There's no INTP without Ti and no Ti without knowledge/intelligence.

[Trope]

Originally Posted by TurranMC

Hope that he will one day be satisfied?

Surely, that can't be his primary motive. Hope is irrational. It would suggest he's an INFP by his own standards.

[Tlatoani]

Originally Posted by Psilo

Unhealthy or poorly used Ti is still Ti. Ti desires to have a consistant internal understanding of the world. However, if the INTP fails to gather good information, the model is less likely to be an accurate representation of reality. It does not mean they did not use the Ti function, however.

Who talked about "Unhealthy or poorly used Ti"? I talked about no Ti at all.

"Neanderthals were red haired"

"He may receive information and accept it..."
Ti is a skeptic function by definition, so this point holds somewhat. I just think it's worth mentioning that dominant function just implies the most used, not necesarily high ability.

Tell me how can you be skeptic with that phrase, for example. (hoping you're not a physical anthropologist here)

Anyway, the point is, if some piece of information like that one is received by the INTP and the INTP doesn't have any frame of reference to analyze that piece of information, then he can't know whether something is true or false, or if it makes sense or not, he's not making use of the Ti function at all, if he doesn't have the knowledge to do this:

Introverted Thinking

Analyzing; categorizing; evaluating according to principles and whether something fits the framework or model; figuring out the principles on which something works; checking for inconsistencies; clarifying definitions to get more precision.

Then it is obvious to conclude that to be able to use Ti, not even properly, use it at all, you have to have the knowledge and in debates (for example), the logic to be skeptical, doubtful of the information that we're trying to analyze.

Also, define intelligence and knowlege as you use it in your OP.

Using English here, use a dictionary if you want, but I'm talking about the common meaning of the words.

Originally Posted by Jorge

Hehe happened to me the first time I met another INTP in person. I tested a friend of mine who tends to do and say a LOT of idiotic things. He's gotten himself into trouble for the stupidest things, which weren't even funny or smart. He tends to think that just because he's an engineering student, he is smarter than a lot of people, when he is in fact failing the classes that other majors ace...

Nevertheless, he tested out as an INTP, and I was really in shock to see that I was "related" in some way to this guy. He's a good friend... but I was just like "really?"

And why don't you question the results of the tests? Here is a perfect example. He's not using any Ti at the moment he heard his stupid friend was an INTP. Why? He just accepted the fact that he is an INTP, he doesn't have a frame of reference in which tests can be wrong, or if he knows the theory behind MBTI (cognitive jungian functions) where he can be certain that despite the stupidity of his friend he's still using Ti-Ne axis most of the time. There's no doubt, no skepticism when receiving this information, he accepted it as soon as he knew and so he proceeded to make a conclusion...

Then I figured out that really, INTPs do not, by nature, have a higher IQ or are more intelligent than other types. The smartest girl (IQ-wise) I've met is an ENFP, and I've tutored a BUNCH of T (INTPs, INTJs, ENTPs, ISTPs... you name it) in a lot of subjects, whereas I've never studied with some Fs.

That may not have any credibility due to the fact that he doesn't know that tests can be wrong, and that he doesn't know (or uses) the theoretical basis of MBTI to do this analysis, this check, that the information we're receiving is right.

[Scruffy]

Yeah, yeah, Ti superiority n' shits.

Cool story bro.

[NewSoul]

Well someone certainly thinks quite highly of himself.

[Jorge]

Originally Posted by Tlatoani

Who talked about "Unhealthy or poorly used Ti"? I talked about no Ti at all.

"Neanderthals were red haired"

Tell me how can you be skeptic with that phrase, for example. (hoping you're not a physical anthropologist here)

Anyway, the point is, if some piece of information like that one is received by the INTP and the INTP doesn't have any frame of reference to analyze that piece of information, then he can't know whether something is true or false, or if it makes sense or not, he's not making use of the Ti function at all, if he doesn't have the knowledge to do this:

Then it is obvious to conclude that to be able to use Ti, not even properly, use it at all, you have to have the knowledge and in debates (for example), the logic to be skeptical, doubtful of the information that we're trying to analyze.

Using English here, use a dictionary if you want, but I'm talking about the common meaning of the words.




And why don't you question the results of the tests? Here is a perfect example. He's not using any Ti at the moment he heard his stupid friend was an INTP. Why? He just accepted the fact that he is an INTP, he doesn't have a frame of reference in which tests can be wrong, or if he knows the theory behind MBTI (cognitive jungian functions) where he can be certain that despite the stupidity of his friend he's still using Ti-Ne axis most of the time. There's no doubt, no skepticism when receiving this information, he accepted it as soon as he knew and so he proceeded to make a conclusion...

That may not have any credibility due to the fact that he doesn't know that tests can be wrong, and that he doesn't know (or uses) the theoretical basis of MBTI to do this analysis, this check, that the information we're receiving is right.

Wey neta.... das hueva. No de una forma que los INTP la dan porque somos unos geeks y nerds. Simplemente estas dando hueva repitiendo tus argumentos a una audiencia que no te quiere escuchar.

And yeah, he read the INTP description and agreed to it. After closer inspection, I do agree with him being an INTP (although I still doubt his I... I keep telling him he's an extrovert, and he refuses to acknowledge he's one)... it was just shocking the first time I read that he was in fact an INTP.

[Kevinaswell]

Originally Posted by Kevinaswell

I just really feel like someone in particular needs to get off their self-proclaimed INTP high-horse.

It's like standard sign of an unhealthy underdeveloped INTP >.<

*cough* *cough*

I mean, really?

Just get off it, yo.

Just because you are sadly an INTP with an inability to see past your primary function (lucky you! you have the narrowest horizon I've ever encountered online :) Work on broadening that shit and maybe you won't come off so pompous), doesn't mean other INTP's are "doing it wrong".

As if that's even possible.

Get out of your logic bubble you've locked yourself into and realize there is more.

You'll never fill in your entire picture of life without doing so.

Sorry. Preach all day. But hopefully you'll see.

[thewindlistens]

Sure, there's no INTP without Ti. But there's plenty of Ti without knowledge/intelligence. They have nothing to do with each other.

Saying that there is no Ti without knowledge/intelligence is like saying that there's no warm water without natural gas.

[Verdant Hollow]

Just because X is you primary function doesn't mean you are good at using it, or any of the functions.

An ISFP who reads their Fi wrong all the time doesn't mean they aren't an ISFP, it just makes them incompetent If I met an INTJ that was so dim that even my Ni was more accurate than his, would that mean he wasn't an INTJ?

And the same goes for INTP. This is evident in INTP kids, who are trying to use Ti but just aren't mature or smart enough yet to use it correctly. They flounder around in pseudo-logic and poorly formed arguments. They are still INTP though. Even if they never grow up to be smart, they're still INTP.

Competency is not a prerequisite for any cognitive process







.....even though I wish it were. Those rare dumb ENTPs, whose Ne just won't stop, piss the hell out of me...

[Kevinaswell]

Case closed.

[Tlatoani]

Originally Posted by Jorge

Wey neta.... das hueva. No de una forma que los INTP la dan porque somos unos geeks y nerds. Simplemente estas dando hueva repitiendo tus argumentos a una audiencia que no te quiere escuchar.

Esa es la parte importante, mi gringo amigo. Yo vengo a discutir con la persona capaz de sostener una discusión teórica conmigo, y al parecer estos taradetes incivilizados no son capaces de quitarle una sola pluma al gallo. ¿Qué puedo hacer? No es mi problema. Mi único recurso ahora es esperar a que exista alguien aqui que de el ancho para tal tipo de discusiones, porque si ves nadie me ha probado equivocado, simplemente se traban en su proceso idiota de sentirse poca cosa y odiarme por "creerme gran cosa". Si es eso lo que pueden entender de mis argumentos, pues que lástima por su poca inteligencia, solamente prueban lo correcto que está mi punto principal: No hay INTPs sin Ti y no hay Ti sin inteligencia y conocimiento.

PD. Espero que te haya sido leve la paliza en el tema de los vegetarianos, te recomiendo un aguacatito vegetariano para que se te pase el coraje y la muina eh ;)

And yeah, he read the INTP description and agreed to it. After closer inspection, I do agree with him being an INTP (although I still doubt his I... I keep telling him he's an extrovert, and he refuses to acknowledge he's one)... it was just shocking the first time I read that he was in fact an INTP.

You don't have the credentials to decide if he's an INTP or not if you're still using dichotomy theory to establish his type. Seriously, there's more to it than the stupid dichotomies.

Originally Posted by Kevinaswell

Get out of your logic bubble you've locked yourself into and realize there is more.

Obviously something that an INTP would say. So sad Kevin-INFP.

Originally Posted by thewindlistens

Sure, there's no INTP without Ti. But there's plenty of Ti without knowledge/intelligence. They have nothing to do with each other.

Saying that there is no Ti without knowledge/intelligence is like saying that there's no warm water without natural gas.

Did you read my posts? are you familiar with forum debates? You have to understand first what I said and then prove me wrong, just coming here and saying that I'm wrong is not enough in a respectable debate. So here comes again the challenge, quote me in the parts I'm wrong and tell me why I'm wrong, ok?

Originally Posted by tdmg

Just because X is you primary function doesn't mean you are good at using it, or any of the functions.

An ISFP who reads their Fi wrong all the time doesn't mean they aren't an ISFP, it just makes them incompetent If I met an INTJ that was so dim that even my Ni was more accurate than his, would that mean he wasn't an INTJ?

And the same goes for INTP. This is evident in INTP kids, who are trying to use Ti but just aren't mature or smart enough yet to use it correctly. They flounder around in pseudo-logic and poorly formed arguments. They are still INTP though. Even if they never grow up to be smart, they're still INTP.

Competency is not a prerequisite for any cognitive process







.....even though I wish it were. Those rare dumb ENTPs, whose Ne just won't stop, piss the hell out of me...

Same for you. Keep trying.