A note on Fe

Hi
I've seen a few places people mistaking Fe for such things as following the rules, copying, or being a sheep, or perhaps not having your own opinions. Other people have spoken about continuing to play by the rules your family set or being respectful or interested in social hierarchy.

I'm not sure any of this is actually true. It may be true of some Fe types, depending on what other functions they are using, but I don't think it describes Fe itself.



One good way of looking at Fe, I find, is what you will do when someone tells you a bad joke. I personally find it very rude if a person tells a joke and not everybody in the group laughs, regardless of whether or not it was funny.

When someone tells a joke then, to me, it is not necessary to consider whether or not the joke was funny - this is completely besides the point. Rather, a person tells a joke for a reason. Maybe they want to make you laugh, maybe they want to feel good about themselves etc. Therefore, the content is not important, only the intention. So I automatically laugh when a person jokes - without any conscious decision - because it's a joke. Therefore, I get offended if other people do not laugh at the joke someone tells, because I think it is very rude to be ungrateful of someone attempting to make you laugh. I will also be irritated at the person for making the situation awkward. The other reason I might laugh, even if the joke teller is an arsehole, is to help the conversation run smoothly - and I think this is another important part of Fe. I think a large part of Fe is facilitating conversation, regardless of your feelings about the other person, whether or not you like them (and Fe is not naive and trusting of everyone, I don't think). This is simply so that the experience is pleasant for both people. Fe will not feel it is selling out by giving this courtesy to someone they do not personally like. Or that is my experience.

The only other very Fe thing I can think of, that I have read about a lot of other people doing, is watching the face of the person I'm talking to to see how the conversation is going. If they seem bored or offended or something, I will change direction and approach them in a different way. This, again, is to help conversation run smoothly.

What Fe is not is following the rules. It does not necessarily think this is important, although some types that use Fe might. Si+Fe may be more likely to do this because they may be more interested in tradition and keeping things as they always have been - they have a more homely character - but Fe itself does not concern itself with rules.

That's my two cents anyway! Feel free to disagree and I may change my position, but this is just to clear up any misconceptions about Fe.

From what I understand, Fe works as social adhesive binding one individual to another in a harmonious state of connected-ness. When Fe love is employed, the user cannot distinguish between (him/her)self and the object of his/her affection. My understanding of this comes from combining understanding the chemicals that lead to the feeling of love and their relationship to boundary issues. Fe users usually have thinner boundaries than other types because of the stickiness of the psychological function. Fe users may have greater difficulty distinguished their separateness from others to whom their Fe love is stuck.

An experiment you can try for yourself: approach Fe user and tell them something inherently flawed about their beloved parent/spouse/friend. See what happens. ;)

Now, let's pretend an Fe user's parent has many strong opinions on right, wrong, morality, rules, etc.
Assuming the Fe user has yet to break free of that binding love that unites child and parent, the Fe user would be particularly interested in following the law, or have great difficulty/emotional pain participating in actions that would sever the unity between Fe user and parent.

Originally Posted by ukinfj

One good way of looking at Fe, I find, is what you will do when someone tells you a bad joke. I personally find it very rude if a person tells a joke and not everybody in the group laughs, regardless of whether or not it was funny.

What if the joke is racist?

Originally Posted by marzipan01

What if the joke is racist?

Then you would be polite to the person by smiling or something without laughing. Don't know. I usually don't make stand to be honest. I think I just keep things cordial and had assumed this was Fe. However, if it was an appropriate situation to debate racism than I would definitely try to tear them down. If I'm just on the street I'm not going to get into that so I don't want a strong willed person to know I disagree with them.

Originally Posted by ukinfj

Then you would be polite to the person by smiling or something without laughing. Don't know. I usually don't make stand to be honest. I think I just keep things cordial and had assumed this was Fe. However, if it was an appropriate situation to debate racism than I would definitely try to tear them down. If I'm just on the street I'm not going to get into that so I don't want a strong willed person to know I disagree with them.

Hmm, interesting. I have fairly string Fe and there's no way I'd laugh at a joke that was racist, sexist or any other sort of ist I find offensive. Now I may not rock the boat by disagreeing out loud but I'd never smile or laugh at anything like that and if it was an appropriate moment I'd definitely mention that I thought the joke was inappropriate.

When someone tells a racist joke, I won't smile...or I'll at least do a slight one that will purposely look far from genuine anyway. I just try to be busy and move away.

If it's an innocent joke that I find corny or cheesy, I'll smile or chuckle anyway out of amusement.

Originally Posted by marzipan01

From what I understand, Fe works as social adhesive binding one individual to another in a harmonious state of connected-ness. When Fe love is employed, the user cannot distinguish between (him/her)self and the object of his/her affection. My understanding of this comes from combining understanding the chemicals that lead to the feeling of love and their relationship to boundary issues. Fe users usually have thinner boundaries than other types because of the stickiness of the psychological function. Fe users may have greater difficulty distinguished their separateness from others to whom their Fe love is stuck.

An experiment you can try for yourself: approach Fe user and tell them something inherently flawed about their beloved parent/spouse/friend. See what happens. ;)

Now, let's pretend an Fe user's parent has many strong opinions on right, wrong, morality, rules, etc.
Assuming the Fe user has yet to break free of that binding love that unites child and parent, the Fe user would be particularly interested in following the law, or have great difficulty/emotional pain participating in actions that would sever the unity between Fe user and parent.

This sounds quite a bit like mysticized gibberish, sorry. There were some things that were right but I couldn't pull them apart from statements like "when Fe love is employed, the user cannot distinguish between (him/her)self and the object of his/her affection. "


It is Fi that leads you not to laugh at a racist joke, because personal ethics (Fi) dictate that racist jokes are not funny.

The complicated exception is if a Fe user believes that it is better for the harmony of the group to not laugh at the racist joke.

@sts06: Being ISFJ, Si would combine with Fe to make it seem almost... traditional, not to laugh at a racist joke. Si being acting based on the past, one would probably look at how racist jokes have caused harm in the past.

Originally Posted by sts06

Hmm, interesting. I have fairly string Fe and there's no way I'd laugh at a joke that was racist, sexist or any other sort of ist I find offensive. Now I may not rock the boat by disagreeing out loud but I'd never smile or laugh at anything like that and if it was an appropriate moment I'd definitely mention that I thought the joke was inappropriate.

Sorry, I think I may have delivered what I said badly. I was kind of in a rush. I think is probably a personal thing. I wouldn't laugh or smile at something that was wrong, but I probably wouldn't make a stand. I think this is only because I would think there was no point in making a stand in this case. Usually if you argue with a racist they won't change their mind, so it doesn't seem worth approaching. I guess I usually just sort of ignore it and will probably politely look for someone else to talk to. I generally don't challenge people. If I do, it's because I think it's going to work or because I am in "debate" situation and it I can just blather on about my beliefs :D I do quite like using logic with a racist or homophobe, because I enjoy proving idiotic ideas wrong, but in 99 per cent of cases I wouldn't bother. More hassle than it's worth because it almost definitely won't change anything and it could just make the situation uncomfortable for other people.

Originally Posted by bobdaduck

This sounds quite a bit like mysticized gibberish, sorry. There were some things that were right but I couldn't pull them apart from statements like "when Fe love is employed, the user cannot distinguish between (him/her)self and the object of his/her affection. "

That comes from various ideas I pulled from a variety of sources:
The chemical basis for love indicates that the neurotransmitters leading to the experience of love do not distinguish between familial, romantic, or any other kind of love. In this way, the distinctions and classifications of love are a human construct.
ENFJs are said to have thinner interpersonal boundaries than other types. I have witnessed this in my own experience. ENFJs fall in love rather easily with one person and cannot shake it. ENFJs also get more upset than other types when someone tells them there is something wrong with their family member. From what I make up about this is that thinner interpersonal boundaries = greater difficulty in distinguishing between one's self and the other person who is the object of one's affection.

It is Fi that leads you not to laugh at a racist joke, because personal ethics (Fi) dictate that racist jokes are not funny.

The complicated exception is if a Fe user believes that it is better for the harmony of the group to not laugh at the racist joke.

@sts06: Being ISFJ, Si would combine with Fe to make it seem almost... traditional, not to laugh at a racist joke. Si being acting based on the past, one would probably look at how racist jokes have caused harm in the past.

I don't laugh at racist jokes. I even have a problem with blond jokes because I feel the "blond" could easily be replaced with any other group of people one might dislike. Replace the word "blond" with "Jew" and you will see what I mean. I dislike this classification of joke and I believe someone should be socially shamed (i.e. no one should laugh) out of relating them. They are, to me, signs of weak character. If someone walked down the street and started punching someone in the face for no reason would you chime in? That is what laughing at a joke is like to me.

I usually tell the person who told the joke exactly my thoughts on the matter. This might hinder my good relations with people but I don't care because if I were being racist I would want someone to point out to me why it was wrong so that I might correct the error.

The racist joke thing has been responded to already, but I have harshly ordered, not asked, people to Shut the Fuck UP, when I have found a joke to be offensive. Not for group cohesion, not for harmony, not for anything else will I just sit and smile/look polite when something offensive takes place. I am an INFJ with a big mouth, and if something is important to me (my values, goals), I will just get up and make my thoughts known in a passionate way that causes people to fall silent at once.