[thedavidhooker]

Hey everybody!

Once again, Mike & myself discuss the Myers-Briggs through an NF perspective. This time around we talk about the difference between your "actual family" (the people whom you're actually related to and/or were brought up with) and your "true family" (people whom you share the same Myers-Briggs temperament with and who understand you). I'd really like to get your thoughts & feelings on this matter and see if any of you feel similarly.



Also, I would like to add (though I mention this in the video) is that this is not suggesting that your family is not your family, that you shouldn't love your actual family or that you must chose one or the other. What Mike & I discuss are the hardships of growing up in families in which everyone is another temperament & the experience of meeting people whom shared your temperament and truly understand where you're coming from.

With that, I look forward to your responses! :D <3

[chaeriean]

my adoptive family i suppose is my "actual family", i didn't relate with them very well at all. i think they were both intps. they didn't treat me negatively or suppress me and they helped me a lot with learning to deal with my emotions and learning to control myself and learning to survive through trauma and giving me opportunities and so on but to them, i could tell i was like an animal rattling the cage, completely foreign and strange and a little bit nervewracking and overwhelming.

i was a "suppressed wildchild" as a kid until i shut down my ability to feel purposefully and then forgot how to reactivate it. after moving to canada and meeting my spouse and partner it got much easier for me to re-identify with my emotions and so on. but all the same even as i was "emotionless" it was still tough for me because my essence is far less rigid than my personality if that makes sense.

in this way i find i don't relate with many sjs that much because while i am conventional and traditional and loyal and honest and dutiful and underappreciated and ethical i am also very much this raging, screaming, flaming thing that is constantly scratching at the walls. sometimes i think if i didn't keep myself grounded so hard i would just burst into flame and fly away and escape out of my own body, but i resist the temptation because it is like my own "self" is different from this "essence" inside of me. i can't explain it any better than that, but i am more aware of it than a lot of sjs are so it is like i have this weird shadow "esfp" personality or something.

i relate more with sjs than i do with any other type, but at the same time i know there is a large disconnect between me and other sjs.

i often get commented here about how i am a "different sort" of sj, my opinions are more apt to change and i am more open-minded, i put different values on a different priority, my te is too developed to be only a feeler, i am capable of re-examining and evaluating my opinions, i enjoy philosophy and debating and etc. people have even tried to convince me i must be an intuitive because of it when i know full well i am absolutely a sensor. (also, unlike most sjs, i don't seem to hold grudges and am capable of looking at individual posts objectively! which means no, i'm not here to hate on you because we disagreed last time).

the experience of meeting other sjs to me has mostly been positive, but at the same time highlights how differently i sometimes feel on the inside than what is expected of me. i guess though by your definition of "true family" that would have to really be my spouses because they are the only ones who really understand me. one is an sj, one is an nf.

(also "sj pond" and "hipsters" made me laugh :P)

[Aelthwyn]

Hey I loved your discussion there - I actually had to giggle with glee at the end because you guys are True Family :D

I grew up as an only child with an ISTJ mother. I suspect my dad to be INTP, but he wasn't around much. Still, I think my mom's stories about him helped give me another adult to identify with, and help me to see that some of my differences from her were valid. I had a pretty good time of it really because she is a school teacher and had done a lot of studying of different kinds of children and was somewhat more used to trying to understand other people's perspectives than a lot of SJs are I think. But I definately know the feeling of being an ugly duckling. American culture at large doesn't quite feel like the right 'nest' for an INFP to grow up in.

It's truely amazing to encounter others of the same temperment, and like you said it's such a breath of fresh air! I remember reading the profile of the INFP for the first time and feeling such reliefe! I really wasn't crazy! I feel like I was finally really able to 'come into my own' and become much more mentally healthy when I met a group of people in College who were mostly comprised of INFPs and INTPs. It was amazing to be appreciated FOR who I was, not IN SPITE OF who I was. It was so amazing to finally find people with whom conversation just flowed easily, and I didn't have to struggle with re-explaining myself to try and get them to understand. I love that sense of being on the same wavelength!

I also spent about half a year living with an ISFP, the mother of my now husband actually, after I'd gone through a time of emotional abuse, and it was really like an experience of rebirth, of growing up again in the right kind of setting. The Feeling and Perceiving traits that my mother had always had trouble understanding and accepting, were finally validated by a motherly figure. It was a very healing experience.

Thinking about this really makes me want to try and help others connect with people of their own kind - in real life, not just on the internet, although that does really help. It seems that especially for Intuitives who seem to be more rare, it's really hard to get in contact with others of our Kind. This would be an instance where I wish I could get some SJs to appreciate my idealistic goals enough to help out with the practical side of making it happen.

I totally agree that NFs seem to be best at understanding other people's perspectives, and sometimes it can be easy to grow bitter because of this. We can be much more accomodating because of our understanding, but don't feel that we get the same in return from others.

[teddy564339]

I'm kind of mixed about everything mentioned in the video.


On one hand, I totally agree with the notion of being able to relate to others of your own temperament or type. I don't know any other surefire ISFJ's in my life, and to be able to post things on the ISFJ forum and have people completely relate to me is like you said, "A breath of fresh air." It can be frustrating not having this with friends and family sometimes.

But I don't feel as constricted by temperament as you do. Now, as you mentioned, this might be because NF's feel this more than the other three temperaments. But for me, a lot of times I relate to and get along with my INFP and INFJ friends than I do with the ESTJ and ESFJ's that I know.

I think part of this boils down to the "statistics" that I've heard/read. I've heard/read that extroverts outnumber introverted, sensors outnumber intuitives, and that male thinkers outnumber male feelers. Because of this, I tend to really bond with introverts and feelers, whereas I imagine N's really bond with other N's. This would mean that NT's and NF's also probably greatly bond with their own temperaments.


But I also think that we always have to be careful not to look into type so deeply that we use it to keep from growing in relationships. Yes, type presents barriers to understanding, but I don't think those have to be given up on. Before I even knew about type, I greatly and deeply related to my best friend, who is an INTJ. We may not relate to each other on the deepest of levels, but we still relate a lot and have a strong, great, deep friendship. There are so many things beyond type that are important in relationships.

But like I said, I think this might be strongest in NF's. And certainly I can relate to the temperament and type notions. My mom is an ISTJ, and I am extremely close with her, and we've always gotten along very well naturally. I have a lot more friction with my ENTJ dad.


But that's also where knowing about the MBTI is helpful. I think when we are open minded to learning about the other types and temperaments, it makes it easier to understand things about them and to make relationships stronger.


So it's all about balance. It's important to be able to relate to others of the same temperament and type, and it's very comforting and helpful. But we shouldn't let that limit us in other relationships either.

[Mei]

I wouldn't say that those who I connect with emotionally is my "true" family. I feel that in describing them that way, really discredits my own family, whom also had and is a part of my life? Whether they had been good or bad is another thing. I feel disloyal if I say that. (Although during my teenage years, and I did not know everything about my family and how each member felt about me, I was really really annoyed with them.) In their own way, they have helped me and I have indeed helped them back. It's what kept our relationship going all these years. As I grow older, I found a term for the environment that I was brought up in. You call it a "vertical" environment whereby if you were brought up with people of different ages. If I had an argument with my mother, I'd seek my siblings for the answers if my mother tells me off. :P If I have been annoyed and argued with my sibling, I'd go to my auntie. If it happened in the family, and the atmosphere was tense, I'd go to my auntie. She'd tell me a bit more about family wisdom and send me back home?

Now, if I don't like my real family, then why does a strong part of my NF side, really misses them as I grow older? No matter how far I worked, and how far away I am from them. I miss them so ?

I always had the understanding that, no matter how harsh the words are said by my parents, or elders, they had my best interest at heart. Maybe it is the timing that they executed those words, and I was most probably was not ever ready to receive them, cos I was in my comfort zone. They sounded so harsh, and so horrible to my young ears. Now that I am more reflective as an adult, I do see it with different set of eyes ?

Oh, my sister knows this too. She is not sympathetic. But she did say once that she'd do anything for me. I brought her to tears... now how often do you see an ISTJ say that? If only she knew I am particularly NF, then she wouldn't be so, I don't know. Cut-throat. She definitely lacks empathy with a big NF.

Even recently my sister-in-law who is an ISFJ said to me. "How come you don't seek out your *favourite* auntie to chat?" Cos I was after some NF wisdom. (Actually, she is jealous, and I never knew that she was. Cos it was also her ISxJ ways that pushes me away. 'Do this, do that, do this, do that. You can't. Don't.') I know she loves me when she cooked my favourite dish during CNY just recently. Her F is coming through.

Through history and through time, if someone changed themselves to fit in with your life, is this not love? Cos it is self altruism that is being exerted here. If everybody brings their best skills to the family them harmony pursues. If you think for yourself only, and not for others, then you won't ever get on with them. I do have my family at heart. Cos I have been through the "blood is thicker than water" mentality already in my 20s. Sure.. in my early 20s, I want to murder each one of them. The fights we had. OMG... I can now say this with fondness.

[The King Of Dreams]

I felt this as far as my friends were concerned. I thought there was something wrong with me when they tried to "fix" me. But my mom (ENFJ) was a breath of fresh air. So I kind of always had that at home which was nice. But I also had a SJ and NT brothers so it was my mom and I when it came to being tribesmen. I guess that's why we always got along. We're pretty close, too. Thanks for making this thread, it helps me reflect a lot. I loved what Mike said about forgiving his parents after he found out they were SJs. It makes sense that they thought a certain way. While Mike thought differently. I guess I can do the same with my SJ brother and my NT brother.