[Ice Ghost]

I wonder if the supposed correlation between Enneagram 4s and the INFJ isn't slightly overrated. It seems especially with the 4w5, that the main ethos of the 4 goes against the Extraverted Feeling function that the INFJ has as its auxiliary. I mean the interest in collective harmony and conforming to certain social norms; if there's one word that 4s hate, I'd wager it's "conform."



Maybe 4w3's are more likely to be INFJs than 4w5's, but I'm betting that there is a not-at-all insignificant portion of INFJs who might actually be 3's, 5's, or otherwise besides 4's. What do you all think?

[snowangel]

I have no doubt that I am a INFJ 4w5...

[Darkstar]

I don't know. Maybe I'm more 4w3 than 4w5, but I don't feel like I exhibit 4ness that much - I'm not sure if that's a function of my INFJ or my 6 and 1 in the tritype. I find myself conforming a lot to social niceties, but mostly just because it seems like the right thing to do. Why make life less pleasant for others?

[emerald sea]

i'm guessing that the conflict you see between Fe and type 4 is the almost defiant originality (or deviance from the norm) of type 4?

our dominant function Ni, in combination with Ti, produces original, innovative, even unconventional thought. in our thinking we are very independent, for such is the nature of Ni-Ti (Ni is original and innovative, Ti is unconventional). "original, innovative, unconventional" is perfectly in line with type 4.

it is not a Fe construct to follow every societal tradition but rather to conform to a set of values which prioritize people, their feelings, relationships, and emotional harmony. conformity to the past, or tradition, is more of an Si trait...'the way it has always been' is not a cage for an INFJ (and type 4s most obviously jump this cage). 'the way it must be in order not to hurt anyone' is the only 'cage' an INFJ adopts. that is how Fe reflects itself in an INFJ...interwoven in his psyche are people/feelings/harmony related values that become the top priority in decision-making. otherwise we refuse to be put in any sort of box imposed by society, for Ni analyzes the box, rather than climbing inside of it.

Ni also has a laser-focus beam which is directed right down to the core of everything it analyzes. it is only natural, therefore, for an INFJ, in analyzing self, to seek to understand what is at his/her core (cf. the type 4 identity obsession) - just as (s)he seeks to discover the core essence of every other person (s)he analyzes.

internally, our allegiance is to Ni's conclusions, regardless of how they deviate from from traditional thought, or the thought of others. deviations from a societal norm, so long as they do not hurt others or violate our others-related values, are perfectly in line with the nature of an INFJ.

[unico]

I am a 4w3 INFJ and I think @seastallion put it better words than I could have.

[adverseaffects]

Fours can be any type. If you want, go read timeless's description, he does a really good job of showing how enngeagram traists can apply to any mbti type. And most fours are infxs.

[Arienette]

When you see the amount of INFJs vs. INTJs vs. ENFJs vs. ESFJs 4s, you get into conclusion that Fe in itself has no real correlation with e4, and that Ni is not enough in itself, aswell; thus the lack in real INTJ 4 representation around here, if at all. I think the combination of Ni-Fe gives more of an Fi nature than any other non-Fi type, which correlates with the Fi nature of 4s. There are much more INFJ 4s than ENFJ 4s, which means once again that it's the Ni-dom combined with Feeling function to make this type a more 'valid' MBTI type for 4s than the others mentioned, and appropriate one in general.

Same goes for Fi-types, when you see the representation of ISFPs vs ESFPs & INFPs vs. ENFPs. Fi is enough in itself, but stronger when Ne is combined. I believe INFP is the most common e4 type, and after that there's no real 'competition' between ENFP, ISFP & INFJ. But those 4 are the most common e4 types.

Hope any of this made any sense ;/

[iMaven]

idk. i think i'm an INFJ 4.
i think a lot of people aren't INFJ 4.
that's all I can offer, though.

it's because Ni is reminiscent of a 4 and so is Fe. How does Fe mean to conform? lol.
Couldn't Fe inspire the exact opposite of that with Ni as the leading function?

[adverseaffects]

Ya know I see this all the time, people grossly misrepresent Fe. Just because your dominant function is Fe does not mean you lose all ability to think for yourself. People who are not Fi users are not robots.

[bmw]

It can be anyone. I'm a strong 4w5 and I'm an INFP.
Certain aspects of each personality are unique to each individual, so I'm sure there are some surprising combinations throughout the forum.