# Is pain subjective?



## ThoughtBox (Apr 23, 2013)

thats my question. i believe it is. i believe we all deal with pain differently. i have the ability to block out pain. we know certain people are better at dealing with pain then others, but why? do we experience it differently? what does pain mean to you? we all know what it feels like, and we all try to avoid it. it is my belief that the things that cause you the greatest pain are the things you can learn from the most. physically, emotionally, and spiritually. so what does pain mean to you and how does it affect you in your everyday life?

please leave your thoughts. hopefully we can all learn something from this thread


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## Aelthwyn (Oct 27, 2010)

yes, I think it's subjective. Certain things certianly seem to hurt some people more than they do others. While learning to bear with it is a factor, I don't think it's the only reason that one person is able to bear something better than someone else. I think two people can actually feel very different levels of pain from the same injury. And I think people can have a higher tollerance for certain types of pain, and a lower tollerance for other types. 

I also think that ideas can affect both perception of pain and behaviors that _look_ like low or high pain tollerance. Anticipation of pain often makes it seem worse, perhaps because in a way it drags out the exprience within your mind. Also attitudes related to the cause of one's pain can have an effect on how well or badly you deal with it - I believe that emotional stress on top of something painful increases it, whereas pain that happens as a side-effect of doing something you enjoy or feel is good for you (and thus has positive feelings attached to the situation) can seem easier to bear. Also knowing that it's going to end, and approximately how soon, seems to boost one's ability to endure pain greatly and I think this is again tied to the _idea_ of Hope (and thus it can also be connected to one's sense of competance in a situation, if you believe you can handle it, or believe it will make you more able to handle it in the future, or if you believe you won't survive, or won't fully recover, or won't gain anything). Also, for example, I find that I have a near phobia of becoming injured, however when accidents actually happen and I do become injured it's usually not so bad - so I act really afraid and 'weak', but may not have as low of a tollerance for it as I seem to think in many cases.

(also, I don't necessarily think that the level of pain indicates how much you can learn from something. Pain is usually an indicator that something is wrong and that you should work on fixing whatever it is though, so pain can be useful.)


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## daringcherry (Apr 23, 2013)

I don't understand why this is in Cognitive Functions subforum but it's an interesting subject. Yes, some people are better at dealing with pain. Often people who meditate are better at dealing with both physical and emotional pain. I'm not sure why. I have started meditation practice and hope to see results in the future.


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## RandomNote (Apr 10, 2013)

I have no idea pain just hurts.


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## Sixty Nein (Feb 13, 2011)

Pain is something that I would find to be objective and subjective, as most physical pain revolves around neurological bodily functions and such. It is a good thing to feel pain, or otherwise you wouldn't realize that you were sick, or that you can't just constantly poke your fucking eyes all the time. Like a few children who don't feel pain, and such.

I don't think this is related to type though, and mostly biochemistry that exists in the person's own body though. Even things such as emotional sensitivity can be explained with science, and such.


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## Quork (Aug 17, 2012)

Can't believe I'm doing this, but yes.


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

How is a reaction caused by electrical impulses from nerve endings subjective?!


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## HighClassSavage (Nov 29, 2012)

No, only our tolerance to pain and perception of pain are subjective. Otherwise, pain on its own is objective.


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## MrShatter (Sep 28, 2010)

daringcherry said:


> I don't understand why this is in Cognitive Functions subforum but it's an interesting subject. Yes, some people are better at dealing with pain. Often people who meditate are better at dealing with both physical and emotional pain. I'm not sure why. I have started meditation practice and hope to see results in the future.







 Me too; this guy has been amazing.


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## KaiserinRose (Mar 27, 2013)

Yes. Some people have a high tolerance of pain while others have a low tolerance of pain.

In other words, the feeling of pain depends on the person (who's feeling pain).


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## RoSoDude (Apr 3, 2012)

Physically, it is subjective because it's just based on neurological impulses. It does only exist in the mind.

Spiritually, for me:

"We barely remember who or what came before this precious moment,We are choosing to be here right now. Hold on, stay inside
This holy reality, this holy experience.
Choosing to be here in

This body. This body holding me. Be my reminder here that I am not alone in
This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal
All this pain is an illusion.

Alive, I

In this holy reality, in this holy experience. Choosing to be here in

This body. This body holding me. Be my reminder here that I am not alone in
This body, this body holding me, feeling eternal
All this pain is an illusion.

Twirling round with this familiar parable.
Spinning, weaving round each new experience.
Recognize this as a holy gift and celebrate this chance to be alive and breathing.

This body holding me reminds me of my own mortality.
Embrace this moment. Remember. We are eternal.
All this pain is an illusion."


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## ThoughtBox (Apr 23, 2013)

St Vual said:


> Pain is something that I would find to be objective and subjective, as most physical pain revolves around neurological bodily functions and such. It is a good thing to feel pain, or otherwise you wouldn't realize that you were sick, or that you can't just constantly poke your fucking eyes all the time. Like a few children who don't feel pain, and such.
> 
> I don't think this is related to type though, and mostly biochemistry that exists in the person's own body though. Even things such as emotional sensitivity can be explained with science, and such.


Sorry guys. i posted this in cognitive functions because i didnt know where to put it. im still a newbie :/

this is interesting. so what your saying is pain is a good thing, and i agree. but i believe there are different forms of pain. Physical pain, Emotional pain (Caused when you lose love), Spiritual pain (Caused when you have a deep set internal conflict). i think the latter two can be much more frustrating and exhausting. we have all felt regret (spiritual pain) and most of us have felt betrayal (emotional pain) so even though the pain comes in different forms only *you* can experience that *exact* pain. because it depends on your enviornment, and every single situation is different. i believe your mindset can help a person deal with pain. if someone is prepared to be cut with a knife i think theyll be able to cope with it better having the prior knowledge and not being surprised with pain. so its all circumstantial, and therefor subjective. thats my opinion at least, the only evidence i have is the truths i pull from my life experiences and of those around me


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## LostFavor (Aug 18, 2011)

I don't think physical pain is subjective. We all instinctively know what it feels like to feel physical pain. And although some of us might have a higher tolerance for physical pain, or better mechanisms for ignoring it, we're all going to react in about the same way to prolonged physical pain. However, we don't always empathize with physical pain easily because our brains naturally block out memories of physical pain.

Emotional pain, on the other hand, is incredibly subjective. This makes sense if you think about how hard it is to understand the perspective of someone who has, for example, lost a loved one and you never have. Or lost a pet and you never have. And so on. Emotional pain is tied to events and people. Hypothetically, I won't necessarily feel the same kind of pain moving out of some kind of random apartment compared to moving away from home.

In short, physical is tied to our bodies and emotional is tied to our experiences. Thus, by nature, physical is going to be objective and emotional is going to be subjective.


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## Bricolage (Jul 29, 2012)

I don't see how pain could be objective. It's an internally felt sensation, by definition. That's pain. How could pain be objective? Perhaps an Adam Sandler movie?


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## HighClassSavage (Nov 29, 2012)

unctuousbutler said:


> I don't see how pain could be objective. It's an internally felt sensation, by definition. That's pain. How could pain be objective? Perhaps an Adam Sandler movie?


Just because it's internal doesn't automatically make it subjective. Would you call a bowel movement subjective as well?


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## Bricolage (Jul 29, 2012)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Just because it's internal doesn't automatically make it subjective. Would you call a bowel movement subjective as well?


Of course I would. Also, I would contend being internal is a sine qua non for being subjective. Look at that word, *subject*ive. Reliant on the subject. Objective: reliant on the object or environment. This is why Ti is sometimes called subjective logic and Te (extraverted thinking) is sometimes called objective logic.


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## HighClassSavage (Nov 29, 2012)

unctuousbutler said:


> Of course I would. Also, I would contend being internal is a sine qua non for being subjective. Look at that word, *subject*ive. Reliant on the subject. Objective: reliant on the object or environment. This is why Ti is sometimes called subjective logic and Te (extraverted thinking) is sometimes called objective logic.


Pain is pain. A bowel movement is a bowel movement. How you tolerate or interpret pain _is subjective_ but that does not make the pain or bowel movement _not_ pain or a bowel movement. Pain, by definition, is an actual sensation triggered by an actual stimulus that is independent to the consciousness. Pain is the form of our awareness. Injury is the object of that awareness. Pain is a direct result of injury. There is no choice about this kind of awareness, no subjectivity what-so-ever. Your experience of pain is not reliant on the subject only how you interpret that experience of pain is. Unless you mean to tell me that if two normal, healthy individuals got punched in the face that it's possible for one to experience pain while the other does not.

EDIT: Do you consciously alert yourself that you are experiencing pain? No. It is for that very reason that pain is not reliant on the subject.


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## Bricolage (Jul 29, 2012)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Pain is pain.


Is that right?


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## Animal (May 29, 2012)

I would never begrudge anyone their pain, even if they are hurt over something that doesn't matter to me. The thing I try to do is help them face it; help them feel stronger. If I see that they don't want to get stronger and feel better and they just want to feel sorry for themselves, I might point that out but it doesnt mean I wont listen. I don't think it's my responsibility to fix other people's pain and problems, but I can enjoy it when people are willing to face themselves and really go on a journey. Also, I understand the merit of being a venting board for someone who is sad or hurt or pissed off. Sometimes I appreciate a friend who can just listen while I vent and solve my own problems during the venting sesh. But if someone *expects* my support and can't respect that I have my own life and problems that's a whole other matter- not happening- I am available on my own time. If someone doesn't expect it necessarily but they're honest, I'm not really bothered by the specific subject matter. I have real problems like chronic illness but sometimes I would rather vent about a boy who doesn't like me. I am not here to judge someone because something bothers them.


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## Foibleful (Oct 2, 2012)

I'm going to avoid the whole subjective vs. objective issue, because I see what people on both sides are saying.

I do think that how people experience pain differs widely. I consider myself to have a low threshold of physical pain. My skin is much more sensitive to stimuli than other people I know and so it doesn't take much for things to feel painful. If the whole Highly Sensitive Person theory is true, I certainly fit the bill. On the other hand, how we express our pain can differ as well. I tend not to say much, be stoic; my husband can be quite dramatic about expressing the pain he is feeling.


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## DAPHNE XO (Jan 16, 2012)

Type of pain: no.
Depth of pain: no.
_Perceived_ type of pain: yes
_perceived_ depth of pain: yes.


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## NT the DC (May 31, 2012)

Pain is totally subjective.

To answer: *@aef8234
*
Because electrical impulses being sent to the brain still have to be processed by the brain.
As such the perception of pain for every individual is unique.
And even the impulses are not going to be the same in everyone, as the same noxious stimulus can excite a different amount of receptors from person to person.
The perception of pain is very multifactoral.


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## Number Six (Mar 4, 2013)

Pain is objective. Suffering is subjective. 

If you embrace pain, you will endure it 100 times more effectively than someone who resists it. The pain is still identical, physiologically speaking. Ask any masochist.


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## Monsieur Melancholy (Nov 16, 2012)

I think the experience of pain is very subjective. People differ widely on their thresholds, and their thresholds can be altered with experience.


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## Carmine Ermine (Mar 11, 2012)

Pain in its raw form, as it's happening in the present, is objective and is still Se even when it's emotional pain. It's the raw data your nerves are giving you. The other functions can filter it a lot, though, and this is why it can be seen as subjective. For example, if you get a burn:

Your experience of previous burns adds Si subjectivity to it.
Your intuition of what it's like to be burned adds Ni subjectivity to it.
Your opinions of how it is add subjectivity from Te/Fe/Ti/Fi.

Yes, even a Te/Fe filter makes pain subjective. Because the objective component of pain (physical or emotional) is only Se, any Fe- or Te-based ideas on pain distort the objective data, making it subjective.


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## NT the DC (May 31, 2012)

I am still confused why people consider pain objective.
Are any of you familiar with the pain pathway? 

In a nut shell:
1) Noxious stimulus
2) Stimulates nociceptors
3) Nociceptors fire differently based on their thresholds which are unique in the individual and as such can vary widely.

As a result some people have hyper/hyposensitivity and a stimulus like light touch can fire nociceptors or you can use a pinwheel on someone and get nothing.
The reasons for something like hypersensitivity are multifactoral - things like inflammation and emotions can impact the threshold of nociceptors, injury can effect things like the spinalthalamic tract which wouldn't allow you to feel pain in the area it is responsible for.

4) After the action potential is fired it stimulates areas of the brain primarily the PAG and the stimulus is interpreted as painful.

The perception of pain is dependent on so many things which can be influenced by so many things lol.
That's why you see things like phantom limb pain and psychogenic pain which are actually devoid of what MOST consider a noxious stimulus.

Simply put: The severity of pain doesn't always correspond with the amount of tissue damage sustained.

So I am really curious what the pro-objective pain arguments are.


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## Skum (Jun 27, 2010)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Pain is pain. A bowel movement is a bowel movement. How you tolerate or interpret pain _is subjective_ but that does not make the pain or bowel movement _not_ pain or a bowel movement. Pain, by definition, is an actual sensation triggered by an actual stimulus that is independent to the consciousness. Pain is the form of our awareness. Injury is the object of that awareness. *Pain is a direct result of injury.* There is no choice about this kind of awareness, no subjectivity what-so-ever. Your experience of pain is not reliant on the subject only how you interpret that experience of pain is. Unless you mean to tell me that if two normal, healthy individuals got punched in the face that it's possible for one to experience pain while the other does not.
> 
> EDIT: Do you consciously alert yourself that you are experiencing pain? No. It is for that very reason that pain is not reliant on the subject.


There is such a thing as phantom limb pain. Some amputees will feel intense pain in limbs they don't have anymore.

And some types of brain damage will make people experience pain, but it doesn't really bother them. Pain has an emotional component. So they're not really IN pain, but they feel pain. At that point, the distinction becomes really blurry. Like, what does pain _mean? _

The subjective/objective argument is kind of off. If you understand more about the pain pathway it becomes clearer. Refer to @_NT the DC_ 's post. There's a lot of machinery involved and lots of places in the pathway where your emotions and your state of mind will have an actual effect on the pain you feel.

To be honest I have a feeling pro-objective pain arguments will be made from ignorance of how the process works. I'd love to be proven wrong though.



JungleDisco said:


> Type of pain: no.
> Depth of pain: no.
> _Perceived_ type of pain: yes
> _perceived_ depth of pain: yes.


Here's something neat I learned in class: pain can be learned. If you "tough out" an injury, you'll end up making the synapses on pain receptors stronger, and lower your pain threshold! And people have different pain thresholds. As a genetic example, redheads typically have lower pain thresholds. So a smaller stimulus would cause them pain than it would in you. 
So you're both getting the same stimulus, but you are feeling different depth of pain.
And maybe you can get it to where you both feel the same depth of pain, but you'd probably be getting it from different stimuli.

And type of pain can also vary! Anxiety can cause headaches in some people, stomach aches in others, and pain in the throat for still more. Being sore after sex feels AWESOME, being sore after being forced into a shitty job feels awful! Objective vs perceived is a false dichotomy here.


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## ManWithoutHats (Jun 2, 2012)

ThoughtBox said:


> thats my question. i believe it is. i believe we all deal with pain differently. i have the ability to block out pain. we know certain people are better at dealing with pain then others, but why? do we experience it differently? what does pain mean to you? we all know what it feels like, and we all try to avoid it. it is my belief that the things that cause you the greatest pain are the things you can learn from the most. physically, emotionally, and spiritually. so what does pain mean to you and how does it affect you in your everyday life?
> 
> please leave your thoughts. hopefully we can all learn something from this thread


Yes to everything you said. To me, pain as an objective phenomenon isn't even comprehendible.. perhaps in a neurological sense if you are a materialist, but other than that, what does it mean for pain to be objective?


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## Carmine Ermine (Mar 11, 2012)

The line between objective & subjective is not clear... in reality you could say everything is subjective as we can only infer everything using subjective experiences (consciousness). Or you could say everything is objective because how something is perceived depends on objective atoms that make up the structures that embody the perception itself.


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## INFJane (Apr 6, 2011)

ThoughtBox said:


> physically, emotionally, and spiritually. so what does pain mean to you and how does it affect you in your everyday life?


My physical pain tolerance is off the charts wicked cray. Each time I've needed a trip to the ER, some one has given me a band-aid because my reaction wasn't severe enough to guess that my arm was broken.. or that i would need stitches.. My mother gives terrible medical advise. Last fall my throat was in pain, so she told me to gargle with salt water and go to work. I had strep. I served people ice cream. 

I warned her I'd sue if she wouldn't stop improvising medical advise. Just because a woman is a mother does not mean that she is talented at nurturing or healing her child's pain.

Emotional? Only sociopaths are resistant to emotional pain. Pain is pain... is pain... is pain... get it?

What is spiritual pain?

you know, if you say 'pain' enough times it stops sounding like a real word


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## ThoughtBox (Apr 23, 2013)

INFJane said:


> What is spiritual pain?


i guess spiritual pain isnt a good way to describe it. maybe there is no such thing as spiritual pain but i think what i was hinting at is spiritual confliction. when you are conflicted by an idea or concept and it consumes you. i dont know you so i dont know your beliefs, but when my morals are broken, or one of my beliefs are broken, i experience a feeling of imbalance. like something is missing or ive been doing something wrong. i guess it isnt pain in the traditional sense, but (subjectively) it is pain none the less.


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## Peripatetic (Jul 17, 2012)

Skum said:


> To be honest I have a feeling pro-objective pain arguments will be made from ignorance of how the process works. I'd love to be proven wrong though.





NT the DC said:


> So I am really curious what the pro-objective pain arguments are.


Well, the objective argument is pretty straight forward, they just argue there is the pain signal that travels through the body, which is objective (since it's made of atoms which are objects) and there is the pain sensation, which is subjective since no matter how many times you you split open an atom, you never see the sensation of pain in the atom. The point being the sensation doesn't exist in the atoms or any object for that matter, it exists only in the mind or the "subject". See qualia. Then a hard line empiricist would take the extra step and argue that we have no observations of the self or mind, therefore there is no subject or subjective. Consequently, all pain is objective.

But maybe that's not the question you're asking. Maybe like @_LostFavor_ you're asking 'must we all react the same way to pain?' (Though that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with objective vs subjective, that is a matter of perception vs hardwiring) Anyway, to that question I say no, neither physical nor emotional. I would say emotional pain is 90% perception, and physical pain is probably between 40-70% perception. I would make the case for the emotional pain by pointing to modern psychology, which states that you "feel how you think". Ie CBT. I would make the physical pain case by pointing to this movement among women who change their perception of childbirth through thought, at which point they no longer feel the pain of it. Actually some even get orgasms. Quite the opposite of pain lol.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8EQ_-irO50w


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## bluekitdon (Dec 19, 2012)

Feeling pain is universal, it is our body's way of protecting us. Touch the hot skillet, ouch that hurts, maybe I shouldn't do that.

That being said, how people react to pain is very controllable. Just look at any martial artist, professional athlete, etc and you will see the level of pain that can be endured with enough practice is phenomenal. If you can practice enduring certain things, I believe that the actual pain level experienced can also be reduced as your body decides that it is not worth alarming you about things that occur on a regular basis and builds up a resistance to the pain. For example, many people may be in pain after running just a few miles, but highly trained athletes can run for hours with little discomfort.


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## ounkeo (May 23, 2013)

aef8234 said:


> How is a reaction caused by electrical impulses from nerve endings subjective?!


The electrical impulse may happen but how it gets interpreted for each person can be quite different.

For example, when I got my tattoos, I found the physical experience quite... nice. It was actually very ticklish whereas others have stated it ranged from mild pain to extreme pain.

So yes, it can be quite subjective. I press my bruises because it creates a feeling of elation in me even though there is a blunt type of pain to it. If I want to physically torture my wife, I press her bruises. It's agonising for her.

Different people have different thresholds for pain and different ways of dealing with it. What is severe for one person may be mild or even forgettable to another.


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

ounkeo said:


> The electrical impulse may happen but how it gets interpreted for each person can be quite different.
> 
> For example, when I got my tattoos, I found the physical experience quite... nice. It was actually very ticklish whereas others have stated it ranged from mild pain to extreme pain.
> 
> ...


I was talking about the objective sensation of pain.
Not the subjective perception of pain.

Yes, there is objectivity in the world, the material world.


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## ounkeo (May 23, 2013)

aef8234 said:


> I was talking about the objective sensation of pain.
> Not the subjective perception of pain.
> Yes, there is objectivity in the world, the material world.


is it still considered pain if it doesn't hurt?


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

ounkeo said:


> is it still considered pain if it doesn't hurt?


Is it still a smell if it doesn't touch your olfactory gland?


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## Slider (Nov 17, 2009)

I was just thinking of this today.

Most people see pain as an intruder.

Suddenly, you feel discomfort in a certain part of your body and are forced to make applicable accommodations to deal with the discomfort. What some people don't understand is that there is a way to make that pain a part of you, instead of just something that is affecting you.

A few years ago, I hurt my neck which lead to nerve damage that affected my left arm and hand. I couldn't sleep for 2-3 months, because of the pain I was experiencing. I could only sleep for 2-3 hours until the pain would wake me up. Sometimes I would pass out from exhaustion and get a few hours of sleep that way. It was horrible.

Towards the end, I finally discovered a way to "own" the pain and make it mine. I was able to calm myself and accept what was happening to me. After that, I was able to sleep through the night.

The nerves in my left arm are still damaged, but I no longer experience any pain.

It was a strange experience.


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## Elyasis (Jan 4, 2012)

aef8234 said:


> Is it still a smell if it doesn't touch your olfactory gland?


Pain has no meaning outside of the subject. It isn't like an objective experience because you cannot measure it objectively. You have to rely on the subjects interpretation of how much pain they are in.

Find a way to measure pain accurately without relying on the subject and it gets to be objective.

You can guess based on their injury and the subjective description of the usual amount of pain people with that injury endure. But that isn't objective.

In other words. The smell is subjective. The particles that make up the smell we perceive are objective and so is the olfactory gland. But the smell is a subjective experience that you cannot remove from the individual.


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

Elyasis said:


> Pain has no meaning outside of the subject. It isn't like an objective experience because you cannot measure it objectively. You have to rely on the subjects interpretation of how much pain they are in.
> 
> Find a way to measure pain accurately without relying on the subject and it gets to be objective.
> 
> ...


And that had any relation to the subject at hand, how?


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## Elyasis (Jan 4, 2012)

aef8234 said:


> And that had any relation to the subject at hand, how?


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## aef8234 (Feb 18, 2012)

Elyasis said:


>


Good for you!


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## countrygirl90 (Oct 11, 2012)

It depends on what is going inside the mind of person who is subjected to pain, if he/she is already burdened with some other distressed issues of his/her life then even small incidents can trigger or make them feel great deal of pain which otherwise wouldn't have effected them ,also if he/she is in a positive and good state of mental health then most hurtful words or situations wouldn't bother them much.
Tolerance for physical and emotional pain differs among different individuals in different situations .


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## Elyasis (Jan 4, 2012)

aef8234 said:


> Good for you!


Thanks! I really needed that extra bit of support today. You truly are an inspiration to us all.

No hard feelings champ?


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## Skum (Jun 27, 2010)

Peripatetic said:


> Well, the objective argument is pretty straight forward, they just argue there is the pain signal that travels through the body, which is objective (since it's made of atoms which are objects) and there is the pain sensation, which is subjective since no matter how many times you you split open an atom, you never see the sensation of pain in the atom. The point being the sensation doesn't exist in the atoms or any object for that matter, it exists only in the mind or the "subject". See qualia. Then a hard line empiricist would take the extra step and argue that we have no observations of the self or mind, therefore there is no subject or subjective. Consequently, all pain is objective.
> 
> But maybe that's not the question you're asking. Maybe like @_LostFavor_ you're asking 'must we all react the same way to pain?' (Though that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with objective vs subjective, that is a matter of perception vs hardwiring) Anyway, to that question I say no, neither physical nor emotional. I would say emotional pain is 90% perception, and physical pain is probably between 40-70% perception. I would make the case for the emotional pain by pointing to modern psychology, which states that you "feel how you think". Ie CBT. I would make the physical pain case by pointing to this movement among women who change their perception of childbirth through thought, at which point they no longer feel the pain of it. Actually some even get orgasms. Quite the opposite of pain lol.
> 
> Orgasm During Childbirth - YouTube


The objective argument doesn't even hold up past the idea that it is a phenomenon that objectively exists in the world so I think it's a moot point. I think we can all agree that pain does indeed exist in the world.


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## like hella days (May 15, 2013)

*Is pain subjective?*

Yes honey
this is why we lean on eachother


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## LilyPhem (Mar 27, 2013)

Once I found out I couldn't have certain types of local, I had to face up to doing some things without anaesthesia, so I know that if you dull some of your other senses, and just distract your mind, you can handle a pretty high threshold of pain (eg having teeth drilled to the nerve). 19 body piercings later, I'm fine with that sort of pain. I know when I had stitches removed in my hand his week, because I was convinced it would hurt, it did.

However, having said that all of that, I will take the general option whenever I can. I am only human


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## LadyO.W.BernieBro (Sep 4, 2010)

The same trigger can affect me differently at different times so trying to gain an objective measure of how that pain would affect myself or anyone is faulty.

l liked at @RoSoDude's explanation the most.

l don't think some people view pain as an illusion at all but that's what it is for me. There's a filter everything goes through before it's interpreted as...what l can only call "real" and l guess that'd mean objective.

When l see a car coming toward me on the street, l don't interpret that subjectively and rationalize that it might not hit me so it's ''real'' and objective.

l can feel pain from emotional triggers but it's like it never quite makes it through that reality filter and becomes an objective thing. l feel the pain in a universal sense. lt's sort of like using a stand-in to experience the pain for you.


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## LadyO.W.BernieBro (Sep 4, 2010)

INFJane said:


> My physical pain tolerance is off the charts wicked cray. Each time I've needed a trip to the ER, some one has given me a band-aid because my reaction wasn't severe enough to guess that my arm was broken.. or that i would need stitches.. My mother gives terrible medical advise. Last fall my throat was in pain, so she told me to gargle with salt water and go to work. I had strep. I served people ice cream.
> 
> I warned her I'd sue if she wouldn't stop improvising medical advise. Just because a woman is a mother does not mean that she is talented at nurturing or healing her child's pain.
> 
> ...


See, l think it's misleading but also a bit dangerous to popularize that viewpoint.

There's a reason perfectly normal people without a feeling preference see themselves match up with some of the sociopath descriptions.

This isn't correct to say..IMO. A non sociopathic person can develop a resistance to emotional pain and frankly wouldn't lose much from trying to do so but if a person is looking to develop emotional intelligence and takes pride in that, they may prefer to experience pain. Though whether this will actually result in emotional intelligence is not guaranteed.

What it is does result in is those who prefer to learn through their emotions considering themselves to be more empathetic by default and a ton of punk ass kids believing that they're sociopaths when it probably isn't the case :kitteh:


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