Unable to see what variant stacking I have - help

Originally Posted by Rim

I thought that was mostly an INFP thing.

@sleepyhead

Neither description sounds like me tbh.

Not panicky about Sp stuff at all, am not flirtations and don't display 8-ish things, don't depend on groups or authority.

Despite not being someone who is an emotional sad sack with his head in the clouds and his rose colored glasses obstructing his view of reality...most INFP stuff holds true. I prefer being independent, prefer individuals to people and I do prefer to have meaning in my life, in fact I need it.

I have seen David W. Fauvre say that the best way is to see what sets one off, what causes anxiety. For me that would be people. There is nothing in this world that causes me more problems. Whatever conflicts with my conscience always stems from people.

This would make me social variant in a sense, however not the kind the descriptions depict. I don't seek to belong, I just dislike the crap people do to each-other for whatever dumb reason.

Ah, I see. Well, here's yet another take from Tom Condon, but more or less as most of the descriptions describe:

Self-Preservation
Self-preservation Sixes often display a personal warmth that is meant to defang the potential hostility of others. If they sense aggression or disapproval in the environment, they may counterphobically zero in on it. Use humor, charm, self-depreciation to make friends out of possible enemies. Can flatter like Twos, play themselves down, work to maintain other people's affection. Act vulnerable, invite rescue. Ingratiating, but more nervously dependent than other Six subtypes. Also less in touch with their own hostility. Their home environment is sometimes important. May feel like their house is a fortress against the outside world's dangers. Worry about their ability to survive; have scary "worst-that-can-happen" fantasies. A good movie example is Bill Murray in What about Bob?. Also Teri Garr in Tootsie and The Cowardly Lion in The Wizard of Oz.

Intimate
Sixes with this subtype tend to act strong or seductive when insecure. They are much more likely to be counterphobic, especially the men. May seem like Eights, take risks, talk tough. Act powerful and in control at the times when they feel most frightened. Worry about looking weak, having their fears show. May act arrogant but aren't really. Some study martial arts or seek a way of life that makes them strong.
Beauty is another focus; trying to seem attractive so as to contain fear, get approval, and distract others. May consciously hide behind a seductive mask. Unlike Threes, Sixes know they are hiding. Can act cool and patrician or be flirty. Some have a focus on aesthetics. This subtype often has a stronger connection to the vanity of 3.
Movie examples include: Humphrey Bogart, Treasure Of The Sierra Madre; Holly Hunter, Broadcast News; Anjelica Huston, The Grifters; Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio, Class Action; Nick Nolte, The Prince Of Tides; Janine Turner, Northern Exposure. In Batman Returns, Michelle Pfeiffer turns from a meek phobic Six into a fiesty counterphobic Six. When phobic, she is a social subtype (see below). Her alter ego, the counterphobic Catwoman, is an intimate subtype.



Social
Social Sixes tend to be dutiful and especially dependent upon authority. More often phobic than counterphobic. Often dedicated to a cause. When acting alone they will still refer to others in their mind for safety and agreement. May want to see your opinion first before they will offer their own. Could change their mind to agree with you. Often align with a group or a cause and will follow the rules loyally, trying to please the boss. "Company men." Focus on a social or work context and try to be ideal within it. Could persecute others in the name of their group's ideals.

May imagine they can't live without the group's support: "If I don't play by the rules I'll be out on the street selling pencils." Later there's inevitable disillusionment. Then Six starts grumbling that they are not appreciated. Could go passive/aggressive, resent a boss they had romanticized. Connection to 9 is stronger with this subtype.
Movie examples include: Wendy Hughes, Lonely Hearts; Ben Kingsley, Pascali's Island; Martin Landau, Crimes And Misdemeanors; Jack Lemmon, The Apartment; Michelle Pfeiffer, Batman Returns; Sheila McCarthy, I've Heard The Mermaids Singing; Martin Short, Innerspace.


fineenn9styls2.html

@Rim
If I were you I'd listen to what @TreeBob said...hmm... in case I didn't misinterprete it... I thought what he meant was that you're sp/sx ascetic... meaning that sx is second but still quite weak...

It was really hard for people to type me instinct wise because of that stacking.

The other thing I already often suggested was "vibe comparison" between pictures of yourself pictures of some famous people about whom you know what instinctual stackings they have. That's how I found out I'm sp/sx ascetic. And it was confirmed by a few others.

EDIT:
If you're still another instinct kinda person you could maybe still find out through that comparison. But dunno if that's a suitable approach for everyone...

What are your feelings on money and security? Is it important for you to pay bills on time?

Problem with sp/sx ascetic is you don't seem to have the same phobic tendencies both @PlushWitch and I have. That "look at me, I'm harmless" thing.

Well, you've gone through sp/sx, so/sx... I'm actually wondering about sx/sp. What do you think?

Sexual/Self-pres
The sexual/self-pres Six is more concerned with strength, beauty and merging. With this stacking, the counterphobic energy is directed more toward individuals than towards ideas and concepts. It’s more about controlling the people closest to them. Paranoia arises when the Six feels abandoned by intimates. In the sexual/self-pres Six, doubt and anxiety is relieved by the knowledge that one's intimates really are trustworthy. These Sixes are always testing their mates for loyalty. The sexual Six is counterphobic in terms of needing to prove their desirability and strength.
This type is identified with their respective gender roles for security. They can be competitive and appear Eight-like. Male Sixes are likely to show strength as a form of counterphobia. Female Sixes are likely to emphasize their looks in order to be attractive. Security comes from knowing they are desirable. They can be very possessive of their mates. This can turn to extreme jealousy. On the down side, paranoia about the relationship can set in. The sexual/self-pres Six can appear Three-like, because of their need for validation and competitiveness.
On the high side, this subtype can be the most fiercely loyal to their friendships and to those loved ones who have gained their trust. The intensity of the sexual instinct brings with it a passion that is unwavering for the love and protection of their loved ones. The nature of the Six to "go towards," combined with the merging of the sexual instinct, can sometimes create an idealization of others, the ones that have passed the test of the Six. On the down side, the fear of losing the close relationship can cause this subtype to desperately lash out counterphobicaly.

sx/sp mystifier (midrange) - the range where the mystique of the sx/sp stack is at its strongest. unconsciously attracts with intense eye contact and other sx feelers, but holds back enough to give them a kind of untouchable or hard to get close to quality. depending on their true intentions this can either frustrate their sx or reward their functional sp cooling system. like midrangers of all stacks, there's a seemingly casual approach to meeting their variant needs as the secondary instinct is kept both in play and at bay, and others may wonder what they really want.

sx/sp wanderer (strong sp) - the most clasically 'blocked' of the sx's, often exchanging intimacy in favor of the more immediate pleasures of the body. paradoxically the most wandering and restless of the sx/sp's. pulls from sp/so to ensure the sx flood is contained by the sp levee, which can provide a sense of stability at the expense of seeming put off by others. sex can mean a hollow satisfying of the instinct while more vulnerable feelings are suspended. quietly charged but muted, and can seem self pres first.

Originally Posted by TreeBob

What are your feelings on money and security? Is it important for you to pay bills on time?

No not really. I sometimes panic (once in a month) about the state of the economy, however everyone does that nowadays. Being able to survive on my own is important, but I don't have a focus on resources, may that be time, money, food or something else. Prior to working and getting payed, I had no such concerns.

Originally Posted by Paradigm

Problem with sp/sx ascetic is you don't seem to have the same phobic tendencies both @PlushWitch and I have. That "look at me, I'm harmless" thing.

Well, you've gone through sp/sx, so/sx... I'm actually wondering about sx/sp. What do you think?

^^; no it doesen't sound anything like me.

Originally Posted by Rim

^^; no it doesen't sound anything like me.

Well, you've been given countless numbers of resources. You keep describing sx-like things (intensity), say you feel comfortable about sp things (resources), and deny being soc because of social anxiety. We've responded (IMO) accordingly. I'm not sure how else to help except to just be a sounding board for you, which is something the entire board can do in some fashion. Maybe if you tell us what you're looking for in terms of responses, we could help better. Just remember, we can't make your decision for you.

Originally Posted by Paradigm

Well, you've been given countless numbers of resources. You keep describing sx-like things (intensity), say you feel comfortable about sp things (resources), and deny being soc because of social anxiety. We've responded (IMO) accordingly. I'm not sure how else to help except to just be a sounding board for you, which is something the entire board can do in some fashion. Maybe if you tell us what you're looking for in terms of responses, we could help better. Just remember, we can't make your decision for you.

The descriptions don't fit and I don't know why. Either it is because of existential depression and my obsession with finding meaning in life. The resulting disconnect by not finding it may be leaving me with a split from instincts. Atm I'm fairly dissapointed and things seem very much in the grey zone (aka no motivation for anything other the fixing this, things seem empty and meaningless). Its gotten to a point where it is endangering my relationship with others, work, health and it has stopped me in my tracks.

...or I have disconnected myself so much from my primary instinct, denying it, that I lost track of what I need.

I'm just trying to find answers and am not looking for a specific answer. I want to know what drives me so I can reconnect with it and figure out why I feel empty and lost all the time. Something is missing and I don't know what, I want to figure it out and fix it. I require what is missing in order to continue on.

This state has been around for quite some time so i don't remember how it was before.

The economy is resources and you panic once a month about them. Sounds Sp to me. I also agree with the comments made by Paradigm. I am not seeing any So at all so I would concentrate on Sp and Sx. Only you can say the order of strength, but if you are depressed (you sound like it) then variant stacking is the least of your worries.

Originally Posted by TreeBob

The economy is resources and you panic once a month about them. Sounds Sp to me. I also agree with the comments made by Paradigm. I am not seeing any So at all so I would concentrate on Sp and Sx. Only you can say the order of strength, but if you are depressed (you sound like it) then variant stacking is the least of your worries.

Yeah, what you say is true. This however is part of overcoming the depression through introspection, figuring out how I work, what the problem areas are and so on. The only way is straight through and that requires answers, questioning and seeking the truth, subjective or not. What I lack is direction, purposue, meaning.

Think of it as runing in a tunnel with no idea where the end is, where one is heading, how long it will take to get there. It takes a shit ton of willpower just to keep at it, but if there is no end in sight no reason, then one's mental fortitude will fail eventually.

I will fix this eventually and I will find my answers.

Since @Paradigm said I don't have the phobic Sp part that she and @PlushWitch share I'll look into the "why?".

@Rim
Why don't you try what I suggested and compare pictures of yourself to pictures of other people? But you have to know the exact stacking and range of that stacking in order to be truly able to relate to the people... I don't relate to other sp/sx people - only the ascetic ones.
EDIT: Same Cognitive functions etc aren't necessary. Same core Etype might help... not sure though.

This first link is the best source for this, but not very structured most of the time. And I'm not sure if there are examples of every possible stacking and range. But at least if you were some sort of sp/sx I know there would also be the right examples for you: Typewatch Enneagram

Some additional sources from the same blog where people are typed with instinctual stackings. Though not with ranges...

Typewatch Enneagram: YouTube Exemplars of Enneagram Types

Typewatch Enneagram: Typewatch Enneagram Instincts

Good luck.