Feminism... For... or Against?

Originally Posted by MissingLinc

Personality definitely, and I think men and women are genetically different

The only genetic difference between men and women is the Y chromosome.

and predisposed to behaving in certain ways.

Maybe so, but societal expectations and gender roles play a huge part as well.

Equality doesn't mean we're all exactly the same

Noone is saying that, although men and women are not that different anyway. There's more difference between two individual men and two individual women than there is between a random man and a random woman, and the main differences are differences which are obvious, such as the genitals, prostates in men, uteruses in women and so on.

there are differences in cultural norms, behavior, personality and gender that have to be considered before we start making accusations of malicious bias or bigoted discrimination.

I agree.

Originally Posted by skycloud86

Of course you have to earn it, otherwise you wouldn't be respecting women, you would be telling them that you respect them.

Glad we sorted that out.

There's some men out there who think their wife is their second mother. They're usually spineless morons who need a woman to wait on them hand and foot because they don't have the ability to look after themselves.

Really? I wasn't aware of this.
You're so informative, guy.
Thanks.

By the way, these women chose to marry these deadbeats.
Whatever happened to women's choice, huh?

I don't believe it will always be crap, we have to advance sometime.

Tell yourself whatever it takes to get you up in the morning.
It still doesn't make it any less true.

So I don't need to tell you that you wouldn't get the same lifestyle as a white man would have done, then.

I'm leaving myself out of this. I'm referring to society as a whole.

Originally Posted by alphacat

By the way, I think I can speak for most people who are posting that we all respect woman.

In fact, I think we can all agree that equal rights is good, can't we?

What specifically is bothering me is when people come in here and start attacking others, calling them misogynists, and making up facts to prove their point.

Yes, rights are good, but not everything have to be equal. Men and women are genetically different, can't we all agree to that? I honestly don't see much wrong with our society today (the US) that warrants the points of radical feminists.

Point made, I see your point. I honestly believe, and the other posters male and female, are free to disagree with me, that men and women hold more common ground on this issue than contention, but for some reason always end up talking past eachother.

Originally Posted by alphacat

What specifically is bothering me is when people come in here and start attacking others, calling them misogynists, and making up facts to prove their point.

Who exactly is making up facts, and do you have proof that they are making up these facts?

Yes, rights are good, but not everything have to be equal.

There can never be true equality, but why not get rid of the inequalities that we can get rid of?

Men and women are genetically different, can't we all agree to that?

Wrong. Men and women are almost the same genetically, the only difference being the Y chromosome.

I honestly don't see much wrong with our society today (the US)

Really? You can't? And please stop assuming that the whole forum is American.

that warrants the points of radical feminists.

Maybe not radical feminism, but mainstream feminism is certainly still needed in some ways.

Originally Posted by adverseaffects

But the dictionary defnition of feminism is equal rights for women. What you're saying isn't true because before men and women did not have equal rights so when women began seeing themselves as equals and advocating for that, they developed a term for this ideology.

This is what I see, people picking a term and painting it with their own prejudices, not on purpose, just out of what you see and here, which is how prejudice works.

From Miriam Webster's dictionary:
Definition of FEMINISM
1: the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes
2: organized activity on behalf of women's rights and interests

Did you not even read what I said? I clearly made the distinction between people actually shooting for equal rights between genders and those who are feminist activists, I'm not painting anything, you just didn't care enough to read my whole post.

Ok guys, changing the playing field.

In all future post, please differntiate between these two terms-

feminism vs. misandrists
misogynist vs. anti-feminism

and when working with the term feminsim please understand this is what it means:
From Miriam Webster's dictionary:
Definition of FEMINISM
1: the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes
2: organized activity on behalf of women's rights and interests

So if you say you are against feminism, the way it will be interpeted is against politcal, economic, and social equality of the sexes.

If you say you are against radical feminism, misandry, and name-calling, say that instead.

I was interested in the differences in how we VIEW feminism, thus why I asked for the defintion, because I was aware that was a lot of confusion of WHAT exactly it meant, but since we skipped staright from debating the definition to arguing, I think we should clarify terms. I'll add this to the original post as well.

Originally Posted by Cover3

Did you not even read what I said? I clearly made the distinction between people actually shooting for equal rights between genders and those who are feminist activists, I'm not painting anything, you just didn't care enough to read my whole post.

Ok but feminists activists are shooting for equal rights between genders. That is my point.

To everyone who is against feminism: Please stop hating humans irrationally. Give everyone an equal chance, they deserve it.

Originally Posted by MissingLinc

The word feminism to me has become a perjorative term that if some identifies themselves as such I immediately get suspicious. More often than not it's more about getting back at white men because we suck and like, stuff, than it is about simply supporting equal rights for all.

Dude... I fully explained that this is wrong. That's misandry, not feminism. Why are you ignoring my post? It's selfish and rude.

So if you say you are against feminism, the way it will be interpeted is against politcal, economic, and social equality of the sexes.

Why is the post asking for a definition if you're going to force-feed us one? I gave you exactly what you wanted, and you ignored it, close this thread already...

Originally Posted by adverseaffects

Ok but feminists activists are shooting for equal rights between genders. That is my point.

Then your point is sadly mistaken.

Originally Posted by Duck_of_Death

Really? I wasn't aware of this.
You're so informative, guy.
Thanks.

By the way, these women chose to marry these deadbeats.
Whatever happened to women's choice, huh?

Of course they chose to, but many men don't put in any effort once they get married, and the couple settle down into an unequal relationship.

Tell yourself whatever it takes to get you up in the morning.
It still doesn't make it any less true.

Guess I'm just not as cynical as you (although maybe my privileges are allowing me to see more potential for a better world).

I'm leaving myself out of this. I'm referring to society as a whole.

Because society back then was so wonderful for everyone? Just as long as you were white, straight, preferably male and preferably Christian (in the US at least). Being middle-class really helped, and no silly extremist politics such as communism or even socialism. Also, you should preferably abide to strict gender roles and societal expectations that would probably be too strict for the Victorians.