[ginnyisdacoolest]

I have seen this discussed a lot with regard to INTJs, but I was wondering if anyone here has every experienced this or known another INTP who has.

For those who don't know, this is the explanation that generally pops up when the Death Spiral is being discussed:

Stage 1: NT meets NF. NF is enamoured of NT, falls head over heels. NT is characteristically cautious, but interested. NFs are fun, after all.

Stage 2: NF appreciates and admires many characteristics of the NT and thus begins to behave more like an NT, perhaps even fooling the NT into thinking s/he is an NT. NT then relaxes, figuring s/he's with a kindred spirit, gets more comfortable with the relationship, starts acting like normal NT self, expecting to be understood.

Stage 3: NF feels NT cooling off and wonders what s/he is doing wrong. Tries to be more like NT to compensate. This doesn't feel right. NF gets needy and/or begins to consider is her/his duty to draw the NT out of her/his shell, encouraging the NT to express all those feelings buried deep inside. NT doesn't get it.

Stage 4: NT feels pressure from NFs emotional demands, needs distance to figure things out. (This might be only INTs. I'm not sure.) NF panics, becomes more needy. NT withdraws more...NF needs more...and so on and so on.

Stage 5: NF suddenly realizes that the reason things aren't working is that the NT is cold and unfeeling or not nurturing or some other horrible thing. Abandons NT without looking back. (This is especially likely with the NFPs.) NT is confused and (sometimes) relieved.


Like I said, I've only ever really seen this discussed where the NT was an INTJ, and I was wondering how much we as their MBTI cousins experience it in comparison.

[nevermore]

Yup, this happened with me and an ENFJ. Think this is pretty common, but it depends on the NF type. Perhaps one with auxiliary feeling would be a better match, even if the stronger feeling would still be an issue?

For me I found their more sensitive nature endearing at first since I have a pretty strong Fe, but having to put up with tons of it day after day is just a bit much. NF's and NT's can be the best of friends, but as for intimate relationships...not always.

[PAdude]

Not sure if she is an NF, but the first four describe my emotionally abusive ex very well except she was a clinger.

[nevermore]

Very often people on these forums will write "NT" when they really mean "Thinker" or "NF" when they really mean "Feeler". I could see what the OP described being am NT/NF thing in particular, but that's still an interesting manifestation of intuitive prejudice.

[Ziggurat]

Very often people on these forums will write "NT" when they really mean "Thinker" or "NF" when they really mean "Feeler". I could see what the OP described being am NT/NF thing in particular, but that's still an interesting manifestation of intuitive prejudice.

I think it's just a case of people taking the temperaments too seriously.

[nevermore]

I think it's just a case of people taking the temperaments too seriously.

That too...sloppy and stereotyped thinking. Understandable since the N temperaments are the only ones defined by Thinking and Feeling.

[lirulin]

Or a lack of evidence that it happens with Ss too? Not wanting to generalise beyond the available data? It would be interesting to see if Ss notice a similar trend - I haven't really seen it yet myself.

I can see it happening a little more with Ns just because we tend to be a little more spaced...the extra groundedness the S types can have can perhaps help when they communicate with each other.

[Ziggurat]

Or a lack of evidence that it happens with Ss too? Not wanting to generalise beyond the available data? It would be interesting to see if Ss notice a similar trend - I haven't really seen it yet myself.

What data?

[lirulin]

What data?

It relies mainly on anecdotal evidence - however, this isn't exactly science so there is only so much one can complain about that. It's more of a description of a relatively common experience rather than a claim that this happens always or x amount of time to x groups of people. Large numbers of people on a couple of forums have given it a ringing endorsement re its bang-on description of their experiences. These people, so far as I have seen, are mainly Ns. It would be cool to see if Ss found the description something they could relate to as well but I'm too lazy to start the thread.

[nevermore]

Or a lack of evidence that it happens with Ss too? Not wanting to generalise beyond the available data? It would be interesting to see if Ss notice a similar trend - I haven't really seen it yet myself.

I can see it happening a little more with Ns just because we tend to be a little more spaced...the extra groundedness the S types can have can perhaps help when they communicate with each other.

I could see that. N's generally tend to "read into things"; if you're an NF, that will generally be into others emotional states. N also seems to have a "glorifying effect" on the judgment function it is paired with, just from what I've seen (not sure if I'm articulating this properly, but NT's tend to exalt logic more than ST's do, and the NF's tend to have a global, universal idealism).