Do you want to know what the most revolting thing about so-called 'feminists' is?

Originally Posted by strangestdude

You have a saddening lack of respect for the power of grassroots activism and/or discourse to change culture.

This and similar forum discussions are neither activism nor discourses.

And I think society desires egalitarianism, rather than feminist ideals.

As someone who admitted never having read a single book written by feminist theoreticians, you should keep away from trying to guess what feminist ideals are.

Originally Posted by Madam

This and similar forum discussions are neither activism nor discourses.

You have a narrow view of legitimate platforms for activism.

you should keep away from trying to guess what feminist ideals are

I'll keep expressing my opinions if that's OK with you... And her...

Originally Posted by strangestdude

Sexist.

Reality.

Fact of the matter is not many people are willing to do the work. The character development, the higher education (law school, years of theological work, and understanding of how to deal with conflict), but they do want to talk about their opinion.

Originally Posted by themonocle

Fact of the matter is not many people are willing to do the work. The character development, the higher education (law school, years of theological work, and understanding of how to deal with conflict), but they do want to talk about their opinion.

Definitely not theology.

Originally Posted by strangestdude

You have a narrow view of legitimate platforms for activism.

Have you still not understood that I'm talking about quality of contents, not platform?

I'll keep expressing my opinions if that's OK with you... And her...

Do you enjoy posting that video everywhere and playing a victim? And yeah, you can go on expressing your opinions about ideals of feminism without ever reading primary sources that talk about those ideals. Almost everyone does that. And if there are useless opinions in this world, then those are the useless ones.

Originally Posted by Madam

Do you enjoy posting that video everywhere and playing a victim?

Different video. That's the unedited exchange between feminists and MRA's.

And yeah, you can go on expressing your opinions about ideals of feminism without ever reading primary sources that talk about those ideals. Almost everyone does that. And if there are useless opinions in this world, then those are the useless ones.

I like you.

Try this.
Define opinion.
Define Judgement.
What is the difference between the two.
Have you formed a judgment or an opinion?


Edit: I should also add.
What is the difference between making a judgment and being judgmental. Knowing that difference can change a whole way of communicating.

As someone who has tried to understand both internet feminists and MRA's by talking to them and asking questions, I definitely experienced about 50 times more hostility and anger trying to engage with the former. I've certainly interacted with many irrational and hateful MRA's, but the ratio of personable to clinically certifiable was much more normal than when I tried to ask questions on feminist blogs, forums and tumblrs; some of their policies included banning people for disagreeing with any tenet of their ideology or for simply being male.

The crux of internet feminist discourse is, in my experience, the rhetorical maneuver known as Kafkatrapping.

Good causes sometimes have bad consequences. Blacks, women, and other historical out-groups were right to demand equality before the law and the full respect and liberties due to any member of our civilization; but the tactics they used to “raise consciousness” have sometimes veered into the creepy and pathological, borrowing the least sane features of religious evangelism.

One very notable pathology is a form of argument that, reduced to essence, runs like this: “Your refusal to acknowledge that you are guilty of {sin,racism,sexism, homophobia,oppression…} confirms that you are guilty of {sin,racism,sexism, homophobia,oppression…}.” I’ve been presented with enough instances of this recently that I’ve decided that it needs a name. I call this general style of argument “kafkatrapping”, and the above the Model A kafkatrap. In this essay, I will show that the kafkatrap is a form of argument that is so fallacious and manipulative that those subjected to it are entitled to reject it based entirely on the form of the argument, without reference to whatever particular sin or thoughtcrime is being alleged...

Originally Posted by strangestdude

Definitely not theology.

Why not? I could see how a culture's prevailing religious ideas (resultant of particular theologies and mythologies) influence gender roles. Culture is shaped in part by institutions like religion, so theology could play a role in an individual's understanding of gender relations. I don't think it is absolutely necessary to delve into theology for that purpose, but I don't think it would be a fruitless endeavor either.

Also, I found this tree that has the tastiest looking fruit. Want a bite?