type 4 or 9?? ISFP?

type 4 or 9?? ISFP?

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This is a discussion on type 4 or 9?? ISFP? within the What's my Enneagram type? forums, part of the Enneagram Personality Theory Forum category; I wander whats the difference with type 4 and 9. I think I am an ISFP and then I cant ...

  1. #1

    type 4 or 9?? ISFP?

    I wander whats the difference with type 4 and 9. I think I am an ISFP and then I cant decide if Im a nine or a four. Can anyone tell me the difference? I can really relate to both of them. And I really can turn the thought inward and outward and feel totally crazy after a while because the one moment I think of course yes I am a nine and not a four and then I think oh my god of course I am a four not a nine. A think I can adapt to almost every person even if I somethimes is shy( somethimes i even can decide if I am shy or not. Maby thats a typycal Nine thing?). The whole of me really depends from what people I am with, what Im thinking, where I am etc. I really is confuced of who I am. I have thought many thimes that Im like everybody. I can relate to everyone and get along with them (but somethimes I can think stupid thoughts like "oh now theyre not going to like me", a little paranoid i guess ( a nine thing?) But as the four.. I have strong emotions and very empathic, and I think I am honest with my feelings.)

    Now you see I think really from every perspective and cant never decide. Is that i nine thing?

    I am extremely sencitive to.. its a four thing.. And yes I often think Im not like anybody, but thats maby both 9 and 4?

    I am highly artistic and I love to dance, sing, play piano, act, have fun, and imitate people haha. Im good at that.

    Something else I think about now.. its like Im allways in some special moode, and everything seems to look different depending on what mood I am in, even if it is the exactly same place.. I allso seem to change my mind all the thime. I cant decide anything.

    When I was little I used to have panic attacs (4 thing).

    I allways felt like I am really strange, but very sensetive and want everything to be good. I just cant stop wondering everything like this.

    I allso allways try something every weekend when I go out with friends. Like, "allright this weekend I am going to see if I am a type 9, or if I am a typ ESFP or ISFP or typ 4. Maby I am an ESFP but just a shy one? Oh no maby I am an enfp? No of course an ISFP. hmmm know I think maby I am an ISFP with i 9 enneagram and a very sensetive nine?
    haha this is what my thoughts is about. Confused!

    So.. now I hope you got an Idea of what I am after you red all this, and that was my idea.:)



  2. #2

    Maybe this will help.

    You seem primarily like a 9 though. Perhaps Fi accounts for the sensitivity. There's also the theory about the tri-fix of the Enneagram, where you use different types depending on your need for that type. You could be primarily a 9, but act like a 4 in your heart when you need to address matters of the heart.

    I think my trifix type is 9 (gut) - 5 (head) - 4 (heart).

    Some average Nines think that they are Fours because they have artistic talents and creative inclinations of one kind or another. As in the case of love not being the sole domain of Twos, artistic capacity is not the sole province of Fours. Other types can be, and often are, artists.

    Even so, the artistry of Fours is much more personal and self-revealing than that of Nines. The art of Nines often expresses idealized, mythological, and archetypal worlds–usually the real world glossed into something fantastic and wondrous. Nines are often gifted storytellers in which "...and they all lived happily ever after" is assured. (There are no unhappy endings in the Nine's world of make-believe.) By contrast, the art of Fours is generally more personal and realistic, the expression of the Four's (and of everyone's) deep longing for love, wholeness, and meaning. Fours often deal in the tragic, finding redemption in self-transcendence; Nines deal in the commonplace, finding comfort in ordinary lives and simple situations.

    The principal reason these types may be confused is that they are both withdrawn types. (PT, 433-36). Fours withdraw from others so that they can protect themselves and give themselves time to deal with their emotions. Nines, on the other hand, are withdrawn in the sense that they remove their attention from people or situations that threaten them, disengaging themselves emotionally so that they will not be anxious or upset. They cut off their identification with others (or never identify with them in the first place), identifying instead with a private idealized version of reality. Average to unhealthy Nines tune out any unpleasantness by dissociating from whatever upsets them, whereas Fours do just the opposite, brooding over their anxieties in an attempt to come to terms with them. Fours are certainly not detached from their emotions–just the reverse, they are keenly aware of them, perhaps too much so.

    Both types can therefore be shy, absent-minded, confused, and detached from the real world. The difference is that Nines are detached both from the external world and from their emotions, whereas Fours withdraw from whatever has caused them pain. (In the end, that may add up to quite a lot.) Nines see the world through rose-colored glasses, and their view of it is comforting, whereas Fours see the world from a garret window as outsiders and are not comforted: everyone else seems to be living a happier, more normal life. Contrast the personalities of Mahler (a Four) and Aaron Copland (a Nine), Saul Steinberg (a Four) and Norman Rockwell (a Nine).
    nafi thanked this post.

  3. #3
  4. #4

    9's
    • Basic Fear: Of loss and separation
    • Basic Desire: To have inner stability "peace of mind"

    Key Motivations: Want to create harmony in their environment, to avoid conflicts and tension, to preserve things as they are, to resist whatever would upset or disturb them.

    Nines also mistake themselves for Fours, but Nines tend to avoid negative emotions whereas Fours often exacerbate them.

    As Nines work through their belief that they are invisible and unimportant, they begin to recognize their true value. They see that others really do want them to show up and share themselves fully. Healthy Nines begin to understand that their very existence makes them valuable—God did not make a mistake in creating them. Their experience is much like the adventures of the Jimmy Stewart character in It's a Wonderful Life. They see that the world would be poorer without them and that they have much to contribute to their fellow human beings. They understand that the peace of mind they seek comes from fully sharing their talents, intelligence, and heart with the world. Thus, integrating Nines begin to invest time and energy in themselves, to develop their talents, and to feel a healthy degree of self-esteem. In short, they learn to take pleasure in their own value and goodness.

    Preoccupied with physical comfort, maintaining habits and satisfying appetites. The image of the lazy couch potato goes with this subtype. Strategy for getting along is to ask as little of life as possible. Can have a love of the minimal and enjoy the repetition of known routines. Distract themselves with pleasant domestic activities. Live conservatively. Consume food and drink for anaesthesia. May have large appetites, drug addictions, be physically slow moving.


    4's

    • Basic Fear: That they have no identity or personal significance
    • Basic Desire: To find themselves and their significance (to create an
      identity)

    Key Motivations: Want to express themselves and their individuality, to create and surround themselves with beauty, to maintain certain moods and feelings, to withdraw to protect their self-image, to take care of emotional needs before attending to anything else, to attract a "rescuer."

    As Fours become more aware of their tendency to brood and to fantasize about their many hurts and disappointments, they also become aware of the cost to themselves of this way of being. As they relax and accept themselves more deeply, they gradually become free of their constant emotional turbulence and their need to maintain emotional crises or to indulge themselves as a consolation prize for not fulfilling their potential. Gradually and naturally, they become more objective, grounded, and practical, like healthy Ones. They also become more realistic and able to operate in the real world. Without imposing harsh disciplines or expectations on themselves, integrating Fours want to become involved in matters beyond themselves, such as in community work, politics, the environment, or in other worthwhile ways to engage their minds and hearts. On some level, they choose no longer to indulge themselves but to live within the constraints of reality. When they do so, they find the payoffs and the pleasures—and their creativity—are deeper and much more fulfilling.


    People with this theme are often advocates of risk. Can be reckless, court disaster or just flirt lightly with loss. Take chances to stir up emotional intensity, play out melodrama or to get attention. Can have a desire to punish other through hurting themselves. The logic is, "If I die then they'll be sorry and finally appreciate me." Can seem like counterphobic Sixes in their behavior. With a 3 wing this subtype is more flamboyant and makes a show of their daring. With a 5 wing they grow more sullen and self-punishing.


    I kinda tried to pull info that showed the differences.

    Pretty much nines are adaptable yes, but more because we are unimportant in the scheme of things. Fours believe that themselves to be important.
    9's lack of self is a hole, nothing, something that's just there.
    4's it's a mountain that needs climbing, a problem that needs fixing.

    Try to look at the desires and fears, then also at the integration circle nines become more like 3:the achiever when we're are the healthiest, fours move to a one:the reformer at their healthiest. look at those to see how well it works. Some people, can have a different triad, I just listed the traditional ones.

    Also look you can try to look at the instinct stackings if you have it narrowed down to two types.
    A good source is here.

    Also, here is a good source for descriptions and just a general resource 9's the peacemaker 4's the individualist

    Hope it helps
    Tucken thanked this post.

  5. #5

    Quote Originally Posted by man1988 View Post
    I wander whats the difference with type 4 and 9. I think I am an ISFP and then I cant decide if Im a nine or a four. Can anyone tell me the difference? I can really relate to both of them. And I really can turn the thought inward and outward and feel totally crazy after a while because the one moment I think of course yes I am a nine and not a four and then I think oh my god of course I am a four not a nine. A think I can adapt to almost every person even if I somethimes is shy( somethimes i even can decide if I am shy or not. Maby thats a typycal Nine thing?). The whole of me really depends from what people I am with, what Im thinking, where I am etc. I really is confuced of who I am. I have thought many thimes that Im like everybody. I can relate to everyone and get along with them (but somethimes I can think stupid thoughts like "oh now theyre not going to like me", a little paranoid i guess ( a nine thing?) But as the four.. I have strong emotions and very empathic, and I think I am honest with my feelings.)

    Now you see I think really from every perspective and cant never decide. Is that i nine thing?
    The answer for most of what you ask here is yes, but it's not strictly a nine thing. Nines aren't indecisive we just choose to leave it to chance most of the time. If it helps I want to say it sounds 4ish.
    Quote Originally Posted by man1988 View Post

    I am extremely sencitive to.. its a four thing.. And yes I often think Im not like anybody, but thats maby both 9 and 4?

    I am highly artistic and I love to dance, sing, play piano, act, have fun, and imitate people haha. Im good at that.

    Something else I think about now.. its like Im allways in some special moode, and everything seems to look different depending on what mood I am in, even if it is the exactly same place.. I allso seem to change my mind all the thime. I cant decide anything.
    Sensitivity nines can be but we just suck it up, and downplay it. Artistic, not really a specific type trait. "Always in a different" sounds very 4ish, I've never really experienced it.

    Quote Originally Posted by man1988 View Post
    When I was little I used to have panic attacs (4 thing).

    I allways felt like I am really strange, but very sensetive and want everything to be good. I just cant stop wondering everything like this.

    I allso allways try something every weekend when I go out with friends. Like, "allright this weekend I am going to see if I am a type 9, or if I am a typ ESFP or ISFP or typ 4. Maby I am an ESFP but just a shy one? Oh no maby I am an enfp? No of course an ISFP. hmmm know I think maby I am an ISFP with i 9 enneagram and a very sensetive nine?
    haha this is what my thoughts is about. Confused!

    So.. now I hope you got an Idea of what I am after you red all this, and that was my idea.:)
    Panic attacks, I can see a nine having one, mainly from a unintentional drama, irrational, conflict arising or multiple of those. Strange possibly, want everything to be good yes.
    Trying out new identities, can't say that a nine would do that, but idk, I can't rule it out either.

    Your post sounds very 4ish, imo, but only you can decide.

    Hope it helps
    Tucken thanked this post.

  6. #6

    Six is also possible - your posts do remind me alot of a 6w7/9w8 xSFP I once knew -, although so far I'm leaning on four. Would you say you have much nervous tension? How do you become when unhealthy/stressed/deeply stressed?
    Tucken thanked this post.

  7. #7

    In your writing, I see panic, and wanting to be belong, like Liminality said, have you considered Type 6? I don't think you are a 9, but you know yourself more than I.


 

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