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About LinkBacksWhat are the decisive differences?
This is a discussion on 4w5 vs 2w1 within the Heart Triad - Types 2,3,4 forums, part of the Enneagram Personality Theory Forum category; What are the decisive differences?...
What are the decisive differences?
There are exceptions, but 2s are generally more extroverted than 4s (especially 4w5s, who are more introverted than 4w3s). 2s are more likely to hide feelings of shame. And 2s generally have a more positive outlook on both themselves and the world around them than 4s do.
Two
Engaging
Rescues
Focus on others
Unaware of self
Altruists
Understanding
Extroverted
Positive
Feel superior
Loving
Four
Withdrawn
Want to be rescued
Focus on self
Introspective
Individualists
Misunderstood
Introverted
Negative
Feel inferior
Ambivalent
Source
The bullet points were confusing me as my self-assessment using those words says half-and-half. Your explanation helped though. Thanks.
2's express a desire to love and be loved, while 4's express a desire for individualality and authenticity. I mean both types in of themselves are very different, but I could see how one could confuse them given that out of all the heart triad types both are the most introverted.
This however gives a good difference between them:
Source: Enneagram InstituteTwos and Fours can be confused primarily because they are both Feeling types, and because they both put great emphasis on the ups and downs of their personal relationships. Even with these similarities, however, these two types are seldom mistaken for each other. When they are, it is usually because they are defining the types too narrowly. For instance, some Twos might mistype themselves as Fours if they have been through a depression or have recently been through the end of an important relationship. They may learn that Fours are a depressive type and deduce that since they have been depressed that they are probably Fours. In fact, all nine types can be depressed: feeling sad or alienated in itself is not an indication of being any particular type. Twos may also hear that Fours are romantic, and seeing themselves as romantic mistype themselves. Female Fours who have been reared in traditional or strongly religious environments may identify themselves as Twos, but this is a danger for woman of all types. Some Fours may also have been under stress for a while may similarly recognize many Two-ish behaviors.
Their differences are not difficult to recognize, however. Twos tend to move toward others and engage them, sometimes excessively. Fours tend to withdraw from others, while hoping that others will seek them out. Twos look for people to rescue, Fours look for someone to rescue them. Twos are very aware of others' feelings, but tend to be unaware of their own motivations and needs. Fours are highly attuned to their own emotional states, but can fail to recognize their impact on others, and so forth.
can 4's be just unhealthy 2's? because it sounds if they just change their mental attitute they'd resemble 2's a lot more.
No. The reason you may see it this way is because 2's integration point is 4 & 4's disintegration point is 2, so there is some connection between them, in addition to both of them being heart/image triad types. In reality, 4s look more like 2s when UNHEALTHY. When healthy, 4s actually have 1 traits - they have moral principles & structure they adhere to to balance their 4ness. 2s look more like 4s when healthy - they develop an inner sense of self-worth & feel motivated to give/help out of authentic feeling & with other people's actual needs in mind, not dependent on being needed by others to feel valued or giving/helping to fulfill their need to be needed/admired, as a sort of guilt-trip to get what they need.Originally Posted by xEmilyx
Their visible demeanors are markedly different, and their false beliefs & core motivations are very different as well. Confusing them in person seems unlikley....
Fours are self-absorbed, Twos are others-absorbed. It diverges even further from there.
Really? Two's don't have Fi? I'm very self aware, individualistic, and a little misunderstood, but that doesn't make me any less of a two...
I'm not sure where you got "don't have Fi" out of that. 2s don't usually lead with Fi, but they may prefer Fi over Fe. 2 is associated with extroversion & Fe, but it's still common for ExFPs to be 2s. It's not so common for IxFPs to be 2s though.
2's and 4's confuse the heck out of me when I first got to Enneagram. I typed as a 2 a lot before I went into deeper self discovery. Ultimately I find that I really like people and like being around them, but I realized that I am focused more on myself then others. Although if you put me in a social situation I could probably act a bit like a 2 - but that could also be because a 2 is somewhere in my tri-type.
Yeah the Heart triad is very confusing to me and I personally think there are a lot more commonalities then differences, even if others may disagree in that. I still have yet to see how 2's and 4's could seem different especially if they have some kind of sexual or social variant to them which lightens them up, makes them more externally focused and pushes them to be more attracted to others in general. Maybe you could tell the difference in Sp types since their personal goal is to put major focus on their own individual needs before anything else. But I imagine social and sexual 2's and 4's would find a lot of common ground together. Especially since both have similar vices and strengths.
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