[INFJ] God and Bible: knowing God and the INFJ intuition

God and Bible: knowing God and the INFJ intuition

+ Reply to Thread
Hello Guest! Sign up to join the discussion below...
Page 1 of 11 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 101
Thank Tree223Thanks

This is a discussion on God and Bible: knowing God and the INFJ intuition within the INFJ Forum - The Protectors forums, part of the NF's Temperament Forum- The Dreamers category; I have been wandering these forums for a few weeks now, and the more I learn about INFJ and the ...

  1. #1
    INFJ - The Protectors


    God and Bible: knowing God and the INFJ intuition

    I have been wandering these forums for a few weeks now, and the more I learn about INFJ and the other personality types, the more 'clicks' I experience. By 'clicks' I mean these little things that have always bothered or puzzled me about myself and others, that now click into place thanks to everything I have learned here.

    This morning I had another click and I would like to share it here, to see if there are others who had or have the same experience.

    I grew up in a Christian environment. My parents are Protestants, but rather open minded, with Catholic sympathies (which is rather unusual). Lately I have been experiencing a lot of trouble going to church on Sundays. I also have lots of difficulties going to bible studies and other Christian/religious activities.

    This morning I was starting to see a connection with being INFJ.

    Perhaps I should provide some examples:
    I go to church and listen to sermons. But often, I will disagree with the pastor, or I will question whatever he has to say. I have this almost uncontrollable urge to get up an walk away, saying: "All this is not about the God I know, so this is not for me."

    Protestants have always put the Bible in the center of their religious activities. Lately, I find that I am questioning this practice. To me it is almost as if many Christians I know worship the Bible as a seperate entity. As if there's the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and the Bible. Now I do believe that God reveals His will and his love in the Bible, but I also think there are other ways to know God. (By no means do I mean to discard the Bible as the word of God).

    I haven't been able to talk to this with any of the Christians I know, even the most open minded ones. Questioning the way Christians treat the Bible is obviously a minefield. Discussion partners will reject my thoughts beforehand.

    This morning I had the thought that my new approach of knowing God may be a typical intuitive thing and taking only the Bible as a way knowing God a typical sensor approach.

    Please tell me, INFJs, if that thought is completely ridiculous, and if so, why.

    By the way, I don't mean this thread to be about whether or not God exists. I don't mind if a thread topic is changed while a thread is in progress, but personally, I will not be getting into that in this thread.



  2. #2
    INFJ - The Protectors

    It seems reasonable to take an intuitive approach to God. In fact, a lot more reasonable than taking a literal or semi literal interpretation of the Bible.

    I can't say I really know what is meant by 'knowing God'. It seems to me that it is mostly a way of explaining coincidence and gut feelings, although I accept that I may be missing something. However, other than people brought up religious, most religious people seem to have had some kind of 'religious experience', something which convinces them that God must exist, and I have yet to find one of these which cannot be explained without a God existing.

    From my point of view then, it makes most sense to interpret God in a way which makes the world a good place to be, and that is certainly not through Bible study! (I've no idea how anyone who has actually read it can take it literally). Gods only seem to have meaning for the people who believe in them, and you will find some people who believe in Gods in pretty much every possible way, so as long as it makes sense to you, and you are not harming anyone else, then go for it.
    Killbain, StElmosDream, WanderingLucid and 2 others thanked this post.

  3. #3
    Unknown Personality

    I'll just reply to this statement.
    I haven't been able to talk to this with any of the Christians I know, even the most open minded ones.
    I feel a closer connection to people on PerC, Christians and non Christians, than I do IRL.
    I would love to gather around a quiet living room and just discuss without division, just to see what's on their mind about the divine. I have so much to learn, and I can gather tid bits from anyone, even people of different belief.
    a few people here, just off the top of my head, have already given insight or I know I could gain insight from... @bubbleboy , @HorribleAesthete , @Zech , @setzer , @GoodOldDreamer , @OldManRivers , @Crono91 , @Vaan , @innovati , @Gnothi Seauton , @Hokahey , @Enki , @StElmosDream , @INFJoshua , @Killbain @SocioApathetic ..................................

    OK...whoa...wait....list is getting out of hand and I realize so far, only male names.
    I have just as many female names, but I should move on to my point, and maybe mention them later....or not.

    I can listen to preachers, or anyone, on-line easier than in person. Because they're human and mess up, they start to confuse me and I end up having to move on if they're not inclined to discuss it. If I can't get back to a place of peace and trust with them, there's no point to listen to them anymore, no matter how much I adore them, or have been helped by them. If there's no forward movement, then I move forward alone. (which makes me very sad)

    This introverted intuition for me, is simply the way God speaks to me and gives me direction.
    If anything causes interference, I'm clueless on which direction to go and spin in circles, grasping for info.
    I'm learning how to tune in better and trust God's voice more.
    I find direction in the Bible, which is God's word to me. I read, listen, ask questions,
    and wait for answers (ok...I'm not so good at this!!)

    I'll end here, this is getting to long. Interesting thread. I would look forward to reading posts.
    Last edited by ruth2ten; 08-21-2012 at 09:20 AM.
    HorribleAesthete, Hokahey, Vaan and 5 others thanked this post.

  4. #4
    INFJ - The Protectors


    Quote Originally Posted by TDMmyriad View Post
    It seems reasonable to take an intuitive approach to God. In fact, a lot more reasonable than taking a literal or semi literal interpretation of the Bible.

    I can't say I really know what is meant by 'knowing God'. It seems to me that it is mostly a way of explaining coincidence and gut feelings, although I accept that I may be missing something. However, other than people brought up religious, most religious people seem to have had some kind of 'religious experience', something which convinces them that God must exist, and I have yet to find one of these which cannot be explained without a God existing.

    From my point of view then, it makes most sense to interpret God in a way which makes the world a good place to be, and that is certainly not through Bible study! (I've no idea how anyone who has actually read it can take it literally). Gods only seem to have meaning for the people who believe in them, and you will find some people who believe in Gods in pretty much every possible way, so as long as it makes sense to you, and you are not harming anyone else, then go for it.
    I like your comment on what knowing God is. It's a good point, well said :-)

    When I hear Christians I know talk about the Bible, I always get the feeling that they want something to hold on to, something tangible, something real, and they need it so bad, that they are afraid the look beyond the paper and ink.

    As for a religious experience, I never had a miraculously big one. Itīs rather a string of events... an ongoing process. I experience God in silence and in nature.

    Also, I would like to add one thing... A few years ago I started reading works by George MacDonald (the man that C.S. Lewis thought of as his teacher). MacDonald took views that are unlike anything else. He said -among many other things- that Christians should stop believing in all kinds of things, like dogmas, thoughts, ideas, the 'right' ideas, and even the Bible. They should START believing in God Himself. Thatīs a quote that really stuck with me. Looking for authenticity I guess :-P
    Last edited by Northwind; 08-21-2012 at 09:07 AM.
    Cerebro, raiimu, Killbain and 1 others thanked this post.

  5. #5
    INFJ - The Protectors

    (Ok, disclaimer time: I am not a preacher or theologian or whatever. I'm just an average Joe. )

    The thing about being Ni dominant when it comes to believing in God (or anything else, I'd imagine) is that at some point, you simply "just know" He exists. You don't need constant reminders or refresher courses on it. (Although at rougher times in life, those are nice.) You don't need to explain how you know (and you probably couldn't, anyway), nor will you be impressed if someone thinks differently about Him because you know Him on a more personal, more intimate level. Bible studies and sermons can seem mundane at times because it feels like you're going through a step-by-step processes to know Him when Ni has done all that for you already.

    And for what it matters, the Bible can become an idol just like anything else. The 10 Commandments (the law) became idols to the Pharisees. Even the house of God, the temple, became a market place at some point. Humans are stupid like that. The great thing about God though is that while "to err is human, to forgive is divine".

    When I go to church, it's to spend some time with others who share in my faith. It's like going to an oasis in this harsh, dry desert of a world. If I get something out of the sermon, great. If not, oh well. The pastor's just as human as I am. But I'm there for the community. It's kinda like how I am here on PerC.

    At times, I might discuss types or functions or whatever. But I'm here for the community, especially for the friends that I've made here. We're all in this together. We're not islands unto ourselves. Same goes at church. There are bonds that are made. And the world wants nothing more than to tear us down. We need to be there for each other to lift us up again, because no one else will be.

    I feel the closest ties to God through music, personally. It's also nice that most Christian music revolves around love in some way, if not love for Him, then love for each other inspired by Him. God is love, after all.
    Vivid Melody, ruth2ten, Killbain and 5 others thanked this post.

  6. #6
    Unknown Personality

    This morning I had the thought that my new approach of knowing God may be a typical intuitive thing and taking only the Bible as a way knowing God a typical sensor approach.


    Something I mentioned on an INTP forum recently is that I think assuming God exists in the sense that Christians seem to speak of, it would definitely make sense that God has the capacity to form personal relationships with everyone and anyone, a capacity which the human heart can many or most of the times lack.

    EVEN if the Bible were the only word of God, the way two different readers of the Bible would understand God would be different (this is one of the nice things about studying the cognitive processes we use ... two individuals can be good at the same subject in school, but for very different reasons).

    Quote Originally Posted by GoodOldDreamer
    is that at some point, you simply "just know" He exists


    I like your way of putting it! Not to say that I've reached this point, possibly because I have pretty pesky Ti. ;) But more than some Ti-dominant users, perhaps, I can connect with this idea quite a bit, and appreciate when others feel that way.
    ruth2ten, Killbain, Northwind and 1 others thanked this post.

  7. #7
    Unknown Personality

    From my point of view then, it makes most sense to interpret God in a way which makes the world a good place to be


    Comment: I say it makes most sense to interpret God in a way that truths are achieved as well, though, and at times that can mean DRASTICALLY refining our notion of "good" ...
    Northwind thanked this post.

  8. #8
    INFJ - The Protectors

    Quote Originally Posted by TDMmyriad View Post

    From my point of view then, it makes most sense to interpret God in a way which makes the world a good place to be...
    This is just IMHO, but the more I come to know about God, the crappier this world becomes by comparison. This is a dark, harsh, and cruel place to be. It's corrupted, full of sin and destruction and evil. It's a battleground of spiritual warfare, and the battle never ends. There's a reason blessings are recognizable for what they are. They stand out. His grace and mercy stands out. He shines a light that this world desperately needs.

    Knowing God means knowing just how good this world could be, but isn't. Or isn't anymore. What I wouldn't give to have been here back when this world was perfect, without the infection of sin. There's a reason that Satan could offer up all the kingdoms of this world to Jesus during his period of temptations. They were/are his to give like that.

    Not that they should be, but people are weak and corrupted. One day this world will be made right again. One day.
    ruth2ten, Killbain, confused girl28 and 3 others thanked this post.

  9. #9
    INFJ - The Protectors


    Quote Originally Posted by GoodOldDreamer View Post
    (Ok, disclaimer time: I am not a preacher or theologian or whatever. I'm just an average Joe. )

    The thing about being Ni dominant when it comes to believing in God (or anything else, I'd imagine) is that at some point, you simply "just know" He exists. You don't need constant reminders or refresher courses on it. (Although at rougher times in life, those are nice.) You don't need to explain how you know (and you probably couldn't, anyway), nor will you be impressed if someone thinks differently about Him because you know Him on a more personal, more intimate level. Bible studies and sermons can seem mundane at times because it feels like you're going through a step-by-step processes to know Him when Ni has done all that for you already.

    And for what it matters, the Bible can become an idol just like anything else. The 10 Commandments (the law) became idols to the Pharisees. Even the house of God, the temple, became a market place at some point. Humans are stupid like that. The great thing about God though is that while "to err is human, to forgive is divine".

    When I go to church, it's to spend some time with others who share in my faith. It's like going to an oasis in this harsh, dry desert of a world. If I get something out of the sermon, great. If not, oh well. The pastor's just as human as I am. But I'm there for the community. It's kinda like how I am here on PerC.

    At times, I might discuss types or functions or whatever. But I'm here for the community, especially for the friends that I've made here. We're all in this together. We're not islands unto ourselves. Same goes at church. There are bonds that are made. And the world wants nothing more than to tear us down. We need to be there for each other to lift us up again, because no one else will be.

    I feel the closest ties to God through music, personally. It's also nice that most Christian music revolves around love in some way, if not love for Him, then love for each other inspired by Him. God is love, after all.
    Lewis wasn't a preacher or theologian either, yet he said some pretty intelligent things about God an faith, and I think the same of you in this post.

    Last Sunday was the first time in ages I actually heard an intelligent and interesting sermon. It was quite daring. The irony was that that partcular pastor has a speech impediment, and people are always complaing about how they don't understand him. Well, I understood him just fine, and I wish there were more like him.

    I find it admirable that you go there for the community. I can't say I share that sentiment. But I do frequent a prayer group. I do go there for the community. It is a safe haven where people help each other.

    The other tie with my church is through our music ensemble. We play classical religious music (Bach and similar stuff) and we play in church services as well. It means a lot to me.

    For me it is a relief to hear from people who have similar experiences, who understand where I'm coming from, or who, at the very least, don't shoot me down from the get go.

    I clicked the Thanks button below you post, GoodOldDreamer, but that doesn't express the depth of my thankfulness, so I will repeat it here: Thanks! :-)
    Vivid Melody, ruth2ten, GoodOldDreamer and 1 others thanked this post.

  10. #10
    INFJ - The Protectors

    Religion is something I practice like a sport, rather than something I feel a part of like a team.

    When I look back to the oldest recorded human civilizations I see two concepts still present in every successful society mankind has had since: Justice and Religion. Not every legal system or religious order has been the same, but trying to operate a society without either one is impossible in the long-term. What is it about us humans that we can only thrive when certain physical needs are met, but also only when certain psychological needs are met too - are we truly the most advanced animals on this planet, or are we just the neediest?

    I look around me and see how much good my church is doing on the community. Being a part of that, and helping my community help my community can never be a waste of my time or resources. I'm happy to serve however I'm able!

    As an INFJ I've long ago stopped trying to find that place where I fit in. I think it's a blessing and a curse that we feel we never fit in anywhere, but it's a fact that lets us move forward without being held back by others - so why do we let ourselves be held back by them?
    Saffronialily, ruth2ten, Cerebro and 5 others thanked this post.


 

Quick Reply Quick Reply

Register Now

Please enter the name by which you would like to log-in and be known on this site.
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.

Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Please enter a valid email address for yourself. *Note* To protect our forum from spam, we require all users to verify their email. We will send you a confirmation email after you've created an account. Be sure to check your "spam" box if you don't receive it in your inbox.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


Similar Threads

  1. [INFJ] INFJ Dating Bible or: How to Date an INFJ
    By Em Dai in forum INFJ Forum - The Protectors
    Replies: 66
    Last Post: 10-17-2012, 03:19 AM
  2. [INFJ] INFJ Dating Bible or: How to Date an INFJ
    By firelink in forum INFJ Forum - The Protectors
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 05-01-2012, 08:31 PM
  3. [INFJ] INFJ with really bad intuition?
    By myosotis in forum INFJ Forum - The Protectors
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 01-13-2011, 04:23 PM
  4. INFJ Has your intuition ever failed you?
    By Ephemeral in forum INFJ Forum - The Protectors
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 08-16-2010, 07:28 AM
  5. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 04-27-2010, 08:11 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:32 PM.
Information provided on the site is meant to complement and not replace any advice or information from a health professional.
Đ 2014 PersonalityCafe