[perennialurker]

As an INTJ I find myself to be quite pragmatic, but I also see myself as being highly idealistic. I would say that almost every major life decision I face involves a war between these two contradictory facets of my personality. Almost always the pragmatic side wins. Also, I find that in the name of pragmatism I am often too willing to jettison my principles for the sake of expediency and attaining results. Do other INTJs experience this conflict of conscience and how do you deal with this?

[InvisibleJim]

I understand your point, eventually I learned to see my beliefs from a different perspective so they were better aligned with my goals.

[Grey]

In a way. Although I'm quite younger, and there's an assigned idealism to the younger age groups (typically, and of course, not all of the time), it would be hard to say, but I have noted such a conflict. Although it does have a habit of coming out when considering future scenarios, I've noticed another such 'conflict' when interacting with others. If others are 'down in the dumps' and imagining the worst scenarios that can happen, I usually feel that I am the most optimistic of all of them, wanting to stop 'moping around' and start taking steps to make the most of what I see as a negative, but not terrible, situation. If others are very optimistic about something, however, I've also found I usually feel that they're being too sightless and need to consider the practical aspects as well.

It's not pure idealism or pragmatism, but that's my experience.

[Wien1938]

This is a conflict with which I can identify. I would describe myself as highly idealistic but prepared to recognise that the world is complicated and that my ideals may be incorrect or even harmful and therefore could need revision, re-evaluation or even abandonment.

Politically I regard certain outcomes (an excellent standard of state education, a sound economy and a strong British presence in the world) as eminently desirable but that these require analysis of the problems in order to find a resolution. This can, as indicated above, require the re-evaluation of ideals which may turn out to be flawed or need application in a different manner.

[0,1,1,2,3,5,8,13,21,34]

They do not conflict so much with me. I can be quite stubborn and I usually follow my ideals until they are proven wrong which is not a pretty thing. Many of those ideals are pragmatic in nature, though. I have to have a philosophy for myself to follow that makes sense, so no, I don't have a lot of inner conflict. I am constantly self-analyzing to improve these ideals... but no, the pragmatism is just a tool to accomplish my goals. I'm not so faithless or impatient that I would sacrifice the long-term quality for immediate results.

Dreams are lame and plans are blind, but if the blind will carry and the lame will guide him they will get where they need to go.

[perennialurker]

I have heard that many of the people on PC are college students. This is precisely why I made this post because for most of my life, including college, I was highly idealistic and principled. Now that I am in the real world, however, I find it much more difficult to live up to those pure ideals which seemed so simple just a year or so ago. I am certain much of this has to do simply with growing up, nonetheless it seems to me that INTJs would be especially prone to this conflict given our strong sense of logic AND idealism. This comes along with the INTJ desire not only to understand the world, but also to use our insights to make concrete contributions to society. Or is this just me? I would appreciate any insights.

[windex]

I thought I was an INTJ for a while and experience this conflicting nature but I always or life always finds a way for me to completely screw up the pragmatic. But maybe it's not idealism. It's more like seeing an unorthodox way to reach a goal that no one else sees(of course since they aren't me). And do I kid myself to pretend I see more than they see? No, not at all. But I do like to see in between the fine print and see what can be contingency planned to reach a goal through whatever methods available. Maybe this is why quite a few INTJ's come from impoversihed backgrounds and are able to accomplish a great deal and survive their adversity with humility and integrity. But again, I don't pretend I'm this type of INTJ or an INTJ at all. So why am I here? I really want to take away the I from every conversation from now on. The I is pointless, limiting, delusional. The I will change soon.

[ultimategangsta]

I'd say I'm an idealist in my goals, meaning I search for things that benefit the overall happiness of people, but I'm very pragmatic in my attempts to implement my ideals, (almost to the point of being brutal)

[bethdeth]

I loathe making decisions that are merely expedience.....it's a fine line of treading in between the now and what is the better outcome for the future so i tend to cut through with pragmatism whilst trying to keep an eye on what is best for everyone involved.....I am sure my thoughts kill fairies out there.

That was a good question BTW.

[calliope]

I have no conflict with idealism and pragmatism. I always follow my ideals, but I won't pretend I can fix something I have no power over. I will always jump in where others don't. If someone expresses the same values I have, I will hold them to the values until they tell me they have changed their mind. There is always something i can do to effect change, even if indirectly. If you are careful in your approach in a given situation, you can at least make other people think about their actions even if they don't change them. I have always done this. When I was college-aged I only used persistent gentle questions to get people to look at their actions. I have a better arsenal now, and I've never been tempted to give up my ideals.