[pianopraze]

what if you were in a situation where you had to kill or your child would be killed?

what if you had to steal to survive?

what if you had to kill to survive? -- many soldiers now have been here --

what if you had to kill and steal for your children to survive?

what if your government tortured you?

what if your government told you to kill?



this happens every day all around the world to thousands if not millions of people.

most of us are so isolated from it we can't even really begin to understand or see enough to even answer those questions... but that evil is in every one of us.

when you have seen, it is hard to live in this make believe fantasy...

[Kudo Shinichi]

No, it's far more likely they'd have a psychological breakdown.

It's also important to note that unless a person is willfully forcing themselves to behave in a fashion befitting the constant over reliance on their shadow functions, it's unlikely - if not impossible - for so extreme a mental state to. . .

I see what you're getting at now.

The more en pointe answer would be that no, I don't believe it's possible under normal circumstances, however, it's said that going through traumatic events can effectively change (or at least skew) a person's apparent type.

sidenote - The above didn't come out as clearly as I'd like, but it's 2 in the morning, so whatever.

It true about the traumatic events that can cause the change in the person's characteristic opposite or much more introvert...just happen to me.

[amethyst_butterfly]

Great info. I am going to save this.

[amethyst_butterfly]

I want to know how can I recognize that I am using my shadow function. Do you always use your ESTJ shadow when you have negative behavior?? I am still curious about this and want to learn more.

[LiquidLight]

I want to know how can I recognize that I am using my shadow function. Do you always use your ESTJ shadow when you have negative behavior?? I am still curious about this and want to learn more.

Check out the thread on "love hate with people with your functions" i posted some videos that describe the shadow nicely.

Shadow isn't a function its a complex. You can think of it as your alter ego (literally). A variation of who you could be had you not chosen to be who you are. So for INFP, ESTJ is literally the opposite ego from a functional standpoint. The thing to recognize as has been pointed out, is that you still have the ESTJ inside of you, you're just repressing it. As you go through life we have to start to reconcile with our shadow and our inferior function (Te in INFP, which of course is the dominant mindset for ESTJ). Remember 'negative behavior' is a relative term. What's negative or tough for you might be normal for someone else. It's more a matter of coming in contact with your shadow, through your inferior function (it's like a bridge between the shadow and the ego), so one might say when you aren't being 'yourself' you are operating closer to the shadow (though we're rarely overcome by it, that would probably result in major problems, probably a nervous breakdown.)

There is A LOT of material on the web about the shadow. From both a personal and societal point of view (there are some philosophers who go as far as to say Nazi Germany was the Shadow of Germany or that the dominant Eurocentric American culture projects its shadow on African-Americans and other minorities -- that's pretty heavy stuff but the idea is interesting). Also some great videos on YouTube, some of which are interviews with Jung himself or his wife or Marie Von Franz who was a protege of Jung.

To Jung learning to integrate the ego and the shadow (along with recognizing anima/animus) was one of the singular most important things a person could do with their personal development. Learning to not just repress the parts of you that make you uncomfortable (or project them onto other people) but rather to come to terms with those things early and often so you don't get stuck behind a self-imposed mask.

Jung: On The Shadow

The Shadow: Our Darker Side

http://www.jungatlanta.com/articles/...ce-with-us.pdf (a movie review about Black Swan but has some interesting things about how the Shadow is portrayed in this film)

http://www.jungatlanta.com/articles/...ple-do-bad.pdf

[amethyst_butterfly]

Very interesting information. I sometimes feel that when I am in certain enviroments I shut off certain parts of my brain, such as the emotional side and I feel kind of empty like if I a fish out of water. I sometimes be upfront and bold when I want my point to get across. I sometimes express my anger and hurt people without caring. I can sometimes be impulsive to get what I want but most of the time I am passive, don't want to cause trouble, if someone does not agree with my point I accept their opinions without getting into never ending debates.

Sometimes I feel very anxious. Is it because I want my ESTJ shadow to get out but I am repressing it? Don't know. I need to research this subject more.

Check out the thread on "love hate with people with your functions" i posted some videos that describe the shadow nicely.

Shadow isn't a function its a complex. You can think of it as your alter ego (literally). A variation of who you could be had you not chosen to be who you are. So for INFP, ESTJ is literally the opposite ego from a functional standpoint. The thing to recognize as has been pointed out, is that you still have the ESTJ inside of you, you're just repressing it. As you go through life we have to start to reconcile with our shadow and our inferior function (Te in INFP, which of course is the dominant mindset for ESTJ). Remember 'negative behavior' is a relative term. What's negative or tough for you might be normal for someone else. It's more a matter of coming in contact with your shadow, through your inferior function (it's like a bridge between the shadow and the ego), so one might say when you aren't being 'yourself' you are operating closer to the shadow (though we're rarely overcome by it, that would probably result in major problems, probably a nervous breakdown.)

There is A LOT of material on the web about the shadow. From both a personal and societal point of view (there are some philosophers who go as far as to say Nazi Germany was the Shadow of Germany or that the dominant Eurocentric American culture projects its shadow on African-Americans and other minorities -- that's pretty heavy stuff but the idea is interesting). Also some great videos on YouTube, some of which are interviews with Jung himself or his wife or Marie Von Franz who was a protege of Jung.

To Jung learning to integrate the ego and the shadow (along with recognizing anima/animus) was one of the singular most important things a person could do with their personal development. Learning to not just repress the parts of you that make you uncomfortable (or project them onto other people) but rather to come to terms with those things early and often so you don't get stuck behind a self-imposed mask.

Jung: On The Shadow

The Shadow: Our Darker Side

http://www.jungatlanta.com/articles/...ce-with-us.pdf (a movie review about Black Swan but has some interesting things about how the Shadow is portrayed in this film)

http://www.jungatlanta.com/articles/...ple-do-bad.pdf

[PisceanReve]

actually I've heard two theories and I have to say, I agree with the second one (which is not that if you are an Fi-dom, you'd turn Te, but Ti instead). It's the reason why I act like an INTJ and not at all like an ISFJ when shadowing (Ne-->Ni instead of Ne to Si)

[Naama]

Shadow functions(Ne to Ni etc) are bullshit, Ne can look like Ni if the person havent learned conscious control over Si, because undeveloped Si isnt being consciously directed, but is directing you and because Si is directing Ne, it might look like Ni, since Ne is focused unconsciously towards introverted matters. Same goes with other functions, INTP might feel like their Fi is pushing up, but its Fe that tries to come to consciousness, but ego is repressing it, because it opposes its Ti standpoint on things. Those repressed stuff can come in forms of projections(you see something as an indicator to something based on yoir subjective atandpoint without realizing it) and these projections can guide conscious attitude.

And btw, for jung the shadow wasnt shadow functions, it was basically an complex of repressed/rejected parts of the self, stuff that you are, but that goes against your ego.