Do These Destructive/Sadistic Tendencies Suggest I'm a Type 8? - Page 5

Do These Destructive/Sadistic Tendencies Suggest I'm a Type 8?

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This is a discussion on Do These Destructive/Sadistic Tendencies Suggest I'm a Type 8? within the What's my Enneagram type? forums, part of the Enneagram Personality Theory Forum category; Originally Posted by Boss You don't need to make it clearer in your statements. Before your tritype post, you stated ...

  1. #41

    Quote Originally Posted by Boss View Post
    You don't need to make it clearer in your statements. Before your tritype post, you stated you were an 8, not a 1 (I quote). Now, if you were referring 8 fix vs. 1 fix, that's different. I may well have misunderstood you on the matter of dod/doi and tritype schematics. My points on the tritype descriptions and their utility as far as self-typing goes, still hold.

    As for arguing your core type, I lean more in the direction of cp 6w5 than 3 after hearing more from you. I've talked about why in my post on this page. Initially, I was considering 1 or 3 for your core. That has changed.

    As for evidence, I have presented plenty in my earlier posts. You may have another look.
    Right, so you're pointing to my security needs. Well, you're right, I do have a security need. But there's really only one, and when it's fulfilled I no longer embody most of the characteristics of a type 6.

    I can't really explain how I know I'm an 8 and, frankly, I don't feel the need to have to explain myself before you.

    3-8-6 is my tritype. I've done the research, I've read the descriptions, I've looked into myself. There's not much that can really bend that at this point.

    But, as I've said earlier, you have helped me explore the various types considerably and have brought up that I might be a type 6 for the first time, and upon reading it -- it is definitely my head fix. It describes why I thought I was a type 5 but in a more perfect/complete way (which is why 6w5 is perfect). But it is not my core drive.. it just isn't.
    marzipan01, Naqsh and Choice thanked this post.

  2. #42

    Quote Originally Posted by Boss View Post
    Fair Maiden, what Type are you this evening? @marzipan01 :P
    I'm a 5.

    grunch grunch grunch
    Naqsh thanked this post.

  3. #43

    @AbioticPrime

    You're not answerable to me;). I know that. I pointed out more than security needs in my post. I talked about control, and as an 8 fixed 3 myself, I can tell you that achievement has never been a way for me to regain control over my life because others were controlling it. 8 fixed id types don't relinquish control over their lives or at least don't register loss of control as helplessness. Such conscious recognition of helplessness is not 8/8 fixed id type concern. I can totally see why you type as a 3 because you have very..very strong 3 influence there. Telling 3 and 6 apart can be tough, in some cases. Though, I have told you where I stand on your core type (cp6). Anyway, I have not seen anything from you here that suggests an 8 fix. In fact, so much points away from it. I talked about repression of impulses/emotions which you talked about throughout your questionnaire. If you have done all your research, you should know what id types are all about. You would also know that a over-controlling emotions is a superego drive not an id drive?

    I respect that you have done your research, but I disagree with your conclusions. And, I asked you about your sources because in the past year I have read nearly everything enneagram related online. Like many others who've been studying the Enneagram for a while, I know that there are only two-three worthwhile descriptions online. I linked them to you. On the basis of said information, your answers as well as considerable research I have done in my own time (which includes reading seminal texts in Enneagram theory over the course of a year+), my own understanding of the types and in-depth reading of your responses, I don't see you as 8 fixed. Not even close. This isn't to one up you lol. Right now, I doubt that you have read Naranjo, Palmer, Maitri and the likes and truly looked into cognitive distortions and neuroses specific to each type ---because frankly this stuff is not available on the web, for free. Some people have somewhat..you know..uncomplicated lives and they're easy for others type just as they find it easy to self-type (And get it right, many times). For some other people, their lives have been rather complex (thanks to controlling parents, other environment factors etc.) and so their personalities take on layers that are hard to peel through to get to the core--not just for others but even for themselves. You are certainly in this category, which is why I didn't immediately type you as X. I looked further because I knew I wasn't dealing with a straightforward stereotypical questionnaire.


    _________________________________________________

    Since I didn't get into a few things to my satisfaction, I will say them here.The core themes in your answers are: security, regaining lost control and maintaining said control, controlling emotions (not just ignoring them), questioning, protecting your loved ones, your answers on anxiety and trust as well as your elaboration on these points is incredibly 6-ish and points away from core 3. The most secure you feel is when you have persistent friendship. core 6s often look to security in the form of friendship/groups/belief systems. You talk about being fearless. Trust me, most cp6s would say that they don't fear death. Fear is like a cliff challenging them to climb it. They are so used to overcoming anxiety, that they start to feel fearless and very confident in themselves. I hope reading your answers again in light of all your research will make this evident to you.

    I am quoting you:
    I don't fear much, not even death itself. But what I do fear, I try to get a grasp of by any means possible -- whether it be controlling the environment around the subject of fear, or controlling the subject itself.
    This is core 6 cp. Pre-emptively striking against fear and controlling it before it can control you is cp6 (6 fixed threes will be somewhat aware of negative possibilities, but they do not fixate on fear in this manner, preemptively controlling the subject [of fear] to avoid losing control is not core 3). You clearly said that you want control so you don't lose yourself . This, in your own words, is the primary reason why you need control. 3s seek control over their lives because increased control means more achievement, and more achievement means more validation. They don't do it because they're afraid of losing themselves or being pushed around by other people's decisions. Like I said, it's a core id type. An 8 fixed 3 will not allow anyone to decide for them from a young age.


    As someone who has mistyped as an 8, thanks to relying on limited information available online, I will encourage you to actually buy some good books and read further. You don't need to defend your current typing any further. You don't need to prove anything to me or explain anything. I know where I stand on your type. I am certain, however, that you have more to learn and more to explore about your type.

    This is my last word to you as of now. In future, if you ever feel like asking any questions or discussing things..feel free to get in touch.

    later
    Last edited by Naqsh; 05-06-2012 at 07:37 AM.
    n2freedom thanked this post.

  4. #44

    This will be a good exercise for me to put my thoughts onto paper.

    @Boss.

    Source: Enneagram Institute: Enneagram Testing & Training

    Home of the best-selling Enneagram authors Don Riso and Russ Hudson, and the Riso-Hudson Enneagram Type Indicator.
    Top ranked Enneagram site (Alexa)
    First, 1 vs 8, respectively:

    Key Motivations: Want to be right, to strive higher and improve everything, to be consistent with their ideals, to justify themselves, to be beyond criticism so as not to be condemned by anyone.
    Key Motivations: Want to be self-reliant, to prove their strength and resist weakness, to be important in their world, to dominate the environment, and to stay in control of their situation.
    While they both resonate with me, I will without a second's doubt jeopardize consistency with ideals and putting myself in a position of criticism to assert myself, achieve close-ended results, prove my position, and most importantly to stay in control.

    I thrive on criticism. I'll often poke and prod until I get answers I feel are coming from a truly honest place. Not necessarily so I can improve on where I'm faulty in the long run (1), but more so so I'll have a better understanding and assessment of the situation and how I can respond and turn it to my advantage (8). Sometimes the answer to that is to improve myself, but this improvement is coming from a place where I'll have a grasp over the outcome of things in the long run and sometimes just to test my ability to persevere over myself -- not to fulfill some ideal vision of perfection.

    I don't give a shit about being right. I want to know the truth. Many times I'll throw out a proposition just so it can be proven wrong so I can come closer to what the truth really is.

    I have an inflated sense of importance (8, 3, or both in my case), which I do try to tone down. I don't try to tone it down because I feel ashamed or corrupt (1) but because being blatantly cocky doesn't cut it in the world, it's comparable to trying to pull out of a Chinese finger trap with force.

    Now to why I'm an 8 in-depth:

    Type Eight Overview
    We have named personality type Eight The Challenger because, of all the types, Eights enjoy taking on challenges themselves as well as giving others opportunities that challenge them to exceed themselves in some way. Eights are charismatic and have the physical and psychological capacities to persuade others to follow them into all kinds of endeavors—from starting a company, to rebuilding a city, to running a household, to waging war, to making peace.
    From childhood, I've always been a challenger, both of myself and of others. On the racing track, I was always the kid pushing beyond his limits -- giving me the best mile time in my school of 2,400 people, I was always the toughest kid on the wrestling team pushing myself past the limits of breakdown during workouts, and pushing my limits in matches even beyond what was required to take down the other person -- just to feel that thrill of battle, earning me an undefeated record my final year. I've always enjoyed encouraging others to push themselves beyond what they think they're capable of doing. Sometimes I push them too hard and the encouraging comes off more as commanding. When convincing a group of people to go my way, I'm rarely overcome by others -- I confidently speak the reasons why it should happen fully, completely, and surely, without flicker or pause, and people listen. They agree. They follow.

    Eights have enormous willpower and vitality, and they feel most alive when they are exercising these capacities in the world. They use their abundant energy to effect changes in their environment—to “leave their mark" on it—but also to keep the environment, and especially other people, from hurting them and those they care about.
    I just explained this up above. But to add on, I'm the guy who will stay up 48 hours straight just to finish a project, and won't complain or doubt my path any step of the way. I'm the guy who enjoys being a voice for the voiceless -- I'll often cut people off who are struggling to explain something to state it clearly in a single, to the point sentence. When I see signs of weakness, indecisiveness, doubt, I'm the one to stand up and seize the torch.

    When Eights are emotionally healthy, however, they have a resourceful, “can-do” attitude as well as a steady inner drive. They take the initiative and make things happen with a great passion for life. They are honorable and authoritative—natural leaders who have a solid, commanding presence. Their groundedness gives them abundant “common sense” as well as the ability to be decisive. Eights are willing to “take the heat,” knowing that any decision cannot please everyone. But as much as possible, they want to look after the interests of the people in their charge without playing favorites. They use their talents and fortitude to construct a better world for everyone in their lives.
    This is exactly me, and this is exactly what I am doing, and what I intend to keep doing. I couldn't have phrased it better.

    Conclusion: I am overwhelmingly a type 8. There are a few type 1 tendencies in me, but at the end of the day -- it's not me. Type 8 is. We're done here.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    marzipan01 thanked this post.

  5. #45

    @Boss.

    Now, type 6 vs 3 respectively:

    Key Motivations: Want to have security, to feel supported by others, to have certitude and reassurance, to test the attitudes of others toward them, to fight against anxiety and insecurity.
    Key Motivations: Want to be affirmed, to distinguish themselves from others, to have attention, to be admired, and to impress others.
    This is the way it stacks up for me. Type 6 fears/motivations are what lie deep within me -- the part of me I always keep hidden and buried, but still seek to feed and nourish. Having a sense of belonging/community makes me feel at ease, safe, happy -- like everything is going right.

    Type 3 is my face. When I'm in a relaxed state, I am acting exactly type 3 -- this is the state I'm in for most of the day, every day. I seek to impress and please, I look for feedback on how I'm doing (affirmation), I distinguish myself from others by making a name for myself (but at the same time, don't set myself too far apart from my people, that threatens my type 6 drive). I strive for achievements for myself and together with others -- I strive for efficiency and clarity. I want to have the rules, bounds, goals, guidelines established so the journey to the end can be a direct and easy journey.

    Type 8 is my body, my muscle. At the first sense of resistance, I'll give a couple chances for the person to correct themselves, then I'll switch to type 8 and destroy. Conquer.


    Type 6 doesn't really manifest itself much externally -- it's more of an internal drive I'm constantly trying to feed. The only people who see my type 6 are those closest to me.

    I like to view myself as a protector. One that can be both tough and caring. One that can be the voice of the people, but also be of the people.



    So, as I've said earlier, I'm dealing with 3, 8, 6. I'm not sure where to place my type 6, since it seems to be my core drive -- the one I'm trying to feed, but also the type I act least like on a day to day basis. It's not a type I rely on to get me what I want. It's more so the type that tells me what I want. But as I've said, type 3 is always my face, type 8 is my muscle.
    marzipan01 thanked this post.

  6. #46

    @AbioticPrime

    6 and 3 are both extroverted judging.
    8 is typically associated with being extroverted and judging.

    I imagine that 3, 6, and 8 correlate quite nicely with ENTJ.
    It's interesting to me that you say that you want to have a community and a sense of belonging.

    I think that you have it figured out. You're the justice fighter.
    6 and 8 together would explain the issues with the gf--6 and 8 together wants loyalty X2.
    With the 3 I imagine, you're able to smooth over the negative consequences of 6 and 8's reactivity with awareness of how other people are reacting to you and responding appropriately.

    3 wants to be smooth and seen as successful
    6 wants reassurance from others
    8 wants to be the master of your own fate.

    Combining those three, I imagine that you're very aware of other people's needs and expectations while at the same time going about your life with the oomf of the 8.
    AbioticPrime thanked this post.

  7. #47

    I decided to look through here because there are some people who like to accuse and ask leading questions in order to get answers they like rather than the truth...


    Quote Originally Posted by AbioticPrime View Post
    Main Questions

    1. What drives you in life? What do you look for?

    I look to live life for whatever I will it to be. I look to iron out all issues and strive to create a perfect existence for myself and those around me, even though the limit will never reach infinity (hopefully you understand my calculus reference). I strive to protect my loved ones,
    I see this as 6+8

    and to achieve perfect control of myself and my emotions.
    The perfection seeking types (aka the competence types) are 3,5, and 1. Since you bring up emotions, I assume it's 3 as that is the perfection type associated with the heart.


    2. What do you hope to accomplish in your life?

    I hope to reach happiness, and find means to stay there.
    What do you think will bring you happiness?

    I hope to be an example for those struggling below me. I hope to accomplish my goals, and learn to get what I want in healthy ways. I hope to learn how to make life less of a struggle.
    Here I sense a desire to connect and a sense of personal responsibility to that connection. 368 fits here very well.

    3. What do you hope to avoid doing or being? What values are important to you?

    I loathe being emotional. I loathe falling trap to an empty nothing, which taints my perception of the world and causes me to make poor decisions -- I want to have full control of the car when I drive, the car being me. I dislike being a passive bystander. I won't be a doormat. I dislike being too selfish and narcissistic.
    3-6 pulling together in combination with 8. You want to be successful--the best--and yet you want to connect and then the force of wanting to be in control of your life.

    Values. A little extra aggression can make my task so much more pleasurable. Personally, I value contribution, willingness to work to the end, sticking to words, taking initiative, vocalizing (sometimes I personally don't vocalize enough), persistence. And for myself I value action, planning, independence.

    4. What are your biggest fears (not including phobias)? Why?

    I don't feel comfortable disclosing this.
    Aww.. :)
    Good decision.

    Okay. I think 836 or 836 or 386. I think 6 is definitely last. Could be 836 or 386. Either one.
    AbioticPrime thanked this post.

  8. #48

    Quote Originally Posted by marzipan01 View Post
    What do you think will bring you happiness?
    I'm starting to learn that happiness isn't an end goal. Happiness is in every moment's experience. It doesn't exist in the past nor the future.

    But in order to experience it, one has to be free of their deep burdens -- resentments, regrets, frustrations, etc.

    Honestly, I'm starting to learn that letting these emotions seep into my anger and channeling my anger in productive ways is proving to be extremely helpful with reminding me to see happiness in each passing moment. Anger for me is aggression, and channeled aggression gives me space, boundary, and a sense of general contentment.

    But bottom line is, happiness comes from a lack of emotional baggage, and a surplus of appreciation for everything.
    marzipan01 thanked this post.

  9. #49

    Quote Originally Posted by AbioticPrime View Post
    I'm starting to learn that happiness isn't an end goal. Happiness is in every moment's experience. It doesn't exist in the past nor the future.

    But in order to experience it, one has to be free of their deep burdens -- resentments, regrets, frustrations, etc.

    Honestly, I'm starting to learn that letting these emotions seep into my anger and channeling my anger in productive ways is proving to be extremely helpful with reminding me to see happiness in each passing moment. Anger for me is aggression, and channeled aggression gives me space, boundary, and a sense of general contentment.

    But bottom line is, happiness comes from a lack of emotional baggage, and a surplus of appreciation for everything.
    that sounds like 7 could be a wing 8w7 or something

  10. #50

    AbioticPrime... Idunno if you're already content with a decision on your enneagram or not, but you've written a lot and its hard for me to sift through everything you wrote because you wrote entirely about your actions and not the kind of person you are. (That at least clues me that you are an ENTJ because I have this communication issue with many other ENTJ's as well.)

    I think there is a much easier way to find your enneagram type, namely, how do you behave when you're in an exceptional mood, and how do you behave when you're in an awful and stressed out mood? This would clue to us your integration and disintegration and you would be whichever enneagram falls inbetween the two.
    Last edited by DJArendee; 05-06-2012 at 07:39 PM.


 
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