[ISTJ] Self-esteem, confidence and recognition

Self-esteem, confidence and recognition

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This is a discussion on Self-esteem, confidence and recognition within the ISTJ Forum - The Duty Fulfillers forums, part of the SJ's Temperament Forum- The Overseers category; ...

  1. #1
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Self-esteem, confidence and recognition

    It wasn't until yesterday that I actually thought about the difference between self-esteem and self-confidence. When I thought about this distinction, I immediately realized what has been a problem of mine the entire time.

    Iíve often been recognized or complimented for my thoroughness, strong will and intelligence. I havenít always had high expectations of myself, but I always managed to surprise myself and surpass what I was thought I was capable of doing. I always managed to stay faithful to my will and have always been able to put myself into a task Ė be it for myself or others.
    All of these success stories have led to me having a decently high self-confidence, because Iím now fairly certain of what I can expect of myself. I know I can achieve almost anything realistic I put my mind to. My confidence is high Ė ďnow, why am I not truly happy with the person I am?Ē Iíve been thinking. Shouldnít I be very happy for the gifts Iíve been given? I definitely am, but I just feel like that there is something missing.

    Getting a compliment is nice, but if this compliment is always based on my practical skills, it gets old. It boosts my confidence every time, but my self-esteem is left rather untouched. It seems like ISTJs are to be appreciated for our practical skills and thinking, but how does that build self-esteem? Iím a very practical and concretely thinking person, but I just donít feel that my practical behavior helps others appreciate me for who I am, and not what I do.

    What are your thoughts?
    WickedQueen, Marcus2x2, Athena and 2 others thanked this post.



  2. #2
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by Flipit View Post
    It wasn't until yesterday that I actually thought about the difference between self-esteem and self-confidence. When I thought about this distinction, I immediately realized what has been a problem of mine the entire time.

    Iíve often been recognized or complimented for my thoroughness, strong will and intelligence. I havenít always had high expectations of myself, but I always managed to surprise myself and surpass what I was thought I was capable of doing. I always managed to stay faithful to my will and have always been able to put myself into a task Ė be it for myself or others.
    All of these success stories have led to me having a decently high self-confidence, because Iím now fairly certain of what I can expect of myself. I know I can achieve almost anything realistic I put my mind to. My confidence is high Ė ďnow, why am I not truly happy with the person I am?Ē Iíve been thinking. Shouldnít I be very happy for the gifts Iíve been given? I definitely am, but I just feel like that there is something missing.

    Getting a compliment is nice, but if this compliment is always based on my practical skills, it gets old. It boosts my confidence every time, but my self-esteem is left rather untouched. It seems like ISTJs are to be appreciated for our practical skills and thinking, but how does that build self-esteem? Iím a very practical and concretely thinking person, but I just donít feel that my practical behavior helps others appreciate me for who I am, and not what I do.

    What are your thoughts?
    Good topic--That's what I think!

    The problem with self-esteem and self-confidence is that the distinction between the terms has been blurred through mis-use. To get back to what they did (and should) mean, drop off the "Self-" and use those definitions, applying them to yourself.

    From what I understand, confidence, or self-confidence in this discussion, comes from having accomplished tasks and goals we or others have set for us. As we successfully complete more and more difficult tasks and goals, then our confidence in self naturally rises. You outlined this so very well in your original post.

    The difference is that esteem applies to values we appreciate in a person. I can esteem a person for their integrity, honesty, loyalty, or whatever of similar type.

    If you lack confidence in yourself, then you can overcome that feeling by setting small, reachable goals, and gradually extending yourself until you reach an objective that is larger and generates the confidence that you desire to have.

    If you lack esteem in your person, then you must conduct yourself in a manner of which you can be proud. If you are lying to yourself, believing that you have integrity, but not living according to your values, then you are undermining your attempts at developing self-esteem. You MUST be true to your values. If you do not like your values, then change them--but if you are not true to your values, the self conflict will result.

    FWIW, the self-talk you engage in will directly impact your success in both of these areas. As an example, if your father was always belittling you and you can continually here those tapes of your father telling you that you can't do this, you are inept, or whatever, then you must first overcome this in order to ultimately achieve the confidence and esteem of your person which you desire.

    I'm rushed...so I hope this isn't too disjointed.


  3. #3
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Just because we don't have talents in creative-type stuff doesn't mean that we aren't special. While there are many things that my INTP friend can do that I cannot, the reverse is also true. It took me a while to appreciate and capitalize on my own things, because I used to always think that the things I was good at (and my values) were well ... boring. However ... ISTJ's make the world function. If it wasn't for us, things would come to a crashing and screeching halt, and end up in a big huge mess.

    <-- in a bit of a hurry also; I'm at work and getting ready to conduct a meeting with our residents
    Flipit, j3321, Athena and 1 others thanked this post.

  4. #4
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by niss63 View Post
    Good topic--That's what I think!

    The problem with self-esteem and self-confidence is that the distinction between the terms has been blurred through mis-use. To get back to what they did (and should) mean, drop off the "Self-" and use those definitions, applying them to yourself.

    From what I understand, confidence, or self-confidence in this discussion, comes from having accomplished tasks and goals we or others have set for us. As we successfully complete more and more difficult tasks and goals, then our confidence in self naturally rises. You outlined this so very well in your original post.

    The difference is that esteem applies to values we appreciate in a person. I can esteem a person for their integrity, honesty, loyalty, or whatever of similar type.

    If you lack confidence in yourself, then you can overcome that feeling by setting small, reachable goals, and gradually extending yourself until you reach an objective that is larger and generates the confidence that you desire to have.

    If you lack esteem in your person, then you must conduct yourself in a manner of which you can be proud. If you are lying to yourself, believing that you have integrity, but not living according to your values, then you are undermining your attempts at developing self-esteem. You MUST be true to your values. If you do not like your values, then change them--but if you are not true to your values, the self conflict will result.

    FWIW, the self-talk you engage in will directly impact your success in both of these areas. As an example, if your father was always belittling you and you can continually here those tapes of your father telling you that you can't do this, you are inept, or whatever, then you must first overcome this in order to ultimately achieve the confidence and esteem of your person which you desire.

    I'm rushed...so I hope this isn't too disjointed.

    That is a very good assessment and clear distinction between esteem and confidence. And the last sentence is very true to me as well. My father was like that and still is for that matter, even though I am now in my 40's and he is in his 70's he still belittles me like when I was 10 years old. Sadly this means I can only stand so much of his company these days and after a couple of days visiting I cannot take any more and have to leave.

    I am convinced that my self esteem and self confidence problems in my teens and 20's were due largely to my fathers influence. It took my 10 years after leaving home to get happy with myself.

    I do think that ISTJ'S are particularly prone to esteem and confidence issues. It is our achilles heel!

    Self administered CBT can help eliminate negative self talk and improve self esteem. Kind of like re-programming the brain.
    Flipit and niss thanked this post.

  5. #5
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by Sela View Post
    Just because we don't have talents in creative-type stuff doesn't mean that we aren't special. -snip-
    ISTJ's can be creative and even artistic! I play guitar in a band and write my own music for example.

    Art and music is 99% persiration and this is where the ISTJ can excell with our determination and persistence. And for the other 1% we can learn to open our intuition and perception and feelings to be creative if we have worked at the craft side of the art enough. i can do this when alone or in a dreamy kind of mind state and that is how we can be creative.

    here is some of my creativity Chicken John
    Flipit, Athena and niss thanked this post.

  6. #6
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnyguitarman View Post
    ISTJ's can be creative and even artistic! I play guitar in a band and write my own music for example.

    Art and music is 99% persiration and this is where the ISTJ can excell with our determination and persistence. And for the other 1% we can learn to open our intuition and perception and feelings to be creative if we have worked at the craft side of the art enough. i can do this when alone or in a dreamy kind of mind state and that is how we can be creative.

    here is some of my creativity Chicken John
    That's cool. You are talented. I especially liked "Foxes."
    Johnnyguitarman thanked this post.

  7. #7
    ESTJ - The Guardians

    I'm confidence that I can make a guy attracted to me, but I have low self-esteem to believe that he will stay loyal to me. Somehow I keep thinking that if a guy likes me, soon or later he will get bored by me and cheating on me.
    Wake, Flipit and niss thanked this post.

  8. #8
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by Flipit View Post
    I've often been recognized or complimented for my thoroughness, strong will and intelligence.... My confidence is high Ė ďnow, why am I not truly happy with the person I am?Ē Iíve been thinking. Shouldnít I be very happy for the gifts Iíve been given? I definitely am, but I just feel like that there is something missing.

    Getting a compliment is nice, but if this compliment is always based on my practical skills, it gets old. It boosts my confidence every time, but my self-esteem is left rather untouched. It seems like ISTJs are to be appreciated for our practical skills and thinking, but how does that build self-esteem? Iím a very practical and concretely thinking person, but I just donít feel that my practical behavior helps others appreciate me for who I am, and not what I do.

    What are your thoughts?
    Revisiting this. How open are you with your feelings about what you value? Do you surround yourself with people of similar values?

    I ask this because I find it easier to compliment what I can personally appreciate. While I can learn to appreciate and compliment on traits and things that I do not have a lot of experience with myself, it is more learned and I must make a conscious effort to do so.

    It sounds like you are wanting people to appreciate your character values, such as integrity, trustworthiness, etc. If this is the case, surrounding yourself with people that value those qualities will make that happen.

    This is interesting to me, because SWMBO (an ENFP) likes to be complimented on specific acts or accomplishments. She has a harder time accepting compliments that are value based, although she does not mind them. I, OTOH, prefer value based compliments, and acts or accomplishments are not nearly so important to me.

    *Scratches chin thoughtfully*
    Flipit and Trauma thanked this post.

  9. #9
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by niss63 View Post
    Revisiting this. How open are you with your feelings about what you value? Do you surround yourself with people of similar values?

    I ask this because I find it easier to compliment what I can personally appreciate. While I can learn to appreciate and compliment on traits and things that I do not have a lot of experience with myself, it is more learned and I must make a conscious effort to do so.

    It sounds like you are wanting people to appreciate your character values, such as integrity, trustworthiness, etc. If this is the case, surrounding yourself with people that value those qualities will make that happen.

    This is interesting to me, because SWMBO (an ENFP) likes to be complimented on specific acts or accomplishments. She has a harder time accepting compliments that are value based, although she does not mind them. I, OTOH, prefer value based compliments, and acts or accomplishments are not nearly so important to me.

    *Scratches chin thoughtfully*
    "Open" and "surrounded with people" are kind of noncharacteristic for me, so it's a little hard to answer those questions with a positive response. I'm only really open to people I know well, and I suppose I only get along with people I appreciate in some way.

    Well, people might be appreciating my values, but I think it's unlikely that they'll say it directly. At least that's for the majority of them - my opposites, ENFP for example, have a much easier time complimenting. I suppose they value some of my traits, but it's unlikely that I'm going to surround myself with them. I've also gotten the impression that they're looking for fun more than anything else, and I can't be a fun store like they can. Does it change that much with age? I've just exited my teens, so I'm not that old

    I'm confidence that I can make a guy attracted to me, but I have low self-esteem to believe that he will stay loyal to me. Somehow I keep thinking that if a guy likes me, soon or later he will get bored by me and cheating on me.
    I have a tendency to believe the same, but I think the main problem is that people are too intolerant. "You aren't as fun as you used to be.. I'm finding a new one" etc. are just comments spawned by immaturity. People don't realise that a relationship takes a lot of work, effort and understanding and that they won't be in love forever.
    niss thanked this post.

  10. #10
    ISTJ - The Duty Fulfillers

    Quote Originally Posted by WickedQueen View Post
    I'm confidence that I can make a guy attracted to me, but I have low self-esteem to believe that he will stay loyal to me. Somehow I keep thinking that if a guy likes me, soon or later he will get bored by me and cheating on me.
    I've been thinking about this...I guess it sorta bothers me. If you find that you can make a guy attracted to you, but your self-esteem is too low to believe that he will stay loyal, I'm thinking that you are either using the wrong bait for the fish you want to catch, or something has happened to you that makes you feel unworthy of a guy's devotion. I'm leaning to the latter because of your added comment that "sooner or later he will get bored by me..."

    What do you think is establishing this expectation in yourself?


 
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