[INTJ] INFJs and the guilt train when disappointing others?

INFJs and the guilt train when disappointing others?

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This is a discussion on INFJs and the guilt train when disappointing others? within the INTJ Forum - The Scientists forums, part of the NT's Temperament Forum- The Intellects category; ...

  1. #1
    INFJ

    INFJs and the guilt train when disappointing others?

    Hi everyone,

    

I had one of those "Aha" moments today about myself/my life and I wanted to know if you can relate to this as an INFJ? 


    I always feel extremely guilty and sometimes ashamed when I cannot meet other peoples expectations (even unspoken ones). 
Even if I say I’m sorry and the other person assures me that they understand and that it’s ok, it never helps me to feel less shi##y about it.
That’s because I know that internally their expectation is still there and that they’re consciously or unconsciously still disappointed in me or mad at me. Whereby "disappointed" is even worse ...

    I wanted to ask if other INFJs experience this too because I had kind of a revelation after watching a video on YT by Tom Davidson called „INFJ & Toxic Shame“. It made me realize that the situation I experienced today is a recurring thing but I never fully realized it before.


    ----
 Optional background story:


    I’m currently healing from depression and anxiety, so it’s probably even more acute for me then usual. Because of that I had to cancel an event where me and a friend should give a presentation about a project we did together. I already canceled a while ago and she wanted to do the presentation alone today but her train got delayed so much that she didn’t make it in time. So she had a lot of stress (for which I also feel guilty) and needed to ask another friend to fill in last minute.

    Even though she assured me that she understands my situation, I always feel the unspoken „you’re not doing your part“ in every sentence she says or writes. I even thought about forcing myself to the event just so she's not so disappointed, but I finally reached a point where I'm not able to act against my own needs anymore.

    While contemplating why I always make such an internal fuss about not meeting others expectations I stumbled upon the video. Anxiety/Depression pretty much forced me to stop now and to put my needs first - which is very hard sometimes and often results in feeling guilty because I cannot function how everyone wants me to. But I realized that this situation is pretty much representative for all my life and the reason why I ignore(d) my own wishes all the time so everyone else is happy.

    

Phew! … That was a long one…


    But I think the guilt train may be a thing more INFJs? 
What’s your experience with it?



  2. #2
    INTJ - The Scientists

    You posted this on the INTJ forum

  3. #3

    The answer is an big yes. Re-post in INFJ forum and I will respond in more detail. You are not alone.

  4. #4

    Quote Originally Posted by OutsideLookingIn391 View Post
    The answer is an big yes. Re-post in INFJ forum and I will respond in more detail. You are not alone.
    Amen

  5. #5
    INFJ

    Yeah I'm sorry I just realized I managed to put the post in the wrong place *facepalm* xD....I'm reposting it in the right forum and will ask the admins to remove this one! Sorry INTJ's
    stathamspeacoat and lilysocks thanked this post.

  6. #6

    Quote Originally Posted by EveJ View Post
    Yeah I'm sorry I just realized I managed to put the post in the wrong place *facepalm* xD....I'm reposting it in the right forum and will ask the admins to remove this one! Sorry INTJ's
    I mean you'll get advice but it will probably be like "other people's expectations are other people's problems."

    Which I think is good advice! haha
    Clumsy and lookslikeiwin thanked this post.

  7. #7
    INFJ

    That's fine I don't really want specific advice I'm more after other peoples thoughts on it ^^.
    Ok, so I'm writing to the admins now and you INTJs can come over to the other forum if you want to join in too ;D
    stathamspeacoat thanked this post.

  8. #8

    Quote Originally Posted by EveJ View Post
    Hi everyone,

    

I had one of those "Aha" moments today about myself/my life and I wanted to know if you can relate to this as an INFJ? 


    I always feel extremely guilty and sometimes ashamed when I cannot meet other peoples expectations (even unspoken ones). 
Even if I say I’m sorry and the other person assures me that they understand and that it’s ok, it never helps me to feel less shi##y about it.
That’s because I know that internally their expectation is still there and that they’re consciously or unconsciously still disappointed in me or mad at me. Whereby "disappointed" is even worse ...

    I wanted to ask if other INFJs experience this too because I had kind of a revelation after watching a video on YT by Tom Davidson called „INFJ & Toxic Shame“. It made me realize that the situation I experienced today is a recurring thing but I never fully realized it before.


    ----
 Optional background story:


    I’m currently healing from depression and anxiety, so it’s probably even more acute for me then usual. Because of that I had to cancel an event where me and a friend should give a presentation about a project we did together. I already canceled a while ago and she wanted to do the presentation alone today but her train got delayed so much that she didn’t make it in time. So she had a lot of stress (for which I also feel guilty) and needed to ask another friend to fill in last minute.

    Even though she assured me that she understands my situation, I always feel the unspoken „you’re not doing your part“ in every sentence she says or writes. I even thought about forcing myself to the event just so she's not so disappointed, but I finally reached a point where I'm not able to act against my own needs anymore.

    While contemplating why I always make such an internal fuss about not meeting others expectations I stumbled upon the video. Anxiety/Depression pretty much forced me to stop now and to put my needs first - which is very hard sometimes and often results in feeling guilty because I cannot function how everyone wants me to. But I realized that this situation is pretty much representative for all my life and the reason why I ignore(d) my own wishes all the time so everyone else is happy.

    

Phew! … That was a long one…


    But I think the guilt train may be a thing more INFJs? 
What’s your experience with it?
    OK, thanks for re-posting! Guilt and depression. Something I have "coped" with all my life. I think the guilt arises from feeling culpable or deficient in something. And that will eventually lead to anger, resignation, and depression. So as for meeting others expectations. I grew up an NF in an S family. Black sheep, as I mentioned on another thread. It was an extremely achievement oriented family. I had an older brother was brilliant, an ES, and I was in the shadows. So I achieved also, raised my school grades, went on into a field that I thought would please my parents, got an advanced degree. My life was directed by what I thought would please others. Then I got married to a college sweetie, We dated for 4 years, and then all my friends were getting married, and everyone was asking "Michael, when are you all getting married". So we had a large wedding, great, everyone got drunk, everyone was happy. The marriage lasted 20 months when I scared the crap out of her with talk of having kids.

    So later in life ( i been around a while) I got the notion that since my background was in research, I would do something that the family would like and appreciate. I spent 15 years researching my family's genealogy, and I was going to present them with a nice book of family history. Well, not one of them could have cared less. It was pretty devastating to me.

    I could go on and on about this. So I won't bore you with more. But the bottom line is, this INFJ expected some kind of feedback, some kind of pat on the back, and rarely did it happen. Conversely, I had high expectations to friends and family. I expected for them to reach out to me (you know, like keep in touch every once and a while) as much as I would reach out to them. You see, I always attended the family functions when called on.

    So now, I have just withdrawn into an inner fantasy world where I make believe that I'm loved, popular, smart, productive and all the rest. I've pretty much cut off all relationships with the past, since it's the only way I can deal with it. I'm not totally unhappy with this setup, but it is an isolated existence.

    I hope this can help you with some insight...

  9. #9
    INFJ

    Quote Originally Posted by OutsideLookingIn391 View Post
    OK, thanks for re-posting!
    Damed, now we're all posting in the wrong thread ;D. Can you copy it over too so I can answer it there?

  10. #10

    God wants you to feel guilty.
    That is why he installed the guilt module in the first place.
    Along with the shame/fear/anger/panic module.
    He wants you to be as miserable as possible, so he can feel better about himself for being so perfect.
    He always blames the devil, but we know who is the real culprint.
    The devil is just a defect angel anyway.
    Had a screw loose, so he threw him away on our planet.
    Real nice place to place a paradise, right next to the defective angel dump.
    lilysocks and StrangeHours thanked this post.


     
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