[MNiS]

No not with regards to advice, just in general discussion about various things.Advice I believe should be taken from everyone but ultimately a person should make thier own decisions, as you said ,in the end it's u who has to deal with the outcomes

Ah, so you're referring to consensus building vs order dictation? There is a time and place for both, IMO. :)

[Happy about Nothing.]

I've noticed the so called "ENTJ" stubbornness, and I generally respect it, as I'm fairly similar. I also agree that the reason for the stubbornness is a huge factor. Sometimes I feel like my ENTJ friends are stubborn "just because". The occassional nit-picking doesn't bother me, but once and awhile it is a bit irritating when they will not budge on the most (seemingly) trite issues.

e.g. ENFJ: Will you take me to taco bell? ENTJ: I don't want to pick you up to go to taco bell because you are the one who wants to go. ENTJ: However, if you walk over to my house I'll drive you. ENFJ: But....my residence is on the way to taco bell.....ENTJ: Walk over here and I'll drive you. ENFJ: But it's dark and scary, and I'll be walking by myself.....ENTJ: You'll be fine.....walk over here and I'll drive you.

In a nutshell.

[ohlizzie]

ENFJ: Will you take me to taco bell? ENTJ: I don't want to pick you up to go to taco bell because you are the one who wants to go. ENTJ: However, if you walk over to my house I'll drive you. ENFJ: But....my residence is on the way to taco bell.....ENTJ: Walk over here and I'll drive you. ENFJ: But it's dark and scary, and I'll be walking by myself.....ENTJ: You'll be fine.....walk over here and I'll drive you.

LMAO. That is really true about ENTJs.

What pisses me off about being an ENTJ is that everybody else's emotional out bursts/break downs FREAK ME THE FUCK OUT. I dont understand you D; why don't I understand you??!

[jdbullet23]

Ugh, just so ... serious. know-it-alls, stuck-up-my-own-ass, nose-in-the-air, bossy assholes.

At least the ones I've met. I can tell you about this one ENTJ I know who I just absolutely can't stand. :/ First of all, last year in freshman year, rather than meeting & hanging out with friends, she made it obviously clear that no one else was worth her time enough. She did extra work, raised her hand every single time the teacher asked a question or corrected the other kids who said something that was wrong. I had like every class with her last year, & she bothered me to no end. Every time I would try to share my opinion with her on any issue, she was quick to point out why I was wrong & why she was right. She sits up on her royal throan all the time, looking down on everyone else if they're not like her, & critisizes everyone who doesn't study every second of their day or who doesn't have a 4.0 grade point average. (BTW: I'm the one with a 4.0 GPA now, & she's got like a 3.0 because she's so busy overworking herself to aim for vallidictorian. Ha! Her, validictorian, when she misses like 2 days out of each week.) Grrrr, she frustrates me.

So yeah, strong ENTJs like that annoy me.

[TheBoss]

1. Ugh, just so ... serious. know-it-alls, stuck-up-my-own-ass, nose-in-the-air, bossy assholes.

2. corrected the other kids who said something that was wrong. I had like every class with her last year, & she bothered me to no end. Every time I would try to share my opinion with her on any issue, she was quick to point out why I was wrong & why she was right.

3. She sits up on her royal throan all the time,

4. Ha! Her, validictorian, when she misses like 2 days out of each week.) Grrrr, she frustrates me.

5. So yeah, strong ENTJs like that annoy me.

1. Flattery will get you anywhere. Bribery though, works even better.

2. Well, you can fix this by actually being RIGHT, right?

3. Throne. (<- Hihihi)

4. I see, that apparently frustrates STs in general? Thought it was just estj's being so...typical (read anal) about attendance. You know, physical attendance hardly is a skill (though I am sure you feel otherwise), let alone a sign of intellectual prowess or knowledge.

5. Glad to be of service. However, seriously now, how about having her take the test? Propose it like "I am sure you are such type" and she looks like she will be glad to do it just to prove you wrong (again).

[jdbullet23]

That's cute. Brought me many giggles.

She did take the test. But this was my opinion. Please try not to prove me too right. I hope not to be so dead on about all ENTJs, really I hope they're not all like this lovely girl I refer too just as an example. :)

Good day.

BTW: I asked her how to spell throne or throan, well she said throan. I didn't really know, I spend my time actually going to school. Flattery usually works XD It's a natural point for me, I thank you.

[MattSenemar]

What doesn't? (:

Almost everything ENTJ do is teasing someone, so pissing people off is their business. They want to shake and squeeze every one to get to their core, get their dirty secrets and then keep them dependent. Fieldmarshals - hated and feared by all.

"Fieldmarshal" is meant to refer to the manner in which they collect intelligence and use the relevant information at their disposal to direct the large scale operations which they have envisioned. Being one myself I have no intention of being hated by everyone. Although I can't speak for everyone, what good would that do me in terms of "allegiance" if people were coerced to follow. I'd get stabbed in the back Ides of March style like Caesar did. It has nothing to do with the douchbaggery to which you insinuate unless that particular individual happens to be a tool. Which happens all the time. You have to remove them from consideration when looking at the type objectively.


Consider that my particular brand of vodka when it comes to my temperament is all about sustainability (unless an action is taken with a deliberate maturity date in mind). Otherwise I like to play it honest because it's all I can expect of the the incumbent with whom I'm interacting. It would be hypocritical of me to hold others to standards that at the very least I don't hold myself accountable to.

With that being said, I'd come correct and reconsider the absolutes. The amount of things that are able to be dis proven to a 100% degree literally do not exist. Gravity? Variable outcomes given vacuums and such. Prisoners dilemma in economics? The rational outcome is that two criminals will rat the other out in fear that they will be in deeper trouble if they don't take care of themselves and roll over on their former partner. It's a convincing tune by the interrogators too, jail starts to look mighty unacceptable when you consider the alternative. Ya know, FREEDOM. Then your brain puts together the relevant details to help you sleep at night. That's the way a "fieldmarshal" thinks, it's the way i do, are you telling me you believe in loyalty to the bitter end while the cell you'd sleep in every night constantly reminded you otherwise?

I can't say for sure but smart money says no sir, you would not. So the absolutes don't really apply. That's all framework to help you intuit what decision is best on the spot given your understanding of the subject, whatever that may be. It's cool to say nothing at all rather than filler whose main point is incorrect.

I completely agree that we our methods may provide discomfort. Your statement is accurate, but incomplete, much like everything else in life. (Do you know what's going to happen tomorrow, for sure?) But that is the only way to increase your ultimate level of comfort.

We squeeze and apply pressure, shaking people up, or at least i do, when they need to fucking be shaken up. Life has a time limit. It freaking ends, and you don't know when. It's not like we go door to door looking for an argument. There will always be douchebags in the world, and they fit in a whole HOST of categories. So you can always find one to use as an example of why you feel a certain way about something. That's annoying though when it's done illegitimately. Think if you have a good point about something and circumstance allows someone to defeat the great position you may have simply because the timing allowed for it. It would bug the eff out of you.

Some people may not like being "shaken up" but I would much rather apologize than ask for permission. Would you agree?

Also, I'm not young enough to know everything anymore. So this is all based on my experience, and as a result, it has it's limitations. But recognizing them and accounting for them helps you stay out of the douche category. Join me.

[carm]

"Fieldmarshal" is meant to refer to the manner in which they collect intelligence and use the relevant information at their disposal to direct the large scale operations which they have envisioned. Being one myself I have no intention of being hated by everyone. Although I can't speak for everyone, what good would that do me in terms of "allegiance" if people were coerced to follow. I'd get stabbed in the back Ides of March style like Caesar did. It has nothing to do with the douchbaggery to which you insinuate unless that particular individual happens to be a tool. Which happens all the time. You have to remove them from consideration when looking at the type objectively.


Consider that my particular brand of vodka when it comes to my temperament is all about sustainability (unless an action is taken with a deliberate maturity date in mind). Otherwise I like to play it honest because it's all I can expect of the the incumbent with whom I'm interacting. It would be hypocritical of me to hold others to standards that at the very least I don't hold myself accountable to.

With that being said, I'd come correct and reconsider the absolutes. The amount of things that are able to be dis proven to a 100% degree literally do not exist. Gravity? Variable outcomes given vacuums and such. Prisoners dilemma in economics? The rational outcome is that two criminals will rat the other out in fear that they will be in deeper trouble if they don't take care of themselves and roll over on their former partner. It's a convincing tune by the interrogators too, jail starts to look mighty unacceptable when you consider the alternative. Ya know, FREEDOM. Then your brain puts together the relevant details to help you sleep at night. That's the way a "fieldmarshal" thinks, it's the way i do, are you telling me you believe in loyalty to the bitter end while the cell you'd sleep in every night constantly reminded you otherwise?

I can't say for sure but smart money says no sir, you would not. So the absolutes don't really apply. That's all framework to help you intuit what decision is best on the spot given your understanding of the subject, whatever that may be. It's cool to say nothing at all rather than filler whose main point is incorrect.

I completely agree that we our methods may provide discomfort. Your statement is accurate, but incomplete, much like everything else in life. (Do you know what's going to happen tomorrow, for sure?) But that is the only way to increase your ultimate level of comfort.

We squeeze and apply pressure, shaking people up, or at least i do, when they need to fucking be shaken up. Life has a time limit. It freaking ends, and you don't know when. It's not like we go door to door looking for an argument. There will always be douchebags in the world, and they fit in a whole HOST of categories. So you can always find one to use as an example of why you feel a certain way about something. That's annoying though when it's done illegitimately. Think if you have a good point about something and circumstance allows someone to defeat the great position you may have simply because the timing allowed for it. It would bug the eff out of you.

Some people may not like being "shaken up" but I would much rather apologize than ask for permission. Would you agree?

Also, I'm not young enough to know everything anymore. So this is all based on my experience, and as a result, it has it's limitations. But recognizing them and accounting for them helps you stay out of the douche category. Join me.

I think a large portion of my conflicts with people come because I won't accept thier Absolutes. ENTJ's are always questioning and deconstructing things to find a better way. That really scares more conventional types who just want to believe what they want to believe.

[MattSenemar]

I think a large portion of my conflicts with people come because I won't accept thier Absolutes. ENTJ's are always questioning and deconstructing things to find a better way. That really scares more conventional types who just want to believe what they want to believe.

And i completely agree. There is an old saying; "if you're going to tell people the truth, you had better make them laugh otherwise they are going to kill you."

There is a friend of mine, a female, who is from a Midwest town and although highly educated, purposely she chooses to be naive about certain things. As you can imagine, it used to irritate me when she would say things like "The world is all warm fuzzies and gummie bears". It was her way of ignoring the negativity and horror that the world had to offer and opt for simply accepting the beauty.

Naturally, given the relationship we had of being very close, I would continue to insist on her seeing the "error" in her ways. The learning opportunity for me was tremendous. I couldn't see that she was in fact very aware of the negativity she was choosing to ignore, while taking a very efficient attitude towards it. One that I hadn't considered or implemented and it was back when I was a bit quicker to jump to hasty judgments.

I think the biggest asset one has is the ability to maintain traction. That is to say, keeping an even keel (however that applies to everyone in a way that lets them operate at their best) so the world opens up it's opportunities for you.

This extensive 'extraversion' of mine coupled with a relentless stubborn trait aided by an even more intimidating level of diction to verbally outswath makes it a humongous liability on my end. Yes, "winning" used to be the goal but at what cost? Emptiness. Alienation. Balance is the name of the game, like riding a bike. Time is linear at least on a practical level, so you can't get it back (yet). Nature doesn't seem to hurry and things get done on time like clockwork.

But luckily developing the sense to think twice or at least question myself and reevaluate what's under the hood is such a game changer in terms of what adjustments i can make to where i can get the eff over myself and just accept whatever it is that used to be unacceptable. It's a choice. Carm you're absolutely right. Highlight the attributes of what you're given and work on what inevitably will trip you up and you're (at least from an ENTJ standpoint) better positioned at not throwing up any red flags and immediately perceived as "insert arbitrary negative trait ENTJ's have become notoriously synonymous with".

[Dear Sigmund]

The only absolute worth considering is Absolute Vodka

just sayin