ESTJ: What Annoys You The Most?

[lantern]

Originally Posted by WickedQueen

ESTJ love competition, it strive us to do the best in everything we do. And we never give up in fighting for what we think is right. Never. Even though no one will agreed with us. This "fighter" mental is very bold, perhaps this is why this forum put the swords icon for our type.

This, in some cases can be misleading as stubborn. ESTJs always wanted to be right, because we strive on winning the competition. The "always right" mentality is often stronger than any types, because when we determined on something, we did everything to achieve it. To some unhealthy ESTJ, they can't take it if they are wrong, because "wrong" means "lose" and "surrender", and it means everything they've done to achieve their goals are worthless.

However, healthy ESTJs, although they have the "always right" mentality, they will sportively admit that they are wrong if they are wrong. But before all proves indicating that they are wrong, they will always think their way is the right way.

This is the mentality of ESTJs. The core of every ESTJs, mature and immature. So if you mentioned that character as the one that annoys you, then you definitely don't have the ESTJ's train of thought.

Second, look at your post that I quoted on top of this post. That was your respond to my previous post. Once again, it is clearly indicated that you don't have the ESTJ's train of thought.

If you are really an ESTJ, your respond would be providing your personal facts and data that shows your ESTJness to support your opinion, because you know that I need to be convinced. But instead of giving me the facts to convinced me, you give me short lecture about why each person are different although they have the same type.

Also, ESTJs love discussion, debates, and arguments. The more heated and "deep" the discussion is, the more we get excited, because our "always right" mentality is being challenged. And nothing moves an ESTJ as much as a challenge. The more people said something is "impossible", the more we become excited to prove that everything is "possible" for us.




.

First I agree with all the points you make, because I do resonate with all of them.

Competition - I am not competitive in the sense that I have to be better than everybody else. BUT I do stick up for my beliefs and values and I will stick up for the people I care about. I for sure take pride in my work!

I am not afraid of admitting wrong if I am. It takes courage and confidence to do that. If I feel I am right and I have the evidence to prove it then I will stand by my own words.

I personally do not want to write down all the evidence because I prefer communicating by talking, and it's far too long-winded as I have so many examples and this is said nicely of course -I cannot really be bothered! I hate long-winded discussions esp if the answer/solution is smack bang in front of my face - I just think - just get to the point.

Who said that I didn't love discussion, debate and arguments??? - I love them and yes I get excited by these - but I prefer talking in person, face-to-face basis - not via writing. I admit that I am not as clear in my writing - and because I resonate with some INTJ traits (NOT ESFJ as you suggest - you don't know me and you didn't read my in-depth report from my MBTI practitioner) - my way of thinking is broad and my pattern of thinking is very analytical - I find it so much easier to say it than explain in writing.

Yes I am a nice person but that doesn't mean that I'm a doormat and can be taken advantage of. If I sense that someone is taking the p**s then I either tell them or just walk away because they're not worth spending any negative feelings - not good for my soul. I just 'let it go'.

Convinced now?

[lantern]

I would just like to add that MBTI is a theory, it is not set in stone! I honestly don't take it that seriously, it's a good insight and very interesting, but I'm not going to get obsessed with it.

[Applemilk]

Originally Posted by lantern

I would just like to add that MBTI is a theory, it is not set in stone! I honestly don't take it that seriously, it's a good insight and very interesting, but I'm not going to get obsessed with it.

I don't know what theory is. It's accurate, but the descriptions aren't. So are the tests.

[lantern]

Originally Posted by haag261390

I don't know what theory is. It's accurate, but the descriptions aren't. So are the tests.

Hmmm...am a bit confused when you say it's accurate but the descriptions aren't? that the questions are accurate but the descriptions aren't set in stone? - could you clarify? thanks

[Applemilk]

Originally Posted by lantern

Hmmm...am a bit confused when you say it's accurate but the descriptions aren't? that the questions are accurate but the descriptions aren't set in stone? - could you clarify? thanks

When you're around another ESTJ, you two will have similar traits. This is how you'd know if you're of a certain personality type or not(plus looking at the descriptions and the functions). However, the descriptions of an ESTJ isn't exactly accurate or as you said, "set on stone" and does not apply to every ESTJs. This results in creating a stereotype for each type and expects an ESTJ to be of a certain way. For example, it's expected for an ESTJ to be aggressive or insensitive. I know this doesn't apply to all ESTJs. I should also add that these MBTI tests are not accurate. I assume that these tests are only 75% accurate.

[fairydust]

Originally Posted by snail

First of all, I know I'm not an ESTJ, but I thought I would post here anyhow, because I thought it was an interesting topic. Consider this a contrasting viewpoint.

These aren't just things that annoy me, but things I would remove from the world with a flamethrower that shoots out of my eyes and my heart every time I encounter them, if it were physically possible:

1. lack of empathy

2. any insensitive or destructive approach to dealing with other people's emotional suffering

3. trivialization of feelings

4. someone who is accusatory or cruel when someone else needs comforting, or who offers advice instead of support

5. pushy neat freaks who consider organization inherently superior to chaos, and who become judgmental over it as though non-neat-freaks are 'obviously' wrong for preferring clutter

6. anyone who considers sensitivity a flaw, something to be cured, something that should be forcefully destroyed and punished, or something that causes a person to deserve to be disrespected

7. people with a "blame the victim" mentality

8. anyone who has ever used the word "whiner" or even thought it silently in his or her head while listening to someone else's problems

9. people who think that having a boring 9-to-5 job is required in order to live a meaningful, productive life, and who look down on those who are self-employed or jobless

10. superficial people who consider looks valid in determining a person's desirability as a mate, especially if size-ism is involved

11. unfairness, especially in the form of disrespecting others or treating them badly for things they either can't control or shouldn't have to

12. false feminism: the "reformed" gender roles where men are still expected to be manly, but women are expected to be manly too in order to deserve the same respect. This is the movement that forces all men, regardless of sensitivity, to be cold-hearted assholes, and tries to force all women to be slutty, bossy bitches with attitude problems in order to feel equal to them, not to be confused with real feminism in which each person is allowed to be authentic.

13. mean people, but I think I already covered that.

God bless you i couldn't agree more...

[lantern]

Originally Posted by haag261390

When you're around another ESTJ, you two will have similar traits. This is how you'd know if you're of a certain personality type or not(plus looking at the descriptions and the functions). However, the descriptions of an ESTJ isn't exactly accurate or as you said, "set on stone" and does not apply to every ESTJs. This results in creating a stereotype for each type and expects an ESTJ to be of a certain way. For example, it's expected for an ESTJ to be aggressive or insensitive. I know this doesn't apply to all ESTJs. I should also add that these MBTI tests are not accurate. I assume that these tests are only 75% accurate.

Oh thank you!!! totally agree, we're on the same page here! hallelujah!

[Nyx]

Originally Posted by lantern

I would just like to add that MBTI is a theory, it is not set in stone! I honestly don't take it that seriously, it's a good insight and very interesting, but I'm not going to get obsessed with it.

The ENFP description actually fits me completely...and I liked getting into it because it helped me become more comfortable with myself...I've gained loads of comfidence

[Pablonuts25]

Originally Posted by justinhammar

The things we hate most about others are the things we hate most in ourselves.

this


/thread

[WickedQueen]

Originally Posted by lantern

First I agree with all the points you make, because I do resonate with all of them.

Competition - I am not competitive in the sense that I have to be better than everybody else. BUT I do stick up for my beliefs and values and I will stick up for the people I care about. I for sure take pride in my work!

I am not afraid of admitting wrong if I am. It takes courage and confidence to do that. If I feel I am right and I have the evidence to prove it then I will stand by my own words.

I personally do not want to write down all the evidence because I prefer communicating by talking, and it's far too long-winded as I have so many examples and this is said nicely of course -I cannot really be bothered! I hate long-winded discussions esp if the answer/solution is smack bang in front of my face - I just think - just get to the point.

Who said that I didn't love discussion, debate and arguments??? - I love them and yes I get excited by these - but I prefer talking in person, face-to-face basis - not via writing. I admit that I am not as clear in my writing - and because I resonate with some INTJ traits (NOT ESFJ as you suggest - you don't know me and you didn't read my in-depth report from my MBTI practitioner) - my way of thinking is broad and my pattern of thinking is very analytical - I find it so much easier to say it than explain in writing.

Yes I am a nice person but that doesn't mean that I'm a doormat and can be taken advantage of. If I sense that someone is taking the p**s then I either tell them or just walk away because they're not worth spending any negative feelings - not good for my soul. I just 'let it go'.

Convinced now?

Umm... Nope.

But whatever. I don't wanna end up judging you. We're here in this forum to have fun.