Can you develop cognitive functions that are not a part of your MBTI type?

I can and I do. I have a feeling that the MBTI 16 types is a bit of bullshit. I do agree with my temperament NT, but anything else is fluctuant. I or E, P or J. Let me give you an example. Ti user with no Te wouldn't be able to do a plan. ENTP supposed to be Ti and I still can plan, even more I turned it into my natural way of achieving things. My bet is that we all can use all of the cognitive functions. Ne, Ni, Te, Ti all of that seems OK for me. Fe and Si are draining me. That meant to be what I'm about to develop - fuck that.

Originally Posted by DarkSideOfLight

Ti user with no Te wouldn't be able to do a plan.

Jung nor Myers has said that this is what Te does.

Extraverted Thinking is but a function, of four conscious functions, in a process of solving problems. As a Thinking function it create names to unknown entities, and as an extraverted function it uses what is external, what is known to everyone else; family, friends, community, universal.

T: "This red oval shaped thing is an apple." (E.g. A variable)
Te: "Because they say so."
Ti: "Because I say so."

Someone with Extraverted Thinking is more likely to ask questions regarding factual knowledge such as "Why does Te work the way it does?" in order to get other people's opinions on the matter, whereas Extraverted Feeling is more likely to ask questions such as "What is the most proper way to behave myself in this community?" in order to get other people's opinions on the matter. The Introverted versions of these work independently, and will want little if no influence from the rest of the world, deeming things according to self.

Stripped down of stereotypes these functions look like this:

F: This information will now be weighed out.
Fi: According to self.
Fe: According to what's universal.

T: This information now has a name.
Ti: According to self.
Te: According to what's universal.

Hello to all of you,

This is my first post to the personality cafe, though I first did the MBTI about 10 years ago. It got me first time. Since then I have used the Analytical Psychology model that Keirsey/MBTI is based on and developed a fair skill at typing people with in less than a minute of meeting them. I get a hit rate of about 9 out of ten based on their acknowledgement of the accuracy of my descriptions.

I am ENTP so my psychic model looks like

Dominant ----> Inferior

Ne Ti Fe Si ----- Ego (Concious)
-------------------------------------------------------
Ni Te Fi Se ----- Anima (Unconscious)

We all have all 8 of the possible functions, but of course we only know of 4 of them, until we go through Individuation.

Jung's model was inspired by studying mental illness, mythology, literature, and religion.

It is particularly useful to me because I have Bipolar Disorder (Manic Depression) and I seem to understand how I collapse.and recover. It appears that the whole process lasting about two years goes like this.

1. A lack of sleep seems to cause Ne to become over active and my mind is flooded with possibility every time I see or hear anything. First manic stage. I have all my best ideas here.

2. Ne shuts down and I am left with a lead in Ti. I appear mildly depressed as I churn over in my mind the overload from Ne in (1) above. First depressive stage.

3. Ti shuts down and I lead with Fe empathy for all around me, I am a sex fiend, air head, and think I'm god at this point (2nd manic phase).

4. Fe shuts down and I am left with just one concious function Si. I feel very ill and display hypochondria. (2nd depressive stage);

5. Si shuts down and I have no concious functioning. I feel to be in a waking dream. I am now psychotic. But I continue to function on my shadow functions with Ni where I sit the exploring my inner world. This seem to be Major Depressive Disorder from here on in.

6. Ni shuts down I am now leading with Te making me a little bit OCD but I haven't got much in the way of energy at this point.

7. Te shuts down and I lead with Fi. I can think of nothing but morality and ethics as I beat myself up for behaviours shown in the previous stages. I hate my self to the core of my being.

8. Fi shuts down leaving me with just one function: Se. At this point unless stopped I will take my own life.

9. Se shuts down and I become profoundly depressed. I cannot move, I can see and hear but make no sense of the world at all. I need full time care and return this by soiling myself.

Getting better is the reverse of this process.

I have gone down and up this path maybe 20 times since adolescence. Various intervention have reversed the process part way through but I have gone all the way twice and have been hospitalized twice for attempted suicide. Please don't worry - I'm in good health at the moment.

What's really interesting here is two recent studies on Bipolar and Schizophrenic Disorders.

1. For nearly 150 years these have been treated as separate illness's until genetic sequencing showed them to be closely related.

2. It seems from a recent paper that Bipolar is for Extroverts and Schizophrenia is for Introverts

I would love somebody who leads with Ni (INFJ & INTJ) who has a diagnosis of Schizophrenia to consider the above sequencing on their cognitive functions. Perhaps you could give us your story? Also an ENFP with Bipolar Disorder should be an interesting story too.

Hope this isn't too scary.

Donald.

Originally Posted by Sky Cat

Dominant ----> Inferior

Ne Ti Fe Si ----- Ego (Concious)
-------------------------------------------------------
Ni Te Fi Se ----- Anima (Unconscious)

This is interesting. What about introverts would cause them to have Schizophrenia? What happens to INTPs and INFPs, Schizophrenia as well?

If you reversed that sequence for an introvert either their intuition (INFJ, INTJ) or decision making process (INFP, INTP) will be left at the end. I doubt that is what happens but it's an idea.

Originally Posted by Chinchilla

If an INTP wanted to could they develop Ni? Could an INTJ develop Ne?

If so how could someone go about developing functions that are not a part of their main four?

I am an ISTJ, and I have developed my Ne and Fe. I understand that such things become easier as you age. I'm 35. Ne for me, I think, may have come largely from long-term exposure and interaction with an INFJ. Fe is a more recent development, and that took a bit more focus and attention.

Originally Posted by Sky Cat

Hello to all of you,

What's really interesting here is two recent studies on Bipolar and Schizophrenic Disorders.

1. For nearly 150 years these have been treated as separate illness's until genetic sequencing showed them to be closely related.

2. It seems from a recent paper that Bipolar is for Extroverts and Schizophrenia is for Introverts

I would love somebody who leads with Ni (INFJ & INTJ) who has a diagnosis of Schizophrenia to consider the above sequencing on their cognitive functions. Perhaps you could give us your story? Also an ENFP with Bipolar Disorder should be an interesting story too.

Hope this isn't too scary.

Donald.

If thats true then I would be an extrovert then. Bipolar seems very familiar. I have to say there is something in the sequence you gave us. Hmmm...

Not sure how it would go in reality as I'm not schizophrenic, but as a model:-

INFP
Dom -> Inf
Fi Ne Si Te ----- Conscious (Ego)
--------------------------------------------------------
Fe Ni Se Ti ----- Unconscious (Anima/Animus)

And if the functions collapsed in dominant order from Ego to Anima/Animus we'd get (very crudely with a lot of interpretation on my part):-

1. Fi collapses - loss of values/ethics leaving overloaded Ne seeing patterns in everything.

2. Ne collapses - loss of insight into the world leaving overloaded Si feeling ill/hypochondria.

3. Si collapses - leaving Te with a mission to organize the world.

4 Te collapses and we fall into a dreaming/nightmare psychosis leading on Fe feeling misplaced empathy. Is there paranoia at this point?

5. Fe collapses - empathy gives way to Ni introspection (soul searching?).

6. Ni collapses - we are aware of the external world and its dangers through Se.

7. Se collapses - leaving Ti trying to logically interpret what has happened.

8. Complete collapse as for Bipolar.

Any INFP schizophrenics got a take on this?

Thanks for taking an interest.

Donald.

Sorry DarkSideOfLight I don't quite understand:- ENTP's are extroverted.

Thanks

Donald.

Originally Posted by Sky Cat

Sorry DarkSideOfLight I don't quite understand:- ENTP's are extroverted.

Thanks

Donald.

I believe that I'm ambivert. Or, I looped myself somewhere inside the process you wrote about. It might work differently for me due to my own experience/circumstances, but it is similar. I'm not sure if my cognitive functions are in the same order. It is confusing for me at the moment, but I'm sure I have found some piece missing thanks to you. I have to think about that.

Sky Cat do you think that it is possible to develop functions that normally would be listed on the shadow side and use them, because of bipolar disorder?

I doubt people are conscious in 4 functions, let alone 8 of them.