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The Freudian Theory of Enneagram

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This is a discussion on The Freudian Theory of Enneagram within the Articles forums, part of the Announcements category; Wow. This is great because it makes sense. Timeless for pres! Originally Posted by timeless However, the id has a ...

  1. #21

    Wow. This is great because it makes sense. Timeless for pres!

    Quote Originally Posted by timeless View Post
    However, the id has a side to it that's more playful, and this comes out with the 8 in private. The 8 ideal is magnamity; the ability to use their power in an equitable and just way. This tends to develop as an 8 grows older.
    I couldn't agree with this more. And I'm glad you added it. My father is definitely an 8w9. Growing up I saw him beat up a lot of people and impose his will onto them. (He was a scary mo fo. Lol). However, now in his 70s he is really one of the most playful and magnanimous people you'll ever meet. Still powerful, but much more easy going.

    I would say for him, this other side started developing towards the outside around 50. But I think he always had an inner playfulness in private.
    timeless and Up and Away thanked this post.

  2. #22

    Quote Originally Posted by timeless View Post
    I should read that book at some point. The fact that it covers this material makes it sound pretty good to me. :p
    It mainly covers type descriptions in much more depth than you'll see at the Enneagram Institute site but there are a few really good chapters that covers the system itself and these correlations. With your background in psychology, you'd probably find Naranjo's work extremely useful if not interesting,as well.

    Hmm, I didn't find it particularly hard. I came up with all this on my own, although I sometimes referenced Wikipedia or the Enneagram Institute for the basic fears and desires of each type.

    Perhaps those Enneagram theorists weren't well versed in Freudian theory. Who knows. In any case, kudos to you.

  3. #23

    @timeless ... that was an amazing post to read, thank you!
    Wake and timeless thanked this post.

  4. #24

    Brilliant, @timeless !
    Thank you for sharing :)
    timeless and Up and Away thanked this post.

  5. #25

    Thank you very much, Timeless! Approaching the enneangram types using ego, superego and id, made more sense to me than anything else I have read. Kudos to you! Thank you for sharing. :)
    timeless and Up and Away thanked this post.

  6. #26

    Awesome article, I found out my tri-type was 5-4-9, and the description you give is spot on for me, good work.
    timeless and Up and Away thanked this post.

  7. #27

    Thanks to this article, I think I've found some interesting correlation (not directly related, but in tone with enneagram's inherent mysticism):

    Gunas

    Rajas: "Id types" - 3,7,8

    Tama: "Ego types" - 4,5,9

    Sattva: "Superego types" - 1,2,6

    The colors associates with each are; red, black and white respectively.
    timeless, Up and Away and VinnyCrow thanked this post.

  8. #28

    And more correlations that I've come up with:

    1 (Superego): Integrates into Id (7) / Disintegrates to Ego (4)
    2 (Superego): Integrates into Ego (4) / Disintegrates to Id (8)
    3 (Id): Integrates into Superego (6) / Disintegrates to Ego (9)
    4 (Ego): Integrates into Superego (1) / Disintegrates to Superego (2)
    5 (Ego): Integrates into Id (8) / Disintegrates to Id (7)
    6 (Superego): Integrates into Ego (9) / Disintegrates to Id (3)
    7 (Id): Integrates into Ego (5) / Disintegrates to Superego (1)
    8 (Id): Integrates into Superego (2) / Disintegrates to Ego (5)
    9 (Ego): Integrates into Id (3) / Disintegrates to superego (6)


    1w9: Mars-Pluto - Superego/Ego
    1w2: Mars-Moon - Superego/Superego
    2w1: Moon-Mars - Superego/Superego
    2w3: Moon-Neptune - Superego/Id
    3w2: Neptune-Moon - Id/Superego
    3w4: Neptune-Venus - Id/Ego
    4w3: Venus-Neptune - Ego/Id
    4w5: Venus-Mercury - Ego/Ego
    5w4: Mercury-Venus - Ego/Ego
    5w6: Mercury-Uranus - Ego/Superego
    6w5: Uranus-Mercury - Superego/Ego
    6w7: Uranus-Jupiter - Superego/Id
    7w6: Jupiter-Uranus - Id/Superego
    7w8: Jupiter-Saturn - Id/Id
    8w7: Saturn-Jupiter - Id/Id
    8w9: Saturn-Pluto - Id/Ego
    9w8: Pluto-Saturn - Ego/Id
    9w1: Pluto-Mars - Ego/Superego

    timeless, Up and Away and VinnyCrow thanked this post.

  9. #29

    It is difficult for me to take much that has come from Freud seriously. The dude was obsessed with dreams and found sexuality to be the root of so many of life's frustrations and happiness. Psychologists now usually refer to Freud in a rather blase "that was back before the studies and their results" came in. I dug some of the ideas he had in "Civilization And It's Discontents," mostly because they actually made logical sense. Freud is considered old school just as lying on couch talking about your problems took about 10-15 years to attain results for the person with mental illness and/or issues. It s-l-o-w process.
    CBT (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) is based on seeing the logic behind one's thoughts which requires brain training because you also have to search for the belief behind the thought, for thoughts are the cataclysts behind emotions. Albert Ellis is THE MAN. He could teach Freud a thing or two.
    Allegorist, Lav and Up and Away thanked this post.

  10. #30

    Quote Originally Posted by Astrid View Post
    It is difficult for me to take much that has come from Freud seriously. The dude was obsessed with dreams and found sexuality to be the root of so many of life's frustrations and happiness. Psychologists now usually refer to Freud in a rather blase "that was back before the studies and their results" came in. I dug some of the ideas he had in "Civilization And It's Discontents," mostly because they actually made logical sense. Freud is considered old school just as lying on couch talking about your problems took about 10-15 years to attain results for the person with mental illness and/or issues. It s-l-o-w process.
    CBT (Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) is based on seeing the logic behind one's thoughts which requires brain training because you also have to search for the belief behind the thought, for thoughts are the cataclysts behind emotions. Albert Ellis is THE MAN. He could teach Freud a thing or two.
    When I was in college, it was pretty hip to criticize Freud but a great deal of his theory is still used today. The unconscious defense mechanisms, for example, like displacement, regression, denial, etc were all initially described by Freud.

    The biggest criticisms of Freud come from the emphasis on sexuality in his theory, which made sense at the time. The Victorian-era society in which he was living seemed to have a huge complex regarding sex. It was something both pursued and vilified, and it's easy to see why he would see sexuality as a root cause of a variety of problems. Society still seems just as sex-obsessed, although it's far more accepted nowadays. I think this was rectified when drive theory came about, since Eros and Thanatos do coalesce particular behaviors into more definite categories than sexuality-in-general.

    CBT is good, but I think that CBT has different motivations than Freudian psychoanalysis. CBT is a more "mass produced" form of talk therapy, for example. That's what you get when you have behaviorism as such a central part of the theory. That's not to say that it's bad, but that it does have it's limits and it's particular uses.
    Athena, Rose for a Heart, DAPHNE XO and 1 others thanked this post.


     
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