Need Help from ENFJ Men

[thehigher]

Originally Posted by Roland

This isn't a question about being sensitive. Yes there is a time for mourning (being sensitive), this is natural, but theres also a time when you have to get back on your feet and continue living.

You can't sulk and regret all your life, you've gotta learn from your mistakes and keep yo' chin up.

I agree. But I don't really think we know his exact situation. But I mean...he shouldn't feel bad for his feelings just because he is a man for certain. I get the sense that he is trying to fit into a mold that just isn't him. Perhaps I am projecting.

[pinkrasputin]

Originally Posted by thehigher

I agree. But I don't really think we know his exact situation. But I mean...he shouldn't feel bad for his feelings just because he is a man for certain. I get the sense that he is trying to fit into a mold that just isn't him. Perhaps I am projecting.

I think you're right about him trying to fit into a mold that just isn't him. And I know this is the first time he's ever felt like this after a break up. He says he used to be the one "detached" in other relationships. And right now he says he feels like he has a life time of tears to shed.

I agree with positive psychology as well. And for me, it really doesn't take me that long to move on. Although break ups do devastate me. I'm going through one now. I feel like my heart was just ripped out through my nostrils. But I just don't like "staying down" that long and I HAVE to do my life in order to snap out of it. So it's been kind of tough dealing with someone who is going through this for so long. But I am also an "open" person who won't judge him for being like this.

What's funny is whenever I have told this ENFJ that a man has hurt me, he responds kind of like Roland. He gives me advice like "Say Fuck him, break up with him and move on...". I find it really blunt and much different than what I give him when he calls me in pain. That truly must be our P/J differences.

And I know he needs me to be the way I am with him because I listen and help him with his perspective. He'll even call and say "Okay, I need to hear some of your magic words. Make me feel good again. Why was it not wrong for me to write her several times...?", etc.

[thehigher]

Originally Posted by pinkrasputin

I think you're right about him trying to fit into a mold that just isn't him. And I know this is the first time he's ever felt like this after a break up. He says he used to be the one "detached" in other relationships. And right now he says he feels like he has a life time of tears to shed.

I agree with positive psychology as well. And for me, it really doesn't take me that long to move on. Although break ups do devastate me. I'm going through one now. I feel like my heart was just ripped out through my nostrils. But I just don't like "staying down" that long and I HAVE to do my life in order to snap out of it. So it's been kind of tough dealing with someone who is going through this for so long. But I am also an "open" person who won't judge him for being like this.

What's funny is whenever I have told this ENFJ that a man has hurt me, he responds kind of like Roland. He gives me advice like "Say Fuck him, break up with him and move on...". I find it really blunt and much different than what I give him when he calls me in pain. That truly must be our P/J differences.

And I know he needs me to be the way I am with him because I listen and help him with his perspective. He'll even call and say "Okay, I need to hear some of your magic words. Make me feel good again. Why was it not wrong for me to write her several times...?", etc.

Yea...I think it's awesome that you are comforting him like that. He prolly does need some objective truth....but then again...there is a shit load of women willing to give him that. I think what he really needs is to understand the different perspectives and how his isn't messed up and all that jazz. Good luck though. You're a good friend.

[Shadow1980]

I really respect Roland's replies. I think anyone in this situation should take the high road, move on, and try not to let it damage their self-esteem as much as possible. However, I also think it's important to take some responsibility to prevent it from happening again. I also think that when emotional pain stays for long periods of time it's because it needs to be relieved. Kind of like how putting your hand on a hot stove brings about pain telling you remove it. He could be experiencing a similar pain, but emotionally.

If he can diagnose why this is so painful for him he can figure out how to change his perception of the situation, ease his pain, and prevent this from happening again. Just being aware of a problem is such a relief...even if it is YOUR problem. In my analogy, he needs to figure out what is burning him to be able to remove his hand, and avoid burning it in the future.

I've done this several times with my own emotions and it works great. The only thing you can control in your life is how you react to things, so why not try?

As an ENFJ I think we have pretty powerful perceptions of other people's reactions and why they behave the way they do, if he can turn that high powered perception on himself, he'll be golden.

For the record, I'm an ENFJ but I'm a female.

[glukupikron]

I'm an ENFJ guy and your friend sounds just like me. I find the point of relationships to be able to be emotionally connected with someone and have the ability to share our emotional states without fear of retribution or disappointment. I'm currently dating an ISFP who isn't nearly as verbally expressive as I am emotionally but is really, really patient and is always a willing listener and comforter and who doesn't get scared/upset/disgusted when I am feeling and expressing emotional vulnerability -- she's also as physically affectionate as I am and that's awesome. Her nonjudgmental nature makes me feel safe. I used to date an ISFJ who was even more emotionally vulnerable and insecure than I am -- that had its own problems.

The great things about NF guys is that we have a special ability to make you feel FANTASTIC about yourself -- our compliments are genuine, our affection spontaneous though potentially overwhelming, and our loyalty unquestionable (at least, among NFJs). If we decide we really do like someone, we will try so, so hard to make our partners happy, because we want to have a perfect relationship. NFJs derive the most pleasure from seeing their partners happy.

I strongly advise caution when approaching romantic relationships with T women in general; with TJ women I advocate even more wariness, and XSTJ relationships I just don't think work with an ENFX.

I think your friend needs someone with strong F to feel comfortable with your his emotional openness, and especially among women those types are definitely out there. A grounded FP or NFP I think would do wonders for your friend's confidence -- don't let him infer too much from one misguided relationship. It's really not about him.

[ENXJ]

Even though I'm an ENXJ, I still function like an ENFJ a lot of the time, especially in relationships, so I feel qualified to answer this.

First, know that something he needs right now is the message of "I care about you." It won't make everything magically better, but it'll sure help him start to feel better again.

Second, know that he projected onto his ex his "anima"; his archetypal image of all women. He feels like if she doesn't like him for his mushiness, then no woman will. So, something that will help him tremendously is MBTI, actually. FILL him with descriptions of INFP women (I can help you find one or two if need be).

Third, know that Roland is only half right (sorry dude). True, letting yourself sulk endlessly is negative. But as an ENFJ man, he needs emotional support. He needs to know that not only you see him as a good person (& am man!!), but also that other women well - I'm sure you've already told him this, but he may need to hear it periodically.

Then, talk to him (if you haven't already) about how he's a different kind of man than most. It's an unescapable fact - he's mushy, and will forever be mushy. But he's most likely a warrior for the weak as well, and probably will make one hell of a Dad. Help him base his sense of masculinity in that - in his non-strereotypical manliness, which is better phrased as his Husbandliness and Daddy-ness. ENFJ men are not like "normal" men, and we have to live with that.

Finally, ask him this: "[Insert name here], let's pretend that your emotional clinginess didn't drive her away, but she like always, she never, ever connected to you emotionally - ever. Would you have a happy marriage with her? Would YOU be happy?" ENFJs can often forget about themselves in this way, so highlight this.

If all else fails, refer him here. I should be able to snap him back to reality a bit. =).

[Roland]

Originally Posted by ENXJ

Even though I'm an ENXJ, I still function like an ENFJ a lot of the time, especially in relationships, so I feel qualified to answer this.

First, know that something he needs right now is the message of "I care about you." It won't make everything magically better, but it'll sure help him start to feel better again.

Second, know that he projected onto his ex his "anima"; his archetypal image of all women. He feels like if she doesn't like him for his mushiness, then no woman will. So, something that will help him tremendously is MBTI, actually. FILL him with descriptions of INFP women (I can help you find one or two if need be).

Third, know that Roland is only half right (sorry dude). True, letting yourself sulk endlessly is negative. But as an ENFJ man, he needs emotional support. He needs to know that not only you see him as a good person (& am man!!), but also that other women well - I'm sure you've already told him this, but he may need to hear it periodically.

Then, talk to him (if you haven't already) about how he's a different kind of man than most. It's an unescapable fact - he's mushy, and will forever be mushy. But he's most likely a warrior for the weak as well, and probably will make one hell of a Dad. Help him base his sense of masculinity in that - in his non-strereotypical manliness, which is better phrased as his Husbandliness and Daddy-ness. ENFJ men are not like "normal" men, and we have to live with that.

Finally, ask him this: "[Insert name here], let's pretend that your emotional clinginess didn't drive her away, but she like always, she never, ever connected to you emotionally - ever. Would you have a happy marriage with her? Would YOU be happy?" ENFJs can often forget about themselves in this way, so highlight this.

If all else fails, refer him here. I should be able to snap him back to reality a bit. =).

why are you mentioning my name. i've never mentioned anything about social/emotional support.

[thehigher]

Yea all NF men are not run-of-the-mill men. We are mushy and emotional....but shit...that's really not bad. If anything....the world needs us to speak up more. Why are we not heard of? Because we adhere our selves to this mold of masculinity that is ....not accurate.

[Ninja]

TheHigher, she wants a limited perspective. You're INFP, know your place

If being in touch with emotions means understanding and accepting aspects of ones own emotional state. He's not as in touch as you think he is perhaps, even if he went to counseling.

Highly evolved, yet thinking he should fit a stereotype and that girls should fit another. Well clearly from his own behavior, and the behavior he has witnessed, that's not how it works. Maybe he has gills or something though... and I don't know what I'm talking about.

He also wants you to validate his actions, and put them in a positive light, concerning what he perceives as a mistake. So maybe you're feeding a negative habit that you have started. Giving good news about something that shouldn't have happened. And then maybe you like that as your role in the relationship. It makes you feel like you're helping and appreciated. There's black magic that can pass off as helping.. then there's the magic that actually helps even if the positive effects aren't seen immediately after you cast the spell.

You fit the emotional caring role. He fits the frustrated needing support. I wonder if caring is being shown in the right fashion.

[thehigher]

Originally Posted by Ninja

TheHigher, she wants a limited perspective. You're INFP, know your place

Fine! Mr. INFJ!