which implies processing Se related info that was acquired beforehand. 

Si on the other hand is perceiving the external object's influence on the self & the consequence is knowing how to mold the external environment in order to produce specific internal stares: pain & comfort for example. o.o there is a difference between Se & Si & it basically comes down to the focus of attention aka preference. 

In a sensor both are stronger then intuition, if one is a Si dom then the 2 strongest functions are Si & Se.

Where a Se dom would say the room has 4 blank white walls a Si dom would say the room feels sterile and cold. *One perceives the object, the other the subject's reaction to the object.*


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

FreeBeer said:


> Yeah, sort of it you consider perceiving interaction (which it is). Se is perception of the state of objects in the external world without subjective bias. The sensory interaction (as in acting) is the result of understanding this and acting upon it, which implies processing Se related info that was acquired beforehand.
> 
> Si on the other hand is perceiving the external object's influence on the self & the consequence is knowing how to mold the external environment in order to produce specific internal stares: pain & comfort for example. o.o there is a difference between Se & Si & it basically comes down to the focus of attention aka preference.
> 
> ...


As I said, I understand what you are saying, but you are incorrect.


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## Recede (Nov 23, 2011)

niss said:


> Relevant to what? That all people experience pain when pinching/twisting their nipples? You're kidding, right? You don't need Si to feel pain.


Plenty of people tend to be unaware of internal sensations, or ignore them in favor of making some external impact. The sensation of pain isn't Si, but a preference to focus on how the environment is affecting you can be (especially along with self-pres). I can't easily ignore internal physical discomfort, so it's very important to me to avoid environments or activities that cause discomfort (for example, working in fast food is physically and mentally painful to me). I have zero interest in making any kind of tangible impact on the environment, which would be Se.



> No. Just no. Si is merely using past experiences to interpret the present.


I'm starting to think that Si means nothing more than Sensing + Introversion, which doesn't necessarily mean the person will rely on past experiences. Some might, because they have internalized their experiences over time, but it doesn't have to be that way. Time orientation can be something separate from functions, and I happen to dislike focusing on the past.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

Silveresque said:


> Plenty of people tend to be unaware of internal sensations, or ignore them in favor of making some external impact. The sensation of pain isn't Si, but a preference to focus on how the environment is affecting you can be (especially along with self-pres). I can't easily ignore internal physical discomfort, so it's very important to me to avoid environments or activities that cause discomfort (for example, working in fast food is physically and mentally painful to me). I have zero interest in making any kind of tangible impact on the environment, which would be Se.


We choose our focus. This is not a cognitive function.





> I'm starting to think that Si means nothing more than Sensing + Introversion, which doesn't necessarily mean the person will rely on past experiences. Some might, because they have internalized their experiences over time, but it doesn't have to be that way. Time orientation can be something separate from functions, and I happen to dislike focusing on the past.


Si is the present invoking the past as a method of understanding the present. It is not a past focus as in dwelling in the past. It is not sensing as in the five senses. It is a perceiving cognitive function, just like Ne, Ni, or Se.


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## LibertyPrime (Dec 17, 2010)

@Silveresque










*thumbsup


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## PaladinX (Feb 20, 2013)

niss said:


> We choose our focus. This is not a cognitive function.


Focus is part of the cognitive function formula. It's in the e/i part. Extraversion/Introversion is the direction of interest (aka focus/attention/curiosity/concern).

The thing that puts the energy into a given "focus" or function is _will_​.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

PaladinX said:


> Focus is part of the cognitive function formula. It's in the e/i part. Extraversion/Introversion is the direction of interest (aka focus/attention/curiosity/concern).
> 
> The thing that puts the energy into a given "focus" or function is _will_​.


But you aren't changing cognitive preference via will. You are changing the focus of your attention. Otherwise, I could decide to be a Ne-dom today. And that simply is not true.


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## PaladinX (Feb 20, 2013)

niss said:


> But you aren't changing cognitive preference via will. You are changing the focus of your attention. Otherwise, I could decide to be a Ne-dom today. And that simply is not true.


"Cognitive preference" is nothing more than the pattern of focus via the will.


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## niss (Apr 25, 2010)

PaladinX said:


> "Cognitive preference" is nothing more than the pattern of focus via the will.


Of course. That would explain the number of Ne-doms that flip and become Si-doms whenever they feel the need to do so.


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