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ENFP guys=Automatic Friend Zone

[ENFP] 
27K views 124 replies 39 participants last post by  Mick Travis 
#1 ·
I saw this in another thread
http://personalitycafe.com/sex-relationships/46220-male-enfps.html

I have gay male friends ( ENFP), they are the best of the best :)
Personally i'm not romantically attracted to male ENFP. I've never been romantically attached, probably because
we never left the friend zone.
And I know I get friendzoned 95% of the time so are all ENFP males basically auto friendzoned? well not Automatically but generally end up being Friendzoned?
And if this is so, what makes us so romantically unattractive?

The fact we seem so immature maybe?
Maybe also the fact that we may push too hard at the beginning i.e needy actions?

I ask since I know most ENFP guys have trouble with women, which i've talked about in other posts. I posted this to target that specific Idea.

So is this true and if so how do we get out/steer clear
 
#81 ·
All male ENFPs have problem with women, some just don't admit it, because they can find something, with which they can cover up the fact. Your flirting - Bumblyjack - comes from the enjoyment of chasing and haunting down the fear of being rejected. Or, you were rejected too many times, so it made you invulnerable to the distress, which you feel, when you're walking up to a girl. Either way, we have the upper hand in many situations, but we simply cannot use it to our advantage: almost 90% of times I realise I know exactly what someone feels, and see possibilities to improve the target's view of me, still, I find myself just pondering inside my head, until the opportunity passes, and nothing happens.
Does anyone had similar experiances?
 
#82 ·
I think your perspective is way too negative and also not appropriate for a forum where people come to grow so they become a better them. You make it sound like an irreversible "disease", but you must realize you are the creator of your own destiny, nothing else dictates it and certainly not your personality type. I had a lot of trouble with women when I was young and even last year - yes, agreed. But now I'm older and it seems like my friends who were getting laid everyday in college have problem with women, I don't anymore. I have so many right now who want to be with me. And as time goes on, it seems like that will only change in the sense that there will be more women who want me. Because people see who I am and they're instantly drawn to it, same goes for women. I'm not a nice guy necessarily, I come off as cold and calculated and logical. I save the nice for whoever I decide to share my world with. I'm not a pushover, I stand up for myself when I feel mistreated. And if a girl thinks she can push me around, I put her back in her place. It takes self confidence and self worth to get there. That's all. When you know what you're worth and you don't radiate desperation... it just all works out. Maybe the problem is that it takes us longer to gain our self confidence and self worth since we're so in our heads.

As for knowing exactly what someone feels and not doing anything to change it... I'm not at all with you there. I'm the best chameleon I know... and lately, I feel like I'm a puppeteer with the ability to bend people at my will. It sounds worse than it is since I use my abilities for good.

PS there are many post here about ENFP men that are beyond excellent with women.

PS By most accounts, my ENFJ former best friend was more of a nice guy to women than I'll ever be and he could have sex with any girl he wanted once he hit about 24-25 and gained the confidence. Same thing hapnd for him... his friends who were getting laid all the time no longer did... and he started to get whatever he wanted. I seem to have gained mine a bit early, fortunately.
 
#83 ·
I may come off negative first, but only to point out the core of the problem. Also, I did some projecting in the previous post to see how ENFP males are doing in real life, since I haven't meet any yet (just testing a theory). I did not mean to be disturb anyone.
To be honest, you were even more direct than I was. It is a matter of self confidence. But, since ENFPs tend to have great egos, ergo they constantly examine themselves, confidence is like a domino game. It depends on a lot of external things, and if something doesn't add up, it basically destroys everything, except for the core. The good thing is, that we can allways get up quickly, and try it again, until it is adequate :)
You've also pointed out the question of age. I did not think of that, due to age :) But it is surprisingly comfortable to know (or to hope), that the constant distress I feel about myself will eventually become a mild annoyance in. So thanks for the heads up :)
 
#88 ·
Self confidence... should NEVER depend on anything external. That has to come from within - then no one can take it away from you, period. I also learned that the hard way. You're way too dependent on others for your self confidence in that case... and not only is that a terrible idea, it scares people away.

I just know how I used to feel was terrible since I had no idea how to attract the ladies, so I hate when someone comes on here and says that "ENFP men are all hopeless." I used to think that... then I let go of that because it's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

What I learned to do was just relax and... yeah just tease the hell out of every girl which I'm surprisingly really good at and they love it. It's actually so natural to me now, I barely notice it. Sometimes I tease TOO much lol, but who cares because I'm doing me and I love me.

For many people, self confidence does come with age regardless of type.

I have a few theories:
1) We are so possibility driven and have such a hard time narrowing outcomes that we see a lot of negative outcomes that are very, very unlikely. This makes it harder to approach a girl because an ENFP male may give it way too much thought. Honestly, I still RARELY approach, most girls that I know have approached me or I've met them thru someone else. I am getting better at it.
2) Again, we're so analytical and live in our heads so much that we see all of our flaws and have a hard time accepting them. We strive for perfection in ourselves... yet can't find it. Accept your flaws. Change what you can change, don't worry about what you can't.
3) We're different from others... that goes without say. This makes us uncomfortable growing up. We may have been subject to bullying or being left out or whatever it may be - this stays with us til we realize that... maybe it's a good different. No, maybe it's an amazing different. It IS an amazing different. A healthy male ENFP? Talk about PERFECTION.

The older I get (and I'm only in my early early 20s right now), the more confidence I gain. The more I realize what I'm worth. The more people radiate towards me... you just have to learn to be comfortable with you are. You need to develop your charm... and one day it'll be very normal to you.

Also - I'm not sure about any other ENFP males, but I do not come off as an NF to the real world. I come off as a cold and calculated NT - always have. The Fi is introverted... more of a set of personal values than emotions. Our Ne and Te are extroverted... and I think the best someone explained it is... we're social philosophers. I'm almost scared of myself now a days... because I know exactly what to say to a girl (or anyone for that matter) to elicit the right response. You'll get there. Be patient... keep reading. This forum was a huge reason I have made it THIS far. I've had girls say they don't like me and I used to take offense, now I'm just like well.... *ahem* leave me alone then buddy. 9 times out of 10 they just want me even more lol.

Also great advice by @Bumblyjack ... he hit it on the nail. When a girl tries to make me feel like I just did something wrong, I don't even care. In fact, my theory is that it's a test by most women to see if you are man enough to stand up for yourself - whether conscious or subconscious, who knows. But you know what? If she doesn't like something about me, she can walk away because I LOVE LOVE LOVE who I am and will never change it. Learn to love yourself.
 
#86 ·
Hmm honeybadger, interesting that you talk about the approaching aspect of talking to girls...
I have no trouble in the conversation (after I've convinced myself to make an approach), but I do have difficulty getting myself to approach girls in the first place. I am prone to making excuses and coming up with reasons not to approach. Maybe it's my Fi telling me "This makes me feel uncomfortable, don't do it."

As far as actually talking to them, however, I feel very comfortable. I think it's because of my experiences as a teenager (I'm 28 now btw, for those keeping score at home). When I was 16, I got a summer job as a lifeguard. There were 2 guys (including me) and 11 girls on the staff. We were never busy yet always overstaffed due to public funding (government jobs FTW!), so most of the time I would be sitting around talking while waiting for my turn to do some actual lifeguarding. So, long story short, for 40 hours a week I had a captive audience of attractive girls who had nothing better to do than talk to me. Needless to say, I ended up working there for 5 years!

By the end of my second summer working there (heading into my senior year of high school), I had learned how to feel comfortable talking to attractive girls and how to be completely genuine while doing so. To my astonishment, I realized that I was naturally charming in a rather unusual and seemingly unique way (at the time I had no knowledge of MBTI types or that I was an ENFP). Girls that I had been working with for two summers, as well as girls I had known all of my years of school, had starting showing interest in and attraction to me.

So, what changed in the way I interacted with girls? Well for one thing, I stopped acting and just followed my thoughts and feelings. Prior to my job as a lifeguard, I was too self-conscious around girls and too concerned that I might say or do the wrong thing. This made me come off as lacking confidence and being uninteresting. Another factor in all of this was that I grew up with an ENFJ brother. He and I were very close and we always joked with and teased each other. Without realizing it, I started talking to girls in a similar way. I felt comfortable doing it, I had fun, and they enjoyed it too.
 
#91 ·
i don't really think i get friends zoned, not to say i'm very sucessful romantically i just don't hardly even have any females friends. In the real world i have been rejected alot of times and i really don't know how to go about attracting, my confidence is basically nil and i kind of doubt thata going to change any tme soon :/
 
#97 ·
It's hard for me to put any guy ENFP's in the 'friend-zone' their just WAAAAY to suave and amazing T.T Their flirtatious words are my downfall >< and I hate it cause I can't stop myself from liking them...grrrrrr! lol XD and it makes me even more angry when they use the same words on like 50 other girls! they make me feel special then -smack- they use the same words to like 50 other girls. X.x
but all you ENFP's are awesome, guy ENFP's look for a girl that likes you being kind instead of being a jerk, sorry but I don't think very good relationships come out of yelling and mean words. TRUST me there's plenty of girls that want sensitive guys...it's just being patient and finding them. ^^
 
#99 ·
this is true. i think our charm lies in making girls feel special more than anything else- like xEmilyx says we're usually found talking to everyone so when we zero in to a particular girl who catches our attention she feels like she's been singled out somehow. it's about knowing what you want clearly, even if what you think you want is wrong as i found out lately, and when you find it know that you've met someone who stands out from the crowd (again, even if you think that wrongly as i've found out..). i've met and know ENFPs who have a crush on a few girls at any given time- that attitude gets us in the friend zone because i honestly think girls can sense it. it just isn't what works for us.
 
#100 ·
the problem the male ENFP faces in the dating game is that he's too much of a chameleon. they can be dominant but they lack the Ti dominance. this keeps them in the friendzone with Fi chicks. they're in the friendzone with SiFe chicks because they're too unpredictable to be the modern "provider" role (XSTJ). but your most consistent qualities are that you're adventurous, thrill seeking and usually clever, so XNFJs will usually be attracted to you and most female ESTPs. of course your ideal match is the female ENTP but they'll more likely find you.
 
#106 ·
I saw this in another thread
http://personalitycafe.com/sex-relationships/46220-male-enfps.html
And I know I get friendzoned 95% of the time so are all ENFP males basically auto friendzoned? well not Automatically but generally end up being Friendzoned?
And if this is so, what makes us so romantically unattractive?
The fact we seem so immature maybe?
Maybe also the fact that we may push too hard at the beginning i.e needy actions?
I ask since I know most ENFP guys have trouble with women, which i've talked about in other posts. I posted this to target that specific Idea.
So is this true and if so how do we get out/steer clear
you're a 7w8 Sx/So (aka serious rake/player potential), bust out that side of your personality and women will want to be service you in a heart beat =P
 
#107 ·

This is how I assume women want to be treated 1:22
 
#108 ·
I sincerely hope you're kidding.
 
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#111 ·
Gosh, I used to be friend zoned all the time, but part of that was because I was trying to "make friends", so I got what I wanted. Every human being is inherently desirable somewhere along the line, including every single poster in this thread. The trick is to believe and understand that. How do you behave with your friends? You're doubtless convivial, funny and attentive. Now extrapolate all those features on to how you approach women, add banter and stir. Courtship has some rules, and if you breach them, yes you will be shelved. She will (usually) expect you to make the first move, but women aren't usually very subtle in their encouragements. Pay attention to all of them, not just their words, and you'll get along fine. Just be yourself. Some girls like the man's man, some like the cute and adorable man. Follow your feelings, they're a bug part of you.

Lastly, don't have expectations. The best relationship I ever had was with a female NT, they are rare. I am a male NF, we are rare. Do you see where I'm going with this? Be patient, and don't assume she's the girl of your dreams, until you know that, she's a sexy stranger, so keep the mystery around her, and keep it around yourself too.
 
#112 ·
Be confident and always remember that you're better than she is. You are worth more to you than she is to you. The minute a woman sniffs any kind of worship/submissive vibe you're done. You might still get to have sex but her glass is shattered. The romantic comedies like to paint it the other way but I've dated a lot and this is how it's gone for me.

Be strong like bull.
 
#113 ·
#116 ·
I recently described how I interact with women in another thread:
Yes, I'm essentially calling myself Balki Bartokomous. What can I say, besides him being foreign I basically do act like him. This is especially true with the way Balki talks to women (at least in the first two seasons of Perfect Strangers). He has this way of making a girl feel special, like there's nothing else in the universe but the two of them. There's something about the way he does it, because instead of looking down on him the girl sees him as this amazing kind of guy that she had no idea existed.
I'll try to describe it further, but this stuff isn't on purpose or planned out:
- I don't think any girl is out of my league but I don't look down on any either
- I'm openly fascinated by them and truly love talking to them
- I speak my mind, share my thoughts and ideas, and express my feelings
- I just be myself, I never try to get them to like me
- I don't worry about what they think of me
- I don't mind rejection and it doesn't bother me if they don't like me
- I respect myself and I only pursue girls who do like me
- I have no plan or agenda, I just enjoy the time with them
- I playfully tease and flirt a lot
- I do things to irritate them, let them think it was serious, and then clear it up.
Example: call a girl I just met the same wrong name several times

Basically, I adore women and I simply enjoy being around them...but I expect them to adore and appreciate me as well. If they don't then they aren't worth my time.
 
#120 ·
I saw this in another thread
http://personalitycafe.com/sex-relationships/46220-male-enfps.html



And I know I get friendzoned 95% of the time so are all ENFP males basically auto friendzoned? well not Automatically but generally end up being Friendzoned?
And if this is so, what makes us so romantically unattractive?

The fact we seem so immature maybe?
Maybe also the fact that we may push too hard at the beginning i.e needy actions?

I ask since I know most ENFP guys have trouble with women, which i've talked about in other posts. I posted this to target that specific Idea.

So is this true and if so how do we get out/steer clear
I think if you're going to deny dating somebody because of four letters from a theory that isn't valid you're shortsighted and foolish. Personally I think the Enneagram type and tritype matter more than the MBTI type...why you are doing something instead of how you are doing it, but that's just me.
 
#121 ·
ENFP males are very picky about who they date. They have so many female friends everywhere, OMG everywhere. They friendzone everyone. Men and women are both attracted to ENFP ( not shocking as both genders are attracted to M/F XNFP ) seriously, and NFP male/female could turn a gay man straight, haha, true story :kitteh:

ENFP men love introverts, Intuitive Introverts. They will and can flirt with every type and they do, however you will often find them in seriously relationships with Introverts, thinkers to be specific.
 
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#122 ·
I know this is an old post, and I didn't read all the replies, but I just wanted to express my opinion. I am an INFJ, and I adore ENFPs. Both sides: the fun, crazy, confident side and the deep, gentle, sensitive side. Actually, although I enjoy both sides of an ENFP, the latter is the one that really attracts me. I would think that other NFs would feel the same as me. So ENFP guys, keep being true to yourself! You are awesome!
 
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