Introspection Illusion

Discussion Item:
Introspection Illusion

The introspection illusion is a cognitive illusion in which people wrongly think they have direct insight into the origins of their mental states. In certain situations, this illusion leads to people making confident but false explanations of their own behavior or predictions about their future mental states. The illusion has been examined in a number of different psychological experiments, and suggested as a basis for other biases. These experiments have been interpreted as suggesting that, rather than offering direct access to the processes underlying mental states, introspection is a process of construction and inference, much as people indirectly infer others' mental states from their behavior.

Introspection illusion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Comment: I agree. My introspection (External Intuition) is my observations of the Others and Political reality. Internal (introverted) Intuition is unfathomable to me.

Introverted iNtuiting

For the INTP this is Critical Parent Shadow Process:

Foreseeing implications, transformations, and likely effects

However, it is the Devil process for the Hamster ISFJ, Dogmatic ISTJ.

Leading process for the Deputy INTJ, Designer ISFJ.

Overnight thoughts:


Introspection Reality (Introverted Intuition)

Logically surmise (cf. Introspection Illusion) these are the incorporated knowledge into your psyche.

Subject to scientific method of proof
Subject to political realities of who is in power (=political)
Subject to general held folk lore beliefs (even though non-scientific)
Subject to political propaganda (the beliefs of the victors)
Subject to academia (truths and fashions of the professors, peer reviewed)
Subject to political and club allegiances etc.

etc. etc.

Intuitively grasped that property interests will be defended by force, even if stolen in the first place (e.g. enclosures, invasions)

Examples where Intuition may mislead (commonly held beliefs):

Astrology
Belief in a Puca (imaginary Being) or Supreme Being (God, allegiance of Freemasonry)
Belief in Psychiatry Personality Disorders (control methods of the Psi Cops)
Political beliefs (e.g, nationalism, socialism, imperialism etc.)

These are independent thoughts. I wonder what Keirsey and the web sites have to say?

e.g.

The sense of the future and the realizations that come from introverted iNtuiting have a sureness and an imperative quality that seem to demand action and help us stay focused on fulfilling our vision or dream of how things will be in the future. Using this process, we might rely on a focal device or symbolic action to predict, enlighten, or transform. We could find ourselves laying out how the future will unfold based on unseen trends and telling signs. This process can involve working out complex concepts or systems of thinking or conceiving of symbolic or novel ways to understand things that are universal. It can lead to creating transcendent experiences or solutions.
http://www.cognitiveprocesses.com/in...intuiting.html

I may be misunderstanding the purpose of all of this...but is the point here to bring light to a "proper" form of introversion, as opposed to one that is simply.....fabricated just like anything else? Or something along those lines?

If that's the case, I do agree that there would certainly be a difference between the two.

But I'm a bit apprehensive about tacking "introversion" onto this topic at all, because "introversion" itself doesn't really suggest any specific neurology of the brain either >.<

I don't see any reason both "versions" couldn't be considered equally as introverted, despite arriving at the introspective perspective via largely differing methods.

It's also a bit of a paradox, isn't it? Am I introverted, or simply noticing myself just as I notice everyone else? But at the same time....am I noticing all these inner workings of myself because I'm treating myself like everyone, or is it because that's where I genuinely spend a lot of cognitive time, and thus notice more of?

Who knooowwwwssssss.

*Goes to jay off about brains.*

Maybe Because my leading function is Introverted iNtuiting, i think I'm affected less by this illusion, but that could be another fallacy/bias.

Is this thread about the different end results of people's introspection based on their skill at doing it, with a preference for Ni being one of if not the determining factor in skill level?

Originally Posted by very bored

Maybe Because my leading function is Introverted iNtuiting, i think I'm affected less by this illusion, but that could be another fallacy/bias.

Is this thread about the different end results of people's introspection based on their skill at doing it, with a preference for Ni being one of if not the determining factor in skill level?

My suspicions are that the "Questors" that questioned the the nature of introspection were not the type characteristic that believed in it. NPs instead of NJ Scientists.

I think the scores on N are the potential for achieving high Intuition (but defining it and then explaining it in a language that each type interprets differently ???)

Biased, aren't we all??

http://soredragon.blogspot.com/2010/...imination.html

Ambiguity, the only TRUE reason MBTI works.

<3.

Originally Posted by Kevinaswell

Ambiguity, the only TRUE reason MBTI works.

<3.

ambiguity | ambjuti | n. LME. [(O)Fr. ambiguite or L ambiguitas, f. as next: see -ITY.] 1 Hesitation, doubt, uncertainty as to one's course. LME-L16. 2 Ability to be understood in more than one way, ambiguousness. LME. 3 An uncertainty. L16-M17. 4 An instance of double meaning; an expression having more than one meaning. L16.
2 latent ambiguity: see LATENT a. systematic ambiguity: see SYSTEMATIC a.

---------------------------------------------------------
Excerpted from The Oxford Interactive Encyclopedia
Developed by The Learning Company, Inc. Copyright (c) 1997 TLC Properties Inc.

I see the point, but I wonder if this is a problem unique to the mind? I haven’t gotten tired of doing this yet, so here goes…

“The extrospection (external examination of the material world followed by rational analysis) illusion is a cognitive illusion in which people wrongly think they have direct insight into the origins of the material world. In certain situations, this illusion leads to people making confident but false explanations of the world’s behavior or predictions about the future. The illusion has been examined in a number of different psychological experiments, and suggested as a basis for other biases. These experiments have been interpreted as suggesting that, rather than offering direct access to the processes underlying material reality, extrospection is a process of construction and inference, much as people indirectly infer the laws of nature from mater’s behavior.”

Does not the history of western science read this way too?

Subject to scientific method of proof
Subject to political realities of who is in power (=political)
Subject to generally held folk lore beliefs (even though non-scientific)
Subject to political propaganda (the beliefs of the victors)
Subject to academia (truths and fashions of the professors, peer reviewed)
Subject to political and club allegiances etc.

These seem to be forces that influence everything. Have we not made up endless hypotheses, influenced by all sorts of nonsense, about what is actually going on in the material world as well? The fact of the matter is that we each construct our own theory of how our minds work and some of them are going to be more accurate than others, just as Galileo is closer to the truth than Ptolemy. Both constructed systems that account for celestial movement, but only one correlated with reality. Physical science benefits from the luxury of peer review, so it has an objective process of affirming the most reasonable world-views. Are we not here on Personality Café to do likewise with our own intuitions about our minds?

This is a very interesting idea and one that we should be aware of. However, for me, it seems to boil down to the difference between the verifiability of introspection and “extrospection.”

Addenda:


Subject to the legal proof of breaking the law

rather than lies spread by your enemies, invented by Pigeons (informers).


Cognitive Biases & Discrimination
Cognitive Biases
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cognitive_biases

A cognitive bias is a pattern of deviation in judgment that occurs in particular situations (see also cognitive distortion and the lists of thinking-related topics). Implicit in the concept of a "pattern of deviation" is a standard of comparison; this may be the judgment of people outside those particular situations, or may be a set of independently verifiable facts. The existence of some of these cognitive biases has been verified empirically in the field of psychology.

http://soredragon.blogspot.com/2010/...imination.html