[Noxes the Grey]

As a ESTJ who is constantly mistaken for an ENTJ, I wonder, How do you ENTJ's consider yourself different from ESTJ's? Especially as it applies to management styles. For example, I like to consider myself a fairly tough but fair manager, I have alot of forgiveness when it comes to situations beyond anyone's control but very little mercy for mistakes of a more stupid nature. Would you say that's typical or just me? Thoughts?

[NastyCat]

ENTJs prefer to coach their underlings. If they think a person's method is preventing them from hitting their targets, they will most likely involve themselves by helping the underling to improve. They're not as strict as ESTJs, but if a worker shows resistance then the argumentative side of the ENTJ may either destroy the underling's self-esteem or fire them if they affect others.

ESTJs prefer to boss their underlings. If a person is lacking, the ESTJ may set a new target for them to reach but may not necessarily do anything other than yell at them. They focus more on results and less on the methods of reaching their goals. It's kinda like a "read my mind" approach to things where every worker is expected to telepathically understand.

HOWEVER, I think the initial methods of the ENTJ may start off extremely similar to that of the ESTJ in general. This is most likely due to inexperience.

[thebrain]

We don't manage: we lead.

[Noxes the Grey]

We don't manage: we lead.

Surprisingly true, I'm thinking. Surprisingly informative responses from you two, thanks! You guys develop followers, I have underlings. You lead a team, I manage a project. Similar, certainly not the same.

[Monkey King]

Well, I can tell you what I avoid in a team: micro-managing.

About the coaching bit--- This is true, I will suggest trainings that may be beneficial to the individual hence beneficial to the whole team. You build up the teams weakness' and hone their strengths in practice.

[topgun31]

Well, I can tell you what I avoid in a team: micro-managing.

About the coaching bit--- This is true, I will suggest trainings that may be beneficial to the individual hence beneficial to the whole team. You build up the teams weakness' and hone their strengths in practice.

Yea Definitely true.

I have an ESTJ superior, and he really likes to micro-manage. It's kind of annoying. If you try to change something up or try to do something your own way - even if its the little things or even if it doesn't affect the outcome (or if it's more logical), he won't like it simply because it's not the usual way of doing things. He's a pretty competent guy though.

On the otherhand, I really don't micromanage. If people had their own way of doing things, and it's still the same outcome, then i'm fine with it. If it's more logical or efficient, I might even adopt it.

And, yea, I'd rather lead than manage.

[Valdyr]

I'm adding another voice to the "I'd rather lead than manage" chorus. One of my closest friends is an ESTJ, and our different styles are evident when we are in charge of group projects at school. She (the friend) is pretty anal and micro-manages a lot, while I tend to "lead by example" and/or coach others in areas I think they need improvements, while leaving them to their own devices on the specifics, so long as their output meets my requirements for the long-term strategy. Said requirements are usually fairly general, as well, while my ESTJ friend will request specifics down to the font others use.

[dude10000]

The best middle-level managers in my experience set clear goals, plan ahead and follow up by setting targets, evaluate employees by the same standards, implement frameworks with transparent incentives so employees will act productively without a baby-sitter, and have a way for the employee to view and use objective feedback, e.g. sales numbers. People who micromanage too much either don't have enough to do, which means they're redundant, or they need to make someone a supervisor/shift lead, create another department, etc.

[Rachelishere]

ESTJ wants people to
1.conceal the problem because they expect 0 mistake. If not you are being seen as useless.
2.support his ego but telling him, how others admire him.what they have done those unnecessary work as long as it is related with their idea. ESTJ really likes it, they think the people likes them and they are doing the right thing.
3.promote status and absolute respect regardless what they do.
4.never learn because don't want to admit they can't see far and can't link well sometimes.unless something worst happened.and mostly are extremely disastrous.


ENTJ is the best!

[amon91]

ENTJs believe in bottom-up management, ESTJs are more top-down. I can perform the latter whenever I need to, I just don't enjoy doing it.